lore-discussion

[strange turtle]

Wait what got cut out?

[pale cedar]

They removed the new player stuff from it

[strange turtle]

Oh right that was a thing

[pale cedar]

Also shortened how many missions you needed to do to get the pieces

[drifting lintel]

Okay so the zaramin 10-0 happened.

The man in the wall gave deals to 2 kids in 2 different timelines.

In one timeline he saved everyone and in the other he saved everyone except for the one kid he made the deal with.

The one that got saved became the operator and got cryo sleep till the quest on the moon.

The one that didn't was stuck in the void and created the kingdom of duviri through his emotions and him trying to go into his "happy place."

Skip a thousand or so years to the start of the new war

Lotus and teshin get thrown into the void. Her hand and teshin landing in duviri.

They help him get out of the cycle keeping him there, allowing him to regain control of his emotions and by extension control of duviri.

He leaves duviri to do stuff in the new war.

Operator still in the void makes a second deal with wally killing all other timelines of the drifter and operator except those two and giving drifter the same powers.

I mean .... If ordis was crash landing that's what he would do.

You'd try to land thrusters first at full burn to soften the blow.

[opaque zenith]

The cave entrance is just to small
I know what I typed

[ocean geyser]

I don’t think it’s crashed

It looks like it was snuck into the cave

[drifting lintel]

Who's to say it was a cave before ordis got there?

[worn cypress]

aha thats the single quote that made me understand

[ocean geyser]

There doesn’t appear to be any damage besides water leaking into the orbiter
Even then that’s probably just because it’s been sitting in a pond for who knows how long

[drifting lintel]

Looking at the room layout and adding thrusters is it even small enough to fit in the cave entrance?

[worn cypress]

i dont know the man in the wall and i dont want to spoild it 🙂
-# i stopped reading at hearing u say the man in the wall

[drifting lintel]

He showed up in the chains of harrow quest

And every time we see a doppelganger with a big grin

[opaque zenith]

Unless there's another entrance via the water inside (that's why the submarine driver) I don't see the orbiter entering by the curent entrance

[pale cedar]

Almost right

The deal you see in New War is the deal that actually happened at the Zariman Incident the only change is the fact Drifter broke them out the loop they are trapped in

And the fact Drifter shook hand

[drifting lintel]

Huh?

[pale cedar]

Operator was trapped in a loop of own history forced to see that event it wasn’t a second deal it was the same deal on repeat with Drifter showing up breaking the loop

[drifting lintel]

Was that confirmed somewhere or...?

[drifting lintel]

I'm not discounting you I'd just love to read that

[pale cedar]

Read the PC in the labs

Ballas file

[worn cypress]

aha i still dont who or what is it

but its a spoiler no ? like we will know after

[drifting lintel]

I only told you things that you would know during the new war.

[opaque zenith]

smt like that

[drifting lintel]

I don't have access to the game till tomorrow, due to school which wiki page would have it?

[tall echo]

well I mean
we see the framework where the thrusters are usually fit into

[worn cypress]

wait so the duviri was throw the operator ?
hmmm i wanna see the duviri quest do i need to replay it ? ):
and teshin in the duviri is the same teshin like what ??

[pale cedar]

https://wiki.warframe.com/w/Operator_Report

[tall echo]

https://tenor.com/view/stormtrooper-traitor-star-wars-finn-tr8r-gif-26603279

[pale cedar]

What?

[tall echo]

linking the wiki instead of the great archives
(jk the report is written out so it's obv acceptable)

[opaque zenith]

1 ?
2 There's yt or orokin archives if you don't wanna replay yourself
3 Pretty much old Teshin, yes

[pale cedar]

Does Archives even have the Operator report?

[tall echo]

good question

[cunning ore]

Hey, if you want to avoid spoil, it better for you to run all the main quests first, honestly

[pale cedar]

I honestly have never checked because many complain if it isn’t wiki

[tall echo]

I actually just memorize lore so I rarely use the archives

[drifting lintel]

How tf did ballas set up a time loop to put the operator in?

[worn cypress]

did the duviri a year ago but wasnt playing serious at that time
came to the game this week

[pale cedar]

The Void set it up

[tall echo]

he didn't, the void just did void things

[worn cypress]

only 6 main quests left @cunning ore

[pale cedar]

The better question is
How did Ballas know that would happen?

[drifting lintel]

Please pay attention, if you don't things won't make sense.

[tall echo]

"the duviri" is funneh

[tall echo]

he didn't

[worn cypress]

wasnt playing at that time

[cunning ore]

yea but those will some parts explain you how, especially with the Hex and their Kim message

[tall echo]

ballless assumed tenno were immortal(false) and decided to yeet the operator into the void, hell

[opaque zenith]

"Hows your day drifter?"
"The Duviri..."
"Type shit"

[cunning ore]

No, Duviri at first surely a confusion, like it should happen before or after the New War, so we can be explained by Drifter being existed in the Origin System in New War

[pale cedar]

It happened alongside New War

[drifting lintel]

Also this shows that drifter has at least interfered with 3 time loops.

• duviri
• operator
• 1999

[tall echo]

you just know the first time drifter encounters that possibly nonexistant slang they actually type it out letter by letter

[tall echo]

cease

[cunning ore]

But the quest just be pushed too dont know wrong position in line to catch up?

[pale cedar]

In New War he wasn’t even trying to as he was powerless

[drifting lintel]

When operator gets stabbed with paracelsis is the exact same moment drifter gets stabbed in duviri.

[opaque zenith]

"Type kuaka"

[pale cedar]

Drifter took the hand off for New War

[cunning ore]

i think i memorized wrong

[tall echo]

yoinky za hando

[pale cedar]

So he accidentally broke a loop by being teleported to Operator

[cunning ore]

I know but the last i remembered, i played Duviri without knowing of why the loop being broken

[tall echo]

nah the quest screen shows in release order

[drifting lintel]

He didn't mean to but he did it.
He's more powerful than people seem to think.

[cunning ore]

man, i cannot remember that if i played Duviri before The Sacrifice or after The New War

[tall echo]

nah the common idea makes drifter more powerful than they actually are

[pale cedar]

They were powerless and was teleported so it isn’t really a Drifter feat

Anybody could’ve done it tbh if they were teleported

[drifting lintel]

They uh ... Do that intentionally.
It's foreshadowing for new players and a callback for old players.
But canonically the duviri paradox is during that gap between when operator failed and drifter arrived in the system.

[drifting lintel]

Breaking the loop is the feat.

[main arch]

And THIS is the problem. New War should've been a two parter, with Duviri taking place between part one and two.

[pale cedar]

Breaking the loop is whatever teleported Drifters feat in reality

That teleportation is a real one

[drifting lintel]

No because him just teleporting didn't break it. It was his unique duviri void magic that broke it.

[pale cedar]

Drifter was losing a fight at that moment before being teleported

[drifting lintel]

And??

[cunning ore]

Yea i still remember that part, i don't be too attracted to that Ballas's hologram 😭

I replayed New War like 4th time so

[pale cedar]

If Drifter wasn’t teleported they would be dead

Lotus was strangling him before he was teleported to Operator which broke it

That teleporter is the real hero

[drifting lintel]

Also we don't even know what exactly teleported drifter. I like to think the two are entangled so drifter's death caused him to get yeeted to his counterpart in the void.

[pale cedar]

Drifter wasn’t dead

[opaque zenith]

Just to see if I'm aconpaning right, the 'teleport' is the swap between drifter and op you're talking about?

[drifting lintel]

https://tenor.com/view/miracle-max-princess-bride-mostly-dead-all-dead-oygente-gif-12754873

[pale cedar]

Drifter was being strangled but wasn’t dead yet

Wasn’t close to death either

[drifting lintel]

All of this makes way more sense if the time loop in the void was just wally pulling his shit again and the switch teleport was the result of the second deal.

[pale cedar]

Was teleported like 2 seconds after so it was a short strangulation session

It was the same deal

[drifting lintel]

And yet somehow drifter got void powers out of it.

Not just powers while in the void but full operator powers

[tall echo]

because they fused with the operator later

[drifting lintel]

And all their timelines died off.

[pale cedar]

Not all timelines

[drifting lintel]

Something we know wally did with baro...

[pale cedar]

We know others still exist

[drifting lintel]

We literally see them all die off. There is now only two.

[pale cedar]

Zariman is host to way more than we see

Wally just spin till he got to the correct one not killed them all

I’m not saying he can’t do that though

He didn’t need to

[drifting lintel]

https://youtu.be/tMr9KGtlp_c

Watch this again

[pale cedar]

We don’t see it as every timeline

Just spinning a wheel till he gets the correct one

Nowhere does it say or does Wally mention I killed all your timelines

[drifting lintel]

We see a bunch of slightly different variations of the operator
We see all the variations of the operator die
We then pan over to only see two variations left, the operator and drifter.

Hmmmmmmmmm

[pale cedar]

Plus we have later evidence others still exist

Zariman is host to other timelines still

We only see some die

It’s never stated as all

Wally legit just spun a wheel till he got to the correct one

[drifting lintel]

There's no other interpretation of this scene sorry.

