spoiler-chat

[copper osprey]

Does anyone know anything about the symbols that spawn inside alad vs secret amalgam labs?

And if they might relate somehow to nira

[zenith jacinth]

The labs are much older than the archons update-wise

[copper osprey]

Oh yea I know, I've been playing over seven years and I remember the jovian Concord

Gas city update for the corpus tile set update

Lol trust me this is a multi year confusing line of breadcrumbs. I have a ton of evidence and a ton of different people trying to find the answer too.

[zenith jacinth]

Pretty sure the symbols don't mean anything

[copper osprey]

even if theyre just markers for DE to use as tileset labels

they are not consistent with that labeling system, literally everywhere in every faction in the corresponding faction language, "hangar bay this, laboratory that"

for example;

[simple moss]

You're probably reading way too into it. Sometimes a little triangle is just a little triangle.

[copper osprey]

these all look like "corpus font" versions of the greek alphabet, leading backwards from Omega and stopping before Tau

[wild wind]

shrug

As far as I'm aware The New War was changed enough from its original concept that any foreshadowing that was set up that long ago no longer actually foreshadows anything in the game

[copper osprey]

the labs and symbols have guaranteed spawns in the current Nira archon hunt

as well as the weird amalgam/sentient boss/nechramech that shows up on the gas city tileset too

[wild wind]

Yeah, the Narmer tileset variant

[copper osprey]

thats exactly whats got me caught up. the archons are literally amalgams, theyre sentient tech heads on corpse bodies. the only difference between Pazuuls archons and Alads amalgams are the shards.

[wild wind]

Well, that and the raw materials.

[copper osprey]

which is what alad as constantly escalated to source, first hes after warframes, then technocyte, then tau tech

[wild wind]

The amalgams are a way of getting around the sentient's inability to reproduce. Their forces in the Origin system are incredibly limited and without the ability to replenish.

The archons were something quite different

[copper osprey]

currently i think the scrapped idea is present in the form of the philanthropist. maybe alad was going to pilot the sentient nechramech and that got scrapped

[wild wind]

The philanthropist was a mimic

[copper osprey]

thats exactly why i think the archons and the labs are related somehow

[wild wind]

Possibly even Natah-Lotus, lol

[copper osprey]

no the philanthropist from the styanax anime

[wild wind]

Oh, him? Definitely not.

[copper osprey]

not the dealer that gave alad tau tech

you dont think that the whole styanax anime was supposed to be alad v piloting the sentient nechramech we see on jupiter

[wild wind]

Nope.

[copper osprey]

the "scrapped idea"

[wild wind]

Honestly, no I don't think so.

Warframe has a ton of throwaway villains in side media that aren't connected to the main game in any way.

Half the named characters in the Leverian for example; Tuvul is the only one there who had a role in the story.

[copper osprey]

thats not what im insinuating,

[wild wind]

No I understand exactly what you're saying.

I just think that what we're seeing is an outgrowth of the OTHER pattern for one-off villains.

The philanthropist is most like the Grineer overseer from the Yareli comic

[copper osprey]

alright, that still leaves my original issue though

i just saw parallels between the story of alad and this weird nechramech boss and the styanax anime, though thats its own tangent.

the secret labs on jupiter do have some method of interaction or meaning beyond the tileset labels

[wild wind]

The necramech-like thing is almost more likely to be a boss fight/third necramech type

[wild wind]

Because we actually haven't had any indication that Alad V is still on Jupiter post-New War

Given that he tried to sell out to the Sentients I'd be shocked if he was involved with that particular Sentient build at all

[copper osprey]

i guess thats true, but we also have no info that he was killed or veiled

[wild wind]

precisely

If he were veiled he'd be MORE likely to be on Jupiter building more abominations against the void

[copper osprey]

how many people have gotten the doors to open tho

[wild wind]

Since the necramech things are there during the Drifter's New War Archon Hunt

[copper osprey]

then its pazuul making the nechramech

[wild wind]

Would have been Erra then. Or Nira herself.

[copper osprey]

or nira?

all of the amalgam labs spawn in her fight

thats literally why i think theyre connected

[wild wind]

I didn't run Nira during my NW playthrough

[copper osprey]

and the symbols inside the labs react to our operator void walk

no the archon hunt right now

[wild wind]

But I believe the lab tiles spawn during the quest

[copper osprey]

they did spawn during the quest

whats weird is that they ALL spawn during her archon hunt

[wild wind]

Yeah, that's a point against Alad having anything to do with this.

[copper osprey]

thats not what i care about either lol

[wild wind]

I can't speak to the door-thing, but given that it's Warframe?

I'd guess it's a bug.

[copper osprey]

i just want to know why there are steps to reveal the symbols on the doors, repeatable steps, and not every symbol spawns in every lab, yet they all do in niras hunt, because all the labs spawn,

ive been thinking they relate to either alad or the sentients

recently the archon hunt for nira spawns all of the rooms? i cant be crazy....

[wild wind]

iirc Rebecca ackownledged pre-NW that people were mistaking the Natah message overrides for bugs because they had a reputation for it

[copper osprey]

thats why im convinced this leads somewhere

[wild wind]

Because every other time something like that happened it was a bug

[copper osprey]

lol! trust me i know i played with stamina

[wicked iron]

That's why I think the glowing orb in our Personal Quarters isn't a bug. 🙂

[wild wind]

If there was an equivalent on the other tiles I'd say something was up. For now I'm not intrigued. Just bugframe being bugframe.

[wild wind]

That though I believe 100%. That's where we'll trigger Duviri, given the precedent.

[copper osprey]

i think there are way too many steps you have to do right for them to appear, and why would a bug contain something as intentional as a letter in an alphabet used no where else in the game

my instinct tells me that they probably are tile labels

[wild wind]

At the risk of being too dismissive, that's kinda how bugs actually work

[copper osprey]

its just too many steps to get them to even show up, and if you follow all the steps properly the door even "opens"

[wild wind]

A non-standard set of actions leads to a trigger from other variables getting crossed

It's possible that Nira's tileset was originally planned to be puzzle-based and you've reverse engineered the steps to proceed

It's also possible that it's leftover work for unimplemented game modes, or a weird convergence of spaghetti code

Like, I'm not trying to completely dismiss your discovery, but it's possible that there's no "there" there.

[copper osprey]

now if you told me that the four symbols, greek letters leading backwards towards the greek letter Tau, were part of a cypher to unlock in Niras portion of the quest, that would be far far far better than where im left lol

[wild wind]

yah that'd make sense

[copper osprey]

ive been seeing these things for years and its only more intriguing with the archon hunt with Nira includes ALL of the labs

[wild wind]

People already complain about stealth missions in TNW, imagine if they had to backtrack lol

[copper osprey]

its obviously intended in one way or another to be an interaction

im just kind of going insane i guess.

[wild wind]

Why is there no Warframe conspiracy whiteboard lol

[copper osprey]

we find the vetruvian symbols, we find the temestarii symbols, we had to find the pass codes on the walls in kahls missions

just to open the cache

this game has many many different examples of this

i know im not insane lol

[wild wind]

why do we never see what's inside the cache ;_;

[copper osprey]

cause when you finally open the doors with symbols theres nothing

and the doors dont really open just change color

[wild wind]

That's why I don't think there's anything to it. If there was meant to be something there, there'd... be something there.

Maybe that's where they planned to stash the partnership fragments originally.

[copper osprey]

heres what gets me

4 symbols, 4 archons

[wild wind]

Five, technically.

[copper osprey]

the greek letters for the sybols are the last 4, and missing tau

[wild wind]

Caliban.

[copper osprey]

caliban is an archon?

since when, his lore is hes fully sentient

[wild wind]

Not per-se, but same DNA.

[graceful zodiac]

Caliban is what the Archons were meant to be

[wild wind]

He was meant to be a Warframe that was a Sentient.

Same... design philosophy, I guess. the MacBook Air to the Archon's iPad

[copper osprey]

lol

thats not the same thing though, the imagery described is almost that the archons arent the head, or the body, but the shard

and even the word archon is angelic orgin

[wild wind]

Okay, so: "A shard of what", exactly?

A shard of an Archon. So what are the Archons?

The super Sentients that ran Tau, if we go by Lotus's explanations in the Hunt dialogue.

[copper osprey]

well the word implies these to be along the lines of the actual archons in angelic terms, singing creation into reality at the outermost edges of "gods empyrean" according to dante's pardisio

[wild wind]

The archons that we know are Pazuul's attempt to make something of the eidolon state.

[copper osprey]

however the names are mesopotamian, babylonian, and sumerian

which is similar to narmer unifying the three kingdoms of egypt or life in the sol system

[wild wind]

And Hunhow quotes the Popol Vuh alllll the way back in The New Strange

[copper osprey]

steve also has his weird thing with platos perfect city, or theory of the metals

i think the symbology is legitimate in regards to these symbols being in greek

[wild wind]

Like I said, I don't think there's a there, there.

If there was supposed to be, something would be behind the doors.

[copper osprey]

gah but this will kill me if they add something behind them

[wild wind]

Have you posted on the forum?

[copper osprey]

if they add anything to this in the future it will rip my brain apart lol

i have lol

[wild wind]

It's possible that somewhere there's an explanation about where it's from.

[copper osprey]

and reddit, and twitter, and discord,

trust me lol, ive been digging. this used to just be "oh thats weird and interesting" didnt even care about it, till my friend who never wanted to play warframe till crossplay came out, he noticed them alongside the weird ephemera like visual effect you get when an amalgam tries to clone you. from there all this was dug back up and its driving me crazy.

lol also you were right

[wild wind]

Well, try to avoid going completely off the deep end.

[copper osprey]

i didnt remmeber my greek alphabet

there are 5 symbols before tau

[wild wind]

yep

[copper osprey]

lol ill even sign an NDA with DE to learn more about this if necessary

[wild wind]

Doesn't work like that lol

[copper osprey]

i literally do not care if i cant share any information they tell me i just need answers lol

[wild wind]

Honestly if you can manage it try to file the whole thing under "weird but cool" again and forget about it until they do something with it

Because right now it's just empty symbolism.

[copper osprey]

the pain that causes my curiosity is unacceptable lol

and yea im used to steve and empty symbolism lol

[wild wind]

that's why you gotta try

[copper osprey]

lol whats even worse is that ive participated in the ARG's as much as my intelligence could allow

and i think its the zariman ARG thats got me all fired up in regards to this

ill take your advice tho, lol

[wild wind]

oh man if they do announce a Narmer tileset ARG I'll be there

with your notes in hand

[copper osprey]

please no lol

thanks lol thanks so much for the emotional support

[wild wind]

Actually speaking of I'm still kinda upset that we didn't get a Praghasa+sun planet to farm Caliban

Narmer bounties are so much less fun hahahaha

[copper osprey]

would be a wild tileset

[wild wind]

Crossing fingers!

