lore-discussion

[clever orchid]

Ah, that explains that

Oh, I have no expectation of anything in the void making sense, hahaha

[restive river]

Kullervo, Albrecht, Teshin, Lotus’ hand
They all fall into Duviri without any explanation as to how other than tossed into the void

[restive river]

The void still has some rules

Like conceptual embodiment
Which is how Kullervo’s hold and his Warden even exist

It’s why the Warden sounds like Ballas

[brittle anvil]

Yesss

[old atlas]

tbh its my headcanon that stalker is a modified version of excalibur

[restive river]

I mean
The only similarity they have is the model for their body

If anything Stalker’s gameplay moreso resembles Ash if I’m not mistaken

[old atlas]

hence modified

[brittle anvil]

Easy enough headcanon is that duiviri might be one of the only solid places in the void for anything to hit

so given eonugh time everything thrown in there will be

[clever orchid]

It would better explain why most of his abilities are from other Warframes.
He's basically been Helminthed beyond anything we can do

[brittle anvil]

and void time isn't regular time

[restive river]

Untime

[restive river]

Modified pretty heavily to the point he’s just a different warframe

Which
He is just a different warframe

[brittle anvil]

Like how old is the drifter? Anywhere between "20something" and nigh-infinite, if they've been looping in duiviri since orokin days

that's rehtorical to be clear

So time in the void/duiviri is inherently borked

[clever orchid]

Yeah, like the towers in the void might have been put in there after they found out they could because they found towers that they eventually would put in there

[restive river]

They’ve been looping since the Zariman incident so the Drifter and Operator are both technically over a thousand years old at the minimum

[old atlas]

as grimeagle said, could be extensive helminth

[restive river]

It’s unknown how long the old war took place

[clever orchid]

We don't know how old our Tenno is either (chronologically)

[restive river]

The void towers exist as safe havens from the sentients if I’m not mistaken

[clever orchid]

We don't even know if we age cause we don't know how much time has even passed.

[tall echo]

A well known fact

[restive river]

Rell seems to have aged

[tall echo]

Tenno can definitely age and seemingly even die of old age

[brittle anvil]

Well, cryosleep ancient is diffrerent than void timeloop ancient, but same diff

[restive river]

All tenno minus Rell was put into cryosleep pods, the second dream and all that

[old atlas]

isnt he also the only tenno whos death is confirmed?

[clever orchid]

And in the void

[brittle anvil]

imo the tenno seems to age but it's unclear if they're physical enough to die simply of old age, given the fact that Rell hung on as a wraithlike transferance-ghost for XXXXX years

[restive river]

Iirc there’s at least two confirmed tenno deaths
I don’t recall if it was Mirage’s or Gara’s, I think Gara’s but the Lotus mourned one of them dying
And idk why she’d mourn the frames :p

[tall echo]

I still firmly believe that ballas could've killed our operator outright if he didn't throw them in the void

[brittle anvil]

100%

[old atlas]

tbf rell also transferred his soul to harrow to live longer

[restive river]

Well that came later when the Lotus moved Lua into the void

For most of the old war the tenno weren’t in the void
Just in cryosleep on Lua

[sly ibex]

That may have been just before our full powers were manifested, though (and reawakened in War Within). Likely from the training that Rell may not have gotten, since Margulis cast him out. That still boggles, that she of all people would have done that.

[tall echo]

Margulis locked away the true potential of the tenno

[clever orchid]

I'm sure he would have known if Tenno are killable.
Can you honestly tell me he wouldn't have tested for that?

[restive river]

Idk, I think he did what he did because he knew he couldn’t kill us
I assume so because ofc he would have tried, he hated the tenno

[restive river]

Exactly!

[sly ibex]

Which would have happened after the training we received.

[tall echo]

How would he test it during the time when the tenno were heroes?

[clever orchid]

The Orokin suck

[old atlas]

archimedean yavi scareing tf out of the orokin so much they decide to imprison him instead of kill him:

[clever orchid]

And they were heroes eventually

[restive river]

Little did they know he would live forever through Lavo

[clever orchid]

Not from the start

[tall echo]

The orokin are dumb, sure, but not stupid enough to just kill one of their prime soldiers

[old atlas]

the tenno werent fully believed by the people to even be real. some even saw them as monsters and beasts (see mag and rhino lore)

[clever orchid]

They didn't start as soldiers.
They started as some kids who survived in the void and were seen as monsters.

[restive river]

There’s the Tenno and then there’s the Warframes

[old atlas]

some still didnt even think the tenno survived

[restive river]

At times they’re used interchangeably so gotta make sure you can tell which is being used in the context

[sly ibex]

In fairness, the feral Rhino was eating people.

That was also before the Tenno-Warframe connection was made though.

[tall echo]

Neither of those are about tenno directly

[clever orchid]

At this point, that could have been a Grendel that got mislabeled, hahaha

[sly ibex]

Or, more accurately, it WAS when the connection was made.

[restive river]

I mean yeah
The tenno, the children of the Zariman were a secret to all but some of the Orokin iirc
But the Tenno faction did exist AND so did the Warframes

[old atlas]

but he was let out for a reason, likely proving the tenno could pacify the first generation warframes

[tall echo]

Tbf it never is directly stated to be a rhino

[sly ibex]

Or just control them in general.

[restive river]

Transference

[old atlas]

i still love that tenno at the time were basically space therapists

[sly ibex]

It's the Rhino Prime codex, and it describes Rhino abilities being used.

[clever orchid]

Yeah, most thought a Warframe was the Tenno, with Tenno just being the name given to them. Like calling a "body" a "human"

[old atlas]

and we know grendels lore, he and gauss had a basically bromance

[restive river]

Yeah

Like
Nobody knew about the Tenno the children
Just Tenno the faction who used the Warframes
And thus they would be used interchangeably

[clever orchid]

Like how the Orokin were called the Orokin, but they were humans... or something like them

[restive river]

They were human.

There are no aliens in Warframe

[old atlas]

the orokin were scifi eugenicists and phrenologists (aka scientific racists with a dash of classism)

[clever orchid]

Yeah, I was just trying to insult them
Hahaha

[old dome]

dont forget misogynistic... or at least, for ballas anyway.

[old atlas]

mainly ballas

that we know of anyways

[old dome]

...i wonder how privileged are the dax, actually. considering that they had a separate mass hall where they were served by other ppl...

[clever orchid]

And yet were still mind controlled.

[old dome]

this is probably more of a headcanons area but. i know that arthur listens to metal (king <3) & aoi listens to boyband pop,,, but what genres do the rest of the protos listen to??

[tall echo]

The encore protos prob listen to the genre that their songs belong to

Idk what minerva could like tho

[old dome]

i think eleanor listens to new wave/post punk,, like depeche mode & the cure. their musical styles are more poetic, just like how she talks.

ik molchat doma didnt exist in the 90s but she'd listen to them too.

idk why but i can see kaya vibing to britney spears. its probably all the pink.

quincy truly listens to whatever but he specifically likes jazz,, hes a lover beneath all that distrustful facade he has going on.

amir... secretly listens to fairouz & a lot of old classical arab music. its what he grew up on. unfortunately he sometimes wouldnt have the patience or presence of mind to actually listen to the song so he just... skips them (the intros alone are like. 10+ minutes long tbf.)

idk abt minerva & velimir.........

i wanna say vel listens to limp bizkit just for the fun of it.

[wraith patrol]

@old dome I can get behind all of these

[humble sierra]

At least 18.

[restive river]

Point is there very likely isn’t much left of the other protos :p

[tall echo]

Amir is still in-universe 'murican

[gentle wave]

The atomycicle has a normal engine or is it modificated by albrecht/hex?

[restive river]

Modified by Albrecht

You should explore this page

https://www.warframe.com/1999/atomicycle

If you check the engine portion there’s a note from Albrecht about how he exposed it to void energy to augment it for the Hex

Amongst other modifications iirc

[gentle wave]

Ok, i remember something about void engines

[gentle wave]

[restive river]

The 1999 sites are really cool, if you have the time check them out

Fantastic world building from DE
And they all fit into the ARG as well

You can find them all at the bottom of this page and the 1999 page :)

[gentle wave]

Thanks Lil duck

[restive river]

[old dome]

ok and...? there are arabs in america...

iirc the arab diaspora in america began in the 80s-90s.

[stray gale]

amir sells video game osts so he's already characterised as listening to those

wait no its aoi that does nvm

🛌

I still think he would though

the guy communicates entirely in nerdy references so he's probably one of those people who would think nier automata's ost is high art

[old dome]

he strikes me as the kinda nerd that boots up a game just to listen to a specific ost,, he doesnt even play. just listens.

