spoiler-chat

[coral cape]

Just walked into the personal chambers after getting excalibur umbra (fire quest btw) n just got jumpscared by the man in the wall

[rain otter]

when they where new.

[coral cape]

didnt even know i was doing a main quest till i finished it

[rain otter]

yee lmao

[coral cape]

i was wonderin why i havent seen him in my ship yet, i guess i got my answer

[rain otter]

did he have his umbra dilaog?

[coral cape]

dunno the difference

[rain otter]

okay so normaly he says

"hey Kiddo" after you do the sacrifice he can say something different.

[coral cape]

ill have to check online

ill let you know tho

[chilly pine]

iirc at the end of the quest there is dialog with wally where iirc operator mentions something about "killing their own son" since umbras memories got mixed in with ours

[coral cape]

ohhh dont think i got that

like the whole prelude to war quest?

i only did the first part for now

[graceful zodiac]

The next time you see Wally after doing the Sacrifice triggers a new dialogue about "you" killing your son due to the memory mixing, and Wally saying "That's good".

[coral cape]

thats makes sense thanks

[sonic cedar]

I would say you get use to that but with the amount of times I have had to peel myself off the Orbiter's roof from Wally just appearing is way to much

[amber marten]

Sadness, and sadder still; Hunhow.

Poor space grandad.

[floral condor]

Why was Albretch creating these things?

[fierce summit]

To, and this is canon, punch the man in the wall in the face

[amber marten]

With science.

[fleet spruce]

BOOBA

[flat magnet]

Did you see how big one of Wally’s forms was in TNW?

[valid jolt]

Albrecht is a fan of Aot

[nocturne kiln]

It's implied they had something to do with both being a defense against the Man in the wall and possibly with looking into the past.

[mild wolf]

New war, operator or drifter?

[obtuse gyro]

your choice, only difference is abit of dialogue

[tawdry socket]

I'll say that Smite Infusion + Roar does the work of a Volt spamming shields, unfortunately the deer suffers from the issue that all his numbers suck and has a painful energy economy ESPECIALLY during hunts

Like he only really has the healing to not let himself/lures die Vs Teralyst, the other two even he just melts. Running adaptation is an option but then your issue is that you can't get the energy return from Hunter Adrenaline to keep up your subpar healing

Best decision I ever made was subsuming Gloom over Renewal

[prime lantern]

It would be rather difficult with the current state of the game

Healing is rather trivial with it either being entirely irrelevant or easy to come by

Energy regen is a decent thing but also with the current state of the game I don't ever find myself all that in need of it even when I'm spamming abilities on 45% eff

Generally "supports" need to offer utility or just raw damage increases

[tawdry socket]

"Support" in this game these days has to function like how Dante, Jade, Wisp provide support
Fantastic buffs to themselves who do brilliant things that happen to affect allies

[terse gyro]

Since the Stalker stops being his Shadow version after Jade Shadows, does this mean he can no longer drop War at all?

[nova harness]

No, he didn’t really use Hate or Broken War before this Update and he still drops both

[terse gyro]

I was just wondering since regular Stalker does not have War as a drop in the codex

[nova harness]

That’s because he doesn’t get it until Second Dream

They haven’t removed it from his inventory Hunhow actually brings up him not using it in https://www.warframe.com/news/the-reapers-lament

[terse gyro]

I know. That doesn't change that it isn't in his loot table.

Or at least that's what it seems like

[nova harness]

Update 36.0 (2024-06-18)

Increased (Shadow) Stalker’s drop rate for Despair, Scimitar Engines Blueprint, Hate, War, and Broken War to 11.73% each.

[terse gyro]

I hope they just forgot to update regular Stalker's drop table in the Codex then.

[nova harness]

Have they not changed this fact? Dread’s drop chance has been reduced on both Stalker (64.8%) and Shadow Stalker (41.33%) to compensate.

[terse gyro]

No War in sight

[soft lotus]

Shame
Didn't make my war, can't anymore for sometime

[terse gyro]

I find it hilarious that I have been playing for the Shadow Stalker's entire life cycle and not once was I able to get War from him.

Absolutely ridiculous.

[tawdry socket]

Does the official drop table site show War?

[terse gyro]

According to (what I assume to be) the official drop table site, War only drops from Shadow Stalker. Regular Stalker does not have it in his loot table.

[supple dagger]

I’ve never gotten war either

[terse gyro]

And for some reason Hunhow has a drop table, despite not being a regular boss that actually drops anything.

[supple dagger]

???

that’s bizarre

[wicked iron]

Maybe from the Octavia's Anthem quest?

[terse gyro]

That's the one time we fight him, but he doesn't drop anything. My best guess is that they couldn't have an enemy that has an empty loot table, so they just copied Stalker's and disabled loot.

Fantastic. I've got like, what, 2000 hours since Second Dream? Not a single War.

[flat magnet]

I mean someone else did say he didn’t have war back then as normal stalker

[terse gyro]

He didn't. That was added with Second Dream, where he turned into Shadow Stalker. He has remained in that form until this update, but now it seems like he can't drop War anymore at all.

[flat magnet]

There has been no changes to his drops as Jade stalker

[terse gyro]

Does Jade Stalker have a separate drop table?

[flat magnet]

Exact same as shadows

[terse gyro]

I don't see him listed here anywhere

[flat magnet]

probably haven’t updated it yet but it’s the same he doesn’t drop anything new

[terse gyro]

Does this new Stalker form even have a Codex entry? Haven't encountered him in a mission yet.

[tawdry socket]

"Jade Stalker" seems to scan as Shadow Stalker in the codex

[terse gyro]

At least outside of the event

[tawdry socket]

First thing I tried when I saw him was scanning him

[terse gyro]

Hm. Strange.

[nova harness]

I think he’s still Shadow Stalker for gameplay stuff not quest stuff

[terse gyro]

No, he's definitely different. Doesn't have the armor or sword anymore.

[flat magnet]

I think they meant that code wise he’s still considered shadow stalker despite the makeover

[tawdry socket]

Ultimately I think you'll have to submit a bug ticket to DE

[soft lotus]

War has entered the Prime Vault...

[tawdry socket]

The vast unprime

[amber marten]

You can still get it via the shop, right?

I did that last year as the drop rate for parts wasn't my liking and I wanted the landing craft skin and armour in that bundle.

[near rune]

I meant in 1999. There was a discussion about proto-Trinity. Not in the current normal game.

[fleet spruce]

In a long battle where 6 Guardians trying to fend off the massive Wrathborne hordes, one Hunter stood there and works something out with an old foldable Nokia, a Warlock shouted
"OI! WE'RE BEING OVERRUN, DO SOMETHING!"
The Hunter is focused on his phone. He responded
"Calling for air support"
That is all he said, the Warlock is surprised because nothing will ever break through the Hive defenses in the air
"Air support!?!?"
As the Warlock questioned, an entire unknown-looking ship flies into existence. Thanks to the void drive it literally avoided all the darkness anti-air fire and starts raining down hellfire upon the Hive with the turrets

[nocturne kiln]

What

Destiny propaganda?

Anyways

Kind of disappointed. I bought Jade's noble animation and put it on my Grendel.... sad to say, they don't let him rub his belly lovingly.

[fleet spruce]

The Railjack that one Hunter called in for air support started to mow down hive after hive, not even champions could withstand the large caliber autocannon Railjack rounds thrown at them :3

[fleet spruce]

Yea gotta tell DE that :3

[nocturne kiln]

It was a sad moment. 50 platinum is a lot to spend for disappointment

At least now when I give him a pistol, he thrusts his belly up into the air and spins around at everyone.

[fleet spruce]

DE PLEASE GIVE US MORE RAILJACK CONTENT !!!

[nocturne kiln]

Direct people to the forums for stuff you think matters. Had a mod on here tell me the other day that DE doesn't pay attention to discord when I was trying to talk to other people about Jade's appearance.

[gusty pebble]

U will get when they start up with vessels ig

Plus rj has so much content did u miss out on events or smthing

[fleet spruce]

I don' usw it mich besides for lich hunting and yea, I missed them events

...
😭

[gusty pebble]

Razor back is rj ithink

Aint kibda regular event compararively

Also there is ov node aswell

[undone lodge]

Apparently right now they’re working on a thing to mix RJ content with open space/world stuff on the side

[fleet spruce]

s p l e n d i d

[gusty pebble]

Bau wasnt the archons made from warframe with weird heads attached to em

How come lotus say wolf taught her or something

@obtuse gyro

[gusty pebble]

They are workin on a lot of stuff x for doubt that it will be released soon

[obtuse gyro]

Amar lived as a sentient on Tau before he came over during the Old War. Amar was then turned into Archon Amar, being frankensteined ontop of a Rhino Prime

[gusty pebble]

Dam

Infested liches helminth and 1999 on their plate rn

Vessels too

But cy did get a shout out during the event so let us c

[nova harness]

DE made the button for removing nemesis’s the same button as watching their cinematics that’s pretty funny

[gusty pebble]

?

