lore-discussion

[jagged forge]

Implied or certain?

Wasn't aware of the multiple time travels

[tall echo]

Certain

[humble sierra]

Yeah it's how there's all the 1999 tech within the labs

We see his final trip to the past at the start of Whispers

[quick wadi]

Albrecht was a giant retro nerd

[humble sierra]

But before then he went to-and-from freely

[humble sierra]

Yeah lmao imagine 1999 had absolutely nothing to do with any of his calculations and he just wanted to go there just because

[jagged forge]

Goddammit this game's lore is so confusing

[tall echo]

Still simpler than fromsoft lore

[quick wadi]

There's a log we all missed of albrecht talking about how CRT monitors looked better

[tall echo]

(Which is an unfair comparison)

[jagged forge]

nah, I had a wonderful time with Elden Ring and Bloodborne (it was easier to digest, I think?)

Warframe has too many questions without a ounce of answer

[tall echo]

(Fromsoft lore is literally made to be as vague as possible)

[tall echo]

You're just not looking hard enough

Almost every important question has an answer

Meanwhile michael zaki makes the lore for his games vague so players can come up with their own interpretations

[jagged forge]

The ones I'm interested in don't have any

[humble sierra]

Oh I forgot to explain earlier but "Void Child" is more likely because people on the Operator's side like the Cavia and the Lotus (potentially) call you Mara or Mara Lohk, it doesn't make too much sense for them to call you a demon.

[jagged forge]

Michael zaki 😭😭😭

[tall echo]

Then they're either not important or you missed the answer

[tall echo]

Hideous taco michael zaki

[jagged forge]

Makes hella sense, actually
Although Lotus calling us demon is something I wouldn't be surprised of

[humble sierra]

I say potentially because I'm pretty sure it's implied the vocals of The Lotus Eaters theme is meant to be her singing

One of the lyrics is "Ilve, ilve, Mara"

[jagged forge]

Yeah I'm with you in that one

[humble sierra]

We don't have a translation of the song yet but we did get it for other Whispers tracks

"Yara jeliira" means "behold my heart", and there's another lyric in Lotus Eaters that's "Amare Jeliira"

And from the overall tone it sounds like she is lamenting for whoever the song is for

[vapid echo]

So like a question here does the third orb mother have any lore or any reason to be in orb vallis in the lake?

[woven coyote]

Nope

[vapid echo]

damn

[woven coyote]

The bath bomb with legs was forgotten and their only friend is a pazuul drone

[vapid echo]

heehe bath bomb

im might ask in their next qna and see if i can get any more answers

[woven coyote]

There is one coming up

Think it was in todays announcements

[vapid echo]

nice is it on reddit or and different channel or something?

[woven coyote]

@vapid echo

[vapid echo]

thx

[worn ermine]

Is Vauban pronounced "Vaw-ban" or "Voe-ban"
inb4 "it's pronounced vauban heeheehee"

[jagged forge]

They talked about it in today's devstream

[woven coyote]

Yeah that they cant find anywhere to fit it in their dev pipeline

[jagged forge]

Unfortunately, I was honestly wishing for it to be the promissed return of the raids

[woven coyote]

I still think they will one day find the timing for it

But for now the story is going elsewhere

[proper barn]

But like it's narmer.

idk.

[old dome]

...its up to interpretation etc etc i know all that but. where was umbra during tnw??

was he just. chilling in the orbiter? & suddenly theres a new tenet who looked like the adult version of the child that saved him, & now that adult is going around being a hero...? like. (scratches head) not even a single, throwaway line about him in tnw, like how ordis mentioned his name in js...?

(umbra is just basically free real estate for headcanons but sometimes... i just wanna know abt these little details.)

[jaunty oasis]

Probably inside helminth, using it like a sleeping bag.

Or maybe helminth has a duviri dimension where it keeps every warframe until it needs em

[chrome rivet]

Headcanon Idea : Garuda Prime's
Signature ephemera allows her to fly, albeit on a more limited scale compare to Titania and Jade

[gusty flare]

Do y'all think we'll go to Tau eventually? 🤔

[lean garden]

give it a few years prob

DE said a year or two back that they had no plans for Tau

[gusty flare]

Oh 😦 makes sense I guess

Cant wait to see whats next after 1999 tbh

I just hope they dont abandon the hex like umbra

[lean garden]

Umbra's story is completed

the hex's not so much

[proper barn]

also

you can't date umbra.

[humble sierra]

Tau is also theorized to be the next major step

[river tangle]

so…

kaya's "bf" shared nidus pics of her to basically anyone else?

idk if we wanted to beat him up on her behalf…

[stiff isle]

what did the nova protoframe do that makes her wanna leave so badly

[north jolt]

Spoilers for 1999 and possible CW: ||She's traumatized from a time where she shared intimate pictures of herself with someone she knew online who then went and spread those pics around without her permission||

||She basically wants to escape her trauma by going to a time where the internet basically doesn't exist (our time) ||

[stiff isle]

ohhh okay, i was super confused as to what happened so i couldn’t understand the lore

[tall echo]

Just beat him up? That's not enough

[river tangle]

give him a fate worse than death?

[north jolt]

I mentioned it in the techrot group yesterday, kind of one of the last things I expected Warframe to really touch upon. Definitely blindsided me a bit (but not in a bad way)

[cosmic ridge]

Poor girl

Wait if she went back in time though she wouldn't remember what is to come right?

[lean garden]

?

Why wouldn't she remember

[azure jasper]

Also, she wants to go forward in time, not back.

[old dome]

yeah,, she wants to go so far forward in time just to escape the trauma & its aftermath (even tho that sort of trauma stays with you forever...)

idt the drifter ever talked abt how crapsack the world is in the far future to her... either that or she just doesnt care.

[cosmic ridge]

Oh.

[north jolt]

So many new ways to be traumatized!

[stuck iris]

Would it be possible for a new warframe to be created? Since the Orokin are long-dead, I wonder if it's possible to do so

[restive river]

If someone had the right know-how and tools, yes
But that would also require a person to be helminthed. So.

The Tenno would likely try to stop it if aware

[graceful swan]

Sure just ask Albrecht to come back and create a new frame

Otherwise currently no it isn’t possible

[dense nest]

with every warframe will have prime version of it probably no (except lavos who primed himself) although there are some prime weapon that tenno make. but then again eternalism maybe there is a timeline where orokin empire still exist.

[graceful swan]

We build weapons with relics of the past containing bps don’t even need Eternalism

[feral cape]

Also we don't need that orokin vaults exist nothing stops anyone from just uncovering lost orokin tech

[old dome]

yeah,, (points at jade/stalker babyframe) like so.

[graceful swan]

They weren’t created they were born

And we don’t even know if they will become a frame

[restive river]

If the child is a frame they were technically “made” a long time ago

[graceful swan]

over 1000 years ago at least

And it becoming a baby frame was still made by an Orokin who didn’t believe the baby would even ever come out

Ballas 100% would do that

[vital gorge]

Ballas is a real turd

the Umbra quest was just... yeah

[graceful swan]

The more lore he’s mentioned in the worse he gets

[vital gorge]

He did give us a really nice sword, but still

[graceful swan]

He gave us a sword just so we would bring it to him for him to stab us with

[vital gorge]

Oh dang I forgot about that

Erra grabbing a Dax by the neck and saying "Hello" was one of the creepier things Ive seen in this game

[graceful swan]

He’s still 0-2 in killing Dax via crushing helmet

[vital gorge]

Yeahhhh

I dont think hes really a villan exactly

[graceful swan]

Funny how he got crushed in the end though

[vital gorge]

The Sentients got really betrayed

[glacial bough]

Erra is dumb, yes

[vital gorge]

hes just a weird bug boy

And Hunhow is still hiding isnt he?

[graceful swan]

He’s not hiding

He’s just stuck in the ocean

[vital gorge]

lol

learn to swim dork

[graceful swan]

Him going in was part of a plan

[vital gorge]

uh huh

[graceful swan]

Lotus was meant to get him out

[vital gorge]

dude tried to hire Stalker

And I ended up with the special sword

[old dome]

how...??

[graceful swan]

Lotus locked him up him going in the ocean was part of his plan in the Old War to eventually be let out of the ocean

[vital gorge]

Lotus is really strong

[proper barn]

yeah she is the daugther of 2 of the snetients that invaded the system a mimic queen even.

[vital gorge]

Yeap

[old dome]

& he cant get out of... a whole planet?

on his own, i mean...

[graceful swan]

Nope

[old dome]

...how big is hunhow again?? & neptune??

[tall echo]

Why neptune

Hunhow is stuck on uranus

[old dome]

theyre both blue...

[tall echo]

Uranus is more of a bluish green

[graceful swan]

More green than blue

[dawn shoal]

to be fair to hunhow, the dialogue we get from him in the new war makes it sound like he's choosing to remain stuck there for some specific reason, and he also did technically die that one time so he's nowhere near as strong as he was when he brought the war on the Orokin

[earnest helm]

@vital gorge hello bearded vulture 2

[vital gorge]

hi five friend

[north jolt]

I mean whatever they ARE, they're already it. Some weird homunculus creature that might as well be its own thing?

