lore-discussion

[ashen pulsar]

Wally was created (probably) when albrecht entered the void

[stoic zealot]

is that big stone guy on sanctum antinomica albetrecht

[eager dragon]

The Great Indifference is another name for Wally

[ashen pulsar]

Wally is the indifference

[spice spade]

oh

[stoic zealot]

ahhh

[eager dragon]

Who is also refered to as The Man in the Wall, the Lidless Eye

[ashen pulsar]

Nah that’s a mech

[eager dragon]

And other titles

[stoic zealot]

why is there 2 indifferences ibn sanctum

[spice spade]

HAH

i thought it was loid and albrecht about to kiss

[stoic zealot]

like ones holding others face

[ashen pulsar]

Not indifferences

[spice spade]

What they

[eager dragon]

Those are Vessels

[spice spade]

For what

Loid and albrecht

[eager dragon]

Basically Warframes made with the Grain Strain

[stoic zealot]

whos the bad guuy with the cat in 1999

[ashen pulsar]

Also… how tf did you miss that during the quest

[eager dragon]

(A bit more complex than that but close enough)

[ashen pulsar]

… albrecht

Dude.

[eager dragon]

Albrecht is the dude with the Kavat

[spice spade]

Why does he have a cat

[stoic zealot]

but albrecht is the blue orokin guy

[spice spade]

just for fun

[ashen pulsar]

Cuz kalymos is awesome

[stoic zealot]

from years ago

[ashen pulsar]

Or were you talking about loid

[stoic zealot]

noo the bad guy with at

cat

[ashen pulsar]

Not u, cookie

[eager dragon]

Because Kalymos is my Pal-ymos

[stoic zealot]

WHY DOES ALBTRECHT BLUE

AND WHY IS HE HUMAN IN 1999

[spice spade]

AHAHAHA

No the cute cat

[stoic zealot]

albtrechrt protoframe?

[ashen pulsar]

“Man-cat”

[eager dragon]

Because it would blend in better

[stoic zealot]

ohh the cat is albtrecht

[ashen pulsar]

No

[spice spade]

AHAHAHAH

[eager dragon]

What

[stoic zealot]

who thennnn

[ashen pulsar]

THE HUMAN

[spice spade]

The cat is loid symbolically🤍

my head cannon

[stoic zealot]

but i thought albtrecht was a blue orokin guy

[spice spade]

not anymore

[ashen pulsar]

orokin was a group of people. Not a species.

[stoic zealot]

how did he chanfge

[spice spade]

he was scared

[eager dragon]

How can you change the appearance of the Operator

Same tech

[stoic zealot]

ohh

[spice spade]

Boom

[stoic zealot]

so how did loid die

[spice spade]

HE DIDNT

[eager dragon]

He... didn't?

Unless you mean in Isleweaver

[spice spade]

He’s just at home waiting for his man

[stoic zealot]

so who got buried

[spice spade]

a rando

[ashen pulsar]

Orokin are blue and have long arms ‘because it’s cool’

[spice spade]

idk actually

[spice spade]

can u tell me why orokin hate ostron

[stoic zealot]

i swear albrtecht buried loyd

in a coffin

[spice spade]

I WOULD CRY is that real

[lilac aspen]

Loid put himself in Stasis

[spice spade]

When where how and why

[stoic zealot]

hear me out the grinneer queen ;]

the worm one

[lilac aspen]

Albrecht put himself in what was essentially a Time Machine and had Loid destroy it right after

[spice spade]

Omg….

[stoic zealot]

so they were freinds

[ashen pulsar]

The coffin he leaves right at the beginning of whispers?

[spice spade]

So he was like i’m sad so i’m gonna bury myself

[spice spade]

they are lovers

[stoic zealot]

gay?

[spice spade]

yes

[ashen pulsar]

Yes

[stoic zealot]

dammmmm

[ashen pulsar]

I don’t think orokin care, considering they can switch sexes at any moment

[stoic zealot]

so albrecht is bad guy or good

[spice spade]

bad to us good to loid!

i think

[ashen pulsar]

Like someone said earlier, good intentions, bad methods

[spice spade]

Yus

[stoic zealot]

brings us pain, brings loid pleasure

[spice spade]

LMAOOO exactly

[stoic zealot]

HAAHH

[spice spade]

They’re so cute imo

[stoic zealot]

what is the murmur

[ashen pulsar]

Part of Wally

[stoic zealot]

when do we learn more about wally

[ashen pulsar]

Also his army

[ashen pulsar]

Like… Every quest

[spice spade]

did he make an army to get his finger back

[stoic zealot]

like who it actually is mabye in the old peace

or the 2-26 upd

2026

[spice spade]

Wally is no one i thought

i thought he’s just the epitome of fear as a monster

[stoic zealot]

hes just a loney rock man

stuck in a wall

untill de LETS HIM OUT

[digital grail]

He is the wall

[stoic zealot]

TURNS HIM INTO A BOSS

[spice spade]

can u tell me why the orokin hate ostron

[stoic zealot]

SHOOT THE WALL

bcs they are small

[ashen pulsar]

Technically, he is a boss

[spice spade]

it’s going to keep me up at night

if y’all don’t help me

[digital grail]

Superiority complex and hierarchy

[ashen pulsar]

Rell thingy was him

[stoic zealot]

theyre too smaall

[ashen pulsar]

And rell

[spice spade]

So they aren’t like racist

[stoic zealot]

thasts why

no they hate small peaple

[lilac aspen]

They are that too

[spice spade]

Omg-

[ashen pulsar]

They’re very racist

[digital grail]

They are every cist

[spice spade]

Oh that’s chaotic

[stoic zealot]

whats like the biggest entity in warframe

[ashen pulsar]

Except for cis

[lilac aspen]

They simply hate and see themselves above anything not Orokin

They even see themselves above each other

[spice spade]

LOL

[digital grail]

Yeah

[spice spade]

Oh ok

[stoic zealot]

whats the biggesst entity in warframe

[spice spade]

i read the naberus lore and they’re Messed the hell up

[digital grail]

And they probably aren't sexist ballas might be

[stoic zealot]

guyyyss>??

[lilac aspen]

True
I think an Orokin would respect your choices in gender, and romantic relationships

[stoic zealot]

answer my qqq

[spice spade]

Valkyr heirloom

[stoic zealot]

noooo

[spice spade]

HDLP

[stoic zealot]

be truthful

[spice spade]

probs the man in the wall

he’s mega

[ashen pulsar]

I mean

[stoic zealot]

what about jordas golem

[ashen pulsar]

I guess

[spice spade]

i haven’t seen him Hold up

[pale cedar]

https://tenor.com/view/the-man-in-wall-warframe-gif-24269482

[ashen pulsar]

Wally doesn’t really have a definite size

[lilac aspen]

Wally is by far the largest

[ashen pulsar]

But he could prob go insanely large

[pale cedar]

He still showed up the largest

[stoic zealot]

or the old eidelon

like the extinct eidelon

[spice spade]

They small

[stoic zealot]

probably the biggest

[ashen pulsar]

Or just… Wally expanding to fill the entire void if he feels like it

He’s kinda a god

[stoic zealot]

no more argon crystals nooo

[stiff beacon]

more like a 4th dimensional being wanting to run the fade

with an aiden pierce cosplayer

[ashen pulsar]

I mean, a fourth dimensional being would basically be a god to us

Fourth dimensional being could look inside a house and see every little bit of everything inside it, down to your organs

[misty salmon]

Wally could be bigger (and may be depending on how much of the view from Albrect's labs could be considered "Wally"), but Praghasa is probably the biggest single entity in that particular scene.

Deimos would be the other strong contender for being an absurdly large living thing.

[rose estuary]

If the infestation can infest an entire moon to make it living could they do the same to a planet?

[normal mountain]

Oh yes
That's what happened to Eris

[rose estuary]

Oh-

[normal mountain]

not that we ever get to go to Eris planet surface

[rose estuary]

Why haven’t we ever traveled to its surface?

[woven coyote]

One can dream

[rose estuary]

And will we ever be able to?

[bright temple]

We just haven’t

No reason other than the devs haven’t done it

[woven coyote]

Yup

[bright temple]

We may one day, but again up to the devs

[rose estuary]

I’d much prefer an eris surface tile set compared to the current one

The current one is pain to navigate in my opinion

[normal mountain]

I'd be careful what you wish for
Given what we know about Eris, that might end up being a bunch of flesh tunnels a la Cambion Drift caves

And those ain't much better to navigate

[rose estuary]

Fair

[normal mountain]

That being said, I'd love to actually set foot on Eris one day

[rose estuary]

I’m scared to ask what the infestation would do to a gas giant like Jupiter…

[misty salmon]

get bloated

[rose estuary]

I’m just imagining a giant pulsating bilesack or something floating in space lol

[strange turtle]

She’s a nonce btw

[normal mountain]

Or maybe 🪼

[ashen pulsar]

im imagining a ship of infestation

[raw stone]

There is no actually tangible mass on Jupiter worth building on. That's why the "land" nodes are those Sky Labs.

That being said, yeah I'd like to see the infestation on that tileset.

[stiff beacon]

yeah an infested gas city would be lit

[misty salmon]

I'm already looking forward to navigating that /s

[tall echo]

Yeah eris surface would be mostly barren, the infested are mainly below it

[high bay]

Y’know, given incarnons are made via conceptual embodiment, I wonder how many little void horrors were made by Zariman children playing Dax to cope with the loss

[half vortex]

Kids have some seriously twisted little imaginations when playing pretend too, so some of the orphaned kids with our operator, coping with loss during the jump, all of us could have manifested some really messed up stuff.

