lore-discussion

[twin wigeon]

Kuva is rumored (i think) to be the blood of orokin saints (i say rumored ofc) but kuva is basically a blood like substance

[restive river]

The kuva liches continuity into new bodies if you kill them
And are generally just given kuva

[restive river]

That’s a myth that Teshin mentions lol

It literally can not actually be that lol

[twin wigeon]

yeah ofc its a questionable rumor, theres no such thing as a orokin saint

[restive river]

Some things point to there maybe were some. Better Orokin
But I really doubt it lol

[wise quiver]

It is said that the orokin had kuva before void travel, which one would assume that means before Entrati did his void experiments.

[restive river]

Even during the radiation wars when they had to continuity people just so they could keep going lol

[twin wigeon]

yep

[restive river]

Yes long before
Albrecht did continuity lol

After his void expedition he never did it again

[wise quiver]

He gave it up after his void bell thing though.

[twin wigeon]

Void energy existed before we had access to void travels and void jumps and shi

[restive river]

No?

The void was useless til Albrecht fell in

[wise quiver]

It existed enough to draw interest, and Albrecht fell in and got the finger and set up the heart.

[restive river]

Due to him being scared of being wally
(Which he isn’t)

[restive river]

Yes the void existed, not the energy lol

[strange turtle]

Theres nothing that specifically indicates anything but it’s more likely augmentation since the only people we’ve known to last that long are Darvo (and through him other Corpus), the Orokin and Teshin, and the Orokin were very strict about gene stuff and social hierarchy

[twin wigeon]

hm... oh wait the kuva doesnt have void energy in it, it just transfers void derived consciousness
yk maybe i ought to stop larping rn

[restive river]

“The wasted years had all shown the Void to be just that. Nothing. No energy. No entanglement. No form. To space-faring ambitions, a dead end.”

[restive river]

It has the void derived ability to conduct consciousness.

When energized it’s more effective

[twin wigeon]

<--- professional larper (smh)

[restive river]

3. What is 'kuva'?

A. Fluid with Void-derived capacity to conduct consciousness (correct)

[twin wigeon]

i love kuva sm and i cant even get the description of the gambling liquid right

[restive river]

lol

[wise quiver]

To be fair, there's like...a lot of descriptions of what it might be.

[twin wigeon]

all i know is that its fuel for my gambling addiction

[restive river]

Wdym lol

Cause Teshin’s is the only one that falls into that and that just
Was not true

[twin wigeon]

i mean we know what it does but we dont know whats its made of

[restive river]

The tablets exist to give more concrete lore and none of them have lied
It gives us the best description of Kuva

[wise quiver]

Grandmother and the story of dagath.

[restive river]

Or where it came from
Or when it was discovered
Or even everything it can do

[twin wigeon]

Neighframe

truly a Night-mare

[restive river]

Uh
Kuva isn’t mentioned there
Wdym lol

Grandmother has the bluva story, are you thinking of that?

[wise quiver]

was it not that?

[strange plinth]

grandmother has the bluva story but that's just as unclear as regular kuva

[twin wigeon]

whats uh bluva

[wise quiver]

The fact it's called "blue kuva" is also a big question

[restive river]

Bluva is just diet transference and we still don’t know if it’s like
Real real
The writers made it sound like it is but we have never seen it

[strange plinth]

blue kuva, temporary continuity rather than permanent

[twin wigeon]

so we have kuva, bluva, and temple kuva, any others

[wise quiver]

The question is if temple kuva is different.

[restive river]

“The silent girl brought them their blue kuva, so they could take on these twisted bodies for only a short time before returning to their own.”

[restive river]

Iirc it can heal sentients and allowed Unum to see through the eyes of the animals

So I’d say at least the second part def makes it different

[wise quiver]

The fact it heals sentients is massive

[restive river]

Also there is the theory that temple kuva is what is used for veils

Which is likely just
Never stated

The veils literally have Orokin tower pieces

[blissful merlin]

And they have that red particle effect

Orangeish red….

[strange plinth]

-# erra watching the temple kuva be used for veils instead of healing literally any sentients:

[restive river]

Which would be him
His sister
His dad
The eidolon

[wise quiver]

To be fair balas wouldn't heal the sentients, cause then he couldn't control them.

[restive river]

Grandma died ):

[wise quiver]

She been dead no?

[restive river]

Yes Praghasa has been dead

She sacrificed herself so that her family could get to the origin system as unscathed as possible
Which
They all have barren wombs ):

[twin wigeon]

Prahgasa been lobotomized to bring Hunhow and a lot of sentients to the origin system

now shes functionally just a ship

and ig headquarters for narmer but i dont think we actually know

[wise quiver]

Didn't we send it drifting into the sun?

[restive river]

Last we saw her she was by the sun so

And being heavily damaged

[wise quiver]

Because like...leaving something like praghasa, which has the ability to kill our sun just orbiting and still functional is...not smart.

[restive river]

I don’t think she’s that functional

[twin wigeon]

it might be orbiting the sun but its probably no longer a threat because Pazuul is not an idiot to resummon a void portal + he cant control praghasa to do so

[restive river]

And I also doubt anyone is gonna try that again lol

[wise quiver]

https://tenor.com/view/blank-stare-really-i-dont-believe-you-side-eye-looking-gif-6151149

[twin wigeon]

https://tenor.com/view/the-man-in-wall-warframe-gif-24269482

[restive river]

Destroying the sun is literally the stupidest decision ever, at most you could use that as a threat that you’d never actually use lol

[wise quiver]

Wally.

[restive river]

C’mon
It was Ballas lol

He was having a crashout lol

[wise quiver]

Wally would 10000% hijack someone and make them do that.

[strange turtle]

From the way it’s described it’s likely how she connects with the Quills

perpetuity. So she gave her followers some of her blood – her refined Temple Kuva – and they in turn gave it to the animals of the land, and the animals became and extension of her, and she became an extension of them. And the animals roamed, and searched. And they found where the Sentient chose to hide itself.

[4] Night in Cetus:
The Sentient sensed this subterfuge, and, capturing one of the Unum's animals, opened it up for examination. And what little of the Unum was present there… lit the Sentie

[restive river]

If Wally gains enough power to be in our timeline he ain’t gonna need that lol

[wise quiver]

Also, what ever Erra is now isn't exactly stable either.

[restive river]

Pazuul

[twin wigeon]

why would he even want to go to tau when its presumably only sentient forces there

[restive river]

The thing is it’s such an immensely stupid decision that nobody would do it but Ballas

[wise quiver]

It's less about going to tau and more about destroying the origin system.

[restive river]

I’m still unnerved at them still being radio silent over there-

[strange turtle]

That’s not him Pazuul’s just taken his body. He’s one of the archons

[restive river]

No he
Was doing that to go to Tau lol

It was also to destroy the system but it was about going to Tau

[twin wigeon]

he would likely get shot on sight by sentients bc the sentients hate the orokin the most

[wise quiver]

I'm not saying someone will hijack praghasa to go to tau, I'm saying someone will use it to nuke the sun because they're crashing out.

[restive river]

And I’m saying that’s not happening cause nobody else is Ballas lol

[wise quiver]

yet

[twin wigeon]

well theyd need lotus to do so and shes still sitting by the pool

[wise quiver]

Isn't the lotus being tempted by wally to give up the operator?

Which is why she sent drifter to 1999 in the first place?

[strange turtle]

Yeah but that’s not outright control

[wise quiver]

For now

[restive river]

Ballas: "You never understood me, my vision. My future lies with Tau. Not here. Not with you."

[twin wigeon]

yeah but the voices are now quiet and shes in the basement far away from the edge

[wise quiver]

Y'all are too focused on your feet to see the horizon.

[restive river]

Drifter has the experience tbh

[restive river]

The horizon you’re suggesting is something that feasibly isn’t going to happen beyond a threat lol

[strange turtle]

And even if it was she still has to reach Praghasa to do it, and it still takes time

[restive river]

Also
With us getting a way to Tau it literally would only be used as a baseless threat

[strange turtle]

And unlike Ballas she doesn’t have that barrier stuff going on

[restive river]

Ah yes I’m going to destroy everything
Including myself
Yay

[wise quiver]

IMO using "no one is as crazy as balas" isn't a good enough reason either.

[strange turtle]

Well she can make them, but it’s not in the same way as he had them, and she’d probably be too distracted

[restive river]

I’ll rephrase
Nobody’s stupid enough

Ballas was having a full on crashout and was at the height of power lol

[wise quiver]

Alad.

[strange turtle]

Even Alad

[restive river]

He
Really isn’t lol

There’s stupidity and there’s being suicidal

Again, at most she’d be used as a threat

Also with things back in order anyone who tries def is getting taken out lol

[twin wigeon]

Alad is a corpus and wants profit, theres nothing profitable about a suicidal venture

[blissful merlin]

Like blowing up the sun???? Huh?? Why would ANYONE else want to target the literal SUN?! This isnt destiny lol. Nobody would gain ANYTHING from that. Especially in the origin system.