Especially given what Pazuul implies about Praghasa making him an archon

[copper osprey]

im fairly certain by the way that Praghasa is a double meaning name, its feels like a crossover with a hindu diety and Tiamat mother of monsters in sumeria

im a history major and all the historical references in this game really keep me going

[wild wind]

All Sentients function like mythological Tiamat tho'

Well actually they're closest to Japanese gods, in that they break apart parts of themselves to make more gods

Looking at you, Izanagi, Susano-o and Ameterasu

[copper osprey]

"lords of tau"

[wild wind]

They sure act like it!

yah the whole bit about the Lords of Tau is really interesting.

[copper osprey]

no one can convince me that the Aricebo message from the Zariman ARG is not the soulframe solar system

[wild wind]

lmao

Going to laugh hard if the Man in the Wall shows up in fantasy Canada too

[copper osprey]

nah dude my roomate was trying to use screencaps comparing nude dude in soulframe trailer to hayden tenno from pre-founders pack E3

cause steve only has one main character and hes sure of it.

[wild wind]

pffft

Hayden Drifter was an accident.

But that's more evidence that he's Steve's SI, not less.

Which reminds me facial hair when DE.

The one thing that can fix male Drifters.

[copper osprey]

I like to think that Ode'n watched the Orokin and Sentients show up and somehow wally sends us to help cause eternalism

didnt they literally bring up drifter facial hair last devstream

someone else brought that up somewhere

[glossy lagoon]

Yeh

[lament axle]

nah, that was just tattoos iirc

[glossy lagoon]

And now tattoos

[copper osprey]

oh yea tattoos

[glossy lagoon]

They bought up facial hair in tennocon tho

[copper osprey]

ah^

[glossy lagoon]

It might come before divuri paradox

[wild wind]

There was a devstream where it came up a while ago

Post-Tennocon I mean, I know it was there too

[copper osprey]

as long as i get the fu man chu from the moovember warframe auxilliary's

[wild wind]

pffffffft

I want a Riker

[copper osprey]

pai mei drifter when DE??!?

[wild wind]

yellow jumpsuit first

[graceful zodiac]

They weren't in charge, just significant members, like the Plains Sentient

[supple dagger]

what part of new war uses necramechs?

i see

i guess its time i watch the whole new war quest on youtube

[gloomy pelican]

No

[supple dagger]

why not

[gloomy pelican]

Bc u gotta experience it urself

[supple dagger]

fine i wont watch it all on youtube

maybe just the first 30 min

[bitter stag]

You guys think we will ever get the chance to go to the tau system?

That sucks

[simple moss]

Only if we can Riker sit. Everyone knows that's how you sit on a chair if you're that tall.

[wild wind]

bwahaha

[west plaza]

dont do this to urself brother

[wicked iron]

No memes in the server, please. 🙂

[rancid solar]

Okay I’ll remove it

[supple dagger]

it gets a lot of hate from bad players who can’t get past stealth sections, it’s pretty funny ngl

[ashen tree]

i found a pazul thing near the 3rd orb, its been circling it for a while, is that something that happens or new ?

[scarlet basalt]

I guess that it is supposed to show that naarmer took the 3rd orb ?
If they bring it to kahl's mission i'm going to cry...

[zenith jacinth]

Means nothing yet

[scarlet basalt]

i hope, but it's likely something naarmer i guess.

[glass mesa]

IIRC that was floating there before New War, it's the pazul tower thing that's new

[zenith jacinth]

Narmer*

[glass mesa]

I think it's before new war because I remember looking at it and going "...this doesn't look grineer, orokin, tenno or corpus..."

[zenith jacinth]

Yes, the little drone is the only new thing

[glass mesa]

Distinctly remember being confused at it.

[steady gate]

If I recall, someone first saw the Pazuul drone near orb 3 after Veilbreaker released

[ashen tree]

so its nothign to be excited about

[woeful jacinth]

That spider is such a mood. An entire war breaks out and she still decides to stay in her coolant bath

[zenith jacinth]

Or it's just dead

[woeful jacinth]

Nah, just lazy

[severe grail]

do we know anything about who the next prime frame is?

[lament axle]

the next ones in line are hildryn/wisp, we dunno if the order will be swapped, but it should be hildryn

[severe grail]

ok. im so hyped for Wisp Prime i want heeeerrr

[daring prairie]

quick question I wanted to post here since it's very spoiler-y:
is the Natah/Margulis/Lotus choice permanent in The New War? What does it change?

[severe grail]

u can change it after when u mean the look

[daring prairie]

oh, thank god. I was so afraid of buyer's remorse. Thanks

[daring prairie]

wait... I thought it was JUST the look? It also says that it's permanent

[wicked iron]

The name and personality are permanently chosen there, but the appearance can be changed.

[daring prairie]

huh... I guess Lotus it is then, the other choices make me feel like Ballas won at the end. Thanks again

[wicked iron]

Ballas never wins. He lost, no matter your choice. 🙂

What he wanted was a version of Margulis he could control, one totally subservient to him. He never gets that.

[daring prairie]

fair enough... Still feeling like Lotus is the choice tho... I don't even know why

[wicked iron]

Whatever choice you go with, they're all correct choices. Choose the one that feels right for you! 🙂

I chose Lotus as well, but none of the choices are a "wrong" or "bad" choice. 😄

[undone forge]

Natah is my friend, I think she's neat :)

[daring prairie]

she's friend-sized

[zenith jacinth]

Note: lotus is the one choosing who to be

[daring prairie]

I still regret not doing the final battle with Umbra so much... Brought Gauss since I thought the enemies would be a tad harder

[daring prairie]

which honestly feels like one more reason to go Lotus, but to each their own

[zenith jacinth]

No, it means that every choice is right

[cyan crest]

Wait a minute is the 3rd orb less submerged here in this pic?

[daring prairie]

I guess I should have added a "to me" there, mb

[cyan crest]

I like both the Natah and Margulis choices
In the natah version, i feel like she's realising the system needs someone who can be stronger than she had been as the lotus, and she embraces her okder self as a response (wait a sec she basically says this... ignore that lol), while in the Margulis choice, i feel like she does it less for the system and more so that the tenno can have the figure of their ideal loving mother once again
And given that she apparently has marge's memories in there, i think it's kinda sweet

I still went for Lotus tho

[zenith jacinth]

Adding: I don't mean that the lotus personality specifically is the one choosing, I just can't be bothered to type out all the names every time

[cyan crest]

Natargulotus

[zenith jacinth]

No

[cyan crest]

:(

You could be vague and just say "the Mother"

[zenith jacinth]

The mimic

[cyan crest]

That weird sentient lady that keeps calling me

[zenith jacinth]

Double double agent

[cyan crest]

The "Is the hat part of her head or not?" woman

[velvet wing]

I mean she takes it off at one point doesn’t she?

[kindred briar]

Lotus does, yes

[cyan crest]

No but like radiant lotus then grows one and natah has two separate thingies that look like it

[velvet wing]

Lotus and Natah are one in the same just at different points throughout her life right? Margulis is the only the one that she absolutely is not.

[fluid igloo]

If this didnt have -100 stat duration it would be alr

[velvet wing]

I kinda think about it in Sailor Moon terms, like she leveled up her power and her outfit gets shnazzier

[cyan crest]

But she can become her

[velvet wing]

Becoming her and mimicking her aren’t the same thing

[cyan crest]

I've had this discussion at least thrice before, I'm not going down it again

[velvet wing]

I’m sure there’s some dumb argument of “through eternalism all things are possible”

And not possible

[bold mango]

I personally chose Natah my self because that’s who she was revealed to be, personally. But I still understand she’s Lotus.

[velvet wing]

I chose Lotus because that’s who she chose to be, she did not want to return to her family and who she was before, she has found a new life and chooses to be the Lotus

[cyan crest]

Oh no it wasn't that dont worry lol

[bold mango]

Fair enough

[cyan crest]

And that's super neat, but given how she's the one making the choice, an argument can be made for her choosing any of the 3 really
In any case, it's a player choice and it's meant for us to pick whoever we see her becoming after new war imo

[bold mango]

You can still change her but her name remains it’s just the skin I think? Right?

[cyan crest]

Her personality (should) also be permanent, each name has different dialoge in Angels of the Zariman

[velvet wing]

I mean at this point I’ve chosen lotus amaga because it’s the fanciest mommy ™️

[cyan crest]

I say should because we only have aotz to know it

[bold mango]

I just really liked Natahs design my self so I chose it along with other things

[cyan crest]

Yeah but her name and personality are still lotus :p
I really wish it wasnt permanent tho i want natah

I made a mistake in my choice

[magic girder]

Duviri paradox teaser??

[steady gate]

yes.

You’re about a year late on noticing that however

[signal dagger]

is there a way to make plains of eidolon/orb vallis look normal again after new war

i absolutely love plains of eidolon and its extremely painful to see it all just brown and boring

is there any plans on making it an option?

[simple moss]

I'm pretty certain no, but none of us are DE employees.

[molten oxide]

World building and consequences from the story

But if you join a friend with them as the host and they haven't done new war it'll be the regular fortuna and cetus

[signal dagger]

was there any warning before starting the quest that open world areas would be permanently changed? if there was anything to say that they would be changed I wouldn't have done the quest, or im just blind and somehow didnt see the warnings

[simple moss]

The plains didn't really change much. Just dead sentient stuff.

[signal dagger]

yeah and its all brown :(

its just disappointing cause I really liked just running around the plans, now theres all kinds of stuff littering the plains and its all brown and sad, and I feel there was no obvious warning of it

[molten oxide]

Wars are causes for large changes in warframe's universe, so the new war was going to have lasting effects along with it.

[signal dagger]

yes but why not have an aesthetic option as well as the mainstream world

[supple dagger]

youd think they would rebuild.

[molten oxide]

They are where they can, but the war has lasting effects.

[signal dagger]

I dont think there cant be an option to have regular looking things simply for the sake of story

[molten oxide]

As for having an option to switch between looks, it's not that simple. As it's entirely different servers/worlds so you can't exactly swap them on the fly like a small thing like having the orbiter in space or the camp.

