builds-discussion

[jaunty briar]

How about bubonico? It seems cool

[peak quiver]

Oh yeah that's a good one imo

[floral sky]

I know the bassocyst is worth getting ive seen somethings saying thats really thats the one ill probably get when i can

[peak quiver]

Oh yeah good pick

[shell pivot]

ive got the bassocyst :D, are there any in this rotation worth taking?

and ive got pathocyst as well

[karmic badger]

Just wait for 50%+ elemental bonuses

Regardless of element, since you can change it with a vice

[hybrid crystal]

i love the catabolyst with the augment

[shell pivot]

okay ill try it thanks!

[midnight horizon]

It doesn't depend on it. But it's affected by it

All types of status effects that deal some sort of damage (we usually call this DoT) are affected by crits

Why? Because the damage is essentially equal to a specific multiplier of modified base damage, which itself is affected directly by crit

[quasi torrent]

greedy pull pulls everything that is not collectibles/caches, thus leaving only them on your minimap

[woven lynx]

I don't understand why saryn is considered powerful

I legit don't get it

[quiet laurel]

cause she can subsume roar onto a kit that has an ability which triple dips faction damage

and gives you free corrosive

and easy shield gate

saryn is part of the big leagues

[woven lynx]

https://overframe.gg/build/207018/saryn-prime/venomous-spores-saryn-steel-path-general-use/

is this an outdated build or somethin? I have only 75 shields lol

[quiet laurel]

do you know what shield gating is

[peak quiver]

Saryn gets better with tougher enemies as long as you can keep your spores up, which isn't too hard.

[quiet laurel]

what are we saying

[woven lynx]

Kinda?

[peak quiver]

The truth

[quiet laurel]

thats the reason you only have 75 shields

[woven lynx]

idk that doesnt work for me it seems

[quiet laurel]

spores tech 🗣️

[peak quiver]

?

[quiet laurel]

you have catalyzing shields which always gives 1.33 secs of shield gate no matter the shield level

[quiet laurel]

you are better off going full weapoons platform

[peak quiver]

Idk what that means and I'm just saying Sayrn is great

[quiet laurel]

spores kinda ass

[woven lynx]

spores are ass indeed

[peak quiver]

You're allowed to be wrong

[woven lynx]

He is not tho

Tho I would helminth miasma cause it just sucks

[peak quiver]

Spores can nuke a room

[woven lynx]

roar is better

[quiet laurel]

spores is like 1% of what saryn can do

[woven lynx]

spores nuke a room if you upkeep the stakcs

which is just not fun constantly managing some resource that can disappear in a matter of 5 sec

tho I use just venom dose for spores and that sit

[peak quiver]

Yes which as I said aren't hard to keep up as long as you always have her 3 up

[woven lynx]

I am considering just putting roar on 4th

[quiet laurel]

which is your best choice

[acoustic bluff]

Spores is one of saryns weakest abilities and actually makes you nuke less if you want to put it one way or another

[peak quiver]

I guess it's a skill issue then? Idk I don't seem to have problems with it

[acoustic bluff]

its either play high range spores and wait for things to die/keep enemies alive or you just kill 2x the amount in the same amount of time without spores

[peak quiver]

Or

3rd option do both

That's what I do

[quiet laurel]

no roar basically makes her weapons platform insanely worse

[acoustic bluff]

There is no third option because you cant upkeep spores on the other

lol

[peak quiver]

I do

[quiet laurel]

one reason for spores would be passive armor strip but 1 aug already does that

[peak quiver]

It is what it is, we're allowed to have differing opinions

[woven lynx]

Should I just put roar and don't bother? https://overframe.gg/build/207018/saryn-prime/venomous-spores-saryn-steel-path-general-use/

Also I hate that you can't make different polarities on different presets

this sucks

[quiet laurel]

omni forma is the way fr

[acoustic bluff]

Like yes you can use spores, sure it doesnt matter because everyone is entitled to their own opinion

But it really isnt that good imo

Because even in low level nuking, everythings just gonna die

on a weapons platform like sobek/akarius/occucor etc everything is just gonna die anyway at a faster rate

Only reason id see for spores upkeep is for the armor strip but its post jade shadows

[quiet laurel]

saryn sobek, saryn ocucor, saryn torid all basically have higher KPM than spores and also scale much higher

so no reason for spores unless you like the ability

[acoustic bluff]

Ive tried high range roar sobek and the difference is pretty big imo

[acoustic bluff]

ye

[woven lynx]

https://overframe.gg/build/226696/saryn-prime/lashing-venom-weapon-platform-saryn-easy-lazy-gate-strongest-weapon-buff/

Can I swap vigilante vigor here for something else pleaes?

any suggestions

[acoustic bluff]

Ngl

[quiet laurel]

you can remove passive gate and active gate

[acoustic bluff]

switch brief for corrosive projection, remove vigor and deflection because her 2 is a really good shield gate

[quiet laurel]

active gating is really comfy on saryn cause of the instant cast, molt aggro and speed buff

[acoustic bluff]

put in an augur mod or something

[acoustic bluff]

Probably the best to active gate ngl

[quiet laurel]

and molt also cleanses

which is huge

[woven lynx]

yeah I have no idea what I am doing

[acoustic bluff]

secrets

[quiet laurel]

vigor and deflection out, duration and strength augur mods in

[acoustic bluff]

I just realised im using brief on my saryn

need to change ts

[quiet laurel]

I think so too

relic of before being a knower

[quiet laurel]

well, atp cata bug isnt knower anymore

[woven lynx]

what is wrong with brief respite?

[quiet laurel]

augur set does the exact same

[acoustic bluff]

apparently i dont even have cata on her

[quiet laurel]

so running corrosive projection will give you a final damage buff by having the armor of enemies removed

[acoustic bluff]

odd this is what i used for my enjoyer, guess it worked really well lol

[quiet laurel]

I mean its saryn

[acoustic bluff]

yeah i thought i had cata corro though for some reason

[quiet laurel]

its not like my sevagoth run yesterday where I was not one shotting

[woven lynx]

do I keep venom dose tho

[acoustic bluff]

This is my build

[quiet laurel]

venom dose is insanely important

[quiet laurel]

ah the aku tech of fast deflection

[acoustic bluff]

this is pre aku thread i think

I think i checked though and we had very resembling builds

[woven lynx]

so brief respite to corrosive and thats it?

[acoustic bluff]

Idk im still confused lol, maybe i changed it after or something

[woven lynx]

so again what do I change

[acoustic bluff]

can take out fast deflection and switch brief respite

[woven lynx]

to what exactly

[quiet laurel]

CP in the aura and fast deflection can also be slotted out (need to actively gate then)

[acoustic bluff]

to corrosive projection

[woven lynx]

Fast Deflection I mean

[quiet laurel]

flex really

transient fortitude or smth

[acoustic bluff]

errr i dont use blind rage but it shouldnt matter, Can run primed continuity

[severe bough]

Rolling guard for me prob

[acoustic bluff]

You dont need rolling guard on her

her 2 status cleanses

[woven lynx]

then what

[severe bough]

Then whatever more str mor duration

[acoustic bluff]

@woven lynx

[woven lynx]

oh ok

[acoustic bluff]

You dont need a stupid amount of strength on her tbh, at some point you overkill like crazy

[woven lynx]

honestly ninjase build are so hit or miss sometimes its insane

[acoustic bluff]

you already are

[woven lynx]

He made saryn so shitty to me

[acoustic bluff]

Nah ninjase is good hes just building things for different reasons. he makes level cap builds and general use builds but some of them are outdated i think

[quiet laurel]

the spores build is 2 months old

and is probably made for people who just got saryn and dont have helminth or smth

but otherwise the build is pretty eh tbh

[acoustic bluff]

oh hm

yeah prob

[severe bough]

Are people still using spore saryn? Never saw one till sobek saryn was popular

[proven sinew]

is proboscis cernos good? will gas be good for it?

[quiet laurel]

used to be a thing before update 36 but after there is no real reason to it

[acoustic bluff]

they started knowing

[severe bough]

Fr

[woven lynx]

now helminth 4

wait I read the above

should I helminth 1 then or what

[severe bough]

4

[granite ginkgo]

4 wont even stun SP enemies

[woven lynx]

how can I access test area mates?

where I can summon enemies and etc

[coral crest]

Simulacrum key from Simaris

[fierce lark]

i prefer spores for endurance, mostly for marking enemies

also on the basis that sobek isn’t the only weapon in the game and map-wide armor strip is nice

giving everyone in the squad 230% corrosive buff and 80% roar is cool too

[old marsh]

plz make sure to type full Corr Proj. u never know

[fierce lark]

also moved from cata respite aegis to circumvent adapt

way more comfy

[quiet laurel]

I will continue abbreviating corrosive projection and there is nothing you can do about it

[old marsh]

https://tenor.com/view/jake-crying-gif-15896901980625544793

[coral crest]

It's so sad that BR(battle royale) sabotages Protea

[fierce lark]

blast radius

pepper coyote

[scarlet mason]

how does blast react to gun CO? does it increase the damage dealt other enemies if they are affected by multiple status effects? what i mean is: if i mod for blast and enemy dies detonating blast than does other enemies in range of blast take increased damage if they are affectted by multiple status effects at the time?

