lore-discussion

[restive river]

What

[smoky mango]

No…if only it was that easy

[restive river]

No that’s Kalymos lmao

Kalymos is Albrecht’s Kavat

[graceful swan]

The Laboratories have come under fresh assault from the Murmur. Unless the Sleeper is awoken, Albrecht Entrati's legacy will perish.

Ah so a legacy of throwing animals into the Void taking drugs to get ideas being the reason the kids were sent to space and humans he made volunteers that need therapy

Some Legacy Albrecht

[restive river]

Minn was a cervulite like Tagfer, both the last of their kind

She died and now he’s super depressed for obvious reasons

[smoky mango]

Yeah he got no friend or companion anymore ever

[graceful swan]

He’s got us

[smoky mango]

Yeah when we aren’t killing things

Which that makes 1% of the time

[restive river]

Wait what
“Taking drugs to get ideas being the reason the kids were sent to space”
????
I don’t recall him having much involvement if any in the Zariman

[lament stirrup]

Tagfer also has the other two Cavia. And Loid.

[restive river]

He has friends
Us
Loid
Bird 3
When he’s not mad at Fib, Fib

[smoky mango]

Well yes but it isn’t his species

God I can’t stand Fib

[lament stirrup]

? Okay? You don't need to be the same species as someone to be friend with them.

[restive river]

I love astarian fish

[restive river]

this

[lament stirrup]

Especially since the Cavia all the same incredibly specific trauma, sans wife.

[restive river]

Technically we aren’t the same species as the holdfasts and we’re friends with them

[restive river]

Trauma bonding!

[smoky mango]

They are trauma bonded but like having your only wife ripped away from you has truely gotta suck

[graceful swan]

Albrecht didn’t have much involvement but him stealing fingers gave the system space travel

[smoky mango]

Wally has made mention that he doesn’t like that

[restive river]

I know
But he was doing drugs to get ideas AFTER that

[restive river]

When someone steals and uses a piece of you you’re arguably justified in not liking it

[smoky mango]

I wonder where Wally will intend next aside from Tau

[smoky mango]

Valid there really wasn’t much consent there

[lament stirrup]

Really funny that Tumblr's back on their "Wally is actually an innocent victim arc" now that he's pointed out that one bad thing did actually happen to him that one time.

[restive river]

Anywhere he can get into

Wally is not an innocent lmao

[graceful swan]

I was just listing all the things he did it wasn’t a chronological order of events

[smoky mango]

I hope we get more story on the lotus deal she made with tmitw

[lament stirrup]

She.. Didn't do that?

[restive river]

Like yes it’s mucked up that his finger got cut off and that finger was used by an empire for a buncha tech
But the answer was not experiment with making adults go crazy and attempt to kill their children

[smoky mango]

Not as comprehensive

[graceful swan]

What makes you think she did?

[restive river]

She didn’t make a deal

[smoky mango]

Doesn’t she say she did

[restive river]

Ah

[smoky mango]

I swear she did

[restive river]

She didn’t.

Nowhere does it say she did

[smoky mango]

Guess I imagined it

Or assumed she did if she knows of him

[restive river]

People speculated it cause her hand was smoking after Wally showed up during the new war but that’s speculation.

[restive river]

Albrecht knows of him and he didn’t make a deal

[graceful swan]

People often think she needed a deal to move the Moon but TSD explains the Orokin just made tech to do that for some reason

[restive river]

We and Baro have been the only people to make deals with Wally.

[lament stirrup]

Also possibly Rusalka.

[restive river]

Void is a good hiding place

[smoky mango]

Albrecht is just a father figure 1v1ing for custody rights with Wally

[lament stirrup]

I'm convinced she has a prosthetic arm because. Void.

[restive river]

Deimos was hidden there too

[restive river]

I doubt it tbh

I think she became the door for him due to the ARG, not some deal

[smoky mango]

I have a feeling she might of

[graceful swan]

Wally can just take over peoples body

[restive river]

I mean it seems you need to be in the void to make a deal with Wally but I’ll admit that’s speculation

[lament stirrup]

It just feels odd that Wally could full on possess someone without some kind of extenuating circumstances, given that he doesn't manifest through the angels or Zariman victims.

[restive river]

Of our sample size of 2 both were in the void for their deals
So
:p

[smoky mango]

I wonder where rasulka might have a play in this

[restive river]

The ARG is those circumstances.

[lament stirrup]

Some, something. "The signal"?

