lore-discussion

[hollow trench]

I bring him with in perita rebellion

And 1999 after the quest is done

[harsh sparrow]

Lazing around the private chambers, on the couch reading would be cool

[analog swan]

Wonder if Helmnith could upload memories of the infested person who was turned into warframe to the cloned body of one 🤔

[hollow trench]

Maybe ?

[stiff fable]

no

according to Lizzie something else is happening to Warframes that erases their minds

[hollow trench]

Huh

[analog swan]

Memory decline yeah, considering Stalker didn't remember everything and even umbra had bits and pieces

[hollow trench]

Do you umbra retains new memories

[stiff fable]

we don't know

[hollow trench]

Like if he was present w you during the new war

[harsh sparrow]

Wasn't that by Ballas' design though, to sentence Umbra to constantly relive when he killed his son

[stiff fable]

yeah, that's why Umbra is as sane as he is

[analog swan]

Perhaps they only remember strong trauma, then again, Jade seemed to be doing fine remembering why she even is playing sleeping princess

[stiff fable]

without that he'd degrade like a base Excalibur

[swift gyro]

oh, i am back. There are more tennos like our character around the universe? also, who is lotus like, i played the mission that tells about her and her ´´brothers´´ but i quiet dont understand her well, in the start i though lotus were smth like an mom to tennos😑😑😑

[hollow trench]

Maybe it’s just strong memory in general

[harsh sparrow]

Maybe it's just any especially strong experience?
Or maybe it's just cause of Jade's situation

Like, how do you forget that there's something living in you now

[analog swan]

Jade didn't seem to degrade though, so maybe it's about emotional chanrge of memory

[hollow trench]

This would seem plausible

[stiff fable]

Lotus is a Sentient

[stiff fable]

and yes, exactly

A strong emotion or bond slows (and possibly can stop) the degradation

this is part of the reason Albrecht screwed the Hex over as bad as he did

[fast dew]

No, the strain was modified specifically to be slower

If that was the case, we'd see it be slowed with Umbra

[analog swan]

I recall in flare convos that he was saying he would tour the stars to return to help us later 🤔

[versed terrace]

Okay
So since protoframes are people infected with a strain of their original warframe (from what im understanding)
Did the orokin base their designs of the warframes off of the protoframes?

[stiff fable]

it did, that's why he's not fully gone

[fast dew]

They would be hibernating on a comet.

[stiff fable]

it's been a thousand years for him

[earnest sapphire]

The elite archimedia has a check point on it, does that mean you can’t do it anymore?

[hollow trench]

The hex turning will be interesting. Because if they manage to retain their consciousness in some aspect it would be a proven method

But if flare is a full on frame that disproves that

[harsh sparrow]

Wouldn't that just cause a whole Ouroborus type time paradox

[analog swan]

yes but with this much degradation even with protos, he wouldn't remember us

[tall echo]

no, the protos are made with strains from the orokin era

[harsh sparrow]

Without the Protoframes, there are no Warframes
Without the Warframes, there are no Protoframes

[stiff fable]

incorrect

You can go straight to Warframes without protos

[swift gyro]

She kinda look human, ik she has a form that look more ´´sentient´´ but who made her? and why does she choose to help the tenno?

[stiff fable]

the only difference is that the protos haven't yet turned into full Warframes

[stiff fable]

The sentients are living machines

[misty salmon]

As far as we know the protos were all either destroyed or went missing without a trace before the orokin took over, hence no protos to base things off of and no bootstrap paradox.

[stiff fable]

Lotus is a "mimic" designed to look like a human

[versed terrace]

Aw
I kinda wanted that to be the case tho
But i see why it isn’t

[hollow trench]

But what if it becomes a situation like fry sleeping with his mother in futurama

[earnest sapphire]

Still no answer 💔

[hollow trench]

A loop essentially

[swift gyro]

roath is a proto tho

[hollow trench]

Or a paradox if you would 👀

[stiff fable]

No no, the protos are a change to the timeline

[analog swan]

Don't think they will, entrati did modify the warframe batch, I would think it's safe to assume Ballas is creator of frames but Entrati took that into the past and made a completely different thing after modifications

[stiff fable]

They did not originally exist

[harsh sparrow]

#warframe-general or #gameplay-discussion would probably answer gameplay questions more than
Yknow

The lore talk chat

[stiff fable]

Ballas created the Warframes
Albrecht got a Clever Plan and went back in time to spread protoframes during the first technocyte (infestation) outbreak

[swift gyro]

but if they werent supposed to exist, who made them at certain points of the time? albrencht?

[misty salmon]

yeah, but roath is a proto from after the orokin developed warframes, as are the others from Entrati's PoV.

[stiff fable]

Albrecht

[fast dew]

they wouldn't remember us, and they wouldn't. They don't.

[swift gyro]

do we know why he made protoframes?

[strange turtle]

There are many more, yes.

Lotus is the Sentient Natah, a Mimic (The Mimic “Queen”) made to imitate and copy the Archimedean (super scholar) Margulis, who was Executor Ballas’ lover.

This was a plot between him and her father, the Sentient Hunhow, to get the Tenno, use them against the Orokin and have her kill them (due to the threat they posed and Ballas’ personal dislike)

Natah, or rather, the Lotus, was barren and infertile due to the trip to the Origin System (our solar system) over the Solar Rail. The Rails make use of the Void, lethal to Sentients without protection, and even then rendering them infertile.

So she began to care for them genuinely, and took them in as her own, betraying Ballas and Hunhow. Both Orokin and Sentients were betrayed, and Lotus put the Tenno and their Warframes to sleep until the beginning of the game, when she has began to wake us up again

[stiff fable]

Albrecht was traveling through time trying to change little things for unknown reasons

[fast dew]

I don't think it was to change things

[stiff fable]

(but probably to logic bomb the Indifference out of existence)

[fast dew]

He set the loop up so things wouldn't change

[stiff fable]

he said he was creating weapons

BEFORE he built the Vessels

[strange turtle]

Unknown, though it was initially believed it was to have “spare warframes” for the Chosen Operator/Us

[fast dew]

The vessels? Or the hex?

[stiff fable]

The Hex and the other 1999 protoframes

[fast dew]

And that doesn't indicate he was doing it to change things

[strange turtle]

But in later conversations the Drifter and Hex begin to doubt that it was just this

[stiff fable]

After that first weapon-making trip he had the idea to make the Vessels with the Grey Strain

[pale cedar]

Hex predate vessels

[eager dragon]

I feel like it was more likely to "signal out" them as people the Drifter had to interact with, to rekindle their empathy/social skills.

But yeah, it's up for debate.

[swift gyro]

oh nice, i wanted to know more about what was that ´´sleep´´. also, (out of the topic question) how exactly does trasnference looks like for the drifter/operator, bcs i think that the operator stays in the ship in that ´´capsule´´ we stay while he remotly control the warframe as its own body

[fast dew]

We don't know why Albrecht even went to any past year

The loop he specifically set up stops anything from changing

[analog swan]

Makes sense he created more than one plan

[stiff fable]

Marie's KIM suggests that he was. His preaching about love and fraternity is pretty clearly trying to seed a more tolerant culture pre-Orokin Era

It just didn't work

[fast dew]

Or its just him trying to repent

[stiff fable]

unlikely

[fast dew]

.. yes it probably is

[stiff fable]

because that Albrecht ends up as this Albrecht

[fast dew]

He is wanting forgiveness, this has been a thing for Albrecht for ages

[analog swan]

Did Albrecht go to XX99 AFTER 1999 tho? It seemed he was more interested in going to tau

[stiff fable]

I believe he believes it, I just don't think he wants it for himself

[fast dew]

Unlikely.

[stiff fable]

yes

[swift gyro]

wouldnt the loop be an paradox? bcs, if an year is in an loop then its supposed to not go past that year, meaning that the year 2000 wouldnt start?

[stiff fable]

1999 was the first

He went there right after Duviri

[stiff fable]

time continues past the loop

But you keep the loop going because Wally can also change things if you don't

[analog swan]

Yeah but he might have gone to 1999 after XX99? Might have been one of MANY plans he has created

[fast dew]

How would he have left xx99? We know the time period is before 1999, and he could barely leave 1999 in the hex anyways

[swift gyro]

i mean, why would he want go to year 1999 since on earth and dont have much things that could help him, but in tao there is plenty of things that would help him somehow (thats what i think atleast)

[stiff fable]

that was an issue he had after his last travel to 1999

[eager dragon]

He went and came to 1999 several times long before the quest.

It only became an issue once Loid broke the casket.

[strange turtle]

Personally have a little theory that it was, in part, his way of trying to “save” people he had met and made friends/good opinions of (in the case of 1999, in his initial loops), even if he had to use them and become a “villain” to them to do it

Among his sentimental mementos in the Netracells, along with stuff like his(?) shawzin and a Token from Mother, you can find Arthur’s sword thing

[fast dew]

...the person is asking if he went to 1899 after the hex

[stiff fable]

ah, misread

[fast dew]

He couldn't have, not after the hex

[stiff fable]

General thing but if you're going to talk about a quest please capitalize it

The Hex is the quest, the hex is the group

[swift gyro]

that seems confuse, i know it sounds strange or random. but in an manwha about dungeon, the mc makes an certain exist outside the space both time or space. then its almost the same thing? the 1999 specially exist outside the line of time?