[celest thicket]

in this build which is better , primary bulwark(obviously considering it stacked) or primary crux ? the riven is fire rate, multishot, crit dmg -proj speed

still trying to get a better roll

[fierce lark]

that’s a great question but im pretty sure blast only cares about the damage your initial target took, and then spreads that damage

but xata’s also adds void damage to the aoe, i think it’s the only buff that actually adds damage to aoe blast procs

[river rain]

Does Hallowed Reckoning's damage per second apply to Harmony's ability?

[quiet laurel]

no, only the initial targets damage you did to will inherit the CO effect into the blast explosion

@acoustic bluff how long you think it'll take? might walk my dog rly quick if it takes a bit

[acoustic bluff]

Can walk them its fine

[fierce lark]

can i walk your dog

[coral crest]

Can I dog your walk

[spiral chasm]

Can i be the

[topaz bridge]

are these builds good on wukong or there are something better than these

i wanna find aa good build for begining and the uprading in something like that

[vagrant anvil]

I need some help
Which is the better bow?
Daikyu Prime or evensong?
I need help for builds with both
I got riven for both
Evensong:
+160cc 124 slash -82ms
Daikyu:
150 tox 198cc -81 impact

[severe bough]

Drop organ shatter for CO

[topaz bridge]

what is CO

[severe bough]

Condition overload

Do u have external attack speed?

Nvm u have

[topaz bridge]

nop

[fierce lark]

daikyu

[topaz bridge]

like this

these

[fierce lark]

external attack speed means attack speed that isn't modded onto the weapon

[severe bough]

Ye but strike is external atk speed isnt it

[fierce lark]

a warframe arcane, an incarnon evolution, a warframe ability

[severe bough]

Bruh theres also wrathful advance on didnt saw that

[vagrant anvil]

Can you help me with a build?
Is the head shot live steal mod good to use and primary head shot mod with no MS available on it ?

[fierce lark]

yes and yes

the weapon itself does more than enough single target, you'd want blast/electric (or both) for aoe damage, so toxin on the riven is not ideal

[topaz bridge]

yeah but what should i focus with the attack speed

[karmic badger]

what's the best stance

[mighty flare]

iron pheonix

[gaunt minnow]

what are ya'lls thoughts about null star on limbo?

[vagrant anvil]

I made a mistake the riven has 198 crit damage not cc
So keep it or roll it?

[dusty meteor]

Is this any good?

[rocky aurora]

The efv5 is not, no

Riven isn't either though

[vagrant anvil]

I love the Jupiter

[dusty meteor]

Ty was going to build it

[vagrant anvil]

Imo go for fire rate elemtal damage and a 3rd buff

[rocky aurora]

Something like that

[dusty meteor]

Is that off overframe

[rocky aurora]

Nope

[dusty meteor]

How do I find that

[rocky aurora]

Its a warframe bot this server doesn't have

[dusty meteor]

Is it on the other discord?

[rocky aurora]

Idk, thats from my clan's server

[dusty meteor]

Ahhh

Either way Ty for sharing

[vagrant anvil]

I currently run a
Crit dmg heat fire rate riven on my Jupiter

[woven lynx]

what weapon goes well with uriel?

[ebon apex]

Always best to see a general opinion on the weapons rank, first. Then decide if it's worth a look or if there's just something about it you like (it's not all about meta equipment; Have fun!). Finally, ask yourself if the riven's effects will greatly enhance what the weapon already has going for it, or neutralizes something to improve weapon performance. You might check this site (among many) that ranks weapons: https://overframe.gg/tier-list/primary-weapons/

[vagrant anvil]

I like that the Jupiter just feels like a good ol assault rifle with no too much gimmicks to me

[ebon apex]

I like something with range, because, if it's 4 (local AOE) is cranked, nothing nearby needs to be dealt with! 😆

[celest thicket]

How does reach/primed reach interact with Landslide fists ?

Does it increase the range of the dash or the range of the shockwave?

Or both?

[proud anchor]

It increases the shockwave

[fierce lark]

keep, you get a bunch of crit chance from acuity, crit dmg is a big roll

ideally try to roll something that doesn't have +toxin but still has cd but keep it in the meanwhile

[rocky aurora]

These lists are so bad

Having kuva sobek in A tier alongside the gotva is a war crime

[frail quail]

is this build any good? tryna take nidus to steelpath

[rocky aurora]

Never trust overframe tier lists lmao

[fierce lark]

overframe's tier list is a popularity contest which also never resets

if something was amazing 5 years ago (the ignis wraith in a lot of eyes) and is now ass (the ignis wraith lmao) it'll still be rated highly

in no realm of imaginability should the ignis wraith and gotva prime be in the same tier as the burston prime and sobek

[rocky aurora]

When Sybaris inc 1 bursts lvl cap thrax but is only B tier

💀

Best thing i ever did was ignore overframe lol

[near vortex]

Why triumbral

Parasitic Vitality is right there

Parasitic vitality blind rage and then you open up a slot for an augment

Or just more strength

[frail quail]

this is my buddies build, i suck at building too much so i asked for his

[near vortex]

I don't think you should use his build. Mecha set isn't doing anything unless it's a Kubrow loadout, and hunter adrenaline is unnecessary when Virulence exists

And your friend is running Bellicose without Parasitic Vitality

Lemme go grab my Nidus config

[frail quail]

that would be appreciated🙏

[mental ermine]

Yo so Im trying to do a weapons platforming build on Dante where Im using arcane hot shot would pyrotechnics be good for the subsume to get that 50x multiplier for that arcane?

[glass bolt]

i believe I cooked this pure abilities Koumei

Zephyr subsume works really well with Koumei 1

[near vortex]

Aura is flexible, I have steel charge for the capacity and melee damage
Exilus is whatever you like because tether gives status immunity
If you subsume over 4, Archon Intensify can be swapped off. Insatiable, Teeming Virulence and Abundant Mutation are all optional for more range or duration.

Insatiable helps with fast stack gain, I like it because it helps me get stacked up in squads.
Abundant Mutation increases my health substantially which means Persistance keeps me alive longer
Teeming Virulence is for a crit based primary like Bubonico or Torid

[fierce lark]

if only koumei's skills actually did anything

[near vortex]

mod Noctua for heat, that should work

[proud anchor]

Yea that can work, I believe you could also build noctua with heat on it as well

[glass bolt]

thats the fun part

so, the string only deals damage when enemy walk thru it, so its not so effective if enemies is, lets say standing there and shooting you

and then air burst exist

you can group them force them to eat every string, if still didnt died, burst them away take damage from string again

[fierce lark]

the strings don't really do much damage to begin with, they just prime a lot of random statuses

[glossy mauve]

Is there any better build with the mods that i have?

[fierce lark]

koumei is a walking CO primer

who eventually turns into a levelcap warframe

[glossy mauve]

Is that who I think it is in your pfp?

[fierce lark]

probably

[near vortex]

part 6

[frail quail]

thanks man, your a life saver

[glossy mauve]

https://tenor.com/view/jojos-bizarre-adventure-stone-ocean-jjba-jolyne-cujoh-jojo-no-kimyo-na-boken-suton-oshan-anime-girl-gif-24005278

[glossy mauve]

Anyone? This is the best build that I could build as my first time modding. Any help is appreciated

[near vortex]

Looks okay for how early you are

Farm some arbis for the galvanized mods

[glossy mauve]

I had to put in 2 forma but I think I can actually do level 40-60 things now

[glass bolt]

yes but thats also a lot of priming+grouping enemies for gas+blast from the string

that they often dies once grouped up by airburst

usually koumei abilities don't have killing power at all

[ebon apex]

Any suggestions for a more reliable (regularly updated) tier list?

[fierce lark]

there really isn't one tbh

[glass bolt]

depends on whether you want a weapon that can slot onto any warframe
or a weapon that built for a warframe

[ebon apex]

Sounds like it's time for someone to draft a Google Sheet and post it in a Discord. Probably best to orient it around public voting, but trolls would likely ruin it. It would be really helpful, though

[glass bolt]

aint the result is going to ended up nearly the same tho?

[autumn trail]

im theory crafting with dante rn, i know roar works on reave, does it work the same on dante's verses?

[fierce lark]

i could tell you the acceltra prime is a great weapon, because it clears 200+ steel path perfectly fine if you have enough buffs or ammo economy for it

but then you'll take the acceltra prime on a caster frame and you basically won't have a primary for most of the mission

[cold creek]

Question regarding Mesa
Is it better to just install 5 archon shards to increase crit chance for 125%? or 4 crit chance, and a single shard for 15% ability power increase?
my regulators already have 100% crit chance by default, and I have 4 archon shards that add another 100, making me constantly hit orange crits always. But is the extra 25% worth it over a general ability power increase?

[fierce lark]

asking for opinions will give you just that - opinions

and those vary too much based on anecdotes

[fierce lark]

topaz secondary crit chance > red secondary crit chance > anything else

[cold creek]

I'm fine with that, because honestly I don't see a negative in having either way at the moment.