[wraith patrol]

Who among us hasn’t played out the title screen track

[old dome]

so true,, me on the koumei update

[wraith patrol]

Me with Dishonored, Dragon Age, Wayfinder, Oblivion, so many bangers

[old dome]

amir starts up tekken 3 in the arcade just to listen to the banger osts

& the opening cinematic

[jolly lake]

gamers if this question's answer is better for me to discover rather than to read it here, tell me

but, does Flare don't like Lizzy? i just unlocked T4 Hex and was able to talk with them on the pc tab, and ||they seem scared of the infestation and "her" (i suppose it's Lizzy)||

[lean garden]

Discover

Its like, the entire thing youre going to explore with flare

[jolly lake]

aight, thank you very much!

[opal girder]

What if limbo didn't miscalculate. What would his move set be before the rifts

[blissful merlin]

https://tenor.com/view/portal-portal2-gif-8490356555426888939

[green hazel]

limbo solved for sqrt(i) and he wanted to die

[opal girder]

Wait fr?

[green hazel]

idk

sqrt(i) is an awful number so maybe its true

for reference 0.707106781 + 0.707106781i

or 1/√2 + (1/√2)i

[plush phoenix]

there are 2 of them

[rotund tinsel]

Is alad V an Orokin?

An acolyte I encountered said he was

[stray gale]

he isn't

iirc hunhow, and probably by extension the acolytes, refer to any human as orokin because they're haters

the corpus arose in defiance of the orokin to begin with, so the idea that an orokin would be part of them is a bit out of character

[stiff beacon]

i think he listens to vanilla ice

[storm hearth]

So how does lizzie .."Respawn" because in the kim message she stats that her pervious versions are still "there" but also flare said when he threw lizzie in the river but she appeared on his bed but lizzie says that lizzie is still there?

[restive river]

Lizzie is infested
So
The infestation can just pop another one of her out

[stiff beacon]

obligatory

https://tenor.com/view/nanomachines-son-metal-gear-senator-armstrong-metal-gear-rising-revengeance-gif-20057254

[proper barn]

Okay i think lizzie can exist in more than one verison of herself cuz hes like basically part of flare and the Helminth and thus can't be fully destroyed @storm hearth @stiff beacon

[restive river]

I mean yeah that's kinda what I was trying to say

[proper barn]

Oh sure.

[stiff beacon]

its like trying to kill the swarmlord

[proper barn]

I was just trying to say it's not a thing specific to all infested I dont think.

[brittle siren]

How many void theme frame are there in the game

[brittle siren]

Ngl the graphic in this game is really aged like fine wine.

[strange plinth]

xaku
sorta dante, sorta citrine
if you squint, all of them
kullervo has a void motif in his design
rev prime was made by the void. but not regular rev. just prime

[graceful swan]

Sevagoth is a Railjack Captain who disappeared into the Void

[strange plinth]

true i forgot about sevagoth
would go into the sorta category imo

[brittle siren]

I mean what frame made directly by the void, or/and use raw void power, not like using it as battery and such

Revenant is definitely born from the "Conceptual Embodiment"

(Rev Prime)

[strange plinth]

"what fatherless aberration is this?"

[brittle siren]

Xaku is 3 frames fused to each other and have literally void energy flowing inside them

(By the void)

Kullervo and Dante is a special case

Idk if Dante spells are pure void, in game it certainly not

Same with Kullervo, he has void energy flowing in him too, yet he could only do slash dmg

Btw is Overguard is powered by the void? Since the color in the HP UI kinda similar to most void color

[strange plinth]

don't know if overguard has a lore explanation
if it is powered by void, its probably just in the same way the frames are

[rich glacier]

alad v is an orokin?

[strange plinth]

yesn't
he's the closest thing to an orokin the system has at that moment

also hunhow is racist
so yk, he's not exactly discriminating who actually is and isn't orokin

[graceful swan]

Hunhow is just being racist

[rich glacier]

didnt the acolyte refer him as orokin

i may be wrong

[graceful swan]

Acolytes serving Stalker who is working with Hunhow

[strange plinth]

i'm also not finding anything on the acolytes referring to him as orokin, but i may be looking in the wrong places

[graceful swan]

This is why they see him as Orokin

The only people who can make you Orokin are the Orokin

[lean garden]

Rev defo cant be counted

[brittle siren]

I forgot to put the word "Prime" in

Prime version

[lean garden]

Like xaku is the clear cut one
Dante was twisted by void tongue and all
Kullervo has a tinge of it but not much
Sevagoth obviously wasnt designed as such

Citrine is right out

Like citrine being considered is a whole mistake and a half

[brittle siren]

I mean isn't this part Hunhow consider all human is Orokin, so that's why he said Alad is one of them? The only distinction to separate normal human and Orokin is the blue skin (beside Albrecht)

[brittle siren]

So is Revenant Prime still void related? I know his kit doesn't but his lore kinda suggest he made by Conceptual Embodiment

[lean garden]

Thats kind of the assumption many made

But theres word it was the unums doing

So like

[brittle siren]

And Unum using void power (as she can stop time, which was not seen anywhere else, even in Duviri, and idk if Protea could stop time herself)

[graceful swan]

The proof he isn’t is
If he was he would have blue skin
Have gold
Not have an as messed up face
And we would’ve killed him for being an Orokin survivor
And he should’ve known about the Tenno and Warframes to some degree

[lean garden]

Which is an assumption that she's using void power

[brittle siren]

Yeah at this point we need more Unum lore

[strange plinth]

citrine i only mentioned because the void tunnel is related, but obv not to the frame itself

[lean garden]

Which is why its a mistake, since it cant be "sorta citrine" if we're looking at void themed frames

The tunnel isnt even citrines doing

[brittle siren]

Lotus said the couple love is so strong that it form a void tunnel, which we could assume their strong emotion make the tunnel via Conceptual Embodiment

Yeah the void is really chaotic, it keep using ppl emotion and memory to create things out of thin air

[strange plinth]

yeah that's fair
didn't think that much about it when i typed

[lean garden]

Is okay, still more thinking done than some folks

-# shudders in TikTok comments

[strange plinth]

i fear whatever goes on in warframe tiktok comments

[brittle siren]

I wonder if Wally could abuse "Conceptual Embodiment" at will, i mean he did made the Murmurs, but like can he "create" other stuff too?

[strange plinth]

assuming that "the indifference" is accurate, probably not. no emotion, no CE
but again, that's assuming that the name is accurate and wally is still bound by those rules

[graceful swan]

The Strands of Khra are CE to some degree

[brittle siren]

I mean he could get mad

And also mocking people in some decree

[graceful swan]

Tbh Albrecht made that name Wally isn't acting very indifferent recently

[brittle siren]

Also Wall really like talking in riddle

[strange plinth]

very true, wally was definitely angry or at least resentful during the hex

[graceful swan]

And during Whispers

If Wally was Indifferent he probably wouldn't have cared about the deal

[brittle siren]

And maybe a tiny bit of "fear"? Like he keep summoning Murmur to delay us helping the Hex

[graceful swan]

Plus he's been chasing a man for a very long time

[brittle siren]

Idk where Albrecht hide the real finger that even Wally don't have a single clue and have to make deals to find it

[strange plinth]

eated it /j

[graceful swan]

Nothing even suggests he even has the original

[brittle siren]

It would be insane that somehow Abrecht sent it to Tau along with the Sentitent

[brittle siren]

I mean, he is the only survival orokin know the finger existence, unless DE pull a plot twist and the OP is the finger

[strange plinth]

that would be
odd

[graceful swan]

If he did have the finger Wally would've found it by now considering he can read Albrechts mind

[rotund tinsel]

Seems like something he would do

[rotund tinsel]

What if the finger was the friends we made along the way?

[brittle siren]

Or he could block Wally mind reading in a certain decree, like how Stanford in Gravity fall could avoid Bill Cipher get in completely in his mind

[graceful swan]

We can't be the finger considering Albrecht lost the finger before we even went into the Void

[strange plinth]

don't remember the last of the albrecht log things between the necralisk and the sanctum
i'm pretty sure it mentions the finger being cut off and splitting into.. however many, but does it say that albrecht took it with him in some way?

[graceful swan]

Orokin took the fingers off him to study

[rotund tinsel]

Now that I remember lotus being in the sanctum,what DID we offer in return to the man in the wall in exchange for saving the children of the Zariman

[strange plinth]

right.
and they made replicas for the railjack reliquary drives
and the zariman's
and who knows what else

[brittle siren]

I saw some games and stories have the plot that an important item is turn into a human being (in many case, it's the main character). Like Bayonetta, or Wonder Woman etc

[strange plinth]

that's the big mystery

[graceful swan]

Now that's the question isn't it, Kiddo?

[rotund tinsel]

Like unitrix from Ben 10

[brittle siren]

It really strange, why Wally really need OP to fullfill the deal as fast as possible, like isn't there a lot of Tenno out there?

