lore-discussion

[loud oriole]

-# we end as we began.
-# as nothing

[dry oracle]

It was way before the ai overview was added

So indifference is killable?

[strange plinth]

probably?

[silk atlas]

We don't know

But assuming he's immortal for no reason isn't gonna help

[stiff fable]

"Not by a Jedi"

but seriously probably not with bullets

[dark compass]

With a hug

[dry oracle]

I look down in the "people also asked" one of them says
Does indifference support LGBTQ

[fast dew]

AHAHAHA

[lean garden]

The indifference at its basal level is a thought form thing.

V for vendetta would have you believe you cant kill a thought, but as the hollow vessel that is my skull proves, you can cause a genocide of thoughts really easy

[fast dew]

No that might be from the joke that wally is homophobic

[strange plinth]

doubt, he leaves the sanctum when loid is reminded of his love /s

[proven spire]

Conceptually embodied homophobia

[stiff fable]

Also he gets really mad about trans rights elements

[fast dew]

Theres a line in isleweaver where wally complains about element mixing being unnatural and its funny

[stiff fable]

Yeah!

I've been cackling about that for six months

[dark compass]

People aren't gonna like what Mara Lohk means

[fast dew]

So theres the joke that he's homophobic because of it

[lean garden]

which is funny, because it has no issues transforming from a woman to a man in an instant

[strange plinth]

tbh my favorite isleweaver line is wally straight up saying "Obliterate yourself."

[proper barn]

The indifference hates loves.

[lean garden]

https://tenor.com/view/ltg-gif-24337002

[fast dew]

"Grrr it's unnatural" is a very common thing for homophobes to say (despite it being natural)

[dark compass]

Alchemy is weird because it's clearly not acting within the normal laws of nature and combined elements ARE a weird different thing in-universe from normal chemistry I think

[fast dew]

Shh dont look at it too hard

[dark compass]

Indifference is chasing Albrecht not because of the finger, but because its homophobic

[proven spire]

Toxin and cold makes viral

[dark compass]

Toxin and heat makes gas

I know my alchemy, my most played frame is Lavos

[proven spire]

If you freeze lightning it becomes a magnet

[strange plinth]

what's the formula to turn a guy into a puddle and then that puddle into a snake then /s

[fast dew]

[dark compass]

If you electrify the toxin it becomes corrosive

[fast dew]

The weird thing is i can see the logic behind them

[proven spire]

That’s gay

[strange plinth]

whys that one gay huh

[fast dew]

Yeah im pretty sure Albrecht was thinking about men when figuring that one out

[dark compass]

Yeah, alchemy has some weird internal logic to it, that's why it's a whole separate science field from normal chemistry

[dry oracle]

So indifference weakness is love?

[dark compass]

Indifference's weakness is giving a shit

[strange plinth]

ah !
r2c3

[dark compass]

And love is a lot of giving a shit

[dark compass]

If you freeze the heat it makes blast

[dry oracle]

Does it gives you steam/smoke

[dark compass]

No, it explodes

[dry oracle]

So throwing ice in fire it would explode

Imagine if that work irl

[dark compass]

Yes, basic alchemy

[proven spire]

Maybe it’s liquid nitrogen

[lean garden]

actually

you can cause a lil bit of the booms

[dark compass]

Rapid expansion

[lean garden]

if you rapidly freeze and heat something

[dark compass]

Or whatever the hell

[dark compass]

Yeah it's called thermal sunder

[dry oracle]

Totally didn't imagine fire being frozen

[dark compass]

Here's another one

If you heat the electricity you get radiation

Truly, a science worthy of Entrati

[dry oracle]

https://tenor.com/view/livasmol-loading-cat-smol-gif-6810651202878211592

[loud oriole]

electricity goes into my Michaelwave and in turn makes anything with water get warm thanks to the Michaelwave radiation

[proven spire]

We’ve been microwaving the enemies this whole time

[frank verge]

Reminder that the head of the CIA (Ash) has more compassion than Ballas

[dark compass]

Sorry but no

Microwaving is a separate status effect

Cannot be reproduced with alchemy

[loud oriole]

microwave-frame when DE.
-# preferably before Fridgeframe

[frank verge]

Freezer frame

[loud oriole]

so frost?

[dark compass]

I'm surprised that there are so many heat themed frames

But cold literally has only one

[proven spire]

Frost the snowman

[loud oriole]

gauss would like to know your location

[strange plinth]

how is volt related to cold

[loud oriole]

fixed it lol

[strange plinth]

ehh, gauss still isn't super attached to cold

yareli has more of a connection than gauss imo

[proven spire]

Yareli is obviously water element

[dry oracle]

And yet we don't have water element damage

Only to be replaced by slash

[frank verge]

Okay now. I'm a bit confused on what generation of Warframes we piloted. I know the ones we build are 3rd Gen with Primes being the most potent DNA from the OG frames. So does that mean the three warframes that were given (Excalibur, Mag, Volt) were second Gens?

[strange plinth]

the frames we build are functionally the same as the gen 2s we originally piloted, so there's no need for that distinction

[frank verge]

I see.

[loud oriole]

waterjets are a pretty good slicing tool

[strange plinth]

the primes are also just a different "model" of the same warframe. just fancy for the 'prime vanguard'

[frank verge]

Really? I thought it was because they had the most potent DNA from the original frames?

[silk atlas]

The distinction between Prime and not, before and after Tenno just really don't matter that much

All Primes are are just "The best of the best"

[drowsy saddle]

Exalted pimpslap?

[strange plinth]

"Primes were reserved for the Prime Vanguard. The best of the best, and the rest... are adequate, I guess. If you're satisfied with merely adequate."
"The Prime Vanguard. The Pride of Empire. And the end of it. Hell of a thing."
both quotes from varzia

[frank verge]

I see. And where do the OG Frames stack up to their prime and current iteration? Are they obsolete in terms of skill?

[silk atlas]

Not explained.

And "current" iteration is misleading because base Warframes were used before along with Primes

[frank verge]

Oh including fabricated ones?

[silk atlas]

They're all the same, functionally, because the fabricated ones all are just exact copies of the old stuff

[frank verge]

Ah. I see. Would Stalker count as an OG frame? Because from what I could recall he did not have a pilot. Only schizophrenia.

[silk atlas]

Again, "OG" doesn't really mean anything. Stalker hasn't been replicated as far as we know, but he has lived since The Old War

[frank verge]

Putting that in my notebook

[coral mirage]

sort of , Primes are original blueprints, that isnt to say therew werent custom frames like the one in Old Peace Excalibur, thats just a category

Meanwhile, Stalker and Jade need to put up with the Orokin's close minded mentality and suffered horrible

And we all saw how they treated Umbra.

So the Prime and First Gen warframes is a lot of trial error before saying "Prime"

Keep in mind that the Orokin are basically in charge of original description, and those are grade a [censored]

[dark compass]

Gauss is a kinetic battery. He's got both heat and cold

Not really a dedicated ice/cold frame

[coral mirage]

All i know.

[frank verge]

Shit some serious CIA black ink stuff

[coral mirage]

when do we play as baby frame?

i want baby frame

[dark compass]

It's like calling him an electric frame because he has lightning sparks during redline

His lightning doesnt do electricity damage btw

Its impact

[strange plinth]

the primes aren't really the original blueprints, either
"Some Warframes were Prime from the start. Others earned it. Ballas never told the whole truth."
not always at least

[coral mirage]

"Orokin did it? Orokin did it"
stabbing Ballas twice was not enough, i wanted to throw his ass in the sun

[coral mirage]

my point, the label of "prime" is not the category, the excal, volt, etc are.
How they came to be is muddled in way too much history its too bleak to see where it began.

[frank verge]

That's too merciful. Hell is a merciful place for him.

Also call this a paranoia. But I don't truly believe Ballas is dead

I know he got GOT by space mom. But I'm not buying it. Ballas is out there. Somewhere. Ready to mess things up again

[strange plinth]

3 of em today?
<@&778745217037238293>

[dark compass]

I doubt they'll bring him back, guy had 5 years worth of story buildup and an ending

It's Wally now

And someone else after that

[coral mirage]

he had 1 respawn too many, now its time for Wally

which gives me serious FMA vibes at this point

[frank verge]

Yet I keep seeing his echoes

One good thing that Ballas did do

Is make the Emperor of Mankind from 40k look like an actual loving father.

[dark compass]

We haven't heard much from him in a while

Old Peace opened a lot of those old wounds for people lol

[frank verge]

Isn't the new update about him?

[dark compass]

Yeah he was behind the events

That happened long ago

That's like the only "echo" he had in years

[frank verge]

Like I said. His echoes are still around. He's dead. But his ghost keeps haunting us to the point we became Kratos and got so traumatized we forgot about the whole Uriel event I think?

[strange plinth]

i mean. he disappeared offscreen and that's the only evidence that he isn't dead

[strange plinth]

memories sealed away by margulis, as she says at the end of the quest

[dark compass]

After getting his whatever eaten by Lotus

[frank verge]

https://tenor.com/view/zeus-kratos-your-son-has-returned-god-of-war3-god-of-war-gif-25409651

[strange plinth]

an accurate way to phrase this

[frank verge]

Every Tenno when Ballas comes back on screen again:

[frank verge]

His soul?

