lore-discussion

[lean garden]

but also because in describing the end of the Old War, Adrian Bott also talks about hiding lua iirc

i need fact check myself brb

And I think all you need to know, really, is that there was an old war, and it was against the Sentients. We know approximately how it began, and we know very much more clearly how it ended, with various, very large scale events, the Sentients destroying the Orokin system end of the solar rail, the whole business about the Sentient attack on Lua, Lua being put into the void… [laughs] It ended in an Orokin victory, and at the celebration, the Tenno turned on them, and so on, and so on.

[red rapids]

what do y'all think about the new tutorial kinda messing up the lore

[dire mountain]

[dire mountain]

Elaborate

[strange turtle]

They made another new tutorial?

Or you mean The Teacher quest?

[red rapids]

i mean the one you get after you start the game for the first time (not the duviri one)

[red rapids]

well, in the old one we were presented as some tuff armor guy that doesn't know a thing of what he is and long after that the game reveals that we're a kid that got exposed to void energy giving us the power to control the warframes, and in the new one, we can see some random kid (probably us?) casually controlling one of the starting warframes just like that

i gotta ask here because i'm tired of discussing this with chatgpt

[red rapids]

oh and in the old one, i think we NEVER see the operator in their actual physical form until that one quest where you get him out of there

(out of lua)

[dire mountain]

That one character is just kinda there. We don't know their deal at all and they never appear outside the cutscene

[lean garden]

plus chatgpt wouldnt be a good source of information because that jaun aint publically available information

[red rapids]

i wasn't asking it for info, i just needed someone to talk

[dire mountain]

Also it makes shit up all the time

[dire mountain]

I'm not taking the low hanging fruit

[lean garden]

anways

we dont know who that was, only that it might be a reference to the/a tenno

it doesnt mess anything up, because its simply not relevant until the second dream

[strange turtle]

Operator isn’t really that big of a spoiler anymore anyway, and tbh the cutscene isn’t too revealing either since I’ve seen people think it was the Lotus

[red rapids]

wait i think i'm onto something lemme think for a bit

[strange turtle]

And it’s like Bau said, we don’t get anything to do with the actual Operator until TSD, a bunch of people probably just forget

[red rapids]

what if that random kid was actually a representation of the lotus waking us up (maybe also the reason why the kid puts lotus flowers in front of the warframes)

hear me out on that

[lean garden]

@strange turtle found one right here

[red rapids]

i mean that kid is obviously not us, and i'm not saying that's literally the lotus there, just a representation of her waking up the tenno

and since he vanishes to never be seen again in the game kinda makes sense

oh wait i was missgendering the kid i think

i lowk forgot how they look

[strange turtle]

It’s Mara, the in-house “Operator” representation and name on the script (Like the Drifter from the trailers), but the bit with the Lotus flowers does represent the Lotus yeah

[red rapids]

never heard of mara before

[strange turtle]

Yeah they’re not an actual character

I don’t remember if it’s even the actual name of the trailer representation? It’s just convenient to call them that

[red rapids]

it would've been kinda cool if that was just a non relevant representation of The Lotus

some spiritual thing

but yeah i'm cool with Mara

[heavy wharf]

Hello tennos, random yap "It builds me up it breaks me down until there's nothing left" so from the lyrics of The Call, I'm assuming this is where DE stands on the ship of Theseus argument. And arguably the Drifter with their cycles, and the Hex by extension, are all Theseuses (Thesi? Like cactus cacti? Anyways) So, I'm arguing that we should all reset the Hex once in a while to ensure they don't get Theseus-ed out of existence (I have no idea where I'm going with this)

[lean garden]

wuh

[eager dragon]

... what did I just read

Are you high?

[heavy wharf]

No, just ... In the mood for yapping my ass off

[modern steppe]

https://tenor.com/view/african-kid-africa-thinking-calculate-hmm-gif-14333456070094555182

[normal mountain]

The plural I would go for is Thesei

[pine orchid]

but isn't Theseus a person's name 😭
it's be ships of Theseus

[tall echo]

Correct

[tall echo]

Nothing SoT about it, that's just what the helminth/techrot does, make you incredibly powerful while subsuming you into the hivemind, erasing what's left of you

Literally "It builds me up it breaks me down until there's nothing left"

[fluid solar]

Yes, it’s a Greek god I believe

[tall echo]

No just a general(iirc) and the original owner of the ship

[fluid solar]

I failed history so I was going off of google and my 2 Bain cells

[tall echo]

I'm going off of a meme about the wikipedia article about the ship of theseus getting ship of theseus'd

But it's a real ship and theseus was a real person

Well. Technically some might say it's not a real ship anymore because every part was replaced

[lean garden]

Fellas did your boat stop being a boat because every part of it was replaced?

[tall echo]

It didn't stop being a ship it's just not the ship of theseus anymore. Or is it?

[heady widget]

Do you think Adis could awaken hunhow

[pale cedar]

Hunhow isn’t asleep

Tyl already woke him up in Natah

[lean garden]

Like during the Old Peace??

[heady widget]

Yes

Idk i get hunhow is not asleep but it does not seem like he did much with his giant body

[lean garden]

?

What are you expecting Hunhow to do during the Old Peace?

[heady widget]

Nothing it's a theoretical question like could green lantern kill superman I don't want that as a comic just can it happen Type of question

[brazen seal]

we have no idea where hunhow, natah and erra actually are in the old peace

[glacial bough]

Natah shouldn't exist

[tall echo]

In the war he did a lot, but in modern times he's stuck

[runic bronze]

ik this is late but yeah fair point, i need to be more supportive to inquiry

[runic bronze]

i thought that's just the indiference

[woven coyote]

With the added context about neci, i just think the song and lyrics of the call just refer to her

[brazen seal]

btw, on the demo at the tauron academy
why the academy only has statues of ballas and you know..... not from the whole seven

[eager dragon]

We don't know and we've only seen a small part, but my theory is that Ballas is the one pushing for this Treaty the most, for whatever selfish reasons, and the Separatists are secretly led by another Seven who has a grudge against him.

[brazen seal]

It would kinda reinforce that this treaty is already the scheme between ballas and hunhow to eliminate the seven and the tenno

[tall echo]

Ballas is very directly connected to warframes and the tenno

[eager dragon]

Yeah, but Tau as a whole was more of a Tuvul thing, so you'd think he would appear as well.

[tall echo]

Maybe he does elsewhere

We saw like one or two hallways

[pale cedar]

Tuvul kinda stopped caring about the Zariman and cut communication

[tall echo]

He didn't stop caring, I'd say he actually cared more before cutting off contact with how much he was seething

[misty salmon]

It felt like a grand entrance hall. If I was an Orokin who cared to have a statue on site I would be personally slighted if it wasn't front and centre. It does feel like this is a Ballas personal project, again.

[tall echo]

Could just be that the orokin with the most work on it gets represented the most, which would be ballas

[turbid merlin]

"The Warframes... All of them... failures. Surprised? They turned on us, just as you did. And so we had no choice but to commit them to grave. This is all you know, Hunhow, but there is a hidden half, a secret, that lies within a place forbidden to you and your kind. I speak of the Void."

[lean garden]

uhuh, and if you look at the next thing ballas says he explains why the void, and then after that he tells hunhow the reservoir is on lua

but lua is not in the void yet

[turbid merlin]

I mean, he literally says it's in the void. I just quoted it to you. "a secret, that lies within a place forbidden to you and your kind"

You can always say he didn't mean it that way, but that is literally what he said.

[brazen seal]

The void in this case are the tenno powers
Not that they are in the void

[turbid merlin]

He wasn't talking about the Tenno powers. He was talking about the location of the Reservoir.

[lean garden]

Ballas: "Before the vain faith, our people held Dualism as truth. That all things were of two parts. Mind and body. Consciousness and matter. Of our world… and the Void. It was from there that our answer finally came."

he was talking about where the tenno came from

[brazen seal]

It's like saying
"They have the power to control the warframes, the void power"

[old dome]

for isleweaver,, was the entire lore shoved into the event that ended a few days ago or...?? bc i havent played in a month...

[lean garden]

its been repackaged into the new node

just that instead of an active threat its an apocryphal threat

[old dome]

the "challenge neci rusalka in triumph of dust" node??

[lilac aspen]

Basically he was explaining the other half of the warframes

The Void-powered Children piloting the frames

[turbid merlin]

Nah, that doesn't make sense with the way he phrased it. The phrasing definitely implies he was saying the Tenno were located in the void.

[lilac aspen]

If Hunhow knew they were in the Void I’d imagine he’d of sent Stalker sooner

[turbid merlin]

I guess it's vaugue enough they can just say that's what they meant, but that's definitely not what it sounds liek they emant.

[pale cedar]

He did know

[lean garden]

It makes perfect sense the way he phrased it

[tall echo]

Yes

[turbid merlin]

I guess if you really wanna ttwist around it it kinda makes sense that he's saying their power to empathize with the Warframes somehow came from the Void, and that could work with his myopic worldview.

[lean garden]

"We got a trick up our sleeves, we got it from the void, we got these kids from the void, and here is where we keep them" thats the flow

[brazen seal]

Do u really think that ballas would give the tenno any credits to anything?

[pale cedar]

Empathy is a normal thing Ballas was saying it wasn’t the Void devilry

[brazen seal]

Ofc he won't say
"The tenno are the answer"

[lean garden]

like Adrian Bott already framed it as such, outer terminus rail destroyed, lua attacked, lua hidden

[turbid merlin]

The Tenno don't "Lie within the void" though. They came from it, but saying they "lie within" it makes no sense. He's using present tense.

