lore-discussion

[marble hound]

Ignore that

[brittle siren]

are you serious

[fast dew]

Albrecht never mentioned wally to anyone, and noone saw wally after (outside the zariman incident)

He seems to have not even mentioned wally to his daughter

He kinda treated it as a infohazard

Which is a fair assumption

[marble hound]

I mean it's kinda hinted by Roathe with all the "I can convince him" or the way he knows a lot about Loid and tbf if he hates Loid that much something must have happened between the 2, specially how Roathe tells us he reacted when they encountered for the first time on the lab. We shall see in the future Ig

[fast dew]

Loid doesn't seem to know Roathe

He didn't even know of the new protos

[strange plinth]

or at least if they did, they also didn't mention it to anyone else
-# idr if yonta says that she was seeing herself in the reliquary drive room before/after her current situation

[marble hound]

I mean he didn't but she saw it trying to enter through the portal of Lohk

Same with Loid

[brittle siren]

I think Loid know Roathe is due to many meeting Albrecht have

[fast dew]

She heard it while going through the wall of lohk, and she assumed it was her father

Which is... not entirely wrong

It certainly would look like her father

[marble hound]

I mean, we don't know. We don't have an option to talk with him so if Roathe recognized him and was pissed that out of all he could have encountered he encountered Loid it literally spits that they know each other

[fast dew]

Loid knows of Wally due to his closeness to Albrecht's works. I do suspect he wasn't immediately told either

[fast dew]

He calls him "a orokin", which is a easy assumption to make. Roathe is blue lol

We are dealing with essentially celebrities in the orokin world

[brittle siren]

ok guys, biggest hear me out

[marble hound]

No. Albrecht passed through the portal, cut his veins with the broken vessel and wrote with his blood and wrote that her daughter had to close the portal and it also describes that he felt how the "entity" was starting to pass through the portal to reach him. Mother closed the portal and the "entity (wally)" fingers were cut off

[brittle siren]

Ballas

[marble hound]

N O !

[fast dew]

Oh. You mean that?

She never asked what the fingers were.

[fast dew]

Eh. Ive heard worse.

[brittle siren]

Karishh

[fast dew]

Id say Nihil but he isn't that bad

[brittle siren]

Nihil is big

[fast dew]

She clearly didn't recognise the tapping on the walls as wally.

[marble hound]

I mean true but technically she saw it. I'm curious though on what form she saw it. Also I need to learn more about the lore but was far as I understood Wally lost a lot of fingers that day, how did he get all of em back except for the one we have on our Railjack?

[fast dew]

No, he is normal sized. We just see him in a nonphysical world

[brittle siren]

Yes but again, he still big

[fast dew]

Those are copies. The fingers are copies. Albrecht only cut off a few, maybe only 1.

[brittle siren]

also here another hear me out

also why he floating

[marble hound]

I like to think that it's kinda like Galactus were depending on the species we see them differently. Like humans see him as the giant with the purple/pink helmet while another species sees him as a spider or something

[brittle siren]

ah levitators

[marble hound]

You really have special tastes... Isn't that the guy from Dune?

[fast dew]

Honestly thats a normal smash

I think my most dubious one i can mention here is wallform wally

[brittle siren]

yessssssssssssss

[fast dew]

Or a hellknight from doom 2016

[brittle siren]

join the Wally cult

[marble hound]

You can't convince me they are not the same

[brittle siren]

the 2nd guys from the right is really hot imo

[fast dew]

Weak, i think all are. Avantus is sooo pretty

Scarne is interesting lookin too

[brittle siren]

which one is Avantus?

[marble hound]

It's lore discussion channel not "What genocidal maniac looks cuter"

[fast dew]

First woman with the short stick lookin thing

She died to a saw going through her spine :)

[marble hound]

Is it me or they all represent the deadly sins?

[fast dew]

As far as i know she isn't that bad either

[fast dew]

Oh they definitely do

[mystic lynx]

tuvul is far right, right?

[brittle siren]

yep

[fast dew]

Last one, yes

[marble hound]

Imagine in the future we get an adventure where we play as the Tenno during the end of the Old War and we have to go and kill each executor, in the end when we go against Ballas we would see how the heck that bastard survived

[lean garden]

mhmm, which is interesting because roathe has no reason to lie, but it does make you recontextualise what bird-3 says that links to wally. About the inside me being too big for the outside me.

Roathe thinks bird-3 is insightful, so it cant be that DE made it that bird 3 and roathe are unaligned in this regard. BUT it does make sense given the other options within this convo that you didnt access, where it seems the gameplan against wally is to reduce the choices/faces it can take (i.e giving it an avatar through rusalka)

[brittle siren]

Tuvul is the one I hated most

[fast dew]

Tuvul wasn't that bad i don't think

Just a idiot

[brittle siren]

oh, I likes man so no opinon on female char

but yes, she does look pretty

[lean garden]

how do we know which is which again?

[brittle siren]

i hate idiot

[fast dew]

File names :)

[mystic lynx]

do we know which which from here?
like balls 2nd from left and tuvul last one

[silk atlas]

Most of them survived the initial assault afail. They had to get caught after in separate atrack

[brittle siren]

pls spoil us

[strange plinth]

they're in alphabetical order in that image

[brittle siren]

could you edit the image to have their name too?\

[marble hound]

Do we have info of how they got killed? It would make sense that the Tenno were the ones to kill em but idk if that's what happened

[fast dew]

In order its Avantus, Ballas, Karrish, Nitokh, Scarne, Tormis, Tuvul

[brittle siren]

only some has, there are 3 unknown fat

[mystic lynx]

avantus is roathe boss right?

[brittle siren]

no

[strange plinth]

nitokh

[fast dew]

Nup, that's Nitokh

[silk atlas]

Some Leverians talk about a couple, Ballas is Ballas, I forgot who's not accouted for.

[marble hound]

Can we ping that?

[brittle siren]

have to ask the mod

[mystic lynx]

ah mistook the wrong woman

[fast dew]

They both are exceptionally pretty

Avantus looks so gentle.

[brittle siren]

Tormis pls alive and actually a good person

[strange plinth]

they wouldn't pin it, they need the important moderation stuff there

its been said before i believe

[rigid ibex]

What if Ballas's body is going to be used as a conduit/vessel for the Man in the Wall? We never see what happens to his body after the man in the Wall appears

[mystic lynx]

so clearly 7 executor 7 deadly sin?
which which?

balls is probably anger or something

[fast dew]

Falls into the void or the sun, either way, he's dead as a dog.

[fast dew]

Pride. Ballas is pride.

[strange plinth]

ballas claims his is lust
karishh matches pretty obviously with gluttony

[fast dew]

Apparently Nitokh was lust? No clue where it comes from

[marble hound]

Quick question. So basically what happened at the end of the old peace is basically why Margulis was executed? She was taken as the traitor for helping the Tenno during the events of the Old Peace and therefore she was vaporized like the baby meme?

[fast dew]

Maybe her design lol

[brittle siren]

Ballas Pride, Tuvul greed, Karishh is sloth or Gluttony

[rigid ibex]

But, if he fell into the void, couldn't the Man in the Wall use him as a puppet?

[brittle siren]

Nikoth could be sloth too

[fast dew]

Nup, it seems to need a deal to be made

[mystic lynx]

she's half naked and ||seduced roathe at some point||

[marble hound]

Won't ask why we took the fat guy as the gluttony

[fast dew]

Ah. I see.

[brittle siren]

and especially Grendel eat him

[strange plinth]

her actions then cause her execution, yes, but not really for treason, just because she didn't let ballas kill the tenno for their supposed treason

[fast dew]

Ehh its overconsumption

He did it purposefully too

Nihil.. wonder what he would represent

[brittle siren]

Nihil isnt the Seven

[fast dew]

He is. He is an executor

[strange plinth]

sloth also matches with Karishh fairly well
but 90% of his characterization comes from the grendel leverian, in which he is excessively feeding himself while his subjects outside are starving
hence, gluttony

[fast dew]

He likely replaced Nitokh. Or the other way around

[marble hound]

So in terms of timeline Old peace is not far from the Tenno causing the extinction of the Orokin? Tbf I never really understood why we never saw any other Tenno apart from the protagonist, like we did on the new war or when Lotus "kills" erra

[fast dew]

We know that Nitokh is filling in for someone

[brittle siren]

no info indicate that tbh

[marble hound]

Wait really?

[fast dew]

... Nitokh's title literally suggests so

[mystic lynx]

Tuvul is envy ig? wants to be the one to reach tau first with zariman

[strange plinth]

there's the second half of the old war between the old peace and the night of naga drums
which we have no time reference for

[fast dew]

"Grand regent" or something. Regent is a person who fills in for a monarch/leader when they are not fit for rule

[brittle siren]

he is executor, but not part of the Seven

[fast dew]

Guess where the name "the seven" comes from? The amount of executors.

[strange plinth]

Drifter calls Nihil an executor
we know from dialogue in the old peace, i believe, that there are only seven executors

[brittle siren]

I see

so the replacement happened

[fast dew]

We also assume immediately that "a executor" means that carriage is carrying a member of the seven

[brittle siren]

kinda sad that we never seen his statue even though he invent the Cephalon tech

[fast dew]

...yeah wait

We have cephalons in the old peace

[marble hound]

Guys now that I think about what Roathe was saying. He basically tells us that Albrecht created the indifference by interacting with the void and that it became an evil kid, an indiferent kid because of Albrecht acting basically indiferent to his daughter, family and Loid being too focused on his task. Imagine in the end we find an even more dangerous being than the man in the wall, the actual void. We still have no explanation of what the void is or what created it I think so idk

[mystic lynx]

what does executor mean here? like they execute the will of the orokin empire?