[coral mirage]

https://tenor.com/view/dude-really-come-on-chris-pratt-bro-gif-16197598

actually, thats more accurate... Ballas was stabbed and then he comes back as a mutant slave.
Then hes a mutant slave king
Then hes a mutant slave king with force fields.
I mean that guy deserved EVERYTHING that was coming to him

[dark compass]

<@&778745217037238293>

[blissful merlin]

Dang another one? Tonight’s been busy with bots and scams it seems lol

[dark compass]

Mass evil grok hacks

[dire mountain]

We watched him die???

He couldnt come back unless they pull some convoluted shit

Which they won't

[dark compass]

Ballasweaver duviri side story

[dire mountain]

[waxen mesa]

soul sucked out, flung into the sun with a veil on

[dire mountain]

Yeah I know

[waxen mesa]

DE would need a better reason then "somehow Ballas returned"

[dark compass]

Conceptual embodiment

[waxen mesa]

can operator even conceptual embody stuff into existence anymore

Drifter could but Drifter wasn't void touched until Duviri Paradox

[silk atlas]

Anyone can CE stuff, it's just stupidly risky and not something you want to rely on.

[lean garden]

everyone can make a CE lol

[silk atlas]

You just need to be exposed to a lot of Void energy to CE stuff

[waxen mesa]

Operator has a bit more reason to not be able to...sicne you know

more void then human

[dark compass]

I conceptually embody you as a virgin and myself as a chad

[dire mountain]

Dont know why they couldn't? They are still very much an alive and conscious being

Therefore they could conceptually embody something

[waxen mesa]

but also yes. I know of two examples of CE and both were far more dangerous then 1 million nuclear bombs

Wallboy: obvious reasons

Duviri: nuked an entire reality to make

[dire mountain]

Where the hell are you getting the duviri part from

Also: holdfasts, belric and rania

[dark compass]

Wally trolling us by shapeshifting into ballas after our old peace deep dive

"you were the one meant to struck a killing blow, not her"

[limber hull]

Just finished the hex quest and got so many questions.
What is that Energy of 1999 that can apparently help us against wally?
Isn't wally an almost omnipotente void god?

[dire mountain]

So you know what nuclear reactors emit right... and you know what element the Murmur are weak against?

[loud oriole]

-# heated electricity

[coral mirage]

we watched him die twice...

[dire mountain]

Yes. I know this.

[dark compass]

That's why at the end Albrecht had to smoke Volt

[coral mirage]

what mean is, that man thing could pretty much now come back as a back on sentient and i wouldnt be surprised

[limber hull]

Yes but is that really it?
If drifter didn't loop was wally gonna be defeated or just kicked out of 1999?

[silk atlas]

1. The nuke.
2. No. Stop and think of what he's actually been capable of before just throwing around labels like "god". He's been far more predictable than anything I'd label as a "god"

[coral mirage]

oh god.

[blissful merlin]

Love is like a nuclear bomb to the indifference lmao

[silk atlas]

Wally stopped trying to barge into 1999 after the nuke, that's what Isleweaver is about.

[dark compass]

You beat the "indifference" by "care", obviously

[limber hull]

Ok now it makes sense ty

[coral mirage]

less a god and more like a reaction, Wally did nto interfere with humanity until Orokin era.
Why? because it still takes a linear point for his non linear concept to exist

[blissful merlin]

https://tenor.com/view/warframe-warframe-1999-1999-nuke-explosion-gif-9536071374254255844

[dire mountain]

We literally watched him die and shit he is DEAD

[dark compass]

Lotus ate him

While he was distracted by a egirl vr headset

[blissful merlin]

https://tenor.com/view/light-mode-cat-gif-481352660004110112

[coral mirage]

yes and again, if you want that thing back hes got a back up personality inside a robot.... again this is just fiction, rules come and go

[dark compass]

Yeah technically they can easily make him return.

I just think it would be lame

[dire mountain]

Yeah but they said they didn't want to bring him back so they wont

[coral mirage]

i dont want Ballas back, i need to get a grasp on whatever the hell Wally is and wants

[dire mountain]

It would cheapen the impact of the new war

[coral mirage]

he acts all fingerless like and non-chalant, i dont buy it

[dark compass]

I suspect tau update will give us some knowledge

[loud oriole]

if ball arse comes back, we'll just give him the Captain Vor treatment, instant evaporation

[dark compass]

Ballas but it's a random miniboss encounter that everyone kills immediately

"what a waste-"

[blissful merlin]

I can’t wait till whenever we see albrecht again

[limber hull]

Now that you bring ballas why does he look so different from His Time in the old peace? Did he just age or something

[lean garden]

"almost omnipotent"

looks inside
generally impotent

[coral mirage]

im really getting a vibe that Wally in its non-linear existence is resentful of the orokin basically stealing the void, which he is a part of, basically saying "you mofos, its not my stuff, I AM THE STUFF, STOP StEALIN ME!"

[dark compass]

I have a really weird specific thing regarding that I really want to see

Albrecht during mission comms

[blissful merlin]

Oh yea….i just can’t wait for whatever speech he’s going to be giving us when we meet him again after the events of 1999

[coral mirage]

https://tenor.com/view/jetstream-sam-my-beloved-gif-22029076

i wasnt the only one who thout that right?

[dark compass]

"Dump it"

[loud oriole]

i mean, if my first interaction with something that wasnt myself and attempted to reach out only to end up only being able to count to 9 while the person i met took my finger to better themselves, id be pretty mad too

[dark compass]

Wally is so mad he sabotges quizzes in duviri with his questions about fingers

[coral mirage]

we look at it from a biological perspective, what if wally is more like an ecosystem and we stole "water"? iits not going to like it... Something about the void is.... hard to describe in that sense

[coral mirage]

https://tenor.com/view/dc-red-lantern-corps-green-lantern-rage-gif-8902729373411792032

[loud oriole]

void/indifference only works in deals, your offer for my offer
albrecht unintentionally did not learn said rule and wally does not take kindly to that

[dark compass]

The Man in The Tablet

[strange plinth]

massive cursor be upon ye

[loud oriole]

i want to believe that wally's modification to that answer is simply "where is my finger, child of void" or something like that

[coral mirage]

but... we broke a deal, it's like a part of the whole narrative, the Op is not having it

[dark compass]

Education in duviri hit rock bottom

[coral mirage]

i mean, Drifter is traumatized to you know what and back, cut him some slack

[loud oriole]

drifter traumatized? yeah i guess
operator however...

[woven coyote]

think there might be a missunderstanding there
nothing was nuked to make duviri

well maybe drifter's sanity

but not a reality

[civic gulch]

How tf everything in rhe new war went so wrong so fast

Didnt erra literally have ballas on a leash

[woven coyote]

It was a ruse

[strange plinth]

fell for the act
erra drops the leash in the last cutscene

[civic gulch]

I never saw it

What cutscene/quest

[strange plinth]

The Maker, i think. last cutscene of prelude to war

[civic gulch]

How the hell did i miss that😭

[woven coyote]

Right after they kick natah into the wall/torch/presumably reactor

[strange plinth]

happens

[eager briar]

Imagine if we got a lotus themed frame

[civic gulch]

Imagine if that frame was called lotus

[dry oracle]

Khora is lotus theme frame

[strange plinth]

khora's based on margulis

[dry oracle]

Same same but different

[median geyser]

"Well yes, but actually no"

[fast dew]

Not the same at all tbh

[umbral cliff]

Is there a big shot who can give you a touch up armor

[proven spire]

The operator survived the zariman by dealing with wally

[proper barn]

Well

[restive river]

Dealing with as in to make a deal

[dire current]

Likely is because Ballas underwent Continuity between the time of the Old Peace and the present. Likely even multiple times. There likely were still Yuvans available, even after the fall of the Orokin Empire, as even though the Seven were considered to be the most powerful... they weren't biologically immortal.

[restive river]

Or they just updated his model cause it was old lol

[dire current]

I mean, that too, but also could still be a viable lore option

[restive river]

Could be

[waxen pond]

You don't really need a Yuvan for Continuity, no?
They were purpose-bred for it, but you can hop into any body so long as you have the Kuva, know the process and can empty their consciousness

[pale cedar]

There’s seemingly emergency continuity

[tall echo]

you kinda do

yuvan is just the word for the next body

[waxen pond]

Emergency in this case meaning "We can't use the preferred option and do all the usual pomp and ceremony"

[tall echo]

yuvans are also not purpose-bred

[restive river]

Where does it state yuvans were purpose bred

[waxen pond]

I thought Yuvan referred to specific caste of people created for the Continuity, but if it just means whoever gets to be skinwalked, then ok

[pale cedar]

We weren’t even a Yuvan tbh the Queen just needed a body and we were the best option

[waxen pond]

Correcting myself - I assume most Yuvan were, because Orokin enjoyed creating people for the task

[restive river]

I think you could just say yuvan for both the ones indoctrinated into becoming yuvans and those who would be the next bodies, if nothing else it helps for simplicity in knowing what one is referring to

[restive river]

Again, where is that stated

[waxen pond]

Roathe's dialogues indicate that Yuvan absolutely could be taken from existing population, which was used as a threat

[tall echo]

which goes against the whole purpose-bred thing

purpose-bread...