[eager dragon]

Oh, I also thought 1999 as in just the year, not the quest, lol.

[stiff fable]

no

It's the year 1999 but when the Hex get to the end of it they start back at the start

[analog swan]

And wally is a sore loser about 1999, so now he interferes with duviri

[stiff fable]

yep

[fast dew]

Has a thing against drifter now

[swift gyro]

i mean, in certain words the 1999 really exist outside the flow of time since its in an loop and doesnt go past that. no? i am just being too dumb to understand?

[analog swan]

Wally is in posession of Neci now, so he experiences all the joys of being a woman 🤔

[swift gyro]

who is wally?

[stiff fable]

no, you're just overcomplicating it

[swift gyro]

thx.

[stiff fable]

Time continues, but the loop also continues

Because if they don't keep the loop going, Wally can change it

[stiff fable]

The Man in the Wall, from the Chains of Harrow quest

[loud oriole]

Man in the Wall, Indifference, Vitruvian Man at the end of The New War, and the copy of the operator that spooks you on occasion

[swift gyro]

ik the man in the wall, but didnt know people called him wally.

[fast dew]

"Joys" trust me, as a ex woman, there is no joy.

Shit is just stressful

[swift gyro]

trust me, joy does exist and its called 100% promotion platinum

[fast dew]

I got 200% bonus plat once. Worth it.

[analog swan]

It does make me chuckle imagining he experiences his void time of the month tho 😅

[fast dew]

PLEASE LET IT

That would be funny

[swift gyro]

how...and such powers shouldnt even exist..

[fast dew]

Manifesting my period pain to Albrecht bcs he deserves it

[swift gyro]

not even him deservers such pain

[fast dew]

True actually thats ballas' job

He deserves it

[analog swan]

Was it even explained why the orokin have big right hand? What's it for?

[fast dew]

Fashion

Aesthetic, to show how much generosity they had

Egotistical bastards i know

[analog swan]

And here I thought it's to be practical, like get apple off a tree without using ladders :<

[swift gyro]

Warframe final update: Ballas dies from period pain, albrencht still makes proto frames to whoever he seem useful and we marry lotus

[fast dew]

Do not our mother

[swift gyro]

then we marry ordis

[fast dew]

Acceptable

[analog swan]

Can't we just clone ballas, turn him into a frame just so we can enter him via transference?

[loud oriole]

only acceptable option is to clone ballas so we can endlessly use him as a punching bag, or target practice

[swift gyro]

the problem is who we would clone him.

[analog swan]

but imagine all the good deeds we could do as ballas frame, puppeting him around 😄

he would hate that

[swift gyro]

and we would love it

[lilac aspen]

We convince DE to let us spawn Ballas into the spawn simulation test room

[stiff fable]

the last time someone brought Ballas back to torture him didn't end well

Sometimes dead is better

[hearty pewter]

i found john warframe

[analog swan]

Can't argue that logic... still hope we get more about Pazuul tho 🤔 that one was kind of abandoned. We did see Amar recently, so maybe we will see other archons

[loud oriole]

its him, THE John Excalibur

[stiff fable]

Pazuul should get more content in the next year, especially if people are right and he's the one who'll reactivate the Solar Rail

[analog swan]

interesting theory about Pazuul, is it based of anything from the game?

[stiff fable]

He's working on a major project

We don't know what

[analog swan]

So could be anything, like giving Kahl a facelift so he looks like handsome grineer again 🤷‍♂️

[stiff fable]

unlikely

but it's either building a new ship or something to do with the rail

or all new archons

[analog swan]

I thought archons were kind of mindless beasts, besides pazuul 'creation' wasn't explained how it happened. Perhaps in future

[stiff fable]

still need some for the purple and green shards

[analog swan]

it is a good story hook

I wonder... if clonning technology was available to Orokin, why wouldn't Ballas just clone Margulis? He should have had enough chances and DNA for that.

[stiff fable]

no continuity of memory

and memory is what matters to the Orokin according to Roathe

[analog swan]

Doesn't seem like he cared for one, given Khora or Lotus

[stiff fable]

He programmed Margulis's memories into Lotus

which is the important part to the Orokin more than the body

[analog swan]

"I loved you once, you know, you were so like her" - Ballas own words.

Hence why I wonder why couldn't he just clone margulis for himself or whole harem of them 🤔

[lilac aspen]

Bro loves Margulis so much that he can’t just settle for a memoryless clone

[analog swan]

yes, but if he programmed memories for lotus, he could do so with clone

[lilac aspen]

He was fine with Natah because she did exactly that

She reminded him of Margulis that much

[stiff fable]

Clones are a bit harder to program than robots

[lilac aspen]

Programming a machine is infinitely easier than programming neurons, I think

Especially if the machine is designed to adapt

Especially if that adaptive machine in question was born to mimic stuff as an ability too

[analog swan]

yeah but Ballas was by no means an idiot, he did design warframes after all

[lilac aspen]

The same ones who he also didn’t understand why they were tweaking out and why only the void children can fix it?

[analog swan]

point taken

[lilac aspen]

Because if he could easily do brain stuff
He should of figured out how to fix their crashing out

[analog swan]

makes sense, and besides it does seem like he tried. Khora if I recall was also attempt ot make something in Margulis image, so the guy was obsessed with perfection and nothing was perfect 🤔

[lilac aspen]

In a way
Ballas may of been an Orokin
But he did love Margulis
Just in an Orokin way

He did sound heartbroken when it was decided for her to be executed

And then that’s when he crashed out and decided to work with Hunhow

[analog swan]

True, lore confirms that much that his love was genuine for Margulis, he just went bananas, especially after tenno burned her

[proper barn]

I mean nothing is ever his fault

In his mind.

[stiff fable]

"Why did you make me kill you"
"Why did you make me betray my species to xenocide while I programmed a robot to look and sound and act like and replace you"

[proper barn]

Like after he threw lotus(natah) away

He looked for her again. Cuz like

He's not a guy that thinks about future stuff.

[stiff fable]

Ballas loves himself and his power and the idea of caring about anything outside of that is a distant 10th

[lilac aspen]

Tbf
Margulis was more like in 2nd place, everything else was in 10th
Roathe even went “Dude, if she told him to curb stomp a baby, he’d do it, no questions or hesitation.”

[lean garden]

I mean, he did love her to the extremes once

[lean garden]

and burn the empire down, which in a way, he still did lol

[fast dew]

Eh, clearly not enough

[lean garden]

not even "no question or hesitation" its "done before shes finished the sentence"

[fast dew]

Still voted to kill her, regardless of "blackmail" or whatever that could mean in regards to orokin leadership

[swift gyro]

never though about it, but what is the place we do the meastery test?

[analog swan]

Which begets a question, if Ballas would listen to Margulis, would he do what he did in the Old Peace or was she also in on the plan?

[lilac aspen]

Like to put in perspective how much he loved her

The first thing he saw when that weird mask was put on, wasn’t anything involving him being the superior or king or whatever.

It was Margulis.

Bro says he wants to be king and supreme and all that evil villain mindset

But in reality he just wants Margulis back

[brazen seal]

his cope mechanism

[lilac aspen]

To think if only things could of been different
Ballas could of been the guy helping the Tenno

Imagine
Waking up and you hear Ballas go “Wake up Tenno.”

[analog swan]

Given how all the orokins are, especially the executors, the other six must have been laughing their ass off when Ballas watched Margulis enter jade light

[cunning tapir]

imho, if any love for Margulis existed in Ballas' cold festering hole where a heart should be, that love died the moment he decided that she should love him and only him.
At that point, all that he felt was obsession and entitlement.

[lilac aspen]

“We got a solar system to fix for Margulis.”

[fast dew]

EXACTLY

Comparing this to something like Loid and Albrecht (this is the only "healthy" relationship between an orokin and a regular nonblue person), Its so very, very different

[lilac aspen]

About that….

[analog swan]

I'd question if albrecht and loid is healthy...

[stiff fable]

even that one's really only healthy in comparison

[lilac aspen]

hoooo boy

[fast dew]

Hence the quote marks.

[lilac aspen]

The Roathe Chats man

[stiff fable]

yeah fair

[lilac aspen]

Roathe really makes you start to realize some stuff

[fast dew]

What, Albrecht's ||dead wife|| he never cared for?

That was arranged?

[analog swan]

So...was Margulis a good person?

[stiff fable]

Yes

[fast dew]

Roathe feels like story telling from someone biased

[lean garden]

I'd say comparatively better than most

[lilac aspen]

Roathe went as far as to offer a deal with the Drifter to help Loid get out of the basement and actually to talk to the family instead of moping about worrying about seeing his Albrecht.