[wise quiver]

I'll agree on that front, and going to Tau they likely couldn't make the sentients into customers

[strange turtle]

Even if they could they wouldn’t want to

[twin wigeon]

not to mention, theres potentially a gazillion sentients there given that its their solar system versus a limited number of corpus or any faction really

[blissful merlin]

Exactly

[strange turtle]

The sentients might as well be the boogeyman for these people

[restive river]

We’re gonna have a way to Tau soon that doesn’t require eating the sun lol

[wise quiver]

So much we don't know about Tau.

I'm still angy at the xenoflora.

[dire mountain]

The only real argument (albeit a stupid one still) is if the Corpus could somehow create an artificial sun or something and wanted to remove "competition" but like.

[strange turtle]

Alad only tried anything because he knew he had things to offer

[twin wigeon]

maybe hunhow will reconstruct the solar rail and we travel to the future so that the rail is complete by then

[restive river]

They staying true to the no alien rule

[strange plinth]

privatize the sun lmfao

[wise quiver]

No no, the future is coming to us remember? Jade Shadows: Constellations?

[restive river]

That’s like 4 people and two ships

[twin wigeon]

yeah but no one said we cant go to their future

[wise quiver]

Not why I'm upset at the xenoflora, from a s tory perspective there are too many...holes not explained.

[restive river]

Like?

[twin wigeon]

plus if they can go back and forth from the future, we can study their tech to also do so

[restive river]

It’s origin doesn’t really have an explanation and likely won’t have one

At most there’s the liquidated kuva soldiers theory but
Eh

[strange turtle]

And if it does it’d be saved for the Tau update anyway

[twin wigeon]

oh the kuva jolted soldiers

[dire mountain]

I mean. Its not the most unrealistic shit ever. Is it stupid? Yes. But I could see it happening even irl

[wise quiver]

Ugh. The xenoflora made the shards of sentients well...sentient and individuals, and without the flora they lose this individuality. Yet there exist sentients that are individuals without the flower, such as hunhow, lotus, etc.

So why is the xenoflora so important when the sentients have the means to make more individuals? How much resources and time goes into creating a sentient like Erra, Lotus, Hunhow that this xenoflora is so vitally important?

That's never explained and i'm angy because of it.

[strange turtle]

Because the individuals are the sources of the hiveminds

[restive river]

The difference is that the sentients that came over and their direct offspring BECAME sentient with time
But the Xenoflora allows the fragments to become sentient individuals as well

[strange plinth]

we only see fragments eat or require the xenoflora, never a larger sentient like natah, erra, or hunhow

[restive river]

Big sentient has individuality and sentience
Their fragment that is basically just them via hivemind rules eats flower
Now it is like the big one mentally but not physically

[restive river]

Except maybe Adis
I don’t think we know what he is
Or if he even “ate” that flower lol

[wise quiver]

The sentients became individuals during their trip to tau + building it. Again, nowhere that ive seen says it takes a long time for a new born sentient to become an individual, let alone how much.

[twin wigeon]

pretty sure he eats flowers too

[restive river]

Newborn sentients aren’t fragments?

[wise quiver]

Lotus. Erra.

[strange plinth]

Adis is quite similar to the Dactolyst, i'd still say he's a fragment, albeit a modified one
but there is that bit in the quest where he has to stop to 'recharge' n we get exposition from valdur

[twin wigeon]

we give him one

[restive river]

Those aren’t fragmentes

[dire mountain]

Fragments ≠ Sentient individual

[restive river]

Hunhow can connect to them cause technically they’re still part of him but only to an extent
They are still their own individuals

[dire mountain]

Like hunhow could still fragment presumably he just couldn't create another natah or erra

[restive river]

It’d literally be like
If you had a baby vs your pinkie toe became sentient lol

[wise quiver]

What was the name of the sentient archimedean.

[dire mountain]

Itzam

[restive river]

Itzam

[strange turtle]

Itzam

[strange plinth]

fragments are the battalysts, mimics, big-hammer-lysts, etc

[wise quiver]

He is a fragment, yes?

[strange turtle]

Presumably

[restive river]

Unknown afaik but maybe

[strange plinth]

resembles a summulyst iirc
one of caliban's summons if not a regular sentient unit

[dire mountain]

Yeah itzam is a summulyst

[wise quiver]

My entire gripe with the xenoflora is it doesn't make sense in terms of scale of importance.

[restive river]

Yes it do

[blissful merlin]

With his cute little glasses

[wise quiver]

at least Without the explanation of "It costs too much time/resources to make babies like the lotus/erra"

[strange plinth]

yea that's itzam without glasses lol

[twin wigeon]

that we get but not loids glasses iirc

[dire mountain]

And guns

[restive river]

Hunhow can’t reproduce due to his solar rail trip

[wise quiver]

BEFORE THIE TRIP

[restive river]

That’s the problem, not time or resources lol

[wise quiver]

Back when they were in tau! During the old peace!

[restive river]

Yeah?
When they could make babies?

[strange plinth]

fragments are like worker drones, separate sentients are specialized for a purpose

[strange turtle]

…because without the Xenoflora all the fragments can’t have individuality?

So their personhood effectively dies

[wise quiver]

Cool, without explaining how much more resource/time does it take for the sentients to make a Lotus or Erra vs making an Itzam + eating flower I don't see why its important unless there is a BIG gap.

If you told me it took like 50 years and/or several tons of resources to make an Erra vs 3 weeks and a pocket of lint to make an Itzam I would accept the xenoflora

[strange turtle]

Because they care about eachother??

[restive river]

I’m not sure I’m seeing what the issue is

[strange plinth]

Natah was the mimic queen because she was to burrow into the tenno nest
Erra. idk what erra was for but still !
hunhow was 'a farmer', praghasa was 'a carpenter'
separate sentients had separate purposes, and the fragments/drones beneath them were extensions of that
all mimics are fragments of natah, as an example

[dire mountain]

Which is why they werent seen since the old war until the sacrifice

[strange turtle]

And want eachother to be able to remain as individual people?

[twin wigeon]

Erra is just worlds worst prince and general

[dire mountain]

Erra is like in the top 5 largest boyfailures in the warframe universe

Such a pitiful guy 😭 and full of hate

[twin wigeon]

well i assume prince given that lotus is refered to as the sentient queen so her brother, erra must be a prince

[wise quiver]

Again, without explaining some context around resources needed to make more sentients like hunhow, erra, lotus, I genuinely don't see the point of the xenoflora existing.

[restive river]

To give fragments sentience?

[wise quiver]

DE explained the sentients simply, it made sense. They flew the long way to tau, became self aware, realized the orokin were going to make a mess of tau and rebelled.

[restive river]

The whole point of the peace is that the now large amount of sentient individuals do not want war

[wise quiver]

That was the story we had before the old peace. Then old peace shows up and says "nah, they are sentient because of this alien flower." basically

[strange plinth]

the sentients didn't need a ton of individuals. they needed a handful of individuals with thousands of drones to do whatever task was required

[restive river]

No
It
Only says that about the fragments

[strange plinth]

then the xenoflora comes along and makes those thousands of drones into individuals, too

[twin wigeon]

Sentients are just robots essentially

[wise quiver]

I get and understand that concept, I also view that as...not great without there being an explanation as to cost.

[restive river]

Sentients head to Tau
Gain sentience on the way
While there and while they do their work the fragments find the xenoflora
The fragments now have individuality
Eventually there are more fragment individuals than there are whole sentients
Thus the peace as the fragments did not want the war that the big ones started

[restive river]

What cost????

[blissful merlin]

I swear they’ve explained this to you like 10x over already lol.

[twin wigeon]

a weird ass plant giving mindless slaves a brain is a huge deal for the orokin (slave masters)

[restive river]

And a huuge deal for the war

Suddenly the sentients that wanted war are now outnumbered massively by those who do not want it

[twin wigeon]

well plant is theoretical bc they dont look planty

[gritty dew]

are sentients a dying race? like are they finite or can they reproduce?

[wise quiver]

This. Right here. Those that wanted war. Why did they not just produce a bunch of their own lotus/erra?

[restive river]

They can reproduce so long as they don’t void travel

[wise quiver]

Presumably the ones on tau can still, if there are any.

[strange plinth]

in the origin system, finite
in tau, they're free to do whatever

[dire mountain]

They can reproduce but none of the ones we know have that ability

[strange turtle]

They probably did, but that doesn’t matter

[wise quiver]

Why the hek not?

[restive river]

They likely did reproduce to some extent but
They
Didn’t need to??? They had fragments which up until the xenoflora were working fine lol

[strange turtle]

Because it’s not about losing the ability to reproduce. It doesn’t matter that they have another way

It matters, that the presumable vast majority of their people, can no longer be people

[restive river]

They only made new sentients with express purposes
Like the Lotus who was made after the Old Peace to infiltrate the Tenno after Margulis’ execution

[wise quiver]

But, as you said, the sentients that wanted war were outnumbered, so why not just produce more individual sentients and go wage war? Was the cost that great?

[dire mountain]

They might have, we don't really have much information on the larger whole of the sentients during the old peace.