[north jolt]

Ngl I still don't fully understand Lotus's actual powers

Besides typical sentient stuff

[proper barn]

Remains alive not necessarily stuck. He could have sided with Erra but Erra was using Lotus.

[tall echo]

When did he die

[dawn shoal]

i mean when the tenno first discovered him in the Natah quest, they were calling the place they dug him out of his tomb, so i'm assuming this means he had something happen to him vaguely similar to what happened to lotus; between lotus and the eidolons sentients don't seem like they die like other beings do

[tall echo]

Hunhow never died, he was just resting

[dawn shoal]

the thousand year sleepy

[tall echo]

Heavily damaged, but not dead

The plains sentient is essentially just returning as ghosts in the eidolons, natah needed three whole archon shards to revive her

Hunhow just stopped caring at some point after the octavia's anthem quest

[proper barn]

The greater Sentient is dead.

It's why the eidolons are wandering.

[tall echo]

Yes

[hidden cove]

I just had a thought about Equinox - is she two different subjects transformed into Warframes, fused together? Or just one person, whose abilities and body manifest in three different ways?

[tall echo]

One frame

[hidden cove]

I'm on the topic also of wondering if the Helminth strain (batches) would transform a subject into the opposite gender upon being injected, ie, if the Mag batch was injected into a male subject would it morph them into a female or would they keep their male body? Or would it just not work on a male subject?

I remember DE wanted to have male and female versions of each Warframe but scrapped that idea early on

Because I'm also thinking in a hypothetical about a Protoframe being made of the batch from an opposite gender. Reddit thread talking about Rusalka and the idea of turning her into a Proto and then using Transference on her to free her from Wally's control - someone suggested she get the Lavos batch, and I think it could work but someone else thinks it's 'impossible' because they're opposite genders.

In essence Rusalka would become a female Lavos basically

Of course she likely fits Valkyr better than Lavos, but I'm focusing more on the Proto-Lavos topic here lmao

[tall echo]

Do people not know that transference can be used on things other than frames

[hidden cove]

Apparently they don't lmao

[tall echo]

Classic reddit

[hidden cove]

I'm probably a bit outdated but don't they need to be made of Orokin tech (Golden Maw, transference bolt), have a positive emotional connection (the Hex being friends), be Helminth'd, or otherwise be alive but have no sentience/sapience?

Side note, damn when I got Transference for the first time I hoped I'd be able to possess enemies and use them to kill other enemies it would have been so sweet lmao but probably too ambitious for Warframe

[tall echo]

Nothing specific is stated

But uh

Silver grove

[hidden cove]

Arthur did manage to throw the Drifter out of his head, so it's possible to resist it too

Might be a bad idea then to Transference into Rusalka while Wally is in there too

[hidden cove]

That fits for no sentience or sapience I think. It's a forest, right?

[north ferry]

I get the impression the primary part of transference is Empathy.

[tall echo]

Trees are very intelligent

[tall echo]

No that's a different thing

That's for calming frames

[north ferry]

I think it's both

[dawn shoal]

that makes some sense to me; plus theres the unum who essentially did the same thing but for one of the orokin's meat towers. though i think there is a lot more going on there than just whoever the unum was before transferring into the tower lol

[north ferry]

Not mechanically but conceptually.

[tall echo]

Not conceptually either

Empathy is just to calm frames and prevent their madness from affecting the transferencing person

[north ferry]

Was the forest the unifed network before she transferred into it? Or did it sort of get mutated afterwards?

[tall echo]

What do you think

There's no direct answer but the implication is that the person is the neural network

[stray herald]

I never knew veso is holding a staltha

[hidden cove]

Veso, the guy you play in New War?

I only remember him having a Plinx

[north jolt]

Okay so I been thinking about this and correct me if Im wrong, but the infestation (in its various forms) has such a strong psychic link that its able to use that link to travel through time through its various members, which is also how we are able to use the frames and vessels directly to time travel. Am I close enough?

[hidden cove]

It does have a hive mind, but I don't know if it can transmit through time

If it could transmit knowledge through time we'd be knee-deep in paradoxes even if we ignore the existence of Duviri

[north jolt]

That seems to be the implication I'm getting, but its also why Im asking a second opinion on it

[lean garden]

Transmitting knowledge through time doesnt really matter if they dont act differently because of it

[hexed oxide]

what does eleanor's pfp mean ?

[azure jasper]

I believe that's the Holy Grail.

[mint wren]

doesn't transference usually require an organic component?

like the reason we can use derelict necramechs is because there's human remains in them?

[azure jasper]

Personally, I think 1999 might not actually be the past, but another pocket dimension like Duviri.

[hexed oxide]

doesn't seem like it, the holy grail usually has a cross in the centre of the cup

[lean garden]

Recall the Heart of Deimos quest, whats happening is that your impulse streams are being crossed into the necramech

So basically, its like using an xbox controller on a PC

[lean garden]

Would be tough given how much drifter and the hex repeat that 1999 is part of the timeline

[hexed oxide]

also eleanor calls herself a witch sometimes, and her callsign is salem

[mint wren]

eternalism is a thing

[azure jasper]

Usually, but we also are in an alternate religious landscape (IE Sol/Lua Worship.) It's possible the crucifix may not have become an icon in this reality.

[mint wren]

probably experiencing an alt 1999

inside an alt 1999

[lean garden]

Eternalism this eternalism that, but drifter and eleanor outright state that 1999 is part of the operator's timeline, so like its not an alternate 1999

[azure jasper]

Furthermore, the Grail is an important item in Arthurian legend, which Eleanor and Arthur both have interest in.

[lean garden]

Plus eleanor, even before making contact with nun eleanor, thinks of a life where she's a nun

[brittle siren]

who doesn't

[brittle siren]

queen of cup ig?

[hexed oxide]

ok that one seems more likely, actually found a grail with a crown on top when looking that up

it symbolizes emotional sensitivity...i think that checks out

[north jolt]

Wait there are? I've actually been wondering about this for a long time but couldn't find any straight forward answers to it

[mint wren]

I swear there was offhand dialogue that mentioned it a long time ago but I am unsure

[north jolt]

If there is I don't remember it either, but weirdly I kinda always suspected the skulls were more then just decorative

And that the actual pods contained more then just computer bits

[humble sierra]

Yeah I feel like there's bodies in them for us to "transfer" into

Not sure if we're capable of transferring into inorganic matter

Plus the "Necra" prefix is indicative of death/decay

[lean garden]

I must reiterate that our control over necramechs is through the rerouting of our impulse streams

[proper barn]

we know that isn't true.

this was a early theory.

but is now not considered true by what DE and the game has said.

[north ferry]

Yeah, I liked that interpretation but word of god and game made it more complicated.

[proper barn]

I kinda always disliked the

"It's not really 1999" theory. Idk feels too complicated and annoying.

[drowsy saddle]

Have you not seen the face of the corn cob that is the necramech?

[restive river]

Literally stated to not be both in-game and by Rebb

It’s the true past

[north ferry]

Tbf, it's easy to feel adding actual time travel to a setting is complicated and annoying. So, same difference.

[restive river]

Eh, the difference is we can cause actual changes to the timeline
And clearly are with the Coda
As well as like. Actual stakes existing

It’s not just an offshoot or some conceptually embodied island but our actual past.

[drowsy saddle]

Also like, the whole point of 1999 is that its so important to the time stream that Wally can't mess with too much since he's bound by the laws of Cause and Effect

[north ferry]

Where is that established? I must have missed it.

[restive river]

You’re confusing him being bound to the strands of khra

[drowsy saddle]

Isn't the strands of Khra just a fancy name for cause and effect?

[restive river]

No.

The strands of khra are conceptually embodied timeless, void renderings of cause and effect

[drowsy saddle]

Faux cause and effect

Damnit albrecht

[restive river]

Wally’s murmur, primarily the fully formed ones exist to tie those strands down so he may travel

Heck we are in one and cut it in whispers

[north ferry]

And I'm confused again

[restive river]

This is what happens if you missed class

[drowsy saddle]

Da cube

[brittle siren]

small warning: for anyone wanna replay the Duviri Paradox quest, don't, it will bring you to the Hex Finale quest instead

[quick wadi]

Like you select replay on duviri paradox and it drops you into the finale?

[restive river]

It did not do that for me btw

[brittle siren]

yeah

[quick wadi]

Wack

[brittle siren]

maybe try it again? I'm not risk 5mins to redo it all over again

or not just in case since you can't leave the quest anyway

[restive river]

Try what?
Replaying the like hour long quest??

