vault of produce rework idea

[knotty kestrel]

current: 2k gold required for active

new idea:
gold requirement -> time requirement (since the game goes like 10 min)

produce amount:
current suggestion(in chat) :
ㅡㅡㅡㅡㅡㅡㅡㅡㅡㅡㅡㅡ
early/mid/late

1. 7.5%/10%/15%

2.(my idea) 5%/7.5%/10%

ㅡㅡㅡㅡㅡㅡㅡㅡㅡㅡㅡㅡㅡㅡㅡㅡㅡ

if too op or weak, someone please tell me, ill fix

[vague pond]

Uhh

I don't quite understand

[tranquil turtle]

my brain still cant process

what it means

[vague pond]

Fr

I read it 10 times and still can't understand

[signal dragon]

lemme see.

[vague pond]

Hai john :3

[signal dragon]

yo

anyways.

resourcement buff when-

is it saying the resource buff activates for you too when the enemy captures tower?

[vague pond]

It says gold req to time req

[signal dragon]

lesser version but still.

[vague pond]

Idk what it means

[signal dragon]

not specific enough.

[vague pond]

The only things I understood are produce amount, max amount g produce, and resourcement buff

[signal dragon]

my only guess is that it activates if a certain amount of time passes

but uh.

[vague pond]

What time-

[signal dragon]

bad idea.

REALLY

bad idea

[signal dragon]

not stated.

[vague pond]

• presentation
  1/10
• information
  2/10

[signal dragon]

this basically nerfs vault's original state and gives it worse tower buffs if the opponent captures tower

[vague pond]

Yuh

[signal dragon]

I'm not one to balance.

but from an idea and gimmick standpoint.

[vague pond]

Reworking VoP instead of buffing or nerfing is much better

[signal dragon]

that's a completely and utterly hurrendous idea.

[vague pond]

The concept's good, but execution is bad

Like you get more passive gold when enemy has center :v

[signal dragon]

it feels like it promotes a more turtle-y playstyle.

with the fact that tower stalling isn't as effective against whoever's using it.

now I'm mostly a new player of sw3

(joined about right before the new upgrades)

but from what I know.

turtling isn't very fun.

[vague pond]

You've been here longer than me xD

[signal dragon]

so yea. don't like it too much.

[vague pond]

It is for me, but SD ruins it

[signal dragon]

(was talking about people playing against turtle)

[vague pond]

Oohh

[signal dragon]

(and that was kinda the point of SD. but it instead created tower stalling. which is basically stronger turtle rn.)

[knotty kestrel]

tower zap thing exist so vault should work depends on time instead of gold required amount-

ok lemme remove the things down tho

is it better? @signal dragon @vague pond

[vague pond]

More time passes = more bonus?

[knotty kestrel]

not more bonus maybe

[vague pond]

This is weak

[knotty kestrel]

hm..

[vague pond]

Weaker than the current VoP

[knotty kestrel]

or maybe 5% at mid game, 10% at late game?

or 5% early/10% mid/15% late game-

[vague pond]

Basically VoP, still a no

Maybe

[knotty kestrel]

real-?

[vague pond]

[knotty kestrel]

late game with 15%: (crashes the game)

[signal dragon]

I'm gonna need to know when it activates tho.

and I mean specific numbers.

[knotty kestrel]

didnt set bc need to ask with some old players who knows the current balance-

[vague pond]

Call Fan Ideas Guy

[knotty kestrel]

fr

[signal dragon]

nah. ima go a step beyond.

[vague pond]

Nvm call someone active

[signal dragon]

ahem

@bronze seal @sterile owl @sturdy glade @past jasper @trail turtle

[past jasper]

Hello

[knotty kestrel]

💀

[signal dragon]

have the council at thee

[vague pond]

Came in quick!

[knotty kestrel]

yeah btw u think time part is ok?

[signal dragon]

top

[past jasper]

I was there while you were pinging me

[signal dragon]

not bad but I need to know when it activates

[signal dragon]

woops

[vague pond]

Lolll

[knotty kestrel]

fr

[past jasper]

Average fig activities

[signal dragon]

eh. got the rest of the council still.