[dark compass]

If they had purpose-bred yuvans then the whole kindapping children thing wouldn't have been a thing

[restive river]

Roathe’s history lesson on yuvans is cool
Really shows how messed up the Orokin were

[tall echo]

I just struggled hard to spell purpose for an unfunny joke

[dark compass]

Aw, sorry :(

[pale cedar]

Imagine joking in my war game

[waxen pond]

Not really
If the demand is high enough in both quantity and quality, creating the supply rather than picking it is reasonable option
But just because you can create the supply doesn't mean you have to stop kidnappings, especially when they have value as tool of oppression

But that's me headcanoning why it would be a thing rather than saying it was a thing

[fast dew]

They had clones.

They didn't want that.

[waxen pond]

The best part here is not him telling how messed up it was by the end, but showing how it went there

[restive river]

Yeah they didn’t go for cloned bodies

[waxen pond]

I wasn't talking about clones

[fast dew]

Im meaning that they didn't want the easier or the more aesthetic option.

[restive river]

I mean they were masters of biology, they could take any body and alter it afterward

[fast dew]

Real easy to make clones.

[pale cedar]

A clone body would be terrible to swap into

[fast dew]

They just didnt want to.

[restive river]

Also with Roathe’s little lesson we know it wasn’t a purpose bred anything

[dire current]

IIRC, the only one who did kinda go for clones, and it was more by necessity at that point, was the Twin Queens. That being said, they absolutely hated having to go that route.

[restive river]

Started as necessity to get the job done and turned into basically a cult

[restive river]

Yup!

[fast dew]

Perfectly capable, reasonable, no child murder and a empty brain. They still chose the children

[restive river]

It’s funny cause they were booted for being twins which was too similar to the clone slave work force

[fast dew]

Because... idk some reason

[tall echo]

the orokin wouldn't use clones specifically bc clones (and by extension twins) are seen as lesser for being identical

[restive river]

Made em feel powerful
Like gods

[fast dew]

Lorists :)
-# i wonder why lorists are always twins?

[tall echo]

the orokin deserved worse than what they got

[restive river]

Oh these lowly peasants want to give their life and body to us! So we may live forever!

[restive river]

Maybe for the connection they have,

[pale cedar]

Blame Ballas for what they did get

[tall echo]

the topic of twins makes me wonder again about how zuud and her sisters worked

[waxen pond]

Ok, but what if it was genuine and early Orokin were somewhat noble and benevolent

That would have hilarious effect on the community

[pale cedar]

Are nukes benevolent?

[restive river]

It started out as necessity to get the job done

[waxen pond]

I mean somewhere inbetween Scaldra's bosses and Executors

[restive river]

Also it def seems like ORO is the proto Orokin and
They’re basically a shady evil shadow government

Even if the Orokin started out well intentioned that doesn’t really matter anymore, what matters is what they became and how they treated humanity

[dire current]

Power corrupts. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.

[dark compass]

"well intentioned"
Looks inside
Totalitarian control for people's "own good"

[restive river]

I’m sure certain famous dictators didn’t start out completely evil but they sure ended up that way

[restive river]

That and living waaaaay too long

[ocean geyser]

All I remember is hivemind
Zuud was her sisters and her sisters were Zuud

[waxen pond]

It's not like there was instant jump from 90s corporate cabal to Old War era Orokin
I doubt any of the original members lasted that long

[restive river]

Through Kuva they could have

[dire current]

Yep. That be the true curse of immortality, even with body hopping. Inevitably, you will go insane.

[waxen pond]

Yes, and despite that both the oppressors and the oppressed often fall into believing this

[restive river]

Again, it does not really matter if the Orokin started out as something good

[waxen pond]

But did they have Kuva during Radiation Wars?
I doubt it

[restive river]

We don’t know!

[ocean geyser]

Although i guess the question of Zuud and her sisters could be developed into: HOW did they become a hivemind?
Cause i really doubt they were like that from the start

[dark compass]

Being a controlling cult like shadow government doesn't really paint them as "good" even in 1999

[restive river]

We don’t know how they discovered kuva or how they figured out what it did or even when!

[ocean geyser]

Considering Solaris kids don’t normally have augs

[waxen pond]

I'd say it does matter for the question of whether they can be forgiven

[tall echo]

your pfp (and banner) are very pretty
-# had to say it

[ocean geyser]

I agree actually

[dark compass]

Yes, I also agree

[restive river]

Not really, they weren’t Orokin when/if they were good

[ocean geyser]

Cool profile :3

[dark compass]

I wanted to say it but thought I would look weird doing that

[waxen pond]

And again, if they are not the exact same individuals that were running a shadow cabal, should they be judged for the actions of that cabal?

[pale cedar]

ORO
Kinematic
ORO
KIN
Orokin

[fast dew]

Dawg just say it, this is the internet, folk are weirder than you

im weirder than you, I have Albrecht looking at me on my drawing tablet as I sleep

[ocean geyser]

True
Especially here

Why’s he looking at you

[dark compass]

You don't know me

[restive river]

Okay are you saying that the potential people after the shadow government aren’t at fault??

[fast dew]

I have clip studio open and hes in the corner looking at me as I hide from drawing

[restive river]

Always watching
With his
lidless eyes

[tall echo]

not the maykr dude?

[dark compass]

The only things I ever talk about is not having a main, about people disrespecting Lavos and symbolically crying in the corner

[waxen pond]

I'm saying I like to entertain the idea that somewhere between the Big Money Illuminati and Executors of Absolute Evil, there could be Golden Emperors Who Tried A Bit To Be Good Guys

Good enough to convince the people they were the force of good

Wouldn't take much with how screwed the Earth was after Techrot and Radiation Wars

[fast dew]

Usually, but im not drawing doom stuff rn

[dark compass]

talking like the evil guys won't actively try to look good to the public

[fast dew]

I was gonna say we never see Albrecht blink, but we do infact see him blink (in the comic)

[restive river]

So the group belonging to the group that caused the major issues is promoting themselves as the good guys and promptly become not good anyway

[pale cedar]

Orokin literally did try making the system think they were generous

[restive river]

Good intentions mean nothing when your actions are literally the worst.

[waxen pond]

I see no one wants to get the point I'm making, so I'll stop making it and leave

[restive river]

This is also assuming a lot about their timeline with Kuva

[pale cedar]

The road to hell is pathed in good intentions

[restive river]

I guess that hard confirms it was him in the comic?

[drowsy saddle]

I think its implied they were naturally psychic and linked, like a network, but when most of them died they basically jumped ship to Zuud

[dark compass]

My point is that they were always rich people in charge and rich people in charge are almost always evil and only have their own interests in mind. That's how they got rich and in charge in the first place

[fast dew]

Hehehehe yeup.
-# still unsure tho

[restive river]

Can never be sure with him with Wally about
But also
Why would Wally make protoframes

[fast dew]

Best set of orokin we have is the entrati family and the matriarch abused her husband, so its not a good starting point

[restive river]

Oh actually that reminds me!
I don’t recall which member of the triad said it but when Albrecht dropped off Roathe he smiled
Iirc he. Does not do that

[waxen pond]

Some people will look at a story that goes great lengths to not be black and white and then paint it black and white anyway

[dark compass]

What if wally needs a vessel to fuse with so he would be able to reattach his now separated finger

[waxen pond]

Ok, actually quitting this conversation now

[dire current]

I do believe that would be Lyon that had said that.

[tall echo]

bruh

[dark compass]

[fast dew]

What.

[restive river]

Yeah.

[fast dew]

[restive river]

Roathe could be a creation of Wally
It’s just a theory ofc

He does hate the Orokin…

[pale cedar]

Albrecht does smile just not much

[fast dew]

The local Albrecht "fan" is now concerned

[restive river]

Maybe the question of if they can be forgiven is more so about their crimes in relation to the finger?

[restive river]

Does he :?
doesn’t loid say he doesn’t, or does he say just not like that (referring to whispers new years scene)

also how did Loid see that

[ocean geyser]

I’m pretty sure this is how it went down?
The Orokin WERE good rulers at some point but then they started getting
Weird
Cause iirc the Lua and Sol faith persisted for quite a while

[pale cedar]

Loid said it didn’t happen much rather than never

[fast dew]

"Rarely smiled, and never like that." Or something

[restive river]

Dualism
They dropped it for the vain faith at some point
But with them likely being billionaires I doubt they were that good to begin with

[fast dew]

Albrecht kinda seemed to be the man to tell a lot with his eyes though, over his mouth

[restive river]

Warframe has a lot of very grey things
The Orokin typically are not one of those things, not when it comes to them and their society specifically

[restive river]

Okay thank you lol
So more likely it was actually him then

[fast dew]

Individual orokin, yeah, but the society? Hell no.

[pale cedar]

Is there any character in Warframe who has never smiled?

