lore-discussion

[woven coyote]

But we dont have any confirmation in game

[marble pewter]

ah interesting..

[restive river]

I don’t think there’s any info on them tbh

[woven coyote]

Yeah

[restive river]

Heck they could be a product of ayatans, just memories

Or cephalons doing their tasks

[woven coyote]

Like i said
Just feels like shadows of the past

[restive river]

They predate the idea of conceptual embodiment, at least for info known to the player

[marble pewter]

cephalons.. that's an interesting theory too

[restive river]

Whatever they are, they kinda just
Are

[woven coyote]

Yup

[marble pewter]

yea definitely that

[woven coyote]

Considering the concept behind lua ,shadows of the past could be a good contender, what with lua spy and all

Also voruna leverian did mention certain regions of lua were known to be more void affected, causing visions and iirc manifestations sometimes

[restive river]

Ye, so likely some form of void manifestation but overall unconfirmed

[woven coyote]

Yeah
Too undefined to be individuals

[restive river]

Love that we can observe the palimpsest of spacetime in real time with Lua Spy

[woven coyote]

Probably some background notion or whatever

[restive river]

If they’re conceptual embodiments they’re not like the holdfasts or. Really any defined void entities we’ve seen

[woven coyote]

Yeah

[feral cape]

If you think that's bad think about the void hole simulor and the black hole ability from the archwing

Think about all the hawking radiation that comes off those

[restive river]

The void hole does cold damage:

[graceful swan]

Void hole sounds like an insult

[restive river]

I’m calling Wally that

Oh yeah, my friend pointed out Wally has another new name/title
lizzie/the infestation calls him “The Smiling One”

[graceful swan]

Ima tell Wally to shut the Void hole so I can take the Zariman to Tau

[restive river]

Please Rebb
Give me some Yonta content this year

[graceful swan]

Speaking of Holdfasts
They didn't help at all when we were on the Zariman in 1999

Quinn said he would

[feral cape]

Yea well it's a bunch of hoopla

[proper barn]

I think the finger drive is too damaged. We could fix the solar rail.

[graceful swan]

I'll just cut Wally's finger off

[proper barn]

Cuz Hunhow only destroyed our side.

[restive river]

I think they’ll help later

[restive river]

https://tenor.com/view/clonk-hooplah-brick-spongebob-noisy-gif-17264229

[proper barn]

I think The Holdfasts and duviri will be like part of the "void entities against wally" coalition we got going.

[restive river]

Wdym damaged

[restive river]

Oh def, they’ll be part of the later part of the void war

Like the void war started with whispers and has continued with 1999 but the real fight has yet to happen

[proper barn]

It's shielding is gone and turning it on is like why there's so much just void radiation happening.

[restive river]

We had to establish love is how we beat him and gain that love

[restive river]

Ah

[proper barn]

I wonder if we will meet like

Some part of the Infested in normal time that wants to help us?

[restive river]

Yonta does know how to get us to Tau

[restive river]

Helminth:

[proper barn]

Besides Helminth.

[restive river]

Lol

The infestation, or Lizzie, has said they love us
So
In theory, yes

We just keep meeting the bad eggs of the hive kind

[proper barn]

Cuz Lizzie is the first purely infested we actually had to have a conversation with. Like we have had 1 sided conversations with our helmith but lizzie is very interesting.

[restive river]

Ye

[proper barn]

No infestation has lied either which is hilarious.

[restive river]

Didn’t she say they can’t lie?

Like lying is a human thing

[proper barn]

Yeah.

Her and the drifter.

[restive river]

Love that tbh

[proper barn]

Like she might not always say it in the best way and what she's saying might be like horrifying.

But she never lies.

[restive river]

Yeah

The infestation can not lie

It does not need to deceive
Except
Ig that one time it did with Arlo

But that isolated and idk if I’d call that lying
Like the Coda liches aren’t lying

[proper barn]

I don't think Arlo ever lied either.

[restive river]

Yeah, more so deceived to an extent with his appearance
But he technically never spoke and thus never lied

But I wouldn’t call mimicry or whatever happened there to be lying

Same with the coda

[proper barn]

The Coda are funny

[restive river]

Funny clones with interview voicelines

[proper barn]

Cuz they weren't even made the Infested purposefully.

[restive river]

What

They used the infestation to make the clones

[feral cape]

Have we considered that there love is war

[restive river]

Iirc she specifically calls out the others for being different

Like we mention how they want to kill us and she says they’re misguided or something
I can’t check atm

[feral cape]

She actually affirms they want to kill us because "do your white blood cells not attack when you're sick"

They view the frames or operator as sickness can't tell

[proper barn]

Made by the infestation purposefully. They where made by a random producer and scaladra.

[restive river]

Ah I see what you mean

[humble sierra]

Probably the void-part of the Operator more than anything

[restive river]

And/Or the fact the frames are void powred

[brittle siren]

To be precise, the Hollvania government

[restive river]

It was explicitly scaldra too

[brittle siren]

Funny that Lizzie called Wally "The Smiling One"

Also she understands the "nothingness" from Wally, when we talk with her

[brittle siren]

Well Scaldra was made with multiple companies behind it including Hollvania government

[restive river]

Yes but for the Coda clones Scaldra was explosively involved

[brittle siren]

Ah I see

So the tank is also their work right?

[restive river]

It sounds like the tank just gets infested

Not planned

[humble sierra]

They made the tank and designed it to be un-infestible

It was very infestible

[brittle siren]

I mean the higher up could experiment on it without letting Viktor know

They did help making the Coda Liches and Viktor seem like he doesn't know anything about it

My theory is the whole Scaldra that go out and fight Techrot is like the Grinner or Dax, and their "real" leader, not counting Neci and Viktor, is like comparable to thr Orokin

[humble sierra]

Viktor seems like he's barely behind any decision making, tbh

Besides ordering troops and whatnot

[brittle siren]

Yeah seem like his hate for the Hex is genuine

[restive river]

He thinks we took his love from him

Cause
It def sounds like he and Russalka were together

[brittle siren]

Yeah, that could what the higher up told him

[humble sierra]

He also got clowned on by Temple and the Rippers too

[restive river]

Maybe but like
She literally disappeared-

[brittle siren]

Well yes, but he could've report to his boss and they tell him sth like: See Viktor? They steal everything from us, now even Neci is dead by their hand.

[humble sierra]

For him, she must've left on Dec31, 1998? Since we extended the loop and that seems to have gotten rid of MITW's presence and Rusalka by extension?

[restive river]

I doubt the higher ups know about the Hex or us ngl

Or even Albrecht

[brittle siren]

They definitely know, Albrecht poster is everywhere

Like even Viktor know Albrecht

[restive river]

He did also have a lab yeah

But us? Doubtful

[brittle siren]

(He was called Doktor Zero)

[restive river]

Likely know the Hex but don’t see them as much of a threat tbh

[restive river]

Doktor Friday.

[humble sierra]

Albrecht was called Doktor Friday

[restive river]

Friday cause
We end as we began
1999 starts and ends on a Friday

[brittle siren]

This is from Neci speaking

[restive river]

I think that was just an insult then :p

Cause he literally went by Doktor Friday

[brittle siren]

Nvm patients zero not dr zero

My mistake

[humble sierra]

Might be why he was called Doktor Friday (as far as creative decisions go, not in-universe)

[restive river]

That too yeah

Def the end as we began thing too

[brittle siren]

Btw from Velimir and Minerva chat, it seem like the Orokin mindset is already exist since 1999 too

[restive river]

Yeah, O.R.O.

Omnia

Also Dualism exists, but that’s a religion

[brittle siren]

So wait, does Albrecht reponsible for the Warframe to exist in the future

[feral cape]

Can you send the kim for your nothingness statement?

[brittle siren]

Surely the Scaldra wouldn't slip a chance to find more info about the "warframe"

[brittle siren]

I'm not in the game rn but let me hop on rq

[feral cape]

Likely not the modern day is separated by 18 radiation wars and probably alot of cataclysm

Think the logic of the loki TV show

[humble sierra]

Probably not

[brittle siren]

Still their mindset from the far past is even connected to their descendants in the future, aka the Orokin. The Infested is also still there when the Orokin are built, so I could assume some data was keep intact (since idk where this was said, that the Orokin deleted everything from the past, but they not that stupid to keep some for themselves)

[brittle siren]

Oh thanks

[restive river]

No.