[gusty pebble]

Lich*

[nova harness]

It’s the same for both lol

[gusty pebble]

I was contemplating life bec if that nemesis*

Probably one too many bugs

Should have farmed so much endo smh

I thought they would trade ban but didnt happen to anyone DE give reward

[thick jolt]

That is a very old idea that i'm pretty sure has been ditched

[cobalt hedge]

They could bring it back for raids tho

If they bring back raids

[strange moon]

Is it possible to make Jade survive?

[nova harness]

Rebb said raids were cancelled

[cobalt hedge]

No

That's kinda the point of the mission

She gives her life for her child

[strange moon]

Ah, I felt I did something wrong in the rhythm game section

and I suck a rhythm games

[cobalt hedge]

Sad

[strange moon]

I think I only missed one beat....

And I was thinking to myself "that one beat could've saved her life"

[cobalt hedge]

Nope

[strange moon]

The ending totally reminded me of the movie Children of Men

when the Corpus stood down to let the baby through

I guess now that's a spoiler for that movie too

Highly recommended

[flat magnet]

Yeah you’re good dw, I missed two

made a joke about whether or not my Babyframe would still be okay despite messing up the pregnancy

[strange moon]

I was literally like "what the hell is going on?"

So did Stalker put the baby in one of the pods?

Or is the baby a Frame unto its own?

Why did we o back to Lua?

[fleet spruce]

how are we gonna explain about Orion telling us he saw thousand people looked like his mom?

[fleet spruce]

lets hope Orion grows up and be as violent as Shadow

[strange moon]

I named em Sirius

[flat magnet]

Same thought sorren would want to honor his dead wife by picking a name associated with her

[strange moon]

Named em Sirius because of the Satelite Radio

[thick jolt]

I kinda went the opposite
I imagined jade would want sorren to name their child to strengthen their bond

[fleet spruce]

named him Orion I love its violent bloody background it came with

[surreal stratus]

Do any of the intelligent tweakers in here know if Archon shard modifactions to secondary stats impacts Jade's Exalted weapon?

[flat magnet]

Such as?

[surreal stratus]

Any of the secondary modifiers. But I suppose the simplest example is the Red Shard's +25% crit to secondaries

[flat magnet]

Plausible reasoning

[flat magnet]

Yes but imo not worth it because her base cc is too low

[surreal stratus]

If I were to use any, it'd probably be the topaz one with the heat stuff. Since it gives a bit more of a bump to crit

[flat magnet]

With 5 Tau Topaz = 375% cc
Creeping bullseye = 200% cc
And a maxed out arcane avenger
You get 15*7.75 + 45 = 161.25 cc on glory

without the arcane it’s 116.25% cc

Personally it’s not worth dumping that many Topaz shards for very little increase in crit chance

[rain otter]

It would be better to just use the strength and duration shards for Jade.

But I like her 3 so.

[flat magnet]

Yeah unless they allow casting speed to affect her 1 whilst in 4 I might eventually get 5 tau crimson all duration on her

[surreal stratus]

Probably. I was just wondering since I've never really pondered the question before. Despite having Mesa who could probably benefit even more from it

[flat magnet]

Mesa can get over 300% cc on regulators with 4 tauforged and arcane avenger

[rain otter]

Idk about all duration. I would get 3 strength 2 duration. But I like having precision intensify.

[surreal stratus]

Casting speed doesnt affect her 1 when cast with 4 active?

[flat magnet]

Nope there’s a noticeable delay between casts so you can’t freely spam

[rain otter]

The funny thing to put on Mesa is parkour velocity cuz it effects her roll. So you can use the augment and with like 1 or 2 velocity tau shards go faster than most frames running speed.

[flat magnet]

I’m happy with her strength, I have negative efficiency and want my 3 to last as possible because it’s expensive to cast lol

[rain otter]

Respectable.

[muted zephyr]

Me before playing jade shadows: yo, wouldn't it be funny if Jade and the Stalker fell in love?
Me after playing jade shadows: stunned silence as I realize my thoughts were an understatement

[nocturne kiln]

Jokes on you, they were in love from the start

[fleet spruce]

Shadow may be violent when hunting down Warframes, but ya boy Kullervo will teach Orion how to be even more VIOLENT than Shadow ever be!

[gusty pebble]

Yes

It works on dante i have extra cc on that jade was mid compared to him for that invig

Ans shards

Also ths ability damage affects the secondary exalted aswell

Shard

[nocturne kiln]

Aw... someone deleted my fallout new vegas benny gif. I guess mods don't know the "the game was rigged from the start" memes

[thick jolt]

Sirion

[gusty pebble]

In this server m

[amber terrace]

So did DE retroactively revoice all of Stalker’s previous lines with Gianni Matragrano?

I also haven’t gotten Stalker to spawn yet(because skill issue), so I have no way to verify if DE got Gianni to voice Stalker’s combat lines

[gusty pebble]

Did stalker change gender?

[undone lodge]

I think?

[amber terrace]

Nah, but he got a wife

[thick jolt]

Stalker spawned three times in a row for me 2 days ago

[undone lodge]

I’ve barely ever encountered him but recently he came to a mission I was on and it sounded different to what I remember

[undone lodge]

Belly of the Beast Alert?

[thick jolt]

Nope was finishing a lich

Was kinda surprised

[nocturne kiln]

...Do you ever think they considered how the name "Belly of the beast" could be connected to jade...?

[amber marten]

Sirius fits, because that was the star Osiris was attributed to in Egyptian lore, so it made sense as Jade has the powers of life and death.

Orion is just a smarmy bastard.

[amber terrace]

Nah, probably to do with how we’re styling on the Corpus in Stalker’s living room

[nova harness]

In what world did your brain come to need to ask this question?

[surreal stratus]

That is a great question

[valid jolt]

Why does everyone like Sirius?

[nova harness]

Probably because it’s the mothers side

[valid jolt]

Wait

There were sides?

[nova harness]

Stalker picked Orion

Jade wanted Sirius

[valid jolt]

How do you know that?

Was it mentioned in the quest somewhere?

[nova harness]

Can’t remember but that’s the general consensus rn

[covert tree]

Not mentioned shown

[valid jolt]

Where was it shown?

[nova harness]

At the end

Stalker was red

Jade was Green

[valid jolt]

You mean during the name selection?

[nova harness]

Yes

[valid jolt]

I didn’t even notice lol

[rain otter]

all your genders' belong to us.

[valid jolt]

I thought it was just a simple preference thing

[rain otter]

it is.

you are both right.

[valid jolt]

I thought Stalker was deciding on both names ngl. But now knowing that the names were apparently color coded, I probably would’ve went with Sirius then

[tawdry socket]

It's implicitly what their preferred name would be, but it's really just the colour coding we have to go off of

[valid jolt]

Guess I’m color blind

[nova harness]

Did you really not notice the red and green?

[valid jolt]

Nope

[nova harness]

Deadpan colourblind confirmed

How has bro got through all his quests?

[valid jolt]

Lol if people said Duviri was colored during the quest, then I would believe I’m color blind

But nah I was probably just caught up in the moment and didn’t even notice the different colors

[nova harness]

Duviri was coloured differently

[valid jolt]

Uhhh not true

[nova harness]

Duviri was emotional

Duviri loves emotions

[valid jolt]

.

[chilly pine]

duviri starts very grey, and becomes more vibrant during the main questline for that spiral,

[steep delta]

What is eternalism...

I need an answer asap

[rain otter]

Basically that multiple timelines exist. That's it.

Or well CAN exist.

Their is still a main one.

[gray coral]

ahh eternalism my old friend

[steep delta]

Hello eternalism my old friend

Lmao

[scarlet basalt]

oh god, i think 1999 may be the real biggest expansion of this game 😭

[rain otter]

I would put Zariman up there but sure.

[amber marten]

Colour, Sirius was green, Orion was red

[scarlet basalt]

Someone glitched in the game and saw that they have a lot of props, given that there are hidden NPC,kallymos,albretch,etc... in here i feel like 1999 may be the true biggest expansion for this game
But DE said that this may not be the case and it would suprise us in other way, they said they have "tricks on their sleeves"

[amber marten]

It's going to Y2K the game. I may have to delete other games on my laptop to run it

[rain otter]

Yeah I don't like messing with leaks or models or whatever.