Like
Unprompted offer
Like literally “Hey you help me, I help Loid.”
“I- what?”

[stiff fable]

But her culture was incredibly evil which poisoned the ultimate good she worked to do

[fast dew]

Oh. That.

He's doing it out of spite for Albrecht.

[analog swan]

In no way she would be unaware of the whole plan in Perita tho... as she said ||"You already know the answer"|| that is pretty open to interpretation.

[fast dew]

Not for care towards loid.

[lean garden]

I dont think it "died" because thats way too binary for what happened.

It looked more like it got mixed in with said obsession etc, which is why he wasnt in a good state after the execution.

[stiff fable]

(The answer is that Ballas set you up)

[fast dew]

He doesn't like Loid, like. At all.

[analog swan]

And she was oblivous to ALL of it? Somehow I don't buy that fully 🤔 seems fishy

[stiff fable]

Just from the few conversations I've seen (damn you descendia) Roathe mostly hates Loid because he sees their situations as very similar

[fast dew]

He complains about him constantly. Insert the line about him being disappointed that the butler that serves the labs was Loid of all people

[stiff fable]

not oblivious, just had no way to know what happened until too late

[lilac aspen]

(Nah clearly Margulis also hates those clankers and didn’t want her children befriending them/j)

[strange turtle]

Just found this relevant bit

[stiff fable]

Because Itzam was assassinated ten minutes after your "award" was presented with the message inside

[analog swan]

Or she wasn't one dimensional good character by default, which might be that as well

[fast dew]

I honestly doubt if Nitokh ever loved Roathe.

[stiff fable]

she was already that by being a high-ranking Archemedian

[fast dew]

Hm?

Archimedians are just scholars

[stiff fable]

Not JUST scholars

[fast dew]

Researchers. Scholars, that sorts stuff

[analog swan]

Exactly, they aren't 'good' people by default

[stiff fable]

The best and brightest

[fast dew]

That doesn't necessarily mean they've done anything bad

[stiff fable]

The weapon engineers, the torture imaginers

[analog swan]

they are loyal to Orokin empire

[stiff fable]

The beneficiaries of the Orokin system

[quick wadi]

I would say odds are against them, but yeah I would say thats true

[stiff fable]

The gap in status between Executor and Orokin vs that between Orokin and not, the single minded devotion to the lover and their insane plans, picking up projects they lost interest in, the emotional pain the lover would inflict because they just couldn't be damned to care...

Roathe definitely can see the parallel

The difference of course is that Albrecht does seem to have actually cared

[cedar cedar]

Something minor that I kept thinking about, I feel like there’s something just so haunting the way that the man in the wall still calls the drifter “kiddo”

[swift gyro]

how can this thing appear inside of my spaceship? like, it uses some kinda of power?

[quick wadi]

I imagine cause he encountered them first as a kid still

[stiff fable]

rap tap tap

[lilac aspen]

Just does

[stiff fable]

You broke the chains

Now he's back

[analog swan]

Wish he paid half of the rent if he freeloads tho

[lilac aspen]

You answered the rap tap tap

[quick wadi]

I did like the acknowledgement of having to deal with wallys shit before rell shut him up for a whole

[stiff fable]

omg

[swift gyro]

this thing make our character have entire books of traumas and he just live free in the spaceship. i calling DE for this ngl.

[stiff fable]

absolute best response to the Uriel scene in Old Peace

"Change of plans. Leave nothing alive."

[lean garden]

I think he alludes to it in the VMs when he talks about being reduced to her plaything/consort

[analog swan]

Uriel is a "spin to win" frame

[lilac aspen]

Rap tap tap, you’ll let me in little piggy

[exotic tulip]

they just ripped that one negan line

[fast dew]

See, the difference was is Nitokh viewed him as that. A plaything. Albrecht doesn't see loid as that. He sees loid as above him

[stiff fable]

hang on

[exotic tulip]

is the uriel in old peace the same on in XX99

[lean garden]

well duh, thats why he hates loid

[quick wadi]

Albrecht at least acknowledges his shortcomings....even if he doesn't do much on fixing them

[exotic tulip]

or is he just a protoframe of that uriel

[stiff fable]

call me by your name intensifies

[stiff fable]

No

[lean garden]

their situations are so parallel but loid is actually loved

[fast dew]

Albrecht views himself as a wet paper towel, Nitokh sees herself as a solid bar of 99.9% purity gold personified

[exotic tulip]

then why he goes to hell or something

[cedar cedar]

“Rap tap tap, you’ll let me in little piggy”

[exotic tulip]

what the hell is even that hellish looking place

[stiff fable]

Long story short: the guy in 1899 turned all his soldiers into Uriel Warframes

[exotic tulip]

i know theyre memories

[stiff fable]

It's 1899

[main crane]

I assume the Uriel in Perita is just one of the Uriel battalion of Roathe.

[stiff fable]

Oh, descendium?

[exotic tulip]

wait what guy

[lilac aspen]

Inb4 DE goes
“Sike, it’s 1699.”

[lean garden]

its the inside of roathes mind

[stiff fable]

That's how Albrecht's memory machine interprets Roathe's memories (maybe with the infestation?)

[exotic tulip]

oh

[main crane]

Descendia is like a representation of the Drifter going deeper in Roathe's mind.

[stiff fable]

Oh but the mission types are because of your Operator/Drifter

[analog swan]

Yes, he does deeper into Roather, up to 21 levels

[fast dew]

He does! He seems to be preparing to die for his actions :) to bleed for what he's done. "If i am to be a devil, let me be an honest one." Is a banger line from Albrecht tho

[stiff fable]

just interpreting things

[lean garden]

and the enemies too

[stiff fable]

yes

[exotic tulip]

but if theyre not the same warframe why he calls himself the devil of tau

[stiff fable]

I nearly screamed the first time the glass resonance popped up

[stiff fable]

The title was his in the first place

[quick wadi]

I should clarify he doesn't really seem to do much to make up for his shortcomings as a person. More hes just tunnel visioning his way to beat the indifference at any cost

[exotic tulip]

ohhhh so the warframe is a copy of the blue guy protoframe

[main crane]

Roathe being the Devil of Tau is literally the reason he has an army of Uriel Warframes.

[lean garden]

theyre all uriel because he's the devil of tau

[lean garden]

no

[quick wadi]

Which I mean...fair enough, it is a big problem

[exotic tulip]

mhm mhm

[lean garden]

compared to his men he became a uriel much later

[main crane]

Roathe had just shit luck lmao

[exotic tulip]

oh so like he made uriels then became one later

badass title btw

[analog swan]

ironic but that's what Roathe's life is, irony at it's finest

[stiff fable]

No no, the order is funny for this
Uriel Prime is created
Roathe is nicknamed the Devil of Tau during the Old War part 1
Roathe's legion are Warframe'd into Uriel because of the name
More Old War part 1, things go bad for Roathe
Albrecht grabs him and turns him into a Uriel protoframe
Albrecht dumps him in 1899 with two religious people

[lilac aspen]

Albrecbt then leaves him stuck with two religious people to watch over him

[stiff fable]

That's important, edited

[fast dew]

Literally blackbagged his ass

[exotic tulip]

mhm mhm got it

[stiff fable]

https://tenor.com/view/shmil-s-half-life-combine-pick-up-that-can-can-gif-22262138

[exotic tulip]

autistic guy and a french woman

[fast dew]

Literally got his ass

[exotic tulip]

autistic and anti social

[fast dew]

... rell isn't related to lyon

[exotic tulip]

he refuses to talk to me

[fast dew]

Lyon just doesn't like you yet i think

[lilac aspen]

Albrecht is evil
Leaving Roathe stuck with french people

[exotic tulip]

stalker didnt like me either yet he came to ask for help.

[main crane]

Well, it was a dire situation

[exotic tulip]

rell isnt french i think he doesnt have teh accent

[stiff fable]

Worse, Marie's accent is Quebecois

Apropos of nothing, but the Geneva Convention exists because Canadians did a bunch of war crimes in World War II

[fast dew]

Because hunhow convinced him so, and he had a dying wife

[fast dew]

Well isn't the story that the Quebec accent is closer to the original french accent?

[stiff fable]

ish

[lilac aspen]

Canadians really did throw cans of food over to the German to train them to expect food

And then tossed grenades

[stiff fable]

but yes

[exotic tulip]

the operator piloting uriel was just a dmc5 reference

[ashen pulsar]

yeah but not just that

[stiff fable]

.....you know that's actually possible

[loud oriole]

minus the plastic lawnchair

[ashen pulsar]

a ton of trench raiding and hostage killing

[stiff fable]

Right around summer Reb was making a bunch of DMC references with Steve during the devshort

they were totally planning it then

[exotic tulip]

mhm mhm it was a badass moment

even his third or second ability when he spins is a move you can do in dmc5 in sin devil trigger mode

[desert oak]

Roathe Conversation Spoiler: ||I'm KIMing with Roathe and he has just referred to Nitokh with very interesting terminology: The Blood Queen. While officially Garuda is called a 'gore queen', that terminology is very reminiscent of her despite not being precisely identical due to Garuda's own vampire theming. Secondarily, 'Blood Queen' is one of the most popular fan names for Garuda. I wonder if that symbolism is purposeful, especially given that Garuda still has no lore.||

[stiff fable]

Hang on, Garuda has lore!

