lore-discussion

[midnight ice]

Median Duck

[strange turtle]

Hmm… Range Duck

https://tenor.com/view/fallout-gif-13246854

[fast dew]

Mm... duck......

[midnight ice]

she does this in PT
her Rubico is also loud as hell

[fast dew]

I. I don't actually like eating duck

I only really use duck fat for cooking

[midnight ice]

I only like the crispy skin, peking duck types. Anything that rends or crisps a bit of the fat

[restive river]

You can live for now

[restive river]

You
Deep void

[midnight ice]

No!!! no!! i dont want to see scintillating shapes wisping from my skull and the gash between worlds!!!

[restive river]

Too bad

[midnight ice]

i dont wanna take off and struggle toward the gate only for space to compress around me, as if the door arrived to me!!!

AAAAAA

[restive river]

:)

[fast dew]

Go... go create an unknowing, unseeing entity

[restive river]

Or give it a shape

Or whatever Al did

CE go brrr

[dark compass]

Weird Al???

[raw knoll]

I gotta ask: Is 1999 "just" a timeloop, or some kind pocket universe like Duviri? And whatever it might be, Holvania will always nuke itself from the outside world perspective?

I find it pretty vague - Entrati needed the reactor to fuel his trip to Tau, to generate enough power for the loop to go on, to contain Wally in the loop?

[pale cedar]

It's the actual past inside a time loop

[pale cedar]

He never said or suggested he needed it to fuel his trip to Tau he just needed it to escape 1999 and Wally was expelled hence

"Murmur expelled. Tau is in sight. They've given their lives for this. Make it count."

[opaque zenith]

It's a timeloop, and while yes the natural course is to nuke, Drifter only need to stop reseting in the loop with the nuke prevented to keep it, which he can't because Wally. So, he keep the risk of going back to the nuke timeline, if he go back and don't fix, and keep fixing it eternally instead
So: Drifter could stop, but that would start some Wally shenanigans

TLDR: If you stop your groundhood day, Wally starts his own groundhood day.
Or: Enclosed timeloop to prevent a time-travelers battle (One go back to kill the other, who go back earlier to kill the one, who go back earlier to kill the other, who- ad infinitum)

Time-travel. Is complicated to explain without drawning, for me at least

[raw knoll]

@opaque zenith Wait - what will Wally do if we ever stop the timeloop?

[opaque zenith]

And so I did

[raw knoll]

Unfortunately, I am very smooth brained, and time travel make my head hurt. If anything, I'm more perplexed by your drawing ...? Whatever the outcomes, Wally changes something with every loop ...?

[opaque zenith]

unknown changes/kill Al/prevent Orokin/kill universe till nothing/???
Wally's endgame is kinda unknown to give a definitive reason for him doing all that he does

[raw knoll]

If I understood your reasoning right, the loop is a Wally containment device. But you also suggest he also "feed" that loop? I feel like Wally* could escape if he just did nothing.

[restive river]

Wally doesn’t have control of 1999 anymore, he isn’t doing anything to it

The loop is also not a Wally containment anything

[opaque zenith]

In one the changes get fixed, constantly. In the other the change lands, stay and things get bad

[restive river]

It’s one timeline, not two

[raw knoll]

Right, forgot about Eternalism. Every decision, past and future, are as true as blah blah blah?

[restive river]

Palimpsest of spacetime
Events can be rewritten

[restive river]

Not relevant here

[opaque zenith]

correct, the drawning is just a representation of the possible outcomes

[restive river]

Eternalism only exists to explain the Drifter primarily and is touched on with a few other things, Baro’s deal for example

[raw knoll]

Ok, so, I'm still still confused. We go back in time, prevent the reactor from blowing up, victory. And then we keep looping. What I can't wrap my head around is why we keep looping in the first place.

[restive river]

It’s not even accessible to anyone but Wally nor is it really relevant in regards to 1999

[restive river]

Albrecht established the loop and it just keeps going

[raw knoll]

@restive river He can do that? I thought it was a Drifter thing

[restive river]

We don’t know how he did but he did
Loid says Albrecht extended it as well, which it was extended as it previously only looped New Years

[opaque zenith]

because Wally can loop too and change to make the reactor explode

[restive river]

Drifter doesn’t make time loops but they can control them

[raw knoll]

Ah, it's starting to make sense now

So the loop is a proverbial arm wrestling match between us and Wally. Something like that?

[opaque zenith]

It gets easier with time (pun intended)

[restive river]

Albrecht makes the loop for New Years, gets stuck for ???
During Whispers we open the way for Wally
In Lotus Eaters we establish the connection
And once Drifter gets to 1999 Wally takes control of the loop, we expel the Murmur with the reactor nearly blowing, Albrecht shoots us and we reset the loop, now encompassing the entire year.

[restive river]

Only during the quest

Once he’s expelled his only other appearances during 1999 are during Temporal Archimedia (Murmur) and the Mall radio

After 1999 he goes on to terrorize Duviri with his garbage fanfic (Isleweaver)

[raw knoll]

I see. So there's no easy way out of the loop - the Hex and Drifter are stuck in it? (As long as they're in Holvania?)

[restive river]

We continue the loop in 1999 now to keep the changes we made and to keep our friends from meeting the fate they will eventually succumb to

[restive river]

Drifter isn’t stuck
But yeah the Hex are essentially stuck in it

The timeline persists beyond the loop so our timelooped friends are both stuck in a timeloop and outside of it
We will never know the versions of them outside the loop (or before)

[raw knoll]

But there's something else I didn't find a clear answer for: After the Hex finale, say we defused the bomb one more time and then not loop again. What would happen? Reality going "nuh-uh"?

[restive river]

Oh also Kaya does find a way out but she prefers to be in the loop

[restive river]

We don’t know what happens if the loop is disbanded

[pale cedar]

https://tenor.com/view/explosion-mushroom-cloud-atomic-bomb-bomb-boom-gif-4464831

Simple answer

[restive river]

Yeah 18 radiation wars do end up happening

We kinda don’t want to disband the loop, keep some version of our friends alive

[opaque zenith]

Reality stays, it's Wally that goes "Nuh-uh". Time-traveling arms-wrestling as said before

[restive river]

Wally’s not really a threat in 1999 anymore tho

He wanted it to get to Albrecht

The main threats in 1999 is Scaldra and whatever we’re dealing with in Temporal Archimedia, which is mostly fixing damage from the loop or keeping up with established events

[raw knoll]

(Wally has some sorts of daddy issues?)

[restive river]

That’s a way to describe it lol

[raw knoll]

Anyway, if Wally keep looping us back in any case, we do have a relative begenning and an end to our timeloop. If wally doesn't, then why keep looping after the hex finale?

[opaque zenith]

If the gameplay loop is cannon, I fell is fair to assume Wally at least keeps his murmur goons there cause: if havoc = no Orokin = no Al = same result (assuming the finale quest need to be "repeated" every year and there's murmur on the reactor part)

[restive river]

We keep looping the Hex to keep them alive and relatively safe, beyond the loop is the rest of history which has at minimum 18 radiation wars
So they live forever or succumb to the infestation/burn

[restive river]

I’d say the gameplay loop is canon, it could be he’s still trying but
We do just expel him every single time

[opaque zenith]

exactly

[restive river]

Even if he lets the reactor explode we don’t know if that erases the Orokin

Heck it does and nothing happens

What even is Wally’s goal beyond chase Albrecht in 1999?
To mess with us?
Cause the reactor going off doesn’t matter if he wants to erase the Orokin
Iirc Albrecht implies he wants to eat the possibilities stemming from 1999

[pale cedar]

I doubt it does condsidering they were fine

[restive river]

Exactly

If he wanted to stop the Orokin entirely that ain’t it

[raw knoll]

Shame we can't escape Holvania then. I was kind of looking towards Naga Drums part two: Genocide Boogaloo. (What with the O.R.O and the Orokin precursors)

[restive river]

He’s either expelled by the reactor going off or by us interfering/looping
if he wanted to attack the Orokin he’d have to do it earlier in the year

[restive river]

Grandfather Paradox

[pale cedar]

We can escape Hollvania

[raw knoll]

(Are we even sure DE has a definitive answer about this anyway?)

[pale cedar]

We aren't trapped

[restive river]

Killing the Orokin before they become the Orokin is too big a change, we know some changes, typically small ones can be made but some changes are too big

[drowsy saddle]

I mean, wally is still affected by cause and effect, so he kinda has to play nice with timelines

[restive river]

You can change something in a Lua Spy, ensure a reactor doesn’t blow, even save a defense target that was meant to be destroyed
But disrupting someone’s timeline in a way that causes them to never cause you to change things is a big no

[raw knoll]

If Eternalism is a thing, why does it matter?

[restive river]

Eternalism isn’t accessible and thus doesn’t matter

[restive river]

The only being that can access it is Wally
So while it’s a thing that exists, it doesn’t matter as we cannot access it

[opaque zenith]

I'd say Wally post-quest strat is less a dependance on the reactor and more like a "keep trowning the hands till all are dead" strategy. Works better for a "no Orokin" result

[restive river]

Only one, maybe two other characters access it and it’s not in a way that really changes things
(Eleanor contacting her Nunself and Kaya looking at other timelines during Temporal Archimedia)

[restive river]

What dependance on the reactor

The Murmur are weak to radiation-

The reactor blows before we get there and the Orokin still exist

[pale cedar]

We depend on the reactor of emotion nuking Wally

[raw knoll]

@pale cedar We should ask Wally if he tried talking to his dad about it. Oh, wait.