[scarlet basalt]

The true trick : the game will be weighting around 200 gb 😍

Warframe need to be like other western game dev and make their game weight 400 gb 😍

[amber marten]

I can yeet Halo and Fallout 4 as I've hardly touched them in months. Not Star Trek Online though

[scarlet basalt]

ngl, i still wonder if the search for Minn will be so unexpected
It would be wild if she somehow landed in 1999 💀
But i really feel like she would land on duviri land, like Lorn

[terse gyro]

Just got attacked by Light Stalker. His scythe does nutty damage now

[scarlet basalt]

i thought stalker would have more skills and would be tougher, it's...Unexpected

[terse gyro]

Honestly, he's tougher just by virtue of no longer being in his Shadow form. Do wish they would still use his unarmored character model though.

Or gave him the ephemera from the event.

[rain otter]

The hunhow Stalker was kinda weaker than normal cuz he was weak to like op bappin him.

[scarlet basalt]

DE also is making a testing ground on duviri, currently you have to manually ground finish units (which wasn't the case before, it was automatic)
Meaning that likely the gameplay could involve a lot of making infestation explode or be thrown away like a kid and their doll and ground finish them

Unless this change was only for the new decree that involve finisher (tho it wasn't needed and the only time we manually ground finish is in 1999 section)

[sage harness]

@hollow sluice

[terse gyro]

To be fair, Shadow Stalker came out before Operator mode was added. His Sentient adaptation and disco ball of death attacks were meant to make him more threatening. The issue was that all attacks were pretty easy to dodge. Then power creep kicked in and the poor guy didn't stand a chance.

[rain otter]

No? Cuz the quest that you do gave you operator. It was a big death Lazer and not running around but it was there. Like their was even a different focus tree then.

[terse gyro]

I know, I was there. But the Operator lazor was still pretty limiting in terms of resetting adaptation.

[tawdry socket]

How, after all these years, have the Quills not developed Eidolon Lures that aren't as janky as the Grineer ones we have to steal

This isn;t even a spoiler question

[undone lodge]

Maybe they just don’t have the production power?

Or eidolon lures could use materials that while they could buy/obtain, it’s much cheaper to just steal the ones the Grineer use instead

[fierce summit]

Why make your own when they keep replacing the ones you steal?
"everything will be as it ever was" you say, running off with the fourth replacement lure the grineer installed that night

[prime raptor]

in the second dream quest stalker will pierce jade if she is our selected warframe :(

[nova harness]

He’s coded to stab any Warframe

[tawdry socket]

tfw the grineer just stop deploying them

[prime raptor]

yes, but it's a shame they left it like that

[thick jolt]

imagine how many more fixes would be needed if they poked the beast that is spagetthi code to change that

[nova harness]

It’s easier to not go into the belly of the beast that is Warframe code and break the game

[fierce summit]

Also it's easy to write off Jade's appearance in even a base Second Dream playthrough as non-canon

She's not supposed to be there, and the only way she can be there is via market purchase

[nova harness]

Or building the bps

[fierce summit]

I mean you can't get her BP until you complete Jade Shadows, which indirectly requires The Second Dream. If she is in the cutscene, you are either doing a replay or you bought her for platinum before playing the quest the first time.

Same but far less dissonant issue with Harrow since he's also not available at the time (Rell's still stuck in him and all that)

[nova harness]

Technically it wouldn’t be canon for people as they are replaying an event that already happened

[fierce summit]

Exactly, hence why I say it's easy to excuse the Stalker stabbing her as non-canon

[amber marten]

DE, a moment of your time.

[prime raptor]

they can simply prohibit playing the quest on a frame that cannot exist at the time of completing the quest

[nova harness]

That would ruin the freedom of choice of which frame you can use

[rain otter]

Yeah.

[mighty sky]

https://x.com/HanumTaza/status/1805244048124547148?t=T_fvuSJA4XaUpX0qf8KKTA&s=19

Pliket-Pliket (Commissions full 10/10) (@HanumTaza) on X

Diabolical
#warframe #tennocreate

Twitter · Jun 24, 2024, 2:18 PM

It should be noted a Warframe is a walking Geneva Convention violation. So a baby frame with no emotional control and either has Jade or Stalker's abilities... Or more horrifying some combo of the 2... Is pretty much a living nuclear bomb.

[real niche]

Geneva Convention does not exist in Warframe, they'd probably use it as a checklist.

[nova harness]

Geneva suggestion

[mighty sky]

Either way the idea of a baby Warframe temper tantrum is... Problematic... To say the least.

[rain otter]

Yeah.

[brittle nymph]

whats going on w bird 3? isnt this where youre meant to get the Entrati stuff?

[balmy storm]

Oop, that’s def a bug

Might want to report that, hopefully it’ll be fixed soon

[thick jolt]

try undoing that tokens filter you have there

[brittle nymph]

nothing else to put it on

[thick jolt]

definetely weird

[amber terrace]

Whoops wrong image lol

There, this is so cool, apparently post Jade Shadows, the Stalker appears differently

Also, got the Nightwave done

[valid jolt]

Would’ve finished it too if I didn’t procrastinate last weeks Nightwave rip

But congrats

[amber terrace]

Thanks, now I don’t need to obsessively do every challenge a week has to offer, really lightens the load of stuff that all happens right at reset

Now all I have to worry about for a given week is the Archon Hunt, Elite Deep Archimedea, and Netracells : )

[valid jolt]

Lol Netracells and Archon hunts aren’t that hard

EDA can be if you get a horrible loadout

[sleek tangle]

Wait how

I done all nw missions

But i got 7,5k

What ?

[thick jolt]

that makes no sense even in a single week you would get more than 7.5k

[sleek tangle]

I know but like

I have only the cache challenge left but if i count it in it’s up to 7,5k

For lv29 tho

[amber terrace]

Never said they were hard, they’re rather easy, just tedious

[amber terrace]

Perhaps you missed a few dailies? Before today’s reset, I was at 9.5k standing at 29

[sleek tangle]

Idk could be but every week you should get enough for like 6 lvl right ?

[amber terrace]

My count was closer to 4 ish but my math could be off

[sleek tangle]

Idk

Oh nah could be up to 5 but not 6

Man

I just want the armor why is it so hard

[amber terrace]

Because it wouldn’t be conducive for player retention if someone could complete an entire Nightwave pass in like a few hours

Or something like that, idk, I don’t like time gating activities that give good rewards, whether they be cosmetic(Daybreak armor) or gameplay improving(M. Duplicate)

[steep delta]

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Theories_of_Time eternalism go brrrrr

[rain otter]

I mean it's still very lenient.

[steep delta]

I just love eternalism lol

[steep delta]

Ummm crap lol

[rain otter]

This is in duviri.

As a tablet.

[hardy wasp]

So jade turned into radioactive dust that gives people superpowers

What would happen if i snorted a line of jade powder up my nose

Can i breathe laser

[autumn turret]

die

[sage wren]

I always like to compare this to the dragon break from the elder scrolls franchise

[steep delta]

Dragon Break?

[sage wren]

It's essentially all the timelines I can and

When the major event happens multiple different path open but in the end all will converge you to one

[steep delta]

I see

[obtuse gyro]

of course todd

[steep delta]

It is as it should be

Eternalism go brrrrrrrr

So.... What exactly is the purpose of say Hunhow for example like what's his role in all this?

The general lore I mean

Or moreso the Sentients in general

[obtuse gyro]

space grandpa

[steep delta]

Lol yep

[obtuse gyro]

before or after they returned from tau and before or after the old and new war?

[steep delta]

Both? I guess

I just don't understand the Sentients

Like what is their purpose

[obtuse gyro]

at which point tho

and do you mean narratively or do you mean like what do they do in-universe

[steep delta]

In-universe

And before/after the new/old wars I guess

[obtuse gyro]

The sentients were made to take the long way to tau and terraform it for the Orokin

at some point the Sentients were like "hang on, we like tau, and the Orokin would ruin tau like they did Origin, we cant let that slide"

and so the Old War began.

The new war happens because Ballas is in control, trying to make the sentients take over the system, like they would have done if not for natah's lack of killing the tenno

[steep delta]

So basically... Natah good; Ballas --controlling baka-- corrupt leader

Did I get that correct?

And that the Sentients were like nope™️ when they realized that Tau would have been ruined like the Origin System

And because they liked Tau they went to war with the Orokin

Is that correct?