[signal dagger]

i more envision it as something you choose when you click on the node, similar to when you enter a relay and you can choose between calm and busy and such and you then enter into different servers of the same place (i assume thats how it works)

the servers of regular cetus are still there, why am I not able to access them myself without someone else with me

[woeful jacinth]

Yea you can use exalted weapons against archons

[wild wind]

Play with pre-TNW players hosting

[zenith jacinth]

Nice

[molten oxide]

Reached old mate with SU and.....that was something

[zenith jacinth]

Now do some bounties and unlock the fun gun for frames

[molten oxide]

Ye

[zenith jacinth]

[molten oxide]

And I can out it on two of my arch guns, because I bought one with Plat a long while ago

[zenith jacinth]

Plat-bought guns have the thing needed to use them with frames pre-installed iirc

[molten oxide]

No no

I bought the grav thing

[zenith jacinth]

Oh

Either way, if you have mausolon, you'll be fine

[molten oxide]

And I do

Will probably save a 3rd for if I ever get a kuva grattler

[molten oxide]

And beat the profit taker, but because of my teammates that evacuated too soon didn't complete the bounty.

[fluid igloo]

Used her once, didnt like, bye mirage!

[simple moss]

She's a fantastic warframe if you take the time to understand how she works.

[hexed ember]

scales forever

[supple dagger]

Rip Mirage

[elfin ivy]

What's to understand dark damage reduction light damage boost everything else go brrr

[simple moss]

Some people don't read skill descriptions, I didn't say she was a deep frame.

[wild wind]

I mean, if you're early in the game and don't have the weapons/mods/arcanes etc to turn Mirage into the chaos agent we all know and love I completely understand preferring her walled up.

[gaunt lark]

Best weps and interactions
How to mod properly

The way u mod certain frames may vary from the usual standard

[fluid igloo]

I just wasn't a big fan of her play style, I prefer room clearing frames like Xaku

[broken ferry]

But she can nuke...

[twilit geode]

Mirage has like 2 and a half different ways of room clearing but okay.

[cold swift]

Finally got my helmlith but damn it takes a lot of rss

[signal horizon]

Mirage is arguably one of the best room clearing frames out there

[zenith jacinth]

I can confirm that, as I have accidentally found that out about 2 hours ago

[simple moss]

I mean, yes, Xaku is stupidly powerful (second most played frame on my account, so 100% a fan), but Mirage can do similar things. She's more of a weapon platform than Xaku is though. A well-modded weapon on Mirage will slice through anything.

[zenith jacinth]

Her 4 also will

[fluid igloo]

Why he lookin at me like that

[hexed ember]

mirage's deluxe is also beautiful

[torpid lantern]

Ooof, someone get this boi to a chiropractor

[vital pewter]

In the new war hunhow scene when op says “not if you help me” did anybody else hear the vine boom sound when the stalker turned its head

[zenith jacinth]

Drifter, not op

[vital pewter]

Drifter is just alternate universe op aren’t they

[zenith jacinth]

Still a different enough person

[lament axle]

if you count their development, op didn't go through a death loop for countless days
neither did the drifter lose his mother, their other mother, and then their sentient mother

however, there's also the fact that Ordis didn't try to explode the drifter if you choose him, as opposed to what happened in TWW

[zenith jacinth]

Drifter probably still lost their mother, and ordis exploding the ship was just a dream

[molten oxide]

death loop for the operator?

[lament axle]

yeah, the biological one probably is

[hexed ember]

death loop for drifter, ie duviri

[frail nymph]

Indeed but also the universe is beyond just alternate at this point.

If Drifter wasn't unique in being the one that "didn't get rescued," the Sentients probably won in their universe, for example.

[whole prawn]

Who was featured in prime time?

[whole prawn]

Any news on new primes i mean

Pfffft me and my friends crave for the new prime to come

[zenith jacinth]

Probably wisp

[inner fox]

;-;

[signal horizon]

Next prime is suppose to be Hildryn

[simple moss]

Yee

[cold swift]

I don’t think I will ever financially recover from the Helmlith

[zenith jacinth]

You can mostly use rj resources, which you get a ton of from the missions

[sharp matrix]

I think I'm in the final phase of the new war and how do i fight the lotus here? Like she's shooting me with the laser beams and knocking me out of my warframe

I can't seem to figure out what to exactly do

[steady gate]

redirect the laser

when you’re out of the frame*

[bold mango]

Redirect the lasers into the like, circle like portals when out of frame. Careful though, suns heat is atrocious.

[sharp matrix]

Oh ok

[frail nymph]

Yeah in general just assume that if the game instantly unconditionally kicks you out of the frame/frame damage isn't working and enemy health looks grey etc, then you're not supposed to use the frame there.

Cause it's gonna happen later too probably.

[weary laurel]

Hola

[molten oxide]

I have to say, exploring the zariman alone and looking at all the small details is cool and chilling

In the park with the orokin statue platform above the glass enclosure that was turned into a living spot, there is a tree near one of the exits with a mask hung off a branch of a tree

[obtuse gyro]

iirc that one at one point could only be seen in operator mode

[molten oxide]

That's spooky, like with Teshin's swords in the dormazone?

[obtuse gyro]

yea, but now idk if they need op now

[molten oxide]

Still op

[frail nymph]

It's Drifter only too not just op

And so at least that part of the timeline is clear, Drifter in AoZ is definitely post Duviri

I guess the paradox could be that Drifter's Duviri experience is pre NW while Operator's Duviri experience is post NW

[molten oxide]

Could be

[frail nymph]

I mean that was always kinda obvious but just more evidence

[molten oxide]

But I just want to give massive props to the level designers at DE, for both the big and small details on board the zariman and elsewhere

[white thistle]

Yeah there's Certainly an amazing work went on it!

Also the easter eggs for pre-duviri i loved it, Orowyrm in mirror/voidstorms, Teshin's swords, the mask

[subtle garden]

@vast pike
As I was saying the archon hunt are very annoying on drifter, the worst by far is the flying one that shoot electricity, it's not funny dodging my shoot 5 time in a row by spamming tp

And if you are not a fan or used to stealth i can see why the corpus factory was a bad moment for some people

[vast pike]

fair

but nira isn't that bad

(or maybe I've played too much dmc)

[subtle garden]

It's just very very tedious, and she is the archon with the most AOE, i play Monster hunter so I'm used to these kind of boss, the problem is that she doesn't really have a pattern sooooo

She is just frustrating

[vast pike]

wdym? as long as you read her signs. you can survive

[subtle garden]

I didnt die, it was just a very long and annoying fight

But most of TNW isnt that hard

Unless you absolutely detest railjack

[flat shadow]

I found a few specific areas difficult. Most weren't really difficult, just tedious.

[subtle garden]

The corpus guy, veso, could be weird for some people if they don't get how the drone works on the last boss, but it was shown via the level design so it would be the players fault

[wary cave]

Why was umbra “umbra” instead of a prime?

Oh cause there already excal prime?

Ohhhh ok

[warped mist]

Hey before i start with the new war should i improve my railjack and necramech first ?

Or is it doable without improving them

Oh ok then i better improve them

[real niche]

Upgrade RJ a bit, Mech can be out of the box

[molten oxide]

Another small detail thing is in one of the random rooms, there is a picture of Ballas leaning against a wall or table with knives in it

[zenith jacinth]

In the eyes, specifically

[fluid igloo]

I feel a bit dumb asking this but is this the Lotus in the opening cinamatic?

if not who is it because im confused

it doesnt LOOK like margulis

[real niche]

No.

[fluid igloo]

is it just a random character

I just dont recognise them lol

[balmy badger]

It's just a random character that has no significance outside of that.

Presumably another Tenno.

[lament axle]

she is supposed to be the "main" tenno iirc

[real niche]

Can't be us because we're still stuck in the gamer chairs on the moon

[lament axle]

oh well, according to DE she is the main one
she is just used for the trailers cinematics but don't have a role ingame so there's not much info about her

her name is Mara and she is a tenno, that's all i know for sure

[kindred briar]

she's their placeholder postergirl DE uses for the Tenno

[jagged granite]

wait i thought all tenno were on lua? how can she be awake if we’re all still in the void

[obtuse gyro]

Shes not

Her role in the opening cinematic is to hint towards TSD

Mara vanishes into thin air when the grineer arrive at the frames

[jagged granite]

so was it just like a representation of transference starting back up? like she wasn’t actually there it was just her void juice finding the frames?

forgive me if im misunderstanding

[zenith jacinth]

It's representing basically nothing

[lament axle]

yeah, that's what i thought

[frail nymph]

We know most were on Lua but we don't know what happened before we were awoken. There could be a couple Tenno who came before us and had to have their powers unlocked, who knows.

[jagged granite]

im just gonna assume that it hasn’t been confirmed yet since im getting a bunch of mixed answers lol

but thank u!

how would they still be alive thousand(s) of years later

if they never went into stasis^^

[obtuse gyro]

Rells the only one we know of

The rest were in the Dream

Theres like, not much indication that anyone got out before us

Mara's case she vanishes upon the line saying dream, indicating that she too is in the Dream

[distant tusk]

How do I change my operator/drifters gender? Was it an earlier option that I don’t remember or what?

Bruh I’m dumb

Thanks

[graceful zodiac]

The Tenno from the trailer is purely just a nod to the existence of the Operator. The character itself doesn't exist for any purpose beyond marketing and in-house consistently

[torpid lantern]

So far. DE has expressed that Mara is the main character but since we play as the main character and they made it rpg, it kinda puts poor Mara in bind. I'm not so quick to write her out of the story completely though because Duviri is pulling all sorts of weirdness. Do I think she'll show up in it? No. But do I think that DE can add random mechanics to make her relevant at some point in the game's future? Yep

[wild wind]

If Mara shows up she'll automatically not be the main Tenno, by dint of not being us.

That also doesn't fly with Hayden Drifter existing at all.

The best way to think of it is that Mara is the player Tenno when DE is the player. Thus the figure in the opening isn't her.

Mara was the name of the Tenno DE used when they were showing off The War Within

[graceful zodiac]

Specifically, Mara is the name DE uses for the operator when writing scripts and the like. That's the extent of her existence for our purposes

[glass mesa]

Yeah, that's how I read her-the "We need a face for X" character.

[frail nymph]

Because using transference from a pod seems to have the same effects as stasis

[frail nymph]

The rest were in the Long Dream though.

The Dream itself hasn't been used since transference was invented. After that it was Second Dream and the the Long Dream.

Narratively, it makes sense for Lotus to send a Tenno to wake up other Tenno. All three wake up by the end of the cinematic.

[distant tusk]

Was the drifter in the duviri paradox gameplay reveal thing a new drifter or was he Rebecca’s?

[frail nymph]

What do you mean by new?