[fierce lark]

ability strength is not super impactful, the damage increase to regulators is additive with other damage sources like galv shot/cascadia flare

[midnight forum]

Does parkour velocity affect hildryn in her 4

[river palm]

yeah

so does movement speed

[midnight forum]

Wait for just moving in her 4 thats movent speed not parkour right

The parkour is the dashes

[fierce lark]

parkour is dodging, movement speed is just movement

[gentle oasis]

is it still worth putting corrosive stack shards on lavos? Would i be better off with the extra toxin status damage?

I hear armor stripping isn't as good since the jade update

[celest thicket]

Does the clones from duplex bond proc archon stretch?

[mighty flare]

no

[gentle oasis]

no to which question 😅

[orchid pond]

guys im building my uriel rn, following this half nuke half weapon build, how do i change it to a full nuke build

[gentle oasis]

why are you running archon intensify?

oh, i just read his 2. I thought it only restored shields

[gentle oasis]

i don't run equilibrium, i use umbral intensify, and i run augur secrets and reach.

Also 5 red archon shards. 1 for duration and the rest for ability str and it nukes just about everything

[fierce lark]

change camisado to concentration, max your augmented, build 280 range and max duration

and aura to corrosive projection

blind rage + molt augmented gives 199% strength, that's enough to kill pretty much anything, beyond that all you care about is having the highest radius & longest duration brimstone

[orchid pond]

like this?

[orchid pond]

i only got 1 augmented

[orchid pond]

also dont have concentration

[mighty flare]

neither corrosive stacks or toxin dmg are good on lavos

[gentle oasis]

yeah neither has felt great 😅

I guess i could try ability dmg on enemies afflicted by corrosive

[coral crest]

On Lavos if you want to use his abilities properly, you can consider casting speed of at least 1-2 shards

Damage is dependent, but ability duration would also bump up your status duration

[vagrant anvil]

@fierce lark I re rolled and stopped at an cd heat fire rate riven and made blast electric on my daikyu now
On test the blast is absolutely funny with a over 100% status chance

[coral crest]

Extra corrosive stacks don't do much ever since Jade shadows

Ability dmg on enemies affected by status might be somewhat usable, because it would reduce the amount of priming you do and most ability dmg shards are covered by his rotation or your other priming tools, but you're looking at like 30-45% increase over 100% more from an extra status

@gentle oasis

[mighty flare]

ability dmg is a bit meh too, caster lavos just needs statuses
usual thing is casting speed, duration, and parkour velocity

[coral crest]

Yeah, if you have caster lavos all you might really need is prec intensify and even that is under question

In case of persistence you might consider archon intensify or just triumbral

[near vortex]

can always slot valence

[coral crest]

His overall str becomes marginally more useful with persistence since it improves healing of his 1 drastically

[gentle oasis]

yeah i have prec intensify and i'm running arcane persistence. i have 2 tau blue and a tau yellow. I just have 2 extra slots left.

I might just make a tau green and put it in saryn, then

i'll put some reds on lavos, ig

[coral crest]

You only need 1 tau blue for armor, I think?

[gentle oasis]

i need 2 to get above 1400

[coral crest]

For what?

[gentle oasis]

so that if i get a heat proc, it doesn't turn off persistence

[coral crest]

You are playing Lavos

Do you even know what his passive is

[gentle oasis]

actually no 🙃

i thought it was just the status applying thing

[near vortex]

Passive gives status immunity for picking up energy orbs

[coral crest]

... he eats an energy/universal orb and it gives him 10s of status immunity

[gentle oasis]

does that remove statuses on me if i have them already?

[coral crest]

He consumes one orb per 5 seconds so you have a 5s grace period

You convert health orbs into universal with his 3

You will basically always have full status immunity

[coral crest]

Yes

[gentle oasis]

maybe i suck, but before i put that 2nd blue on i was dying a lot more 😅

I'll give it another shot now that i'm more used to his kit

[cinder thistle]

Arcane Expertise on Styanax is nice guys. Primed redirection, Boreal's Hatred, then maximize Abi Strength and you get around 200% CC at max overshields. Slide Augur Stretch + Augur Strenght. Then you protect it with the Overguard and you are a walking Crit chance riven.

Let's hope they go crazy with the base shields on Styanax Prime

[river palm]

breaking news, shield arcane increases shields

[cinder thistle]

Most people ignore passives or just disregard them... I've seen multiple people tell me Styanax passive "ain't that good" while Rhino just does a little shockwave when he lands from a certain height. And Styanax is one of the frames I see less in pubs.

[fathom sky]

Rhino having a worse passive doesn't make Styanax's any more impressive. It's a decent bonus but not one to focus on hard.

I don't give too much hope to Styanax Prime having a lot more base Shields because of the passive, unfortunately.

[cinder thistle]

I still don't understand that mentality. People will pay 2k plat to get 150% CC on a riven. Having a passive giving you 200% with everything is pretty neat imo.

[real belfry]

what's the best prime gun for status chance?

[lavish orbit]

I put epitaph high above for is simplicity

[fathom sky]

Because generally the Riven has other stats that would make it just strictly better than the mod it's replacing, even if getting a Riven for that expensive I think is still a big meme. Here you've gotta weight the benefits and drawbacks, though I don't personally care much about how you're building Styanax in this regard since it's not like his abilities don't want a decent amount of Strength regardless.

[cinder thistle]

Well I do personally think that the 4 should give Overguard without the augment if DE wants us to build for shields with the passive...but that could be said about a bunch of augments. But with Roar replacing the 1, you barely touch your 2, you keep the 3 up and all your squad is happy, and you keep spamming 4 to "Prime rooms" before entering them (because most SP enemies won't die from the 4), I still think his kit is pretty nice, considering the 200% CC passive

[fathom sky]

Yeah he's not really hurting for stats, especially when he drops Efficiency anyway

[cinder thistle]

If they make it that the 4 on the Prime does enough DMG to kill 98% of SP enemies..I'll be happy. Since status rework the 4 has been less powerful, because Slash, and I think a little increase on the overall DMG of it would be good.

[forest magnet]

Hey guys, just got Frost Prime.

Does anyone have some good builds for him?

[fierce lark]

nobody is paying 2k plat for a 150% cc riven

they're paying 2k plat for a riven with 150% cc and 150% cd and 150% ms and lower zoom

on a good gun

[cinder thistle]

It still doesn't change the core of the argument. If you don't have CC on the riven you are not going to pay that price. It also brings an additional CC additional boost to your loadout meaning that a...75% CC melee weapon using Duplicate could now be sitting near 100%. Or other similar effects.

So you could slot all the Crit chance mods/arcanes and still get the additional 200% which you could bring you to red Crits instead of orange

And that's without accounting for the double effect of the passive on Spearguns since Spearguns are meh

[fierce lark]

crit chance is the one stat that is like...widely accessible from multiple sources for everything except shotguns

[fathom sky]

Then at that point it becomes a matter of if you'd get more benefit out of slotting a different mod on your gun if you're getting that much CC out of your passive. You're kind of alluding to that by talking about a Riven that wouldn't have CC on but other stats, which that CC would then be made up for by the passive. It's not a simple yes/no thing.

[fierce lark]

it is still a good stat, but crit chance that is additive to your modded cc is nothing super crazy

[cinder thistle]

Ok but additional tiers still being an increase after red Crits. If you hit 400% instead of 300% it's another tier.

[fierce lark]

like everything else, crit chance gets relatively worse the more of it you have

[fathom sky]

Realistically you're not hitting those high of tiers on CC unless your name is Harrow, and if you're speccing that much into CC, you're losing damage from dropping other core mods.

[rocky aurora]

Only if you can reliably hit that next crit tier when shooting

If you have 401% cc, you have a 1% chance to hit the next crit tier

Not worth it if you're sacrificing something else to obtain that 1%

[cinder thistle]

I agree but most frames don't have that kind of output so I don't understand the "it ain't that good"

[rocky aurora]

Youll have to give an example, not many weapons can reach that high

[fierce lark]

100% crit chance is 100% more than 50%
150% is 50% more than 100
200% is 33% more than 150
250% is 25% more than 200
300% is 20% more than 250

etc etc etc

the relative value gets worse and worse the more of it you have

[rocky aurora]

Like, if you have to sacrifice fire rate for slightly more crit chance, well less fire rate = less dps

[cinder thistle]

But If your Crit DMG is 18x...even if it less..hitting the next tier is still gonna be better than slotting something else than Crit chance no ?

[rocky aurora]

Next crit tier is only 2x

[cinder thistle]

Crit DMG.

[rocky aurora]

Yes

Now you have to sacrifice something to obtain enough extra CC to reliably hit the next crit tier, if that

[fathom sky]

In that case yeah but most weapons don't even get half that normally.

[rocky aurora]

If we're still talking about ridiculously high cc

[fierce lark]

if your crit damage is 4x, and your crit chance is 100%, going up an entire crit tier would only double your damage. you'd go from guaranteed 4x damage crits to guaranteed 8x damage crits.

how many resources do you have to use to gain that entire extra 100% modded cc?