[brittle siren]

no no

it just the finale part

like 5mins or less

[restive river]

It’s 15 minutes

[brittle siren]

it not though? like the only long part is Lettie and Eleanor

maybe it more than 5 but still not that long

nvm most vid is above 15

[restive river]

:p

The game literally says its 15 mins or longer lol

Like the first time around at least

[brittle siren]

maybe i'm being ignorant about the time I spent

I posted it on the Forum and hope DE see it

[brittle siren]

how is this related to WF lore?

[vague lark]

Saved*

[woven coyote]

Yeah... maybe #fan-art or smth in that category

[obtuse vine]

i still dont get what arthur meant by this, when did he save us?

[proper barn]

talk to her and you can figure out what she means.

[brittle siren]

I actually forgot what we owe him

[proper barn]

you wouldn't know?

[brittle siren]

I seriously not remember anything

[proper barn]

I meant

[brittle siren]

Just spill it out

[proper barn]

I Meant you wouldn't know cuz it's made up for this conversation.

you say what it is in the conversation

it's not a real thing otherwise like it's just for the converation.

[brittle siren]

What

The
Balls

Dude just say what is it

[proper barn]

I AM NOT SAYING

WAIT NO

[brittle siren]

Just put spoiler lmao, I already did all the convo

[proper barn]

AHHHHHH this is hard to explain.

the convo is all we know.

it sounds like i'm saying i don't or can't tell you what i am saying is the only thing we know is that we own him something from that converstaion. i think it's just said he saved us during a mission or something. @brittle siren

[brittle siren]

If I remembered correctly, he didn't save us, once. He stabbing our hand and intended to throw us into the Techrot

He even make us do his chore

If anything, we save him, not the other way around

[proper barn]

yeah i know

this is just for the conversation.

[old dome]

...is there any hope that de will go back to jade shadows & tell us why the orokin empire (or ballas) had redacted jade's entire existence from documents??

bc like. this feels like an extra step even for ballas... especially considering the implication that every other frame has their docs intact & can be accessed by ordis.

but somehow he couldnt find much of anything on jade...? its. ????????????????

i need to go sleep ive been awake for nearly 24hrs i think—

but before that: does anyone know the japanese words/phrases koumei says when using her abilities?

[lean garden]

Well thats because you might have hallucinated this bit

Ordis struggles with figuring out whats draining Jade, which as we can clearly see from the Jades we can make, isnt meant to be a default for the warframe

[brittle siren]

Beside Tenshin is Jade memory, it literally said everything you need to know

[brittle siren]

Same with Stalker right?

[swift sentinel]

Combined with Lizzie's insight, it appears that driving the Warframes insane was purposeful on Ballas' part and NOT what would happen 'naturally'. So any Warframe that remained sane was also purposeful on Ballas' part, for Soren and Jade specifically it enhanced the torture/punishment if they remained fully aware of what was happening, rather than relying on a single moment of trauma like Umbra.

[strange turtle]

Ordis does mention documentation being “scarce. almost…redacted”, but I’m pretty sure he was just referring to Jade’s disappearance around the Night of the Naga Drums that he had just mentioned

[lean garden]

mhmm, thats exactly how I read it

[lean garden]

Not exactly, it would be a natural process, since Lizzie at that point doesnt actually recognise why the human mind might buckle under the weight of joining with the infestation

in around the same convo area, you elucidate what Lizzie is aiming for for flare, and you realise that its a really big change in the mind for people

which leads to the "infested madness" line

to which Lizzie still calls it 'not madness' just a different way of thinking

[swift sentinel]

I see, but Soren and Jade do show that it's possible to fully convert someone into a Warframe but have them retian both individuality and sanity.

[lean garden]

Individuality yes, sanity? Half-yes

Stalker doesnt have all his marbles

Jade does better than her husband

[swift sentinel]

I think it's debatable that that was from becoming a Warframe and much more likely having to spend uncounted years watching his beloved wife sit slowly dying

[lean garden]

eh, he didnt know it was jade until the events of jade shadows

so him losing his ding dongs is definitely not because of "having to spend uncounted years watching his beloved wife sit slowly dying"

[swift sentinel]

It's been a while but I'm pretty sure he knew when she saved him during the Night of the Naga Drums

[lean garden]

No actually

[swift sentinel]

otherwise why preserve her

[lean garden]

Hunhow: "Her light is dying, her life almost spent. And you will never learn why this unknown slaughterer chose to spare you."

When the drums struck, I saw him. Changed, just as I was changed. But the medal was his. There is no other like it.

**My Sorren. And he did not know me.
**
I took him. I flew. Through the blood and storm and insanity, I flew.

[swift sentinel]

I misremembered then

[lean garden]

its a fair question

although Im half certain its a mix of instinct, curiosity and gratitude

but not because he knew

it enhances the tragedy, because only now did ballas's "promise" get fulfilled

[humble sierra]

Yeah he gets his memories steadily back throughout the quest, when we see his memories

[north jolt]

I think the claim that the Orokin have completely erased all records of the past (prior to the age of the orokin empire) is a lie, kind of. I think when they were still around the elites of Orokin society still had some records of the past but just heavily gate kept them from basically everyone else. They were all about control after all so makes sense they would also try to control people's access to knowledge and history while keeping some stuff they like for themselves (like certain cultural artifacts)

[graceful swan]

They didn’t erase all records they erased the fact they were human making people think they were gods

[wide niche]

Could someone help me understand what happened during the new war and after

I understood nothing

[drowsy saddle]

Alot of buildup for new war was in operations that aren't around anymore, still. The main point is that the sentients kicked our rears and banished us to the void (and since us the player specifically made the deal, presumably all tenno got snapped as well). Fast forward an unknown number of time to the Drifter showing and beginning the process of putting the lotus back together

[graceful swan]

Did you skip the cutscenes in the previous quests?

[north jolt]

I thought they "erased" most records of old earth tho

[graceful swan]

Yeah that would’ve been a record of old earth

Orokin didn’t originally do the god thing

[north jolt]

Yeah Im just talking about their manipulation of history and info in general

[wide niche]

That's it?

Thought it would be more but ty

[wide niche]

No

I never skip but I didn't understand a thing

[strange plinth]

that's the basic rundown, yeah

[graceful swan]

Might be worth replaying the prelude to War stuff

[obtuse vine]

ah ok so basically what/why we owe him is entirely decided by the dialogue tht we choose, essentially it didnt exist before or after the convo

[proper barn]

it kinda exists after but yes.

[tall echo]

Yeah the KIM system saves some responses for future convos

[quick wadi]

Like the cubed spaghetti thing

That one had some preamble but some stuff just happens offscreen

[winged flume]

I love how on the Zariman, the corn on the cob; is just cut into a cube.

[graceful swan]

Corn on a cube

[raw stone]

Okay so... there's no definitive information, but Praghasa requires energy to travel right?

There's no info for what I'm about to insinuate.

If Praghasa requires a whole star to make the jump from Sol to Tau, presumably that's where Pazuul and Ballas wanted to go, then back during the old war, how did Praghasa jump from Tau to Sol, to make the attack kn the orokin empire? Me and a friend were just talking about it.

[quick wadi]

We used to have two suns

Everyone just forgot

I have absolutely no idea

Actually wait maybe they did just collapse a star in tau

[strange plinth]

solar rail
they took the long way to Tau the first time, made the tau-side solar rail, had their revelation, came back n destroyed the solar rail at pluto

[graceful swan]

Praghasa doesn’t require the sun to go to Tau Ballas just used Praghasa to destroy the Sun so nobody would follow him to Tau Lotus had already powered Praghasa

[raw stone]

Ah.

Ah to... both explanations.

[winged flume]

I think a fully charged Praghasa didn't require a sun to jump, but it was void shot to Tau first time through, then built the corresponding rail to Sol. That's about as far as the logic seems to go for me. Why Praghasa need Sol to send one lowly excutor to Tau is beyond me. I think it has more to do with Wally and his machinations.

Or rather their machinations as Wally defies gender prisons.

[chrome frost]

So like....how the infestation even come to be? Don't get me wrong I get that the infestation is basically techrot made into a weapon by the orokin but...then where did techrot come from? From what we read lizzie write in Kim and how the helminth acts, I could only think of it originally being made to be some wonder cure for all diseases which somehow went wrong and started that whole hive thing

[strange plinth]

we don't know the exact origin of the infestation

the closest we have is the techrot's outbreak

[chrome frost]

The techrot then, it's origin is also a mystery right?

[silk atlas]

Yes

[chrome frost]

...ok wild theory, what if O.R.O were trying to achieve immortality through bio-mechanical engineering?

Think of it this way, they made nanobots and started trying to mold them into what they wanted them to be via coding them, and then they wrote something like "make human unable to die" leading to the techrot interpreting it as "don't let the mind die" thus leading to the creation of the hive mentality

Then again the theory is held up only on "ifs", not much proof other than the fact that the infestation sees its actions as good

And even then we mainly hear the helminth strain speaking to us and I'm not sure if other strains have same thoughts as the only "friendly" one

[old dome]

ah,,

[old dome]

yeah thats the one i was talking abt,, like. why would it be redacted...??