[obtuse gyro]

eh not natah good, more like natah broken and manipulated so she didnt do what the sentients expected her to do

[obtuse gyro]

yeap

[steep delta]

She was still broken up until TNW and manipulated by Ballas during TNW so

--Ballas got what he deserved--

[potent vine]

I do love that parvos knows who “Ordis” is he immediately knows that voice

[nocturne kiln]

I mean... You know what certain presidents sound like. or an aproximate. famous movie stars and politicians... in orokin society, it was whoever supported orokin rule the most that was celebrated. Im sure they broadcasted Ordan Karris as much as they felt wise, both to moralize thier populace... and threaten them as well.

[valid jolt]

I’m glad DE made Ordis’s backstory more obvious. Before, you had to collect like all Cephalon Fragments in order to find out

[nocturne kiln]

I mean... to get the full story, you still have to. ...or look up a youtube video

[junior vine]

There's one youtuber that I can never trust after seeing his Zariman video

[hearty pendant]

what was wrong with it?

[junior vine]

He's saying us. The tenno died on the Zariman

[hearty pendant]

yeah that's
that's pretty wrong

[junior vine]

Exactly

Because how would the orokin have recovered the children of the 10-0 if they died

[hearty pendant]

ig you could try to make the case that the tenno are like the holdfasts, but the holdfasts don't seem able to leave the void/the area near it which causes a huge issue there

[valid jolt]

Which Youtuber if you don’t mind me asking?

[junior vine]

Pen Of Evil

[valid jolt]

Well yea but at least more people know about Ordis’s past. I one time met someone who was like LR2, had like thousands of hours in the game, and had no idea who the Beast of Bones was when someone talked about it

[junior vine]

I believe Dark Siege actually went through all the cephalon fragments for the lore of Ordis

[junior vine]

The beast of bones is Ordan Karris aka Ordis

[valid jolt]

I’m sure it’s just their theory lol

[junior vine]

Mr 18 btw

[junior vine]

True, however if it wasn't it's definitely wrong

[nocturne kiln]

I'd love a third timeline. Operator, Drifter, ...and the Son/Daughter of Bones (Ordis never threw Karris away and instead trained the operator above and beyond thier Tenno ways)

like a dark timeline

[valid jolt]

A timeline where the Tenno never massacred the Orokin would be cool

[balmy storm]

That’s Drifter’s
Unless you mean the tenno were saved but never got the chance

[valid jolt]

Yea I meant if the Orokin won the Old War thanks to the Tenno and everything, but the Tenno never killed the Orokin during the Naga Drums

[balmy storm]

I’d imagine they’d send the Tenno out at some point with a better plan to take Tau but idk

[fierce summit]

Ah yes the timeline where Hunhow threw out Ballas' vitruvian message as spam and thus did not send his daughter to do a little trolling

[valid jolt]

Lmao basically

[nocturne kiln]

Stalker's dating sim nightmare: The remaining grineer queen, the half sentient Lotus, the Tenno reanimating his dead wife in front of thier son

[fleet spruce]

Tenno while fighting: listens to their favorite playlist
Grineer: Gruppa Krovi - na rukave, Moy poryadkovyy nomer - na rukave, Pozhelay mne udachi v boyu, pozhelay mne: Ne ostat'sya v etoy trave, Ne ostat'sya v etoy trave. Pozhelay mne udachi, pozhelay mne udachi!

[nocturne kiln]

...Is that Rammstein?

[junior vine]

Was everyone else wondering if the Tenno was gonna have a big void blast attack the statue near the end of whispers?

[nocturne kiln]

According to eternalism, they did/didn't have a big void blast attack

[junior vine]

But they never used it

Also, do I have to get the standing for that damn Shard combiner thingy

Or can I choose it when I rank up?

[nocturne kiln]

They did/n't

[junior vine]

No they didn't?

[nocturne kiln]

Right, they- nevermind. You dont understand eternalism

[junior vine]

You're not even using evidence to back it up💀

[nocturne kiln]

its a fundimental eternalism concept

[junior vine]

Im talking about within the quest. You clearly didn't read it correctly

[nocturne kiln]

I did. Im just applying a principle for the game. its not going over nearly as funny as I thought it would be

[rain otter]

That's not how that works.

[gusty pebble]

What are u on about bruv

Bruv talking about assumption and sayin proof lmao

[rain otter]

We have never seen DE use eternalism for that way.

[nocturne kiln]

That may be why the joke isnt working

[junior vine]

Unless you mean the iron man type shi after the second dream and before tww idk what you mean

[rain otter]

I've seen way more people make eterlism jokes or be mad about it when they literally don't know how it works or how it's been used.

[gusty pebble]

Fpr what way im lost

[nocturne kiln]

its applying one of the concept of the classroom problems and trying to apply it here. I may be applying it wrong though

[rain otter]

You are.

[gusty pebble]

Bruv jokes arent limited to ur understanding

What u dont understand might be funny for another

Dont shove ur bs

[junior vine]

That's not what eternalism is. Eternalism is where there is different ways a situation would have played out

[rain otter]

Also we have this which seems to imply we have a base timelines.

[gusty pebble]

Yea

[rain otter]

Different timelines being possible and such.

[junior vine]

Like for example the drifter and their Zariman

[rain otter]

Like the unum seems them all.

So it's not that werid.

[nocturne kiln]

right, where such a situation both did and didnt happen, where both answers are true

[rain otter]

Could and couldn't.

Not did and didn't.

[gusty pebble]

If unum do see stuff its like infinite possibilities laid out there

[rain otter]

Cuz like we can't go to the drifters timeline.

[gusty pebble]

Each event will span out another infinite possibility for next

[rain otter]

Also it seems to show like Wally killing all our other like possibilities in tnw.

[nocturne kiln]

Then what was the example given about saving the mom or dad about? I thought it was a did or didnt scenario

[gusty pebble]

Like we can see unum failinv on with eidolon

[rain otter]

What?

[gusty pebble]

Also when we shook hands we could see many drifter/operator dying

[rain otter]

It was more saying you could do both kinda.

[rain otter]

That is what I'm talking about.

[gusty pebble]

Unum giving kuva to animals to monitor and attacking eidolon backfired

Didnt anticipate that

[rain otter]

It did not backfire really.

[gusty pebble]

Or did and did anyway

[gusty pebble]

Clearly states

Backfire

[rain otter]

No?

[gusty pebble]

Because sentient found imout the kuva can bring back their capability to spawn iffspring

[junior vine]

Hold up. Didn't Gara defeat that sentient?

[gusty pebble]

Which in turn intensified attacks instead

[gusty pebble]

Then gara

[junior vine]

Did you know that they're the same Gara?

[nocturne kiln]

Gara the frame or Gara the tenno?

[junior vine]

There was no tenno named gara?

[rain otter]

The frame. Also gara and the tower where gay.

[gusty pebble]

How do i quote

[junior vine]

Shaking hands combined both of their realities into 1

[gusty pebble]

No tenno are named of warframes

[junior vine]

There's no warframe named wickedkilla6969?

[gusty pebble]

I see many dying of suffocation or somesorts just death

[junior vine]

It combined every last reality into 1

[gusty pebble]

The Sentient sensed this subterfuge, and, capturing one of the Unum's animals, opened it up for examination. And what little of the Unum was present there… lit the Sentient's mind like the dark star from which it had fallen. The Sentient, you see, could not procreate. But in the Temple Kuva it tasted healing. Completeness. A future. It devoured each and every last Unum-animal, but it was not enough.

The Sentient turned its hundreds of eyes toward the Tower with new understanding: it would not destroy the Tower. It would become the Tower. It would kill the Unum, take her place, and, one with that healing palace, give birth to a race of itself.

^

[junior vine]

Sorry buddy, but your tenno are named after warframes is quite wrong. There's no warframe named wickedkilla6969 or pancakeinabin

[gusty pebble]

Wbat is blud yappin about

[nocturne kiln]

doesnt that say gara was a tenno?

[rain otter]

Eh

[gusty pebble]

Collectively everyone call warframes tenno

Not much know about the operator secret

[rain otter]

Ehhhhh

[nocturne kiln]

"The Tenno scattered but one remains. Gara" That sounds like Gara is the name of the Tenno

[rain otter]

Gara is the frame

[junior vine]

M8, when they're called tenno they're referring to the operator

[rain otter]

They might have a operator.

[nocturne kiln]

So, correct me if im wrong, I thought the warframes were named post production after the Tenno that used them the most. like a weapon being named after its user.

And the tenno selected names for themselves from across history as a way to disassociate who they were before and after the Zariman tragedy.

[fierce summit]

Unless the speaker is a high-ranking Orokin, the title "Tenno" refers to the Warframes. The real Tenno, the children, were a closely guarded Orokin secret and thus most people in the empire would have no idea that the Warframes were being remote controlled.

[rain otter]

This is incorrect. Ballas Names the frames

[rain otter]

We know this from the prime Trailers. Ballas is like presenting them to the other 7 (usually sometimes not) and then says their name at the end of the presentation.

