lore-discussion

[normal mountain]

That's the one part I didn't quite get myself, tbh

[dense herald]

maybe they mean they viewed the twins as defect=unique?

[strange plinth]

more that there were two of them, so they weren't unique
is my reading

[misty salmon]

They seem to have a weird juxtaposition of hedonistic seeking of the new and unusual, and often quite horrendous, but also emulating the trendsetters that do find it. I could see them developing a desire to find something so unique that nobody else can possibly copy it... and a twin is somebody who's been copied from birth, which is a bit of a social faux paux to start life with.

[dense herald]

hmmm anyway all I know he gotta die

and painfully with humiliation torturing him as he dies

[strange plinth]

well, we'll be waiting for your return if it does happen

[dense herald]

I took a ss when I thought he was dead the first time

[normal mountain]

I don't know about torture
But, well...
dangit, I can't spoil that, it's too good

[strange plinth]

yeah

[normal mountain]

Can't even hint about it, it's just too good

[dire pawn]

Hey guys new guy here. I would love to know more about warframe lore. Newbie so don't know anything except a little bit of story. Any recommendations on where can I learn more about lore.
Any website or youtube video. Anything is appreciated.
Thank you 😊

[strange plinth]

experience it through the game first
find clarification through here or Orokin Archives later
(also ignore duviri paradox until after new war)

[tacit pagoda]

pay the most of attention to all the dialogues and cinematics from main story/side/warframe quests! although they can be replayed i dont think you’ll wanna do that

and if you like reading, the warframe wiki has a very on point collection of information lore-wise from every aspect of the game

[proper barn]

Well Orokin isn't a race.

It's a class of people.

So they just go into new bodies and the twin Queens go into Grinner Bodies. But they where born as twins and the Orokin Saw Twins as like a bad omen or something.

@dire pawn how far are you into the story? If you haven't done natah or second dream do those.

[woven coyote]

Twins= look the same
Looks the same resembles clones
Clones=slaves
Thus
Twins = bad in the orokin society

This is explained in the kuria poem about the queens

https://wiki.warframe.com/w/Kuria

[vast willow]

On-Lyne is definitely not my favourite band

tbh they make better songs than (DATA EXPUNGED)

[dense herald]

the moment I saw the name I went to hating the song from loving it lol

[brittle siren]

did we know when exactly Margulis died? Before old peace or during it?

[vast willow]

It's a leitmotif of We All Lift Together

Because it's set in Fortuna

[vast willow]

Margulis died during the Old War, so after the Old Peace.

[brittle siren]

Old Peace is in the middle of the Old War right?

[vast willow]

Well the campaign hasn't been released yet

So idk ig

[brittle siren]

well we def know Old Peace is after the first Old War since the Tenno said "we used to have a war" in the demo

[vast willow]

GOD JESUS

Google, please stop feeding Gemini your steroids.

[north robin]

Hello, potentially stupid question that I missed answer to in the game… we have Entrati labs on Deimos, that is consumed by infestation. How did labs stay untouched by infestation and no one saw labs from the underside of Deimos, or is it inside the planet

[swift sentinel]

The labs are inside Deimos, and extend partially into the Void, or the Void is swallowing them.

[north robin]

So void is shielding them from infestation then? Like Wally proclaiming that it’s his turf so murmur kill any infestation around?

[swift sentinel]

Only the part the family were living in got infested, the Labs were sealed completely.

[north robin]

So infestation didn’t manage to get that deep into the planet itself?

[dense herald]

wait is this the orbiter?

[north robin]

Yeah

Looks more like a landing craft tbh

[swift sentinel]

Everything below the landing craft and in the cave is the Orbiter

[dense herald]

I killed 2 out of the 3 ||archons|| how far into the new war quest am I?

[opaque zenith]

End of second arc, kinda

[dense herald]

how many arcs are there?

[opaque zenith]

3, like a movie, begining ||Till the Ballas backstab||, middle ||Till you give lotus the second shard||, end ||the end, lol||.

[lean garden]

correct

[lean garden]

before the old peace

old peace clearly happens after tenno have been weaponised

she died before that happened

[lean garden]

Old Peace is during the Old War

it happens before Hunhow attacks Lua and Lua is punted into the Void

[vast willow]

How do you know this?

[lean garden]

pls hold fighting for super earth

[vast willow]

???

[swift sentinel]

Because at that point the Tenno were put into the Second Dream and wouldn't be able to transfer out of their Warframes like we saw in the demo.

so it has to be before that point.

[opaque zenith]

It's a theory. A very plausible one with solid ties to the know lore, cause waframes exist and tenno have control of their powers, but not yet confirmed till the actual quest release.

[lean garden]

oh its not a theory

Im back from fighting for super earth

[lean garden]

And I think all you need to know, really, is that there was an old war, and it was against the Sentients. We know approximately how it began, **and we know very much more clearly how it ended, with various, very large scale events, the Sentients destroying the Orokin system end of the solar rail, the whole business about the Sentient attack on Lua, Lua being put into the void… **[laughs] It ended in an Orokin victory, and at the celebration, the Tenno turned on them, and so on, and so on.
Adrian Bott, Warframe Lead Writer in an interview with cgmagonline

[opaque zenith]

People thinking "theory" is a downplay, instead of just a statement that the official thing (the actual quest) isn't released yet is an unfortunate trend of today.

It DOES make sense that is a quick peace treaty in the middle of the old war, just not confirmed cause is not officially here yet.

[lean garden]

what?

Me saying that the Old Peace happens before the end of the Old War isnt me theorising

its me repeating what the lead writer said

you cant just call a word of God from the devs a theory can you

[opaque zenith]

you said during

[lean garden]

uhuh

and?

like

Everybody, when they’re starting out, whether they know it or not, the first port of call is The Second Dream, which is that big revelation that everybody quite wonderfully keeps secret from their fellow players. You have to go through it yourself. It’s not something that you want to spoil. But I think even players who are very well-versed in the lore and have assembled everything up to now and have a really clear grasp of the timeline, I doubt any of them would have expected the idea of a temporary ceasefire and a peace in the middle of The Old War, which is what we’re looking at here.
-Adrian Bott, same interview

This isnt a theory its a direct statement

[opaque zenith]

Then send that first thing, but (only) now I see the proof, yes

[vast willow]

Lotus tried so seal the Operator's powers, but the Operator relearned them in the War Within.

It could be the Operator got rid of the Lotus' Void power inhibitors, or it was before that, because in Prelude to War, we could see Erra getting obliterated in the Old War by a Hadouken shot by like 6 Operators led by the Lotus

[pale cedar]

No she didn’t that was Margulis’ doing

Lotus just hid us on the moon

In the Void

[vast willow]

That was the War in Lua

Hunhow was trying to destroy it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DwrJw9trS5o

Watch

[pale cedar]

That’s why Lotus hid it in the Void

[vast willow]

There are Lotus cryopods in the background

This was like in the Old war, still

[pale cedar]

Lotus didn’t seal away our powers

Margulis did that

[vast willow]

Welp

They got the powers back

And they're at it again

Or it could just be one big lore inconsistency when DE realised The Old Peace was in the Old War

[lean garden]

eh?

[pale cedar]

DE know Old Peace was during the Old War

There’s no inconsistency

[vast willow]

It was during the Old War, yet it was also after the Operator got the powers back, but then Margulis was executed in the Old War, so then um uhhhhhhh

[tall echo]

Operator forgot.

Simple.

[vast willow]

So what we know is:

Old War pt. 1 ---> Old Peace ---> Old War pt. 2 ---> Second Dream ---> Operator gets powers

[pale cedar]

Margulis lied to us until we believed we didn’t

[vast willow]

What

[pale cedar]

It was a lie of omission

[tall echo]

Second dreams starts somewhere during the war

[vast willow]

How the- What?

[pale cedar]

After she was blinded she omitted details so we got nerfed

[dense herald]

what does the drifter or operator choice do in the new war?

is it just cosmetic or do I go to devuri paradox if I chose drifter?

[pale cedar]

It’s just who you use to do the final part

[dense herald]

so I don't get to keep the older look?

[pale cedar]

Both can be swapped between after

[opaque zenith]

Mostly dialogue changes, otherwise cosmetic

[dense herald]

do I get to keep the older look?

[pale cedar]

Yes

[dense herald]

ok

the older voice for the operator, it isn't moonkight voice actor from marvel rivals is it?

they sound so similar

[pale cedar]

It isn’t

[restive river]

The only powers we use here are the void beams, which we have right away after waking up from the second dream

What Margulis sealed was the powers we remember during the war within
Innate transference, void dash/sling, void mode, all that
The void beam is entirely innate regardless of our memory situation

[proper crow]

The ability to fire Kamehamehas from our hands is innate, yes

[hexed oxide]

It's not even that deadly at that point unless you're a sentient

The one in the new war's trailer on the other hand

[pale cedar]

Is a product of the old system

[dense herald]

does it matter who I pick for lotus?

[lean garden]

@warm otter Both Dante and Kullervo indicate that pre-tenno autonomous warframes were hunted down and destroyed, I fail to see how or why the orokin would continue to produce those kinds of warframes especially when they had tenno

[dense herald]

it is a choice of ||natah, lotus, and margulis||

[normal mountain]

The name is permanent
Otherwise, it just matters for your alignment

You can buy the other skins with plat later

[dense herald]

K I picked marg

[normal mountain]

...