She was found in a bunch of mushrooms

Which we now know are part of the Undermind/Nokko

[desert oak]

I think that's very transitive lore, especially since she wasn't found in some fungi. Her blueprint was. I feel Roathe's ||reference to a Blood Queen is much more direct|| to inspire theorizing about.

Though it could, of course, always be connected to both somehow.

[stiff fable]

So, jokes aside, no, it's not a Garuda reference

Both Garuda and Nitokh's nickname are references to Elizabeth Bathory

Who was a European noblewoman famous for bathing in the blood of women

[lilac aspen]

Nokko saw her sleeping and went
“Yo I’m gonna prank her.”

[stiff beacon]

bit of weird ass coincidence

[stiff fable]

[strange turtle]

We fed Nitokh to the mushrooms

Genius

[stiff fable]

honestly, that'd be good

[fast dew]

Well, now that we know Nihil isn't a executor

Who is Nitokh standing in for?

[stiff fable]

Sloth, probably?

[wind ruin]

Not with that, ah, bloody attitude? Wrath, I'd have thought.

[strange turtle]

Maybe the Regent bit refers to their role “under” the emperors, rather than her replacing someone?

[wind ruin]

Emperors are the majority shareholders, Executors are the Board of Directors and CEOs...

[strange turtle]

Like, them being “regents” who govern in the Emperor’s stead and execute their will, with Nitokh being the like, “Head” of the council?

[fast dew]

Nah, her title "Regent" implies she is standing in for a incapacitated executor

[stiff fable]

The concept has completely changed over the centuries, but I think about the first VM from Rothe where he talks about how ultra bored she is

[wind ruin]

Sloth could fit.

[stiff fable]

she doesn't kill people out of hate, she kills people to feel something

[stiff fable]

If she has gold statues alongside the rest of the Seven and is listed in the list of the Seven Executors, she's an Executor

[wind ruin]

Whomever is in charge of the military is Wrath, I'd think.

I'm having difficulty deciding whether Ballas is Pride, Greed, or Lust. Or if he's some amalgamation of all of them.

[fast dew]

Pride tbh. Or envy.

[stiff fable]

I've heard he's envy yeah

[lean garden]

I really think she's like acting for the emperors, as with the other executors

its just that the orokin need for pompous titles landed her with that one

[mystic lynx]

Why does Roathe just VC me random tid bits of Orokin history unprompted

[fickle tinsel]

We taking about which sin each exec is?

[mystic lynx]

Is he that lonely

[lean garden]

funny enough both her and roathe experience a smidge of nominative determination

[stiff fable]

actually here's a thought

[lean garden]

its paving the road lol

[stiff fable]

What orokin virtues correspond to the executors

[drowsy saddle]

It is prompted, usually after you clonk him in the head

[stiff fable]

Agility, Coaction, Cunning, Endurance, Power, Speed, and Stealth

[strange plinth]

envy fits with his burning down the empire because margulis valued the tenno over him or whatever
though i'm not sure how exactly envy fits into everything going on during the new war

[strange turtle]

Wait where did we learn these were virtues?

[mystic lynx]

Ah it's tied to us doing dark refactoria canonically at least?

[drowsy saddle]

Eyup

[mystic lynx]

The mods

[drowsy saddle]

Specifically the number of times we blow up his throne

[strange plinth]

i thought i saw something about redtext mentioning them as virtues at some point? debatable source

[stiff fable]

Duviri tablets

And from Update 18's patch notes
"The Halls of Ascension are tightly wound into the fabric of known Orokin civilization. […] Challenge yourself in seven unique rooms across seven principles for new unique mod rewards. The measure by which the Orokin were judged will now put you to the test."

[wind ruin]

Those tests on Lua are all about 'worthiness to be Orokin'. It's buried in the background materials too. Get all seven in front of witnesses, hey, welcome to the caste.
Of course, they're all lethal tests...

[stiff fable]

The measure by which the Orokin were judged is the interesting bit

[worn trout]

does old peace come before old war?

[strange plinth]

during

its in the middle

[stiff fable]

Old War pt. 1
Old Peace
Old War pt. 2

[worn trout]

wgat

[humble sierra]

Not unprompted, it's tied to you killing him in Descendia

[worn trout]

damn so pt2 is when sentients 'rebel'?

[humble sierra]

Pt1 is the rebellion

[stiff fable]

Sentients rebelled in part 1

[humble sierra]

Old Peace is them gaining independence

[stiff fable]

part 2 is after the Orokin break the peace and blame it on a rogue Warframe/the anarchs

[worn trout]

pt1 is not in the game is it

[stiff fable]

correct

[humble sierra]

Yet

[worn trout]

also pt2 is right before the big time jump?

yk to tutorial

sorry i left out until 1999 plot

[brazen seal]

old war ends
we sleep for 1000 years
game begins

[restive river]

Pt 2 is when Hunhow would destroy the rail

[stiff fable]

what the quest did is finally lay out a broad timeline of the Old War

[worn trout]

1000 years? i thought it was like 20k years lol

[restive river]

After the war is the night of the naga drums then the big nap of about a thousand years

[strange plinth]

its at least 1000 based on something w/ jade's memory feathers

[restive river]

Wasn’t it based off what Varzia said?

The Jade feathers just reinforced it to a degree

Ballas was more so mocking her about how long she’d need to stay still iirc

[strange plinth]

i'm not aware of a varzia line that points to it, just the jade feathers
i wouldn't be surprised if we had an estimate from her as well though

[brazen seal]

I based it on varzia

[strange plinth]

ah

[humble sierra]

The biggest glimpse of Pt2 we see is the cinematic opening cutscene of Awakening, then maybe the Erra cutscene

[brittle siren]

Do any of the 1999 hex members (including the “ETA” trio, not the Devil Triad) believe in Sol and Lua gods?

[humble sierra]

Eleanor seems like she does, Lettie has her own gods, the others all seem to be more agnostic

But still say things like "Sol damn it"

[stiff fable]

Eleanor wanted to be a nun, so yes

[fast dew]

Roundtable is the name for those 3. And flare.

[strange turtle]

Eleanor does but also has a thing about having not thought they were “real real”?

It’s a rank 6 convo

[fast dew]

I know what she means

She, unlike lettie, doesn't think the sun and moon are literal people, moreso just myth. Kinda like how folk don't believe that there was a literal god and he, as his son jesus came to earth, but there was probably a dude called jesus who did things in that time

[lean garden]

historically there was a dude called Jesus, because theres a few records of a roman admin going "yo whatever is happening over on that corner of the empire is goofy"

[modest stream]

gotta wonder who this line is referring to

[loud oriole]

sorry i was playing nidus earlier in hollivania

[modest stream]

Nidus was one of the dialogue choices lol

[strange plinth]

xaku fits there the least imo
compared to the others at least
and iirc nekros isn't an option

[loud oriole]

would be cheeky if DE added another option for Uriel since that would really be sight for the scaldra

[modest stream]

in the context of the Proto-Frames Xaku absolutely fits IMO

[sly pagoda]

Space Satan at that.

[strange plinth]

as a proto, sure
but for a regular frame?

[stray dove]

Is the xenoflora a reference to "Flowers for Algernon"? Because--

[modest stream]

I mean its still pretty... unordinary

[strange plinth]

oh yea kullervo is also a weird choice for that convo
he has some knives in him, so what

[modest stream]

cause its still 3 people stitched together

[drowsy saddle]

God could you imagine if Uriel could yell Roathe's boss fight quotes?

"Uriel demands Brimstone!"

[modest stream]

also they turns into a void skeleton from hell which is also terrifying

[strange plinth]

they
and the void skeleton's just sitting in the shell anyway

[drowsy saddle]

Much like a lizard sheds its tail to escape danger, xaku sheds their skin to evade damage

[mystic lynx]

What's the other option?

[modest stream]

Nidus Kullervo Sevagoth Xaku Grendel

iirc

[loud oriole]

"what do you mean it exploded and was only a skeleton with a gun mowing down our troops?!" - Scaldra, probably

[mystic lynx]

Sevagoth seems very tame compared to everyone here

[stiff fable]

what rank convo is that

[strange plinth]

"He feeds on the spirits of the dead to come back to life."

[stiff fable]

Because the whole "Viktor tumblr meme" post is still the greatest thing ever

[modest stream]

Best Friends

[strange plinth]

r6c7

[stiff fable]

YUP IT'S ANOTHER REFERENCE

[modest stream]

the grim reaper?

Personally I would've picked Dagath she is literally the headless horseman

[stiff fable]

January 12th 1999, Viktor Vodyanoi is baffled that 50+ new members joined The Hex litterally overnight.