[distant tusk]

Was he an entirely different character or was he the players customized drifter?

[frail nymph]

Player customized drifter

[distant tusk]

Ok

[frail nymph]

Since your drifter ingame has Teshin's swords

[distant tusk]

THEN DE NEEDS TO MAKE OPERATOR CUSTOMIZATION AVAILABLE FOR DRIFTERS

[real niche]

They've said they're doing it "soon"

[frail nymph]

It is available...

[distant tusk]

Before duviri releases hopefully

[frail nymph]

Drifters are more customizable than operators

[real niche]

That's not what he asked for.

[distant tusk]

No the Dax armor you can get from teshin is only operator

[frail nymph]

Oh you mean operator skins

That'll happen eventually

It's as much effort as making new skins, right now

[obtuse gyro]

When I said Dream I meant the Long Dream.

Like I've said Mara disappears upon the mention of dream, which to me seems like a tongue in cheek reference to the sleepy babies back on Lua. No idea how or why DE had a projection of their flagship MC which is supposed to be where we are at in the story out on Earth but hey, at least Mara aint mara sov

[frail nymph]

But it could also be a tongue and cheek reference to the second dream. The second dream is the reason why Tenno are called Dreamers.

Also maybe Mara did wake us up, but given that only you wake up in the gameplay unlike when Mara woke up three frames, it's likely not supposed to be the exact same continuity, so I'm not sure about the problem with Mara being in the cinematic.

[obtuse gyro]

Thats what Im saying

[frail nymph]

The Second Dream is not the sleepy babies on Lua though

The Second Dream is Lua Pod/Orbiter Pod style transference

In which case Mara would have been woken up before the other 3 of the cinematic

[obtuse gyro]

Those are the sleepy babies

Until we dropped out like a newborn cow we were all sleepy babies in the pod

[frail nymph]

Only long dream causes "sleepiness..." and the effects persisted after it ending but only till the second dream also ended.

Post TSD quest, until TWW, we still use The Second Dream.

If TSD itself was about sleepy babies, it wouldn't feel like waking up, but it does feel like that.

[shut mica]

did DE mention any plans to adapt operator clothes for drifter? There is a lot of customization for the operator but drifter has maybe 5 suits available

[real niche]

"soon"

[distant tusk]

Yeah we were talking about that earlier

[lament axle]

probably coming with duviri ig, or maybe earlier

[distant tusk]

Hopefully earlier

I need to drip out my drifter before duviri

[opaque bear]

Soon could be 3 years knowing de

[real niche]

Congrats, you understand Warframe

[marsh wave]

Cedo worth keeping right? was told this I think I think whoever said it said yes? just confirming again.

[woeful jacinth]

Definitely worth keeping

[marsh wave]

Alright what about Zymos and Keratinos?

[woeful jacinth]

Those weapons I haven't used so I wouldn't know how good they are

[marsh wave]

alright.

Once again I'm a dumb dumb... I thought this was #gameplay-discussion its #spoiler-chat ....

[frigid edge]

zymos is good and keratinos is ok i think

[marsh wave]

Might still be fodder for me..

[simple moss]

Keratinos are pretty good for claws.

[cosmic rose]

I can't find any railgun moas for sands of inaros, any suggestions?

[steady gate]

Europa has a good amount of them

[signal horizon]

Can also look it up on the wiki and it’ll tell you the best missions to find them

[sharp cairn]

When the next warframe out

[subtle garden]

We will have citrine come out this month, mid or end of month most likely from what was announced on last Dev stream

[past idol]

New Prime too ?

[subtle garden]

New prime has not been announced yet

[past idol]

Ok

I Hope this will be Wisp prime

My ❤️

[subtle garden]

Most people would tell you it will be either wisp or hildryn

[past idol]

Nice

[subtle garden]

My money is on hildryn, wisp will be after

[zenith jacinth]

My money is on neither because I'm broke

[subtle garden]

This is where I insert a "brokie" joke

[velvet wing]

I think it will be Wisp, the next prime should be releasing around the anniversary and last year they gave Wisp Dex skin so they’ll be bringing it back this year and I think it would just make sense

[simple moss]

It should be Hildryn given the release order.

[craggy solstice]

If timetables are correct, it's gonna be hildryn.

[zenith jacinth]

Haven't some recent primes already been getting released slightly out of order?

[simple moss]

Nope. That hasn't happened in years.

That's not to say it hasn't, because it has.

[zenith jacinth]

I think nidus was out of release order

[simple moss]

Which isn't recent because time has been messing with us really badly. XP

[velvet wing]

Khora Prime was supposed to release before Garuda but they got swapped

[near rune]

probably so Khora Prime could coincide with TennoCon to drive up sales

The two warframes within the gender pair (MMFF) are always subject to switching if it would be more profitable, since winter 2016.

[velvet wing]

Just pointing out that yes they have within the past year swapped the order of prime releases so it is possible it could be Wisp instead of Hildryn

If we consider profit driven incentives releasing Wisp Prime makes sense because they’ll be giving everyone a free Wisp skin around the time a new prime is supposed to come out.

[graceful zodiac]

Not entirely

They do switches when the time period is right to try and drive up sales

Usually Christmas, with Tennocon also counting

[near rune]

In my opinion, the Dex skin would be a downgrade from whatever Wisp Prime looks like, but that's because I like the Prime aesthetic. So Wisp Prime releasing alongside the (repeat of) the Dex Wisp skin is not a huge benefit

[velvet wing]

Isn’t Warframe’s 10th anniversary a good time to push sales?

If you get a free skin but don’t have the frame but oh wait they just made it so you can buy her prime version

[near rune]

TennoCon is when DE does a huge advertising push to draw people (back) to the game, and winter is a huge sales season for everyone. The 10th anniversary, while significant, is not going to be noticed by people who aren't currently playing the game, unless DE does another big advertising push like they do for TennoCon.

DE typically releases some anniversary merch like shirts in their online store, but as far as I'm aware the Dex anniversary time period is not a big player draw, so not a sales target for popular releases.

[signal horizon]

That’s only happened twice out of the 30+ prime frames that have been released afaik so not something too hope for really

[hexed ember]

Primes are released in order while also following the mm-ff format gender wise

[signal horizon]

^

[velvet wing]

Except for when they don’t release them in order

[lament axle]

as they said, happened twice in more than 30 releases, so it's not reliable (although, it can happen)

[flat shadow]

It's happened more than twice. Not much more, though.

[graceful zodiac]

It's been twice in the female order and once in the name order (though depending on whether you want to count Chinaframe)

[velvet wing]

Enough times to say that they aren’t tied to doing it strictly by release date

[graceful zodiac]

Not really. It's 3 or 4 times out of 30+

You can't say 100 percent, but 9/10 they stick to release date, only switching usually when it's christmas for the more popular female frame

[vital creek]

its a safe assumption they will follow a pattern that happens 90% of the time, even if its not guaranteed

[peak steppe]

What are the possibilities that the next big update will be in the next 3 or 4 months?

[zenith jacinth]

Very high

[spring grail]

I expect big update on the Games B-day, which is 25th of March (If I am not mistaken)

I mean, 10 years is not just any number. Its kind of significant

[torpid lantern]

Maybe that's when they'll drop Duviri

[balmy badger]

It would be fitting, since Duviri is an awakening themed update of it's own, in a sense.

[zenith jacinth]

How?

[frail nymph]

Operator goes from Awakening->Warframe->Operator

Drifter is Drifter w/Lotus->Awakening-ish->Warframe

[molten oxide]

So I'm rank angel with the holdfasts and archimedean Yonta said she figured out how to reach tau in a single bold leap disengaging the safeties in a sequence

Just thought that would be interesting

And just got an interesting one from Quinn: "we've both been given a second chance. I perceive two void silhouettes inside you, do you know which is the real one?"

[near rune]

Yeah I'm always interested in how the syndicate dialogue evolves as you level up

My favourite approach is Cetus, which has 3 ranks of dialogue (neutral, 3rd rank, 5th rank). All the other ones only give you new info at max rank.

[balmy storm]

If we ever solve our void problems maybe we’ll finally get to go to Tau 🥲

[molten oxide]

And a third I remembered from yonta, about a dream regarding the grandfather Entrati, him saying in the dream "I'm everywhere" before tearing himself in half

Got it again, here's what I found interesting in it.
"I asked him where he's gone, he said 'everywhere' then tears himself in half"

Definitely worth getting to the angel rank with them

[zenith jacinth]

As it's a dream, I personally don't think it's important, especially since it's known that albrecht simply chose to die of old age

[balmy storm]

I feel like that dream either has incredible importance or Yonta just has some problems with the void and Albrecht

[near rune]

Albrecht's log says that he decided to die of old age, and that is the simplest explanation, but DE did leave it open-ended and we've never gotten any confirmation he's actually dead, only that he's missing. Yonta's dream tells us that he disappeared before the Zariman departed, but it doesn't shed any light on what he's been up to. His actual words and actions during the dream are highly suspect, since Yonta already admits she's been influenced by the Man in the Wall.

[rugged ridge]

I like to think that the dream is talking about something I realized could be possible recently: Albrecht might have had a Duviri Paradox-like situation of his own, and the Albrecht who died of old age is one of two just like our Operator and Drifter. And maybe the other is up to no good

IDK, it's so early to even speculate on that, but I still think it's an important line from Yonta

[rugged ridge]

I love this sort of writing so much

My super-unlikely but fun working theory on that is that the Operator and the Drifter are a Schrodinger's cat situation, both alive and dead; the Operator is a void 'ghost' similar to the Zariman Holdfasts while the Drifter is the real thing, having been locked away safely so the void can have a sort of reference copy or something to draw energy from

Also some interesting things I noticed: Nora Night talks about being watched by 'gods and ghosts who dwell in the direction we cannot point to'; some Kuva Liches talk about actually going to the 'place we cannot point to' when they die in between fights with us and then threaten to send us there. I wonder if that's in reference to Duviri or some other strange place. I also wonder if the Kuva Liches/maybe the Sisters of Parvos are similar void constructs to the Holdfasts as well

The Lotus/Natah during the Ropalolyst mission opens by saying "our history is smoke. blurred by dreams, guided by ghosts"

I feel like these lines hint at some sort of mechanism for how the void does its manipulation of reality

But I really don't know. Sorry for the rambling, I'm super interested in this side of the story lol

[zenith jacinth]

1. Two of the same person can't exist in the same universe at the same time
2. How would the other albrecht even get to our universe

[zenith jacinth]

Yes, incredibly unlikely considering the operator can bleed (it happens in a dream, but still)

[zenith jacinth]

Liches are almost dead grineer that got upgraded using kuva, sisters are corpus that got upgraded with specter particles

"The place we cannot point to" most likely refers to the void, since it defies all laws of our reality

[frail nymph]

That is neither an accurate description of Schrodinger's cat nor of Operator and Drifter.

