lore-discussion

[cunning ore]

Yea but for sure, each time Drifter followed his track, yep, we gained more for Drifter to date.

[fossil timber]

De just speed running game genres

[fast dew]

Given his behaviour with them, I wanna say post hex, possibly pre-roundtable

[restive river]

Tell them they can ignore the dating aspect and if they really want to the sim aspect all together

[twin wigeon]

Surely caliban proto

[fast dew]

This also goes for his hiatus in xx99

[restive river]

I think you’re confusing dev time with the actual order of events

[fossil timber]

what do you rate the 1999 quest ducky

[restive river]

Not the hex quest, correct?

[cunning ore]

No, im jk more of how Albrecht leaving drifters more lovers.

[fast dew]

Yeah lol just the group

[cunning ore]

😭

[restive river]

9/10
Works best if you do the kim system to get the finale
Needed more pizza

[restive river]

Ah

[fossil timber]

Im yet to play it

[restive river]

Ok good lol

[fossil timber]

lowkey just might do it for the motorbike thats it

[restive river]

Trust me, do the kim system afterward

At least to a certain point

[fossil timber]

Whats kim system

[restive river]

Which will be apparent

The “dating” sim

[fossil timber]

ah…

im aight on that one

[restive river]

It’s more of a friendship sim but you can date if you want to

[fast dew]

Yeah, he. Would've made them right before he fully left for 1999

[restive river]

Like you do specifically have to go down that path

The dating aspect is just one aspect of it and you can ignore it entirely

[fossil timber]

1999 to the old peace was such a 180

Never expected there to be an update on sentients for ages

[restive river]

From the way far past to the somewhat more recent but far past

[fast dew]

Still unsure how Albrecht managed to drag Roathe's unconscious ass to a helminth unit in his labs, and managing how to get that past Loid

[restive river]

Loid was out getting them sushi or somethin

[fossil timber]

Yeah the year 1999 was yonks ago in the warframe world right

[restive river]

Yup

We don’t know how long and we will never truly know
But at least ten thousand years

[fast dew]

Also chat do we think Albrecht's fallen down those stairs in the backrooms?

[fossil timber]

Cool idea from albrecht to dip into the past to escape wally

[fast dew]

Just. Fallen down and ate total shit

It was more to keep wally distracted

[fossil timber]

wait did he try to escape into the past before the creation of wally? And wally just followed him

[restive river]

We don’t know why bro made the protos

[fast dew]

Yeah, void is non-linear

If wally is. In the void

[fossil timber]

protect albrecht no?

[restive river]

Wally only catches up when we take a ride through to Arthur

[lean garden]

look at some of the scribbles on the wall

[fast dew]

He can go where the void is

[restive river]

Nope

[fast dew]

Oh yeah, im very aware of them

[lean garden]

look at how theres some long arcs here and there

thats albrecht falling down the stairs

[fast dew]

One of them is a spiral with the word forget next to it

So. Thats something

[lean garden]

oh wait backrooms

I was thinking the big spiral staircase on deimos

[fast dew]

Those too

[fossil timber]

uriel is one of the only proto frame designs that i thought was sick. Orokins are kinda cool

[fast dew]

I like to believe he'd walk up those on all 4s

[radiant pier]

we've been tryna sleep for almost 2 hours

hello lore chat

[fast dew]

Orokin are child murderers who do that for the sake of immortality

[radiant pier]

I am at a hospital

[restive river]

Just their style
They’re literally the worst otherwise

[fast dew]

What happened 😭

[radiant pier]

duty

[fossil timber]

ofc but they lowkey dripped out

[fast dew]

They are, Nihil...

[fossil timber]

did u guys see balas’ signa during the old peace

Holy drip

[restive river]

I want it

[cunning ore]

But seriously, i think the orders it unclear cause there many reasons:
First, it the age of The Hex and Triad living. It made the time Albrecht come to visit them became too complicating to rearrange.
Cause before 1999, he might have come to XX99 and then abandoning Roathe there. Combining with the trait of how Void affect to time, Albrecht can be in 1999 before or after XX99.

[fast dew]

Nihil...

[cunning ore]

I'm Ballasholic and yet, i cried for cannot have it

As well as the hologram of him in the Narmer Era

[fossil timber]

Surellyyy we get it

Its like ember heirloom but cooler

[fast dew]

Nihil's ears are a lil mucked up lookin actually

[fossil timber]

Yeah bro it stood out so much i thought it was obtainable

[radiant pier]

how do we get those...the pentagons

[fossil timber]

Where did ballas go after we raided tauron with uriel

[radiant pier]

I've seen a bunch of people have em

[fast dew]

Ohh uh. Those are a actual arm armour but I cant remember

Fraktia is the name iirc

[fleet furnace]

think those are a nightwave reward

[stiff beacon]

back to his pad on mars probably

[fleet furnace]

nightwave yeah

[fast dew]

Ahhh. Thats where

Almost got the name right

[fleet furnace]

usually anything saturn 6, emissary or glassmaker is nightwave, since thats how those stories were told

[fast dew]

Its annoying they don't do proper reruns tbh

Lemme experience the cephalites randomly appearing to try and get me

[fossil timber]

Would wally ever had been a problem if we hadnt freed rell

[radiant pier]

frakta shoulder pads

[fleet furnace]

yeah i came in noras mix 3 i think? veilbreaker was the update, would be cool to be able to go back and fully experience those stories as they originally were, and not piecing them together like we have to now

[radiant pier]

have they ever returned

[fleet furnace]

rank 23, noras mix 9, and i swear they were in another previous mix

[radiant pier]

I need emmm

voruna gotta be a bad b

a feral b

rawr

awoooo

[twin wigeon]

Awooo lady?

[twin wigeon]

I think Wally would’ve eventually broke thru Rell’s chains

[fossil timber]

O ok

[twin wigeon]

Bc like how rusulka puts it: rell was trying to “hold back the infinite”

[rigid compass]

Yeah rell was already kinda losing harrow got taken over by wally

[rigid compass]

Isnt rusulka just wally?

[twin wigeon]

Yea plus it would’ve been cruel to leave Rell

[twin wigeon]

Yesn’t

There’s no clear distinction between the two as of right now

It’s highly likely Rusulka could just be dead but we’re hoping she isn’t

Poor lady was dying of the techrot and some weird smiling fella comes along to shake her hand with one of her severed hands

[rigid compass]

Either rusulka is just wally. Or she's like a vessel of wally. Granted some memories and knowledge and power but still her own person

At least the rusulka we see but og rusulka prob died early into hex

[twin wigeon]

Hopefully it’s the latter bc it’d mean she’s still saveable.

[rigid compass]

If she's just wally

[rigid compass]

[twin wigeon]

Not for us but for Minerva and Vel

[rigid compass]

I feel like a lot of players want certain people to be redeemable

[rigid compass]

Who?

[twin wigeon]

Minerva and Velimir?

[rigid compass]

Yeah

[twin wigeon]

Smh

Saryn and Frost Protoframes?

Neci’s adoptive parents?

[rigid compass]

Dude I finished hex and havent touched it yet

Who is neci

[twin wigeon]

Oh mb

Neci Rusulka

That’s her full name i believe

[rigid compass]

Oh yeah

[twin wigeon]

You’ll meet the charming divorced couple soon enough

[rigid compass]

I mean lowkey half the evil characters I just wanna see dead. I was rooting for natahs death in New war

[twin wigeon]

Maybe sit down and share a beer or three with em

[rigid compass]

I hate loid too

[twin wigeon]

Someone subject this Worm to the Jade Light NOWWWW

[rigid compass]

Necraloid >>>>>>>> loid

[twin wigeon]

Actually, Glass this worm

But don’t turn him into a cephalon

[rigid compass]

https://tenor.com/view/nihil-nihil-nihil-mogh-elden-ring-nihil-nihil-mogh-elden-ring-gif-25654726

NIHIL!

Lotus should've died in New war erra should've been the final boss ballas should've been sidelined in favor of hunhow fighting us with the sentient fleet

[radiant pier]

dawg what

[rigid compass]

U heard me

[radiant pier]

and I will be choosing to silence you

I am reminded of the guns and ball tweet

[restive river]

Ah yes let’s root for the death of the person who got heavily manipulated and basically abused lol

[radiant pier]

you should look at their above message and maybe judge em completely based off of that

[proper barn]

Natah isn't evil.