[pale cedar]

His dad ran away to get the milk

[opaque zenith]

I'm giving a possible reason for Wally to keep wanting to go back to holvania, and the reason why the loop must go on.

I'm trying to theorize the possibility that reason for the loop is Wally, and attempting to explain Wally's reason to do all

[opaque zenith]

Now the tricky part about the loop is that time still passes "outside" the loop, so we're "making a film and wacthing the finished one at the same time", which goes into another theory that all these time-travels are actually "predestined alterations" (I forgot the name for that type of time-travel) and nothing will change in the present because the present is already the "timeline changed" present. So not that it won't matter but that we must do our roles in the "theater set of history"

My brain hurts, i'll go read syandanas descriptions lore instead

[waxen mesa]

did the orbitor used to belong to Ordan? Why would Ordis's 'old stuff' be in the personal quarter?

i mean i guess a cephalon can have possessions but I feel like there's more to it then a cephalon's trinktes

[pale cedar]

Nah, always belonged to the Tenno

[waxen mesa]

can someone remind me who cephalon suda was? i remember she was like...a lore figre

[opaque zenith]

https://www.warframe.com/pt-br/media/comics/what-remains TLDR: An archimedean

[waxen mesa]

is that a brazilian link?

[dark compass]

Doxed

[opaque zenith]

Whoops, it will auto-change to your languange tho

I think

[waxen mesa]

it did

just thought it was funny

[keen latch]

It could also have been storage for maintenance components. But also as a cephalon he could've just had some stuff he wanted. He is not a true machine after all.

The personal quarters were unused for the better part of a millennium.

[fast dew]

He. He might just be somewhere in the ship. His lil glass cube...

[pale cedar]

He is the ship

[keen latch]

Under the railjack docking umbilical.

That's where we installed the vitruvian.

[fast dew]

Yeah but where's the glass cube! Where is the glass nihil made out of, or for Ordis

[pale cedar]

I smashed it and made him become a trashcan

It's what he gets for not becoming the trashcan when it was shown in the Sacrifice

[tall echo]

No

[fast dew]

Yeah no that was weird actually

[strange turtle]

Because it was previously just more storage and stuff and Ordis was the one running things for a thousand years before we woke up again

IIRC Steve actually wrote a little story about him trading with woodland critters on Earth for scrap parts Pre-Awakening as a sort of scrapped backstory for his Drone body

[waxen mesa]

so i guess ill just assume his stuff was various bits he collected

[rose estuary]

How does ordis even get his drone body bc when you do the new war at some point he just suddenly has it out of nowhere seemingly

[silk atlas]

Because time skip

[waxen mesa]

Drifter probably got it for him

[rose estuary]

Oh ok

[ocean geyser]

Or he finally had a reason to start using it

[waxen mesa]

Drifter's familiar with the concept of cephalons so they probably found it when scavenging some orokin wreck. or like Dar said, he might have had it in storage and pulled it out to new out a bit more with the war

given old peace. we can assume Ordis's body is standard cephalon equipment

[strange plinth]

Ordis presumably finds his body during The Sacrifice, as vitruvian ordis has it hidden in the background of his little 'portrait'
why he doesn't use it until TNW, dunno

[normal mountain]

Probably never needed to
Considering the Orbiter was always intact until then

[pale cedar]

It was just a drone so he could move about and be the Orbiter

Orbiter wasn't damaged

[distant sun]

Do you guys have any resources y'all recommend to read or listen to warframe lore? I'm starting to get obsessed and ik I'm fairly bad at picking up subtext while playing the game so I want MOAR!!!

[silk atlas]

Orokin Archives

[tall echo]

Aye, the archives are the most reliable source

[restive river]

It’s actually teased during the Sacrifice so he could have gotten the Proxy body from that (somehow)
Maybe the blueprint was something he gained and Drifter (or him) made it off screen

[median turret]

Is the monthly relationship reset in 1999 something that exists lorewise or is it only a feature in the game? Like are any of the protoframes aware that the drifter can do that?

[strange plinth]

there are convos with the hex that acknowledge both remembering past loops and forgetting them
so its a lore thing too

[silk atlas]

It's a lore thing

||Lizzie and Roathe even know something is up if you reset them||

[restive river]

You find out how the Drifter can reset the Protoframes via the Triad
||that being that Drifter resets them through the Helminth rather than the timeloop specifically||

[median turret]

Ohh i see thank you, i was wondering because i hadn't seen any of the protoframes mention it yet

[restive river]

Iirc Lettie mentions it if you’re dating

[median turret]

Alright I'll keep an eye out when i talk to her

[strange plinth]

there are later convos with arthur and quincy about it as well
very brief mention in one of amir's early chats? maybe aoi as well

[median turret]

Ouh okay pretty cool

[restive river]

I wanna say it comes up with Eleanor but maybe not

She does get an Eternalism experience instead tho
If you go down that route

[median turret]

Yeah I've seen that one

[blissful merlin]

One of my fav convos ever with her

[fast dew]

How many times have we all mentioned the orokin archives, its gotta be at least a hundred by now 😭

[strange turtle]

302

[twin wigeon]

302 mentions

[restive river]

Is that in this chat or the whole server

Also there’s a thing in game called the Orokin Archive iirc but that would be mentioned less for sure

[fast dew]

Mm, whole server has 403

A whole hundred more lmao

[south sun]

makes sense, though I'm surprised the orokin archive people don't try to get things over to the wiki

[fast dew]

The wiki people do that themselves lol

A lot of the quote pages are sourced from the archives a lot iirc

[south sun]

There can be gaps though, but it just seems strange the OA people don't simply work on getting things fully ported.

While the wiki has more overall, OA has some detailed things, though can still be tricky navigating between what is fully "fact" vs "assumed".

At least on the wiki can trace when an edit was made to understand context/timing of it.

[fast dew]

Theres... also not people

Iirc its one guy 😭 maybe 2? As far as I know its not a big group, if a group at all

[south sun]

Damn.
Even more of a reason to try and work with rather than in parallel to.

[fast dew]

Why are you so insistent about this? The wiki is a separate project from the archives, and the folk at the wiki can do it themselves

[strange turtle]

I mean some of us in the server help out sometimes I think, but yeah it’s mostly just Gray

[south sun]

?

It's just a conversation about it.

[restive river]

Well there’s only one Orokin Archive person and they’re still catching up with new content as they have their own life
The Wiki folks should maybe utilize the Archives to fix lore inaccuracies (though most of those are half baked theories they put on the wiki with nary a source)

There is an Orokin Archives community but like
That’s not our job

I do my part by hanging here, I’m not fussing with the wiki lmao

[fast dew]

I occasionally check the wiki, especially regarding Albrecht's shit

[fast dew]

https://tenor.com/view/im-doing-my-part-serious-stare-gif-11979677

[restive river]

My single contribution to the wiki, and idek if this is on the new one was regarding the Vagabond

[dire mountain]

Mine was for nightcap being called a fauna vendor

[restive river]

Wait
What

[dire mountain]

Yeah idk how someone messed that up 😭 he sells plants and fungi

[winged glen]

Hello Im a new player to WarFrame got 4.1 hours so far

[restive river]

This chat is for story/lore related spoilers, it’s best you steer clear unless you need a story/lore question answered, my best advice is to stay away til you’re caught up with the main quests

[humble sierra]

Welcome! As ducky said, you could get a few spoilers on these channels. The early game's story is certainly confusing, but over time everything starts clicking. Just keep following the Star Chart and playing the quests.

[lean garden]

My greatest contribution is deleting the insane statement that hunhow was dead and speaking from the grave

[restive river]

What 😭

[swift sentinel]

It's wrong, but in a poetically misleading way. Hunhow is a broken machine, speaking from the place he will never move from (probably).

[fast dew]

Hes figuratively dead!

[drowsy saddle]

he has ultra depression

"Tenno, I miss my wife"

[humble sierra]

"And daughter. And son. And that one edgy guy who was here doing my bidding."

[drowsy saddle]

drinking buddy

[lean garden]

while you can make the very apt poetic allusion, the wiki statement was being waaaaaay too literal LOL

[swift sentinel]

Yeah, I just thought it was funny how close to being right in how wrong they were.

[sharp breach]

https://discord.com/channels/552966801558863896/1470984306653397185

Is it a well known thing to call him wally?

Its the first ive ever heard but its so perfect

[humble sierra]

Yep, longtime community pet name

[sharp breach]

Thats awesome

[viscid aspen]

Do we know what happened to the Operator's Zariman? Because it's mentioned the ship was found adrift and the children rescued from it so the Orokin had possession of it, meaning the Zariman in present day is Drifter's because that one appeared back from the Void

[strange plinth]

the zariman that returns during angels is the operator's
drifter's zariman is visible in duviri

[viscid aspen]

Isnt the Origin Zariman and Duviri Zariman the same though? They're both plugging the same hole in reality

Like a mirror

[strange plinth]

somewhat
"This place is like an embassy. Playing host to misfit realities that were never chosen."
"Sharded causalities piled up in the Heilbronn margin, singularity refusing to play with any of them… oh, the Universe is a messy place."
both yonta quotes
they're both plugging the hole in the albrecht membrane because every zariman 10-0 is plugging the hole in the albrecht membrane

[topaz pawn]

it gets complicated because they're both the front half of the Zariman. there's "two" of them, but they are the same ship and are connected

its why the dormizone is accessible from both sides. going through the looking glass, in a way

[viscid aspen]

Yeah i picture it like this, same ship reflected in two places

[strange plinth]

drifter also mentions in a KIM convo that their zariman is likely the only thing left of their reality, having been pulled into duviri

[topaz pawn]

the Duviri Zariman is also notably more degraded and old looking than the one in the origin system

[viscid aspen]

But the Zariman the Orokin found isnt plugging the hole though, because the current Zariman wasnt in the Origin System until New War.