[oblique siren]

Part of what makes the tenno so dangerous, honestly

[tall echo]

Keep in mind that CE usually needs extreme emotions to even happen

[high bay]

I mean, I’d argue that the Zariman disaster generated some pretty extreme emotions, no?

[tall echo]

For most, yes

[half vortex]

Heh, now I'm wondering if incarnon weapons are the result of Tenno in the void getting super frustrated at how weak their weapons are handling while in missions.

Just inspired Cavalero to do his thing.

[steel compass]

So is Albrecht in a open relationship?

Like he has a daughter, and loid is his lover.

Didn't think of that until now

[woven coyote]

euleria's mother apparently wasn't even in the picture apparently

[stiff beacon]

or she died

we don't exactly know which

pretty sure she's dead though

[woven coyote]

i mean by now yeah lol

but the only comment we have of her is how euleria has her eyes

[normal mountain]

I distinctly recall Albrecht saying she had left him when Eularia was little

What he meant by "left" is another matter

[misty salmon]

The Dagath lore (via Grandmother) gets a bit more into what sorts of relationships the Orokin considered acceptable. Makes it likely that Loid wasn't acknowledged in any way publicly as a lover, for his own safety.

[oblique siren]

I was hoping so hard that Albretch had a child with a surrogate, cause its nice to see different kinds of parenthood represented

[west cliff]

how do i get the Isleweaver Kim chats, i got all the fragments, ive found all 3 dead bodies of Loid, Minerva, and Velomir, SO WHY DONT I HAVE THE CHATS!!!

and this is POST HOTFIX

[humble sierra]

Isleweaver itself only has one KIM chat, and it needs you to have the Best Friends ending with Veliminerva and also the email sent after finding all 15 fragments (bodies don't matter)

[west cliff]

so i have to redo the Roundtable again...

darn

wait wait wait

so if i got the bad end for Min and Vel, and then got all fragements, does that lock me out of that chat when i reset?!

[humble sierra]

Nope, that shouldn't be an issue

[west cliff]

OH THANK GOd

[humble sierra]

Upon resetting, then getting their good ending, you should be fine

and you won't have to get any of the fragments again or anything

[west cliff]

ok good, cause out of all 3 round table chats, Kaya is the only one that i got the Good end for

Flare, i got the eh...end where Lizz screamed at me

[humble sierra]

Worth resetting then, you're missing out on Lizzie!

And luckily the year loops next week

[west cliff]

so how do i avoid geting this?

[humble sierra]

Learn from your mistakes. Ask yourself why Lizzie exists, what she provides Flare with.

And look up the answers on Kimulacrum

[strange plinth]

min/vel and flare chats kinda have the same goal
get them to work together
stay neutral with min/vel, aim for peace with flare n lizzie

[normal mountain]

And remember
Lizzie is a guitar for a reason

[eager dragon]

Also I recommend reading the descriptions/bio/whatever it's called once you finish a chat. It can be useful.

[eager dragon]

I wonder if Orokin could have built a Dyson Swarm

[hearty heron]

Resetting?

[proper barn]

Do you mean Sphere? In some lore it's implied that the Orokin had many such like Evil Super Weapons but the sentients hack them all. Like we see in the new war.

They just can hack most robotics.

[eager dragon]

A Swarm is a more efficient form of a Dyson Sphere, yes.

[strange plinth]

dyson spheres are incredibly impractical, swarm is more realistic
depends on if they needed that energy before they could utilize the void for it, i'd guess

[proper barn]

Okay what would the swarm be made of?

Robots? If so hacked by the sentients.

[eager dragon]

Effectively giant solar panels. The hardest part is transferring that energy.

[proper barn]

The point is

The Orokin had many mad scientist style

Dooms day weapons just they all get hijacked by the sentients.

[eager dragon]

To be honest a Dyson Sphere is hardly a doomsday weapon.

It's just a question of whether they need that energy, probably

Like Grey said, if the Void gives enough energy that the Dyson Swarm becomes redundant, they probably didn't bother

I just find it weird that something like that isn't ever mentioned

Closest we have is Praghasa, I guess

[hearty heron]

Whats the KIM Chat reset about? I'm in my first year of 1999 - Does everyone reset and start again?

[eager dragon]

Only if you decide to reset it

[strange plinth]

it resets all of the convos with the hex (though not your overall hex syndicate rank)

[hearty heron]

Ahhh. So if you boo booed a conversation you can reset. Is it everyone or can you target it?

[strange turtle]

You can choose Round Table and Hex seperately

[strange plinth]

yeah, one split between the two waves of protos, but can't hit individuals

[strange turtle]

You also have the chance to get extra convos

[strange turtle]

By going to settings and turning on the All Convos option

[hearty heron]

Oh I noticed that option very early on.

Honestly though, the KIM conversations arean awesome addition. I find myself wanting to get to the next day to chat. ^.^

Sneaky way for the player to slip in some of their own characters lore as well.

I wonder if Tau will have similar things for the Operator.

[humble sierra]

Presumably everything the Drifter talks about before the Zariman is also what the Operator's life was like

[proper barn]

Well tau

Is after the Zariman.

At least when the operator was in tau.

[rich stump]

That would be awesome

[raw stone]

Can't believe the Orokin covered up the Peace Treaty.

Idk. I guess The Old Peace'll be one of those events they just didn't cover since the Operator sorta lost their memories? So.... really all that remains is my question that... why are we going to Tau specifically...

[pale cedar]

I can they covered up the records of pretty much everything else

[humble sierra]

The narrative team discussed this. The Drifter has a reason for going to Tau— Albrecht seems to be going there, and Drifter sort of wants him to answer for his crimes. But the Operator doesn't have a personal reason yet. They'll have one in the Old Peace when they remember Adis and all that happened on Tau.

[ashen pulsar]

orokin being losers isnt really a new development tho lol

[raw stone]

Okay I won't ask further cause I feel like we'll hit a dead end but to me... it just seems like Old Peace seemed like we were going to Tau. But lmao if it all turns out to be a Dorothy situation.

[humble sierra]

Old Peace is our memory

We've been to Tau, but Margulis and Lotus suppressed those memories

[eager dragon]

The Old Peace is a memory, we are only going to Tau in 2026, probably December of that year.

[raw stone]

Lmao.

So from a gameplay perspective, it'll serve as like a Zariman intermission like New War?

[humble sierra]

No, it'll be a full length quest.

And presumably it'll open multiple nodes too

And the lore will just be us remembering the missions we went on

[raw stone]

So another island like 1999

[eager dragon]

Closer to Whispers probably

[raw stone]

Hmn mhmn. Wonder what they're gonna say to justify using our own frames from current day. Probably some stuff like changing your memory or something

[eager dragon]

We probably won't

I think it's either going to be an expansion to the Sanctum

Or something Narmer-related

('Cause the Murex was the Tennocon Relay, so hopefully we get to see more use of such an underused tileset)

[humble sierra]

The lore will probably be that we had them in Tau back then

Or yeah, our memories are blending with our current reality

[tall echo]

Probably just. Won't let us

[humble sierra]

We won't have them in the quest but probably afterwards

[raw stone]

Oooough I HOPE IT'S THOSE STAIRCASES BENEATH THE SANCTUM.
I was trying to discern the locale from the cutscenes in tennocon but like. I was so transfixed on eyeless margulis.

[pale cedar]

Considering it is memories we probably didn’t have the arsenal of frames we do now

[humble sierra]

It's definitely in the Sanctum, and yeah, that staircase is the leading theory

[raw stone]

Yeah like. I'm past needing a justification on my frames in 1999. Idfc by this point. Whatever they justify for Tau, I won't care after a while.

If it is memories, and each time we simply lay in that lotus basin... hmn. I'm going with the memory melting pot thing. Cause before... actually. We've never acted in the Old War from a gameplay perspective. Closest I can recall is Erra's Intermission. But that was just a cutscene.

[humble sierra]

It is memories, that was confirmed.

We're accessing it like the Animus in Assassin's Creed. We plug into Lotus and she undoes the Dream.

[raw stone]

Gotcha gotcha. Confirmed from the tennocon?

[humble sierra]

Confirmed from TennoCon, confirmed in interviews afterwards

[raw stone]

OH. Gotchaaaaa cue the olivia wilde nod.

I missed most of the tennocon stream sadly. I was at a show that evening. .. in-person interviews?

[pale cedar]

You can always watch the Tennocon stream it is on YouTube

[silk atlas]

<@&778745217037238293>

[steel compass]

do y'all think harrow might have been made by entrati?

harrow prime has a lot of entrati designs, so maybe the base too was made by him?

just rambling, don't mind me if i'm wrong

[pale cedar]

Nothing actually suggests he was

[shadow coral]

Forgive me if this is a silly question, but why did Albrecht believe that killing Wally's "host" Rusalka would do anything to prevent his influence?

[steel compass]

I think he was testing the Drifter rather than asking him to do something meaningful to wally.

Could be wrong tho

[glacial bough]

Rusalka was his anchor for 1999

Without her, he's got no way in

[shadow coral]

Gotcha. So basically, since the void was inaccessible until the distant future, that one anchor person is the only way for him/it to manifest.

But in that case, how did Wally attach himself to her in the first place?

The reason Albrecht went to 1999 was because it was "the one place he could not follow".
But then, it followed.

Does Albrecht have like, a permanent aura of void-muckery wherever he goes, since he was so wildly exposed?