[lean garden]

@warm otter

Orokin rise > primed era > Tau colonization by sentients > zariman accident > the old peace > the old war > post war primed era > naga drums > ??? > Modern day
wrong here

[dense herald]

wait I get Excalibur umbra for free?

I thought it was just for the new war

[lean garden]

yes!

[normal mountain]

You got him in The Sacrifice

[ashen pulsar]

You didn’t notice??

Also his sword

[manic rover]

Zariman was sent before the Sentients went to Tau no?

[warm otter]

That whole chunk is fuzzy. We don't have a precise when, but I believe Tau was colonized first, then the void accident happened and enough time passed for us to learn and master being a tenno.

[dense herald]

I thought it was a quest chain thing since he got beef with bitc ahem ballas so I thought he was along for the ride

[warm otter]

It's mentioned that we used to be at war during the demo, so it could be that the old peace is just a short interlude mid-war, but I don't believe that

[trim kettle]

tenno were what tipped the old war into orokin favour no?

[normal mountain]

That would make sense
Unfortunately, the Orokin decided not to make sense

[manic rover]

Old Peace takes place I would assume between Sentients proclaiming their independence in Tau and before the Old War

[lean garden]

its Orokin rise > Orokin Era > Orokin sends the Sentients to Tau > Orokin get impatient, tries to send the Zariman to reach before the Sentients > Zariman accident > Old War > Old Peace > Old War > Old War ends > Night of Naga Drums > Collapse

[warm otter]

No, the sentients were sent first because they were sent to terraform it, make it habitable

[normal mountain]

It's during the Old War
Smack in the middle

[manic rover]

Then why isn't it called the Old Ceasefire :(

[warm otter]

I think the zariman was sent a little bit after the sentients, give them a head start

[dense herald]

excalibur umbra is a prime type frame?

[lean garden]

Everybody, when they’re starting out, whether they know it or not, the first port of call is The Second Dream, which is that big revelation that everybody quite wonderfully keeps secret from their fellow players. You have to go through it yourself. It’s not something that you want to spoil. But I think even players who are very well-versed in the lore and have assembled everything up to now and have a really clear grasp of the timeline, I doubt any of them would have expected the idea of a temporary ceasefire and a peace in the middle of The Old War, which is what we’re looking at here.
Adrian Bott, Lead Writer

[warm otter]

He is a prime in everything but name.

[lean garden]

no, its just an equivalent but not a prime. Doesnt have prime passives

[lean garden]

Sentients were not sent to terraform for the zariman

[manic rover]

Ohhhhh, ok

[warm otter]

Yes he does, he benefits from death orbs and better stats over base

[manic rover]

Why do I just now learn about the Lead Writer names

[lean garden]

he actually doesnt have the orb passive

[manic rover]

Why did I thought Rebb wrote the lore

[bright temple]

https://tenor.com/view/cringe-ew-why-neveragain-gross-gif-4978760

[manic rover]

He used to

[normal mountain]

Used to benefit from orbs
That got removed
For some reason

[lean garden]

and then it was removed, because God forbid a boy has a prime passive

[warm otter]

She has a significant say, as well as an ideas person and probably sees and approval stamps new stuff

[normal mountain]

I know

[dense herald]

so......what do I do now?

and is the new war the biggest quest so far?

[manic rover]

I'm convinced the entire 1999 arc was her idea. She forced the writing team to make it canon

[manic rover]

Yeah

[pale cedar]

“He’s not a Prime”
Digital Extremes probably

[dense herald]

Oh WTF IS THIS

[normal mountain]

Go talk to Konzu and Eudico
Then either Veilbreaker or Angels of the Zariman

[manic rover]

The second longest is probably either the Sacrifice or the Second Dream

[manic rover]

Big Daddy Wall

[warm otter]

Hey kiddo.

[normal mountain]

Remember that freaky twin that jumpscares you?

[lean garden]

@trim kettle

temple & the 1999 protos are paradoxical, entrati got the temple strain SOMEHOW from the 1 and only, then brought it back to 1999 to create temple
Okay now for this: its actually not paradoxical at all. The protos do not influence their future frames. Even temple is not a bootstrap, because whatever albrecht gave flare doesnt actually immediately produce what we know today as temple. That was a result of Flare bleeding onto their guitar. Think of it as such:

Ballas designs pre-temple, albrecht takes the design and injects a strain of it into flare, flare becomes the pre-temple proto, flare has that one traumatic concert and bleeds onto lizzie, giving us the temple proto. Flare then goes into the future the long way and becomes temple

[manic rover]

I like to think Yareli didn't have an Operator. The Warframe herself was just playful like that

[lean garden]

and @warm otter

Operator into void, loop starts over, they make a different choice early on, loop changes entirely to become duviri instead of origin system, then they break the loop and emerge
Thats not how Duviri happens at all actually

like its the furthest from what happened

When the Zariman incident happened, you met wally, and you made a deal. From that deal split two yous, one that would become the Operator who was saved from the Zariman and the other the Drifter, the one who was never saved from the Zariman

[bright temple]

*their

[lean garden]

right yes

[warm otter]

The second you that split from there is the same you that got sent into the void. Your personal loop has been disrupted. The paradox was made because we went back and made the other choice.

[lean garden]

incorrect

horribly incorrect

[manic rover]

My personal theory is

Ballas R&D Team created a "ceremonial Warframe" design. You could think something along the lines of a Shawzin player which wasn't meant for battle.

Albrecht potentially aware of a certain Guitar frame appearing in the Night of the Naga Drums, takes the design(OR even the sample of the mysterious Warframe that appeared) and makes the Warframication Vial™ which was used on Flare.

It's a loos bootstrap paradox

[warm otter]

So then what happened to us when we got goid portal'd?

[lean garden]

Albrecht potentially aware of a certain Guitar frame appearing in the Night of the Naga Drums, takes the design(OR even the sample of the mysterious Warframe that appeared) and makes the Warframication Vial™ which was used on Flare.
Impossible to happen, albrecht was already gone to 1999

[lean garden]

the Operator was trapped in their own timeloop, reliving the experiences of the Zariman incident over and over again. All this while Drifter and Duviri existed

[manic rover]

Scrap that then. Albrecht just took the designs for the ceremonial Warframe.
The ceremonial Warframe's design was altered as it fused with Flare giving us Temple.

[pale cedar]

“The Tenno's personal timeline has been disrupted. Knowing he cannot kill the Tenno, Ballas has opted to imprison them within their own history. The Tenno will be unable to escape this loop without the paradoxical intervention of an outside force.”

[lean garden]

this I vibe with

[warm otter]

Paradoxical intervention of an outside force being Lotus' hand going to duviri and finding Drifter.

[lean garden]

more like Drifter intervening, as we see in TNW itself

[manic rover]

It's paradoxical because it's the same person.

[lean garden]

regardless, the actual split between Operator and the Drifter happens all the way back in the actual Zariman incident

[pale cedar]

Drifter and Operator meeting broke the loop

[warm otter]

I don't think it unreasonable to believe that Drifter was spawned when we got sent into the portal. If he can make different decisions each loop, maybe that first decision changed our loop that significantly?

If we get void portal'd again, maybe another Us would pop out.

[lean garden]

it is very unreasonable, because thats not what we are told

[pale cedar]

Drifter is an alternative timeline Operator nothing more nothing less

[trim kettle]

temple was on the asteroid that kaya tped him to and awoke when the naga drums sounded

there was only ever 1 temple bc he was too uncontrollable

[warm otter]

You believe Duviri and such already existed including Drifter, but duviri seemingly existed to Albrecht on his explorations (that were likely post zariman). Albrecht never mentions Drifter in the sanctum lore fragments.

[trim kettle]

when did albrecht get to duviri??

[warm otter]

Who are we to say when and where this timeline truly starts?

[pale cedar]

Albrecht went after it was already created

[lean garden]

multiple times actually, he's the reason why scholar's landing exists

[warm otter]

I don't know. One of the logs in sanctum anatomica talks about it. Duviri has a good chunk of history that seems to have already happened by the time we see it.

[lean garden]

did you not play the KIM chats at all or something?

[warm otter]

Albrecht is a known figure there

[manic rover]

That's how Flare was taken from 1999 to Year XXXXX, the Night of the Naga Drums yes.

The paradoxical question is that the name of the Warframe is Temple but that's Flare's stage name implying that the actual Temple that appeared in Naga Drums was Flare.

[manic rover]

Duviri always existed because of Eternalism.

[dense herald]

yeah, so the wall is the ruler/avatar of the void?

[trim kettle]

yeah, it has history because drifter has been looping it hundreds if not thousands of years after it started

[manic rover]

Albrecht visited Duviri way before the Zariman Incident

[pale cedar]

No it didn’t

[trim kettle]

it IS the void

[lean garden]

actually... we dont actually have any evidence of this lol

like whats stopping albrecht to have only gone to duviri after the zariman incident

[pale cedar]

Stupid Stallord presenting that as fact lol

[trim kettle]

albrecht singlehandedly making all of the lore

[manic rover]

before I said.

[whole charm]

Wait but wouldn’t the Zariman incident have to come first then Duviri or am I horribly mistaken?