[fast dew]

We know that glassing stopped once Nihil screwed off

[strange plinth]

of the emperors, yes

[fast dew]

So nihil left before the old peace?

[lean garden]

nihil only screwed off after/at the end the old war tho

[mystic lynx]

theres emperors what?

[brittle siren]

will of Emperors, but they are puppet kings

[strange plinth]

(said emperors didn't do anything so they were mostly left to their own devices)

[fast dew]

Maybe he figured the end of the new war was the old peace?

[marble hound]

In terms of kingdom they are the "princesses and princes" being only surpassed by the kings and queens

[lean garden]

I mean, the Cephalon programme surely didnt need nihil at the helm

[fast dew]

It needed his sword didn't it? Outside the thing that fella on the zariman had

[brittle siren]

not really, glassing still a thing with Gara and I doubt that Orokin would abandoned that tech because of their creator is "bad"

[lean garden]

folks like quinn had access

[mystic lynx]

i have never heard of an orokin emperor where are they mentioned?

[lean garden]

so like theres a way to give the "power" to glass

[fast dew]

It was previously a disregarded idea. Its been brought up again.

[brittle siren]

Roathe and mentioned briefly before Old Peace updates

[marble hound]

As far as Ik we don't know much about them, we know about the executors but not emperors

[fast dew]

Emperors "order" the 7 around

[lean garden]

Roathe talks about the Glassmaker, but only that becoming a cephalon is worse than dying to him

[strange plinth]

they were mentioned like once in a super old codex entry, then they were brought up again during the old peace buildup livestream, and now roathe has a little dialogue about them

[marble hound]

I mean, If Ballas managed to survive all this years maybe the emperors did too.

[fast dew]

They likely died in the collapse

[marble hound]

If there is no corpse nor mention of a corpse then they are not dead

[strange plinth]

they were at the celebration that turned into the night of naga drums iirc
so they would almost certainly be some of the first deaths

[fast dew]

Ehh not necessarily

[brittle siren]

or some survived, we don't really know, since 3 Seven fate is unknown either

[fast dew]

Again, the emperors were discared as basically a typo

Until very recently

[marble hound]

Yes but if they were brought up again then it must be because of something.

[fast dew]

Eh, all roathe mentions of them is that they woke at the thought of war

We didn't see them in the new war

[marble hound]

As far as we know the decision of resuming the war was because of the executors, not something the emperors wanted

[mystic lynx]

theyre building them up as the people we kill when evantually we get naga drum quest

[brittle siren]

cracked theory: our OP is a child of one the Emperors, and our parent in Zariman is fake

(I was joking pls dont glassed me)

[fast dew]

We kill son's fiancé :)

Probably us anyway

[marble hound]

I mean it would explain why wally was so interested in us

[brittle siren]

not really, unless the OP has the finger inside them

[fast dew]

Please consider what you say 😭

[marble hound]

Imagine in the final battle against the final boss (probably wally) the OP creates a new Warframe using the void that has the form of a king/queen

[brittle siren]

did you block me...

[fast dew]

And they uh

[marble hound]

AYOOOO

[fast dew]

Kinda do

[mystic lynx]

well the OP is kinda like the anchor for wally to the real world no?

[strange plinth]

-# The Tenno appeared at the Terminus, gleaming and victorious. Our cold and gold Emperors, breathless, bathed you in saviour's silk. Then came the sound. Across all our worlds, all at once, the ceremonial Naga drums. A royal salute to the honoured Tenno. Ten solemn beats to declare the suffering was over. I watched from a distance, with the rest of the Low Guardians. With each beat terror began to crush my throat. The Tenno were not stoic and silent. They were waiting. They were poised. I tried to call out, but only a strangled whisper escaped.

-# When the ninth beat rang, a torrent of blood filled the stadium, loosed by Tenno blades. The drums, the Empire, fell silent forever.

[brittle siren]

not really, he still have the Murmur and can enter as illusion (and wall form too)

[marble hound]

All tenno are, anything that has interacted with the void long enough is. But the man in the wall took a special interest in the OP so it must be because of something

[fast dew]

.. our deal

We made a deal. Thsts why

[strange plinth]

its just main character syndrome
we were unique in some way to wally
so he approached us

[marble hound]

Yes but as far as I remember it is mentioned that Wally had a special interest in us even before the deal/ regardless of the deal, I may be wrong but I think it's something either Albrecht or Lotus mentioned.

[marble hound]

That

[spice wedge]

The deal that tenno's in another's universes have disappeared and they act same as evil baro ki teer.

[fast dew]

No?

[spice wedge]

almost

[fast dew]

We don't know what the deal entailed outside "our light' and wally giving us a bit of him

[marble hound]

I mean during the scene of the deal we were the only ones with a light trying to maintain hope on the room

[fast dew]

Wally likes uniqueness. Probably why he "liked" Rell

[brittle siren]

WHAT DID WE OWNED YOU, YOU STUPID VOID LUGGER

[fast dew]

Eehh

We didn't really know what our side is

[strange plinth]

he's already mimicking us before we do anything in that scene
sitting in the corner, tapping on the glass

[fast dew]

And the one time wally offered to add something to the deal, we broke it

[marble hound]

True. Talking about Rell, did you all notice the "Rap Tap Tap" the tenno screams during the Old Peace? Did Rell meant that all this time or nah?

[brittle siren]

well we (and our friend) become void demon
idk what we owned him still

[fast dew]

Rap tap tap comes from the sound Wally makes

Wally taps on the walls

He whispers in the walls

[strange plinth]

wally is tapping on the glass of the zariman the first time we ever see him, its just his thing

[fast dew]

Not exclusive to zariman children as well

[marble hound]

I know but i found curious that the Tenno screamed that during the quest, maybe Rell also meant that but I doubt it

[fast dew]

Mother experienced it

[brittle siren]

he tap on wall of lohk now he tap everywhere

[spice wedge]

Wait those mods that gets opened from fissures lohk etc.

[fast dew]

Lohk just means void

"Wall of void"

Also, go read Albrecht's autobiography "behind the wall of lohk"/j

[spice wedge]

What would happen if that finger gets given back to the man

In the wall

[fast dew]

He'd kill us.

[spice wedge]

explain

[fast dew]

He'd kill our timeline, like he already tried to do

[fast dew]

Wally's heralds used to be us.

[spice wedge]

What if tenno's sacrifice himself on that purposes.

[fast dew]

Doubt it

[obtuse vine]

assuming we are no longer considered his heralds, Im curious how these void powers actually works

because id assume then wally could just take away our void magic if they wanted to

[stiff fable]

They die first is what happens

[ashen pulsar]

according to roathe, it's part of his method of accessing our world

but he might not be able to remove our powers anymore

[eager briar]

Why does Lettie even need medical supplies? She’s a Warframe whose whole thing is healing people she can just like grab their shoulder or something.

[obtuse vine]

the hex protoframes dont seem to be as powerful as refular fully framed warframes

[silk atlas]

She can't be everywhere at once either

[obtuse vine]

that and the fact that the way trinity heals is by siphoning life from someone else to heal her allies

It would be pretty grim if she had to constantly leech life from someone else to heal someone

[eager briar]

Just make a farm for techrot

Think smarter, not harder

[sly pagoda]

Her 4 does not drain health from others to heal.

But i would argue that before the good ending to the power plant where rhe drifter transfers in they did not realize their full capabilities as for part of why the protoframes seem less powerful.

[woven coyote]

pretty sure wally said they used to be "like" us not "us"

[woven coyote]

why wouldnt rell mean the sound that wally makes ?

[obtuse vine]

i think theyre trying to stop the techrot, not make more lmao

[obtuse vine]

thats a fair assumption id say

[strange plinth]

techrot that would spread more spores and potentially infect more people? lettie already hates entrati for making the hex silent carriers, she would not grow techrot just to utilize her abilities

also, she's a trained medic, and an inexperienced trinity. she's using what she knows how to use

[eager briar]

No, no but just like get a floppy disc of it

That would actually be a cool enemy type

Maggots re-skin as floppy disks when

[obtuse vine]

flying infested floppy disks

[marble hound]

Nono I know Rell refers to the man in the wall but I found curious that the Tenno screams that

[woven coyote]

man in the wall also speaks in our head to annoy us

and also makes the physical noise against the glass in the classroom

[marble hound]

Heralds? I thought the only "Vessels", to give it a name, of the man in the well were the OP and Albrecht. Were there others apart from them that knew or serves Wally?

[sly pagoda]

I admit I am disappointed that none of the ranged techrot fired CDs or laserdiscs as an ammo.

[woven coyote]

@marble hound

[marble hound]

So there is someone who interacted with it that we do not know?

[woven coyote]

what wally said sure sounds like it

[strange plinth]

could just be people from those other "decayed universes"

[woven coyote]

it sounds especially suspicious to me combined with that isleweaver dust resource description

[stiff beacon]

Maybe aliens

[obtuse vine]

decayed universes?