Presuming they did, those individuals might still have not wanted to go to war. Or if they did, their fragments may have gained sentience of their own

[restive river]

There were more fragments than regular sentients
You wanna pump out babies all day???

[strange turtle]

You’re assuming its because of cost

[wise quiver]

Depends on how the babies are pumped out, how painful it is, time, and resources needed.

[strange turtle]

Maybe they just didn’t want to do it when the rest didn’t? Or they didn’t want to go against whatever decision making system their society had?

[wise quiver]

Cost is time, effort, raw resources.

[restive river]

Yes, it does depend
But judging by the fact that they weren’t just pumping out babies to try and outnumber the already immensely large amount of fragments would likely be fruitless

[strange turtle]

Hell, maybe they just didn’t want to risk going against the Orokin and potentially the other Sentients

[restive river]

Also again, the newborn sentients are purpose-made
They aren’t like fragments

[wise quiver]

Assumption. I don't care about assumptions unless they are stated in game.

[strange plinth]

ik the topic's moved way on but i did find a pazuul line that says praghasa's probably not doin great

"Bones of my father, fathom-drowned... behold me. Carcass of my mother, flame devoured... behold me. Limbs of my children, piecemeal, unblinking... behold me."

[restive river]

Well in game they weren’t pumping out babies to combat the fragments soooo

[restive river]

rip grandma

[wise quiver]

And thus we can assume a lot. They could have chosen to not go against the new majority, which isn't great. Or the cost was too high for them to do it.

Or maybe they were, just their newborns were being consumed by the anarchs for their rebellion/war stuff.

[restive river]

You keep assuming there’s a cost but the only known cost is just resources
Which
They have

And why is them choosing to not go against the majority not great?

[restive river]

The anarchs used fragments

[wise quiver]

Cost is resources + time.

[restive river]

Ok
If it takes resources and time then they aren’t going to mass produce new whole sentients to make an attempt to outnumber the untold amount of fragments

[dire mountain]

Yeah the anarchs did explicitly use fragments

Like the dactolyst, attempting to use brachiolysts and conculysts

[restive river]

If we just assume that the whole sentients that arrived each made
A thousand fragments each
Then it would already be fruitless to try and constantly reproduce

[wise quiver]

Because if they don't choose to go against hte majority in some fashion, they don't need to be mentioned.

[restive river]

But they were against them to some extent, they wanted war lol

The whole sentients started the war and wanted it to continue
The now massive majority does not

[wise quiver]

Not if they can make Lotus and Erra's, fully formed and self actualized individuals, in a month, or even a year. They have time as far as we know they don't age, they could just wait it out on the sidelines.

[restive river]

It should be noted that the fragments also cost resources but it’s def less

[dire mountain]

I feel like you keep assuming new sentient individuals would also expressly want the war

Which, some may. Some might not

[restive river]

I mean that’s likely why the fragments didn’t want war
They were born into it lol

[restive river]

Maybe that was their plan
Not that that mattered as the war was back on lol

[wise quiver]

One thing we don't know is when the sentients decided to go to war. A lot of the flowery stuff I've seen was the sentients realized the orokin would ruin tau just as they did the origin system after they got there and started work. I.E. when they would have found the xenoflora.

[dire mountain]

Sure, if you were born into an environment shaped by war and everyone around you was fighting for their lives yeah you'd probably grow up wanting war also.

But with all those fragments around wanting and trying to fully achieve peace you'd probably question it a lot sooner

[restive river]

Well
We do know
Tormis visited
Left
Those who went next got met with war

[strange plinth]

iirc perita was described as the only place with xenoflora, and somewhere the sentients were newly getting to during the war
i'll find a source on this one if possible, though

[wise quiver]

Aye, so by then all the sentients, fragments included, were individuals. They all wanted war at that point.

[restive river]

The exact timeline isn’t clear and also could easily take place over a larger period of time than we know

[restive river]

Doesn’t seem like the xenoflora’d individuals did lol

[dire mountain]

I could be wrong but I dont think that'd match up with Adis freaking out when the 5-9 activated and the whole "how many golden-curse pods" bit?

[restive river]

They likely originate from perita and were grown and spread out across the system

[strange plinth]

could be transported elsewhere later, but xenoflora started on perita, i mean

oh ok

[restive river]

Oh cool :D

[blissful merlin]

Wait a minute-

[restive river]

I mean they are dax lol

It makes sense

I do hope that in Tau they have like
A museum somewhere

No years ofc but maybe it details ages and events from the sentient perspective

[dire mountain]

Tauron academy felt like it could've had a museum but

Well. You know

[wise quiver]

Tauron Academy could have used more tenno students.

[restive river]

Creating the rail
Building up Tau
Rebelling and the war
The xenoflora
The peace
The fall and the continued war
And what came after

[dire mountain]

Perita was so pretty tbh despite mostly just being a barren rock

[restive river]

I’d love to see the whole sentient’s perspectives on the xenoflora’d sentients
I’d assume they didn’t all just share the same opinion as they were all individuals
Some likely hated it, they wanted war and hated the Orokin
But I’m sure some were chill with the once sentient fragments

[dire mountain]

If anything the hypothetical sentients who were fine with the liberated fragments would probably be the first ones ready to burn down the empire

[wise quiver]

I do really wonder what happened to tau and the other sentients that stayed behind when hunhow and praghasa went to the origin system.

Or if there even were any sentients left to stay behind.

[dire mountain]

There were

[wise quiver]

Considering how important the archons seemingly are culturally, it seems weird that they would go on effectively a one way trip to the origin system.

[restive river]

I mean
War

[strange plinth]

no blooms left to guard

[restive river]

Amar was guarding blooms
No more blooms
Time to kill those who caused no more blooms

[dire mountain]

Thats just for amar afaik

[restive river]

Actually wait
Amar proves we had this exact thing

I love auto correct dude its so cool

[blissful merlin]

Amir haha

[strange plinth]

he mentions getting the other guardians, though
which could be the other archons
seems somewhat likely to me, at least

[wise quiver]

And that aside, assuming what AntiCaesar said is true(pls give source if possible) about sentients still in tau, they've had all this time to prep for round two, or just...assume they won.

[restive river]

Amir was totally there, trust

[restive river]

I mean they
Did win
The rail was destroyed lol

[wise quiver]

They know that wouldn't stop the orokin.

[blissful merlin]

Knowing him…I’d believe it. He somehow would end up there. Lmao. Would be so funny.

[strange plinth]

let the war party go off and destroy the orokin and prevent any further incursion if they fail, we keep tau regardless

[restive river]

It literally stopped the Orokin who were promptly wiped out lol

Granted, they may have not known that was the plan
But
The rail was destroyed and nobody showed up lol

[strange plinth]

there is that one weird line from hunhow in reaper's lament though actually

[wise quiver]

Did it though? We the tenno kinda killed them during the "we won the war" ceremony and it's very possible that they were gearing up to go back to tau after that.

[restive river]

What do you think the ceremony was about?

[dire mountain]

"Pazuul preaches of Tau, where once the great beasts held dominion. But none have seen Tau in centuries, nor heard it speak. Nira and her kin were doubly abandoned."

[blissful merlin]

It did yes

[strange plinth]

Hunhow: "How much do you recall, my Shadow? Do you even remember what came before this time of scars?
Your masters sent steel and flesh to cross the gap: clay they wished to rule and sculpt into a new and toxic paradise. Laughable. Even at the end, they never truly understood the answer lay not in things their stolen, blue-bloated fingers could covet.
The answer… was song. Your music reached our listening spines in Tau long before their rubble crusades.
Did you understand, my Shadow? When you heard the Naga drums, did you realize my people heard the thunder of our bitter, belated victory?

[wise quiver]

It was important enough for the emperors to step out of their coffins, if memory serves. It was celebrating the victory in the war, the war was over.

[dire mountain]

Mentions of "the lords of Tau" and nobody hearing from it implies that there were still sentients present there

[restive river]

Yes
The war was over
Aka they weren’t going back anytime soon lol

It is literally better to leave the sentients alone

[strange plinth]

so the tau sentients most likely knew about the plan, if they knew the drums signalled their eventual victory

[wise quiver]

Or, because this is the orokin we are talking about, it was a show. A lie. Because, as mentioned, there were still sentients in tau.

[restive river]

Or uh
Were
There likely are but we haven’t heard anything in well over a thousand years

[dire mountain]

Also the Reaper's Lament yeah

They wouldnt have listening spines if nobody was supposed to hear what they picked up

[wise quiver]

Wasn't the plan by the lotus aka natah at that point?

[restive river]

And a destroyed rail
And again it’s literally better to leave them be, the sentients were whooping them lol

[blissful merlin]

What are you trying to argue against at this point??? It feels like you’re going in a whole loop with your questions. I don’t mean to sound rude but they keep answering your questions with the same answers you keep asking questions about.

[strange plinth]

ballas sent the truth of the tenno to hunhow, hunhow made natah, natah followed the plan up until the last step, maybe due to ballas's interference

[restive river]

The Orokin could rebuild the rail ofc but
Why would they?