[wooden stag]

Someone can explain externalism to me..?

[silk atlas]

Do you know the many worlds theory?

[old dome]

(points at dc & marvel comics' multiverse) that.

[wooden stag]

Yes

[old dome]

just understand it as a comics multiverse. its so much easier than breaking down quantum mechanics.

[wooden stag]

The um every possible outcome happens but in a different parallel reality?

[tall echo]

It basically is just generic split timeline multiverse with an unnecessarily complex explanation

[wooden stag]

How does this tie into the drifter operator duality is all i care about

[tall echo]

Timeline split at the point when they made that deal with wally on the zariman

Operator got every kid on board void powers including themselves, drifter saved all of them

Wally did a little funny with the wording of the deal for drifter

[old dome]

drifter: made a deal w the devil to save the tenno on zariman, didnt get the void powers bc wally is. wally & he thought its funnier for his own amusement; grew up on the zariman alone (?) & created duviri out of a storybook as an unhealthy coping mechanism. once they wanted to leave duviri, the king didnt like it & started the death loop we saw in duviri paradox quest.

operator: made a deal w the devil to save the tenno on zariman, got void powers & became a child soldier for the orokin empire. was put into cryosleep by lotus/margulis.

[tall echo]

Don't think all that extra explanation was necessary tbh

[wooden stag]

So how did drifter end up getting void powers afterall?

[tall echo]

Did you play the new war

[wooden stag]

Yes , but a long while ago

[tall echo]

Drifter "fuses" with operator during it

[wooden stag]

Sounds like we gotta recap some of the story huh

[old dome]

yk the handshake drifty & operator did in tnw?? yeah operator shared their void powers w drifty

[tall echo]

Eh, not much left to explain beyond that

[wooden stag]

Fair enough

Thanks y'all

[tall echo]

(And their place in realspace)

[north jolt]

Im going to post it here cause I just noticed it, but not really sure what to make of it

But while doing a Codacyte encounter I noticed this area around earth that kinda looks like a aurora borealis?

[restive river]

Yeah?

[jaunty oasis]

I'm guessing Tenno in 1999 refers to something to do with War Sector?

[drowsy saddle]

Fairly sure that's the techrot swapping in Tenno in place of "noob" or something similar

[tall echo]

It's a reference to the coda swapping around bits of their pre-programmed interview answer lines to make them work

[jaunty oasis]

ah ok

[north jolt]

Just thought it was interesting but also wondered if there might be a greater lore significance to it

[restive river]

Do you know what the aurora borealis is?

[north jolt]

More or less

[tall echo]

[restive river]

Then no, no greater lore signifigance

It’s as natural as a tree
Actually
More natural

[tall echo]

Occam's razor

[restive river]

Natural as the sky itself

Does the real one have lore significance like???

[north jolt]

Probably right, but if I recall some of the night time levels in Hollvania show it too right?

[tall echo]

Ok and

[north jolt]

so from that height you might be looking down on the city (or at least where it use to be)

[tall echo]

Aurora borealis don't just occur in one place

[north jolt]

I know, sometimes they occur in my kitchen

[restive river]

:p

[static lintel]

MC FINALLY SAID THE WORDs

I confirmed my thesis that Drifter is DUVIRI

It has now been debunked

[drowsy saddle]

Usually its confined entirely in my kitchen

[nimble pendant]

I have a question, whos is the strongest warframe? To be more specific, who can win the most 1v1's in a fight? (no gameplay mechanics,no operator or drifter, just by pure skill and abilities)(I will not count Limbo because he is literally the god of his own dimension)

[silk atlas]

Whichever you want to win. There's no reason to bother with this kind of distinction because if one of them was explicitly more stronger, they wouldn't have kept making the "weak" ones

[humble sierra]

There's lots of annoying powerscaling feats (like apparently Grendel could swallow a planet, and like you said, Limbo's got a domain expansion) but in terms of raw strength, I'd have to guess Yareli because she's the only Warframe capable of getting ragdolled by a fat corpus guy

[drowsy saddle]

Technically? Atlas could shatter planet destroying asteroids, with the caveat of needing his rumblers to weaken key points

Saryn is said to have temporarily cleansed earth of infested

Protea when pushed to her absolute limit can create a pocket dimension

[nimble pendant]

protea vs limbo, the time juggler vs the hat in time

[drowsy saddle]

Their powers colide and time continues as normal, that or they play 5D Paradox-Billiards-Vostroyan-Roulette-Fourth-Dimensional-Hypercube-Chess-Strip Poker

[nimble pendant]

or just a clown show

juggling and rabbits in hats

[nimble pendant]

lets change the question but same rules. Who has worst and who rhe best way to offer death to their enemies (worst being painful, long, traumatic etc.. and best the opposite)

[drowsy saddle]

Excal and ash are probably the fastest deaths

Baruuk and atlas too, though not sure how Atlas' petrify would play into it

Yareli depends, if you run into her saws then instant death, but you could be drowned by her bubbles and vortex

[nimble pendant]

drowned by an idol thats a way to go

[drowsy saddle]

You would also think mesa is fast, but regulators hit center mass, you'd be shot 50 times a second before the trauma kills you

Saryn, Nidus, Grendel are all different forms of slow deaths

[nimble pendant]

literally

digestion ifestasion and intoxication

[drowsy saddle]

Cyte would be up there, hopefully you're not near anyone

[nimble pendant]

that funny, thats sound like grunt talk

[nimble pendant]

imagine being the last, fast but horrifying

[drowsy saddle]

Volt and gyre could absolutely shock you enough to fry your nerves but not kill. Don't google what happened when an electric chair fails to kill...

[nimble pendant]

electric handball

what about octavia

[drowsy saddle]

Mag could just Magneto you, pull the iron straight out your blood

[nimble pendant]

are you even aware of her hynosis

[drowsy saddle]

Brain aneurysm

Burst blood vessels

[nimble pendant]

sound and psi be like

same for banshee i guess

who is worst emeber, frost or gauss

(heat and cold gauss)

[drowsy saddle]

Gauss is like yareli, you could get mach rushed into tomato sauce, or slowly singed by 4th degree burns

Also trinity would be funny, you'd be kept alive indefinitely to act as a blood/punching bag

[nimble pendant]

DAMN, I never thought of that

wf's that keep Youalive

like nidus' link

or Nyx's first

or xaku

garuda

[drowsy saddle]

If you convince Nyx to treat you as a pet/companion, you'd get to be invincible with her 4th augment

[silk atlas]

Insert Amir housebroken joke here

[nimble pendant]

nidus' link would be really weird, how does it work? does it transfer pain or eat you to protect nidus, can you feel what nidus feel? what if he eats taco bell? am i the one who goes to the bathroom?

what if I eat poisin? does he get poison or is the infestation smart enough not to do so?

if he vibes do i vibe?

[fleet rain]

Are the coda the infested boy band or is it the infection just mimicking them?

[nimble pendant]

just clones

[restive river]

The Coda are specifically clones of the boys made from the infestation

[nimble pendant]

really twisted clones

[restive river]

Go read the PC in Aoi’s shop

[fleet rain]

Okay 👌🏼

[nimble pendant]

can they clone moist critical?

[restive river]

In theory, sure

[nimble pendant]

whats the difference between protos and regular frames? are protos like umbra?

[silk atlas]

No. Protos are just a modified version of Warframes that slowed down the transformation process in an attempt to prevent them from losing their minds.

[nimble pendant]

so what makes umbra especial? He doesnt look very sane but not crazy

another question, whats the source of warframe's powers? void right? does that mean that the oparator is just a kid with void and possesion powers?

[nimble pendant]

if so, how are the hex able to control the void if they didnt make a deal with the man in the wall?

[silk atlas]

Warframes don't need the Void to use their powers.

It's just for the Operators to help control them.

[silk atlas]

Special transference bolt that makes him relive killing his son over and over

[restive river]

When the heart goes is malfunctioning we lose our abilities but can use transference mostly fine tho

I’d absolutely argue the void is used for their powers

They’re void tech

[restive river]

They’re void attuned, likely connected to the Heart of Deimos which powers all void tech
So
They’re void tech now

[nimble pendant]

huh interesting, bluetooth power connecton

ty guys

[north ferry]

Except they're in a completely different time than the Heart?