[lean garden]

sorry, yes, before, statement still stands

[manic rover]

Albrecht singlehandedly being the "IT WAS EXPLAINED IN CFYOW" meme

[pale cedar]

Correct

[trim kettle]

zariman comes before duviri to create the branch timeline

[pale cedar]

Albrecht went after it was created

[lean garden]

Like Albrecht only visits after Duviri is established, so like you have to put in more work to have him go to duviri before the incident

[manic rover]

There is nothing preventing Albrecht from encountering Duviri before the Zariman Incident because funny Eternalism.

So it's entirely plausible that Duviri "existed" before the Zariman Incident

[pale cedar]

That’s not how Eternalism works

[trim kettle]

the past, present, and future all exist at once and decisions make new realities
thats eternalism

[manic rover]

Fine, not Eternalism per SE but Void completely ignores the laws of linear cause and effect so it's entirely plausible and in character with the concept of the void that Duviri "existed" before the Drifter did

[pale cedar]

You’re missing theoretically accessible

[manic rover]

Everything, Everytime, All at once.

[lean garden]

*are all equally as real. Its not so much "exists" all at once the way vadarya's lightning exists all at once

sorry, existed all at once, since the patch

[manic rover]

And the void is the space between what is equally real

[pale cedar]

Eternalism is stated to be theoretically accessible not always accessible

[oblique siren]

Went hunting for my favourite screenshot of my Operator for this:

This is what it feel;s like sometimes trying to understand Warmf Timelines /lighthearted

[whole charm]

Nah word, I’m just sitting here reading all this

[oblique siren]

But if I can survive Homestuck, I'm sure I'll begin to understand this. XD

[lean garden]

I mean critically here it being plausible doesnt mean that its what happened here. Like regardless in a causal chain the events of the Zariman incident have to occur for duviri to be created.

Even if you tout that its is by linear time that duviri could possibly have existed before the zariman incident, it then would become quite the moot point, because causally the Zariman incident must occur first

[pale cedar]

People really didn’t listen in class

[lean garden]

Im sure homestuck is harder

[manic rover]

I just had a brain fart.

Warframe Lore is making me lose electrolytes

[oblique siren]

It got very complicated ya. XD

[manic rover]

This is almost as demanding as trying to piece together NieR lore

[lean garden]

what are you a plant? craving electrolytes?

[lean garden]

oh nah nier is harder

[oblique siren]

It's kinda fun tho.

[lean garden]

I tried that, nier is defo harder

[trim kettle]

still not worldbuilding as good as fromsoftware 🥀

[oblique siren]

Wha
Humans need electrolytes XD

[lean garden]

Ah, I take you havent seen the hit documentary Idiocracy yet

[oblique siren]

Probably not, or I'm ADHDing real hard and have forgotten XD

[manic rover]

At least Warframe keeps all its lore in ONE type of media.

Not 17 stageplays, 3+3 games one of which got axed, 70 different side stories and some random collabs

[oblique siren]

Don't recognize, but LOL

Back on the timelines and such topic; it's like a puzzle putting it together. Even if I arrive to a wrong conclusion at first, it's fun getting there

[manic rover]

love me when Brawndo bought FDA

[whole charm]

So The Zariman incident is like THE core point in order for Duviri to exist and the two times lines to be created?

[lean garden]

yes

No Zariman incident, no deal. No deal, no operator and drifter split. No operator and drifter split, no duviri

[manic rover]

I mean.. technically the Wall of Lohk opening was the more crucial step towards that

No Wall of Lohk = No Wallace

[oblique siren]

So, do we know if Albretch was able to access Duviri? Not sure if that was confirmed in this talk, or just discussed

[manic rover]

No Wallace = No Deal

[manic rover]

He was literally wandering about there

Teshin met him

[oblique siren]

Thank. So, then, does Void Weirdness mean Albretch, who was Before the Zariman Incident, was able to access Duviri?

[manic rover]

That's what Im saying but.. it's more of uhh... not confirmed

plausible but not necassary

[lean garden]

not the necessary turn of events

like albrecht has a large runway to enter duviri

[silk atlas]

That's the whole deal with Isleweaver.

[lean garden]

like dude was around for a good chunk of the old war

[oblique siren]

Okay :D
I still need to do Isleweaver--

[manic rover]

although Teshin encountering Albrecht even though he fell to Duviri during the New War

[oblique siren]

Ive done the Opening Quests for all the way to 1999, but now I'm working my way through the standing

Almost done the Zariman, then moving onto Sanctum. So, as you can imagine, I am missing info

Hence my probably flawed logic

[whole charm]

Yeah I wanted Temple so bad I skipped the Jade Shadows and Zariman quest and went straight to 1999😭

[oblique siren]

Jade Shadows is so good thooouuugh

[whole charm]

I bet

[manic rover]

I hope the Stalker has a major supporting role later on

[whole charm]

Ok if someone can help me see if I’m correct or refresh my memory

[oblique siren]

I hope we can help the Stalker :C

[whole charm]

1999 has and is still looping

[oblique siren]

So that life hurts less for him

[whole charm]

In order to trap the man in the wall right?

[manic rover]

We lose all of our frames and stumble upon his little shack with the Stalker feeding Orion some baby formula

[oblique siren]

waaaaah

[lean garden]

correct

[lean garden]

sadly incorrect

wally is like, not in 1999 already

thats why we have isleweaver

or more accurately, operation: eight claw which resolved into isleweaver

[manic rover]

Albrecht wants a space where Wally has little influence. Because of the importance of 1999 and other shenanigans, Wally's influence in that year is kept at a minimum

[whole charm]

So 1999 is still in its own loop to keep the Man in the wall out then?

[lean garden]

meanwhile wally had control over a key actor within the scaldra, who are critical in 1999's hollvania LOL

[lean garden]

keep out? sadly also no

[whole charm]

Oh lord

[lean garden]

its looping because the timeline needs to be set straight

[oblique siren]

What if I wanna set it gay tho? /j

[manic rover]

In the present time he can summon a goddamn.. whatever the wall in TNW was
In 1999, we were able to subdue with an RPG.

[lean garden]

I mean... barring old man yaoi just rizz up the appropriate hex

[oblique siren]

Hell yeah.

[lean garden]

and well, the literal power of friendship too

[oblique siren]

I'm still not sure who I'll romance... Especially with Proto-Wisp on the way 😳

[lean garden]

its literally the power of friendship and this gun I found

[manic rover]

https://tenor.com/view/lechonk-kick-abbacchio-joins-the-kicking-abbachio-pokemon-gif-25872890

[oblique siren]

DE, intorducing more hot ladies: Please, I'm already gay!

[whole charm]

Got it

[manic rover]

Albrecht is bi(himself)

No one talks about Albrecht's ex, Mother's Mother.

[oblique siren]

I'm still holding out that his relationship with Mother's mother was more of a "Non-standard nuclear family thing", as someone who is persuing single parenthood myself XD

I think? All we know is Albretch says "her mother is no longer with us" right?

[manic rover]

wdym exactly?

[whole charm]

OHHH I confused the Man in the Wall with the Indifference

[manic rover]

https://tenor.com/view/how-do-we-tell-him-mr-krabs-spongebob-meme-spongebob-meme-gif-24063814

[whole charm]

Look I’m not that smart okay😭

[manic rover]

The Man in the Wall IS THE Indifference.

[oblique siren]

So, Albretch and Mother's mother could have had a non-romantic relationship. M's mother could have been a friend who offered to surrogate for Albretch when he wanted a child, or maybe she wanted a child and asked Albretch to provide, ahem, genetic material. Maybe the both wanted a child and agreed to co-parent, but weren't romantically invovled.

[whole charm]

Ok got it

[manic rover]

watch his ex be revealed to be a goddamn cephalon

Plankton type shii

Albrecht does feel like a fusion between Plankton and Rick Sanchez

[oblique siren]

There's a growing number of "singel parents by choice" families, and it would be SO COOL to see that in a game, especially one as popular as Warmf

Or even Queer Platonic Parents who raise a kid together cause they want to.

[manic rover]

I don't have an issue with that but Albrecht IS NOT a good representative of that.

[oblique siren]

Well, we don't know how his relationship is with Mother when she was a child, do we?

[manic rover]

Again, Rick Sanchez.

[whole charm]

Okay ima go run around and farm Entrati standing in order to get full Helminth

[oblique siren]

Like, once he's Old Man and doing Ends Justify the Means, ya, he's not fantastic, but do we know much of his youth?

[manic rover]

He was definitely Rick Sanchez in terms of fatherhood

[oblique siren]

Oh god. Rick Sanchez is the Rick from Rick and Morty isn't he

[manic rover]

Yes.

[oblique siren]

asdghjk G o d

[manic rover]

Loves his daughter dearly but not a good dad one bit.

you know what? Im sensing a pattern. Every loving parent in the game is dead.

[oblique siren]

-nod nod-

I guess he could also have been "Gay but got married and had a kid before realizing", or ya, just bi. No matter, it is VERY cool that one of the most important characters to the story of Warmf is queer c:

[oblique siren]

Oh god, we're a disney movie

[manic rover]

Except Stalker.