[cinder thistle]

Melee Doughty can bring a lot of weapons to 18x-ish but then I only melee with Kullervo so my argument is irrelevant. But in the case of...Eda..eta...circuit...well Styanax with that 18x melee doughty pumped weapon, is going to be pretty effective compared to other frames

[rocky aurora]

Just doesnt make sense to me, CC isn't the only stat that makes sense to boost

[fierce lark]

regardless of what your crit damage is, going up a crit tier from 100% to 200% is only doubling your damage

[rocky aurora]

Building a melee specifically for Doughty seems....subpar

Unless it's a puncture focused melee, i guess

[cinder thistle]

My Harmony build will disagree

[fierce lark]

even if your crit damage is 20x, if you go from 100% crit chance to 200% crit chance, then your crits go from doing 20x damage to doing 40x damage

either way, it's still only doing 2x what it was doing before

[rocky aurora]

Yes, let's take the obvious exception to the rule

Even then, harmony works better with afflictions in my experience

What other melee would use Doughty better than other arcanes?

[fierce lark]

none, including harmony lol

afflictions is just way better

[rocky aurora]

🤷‍♂️ exactly

[fathom sky]

I think Motovore?

Wait

[fierce lark]

pretty sure slash motovore is still better

[cinder thistle]

I have it on...Sydon...Coda motovore..

Brb

[fathom sky]

Apparently Anku?

But that's Anku.

[fierce lark]

actually it looks like impact motovore is the common build

[mental ermine]

Pretty fun wisp build i came up with

[cinder thistle]

Yeah I don't common build since I think that modding should be heavily influenced by playstyle/frame and content

[fierce lark]

lmao this is funny

rending strike + collision force with exposure

[mental ermine]

Diriga with helstrum is getting me the hot shot procs

[rocky aurora]

Yes, so Doughty already is a niche arcane used on weapons that aren't really used often

Maybe if Influence didnt exist, we'd see it more

[fathom sky]

Well yeah.

It's just that most weapons have nothing special about them that would make you build them differently even factoring in that, nor do most frames care in the first place.

[fierce lark]

warframe builds are personalized

weapon builds are much less so

there is an objective reality to weapon performance

[fathom sky]

The only frames I remember that actually care about the weapons you use are stuff like Kullervo, Mag and Zephyr

[cinder thistle]

Initial talk was about Styanax and his passive getting more juice from the new arcane, thus resulting in a better Styanax

[rocky aurora]

All frames dont really care about what weapon youre using if you have insert incarnon here

[fathom sky]

In most cases that wouldn't change how you build the weapon minus maybe dropping the CC mod on your guns for something else.

[fierce lark]

someone responded to that with “and water is wet” idk where it went from there

[cinder thistle]

About 75% of the weapons that couldn't reach decent SP viability can with this extra 200% CC

[fathom sky]

Some examples?

[rocky aurora]

I can make a non-inc mk1 braton reliably kill SP enemies, your statement doesn't really mean anything

[fierce lark]

but yeah in the most reasonable sense of building into his passive you’re looking at like 5k ish shields before overshield, that’s basically adding pistol gambit to your weapon

[cinder thistle]

Well most melee that were sitting at 50-75% CC you wanted to use Duplicate on ?

[rocky aurora]

Nah, the BiS right now for most is Influence

[cinder thistle]

You are now at 100-110 instead of 75% which means a HUGE increase on performance

[jovial lion]

any shard suggestion for my lavos?? im gonna add an armor one for persistence but besides those idk

[river palm]

duration does lavos very well

[rocky aurora]

Cowbarfluence on any melee regardless of frame deals with at least early SP

[jovial lion]

hmm maybe 2 cast, 2 duration, 1 armor

[fierce lark]

reminder that his passive gives you modded cc, not final cc

if your weapon has a base crit of 24%, styanax is adding like 29% with his passive assuming you have primed redirect and ~350% strength with expertise

[fathom sky]

I'd say that's a really weird number to get from having Sac Steel modded on. And unfortunately Influence would likely just be better

[fierce lark]

that’s nice but nothing crazy

[river palm]

that's basically what i have on mine, except i have 3 duration instead of an armor

[cinder thistle]

Bro if I wanted to slot the same arcane on 400 different melee weapons...what's the point of playing the game ? "You should slot Influence"...like ew. If I can other stuff viable without influence let's goooo

[rocky aurora]

I didn't say you should

Youre quoting Casper bro lol

[cinder thistle]

Sac steel is additional not absolute..

[fathom sky]

If you mean additive, so is Styanax's passive.

[rocky aurora]

Valkyr claws and Garuda talons are just 2 examples that dont need Influence

[fathom sky]

If it was absolute then it'd definitely be a shoe-in

[cinder thistle]

Yeah but I never said to NOT USE the CC you have available in favor of Styanax passive...I said to ADD it to what you had

[fierce lark]

not using cc and using styanax’s passive would be the ideal way TO use it, if you can use the slot for something better

[river palm]

styanax's passive really shines when you're trying to make a speargun shred

[fierce lark]

you use external buffs to replace, not to add

[cinder thistle]

You can't. The next tier of CC will always be better unless your initial build was doodoo

[fierce lark]

did you miss the entire example earlier

[rocky aurora]

Next tier of CC is not always better, no

[fierce lark]

going up a crit tier is only adding damage relative to the previous tier, regardless of what your crit damage is

[cinder thistle]

I'm using Tenet Ferox and it's sadly not that great even with 400% extra CC. Maybe Javlok is better but I didn't go there.

[fathom sky]

The spearguns got shafted for no reason

[rocky aurora]

Well yea, the ferox just sucks lol

[river palm]

try scourge prime with debilitate

[cinder thistle]

Ok but that what mod would you replace the CC mod with that would be better than an additional Crit tier

[fierce lark]

bane, elementalist, punch through if the gun doesn’t have aoe

[rocky aurora]

Fire rate

[fierce lark]

no crit mod is gaining you an entire crit tier btw, except galv scope on some very high base cc weapons

[rocky aurora]

Latron inc would probably get there, but even then barely

[fierce lark]

or like crit delay on the burston and some bows/snipers

maybe some other guns

[sullen python]

cunning drift or power drift? (+15% range or strength)

[fierce lark]

gun needs 50% base crit chance to gain a crit tier from critical delay

cunning but im very range pilled on gara

strength is additive to base melee damage

[rocky aurora]

Personally I go range

Oh that's another weapon that doesn't need influence to deal ludicrous damage, Gara's whip

[cinder thistle]

Ok but let's say that instead of 210...you are at...250. You are still hitting way more reds than orange than before.

[sullen python]

ty guys

[rocky aurora]

What weapon is that, though?

Just because somethijg is red critting doesnt necessarily mean it's doing more damage

[cinder thistle]

I'm talking about an "overall build". Endgame is ETA/EDA and Circuit. This means that you want to have the best "frame" that can boost the "most" weapons

[fierce lark]

EDA/ETA doesn’t let you pick the frame you want most of the time lol

[rocky aurora]

Just pick stuff like Hildryn, mesa, or Garuda and you dont have to worry about your weapons

[cinder thistle]

That's not the conversation right now. I know you get 3 picks out of...what...60 frames ?

[rocky aurora]

If you have 60 in your inventory

[floral sky]

Is this a good riven

[rocky aurora]

No

[fierce lark]

no

[cinder thistle]

You have picks that you don't own...

[rocky aurora]

Yes, and 1 of the 3 is something you do own

And unless you want the 50 vosfor or extra peely pix, you have 1 flex slot for anything

[cinder thistle]

I know that don't worry, that still doesn't change the initial weight of the argument

[rocky aurora]

Sure it does

You only need to build a good handful of frames and toss the rest, or build 1 or 2 frames that are not effected by 99% of the modifiers and use your flex slot to use 1 of the 2

[cinder thistle]

Who wants to cheese everything with Dante every week ? It comes back to my argument to say "why even play the game then'.

[rocky aurora]

I never mentioned dante

[rocky aurora]

.

And those arent the only ones

[cinder thistle]

Because you can use Dante to cheese every week...and never care about anything else...

[rocky aurora]

He'd be one of the choices, yes

Except when the only thing he can do is give overguard and not anything else when a mission requires heavy guns

Which exalted weapons are not effected by

Excal would even be a good pick there 😆

Not nearly as good as mesa or hildryn though

[cinder thistle]

Ok but isn't the channel builds discussion ? Like, do you really want 4 builds and it's GG ?

[fierce lark]

this is what my current burston prime build does to an armor capped corrupted heavy gunner (no strip, no buffs, body shots, stacked mods)

this is what it would do if i put it on a 5k shield styanax

[fathom sky]

I'm trying to look through an example, and got one with Burston Incarnon. Assuming you put Crit Delay on it (ignoring the FR decrease because the relative DPS between each other wouldn't change), if the mod you add in would multiply your damage by less than 1.5, then you would replace your CC mod for that mod.

[fierce lark]

the crit chance goes from 310% to about 360%, resulting in a dps gain of around 15%

[fathom sky]

So something like Primed Bane or Primed Shred would definitely be slotted over Crit Delay in that case if you were to utilize Styanax's passive, assuming the passive is also giving you 200%. (Assuming they're not already slotted in and assuming that they're the first mod of their respective stat being slotted in)

[rocky aurora]

What are you even saying?

