lore-discussion

[strange plinth]

the anti-fashion frame, his brutalist concrete aesthetic cannot be hidden

[fast dew]

Ykwhat fair, theres a reason I play for the lore and not the gameplay

[rotund trellis]

But I got it. Thank you guys, now I understand much better how the lore is progressing.

[fast dew]

Its so delightfully jarring compared to how Albrecht usually designs shit

Like where did the obols go? Where's the unnecessary design choices that make the chair he designed horrible?

Mm. There's a bit of that one actually

[strange plinth]

fr what's the lore reason that the chair is atrocious

[fast dew]

He just sucks at chair design 😭 i can see the vision but

I feel like it would break?

If he designed his labs, its impressive how badly he messed up that chair compared to his labs

Albrecht's labs are genuinely so pretty

[tall echo]

I think the fact that the concrete slabs "breathe" counts

as unnecessary design choice that makes it horrible

[humble sierra]

Arbiters finally have lore

[strange turtle]

Wha

[fast dew]

Nah, high chances the breathing is required. Think like how control rods aren't always in the reactor, he still needs to keep that energy going

[tall echo]

ok but unlike those the concrete is literally sealing the entire core of qorvex

he's just farting out radiation in regular intervals

[fast dew]

Yeah thats normal

Or he underproduces

So, let some go

And control rods do kinda seal the other fuel rods, from memory

[calm kettle]

How to get harrow chasis blueprint?

[tall echo]

[tall echo]

fissure enemies drop it

[signal minnow]

Can anyone really be trusted as a narrator in Warframe's universe? I've made it all the way up to the Old Peace and it seems like more and more, nobody can really be trusted to give an unbiased retelling of events. Only characters' colored views making a patchwork tapestry of events that might be the truth. || Do we even know if the Operator's memories in the Dark Refractory are accurate? ||

[swift sentinel]

The Dark Refactory would be meaningless if it was fake, especially since there's no hints or clues that the memories are unreliable.

[south sun]

It's basically shrodingers cat.

There's nothing really cementing it all one way or the other.
The overall events would be correct, but the smaller details, the more personal details, are what can be vague.

[swift sentinel]

It is the Operator's memory of events as well, so POV is what should be considered. The *what *is probably correct, they why is where there's ambiguity.

[strange plinth]

good example is the elder queen's dialogue during war within
the general stuff she says is correct, but she'll sneer and mock you during the stuff she's twisting

[humble sierra]

Dark Factory is 80% accurate— there's a section in the quest where Excalibur Prime wields the Vinquibus, and that's a result of memories overlapping (after we get that brief glimpse of Uriel's rampage).

The Recall missions are also likely accurate besides the final battles— we likely only do them once, and it's very unlikely we fought them in an enclosed canyon thingy where we see the astrolabe in the sky

[south sun]

Even just the way characters can be perceived.
I've met enough people in life that remember the exact same event in different ways simply because of their emotions.

One telling had a person angry, the other telling was the person did nothing.

So then to apply that all to a literal child?

[strange plinth]

a profoundly traumatized child, at that

[swift sentinel]

A benign example would be Valdur at the end of the quest. Was he actually as sad and apologetic as we remember? Maybe not, but we remember him that way regardless.

[fast dew]

The memories should be accurate, but only if there's no outside influence. Remember, this machine was made by Albrecht, he's the type of person to freak out over anything that doesn't align correctly [in ways that could mean wally], so id reckon it would be pretty accurate

He's still mildly freaking out about if he's wally or not

[strange plinth]

even without albrecht being meticulous, the orokin cared for memories a lot, so if they can be messed up that easily, that'd make the refractory less valuable

[fast dew]

Mm, its probably Aya related, the dark refractory

[south sun]

The machine also did have glitches and was pushed harder than it should have.

[fast dew]

We still don't know why Albrecht made it, or if he made it for us explicitly

[south sun]

And was left sitting prior to that for who knows how long.

[fast dew]

But. Loid seemed well versed in the operation of the machine, so id wager its not the first time Loid has used it

[south sun]

That is assuming a lot

He can know how it works while not knowing the exact state of it.

[fast dew]

Id honestly blame any real glitches from Wally's presence tbh

[south sun]

It really will just end up with how DE wants to use it.
It's a plot thread that could literally go in any direction.

[fast dew]

Dude he probably helped build it, he absolutely knows if its broken or not 😭

[south sun]

They gave enough openness to not be glued to any one specific path.

[fast dew]

Ehh. The reason behind the dark refractory isnt an important thing but its a very closed thread

It can go basically two ways

Albrecht needed it for himself, or he knew we'd need it

Secret third thing is that its both

[south sun]

I think that's more your biases showing on what you prefer with it.

All I'm saying is that there are enough vagueness tied to it (same with other parts of the game's story) so DE aren't locked in at all.

They can literally put a thing out next that has the events contradicted and it would be equally valid.

Reality is: none of us know.

[fast dew]

huh

What biases its literally the only two reasons that it could possibly exist for

[strange plinth]

if it were not in the labs, i'd say the origin is more open

[south sun]

You want the machine to be undamaged and not prone to errors.
So then it has to be that way.

[fast dew]

Albrecht needed it, or he knew that we needed it, that. Seems to be the only two logical steps?

[fast dew]

Why would it be damaged, for one, and why would Loid purposefully risk the operator if it was damaged? If something isnt right Loid would know.

And again, only real times it gets weird is when wally is messing around with shit

[south sun]

You are putting A LOT of assumption on Loid though, drawing your own inferences & conclusions.

Just best to be more open with it.

If it happens one way, then so be it, if it's the other, then cool too.

[strange plinth]

tbf it doesn't seem damaged from what we can see of it during the quest and in the room after
obv damage doesn't have to be visible, but it'd be weird for it to not be brought up at all if it were

[fast dew]

Except. Loid knows the machine.

[south sun]

I don't mind either way, both paths are interesting to explore.

[restive lantern]

This is actually rather interesting to consider

[fast dew]

Yeah, exactly. If loid thought that weird shit happening wasn't normal he'd let us know. Ie murmur coming in to get our asses

[south sun]

Everything was rushed and pushed harder. Loid was saying it should be ended.

Everyone else wanted things now.

[fast dew]

Yes, but its not because of the faults with a machine

Its because of the nature of the machine itself

"It places a murderous burden on the user" is the quote, i believe

[south sun]

And so the machine can't have issues when pushed harder than it was supposed to... because....?

[fast dew]

Its not the machine thats being pushed, its us?

[lilac aspen]

Clearly the only truthful person is Alad V

Alad V NEVER lies to us

[humble sierra]

These were traumatizing memories

[restive lantern]

I have often considered how we are a unreliable narrator seeming how memories seems like they are more malleable than we assume

[fast dew]

Loid even says we can do it again, he just didnt want us to go through shit again. Which. Respectable

[south sun]

And you know that... how?

If you're increasing the voltage on your GPU to push it harder to overclock, it can work, til the thing fries.

[humble sierra]

The 'L' in Alad V stands for liar.

Wait no sorry I mean

The 'F' in Alad V stands for Fibber

[fast dew]

Yeah or till it stops itself from frying? Most computers will have automatic shut-downs if something is that drastically wrong.

And again, there is no indication its the dark refractory thats being pushed

Everything else says its us, and the stress on our mind

[south sun]

You are assuming again way too much and locked into this.

[fast dew]

You aren't acknowledging the 2 times we're told its putting strain on us, not the machine.

[south sun]

It's a story for one, and again: one that has enough openness to go either way.

Don't be too locked into one specific path because you want it so.

[humble sierra]

I mean the technology clearly has the ability to be messy, as seen in the bit where Excal gets the Vinquibus

[fast dew]

You're doing the exact same thing?

You dont want to see that the machine probably isnt being stressed

[signal minnow]

But about memories specifically. The people who we get exposition from are either undergoing some form of trauma or have gone through trauma. Trauma distorts the memory most often, and considering the insane happenings of Warframe, the events you do hear about are almost never the full picture.

[fast dew]

We are told that its us, both by Loid

[south sun]

I keep saying that both options are interesting to explore and I'm not tied to any one specific path.

[fast dew]

If Loid thought the machine was being stressed, then he'd also say that i feel

[south sun]

I'm saying to keep an open-mind about both sides of the coin.

[fast dew]

I just cannot see it your side? It. Is pretty obvious that its not really that open

[humble sierra]

I don't think the Refractory is capable of being stressed, but the memories do get messed up if the machine isn't being used right

[south sun]

And there has also been a rising note of how traumatized "the kid" is in a good chunk of Drifter KIM stuff

[humble sierra]

Which seems to be on the user-end rather than the refractory

[fast dew]

It would feel mildly insulting if DE went "ignore what we said previously, its actually the machine and the man who knows how to use it is wrong"

[fast dew]

I wouldn't say trauma changes memories, rather that it makes it harder to recall them, and folk may try to fill in gaps that should not be filled by something

[restive lantern]

Not to mention the literal distortions and lotus just casually editing our memories over and over 😭

[fast dew]

But again, the nature of the dark refractory doesn't seem to hold that bias, along with the fact that we couldn't even get to those memories, not from trauma, but from Margulis

Though id imagine the trauma still makes it hard to recall once you unlock them

[strange plinth]

when one POV could be inaccurate, you look for other sources on the same thing, find the common ground
as an example, there's a ton of information about the zariman
the ember prime codex calls it a military ship, but everything else calls it a colony ship. elder queen says the children enjoyed killing their parents, but other dialogue makes it pretty clear that they were forced to
we know there are pieces of the old peace that are accurate, as they are mentioned by roathe, or caliban prime's stuff, but some of it is still left 'in the air'

[strange plinth]

lotus never edited our memories, tmk?
margulis did, twice, but lotus didn't

[humble sierra]

Here she's just decoding them

[south sun]

It'll be interesting when the academy / tau can actually be visited, and seeing how it really ended up.