It is well known that Operator and Drifter are simply the same Tenno from different timelines.

And Operator cannot be a void ghost given that the Zariman crew feeds off of the "light" radiated by Operator.

"Direction we cannot point to" is a very physically accurate name for the void.
You can't go along the x, y, or z axes to go the the void, so it is never in any direction that you can point to.

Liches are made through Kuva, which was discovered long before the void and is therefore probably unrelated.

Sisters are specter tech, which is somewhat related to the void but are certainly not void manifestation like the Holdfast, since Sisters are not constantly on the brink of turning into angels.

[frail nymph]

The long dream made the memories of your operator hazy. That's what blurred by dreams means.

Lotus' personality is based on a dead person named Margulis (and probably a bit of Natah) . That's what guided by ghosts means.

[near rune]

I always took "direction we cannot point to" to just mean an afterlife, not the Void specifically. Then again, many people speak of the Void as an afterlife, even though we don't have any indication it actually works like that.

[rugged ridge]

👍 Makes sense! I really shouldn't try to talk about this sort of thing while sleep deprived

[zenith jacinth]

Just figure out how to point towards the 4th dimension, that shouldn't be too hard

[thick jolt]

Didnt yonta also diferentiate between the dead holdfasts and the living operator ?

[zenith jacinth]

Yep

[native robin]

Love this chat

[molten oxide]

Also yonta might have a crush on the drifter (hopefully the drifter)...with two lines from her saying she's missed us and how we would liked her when she was alive, then hopefully liked.

Zariman is definitely one of my favorite places to explore and visit

[zenith jacinth]

I don't even know to respond properly. In short though; no, she most likely doesn't. It really doesn't sound like she does at all.

[frail nymph]

I got that impression when that bug made her say rank 5 dialogue when I was rank 2, but it's actually rank 5 dialogue - it's supposed to sound like they like you cause they're very very grateful for your help

[hexed ember]

the portrait of hers is quite huge... trying to impress you..?

[narrow tide]

hello

can i pleasa talk with a mod?

i have a question

it says i have been banned for 12 years (until 2035) because of multiple dudes hacking my account and saying N word

today i was trying to log in and i couldn't and when it let me in it said im banned until 01 jan 2035

please help me

[real niche]

#support-and-bugs
No one here in this server can help you

[narrow tide]

i can't

im logged in on google with my warframe acc and i can't fila report because im banned

i have image proof

[real niche]

You're allowed to make a throwaway account for that

[narrow tide]

i don't have another email

what else can i do, i can't contact Devs

hello?

i need to talk to someone important

[signal horizon]

Only way for your problem to be addressed is via #support-and-bugs if you can’t use your original account then you gotta make a new one. Just gotta make a throwaway email as well to make a new Warframe account just for the sole purpose of putting in a ticket. There is no other way

[fair ether]

U can easily make a new e-mail (Google mail as example). If u only use that email for a throw away warframe acc u don't need to bother that email afterwards

[narrow tide]

i've sumbited a request

[subtle garden]

Actually curious about two thing 1) what did you guys decided lotus should be at the end of TNW and why 2) will our choice and the color thing ever matter ?

[zenith jacinth]

1. Lotus because I don't like the names of the other two as much
2. Unlikely

[plain gale]

Who’s the next prime coming out ?

[fleet veldt]

I chose Lotus, though I wanted to pick Natah (and bought her skin in lieu of making that choice), as Lotus was the neutral option, and she's known us past and present the most.

Picking Margulis was a no-go, as that would just be fulfilling Ballas' desires for a lover and to me implies that we've been Narmer'd, as you only see that version of Margulis via Ballas' perspective.

Natah would've been my option because she'd no longer have to play pretend, but... I am fine with my present choice.

The ambiguous choice disk could open up conversation options if DE wanted to add more dialogue opportunities, but at current it only affects some dialogue. I hope DE use it in a vein akin to the Paragon/Renegade system, with the ability to reset it via rerunning all the quests that involve it at a higher difficulty so there's incentive to replay quests.

I expect Lotus to show up in Duviri, looking for her missing hand, acting like some vampire and having some particularly interesting interactions with the Drifter considering how, when we see Drifter back at his camp, Lotus isn't hostile.

[plain gale]

Who’s the newest prime coming out

[fleet veldt]

We do not know yet. Most recent to release were Revenant and Baruuk to my memory.

[plain gale]

Oh ok

[fleet veldt]

So the next two are very likely to be Primed female frames.

[plain gale]

Ok thanks

[brazen hull]

i think hildryn and gara vaulted

[fleet veldt]

Hildryn isn't Primed yet.

[simple moss]

They're talking about the incoming prime, which is being guessed to be Hildryn.

[tight bone]

Hildryn then wisp right? Then gauss and grendle

[zenith jacinth]

Always gotta keep in mind that:

1. Lotus is choosing who takes control
2. The other personalities are still there, the chosen one is just the main one

[signal horizon]

Gara will be vaulted when Hildryn Prime comes

[fair ether]

1. Lotus because space mama. Morgulis would have been my second choice but she has some flaws aaand (and I played the story between a few years without paying full attention) Natha was a no. What we saw from her wasn't... the kindest and I build up the lowest affection for her. I don't think I would have chosen different now, knowing more about those three because space mama
2. I don't think so even it wouldn't surprise me. In the end everyone is supposed to have the same story and I kind of like that since there is so much more to the game than only the story and i wouldn't want to have several playthroughs, even only the story, to see all options. Would be nice if the decisions would make some small changes: the reaction of the operator to some stuff as example.

[brazen hull]

i chose margulis for a reason

[molten oxide]

I went with margulis since after everything that happened, hunhow hunting the heart of the tenno, joining ballas, the new war and death and brought back, the lotus left for good and natah didn't really work for me, so I chose margulis

Though using the normal lotus skin is not something I keep on for long because it still has the glichy voice affecr

[fair ether]

Yeah Lotus went through some stuff

[molten oxide]

Yeah, time for her to rest and the tenno step up to handle their missions

[zenith jacinth]

Natah was brainwashed, she is not responsible for anything she's done

[zenith jacinth]

No personality goes to rest, they're all still there

[fair ether]

Yeah, true. Had to be a mimic for very long and then she got brainwashed again

[subtle garden]

I was thinking of something like they do in bioware game and other choice RPG
Like the choice you make alter some minor cosmetic on your character or something, I like the idea of unique dialogue

I picked margulis because as much as lotus is iconic I don't feel anything special about it and natah was just plain weird to me

Feel like it's also the best choice if you wanna screw ballas cause only you get to have margulis

Very petty

[fair ether]

I have got Morgulis and u don't muhahahah

[subtle garden]

Also as a HUGE philosophy fan I love the theory that our choice are somewhat linked with the Carl Jung "shadow" concept, and I am a huge enjoyer of depression based philosophy so it's like picking the "moon" choice just fit's me as a person and based on my interest in life

Also I found margulis better looking but that's an adjacent bonus point more than the sole reason

[fair ether]

What do u mean with "Carl Jung "shadow" concept"?

[subtle garden]

To keep it very simple, it's a metaphor of your own ego and desire that are subconscious inside your mind

It's supposedly everything that you repress that would make you unfit for society or make bad choice, some sort of pool of inner dark taught and desire

[graceful zodiac]

Note, that's not what Moon choices mean though

[subtle garden]

Allegedly those things can also be stuff that would hurt you in some way and is more prominent with people that have suffered or self esteem issue

[graceful zodiac]

That'd be slightly closer to Sun as a choice

[subtle garden]

Well I'm oversimplifying everything tbh, but the theory is relevant for both moon and sun

[fair ether]

An the neutral are left out? XD
Just watching from the side

[thick jolt]

What ?

[subtle garden]

Remember that "good" is very subjective

[thick jolt]

How many times do we have to bring up the teshin line where he explains is not about good and evil

[fair ether]

The options aren't really "good" or "bad" no matter which side u go and what answers u give

[subtle garden]

I'd call it "the third path" more than anything

[graceful zodiac]

It's not Yin and Yang either, beyond representing a dichotomy

[thick jolt]

You did say neutral is the good one though

Which isnt the case

[fair ether]

I feel like the sun side is not offensive/aggressive while the moon side is more peaceful. Most of the time atleast

[graceful zodiac]

It'd be the opposite

Sun is about passion and emotion, tending to be proactive, optimistic

Not rage, just emotional

[fair ether]

Isn't rage an emotion 🤔 (I don't know the exact translation)

[graceful zodiac]

Yes, but rage isn't specifically related to Sun choices

They would tend to align since Sun is about emotion and active choice

[fair ether]

That's more fitting

[supple dagger]

i choose whatever makes my tenno more of a villain

[fair ether]

XD

I just go for my personal morals

[supple dagger]

i straight up told that kid in the zariman ship his parents werent coming back

being sincere is very good though

did they actually come back? was i wrong? no

[fair ether]

Well... it was the truth. That's not evil. U didn't caused them to feel the pain later u just allowed them to feel the pain in that moment. No wrong hope

Just low empathy

[supple dagger]

i guess

[subtle garden]

I don't think it's necessary the good choice

Think about it this way :

They are in a very stressfull situation into the unknown and the boy is looking for reassurance, anything to grasp some hope
And you are literally telling him "you are gonna die"
Well that sounds pretty mean to me, someone with hope will try his best to survive and get anything out of his current situation

So are you doing the good thing and helping him, or are you just getting some sick kick out of seeing a kid crying, stroking your ego because you are so much more realistic and grounded

Everybody lies, most of the time it's to protect people
But some other would argue that whatever the reason it's always unjustified
Yet we all do it

So it's definitely more complicated than that, granted I'm pulling straws here

But you see my point

[fair ether]

U got a point for sure (in general it is hard to generalize what is the right thing)

[subtle garden]

To be fair I am a bit of hypocrite because there are things that I find inexcusable
Like out of the three choices of the Sacrifice quest the "acceptance" one just makes me mad, I find it unnaceptable

Like you are just gonna go "my child is dead ok" nah fam
Either delete it from your mind to be at peace cause it's too much for you or go crazy go stupid but don't just sit there and accept it

[fair ether]

I have the feeling we might have a very different few on that xD

Lemme check the other options

[subtle garden]

I believe moon is the "forget the memories" the balance is "acceptance" and the sun is the "wrath" one

Well logically it's what it should be

[fair ether]

Yeah it is. To me the wrath is absolutely not necessary (because wrath can have a negative impact on logic thinking) and emptiness has also no benefits. We should keep it mind and remember it if needed but continue on without accepting it to control is in any way

I am more of the objective person xD

[subtle garden]

I agree you could argue that rage leaves you down toward a treacherous path of loosing yourself. But it shows you care about it
Technically forgetting it is like running away from consequences and responsibility. But it also shows how much it hurts you how much you care

Acceptance just seems, phony ? Like it feels disconnected from the reality, granted it's a game that's normal
But I feel like it's the answer the game wants you to choose

And I tend to make my own mind on stuff, I don't like that answer but I can understand why you would choose it, it just doesn't feel human to me

[fair ether]

I do agree, that it feels less human. Since strong emotions are already there and it would probably make the most sense to let this emotions flow

[subtle garden]

Was a cool conversation, hope other people bother reading through it lol
Thanks man

Regards

[fair ether]

Any time again

[steep delta]

got my steam deck and i am ready for !Teshin when duviri drops

was there supposed to be a devstream for Duviri soon?