[brazen seal]

They're not
They power is

[pale cedar]

"--We had created monsters we couldn't control. We drugged them, tortured them, eviscerated them... we brutalized their minds, but it did not work. Until they came. And it was not their force of will, not their Void devilry, not their alien darkness... it was something else. It was that somehow, from within the derelict-horror, they had learned a way to see inside an ugly broken thing...and take away its pain."

[lilac aspen]

Here’s what I’m concluding

Ballas tells Hunhow about the place
Hunhow sends Erra
Natah Betrayal
Lua goes into the Void
“Mfer, well that sucks” Hunhow snoozes
Waits centuries
Awakens
Gets crippled by explosives so Hunhow can’t do anything
Recruit Stalker since Stalker ain’t poisoned in anyway by the Void
Lotus gets us to drag Lua back into real world so we can get there
Blah Blah Blah Second Dream Quest completed

[turbid merlin]

Sure but he also says "It was that somehow, from within that derelict horror, they had found away to look inside a broken ugly thing, and take away it's pain."

[brazen seal]

Which is the reason that they control warframes

[turbid merlin]

Uh, I probably shoudln't have quoted that from memory

[lilac aspen]

That’s…

That’s empathy

[turbid merlin]

Yeah, he's saying it came from the void.

Because he's ducking Ballas.

[pale cedar]

He’s also being stupid

[lilac aspen]

Because Ballas doesn’t comprehend what a heart is

He does not understand that
“Of course! The children who suffered immensely can relate to other people suffering immensely!”

[pale cedar]

The Void didn’t give us Empathy we already had it the powers just allowed us to use it a different way

[lilac aspen]

He sees it as some
Alien ability rather than just simple human empathy

That’s how distant the Orokin are from the common human

[turbid merlin]

The main reason I don't think it works is that Ballas is using present tense when he says "lies within"" Like he's saying it's currently there, not something they got from the void.

[lilac aspen]

I’m gonna be honest
I think you’re trying to read between lines that aren’t there.

[turbid merlin]

But the idea that he thinks empathy came from the void is super compelling, so I'm kinnda inclined to just ignore it now lol.

[lilac aspen]

It represents how fundamentally different Orokin are from average people

[brazen seal]

Yep
Power gave us the ability to .... View ? Someone's memory
Just like transference ig

And our empathy did the rest

[lean garden]

Thats cuz the source of the Tenno comes from the void, the source of the answer they needed to the Sentient problem came from the Void, but again, Lua hasnt been put into the Void yet

[brazen seal]

Wait
Did we have innate transference since zariman ?
Not like the remote transference that we have rn ofc
But did we ?

[lilac aspen]

Ballas basically says things like “We tried to drug, abuse, control, everything to get the frames to listen. Why tf are they not listening.”

Sees kid use empathy to get the warframe to cooperate.

“WHAT DEVILISH POWER IS THIS?!”

[lean garden]

like I already said, the Lead Writer puts the end of the Old War as such, Outer Terminus Rail is destroyed, lua is attacked and lua is hidden

[lean garden]

yes

[pale cedar]

Transference we did have since the deal Margulis nerfed us though

We didn’t use it till Warframes though

[brazen seal]

Damn
Didn't know that
Cool cool

[lilac aspen]

Yeah
Hunhow sends Erra and in response Natah decides to yeet it into the void to avoid that occurring again

Until Stalker

[turbid merlin]

The funny thing is, he is rational enough to realize it's not some sorta clear "void power" but still believes it's still something that must have come from the void.

Like, 'They aren't shooting them with energy beams to calm them... they're doing something more subtle and unfathomable.'

[lilac aspen]

The funniest thing is we kinda were also the first to introduce kindness to Wally

The first thing the player does
Is offer Wally their flashlight

We are the first person to offer something rather than take

[turbid merlin]

That's also a good point.

[brazen seal]

That's why he gave us his power freely
Trust
dont trust

[lilac aspen]

Wally really did go
“I’m gonna watch these parents kill their chil-“
Offered Flashlight
“..I’m going to give these kids powers so they don’t die.”

[glacial bough]

Probably a bit more deliberate than that.

Most certainly a double whammy of "parents killing kids" and "will kids kill their parents"

If he caused it, of course

[lilac aspen]

Wally was just teaching the kids to do their chores (Murder their insane parents) instead of doing it for them

Taught them more responsibility 100% Trust

[lean garden]

Ballas: "The warframes… all of them… failures. Surprised? They turned on us, just as you did. And so we had no choice… but to commit them to grave. This is all you know, Hunhow, but there is a hidden half, a secret, that lies within a place forbidden to you and your kind. I speak of the Void."

The way the sentence works is that the object of the sentence is "the secret". So "I speak of the Void" refers to the secret

Ballas: "Before the vain faith, our people held Dualism as truth. That all things were of** two parts.** Mind and body. Consciousness and matter. Of our world… and the Void. It was from there that our answer finally came."

From here ballas establishes the dichotomy of Mind and Body, Material and Void, leaning on the "half"

Ballas: "Distorted by vague horrors, we kept the Zariman survivors within a secret Reservoir. They were **the missing half. **Transference-linked: the warframes, the body; and they, the mind. I give you now the coordinates and codes to this place. But do not underestimate these devils, Hunhow. They did what we could not. We had created monsters we couldn't—"

Repeat of the "half" establishing that the secret is the Tenno, while telling hunhow, here are the Cords bozo

[eager dragon]

Kill a kids parents, and they will be depressed and traumatised for a year.
Make the kids kill their parents themself, they will be depressed and traumatised for the rest of their lives.

[lilac aspen]

Making sure they were built diff for the future

The fact Wally wants the Operator
I wonder if it simply wants like

A child

Think about it
Cosmic Brain Melting Entity given the knowledge of our existence because one ant decided to tap on the glass to get its attention

Probably sees the concept of families, despite not having the concept of love as part of them

Then add the fact the Ant decided to cut off some of its fingers by closing the lid on its hand

We took from it
It’s only fair if it takes from us

[lean garden]

woah woah woah

Lets introduce the wonderful topic of

DISPROPORTIONATE RESPONSE

[lilac aspen]

To it that is, to us this is a cosmic entity trying to literally kill us

“they cut three of my fingers so I’m gonna erase them and take the kids that I made into orphans.”

[brazen seal]

btw, the Rusalka dialogue on isleweaver that says

Only two of you. Pity about all the rest.
doesn't it imply that we actually ended the eternalism on that scene on the new war where the drifter and operator shake hands leaving only both of them ?

[eager dragon]

I assumed it just means out of all realities only the Operator and Drifter survived the Zariman, no?

[lilac aspen]

That probably explains the weird scene of multiple drifters collapsing before it only shows Operator and Drifter

[lean garden]

operators

[brazen seal]

Or maybe wally killed all of them ?

[lean garden]

not drifters

[eager dragon]

They would have gone insane in the Void regardless, I think.

[pale cedar]

There is only 1 Drifter

[eager dragon]

Either that or their parents would kill them

[lilac aspen]

Throughout the entirety
Only two outcomes that weren’t death

And ironically both only survived because of the Void, except one was Wally giving powers and the other because they managed to Delulu Duviri into existence

[brazen seal]

Wait
If drifter shaked hands with operator of another timeline before us
Would our operator that we play with die ?

[pale cedar]

Drifter probably survived in part to the Operators killing the parents then Duviri being created

[lilac aspen]

What if we did die? And our Operator is only a different one
You’d never know, Kiddo.

[brazen seal]

Alright this is going too much into the What if scenarios

[lilac aspen]

What if
Wally was just jealous Drifter rizzed everyone but them

[eager dragon]

Romanceable Wall of Lohk when DE?

[lilac aspen]

Actually pause
Because Wally did offer that

In the Isles

[pale cedar]

“I can be your lover”

[lilac aspen]

DE make it happen where one option of dialogue towards Wally is just Rizz attempts

[eager dragon]

Honestly don't know how reliable that is though 'cause he's clearly influenced by Neci.

[eager dragon]

Yes, please, I need this!

[lilac aspen]

Sol, balance, Lua dialogue? Nah
Rizz, Friend, Hate dialogue?

[latent timber]

Soooooooooo what are the odds Uriel was an operator they decided to inject with a helminth strain?

[lean garden]

extremely low

[latent timber]

The hood looks awful operator-y, adversaries constantly refer to the operator as a devil and it would be one of the Orokin's more.. Extreme things, hence the "Can they be forgiven?" thing.

[lean garden]

the hood?

You mean the head? That doesnt look like the operator hood?

[latent timber]

Devil frame's helm looks very like the default operator hood.

[lean garden]

It doesnt

[latent timber]

In what world is that not reminiscent.

[thick vault]

The devil frame's helmet looks somewhat similar to that of the Zealoid boss's head if you think about it since I got a closer look at the devil frame's head

[lean garden]

in the world where they do not share the same design silhouette

[latent timber]

Oh yeah the prelate exists.

[lean garden]

The game also exposits through the KIM that the Drifter (and thus operator) are immune to the infestation

Salem: I could come up with a dozen different reasons why we shouldn’t be together, and you’d have an answer for every one of them. Oh, what if I infect you? You’re immune. What if I try to eat you? You’re functionally immortal. What if I see inside your head? I’m sure you’d just kick me out again.

Salem: Sol. Here I am feeling sorry for myself for being a plague victim, and dumping on you for being immune, and you’ve seen whole worlds get eaten by the selfsame poxy crud.

[latent timber]

🤔 Sadness.

(I do not speak to Eleanor. Nor will I ever.)

