lore-discussion

[pale cedar]

Yeah

The 1000 laws they have

[fast dew]

That rule isnt just for lower caste members, as it goes for Albrecht and loid as well

[brittle siren]

idk if it apply for Archimedean and a Seven

[pale cedar]

Orokin just can't really get punished for it

[cunning ore]

Like Jade and Sorren are both Dax so they got punished.
And here there Ballas and Margulis somehow still approved. So now i have more questions:
If the Archimedean be prohibited from marriage?
If that Ballas's effort in making Margulis into his consort?

[brittle siren]

Sorren is low guardian not Dax

[cunning ore]

Oh yeah, Loid and Albretch case

[fast dew]

I mean. Its a rule specifically done to avoid mixing castes. Loid and Albrecht could've been very close caste wise, but it was still very. Against it

[brittle siren]

Loid is a butler + assistant

[cunning ore]

Mb then, but still the question remain

[pale cedar]

Even the Archimedeans can get punished for it

[brittle siren]

unless they become blue

I mean Ordan almost become one

iirc

[fast dew]

They. could become orokin, yes

But given that it was. Illegal to mix castes, I don't think it would've been through that

[pale cedar]

Basically, you are immune from most laws if you're blue

Anything less than that you can

[brittle siren]

Ballas hold a lot of power, he could just turn Margulis into an Orokin at anytime, but jealousy get over him and you know the story

[fast dew]

High chance she wouldve refused

[cunning ore]

Since it illegal for them, but Ballas did somehow manage his case to be publicable and legal so i just ponder if this about social-rank or standing affect. Margulis still stayed the same as an Archimedean as we known so the offer of being Onigiri really not affect much since if there is, there possible it leaning toward Orokin marriage

[brittle siren]

imagine blue Loid

[pale cedar]

Bloid

[fast dew]

That was an idea sometime in concept

[cunning ore]

Oh 😭 Onigiri

[brittle siren]

true but everyone know Margulis and Ballas is a thing and no one dare to bat an eye

[cunning ore]

Orokin, mb mb

[pale cedar]

Its funny how many think he is Orokin despite the fact he isn't Blue

[brittle siren]

Hunhow did mistake Alad as one

[cunning ore]

It still against the rule tho, since Margulis still stayed as An Archimedean

[fast dew]

He was. Visually close to Albrecht

[pale cedar]

Hunhow was just being racist

[fast dew]

The C face line reminds me of ballas lol

[cunning ore]

Because Orokon is a complicated humankind

[cunning ore]

Thank, i gonna yoink that

[brittle siren]

F column is so cool

[fast dew]

Im a A or E column enjoyer

[cunning ore]

Not cool for a gei

[brittle siren]

E looks like Mc Donald man

[cunning ore]

So they need a face suit with Albretch taste and a boobs window

[fast dew]

Yeah loid has always had. Most ideas with the boob window

[cunning ore]

Okay, but why Margulis and Loid have boobs window outfit?

Yonta dont have that-

[fast dew]

Its just orokin era fashion

She kinda does?

[cunning ore]

Wait she does?

[fast dew]

Just. Not as low as either of them

[fast dew]

Actually Loid's is pretty high up men just have different anatomy

[cunning ore]

Now i think it shoulder-open

But Margulis and Loid window quite the same a little?

[fast dew]

Its low cut, she's. Probably just flatter i think

[pale cedar]

Why does Margulis often look like a statue?

[cunning ore]

If you once saw the Aphrodite picture

[crimson abyss]

did the orokin have white canes for the blind

[fast dew]

Mm, idk. Where the full image is actually from but its pretty low cut i think

[brittle siren]

it a Lotus skin so it use the same posture

[cunning ore]

I doubt they even can be blinded

[fast dew]

Albrecht was

[cunning ore]

Yea, so not the same type of boobwindows

[cunning ore]

Dang-

I still wonder how he can see road with that helmet

[fast dew]

He got better, after. Healing

[crimson abyss]

margulis was blinded

[cunning ore]

Got this a bit weird question: Yonta flatter than Loid?

[fast dew]

She wasnt orokin

[crimson abyss]

i meant the empire

[pale cedar]

You can blind an Orokin as they are still human

[fast dew]

Loid has muscular pecs, which are in a different spot sorta than. Boobs

[crimson abyss]

not the blue creatures

[cunning ore]

So flatter than Loid?

[pale cedar]

Now
Can you blind Wally?

[fast dew]

No, not in the same way

[brittle siren]

I mean his wall form has no eye

and most of his eyes are all over the place

[fast dew]

Boob mass will be lower down, smthn smthn weight

[cunning ore]

Oh so Margulis > Yonta > Loid

[fast dew]

which is why they are. Roughly the same cut, but one isnt the same as the other, regarding Margulis

[brittle siren]

we did blind a lot of it during the Fragmented boss fight

[fast dew]

I. Should draw an example

[crimson abyss]

he already looks blind

[fast dew]

The lidless eye..

[fast dew]

Pretty much 😭

[cunning ore]

Assume something blind like assauming a definition that having a conceptual embodiment to be blinded

Interesting, i will ask if my chair blind

[cunning ore]

Okay, got it

[crimson abyss]

he doesnt have any pupils

[fast dew]

Doesnt need them

[cunning ore]

My chair also have only limbs

[pale cedar]

Can we blind Thomas for plotting to bite me?

[crimson abyss]

No

[fast dew]

Do it

Ill bite you harder

[dark compass]

even if you blind Thomas, the bite will be delivered by smell

[fast dew]

Not even smell, hearing bro

I can hear shit

[dark compass]

oh right

[fast dew]

[dark compass]

hearing exists, i forget sometimes

[fast dew]

Echolocation

[crimson abyss]

He can just run away

[pale cedar]

https://tenor.com/view/warframe-trailer-cinematic-trailer-grineer-tenno-gif-23972872

Hear this

[fast dew]

Cannot escape the rage of a man scorned

https://tenor.com/view/single-hit-real-cat-car-gif-15576000014729577925

The hunger.

[cunning ore]

I cannot hear it

[pale cedar]

Think Grineer will run if I do this in gameplay?

[crimson abyss]

Yes

[cunning ore]

I think it will work like Silence of Banshee

[fast dew]

Guh

[pale cedar]

Think there's a single Warframe character who never had a bad thing happen to them?

[crimson abyss]

no

impossible

[violet storm]

No one is safe

Not a single soul or core

[smoky gulch]

Honestly it's wild how long it took before we got literal Alchemist Albrecht into story, considering we had stuff like rubedo since day 1

[narrow pendant]

helminth probably

[loud oriole]

idk i put googly eyes on mine, along with ball arses staff as “glasses”

that seems bad to me

[pale cedar]

Helminth had to watch their children be put to grave

[narrow pendant]

ok well

what about drippy then 😭

drip drip hurray

[pale cedar]

Drippy got nuked

Orokin also erased Drippy when the internet was abandoned

[narrow pendant]

ok i got it now

third orb mother, because there is no lore lmao

[drifting lintel]

She's a Frankensteins monster of a sentient mixed with corpus tech

[narrow pendant]

that being bad to itself depends on your point of view

[drifting lintel]

Maybe nothing bad happened to "her" but a lot of bad things happened to the sentient

[ocean geyser]

Bro’s all ears

Hm

[fast dew]

All ears..

[ocean geyser]

Hey why aren’t there murmur enemies with bigass ears

[pale cedar]

She was forgotten by DE
That's bad

[fast dew]

All eyes all ears..

[ocean geyser]

Let her take her bath :(

[narrow pendant]

which one

[fast dew]

Mm, maybe cuz Albrecht can't listen to shit so they don't know what a ear is

[ocean geyser]

Huh

[narrow pendant]

me when i cant read

[ocean geyser]

Warframe player moment

[drifting lintel]

Maroo?

[pale cedar]

Didn't she have to get rescued or something in her quest?

[drifting lintel]

I didn't even know she had a quest

[pale cedar]

Stolen dreams

Pretty sure she sends a distress signal in it

Can't remember what she did to get captured though as I haven't done it for years

[drifting lintel]

I just reread the wiki. She was hiding from us and we capture her

All we know is shes a freelancer thief and she found the arcane codacies.
She was gonna hand them over to the grineer but hid on a corpus base where we find and capture her.

[pale cedar]

Either way

Lotus: "Maroo, I am the Lotus. I come as a friend. You are in mortal danger and you need to come with us."

Something bad happened to her

Nobody be safe in this game

[narrow pendant]

just realized that panel at the end of the hex had an unknown voidtongue glyph

whith albrechts book on his desk having possibly a lot more

[ocean geyser]

was going to
She basically sold the grineer a fake codice because she thinks they smell
And sold a real one to the Corpus

So the grineer were trying to kill her

[pale cedar]

If you think about it

Someone planning to kill you is still something bad

[ocean geyser]

Yeah

But rather it was going to happen instead of it already happening

I could be nitpicking

The semantics….