[north jolt]

I think in a sense he might. Or him bringing void powered technology back with him allows Wally to follow him somehow

[glacial bough]

It's not about there being no Void, it's about Wally not being capable because he's missing his finger

[lilac aspen]

She mentions it in Isleweaver I believe

[shadow coral]

Enlighten me.
Shamefully, I haven't done Isleweaver yet

[lilac aspen]

She was huffing Evaron or however you spell it to burn the techrot that had gotten into her lungs and Wally contacted her during that I think?

I forgot the exact statement
She was talking about trying to stop techrot from killing her internally and then mentioned Wally and their promises and whatnot

[shadow coral]

I see. So not at full power because he isn't whole. Makes sense.

[shadow coral]

I could buy that also.

So then, being that Wally is "released" in Chains of Harrow, does he then just have some form of influence across all of time, and simply didn't consider 1999 until Albrecht went there?

[pale cedar]

He had no reason to go to 1999 till Albrecht went

Plus he can’t easily get to 1999

[quick bough]

So...can someone summarize what chromas lore is? Am confused.

[digital echo]

its an unfinished/rushed plotline that probably wont ever get a satisfying conclusion, ngl i dont blame you since it confused the shit out of me at first too

[limber oracle]

Are there any decent lore videos or maybe podcasts? Like the entire thing in depth, or is it basically a hit and miss and depending on the creators’ niche interest?

[shadow coral]

The last time I watched one was before 1999, and it was the "best" comprehensive lore video at the time - and the creator still missed the mark on a few things.

"revantx" uploaded one on youtube about a month ago titled "The Complete Mainstory of Warframe" that seems to be popular. Just glancing at the comments, nobody is mentioning any glaring mistakes.

It's two hours long, I'll probably give it a watch soon.

[limber oracle]

I will have to check it out

Thank you @shadow coral

[restive river]

Tbh I’d recommend that if you check out a lore video come back here if you have any questions or need further explanation

[pale cedar]

GMK/Bagus's Channel

Main Quest breakdown (pre-1999)

[dense herald]

in terms of lore, the order doesn't matter because they both stories happen in different "strands of khra" within eternalism, so it's kinda parallel

someone said the devuri paradox is a alternative/parallel timeline is that true?

[normal mountain]

More or less
Drifter is from a timeline where he didn't get saved with the other Tenno (and also didn't get Void powers)
He then accidentally created Duviri because the Void does funky stuff like that, and then Duviri Paradox covers the rest

[swift sentinel]

The entire Duviri Paradox quest happens in the span of time from when Ballas cuts off the Lotus' hand and throws the Operator into the Void and when you start playing as the Drifter in The New War.
Except time is weird in the Void so it's not quite as neat as that l.

[pseudo edge]

Guys I been wondering
What is the inspiration that led to the orokin?
As in designing them

[misty salmon]

greco-roman sculptures with the arms lopped off /hj

[dense herald]

so devuri does not exist in our timeline?

we doing some time hopping?

[misty salmon]

Duviri exists during our timeline, the void doesn't follow normal timeline rules.

[dense herald]

?

[silk atlas]

The Void is its own "dimension" that exists between timelines, which Duviri happens to be in.

[misty salmon]

It was created from the drifter from the alternate timeline, but the void they access is the same void we access. The whole place exists somewhat outside of what we perceive as time, but connected at arbitrary points, which is part of why we can use it for time hopping (back to 1999, and connecting the Drifter and the Op).

[restive river]

So Drifter and Operator were once the exact same person, then the zariman jump happens and the two are split presumably when making the deal with Wally, one version gets stuck in the void and no powers (Drifter) whereas the other eventually gets out of it and has powers (Operator)

We don’t even know if Drifter’s timeline exists or not
We just know they are the version of the Operator that wasn’t saved
And since they were in the void when the split happens, a place where time doesn’t work the same as outside it it complicates things

I also wouldn’t call alternate timelines strands of khra within eternalism
Strands are conceptually embodied void-renderings of time, we have been in one during Whispers and didn’t even know it
Eternalism is something that has been used to explain like 2 things and isn’t accessible by anyone except Wally

We were also in a strand for Isleweaver, presumably Wally’s heralds make them, then they tether them so he can travel along them as he is bound to only traverse along strands

Which in both instances of strands it’s been either outside of the void or in a pocket like Duviri that seems to have different rules than the outer void

[stiff beacon]

other then that questline being a sort of prelude to 2nd dream, can't remember much other then some random thing about chroma killing and skining a dragon then wearing its skin

that and him being controlled by something whilst simaris was being a @$#! on comms

[restive river]

It was presumably a sentient

Fun fact tho
Chroma’s visual design is that of a knight and as you just said he skinned. Something
I’ve heard it was a sentient but I do not recall the source

During the quest he was controlled by some form of sentient though from what I recall, the machine he’s seen near has a sentient bone of some kind that was never elaborated on

Chroma’s presumably one of the strongest in lore too though I don’t believe any feats are mentioned

[strange plinth]

just lotus's warning iirc
which has some amount of credence, probably
not really a reason to lie about chroma's strength, yk
lore wise

[stiff beacon]

maybe he killed whatever the archons were, and became a psuedo one by wearing its skin?

is the best explanation i can think of

[lilac aspen]

if he skinned something dangerous (that have been a sentient)
Wears it
Manifests the four base status effects on his own and can rapidly become tougher and stronger the more he’s hurt.
Oh AND he can cause the skinned remains to come back to life as a minion

Probably makes him pretty strong in the eyes of some.

[restive river]

Archons are just sentients designed like old earth animals strapped to a warframe with a shard to keep em going

[lilac aspen]

A Knight that slain a dragon and proceeds to casually bring its flayed hide back to life as a minion is a flex ngl

[restive river]

Just wish any of that was reflected well in gameplay

Chroma needs a rework so bad

[stiff beacon]

maybe after oberon

[lilac aspen]

His current rework at least made him not needing Fashion Frame to decide his element

I wish the augment that lets people keep the duration going after they leave his range was just his baseline capability

[trim kettle]

whats this referencing?

[restive river]

Chroma and Equinox are my two at the top of the list for needing reworks

[strange plinth]

ghouls comic i think

[restive river]

https://www.warframe.com/media/comics/ghouls3

[stiff beacon]

yep

[restive river]

https://www.warframe.com/media

[trim kettle]

so do the ghoul comics detail how vor got sent into the void? with his janus key

[restive river]

No?

[stiff beacon]

bro gets cut in half, key portals him to the void

[misty salmon]

Think the void gate in the comic connects two points in real space. There doesn't seem to be much infestation presence in the void (barring the "it's in the void" theory for how Deimos was hidden).

[normal mountain]

That's not a theory
Deimos was confirmed to be Void-shunted just like Lua
now if I could just find where that was confirmed. I know it was here somewhere

[misty salmon]

They never actually clarify where they were shunted to my knowledge. The void makes a lot of sense, both being the known place to shunt things, and that the Orokin had the capability. But it feels to me like the Heart would have some issues channelling the Void into realspace while not actually accessible to realspace.

[glacial bough]

The confirmation is from the opening of the quest. It's stated to just appear in Martian orbit and Loid say explicitly they had to phase back in to solve the issue with the heart

[normal mountain]

I know
But some people can be finicky enough to point to that and go, "but it doesn't say they were in the Void"

[humble sierra]

you probably have to find some dialogue about the derelicts and whatnot then

[normal mountain]

Which, in all fairness, it doesn't actually say that Deimos was in the Void
But really, where else are they gonna phase back from?

[silk atlas]

The unannounced Void 2

[misty salmon]

where all the enemies have immunities to nerf the melee influence builds? some sort of electric... hmm the word escapes me.

[trim kettle]

wrong channel

[normal mountain]

clearly, you've never heard of the Electric Boogaloo

[restive river]

The anti-void?

[spice spade]

why does baro not get scared of the void like albrecht

[glacial bough]

Baro didn't run into fully realized Wally

[spice spade]

but albrecht made wally

so why didn’t baro make something scary too

[glacial bough]

We don't know if albrecht made Wally

[misty salmon]

Albrecht was the first person to go into the void, he expected it to be a whole lot of nothing, like his earlier probes had suggested, and it very much wasn't. The combination of the laboratory accident, the bleeding all over the place, and a copy of him standing in a copy of his own lab was a very large surprise. Baro by contrast has been scavenging off the remains of whatever the Orokin threw into the void in the many years afterwards, over which it had lost a lot of it's mystique. He probably bumps into odd Orokin stuff in the void all the time, and would be a lot less phased by things.

[spice spade]

Ok true

i forgot he was first togo in there

[bright temple]

Also Baro made a deal with Wally to turn him into a singularity so, they're probably chill

[spice spade]

what is a singularity

[misty salmon]

how did Baro describe Wally... "a dashing stranger"... I suspect Wally did his usual showing up as a copy of somebody and Baro, with his not insignificant ego, was just "of course, why choose anything less than perfection"

[bright temple]

Baro and Wally glazing each other up

[misty salmon]

In the case of Baro: "Singularity: The state of being singular", one unique Baro across all the different places that Baro could be.

[strange plinth]

Baro talking to "Baro" about merging all of the Baros into one Baro

[bright temple]

into the Baro-verse

[spice spade]

how is there one baro

ok nvm

[misty salmon]

he made a deal with Wally, an excuse for the devs to explain why he was no longer providing different wares on different platforms, as part of their move towards cross platform.

