spoiler-chat

[reef compass]

maybe Euleria

[balmy storm]

She cut off her husbands arm 😭

[reef compass]

well when they were already nuts

[balmy storm]

She is not stable lmao

[reef compass]

i would excuse "being turned inside out by infestation"

[thick jolt]

I dont think euleria would have cared

[abstract sorrel]

The issue is that you, Ducky, are coming from the view of the Orokin are all terrible and needed to be exterminated, when in situations like these it is best to come from a point of neutrality and not acting as though they are all the same.

Some Orokin without a doubt knew their society was going to shit

[thick jolt]

.....

[reef compass]

which is why its kinda hard for us to not hate Ballas guts cause the things he does got quite personal

[worn fjord]

As Roathe says “Well. Save the Executors. They were a lost cause. It may shock you to know Ballas was not the worst of them.”

[reef compass]

and in exchange, project on the orokin society

[balmy storm]

I know they’re not ALL the same but rather varying degrees of awful.

I don’t think someone who’s willing to murder untold amounts of children for purely selfish reasons should lead humanity
And that fits every Orokin ever!

[reef compass]

pretty sure most of the playerbase before this update was "well why not we just burn all of orokin stuff once we are done and melt all that gold from the void towers"

[undone lodge]

The Orokin era was a dark age. Sure the technology was good and there was a lot of, art and stuff ig, but the Orokin’s reign got pretty grim overall

The Orokin tortured people and treasured the memories - preserving them forever in ayatans, took on the role of tyrants who could take and do what they wanted, rewrote laws as they pleased, had entire armies fight and die for petty causes (as opposed to an actual, even minor goal of any kind), ran an entire caste of slaves, discriminated on even slight “flaws”, punishing scholars/researchers for making suggestions they didn’t like or even just choose

[abstract sorrel]

I was raised on the belief of giving everyone the benefit of the doubt individually until they give me reason to not and do otherwise.

I do the same for everyone

[balmy badger]

I still refuse to believe that. Ballas tried to destroy the entire system just because of relationship issues

[balmy storm]

I don’t think that applies to a group like the Orokin who are equatable to billionaires, tyrants and psychopaths beyond help

[reef compass]

oh I can also say that but definitely there will be some point ever when afflicted personally by something, that's kinda hard to abide by

[unique wagon]

if I bang marie, do I access her brother's furniture shop?

[hearty pendant]

woa

[obtuse gyro]

what a way to derail LOL

[balmy storm]

Bruh

[balmy storm]

No

[unique wagon]

sorry, public chat said so...

[obtuse gyro]

no. Romancing marie is independent from unlocking lyon

[undone lodge]

Tbf here he’s saying Nitokh, the one who wanted to kill everyone and bring about bring about societal collapse because she was bored, is worse

[reef compass]

you will get that way before
the furniture shop

[abstract sorrel]

The Orokin once believed in honor and integrity, and even believed in and practiced dualism. They were not always the Orokin we saw and knew of

[undone lodge]

And even then he admits that Narmer Ballas might be worse

[abstract sorrel]

That is why I give the Orokin the benefit of the doubt

[thick jolt]

Again dude snapped because his lover cared for orphans...... and roathe suggests that happened even before she was hurt..... that relationship really wasnt gonna end well

[abstract sorrel]

Because I KNOW they can be better

[balmy storm]

If the Orokin originated as the ORO company then, nah

[balmy storm]

When literally forced with no other option lmao

[unique wagon]

wait I gotta socialize in that 1999 computer to access the lyon unlock?

[balmy storm]

The only Orokin that’s somewhat bettered themselves is Albrecht who was traumatized by something he did not understand

[reef compass]

oh it definitely wasnt, roathe already said that orokin loved and hated and lived "passionately" always so such things were... normal <_<u

[hearty pendant]

the pom-2 yes

[balmy storm]

Yes there needs to be a catalyst, that catalyst has never been them by themselves wanting to not be awful

[unique wagon]

fml...I suck at socializing, even with AI; any cheat sheets?

[worn fjord]

Get Marie to Liked to talk to Lyon

[balmy badger]

Kimulacrum, if you don't care about spoilers.

[hearty pendant]

kimulacrum, but the flowcharts for the triad are uh. a bit complex.

[balmy storm]

Oh also replace Orokin with any group that’s terrible

[abstract sorrel]

We literally don’t know that because we don’t know enough about the Imperial Era or the Orokin who lived then to see any Orokin who might have been different

[obtuse gyro]

I mean, Im all for giving second chances appropriately, but uh. The Empire as a collective was rotten. If you avoid monoliths, which you yourself say you should, then the Empire must die, even if the "better" ones live

but also again, the tenno may have been the knife, but they were being wielded

[balmy storm]

If any better Orokin existed I would imagine we would have known about them, that they would have lasted
But they didn’t and we don’t.

[thick jolt]

The moment they start using kuva i'd say they have gone too far

Dunno what imperial era headcannon you have but my line is drawn when they decide using kuva was totally cool

[balmy storm]

Being part of their society corrupts you, from childhood.

[reef compass]

doesnt the voice log of Roathe ||where he talks about people he laments like the faithful one he abandons or the grineer that stays at the turret|| count?

[obtuse gyro]

The notion that we did the system dirty by destroying the empire gives us way too much agency for what actually happend

[balmy storm]

Even the children were morally corrupt tbh
The bluva story for instance

[obtuse gyro]

Like your point of contention was "what if there were orokin capable of reform? they shouldnt have died!" which is fine and all, but their system cannot continue

you cannot "save" the orokin if their system is not destroyed

[reef compass]

did we kill those children though?

[hearty pendant]

that's the whole reason roathe can be redeemed

[balmy storm]

A “good Orokin” isn’t an Orokin anymore

[reef compass]

I believe the Tenno just did the Night of Naga Drums? the other deaths would have been grineer rebellion and such

[obtuse gyro]

and then you have two different groups (ballas and the sentients) who want all the empire gone, theyre the ones pushing us into the Night of Naga drums. Trying to save the Orokin is a lost cause because of them

[balmy storm]

Not us specifically but in theory a tenno had to kill Orokin children
Which is horrible
Until you remember even the children seemed pretty awful

seriously the Bluva story shows us that even as children they were terrible-

[reef compass]

ah that naberus one? i dont have access to it afaik

but i willl take you for it XD

[balmy storm]

An Orokin baby, if one existed at the time should not have been killed ofc
But they wouldn’t even grow to be an Orokin cause they weren’t even a person yet

[balmy storm]

It’s about some Orokin children using temp kuva to body snatch some modified ostrons for halloween costumes

Psychotic stuff

They ofc got what they deserved, their kuva was swapped for the real stuff

[reef compass]

Werner Herzog would be proud

[balmy storm]

But it shows us what the children had access to and what they were like

[unique wagon]

man, I didn't know the lore here was that dark already...

about time...

[reef compass]

old lore was quite so

[thick jolt]

Always was

This has never been a utopic sci fi

[reef compass]

if you have checked the Arlo's story that was pretty messed up

you can check it in Nightwave

[thick jolt]

It's always been a distopia at best

[worn fjord]

In Roathe’s own words: “I will not apologize for the Orokin Empire, as I was not its creator, merely a denizen of it. But neither will I take any blame for planning to tear it down around me. We deserved what we received, and worse.”

“If there is a single thing I feel guilt for? It is that the Tenno were responsible for finally burning it all down, and not me.”

[obtuse gyro]

DE giggling as they prevent roathe from utilising any of the various methods of timetravel to go to the night of naga drums and joining the tenno

[worn fjord]

There’s also more in the story logs but yea

[balmy storm]

Bro would be shot on sight

[thick jolt]

Yeahhhh

[worn fjord]

Hah ..that would be interesting to say the least

[reef compass]

Choosing Uriel and protoframe skin doesnt count? X3

[balmy storm]

Oh wow Roathe agreed with me wowie

[reef compass]

Tho I would take Umbra there <_<

[balmy storm]

Bro was locked inside a lab on Lua ):

And Uriel was lost by the time of the naga drums

[reef compass]

No I mean when we get to go there

Its not an if is a when

[thick jolt]

If we ever go there it will just be another dark refractory thing so wouldnt change anything

[balmy storm]

If we do it’s likely as a memory during a quest or something

[worn fjord]

Lol but I remember Roathe said “The Tenno would have slaughtered me with all the rest on the night of the Naga Drums. I would have likely died, attempting to save Nitokh's life.”

[balmy storm]

Where we can’t pick what frame we use really

[thick jolt]

There isnt any point in risking ruining the night of naga drums

[balmy storm]

Yeah lmao

[reef compass]

And we will be once again be a darn Excalibur

Nah again we will turn out to be Hildryn because ofc lol

[worn fjord]

And it’s not like he could not save her, it was his “role” in a sense

[thick jolt]

Or another frame yet to be released

[worn fjord]

Even though he was a bit infatuated with her (his words)

[hearty pendant]

i feel like the minority in thinking that we shouldn't ever see the naga drums. or very brief glimpses at most
from a narrative standpoint and like. i don't think it could be done justice

[naive mist]

Watching Bricky's old peace video, did anyone notice this flash the first time youre going back into the dark refractory

[balmy storm]

We noticed that at Tennocon

[reef compass]

Like castlevania never doing the 1999 war 💀

[thick jolt]

Everyone noticed the first time it was shown in tennocon

[worn fjord]

I think for a Night such as that, it can never be done perfectly gameplay wise

[thick jolt]

Youtubers will never bring new stuff to the table even if i like bricky

[naive mist]

I didnt watch tennocon and when I played the quest i didnt notice it

[hearty pendant]

yea its margulis, symbolic of her being the one to lock away the memories, as was thought when it was shown prior

[obtuse gyro]

I would say its a very literal blink and you miss it thing

[hearty pendant]

it is like. one frame. i don't blame you

[thick jolt]

Yup

[naive mist]

also why does margulis not have eyes?