[fierce summit]

Even now, the idea that the Tenno are not the Warframes is obscure knowledge

[rain otter]

All the Quills know.

The unum knows.

[nocturne kiln]

...I guess that does explain why Harrow was not named Rell.

[fierce summit]

The Quills and Unum can see the threads of Khra, they're weird

[rain otter]

One of my favorite prime trailers is actually Ballas taking to hunhow about how when he kills all the operators leave the one controlling hyldrin alive cuz that one is his bodyguard

[rain otter]

Also unum was a old pre old war tenno ally and was In a relationship with gara.

[junior vine]

But then we now know that Hunhow is an ally to the tenno

[rain otter]

Ehhhh not a Ally

Begrudgingly accepting us as his daughter family as he is depressed in a ocean.

[junior vine]

Question tho. If he didn't wouldn't he have no recommended the stalker go to us for help?

[junior vine]

And nobody ever named Jade

[fierce summit]

GF got turned into some space child's weapons platform? No problem. Simply Continuity / Transference yourself into a giant meat tower and become a time god.

[rain otter]

This is after the new war. He is a broken father at this point.

[junior vine]

He's a dual grandfather

[gusty pebble]

Thats so stupid

@obtuse gyro lil help

[rain otter]

Like after the new war Hunhow is like a sad grandfather that regrets all his life decisions.

[junior vine]

Explain how please

[nocturne kiln]

mind you, in old english literature, things like saying they were inseperable or beloved does not necisarily designate romance but instead closeness

[junior vine]

Yeah

[gusty pebble]

Not much people know about the operator secret bruv

People only knew about the warframes

[junior vine]

Clearly everybody knows now. Except for maybe the Corpus

[fierce summit]

Jade keeping her name and also being equipped with the powers of the Jade Light seems to be some kind of sick joke by whomever created her (Ballas probably).

[gusty pebble]

No bruv

[junior vine]

What about the grineer queens?

[fierce summit]

They're Orokin. They likely knew from before

[gusty pebble]

They didnt know till teshin ratted out

Again limited people

[junior vine]

Clearly not if the elder one was looking for the tenno as a Yuvan

[rain otter]

1. This isn't old English. 2. I think a lotta that was also people being gay but people at the time didn't wanna admit it. Homophobia was rampant at the time. We have the "they where roommates" joke for a reason.

[gusty pebble]

Dude even alad v didnt know who disected a warframe

U think with all his research he wouldave missed that part?

[rain otter]

Also also you're gonna look at me in the eyes and tell me "her love" "inseparable" "beloved unum" isn't a relationship? @nocturne kiln

[nocturne kiln]

okay, at least be factual with your arguments. homosexuality has been present (though not spoken of openly, such as being shamed) in several human civilization

[junior vine]

You said that the queens didn't know until teshin ratted them out

[gusty pebble]

Yea

Teshin helped at the start of the quest against tenno

What were u even doin in the quest blud

[rain otter]

It's been present in every one so has every identity.

[nocturne kiln]

And I refuse to believe that everything should be viewed from the lens of only modern politics. writers of game universe often make side lore somewhat obscure so they can do things with it later if they want to

[gusty pebble]

Yea

[rain otter]

This isn't modern. What?

[gusty pebble]

Dudes doin ads of lg

Can we get topic to spoilers

[junior vine]

Okay, but listen. Did you hear the smaller worm queen say "My sister needs the orphan child not it's infested puppet" which clearly proves she knew

[hardy wasp]

Romans and greeks arguing who had the gayer history

[obtuse gyro]

Not the case at all

[gusty pebble]

Bruv r u even listening to me

[rain otter]

Also warframe is literally us fighting space capitalists.

[gusty pebble]

Bau help with this dude

[rain otter]

Like idk what to tell you bro it was always this way.

[nocturne kiln]

The japanese had some doccumented cases as well

[rain otter]

The gay was in the house all along.

[junior vine]

"They didn't know until Teshin ratted out"

[rain otter]

If this was a guy and a girl you would agree.

[gusty pebble]

Yea

[nocturne kiln]

capitalists? See this is what I mean

[gusty pebble]

Shady gettin blocked

[hardy wasp]

Kabuki no?

[nocturne kiln]

Corpus are the capitalists, at most. the other factions have completely different structures

[rain otter]

THAT'S NOT NEW. PEOPLE ALWAYS USED THIS WORD.

[junior vine]

The fact you're mad that basically all of us are correct and you're not using jack to even back your claims up. And your grammar is horrible

[gusty pebble]

What are u on about bruv

[hardy wasp]

*you're

[gusty pebble]

He was yappin about lg rather spoiler so he getin blocked

[junior vine]

?

[hardy wasp]

Shut it zoomer the adults are talking

[junior vine]

What part @hardy wasp

[obtuse gyro]

Not everyone. The grineer queens dont appear to have bothered to share that secret with the rest of the grineer.

Its still very much a closed secret

[hardy wasp]

Was just kidding

[gusty pebble]

Yea

[rain otter]

DE has said we fight space capitalists idk what to tell you. This a political game. We take down like unjust power structures and stuff.

[rain otter]

What does LG mean? I wanna know.

[gusty pebble]

Another challenged user ari getin blocked

[junior vine]

Lgbtq

[nocturne kiln]

and this is how discussions deteriorate... someone uses an absolute in thier wording and trust that the other is speaking in good faith degridates on both sides...

[rain otter]

He didn't say all of it.

[nocturne kiln]

IG: I guess

[rain otter]

We didn't even get to like the funny dagath story.

[junior vine]

But that's what he meant. Because you were on the topic of the Unum and Gara being lesbian

[rain otter]

A evil bi Poly couple takes in a horse girl.

That's not a joke that's real.

That's her story.

[flat magnet]

What did I miss seems there was some drama

[rain otter]

Nah.

[gusty pebble]

Yea

[obtuse gyro]

Im lost too

[rain otter]

I don't think so.

[junior vine]

Ppl not knowing lore

[rain otter]

I'm just talking lore.

[nocturne kiln]

yup. and it turns out the horse girl was secretly a Goth (like the warriors) all along

[gusty pebble]

Yea u

[fierce summit]

Dagath also seems to regain her free will when they holepunch her face with a laser.

[rain otter]

Yes.

Dagath is a very odd warframe.

[junior vine]

Intrinsic is saying that the grineer queens didn't know about the tenno themselves until after Teshin supposedly said something about it

[nocturne kiln]

no thoughts, head empty. truely ignorance is bliss

[flat magnet]

It was never stated that original Dagath died right?

[obtuse gyro]

Makes me feel like her transference bolt got fried, but thats speculation at best

[gusty pebble]

The problem

[rain otter]

She did not. Well she would slowly die without a helmith.

[fierce summit]

Not that I'm aware of. She might still be out a-roamin'

[gusty pebble]

Dude didnt get it

[junior vine]

I was already corrected for that.

[flat magnet]

Yeah she just turned into an urban legend

[gusty pebble]

U were still yapin on that

[nocturne kiln]

the way dagath's story was writen, it almost paints warframification as an alternative to being glassed/becoming a cephalon

[rain otter]

I mean without a helmith she probably slowly dies.

[rain otter]

I mean it is.

[gusty pebble]

U didnt even acknoledge u were wrong u just went on

[flat magnet]

Yeah it was also used as punishment

[rain otter]

We see that in the sacrifice.

[obtuse gyro]

How they know isnt exactly said clearly, but its possible their past as orokin aristocrats might have lent them some way to learn of the secret on lua

[junior vine]

Because you were trying to say that the grineer queens didn't know about the actual tenno not the warframes until Teshin said something

[gusty pebble]

I said teshin worked against operator on that quest

[junior vine]

Yeah, and I even quoted what the smaller worm queen said during the quest and he still didn't understand. Btw I see your point with the ds stuff. However they still possibly could've used it as a base design

[gusty pebble]

Hand to hand with the queens

[junior vine]

Clearly not if he said "A chance to kill you, and now I finally have it."

[gusty pebble]

At the start atleast

[nocturne kiln]

He did, but because he was bound against his will. bound by honnor

[fierce summit]

I'm assuming that as well. Her inactivity while she's with the couple as a Warframe makes it seem like she never had an operator (which is good because can you imagine putting a child in that mess) but once she got the laser suddenly she's back to action.

I'm guessing the Helminth might have been able to decentralize her nervous system or something and allow her to wake back up.