[ashen pulsar]

https://tenor.com/view/walter-white-truth-nuke-walter-white-true-breaking-bad-truth-nuke-breaking-bad-true-gif-2370094217877194192

natah suffered so much

her entire life was dictated by others

[fast dew]

Natah is. A victim

[humble sierra]

The Lotus we know is Natah in her truest self. When she went by Natah from Apostasy—New War, she was brainwashed

[cunning ore]

I once liked Mogh i mean the time they not release the DLC as he was named..moghlester

[cunning ore]

Honestly i dont know how to defy her identity too..

[fast dew]

She is. Herself

No matter her name. She is. Herself

[cunning ore]

Like she being Lotus? It not really her since she inheriatged from the modification

Being Margulis? Umm, no too? Since she is the reason Natah got "fixed" into Lotus.
Being Natah? Umm. I don't know, like she does have sth to remain?

[humble sierra]

She was born Natah, designed to mimic Margulis, and chose to be the Lotus

All three are valid names for her but she mostly goes by Lotus

[cunning ore]

Not really her choice i think so. Since Natah is a sentinent and yk, what is sentinent. It like a white paper.

[stiff fable]

well, no, they're programmed machines

[ashen pulsar]

sentient is literally a sentient being.

[cunning ore]

Margulis more like the pen that carving the traits in her so it like

[stiff fable]

Natah was created for the purpose of taking on Margulis's memories

[ashen pulsar]

they can be reprogrammed, but they are sentient.

[cunning ore]

Hardly to really know what she is, so she had more like no choice than to be with what she gave/modified to be

Or she be back like sentinent

[ashen pulsar]

she had the choice to be the lotus.

[humble sierra]

She chose to be Lotus, that was her fighting her programming. Instead of manipulating then killing the Tenno, she loved them

[fast dew]

So are we, your point?

We are machines too, just. Fleshy ones

[stiff fable]

THAT is very far from confirmed

[cunning ore]

She not, Lotus is the what Ballas gave her. So i think she not them anymore but she need to or she will be nothing.

[humble sierra]

Not if I can help it, gonna get chromed up

[fast dew]

What do you mean lol we are machines in our own right

[humble sierra]

https://tenor.com/view/adam-smasher-ashton-hall-cyberpunk-viggle-cyberpunk-2077-gif-17480326311187901395

[scenic oar]

Natah is Lotus. Lotus is Natah. Margulis is only Margulis.

[cunning ore]

Oh, yea like we chose what we have to be so we can live-on despite it isn't the life you unknown

[scenic oar]

That how my simple brain process it

[fast dew]

Gross fleshy machines

[cunning ore]

Quite same with humanity

[humble sierra]

Margulis loved the Tenno too— if it weren't for her, Lotus wouldn't have loved them either.

All three are valid options

[fast dew]

We're powered by a form of electricity too

[cunning ore]

It like you gave an Android your everything. It both become you and not you

[fast dew]

Ship of thesis or whatever it is
-# im tired i cannot remember names

[humble sierra]

Theseus

[fast dew]

Same word just longer

[scenic oar]

Well love may pass from margulis to lotus/natah, but still Natah/Lotus not Margulis.

[cunning ore]

So it become and think like you and then it happened. It you but also you as it in thought having what you have.

[ashen pulsar]

margulis is what ballas gave her.

[scenic oar]

Yall calling ballas , ballas ?

[fast dew]

I mean yeah

[scenic oar]

He deserved Ball Ass only

[cunning ore]

Lotus is what Ballas gave her, if not she could not be treated different and beside have a mind that seperated from her.

[fast dew]

I also call Albrecht, Albrecht, because imo calling him by his last name is. Dehumanising

[cunning ore]

So it like the mid of Natah/Margulis

Android with memories more than soul.

[ashen pulsar]

she was created as natah, forced to be margulis, then chose to be lotus. then balls forced her back into natah, until she became the eidolon natah/lotus before finally getting the chance to make her own decision at the end of TNW.

[cunning ore]

She not chose to be Lotus, but modified/manifested to be indeed.

If you can explain deeply of how Lotus have her own love for Tenno, not stick with Margulis.

She still just a puppet being manifested by what remains of Margulis

[ashen pulsar]

you aren't listening. she was programmed to be margulis. she made the decision to break the mission and become the lotus by herself, putting the tenno in the second dream and betraying the sentients.

if it were just programming that caused her to do this, she would've carried out the mission.

she isn't just a robot.

[fast dew]

Mhm

[ashen pulsar]

she is a sentient, and can make her own decisions from her own experiences.

[fast dew]

To insist she is, is exactly the type of bigotry Roathe does

[scenic oar]

Drifter vs operator might be a thing as hinted by chat with Roathe.

[fast dew]

Dont think that. Its roathe manipulating you

[scenic oar]

I put my money on the adult

[fast dew]

He wants it to happen

Ehhh. The kid is more experienced

[scenic oar]

Well, let it be, who knows someone get manipulated and cause drifter vs operator to happen

[fast dew]

No, because thats. Pointless

[scenic oar]

My point is, kinda wish to see drifter vs operator in future

[fast dew]

Why do you think that'll work?

[ashen pulsar]

and has better training, unless they do share memories.

[scenic oar]

Come on , just for funnnnn

[cunning ore]

You are the one not understand it. It a complicating project as if you watched those movies about clones and androids. Lotus never a choice but nothing more than an image you feel stich with. She was a modified/manifested with data of Margulis. As it also built up her current-unexplain bond for the Tenno.
So in short, she is nothing if she has no memories/data of Margulis. She has nothing with the Tenno if she didn't have a Margulis
foundation. In the following, you chose Lotus and see it as her choice caused that's you familiar image.

[restive river]

They currently don’t have a reason to go against each other

[fast dew]

All operator gotta do, is not go into a particularly weak area in regards to void

[ashen pulsar]

she experienced things that margulis never did. she became something.

[humble sierra]

In Warframe, sentients, especially ones like Natah, are more than robots.

[scenic oar]

Roathe spark the idea, maybe just maybe it will

[fast dew]

Roathe is also a bigoted bastard

[restive river]

But why lol
Roathe is also wrong and manipulative

[cunning ore]

Foundation on Margulis. You expected a mimic with no foundation?

[restive river]

They have no reason to go against eachother, not really

[humble sierra]

Mimic but not clone

[fast dew]

Functionally how would that work after the fact as well

[humble sierra]

Yeah if they fight it'll be a temporary dispute at most

[cunning ore]

They are in Orokin words, "Tools" if you forget of how Ascaris Prime appears within the Xenoflora.

[humble sierra]

Orokin think lowly of everything

[scenic oar]

Yup, no reason. For now. Hope DE cooking something hehehhe

[fast dew]

They have feelings.

[cunning ore]

At least Detroit becomes Human far more better than Lotus

[fast dew]

Its literally the same thing

[ashen pulsar]

if you think her foundation determined all of her behavior, then why didn't she destroy the tenno? clearly that was what she was designed to do.

[humble sierra]

She literally pulled a DBH, she went against her programming

[fast dew]

DBH my love

[restive river]

What reason would there even ever be?

[humble sierra]

We don't see her doing the deviant wall breaking cutscene but just imagine she did

[fast dew]

Marcus is gender goals tbh

[humble sierra]

Mercy/non-mercy probably

[restive river]

It’s a neat concept but practically I can’t see it happening

[cunning ore]

Of course, i do believe it like how science prove trauma affected a person?

[restive river]

But for who lol

[cunning ore]

Why she have to destroy the Tenno when she is nothing?

[humble sierra]

Yeah if they're setting it up they'll have to make up an entire background for the conflict

[fast dew]

Which. Would be pointless

[cunning ore]

She loved Tenno because she programmed on that Margulis foundation

[ashen pulsar]

you are the one saying she is nothing.

she was told to be margulis and destroy the tenno, she chose to follow neither.

[humble sierra]

No, she was designed to kill them and manipulate them. She ended up actually loving them

[restive river]

Exactly, let alone how it’d work gameplay-wise
They ain’t doing pvp and locking rewards behind a choice isn’t their style

[cunning ore]

You forget the part of tripping that Margulis foundation? You clearly not read

[fast dew]

Why have an entire conflict that just becomes pointless

[cunning ore]

They are nothing without Margulis foundation as Natah have no connection to Tenno before.