[hearty pendant]

accidentally burned out by a tenno
top contenders are us or rell

[reef compass]

A Tenno voided her eyes out in accident

[abstract sorrel]

You can be Orokin without being evil

[naive mist]

ah, that makes a lot of sense considering it looks like void burns

[thick jolt]

Turns out trauma makes powers really hard to control

[obtuse gyro]

missed my point completely

[balmy storm]

Thanks Wally, for both

[obtuse gyro]

the system cannot continue

it doesnt matter the moral standing of a blue-skinned aristocrat or what have you

the system is what must go

[balmy storm]

Name one Orokin that wasn’t evil that wasn’t forced to change from an outside force such as anything from the void, infestation or the tenno

[reef compass]

Does Suda count?

[thick jolt]

They are still gonna ignore other characters in universe not seeing any other option besides kill the orokin

[unique wagon]

what do you replace the system with then, anarchy?

[obtuse gyro]

shes an archemedian no?

[misty sand]

Quick question how mutch do i have to go to decendia for Roathe to talk to me again

[balmy storm]

Not an Orokin!

[thick jolt]

Archimedean

[balmy storm]

He has 21 VMs

[obtuse gyro]

I mean, not necessarily.

Like roathe's attempt at replacing the system might have worked if he was given a chance, and that's not anarchy

did you perhaps confuse me saying "the system must go" with "any systems cannot exist"?

[misty sand]

Soo how many runs is that

[reef compass]

Obviously a zealous capitalist state

[unique wagon]

yep

[balmy storm]

Why are your options
Terrible system OR anarchy
???

[thick jolt]

And again roathe also admitted he may also not be able to let go of power

[balmy storm]

21

[obtuse gyro]

I mean, technically he only says:

[thick jolt]

Which would just eventually loop back into a similar situation

[obtuse gyro]

https://tenor.com/view/kanye-raise-award-well-never-know-oh-well-gif-5061742

But he does say he genuinely thought he would have

[misty sand]

I need to go 21 ish times top to bottom ?

[balmy storm]

No, 21 boss fights with him

[obtuse gyro]

but then wraps it with "no way to find out now lol"

[balmy storm]

You can just replay it afaik

[unique wagon]

Well, I was going to ask what other systems of governance could work besides the Orokin Empire, but one could argue it was inevitable. The orokin empire does take place in the future. At least within this sci-fi world, it was inevitable.

[worn fjord]

Roathe’s plan - “I would ensure that all the Executors and the Emperors would be... removed, and I would take over as Interim Executor until a new system could be put into place.”

[obtuse gyro]

An empire who's heads dont last forever, thats for one

[balmy storm]

I mean anarchy has been better ngl
We just gotta keep the peace now

But a better possible system absolutely exists

[thick jolt]

And like bau mentioned earlier
There were a lot of things in motion

[obtuse gyro]

roathe's diagnoses of where the empire started to go wrong, was when it started lasting too long

[balmy storm]

And he toootally wouldn’t be corrupt and would absolutely give up power!

[balmy storm]

Oh so like most TV shows

[thick jolt]

Who wouda thunk that stagnation is bad

[balmy storm]

[unique wagon]

If someone is ruler for a long-term, like never dies, they might as well eventually not value temporary fragile lives to their own. Similar to elves in lord of the rings lore...

[balmy storm]

Even if we didn’t slaughter all the Orokin (likely the only real option) we’d have to figure out a better system
And
The tenno are just children, that should not be their job (not should being child soldiers)

[fading current]

Ugh…my stupid heart. I am falling for the orokin proto…eh whatever I’m sure Amir will understand lol

[balmy storm]

Yes that’s the entire Orokin group and empire

They’re all practically immortal people who care not for anyone but themselves

[fading current]

Roathe has this hold on my heart that I can’t explain….

[balmy storm]

Almost purely greedy and selfish to their core
I say almost cause Albrecht exists and he was one of, if not the only known exception for the time

[unique wagon]

children as soldiers, reminds me of the spartan program in Halo, lol

[obtuse gyro]

took them 4 generations to figure out how to not use kids

[worn fjord]

Although this is important context -

VM: DIPLOMACY

|| Roathe: Among the Seven Executors, Ballas had styled himself first among equals. ||

|| Ever the diplomat, ever the honey-voiced persuader, he resolved the grudges and disputes of the others. ||

|| I found, to my utter glee, that he was now the rose caught between two thickets of thorns. ||

|| The warmonger faction, headed by Nitokh, pulled one way. The pacifists, under Scarne, pulled another. ||

|| Ballas was obliged to decide, and earn the scathing enmity of whichever cadre he did not side with. ||

|| For reasons I cannot guess, he chose peace; it was four to three, and so the ravening Sentients were suddenly allies and friends. ||

|| "One way or another, he shall come around," Nitokh promised, even as I was dispatched to seek out malcontents among the garrisoned Dax. ||

[obtuse gyro]

funny enough only the SIIIs were actually deployed kids

SIs failed and were crippled adults, SIIs were deployed as adults SIIIs were deployed as children and SIVs started as adults

[unique wagon]

IDK if the human mind can tolerate immortality tbh, might just turn insane or irrational after many years.

I'm more concerned about the man in the wall though.

cuz the parents of the tenno killed each other like crazy peeps

while the tenno kids hid, wonder if the same happened to the tenno

during that night of w/e

[fading current]

Does Roathe have any VM’s about the Tenno or warframe project? So far it’s been about the sentients and the start of the war for me and that’s about it.

Lowkey after he was talking about certain things I was certain warframes were going to be brought up next. But idk if they were and I missed it or haven’t gotten it yet. My brain be messing with me like that….

[worn fjord]

Yupp there are

[thick jolt]

He wasnt the head of that project so i dunno what you expect him to say that ballas (who lead the warframe project) didnt

[worn fjord]

But like not in detail

[hearty pendant]

the parents were driven mad and the children given powers to defend themselves
both by wally
the night of naga drums was orchestrated by ballas, directly commanded by lotus, and executed by the tenno
unrelated to wally

[fading current]

Perfection 😈

[balmy storm]

If the voices took hold again at any point it would have been during the night of the naga drums but that’s speculative and highly unlikely as the only other time our Tenno would leave a pod would be to assist the Lotus against Erra

[unique wagon]

ah I don't know much about the night of naga drums...guess ballas wanted the lotus to destroy the tenno too, afterwards...

[balmy storm]

I wonder how many of the seven were planning on killing the others tbh

Not a great set of leaders tbh

[hearty pendant]

i wouldn't be surprised if the voices were present for the drums, but i'm not sure how much control they would've had, considering the tenno would've been in the second dream at that time

[unique wagon]

probably all of them

[thick jolt]

Probably yeah

[worn fjord]

In Roathe’s words, Orokin betrayed each other quite often

[fading current]

Didn’t Wally have something to do with us, the group of Tenno and the lotus against erra??? Like we had his eyes. Maybe she made some deal with the man in the walls to protect us??? IDKKKKK.

There’s also her line in old peace where she screams “NOT YET” in both her tone and in Wally’s tone.

[hearty pendant]

we were in the second dream at the time, the eyes are probably due to being in stasis rather than wally

[fading current]

Yet they’re the same exact eyes as when wallly is in control

[balmy storm]

Ah yes such a great society

[unique wagon]

yeah, not a coincidence, imo either

regarding the wally eyes

[fading current]

THANK YOU!!!

I know it isn’t a coincidence lol

[hearty pendant]

what does wally have to gain by being in control then? we blast erra and go back to sleep

[thick jolt]

The best joke in this update is that the devil who is being judged constantly plays devil's advocate

[worn fjord]

Lol I can tell you’re still thinking about the previous convo

[fading current]

Ask lotus, cuz clearly some type of deal was made between the two. Especially based off recent dialogue after lotus eaters.

[hearty pendant]

whuh

[balmy storm]

orokin apologists make me angry

[hearty pendant]

i don't understand where the 'lotus made a deal' thing comes from

[balmy storm]

its like being an apologist for some other specific groups in the world who are irredeemable

[worn fjord]

But I think it went okay.. at least it didn’t escalate that much

[thick jolt]

People mixing up entirely separate lines while she is on the wally precipice

[balmy storm]

theory based off the moving the moon line despite us seeing the exact tech she used which originated from the Orokin lol

[balmy storm]

I think they recognized nobody was going to agree with them much on their points

like the Orokin are very clearly not a good set of people

even on individual levels they are
not great!

[thick jolt]

The mighty deal......that was broken by shooting at a piece of machinery....

[balmy storm]

LOL

[fading current]

At this point her moving the moon into the void is not whatever deal she could’ve made with Wally. That was all clearly orokin tech based to phase the moon in and out of sol.

I’m def on the theory she had some kind of deal with the man in the walls and we’re not sure what it is or what consequences it has but it HAD to have been for us Tenno. If not…there’s another twist incoming.