[gusty pebble]

Yea

[flat magnet]

When we go to the fortress she says I don’t want the puppet bring me my yuvan or along those lines

[gusty pebble]

Like u cant make dude who is bound spill some secrets

[nova harness]

Bound by Kuva

[nocturne kiln]

he wanted to kill the queen but was honnor bound to serve her. teshin was of a breed of warior that held thier creed, thier code above themselves as an individual

[junior vine]

The smaller queen says "My sister needs the orphan child not it's infested puppet"

[junior vine]

Yup

[gusty pebble]

Yea bruv they knew

[flat magnet]

Not honor, his body literally couldn’t attack them whilst they had the sceptre

[junior vine]

He even helped the tenno escape

[nova harness]

He wasn’t bound by honour he was bound by Kuva

[junior vine]

Which is why he needed the tenno to grab it

[nocturne kiln]

He was honnor bound to serve those who held the kuva

[rain otter]

The funniest thing about Teshin to me still. He can do mind kung-fu. Like he leads us on a whole vision quest in our mind.

How can he do that?

[nocturne kiln]

Which is why when we get it... he is free

[junior vine]

As I was saying🤣🤣
And you said they didn't until Teshin mentioned something

[junior vine]

Yeah

[junior vine]

Yup

[flat magnet]

Not even honour if it was just honour he could still attack and then be dishonoured

[junior vine]

I refuse to believe Intrinsic actually payed any attention to The War Within

[flat magnet]

Saying honour bound was just a nice way of putting you can’t go against your master

[gusty pebble]

Queens knew from vor or teshin or fron their orokin times

"But the Dreamers have awakened. They will come for us."

[junior vine]

Vor literally tells them that they have awakened

[obtuse gyro]

With how wonky warframe designs are, we can assume that helminth can do such a thing, especially when we look at frames with the most wonky heads that cannot accommodate the crux of the nervous system

[junior vine]

I mean we were bound with honor to serve the orokin and look how that happened. A whole race is practically gone

[flat magnet]

Yeah exactly honour didn’t stop us

[gusty pebble]

and even lotus didnt know queens had form

Lotus: "I thought the Queens were just an invention of Grineer command. No one has ever seen them in the flesh."

Operator: "I have a feeling Teshin has. Can you track him?"

[junior vine]

"So you became tenno, serving the orokin but bound by honor." The Lotus during the end conversation of The Second Dream

[nocturne kiln]

No... no thats not how an honor bound warrior works...

[junior vine]

"No one has ever seen them in the flesh"

[nova harness]

We had a handler so we didn’t the problem was the handler wanted them dead too

[nocturne kiln]

We are not of the dax either

[junior vine]

@nocturne kiln

[nocturne kiln]

okay, going into the dax, our suedo bushido samurai

[random solstice]

I prefer to listen to the handler than the people who threw people around like slaves

[nocturne kiln]

They were raised, from birth, to be the orokin's footsoldiers. honor bound, likely even psychologically augmented, to hold thier creed above all else in thier life, above even themselves

the perfect loyal soldiers for thier golden lords

[flat magnet]

the point I’m trying to get is honour isn’t something that could physically stop teshin from attacking them

[flat magnet]

What about when we take the sceptre and give him the choice to kill the queen

Why didn’t honour stop him then?

[coral cape]

What is Wally exactly, is he just the void itself, or is he a literal entity (possibly from the void?)

[fleet spruce]

oh well, we had the scepter

[random solstice]

Because we have the scepter

[nocturne kiln]

right right right but we're following a different code. The Tenno code of honor, which was more about belonging to our own group and taking care of each other

[junior vine]

As I quoted with the voiceline from the lotus with the "We fought with honor" choice in the second dream

[obtuse gyro]

Literal entity

What he is to be exact is to be determined

[gusty pebble]

Yea

[coral cape]

thought so esspecially with the dialouge about him

[junior vine]

Which proves he's bound to follow whoever is holding the scepter which has the kuva

[gusty pebble]

We still dont know what it is

[flat magnet]

Yes exactly my point is honour wasn’t stopping him the sceptre was stopping him

[junior vine]

Because of the Kuva

[gusty pebble]

Many theory some being that is enchained and prisoned

[obtuse gyro]

I have more thoughts about what he is, but uh, Im not in a position irl rn to go in depth, remind me in like 30mins to an hour

[junior vine]

He is far from imprisoned

[gusty pebble]

Some theory the cumination of dark desires

[nocturne kiln]

no... no not that at all. He was honnor bound to obey the wielder of the scepter. His command was transfered, not erased

[flat magnet]

Do you think it’s that specific kuva vial or it works on all kuva lol

[junior vine]

Probably all Kuva

Who deleted his message?

[gusty pebble]

Whatever ur opinion is dont bother me

[nova harness]

That Man trapped in the wall

[coral cape]

the guards also had kuva armour stopping our warframe (and probably him) so all

[nocturne kiln]

It was always about who held the kuva, not that his honnor suddenly didnt exist

[junior vine]

I say he's far from imprisoned because he can come into our world

The reliquary drives

[nova harness]

Through us

[gusty pebble]

He cant thats like astral projection

[junior vine]

The reliquary drives are his finger

[gusty pebble]

I say u havent done new war so shutup

[nova harness]

He doesn’t just come and go as he pleases

[gusty pebble]

It was cut off before he could come in fully

[fierce summit]

That is actually part of why he's trapped. Wally is not bound by time like we are, but because his finger is stuck in our timeline, so is he.

[junior vine]

But with his finger being I'm this world. He can enter it as he pleases

[gusty pebble]

Bruh needs commonsense

Feed him someone

[junior vine]

He isn't imprisoned, look at the labs

[gusty pebble]

[junior vine]

Have you ever seen the labs?

[gusty pebble]

Bruv its not him

[flat magnet]

You said serve her implying that he as a dax were duty bound to serve the orokin and couldn’t attack her because of honour to HER

[junior vine]

Yes it is

[nocturne kiln]

To be fair, its really hard to describe the concept of eldrich horrors to someone the first time

[gusty pebble]

He can do void transferen d like us

[fierce summit]

Imprisoned relative to our existence. He is free to warp reality within that as much as he pleases.

[gusty pebble]

Not real body u need sense

Maybe it is it is unsure if he got out from new war ending its a maybe

[junior vine]

He did

[gusty pebble]

Not real body bruv

His body is what u see in new war end

[junior vine]

Do you hear yourself🤣🤣🤣🤣

[flat magnet]

We don’t acc know what Wally looks like

[gusty pebble]

The other is a projection

The one on our siz3

[nocturne kiln]

The orokin were bastards. they always built in some way to backstab someone. Take away your political opponents kuva and then make his own dax bodyguards kill him. Im sure it happened more than once

[gusty pebble]

U are mentally incapable of understanding what im tryin to say

[junior vine]

Wait. So you're saying the indifference isn't parts of him?

[junior vine]

trying*
You*

[nocturne kiln]

its more like he's part of the indiference, the inteligence behind it

[gusty pebble]

Im not sure

[junior vine]

Don't argue with me if you have horrible grammar it's hard to read without proper grammar

[junior vine]

It is.

[flat magnet]

He is the indifference

[gusty pebble]

Not his actual body parts

[nova harness]

Indifference isn’t parts of him it’s just a flashy title

[gusty pebble]

Yea

[nocturne kiln]

its a way of describing the undescribable

[prime lantern]

It's not

[nocturne kiln]

He doesnt care, but even more so. He is the Indiference

[flat magnet]

the indifference is just the physical manifestation of the void

[prime lantern]

The wally has no real form

[gusty pebble]

The real wally is huge with 4 hands

[junior vine]

Exactly because we don't know Exactly what he looks like

[gusty pebble]

Breh im losing braincells

[prime lantern]

Wally has no real form

[flat magnet]

Not even his acc form we don’t know what he looks like

[junior vine]

Exactly

[nova harness]

He can look however he wants

[nocturne kiln]

he has ways of expressing himself. the giant statue, mimicking the forms of those he has spoken to, like the tenno and Albrecht

[gusty pebble]

We dont see his face

[prime lantern]

No outside form is big enough for inside him

[junior vine]

It's not his real form. As you can easily tell from the end of whispers.

[gusty pebble]

Only face is cannot be seen and only lotus has seen

[junior vine]

He can take forms of others

[junior vine]

Yeah. You need to go replay all the quests

[nocturne kiln]

well, given he's not "real", not of our reality, to begin with, he likely has no form of which we can define beyond his entity, his inteligence

[fierce summit]

IIRC
The Indifference = Eldritch being from within the void
The Great Indifference = Physical manifestation of the Indifference (what's leaking into the labs)
The Man in the Wall = The Indifference when it wears our skin
The Murmur = Appendages of the Indifference

[gusty pebble]

This is him look at his fingers

[prime lantern]

That's a form

[junior vine]

That isn't his actual form

[prime lantern]

Its no real form

He doesn't have a real form

[gusty pebble]

If its not y is it missing fingers

[nocturne kiln]

lower left hand, index finger

[gusty pebble]

^

[flat magnet]

That’s acc well put

[gusty pebble]

Right hand

[junior vine]

@gusty pebble answer me this. If that was his actual form how can he take the form of us and albrecht?