[plain marten]

In the end of month always

Usually on Friday which should be around 24th Feb.

[steep delta]

Ok

[boreal holly]

Im trying to infiltrate the narmer veil factory and i cant seem to get past the second one

On the left

[near rune]

Are you still trying to unlock the big door with the 4 locks?

[boreal holly]

4 locks ?

I have to activate 2 doors

[near rune]

You're in the Corpus Narmer facility?

[boreal holly]

Yes

[near rune]

Have you used the camera to disable the energy doors?

[boreal holly]

How

[vital creek]

for The New War or Veilbreaker?

[near rune]

Most of that mission is using the various cameras. You can control them at the computer terminals.

[boreal holly]

New war

[near rune]

Ohhh I thought this was Veilbreaker, my bad

[vital creek]

ok ignore the camera advice then

[near rune]

Yeah ignore everything I said

[boreal holly]

Ok

[near rune]

no ignore that haha

[boreal holly]

Ok

I will

Ive been stuck on this for a week and ive watched a few videos

[near rune]

If I recall correctly, you can only disactivate one of the energy barriers at a time, so you need to go in one side, hit the console, then go back through the other side

[boreal holly]

Its hard tho

I keep getting caught

[near rune]

It is a bit hard to figure out the factory layout

[boreal holly]

Yeah

[near rune]

I'd say just go slow and avoid the Deacons, memorise their patterns

[boreal holly]

Ok

[vital creek]

slow and steady, don't move until you have deacon patterns memorized

[boreal holly]

Ight ok got it 👍

[near rune]

Yeah you can stand in a safe place and just watch them go back and forth til you've got it

[vital creek]

try to find openings you can sneak past them and watch the timing window before going for it

[boreal holly]

Ok ill try

Thanks

[frail nymph]

Why would it imply us being Narmer'd? It's Lotus' choice, she decides what's best.

And her version of Margulis comes from Tenno memories originally, even if its creation was enabled by Ballas.

[tight lion]

i need last wish

[high shadow]

Another mini tip I found, on the part where the elevator is, there’s a beam you can walk onto where two of them wont be able to see you 🙂

[zenith jacinth]

(Which is actually the intended path)

[lament axle]

yeah, took me 40min to realize i could do it

[uneven sage]

Hildryn is a possibility looking at release dates, and after that possibly Gauss.

[uneven sage]

Lotus cause I feel that's the person she herself choose to be for herself, she broke free from Natah and Margulis was to be a friendly face to the Tennos but was a facade.

[zenith jacinth]

Hildryn and wisp

Prime release pattern is male, male, female, female

[zenith jacinth]

Lotus was forced on her as much as the other two

[uneven sage]

Dang, I wanted my Gauss prime

Natah is her original apperance/personality, the lotus is who she choose to become when she betrayed the sentient and saved the Tennos.
At least that's how I gathered from it.

But she became the Lotus after the orokin had been defeated, and it was when she was tasked with killing the Tennos she defected and became the Lotus.
No one made or created her to be Lotus, it was her own choice even if Erra believes she had been forced into it.

I'm reading through the wiki Fandom of them and can't find where it says Ballas did it.
I could see she getting his help to become Lotus and he plants the idea of her being Margulis in her, as she refused him at the beginning then he does something and he accepts herself as Margulis and accepts his hand.

I won't say it's perfect but it's better than nothing.
And as I said reprogramming her I could see regarding the Margulis part, but if he was responsible for it all along forcing it upon her why would she refuse him at first?

He did get to first base twice.
But then it worked out perfectly when he snapped his fingers later on.

And she got the mission to kill the Tennos and refused it before being becoming the Lotus.
It's just a personal feeling cause I don't think it's actually definitively stated one way or the other, but that she refused to kill them as they were children and she had become infertile herself, she then decided to become like a "mother" she to the Tennos explaining the apperance of Margulis who the Tennos knew and trusted.
To do this she taken the help of Ballas that wasn't exactly on orokin side, and he took the opportunity to add some subconscious stuff, might even be a good he who pushed her towards Margulis apperance, to be activated when his "plan" is was to be started.

[zenith jacinth]

No, the wiki is made by players and extremely unreliable. Do not use it for lore outside of quest transcripts and quotes.

Natah was supposed to infiltrate the orokin empire, make the tenno kill the orokin and then she would've killed the tenno. Her infertility and marge's memories that were put into her made that last part not happen. She was always the lotus since she got marge's memories.

[uneven sage]

Okey in what mission is that definitively stated I'll check on a game play video of it.

[fair ether]

Alot of memories got taken from Lotus

[uneven sage]

I do remember that from New war I believe, when she has become Natah again and she can't keep the time lines straight, thinking the old war was still ongoing.

[obtuse gyro]

it was definitively stated

however, the waters are quick to be muddied, especially when we learn that Ballas put Marge into Natah, thus forcing a conundrum: Did she save us because she wanted to be a mother, or was that Margulis's love for us

She did not take the form of the Lotus because having a half margulis image was comforting to us, but rather she was remoulded into such by ballas according to the ropalolyst fight

[uneven sage]

Where is that, love to read the whole thing.

[obtuse gyro]

Natah the quest

[uneven sage]

That is definitely stating Ballas had a hand in it, as I said I believe he did.
But dont seem to state it was done against her will, that this change and everything was forced upon her.
With her own words "Natah was the daughter until I destroyed her. Now I am the Lotus. Now I am the mother." it does seem to imply it was her own choice.
Gonna look through a gameplay video of the quest to see, it was a long time ago since I did it so my memory is definitly muddy.

[obtuse gyro]

thats because where its stated that it was against her will was the ropalolyst fight

Here Natah questions the story she told us, remembering that she was "remade"

[uneven sage]

Damn it why dont it show up like that on the link for me, cant find the voice lines written up like that, just bits of them.

[obtuse gyro]

just look up "ropalolyst/quotes"

[uneven sage]

Those quotes are from after she's been remade yet again by Ballas and turned back into Natah, question is if those can be trusted either, this is the same time she calls the tenno and void evil.
Not trying to be difficult about it, genuinly intruiged by it.

[fair ether]

The Transcription shows all quotes of that quest

[uneven sage]

Like this suggestion she's fighting/questioning what was done to her when she was turned back into Natah.

[fair ether]

I think that is the problem. She got programmed several times. Some memories taken away.

[obtuse gyro]

this doesnt change the fact that its been evident that when she was turned from Natah into the Lotus, she was not doing it with open arms

not to mention in the apostasy prologue (or was it the one before it) ballas manages to force the Lotus into following him, even after she tells ballas shes not who he thinks she is

(and thats before being turned back into Natah)

also worth mentioning: during one of the live theater events from Tennocon right before the New War, the display piece was meant to show how ballas had/has been manipulating Natah into Lotus

[fair ether]

Apostasy prologue

[uneven sage]

Exactly, that was what I was talking about before.
That I believe when she refused to kill the Tenno she decided to change, using Ballas that despite being an Orokin wasn't exactly pro Orokin after Malguris was executed, to make these physical changes happening and possible more.
And when he did change her he planted more in her subconcious, which got activated when he snapped his fingers after she first refused her, that definitely set of something that had been planted in her.

[obtuse gyro]

which is something that the ropalolyst fight indicates is not all that happened

there is sufficient evidence that her transformation into the lotus was not of her own doing, and even of her own volition

[thick jolt]

Honestly to me new war ending makes it look like its her first choice as herself

Making it so the other moments werent her choice

[fair ether]

As a far as I know it wasn't Natahs choice to become Lotus but the Lotus would probably not want become Natah again

[uneven sage]

That does back up he changed her, it does nothing to back up it it was forced upon her or of her own choice.

[obtuse gyro]

then try this

[uneven sage]

How does that disprove the theory I laid out here "And when he did change her he planted more in her subconcious, which got activated when he snapped his fingers after she first refused her, that definitely set of something that had been planted in her."

If it was all him from the beginning then why wasn't she on his side from the beginning, why did she refuse him at all first?

[obtuse gyro]

its not this part that is in contention, its the part where you claim that her refusal to kill the tenno is what lead to her change into the Lotus

[obtuse gyro]

this indicates that she is turned into the lotus before she is tagged to us, meaning that she could not have decided to spare us and then turned into the lotus

[uneven sage]

I dont claim it, I said I believe it.
And the part saying otherwise is from when she's been turned back into Natah and her memory is definitely fractured and she's remembering events in multiple different ways.
Why would she choose to remain or act like the Lotus if all of that is a lie?
If she truly believes the Tenno to be her enemy then by picking the option to have her be Natah, which canon wise is her own choice, why would she remain friendly with the Tenno?

[uneven sage]

Btw, you a swede?

[fair ether]

The last part is a but grey zone too

[fair ether]

Nej, why u asking?

[uneven sage]

The name "Potatis" is swedish for potatoe

[obtuse gyro]

Lets look at it this way:

Lotus (during Natah): I loved yall so I aint kill yall
Natah (during ropalolyst): I thought I loved yall but I sense I was remade to do so
Lotus (during TNW): I love yall, but I was first remade to do so by ballas

regardless of how fractured her memory might be, there is a line of thought that can be followed:
I love yall so I aint kill yall but I was remade to do so at first by ballas

Natah/Lotus/Margulis's choice at the End of the New War encapsulates what shes always told us: Dream not of what you are but of what you want to be. The 3 choices are as follows:
Natah: Her original form, untouched, pure
Lotus: With kindness, with strength, a balance of the two to get the job done
Margulis: Compassion but implanted.