Just with how the lotus saw the man in the wall at the end of new war, refused to explain what she saw and more.

[thick jolt]

I am fairly sure until lotus eaters she couldn't even perceive wally

[hearty pendant]

please. what is the more.
she said she didn't see anything, sure, but that isn't evidence of collaboration?

[worn fjord]

Mmhmm again I think - apart from the whole Orokin thing - if I were to look at it from an objective point of view, I think they couldn’t come to terms with all those people dying. And that’s where their point stems from

[thick jolt]

Wouldn't be the first time we see someone with synthetic senses not perceive wally either

[fading current]

She keeps saying post lotus eaters she wants to give us to the man in the wall. Something more is happening between the lotus and indifference than we players are aware of

[hearty pendant]

that's evidence of her Not Seeing Anything or lying about it because it would be more comforting in the moment
its not the first time for that either. see all of war within

[balmy storm]

I mean I get that, I really do but even from an objective pov the Orokin were awful and there realistically wasn't much better options

[unique wagon]

probably why the anarchy faction exists, the rebels

[tropic venture]

Even if the current way isn't necessarily better, the Orokin simply could not be allowed to remain, lest it be the end of everything

[hearty pendant]

"You, my child. The Great Indifference wants to take. I want to let it. I feel... only the call."
the voidsong, which is ringing out throughout the system, that the holdfasts are.. holding against. she drowns it out with her own voice to avoid being affected by it

[thick jolt]

Nah that was just part of nitohks plot

[balmy storm]

the anarchs? they exist cause they were promised Tau for fighting in the war and then the peace happened
it was all an Orokin plot anyway

[unique wagon]

ah oof

[worn fjord]

Yea and it’s kinda unfortunate they couldn’t see the point we were trying to make but it is what it is I suppose. This game’s story is not black and white

[balmy storm]

i'm also pretty sure the Orokin are the fascists??

[fading current]

She constantly wants to give us thou. Again, there’s something more with her and the indifference than we know

[balmy storm]

yeah it's very much gray
the closest thing we have to a wholly good character is probably Ticker

[fading current]

She may be fighting against it but WHY, why does SHE have a specific relationship with this being? When did she come into contact with it? And if when? What did it say to our lotus??

[worn fjord]

Oh Ticker, yes definitely

[hearty pendant]

she spent the entirely of chains of harrow denying that he existed because she Didn't Think He Existed

[tropic venture]

That's why she's the goat, the GOAT

[worn fjord]

(My heart just grew hearing her name)

[fading current]

And yet that mission and new war proved her beyond wrong lmao

[balmy storm]

she is the goat yes :)

[unique wagon]

lotus wasn't the only one having issues with the man in the wall too

there was the 1999 scientist dude too

[fading current]

Well yea no duh lol.

[thick jolt]

You assume she saw wally but consider these lines

[unique wagon]

I wonder if the 3 are connected somehow

[hearty pendant]

yeah??? so when would she have made a deal with the entity that, her first confirmation of him existing, is Rell. The Sentinel.

[fading current]

She saw the same thing we saw 🤷🏻

[thick jolt]

You are still assuming that

[fading current]

As we all are with these things lmao

[hearty pendant]

we have more from albrecht's notes that says synthetic equipment wouldn't pick up wally iirc

[thick jolt]

I gave you an example of another character with synthetic senses that describes a piece of wally as a nothing

[fading current]

Nothing has been proven right? Give me the lore statements where all of what you said is true.

[thick jolt]

Oh excuse me lmao

I have produced my evidence, where is yours?

[hearty pendant]

there's far more evidence on one side than there are for the other
which i have been giving examples of, and you've been saying 'nuh uh' to

[fading current]

You’ve literally given nothing lol

[tropic venture]

I need to farm more debt bonds for her Honoria

[worn fjord]

I love that. Roathe being Devil’s advocate is such a great idea story wise

[fading current]

Your “evidence” has provided nothing so idk what you mean

[balmy storm]

saaame
somedasy I will have it lol

[thick jolt]

Oh so you are one of those
I have my headcannon trust me bro

[fading current]

Ah so you’re one of those as well. Gotcha.

[worn fjord]

Wait what happened

[unique wagon]

to be fair, the game was pretty unclear in that scene at the end of war within

[fading current]

https://tenor.com/view/albrecht-entrati-the-man-in-the-wall-warframe-1999-warframe-you-are-late-warframe-jojo-gif-4432154459658682236

[unique wagon]

was a cliff hanger imo

[hearty pendant]

"And while there have been countless souls who have followed me through, with their light-skippers, and field-wave skins and vari-eyed instruments... not a single one ever saw him."

[thick jolt]

Lotus is a synthetic being
She does not have bilogical senses

Cephalon cy also perceives the world through synthetic senses, because he is a cephalon

Both describe a piece of wally as nothing

And yet you just say "lmao that's nothing because i have funny headcannon"

[fading current]

When did I ever say headcanon?

Now you are placing words in my mouth lmao

I did not ever say “lmao that’s nothing because I have funny headcanon” no where did I say that yet you put those words in my mouth.

[thick jolt]

You have produced no evidence so what you said so far is just as good as headcannon

So what do you have that is in favor of your idea?

[fading current]

So just cuz I haven’t gone out of my way to show you evidence you automatically condemned me to “headcanon” and decided to put words into my mouth that I said such things????? Wow

[thick jolt]

When you end a bunch of sentences with lmao yeah

[hearty pendant]

i requested evidence and what you returned with is just as much evidence for the opposite interpretation as it is for yours, if not more

[tropic horizon]

IDK what's going on here and I'm not too invested but at least one person here is acting like they think headcanon is a bad thing and I'm just wondering if that's a common opinion

[worn fjord]

I think this is going a bit out of hand

[fading current]

Who even cares anymore. Even if I have sources you won’t believe me so what’s the point???

[hearty pendant]

headcanon, when treated as canon, is a bad thing
headcanon on its own is fine
imo at least

[thick jolt]

Ok i will rephrase

Evidenceless affirmations they use to laugh at others in the conversation

I did get emotional

But i personally find it very bad when you just deny the other party's point and end all sentences with lmao

[tropic horizon]

oh, good, thanks

[fading current]

Have a freaking merry Christmas yall. Just gonna call it a night instead of doing anything else cus it’s 4 am and I don’t have the energy to go and literally look up sources and stuff. I’ll do that tomorrow and tag you if I freaking have to but right now? Bedtime!!! 4 am. I’m way too tired for that bs lol

[hearty pendant]

ok 👍

[tropic venture]

https://tenor.com/view/rage-gif-25113751

[fading current]

Last thing I wanna do is turn my grouchy side on this amazing community so GOODNIGHT

[tropic horizon]

goodnight, rest well!

[fading current]

https://tenor.com/view/warframe-warframe-1999-warframe-loid-loid-entrati-gif-17024902272398978290

[fading current]

You as well, Tenno!!!!!

[unique wagon]

the thing that's interesting is that sentient friend in the old peace practically makes you the tenno into a god, kinda

[hearty pendant]

hm?

[thick jolt]

The revive thing?

[unique wagon]

yeah

[tropic horizon]

Adis... I finished Old Peace two days ago and I'm still upset about what happened to Adis

[thick jolt]

I am a bit skeptical on that one tbh

Like it doesnt sound like it was a particularly unique thing to revive others, at least in the height of the orokin empire

Maybe among sentients

[abstract sorrel]

I’m fine with that

[unique wagon]

also they said the sentients have a hive mind originally

[thick jolt]

But not particularly in the empire

[abstract sorrel]

I’m just not fine with what exists currently

[hearty pendant]

other tenno are more than likely able to revive as well
i have a tinfoil hat theory about this thing but i'll keep it for now
lotus says she's trying to surge the revive systems of a mirage that she was losing during the old war, during hidden messages

[abstract sorrel]

The Grineer and Corpus have proven themselves utterly inept in all facets of ruling

[obtuse gyro]

what exists currently is a result of several layers of orokin consequences

[tropic horizon]

yeah
It felt more like a temporary power boost than a permanant one

[abstract sorrel]

The very IDEA of the corpus is built on profit and profit alone

[thick jolt]

Wonder if it really was a general hivemind or if that was just the fragment's pov when controlled by their original sentient

[abstract sorrel]

The whole thing is rotted to the core

[unique wagon]

I think the man in the wall is part of the hivemind somehow, it's part of the void energy.

but idk...

[thick jolt]

No but that wouldnt make sense, isn't void poison to sentients

[obtuse gyro]

there is no empire for the grineer and corpus to rule

they did not take over the reigns

[tropic horizon]

was about to say this myself...

[unique wagon]

that is true...

[zenith jacinth]

Worse than poison, it's like hyper-effective acid

[obtuse gyro]

there are colonies free from the orokin, the grineer, the corpus

[abstract sorrel]

They carved out their own empires from the ruins of the Orokin Empire

Grineer control about half the system and the corpus the other

[thick jolt]

The main reason i am skeptical of any power or light donated by adis is because in my understanding it would just be consumed by the void within the tenno

[obtuse gyro]

unless...

yknow already know what it is

Crackpot void-based Sentient Sentience RAAAAAAAH

[unique wagon]

xD

[thick jolt]

Lol
Maybe

Usual DE just leaving us with more questions lol

Love them tho

[tropic horizon]

I'm so glad I finished the main quest I can actually trust myself to read Spoiler-Chat now!!