[dense relic]

okay guys tell if I’m crazy. I’m having an argument with my buddy because I said I would enjoy it if they added Sentient adversaries somewhere down the line but he immediately shut me down because of two reasons; that there are no interesting sentient weapons in the game and that “sentients are already primed and like orokin descendant”. Did I just smoke a pound of something and skip over a whole chunk of the story or is he kinda insane?

[strange plinth]

the sentients were made by the orokin but i have no idea what they're talking about otherwise
excluding amalgam, eidolon, and archon weapons (as those would be less likely to get an "upgraded" version), there aren't a lot of sentient weapons, no, but its not like more can't be added
(especially given Old Peace and Tau coming up)

[bright temple]

I feel like your friend might be a few stars missing from a full ayatan

[dense relic]

I think he didn’t even make it to the sculpture

[bright temple]

(But also yeah like... They can always make adversary exclusive weapons, it happens)

[dense relic]

It’s a new debate with the guy everytime and it’s always the most half baked bs everytime

[dense relic]

cough cough Torxica

also how dare he for dogging on one of my favorite secondaries; Cyanex

[strange plinth]

true i wasn't even thinking about adversary exclusives. motovore my beloved

[misty salmon]

The first one is a bit of an issue, not a lot of sentient weapons unless you count amps... hmm. But that's something the devs could fix, though I'm not expecting to see an Accord Nataruk anytime soon.
Second one is very... huh.

[bright temple]

If there were ever to be a time to add Sentient adversaries, it would be Tau

[lean garden]

the second point is like, a highly irrelevant point

like so what if they were made by the orokin

theyre not of prime make

like there are only 2 prime sentient weapons and both are calibans

[strange plinth]

oh that's what they meant
priming sentient stuff clearly wasn't "normal," based on daklo's comments

[normal mountain]

Actually, the fact that they didn't do Shedu Prime has me wondering if they are in fact cooking something regarding Sentient Adversaries

[bright temple]

👀

de gimme the shedo

[bright temple]

<@&778745217037238293> Bot

[stray elm]

Thanks!

[proper barn]

Eh. I do really like the sentient sniper

Its also aoe

So a actually good sniper. The second good sniper in warframe.

[deft knot]

is there a lore reason as to why some frames have a flower mark on them or is that just a cute desigbe detail?

[bright temple]

Flower? You mean the Lotus symbol?

[deft knot]

i belive so

[proper barn]

It's just the tenno/lotus symbol.

[deft knot]

gotcha, just notcied it and got curious

[viscid aspen]

Friend of mine wanted me to summarize the game's lore. Is this accurate?

[eager dragon]

In the most part. The Zariman 10-0 was sent after the Sentients (because the Orokin weren't stupid enough it seems), and Natah became the Lotus somewhere before the Collapse (although how much earlier is not known)

[proper barn]

Okay I still think the warframes didn't "go mad" they just didn't obey but sure. Margulis was basically their advocate. It wasn't until she was killed that the Orokin made the Tenno fully into soilders but the timeline on that is murky. Also due to margs Death and some lotus melding.

[eager dragon]

Also I think the Orokin don't fully expand until after Entrati manages to enter the Void? Not sure, don't remember in which Era that happens, but I always assumed it was the transitional point between the Lith and Meso eras.

[proper barn]

Okay entrati is trying to find a way to get "out of tne origin system."

[viscid aspen]

Gotcha

The Lotus thing confuses me cuz we saw the flashback in TNW which was clearly labelled Old War and Lotus was already with the Tenno

[proper barn]

I mean during the old war

Lotus was basically a sleeper cell

Put in place by Hunhow/Ballas.

To take down the empire from the inside.

She just refused to kill us at the end of it.

[eager dragon]

Yeah, I assume that Hunhow sent Natah in agreement with Ballas, who pretended like he captured and reprogrammed her to the other Seven as Margulis to better control the Tenno.

[proper barn]

When did yoy think the lotus became the lotus?

[viscid aspen]

But that was after Marg was killed right

[proper barn]

Yes.

Marg was killed before the tenno where used as warriors.

[viscid aspen]

Ohhhh

[eager dragon]

Ofcourse, he did brainwash her, and a bit more thoroughly than Huhnhow liked, if I'm understanding it.

Because Ballas wanted his Anime Bodypillow

[viscid aspen]

So the tenno come back from the void, margulis takes care of them, they kill margulis, natah becomes lotus, the tenno drive the warframes?

[eager dragon]

The Orokin kill Margulis

[viscid aspen]

Right

[proper barn]

I mean Ballas even "betraying" the orokin for killing margulis when it was actually his fault

[proper barn]

Is peak.

[proper barn]

Ballas specifically even.

[viscid aspen]

So wait why did Ballas kill Margulis? Because she loved the kids more than him?

[proper barn]

He orders the like execution.

[eager dragon]

He leads the execution 'cause that's his job pretty much, but she was convicted by all of the Seven.

[viscid aspen]

And then he sees Natah and he's like "im gonna make you just like i want to" but Natah also loved the kids and she betrays him too?

[viscid aspen]

What was her crime?

[proper barn]

Not exactly. Okay so Margulis basically is told by Ballas "hey If you act all weak and patheic I can make sure they don't kill you." And Margulis Is like "what no? I love those kids" and since she does that Ballas is like "well I gotta like the orokin ruler so die."

[humble sierra]

Not letting the Orokin use the Tenno as weapons, I think

[proper barn]

Her crime was caring for the tenno.

[eager dragon]

Going against the Orokin using her Trasference Therapy as a weapon.

[proper barn]

Not even just that they wanted to kill the tenno

[viscid aspen]

Gotcha

[proper barn]

Cuz they where "too dangerous"

[eager dragon]

He took advantage of the deal with Hunhow pretty much, too turn Natah into Margulis.

[proper barn]

And she didn't wanna act like a obedient citizen.

And Ballas didn't wanna stand up for her.

And then he said it was the orokin empires fault.

Do you see how everything is never ballas' fault?

[humble sierra]

Say what you will about Ballas, but his bitterness is totally understandable even if it's his fault

[eager dragon]

Yeah, he views himself as the most tragic being in the universe.

[viscid aspen]

Do we have any insight into what the Tenno think of Natah taking Margulis' role? Cuz obvs they know Marg was killed, but they didnt know Lotus was Natah. Was Lotus just the second mom they really got attached to?

[proper barn]

Its not though. He could have done anything.

[eager dragon]

I'm not sure if they even knew that Margulis was killed to be honest.

[viscid aspen]

Classic ball ass

[proper barn]

He didn't use her power to get her away He didn't use his power to save her He didn't use his power as chief executur to save the kids

He didn't do anything.

[eager dragon]

For all they know, she disappeared one day, and then another lady with the exact same appearance and voice came around.

Who claimed to be Margulis

[humble sierra]

Well yeah, he loved the idea of Margulis, maybe not the person, and he couldn't fathom why she loved the kids more than him

[proper barn]

@humble sierra like he talks to Margulis before she goes out to talk to the Seven and is like "just let the kids die" and she's like "no Ballas we gotta save um" and he's like "well."

Like do anything

Like Ballas uses his powe for nothing

[pallid spoke]

They do, at the end of Second Dream it's directly addressed.

[proper barn]

Like "I can turn anyone I want into my body or a living statue or a bodyguard but ask me to save my lover? OH PERISH THE THOUGHT."

[eager dragon]

They know of that after the quest, sure, but are we sure they knew of it back in the Old War?

(Which is what I was talking about)

[pallid spoke]

One of the dialogue options you can pick has the Operator mention it before Lotus says it.

[humble sierra]

The voices we hear at the end of the second dream might be our memories returning, I think

[proper barn]

Also in The drifters like

Kim messages it talks about how it took margulis dying

For the tenno to rebel

[viscid aspen]

I cant wait for the operator appearance rework to replay those quests

[eager dragon]

Ok, yeah, I see it.

[viscid aspen]

Okay i think its fixed now

[eager dragon]

*The Zariman was sent into the Void after the Sentients were sent to Tau but before they reached it.

(I probably should have been more clear on that, my bad)

[viscid aspen]

One thing i hope becomes more clear on is how much time passes between each point. For all we know between the Entrati's discovery of the Void and the creation of the Sentients it could've been hundreds of years thanks to their extended lifespans and body hopping and whatnot

[viscid aspen]

Gotcha

[humble sierra]

Yeah that's a fairly new thing we've learned and that was also in an interview, not in-game

[eager dragon]

Yeah, I seriously hope it's some really poor wording choice

[viscid aspen]

Okay i think this is good now

Side note i reaaaaaalllyy wanna see the night of naga drums

Real order 66 vibes for me

[eager dragon]

The order seems right, yes

[viscid aspen]

Thank u

[strange turtle]

You should probably elaborate on the Grineer/Corpus bit, since they weren’t in their current state

Unless they already get that bit

[raw jetty]

Hello, I have a question. I’ve recently just finished the whispers in the walls quest and have been getting into lore lately and I noticed since the new war quest, is the tenno the sole survivor of its kind? Aside from the drifter which I believe is still him/her just in an alternate universe/timeline?

[eager dragon]

No, there are other Tenno

Our Operator is just the "Chosen" one

(Probably 'cause we made the deal with Wally, but I'm unsure if that was the reason the Kalymos Protocol chose us)

[raw jetty]

But why didn’t the other tenno help during the new war? I was expecting to see other warframe npcs fighting side by side on a full on war

[eager dragon]

What I think is that, due to the Operator being the one that made the deal, all of the Tenno powers are inherintly linkend to them - when Ballas sent us into the Void, it weakend the other Tenno sufficiently that fighting just wasn't an option.