[rotund tinsel]

Just convenience that the one who struck the deal is us essentially

[brittle siren]

I know that we are the one make the deal, but Wally target Rell once, why didn't he do the same method on other child

[brittle siren]

My theory that we, or our parents is parts of sth greater than what we anticipated

[graceful swan]

Operator was just the first kid to go to Wally

[brittle siren]

Still, he could trick other weak mind Tenno, even Rell is his victim

[rotund tinsel]

The way you could see it,operator was desperate to save the others that a light bulb flashed in their head when warframe Satan offered to save them

[brittle siren]

Why he need US so desperately, what did we offer him that he must make us fullfill it as soon as possible

[graceful swan]

He didn't need to trick a weak mind he had a traumatized kid right in front of him

[brittle siren]

Even luring Lotus to capture us and bring the OP to him

[rotund tinsel]

Hoping next big update shines some light on it

[brittle siren]

After New War I don't think we really that traumatized like pre War Within

And also, why Wally choose US to shake the hand? Surely those child that wanting their mom and dad back would be the most easy target

[graceful swan]

During the deal we was though

[rotund tinsel]

Trapped inside a ship that's stranded in hell would fill me with trauma that lasts centuries

[graceful swan]

Because we was right in front of him

[brittle siren]

So is other Tenno, remember the one that accompanied with Jade?

[brittle siren]

He literally could be anywhere on the ship

[rotund tinsel]

Even killing my own parents,depending on your Kim choices

[brittle siren]

But no, he choose us, in every possibility

[graceful swan]

He didn't want to do that though he just waited till someone came to him

[strange plinth]

the interaction happens because we're the protag, there's probably nothing else behind it

[brittle siren]

And again, he rushing us to shake his hand, he rushing us to fullfill the deal, he even trying to make Lotus gone crazy so the OP could be turn in

[rotund tinsel]

That tenno reminds me that at the end of the day the tenno are still kids

[rotund tinsel]

Wait when was the lotus part?

Guessing lotus eaters

[brittle siren]

Lotus Eater, Wally using void song to make Lotus willingly give OP to Wally

[rotund tinsel]

I wonder how pleasant the void song is if it turns people into angels and makes your step mother wanna hand you over to satan

[brittle siren]

Then again, even we using "oh the OP is main character" logic, it still doesn't make that much of a sense why Wally deemed us important to his plan.

And Wally only need OP not Drifter even though both shake his hand

[rotund tinsel]

Maybe he saw more potential in us then the rest?

Although sounds far fetched

[strange plinth]

operator and drifter's deals were different, based entirely on semantics

[brittle siren]

Still shake hand

I don't think Wally and OP deal was that simple

[strange plinth]

"I can save them, all of them"
operator's "them" included the operator (as in the children of the zariman), drifter's "them" excluded the drifter (as in the others)
whatever drifter's cost was, the deal is already complete. operator still "owes"
we also know that drifter didn't get void powers, but operator (and the rest of the tenno) did.

[brittle siren]

Like DE still hiding what OP offer to Wally

[silk atlas]

What Operator is giving Wally in the deal is purposefully vague

[prime mural]

So about the loops, I have played the 1999 update for many weeks and here is 1 thing I don't understand. I just got the dialog from Quincy for the first time about resetting stuff and him forgetting us. I always go no and it doesn't reset chemistry etc, but the calender date goes back. So like does study get reset or no? Or do we reset stuff and in game lore we can choose what we take with us(relationships memories etc)

[strange plinth]

the loop happens regardless, you are deciding if the hex's memories get reset as well. based on chats with lizzie, the memory reset is a thing you can do in lore.
in regards to quincy, he's paranoid about your ability to control the loop, whether you have reset memories or not, he's sure that you can, and possibly have before.

[prime mural]

So there are 2 types of reset in lore? And not it's always reset but they remember for gameplay reasons?

Like we actually choose if they forget and it's not they always forget but we have the option thay they don't so we the player don't have to grind again?

[strange plinth]

it definitely seems to be a choice if they remember in the lore, yes
namely, the two biggest things that point to it are
lizzie saying "time to try again, Demon..." when you reach the fail state, and "Mmm. We see You're the type that likes to shake the little magnetic toy and give things another go-around, aren't You? That's all right... We'll play along... We love a good game of... pretend... ;)" when re-introducing herself after a reset
the helminth having a unique relationship with time is likely what allows her to be aware of the reset

[gentle wave]

If Lavos doesn't use energy for abilities, where are from the elements that he combines for her alchimist things?

Body fluids or is like the duviri circuit element bottles?

[old dome]

...what??

oh!! i think its like the duviri circuit bottles yeah

[tall echo]

Alchemy

[daring crow]

Is the drifter always in 1999 post hex cannonically?

[tall echo]

No

[daring crow]

So like we are playing as the tenno while in origin system story wise

[graceful swan]

Yes

Actually, Drifter can take the Hex into the future

[daring crow]

I thought he could only loop

[tall echo]

Drifter can move back and forth at will

[daring crow]

I thought you literally meant take hex to the future

Like hollvania

Dunno why

[tall echo]

??

[daring crow]

I wonder if the tenno also can learn to loop time

Since isnt the drifter just using the tennos power?

[graceful swan]

Time looping isn't an actual power

[tall echo]

The 1999 loop existed before the drifter got there

[daring crow]

I thought the drifter broke that loop and made his own tho

[tall echo]

Albrecht extended the loop

[daring crow]

Or was it he incased it in his own

[graceful swan]

Loid states Albrecht made it and did it to give you more time

[daring crow]

So the drifter doing the whole AGAIN! did nothing?

It was just Albrecht?

[graceful swan]

Yes

[tall echo]

Yes

[graceful swan]

Slamming the fist was a motif

[daring crow]

Dang i was really hoping the drifter had like gained the power to turn anywhere he is into like a mini duviri

[tall echo]

And a mistake on the writers' part it seems

[daring crow]

Im still hoping for more duviri atleast connected content

I wanna see more into how the void works and how duviri actually functions

[graceful swan]

Drifter canonically does go back

[daring crow]

Drifter returns to duviri

Gotta happen

Or would duviri be erased once he leaves

[tall echo]

It does happen

Every time you go to duviri in game

[daring crow]

I thought that was just a uncanon gamemode so duviri wouldnt be wasted

[tall echo]

It is not

[graceful swan]

Drifter states on kim they return and enjoy it now

[tall echo]

If it exists, it is canon unless stated otherwise

[daring crow]

So they would replace thrax?

[tall echo]

No

[graceful swan]

They chose not to replace Thrax

Drifter just wanted to leave and had a favour to repay

[chrome frost]

Hey fellas anyone got corpus religious texts?

[proper barn]

I mean the closest we got is the tenets.

The parvos tenets*

[chrome frost]

ok so... 1)yes to charity 2)no to staleness 3)dont let morality block your path towards your desire 4)chase your desire

[proper barn]

Yes to loan sharing not charity really.

Also lying is gokd Taking what you want is good. Enslave your brother.

[stiff fable]

The real basics are "greed is good" and "anything you do to make money can be justified"

Again he sold his brother into slavery

[chrome frost]

...isn't there also the whole "don't let yourself go stale" or something among those lines?

[tall echo]

He kept his brother as his own slave*

[raven urchin]

The Drifter Is Thrax

Thrax Is Drifter

[proper barn]

@raven urchin no

[raven urchin]

https://tenor.com/view/i'm-open-to-being-wrong-grady-smith-i-know-when-i'm-wrong-i-know-when-i-made-a-mistake-prove-me-wrong-gif-4676941739668948540

[proper barn]

You are.

We literally have know what thrax is

Since duviri came out.

He's literally on the duviri Book.

How would he be the Drifter if he's from a Book that was made before the Zariman was made?

You get the book as a decoration.

[restive river]

When Drifter says that Duviri is them they don’t mean that literally, they say that because Duviri was made from and because of them
That includes Thrax

[lean garnet]

i don't get it how do certain infested entities have their own separate personalities?

[tall echo]

Easy: they do not

Not if they're full infested

[tall echo]

I wonder what the book tastes like

Hmm

I wonder why I thought that ._.

[lean garnet]

but fass and vome, are full infested but they are depicted having a sibling relationship and also attack eachother.

I don't understand

[tall echo]

And where's the personality in that?

[strange plinth]

i was going to say 'probably paper' but is the duviri book even made of regular book materials or is it orokin-whatever-material

[lean garnet]

Makes it seem like they have separate personalities as separate entities.

[tall echo]

They're probably named by the entrati but their names represent their effect on deimos, fass makes the place more hostile while vome makes it calmer. They might've been influenced by the void stuff inside deimos

Chaos and order would not get along well

[lean garnet]

ok so it's the void effect that separated them

[restive river]

No?

They’re just named fass and vome

[tall echo]

It's a theory

[restive river]

It’s unknown why they fight

I mean a more likely theory is the entrati family’s dysfunctions affected the infestation as it too affects them

Also Deimos was in the void for an unknown amount of time, if anything is affecting it it’s that
And there doesn’t seem to be any signs of that

[tall echo]

Both could be equally likely, the infestation is evidently quite sensitive to void on a subconscious level

Maybe a mix of both

[restive river]

Have we observed the infestation being effected by the void like that?