[fast dew]

Loid i think

Ive never seen him smile

[tall echo]

konzu

[fast dew]

No early lunch for him

[tall echo]

konzu knows no joy without his early lunch

[pale cedar]

Has Drifter ever smiled?

[tall echo]

yes

[restive river]

Yeah some individuals were okay
Or
The closest thing an Orokin can be to okay

But their society at large was awful as well as what it perpetuated, which was disgusting deeds and psychopath rulers

[dire current]

Yep

[restive river]

omg is that wally

[restive river]

Ordis?
All cephalons minus maybe Suda?
Nihil?

[pale cedar]

If a character smiles they are automatically Wally trust

[tall echo]

why did wally decide to make smiling his defining feature

[restive river]

Umbra never smiles he can’t be Wally for sure

[ocean geyser]

At the very least there’s gotta be a time where they were Not Nearly as Goddamn Weird™
which was the point
Don’t get us wrong, the Orokin WERE freaks
But I’m pretty sure it’s pretty clear that they got worse over time

[fast dew]

I think a lot of people who think the entrati family as whole are great people forget about like. Mother and Daughter straight up assaulting Father

I think the best orokin would be Grandmother

[restive river]

Yeah, they’re likely the best the empire has to offer and
Woof

[ocean geyser]

She’s the best Orokin because I’m pretty sure she isn’t even Orokin

[pale cedar]

Did Dagath ever smile before her face had a minor accident?

[tall echo]

nah, kermerros, I'm definitely unbiased
-# ↖️ extremely gay for kermerros

[fast dew]

Nah, shes orokin.

[restive river]

She’s the most fun Orokin for sure
Her risking all voidtech over a family feud is troubling but compared to the rest of her family? Yeahh

[fast dew]

TRUE I FORGET ABOUT THAT

She did do that and attacked us

[restive river]

She put the entire system at risk lol

[fast dew]

But we're fine

Tbf i dont think she initially damaged it, only finished it off

[restive river]

I don’t think there’s a single Orokin that hasn’t done a crime

[fast dew]

Totally.

[restive river]

No she def initially damaged it

[tall echo]

all orokin have at least committed murder

[restive river]

She did that to get our attention to make her dumb family behave

[pale cedar]

I don’t think there’s a single Warframe character who hasn’t done a crime

[tall echo]

konzu

[restive river]

Which we do too but it’s factually different as they have all killed an innocent while we kill to protect the innocent

[fast dew]

I like Mother but she did stab her husband

[restive river]

Ticker?

[restive river]

Cutting off his arm is worse than stabbing depending on who you ask

[fast dew]

Tbf what she is doing could be a crime for the corpus (not us tho)

[tall echo]

I think most of the older solaris could fall under terrorism

[pale cedar]

Ticker sells humans to join in our war crimes

[dark compass]

Why would it be a crime for corpus if the money's getting paid?

[restive river]

The corpus are a money cult that worship what would be nothing if not for Albrecht
And
They have stupid outfits

[dark compass]

I don't think anyone really cares where it came from

[tall echo]

people are getting out of debt, that's less money in the long run

[restive river]

That’s a recruitment deal, not slavery 😭
The real crime is some of those names

[tall echo]

the point of the solaris is infinite debt slavery

[ocean geyser]

I’m pretty sure we’re hiring the humans instead of buying em dawg

[dark compass]

In the long run their brains are literally getting shelved and put out of use

[fast dew]

Shh don't give the folk who cant read any more ammunition to hate Albrecht/j

[restive river]

Some people in the system really named their kid (or themselves) after warframe’s equivalent to Chess/Go

[fast dew]

God a person would read that and blame Albrecht for the corpus

[restive river]

I mean that wasn’t even his fault tbf

[dark compass]

Either way

[tall echo]

I love my red veil crewmate called komi

[restive river]

You can not control conceptual embodiment

[restive river]

Oh same

[dark compass]

I don't remember any of my crewmates :(

[restive river]

Why do arbiters have the longest names ever

[dark compass]

I should fire them

[fast dew]

Yeah but folk arent smart, cmon, we know this

[tall echo]

close second to mr. sneeze, aka probate questrahend

[restive river]

True ):

[pale cedar]

CE can’t catch me if I abandon my emotions in the moment thus I win

[fast dew]

Folk hate Albrecht for leaving his family, which is arguably the best option he could've done

[restive river]

Can’t abandon all concepts within your mind >:)

I mean you could but you’d basically be a rock

[tall echo]

I wonder how my old pilot crewmate from my 1st account is doing

[tall echo]

hope he's still getting his daily dose of flying into asteroids

[restive river]

Waiting for your return that shall never come, wondering where their tenno went as they peer into the deep inky abyss of space “Scrap, come back to me…” they say

[pale cedar]

I control the embodiment just can’t remove the concepts

[fast dew]

Like the horse "man" meme. Yk?

[dark compass]

Me escaping the void horrors through the conceptual embodiment (this is just an exact copy of my home, I am very shallow)

[tall echo]

ngl I don't think he's smart enough to articulate even the word "me"

[restive river]

Folk would hate him for leaving the pager on the ground (he littered)

[restive river]

LMAO

[tall echo]

like, he genuinely flew into rocks whenever he could

[restive river]

Ke escaping the void horrors and world of dust horrors through conceptual embodiment (yay escapism)

[pale cedar]

Which Cephalon Scrap account is batter at Warframe?

[tall echo]

huntsman

[fast dew]

No clearly he littered. Clearly he's responsible for global warming.

[tall echo]

hunter is stuck running on switch hardware which is mediocre at best

[restive river]

On Deimos
A moon that was lifeless til some rock lovers meat nuked it to fight back against some sentient gaming pcs

Ignore that the Entrati probably had a whole thing and it was maybe terraformed to a degree

I just realized how little the Orokin must have cared for the Entrati actually if they allowed that-

[fast dew]

Theres a road. On deimos. In the Cambion drift.

[restive river]

Yeah lol

[fast dew]

Does that mean there's cars

[restive river]

Kaithe drawn carriages

[fast dew]

OH YEAH

[restive river]

Designed by Euleria herself

[fast dew]

THAT'S TRUE.

[restive river]

I wonder if she had a personal Kaithe

[pale cedar]

What if Ballas really just tried to end Global Warming by destroying the Sun

[restive river]

Like how rich people will just have their own horse

[fast dew]

They were weird :((( they had crypts and ossuaries instead of cremating the bodies of their servants/yuvans :((((((

[restive river]

He tried to end a type of climate change with a virus lady

[fast dew]

She probably did. Named after some old world scientist too

[restive river]

It sounds like that wasn’t even them
The cryoleums were a thing apparently

[dark compass]

When Sentients attack and your microwave suddenly obtains an urge to kill

[restive river]

Actually the Entrati probably respected death more than the wider Orokin society lol

[fast dew]

Oh no they just deadass have them, its a loid line

[restive river]

Wait cryoleums were mentioned before this update? :o

[fast dew]

No I mean ossuaries lol

[restive river]

Ik you sent that concept art that one time with them too iirc

[pale cedar]

And before that he tried nukes

[fast dew]

Should've... specified

[restive river]

Oooh lmao

[fast dew]

But yeah, weird as shit that they have that now that we know that wasn't the norm

[drowsy saddle]

I assume with cryo in the name, Cryoleums use cryotic somewhere. Does... That... Mean when excavate artifacts, we're just grave robbing orokin tombs?

[fast dew]

They just really liked bones

[dark compass]

Someone had to be used as proxies for necramech brains after all. Ai's banned

[restive river]

Cryo as in cryosleep but more like mausoleums so body preserving graves.

[pale cedar]

Orokin nuking Earth didn’t even work cuz Techrot just waited

[restive river]

Cryo is just separate from the wf resource lol

[restive river]

All it takes is one
tiny
spore

[drowsy saddle]

Well what resource do we know that's cold? Cryotic

[fast dew]

I fully think all Bonewidow models have Mother's skull on it, following what we now know is Loid's replicated skull on necraloid

[drowsy saddle]

Like how freon is always used in air conditioning

[ocean geyser]

Tf freon

[restive river]

I mean maybe?
But I doubt we’re mining cryoleums

[dark compass]

Eveelution

[ocean geyser]

Oh

[dark compass]

[restive river]

Nah that’s glaceon what

[fast dew]

The skull part for loid is canon now, I think we all collectively just assumed that the skull necraloid has was Loid's, I don't think there was any text saying it was until this update

[dark compass]

I assumed it was Otak's at some point

[ocean geyser]

Love how Necraloid has glasses too

[pale cedar]

Ballas could’ve ended Warframe early if he just pulled out Paracecis and opened the pods on Lua

[fast dew]

Built by Albrecht. Interesting to see how he sees his lover in a condensed form

[restive river]

I think I assumed it was his since Whispers

[ocean geyser]

Ballas is too dramatic for that

[restive river]

Otak was added later so it def wasn’t his anyway

[dark compass]

Fair enough

[restive river]

But
He can’t kill the devil, all he can do is send them back to hell

[ocean geyser]

I wonder what Loid and Otak would look in that geometric glass form

[drowsy saddle]

Otak would be a clown mirror

[ocean geyser]

LMAO

[restive river]

Otak is a big smiley face
Necraloid probably has glasses like his proxy body and human counterpart

[fast dew]

I think more people started thinking it was when Dante's update dropped and that line Loid has (this is the same line that mentions the family's ossuaries) about Dante wanting to look at his replicated skull

[restive river]

Loid is destined to be a nerd in all forms

[pale cedar]

The issue I see with that is he hadn’t even tried it before because he just sent us through the loop before we could test bleeding out

[restive river]

True yeah that helped with that

[dire current]

And in this case, sending them back to hell was basically trapping the Operator in their own memories, in an effective loop that could only be broken by a paradox.