[thick vault]

Though I did take a look at the sentient heads in the codex and.. the Zariman hood when closed looks actually similar to that of a sentient's head part or what is considered a head where their eyes are located. It does predate there being a coworksmanship on the Zariman outfit designs and certain frame designs in the past before the Old War ever happened between Sentient and Orokin

[astral sparrow]

Something I just noticed when looking at this. I see 4 languages in the ring of text corpus grinner and oroken. But what's the 4th?

[thick vault]

Could be Tau (Sentient). Cause it's definitely not Ostron

[lean garden]

got a bigger image?

I cant even make out the orokin script

[thick vault]

Solari.... as in Solaris?

[astral sparrow]

Not trusting this wiki anymore but I can't find it on the new one yet.

Same markings

[astral sparrow]

Neeet glad they figured it out

Guess I should have guessed it was saying something about arllo. That little scumbag

Guess there is 5 languages neet

[rich stump]

You’re missing out tbh (I say as an Eleanor simp)

[tall echo]

Why tho

[tall echo]

You are aware that neet and neat are not the same yes?

[latent timber]

The vibes just aren't vibing.

[proper barn]

Why? She's great.

[tall echo]

How do you know that if you never talk to her

[latent timber]

I mean I did during the quest? I don't know, am I contractually obligated to like every hex character?

I also can't stand Keanu Reeves. Maybe I become Uriel.

[astral sparrow]

Dyslexia tends to make that an issue

[tall echo]

Ok you're just being contrarian for the sake of it

[tall echo]

Ah

[latent timber]

Is it really so hard to just accept that not everyone like every popular person?

[tall echo]

It's hard to believe that anyone can dislike keanu reeves

[proper barn]

It's cuz you didn't try to like at least understand Eleanor.

[tall echo]

Though he is an underwhelming voice actor

[latent timber]

I do understand her.

[proper barn]

You don't have to like Keanu Reeves.

[latent timber]

Not me out here thinking his role in the Matrix and 2077 was his best work.

Lore-wise: I love Flare?

[tall echo]

His delivery on almost every line in 2077 is incredibly monotonous imo

[leaden goblet]

Hello fellow tenno. I have a question since I have seen a replay from the sacrifice snd the Chimera Prologye. ||How did Ballas went from being a puppet and yearn for Natah's death (giving us the Paracesis... To being the Master behind all?) i have to admit that I have just recently come back to the game so I did not play any of the missions that came with each part of the Prologue||

[pale cedar]

https://tenor.com/view/its-all-a-lie-lie-mislead-false-inaccuracy-gif-12849382

[restive river]

^
Ballas is a liar lol

[sly pagoda]

Xanatos Gambit

Ballas was running successful cartoon villain levels of planning

[peak ether]

They were working together, and that whole ballas becoming subservient to him was just a ruse to get the sentient forces through Natah

[sly pagoda]

Until the drifter came along and threw a monkey wrench into the gears, everything was on track.

He was playing a very long game

[peak ether]

Then he decided that because the thing that took the form of his former lover also didn’t love him enough to choose him over the Tenno (basically got cucked by the Tenno twice), he didn’t want to live in a solar system where he took generational Ls and wanted to destroy it

[leaden goblet]

Did Ballas play the operator too by giving them the Paracesis? I'm still confused why he would give the sentient slayer weapon to his enemy

[brazen seal]

Ballas had 400/600 years to plan his defection from orokin

• Idk how long to plan to get Lotus for himself
  Drifter appears:
  

[peak ether]

To sell the whole “I made a mistake in tricking her so you need something to help take her down” and make it seem like he’s completely lost all power

[sly pagoda]

Drifter showing up like John McClane from an air vent.

[leaden goblet]

... Well I be damned. Thank you guys

[brazen seal]

Just like ballas showed up in the apostasy prologue

[sly pagoda]

At least the drifter did not send Ballas the last archon’s corpse with a sweater saying “Ho Ho Ho, I have a warframe”.

[misty salmon]

Ordis is taking up knitting

just as soon as he finds some hands

[restive river]

Also so we would take that very weapon with us

[peak ether]

Yeah that whole bit you had to read into it quite a bit, in one of the prologues erra drops the leash and ballas fixes his posture which implies they were faking the whole thing

[peak ether]

Wdym?

Oh to use against lotus if he needed it?

[restive river]

Ye

We bring it during the new war

Where Ballas proceeds to damage lotus and stab us

And ofc we bring it to confront him at the end of the new war iirc

[misty salmon]

I think it was technically "loadout optional", but very heavilly telegraphed that we should bring it... and he just finds a spare if we don't.

[silk atlas]

The original intent was that Paracesis would've been a required craft to progress in the story, but then people whined because they never grinded for Ducats in their entire life for some reason

[peak ether]

Iirc it wasn’t optional you needed to bring it to TNW, I wanted to go umbra excal skiajati for the full cinematic experience but it wouldn’t let me

[silk atlas]

You did not need to bring it. The decision to make it NOT required for TNW was long before the quest even came out.

[restive river]

You have it during tnw no matter what

[silk atlas]

That too

[restive river]

Like you can’t uneuip it
You just have it during

[sly pagoda]

I mean 1000 ducks is a lot for one thing.

Mind that people playing straight through the MSQ probably do not have enough relics to make 1000 ducks.

I did eventually farm up moneysword though. Did use the loaner for TNW though.

[surreal ermine]

I saw it in tiktok went to check it out and got 2000

[strange turtle]

Somehow I think you might be biased. Just a tad.

[iron tiger]

Alad v mentions that the Tenno got close to the sentients and brought the orokin down right?

So what if

The sentients were there during the massacre

But some conspiracy led them to hate the whole system again

[glacial bough]

The Sentients can't be

[humble sierra]

The massacre began on the day the Orokin celebrated the Tenno for winning against the Sentients

[hidden cove]

What is 'the Manifold'?

[hidden cove]

Its hilarious that it's Ballas' weapon that he acts like is the only thing that can kill Sentients or something and he tricks you into building it, bringing it to him, then ||stabs the Operator with it||

It could just as easily have been, Ballas still had the Paracesis and we get a built one for free after completing TNW like Broken War after TSD

[limber prism]

Seems like you guys know the lore

So I have a question. How in the actual hell did we time travel back to 1999, and how did the infested boy band time travel forward?

Everything else I’ve been able to figure out on my own EXCEPT THAT

[strange plinth]

second question first: the long way

[limber prism]

You’re telling me Onlyne went underground for 3000 years then suddenly showed up JUST as we need them to be?

[strange plinth]

we don't know how exactly albrecht went back in time, but we follow him because the helminth existed in 1999 and the current era. it's not really affected by time in the same way we are, so we basically told it to send a basic excalibur to the past while we were transferred into it, afaik at least

[limber prism]

Gotcha

[strange plinth]

they're tracking your "void-saturated dna"
so you show up on their radar, and they become active again

[limber prism]

…god I hate time travel.

[sly pagoda]

“Tell me doctor, where are we going this time. Is it the ‘50s, Or 1999” Huey Lewis, Back to the Future soundtrack.

[strange plinth]

yeah
at least we avoid paradoxes with it here though !
those make it considerably more complex

[sly pagoda]

Time Travel can get messy yes

[limber prism]

Time travel always gets messy

Hell, when I was writing a story, I was actively trying to avoid any time travel shenanigans with it

[sly pagoda]

Especially when you travel by worm mouth like the drifter did. instead of a poorly built stainless steel car from Northern Ireland.

That had to be actually messy

Of course keep in mind we are mixing time travel and a Groundhog Day loop.

[limber prism]

Still makes me cackle a little bit

||Drifter|| escapes a paradoxical time loop…only to create another one.

[sly pagoda]

Though at least this time they are the one in full control of it.

[limber prism]

Kinda? Who knows what Wally is doing behind the scenes, especially with 1999 lady currently sitting on a toy man’s throne

[strange plinth]

wally's puppetting Neci around currently
so there's not a huge amount 'in the background'

[rich badge]

i understood it to be that Drifter is sort of out of the loop and not affected by the memory thing, allowing them to change things to try to get the 'good ending'

[strange plinth]

yeah, drifter has multiple lines showing that they remember even if no one else does

[glacial bough]

That'd be because he's directly in control

[iron tiger]

Pretty sure it’s some kind of womb for the sentients

[hidden cove]

Ah, cool

[dapper nova]

that is definitely a way to put it

[fallen iris]

What came first

The prime or the base

[mystic lynx]

wheres that audio from?

[silk atlas]

Varzia

[fallen iris]

Ig caliban was a prime first

Because it says that og caliban was created by era

[silk atlas]

Caliban's alt helm mentions him being used in The Old War so we'll have to see where The Old Peace falls into this

[fallen iris]

Also what’s with Xaku prime

How does them exist?

We didn’t even get a prime trailer of them

[mystic lynx]

Albrecht found Xaku and think damn thats cool (at least thats the current theory)

[silk atlas]

Could've just been made after Xaku came back

[fallen iris]

Warframe lore has gotta be up there with Star Wars imo

Shit is gas

[mystic lynx]

is the old peace some kind of alt dimension/timeline? it is my understanding that the timeline is Old War > Fall of the Orokin > Current Stuff how does tenno and sentient being friends fit in here?

[fallen iris]

Nah

It’s just the past

There was a war then peace then war again

From what I understand

I could be wrong so don’t quote me

[mystic lynx]

so its sentient goes to tau > war > peace > Balls tomfoolery > war again with sentient

[manic oxide]

is that Excalibur prime not in current timeline but it was experimented into a Umbra which operator has in current timeline and he will get visions when using it of Old peace

[strange plinth]

most likely

[strange plinth]

umbra was a dax solider prior to being warframe'd

[misty salmon]

nah, Excal Prime is existent, it's just in far shorter supply.