[past jasper]

Stalking people

[trail turtle]

“I was there when it was written” moment

[vague pond]

We got the most professional of professionals of balancing

[past jasper]

Anyways, when does it start?

[signal dragon]

indeed

[trail turtle]

oh no maybe wrong reference

anyway

[signal dragon]

top (again)

[knotty kestrel]

or call masq the old ancient top 1 player

[trail turtle]

wrong

[knotty kestrel]

or is he in sw3 channel?

not sure if hes ded still

[signal dragon]

ay. hold on.

[past jasper]

He's too rusty now

[knotty kestrel]

or CRazy the ancient dude-

[knotty kestrel]

?

[trail turtle]

dude

this is a nerf.

[vague pond]

THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYINGG

[knotty kestrel]

aleast you can use after time passed enough hm..

[signal dragon]

you removed your 👎 emoji.

SELF REACTOR!

[knotty kestrel]

or prob buff it again?

[vague pond]

[signal dragon]

not anymore.

[trail turtle]

what is the time threshold before it starts?

[past jasper]

He hasn't played in so long that even though kytchu is clearly OP and most of the community already realized how OP she is, masq still says that kytchu would be balanced "again" if SD got removed

[signal dragon]

that's what I've been asking.

[knotty kestrel]

or do u guess 2.5% early/5% mid/7.5% late game gonna work?

[signal dragon]

this is what he said

[knotty kestrel]

💀

[trail turtle]

I mean it would help but wouldn’t solve everything

[signal dragon]

that is disgustingly low.

(imo)

[past jasper]

Late-game starts at around 7 minutes mark at its fastest

[knotty kestrel]

hm...

[past jasper]

7.5% ain't gonna do anything by that point

[vague pond]

Brother, why?

[signal dragon]

double at least.

[trail turtle]

I won’t bring a mythic card to give me that low of a percentage every 20s

[knotty kestrel]

or 10% late?

[knotty kestrel]

hm...

[vague pond]

[trail turtle]

what is the purpose of this? are you actively trying to nerf it?

[signal dragon]

as in maybe 5/10/15%

[vague pond]

[trail turtle]

I can get VoP working at max between 6-8 minute mark of the game

[knotty kestrel]

who agree with this-

[signal dragon]

(that's a lil low still or maybe I'm tweaking)

[trail turtle]

with this id need beyond overtime to get it at max, just for it to give me less gold than pre-nerf VoP

[knotty kestrel]

not nerf, just set it as low so we can discuss with it

also i can fix the ideas by chat-

[past jasper]

If I can get a giant and a magikill (with brilliance) before 2:40, then y'all can definitely get VoP working early

[signal dragon]

how much does VoP give again?

[vague pond]

1000 max

[signal dragon]

as in extra percentage

[past jasper]

10% every 20 seconds

[signal dragon]

aight.

so 5/10/15's good?

[knotty kestrel]

fixed

[knotty kestrel]

nah bc of early game

i used to love using vault

10% got the chance to make new meta if early game so nope

(i was one of top 100 in 2022 with vault+ giant deck, top 200th in 2023)

[trail turtle]

the issue with VoP is being useless early game, by the time its useful you’re better off spending the gold you saved to get an army and rush the opponent instead of stacking VoP, because SD basically made the purpose of VoP useless, since you have no late game to prepare for anyway.

im pretty sure giant spam is the only strategy that can make use of current VoP, even then its not good because you’d be playing broke the entire game except for the last 4 minutes where you go all in

[past jasper]

Ngl I don't think people realize that VoP will be useless as long as SD exists, or at least is not at 20:00 or after

[signal dragon]

yea.

[knotty kestrel]

but game goes only 10 min so

[signal dragon]

SD destroys vault.

[past jasper]

That's the problem

[trail turtle]

what if we make VoP just outright give player gold the longer the time passes? and it wouldn’t be purely based on your gold balance?