Literally took the Drifter being a thing to break that paradox. Which... huh, makes me realize, the Chosen Operator pretty much is in a state where very little can truly defeat them, huh?

[restive river]

Basically
He’s stupid

[ocean geyser]

Why do the Entrati love obols so much

[restive river]

Own timeline but yes

[ocean geyser]

These guys LOVE golden circles it’s insane

[dark compass]

Cephalon profile of Loid but it's just a nerd emoji

[pale cedar]

You don’t love gold coins?

[fast dew]

This is a bit spoiler-y so be warned, but ||it seemed that Loid at the very least, wasn't a cephalon. He was "Necralized" according yo mother. Not glassed.||

[ocean geyser]

They glue them to their windows bro

[restive river]

Look up what obols are

[dark compass]

Think about it. Skulls and gold coins.

They were pirates obviously

[drowsy saddle]

Because when you're influential enough to have your own currency, why not use the one that you use to pay to travel to the underworld?

[ocean geyser]

What does that even mean lmao

Ohh OHHH

[fast dew]

||No clue, but it does seem to be notably different to glassing||

[ocean geyser]

So like
No glass, straight into funny robot?

Makes sense

[restive river]

Maybe some glass, as a treat

[ocean geyser]

Lmao

[dire current]

Neural mapping to a structure similar to a cephalon, if I were to guess.

[fast dew]

Mhm.

[restive river]

Probably yeah

[drowsy saddle]

Literally Ctrl+C Ctrl+V with the pom...

[fast dew]

Thankfully, means that Albrecht didnt clone and kill a clone of loid. Hopefully.

[restive river]

Why didn’t the Orokin do that more often?
Cause being a cephalon was a punishment and to them the worst kind

[drowsy saddle]

Albrecht really pushing that yee yee ahh windows 95 pewter to do all sorts of scifi shenanigananery

[restive river]

Memories are very important to the long living psychopath society

[ocean geyser]

Wonder how would have looked if he was given the sentinel owl body instead of funny skull

[fast dew]

Marie seems to agree with many (me) that it was done out of love, rather than maliciousness

[restive river]

Did Albrecht make the E-Grimoire or did Drifter code that

[pale cedar]

Something I find funny is the Orokin had an eventual resource problem but after the Zariman incident and Old War start and continuation they seemed to have forgotten about the issue of it

[dire current]

Kinda seems like something the Drifter made, NGL

[dark compass]

I swear DE would do ANYTHING to not give us a new grimoire weapon

[drowsy saddle]

Fairly sure the grimoire is his secret fanfic that's so foul it can literally kill people

[fast dew]

Albrecht couldnt think of a person more fit for the family, so he made loid. Not even himself.

[restive river]

Or necessity, he needed someone he could trust but didnt want to have Loid face hundreds of years like that

[fast dew]

I think that says a lot about how Albrecht views loid

[restive river]

Lorak:

[pale cedar]

Albrecht don’t like himself

[drowsy saddle]

I wonder if grandmother does know what's going on with the basement

[restive river]

Nemesis is standing right there

[dark compass]

THIS IS JUST ANOTHER PROOF

[ocean geyser]

Even then it’s just the transcendence beam

[ocean geyser]

Books don’t have legs

[pale cedar]

Damn insulted my pfp

[fast dew]

Spoilers but ||SHE DIDN'T. BUT WORSE. SHE KNOWS OF WALLY.||

[restive river]

Book no like when you rip out the pages

[opaque zenith]

I have a theory that is lizzie making the kim updates, like this "optimized reset options"

[restive river]

Not an insult
I like it ):

[dark compass]

Helminth software developer

[drowsy saddle]

Grandma's aura is strong enough that she baby's wally

[ocean geyser]

Oh hey you became a different Grimoire

[restive river]

Maybe she worked with Drifter for the loop stuff to work
There is that old bit about the techrot overload or whatever

[ocean geyser]

Is that the Necratech one?

[pale cedar]

Yeah I entered my ultimate form

[restive river]

Lorak, the Zenurik Grimoire

[ocean geyser]

Oh makes sense

[pale cedar]

Lorax is the best name for it

[restive river]

I wonder if we’ll ever get skins for the strike weapons

[dark compass]

Lorax...

[drowsy saddle]

I am the Lorak, i speak for the Tenno, the Tenno demand blood

[dark compass]

The Tenno demand ability efficiency, strengh, and duration

[restive river]

blue blood
The Drums begin to beat.

[fast dew]

God the night of the naga drums is so cool. I like the sound it has...

[drowsy saddle]

TENNEBRE ROSSO SANGUE

[opaque zenith]

There's also a roathe kim ||about the protoframe serum after some reset shenanigans|| that started this theory

[restive river]

||a unique convo after resetting them?||

[ocean geyser]

I love how Cogron has a more dramatic sounding title than the other Tauron Strikes

[drowsy saddle]

Ron's Cog

[ocean geyser]

Mf gets “HAMMER OF UNAIRU”
But everything else gets “[insert school here] [insert weapon type here]”

[opaque zenith]

||RoatheRank2Convo2. You need to reset, get the 21 audiologs, and then start talking to Roathe||

[restive river]

||got it, I will finish the descendia logs for sure before I reset them now (I ain’t getting the good ending, Marie doesn’t like me for. Idek why)||

[tall echo]

that's basically the same tho

[thick yacht]

Roathe is crazy

[ocean geyser]

I mean yeah but why does Cogron get “of”

It’s the only one with an “of”

[drowsy saddle]

To give it impact

[ocean geyser]

Lmao

[restive river]

Cause Cogron is the coolest
Totally
This isn’t subjective at all

[drowsy saddle]

No question

[opaque zenith]

||Pray you won't need to do the descendia 21 times again, cause idk how the audiologs work. But there's a indentifier of sorts on the first chat at least||

[drowsy saddle]

Effectiveness? Ehhh, aura? Cogron

[thick yacht]

What if I reset the triad

[restive river]

||afaik you only need to do all 21 once, iirc its bugged if you reset before finishing them though||

[thick yacht]

Would I be able to date them again

[restive river]

Why wouldn’t you

[opaque zenith]

Reset is literally the only way to be able to date them, if you screw up beyond repair, and pass all the fixing options

[thick yacht]

Because Roathe knows

[restive river]

Are you going after him specifically?

Maybe he just pretends and likes the game

[thick yacht]

https://tenor.com/view/frog-sad-eyes-big-eyes-black-gif-15621424004514858751

[opaque zenith]

And yeah, you have like, 2 to 3 chances to fix things

[restive river]

https://tenor.com/view/what-you-sure-you-sure-about-that-dog-watching-gif-26139783

[restive river]

Dang the game just hasn’t given me anything lmao

I have all convos on and I got nothin

[opaque zenith]

Takes a while but, if you for example screw up Marie, you can ask either Roathe or Lyon for help, and there's even a sure-fix with a deal with the devil||after a rest though||

Kinda forgiving system... If it wasn't bugged at the moment

[restive river]

Should be some fixes this week

Potentially today but if not likely Friday

[opaque zenith]

Hope so

[restive river]

They said they were working on things so

And we get the devstream later this month too

[mystic lynx]

I'm at an impass at roathe do i need to do all 21 floor of descendia 21× or do i just need to kill roathe 21 times?
Cuz i did the last floor once and he's like counting it

And do i need 21 starting from the anathema thing or does my previous run count?

[strange turtle]

Just to be clear, these were specifically for “low rank” Orokins who didn’t get to be Continuitied whenever they would’ve died, and Archimedeans (+whatever other high castes there might’ve been).

Dax probably got a warrior burial/burning kind of thing maybe they got made into ash diamonds. Lorists, idk, maybe they had their devices removed and got thrown to the Kubrow

[pale cedar]

Final floor 21 times you can even start at the final floor after doing the 21 floors to get there

[mystic lynx]

I have only done 2 descendia after the anathema but roathe is counting to 8 when i fight him
So am i at fight number 2 or 8?

[lean garden]

means you've killed him 7 times before in total

[mystic lynx]

So do i need 19 or 13 more fight to progress with the chat?