[manic oxide]

What if War between Dax and Excalibur does some Have link won't they be replaced
in teaser we saw them

[misty salmon]

We'll get to use an excal prime during the historical quest (unless they change their minds before release), but I doubt it will be available outside of it. DE has been very consistent with the few times they've done limited release items.

[fallen iris]

Excal prime is cool

But umbra is cooler

[misty salmon]

Umbra was a unique thing, do we know why Ballas was so pissed with that one particular Dax?

[strange plinth]

discovered that ballas was going to betray the orokin

[misty salmon]

Hmm, that might actually make him relevant in the Old Peace then.

[fallen iris]

The sacrifice quest was so good bro

Love how we found out what warframes actually are

[mystic lynx]

does umbra count as protoframe then at some point?

[dense nest]

no umbra after warframe

[steel compass]

Cuz he knew too much

[dense nest]

ballas make umbra for warframe that orokin can control

[steel compass]

I mean, every organic OG warframe was a protoframe until they weren't anymore

[strange plinth]

eh
the protos' transformations are slowed a lot compared to regular frames

[misty salmon]

A proto-protoframe perhaps... I don't think the retention of sentience/personality was entirely intended. Albrect may have learned from the process in developing his method though.

[strange plinth]

umbra's sentience was fully intended
"single, burning memory" n all that
the protos also had to not go mad for the time albrecht needed them

[manic oxide]

Just wish for Umbral or Sacrificial mods expansion

but they didn't said anything means not relevant

we might need this mod configs as its (Tau )
it is tau faction mod

[misty salmon]

I feel Umbra was at most intended to be a "I Have No Mouth" thing... forever trapped with that memory, but unable to act of his own accord. That he could display his personality and act independently was an accident.

[fringe moth]

Was lotus always standing here?

[dense nest]

Yes after certain point prolog for 1999

After or during lotus eater iirc

[fringe moth]

Hmm

I thought it was just the 1999 kim thingy

[dense nest]

Before , it just the phone on the ground.

[restive river]

Pager

[swift sentinel]

After Lotus Eaters is when she shows up there

[swift sentinel]

Until we get a proper timeline, my guess is that Caliban was Primed as a show of cooperation between the Orokin and the Sentients.

[iron tiger]

Are some warframes white and others black for a lore reason. How come there is only 1 umbra but al l these primes

[dire mountain]

No they just look like that

[iron tiger]

Would it be valid to rename some warframes umbras

[iron tiger]

😭

[dire mountain]

No because excalibur umbra is a specific case that was for a specific dax ballas wanted to torture

[iron tiger]

Will there be more umbras in the future?

[mystic lynx]

unlikely

[modern steppe]

No

[dire mountain]

There's not a lore reason wisp prime is green

She just is

[swift sentinel]

Umbra appears to be what the Dax that Ballas turned into was called. The concept art shows him with extra U shaped decorations in his Dax armour

[stiff fable]

confirmed no

Mostly because players dislike the mechanic and DE can't fix it

[dense nest]

what player want umbra accessories aka the scarf

[astral island]

Where can I learn the lore of missions I am doing? I find it hard to pay attention to them while I'm getting shot or worrying about my loot but my friend told me some stuff and I am very interested in learning. I don't mean the general stuff (that my friend told me) I mean the missions I'm doing and the plotlines of the missions and stuff, is there a youtube channel covering it or something?

[iron tiger]

Do you mean quests?

Try stallordD on YouTube

There’s also xayl who is a little outdated but should still hold up

[stiff fable]

There aren't a lot of good loretubers for Warframe, partially because so much of the lore is deliberately vague or goes over people's heads.

Best way to pick up what you missed? Orokin Archives has the text of every quest

orokinarchives.com/

[strange plinth]

i think they are talking about the standard exterminate/spy/whatever missions?
which. there's not much? basically just whatever lotus is saying as you run through the first few rooms
other than assassinations, which have a little more
i could also be wrong about that assumption tho

[iron tiger]

As captain said they should be taken with a grain of salt I’ve been playing since 2018 and still find some stuff hard to follow

[astral island]

I see, thanks a lot I'll give StallordD, xayl and the Orokin Archives a look

[iron tiger]

How far are you in the game by the way

[astral island]

I think I just finished my first quest to get the bomb out of me

[stiff fable]

oh lord yeah okay stay away from the loretubers

youtube's algorithm will feed you ALL the spoilers

[astral island]

I know the general stuff about the army of clones, the orokin, tau, the man in the wall, some warframes lore, the operator

I want to go somewhere I can learn "what is this quest I'm doing" or what is its place in the general story, I just have a hard time focusing in game

[strange plinth]

story doesn't really pick up until uranus/neptune
so if you're looking for specifics, that's where to head

[iron tiger]

You know its bad when he calls the escaris a bomb

[stiff fable]

.>

[iron tiger]

Make sure to scan cephalon fragments, and generally just anything by using Helios

A lot of lore comes from scanning

Cephalon simaris has a whole set of enemies you need to track down multiple times to get some thick chunks of lore

[astral island]

I started the game because of the Starfinder AP announcement too so I want to get the lore for the protoframes but as far as I know that is super late game

[iron tiger]

Yeah homie that might take a couple months to get to

[strange plinth]

months if you pace yourself
you can absolutely get there in a week

[iron tiger]

Truth

But don’t burn yourself out warframe can be one of those games fr

Focus on what’s fun

[stiff fable]

one of my friends who burned out came back because of The Old Peace

though he still hasn't done The Hex yet

[iron tiger]

That’s because that update looks fire 😮‍💨

[brazen seal]

Big sword

[iron tiger]

Even the new teshin quest sounds good and it not even old peace

[brazen seal]

That's the reason

[stiff fable]

might take my Switch 2 over to his place and bully him into doing it finally

[strange plinth]

real

[astral island]

I play a lot of arknights so I know what I like. Building characters, so my gameplay is probably going to be:
look a new warframe
farm new warframe to its max potential
search the next one and only use this one to farm the next

[iron tiger]

Madurai chest laser has to comeback too hopefully

[stiff fable]

PS Warframe on Switch 2 looks super weird

I know it's because it's not a native version but wow

[iron tiger]

If you’re focus is diversity: get lavos(underground), gauss (really popular), wisp(really popular), frost or limbo or gara for defensive playstyles, Ivara for sneakies

If you want to litterally just nuke everything get Saryn or mesa

[astral island]

my bff is going to give me a tour through all of her frames tomorrow. Right now my most interested are citrine, jade, garuda and titania

though Idk how fast I can get most of these

[strange plinth]

garuda mention
now if only DE would mention her lore,,,

[stiff fable]

Jade is ultra endgame

[iron tiger]

What playstyles are you looking for?

[stiff fable]

Citrine is early game but takes forever to farm

[iron tiger]

I also think it should be noted ivara is great for fishing

[limpid crane]

Is it wrong to say that in a sense the sentients actions were kinda justified

[stiff fable]

no

basically every Warframe player agrees that the Orokin had to be destroyed

The problem is that the Sentients wanted every human exterminated, not just the Orokin

[sly pagoda]

The farther down some rabbit holes you go the worse the Orokin become.

But yeah the Sentients were going to go full skynet.

I do ponder if the sentients even considered using their mimics to plant seeds of rebellion instead. Though an uprising would have been hard given just how rooted the golden lords had their rule.

[limpid crane]

That's also probably one of the factors that made them decide to kill all humans. If I remember correctly the tenno are human not orokin so maybe us as a human killing a sentient/adis's family was one of the final pushes that made the sentients decide all humans/orokin are bad.

Idk I could be completely wrong

[lean garden]

I mean, the Orokin are also human

[limpid crane]

Wasn't the whole point about the orokin that they ascended above being human or atleast what they consider human

[normal mountain]

It's like the old geometry saying:
A square is always a rectangle, but a rectangle is not always a square

[lean garden]

Orokin being squares is apt

[limpid crane]

Or whatever shape ashes are 💀

[stiff fable]

yeah that's exactly it, but the Sentients rejected that distinction

[sly pagoda]

I ponder if in the future we will fight that giant sentient the Hunhullus with one of the vessels.

[pine orchid]

that would be cool, giant fistfight!! Xd

[stray herald]

Are the orokin just the seven who so happens to be blue or does it include other high ranking individuals outside of the seven?

[strange turtle]

It’s a caste

The Seven are just the highest up of all the Orokin

[humble sierra]

Citrine is a bit of a grind but can be earned right after Deimos. Jade can't be unlocked until after her quest, which is after the 'New War' (one of the later quests in the game).

Garuda can be earned after Fortuna (Venus), but is a bit tough to grind for.

Titania is fairly easy to unlock, you get all of her stuff in one quest

[lean garden]

Theres the Seven, consisting of the Executors Ballas, Tuvul, Nihil, and potentially Executors Aventus and Karishh

And then theres more Orokin, consisting of the entire Entrati Family, and even the Grineer Queens

[swift sentinel]

Earliest Frame you unlock is Gara, but Koumei is probably an easier grind and only a tiny bit later.

[tall echo]

Like a few minutes later at most

[hidden cove]

I never realised that Gara and Koumei are the earliest Warframes you would be able to get in the game after starting off

I have been playing since before either were added, so it never hit me when exactly in progression they were

[swift sentinel]

Koumei even has a shorter craft time as a starter Frame, same with Rhino

[hidden cove]

I hope DE give all frames main bps a 24h craft time

Keep Primes at 72h

The time gating is definitely a factor in player loss (quitting) early on

[swift sentinel]

Gara is behind Cetus bounties so is probably beyond people who are brand new, but Shrine Defence is pretty easy.