We're talking about builds

In the builds discussion channel

[cinder thistle]

I'm saying that elitism of builds brought this kind of mentality where "look if you ain't using those 4 weapons out of 700 of them you suck" is kinda of...not good for a game where my Verglas can solo SP enemies

[rocky aurora]

Im not saying that lmao

Idk who youre talking to

[cinder thistle]

I think theyre are waaaaayyyy more viable builds than what the "meta is saying"

So saying "well other frame have better passive" is kinda eh

[rocky aurora]

Who are you quoting??

[fathom sky]

In the reverse saying other frames have a worse passive is eh. I'm just here trying to show the math out for it.

[rocky aurora]

I genuinely think youre talking with someone in a different channel lmao

And just replying here

No one has stated meta or that a different frame has a better passive, afaik

I even listed weapons that perform great without influence, without mentioning any slam weapons

Also it's ironic you mentioned the Verglas when talking about meta..

Verglas is the meta

[cinder thistle]

Sealskin was the one who initially went against my Styanax message by saying that Rhino having a worst passive doesn't make Styanax passive more impressive

It's the whole convo

[rocky aurora]

It's definitely not when we've been discussing crit chance for the past 20 minutes

Also

[cinder thistle]

And Rhino slams the ground for crap DMG ? And a BS knockdown effect depending on height ?

[rocky aurora]

Rhino having a worse passive is, to be honest, a fair statement

[cinder thistle]

It's 10000% the topic. If you move the goal post it's on you

[fierce lark]

he was right though

just because rhino's passive is nonexistent doesn't mean styanax's passive is amazing

by comparison it is, sure, a free-ish 130-140% crit mod isn't terrible by any means

but rhino's non-helminth roar does more by itself than styanax's entire kit

by like...magnitudes

[cinder thistle]

We aren't talking about which frame is better than the other, we are talking about PASSIVES

[rocky aurora]

Youre the one moving the goal post. The discussion was about Styanax passive adding crit chance and crit tiers. You were crying about it for the past 20 minutes.

Dont then say im moving the goal post when you bring up a rhino passive statement after you have no more input into our retorts

[cinder thistle]

Otherwise I'll start accounting for all that Overguard I'm giving to squadmates instead of Rhino

[fierce lark]

im ngl, if i have to pick between overguard or 270% double-dipping faction damage multiplier...

[rocky aurora]

If you're good at shield gating, id rather have the roar

[fierce lark]

not even shield gating anymore tbh, i moved all of my shieldgate frames to circumvent

i get my own overguard now 💯

[rocky aurora]

I can just slap revenant on and have my rhino super juice their roar

[cinder thistle]

I have Roar on Styanax and again...this aint about which frame is better otherwise everyone will only play Rhino lmfao

Unless they play solo

[fierce lark]

i meannnn there's a reason revenant was so popular last year

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[rocky aurora]

There's so many frames that can do more than rhino

[cinder thistle]

Noobs not being able to survive without the invincibility?

[rocky aurora]

Yea, actually

[fierce lark]

no, just people realizing revenant is the easiest means to the end they're trying to achieve

[rocky aurora]

Wow I agreed with you, I think this is a lesson

[cinder thistle]

Nobody can give a 400% boost to DMG and abilities that applies like a faction buff to the whole squad. That's 1600% DMG increase lmfao

And it's exponational if you have other frames that would benefit from it

[fierce lark]

it's not that they "need" the invincibility, though im sure that is true for some people

it's that there's a frame that can complete the content they're trying to do in nearly the same efficiency as any other frame, while being completely unkillable while doing so, seems pretty chill

[cinder thistle]

Multiplicative, absolute boost. No one does that

[rocky aurora]

Can rhino give overguard to the squad? No

Can rhino give crit vulnerability, damage vulnerability, tile-set wide % hp nukes?

Can rhino give fire rate/attack speed buffs, health buffs etc

[cinder thistle]

Enemies should never touch you if you do enough DMG. Rule number one of survival in WF

[fierce lark]

the reason rhino isn't more popular is because any other frame in the game can take his strongest ability

a weaker version mind you, but still, he is not special for having roar, his roar is simply stronger

[rocky aurora]

It's funny youre saying this now after you crying about meta play earlier

[glass lichen]

What do u think of this build?

[fierce lark]

i agree with you, but then why do we care about intrepid stand

[cinder thistle]

I never did you can screenshot if you want. I also don't think Rhino is "meta" since most elitist will put him D-tier because he's easily available lol

[rocky aurora]

Idk man

[fierce lark]

drop viral heat for serration stormbringer & a fire rate mod, get critical delay instead of point strike, and it basically looks the same as mine minus the arcane

[cinder thistle]

No Rhino mention in that

[rocky aurora]

You are so obnoxious

Youve been rage baiting us this whole time havent you

[fierce lark]

isn't rhino prime vaulted rn and not in the current prime resurgence?

[rocky aurora]

I dont believe youre not rage baiting

[rocky aurora]

Correct

[cinder thistle]

36% usage Rhino, 18% Styanax in second place. No ragebaiting

[rocky aurora]

Nah youre definitely rage baiting

[fathom sky]

Either you don't have enough CC that makes it worth removing your CC mod for, or it is and you remove the CC mod for something, really. That's mostly what the passive boils down to, regardless of the whole convo that's gone on.

[fierce lark]

how is he easily available then

"Rhino" the warframe you get from Jackal is MR and helminth fodder

Rhino Prime is not currently available without trading

[cinder thistle]

It makes about 200 weapons viable for Melee Duplicate but ok

[fierce lark]

melee duplicate is bad on 99% of weapons lol

[rocky aurora]

😆

[cinder thistle]

You are not gonna proc Melee Influence on those weapons anyway

[fierce lark]

and when i say "bad" i mean that almost every other cavia melee arcane is better, including exposure and afflictions

[cinder thistle]

Afflictions is doodoo when you one shot everything cmon

[fierce lark]

afflictions saryn is probably the strongest slam platform in the game

[rocky aurora]

You must be in non SP

[fierce lark]

and like it's so not close it's unhealthy

[rocky aurora]

This rage baiting has gone on too long

[cinder thistle]

Ive been in SP for years and 99% of the time I have most kills with highest DMG in squad...unless there's a Kullervo spamming Magistar slam

[fierce lark]

saryn with toxic lash (doubled dmg on melee hits btw) and afflictions with 4x toxin dmg shards is slamming things with guaranteed toxin procs that are ticking into the millions

if they don't die to the initial slam, they will die to the first toxin dmg tick

[rocky aurora]

Rage bait used to be believable

[fierce lark]

i would never want to slam on kullervo anyways lol

slamming is spending most of the time away from enemies, up in the air, out of range of recompense

[cinder thistle]

Ok sure, I ain't on here to debate I just shared a Styanax build and ppl got sour lol

[fierce lark]

thats how you die

[cinder thistle]

Die ? In Warframe ? With Kullervo ? Ok I'm out

[old marsh]

Valkyr Slam is more consistent. u maintain max bonus even at low density

[fierce lark]

vulcan blitz slamming with lash is the biggest funny

[floral sky]

Is this one any good just foe the crit damage

[fierce lark]

more crit damage than vital sense, free cold

unfortunately i dont think dread wants cold

unless blast dread is a thing?

[old marsh]

pre-augment every Kullervo died.

[cinder thistle]

"if you ain't using the 4 frames out of 60 with the 4 weapons our of 700 you suck" is basically what you guys are saying

[cinder thistle]

The 2 gives Overguard, you need to watch some YouTube videos my guy

[fierce lark]

in what universe is anyone saying this

[rocky aurora]

Crying about meta again

[floral sky]

Yh kinda annoying om not getting much luck tryna make some plat 😂 dont rlly know what guns ppl use tho

[rocky aurora]

You really must never touch anything beyond lvl 100

[cinder thistle]

Im in every Omnia Cascade fissure

[rocky aurora]

😆

[fathom sky]

The sweet spot for Duplicate would be somewhere around 17-20 base CC, assuming Max Rank Blood Rush along with the passive, and a lot of those weapons I wouldn't deem incredibly impressive with or without access to Duplicate anyway. Even then, a lot of those weapons like Kogake Prime have absolutely amazing Status Chance, so blanket statement-ing them with "They wouldn't run Influence" is disingenuous.

I've been chill this entire time and already prefaced this entire convo with "Yeah it's not that big of a deal since Styanax probably has some slots to free up for being comfy anyway"

[old marsh]

and yet u still died. looks someone didnt play Kullervo at launch.

only a year later it was fixed lol

[fierce lark]

the 2 without the augment is just a damage button that either damages an enemy and gives you overguard, or damages you if nothing is in range

[old marsh]

kids these days thinking they actually know Kullervo

[fierce lark]

you didn't just press a button and gain 30 seconds of immortality lol

[old marsh]

anyways. he goated now so its cool. cant wait for his prime

[fierce lark]

im scared when his prime does come he's gonna catch nerfs

[old marsh]

tbh Gyre was busted beyond belief and they kept her as is. KP will be fine

I am more worried about Nokko Prime

[sage idol]

which should I pick here?