All 3 have a downside, all 3 have an upside.

But common to all is that Natah/Lotus/Margulis understands that she wants to be our space mom. Regardless of how much of the previous lives are a lie, she wants to assume that mantle under her terms and hers alone. No ballas.

[frail nymph]

From an orokin perspective, Lotus is just a dangerous Margulis. Lotus is not who anyone wanted to be, just an unavoidable amalgamation of two different personas.

[frail nymph]

She wasn't created to be Lotus, yes. But she only chose to be Lotus the first day she had to deal with killing Tenno. She was always Lotus, just not "officially."

Basically she never became Margulis, it was only a failed attempt that instead led to Lotus.

So comparing them is not a simple A vs B vs C

And ironically even if she had successfully become Margulis, Ballas wouldn't get what he wanted cause she'd choose the Tenno still

[uneven sage]

Lets look at it this way:
The lotus all before she's turned back into Natah have memories of who she was without acting like Natah after she was changed back.
Why is it possible that as the Lotus her memory and personality have been tampered with and not possible that when she's remade into Natah her memory and personality have been tampered with?

If anything her still loving the Tenno even after she's being told she was just made to do so and it's false seems to speak that her true self is that she loves them and fighting the change. That is a quite common trope.
But it's by no means definitive, I'm not saying that, this is all just my theory.

[frail nymph]

But it was probably a good think cause Margulis wouldn't even let Tenno fight the war maybe

[uneven sage]

Very true, and that's along the lines I'm thinking, that the change from Natah into Lotus was of her own will, but Ballas tried to turn her into Margulis cause that's what he wanted, possibly by placing that "programming" to slowly grow subcounciously until he activats it.

[obtuse gyro]

Ah the sci-fi fantasy future where not as many people question child soldiers as much as they should

[uneven sage]

The emperor would be proud... I think, I only know 40k through memes.

[frail nymph]

Remade Natah between Sacrifice and New War is definitely a tampered version.

Lotus was only suppressed, not deleted like reverting some update.

That's the whole point of the Orphix Venom secret dialogue.

[zenith jacinth]

Same

[obtuse gyro]

And given Ropalolyst, even the lotus we knew before all the lore went down was also tampered

all tampered by ballas for ballas

[frail nymph]

Well she was the result of that tampering in the first place... Yeah

[obtuse gyro]

no idea where youre trying to go with the inclusion of tampering given that the venn diagram of the Natah/Lotus/Margulis that we interact with and the tampered forms she assumes is a perfect circle.

I've already mentioned that theres a pretty nice line to draw that shows the full story of her stint in the solar system, despite being tampered, its remained logically consistent

Additionally, (as I've again said before), Natah was implied to be reshaped by ballas before she was attached to us as the tenno handle, ergo she could not have spared us before turning into "the Lotus" as we've seen her at the start of the game

[uneven sage]

That's the thing I'm questioning, if the active Lotus is the tampered version, or if the tampered personality is dormant until Ballas activated it.

[obtuse gyro]

all of it

all of it has been tampered

The lotus we first see is unaware that she was led to believe that she by herself chose us over fulfilling her mission

and then when ballas got her again... everything from that point is tampered with, the only freed version of her is when Ballas is finally dead and she can choose who she wants to be

[uneven sage]

You think, you dont know either, the only thing speaking against it is quotes from when we know she's confused and her mind have been tampered with.

[obtuse gyro]

...

So you think that despite two independent mentions of being tampered, a whole statue/mural thing showed during tennocon of her being tampered (and perhaps implied to be of the first time?)...

she was not tampered at the start??

[frail nymph]

And we still don't even know if that's the whole truth

What's the point of creating distinctions when every version of her any Tenno has ever seen has only existed because of a new type of tampering.

[uneven sage]

First I've not seen the statue/mural thing, you could say it shows the Lotus being the lovechild between Tenshin and Kozu and I could say neither yay or nay to it, unless you link it so it can be seen.
And second does it really disprove my theory that Ballas have merely planted the tampering from the start but it was not active until he activated it?
Does it show her being hunted down and then remade forcefully while she's screaming for help and mercy?
Or does it simply show that he had a hand in it all along, which dont go against what I've said at all?

[distant tusk]

Do we really know that teshin is dead?

[real niche]

His head was crushed to hell and back, yes he's dead

[obtuse gyro]

Teshin we see in the new war is dead, as for twoshin in duviri, we'll find out how hes alive

[distant tusk]

Oh

[real niche]

Twoshin's most likely just a different Teshin entirely

[frail nymph]

??

[distant tusk]

Stupid what’s her face

[frail nymph]

For all we know it could be a Varzia situation exactly, but yes he is prolly ded.

[uneven sage]

Unless Tenshin used similar methods to cheat death that the Orokin previously used.
But in most likelyhood he's dead.

[distant tusk]

But didn’t lotus survive?

[frail nymph]

She's a sentient

A sentient can be revived

Twoshin could be a Zariman Holdfast situation, a Drifter from another mother timeline situation, or a Varzia situation. In that (decreasing) order of likelihood.

[real niche]

Wasn't there a snap and all when Teshin got did in? And wasn't Varzia still moving after she got out in her version?

[frail nymph]

Varzia's cutscene was long enough for her to start moving again after she passed out and went limp. Teshin's was too short for that

[real niche]

Yeah but then wouldn't we have Teshin back in the Conclave place

[frail nymph]

The sound was slightly louder but it's not like they have to reuse the same mp3 for two things. And visually nothing happened to him

[frail nymph]

He would've been sucked into the void same as Lotus and operator

Maybe the reason the Warframe didn't end up in there is probably that operator made sure to anchor it before coming out so that they could hold on to Lotus.

What if your New War fashion'd Warframe did end up in Duviri and it's one of the duviri-starters? 👀

[obtuse gyro]

https://youtu.be/fvSSWv4hcqw?t=1958
As stated by the devs themselves, the beginning of her transformation into the lotus (take special notice of the handcuffs)
as for your second point: same thing, shes been tampered with from the start, even if she had a sleeper in her, she's still tampered because she did not express knowledge/recognition in that point in time that she had been tampered with (recognition/knowledge she has expressed on two independent occasions)

Lotus does not need to run and scream, I dont understand the necessity of such extremes to get the point across that ballas twisted Natah into a shape he wanted.

[frail nymph]

Also Lotus explicitly describes how exactly Ballas changed her.

He dissolved her old self, reshaped her, and directed her to Lua.

Can't get more tampered than that

[obtuse gyro]

twas what I've been saying

[obtuse gyro]

^

[distant tusk]

Well teshin is best

[uneven sage]

An literal art piece, common thing in art is metaphors, like the Tenno in the palm of Ballas.
Ballas also looking as when he was an proper Orokin, far from true since some time.
The handcuffs could represent the bonds by the orkin placed on the sentients, or the duty she had towards her sentient brethren and her mission, or the dorment tampering I believe Ballas placed on her and it might very well describe her being caught and forced by Ballas.
That's the thing, I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm saying I have a theory and I've yet to seen definitive evidence of it not being possible.
Hunhow himself had no idea what happened to Natah, why she didnt finish her last mission, it'd be weird for him to completly miss his own daughter being kidnapped, if she on the other hand made the choice to evade and escape him it'd make more sense it'd all escape his knowledge.

But there is still that she during it all had gaps in her memory, that she remembered that she completed all her mission except the last one, that is weird.

I dont understand why it's so important to you for others to not even consider alternate option or possibilities.

[lament axle]

what is the subject again? i'm kinda lost on what you guys are debating

[uneven sage]

To the core of it, that if the original Natah choose to become the Lotus or was forced into becoming it.

[obtuse gyro]

Mangrove believes that the moment Natah chose not to kill us is the moment she decided to transform herself into the lotus, we have 1 "artpiece" and a line from the Lotus herself that show that she was turned into "The Lotus" before being attached to us

[graceful zodiac]

She was forced into the role, but eventually made it her own thing

[uneven sage]

That's the meaning YOU'RE giving the artpiece, you've never heard of art being subjective and different people places different meanings on it?
Cause I sure didnt hear the devs saying it represents her being captured and forcefully being turned into the Lotus, I heard them say it represents Natah in her beginning transformation into the Lotus.
Lines from her when she's definitely mentally tampered.

[obtuse gyro]

I mean, your own offered interpretations show that she did not go through the transformation out of love and "mentally tampered" is not a strong counter argument against her remembering what ballas did to her (because she's said roughly the same thing twice)

For as long as we've known her she has been tampered

[uneven sage]

It does not, stop putting your words in my mouth.
I've said multiple times I believe Ballas was involved in her transformation into the Lotus, but that it was still voluntraily, and that he took the opportunity to do more than she had asked for.
It kinda is when she's serving the person that allegedly hunted her down and forcefully destroyed her personality and replaced it with another.

[obtuse gyro]

The handcuffs could represent the bonds by the orkin placed on the sentients, or the duty she had towards her sentient brethren and her mission, or the dorment tampering I believe Ballas placed on her and it might very well describe her being caught and forced by Ballas.

your words, not mine

[uneven sage]

Yes that's my words, exactly where does it say she was forcefully transformed into the Lotus in the interpretation "the dorment tampering I believe Ballas placed on her"

[obtuse gyro]

exactly where does it say she does it out of love for us?

[uneven sage]

If you said that the interpretation states she was forcefully transformed into Margulis then I'd agree.

[uneven sage]

Where does it say she did not?

[graceful zodiac]

It's in Natah

[obtuse gyro]

I was refering to his interpretation of the handcuffs in the tennocon statue

[uneven sage]

My interpretation said nothing about WHY she became the Lotus.

[obtuse gyro]

Your personal theory maintains that she chose to be remade into the lotus after sparing us yes or no?

[uneven sage]

True, and that for her to change shape into what she's like as the Lotus she took help from Ballas, who at the time was no friend of the Orokin due to the execution of Margulis, and that he took advantage of that opportunity to implant something subconciously, that he activated after she rejected him which caused her to accept him.

[graceful zodiac]

Oh, that's blatantly not the case then

[uneven sage]

Please do tell.

[graceful zodiac]

Both DE and Ballas have directly said that she only loves them because she was made to. At first anyways

[uneven sage]

Ballas word I would not trust, where did DE say it, cause if the Devs said it directly did then yeah, I'm completly wrong.