[opaque zenith]

Depending where you are, yes, iirc all Roathe's R5 chats are inacessable till the 21 runs

[mystic lynx]

Guess I'll just keep fighting until he starts talking

Alright roathe time to lock in and give me vinquibus

[opaque zenith]

Side note that idk if it counts by the actual runs or the audiologs counter (which you only get 2 per week) so I'll need someone else to confirm what it is by experience

[brittle siren]

https://fixupx.com/shieldgating/status/2008869307628073223?s=46&t=5XSoAshUqsO-YG_gq2tB3Q

Warframe Archival (@shieldgating)

Comparison between voicelines of Protea's Specter & Lizzie

**💬 2 🔁 6 ❤️ 154 👁️ 2.8K **

▶ Play video

FixupX · Jan 7, 2026, 11:52 AM

[dry oracle]

You can reset the traid?

[strange turtle]

Yes

[dry oracle]

How

[fast dew]

The digital grimoire, one of the buttons down the bottom, next to settings

[marble pewter]

https://x.com/shieldgating/status/2008876859392704671?s=46&t=UJDXCgf0wCfQ5KrE0jrWpQ

Warframe Archival (@shieldgating)

Pages of Albrecht's Grimoire: Kingdom of Duviri

X · Jan 7, 2026, 12:22 PM

[marble pewter]

“…But as the days melted away, I came to recognize the strange cast of characters Euleria had created, and their purpose. I heard voices I had myself first conjured in the darkness of her childhood chambers, for no other reward than her delight. She had not only preserved this gift I had thought so trivial, she had made it an instrument of healing. More: a stronghold.”

“Despite my legacy of neglect, despite my shoddy example, my needs, my demands, my daughter had triumphed in my absence. Her confidence, her warmth, shamed me. I had fled from the horror, but she? She had stood alongside the most vulnerable, those with the most to lose, and told them a different story.”

“I did not perceive the significance of Euleria's stance at first. Her concern for the children was not merely pastoral attentiveness. It was a direct strike against the Indifference. She was teaching the weak to be strong in the very places where those cold fingers could reach, and through her act of compassion, spitting in the face of alienation and despair.”

“Could I do less?”

“Shame is an inert state, but fertile. It primes the mind, bolstering it for repentance.”

“I had thought to make a difference in Duviri. But Duviri had made a difference in me. My own daughter's creations, reverberating and growing in the womb of the Void, had shown me another path than that of the indulgent coward. I was neither helpless nor irredeemable. Like she had, I could fight.”

This part damn…

“Despite my legacy of neglect, despite my shoddy example, my needs, my demands, my daughter had triumphed in my absence. Her confidence, her warmth, shamed me. I had fled from the horror, but she? She had stood alongside the most vulnerable, those with the most to lose, and told them a different story.”

“I did not perceive the significance of Euleria's stance at first. Her concern for the children was not merely pastoral attentiveness. It was a direct strike against the Indifference. She was teaching the weak to be strong in the very places where those cold fingers could reach, and through her act of compassion, spitting in the face of alienation and despair.”

Here’s to hoping Mother/Euleria is more involved in the upcoming updates

[dry oracle]

W mom

Mother*

[marble pewter]

If she does get more involved in the story, hopefully the Indifference doesn’t hurt her. Could the Indifference do something against an Infested being? Seems unlikely

[pale cedar]

First

Wally did play knock door run with her

Second Wally literally scared the Infestation

Also you have a piece of Wally that can directly kill the Infestation

[marble pewter]

Oh right

[pale cedar]

Helminth even says we fear nothing but the Void demon

[marble pewter]

So that would apply to the Entrati fam as well then

[pale cedar]

We could kill them if we wanted to

But they’re useful to keep alive

They manage the Heart which powers all Void tech including Warframes

[marble pewter]

How about “But Drifter/Operator has grown to like them despite everything”

[pale cedar]

They weren’t as bad as the 7 and we need them

[marble pewter]

Well yes the 7 were the worst

[pale cedar]

I can’t tell who’s worse between Albrecht and Grandmother tbh

[marble pewter]

What did Grandmother do apart from trying to keep the peace between the family

[pale cedar]

She damaged the heart

Which is a very important thing

[dry oracle]

I just went to my alt account and I never heard eleanor say "I could have a lot of little babies!"

Since when she can say that

[marble pewter]

Can you give me a direct lore line? If not, does she explain why she even did that?

[dry oracle]

It wasn't a rogue necramech who damaged the heart

[pale cedar]

Controlled by Grandmother

After the quest she gives out the least convincing it wasn’t me ever

[pale cedar]

Since 1999 released and you start dating her

[marble pewter]

Ah found it. “The Tenno glean from the conversation that Grandmother caused the events surrounding the Heart's destruction to unite the family.”

And this - “After his first voyage into the Void, he would construct the Heart atop the Wall Of Lohk; the very Void gate he used in the experiment”

[marble pewter]

So from my understanding Grandmother wanted to destroy access to the Wall of Lohk to unite the family?

[woven coyote]

Create a crysis that united them

Risky gamble but it did work

[pale cedar]

^

[marble pewter]

Maybe we’ll eventually fix the Heart

[pale cedar]

We did fix it

[woven coyote]

Very subtly changing the subject lol

[woven coyote]

If it was broken nothing we use in the entire system would work

No solar rails, no warframes, no void tech at all

[marble pewter]

Where is the Wall of Lohk located?

[pale cedar]

Think the fingers would still work?

[marble pewter]

Ah wait it’s where the Heart is nvm

[woven coyote]

Maybe they could be repurposed as a proper power source but they don't seem to be that great as for system wide supply

[woven coyote]

Probably further up

Sanctum as far as i can tell was built after the incident

[woven coyote]

Also where did you get this?

[marble pewter]

The wiki

[woven coyote]

Ah that was the feeling of something amiss

[marble pewter]

Wait it’s wrong?

[woven coyote]

He never said he built the heart on top of the original door

Even the sanctum has a tile with another door

[marble pewter]

Thanks for correcting it

I’m starting to forget details of the lore as years go by lmao

[woven coyote]

If there is more than one door built, and he never stated he built the heart on the original one, then that line in the wiki becomes speculation

[marble pewter]

Ah yea that makes sense. Then that wiki page needs to be updated

[woven coyote]

Like could that be the original door? Yes
Do we actually know that? No

Do we know why the heart is set there? Also no

All we know for sure is that heart is essential for system wide void tech

And that since it is void tech it necessarily comes after the door on finger incident

Wonder if we will ever know how he opened the original door

He stated there was nothing detected in the void before then

So how did he both power it and nail the "coordinates"

[marble pewter]

Either that will remain a mystery to us or DE will write something up

[rich meadow]

Licks the finger

I am now in unspeakable pain

[stiff beacon]

Bro probably stretched an atom or discovered how to use dark matter

[winged flume]

I hope The Teacher becomes re-playable, as well as all of the quests that aren't. Please. Particularly Vor's Prize, Limbo Thereom, and Hidden Messages, as well as Glast Gambit. The story is just so much fun. I hope Alad V get's a new reintro to explain the "betrayer" bit more for folks (like me) who missed events tied to him. Also, I hope Alad V comes back around again too. Salad Five.

The whole Story is just so much fun.

[eager briar]

If she didn’t get lost in the sauce, what wears do you think would have been pedaled by kira?

[drowsy saddle]

Somachords and shawzins

Maybe stand alongside Hombask in selling decor? That or she would have Gyre parts

[winged flume]

Is Teshin his real name? Or is that a Title like; Dax?

Is Teshin just Orokin for "Teacher"?

Teacher Dax.

[eager briar]

Dax is a title teshin his name

Teshin isn’t A teacher he’s OUR teacher

[winged flume]

Also; did the Orokin take the Zariman to Tau to set up Tauron and finally make a foothold or was the Tauron the ship/station that got them there? Were the rails set up after the Zariman incident? Has the Zariman gone missing twice? The first incident then disappearing again to later show up after Ballas's grandeur?

[pale cedar]

Sentients sent to build rail
Got impatient
Sent Zariman to beat the Sentients there which we all know how that went
Sentients built Rail
We use Rail
Temporary peace happens
Sentients later destroy rail on our side

[strange turtle]

The Zariman in Tau is a different one

[strange plinth]

the five-nine and the ten-zero
the only two zarimans we actually know anything about

[ocean geyser]

Salad V

[pale cedar]

We know all others other than 10-0 were unmanned drones which is something

[twin wigeon]

the unmanned zarimans deployed the world seeders to partially terraform perita and tau

[strange plinth]

the 5 series are the world seeders

[twin wigeon]

mhm

[strange turtle]

There’s the Zariman 10-0, a human colony ship that was to go to Tau via Reliquary Drive but failed, getting lost in the Void, coming back, going back into the Void and then coming back again after Ballas opened that Void portal using Praghasa

And then there’s the 5-9, an unmanned terraforming device tugged to Tau by a Cephalon-piloted ship

[twin wigeon]

Was the Zariman a colony ship? could've sworn it was like a military ship with weapons instead of a normal ship for colonists

[strange plinth]

its referred to as a military ship in the ember prime codex and a colony ship everywhere else afaik
idk why the ember prime codex is weird

[strange turtle]

Its a cover up, IIRC

[pale cedar]

That was the lie the Orokin used rather than truth

[dry oracle]

Dark sector connected to warframe?