[scenic oar]

Well, it can be just a one time story stuff.

[humble sierra]

Roathe should never have said that chat

In fact he probably just wanted people to argue

[fast dew]

He wanted to push us against our friends for some reason

[scenic oar]

Hehehhee, rage bait by Roathe

[fast dew]

Hes either plotting some shit bigot style or he's just a bigot

Either way, not fun

[humble sierra]

He ragebaits a lot, for example asking you if the other two members say prayers when dating them

[fast dew]

Either way, deserves a punch

[ashen pulsar]

I played the story, same as you. she broke out of the margulis directive, just like she ignored the directive to destroy the tenno. Natah had her own experiences, and they caused her to go against her programming, including the programming to be margulis.

[humble sierra]

Speaking of dating them I think it's time for my mandatory daily brag of how I am dating all three at the same time somehow

[ashen pulsar]

if she is nothing if not her programming, why would she choose to be someone else???

[fast dew]

I hate when people use the "well think about the time he was in!!" Because. Loid is also right there, from the same time, and isnt a bigoted asshole to her. In fact, wants to make her more comfortable, treating her like a human!
-# he. Isnt exactly sure on how to make the lotus comfortable, but i like to believe the chair and Ottoman in the dark refractory is his attempt

[humble sierra]

Also, Margulis never wanted the Tenno to be weapons and tried sheltering them as much as possible . Lotus didn't want that for them either but she knew the only way for them to be free was to fight— that's an example of her independence

[radiant pier]

I don't see such a conflict happening between the operator and the Drifter, not just the fact there's nothing there, I doubt The Drifter would be one so rash

it'd be a horrible waste of time to spend that much time into making up a forced conflict between the two imo

especially with tau on the horizon

and hell no I don't want that forced drama in the story when I'm tryna explore tau 😭

[cunning ore]

I also played the same story with you. Then how can you not think of Natah, once a sentinent unknown if have the affect of Xenoflora in The Old War, have no connection with Tenno suddenly got turned/mimiced someome else then have taking on their duties and being brainwashed to also love the children the same as Margulis and be named Lotus so people just assumed that "she is Lotus"? Define her through her history, i see it nothing more than an blank shell being pumped in an indentify that it has to be. There is nothing mean that if you can explain how Natah have connection with Tenno in the Old War without Margulis/Lotus then?

[scenic oar]

Don't know man, seems to me like Lotus don't want to coz Margulis don't want to. I nvr sure Lotus in her current state, still independent

[radiant pier]

never cram too much into one storyline, never

[cunning ore]

Tell then, what Natah with Tenno?

Connection? Any?

[ashen pulsar]

natah never needed xenoflora, she wasn't a split sentient btw

like hunhow

[radiant pier]

they're kids

[cunning ore]

Tell. What Natah with Tenno before The Old War? Before the Lotus exist?

[radiant pier]

does she really need any other reason?

[ashen pulsar]

natah didn't exist before the old war? try again.

[scenic oar]

I don't think natah can relate to tenno if she remain as natah. I thought natah created for margulis ?

[cunning ore]

That's Margulis, the love of godmother tho.

[scenic oar]

Thanks to Ball Ass

[fast dew]

Margulis abandoned an autistic kid. She's no saint herself.

[cunning ore]

Don't mispell it. What is the connection between Natah and the Tenno before The Old War, The Old Peace?

[fast dew]

She. Didnt exist

[cunning ore]

I asked for that. If you can tell they have connect

[ashen pulsar]

again, natah didn't exist before the old war.

[fast dew]

She existed after Margulis died

And. As we know, Margulis is in fact, alive for the first part of the war

[cunning ore]

See, she not exist so where that love of Lotus from?

[ashen pulsar]

natah was created near the end of the old war.

[scenic oar]

Ya, I believe that her purpose or ball ass purpose..

[cunning ore]

Margulis.

That identity ate up her.

Lotus is nothing a manifested shell

[ashen pulsar]

from the time spent with the children after being sent to impersonate margulis so the sentients can manipulate and destroy the tenno.

[scenic oar]

That's why at the end of new war, u get to choose what she will be ? Coz at the end, don't really matter anymore ?

[cunning ore]

What you chose it a just a believe to direct a person's life.

Cause she also not chose to be Lotus. So we have to chose

[fast dew]

That isnt us choosing there. Thats. Herself

[scenic oar]

By the way, just sharing I chose to let her be Natah, and use margulis skin on her.... lmao

[cunning ore]

Or she become nothing, confused with identies

[fast dew]

The game doesnt portray it correctly

[cunning ore]

It not

[ashen pulsar]

SHE WAS DIRECTED AND FOUGHT THAT. You are making her decisions sound like nothing. People are shaped by their experiences

[fast dew]

No, she knows who she is. She just has the other two

[cunning ore]

Then don't force me to chose then?

This game clearly not make clear and so this war going on

[fast dew]

Its player choice but not a choice the tenno makes

[cunning ore]

At first if she want to be Lotusz why forcing to chose then people keep yapping of "No, Lotus is her"

We, in role of the chosen one

[velvet tangle]

Ballas is such a kind, nice and caring soul who brought nothing but happines and smiles for the past 100 years but sadly the tenno mafia and his evil divorced wife violently jumped and killed him infront of his trusted collegues right before he was about to go home

Thats the story right?

[cunning ore]

If so it not even her.

[fast dew]

In that moment. We the player are the lotus

She is. All 3

[ashen pulsar]

if a child is raised in a very controlled environment but eventually rebels, they didn't rebel because the parents told them to.

[cunning ore]

It you, people defy her and story

[fast dew]

Not. Realy

She has both natah and Margulis in her head, she is both

One just leads the other two

[cunning ore]

She is. Accepted it. As even when the OP happened, thr choice affected the word she given us at the end.

[velvet tangle]

So she has personality disorder

[ashen pulsar]

in the story, it is her. you just choose so that her decision can be represented

[fast dew]

Plurality, I wouldn't go as far as DID or anything

[humble sierra]

It grew

Like how natural love does

[ashen pulsar]

she didn't exist during the old peace.

[cunning ore]

It not, it not her choice but her being manifested into a shell she expected to be.

That the tragedy of mimic

[radiant pier]

did you get ignored in #warframe-general or something I already saw you send this earlier

[cunning ore]

Never ever be yourself.

[humble sierra]

Amar is a mimic too

[velvet tangle]

Symmetry or smth

[cunning ore]

At least he not heavy modified and manifested

[fast dew]

He is lol

[ashen pulsar]

it is her taking all the experiences she's had since her creation during the old war and choosing how sshe represents herself.

[fast dew]

Have you seen Amar's two forms

[radiant pier]

ignored, got it

[cunning ore]

It heavy modified. You not see his words?

The Archons tell the story, as they still have themselves in those modified bodies

[fast dew]

So does the lotus!

She still has natah with her

[cunning ore]

So does not the Lotus! cause she heavy modified and manifested?

[fast dew]

She still has Margulis with her

[cunning ore]

You skipped my words? And tell then, what Natah connection with Tenno?

[fast dew]

She saw them and couldn't kill children

[humble sierra]

The only time it's ever suggested Lotus' love for the Tenno is false is during the Ropalolyst fight where she's being actively brainwashed

[humble sierra]

The same as any adoptive mother

[cunning ore]

You said "she not existed". I asked it what the connection between Natah and Tenno before the OP or the Old War?

[humble sierra]

She didn't exist before the Old War

[fast dew]

She. Didnt exist. But she still saw rhe sleeping tenno.

[cunning ore]

Yes, that, so how she could have sth for Tenno more than being manifested by Margulis's love for them?

[radiant pier]

ah yes, the rotisserie chicken fight, good times....she could NOT stop speaking

[cunning ore]

Where imply that from that time?

[humble sierra]

Do you (the royal you as in people in general) only love people because you're told to?

[cunning ore]

Oh yea, because they also modified my brain to have the fake image of me loving them.

C'mon, how you can love someone without knowing them through your memories?