[hidden cove]

Aye, so Koumei would be the easiest and fastest Warframe to get

Of course they make the literal gambler the first Warframe new players can pick up after starting 😭

[sly ibex]

This sounds like something that would be good to suggest on the forums! I like the idea, as well. 😄

[hidden cove]

It's a great medium

Mitigate the issue where players quit because they have to wait half a week to get a new 'character', while also keeping the formula for the more powerful versions of each Warframe

The people who have the patience to farm Prime Warframes definitely have the patience to wait 72 hours to use it

[lilac aspen]

Clearly slipped and fell into some fungus

…
The Fungus Frame buried her

[pastel violet]

and what about Equinox? 👀

[hidden cove]

In that case I hope they either remove the Aspects shit, or move Equinox to a less time consuming boss

Equinox Prime doesn't have a separate day/night parts and aspects. Equinox base can be changed

[pastel violet]

the prime have only 4 blueprints not one for day and another for night

[brittle siren]

hey could someone help me go into isleweaver to take the final fragment?

it's in the undercroft and... it really high up so I can't take it solo

[strange turtle]

Tbh the aspects bp stuff should just be removed either way

[pastel violet]

hummmm 10 seconds for take it its impossible

[brittle siren]

could you join me

1 more person is enough

[pastel violet]

ok, lets do it . btw do you find the 3 corpses? i don't know if there are more

[brittle siren]

I only found Loid

[eager dragon]

It's possible in solo, I took all the fragments in solo, but yeah, you have to know every spot

[brittle siren]

ign pls

[pastel violet]

invite, same user as here

[brittle siren]

@pastel violet thank you for showing me

wait so how can I get Velimir and Minerva secret chat

I interact will all 3 corpse

nvm

Pom 2 not show up on screen but when access it show new msg

[pastel violet]

wait ? we change the KIM for interact with the corpses?

[wanton mauve]

Do we know where Nora is? Or, do people have speculations on where she probably broadcasts from?

[pale cedar]

We don’t

Not even Narmer could find her

[dense nest]

most likely always on the move using nightwave landing craft

[open ember]

Was the blinded lotus actually in the teaser for the old peace update

Wait yeah wth is this 😭

[brazen seal]

I believe is just an operator's trauma bc of what happened

[open ember]

Didn't the tenno blind margulis in lore but she kept caring for them?

[eager dragon]

Yes

[idle current]

the amount of people that didn't know about this before the trailer surprises me, glad people are getting educated on the lore

[tall echo]

On her landing craft, flying about

[brazen seal]

until not long ago I didn't know that the zariman were created after the sentients were sent to tau

[eager dragon]

That review... I still can't believe the Orokin are that stupid

[brazen seal]

btw

the sentients were sent to Tau
by which means ?

bc natah was born at Tau
if the sentients went to Tau by the void, natah wouldn't exist

[eager dragon]

I believe it was sub-light travel, no? 'Cause they can't access the Void without becoming infertile

[brazen seal]

yea, that's the point
probably
that's why it prob took so long

and the zariman project happened

[eager dragon]

And they were building a line of Solar Rails while flying so that consequent travel was faster

[eager dragon]

Yeah, but making a whole new project just to try and make the previous one way less important (if not entirely redudant 'cause the rails are pretty useful) is so... stupid

[brazen seal]

so the sentients travel gave enough time for the zariman to happen
the kids being rescued
and being taken cared by margulis

[tall echo]

The long way

[brazen seal]

considering that they were imortal at that time
pretty much

[eager dragon]

Assuming the review wasn't just phrased poorly

[stiff fable]

I still think that's the most likely answer lol

[brazen seal]

I hope this holds as true
so I can assume the old peace happened before the Lua's attack

[eager dragon]

I mean, based on the stars it might be Sirius (rather than Tau Ceti as assumed), which would be 8.6 Light Years, so sub-light would take... quite a while, yeah

[pale cedar]

Zariman went first

[brazen seal]

no it didn't

[pale cedar]

Yes it did

Sentients weren’t even the second attempt

[eager dragon]

There was a review recently that said that the Zariman happened while the Sentients were traveling

[brazen seal]

unless in the interview they mispeak
not they didn't

[eager dragon]

Hopefully just a poor choice of words

[pale cedar]

The Zariman returned after the Sentients were built that’s all

That’s what that’s saying

[eager dragon]

That doesn't make sense in the context of the text though

It says that the other factions got impatient

So Zariman was built

[brazen seal]

and what do u have to base what u saying ?
that's literally the head of the narrative of warframe saying

[eager dragon]

And then the Zariman never got there*

[pale cedar]

Sentients wouldn’t have been needed if Zariman didn’t fail

Zariman had terraforming tech

[brazen seal]

^

[eager dragon]

Yeah. The Orokin are just that stupid

[tall echo]

Also the synthesis entry for the origin of sentients says countless other ventures failed before

[brazen seal]

it doesn't especifically say abt the zariman tho

[eager dragon]

Which is why I hope that this is a simply poorly worded

As it stands

[pale cedar]

Sentients weren’t a second attempt as many make it out to be or a first

[eager dragon]

This is newer info and as such is more likely to be true

[brazen seal]

btw
I'm pretty sure that the zariman incident
the orokin deleted EVERYTHING abt it
just left the tenno alive

[eager dragon]

And we must just assume that their were other projects we don't know about

[brazen seal]

and this has ingame base

so ofc it wouldn't be on that imprint

[tall echo]

They tried to cover it up by calling it a military ship

[pale cedar]

Also isn’t Adrian the guy who in the Reddit ama didn’t know anything about Fortuna?

[tall echo]

Which is. Certainly fascinating considering the whole zariman sendoff parade thing

[tall echo]

Also it says zahriman

[pale cedar]

I’ve literally never seen anyone spell it as Zahriman lol

[tall echo]

Well it's better than zaramin tbh

At least it's phonetically similar

[pale cedar]

I want me some Zarimen

[tall echo]

I want zarimen and zariwomen

[pale cedar]

Actually that brings up a question are Tenno immune to diseases and stuff

[tall echo]

Well this is a weird way to learn that there apparently isn't a pan emoji

[limber prism]

Certainly seems to be considering Eleanor and Drifter argue about it

[eager dragon]

They are immune to the infestation atleast, so maybe?

[pale cedar]

They argue about it? Got the conversation?

[limber prism]

It was a KIM chat, and I’m not sure if there’s an archive about those

[pale cedar]

Kimulacrum has them

[tall echo]

The convos also do get archived in game under the clock symbol in the KIM profiles

[eager dragon]

Only about the infestation, I think

[frosty latch]

what is that?

[eager dragon]

Ventkid grafiti, I think

[tall echo]

Yes

[pine orchid]

reminds me a lot of roky! :p

[iron tiger]

Does anyone have any weird and or obscure warframe lore

[pale cedar]

Albrechts notes are technically obscure

[strange turtle]

Titanium was exploited so much by the Orokin it can’t be mined from planets anymore, only found in asteroids and such

[iron tiger]

Woah that is weird and obscure

I wonder if the gold we see on lua is a titanium alloy

[violet storm]

Ventkid graffiti.

[sly ibex]

Oddly, it's really only the Operator who witnessed the Infestation devouring planets and such. Drifter only sees the aftermath in the present.

[violet storm]

Isn’t the Drifter the version of the operator Ballas sent to the void?

Or am I forgetting/missing something

[misty salmon]

Drifter is the version of the operator who didn't take Wally's "deal" but instead escaped into/constructed Duviri and survived anyway.

[violet storm]

Oh

Yeah

[eager dragon]

Pretty sure the Drifter took the deal though

Just wasn't saved by Wally

There was a zariman tablet in Duviri

[stiff fable]

Small correction but Drifter DID take the deal, Wally just "exact words" 'd them

[eager dragon]

That said "I promised I would save all of them, not you" or something along those lines

Don't remember the exact words

[lilac aspen]

“Save all of Them”

Wally:

https://tenor.com/view/asgore-undertale-deltarune-gif-8006577193793263180

[glad yoke]

How would captain vor be classed as in powrrscaling discussions

[stiff fable]

Depends, Janus Vor?

He eats entire Warframe kill teams for breakfast

[brazen seal]

vor u say ?

Look at them, they come to this place when they know they are not pure.

[glad yoke]

I'm talking about captain vor at the point where you fight him in the starchart

[distant ivy]

So guys i have a question, Margulis is the original caretaker of the tenno, then later she was killed by the seven, then Natah replaced her ?

[glad yoke]

Is janus vor the void vor in the circuit or the secret hard mode vor from his bossfight

[stiff fable]

Hard mode

[stiff fable]

Yes

[distant ivy]

So then whats the whole thing about her losing her eyes specifically being gouged by the tenno

and Lotus covering her eyes aswell in her fake form

[glad yoke]

So is Janus vor at least above street tier if we're using powerscaling terms

[distant ivy]

to mimic her ?

[glad yoke]

Idk the full powerscaling terminology

[stiff fable]

While she was our caretaker, the Tenno lost control of their power and destroyed her eyes

[lilac aspen]

Look at them, they come to this place when they know they are not pure. Tenno use the keys, but they are mere trespassers. Only I, Vor, know the true power of the Void. I was cut in half, destroyed, but through it's Janus Key, the Void called to me. It brought me here and here I was reborn. We cannot blame these creatures, they are being led by a false prophet, an impostor who knows not the secrets of the Void. Behold the Tenno, come to scavenge and desecrate this sacred realm. My brothers, did I not tell of this day? Did I not prophesize this moment? Now, I will stop them. Now I am changed, reborn through the energy of the Janus Key. Forever bound to the Void. Let it be known, if the Tenno want true salvation, they will lay down their arms, and wait for the baptism of my Janus key. It is time. I will teach these trespassers the redemptive power of my Janus key. They will learn it's simple truth. The Tenno are lost, and they will resist. But I, Vor, will cleanse this place of their impurity

[sly pagoda]

The tenno had issues controlling the void beam and accidentally blinded her.