He has no idea which of them, if any, are the Drifter Nightingale keeps talking to on the coms.```

[drowsy saddle]

Wait that last sentence. Is everyone on the same damn radio frequency?

[strange plinth]

nekros, rev, dagath, voruna maybe?
are better fits than xaku or kullervo
oraxia, nokko, and uriel would also be up there but obv they didn't exist when the dialogue was written

[stiff fable]

Open mic night baby!

[strange plinth]

it sure seems like it with 90% of the convos lol

arthur makes jabs at viktor and viktor seems to know arthur is talking to us during the tank assassinations

[mystic lynx]

Well we have another grim reaper already
Only one that eats other people
Only one that's an amalgamation of frame
Only one that is almost purely infested
And Kullervo lore is an entire 3 paragraph long

[loud oriole]

i mean technically every frame a player has would be horrifying to the scaldra since we're min-max/walking (or standing) nukes

[modest stream]

its 1999 so radio encryption isnt great lol

[drowsy saddle]

Good thing the operator can't exist in 1999. Im fairly sure Victor would let himself be eaten by techrot if he had to constantly hear "My warframe is strong"

[strange plinth]

true

[drowsy saddle]

What's wrong with Kullervo, he's a finnish convict with a penchant for daggers

[sly pagoda]

On the other hand if we got to raid his command center.

“Rap Tap Tap, You’ll let me in little piggy”.

[mystic lynx]

Suprised Garuda was also not an option

[drowsy saddle]

Mfw i jam the radiowaves with "Roses from the Abyss" to drown out Scaldra's comms

[strange plinth]

that would acknowledge garuda in lore, we can't have that

[drowsy saddle]

What if Garuda had lore, but everyone who documented it got put in the blood altar

[modest stream]

Oh Umbra would be an option too

I think the screaming would be pretty scary

[mystic lynx]

Jade

[sly pagoda]

Roathe. “Now i am in something called a mall”.

[drowsy saddle]

If umbra could drink, Arthur and him would empty the Roundtable's liquor stores

[loud oriole]

showing up to the scaldra mission with the broken umbra mask so they have a horrifying sight as i slash-dash toward them

[brittle siren]

tbh just use Nekros and pull the soul of the dead back up is enough

[drowsy saddle]

Umbra and Arthur being scar eyed buddies

[brittle siren]

did we know how Arthur eye is like that?

[stiff fable]

bullet to the knee eye

[drowsy saddle]

Ain't it from his time in service

[brittle siren]

btw whose Vessel did Wally control during the end of Whisper in the Wall

we know the middle one in the room is Arthur

[stiff beacon]

amir shocked him @brittle siren if rememberring some kim chat dialog

correctly

[brittle siren]

how shock a man cause ONE eye to be blind?

[drowsy saddle]

Magic lightning

[strange plinth]

says "some of those scars he has"
doesn't specify that its the eye, though it could be, unless there's a different explanation given elsewhere

[brittle siren]

if I have a dollar for everytime a character have an eye or two gone because of a younger person than them, I would have 2 dollar

[tawdry lintel]

i think i found the Gruzzling speaking english

not sure if im mishearing it tho

[brittle siren]

Kinda spoiler but does anyone know if there is a secret glyph for Uriel or Roathe?

[humble sierra]

Doesn't seem like, but there is a secret Honoria for killing Roathe while using Uriel

And another one for going through all 21 floors on Steel Path without dying or stopping

[strange plinth]

have to be solo for that one too

[stiff fable]

Oh clever

[brittle siren]

what does that call?

[humble sierra]

Something Latin, I think Descensus Diaboli Avernum?

[tall echo]

Nerves fried

[tall echo]

New goal obtained

[lean garden]

which is rude because Ive done that multiple times and have gotten nothing

[tall echo]

Gruzzlings speak english gibberish

[humble sierra]

Was significantly easier last week imo

[lean garden]

does it fail to trigger if any of your teammates die?

[tall echo]

Solo

[lean garden]

because like, I have an immortal inaros

[strange plinth]

Facilis Decensus Avernum

[humble sierra]

Needs to be solo apparently

[lean garden]

OH SOLO

welp, Im going back in then

i kid you not my inaros really cannot die

[tall echo]

I'm gonna do it later too now that I know about it

[strange plinth]

-# i did it with valkyr a day or two ago, that's the only reason i know lmao

[tall echo]

Same except apply that to all my health tanks

[tawdry lintel]

i know the Murmur speak Voidtongue
but one of the gruzzlings quotes sounds like its saying, somewhat clearly: "Gruzzler! I Gruzzler."
(i did add that to the wiki, but im not sure it tis accurate)

[tall echo]

As I said, gruzzlings speak english gibberish

[strange plinth]

gruzzlings are like pokemon, then

[tall echo]

There are words but it's mostly nonsense

[fast dew]

Gruzzlers also appear to say i love mara or something like that

[tawdry lintel]

i mean, if translated word for word, voidtongue is kinda like english gibberish

[fast dew]

Words picked up by the books it stole from Loid kekw

[tall echo]

That's just all language

[tall echo]

His doomed old man yaoi book?

[fast dew]

Nah Albrecht's angsty fantasy romance books that Loid holds dear

[tall echo]

Same thing

[celest needle]

How does grendels body work

He has a giant mouth in his stomach
can curl his body into a ball and move like a ball
and has basically infinite storage in his stomach to eat things like the Murmer

Does he work off of cartoon logic or something?

[strange plinth]

same void shenangians going on with the orbiter's storage room probably

[celest needle]

The orbiter is biiiiiig ship tho

Grendel casually splits half of his body open to consume a tusk Dargyn

Curls into a ball at mach speeds

and somehow can vomit it all out

[strange plinth]

correct
and given that warframe abilities are powered by the void, they're not particularly limited by the actual space grendel takes up

[celest needle]

Then where do the enemies go

subspace?

[swift gyro]

is it explained how exactly orokins,ballas and albrencht created warframe/protoframe?

[lean garden]

like what exactly are you asking for

like the science behind it or just the general how

[swift gyro]

the general

i think exactly would be hard to explain

[strange plinth]

not exactly, but we know that they cultivated a strain of infestation into the Helminth, this was primarily ballas's doing, and then it could be individually edited and injected into a subject to transform them into a warframe
albrecht took existing warframe batches and modified them to be a slower transformation, but its otherwise the same process

[swift gyro]

also, what is the infestation and is it different from helminth? what/who started the infestation

[strange plinth]

the infestation's origins are unknown, other than already existing prior to 1999
helminth is a strain of it, like the gray strain on deimos (makes things big) or the mutalist strain remade by alad v (specializes in taking over tech)

as for what it is
uhh someone else can take that question

[tall echo]

They are very visibly turned into some kind of energy when consumed

[restive river]

Helninth is a strain of the infestation, the infestation is a “techno-organic parasite”
It’s true origin is unknown, we know it predates the Orokin though

[humble sierra]

We also know that Ballas had enough control over the Warframes and their designs to specifically give them their abilities and appearances

[restive river]

It can take in pretty much anything and use it

[swift gyro]

hmm, what is the most ´´past´´ thing we know about? like, who started all the bad things in the past?

[celest needle]

Even Kubrows

[tall echo]

Great question

[brittle siren]

I love this challenge than what ever the muck is 60 eyes, Apex tank and whiney Vor

[tall echo]

It's just a fair skill challenge rather than an overinflated numbers fest, it's great

[swift gyro]

to give warframe abilities it isnt only void right? does it involve like the perso who turned into protoframe? i only know that the protoframes are just the rough ideia to what will be the warframe.

[restive river]

Furthest back we know is 1997 or 1998, where the people who owned On-Lyne worked with Scaldra to make the Coda Clones

As for what really started everything, we don’t know
In some ways Albrecht is responsible for a lot of major issues atm though

[brittle siren]

better version of Circuit too

[tall echo]

Nope, just void

[brittle siren]

also yay

[swift gyro]

albrencht and ballas too, i assume?

[restive river]

Protoframes aren’t the original frames

We know the frames are designed, we know their design can even be altered and we know they are void powered (which is likely how they can use many of their abilities)

[celest needle]

I always took that as just a visual effect but then, how does Grendel eat energy

[swift gyro]

but if its just void, then if ballas wanted a specific ability (idk why he even created warframes) it would take a lot if time no?

[restive river]

Yeah Ballas has caused a lot of issues
Like
Most things can just be put on the Orokin in terms of blame lol

[restive river]

The void powers the abilities and the frames

The frames can exist without it but they’re def weakened

[tall echo]

Not really, he's extremely intelligent

[brittle siren]

idk if he did this because he want to put in sth inside Techrot-the ancestor of the Infested-to help our Tenno

[restive river]

It’s probable that the abilities could be using some level of conceptual embodiment but that’s speculative atm, we mainly just know everything they are is designed

[brittle siren]

I dont even know if anyone can change the past

[swift gyro]

So basicly, ballas can create an frame with certain abilities, but he needs the void to do void things to the warframe then they get stronger?