[old marsh]

https://tenor.com/view/mcmahon-crying-he-was-special-wwe-vince-mcmahon-gif-13313547165599993551

not worth it. low dispo

[fierce lark]

i love my 3 augment frames

[old marsh]

unless u can roll 3 elements on it and use it as a primer

[fierce lark]

fr sc cold would be great for a primer if it didn't have -dtg

[old marsh]

tbh u can swap Adp with RG. pairs well with Circumvent

[fierce lark]

but now if you shoot a grineer with it you get heat unherit

[old marsh]

https://tenor.com/view/dark-souls-roll-confuse-gif-11695636

[fierce lark]

i thought about rolling vs adaptation but in my head adapt works with RR on the stolen overguard

or on stolen overshields

[vocal vector]

what would yall put on a kuva shieldeg?

[old marsh]

RR? or DR?

[fierce lark]

reverse rotorswell

the damage redirected is also DR

[old marsh]

https://tenor.com/view/the-simpsons-homer-simpson-oh-okay-bush-hide-gif-17408797

[fierce lark]

which is like 74% once molt is stacked

[old marsh]

Tox for slam. Electric for light spam,

[fierce lark]

nothing cause it sucks tbh

would level it for mr and let it fester

[old marsh]

can go heat and use primed fever strike to make it gas. upto u

[vocal vector]

something like this?

[old marsh]

oh. thought u wanted to know proj. sure this works. be mindful it will be slow before every berserker stack

[vocal vector]

I assume electric progenitor, right?

[fierce lark]

underframe spotted

[vocal vector]

they need to switch names cuz underframe is over overframe 🔥

im a mfkin poet

shakespear copied my work in school 🔥

[fierce lark]

following random builds and old outdated popularity contest tier list garbage slop ❌

caculators ✅

[vocal vector]

this should be fine for base sp, right? I dont rly use melee so I have no idea about them, I dont have a single one properly modded

I only want one for like melee calendar challenges n stuff

[fierce lark]

this is slopfluence 12x standard

with discipline's merit in the exilus slot

or some flavor of tennokai

[vocal vector]

I dont like tennokai

I wouldnt use it, just a waste of forma

[fierce lark]

up to you then, your output will suffer a lot without it though

[vocal vector]

why?

[cinder thistle]

I don't have the augment, the Overguard always kept me alive, because Kullervo can one hit kill everything in game 2 hours in without any brain power. Like if you die with Kullervo go play something else 😂😭

[vocal vector]

isnt that just one heavy attack occasionally?

[fierce lark]

a free heavy attack every 4 hits at 12x combo that's max speed and doesn't consume combo counter

is ludicrous amounts of damage

[vocal vector]

okay which tennokai mod then 🧍‍♀️

[fierce lark]

here's the tough part xd

[spiral chasm]

one of the gold ones

[fierce lark]

the one you want is discipline's merit, but that one is usually 70p+

[spiral chasm]

personally just buy bundle

[fierce lark]

buying the bundle and then selling all of the ones that aren't merit will probably cost you around 50p if you get them all sold

[spiral chasm]

i saw the drop rate and bought the bundle day 1

[fierce lark]

there's no nice way to say this, not using volatile recompense on kullervo is just dumb

if you're trying to prove a point to yourself then fair enough, but you've lost everyone there

[vocal vector]

is dps calculation looking awful just part of every melee? kinda every melee looks 💩 dps wise without everythign stacked up

[spiral chasm]

yeah u need combo for melee to be good

[wicked scaffold]

isnt volatile recompense the overguard one

[spiral chasm]

thats why tennokai good

[fierce lark]

a large majority of your damage comes from mods that scale off of your combo counter

[spiral chasm]

dont lose combo on heavy

[vocal vector]

so using melees for only a few enemies isnt worth it?

[wicked scaffold]

as kullervo, no not really youre a melee focused frame

[fierce lark]

reconpense is his 2, that gives you overguard when it does damage

volatile recompense is an augment that makes his 2 a buff, the daggers circle around him and deal damage constantly, giving him constant overguard while it's active

[wicked scaffold]

yeahyeah that ones crazy good

[spiral chasm]

not really no

[fierce lark]

no, 12x melee builds require you to be meleeing all the time to be good

if you want a melee to occasionally use, you need a heavy spam or slam build

[spiral chasm]

unless its a tanky unit

[quiet laurel]

or okina

[fierce lark]

or whatever okina does

[vocal vector]

it seems like every good mod depends on combo

[fierce lark]

not at all

[vocal vector]

the non combo ones barely give anything

[quiet laurel]

okina halts combo counter when you dont use it

[fierce lark]

some of the strongest melee weapons are heavy spam/slam/glaives

[spiral chasm]

i used to run naramon when i did a lot of melee

[vocal vector]

didnt they kill slam builds tho?

[fierce lark]

harmony, a bunch of glaives, magistar, arca titron, coda mire

hell no LMAO

[quiet laurel]

not at all

[vocal vector]

you need to be higher for it to do full damage now, no?

[quiet laurel]

no

[wicked scaffold]

im a little bit of a slopfluence user so ive never experimented with the heavy spam/slams unless you count hate

[spiral chasm]

not kill but did nerf it

[quiet laurel]

damage wasnt touched

[fierce lark]

it was but not in that sense

[quiet laurel]

you now just need to jump for slam spam

[vocal vector]

is heavy or light slam used usually?

[spiral chasm]

dmg is nerfed tho cuz nira isnt multiplicative anymore

[fierce lark]

they made nira's mods on warframes stop being multiplicative slam modifiers, and now the radius of the slam scales with distance

[spiral chasm]

thats 4x or msht less dmg

[vocal vector]

so they only touched the radius?

[quiet laurel]

its multiplicative rn

[fierce lark]

always heavy slam

[quiet laurel]

before it applied to several multipliers

[spiral chasm]

didnt they nerf it to be additive to seismic?

[fierce lark]

oh wait yeah, nira's were multiplying to both the base melee damage and the slam damage

[vocal vector]

whats used for heavy slams usually

[fierce lark]

hammers, and the coda mire

[vocal vector]

I dont wanna constantly melee so might just make a slam build

[vocal vector]

can I just use the kuva shieldeg then?

[fierce lark]

magistar, sibear, arca titron, coda mire, coda motovore, anything else hammer-shapped

[quiet laurel]

its multiplicative still but now it acts as a seperate multiplier like eclipse

[fierce lark]

you could use the shildeg for slamming yes

[spiral chasm]

aaah i see

[fierce lark]

it has obnoxiously high base crit chance so it would scale pretty well with sac steel

[vocal vector]

still melee influence?

[spiral chasm]

nah slam has smth else

u have 2 routes. exposure with inital combo or if u wanna scale for long missions duplicate

[quiet laurel]

exposure is used for lvl cap

duplicate isnt used on slams at all

cause of how heavy attacks have 2x crit chance

[spiral chasm]

wha pretty sure duplicate scales a lot more

[vocal vector]

I just want to use it for base steel path mostly

[quiet laurel]

not even close

[spiral chasm]

oh wait

crescendo

i forgor the name my b

[quiet laurel]

crescendo is overkill nowadays

you can one shot basically anything by just going exposure reflex

[spiral chasm]

tbf i slam before my pet can even prime the targets but yeah exposure should be fine

[fierce lark]

crescendo is too hard to stack on slams without external help

[spiral chasm]

cuz i was looking to slam 1 shot with no prime and no strip

[fierce lark]

everything you slam dies

[vocal vector]

and I just use one ability before I wanna kill someone?

[spiral chasm]

and i had to go with crescendo to scale it

[fierce lark]

press an ability every 20 seconds or w/e it is, which if you're playing kullervo you're doing regardless

[quiet laurel]

for base SP there legit is no difference between crescendo and exposure

[spiral chasm]

yeah i was looking into cap thrax

[quiet laurel]

for cap you need a riv for consistent one shots with no strip no priming

[vocal vector]

im not playing kullervo tho?

I hate kullervo

[fierce lark]

press an ability every 20 seconds on whomever

[spiral chasm]

yeah i got riv for it

[vocal vector]

does the stance matter for slams?

[quiet laurel]

no

[vocal vector]

something like this? what else am I supposed to use?

[brittle iron]

is my caliban build good

[fierce lark]

no reach, no glad might

[fierce lark]

corrupt charge can be smite, if you can be bothered

blood rush is specific to magistar/crescendo builds

can also be smite, or spoiled strike

[vocal vector]

something like this then?

I dont fw faction mods

wait uhh, what element should the progenitor be anyways

[fierce lark]

regular organ shatter, drop reach for primed fever strike

progenitor should be toxin if you have primed fever strike

if not...im not sure it matters tbh?

[rocky aurora]

Galv steel with the stacked cd does more iirc

And whatever that rad mod is with hae

But I use glad might

[fierce lark]

slam builds might've changed a bit since i last played it

[rocky aurora]

Nah ive been using the same one since October 2024

[severe kettle]

Does anyone have a good SP or level cap Mesa Prime build?

