random 3AM idea parry

[cunning path]

Simple concept
If two units attack each other at the same time it counts as a parry and they either deal no damage or half damage only 1 attack can be parried at a time

If you UC a unit and attack a projectile the moment it hits them then it will parry the projectile and deal no damage (AI will not attempt this only UC)

Debuff attacks can be parried but not the debuffs themselves for instance if a toxic dead is parried then your UC will still get poisoned

Special abilities such as sword jump, jugger charge, fullminate, ect cannot parry and cannot be parried with the exception of Tactical roll and shadowrath which can parry

Stun and splash attacks (as well as the base damage from the attacks) cannot parry and cannot be parried except by shadowrath this keeps their parry ability unique and will still stun it wall also make ripriders and sicklewrath more consistent and not have rips be virtually immortal Marrowkia will also not be able to be parried except by shadow

If the parry mechanic blocks 100% damage then after 2-3 consecutive parries damage is dealt anyway this counts for projectiles too

Bombers are also completely unaffected by parries as it could render them useless against an army mid fight

As for if this should be UC specific idk cause in some cases this could make battles last allot longer but it just makes sense for every unit to parry. Either way it'll definitely add some skill into the game and give an edge against brain dead archer cowards as well as giving some other units a little more usability

[tepid oriole]

What

@violet sable @tight pine @civic sage @fallen pond @frail sierra

@cosmic wing

I forgot about him, again

[cunning path]

Thanks

[violet sable]

Me watching a tower stall abuser parry my entire fcking archidon army with a single damn crawler:

[cunning path]

That's not gonna happen tho lol

Would be funny

[violet sable]

I don't want a bootleg shadow parry for every unit

Imagine the backline sniping

Atreyos or spearos just runs into your backline and murders your archers while simultaneously parrying many arrows

[cunning path]

That's gonna happen with Frontline regardless though is the thing

That's why I argued to make it UC specific

[violet sable]

It's still going to be a problem

[cunning path]

It parries 1 attack only dude

[violet sable]

Oh dear God imagine the raw power of spear start

[cunning path]

Your not having a swordwrath parry 20 arrows from kytchu

[violet sable]

Just fcking parrying all the damn CA arrows (which is basically the only actual way to stop spear eco sniping other than having swords)

[cunning path]

That's also why I said half damage as well so you don't have he immortal on point

[violet sable]

It's still going to be a problem, parrying half the damage is still a fck ton of damage parried

[cunning path]

You obviously didn't read the full post bro

[violet sable]

?

[cunning path]

Splash damage is not blocked so CA and CD can still deal consistent damage

[violet sable]

Not against an early spear trying to eco snipe you

[cunning path]

So uhh right
Start of he game send spearton in to attack workers

Every game even without parry

Cause the parry doesn't effect CA you illiterate fool

[violet sable]

Where does it say that?

[cunning path]

"Stun and splash damage cannot parry and cannot be parried"

[violet sable]

CA damage against a single target isn't splash damage

[cunning path]

It still can't be parried just like sickle and rip can't either

Thought that was obvious

[violet sable]

It wasn't obvious

[cunning path]

I overestimated the intelligence apparently

[violet sable]

You only said it about splash and stun, not the single-target damage

I'm talking about the single-target damage

When I complain about HHW spear start becoming even more powerful

Because realistically, against HHW spear start the CA won't be dealing any splash damage, only the single-target damage

[cunning path]

Ok give me a sec lemme stupidify it for you

[violet sable]

Fym stupidify

You never said anything about single-target damage being unparryable

Only splash damage and stun being unparryable

[cunning path]

Happy now?

[violet sable]

You should've included that earlier

[cunning path]

I figured you were at least adept enough to understand what I meant when I said stun and splash but i was wrong

[violet sable]

You never specified anything about the single-target damage of the things that have splash damage

[cunning path]

Either that or your actively trying to find loopholes in my words cause you dislike it

[cunning path]

Cuz I didn't have to

Any person could have understood that

[violet sable]

You did

You only said stun and splash damage, and the base attacks are NOT splash damage

[cunning path]

When a giant hits someone do you think tiny sword is gonna win or big fckn club and a dead body?