The infestation as a whole both does and does not have individuals
All “individuals” speak for the hivemind
Lephantis
Zealoid
Helminth
Even Lizzie

They are singular entities that are still connected to and apart of the hivemind
A hivemind that is connected throughout yet still can differ
Helminth loves us and does not attack us
Other strains do attack us, though may even comment on the beauty of our Warframes due to being infested

[lean garnet]

helminth relinquishes control of the warframes to us anyways, wait a minute....

[tall echo]

What

[restive river]

What

Where did you get that

[tall echo]

No but void doing void things while deimos is in the void seems possible imo

[lean garnet]

Because they're connected to the helminth.

obviously

[restive river]

Yes, but the Warframes are specifically designed to be inert for Tenno use by the Orokin
Not by the Helminth

[restive river]

I guess

[tall echo]

Yes but helminth has no direct control over frames in general it seems

[lean garnet]

Then what the hell was controlling our warframe in that one mission, is that just always gonna be a mystery?

[restive river]

Before the tenno the warframes would literally go mad over time, succumbing to the infestation

[prisma sundial]

I think Infested having personalities mixed within it rather than it all being a singular entity is mainly for interesting narrative purposes, there may be a reason we don't know yet

[tall echo]

Pre-tenno frames weren't coordinated like a mini-hivemind would be

[restive river]

The frame itself?
The frames still have some semblance of their humanity, of sapience, it’s just largely suppressed for tenno use and so that they don’t go feral

[tall echo]

Specify

[restive river]

I assume they mean the second dream

Cause
That’s the only time our frame moves on its own without proper explanation

[tall echo]

That would just be touch transference during the carry segments

[restive river]

No when it’s stabbed and we are being strangled :p

The frame rips the War from their body

Which it’s more likely that’s also just a natural survival reaction cause
oop I’ve been stabbed!

[tall echo]

And some subconscious transference when the operator is about to die or the tiny fragments of leftover conciousness

[restive river]

anyway yeah it’s very unlikely that was Helminth

If it was they would’ve done a lot more probably

[lean garnet]

would be cool

[prisma sundial]

My guess based on what we know is its the deep, last vestige of whoever is the Warframe now

A last act to save their operator

[restive river]

I sincerely doubt the Orokin would allow for that to happen

[lean garnet]

but i would, i love the helminth.

[restive river]

It felt less like them saving us and more “I have been stabbed, time to react accordingly”

[tall echo]

Too dangerous

[restive river]

Just a simple reaction

[prisma sundial]

It definitely could be that too

[restive river]

You have Lizzie

[prisma sundial]

I felt more of a connection in that scene looking back on it, when I first saw it I was like "hunh"

[tall echo]

"Time to react accordingly by not fully removing the sword and just making it worse"

[restive river]

We also know the warframes have remnants of the personalities from the people that were used to originally make them
See every Idle animation

[restive river]

Not enough strength to fully pull it out but enough strength to do their best

I mean I really doubt they knew breaking it would save us
Did you know breaking the war would save us in that moment?
That it’d boot Stalker?

[tall echo]

Yeah the frame doesn't even try to remove war it's fully intended rip apart

[lean garnet]

also is the reason we can do one mission multiple times because of drifter's ability to rewind time

[restive river]

What

[tall echo]

Quest. No.

Replays are not canon

[prisma sundial]

I think that's just trying to tie in gameplay mechanics to story which don't work

[lean garnet]

damn

[restive river]

Even just redoing an assassination isn’t canon

[strange plinth]

no-
90% of missions are done once and never again
defense is the only one i can think of that's like. yeah you could go back

[prisma sundial]

Like we don't need everything we do in the game to tie into the story

[restive river]

Also Drifter’s rewind ability is only in Duviri and 1999
Which they didnt even make the loop in 1999

[tall echo]

Unless it's sergeant or corpus robotics

[restive river]

Exactly, many of it does but not all of it

[restive river]

Idk bout sergeant but yeah
When it seems like it’s applicable it is, like robotics
But refitting Regor isn’t him coming back again or us rewinding time

Lephantis refights could maybe be canon but eeeh, considering what they are and how long it took for them to be like that I doubt it

[tall echo]

It has been mentioned by an official source that when we kill the sergeant another corpus just instantly gets promoted iirc

[prisma sundial]

Vay Hek could also be canon on us redoing the mission but I highly doubt it, he escapes for the Assassination but I don't think it's a lore beat to worry about

[restive river]

LMAO nice

[restive river]

He escapes so he can keep up yapping on the plains

[strange plinth]

vay hek is such a funny fight
locked behind mr 5, you can ignore him for 2/3s of the mission, and then he flies off at the end

[restive river]

And also in general ig

[tall echo]

I guess the sergeant promotion comes with a complimentary tenno craptalking course considering the transmissions

[prisma sundial]

Truueee

[tall echo]

"Fashion victims about to become murder victims"

[prisma sundial]

The new Sergeant just gets the same script as the last one

[lean garnet]

could things like the infested be made in real life

[restive river]

“So I just. Scream at them..? Isn’t that how the last guy died? Oh I get paid? Bet.”

[restive river]

No??

[lean garnet]

aw

[restive river]

I mean
Maybe, I believe most anything can be possible but like.
We don’t even know the origin of the infestation

Also the infestation is
Like
Awful
Like it’s cool for us cause we aren’t effected but it’s not a good thing

Even being a Protoframe is a horrible thing

[lean garnet]

the only thing in the warframe universe i don't see as possible is everything related to the void.

[restive river]

Well yeah

[prisma sundial]

There would need to be some wacky evolutionary and biological leaps for the Infested to become a real life thing

[lean garnet]

i mean it could also be manufactured but the things required for that would be insane.

[prisma sundial]

And you would only need to once, it consumes technology and biological matter to make more of itself

[strange plinth]

extremeophile that adapts and grows quickly
the closest real life thing is probably a fungi or something
and although mushrooms are described with "flesh" and "meat," its not the same type that the infestation has

[tall echo]

Why would you want that

Please don't be another "the infested are the good guys"

[lean garnet]

if there was a possibility of making it subservient it would be useful.

[tall echo]

Technological. Technocyte is a technofungus

[lean garnet]

similar to the helminth

[tall echo]

How would it be useful

Sure, it can alter things on a molecular level, but it can't just... create

[lean garnet]

it's like alchemy i know

[tall echo]

It also tends to mutilate whatever and whoever it comes into contact with

[tall echo]

[lean garnet]

turn one thing into another, of course there's also sometimes a loss.

[gentle wave]

[upper charm]

Damn, now I wish the WF universe was real so we could get a whole frame instead 🙏
Tyl Regor will finally stop getting killed 500000 times

[brittle siren]

Unrelated to lore but where can I find/buy Xaku Prex?

[tall echo]

Baro

[brittle siren]

Yeah I accidentally skip Xaku Prex in Baro once

Very sad

[restive river]

It’ll come back
If you got the tennocon pack you can get it when he comes during tennocon too

[brittle siren]

Btw, what does Cy mean "concentrate void energy"

[blissful merlin]

Probably just that the shadow sevagoth uses is just concentrated void energy. Just formed into his shadow? That’s my theory at least!

[daring crow]

Whats the next story most likely gonna be? Like would it be exploring the Void or 1999 more

Since we kinda saved 1999

And operator just chilling commiting war crimes

[brittle siren]

Def not 1999 since the dev we basically done there

But next could be Tau, or the Void War

[daring crow]

I wanna return to duviri 😦

[blissful merlin]

Same here!!!!

Loved duviri

[cunning tapir]

i dunno if we're really "done" with 1999 until we tie up the loose-end that is Neci Rusalka.

[dire mountain]

Theres a ||boolean in the final chat with Minerva and Velimir that is left unused. We might be done with 1999, but maybe not Rusalka.||

[blissful merlin]

Imagine if Wally just casually drags her into the origin system.

[cunning tapir]

I know, but I have a theory on that. I have no proof it'll work though so take this with a grain of salt.
||I think when we get that boolean, the 1999 calandar will have a thing for August 11th 1999. Why that specific date? Because of that phrase "on empty crossroads, seek the eclipse". And that date is the date of a solar eclipse, the only solar eclipse in the year 1999.||

[blissful merlin]

https://tenor.com/view/dragged-gif-27008479

[hidden cove]

It's hard to understand just how powerful enemy factions are when you can gib them in hordes

Sentients are powerful enough to stand a major threat against Warhammer 40k lmao

A single Grineer Lancer is the equivalent to a basic Space Marine from 40k and we can cleave them apart in droves with swords and basic melee weapons

[lean garden]

Eeeeeh, I think thats quite a stretch

You'd find stark physical differences between a lancer and a basic space marine

More organs, bigger, faster, not riddled with genetic decay

[craggy dune]

Have you ever had a dream where you were inside the game and lived its events?
I dreamt that I was kidnapped by the corpus and I was locked in a place with dead grineer bodies.