[sour oxide]

Yipeee

[unique wagon]

idk, but the endgame enemy is the man in the wall; that shit...wtf

[worn fjord]

I think that’s the whole point DE is trying to make story wise. Corrupt and inept as a whole but then we have characters like Kahl, Veso-R, || Maryna ||that shed light on the good

[hearty pendant]

welcome, then

[zenith jacinth]

For now

[tropic horizon]

thank you!

[obtuse gyro]

and also the tenno now have agency to make things better

1999 is a microcosm of it

[zenith jacinth]

Who's maryna

[obtuse gyro]

where we fight to keep the timeline in the "good" ending

[abstract sorrel]

Drifter isn’t a Tenno

[unique wagon]

need more time travel, reeeeeeeeeee

[worn fjord]

Roathe VM story, you want to know the details?

[zenith jacinth]

Drifter is a tenno

[thick jolt]

I think it is extremely unlikely but i would really love if my shower thought that wally was just ascended alternate reality humanity that forgot about everything until they met albrecht became real

[hearty pendant]

after the new war, they effectively are

[fading current]

Think our next batch of protos will be from XXX9? Lol

Albrecht just exploring all the 9’s 🤣

I…need to go to bed so bad lol

[zenith jacinth]

Every kid from the ten-zero/O is a tenno

[obtuse gyro]

0099, give me "My dad saw Jesus get crucified"

[unique wagon]

oh god, time travel, and other dimensions; great the whole sci-fi mess

[hearty pendant]

which proto would be saying this
i need to know

[zenith jacinth]

Eeeh probably grandpa knowing lifespans back then

[worn fjord]

Exactly, for a long time it was just being part of syndicates, but now as the story develops, I’m beginning to think there’s stuff we’ll be able to do

[tropic horizon]

0009, he just makes Jesus a protoframe

[abstract sorrel]

Albrecht should’ve just let Roathe do his coup

Roathe was trying to pull a General Zod and Albrecht messed it up

[thick jolt]

Main reason i thought that was DE's statement that "there are no aliens in warframe" and wally felt like too much of an outlier to that, granted tinted by my view that wally isn't just CE

[unique wagon]

CE?

[zenith jacinth]

Your pfp reminds me of cult of the lamb

[unique wagon]

also aren't sentients aliens basically?

[tropic horizon]

oh that's cool, I'll take that as a compliment!

[thick jolt]

Conceptual embodyment

Part of one of roathe's chats is him claiming that wally was just conceptual embodyment

[thick jolt]

Created by humanity

[unique wagon]

oh wow...wtf

[thick jolt]

First confirmed alien life we saw was really the xenoflora

[steep hemlock]

so marie is a crazy religious fanatic? I mean yes she's a nun, but I didn't expect to fall in love with the blue devil before listening to my member... the more I talk with her the more I respect and love Roathe and pitty Lyon.

[hearty pendant]

and then we killed it all !

[zenith jacinth]

Probably the best way to take it, it's just the similarities to the titular lamb

[zenith jacinth]

N o

[abstract sorrel]

Roathe is a W

[tropic horizon]

this does raise the question (that I ask myself a lot in many contexts) of how long can a civilization born but no longer living on earth be considered "of earth"

[abstract sorrel]

I would destroy the corpus and Grineer just to give him control of the system ngl

[worn fjord]

..she’s not a “religious fanatic” really.. as someone stated on Reddit - Marie is a kind soul trying to grasp at the notion of personhood, both on others and on herself, as well as coming to terms with the fact that someone that was so kind and instrumental to her life may in fact be a monster. But she is curious, so you play the role of the kind teacher.

[thick jolt]

No idea but when the immortal leaders make the moon a glorified golden trone i think it becomws hard to forget

[zenith jacinth]

That's why we don't say earthlings, we say humans

[unique wagon]

how the hell did humanity create the sentients?

[obtuse gyro]

Jesus would be like 9 lol

[thick jolt]

Was just a corpus archimedean to boot

[hearty pendant]

crewman synthesis shows the proposal of them to the Seven

[zenith jacinth]

Impressive

[abstract sorrel]

[thick jolt]

First instance we got of ballas being a manipulative jerk too if memory serves me

[zenith jacinth]

Back to the orokin empire, let's repeat the cycle

[hearty pendant]

i believe that is correct, yes

[unique wagon]

that's crazy, we created the sentients then have war with them...

[tight pagoda]

Basically they needed something that could adapt to dangers and whatnot and it evolved

[zenith jacinth]

Well they weren't sentient at creation

[thick jolt]

Well they werent supposed to develop sentience
And if they did the void was supposed to kill them

Neither expectation worked

[zenith jacinth]

The sentients started a war after gaining sentience

[lament thicket]

Idk where to put it but I'll just put it here. I can't tell if I'm one step away from dating her or not.

[unique wagon]

but the void didn't kill them?

[steep hemlock]

exept maybe I went in the wrong direction during the Trafger conversation but she sure does sound like one... and I've had enough of taht in my life to lose my patience in these kind of contexts... does she eventually become more reasonable and we get her to reason?

[abstract sorrel]

No because my Drifter would be by his side as his Queen

[thick jolt]

The orokin didnt expect the horse of troy tactic

[zenith jacinth]

Thanks to praghasa transporting all the others

[abstract sorrel]

We would start anew and sever the degeneracy that led humanity to this state

[zenith jacinth]

Impossible

[tropic horizon]

I thought the void just made it impossible for them to reproduce?

[zenith jacinth]

That was the HEAVILY weakened effect

[thick jolt]

Well the original idea was just described as poison

[zenith jacinth]

Direct exposure annihilates sentients

[tropic horizon]

"several people are typing" wow I kicked the hornets nest

[worn fjord]

Oh that convo, I haven’t had that yet but considering what has happened in previous KIM chats like Hex and Roundtable, I’m guessing there will be

[unique wagon]

makes them burn from what I saw ingame

[thick jolt]

And the end result after phragasa ferried the rest of them to origin was that the ones inside were sterilized and phragasa died

[zenith jacinth]

No just dissolves them

Rapidly

[unique wagon]

https://tenor.com/view/same-gif-8650053

[thick jolt]

We do see the state the lotus is in after drifter pulled her out of the void

[steep hemlock]

This is how today's conversation with marie ended and I'm kinda lost on if anything I'm saying is actually reaching her or if I'm pushing her away too much. Spoilers obv, I have hope in DE but I kinda start losing mine for Marie...

[tropic horizon]

anyway, sleep time for me
good talking to you all!

[hearty pendant]

comparing her to someone she hates probably wasn't a great choice there

[abstract sorrel]

She hates Roathe for seemingly no reason

[unique wagon]

xD

[abstract sorrel]

I don’t blame Roathe for not liking her at all tbh

[zenith jacinth]

Roathe is a literal devil to them

[hearty pendant]

she explains why she hates roathe
so does lyon

[reef compass]

I mentioned her about what the faith would say about that and her reaction seemed even more strong xD

[steep hemlock]

I mean I can and I will at this point

[unique wagon]

playing the devil's game, nice

[lament thicket]

idk if I reached that point myself tbh.

[reef compass]

its kinda eerie how she has no notes

[lament thicket]

RIGHT?!

Though I did end today's conversation nicely.

[worn fjord]

I’ll try not to spoil myself but here you can use the Kimulacrum to see the many ways the convo could’ve gone. Search up Marie Rank 5, convo 1 @steep hemlock

[steep hemlock]

mine is the same, I've seen on reddit posts where people had a not saying that she's angry and you need lyon and roathe help or something so maybe we're in the doog route

[lament thicket]

let me quickly ss the end of the convo

[steep hemlock]

after I reach the ending for sure I'm not gonna reset any of my convos ever, don't have the patience

[abstract sorrel]

I mean tbh idc if she’s angry as long as I can romance Roathe

Ultimate power couple tbh

[reef compass]

i still havent reset any, doesnt feel sincere otherwise

[worn fjord]

I just took a glimpse at the flowchart and it’s crazy lmao— I’m ..wondering how this convo will go for me

[steep hemlock]

Dated Eleanor on first try and never looked back ahahahah

[abstract sorrel]

Same with Arthur

[reef compass]

Aoi here, no regrets

[abstract sorrel]

Never even looked at the flowchart I just somehow managed to hit all of the correct nodes

[worn fjord]

Same, trying not to reset

[steep hemlock]

all the people saying the eleanor was hard and unpredictable in the beggining I just found her most relateble

[worn fjord]

I found her relatable too!!!!! She was so cool to talk to

[reef compass]

relatable or not, I find that the mind reader having some outbursts and not checking our state about them idk

[lament thicket]

This is how my conversation ended with her.

[reef compass]

she was very well written with some big buts

[lament thicket]

So... I can only assume I'm doing good...?

[worn fjord]

Is this the Tagfer one

[lament thicket]

I mean surely she isn't fully devouted to Entrati anymore right?

[worn fjord]

Or something else

[reef compass]

that just seems like siding with her

[lament thicket]

Nay. This conversation was about how she feels today.

She essentially tried to dismiss us saying it's nothing major, but we delve further into it.

[reef compass]

which i really refused to do

[lament thicket]

I will date the nun.

Full send.

[worn fjord]

Ah not there yet. But interesting

[lament thicket]

Also speaking of Tagfer...

I DID have a conversation with Roathe about how um... She had a "screaming contest" with Bird 3...