WHY IS STALKER THE OUTLIER

[oblique siren]

Because He Keeps Surviving when everything he loves dies

Surviving is his Suffering

[pale cedar]

Entrati family have children

[manic rover]

Too absorbed in his work to realize he likes men

[oblique siren]

Rael did specify "loving" parents. XD

Tho, again, we only see them in a low point of their lives, with their adult children. Who knows what they were like when the kids were kiddos

[oblique siren]

This is objectively the funniest answer

[pale cedar]

They are loving just a little disfuctional

[oblique siren]

Poor Loid. He really knows how to pick em

[oblique siren]

Mother did mutilate Father... XD I think that's more than a little disfunctional.

[normal mountain]

Or the kid is dead
or at least lobotomized by a eldrich being

[oblique siren]

:']

[pale cedar]

We changed them

Mother says as much

[manic rover]

The bri'ish twins being the only people in the game whose loving parents didn't die or were lost

[lean garden]

arent aoi's parents still around

[trim kettle]

aois parents are out of country(?)
quincys family is alive

[lean garden]

yea so the only ones who have loving parents who arent dead

are a good third of the hex

and technically half the roundtable are loving parents

[manic rover]

The 1999-ers are normal people. They don't count

[strange turtle]

Well. Were

[normal mountain]

Some were normal
Some were spies

[pale cedar]

There’s no such thing as “normal”

[feral cape]

The rest are gonna be loving parents when im done

[hexed oxide]

😦

[feral cape]

Don't boo me

[strange turtle]

You’re gonna make Kaya a mother at 19 and then abandon her to take care of the child in Hollvania or (whatever it’s called) relay while you go frolic in Tau?

Tsk Tsk

Shame on you

[feral cape]

Is the "roundtable" not the og hex

[strange turtle]

No

That’s The Hex

The Round Table is the Encore ones, like the bar they all hang around

The Round Table

[feral cape]

Theres been an error in communication and I retract all previous statements

I will make the hex all loving parents

[strange turtle]

I don’t blame you for not knowing tbh they don’t exactly try very hard to push the name for them as a group and it fits Arthur’s group more anyway

[humble sierra]

I think this was outright confirmed to be the case, though. The Old Peace is a ceasefire in the middle of the Old War.

[normal mountain]

Ye
Of Kaya

[feral cape]

No twin not of kaya

[static elbow]

I'm so sorry to barge in, but is a member of mod staff or the team ok with me sharing a simple google sheet here?

I had ideas.

@ me please, so I see the ping.

Thank you.

[static elbow]

It's about Codename: U

[lean garden]

what uriel?

why do you need a lore channel for this

[brittle siren]

what is this sheet about

[dense herald]

question are any of the quest after the new war scary/running from ememies type quest?

like with rell quest(hated the gameplay with a passion)

[swift sentinel]

I think Chain's remains unique like that

[dense herald]

?

so it's the only scary type quest?

[swift sentinel]

Yes

[static elbow]

A quick idea that popped in my mind for Uriel's abilities.

[lean garden]

might be a hot bit late for that

if they've already rendered uriel

they've likely also gotten a baseline for his kit

but also: why in this chanel

[static elbow]

Ah well, yeah ok, I just think making another fire elementary damage after Temple is a bit stale.

[strange plinth]

the first bit of angels of the zariman is a little similar, but not to the same level as chains

[static elbow]

I'm sorry for interupting, it was just constructive criticism.

[lean garden]

odd, I mean constructive criticism is fine and dandy but... what is there to critique on? we only have his name and look

like we're sooner to get mushroom frame than a look at uriel's kit

[brittle siren]

also not all demon is fire theme

[static elbow]

I had ideas how the seven deadly sins can theme around various elements, in a short and simple spreadsheet.

Specifically sub elements.

Used as a swap on his 1 tapped, imbuing direct element damage and procs from his hold 1, 2, 3 and 4. Passive would be a constant aura with the 7th element.

[humble sierra]

Kinda sounds like Lavos?

[static elbow]

But instead of mixing elements, it's a straight up sub-element power scheme. Meaning it's direct sub-element damage.

Not changing weapon element procs, unless passive.

Just a rough idea, btw.

Kinda like Chroma and Lavos inspired.

Cyte-09 too, a small bit.

I mean he's a demon, demons are the dark manifestations of sinners.

[humble sierra]

The wording is 'Devil', which could be potato potahto, tbf

[static elbow]

Imma just type it out instead, may take a small bit.

Wrath: Blast
Sloth: Gas
Gluttony: Viral
Greed: Void
Envy: Corrosive
Lust: Magnetic
Pride: Radiation

Void, cuz it may be related to Entrati.

I mean pretty obvious, considered he's the one who spoke his name, in the trailer.

[restive river]

I don’t really see void with greed

Also Envy should just be Toxin as that’s been kinda preestablished with Duviri
Ofc that’s the feeling of envy and not the “sin” but it’s the same thing

With Uriel apparently meaning "God is my flame", he’s def gonna have fire, radiation or blast
Or maybe even void

[brittle siren]

Another true dmg frame would be nice

[restive river]

Could also be that since he’s a devil instead of an angel that he will have the opposite of fire
Which a new cold frame would be cool

Fire so hot it freezes

[restive river]

That too

[brittle siren]

https://tenor.com/view/kyurem-pokemon-gif-25570607

remind me this guy

his white form shoot cold fire

[restive river]

Tbh taking the name Uriel at face value it would be really good for a jade light angel frame…

[brittle siren]

if that make any sense

[restive river]

Maybe, but having both heat and cold has somewhat been done with Gauss but this would likely do it differently

They have repeated themes and had similar abilities before so wouldn’t be too weird

[brittle siren]

maybe a "frostbite" effect that do DoT dmg and slow enemy down at the same time

I mean in extreme cold, it can be considered as frost-burn

[restive river]

Gauss’ ability is specially about thermal and I doubt Uriel would have that exact theming to

[restive river]

Oooo maybe!
Like that’s their passive

Heat/Cold procs also leave a Cold/Heat effect

So build for cold and you’ll still get heat’s effects while proccing cold and vice versa

[static elbow]

I like that a bit.

Instead of merging the element, they do both at once.

[restive river]

Uriel does have “fire” in his design so it’ll come up somewhat since it’s in the design and their name

I’m kinda hoping that’s what they do now but I’ll be down for anything
Like he could only deal slash for all we know lol

[static elbow]

Cold + Heat + Blast + Void?

[brittle siren]

when is the next devstream btw

[restive river]

I kinda doubt he will deal void damage unless it’s like
A very specific ability ig

Void damage is weird and we do have a voidframe with Xaku already (ofc they can do whatever they want)

[static elbow]

Cause it would've been an Entrati experiment. so it does make sense lore-wise.

[restive river]

Next month

[restive river]

We don’t know if he’s an entrati experiment,

Also
Qorvex

Literally made my Entrati but don’t have void damage

[static elbow]

Radiation only, right?

[restive river]

Heck Dante has a voidy book and he doesn’t even deal it

[restive river]

Yeah

[static elbow]

Even then, Just Heat, Cold and Blast dmg would kick ass.

[restive river]

I think they’re treating void damage similar to Tau damage in some ways

[static elbow]

But isn't Gauss like that too?

[restive river]

Oh 100%

Yes i mentioned that

[static elbow]

Myea-

Mhmm..

[restive river]

Gauss’ theming is through the lens of it being thermal-based

Where as fire so hot it’s cold and ice so cold it’s hot is different

[humble sierra]

September 25th, and it'll go over everything in the unannounced Fall update, including the Fun Guy Warframe and the Teacher quest

[restive river]

And stuff they talked about on the devshort

[brittle siren]

damn DE really taking their time (not a bad thing though)

[restive river]

Which if you haven’t go watch the most recent one

[brittle siren]

pls nerf or remove dmg attenuation

[humble sierra]

Yeah the latest devshort is probably one of their best in terms of info

[restive river]

I hope they get what rest they need to, they’ve been doing a lot

[static elbow]

Updated facial animations with The Old Peace, right?

[humble sierra]

One of the things they'll talk about at the Devstream

[restive river]

Yeah

[humble sierra]

To my knowledge it's less so facial animations and more so the Operator's actual appearance

[static elbow]

Please, fix Konzu's mouth, it looks weird af..

[brittle siren]

isn't they gonna have VIP meeting iirc?

[restive river]

Yupp

[restive river]

Yeah

[static elbow]

Or Ostrons all like that with the unhinged facial animations?

[restive river]

Rebb was jetlagged in the devshort

[brittle siren]

I think that intentional for their face to look deformed like that

[restive river]

That’s what eating plain animals and tower meat does to a person

[static elbow]

Explanation?

[humble sierra]

Yeah the Ostrons aren't meant to look as human as we do

[static elbow]

Like why, lore-wise?

[humble sierra]

They've experienced evolution

[restive river]

I don’t think there is an explanation?

[brittle siren]

don't forget the toxin from Grineer (and a dose of Infested spore too)

[misty salmon]

they're from Innsmouth?

[restive river]

They’re infested free thanks to us

[brittle siren]

I forgot there literally no trace of them on Earth (beside dark sector and the Techrot floating in space)

[lean garden]

geh?

hey man just because konzu has an ugly mug dont mean he aint just as human as me and you

[humble sierra]

Idk just stretching there, headcanon, should've specified

[restive river]

Real

[brittle siren]

wait I forgot the operation that the infested meteor crashing down

[restive river]

And the fate dream

[static elbow]

Oh definitely not, he's a great guy. Just his face is unhinged af.