[rocky aurora]

Just not corrupt charge or spoiled (rad mod woth hae and glad might) and then galv steel

[brittle iron]

what do i build for on chroma

[vocal vector]

dps seems to be almost exactly the same with sac steel and galv steel

[rocky aurora]

Because both will 1 shot anything below lvl 8000

This nitpick stuff only matters at cap tbh

[fierce lark]

sac steel should be better if you have literally anything giving you CD

including tenacious bond from companion

[vocal vector]

is it supposed to be pure corrosive? because toxin progenitor doesnt go into corrosive without an electric mod

[brittle iron]

whats tenacious bond

[fierce lark]

corrosive comes from melee exposure

[vocal vector]

so in that case it needs to be elec progenitor

right, but should it be both corrosive and toxin then?

this is the damage share on heavy slam with toxin progenitor

[fierce lark]

yes, exposure is just like a 240% corrosive mod

[rocky aurora]

This for maximum damage without riven

Exposure is way better for anything that is not an endurance mission

Glad might <-> rad mod w/ hae

[vocal vector]

this lookin good then?

[rocky aurora]

Even without nira mods that'll do fine for everything outside of long endurance like cascade lvl caps

Magistar slam is just goated like that

[vocal vector]

this is not magistar

this is kuva shieldeg

[rocky aurora]

.

I assumed based off this

Mb, oopsie

[fierce lark]

im using my magistar as an example for slam builds because it's the only slam weapon i have forma'd a bunch lol

[vocal vector]

why not pure corrosive tho? status chance is negligible and corro is better for general use due to grineers

[fierce lark]

if you want to install an elemental vice, feel free to do so and swap the element to pure corrosive when it applies

the reality of the matter is, it doesn't matter, everything you hit is going to die

[vocal vector]

I dont wanna change it around based on missions, I barely use melee, I just wanna have one to have one

[fierce lark]

the reason pure toxin is good for general use is because it allows you to ignore corpus shields

[vocal vector]

well with exposure its never pure toxini

[fierce lark]

yes it is

exposure doesn't combine or force elemental combinations

it's a separate non-combining corrosive damage bonus

same as saryn's 1 augment

[vocal vector]

its non combining yeah but its still part of the dmg

so it ends up being like half half

[fierce lark]

and? so is your modded toxin

it doesn't take away from your toxin damage, it just adds 240% corrosive on the side

[vocal vector]

wait nvm im dumb

toxins fine then ig

[mighty flare]

slam is double sacs or ppp + galv steel, you dont really mix

[vocal vector]

should I change anything still or is this fine then?

[fierce lark]

apparently sac pressur is better than ppp if you have it maxed and have mod space

[mighty flare]

what?

[rocky aurora]

But thats just more additive damage

[fierce lark]

responding to them with what you responded to me with

[mighty flare]

kk

[vocal vector]

double sacs does seem a little better numbers wise so gonna change to that then

also better to use than galvanized ig

[fierce lark]

huge pain in the ass to slot two 16 cost umbral mods

mitigated slightly by the kuva weapons' rank 40

[vocal vector]

nah 2 formas only

[drowsy pelican]

How do subsumes work on lavos if he doesn’t have an energy pool

[fierce lark]

they have a cooldown

[vocal vector]

for slams are you supposed to jump high or can you still just slam from like 3 cms high?

[wild rune]

radius scales based on fall distance

[vocal vector]

damage is the same regardless?

[fierce lark]

yep

[vocal vector]

Got it, just gonna make it as is then, thx for the help, appreciate it :33

[fierce lark]

if you have nira's mods for your warframe, equip them

or at the very least equip the exilus one

and if you have the Ready Steel aura you can equip that as well, IC is always good

[novel bear]

Can exalted melees get the set bonus from the whip mod if you have it equipped on your normal melee?

[languid oxide]

anyone know if using xoris+melee influence in index is faster than soloing with wukong?

was otherwise thing of excal umbra with tenet cycron

[dapper glen]

what is better to keep to excalibur umbra ?
radial howl or radial javelin ?

[mighty flare]

javelin has dmg boost augment, howl is blind
so usually javelin

[dapper glen]

• i use exalted so i can generate the blind from that skill

[mighty flare]

low health frames like shadow should use arcane blessing to properly benefit from persistence (its a bit weaker earlier but better in the end)
saves you slots and only needs 1 armor mod like carnis carapce

[pure reef]

got 2 questions on this evolution for the cestra that i cbf to test myself

• is it my defenses or an enemies?

• is it a flat 3x CD akin to arcane crepuscular

[viscid silo]

its not sec

sev*

that's shadow

[mighty flare]

i meant shadow, but yeah same thing for shadow

[viscid silo]

would the blessing remain when the shaodw is put up?

becasue my idea was to have as much energy upkeep as possible and get as much health back as possible with life strike and the 3

[mighty flare]

maybe? haven't tried but needing 3 slots for +1,000k health is very poor for persistence

[viscid silo]

its also for the extra str and armor

and then like i said i can upkeep health through the health gate

[mighty flare]

high strength is not that important

[viscid silo]

it makes the enemy debuff on the 3 much stronger

[mighty flare]

you dont need a super strong 3 for shadow

[viscid silo]

like im not sure what you are saying is the issue here when all youve suggested is a b- tier arcane (that i cant even guarentee wil work) in place of something that could make my attacks more potent

[mighty flare]

blessing works

just tried it rn

besides having the stats & healing for persistence, you also need a status cleanse or immunity
using stuff like blessing allows you to fit mods like carnis / rg which are needed unless you have another method to give shadow status immunity

[pure reef]

which one should i pick ??

[undone dust]

you would assume the one with higher numbers

[twilit crest]

but the one on the left is called vexicron

[quiet laurel]

https://tenor.com/view/patrick-s-patrick-patrick-star-bottle-dumb-gif-1741625486363070335

[fleet yacht]

Hiii can someone help me with an acceltra build?😢

[undone dust]

oh true!

[fleet yacht]

I have six form on it and a lot of mod but i dont know how to build it

[scenic echo]

Yep skin to arcane crep

And your shield

[scenic echo]

I gotchu

[jovial lion]

these always aply on the player not enemiies

[scenic echo]

This is what I did

Allows u to stack crit in close range

Let er rip in long range

I also have a riven for crit chance and damage

Which brings my dmg even higher

But realize not everyone got riven so swapped for crash course

Now if you want something a bit bigger boom with less crit

Swap out galvanized scope for fulmination (whatever the primary blast radius + mod is)

Basically treat acceltra as a rocket launcher, that just so happened to have a gattling gun attached to the back

But because they didn’t go to their doctor

The rockets r realll limp and just slap against a enemy if they’re too close

So u make them pointy again with crit

Poke an eye out with em

[quaint breach]

So I’ve got this Grendel build, however I’m currently split on whether to leave it as it is, or replace fiber with primed flow and put 2 tauforged armor shards (for arcane persistence). It does a great job at clearing out enemies up to level 400-500 in EDA (idk how high exactly they get up to), but I’m wondering if it’s worth it to change it out or to just keep it

[fierce lark]

with the amount of armor generated by Feast, especially if you slot Gourmand, i don't think you'll take enough damage for persistence to trigger, even in ETA

[quaint breach]

It’s happened a bit, not often it’s enough to one shot me but it does get me close sometimes so I’m just prepping in case that happens lol

[mighty flare]

grendel has status immunity from hearty nourishment which is necessary for magnetic or taking heat on an empty stomache

that would also reduce need of full triumbral

[quaint breach]

Oh I forgot to mention I’m using gastro so enemies don’t stay in me for long lol

[fierce lark]

gourmand lets you eat indefinitely, you can heal back the lost health with nourish, and the 2k armor combined with adaptation should make you tanky even at ETA levels, regurgitate does scaling health damage with gastro so you don't need a lot of strength either

[mighty flare]

yeah, but the status immunity from hearty nourishment will last which covers the empty stomache

[quaint breach]

Fair

[mighty flare]

persistence without status immunity/cleanse performs very poor

[quaint breach]

Welp now the issue is if I take out umbra fiber I now don’t have the armor needed for persistence 😭 and if I keep enemies in me I’m basically making my handheld nuke gastro useless

Might drop stretch or something else, just not sure what

[mighty flare]

grendel just needs 2 armor shards or 1 armor shard + the armor aura mod

[queen parcel]

two questions for sevagoth

is stength important? and what's the point of using the shadow form instead of jst styaing in sevagoth

[quaint breach]

What do I replace for primed flow? Currently I have 2 toxin damage shards 1 cast speed and 2 mana bonus

[mighty flare]

gastro grendel doesnt need toxin dmg

[quaint breach]

You sure? His 4 still does toxin damage

Then again I just had my world rocked like pop rocks so idk anymore

[mighty flare]

grendel provides max viral and full armor strip
the ability dmg isn't necessary

also iirc gastro does max gas too, so ur fine

[quaint breach]

I’m gonna do some testing rq but I’ll try that, thx

[mighty flare]

i ran this with 2 armor shards if you want another reference
you can swap round like running

• swap in armor aura --> drop 1 armor shard
• replace flow with 1-2 max energy shards
• replace vitality + flow for diumbral (if using max energy shards) --> replace molt for bellicose

[fierce lark]

gas damage + status that scales with the max hp of the enemy you spit

[quaint breach]

Ok you’re right about the archon shard thing, I just did some testing

Sorry about doubting you, I just raised an eyebrow when I heard Grendel’s 4 doesn’t need toxin damage buffs with gastro

[scenic echo]

strength is verrr important

[keen rover]

can zid an uskos proc heat status? i cant see any heat procs even at 250%

[quaint breach]

Strength increases the damage boost of his 2 and the damage of his 1 overall, also increases slow speed of his 3

[hexed lodge]

Strength is important but past a certain point is diminishing returns, Shadow is useful cause of its amazing 1 for grouping and 5s of survivability on demand.
Assuming we are talking about Sevagoth roar - 255% is the strength checkpoint for his nuke, but you can use a focus school to reach Gloom's slow cap at 272% str, and if you decide to subsume Roar over Gloom instead, Shadow's 3 starts the nuke chain-reaction for you saving you energy and, again, giving you 5s of invulnerability on demand.