[distant ivy]

thqt didnt kill her right? so she just became blind

[stiff fable]

Personally I think it was Rell who did it because it explains a few things

But yeah exactly

[lilac aspen]

Man something came over me, I don’t know what possessed me to immediately post that

[distant ivy]

is Lotus's design covering her eyes on purpose to mimic this ?

[stiff fable]

Lotus covers her eyes to emulate that, yes

[sly pagoda]

I hold a theory that amps are partially about control of that energy flow.

[distant ivy]

Alright thanks !

[sly pagoda]

They act as a regulator like how cyclops in the xmen has that visor.

[stiff fable]

It's interesting to think about but amps are made of sentient bits too

[brazen seal]

isn't said somewhere that amps is used to channel our void power tho

so we can do what we do with the amps

[distant ivy]

how much of our energy is supressed then

[stiff fable]

Yeah, Onkko spells it out

[stiff fable]

So uh. The void is an infinite energy source.....

[brazen seal]

infinite energy sauce

[stiff fable]

Yum tastes like raspberries

[distant ivy]

[brazen seal]

dw, it's the rule to do that once vor is mentioned
it is not

[lilac aspen]

Amps basically let us output VOID better without like

Vaporizing everyone in a multiple meter radius to achieve the same effects

It’s basically a magnifying glass for the sun, so the sun doesn’t have to burn brighter.

[stiff fable]

Theoretically I feel any Tenno could be a second Heart of Deimos

..... which is very bad because that's a portal wide open to the Void

[lilac aspen]

It’s why it’s kinda made of salvaged Sentient parts and stuff since the Sentients are the only creatures that managed to traverse the Void without instant death/insanity and only lost the ability to reproduce from said trip

[stiff fable]

Oh, no, other way around

The Sentients are EXTRA WEAK to the Void

Like, if they step into the Void they're instantly melted vs. people who just get burned

[misty salmon]

I thought it was the rule to never let him actually finish the entire monologue because vaguely defined bad things might happen.

[stiff fable]

They're even weak to normal void travel through solar rails

They only survived because Praghasa took the damage for them by growing huge and it still sterilized all of them

[lilac aspen]

Probably then it’s modified Sentient remains. Since the Orokin deliberately added this design weakness

[stiff fable]

Very possible

There's an extra curiosity with the Archons, since their shards are "anti-entropic"

And from what we can tell the Murmur aka Wally's "body" is a thing of pure entropy

[lilac aspen]

Entropic means state of disorder, randomness, or decay

Therefore Anti-Entropic is just
L i f e

[iron tiger]

Not really

Entropy is a confusing concept

Entropy can also mean like things aren’t separated into order

Life exists because the universe isn’t perfectly chaotic or perfectly ordered

[lilac aspen]

In physics Entropy is basically things like ice melting
Body breaking down from age
It is, in the best way without mass confusion

End

[stiff fable]

It's energy going from usable states to unusable states

Charcoal to smoke etc

[lilac aspen]

Which causes disorder and chaos because think from a state of matter idea

It’s pretty chaotic watching a solid (ice) destabilize into a liquid (water) and then further destabilize into a gas (evaporation)

[iron tiger]

I think we might all be correct

[stiff fable]

More or less, they're all different parts of the same concept

[iron tiger]

I think the thermodynamic definition is the one archon shards refer to the most

It’d make the most sense

Radiation isn’t necessarily anti-life

It can produce it too

[lilac aspen]

Radiation is more of “Energy emitting”

We emit radiation, we radiate heat.

[iron tiger]

Oh yeah good point

[lilac aspen]

Anti-Entropic Radiation is essentially saying “This crystal emitting an energy that does the opposite of entropy.”

[iron tiger]

The opposite of entropy being making energy that does stuff

[stiff fable]

But also gives out more energy than it took in, perhaps?

[lilac aspen]

It’s granting a “Start” rather than an “End”

[iron tiger]

As in like exothermic or like literally producing more energy

[violet storm]

And thus is why we get stronger with each one used

[lilac aspen]

Which is why it’s weird in function and why dear god Natah needing Three to come back from Eldion-state

[stiff fable]

Oh God I just realized

Adis has to be an archon

[brazen seal]

huh

[stiff fable]

He did the same thing to that Conculyst

[lilac aspen]

Nah I think he just a Sentient who’s purpose was to be a medic

[misty salmon]

anti-entropic would imply it is capable of producing energy without affecting its own state... no radioactive decay, no loss of temperature towards the mean, etc.

[stiff fable]

Yeah, but how does that work?

The Conculyst was dead, and then he brought it back

[violet storm]

I think the conculyst was just too damaged to function right

[iron tiger]

Are you saying the flower grew a mini archon shard as an anther?

[violet storm]

Less dead, more incapacitated

[lilac aspen]

Hunhow himself states “Death” is different for Sentients compared to humans anyways

[iron tiger]

Death leaves a mark even for them

[lilac aspen]

So either it was just severely incapacitated or dead but not “dead enough”

[stiff fable]

Actually yeah, kinda

If you look at the duel between Operator and Adis at the start, when you give him the flower he melts it into a crystal, absorbs it and glows brightly for a second

[lilac aspen]

Sentients are cool
I’m glad we’re looking more into their lore

[iron tiger]

Are you sure he’s an archon or is he just an eidolon

[brazen seal]

same glowing with Lotus when she kissed ballas to get power
funny enough

[stiff fable]

Eidolons are dead sentients

[misty salmon]

Live Adis reaction:

[stiff fable]

So definitely NOT an eidolon

[iron tiger]

But all archons are eidolons?

[stiff fable]

They are not

The Archons we fight are Warframe/Sentient hybrids

They are made from pieces of Sentients, but not dead Sentients

[lilac aspen]

Archons were Sentient creatures that were slapped onto warframes to make the revival occur

[brazen seal]

btw, did Adis stop crushing us on the demo when ..... the sun came out ?

[stiff fable]

We don't know a lot about the Sentient Beasts but Sentients in general don't die easily

[lilac aspen]

It’s why they are kinda mad at Erra
And promptly returned the favor by using his body for Pazuul

[lilac aspen]

Probably theme setting to show Adis wasn’t actually an enemy

[stiff fable]

That's just good cinematography, it's just that your battle is supposed to end when one of you "loses" the fight

And Adis accuses you of letting him win

[iron tiger]

Hunhow specifically says they were made from the blighted battlefields where sentients and warframes fell

[stiff fable]

Right, but Sentients don't die the same way people do

Break a Sentient apart and it's still the same Sentient

[lilac aspen]

Yes
They were made from their original remains and warframe remains, the Archon shards being used to allow them to maintain living

[stiff fable]

They're actually closer to Amalgam Corpus

[iron tiger]

I remember lore about sentients being able to procreate through amputation, is that still canon?

[stiff fable]

The Sentient's mind is still intact, they're just mounted on a new body

[brazen seal]

hm
I just thought abt a coincidence of a giant sentient that attacked the PoE on the old war

[lilac aspen]

They basically got clapped during a battle and were brought back via the very corpses they probably made during the battle

Talk about dying and waking up attached to a body you probably killed

[stiff fable]

That's not really Sentient procreation, just breaking off pieces to go work on their own.

[iron tiger]

Oh I get what you mean, that makes more sense

[stiff fable]

Like, a robot detaching its hand to use as a drone

[lilac aspen]

Fragmenting to cover more ground and numbers

[stiff fable]

Except in this case it's individual "cells" from their body

[iron tiger]

Now that I think about it warframes can revive too

Two ultra durable beings being fused than coming back to life through some Frankenstein shi

[lilac aspen]

Helminth the goated

[stiff fable]

True Sentient procreation would be creating a new governing consciousness and giving it a new body that can grow, which they are now incapable of

Warframe revivals are kinda messed up because it's implied that the Warframe is fine, it's just the Operator thinks the Warframe is too damaged to keep going

[lilac aspen]

They are kinda connected in a way
Also because despite being mega tough it still has anatomy logic

If I break a Warframe’s legs, it will be forced to crawl even though it’s relatively fine still

[stiff fable]

Right, but actually getting to that point is very very difficult

[lilac aspen]

It’s why our frame could still snap War in two despite being impaled by it, Stalker didn’t hit it in a way that’d disable its ability to use its limbs

Thus Operator could still operate it and snap the sword

[stiff fable]

And the Warframe itself might not notice the broken bone while the Operator does

Ahhh small note but that wasn't the Operator

The Warframe woke up and did that on its own

It's the ultimate response to Hunhow calling the Warframe an empty puppet

[lilac aspen]

I refuse to believe the mindless meat puppet did that

[stiff fable]

There is SOMETHING in there

[lilac aspen]

MINDLESS MEAT PUPPET

[stiff fable]

But it's existence is pain and it's much happier asleep

[lilac aspen]

I say as my frame does its poses because drifter canonically says those are based on the frame’s personality memories

[stiff fable]

lawl

Like I said, the thinking mind is deeply asleep

Unconscious tics are unconscious tics

[lilac aspen]

I would go insane too if I couldn’t eat chocolate anymore as a mouthless entity

Unless I was turned into Grendel

[stiff fable]

I don't think Grendel has taste buds in that mouth

It's basically Guzzlord

[lilac aspen]

Grendel stress eating everything

I’m glad they kept the whole eating grenade thing still

[stiff fable]

https://tenor.com/view/belch-gif-26675594

Walking nuclear reactor pile that you shovel things in to as fuel

[brazen seal]

I've a dumb theory with absolute no base on it that Adis and its mecha.... hunhullus ? are the sentients that attack PoE

[stiff fable]

The Hunhullus is a Sentient "homunculus"

[humble sierra]

The Eidolon could be related to the Hunhullus, but it's probably not Adis

[stiff fable]

As far as we know most Sentients didn't need to take humanoid forms

Most of them look like space ships actually

[lilac aspen]

Hunhullus
Homunculus

Clearly they made the Hunhullus made in response to Warframes

[brazen seal]

it is the only colossal sentient we have seen till now besides hunhow tho

[stiff fable]

Very possibly

[stiff fable]

Praghasa, the Murex...