Unless the Orokin yeeted the ship back into the Void at some point after rescuing the Tenno. But if thats the case they havent told us

[topaz pawn]

I don't think they ever took it out of the void in the first place

[strange plinth]

it's been plugging the hole the entire time, but its been washing back and forth between origin and void
i think Quinn says it? i'll find the quote

[viscid aspen]

Its mentioned it was found adrift in space so it did come out of the void. If it was plugging the hole then they mustve sent it back for the New War stuff to make sense

[topaz pawn]

if it was coming in and out of the void then that would also make sense

[strange plinth]

ah it was. the same kim convo i already mentioned lol

[viscid aspen]

Ohhhhh

I dont think i had that convo with her, been a while though

[strange plinth]

eleanor r3c4, for reference

[dark compass]

One letter away from disaster

[midnight ice]

orb zariman

the zorb...

[restive river]

The Zariman is like the Operator and Drifter
Same ship

[restive river]

It being stuck is it plugging the hole, which is new

[restive river]

That’s more a disc
zariman frisbee

[midnight ice]

zariman plate

was it ever mentioned how depictions of the void turned from the vast white expanse dotted with pitch black stars to the foggy teal-dominated nebula it now is?

or are they two different things? layers? subjective perception? evolution?

[humble sierra]

https://www.reddit.com/r/WarframeLore/s/a9cGmhqTwb

Can yall help me here, it seems like this player has a lot of misconceptions

I wanted to answer what I could but I'm also at work

[dark compass]

"plotholes"
"Lack of characters from a specific faction in old peace (can be fixed with an update that expands on-"

This reads half like misunderstanding the story and half like a wishlist

[strange plinth]

'grineer bosses' ok? i guess? 'glassmaker' what would he be doing in tau lol. 'excalibur umbra' he's just some dax during the old peace ! if he was a favorite of ballas or whatever, he's probably not in the active warzone

this sure is a post huh

[midnight ice]

impressive having the sheer balls to be that wrong. Along wirh posting pixellated memes and call it pixel art. My goodness

[humble sierra]

Bro desperately needs to replay certain quests and look up lore because he's under the impression Margulis becomes Lotus

[dark compass]

I ate Margulis

[midnight ice]

we outta margulis

(suspiciously margulis shaped lotus)

[fast dew]

... that's certainly a thread name 😭

I do have a genuine question, how does one come to this conclusion?

[fast dew]

I can see Nihil being mentioned in a very offhanded way, by like. A dax who's scared of the consequences of what they're doing

[glass sluice]

There's kim conversations where you ask that exact question about Albrecht.

so it's not totally out of the blue.

[strange plinth]

maybe, ig? i'd imagine that jade light would still be mentioned before nihil though

[humble sierra]

Plus the "You Are Late"

[glass sluice]

That honestly tripped me up, hearing it later on too.

[fast dew]

I was unsure if Albrecht in the comic was. Albrecht, much like how the ARG Albrecht wasnt actually Albrecht

[humble sierra]

Plus Albrecht himself isn't even sure

[glass sluice]

I forget the place it was said, but someone else dropped that exact phrase.

[fast dew]

I mean? It was immediately explained by how the murmur overloaded the system, so I assumed that. Any anomalies came from that

Plus we saw his normal eyes + kalymos

[glass sluice]

Wally can hide the eyes though, it's shown at least a few times that they reveal them when it's dramatically appropriate.

[fast dew]

What?

[humble sierra]

Also Loid says something right after about Albrecht not ever smiling like that

[fast dew]

Only time he's done that was with Rulsalka, and thats. Thats a whole thing

[glass sluice]

my big question is: why protoframes exist.
no one seems to know, and I very much doubt we're getting an answer any time soon.

[strange plinth]

afaik the only exception to the eyes is Rusalka, and she's in a different situation
if you can see the eyes and they're not the purple-black orbs, it isn't wally

[humble sierra]

The vessels

[fast dew]

We don't know

[fast dew]

Ah, that came after

[humble sierra]

Yeah but for them

[strange plinth]

the idea for the vessels came after the protos had been made

[humble sierra]

Nvm

[fast dew]

No, the idea of the vessels came after the protos were made, Albrecht didnt even have the idea to make them large

[glass sluice]

Drifter specifically mentions that they thought it was just in case they couldn't get a frame through the helminth time portal thingy, but now they're not so sure.

arthur KIM conversation, early on.

[fast dew]

This is Albrecht we're talking about, we don't know a lot about his actions

I believe that the roundtable was an attempt at doing something good, much like the triad imo

[strange plinth]

-# n he sure as hell doesn't explain many of them in advance

[glass sluice]

that is honestly the big thing.
also, roathe flat-out promised to ||murder the entire entrati family when albrecht came back, loid included.|| So we may have to deal with that at some point.

[fast dew]

He explains some! Just in a private diary not many folk know about

[strange plinth]

if he's gone down the villain route, yea

[fast dew]

Thats the villain ending lol

[glass sluice]

then its canon for me

[fast dew]

Good ending has him ||protecting them with his life iirc||

[glass sluice]

cant stand that blue bugger

[fast dew]

Nor can I, mucking hate the bastard

But. Redeemed Roathe is important

[glass sluice]

not trying to endlessly complain or anything, but i really didnt like the convos with him about the murder of the orokin species.

[fast dew]

The whole triad was done so Albrecht could answer the question "can the orokin be forgiven". The question wasn't really meaning the orokin, he was meaning himself

[fast dew]

They're not a species, theyre a class/caste

[glass sluice]

obviously

[fast dew]

They're like. Giga elites

[strange plinth]

this thread is. devolving.

[fast dew]

Think the muskrat but thousands of em

[glass sluice]

im using it as a general term, rather than go for specific phrases that i cant remember right now.
like, that arena massacre had its own name but its been years since i read it

[fast dew]

Night of the naga drums?

Most of the orokin there deserved to be slaughtered ngl

They're child kidnapping, murdering monsters who kill things for pleasure

[midnight ice]

i always love repeating the Naberus story about how awful the orokin are

[fast dew]

Insert the bluva story
-# thats. Thats the right one, yeah?

[midnight ice]

yup!

[fast dew]

Mm. Stealing people and their bodies and mutilating them to wear as costumes mmm

[midnight ice]

mutilating and flaying them alive iirc? just for cheap scares at naberus night

[woven coyote]

Yup

[fast dew]

Yuppers

[strange plinth]

they. they're saying the orokin came from tau

[fast dew]

Lord

[humble sierra]

Albrecht should've tried putting this into the void to dumb down Wally instead of the Cavia

[midnight ice]

illiterate warframe player final boss

[fast dew]

[midnight ice]

they're gonna think the seriglass bell is a plothole and attempt to make up a way to "expand on it" so they won't try to open the hatch, itll be fine

[woven coyote]

The one time wally would make the void spit something out without changing anything

[fast dew]

No maybe it'll make wally angrier. How dare you send him a lobotomised brick 💔

[midnight ice]

dear god

speechless

[fast dew]

[strange plinth]

not the entire corpus is against us
they're merchants. they fight us when we get in their way

i'm.

[fast dew]

recruiting tag
not recruiting until the last sentence

[waxen mesa]

You don't take the orbiter to planets and the lander has stealth. Plus tenno attacks being a few minutes leaves little time for reinforcements

Bam. Solved. Goodnight

Plus the lander being fairly advanced compared to other non orokin ships

[fast dew]

Also do we think they'll give Loid some lines for naberus this year theyre not against adding stuff (like baro last year)

[midnight ice]

loid in a naberus costume what is he dressing up as

[waxen mesa]

Santoid

[fast dew]

Mm. Kavat. "man-cat"

[midnight ice]

kavat ear headbands..

[woven coyote]

Not loid jealous of kalymos lol

[fast dew]

Kaeli is supposed to be a kubrow, so they can match!

[fast dew]

I feel as if he did the kavat costume first, then drifter pointed it out and now he refuses

[glass sluice]

if they finally dress up fibonacci as a shark, my fanfiction will be complete

[woven coyote]

I could see that

[fast dew]

Do... do sharks still exist?

[glass sluice]

theyre in uranus, so yes

[woven coyote]

There is only one costume possible for fibbonacci and that is vampire

[glass sluice]

shark-like anyway

[woven coyote]

Lanx yeah

[fast dew]

Heh

Vampire fish

[glass sluice]

lotus showing up to the sanctum and complaining that fibo stole her costume

[woven coyote]

Fishtarion forever

[midnight ice]

he should get Astarion's shirt

[humble sierra]

Fishstarion combines with Viktor

Tattooed goth vampire fish

[midnight ice]

also sharrac?

[fast dew]

Forever funny to me that astarion's va does

Vampire
Fish
Evil fascist catboy twink

[glass sluice]

some would argue that's darvo and newbies buying his deals.
the naramon lens for plat was sold out the other day. poor new tenno.

darkvo

[fast dew]

Poor baby tenno.