[pale cedar]

It's Bad vs worse

Finding a character nothing bad happened to is hard because we're often sent in to deal with something bad happening to a character

Or the aftermath of it

[zenith ore]

||Margulis||, isn't she the ||lotus||? Why did she say ||Margulis|| was murdered by the orikin? This is at the end of second dream

[humble sierra]

How much of the quests have you done?

[pale cedar]

2 seperate characters

[zenith ore]

Replaying

To uncover more stuff

[fast dew]

Margulis is who Natah was supposed to mimic lol

[humble sierra]

Margulis was the original, Natah was made after her death

[zenith ore]

Dang

[humble sierra]

Margulis was executed by the 7 because she objected to the Tenno becoming Warframes

[fast dew]

Yeah it. Is random

[zenith ore]

Now I hate ballas more than I hated him before

[fast dew]

Not sure why they didn't just repeat a glyph

[humble sierra]

Ballas, being one of the 7, became bitter and that's what caused him to betray the Orokin and help the sentients

[pale cedar]

Could've been made before her death tbh just not used till after it

[fast dew]

Or. Use another

Because theres. Lemme count

6 out of. Like. 8 void tongue glyphs there

Vome, fass, ris, jahu, netra, Xata, khra.. mmm. Missing one.

[humble sierra]

Could be a new glyph

Mara, maybe

[pale cedar]

It's the X one you're missing

[fast dew]

Nah i was just listing off known voidtongue glyphs, i always forget one

[pale cedar]

Lohk maybe

[fast dew]

Oh my god its Lohk

Its either Lohk or Jahu i forget

[pale cedar]

See Thomas we think alike

[fast dew]

Nah im just a brain eating amoeba inside your very full brain :3

[fast dew]

It very much could be, nothing is really done unintentionally I feel

[pale cedar]

Looking at it Lohk is the one not mentioned but visible there

[fast dew]

Mm, Oull needs to be mentioned more

[stiff beacon]

Oull's only purpose is to sit in a requiem mod slot

[pale cedar]

Think about all the possibilities for Possibility to be used

It might break your brain

[ocean geyser]

Im thinking about how people used to think Wally was saying the Requiem words we knew instead of new ones

[fast dew]

Mm, he mainly does

[pale cedar]

Wasnt Oull also the 9th that they forgot to add which is why Albrecht doesn't mention it

[ocean geyser]

Well
Out of those words, he said only TWO we knew

[fast dew]

Probably lmao

[ocean geyser]

Xata and Lohk

[fast dew]

Vass and Fass despite being two different words are very similar audibly

[pale cedar]

Well they are siblings

[fast dew]

No nemesis thats. Vome and Fass

[storm saffron]

Anyone else found Loid's expression right before he smashed the casket of AE a bit malicious?

[fast dew]

Vass is a separate word iirc

[fast dew]

He's angry, I don't blame him

And. He's swinging a giant ass hammer

Hes gonna be scrunching his face lol

[pale cedar]

My book brain attacked me

[fast dew]

Yeah me the brain eating amoeba

[ocean geyser]

So
“Voull Ne Xata Vok, Mara Lohk?”
Was interpreted as

Oull - Ris - Xata - Vome. Khra - Lohk",

My assumption is that people assumed other words weren’t possible or something

[fast dew]

How does one get. Ris from Ne

[pale cedar]

I'm still trying to find where it was said Drifter and Operator would fight each other

[fast dew]

Roach kim

[ocean geyser]

Like i know that it’s hard to hear in the cutscene but these do Not Sound like those words lmao

[fast dew]

Its a theoretical he proposed, though. I really do not like that

[pale cedar]

Nah, a user said it was said somewhere else too

[fast dew]

Roach trying to turn the drifter against the lotus was.
Weird.

[ocean geyser]

Which people immediately latched onto as fact because they can’t comprehend people being biased
Other times people say the conflicting information is bad writing???

[pale cedar]

I doubt it will actually happen

[fast dew]

What is that rat planning

[strange turtle]

Maybe he just hates single mothers

[fast dew]

So thats why he hates Albrecht/j

[pale cedar]

It's almost impossible to happen due to Void pocket rules

[ocean geyser]

Wow two sources of information can conflict sometimes? Man that must totally be bad writing, this never happens!!!
Stupid ass

[fast dew]

Duking it out at the edge of the sanctum

[fast dew]

No clearly kims must be 100% accurate

[ocean geyser]

Lmfao

[pale cedar]

I do think it is just Roathe being Orokin rather than something that will happen

[fast dew]

Woe Daklo

Wait oh my god

Its drawn over the ordis model

[pale cedar]

Was Daklo voiced by Ordis VA or someone else

[fast dew]

Still, its. Weird

Maybe he's just being racist

Either way shit was weird and offputting

[fast dew]

Uhhh no clue

[pale cedar]

Looked at Voice cast

Kevin Cherry

That's actually a funny name

[fast dew]

Mm, it kinda is lol

[cosmic badge]

Throwing hands aboard the zariman

[loud oriole]

-# de pls give us daklo skin, i do not care if its just Ordis but owl, its a cool cephalon design

[tall echo]

(new ordis is already known as owldis to some)

[pale cedar]

Owlscrap when?

[modest lion]

Does Nokko have any lore on what he actually is?

I can only find that the prince paths reference the vallis fungi could be a failed orokin experiment. Did the helminth come in contact with the experimental fungi? Did Ballas make him? Did he just naturally form from the vallis fungi trying to protect itself? My silly mushroom man needs answers

[daring wave]

I've just finished this dialogue with roathe and some part of me thinks that this is foreshadowing something in the future of the game i wonder if im right and how it will look if im

[fast dew]

He might just be being racist here

[woven coyote]

Basically all we have on nokko comes from a sentient fungus and a zombie raised by said fungus that doesnt even remember dying

So yeah not the clearest

[daring wave]

True but this was a long dialogue and he was right with some of his points so idk it feel different

[strange turtle]

A Warframe potentially changed from their base similarly to Lavos and Revenant

[fast dew]

Gotta remember that Roathe comes from a society that hates what the semtients are and what they represent

[modest lion]

Cries in hopes that Flare gets to Prime themselves similar to Lavos

[fast dew]

He was also really close on how neci was possessed by wally, despite it being wrong and mainly without a lot of context

[jolly root]

Bud have you watched star wars the clones even with reprogrammed battle droids still hated the droids

[daring wave]

Yeah oh this convo reviled how many teno are out there apparently there is only a few hundreds of them i thought its in the 10 of thousand's

[daring wave]

True lol

[fast dew]

This being. Albrecht trying to trap wally inside Rulsalka despite that. Defeating the whole purpose of him leaving to 1999

[daring wave]

The game really want me to date here i keep getting this conversation every single day 😂😂

[fast dew]

Do it.
-# do not.

[daring wave]

Im loyal to aoi i shall never betray that trust 😤

[fast dew]

I mean you can date both and aoi is fine with it but

[daring wave]

Wait there was a conversation where she says that i know Marie had this conversation not aoi

[fast dew]

All of them have one. If the writing is good or not is. Up to interpretation.

[woven coyote]

That wasnt a confirmation rlly

It is just drifter throwing out a number

[daring wave]

Throwing out a number?

[woven coyote]

DE has no plans to confirm a number, they even redacted the number of crewmembers on the zariman

[daring wave]

Interesting

[fast dew]

Heh

[woven coyote]

Drifter is basically saying "there are many more of them than me"

[daring wave]

But one of the options of this conversation drifter said that there is hundreds of them

[fast dew]

Have you been agreeing with Marie on her views on Albrecht?

[woven coyote]

Plus just a hundred children for a colony ship feels very low

[woven coyote]

He says hundred singular

[daring wave]

Yes because i really think he is not a bad person so i agree with her

[strange turtle]

They said “idk, a hundred?”