[strange plinth]

they didn't really get the chance

[restive river]

Also cause she just
Took pity and wanted kids

[wise quiver]

Same reason they wanted to go to tau in the first place.

[restive river]

Except now Tau has angry sentients who again, were whooping them.

The sentients would have won the war eventually, the Orokin were losing iirc

[wise quiver]

If we assume they were losing because they were fighting a massive army of thinking individuals, rather than a handful of hive minds and their drones, they solved the 'getting whooped' angle rather effectively with the end of the old peace and nuking the blooms.

[dire mountain]

I mean they did attempt to go back with the mag prime codex

[restive river]

Random thought
What if the way we get to Tau is the Sentients sent a sentient the long way round to check on and repair the rail
And they are only arriving somewhat recently

[dire mountain]

We sat, strapped in, safeties off, waiting for the punch. Waiting for death. Through my filthy porthole I saw stars among the outlines of the other Splinter ships queuing for the Solar Rail. It would soon grip us with an incomprehensible power and cast us through the Void into the mouth of our enemy.

[wise quiver]

That might be from before the old peace.

[dire mountain]

True

Actually wait

[restive river]

They really wouldn’t have solved it with that lol
The sentients could hack nearly all of the Orokin tech, they would have lost

[dire mountain]

No it likely is because the solar rail

[gritty dew]

so what are ALL of the open story threads in the game currently?

[dire mountain]

The whole. Not being broken

[wise quiver]

The tenno were fighting back and a certain distinct lethality, the sentients still feared us immensely.

[restive river]

Tau arc
Void war arc
Jade Shadows arc
Parvos
Worm queen
Narmer

[gritty dew]

okay so whats each of them gotta deal with?

[blissful merlin]

It def is

[restive river]

Yes, we were their best weapon
I do still think the Orokin would have lost eventually lol

[restive river]

Unknown for Tau
Defeat Wally, get Albrecht
Find out in June
Possibly related to what’s in June
Unknown
Unknown

[wise quiver]

I don't. Tenno are almost literal ovarian cancer to the sentients. Find a way to do a void nuke and you really screw over the sentients.

[strange plinth]

-# Transcript: At first, the Warframes seemed more of an artistic statement than a legitimate weapon.
-# The war was all but lost; the Sentients were unvanquishable; let us, then, create these strange and surreal warriors and arm them with weapons of ancient pedigree.
-# At least our defeat shall be beautiful. Memorable.
-# But against all expectations, they prevailed. Soon stories of outrageously improbable heroism filtered back from the Front.
-# Warframes had appeared from the sky, angel-like, liberating captives and devastating Sentient strongholds. Even alone they were miracles; in groups, they were gods.
-# Little wonder, then, that they were seen as mere propaganda.
the tenno + warframes brought the war to peace, as far as i'm aware. in addition to the xenoflora
Valdur: "'Xenoflora'. Flowers. The only real alien life we've ever found, and the Sents scarf them down like kubrow chow! Just as well for us they did, eh, Tenno? Suddenly they've all got minds of their own, so no more hivemind, so no more war."

[gritty dew]

who's the worm queen i forgot also Parvos is an old man what does he want anymoe

he needs a retirement home

[restive river]

We were lethal because we’re relatively low tech, our powers were largely sealed by the Old Peace’s end lol

[restive river]

Grineer queen

[wise quiver]

Worm Queen's thing is reviving the big queen. Narmer is finding Pazuul and...doing something with him, either curing or killing probably.

[restive river]

So she’s delusional basically

[restive river]

Minor correction
Not largely
They just were sealed lol

[gritty dew]

Hyekka happy

[wise quiver]

The orokin of old were very immortal, as long as they had a body to go to and...well we don't realy know? I think our warframes can absorb/burn the Oro thing that they transfer over, which is why we were able to kill off the executors.

[dire mountain]

Low tech, pretty adaptable, agile, and piloted by a child soldier who can just blast them with their weakness tbf

[gritty dew]

so what is Parvos's whole deal,i would assume he is like the 40K emperor of mankind in a sense that he wants to return the Corpus to his beliefs and how he hates the modern Corpus

[wise quiver]

From what I recall us last hearing from him, he was going to either reform or burn the corpus and rebuild.

[restive river]

They weren’t literally immortal and she is literally dead dead lol

[strange plinth]

we could kill the orokin because we could keep killing them
if they had emergency continuity set up, it didn't matter

[wise quiver]

Ordan Karris codex entry my friend.

[restive river]

Yes
But
After the old peace we couldn’t do that last thing

[vestal vine]

Whats a way to perma kill a Warframe?

[dire mountain]

True...

[wise quiver]

Lock an operator into the frame via and ascaris (i think?) and then kill it.

[strange plinth]

in which he kills a bunch of orokin, then they walk back out from behind a doorway or something
they had emergency continuity because they knew he would deny their offer and attack

[restive river]

I don’t see what your argument here is
We know how the Orokin lived for as long as they did and it wasn’t literal immortality lol

[gritty dew]

what made our Warframe move in the second dream when Stalker has us in his hands?

[restive river]

Unknown, likely instinct

[strange plinth]

the warframe itself
the mind is still in there, just super dormant

[vestal vine]

I was going to say launching them to the sun, but I just remembered the new war

[wise quiver]

As long as they had a body they could swap even if killed. We saw this in ordan karris codex entry when he murders the lot of em and they just laugh it off.

[restive river]

Bullet
Cut off the head
Etc etc
But that’s for the frame, the Tenno are a slightly different story

[strange plinth]

just a warframe? bullets, blunt impact, etc
stalker has a bunch of warframe heads in his lair

[gritty dew]

i thought warframes are just replicas as in like a lego set

[restive river]

Ok
Where’s the grineer queen then?
Her sister has kuva
So where is she?

[strange plinth]

emergency continuity has to happen pretty soon after death
we're far out of that window for elder queen at this point

[wise quiver]

No clue. From what I recall, they didn't have enough kuva to revive her, hence why worm queeny was working so hard to harvest it.

[gritty dew]

ah so he's pulling a "what if the emperor of mankind woke up"

[vestal vine]

What did exactly our warframe to move with a blade through its body in the 2nd dream? Another influence or the frame itself

[restive river]

Likely the frame itself but we don’t actually know

[vestal vine]

Cus sounds kinda weird a Warframe can resist the sun temperatures but not bullets

[pale cedar]

Replicas are the exact same as originals in almost every way

[restive river]

It wasn’t us I can tell you that

[wise quiver]

We still donno about this.

[restive river]

Only modification is the mandatory lobotomy

[gritty dew]

wait so the blueprint holds the existence of the person the warframe was in the program?

[wise quiver]

Case in point, Umbra.

[strange plinth]

not the blueprint, per se, but the infestation its connected to

[gritty dew]

wierd

[restive river]

Yes they share the memories via infested and also foundry being just that good

[vestal vine]

At the moment I thought Lotus was using the frame as the same way the operator does. But until I know she's not capable of that

[dire mountain]

Yeah infested material is the only real exception to the foundry being shit at replicating organic matter

[restive river]

She does actually have access to transference, that’s how Drifter uses it in Duviri!

[wise quiver]

I thought it was a hint at our operator being able to do transference without the chair.

[restive river]

I doubt it was Lotus who did though

[restive river]

We were busy being choked out

[strange plinth]

even then, i doubt she was close enough during the stalker sequence to influence the frame

[wise quiver]

And then umbra came out and now it's a hint at the possability of warframes all being able of being...well...like umbra(walking around and attacking along side us)

[dire mountain]

And fresh from a very long and disorientating nap

[vestal vine]

It means we can teorize Lotus saved us? I mean, kinda makes sense, Lotus is presented in the flesh right after that

[wise quiver]

Also, what was in that nap that slowed our bodies aging?

[restive river]

The anims are remnants of their personalities and we know that even the protos can be aware of the others who were turned into the same frame

[vestal vine]

Likely as well

[dire mountain]

Have you tried to do anything immediately after waking up

[strange plinth]

stasis
or cryo, somewhat unclear which it is or if there's actually a difference

[blissful merlin]

Cryo

[restive river]

I doubt it was her tbh, we never see her use it directly
I think it’s more of a nod to what the frame’s are, people

[wise quiver]

This also brings a lot into question on how long the war raged on, cause we have tenno going to the academy and etc...

[pale cedar]

A long time

[dire mountain]

Yeah so we have like, one piece of information about any sort of timescale

[wise quiver]

Define long, cause I'm still annoyed that my tenno is considered a kid.

[dire mountain]

Nvm we have like 2

[blissful merlin]

Oh my gods lmao.

[dire mountain]

"For generations you slept" (the beginning of the game)

And "the events in Höllvania will chart the course of human history for the next 10000 years"

[restive river]

Timeline seems to be
Zariman incident
We get saved
Cryo
Therapy
Cryo
Old war starts
Transference discovery
Tenno control the frames
Old peace
Second dream / cryo
Out of cryo to blast uncle failure
Back to cryo
War is over
Slaughter the orokin
Big nap

[dire mountain]

Neither of which are about the old war

[vestal vine]

Something I never understood about Warframes is if most of them have very destructive powers, why there was many of them dead at in the past war where Lotus and Erra fought

Were the concients that strong?