[nocturne kiln]

Now... here's a question. Cy describes the reliquary drive as "a" reliquary drive. How many more fingers does he have out there?

[gusty pebble]

That is him doing astral projection

[fierce summit]

I don't remember where I got the idea that the Great Indifference is the hellscape we see in the labs but I swear it was written lore!

[prime lantern]

I agree with you but that is a really dumb gotcha

[flat magnet]

Probably cloned

[junior vine]

They cloned it.

[prime lantern]

Wallys gimmick is mimicry

[gusty pebble]

We had him way before he wareleased on new war

[nova harness]

That’s the concept art and isn’t actually missing any fingers

[flat magnet]

Orokin had complete control over biology pretty much

[prime lantern]

The fingers clone themselves if stored improperly

[gusty pebble]

He can project to people who have touched the void or something and talk to them

[gusty pebble]

It is missing u r blind

[nova harness]

No it isn’t

[junior vine]

Go replay all the quests.

[flat magnet]

It is

[junior vine]

Like seriously you don't know the story of the game.

[fierce summit]

The Vitruvian Man concept art is missing its lower left index finger past the first knuckle. All other hands have five fingers, it only has four. That finger was then cloned to make Reliquary drives.

[junior vine]

I can actually agree with them on this. There's 3 on one hand

[nocturne kiln]

Mastery over it so as to make it as much art as science. yet not the same control over sentience, though they were getting there. they displayed that clearly. Play with the fires of creation as if you were gods and you will get burned

[junior vine]

The thumb isn't a finger

[gusty pebble]

Bruv whatever u think is correct leave me i know what i know smh

[junior vine]

So nothing?

[flat magnet]

Human hubris, no matter how much they changed themselves to be different from the overall population they were still human

[gusty pebble]

Blocked*

[junior vine]

Alright. Have fun.

[prime lantern]

The fingers as stated by Archimedean yonta the fingers clone themselves

[junior vine]

Good. Glad you matured

[flat magnet]

The thumb is over the palm

[junior vine]

But the thumb isn't a finger

[nocturne kiln]

so what you're telling me is...

[junior vine]

So in all reality we have 4 fingers and 1 stub

[nocturne kiln]

https://tenor.com/view/war-never-changes-war-fallout-soldier-run-gif-16498934

[junior vine]

🤣🤣🤣

[flat magnet]

He is still missing his index finger

[junior vine]

Ik

[nocturne kiln]

one Stubba, yes

[junior vine]

On the hand he's missing the index he has 3 fingers

[fierce summit]

From the end of New War. Although I got the hand wrong so they did actually change the model

[junior vine]

Yeah

[gusty pebble]

Yeap

[obtuse gyro]

Incredibly awkward that we have such vivid talks of wally and Im not available to dive deeper

[flat magnet]

Mb I thought you said he wasn’t missing a finger

[junior vine]

Why?

[nocturne kiln]

I wouldnt be surprised if it was a different finger every time it got shown

[prime lantern]

Someone walk me through what happened I'm a little confused

[junior vine]

That was Nemesis

[prime lantern]

I can be baus less informed stand in

[fierce summit]

That... would be totally appropriate

[gusty pebble]

@obtuse gyro isnt this 4 handed version the real body of wally?

[nocturne kiln]

Nemesis?

[junior vine]

🤣🤣🤣🤣

[flat magnet]

We don’t know we can’t just assume it is

[nocturne kiln]

fitting even

[gusty pebble]

Bro when wally was projecting as lotus we literally kill and he come back

Only this for has sustained damages

[junior vine]

Also I'm still wondering if the zariman we have in the system is the Zariman our tenno were found on because if you pay attention in the actual orbiter itself it shows the albrecht membrane and I believe only the drifter had access to Duviri

[gusty pebble]

The only part thats not revealed of wally is his true face

Only loftus has seen so far

[junior vine]

Exain how. And actually use evidence.

[prime lantern]

Once again as we know based on lines from bird 3 wally would have no true outside form

[gusty pebble]

She doesnt mention it what she saw after the new war when asked by the drifter

[prime lantern]

He would have a true metaphysical form but no true physical form

[flat magnet]

The Vitruvian man could just as easily be another one of his projections

[junior vine]

That's what I've been trying to say

[nocturne kiln]

it is, though the crew are not. they were but mere echos of the void holding onto the identites of the people they are mimicing

[prime lantern]

Also that why would wallys real form be an orokin vitruvian man

[flat magnet]

Because he would’ve seen it from albrecht

[obtuse gyro]

In a meeting

[junior vine]

Ah

[flat magnet]

Could’ve just been like oh that looks cool lemme make that

[nocturne kiln]

form is something the void learned from our reality. it does not quite understand it, thus the many eyed and handed forms, the geometric shapes...

[junior vine]

Oh, @obtuse gyro I still think they used the dark sector enemy design as a base model for Gyre and just adjusted it

[prime lantern]

Yea that's kinda the point

[obtuse gyro]

Some folks that are rather reputable on another server posit that the pristine zariman is actually a third zariman

[prime lantern]

Wally has no real physical form

[obtuse gyro]

Okay you do you

[prime lantern]

He's got a real metaphysical form a real big one

[flat magnet]

All the other colony ships failed as well right? Ours was the only one to return

[junior vine]

Yeah, and people say that the Zariman we have isn't the same one because when it first showed up by Saturn environmental was fully up and running. The reason it's corrupted by the void is because they left it drifting in the void after recovering the tenno

[prime lantern]

Hence why wally wouldn't have a real physical form

[flat magnet]

Seeing as how big the ship is I wonder how long it took them to search the whole thing

[obtuse gyro]

There were no others mentioned or known

[junior vine]

Probably took them a while

[prime lantern]

Because nothing physical is his it's just a copy of something else

[nocturne kiln]

you keep saying real. Real is something from our reality, not his/hers/thiers

[junior vine]

The colony ships were used as a grounds for the infested testing for warframes

[prime lantern]

No real is definitely where wally is physical aint

[gusty pebble]

"I have seen the wall's other face, too. I have heard the voice."

[junior vine]

Wally doesn't have a physical form

[prime lantern]

He's got a couple dozen forms but none of them are his and only his

I'm me and only me the one and only

[junior vine]

I hope you know that you proved yourself wrong about the vitruvian man being his physical form

[prime lantern]

Wally ain't got a me to call himself

[gusty pebble]

He has

[gusty pebble]

^

[prime lantern]

Couple dozen copied forms

[junior vine]

🤣🤣🤣🤣

[gusty pebble]

Natahs quote

[prime lantern]

None quite match his metaphysical form

[junior vine]

Natah. Not the Lotus

[gusty pebble]

Bruv just shut up stop yapping without proof

[prime lantern]

Something real large an aleph 0 maybe an aleph 1

[junior vine]

I'm not gonna stop talking💀

[prime lantern]

Didn't he block you

[gusty pebble]

At the end of new war operator asks lotus what did she see she just changes subject

[flat magnet]

Sorry what’s an aleph?

[junior vine]

Clearly not if he's telling me to shut up

[gusty pebble]

Im talkin about u medi

[prime lantern]

A way to denote sets of numbers

[junior vine]

She says "nothing."

[nocturne kiln]

its a bad faith argument to stop discussion "because shut up"

[prime lantern]

Aleph 0 the set of all natural numbers is 1 2 3 4 ...

[junior vine]

She doesn't change the subject

[prime lantern]

All the way to infinity that's a countable infinity

[flat magnet]

Numbers so big it’s unfathomable?

[gusty pebble]

Yea i was wrong on that

[prime lantern]

Aleph 1 that's 1 1.000...1 1.0000...2 so on and so forth to infinity

The set of all real numbers

[junior vine]

I honestly wonder if Tuvul was pissed that the Zariman failed. It was one of his war ships

[prime lantern]

That's uncountablly infinite

[nocturne kiln]

yet not quite infinity. Like a Google is a one with a thousand zeros behind it. a Googplex is a one with a google of zeros behind it

[prime lantern]

I've said alot pick one thing I'll show you my proof

[flat magnet]

Ty first time heard that term before

[nova harness]

It wasn’t a war ship it had no dangerous guns or anything

[gusty pebble]

Hes got no metaphysical form

[nocturne kiln]

You thought Google made it's name up?

[junior vine]

War ships don't have to have guns?