[azure elm]

so unifying flare, does this story take place the fastest?

maybe its just me but im still in talks with nova, and I might have screwed up on the divorcee's

[humble sierra]

You can unify Flare and Lizzie before you can get Veliminerva back together, yeah, but they'd all finish their storylines around the same time, I think

[azure elm]

i think I utterly borked the vel/min relationship

[humble sierra]

Depends on the chat you got today

[azure elm]

they've only been posting 3 messages in the chat the last two days

[humble sierra]

OOF yeah you'd have to reset if you want them talking again

[azure elm]

ah right no cussing

now I feel like nova

[restive river]

what the [molecular_prime.sfx]

[humble sierra]

If you got the Argon crystal chat with Kaya today (and you talked about Argon crystals instead of being a troll and talking about the other two), you're set with her

[azure elm]

but kayas been talking about me being a lighthouse, so I assume im on the right track with them at least

[humble sierra]

Yeah there's nothing else to do with her as far as her "good" ending goes

[azure elm]

Im really happy that kaya is warming up, i kinda expect that she's gonna be a character we see in future updates

seeing as shes the only one devoted to getting OUT

[restive river]

I think we’ll see them all again, including russalka

Which
I can see her becoming an ally ngl

[azure elm]

rusalka comes back but we make her an ally thru 2 weeks of messaging her XD

[restive river]

Lmao

[azure elm]

also, maybe this was me reading too deep, but was viktor a fan in the super fan way, or a fan in the, take you to the band bus wayyy?

the quarrel between vik and flare feels like situationship gone nuclear

[restive river]

I 100% agree

I got that vibe real fast

[azure elm]

yea, like a stalker going postal after being told they can't be more than a one night stand

which also fits into flares bisexual bowie vibes

[humble sierra]

I think Viktor wasn't a fan at all, he just thought "Man, these Hollvanians are such a downer. I'll look for a band to cheer them up, but I don't listen to anything but classical music. Intern, give me a band! Temple and the Rippers, huh? Okay, I'll contact them. Heyyyyyy Flare, I'm a big fan, play us a song"

And then he finds out the band isn't exactly appreciative of paramilitary organizations like Scaldra

[azure elm]

I can fit that manipulator mindset in my vision of viktor, it just seems like he himself is very attached to making flare specifically suffer

in a 'lover who shouldn't have been loved scorn' way

[humble sierra]

It was probably humiliating for him directly

[azure elm]

that is also true

[north jolt]

So basically the plot of that one movie where some dudes get hired to entertain a dictator

[azure elm]

mannn I dont wanna reset just to get vell and minervas good ending

im on good terms with literally all the other hex its not my fault I dont do well around angry divorcees :C

[humble sierra]

Yeah I wish we could reset individually

[azure elm]

YESSSsss

[humble sierra]

The issue with these new protoframes is that there's a good ending and a bad ending

it's not like the Hex where the only thing you can lock yourself out of is the romance

[azure elm]

very true

[sweet wadi]

The KIM messages for the new protos are a puzzle rather than a roleplay, yeah.

[azure elm]

^^ legit

felt like I was stepping on egg shells instead of talking to someone

its like how the birthday messages are either good or bad

[north ferry]

I mean... kinda yes and kinda no?

[azure elm]

So, a disection of what threads are left to chase as far as main beats
the pazuul entity, erras soul, the idea of resurrection to sentients and tau
Albrecht either on tau or on his way, major rusulka kept in void stasis, as kaya mentioned today, things in the void don't decay
the indifference, their struggle to conceptualize human emotion, and how the infested might possibly play into that with how lizzie struggled to understand it
Narmers remnants, clems operations, and stalker with his orion/sirius beybe
how do yall think the next year plays out? Will erra/pazuul get involved when albrecht, an orokin thru and thru, reaches tau? will albrecht even survive tau, if scaldra are able to rough him up what good is he against sentients? Further more, how will we use love to destroy indifference? One big concert with flare and true onlyne at the head?

also, did I miss anything worth discussing?

[heady quest]

They’re gonna do a 180 again… like they have done after NW and after duviri

The difference is gonna show up

[azure elm]

😮

but we're the difference

cuz we make a difference

sure its not measurable in gameplay values but we saved the lives of the hex, and the zariman remnants, cetus and venus

[lean garden]

What I told DE in their survey on how I imagine things panning out went like this:
We revisit Pazuul and narmer, since pazuul was trying to harvest tons of resources for something, that something is pazuul reconstructing the rail to tau, we stop pazuul (or not) but the rail goes live, and we head to tau, there we discover the mesoamerica themed sentients (KIV Lettie's KIM), but instead of clobbering us, they turn to us for help, because theyre being beseiged by murmur forces, chock full of void stuffs that hurt them bad. Why are the murmur there you might ask? Because flippin albrecht entrati is there in Tau

[heady quest]

Damn that would be cool to see

[lean garden]

DE please hire me

[azure elm]

i like that idea, however Im not sure the sentients use meso american language for anything more than to accurately illustrate the dicotemy of them agaainst the orokin

[lean garden]

its not meso american language, theyre straight up quoting mesoamerica ancient religious texts

[azure elm]

the nahua americans were a sea (system) away, and fighting against pale monsters who wanted to steal what they had sewn into the earth

[heady quest]

We need like a bit more down to origin system story progression, you know? Like we have been going to different places like duviri, the labs (which kinda goes to that murmur place) and now 1999 we haven’t had a decent actual story progression in the origin system itself. Yea we got Jade shadows but that didn’t really add anything for us

[lean garden]

Well, yes, that comparison is extremely apt, but I suspect that mesoamerican design language will find itself into present day Tau sentients

[heady quest]

Guys like the third orb 😮

[lean garden]

part of the sentient design is already edging in that area

with the whole ball slit eye design

[azure elm]

i can see that happening, but I have a feeling the sentients quote that language to try and appeal to human history, however the orokin, and by extention the scaldra, have destroyed so much of it that their efforts are futile

lettie, as with all of the hex, play an important role in showing humanity =/= orokin

she and the others give us the historical concept that the tenno lack

in a sense, they adapted to the fact that they wouldn't be able to reason with the orokin

but now, with grandpa hunhow setting aside old grudges, erra's inner soul thinking at times on forgiveness, and lotus being a new being entirely, perhaps the path to peace is clearer than ever

[lean garden]

We literally have 2/3 of what I'd like to call the Command-Class sentients on our side

like we have majority support of Sentient Command on our side

[azure elm]

i would say 1/2, as hunhow isn't really on our side or against us

hes tired and sleepy and taking a nice bubble bath

[heady quest]

If grandpa is calming down we need like a rogue sentient to replace stalker. Then the acolytes can worship that guy

[lean garden]

Nah, the Great and terrible hun how will definitely vouch for us if it meant convincing the tau sentients that we can help them

[azure elm]

the only thing he truthfully cares about is his children, and that means us restoring erra

if we wanted hunhow in action, we'd need to bring his attention directly to healing erra of pazuuls archon influence

but whos to say he's not so spent that he can even rise?

he didn't have the benefit of staying on tau, or hiding in the moon'

[heady quest]

I wonder where frame baby comes into play

[azure elm]

orion will be either extremely important or never touched on again

like the kuva braid

[heady quest]

Kuva braid? 😂

[azure elm]

exactly

the kuva we ingested or didnt at the end of war within

[heady quest]

Oh that was nothing really. Just some mind controlling substance

[azure elm]

I have this really sad headcanon that orion will grow rapidly, and end up going on a quest to learn the stalkers identity, driving him into conflict with his father

at the end, impaled by his own HATE, the stalkers identity will be revealed to orion, who then takes on the stalker identity

[heady quest]

Bro stalker has to chill man. We have done so much for this guy and our grandpa has laid down his weapons. He gotta be replaced somehow with something else

[azure elm]

by his son

[heady quest]

Nah but why his son coming after us? We are the reason he was born

[azure elm]

his identity shouldn't matter to us, it wouldn't be impactful anyway, but to lose your father because he was so attached to his identity of revenge, and our meddling in the quest perhaps

it might just drive one into grief, dread even, despair maybe?

[heady quest]

If you think about it, us the operator got inside Jade and literally felt the birthing. So we got to have some motherly instinct that got imprinted on us from Jade so idk why we could betray Orion in an upcoming quest

[heady quest]

Ah hell nah 😂

[azure elm]

we dont betray orion, he loses himself in sadness

[heady quest]

Imagine he just gonna be a frame for us with stalker abilities

Maybe that is how he will get to duviri

[azure elm]

i jsut want the stalker helmet pls DE

[rancid lance]

I need more stalker lore

[azure elm]

i disagree, who stalker is aside from sorren and his love of jade dont actually matter

what matters is what happens next

[heady quest]

Coming for Wally

Get him out of his wall

[rancid lance]

thats exactly what i want

[heady quest]

Who needs a wall anyway

[rancid lance]

Just trap him in a giant jar. Easy as that, hes contained.

[azure elm]

qorvex and atlas need a wall

[heady quest]

Trap him inside another wall

[heady quest]

It would be funny if they just grab a piece of wally’s wall to place down in the world for 2 seconds

[rancid lance]

Sad that wally has never experienced the joy of gambling 😔

[graceful swan]

All people that live in a house Apartment, Orbiter, Spaceship the Moon or Mars or it’s moon

[heady quest]

Just get a force field they’ll be alright

[restive river]

Guys
Wally?
He’s Konzu’s half brother

Source: ||I saw it in a dream on the first if April ||

[proper barn]

okay this isn't as bad as april first postsi've seen before lmao.

[old dome]

actually,, speaking of kuva & tnw... what were the big glowy red orbs inside the sentient ship in tnw??

[proper barn]

Kuva.

It implafies the effects of the veils.

At least and probably some other stuff too.

[old dome]

ordis having more lines abt the resident dax dad, umbra (where was he in tnw? why didnt ordis mention him back then???)