[violet sable]

Unironically a swordwrath can solo a giant in a 1v1

[cunning path]

Why would a parry halve/block the damage but stm deal the stun???

[cunning path]

True but not without UC

[violet sable]

You could probably pull it off with enough torturing yourself with way too much micro

Honestly probably not

But maybe it's possible

[cunning path]

Theoretically it's possible if you threat it to he millisecond decisions

Either way I'm genuinely disappointed in you

[tepid oriole]

He oi the legend

[cunning path]

Why do you think I had such high hopes

[tepid oriole]

How?

i didn't

[tepid oriole]

Well

He has a poinr

[tepid oriole]

@fallen pond

[fallen pond]

people are generally less technical than what you’d expect, better ask questions to clear confusions first before continuing to assumptions

the concept is interesting, but I personally don’t like how its going to be applied

like yknow, drop the mechanic to everyone except AOE/Splash without much consideration to the early phase of the game

there should be more changes to this aside from adding the parry mechanic itself

for example, UC ignore nerf, maybe get it tied to something like a card(CW or upgrades)so early isn’t busted. and most importantly be critical to what the parry does, you can’t just say 50-100% dmg reduction then add a little mechanic that tried to mitigate near invincible UC with parry. because balance wise anyone smart enough will immedietely pull away from approve button because clearly it has some unchecked dangers to game balance

[violet sable]

I probably should've mentioned that this just further nerfs underpowered units and make already strong units even more powerful

[fallen pond]

that is true, that one of the bad side effects this does and is clearly overlooked

strong units will benefit more from this than underpowered units

thats why I dislike how its designed to be a universal mechanic

[violet sable]

Shadows got less unique and indirectly nerfed too, spears, and overall units with snappy attacks (mainly spears tbh) got buffed further, and units with slow attack speed or attacks with longer "start lag" as genericalt calls it got nerfed further as not only will it be easy to parry them, it's also hard to parry with them

[fallen pond]

My poor Zarek

[violet sable]

The only underpowered unit that I see actually benefiting from this is sickles since they have the same attack animations as swords

[tight pine]

eh...

how is this nessessary?

[cosmic wing]

Nope
I don't think I even need to explain how bad this would be to fight against
Spears already ate strong
But if you uc a spearton because they have a very quick animation start up they will most likely deflect the projectile
This also buffs crawlers too
Because they have a quick attack if their small hitbox and their movement is not enough....

[sour edge]

....what

[cunning path]

Tbf I was tired as hell when i made this and wanted to push it out while it was still fresh in my mind

[cunning path]

While your right
A jug versing a swordwrath is pretty obvious who's gonna win that even without parry
You have to get multiple light units anyway to effectively kill the jug
Single archers can still take on singular units but if said unit is UC then it just makes them harder to kill but not impossible
On top of that an archidon can't parry due to them not having a malee attack
The fix to counter parrying is just more units the only issue is I haven't though much of early to mid game with this so stuff will likely be changed

[cunning path]

Its not its just a fun idea I figured I'd share

[violet sable]

The only reason this would be good is to give swords and sickles a way to properly fight against archer start in early game

[cunning path]

Why do you keep thinking Sickles have the ability to parry???

[violet sable]

Other than that, it just makes the game more unnecessarily complicated and fcks up the balance of early-mid game

[violet sable]

Oh right, the fcking base damage with splash thing which makes no sense

[cunning path]

When it comes to a single archer on point hen yeah kinda but once again all you need is 2 or 3 to kick people off the point and the other need to UC heir swordwrath

[cunning path]

Bruh

Its so that way rips can't parry and CA can't be parried
How tf is that stupid to you???