[steep hemlock]

a had this one days ago, it's in part why the recent ones feels so frustrating

[reef compass]

and thats fine, but I wouldnt feel okay dating her through just siding on blind faith for albrecht

[lament thicket]

I thought I had to go talk to Bird 3 but it was just a chemistry convo LMAO

[tropic venture]

it was with Tagfer

Bird 3 was an onlooker

Tagfer and Marie got into a fight about Albrecht

[reef compass]

yeah the screaming was very obviously tagfer

[lament thicket]

Honestly speaking of that gramps, he really is shit at proper explanations. Like PLEASE stop giving us shit and not explain us properly of wtf are their purpose 😭

[reef compass]

bird 3 was just unconsolable

cause of what witnessed

[worn fjord]

I think it’s possible for you to date her while speaking reason on the topic of Entrati. If I remember correctly even Lyon encouraged us saying

“Trust is a stained glass window. Delicate in its creation. Beautiful in its splendor. Tragic in its breaking. And dangerous once destroyed.”

“Would that I could take from her the corruption he had sown into her mind. I can only pray that you might succeed where I have failed.”

[lament thicket]

Oh yeah. I had this conversation with Lyon.

I will definitely try my best with her though. 100%.

[worn fjord]

That quote about trust is so well written..I love it

[worn fjord]

Good luck

[lament thicket]

Roathe also. He is such a sassy bastard but I genuinely love that about him. Conversations with him end up being so surprisingly profound despite the undertone in comedy he puts.

He truly is Emet-Selch at times I can't help but see Emet in him LMAO

[worn fjord]

Yea his convos are interesting. Like I’ve said before, he’s very much the devil’s advocate the KIM chats needed

Or story as whole really

[lament thicket]

He is also technically our only foray into what Orokin society was from the perspective of an actual Orokin. I think so, atleast.

[lean siren]

I got to close with Roathe but when I go to see him the option to ask him out isnt there, is it a bug or??

[steep hemlock]

there's a dialogue before that I guress or something

[worn fjord]

Well apart from the Entrati Family I suppose so

[steep hemlock]

I dont;'see it either

[lament thicket]

Yeah. And he REALLY doesn't mince words at times. It's refreshing.

[worn fjord]

Yea it is refreshing

[lament thicket]

Also lowkey may have ragebaited him into delving in the Dark Refractory further on accident

Dude just REFUSED to talk to me about what's wrong that I accidentally ragebaited him.

Whoops.

[worn fjord]

We have to see all 21 VMs in the end so yea you’re good

[steep hemlock]

also is me or the new batch of kims are at times longer than expected, like you say something and think after this one they gonna end the convo and they keep going ;-;

[worn fjord]

…I got it all ahead of schedule because of a bug. It was not soft locked like it was supposed to be

[lament thicket]

Alright well I just gotta wait for tomorrow and see what Marie has to say. Hopefully one of the convos with Lyon ends up me talking about confessing to Marie. Cause I for some reason had a convo with marie about confessing your love to Lyon.

So that was interesting at the very least.

[worn fjord]

It depends on the option really but yea maybe they are a bit longer (not complaining haha )

[worn fjord]

Can’t wait until my Drifter confesses to Lyon

But for now just enjoying the chats

[worn fjord]

Good luck with yours!

[reef compass]

about that ||I had an option today but refused cause it didnt feel right||

[steep hemlock]

||the one in the chat with marie?||

[worn fjord]

Yea that’s also another thing.. I’ll have to see how it goes

[reef compass]

2nd talk about ||conceptual embodiment||

[steep hemlock]

I'll see i guess

[worn fjord]

Thanks for the heads up I suppose. I’m sure there are other convos that are better for the confession

Hopefully…

[abstract sorrel]

I dream of independence for the origin system

[reef compass]

yeah because that one got DARK

[abstract sorrel]

Drifter and Roathe will deliver unto the system freedom

[worn fjord]

Yea I can imagine…so it’s either text or in-person ask might be better

I hope DE implemented that

Like they did with Hex

[abstract sorrel]

[steep hemlock]

this is the first one right?

I don;t remeber any before that with him

[worn fjord]

Wait I remember the first one. I think it was R3 convo

[reef compass]

yeah thats the first

[steep hemlock]

ok tehn tommorow I guess

[reef compass]

...not really? I had quite a few chats after

you will know cause he will expressly ask that

[steep hemlock]

yeah they give you all the chats disponible I noticed, I even had some with roathe that were frustrating that felt out of place

[worn fjord]

Ah I got it mixed up with R3 convo 3

[lament thicket]

Idk if it's better to have that option turned on where you have ALL the conversations but will take a while to actually increase your relationship.

[reef compass]

More lore= good

[worn fjord]

Lyon - And such is the nature of my curiosity. I have come to wonder this "aloud" to see if you might be able to expound upon it. When the Void is given form, what wanders from it - is it "real?"

[lament thicket]

True.

[worn fjord]

That convo was interesting..and it’s cool to know similar convos are coming up, looking forward to it I guess

[steep hemlock]

you can turn it off?

ok no it is off by default

then this one felt much more out of place what the hell drifter

[worn fjord]

Idk I’m still debating whether I should off it..at the same time I’ll miss potential lore

And even worse, less chats

[reef compass]

I believe they mentioned that the triad cant lose on chats at devstream

[worn fjord]

Drifter’s convo starters with Roathe are a mixed bag 😂

Ah I should sleep

Gnight

[steep hemlock]

for the first time the whole kim with roathe I felt like I was about to walk on glass

[worn fjord]

https://tenor.com/view/pianistchenle-dog-shaking-gif-22127400

You probably during that convo

Okay Gnight fr😂😭

[steep hemlock]

then did a double flip and saved the day

[reef compass]

Oh I once told him about cause he was orokin or something and he went || I hope you dont got blue tint on your skin|| and had to apologize (and he liked it)

[reef compass]

I certainly didnt have that one myself at least

[static plover]

I have encountered a broken conversation with one of our new friends… been stuck like this for several minutes

[hearty pendant]

try doing a bounty for the hex
i saw it work for someone else in here before

[static plover]

That helped… but when I got back to the messenger in game it loaded up a completely new conversation with him with no history marker for the one in the clip… lol

[hearty pendant]

unfortunate
its the only fix for the mid-convo stop i know of
but i believe its either lose the convo or get a new one via the bounty
should be fixed when DE get back from break, though

[midnight swallow]

ah yes i can confuse i was lying about being a follower of sol when i said i wasnt in the faith conversation. W check

[undone lodge]

There’s an option in Rank 3 where you can say you’re interested but he’ll basically just say you don’t know each other well enough for him to be comfortable discussing it

[signal token]

tbh shes a nun

now

Go to the confession booth.

[quick smelt]

Confess your sins or get
[Sol Gate Blast]

[solid otter]

I didnt think nuns took confession?

[signal token]

i have no idea about the religion but marie do

[balmy storm]

If you reset the triad do you lose access to Lyon’s shop?
And Lyon for that matter

[quick smelt]

…
I sure hope not

[regal loom]

It's this wild

I'm sooo scar3d

[velvet silo]

Is the Exorcist honoria still bugged? I've not recieved it yet, and I am positive I've gone through Descendia more than 21 times.

[cerulean kiln]

Have you defeated Roathe specifically 21 times?

[velvet silo]

No, I mean: I've gone through all floors and defeated Roathe, more than 21 times.

I've got all his VMs.

[cerulean kiln]

Servers probably being slow then

[velvet silo]

Okay. I suppose I'll either just have to see if it works again the next time I do a run; or wait for the weekly reset.

Thank you, Nemesis.

[tame canopy]

I finally got Lyon to initiate talking to me

It happened just recently lol

[slate dagger]

We're dating but no option for kisskiss? Please let me kiss my holy husband 😭

[loud dock]

still kinda mad the roathe thermostat is affected by
everyone?

and just offhandedly agreeing that he's kind of a serious pain sometimes = "btw, condemned to never improve"

[pure merlin]

Did you ask him out at the Cathédrale or by chat?

[loud dock]

i think kiss kiss is today if you've been mostly caught up

since i've seen some clips floating around of people able to scruff them onto their captura dates

[slate dagger]

asked him via chat because I confessed my feelings to him, then went to the Cathedrale to see if I could give him kisskiss but it only suggests asking to break up along with his shop lmfao

[formal fable]

i think my roathe romancable but marie for me cant romance

[dire crest]

I’d love Hunhow to be a visit able character. Give grandpa a store and something to do

[night zephyr]

Maybe that option will only be available to you when you reach max rank

[rancid pilot]

What coffesion convo was it, the rank 5 or rank 4?

[slate dagger]

I think 4?

[slate dagger]

Correction, Rank5Convo1

[rancid pilot]

Some of us were speculating in the this chat earlier, from what we've gathered the Rank 5 confession will be acknowledged in future Rank 5 convos

So you're on a better track then me

I confessed at the Rank 4 Convo 7(?) and basically he just started cycling the other rank rank 4 convos and it felt weird, probably no boolean/check for the confession counter

TL:DR you've confessed and basically activated that boolean, so keep doing KIM

[dreamy turtle]

Can anyone tell if this is a bug or not, because I think I picked all the correct dialog options to not upset and maybe romance her, but the notes say nothing.