[open sorrel]

what's the best shattered lash build for building damage on splinter storm

will this give me good damage gain for splinter storm?

having good damage from breaking mass vitrify would be good too

[burnt surge]

What’s a good build for steel path for hildryn prime?

[gaunt hamlet]

which one would be better? 👀

[fathom sky]

Left but neither are slottable

[acoustic bluff]

Left

Vro it’s self explanatory 😭

[fathom sky]

Nah not really because Nukor has no CC anyway

And you go Enervate if you want crit

[hexed lodge]

Yea if you're using Nukor for crits, you are not using additive crit chance mods

[fierce lark]

terrible terrible gun to roll rivens for

dispo is literally bare minimum

[pastel olive]

Which one should I choose?

[near vortex]

Is that supposed to be a question?

Left is dead, take right

[fathom sky]

-MS dead riven

[pastel olive]

Ok which stats are necessary?

[near vortex]

Crit Chance for tenacious bond

Otherwise I don't think it matters too much

[fathom sky]

+SC for primer, CD and MS are easy nabs

[pastel olive]

Ok ty

[open sorrel]

I don't really know how to make this do what I want it to, I want to press 4 then press 2 and then 1 and become a blender

it works on a lot of things but I hit a wall pretty early on

[timber ocean]

do i replace anythinjg on here for primed pistol gambit

[sick remnant]

anyone a mushroom guy build

[untold moss]

Do you get the bonus from archon intensify with chroma's heat version of elemental ward?

[queen parcel]

what about duration?

[fierce lark]

i dont believe so

but you can run the guardian armor augment with combat discipline, would give you a means to keep archon intensify up permanently and enable arcane avenger

i don't think it's particularly good, but it's a thing you can do

[untold moss]

so you're saying that it does activate but only on heal

honestly I just want it to activate

I might try it with combat

[fierce lark]

yeah, iirc there might be some things which give you health which do count as healing for the sake of aint, but i don't know exactly what

[wraith sinew]

Just got ignis wraith, how do I build

[untold moss]

alr thanks

[fierce lark]

serration, shoot some enemies (or just let people in multiplayer kill things) until it's level 30, then sell it

[hexed lodge]

It depends if you are running Roar or not, and if so, on slot 3 or 4?

[karmic badger]

You need like Primary Debilitate and a weapon platform to make the Ignis Wraith actually viable for anything above level 60 lmao

[untold moss]

just tested it does not work 😭😭😭

[queen parcel]

i'm not running roar

[hexed lodge]

Then any duration is fine, the more the better but 130%-155% is good enough too, mainly to upkeep gloom's drain and keep 1's buff up

[wraith sinew]

Does it sell for a good amount

[fierce lark]

idk probably like 5k credits lol

it's just not a very good weapon

[wraith sinew]

But

Flamethrower

[karmic badger]

Temple is better

[wraith sinew]

Okay

[fierce lark]

flamethrower with...not even mediocre, kinda just bad stats

[karmic badger]

Hell the Atomos is better even since it has an incarnon adapter

The flamethrower amp is arguably better even, now that we have Tektolyst arcanes

[untold moss]

I tried using hunter's adrenaline + combat discipline + archon intensify. Idk if I'm doing it wrong, but seems like there's no synergy between the 3

[karmic badger]

Fairly sure hunter adrenaline specifically doesn't work with self damage

[untold moss]

the healing effect of elemental ward does not activate on self damage too it seems

welp there goes my hopes and dreams

[unborn light]

what should i subsume over my oraxias 1?

[novel bear]

Wisp is the only one I think

[fierce lark]

healing mote was the only thing i could think of

[hexed lodge]

Wait what? not sure if i kept track correctly, but i don't ever recall heat elemental ward being able to "heal"

[novel bear]

It increases max health

For vitality motes, that triggers archon intensify

Every other max health increase doesn’t

[untold moss]

oh ffs I thought it healed that's why my dumbahhh mb

[hexed lodge]

yea i thought so too lol

[untold moss]

like regen :/

[fierce lark]

na wisp is just randomly the exception rather than the rule

[karmic badger]

Probably spaghetti jank of her mote raising max hp and applying a healing effect

[jovial lion]

idk if its worth keeping flow and forma the aura

or i could remove flow and add something else instead

[proud summit]

am i cooking or am i washed

[fierce lark]

go back to anime horse racing

kidding

[sinful lagoon]

Don’t have a lot of plat only around 100 but I really need some of these remaining mods to finish the build, How much play would it cost for these mods for a panzer build, wanna make a build for it but just have limited plat, I have viral quips synth deconstruct, enhanced vitality and fetch wanna know how much for the rest

[proud summit]

honestly fair counter

im not working with a ton on the base anyways

[karmic badger]

No chromatic blade sadge

[proud summit]

ah yeah, need a reactor to progress the syndicate

dont have enough creds lmao

for nightwave

[fierce lark]

so basically

other than getting chromatic blade and running blue emissive

[karmic badger]

INFLUENCE SLOP

[proud summit]

this is actually pretty helpful ngl

looks like i gotta get to steel path then

so i can grind galvanized

[karmic badger]

Nah galvanized mods are from arbitrations

Slightly easier

[fierce lark]

just about every single melee weapon in the game that wants to press light attack runs the same build, with very minor optional adjustments depending on external factors like buffs/arcanes/shards

[proud summit]

oh? then looks like i can continue to procastinante on getting to steel path, not like i would be ready for it lmao

[fierce lark]

you have to get to steel path to unlock arbis, they both come from starchart completion

[proud summit]

looks like i cant procrastinate then

[fierce lark]

but yeah arbitrations are significantly easier than sp

[proud summit]

suprised viral isnt used

why is that, I thought it was the peak element combo

[fierce lark]

viral messes with the electricity weighting

[karmic badger]

Plus plenty of options for external viral priming

[proud summit]

huh, odd. gonna assume this is a subtle game design thing, and just run the exalted umbra sword as electric then

[fierce lark]

12x melee weapons built right with influence do so much damage on their own that they don't need viral to kill things, you just want as much electricity status chance as you can fit to maximize influence procs

[proud summit]

yeah, i got a lex prime i can kit out for viral, just need to source a spare potato and maybe craft some more forma

[karmic badger]

A lex isn't the best choice for priming.. Its a crit weapon

[fierce lark]

lex is a slow firing handcannon, not a primer

[karmic badger]

Companions like sentinels or a panzer would probably be easier

[proud summit]

oh

[karmic badger]

Of course there's the Kompressa and Epitaph

[proud summit]

i do have a braton prime on in the wings as well

[fierce lark]

if you really do want to prime for melee, use the diriga companion with tazicor or the cedo prime

[proud summit]

just missing a cell for it

also just read melee influence, so if i proc electricitys stun on one guy, it can spread to other nerds in the area? seems... kinda cracked'

[fierce lark]

cedo i think is the single best primer in the game, shoots an aoe homing glaive that targets a bunch of enemies, carries your statuses and status chance, and also has a 50% chance per hit to proc an additional random base status

[karmic badger]

Pretty much, it solves the fundamental weakness of melees, a lack of aoe

[fierce lark]

and you can run debilitate on it so that your viral procs will proc an additional toxin/electric status for more condition overload damage

[proud summit]

its MR 8 this is pretty easy to get my hands on

[karmic badger]

Hence the predominant melee setup of either slam builds or influence

[fierce lark]

or radiation or magnetic from those mods if you run them

[proud summit]

man looks like i need to grind a ton

gonna need a few more potatoes

plus syndicate grinding

[viral crown]

What’s stronger 214% subsumed roar OR a maxed primed faction mod

[kind tendon]

Preferably both. Outside of that, I lean towards roar more than faction mods.

[viral crown]

Me too so then I don’t have to constantly switch the mods around

[kind tendon]

Roar should be getting you around 63-64% at that power strength. Universal buff as well so mods are less concerning as you mentioned

[fierce lark]

214% subsumed roar is a 69% or something faction damage multiplier, primed faction mod is 55%