[tall echo]

As for why ballas made warframes... it's in the name

[restive river]

What
No I’m not saying he had anything to do with the coda

[tall echo]

Frames channel void energy for their abilities

[brittle siren]

imagine first warframe ever is literally Ballas picture frame that have legs and arms

[strange plinth]

"events can be rewritten, traces of the original remain"
palimpset of spacetime

[restive river]

Yeah, think of the void as electricity and the frames as like
Idk a microwave ig lol

[tall echo]

Excal is the first

[swift gyro]

didnt albrencht looped 1999 so someone wouldnt change it?

[glacial bough]

All the Protos are after the fact. They have no bearing on abilities

[brittle siren]

I'm joking lmao

[tall echo]

A very angry microwave

[restive river]

The timeline extends past the loop and any changes made in the loop go though to the rest of the timeline
We know that events can be rewritten

[tall echo]

He looped it to give himself more time

[brittle siren]

Oh no I'm talk about generally, because Techrot already exist, and Albrecht said he would give the "cure" but in reality it just make things worse

Idk why he would make infested/techrot stronger though

[restive river]

We just do not understand why he did most of what he did tbh

[swift gyro]

but arthur is proto of excalibur and we see that he can use abilities from excalibur or is this wrong? bcs right now my mind is like this> Protoframe are the concept created by albrencht or ballas, then there is the warframe that were made by ballas and finally the prime frames that are an ´´rich´´ version upgraded with tech of orokin.

[restive river]

The only known motive for going to 1999 is he figured out that’s where he needed to go
We don’t really know why

[tall echo]

Proto comes after base

[swift gyro]

but if he needed more time, why didnt him traveled more back into the time? (idk if this was even possible for him when he looped 1999)

[brittle siren]

also talking about "can the victim affect the frame ability", I mean we have Mirage who change Ballas design entirely and Umbra change a bit Excal abilities to suit him more

[restive river]

The protos don’t influence the abilities of their strains, none of them (except one) is the original warframe

[glacial bough]

No, every Proto is an after the fact creation. Regular frames and abilities all come first.

[tall echo]

And sometimes primes were first and sometimes they weren't

[brittle siren]

Flare the goat

[glacial bough]

Proto is a bit of a misnomer

[restive river]

Ballas makes the frames
Albrecht steals the designs
Goes back to 1999
Makes the protoframes
Protoframes are all lost to history
Ballas makes the warframes, entirely separate

[tall echo]

Thanks DE

[swift gyro]

so, warframe came before proto?

[tall echo]

Yes

[glacial bough]

Yes, every one

[brittle siren]

funny Ballas make base Protea then proceed to make Prime version of her just to spite Parvos more

[swift gyro]

i swear i saw some guy in the game chat saying that it was other way, like proto were the ´´test drive´´ before the real creation of the definitive warframe ( temple proto then warframe temple)

[restive river]

Flare is the only odd one
Their design existed at the same time as the others but wasn’t actually made until Albrecht gave it to Flare in the past where they then became the first Temple Warframe (and probably the last until Drifter obtains the design)

[glacial bough]

Anyone who says that is wrong

[restive river]

That guy was lying lol

[brittle siren]

also the fact that this first ever Protea able to all of these time shenanigan and her prime just so weak

[restive river]

We know the timeline and it ain’t that

[swift gyro]

dang, he was flooding into the chat idk if he got banned tho.

[restive river]

For lore inaccuracies? Nah
If that was bannable more than half of the community would be gone lol

[tall echo]

Lore liars rarely get banned

[swift gyro]

the hell did albrecht even stealed from ballas? isnt albrench just a human that is super intelligent?

[tall echo]

And usually it's not bc of lore lies

[strange plinth]

there's a reason we have this lol

[tall echo]

They both are

[brittle siren]

iirc there's a thing call loop paradox, mean an event will always meant to happen. Temple exist because of Flare and Flare/Lizzie exist because of Flare.

Am I wording that right?

[restive river]

All Orokin are super intelligent humans with egos the size of the system
Albrecht stole the Warframe designe/serums from Ballas, went back to 1999 and made the protos

[tall echo]

Orokin are cosmetically altered humans

[swift gyro]

but like, ballas had to keep the designs and how to do the warframe super secret or he though that nobody would stealed from him and kept on the table inside his house?

[strange plinth]

flare does not impact the creation of temple, so no
err, you're wording it correctly but that's not the situation

[brittle siren]

I read doraemon too much and it "time paradox" haunted me

[restive river]

No, Flare is not a bootstrap paradox

[brittle siren]

oh I see

[glacial bough]

Temple, as a design, exists regardless of Flare

[restive river]

It’s somehow an incredibly common misconception

[swift gyro]

oh right, i forgot that orokins are human but with ego bigger than their...

[tall echo]

Unknown

[restive river]

Yeah lol

[brittle siren]

not really no, I think he would share to those that ask him

if he wanted to

and if that person is Albrecht

[tall echo]

Definitely not

[restive river]

Albrecht def stole them

[swift gyro]

also, you all remember that message we recive after finish all dialogues with flare? saying that he found strange that there is many other versions of him (warframes) with other lizzies. so warframes are basicly an ´´watch for 5 min and learn how to do it?´´

[tall echo]

Orokin frequently get stolen from, their home security must suck

[tall echo]

They*
Them*

[brittle siren]

so we can assume Albrecht invent the "teleport" device already, otherwise how can he even go in Ballas places

[swift gyro]

oh right, since is flare and lizzie mb.

[restive river]

Idk lol
We don’t know how he does what he does

[strange plinth]

no, flare is just nonbinary

[tall echo]

No flare is just nb

[pine orchid]

he didn't say many iirc just the one they were like "why is there a warframe called Temple, it's my stage name"

[swift gyro]

bro stayed crounched and turned invisible

[tall echo]

Get out of my brain

[brittle siren]

wait so does Lizzie have gender?

[cunning tapir]

not just that but Flare is canonically they/them. that's their pronouns.

[restive river]

Xaku’s they/them cause they’re three people glued together
Flare/Temple is they/them cause they’re nonbinary
They are not the same

[restive river]

She/her
even though she’s part of the hivemind

[swift gyro]

Nb? non binary?

[strange plinth]

no :)

[cunning tapir]

yep.

[swift gyro]

yes.

[swift gyro]

mb, didnt know that.

[brittle siren]

and does Helminth (our Helminth) have pronoun too or it just "it"?

[restive river]

I don’t know if it comes up actually

[pine orchid]

Helminths pronouns are Hel/minth Xd

[strange plinth]

its never specified, i believe

[tall echo]

There's like 5 ppl trying to answer 1 person's questions here

[swift gyro]

i think is a mass of vermes and things that arent healty, so i guess no?

[restive river]

Eat/ing

[swift gyro]

so tuffness inside one discord person....

[strange plinth]

duality of lore chat
one person and a bunch of questions
one question and a bunch of answerers

[brittle siren]

and Wally

did we ever hear anyone call him "he/him"?

like Loid keep calling Wally "it"

[tall echo]

And then there's me getting overstimulated by the combination of both

[swift gyro]

i literally made 12 persons go crazy bcs english isnt my main language, so my wording sometimes may make the questions a bit confuse.

[tall echo]

The man in the wall.

[pine orchid]

we're just very helpful

[swift gyro]

The ´´man´´ in the wall? i suppose its a woman.. ( i marked the wrong person😭😭😭)

[tall echo]

Currently it is

[restive river]

Wally’s gender fluid but in like
A cosmic horror body/identity stealing kinda way

[brittle siren]

Romance him when

we should put him in a lamp

[strange plinth]

wally's gender is 'incomprehensible, have a nice day'

[restive river]

That’s poison to his plan

[swift gyro]

i mean, wally is literally an entity that albrecht just helped to get an body and form in our universe, i think roath said something about it in the chats, if i am not wrong.

[restive river]

Nihil

[brittle siren]

Wally: my pronoun is αυτός/αυτή/αυτοί/αυτό

(I use google translate pls dont glass me)

[strange plinth]

its certainly what roathe thinks of wally
it isn't known how correct he is, though some of his theories line up with common ones here

[tall echo]

Purghaps

[brittle siren]

Good, torturing an eon olds child with love

[swift gyro]

his pronoun came directly from🥶🥶😭😭😭😭😭 ( jk btw)

[restive river]

What? Albrecht didn’t help him get a body
Wally either existed prior to Albrecht and his presence influenced him and got his attention or Albrecht caused him to exist in the first place
Either way Albrecht just got his attention, accidentally cut his finger and that’s why he’s cranky

[swift gyro]

mb than.

[restive river]

It is nice we got affirmation he isn’t a god as Drifter so wrongly assumed
Which it’s a fair assumption, just wrong

[strange plinth]

yea
the amount of power he has is where wally's.. origin? gets weird

[swift gyro]

if wally was a god, then all universe would be cooked no?