[restive river]

Whatever that is

[brittle siren]

I think it just a dream make by Unum and Koumei just show it to us

[restive river]

That we can play-

[brittle siren]

though if that the case, Unum can literally make a domain expansion

[misty salmon]

I'd say they don't have good medical coverage... but they do have the Unum and access to corpus/solaris trade routes.

[humble sierra]

Same energy

[restive river]

We know the corpus can live past 150
I wonder how long ostron lives are

[lean garden]

hey man I unironically know people who look like this

[static elbow]

War framed, why? what it do?

[humble sierra]

I'm mostly talking about the camera angles and expression more than anything

[brittle siren]

I mean they eat the meat from the space-time bending tower, they could have live longer than normal human from 1999

Unum feat atm:
-create a dream that can be enter, much like pocket dimension (or pocket of possible future?)
-stop time
-mind control if anything consume her flesh/blood
-somehow use the void to make Rev Prime, and sent him to the past for lol
-predict future

[misty salmon]

-be an entire black hole of actual lore explaining any of it.

[brittle siren]

yeah idk how Unum has these kind of temporal power.

like if DE make her into a plot device that put Wally in a time loop I would buy that idea too

[humble sierra]

It would be neat if she's relevant to beating Wally but imo they really need to make her more relevant first

[strange plinth]

she 'saved' us once during the new war
might feel a little cheap to have her do so again against wally
assistance maybe, but not just her

[restive river]

The mirror princess story 😭

[proper barn]

She was in the new war.

[humble sierra]

Yeah but she hasn't been involved in anything since then

[proper barn]

What is the name of the like it's the "X gambit" where you leave mysteries and open threads so you can pick up on them later.

It has a name I just literally forget it.

[misty salmon]

Xanatos? the one where you set things up so that no matter what the outcome of an event you benefit in some way?

[proper barn]

No it's specifically for stories.

Like you leave plot hooks or mysterys around to pick on up later if you want.

I heard someone say the name of it when talking about fnaf

cuz i have described how DE has done this before and it's not them planning like YEARS ahead (though they do that) it's like setting up plot points they can follow up on if they want/when they want to.

[misty salmon]

leaving intentional loose threads that they can connect to later.... not finding a specific term for it though.

[proper barn]

it's called like the "cobblers gambit" or something like that.

I wanna say the like "Fishers gambit" it's some job title.

[bright temple]

did someone say... gambit??

https://tenor.com/view/drifter-destiny2-ding-tag-flick-gif-16330328

[misty salmon]

Between Marvel, chess, and it being a fun word for authors to put after something in a title, this is surprisingly hard to google.

[proper barn]

true.

[strange turtle]

https://tenor.com/view/drifter-gambit-oooh-ooh-destiny-gif-9454077962753595280

[royal shadow]

while playing void flood teshin always talks about “close the thing or their master will be freed” who is that master of void angels

[mystic lynx]

Wally?

[royal shadow]

Who’s that too

[mystic lynx]

TMITW, The Indifference, the thing possessing Neci Rusalka, "hey kiddo" guy
He goes by many alias these days

[royal shadow]

Ohh wally is a cute nickname

So wally is the one that controls void angels or making them

[proper barn]

yes.

indifference wally man in the wall.

The one Rell held down for 1000 years.

you know that thing.

[royal shadow]

menace

[tiny drift]

so, who and what is exactly margulis and narmer?

[lean garden]

Margulis was Ballas's lover

She's dead, long dead

[strange plinth]

narmer is the cult/group/organization/whatever first led by Ballas and Erra
they use the veils to control people, giving them a "warm lie" (to quote Little Duck) to be happy with
after the new war, Pazuul (an archon made from Erra's body) takes over with the (seeming) main goal to return to Tau

[strange plinth]

margulis was also the original adoptive mother of the tenno
tried to help heal us from the trauma of the zariman incident
ended up getting executed for being in the way of weaponizing the tenno
ballas reprogrammed natah to be more like margulis, which is how her personality sorta exists in the lotus

[restive river]

Most probably more, no?

Like
Since the Zariman returned at least?
Or since he had harrow

[proper barn]

yee

[vast willow]

Wait, hold on a second

So Stalker did the ooh-la la with Jade

But that was bad

So Ballas turned Jade into a Warframe

[strange plinth]

both of them were turned into frames for it

[vast willow]

Oh

Then why did Stalker not even recognise his wifey

And why is Stalker sentient

[strange plinth]

they were separate, stalker never saw her after the transformation
she recognized his medal

sentient frames continue being sentient through focusing on one thing, it seems
stalker's was his hatred for the tenno, primarily
jade's was her child
umbra's was his single, burning memory
etc

[vast willow]

Interesting

What happened to le baby

Or was Jade pregnant with them

[lean garden]

wait

have you not done jade shadows yet? I forgot

[vast willow]

Was ABOUT TO

UNTIL MY STUPID SISTER

DELETED MY WARFRAME ACCOUNT

[lean garden]

well do it and find ou-

[vast willow]

😠

[lean garden]

wuh?

how did that happen

[vast willow]

SHE DELETED MY ACCOUNT FOR FUN

[strange plinth]

jade was already pregnant when she was turned into a frame
i'll uh. let this next bit play out before i answer the next piece

[vast willow]

MY SISTER EXISTS ONLY TO TORMENT ME

[lean garden]

no like how did she manage it

[vast willow]

The Old "shove a person aside when they log in then pin them to the ground while you slowly go into settings and delete your account" thing

[lean garden]

there's... a delete acc setting?

[vast willow]

Well she found it

There has to be a way

[lean garden]

she could be lying to you

[vast willow]

She didn't say it

[strange plinth]

that's what i was thinking
i thought DE wouldn't delete an account unless it was banned

[vast willow]

I couldn't log in later

Maybe she locked it, idk

[lean garden]

no. she is lying

[vast willow]

It's just gone

[lean garden]

you need to contact customer support to delete an account

it's not something that can be done so fast

[vast willow]

Well it's gone

It ain't on Steam anymore

[proper barn]

Not possible?

[vast willow]

Warframe.com I can't log in

[proper barn]

Is your password changed?

[strange plinth]

what was your username

[vast willow]

Why

[strange plinth]

see if i can view the profile
i have the game open, may as well, yk

[lean garden]

you sure she didnt just hit uninstall on steam lol

[vast willow]

No

Reinstalled it account didn't work

[proper barn]

Is your password different?

[vast willow]

Anyway since I'm about to shove my sister down the stairs some point today, let's carry on.

[proper barn]

Don't do that.

Also contact DE support.

[vast willow]

I'm going to contact support later

[proper barn]

Anyway

Play the quest.

[strange plinth]

lmao ok
i get the feeling you don't care for the spoiler at this point, but i'll still be vague
she has the baby during the quest, but dies doing so

[vast willow]

I wonder how long is a gestation period for a Warframe baby to be born

[strange plinth]

ballas yapped about it to her
can find memory feathers after the quest that give some more detail on jade's perspective of it all
"There is plentiful strength within you - but only to keep you preserved as you are now. Your child, alas, will never grow. Even if you fed it with all the strength in your body! Perhaps if you lay lifeless for a year, the child would twitch a little. A century and its heart might begin to beat. A thousand years, and who knows? Perhaps you might feel a kick."

[spice wedge]

Oh that is when jade passed away and the baby appear, where stalker protected her from troopers and where sister of parvos the only one who understands the situation and story ordered to cease fire too.

Where they continued to shoot until that moment.

I wonder what happened to her after that.

[eager dragon]

Correction, she wasn't a sister of Parvos. Don't remember if she was merely some random captain or a candidate for sisterhood, but definitely not a Sister yet.

[steel compass]

Hope she got promoted.
The way she got desperate as soon as she heard the baby crying was powerful.

[lilac aspen]

Well Parvos won’t kill her
At least

If anything he probably would promote her since they discovered the Jade Light motes at that place.

[steel compass]

Parvos is a greedy bastard, but he is not a monster.

Nef anyo in the other hand...

[eager dragon]

I doubt Parvos would severely punish her, but losing the chance to analyse one of, if not the most unique being in the Origin System isn't something that would be rewarded, either.

More likely than not she probably retained her job but lost any opportunity for promotion.

[steel compass]

Jade motes was a thing tho.
She helped them with that

[eager dragon]

Yes, but they are also much less valuable than the baby

[steel compass]

Personally, screw her for basically making jade eximus units a thing.

But props for the cease fire

[eager dragon]

That's why I said she won't get severely punished

[steel compass]

Thats also true

[lilac aspen]

Jade Light army, if he had gathered enough motes to properly give them full on Jade stuff, is a pretty nice thing though (for him, not for us).

The small amount of Motes he gathered gave him Jade Eximus units. Can you imagine if he gathered a lot more of them?
Imagine fully realized Jade Light Units as batteries to allow Corpus ships to fire Jade Light.

[oblique siren]

Ney Anyo is the most Elon Musk coded mother-hecker. I want to dump a bucket of extra fine glitter over his head

[narrow pendant]

i just really appreciate how the cephalon in the old peace mustve been cherry picked by the orokin to be sent there, knowing he was racist

very orokin thing to do

[eager dragon]

I thought canonically he already had Jade Eximi - he just needed the motes to improve them. It's why you can find them even before Jade Shadows, if I'm remembering right.