[restive river]

A bullet is a bullet

[vestal vine]

Warframe bullets must the strongest bullets in media lmao 😭

[wise quiver]

Ember's fire is st ill fire, it was the tenno's void energy that was dangerous to the sentients.

[blissful merlin]

They didn’t have the right mods equipped duh…/j

[restive river]

I think I may have missed an event or two, ik I left out the frames being made and the insurrections

[wise quiver]

Also, keep in mind, we saw a literal basic rhino with a tigris prime die in the start of the new war.

Also plenty of warframes died to Jackal.

[pale cedar]

Or Warframes aren't as strong as you think

[vestal vine]

They could've had have Prined Mods equiped actually

[restive river]

I mean
Shoot something in something vital and it will probably die lol
The thing is, while our frames die we do not
Or not all the time anyway lol

[vestal vine]

But are really resistent

[wise quiver]

We've seen the lore version of their power in the various trailers as of late.

[blissful merlin]

So how did they die lol. They didn’t have any mods is the best explanation. Even if they had prime mods they would’ve survived. Shame on them.

[gritty dew]

Do yall think we’ll see a Kuva/Tenet/Coda variant for Sentient themed weaponry if we get more sentient weapons?

[restive river]

The Hex don’t have mods ):

[vestal vine]

Knowing the Orokin, is not that weird

[blissful merlin]

I’m not taking about the hex

[restive river]

Possibly, it depends on what they do with Tau

[wise quiver]

Nah, it will be a Tauron variant.

[restive river]

I know
I just wanted to bring up that they did all that modless

[blissful merlin]

Knowing the orokin. It is!

[restive river]

We coulda saved them via modding
Slap radiation resistance on Arthur
Boom ez

[vestal vine]

Shield Gate build

Or Primed Redirection at least

[blissful merlin]

Maybe we couldn’t do that to them yet without their full consent…?

[strange plinth]

the "lore version" of their power is not that far off of what we can actually use
we do not know how canon the constellations trailer is until we see more of the temporal twins and their quest

[blissful merlin]

Do we know how mods look in-game?

Are they like huge or small or a character

[restive river]

True but
The whole point of the finale is we save them by knowing them
Which implies we had their trust by that point
So why couldn’t we prep them? Albrecht ensured we had our arsenal lol

[wise quiver]

Doesn't Teshin show you one during the beginner quest?

[restive river]

Mods are canon and iirc maybe made by a Cephalon

[blissful merlin]

Probably wasn’t enough time to mod them up??? Idk

[strange plinth]

forgor for a full year obv /s

[blissful merlin]

I don’t remember lmao

[restive river]

We had control of the time loop, wdym no time 😭

[dire mountain]

Do you know how long it takes to get mod capacity on a human being

[wise quiver]

I know he teaches you how to mod.

[blissful merlin]

We didn’t the first go around!

[vestal vine]

Warframes are not cosmically strong, but strong enough to end wars with a small amount of them. Not talking about ours

[restive river]

It can not be longer than a year

[pale cedar]

Teshin is terrible at modding

[restive river]

I’m not talking about the first go!

[blissful merlin]

OH😭

[restive river]

Bro thought he was still in the Orokin era

[vestal vine]

Was

[blissful merlin]

I’m sorry it’s 4 am and I just got off a 14 hour shift. My brain is mesh right now.

[dire mountain]

Skill issue on his part its so simple even a child can do it

[vestal vine]

Love is also let go

[wise quiver]

I was just about to say warframes are city level threats but then I remember the nova getting 1 shot by a grineer with a rocket launcher in the new war trailer.

[strange plinth]

told us to put 3 mods on our equipment n sent us off

[restive river]

Oh damn
Get some good rest soon and stay hydrated

[restive river]

“Go to Fortuna or somethin idc”

[dire mountain]

What if he knew they were like level 5

[blissful merlin]

I will! My brain seems to be in a loop of its own lol

[restive river]

Non-canon
Take everything from Sumo with a grain of salt lol

[dire mountain]

And just went "yeah this is already overkill whatever"

[restive river]

Damn lol

[pale cedar]

Was funny when he fought us and I just one tapped him

[wise quiver]

Everything from Sumo? What you mean? It's the official new war trailer?

[vestal vine]

There's two options:
▪︎ Most of frames are just glass canons
▪︎ The lore is quite inconsistent about it

[pale cedar]

Teshin should equip some mods tbh

[wise quiver]

Not terribly inconsistent, I mean mirage gets overwhelmed by infested.

[restive river]

They made the official opening cinematic which literally made up a new ability and had a tenno outside the dream lol

[vestal vine]

What are the "strongest" frames according to lore at first place

[restive river]

Just don’t take what they push out entirely literally
They make a quality product visually but man. They do not know the lore

[wise quiver]

Wut? Oh, you're talking about the mag t hing, DE told them they were doing that thought.

[restive river]

It narratively does not make sense for us to find out Teshin is a dax in the Teacher

[wise quiver]

Follie.

[dire mountain]

He should have put on PSF and rolling guard maybe he would have beat erra 😭

[vestal vine]

We've found one

[pale cedar]

Why are you asking what tool is the strongest when they do different jobs?

[restive river]

DE added that ability LATER in response to that not being a thing in game lol

[vestal vine]

How good is Chroma in game btw

[blissful merlin]

Not great

[vestal vine]

To clear my mind

[strange plinth]

not very lol

[restive river]

Your favorite

[wise quiver]

Not what I remember. It was during a dev stream when they announced that was their plan all along.

[vestal vine]

Follie with the power of love?

[wise quiver]

Not terribly anymore.

[restive river]

I’m just stating what I recall lol
Also again
That tenno at the start doesn’t make sense

[restive river]

Sure :D

Again, Sumo makes visually amazing things
But I do not trust them on the lore end at all

[wise quiver]

Well, its official DE stuff, so weither or not we like it doesn't make it non canon.

[restive river]

The choice to reveal Teshin is a dax in the Teacher was a poor one for instance

[vestal vine]

Lets just say Glem is the strongest

[wise quiver]

Xenoflora is canon and I dislike it, but I accept that it's canon.

I would have preferred something different but alas.

[restive river]

This isn’t on the basis of I don’t like it lol

Again, Sumo makes a good product but their understanding of the lore does not seem to be what it should be

Genuinely, revealing that Teshin is a Dax that early was a bad choice narratively as it’s meant to be a reveal for the Operator in the War Within

[wise quiver]

And I refuse to believe DE would release something that stepped that egregiously from their lore.

[restive river]

They released it cause it’s cool lol

This also isn’t like
That egregious tbh

The most egregious thing is the tenno in the opening who, again, does not make sense to actually be there.

[vestal vine]

Ok Im into undiscovered terrain

I gotta go

[restive river]

Have a good one

[vestal vine]

Cya

Clean your ass everyone, you'll thank me later

[pale cedar]

DE should start giving less creative freedom to either non Warframe players or players who aren't good at Warframe in any way

[restive river]

I think Sumo just drafted up something cool and DE said yes lol
Rule of cool nd all that

They clearly don’t really know the game that well since
The Teacher quest launched with Teshin literally being wrong

[blissful merlin]

https://tenor.com/view/ishtar-ishtar-fgo-fate-grand-order-anime-finger-gun-gif-16896854

[restive river]

They know it well enough ofc but not as well as say, the head writer

[pale cedar]

They should've found people good at modding

[wise quiver]

You hafta get people used to the basics before teaching them advanced stuff, which if memory serves is what teshin does.

[pale cedar]

Teshin literally gave misinfo

DE even had to remove it later

[wise quiver]

I've slept since then admittedly, what misinfo? I mostly just recall the alchemy stuff...

[wise quiver]

Ah that may explain it, I played it after that change most likely.

[pale cedar]

He was saying it only affected Corpus

[strange plinth]

corpus shields vs shields in general

granted, corpus are the primary enemy with shields, but they're not the only ones

[wise quiver]

Wasn't there a plan to make different things though?

I.e. grineer armor weak vs corrosive, corpus armor weak vs something else?

[dire mountain]

Theres like a dozen corpus units with armor and most are bosses

[wise quiver]

Then again I am reminded of when DE proposed changes to the IPS damage types.

That were so universally hated they had to rework an entire warframe(Khora).

[topaz finch]

Ancient memories coming back to me

[wise quiver]

Remember, Khora was supposed to be able to switch between Impact Puncture and Slash damage types.

But it was so integral to the IPS changes DE proposed at the time, they had to rebuild her kit after they had to scrap those changes because....everyone hated them.

I wonder how that changed her lore as well.

If the plan even then was Khora being a tribute to Margulis.

[restive river]

“None of them truly understands how much I lost, when I lost her. Nor by what subtle art my dead love now lives, within another's gleaming skull.

So tonight, we shall celebrate. In her honour, and mine, I shall unveil a new creation. A harmony of mistress… and monster.

An apex predator. A deathless companion. Unsurpassed. Blood-raw in whip, claw, and fang.