[strange plinth]

-# we had evil baro last year, this year will be evil darvo

[glass sluice]

we need a shorthand for newbie tenno.
des2 has "new lights". we need something catchy.

[fast dew]

Man I cannot wait for devstream

[woven coyote]

Clem but trained by manics

[strange plinth]

i've heard 'dreamers' thrown around, but 'baby tenno' is most common i think

[woven coyote]

Baby tenno

[glass sluice]

dreamers just makes me think of nora's....eccentric performance.
baby tenno doesnt flow though, not "snappy"

[woven coyote]

It is what it is we never take anything seriously enough to do something like "new lights" eurgh i cringe just imagining someone saying that with a straight face

Look at our track record
Lotus lotus
Grate prime
Clem
John prodman
Potato

There was a short while where region chat called relics cabbages

[strange plinth]

ig they're kinda shaped like cabbages
too long though

[woven coyote]

The pizzas

Ajoll egg and bopp bipp

[fast dew]

They're like
Iceberg lettuce

[woven coyote]

Hell even cephalon fog shows we as a community cant stay serious for long

Good old days of the zariman arg devolving into the cult of fog

[fast dew]

The most serious we get is like. Keeping the secret of what CoH is like. And thats a big maybe

[dark compass]

He also played Heisenberg in RE8

[fast dew]

Thats even funnier lmfao

Albrecht's and Loid's VAs do audiobooks! Of. Questionable content.

[midnight ice]

destiny 2 has blueberries but thats a catch-all term for "random, usually newbie players"

ffxiv has sprouts

[dark compass]

All my teammates are BABIES

https://tenor.com/view/wooo-gif-13818320060559047800

[woven coyote]

Yeah was gonna say babies in caps is automatically read in heavy's voice

No other option exists

[glass sluice]

ferrror reliche

[fast dew]

Yk. The only other big fandom im in. Is like doom. And you don't see new players much, given its not really a multiplayer game series. It has capabilities but high chance in classic doom multiplayer, you knew each other

[glass sluice]

theres also the fact that doom actively insults people trying to play on a lower difficulty, despite that being an important option for accessibility.

[woven coyote]

Speaking of ever watched the live action meet the heavy with the actual voice actor?

[glass sluice]

right, lore-talk.

[fast dew]

I. I need you to run that by me again? A... early 90s game... makes a joke about being to young to die?

Thats lost on me chief

[dark compass]

Remember when they advertised dark souls invasions

[fast dew]

Really funny you say that actually, they deadass won an award at GOTY for accessibility 💀

[fast dew]

Hm?

[dark compass]

I'm pretty sure Eternal early on had a marketing campaign that talked about being able to "invade" other people's games

Playing as high tier demons

[fast dew]

OHHH

Yes! Empowered demons

[dark compass]

And all that remained of it is the Revenant scene for the super shotgun

[fast dew]

Good lord I hate eternal.

[fast dew]

Mm, we still have multiplayer where you play as the demons

[dark compass]

No invasions though

[glass sluice]

payday 3 was nominated for long term support awards. any of those award shows mean nothing.
but that's not exactly a hot take.
i guess to get back on topic: do we ever think that we're going to get to actually play the naga drums thingy?

[woven coyote]

That was a funny one yeah

[fast dew]

No.

[glass sluice]

I feel the Uriel bit at the end of Old Peace was a bit of a homage.

[fast dew]

Ehhh

[glass sluice]

if nowhere near as violent

or "arena filled with blood" ish

[fast dew]

Uriel's rage at the end of that wss far from the night of the naga drums, but it probably set something off later down the line.

But I doubt we'll play it.

[midnight ice]

would be siiiiiiick if we could

[dark compass]

To close the "it shouldn't have happened", Baldur's Gate 3 won best multiplayer the year it came out, even though it hasn't been working properly until like half a year ago

[woven coyote]

Maybe we could get a dark refractory naga drums

[fast dew]

We are supposed to be asleep.

[glass sluice]

I honestly doubted we'd ever see Tau, so I'm not saying "never" to anything at this point.

[glass sluice]

exactly, its the best multiplayer. because it doesnt have any.

[midnight ice]

dark refract naga drums
the farmable gamemode is just a Taiko arcade

[glass sluice]

solo forever! 💪

[dark compass]

Legally distinct taiko ludoplex pls

[strange plinth]

i personally don't think so, and i don't think it should ever be shown in detail, either

[dark compass]

Make it Octavia themed

[midnight ice]

legally distinct not!freedom dive in legally distinct not!taiko ludoplex

[glass sluice]

Descendia could have us just repeatedly murdering ballas with increasingly blunt objects, and people still wouldn't play it if the loot was as bad as it is now.

[dark compass]

They hired a whole game studio to develop caliber chicks

They can do it again

[viscid aspen]

As much as I would love that, i dont think DE is capable of the large scale presentation that would make the Night of Naga Drums justice

[glass sluice]

They already reached perfection with Wyrmius, no hiring necessary.

[dark compass]

Vallis Undermind... Descendia...

Maybe one day we will get Overmind and Ascendia

[glass sluice]

In 2015 I'd have agreed with you.

[dark compass]

Yeah I think they can pull it off

[fast dew]

They mentioned that doom insults players who need it slower (im to young to die is apparently an insult and not. A common phrase), yet ig when TDA actually improved on that, and made it more accessible for players like me who need certain aspects slower, it doesn't mean anything bcs it won an award

Anyways. Lore.

[glass sluice]

We're going to get to finally fight Wally, open a door and it's just the Soulframe intro.

psyche, your WF account gets deleted. you play soulframe now.

[dark compass]

Waiting for inevitably having Herzog voice Wally speaking english

[fast dew]

God lord he was a jumpscare and a half

[glass sluice]

I actually thought that Herzog was going to voice Albrecht.

[dark compass]

Him being a guest to narrate the trailer was not a huge thing, he likes random cameos

[viscid aspen]

Wally when he knows of Orion/Sirius:

[dark compass]

But then he says the "me" thing

That was a jumpscare and a half

[fast dew]

Do not let him see the baby. He might isolate and manipulate the baby

Again

[glass sluice]

he honestly looks kinda similar to old albie'

[dark compass]

https://tenor.com/view/werner-herzog-herzog-werner-if-a-dog-sitting-gif-15569692

[viscid aspen]

Plot twist: he's voicing Nitohk

[glass sluice]

new ordis voice.

[fast dew]

Id genuinely love that

[viscid aspen]

Would be peak

[glass sluice]

god, imagine him making the bad puns.

[fast dew]

Show more weird gender shit with the orokin DE I demand it

[dark compass]

She's just a really heavy smoker

[glass sluice]

@fast dew i mean, roathe tells us a story in his KIM about taking over a female body. so theres precedent.

[fast dew]

Yes. I am aware.

[viscid aspen]

FemRoathe

[glass sluice]

i tell you, replaying these KIM's have given me such a weird perspective

[midnight ice]

orokin jade light top surgery

send post

[dark compass]

Froathe

[fast dew]

The orokin widely did not care for gender norms, but only in regards to their own caste, it seems.

[viscid aspen]

glassing bottom surgery

lil trophy

[glass sluice]

im not sure if this is lore related, but this channel seems to be vague at best.
did anyone else expect the grineer captain guy on the old peace poster to be a protoframe rhino?

[fast dew]

Albrecht big naturals!
-# this. This has happened 3 times.

[strange plinth]

there was a feminine name but no description iirc
still possible but not confirmed

[fast dew]

Help me.

[midnight ice]

average sized trophy

[glass sluice]

he says "she" or "her".

if she identifies like that, its good enough for me

[midnight ice]

would be neat

[strange plinth]

"Maryna. You gave me your body. Together, in that trench, we drank Kuva. My hands shook and my gashed throat leaked, but I kept enough drops down for it to take.
I remember your last salute. The fading. Then I blinked open the eyes that had been yours, and saw my gutted corpse dead in the mud."
he does not

[glass sluice]

theres more to the convo than that last line. im 100% sure a gendery thing is mentioned. i made a mental note of it at the time.

[fast dew]

I am so glad my kimchat almost never broke and I got Loid up to the family on the first try

[strange plinth]

the next bit is about Rostig, a grineer that stayed at his turret while on fire
the bit before was Traivon, a railjack pilot that sacrificed themselves to allow Roathe's escape

[glass sluice]

i had thought before that it was locked to similar body types, which is why i was so surprised at the time

my kimchat went weird, i had to get marie+lyon to convince roathe, then i did the descendia boss grind and roathe was talking about going to do the upstairs things.

[fast dew]

Nah it wasn't restricted body types. They just preferred certain ones

[viscid aspen]

This made me wonder if an old decrepit orokin got a younger body from the yuvan theatre, regretted it/didnt like it a day or so later, and went back to get another. How many lives they mustve taken out of pure, inhuman vanity

"Can the orokin ever be forgiven?" F NO

[fast dew]

That question isnt about the orokin btw

[dark compass]

No, please, less protoframes, no protoframes, stop printing them to bait people into playing the game, they lost all their luster please get out of myheadgetoutofmyheadgetoutofmyhead

[glass sluice]

oooookay

[fast dew]

Only proto ill accept is protoloid

[glass sluice]

you need a timeout, amir

[dark compass]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-cat-crazy-cat-cry-gif-25695744

[dark compass]

Same

[midnight ice]

beaming into your skull vanguard protoframes

[viscid aspen]

Ikik but the very concept of such a thing

[dark compass]

We have a perfect plan

[strange plinth]

ya, ballas was going to use yareli as a yuvan until she disrespected the kuva and she got helminth'd instead

[dark compass]

https://tenor.com/view/exploding-cat-cat-car-meow-explosion-gif-13527070362113797677

[fast dew]

Its genuinely so obvious thats what gonna happen

[viscid aspen]

Butbutbutbut

Yareli Protoframe

[glass sluice]

ballas was going to use US as a transfer if we failed in that objective.
he aint that picky

[fast dew]

He wanted to be a little girl. Mm.