[tall echo]

No

[burnt locust]

Jade Eximus were introduced in Jade Shadows

[eager dragon]

The update, yes

[tall echo]

Them being able to appear before is just ludonarrative dissonance

[burnt locust]

Jade Shadows happens, Parvos discovers her, and wants to turn her into a weapon, we collect her motes in Belly of the Beast and throw them into the sun, Parvos uses residual motes to make Eximus

[normal mountain]

especially if, like me, you're introduced to them during the quest

[sage comet]

[rose token]

in whom are the relics or parts of Atlas Prime?

[opaque zenith]

That's more of a #gameplay-discussion, but if you type atlas in the relics tab you can check it. Or go to the wiki ofc

[vast willow]

This bugs me a lot

Why did the bomb Kahl-175 was using to blow up the Condrix not work?

The cutscene just shows "Kahl start bomb, bomb not work, Erra appears"

[ashen pulsar]

Think erras disabled it somehow but I’m not sure

[vast willow]

Erra just about walked by

He didn't do anything

[blazing heath]

Dos any one have this bug?

[ashen pulsar]

#warframe-general or #gameplay-discussion

[ashen pulsar]

Maybe he did

Either the bomb was broken or something he did, manually or not, disabled it.

[silk atlas]

Wasn't he trying to blow up a murex, aka the anti tech thing?

Wait

Oh, a Condrix, nvm

[wanton mauve]

is technology from the Orokin Era considered to be better than the current technology?

[pale cedar]

Yes, nobody is able to mimic their level of building

[wanton mauve]

Aside from the Entrati, and I'm assumingly the finally completely-dead Ballass, are there any other Orokin still around, and possibly some that aren't straight up evil?

[pale cedar]

The Queens are Orokin

All Orokin have done something bad

[misty salmon]

Glassmaker was sort of still around until we bopped him, the Grineer queens are technically Orokin, there's some weirdness with Alad that implies... something, but we're not sure what... also might be dead.

[pale cedar]

Alad isn’t Orokin, Hunhow is just racist

[misty salmon]

Which betrayal does Alad constantly refer to?

[pale cedar]

Ours

We betrayed the Orokin

[wanton mauve]

Ah, didnt realize queens were orokin, thought they just wielded a Kuva Staff which was enough to make everyone think they were

[misty salmon]

So he's at least an imperial loyalist?

[pale cedar]

He’s not really an Imperial loyalist he just knows about the collapse

[glacial bough]

It's just an objective fact really

[wanton mauve]

Isn't the only reason the tenno complied with the orokin before the fall because they were keeping Marghulis captive? It's not really 'betrayal' if you're only aligned out of coersion

[glacial bough]

Margulis was long dead

[wanton mauve]

Oh, thought it was Old War -> Maghulis killed -> Tenno find out -> The Fall

[misty salmon]

we were still aligned out of coersion, but so was the entire empire.

[pale cedar]

We betrayed them by making a whole ass plan to kill them after winning the war for them

[wanton mauve]

I don't think betrayal is the right word for that

[misty salmon]

the fall may have been the first convenient time to actually enact something to wipe them out.

[wanton mauve]

"In other news, starved wolves turned on their abusive master"

[pale cedar]

By planning to kill them that’s already a betrayal

[wanton mauve]

hmm, well, I guess it just goes to show that betrayal has negative connotations but isn't actually inherently a negative

[pale cedar]

It was a positive as a whole the Orokin were terrible people

[lilac garnet]

how does teshin know of the duviri story book?

I know he's in duviri, but he mentions the book itself

[pale cedar]

Because he’s apart of it now

[lilac garnet]

elaborate? that doesn't really make sense to me, unless you're saying the book writes itself around what's happening in duviri or something?

[pale cedar]

That’s exactly what happened

[normal mountain]

I always thought of it as a bestseller
Sure, it was meant for the Zariman
Doesn't mean nobody else could read it

[lilac garnet]

makes sense actually, thanks

[misty salmon]

The stories aren't new or unique, Albrecht used them as children's stories that he told Euleria when she was young. She rewrote them with the morals of controlling ones emotions for void travel.

[tall echo]

Aight what's the topic?

[lilac garnet]

the tales of duviri book

[tall echo]

He's old enough to just know about it

[misty salmon]

It wouldn't be unreasonable for Teshin to have heard them somewhere else as well, and recognized the characters. A bit like how we all know most of the Brothers Grimm stuff, but still end up shocked by how many people end up dead in terrible ways in the originals.

[lilac garnet]

and also, what actually are rhe islands of duviri? are they the drifters mind? a place in the void? I'd like to think I'm pretty okay on the rest of the lore but duviri sends my head west

[silk atlas]

A place in the Void

[tall echo]

A place in the void created by drifter's mind

[lilac garnet]

right yea okay, that makes sense

[misty salmon]

A place in the void that was created (Conceptual Embodiment) by the drifter's mind.

[lilac garnet]

and the islands coming and going, such as scholars landing is explained how exactly?

[tall echo]

That's not part of the book

It's how thrax and the duvirians keep out wally

[lilac garnet]

so are all the things about people seeing their reflections whilst in the reliquary drive chamber and such physical things? not just their mind?

[tall echo]

Yes

[lilac garnet]

that's scarier now lmfao

[tall echo]

Mirror images specifically are usually wally

[misty salmon]

The rest of the void is trying to encroach and reclaim the islands. Some of them are better connected than others. Scholar's Landing in particular was not all that tightly connected, as it was added after the fact by the Scholar for his own use, and then he left.

[lilac garnet]

the scholar being Albrecht, correct?

[misty salmon]

it then came back in Isleweaver, and correct.

[tall echo]

[lilac garnet]

my reaction too ngl

[pale cedar]

Wally made a fake one

[violet storm]

With scholar’s landing came something else

[misty salmon]

also a possible interpretation, yeah... made a fake one, or brought back his corrupted one. It did bring Oraxia, who does not appear to be entirely void constructed.

[lilac garnet]

isn't it also where he keeps the original wally's finger?

[tall echo]

No

[pale cedar]

It is referred to as a false Duviri

[violet storm]

Wally’s finger is somewhere

[misty salmon]

Unlikely, the original finger is probably somewhere in Origin

[tall echo]

The secret to the location of it

[silk atlas]

The original finger(s) are locked away somewhere safe, according to Yonta

[lilac garnet]

likely somewhere in deimos then, I'm gonna guess

[pale cedar]

Probably not

[lilac garnet]

lua?

[violet storm]

It’s somewhere

[pale cedar]

If it was on Deimos Wally would have it by

Plus nothing even says Albrecht has the original

[lilac garnet]

additional question, if I'm correct in thinking that the heart of deimos Is what gives our warframes void energy to power themselves in the origin system, how do our frames get powered in 1999?

[misty salmon]

False does not have to be entirely new materials, and the void is better known for plagiarism than creativity.

[lilac garnet]

It'd make sense for him to, no? since he's the one who discovered wally and therefore, his finger

sorry if I'm being clueless lol, just fascinated by the games lore and played a lot of it when I was younger and rushed through the story, so some things I'm not too sure on

[pale cedar]

If he still had it Wally would have it by now

[silk atlas]

iirc the heart just connects to 1999, according to KIM convos

[normal mountain]

That explains a lot
It's never a good idea to rush the story
Especially not Warframe

[lilac garnet]

why does wally want his finger back so badly?

[lilac garnet]

tell that to 13 year old me who wants to do cool space ninja stuff

[silk atlas]

Can always retread the quests

[misty salmon]

If somebody up and chopped off my body part and stole it I'd probably want it back too.

[normal mountain]

Something about his finger being severed binding him to the Strands of Khra
And it seems the Wall Man doesn't like being bound like that

[lilac garnet]

I mean yea, but there's plenty of copies in our railjacks and stuff

[misty salmon]

But also it seems that the loss of the finger has put a big restriction on Wally's abilities somehow.

[lilac garnet]

what is a strand of khra

[pale cedar]

But that’s not the original

[normal mountain]

That's the question, isn't it Kiddo?

[lilac garnet]

heh...

[misty salmon]

Strand of Time.

[silk atlas]

Given the fact they can be cloned at all, a rare spark of Orokin genius led them to just seal away the original fingers since they can just use the clones.

[lilac garnet]

you'd think that an eldritch being would be able to track down his own finger

[misty salmon]

Perhaps having part of himself in linear time/realspace has locked him down to only being able to influence this particular section of things, he can't travel that far from his finger in X dimensional space.

[lilac garnet]

and what exactly is the murmur?

[misty salmon]

Murmur is another term for Wally, or his lawn ornament minions.

[lilac garnet]

lmfao great, whys he eating away at albrechts lab then? I thought it was because it was some sort of void infestation but turns out I'm wrong

[misty salmon]

It sortof is. Probably a combination of Albrecht being his best lead on the finger, his labs possibly having a weak point in the wall/membrane due to all the cross boundary experiments, and a dose of revenge.

[lilac garnet]

yea, would make sense

another question, what is a 'spiral' in duviri, I know it's a certain emotion but why is it called a spiral?

is it just "spiraling down" said emoiton?