[fast dew]

Yeah it was just Margulis and maybe wally

[humble sierra]

Undoing the Dream

[humble sierra]

https://giphy.com/gifs/movie-sci-fi-planet-of-the-apes-cwKEyFg7TY0o0

[fast dew]

Wally is present and is trying to mess around with our memories, the lotus has a line about recovering them from him

But its unsure what that actually. Means

[strange plinth]

margulis made us forget the zariman (TSD/TWW), and then she made us forget the war when she put us fully into the second dream (TOP)
-# how many quests in this game start with "the"

[fast dew]

Wally stole memories is easy but like. How? We probably can guess the why tho

Smthn smthn connection and keeping that away from children

Good lord I still cannot get over wally defenders

[restive lantern]

For what it's worth I think the possibility makes a lot of sense that there would be issues possibly. Especially since loid was asleep until just now and there's a huge hole in the room 😭 I don't think ole Albert was the master planner folks assume him to be. But yeah i can see it being a possibility

[fast dew]

Nothing infuriates me more than to see someone try to go "he tortured that autistic boy for over a thousand years because hes a victim :((("

[south sun]

Yep.
Too many assumptions made on these people, their machines, and the process of it being infallible.

[humble sierra]

The Refractory also has a lot of room for interpretation, as seen in Descendia.

Unless Roathe really just went to hell some time ago

[fast dew]

Which is mainly from the. What, 3 other outside influences?

Us, Marie and Lyon

[south sun]

I know people get all worked up over Ballas in here (almost to an unhealthy degree), but it would be interesting if the events we see in the Academy weren't really how it happened.

Major events? Sure.

[strange plinth]

-# The Teacher, The Archwing, The Second Dream, The War Within, The Sacrifice, The New War, The Duviri Paradox, The Lotus Eaters, The Hex, The Old Peace, The Deadlock Protocol, The New Strange, The Glast Gambit, The Silver Grove, The Waverider, The Limbo Theorem, The Jordas Precept
17?

[south sun]

But the personal ones? Could be different, especially with context the player wouldn't have any way of knowing.

[fast dew]

Just you wait, there's gonna be another quest this year with another one!

Probably. Tau or some shit

[humble sierra]

The Tau

[ocean geyser]

People defend bro??

[humble sierra]

He's just a little guy who got tortured by Albrecht and the Orokin

[fast dew]

Yeah its. Infuriating. They always use the "oh he was a child/oh he got hurt by Albrecht" excuse

[ocean geyser]

How have i never heard of this 💀

[fast dew]

They also always get it wrong when it comes to who duplicated the fingers

[humble sierra]

He just wanted a handshake! Ignore that time he traumatized a group of children by making their parents insane and actively try killing them

[strange plinth]

all he did was indirectly force us to kill our parents, its nbd
ignore the murmur actively trying to kill us Right Now
/s

[fast dew]

Ignore that he regularly uses predatory tactics to isolate and alienate children from their connections

[ocean geyser]

Elder Queen prolly just said that to be a forehead tbh

[restive lantern]

That's the thing, people can be manipulating the facts to us

[fast dew]

It wasn't Albrecht who made most of the reliquary drives. We all know the man cannot resist putting obols all over shit [like the zariman one] it is widely blamed as just the orokin

[ocean geyser]

Not even just us, everyone
The Wall thinks people having positive connections is stinky unfortunately

[strange plinth]

absolutely, she wants us to feel horrible about it, so she can worm her way in farther
but she tells half-truths during that section, and sneers and mocks when she's lying

[ocean geyser]

Doesn’t he laugh when you break up with a protoframe

[fast dew]

He does, but he does it in an way that attack childhood things [ie Lyon and neci and their childhood memories being attacked by wally]

[humble sierra]

I haven't noticed that

Unless it's something with the Triad

[fast dew]

When its not a child, he'd attack the childhood memories

[humble sierra]

I've yet to break up with anyone there yet

gonna wait to have all of Lyon's date scenes first

[restive lantern]

Okay that's kinda funny tho if true LMFAO like just how silly and immature that is

[ocean geyser]

He’s simultaneously the worst being ever and the biggest troll in history

Didn’t this mf show up as a wall because the Lotus didn’t believe he existed

(Not to mention the various players who didn’t think he existed)

[fast dew]

Wally likes to force wedges between people for the explicit purpose to manipulate vulnerable people

[strange plinth]

wha

[fast dew]

People once thought that warframes couldnt possibly be human once

[ocean geyser]

Oh man i gotta show you this wiki comment

[fast dew]

Wiki strikes again

[ocean geyser]

Live Helminth Reaction

[fast dew]

Coming up here with impressively dumb takes lets go

[strange plinth]

not believing due to only chains of harrow, sure? i guess?
but his pop-ups after? and the guaranteed one after The Sacrifice?

[fast dew]

I should put in trivia on Albrecht's or Loid's page that they're not father and son

[ocean geyser]

Found it

[ocean geyser]

Yeah that’s what i meant

Although to be fair

Some people think the operator clone is rell

For
Some reason

[fast dew]

Its still pretty impressive to

WHAT.

[ocean geyser]

Hopefully the Large Guy in Wall fixed that

[strange plinth]

i'd hope so lol

[fast dew]

Man I didnt think it would be that bad

[ocean geyser]

People had drawn very strange conclusions up until New War

The conclusions are still strange, but still

[fast dew]

They still do
-# once again, people thought Albrecht and Loid were father and son

[ocean geyser]

😭 ??

[fast dew]

A new one i did see was that Loid was a clone of Albrecht

Which. Takes some mental gymnastics

[ocean geyser]

Well that’s some interesting mental gymnastics at the very least though

[fast dew]

Ive never favoured the loid is a clone theory at all but christ

Nor loid used kuva theory

Neither hold any weight outside "Loid old"

[ocean geyser]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/786650808321048596/1454868666444288182/image0.jpg?ex=69a31308&is=69a1c188&hm=f717116391baa1782906165294418b0358019b4d18dc85349229fb00c35cfc39&

[fast dew]

Which can be explained away by

Darvo being over 100 and still looking normal

[ocean geyser]

Posting this again though
It’s just too funny

[fast dew]

Teshin not getting cryo sleep and still looking normal

[ocean geyser]

Teshin just built different though

[fast dew]

Putting this in the orokin archives discord rq

[ocean geyser]

Being a Dax probably helps

[fast dew]

So is loid! Everyone should have a healthy fear of Loid

[ocean geyser]

Yeah i saw that man bullet jump

[fast dew]

Just looking back at the intro cutscene is.

[ocean geyser]

Gotta wonder when he beat up the Corpus that Parvos sent

[fast dew]

Damn man no wonder Albrecht was pathetic around him

[fast dew]

He didnt just beat them up, he probably killed them dude 😭

[ocean geyser]

Yeah im just simplifying it for the funny

[fast dew]

Corpus dont stop at broken legs

[ocean geyser]

But like
When’d he do tha

[fast dew]

Mm, whenever parvos made ballas make protea

[ocean geyser]

I see
Probably before the uh
Belric and Rania moment

Then
Cause sending a crew down there in post- Grey Strain Deimos would have been some goofy shit 💀

Getting past the Infested is one thing, and breaking into the Entrati’s basement is another

[fast dew]

He's just. Silly like that

[ocean geyser]

People can hardly handle the first one and you expect people to do both??? 😭

Something something desire i guess

[fast dew]

The poor corpus has probably never seen a necramech before

[ocean geyser]

And if they ever did it’d have to be Voidrig and Bonewidow
Imagine them getting swarmed by the ones on the labs

[fast dew]

"Its just some scientist and his butler!"

The humble voiding/bonewidow

[ocean geyser]

Random crewman watching his team get atomized by Guard Mode:

https://tenor.com/view/worried-scared-oh-no-stop-it-fearful-gif-12534009

https://tenor.com/view/on-fire-pizza-gif-6074641

Maybe this one actually

Man
The more I think about it
The Labs are basically just the Backrooms to the average person

Endless sprawls of liminal space hallways filled with errant machines and otherworldly creatures?

GODDD I WANNA WRITE SOMETHING ON THIS NOWWW

DE can i get lore fragments of the Corpus getting lost in the Labs

[fast dew]

Roathe does comment on how large it is

Albrecht himself got lost a lot

[fast dew]

Albrecht sending out a feral Loid to deal with tbe stragglers

[ocean geyser]

heheh

gang his own cryptid atp

gay man with the zylok prime that bullet jumps

Eximus beware

[fast dew]

What's worse. Gay man with a Zylok prime that bullet jumps or gay man with a lex prime that teleports?