[restive river]

And yet they and their bikes are void attuned

Oh and also all the other void tech we have in the backroom

I was expecting a heart to be seen in 1999 but presently it can still make sense the one on deimos is powering things in 1999

[obtuse vine]

yeah either albrecth somehow managed to connect things in 1999 to the heart or he made another void pump somewhere in 1999

plus there's a kim convo tht talk about this subject specifically

[north jolt]

Probably something about using the "strand of khra" to link stuff together

And somehow using warframes/vessels as conduits (though they don't seem strictly necessary since, you know, he went back and forth repeatedly seemingly only using that coffin looking device)

[restive river]

If he utilized a strand that’d just give Wally a path

[restive river]

Maybe notable but the vessels have hearts that are very similar to the heart of deimos itself

[north jolt]

Maybe that's how Wally tracked him down. Dummy should of dug up a Delorean or something

[restive river]

Could just be they’re void attuned via their connection to the vessels, which it would make sense that Albrecht would have a Vessel for every Proto

[north jolt]

The whole idea of that is kinda reminiscent of the idea of "ancestral memory" to me. Not like exactly, but a little bit

[limber pulsar]

does that mean he also has a bunch of giant atomicycle vessels lying around somewhere

[smoky solstice]

did the indifference consume her

what is this? "haha!" "omg."???

something's up

a complete 180 from how she was before, I mean I didn't expect her being super cold anymore but I also didn't expect for it to go all the way to this
is there a big twist coming??? she played around with the void and it cost her everything?

[limber pulsar]

a kid in a rough situation being initially mistrusting of a stranger does not mean that they are forever incapable of laughing

[smoky solstice]

yeah but I'm used to her being all business and to the point

also why am I forced into helping her get out

I mean I don't mind helping but I'd like to know it's for the right reasons, so far the reason she gave seems like definitely not a good one, but ig this part is whatever

[north ferry]

... treat them like your character would? As far as I can tell almost every Kim chat can just be a jerk.

[smoky solstice]

yeah but today it's one dialogue option about me telling her about duviri

I don't wanna be a jerk either, it's just that I don't wanna help her if her only reason is, what, some sort of spite against the people who wronged her? and I haven't seen an option which confronts her about that while also not being categorically against the idea of helping

but it's like a very specific line of dialogue I'm thinking of so I'm not like too upset

overall, she seems kinda cheery here and that threw me for a sec tbh, I guess I was just too used to the conversations being super difficult and not light hearted at all

[old dome]

...ngl?? you Do actually seem upset abt it.

[smoky solstice]

not really sure how to respond to that

[dark zenith]

So like

[smoky solstice]

it's a criticism, but it's not like I hate what's going on here now lmao

[dark zenith]

How in gods name do the warframes get into the orbiters?????

[smoky solstice]

and I understand that my vision would be like pretty hard to execute

[old dome]

we print them in the foundry... inside the orbiter.

[smoky solstice]

I mean you see it when you extract, they have a little warframe shaped hole they magnetize to

[old dome]

wdym running away from a traumatic situation isnt a good reason to help her...?

[restive river]

Maybe just one

[dark zenith]

I know that but when your inside the actual ship it doesnt actually have an entrance outside the door in the back which leads to the orbiter

[smoky solstice]

that's not really what she said though, and it's not really the situation considering she's no longer in the traumatic situation, in terms of everyone holding that against her, she just associates the world she's in right now with what happened, and going to the future is in many ways symbolic for her - she's leaving all this behind, and staying here is equivalent to not being able to move past it
I just think that sorta thinking is a bit, idk what would be the right word, inaccurate ig? and I would have loved to delve into it more

but I understand that it may be hard to do in a video game system

sometimes you just have to accept you can't make all the decisions precisely how you would have wanted to and that's okay, it's just a limitation of this not being real life

[old dome]

...you had me in the first half & then you lost me again.

[limber pulsar]

the front bit of the orbiter with the star chart detaches and is the landing craft you enter at the end of missions

[old dome]

so you want drifty to do... what exactly?? other than Not helping? /gen

[dark zenith]

Like

I know the landing craft detaches
Its just the confusing part is

There is NO entrance inside of the landing craft outside of the path leading to the orbiter bit (the doorway)

[smoky solstice]

I never said not helping, I said simply delve more into the reasons why she wants to do it, because it's not like this is necessarily the solution to how she feels or the best way to deal with that trauma, simply talking about what makes her feel like this would be good
you can help but also make sure the other person doesn't regret it in the future by making sure they've fully thought it through, since this does seem like a big decision

god, I'm tired, can hardly type, hopefully this makes sense

[dark zenith]

Sure theres the tube thing
But like how the hell does it transfer you from the tube to the inside of the ship

besides maybe Mystical Void Things

[smoky solstice]

does it really matter? you are in the tube, there's a thousand different sci-fi mechanisms which can put the warframe in that position to inside the ship

that aren't necessarily visible on the inside either

at least not obviously

[old dome]

yea it does!! im. just as tired so thats why i kept asking,, & yeah i agree w that. if we can therapize 2 adults who have massive communication issues, idk why we cant tell the 19yo girl what the future is ACTUALLY LIKE & how maybe its not. the best thing ever... but at the same time i Get why she wants to travel to a time period that has nothing to do w the one she feels trapped in.

[smoky solstice]

just feels like a mechanical detail, I'm not sure how this is in any way different from a lot of the other mechanisms in the orbiter ig is what I'm trying to say

[old dome]

her trust issues are. really Something that needs to be unpacked for her development as a character.

[dark zenith]

My Inner Engineer brain is fried thats all

[lean garden]

I think both endings have her resolve her issues

[dark zenith]

if the landcrafts existed in real life id probably die due to me being really dumb

[lean garden]

I wont say what specifically, but one gets her to understand that staying is not a problem, and the other one is a certified Kaya Velasco Hood classic

[proper barn]

She's literally still in it. Also DE literally disagrees with you.

[smoky solstice]

yeah, like I'm not even sure if it's a bad decision, just wanted to delve into that more, but as I said it, I also kinda realised that having that as a third option or something would be an absolute headache for it to flow within the context of the KIM system, so I understand the binary as well, either being fully supportive of it or not, and I lean more on the fully supportive side anyway so I don't feel like my intentions are completely in the opposite direction

[proper barn]

Her good ending is literally ||getting out of 1999||

So DE says your wrong.

[proper barn]

Their is still a "bad" and good ending.

So like SHRUg

[lean garden]

Kayas issues is more than just a trust issue, its also a self-perception issue

Only one of the endings will settle that self-perception

[smoky solstice]

what I meant is that it's not an aspect that she has to deal with daily anymore, obviously the trauma is still there, I'm just saying that the situation of it being constantly shoved in her face is not

[proper barn]

DE literally says you aren't resolving her issues if she can't do the thing.

[smoky solstice]

a big part of her trauma was it literally being in the news, everyone knowing about it, everyone constantly reminding her of it and demeaning her for it

I was talking about specifically THAT situation

[lean garden]

Thing is just because youre removed from the fire dont mean you aint cooked

[smoky solstice]

is it treated that way? because the concept of "good" and "bad" doesn't get brought up much in warframe from what I've seen

[proper barn]

wait am wrong about that?

[smoky solstice]

that's exactly my argument actually

[proper barn]

okay in the DE thing it's said if you resovled it correctly

you get to be "best friends" and if you do it wrong they where "aquintances"

Pretty sure.

[smoky solstice]

interesting

idk what DE thing you're referring to, I mean I've steered clear of spoilers for the most part

[proper barn]

It's WAY easier

To Tell in like

Minerva and dude and Flare.

[smoky solstice]

honestly her getting away does surprise me, because like she's still in the mall, I just assumed both endings would be a version of she stays, but she either doesn't resolve her issues or she does, and there's no actual way to time travel

[lean garden]

Yea you might need to refine how you say it, because so far youve seem to grasp her desire to leave due to the incident, but not so much on the impact the incident had on her self-perception and self worth

[proper barn]

i can't tell what is the right choice for Kaya BUT i can for the rest.

cuz you litearlly can't have all the converstaions with Flare or Minera and Frost man if you do very very badly.

[smoky solstice]

not my point at all actually, and I thought I made it clear with what I said to nada, my argument was purely about whether time travelling would actually help with her issues or not
that's why I'm saying what you said is my argument exactly, she leaves 1999 but that doesn't mean she's not still "cooked", which is why I brought up the possibility of helping but also delving into her reasons deeper to make sure she's fully considered it

[lean garden]

Which is why I said you didnt consider the impact the incident had on her self perception and worth

Because her being able to reach 1999 is a direct anti-thesis to the incident

[proper barn]

you would have to do the rank 5 convo one so bad

[north ferry]

... so, as far as I know no one has finished the new KIM?

[proper barn]

to not get the Kaya goes to a place ending.

[smoky solstice]

seems like I'm circling the drain here, everyone seems to be concluding

definitely minnerva and velimir

[proper barn]

wait what?

you shouldn't have ended that this soon.

[north ferry]

Well, I suppose you might want to loop when it come around.

[proper barn]

if you did you got the bad ending.

[smoky solstice]

I'm not saying it's ended, I'm saying it seems like we're basically wrapping up here

minnerva and velimir are back to being a couple it seems, probably not too much more til it ends

with the others there's still stuff to do

[lean garden]

Like you should have already done the KIM where she talks about the incident, a key thing she mentions is that how all her effort is undone, all that kaya velasco is, reduced to a nude.

Imagine what being the one to figure out time travel does for a girl who needs to know that she's still the smart cookie she's always been?