[odd prairie]

yeah its a panic attack in physical form

the dax are the most extreme version of a defense mechanism

[lilac garnet]

thanks!

[civic shell]

Is there a in lore reason why "new frames" get a prime?

To be clear when I say new I mean frames that weren't found or "made" untill late into the time line like mesa prime or nidus prime, it's not a bad thing just wondering if they expain it

[proper barn]

Mesa and Nidus weren't made late into the time line?

Umbra is the like latest one we know of.

[civic shell]

Wait I thought mesa wasn't made untill Allen v was infected and made him crazy?

[proper barn]

Her and no?

Oh you meant alad v went crazy.

No. He puts a Infested control collar on a empty warframe that happened to be Mesa. @civic shell

[civic shell]

Ohhhh ok mb

[proper barn]

And nidus prime also wasn't new all his like lore says is Ballas puts him on a asteroid or something after making him.

[misty salmon]

If I was hunting for odd primes it would be frames that became what they are supposedly due to odd circumstance, particularly implied to be over time after the war.
Revenant mostly, Caliban got worked in, Temple is going to be funny but not too difficult.

Voruna's another that's going to be slightly odd.

[proper barn]

Yeah

She doesn't look like the Voruna we know until after she consumes the kuva

And melds with her kubros

[misty salmon]

Jade will be... something... and many of the possibilities are disturbing in all sorts of ways.

[proper barn]

We stole a second pregnant women

[misty salmon]

(or more than one other)... definitely one of the disturbing directions that could go.

[proper barn]

Or

They make a artificial pregnancy.

[rose estuary]

Or jade prime is just her child idk

[humble sierra]

Nah

[strange plinth]

difficult bit with that is that primes come from the relics
so it has to exist during the orokin era to end up in relics
afaik, at least

[misty salmon]

also a disturbing direction.

[harsh perch]

Lizzie has a line "Made of stolen fingers and infested toys" what does this mean?

[strange plinth]

stolen fingers refers to the man in the wall, whose finger(s) were cut off and used for.. a lot of things (railjack and zariman jump drive, as examples)
notably, not the tenno (lmao), but a separate event in which the player made a deal with the man in the wall. they (and the other zariman children) got their void powers out of it
infested toys refers to the warframes

[sturdy arrow]

I'm gonna be honest, I don't think Man In The Wall should be viewed as an antagonist... Like, sure, he eats concepts for breakfast and realities for lunch, but what else would I need to expect from an eldritch being?

[strange plinth]

i mean
he did make the parents of the zariman go mad
for.. seemingly little reason
and then gave the kids the ability to kill their parents

[glacial bough]

Yes on the kids, maybe on the adults

[lean garden]

I mean, lets get a few things clarified here:
what do you think is the purpose of the Antagonist

[sturdy arrow]

An antagonist is defined as an obstacle towards the protagonist, right,

Like, something for the protagonist to overcome. I got no beef toward Wally, it has no beef with me

[lean garden]

you... got no beef with wally?

[glacial bough]

Wally explicitly has beef with us

[lean garden]

really? after what its done to you?

no beef?

[strange plinth]

it does, though
we went against the deal in whispers, and now its mad at us
and we took hollvania from it, so it tried to take duviri

[lean garden]

something reached out and made your parents mad, mad enough that you had to one way or another kill your parents, and you have no beef with it?

[proper barn]

no maybe.

[strange plinth]

the velimir body in isleweaver has some fairly explicit 'i made the parents go mad'
"The adults turned on us. Did you do that?"
"The parents turned on you," "The rest of the adults were spared. At first."

[proper barn]

Wally says he made the parents go mad and kill their kids and the kids fight their parents

to just see what would happen.

[restive river]

He’s responsible for the death of our and all other tenno’s parents going crazy and ultimately dying
and Drifter being stuck in Duviri

[proper barn]

also @glacial bough We know the people to go mad first where the people with kids.

[sturdy arrow]

I guess Wally did invade Drifter’s kingdom…

[sturdy arrow]

Drifter got stuck because of Drifter, didn’t he???

[strange plinth]

Drifter wasn't rescued because of semantics in the deal
inclusive "all of them" vs exclusive "all of them"

[restive river]

Drifter got stuck cause Wally didn’t give them powers, they are the version of the Operator that wasn’t saved

[spice wedge]

So i noticed wally whispers in the walls, did we even notice wally hands seems like hands of lotus were being used by wally, just like drifter when it found hands near in duviri that he obtained powers.

[lean garden]

did we even notice wally hands seems like hands of lotus were being used by wally
Well we didnt notice because Wally didnt whip out no lotus hands in Whispers

[spice wedge]

Nah more like when he extended his hands to operator for some deal.

[proper barn]

that's new war.

or flashbacks during new war.

[spice wedge]

as albrecht told wally is afraid of love.

we need more stories.

[strange plinth]

is.. offering severed limbs just a thing that wally does?
he did it to rusalka too, apparently

[spice wedge]

Even he did to other people looks like,that got corrupted by a void.

😐 Ballas does he knows about wally.

[restive river]

I think i saw someone speculate he didn’t like direct touch?

[restive river]

No

[strange plinth]

ig that isn't out of the question
seems odd for a "dealmaker," though

[rich badge]

It's because the last time Wally used his own hand to reach out Albretch cut off a finger or two

[strange plinth]

oh wait
is it just 'trauma' from that lmfao

[rich badge]

So he's now extremely cautious about never using his own body to reach out

To my knowledge yes

[restive river]

Oh yeah true!

[pale cedar]

Hey, the door did the cutting not Albrecht

I do find it funny how the only thing that can defeat Void is Void

[dense herald]

wait are the deimos family orokin?

[strange plinth]

yeah

[dense herald]

hmmm I don't trust em now

the lore of orokin paints them as POS

and scum

wait why did ballas say he was the last of his kind? did he not know of them?

[strange plinth]

possible
they were able to stay out of narmer's attention by being quiet

[dense herald]

what is the narmer? the sentient ships?

[strange plinth]

you've done new war, yeah?

[strange plinth]

eh, heart of deimos gives some ground for trust
and further ranking up that syndicate gives more, imo

[lean garden]

I mean, unironically they're the better of the orokin

theyre still hella dsyfunctional

but their victims are themselves

[dense herald]

yeah

[strange plinth]

then yeah, it was the ballas + sentients alliance cult/group/whatever

[dense herald]

and fk ballas till it's backwards, he should've suffered before dying

[strange plinth]

lmao

[dense herald]

I wanted to drop a ship on him

[lean garden]

standard response

I full expect more ballas hate to come with the Old Peace

[dense herald]

he lucky lotus is our mother figure if I had the choice to kiss her infront of him as he was dying it would be sweat

[strange plinth]

god i hope so
i do not want to sympathize with that guy

[dense herald]

but I was surprised hunhow did what he did, does he go back to being a pain in the arse?

[dense herald]

why tf would someone sympathize with the bastard?

they got a villain kink?

[strange plinth]

you'd be surprised

[dense herald]

he should've been broken before, dying having anything he loved(one sided margulis love) being taking away from him

[pale cedar]

Ballas saying that makes sense when you consider

Albrecht went to 1999 which only Loid and the Cavia knows about inside a secret lab

Deimos got Infested so assuming the family were Infested not Orokin now makes sense

Nihil was unaccounted for because he was hiding

Queens were outcasts and constantly on the move so keeping track of them wasn’t worth it for him

[eager dragon]

I do hope, however, that he isn't that big of a villain in the Old Peace. I would love to see other Orokin being behind the Separatists, maybe even Tuvul (who's absence is surprising).

Having Ballas be a big (or, I suppose in this case, relatively big) bad again would be narratively dissatisfying.

Like, I love to hate him, but him being behind every problem does get old (yes, yes, I know he isn't literally behind every problem, with the likes of Nihil or aforementioned Tuvul ect, but I think you get my point).

I would love to see Ballas be for the peace treaty, for whatever twisted goals, and someone else on the council of Seven trying to undermine him via the Separatists.

[lean garden]

I mean fair enough, it could be tuvul it could be the remaining 2 of the 7

i just know an orokin is behind the seperatists

[eager dragon]

Yes, seeing more of the Seven in general would be great.

I just mentioned Tuvul 'cause he was the one pushing for Tau the most, from what I remember.

And yet we've seen zero reference of him.

[velvet cradle]

Probs last of his kind in position of power and still have his orokin pride, purity and more with lots of others not being pure orokin or ones being scared and in hiding which may be unbecoming of an orokin to ballas

[lean garden]

ballas at that point is pretty much the last of the Seven

barring the last two unaccounted for goobers

[velvet cradle]

Well, Albrecht is the other big orokin that caused many issues cos of ripple effects from his void research and his encounter with the indifference all contributing to later events

[dense herald]

ballsas sucks the more I learn about him

[dense herald]

No he deserves no pity points in good, I would rather him be a puppet to someone more evil and powerful than him being pited in any way

I wonder if the tau system will have a void of there own? or is the void in every system not just the origin?

it could be cool to have a tau version of warframe/tenno

and I wonder if we will have a new star chart? like a new frontier when we go to tau next year?

[lean garden]

tau version of tenno? unlikely

[pale cedar]

Tau version of the Tenno doesn’t make sense

Tenno are people who survived the Zariman incident

Tau system didn’t have a Zariman incident

[dense herald]

hmm well they could just have scary ai warriors?

or I wonder if when we go there we will find the sentients enslaved?