[restive river]

Considering she has no way into the void I doubt she made a deal

I doubt she made contact until the ARG
Which
Is all that was needed for Wally

[smoky mango]

If Wally was able to go into 1999 then given he probably talked to rasulka as someone she knew

[graceful swan]

That’s probably more on him only really being there for most part more than only being able to make deals there

[restive river]

He only got into 1999 because of Russalka being the door for him.

[lament stirrup]

You know what would be awful? If Rusalka made her deal with Wally in return for ensuring her parents survive the Techrot.

[restive river]

Why is she the door?
Likely the events of the ARG.

[graceful swan]

We let Wally in

[smoky mango]

That what I was thinking

She probably missed them

So he got what he wanted and she is going to get what she wanted

[restive river]

I mean yeah
It seems he can only exist within the void and outside of it via strands of khra

[lament stirrup]

It ties up Albrecht coincidentally making her parents protoframes with a nice bow.

[restive river]

Which iirc we know Wally didn’t have access to 1999 until he got to Russalka

[lament stirrup]

Wait. Do you think Albrecht Protoframed Rusalka's parents in an attempt to weaponize familial love?

[restive river]

He didn’t?

[lament stirrup]

The Saryn and Frost protoframes are Rusalka's parents.

[smoky mango]

Hope we find out as there is more to Albrecht

[restive river]

The serum can just
Exist out in the world
Iirc it was stated they stole it?

[lament stirrup]

Was it?

[graceful swan]

Such a Viral relationship

[restive river]

It’s not exactly impossible

[smoky mango]

Definitely needs to build some immunity to toxicity

[restive river]

Albrecht put the cure out there, his serums could’ve easily been stolen

[smoky mango]

I assume we will learn of scorches backstory to

[lament stirrup]

Do you mean Flare?

[smoky mango]

Yes

[lament stirrup]

They're Zeke's ex. My evidence for this is vibes.

[smoky mango]

I’m sure it’s certainly pivotal to the story

[graceful swan]

Have we even heard Flares voice yet?

[smoky mango]

I don’t think we have

Well I haven’t

Gtg take care yall

[lament stirrup]

I think in their theme song? But otherwise none of their voicelines played, even in the shop.

[restive river]

No

We know Flare isn’t a fan of Scaldra cause they executed their bandmates tho

[restive river]

They had them turned off
Or
They weren’t implemented yet

[lament stirrup]

Now perhaps I'm deranged.
But you know what would be a great new source of Coda personalities-

[graceful swan]

Probably learn it the 19th

[restive river]

That would involve Scaldra cloning them too :p

Which we don’t know if the originals need to be alive or not

[lament stirrup]

The Onlyne Coda were made with hair and the Infested can consistenly produce it's templates once the first generation is done (I.E. ancient healers and the Juggernauts) , so I doubt they need the originals?

[graceful swan]

I’ve actually heard some people trying to say Scaldra are the good guys

[restive river]

Can
Can we stop saying the obvious bad guys are secretly the good guys???

The Grineer? Harm civilians
The Corpus? Greedy and harm civilians
The Infestation? Uncontrollable, harms civilians
The Orokin? Unethical, warcrimes, harmed and oppressed so so many
Wally? Cares about nothing but himself, willingly harms and makes people insane
Scaldra? Actively harms civilians and caused most of these problems, plus they’re trying to use the chaos to take over Höllvania

[lament stirrup]

No guys, you don't understand. They had to shoot those civillians to stop the techrot. They're doing what they have to do.

[restive river]

Heck we aren’t even the good guys 100%
But we’re the closest thing to it.

[lament stirrup]

I think the Mars Gradvius event is the only time I can solidly say the Tenno did a Bad Thing.

[restive river]

I mean we do kill a lot of people
Granted they woulda killed more but it’s still not great

[graceful swan]

Wasn’t Gravidus Alads fault?

[restive river]

What isn’t his fault

[lament stirrup]

I mean, the Grineer used Corpus finding cryopods as an excuse to do a tiny bit of colonialism on the native Martians. The player base siding with the Corpus directly led to Baro's mom (and everyone he ever knew and loved) getting shot.

[graceful swan]

All the events before he was born

[restive river]

Nah those were his fault too

[lament stirrup]

Incidentally, absolutely horrifying that Teshin's descriptions of Yuvariums and Baro's backstory imply the Martians were deliberatly kept technologically regressed and ignorant of the greater empire so the Orokin could farm them for "exotic" bodies.

[graceful swan]

Wouldn’t it be his parent’s fault for giving birth to him?

[lament stirrup]

He could've let a different sperm win.