Wally condensed our eternalism down to 2
The one who got saved and the one who didn't.

There's no more infinite variations to fall back on. There is operator and drifter.

[pale cedar]

Look at any thing where you spin a wheel there’s still others that exist

[drifting lintel]

They all died.

We see them die

[pale cedar]

Source

[drifting lintel]

The video I sent just a bit ago

[pale cedar]

Where in game does it till you every timeline is now dead

[drifting lintel]

The cutscene ... Where it shows only two variations of the operator not dying.

[pale cedar]

So I’m telling you spinning a wheel is another interpretation of it

[drifting lintel]

And I'm telling you spinning the wheel doesn't make any f***ing sense

[pale cedar]

It does

I’m telling you how it does

Wally legit spins and gets to the correct one being us

Nothing says that was every answer

We only see some
Nowhere is it stated as all

[drifting lintel]

Why does he need to do that? Why kill the other variations? Why show so many?

He's done it before! With baro!

[pale cedar]

We aren’t shown so many as they aren’t important

I can kill 3 people that exist in a timeline

Doesn’t mean I have to kill all 3

That’s my point

He can get to what he wants and not kill everyone

Wally doesn’t ever even mention killing all of them

While with Baro that’s exactly what is said

So yes 2 interpretations

[fast dew]

.. because he can

He killed other operators

[drifting lintel]

We see a scene... Where there are a bunch of variations of the operator in a circle.

We go down the circle seeing all of them get killed.

Except for the last two, the operator and the drifter.

And you're telling me, that that ISN'T SUPER OBVIOUS SYMBOLISM SAYING HE KILLED THE OTHER VERSIONS OF US!?

[drifting lintel]

Nemesis thinks that wally didn't kill all the other timelines. Just a few ... For no reason.

[pale cedar]

I’m saying nothing says that was every single Operator ever in existence of Eternalism

[fast dew]

Well he didn't

Theres nothing that suggests that he killed everyone

[fast dew]

It absolutely wouldn't be

The number is inconceivable lmao

[pale cedar]

DE quite often only show a few so there’s no issues with clipping and stuff

[drifting lintel]

The whole point is that he condensed the eternalism down to only two. The shrodinger twins so to speak.
The one who was saved and the one who wasn't.

[fast dew]

We do not know that

[pale cedar]

So just assuming that’s all of them when nothing ever says it was is pure assumption

[drifting lintel]

Omfg

[fast dew]

Even then, with Baro its seemingly not that

[pale cedar]

With Baro it directly stated that it is all

With Operator it isn’t

[drifting lintel]

You two are flipping stupid if you can't see the most obvious cutscene ever.

[pale cedar]

We work with what we are told not with what we assume

[dark compass]

[opaque zenith]

Welcome! Have some 🍿

[pale cedar]

Obvious would be DE directly saying all timelines but ours died

[fast dew]

Which. Again, isnt even what happened given we have red baro

[tall echo]

the first to throw insults is always losing the argument

[pale cedar]

I’m not saying it isn’t a possibility I’m saying it could be either or

[fast dew]

Especially when unspecified

[drifting lintel]

I'm talking to brick walls is what's going on.

[fast dew]

Dude can you at least be civil

[drifting lintel]

We literally see the variations of the operator split off of the one who shook the hand and get killed.

[tall echo]

last time you were the brick wall. and again, when you start throwing insults you've already lost

[drifting lintel]

I'm running on one hour of sleep and had to get up at 6am I'm just pissed

[dark compass]

I definitely ate one of the timelines

[drifting lintel]

Do I have to go frame by frame...?

[radiant pier]

nothing says #lore-discussion than someone getting pissed off for some reason how are you chat

[drifting lintel]

It's right there in the cutscene showing that he killed all timelines, not just a few.

[dark compass]

https://tenor.com/view/crunch-cat-luna-eat-gif-3997701764820700221

[woven coyote]

Well that's the thing

He didnt say and now i kill all your timelines

They could be dead yes
They could have been locked away
Hell with some isleweaver lines he could very well have just collected them and turned them into heralds

You are assuming your one singular interpretation to be the correct one based on vibes

[drifting lintel]

Because it's a repeating motif.

[vast depot]

If you can't debate without resorting to insults, it'll result in both the debate being shut down and you being warned over it.

Really simple.

[radiant pier]

do folks get banned here for repeat offenses

[drifting lintel]

I am sorry. I shouldn't have insulted people.
I'm just really tired and I've been arguing the same point for an hour with no progress.

[tall echo]

4 warnings get a ban iirc

[fast dew]

Whuh did

[vast depot]

Not quite, no.

[vast depot]

Yes.

[fast dew]

Did grandmother always talk about the chambers under the labs?

[radiant pier]

more than 4 or less?

[fast dew]

...necralisk

I mean necralisk

[vast depot]

Recommend resting over debating, or at least doing something that doesn't raise your blood pressure.

[radiant pier]

that would explain why some of the hateful speech peeps aren't banned yet

[vast depot]

Case by case.

[radiant pier]

yes! who wants to hop on Follie's hunt!

I just remembered you need more paint if you're not solo so nevermind

[drifting lintel]

I can't rest rn because I have classes all day. I was just trying to talk about lore during my break...

[radiant pier]

ooo, the bike mini game, can that be done with a squad?

[opaque zenith]

good idea, unfortunaly no

[drifting lintel]

Wait why can't the bike mini game be done with a squad?
There's 4 bikes on the machine

[radiant pier]

we need dumber mini games to be added

super mario parody

[tall echo]

I've already figured out how to streamline it a LOT so I think it wouldn't be much worse if I do coop follie farming

[radiant pier]

how so?

[woven coyote]

Now that we have the mario 64 painting thing we need the toad and luigi poker minigame

[opaque zenith]

Old Excal and Gauss in the olimpics
Orbiter asteroids
Grendel cut the rope

[radiant pier]

isn't it just, find canvases(C in spawn floor, B on the right of the bottom floor, A in main) get paint, BCA, done?

[drifting lintel]

okay. what is the reason people think wally didn't kill all the timelines?

I think killing all the timelines other than 2 makes the most sense from a cutscene analysis and story perspective.

so why otherwise?

[woven coyote]

Me personally? Isleweaver

[drifting lintel]

oh cool someone on the de team shares my name

[woven coyote]

The lines there point to other uses

[drifting lintel]

I didn't play much isleweaver so explain that to me

like how does that connect?
genuenly asking

[tall echo]

it's actually really simple, just find the shadowgraphs before picking up any ink. makes it much faster

[radiant pier]

that's it? I'm starting to think I've already got the gamemode nailed down

[radiant pier]

I keep seeing people talk about strats and tips thinking it's some super secret thing I missed

[drifting lintel]

are heralds just the forms wally takes?

[tall echo]

also use kullervo or any other easy overguard frame

[pale cedar]

“It’s Heralds are the stars that fells”

[woven coyote]

Well the line is during the fragmented so those would be the heralds

[woven coyote]

Then there's that line

[pale cedar]

The Heralds are implied to be other versions of Operators that Wally turned hence fell

[radiant pier]

I spend most of it as the Operator/Drifter anyway, I've got valkyr with shield gating so I'm good for the most part!

[woven coyote]

But when you combine the
"My heralds used to look like you" with the temporal dust description

[pale cedar]

So even Wally don’t want us all dead

[tall echo]

how about I inv you and we see how fast it goes

[radiant pier]

if I wanted to minmax or however you call it, probably a movement frame

[radiant pier]

OWKI

though I don't have the SP unlocked-

[tall echo]

I don't like farming in SP, rarely worth it for pity resources

[radiant pier]

who's....Palladino

[tall echo]

iron wake

[radiant pier]

the red veil lady right?

[pale cedar]

Ye

[radiant pier]

what

[pale cedar]

She’s at Iron Wake

[radiant pier]

WHAT

IT'S A RELAY TYPE THINGY?

[tall echo]

yes

[drifting lintel]

okay maybe I'm just tired but that sounds like something different than what y'all were saying.

my herald looked like you once.

• singular, meaning one herald
• only herald we know of is the murmur boss

so it could mean "I used something that looked like you to make the murmur"

and we know the murmur are made from dead worlds.

"I used the dust of the timelines I destroyed to make the murmur"

[radiant pier]

I NEVER KNEW

[tall echo]

the fragmented are 4 different beings

[radiant pier]

YOU CAN TALK TO HER?

[pale cedar]

We know there’s multiple Wally just speaks differently

[radiant pier]

IT'S A SHOP?

I didn't know

[pale cedar]

You’ve been missing out

[radiant pier]

I know

[tall echo]

on free rivens

[radiant pier]

I'm staring at it right now

[drifting lintel]

no no this thing is the herald

[radiant pier]

I did that quest almost a month ago

[pale cedar]

That’s a herald
We know there’s more than one

[radiant pier]

why does it have thick lips

[tall echo]

yo dm me yer game username so I can inv ye

[opaque zenith]

For the herald, she quite literaly summons 2 in the boss fight, and there's 4 variations of their types in total (suzerain, Zelator Anchorite, the one)

[radiant pier]

WAIT I'M EATING DINNER

later I'll message

[tall echo]

eat n farm, ez

[drifting lintel]

I only played isleweaver once so I forgor

[tall echo]

jk

[radiant pier]

I like to enjoy my food without distractions

also cuz it's a habit I gotta break

I'm only cooking right now so it doesn't count!