[hidden cove]

No but I have actually dreamed about playing Warframe before lmao

[karmic prism]

I've had quite a bit when I was younger. I've had one where the orbiter had a bottom floor that was the personal courtiers before there was one. I've had multiple that where in missions. Like Earth and the Void (specifically the ship tilesets) the most recent one was me in my orbiter in a "Easter egg hunt" with Wally's face

[proper barn]

we don't know.

maybe third orb.

[woven coyote]

Sounds more like you were kidnapped by red veil agents disguised as corpus

[craggy dune]

Maybe because I always tell myself that I hate the corpus
(￣▽￣;)
But after jade's quest I think not all of them are terrible people

[dire mountain]

Keep cooking

[stiff fable]

at the risk of a small spoiler, the next update may be ||Grineer themed||

The next major update? No idea! Tennocon'll tell us

[rotund tinsel]

Orokin really that strict if Umbra got to have issah but Jade and Sorren couldn't have Sirius/orion

[normal mountain]

Iirc the problem was they had the child without permission

I presume Umbra was a good Dax and filed the proper paperwork beforehand

[stiff fable]

Sorren and Jade weren't dax

Dax had privileges

[rotund tinsel]

His portrait decoration said he was once mighty so probably one of the best dax there was

[normal mountain]

Would make sense
Then either he was 'given the honor,' or filled out the paperwork

[rotund tinsel]

If every ceremony in the orokin empire era started with "By the glory and wisdom of the 7" it's safe to say that you had to be VERY and HIGHLY privileged to have a child

[normal mountain]

That seems stupid when I think about it
Then again, we ARE talking about the Orokin...

[rotund tinsel]

And they were cocky about jade and Sorren too

Dangling the fact he's a devoted dog just for him to see his family

[stiff fable]

The Orokin were gods and the Seven were THEIR gods

[rotund tinsel]

But even gods can be killed then

[stiff fable]

fam have you ever read mythology

[normal mountain]

your not disproving my point, you know

[green hazel]

which one

[stiff fable]

ANY

[green hazel]

uh i guess

[stiff fable]

Gods aren't invincible

That's why they bring the hammer down whenever an individual gets uppity

[rotund tinsel]

They aren't [title card]

[green hazel]

are you sure

pretty sure just tossed a trash bag into space

[rotund tinsel]

I always thought it was metaphorical for the orokin to be gods for the way drifter describes them

[stiff fable]

They explicitly styled themselves after gods

and with the entire origin system under their control they weren't too far off

[normal mountain]

They sure thought they were gods
And acted like it

[rotund tinsel]

I mean, immortality with continuity,everyone under your heel,"the not yet but is gonna be" tenno hunter,Warframes and the tenno,I would've thought they were gods too

[rotund tinsel]

"but you will,won't you?" I don't think that's erra slipping through anymore

[old dome]

wh??

[cunning tapir]

Welp, we'll know for sure tonight ||when Summer goes around. Then it'll be July, August, and September. But srsly, if anything eclipse related is going to happen, it'd be on this date. A day when Sol and Lua converge in the sky? that's gotta be important.||

[restive river]

I mean the password is for us to give to Russalka
Who has disappeared from 1999
So i doubt it

It wasn’t for us, it was for us to give to her when we see her

We shall see tho

[woven coyote]

It sounds more like a plot point for this arcs "the new war"

[cunning tapir]

The void war?

[woven coyote]

As in we dont know what the name of the quest will be
But this plot point will likely return in a quest that has the same importance as the new war, but for the current arc

[cunning tapir]

Maybe, the only reason I got for that whole "Solar Eclipse" theory was because it's difficult to say if we really did everything we could do at this point.

Imo, it feels weird to have us jump through all those hoops to give us a code phrase to give Rusalka only to have us wait until an update that lets us give her the code phrase. know what I mean?

It'd be like saying "Btw, you cleared this quest, but your reward is still being worked on. You'll have to wait til next update to receive it."

[restive river]

Somebody didn’t play railjack when it was released

Anyway though the whole point of the code is we give to Russalka once we find her
Which
We aren’t doing in 1999

[cunning tapir]

good point

I completely forgot about Railjack.

[restive river]

Railjack at release was genuinely painful

[spice jewel]

Oh god the rj launch fiasco

[restive river]

I remember videos where people figured out how to initiate the launch animation but that was about it lol

Then we got the whole thing with the reliquary drive

[spice jewel]

You mean the pre-empyrean update?

[restive river]

Yeah

We got to build the railjack before we got to play railjack

Once it was ready and released
Which
It was still horribly buggy
We installed the reliquary drive key like you do in the quest

[spice jewel]

Yeah i remember that, damn ship felt too large and twisty for me to navigate

[restive river]

I kinda miss the old ship layout, specifically the old turret windows
But the changes they made were needed and good :)

[spice jewel]

After some reworks tho. I actually started liking rj, i get to be captain now with npcs

[restive river]

Yeah it took a bit but it’s in a good place now :)

[spice jewel]

I still wonder how the dax crews exit the ship, do they also use archwings?

Like originally rj crews were dax iirc, so I’m like how do they get out or do they never?

[restive river]

I can see them using archwings

They have built in life support so no real issues there

[spice jewel]

I’d like to see teshin using one, don’t tell varzia

[stray herald]

How can a lack of life support kill a warframe? Is it because they are still partly organic?

[lean garden]

Yeap

[tall echo]

Current rj is too small imo

[restive river]

Old rj was too big

And that’s coming from someone that liked old rj layout

[tall echo]

So was ridley, yet now he's in smash

Bad joke

[woven coyote]

Mostly organic

[onyx compass]

do they breathe?

[lean garden]

Well, the life support does indicate they do

[woven coyote]

Eris has a spawn and a couple of extractions that demonstrate well enough that without something providing life support warframes cant breathe in space

Not to mention survival missions in grineer and corpus ships outright calling for our need for life support

[cunning tapir]

I think it just boils down to "hold your breath"

[woven coyote]

And before someone mentions archwing missions
The archwing provides life support
We can even see the life support membrane in the cutscene in the archwing mission where we use it for the first time

[cunning tapir]

like warframes do the "hold your breath" better than a normal non-infested person would.

[raven urchin]

I wish railjack was more integrated in base gameplay, replacing the Orbiter, being available from the beginning, merged navigation terminal, all archwing missions restructured to be Railjack missions, all terminals being movable like the conclave one so one can choose were to put arsenal, forge etc. The operator room hidden together to Wally finger

[restive river]

That could be really cool yeah :)
I hope they, at the very least, bring back the asrenal in the railjack and figure out how to implement railjack from open worlds

Like give us the nef fight crewsjip
Have us take on vay hek in orbit
Let me fight the infestation surrounding deimos

[raven urchin]

I think the Dax totally only used the slingshot, like cannon ball man

The biggest problem to Warframe is still having a lot of great systems but none of those working together.

It's great that I can summon my archgun and necramech on railjack/open world missions and some node missions, but I want more

[restive river]

I like to think in an alternate history we used the railjack to get to Duviri, crashed it, used it as our base of operations while we tried to escape
Though Duviri would probably have to be different in some concepts

I remember when all we had was the teaser
And then it finally arrived and it was fantastic
And still is!

[restive river]

They’ve def strayed from the “content island” claims in more recent years

Meanwhile K-Drives…

[raven urchin]

Why can't I ride my k-drive using Drifter on Hollvania like Back to the Future DE? Why?!

[restive river]

I remember when they talked about having our Operators ride K-Drives and ragdolling on a devstream
Iirc that was 2019

Also Operators in relays never happened, probably for the best tbh

[raven urchin]

No spoiler approach

[stiff fable]

I mean they could force pre-Second Dream players to only see Warframes in relays

[raven urchin]

But the Drifter uses k-drive in New War, sooo

[restive river]

Yeah, maybe that’s a remnant from that

Thing is
Drifter doesn’t do a lot of what they do in Duviri / prior to getting their powers because they had no other option
It’s safer and they’re stronger if they do it via their frame

Same reason they don’t use normal weapons or go into combat by themselves
The frame is more powerful and safer

While can not die we can be hurt

[raven urchin]

Yeah, but that's the lore reason...