[graceful swan]

How he won the race is a big mystery

How much of the modern Corpus can I blame on Granum?

[lament stirrup]

He's good at running if his behavior during the Zanuka boss fight is any indication.

[graceful swan]

Corpus are good at cheating death

[stray herald]

I need to know all the sentient mob names’ references/inspiration

Like i didnt know a sentient murex was named after a genus of snails

[tall echo]

"If you kill a killer, the number of killers stays the same."
"Kill... two."

[dire mountain]

He has Loid and Bird. And i guess also Fibonacci but I don't blame tagfer for still being slighted toward him

[dire mountain]

Did you not listen to what Bird 3 said 😭

"If this is smart I wanna be dumb. Yell yell yell yell yell! Hit and hit and hurt and hurt. We lost it all. We lost green and run and food-want and smell-follow. And sky blue. And Minn. And all we got for all that losing… are these big brains. Big brains and each other. And you wanna lose that too. Brains by being dumb and each other by throwing us away. We're all we got! Nobody knows what it's like being us. Nobody but us. You're not mad at each other. You're mad at you. You can't hurt everything that hurt you. Sometimes things just hurt. Sometimes things not wrong, sometimes things just are. We're all we have left, and you want that to die, too."

Like he isn't completely alone

[restive river]

Yeah lmao

[strange turtle]

“Before you embark on a journey of revenge, dig two graves”
“What a stupid quote. I’m killing way more than two people, idiot”

[woven coyote]

Average warframe player angered by rng

[proper barn]

I think most of our rng is fine.

[tall echo]

Mine isn't

[proper barn]

"i'm built different"

[tall echo]

I'm built incorrectly

[proper barn]

yeah that is different.

[distant maple]

is there a lore reason why Dante is so powerful?

[proper barn]

Book

[distant maple]

even after several nerfs he's probably still the most powerful warframe in the game

[proper barn]

BOOK

[proper barn]

They did also go back on the hardest nerfs. Mainly the line of site stuff.

[distant maple]

i was wondering if his dark verse 4 was LOS restricted or not

[proper barn]

Yes and no.

They changed it so if you are close enough it bypasses LOS.

Also the Brozime short for his just dark verse attack isn't true anymore.

[restive river]

Everyone was in such a tizzy about Dante’s nerfs but like
It wasn’t even that bad :p

Like he released in a tremendously powerful state and they arguably minorly nerfed him and realized they needed to chang the LOS system
Which was good, balancing and updating a system is good

[proper barn]

Also like I said a bunch was walked back. But people don't remember that.

Anyway.

[restive river]

At no point has Dante been bad
Just not as powerful as launch, which was arguably too powerful

But yes
Anyway
Lore

[proper barn]

Yee

BOOK

[restive river]

mfw you get to curious and get whisked away by forbidden knowledge of an eldritch being

[old dome]

...yeah sounds like the orokin alright. (/neg)

[distant maple]

oh its because dante is WALLY POWERED

Dante wields the ultimate wally power

He had discovered The Book, an unknown, unearthly tome of knowledge that was laid as a trap by The Indifference as an attempt to seize control of him.

THE BOOK

DARK WALLY BOOK

[pale narwhal]

Noctua?

Wouldn’t say its like the Grimoire

[proper barn]

It literally says it is in his what's it called. Laverian

[pale narwhal]

Yeah, I was wrong, it was

But its not called a Grimoire like the weapon we own

[lament loom]

guys is it confirmed lore arthur was destroying aoi in the back room

[restive river]

It is a grimoire type weapon :p

[restive river]

No

[pale narwhal]

Yeah, its a Tome

But not a Grimoire

[low girder]

whicch faction are humans?

[digital grail]

Most of them

[lean garden]

all of 'em except the Sentients and the Murmur, but theyre both human-derived

[burnt light]

Honestly I always assumed everything was some evolved twisted evolution of humans

[graceful swan]

That’s pretty much how it is

Orokin mastered human biology

Continuity made them almost immortal

Well Infestation may predate Orokin doesn’t necessarily mean it predates humans

[low girder]

thanks

[digital grail]

My sentence didn't even imply that

[low girder]

and what orokins mastered infrastructure and fashion?

[burnt light]

And erased every history book that predates them

[restive river]

The origin of the infestation is unknown

We know it predates the Orokin since we literally see it in a time before they existed and are told outright it predates them
But beyond that the origin is still unknown

[graceful swan]

"The Orokin were inhumane scum. The absolute dregs. But sweet tender mercy, could they design.