[tall echo]

I'm running on tism and adhd I physically can't do only one thing at a time

[radiant pier]

genuinely what else do you use riven slivers for

[drifting lintel]

yeah I'm listening to a comedy thing while doing this

[drifting lintel]

requium relics, rivens, stuff like that

[radiant pier]

that's it?

[pale cedar]

Yeah

[radiant pier]

okay I'll just grab the rivens later then

[opaque zenith]

weekly riven, cred, kuva, endo, and cards deco now

[radiant pier]

WHAT

[drifting lintel]

the emotion cards in the chains of harrow quest

[radiant pier]

IS THAT CLEM

[woven coyote]

Just another mention of the fragmented, in plural, as heralds

[radiant pier]

there was a Khora here just now she disappeared as I took the photo

[opaque zenith]

You should have acess to that since the chains quest https://wiki.warframe.com/w/Palladino

[woven coyote]

Clem and popcorn's blunt fort is so cute

[radiant pier]

this is so cute he his

pillow fort and his trust twin grakatas

[drifting lintel]

I get it, there's more than one herald.

but it uh ... still sounds to me like he used the dust from all the dead timelines to make them.

which would mean "once looked like you" is literal

[radiant pier]

I mean did he ever mention this whole....killing all other timelines thing?

[opaque zenith]

Oh forgot the Ultimatum, off to emergency mobile play

[radiant pier]

Ultimatum?

[drifting lintel]

during the new war we see at least like 10 die.

[tall echo]

requiem relics drop slivers

[fast dew]

Forces your lich out

[radiant pier]

was....anything mentioned or

[tall echo]

uhhh a honoria from roach

[drifting lintel]

we see him do it.

[woven coyote]

That is still you assuming death

Pain sure, but death was never confirmed

[drifting lintel]

they disapered after having an angurism and falling to the ground

they dead

[fast dew]

Its heralds are the stars it fells could be read as stars = ayatans = us

[drifting lintel]

and we know the dust of dead worlds once looked like the operator since wally said so in isleweaver as you yourself pointed out delta

[fast dew]

I mean theres. Other ways to kill an operator other than collapsed timelines

And. Afaik those were just from the decay of universes or dmthn

[tall echo]

eeeh, the ayatan thing is very specific

[radiant pier]

wait are we talking The Tenno as a whole being only us left, or just the concept of THE Operator(and by extension the drifter)

[fast dew]

I dont agree with it personally but it is something brought up a lot

[drifting lintel]

yes

[radiant pier]

which

[drifting lintel]

oh wait I misred.

[cunning ore]

only 10?

[fast dew]

Id go replay the old war but

[drifting lintel]

the main character

[fast dew]

Yk screw playing the old war

OLD WAR.

[radiant pier]

wanna go play Follie's hunt later?

[pale cedar]

Problem with only seeing 10 die is that’s 10 that’s never mentioned as being all

Or implied

[drifting lintel]

in the cutscene where we shake hands with the man in the wall again we see several variations of the operator split off the main one and all die.

[radiant pier]

you cannot deny the big lady

[fast dew]

Unfortunately im grinding w my alloidlings for the ducats required for the Loid floofs 😭 there's no room

Or, will be no room

[cunning ore]

oh you mean operator death, i thought total mb

[strange turtle]

There’s also a line earlier about Nelly asking if Drifter wants to change their form

"Tired of your human body? Want me to reshape it?"

Plus the whole “Murmur are animated with the Dead Universe Dust” thing

[radiant pier]

ahhh, that's fair

who's your favorite from the Hex

[fast dew]

Eleanor, personally

[radiant pier]

do you decorate your base of operations

[fast dew]

... did you not see the Albrecht shrine

[radiant pier]

nope

[pale cedar]

Can Wally reshape my book body?

[fast dew]

Oh

[drifting lintel]

the backroom is predecorated so idk what to add lol

[fast dew]

Hold on then

[strange turtle]

As long as you don’t want to be a book of love poetry

[woven coyote]

The one thing i wanna point out is you are skipping a few steps straight towards dead

Dust of decayed universes not necessarily dead

Like hek for all we know the extra us in the cutscene could be in pain from being turned into heralds instead of outright dead

[pale cedar]

Don’t ask me why I want a non book body

It might be so I can have arms to throw Thomas somewhere totally harmless

[drifting lintel]

.... Occam's razor is a thing for a reason.

[radiant pier]

oh you weren't kidding

do you have any floofs around? also that's cool you're using the backrooms

[pale cedar]

Issue with that is it still opens room for other interpretations

[fast dew]

I have a few

[pale cedar]

Which you tried saying didn’t exist

[radiant pier]

like?

[fast dew]

Ordis, QTCC floofs, 2 arthur floofs, the cavia

[tall echo]

oh lord you actually do have a shrine

[fast dew]

WHY DOES EVERYONE THINK I WAS JOKING

[woven coyote]

Like documenter you are saying they have to be dead for sure

But we are saying there's lines and text that point to other possibilities

[pale cedar]

Did you think it was a myth?

[cold star]

Have we met the other protoframes in 1999?

[tall echo]

I thought it was hyperbole

[radiant pier]

PREPARE TO ADD ANOTHER FLOOF TO YOUR COLLECTION

[tall echo]

?

[fast dew]

HIH

[pale cedar]

Thomas
Go get Scrap for downplaying the shrine

[cold star]

I completed the hex. Is there a side story where we meet velimir and such?

[tall echo]

yea thomas is already upsetti over possibly being able to miss baro bringing them

[fast dew]

https://tenor.com/view/bunny-rabbit-angry-attack-gif-8318612315233716848

[tall echo]

oh nah they're introduced in a yt trailer

[cold star]

Gotcha, ty

[drifting lintel]

"when multiple explanations exist for a phenomenon, the simplest one—requiring the fewest assumptions—is usually the most likely to be true" -Occam's razor

I'm arguing that the death of all other timelines is the simplest solution given the imagery we're given and the details that were given after

[woven coyote]

Just trailer and group chat pretty much

[radiant pier]

NYEHEHEHE

[radiant pier]

CHECK THY INBOX, OH GREAT FALL-OFF-THE-MAP ONE

[strange turtle]

The simplest assumption is that we don’t know what happened because it hasn’t been stated

Not that we’ve worked the events out through a comment from separate content

[pale cedar]

Can argue the simplest answer is not all timelines died based on dialogue after than the fact you just saw 10 people die out of infinite timelines

[fast dew]

Rq whats your favourite floof

[radiant pier]

oh I already have my favs

nice try

[fast dew]

Youre getting ordis then

[radiant pier]

you really think I didn't already buy 2 Lettie floofs?

[radiant pier]

AHA! NICE TRY, I ALREADY HAVE TWO OF HIM

the baro statues too!

[fast dew]

Protector stalker?

IM TAKING THAT AS A NO

[pale cedar]

If we saw something saying infinite people died then we could say that’s the simplest answer

[radiant pier]

I'M EATING HOLON

NICE TRY I THINK HE'S AN IDIOT

[fast dew]

IDC

[radiant pier]

CRAP

[drifting lintel]

I'm saying that it is up to interpretation.
Given we haven't seen any other timelines, we know timelines were destroyed, and we know he's made this exact deal before...
the simplest interpretation in my eyes is that all other timelines were destroyed.

like ... I know it could just be a gameplay-ism... but there are infinite heralds and they all once looked like the main character

[radiant pier]

I thought you had zero plat

[fast dew]

I bought some participating the loid floof

[radiant pier]

so it's up to interpretation....but you debate that your interpretation of all the other timelines being destroyed as....the only...

I'm gonna erase that message from my memory

[tall echo]

you mean anticipating?

[radiant pier]

then it turns out it's from baro

[fast dew]

IM TIRED

[radiant pier]

who's red baro

[fast dew]

Yuppers

[tall echo]

hi tired I'm scrap

[radiant pier]

hi tired I'm duck

[pale cedar]

We also know why we haven’t seen those other timelines

[drifting lintel]

I was arguing because I didn't understand the other interpretations. hell I hadent even heard of these interpretations until people in this chat told me about them. I thought everyone kinda understood the cutscene how I did.

I was wrong to think that.

[drifting lintel]

baro's drifter /j

[radiant pier]

yay

[pale cedar]

If you didn’t understand other interpretations why did you argue with me having another interpretation instead of just saying something like oh, that’s another interpretation I haven’t considered can you explain it to me or something like that

[drifting lintel]

I still don't agree with those interpretations mind you. they dont sound logical to me...

[radiant pier]

okay we're back to square one basically

[drifting lintel]

but you're free to think that

[radiant pier]

square two

[pale cedar]

What’s square 3?