[signal minnow]

Does the gay man teleport or does the Lex Prime teleport?

[fast dew]

Gay man teleports, but you're right thats some bad phrasing on my part

[signal minnow]

Oh no you're fine. Though now I must admit, the mental image of a randomly teleporting lex prime throughout the warframe universe is humorous to me.

[fast dew]

I wonder how either Albrecht and Loid would feel if they knew what we were calling them

[signal minnow]

Per your original question, I would side with the Zylok Prime.

[fast dew]

It's how Albrecht teleports, clearly smh

[fast dew]

Fair fair, lex prime does beat incarnoff zylok prime, but if this is either man's gun, its cracked no matter what

[signal minnow]

It is cracked as are the people it shoots

[fast dew]

Albrecht's mind is a little cracked, yeah

[signal minnow]

I giggled

[fast dew]

The word cracked is. Funny

[ocean geyser]

it is
original meaning was funnier tho

[fast dew]

Can you imagine how hard Albrecht hit his head when he fell into the void

[glass sluice]

i wonder if he was climbing up on his toilet at the time.

I guess that's more time than void, but still works.

[waxen mesa]

does this mean that, to those outside the void, the zariman incident was only a few days old when it reappeared?

[fast dew]

I can see it being that way yeah

[strange plinth]

there's another place that says it had been years iirc, not quite sure where though

lotus claims it had been lost for years during TSD
possible retcon or just the usual weird stuff around the ember prime codex

[fast dew]

Nodding nodding

[fast dew]

Yeah like that entry calling it a. Combat ship?

[strange plinth]

yeah its called a military ship in that codex
which is more easily explained via the orokin doing a cover-up on the zariman (which also seems super weird given later context) compared to days vs years

[fast dew]

Yeah this whole

Thing seems muddy

How old is that ember lore?

[strange plinth]

very afaik, one of the first mentions of the zariman

[fast dew]

Oh so it could just be a writing mistake cus old ass lore

[strange plinth]

oh yeah, added in 2014 lol

[fast dew]

woof. That's old as shit 😭

[restive river]

issue is I do believe it can't have been days since
the war started
the frames were made and retired
so unless they put those kids in cryosleep asap, I don't think this is true anymore

[waxen mesa]

Dunk the kids into the pods

[humble sierra]

Watch it be revealed that the Old War lasted a month, the Orokin are very impatient despite their immortality

[strange plinth]

they were impatient with the sentients going to tau
or at least enough of them were to get the zariman project started

[fast dew]

Mm, not enough for them. Its never enough for the orokin I feel

[restive river]

LMAO

[restive river]

It sounded like it was mostly Tuvul and his inner circle iirc

[fast dew]

It probably was him pushing for it, but i don't imagine the other members of the 7 had no say in it.

[sly pagoda]

I did realize something scary, if the Techrot broke from Hollvania and somehow got across the Atlantic, there is a non zero chance of that causing. Techrot Canadian Geese.

[glass sluice]

I mean, remove the "if" part. They do get out.

Although I was always curious about the timeline, there's an unknown but surely sizable gap between 1999 and the Orokin.

[strange plinth]

10000 years according to the hex prequel comic

[glass sluice]

I'm going to take any specific amount of time as non-locked in canon, feels like it'll cause issues somewhere down the line.

[strange plinth]

pretty much how i treat it
an estimate at best

[sly pagoda]

I think its a lot more than 10k years, but which comic estimated that?

[glass sluice]

I could maybe see 10k years being the time that the Tenno were in cryo for, but even that feels iffy to lock in.

but 10k for the entirety of the empire to rise and fall feels.....I mean evolution of animals alone.

[strange plinth]

we have 1k as a slightly more concrete estimate for the tenno cryo
varzia dialogue + jade's memory feathers both use 1k years

[glass sluice]

I'm going to assume that nothing is canon unless it's specifically stated in a main question, as far as a direct timeline goes.
And I'd bet my Orbiter that they will never give us a full timeline, it locks off too much.

for the record: i dont want a full timeline.

[strange plinth]

page 20 of this comic

[glass sluice]

It's worth noting that the use of "a thousand years" as a timescale, is often meant to mean a sort of "great amount of time", not literally 1k.

sort of "40 days and nights" kinda vibes.

[fast dew]

The "Albrecht is a bastard who made like the British and stabbed Arthur" comic

[strange plinth]

mhm
the timescale for jade (very) roughly lines up, but varzia's dialogue is a lot more loose

[fast dew]

Look at him... run? Shmoove away

[glass sluice]

🖐️ so sassy 🖐️

[restive lantern]

I feel as if people assume there are many absolutes in this game but quite literally most things feel nuanced and malleable on nearly every front lol

[fast dew]

He is, ive been told it might be a jojos reference but I know legit nothing on the topic

[sly pagoda]

of course its not impossible that 10k years was changes on Earth that lead to the eventual rise of the Orokin. We know the empire stood for an extremely long time

[glass sluice]

The last time I watched an anime was a video cassette of voltron.

[fast dew]

HA real

I don't. Particularly watch anime, but I do have a collection of monty python VHS at my sister's house

[glass sluice]

Whilst I'm here, I might as well tinfoil hat, and say that since reb said in the 193 devstream that Shadographer is going to require Chains of Harrow to be done, that it's in some way related, and not just because it's a mechanic based thing that makes sense for progression.

[fast dew]

Mm, thats what had me worried yeah

[glass sluice]

oh i love the big red book!

[fast dew]

From the small gameplay we did see it does appear to be largely unrelated?

[lean garden]

I think using evolution isnt the right move for guesstimating the speed of development.

you'd be better served looking at the speed of development for humanity

[glass sluice]

i had the "and now for something completely different" movie, that explains a lot about why im so weird, i feel.

[lean garden]

except for that one line about feelings and faces

[strange plinth]

i genuinely think its to preserve chains as the 'wth this is a horror game now???' quest

[sly pagoda]

I am sure advancement was fairly fast under the empire just because they have no moral compass.

[glass sluice]

I'll be honest, the sheer amount of people that don't realise follie was a horror quest frame before the reveal kinda boggled my mind.
her name can be translated to madness!

[sly pagoda]

I mean I did not know that, Figured she was just a painting themed frame

[restive lantern]

There is do definite timeline for "human progression" tho

[lean garden]

the strongest estimate of how development is going to go is speed.

speed of transportation
speed of production
speed of information transfer

[glass sluice]

entire species existing from seemingly unrelated animals has to factor in some how. dogs dont lay eggs, ya know.

[lean garden]

but thats a whole different shebang

[glass sluice]

that is literally what i said lol

"the animals alone"

[lean garden]

I am so deeply confused why you slid that in the end of your sentence then

[glass sluice]

of course its not the sole measurement, but it is worth factoring it in with regards to timescale

[strange plinth]

the kubrows were genemodded weren't they? or am i completely making that up

[glass sluice]

i just assume someone is going to read the entire reply before they respond to it

i need to start putting subway surfers in my posts

[lean garden]

alot of the animals are in the orokin empire iirc, you should be able to find it in the kims

[fast dew]

see, i really love their rendition of wind in the willows, i did read the revised version of the book as a kid so any rendition of it holds a special place in my heart

[lean garden]

Ah see whats happening, youre thinking that the creatures in origin naturally developed

[glass sluice]

honestly, ill watch anything with them in it.
oh its almost certainly unrelated to harrow and stuff, but i can kinda see how it might be linked up, maybe follie was another abandoned kid, the orokin seemed to like to do that

[fast dew]

Euleria commissioned the Duviri kubrows! To exist irl somehpw!

[fast dew]

yeah honestly, she seems to be super childlike, as if she doesnt. know? what shes actually doing [ie crying when we die]

[glass sluice]

with the name being what it is, and her whole vibe, i do get "traumatised child whos basically comatose" feels from her.

not in the way the other tenno were, but something deeper

[fast dew]

Something closer to a child being fused maybe? An still sleeping Tenno?

I am reluctant to say she was physically a child turned warframe, DE does like to avoid that

[glass sluice]

ooh nice, yeah i had a brief thought that the end is us waking her operator up

maybe the frame herself is a parent

[blissful merlin]

Plus us carrying the ink requiring us to enter operator mode strictly is interesting to me

[strange plinth]

true, what's up with that

[fast dew]

Last example of a warframe being confirmed to be a child is like. Yareli? And Nokko is probably designed to be one as well, though I am unsure if that's implied in the lore

[glass sluice]

is there some form of mental disability that is helped by drawing or art in some way? im new to all this stuff.

[fast dew]

Theres a few

Extreme cases of Autism, level 3 and stuff

[lean garden]

maybe its why CoH is needed

[fast dew]

Rell is like that, needing to express his emotions with cards

[sly pagoda]

at the Hollvania zoo you can find an enclosure with something that resembles Bird3 on the sign.

[fast dew]

Yes! And Tagfer, a gorilla and a Rhino. They translate to Tagfer, Wuk, gorilla and. Rhino

[restive lantern]

Yes there's a couple , art therapy is often used for children as well

[lean garden]

I checked for the kavats, drifter says they evolved from cats, still looking for kubrows.

I vaguely recall a line about the orokin needing to reengineer species that died

[glass sluice]

well that's it then as far as I'm aware
do we know who the voice on the tape is yet?