[graceful swan]

In your arsenal silly

[old dome]

i just would like more lines abt him from ordis bc of this... like how ordis always complains abt helminth & the animals you bring in

that one like in js made me realize how starved i am for umbra just. doing whatever around the orbiter 😭😭

now for smth acrually serious,,, i really would like them to explain how drifter met the lotus at some point and how they managed to get her back into the main continuity world... & where was operator exactly—i know they got sucked into the void but where did they end up after that??

like. its been years since tnw ended & these 2 things were just... not explained. at all. not even in like,, post-quest notes found somewhere in the camp.

[north ferry]

So... Duviri and... trapped in hell?

Actually the Whispers in the Walls pc I think also covers it.

[old dome]

pc...?

[north ferry]

Next to Loid.

[old dome]

i know ballas said he's send the tenno back to hell but like......... which hell is that? literal or the zariman?

[north ferry]

It has a convenient run down of the major events up to that point, probably specifically as a reminder of the missed details.

[old dome]

also lotus wasnt in duviri,,, just her hand but not her entire body

[graceful swan]

It’s either
The hand regrew her or
She was found off screen

[north ferry]

I just persumed she reformed from the hand.

[graceful swan]

Yeah

That's my theory too

Me and Ducky were actually talking about this last night

[old dome]

it doesnt make sense to me,,

[north ferry]

Considering she fell into the same void portal that Operator, Hand and Teshin did, entirely possible it's duviri or zariman.

Can't help you there.

[graceful swan]

Why doesn’t it make sense that she reformed from the hand?

[lean garden]

where was operator exactly—i know they got sucked into the void but where did they end up after that??
The time loop lmao

[north ferry]

There are angry sentient ghosts (eidolon) piecing shattered pieces together and wandering across the Plains after being detonated as well.

I really suggest reading the terminal in the sanctum anatomica. It helps understand, it helped me.

[graceful swan]

I’m sure a Sentient can reform from a hand

[north ferry]

Iirc before the first shard she was simply ghostly except hand.

[graceful swan]

I’ve always wondered how Lotus can be weak to Void yet is completely fine holding a child and being carried by Drifter and is fine going on the Moon that was in the Void for 1000 years

Oh and is fine standing on Wally

[lean garden]

its not like touching us going to do anything to her

[north ferry]

I mean, we're weak to water but we go swimming I suppose... it's not like it's being blasted at her as a beam.
Also the vanguard of the sentients came through the void if I recall.

[lean garden]

all 'em Origin side sentietns came through the void

[graceful swan]

So is it only direct contact with the Void that they’re weak to?

[north ferry]

I heard things about a solar rail being built to tau or something, did that not complete?

[graceful swan]

It was completed

Hunhow destroyed it

He destroyed the one on the origin side

[north ferry]

Could they not have brought Sentients through it? Or does it use void too? I never thought about that, I just assumed it didn't.

[graceful swan]

They can go the long way round

But on way back they didn’t

That’s why Praghasa was in the state she was in

[lean garden]

they very much brought sentients through it

[old dome]

wh??

[lean garden]

time loop

[old dome]

...sorry i still dont get it

[graceful swan]

What don’t you get about time loop?

[old dome]

what does it have to do w operator being sucked into the void??

especially bc drifter went into main earth... but where exactly did operator go??

[lean garden]

Into a time loop

remember the bit you played during the New War where you walk around the zariman?

there. Time loop

[old dome]

ah... so stuck on the zariman in a loop

[lean garden]

pretty much

[old dome]

...yeah that makes sense bc that Was their personal hell

[dreamy peak]

Quick question. How long was the lotus gone ingame before she came back in a later quest.

[old dome]

we dont know

but irl she was gone for 4 years

[dreamy peak]

Thank you

[graceful swan]

Game doesn't give time information

1999 is the first time we have even got an actual year

[old dome]

yeah the narrative is very "stream of consciousness"-esque where the time is whatever you want it to be.

[humble sierra]

Yeah the events of Warframe could be all in the span of a few days

[strange turtle]

Also because he threw them in the Void, and the Tenno are called “Void Devils”/“Demons”

[charred patio]

well, I would have loved to progress our relationship further
but aoi broke into my room the other day
and I just couldnt break up with her

[graceful swan]

There's always yearly reset to correct your mistake

[charred patio]

yeah, waiting for that XD

[humble sierra]

Luckily it's this week

[charred patio]

well, there it is
THE nova conversation

[brittle siren]

How strong is Dominus Thrax army (including Orowyrm) compare to other faction in Warframe?

[azure elm]

Not very

the orowyrm is the only outstanding fator

in most like space fights it could be a tide changer, being invulnerable and such, but the rest of his forces are so paper squishy it doesn't even take a warframe to maul thru them

[chrome frost]

Did we ever consider the possibility of the infestation trying to protect the solar system by assimilating everyone and everything in it?

Their whole mentality from what we hear and know seems to be just...well...unconditional love and desire to spread said love and make sure Noone stays lonely if we're dumbing it down. And infested seem to know of wally (look lizzie convos and voicelines). The giant bodies in albrechts lab seem to be infested by a modified Grey strain of the infestation, which means everything they hear and see is also heard and seen by the greater hive since the infested seem to operate by the logic of if one knows something all know it. Thus it's possible that they listened to albrecht yap about the "weakness" of wally

And they never seem to even say the word hate, only when they are confused as to why you're attacking them

[graceful swan]

You can't Infest the whole system then play the I'm only doing it for your protection card

[chrome frost]

I am being out of character rn, also who says that they aren't trying to protect it with their own infested screwed up way?

They don't see "self" as having any meaning, so why wouldn't they consider themselves heroes? In their hivemind all they're doing is fighting off a giant cosmic uncontrollable, uninfectable, ununderstandable horror which can take over bodies

Afterall the indifference targets those who are alone, have no connections, who don't have love. What does the hive do? It grants you access to THOUSANDS of people (though that's not certain) and all preech the words of "embracing" eachother

[feral cape]

And if it's doing that so what?

The goal of saving everyone only matters when everyone's left

I wish to end all suffering thus I will freeze the universe in a snapshot of time nothing will happen nothing will suffer

[chrome frost]

may be just trying to understand how the hive works since it doesn't seem to spread just for the sake of getting rid of hunger

[lean garden]

I think the key things to consider that what we think of "love" or "embrace" in the case of the infested, is very likely not going to run counter to wally

because this is love and embrace in the infested sense, but wally is running on Hooman OS

[chrome frost]

Well yeah

Also arlos story from nightware looks as more of the infested trying to establish contact and trying to show that they are in their own twisted way harmless instead of just luring peeps in

[graceful swan]

Infested also can't fight Wally and Wally existing downstairs feared them

[chrome frost]

If you look deeper into it

[lean garden]

I mean, its undeniable that they want to subsume anything in their path, but for protection? I think thats unlikely

[chrome frost]

They fear wally, they might have heard entrati figuring out love being the weapon (if those giants have some connection to the hive) wouldn't they try to create said weapon?

It's like....uhh how do I phrase it even?.

Imagine a thing which mainly follows its survival instincts, has a mind, and is yet to be permanently killed or hurt...and then it suddenly gets this dread, the first time they fear death

[lean garden]

Well, because theyre not constantly pushing for that:

Konzu: "Infestation. My uncle, Hinmun, sold minerals aboard a market near Eris. Quite popular with deep-system traders. At least it was. They were broadsided by one of these boils. It spread fast. They could have run, risked taking it with them. Instead, they turned off life support and blew out escape pods. Decades later, it still orbits Eris. Writhing. One voice repeating the same message over and over: 'We are death. Leave us, and do not look back.' My uncle's voice. Fail here, Tenno, and that will be the fate of Cetus: to be a warning for the living, from a place where none may tread."

If they were truly only trying to manufacture the biggest anti-wally weapon, they are doing the worst job at it for konzu's uncle

[chrome frost]

huh never got that line

[strange plinth]

the vessels are probably cut off from the infested hive in the same way that foundry-built warframes are, they'd need to be "reclaimed" like that mesa was in the infested alad v quest i can't remember the name of

[chrome frost]

where is it?

[lean garden]

when did you start playing warframe?

[chrome frost]

uhhh 2023 ish?

gimme a sec gotta check steam

[lean garden]

2023 when?

[chrome frost]

a moment

[lean garden]

anyways, if its anywhere near november 2023, then you'd have been too new to enjoy the plague star event

which is where the line comes from

[chrome frost]

didnt get to do it sadly

[lean garden]

its a much anticipated event, because its forma galore

[chrome frost]

that would also mean that that infested lore is lost to me so

[lean garden]

https://www.orokinarchives.com
behold

[chrome frost]

:0 this demon provides lore

[chrome frost]

also would that mean that the infested are lying? or just certain infested not getting suppressed enough by the hivemind and so they basically tell you "run the hell away the us are coming to assimilate you"

but that also goes against what lizzie told us, that infested cant lie....