Nowadays I love to go on Drifter mode with Umbra

[restive river]

I haven’t played with Umbra in a bit
I should do that since we got the exalted weapon changes

Been enjoying Mesa a lot

[raven urchin]

I only do 25 min endless runs? Yeah, but its great

Driftet should get more gameplay love, it's amazing to use him on duviri

[restive river]

I just wish we got some primaries for Drifter in Duviri
I’d love to have her use the Tigris like in the original teaser

[raven urchin]

And him using melee would let us have 2 melee in mission

[raven urchin]

DE should at least let us use pistol skins on Sirocco/Amps

[stiff fable]

It might actually happen now, they don't need Duviri as a testbed for Soulframe anymore

[restive river]

Agreed

[restive river]

Truuue

[stiff fable]

but I don't see us getting star chart weapons

Instead it'd probably be Sirocco sidegrades

[restive river]

I’d love if the two paths for Drifter and Operator were
Drifter gets more conventional weapons
Operator gets void majicks

[stiff fable]

Like a single shot musket, a blunderbuss, that kind of deal

[raven urchin]

The Drifter way should be a school like Naramon

[restive river]

I just want an expansion on our void abilities
Let me combine requiems for different effects

[stiff fable]

Operator abilities 3 and 4 when

[restive river]

Real

[stiff fable]

imo the last Drifter intrinsic should have been Sirocco customization unlocks

[restive river]

I just want more with the requiems
I loved how Ris was used in the arg

[stiff fable]

Which then applies to Sirocco as an amp

[raven urchin]

Customization as in modding? Agreed

[stiff fable]

Not modding, just changing how it works

[raven urchin]

As Skins? That should be base

[restive river]

Oh my friend had a wonderful idea
Transmog for weapons

Lore reason could be some void camouflage or something

[strange plinth]

transmog would be wonderful

[stiff fable]

No I mean you'd unlock the ability to make it rapid fire, or do extra status damage, or reload faster in exchange for no big hit etc

[raven urchin]

I just want transmog for amp than,I'm happy with normal skinned weapons

But of DE couldn't do it otherwise, I'd be happy regardless

[raven urchin]

I seee, you mean the amp but inside Duviri

Could be something like you "got the operator inventory of amps" intrinsic

[stiff fable]

yeah

I liked how Drifter intrinsics had one thing that would carry over to regular gameplay

Modified Sirocco in star chart would be a good one

[raven urchin]

WELL, that's the amp already

[stiff fable]

No I mean the modified one I'm making up here

[cunning tapir]

there was that snippet of the Sirocco having an incarnon skill-tree when Angels of the Zariman was being hyped up.

[raven urchin]

They should release the base of sirocco, so we could edit its other parts, the charged shot is fun

[woven coyote]

i think they mentioned that was a placeholder

[cunning tapir]

kinda figured. lowkey feels like we were robbed D=

[woven coyote]

would've been cool

[cunning tapir]

imho, it could've definitely used an incarnon mode.

[stiff fable]

amp incarnon lol

[cunning tapir]

🤔 maybe it could've used that charged shot for the incarnon transformation. Just give that puppy a super incarnon mode.

[raven urchin]

Another thing a Railjack overhauled base game could do is taking all missions on spacebases turned to Railjack missions

[stiff fable]

Oh right, quick shower thought: the Temple Warframe really didn't exist until Techrot Encore happened

[raven urchin]

That I don't know, things like that would impede a Prime by lore

Not that a lore contradiction would impede DE

[stiff fable]

we actually know this canonically

[cunning tapir]

Actually it's still possible for Temple to get a prime. All they'd need canonically is a primal strain.

[stiff fable]

spoilers for KIM stuff ||Ballas designed but never built Temple, and Albrecht got his hands on the batch and blueprints. Flare in the original timeline dies of the infestation/performs while infested and is executed, and then Albrecht gave them the jab* only for Flare to die in the reactor explosion. It's not until the loop starts that Flare survives, and can eventually leave the loop to reach the Orokin Era to participate in the Night of the Naga Drums like the inbox message says||

*Flare is simultaneously ||the inspiration for Temple, the Temple protoframe, and the original Temple Warframe which is unreal||

[raven urchin]

Can you explain it for me like I'm five ?

[stiff fable]

Just did

[raven urchin]

Thanks

Nope, DE isn't doing the circle timeline I refuse to believe it

[stiff fable]

Sorry fam

[raven urchin]

I hate the circled theory

[stiff fable]

They actually did it

[raven urchin]

https://tenor.com/view/vegeta-under-the-rain-gif-23841926

[stiff fable]

The important bit is that this confirms that the circle DOES eventually end

Because otherwise ||Lizzie would never be gifted to you as a shawzin||

[raven urchin]

But how does this makes a broken circle if the drifter goes to the past to receive Lizzie?

[stiff fable]

The Drifter doesn't actually carry things between past and future

Your 1999 arsenal is a copy made by Albrecht

(incidentally that's why Scaldra is much harder than Grineer and Corpus, your 1999 arsenal is made using 1999 materials, which is on par with what Scaldra has. In the Origin System the Tenno have much better materials science than Grineer and Corpus)

[restive river]

I don’t know about them being the inspiration?
They were on a comet til the night of the naga drums, the Orokin weren’t aware of them

Like Temple is not a bootstrap paradox from my understanding

Mostly cause
There’s no way the Orokin would be aware of them prior to their appearance during their very downfall
There’s no way for Albrecht to get the Temple strain during the old war when their appearance is during the night of the naga drums

[stiff fable]

Warframe still runs on the "things have to happen before they happen" rules. ||Temple didn't survive 1999 until the Drifter prevented the reactor from going up, so|| Albrecht got the Temple batch from Ballas, not from a live sample.

So there's no bootstrap paradox because the source isn't the Temple Warframe.

[restive river]

From my understanding the batch Albrecht used on Flare wasn’t Temple directly?
Like they become Temple and the design was likely altered when they bled on their guitar

[stiff fable]

Flare's email spells out that the Warframe batch was pretty clearly Temple

[restive river]

Notably though they mention how the design Ballas made was just a design
Which implies to me he never made them out of fear of them being too rebellious
So Albrecht nabs that design, makes the batch, gives it to Flare, Flare becomes the first Temple

[stiff fable]

Correct!

The paradoxical part is that Ballas made Temple based on Flare's story

[restive river]

I am glad we both agree there’s no bootstrap
Cause
Just no lol

[stiff fable]

And then Albrecht thought it'd be funny to make Flare the Temple proto

[restive river]

Little did he know he would be making the first Temple warframe

[stiff fable]

[restive river]

Or I guess he did know just didn’t know they’d survive til the fall of the orokin

Cause he didn’t even know that would happen
Probably theorized it cause. Duh but no way he could have known

[stiff fable]

This is where the history did change, because altering the fate of Hollvania added Temple to the Warframes who participated in the Orokin Collapse

[restive river]

Cause all the Protos will become full Warframes outside of the loop

[stiff fable]

mostly yes

[restive river]

Yeee
Also cause we help Flare in accepting Lizzie and their helminth infusion as a whole

[restive river]

Wdym mostly?

[stiff fable]

Kaya mentions that she feels less crazy when she's being piloted

Kaya also escaped 1999 differently

[restive river]

Well that’s a product of transference

[stiff fable]

yeah

I suspect that Kaya's escape route could be used by the rest of the protos

Jump to the origin system, find an operator

[restive river]

Also yes she does escape in her good ending
So Kaya escapes freely and likely with our consistent help strays from transforming fully

[restive river]

Hopefully
Only one who couldn’t go is Flare OR they know they have to go back to eventually become Temple and assist us in our past, their future

It sounded like the Protos weren’t gonna join us for what’s next but I hope that maybe through Kaya they could

[stiff fable]

I think Flare chose not to so they could keep fighting their rebellion to the end

[restive river]

Yeeee

We love Flare

[stiff fable]

Yeah the protos have to keep the loop going

[restive river]

Yeah
Ongoing fight against scaldra and keeping up the changes we made to 1999

Like the reactor not going boom

[stiff fable]

And now making sure the timeline doesn't break organically

though I guess that's mostly Minerva and Velimir

[restive river]

And Kaya but she’s just running numbers basically

[stiff fable]

yeah

[restive river]

Telling us where to go and such
But she can do that from Larunda tbh

Probably easier in the loop but she can always go back

[stiff fable]

I really like the sticker system and hope it'll be backported to EDA

[restive river]

I need to do a photoshoot of her and Yonta…

[restive river]

Same!

I’d be fine if the stickers were added but not the pix chips tbh

Like as a reward

[stiff fable]

yeah that's fair

heck go really crazy and let us use them in sorties

[restive river]

Minus the stickers that give pix chips
Those should still be useable

I’m kinda expecting them to do the archimedia gamemode at least one more time for whatever comes next

Maybe Yonta can give us something?

Maybe she gets in touch with Suda!

[stiff fable]

next update should be Grineer focused due to the Vor rework

[restive river]

Oh for sure!

[stiff fable]

major update.... sky's really the limit

[restive river]

Also the lighting!

I’m gonna be in the hospital during Pax unfortunately
Hopefully I will be awake enough to catch the stream somewhat

[stiff fable]

we're going to have to wait for Tennocon though

[restive river]

Yeah for sure

[stiff fable]

which aaaaaaaaa

[prisma sundial]

Update the Kuva Liches if they do the Grineer plz and thanking

[stiff fable]

it'll probably be at least two years before they meaningfully change the lich system

It works well enough

[prisma sundial]

Yeah but the Codas show how much smoother it could be, as a returning player having done both recently there's a big difference in terms of tedium

[stiff fable]

and they need to collect data from the infested liches first

It's mostly because you're supposed to double up on requiem thralls whenever your lich spawns

[prisma sundial]

But this is lore, a Grineer update will be interesting, some new movement would be cool from them

[stiff fable]

in practice though you obliterate enemies too fast for your lich to thrall up the extras

[restive river]

So excited for the new Vor fight

I gotta unlock the SP version to prep

I wonder if he’ll have new dialogue!