[viscid aspen]

https://tenor.com/view/yareli-yareli-prime-warframe-gif-16368497040556827899

[strange plinth]

tbf it doesn't matter much for a group of people who can bodymod to that extent

[fast dew]

Theres also the chance he'd just. Change into a more fitting yuvan

[glass sluice]

jokes on ballas, he can have the new face system, im still my old drifter back in duviri

[viscid aspen]

Waitaminute, would he have gained void powers or are our abilities tied more to our soul

[fast dew]

Mm.

[glass sluice]

nah, think of it like a skin suit. like the bug in men in black.

[fast dew]

Thats not a question I want to know the answer to

[glass sluice]

i like to think kuva transfer looks like that

[sharp breach]

Wait i thought it was the grineer queens that wanted to transfer to our body. Balas too?!

[viscid aspen]

Makes sense

[strange plinth]

given that we can turn our body into energy (or whatever the hell void form is), i'd say its more tied to the 'soul' than the body

[viscid aspen]

Iirc he threatened us with it if we failed to protect him during The Old Peace

[glass sluice]

well, his cepha did threaten us

[fast dew]

Ive quickly learned that asking questions that could have weird answers never ends well.

[glass sluice]

i dont think ballas was all that picky

[fast dew]

Thank you, Rebecca.

[strange plinth]

Palanquin: "Be aware that I am authorized to perform emergency Continuity to save Orokin lives, and you are the only potential Yuvan in the vicinity."
only plays if the palanquin hits 10% health i believe?

[sharp breach]

Oh so you can fail protecting him. weird

[glass sluice]

i got it as close as i could, honest.
blue buggers.

[dark compass]

The horse of continuity:

[viscid aspen]

Emergency Continuity but it still gotta be the kid smh

Not even a dax soldier

[sharp breach]

People who pre watched players and realized its balas only for them to be threatened with that lol

[glass sluice]

you can find out for yourself today/tomorrow when its replayable

[fast dew]

-# WHAT DOES SHE MEAN BY FLOCK ARRRRHHHHH

Rebecca

[dark compass]

Birds

[fast dew]

Rebecca Rebecca Rebecca

[strange plinth]

careful, you'll summon her

[viscid aspen]

I cant wait

[glass sluice]

Rebb went to australia and now we're closer to getting bird companions.
I'm 1 step closer to having a pet magpie!

[fast dew]

Yes I saw her in Australia

[midnight ice]

modular binbird

[viscid aspen]

Inb4 quokkaframe

[fast dew]

You don't want a pet magpie. Not because theyre violent. Because they're loud

[dark compass]

Built in silence as an ability

[glass sluice]

nah, i feel them every day.

[viscid aspen]

Fr?

[dark compass]

Everyone goes deaf

[fast dew]

Yeah lol

[viscid aspen]

Awesome lol

[glass sluice]

like, literally.
they bring their babies in the spring. Super friendly if you supply food.

[viscid aspen]

Awe

[glass sluice]

its friggin adorable.

[fast dew]

They're cute when you dont have to live with them

person who has lived with a rescued magpie

[glass sluice]

nah, they're fine.
if they like you, they make clucking noises, its their purr

[fast dew]

You become viscerally aware of how much meat they like.

[dark compass]

Mag... Pie

[glass sluice]

australia maggie, yeah. not the british kind.

[viscid aspen]

I read that as they purr and i was like

[glass sluice]

think of it like a purr, but with bounces

[fast dew]

:D

[viscid aspen]

Cute

[viscid aspen]

So luckyyyy i wanna meet them all

[fast dew]

I also met Ticker's VA, Guy

Funny name, heh

[glass sluice]

i am so jealous, i live so darn close to brissie

[fast dew]

:DD

I lived nowhere close to Melbourne

I caught a 5 hour train for this

[glass sluice]

medical stuff, cant travel. very annoyed RN

[fast dew]

Worth it

[viscid aspen]

I have the plushie right next to navigation and listen to it sometimes

[fast dew]

I shouldn't travel, medically wise

I just do because thats what folk with fibro do

I felt the punishment later though

I couldn't move for an entire day after 💀

[glass sluice]

I'd have gone if it was anything less than death, ngl

[humble sierra]

Me too! Just wanted to brag. Also met Thomas there lmao

[fast dew]

Yea!! I was yapping so hard
-# I talk a lot when im anxious

[humble sierra]

Guys does anyone have a quote that just unequivocally states that the Orokin are humans with modifications

Yes it's to do with that chain

https://www.reddit.com/r/WarframeLore/s/1Wt8LR9jNT

[midnight ice]

ech, its such a common knowledge that everybody's parroting the point with no hard quote

one second

[fast dew]

Ordan getting offered to become an orokin?

That should work

[midnight ice]

though there is an unequivocal bit that the grineer were "human stock"

[strange plinth]

the op replying to one of my points, "25 who are the Bloom Guardians and where were they were Adis died? where were they when the Tauron space station was having a whole free for all? what battlefield were they on during perita rebellion? they're random no names that do nothing for the story at all. Boreal and Nira are the archons, they just named the dog after Amar that's it. it would have been great if the archons actually showed up here instead of getting jumped during archon hunts, but here were talking about how they were mentioned one time."
what.

[fast dew]

Ive gotten out the drinks for this shit holy christ

Too sober for this

[midnight ice]

oh godddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddd

[strange plinth]

why would Amar, the wolf-like sentient shown in the old peace, not be Amar, the Wolf, the Archon
they're the same damn thing

[midnight ice]

this has to be a really long winded bait

like a very elaborate bait

[strange plinth]

i want it to be. but bait usually doesn't have this much conviction behind it

[midnight ice]

its hitting all the "are you actually a sentient being?" talking points. its in one lore tidbit somewhere that amar was desecrated to become the archon

[strange plinth]

when they're 'introduced' by hunhow, he mentions that they're "hybrid abominations raised from the blighted battlefields where sentient and warframe fell" or whatever

[midnight ice]

the... the bloom guardians... were on the field... protecting... the.. blooms..... and we aren't where the blooms were (that main ceremonial area, i forgot the name) when the whole ordeal with Adis went down....

theyre called.. bloom guardians.. because they... they guardians the bloom...

[strange plinth]

and why would they go to tauron academy first if they went on the offensive (because no more blooms to guard)

[midnight ice]

one second

is this spoiler talk territory?

post tnw and all

[strange plinth]

we're in lore chat, doesn't matter

[midnight ice]

what! what! what! wh

what!

yes the operator was jxtmjdtnjdjrjrjrndtkidktmgmdkt

[strange plinth]

man i wanted to play stellaris now i have to reply to this guy again /s

[humble sierra]

"Fixed if the writers knew how to use dialogue and stopped over complicating the story" buddy I think it could be fixed if you played the futzing game

and paid attention

[dark compass]

They're laughing at you up there, kiddo

[fast dew]

Literally why would nihil even be remotely important? Again, could be mentioned as a offhanded "ohh hes the bogeyman who turns people to glass", but that would feel cheap.

[dark compass]

This whole list is just a wishlist of "what I wanna see"

90% of "fixes" is just an update wishlist

[humble sierra]

Or just missing stuff that's super obvious in the game

[midnight ice]

why is varzia.. relevant..

erra mogged her once and thats about all she's done

[dark compass]

Retired

[fast dew]

Ive noticed this happens a lot. Specifically with umbra

[dark compass]

Here's my list of things I think are missing from the plot that are important

Vial Rush augment
Kuva Javlok
Tau railjack content
Voruna protoframe
Tenet exerg-

https://tenor.com/view/orange-cat-gets-flung-and-explodes-orange-cat-funny-cat-meme-explodes-gif-10706110874965244466

[drowsy saddle]

Tenet tenet Ambassador

[fast dew]

Here's my list of things missing from warframe that are integral to the story

Varzia kissing Maroo
Albrecht kissing Loid
Gerivaine - what does she look like??
Albrecht's kids - mpreg??
More nihil content
Albrecht redesign - he doesn't need to fit into 1999 any more
Loid proto

-# can you tell what I like the most

[strange plinth]

i wonder

[fast dew]

Hmm what an impossible question

[drowsy saddle]

G A Y

[unique aspen]

A mystery...

[fast dew]

Couldn't possibly tell you all

[strange plinth]

only mildly related, has the tales of duviri book ever been mentioned being outside of the zariman? not including duviri itself obv
with its whole thing being teaching children to not accidentally CE anything, i feel like it wouldn't be anywhere else?
-# you can probably guess why i'm asking.

[drowsy saddle]

Albrecht

[fast dew]

Yeah, i don't think its mentioned? Albrecht talks about it but thats also while he was in duviri

-# I actually dont know why youre askin

[strange plinth]

ik there's the one in the netracells but i don't think it goes beyond there and the zariman
thanks
-# the reddit thread. OP's claiming duviri is a widely known storybook that random anarch dax could reasonably mention instead of 'the tenno are a myth'

[fast dew]

Ah.