If your memories got fixed, you clearly can love someone you not even know

[humble sierra]

She knew them through her own memories too, not just Margulis'

[fast dew]

Im sure my ex carers loved me, despite not knowing me fully

[cunning ore]

When where? Tell? Not after being modified to be Margulis 2.0 pls

[fast dew]

Thats. How she was created

[ashen pulsar]

I'm going to explain which characters we have.
Natah (nothing)
Natahgulis (Natah, programmed to be margulis and destroy the tenno)
Lotus (Natahgulis after her time with the tenno, decides not to destroy the tenno and to betray the sentients)
Natah, after apostasy prologue (lotus, reprogrammed by ballas)
Eidolon lotus (idfk, shes just crazy)
Radiant lotus (all of her experiences as natah, her memories from margulis, and the MUCH LONGER amount of time she's experienced as lotus)

[fast dew]

She physically was never without it

[cunning ore]

Then when and where is Natah love Tenno or you imply it Lotus?

[fast dew]

Doesnt she hesitate to kill us a few times or refuse to?

[humble sierra]

She only had Margulis' memories as information. Not her feelings. If she was given feelings, it would defeat her purpose to manipulate and kill them.

So she ended up having the feelings naturally

[cunning ore]

Oh, wowie, Drifter alsmost died by her beam

Lotus beam

[fast dew]

Drifter isnt her child lol

[cunning ore]

Lol modified Lotus can only love Tenno

[fast dew]

I mean. Yeah

[cunning ore]

Read the later phrase then

[scenic oar]

Huh ? Wut. Now I more confused, isn't Margulis a real human. While Natah just doll created by Ball Ass ?

[ashen pulsar]

im talking about the forms of lotus, but yes. margulis died before any of these existed.

the real margulis.

[cunning ore]

You put in a shell whatever and when you break despite the whatever you pull out, it still have traces tho

[radiant pier]

okay wait now I'm confused, wait which came first, Natah or Margulis

[fast dew]

Anwyays this is getting pointless, ping me when Albrecht is mentioned

[ashen pulsar]

margulis died before natah was created.

[radiant pier]

ahhh, AHHH

[cunning ore]

I need even an information to confirm that

[ashen pulsar]

I can change it to natahgulis if that helps

[radiant pier]

okayokay, makes sense

I thought it was Natah that came first

[cunning ore]

I still stay with, she is not of them but also them

[radiant pier]

...there's a not-real Margulis?

[cunning ore]

And to prove my point i will add in a curse of Dualism and Eternalism.

[scenic oar]

Should be margulis first, as real human. After margulis dead, Ball Ass that pathetic simp decided to create natah to replace margulis for his own "agenda"

[ashen pulsar]

yeah. natah was programmed to replace her and destroy the tenno. that failed tho, cuz in that time she ended up loving the tenno so much she betrayed the sentients.

[radiant pier]

oh so, that Margulis execution, that was the REAL Margulis being killed?

[ashen pulsar]

mhm

ballas let her die, then blamed the orokin and tenno for it and started helping the sentients create a replacement to destroy the tenno.

[radiant pier]

okay cool

that clears up a lot

[ashen pulsar]

in case you didnt hate them enough.

him enough

[radiant pier]

though, how did the Natah have these memories with her?

[scenic oar]

Like how V have Silverhand memories

Coz it's inside her brain I guess

[ashen pulsar]

programmed into her

[radiant pier]

I get the whole...programmed into becoming a replacement Margulis, but how did she have these memories of the execution, the conversation with Ballas

[cunning ore]

He clearly forgot of how Margulis affection effect works

[radiant pier]

was he legitimately so far up his own ass he thought she'd serve him?

[cunning ore]

What he want is in the Veil, it like someome so selfish than want everything back, like a child in an asshole shell

[ashen pulsar]

not quite memories, more so directives. "you are margulis. this is what margulis does. kill the kids"

iirc

[cunning ore]

Memories magic ✨

Motherhood magik ✨

Chose to die to sacrifice dignity and forcing kids into a long-term revenge and being hunted by the whole universe

[radiant pier]

Ballas you dumbass

[cunning ore]

Yea he dumb, he is a fool knowing the first time how to love

But power gives no chance to regret

Like how killing is easy but regret being nothing than a self-relive

[radiant pier]

okay wait, the execution of Margulis happened after the old peace, or before?

[cunning ore]

After

[radiant pier]

okay, after

they gotta fix the wiki page, they need to separate original Margulis and Lotus

OKAY THAT CLEARS EVERYTHING UP, THANKS ALL

[scenic oar]

U mean in wiki, it's still saying Lotus = margulis ? Lmao

[radiant pier]

don't....don't all the Orokin executors need to agree for the execution to go through?

[radiant pier]

nah it's just super confusing, I just went to check it now and got even more confused cuz it's kinda jumbled looking

[radiant pier]

so Ballas could'a totally

totally stopped the exe....Ballas I hope we see you again just so we can beat you to death

[ashen pulsar]

like I said,

ballas let her die, then blamed the orokin and tenno for it and started helping the sentients create a replacement to destroy the tenno.

this man is a cartoon villain.

[radiant pier]

the more I hear about it, the less I think he's even smart LMAO

this is cartoon levels of stupid

[cunning ore]

Oh, it the mental issues of narcissist so yea in way it does seem stupid

But gladly it made sense so ✨

[stiff fable]

hey so small thing

The leaked Ephemera refers to the Colossus of Hull

Isaah says Umbra fought at the battle of hull

[humble sierra]

👀

[radiant pier]

BADASS

I'm glad they haven't forgotten about Umbra

my goat

[sleek berry]

When Ballas kissed Lotus/Natah and stole her energy in New War; was that a Transference thing or something else?

[cunning ore]

No, it just absoring energy in a more artistic way tho

[scenic oar]

By the way, do u believe the main quest / story we been doing so far it's about a MC Tenno story ? Like while this tenno experiencing all stories, while there are some other tennos doing-who-knows-what ?

[lean garden]

yea

[tall echo]

yes.

[lean garden]

all the other players you see are really just other tenno bumming around

[humble sierra]

Yeah but we are the only Tenno who experience the quests

All other Tenno are just doing missions

[tall echo]

that's
not even a "believe" thing

[woven coyote]

Imagine lotus being brainwashed by ballas #264538 because a new tenno started the quest

[scenic oar]

Hah, glad to know that I am not only one, lolz

[humble sierra]

Vor dying for the 40 millionth time

Oh wait that's just the canon amount of times you kill him

[scenic oar]

So means while MC tenno having traumatic experience, we other tennos just enjoying making other factions sufferrrr

[strange plinth]

the eventual fate of any Vor

[humble sierra]

I mean, maybe they're dealing with the ramifications of our actions

Lua suddenly returns, now the Tenno try to stop corpus and Grineer from investigating to the best of their ability

[scenic oar]

Do u think would it be better, if the game introduces a npc tenno that generally give us a hint on what other tenno doing while MC doing all stories stuff

[lean garden]

I mean, fun extra clarity but ultimately not critical I feel

[scenic oar]

Ya, not necessarily

[viscid aspen]

I keep waiting for the Lotus faction to become an actual thing, i sooo want to explore stuff about the people we rescue or around the relays

Like imagine we get a Lotus faction hub and there's a room full of consigned kubrows and kavats

[strange plinth]

-# .. lotus is part of the tenno faction

[twin fox]

Heyoo replayed few quests and wally is kinda right to be angry cause like orokin took his finger unlike the deal "freely" done

[strange plinth]

angry, sure
everything he's done as a result? no

[viscid aspen]

Yeah she's our guide but there's clearly a larger organization of mostly Tenno-allied humans that she's either a part of or commands

[twin fox]

That yea his actions bad but he is angry for right reasons and now its too far gone to just return finger and call it a day

[scenic oar]

The finger stuff in our railjack, I still kinda confused about lore behind it

[strange plinth]

yes, that's the tenno faction
the relays are under the tenno faction

[twin fox]

Its the relenqury drive its a clone/copy of real wally finger u can also find it in the def mission in zariman

[viscid aspen]

It's pretty straightforward tbh

Wally's finger/fingers (theres contradictory info about whether there were many or just one) were severed, the orokin studied it/them and cloned it/them and used it/them to power railjacks

[strange plinth]

among other things

[twin fox]

For more lore u can also check the words tablet in deimos in the necraloid room of the story of xata ris jahu etc

[twin fox]

I think 1 original exists but all copies we see are cloned

It was in the mission transmission of def mission or something i think

[viscid aspen]

I love listening to them every once in a while

"To cosmic forms from tangent planes, we end as we began"

[stiff fable]

not cloned, it's a relic like the Catholic kind.