[loud dock]

I think what's happening for a lot of people that if you're not doing "play-all" it's not - triggering the right stuff. >>;?

like it'll be yes you confessed to them but being fully able to kiss or anything isnt unlocked yet till i think all the way at rank six, guh

thats what it's looking like for roathe at least

[worn fjord]

Which is understandable..I didn’t go for that option either. Didn’t feel right

[pure merlin]

Really funny if Marie and Roathe are bugged but Lyon's fine

[worn fjord]

Kind of but I feel bad for the others..truly it’s unfortunate it is a bug

[regal loom]

Oh wait sorry wrong chat

[regal loom]

Is it fine for you?

For Marie and the devil

[pure merlin]

They don't even change dialogues in the Cathédrale based on your rank
Hopefully hotfix soon

[zenith jacinth]

Bruh.

[primal gyro]

Am i right to assume that roathe's kinda chill or am i falling for the devil's bait and he's tricking me for something
Cuz as far as my kim chats went with him, he keeps reminding me of the "im nothing like yall" meme in regards to being an orokin with opposing stances to the other executors and whatnot

[primal gyro]

Wait are people stuck in trusted status with roathe too

[zenith jacinth]

Both

[regal loom]

You mean like this

Kind of, some of the people in this server said they have the same issue, don't know if it is a bug

And others CAN date which is piss me off

https://tenor.com/view/mad-angry-stick-meme-screaming-gif-12040936646549744950

[primal gyro]

Yeah my status with marie is close but i dont have a note (checked my kim just now)
Roathe, on the other hand, ive been stuck at trusted status for god knows how long now

[regal loom]

Hmmm I think you didn't ragebait him

Cuz shii he sooo crazy

[primal gyro]

Today's kim chat that i got with roathe was about yuvan theater stuff

[regal loom]

Uh huh

Maybe tomorrow you will get him close for sure

[primal gyro]

And this is the chat that made me ask my question cuz it seems like he hates ballas as much as we do

[regal loom]

Ooooo

Ballas is a btuxhhhh

[worn fjord]

Marie is fine. The only thing bugged is Roathe and his VMs for me. Instead of getting 2 a day or based on the rank, I got like 5 or however many times I played Descendia. And I couldn’t chat with Roathe without seeing the VMs so now he’ll probably accuse me of resetting…

[regal loom]

Dann the bug is getting worse somehow..

I'm sure the bug will be soon fix or it was gonna be like that..

[worn fjord]

This particular one has been around for a while

Unfortunately

[regal loom]

Well danm

https://tenor.com/view/phonk-boii-what-you-say-boi-what-you-say-boiii-what-you-say-boi-what-you-say-about-phonk-gif-4119311610194571313

[worn fjord]

After holidayyyys

[regal loom]

Ade you sure.....

[hidden comet]

uh?

[worn fjord]

Oh dear whattttt

[regal loom]

Bro become yandere

Kidding but what the hell

[worn fjord]

That’s so?? How did you piss him off and get close with him

[golden tulip]

Hey so I came here to ask and it seems im not the only one at "Close" with Roathe and the option to date is not appearing when I speak to him?

[regal loom]

You ragebait him toooo much

[formal fable]

my even worse i am close with marie too

[regal loom]

With no text bio?

[formal fable]

have text bio

[hidden comet]

everything was fine until he started sending me vms continuously

[regal loom]

WHAT?

Screenshot

[worn fjord]

Oh dear

That bug

[formal fable]

my says this

[worn fjord]

Well he’s not pissed at me yet

[regal loom]

Oh you make her mad..

[formal fable]

roather and lyon are this

[regal loom]

Let me see

[worn fjord]

There might be a MarieRepair convo

[regal loom]

This one is normal totally...

[hidden comet]

i dont think he's mad he just doesnt want me in descendia anymore

[formal fable]

this one is roathe

all are close

[golden tulip]

ive got this and i cant ask him out :/

[regal loom]

I RHINK roath want you

Like sooooo into you with smooch

[formal fable]

i think tager figght i didnt know how to do it

[regal loom]

Bug these days

[formal fable]

well i wanted marie

[regal loom]

Soooo piss me off

[hidden comet]

lyon to the rescue ig

[regal loom]

Maybe maybe tomorrow you can apologise to her?

[worn fjord]

So has he stopped chatting with you after then?

[formal fable]

my roathe today

[golden tulip]

are you kidding? when does DE's holiday's end? this is so annoying i was so excited :(

[worn fjord]

Aw bless his heart

[regal loom]

Yeah maybe we need to wait for weeks until holidays end

[hidden comet]

yeag

[floral badge]

😭

[formal fable]

this is marie convo today

[hidden comet]

he has spoken

[worn fjord]

Jan 8th I think, but they might need time to go through the bugs

[regal loom]

Nothing happen is just you flirting with her

She soooooo flattering

[formal fable]

lyon got mention rei

[worn fjord]

Oh

[sacred pebble]

Oh i reset everything🍿

[formal fable]

my for lyon today

[regal loom]

We don't know if is it bug or not..

[worn fjord]

Well because of the bug I got all 21 so he can’t tell me to stop technically

[regal loom]

You give him extra truama

[floral badge]

I know her reaction was funny

[sacred pebble]

I try again picking up different messages to see what will happen

[regal loom]

Yeah so cute

[regal loom]

Goodluck on that..

Hope the bug stop

[formal fable]

about rei

[regal loom]

Yes?

[worn fjord]

Had this chat yesterday

[regal loom]

Had this bur he was fine after that..?

[formal fable]

dont know wether i can get close friends with devils triads or just assoicates

[worn fjord]

Nah when the convo comes up he’ll talk about it eventually

[sacred pebble]

He diva leave him alone 💅😔

[worn fjord]

The chats are random sometimes

[formal fable]

after convo

[regal loom]

Hmmm

[worn fjord]

Oh yea this one

That’s more of an earlier chat

[formal fable]

this one is today one

[regal loom]

Yeah sometimes Lyon's mental health is horrible especially his parents abusing

[formal fable]

today convo

[abstract sorrel]

I need to get the option to date Roathe

[formal fable]

lyon family

[abstract sorrel]

I wish Roathe would talk about his parents

I want to see what it’s like to be raised as an Orokin

[regal loom]

That would be interesting

[golden tulip]

keep chatting :)

[abstract sorrel]

I’m already at close with him

So I assume it has to be soon or never

[golden tulip]

im afraid we gonna have to fight all 3 of the devils triads parents they're all pieces of work. which explains alot ig

[formal fable]

roathe parents

[abstract sorrel]

Useless

Roathe became the wonder and terror of his age on his own then, I like him even more now

He rose high himself

[regal loom]

https://tenor.com/view/phonk-boii-what-you-say-boi-what-you-say-boiii-what-you-say-boi-what-you-say-about-phonk-gif-4119311610194571313

Boooo what U say about phonk

[formal fable]

yeah devil triad rizzing abit hard

[abstract sorrel]

I will have Roathe

[sacred pebble]

Ill try again message marie from the start to see if it a bug or we really did something to annoy her it probably bcs we didn’t stand with her

[sacred pebble]

Sure take him I don’t like him

[regal loom]

He so stupid

[abstract sorrel]

Your loss my gain

[regal loom]

Update?

[formal fable]

okay

[abstract sorrel]

Roathe and I are going to rebuild the Empire ong

[sacred pebble]

Just restarted the messages yesterday

[regal loom]

Okay okay

[abstract sorrel]

Steal Tyl Regor’s gene templates, make a bunch of actually not genetically defective Grineer, and wage war on the system

[regal loom]

I might go to sleep rn I'm so tired

[sacred pebble]

Ill keep until the fight problem lol

[abstract sorrel]

[formal fable]

i think tagfer fight abit hard to read

[sacred pebble]

Ill send ss here when i reach that moment

Tagfer have no chill fighting a woman

[formal fable]

yeah

[regal loom]

Aight Betttt

[abstract sorrel]

We need night of the naga drums to be shown

Legit the order 66 of the warframe universe

The Tenno betrayal of those they fought alongside and served for

[placid shadow]

F*CK, what do i do? can she break up with me if i say something wrong? should i just don't say anything? what should i do?

[regal loom]

Okay this is like

If you want a two partner

Poly relationship but you need to ask the hex member (if you are in a relationship with them)

So like is a cheating update thing..

No need to panic is kinda Ur choice if you want to cheat or want two partner

Or end it

End- cheating
Ask - multiple relationship

But some people say that the hex member can just break up with you for that?

[placid shadow]

ok i asked her and she didn't care, she just wants me to be happy and she even wanted to meet lyon

[pliant saffron]

Two tisms collide

[regal loom]

Wow so cute

[pliant saffron]

Wondering how lyon will react to boy band music now

[thick jolt]

Iirc it "tests his faith" dunno if that is good or bad

It's a line he can say during descendia if you get the coda boyband as a miniboss

[placid shadow]

yeah he doesn't seem to like it

[pliant saffron]

Amazing

[quick smelt]

Arthur
Lyon

“I hate that boy band.”

[regal loom]

God danm

[placid shadow]

i think he and arthur would be good friends

btw is it possible to like make marie stop glazing entrati so much, make lyon stop hurting himself etc.?

and did anyone managed to help roath convince loid to talk to entrati family

[obtuse gyro]

of course it is

you just need to talk to them with them in mind

no steven universe up in this shit

[sacred pebble]

Hmm i smell cheating

[tight fulcrum]

Is there a kim loid conversation after the initial one?