[restive river]

I mean Thrax could reverse and fully control Duviri and things can just be made through conceptual embodiment
The void and what it makes is wild

[brittle siren]

like multiple time too, from the Hex chat and now Roathe

[restive river]

They’re cooked regardless of whether or not he’s a god

[strange plinth]

the murmur are made of 'dust from decayed universes'

[restive river]

He’s a very very powerful entity, someone who doesn’t know better (Drifter) would call him a god

[pine orchid]

guess it depends on how you define god, if it just means a very powerful entity then he could be a sort of god
but he certainly isnt the omnipotent, omnipresent definition of a god

[brittle siren]

So there a chance one of our OP versions is inside those thing

[restive river]

He’s omnipresent in every piece of him it seems

[strange plinth]

eh, maybe
there's the isleweaver dialogue stating that the heralds were like us, once
unknown exactly what that means, but it could be other operators ig

[restive river]

Like there can’t be a good murmur cause it’s all just him, it’s not a hivemind it’s just him

[brittle siren]

Also what is the strongest being that Wally has made?

[pine orchid]

what's a herald again? idr what that connects to

[brittle siren]

The Fragments one?

[restive river]

Yeah

[strange plinth]

probably the fragmented boss we keep fighting
holds down strands of khra to bind them to reality

[tall echo]

Prob 60 eyes if it's canon

[humble sierra]

The Tenno 🧠

[restive river]

Truuuueee

[brittle siren]

From nothing*

[runic jungle]

Bro roathe is insane

What the hell

[restive river]

Then yeah the fragmented lol

[strange plinth]

yea its what he does

[tall echo]

Nah he's very sane

[pine orchid]

kind of like Hunhow and his Sentient drones, but not the sort of omnipresent like irl Christian capital g God for example

[runic jungle]

Bro reinvented the helmith with a box of scraps by himself 😭😭😭

[humble sierra]

Yeah we're nothing without him, we should like totally do what he says

[restive river]

His gemini emote says otherwise (image half related)

[runic jungle]

Genuine mad man

[tall echo]

Roathe is probably the most sane orokin which tbf is an abysmally low bar

[brittle siren]

Tbh he is one of the chillest Orokin we met,

[restive river]

His fragments, but yeah actually kinda!

[runic jungle]

Roathe is genuinely a genius

Wtf

[tall echo]

That requires sanity

[restive river]

Average Orokin moment

[humble sierra]

Have we met a stupid Orokin?

[tall echo]

Nihil

[brittle siren]

No but those 2 choose to drill a hole in a warframe is

[restive river]

They’ve all made stupid choices but they’re all seemingly very very smart

[runic jungle]

No acces to orokin tech, no access to transference, no access to the Tenno either. Only had access to his own proto frame body.

😭 😭 😭

[humble sierra]

Like a complete blundering fool? Most of the "stupidity" is just based on their ignorance but they're all so far geniuses of some sort

[restive river]

The closest thing the Orokin seemed to have to a god was knowledge itself

“No god above knowledge” goes insane

[runic jungle]

If I’m getting the Kim conversations right, he was trapped in the past but somehow brought himself to the future

[tall echo]

And then there's the honoria: the god above knowledge

[humble sierra]

"There is no power greater than Knowledge, and no knowledge which does not have power" - Mortal Kombat

[humble sierra]

Ooh, from?

[brittle siren]

He made a tech that turn human into AI

By modern standards, that is nigh immortality and free AI that can have emotion

[tall echo]

Roach

[humble sierra]

For?

[tall echo]

10 high tier voca

[brittle siren]

Maybe the Cavia material?

[restive river]

10 voca

[humble sierra]

Easy

[restive river]

It’s worth it

[humble sierra]

Thanks

[runic jungle]

How strong are the protoframes lore wise in comparison to base warframes and prime frames?

[restive river]

I’m at a crossroads with honoria
I do no god above knowledge OR scholar of secrets (I’m in the clan Scholars of the Orokin)

[strange plinth]

either the unseeing herald enemy, which is the floating mouth in isleweaver, or the fragmented, as that's when the line plays
probably the former?

[humble sierra]

Weaker but that's because they're lacking experience

[tall echo]

Notably weaker

[strange plinth]

weaker. they're unmodded and inexperienced
at a full transformation, they'd be the same

[restive river]

Just as strong but mostly lacking the experience with their abilities

[runic jungle]

Hm ok, that makes sense

They are the first frames timeline wise but not the first warframes created. Time travel is weird

[pine orchid]

oh right I forgot they're called that 😭

[tall echo]

The protos physically can't put in as much as full frames bc they still have regular organics in places

[drowsy saddle]

"timey wimey slimey shenanigananery"

[burnt blade]

Are warframes mutated robots?

[tall echo]

No it's "wibbly wobbly timey wimey stuff"

[runic jungle]

They aren’t robots

[tall echo]

How far in story?

[humble sierra]

How much have you played?

[pine orchid]

warframes are people

[burnt blade]

It's not for Me, I'm all the way up to old peace

[tall echo]

Yep, good, throw in all the spoilers

[humble sierra]

All your questions will be answered the Sacrifice

[restive river]

Replay the sacrifice

[tall echo]

That is. Concerning

[burnt blade]

I ask bc of a friend

[runic jungle]

Best explanation is they are people who are mutated with a special strain of the helmith

[humble sierra]

Tell them to play the game

[drowsy saddle]

Some peeps just need a refresh is all

[burnt blade]

They have and still don't get it

[runic jungle]

😭

[burnt blade]

Ik

[strange plinth]

/s obv

[humble sierra]

They're also past the Sacrifice?

[restive river]

Simplify it as space ninjas, they’ll know more if they get to the sacrifice

Though do not rush it

[humble sierra]

Legendary reaction image

[burnt blade]

They've played it

And still think they are mutated robots

[humble sierra]

Well they're mutated humans

[drowsy saddle]

This is definitely for the Registered Losers lmao

[tall echo]

I think I'm using "lamenting one" rn

[restive river]

They should play it again
Did they skip cutscenes?

[runic jungle]

https://tenor.com/view/ishowspeed-meme-trying-not-to-laugh-laugh-homeless-gif-9458928528704746136

[burnt blade]

I even compared them to if Tony stark got turned into his iron man suit

[drowsy saddle]

They're genetically modified humans

Do you know how little that narrows it down?

[tall echo]

Lost cause

[runic jungle]

They are super soldiers

Well super is an understatement

[strange plinth]

ballas says outright "We took our greatest, volunteers or not, and polluted them with these cultured reagents. They transformed." bruhhh

[restive river]

Orokin
Grineer
Dax
Maybe Corpus
Technically kinda the Tenno

[humble sierra]

Using Demoness.

Also is that one intentionally gendered? Because I'm a guy and although my Drifter and Operator are both femme, for me personally I'd like to change it

[restive river]

Super duper soldiers

[pine orchid]

I guess more like if Tony stark grew his Iron Man suit as a second layer of skin and can never get out

[restive river]

Isn’t that the voruna one?

[runic jungle]

Also he is going mentally insane because he is connected to a zombie hive mind

[strange plinth]

i feel like Demoness can be neutral, but is more femme?
it is a weird one

[tall echo]

That one being only fem kinda bothers me tbh

[restive river]

No wait thats wolfmother

[tall echo]

No

[drowsy saddle]

We're all GMOs in the end...

[humble sierra]

Nah this one is bought from Roathe using Ignia

[restive river]

Some are hard gendered and some are ambiguous
Like matriarch and patriarch exist

[tall echo]

It is not neutral

[runic jungle]

Why didn’t Balls just make Warframe 2 to defeat the Tenno? Was he stupid?

[strange plinth]

i'd say "void-saturated dna" qualifies for genetic modification

[burnt blade]

Anyone got a simple way to explain what warframes are like ur talking to a child?

[restive river]

So is wolfmother lol
But yeah idk, it sounds like it is which is odd?

[tall echo]

Yeah but why is there no demon honoria

[humble sierra]

"Robot space ninjas"

[restive river]

Yeah I count that lol

[runic jungle]

They are super soldiers, that’s about it

[restive river]

Infested + people = warframe

[pine orchid]

maybe that robot part is what caused the misunderstanding to begin with XD

[humble sierra]

Good point

[runic jungle]

All the void magic and transformation stuff aside, at the end of the day. They are like captain America x1000 + zombie outbreak

[humble sierra]

Tell your friend to play darksector

[restive river]

LOL

[humble sierra]

That reveals everything

[restive river]

Tell them to play sacrifice again

[humble sierra]

Warframe really spoiled the Sacrifice 10 years before release

[runic jungle]

Is darksector canon to warframe?

[burnt blade]

Isn't there a video to use?