[viscid aspen]

Yes

[twin fox]

Oh yea that is amazing writing

[stiff fable]

One trait of a genuine Catholic relic is self-duplication.

[strange plinth]

there's a line in angels of the zariman in which yonta says there are "originals"

• the albrecht log mentioning 'pale, reaching digits upon the floor'

[stiff fable]

(hence why there are millions of true pieces of the cross etc)

[twin fox]

But we only see 1 cut off from it in new war

[strange plinth]

and then everything else just says there's the one finger that's missing so, yeah

[stiff fable]

One finger is missing, but it divides and divides without end.

Like.... timelines.

[scenic oar]

Guess which one missing

Middle one I bet

[stiff fable]

pointer

[woven coyote]

Even the signa is missing the pointer finger

[viscid aspen]

Either the literal man in the wall form is some kind of abstract-made-solid representation of Wally or there being many is (most likely) a retcon

[viscid aspen]

It is? Thats cool

[stiff fable]

Yeah, when he shows up at the end of New War one of the hands is missing the pointer

[strange plinth]

eh. wouldn't say its a retcon. just conflicting information about something we don't have all of the info on

[stiff fable]

And a bunch of his Operator manifestations too iirc

[strange plinth]

iirc its only the Vagabond that's also missing a finger

[viscid aspen]

https://tenor.com/view/warframe-wally-wall-warframe-wally-slay-gif-17731710966554021720

[stiff fable]

Vagrant (we both made the same mistake last week)

[strange turtle]

One got cut off but multiple dropped, so there’s a few

[stiff fable]

anyway my heavy crack theory suddenly has new ammunition

[strange turtle]

Probably like, two or three

[stiff fable]

The Unum = og finger

One of the Unum's nicknames is "the Wall"

[strange plinth]

i feel like wally would've checked

especially given we were there during TNW

[stiff fable]

He's bound by cause and effect

He needs a reason to check even if he knows the answer ahead of time

[strange plinth]

would 'search for my missing finger around the system' not be enough reason

[stiff fable]

Plus, the Unum's big power is being able to operate across multiple timelines simultaneously

[strange turtle]

That’s not what causality is

[stiff fable]

Which is the one power Wally LACKS

[strange turtle]

Him being bound by cause and effect doesn’t stop him from just, randomly doing stuff

We’re bound by cause and effect and we randomly do stuff

[stiff fable]

Right, but the Unum can just not be there when he looks

Because it isn't bound by causality

[strange plinth]

what

[stiff fable]

Yeah after I saw the thing about the Unum's nickname I went and checked some things

[scenic oar]

So, wally is are a We ?

[strange turtle]

We as in us

Like, irl people

[stiff fable]

Pardon me laptop came unplugged a few hours ago and I didn't notice until it turned off

anyway yeah Onkko has a TON of trouble talking when you ask him about Saya

His brain isn't used to processing linear time anymore

[scenic oar]

BTW, it got me thinking, wally must be very busy in zariman that day, making deals with lot of kids not just MC

[strange plinth]

only one deal

[stiff fable]

(from our perspective)

[strange plinth]

the deal affected all of the other children, there was only one

hence why he can semantics his way into abandoning drifter

[tall echo]

"I can save them, all of them. You just have to want it"

[stiff fable]

I actually wouldn't be surprised if every Tenno remembers making their own deal tbh

[tall echo]

one deal for all tenno

[scenic oar]

So u saying wally only deal with MC tenno, and gives void power to other kids to make them tenno aswell?

[tall echo]

yes

[strange plinth]

mhm

[scenic oar]

Does that makes MC tenno actually more powerful than. Normal tenno ?

[stiff fable]

but anyway yeah going by Onkko's dialogue every Quill is networked with each other

And across multiple parallel realities too

[strange plinth]

not necessarily. they're just the one who made the deal, they have the same powers as everyone else that got affected

[stiff fable]

"Venus, Tessera. Actor zhe-seer-point-now will combine with complex node at zwhong-point-zhul. Notify Quill Veder Soon Tertiary-zhwong, via Quill Montan Secondary, via Quill Onkko Primary. Risk of uncontrolled consequence propagation. Observe and contain."

[scenic oar]

Wait, then if only MC tenno exp stories, then only MC tenno have drifter while other tennos does not have drifter?

[strange plinth]

correct, only one drifter as well

[woven coyote]

Something even the drifter acknowledges

[scenic oar]

well, this makes me more curious about what do normie tenno do all this while actually

[stiff fable]

imagine if that's the Narmer update

Canon alternate Drifters

[scenic oar]

All sleeping in lua ?

Only MC tenno awake?

[stiff fable]

Not since Second Dream, no

Lua is potentially unsafe now

After the player Tenno pulled Lua out of the Void, off-screen the others Tenno extracted themselves from the Reservoir

[strange plinth]

yea, if we had to be taken out of lua for protection, its a safe assumption that the rest were also taken out of lua soon after

[scenic oar]

Man, really wish we get to meet a npc tenno

[stiff fable]

Rell

[woven coyote]

Dunno if that quite constitutes a meeting lol

[lean garden]

well theres at least one other tenno thats awake

that we can confirm is awake

[stiff fable]

Voruna's

[lean garden]

aside from an assumption that the rest would have been woken up, assuming no ludonarrative dissonance that other players can also transfer out of frames

[lean garden]

bingo

[narrow pendant]

ehhh also survival missions

"a lone tenno operative" blah blah

[scenic oar]

I can already imagine a plot, where they introduce a jealousy tenno, as in why only MC tenno get all the attention. Then we as mc tenno have to fight him/her

[stiff fable]

All dialogue before Second Dream completely conflates Warframe with Operator

[lean garden]

That could easily refer to an operative for the "Tenno" faction tho

[stiff fable]

Both are Tenno

[narrow pendant]

fair

[lean garden]

DE, just add a damn "infiltration" mode where we are the operative

solo only mode

[stiff fable]

Add it back you mean?

[scenic oar]

I would assume MC tenno is superior than normal tenno

[stiff fable]

On a technicality

[lean garden]

eeeeh, we have no basis of comparison

[stiff fable]

I'd say that they're closer to the vanguard

Anything they can learn to do others can as well

[lean garden]

since when did we have a mode of being the lone goober?

[narrow pendant]

has a drifter counterpart and the essence of adis inside

[strange plinth]

essence of adis isn't really tied to being a tenno
drifter's separate

[narrow pendant]

lotus in the refractory directly mentions how both drifter and operator have sentient essence inside of them
drifter has lotus' hand
operator has adis' light
She says that the sentient in tau may see it as an honor or as an insult

[scenic oar]

But, I see, Lotus closer to mc tenno, drifter only ally with mc tenno

[lean garden]

que?

[stiff fable]

I remember talking with a friend years ago who told me there'd been a removed mode before spy

So yes, the Operator IS Lotus's favorite child

All her children are equal but one is more equal than the others

[narrow pendant]

ah yes

[stiff fable]

But there ARE other Tenno with railjacks, and Tektolyst artifacts

[scenic oar]

Ah, I see

[fast dew]

Tbf its not

[restive river]

We do have plot armor
And were in the only known human sentient friendship

[fast dew]

That, one just needs more support

Im not sure the other tenno experience Wally's voices

[stiff fable]

Heck you could argue that the Operator is LATE to having a railjack, and late to wake up

[lean garden]

what? deception?

[restive river]

I believe they all suffered from the voices

Iirc the voices are mentioned in chains

[scenic oar]

true

[stiff fable]

hmm that's probably it

[fast dew]

The only other one is. Rell and we can't make him as the standard for how wally treats other tenno, given wally had. A interest in Loid

LOID. I DOD THAT 3 TIMES

3 different names.

Rell.

[stiff fable]

This 'Man in the Wall', these delusions – symptoms of the Void exposure all Tenno experienced.

[narrow pendant]

technically also the valkyr alad captured

she still moved in the cutscene

[stiff fable]

So it's implied other Tenno saw Wally

[narrow pendant]

they had at minimum all the voice we expirienced in the old peacxe

[fast dew]

Mm

[strange plinth]

• Follie's Hunt dialogue talking about the Voices

[scenic oar]

Hahaha, this also explains why wally only disturb us randomly. Coz he's too busy saying hello to other tennos

[restive river]

nvm i don’t think so

[stiff fable]

pfft

[scenic oar]

Need to hop in ship by ship

[stiff fable]

were you around for when Whispers in the Wall released?