[lean garden]

lying? nah

[chrome frost]

so the hive basically just twists the mind of the victim into believing its motto?

oh wait we have an example, salad V

"You see Tenno, my new flesh comes with new desire. This Infestation and I, we are one. I want what it wants. And it wants- what I want. Together, we will crawl across the bountiful flesh of this system. Join us."-Mutalist salad v

[chrome frost]

well yeah it still a wonder he was even able to speak against the hive's desire, then again there are atleast 2 options as to why he was doing that:

A:not fully assimilated into the hive, letting him speak what he believes without his beliefs being twisted into something else by the hive

or B:may be it had something to do with the fact that he and konzu are blood related? like konzu acting like this little beacon amongst the sea of darkness that is constantly shifting around his uncle in the infestation

[hybrid silo]

Who is Drusus and why don't we see im in the Sanctum?

[chrome frost]

i think hes a sephalon whos whole shtick is that hes the sanctum itself, as in the sanctum is his cephalon domain much like the sanctuary is for simaris

[hybrid silo]

Ahh

[chrome frost]

his mind so to speak

[lean garden]

*Leverian

[chrome frost]

give him a lot of money :3

[lean garden]

Sanctum is something else

[chrome frost]

yeah that

so back on the infestation i just remembered something... did you happen to see the styanax trailer?

[lean garden]

Or C being a One being with Many desires, sometimes somethings get said. You yourself as a singular being contain multitudes, with desires the compliment and contradict each other. Imagine a being that literally contains multitudes

[graceful swan]

I wish OA could be pinned here

[chrome frost]

why would they be trying to spread then? all of the system sees the infestation as a monstrocity, wouldnt they rather try to somehow end their own suffering instead of spreading the thing further?

[lean garden]

Because theyre not just the sum of their composites, theyre infested

they have a... new way of thinking

join us, embrace us

[chrome frost]

clarify

[graceful swan]

You'll never erase us

[chrome frost]

join us embrace us is the motto of the hive as a whole we know that

[brittle siren]

@restive river

[lean garden]

They may have been made from humans, but theyre not humans now, so while they have artefacts of human desires, or what not, they also think infested, which is to say, very comfortable with spreading around where they want

[brittle siren]

Only Helminth and Lizzie has truly good intention when saying these

[lean garden]

and keeping away who they dont want

[chrome frost]

cant they also be...like.. basically the body is piloted more by the hivemind than the infected individual? thats why i brought up the styanax trailer by the way, even if it might make no sense to do so

[lean garden]

You familiar with star trek?

[chrome frost]

not really, why?

[lean garden]

damn

the borg is what I want to bring up

[chrome frost]

the slaves turned killers of their masters?

[lean garden]

wuh?

[chrome frost]

robot dudes

[lean garden]

are you thinking of the robots from the Orville?

[chrome frost]

with guns in their heads

[lean garden]

LOL thats the Orville, a parody of Star Trek

[lean garden]

Yeap, The Orville

[chrome frost]

okey dokey

[graceful swan]

Borgs are the ones part of the collective

[lean garden]

The Borg hive mind operates by subsuming the individual into the collective, the individual exists still, but only as part of the collective

there is an I in wii

[chrome frost]

ah

[lean garden]

so much like how we cured Alad V, its possible to save individuals from the Borg

[graceful swan]

Did they ever explain what actually cured Alad?

[chrome frost]

but see why i brought up styanax trailer is that they kinda seemed out of it while inside the giant flesh body, but it was only when styanax sorta "made their will stronger" via his 3 was when they woke up

[tall echo]

An experimental cure from regor's labs

[chrome frost]

"im very excited now"

[graceful swan]

Let's go cure the family

[tall echo]

Kaelli explains why that isn't possible

[chrome frost]

um.. i think that part is the hard part

[tall echo]

The infestation changes so quickly that it's impossible to create a permanent cure, the alad thing was sheer one-off luck

[graceful swan]

It clearly doesn't change quick enough if it worked on Alad

[chrome frost]

also im 90% sure the infestation somehow twisted their bodies beyond saving since we never see their lower halves

[tall echo]

Yeah also that

[graceful swan]

They could just get a new body

Assuming they were cured

[chrome frost]

NO WE ARE NOT DOING THE CONTINUITY

[tall echo]

Try to find a volunteet

Volunteer

[graceful swan]

I'll just use one of the other 1000 or so Tenno

[tall echo]

That is the worst possible option

[chrome frost]

Lotus is disappointed in you, demon

you go to your chair and think about what youve said

[graceful swan]

I'll just use Albrecht

[chrome frost]

for all 5 family members?

[graceful swan]

Just one

[chrome frost]

who?

[tall echo]

Gomaitru

[graceful swan]

Yeah

[chrome frost]

so..daughter becomes father?

eh? me am confusion

[tall echo]

Yes

[graceful swan]

Then I'll go to an outer colony and find a random few on the street

[chrome frost]

or... you know... we could just punch out all his blood, then take over a grineer cloning facility and clone them some bodies

[graceful swan]

Actually, I'll just take a Scaldra person into the future

[tall echo]

If you figure out how to stabilize the process

[chrome frost]

mate they are high 90% of the time, their bodies might not be good enough

[tall echo]

They. Are not

[chrome frost]

are you sure?

[tall echo]

The efervon is not going into their bodies. That would kill them. Efervon is lethal to organics.

[graceful swan]

Are we immune to Effervon?

[tall echo]

No

[chrome frost]

why are there scaldra with that gas literally in their helmets? or is it different?

[tall echo]

Think for a moment. Think real hard about how that might work.

[chrome frost]

we are a half void ghost child with god powers. We would still die but not permenently

[chrome frost]

either the gas is a different one or....eh?

[tall echo]

Double layer helmet with gas inbetween

[chrome frost]

oh...but why is the gas so frickin thick then?

[tall echo]

Who knows

[chrome frost]

cant evem see whos behind the bloody thing

[graceful swan]

I wanna see Viktor so I can throw him into some Effervon

[tall echo]

Nah that's too nice

[chrome frost]

throw him into the rift, freeze time and then slowly pour effervon

[strange turtle]

I feel like rather than that being representative of the Infestation as a whole it’s just how the Technocyte’s desire for proliferation manifests in Lizzie, who is born directly from a Helminth-infused human and the Techrot, the two most amicable and “tame” strains we’ve seen

[strange turtle]

Let Kaya take him to a Tenno Clan in the future and give him the Rippers’ death

[tall echo]

Cover him in a small amount of efervon regularly so he's in constant pain due to its acidic nature

[chrome frost]

send him into the sanctuary database

or glass him

or j- wait no jade light is too good for him

[tall echo]

All of those would likely be less painful

[normal mountain]

maybe do what they did to Archimedian Javi?

[chrome frost]

sanctuary...less painful?

[tall echo]

Look at the drifter

[chrome frost]

also dont forget about the mental damage it will cause

[tall echo]

Die often enough and you stop caring

[chrome frost]

...alright

[strange turtle]

Even Simaris wouldn’t take him

[chrome frost]

ok that actually got a laugh out of me

[tall echo]

If he gets glassed, throw him into my part of the weave

[strange turtle]

He’s probably give you an alert to erase what little history there is of him

[restive river]

Yippee!

[chrome frost]

OH I KNOW! Glass him and then tell ordis to tell him ALL of his jokes

[strange turtle]

“I have come to realise some information isn’t worthy of Synthesis”

[graceful swan]

Glassing is way too kind

[tall echo]

Glossing

[normal mountain]

OOH
FEED HIM TO PRAGHASA

[strange turtle]

Mr Entrati, send him to the Void with no Seriglass

[chrome frost]

cant, shes dead

[normal mountain]

Aight, then find a Hydrolyst

[chrome frost]

also i am pretty sure its like being jade lighted

[normal mountain]

Or maybe give Lephantis a snack

[chrome frost]

suddenly the helminth THIS DEMON BRINGS US SNACKS?

GIVE!

[normal mountain]

gives

[brittle siren]

HUH

Let this person cook

[north jolt]

They might be on to something

[strange turtle]

Do y’all think when we go to Tau we’ll get another Base?

[north jolt]

But also that weird interaction between Arthur and Albrecht at the end of the subway level, has anyone ever even explained that or what? Cause to me it feels like the game telling us in the least subtle way possible "Watch out for doppelgangers"

[tall echo]

?

[north jolt]

Y'all really don't remember?

[graceful swan]

Probably just another hub, not a base of operations

[tall echo]

You mean at the end of whispers, before drifter comes into the loop to prevent wally from winning

[north jolt]

Yeah that, except why was Wally seemingly impersonating Albrecht then?

Besides just to screw with Arthur

[tall echo]

He took over albrecht

[graceful swan]

No that was Wally taking over Albrecht like he did Rusalka

[north jolt]

But that got undone by the time loop?