[burnt light]

I just headcanon someone played around with genetics and made a big oopsie

[digital grail]

I'm just gonna delete my message

[low girder]

What did the orokin do that was inhumane?

[burnt light]

If that guy, forgot his name, could come back and possibly made the tech rot, than chances someone else could have made the infestation

Experimenting with genetics and all that

[graceful swan]

How far into the story are you?

[burnt light]

Least that’s my headcanon

[digital grail]

So much someone probably has a list

[restive river]

The Grineer
The Warframes
Generally oppressing anyone who wasn’t them
The sentients
The Zariman 10-0
Continuity
And that’s just some of their crimes

[burnt light]

Everything that’s on the Geneva convention

[restive river]

The techrot wasn’t made by Albrecht.

[burnt light]

Oh

[digital grail]

https://tenor.com/view/chuckles-dnd-dungeons-and-dragons-dungeon-dragon-gif-16280088619428719972

[restive river]

The infestation was already there before he got there

[graceful swan]

It’s not a war crime if it’s not on earth

[restive river]

The most he did was accelerate it’s spread for his protoframes
But it already existed

[burnt light]

So someone did do bit of experimenting

[restive river]

Heck Scaldra was mucking about with it, they made the On-Lyne clones

But still, the origin is unknown

[graceful swan]

Scaldra war crime list when?

[digital grail]

The infestation might be natural

[restive river]

Does it have the same origin as the technocyte in dark sector? Maybe
But overall it’s still unknown

[burnt light]

If they don’t have space flight in 1999, then chances someone made them and everything was covered up

[graceful swan]

Actually was Albrecht throwing the Cavia into the Void considered inhumane?

[restive river]

It could be
It could not be

[low girder]

As in they made The grineer?

[digital grail]

YES

[restive river]

Yeah
They made cloned slaves to do manual labor for them
That’s pretty inhumane :p

[burnt light]

The corpus were what?

[restive river]

Granum made the corpus

[graceful swan]

Is there anything they did that wasn’t inhumane?

[low girder]

So the orokin are the orginal humans then

[restive river]

The Orokin just let them exist

[low girder]

if the grineer comes from them

[restive river]

Sure?

I mean they took control of like
Everything

Normal civilians do exist so

[graceful swan]

Well they did try stopping him but he blew up the Warframes so that’s probably why Ballas gave Parvos a gift to stop

[low girder]

The warframes were made because of Ballas testing with infestation right?

[restive river]

The Orokin did destroy all records of old earth

[burnt light]

Few places where can find people that look closely to humans

[restive river]

He used the helminth strain, a domesticated version of the infestation to make the warframes to combat the sentients

[restive river]

They are humans

Orokin, Grineer, Corpus, pretty much everything that’s not a robot or infested is human

[graceful swan]

Everyone always forgetting Warframes are still human

[restive river]

Minus the holdfasts and duvirians

[restive river]

Exactly, that’s like
The whole point of the sacrifice

Yea we clone them but they still have a human in there, pieces of who they were still remain

[low girder]

If it explains it, how did the Corpus come to be? Parvos im aware of, but The corups was already a faction by then right? So what started the Corpus

[graceful swan]

Holdfasts were human

[restive river]

Granum did

[low girder]

Why use Were? and not are

[restive river]

Keyword: were.
They aren’t anymore

[burnt light]

Who is Granum?

[restive river]

Because they aren’t human anymore

[graceful swan]

They died and became ghosts

[restive river]

They say so themselves

[low girder]

Wait how? did the quest explain that?

[restive river]

I believe it’s explained when leveling up with them

[low girder]

ic

[restive river]

They are void entities, conceptual embodiments of the memories of the crew that died
Yes born from humans but physically? Something else entirely.

Void ghosts if you will

[woven coyote]

Well the granum slabs seemed to depict them as farmer families before idk
But general merchant enclaves in a way

[restive river]

Founder of the corpus
Big mucker

[low girder]

So they arent actual them

because theyre dead

[woven coyote]

Memories of them basically

[graceful swan]

(if the Tenno is rank Angel) "Look at us. A living dead man talking to a Void-born paradox! Heh. This Universe surely is full of wonders."

[low girder]

its the void speaking to us

[low girder]

Ye like durviri

[burnt light]

Ordis was once human right?

[low girder]

yeah

[burnt light]

And the Cephelons?