Khora.”

Meanwhile, the Khora Prime that exists before Margulis’ execution:

Y’know if she never died via the jade light we would have had theories about Khora being Margulis lol

Also funny that they made a cat more immortal than themselves lol

[dark compass]

Margulis is actually alive and is secretly a Khora protofr-

https://tenor.com/view/stinky-loser-tiny-kitten-explode-gif-15623895175038521381

[strange turtle]

Makhora..

https://tenor.com/view/mahoraga's-adaptation-mahoraga's-wheel-divine-general-mahoraga-makora-gif-6549350953160866281

[unique talon]

https://youtube.com/shorts/KBx0pfFmO4c?si=5FB9A1L_O2igBsja I just love how people completely misunderstand the lore itself

Are people really pissed off about that?

[clever linden]

I don’t care about American whinging

I enjoy being in non-fascist America (Canada)

/s all my friends are American. I’m scared for them. I’m just tired of Americas problems.

[unique talon]

What if there are more details about the Warframes that Ballas never told?

[clever linden]

He would have used them during new war

He had to stab operator with the parathesis they crafted

So he really had no countermeasures against them

I don’t believe they had any form of planned obsolescence like sentients

[unique talon]

Have no idea what that means

But my point is that people often misunderstand the lore

[dire mountain]

Tell me about it

[unique talon]

I mean.. they look really bothered about follie

[somber urchin]

my first though when they added her was: okay, they adding a more diversity, sure.
but this video is hilarious 😂

[unique talon]

If I'm not mistaken, the orokin were extremely cautious with their Warframe aesthetic and beauty

'cause they look really careful when it comes from appearance

[bronze harness]

Is there a way to read the lore? I'm ij the 2nd dream and still don't know the plot

[pale cedar]

https://www.orokinarchives.com/

[strange turtle]

Codex fragments, scanning enemies for codex entries, Simaris entries, item descriptions, if you’ve done the Entrati syndicate they have some logs, and there’s a bunch of limited time operations you can read up on with the Orokin Archives

You can do the rest on Orokin Archives too but some people like to do it themselves in-game

[wise quiver]

People were pissed off at equinox being maybe a gender swapping frame(it's not).

[dark compass]

They had to clarify she's female in each form

(coward move of them ngl)

[lean garden]

"extremely cautious"

and it was really just "cowabunga dude"

Ballas made grendel because people complained the warframes released prior were too genteel

[unique talon]

And also monsters like rhino

[tall echo]

Don't worry you're literally just starting the actual story

[stiff beacon]

You quite literally got to the end of what most warframe vets call the tutorial

[humble sierra]

So you basically just started the story

[bronze harness]

[humble sierra]

Before this there's not much in terms of story— the big thing is that there used to be an Orokin empire who ruled the galaxy, but then their greatest soldiers, the Tenno, turned against them with the help of the Lotus. Generations later, the galaxy is divided between the rule of the Grineer and the Corpus

The previous quest, Natah, explains that there was an Old War against the Orokin and Sentients, and introduces Hunhow, a major Sentient leader, as well as revealing the Lotus is his daughter, Natah

[alpine tusk]

Won't it be so funny if we have to build a railjack carrier to reach tau
Like, "tenno, the railjack is good, but not enougth as a outer system travelling craft, and cy have found a corrupted blueprint and we need to travel gaps of the void to salvage this lost aircaft carrier and also learn more about wally plan and stuff"

[ashen pulsar]

try not skipping the entire story and just playing the game

[narrow pendant]

there isnt too much story up to that point other than learning the setting, story begins shaping up properly with second dream

[vagrant zephyr]

girlboss chinggis khan???

[tall echo]

genghis

[somber urchin]

lmao always thought shes male in both 😂

[stiff fable]

Chinggis is actually the correct romanization based on the original Mongolian, Genghis is a corruption

[fast dew]

Not sure how you managed that one 😭

Shes just two sides to lesbianism/j

Butch and Femme......

[radiant pier]

what was blue girl up to

kaelli I mean

what is a pleasant enough distraction for her

[stiff fable]

Providing overwatch for Kahl

[tall echo]

well the corruption is the far more well known version

[radiant pier]

damn this is super cool

did the Grineer snipe lady just tell everyone to pretend they didn't see us lmao

OH WAIT SHE'S THE REASON WHY HER DAD LOST AN ARM?

[tall echo]

kaelli? yes

bit more than the reason why, she literally did it

[radiant pier]

that's hilarious as hell

does a Kahlli ship exist

[tall echo]

yes

[somber urchin]

idk no robe aspect doesnt look female, so i thought robe was just a monk vibe

😂

[fast dew]

Wh

[radiant pier]

poor lady, nightmares be bad

okay that's enough for today

[tall echo]

that's
certainly a brain

[radiant pier]

I will only do this once a day now

[tall echo]

do what

[radiant pier]

WHOOO SAID THAT

WHO SAID "I feel sick"

what's that glowy thing in the

MY TANKS

WHAT'S HE DOING OUTSIDE

[tall echo]

who

can you be any less specific

[tall echo]

roombas just shmoove wherever they can

there's a lot of dirt outside

they're very dedicated to their job

[ashen pulsar]

they said “my tanks” so yeah I think they could be a lot less specific

[tall echo]

"my tanks"
"what's he doing outside"

[fast dew]

My tanks are all girls

[tall echo]

plural, singular

[fast dew]

I use she for all my objects

[tall echo]

ok

[lean garden]

ah, were you not there for joel's great tankening?

[tall echo]

the problem was switching from plural to singular

[zenith quail]

Hello, do you recommend getting the hex good ending before starting the old peace?

Lorewise. Does the old peace happen after it, or are the two disconnected?

[midnight ice]

disconnected

irrelevant of eachother

[stiff beacon]

they happen technically at the same time

[zenith quail]

So drifter is absent.

[stiff beacon]

given 1999 is in a loop

[midnight ice]

yeah its the "for you, my child, the horrors. for you, drifter, unlimited hoes"

[celest needle]

At least the drifter can share their trauma

[zenith quail]

Huh, so a quest has never required syndicate standing, right? Looks like until then Drifter is off-duty in the origin system.

[midnight ice]

yup

the whole hex thing is basically bonus goodies for ranking up; that and unlocking new vendors

[naive rune]

https://tenor.com/view/push-loop-infinite-gif-26761476

[stiff fable]

sips coffee

[rigid compass]

Drifter was always off duty. he hasnt done anything in the origin system since new war has he

[stiff fable]

The worst thing I have learned today is that Qorvex is an even worse pun than I thought

See, Warframe's eternalism is a deliberate misnaming

[rigid compass]

qorvex is a pun?

[stiff fable]

If only

In actual philosophizing about time, "Eternalism" is the concept that both past and present exist independently

What Warframe calls "Eternalism" is actually "concretism"

And Qorvex is the concrete frame

[restive river]

Is concretism basically just eternalism mixed with many worlds interpretation

Also Qorvex’s name could be a joke
Qor = Core and Vex
He’s an annoying core, a radiation weapon against the murmur

[fast dew]

Knowing Albrecht, that is entirely possible

-# TIMELESS STYLE. TIMELESS STYLE.

[celest needle]

Was Qorvex even built ever?
Did Albrecht kidnap some poor soul ?

[restive river]

Albrecht thinks he’s soooo clever

[restive river]

Unknown

But I can see it have happened

[fast dew]

I prefer the idea that its just another protea situation

[restive river]

Albrecht infected many a soul with the infestation lol

[restive river]

I don’t really see why it would be and we know he knows how to use the Helninth
He’d also need a practice run somewhere

[stiff fable]

It's more "Eternalism without the time travel"

[fast dew]

Mm. Designed. is the word i latched onto

[restive river]

Ah, neat!

[fast dew]

I feel as if it was actually, physically produced by him they would've used a separate word

[stiff fable]

The Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy has an article called Possible Worlds if you want the actual jargon-filled explanation

[restive river]

Albrecht def designed him but I doubt he sent the design to Ballas to make it

[fast dew]

I wouldn't see why he couldn't

[stiff fable]

Anyway I imagine there was an original Qorvex

[fast dew]

He absolutely was in contact with ballas, there's no way he wasn't

[restive river]

I don’t see why he would though lol

[restive river]

I don’t think we know that

[celest needle]

How does Qorvex prime work in this context then.

[fast dew]

How else would he have gotten temple lmao

[stiff fable]

Watch Qorvex Prime be part of the next Prime Vanguard, like Caliban

[restive river]

Albrecht can have designed that too lol

[restive river]

He doesn’t have to talk to the dude to steal from him lol

[tall echo]

take qor, add gold

[fast dew]

Sent Loid up to whatever area ballas did his work and got him to steal it?

And theres the paracesis' sheath having obols

[restive river]

Albrecht literally infected an Orokin, possibly more
I don’t think he respected Ballas’ privacy

[restive river]

We don’t know who in the family made that or if it was them

[fast dew]

I don't think ballas was too fond of people getting into his labs

[restive river]

Also Vilcor would be a more obvious pick for making a weapon lol

[celest needle]

Loids holding out on us and giving us the non-primed one?