[scenic oar]

Obiter*

[fast dew]

Oh yeah lol we're the chosen operator we're just exposed to wally and murmur more exclusively because of that

[restive river]

Wally fr

[stiff fable]

oh that's also true, Margulis put all the kids into the Second Dream to help with that

[scenic oar]

I been around before operator is a thing... well, just that I don't dig deep into lore

[pallid spoke]

My money's on insult.

[stiff fable]

https://www.orokinarchives.com/tennocon-2023-teasers/

DE wrote a series of small horror stories before Whispers launched

[fast dew]

https://tenor.com/view/warframe-entrati-albrecht-entrati-entrati-walking-gif-17498260713109834464

Retreating to read

[stiff fable]

Where different people call in to Nightwave to tell her about the wufus going down around Deimos

[strange plinth]

mmm, the miners digging to deimos from elsewhere is my favorite

[fast dew]

Necraloid is definitely a favourite

[stiff fable]

That is the single most f'd up thing in Warframe since The Sacrifice

[narrow pendant]

"look arthur what gadget i found in parvos' personal belongings"

protea rewinds

[scenic oar]

Well, i don't think I need to read to know that, must be something to do with dead people made into mech

[stiff fable]

Not necraloid lol

actually the base necraloid is weirdly wholesome

They copied Loid's skull and made a mental copy of him to live inside of it

No, the asteroid miners

[scenic oar]

O I see

[tall echo]

-# parvos stole that research from albrecht

[stiff fable]

THAT part is messed up

But also I really like this bit from the Latrox convo

NORA: "The what?"

Caller: "The incessant knocking. It's ceaseless! Anyway, you've no doubt got more interesting callers waiting on your—"

...
NORA: "The knocking, Latrox. What does it sound like?"

Caller: "Like… knocking. Old pipes. Rhizal moles bashing about the place. That sort of thing."

NORA: "What's the rhythm sound like? Did it have a sorta beat to it?"

Caller: "Erm, rhythm? No, it— well, I think it sounded sort of like… One-two-three. One-two-three. Like the Orokin waltzes my old quartermaster used to play. Did… did I say something wrong?"

NORA: "Send me that data, Roxy. All of it."```

honestly these are really good, they should be in game somewhere

[fast dew]

"There was someone with whom I could share these fears. And yet, all of a sudden, right as this all began, they are gone. They would not have abandoned me, would they? So abruptly? So coldly?"

Necraloid. Those are familiar feelings.

[pallid spoke]

Honestly I kinda wish Nora was more relevant to the main plot outside of her narrating during Drifter's segment of New War.

[fast dew]

I think the best part is that. You can hear the knocking in the requiem log room

[stiff fable]

that was the plan with the story-based Nightwaves in 2019

[strange plinth]

easiest way to do that is converting those old nightwaves into quests,,,

[fast dew]

That was pretty cool

[stiff fable]

they should have left that

[fast dew]

Ehh, I can see why they removed it

Or. It stops whatever happens

[stiff fable]

at least from New War to Whispers

[pallid spoke]

Eh, that never felt like main story to me, just side story.

[fast dew]

Ive noticed it once, then never again lol

[tall echo]

the door's open, why keep the knocking

[fast dew]

Oh yeah I wonder if Father heard it

[stiff fable]

Part of the Kalymos Sequence involved putting the family to sleep when the weird stuff started

[fast dew]

He killed murmur, of course

[fast dew]

they failed that part lol

Father. Killed murmur

He was aware of.. something

[lean garden]

I need to check father's new idles because I had the impression it was before... well... worm

[stiff fable]

It was never going to be a perfect solution

[lean garden]

but then again when I try to hear the lines in game I dont get them no matter how many times I force an idle

[fast dew]

I mean he is like. Right next to that door isnt he?

[fast dew]

Have. You gotten loid up there or

[stiff fable]

Mother was hearing the knocking in her dreams long before Chains

[fast dew]

Not even her dreams

[lean garden]

Yea, I can get kaeli to tell me loid has questionable taste in men

[fast dew]

That dream was something that actually happened

[strange plinth]

-# he's one of the farthest away from necraloid's room, no?

[fast dew]

Time to check

[stiff fable]

Grandmother's the farthest

I believe Father and Mother are equally close

[strange plinth]

daughter is the closest i think, then mother, father, son, grandmother, otak

[stiff fable]

But they're still a room away

[lean garden]

Ok so from what I can tell by the dialogue

Father has just been occasionally dealing with them from a time period of [whenever the extra secret labs were made] to [now]

[stiff fable]

He did build the necradogs and small necramechs for the labs

[fast dew]

Yeah you right 💔

[restive river]

Funnily enough
I’m hearing knocking right now

I’m p sure it’s my cat

[lean garden]

mhmm

[restive river]

But y’never know

[stiff fable]

Get the door.

It's domino's.

[restive river]

:O

[fast dew]

Reckon Vilcor just finds piles of sand sometimes

[restive river]

Free pizza

[fast dew]

"Sand"

[stiff fable]

damn suddenly I want pizza

ughhhhhhhh

I ate vegan all day

[fast dew]

Same but I didnt get a refund for something and im waiting on that

[fast dew]

Albrecht core/j
-# yes it was just a vegetable pizza, still

[stiff fable]

I've got personal pizzas in the basement, I'll air fry one and eat half

[fast dew]

With. God damn olives.

God the man is disgusting

[pale cedar]

Just go ask the delivery guy in 1999 to bring you one he even stays delivering in the plague year

[stiff fable]

hahaha

Mob pizza

[restive river]

What’s Wally’s pizza order

[stiff fable]

"Delivery in 20 minutes or we shoot the delivery guy"

[restive river]

Pineapple pizza with universal dust on top

[stiff fable]

Hawaiian. Not because it's bad but because he knows it'll provoke a reaction.

If he actually wanted to disgust people, he'd order a pesto pizza with no other toppings

[restive river]

No I mean the bad kind, the pineapple from a can kind

[stiff fable]

Mmmmmmmmm

so I'm trying to think of what the next vocal song is going to be

Starting with We All Lift Together we've had pop songs, sea shanties, dirges and an opera

[restive river]

Rap

[stiff fable]

damn that probably is in the pipe

good guess

[restive river]

It would be wild to get a musical quest

[stiff fable]

Warframe Musical Episode!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xjy6idrqHqo

This but Grineer

[lean garden]

Why you always calling us when you got some drama

[stiff fable]

One of these days we'll repay you, slay you!

[lean garden]

Best part of that episode, even though we got kpop klingons instead of klingon opera

[stiff fable]

I stan the Bat'leth Boys

[fast dew]

Chat how. How did Albrecht see what happened in the void if. He got blinded by it?

[pale cedar]

He used his other 4 senses instead

[fast dew]

[strange plinth]

based on the wording in Khra, he was blinded as he came back rather than as he entered the void

[fast dew]

Ic ic

So. How would that have happened?

Did he like. Fall onto glass that happened to get into both of his eyes?

[strange plinth]

When I arrived at the door, or rather, the door arrived at me, I howled, hurling myself inside. Out. And then and there, I was. Lost and unlost. Howling on the floor in harmony with my wretched Kalymos. Lacerated in flesh and heart. Scattered as the bell glass. Spilling blood and stomach on the cold, stone floor. But I sensed the other there, at the wall's breach behind me, reaching still. I screamed, but my voice was gone. Forever. I looked, but my eyes would never see again.
tbh maybe

[fast dew]

Also, do we think the. Spilling blood and stomach on the cold stone floor part is supposed to be seen as him throwing up or him literally having his stomach on the floor?

Because i imagine screaming while throwing up probably is. Pretty hard

[strange plinth]

first assumption was literal, he's cut up enough that his organs are spilling out just as his blood is
but also. he's landing on glass, i'm not sure if it'd do that much damage

[fast dew]

Iii also could reason that its not. Glass that shatters into small pieces [tempered]

It was a big diving bell, enough to hold him comfortably

[strange plinth]

fair point

[fast dew]

I could argue that some of the bottom rail structure held the other half of the glass, which he could've fallen on

[stiff fable]

but small enough that him tripping threw the bell off course and cut it through the portal

[fast dew]

Unbalanced, not small

In fact, its harder to balance a larger structure than a smaller one, when it comes to spherical shapes, if the shape of the bell in the requiem is accurate

Youd need wide rails for it

And. If he didn't do that, then it would be easy to topple it

[strange plinth]

mm
yeah those could cut sufficiently

[fast dew]

So
Yeah but honestly could've been both?