[woven coyote]

Duviri is closer to imagination than memories in a way, since it is derived from a story book

[woven coyote]

Digitized human minds

[low girder]

Becoming A cephelon was seen worst than death, and was used by the Orokin as an punishemt method

[restive river]

The void doesn’t do anything on it’s own

[low girder]

Well then someone needed to think of the crew then to create them through the void thenn no? Like Drifter creating Durviri off the book

[burnt light]

Void seems like the place that can create things from a persons mind

[restive river]

Yup
It’s never stated who brought them into existence exactly but it’s hinted at that it was Wally iirc

[graceful swan]

It can

[woven coyote]

Hadnt thought of it before but maybe before parvos the corpus were just farmers

The other option for food supply would be the grineer but they considered the grineer dirty for being clones, and even today you dont want what you consider dirty near your food

[restive river]

Conceptual embodiment
Emotions and concepts interact with the void to make and do things

Like Belric and Rania love eachother so much that even in death the void keeps them connected via a void-tunnel sustained between them

[graceful swan]

I wonder if CE can work outside of the Void?

[burnt light]

Wonder if Wally was made by someone’s mind unless was always there

[restive river]

Considering Belric and Rania?
Possibly, if the emotions are high enough

[restive river]

Albrecht

Go listen to his logs in Necraloid’s room

[woven coyote]

Belric and rania i guess

Also regions of lua were known to be "haunted" in a way

[woven coyote]

Forgot the specifics from vorunas leverian

[restive river]

It’s possible Wally conceptually embodied the holdfasts up so his finger could corrupt them and he could get an army basically for free

[low girder]

So how did people get to the void, with void keys, but how did they first discover it.

[restive river]

Unknown iirc

[low girder]

is it a differennt dimension?

[restive river]

But nobody stepped foot in it til Albrecht

[burnt light]

Wasn’t it said the Sol systems is surrounded by something making sure no one leaves?

[low girder]

Also the Sentients come from Tau, which is its own system far from the origin, right? or something like that

[woven coyote]

Determined to be nothing until albrecht crossed into it

[woven coyote]

Robots sent to tau to terraform that came back to prevent the orokin from ruining it

[restive river]

No.

[woven coyote]

Because orokin ruining stuff isnt a matter of if its a matter of when

[restive river]

There are no aliens in Warframe

The closest thing we got is Wally and he seems to only exist because of humanity
Specifically Albrecht

[restive river]

Curious how it lacked even energy til then

[burnt light]

And bet Albrecht knows later he created it but won’t admit he has done it, guy comes off he will never admit he made a mistake

[woven coyote]

I like to think of it like it just had pure potential
Needed something to give that potential direction

[restive river]

He literally admitted to creating Wally lmao

[burnt light]

Least admit it to anyone else

[restive river]

I can see that tbh yeah
Cause it was p much a dead end til he entered and basically gave it a little push

[woven coyote]

At least he thinks he did
Just like how he thought throwing animals into the void would dumb wally down

[restive river]

He admitted it to the only person who really knows enough about it and whom matters
Us

Not many know about Wally :p

[low girder]

So something came from nothing?

[restive river]

Yeah, which I think he’s half right

[woven coyote]

Probably

[restive river]

That’s the void yes

Conceptually embodiment is a wonderful thing

[woven coyote]

Rather than nothing i think its closer to something they couldnt detect

[low girder]

Wait so that would mean Albrecht Thought of the void and he created it, not founded?

[restive river]

No… he didn’t make the void
He was the first to enter it

The void already existed but it was thought to be nothing as all tests came back showing it was nothing

Until Albrecht stepped into the void

He came back with a big finger that launched the Orokin into utilizing ftl travel and they could finally utilize void energy which they did a lot

Like two of their greatest inventions are void powered
The rails and the warframes

[burnt light]

Aren’t there frames that can use the void as a weapon?

[restive river]

All frames are void powered

Xaku specifically utilizes the void directly but they weren’t designed that way, rather they came to be that way

It’s possible they’re another case of some level of conceptual embodiment
Their fragments emotions, possibly loneliness or wanting to be whole, causing the void to react and bring their pieces together to form the composite that is them
And from there they utilize the void

All their abilities utilize it to some extent, except maybe their 3 as it’s more tied to the lost frames they’re composed of, but they arguably exhibit some void properties and like all warframe abilities are still powered by the void

[burnt light]

Makes me think the proto frames are weaker versions of their frames, because I feel if they faced a real frame one on one at their full power they will lose

[restive river]

No
The protos are void attuned

And we literally go 1v1 with Arthur

[burnt light]

Ah okay

[low girder]

Wait how so? If something deleted the void, no warframe would work? Even umbra?