[tall echo]

Yes

[graceful swan]

Yes

[north jolt]

Still has me paranoid ngl

[graceful swan]

Albrecht has backup plans for backup plans

[normal mountain]

Nothing wrong with a healthy dose of paranoia when it comes to the Wall Man

Just don't let it get to you like it did Sythel

[north jolt]

TBF I think the only person in the system who has him beat for number of plans going wrong is Alad V

[tall echo]

Ballas

[graceful swan]

The Orokin as a whole

[strange turtle]

Person

[north jolt]

Ballas actually won though, for a while at least. Obviously there was no way he could of accounted for the Drifter but

[tall echo]

So did alad and albrecht

[normal mountain]

Alad had a small empire with his Mutalist strain iirc

[graceful swan]

Albrecht succeeded in his mission to
Get Void energy
Take Helminth into 1999 to make protos
Build Vessels even if only partially
Have the Kalymos Sequence completed

[north jolt]

Albrecht kinda 1 for 1 atm and Alad V is literally a meme with how often his plans fail or backfire

[north jolt]

Fair point tho

[tall echo]

After they succeeded for a while

[normal mountain]

Then there's the Amalgam project that he blundered into

Granted, they worked, but still

[tall echo]

Added another layer to the wolf's torture too

[clever kiln]

Is there any confirmation on the background of infested? I keep hearing orokin "made" the infested but it sounds like they're pullin the same move where they claim they "made" kuva and reality just found a random sludge and utilized it, or with the infested found it randomly and weaponized it

[tall echo]

The infestation is older than the orokin empire

[lean garden]

They also never really "made" kuva, it was just a thing in their empire, much like the infested when the orokin weaponised it

[clever kiln]

yeah I'm realizing that the orokin claim a lot of stuff as their great creation and its just them optimizing a random natural resource they found on a whim

[tall echo]

They never claim kuva or technocyte as their creation afaik

[lean garden]

I dont think the game so much as says that the Orokin claimed as such, only people wildly extrapolating the lore

[normal mountain]

I do believe they made the Lephantis tho
Definitely used it as a weapon if not

[clever kiln]

Well they definitely have never claimed technocyte but what i mean to say is they generally boast or horde resources or technology to their own group and use it for random nefarious things and so it gets murky where the origin of that thing is

[lean garden]

You'd be right

Behold the 0.0000000000000000000001%

[clever kiln]

like kuva is easy enough to follow where it comes from but with infested its weird cause is this something that showed up one day like a random virus or has this always been there like a natural danger to all the system, kind of like zombie apoloypse reality vs dragons and monsters reality one is bad mixture of chaos and another is natural predator that exists due to its world's nature

[graceful swan]

Did the Orokin ever actually claim creating the Infestation before DE changed the quest where Lotus claimed it predated

[lean garden]

nah it was only vaguely described as an orokin weapon, but the infested as it was in the Old War was weaponised to be an Orokin weapon

[clever kiln]

when you go looking online it says they "made" but it gets finicky because its always backpedaled by the fact they describe cultivating the helminth strand from a a base strand of infested and my question is where did they get the base strand cause there's no way I believe they made the base strand

[tall echo]

They found it

[clever kiln]

so yeah it basically circles back to was it a random virus that showed up one day or a natural danger existent in the system?

[tall echo]

Have you played 1999

[clever kiln]

ye

[tall echo]

Techrot is more primitive infestation

And it's even older than that

It was discovered a few years or so prior when it started manifesting on people as armor-like patches of skin

[clever kiln]

so the infestation existed for a while but started kicking more into power (at least in hallvania) around 1999?

[tall echo]

Pretty much

[clever kiln]

Awesome, but also raises so many weird questions, like what is the level of sentience transferred from host to infestation if infestations like lephantis take hundreds of years to become semi smart by eating multiple infested, and how much is their hive mind functional at since I got some people who think that its across time since Lizzie knowing drifter but another that thinks they only know that since the helminth strand came with albrecht

[tall echo]

The infestation is a hive mind, there's one intelligence and that's it

And at least the helminth strain can communicate across time

[restive river]

It def sounds like all of it can

[tall echo]

It's implied but only helminth is definitely capable iirc

[clever kiln]

I hope there will be more infested lore, their biology is so weird and awesome, plus I want to know what exactly are the limits of what the infested can do or takeover, cause so far we've seen em take control of a tank, jordis, and an electric guitar that functions as a flamethrower, so I'm definitely excited to see what it subsumes?? next

would love too see how the infested interacts with sentients but something tells me they don't really do so well together if the orokin used them as a bomb to sentients just to take a planet

would be cool asf to see a infested hunhow like creature tho, would lose my mind tho

[restive river]

A moon but yeah

[silk sorrel]

What order should someone play duviri in relation to the new war? After right?

[restive river]

Also like
The heart of deimos was there so it was save void tech or let the sentients take it

[restive river]

Before or after, the Duviri Paradox takes place between Act 1 and 2 of the New War so

[silk sorrel]

Oh

[graceful swan]

Sentients are Immune to Infestation

[silk sorrel]

I have two friends playing through Warframe and I wanna make sure they experience things in a way that makes the most sense lore wise. I know I didn’t lol

[clever kiln]

I think in the case of before or after it doesn't really matter but if they don't have like super crazy memory it helps to do it right before you start it up just so its not months before you do new war

[restive river]

^

[clever kiln]

dang so zombie hunhow will only exist in my dreams, suppose that's a good thing tho, I think the tenno would be screwed fighting something of that scale

I mean if the infested can take a whole planet tho there's still plenty of other things it can eat besides sentients that would probably make for a crazy battle

[graceful swan]

The only reason the Sentients didn't go to Deimos or Eris in the War was because of the Infested bomb that blew them up and probably because of Infested having more units than they could handle

[restive river]

Moons
They’ve taken moons

Not planets

[clever kiln]

oh shoot you right

[chrome frost]

Still more than a Chicago

[graceful swan]

Is Earth the only planet in Warframe without an Infested mission?

[chrome frost]

There is in fact an infestation mission

[graceful swan]

There is?

[chrome frost]

Excavation

Unless they deleted it

But even then there's the koumei mission so yeah

Infestation is everywhere

Except void

[graceful swan]

Yeah there's the Dark Sector excavation

[restive river]

Plague Star:

[graceful swan]

True

[chrome frost]

Koumei:

Shrine defense I think

[north jolt]

Its weird that a hive mind parasitic virus able to assimilate technology just sprouted up one day

But then again we have IRL bacteria that can eat synthetic fibers sooo

[tall echo]

And whatever eris is

[north jolt]

Is Uranus classified as a planet in Warframe lore?

[proper barn]

Yes.

It's also liquid you can swim In.

But not drink.

[north jolt]

Good to know that I can swim in Uranus

[graceful swan]

Yes DE don't really change classifications when it comes to the star char it’s based on the solar system

Lua is the only thing not called what it is called irl

[proper barn]

Sol?

[lilac aspen]

Pluto floating in Warframe untouched by everything

[proper barn]

I mean we just call our moon MOON

[graceful swan]

Yeah

We call it moon because it was before other moons were discovered

[north jolt]

Also I just remembered something else semi-related to that post about the void syandana earlier. Mainly a line that Tagfur has about the void/Wally itself, how he thinks it might just be lonely and is trying to reach out, but doesn't know how to do so in a way that's not harmful to us. Seemingly fits into a theory I have about how we might end up actually "defeating" the indifference, basically (in very dumbed down terms) forcing it to comprehend human empathy and compassion and reaching some kind of truce with it

[proper barn]

Btw Earth in Warframe is still the main planet for fresh water.

[lean garden]

Not even titan?

[proper barn]

They say Earth in the fragments.

[lilac aspen]

As I said
We beat Wally by friendship/rizzing

[north jolt]

Yes

My second theory is that we conceptually embody a gun that kills him in one shot

[lean garden]

https://tenor.com/view/mirai-sentai-timeranger-timeranger-super-sentai-superhero-tokusatsu-gif-19940481

[proper barn]

Talking to most of the hex we don't know what Wally wants but most agree if it wanted to not be a evil thing it could have been already. It made our parents go crazy and then gave the kids powers to literally see what would happen.

[north jolt]

There might be a real world psychological equivelent to this, like a child that doesn't know how to get people's attention without being a complete sh*thead or something

But, on the scale of a eldritch entity

[silk atlas]

Me making children gun down their parents because I'm bored:

[lean garden]

Maybe the reason why the infested fear wally is because unlike them, wally sucks at sharing

[north jolt]

||Individualist capitalism (Wally) vs. hyper collectivist communism (the infestation) just a joke plze no actual arguments ||

[restive river]

A moon???

[restive river]

He does kinda seem to be their opposite in some ways

[tall echo]

Look, I'm not interested in anything beyond earth, so I'm not gonna know that stuff

[graceful swan]

Warframe failed you

[north jolt]

Except for 1999 and Ostron Earth is arguably the least interesting planet

[proper barn]

that's more parvos.

but anyway.

[old dome]

...thats not even comparable at all—a child is a child for a reason, underdeveloped brain & all that so ofc theyll do things to get our attention (especially if youre a neglectful person to them); wally is nothing like that. he was literally inside albrecht's brain (iirc) + thousands of years old by the time it met albrecht + the animals are unreliable narrators when it comes to wally bc theyre animals. just bc they can speak doesnt mean theyre exactly intelligent.

if wally truly wanted to Not be evil or do evil things itd have understood that by not conducting a social experiment on a bunch of kids. itd have stepped in to HELP THEM from their parents instead of passively standing by & watch the whole thing happen.

[lean garden]

You must still consider the fact that they were made smart to understand him

[north jolt]

Well I'm glad to see you grasp the concept of a metaphor. Far as the animals go I don't know if we can really determine how reliable, unreliable they actually are, I certainly don't think their view on things should be dismissed

[lean garden]

As such there may be kernels of truth as they speculate on him

[north jolt]

Also this

[old dome]

its a bad metaphor bc it doesnt even work in this case

[lean garden]

I will say this wally stuff might be closer to early psychoanalytical thought than real psychology tho

[old dome]

(you also didnt even phrase it as a metaphor...)