[smoky solstice]

but it's not about the discovery, it's about the actual act of time travelling to the future, that's the way I interpreted it at least
I mean sure, a discovery of this scale would probably help in terms of self-esteem, but it seems like the obsession isn't just with discovering this, it's also utilizing it to get to a future where basically none of this is real

and her not being able to do that would mean that she's just never gonna be able to move on

[lean garden]

At what point did I say kaya was only focused on the research of time travel

She figures it out, she applies it to prove it works

[smoky solstice]

the part where you said it's mostly about her needing to prove to herself that she's still the "smart cookie she's always been"

[lean garden]

And how does that somehow not include traveling to the future?

[smoky solstice]

like even this implies that the time travelling would be to prove that she can

[lean garden]

Research is one thing, application is another

[north ferry]

I think you're getting the idea that her self worth coming from her intelligence as the character arc.

[smoky solstice]

because the time travelling isn't about this, that's what my point is, she wants to time travel to leave 1999, it's not just about discovery and proof that it works. She even says that part of the problem is the fact that she could be the smartest person in the world and all that people would care about is that picture.

[north ferry]

Her arc is about overcoming her mistake and the shame brought about by it. At least from what I've gathered so far.

[smoky solstice]

I don't think this is an ego thing, or that she needs to prove to herself that she's still incredibly smart, based off what she said, that isn't really that important to her

[lean garden]

Which is to me, missing the subtext

[smoky solstice]

I'd personally say it's more about the fact that she feels she can't overcome it, since all that people care about is the pictures, she can't move past this, unless she leaves it all

[lean garden]

Theres a way she will phrase her final kim message

Which encapsulates that this is all about who kaya velasco is

[north ferry]

It remains to be seen I guess.

[smoky solstice]

well that's not necessarily contradictory to what I said, yes, it's about how people perceive her, and it seems that the way she sees it at the point where she explains her trauma, she doesn't think that will ever change now that the pictures are public, that's all she will be remembered for and she feels going to the future is necessary to be able to change that, to move past all of this to a world where none of this matters

but ig I'll finish it and see what's written

[lean garden]

In both paths (at this point?), she should remark that she knows that the opinions of others dont matter. So escape isnt for them

Are we at 5.1 or 5.2 today?

[smoky solstice]

you mean at the ending? is that like a point where she grew on that? because, like, that's one of the things that kinda bothers me about her motivation at this point, the fact that it seems to be all about how others perceive her and that she can't change that

[lean garden]

Or are we at 4.3?

[smoky solstice]

I mean it's fair to feel that way

but you know what I mean

[lean garden]

Because if its 5.2

This is literally the point of this discussion

[smoky solstice]

also, what's the actual prehistory of kaya, I don't know if it's anywhere in game

[lean garden]

If its 5.1 then wait to tmr

[smoky solstice]

like all of the others talk about what caused them to inject themselves, I don't remember if kaya ever does that

[north ferry]

Huh

[smoky solstice]

I have no idea, if it helps, I had the dialogue today with kaya where I told her about duviri as like something that could help her in her pursuit of time travel

oh and all the dialogues put me at close

[lean garden]

Kaya found doctor e, he gave her a "choice", she's here now

[smoky solstice]

was trusted yesterday

[smoky solstice]

a choice?

[north ferry]

Pretty sure this conversation with her happened earlier.

[lean garden]

4.4 then

[smoky solstice]

what exactly are we talking about here, what context did he find her in and what choice was it

[north ferry]

'Hey Kiddo, you wanna be a protoframe?' Or somethin

[lean garden]

You are 2 convos away to her talking about perception

[lean garden]

she found him

[north ferry]

... he didn't find her tho

[lean garden]

Not the other way around

[smoky solstice]

oh I found it

[north ferry]

Anyway time for my conversations for the day.

[smoky solstice]

ok she doesn't detail what choice it was

but I remember the thing about her finding him now yeah, not sure how I forgot this, ig the whole first half felt a bit uneventful, ig maybe it faded into the background somehow lmao

[north ferry]

It's because she wanted it to be uneventful.

[smoky solstice]

well regardless, it's a bit vague "he gave me a choice and well whatever. Now I found you", skipping a lot of in between there lmao

or why she even chose the injection, with the others it felt like they were in some way misinformed, here it's not clear

in fact, here it seems like she may have known what she was getting into, although she also seems non-chalant about that decision? idk, it's weird

[north ferry]

Yes... that's Kaya.

[smoky solstice]

"grumpy teenager" does not necessarily imply "oh yeah idc about this injection that will completely transform me"

at the same time, maybe it was like that

her life already ruined, maybe she just didn't care anymore, decided to take a risk because why not

not really any reason for it, just that it can't get any worse than it already is

[north ferry]

Its nothing to do with how she feels about it and has everything to do with how she interacts with a relative stranger over KIM

Also, yes. She's confident in her ability to assess the situation and make an informed choice. She's not concerned about that choice, she knows that it was the correct one for what she wanted to achieve.

[smoky solstice]

oh you meant like how she talks to us specifically

I'm just saying that she puts nothing behind that choice, she just chose it and that's it, I know we're a stranger but idk

[north ferry]

I mean, the fact she was so nochalant about that statement shows she's either nochalant about it, or wants to appear nochalant. Considering how standoffish she is, I would say the later.

[smoky solstice]

fair

[lean garden]

Mmw she will remark nova as being something she likes

[smoky solstice]

oh I guess she would've been doing this whole time travel research thing well before she found us yeah

[lean garden]

I aint even need to kimulacrum it, with the way things are going shes going to say something of the like

[north ferry]

I was going to say, the Portal, High Tech Frame, she would be on to that.

Imagine how annoyed she'd be if a Protea Protoframe shows up XD

[lean garden]

The funny part she was already sneak attacking people before she became nova

[smoky solstice]

she says that pretty early I think if that's what you're referring to? like the thing where she wants us to refer to us as Nova online and, when asked, simply says that she likes that nickname

[north ferry]

Haven't got there, I have no idea how the progress with her giong in my KIM. indeed my progress with all of them.

[lean garden]

Eeeer, not exactly that, but thats well supportive

[smoky solstice]

well she's already aware of Protea, pretty sure she brings it up asking us about how the mechanics of the anchor work

[north ferry]

God though, I love Lizzie.

[north ferry]

Yeah, exactly my thought. imagine having an actual protea to pick their brain, or that she was even and option of a protoframe.

[smoky solstice]

you know, at the same time, I kinda feel like a warframe which can create wormholes is probably about as important, I mean we're talking about something that can't really be possible normally because essentially teleporting would have to screw a lot with time, no?

like the whole time dilation thing, how it relates to velocity, that may be big in terms of discovering time travel

[lean garden]

I think its not considerable for nova, the velocity thing

Because its not a velocity thing when you hop through

Its like uuuuuh, you ever watch stargate?

[smoky solstice]

well yeah but how can you hop through and have that not mess with things

[smoky solstice]

no

[lean garden]

Star trek?

[smoky solstice]

no

[lean garden]

Damn

[smoky solstice]

like I'm just saying, the speed of light seems like a pretty giant barrier

[lean garden]

Er point to point transmission, no high speeds involved

[smoky solstice]

well yeah, but how exactly is that possible, you know?

[lean garden]

Its "ftl" travel without traveling ftl

[lean garden]

Well warframe aint that kinda sci, its soft as hell

[smoky solstice]

in fact is there some theoretical explanation for how that type of teleportation could happen irl?

[native heron]

Guys hear me out

[lean garden]

Hard scifi would give us the damn formula

[north ferry]

I mean, yeah, correct you're both saying the same thing kinda

[smoky solstice]

well yeah but how can you even hard sci-fi this

[native heron]

You know how dante helped loid with research and stuff?

[lean garden]

You cant because it came out soft to begin with

[native heron]

What if dante was actually the love triangle of loid and albrecht? :3c

[smoky solstice]

yeah but I'm asking how can you hard sci-fi teleportation

is there some theory as to how that could even be possible irl?

because idk how something can move from point a to point b without having a velocity

[smoky solstice]

I wish I knew more dante lore so I could engage with this

sorry sq

[native heron]

Sadge

[north ferry]

Uhhh, considering both Loid and Albretch are pretty commited. Besides, Danta and Drusus have their thing going on.

[native heron]

Oh right i forgor about drusus

[lean garden]

Eeeer havent studied physics in years, and never professionally studied QM, but quantum entanglement go brrrr?

[smoky solstice]

what is quantum entanglement

[native heron]

But here's like an actual theory,so you know how temple's guitar is a helminith creature and all...does that mean that fish girl's skate is actually a spy?

[feral cape]

Drew would have an issue with calling star trecks thing not ftl

Because like star trecks thing is moving you just move everything behind you and cheat that way so like a speedometer would say ftl

[smoky solstice]

oh speaking of which, lizzie did in fact want to eleanor flare

we have to talk her out of it

[feral cape]

Deconstruct a body into into data and teleport it that way

[smoky solstice]

so you have like multiple bodies?