[radiant pier]

they become omnipotent

[pale cedar]

Sorry, I ate that timeline

It was tasty

[radiant pier]

in a cosmic sort of way or like....chicken

[drifting lintel]

I'm sorry but they just don't make sense to me. idk...
and I don't think explaining it more will really change that.

and it's clear that explaining my perspective isn't helping to explain why it doesnt make sense to me

[pale cedar]

It doesn’t make sense to you is still just it doesn’t make sense to you

We saw 10 out of infinite

So we can’t say all died till something says that

We go with what we’re told over what we aren’t

[radiant pier]

just something more concrete than just 10

[drifting lintel]

and from my perspective I see them splitting off of the operator, like he cut them off at the root. (the 10 or so timelines that split off from the point of the handshake)

[radiant pier]

if DE intended that to be the only interpretation, they would've gone bigger with presenting it

[pale cedar]

We just don’t have enough to say the only correct answer is 100% are dead

[radiant pier]

I would doubt they'd skip the grandeur

[drifting lintel]

I don't think they did simply because they cant pre-render that cutscene. you can only show so many operators on screen without crashing a ps4

[pale cedar]

Which is why when presenting lore the easiest thing to do is go with what we have than what we don’t

And currently there’s more evidence pointing towards not all than all

[drifting lintel]

the evidence you provided me just isn't convincing.

[radiant pier]

@fast dew DANG IT

[pale cedar]

It’s not convincing to you
But it’s what we have

Go with what we have over what we don’t have

[drifting lintel]

and what we have equally points to both.
and from my pov the story makes more sense with him killing all.

[pale cedar]

It doesn’t equally point to both

There’s more evidence for some not all

[drifting lintel]

those evidence points you provided point to both, that's what I'm saying.

[pale cedar]

It doesn’t though is the issue

[drifting lintel]

and we're back to square 1

[pale cedar]

Saying it is 50/50 isn’t true because we have something implying another timeline exists

[drifting lintel]

what does?

because I don't remember any

[pale cedar]

The Isleweaver line

[drifting lintel]

that only implies that other timlines are dead

[pale cedar]

Plus the Albrecht quote

[drifting lintel]

which albrect quote?

[pale cedar]

It’s heralds are the stars that fells

Isleweaver quote doesn’t say that Operators timeline is dead

[drifting lintel]

yeah, the stars that died, and became the dust of dead worlds, that make up the murmur

[wraith sail]

I have over 20 warframe mastery rank 11 or 12 and still dont understand the story or anything am i dumb or is it confusing for everyone else to

[drifting lintel]

I have to go to a class, see y'all in an hour

[fast dew]

:3

[cunning ore]

it just confusing tho

since we don't have a decent time, it harder to really rearrange beside some events not happened in this place but other places so it a mess like that

[tall echo]

MR and lore knowledge are unrelated

so are MR and skill

[drifting lintel]

Last note before my class starts

• The heralds are murmur
• The murmur are made from dust of decayed worlds.
• the decayed worlds are most likely worlds wally killed during the deals.
• we know that wally killed several worlds the operator was in.

Therefore, "my herald looked like you once" means, "you're fighting a creature specifically made from the dust of your dead alternate versions."

Which then would mean it is equally likely if not moreso that he killed all the alternative outcomes not just 10 or so.

[strange turtle]

You’re assuming it was during the deal, and this hinges on that specific interpretation of the Zariman cutscene being correct.

It also neglects the fact that Wally specifies it is the fate that awaits dealbreakers —something the alternates couldn’t have done if they were killed off during the deal, and a term of importance due to it’s relevancy in recent content, since the opportunity for the deal to be broken and us being given the name only arose in Whispers with the final page being added to it (and the only other way to get it would be to somehow deny Wally the promised “light”, which the alternates couldn’t do either)

[ashen pulsar]

other worlds prolly couldnt handle wally

without the chosen operator, I mean

[strange turtle]

There’s also another thing - you bring up a potential connection of the Temporal Dust to the dead Operators, but there’s no way for them to be connected. Wally still has to get access to their timeline+universe after killing those Operators, the process of which we know takes long enough and would be so separated from the Operator’s death (beyond their alternates role in our universe’s story and the specific events that happened) that there’s not really a connection to draw

[ashen pulsar]

dead operators = undefended dimension/timeline = dead timeline

chosen operator, I mean

[strange turtle]

Yes, but that’s not linked to them at all

Because they wouldn’t have even gotten to the stage of being an Operator

There’s also the fact that depending on certain unknown factors that’d influence how it went, Albrecht might not even create a plan around there being an Operator in said timelines, or others could just fill in for ours

[strange plinth]

i can kinda see your point, though its also implied that the heralds are the consequence of breaking a deal through another line

(When the Fragmented envoy appears) Neci Rusalka: "I have uses for dealbreakers."

[pale cedar]

Albrecht probably doesn’t even know about other timelines or knows they aren’t important to care about

[drifting lintel]

He's a being outside time. Maybe this is the timeline that doesn't directly break the deal.

[worn cypress]

i am in the duviri quest i skipped by mistake the first book we read in the 1st undercroft mission and now i cant find it in youtube

people get things different than me

[drifting lintel]

I honestly don't remember... Which spiral was the first one again?

[tall echo]

What

[worn cypress]

a book interaction started saying with duviri tails

[twin wigeon]

the tales of duviri?

the storybook that defines the existence of duviri

[worn cypress]

yes i wanna hear it

[twin wigeon]

you don't/you can't

[worn cypress]

why and how
and why do people on yt didnt get it ?

[twin wigeon]

its all stories Euleria Entrati ("Mother") wrote to keep the Zariman children from conceptually embodying things, keeping them conditioned to neutrality

[twin wigeon]

wdym ppl don't get it?

[worn cypress]

they dont get the scene

[worn cypress]

where can i find it ? like a wiki

[twin wigeon]

none of the stories are given to us

just mentioned that all of Duviri was based on the book warning about the dangers of self-expression

[worn cypress]

how did i get it ?

[twin wigeon]

you get it as a decoration after the quest i believe

can't read it tho

afaik

[worn cypress]

@twin wigeon found a book interacted with it it started saying Duviri Tai- skipped by mistake

but where did u know that its a tail from zarman ?@twin wigeon

[twin wigeon]

Tale and its from that cutscene

[worn cypress]

what cutscene

[twin wigeon]

towards the end of the quest when you're taking back control from duviri? you see the scene with the figurine of thrax next to the storybook

[pale cedar]

Technically you do hear chapters of it but never the full thing

[drifting lintel]

We do hear some of it during the spirals.

[pale cedar]

Yeah

[drifting lintel]

Just like in the background from a narrator

[lean carbon]

I am going to draw Saryn because I love her and she is my favorite Warframe, but I also want to practice my faces so I was thinking of making a new Protoframe of Saryn that isn't Minerva. So my question is, would there be a possibility that there could be more than one person as a particular warframe. I just have some other ideas for alternate Proto Saryns I want to draw and was wondering if there would be any feasibility to the idea in lore. Not that I'm going to let the lore stop me, I am just curious and am still learning the lore. Thank you all :)

[drifting lintel]

For the longest time I thought the Russian girl was something close enough to a proto saryn

[pale cedar]

Going to be honest it’s your own work so whether it works lore wise or not doesn’t matter

[dark compass]

Strain injection takes some time. You can certainly make someone with that design with no real "breach" of lore

[strong viper]

Hey, don't know why I haven't asked this in all my time playing, but what's the point of putting credits into the foundry to build stuff? Materials I can get, but how is it the foundry needs cold cash to build something?

[pale cedar]

They weren’t mass produced

Mass production is never once mentioned

[dark compass]

Oh?

[drowsy saddle]

Ordis uses it to buy maintenance stuff

[strong viper]

There were more than one of most warframes (except a few like Harrow). Protoframes are time travel BS caused by Albrecht, they're unrelated but also related to warframes. Never clear on how many there were, but there were definitely more than just a single Saryn and/or Saryn prime

[drowsy saddle]

Buy fuel, repair materials, etc etc

[strong viper]

Ordis needs to keep his ass off of Temu if he's spending my money.

[drowsy saddle]

We literally bleed nef anyo for millions of credits from profit taker and index, what's like, 30k for ordis to buy cleanex

[pale cedar]

We get a sort of answer to this

ArtificialInsanity asks: When you build something in the Foundry, where do -those- credits go? To Ordis? What the heck is he buying behind my back?

Tenno, if left unattended, might spend the majority of their earned resources constructing new weaponry instead of managing "less essential" tasks, such as LIFE SUPPORT. While I cannot speak for Cephalon Ordis, it is conceivable that Ordis allocates acquired credits to managing other trivial areas unrelated to slaughter, such as Liset fuel cells, breathable atmosphere, etc.

I can assure you with absolute certainty that Ordis doesn't not contribute a portion of those funds into a probability pool weighed against your odds of survival.