We don't know the actual reason though.

[raw jetty]

Ohhh alright thank you

[eager dragon]

(During the start of the quest though the other Tenno were definitly present, just off screen)

(As can be seen with the "dead" Rhino during the Kahl section)

[raw jetty]

Lol there was?? I didn’t pay enough attention to detail 😭

[pale cedar]

That’s always a recipe for disaster

[ashen pulsar]

That’s where he steals the shotgun

From a rhino body

[raw jetty]

I just looked it up on yt again and I barely recognized it was a rhino in the cutscene. Really thought it was just another grineer the first time I played

RIP Kahl

[pallid scroll]

Yapping

[tall echo]

You are

[bright temple]

?

[wraith elbow]

ok @eager dragon, the duviri paradox starts at the same time as the new war, the duviri paradox ends before the new war log in screen, this can be easily explained by how the drifter says that he's the version of the operator that didn't get saved, the file for the drifter on POM-2 says that they now coexist with eachother, even though that doesn't explain much.

[eager dragon]

That is excatly what I was saying

They occur at the same time

[tall echo]

Well the paradox happens specifically between operator getting stabbed by ballas and the first drifter sequence in tnw

[wraith elbow]

ok, i just got confused because you just said that they happen at the same time, instead of just saying that it happens during the beginning of the new war

[brittle siren]

So Albrecht Entrati could be consider a doctor right

[spice jewel]

A doctor of science

[brittle siren]

So

Apple is his fatal weakness

[wraith elbow]

i don't think apples exist

unless they do

[tall echo]

By our current irl definition probably not

[brittle siren]

I mean it doesn't specify which doctor would be affected by apple

[tall echo]

Well the doctor used for the meme is usually a dentist, but no matter what, albrecht very likely doesn't have a doctorate

[brittle siren]

Time to take some from 1999

[wraith elbow]

this is absolutely canon now

[brittle siren]

Also since he saved Kalymos, he at least vet doctor worthy

[tall echo]

Not like a vet would

[pale cedar]

Albrecht causally doing a sin no vet would ever do

[misty salmon]

Minor quibble: I think the Zariman came back relatively quickly (in 4a) but the Orokin had no idea what to do with the kids and stuck them on ice, and Margulis' therapy project (until 7)

[pale cedar]

The timeframe is mentioned as both years in one place and less than a year in another so there’s no conclusive answer to that

[viscid aspen]

They dont but at least they are way easier to get before the current day iterations

[misty salmon]

The days reference is Ember Prime. Where's the years referenced?

[pale cedar]

Lotus says it somewhere

[misty salmon]

End of Second Dream, thanks. Also hmmm.

[raven hedge]

Honestly, I feel like Tau is another origin system thats lightyears away from ours-

[woven coyote]

......

It isnt an origin system because thats just the name of our system

Tau is just another stelar system

[misty salmon]

I now want the lightyeet to be a unit of measure, based on the distance one can throw a photon.

[lean garden]

explain

[humble sierra]

The computers in 1999 are Pom ][ — Pomme meaning Apple in French.

[raven hedge]

Well, it would make more sense when put in practice. The tenno draws thier power from the void,but we have frames like umbra with resistance to tau and caliban who has tau damage onto him as if he draws it from tau like we do with the void. Plus,the sentients had to have originated from somewhere, not just they appeared but the same stellar system as ours just doesnt feel right.

[glacial bough]

The Sentients came from the Origin System

[tall echo]

Oh you're that unaware huh
Why did I phrase this so rudely

Sentients were made by the orokin, tau damage is just sentient damage

[raven hedge]

Ah i see nevermind then😅

[misty salmon]

Sentients were initially built in Origin, shipped out to Tau as a terraforming and highway construction crew, then decided that the Orokin weren't actually very nice guys and rebelled.

[tall echo]

Realized* not decided

[raven hedge]

Ill delve into the lore again,because I honestly didnt know that(or just forgot and my brain said nah this feels right lol) and ive been playing this game for years😅

[tall echo]

Likely the latter since it's stated a few times in various places

[humble sierra]

Bruh, Directive8020's trying to get to Tau as well

[restive river]

Huh

[normal mountain]

Amateurs
They put aliens on Tau
We got super advanced robots

[humble sierra]

That new Ryan Gosling movie is about him going to Tau as well

[winter geode]

i was watching someone play the new war for the first time and we were going over the lore and i was unclear on whether the orokin weaponized the infested against the sentients or if the infested were a threat that predated the sentients as it seems to indicate in the silver grove and witw+1999 or what

[spice wedge]

Entrati was trying to escape man in the wall.

[oblique siren]

.. is Tau the name of an actual location space, or is this all a fun coincidence? XD

[restive river]

Tau Ceti

[humble sierra]

Actual place that all 3 things are basing it off

[oblique siren]

That's really cool! I love stuff like that

[strange plinth]

the infestation existed long before the orokin, but the orokin did weaponize it against the sentients
both with standard infestation stuff and cultivating it into the helminth to make warframes

[mystic lynx]

Have we seen any infested sentient tho?

[normal mountain]

No
Nor have we seen Sentients interact with Infested at all (with the unconfirmed possible exception of the rogue Chroma from The New Strange)
Which makes me wonder if they just don't like each other, and why

[strange plinth]

we've only heard of it tmk
with deimos being bio-bombed to prevent the sentients from taking it

[humble sierra]

If I had to guess, the infestation and Sentients would probably just keep adapting to each other

[normal mountain]

Recursive adaptation
That could get ugly...

[trim kettle]

could infested... infest a sentient?

[misty salmon]

"We're back with day 4503 of the Adaptoff. With no access to void damage, and having fully adapted immunity to all other damage types by day three, our contestants continue to glare at each other for the 4500'th straight day. Tomorrow is expected to be much the same. Back to you Steve."

[trim kettle]

they can certainly take over mechanics by sheer force of "we're moving THIS way now with MY muscles"

[lilac aspen]

It’s actually interesting but apparently the Sentients are completely immune to the infestation to the point you can use Sentient stuff as something to hinder infestation, like during the Boil event on Cetus

But they don’t really bother trying to fight the infestation either because they’re a pain in the butt to even the Sentients despise being immune.

Basically
“We’re immune, we can totally fight them, but we have more time consuming matters, like the Warframes.”

It’s why the Orokin focused more on Helminth to do warframes
Any other infestation weaponization was only shooting themself in the foot because the Sentients knew it’d be a bigger problem to everyone else than to them, they’d only need to sit back and watch those man made horrors tear the Orokin apart.

[misty salmon]

not to be confused with the Warframes, tearing the Orokin apart.

[feral cape]

Simple like the mushroom you can not kill the infestation in any way that matters (excluding like head units)

The infested just turn the dead infested into more biomass its a net neutral front that the sentients will only lose

Although apparently bringing sentients back from the dead is just

Something other sentients can do because uhhhhh

[lilac aspen]

Built diff

Death is just a severe inconvenience

[misty salmon]

DE's audio guys are just that good

[glacial bough]

Why wouldn't you be able to rebuild machines

[feral cape]

Also there wouldn't really be recursive adaptation the sentients adaptation is a bit on the slower and has an upper limit and the infestation cant really adapt like that

[feral cape]

Well hunhow just kinda brings them back no rebuilding they just stand back up

Like if you remove it from the field and repair it sure thats fine but hunhow actually just raised the dead

[lilac aspen]

Irony that the infestation still tore them apart, except Void-power children handed the infestation a steel-chair.

[feral cape]

Infested adaptation from my knowledge is just basic darwinism not like actual adaptation as an ability

[lilac aspen]

Oh that’s because apparently they’re “pieces” of him
So unless you obliterate them, he can make em stand back up

[feral cape]

There's gotta be a limit to that

If I bisect a drone can hunhow just make it stand back up

[lilac aspen]

Sentients are weird
How they talk sometimes and stuff gives weird hive mind yet still individual consciousness vibes

[feral cape]

I just think of it like vex one giant discord call between everyone

[humble sierra]

Majority of Sentients we've seen are fragments. Hunhow, Erra, Natah, and Adis all seem individual.

[feral cape]

Yes I know that

[humble sierra]

The Orb Mothers might be one mind too

[glacial bough]

When does he do that? The only things drones get is that other living drones can use the spare parts

[feral cape]

He doesn't do that im asking a hypothetical question

In the new war he makes the drones i killed stand back up whats the limit to that

[misty salmon]

I suppose there's the question of what is a sentient? Are there only four actual sentients in Origin (not including Archons), and all the rest of them are just fragment drones. Semi-autonomous appendages of the four big names?

[lilac aspen]

I mean
Probably if a warframe actually ripped them apart

[feral cape]

-lyst means its a drone

[lilac aspen]

We basically were just given target practice targets

[feral cape]

Anything not named -lyst is an individual

[misty salmon]

if that's the case then their inability to reproduce might be just that they can't spawn a new mind, but they can chop up their bodies and regrow those nearly endlessly.

[feral cape]

Thats what they do

[lilac aspen]

Remember Drifter was a generic human figuring out how to use a sentient-based bow during that moment

Hunhow’s fragments were probably getting tickled despite it being an exploding bolt of energy

[feral cape]

Although they can't regrow thats the issue

The planes sentient tells us this

[lilac aspen]

Sentients can heal
But there’s a limit to their healing factor

Like what happened to Hunhow or with the Eldions

Which are fragments of a giga sentient that was essentially point blank nuked by Gara

Basically Hunhow is “slow dying” at this point unless Drifter/Operator plans on getting him out of the ocean

[misty salmon]

The warframe that became Revenant was out there specifically to keep the Eidolon locked down, the nuke was arguably not enough to ensure it couldn't rebuild.