[fast dew]

Mm, no not yet

[lean garden]

have you not seen the resilience of birds

[strange plinth]

if it was solely for the mechanic, it'd be locked behind TWW, no?
seems odd to wait for another quest if its just mechanics
ig CoH requires more operator gameplay tho

[glass sluice]

id bet 5p that it was her caretaker, or at least the operators.

[fast dew]

And its really strange. Warframes cannot speak. They don't have mouths.

[lean garden]

not mechanic wise, but uuuh lore wise

[fast dew]

Im not even sure how they scream, though I can see other organs being made for it

[lean garden]

just scream with your mouth closed ezpz

[fast dew]

Loid has a line about it

[glass sluice]

I always imagined that it was the inftested inside making the screaming noise
e.g. saryn/valk/whoever

[fast dew]

Loid my fella where are you

[glass sluice]

side note: seeing that saryn recording session about making her noises looked genuinely unsettling

[fast dew]

"Warframes cannot speak, as a rule. Their creator decided they should only scream, or roar, or howl."

[strange plinth]

ballas would do that

[fast dew]

In other news

THEY CHANGED LOID'S PHOTO

[blissful merlin]

Reminds me of this jade feather lore bit:

The Executor smirked down at me. "What is a life but a mass of unfulfilled potential? Just like the life that would have grown within you. But you chose to spite Us. And for that sin, you will mother only ashes and oblivion. Jade."

I screamed defiance in his face, but my voice was razors and steel.

[fast dew]

Mm, yeah. Ballas was extremely sadistic towards Jade. No clue why

[sly pagoda]

I suspect they have some speaker unit that the Tenno communicates with regular people through.

[fast dew]

Like yeah he's a bastard but

[sly pagoda]

Ballas is gunna Ballas.

[fast dew]

That was so wildly out of left field at the time

[sly pagoda]

there is a reason he is so hatable.

[glass sluice]

I assumed it was because he never got to have that with his ....I dont wanna say lover, she was more like a victim.

[naive rune]

that's just Ballas being the worst, as usual

[fast dew]

He was somewhat normal before Margulis, and. I don't know if Jade was before then but

[blissful merlin]

“How dare you bear a child!!! Helminth injections for you all!”

[glass sluice]

i speak from experience here: people can be really good at hiding the evil.

[blissful merlin]

Attack on Titan vibes lmao

[fast dew]

They did, unfortunately, love each other. Much like most narcissistic abusers, they tend to hide their worst traits at the start

[sly pagoda]

I suspect the type of guardians that Jade and Soren were are supposed to be totally celebate I think is the term, Probably in honor of the golden lords or some egotistical BS.

[glass sluice]

oh been there, yeah

I personally don't see what he had as love, even if he himself thought it was.

[fast dew]

Yeah, its. Pretty shitty. And then they do the whole. Normal>suddenly really shitty>normal loop again and again

[fast dew]

I see what Roathe says about it as huge projection.

"Ballas must've loved Margulis. If he loved Margulis and treated her like that, it means Niktoh and how she treated me means she loves me!"

Sorta projection

[naive rune]

https://tenor.com/view/rhea-ripley-projection-that-all-just-seems-like-projection-to-me-wwe-wrestling-gif-7548813325014235771

[fast dew]

RHEA

[glass sluice]

the orokin really were all just a doctor phil special waiting to happen, I kinda feel a little satisfaction knowing that if the tenno didn't turn them into smoothies, they would've done it to themselves after long enough.

[fast dew]

She's Australian and shes super cool

[glass sluice]

wait, how haven't I heard that, she's from here?

[fast dew]

Yeah im like. 89% sure

I think Adelaide?

Or maybe just south Australia in general

[glass sluice]

holy cow she's an adeladian

[naive rune]

you'll forgive me if I have no idea who that is (I thought the gif looked neat^^)

[glass sluice]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhea_Ripley

[fast dew]

Shes a. Wrestler? For the WWE, she's like. Super cool and a lot of lesbians love her

Havent met a single one who doesn't

[glass sluice]

well youve just found another one lol

[sly pagoda]

I mean Roathe even hints there was plans by his boss and bone to overthrow things.

[glass sluice]

i can see why though, she just has THAT vibe

[fast dew]

Yeah which is really funny cus he claims he loves Niktoh, and then gripes about how Albrecht never cares about people who he's supposed to love

[naive rune]

she looks like a fun person

[fast dew]

Brother you are doing the exact same thing you claimed he did

Except, Roathe's talking about the wife Albrecht was forced to marry

[glass sluice]

oh no she likes ice nine kills.
ive fallen into a rabbit hole halp

[naive rune]

Who? The sexy lesbian wrestler?

[fast dew]

Unfortunately she does have a husband

And that made me. So sad

[naive rune]

beard 😉

(I have no idea what she likes)

[fast dew]

I. Think he might?

[glass sluice]

nah shes straight, its a lesbian thing to fall for straight women

[naive rune]

(nor will I spread rumours)

[fast dew]

Yeah when i was a girl the whole. First girl crush being straight deal was so sad 😭

[naive rune]

unrequited love, classic

[fast dew]

I knew I was queer since I was like. 10? Wasn't exposed to literally anything

But i decided I liked women

And that was that

[naive rune]

I totally get it^^

[glass sluice]

i only came out a few years ago, but it was so obvious that im annoyed i took so long

[fast dew]

Yeah sometimes the closet is glass

[restive lantern]

That's genuinely shocking

[blissful merlin]

I remember being like 5 years old and seeing the wiggles on tv. I was attracted to the yellow shirt wiggle guy but obviously had no clue what those feelings meant. Now I do. I was crushing hard back then lol

[fast dew]

But, you'd need to be outside the closet to realise

[fast dew]

REAL

[glass sluice]

i get told that a lot, but it was sure shocking to the family. unfortunately.
okay enough of my trauma dumping.

[naive rune]

armoured glass that need endless strikes from the sledgehammer to break through

[blissful merlin]

Like it’s crazy I knew my type way back when lmaooooo

[fast dew]

My sister, the woman who raised me just. Was happy I wouldn't get pregnant she is. A complex woman but I do love her

[glass sluice]

your first crush being Greg from the Wiggles is so amazingly wholesome and adorable that I genuinely can't even.

[restive lantern]

You are like classic dad-joke spouting lesbian vibes, I thought you were a lesbian before I realized your pfp was literally the lesbian flag LMFAO @glass sluice /affectionate

[glass sluice]

actually funnily enough, this pfp was given to me by a mod friend from another big server im in, it was the first thing i got froom someone when i came out and it holds a special place for me.

[fast dew]

On the topic of sexuality, I like to believe Albrecht is literally the most possible form of Aro/ace ever. He embodies that flag until it comes to Loid. Does this stem from my inability to imagine this man being any form of relationship outside Loid? Probably

[restive lantern]

That's so adorable 😭💙

[fast dew]

Like i know he probably had to have done it at least once, but for some inexplicable reason i genuinely cannot see him doing it

Like im 99% sure Euleria was a damn tube baby at this point

[smoky gulch]

Regarding Transference: in Duviri Paradox we can see Drifter moving Warframe while his body is physically present - does this mean Drifter could hug a Protoframe and use Transference for both sides to feel the embrace from both sides?

[restive lantern]

Genuinely probably could do that with anyframe

[fast dew]

Mm, from memory thats just partial transference? Probably but I wouldn't hold anything to it

[glass sluice]

ya know you have been single for too long when your lore question is "how can i hug myself"

[blissful merlin]

Greg was the man and still is the man I need in my life lmao.

[glass sluice]

poor guy

greg, not you lol

[fast dew]

I feel, if we asked Loid really nicely, he'd probably hug us as drifter

[blissful merlin]

Lmaoooo

[fast dew]

He'd be a lot more willing to hug the operator i feel

[smoky gulch]

I was thinking of Protoframes explicitly coz you can date them - imagine how enjoyable it would be to hug and be hugged and feel both bodies at once

[lean garden]

was greg one of the originals or one of the new ones

[fast dew]

Mm, original I believe.

[glass sluice]

i think Eleanor actually talks about that, or similar.
I have a distinct memory of a relationship convo

[fast dew]

Or the second one?

[smoky gulch]

Other uses of this concept... Are fade to black territory

[glass sluice]

Greg was one of the OG 4.

[fast dew]

Yeah. Sick

[glass sluice]

Greg Page, to be specific.

[restive lantern]

He's like the wiggle, the og yellow one who was the leader

[glass sluice]

yeah he is/was. 🙁

[fast dew]

Anthony is good looking for his age tbh

[lean garden]

ah, then I could have seen them live if it werent for one of them falling sick and cancelling the concert

[fast dew]

Thats. His name yeah? Been years since I ever touched the wiggles

[glass sluice]

that'd be greg, he was ill for a long time, on and off

[blissful merlin]

My poor guy….

[lean garden]

should work, you already could engage transference by making direct contact with the frame

[naive rune]

it also gives the insult "go fornicate yourself" a different meaning^^

[glass sluice]

my bogan claim to fame as a kid was that i met the Hoolie Doolies.

[restive lantern]

Yes that was Greg, he unfortunately has chronic illness

[fast dew]

HELL YEAH

Thats mucking sick as hell

I think. At drama camp, way back when, I met like

Someone from home and away???