[prime lantern]

I ain't said that

[junior vine]

They can be used for supplies and still be called war ships

[prime lantern]

That's not an aleph

[nova harness]

It was a colony ship made before there was even an old war

[prime lantern]

Alephs denotes sets of numbers upto infinity

[gusty pebble]

Mb

His form is the 4handed wall man

His face cannit be seen

[nocturne kiln]

ah, its a set, not just a specific clasification

[flat magnet]

Why are you so sure that it isn’t just a projection?

[gusty pebble]

Y would he do 2 projections

He was siting on top

2 he has sustained injury the fingers

[prime lantern]

I mean it is a specific classification of the set generally you'll never need to use alephs ever

Most fictions don't ever mention them because trying to explain why some infinities are countable is a bit hard to do in an entertaining fashion

[gusty pebble]

3rd this is what was described by the first person to ever see wally in the game

[junior vine]

So its clearly not his actual form if Natah has seen his face

[gusty pebble]

His face is mutilated in this form

[junior vine]

Also, she says "I too have seen the walls other side"

[prime lantern]

But I want to go back to my show so I'll post this and leave ping if you have questions I'll get back to you in a bit

[gusty pebble]

Yea ig

[prime lantern]

What is
The man in the wall

The man in the wall other times referred to as the indifference is an eldritch being of unknown origins

The man in the wall was first encountered by albretch entrati, the man who first entered the void it was this encounter that changed wally from a shapeless Nothing to a shaped something by ripping a shape out of albretchs memories

After this encounter the man in the wall became real however he vanished for a while as albretch notes nobody had seen him after he entered

The man in the wall reappeared to the zariman a ship crashed in the void and drove nearly all the adults aboard insane making them attack the children

The children were forced to barricade themselves into classrooms where to one child the man in the wall offered a deal "I can save them all of them you just have to really want it" taking this deal birthed the tenno human children armed with para human abilities

Sometime later albretch entrati sent animals into the void eventually creating the cavia

From these animals (specifically bird 3) we learn what may be the man in the walls end goal

To be able to create/steal a physical form and free himself from needing other physical beings to think of things for him to be able to create them as he seems to be incapable of creating unique thoughts

Instead he merges together the thoughts of other beings to create an attempt at his end goals

Made with the help of bau

[nocturne kiln]

its as much a projection as when we see him/them sitting on the throne at the end of Whispers

[gusty pebble]

This is like the idea of originality and something will never be original

[nocturne kiln]

"After this encounter the man in the wall became real however he vanished for a while as albretch notes nobody had seen him after he entered"

Or didnt vanish... Albrecht mentions in his notes that he fears most of all that he is actually the man in the wall, just believing himself to be Albrecht Entrati when he is not.

[gusty pebble]

Yea

[fierce summit]

Very funny that Albrecht intended the Cavia to give the Man in the Wall a lobotomy and it just hit him with the Uno Reverse Card.

[nocturne kiln]

ultimately, the human experience is built upon derivitives, right down to the language you may use to express it.

[flat magnet]

Why would he have his “real” form and his projection on top of himself?

[nocturne kiln]

because he can

and to toy with you, letting you have a clue to who he is

in case you werent paying attention with the missing finger thing

Nothing quite as dissatisfying as mocking someone and them being too stupid to realise it. You dont even get to lord it over them

[flat magnet]

Yes the finger thing was noticeable

[nocturne kiln]

some people didnt notice

[flat magnet]

Straighten in this out for me because you replied to something I said earlier making it sound like the wall could also be a projection but now you’re saying it’s not?

[junior vine]

He didn't need a Lobotomy he doesn't show true emotion

[nova harness]

Albrecht still tried it

[fierce summit]

I meant lobotomy in the vernacular sense as a stand-in for making Wally dumber.

The point of the Cavia was to try and revert Wally to animal level intelligence since Albrecht thought it was only smart because he was smart

[nocturne kiln]

whatever you have seen of the man in the wall is not him because he isn't real, or at least not real as we know real to be. He's not of this reality. Anything you have seen is him taking information from our minds and allowing us to percieve him in a certain way

[junior vine]

Ik

[prime lantern]

Albretch entrati in real space is very much not wally

[gusty pebble]

What wally reflects is the shadow

[nocturne kiln]

He cant be sure

[prime lantern]

He can't I can

[flat magnet]

That’s kinda my point? So I don’t know why they’re so convinced that Vitruvian man is his true form

[prime lantern]

This is baus specialty

[gusty pebble]

Like his finger has real sense of touch and physical

[nocturne kiln]

While countless others have ventured into the Void, none have ever met this "man trapped in the wall" that Albrecht first saw. Pondering about its absence, Albrecht decided to not partake in Continuity ever again – the ritual where Kuva is used to transfer consciousness from body to body, effectively granting immortality – fearing that maybe the one who escaped was not him, but perhaps the other.

[gusty pebble]

His reflection of us isnt physical

Like in the handshake seen he uses lotus' hand to shake

In the child form

Since it has physical proof the 4 armed guy is the actual physical form of wally

And albrechr and all living so many eons would make their unconscious world pretty nasty and deep

[prime lantern]

Yea albretch is paranoid had it actually been wally the following events make no sense

Why would wally try and escape wally

[gusty pebble]

Like what could an immortals true fear be

[prime lantern]

Why would wally be working to stop wally

[nocturne kiln]

he doesnt have a physical form. or if he does, its one he's created and is no more as part of his inteligence as you are controled by... your finger

[prime lantern]

Orokins immortality isn't perfect

[gusty pebble]

What is this sentence

[prime lantern]

They can still die rather easily

[nocturne kiln]

Something to fear forever: nonexistence

[gusty pebble]

Yea but the longevity is still the point

[prime lantern]

Cut one in half and they don't get back up

[gusty pebble]

Yep

[prime lantern]

Rip out there throat and they stay on the ground

[gusty pebble]

Bruv immortal aint the point the anguish of mind in the longevity

[nocturne kiln]

Okay, is your finger something that decides how the rest of your body moves? Could you live without your finger? Thats what a physical form is to Wally

[gusty pebble]

Im saying like the finger proves that his four armed form is the true form

[gusty pebble]

Dude had a happy ending

😂

[nocturne kiln]

He is a formless being expressing himself as sensory perception and matter

[valid jolt]

I thought of it has Wally mocking us

[gusty pebble]

I dont think so

Like most people have seen him in that form that they started calling him man in the wall

In void or behind the scenes*

[prime lantern]

Albrecht called him that

[gusty pebble]

Yea

[prime lantern]

Albrecht saw him as Albrecht

[gusty pebble]

We also seen that

[fierce summit]

We see him as us (the operators)

[gusty pebble]

We dont interact physically

As in the child or reflective form

[nocturne kiln]

Albrecht sees him as Albrecht. Rell saw him as... shadow. Rell was autistic.

[valid jolt]

Also, that 4 arm form is literally based on a da Vinci painting lol. No way that’s his final form. It makes more sense that he’s just messing with us since we call him “The Man in the Wall”

[gusty pebble]

Rell was neglected

[fierce summit]

He has no definitive form because he's a void god. He can appear as any concept we have fed him.

[gusty pebble]

Like jade being archangel is bs if u say like that

[gusty pebble]

Its like u r describing god at this point

[nocturne kiln]

The Vitruvian Man

[valid jolt]

Yea

Wallys just formless for now

[gusty pebble]

Davinci painting dont have a faceless and its not embeded inside a wall but ok whatever dude

[fierce summit]

I mean yes. That's the point. Eldritch horrors are supposed to exist beyond our comprehension as mortals.

[nocturne kiln]

He's only formed when he wants to be

[gusty pebble]

Ok dude whatever

[nocturne kiln]

Thats actually the point. the fear of the unknown manifested

Dont try to understand them because to attempt to do so would be your undoing

the litterall form of "I am high and cant handle this right now!"

...actually being high might help...

[fierce summit]

Delicious Lovecraft flavors. At least until everyone started conceptualizing Chthulu as a giant squid man

[gusty pebble]

My take is he is either a child that is a reflection of the dark unconscious world sort of like an ai trained with trash data

Or he is a persons darkest side

[nocturne kiln]

He is childlike in the fact that he does not care about the destruction of our reality as he toys with it in order to understand it

[gusty pebble]

I think thats all connected to our trauma and suppressed memories if 10-0

[flat magnet]

You think the adults tried to understand him hence the insanity

[gusty pebble]

Like here i think domeone transferred into lotus

[nocturne kiln]

no, the adults were torn asunder by reality being exposed to non reality

[gusty pebble]

And our eyes are black here

[nocturne kiln]

yes. that person was Natah.