[restive river]

All void tech is powered by the heart of deimos, in the quest by the same name we see what happens if it goes down
Our Warframe is depowered during that portion iirc

We’re forced to use a necramech to defend and repair the Heart

Since they aren’t void powered ig but are still transference controlled

Also yes even Umbra, he isn’t special due to any other factor other than retaining more sapience due to his special bolt keeping that burning memory alive in his mind

Even when killed and cloned it’s etched into his very design

But we help him out so it’s all good :)

[drifting mirage]

I really want to be able to replay that

[low girder]

We do clone him when crafting him, never thought of that. So that means we cloned a human essentially then no? That was sentient somehow

[restive river]

Yes
Every time we make a frame we’re cloning an infested human, down to their very mind

I mean in theory if you could replicate someone completely down to the last neuron they would be the same person so it makes sense
Our foundry is very powerful

[restive river]

Which one?

Cause the Hex Quest and Duviri will be replayable with Techrot Encore

[burnt light]

I always thought when we make the frame the person, whoever was made into that frame is either gone or working with us

[restive river]

I mean all frames have their minds essentially suppressed so they don’t go feral
Minus Umbra cause he was literally built different

[burnt light]

And those frames that were in those gateway like things?

[restive river]

We do have cases where strong enough emotions cause frames to retain sapience but it seems to be rare and wasn’t utilized much by the Orokin beyond Umbra

[restive river]

The specters from the solar rails?

[burnt light]

Yea those

[restive river]

Iirc they’re either just specter particles or just empty infested puppets with a basic goal of “protect rail”
I don’t recall which exactly

Point is they’re not controlled by a tenno

[low girder]

Wouldn't it be Ordis is powerful?

[restive river]

Heck idk if we ever actually fight tenno controlled frames beyond pvp

[restive river]

He controls the Orbiter yes

The Foundry is just part of the Orbiter like the other systems

[burnt light]

I just imagined every Orbiter is controlled by an Ordis or something similar

[low girder]

The whole tldr lore of ordis is he was an executioner or something like that, and he didn't like how Ballas was doing stuff, so he attempted to slaughter the whole orokin councel?

[restive river]

Ordis can be in multiple places at once

[graceful swan]

Ordis drones

[burnt light]

Oh cool

[graceful swan]

Had to put fake Ordis in Backrooms

[burnt light]

Think for longest time I thought Ordis had a split personality

His butler like side and his mad psychopath side

[low girder]

wait is that nnot the case???!??!?

[lean garden]

he was just a merc

and in an attempt to go out in a bang, tried to kill ballas

[graceful swan]

What is it with everyone failing to kill Ballas are they all just terrible at killing?

[woven coyote]

Yes
Just chop off the head it was a simple task
The French had it right the whole time lol

[burnt light]

Everyone forgot to go for the head

[graceful swan]

https://tenor.com/view/avengers-infinity-war-thanos-gone-for-the-head-snap-gif-12260153

[drifting mirage]

Heart of Deimos

[restive river]

Same ):

[burnt light]

So did the Orokin messed with the animals on Earth as well?

[tall echo]

Everyone forgot to go for ballas

[restive river]

Yes

[old dome]

they messed with everything. they didnt leave a single being alone.

[old dome]

tbf kullervo did try to go for ballas' head... he just didnt account for how thick ballas' plot armor is.

[woven coyote]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1159566087059419156/1316134783478141039/latest.png?ex=67ce9e48&is=67cd4cc8&hm=82a7f36c017dd50999bf69bfd91d7f474a3823fd714f253c468a5e21ec80e900&

You tell me lol

[restive river]

Okay but it’d actually be wild if we saw the ancestor to this thing in the Hollvania zoo and it was shockingly similar-

By the void how is that thing still alive 😭

[woven coyote]

Lol

[graceful swan]

Now I want a Hollvania Zoo

[restive river]

Same but like
Not infested and terrible

I wanna see the funny sloth gorilla :]

[graceful swan]

Just add a zoo to the mall

Or a mini zoo

[restive river]

Real!

Omg I’d love an animal lover proto
Other than Lettie

They’ve been talking about a falconeer frame a lot recently tbh though we know bird pets aren’t this year if at all

[graceful swan]

If I made the mall I would’ve added some history of animals and other details like that

[restive river]

We are getting a museum tile in the next update

And a FOAM PIT :D

[woven coyote]

I mean bird pets have finally been acknowledged in a devshort so its progress lol

[graceful swan]

https://tenor.com/view/quinn-maverick-2points-for-quinn-quinn-get-em-maverick-knocked-out-gif-21236351

[restive river]

It is!
And they’ve talked about falconeers on prime time!