[strange plinth]

this
the description of temporal dust

[waxen mesa]

So i was doing a thinking about O.R.O

do we know when kuva was discovered? Could it be O.R.O discovered it and thus Orokin being O.R.O kin

[fast dew]

Oro is a philosophical idea

[waxen mesa]

Was it not the lab Amir briefly worked for

[tall echo]

company not concept

[hexed oxide]

"oro" is "gold" in spanish (and other languages i think) thus they are the goldenkin

[tall echo]

possible

[hexed oxide]

think he was talking about oro as in the thing talked about in conclave

[tall echo]

thomas was, minuet wasn't

[waxen mesa]

Minuet was specifically talking about O.R.O. The lab.

[tall echo]

yes

[waxen mesa]

which was apperently of interest enough to have Albrecht? asking about it

and capable enough that they were able to find out about Amir's data breach despite his attempts to conceal it

[hexed oxide]

didn't albrecht snitch on him ?

[waxen mesa]

I just reset my hex so i can't go check on conversations but I thought it was Albrecht asking about it

i guess he could have snitched to put Amir in a position he'd need the protoframe injection

[lean garden]

NIHIL LOST HIS EXECUTOR STATUS

[humble sierra]

Is this in a chat?

[hexed oxide]

yeah, albrecht snitched on him "and this dr. e wanted specs on the reactor and told me it was a matter of life or death" "I GAVE HIM WHAT HE WANTED" "but then the O.R.O. found out... i don't know how i covered my tracks perfectly i KNOW i did"

[dire mountain]

Yes but moreso the chat got edited.

[strange plinth]

-# "and this dr. e wanted specs on the reactor and told me it was a matter of life or death"
-# "I GAVE HIM WHAT HE WANTED
-# but then the O.R.O. found out... i don't know how i covered my tracks perfectly i KNOW i did
-# and they sent scaldra after me because i was a traitor to national security they said
-# i got a page from a number telling me to go ton an address
-# didn't know what else to do, and... so i went and it was... it was dr. e
-# he gave me this vial and said if scaldra found me i should inject it and..."

[lean garden]

technically yea, the one kim we had that definitively stated that hes an executor was changed

so hes just The Glassmaker

[strange plinth]

this threw me into a coughing fit btw, thanks lmao

[hexed oxide]

you did it much more neatly than me, thx

[humble sierra]

Interesting, so it seems they want us to know he just never had the title of Executor

[strange plinth]

that removes some complexity
though it does mean that there's something else going on with the "grand regent" thing?

[lean garden]

Like Ive been sayins, a regent is for a monarch and like, the executors arent the monachs

they very much arent the monarchs

[humble sierra]

Yeah, Executors are the Executors of the Emperors' will

[pine orchid]

have we ever had any mention of the Orokin Emperors in lore? as in like who they are or what they're like? I always thought The Seven were the highest in the hierarchy before recent update

[lean garden]

the biggest mention was stalker codex where we killed them LOL

[pine orchid]

dangit, I'm so curious what they're like XD
esp since most names and things that happen are just The Seven, it makes me wonder what the Emperors think or do
The Orokin apparently like to 'play pranks' om each other starts a war and kills you "it's just a prank bro" lmao
Are the Emperors the same? Do they play by proxy of the Executors? Or are they just so high that such 'play' is beneath them?

so many questions!

[kindred barn]

Is the blue skin and long arm a status symbol or a fashion choice?

[fast dew]

Both

Blue skin did seem more required than the long arm

[thick yacht]

Long arm looks kinda… bad

It can’t be functional

[obtuse vine]

i have a theory that maybe the blue skin is a side effect of taking alot of kuva. ans thats why albrect is not that blue

[fast dew]

Albrecht still did continuity.

[strange plinth]

its the refacia tech

[fast dew]

And he was blue. Very blue.

[pine orchid]

Albrecht also used to be blue

[strange plinth]

also there's a portrait of blue albrecht in the zariman

[fast dew]

And its post void incident

[obtuse vine]

yeah but then he stopped

[strange plinth]

refacia tech that we can also use to be blue

[fast dew]

And? He still was blue for a long time. We know its not related to the kuva because we can be blue.

[obtuse vine]

dang so its purely cosmetic?

[strange plinth]

yea

[fast dew]

Albeit they're "imitation" colours

[fast dew]

Long arm wasn't functional. That's probably why Albrecht never seemed to have one.

[pine orchid]

tbh the blue skin reminds me of like... Krishna? there's a religious depiction of gods that were blue but idr... Hindu?

[fast dew]

Yeah I'm pretty sure this is the exact inspiration

[thick yacht]

Roathe doesn’t seem to have one either

[fast dew]

Roathe doesn't have that arm i don't think

[lean garden]

Roathe is quite the functional man

because roathe was indeed on the battlefield

[strange plinth]

imitation probably because we aren't proper orokin
or it isn't the exact tech they used. maybe incomplete

[lean garden]

no palaquin to protect him

[thick yacht]

His left arm is Uriel’s and his right arm is normal length

[pine orchid]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Krishnaism

[thick yacht]

So maybe since he was an actual battlefield commander he didn’t want to have a useless appendage

[fast dew]

Well. Having a long arm certainly didn't stop Nihil from beating my ass.

[pine orchid]

nor Ballas but he also had funny sticc

[fast dew]

Wouldn't that mean Nitokh Wouldn't have one?

[thick yacht]

Nitokh has the arm

[pine orchid]

and Entrati Father (Vilcor) also has a long arm and he was a mechanic? maybe a pilot? idr

[fast dew]

So.. it wouldn't be from being a general, then, would it? She actively killed people too.

[thick yacht]

Isn’t his name Petros

Bro lied to us

[fast dew]

He doesn't... have that arm i don't think

[strange plinth]

tbf you can have the long arm and be doing stuff, it just isn't the best

[fast dew]

He didn't remember it.

[azure jasper]

THe Entrati chose new names. That's their whole thing.

[fast dew]

None of them did

[thick yacht]

We need to go upstairs with Roathe and Loid and talk to the family

[pine orchid]

yes, his name used to be Petros, forgot his name and just became Father, then was given the name Vilcor when you ascend through Entrati syndicate ranks

[thick yacht]

They’d be so stunned

[fast dew]

Mother is volatile. I would expect her to slap Loid up the side of his head

[pine orchid]

I thought he did, but idk could be an effect of him not having his left one? I'll have to go in game to check

[strange plinth]

hmm i wonder what roathe offers the first time we talk with him

[fast dew]

But he did raise her, so i do hope she will be happy.

[thick yacht]

Feel like they’d be more surprised by another Orokin being literally beneath them

[fast dew]

Eh

Mother knows Albrecht.

He would've done this shit before

[pine orchid]

I can imagine the conversation
"Loid??? We thought you were lost to us!"
"Well... I was asleep for a rather long time"

[pine orchid]

meaning Roathe right?

[fast dew]

I think the family thinks Loid is dead

They think necraloid is Loid

Mother will learn that Albrecht is alive

Debatable if he's okay

[strange plinth]

will she slap father because of this

[pine orchid]

Albrecht talk to your family or draw 25

[fast dew]

She will lord it over him.

"I WAS RIGHT VILCOR. I WAS RIGHT HE WAS ALIVE."

And loid is just standing there like 🧍

[pine orchid]

I think father is wise enough to stay out of long arm length XD

[fast dew]

If i see the grandchildren call Loid anything but loid (like a nickname) i will actually have an aneurysm and die

Loid was around for their childhood too

[pine orchid]

that would be cute, though I think it's unlikely personally 🥹

[fast dew]

Watch it be some silly name and Loid just cries or something
-# wistful thinking

[pine orchid]

they call him Moustache

[fast dew]

Mother telling necraloid about her nightmares too makes me think she'd do that to loid as well, especially after the void incident

[pine orchid]

awwe that'd be sweet

maybe Loid and Mother together will come up with a plan to fix the Solar Rail system? but then that requires you to finish Roathe's storyline at least and idk if they'll want to gate the new content that way

[waxen mesa]

so does Entranti's name mean "To enter the light"?

[fast dew]

Maybe..?

[waxen mesa]

or light enters for a little more literal

[fast dew]

I hope so. Of all people who would know how to build a void bridge, it would be mother.

I think they should gate content behind more things imo

[pine orchid]

and Loid is also very knowledgeable esp with his experience with Albrecht and the Cavia

[fast dew]

Oh no. You have to play the story to do stuff. Poor you./s

[strange plinth]

within reason, absolutely
removing stolen dreams and the new strange from the main quest requirements even though they build up to Natah perfectly and don't make sense after,,,

[fast dew]

Loid is probably who taught Mother that stuff.

[iron tiger]

So where is descendia lore wise it’s not a memory is it?

[fast dew]

I lowkey wanted the triad to be locked behind both r5 hex and r5 cavia.

[waxen mesa]

Descendia is the fragmented memoreis of Roathe

[fast dew]

Its Roathe's memory/mind.

[strange plinth]

bit of roathe, lyon, marie, and your psyches mixing together i believe

[waxen mesa]

Every layer is a metaphor

for example. the one where you run around and shoot at defenseless targets has a pretty clear meaning

[iron tiger]

This makes the most sense, but if it’s a memory where is it a memory of? It literally looks like hell

[waxen mesa]

see above. its all a metaphorical hell

[thick yacht]

Rework did my drifter right ngl

[strange plinth]

oh no! the two syndicates with the easiest to farm standing! /s
its barely a requirement unless you play for like an hour every week

[pine orchid]

smth like that, there's a line by Roathe saying it's his memories + our mind but idk of Marie and Lyon are also connected/mixed in or just observing

[fast dew]

Literally it would make more sense for the cavia to be completed over the hex.