[signal dragon]

I still think it's amusing the fact that after us asking for a SD extension all this time they extend it by one minute

[trail turtle]

so yknow you wouldn’t have to save, if you plan to it would just help, but VoP would still give you good amount of gold eitherway

[knotty kestrel]

or is this good?

first 1 min: 2.5%
1~2min: 5%
2~4min: 7.5%
4~6min: 10%
6~8min: 12.5%
8~10min :15%

[vague pond]

[knotty kestrel]

or idk

[signal dragon]

I'm not entirely certain but I'm not the best at balancing.

[knotty kestrel]

same here

but i know vault buff should not get active at that early game

too early game i mean

[signal dragon]

you sacrifice a mythic slot for it.

I think it's about fair enough.

[knotty kestrel]

hm..

[vague pond]

10% boost the entire game

[knotty kestrel]

fr

[signal dragon]

that's straight up a buff.

[knotty kestrel]

heavy gold deck will crack the game-

[signal dragon]

-#

[past jasper]

No sht, and it needs it

[signal dragon]

fair enough.

honestly. while it would be a little lame if it was straight up 10% extra gold. it would be really nice for it.

[knotty kestrel]

there was an time when (this deck was made by me)
miner
sickle
archidon
spearton
mage
giant
monstrosity
vault

cracked tons of decks which i made at that time

[vague pond]

Turtle decks shall rise again

[signal dragon]

-# pls no

[knotty kestrel]

gold heavy deck: :nuclear:

[vague pond]

[signal dragon]

[signal dragon]

[knotty kestrel]

fr 3 thumbs down

[vague pond]

[signal dragon]

mostly cuz it's just a nerf

[knotty kestrel]

then buff it more than this-?

[signal dragon]

probably yea.

but as for me. ima see about creating a new unit idea.

[bronze seal]

Who has summoned me???

[signal dragon]

it's been too long without me making one.

[signal dragon]

I have.

[bronze seal]

What is the purpose of this summoning?

[signal dragon]

this

[bronze seal]

Ok

[signal dragon]

(I'd to to top but this is closer)

[clear flint]

oh

[knotty kestrel]

then do u think then 7.5% early/10%mid/15% late gonna be good?

[signal dragon]

top (anyways)

[sleek rampart]

Wtf

[knotty kestrel]

[signal dragon]

maybe?

[vague pond]

Me having a 1 month streak:

[knotty kestrel]

somehow it became like this

[signal dragon]

not certain.

[sleek rampart]

Instead of vault, i change that mythic into completely different.

[sleek rampart]

[vague pond]

YES!

[knotty kestrel]

now fixed it again

is it better

[bronze seal]

7.5% is a weird number

[vague pond]

Who finna be 4th place

[bronze seal]

10%,15%,20%
It might be better that way

[sleek rampart]

BARGAIN HUNTER(revamped vault)
that give 5% discount to all units

[knotty kestrel]

uh.. 20% gonna destroy game up

if you were in 2022, u might know

[vague pond]

It ain't much tbh

[bronze seal]

It was an example of sorts

[sleek rampart]

Easy to understand

[signal dragon]

will it?

[knotty kestrel]

you played 2022 version once-?

[signal dragon]

actually maybe.

[knotty kestrel]

20% unrecommended

[vague pond]

Once

Then after 2 years blah blah blah

[bronze seal]

I Played in sickle meta

[vague pond]

Here I am

[sterile owl]

I WAS SUMMONED

[trail turtle]

I wonder if CivilBreak would like to be pinged here

[sterile owl]

TOP

[knotty kestrel]

i used to love sickle meta bc legasht deck ate that up

[bronze seal]

Caster probably played when it was in a super early beta

[signal dragon]

anyways. regarding this rq

[vague pond]

[signal dragon]

new boss? twin generals? or an elemental general?

[bronze seal]

I'm gonna go make my griffon idea

[bronze seal]

Boss idea would be interesting from you

[vague pond]

Twin generals, I need more than just twin juggs

[bronze seal]

Generals are pretty common

[signal dragon]

it'd probably be a bit stronger than golem.

[knotty kestrel]

btw dev needs to change his mindset with vault current ability

[sleek rampart]

The vault idea u make somewhat strange

[signal dragon]

that I would say.