[lilac aspen]

Considering like
Prime Excalibur was on par with it

[humble sierra]

The Eidolons

[lilac aspen]

Like you know how ridiculously strong you need to be to actively hold up a giant foot that is TRYING to stomp on you

[humble sierra]

I think size-wise, the Hunhullus is only twice the size of one of the Tridolons

But the gameplay of the fight and design of the map makes it feel much larger

[brazen seal]

really ?
I thought abt like x3

[stiff fable]

Hunhullus is roughly the size of the Hydrolyst

So the Plains Sentient would have been MUCH larger

[lilac aspen]

Which is still scary in thought of how big NORMAL Sentients can get

[stiff fable]

Because Harry is only made of one Sentient rib bone

[lilac aspen]

Imagine big Sentients going “I’m getting in my Hunhullus.”

[humble sierra]

Imagine we get to Tau in 2026 and every Sentient is just using a Hunhullus

[brazen seal]

plottwist
there's no sentients in current Tau

[stiff fable]

So funny story that actually kinda happens in Second Dream

War is part of Hunhow's consciousness

And shattering it weakened him permanently

[lilac aspen]

[stiff fable]

Sentients have a distributed consciousnesses

[lilac aspen]

That’d be depressing

[stiff fable]

No central "brain" like we have

[lilac aspen]

Imagine going to Tau
And just every sentient gone/dead

[brazen seal]

based on this I'm 100% sure that Hunhullus is our equivalent of warframe

[stiff fable]

I mean I kinda expect Sentient Mad Max

[lilac aspen]

Operator depression once more

[lilac aspen]

Yeah

Basically they saw the Warframes and made giga mechs in response

Sadly the agility feature of frames basically made it like trying to fight flies

[stiff fable]

Being Tenno is suffering

[stiff fable]

Thing is, the Hunhullus would let them accomplish war objectives more easily

[lilac aspen]

Operator forced to cry infinitely whereas Drifter is loved infinitely

[stiff fable]

The Sentients weren't trying to kill every Tenno, they were trying to destroy human civilization

So going full Godzilla is a valid strategy

Though really they should have just used mass drivers from outside the solar system

[brazen seal]

I love this meme
but I feel like ppl forget that Drifter spent prob a millenium ? being executed over and over

[lilac aspen]

Sentients should have just tried to friend everyone and say “You hate the Orokin? WOW, so do we! Let’s kill them together!”

[stiff fable]

They just really wanted to kill every human, is the thing

[lilac aspen]

Yeah

[stiff fable]

"I don't want to cure cancer, I want to turn people into dinosaurs!!"

[lilac aspen]

“You could like, save everyone from the Orokin and clean up the mess they caused.”

“I don’t want to save the solar system, I want to kill it!”

[stiff fable]

[sly pagoda]

Spin up the vessels it’s time for Taucific Rim.

[tranquil mica]

https://tenor.com/view/dredd-judge-aldor-lore-i-am-the-lore-gif-22133107

[blissful merlin]

https://tenor.com/view/aa-gif-22170771

[lilac aspen]

“There’s a Tenno in the outer sector!”

“Send in the Täueger.”

[valid bear]

Does this talk about warframe

[brazen seal]

hm ?

wdym

[fringe moth]

How does baro survive the void?

[stiff fable]

He uses a ship

And he isn't entering the void proper, just exploring towers the way the Tenno do

[sly pagoda]

More importantly then is his ability to hide from the neural sentry

The thing that brainjacks the corpus and grineer who try to raid them

[fringe moth]

So like the void missions?

[sly pagoda]

Yep those towers are hidden in the void

[fringe moth]

Ah

[sly pagoda]

The computer in the labs I believe mentions some orokin built them as something like a prepper bunker in case the sentient war went south.

[fringe moth]

Which labs?

[sly pagoda]

Entrati, the PC right by Loid.

[fringe moth]

I'll check it out

[humble sierra]

Also, he made a deal with the Man in the Wall. It might have nothing to do with how he survives in the Void, but still.

[pale cedar]

Doubt it considering he was doing it before the deal

[tall echo]

Inaros prime guards him

[sly pagoda]

The deal was basically something throw away IMO. An in setting reason for why his arrival and inventory is now synced across all platforms.

That said, probably wise to tuck it away in case it becomes important someday.

[normal mountain]

It also explains crossplay: why Tenno from different consoles- er, I mean universes, can interact with each other

[humble sierra]

Yeah, it was just a joke to provide an in-universe explanation for crossplay: that a guy made a deal with an eldritch being just to sell his goods to a wider audience

[misty salmon]

don't tell the corpus

[humble sierra]

Anyone think the decoration given in the TennoCon bundle has anything to do with the lore/teasers for TennoCon in hindsight? Besides showing transference, perhaps in a more 'connected' way that could hint at the focus on Operator and also the Focus updates?

[snow shoal]

ooo

maybe new transference effects

that would cool as hell

could be like the exoprimal suit up

[worn crescent]

I need to prove a point, who would win, the Star Wars universe, let’s say it’s old republic era with Anakin, or the Warframe universe, Old War era with the Drifter

Let’s assume that it’s Darth Revan as the main Sith, Anakin is full potential, and the Tenno don’t team up with the Jedi

And the Sith and Jedi do team up against the Warframe universe

The Drifter has access to all warframes, yalls opinions?

Current Warframes*

[normal mountain]

...
Not sure how effective a lightsaber would be against a Warframe, but
I think it's possible Warframe might just come out on top this one

[swift sentinel]

Star wars probably wins on numbers alone. A whole galaxy vs a single solar system.

But it's not a quantifiable answer, things are too different.

[worn crescent]

Ok let me specify more, just the Jedi and Sith and let’s say there’s the same amount of droids as there are grinner

[normal mountain]

I mean, unless we can get the Man in the Wall on our side
Then Star Wars is likely cooked in oil

[worn crescent]

Ok, were not including any gods

No brother/sister/father abaloth, no wally

[patent cargo]

can we get veso? i bet he could turn the droids against each other

[normal mountain]

Sentients
Sentients can take control of robotics
Where's grandpa Hunhow?

[patent cargo]

ooh or nyx! we could turn everyone against each other!

[worn crescent]

Ok how would Void and Force interact?

[lean garden]

lightsabers could do damage, warframes are not immune to high heat enough to cut through blast doors

[normal mountain]

Now that is the question

[worn crescent]

Because depending on that would make or break this

[normal mountain]

Right
But could they sever a Warframe's limbs as easily as they can the limbs of most other beings?

Or would it take as long as a blast door to cut through

[unique talon]

Does garuda, cythe and hydroid have lore?

[lean garden]

probably not

[normal mountain]

Although, that's really only relevant for Inaros, Nidus, and Kullervo (kinda)
The others have shields

[lean garden]

warframes notably have not tanked a blast

[normal mountain]

Lightsabers can't cut through energy fields

[lean garden]

and whats the science behind that

[worn crescent]

Ok but seriously, the big thing is how Void and Force interact, we really need to figure that out first

[swift sentinel]

Garuda, no. Solaris found her blueprints in the Vallis
Cyte was a secret batch Entrati found
Hydroid appears to have been built as a terror weapon.

[normal mountain]

Cyte, kinda
He disappeared after the Fall
The others, not as far as I know

[swift sentinel]

Why would they interact, they're different things

[unique talon]

He disappeared? How? And who's the "others"?

[normal mountain]

I dunno
There's a Legends source that says trying to cut through high-energy fields usually yields explosive results

[worn crescent]

Because they literally couldn’t kill each other, certain Sith have such a strong force barrier that almost nothing could go through it, and the Drifter is obvious

[normal mountain]

Hydroid and Garuda are the "others"
As for how Cyte disappeared, presumably Entrati stole the last sample

[swift sentinel]

This is the lore we have for Cyte
Move like a shadow, strike with force. The Orokin created a Warframe that marries damage and stealth to eliminate sensitive problems, but he disappeared in the chaos of their demise. All that remains is a batch name: Cyte-09.

[normal mountain]

I'm not inclined to trust most Legends material though

[swift sentinel]

And Loid's message after The Hex
I can offer one service, at least. I discovered a clandestine blueprint among my Albrecht's personal effects, for a Warframe so secret it was never named. It is yours.

[worn crescent]

A lightsaber is pure plasma, they are pure energy, so according to my friend who is the biggest lore nerd, that’s why they can’t

[swift sentinel]

Don't use real physics in a fictional fantasy universe unless the fiction itself brings it up.

[worn crescent]

Star Wars is confusing ok

[lean garden]

pure energy... unable to take down shields?

that doesnt seem to gel right lol

[swift sentinel]

It really isn't

[lean garden]

like dont the plasma fire from ship armaments take down each other's shields?