It’s them throwing out a large guess off the top of their head

[fast dew]

Oh my god 😭 I agree too but please be careful

[woven coyote]

Like it really isnt even close to a confirmation or reveal

[daring wave]

Dont forget allot of them died on that ship and in yhe war

[daring wave]

Why

[daring wave]

I see ok well who knows then lol

[strange turtle]

A few died in the war

[fast dew]

You can very easily fail her chat if you agree on too many things

[daring wave]

Only a few ? I find that hard to believe

[strange turtle]

Well the only way we know to kill them is special, unique radiation and age

[daring wave]

Ohhh yeah i know no i answered on how i think and i think he is a good person that's really try to fo good

[woven coyote]

It is just like how DE wont give us a current year

[strange turtle]

Didn’t go on for long enough for age to do any in, and the radiation is, as far as we know, limited to certain spots on Perita

[daring wave]

There is this event de did before the new war that give you a strory of a some teno that got stuck inside the Warframe and dies because of some gas

[strange turtle]

That’s not before the New War

That was before The Old Peace

And it was the radiation I mentioned

[daring wave]

Oh ok my bad

[fast dew]

We'll see at the end of her chats if you didnt screw up or not. Tbf its very easy to screw up the triad. Lyon being probably the easiest to not screw up

[daring wave]

I still wonder how old a teno get get before passing of old age for what i know i believe its a few hundred years or a couple of thousand

[woven coyote]

We have no timeframe at all

We know rell eventually had to abandon his body, but were never given a timeframe

[pale cedar]

Older than 100 considering there's a character in this game that is almost 105

[daring wave]

I managed not yo screw them up because im being careful except that one time with roathe when he got afraid of the decendia i said he is afraid and he got mad lol

[woven coyote]

And considered relatively young

[daring wave]

I thought that there is one that is close to a thousand

[strange turtle]

There’s Teshin, who’s like, over that

[daring wave]

Plus if only they gave us conzu age it will be easier to guess

[pale cedar]

We're over 1000 already

[woven coyote]

Only character whose age is known is darvo

[strange turtle]

Since he didn’t do cryo

[daring wave]

Well yeah but he is a dax they got modded for that

[pale cedar]

Due to there being an advanced system it came with advanced healthcare thus advanced lifespans

[daring wave]

Yup

But 1 thing for sure is even if a tenos boddy dies they dont die in spirit and stay alive in some way like rell

[peak ether]

was just thinking of that, yes the orokin were practically immortal through kuva but its safe to assume that the average lifespan for those under them would be drastically increased

[daring wave]

Yeah that's why i believe a teno can grow old until the age of a thousand or 2 at least

[daring wave]

And he still see him as a child do go figer lol

[peak ether]

id say rell is an outlier in the sense that he transferred himself into harrow so whilst his body is dead his mind is essentially intact.

[fast dew]

Smthn smthn Loid being Albrecht's man for more than a life time

[daring wave]

True that why i believe that a teno can still exist even when there boddy died

[fast dew]

Thank you loid for existing, we all say

[peak ether]

wasnt he in cryosleep? or do you mean even before that?

[pale cedar]

Longest relationship in the game

[fast dew]

Even before then, its a Drusus line

[peak ether]

ahh

[fast dew]

This is true

[misty helm]

That and the fact that the main fragment of lore that points at the fact of Tenno aging without cryosleep, comes from Lotus in a context in which she completely ignored the fact of how the Tenno were affected by Wally's deal; thus she may be completely wrong on her assumption that Tenno age normally... Speciall when we know the kids that came back with the Zariman weren't exactly the same anymore.

[fast dew]

I really need to pin my. Loid minimum age calculation to my clipboard

[daring wave]

Yeah so who knows lol to many clues

[misty helm]

And I said 'fact' too many times... Sorry bout' that 👀

[fast dew]

I also will say I hate the Loid used Kuva theory with a burning passion

[peak ether]

would loid even be allowed to go through continuity?

[fast dew]

No probably not!

[daring wave]

Is loid even an orokin ?

[fast dew]

Which is what makes me annoyed every time I see it

[fast dew]

No! Hes not and thats another thing folk think

The Loid enthusiast is being tortured

[peak ether]

yeah thought so, he's essentially a servant to the entrati family so he isnt an orokin

[strange plinth]

he's an archimedean at the highest iirc. not orokin

[fast dew]

Archimedian assistant at best

[daring wave]

Ok so yeah he wont be allowed

[fast dew]

Some folk think Albrecht would have found a way for him to have done it but

[daring wave]

He stopped doing it himself so why will he

[peak ether]

i think it would entirely depend on whether the orokin, the seven specifically, found him valuable enough for it

[fast dew]

I really do not think Albrecht would risk Loid's. Entire life like that yk? God knows what the 7 would do if they found out

[misty helm]

Is not like there's much of the Orokin left to gatekeep him away of perfoming contiuinity anyways, though That is, assuming the whole ordeal happened during the fall of the Empire

[pale cedar]

Assistant not Archimedean rank

[fast dew]

EXACTLY like man he doesn't even trust himself with it

[peak ether]

they thought Ordan, was valueable enough and allowed him for his contributions to the empire

[fast dew]

True, Loid. Isn't

Loid, to everyone else, is replaceable

[daring wave]

I think that he doesn't want to do it again because what happened with wally not that he doesn't trust himself

[fast dew]

He is insignificant compared to the likes of Ordan

[peak ether]

yeah id imagine his contributions, scientifcally (if any), would've been buried under albrecht's

[fast dew]

He might’ve not been able to actually sign his name on any real research. Wouldn't be surprised

[peak ether]

yeah

[fast dew]

Mhm. After the void incident, he's always had an issue with it

[daring wave]

Yeah

[woven coyote]

Well they said they would allow him to join them, but we dont really know if they meant it

[jolly root]

I did his accidentally

[woven coyote]

For all we know it could have been just planned entertainment from their pov

[tall echo]

"who would win, one hundred tenno-sized drifters or one drifter-sized tenno"

[daring wave]

My kubrow

[peak ether]

also very true, but id assume he would at the very least be granted continuity so he could work for them for enternity, and not join them like a common dax

[fast dew]

Yk its wild to me Loid can deal with having wet clothes. Like damn you really are just normal enough to deal with wet clothes

[tall echo]

clearly all clothing from the orokin era is hydrophobic

[normal mountain]

What If... Loid's suit is waterproof?

[dark compass]

hydrophobic, perhaps?

[tall echo]

(water that gets inside the clothes just flows out through a tiny hole in the shoes)

[misty helm]

*Sad Hydroid noises*

[woven coyote]

I kinda get the feeling they were going for some performance like "oh you can join us but you have to do X" likely killing his family or maiming someone

But then he just went on his own script lol

[tall echo]

get enough water into orokin clothing and you can pressure wash with it

[normal mountain]

meanwhile, Yareli says "Challenge accepted"

[peak ether]

and those psycopaths still found it entertaining

[woven coyote]

Yup

[peak ether]

did they ever explain the specifics of continuity? like he did kill some in that ceromony but how would they come back? maybe through the aya memories?

afaik, the yuvan ceremony is, dying / old orokin (not dead entirely) makes yuvan drink kuva and they take over the body. how would they take over the body if they're "dead" already?

[narrow pendant]

i assume there is some sort of time even after someone is dead in which you can still force the kuva down their throat

like as long as some brainactivity is there maybe, its left open

[tall echo]

the orokin drinks the kuva

[peak ether]

ahh mb

[misty helm]

Yeah, like Roathe mentions he did with that woman

[narrow pendant]

roathe recalls him having his bowels ripped open and he was just barely able to drink it with a female dax of his which he then swapped conciousnesses with

[misty helm]

Apparently the thing can be even done haphazardly, no need for the whole ritual.

[peak ether]

roathe wasnt dead completely though? he was on the brink then next thing he knew he saw his dead body

[narrow pendant]

ritual is just bc orokin held themselves on a godly standard

[peak ether]

i would think, Aya has something to do with it if the orokin dies before the continuity, after all its not our bodies which make us, us. its our memories

[fast dew]

Mm memory plasma

[misty helm]

Yeah, maybe something like the glassing process in which they create cephalons; clearly they can store "consciousness" that way. Through Ayatan too. Althought that last one may not necessarily include a whole person...

[woven coyote]

Actually ritual might have some effect on success rates as described in the voruna leverian

[fast dew]

Mm, glassing and cephalonisation is still a very unknown and weird thing

[woven coyote]

Like tuvuul was desperate then

He didnt have time to setup the ideal ritual but still he tried to make do with a somachord instead of a singer and the grimoire to try and defend against the void (ironic i know)

[misty helm]

Yeah, I do wonder if Nihil can literally get out if they somehow managed to get their hands on an available body; could the entire cephalon/glassing process be reverted? Could his mind actually jump into a living, breathing body? If so, then that's a ticket to introduce a whole lot of Orokin that may had done the same to save themselves from death in the scenario in which there's no inmediate available body

[peak ether]

speaking of, is it the same grimoir from the labs or are there multiple void touched grimoires?

[fast dew]

Multiple i presume

[stiff fable]

Albrecht had a personal grimoire which is the one you get as a weapon

[fast dew]

And. Im. Not sure it was explicitly a grimoire

[pale cedar]

He had to be let out by another person

[stiff fable]

But tuvul wouldn't have used that one

[narrow pendant]

an oubliette is a medieval torture method in which an alive naked individual would be lowered in an extremely narrow hole in the ground with grates at the top where they would be left to die of hunger, it would be intentionally be built close castles so that they would hear the sounds of people enjoying their day

so no, i dont think nihil can get out by himself lol

[peak ether]

ik that was a thing, never knew its name interesting

[fast dew]

He does ask us very very nicely to let him out

[peak ether]

DE's naming scheme always amazes me, they're always so good

[narrow pendant]

been lately watching videos on the worst torture methods in history lol

for scientific purposes ofcourse

now i just need a ballas voodoo doll

[pale cedar]

What is the worst?
To kill Orokin of course

[narrow pendant]

according to some scale the worst one was supposedly the act of restraining a person publicly then systematically snipping out pieces of their body from least lethal to most

[peak ether]

dipping their feet in salt water for hours and having a goat lick them

[narrow pendant]

"death by a thousand cuts"

originated in china, was still in practice in some southamerican countries until the 1980s..