[knotty kestrel]

fr

[bronze seal]

I'd like it if you try to make a boss that relies on summons

[sleek rampart]

Nah, change to my version

[knotty kestrel]

current: 2k gold required for active

new idea:
gold requirement -> time requirement (since the game goes like 10 min)

produce amount:
current suggestion(in chat) : 7.5%(early)/10%(mid game)/15%(late game)
max amount gold produce: 1000->???

if too op or weak, someone please tell me, ill fix it

currently wrote like this

[sterile owl]

Eh i dont quite understand

7.5% / 10% (mid game)
Mid game /15% (late game)
? Idk what the percents are for? Is it gold gain per 20 sec? If so terribly op

[signal dragon]

hm. cool idea but that ain't exactly what I was thinking of.

[knotty kestrel]

per 20 sec

[signal dragon]

I might make a new idea about that.

[bronze seal]

Yeah

[sleek rampart]

This is like mini center tower

[bronze seal]

I'ma go make griffon

[knotty kestrel]

yeah op but ppl saying too weak

[sterile owl]

OH

[sleek rampart]

But u don't have to capture tower

[sterile owl]

Op as hell

[sleek rampart]

For me it's mid.

[sterile owl]

Guaranteed extra eco with no work

[knotty kestrel]

@signal dragon see?

old ppl thinks its op

[sleek rampart]

5% discount at your service 🔥

[signal dragon]

ima coinflip between twin generals and boss

[sterile owl]

What

[signal dragon]

he aint the only one.

[sleek rampart]

Already made one if elemental fanmade boss

[signal dragon]

not that.

[sleek rampart]

I revamp vault to complete different card

[knotty kestrel]

yeah then whts your suggestion?

[sleek rampart]

[trail turtle]

how about both?

[vague pond]

TWIN BOSS

[signal dragon]

interesting idea. Will try it later.

[sterile owl]

Oh...

What is it

[signal dragon]

but the coin has chosen a new boss.

[knotty kestrel]

but i just wanna suggest 5% early/ 7.5% mid/10% late in this moment

[signal dragon]

and now I gotta see how the boss will work.

[sleek rampart]

BARGAIN HUNTER(revamped vault)
that give 5% discount to all units

[knotty kestrel]

salv:

25% refund

[sleek rampart]

It's 20% now

[sterile owl]

Oh...

[knotty kestrel]

ah

[sterile owl]

Meh

[sleek rampart]

Or maybe

Ehhhh

[past jasper]

It 20% now

[sterile owl]

I dont like it

[knotty kestrel]

but 20% also good

[sleek rampart]

YEAH

That

[knotty kestrel]

and slightly insane in 2v2

[sleek rampart]

Why not? It's not like 25% discount or some shit-

[sterile owl]

So like worse than smithy

[knotty kestrel]

1 unit death, it gives 20% "per" user

[trail turtle]

thats a mythic?

[sleek rampart]

For now yes, but i change later

Since i had 0 motive make balances crap

[knotty kestrel]

#1302522624131207270 message

[trail turtle]

you should either make it scale with upgrades or add a secondary bonus

reducing costs is strong, but 5% alone isn’t

[sterile owl]

Ik your reffering to brilliance and that is justified because
1: magikill arent 400 400 type ahh valuable and
2: it costs an entire slot that does 2 things because noone buys bastion

[sleek rampart]

There is secondary bonus

[trail turtle]

what

[sterile owl]

This is just so borring for a mythic

[trail turtle]

the max amount of gold produce seems useless

[sterile owl]

Also underpowrred

This post is just op tho

[sleek rampart]

I think the new version of bargain hunter is

(Level 1 environment) 8% discount + 10% mov speed & damage

(Level 2 environment) 12% discount + 16% mov speed & damage

@sterile owl @trail turtle

[sterile owl]

Hm?

[sleek rampart]

If i remember or saving its note

[trail turtle]

what speed

[sterile owl]

Why dmg and speed?

[vague pond]

[trail turtle]

ay wait what

[sleek rampart]

Movement speed

[trail turtle]

hell no

[sterile owl]

Lv 1? Why is it tied to upgrades? And what u0grade?