I remember when that was one of the options for the 2nd community frame

[woven coyote]

I think the community wanting bird pets is as old as kubrows

[restive river]

Love that we got Xaku instead (broken) ofc
And we arguably got calligrapher with Dante

[graceful swan]

I got the void bird thing because it was the closest thing

[restive river]

I do kinda wish we got a calligrapher with a big brush or pen but Dante is cooler

[restive river]

The Dante Paragrim?

[graceful swan]

Yeah

[restive river]

I have one near one of my paragrims

[woven coyote]

Well his fingers on the casting hand are shaped like a quill

[restive river]

Yeah! He’s way cooler

[woven coyote]

I got the duviri one

[restive river]

Fun fact; Dante’s idle anims when applied to other frames let other frames utilize the book in the animation!

[restive river]

Both are lovely :]

I need more
For a time I did nothing but farm for them lmao

[graceful swan]

I wonder if Wally cared about the Nuke going off?

[restive river]

He was in the reactor

And it went off constantly before we got there

I mean Albrecht was probably lying about it needing to go off since it did so many times before :p

[graceful swan]

In the other server there was someone complaining 1999 was about the Indifference at all

[restive river]

?????

The quest was called “The Hex”
Not “Wally’s Venture into Y2K” or “Techrot Party”

[graceful swan]

“The story was good and all it just didn't feel like it should've been part of a story like this. like they could've made the next super villian we fight be a time travler who opens up a portal and threatens to destroy the year 1999”

They didn’t want it to be the Void War arc it seems

[restive river]

Wally was literally threatening 1999 and like
All of Earth’s history????

[restive river]

That’s the arc we’re on and that they’ve clearly been setting up for

Like
For years lmao

[graceful swan]

The story has been building up to Wally being the next threat

[restive river]

Yeah

[graceful swan]

Actually thinking about it Wally travelling to 1999 threatening all of 1999 is basically what they said they wanted

[restive river]

Exactly

[tough musk]

Everyone in the Hex is bisexual right?

[silk atlas]

As one video I saw put it, "playersexual" seems apt.

[restive river]

Or pan ye

Our Drifter is whatever we want them to be
Which includes more than the binary of male and female

[tough musk]

well I know for sure at least Eleanor is bisexual. (KIM message spoiler)

[restive river]

Yes

She had a crush on a girl and had a guy fiancé

[silk atlas]

gasp!

[tough musk]

right. so is that the case for the rest of the hex? I'll cut to the chase, does Arthur ever talk about his ex boyfriend?

[restive river]

No

I don’t believe any of them talk about their past love lives like that

[lean garden]

he will talk about his ex-girlfriend tho

[restive river]

Ah nvm

[lean garden]

and aoi will talk about her ex-boyfriend

[restive river]

Oh :p

Har har Bau

[lean garden]

(because theyre talking about each other)

[woven coyote]

[restive river]

I would def say all of the Hex are pan tho

If I had to guess
At least one of the new protos (either Flare or Kaya) is maybe Ace

[woven coyote]

I have to say
Really love DE, i think it's amazing how they didnt let themselves be pressured into making more romances

[restive river]

Same!

[tough musk]

tbh I hope it's not Kaya. one of the only female frames who doesn't have the conventionally attractive hourglass bodytype shouldn't be Ace imo. They should make one of the hyper sexualized frames Ace, like Saryn or Wisp. just my opinion

[restive river]

I mean I’m sure we’ll get a reason as to why Kaya’s not dateable

Same for Flare

[tough musk]

oh really? cause I was wondering about this. So we can only date the Hex? that's fine with me tbh

[restive river]

Also conventionally attractive or not doesn’t matter :p

Heck maybe she’s just Aro

[graceful swan]

Eleanor talks about Christopher

[tough musk]

she also talks about Mandy Jellicoe

[woven coyote]

Pablo or rebb mentioned it last devstream "we didn't want to do the same thing again"

[graceful swan]

We can probably still become friends with them

[restive river]

We def can

Can’t wait to repair that broken marriage

Ugh we’re gonna have to reset if we muck it up-

[tough musk]

Unicorn to the rescue : P

[graceful swan]

Best friends is equal to lover after all though Kim anyway

[woven coyote]

I for one hope we can help them find closure
Repairing isnt the only healthy path for a relationship

[graceful swan]

Imagine someone broke up with their lover just to be ready date one of the 4 new ones then got the news they couldn’t anyway

[woven coyote]

I would laugh

[silk atlas]

That's definitely going to happen, have you seen the Reddit?