[restive river]

No

[humble sierra]

Nope

[tall echo]

Warframes are the last of us turned up to 11 but in a controlled environment

[strange plinth]

yea the sacrifice quest

[burnt blade]

Lol

[tall echo]

Canonically only a book

[restive river]

Darksector is a book and movie in Warframe
It literally cannot also happen

[humble sierra]

Hey it's also a movie

[strange plinth]

the vitruvian shows a human body transforming to infested, then warframe

[humble sierra]

Yeah that's probably the best cutscene

[pine orchid]

yeah that particular vitruvian

[humble sierra]

See if you can find the Vitruvian entries on YouTube

[restive river]

The game spells it out and people miss it cause they just. Don’t pay attention when talked to?? Idk

[drowsy saddle]

Void + people = Tenno
(Ctrl+paste) + people = Grineer
(Capitalism+Religion) + people = Corpus
Magic Kool-aid + people =Orokin

Is quick maths

[pine orchid]

as someone with adhd... yeah I miss part of voicelines sometimes bcs I get distracted
no convo logs to help me 😔

[restive river]

Some things are way more vague in Warframe
What Warframes are is not, so long as you get to the sacrifice

[strange plinth]

even just these images
(idk why they have the translations i'm stealing from the wiki)

[pine orchid]

that's super cool

[restive river]

Convo logs would be a great feature tbh
Or
Just a replay of the quest lol

Which I will say now is a good time to do so! New faces!

Oh fun fact, ig replaying quests is now canon!
Thanks dark refractory!

[pine orchid]

wish we could do that with old peace lmao

[strange plinth]

oh, yeah i guess we can do that. interesting.

[restive river]

Saaame

[humble sierra]

Soon

[pine orchid]

for now though Orokin Archives are my convo logs

[restive river]

Tbh the refractory opens up so much it’s amazing

[restive river]

Love your operator!

[pine orchid]

because even if I replay the quests I could definitely just get distracted again trying to get to part I missed and forget to pay attention

[restive river]

You can always pull up a playthrough

Sometimes I catch my friends playing it for the first time and watch em

[strange plinth]

i'm always trying to do this lmao

[humble sierra]

A buddy replayed New War just to get to the scene with the Operator and Drifter to see them reworked

[restive river]

Based

[pine orchid]

yeah, though I'd prefer if they just let us have convo logs

[restive river]

Oh for sure

People have wanted chapters for the new war for a while

[pine orchid]

some of them being spoken while in the middle of a battlemap with explosions everywhere does not help 😭

[humble sierra]

I wonder why they don't make most quests replayable at launch.

Probably a technical thing.

[restive river]

Probably yeah

Lotus Eaters better be replayable next year

Oh and heart of deimos wasn’t replayable for years iirc

[strange plinth]

dark refractory would let it happen from a lore perspective too
it would also let you leave the quest, theoretically
which i feel like is a technical issue rather than a 'won't do it' issue

[pine orchid]

basically I'm saying missing stuff in quests in understandable and just replaying the quest isn't always helpful

[humble sierra]

Just became replayable with Undermind I think

[strange plinth]

and then it was made replayable and immediately broke

[restive river]

Is it still broken?

[strange plinth]

not anymore, i don't think
but the first time they tried to make it replayable, it had to be disabled a couple hotfixes after

[drowsy saddle]

Hmm... Spaghetti

[pine orchid]

how was it broken?

[thick yacht]

Does ANYONE have access to Lyon?

[pine orchid]

curious to see if it's like... unresolved triggers in the quest or what

[thick yacht]

I’m at liked with Marie

And Lyon is still giving me the cold shoulder

🗿

[drowsy saddle]

I genuinely think DE haven't actually made the furniture for his shop lmao

[strange plinth]

update 38.6 - you can now replay the heart of deimos quest
update 38.6.2 - removed the ability to replay the heart of deimos quest
update 40 - the heart of deimos quests are now replayable!
not finding detail on why. chimera prologue and erra were also affected tho

[thick yacht]

Also

[earnest sapphire]

Yeah

[humble sierra]

Got it today

[thick yacht]

How

I’ve been doing the dialogue every day and I still don’t have this guy

[fast dew]

Necraloid wouldn't spawn iirc

Im.. friendly w marie i think?

I should be able to access it yeah?

[steady shore]

why are we only just getting orokin lore from Roathe when couldve asked the entrati family about the orokin AGES ago? 🥀

[thick yacht]

Because they don’t remember even their own names

[fast dew]

Brain wormed and they aren't traditionally orokin

[thick yacht]

Much less deep lore about their people

[strange plinth]

they didn't remember their names, you think they remembered detailed orokin life?
sorry that might've been ruder than i intended lol

[steady shore]

ahhhhh i forgot about that part ofc

✌️

[drowsy saddle]

Only one that does likes being cryptic

[thick yacht]

Roathe is the first non-hostile orokin we are on a talking basis with

[fast dew]

... the family

The family are right there

We talk to them loads

[humble sierra]

Need to be Liked

[thick yacht]

???

This game is broken then

I am liked and I can’t talk to him

🗿

[humble sierra]

I might've hit liked with her yesterday?

[thick yacht]

🗿

[humble sierra]

And so at the reset he's ready?

[brittle siren]

I wonder
Why Ballas not pick a random Tenno and use them to Continuity?

In New War I mean

[strange plinth]

why would he?

[brittle siren]

I mean his current body is old and half of it is no longer whole

[thick yacht]

Because it’s Ballas

[marble pewter]

Kind of hoping that for the future updates, DE can add more convo/scenes for the Hex or Triad instead of adding more protoframes

Lowkey miss the chats with Hex but don’t wanna reset what’s already been said

[humble sierra]

Ballas would probably prefer transferring into a Kubrow than a Tenno

[vague flame]

Guys can the Indifference only reprensent him self as those he has made deals with? Ex: Operator, Loid, Albrecht, ect due to the fact he is never seen as Drifter

[strange plinth]

Loid hasn't made a deal with him

[humble sierra]

He never made a deal with Loid, and HAS made a deal with Drifter

[vague flame]

oh when

[strange plinth]

same time that operator did

[humble sierra]

It's the same one made with the Operator

[strange plinth]

same deal, even. that's when they split

[vague flame]

oh

[humble sierra]

They made the same deal, but there was a split because of what Wally did

For the Operator, he gave the children powers

[vague flame]

ye

[humble sierra]

For the Drifter, he saved them some other way, but not the Drifter

[vague flame]

Ohh

[humble sierra]

So Drifter was left completely alone on the Zariman

[strange plinth]

"I can save them, all of them"
all of [the children of the zariman] for operator
all of [the other children] for drifter

[humble sierra]

"I said I'd save them, never said I'd save you" — a tablet in Duviri

[vague flame]

never noticed that

[thick yacht]

I hope he knows we are trying to kill him

Let there be no surprises

[hollow trench]

So I asked Marie what she thought of roathe

Ce diable est un imbécile qui se croit au-dessus de tout reproche! Je préfèrerais boire un pot de vernis à bois plutôt que de passer une minute de plus à l'écouter s'enorgueillir comme un chat qui lèche le pelage!

Translated

This devil is a fool who thinks he is above any reproach! I would rather drink a pot of wood varnish than spend an extra minute listening to him proud like a cat licking the coat!

Got a good laugh out of it

[hollow trench]

Isn’t he also referred to as the vast untime or is that just the void in general

[thick yacht]

To be fair pretty sure according to her she never got a good convo out of him anyway

[strange plinth]

that's just the void
well, vast untime is xaku's 4th iirc
but untime is void

[hollow trench]

So killing Wally doesn’t eliminate the fact that the void would just manifest something like Wally again right?

[fast dew]

Well

[hollow trench]

“Killing”

[strange plinth]

it could, doesn't mean it will
void probably didn't do that on its own

[lean garden]

well, if we just do this really easy thing and like

not freak out when going inside

it gets real easy

[fast dew]

The void itself doesnt manifest someone

[brittle siren]

so what is this Jade light come from

[humble sierra]

Just a beacon I think

[strange plinth]

was added (or at least made green) in jade shadows iirc
no explanation i'm aware of

[brittle siren]

again, from where?

[fast dew]

You'd need someone to go in there and trigger conceptual embodiment for shit to happen again methinks

[thick yacht]

Also I’m like 80% sure the feeling of enmity is entirely mutual between them (Marie & Lyon, and Roathe).

Marie: "By Sol I bless the day and all its labors."

Lyon: "By Lua I bless the night and all its respite."

Roathe: "By the void I wish these two would shut up.”

[hollow trench]

To be fair

We blasted our way out of a ship that was full of insane parents and children with power capable of leveling cities and then proceeded to be rage baited by ballas the entirety of the old war up to the naga drums then when we wake up again

[brittle siren]

Jade Shadow supposed to be post new war right?

[lean garden]

to also be fair, that directly resulted in duviri

[humble sierra]

Some Grineer station probably, like those giant red radars at the end of certain corpus ice planet missions

[strange plinth]

yes

[hollow trench]

For the drifter

Not the operator

[lean garden]

yes, who was on the ship

[humble sierra]

God I love that interaction

[lean garden]

so like, yknow, just don't do that

[pine orchid]

whatever you do, do NOT think about elder gods or eldritch beings or even regular gods- Xd