[strong viper]

So background stuff

[drifting lintel]

The protoframes are made using a modified version of the original Warframe helminth strains

[drowsy saddle]

And probably pay for parking fees at relays

[dark compass]

Can he pay for my skins

[strong viper]

Yes, and they're made before the Warframes. That's why it's time travel BS. Alternative timeline or whatever. I'd say it's conceivable there were other timeline proto-Saryns.

[drifting lintel]

Technically in history they were made before since they exist in 1999 but if you look at it from the perspective of the literal needle that gets injected into them it was made after the original Warframes

[pale cedar]

They were made using existing Helminth thus were made after Warframes were made otherwise there wouldn’t be a serum to make the Protos from

[strong viper]

Exactly so. But they're in 1999, long before current day Warframe in the year 10k or something, never confirmed.

[pale cedar]

Albrecht time travelling didn’t ever make them the first actual first Warframes

[drowsy saddle]

This is a rather pointless technicality to be debating

[strong viper]

Facts, but Warframe timeline lore is fun to talk about because there's no right answer.

[drowsy saddle]

Also considering we the player are the literal linchpin of the timeline, its best to just use our perspective to dictate the timeline

Protoframes are after warframes because we the player encounter them later

[drifting lintel]

Like:
Normal time stream: Quincy -> lots of time -> helminth created -> cyte-09 batch created -> cyte-09 edited
Strain's perspective: helminth created -> cyte-09 batch created -> lots of time -> cyte-09 edited -> time travel -> injected into Quincy

[drowsy saddle]

Frankly the time traveling helminth has got to be the wildest form of genetic memory in media

[pale cedar]

Flare is the only exception to the what was actually made first due to Ballas not using the serum

[drifting lintel]

Temple might be their own bootstrap

[twin wigeon]

no

[drifting lintel]

Hey I said might, just that it's a possibility

It's probably not

[drowsy saddle]

There's a starman, waiting in the sky

[pale cedar]

DE purposefully avoided adding paradoxes to 1999

[twin wigeon]

the temple found in the Naga Drum night is the same Flare Varleon we meet in 1999

[pale cedar]

It isn’t a bootstrap based on what a bootstrap actually is

[drowsy saddle]

Yeah, flare doesn't have boots

[twin wigeon]

they don't have boots?? could've sworn they did

[drowsy saddle]

Yeah, wild stuff, next thing you know the shrimp fried the rice

[twin wigeon]

lol

[drifting lintel]

Yeah if it was a bootstrap it would go:

Injected into flare -> lots of time -> fighting in the naga drums -> temple dies -> strain taken off of Temple's corpse -> taken by Albrecht -> injected into flare

I'm pretty sure that timeline is wrong tho because ballas just made it and didn't inject it into anyone.

[twin wigeon]

yep, because "rebellion was suffused in their blood" or smth and he was scared of creating something like that

so now you got a rebellious rockstar rocking and rolling

[drifting lintel]

He was probably trying to make a shawzin playing Warframe and put too much f*** the system into it.

[pale cedar]

He made a rebellious serum then realised it was a bad idea

[twin wigeon]

he was def plotting to rebel against the orokin while making it and decided to do it himself instead

[hollow wagon]

Explain follie to me

[twin wigeon]

Ink lady

[hollow wagon]

Pretty please with a cherry on top

[hollow wagon]

Splatoon?

[twin wigeon]

close! thats ink squid

[drifting lintel]

Therapist who was forced to do indoctrination.

We walked into an indoctrination painting.

[hollow wagon]

I-
Huh

[twin wigeon]

what

[hollow wagon]

Indoctrination painting?

[twin wigeon]

ohhhhhhhh

[drifting lintel]

Follie hunt.

[twin wigeon]

wait i get it

[hollow wagon]

I dont get it

Enlighten me

[drifting lintel]

In the follie hunt game mode we walk into a painting made by follie that was meant to indoctrinate people.

Because the orokin made her stop being a therapist and do indoctrination instead

[twin wigeon]

ummmmmmmm

where in lore?

[drowsy saddle]

What was the name of that movie? Color orange?

[drifting lintel]

Clockwork orange

[drowsy saddle]

Yeah that

Mindbreak a mfr via rorschach blots

[hollow wagon]

I prefer clockwork Olive green tbh

[twin wigeon]

I thought you was making a joke like we're trying to indoctrinate follie to join us and instead we're getting trapped in a painting

yeah so you lost me

again, as always

[drifting lintel]

Follie had developed a method of therapy where the patient would paint something with gentle guidance from the therapist and then the patient would try to explain what they made.

The orokin forced her to instead twist it and indoctrinate by having the therapist tell the patient what to paint and then lecture the patient on what it means.

The painting we walk into in the follie hunt game mode is one of those paintings.

[twin wigeon]

is that lore or just a headcanon

[drowsy saddle]

Can i paint two bears high fiving

[drifting lintel]

The first two parts are lore, the third one is my interpretation of us walking into a painting and getting attacked by a therapist.

[twin wigeon]

ohhhhh

hell yeah

i assume you get that from getting those letters from collecting atramentum?

[drifting lintel]

Actually if you have follie you can

[drifting lintel]

Yeah

[drowsy saddle]

Figured, real question is what object to apply it to

[twin wigeon]

rpg

wait no

skittergirl searchy thingy

[drifting lintel]

I find it funny that people were confused by the RPG when if you don't recolor her and summon it ... It looks like a paintbrush.

[worn cypress]

what now guys ? 🗿

[twin wigeon]

angels

[drifting lintel]

Both are their own flavors of acid trip.

[twin wigeon]

both are lovely

[drowsy saddle]

Angels, cause incarnons

[drifting lintel]

You gotta do both anyways.

[worn cypress]

for the lore whats first ?

[drowsy saddle]

Plus angels is first

[drifting lintel]

Angels

[twin wigeon]

angels

[noble oyster]

god i am so curious about the lore behind Follie

[drifting lintel]

Follie had developed a method of therapy where the patient would paint something with gentle guidance from the therapist and then the patient would try to explain what they made.

The orokin forced her to instead twist it and indoctrinate by having the therapist tell the patient what to paint and then lecture the patient on what it means.

[twin wigeon]

Ex-therapist

[drifting lintel]

Angry therapist

[twin wigeon]

er reverse-therapist

[noble oyster]

so my question is, who the hell is in Follie in the mission?

[worn cypress]

will i be able to stop the game ?

[drowsy saddle]

Follie's own trauma?

[twin wigeon]

just equip sirocco

[drowsy saddle]

Breaking the hypocratic oath and what not?

[twin wigeon]

and i tthink yeah

[noble oyster]

my theory is its either a. the teacher we hear in the voicelines or b. another Tenno traped in th e frame, like Harrow was sorta

[drifting lintel]

Probably the original follie. She was helminthed at some point.

[drifting lintel]

I think it's the teacher. Like that's just follie's voice before the transformation.

[worn cypress]

..

[noble oyster]

maybe

[twin wigeon]

perhaps

[worn cypress]

ha ?

[drifting lintel]

You can exit the game but idk if you can access arsenal or star chart until after the end of the mission.

[noble oyster]

if she is, then i understand the publics reaction to her now

[twin wigeon]

wym?

[noble oyster]

you know what i mean.

[twin wigeon]

i do not.

[noble oyster]

im gonna look you in the eyes and ask you what has been the popular reception on Follie

[twin wigeon]

👁️ 👄 👁️

[noble oyster]

no go on, answer

[twin wigeon]

thats shes a squishy, chunky, blob of ink?

[noble oyster]

...

[pale cedar]

This didn’t take long to happen

[drifting lintel]

She has a lot of inspirations surprisingly.

Her design and outfit are similar to that of an opera singer and costume.
Her abilities and lore kinda tie into the sad clown.
And her lore is primarily about therapy and mind control.

[noble oyster]

thats entirely unhelpful lmao

[twin wigeon]

ohhhhhhhh

[woven coyote]

Some people really just are terminally online huh

[twin wigeon]

i mean in roman times isn't fat = richness/beauty? or smth

[drifting lintel]

Yes even into the 50s

[twin wigeon]

and the orokin are rather roman?

[drifting lintel]

Yep

Well more Greek but they had the same view on it

[pale cedar]

I bet whoever wrote it was super enthusiastic when coming up with it

[noble oyster]

region chat is so god damn funny

[dark compass]

It's not :(

[noble oyster]

its comical seeing how angry people are about Follie, when we are space children ninjas with void powers because we travveled through time

i dont think realisim is DEs first priority here yall

plus Xaku, Hildryn, Yareli, Grendel, so many other frames have unrealistic builds, and not a ONE of those gets any complaints

[drifting lintel]

Realism is literally just "can we stretch this to fit with quantum mechanics?"

[faint wadi]

Don't forget about Jade

[noble oyster]

exactly

[faint wadi]

Honestly, I think Follie's awesome. I'm just not a personal fan of the game mode, so I'm just going to farm it enough to subsume her

[drifting lintel]

Like ... I really don't get why this is such an issue.
I took one look at her and went "opera" and was presently surprised when the game said therapy/art.