[feral cape]

No you only have one

[smoky solstice]

but wait, does data even travel ftl?

[feral cape]

I've heard researchers have managed to teleport data I've not looked into this so I don't know the specifics

Also there's the option of just folding spacetime

[smoky solstice]

what the hell

[smoky solstice]

and what would that mean

[feral cape]

Spacetime is blanket

Fold it in half

[smoky solstice]

yeah but how does one practically do that

[feral cape]

Lots of energy

[smoky solstice]

what does that look like

hm

but does spacetime even necessarily imply that that's actually possible?

[feral cape]

Should be

[smoky solstice]

I mean yeah technically you just have to take what it is and manipulate it to where you can move from one point to another without requiring any movement, the problem is just like if that type of manipulation is even possible

[feral cape]

Well everything warps spacetime

[smoky solstice]

like just because spacetime can curve doesn't mean it can curve however you want it to curve

[feral cape]

Folding it is probably just really intense warping

[smoky solstice]

perhaps there are limits

[worn crescent]

2 things that share the same quantum state so anything you do to 1 will happen to the other no matter how far you are(?)

[worn crescent]

It’s been awhile since I did anything relating to quantum physics

[smoky solstice]

idk my impression of the speed of light has always been "how the hell do you even get past this"

so ig whatever solution would have to circumvent speed yeah

[worn crescent]

You can’t, unless you want to quite literally break time

[feral cape]

Thats also assuming general relativity applies to the fictional universe

[smoky solstice]

especially considering that I think velocity in a big way is relative

[feral cape]

Its fiction they can pick and choose what's true and what's not

[smoky solstice]

isn't that the whole thing behind all those relativity theories, that it's all just based on whose perspective you're considering

[smoky solstice]

ig true yeah, just assume that the blanket fold will work and create some device that folds the blanket

you have some theory behind it at least

[feral cape]

For example

Any universe that does actually anything with black holes is spit balling

[worn crescent]

So wormhole?

[smoky solstice]

yeah ig

it can be any type of hole you want 🙂

[worn crescent]

Absolutely not.

[smoky solstice]

in any case, ig I can see some potential theoretical routes now, I've just always wondered if there's anything out there to help with this conundrum of teleportation in fictional universes

nice to know there is and this pressing issue has a solution

[worn crescent]

So just how much do we know about the void?

Like I know it’s a field, a type of energy, a place and apparently sentient

[restive river]

Unknown if it’s sentient

We know it was nothing before Albrecht, no energy, no anything
Space and time work differently or. Not at all, untime and all that

We know emotions and concepts can interact with it to create things, weapons, animals, people, memories

[lean garden]

Trek warping is ftl, trek transporting is not

Beaming in star trek is what you said, break down into data, reconstruct from data

[lean garden]

Look up alcubierre drives

[old dome]

tbh i just skipped ahead to reading the kimulacrum

[north ferry]

... that's a terrible choice.

[pine stag]

I’m a sort of new player with 300-350 hours and I have a few questions about the lore

[main crane]

Go ahead. I'll try my best to answer :3

[rancid lance]

Why is aoi so damn fine

[lean garden]

Because

[old dome]

...is that the rest of the zariman ship in the background or??

[proper barn]

it's more of it.

[median reef]

is rusalka garuda proto?

[brittle siren]

no

[old dome]

nope. shes just an npc.

[median reef]

riveting discussions guys really.

[humble sierra]

Rusalka's an NPC and she might be a proto in the future but it'd probably have to be for a brand new Warframe

[proper barn]

you asked a question?

did you not want people to answer the question?

[brittle siren]

So can any of the Sentient able to mind control?

Seem like Revenant is the only variant could do that (he fuse with Eidolon power)

[median reef]

youre not making sense

[median reef]

no

[brittle siren]

I think you are the one not making sense. Like you asked if Neci Rulsaka a proto, we said that she is not

[proper barn]

yeah.

[median reef]

lmao why would i take your word for anything with zero reasoning or explanation

[proper barn]

Okay

Protos are fully incased by the helminth.

Ruskla is not she is just missing an arm.

[graceful swan]

Guy asks question
Gets answers
Doesn't like answers
Complains about answers

[median reef]

doesnt get answers

[proper barn]

i explained it.

[median reef]

lmao

[proper barn]

Look at all the protos they are incased mostly in helminth ina warframe shell.

[median reef]

at least you got some kind of headcannon. i'll give you that

[brittle siren]

Because with common sense you would know. Albrecht and every single Protoframe never mention that she is a protoframe. And the fact she join Scaldra means she ISNT one. Viktor hate the Hex, why would he let Neci join Scaldra if she half infested

[graceful swan]

Rusalka isn't a proto this was actually confirmed by DE

[brittle siren]

This too

[median reef]

imma need a clip

[graceful swan]

Just because you don't like an answer doesn't mean it isn't true

[brittle siren]

And if you want proof? Play the 1999 content. The info is spread out all over the place

[proper barn]

what?

this isn't headcannon.

[median reef]

non answers arent answers

stop coping

[proper barn]

I can show you the lore where all the protos are injected with helminth.

[graceful swan]

Just watch the 1999 devstream

[proper barn]

do you want those lore bits?

[humble sierra]

Actually she was confirmed not to be a Gemini skin or a Proto before the release of 1999, they said that to squash any theories of her being ProtoSaryn and secretly being a Gemini skin to unlock

Her future is uncertain

But there's not really a Warframe that she could be a Gemini skin for

[graceful swan]

As of the current moment she is not a proto

[median reef]

i didnt dispute this.

[brittle siren]

?????????????

Ok I quit

[graceful swan]

You did dispute it though

[proper barn]

Okay what specific answers do you want?

[brittle siren]

He need proof

Like write word by word

[proper barn]

cuz everything i said wasn't like head cannon at all.

do you wanna see the lore segment?

[brittle siren]

Everyone with common sense would know

[proper barn]

i can get it.

[graceful swan]

Lore discussion is one place where we don't do headcanon

[brittle siren]

Please do, just end this suffering

[proper barn]

I am gonna get the one from whispers.

[brittle siren]

Well we do sometime but always have a head up

[median reef]

you clearly have none because you keep projecting on my statements

[graceful swan]

Pale can you give us proof that she is?

[brittle siren]

Is this enough for you

Or do I need to find the exact timestamp for you?

[median reef]

no man all Ive asked for is naysayers is to have a reason other than no. how this escalated is some autistic nonsense.

[graceful swan]

Look at Rusalka's design

Missing an arm

Scaldra outfit

No Helminth infusions

[proper barn]

https://www.orokinarchives.com/albrechts-notes/

go to the vessels part of this.

[median reef]

bro thats not a rule. I understand why youu think that though. you may be right.

[brittle siren]

Oh now I'm autistic

[median reef]

yep and Im gonna keep making you mald as much as I can if you dont chill out.

[graceful swan]

Rusulka doesn't have a Garuda Helminth design

[median reef]

fair enough.

[proper barn]

that's what i said.

[median reef]

I really hope they do turn her into into one to screw with you lot in the end

[graceful swan]

What they do in the future is anyones guess really

But currently nothing suggests she is

[proper barn]

She currrently a host of wally.

[median reef]

a clone I think actually

[proper barn]

no

clone?

[graceful swan]

She isn't currently a host of Wally after the scene where Albrecht tells us to kill her he leaves her body

[proper barn]

no they say in the quest and when you talk to the couple that she is wally's like vessel.

[proper barn]

does he?

[humble sierra]

The Coda are clones, Rusalka is/was a puppet for Wally but now she might just be a husk.

[graceful swan]

Yes that's why she asks who we are

[humble sierra]

He tells you to kill her so Wally can't access her again, and in the rest of the quest the Indifference speaks with her voice

So I think it's implied It took control again

[graceful swan]

Wally takes us after that

He was already in 1999 at that point

He didn't need her anymore

All we know is after the quest she is gone

Where is anyone's guess

[brittle siren]

I maybe never gonna engage in any lore conversations after this situation

[proper barn]

no don't do that.

don't let this one person stop you.

[median reef]

lol same here man you were such a good welcome for my first post

[brittle siren]

F off

[graceful swan]

Lol

[median reef]

https://tenor.com/view/fat-boohoo-cry-baby-gif-10647085

[brittle siren]

https://tenor.com/view/1blocked-message-discord-meme-troll-brick-wall-gif-23392632

ok I will stop now

[tall echo]

The hek happened here

[feral cape]

Because there is literally no evidence to support rusalkas a proto frame there's nothing to explain other than no she's not a proto

[feral cape]

Thats called an appeal to ignorance i don't need evidence proving otherwise until evidence shows up that says she is a proto

[graceful swan]

They accepted this idea

Took a lot of convincing though

[graceful swan]

Scroll up and find out

[median reef]

No.

[graceful swan]

We aren't getting Garuda Rusalka anytime soon even if it ever does happen as Albrechts gone Rusalka too and DE are moving in from 1999 content and back to stuff in regular Origin System

[median reef]

What a miserable group of people you guys are here. Worse than region chat and that’s saying something.