[ashen pulsar]

there's no reason for that.

[fast dew]

The triad has nothing to do with the hex outside the fact they're protos

[thick yacht]

Are Cavia even really that important to the lore aside from being pets that almost died

[waxen mesa]

Cavia and Necralisk at rank 5 and completing Roathe's KIM chat

[strange plinth]

lyon says something like "i think i'm responsible for this one" when you hit a 'break all the crates and loot' level

[iron tiger]

I wonder how many other protoframes there are in different 99’s

[fast dew]

They are apart of the kalymos sequence, so they would be pretty important.

[waxen mesa]

I''d say the Cavia helped Loid process some of his emotions

[fast dew]

Yeah, that too

The cavia are important

[iron tiger]

Imagine a 99 BS&L

[pine orchid]

so Lyon is Link... ✍️

[iron tiger]

With like Greek philosopher protoframes

[fast dew]

What could he possibly mean by this

[iron tiger]

Assuming sol and lua have their versions of Jesus

[ashen pulsar]

again there's no reason to lock the triad behind syndicate things. it doesn't benefit the game and it would end up with more angry people than not.

im kinda late sending this tho

[fast dew]

So? More people should be actually playing the story.

[strange plinth]

the triad are unlocked after the kalymos sequence completes w/ the hex finale
i feel like that makes sense

[iron tiger]

I just wish there was more reward to rank 5 across all the syndicates

[pine orchid]

tbf the start of the triad doesn't have much to do with any of the other syndicates, and Roathe's storyline does seem to just at least need Entrati rank 5

[fast dew]

Especially with something as story heavy as the triad

[iron tiger]

Like a mini exclusive mission with a story and a gun would be great

[fast dew]

No need for the gun tbh.

We have the stories given to us on rankups

[iron tiger]

There isn’t I just wanted something I could possess

[iron tiger]

Only sometimes for the newer content

Fortuna and the plains have nothing like that

[fast dew]

Mm. Fortuna and Cetus (quills n vox solaris too) don't

[strange plinth]

ostron and solaris rank up cutscenes when, DE
also rework their standing please

[fast dew]

But the rest do, outside the relay syndicates

[iron tiger]

Exactly

[ashen pulsar]

syndicate ranking isn't relevant enough for that

not enough to force players to do it

[fast dew]

... it kinda is. We learn a lot in rank up lore

[strange plinth]

is attaching story elements to it not making it relevant enough??

[iron tiger]

It’s almost every update we get a syndicate now

It’s seems they’re important to me

[fast dew]

Most people should be ranking up cavia for deep Archimedia anyways.

[lean garden]

plus like it makes sense lol, you cant be sending loid up those stairs into a warzone

[pine orchid]

for me personally the Solaris and Fortuna rankings are the least exciting to rank up precisely because we don't have storybits attached to them

[lean garden]

fix the entrati and then loid has a family to go home to

[fast dew]

Fix the entrati, fix the cavia

The r5 hex requirement is only cuz the other protos need it (outside flare)

[iron tiger]

I’m sure if we learn more about the unum the plains will get something

[fast dew]

We get to hear Loid cry during the r5 cavia rank up

[iron tiger]

As for fortuna it supposedly has some pretty high grade orokin tech beneath the vallis

[fast dew]

I think it was worth the week and a half of grinding

[ashen pulsar]

what I meant was, forcing players to rank up syndicates to rank 5 by locking stuff behind it that isn't even part of that syndicate isn't a smart choice. more people will dislike it than people who like it.

[pine orchid]

I would LOVE Unum lore bcs what is this omni-aware tower that they're flaying regularly for food???? 😭

[fast dew]

... the triad are arguably apart of the cavia

Necraloid isn't an animal and he is apart of it

The triad absolutely counts imo

[obtuse vine]

Im betting its a silver grove situation

[fast dew]

Prolly why they didn't have their own syndicate

4 syndicates in one space is far too much

[cedar cedar]

Wait so, if all warframes were originally human, why is umbra the only sentient one?

[fast dew]

He isn't, not exactly.

Jade, stalker, the acolytes probably

[pine orchid]

uhm ackshually, he's just 'awake' 🤓

[strange plinth]

umbra has his "single. burning. memory" to keep him from going feral
something to focus on keeps them "sane"

[iron tiger]

Ngl I don’t mind it makes everything feel so connected and having the game so disconnected between loading screens sucks nuts

[obtuse vine]

cuz ballas wants to torture him personaly

[azure jasper]

Pretty much this, yeah. He hates Ballas so much that the hatred keeps his mind from going.

[pine orchid]

Im just joking btw, Sentient is usually conencted to the... well the Sentients

[ashen pulsar]

imo cavia is the syndicate and everything attached to it. simply being there isn't enough to make them part of the cavia. they arent a syndicate

[obtuse vine]

idk about "not going feral" bro is very feral

[strange plinth]

he's on a rampage because he's being forced to relive that memory. he's in control, doing it on purpose

[fast dew]

... id argue being there absolutely makes them apart of that syndicate

They are involved with the cavia

[ashen pulsar]

why? they don't use materials or standing from cavia.

[strange plinth]

the cavia are mentioned in the triad chats

[fast dew]

.. they do actually

Roathe does use voca for a honoria

[iron tiger]

Ngl I hate how they sidelined umbra after the sacrifice

[ashen pulsar]

just communicating with them isn't enough.

[iron tiger]

He needs an epilogue quest

[strange plinth]

ehh. his story was done. he's accepted that memory

[ashen pulsar]

are we really gonna nitpick like this

[pine orchid]

I want umbra just chilling in our Orbiter

[fast dew]

Uriel also uses materials found exclusively because of the cavia syndicate

[obtuse vine]

idk about tht, he seemed preety unhinged when we first equiped him. yelliong and screaming and stuff.

[azure jasper]

I'd like to see Umbra just walking around the Orbiter, doing random stuff.

[fast dew]

The cavia syndicate are also attached to the old peace quest as well

[obtuse vine]

i think our intervention is what made him go sane

[pine orchid]

Instead of Wally going hey kiddo, sometimes it's Umbra petting your cat or smth

[obtuse vine]

what would an umbra epilogue look like?

[ashen pulsar]

that's because the dark refractory is located in entrati's labs.

[iron tiger]

I mean we “tamed” him I’m not sure he just wants to live as a single memory though and given his ties to the old war a comeback to the story wouldn’t be out of the question

[fast dew]

Yeah.

Something the cavia, Loid mainly, has. The refractory is Albrecht's. Is the cavia's.

Id say they're apart of the syndicate

[ashen pulsar]

... and so therefore anyone in the labs is part of the cavia?

[obtuse vine]

when they said "the cavia have reverted" in the quest i was really expecting it to actually effect the cavia in the sanctum but it seems like nothing happened

[strange plinth]

would you not also yell and scream if you were rebuilt just to watch you kill your son again

[fast dew]

...yeah everyone so far has been

[ashen pulsar]

are the cavia part of the necralisk syndicate because they're attached to the necralisk?

[strange plinth]

they un-reverted after the indifference was warded off

[fast dew]

Necraloid joins once you get to r5

[obtuse vine]

i would be yelling and i would also be feral and not sane

[iron tiger]

They are experiments/pets/individuals

[ashen pulsar]

is nightcap's syndicate just SU?

[strange plinth]

yea i'd say they are

[thick yacht]

Roathe just told me Kuva wouldn’t work on him anymore

[strange plinth]

part of SU yea

[thick yacht]

So that means this body/life is his last

[fast dew]

Well, they don't interact and rely on each other.

[iron tiger]

How does that work even does blue kuva work temporarily like within the day and then red kuva is lifetime transference

[obtuse vine]

i wouldnt say they are since the entrati family is completely unaware of whats happening down there (no i have not finished roathes KIM idk if he keeps his deal)

[misty salmon]

Nightcap has his own little thing going on down there, I'm not sure how much contact he has with upstairs.... but he'd certainly fit in with SU or Vox if they offer.

[obtuse vine]

nightcap is intresting because his flashbacks makes it seem like he was a corpus merc that then defected

but if there arent any records of him in the debt ledgers then why is his head in his chest

[strange plinth]

tbf we don't know if blue kuva is even real
but yes, its meant to just last about a day, while red kuva is permanent

[ashen pulsar]

syndicates in gameplay are different from syndicates in lore. and there's no reason that helping nightcap should require you to be best friends with eudico, just like there's no reason helping cavia should require you to completely repair the entrati family, just like there's no reason talking to roathe should require you to know loid perfectly. People don't just ignore you because you aren't besties with their partners.

[fast dew]

Where did i say literally any of that lol

And yeah. You do actually need to be r5 with the family to help loid.

Roathe will refuse to do it if they're not.

[misty salmon]

My guess is Nightcap is not his old name, and he's been down there for a very long time. Trying to find him on the debt ledgers would be an exercise in archive diving.

[ashen pulsar]

that's different. that's a time when bonds between people actually does matter.