[jagged sable]

KIM SPOILER:
||You can get a message from loid that he's ready to meet the entrati family after you convince all 3 of the devil's triad to help you help him reunite with the family.||

[quasi mason]

So, I finally did the quest yesterday, I WAS playing the game but just wanted to do other stuff first

Before, is there still a "spoiler rule" in the server?

Second, I did Descendia today, loved it, did finish the normal path, which had no one shots as people said they were getting...

So> Can I now try Steel Path?
And even not counting Steel Path, "path", can I still do Descendia, for Roathe resources?

...I want to finish mah Melee Careen

[steep hemlock]

so it's been about 10 years and I still don't know for sure if it was us, wally or the frame on it's own to break hunhow's war at the end of the second dream

[balmy storm]

It wasn’t us
It wasn’t wally
It was most likely just the frame acting on their own

[livid glen]

I still think it was us, as a foreshadowing of the War Within, honestly.

[balmy storm]

Which isn’t entirely impossible, gen 1 frames had sapience and we know the gen 2 frames we use have remnants of their personality

[balmy storm]

Iirc the issue with that is us being choked out at the time

[livid glen]

But that's exactly why - such a precarious situation made us grasp subconsciously to abilities we once possessed but have since been locked away/forgotten.

[balmy storm]

Maybe!

[hearty pendant]

the weirdest part of the whole scene is that none of the candidates would know that snapping War would do anything

[steep hemlock]

wait what if it was the lotus?

[balmy storm]

Which is why I’m in the it being a natural response to just being stabbed

[steep hemlock]

what if mommy can controll our toys to some degree?

[balmy storm]

We don’t know if sentients can use transference, even through somatics
But we also know she can act as somatics for the Drifter sooo
Maybe?

[hearty pendant]

that's an odd thing to say
but the lotus hand in duviri would imply that to an extent

[livid glen]

Maybe but it's the least likely option as unlike the others this one isn't really ever focused/expanded on, outside of the hand in Duviri, I suppose.

It is possible none the less, though.

[steep hemlock]

the lotus does appear in the orbiter the exact scene after after the war getting broken

[balmy storm]

Tbh they’re all possible except the Wally one

He lacks any influence at that point and is bound by Rell
The most he does is speak to us which he has always been able to do through pieces of himself

[livid glen]

Speaking of Wally, I will say, the discussion with Roathe regarding him and his finger was rather interesting.

Although it does make me wonder, why would the finger count as spreading the Void, yet Wally himself, supposedly, wouldn't?

And then, if the fingers do what Roathe theorizes they do, why would Wally still be so mad at them being taken?

Man I love Roathe.

[balmy storm]

Orokin used his power without his permission

[livid glen]

Right, sure, but is that so bad if it's always what allows him to travel/exist within the Origin System?

Like, I know he didn't consent and all that.

[balmy storm]

I mean yeah thats kinda the issue
His first experience with humanity, with the orokin was his finger being cut off and then promptly used without his permission

Even if its a boon to him he still was hurt and his power was still used without his consent

Also by missing his finger he lacks full power essentially

[livid glen]

But at the same time, if the theory is right, and he is a conceptual embodiment who can only be in void-adjacent areas, with the fingers acting as "spreaders" of these void-adjacent areas, would it really be that bad?

Although I do wonder regarding the "keeping him tied to a string of khra" part, yes, and how that interacts.

[balmy storm]

I mean if he gets his finger back, the original, he can just spread void storms wherever probably

As good as the fingers might be for him rn if he got it it’d just be better

And again, the Orokin used his power against his will

[livid glen]

I'm still trying to figure out the extends of his powers, to be honest.

The fact we haven't seen him do much yet certainly doesn't help.

The Zariman is pretty much the most he's done, no?

[balmy storm]

I mean
The Murmur are his/him
the invasion on the labs in general
Isleweaver

[livid glen]

True, I suppose, the problem is that all of these, Zariman included, have all been completely or mostly within the Void itself (where I'm assuming he has almost if not full control). I probably should have phrased it better, but I'm more so wondering his extent of power outside of the Void, or at the very least the "void-touched" parts that aren't, inherently, within the Void themselfs.

[zenith jacinth]

Wally doesn't have full control over the void

[livid glen]

Which is why I said "almost if not full", since we don't know the exact extent of his power within it, just that it is great.

[zenith jacinth]

It's actually kinda pathetically little

[livid glen]

Meh, I wouldn't say little.

Not absolute, sure.

Mostly when it comes to other conceptually embodied things.

[zenith jacinth]

What void-related things does wally have power over?

I want to see how many you can think of

[livid glen]

Zariman, Murmur/Albrecht's Labs, and Duviri to an extent (the Lost Islands and Scholar's Landing)

Which is most of the main locations within the Void.

Only other thing I can think off are the Orokin towers.

And we have no idea to what extent he can interact with them sense he never had a reason to.

[zenith jacinth]

He has no control over anything on the zariman, the sanctum stuff he had to manually corrupt, duviri he can't control anything unless he goes to a fake version

[real niche]

Trying to get his fingers back would've been a good place to start, considering the entirety of Orokin civilization bastardized his fingers and he didn't show up a single time between Albrecht's crossing and the Zariman

Frankly what reason did he have to screw with the Zariman if his issue was with Albrecht anyway

[livid glen]

My understanding is that he was just trying to understand the parent-child dynamic. ¯_(ツ)_/¯

If with... questionable methods.

[real niche]

Oh no he understands how things work, he just loves manipulating people. Even after the Zariman the benefit of doubt is stripped when we see what he does with Baro and Rusulka

[zenith jacinth]

Nah, he just wanted to make a mess

[real niche]

Making Wally out to seem ignorant is just going to cause issues later on, he's been deliberate the whole time

[livid glen]

Oh, I don't think he was ignorant. I just don't think he's 100% malicious either.

I am with Entrati in the end though.

Whatever that may entail.

[real niche]

Pretty damn close to it.

The only reason Rusulka is possessed is him going "Please please please please please" the whole time and waiting for her to crack

There's also him wanting to take the page from us in Whispers when that wasn't even part of the deal.

And just his whole shtick of messing with people who have nothing to do with the finger

Like the Zariman

[zenith jacinth]

He's 99.9999999% malicious

[solid otter]

He gave us powers then made us kill our parents HE turned insane?

That's uh

Pretty damn malicious

[undone lodge]

He also seems to have used us to turn them insane in some way, given that the non-parents did just fine until they came back as Holdfasts and heard The Song

[livid glen]

If it was for the sake of gaining more knowledge of human interaction? Not really, no.

Indifferent to the suffering he causes, sure.

[solid otter]

... no it wasn't

It very much wasn't

[livid glen]

But how do we know it wasn't?

[solid otter]

He genuinely just wanted to destroy the relationship you have with your parents to get closer to you

Thats what wally does

[undone lodge]

Not like directly using us as a vector I mean but like, whatever method he used to mess with the crews minds seems to have involved their kids

[solid otter]

Love forces him away, can't get to you if your parents still love you

With what we know Wally likes to do

It was probably done to just seperate us from our loved ones.

[real niche]

There's also just the fact that he forced the Operator into the deal the Operator has no idea of the specifics because he knows that the Tenno would die anyway if they didn't accept instead of just happening to save them without the strings

[solid otter]

He does it a lot.

Or, prays on folk who aren't close to their loved ones

[livid glen]

Side tangent but it does feel weird to me that only love is stated to be a weakness and not any other strong emotion.

Like, completely unrelated to the conversation, I just find it a bit odd.

Anyways, the problem is that we see all of that from our perspective.

[zenith jacinth]

He very clearly talks about how much he enjoys to just cause death

[solid otter]

I think it makes perfect sense

He is "indifferent", arguably love is the opposite of "indifference"

[livid glen]

We don't really know of Wally's goal other than to get his finger back, nor do we know how important that task is to him.

[loud dock]

something something the indifference / man in the wall / void is built upon entropy
having love means you care and have self-agency

[livid glen]

Any strong emotion is the opposite of indifference.

It's a set versus set thing.

[solid otter]

... absorb this specific universe. He has done this a lot.

[zenith jacinth]

Revenge

[solid otter]

Kill us

[loud dock]

like honestly its more like
apathy vs empathy
when it comes to wally v his weakness

[solid otter]

He did that to other us

Kill people in general

[uncut solar]

For the embodiment of apathy Wally weirdly gives a shit in The Hex

[sacred pebble]

I have question how can lotus see without eyes

[solid otter]

She has eyes, Margulis doesn't

[loud dock]

he wants what he cant; have
the man in the wall cannot feel, empathy
it lacks it
so it tries to make everything else feel like itself

[zenith jacinth]

Lotus has eyes

[sacred pebble]

Ah yeah

[zenith jacinth]

Didn't*

[livid glen]

Yet left us alive. Like, why would it be necessary for a pact with some random child? (Or Baro). It just seems so... random, as a requirment.

[sacred pebble]

She look scary without eyes

[real niche]

Triumph of Dust would like to have a word. Rusulka loves it prattle on about how much (s)he wants to make thing "still" and to dismantle everything around him

[zenith jacinth]

Why not

[solid otter]

Because he made a deal with us? And baro? There's a chance that if we die, the deal falls through.

[loud dock]

war and rage over time will errode someone's empathy and replace it with apathy which is why it likes to cling to warmongers too

[undone lodge]

We can make some guesses from what Nelly says in Isleweaver

[livid glen]

True, which is why I would follow Entrati to hell and back just to stop Wally, but my point is that it's not inherently, necessarily malicious.