[violet sable]

Why shouldn't ripps be able to parry?

[cunning path]

So they aren't as hard to deal with

[violet sable]

For CA, it makes sense, but for other things, absolutely no sense

[violet sable]

Pretty sure you already said that only 1 attack can be parried at a time, ripps really aren't cheap, and they have a 2 seconds attack speed

[cunning path]

Sickles and marrowkai are the only 2 I can see being effective negatively here

[cunning path]

Yes if they could parry then they could arguably hold 2 units for an absurdly long time
If they could be parried ut renders the completely useless as a pick and just makes them even more of a damage sponge then they already are

Marrowkai will also be able to attack whenever and not have his attacks blocked so his long hit time will at least be consistent

[violet sable]

Ripps would be affected the least by this (other than obvious units like giants and spellcasters)

[cunning path]

Sicklewrath strength isn't hampered by parries either so they can still melt hordes

[cunning path]

Explain dude

[violet sable]

1. Most expensive tank
2. Slow ass attack speed

[cunning path]

If the slow attack speed can be parried then why tf are ou wasting money

[violet sable]

Their movement is also rather unpredictable, so parrying them really won't be that easy since you won't be able to effectively predict which unit they will hit

[cunning path]

But if it is AI being able to do this then theres a half decent chance they'll parry it
If a person really grinds that skill on parrying then they could arguably do it consistently

[violet sable]

Nope

[cunning path]

Yes

[violet sable]

It doesn't matter on the player's parrying skill, it matters on their hitbox knowledge

[cunning path]

It matters on both

[violet sable]

It's hard to predict which unit ripps will hit, which is what would make them hard to parry

[cunning path]

People who want to grind that knowledge and skill will and they will use that effectively

[violet sable]

Also you said that this is an UC exclusive, right?

[cunning path]

It can be but whether it is or isn't it still gonna make rips even less useful

[violet sable]

In an actual battle, rippriders attack patterns are too unpredictable

[cunning path]

When theres more than 1 yeah but with a skillful player I don't think it'd be that hard

[violet sable]

Actually, it's going to make them more useful since while the ripp can consistently parry, the enemy won't be able to

[cunning path]

That's assuming they're UC though

[violet sable]

Due to ripps movement, they're basically constantly switching their target, which would make it too hard to parry them

I will delete you from existence if you say that this parrying feature isn't UC-exclusive

[cunning path]

But if it's AI parry then it's not gonna matter unless there's only like 5 guys
Them attacking an army of people will just parry their 2 sec attack speed and deal no damage

[cunning path]

Its the under the notice that it could be or couldn't be
I take both into account

[violet sable]

This feature is already broken enough with it being UC-exclusive

[cunning path]

Either way assuming a rip can be parried it makes them useless
Not to mention if they parry others there still taking damage from the army while doing no damage

[cunning path]

It'd just make fights last longer is all it would do
Your acting like a single swordwrath could solo a general and win which even with this they still can't

[violet sable]

Assuming that this feature is UC-exclusive, it's going to be too hard to parry ripps due to them constantly switching targets because of their AI

[violet sable]

A single spearton could solo xiphos head-on with enough skill

[cunning path]

Same with juggerknight but he parry doesn't exactly give xiphos any edges

It just means they hit eachother and did less damage
So what

[violet sable]

A jugg wouldn't be able to

[cunning path]

I've done It with jug before

[violet sable]

Because juggs have a slow attack speed and can't benefit as much as spears from this

[cunning path]

True

[violet sable]

This basically has the same problem as the overhauled upgrade system

[cunning path]

How's that

[violet sable]

Some units benefit less than they should and some units benefitting too much

[cunning path]

Who benefits too much then?

[violet sable]

Spears

[cunning path]

Shadows I can see being nerfed since everyone can parry

[violet sable]

Swords and crawlers benefit a lot from it too

[violet sable]

Not just that, they don't have a snappy attack, which means that their one advantage can be used against them by other units

[cunning path]

A snappy attack?