[obtuse vine]

he's like batman but for mushroom folk

[ashen pulsar]

you said kim for the triad should be locked behind r5 cavia and hex

[fast dew]

Im sayin that the hex r5 requirement would just be keeping the standard with the round table, and the r5 cavia requirement will allow Loid to actually feel like he has enough free time to see the family.

[strange plinth]

links between syndicates don't matter unless they do matter

[fast dew]

Suda and Simaris have no link until octavia's anthem

They're just cephalons in the same building

[fast dew]

Because remember, Loid is trying to find a cure for the cavia.

[strange plinth]

the cavia are in a bit of a crisis until rank 5, yea

[fast dew]

He would be spending all his time on it.

Wouldn't be a good idea to reach out to the family as well

[ashen pulsar]

there's more of a link between round table and hex than triad and cavia. velimir and minerva still use hex standing and kaya does make you do (somewhat) normal 99 missions to get hex standing

[fast dew]

Hell are they even gonna do? Son doesn't specialise in void poisoning.

Mother maybe

But there's no guarantee that she even remembers Loid

[fast dew]

... that they're in the same space and they also got screwed over by Albrecht?

[ashen pulsar]

gameplay wise not lorewise

[fast dew]

Okay and im talking lorewise. From a story perspective it doesn't make much sense for Loid to be willing to see the family while he worries about the cavia.

[ashen pulsar]

oh yeah im fine with the loid part requiring r5 necralisk

[obtuse vine]

so yall are saying yall were arguing over nothing......

[ashen pulsar]

I was arguing over something he said earlier

[strange plinth]

adding cavia r5 to the triad requirement

[ashen pulsar]

yeah

I dislike locking gameplay behind optional lore even if you SHOULD know what the lore is

[fast dew]

I think it should be done more.

The cavia and hex already do it.

[obtuse vine]

story wise tht makes the most sense but uh yeah noone would touch the triad if the requirements are the hex finale AND r5 cavia

[strange plinth]

you are unlocking more gameplay by ranking up the cavia though
and it isn't a massive requirement, either. cavia is pretty easy to rank up

[obtuse vine]

though that being said, it would give new players a reason to grind cavia and unlock EDA

[ashen pulsar]

im just saying it shouldnt happen as a whole. newer or midgame people would complain even if the lore nerds would like it

[fast dew]

Eh

[ashen pulsar]

its worth appeasing the larger audience

[fast dew]

They should be doing it for EDA and ETA

[ashen pulsar]

this is true

[fast dew]

Just adds more to it.

More rewarding.

[ashen pulsar]

but these are different people with different stories so it is still kinda dumb

[fast dew]

Ehh

[obtuse vine]

does the game even tell you EDA exists? I know it cuz they showed it off during the devstreams. idk how new players would stumble across EDA

[strange plinth]

not until you've unlocked it

[ashen pulsar]

in the case of the round table you're more expanding the hex syndicate than adding a new part of the game

[fast dew]

Nup. Its just there.

You randomly see necraloid there and go "hey wait"

[obtuse vine]

so before its unlocked they dont know it exists thus theres no incentive to push them to r5 to unlock EDA

[pine orchid]

I figured the merchant items locked behind rank 5 would be the push before EDA

[ashen pulsar]

the incentive is someone on discord saying "oh man my ETA rewards this week were insane"

[obtuse vine]

im just now realizing how much DE relies on devstreams to show and explain things in the game

[pine orchid]

stuff like Helminth segment

[obtuse vine]

thts not good...

[ashen pulsar]

indeed

[strange plinth]

a higher rank with a syndicate i like is all i need tbh. but i know that isn't enough for most
which is why putting stuff behind higher ranks makes sense, its an additional incentive. you just need something that alludes to it.

[ashen pulsar]

thats r3

[obtuse vine]

even that isnt explicit. like the game doesnt go HEY THE HELMITH LETS YOU MIX WARFRAMES.....its just kinda....there.......

[pine orchid]

I know, but that was the driving force for me to unlock r3 with the Cavia to begin with, then I stopped for a while before eventually getting r5
What I mean to say is if there's more interesting r5 merchant items it would be a way to push towards maxing out syndicates

[obtuse vine]

my friend did 1999 before he found out about the helminth segment, he was so confused when i asked what frames did he subsume

[pine orchid]

same with me, I spedran the story (as in I ONLY did story, watched all the cutscenes, didn't do much or any side content)

[obtuse vine]

I wanna talk about how theres also no tutorial on how the railjack works but tht seems like its too off topic from lore discussions

[strange plinth]

i feel like i have to

[pine orchid]

by the time I got to 1999 I had little to no standing with other syndicates, I only had mote amp and sirocco, no helminth segments, etc

[dark compass]

Almost all things in the game have a small sign you can hover over to explain the mechanics and purpose. Nobody just reads it. Those signs even have tips for making a build for specific warframes when previewing them. But no, nobody ever bothers to read those.

DE needs to make it cover half the screen

[strange plinth]

/s

[obtuse vine]

we're warframe players, we dont read

[strange plinth]

well that's half the problem

[dark compass]

These tips seriously give so much context but absolutely nobody is using them

[spring elk]

I dont think everything needs to be tutorialized, especially a system that largely uses existing systems for modification and already has a dedicated quest

[pine orchid]

at risk of adding to the stereotype I must ask, which ones in particular? I have no clue what you're talking about, building how as in the mods? the abilities? the foundry?

[obtuse vine]

most but not all, again, railjack quest doesnt even tell you u about the big gun to make the crewships go boom

[spring elk]

Trial and error a bit, faff around in the ship you just got, explore it

[obtuse vine]

the railjack quest funnily enough doesnt teach you how to use the reailjack

[pine orchid]

I was very confused when they said "forward artillery" and it is not meaning the guns I have when I'm in the driver's seat

[dark compass]

Building as in making a build for them

[obtuse vine]

dont really have time to explore when the entire ship is getting shot at

[dark compass]

Let me grab a good example, booting up the game

[strange plinth]

yes, yes, yes
the abilities menu has a big "TIPS" thing on the side with some mediocre tips about how to use the abilities
hovering over the "buy blueprint" in the arsenal menus will show you where you can get the pieces
the modding menu gives much more basic tips, but its still there

[spring elk]

There is a free flight node
I had forgotten about the quest not teaching much about thr ship itself

[pine orchid]

I was told "oh it's just normal gun/ship stuff" and I'm like but I'm not a gun/ship person! I don't know this jargon! they dont even boot me out of the driver seat and point to where the forward artillery was! I didn't know those lil circle things were interactable! qwq

[strange plinth]

railjack is horribly explained though yes that needs improvement

[obtuse vine]

yeah thts my issue is tht the railjack quest doesnt teach you the basics of jacking

[pine orchid]

my partner has to help me with learning the (rail) jacking

[obtuse vine]

considering they said in an interview tht there will be more railjack content next year, im hoping they actuallly do a tutorial to it

[pine orchid]

pls they made one for mods

[obtuse vine]

also praying for railjacks on Tau

please

[pine orchid]

I'm surprised Sevagoths quest didnt teach us more tbh

[strange plinth]

CotT assumes you have a decent railjack and murders you immediately if you don't lol

[pine orchid]

I had a starter railjack doing that

[obtuse vine]

there needs to be a mini section at the end of rising tide where cy takes you to free roam and teaches you the very bare bones basics

[pine orchid]

it's like the TWO railjack main quests

[strange plinth]

then i will add you to the list of anomalies because that first 'infiltrate the corpus archives' has killed most of the people i've heard of playing it w/ a starter

[dark compass]

there IS an official tutortial... its just on their website https://www.warframe.com/news/railjack-guide

[pine orchid]

tbf it did, and all I gotafter was my partner taking me to speedrun som hull upgrades so I dont explode immediately

it was the same with New War assuming I had a decently built railjack, until recently apparentl lmao

[humble sierra]

Yeah Hinduism has many gods, Krishna is one of the blue ones. I think it's a big inspiration for DE design-wise. "Madurai" is also a sacred place IIRC, though that could just be a coincidence since the other schools aren't existing names.

[dark compass]

https://support.warframe.com/hc/en-us/articles/38820115630093-Railjack

and an even better one on the support page

[obtuse vine]

bad

noone should ever

open a browser to learn about the basics of a system

[pine orchid]

imo, it's bad design to not be explaining core mechanics of a game within the game itself

I think all of that should be in the game, maybe in a help section like games usually have a mechanics/guides tab somewhere that explain these things to you or give a tutorial popup you read through while the game is paused
explaining things to me through live transmissions mid combat is not effective, though that could just be a my executive function disorder issue

[swift sentinel]

DE is notorious for under explaining their game mechanics

I still think there is no explanation about one of Gara's core skill interactions

[dark compass]

which one?

[pine orchid]

it's quite important to improve when they're pulling in new players, esp like ironmouse who will likely bring in more new players who will then feel this frustration if they didn't happen to already have a veteran friend (like marcomeatball)

[strange plinth]

unfortunately
it is still one of the biggest things that prevents people from playing
they're attempting to solve it, evidenced by the modding quest, just needs a bit more attention to that area

[dark compass]

the duration/damage stacking of splinter storm?

[obtuse vine]

this 100%

[dark compass]

its in her tips if thats what youre talking about

[obtuse vine]

though that being said DE have been making moves to improve the new player experience

[dark compass]

like even stuff that might look like jank at first is often explained in these

[main crane]

I got a question. Is there a lore behind why the Prime Vanguard are so tall in the Perita Rebellion/Old Peace?