[fast dew]

Eh, Albrecht has designed weapons

I believe the Ruvox is one

[restive river]

I’m sure he wasn’t
But I’m also not sure Albrecht would have wasted time to try and talk to Ballas, to say “hey ima need all your serums including that one I shouldn’t know about”

Ballas isn’t gonna give him Temple lol

[fast dew]

And do you think Ballas didn't immediately find out once he lost a sample?

[restive river]

Could more so be the base was the design intended for us and he had drafts for the prime
We’ll see what lore the prime has if any

[midnight ice]

loid just learned the keyword "drip-feed marketing"

[fast dew]

My idea is that Ballas took it for his own use, its not too out there to think so

[restive river]

I don’t think he was constantly checking on the design that he very confidently shelved lol

[fast dew]

I. Think he kinda would have some system in place

It would be dumb not to, even for a harmless sample

[restive river]

Listen, I get the thought process but we also do know Albrecht knows how to utilize the infestation
He can have designed a frame all on his own and made them all on his own
He did that with the vessels

Heck in theory if he knew how to manipulate the helminth enough he maybe didn’t even need to go through Ballas at all

[rigid compass]

couldnt albrect just time travel his way into ballas' labs

[fast dew]

How would that fix any of the problems

[rigid compass]

what problems

[fast dew]

They're orokin, they lie and steal all the time, its not above Ballas to have a security system

[restive river]

A system that didn’t work
Cause I find it more doubtful that Ballas would give up that design especially lol

[fast dew]

Especially for his most hidden project

[rigid compass]

albrecht just does

[restive river]

And it is especially not above Albrecht to steal lol

[fast dew]

Even Albrecht has a. Weird security system

[rigid compass]

easiest explanation is albrecht albrected it

[restive river]

He doesn’t even have to send Loid, if he knows its too dangerous then Albrecht could have done it himself

[pale cedar]

Albrecht’s security system was useless because of Ballas

[fast dew]

No, we know that, but again, someone in the entrati family was in contact with Ballas, and someone who "designed" a warframe exists in that family

[restive river]

I just think that Albrecht talking to Ballas and asking for basically his entire catalogue is incredibly unlikely lol

[rigid compass]

was the warframe project really hidden?

[pale cedar]

Yes

[fast dew]

The method of making warframes were, yes. Among the 7, perhaps not. Nihil knew of how it works. For some reason

[restive river]

Those can be true and he can also have not spoken to Ballas lol

[fast dew]

Idk i don't buy it

[tall echo]

did he?

[fast dew]

During the whole Gara thing, he's pissed she wanted to be a warframe

[restive river]

Ballas ain’t letting go of Temple, a design he was afraid to make
And he def ain’t giving up his entire catalogue

[tall echo]

and
how does that imply he knows the process

[rigid compass]

it doesnt necessarily need to be broadcasted to the whole system but it could just be they worked on it and not really top secret or something.

[restive river]

I do think that an easy alternative is Albrecht tickling the info out of the Helminth too, that would be a probably much more reliable and easy source

[fast dew]

Wh

As in
A human wanting to be a warframe

[pale cedar]

“A mysterious weaponized armor controlled solely by the Tenno. Through the Warframe, Tenno can cheat death, channel the forbidden Void energies and face scores of enemies without fatigue. Due to apparent resistances of their Bio-Metal exoskeletons, Warframes can be safely deployed to Infestation Outbreaks, should they occur. In-depth information of the Warframe mandate is forbidden to all but the Seven.”

[fast dew]

He can see that, in front of him

[tall echo]

ook I don't think that aspect was particularly secret

[fast dew]

^

[rigid compass]

where dis from?

[pale cedar]

Warframe technology fragment

[fast dew]

So like

Nihil being there for Gara's whole thing is funny lmao

[rigid compass]

🤔

[fast dew]

He doesn't even go here

[tall echo]

before nihil got retcondemoted

[rigid compass]

when was nihil retconned?

[fast dew]

Old peace

[tall echo]

with old peace

[rigid compass]

retconned to what?

[fast dew]

He was labled as an Executor, one of the 7

[tall echo]

not an executor

[fast dew]

Now he's. An Executioner

[tall echo]

DE loves their random retcons

[fast dew]

I still fully think they made the rest of the executors and forgot about Nihil

[tall echo]

-# ...especially since rebb took over

[rigid compass]

thats weird i remembered him as just being a executioner when he came out, though i did also misread ballas as being executioner too so meh

[turbid kestrel]

Catalog of what?

https://tenor.com/view/hinatazaka46-suzy-tomita-suzuka-gif-15515705339017940190

[rigid compass]

we got a list of retcons?

[fast dew]

You wouldve heard the line Nora has about him. "Worse than a executioner, something something excruciator" or whatever

[restive river]

Catalogue of frames?

[pale cedar]

When Old Peace they changed the thing from

Executor Nihil the Glassmaker to
Nihil the Glassmaker

[restive river]

Idk if the Nihil thing was a retcon, more of fixing the KIM writer just being wrong lol

[tall echo]

.

[rigid compass]

the line from 2020 yeah i totally remember that. also that line alone doesnt mean executor

[fast dew]

Eh, we do know that only the 7 knew about actual warframe production, and.

Nihil randomly

[restive river]

Nihil was only called executor, mistakenly, in one KIM chat
No?

[restive river]

I mean there was the thing with Gara

[pale cedar]

Yeah

[restive river]

Bro ain’t stupid

[pale cedar]

Officially at least

[fast dew]

Yeah, which he really shouldn't have known about

Again, only the 7 knew
And
Nihil

[restive river]

He wanted her glassed
She wasn’t glassed
Oh woah mysterious glass warframe?
1 + 1 is 2

[fast dew]

So I can see there was an intention

[turbid kestrel]

Ball ass when hearing weird noises coming from Lotus Bedchamber: 😭 marguilis, WHY?!

[fast dew]

Ducky why did he want her glassed

[rigid compass]

i mean the executors could probably tell people at their own discretion on how warframes are made considering orokin break laws and ballas probably had people helping him too

[tall echo]

he wanted her glassed for volunteering for being framed

[restive river]

Oh right
How did bro know

Who told that slime of a man

[fast dew]

Exactly

Why was he told if only the 7 knew

[pale cedar]

Ballas did certainly glass her
But not in the way he wanted

[restive river]

I mean Albrecht knew

[fast dew]

So I can see the initial intent for him to be an Executor

[restive river]

Eh

[rigid compass]

buh i just replied 😔

[tall echo]

albrecht is a sneaky little thief

[restive river]

Our only evidence of that is a KIM convo that was a mistake lol

[fast dew]

Albrecht is a bit silly like that

[restive river]

Albrecht def is not above theft

[turbid kestrel]

Ball ass is a c4ck

[fast dew]

He also does just do biotech or whatever the shit the body parts in the labs are

[pale cedar]

I don’t think any Orokin is above theft

[fast dew]

He does it regularly, unless he somehow paid for the cars in the labs

[turbid kestrel]

ball ass is a little bich that needs to be punished, death let him off easily

[restive river]

That’s what I’m sayin’ bout the frames

[fast dew]

I think the making of qorvex could've been a diversion tbh

[rigid compass]

they do have some lines that they agree shouldnt be crossed and stealing certain things of other orokin might be one

[restive river]

He 100% would have stolen them
Especially since talking to Ballas and getting him to give up essentially every single frame is the most unlikely thing ever

[turbid kestrel]

I cast 600 lashings on ball ass

[restive river]

“Make concrete boy for me”
“No”
“Fine. I’ll be “borrowing” all your research”

[fast dew]

Nono, I believe ballas did produce it

Just. Sent Loid down to steal some shit.

[restive river]

Albrecht ain’t above stealing and I don’t think he would have found the time to talk to Ballas to maybe get the serums if that’s what he needed lol

[fast dew]

Or, Albrecht did it after he faked his death

"Is that Albrecht? No, he's dead."

Little did Ballas know

[restive river]

Also I do think that Helminth is another avenue, depending on how well Albrecht could manipulate it

Which judging by the protos
A good bit

[fast dew]

There's a lot of questions around Albrecht's whole. Thing

Wish devs gave us more information

[restive river]

My point is he practically wouldn’t have gone through Ballas and I doubt he would have in general

Not because he couldn’t have, but because I don’t see why he would have bothered lol

[fast dew]

I'm saying the entrati at least had some communication

[restive river]

He was focused on a bigger picture, I don’t think he was waiting around on Ballas’ response

[fast dew]

I mean. Albrecht isnt known for being able to brute force things

He goes through his own rat like ways

[restive river]

Realistically, I don’t see why he would have talked to Ballas about it

At minimum I could see it maybe for Qorvex but that’s literally it
Ballas ain’t giving up those designs lol

[turbid kestrel]

Because he’s gae

[fast dew]

Yeah, and I'm saying he could've used Qorvex to get the other strains

[radiant pier]

what's he doing....

[restive river]

How does he get every strain from collabing once?