[peak ether]

on sleep deprivation and irregular water droplet timings on their head for an extra touch

[main arch]

https://tenor.com/view/weegeepie-luigi-oh-hell-no-garrys-mod-ragdoll-gif-5306608774005028032

[peak ether]

killing the orokin is too merciful

[narrow pendant]

put them in permanent water torture

the one where its just irregularly timed water droplets to the face

or make them farm for pre-buffed equinox droprates

[peak ether]

great minds think alike! (im not finishing the quote)

[tall echo]

that... is the end of the quote

[peak ether]

nope its, "Great minds think alike, but fools rarely seldom differ" its misused all the time

[tall echo]

I think that's just some made up extension like "curiosity killed the cat but satisfaction brought it back"

[main arch]

Me when I come to the conclusion Lavos is potentially able to transmute the mods on himself

[tall echo]

well
technically?

[gritty dew]

okay im playing through the old peace and im confused by the setting, is our Tenno transferring to an alternate universe of Tau or is this truly what its like over there, and what is entirely our goal and why is Ballas back

[loud oriole]

revisiting old memories, current day tau is vastly different

[misty helm]

You could see it as doing a regression to dig out our memories of what happened during that time

[tall echo]

old peace, it's just memories from a truce time in the old war

[peak ether]

adding a layer to the Old war against the sentience too because before this we assumed it was just one big war rather than it being split in two with a treaty in between

[tall echo]

(unnecessary extra depth that messed up the known timeline)

[peak ether]

how did it mess up the timeline?

[tall echo]

mostly the timeline of sentients vs zariman

[peak ether]

elaborate? i dont know what you mean

[gritty dew]

when people say messing up a timeline i always take it as the writers clearing up gaps in the existing timeline and presumptions people made prior to the fleshed out timeline. Not really messing it up but making it more fleshed out

[tall echo]

before old peace it was assumed that the zariman predated the sentients, not that the zariman stuff happened bc some orokin got impatient

then they felt the need to make it more complicated for some reason

[gritty dew]

key word: assumed

in your words it was never confirmed as such

[pale cedar]

It was heavily implied as such based on other things

[restive river]

actually we had evidence the sentients were before the Zariman ever since either Duviri or Kullervo's update
whichever one added the zariman tablet about it

it was assumed to be the other way around but we've had the pieces since then

yup it was Kullervi's update

[Inside the citadel at Kullervo's Hold]

7. Who is constructing the Extrasolar Rail between Pluto and Tau?

A. An elite group of loyal servants of the Seven (correct)

B. A new, hardy strain of Grineer Void Engineers

I recall rereading this and it clicking that the proposed timeline didn't make sense, ofc later the head writer outright confirmed it

[pale cedar]

Tbh

That doesn't necessarily mean they did that before the Zariman before we got official confirmation just that they did it

One truth is though no matter the order

Loretubers often get it wrong anyway

I see many saying the Sentients were sent to build it in preparation for the Zariman 10-0 to arrive

[restive river]

Yeah that last bit is just wrong lol, yikes

[restive river]

It does imply it actually, the sentients were still building the rail (the pylons) while the Orokin (Tuvul) got impatient

[peak ether]

Is there any significance why the zariman jumped from saturn?

[tall echo]

everyone knows the sentients were built on the zariman

[restive river]

Reminds me of the crazy concept art with the vessels and duviri statues lol

[pale cedar]

Should've jumped from Europa it's much closer

[restive river]

Or pluto, y’know
Where the rail is lol

[pale cedar]

I'm getting thr impression these golden “gods” aren't very smart

[restive river]

To elaborate on this
With how long it takes to make the rail it does imply that the individuals making started before the Zariman 10-0
It doesn’t make sense for it to be concurrent cause then there’s no point in the Zariman project and the Rail happening at the same time

[peak ether]

i mean one of their greatest scientific minds decided to just go into the void themselves without properly testing

[restive river]

They did proper tests before, they just didn’t do any biological expeditions
Bro just
Made the worst choice in experimentation

Ah yes the drones found nothing, clearly that means I must go myself!

[pale cedar]

Well there was testing

But until Wally the wasted hours gave 0 results

[restive river]

The Orokin aren’t above animal testing so the only reason I could see that Albrecht didn’t do that is maybe his standing was just that low
Or he was just that depressed

[peak ether]

sounds like if a scientist today just skipped the testing procedures for new drugs and just took it themselves to see the results

[restive river]

Then said depression and fear cause Wally and the Void to be useful

[pale cedar]

Albrecht is such a theorycrafter

[restive river]

Exactly!
Albrecht is honestly a really bad scientist lol

All of those animals he sent in later on the pretty baseless idea that it could dumb down the thing he saw like
One time in the void

[peak ether]

Fire YT video though if he vlogged it. "Hey guys! Albrecht E. here, today we're jumping into the VOID"

[restive river]

“Uh oh guys, it looks like my fear and depression has manifested into an eldritch being that some would consider godly!”

[pale cedar]

Tbh

His daughter wrote the book on CE and then got shocked when her book became CE

[restive river]

It was a nice thought tbh

Duviri was too good of a story, the lessons it meant to teach just didn’t carry through though smh

[peak ether]

"Comment Down below what i should do next vid!" Next video: So top comment from Ballas_Lover7 was to throw in a bunch of animals in there so here we have the last two remaining members of a species!

[pale cedar]

Mother is just too theoretical of a scientist

Too afraid of Practical Void science

[jolly root]

Hm i got rank 5 for them now

[strange turtle]

@proper star why would you do that

[barren jasper]

How does the time loop in 1999 affect anything that happens in our reality? What events actually took place in 1999. What happened after the year 1999. Like I don't really understand why the loop exists or how it even has any effect on the world we know. It just seems entirely self contained and kind of just out of the way.

[strange plinth]

the changes from the loop continue to the rest of the timeline, hence why we have to stay to keep it on the "correct" outcome
its like a loop-de-loop, time both loops back to the start of the year and continues going each time

[woven coyote]

Think of it less as a circle at the end of a line and more like a loop on a rollercoaster is how i understand it

Less closed loop and more loop along the course of a line

There's also at least 18 rad wars between it and present day kinda forcing most things there to not matter

[tall echo]

keep in mind that the loop isn't an alternate reality, it's the direct past

[twin wigeon]

the loop does end eventually. Hollevaniva still gets nuked which kicks of like 15 more nukes around the world in attempt to purge the infestation iirc

[barren jasper]

After one successful loop why keep looping

[strange plinth]

'not enough to make it right, you have to keep it right'
paraphrasing from the arthur email

[barren jasper]

Hollvania gets nuked regardless of the reactor exploding?

[strange plinth]

You still need to keep the loop going, though, don't you? Because it's not enough to put things right, is it. We need to keep them right.

Soldiers against the tide. Now and forever.

seems like something will push the timeline back to the "original" outcome if we're not around to maintain it

[dim mauve]

To try to keep the indifference trapped in the loop. That's one of the reasons why Entrati went to that year spesifically since he was being chased by it

[tall echo]

seemingly the infested will

[barren jasper]

Well its not even trapped there

[tall echo]

nah wally is already out of the loop

[twin wigeon]

yep, it kicks off the Radiation Wars which is responsible for loss of most culture and life on earth. Good thing theres some rich people in space or smth

[tall echo]

that was the whole point of the oraxia event

[strange plinth]

albrecht went to 1999 because it would be hard for the indifference to follow
it did anyway, of course
and proceeded to briefly take over the loop, then get banished from it

[tall echo]

nah he wanted wally to follow to lure him away from loid

[barren jasper]

That clearly didnt work because simultaneously its attacking the dark refractory

[strange plinth]

thats why he left, but 1999 specifically was due to the difficulty iirc

[tall echo]

that's not the main being

[strange plinth]

Albrecht Entrati: "If I had remained in the Deimos laboratory, Loid would never have been safe from ... Him. You know of what I speak. And so I retreated to the only place in history where that entity could not easily follow. To draw His greedy eye away from Loid."