His face was super familiar

[glass sluice]

i have 0 memory of this because i was too young, but there's a photo somewhere in a box with an aunt or something of me and them.

[smoky gulch]

A selfcest by other means

[fast dew]

Yk ive had. Some interesting teachers in my life

I knew a damn clown

[naive rune]

I am bit ashamed to know what that is^^

[lean garden]

for some reason my brain autocorrected drama to drampa for some reason, so congrats you are a pokemon

[fast dew]

Dont be, most people on the internet chronically enough would

[naive rune]

now I got to catch you

[glass sluice]

im just now picturing myself as a pokemon, and the "whos that pokemon" plays, and then nothing cause no talky
just awkwardly staring at the camera.

[fast dew]

Erm excuse me but I am a treecko

[naive rune]

https://tenor.com/view/squirrel-listening-intensity-chew-eating-gif-12305883

like so?

[fast dew]

We need more Treecko content

[glass sluice]

more like.....wait lemme find it

[fast dew]

I loved OR/AS as a kid, shit was fire

[glass sluice]

https://tenor.com/view/br4uh-gif-24710037

[lean garden]

no,

you are now

BROWT

[restive lantern]

Actually on the topic of proto frames, during a conversation with Quincy they discuss using transference to take him out of the city but they don't know how long it would last

[naive rune]

https://tenor.com/view/elmo-door-hi-gif-24431255

[fast dew]

This is scary to me for so many reasons

[restive lantern]

And like if it did couldn't our tenno just evacuate them all

[fast dew]

Hit too close to home Bau

[glass sluice]

i had that exact one today! he comparedit to being on a dog leash lol

[lean garden]

should be out 1999 not just hollvania.

with how mobile warframes move they can easily scale over any walls keeping anyone in or out the city

[naive rune]

https://tenor.com/view/dog-leash-chase-come-here-wait-gif-15238098

[restive lantern]

How do YOU know that Quincy, quickly LMFAO

[naive rune]

but who is really leached? 😉

[fast dew]

Good lord that kid is gonna get salt water in their face 😭

[smoky gulch]

Yeah, try to stop pixie-size Titania from going where she pleases

[fast dew]

Nasty experience, from memory

Glad I don't live anywhere close to the ocean.

[naive rune]

nobody can keep Titania down^^

[glass sluice]

i told him to bugger off, so im going to go with eleanor when she feels his anger later lol

[restive lantern]

Yeah, I wonder why they can't just technically leave lol

[glass sluice]

oh no, not the thanos joke again

[lean garden]

because they wanna make the loop stay right

kaya leaves all the time

she comes back anyway

[smoky gulch]

I know that for a fact: here she ignored floor of transition to Cetus

[restive lantern]

I am literally flirting with everyone bc I can't decide still 😭😭😭

[smoky gulch]

Getting Volt boosted and 4-stacked Razorwing speed booster might have helped

[glass sluice]

im too gay to even flirt with male video game characters.
still not sure how it took me this long to realise lol

[fast dew]

Mm, did you know a chunk of the tower Unum has collision inside? Even outside the area of the new war

[smoky gulch]

Oh, that's cool - I tried getting close, but never managed to

[naive rune]

must be nice to have all the choice at the buffet

[restive lantern]

Being pan & poly irl the hex polycules are my truth and I still wish they made some of them dateable at the same time. Like I understand not being able to date Eleanor and Arthur at the same but Quincy gives down to clown vibes absolutely

[fast dew]

Its. A super weird thing to get to, you gotta spam kdrive on the border of cetus to get out of bounds, then fall into a small out of bounds area in the entrance loading zone and very carefully walk out of bounds

The out of bounds area is also like. Stupidly detailed

Why does it have normal texturing 💔

[glass sluice]

im just picturing arthur getting really mad if you ask to date him and his sister together

"drifter, lets talk" as he pulls out the skana.

[fast dew]

Well, Arthur is blatantly against that sorta stuff, poly I mean, same with Lettie. Which is what makes the whole. "Poly" shit with the triad a bit annoying

[glass sluice]

thetriadshouldntbedatableinthefirstplace

[fast dew]

Ignoring that. You are forced to cheat in order to get said consent convos

[restive lantern]

Yeah it would kinda be a funny interaction of them being like wtf no lol

[fast dew]

And can only break up in 1 of them

[naive rune]

and then he gives you the old Caesar treatment🗡️

[fast dew]

And you can continue to ignore them, except for like. Eleanor's I think

[smoky gulch]

Honestly, if it's a poly relationship, it'd be fun to see protoframes date someone else as part of the deal

[glass sluice]

actually i did it the right way today.
was dating Marie, then flirted with Aoi and after she said yes, the very next convo was asking for consent.

[fast dew]

Tbf she'd know immediately but

[glass sluice]

thhats as close to right as you can get in wf

[fast dew]

Mhm, closest you can get to it

And its still pretty scummy unfortunately

[restive lantern]

Amazing taste btw

[fast dew]

Can't trust DE with shit sometimes

[glass sluice]

El's way more my speed, but I was really curious about Aoi underneath the facade.

[fast dew]

Thats what makes it more of an open relationship tbh. Its not mutual affection between all parties, its. Allowing drifter to go out with someone else

I like Eleanor, but its kinda funny

[naive rune]

every single one of the dateable characters is extremely loveable and fornicatable, even those that are not my type^^

[restive lantern]

That's why they need to right poly stuff correctly and people not treat it as some abhorrent immortal cheating scandal

[fast dew]

I was going through them all, for the sake of the honorias, to then settle down on Eleanor and

She has a line, asking if Arthur has been in the backrooms

[naive rune]

you just described greek mythology^^

[smoky gulch]

Yeah, but then again quite a few players would be very angry if their dateable could hang out with another person

[restive lantern]

It could just be player initiated to avoid this

[fast dew]

A huge part of the playerbase got super upset over the whole "its not cheating if its time travel", so the consent convos probably come from that backlash

[restive lantern]

Open relationships are a form of ENM & polyamory

[blissful merlin]

As the husband of Amir I can safely say he’d def feel jealous over the open relationship thing in someway. I know my Amir. He would not just accept a random open relationship, even across space and time just so abruptly. He’s the one to get super jealous. I’ve seen break up convos with him and even accidentally click on we should break up (thankfully they have the option to back out before confirming) and he’s immediately like “IS IT SOMEONE ELSE?!” Or “what did I do?!”
And then Marie comes along…I wanted to test how that relationship on would go but the moment I had the convo with Amir about it, I felt so bad. I already did initially but the chat made me feel worse. It felt like he was hiding his pain behind a smile. Like he didn’t want this outcome but is ok with it cuz he can’t do anything about it and I feel bad. Yet the scenes with Marie are so cute so I can’t even break up with her now cuz guilt trip lol

[glass sluice]

as far as media and poly relationships go, WF handles it better than anything else ive seen/read/played, im curious if theres a better one

[fast dew]

We got two examples with "poly" in warframe and both suck at consent 😭 poly is just super hard to write but man

[naive rune]

I never persued any of the romances, I always considered them friends first before anything else

[restive lantern]

I... Almost said stardew valley and fallout 4 only to remember I modded those 😭

[glass sluice]

im picturing some of the mods ive seen for fallout 4 and got very worried about you for a second lol

[fast dew]

"Dagath and the whole. Dax physically cannot disobey to orokin" takes a bit of thinking and

[glass sluice]

wrong reply lol

[blissful merlin]

I was originally gonna go after Arthur but Amir pulled me all the way in with his personality

[glass sluice]

that was meant for thomas:
i think thats just "has he been in here", since that line shows up when you are mid dating her.

[fast dew]

No but I do like fo4 a lot so

[fast dew]

Yuppers, it appears regardless of if you've had arthur in there, but. Man he was the one before Eleanor and that shit spooked me

[restive lantern]

Idk amir v much gives poly vibes mainly bc every polycule I know has an amir. I actually see him, Eleanor and Quincy being okay with it the most

[fast dew]

Amir is very sweet, he is a bit much for me, same with Aoi

[glass sluice]

Aoi I thought so too, until I got deep with her convos. It's a shield.

[fast dew]

Its a shield, sure

[blissful merlin]

Amir types the way I do when I’m texting. Especially when I’m super excited about something or super into the person I’m talking with. Typically a curse. Sometimes a blessing.

[glass sluice]

she reminds me a lot of my earlier self actually, "go along to get along".

[fast dew]

But she still is incredibly overstimulating to me

Amir also mildly reminds me too much of my little brother

[restive lantern]

Aoi is such a sweetheart I want to hug her people are mean to her low-key

[blissful merlin]

I wish we could give hugs to the hex members…friendly hugs and a simple kiss for our love that’s not tied to new years lol

[restive lantern]

The messages of Aoi literally experiencing sexism made me so sad to read through 😭

[restive lantern]

So true honestly

[sly pagoda]

I mean I am polying Amir and Roathe, an odd mix if there was one.