[pale cedar]

They do it’s called the Sentients

[strange plinth]

enslaved by.. what? other sentients?

[velvet cradle]

Void is everywhere

[dense herald]

or they become like the orokin of old and they have classism up the wazzu where the evolved human looking ones are the rulers and the generic none human looking sentients are drones and slaves

[analog glade]

bit of a stretch seeing as they started the war because they disliked the orokin.

[dense herald]

we made them ofc they can and could do them

[dense herald]

again if they even have 10% of human greed they can and will do that

with what I saw with hunhow and his family they have human emotions and greed is one powerful emotion

[pale cedar]

They started the war because they realised what the Orokin would’ve done

[dense herald]

yeah I remember that lore drop, they feared them wiping them out

[pale cedar]

It wasn’t fearing the wiping it out at the start it was them realising the Orokin would’ve brought ruin to Tau as they did in the Origin System

[dense herald]

I remember the dialouge and the wiping out was right there with it

[pale cedar]

That came after

The Sentients feared us wiping them out only once the frames started working

The Warframes weren’t winning at the start

"We are losing this war," you say. You whisper that my warframes are too genteel.

[analog glade]

I was generalizing, i know its a very nuanced topic.

[eager dragon]

I never said anything about pity..? I meant I want to see other Orokin for once.

[eager dragon]

Yes but Albrecht being the cause for the Separatists is highly unlikely, nor is he really a "villain".

If it does turn out to be Albrecht's doing, I will be a bit disappointed, not going to lie.

[strange plinth]

Albrecht's busy doing other things, not messing around with a "fake" resistance in Tau

[pale cedar]

Albrecht is busy doing what he does best, run

[eager dragon]

To be honest the only actual instance of him running away that I can think of is into 1999.

[pale cedar]

Albrecht being at fault for the Separatists doesn’t make sense because it is our memories and during that timeframe he was busy

Healing from injuries
Building a Time Machine
Throwing animals into the Void
Going to Duviri to be a teacher
Going to 1999 building frames going back then making Vessels
Then trapping himself in 1999

[eager dragon]

I agree, it's just something that seems to be thrown around regarding the Old Peace and I'm saying that, if DE does do that, it would be extremely lame.

[pale cedar]

When he first met Wally he ran

[eager dragon]

...what else was he supposed to do though. That's hardly something specifically Albrecht when it's a common human instinct.

[pale cedar]

In 1999 stuff he ran from Wally twice

[eager dragon]

Huh? I can only think when he ran into 1999.

[pale cedar]

Him leaving 1999 was running again

[eager dragon]

The end of the Hex is hardly running away, his plans in 1999 came to a conclusion, why would he stay.

[pale cedar]

Wally was in 1999

[eager dragon]

He's not a cephalon, he can't be in multiple places at once.

[pale cedar]

So him leaving is him running

[lilac garnet]

isn't albrecht at the end of 1999 (the one with a normal face) wally?

[pale cedar]

Which ending there’s 2

[lilac garnet]

why did hunhow decide to Bury himself deep in Uranus? regret for his actions?

[lilac garnet]

I believe the 'Good one' where he mentions tau being in sight

[pale cedar]

So he could leave the rest of his work to his children

[lilac garnet]

so he's just retired

[pale cedar]

Albrecht isn’t in the good ending just his voice

[eager dragon]

No, only in Whispers

[pale cedar]

The bad one is where he says Tau is in sight

[eager dragon]

Based on Natah I'm assuming it was a ruse for her to wipe the Orokin and Tenno.

[eager dragon]

I disagree however. The Drifter was there. The purpose for 1999 was complete. There was nothing for him left to do there.

[strange plinth]

no void eyes, no smile, he's not being possessed
everything he says lines up with what we know otherwise
and wally throws a whole fit about being kicked out of hollvania

[lilac garnet]

does he? when?

[pale cedar]

Isleweaver

That’s Wally getting revenge

[lilac garnet]

I'm not caught up on isleweaver lore at all

[strange plinth]

yeah
Wally (as Rusalka): "They ousted me from my city, so I found myself a kingdom to rule. Mother would be proud."

[lilac garnet]

ooh right okok

n where does oraxia fit into all this?

[eager dragon]

Brought by Albrecht when he was first there

And then Wally, using Albrecht's voice

Controlled her

[pale cedar]

Just a frame that protected the lab Wally used Albrechts face to trick her

[strange plinth]

according to wally, albrecht wanted her to help us

[candid elm]

So I was watching rhe old peace demo to get some ideas for a caliban fashion, and the captions called the giant robot a hun-somthing or other

So hun seems to be a surname given to war based sentient machines, but if that's the case why doesn't erra, natah, or pregasa have it?

[pale cedar]

Natah wasn’t designed for being a soldier she was made to be a mimic

[candid elm]

And erra?

[pale cedar]

He’s a metal shell and wasn’t given a purpose

Praghasa she’s a giant ship that’s the Mothership

Also a side note is Sentients weren’t actually meant to be war machines they were meant to go to Tau to prepare it for the Orokin

[lean garden]

hunhullus

but hun how is a full sentient

and the hunhullus is described as a sentient weapon

[distant lagoon]

The idea to win the war was to have Natah become the Lotus and manipulate the Tenno into betraying the Orokin. Hunhow would then fake his death in battle at Uranus and go dormant beneath the sea, and the smaller sentients would go dark as well. This would be a huge victory that would lure the Orokin leaders into the open to celebrate/gloat. Then Natah gets the Tenno to kill them in one swoop, then she either kills or neutralizes them and reawakens Hunhow. But she only completed step one with the night of Naga drums.

Since being awakened by Tyl Regor, Hunhow made a couple tries at a comeback tour, and failed pretty badly - then along with us, he lost Natah to Ballas and Erra. So now he's just resigned to staying buried until death or whatever else.

[candid elm]

i hope with the tau update we can resurect space grandpa now that he's a bit mroe chill

[pale cedar]

He’s not dead

[candid elm]

you know what i mean

[silk atlas]

And I don't think he wants to get out anyway

[candid elm]

fair enough

[pale cedar]

He’s fine with waiting to die

[candid elm]

i mostly just wanna see his eraction when he finds out we're going to tau, or get his take on whatever ends up happening with the old peace

[pale cedar]

He can’t get out

Getting a thing such as Hunhow out would be a complicated task

[rose estuary]

Unless he’s somehow able to get out on his own

[tall echo]

He is slowly dying though

[pale cedar]

As we all are

[candid elm]

na doubt it, again i mostly just wanna see his reaction to us going to tau

[rose estuary]

Same ngl

[tall echo]

You know what I meant >:(

[distant lagoon]

You want to see his what

[rose estuary]

Just attach a giant magnet to our orbiter and pull him out lol

[pale cedar]

Hunhow didn’t actually say he was dying he only said waiting to die

[candid elm]

i meant reaction

though i wouldn't mind seeing that either...

[rose estuary]

Ayo? 😳

[tall echo]

It's a machine

Hunhow is not organic

[candid elm]

you don't know!

this is rebecca we're talking about, i'm sure she has an idea of how sentients do it

[tall echo]

[narrow pendant]

maybe he can give us a proxy like how he gave stalkwer the war

[tall echo]

Change the topic back to something actually important, yes

[candid elm]

i do wonder who'll come with us to tau, how we get there is too open to speculation

[narrow pendant]

entratie contraption

i believe the ceiling at the end of the trailer somewhat acts as a map

oooor the zariman does it since yonta keeps saying how she now knows how they could do it successfully, however it might wont be the case since it has to keep plugging the void

[candid elm]

maybe, but there's also a supposed solar rail being built somewhere at pluto, we have narmer clawing at the chance to get back to tau so we could hitch a ride to whatever they're planning, there's a zarimen ofc, void BS, could probably supercharge whatever is left of pregasa, maybe hunhow sacrifices himself in some way to do it idfk, max strentgh volt + titania, aaaaannnndd...idk smth with kaya

plenty of way to get to tau

i wanna know who's coming with us!

[narrow pendant]

funny to think how lotus is younger than the tenno

[candid elm]

no?

[silk atlas]

I don't think anything says she was made before or after the Tenno

[lean garden]

Well, she does

[silk atlas]

Really? Weird

[candid elm]

i mean i assume she was made before and she was simply reprogrammed

[distant lagoon]

It's possible but yeah I don't think we have enough info

[lean garden]

"So the Golden Wrath came. And after, I was born. A mimic, a spy. Conceived to burrow into nests and swallow the pitch-eggs of their war machine: The Tenno. But when I saw your tender faces, I took mercy. Or so we were told."

[candid elm]

i stand corrected

[lean garden]

She was made to infiltrate us

[distant lagoon]

Nothing said in Ropalolyst should be taken at face value fyi

[lean garden]

okay now try to use anything else we know that would deem that bolded segment false

[silk atlas]

Well the facts of what she's saying aren't wrong.

[distant lagoon]

It's the most gaslit character in fiction telling us her most recent belief

[silk atlas]

Just that she's trying to spin them as the Tenno being some kind of corrupting influence

Her being made before or after wouldn't really change what she says about the bold part if her gaslighting would be around how the Tenno supposedly screwed with her brain