[worn crescent]

Upon further conversation with my friend, a saber would be able to break a shield but it wouldn’t straight up bypassing

[lean garden]

oh yea sure not bypassing

but being unable to break shields is something that doesn't seem to tally with in universe things

[worn crescent]

Ok can we please figure out how Void and Force interact, that is quite literally the deciding factor

Is Void stronger? Is the Force able to kill the Drifter like Void? Can Void bypass Force barriers

[lean garden]

well given that force and void are two very separate things

comparison is a fools game

[worn crescent]

Well than we quite literally cannot figure this out, they’re has to be some interaction for this to be an actual conversation

[lean garden]

you cant force choke someone with the void, and you cant do some doodoo "blamo your childhood fears are now permanently physical" with the force

[worn crescent]

Ok we need to decide 2 things

[lean garden]

the void cant even kill the drifter since its the goober caca that keeps them alive

[worn crescent]

Can Force kill the Drifter, and can the Void bypass the Force

Or Tenno in general

[swift sentinel]

Void doesn't do anything, and no the Force can't kill the Tenno, since they might not even really be alive

[worn crescent]

Ok than literally it’s a stalemate

Because there’s no way to finish off either side

[lean garden]

the Void, most notably like its namesake

[hidden cove]

I think that's Margulis

I see why you might have confused her for the Lotus considering Lotus took Margulis' appearance but that's most likely Margulis

[feral cape]

Like comics? Im pretty darth vader has enough power in the force to like rip planets apart sometimed

[feral cape]

Can the force interact with consciousness?

[sly pagoda]

For all we know the Drifter could lock the Jedi/Sith in a time loop.

I mean right now we know at a minimum they are looping a whole city-state at will.

In truth Tenno and Jedi face canon power curves that make it hard to judge. And you would not want either running loose on your ship if they had your number.

[feral cape]

Drifter cant just loop time at will

[sly pagoda]

Though i am pretty sure my Rhino could take a Droidika. 😉

[feral cape]

So far drifter only created a timeloop in the void then hijacked/was given control of albretchs timeloop

[lilac aspen]

…
Anakin at full potential?
As in THE anakin? The guy who did ridiculous stuff as Darth Vader, the version of Anakin in a severely crippled state to actually weaken him?

The amount of insanity in the Star Wars universe

Not to mention you are saying the Sith and Jedi team up

That’s bound to cause some to actually mix both of their beliefs and that opens a whole new can of problems to try fighting

Don’t get me wrong
Warframe team wouldn’t get obliterated, it’d be an extremely long war.

[analog glade]

Against the fodder, Warframes would slaughter; Against a Jedi/Sith, it would be a prolonged fight but the warframes would tank a few hits and probably take it in the end.

[sly pagoda]

The main thing is force users apparently have issues with bullets.

[analog glade]

Warframes have shown to be able to parry/block bullets fairly easily.

[proper crow]

You also kind of gotta consider the level of each Warframe as well.. a Warframe is only as good as its pilot, and this is without even the prime frames being leagues stronger than what we have now

[candid loom]

What’s the height of Baro?

[sly pagoda]

Probably similar to a warframe. Just because id imagine for game dev simplicity he shares a rig with male frames.

So 6ft would be my guess which i think is 180cm metric.

[proper barn]

Actual bullets yes.

"Slugg throwers" is what Guns that use real bullets are called.

Also we could argue if the average tenno actually has stronger mind powers than the average Jedi.

[sly pagoda]

My understanding is that the saber cannot vaporize them so they get a face full of molten or heated bullets.

[proper barn]

Not like Yoda or someone but John the Jedi Knight.

[analog glade]

if anything Jedi would be like an eximus unit.

resistant to powers till you break away the defenses.

[fallen iris]

So the drifter was never a Tenno

Never served the orokin

Correct?

[proper barn]

The Drifter was duviri from the Zariman incindent until the new war.

[analog glade]

Well the drifter was on the ten-zero, then in duviri

[limber prism]

Warframe. 1000%.

[proper barn]

Revan is stronger as a Jedi

[limber prism]

Ground fights against Warframes is more or less suicide the long way around, even with the Jedi or Sith’s most powerful abilities.

[proper barn]

Like a team of RJ would probably beat most fighters as well.

[limber prism]

Space battles might even be more of a slaughter. Railjacks more or less have the firepower of a heavy cruiser with the mobility of a fighter, able to shrug off most damage, and even then repair what damage is done, and, oh yeah, SUMMON FRIGGEN BLACK HOLES THAT SUCK YOU IN AND DELETES YOUR PARENTS

[proper barn]

Well right now seeker is better. Also Rjs have hyper space jumps

The average fighter does not.

[sly pagoda]

Knowing the luck of movies and games the Tenno would accidentally track some infestation onto the Death Star and oopsie.

[analog glade]

I think the best way to think about it is thus; The drifter is a Survivor of the ten-zero so a Tenno, but was not saved and granted powers till the paradox happened.

[proper barn]

You know the orokin had infested bombs right?

The Orokin did that to diemos so the Sentients wouldn't take it.

[limber prism]

Even IF they capture the operator/drifter, the second they try and Jedi mind tricks they’re gonna be blindsided either by the operators millennia long space trauma or Drifters execution circus

[proper barn]

I think both

[stiff fable]

actually mixed, roughly a third of SW fighters have hyperdrive according to eu material

[proper barn]

Cus they both exist at once.

[proper barn]

Don't thet need to use the like

[sly pagoda]

Bring Umbra along to add his space trauma. 😉

[proper barn]

Ring things?

[stiff fable]

higher when the Empire isn't in charge

In SW? Nah

[proper barn]

Well old jedi fighters did need the rings

Tie fighters do not. X wings do?

[stiff fable]

X-Wings are all hyperdrive capable

[lilac aspen]

Worse case scenario
The infested finds the damn Blackwing virus

[analog glade]

Mando's second ship is a good example of an average fighter.

[limber prism]

That’s the only advantage I think they have over the Tenno

Void travel is VERY risky, even though we use it all the time. But we have never used it to leave our solar system. Hyperdrives allow them to go anywhere

[stiff fable]

one thing to keep in mind is that Warframes don't have truly automated weaponry

It's all machined to perfection but it's slug based

because the Sentients could hack any and all smart weapons

Forcefields in SW completely shut that down

110% do not pass go

[limber prism]

Doesn’t matter if they’re slug based, they still hit hard enough thanks tk the ludicrous modding we are able to do

[iron tiger]

We see that happen to corpus tech weapons

[proper barn]

wasnt't the lore it go through it?

[stiff fable]

nope

Even the Yuzhan Vong, who don't use laser weapons at all, had a hard time with shield tech

and yes there are personal force fields

[limber prism]

But they’re not exactly mass produced to stormtroopers

[stiff fable]

There's a reason the standard SW weapon is a blaster and not a slugthrower

[iron tiger]

What kind of sci-fi weapon types don’t we have? I feel like warframe has almost everything

[stiff fable]

weirdly, stormtrooper armor is supposed to be really good

[analog glade]

its good, but not beskar good.

[limber prism]

Even then, some Warframes can just outright ignore the shields. Hildryn, Sayrn, Nyx, etc

[stiff fable]

yeah true lol

[proper barn]

Helments sucked though.

[stiff fable]

but also Star Wars superweapons are roughly Praghasa tier

And there's one every twenty years

[limber prism]

Stormtrooper armor looks like it’s not different than standard titanium armor, maybe even weaker considering in the Mandalorian, Boba was able to literally crack it with a stick

[proper barn]

Also my favorite star wars thing is rebels

[stiff fable]

ewwww

[proper barn]

WHAT DO YOU MEAN

[stiff fable]

just an awful show lol

[proper barn]

Rebels is great. i'll tackle you.

[limber prism]

You’re forgetting that Tenno have something that will always win.

[stiff fable]

1v1 me coward

[proper barn]

Watch clone wars and then watch rebels and TELL ME CLONES WARS ISN'T WORSE

[stiff fable]

I can dislike both!

[limber prism]

…

[proper barn]

the Bendu si a great character.

[lilac aspen]

TLDR the Blackwing Virus is basically the Star War’s equivalent to the infested in the manner of its self-aware of its existence.

It did stuff like deliberately be asymptomatic until it replicated enough to just completely overwhelm the immune system, for example.

It was self-aware and weird enough to infect an Extremely Force sensitive Flower and was also made from some of that said Flower, which has scary implications that its hive mind ability and all its intelligence is Force related.

[limber prism]

Thrawn takes the cake for me.

[iron tiger]

Now that I think of it we don’t have force field shields

[stiff fable]

Thrawn was cool but he was better in his OG trilogy

[proper barn]

we litearlly have Shields

[humble sierra]

Drifter 'served' the Orokin the same way any civillian did, but yeah, never a child-soldier-with-superpowers

[iron tiger]

No. Like A SHIELD

Made of forcefield

[analog glade]

ack and brunt says hi

[proper barn]

cetus is that

[limber prism]

Anyhoo, back to lore. Tell a Tenno that destroying the Death Star drops a new Warframe BP, and they’ll be on that like murder hornets when someone whacks a nest

[stiff fable]

hahahaha

[iron tiger]

No like as a weapon

[stiff fable]

god that's so true

[lilac aspen]

Basically if the Infested gets a hold of the Blackwing virus

We get Force Sensitive Infested, let that nightmare fuel sink in

[stiff fable]

now that I think about it, this is basically the argument for why Warframes end the Guardians from Destiny

[limber prism]

Hmmm

[stiff fable]

Ruk: YOU DON'T FIGHT FOR HONOR, YOU FIGHT FOR TREASURE!!

[limber prism]

I think that matchup would be a lot more nuanced, but at the end of the day I think it’ll come down to who has the stronger drive to get a new gun

[stiff fable]

Tenno: haha 4% bp drop