[pine orchid]

not that I know of

[obtuse vine]

assume its just gameplay reasons until told otherwise

[strange plinth]

doubt. they're probably just meant to stand out in the crowd, so they're bigger

[pine orchid]

probably for the bigger hitbox in squad play

[obtuse vine]

possible reasons, galastra wanted them big

they could also be larger than life because thats how our tenno remembers them.

[pine orchid]

tbf... our tenno was a child everyone looks bigger when you're a fetus 🤣

[main crane]

LMAO

Actually yeah everything makes sense now

[obtuse vine]

everyone except the ostron lmao

[pine orchid]

yeah though the ostron do look to be a lil on the shorter side in general

[dark compass]

its because of the wall meat diet

[hollow siren]

It's kinda unclear how much of the Ostrons' biology is actually in-universe and how much is just DE not being great at modelling humans yet by then

[dark compass]

i will continue to hold the wall meat as the headcanon

[hollow siren]

That would be a decent way to retroactively give an explanation

[pine orchid]

ostron and fortuna glowup when

[dark compass]

fortuna people look much better than ostron

[strange plinth]

bisexual lighting fortuna return when

[dark compass]

it has to be the wall meat

[white sable]

Is there any lore on ballas on why he's hated even before old peace

[hollow siren]

1. He's one of the Seven
2. He's the our adoptive mom's toxic boyfriend

[strange plinth]

he's a bit of an ass
and iirc he tried to have the tenno destroyed even before the 'ruined the peace w/ the sentients' thing

[obtuse vine]

yeah he was mega jealous tht margulis cared for the kids more than him

[proper barn]

Did you play the sacrifice?

Or new war. Or many other quests.

He's like the creator of warframes at a base.

And everyone thats interacted with him has had a terrible time.

[main crane]

Long story short: The Orokin are assholes

Especially the Executors

[white sable]

Guess I'd need to look more about executors xD
Any place where lore about them is there

[strange turtle]

Just a heads up that was a mistake and they fixed it, he’s just “The Glassmaker” in the KIM now

[brittle siren]

oh I see

@fast dew

[strange turtle]

He knows

Was revealed in another server

[pine orchid]

big respect to the peeps going in the files to get all this info, to even find smth was changed like that

[strange turtle]

They don’t go into the files

[stiff fable]

wow, and so many people leapt to correct me (and others) who said that he wasn't

[strange turtle]

Theres a site hooked up for people to simulate convos and read flowcharts of all thr kim data

[stiff fable]

makes me feel like being real petty lol

[manic rover]

SHE SAID THE THING

[strange turtle]

Tbf there was like, an actual statement at the time but like

[strange plinth]

the drifter saying he was an executor was a reliable enough source
that has since been removed.

[strange turtle]

IMO it was kind of obvious that he wasn’t until then, and that the title could have been a mistake or retcon

[stiff fable]

right but the initial confusion was always over him being an executioner and not an executor

[strange turtle]

Like
This is the kind of thing that you’d expect to get brought up in the Nightwave quest or one of his little Oubliette voicelines

[stiff fable]

the fact that DE was also confused over this is further amusement

[humble sierra]

Ngl you could just chalk that up to Drifter being a moron

"What's his name again? Ballas" like you ain't just listened to a whole ahh song

[strange turtle]

Calling someone an Executor is something DE doesn’t shy away from, after all

And this was also an actual character in the modern WF era. Maybe he wouldn’t get the Ballas treatment but to have him be a one-note villain and not just the antagonist of a long, drawn-out equivalent of a quest?

[pine orchid]

even if they're not going into the files manually, they still had to setup the kimulator to access this stuff and then look through all the dialogue lines to even notice
so I think it's still worthy of respect

[strange plinth]

i feel like that was more snark than actually not knowing

[humble sierra]

Of course but it's much funnier to imagine they just had no clue

[strange plinth]

i mean, i heard about it, checked my KIM history, and found the line changed

[manic rover]

It's official. They were freaky with each other

[humble sierra]

IT SHOULDVE BEEN ME

well it could be me

[stiff fable]

tbf most of the executors were slain fairly quickly in the backstory

[strange turtle]

Thats backstory

[stiff fable]

Karishh was offed in his initial intro off-page

[humble sierra]

Also Nitokh sounds hot

[manic rover]

you can find a statue of her

[stiff fable]

bruh have you seen the lineup of the seven

[humble sierra]

Just the 5-ish statues when walking around the academy

[stiff fable]

if she existed in modern Warframe we'd have normal people, not even chuds, asking if they could swap sides from Lotus to Nitokh

[pine orchid]

the Orokin are just "freaky" in general Xd
guess that comes with being immortal and bored

[stiff fable]

right in the middle

[manic rover]

to be perfectly honest, I believe Balls died a virgin

[humble sierra]

Oh my god she's beautiful

[strange plinth]

Avantus, Ballas, Karishh, Nitokh, Scarne, Tormis, Tuvul
alphabetical order

[humble sierra]

Oh sorry was looking at Karishh

[velvet cradle]

Yea. When you are immortal

You kinda seen almost everything

Anything new is exciting even if it is weird and freaky

[strange turtle]

It makes sense to not give them much attention. They’re not here so they’re not important beyond background information. But to have such an influential figure as an Executor be an exception to the slaughter and survive to this day, introduce him and then kill him off in the same sequence would be crazy work

[stiff fable]

yeah she's the type you commit war crimes for

[strange turtle]

Icl I just don’t see it

[stiff fable]

Su Daji

[humble sierra]

Was Avantus a woman? Or well, at least a woman often enough to be depicted as such?

[strange turtle]

Like, even beyond it literally just being a monocolour statue

[pine orchid]

it would be sooo funny Ballas' whole crashout is because Margulis is too busy with the kids and wouldn't let Ballas tap that

just ultimate incel behaviour

[strange plinth]

referred to as she during the synthesis entry we have about her
so, yea

[manic rover]

Bro pulled the "The kids or me" card and it backfired historically

[stiff fable]

the one where Avantus get chainsawed lol

[humble sierra]

Damn I missed that

[humble sierra]

It's also partially Roathe's descriptions of her, reminds me of Carmilla in Castlevania

[pine orchid]

I should do more synthesis...

[humble sierra]

HUNTER

[velvet cradle]

I swear a good chunk of the lore is like dark souls lore

[manic rover]

what the hell is the thermostat counter 😭

[strange plinth]

half of them are good lore and the other half are mediocre lore iirc

[strange plinth]

related to the ending you get
||higher|| is better from what i hear

[humble sierra]

If I had to guess, how temperamental he gets

[manic rover]

oh right, there are endings to this too

[pine orchid]

out of curiosity, once you reach an ending with KIM messages you can reset and try to get the other ending right?

[manic rover]

i guess?

[stiff fable]

Yes

but (outside the Hex) there are best endings

[pine orchid]

I played to the hex and roundtable ones once and never reset but good to know

[strange plinth]

w/ the roundtable, you'll have "associate" status if you got the bad ending

[pine orchid]

I think I managed to get best endings for the roundtable like
I got ||Rusalka's hope, I got Lizzie Shawzin and got to see their song, Kaya is in a relay in present Tenno day||

[velvet cradle]

Roundtable?

[pine orchid]

minerva, velimir, kaya, flare

[velvet cradle]

Oh wait

The ones with the second round of proto

[strange turtle]

Lmfao Corpuszoned

[manic rover]

It seems the progression in 1899 is rather quick
after 4 days im in the liked status for Roathe and Marie

[pine orchid]

same, though maybe bcs there isnt a proper standing/chrmistry grind attached to them?

[manic rover]

probably but better for me

[strange plinth]

no gifting either
so i think a good amount of chemistry gains are forced

[manic rover]

yeah you def get chemistry even if it doesnt show

which makes me think the extra chemistry you get is superficial

[pine orchid]

mybe later down the line of convo they'll have differences based on the chemistry lv? but idk

[manic rover]

it might be an indicator that you choose the favorable answers

[pine orchid]

I want to know what kind of gifts the triad would like though, imagine Marie being so happy to have a coffee machine

[manic rover]

I'm gonna throw an entire carton of eggs on Lyon

[restive river]

I don’t think we could give Roathe anything he would want
Might do something bad

||bro reverse engineered the helminth with nothing but his blood-||

[pine orchid]

imagine Roathe liking puzzles or mystery books

the ben starr puzzle crashout but it's Roathe

[pine orchid]

Loid: "What do you have there Devil"
Roathe: "A mechanism"
Loid: "NO-"

[brittle siren]

has anyone found this yet?

[humble sierra]

I think so. IIRC if you face the depicted engine as it's going upwards, then go left to the edge of the cliff/map it should be there

[brittle siren]

where is this?

[humble sierra]

One of the Spawns. Try "Recall: Dactolyst"

[hollow trench]

Wait a minute

Did the orokin use corpses for the warframes?

Because if so

Holy f

[pine orchid]

nah

they used living people Xd

[brittle siren]

not the tune I seeking

[humble sierra]

Ah my bad

[next mica]

stage 21 of the descendia according to reddit

[brittle siren]

oh I seee

[humble sierra]

OH DANG ITS THAT ONE?