[glass sluice]

theres a particular amir convo that made me genuinely want to slug him, ill see if i can find it

[fast dew]

The one about being a cephalon? Same

Ive felt the need to punch almost all protos

[glass sluice]

yeah there it is, knew i had it saved

[fast dew]

Except for like. Lyon and Eleanor

Only two i haven't wanted to harm moderately

Oh, and the round table, they're chill

Love them all a lot

[glass sluice]

oh i can not stand M+V

[blissful merlin]

Legit doesn’t even have to be an extended shot of the kiss. Just give us a quick moment to kiss our partners real quick as we’re approaching them.
And with the rest of the hex, let me just hug my friends when I want! It’d be so cute!!! I love giving my besties a hug. Even randomly. Doing it in game would mean a lot.

[glass sluice]

like i get it, divorced energy. but my god.

[fast dew]

Im sympathetic towards them, once you finish their story it gets a lot better

They both feel responsible for what happened to Neci and it shows

[sly pagoda]

I got them back together.

[glass sluice]

i tried twice to get it to work and im convinced i hit a bug or the writing was weird, because they are just not clicking

[fast dew]

They're a lot more tolerable once they fix their shit

[sly pagoda]

I mean may as well since I can't shag V anyway.

[fast dew]

Mm, recently? As in post old peace? Im not sure the roundtable escaped any bugs from the kim updates

[glass sluice]

oh this was well before old peace

[fast dew]

Ah.

[glass sluice]

i went through every other protoframe on vibes and got them to super loved or whatever.
m+V? twice no dice.
except for roathe, the bug actually fixed his relationship for me lol

[fast dew]

The writing is a bit hard sometimes, they are the first ones you can properly fail

[glass sluice]

im enjoying this current run through, where i just tell quincy to get bent every time

[fast dew]

The round table as a whole, they're the first ones you can actually fail

[restive lantern]

I always have the flowcharts up lmfao

[fast dew]

The hex just makes it so you can't romance em, you'll still progress

[glass sluice]

@restive lantern honestly did not know those were a thing until i joined here

[fast dew]

Kaya is. A interesting character

[glass sluice]

ive had a weird WF life, most stuff has just kinda gone "on vibes".

[fast dew]

She seemed to have somewhat of a bond towards Albrecht, which isnt new. Albrecht did just come off from being a teacher lol

[restive lantern]

I am always curious about the answers you can give them, for instance I didn't know you could literally call Aoi an manic pixie dream girl until I was looking through flowcharts

And I love how they game lets you know how shitty that is

[glass sluice]

Kaya is one i get 100%, but I think there should be an ending where she doesnt go and works to accept and work through the trauma.

i think every woman has been through something like she has before, if not quite so public. I get why they went the direction they did, but would've been a hell of a writing turn to go the other way.

[fast dew]

We know its harder for her to make friends, or be friendly towards anyone, so its interesting that Albrecht managed to let that happen. It seemed he just let her yap a lot without interrupting, which. I feel is Albrecht being reminded of his daughter

Which happens a lot actually

[glass sluice]

Lonely kids just want someone to talk to, marginalised kids even more so.
I actually find his manipulation of her via that pretty.....gross is the wrong word. Unsettling is too weak.

[fast dew]

Why is it always manipulation?

[glass sluice]

because that's albys whole deal. Aoi even says so.

[fast dew]

Not. Not really? It was literally only for the hex

He had always been blunt before hand

[glass sluice]

she said that she could sense he was planning something bad for them, something bad to happen. And she didn't speak up because she doesn't do that.

[fast dew]

Kaya literally hunted Albrecht down and he did not want to see her 😭

[blissful merlin]

Kaya randomly showed up in the shadows of every street corner albrecht came across during his travels lmao

[glass sluice]

that kinda proves what I just said. We don't know what his plans are for them, but it was not what he told them.

[restive lantern]

He literally manipulates, you, the player 😭

[fast dew]

huh?

[blissful merlin]

“TALK TO ME ABOUT TIME TRAVEL-“
Girl I feel that…give me the lore dump. Tell me all you know time traveler

[fast dew]

Genuinely where does he ever do that? Outside him saying "this does this" and it doesn't, he genuinely doesn't manipulate, he just does shit

[glass sluice]

@blissful merlin i genuinely wish the kims were more extensive, just more everything. more info dumping.
I could talk for hours about some of the topics, but its always a dozen or so lines at most and then "offline"

[fast dew]

We don't know the original usage for the protos, all for we know Albrecht wanted to give folk protectors for when wally inevitably came in

[boreal spoke]

Hello everyone I need help on the limbo therum

[fast dew]

Because murmur do break in

[glass sluice]

the emphasis there being "for all we know"

[fast dew]

Which. Isnt really on Albrecht, thats on us for bridging that gap for wally

-# as in the ARG

[restive lantern]

Literally 😭 one of my favorite games ever is dragon age origins and the Kim Chats is the only other thing that has come close to the amazing character writing.

[glass sluice]

oh i love that series!

[fast dew]

Yes. Which is just as good as your own theory, coming from a biased source. As much as I love the hex, they physically do not have all of the information, and even if they did, they are biased

So aoi going "it felt suspicious" doesn't really amount to much

[glass sluice]

@fast dew I didnt say it was a theory, i was quoting a kim convo not quite verbatim because i dont have a flow chart

[fast dew]

Used the wrong word, meant to use argument

In a debate way, I dont think were having a full on argument

[glass sluice]

i usually use "discuss" for that, helps avoid assumptions.

[fast dew]

I like to compare Albrecht to someone like Samuel hayden, a lot. They are super similar, like. If you looked at them front on, you'd assume they're the same character rehashed

[glass sluice]

since all my communication is via text IRL, I have to be clear when it;s something more important.

[fast dew]

I use a lot of speech to text stuff when yapping here

What you're hearing is my own words, fixed with grammar

[smoky gulch]

Is there any ballpark value how much time happened between handshake and current times? That ought to be millennia

[fast dew]

... reading

Mm, around a thousand years, maybe more

[glass sluice]

no speech on my part, just the text 📔

[fast dew]

Both appearing to be narcissistic people killing things for the betterment of humanity. Both do help, they help a lot, but the means are harder to justify

[smoky gulch]

Drifter really had a fun time, chilling in Zariman with only Duviri to pass time

[fast dew]

Well

Not at all, actually

Their childhood was normal ish in duviri, after the zariman

Then they turned into an adult and wanted to leave

Then thrax began to murder them daily

[glass sluice]

"and thats when the excutions started"

[smoky gulch]

Ah, so it was at least okay at first

Getting really Peter Panned there

[glass sluice]

imagine if tinkerbell just started killing peter over and over, etc

[smoky gulch]

Oh, there were versions where kids get murdered by Peter Pan once they started growing up

Those who fled became the pirates

[fast dew]

Samuel hayden however, has little to no sympathetic traits. He is just like this. Best you got is brain cancer and him turning himself into a giant ass robot. Albrecht has sympathetic traits. He loves people, he does genuinely try to be better. [We think this is because of his time in Gaul, after he made the hex], he shows remorse guilt and genuine disgust at himself

And thats what makes these two characters different, despite seemingly similar
-# ignore that Samuel becomes Samur and it is legit just Albrecht all over again

[glass sluice]

(I googled it and Samuel Hayden is from doom)

[fast dew]

Yes hes

A whole ass mf its annoying

He went to Harvard though, from memory

And. Is 130+ years old

And responsible for thousands of deaths

[glass sluice]

i played doom whatever year it was, but imma be honest, the plot did not grip me enough to retain memories

[fast dew]

But! He solved the energy crisis. He saved earth, but at a huge cost

[fast dew]

2016, I think?

Unless you mean either doom 3. Which is 2004/5 or classic doom, which is the 90s

[glass sluice]

i owned the movie on DVD, if that helps

[fast dew]

HA

Oh my. What a dogshit movie.

It is fun though, just. Not loved from a lore standpoint

Back when the rock was in literally everything

[glass sluice]

hey now, cmon. he was called......honestly i got nothing.
Im starting to think i was men in black flashy thingd at some point for like half of the media ive seen

[fast dew]

Yeah same. Unless its a hyperfixation or a special interest, it just. Leaves

This extends to names, birthdays and appointments

But, get me on the topic of doom and id be there yapping for hours

Like did you know the religious aspects of doom actually represents authoritarianism

[glass sluice]

never clicked as a franchise for me, i was always more into the way too big RPG's
which explains why i have so much time in a few of them as MMO's and more in offline

[fast dew]

I actually don't really like FPS games, or games like warframe

Much more of a metroid/metroidvania fan

Or, rpgs like the original 2 fallouts or disco Elysium

[glass sluice]

im getting too old for twitchy gameplay, which is why im so happy with wf's settings.
just no more of that in wf, thanks

[fast dew]

I guess slime rancher counts as FPS actually

[blissful merlin]

I’m off to bed. I just realized it was 4 am. Goodnight Tenno. Was a fun convo to be apart of a little bit haha. Sweet dreams to Lua

[fast dew]

https://tenor.com/view/cecesrhaccc1-on-tiktok-cecesrhaccc1-wave-wave-cat-cecesgif-gif-3519480851846766777

[glass sluice]

https://tenor.com/view/good-night-goodnight-cat-kitty-gif-23955236

i should go too, im not gong to be alone tonight so should make a token effort to be less gremliny

[fast dew]

Im gonna explode why does grandmother's ao3 tag come up before the official wiki page does

[glass sluice]

good talk with y'all

[fast dew]

Night

[restive lantern]

Goodnight ❤️

[charred patio]

what if

ballas and wally merge together?