[stiff beacon]

ngl i feel bad for hunhow

[spice wedge]

Which means that steel path lvl 130 eidolon hydrolost should be encountered,but warframe is reduced in almost everything

Revenant

[halcyon grotto]

Why this games story feels really scattered and broken in pieces feels both can't understand sheet and too badass like hell at the same time

[eager dragon]

Mostly because a good chunk of lore is missing from the game due to limited time events

The biggest example of this is Alad V

[strange plinth]

yeah, like ender burster said, a decent portion of the lore isn't in the game (a lot of us hope it'll get re-added in some way. even if it isn't the event itself, some email or something)
but if you ever have questions or need clarification about it, that's what this channel is for

[strange turtle]

You can find transcripts of all the quests and peoples dialogues on Orokin Archives

[halcyon grotto]

Okay so what actually happened in the quest netracell

Someone cheated on loid now he likes that clone of mine and he's a peeeeedoooo now?

[eager dragon]

What

[halcyon grotto]

That's all I understand

[dull quiver]

they have to add old events as quests

[eager dragon]

He's still very much into Albrecht

[halcyon grotto]

New war and war within was even more confusing

[eager dragon]

Ok, which part specifically

Wally? Drifter? The Grineer Queens? School?

[halcyon grotto]

Mostly everything after defeating corrupted jackal and excluding school part

What is drifter

Future op?

[eager dragon]

It literally stated in the quest that the Drifter is not future Operator but an alt-timeline version

That did not get saved from the Zariman

Unlike the Operator

If you play the Duviri Paradox now, you'll see what the Drifter has been doing for the past couple thousands of years

[mystic lynx]

Is the passge of time in duviri much longer than origin system or does void power give tenno some kind of eternal youth?
I'm trying to understand why drifter is much older than tenno

[eager dragon]

I'm assuming 'cause Cryosleep

[halcyon grotto]

Uhhh okaay

Soo is this stalker guy also a warframe??

[eager dragon]

Yes. Just not a Tenno.

[strange plinth]

most common explanation i hear is that drifter aged until they wanted to leave, at which point the duviri timeloop prevented aging (because they kept dying lmao)

[eager dragon]

Have you played Jade Shadows?

[halcyon grotto]

What about jade?

[halcyon grotto]

Yes

[eager dragon]

The shrine next to Teshin on any relay explains that.

[halcyon grotto]

I couldn't even understand what I exactly is a warframe

Like a guy controlling another living being or smth?

[eager dragon]

You know the Infested?

[halcyon grotto]

Yeaah

[eager dragon]

Basically, this is them, but a controlled version

And the Tenno control the resulting being

[halcyon grotto]

Who made them?

[mystic lynx]

Balls

[eager dragon]

Ballas in the most part

[strange plinth]

Loid and Albrecht are a couple, Albrecht left for 1999 and in the time since, Loid's emotions have soured. The Indifference feeds off of negative emotions and did its best to amplify them. however, the indfference is also weakened by positive emotions, which is why its driven away at the end of the quest, as Loid remembers how he actually feels about Albrecht when he sees the vessels recreate their last moment together (although unintentionally, as the operator wouldn't have a way to actually know what happened there)

[eager dragon]

(Which is explicitly stated in the Sacrifice but ok)

[halcyon grotto]

When I see lotus soo distorted that scared that shit out of me I can't see her like I used to now😭

[misty salmon]

It's Natah bug in a Lotus suit.

[halcyon grotto]

Where is lotus btw like on another planet or smth?

[halcyon grotto]

That natah ruined mommy lotus😭

[strange turtle]

She’s in the labs rn if thats what you mean

[misty salmon]

Unsure, she's currently chilling on Deimos. She did drop by Lua at least once in person, but probably wasn't staying there as it had been in the void and that would have been a problem for her.

[strange plinth]

don't know > lotus chamber on Lua > [apostasy prologue to the new war] > sanctum anatomica

[misty salmon]

where her actual base of operations is, if such a thing exists, is unknown.

[halcyon grotto]

Okay sooo what is tau again?

[eager dragon]

Do you mean Natah or Eidolon Lotus

[eager dragon]

A separate Star System. Based on the stars, probably Serius.

[misty salmon]

The next™ star system over. Where the Orokin were planning on expanding their empire to.

[strange plinth]

another star system that the orokin wanted to colonize
the sentients were sent to terraform it first, then the zariman. zariman never arrived, however

[halcyon grotto]

And... Why do I have mod named tau resistance?

[strange plinth]

sentients do tau damage

[eager dragon]

Because the Sentients (and Caliban) deal Tau damage

[proper barn]

@halcyon grotto okay so warframes are people molded into warframes with the use of the helminth.

Also yes Loid and Ballas are gay.

[halcyon grotto]

😖

[proper barn]

What does this mean?

[eager dragon]

You mean Albrecht

[misty salmon]

*Albrecht?

[halcyon grotto]

Loid is okay ballas feels weird furry thing

[proper barn]

OH

[eager dragon]

Ballas seems pretty straight to me

[proper barn]

OH I SAID BALLAS.

Albretch

My bad.

[misty salmon]

I wouldn't put it past Ballas to be very pan. The Orokin were rather hedonistic.

[halcyon grotto]

I mean ballas look weird idk imma wet my pants if he knock at my door at 12am

[eager dragon]

I think his base Orokin appearance was pretty cool

[strange turtle]

Fair

[halcyon grotto]

Okay so does stalker have any kind of relationship with orokins?

[strange turtle]

Statue looking ass

[strange plinth]

most orokin had the blue skin and long arm
his sentient features were.. odd, though
(seriously why'd they mess with his legs? what was the point?)

[strange turtle]

He was a “Low guard” (guardian?) who worked for them

[proper barn]

We'll Ballas uses the fact Kullervo loved him to torment him. Also Ballas was gonna use a woman yuvan for his new body but I think he would just make himself look like Ballas again in that body.

[eager dragon]

One of the only cases where Dis-Symmetry looked better than a symmetrical look.

[strange turtle]

Truly, a fate worse than getting made into a warframe

[halcyon grotto]

Does stalker used to work for tenno if he does then why he try to assasinate us

[proper barn]

She was turned into a warframe instead.

[proper barn]

No?

[halcyon grotto]

Oooh

[strange plinth]

stalker's an orokin lapdog, as they promised he'd see his wife again if he was obedient
so when the tenno,, massacred most of them, he's still kinda upset about it
even if he's forgotten why he was so loyal in the meantime

[proper barn]

Wait the orokin where rulers tenno never told orokin what to do? @halcyon grotto

[eager dragon]

No. Pre-Jade Shadow's he did it 'cause he hated the Tenno for hurting Jade, post-Jade Shadow's... well, let's say baby food ain't cheap.

[proper barn]

Did we hurt jade ever?

[strange plinth]

i don't think so?

[proper barn]

Isn't it just she's using all her energy to have a child

[eager dragon]

I assumed so based on the first cutscene to be honest

[proper barn]

Why?

[strange turtle]

He worked for the Orokin as a Low Guard as Sorren, then again as Stalker so he could see his wife and child again (at some point he forgot), but then the Tenno killed the Orokin

[proper barn]

Yeah I don't think we ever do.

[misty salmon]

I think it's more that we attacked the Orokin. Jade popped in to rescue him from that mayhem, and they retreated to someplace in Hunhow's basement.

[strange turtle]

Yeah no there’s nothing indicating injuries she’s just keep Sirion alive

[eager dragon]

It just seems weird to me that he would remain so loyal to the Orokin after they all died.

[proper barn]

More letting him grow.

[eager dragon]

To the point that he would ally with Hunhow

Just to take revenge on us

[proper barn]

Well Stalker saw it as the way to get jade back and we stopped him from doing that. Now we can even if we want say he hates Ballas still cuz Ballas is the one that did all this to him.

[strange turtle]

I thought he got stuck at a stage? Since we needed to get her stuff so she could finally give birth

[halcyon grotto]

Yeah and he said smth about tenno betrayar or smth but in jade shadows why stalker came to us for help we are enemies right?

[misty salmon]

Combination of orokin brainwashing, and then not getting his wife back and the only people he could think of that might save her were all dead?

[strange plinth]

it turns from loyalty to "you took my chance to see my wife again"
from my understanding
ofc he forgets her and that purpose later, just being his hatred of the tenno that keeps him going

[misty salmon]

Hunhow talks some sense into him at the begining of Jade Shadows.

[proper barn]

The feather says like Ballas is like "stay still for a year to get your baby to kick".

[strange turtle]

He came to us for help because we’re the only ones who could

[strange plinth]

hunhow has to really talk him into going to us for help
and he still exhausts every other option first

[eager dragon]

With some firm talk from Hunhow

[halcyon grotto]

Okay so uk that void jump incident

[eager dragon]

The Zariman, yes

[halcyon grotto]

How did the opretors survived

[eager dragon]

Wally

[halcyon grotto]

After that

[eager dragon]

He offered us a deal

We gave him our "light", and in exchange, he saves us

[proper barn]

By dealing with the adults and then hiding out.

[halcyon grotto]

I cant remember that name

[proper barn]

Well drifter stays.

[eager dragon]

Man in the Wall, the Great Indifference, Lidless Eye, ect.