Like, it's closer to killing all Mosquitos/bugs so they stop annoying you, if you understand what I mean.

[undone lodge]

To be clear I do mean that “can” literally, I don’t have one myself

[solid otter]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1447039990847504535/1448726608981659689/IMG_0074.gif

[livid glen]

But why does he need to make a deal? That's just so... random.

[zenith jacinth]

Not really

[real niche]

The Void longs for stillness, emptiness. But first, things must be made still.

Why are you fighting, Kiddo? This place was your prison. We can dismantle its pieces together.

If you're wasting your time here, who's protecting those freaks back in Höllvania?

Absolutely deplorable comments

[zenith jacinth]

Devil things

[solid otter]

From what Roathe said, we act as Void conduits for him, so there's that

[real niche]

Roathe theorizes that being a Void thingie lets him spread his tendrils around a lot more

[undone lodge]

(Find the hidden chest) Neci Rusalka: "You can be ripped out and burned up as easily as a storybook page."

(Find the hidden chest) Neci Rusalka: "Aw, don't cry, Mathila. Nobody's listening."

(Find the hidden chest) Neci Rusalka: "Didn't you have children once, Mathila? Did you forget about them too?"

(Guide your reflection into the light) Neci Rusalka: "Ask Mathila where her children went."

(Guide your reflection into the light) Neci Rusalka: "Children are feral. Savage. They just need the right encouragement."

(Guide your reflection into the light) Neci Rusalka: "Don't be jealous of Neci, kiddo. I'll still wear your face."

(Locate the eyes of Indifference) Neci Rusalka: "Taking my eyes now, kiddo? Wasn't Margulis enough?"

[livid glen]

The only reason I can see it existing is some weird quirk of Albrecht's conceptual embodiment, to be honest.

[real niche]

The reason Wally can exist outside of the Void is because of the Void powers we have within us.

[zenith jacinth]

And all the other things using void energy

[real niche]

Else, CE'd stuff would've just stayed in the Void

[undone lodge]

Tbh most of the lines are some form of f*cked up and twisted

[livid glen]

Awful un-indifferent for an entity called the Indifference, but honestly? I'm not sure how much that is Wally and how much of it is Neci, here, and really in any interaction 199 onwards.

Not that I think Neci hates Duviri, I just think that Neci's general... demeanor was infused with Wally's annoyance with Duviri.

[undone lodge]

We know that Neci is seemingly mostly gone, and the actual Neci bits are all, well, fairly obvious?

[balmy storm]

Wally/Neci def went after Duviri cause we took 1999 which was Neci’s home

[zenith jacinth]

What I love about the isleweaver lines is the way they make it blatantly obvious that whatever plan wally has is going wrong

[livid glen]

Probably mostly the fingers, but yeah.

Which is the other question I raised which started this conversation, as to why Wally's fingers count but he doesn't for spreading his influence.

[undone lodge]

Like DE isn’t exactly hiding which is which and trying to make us guess who’s mostly influencing each bit of dialogue

[balmy storm]

I think through Neci we can maybe beat him, somehow
She loves her parents for sure so he now has a weakness so long as he holds on to her

[real niche]

He's not indifferent because he doesn't care in general. He's indifferent to the suffering he causes. Like, we know damn well by now he just loves to cause suffering for absolutely no reason. And it's not like Neci would have any clue about Duviri before Wally would've taken over anway

[balmy storm]

They made it seem more vague at pax lol

[hearty pendant]

wally spends half of them throwing a fit and the other half trying to act confident

[zenith jacinth]

Neci isn't a bad person

[balmy storm]

I mean she isn’t a good person either lol

Ig we don’t know the whole story of her working with Scaldra

[zenith jacinth]

Can't know that, but we do know that she has some morals based on velimin chats

[balmy storm]

Oh for sure

She’s not Viktor levels of awful lol

[undone lodge]

“STOP IT. IT’S UNNATURAL”

[real niche]

Nono, Roathe makes it pretty clear that the Tenno are also part of the issue in terms of how Wally can get around

[balmy storm]

I think some people forget most moments we have with her are actually with Wally lol

[zenith jacinth]

I firmly believe scaldra being so 1945 is mainly viktor's doing, but that's just my opinion

[balmy storm]

They were like that when she was in charge tho too

There was a whole year of them gooping areas to push out civilians to bring in their own people
But also, depending on when she let him in it may have not been all her

[zenith jacinth]

They were religious, afaik nothing says they were just gassing people for the sake of it

[balmy storm]

She def was herself to a degree, she has no idea who Drifter is

[balmy storm]

I can’t find the exact quote on the archives but Scaldra was gassing civillians out to bring in their own

[zenith jacinth]

That's a mission quote from aoi

[undone lodge]

They mean before Hollvania and Techrot Op

[balmy storm]

Yeah ik i cant grab it 😔

[balmy storm]

Before, yeah she was likely fine
But she was active for that year and let wally in at some point during it, presumably

During the year of 1999 she permitted something like that

[undone lodge]

No Aoi content on the Archives

@near rune this slight will not be forgotten

[zenith jacinth]

( ! )Rodney will remember that

[near rune]

sorry lol
I'll get around to it

[balmy storm]

The archives are the only way I can check quotes on mobile, phone no like the wiki 😔

[zenith jacinth]

other way around for me

[shadow sphinx]

ha ha hey. hey now. hey what the fu--

[zenith jacinth]

yes

[balmy storm]

Lmao the “wait…” is literally you rn

[shadow sphinx]

paused. thought i was being delusional. went back to check. confirmed i was not being delusional. actually continued the chat. double confirmed i was not being delusional

[tight pagoda]

Drifter goes "Wait..." so many times it's actually hilarious

Basically their catchphrase

[shadow sphinx]

Drifter when things start to make a little bit too much sense:

[echo basalt]

its more like

https://tenor.com/view/james-doakes-james-doakes-doakes-meme-doakes-suspicious-gif-7434634924845802139

[tight pagoda]

I just looked up the convo flowchart and now I'm wondering why the hell Velemir, Minerva and Rusalka decided to use ||what's basically a bible passage|| as a super secret codephrase

Not very secure

[echo basalt]

no one ever expects a bible passage

[shadow sphinx]

i got an impression that it's archaic/obscure as all hell, with how much surprise lyon expresses ("yo where the hell did you get that from")

[undone lodge]

Yeah I figured it was either from a rarely long/wordy holy book or just some random philosophical/religious text they liked

[tight pagoda]

Yeah maybe that specific wording is like the original texts and there's a modernization that changes it, even in Lyon's time

[shadow sphinx]

ye ye ye

[tight pagoda]

YIPPEE

[loud dock]

AAAAAAAAAGGGGGGGHRAAAAAAAAAHHHH
SERIOUSLY I CANT ASK HIM STILL WHY

[tight pagoda]

WHERE THE HELL IS IT DE

[pure merlin]

Still don't know if his redemption and romance are bugged, but at least this works

[raw arrow]

From what i hear its pretty buggy

[slate dagger]

Another day, another reset, another day for no kisskiss 😭

[loud dock]

yeah can't get access to him still and i really don't wanna reset progress

[tight pagoda]

You need to reach the max rank with them first I think

I'm dating Marie but no option for a kiss/date

[loud dock]

roathe's still not even accessible to me 😭

this is a CRIME,,,

[raw arrow]

If it helps you’re not the only one, which means its probably a bug

Its not even a “just got in enough chemistry” thing cuz people have been there for a few days and still no option

[slate dagger]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-crying-cat-cat-meme-cat-crying-meme-crying-cat-meme-gif-1182720488497099882

[loud dock]

man with how it was teased though i was honestly thinking it'd be today ;;;;;
guuuuuhhhhhhh

[slate dagger]

imma start biting if its not soon 😭

[raw arrow]

For now im planning on completely skipping it since theres so many people having problems with it

Ive heard of roathe getting sent to a different route than the one your options led to

[loud dock]

wait is it

is it because the operation is taking up his dialogue box

i can see it on maire

[pure merlin]

I think, Roathe might be date-able tomorrow
Maybe there's a way to save his route and only one chat's buggy, from what I've noticed with today's chat

[fiery oyster]

uh

I dont think thats normal, is it?

[raw arrow]

Yeah its been like that for a lot of people, as far as i know its just visual

[fiery oyster]

ah ok

[loud dock]

mnope; that's what i got with her but then she was dateable today if wanted

[fiery oyster]

cause I had a fairly bad arguement with her regarding Entrati lol

[fiery oyster]

funny, I had the option to begin dating Lyon like 2 days ago

[loud dock]

god there's almost a temptation for me to just start dating her and then split up and see if that makes roathe available as mean as that is ;;

[fiery oyster]

oh yeah we cant just snap our fingers and erase their memories, can we? lol

[regal loom]

my marie is mad at me what do i do

[sturdy sun]

Hey good news. I got to chat with Marie where I can confess feelings for her. She says "and you took le cardinals side in order to get to my good graces". There's two options. 1, Well when you say it like that... and 2, Only Partially. I do honestly believe in Entrati". What happens if I choose either or?

[zenith jacinth]

no good option tbh

[uncut solar]

Cornered

[sturdy sun]

How so?

[loud dock]

😔 no dice

[obtuse gyro]

because you kinda confessed at an extremely bad time

the power of love aint gon help you today

[undone lodge]

You can quit out

[sturdy sun]

Oh I can just restart the convo