[stiff fable]

I've seen a small leak and am pleased

[restive river]

[stiff fable]

But I wonder about the SP variation

[restive river]

Crazier parkour

[stiff fable]

honestly good

So many boss fights were made before the parkour system was in place

so the first fight that leverages your mobility is.... well okay these days it's the Jackal

But discounting reworks the first fight that leverages your mobility is Tyl Regor

[restive river]

I think next up for boss reworks should either be more grineer ones or lephantis

[stiff fable]

Sergeant

[restive river]

Well yeah lol

[stiff fable]

but yeah Lephantis is.... woof

[restive river]

I did it recently with my partner and it’s
Not great

[stiff fable]

SP version is so much worse

[restive river]

Glad I was there to hit them hard but it’s a big yikes

Boss fights should be fun not a slog

[silk atlas]

Go try Apex Tank :))))))

[cunning tapir]

the "Umbra main who played Metal Gear Rising" in me lowkey wishes we'd be able to do a "Rules of Nature"-like killing blow on large bosses like Lephantis. >w>;;

[restive river]

I gave up on that a while ago
But that also exists to test you, it’s not a normal boss lol

[silk atlas]

Tests my patience, for sure

[cunning tapir]

I think it definitely tests the drifter's patience.

"I have weapons that're thousands of years more advanced than this thing. I have a literal otherworldly pistol that fires void energy. so why? Why can't I pierce this things mucking armor????"

[humble sierra]

https://tenor.com/view/kingpin-kingpin-clicking-pen-clicking-pen-spider-verse-into-the-spider-verse-gif-5180708998338482135

[tall echo]

Answer: because we mostly use weapons that, during the orokin era, were considered archaic

[humble sierra]

It would be crazy to get an Orokin enemy type or something that used Orokin-Era tech

[proper barn]

uhhhhhhhhhhh

ehhhhhh i could see it being a FEW things.

could be a update with a few reworks

i wouldn't put that past DE.

[stiff fable]

Like I said I saw some spoilers. >.>

Trying not to get the mods on my head, but Grineer update is a safe bet

[proper barn]

oh i know i also seent umm. but yeah i could see them like showing 1-2 updates at pax.

we are getting at least 3(?) more frames this year i think is what DE said?

[stiff fable]

that makes sense, we get an update every 2.5 months

[proper barn]

i could see the rest of the updates this year being like

All reworks for corpus grinner infested in the main system.

[stiff fable]

Definitely not

[proper barn]

they said something about a open world boss.

[stiff fable]

Just because they need SOME new content to progress things

[humble sierra]

4 Warframes a year is crazy tbh. If last year is any indication:

We got Temple in March
We probably get one this June
another in September
And one in December

[proper barn]

So the 3rd orb

[stiff fable]

oh that's cool I hadnt heard that

[proper barn]

I pretty sure it was "we will revist a open world" is what they said.

[stiff fable]

lol imagine it's actually the flydolon finally

[proper barn]

Which Fortuna needs a face lift.

hey we got the Flydolon.

it's The Ropalyst

[stiff fable]

in a completely different context!

[proper barn]

yeah but we did? lmao.

[stiff fable]

But realtalk Deimos has actually gone the longest without any changes

[proper barn]

I also think cetus is just like Finished and complete but Fortuna is a little still kinda rough around the edges.

[stiff fable]

Fortuna did get changes with TNW

[proper barn]

Diemos is actually fine i think.

[humble sierra]

Well they made it so that Vome turns things blue

that was a neat visual change

[stiff fable]

wasn't that part of the lighting changes?

[humble sierra]

I think it was with the Koumei update

[stiff fable]

huh!

[dire mountain]

Thats actually the name of my excalibur loadout

[dire mountain]

I think it was "we will be revisiting a familiar area" actually

[proper barn]

Was it?

I thought it was open world specifically.

I could be remembering wrong.

[dire mountain]

I think it was just familiar area

I don't think they said open world

[hexed oxide]

they did say open world

familiar open world area

[cosmic whale]

I'd like to see an orokin themed overworld we could explore. Like with this whole paradox thing maybe we could go back in time when the orokin was still a thing lol

[proper barn]

Why?

To see their war crimes and pre-kill them? Lmao

[proper barn]

Also Cetus is that. litearlly a Orokin Tower.

or diemos is a Orokin Families moon planet

just infested.

[restive river]

Also the Vallis is the way it is because of the Orokin

Like their remnants are
Everywhere lol

But going back to the orokin era or old war at some point could be fun, depends how it’s done

It’s clear we can change some things but others we just
Can’t

Like we can alter history to help Flare with Lizzie and they help us later but we can’t go back and save their bandmates

[proper barn]

i think the orokin stuff

is the most intresting when it's like this tbh.

[restive river]

Same tbh

Remnants of a lost civilization

That being said I would like to see the Orokin at their peak AND the night of the naga drums

Mostly the naga drums tbh

[brittle siren]

which proto is connect with this Vessel?

[swift sentinel]

Only Arthur and Aoi are shown in the Netracells, but there's no further information we can glean.

[restive river]

We only know Arthur’s Vessel which we use in Whispers

[dire mountain]

Vessels are so cool I hope we get more about them

[green hazel]

gang where is the sanctum. like why is the sanctum underneath wally

is it in the void

[dire mountain]

Its both inside deimos and parts of it are within the void

Wally is encroaching on the labs and sanctum

[old dome]

lua & the void are literally orokin architectural designs...

[restive river]

Heck you can make the argument that Duviri in some ways is quite Orokin due to it’s obvious culture inspirations in-universe

Like gold everywhere
People with long arms and blue skin
It’s like the orokin empire under an altered, storybook lens

[dire mountain]

Why did i see another person claiming that silvana used the Infestation to grow the forests of Earth

There's literally nothing that I know of that points to that

And no, her being an infested biologist is not enough. That's relevant for her being drafted into the transference and warframe projects

[lean garden]

doesnt she also say that her attempts were jiving?

[sage comet]

I have a question that I want to clear out
during the sacrifice quest, it was said mods existed
would that mean modding is part of the lore as well?

[dire mountain]

Always has been

[sage comet]

oh boy

that is rather busted as hell

[dire mountain]

She did say she needed a change. But if she brought along the technocyte I feel like she would have said that?

She said she would also grow the forests with her own willpower

"I'll stowaway with Earth-bound cargo. Just my Apothics and these slapdash Somatics I've stolen. By nightfall I'll be home again in a my tent under those bitter, acid skies. This time I'm going to fix it. I will seed a mighty forest, stronger than history... and by my will, use it to bring life."

[lean garden]

I think its in the first entry

she says something about her progress

[dire mountain]

Yes that's before she set off

[blazing helm]

for newwar, should i choose drifters or operator

base on my personal preference , i think i should choose operator since i feel that operator much close to lotus .. but idk if its good idea to choose operator

[strange plinth]

the choice there only affects dialog for the rest of the quest, afterwards, you can swap between them whenever you wish
gameplay is the same between them
and you can redo the quest (if you want) to see the other side

[dire mountain]

Why did someone laugh react to this

[blazing helm]

it was me, missclick sory

[dire mountain]

Understandable

[blazing helm]

but both like "ending" for the quest will be the same? just different path to the ending?

[strange plinth]

same ending, just different dialog, yeah

[blazing helm]

i feel i'll betrayed operator tho if i choose drifter at the same time drifter much cooler & matured

anyways , thankyou

[raven urchin]

DE should just merge the Drifter and operator at this point, there's no actual reason in having both, when one grows up we need to let our infancy behind, that's life

[strange plinth]

they're different characters, though
and they both have their purposes. drifter's in 1999 and operator's doing.. whatever's coming up next, presumably

[drowsy saddle]

the operator is technically more experienced

like hundred+ years of military service

[strange plinth]

true, somewhat
drifter has like a hundred+ years experience of dying instead

[woven coyote]

Ah yes the infancy of being a child soldier while under hypnosis to think you are a war machine

Classic

[strange plinth]

actually do we know how long the tenno were active before the initial second dream stuff?

[graceful swan]

They pretty much are merged 90% of the time plus if there was only Operator 1999 would've been more dangerous

[raven urchin]

It still exists as a nostalgic memento of days past. It needs to be gone

[woven coyote]

Lol

[raven urchin]

The non lore reason is that DE is /"lazying around"/ working on other things, instead of converting all operator cosmetics into Drifter cosmetics. I want my Wolf of Saturn Six Helmet!