[vague pond]

+16% is crazy

[knotty kestrel]

ok 3 suggestion

refixed

[vague pond]

That's nearly half of rage

[sleek rampart]

It says "environment upgrades"

Basically revamped bastion

[sterile owl]

Discount is also STILL over shadowee by smithys 20% refund on death

[sterile owl]

Your going to add a 6th upgrade just for vault?

[sleek rampart]

What...??

[knotty kestrel]

all separated train queue deck user would love this 👎

[vague pond]

😂

[knotty kestrel]

u dont know how this is op yet

fr

[sleek rampart]

Me as SE players :3

[sterile owl]

Like we have
Barracs
Forge
Armoury
Temple
Bastion

And now eviroment?

[sleek rampart]

Nope

It's all revamped

[sterile owl]

Oh

Then

[sleek rampart]

Because fuck- current level name

[sterile owl]

Why are you givng ud part of this

Without the full thing

And expectig. Up

Us

To get the full thing

[sleek rampart]

I think u forgot my upgrade tree

[sterile owl]

From just a part of it

[knotty kestrel]

all separate trained queue deck: u can build full population from 0 withen around 1~2 min during game

[vague pond]

We are getting REALLY off topic here

[sterile owl]

Your upgrade tree?

[sterile owl]

Just make a fan ideas post

[knotty kestrel]

without tower train buff

[vague pond]

[knotty kestrel]

tower full lvl buff+ train upgrade full lvl buff: ofc 1 min then 100 pop rebuilded ez

[sleek rampart]

Barracks –> Archery/Deadeye
Forge –> Bladework/Merciless
Armoury –> Defender/Brutality
Temple –> Sorcerer/Necromancy
Bastion –> Environment

[sterile owl]

JUST MAKE A FAN IDEAS POST!! ITS SO MUCH EASIER TO ORGANIZE IDEAS THERE!!!!

Also its overshadowing this guys post

[sleek rampart]

Time to wrote down whole document of what changes lmao

[knotty kestrel]

omg over 350+ msg

[sterile owl]

Just link the doc

In the post

Also

Shameless plug

https://discord.com/channels/555057405080371210/1302084629410484244

[vague pond]

And half of it are just discussing about another person's fan idea

[knotty kestrel]

ye fr

[sterile owl]

Yeah srr abt that

I dont find this idea particulsrly balanced

[knotty kestrel]

btw should i repost this late but with the multi choice like 1.2.3.4.... and etc-?

[sterile owl]

No added skill or planning is needed to use this card

[sterile owl]

What?

Oh no

[knotty kestrel]

eh idk then

[sterile owl]

I dont really like thos ideas

[knotty kestrel]

[sterile owl]

As in

[knotty kestrel]

btw we rlly need to revive vault tho rip

then nerf if more than 5% player using vault

[sterile owl]

Its like ppl will say that 1 is bad and someone will say 2 is bad and they argue over both ideas like their the same but their really arguing over 2 different ideas

[knotty kestrel]

buff little if less than 5%

[knotty kestrel]

yep

hm..

[sterile owl]

Vault died because they removed 300 extra bonus starting gold and they buffed everythint else where it killled late game magiant

[knotty kestrel]

btw when i suggest 2.5% early/5%mid/7.5% late

ppl pressed thumb down

rip

[knotty kestrel]

wasnt it 100 gold extra-?

[sterile owl]

Oop

Yeah it was

[knotty kestrel]

breh

btw i dont wanna make vault trashed hm..

i kept use until tower zap

with stay around diamond~master rank

[sleek rampart]

https://discord.com/channels/555057405080371210/1302545472153456650

@sterile owl

[signal dragon]

update: my creativity is dying

[knotty kestrel]

[knotty kestrel]

tip: dont set its op, set ability as weak bc weak ability doesnt means its actually weak

[signal dragon]

respectfully.

fck that

[knotty kestrel]

example:

[signal dragon]

I'm making a boss unit. it's less about the balance and more the spectacle

[knotty kestrel]

downside for all unit if this idea

with less dmg compare to acid rain

[knotty kestrel]

hm..

btw dont make the ability very high if for online

if you palyed quite long, you might set as "looks very weak" but not weak