[fast dew]

Why would a dax know a children's book likely written while they were a grown adult???????

[glass sluice]

damn right I am.

[glass sluice]

Plenty of kids books become popular in general culture.

plus, remember that it was written as propaganda for the younger generations.

[strange plinth]

wasn't really propaganda, though?

[glass sluice]

Subtle propaganda is how those things work.
this is touching a lot on IRL stuff that I do not want to discuss, so I'll just say that they're well made.

[south sun]

Easy example: mtx in games

[glass sluice]

Sure that works, and is much less historically horrifying.

I guess for a WF example, think about the whole profit/prophet thing for the corpus.

[south sun]

Yep, though still has a lot of dark connections, just not as bad... relatively.

[midnight ice]

my list, personally:

1. harrow skin
2. harrow skin
3. harrow skin
4. harrow heirloom
5. harrow deluxe again
6. harrow skin
7. harrow skin

[unique aspen]

I'm basically just excited for lots more Sentient stuff in Tau. No notable plot holes I want patching, just happy to dive into the big new thing.

[fast dew]

... it was a child's book about managing emotions. I. Dont think that's propaganda?

information, especially of a biased or misleading nature, used to promote a particular cause, doctrine, or point of view.

If thats the definition of propaganda, duviri doesn't really meet it imo

[dark compass]

Emotional maturity is propaganda /s

[topaz pawn]

that's what Big Feelings wants you to think

[fast dew]

Big feelings wants me to control my feelings!! So I should. Uh. Get overwhelmed and put another chair in the wall!!

[tall echo]

Try to hit wally

[fast dew]

Ill try

[strange turtle]

Theres also just. Other places on Perita and in Tau?

“Where were they”
Literally anywhere else

[midnight ice]

new concept: things can be at multiple locations

[strange turtle]

Hell, Duviri is probably like, one of the healthiest and helpful sources of information most of the kids will even read

Aside from emotional control it’s teaching stuff like empathy and understanding that other peoples experiences and perception of things are valid and meaningful to them

The closest any other Orokin stuff has come to that is the thing about envy being bad (because it’s bad for the empire)

[fast dew]

Its hard to believe that an orokin wrote it, but i suppose that just shows how well Albrecht/Loid raised Mother

[surreal halo]

Wait so you are telling me that mother made Duviri

[strange plinth]

she wrote the book, albrecht told her the stories

[fast dew]

She wrote the book, yes

Albrecht made the stories and characters for her, for her childhood stories

[humble sierra]

She was able to apply the conceptual embodiment theories to the book to help explain to children why keeping their emotions in check was important, especially in the Void

[fast dew]

And i think thats admirable of her

[humble sierra]

I took another look at that thread and I can't believe I fell for the ragebait

It has to be bait, of course, that's the only rational explanation

[strange plinth]

they've started saying "its not that deep"
so either it was always bait or it certainly is now

[fast dew]

Just think its bait for your own mental health

[strange plinth]

either way, not worth my time anymore

[fast dew]

Convince yourself this is bait for your mental health my friends

[humble sierra]

I feel like Arthur when It Cures kicks in

Revived

[fast dew]

Real as shit lowkey

[ocean geyser]

Just saw that post yall were arguing over
Good lord people really can’t read

[restive river]

What
What even

What’s Xaku gonna do???
Assuming I was looking at the same one but
What??

[fast dew]

Maybe they're just a xaku fan??

[restive river]

They mentioned Revenant too
I think they’re just going off frames with a connection to the Orokin or the Void

[fast dew]

All warframes have a connection to the void and the orokin.

THEY'RE MADE BY AN OROKIN AND POWERED BY VOID CHILDREN.

Lord

[restive river]

I do wonder what events had already happened by the time of the Old Peace
Like Parvos wanting Protea already happened
Did the Entrati Void Expeditions already happen?
Does Xaku Prime exist yet? (You use default Trumna apparently??)

[fast dew]

Oh word?

[restive river]

I meant a more defined connection than that lol

[fast dew]

Swore it was trumna prime

[restive river]

Xaku is from the Void Expeditions (they’re the Entrati frame!)
Revenant Prime was birthed via the Void, somehow???
So that’s. Something

[restive river]

Finally got another friend to play it and uh. Nope, it’s default

[fast dew]

Oh wtf 😭

[strange turtle]

Icl I forgot theres a Prime

[fast dew]

Mm, Im unsure if knowing when Xaku did the whole. Xaku deal really would tell us anything, but it would be neat

[strange turtle]

-# Wouldn’t be surprised if DE did too

[fast dew]

They deadass mightve

[restive river]

I mean I want to know more about the void expeditions
But my point is more so if their prime has happened yet

Xaku is very likely a form of conceptual embodiment, Revenant Prime may be too
So that’s uh. A connection, ig :p
no idea how those would be relevant or help during the Old Peace but yeah

[fast dew]

Im still a firm believer that the entrati family brung Xaku to Ballas to be primed over Albrecht just. Randomly being able to do that himself

[restive river]

Albrecht designed Qorvex
He can design a prime

I do think Albrecht would want to examine Xaku if he caught word of them

Or his daughter would at least

I’m unsure if she knows the requiems but I can totally see her commissioning Xaku Prime aswell as being the one to name them and their abilities

[fast dew]

I mean, there's designing and theres making a prime. Which is different imo

[restive river]

I do wonder how Xaku got their name and abilities
But I could even see a Tenno using transference on them and finding it out that way, with Xaku telling them

[solar salmon]

I wonder if it'd be pure coincidence that they echo a requiem poem or if she knows of them

[fast dew]

But this is an agree to disagree moment

[restive river]

Oh no for sure, but my case is that Albrecht would have zero issue with making a frame as he literally makes giant ones and even alters the formula for normal ones

The Orokin in general are smart
Albrecht seems even smarter
I do not put it past his abilities to be able to do it

The main issue would actually be his motivations for doing it

Which even for the rest of the family we have to ultimately speculate

[fast dew]

I do find it really really funny that Albrecht managed to make essentially warframes but seemingly not a ticking timebomb about to go insane (in reference to the vessels, not the protos)

[restive river]

I’m glad you specified, one of those is exactly that

[fast dew]

I do want to know how he managed that, the vessels not going insane

[restive river]

But yeah, maybe due to their unfinished nature they’re. Dormant??
But they’re still infested so like

[fast dew]

Maybe cuz its not based on a human body??

[restive river]

The Vessels are in fact chillin

[solar salmon]

the grey strain is chill as hell as an innate thing I guess isnt it chill towards the void also or am I misremembering

[fast dew]

The meat of the infestation seems to be on the outside, over the inside?

[restive river]

It’d still be mostly infested tissue and they still have human DNA in them to some extent

[fast dew]

Nah, the greystrain isnt, its the helminth that is

[restive river]

Granted that’s more so for the bio connection to the protos for
Transference time travel ig

Helminth is the chill one and even it goes wack

[fast dew]

Im thinking because it lacks a human brain, it cant go insane like the warframes?

[restive river]

Could be actually!

While they have human DNA and are modeled after humans they don’t have normal human parts

[solar salmon]

I mean its possibly because its not people and its more or less printed bodies like our warframes

[fast dew]

Realistically thats the only real difference, the lack of a human body as a seed

[solar salmon]

theres nothing there

[restive river]

Would androids be the proper term?
Infested androids?

[restive river]

The printed frames still have remnants of their personalities

[fast dew]

Ehh, can't copied warframes still go insane?

[restive river]

Umbra:

Yes he’s special cause his bolt but he’s still a fabrication with memories

[fast dew]

They still have the human body inside, just. 3d printed over grown like a person

[restive river]

Yup

Well not Xaku they’re uh
They’re different

[fast dew]

They're multiple human bodies!!

Yayyy :DDD

[restive river]

The copies we make are 1:1
i do theorize the reason the sapient ones we replicate are affixed with a bolt to suppress them but that’s a theory

[strange turtle]

Maybe he used the “templates” from frames for the neural stuff, and just excluded/ “hollowed out” the people parts?

[restive river]

More so the skin ig lol

[glass sluice]

You really need to look more into how that stuff works.

[restive river]

They have hearts
But they are void hearts so maybe thats more required than say, a stomach

[strange turtle]

Or maybe on that scale you can just, create the brain/equivalent much more easily since it doesn’t need to be as complex, especially since they’re intended to be piloted from the start

[glass sluice]

Although that response does explain a lot about the kinda responses I see online to stuff.

[fast dew]

... im using the literal definition of propaganda, and a story about how to manage your own emotions isnt matching up.

[restive river]

Oh wait were y’all talking about if Duviri is propaganda

[glass sluice]

It's not a matter of "if".

[fast dew]

The book of Duviri is propaganda ig?

[restive river]

Yeah no I can see that

Like
To an extent purely in the fact it’s this weird sorta fantasy idealized everyone’s an Orokin culture

[fast dew]

Yeah, i can see that, sure

[strong viper]

Yeah like almalexias bedtime stories

[solar salmon]

im just assuming albrecht has a different understanding of cloning and managed to make purely just blank vessels out of necessity, we dont see the fused together organs and such as the spare parts for the vessels are kinda strewn about the laboratories in instances

[restive river]

The people go about Orokin hobbies, they have Orokon ideals, the long arms, the blue skin all with a weird fantasy twist of
They have a singular ruler and there’s dragons

[fast dew]

But genuinely they seem to think the meaning behind duviri is... propaganda for. Something

[restive river]

As Thomas said they also just aren’t human

[fast dew]

I don't think they ever specified

What thing its pushing

[restive river]

Iirc the Orokin had mostly tamed the infestation, or could via bio-engineering

[strong viper]

Duviri is just a dagath, a mirror which accuses

[restive river]

It’s not pushing anything beyond “orokin society and culture good” ig
The main messages of the book are in regards to regulating emotions, that’s why it was made

[glass sluice]

There are literally bits in it about how you should feel honoured to be chosen to be a choice for Yuvan, how you should make sure you are at the peak of physical condition, and be perfectly clean at all times, just in case you're chosen.