[barren jasper]

It didnt work tho

[tall echo]

it. did. work.

the murmur are not wally, they're bits and pieces

[strange plinth]

worked until ballas let wally into the system some more
then the labs became a danger

-# CRITICAL DEVELOPMENT
-# In a deranged attempt to transport himself and his cult to Tau, Ballas opened portals between the Void and conventional reality on an unprecedented scale.
-# This has attracted the attention of THE INDIFFERENCE, whose freedom of action appears to have drastically increased.
-# The threat posed by THE INDIFFERENCE is now at a critical level.
-# The Laboratories have come under fresh assault from the Murmur. Unless the Sleeper is awoken, Albrecht Entrati's legacy will perish.
Operator Report
-# Loid: "The Murmur presumes to destroy our auditory and visual sensors. In all the time I have been asleep, they have never ONCE been so bold!"
Loid in witw

[barren jasper]

Oh rigjt because eternalism bullshit makes it so that you can linearly affect the past even tho it has already happened

Because changing the past doesn't somehow change what has already happened in the near past, like during the whispers in the walls mission. If we were always in 1999 then wouldnt it be a distraction for wally and he wouldnt show up during that quest?

[tall echo]

us going to the past happens after whispers, and wally was already on the way to 1999 during it

[strange plinth]

i think palimpsest of spacetime stuff would apply there
'events can be rewritten, traces of the original remain'

whatever loop it was during whispers is not the one we arrive to in The Hex

[ocean geyser]

Wally only attacks Duviri and the Dark Refractory after we kick him out anyway

[strange plinth]

the murmur would be attacking the dark refractory at the same time wally's in 1999
isleweaver would happen after, though, yea

[ocean geyser]

Ohh

Right i forgot that’s what happened

[ocean geyser]

I’m wondering how Loid knew they hadn’t tried to poke around in the labs when he went into stasis
Does he have like
A HUD in that mf

[barren jasper]

I really dont understand how the past is changed and it only starts to affect our timeline after we leave the present to go back. None of the past changed but now our present is different because of us in 1999.

[ocean geyser]

DE decided to look at conventional time travel rules and said “no”

[tall echo]

small changes in a long timeline make no big difference

[strange plinth]

yea, there's something that changed that does matter, in some small way, but a lot of the details don't
its probably more to do with keeping wally out of 1999 than anything

[ocean geyser]

18 radiation wars kind of help with that too

[barren jasper]

Sorry, why again are we keeping wally out of 1999

[strange turtle]

Because we like to live there and he’ll do mean things

[ocean geyser]

Would you like the Indifference to rewrite history?

We sure don’t

So Wally taking control of the loop is generally Not A Good Thing™

[barren jasper]

Well it could do it at literally any point

[ocean geyser]

Not actually

[strange plinth]

it needs an in
rusalka was the "in" for 1999, like mathila was the "in" for duviri

[ocean geyser]

It can only visit places and times the Void (or people touched by the Void) have been to

Which is why it’s able to follow Albrecht everywhere

[ocean geyser]

I didn’t know Mathila was it’s “in” though

[strange turtle]

It’s one of Nelly’s voicelines

[strange plinth]

its like one random isleweaver line, i'll find it

[ocean geyser]

Ohh

[tall echo]

time travelling to anywhere besides 1999 is actually really difficult for unknown reasons

[strange turtle]

Because of her husband, Garmi

[normal mountain]

Nelly?

[strange turtle]

Neci Wally

[strange plinth]

(Energise the shrine) Neci Rusalka: [laughs] "Don't tell Mathila it was the crack in her mind that let me in."

[normal mountain]

...
Alright, that checks out

[strange turtle]

The past does change, just in inconsequential ways

[strange plinth]

the crack is garmi, yea. garmi disappearing in the rain of chains, mathila's refusal to acknowledge him, etc. creates a way for wally to worm its way in

[ocean geyser]

Ah yeah

[strange turtle]

The only thing that has a big enough impact and lasts long enough to matter is when we make the Technocyte Coda and they go dormant for ages

[ocean geyser]

Duviri moment
She doesn’t acknowledge him because she can’t
Because they can’t deviate from how their stories were told

She kind of just shuts down when Garmi’s mentioned, right?

[tall echo]

it's more that she doesn't want to

they can deviate from their stories, but not from their personalities

[ocean geyser]

Hm
Fair

[tall echo]

mathila is joy

joy can't feel sad

[ocean geyser]

I guess i always figured they couldn’t deviate cause funny CE nonsense

Noted

[strange turtle]

They way it’s phrased it’s seemed like he’s somehow just. Gone?

"Two children and no memory of her husband. Poor Mathila. I wonder if sad memories can even exist in that happy mind?"

I found Garmi's log in the toppled ruin of the lighthouse. With admirable presence of mind, he describes a form steadily approaching out of the Void. A monstrous hand, possessed of only three fingers and a thumb.

With the lighthouse gone, Watcher's Island crumbled and was gone too within three spirals.

Garmi has no grave nor memorial, as if he had never lived. But I remember. And so, I record.

Whether the memory is just being repressed as part of her coping or something else is going on

[proper star]

Why not XD

[blissful jungle]

Love the pfp, that time I got reincarnated as a slime is goated

[celest needle]

What is the point of Kavor

What do they even do?

[maiden crypt]

i’m loving the direction of the lore, but i have been wondering one thing. it feels like they’re kind of setting up the story to be “we are gonna beat the indifference with the power of friendship” with how they’re making us build up relations with the hex, roathe etc

or have i been missing something?

[stiff fable]

Before prep for The New War really started there was a push to fill out the universe

so we'd see more kinds of Grineer or Corpus

As soon as Reb took over the game went in a different direction with entirely new factions instead of variants on the old ones

Actually answering the question, the point of the Kavor is "what would happen if there were Grineer who went full pacifist"

[celest needle]

But they essentially are just

The final phase of rescue repeated over and over.

Outside of what the lotus tells us, they don't seem fleshed out in the slightest.

If they had any plans for them, then was that mission really supposed to be it?

[stiff fable]

Right, the idea isn't "there's this big whole piece of story out there that we never got around to"

But instead it's like Zorba and the Arbiters lore he drops

They had one idea for a Warframe, connected it to something they'd left in the game, and tied it to a third thing they'd wanted to do for a while

[lusty arch]

I'm thinking the tone's headed towards 'we're learning how to help Man-In-Wall ask Albrecht to apologise for breaking a finger and vampirism ' considering how much Man-In-Wall divulged to us Tenno over recent quests.

[stiff fable]

Mario 64 picture frame for 64th Warframe +
Destroyed Vesper Relay +
Arbiters of Hexis mini expansion

So the Kavor right now are waiting for someone at DE to have an idea that they can link up to pacifist Grineer

[lusty arch]

Maybe a farming simulator minigame? Considering that's the last thing I remember hearing about the Kavor defectors - that they're seeking pacifistic lifestyles to eke out a comfortable living.

[stiff fable]

lmao could be!

Or maybe the Kavor decide to live in Cetus and we get a vendor who buys new plants in exchange for arcanes

[lusty arch]

Would be funny if it got tied into post-New-War state of affairs with Hunhow making an appearance, offering his fighter drones as farming equipment in exchange for materials to craft more?

[stiff fable]

that could be kinda dramatic

Since Temple Kuva can heal Sentients

[lusty arch]

Lotus would be happy if Hunhow got to sip on some Lohkblood - as that is what Kuva is derived from... Though that'd require getting the good graces of the Man-In-Wall, which'd require Albrecht making a prosthetic finger of Khra and finding a compatible blood donor.

But Temple Kuva would add the Unum back into the mix.
Would make very interesting dialogue.

[stiff fable]

I have a specific guess about that

The Unum is probably going to be a Cetus expansion like the Sanctum is for Deimos

they've got a few tiles from New War ready to go

[humble sierra]

For the first time in ages I've done a Kuva Fortress defense mission, and there's unique dialogue there about the Grineer making kuva from sludge

[lean garden]

I mean wally was repelled by old man yaoi so like

we know what really works

[humble sierra]

[Insert Follie dealing damage by drawing grineer mpreg]

[tall echo]

yaoi?

[lean garden]

mhmm

[tall echo]

think furry yaoi might work better?

[lean garden]

I think the closer relation to the human form will deal more psychic damage

[humble sierra]

oh that reminds me, Voruna Prime this week!

[tall echo]

furry yuri?

[humble sierra]

٩(◕‿◕｡)۶

[tall echo]

oh true, finally gonna get the ugly maxed out standing off my syndicate screen

[humble sierra]

Gonna spend my quarterly $150

[tall echo]

wh

how

[robust sleet]

who is talking in the follie mission

[fresh orchid]

Huh

[humble sierra]

AUD

[tall echo]

unnamed archimedean

[robust sleet]

i see

[fresh orchid]

The Archimedean who stabilizes cryo tenno

Otherwise I think they canonically go insane if they’re not cycled out and stabilized mentally

[tall echo]

unspecified

[humble sierra]

It sounds more like she's just using the Paint Therapy to interrogate them and figure out what happened on the Zariman

[fresh orchid]

It was on the blue wiki which is the canon one right?