[strange plinth]

cover up makes sense, ig

[strange plinth]

not beyond being a movie(?) in 1999

[twin wigeon]

Ember's Codex says all the environmentals were intact as if it never left but we know they were sabotaged

[strange turtle]

It was made from the original concepts for WF, and it exists in universe as like a book or movie

[dry oracle]

If dark sector hayden is the first protoframe

[strange turtle]

No that was specifically the agrithingies

[pale cedar]

It was never a military ship which you can easily figure out with the fact no soldiers were on board and the fact it had no real weapons

[dry oracle]

I mean the game

[twin wigeon]

you're think of the hit 1999 game, WarSector

[strange plinth]

WarSector is the game made by DE, but there's also like. movie posters around the mall & subway in whispers

[twin wigeon]

oh

[dry oracle]

War sector?

[pale cedar]

Dark Sector with another name

[fast dew]

Dark sector's equivalent basically

[twin wigeon]

i'd say an homage to Dark Sector, the old game DE made and had to abandon

[strange plinth]

its brought up in the 1999 ARG and then never relevant again lol

[winged flume]

Warsector is the proto version of Darksector before the released version of Darksector became a thing, the impetus of Warframe the one set in space.

[twin wigeon]

Nem! is that a Lorak as your profile pic :3

[pale cedar]

Yes

[twin wigeon]

:))

[winged flume]

Did an aspect of Rell become Mathila's husband?

Like Rell's Paradoxical twin

[strange plinth]

no
mathila's husband was in the duviri book

[fast dew]

I think he was always dead? Isnt that like

How she was written?

[twin wigeon]

no he was killed i thinks

[strange plinth]

he dies during the rain of chains, which is related to chains of harrow

[pale cedar]

No, Rell would’ve been saved from the ship and Garmi is a fictional book character that entered live action with the rest of Duviri

[strange plinth]

garmi that's his name,,

[fast dew]

GARMI??

What a name. Sounds like something in hollow knight

[strange plinth]

oh it does lol

[pale cedar]

He’s the lighthouse guy that Wally lightly tapped with a finger

[fast dew]

With hit names like Nuu and... Garmond and Zaza, it fits

[tall echo]

But it's not abandoned

[dry oracle]

Back when it used to be scary to fight the stalker in dark sector

[drowsy saddle]

Well it went from MMORPG to knock off resident evil clone

[dry oracle]

Oh no tagfer is missing I wonder what happened to him...

[wind ruin]

"Why would you put children on a military ship?" ~Dax in the time of war with the Sentients after the 10-0 was erased from recorded history and all ships are now military ships. "We didn't." ~Orokin who was allowed to remember the 10-0.

[twin wigeon]

deadass? or is it edited?

[fast dew]

Tagfer is just gone walking

Don't worry

Daily reset time

[brittle siren]

so I have been best friend of all 3 of the Triad, with Roathe is Loved. All of them are agree to help me united Loid. So how do I actiavte that scene?

@fast dew do you have any info about this?

[fast dew]

Nup. I have a video of the cutscene, but I haven't had a clue how to trigger it.

[brittle siren]

could you re-send me that video?

[winged flume]

https://youtu.be/SUrHsly8zP0?si=Ga1ktwSUYmYvfUya

We're all dopplegangers doing the Spiderman point pose meme wondering who's the Indifference.

[fast dew]

Yeah

Thats why Albrecht doesnt trust anyone

Took me a moment to understand that thumbnail too

The glass is Seriglass

Which.. I dont think looks like normal glass

[winged flume]

I just watched this and I had a similar thought around Heart of Deimos when that dropped, but I kept it at the back of my mind.

[fast dew]

But i digress

[winged flume]

How Carl Sagan said it best; "We are a way for the Universe to know itself" the Indifference took that further.

[fast dew]

Curious as to why you thought of it around the time heart of deimos dropped. Was it the requiem logs?

I know a lot of people miss the requiem logs nowadays

[winged flume]

I spoilered myself during that time even though I was a baby Tenno in 2019ish.

I didn't get my Operator until like mid 2023sh? I raced the way in after getting my last Stalker scan.

I wanted to be ready for the Whispers update for the Event.

[fast dew]

Ive found that the players who speed through the story miss a lot of the foreshadowing

Albrecht was mentioned in the duviri tablets, and not in a dismissive way

What was the ultimate fate of Albrecht Entrati?

A. He is entombed on Lua
B. That's the question, isn't it, kiddo?

[winged flume]

Yeah, the "correct" response is B.

[fast dew]

Oh, and not to mention his statues around duviri

Theres even one in the quest :)

[winged flume]

Please make Heart of Deimos replayable....

[fast dew]

It is lol

[winged flume]

DE, please.

[fast dew]

They fixed it now

[winged flume]

Oh

I'm like in another timeline then.

[fast dew]

Been replayable since Vallis undermind

[winged flume]

[fast dew]

Funny thing is, you enter deimos in that quest through Albrecht's prospect. I know its not intentionally done, but that is funny to me

[winged flume]

The last time I played that was 2020, so I suppose a new galavant is in order.

[fast dew]

It always is.

Don't replay whispers tho, that shit might bug your game

[winged flume]

No😭

That's one I want to replay, I still need to make the good ending. I'm like spread too thin in this game. I need to rank up Unko and my Op skills.

Ohh oop wrong quest.

[fast dew]

There's a few bugs w it i think?? One is that necraloid wont spawn i think
-# which is funny considering thats why heart of deimos was unreplayable

Oh no thats the hex

[winged flume]

Yeah I realized after I hit send.

[fast dew]

Good ending is the hex quest

[strange plinth]

might is an understatement

[fast dew]

Hey I replayed it after I finished the old peace and it was fine 😭

[strange plinth]

oh weird
maybe it broke after a hotfix then

[fast dew]

I just don't get bugs often ig???

Blessed copy of warframe on playstation

I think the worst bug i had was being spawned continually into water on the Plains

[winged flume]

I run on PC, via Steam Deck.

[fast dew]

Probably? Maybe the update when they allowed us to get into the dark refractory

Bcs that was...

A mess lowkey. Still is

Why can we enter the cathedral through necraloid's room.

[winged flume]

Despite Jades Shadow, despite grabbing EVERY scan of The Stalker, I still don't understand him.

[strange plinth]

i think i got locked out of all functionality mid-mission at one point
moonwalk bug or whatever. luckily the other people in the squad still completed the mission
wasn't a zariman mission and that's the only reason it stands out in my memory

[winged flume]

Maybe I'm just dumb.

[fast dew]

Nah, stalker is just weird

His codex entries wont tell you much

[strange plinth]

stalker's kinda weird yea, what's confusing, though?
might be able to help

[fast dew]

"I am your reckoning!" Or whatever

[strange plinth]

stalker's codex gives more info about the night of naga drums than stalker lol

[fast dew]

UEAH??

Damn. I missed em.
-# thats right i did i missed shadow and regular

[frail harness]

Gyre's timeline has me a bit confused

[fast dew]

You and a lot of people buddy

[winged flume]

His hatred of the Tenno, of the Warframes, what lead him to become one is just... I'm not understanding it yet, maybe in a few hours once I'm done re-exporting a recording of my playthrough of The Old Peace, an export I've done accidentally for the second time. I'll go to The Conclave and read the notes there and replay the quest.

[strange plinth]

there was a big discussion in another server about this recently
she uh. starts existing. at some point.

[frail harness]

Ive always been under the impression that the Zariman departed before the old war started and yet there was a warframe on board

[winged flume]

https://tenor.com/view/doctor-who-wibbly-wobbly-gendy-bendy-stuff-gender-gif-19260310

[fast dew]

||oh, this is fine and not entirely unknown. The tenno killed the only person who could save his wife i think?||

[frail harness]

Was she just on the zariman in a different timeline where warframes were made sooner and then eternalism stuff brought her to our zariman lol

[strange plinth]

Gyra is more than likely not Gyre, if that helps
Gyra was given to the zariman, Gyre's pieces are just onboard when it returns to the zariman in the modern era

[winged flume]

I still feel like the Protoframes make Warframes a bootstrap paradox.

[fast dew]

Dw. They all die.

Except for Flare and Kaya

[humble sierra]

She was made in honor of Gyra, a dancer, post the Zariman's return

[fast dew]

They all die.

[strange plinth]

no information of the protoframes would survive to the orokin era in order to inspire the warframes, so no bootstrap

[winged flume]

Doesn't mean Ballas can't find about them.

[humble sierra]

Since the Warframes weren't made until the Sentients rebelled and I think that was much after the Zariman was lost

[fast dew]

Ballas is dead

[frail harness]

I dont think warframes are a timeloop personally but I think the infestation may be

I think roathe engineering a Helminth for time travel may be the original source of the infestation

[winged flume]

The Warframes are part Infested.

[fast dew]

I mean, the loops extend to animals

[humble sierra]

Yeah the infestation somehow communicates through time

[fast dew]

The loop is presumably the loop from Duviri

[frail harness]

Oh I meant i think theyre a loop in the bootstrap paradox sense

[fast dew]

We changed it, it wasn't always a year long

Oh

[ashen pulsar]

is that confirmed

[fast dew]

Shit mb

[frail harness]

I think the infestation's origin is just that the infestation got brought back in time w/ the Roathe shenanigans

No true beginning

[humble sierra]

Gyra and Gyre are connected but I don't think there's anything to her beyond that?