[spice wedge]

No no bad idea

[restive river]

One is dead and the other hates the Orokin explicitly
But
They have a common enemy

But also
One is dead

[midnight ice]

not for long

running nekros and soul punching him at the end of tnw

[restive river]

LMAO

Just go beat up the warden

[fast dew]

Imagine if like

If ballas did fall into the void

His corpse just smacked into Thrax or some shit

[restive river]

Lmao

[fast dew]

And he does that wail little kids do when they trip over or smthn

[strange plinth]

new visitor to duviri: ballas's corpse !!

[fast dew]

Corpse's landing !!!!

[strange turtle]

Corpses Landing is shattered by all the Orowyrms and cast into the Void in retaliation

Unfortunately it’s also the island Thrax’s palace is on

[fast dew]

Thats the kind of tantrum id expect him to make

[charred patio]

didnt he get sucked into the void or something tho?

[strange turtle]

Reasonable crashout tbh, considering it’s him

[fast dew]

Possibly but it also could've been the literal sun

[fast dew]

A calm crashout, actually

[strange turtle]

Clearly some bad juju going on for it to be the site of the only incident of foreign things falling into Duviri to smack into someone

And a corpse, of all things

[fast dew]

Deadass, the superstitious ones will worry!

[grand acorn]

hey so i have a question since like the hunholis was just left on the ground after adis died when we go to tau will it still be their and can we pilot it cause that would be great

[fast dew]

Mm, from memory, we'd need a lyrotic? Lyotic? Bridge. We'd basically need to be a sentient iirc

[grand acorn]

yea but think about it cant we like connect to like we cnnect to the warframes

[fast dew]

Maybe, but we already have our giant machines to use [the vessels], so i wouldn't see the point in adding a second one

[grand acorn]

so thats how we got to 1999 i thought there was a portal or i just wasnt paying attention😆

[fast dew]

Well, theres a few ways, but yeah, thats one of them

[grand acorn]

oh ok

[fast dew]

One of them is how Albrecht gets there, one being the weird transference we did to arthur in whispers, the other being straight helminth travel

Helminth travel did seem related to the vessels but with Roathe being able to do it now without them

It seems like the helminth can just do that

[mental herald]

So did narmer not touch deimos at all?

[fast dew]

yeah, but tbf, why would they lol

[mental herald]

Didn't they almost control the whole world? I thought ballas was egotisical enough to do that tbh.

[fast dew]

Yeah, he's egotistical, but he's not stupid. There's almost nothing left on deimos, and the small amount that is, isnt worth the risk it would take to overwhelm the infestation and the Entrati's full defence forces

If ballas thinks theyre even alive

[mental herald]

I mean if they took down the heart of deimos they would basically get rid of the tenno ?

Like just to make sure

[fast dew]

Yeah, but it would also cripple every other void powered structure

[tall echo]

the heart doesn't just power frames

[mental herald]

Wasn't narmer lik 90% sentient? Won't it benefit them

[fast dew]

It won't benefit ballas, thats all that matters

[tall echo]

if you took over the world, would you destroy every nuclear reactor "just to be sure"?

[fast dew]

It stops any form of void based travel

So, like. The rails and stuff

[mental herald]

Where are these rails? I always see them mentioned but I have a hard time imagining them. Like are they like trains

[tall echo]

the junctions we use are rails

yk, those things connecting all the planets

[mental herald]

Oooh

I wish there was a mingame where we drive a rail lol

[tall echo]

that would be the world's shortest minigame

[mental herald]

I actually don't mind that kind of energy

[tall echo]

the point of solar rails is that it's faster than light travel

[fast dew]

Most form of short interplanetary travel that would benefit ballas would be gone, 99% sure he wouldn't be able to open up those void portals

[tall echo]

it was a hypothetical, destroying the heart would be like destroying every form of energy generation

[mental herald]

Unrelated. So if ballas actually was successful in making the ship eat the sun. The man in the wall would kill him

?*,

[tall echo]

no

[mental herald]

Then why does he come in the end? Just to scare us?

[tall echo]

kinda?

[mental herald]

I see i see

[tall echo]

we can't exactly know why the eldritch horror is doing eldritch horror things

[mental herald]

Statue looking ahh

[tall echo]

not his true form, just a mockery of our name for him

[fast dew]

Its not even our name for him

[tall echo]

it kinda is

[mental herald]

If i imagine him as a car will he become a car

[fast dew]

Albrecht called him that first, then Rell. Not like. Release wise but lorewise

[tall echo]

...and then we did

[fast dew]

Ive always found it interesting that both Rell and Albrecht came to the near same name but they've never interacted

[mental herald]

Rell probably knew who albert was

[fast dew]

Yeah, but Albrecht did not ever mention wally to anyone

And Rell likely only knows of Albrecht as a author for science stuff

[tall echo]

brecht

[mental herald]

I wish we get to see deimos before it was infested in operators memories

[tall echo]

it'd just be a rock with entrati buildings on it

[mental herald]

Yeah I wanna see the entrati buildings and streets

[fast dew]

Its like saying we know Einstein, we know his theories and stuff but a lot of us never knew his personal life

[fast dew]

There was some form of highway

[tall echo]

to hell?

[fast dew]

To your mum

[strange turtle]

The abyss actually, but close enough

[mental herald]

Orokin cars would be interesting

[fast dew]

They probably had carriages, now that we know that Kaithes are just. Real

[midnight ice]

why does the Ostron carry such... bulbous outfits? are they like pouches?

[midnight ice]

orokin honda civic

[fast dew]

Yeah they probably are! Those look like water carriers of sorts

[midnight ice]

ooo, camelpaks

[fast dew]

Yeah!!

I could see it being temple kuva

[midnight ice]

makes sense since if you're a Tower worker you'd need like, constant hydration that might not be readily available

i dont think the orokin installed tap water in the Unum

[fast dew]

They wouldn't, no

[midnight ice]

does the orokin drink tap water...

do they have like, their own Fiji

[fast dew]

I fully think that they dont drink water

They've transitioned into like

Wine fueled creature

[strange turtle]

relic of oldframe when all the extra bits had to be as thick as a folded towel what Tom said probably

[fast dew]

Oldframe moment

[mental herald]

Why are the ostron so tiny?

[midnight ice]

short kings

[pale cedar]

Some are children and children are small

[midnight ice]

this is a grown ass man

ostron are just tiny

[fast dew]

Woah they are thin

And really long

[midnight ice]

assuming 6ft warframes, most ostrons are say reaching 5ft? 5'3-5'4? roughly the global south/southeast asian average

[midnight ice]

a lot of their bulk is just clothing

[fast dew]

Oh for hells sake im the size of an ostron

[fast dew]

Yeah but like. Woah. Yk? I forget how thin humans are compared to most warframes

Like on devstream, when they changed between grendel and arthur it was

[jolly root]

Well they also are kunda living in a dystopiela

So.makes sense they are.smaller and kinda thin

[fast dew]

Made Arthur look like a twink, it was weird

[jolly root]

🤣

[midnight ice]

lemme finish this koumei mission and ill do one with a skin-tight drifter fit to compare
and Harrow is in the lanky spectrum of frames, too, so likely the ostrons are just really lean. life of manual work? tower meat not being too nutritious?

[fast dew]

Genetically changed maybe? Being thin in a certain way is good for swimming..? Oh maybe they're built for climbing?

Or. Something?

[midnight ice]

i think the other (modern, so not counting Loid or the Holdfasts) humans we see are like, normal people sized?

see relay workers

[fast dew]

They are normal sized

Like, here's limbo, who's pretty slim

I deadass think Loid's waist is thicker than limbo's 😭

[midnight ice]

ostrons are just uniquely small

theyre not all too different from the drifter? wf just has a habit of making lank people

[fast dew]

Is that a drifter? Why it kinda look like a lobster

[ocean geyser]

I see your desire for proto loid has lead you to make a Loid-coloured Limbo

[fast dew]

Thats actually just base limbo prime

[ocean geyser]

Seriously??

[fast dew]

Yeah

Its super weird, and super coincidental

[ocean geyser]

i see

Loidbo

[fast dew]

Iimbo proto.....

Its gonna be Loid.........

https://tenor.com/view/feel-that-that's-true-feel-that-thats-xata-xata-warframe-meme-gif-15531284589461707381

[ocean geyser]

Randomly mentioning that i think Wally used Albrecht’s voice when saying “XATA FASS XATA”

Specifically Xata
I’ve mentioned this a while back i think

Idk
It just sounds like how Albrecht would pronounce Xata

[fast dew]

Mm, can you clip it?

I would like to hear it

[mental herald]

I love the sanctum anatomica music in my orb

[fast dew]

Yeah, its a nice soundtrack. Yara Jeliira is even better-

[mental herald]

Please DE let me play somachord songs in missions iam tired of listening to Match of the moa for the millionth time

[mental herald]

I never listen to it more than a second lol

[fast dew]

I like it because of the sound, along with the translation

[mental herald]

It just creeps me out

[fast dew]

It shouldn't, its a love confession :)

[mental herald]

I'd love to hear party of your lifetime and other songs in missions because it always hurts me when my somachord music stops as soon as I start a mission

[mental herald]

Wow I'll give it a listen later

[fast dew]

You wont hear it, its in voidtongue, but the translation is sweet.