[tall echo]

neither one is

[fresh orchid]

Ooooh

[humble sierra]

Both wikis are fan-run

So unless there's direct quotes to back up their claims it's up to interpretation

[fresh orchid]

She talks a lot about stabilization

[humble sierra]

That's mostly just putting them back on ice

"Yeah I'm done here, get rid of them"

[fresh orchid]

Yeah they were taking them out and stabilizing a bunch of Tenno

Although Nitohk has recently come up in decoration and random things so maybe it’ll be more into her lore?

[humble sierra]

Yeah they're seeming to set her up

Potentially for the arc villain after MITW

[fresh orchid]

So maybe we’ll find out more about unknown Archimedean? It would be cool to have more lore about them

The only one I really know anything about atp is Ballas

And Margulis

[humble sierra]

Ballas isn't an Archimedian, he's an Executor

[fresh orchid]

Ye but Margulis and him give some Archimidean lore

[humble sierra]

ah ye

[fresh orchid]

Outside of that there’s not much is more what I meant, silly wording on my end

[tall echo]

and suda and the one on the zariman and javi

[humble sierra]

And Otak!

[fresh orchid]

I haven’t gotten much with Suda yet! Idk who or what Javi is

[tall echo]

lavos leverian

[fresh orchid]

I haven’t leveled with Otak or Zariman faction either

[tall echo]

one of lavos' snakes is former archimedean javi

[fresh orchid]

So where I’m at, I know almost nothing about Archimedians and I’m in end game

[humble sierra]

Melica is just on the Zariman, she's not one of the factions you level

She was just turned into a Cephalon and teaches the children

[fresh orchid]

Ohhhh

[fresh orchid]

Was she an Archimedean?

[tall echo]

also not a confirmed archimedean

I meant the redhead

[humble sierra]

I'm a moron my bad

I was just thinking of Cephalons at that point

[fresh orchid]

I know a little about cephalons but still kinda confused

Was horrified to find out what they did to the robot race people in Old Peace

[tall echo]

?

[fresh orchid]

They turned whatever Adis’s people are into the space stations we connected together and they’re the ones who built it from what the story said

[tall echo]

oh, no, sentients are just machines

orokin-made machines

cephalons however are digitized human conciousnesses

[lean garden]

its not so much they turned the sentients into parts of the relay, its literally what the sentients were made to do

its not some enslaved race thing then, it was literally "the track laying machine laid tracks"

[fresh orchid]

They didn’t have any option to do anything else though? And they became part of the relays to which Adis has feelings about due to the freedom those weird flowers give them

[lean garden]

it was their purpose

[humble sierra]

They were programmed

They grew actual sentience on the way

[lean garden]

its the literal thing they were made for

[fresh orchid]

Yeah and the flowers gave them more than what they were programmed for which means they had the capacity but it was programmed restraint

No?

[tall echo]

the flowers just gave fragments individual minds

there's full sentients, which are always sentient, and there's fragments, which normally are part of a full sentient's hivemind

[humble sierra]

Fragments are the ones you normally fight

[fresh orchid]

Yes and with an individual mind they were able to achieve more than what their programming allowed so I view that as they were purposefully kept to a hivemind of a singular purpose that was programmed

[humble sierra]

A hivemind leader is something like Hunhow

[strange plinth]

Natah, Erra, Hunhow, etc

idk why i said etc there's only like two others

[fresh orchid]

Adis was a fragment turned by Hunhow at some point

[tall echo]

fragments are pieces made by full sentients from themselves, not original sentients

[fresh orchid]

Was Adis a fragment?

[tall echo]

yes

[fresh orchid]

From Hunhow?

[tall echo]

unknown

[strange plinth]

feeds off of the xenoflora and looks a lot like the dactolyst

[fresh orchid]

So they would only think in the same way their original sentient progenitor would?

[tall echo]

ducktolyst...

[tall echo]

they wouldn't think at all

[humble sierra]

Okay so basically imagine it as an actual hive, maybe.

You have the Orokin, who are the beekeepers, and the Hivemind leaders (such as Hunhow) as the Queen Bee. The Orokin tells the Queen Bee what to do, and the queen commands worker drones to help it do that task-- the queen then turns against that task and all the drones now also turn against that task, because the drones listen to the queen. The Xenoflora allows the drones independence from the queen.

[fresh orchid]

That’s why I said they would only be capable of what their original sentient maker thinks or they’re programmed separately and kept to a hivemind for subjugation?

[tall echo]

drones don't think, they just follow orders, same with fragments

[fresh orchid]

Ah I thought Adis was fully their own sentient

I remember they said they had to get the flowers or they’d be filled with bloodlust or something

[humble sierra]

Without the flowers, they'd return to the hiveminds. The hiveminds were wanting the Orokin dead.

[lean garden]

I think it's less that they were inhibited by the orokin and more that they evolved yknow?

[fresh orchid]

the fragments or the original sentients?

[lean garden]

all of them

the original sentients werent so sentient while on the way to tau

[fresh orchid]

Are the Orokin why the Sentients like Hunhow became so bloodthirsty?

[lean garden]

otherwise theyd turn around and beat the orokin black and blue before even leaving origin

[fresh orchid]

ah so everything is the Orokin's fault and compassionate ones like Margulis were rare?

[brittle siren]

yeah

[lean garden]

typically the orokin were the direct/indirect engineers of their own demise

[restive river]

Tormis

[brittle siren]

btw what did Ordan do before he became an Cephalon

[restive river]

He killed people for the Orokin

[fresh orchid]

Do they have a page of what all the cephalons were before?

[brittle siren]

only known one is Ordan and Suda

and Nihil

[lean garden]

and otak

[brittle siren]

oh yeah

[fresh orchid]

oh 🤔

what's the cephalon's name that does the sanctuary stuff

[opaque kestrel]

Cephalon Simaris

[cunning ore]

This makes me ponder, what were the hiveminds and how it evolved.

[jolly root]

Probably accidentally but probably needed

[cunning ore]

Like what exactly the hiveminds in The Old Peace.
Does the unaffected-sentinents consider as some type of like the migrates since they used Xenoflora as a way to going against their sentiment?

And how it evolve to have an independent thought of killing Orokin. Beside that, could be possible that the enemy was holding the hiveminds?

[twin wigeon]

uhhhhhh well Sentients are robots to put it simply, fragments of their Father and Mother, Hunhow and Praghasa

[cunning ore]

Yea i know, so it like i wonder if it was Hunhow command them to kill while in the peace treatment between sentients and Orokins

Or there a represent of a group of sentients?

[twin wigeon]

They still are controlled by Hunhow and Praghasa, yes ordered to carry out tasks and to terraform Tau and such. But Xenoflora cuts them off from the Orders given by Hunh and Praghasa

They act as individuals, as long as they have flora

[cunning ore]

Not by that i mean mm, how can i say this

[jolly root]

I have a feeling hunhow knew about what happend to adis hence his hate for a us

[twin wigeon]

without it, they "devolve" seeking orders from anyone, even Anarchs, given time They Follow Hunhow and Praghasa

[cunning ore]

I mean if they all concluded into a peace treat, then why there still killing orders from hiveminds?

[twin wigeon]

Adis is Unique, his death is symbolic. As the ONLY Sentient able to resurrect/heal sentients, killing him is a MASSIVE blow and is very traitorous

He is presumably a direct fragment of Hunhow and Praghasa rather than offsprings of offsprings

bc Sentients are able to reproduce on their own

Well perhaps Hunhow detected the loss of his kind and decided that Tau needed to be saved and the Orokin could not be trusted with that, severing the Solar Rail connecting the Origin system to the Tau System

[strange plinth]

lotus said that healing sentients were rare, not unique
though there was still one lost regardless

[twin wigeon]

Also i guess hes the only sentient student,

hence why Itzam repeatedly states that the Union of Us and Adis is so important to the treaty

[cunning ore]

My point is about the logic: If the Hiveminds agreed to peace, why is the order to kill Orokin still hard-coded into the Sentients? Does this mean the Hiveminds are lying about the peace, or that they don't actually have total control over the Sentients' fundamental directives?

I think my question close to this

[lean garden]

hard coded? Nah, they do that shit willingly

[cunning ore]

I used AI since the barrier just to big

[lean garden]

lol you can see the failing of AI already

[cunning ore]

Like there still hiveminds go against the peace to let the "killing code" still there?

[twin wigeon]

Sentient Hivemind agreed on a Treaty. the violation of this treaty would mean the Orokin are not to be trusted and hence the sentients are going back on all their work, including the solar rail and the terraforming of Tau for the Orokin.

[cunning ore]

😭 i have no other choice

[twin wigeon]

Hunhow and Praghasa were still working on the link between systems, the sentients in their control helped them. The ones that consumed flora, became scholars and trusted soldiers for the Perita rebellion

[cunning ore]

Still oddly. Like i know about the Adis event, but it not explain of how we forced to kill the Dactolyst?