[fast dew]

... thats not the book

Thats not from the book holy christ

[glass sluice]

I didn't say the book, I said in Duviri.

[strong viper]

The book was like one fish two fish lmao

[fast dew]

Thats from the zariman

That shit is from the zariman

The literal propaganda machine

[glass sluice]

You need to learn to read responses fully before you explode in pointless anger.

[strange turtle]

Not very good propaganda when it preaches stuff that’re out of place with 99% of what we’ve seen of the Orokin Empire, and Thrax being presented as an Orokin/equivalent while being what he is

The Calaventi were proud. They considered themselves reflections of the 'true' Orokin, and though they bent the knee to Thrax, they did not respect him.

With his changeable moods and his short stature, Thrax was – they whispered – merely an upstart, an imitator.

[fast dew]

Not from the book of Duviri

[fast dew]

I was talking about the book???

[strong viper]

And culturally felt very dax

[fast dew]

Next time specify if you're talking about the book of Duviri, or the world of Duviri

WHICH COMES FROM THE BOOK

Good lord.

[glass sluice]

You remind me of someone from another server I'm with lore talk.
Like, I take it seriously too, but I'm not going to swear and explode in anger if someone has a different point of view to mine.

[fast dew]

Oh no

Oh no a person is frustrated

[glass sluice]

Chill mate, it's just a game.

[fast dew]

Bevause for some reason people cannot separate their terms

Its like that one person who did "Albrecht's logs" okay damn which one

[glass sluice]

Are you arguing with yourself now, because no one else will?

[strong viper]

No we call that Duviri

[fast dew]

Unfortunately, this shit isn't just a game for me

[fast dew]

...no if I wanted an argument, id argue with ducky.

[strong viper]

I give your squinty eyes a nice blue flower in this trying time

[glass sluice]

Yep, you really do feel like an alt for that other person.
hawk', is that you?

[strange turtle]

It’d also be very odd for it to be propaganda considering weird out of place woman from the weird out of place family wrote it

[solar salmon]

lowk called duviri propaganda then told someone to be more educated about propaganda then went well I wasnt talking about duviri when the storybook being propaganda point wasnt applicable in the situation

sinking ship of an argument

[strong viper]

Haha sinking ship

[glass sluice]

I said text in duviri was propaganda, i never said the childrens book was.
I see this place likes to use big words to seem smarter.

[fast dew]

Thank you for the flower, thats actually the background to my puter

[strong viper]

A sinking ship of thesus looking for a sunken cost fallacy

[solar salmon]

what big word did I use 😭

[strange turtle]

…in what world are these big words 😭

Also do you mean

The Tablets

[glass sluice]

@strange turtle Considering what I've seen on this server just today, any word above 3 letters is big for here.

[solar salmon]

the tablets definitely were I get that I just dont get how it relates to storybooks being propaganda in real world

[strange turtle]

Yk you’re not responding very maturely yourself for someone whose so critical of the other side

[fast dew]

Maybe you were just friends with an autistic person and didn't realise that their special interests actually affect them? Like... like mine does?

[opaque zenith]

Lohk (combusts)

[fast dew]

Thats why this stuff isnt just a game for me

Its genuinely all i can think about

[strong viper]

I have a few lores where i hyperfocus a bit, warframe is aming the few.

[fast dew]

And so I get excited, loud, frustrated over these topics

[glass sluice]

Someone else who takes something too seriously does not mean that everyone else needs to take abuse when it's hurled at them.

[strong viper]

Also elder scrolls, fallout, and used to be fromsoft too but not anymore

[glass sluice]

I do need to get back into the TES lore, been too long since I dabbled

[fast dew]

See its just warframe and doom for me, its kinda exhausting

[solar salmon]

if we said it from (big word incoming) a metanarrative way of the writers putting literal propaganda in the form of those slates into an orokin self help book as a critical take on the real world usage of story books id get it

[strong viper]

Esp when warframe is written as live action serials, so basically tv show

[fast dew]

Also I just blocked them because I think they thought doom was the game that insulted you for playing on a lower level (it doesnt, that's wolfenstein, from memory), and i cant tolerate stuff like that

[strange turtle]

Never said you needed to. If your only other option from that is to “just take it” it might be best to just stop engaging at all, at least for a bit

[strong viper]

If you have any questions i am very knowledgeable

Been frequenting UESP and TILcord for years

[solar salmon]

tes lore is so good I sure hope they dont fumble the next entry

[strong viper]

One might hope. seethe

[restive river]

I wonder which of the Seven was in charge of propaganda

[strong viper]

Ballas lmao

[solar salmon]

yeah

[fast dew]

I need you to find where I hurled abuse at you brother because ive just. Expressed frustration?

[restive river]

Yeah I can see that

[strange turtle]

Tbh I feel like Scarne would be

[fast dew]

Anyways

I feel as if it was Tuvul

[restive river]

Though the Zariman tablets may be from Tuvul since
Zariman is his

[strong viper]

Oh yeah tuvul good one

[fast dew]

Hey same thought

[restive river]

They’re all just so scummy lmao

[fast dew]

He bullshits so much

[solar salmon]

they all seem to be somewhat invested as theyre figureheads of the empire

[strong viper]

I imagine if they were assassinating one another it was really a dragons den as far as propaganda goes

[restive river]

Speaking of
When we gonna see the Emperors

[glass sluice]

@strange turtle I only got about half of that, but sure.
@strong viper I actually am a very old hat at UESP, used to have the books downloaded on my phone lol.
but i havent really gotten into the heavy stuff since skyrim, then later on ESO, but it's hard to tell if all that is going to count.

[solar salmon]

but the emperors probably did a lot of that as like their main job

[fast dew]

Im shocked that they brought them back

[strong viper]

Eso is heavily canon

[strange turtle]

Not because he’s smart but he feels like the only one who could detach himself enough to put himself in the right shoes to make it really effective and adapt it

[fast dew]

Old lore revived

[restive river]

What’s next? The Arcane Machine?

[fast dew]

Nihil............

[restive river]

He

[glass sluice]

I was part of its beta, but sorta fell off after a while. The expansions were a bit pricy for my poor tastes.

[restive river]

HES IN A BOTTLE

[opaque zenith]

Kappa beacons back

[fast dew]

LET A MAN DREAM.

[strong viper]

Nihil was a propgander before taking up his Yamako syandana

[fast dew]

LET A MAN DREAM DUCKY

[strong viper]

And going all Street Justice behind the seven

[restive river]

WHATS HE GONNA DO

[fast dew]

HES GONNA.

[solar salmon]

like queen elizabeth popping up at some event for people to clap their hands to but being more or less useless as far as hard power goes unlike the executors

[strange turtle]

Maybe Nitokh too but considering, well, her everything, I doubt she’d go for the task

[restive river]

Nothin

[strong viper]

GONNA.

[fast dew]

Uh. HES GONNA DO SOMETHING

[strong viper]

He's simply GONNA.

[fast dew]

JUST YOU WAIT

[restive river]

Cause he’s a BROKEN MIND in a BOTTLE

[strange turtle]

Oh they didn’t really do much of anything

[glass sluice]

If I have a nihil bottle in my orbiter, and the backrooms. Does that mean that nihil is split up, or did we just get souveneirs and the actual nihil is in a vault somewhere?

[fast dew]

HES GONNA BREAK THAT BOTTLE

[strong viper]

Forever glassed eternalistically in that GONNA

[strange turtle]

They were on ice, sleeping the centuries away

[strong viper]

He's GONNA.

[restive river]

He’s a cephalon
Sooo

[strange turtle]

Probably got deposed and just kept as figureheads

[glass sluice]

ahah, so thats how this whole thing started. we take him back to 1999, then his bottle gets found by the orokin later and they make up this whole story to explain it.

[restive river]

What

[fast dew]

Hed be dead lmfao

[strong viper]

Wrong orokin

[restive river]

Say psyche rn

[glass sluice]

its either that or we bought our bottle at a gift shop

[fast dew]

The nukes would destroy him first

[glass sluice]

he was in a fridge

[restive river]

There is at least 18 of them

a fridge can handle like 1
not at least 18

[strong viper]

That only works in indiana jones and the ncr

[fast dew]

And thats assuming that theyre using traditional atom bombs

[fast dew]

And the commonwealth

[glass sluice]

the one in fallout was honestly funny, because that fridge had a vent hole at the back.

[strong viper]

Wait, 4 did the gag too? Lmao

[strange turtle]

Which makes their appearing in the Stalker codex kinda funny

“There was a big war, we won, heres your leaflet about what happened. Speech is in an hour, you’re gonna award them”

proceed to die not even a day after getting out of cryo

[solar salmon]

sometimes when Im bored I dip my nihils oubliette into the void and he screams loud as hell

[strong viper]

Oh right ghoul boy. Yeah true

[glass sluice]

that one BoS guy opens the door and maxxy is just all crispy

[fast dew]

Yuep, down south

[restive river]

I do hope we get to see the radiation wars
Like
What’s up with that lephantis guy

Random name drop for someone we don’t even know about

[fast dew]

Why is the big infested guy also named that
-# he is right im not insane

[restive river]

Ambrosias iirc

[glass sluice]

I do wish the game did a better job at differentiating between operator and drifter in the kim convos.
Like, so many times drifter talks from the point of the operator.
I get why, but they are not the same person.