[north jolt]

A lot of Warframe story does take inspiration from psychoanalytics tbf

Thankfully not of the Fruedian variety though

[lean garden]

Erm....

Technically yesnt?

[north jolt]

Stop, don't want to know!

[old dome]

tbh i'd dismiss them bc yeah they were given intelligence to understand him... but to them, its either him or the man who wanted to kill them as an experiment so. ofc theyd side w wally. he never did anything harmful to them unlike albrecht.

[lean garden]

Would you like to hazard which kooky bugger wrote "A man when sick replaces all love with indifference" (paraphrased)

[north jolt]

Damn, but I mean kinda has a point though

[lean garden]

Honestly not really, at least to me, this was one of the lines I had the most fun critiquing

Because how many stories do we have of someone still providing care even when sick to their loved ones

[north jolt]

Obviously Im not the first one to make this comparison, just to get it out of the way. But a lot of people seem to draw comparisons with Jungian theory especially with the whole "light/dark" mechanic that comes up at various parts of the game

[lean garden]

Like damn freud just because yo mama aint love you dont mean mine dont

[old dome]

-# & therein lies the whole flaw of his philosophies: man was hardcore projecting.

[north jolt]

But sometimes (even if we disregard Freud specifically) that projection can have a grain of truth to it

[lean garden]

Anyways back to this. Its quite a reductionist take to think that theyre choosing to side with wally in their speculation. Mind you when wally popped up in their bell all of them had their fight or flights triggered

Minn is dead because Fib was scared of wally

I dont see how you'd lump them as "siding with wally"

Like bird 3 has one of the most interesting lines on wally, and at no point is he actually referring to wally while saying it

[proper barn]

frued's main problem was thinking everyone had some inate trauma and they needed to do Cocaine.

[north jolt]

I think that would only make sense if they were somehow being subtly manipulated by Wally, which is always possible but I don't think we can say for certain that's the case right nonw

[lean garden]

Bird 3 recounts how everything was simpler when he wasnt a who, and how he could be everything because he was nothing. And now his inside me feels too big for his outside me

[north jolt]

Otherwise we have to assume that, regardless of how accurate their "interpretation" is, it is their sincere and honest view on the matter (mostly Tagfur's tbh)

[lean garden]

Like hello??? Thats a very philosophical thing to say bird 3

[proper barn]

Also Frued is funny cuz like his later years is all just him doing too many drugs but like a bunch of his like research in like how to make sure like infants don't die is still like the basis of early childcare.

[north jolt]

Character with a single braincell bouncing around like a screen saver suddenly has the most profound and philosophical thought

[lean garden]

Anyways Gaben, you might wanna take a quick wiki dive on what intersubjective theory is

[north jolt]

That moment actually made me like Bird 3 even more then I already did

[proper barn]

I still think Wally was gonna kill the cavia like he did to ever other batch of animals Albretch sent in. The only reason they surived is cuz of what Fib did is still my take.

[north jolt]

I will make a note of it

[lean garden]

https://tenor.com/view/dvd-player-logo-satisfying-gifs-gif-18254906

[lean garden]

In essence, wally doesn't have a full who yet, and needs to be destroying anything that relates to him to make himself a full who

Usually this destroying takes place within your own mind... but as we've seen with the void... things dont quite stay in the head

[north jolt]

I think I can kinda see that. He was never REALLY a "who" until Albrecht's accident, and even then he's really only ever a mimic or reflection of other people, no real core identity to call his own

[old dome]

speaking of the bell... i wonder what does it look like—yeah its a diving bell but like. (gestures at albrecht's labs) how big was it for an eldritch horror entity to just pop right in the middle of a bunch of animals?

if it was anything like the modern diving bells, all of them wouldve been thrown out & not just minn...

[north jolt]

I Imagine different sized bells were made to suit different individuals and groups?

Also Wally can seemingly change form and size at will

[lean garden]

Blah blah blah, to be an individual you must be with someone who recognizes you blah blah blah, need to destroy them, blah blah blah, need them, cant destroy them, blah blah blah, tension due to the need to destroy and preserve them, bing bang boom dominance

[old dome]

all the modern ones are p small...

like. very. only one person can go in.

maybe 2 at most but... 4??

INCLUDING A WHOLE FISHTANK

[north jolt]

Also semi related to your question, something I always wondered is WTF actually IS serum glass?

[old dome]

INSIDE A TINY BELL

[old dome]

seriglass... im guessing its like plexiglass

[north jolt]

Like a material that can form an effective barrier between you and the literal void where all things can be made manifest from your own mind and emotions, that has to be some pretty serious material

[north jolt]

Also its apparently used in some Entrati weapons, for whatever that detail is worth

[lean garden]

So... glass?

Dont underestimate how good glass gets

[north jolt]

Glass is pretty chemically innert yes but I don't know if it would also be...void innert?

[lean garden]

Well it dont got thoughts

[north jolt]

Im just thinking that in order for it to basically shield you and your mind from direct contact with the void, wouldn't it also have to have some metaphysical properties to it as well?

[old dome]

This plastic is often used in sheet form as a lightweight or shatter-resistant alternative to glass.

about plexiglas... im thinking seriglass is smth like that

[lean garden]

Might have to see if seri is a prefix

[lean garden]

Its not

[north jolt]

Probably in terms of physical qualities, though unless I'm misremembering the way it was described in Albrecht's logs sounded like it shattered very similarly to how regular glass does?

[old dome]

idk i havent read his logs

[north jolt]

Cause plexiglass doesn'y really shatter and break apart so much as it just kinda cracks and splinters, and the bell was described as having shattered into sharp pieces that Albrecht actually injured himself on

I think he cut his hand on the debris or something like that

[glacial bough]

It's explicitly a type of glass, we have full shards of it

[strange turtle]

He cut a lot more than his hand, he just used the shards to cut his hand so he could write “close it” with the blood

When I arrived at the door, or rather, the door arrived at me, I howled, hurling myself inside. Out. And then and there, I was. Lost and unlost. Howling on the floor in harmony with my wretched Kalymos. Lacerated in flesh and heart. Scattered as the bell glass. Spilling blood and stomach on the cold, stone floor.

But I sensed the other there, at the wall's breach behind me, reaching still. I screamed, but my voice was gone. Forever. I looked, but my eyes would never see again. I swept my fist across the floor, snatching broken shards. And in gripping tightly, I filled my hands with ink. "Close it!" I wrote.

[azure elm]

we can assume that albrechts blue orokin body died in this incident.

at least thats what I do

Loid then performed continuation on his dear master, and from then on albrecht was so focused on void science that he never underwent another orokinification, blue skin and asymmerty

[north jolt]

I remembered he cut himself on that glass at least

[tall echo]

It explicitly did not

Albrecht was put in a legally distinct bacta tank to restore his body

Also, *continuity

Like the mod

(Another thing, albrecht never got the long arm)

[humble sierra]

Yeah you can buy this portrait of what he looked like, his arms seem to be symmetrical and of a proportionate length

[quick wadi]

Is it really albrecht without his jojo hat

Someone shop one on

[azure elm]

jesus the chats with vel and minerva are drier than chalk now that I messed it up

its like talking to an ex

in the future KIM updates, I hope they add chances for redemption in convo instead of just %%$##% up one thing and it all goes blah

[humble sierra]

😭

[azure elm]

these are adults, not petty teenagers, I should be able to salvage a CHATROOM CONVO

[humble sierra]

there are multiple chances for redemption

[azure elm]

OH??

[humble sierra]

you messed up multiple times 😭

[azure elm]

GAWDDAMN IT

ITS NOT MY FAULT I DONT UNDERSTAND TOXIC LOVERS

I GREW UP WITH A SINGLE MOM I DONT KNOW HOW TO DO HIGH CONFLICT DIVORCE THERAPYYYY RAHHH

https://tenor.com/view/aragorn-fury-mad-angry-the-lord-of-the-rings-gif-17541983

there should be a 'fail' state redemption

like after you've totally biffed it just apologize and start from square 2

[quick wadi]

We need Quincy to bail us out again

[silk atlas]

It's called new years reset and also just accepting the fact you failed multiple times with the convo syste

[azure elm]

i aint resetting 9 convos just to mend two grumpy farts hearts

[quick wadi]

"hey quincy, you know that weird infested guitar that keeps talking to people"

"I need you to go tell her I'm actually really cool"

[azure elm]

lizzie is more understandable than angry boomers

tism problems

[north ferry]

Then don't.
Sounds like real life, you can't understand everyone, as much as you try 😦

[azure elm]

very tru 😔

[brittle siren]

so Kubrow is already a term for "dog" in 1999

[old dome]

this is why i just skipped ahead to reading the kimulacrum

i cant read emotions through texts!! im terrible at handling conflict!!!