[jolly root]

Actually i dont think hunhow was agianst the treaty

[jolly root]

The anarch controlled that one

[strange plinth]

'can't fix a core override' or whatever

[jolly root]

If i remember right i could be wrong

[twin wigeon]

Dactolyst was deprived of flora given individuality. it is still a robot that needs orders, the closest order giving entity was the Anarchs since it was captured.

Sentients deprived of flora, devolve into Order Recieving Robots, doesn't matter who's giving orders. If they aren't given an order, they automatically reconnect to the hivemind

[cunning ore]

So some said the device just remove the Xenoflora's affect. So the sentient tend to kill us at the Dactolyst. So it confused me if Anarch have sth with the hiveminds or not

[twin wigeon]

Anarchs have nothing to do with the hivemind

Dacto was just starved of xenoflora

No device was needed to remove Xenoflora's affect

[cunning ore]

Wait so Xenoflora belike forbidden-meds to sentients?

[twin wigeon]

no

[cunning ore]

[twin wigeon]

Xenoflora is just Flowers that give individuality to sentients, they're not forbidden bc 1 thats taking individuality from them and 2 the orokin didn't know the effects of flora, it was alien to them as well

[cunning ore]

Sorry this make me..think like that

[dark compass]

Xenoflora cuts a sentient off the hivemind, resulting in a personality forming inside the separated

[twin wigeon]

hence XENOflora

[cunning ore]

I mean drugs..or the type i should not speak out that cause people to ykyk

[dark compass]

If they're starved, the connection opens up again and they become less independent

[cunning ore]

Tooaddicted

[dark compass]

And prone to outside control

[cunning ore]

Okay, so it drugs

[twin wigeon]

no

its like an augment to their existence really?

... maybe?

[cunning ore]

Let me add /jk about it being drugs as i ssid

[dark compass]

It cuts them off and personality is a side effect more than anything

[twin wigeon]

reverse drugs

[cunning ore]

Reverse drugs? This confusing

[twin wigeon]

addictive drugs irl take away control and stuff right?
these drugs give control back to the sentients themselves

[humble sierra]

You gotta wonder how exactly it gives them individuality... are the flowers actually parasites that instill their own consciousness onto the fragments?

[cunning ore]

Or it can be...illegal drugs irl /jk

[jolly root]

And why does it look like void energy

[twin wigeon]

in that case its more like medicine than drugs

[dark compass]

I feel like its just them having a thinking, working brain that can't act independently due to higher functions still being out there. Disconnecting from those higher functions allows the now separated mind to flourish

[twin wigeon]

mhm mhm

in some cases it allows for archimedians and scholars

[cunning ore]

The type of making delusions? Or the type that stimulating the feelings?

[dark compass]

They're Sentients, they adapt

[cunning ore]

sus Xenoflora

[dark compass]

And getting cut off from the hivemind adapts the mind into its own

[humble sierra]

Maybe the flowers are Oro

[dark compass]

[twin wigeon]

A lack of orders forces them to adapt creating their own orders

[dark compass]

I really don't think flowers are anything significant or complex in terms of effect

They just interfere with the signal

[twin wigeon]

i think flora is just poisonous to humans

[cunning ore]

So it like Dactolyst was addicted to the Xenoflora and the Anarch have a device that remove the effect. So Dactolyst aggressively attacked up cause his starving for the flowers?

[twin wigeon]

no

[humble sierra]

They're not addictive

They just need it to be independent

It's more like medicine than anything

[jolly root]

No it lost the higher though of.reason

[twin wigeon]

think as flora as blood for a vampire. Without the blood, they become thirsty for blood.

Without the flora, they become thirsty for orders.

[humble sierra]

Not sure if the flowers are poisonous, it's just that they can't survive in an atmosphere that isn't poisonous to humans

[dark compass]

Me eating a flower and suddenly my kidneys are planning a revolution

[jolly root]

Haha imagine your skeleton doing that

[gray trench]

Can't believe the Orokin would commit an opium war on the side of destroying the opium. smh

[cunning ore]

Why it does sound illegal?/jk 😭

[dark compass]

It would be a hostage situation

I am still just a brain piloting a mech

[twin wigeon]

flesh mech

[jolly root]

Hmmm what do ya know that happend in history i belive during the east india trading company

[dark compass]

What the mech is made of is irrelevant

I'm like 30% metal and silicone

[twin wigeon]

honestly i think we need to abandon the flesh and to crave the certainty of steel

or smth

[twin wigeon]

and 50% plastic

[dark compass]

Steel can't heal and sustain itself

See, even you understand

"flesh" is dubious at best

[twin wigeon]

Steel can repair and upgrade

[dark compass]

Steel cannot

[twin wigeon]

I want to go full 'borg

[gray trench]

but fleshsteel could... It's time to become a warframe

[dark compass]

It needs a working hand to do that

If you have your other buddy so you could... Sustain the steel of each other

[twin wigeon]

Yessssss Embracceeee

[dark compass]

Then maybe

[dark compass]

Even Orokin realized that flesh ends up superior long term

[gray trench]

I mean that is mainly because of the rite of continuation, otherwise I'm sure they would have switched over

[twin wigeon]

nuh uh, I summon my Necramech upon thee

[dark compass]

It's because of AI uprising they had at some point in history

[gray trench]

wait they had an ai uprising?

[dark compass]

It made all conventional tech unreliable and prone to control

[gray trench]

oh, the sentients, I'm silly

[dark compass]

Nope

[twin wigeon]

???

[dark compass]

Before Sentients, they had an AI uprising that made the law forbidding any sort of AI in the first place

[twin wigeon]

is this warhammer or warframe

[gray trench]

I mean there's servoskulls in both

[dark compass]

So you can see how a lot of orokin towers are powered by trees growing as cables

[twin wigeon]

they are??

[dark compass]

Yeah

[clever linden]

What do we know of the other Orokin Houses besides House Entrati?

[twin wigeon]

is that why eidolons are trees

[dark compass]

They basically dropped conventional technology because AI controlled shit and it made everything bad

[strange plinth]

the arboriform, infamously unexplained

[twin wigeon]

i think House Lavan, Zekti, and the others i can't remember rn are also orokin houses?

[dark compass]

That's why Sentients were so divisive

Because it's another attempt at introducing AI, essentially

[clever linden]

Cus we know that House Entrati were the quirky reclusive boomers of the Orokin who preferred to use their own homegrown “antiquated” tech but we really don’t know much about the others…

[dark compass]

Using their new funky "safe" tech

Then Tau happened

Their shit got hijacked again

[gray trench]

I can't wait for 2038 when all this is explained on Tau planet 7

[cunning ore]

I want to know Ballas's parent

[clever linden]

Operator mentions in Old Peace that feuds between the Houses was “commonplace” or something like that

[cunning ore]

Unless he parentless

[dark compass]

Then years after Corpus returns to this more conventional technology. And Narmer happens. And you could immediately see the problem in Veso's story and why Orokin switched from it

[clever linden]

Like military confrontations

[dark compass]

I also conveniently headcanon this as the reason why Lotus has her mad hacking and communication powers

Because she's a sentient, she can just hijack stuff

[cunning ore]

She can also mimic

I fear of her

[twin wigeon]

oddly enough Ballas can hack too?? or smth? he did a "hacking pulse"

during apostasy prologue iirc

[dark compass]

I don't remember when that happened

Oh yeah he was half sentient by then

[twin wigeon]

he can'tve been

[dark compass]

Oh wait

[twin wigeon]

he was still orokin ballas

[dark compass]

I confused the quest names

[twin wigeon]

goober

[cunning ore]

I hate Narmer hacking, any tips for it?

[dark compass]

https://tenor.com/view/stupid-cat-cat-cat-grab-cat-meme-cat-gif-gif-16708721365088240754

[twin wigeon]

mirror

[strange plinth]

only thing i can think of is during the sacrifice, when he tells umbra to stop
but that's prolly just transference stuff rather than hacking

[cunning ore]

Maybe we can ask his magical staff? Possible i guess?

[dark compass]

Yeah it's definitely just transference stuff

[strange plinth]

-# auto breach my beloved

[dark compass]

He has the transference thing installed

[cunning ore]

🥹 pls no

[restive river]

When he moved his hands and the cords came out?

[twin wigeon]

yepp

also hi duck

[restive river]

Hello

[strange plinth]

oh that-

[cunning ore]

So Ballas is a hybrid warframe?

[restive river]

No

[dark compass]

No, transference is just tech you can install into yourself

[restive river]

The Orokin just modified themselves with tech too iirc

[restive river]

Somatics!