[strange plinth]

parents went insane (because of the man in the wall)
the man in the wall offered a deal to one of the children (player character)
it gave all of them void powers to kill their parents in order to survive
(drifter's line splits off at the deal, the other children were given powers and saved, drifter was not.)

[eager dragon]

True, but he asked about the Operator specifically.

[halcyon grotto]

And why does that man in wall want that grimore

[strange turtle]

Yeah but it’s been 1000+ years by the time of Jade Shadows and he’s born immediately after we give her the cortichrome, so I figured at that point they were just holding on for the final steps

[misty salmon]

Somebody (MC Tenno) made a deal with Wally (The Man In The Wall /Indifference), he gave the kids void powers to protect themselves. Eventually the Zariman popped back into realspace, and the kids got "rescued" by the Orokin empire, who had no idea what to do with them. Margulis managed to get them not killed instantly, and instead got to run a mixture of cryosleep and a therapy program with them for a while.

[halcyon grotto]

And is that bald gay friend of loid is real guy or just a copy like tennos copy man in the wall uk what I mean ik u understand what I'm trying to ask

[eager dragon]

Are you talking of the Vessels?

'Cause I don't think Albrecht is bald

[halcyon grotto]

What's that

[misty salmon]

there's two versions of Albrecht (who is not particularly bald) running around. The one with the more awkward grimace is usually Wally.

[eager dragon]

The big "humans"

[misty salmon]

vessels are the giant humanoid statues in the deimos labs.

[eager dragon]

/statutes

[strange plinth]

albrecht
isn't bald i don't think?
but pay attention to the eyes. black/purple is a wally copy, otherwise its real
there's only one case where wally doesn't have those eyes

[misty salmon]

technically some sort of variant warfame using the grey strain of infestation

[halcyon grotto]

Nonono

Thsi guy

I think he's bald

Or maybe his hairs was glitched

[misty salmon]

he was bald in his Orokin painting... did we ever see him without a hat in his current appearance?

[halcyon grotto]

The terminal was glitched to so I had to login and log out 7 times just to start the netracell quest

[strange plinth]

don't believe so
if there was, it was probably the interrogation scene?

[misty salmon]

Albrect: "The hat stays on".

[strange plinth]

"A giant to battle giants, merging the humanity of the man Arthur, the anatomical perfection of Ballas's Warframes, and the titanic potency of the Grey Strain."

[halcyon grotto]

In the end cutscene his eyes was Black to just like that op clone(walls in the man ig)

Man in the walls

Sorry mb

[misty salmon]

yep, if the eyes are black that's probably Wally impersonating somebody

[halcyon grotto]

Okay and what was the reason of orokin empires downfall

[misty salmon]

Hubris

[strange plinth]

hubris, yeah
but the tenno did most of the work

[misty salmon]

Most directly the Tenno killed every Orokin they could find at the end of the Old War.

[halcyon grotto]

What's hubris

[misty salmon]

an excessive and unfounded confidence in their own superiority.

[strange plinth]

yeah. lots of pride

[halcyon grotto]

And why were sentists against orokins

[strange plinth]

realized that the orokin would ruin Tau just as they had ruined Origin

[halcyon grotto]

Oohh

And what is kuva and what its role in story

[misty salmon]

Kuva is the mysterious substance that allowed the Orokin elite to have immortality, in the worst way possible.

[strange plinth]

void-derived substance
(we don't know)
the orokin used it to transfer their consciousness to another body, overwriting the original mind in the process
it also seemingly allowed control over the dax, seen with the scepter in war within

[misty salmon]

it also has some other weird effects.

[halcyon grotto]

Oh.....

[misty salmon]

We have a source for it being void derived? Because I thought it was very much in use before Albrecht made the void vogue.

[strange plinth]

it was,
i think the item description says its void derived?
it does not. hold on. i swear it says it somewhere-

[halcyon grotto]

Okaay....

So a warframe has no conscious right?

We transfer ours to warframe

To control it

[misty salmon]

erm... we transfer ours to the warframe to control it yes

[halcyon grotto]

So what about umbra

There was a scene it grabs tenno by neck

[misty salmon]

but some warframes definitely have independent consciousnesses (Umbra, Jade)

[strange plinth]

most don't
there are some exceptions, like Umbra, Kullervo, Dante (although he's somewhere), Stalker, and Jade (pre-jade shadows)

[halcyon grotto]

Okay

[strange plinth]

the main thing that would let the original host keep their mind intact is something to focus on
Umbra has his Single Burning Memory, Stalker has his hatred, Kullervo has.. whatever's going on with his Seven Crimes, etc

[halcyon grotto]

And uk that mission where operator lose its warframe and he goes to a snowy area

And fought with that uhm worm or smth?

[strange plinth]

war within, yeah?

[halcyon grotto]

Yeah

So he forces himselfs into that worm and he could control it

[strange plinth]

through transference, yes
same way they control warframes

[halcyon grotto]

So can u like disable warframe conciousness forcefully?

[strange plinth]

sorta. its a battle of wills if the warframe's consciousness isn't dormant

[misty salmon]

yeah, but my understanding is we're usually more polite with our frames.

[strange plinth]

have you done the hex quest?

[halcyon grotto]

No

I just completed gay loid quest

[strange plinth]

ok. then Umbra will do
when you first build umbra, you transfer into him, but he kicks you out
but when you learn his story and help him move past it, he allows you to transfer in without issue

[halcyon grotto]

Hmm that's kinda polite ig

But kinda feels like sleep paralysis but ur body can move

[strange plinth]

yea probably

[halcyon grotto]

Okay so in that...

Um zariman yeah why does our player meets zariman what about the other kids? Does they rejected that?

Offerr

[strange plinth]

the offer was given only to the player's operator(/drifter. whatever), and affected all of the other children as part of it

[halcyon grotto]

Why only us?

[strange plinth]

we're "unique" iirc

ye olde main character syndrome, though

[halcyon grotto]

Oh plot armour that explains that really well

[misty salmon]

In theory all the other kids end up being all the other player's (and various historical) tenno... when the game remembers to telegraph that instead of "you're the only character".

[strange plinth]

yeah
only big exception is Rell
but his story is done anyway so

[halcyon grotto]

Can u simplify bc that flew miles above my head

[misty salmon]

So the main character Tenno (-yours-) made the deal with Wally, which resulted in all the kids becoming Tenno. From your point of view, all the story events happen to your Tenno, everyone else's are just supporting roles, show up in missions, etc.

[halcyon grotto]

So all of em are alive?

[misty salmon]

The game sometimes acknowledges that there are lots of Tenno running around, but because all the storyline happens to you, it also frequently feels like there is actually only one Tenno.

[strange plinth]

only one is confirmed dead afaik
the rest are presumably alive

[misty salmon]

Not all of them are alive, there's a handful of historical Tenno, Rell being the best known, who have died at some point in the backstory.

[halcyon grotto]

Damn someone thinking so typing this much makes me feel happy🫠

[halcyon grotto]

Ig I dropped that rell quest

[strange plinth]

-# wait are there other confirmed ones that i've missed

[pale cedar]

Gara would’ve had an Operator considering the time period and if the Tenno feel what the frame does that Operator is probably dead

[strange turtle]

It’s from one of the Zariman tablets in Duviri, but you’re misremembering slightly. The ability to conduct consciousness is void derived, but kuva itself is kinda just there for some reason (though it can also be got from the Reliquary fingers)

[misty salmon]

Nobody with a known name that I recall, and nothing straight up confirmed.

We're not quite sure where Voruna ended up taking her Op

[strange turtle]

Like it’s creation/appearance could be linked to/caused by the Void but we don’t know much about it

[strange plinth]

yeah that falls into the 'does the operator die if the warframe does'
so there's the mirage in hidden messages as well
warden? who knows once he re-emerged as revenant though

[misty salmon]

I wish this wiki was as well cited as the FR one.

[pale cedar]

Before becoming Tenno a kid got strangled by an Angel

[strange plinth]

ah. right, thank you
ngl i competely forgot to actually keep looking for that line about kuva. got sidetracked with the rest of this convo lmao

[vast willow]

My love for Warframe can make me go crazy

I don't know if its accurate lol

[strange plinth]

timeline isn't quite right and parvos was "assassinated" by the other members of the board, without warframes involved (other than protea, granum's bodyguard)
otherwise looks mostly good

[proper barn]

Okay parvos void stranding was actually from his own board of directors.

[vast willow]

k

I got warned for yapping in my friend's studio

hehe

[proper barn]

Every warframe at some point was a person. Also the Zariman was them testing out jumps outside the origin system and trying to get to tau. Also the warframes where made to fight the sentients.

Otherwise

[vast willow]

I kinda got confused there because Parvos said something about Warframes destroying his ship in Deadlock Protocol

[proper barn]

Not his ship they raided a base.

[vast willow]

Wait, didn't I say anything about the Warframes killing Sentients?

I did

[proper barn]

I was more saying that the creation of the warframes themselves happened after the old war started.

[misty salmon]

Zariman didn't even make it out of the Origin system, it failed on a "test jump" leaving Saturn.