[tall echo]

I fixed both the velimin and the flare/lizzie conflicts

Through logic, not emotions

[old dome]

ok good for you.

i cant deal w adults who dont know how to talk to each other simply bc theyre so into their own heads

[azure elm]

real

I get that our tenno is the hex therapist but I didnt sign up for divorce counseling

[old dome]

yeah... it doesnt help that i play my drifter as a self insert too—i'd 100% mess up that counseling so.

kimulacrum it is

even tho it was hard to read the chat chart

like. from a character analysis pov i Get why it was drifter doing the counseling (velmin desperately Needed that voice of reason from an unaffiliated person who knows nothing abt them at that point in the relationship) but also.......... youre adults. in your 40s+. how did yall last this long together??

[humble sierra]

I think that was just the member trying to make the connection clear to you

[brittle siren]

well it was from Kaya

[azure elm]

what is a kimulacrum??

[humble sierra]

"But his name was Zylo. **You'd call him a Kubrow I think. **"

[humble sierra]

It's a website. Look up kimulacrum, or go to browse.wf, all the chats are on there, even ones you can't play yet

[tall echo]

skill issue

[old dome]

🙄🙄🙄

[tall echo]

Probably helped that I have some experience in analyzing conflict situations for some reason

I am struggling with kaya

[azure elm]

LOL, see now we have opposites

I specialize in the NPO field so Im used to teens being snappy

[brittle siren]

To be fair, if her dog can bite a person off, it is a Kubrow

[azure elm]

With Kaya, the best advice is let HER speak, and assist her thoughts when you can

if you treat her like a kid or like shes stupid she'll just shut you out

[tall echo]

Ironically I recognize some aspects of myself in kaya which might be exactly why I don't get along with her

[clever kiln]

true but still wonder if this was an always or sudden problem, and what severity does the it carry in danger level, I want to say that infested can't make it into the void (I think can't remember) and tau system (again no clue remembering) so there's still some level of things stopping it the same way were stopped from surviving in space from lack of air, pressure, and heat death

[lean garden]

I mean, super technically if the infested are willing to travel many many many many many mant years, they could manually launch themselves to tau

[chrome geyser]

Thinking about Amalgams

Obv Erra was forcing Alad V to practice the procedure that would eventually turn Warframes into Archons

But like

Did the Corpus who became Amalgams sign up voluntarily, knowing what they were getting into,

Or were they forced to / prisoners / test subjects

Or were they dead like the Frames that became vessels for the Archons’ possession were

[proper barn]

That's the reverse od what you said. Also it was Natah not erra that did that.

[chrome geyser]

?

Reverse?

[proper barn]

Also Alad V continued working on it after we freeded him from the Bird.

[proper barn]

The archons are from the old war.

[chrome geyser]

Correction: they were Sentient Beasts in the Old War. Erra scooped them up and strapped them to dead Frames after they died

Then they became Archons

[proper barn]

They died and where reattached in the old war. Except for exactly the ram.

[chrome geyser]

Hm

Regardless of timeline my question about whether the Amalgams were willing volunteers or not still stands

[proper barn]

Probably not more than the average coprus soilder for anything.

[stray gale]

I felt this way as well and it honestly makes me not care all that much

this is one of those essay-grade post sort of things but the new kim chats feel so much less relatable than the base 1999 ones

I just can't find it in me to care at all about velimir and minerva's relationship like, get on with it, yknow

I suppose the issue is just that the new kim chats are each person having a problem that every conversation revolves around and that's just 💤

[north ferry]

Wolf of Saturn Six got amalgam'd unwillingly I believe.

I feel the opposite, the new KIM chats seem less Drifter orientated, which yes makes them more complicated to navigate and less inherently engaging. However I feel that's a feature and not a bug.

[stray gale]

maybe it wouldn't be so bad but the drifter seems like they're fumbling the charisma rolls this time around, as well

especially in the kaya chats, it's like neither of them have ever spoken to another human being before

[hybrid silo]

Can someone explain to me the post credit scene for The Hex happy ending quest?

The loid and the statue scene

[strange turtle]

There’s actually a few different ways the conversations can go from that instead of their issues you just haven’t chosen the right options

There’s a bunch but you have one shot to pick a very specific option and if you don’t you’ll get locked out of more conversation options branching from that later on so they’re easy to miss

[stray gale]

well, that's a bit silly

[lean garden]

dripster sending a message back

[whole dragon]

Learned why Minerva and Velimir are here. Damn.

On a separate note calling Velimir PAPA and BEAR???? IN THE SAME USERNAME???????

[lean garden]

Is it not just PaPaPolar?

[drowsy saddle]

Mental Autofill

[whole dragon]

You're so right

I'm just thinking about Velimir too much

[lean garden]

Cant relate but very understandable

[whole dragon]

I think I've misunderstood Drusus' story

Is he a cephalon that looks like a face or just like a weird seperate thing

[graceful swan]

A Cephalon

[whole dragon]

Okay thought so

[graceful swan]

Cephalons can make their own places in the Weave

[foggy yew]

Сan anyone explain how the proto-skin of the proto-frames works? i mean, can they remove it completely somehow, or certain parts? There are lines where characters say they take a shower. I wonder, do they shower in their suits? And how does their internal physiology work? If they eat and drink like normal people, what about natural processes?

[drowsy saddle]

Certain orifices are still there and available

[foggy yew]

so it's still skin and not armor?

[proper barn]

No it's armor.

just all their bits and peices still work apparently.

[foggy yew]

I'm confused..

[proper barn]

AREN'T WE ALL

lettie i think is the least infested.

Aois's nails are helminthed over and you can see that her nails are bleeding.

[old dome]

dont think abt it too much.

[proper barn]

Just Quincy and

even Lettie say they still got working parts but we don't know how that works.

[foggy yew]

but I love the game's plot, but because of a bunch of holes I can't put everything together into a complete picture

[proper barn]

also Aoi's like she seems to wearing a shirt over most of her.

lettie has her legs and arms exposes

so she has to wear shoes.

[foggy yew]

Arthur has armored legs but still wears shoes

[proper barn]

oh kaya only has one of her hands not helminthed.

[old dome]

in this specific case: its a weird mix of armor & flesh; kaya wears a crop top but you can see her stomach turning into nova's skin (her white pants arent helping the ambiguity). quincy's arms & legs are fully helminthed but i think the rest of his body isnt.

[proper barn]

does he? it just looks liek wearframe feet.

[proper barn]

oh yeah her like sweater turtle neck crop top thing. her and Aoi i think wear shirts cuz like otherwiset hey might just look like minerva or worse if they didn't lmao.

[foggy yew]

Well, by the way, yes. If some characters seem to have the ability to open their intimate areas to (sorry) go to the toilet, then how does Nova do it??

[old dome]

thats where headcanons come in...

[proper barn]

we don't know.

[foggy yew]

it's sad...

[proper barn]

but they can APPRENTLY cuz Quincy and Lettie are completely covered up there. Also Eleanor talks about it too but in a funnier way. she is worring about killing people if she does something like that. she might accidently kill you during is what she says. or she is afriad of it. "sexy praying mantis problem" is what she says. @foggy yew

[old dome]

just make up smth to fill that in. the game doesnt go into ALL of the details in this case.

[proper barn]

OH lettie doesn't have either of her hands

i forgot.

[old dome]

tbh minerva's upper body doesnt even LOOK helminthed—it looks like shes just wearing a jacket that she doesnt wanna zip up.

[foggy yew]

Warframe lore is starting to look more and more like Warhammer... I hope it won't be the same here, that everything people write is now canon...

[proper barn]

they all look like this. kinda in different ways. cuz it is "skin".

[old dome]

vel's the same

[proper barn]

what?

idk what that means. we have had a lot of people being wrong.

we have had big arugments here before.

[old dome]

nope. de just doesnt go into the itty bitty teeny tiny specifics. the overall lore is actually pretty cohesive.

[proper barn]

I think you can piece it together but i also like how we have to put it together ourselfs a bit.

[foggy yew]

I mean, I don't want to fill plot holes with my own speculations, because then everyone has their own story and it's confusing, the line is erased and you no longer understand that there is a primary source

[proper barn]

what do you mean plot holes?

this isn't plot holes.

all i said was said by characters.

or things you can see ON THEM.

[old dome]

how the protos deal w their private business isnt a plot hole tho....... even the characters themselves are speculating on what their new bodies can & cant do.

[proper barn]

yeah.

that is also it a lot them are still confused and just don't know how it all works.

minerva and Velimir even have a werid flirting moment if you like get the good resolution with them. talking about how Minevra is actually like a little posionous to the touch and Velimir is like a cloder body temp.

[foggy yew]

Then how do you explain the fact that we can use their appearance as a skin? i mean, flying through the system with their appearance. or can that be written off as fanservice?

[proper barn]

it is very like "MOM AND DAD ARE FLIRTING IN FRONT OF ME" moment lmao.

[proper barn]

oh this one is easy it's explained in lore they let us do that and we are their liek connection point i gues?.

They even talk about it but we are like using them for a second in a mission they aren't staying anywhere really.

[foggy yew]

it's just that Quincy has a dialogue where he talks to the main character about how he'll worry when he flies away on his own business, saving the universe, and at the moment they don't know a way to travel to the future with the main character. (excluding Nova's theories about moving)

[tall echo]

There is no known way for them to permanently leave 1999

[proper barn]

I think they can't stay in the future but they can for like "a mission" be used cuz of how like the frames we use are connected to them.