[dark compass]

And it works by being able to give direct commands to the husk with your mind

Operator can just possess the same husk

[clever linden]

An Amalgam at time of death

[cunning ore]

Can he do the transference? Yes.
Can he hack with sth in his arms? Yes
Can he bulletjump? No
=> okah, he not wf, mb mb

[strange plinth]

ballas mentions that umbra was installed with a special transference bolt so that they could talk
or, rather, so that ballas could yap at him without isaah hearing

[cunning ore]

I didn't check the last 🙁

[cunning ore]

I feel Umbra pain but would love to suffer it in his place

[dark compass]

It's not really transference as we know it. We possess. He gives commands.

We assume direct control.
He has a remote.

Obviously our priority is higher

[restive river]

We control in different ways

[cunning ore]

Yep i forgot about it, mb

[restive river]

Our way is better, we actually have a relationship with the frames

[strange plinth]

empathy v authority

[cunning ore]

So, with Hildryn case?

[restive river]

She was just his favorite

[dark compass]

Me hugging myself in the corner to let Lavos Prime know that he's seen and loved

[restive river]

During the Night of the Naga drums her and her tenno were meant to protect him
Hunhow wanted them spared

[cunning ore]

I just wonder if she had a sense i mean sth to empathy

[restive river]

With her tenno?

[dark compass]

They don't really connect at the same level as we do in the first place

[cunning ore]

Like she the frame i feel curious pretty much, after Wisp and some other frames

[dark compass]

It's like

Uhhh, body vs soul

[cunning ore]

Like with her origin and yea Tenno

[restive river]

Hildryn doesn’t have much lore beyond being Ballas’ shield
Wisp just has nothing

[dark compass]

Her lore got wisped away

[restive river]

Most I can give you on Wisp is it looks like she was initially concepted as the Duviri frame, but that’s speculation based off the artbook

[cunning ore]

She is Will-O-Wisp tho

[dark compass]

She may not have much to her story

[restive river]

Also her prime trailer but
We didn’t really get anything lol

[dark compass]

But her legacy (agile animation set) stays on

[cunning ore]

Do you think that she might have a spooky tale within like with Dagath?

[restive river]

No

DE doesn’t really go back to give a frame lore unless they do a leverian

And we don’t know if they sunsetted leverians or not

I also doubt she’d get anything by this point since Drifter says Wisp got nothing :/

[dark compass]

Rebb said we're getting Garuda lore this year btw

[restive river]

Garuda lore
Railjack content
Tau
Nitokh setup
Operator/Drifter are amalgams

This year is gonna be crazy

[cunning ore]

Too many things but mostly i hope this more about Orokin i mean closer to sth in that Orokin Era or The Old War

Honestly Follie brought me a little disappointment of the information she came with

[twin wigeon]

welll

she's content for post chains of harrow

[dark compass]

It's a big mystery as to what's happening on Tau now

So maybe we'll get something fancy

[twin wigeon]

obviously that doesn't pique any interest for people who are caught up

but for the tiny tennos who just laid a ghost to sleep and are now haunted by some doppelganger and now they gotta explore an not-so-abandoned relay?

the torture never ends

[dark compass]

Yeah Nokko didn't have any plot developments either

It's just here as a side thing to do

We can have a little distraction, as a treat

[twin wigeon]

instead you get australian mushroom man with cheeked up shrooms

that hates corporate and the irs

[jolly root]

Hahaha

[cunning ore]

Yea big one that solve many things within. And a lot claimed that they can fix Niktoh currently-

[dark compass]

Or playing legally distinct Outlast Trials in Vesper Relay

[twin wigeon]

NOOOOOO

[cunning ore]

Russia boy i think

[twin wigeon]

hum?

Nokko isn't russian

[dark compass]

Idk Follie's hunt reminded me of outlast trials

[cunning ore]

Mushroom, the dance pretty close to slavic and the head, then my friend styled him into a rus

[twin wigeon]

he's just No Co(rperate)

[cunning ore]

Okay

[cunning ore]

Oh yea

[stiff beacon]

but the dance is

[twin wigeon]

thats sickkkkkk

[jolly root]

Hahahaah

[twin wigeon]

i need to see this Russian Nokko

[jolly root]

Of course thw blood queen can be fixed

[dark compass]

Please don't be a kim chat protoframe PLEASE

[cunning ore]

Green, black and white. Then throw a shroom and boom the room!

[stiff beacon]

the promised garuda lore lol

[jolly root]

I hope not

[cunning ore]

Yep Kuze R6S

[twin wigeon]

please Caliban Protoooo

i need more KIM

[cunning ore]

https://tenor.com/view/rainbow-six-siege-gaming-tied-hi-wave-gif-16635476

[jolly root]

I enjoy roathes charecter but one unhinged orokin is enougj

[stiff beacon]

who knows maybe nitohk is the other kind of unhunged

[twin wigeon]

Nitokh isn't unhinged

[cunning ore]

I remember how Q&A claimed they qualified to be fixed by her

[twin wigeon]

there was never a door to begin with

[cunning ore]

Doubt, i can only see our Drifter see every protoframes like ..if it single, teen or married

[jolly root]

Oh gods thatll be bad

[dark compass]

If they add another protoframe to romance, it would mean another thing

Consent conversations for the triad

Roathe just kills you

[cunning ore]

Well, since we can date 1 in The Hex, 1 in The Devil Triad

I don't think they know

[strange plinth]

-# there are consent convos for the triad, though?

[dark compass]

There are?

[strange plinth]

yea
they're a little less copy-paste than the hex's

[dark compass]

I've been told the opposite

Have I been misinformed

Why would anyone lie to me online

[strange plinth]

who would go on the internet and tell lies

[dark compass]

How could this happen to meeee

[strange plinth]

roathe yapping as usual

[gritty dew]

When does Kahl's Narmer missions occur because there are Namer everywhere but in star chart gameplay Narmer are nowhere, whata up with that?

[strange plinth]

kahl's dealing with the remnants of narmer, similar to how the cetus/fortuna narmer bounties work

so, any time after they're unlocked

[clever linden]

They are gonna fix that

Narmer will get “proper content” in the future according to DE

They are definitely still out there

[fast dew]

Roach would.

[strange plinth]

xata,,

[fast dew]

Goes onto a help forum
Lies
certified roach behaviour™

Me when I lie

Kaxata...

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/952946035733438575/1461285583681753251/explode-1768467993232.gif

[clever linden]

That’s Albrecht

[cunning ore]

He my only source to know about BallasMargulis story

😭 also how i got heartbroken at how Ballas really love Margulis

[gritty dew]

Well obviously, it's teased in New War at the end that Erra becomes an Archon, speaking of which how does he become an Archon?

[strange plinth]

unknown
in archon hunts, lotus vaguely implies that nira might've been involved, but that's about it

[gritty dew]

Nira, who is that?

[strange plinth]

the snake archon

[clever linden]

‘Errs’ technically is already an Archon, host for the de facto leader and High Confessor of Narmer, Pazuul, the great ram

[clever linden]

The Narmer soldiers found Erra’s body and used it as a vessel for Pazuul

[strange plinth]

Lotus: "I do not know if Pazuul is truly the leader of the Archons, or their puppet, Of all of them, only Nira has the guile to seduce Erra like this."
Lotus: "Nira devoured her brothers. I will not stand idlely aside while she and Pazuul devour mine. Be my sword, Tenno. Strike."
Lotus: "Nira. Could she somehow be responsible for what Erra has become? A repayment for what he did to her? The Serpent is old, Tenno, and full of secrets."
Lotus: "Who whispered dreams of dominion into Pazuul's ear? Who keeps Erra suppressed and tormented with dilusions? The stench of Nira's venom is upon this, Tenno."
exactly how is unknown (especially given that nira would be dead at the time-), but nira's the top suspect according to lotus

[fast dew]

Though, its a unique case

[clever linden]

Pazuul also claims he is receiving holy visions from the “Lords of Tau” presumably Sentient Leadership

[fast dew]

He's. The only archon that's bonded onto another sentient, yeah?

[clever linden]

Yep

[strange plinth]

mhm
the other three are to warframes

[clever linden]

The interesting thing about this is it’s entirely possible that Tau has had no communication with the Narmer forces and Pazuul is just assuming these things

An interesting thing I learned from the lore was that the sentient forces that started the New War had been hiding in deep space for centuries, they are the remaining sentient forces that survived the Old War, they are basically Sentient warhawks who could not let their loss of the war go, they have not been in Tau themselves since the Old War

[strange plinth]

he only mentions the lords of tau twice afaik

"Above, the Lords of Tau. Below, my people. Below them, yours. And I, I shall serve as shepherd and minister."
"My father severed the worlds, sundered the link we had forged with Tau, in the days of our enslavement. In the darkness beyond the Veil, we waited. The lords of Tau were silent."
n even then, we can guess that Tau's been silent since the old war from the second line

[clever linden]

He does say he thinks he’s receiving visions from Tau, and that likely means the Lords of Tau specifically

[fast dew]

Mm. Abandoned. Makes me wonder if the tau sentients did not want. Warmongering sentients

[clever linden]

That’s what I’m thinking