[cunning ore]

I just ignored everything, it after all "The freedom"

[drifting lintel]

What?

[noble oyster]

ballas doesnt speak english im guessing, give em a sec

[cunning ore]

I mean that bad words, good words, whatever about Follie is just like freedom in speeches and everything else so should not bother at it

[cunning ore]

Yea, it not my main

[noble oyster]

ballas is tryin to say that free speech and all that. while i sorta agree, i still find it funny people are so upset over this for like.. no reason

[cunning ore]

In short, they just don't like her that all

[faint wadi]

yeah, I don't really get the lash back, myself. I could maybe understand with Jade... but not with any other frame.

[drifting lintel]

What's wrong with Jade?

[cunning ore]

Each individual has their own taste, so that's why.

[faint wadi]

for me, personally, it's the ethical dilemma of playing as a frame that is perpetually pregnant.

Like... I'd rather play as either Jade or her offspring after they grow up. Not as Jade still pregnant with a child for eternity, you know?

[drifting lintel]

Oh the one we recreate isn't actually pregnant.

The original who was pregnant did give birth during the quest.

The one we recreate just looks like that.

[faint wadi]

ah. that makes more sense.

[cunning ore]

And there no child but the core power actually

By morality, we all should have feel unease when duplicating corpses to reuse it as weapons

[drifting lintel]

Oh yeah that part is weird. We're essentially 3d printing bio machines that still have vestiges of their original version's minds (as shown in their animation sets)

[noble oyster]

actually i was curious about that

whats the deal with the animations? if we're in control of the suit, why do they all have unique idles?

[cunning ore]

They not suits?

[noble oyster]

ik, figure of speech

[normal mountain]

Remnants of the original person/frame's personality persisting after the lobotomy

[faint wadi]

yeah, the originals are just hollowed out like gourds, retaining what little shreds of their original personality.

When we duplicate their blueprints and build them, I guess they keep that little bit of personality in the form of idle animations

[drifting lintel]

The only one who isn't basically a suit is Excalibur umbra due to the umbra transference bolt repeating the memories of the original killing his son on loop.

The others are all essentially mindless drones who only retain some muscle memory from their originals.

[noble oyster]

i wonder if its like, an impression they leavce on us then

[normal mountain]

It's exactly that

[drifting lintel]

No no the originals are like jade and stalker.

They still have minds.

The 3d printed ones are hollowed out in the way you said.

[normal mountain]

I don't remember the Drifter KIM quote, but that basically the way it's explained

[faint wadi]

whatever the case is, I'm taking my gourd-frame to Terrorem to farm mutagen samples. 😂

[cunning ore]

They have more anwers than me.
But i would choose mine as the Muscle Memories thing like a possibility.

[normal mountain]

would depend on the original
There are some frames that were made after the Zariman returned
It wouldn't surprise me if those were lobotomized from the start

Of course, knowing which ones those are is another matter entirely

[cunning ore]

Have good time!!

[drifting lintel]

I don't think they were due to just how the serum works.

But some like quorvex may be entirely synthetic, never having an original.

[cunning ore]

Then we have to wait or kick Albrech's ass to threat him about the serum formula

[drifting lintel]

Quorvex is a special case tho since we know Albrecht created the blueprints loid gave to us and there's no evidence of another quorvex.

[cunning ore]

I heard a joke of Quorvex made by cement?

[normal mountain]

The serum works that way, yes
But who's to say the Orokin didn't immediately braindead the first versions of frames meant to be Operated?

tho I will readily admit, the Orokin don't always do things the logical way
as the Zariman itself proves

[cunning ore]

They did it by mood. Like if Ballas woke up, no Margulis = someone die

That's Orokin.

[drifting lintel]

Yes. He's a frame designed off of nuclear reactors. Nuclear reactors use concrete to block the radiation at its center.

Quorvex is designed to look like he's made out of concrete but he might just be a different material or even murmur material.

[cunning ore]

Wait, possible that Quorvex used to be planned to be brought to 1999?

[drifting lintel]

It's actually mentioned that he's designed for the chosen operator (main character) to defend the sanctum anatomica.
And it deals a lot of radiation damage, so it's likely specifically for killing murmur.

[normal mountain]

I mean, he might have been inspired by the Hollvania nuclear reactor
But otherwise, I don't think there's any connection to 1999

[drifting lintel]

I didn't even think about that.
Containment walls and stuff.

[cunning ore]

Nuclear reactor is the keyword that make me things of that, and Quorvex just be like forgotten.

[drifting lintel]

Lol imagine if quorvex was actually made after 1999 due to the reactor and Albrecht made a quick stop by the lab to put the blueprints where loid could find it before going to tau.

[normal mountain]

That
Would be funny

[drifting lintel]

If I could draw and animate I would make so many silly little animations about shenanigans I imagine Albrecht doing in the background like that.

[strange turtle]

Albrecht making a stopoff in like 2001 or 4 to pick up more Onlyne albums and merch

[cunning ore]

Pls add in Ballas 🥺 ✨

[cunning ore]

And he gave it to his granddaughter?

[strange turtle]

No for himself

[cunning ore]

Everytime i fishing and have to listen that On-lyne

[strange turtle]

He’s a big fan

[cunning ore]

I begged for annihilation

[strange turtle]

Genuinely has like 30 CDs

[cunning ore]

Serious Praghasa should eat Sol

[drifting lintel]

I would animate Ballas coming back to life due to the void and getting jumped by the operator, umbra, and Odis.

[cunning ore]

https://tenor.com/view/jojos-bizarre-adventure-milton-jojo-kicking-fight-gif-16647809

[drifting lintel]

Yes

[cunning ore]

It sound like

😭 no, my cutie

Oh, now i can create a Ballas Drifter, good new face blending

[drifting lintel]

I'll be the "he's complicated" Albrecht defender all day long.

But F*** BALLAS

[cunning ore]

I will belike: ehee 😆

[drifting lintel]

Also ... I just realized, Albrecht tried to use the cavia to "Wheatley" the man in the wall.

[raven oar]

Hey guys do you think you can help me figure out some things about the dark Refractory i can't seem to rap my head around it

[gloomy prism]

So is Follie a new addition to the sentient operatorless frames?

[cunning ore]

What with it?

[worn cypress]

what to do to be ready for angels of zariman?
or should i just not complicate it

[cunning ore]

Hmm, more like Nokko's case to me than sentient, like she could be turned into warframes by other reasons not by Ballas.

[drifting lintel]

Been a thing since the start, read the rhino prime shard

[drifting lintel]

Go ahead

[cunning ore]

Sirocco, that all. You can go with Xaku as a bonus

[raven oar]

So the dark Refractory is a memory machine right then how are we getting loot from a memory?

[drifting lintel]

Nokko was also helminth. He was just forgotten

[worn cypress]

u sure ?

[drifting lintel]

It's a video game.

[cunning ore]

Void damage, why not?

[drifting lintel]

Sorry to be a downer but yeah you're not actually getting any loot from it in universe. It's just the game being a game.

[cunning ore]

We stole tissues and erotic pages for his fan-girl steaming erotic book

[worn cypress]

what ?

[drifting lintel]

The operator isn't actually getting loot from the dark refractory. We just get loot because we're playing a looter shooter MMO

[raven oar]

So basically none of it is cannon after the quest is done

[cunning ore]

I can give you some if you seeking meanings in them?

[raven oar]

Go ahead

[drifting lintel]

I like to imagine the 6 resources you get from it are just like the operator remembering things.

You use three of them for getting ahold of a tauron strike artifact and then upgrading the focus tree associated with it.
So it could just be that you remember where it is and how to use it better.

As for the other two you just get lost in thought or something, remembering all the dax you had to kill when making the prime grineer scythe and pistol.

[cunning ore]

You know there two main things: Maphica and Ignia you can earn from Dark Refractory of Roathe? So yea, they alike marking stones of the progress you had made in Roathe's mind. Those after that you returned to Roathe to exchange stuffs, consider them like pieces and pieces of his memories and those fragile pieces, by how it affects his change. Ignia for redemption, and Maphica for his sins that possible turn him into villain path.

You used it to exchange with Roathe, right? It like a way to help him gathers himself. /jk

[white goblet]

Idk if im just goin crazy but

I like the idea that 'The Guilty' doesn't refer to the boss fight. I feel that the Perita Rebellion is just the Operator's trauma cental, but that mostly refers to their fear, their helplessness, their pain, etc etc.

I think the guilty is supposed to be specifically to address the Operator's guilt in their own actions during the rebellion. In their eyes, they killed helpless sentients, helpless tenno, and (to an extent) adis (who wasn't helpless).

We are the guilty

[cunning ore]

That also why it has to be Uriel

[drifting lintel]

The bosses in the normal mode are called "trauma resurfacing"

[cunning ore]

The frame we used to cause the further guilt i guess? Or? Idk how to describe

[drifting lintel]

I think it's just because Uriel was the "devil frame that did devil's work" that the operator commandeered to destroy tauron academy.

It is the symbol of his guilt, of him snapping.