Cuz apparently through flares dialog the Helminth can see both 1999 and present all the time.

[graceful swan]

How long is the unknown bit

[proper barn]

A mission.

[azure elm]

I feel the same way fr

[astral sparrow]

Question. Do we have a idea what the operator eats and when they do eat? Not the drifter but the operator as we know the drifter eats.

[graceful swan]

Mostly same things as Drifter Operator eating is done offscreen but you see it on the Zariman

[silk atlas]

Cube.

[brittle siren]

Meat cube, fish cube
And now void cube

[slow bramble]

I think that goes hand in hand with how much they interact with the various cultures outside of bounties.
Like, would they buy roasted meat from a stall In Cetus?

[brittle siren]

This is Kaya chat right?

[brittle siren]

Who are "they"?

[slow bramble]

The Operator/Tenno

[silk atlas]

I wouldn't see why they wouldn't, they'd just cube it

[brittle siren]

I mean yeah, food is food, they have to try it first though since animal that have Unum inside them is not normal

[graceful swan]

Quincy

[slow bramble]

Cubes on a kebab

Square sushi

[brittle siren]

So wait, why can't we use the same solution for Kaya? Or we just don't want to make her uncomfortable?

[graceful swan]

Because she wants to leave 1999

[lean garden]

she wants to solve it on her own

[slow bramble]

Fully

She wants to leave fully

[brittle siren]

Jesus Bau

[lean garden]

what

its an AMA, thats anything right there

[brittle siren]

No no I'm just suprise how fast you type this in

[graceful swan]

He probably pasted it

[slow bramble]

Kiddo firing squad lol

[brittle siren]

Tbf he can survive the Sun so

[lean garden]

I prepped it and pasted it

[brittle siren]

Damn, I wonder how much you would ask if you have the VIP ticket

[lean garden]

You wouldnt want to know

[brittle siren]

Actually I intrigued

Should we tell Grey Archon to ask sth in AMA too, the more the merrier

Also kinda interesting that this map is not yet in the game

[glacial bough]

Shoot, forgot the AMA is today

[slow bramble]

Where is that supposed to be?

The map?

Do we know?

[lean garden]

looks like a corpus derelict

[slow bramble]

Corpus haven't had an update storyline wise in a bit. I don't think the Grineer have either

[lean garden]

not unless you count kahl

the corpus technically got a lil tidbit in jade shadows, but they werent the focus

[slow bramble]

Oh! That was recent?

[lean garden]

eeeeeeer, how do you qualify whats recent

like whats the oldest it can be

[brittle siren]

For me if it under a year, it recent

[slow bramble]

Phhhhhhhhmmm..... after Dagath I think

[lean garden]

oh man veilbreaker is 2 years old, coming up to 3

[lean garden]

then only the corpus got a lil smidge in jade shadows in recent times

[slow bramble]

Yeah Grineer need a kick storywise

Both do

[lean garden]

oh and a lil more during dante unbound

since well, parvos is corpus

[slow bramble]

YEAH the donation thing is driving me nuts

[brittle siren]

Tbh both Grineer and Corpus kinda in a stalemate. Parvos busy fight with the current Corpus leader, Grineer and Tenno.

While Grineer also the same but they trying to revive the elder queen

[lean garden]

ngl I think its aight that the infested get some love this time around, since they've not had much since like forever

[slow bramble]

100,000
This is too much... but I'll take it
My guy YOU ARE IN DEBT

[slow bramble]

In which universe?

Origin I agree

[brittle siren]

He mean the Techrot expand Infested lore

[lean garden]

the last infested centric update was in 2021

[brittle siren]

Though how the "Coda Lich" appear at the present and how even Cy know them is kinda shroud in the void

Like it make sense in the grand scheme of thing but also not

[lean garden]

Which I'm beggin DE to answer during the AMA

[slow bramble]

Lich time travel should be explained... maybe its tied to Kaya?

[brittle siren]

Eh not really, she working alone as far as I know

The only time she work with someone is in ETA

[slow bramble]

I'm more thinking she jumps into the future and the Coda surprise hitche a ride

[lean garden]

I dont think its going to be the case

since the coda do that before she can even figure out travel yknow?

And like, if you dont play your cards right she'll never figure it out

[slow bramble]

Fair

The new Proto's feel more fussy, but also too easy to help?

One I got a few words in Velimir and Minerva clicked together in one convo

Then again I'm one for a slow burn

[glacial bough]

As suspected, the Coda are pretty much just sitting and waiting until they reach modern WF time period

@lean garden

[lean garden]

yes, you've seen the reply to my questions huh

they really just 12th Doctoring it lol

[torpid jewel]

So i have a few questions about lore aspects;

1. Would the drifter event be EXCLUSIVE to that character, or could it technically have happened to other kids on the zariman as well?
2. Are there other frames like umbra, which can act on their own?

[old dome]

stalker, kullervo, & og jade (the one that died in the jade shadows quest).

[silk atlas]

Operator/Drifter was the one who made the deal. On behalf of everyone else on-board, unintentionally, but still.

Jade, Dante, Kullervo. Mostly just comes from having some form of strong goal in mind

[torpid jewel]

ah right, i forgot about those!

[normal mountain]

Dagath was also capable of operating solo

[torpid jewel]

Oooh ok! But would that mean, that the kids on Drifter's zariman never became tenno, because no deal?

[silk atlas]

It wasn't no deal, it was Wally screwing around with the details

29. You wouldn't welch on a deal, would you?

A. CORRUPT FILE DETECTED

B. I saved them. All of them. Never said I'd save you. (correct)

[torpid jewel]

oh so the deal was made, but wall-e decided NOT to save drifter, leading to his duvari moments and all that?

same reason Drifter did not have void powers before the whole "i am you, you are me" part?

I think i need to replay the whole story, because i am CONFUSED

[lean garden]

the key thing to understand that before the deal was made, there was no drifter

only when deal was made, did the drifter begin to exist

[normal mountain]

Not surprised, it WAS confusing

[torpid jewel]

i think my head will start hurting soon haha. So it's like a timesplit or something; the deal was made, and both came into existence as a result; one timeline where we're saved, and one where we aren't (Drifter, Duvari, etc).

So drifter does have void powers, but they were dormant somehow?

[lean garden]

it was a fork in the road, because they were the exact same

Wally used a cheeky loophole in the deal, because he really never specified the drifter

and so, no void pow pows

[torpid jewel]

My poor brain tries to follow, but it's hard :kek

but how was Duvari made then, if no pow pow?

[lean garden]

Void no need pow pow to make thing

[normal mountain]

The Zariman was already in the Void
Drifter had strong emotions, and conceptual embodiment took care of things

[lean garden]

Void is pow pow, Void take thing in brain, make real

[torpid jewel]

aight, so what i'm hearing from both of you; Drifter did not actually create Duvari. Instead, the void did, based on the drifter's feelings.

[normal mountain]

Well, he DID make Duviri

Just not on purpose

It sorta just happened, if you follow me

[torpid jewel]

I do, but i don't

Because i my head, one would need some sort of void connection to shape something into existence, but it sounds like he had none, and that the void did it all

[lean garden]

Ok think of it like this

You cannonball into the pool

The waves are made

but it is an inherrent property of the pool that allows the waves to be made, but it was your body that was used to make the waves

the Pool is the void,
the waves is duviri
your body is drifter's strong emotions

if it werent for you, there would be no waves

[torpid jewel]

aight, i think i get it then! No void powers needed, no direct conenction. Just ripples sparked by him.

[normal mountain]

That's a pretty good metaphor, ngl

[torpid jewel]

yea that was a smooth way of putting it

[lean garden]

Thanks, I am one of the millions of registered losers

[torpid jewel]

Lore lovers! We're the suckers for a deep narrative haha

but man does this complicate my roleplay ideas

[normal mountain]

Mate, if youse can metaphor like THAT, youse ain't a loser, see?

[lean garden]

I ams a loser I am! Am proud to be a loser I am!

[torpid jewel]

then we shall all join you on that wagon!

[normal mountain]

alright, so my attempt at a Fonz impression failed

[torpid jewel]

Mr winkler himself!

[graceful swan]

Explains how Amir got one shot

[restive river]

We need this framed

[candid elm]

Oh god, if they ever come to the future I can only imagine the havoc they could wreak with orokin tech

Considering them being fully sentient warframes

[proper barn]

TO BE FAIR TO YOU. duviri is confusing if you don't remember the new war. we re-grow lotus from the hand we get in duviri btw.

[winged flume]

Lotus's hand flays your hand apart to sit in the cavity/wound it made by adhering to you. Metals as ||cheese||

[humble sierra]

RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH

THIRD ORB

or maybe the Trolololyst instead

[normal mountain]

Honestly, I'd rather have Lech Kril and Sargas Ruk revamps than third orb

[winged flume]

I hope we get the full individual frames that made up Xaku, that would be pretty cool.

[proper barn]

Okay the third orb is like would be a Narmer plot point.

WILL MY PREDICTION of Pazzul wanting to rebuild the Solar Rail be RIGHT?

[humble sierra]

Narmer Orb -> Tau is a logical step

[proper barn]

No I think we will actually stop him.

And we aren't gonna go to tau for 1-2 years