I imagine his mouth was producing.. something

If not him literally throwing up blood lol

[fast dew]

Also love the obols on the ground lol

Even in the recounting of a traumatic event, they're present

[stiff fable]

those aren't obols, they're much too large

[fast dew]

Obols are massive, wdym? The golden circles everywhere are. Not one size

The ones on Albrecht's coat are pretty big too

[lean garden]

imagine, albrecht wrote so dramatically, but from euleria's poc he was actually just twitching on the floor foaming at the mouth

[stiff fable]

?????

Obols are coins

[fast dew]

Yeah and

[lean garden]

the whole "wrote close it" bit was just albrecht tapping frantically on the floor

[fast dew]

Theres big ass obols still

[stiff fable]

They can be large coins, but not a significant percent of the bell

[fast dew]

Probably gurgling slightly

[strange plinth]

standard obols are the small coins, yea
there's some large obols in the referactory, even
i'd still call the ones there obols

[lean garden]

she closed it not because he was panicking but because he was a medical emergency on the floor in the yamcha pose

[rich sphinx]

Is there a video that explains the whole lore in chronological order

[strange plinth]

not a good one

[fast dew]

Ngl she. Probably did lol

[stiff fable]

no, because we don't have all the lore in chronological order

[lean garden]

ljke those stories where folks having seizures remember their seizures very differently from reality

[rich sphinx]

Oop

[fast dew]

I Can confirm

The pain you feel is like nothing else.

[lean garden]

"Yea I calmly stood up and said 'im going to have a seizure, nobody panic'"

"Bro you shot up and shouted 'PANIC' and then collapsed"

[fast dew]

I had tonic clonic seizures, and. I remembered parts when i was semi conscious and when it devolved into a lesser one, and it. hurt

I felt like i was. Going everywhere but I was kinda just twitching face first

Traumatic 0/10 experience

[lofty locust]

hi sorry for interrupting the important albrecht talks, i guess it's in the same vein as albrecht because it's orokin related but, i recently reset the devil's triad and roathe seems to know that you reset. how does he know, i wonder? are orokin immune to time loops? someone in regional chat suggested that it's because orokin are more in tune with albrecht's tech but if that's so, is duviri of the drifter's making, or of albrecht's???

[fast dew]

Oh, no not at all.

The loop is of a different nature

Here we just erase their memories with the infestation

[lofty locust]

ohhhhhhh

[strange plinth]

ok the person in region chat was wrong
roathe knows about resets because the work in descendia goes deeper than your chats do
also the triad aren't even in a timeloop so there's nothing to be "attuned" to

[lean garden]

Roathe is a smart cookie

[fast dew]

While the 1999 and duviri loops are temporal

And. Yes Albrecht made the 1999 loop

No clue how he did, he just did

[lofty locust]

now i'm so confused, how the heck does one use the infestation to erase your memories? what's... what's the tech here...

[lean garden]

tech?

aint no tech here

✨ SPACE MAGIC ✨

[fast dew]

Pure infestation shenanigans

[radiant pier]

balls

[strange plinth]

that is. unknown, even to the one doing it.
the infestation has a weird relationship with time, so maybe it can. revert minds to a prior point, or something,
but just surface knowledge

[fast dew]

Albrecht did it to roathe as well, so its not a trait exclusive to drifter

[pale cedar]

I wonder what the Infestation is trying to hide by removing them

[lofty locust]

@.@ what the heck... i was trying to simulate the kim chats thinking i'd have to redo them the same way i do it with 1999, but it seems there's a LOT more variables overall in there. most intriguingly, the whole "infestation removing memories" thing. somehow i feel bad? like, it's like that one gif with "are we the baddies?"

[fast dew]

Yeah.

Its pretty messed up

[strange plinth]

consequences of your actions be upon ye

[fast dew]

I wonder if Roathe knowing of the loop is an attempt to make us realise it

[lofty locust]

this is making me wonder in depth about what i'm about to do to roathe after i'm done 😭 i'm sorry bbg!!! i didn't want you to villain into the sun!!!

[fast dew]

:)

[strange plinth]

-# (except sometimes the consequences are not related to your actions and its just the triad being messed up)

[fast dew]

Dw hes still a bigot, he's still pretty bad

Don't feel too much sympathy

[lofty locust]

as all orokin seem to be...

[fast dew]

Albrecht seemed pretty normal actually

But. Thats because bro has the self esteem of a wet rat

His granddaughter however.

[lofty locust]

i find it funny that he had a... what's the male word for mistress. i'm talking about loid here. they tried to lavender marriage him.

[fast dew]

Oh, no.

It was an arranged marriage. She's dead.

[lofty locust]

....what. g. grandmother is dead?!

[fast dew]

Loid might even predate her lol

Oh.

You meant. Her

No wrong grandmother

Thats Father's mother

[lofty locust]

oh okay okay

[pale cedar]

Normal?
Autismbrecht and normal don't go together

[strange plinth]

Grandmother is Father's mother
Albrecht is Mother's father
titles. are fun.

[fast dew]

Albrecht had a wife, Gerivaine

She's. Dead. Way before the night of the naga drums too

[lofty locust]

oh so that's NOT grandmother. that's just his dead wife.

[fast dew]

And according to Son, it was exclusively done to produce an ideal offspring

Genetics wise

[lofty locust]

is mother ideal, then?

[fast dew]

Eugenics, no. Euleria :D

[pale cedar]

I wanna know how she died with Orokin mastered biology being a thing

[fast dew]

Supposedly. Roathe believes so

[lofty locust]

yuvan theatre lalalala gods no

[fast dew]

Not all orokin had access to the yuvan theater actually

They had the. Cryoleums

[lofty locust]

i know albrecht didn't choose to take the kuva and the whole orokin blue arm thing, but i don't understand cryoleums yet

[fast dew]

Noone does really

Oh, and Albrecht was blue

[pale cedar]

I don't wanna know why she didn't have a Yuvan I just wanna know what could even kill her

[lofty locust]

albrecht WAS blue?!

[pale cedar]

Yes

[strange plinth]

yea there's the zariman portrait w/ him blue

[lofty locust]

guys i'm finding out so many new things oh my god

[pale cedar]

He is still Orokin

[strange plinth]

he just stopped being blue to blend in in 1999

[fast dew]

Woe

He was also kinda chubby. Dad bod Albrecht

I wouldve killed to see this form in game

But. People would've been assholes

[lofty locust]

oh. huh. i was under the impression he rejected kuva because of the 1999 chat with aoi where she asks whos the best orokin.

[pale cedar]

Albrecht went to the gym and did some Wally bench presses and Wally punching bags

[fast dew]

He. Did do continuity

[strange plinth]

he's done it before but did swear it off

[fast dew]

But. There's a chance it was before they. Started using children

[strange plinth]

however the blue skin is not a result of kuva/continuity, just part of orokin fashion

[fast dew]

Bet you didn't know he has purple eyeliner

And piercings :)

[strange plinth]

same with the long arm (which albrecht actually didn't do)

[strange plinth]

woah

[fast dew]

Sorry autism

[lofty locust]

NO??? I UNDERSTAND WHY ROATHE SAYS THAT THE OROKIN WERE VERY ARTISTIC

[fast dew]

Look at the images i just forwarded lol

Shit and I think black on the top too

Loid also has a septum piercing, but it disappears sometimes

[lofty locust]

i just checked them, oh my wow. this is a trove of info. should've joined this server sooner i was really DEVOTED to the lore because of speedrunning the quests

[pale cedar]

Why aren't those piercings gold like almost everything else there

[fast dew]

Im the Albrecht lore guy who will also defend the man until I die.

I also am very disgusted with him

The chat is pretty cool

[pale cedar]

Such a love hate relationship

[fast dew]

Until. Someone comes and disrupts the natural order of things

[fast dew]

Its a personal thing, I won't get into it

[fast dew]

Woe, Loid

[pale cedar]

I just want to shoot Albrecht because he shot me

[strange plinth]

the piercing's on the floof, they've gotta fix it disappearing sometimes

[fast dew]

They literally just nuked it from the sanctum for some reason

It appears elsewhere

Just. Not the sanctum

Evidence that he doesn't wear it when working

[strange plinth]

it was intentional all along /s

[pale cedar]

He wore it in Old Peace didn't he

[fast dew]

He did!