Sorry Ranoru

[lean garden]

@pale pelican

All operators by the time of the Night of Naga Drums are in the second dream

[humble sierra]

Remember that bit in the Erra cutscene where the Operators all have blacked out eyes?

Is that because they're dreaming and the Lotus is in control?

[lean garden]

a state where they are in the pods connected to warframes via transference, but "asleep" in the pods.

transference in this state would be akin to lucid dreaming

[strange plinth]

most likely imo
makes a lot more sense than the wally possession theory

[humble sierra]

Because the Old Peace ending seems to suggest the Margulis started the Dream there?

[restive river]

She put us specifically in the dream after the quest, locking us away on Lua

[humble sierra]

Which imo kinda makes the Night of the Naga drums less impactful, it doesn't feel like our decision to turn anymore

[pale pelican]

But isnt it also implied at some point that lotus put is in a dream state too

[restive river]

Where we would technically wake up for blasting Erra

[restive river]

Wdym?

[pale cedar]

It was Ballas’ plan that's old lore at this point

[spice spade]

Does anyone know how many audio messages Roathe has in the Kim messenger in total?

[humble sierra]

Wait, so the Tenno rebellion was never us actually rebelling? Screw you Ballas

[pale cedar]

It was

[gloomy wharf]

My thirst for orokin blood still isn't quenched. When will we be able to actually relive the night of the Naga drums?

[pale cedar]

But Ballas planned it

[restive river]

Ballas wasn’t behind the naga drums what

[pale pelican]

I get that im just saying that i thought operator was there in person not as a warframe only

[pale cedar]

He was

[restive river]

I don’t recall that at all

[strange plinth]

21 i believe

[restive river]

His plan to overthrow the Orokin with Hunhow, yes
But the actual Naga Drums?

[lean garden]

Yea and I said all of them are in the second dream

[restive river]

Like the amount of floors!

[spice spade]

Jfc, thx.

[humble sierra]

You can just spam the Roathe boss fight

[spice spade]

I thought it would be around 15 at most

[strange plinth]

the details weren't all planned out, but the basics of hunhow losing and the tenno turning on the orokin were planned by ballas i believe

[lean garden]

dont worry, just beat up roathe and only roathe

[pale cedar]

He started plotting to kill them after Margulis died which was the Naga Drums

[restive river]

I know the Tenno did it cause Margulis died but it sounds like you’re saying he did that cause Margulis died
Which I vaguely recall as him being stupid cause he had the literal power to stop that

[spice spade]

Ik ik, I've only been doing the floors as it rotates weekly

[pale cedar]

He still sees it as the Orokins fault which is why he turned

[slate basin]

Praghasa CAME to the origin system at the beginning of the New War right?

[restive river]

He was just looking for any reason probably

[spice spade]

But I believe I already have around 10 of them I'll grind it later

[pale cedar]

He reprogrammed Natah to have us destroy the Orokin

[restive river]

She would have been there since the end of the Old War, just on the far outskirts

[restive river]

Right right
I remember now

[pine orchid]

it's Ballas, I can see it being that he doesn't want to take the "wrong" stance by defending Margulis due to his pride as one of the Seven

[humble sierra]

Ducky woke up from the Dream

[restive river]

Where am I-

[slate basin]

oh, i see
cause if she came over from Tau I would have assumed that she ate one of the suns to do it, and going to Tau we would see only one sun is left

[humble sierra]

To my knowledge the suneating is just for a jump, not for simply traveling

[strange plinth]

prolly close to how he justified it
but he also seemed to be one of the biggest contributors to the "kill the tenno" idea, so him pardoning the one getting in the way of that is also weird

[lean garden]

honestly its really easy I used nokko and leisurely beat him in 2 minutes

[pine orchid]

yeah and Margulis wasn't Orokin so she can't just bodyjump when she dies she's just dead, unlike say... Nitokh maybe killing Roathe for fun but then Roathe can respawn in another body anyway so it's fine

[pale cedar]

Not anymore he can't

[restive river]

Ballas only had her doing that so she could make a void portal to quickly get to Tau, she likely took the rail to get back to the Origin System during the tail end of the Old War

[humble sierra]

The resurrection process isn't just "I'll head straight to another body", it needs to be prepared with Kuva and stuff. Jade Light also is an execution tool so it's possible it just destroys everything involved

[restive river]

She could though, anyone can use the Kuva but the Orokin had all of it for their own use

[pale cedar]

We're actually the reason Ballas and Margulis’ relationship fell apart because Ballas couldn't handle Margulis loving someone more than himself

[stiff fable]

there's a mystical component to it

[restive river]

We killed 99% of the Orokin, they didnt just hop bodies lol

[stiff fable]

the Orokin thought alchemy would be enough for Javi to survive the light

[restive river]

There can be

[brittle siren]

Ballas: You fool, you ruined my plan to kill all the devils so we can have some time alone

[pine orchid]

could but isn't the point that only Orokin had access to Kuva at the time anyway? and I'm not saying it necessarily has to be Nitokh surprise killing Roathe, it could be like a "hey Roathe I'm bored can I kill you" "sure let me get my Kuva and Yuvan ready"

[restive river]

The whole continuity process seems like it doesn’t have to be a big ritual but it can be

[fallen iris]

So my boy Roathe was a mean homie and Albrecht was like “you gon go to the past boy”
Is that right?

[strange plinth]

there's some kind of emergency continuity, as that's what happens with ordan's rampage and we're threatened with it during the old peace if the transport (that i still can't remember the name of)'s health gets too low

[brittle siren]

It may need those void mirror

[stiff fable]

and Lunaro's lore was originally that it was training for destroying Oro

[strange plinth]

sounds like it, yea

[stiff fable]

Conclave lore, who knew

[lean garden]

it isnt, roathe || does continuity in the middle of battle||

[pine orchid]

there's this too, I'm not sure what it is since we haven't had more info yet?

[restive river]

Nope, all that’s needed is Kuva and another body

[restive river]

I’m saying it doesn’t have to be a ritual but can be

[brittle siren]

oh that simple?

[pine orchid]

regardless, Margulis' punishment is permadeath and Ballas is proably salty about his secret lover being taken away from him

[restive river]

Aside from Roathe we know of two instances of continuity
The War Within and Voruna with Tuvul
One is a whole ritual, the other is not

[pine orchid]

by the Orokin

[lean garden]

oh yea no I agree, Im just saying that the essentials dont need it

[strange plinth]

can remove the "probably" there

[restive river]

He could have stopped it lol

[restive river]

Ye
Just a flask of kuva and another living body

[lean garden]

Havent people started getting the convo from roathe about ballas and marge?

[pine orchid]

you right, it is the reason Ballas wants to destroy all Orokin even if he was involved in the trial of Margulis too XD

[pine orchid]

I got the one about his time in the storm

[strange plinth]

i've heard of it but not gotten it

[pine orchid]

I'm assuming that's one of the rank 2 convos?

[stiff fable]

no, because descendia keeps cancelling my roathe convos

it's infuriating

[strange plinth]

and yea i've had one roathe convo cancelled by a VM

[stiff fable]

I've had three

[strange plinth]

oof

[brittle siren]

not this either

[restive river]

I haven’t

[lean garden]

doesnt reopening give you the roathe convo

[copper mountain]

A palanquin, which is a type of covered litter. Fun fact, they don't normally talk IRL!

[dark compass]

I was right about that all along

[strange plinth]

no

[lean garden]

covered litter? I know those are a pain to carry casualties with lol

[karmic marten]

Is this a real dialogue or edited???

[lean garden]

obviously edited

[restive river]

Yeah very obviously lol

[karmic marten]

Oh ok

[strange plinth]

yea. right text size but wrong text spacing
or maybe the font is like. one size too big
why am i analyzing this. what.

[restive river]

That def should say serum
Not
Anything else

[copper mountain]

There's a space obviously missing after the... uh... word in question... due to the width of the 'm' and 'n'

[brittle siren]

though he did said he will lick Albrecht hot (thick?) blood on his claw

I think that voiceline is from the 18-19th time we fight him

[maiden flame]

sometimes I got a thought that Wally isn't evil at all, He just so angry at Albrecht for what He did and took in the past. I mean, if Wally indeed an evil being (like Corpus with Their greed or Grineer with Their desire to rule), wouldn't He already wrecking around the system with His massive power? I mean massive power is He's literally the one who gave Us the power We used all these time and He surely can do It too with bigger proportion, right?

what do You guys think? is Wally actually or not?

[pale cedar]

He killed your parents

Well made you

[strange plinth]

indirectly, but yea

[maiden flame]

well, is it really His did?

[strange plinth]

he put the pieces there

[strange plinth]

he made them go insane, then gave you the powers to kill them

[pale cedar]

Wally made them go mad them gave you a piece of him to kill them with

[restive river]

Wally is limited by lack of finger

Also he is def not good lol

[restive river]

Or gave the other kids powers to kill them

[pale cedar]

DE actually call him Evil Twin and Evil Man in the Wall

[maiden flame]

🤔 🤔 🤔

[thick yacht]

The only reason why Wally even got this powerful now is due to Ball ass

Since he wanted to cause mayhem

🗿

When in doubt blame Ballas

Chances are you’d be right

[maiden flame]

🤔 🤔 🤔 🤔 🤔 🤔

[thick yacht]

[pale cedar]

Wally also directly tries to kill you in Whispers

[thick yacht]

That was his attempt?