[restive river]

He’s talked about with the Arctic Hive cluster

[strong viper]

Idk but it reminds me of elephantitis

[fast dew]

.. well. They were until the split

[solar salmon]

drifter probably got the transference lore drop they gave arthur when they connected

[fast dew]

Before the zariman incident they are

[solar salmon]

so the memories probably felt lived

[glass sluice]

thats the clone question.
if you date your clone, is it yourself or a different person.

[restive river]

Same person, different experiences

[restive river]

Biologically it’s you so they became your identical twin essentially

[strong viper]

I gave my op void strain scarring but drifter just has pretty face paint, like duviri made her adapt

[glass sluice]

theres a really fun old-old cracked article on that topic. its a fun read if its still online

[solar salmon]

I gave em really shiny voidy eyes and drifter's kinda normal similarly

[glass sluice]

Yes you are biologically identical, but only up to a point, your environment and experiences change you, and you dont share memories.
so its more like a sibling

[restive river]

I gave them different eye effects to reflect what they went through

[strong viper]

Oh yeah, marika eyes on mine

Slightly greener on drifter

[glass sluice]

train man is live!

[strong viper]

Her energy is fae coded and she runs vazarin

So it fits

[restive river]

I forgot vauban heirloom is today

[strong viper]

Im really settling into dagath now too

[restive river]

Goodbye

[strong viper]

Which is great. Good luck!

[strange turtle]

Fae coded?

[strong viper]

Lots of blue-green and gold and teal and deep forest and wing motifs

Fae path ephemera

And spores ephemera on drifter in goth gear lol

[glass sluice]

I'm actually curious on y'all thoughts on this topic.
do you think that each protoframe is written as purely bi, or do they have preferences? I've noticed a few cases in the convos+comments where they seem to stress a straight mindset over it being equal.
yes this is a very heavy question and im almost certainly reading too much into it.

[strong viper]

I think their perspectives grew after their bodies changed. That opens the door for a lot i guess

[fast dew]

Real

[strong viper]

And a lot of people experiment without necessarily changing teams

Its hard to explain and seems contradictory but it happens

[solar salmon]

quincy's definitely bi LMAO

if it was a competition

[strong viper]

Oi, heard. And arthur is hiding.... SOMETHInG imo

[glass sluice]

It only really clicked for me once I started dating Lettie (very much a regret, ngl), but just some of the lines she has seem to imply she's not into women at all.

[strong viper]

She's a domme but I think her trust in El has broken her idea of women for a bit

Because she seems more intimate with her, despite the technocyte drama, than with Aoi

[glass sluice]

Genuinely not trying to be controversial here or anything, but that feels like it was written by someone who does not know the experiences there.

its a problem in honestly, most games ive played with WlW romances. they never feel right

[strong viper]

Yeah, no, yeah. I feel the same about Amir, too, with the squirrelmoding....

[fast dew]

Only Eleanor, Quincy (i think) and Roathe are written directly to be queer, with Lettie being a maybe

[solar salmon]

it might be that aoi generally is more idealistic than eleanor is, while eleanor goes there in conversations which she outright says she likes

[fast dew]

The rest are generally written to be playersexual, which is different to pan and i am tired of explaining how

[glass sluice]

El' has that big of kim dialogue where she very much describes what its like to have your first queer crush before you realise it, and I just know someone who wrote that has gone through it

[strong viper]

Oh yeah, i'll never forget her cold open when i was literally just planning F&F

[glass sluice]

ngl felt very seen with that one, almost too much

[fast dew]

She mentions having a girlfriend and a dude as a fiance lol

[solar salmon]

and both their convos deal with spirituality

[glass sluice]

yeah, as someone who grew up REALLY catholic, i feel it

[strong viper]

Yeah i went to a non coed highschool

Ended up more zen and crap.

But heavy catholic background. Meow, marie

[fast dew]

My dad tried to force me into that shit but I refused

[glass sluice]

public school all the way, except religious for like 2 years in primary.
marie feels weird to me, she feels too much like a relative that i have, and i hate it because i genuinely like her once she realises about Albrecth.

[fast dew]

Didn't particularly like following something blindly, I guess

[strong viper]

Nod.

[fast dew]

I don't think a lot of people understood what Marie's chat was for

[glass sluice]

I dont think it's controversial to say that a lot of those conversations went over people's heads.

I'd say the bulk of people never got past Aoi's chibi armour

[fast dew]

So many people used it to reaffirm their vitriolic hatred of Albrecht when it very much was written to do the exact opposite

Because the good ending to that chat isnt "Albrecht is evil and bad", its "Albrecht is a complicated person", which goes for Marie's view of him, as much as ours

[glass sluice]

that part I dont mind, because its written well enough that it can lead into different paths.
leading marie to realise that Entrati helped her a lot, but that it doesn't mean he's blameless, felt like a real end point to her character.

i sort of wish she wasnt a romance option, she feels like she'd fit more with the other 3

[solar salmon]

Ive had to reset for roathes bugs and such but I cant wait to have that chat again last time I told her roathe would be proud and I dunno if theres any other that roughly lead to that understanding outcome

[fast dew]

I just wonder why they chose to make the character who visually looks like something aligned to lua, aligned to Sol

Asked my baby tenno, who's never seen them, and he did the. Marie looks like lua, Lyon looks like Sol

But its. The opposite 😭

He also cussed out Roathe, which. Fair enough

[strong viper]

Well she has the golden hair. But yeah her frame and his frame fit the other

[fast dew]

BOTH ARE BLONDES

[strong viper]

I know

[fast dew]

They look like siblings and it was fully intentional

[strong viper]

They are le franswah

[fast dew]

Oddly, all the french people ive known, which is like. 4, at max, only one was blonde

[glass sluice]

i do wish they'd chill with the french.
I speak no french, half her conversations felt like i was watching a movie on SBS

[strong viper]

Most i know are dirty blonde/brun mix

[solar salmon]

somethign something dualism maybe

[strong viper]

Cajun french have darker features in skin and hair, most my relatives are that

But france is very diverse actually for a european nation

[solar salmon]

its odd tho can you tell me what specifically about her design screams lua

[fast dew]

Maybe that's who the other folk were

[glass sluice]

I mean, she's clearly from what, late middle ages france, yeah?
Maybe a bit later, that would explain the type of french they're speaking, which i understand changes a lot over the years

[strong viper]

Lmao her wisp idles xD

Its ecclesiastical vernacular french

[glass sluice]

to be fair, wisp's ult is literally blasting the sun out

thats pretty sol

[strong viper]

Yeah, fair

[glass sluice]

I play the kamehameha noise every time i turn it on.

[strong viper]

I just meant her mood in dance, very lua. But thats true

[fast dew]

For me its generally the whole. Darker colour scheme? Like. Without the knowledge of being based on wisp, it feels like the night. Like the stars and the moon, yk?

[strong viper]

The stealth stuff is more typically lua too

[fast dew]

Maybe its more process of elimination though

[strong viper]

Yeah

Harrow just smokes it up so

[fast dew]

With lyon being. Aggressively more sol-like

[strong viper]

I guess thats very heckate

[glass sluice]

Do you think Lyon was made sol so that someone could make the "sunny disposition" joke?

[fast dew]

Kinda like how Albrecht and Loid are very. Sol and lua aligned visually, yk?

[strong viper]

Also the whole Lion Devours the Sun in french alchemie

Lions are associated with suns and not moons in french arcana

[strange turtle]

Tbh all of them feel like they shouldn’t be romance except for maybe Lyon.

Marie’s just dealt with her relationship stuff with Albrecht.

Roathe’s still relatively fresh from a very messy toxic relationship (then again you can intentionally lead him to being evil just because they wanted to pander to “if evil why hot” fans so that wasn’t in the cards anyway)

Lyon has, Idek what to call it but he had it going on, though personally I don’t feel too strongly either way about it for him, both make sense

[strong viper]

So its a doubletake for sure

[glass sluice]

@strange turtle Roathe feels extra weird, that one feels like a fe tish for sure.

[strange turtle]

Oh it absolutely is

[fast dew]

Oh it is lmfao

All of them are

[strong viper]

Roathe and Lyon are just a bit too priestly for me to get into that. For some reason I dont have the same reservation towards nuns xD

[solar salmon]

he uses silver while she uses gold but his belt buckle adornment thing is much more RAYS OF THE SUN vibes as well so I guess it really is a dualism thing

[fast dew]

I will stand on that hill.

[glass sluice]

so fun fact: when I went to romance lettie, I did it via just normal convo, then asked her to date afterwards.
so the domme stuff came out of nowhere for me. was honestly a real whiplash.

[strong viper]

Lmao

Can always break up with her. Id never want a ratking for a domme myself

[glass sluice]

"hey lettie wanna date, and move in together""
"hey drifter, imma beat you up later, and you'll like it"
"hey lettie, the hell?"

[strong viper]

I'll stick to a nice tongue and a thoughtful speech pattern

[woven coyote]

Funny how asking out in person leads to talking less with the characters