[pale cedar]

He was working then

[fast dew]

I was celebrating it lol

Ahh different type of work

[lofty locust]

those green eyes are to be envied, love them. i think of him in canon as a sort of tired wine uncle to the Tenno

[fast dew]

As in. Bird-3-is-not-there-to-yoink-it work

[smoky gulch]

"Come on. Let's at least pretend this mess can still work."

[fast dew]

He did help raise Euleria, when Albrecht struggled to, so. Perhaps hes the step grandfather

Because. Mother adopted us against our will/j

[pale cedar]

What work is he even doing
He just stands there

[fast dew]

Monitoring the cavia

Keeping an eye on us

Acting as a vendor

[strange plinth]

waiting for the results of something he was doing just before we showed up obv

[fast dew]

Keeping an eye on the lotus

Looming over Roathe

A lot of things

[lofty locust]

see there's something that i spotted in roathe's chats when i was doing them the first time around. why does roathe think that the lotus's circuitry will fail her? or that the tenno will turn on the world because of it?

[pale cedar]

Someone should tell Loid the mess already worked

[fast dew]

Hes a bigot with a plot.

[lofty locust]

elaborate

[fast dew]

He's treating a sentient... sentient like a machine

[strange plinth]

roathe likes to stir the pot
taking something that's potentially possible and taking it to the extreme

[fast dew]

Which. Is not true for her

And he's. Trying to get us to doubt her

For... whatever reason

He's either doing it to manipulate us, or he's doing it for shits and giggles

Both are highly likely

[lean garden]

he who stirs the shit must lick the spoon

[lofty locust]

he likes to wax philosophical as far as i've seen. i wonder how our tenno would regard him if they ever saw face to face.

[fast dew]

These obols are quite large too, ceiling obols. There's no maximum size to a coin lol

[pale cedar]

It's funny how people can't accept just because he wants something to happen doesn't mean it will happen

Some people can't understand Orokin love saying stuff to make stuff happen

[fast dew]

Tbf they mostly have experience with orokin who. Make those things happen

And then theres. Nihil

[lofty locust]

oh no i fully understand that. i just find it funny he thinks that he's gonna get mauled by thousands of traumatized teens at the behest of a scary giant machine that is their mom. the tenno are not a hivemind, roathe!! he needs some deprogramming i fear lulz

[fast dew]

LMAO

Yeah hes a coward, course he feels scared

Can you tell i don't like him.

[pale cedar]

How can you both be a coward and be someone who fought on the battlefield

[fast dew]

They're not mutually exclusive

Hes just cowardly in other ways

[lofty locust]

he's a lil shit. first time i saw him i had the urge to say this:

[fast dew]

Heh

[lofty locust]

(yes i did make this meme in two minutes how could you tell)

[fast dew]

I call him. Roach.

[restive river]

Roache

[lofty locust]

he's like. in terms of likeness i like him in the same way i like viktor vodyanoi. i like making these men nervous and i won't stop

[pale cedar]

Is there a roach
Not my name?

[fast dew]

Nemesis this is the first time you do not make sense to me

[midnight ice]

he's kinda like temu raphael

[fast dew]

Make the man nervous yes good

[pale cedar]

Good

[lofty locust]

ask and ye shall receive

[restive river]

If Roathe wasn’t kinda useful would we have killed him by now

[pale cedar]

Perfect

[fast dew]

Mm. At least daughter likes him

Wonder why.

[lofty locust]

he is isn't he?! with the waxing poetical and the whole talk of morality and "let's make a deal" and blablabla, i'm surprised it's not raphael's voice actor who voices roathe, there would have been an UPROAR

[restive river]

Shocker

[pale cedar]

I don't like Daughter for being a hypocrite

[restive river]

I like DE reminding us that yes
The Orokin are still Orokin lol

[fast dew]

Still finding the tumblr post where someone was upset that Son did continuity

Fork found in kitchen

[restive river]

LOL

[lofty locust]

i have found out that there is a filter! will try to reword. ahem

[fast dew]

Like what did they expect

[midnight ice]

lacks raphael's flair of "i sing my own theme song" (an uriel wagging his tail to the theme song does not count) and the whole jazz of the House of Hope
he's just stuck here with two bums without electricity

[restive river]

For their blorbo to not be evil lol

[fast dew]

I know i. Commented on the post, but I do not think that tumblr allows you to search with that 💔

Waitm

[pale cedar]

Orokin might be Orokin and act Orokin

[lofty locust]

the funniest thing alive out of my entire interactions with roathe is. when he talks about nitokh. in the same sentence he wants to bed her and also kill her. it's unbelievable. thank you for being a weirdo, roathe

[restive river]

Black rom from Homestuck aah

[lofty locust]

well... he did engineer a helminth out of his own blood... gotta give him some credit at least... less of a narcissistic bum than raphael...

no, i changed my mind, they're like both narcissistic, but different flavors of narc

[restive river]

He also made it into a time portal that’s gold lol

He really made an escape route and decided
Hm
It better look cool
Very Orokin lol

[pale cedar]

There was someone who tried telling me the Prime weapons in Old Peace don't count as Prime weapons

[restive river]

What lol

[lofty locust]

apparently there was an uriel prime....

[fast dew]

They mightve deleted it

Shit 💔

[strange plinth]

whuh

[restive river]

Why isn’t the trumna in the quest prime
Did Xaku prime not happen yet

[fast dew]

i did find a very fluffy loid though

[pale cedar]

Base

[restive river]

Maybe they realized they were wrong

[lofty locust]

imo, as far as i know, right, i'm pretty sure some primes came before their normal counterparts. case in point being the old peace weapons

[fast dew]

I love going through my tumblr reposts and finding delightful art that folk i like posted

[pale cedar]

I think the person thought because it isn't in relics it isn't Prime

[fast dew]

Not all, some are. Some aren't

[restive river]

Some primes came first some came later
It’s a case by case basis

[lofty locust]

i know, that's what i'm saying

[strange plinth]

primes are just fancy variants of the regular
in most cases, both were in use at the same time

[smoky gulch]

Could Deimos Entrati do the morally evil thing and Continuity into non-infested hosts?

[strange plinth]

roathe can't continuity because he's infested, so

[restive river]

Nope, can’t continuity out of an infested body

I’d imagine their mind, their consciousness is part of the hivemind enough that it can’t “jump ship”
Also we’re not letting them murder someone :p

[smoky gulch]

Right, I should get around doing KIMchi-tchats to give old piece a chance

[pale cedar]

Time to try that to see what happens for science of course

[fast dew]

Wonder if Albrecht can help..

If he managed to halt techrot progression, I wonder if he could help halt greystrain progression

[restive river]

Does he work with separating consciousnesses from a horribly tangled and also conscious mass?

[pale cedar]

Albrecht can only help by making you infested

[fast dew]

I. Was thinking stopping it from worming their brains further

[lofty locust]

oh, another thing, since roathe loves to wax philosophical about it: why does he seem to think that the man in the wall is of our making? like, why does he think albrecht and humankind itself made it? i know he's all focused on conceptual embodiment, but it's hard to agree, yknow?

[restive river]

You can’t stop it fully

[fast dew]

You can slow it down, get it slow enough maybe

And. Daughter is great and all but how much experience does she have with infestation manipulation?

[restive river]

I prefer the idea Albrecht “made” it and due to it being a product of the void emotions and perceptions of it can have some level of impact on it
If you’re afraid of it it grows more powerful

[fast dew]

Mainly cuz the game doesn't let you agree until the end

But theres been more evidence he is a case of conceptual embodiment rather than just a random dude in the void

[strange plinth]

i mean, the man in the wall being CE lines up
albrecht breaks into the void with that mental state and creates something like that

[restive river]

The infestation’s gonna outlast Albrecht, he can’t help them forever

[pale cedar]

I wonder what happens if you give Helminth to the Infestation

[lofty locust]

NOOO NOT KIRBY DON'T LET THEM TAKE MY KIRBY

[restive river]

Friend :)

[restive river]

It already uses the mouths, funnily enough

The deimos balloons are helminth mouths

[fast dew]

I mean. If he can halt it long enough to make a cure to help reverse it, or parts of it, I think he could help a lot more

Than. Whatever grandma is doing with the tea