[white goblet]

Maybe it's the lotus seeing that if the operator understands the guilt of Roathe, they can understand their own guilt?

[drifting lintel]

That sounds accurate.

You do need to understand roath's guilt to make it in the first place.

[cunning ore]

Luckily, Thomas not here

[white goblet]

the train engine?

[raven oar]

Why is that?

[drifting lintel]

No the one with the Artur pic who hates roathe because he says a slur against Captain Vor in the Gemini skin

[cunning ore]

Uhmm, you will know if you visit this place more often ✨ 🥺

[white goblet]

he does??? wha

one sec haha

[drifting lintel]

Yeah if you fight captain vor while wearing the Gemini skin roathe will say he's an amazing soldier and leader "despite being a vat rat."

[white goblet]

oh LMFAO, i mean i feel like there are more reasons to hate roathe, im pretty sure one of the big parts of getting to know him is understanding that he's, to an extent, a product of his time

[cunning ore]

So, i'm dating with Roathe and at R5, and i have a Ballas Drifter. So if i share time alone, was it a disaster?

[drifting lintel]

That's what I've tried to tell Thomas but he won't listen lol

[drifting lintel]

It'll certainly look weird, but it'll play out the same. I hope you like seeing ballas getting dommed

[white goblet]

eh whatevs, anyways yeah i like the idea that we're the guilty, and with every fight, we're being judged for our sins

[cunning ore]

NO.

[white goblet]

it also works with lotus's voiceline

So, Devil (meaning both the 'void devil' and the 'uriel devil'), you choose the harder path (the path more stressful to the operator), as always

[drowsy saddle]

Judgment

Prepare thyself

[cunning ore]

See! Even Lotus agree they are devils

What a mom!

[drifting lintel]

I think she was making a joke about the skin.

[cunning ore]

wait what? Im eepy abit

[white goblet]

it can be both LMFAO

[drifting lintel]

Uriel is the devil Warframe. The operator sometimes gets called void devil.

So it's the lotus jokingly calling us devil because of the Warframe we're wearing.

[digital lark]

Who’s the voice in follies hunt? To me it sounds like mother

[drifting lintel]

most likely follie herself. recreating the voice she had before she was turned into a warframe

[onyx musk]

guys. A puck of plat in warframe is 60 lbs or 27.6 kg

that means warframes can flip 27.6 kg in one hand easily.

[gentle rapids]

like a coin

[noble oyster]

question rq, whats the lore reason (if there is one) to Excal Umbras animations being on every other frame?

[pallid spoke]

There isn't one. It's just a freebie cosmetic.

[muted isle]

Just imagine its some weird helminth hivemind interconnected bs spaghetti :p

[strange turtle]

The animations being a cosmetic option isn’t a canon thing, since it’s specifically a bit of the remainder of the OG’s mind/memories

That and a bunch of them rely on the specific Warframe

[wooden cave]

I feel like we trauma dump on quincy the MOST out of the hex I'mma be fr

lettie a close second

ts feels like the green goblin mask calling to me

https://tenor.com/view/green-goblin-gif-14141276552966470862

[worn cypress]

lol guys

[raw frigate]

I have a question that I can't quite figure out after playing Follies Hunt for a few hours but, whats the lore for this update? I'm assuming Follie had an operator that was rather creative, but clearly either very unstable or very much a prankster due to some of the audio you get from the missions. But are there like data fragments or something to scan for the lore or somewhere I can go to read it?

[drifting lintel]

Be nice!

[wooden cave]

:3

[drowsy saddle]

The... Letters that you unlock by gathering the new resource

[raw frigate]

.....that can't be it right? Theres barely any lore in those letters

[drowsy saddle]

There's plenty? Follie's a therapist who used painting as a medium

Then got twisted into indoctrination programs for the orokin

[drifting lintel]

Which drove her crazy.

[drowsy saddle]

I was crazy once

[drifting lintel]

https://tenor.com/view/tadc-the-amazing-digital-circus-caine-caine-tadc-constructive-criticism-gif-17531607876873789742

[raw frigate]

Maybe I missed one of the letters then. I did kinda listen and farm for everything at like 3 in the morning so might have missed it due to being on auto pilot/absolutely exhausted lol

[wooden cave]

god this hex finale is making me so shaky
saving every member one by one
knowing what might happen if you even fail ONCE
then having to fight off the murmur right after that

[wooden cave]

do you need to get to the MAXIMUM STANDING RANK
to do chemistry with the hex again??

[pulsar pendant]

Do Operator/Drifter need air to breathe?

[strange plinth]

in most cases, yes

[pulsar pendant]

is there air in Duviri?

[strange plinth]

probably

[pulsar pendant]

i mean Teshin needs it so probably

[wooden cave]

I mean yeah

the tenno are just normal humans
just with magical fantastical powers

[pulsar pendant]

It's confusing, u can chill in some places with the Operator/Drifter while there is no air

Well shouldn't be air

[strange plinth]

there's a couple spots they can be in where there isn't air, yea
even the warframes need air, it seems
occasionally its ignored, like the last bit of TNW

[pulsar pendant]

exactly

Deimos, Venus probably

[woven coyote]

Venus is terraformed and so is deimos

[pulsar pendant]

why does Deimos have air tho?

[wooden cave]

I mean if the animals on venus can breathe we can too

[pulsar pendant]

also how

[woven coyote]

Tho deimos retains its atmosphere most likely because of the infestation tendrils

[wooden cave]

it was a planet once
the sentients terraformed it because earth was absolutely trashed by the orokin

[woven coyote]

It's hard to remember but we are relatively deep in the deimos infestation mass

[pulsar pendant]

well Orokin rather

[woven coyote]

We pass by quite a bit during the fly in cutscne in heart of deimos

[wooden cave]

well
deimos is STILL a planet
just
very infested

[woven coyote]

Sentients were sent for tau not deimos

[wooden cave]

I thought tau became deimos tho no?

it would make sense
since the entratis are there and all
all the orokin technologies still remaining

[woven coyote]

No

[pulsar pendant]

i mean there would be air in the Necralisk, but Deimos? Infestation doesn't need it, they just poison it

[woven coyote]

Not even close

[strange plinth]

deimos got bio-bombed to prevent the sentients from invading during hte old war

[wooden cave]

that's what I got from the old peace stuff

[strange plinth]

tau is/in another system

[woven coyote]

https://youtube.com/shorts/RHBxOs78yQM?si=yR1t3FFiAKG8wGg1

Deimos has a lot more gases than you are giving it credit for

[wooden cave]

hmm

[woven coyote]

Old peace is memories from the old war

We have no idea if anything remains

[pulsar pendant]

well ofc

[woven coyote]

We are literally pulling a assassin's creed it's all memories

[pulsar pendant]

Infestation is farting all sorts of things

[wooden cave]

I also love how the old peace just reinstates the fact that ballas is the WORST character in the story

[woven coyote]

Well yeah and luckily enough of it is breathable lol

[strange plinth]

-# also lotus said "tau is in sight, it will not be the place that you or i remember"
-# that doesn't make a ton of sense if we were inside of tau at the time

[pulsar pendant]

That's something, what about a Sentient ship?

[wooden cave]

like literally "oh he also is basically the entire reason the war restarted after a brief time of peace"

[woven coyote]

That one i got nothing lol

[pulsar pendant]

Exactly, they don't have air

[wooden cave]

like
the tenno's crashout when they take the uriel frame is very justified imo

[woven coyote]

Like the narmer ones we can assume have enough for ther veiled crew

But the anomaly in veil proxima? No clue

[strange plinth]

the sentients were originally terraformers
i don't think its a huge stretch to say they have some oxygen production in there somewhere

[pulsar pendant]

Exactly

[wooden cave]

to add on to the air question
tau didn't have any air either

[pulsar pendant]

They used masks

Somewhat

[woven coyote]

Well not human friendly air and not until the terraformers activated

[wooden cave]

our character's seen wearing an oxygen mask

[strange plinth]

had a mask then, until the world seeders gave it some

[pulsar pendant]

There is air, the flowers poison it, iirc

[woven coyote]

Rather our air poisons the flowers

[pulsar pendant]

Or that

Also another question, how are we getting weapons and resources from a memory?

[woven coyote]

Yeah for the narmer ones with human crews it isnt a stretch

But for the veil proxima one with no humans in sight? That one is weird to have air (probably just chalk it up to gameplay anyway)

[pulsar pendant]

Perita Rebellion i mean

[worn cypress]

what the sht is this shi doing here*

[pulsar pendant]

u're new?

[woven coyote]

Well the blueprints would be the same way varzia draws prime stuff from regal aya

[worn cypress]

ye

kinda

[pulsar pendant]

explains ur confusion

[pulsar pendant]

and the resources?