[fast dew]

Nah,

Thats the helminth, helminth doesnt spread normally

It needs to be injected or purposefully cultivated

[frail harness]

Yeah but I fully believe infested strains can split as they evolve

Even Deimos' strain has opposing forces in its hivemind that could very well split

[humble sierra]

The Infestation is very likely man made (it would just fit a lot of the themes of the game)

[ashen pulsar]

I think gyre just reminds quinn of her

[fast dew]

Likely man made, yeah, but I wouldn't say its from the helminth

[ashen pulsar]

quinn says “The way you move now reminds me of her.”

[frail harness]

I mean given the techrot and Effervon lore is taken from Dark Sector, if we assume the infested lore as a whole is then the Infested is a bio weapon made by the US military lol

[fast dew]

Unless the helminth de-evolves itself lol

[frail harness]

Sometimes things evolve to be lesser for survival

[fast dew]

Ehhh. Dark sector isnt canon and shouldn't be treated as such

[humble sierra]

We don't know how much of darkSector's stuff carried over tbh

If anything

[frail harness]

I know. Thats why I said "if we assume". It isnt canon, but a lot of lore from DS was kept so its not impossible that more was

[strange plinth]

sure, but the helminth doesn't need to. especially if its connected through time, it knows it would pop back up later

[fast dew]

Its not a de-evolve in that sense, the helminth survives a lot

I mean to "de-evolve" in the way its de-evolved from being helminth back into techrot

[frail harness]

Infestation comes from Dark Sector, so does it turning people into biomechanical monsters, and Effervon is directly taken from Dark Sector too (granted i believe its name was Enferon), also used to kill the infestation

[fast dew]

Because the helminth is techrot, it's a more tame strain

[frail harness]

So I dont think its impossible

But tbh I hope we dont learn the history of the infestation that'd make it less cool to me

[fast dew]

I mean.

Dark sector is a movie in 1999

[strange plinth]

i mean, a good amount of 1999 uses DarkSector as inspiration/homages

[fast dew]

Its more Easter eggs than actual canon

[frail harness]

Unless the infestation is a bootstrap paradox then I do want them to show it because itd make me feel smart, but otherwise im keen for it to stay a mystery. Truthfully I dont think any reveal would be super satisfying

[humble sierra]

In some of the files, Höllvania is called Lasria, so there may have been plans for a canonization, but they obviously didn't go through with it

[strange plinth]

a bootstrap would be unsatisfying from a narrative standpoint
but maybe that's just me. don't like bootstraps

[fast dew]

Yall i have discovered that the peely pix are apparently scratch n sniff.

[hollow trench]

Nice

[frail harness]

Maybe not but theres no telling what DE does and doesnt want to use in the future, was all I was saying

[fast dew]

So.

Albrecht's peely pix. What would it smell like.

[humble sierra]

in fact if you set your username before logging as visit.lasria you get a little fun Easter egg

[hollow trench]

Could you imagine requiem peely pix

[winged flume]

Every time I think Darksector I think of the very original pitch prototype Warframe; Darksector.

[frail harness]

I dunno, I kinda like it. Such a devastating force brought back to the past due to actors like Albrecht only to end up technically being the origin of it. The Orokin are all about the folly and ego of man after all

[winged flume]

Not the one that actually launched.

[fast dew]

Mm smells of burnt human flesh, blood and vomit.
-# in reference to the requiem logs

[hollow trench]

Wow it sure smells like horrors beyond human comprehension

[fast dew]

War sector?

[humble sierra]

They utilized that old concept in the 1999 ARG as WarSector

[frail harness]

I dont think "infestation came from the infestation going back in time" would be satisfying exactly, but i think its the only reveal that wouldnt be dissatisfying, if that makes sense

[hollow trench]

I am considering getting khra tattooed on my right arm

We end as we began

[humble sierra]

Eh, I think there's plenty of things they could do

[fast dew]

Im considering getting the entrati crest on my neck lol

No god above knowledge goes hard as shit ngl

[frail harness]

Somehow 600 hours in and lots of lore videos later I only learned about the Radiation Wars three days ago from my MR0 friend telling me about a Lotus voice line I'd missed

[hollow trench]

What does that look like

[humble sierra]

Humans messing with stuff beyond their comprehension
Ancient mutations
Actual aliens

[fast dew]

The backrooms kinda has it but it's found on floors in the labs. The eye and the bits around it kinda

Ignore Eleanor

[frail harness]

I dont think id be satisfied with the infestation just being another man made weapon, nor it just being an alien thing

[fast dew]

I mean

Aliens in warframe are so scarce, it could be done well

[hollow trench]

Most likely once it consumed enough it scaled the thinking up

Essentially warframes version of the flood

Can try to kill it but it won’t go away

[frail harness]

If the infestation is a man-made weapon, the orokin using it as a weapon feels less.. impactful? I like that they found just a seemingly natural(albeit dangerous and volatile) disease and warped it to their purposes

[fast dew]

Is that not the murmur

I wonder how we'll defeat wally and keep our powers

[hollow trench]

Fair point

[frail harness]

Theoretically the infestation is killable you just gotta eradicate every single instance of it all at the same time. Very possible 👍

[fast dew]

Are we gonna do what we did to nihil and put him in the toob

[hollow trench]

Wally.zip lmao

[frail harness]

Not the helminth strain tho, the helminth strain can stay

Its chill

[hollow trench]

The infestations reaction to the void tho

Does it understand Wally is just a giant threat

Like Lizzie talks of the smiling one

[frail harness]

In 2083 we get the Infested Cure main story quest where we save the universe from the infestation by giving the passive Helminth Strain control over every infested hivemind and it leaves to peacefully terraform its own system to thrive in 🙏

[fast dew]

Have him on our hip like the boyfriend in Lollipop Chainsaw

[strange plinth]

hit it with ye olde 'we end as we began'
tbh if it was a man-made weapon, it's own evolution to what the orokin were dealing with is still far enough away from its original purpose, i think. seems to be its own thing at that point

[waxen mesa]

So where does the Operator fit in with the tenno faction hierarchy

[frail harness]

Nah the infestation is actually caused by Nidus Prime going back in time and dying deep in the earth's crust and a piece of his infested biomass being found by an oil rig drill trust DE told me

[waxen mesa]

are we the leader (under Lotus) is the faction mostly fragmented and don't have any formal structure?

[humble sierra]

Yeah pretty much

[fast dew]

Reckon Albrecht would play lollipop chainsaw? Ik its a 2012 game but i feel like i can envision him playing it and feeling girly pop

[humble sierra]

Lotus and Teshin are our mission coordinators

We're the best soldier in the army

[hollow trench]

Do you think Wally hates the infestation

[waxen mesa]

is it sort of like. the tenno are just a bunch of mercs with the Lotus being the handler

[strange plinth]

he's not shared an opinion on it tmk
might be one of few things he's actually indifferent on

[hollow trench]

Unorganized war crimes

[waxen mesa]

they probably find the infesation to be boring.

[frail harness]

I mean, the void and the infestation basically work the same, psychologically. Frenzied flame type beat, melt all that divides, yada yada. Neither particularly like when people do their own things and make their own connections

[fast dew]

In tf2 words
The lotus is the administrator, lotus is miss pauling and we're the mercs :)
-# sorry tf2 has suddenly popped up and is rotting my brain today

[waxen mesa]

human can be played with like toys. the infestation is just mindless. you can't torture an infested creature anymore you can torture an ant

[winged flume]

Which line and when/where?

[waxen mesa]

does "The Lotus" even exist anymore or has that been retconned out of existence

[fast dew]

She does

[strange plinth]

prolly one from Once Awake

[fast dew]

She exists, but she isnt alone in her head

[hollow trench]

I wonder what Wally tells her

[fast dew]

I still lowkey don't trust the lotus

[hollow trench]

What deal did she make if she made one with him?

[strange plinth]

there's a very big 'if' there

[fast dew]

Shes singing to keep him away.

Shes not at the edge anymore

Shes not singing i don't think

[frail harness]

I believe its during Once Awake, but I could be wrong. Apparently in a convo with Eleanor, she and the drifter agree that the Radiation Wars start to wipe out the Techrot which eventually becomes the infestation we know today. The radiation wars were the wars that led to the formation of the orokin

I never got that convo because I forgot to enable the all chats setting when I did the hex

[waxen mesa]

crazy how the radiation wars were canon back then

[frail harness]

They still are

[waxen mesa]

you've never reset the convos?

[strange plinth]

his attention might've been moved away from the sanctum a bit after the old peace?
unsure. her current location seems odd anyway

[fast dew]

Ive only reset the round table

[waxen mesa]

you misinterpreted my message.

Crazy how the radiation wars were part of the lore, even as old as that line is.

[fast dew]

I mean. Given how rabidly the murmur attacked, I wouldn't say that

Her absence was very much noted by Wally

[frail harness]

Yeah ive reset the hex a few times but I didnt learn about the all chats setting until recently and ngl I dont feel like doing all the hex convos again for the few I missed