[graceful swan]

It’s not easy to convert all the outfits

They aren't being lazy

[woven coyote]

Yuuuup clear troll

[strange plinth]

just because it isn't a priority doesn't mean they aren't working on it
new content over updating old content, most of the time
which tbf they're doing a pretty good job of balancing as far as i can tell

[blazing helm]

may ik , natah lotus or margulis?

i should pick lotus right?

i mean shes not margulis , and natah look weird 😂

[graceful swan]

The look is irrelevant you can buy the other skins

[blazing helm]

its weird but still beautifull just not normal looking

for lore wise, i should pick natah?

[graceful swan]

Natah or Lotus

[blazing helm]

i think i might go for natah, i feel like that her true self

[graceful swan]

There's reasons to pick either

Margulis is like giving Ballas what he wants

[blazing helm]

but ,its not that she also want to be margulis?

[graceful swan]

It’s still wrong

[blazing helm]

wut i understand, lotus who she is now and natah who she was and margulis who she want to be and also ballas want, but i hate ballas soo margulis is a no 😂

[graceful swan]

Renaming yourself to a dead woman's name

Ballas wanted Lotus to be Margulis

[blazing helm]

hell na, f u ballas

imma get lotus , shes my operator mom

[strange plinth]

they each have reasons, but margulis has the least
the name is the permanent bit. the appearances can be bought
||imo lotus is the best option||
and lore-wise, she's choosing here. that's something that catches a lot of people
you, the player, are making the decision, not your operator/drifter

[blazing helm]

btw, r this something that i have to be worried about?

[strange plinth]

not particularly
doesn't do much rn

[blazing helm]

understandable

[shrewd wyvern]

It's just a personality indicator of sorts for now

[blazing helm]

alrightt thankyou

[graceful swan]

DE was gonna tie it with abilities but never went through with it so now it’s kinda pointless

[blazing helm]

imma go for natah

[winged flume]

Now watch, it's going to be super crucial to how we resolve Walbrecht and Wally, and the whole Indifference when this Act wraps up.

[heavy dagger]

i just started the war within mission and something got into my mind what exatcly is the grineer?

[graceful swan]

Clones

[drowsy saddle]

if you asked the "people" who made em, tools

[heavy dagger]

The queens ugly asf

[drowsy saddle]

like a combine harvester or a planter

[heavy dagger]

i gotta watch like a 3 hour warframe lore video

[drowsy saddle]

that's due to clonerot

[graceful swan]

They had to take Grineer bodies because there weren't any kid bodies to steal

[heavy dagger]

Watched too much youtubeshorts while getting cloned thats why they rottin

[strange plinth]

don't-
they'll probably be full of headcanon and/or outdated info

[heavy dagger]

So the queens aint grineer?

[graceful swan]

They're Orokin

[heavy dagger]

What do u think is the real one tho i have a lot of confusions

[heavy dagger]

What is orokin

[strange plinth]

you're about to learn a bit about them through that quest

[graceful swan]

Keep doing your quests when you meet a blue person you've met an Orokin

You killed most of them

[heavy dagger]

ı'm so confused abt a lot of things
Sentinels
Teshin
Duvuri

[heavy dagger]

U mean tenno did?

[graceful swan]

Yes

[strange plinth]

yeah
duviri, story-wise, is during a different quest that's later. unfortunately duviri is way too useful to lock behind there

[drowsy saddle]

Duviri is irrelevant till you finish New War

[graceful swan]

What’s confusing you about Teshin?

[heavy dagger]

Ah k

[drowsy saddle]

Duviri is just available early due to how useful the Circuit is

[heavy dagger]

Why was he in duvuri and didnt he die? Besides why is he so human and tech and why is he with the queens

[drowsy saddle]

even outside of SP rewards, being able to quite easily pick up a frame and an augment for it every week is incredible

[graceful swan]

You revive him in the Duviri Quest

[heavy dagger]

Yeah

[drowsy saddle]

the events of Duviri haven't happened till the New War

[heavy dagger]

When we turn back time right?

[graceful swan]

Yes

[heavy dagger]

i don even remember the events

[drowsy saddle]

Teshin is a Dax, basically a supersoldier genetically forced to be loyal to the Orokin, and in specific anyone who hold the royal sceptre

so even if he wanted to rebel against the queens, his DNA wouldn't allow it

[graceful swan]

You really shouldn't have done Duviri before War Within

[heavy dagger]

My friend told me to open it cuz he said i Can get parts and augments quickly

ill prob play the duvuri quest again after the war within

[graceful swan]

You're friend definitely didn't think about the lore ramifications of that

[heavy dagger]

Yea he only cares abt lotus

[drowsy saddle]

tbf i did duviri as soon as i got to uranus, i just let it slide over my brain

[heavy dagger]

So the orokin is like royalty?

[graceful swan]

They were

[drowsy saddle]

im used to what-if and alt stories form LNs

[strange plinth]

the orokin were the high caste of their society, yeah

[heavy dagger]

Then a war happened

[drowsy saddle]

the 1%

or even the 0.1% tbh

[strange plinth]

yeah i did duviri before it got locked behind a junction n i accepted most of it as 'oh ok. i hope that'll make sense later'

[heavy dagger]

Lotus hid the humans in the moon
Then hid the moon in the void and use flesh puppets called frames

To defend shi

[drowsy saddle]

the flesh puppets were before the moon

[graceful swan]

They were in pods before Lotus

[heavy dagger]

Huh

Who put em there

[graceful swan]

Margulis

[heavy dagger]

Whosthat

[graceful swan]

You hear her voice in TSD

She is also mentioned at the end

[heavy dagger]

Tsd?

[drowsy saddle]

Second Dream

[heavy dagger]

i forgot that quest too

Wait is margulis the woman at the opening cutscene?

[graceful swan]

You really gotta start paying attention in quests as the info after won't make sense

No that's you

[heavy dagger]

what

[graceful swan]

That cutscene wasn't made by DE so doesn't actually make sense

[heavy dagger]

Oh k

[charred patio]

oh god
I forgot that the reset means I have to go through the kaya conversation again

[terse yacht]

What books do y'all think Dante like

[karmic prism]

Yaoi

💯

[graceful swan]

Magic books

[raven urchin]

I just understood it as she was the first Tenno to wake up from Second Dream, not exactly us

[graceful swan]

It’s meant to be us but third party didn't bothe thinking about the lore errors

[raven urchin]

Of course It's haha, that's just my headcannon

https://tenor.com/view/daffy-duck-kanone-canon-gif-15002625

[old dome]

jane austen's

[brittle siren]

I mean which part not make sense beside the gender of that Tenno and the fact they still know that they are not just "Warframe" but also a human with void power?

[restive river]

I mean she’s just a stand in for us the player so her gender doesn’t really matter
But also yeah the whole not being in the second dream just. Doesn’t make sense

[graceful swan]

The Second Dream

[restive river]

I mostly chalk up that cutscene as she’s another tenno that’s gone through a different journey

[brittle siren]

The Lotus part also not make any sense too

[graceful swan]

It wasn't made by DE which is why it isn't lore accurate

[brittle siren]

(I mean the lotus flower)

[restive river]

The mag bubble literally being so inaccurate they had to make it an ability:

[graceful swan]

Lol

[restive river]

What about the lotus flower doesn’t make sense?

It’s just a symbol of the lotus lol

[graceful swan]

DE really should've done it themselves

[brittle siren]

Oh no I mean
How tf a "dream child" can put down a flower in real time

[graceful swan]

It wasn't a dream child

[restive river]

They were likely busy with other stuff

Like
Making the game better :p

[graceful swan]

Then they should've told them the lore first

[brittle siren]

Also she reappeared in New War trailer, and it kinda canon, quesion mark?

[brittle siren]

But isn't she a Tenno too?

[restive river]

Yeah, it feels like they told them some of it or one of the people on the team played enough but didn’t understand everything

[restive river]

She’s a tenno but she’s awake before she’s supposed to be and a stand in for us so it just
Doesn’t make sense cause if she’s a stand in for us she’s meant to be asleep on Lua

[graceful swan]

She's not in the dream at the start of the game that’s the whole reason the cutscene doesn't make sense

[restive river]

What happens in game is canon
Mara is just a placeholder for us, she isn’t canon

Like there’s no Mara character in game, in the script she’s a placeholder for us

[brittle siren]

Like what I'm saying here if she not physically there, then how she could put the flower down and those lotus still under the 3 warframes even after she gone?

[restive river]

If anything I can see the interpretation of that cutscene of us finding our way back to our warframe after being in complete cryosleep for so long

[graceful swan]

Lotus gotta stop waking up her kids early

[restive river]

You’re overthinking it
And someone placing a flower while hypothetically not actually being there is the least insane thing that’s happened in this game

[brittle siren]

Yeah probably

[graceful swan]

She wasn't not there you see where she goes

[restive river]

Easy explaination: she’s a representation of us getting back to our frame, we conceptually embody the flower as we place them and fully awake when she disappears
Boom