[mental herald]

I see i see. Old man yaoi at it again

[fast dew]

Behold my heart, fill my heart fiercely.

Eternal union, eternal union, I am your counterpart.

Behold my heart

Fill my heart fiercely

AHHH

AND IT GETS WORSE

There's two voices.

The first part has two voices.

[mental herald]

Who is singing ir

[fast dew]

Well, we don't know but

Its very clearly implied to be about Albrecht and Loid

It plays during the cutscenes when the vessels do that thing

[mental herald]

Ooo

Warframe Romantic moments: Two huge things embracing eachother

I liked the whole quest I just wish there was more to loid than just standing there. It would be nice to chat with him like minerva and Frost guy

[fast dew]

Well.

You have the 2 Kim chats he has with the traid

[lapis fiber]

I skipped story up to harrows chain back when I played but now that I’m coming back I want to get into the story what do I do

[fast dew]

And small titbits of character development too. Such as Loid greening out that one time

[fast dew]

Honestly, just replay the quests you can.

[lapis fiber]

Oh you can replay quests

[fast dew]

Yea, some you can't, some you can

[lapis fiber]

Ok

[strong viper]

Arthur sits comfortably in twunk territory i think

Grendel is, well, Grendel

[drowsy saddle]

UwU

[midnight ice]

grendel is bear(?)

[fast dew]

He would be yeah

[strong viper]

Chroma is a bear moreso, but grendel can pass bear too yes

[midnight ice]

default harrow is twink and he's upgraded to hunk in prime

[strong viper]

Rhino, chroma, grendel. Bear trinity

[fast dew]

Dont say frost/Velimnir is a bear, he isn't

I will die on that hill

[midnight ice]

otter?

[strong viper]

That makes sense.

[fast dew]

Yeah, silver otter or whatever

[drowsy saddle]

Ain't Velimir a FILF

[normal mountain]

Imo
Chroma is grizzly
Grendel is teddy

[strong viper]

Real.

Im a twunk so im quick to delineate em

[normal mountain]

Both bears,
But very different kinds of bears

[midnight ice]

frost id like to fornicatewith?

[drowsy saddle]

An actual father figure

[strong viper]

Hard to beat Stalker there

But i wouldnt know

[midnight ice]

stalker would be older than arthur

older twunk

[sudden notch]

Game 10+ years old and zero political messaging or ideals /j

[sudden notch]

"Pass" hes a full on bear and I say this as a bara consumer

[strange turtle]

No he’s more like an ogre or troll I think

[midnight ice]

you up next on the jade light

[strange turtle]

https://tenor.com/view/breaking-bad-drama-walter-walter-white-gif-3374138

[radiant pier]

so the drifter is a separate character?

[twin whale]

no

[radiant pier]

nono I meant

[waxen mesa]

Drifter is the version of Operator that was left stuck on the Zariman

[radiant pier]

they're not the one we've been playing the entire time before this?

[twin whale]

they were the same person, the timelines split, now they are different people becuase of how time and experience passed

[waxen mesa]

depends on your school of thought but ultimately. yes

[twin whale]

The Operator is the one you started as

[waxen mesa]

Drifter has had a different life then Operator

[radiant pier]

OH

wait so where the heck has the Operator been this whole time of the Ballas bs

[waxen mesa]

im assuming you havn't finished new war yet?

[radiant pier]

nope just at the part where you choose

[waxen mesa]

because it's explained there but

Because Operator and Drifter are the same person. only one can exist at a time

[radiant pier]

just got a tiny bit confused is all

[waxen mesa]

When Operator was thrust into the void, Drifter came out of Duviri

[radiant pier]

I was gonna choose the drifter because I thought

[restive lantern]

KAMI IN LORE CHAT? 🗣️

[waxen mesa]

At the time of New War, Operator is stuck reliving the Zariman incident

[radiant pier]

"this is the character I started with, it'll be good closure"

and I thought The Operator was like....AU

[waxen mesa]

that's what those Zariman "flashbacks" are. they are actually happening in real time

[radiant pier]

okay I'll pick The Operator now

[radiant pier]

I KNEW IT

OKOK THIS IS FUN

but I can choose the drifter after this quest, right?

[waxen mesa]

yes you can freely switch after new war

[radiant pier]

because I'm gonna be honest with you

modelling her after me was a gigantic mistake on my end

[waxen mesa]

you can change that lol

apperance is not set in stone

[radiant pier]

nono, I meant

I don't wanna sound narcissistic

ORDIS? I THOUGHT YOU WAS DEAD?

HUH

[twin whale]

only for a littel bit, now I am gona take a lore bath

[radiant pier]

TEARING BALLAS IN HALF MY THOUGHTS EXACTLY BEST BUDDY

[twin whale]

keep playnig lil ducky

[radiant pier]

so uhm...how is Ordis alive

[twin whale]

it gets real fun

[radiant pier]

WAIT I WAS DEADASS PLAYING AN ENTIRELY DIFFERENT PERSON THIS WHOLE TIME

holy plot twist damn

also goddammit Ordis you scared the crap outta I thought you died

[twin whale]

yesn't

they're the same person, there was only one of them until the zariman 10-0 thing happen

(fyi, Ten Oh...)

that's what a Tenno is and there's technically more of them than just the main character we play

either way

[radiant pier]

yes dw I know they're the same person, I just meant I thought I was just that exact same person that fell into the void years later

[twin whale]

this is explained in the next couple of big main missions

[twin whale]

oh so just a timeskip montage sort of ?

[radiant pier]

yes

[twin whale]

so did I

then I thought it was a fever dream

:D

[radiant pier]

I was super suspicious already at first

because like....how the heck did you get out....why are you so big

it can't have been years

and then that class THIS IS SO COOL

but it's 4am bye

[twin whale]

nini sweet dreams

[ocean geyser]

ngl
Murum Vull and The Master Returns feel like two sides of the same song

MV being sung by the Murmur and TMR being the Sanctum side of it

[ashen pulsar]

it lwk might've been years

not that many years but years

[fluid nacelle]

dinosaurs

[tall echo]

No

[restive lantern]

Bro... Drifter cutting their food into squares is so OCD coded 😭

My partner literally (affectionately) makes fun of my bc I prefer square cut pizza 😭

[ocean geyser]

Hrm
Since normal people can’t see the Thrax
Does that mean people without an affinity to the Void can’t see the Murmur?
I know the Thrax and Murmur aren’t exactly related but
For the most part it’s been established that non-voidy people can’t see void things

[unique cloak]

I mean probably right?

It’s called the murmur so maybe they can only hear them but not see them?

[ocean geyser]

Ominous

Once again making me want to write spooky stuff about it
Like Grineer and Corpus logs of expeditions into the zariman

[smoky gulch]

Headcanon: Orokin were too paranoid to have slave servant that scratches their back, so they mutated arm to be able to scratch backs themselves

[ocean geyser]

Seems Orokin enough

[strange plinth]

i fear there's already an explanation for their longer arm
it was "shaped to match their generosity" according to Tuvul

[smoky gulch]

Ah, so enough length to be as far away from common filth as possible while saying it's good

[strange plinth]

"We stretched forth our Great Hands, shaped to match our generosity, and we gave."
yea, trying to say they were generous and charitable when they very much were not

[jaunty oasis]

That's just biological truth ain't it, if they weren't generous then why are their arms long huh?

[restive river]

It’s not a biological trait though

[jaunty oasis]

im just joking

[tall echo]

Not mutated, just surgically lengthened

[restive river]

Tone doesn’t transfer through text 😔
Apologies

[tall echo]

Without a lot of practice*

[restive river]

Even then, it sometimes does not translate

[fast dew]

Its hard without like

Using a lot of emotes

[ocean geyser]

I tend to just use “:3” and it works fine

[fast dew]

I have a wider range of emotions through emotes, but they're so restricted here.

Though I do have like. 4 that express my main emotions here at least

[ocean geyser]

Yeah that’s kind of stinky

Like i get it
But still stinky

[sly pagoda]

I think i have figured out the Zariman problem. Form a Tenno pop group to seal the Albrecht Membrane letting us remove it while the murmur is sealed in the void. 😉

[tall echo]

Is this a reference to smth

[cosmic badge]

Emoticons might help?

[tall echo]

True, tbf my general tone tries to be either factual or sarcastic, not much variety there

[restive river]

I know your overall tone well lol

[sharp breach]

Hey what does the operator do since the drifter showed up and we equipped him?

Does operator just farm perita rebellion or somthing lol

[fleet furnace]

it was mentioned somewhere im not sure, but when op or drifter is active the other exists in this void pocket where they cant do much, but can share thoughts with the other. there can be exceptions however as the old peace and 1999 happen simultaneously

[sharp breach]

I wonder if young op cringes or what when we kiss protoframes. Like do you think they are the girls or guys are gross or does that sorta relationship stuff never cross their mind since they are so young.

Do they even age?
Is this a old man or woman in a child body?

[gentle isle]

I think they'd be happy for the drifter

[lean garden]

shrimple, during the events of the Avatar: The Legend of Aang, was Aang a child or an old man in a child's body?

[sharp breach]

How long did he know adis for?