[obtuse gyro]

Not to mentioned her line showing pretty plainly she was Lotusified before being sent to us

She could not have spared us then be physically transformed into the Lotus

[graceful zodiac]

Like Bau said, the point of the New War diorama showing her starting point. And this is not a situation where Ballas would be lying, it's literally him loading over his power and superiority over us at the climax of the new war

[uneven sage]

And I agree that's a possible interpretation, but not the only one possible.
"Gather the fleet. She is coming to us - what's left of her. She will kneel before me and, by my word, slaughter the only thing she has ever loved. And then? We feast."
This is still possible that he made her love them, but then why could he not make her love him is my question?
"Pitiful, broken thing! A puppet accusing her Maker of... "A lack of substance", was it?"
And this I feel would still fit my theory as he did use her as a puppet from when he snapped his finger after her initial rejection.

And again, this is just my theory, a literal fan theory and I agree a far fetched one.
If the Devs have definitively stated Ballas was behind even her loving them.

[frail nymph]

I feel like that's an redundant question-and-answer too...

Whether her code looked like
If(object==Tenno) {Feelings.love();}

Or

If(person==Tenno)
{Margulis_Implatation->Feelings.love() }

It doesn't make a difference.

[uneven sage]

The difference would be if it was her own choice or something forced upon her, whole free will and all that.

[frail nymph]

Not really no

Both would be forced upon her, because she would never even try to answer said question unless she was forced to think like Margulis

[uneven sage]

We dont quite know that, as we dont really know how she was when she was Natah, we got some views in The New War but she was clearly messed up at that time.

[frail nymph]

Either way, Lotus has not made an unhindered-Natah-personality choice ever since Ballas reprogrammed her.

If she was at all programmed with Margulis, there wouldn't be a need for her to choose to Love Tenno independently

[graceful zodiac]

She did love him. The issue is that she comes never only love him. Ballas is smart, But also full of himself. He imported Margulis into Natah and left it at that because he didn't think he needed to do more. And then she wanted kids, * because* Margulis also wanted kids.

[uneven sage]

How do you mean?

[uneven sage]

Margulis loved him, if the version of Margulis in Lotus/Natah ever did I'm not so sure, hard to even say how that version was even created, was it just memories Ballas had, was it somehow a copy of her entire being or simply records the Orokin had.
Both Ballas and Lotus seems to seperate the "real" Margulis from the one in Lotus
Ballas: "I loved you once... you were so like her." Implying she never really became like her.
Lotus: "You dreamed of a Margulis you could control. But she chose death over you." Implying Lotus and Margulis are seperate.

Ofc this could just be me looking to far into it, seeing things that arn't there.

[fair ether]

Ballas killed the real Margulis. Natah was forced to mimic Margulis

[zenith jacinth]

The seven collectively voted to execute margulis

Which is necessary for the vote to count, meaning ballas was throwing such an extreme temper tantrum about marge choosing the tenno over him that he got her killed

[real niche]

And then Lotus comes in and hey look what happened funny isn't it

[fair ether]

A lovely lover and his mistake (atleast for him)

[real niche]

I read those lines as him being oblivious to the fact this is why Margulis and now Lotus hate him, and thinking Lotus would be different

[uneven sage]

I can see that viewpoint of it.
He was pretty whack by the end of it all.

[zenith jacinth]

By the end?

I think you mean from the start

[steep delta]

lol

[fair ether]

I would say antisocial-personality

[real niche]

Bro him being whack is the entire reason Warframe's story in its entirety exists.

[uneven sage]

Also being the reason it almost stopped existing, A-Z it's all Ballas, Balls to the walls

[real niche]

Nah we still got Wally

[fair ether]

Wally is great

[steep delta]

Wallzilla

[hexed quiver]

What took you so long, kiddo?

If Wally says that when we inevitably encounter him, I'm gonna lose my mind.

[fair ether]

I want to play the quests again... just to talk with wally.
But yeah he is kinda... I didn't know u existed man xD

[steep delta]

I just love how warframe has references like this in quests

[fair ether]

Where is that? XD

[steep delta]

New War

Zariman Ship when you go to meet the Drifter

[viral palm]

Ok so he doesn't look like Pagan Min but he's definitely got that east Asian pretty boy flare ngl

Idk how it happened cuz it looks nothing like the op

[fair ether]

Oh no i might have missed that!

[viral palm]

But eternalism or whatever

[supple dagger]

looks cool

[viral palm]

It could have been far worse

[supple dagger]

Bro
I need the Duviri Paradox
The New War was the best warframe level for me... I felt things I had never felt before in this game
And I believe that Duviri will overcome this... It will be better

[lament axle]

yeah, gotta agree with you, TNW was amazing and Duviri is looking even better imo

[fair ether]

Don't make somwthing breaking me more than tnw Fortuna

[molten oxide]

I was not expecting the Stalker to spawn on the zariman

[brazen hull]

stalker was the only thing you could fear in the alpha version

[molten oxide]

I didn't think he could've spawned on the zariman since it's somewhat of a free roam area

[undone forge]

He's welcome to ambush me on the Zariman anytime, he drops free lanthorns

[steep delta]

Instant Lanthorns just add Stalker

[uneven sage]

Poor stalker shivering in a corner with murder hobo Tennos looking for him with low voice chanting "loot, loot, oh stalker come out and playyyyy"

[deft void]

Can I have a female operator and a male drifter?

[brazen hull]

how about a mix of both

[deft void]

Mix of both?

Since Drifter is operator

[flat shadow]

I have a fem face with a masc voice on mine.

[deft void]

Wait.. is drifter thr same as operator?

[molten oxide]

...yes? How far in New war are you?

[deft void]

Beat it

It's just confusing

[tiny ibex]

when the Operator had the choice to shake hands with the man in the wall, the one that shook hands is the kid

while the Drifter is the one that didn't take the deal

[flat shadow]

Eternalism makes the answer yes and no at the same time

[deft void]

@_@

[fair ether]

Yepp

[ruby eagle]

and a pineapple too

[tight lion]

i need last wish ;-;

[brazen hull]

who lives in a ayatan anasa sculpture under the sea

[brazen hull]

why tho

[brazen hull]

drifterator

[cyan crest]

Why not? :p

[chrome glen]

Any word on when The Last Wish will drop

[minor goblet]

Maybe tune into dis weeks primetime

[frail nymph]

Hmmmmm

I wonder what the ingame explanation for Duviri multiplayer will be

I wonder if there's a main Drifter and other Tenno from his Zariman also got stuck there...

So only the Drifter and Operator versions of your character are the ones that perform the events of New War/Duviri story, and all others get powers.

[abstract vault]

wait that was the man in the walls we shook hands with?

[gilded fog]

bro look like Ain't no way emote on 7tv

https://tenor.com/view/skull-skeleton-nah-bruh-free-fire-gif-25130870

[frail nymph]

They called you kiddo, rap tap tapped their finger on the wall, had weird eyes and Lotus's hand, looked exactly like you, and offered you a deal... Of course it's MITW.

[abstract vault]

that makes alota sense now

[brazen hull]

Can he do a lightskin stare

[viral palm]

I have absolutely no idea what that means

[viral palm]

What

Oh... I don't see the resemblance.

[supple dagger]

he just did

[river island]

Tenno Squarepants!!!

[brazen hull]

who lives in ayatan hemakara sculpture under the sea

[steep delta]

What the blep is an ayatan Hemakara sounds disgusting lol

[brazen hull]

it's a Mitsubishi car

[steep delta]

Lol

[brazen hull]

ayatan stars are Mitsubishi Materials

[sly pond]

LOL

[fair ether]

[deft void]

r..R..regor.. he's a aliv..omg..

[tight lion]

my wish ?

[balmy storm]

The return of the king

[scarlet basalt]

I guess the easy lore about Citrine is that she "geoded" herself with 2 Other warframe to stop the void leaking too much ?

[thick jolt]

doesnt sound like the two lovers preserved in the cristals were warframes in the short page about the update

[scarlet basalt]

That's strange, on the stream we don't really understand what's going on.
Like there is Lodun, a tunnel between 2 place... but i wonder why in those 2 specific place ?

[thick jolt]

according to the page the void responded to the lovers feelings and bridged the gap between them

[balmy storm]

It stated that the void is responding to their connection
No idea why it’s happening though

[scarlet basalt]

That explain a little bit more about the void.
It feels like : feelings seems to have an impact on the void ? Like what if the fact that Angels exists in the void was solely because of their madness 🤔 ?
So the void respond to their wish, to be able to kill everyone ?
But then on Rania and Belric
the void responded to their feelings to be together ? So it made a tunnel ?
That would be a weird theory tbh

[balmy storm]

The angels exist because the holdfasts consumed the energy of the big finger

[scarlet basalt]

oh yeah, i forgot about that.
Maybe a new property of the void ? Smilar to how the thrax leader can change his world ?

[balmy storm]

I think it might just be their feelings were strong enough or something in relation to Duviri, since we do see the Orowyrm

[scarlet basalt]

then i wonder what is citrinne's wish ? 🤔
200% she has to do with it and has done something to reunite them maybe ? 🤔

[balmy storm]

Maybe Citrine, or their Tenno, was the child of Belric and Rania?

[scarlet basalt]

wait why the update is 6.6 gb ???
Are they putting the entire duviri paradox ??

[balmy storm]

Their wish is to keep their parents together, or the wish is just to preserve a love they witnessed

[scarlet basalt]

bro wth is going on, the update is 6.6 gb but it offer so little with what is said on the patch note, 200% there is going to be another bug with duviri and it will show the map lmao

Lodun was already rendered through railjack so it is even weird

[red hinge]

Big chungus kills pazool

[obtuse gyro]

The void has been shown to be able to react to and manifest based on emotion and thought

[limpid cypress]

New players: "What's a Drifter?"

DE: "Don't worry about it"

Meanwhile I'm still nine hours away from finishing building a Voidrig so I still can't start The New War. =\

[steep delta]

The drifter has tattoos now cool

[supple dagger]

on god

[limpid cypress]

(To be fair, on my part at least, first thing I do when I start a new game is look into customization options, so I was spoiled before I started)

[fair ether]

I look into customization everytime I change something on my Warframe etc. And somehow I bugged out one of my pets xD

[frail nymph]

Spoilers for Citrines last wish:
She just wants Tyl Regor to give the damn jeans back

[molten oxide]

Teshin's swords are gone from the dormazone

And the colorless effect from duviri is bleeding through the door where they laid

[lament axle]

uh oh, they're coming!

[woeful jacinth]

He just walks in, takes his swords back and doesn't even say hey to us

[zenith jacinth]

Are you in drifter or op?

[molten oxide]

Drifter

[zenith jacinth]

Huh

[molten oxide]

I'll send an image

[glass furnace]

Hey how are you doing