[vast willow]

This game has way too much lore lol

[strange plinth]

falls into the timeline issue
corpus forms > sentients proposed > sentients sent to tau > zariman incident > old war begins > zariman returns? > warframes > tenno-controlled warframes > old war ends > night of naga drums
is the relevant stuff i believe

[dire mountain]

Some would argue not enough

(Im some)

[vast willow]

Not enough but too much for my brain

[dire mountain]

Also your pfp is master chief that series has 24 years of lore under its belt get real 😭

[strange turtle]

Also idk if you left it out to avoid too many spoilers but a bunch of important tenno info isn’t there

[dire mountain]

You could get lost on the wiki alone for an entire day

[vast willow]

Mostly it's just big religious aliens come to kill humans, aliens want superweapon, aliens find the fake infested and then big walking green war criminal destroys the superweapon and everyone else

[strange turtle]

Missed out the stuff with Wally and the Void Angels, Margulis and Lotus + a bunch of the stuff you said were Tenno powers are warframe stuff

[dire mountain]

You forgot that humans are the inheritors of all the technology the aliens worship so the leaders conspire to kill them all just so others dont find out their religion is fake

[vast willow]

Yeah also that
We don't talk about the Reclaimer symbol, it make me hallucinate the Marathon logo everywhere

Anyway gtg guys

[halcyon grotto]

Okay so as u said that warframe are people molded into machines right?

So that arthur from 1999 is excalibur from our time?

[misty salmon]

Bioflesh hybrids more than machines, but close.

[halcyon grotto]

Damn 🫠🫠😆

Spaghetti ramen same thing

With different spices

[misty salmon]

Arthur has been changed using a modified version of the Helminth infestation batch that would produce an Excalibur.

He gets all the powers, but also gets to keep his charming personality intact, and the grumpy scowl.

[velvet cradle]

No.

That would cause lots of timeline issues

It is more a modified strain of the helminth strain than anything

[misty salmon]

As far as we can tell he does not end up remaining as an Excalibur by the time the Orokin Empire is building warframes.

[velvet cradle]

Well, warframes are still largely bio mechanical based but yea can be seen as more peusdo robotic puppets

[pale cedar]

Albrecht took Helminth from the future into the past

[misty salmon]

For the most part it's understood that the Hex are going to end up getting wiped out in some of the massive global conflicts that resulted from the Techrot. They still have 18 (maybe a couple fewer) "Radiation Wars" to get through and a planet to severely mess up.

There's a couple potential exceptions, but those are spoilers for stuff at the top end of the Hex ranks.

[pale cedar]

Eh, nothing says what happens to them in the future

[velvet cradle]

Well:

1: ballas was the OG creator of the Warframes , not Albrecht causing a grandfather loop of sorts

2: and the time between 1999 and the time of the orokin empire is undefined and may be far too much of a gap for any protoframe to still be around and in any state to give Ballas the blueprints to base the Warframes on them

[misty salmon]

Nothing is said, true, but if they aren't written out somewhere in the intervening years then we end up with a likely bootstrap paradox.

[velvet cradle]

Yeah all up to speculation

The best is that they perish of old age and get buried somewhere where their remains rot beyond use and recognition and at worst , they perish and get reduced to dust or atoms in a conflict

[velvet cradle]

How would it lead to a bootstrap? Cos there is a clear start point that ballas is not basing the Warframes on the protoframes from the sacrifice quest

[pale cedar]

Considering Warframes don’t age the most that will happen is they will become full frames and maybe get transferenced on

[misty salmon]

Which means Ballas has to be unaware of their existence, which means they probably no longer exist.

[pale cedar]

Not really, once they leave the loop they’ll become full frames eventually meaning nothing will happen to them except being used as frames

[eager dragon]

You think Ballas would just... not notice some random frames he never created suddenly be found?

[strange plinth]

assuming they survive
they'd still be considered gen 1s in terms of survivability, which the orokin were able to kill
i wouldn't put it past 18 radiation wars to be able to do that as well

[pale cedar]

Nothing says they wouldn’t survive tbh

They’re still stronger than the average human

We don’t really have any info on their future rn

[velvet cradle]

@pale cedar

Yea.

Even if they become full frames, they are not immune to destruction.

There might be stories of myth that would have survived but the records of the time before the orokin empire I think are lost to time so we have no clue what happened between 1999 and the orokin empire

We are also unsure the time gap between 1999 and the height of the orokin empire where they do all the steps to make the void tech, sentients and such.

Also, the transferance tech was made by margilus if I am not mistaken which is another issue if the protoframes had them and survived

[pale cedar]

Transference tech isn’t even needed for us cuz we have it innately

[eager dragon]

I feel like just the fact that they do not mess with the current time, with Ballas and the other Orokin unaware of them, means they didn't survive.

[pale cedar]

Or they just became a full frame and we have 0 idea what happened after that

[velvet cradle]

That is only after the war within

Transferance bolts are still needed before that

[eager dragon]

They did turn into a full frame most likely.

[strange turtle]

That’s because it was locked away, we always had it

[eager dragon]

However, Earth was literally exploited to hell and back.

How could the Orokin have missed any Warframes that were still active

[sly ibex]

Another proposed option: we find a way to bring them into the future and halt the spread of the Infestation in them, or maybe even one day cure them of it (since Alad has a radically effective cure, even if it still isn't 100%).

[eager dragon]

Especially as they would have been present through out the entire existence of the Orokin civilization if they survived.

[misty salmon]

that does end up being a possibility, yes

Along with evidence that a warframe can survive that sort of timespan, in a relatively safe environment, and still be functional.

[pale cedar]

We can’t really predict the future tbh

[eager dragon]

We live in the Future

We know Ballas and the Orokin seemingly never find out about the protoframes

[velvet cradle]

My proposed idea that is dark

If not cured or a way to stop the spread, they may have a pact to stay together and take them out of commission if they succumb to the helminth

[halcyon grotto]

Hey does arthur know drifter bc they looks like it and my drifters name is marty?

[eager dragon]

Missing several Frames that remain active for the span of the entire civilization is nigh impossible

Ergo, something happens to them

[misty salmon]

Marty is a movie reference, they've all watched Back to The Future a few too many times.

[halcyon grotto]

And what is murmur

[strange plinth]

arthur and drifter meet properly for the first time during the hex, but arthur was also vaguely aware that something was weird during the 1999 section in whispers

[halcyon grotto]

So they all know drifters?

[eager dragon]

The hands and legs with fight

[velvet cradle]

Marty is a reference to back to the future movie cos the time travel and the drifter has no relation to arthur

[misty salmon]

Murmur is a (yet another) name for the Indifference/enemies.

[halcyon grotto]

Are they.....in loooove?

[strange plinth]

can be. player choice

[misty salmon]

nope, you're the only drifter they meet.

[velvet cradle]

Are the drifters surname Mcfly

[strange turtle]

Mcflea* smh. What kind of ripoff did you watch?

[halcyon grotto]

I downloaded the game a month ago and......

Damn this is insane🫠

[chrome raft]

Only 400?

[velvet cradle]

Never watched

Mcflea makes me think of a different way of calling him

[strange turtle]

It’s a joke because in Back To the Future his name is Marty Mcfly, but they had to change it for 1999 so they swapped it to flea

[velvet cradle]

Wrong chat but decent numbers

[velvet cradle]

Aahhh

[halcyon grotto]

Heey what's with that nyx in 1999 she feels like a main antagonist or smtg

[pale cedar]

She’s not

Murmur are the main antagonist

[humble sierra]

She's just fighting the urge to become one with the Infestation

[halcyon grotto]

Aoi died😭

[sly ibex]

Your best bet is to just play through the quests in the game. 😄 You'll have a better understanding after experiencing it.

[humble sierra]

They've got that covered. They're already doing the Hex stuff!

[ashen pulsar]

Physically can’t be, she’s stuck in 1999

[velvet cradle]

Do the quest,

Get to rank three and bonds up

And do the finale

[raw stone]

Actually. I'm kinda curious. We've had to deal with the pipeline that DE lets out each project for warframe. But like. How quick does it look to a new player rn? It's like... what War Within to the Apostasy to the New War to the Angels to the Duviri to the Whispers to the 1999?

[eager dragon]

Pretty much

From Rising Tide (the last junction quest) to New War it takes around 4 hours, 5 if you count the crafting time for the Personal Quarters Segment

[raw stone]

Mhmn mhmn.

Wild. We had to deal with what 5 years? No. 7 years of being dripfed this. And to be honest it felt sorta idk if I'd mean it was entirely plausible to take like a few months between events. But the idea of someone speedrunning warframe so far sounds funny. Like:
Tenno, the entirety of the Origin System has gone to the wolves. Get out there and wipe them out. - Lotus

Seriously tho. I beg for some kinda in-universe timeline that isn't just a vague number of events

[pale cedar]

PC in labs

[eager dragon]

Someone completed the entire story in 17 hours

Obviously this is someone who already played Warframe before

But the fact it's possible (and the fact that it wasn't even that much of a speed run so sub 16 hours is probably possible) is hella impressive.

[pale cedar]

Definitely skipped cutscenes

[eager dragon]

Probably, I don't quite remember.

I do know you can get to the New War atleast at around 14 hours or so in I think

Without skipping cutscenes

As I did that in my alt account

But I wasn't the most efficient at it either.

[pale cedar]

Really depends on the player tbh

[stiff isle]

so i was loading into some onslaught for grinding, when this text box popped up, it looked to be orokin writing and one line was red with the others being white

this a bug or lore?

[eager dragon]

A new player would definitely take longer

I'm just bringing it up as a minimum

Compared to what it was before.

[quick bough]

So...what exactly is xaku...isnt it multiple parts of different frames smashed together and run by void magic?

[glacial bough]

They are 3 frames combined, yes

[digital grail]

Lore its something old that from like war within i think

[stiff isle]

ohhh okay so my game isnt gonna die