Mediocre suits you. 👍🏽

[silk atlas]

https://youtu.be/UYHoyHxbj0s?t=4492 Here's where Reb says she's not a Proto skin.

[graceful swan]

Rebb didn't want you to be disappointed and you disappointed yourself anyway

Then blamed it on us

We weren't using headcanon

[median reef]

Lmao bro I haven’t even defended the idea once. You’re lost in the sauce.

The amount of coping you need to do to make yourself some kind of victim is wild.

[graceful swan]

The amount of coping you did because you really wanted it though

[median reef]

I really didn’t though. Asking questions when you get one word responses is fine.

[graceful swan]

We told you how it didn't make sense told you DE confirmed it isn't the case yet you still kept going on how it is just our headcanon

[median reef]

No you couldn’t handle being asked for proof.

[graceful swan]

I'll tell you where this conversation today went wrong you were given info from people who listened to the Devstreams and lore sources instead of just asking for it to be explained more clearly you decided to be sarcastic which is confusing which caused an argument

[sly ibex]

Time for a new conversation topic. 😄

[sly ferry]

am I the only one bothered by jade's feathers at teshin saying "dog" instead of "kubrow"?

[sly ibex]

She probably knew of the old Earth animals.

[graceful swan]

Well Kubrows are dogs

[sly ibex]

Also that lol

[sly ferry]

how? orokin erased all info about old earth when they came to power

[sly ibex]

Well, semi-dogs. I wonder what kind of genetic tinkering the Orokin did to make them lay eggs.

[sly ferry]

but they don't call them dogs

[lean garden]

well, old earth records might not be able to erase the evolutionary history of present time animals ya getme?

[sly ibex]

They still tried to recreate old Earth animals though, so there must have been records enough for that. Even Lotus talks about old Earth animal records in regards to the Archons.

[lean garden]

like you can erase history to control the present narrative (which is and has been done irl), but like sometimes certain present things rely on "safe" information from the past

[sly ferry]

then still, why would a long-extinct old earth animal be the thing she goes for when talking about drawing a picture of their family?

[sly ibex]

All present creatures are recreations by the Orokin. Genetically engineered. At least, if that old lore tidbit still holds true.

[lean garden]

where is that tidbit from?

lemme go see the ceph fragments before I do some ETA

[lean garden]

Most of the wildlife observed today can be traced back to creatures of Earth. In the Orokin Age, organic manipulation was used to modify earth lifeforms to a purpose: war, agriculture, pets. Long after their Orokin masters perished, some of these species managed to survive through adaptation, and can be found roaming in natural environments.
This one?

[sly ibex]

I think it was something said in a dev stream long ago, so it may or may not still be true.

Ah, okay. So it did get altered. Originally basically all life was wiped out by the Infestation, and the Orokin then made things with genetic engineering, I think it was.

[lean garden]

hmmm, I wouldnt necessary say it was wiped by the infestation, since thats not what the entry inplies

from the second sentence it seems more like a All Tomorrows situation between earth animals and the orokin

[sly ibex]

I meant that is what they originally said happened, possibly before the fragments were put in. So they must have just changed it, is all.

[lean garden]

finally, an actual case of a retcon

[sly ibex]

There have been a couple other ones, like an early dev stream where Steve said Hayden was the first Tenno. Clearly not the case now, since with 1999 we know he did not exist in Warframe's universe.

But never anything already stated in-game, unless it was an "unreliable narrator" kind of situation. Ballas being the massive liar and manipulator he was, that makes sense in lore, though.

[lean garden]

I thought that was a joke referrence?

Since Hayden Tenno is technically the first tenno that DE made, because his surname is tenno?

ah doesnt matter hayden aint even in Warframe

[graceful swan]

Didn’t his Tenno name refer to his actual last name not a nickname like ours?

[sly ibex]

Steve meant that he was the first Tenno in the Warframe universe. But since we know Warframe Earth is not real world Earth, that isn't the case anymore.

But again, that was FOREVER ago. Like super early dev streams, so hardly a retcon as far as I am concerned.

[graceful swan]

We became the first didn’t we

[north jolt]

Bat dogs
Bogs
Dats

[north jolt]

Afaik they more or less evolved naturally and eventually domesticated by Orokin, so maybe they just already did that?

[north jolt]

Ahh nvm, missed this tidbit

[pine stag]

Hi I have a question about the lore

[lean garden]

shoot

[pine stag]

The void angels

[lean garden]

what about them

[pine stag]

There called void angels it there in the Zara in

[north jolt]

Yes?

[lean garden]

yes, the void angels are called void angels in the zariman, what is your question?

[pine stag]

Why are they called the void angels but there not in the void, that’s kinda dumb

[lean garden]

would you perchance like to hazard a guess where the zariman's back half is?

[pine stag]

I’m going to guess the void?

[lean garden]

ding ding ding!

[pine stag]

Yay I’m smart

[north jolt]

They're former Zariman crew who got corrupted by the void and turned into those things

[pine stag]

Ohh thanks

There quite enjoyable to fight

[graceful swan]

Zariman was sent into the Void to attempt to go to Tau

[pine stag]

Ty

[north jolt]

Technically void jumping had always been a thing but in Angels and New War they mention how previously it was always done shorter bursts. The Zariman was suppose to be the first time a LOOOONG jump through the void was attempted

And it worked out great and nothing at all went wrong

[pine stag]

Until…

[lean garden]

The zariman was originally meant to make smaller jumps to tau, its just that they changed it to one BIG jump

[pine stag]

Kk

[north jolt]

And it worked flawlessly

[lean garden]

https://tenor.com/view/no-war-in-ba-sing-se-avatar-earth-village-gif-25923233

[obtuse vine]

eleanor's dialogues tht happens when u look at her arcanes plus her vendor intro dialogue makes me think tht arcanes are infested

[glacial bough]

Maybe hers, but definitely not in general

[stark arrow]

Operator: "So, the great Teshin is just a dog, fetching the Queen's stick wherever she throws it."
There is a line in The War Within

[wooden stag]

What is tau again?

[lean garden]

Another star system

[wooden stag]

What's so interesting about it

[graceful swan]

Home of the Sentients

[wooden stag]

So basically aliens?

[graceful swan]

No

[wooden stag]

Huh

[graceful swan]

They were built in the Origin and sent to Tau and made it their home

[wooden stag]

Ugh so they're really is no aliens at all?

[graceful swan]

Nope

[wooden stag]

Wally ig

[graceful swan]

Wally isn’t an alien either

[wooden stag]

Well the closest

[graceful swan]

Is just a Void Entity

There’s a 50/50 chance he was even made by Albrechts fear

[wooden stag]

Wouldn't void entities account as aliens

Imean c'mon murmur

[graceful swan]

Murmur are just Wally cutting himself

[wooden stag]

Ig that's fair

Got unique points

[candid elm]

How old are the members of onlyne?

Cause packets floof says he's a teen

[hoary vapor]

Packet is (imo) on the younger side of a teen.

The dialogue shows Packet as naive and sheltered

[graceful swan]

Most characters ages in the game aren’t stated past teen adult child stuff like that

[normal mountain]

I would be sorely disappointed if this book isn't littered with Sun Tzu puns

[brittle siren]

What timestamp is it?

[silk atlas]

The link should timestamp it

[brittle siren]

Ok

That guy still an insufferable person even after I leave that conversation

[graceful swan]

Lol

[restive river]

Man I’m glad I was asleep during that lmao

[graceful swan]

I wish I was

Many People in Lore discussion been having weird takes recently

[proper barn]

Well the Coda packet is probably perpetual young.

[proper barn]

I've only seen like 1-2 it's been mostly fine.

[graceful swan]

I bet that’s the same for anybody Infested related

[high bay]

So uhhh… what exactly is Grineer armor made from? Follow up question, how many roentgens of radiation would it take to reduce an average steel path Grineer into an elephant’s foot-esque mass?

[graceful swan]

Ferrite armour

[high bay]

So like an iron alloy or steel?

[restive river]

Ferrite is iron

[high bay]

That much I know, I should know that given I’m going into welding as a career lol

[restive river]

Lol

[marble pewter]

It's still a bit eerie to see these ghosts on Lua. Are they Orokin or Tenno or.. both?

[woven coyote]

We dont have armor types anymore

But before they were ferrite for most units and alloy for bombards and such

[woven coyote]

Probably neither

Just vague memories

[high bay]

I know that, I’m making a funny about Qorvex literally melting people with a morbillion roentgens of radiation from his 4 😂

[marble pewter]

Neither? hmmm

[restive river]

Unknown

[woven coyote]

Yeah
Its probably some conceptually embodied shadow
Maybe of the everyday routines people once had there when it was inhabited

But it doesnt look defined enough to be individuals

Really just feels like shadows of everyday life that lua once had

[restive river]

I’ve seen the theory it’s connected to warframes before, I think cause of some of the poses they do but
Ehhh