[radiant pier]

MY SON GET BACK

[restive river]

Again, Ballas is not giving those up lol

[radiant pier]

WHERE ARE YOU GOING

[fast dew]

Stole em, used Qorvex as a means to get closer to Ballas' labs

[pale cedar]

I wonder who is more obsessed
Albrecht towards Wally or Wally towards Albrecht

[fast dew]

The Entrati we're exceptionally.. mm. What's the word

Even to ballas they had a level of. Audacity?

[radiant pier]

GET BACK HERE YOUNG MAN

[restive river]

Eh, maybe
He wouldn’t really need to be in the labs to do that though

[radiant pier]

COME BACK INSIDE

DONT GO IN THER WATER

[restive river]

Let then see the world :)

Put that one outside forever

[pale cedar]

"The Orokin found conventional books offensive, primitive. They clung to their precious Ayatans and sneered at our grand libraries. Oh, how we loved to offend the Orokin, Albrecht and I. And how secure our primitive libraries proved while their towers burned."

[radiant pier]

he's headed back ibnside

he's had his timew in the su

you're kidding me

[tall echo]

that's surprisingly impossible

[restive river]

I mean for that specific one yes
No way to track em

[tall echo]

roombas just find their way inside or outside no matter what

[restive river]

You can just
Put them outside

[tall echo]

they'll go inside

[restive river]

Maybe!

Put em beyond the little path to the more open area

Or up the hill with Kahl

[pale cedar]

Even Roomba is afraid of Effervon grass

[radiant pier]

WHY ARE YOU ALSO OUTSIDE

[fast dew]

In other news, I cannot draw Loid without making him strong send help

[restive river]

Nah

He’s buff now

[radiant pier]

WAIT A DAMN SECOND WHY IS SHE OUTSIDE TOO

[restive river]

Lotta Ekhein swinging

[radiant pier]

when did i raise such rebel-oh she's headed back inside too

[fast dew]

I can do that but like once you spend 3 years drawing doomguy it gets to a point where you cannot draw lean musculature

[tall echo]

I've seen roombas just end up there when I have them in the operator room

[restive river]

Ye
They’ll go everywhere lol

[pale cedar]

Usually they just escape when you do

[radiant pier]

okay they had their time in the sun, time to go ba

[restive river]

Give em enough time and they will clean every surface

[radiant pier]

is that another one

[restive river]

Well yes they can’t access the ramp

[radiant pier]

WHY ARE YOU OUTSIDE

[restive river]

But the ramp is always open iirc on the camp

[tall echo]

the roombas will rest when the earth is stripped away to its core

[amber onyx]

why is kahl kind of goated

[radiant pier]

that's three do I hear 4

you're kidding me THERE'S FOUR OF THEM

[restive river]

Loyalty gene + his loyalty shifting from the queens to his “brothers” in a sacrificial moment that evolves into his perception of “brother” to just be fellow tube babies but any snared by the veil

[radiant pier]

atleast some of them are headed back inside yk

[restive river]

You should play tempestarii

[pale cedar]

Yeah

[radiant pier]

YOU ARE JOKING

[restive river]

It’s p good

[restive river]

You’d like it

[radiant pier]

YKW, THEY CAN DO WHAT THEY WANT

[fast dew]

You should play slime rancher

[radiant pier]

they can handle themselves

[restive river]

Go play funny quest :]

[radiant pier]

it is 3 am, no, also my railjack sucks so not yet

[tall echo]

y'all should play darkest dungeon

[radiant pier]

gimme a week

[restive river]

loud incorrect buzzer
This is warframe chat 🤓 ☝️

[fast dew]

Yall should play slime rancher 2

[fast dew]

Errrmm nuh uh

[restive river]

I do need to play that lol

[fast dew]

Its so fun i love it

[pale cedar]

Go play CoT or I find a Sentient to hack your tanks

[fast dew]

I should draw my blorbos with them slimes

[tall echo]

slime rancher 2? I thought slime rancher was barely even complete

[restive river]

I think I prefer the original but I haven’t done as much with 2

[fast dew]

Wh

[restive river]

It’s been complete lol

[fast dew]

Did we play the same game

[tall echo]

I never played slime rancher thomas

[fast dew]

I really want multiplayer tho, it would be so fun

[restive river]

I played alongside it’s development
Fantastic game
10/10
go play the first one

[fast dew]

I have. Too many carrots now

[fast dew]

I played along slime rancher 2's development!

[restive river]

Ik the second one goes harder on automation which
Is what the first one turned unto

[tall echo]

I've watched lets plays and it never seemed fully done

[fast dew]

Mhm

[restive river]

Well it is and has been lol

[fast dew]

Kinda the nature of a farming sim

You're never really done

[tall echo]

I mean development wise

[fast dew]

Yeah, which i feel comes from the infinite nature of a farming sim

[restive river]

Tbh it had been done and they added even more afterward lol

[fast dew]

It doesn't feel done because it doesn't have an ending

[restive river]

But
It does

[fast dew]

Which

There is a end to the story

[tall echo]

it had some sort of progression and idea of a story

[radiant pier]

where did they go

[restive river]

Not an idea of a story it just has a story lol

[radiant pier]

wait my orbiter is legit empty

[restive river]

Find them.

[fast dew]

But outside it it does feel like its "not finished" because it. Doesn't "end"

[restive river]

Well it
It does end and does feel finished lol

[tall echo]

[fast dew]

Like other story games would

[radiant pier]

are they legit all outside

[fast dew]

Not what im saying, I'm trying to say that's probably what scrap is feeling

[restive river]

It has the defined story and optional content after lol

[radiant pier]

EVEN HER

[restive river]

Scrap has never played the game and isn’t in the loop
They think it’s not done cause they didn’t play it lol

[tall echo]

no I mean there was literally no ending when I last saw it

[radiant pier]

WHY IS SHE ALSO OUTSIDE

[fast dew]

There is a set end to the story, but story based games end when the story does

Slime rancher doesn't

[fast dew]

Yeah, thats what I mean

[tall echo]

you'Re overthinking

[fast dew]

Im over explaining

[radiant pier]

WHERE ARE YOU GOING

[restive river]

Scrap
The game is finished
It has a lotta good content
If you get the time go play it lol

[restive river]

Hell

[tall echo]

I have nothing but time it's partially why I'm depressed

[restive river]

):

[fast dew]

Which is why you fill your time up with shit

[tall echo]

nothing but time and nothing to do except stuff I'm burnt out on

[radiant pier]

no words

[fast dew]

Just today I spent like. 5 hours at a mates trying to figure out what's wrong with my housemate's shitty ass puter

[restive river]

Let’s circle back to Warframe
Slimeframe when

[fast dew]

Oo

[radiant pier]

they're legit all outside

[tall echo]

mix of hydroid and follie

[fast dew]

Can I dress him in a corn costume

-# I wish someone gets that reference

[restive river]

“Is Follie a slimegirl”

[fast dew]

https://tenor.com/view/big-joey-corn-87-gif-9195562334578754181

[radiant pier]

tired of the sun i see

nope

nope she was not in fact tired of the sun

round 2 ig

seems they're limited to an outline cuz they don't seem to be staying from the path once they're out of the shadows

I stand corrected

[restive river]

We need a trilogy questline about your roombas dude

[tall echo]

they're only limited by collision

colission... collission..

english sucks

[restive river]

Collesium

[celest needle]

Colleseum

[radiant pier]

how

OKAY ENOUGH WF FOR THE DAY

[restive river]

So since we know the first 2 (maybe 3) of the frames this year what do you think we’ll get later in the year?

[radiant pier]

more roombas

[restive river]

I’d like to think we’ll get a more spacey frame or a frame that somehow relates to Tau with Tau
But that Autumn update could really be anything

[radiant pier]

I should probably make an album

[restive river]

Joel
What frame do YOU want in the game?

[tall echo]

probably a roomba frame

[radiant pier]

yes

a cupid roomba tank frame

with a duck deluxe skin

[restive river]

Yes

Tbh an all terrain frame that’s just a duck would go crazy

[dark compass]

I want a frame that has the theme of Temple with the kit of Garuda and the fashion sense of Lavos

[tall echo]

so. a music frame with toobs and blood abilities

[dark compass]

Oh no no

I said kit, more mechanically so

The rest is spot on though

[restive river]

Mad scientist pyromaniac that can jump at you from across the map?

[dark compass]

A bard with scaling caster focused abilities

[restive river]

Octavia?

[dark compass]

No

[restive river]

[dark compass]

Garuda's kit is mentioned because

Of how active she is

[restive river]

Yeah you can be p inactive with Octavia

[dark compass]

Active octavia is a gun platform

[restive river]

Iirc Temple is more active but they don’t have the vibe you want

[dark compass]

Temple is an exalted ignis

It makes me want to sleep 5 minutes in

[radiant pier]

I might genuinely buy 12 tanks if I ever get another 75% off

[restive river]

Mhm
And lotsa casting of the other abilities iirc

Temple is cool but I have not heard a soul talk about them since they launched lol

[dark compass]

Temple's kit does nothing but weapon buffing