[violet sable]

An attack animation where the attacks lands pretty much right at the start of the animation

[cunning path]

Bt they should circumvent that with he increased damage

On top of that their parry ability will still stun

And it can block stuns and splash

[violet sable]

Don't bring shadowrath parry into this, it's legit broken OP

[cunning path]

Lol k

[violet sable]

I hate how weak shadowspear is

[cunning path]

So assuming this is UC specific then only 1 spear ot of the force will be able to pary
A spear even without UC can still hold a point for early to midgame as well as scare off cowardly archers or take on 2 swordwrath

[violet sable]

Spear start will become so, SO much more powerful

[cunning path]

As soon as that person gets more than 2 or 3 units then your reliability on parry falters almost completely

[violet sable]

Nope, you'll still be parrying some damage

[cunning path]

In the sense of holding the point for longer yeah kinda but not unbeatable

[cunning path]

Some doesn't mean all

[violet sable]

It's still going to be a pretty big advantage

[cunning path]

3 swords ok maybe they'd be able to better defend against but anymore than that no

[violet sable]

Pretty much negating the DPS of one unit in early-mid game is a big advantage

[cunning path]

Yeah but that's kinda only to spears
I don't see many other units benefiting from this
Crawlers tou can argue but their health pool is small

And once again it's only 1 crawler

[violet sable]

Crawlers being able to block CW archer arrows

[cunning path]

They playing fetch

[fallen pond]

anyone has tp to top?

[fallen pond]

nvm

what if, parry only negates either The base dmg or the bonus damage part of an attack.
wether its base dmg or bonus dmg being parried, it may depend on balancing, melee or ranged attack, or even a player card/unit specific effect.
(for flexibility)

status effects still carries through when parried as usual. (counter)

parry immunity of consecutive succession will be removed, since it can no longer parry up to 100% anyway.

splash attacks can now parry and be parried, either a parried splash attacks does no splash, or the full damage still executes to others except to the unit that parried the attack.
you can even choose wether the UCed unit can only parry splash if its the main target, otherwise it only parries the splash that would otherwise deal dmg to itself only.
a player card can have its own specific mechanic that interacts differently with splash, like maybe its parry removes the splash’s bonus dmg even for the splashed targets.
(this part is also a very flexible part)

AOE units cannot be parried in anyway, trying to parry an attack with stun or knockback makes the UCed unit recieve knockback(for stuns) or full knockback distance(for knockback) that ignores stun immunity. (counter)

I think this one gives more space for expansion of mechanics, and balancing since there are many options.

its not just this unit can’t parry and be parried or the parry negating 50-100% of damage.
excluding AOE/stuns, which would be the natural counter of parry

[civic sage]

Tp to top

[proud onyx]

This idea sucks hard

[cunning path]

So when it comes to splash both the base damage and splash damage itself cannot be parried in return units who have splash cannot parry either
It does not matter if it's a single target or multiple targets it is not effected by the parry mechanic
This is so that CA cannot have their shots blocked
Sicklewrath can arguably be more consistent in damage
Ripriders aren't able to live longer and can (again) deal more consistent damage as opposed to normal units
And for marrowkai himself to be better at dealing damage as well
(This consistency is very meager through and add little to nothing in the way of balance)

As for not being able to parry stuns and the bass damage with the attack
Its so that units can't parry magic attacks or boulders from egaints as that would render both of those units relatively useless against UC but it also in most cases just makes sense
A person isn't going to block a giant club that's twice their size coming down on their head

[tepid oriole]

This is a great idea, but needs improvement.

because this would make user control far too overpowered

because if you have good reaction time, then the opponent would recognize the attack pattern on what time they are gonna attack, and predicting every attack making the opponent parry every single attack.

vague explanation

but you get the point

but overall this is good, just needs a little push.