Pretty piss poor attempt ngl

[pale cedar]

He controls the Vessel and thinks he crushed you

[strange plinth]

he spends all of isleweaver trying to kill you too
and is taunting you the whole time

[pale cedar]

He didn't account for the other Vessel

[maiden flame]

okay so, if Wally is indeed evil, would that means He's not smart? 😆 I mean cmon, with His remaining power (that's still massive) He only wreck the lab at this point

[pale cedar]

Wally hasn't got a good intention in his body tbh

[thick yacht]

Dude is failing this badly to kill a child

Rough

[pine orchid]

part of me thinks Wally isn't taking this that seriously, like... playing with his food kinda thing? he seems to like sowing despair or despondency/apathy

[pale cedar]

He's also not trying to most of the time cuz there's a whole deal

[strange plinth]

his power is heavily limited by the fact that he's missing a finger
and, yes, without intervention, he would take over the lab. ||he almost does during the old peace quest||, but we keep beating him back

[pale cedar]

Wally doesn't directly fight us most of the time just leaving the task to Murmur

[maiden flame]

so, You mean like, Wally personality is actually like a playful child?

[pine orchid]

and like... if Wally was CE'd by Albrecht, an Orokin... perhaps Wally is 'playing' like an Orokin would like political games and stuff
smth smth "we are not made in the image of gods, gods were made in our image"

[pale cedar]

Wally isn't even a god lol

I'm happy Roathe called that out

[pine orchid]

not playful child, more playful Orokin
like "I'm bored lets kill everyone and take over the Empire" playful

[thick yacht]

I’m pretty sure even Bill Cipher was more successful than Wally at this point

💀🥀

He actually gained access to reality

[pine orchid]

I think Wally has called this a game a couple times, or that we're playing together (menacingly)
maybe it was during Isleweaver?

[restive river]

Same!

[restive river]

He can’t do much cause he doesn’t got his finger and we keep snapping his strands

[pale cedar]

I dunno

Wally did manage to kill our family while Bill couldn't kill the Pines

[restive river]

Any way he could fully get in to cause problems we either stop or he lacks presently

[strange plinth]

(life support activated) Neci Rusalka: "I am playing the long game."
yea maybe

[restive river]

Bill killed his whole ||dimension/universe|| iirc
But that was prior to everything in the show

[thick yacht]

Bill gained unrestricted access to reality at the height of his power, only stopped by a failsafe no one even knew about until it was triggered, Wally is still trying to access reality without having to use vessels or third parties

[maiden flame]

honestly, playful child is more make sense to Me, because if You think about how kid would react when Their toy or plaything is taken from Them, is exactly how Wally react when We resque the hex in the Hex second ending

[pine orchid]

that one is a bit on the nose and sounds like coping lmao
there's a different one I'm thinking of abt like how we're playing in the undercroft while our friends are out there dying or smth

[thick yacht]

If it wasn’t for the fail safe reality would’ve been destroyed by Cipher

[pine orchid]

(that was abt the line quoted idk why discord keeps removing my reply smhsmh)

[thick yacht]

When Wally can actually access the Origin system in his preferred form and start causing real havoc then he’ll be the threat he makes himself out to be

[strange plinth]

Neci Rusalka: "If you're wasting your time here, who's protecting those freaks back in Höllvania?"
this one?

[thick yacht]

Though something tells me that DE is going to end up having Wally fully break through

Maybe he’ll cause a void rift or something

[turbid vigil]

ofcourse

[maiden flame]

yeah, Wally literally can go anywhere He want, no matter where place and when's the time line

He can go to Our orbiter even go to 1999

[turbid vigil]

he somehow wants us iirc

we still dont know everything about the deal

[maiden flame]

true but His number 1 priority is probably Albrecht

[turbid vigil]

it already had Albrecht in 1999

[maiden flame]

He want Us but not the way He want Albrecht

[restive river]

No, he wants what we owe him.

[strange plinth]

we still owed something from the first part, supposedly
but he added the page during whispers and we directly broke it then by not giving him the page

[restive river]

He wants Albrecht
He wants what we owe
He wants his finger

[strange plinth]

hell, maybe the thing we owe is giving him his finger

[restive river]

Bro does not know how deals work lol

[turbid vigil]

its in our orbiter often tho cant it just go into our rj

[restive river]

Oh I’ll give him the finger…

[strange plinth]

lmao

[strange plinth]

that is a replica, not the one he's looking for
same as the one in the zariman

[restive river]

No
He’s not physically in our orbiter either

We have a piece of him so he can manifest in our vision and head whenever he wants

He’s known to speak and move through pieces of himself aswell, including the replica fingers
But only the original will do

[turbid vigil]

so why doesnt it take control of us just like in prelude to war

[restive river]

I don’t think he can, we aren’t purely a piece of him

He just gave us visions in the preludes anyway

[pine orchid]

Oh yeah! I guess that one doesn't directly reference games/playing, but several of the other lines do

[turbid vigil]

it can due to it literally putting us on praghasa and other spaces

[pine orchid]

also found one of the lines implying we were the one who took Margulis' eyes, because a few ppl were asking about it recently

[restive river]

We weren’t literally in those spaces-

[turbid vigil]

oh

but how do we interact with it

[restive river]

It doesn’t even make sense for him to say that, he’s talking to Drifter lol

[pale cedar]

I think that's reffering to the Tenno as a whole rather than specifically you

[strange plinth]

we astral project multiple times throughout the main story huh

[restive river]

What
We don’t interact with anything

We just play hide and seek basically lol

[turbid vigil]

ballas sword

natah noticing us

[strange plinth]

we take the knowledge of the sword, not the sword itself

[restive river]

You missed what he said
We took the memory of it

[strange plinth]

or, memory, that works too
i forget exact lines

[turbid vigil]

oooh

[pine orchid]

and it was said here before that the leading theories is either us or Rell specifically
Rell implied from Chains of Harrow quest
Us implied from I assume this line and another line in the Second Dream

[restive river]

So for how they know we’re there
We don’t know exactly but we aren’t like. Actually there or we would have done literally anything

The Lotus has a connection to us and also Ballas just gaslights everyone
Also we may have had a manifestation of our selves, our body still on the orbiter but our mind elsewhere, astral projection essentially

[thick yacht]

Honestly

I wonder if we could throw this SOB into a black hole

[turbid vigil]

that is true

[maiden flame]

🤔

[restive river]

Goodluck throwing the entity with no true singular body or form into a black hole

[maiden flame]

I'm reading all these and gain a lot of new knowlage

[pine orchid]

He could just see Tenno and Drifter as effectively the same so idk man I'm just showing the lines

[pale cedar]

DE actually retconned a KIM chat

[turbid vigil]

atp an entire dimension

[strange plinth]

yup, nihil lost his executor status

[restive river]

What
He’s not the literal void lol

[strange plinth]

(Guide your reflection into the light) Neci Rusalka: "Only two of you. Pity about all the rest."
related

[restive river]

Wally is just a very powerful void entity, he’s not a god, he’s not the void incarnate
Why he’s like this? We don’t know, but he isn’t either of those as far as we have actually seen or been told

[thick yacht]

When?

[pine orchid]

that too, I didnt find it because I thought the line was "shame about all the others" 😂

[strange plinth]

so did i lol

[pale cedar]

A chat with Amir used to say Executor Nihil the Glassmaker

[fresh jacinth]

Why are the enemy warframes are so much bigger as ouer own warframes ?🤔

[pale cedar]

Now it just says Nihil the Glassmaker

[turbid vigil]

ye

[lean garden]

probably so we can hit them better

[fresh jacinth]

👀 ore more backery

[turbid vigil]

we already are practically blind during a fight

now try to hit an Warframe the size of your warframe

also it's way more menacing

[pine orchid]

the flood of bright sparkles when they land doesnt help

[pine orchid]

thats just soulframe- XD

[thick yacht]

Honestly they might have Nitokh return now then

Considering all the lore we’re getting on her

[dark compass]

Maybe we'll get some elaboration on her impact on this whole conflict, doubt they'll straight up make a new member of the seven a villain

[tall echo]

Dark souls principle, make enemy larger to make them easier to see

[main crane]

Somehow, I wanna see Nitokh doing nasty things since Roathe told us she's the worst Executor, not Ballas.

[brittle siren]

is this Roathe?

[hollow siren]

either him or the guy from the ARG

[strange plinth]

arg person more likely
no Truth, hmm
there's more to find there

[brittle siren]

wait so could this be Olemedi?

I hope we know more about them

[restive river]

Likely ||the tenno|| from the interactive

[hollow siren]

wonder if that kinda ties into "the direction you cannot see" that serious Liches mention

[brittle siren]

wait how did you get that...

[strange turtle]

Lotus put us to sleep sleep after the Night, and thats what we wake up from at the start of the game

[restive river]

Get all the schools

[dreamy sluice]

Since I like to write smaller fanfictions and I wanna write a short story about a normal grineer...

What do grineer eat? Do they have their own cooking book?

[opaque zenith]

https://www.warframe.com/pt-br/the-old-peace/history-of-tau in this Lore tibbit, there's a cheat-sheet somewhere but I don't have it rn

[strange turtle]

Literally like all of Isleweaver’s dialogue:

[opaque zenith]

Kuaka (and presumably other regional animals), rations, dead brothers soup