[worn cypress]

why and what is he doing here + i am still not sure what is this entity

i am in whispers quest

withoout spoilers guys

[pulsar pendant]

||basically after Chains of Harrow i think, a Tenno named Rell kept Wally at bay, now u released him and now he haunts everybody||

[woven coyote]

Nothing again lol

I remember that for something roathe just had a stockpile somewhere but was a specific case iirc

[worn cypress]

i dont think thats ||this is rell ..||

[pulsar pendant]

no that's Wally

[humble sierra]

That's the Man in the Wall

[worn cypress]

ye thats what in my mind but i cant prove it

[humble sierra]

He's been showing up since War Within

[pulsar pendant]

now u know

[pulsar pendant]

i thought CoH?

[worn cypress]

just dont spoil spoiler 🙂

[worn cypress]

n

[humble sierra]

The veeery end of War Within, he possesses you

[worn cypress]

will his lore or what the f is it or what does it want show after ?

[pulsar pendant]

right but we released him in CoH

guess he was late

[humble sierra]

He's the main antagonist of this current story Arc that started after New War

[pulsar pendant]

Wally is... something

[pulsar pendant]

Yes, but many questions still linger

[strange plinth]

end of new war attracted his attention and let him do more
hence whispers

[pulsar pendant]

was it because of Kuva?

[humble sierra]

Ballas basically used Praghasa to tear a big hole in the void

[pulsar pendant]

Also what happened when we drunk it?

[humble sierra]

Because he was trying to jump to Tau

[humble sierra]

Ultimately nothing because drinking it is optional

[pulsar pendant]

I mean it should do something no?

[humble sierra]

It changes what Wally says upon possessing you but that's about it

So far

[pulsar pendant]

Interesting

also nice pfp

[worn cypress]

who is tau ? i here everyone speaking about him or it

[worn cypress]

but dont spoil after whispers 🙂

[humble sierra]

Tau is another star system. We are in Sol, aka the solar system, aka The Origin System.

[pulsar pendant]

i love this
whatever that is

[humble sierra]

Expedition 33 photo mode

[pulsar pendant]

Orokin attempted to voidjump to Tau, but that backfired heavily

[worn cypress]

aha
And why does they want to go to it ? and where is it stated that its a solar system

[pulsar pendant]

they needed more room

[stiff fable]

Ever heard of Tau Ceti?

[worn cypress]

no

[humble sierra]

Basically the Orokin plundered the Solar system of its resources, so they tried going to Tau. The Zariman was sent to colonize it, the Sentients were made to prepare it.

[stiff fable]

It's a star

With its own solar system

So, Tau System

[worn cypress]

ah ty guys

[humble sierra]

The Sentients gained sentience, and realized the Orokin would ruin Tau as well, so they rebelled

Which kickstarted the Old War

[pulsar pendant]

wait doesn't that mean ||Sentients are still on Tau, doing their shii?||

[worn cypress]

so colonizers keep colonizing

[stiff fable]

Yes, except Tau has been completely silent since the Old War

[humble sierra]

As of OLD PEACE SPOILERS DONT CLICK ZIN ||they're on Tau, but following basic programming as they don't have the Xenoflora to give them independence||

[stiff fable]

So the question is, what did the Orokin do before they were pushed out?

[stiff fable]

just to clarify, ||"basic programming" means going back to being little pieces of bigger Sentients like Hunhow||

[torn wave]

Not really, pazul mentions a bit about tau on recent events, "lords of tau" and we learn the archons were present on tau , not during the old peace but likely after

[stiff fable]

That's incorrect

[pulsar pendant]

so Sentiens aren't sentient when sniffing the flowers?

[torn wave]

So we got some "present day" info on tau

[woven coyote]

Amar is literally on screen in old peace

[worn cypress]

ok i am logging out of the chat see you guys

[torn wave]

Not fused with rhino yet

Thats what I meant

Like before they were chopped and mashed together

[woven coyote]

And no pazuul isnt talking about real current events

[strange plinth]

tau's been silent since the old war

[torn wave]

I mean he was talking about recent ish, stuff after old peace cuz we didn't any of this during

[stiff fable]

After Old Peace is the entire second half of the Old War

Tau went silent during that time

Pazuul doesn't know anything about what it's really like

[woven coyote]

We have been 100% cut off ever since hunhow blew up the rail

[strange plinth]

hunhow shattering the rail, the assault on lua, lotus vaporizing erra, etc

[torn wave]

Not really? We get basically to the part of adis dropping the mask, then cut off, we don't know what all fully went down

So there's till more

[stiff fable]

That.... no

[torn wave]

Yes

[woven coyote]

How recent do you think old peace is timeline wise?

[pulsar pendant]

the Sentients are sentient when good or bad? Like when they're blue or red?

[humble sierra]

Old Peace's ending basically killed off sentient independence, the only ones remaining are the hive minds

[humble sierra]

Blue is indicating they've got Xenoflora

[pulsar pendant]

ok

[stiff fable]

They're still Sentients either way

[strange plinth]

if we're going back to origin at the end of old peace, the rail is still intact
as the latter half is beginning, that means a bunch of events we know happened during the old war haven't happened yet

[woven coyote]

Fragment independence rlly

[stiff fable]

But they're not individuals

[humble sierra]

It's not that blue means good, they can still be independent and evil

It just means they're making their own decisions

[pulsar pendant]

ohh

[torn wave]

Recent enough on current know present story, again I'm not saying it happened last week for the tenno, I'm saying pazul who after the new war was the one to make us aware of the Lord's of tau which we really don't know much about, that's new news to us

[pulsar pendant]

so Hunhow was there

actually where was he? during that time?

[humble sierra]

We just didn't see evil sentients because they were all clearly wanting Perita to be their own

[stiff fable]

It's likely that the Lords of Tau are the Sentient leadership

The ones who negotiated with the Orokin in the first place

[woven coyote]

Old peace is as ancient as the old war

They cant be called recent in any way shape or form

[fast dew]

And genuinely just Perita

[stiff fable]

So while they're new to the players they're old news for the characters

[torn wave]

Not speaking narrative, recent for us people in this real world with flesh and blood unfortunately breathing oxygen

But for the narrative we don't know if like the tenno knows? It's very kinda ok what all does the kid know??? The Kim chats basically filled in years of unanswered questions and would be nice if we got a Kim (no romance) system for the operator to give us some more lore bombs like drifter did

[humble sierra]

I wonder why we only saw Perita. Is that the only one with possibility for life?

When we terraformed Perita did that also terraform the other planets?

[strange plinth]

sadly rebb has said no KIM for the operator, as "kids can't type"

[humble sierra]

Or rather other moons, because we haven't even gotten to a planet yet

[stiff fable]

It's just where we were stationed

[humble sierra]

My question is more so "is there xenoflora elsewhere, alive? Is there hope?"

[torn wave]

Still want one with no romance just strictly for lore

[stiff fable]

All of the Tau system was terraformed, but Perita is where the Xenoflora were found, so it was the place the Setients cared about the most

[pulsar pendant]

i just realized, there was no base frame in Old Piece

[stiff fable]

nope

[torn wave]

Just something like how exactly was the tenno during the first transference, how did that go down

[humble sierra]

Excalibur Prime? Uriel?

[pulsar pendant]

Just Primes

[pulsar pendant]

oh right Uriel

[stiff fable]

Margulis created it

[strange plinth]

there were a lot of completely sealed glass cases. it isn't completely impossible but it is highly unlikely

[stiff fable]

Transference was a therapy technique she made

[pulsar pendant]

but that's it, every other commandeered frame was Prime

[humble sierra]

Rhino Prime was rampaging, broke into a room where all the Tenno were in cryosleep, and he was calmed, so they realized they could use the Tenno for that

[torn wave]

Yes but not what I'm talking about, more of "hey kid we gonna put you in this screaming zombie, it shoots lasers, try to uh twirl into the air at high speeds ok?" The poor tenno "...?????"

proceeds to smack into the wall

[stiff fable]

Nah

The original transference frames were human standard

[pulsar pendant]

how could a kid with lots of trauma calm down someone that was brutally transformed??

[stiff fable]

After the Rhino Prime incident Ballas got the idea for the operators

[torn wave]

You have no whimsy

[stiff fable]

by also knowing what it's like to be brutally transformed

[humble sierra]

Yeah the Sacrifice goes a bit more in depth

[woven coyote]

Empathy tm

[stiff fable]

m8 you asked a question

[humble sierra]

Literally why the Orokin couldn't

[pulsar pendant]

glad we could see that in the Sacrifice

[torn wave]

Nvm you ain't really matching the vibe

[pulsar pendant]

i guess we are space therapists

but like 90% of the original alive frames are gone so

[twin wigeon]

Empathy™

[wooden cave]

talking with flare finally
is it better to confront them about what their issue at hand is or to keep the convo normal?

[worn cypress]

@humble sierra@stiff fable@pulsar pendant
oh shit we are cooked
so it is a universal threat and an entity

looks like the void is muuuch bigger and more important in warframe universe

[pulsar pendant]

yep

very very important

[worn cypress]

why cant he be killed ?
( is there a answer withot a spoil ? )

[humble sierra]

We're just built different

Though there could be a spoiler answer too...

[twin wigeon]

Think of the void as a dimension, thinly protected by a membrane that is currently pierced and plugged up by the zariman, which seems to be a layering of countless unrealized possibilities