[tough musk]

tbh I don't expect to see that level of emotional maturity in a videogame discord. it's refreshing

[tough musk]

let me guess.. Saryn thirst?

tsk tsk tsk, everyone wants that poison kiss :p

[graceful swan]

No, I stopped visiting the Reddit often not long after joining this server

[silk atlas]

No but that obviously exists. There was one dude who dated Eleanor and admitted to Arthur he was only doing that to get with Arthur.

[woven coyote]

That kim tag really doesnt help tho

[restive river]

Ooooo
I hope I can find as happy an “ending” as I can for them

[woven coyote]

We will see

The point they are starting at is certainly one of strain tho

[tough musk]

kim tag?

[woven coyote]

Nickname in the chatting system

[tough musk]

why what is it?

[woven coyote]

Minerva's is momtoxicated or smth

Hold on grabbing a screenshot

The nametag along with how desperate proto saryn fans were made them... agitated

[restive river]

Homestuck aah name

[woven coyote]

Love velimir's
PapaPolar
He will be the best cool uncle to the group

[restive river]

Real

[normal mountain]

Indeed
He'll definitely be one... chill dude
Helping the team stay... frosty

[lilac aspen]

Momtoxicated sounds exactly what my own mother would put down as a name if I said "It can be any name"

People really have an issue if such a common old person vibe name makes them double down on wanting to date her

Not like I can see said fans succeeding in actually charming her anyways without using the wiki.

[drifting mirage]

Papapolar: "I'm the cool dad" :finger guns:

[old dome]

thats p much all of the hex's usernames

[drifting mirage]

if you didn't have a dumb email/AIM name at that time, what were you even doing?

I still use my gmail from then for my spam email needs.

[untold spire]

Is True that Wally has the Original Dante?

[proper barn]

No.

[graceful swan]

What gave you that idea?

[untold spire]

I was playing and in the chat someone said that Wally is Possessing Dante

And the Original Noctua

Boundless Death note

[graceful swan]

There’s your problem chats with randoms doesn’t give the best lore info

[strange turtle]

Quincy is too

standing in the lights. mandem, galdem all droolin' over me.

[plush phoenix]

well i think they are all bisexual because you can date them with any drifter

although yeah i get that playersexual isnt quite the same as bi

[restive river]

I mean I’d still argue pansexual > bisexual since our Drifter’s gender is entirely dependent on what we the player want to be, including outside of the binary of just male and female

Heck the Drifter themselves comments on gender

[tall echo]

"Gender doesn't exist"
-drifter, 1999

[restive river]

Based

[sly ibex]

I wish playersexual wasn't a thing in games, honestly. It always pulls me out of the game by reducing how much the characters feel like characters and making them feel more like caricatures.

[restive river]

I think it helps that the Hex are so well written

[sly ibex]

That does definitely help, yeah.

[restive river]

Lettie really got to me, she’s probably my favorite next to Eleanor in terms of writing

Like I actually kinda was scared she’d actually hurt me if we broke up-

The combined writing and voice talents DE have cultivated are peak

[woven coyote]

Was definetely refreshing to see fixed sexuality in wh40k rogue trader
Tho i doubt they have much choice in universe with the indoctrination and all that

[humble sierra]

Personally I prefer it, I don't want to change my character to romance someone else, and as long as the character has depth it doesn't feel too icky

some companions in Fallout 4 were like that, not fleshed out enough to make me feel like the romance was there

[plush phoenix]

not really related to the main discussion but during a dark time in my life i downloaded a nick valentine romance mod and it got me through it

i had like nick valentine wallpapers on all my devices

[tall echo]

Same, it's one of many reasons why I like fire emblem

[plush phoenix]

okay i am an fe fan too but this is a crazy take

[tall echo]

It's a crazy take to prefer it when characters have actual preferences, making them feel more real. Noted.

[humble sierra]

Valid

[plush phoenix]

this is not what i meant

[slow bramble]

Do you think the Tenno stayed with Margulis in her house? Ballas's reality warp speech seemed to indicate so

At least to me

[tall echo]

What else could you possibly have meant

[plush phoenix]

not relevant to the topic of the server just that fire emblem as a game series has been absolutely horrible in terms of respectfully representing characters' gender preferences (soleil being one of the worst examples) & romantic relationships between the PC and NPCs in general and i absolutely would not praise it for its handling of this

[tall echo]

They're bad at representing the preferences of their characters?

[plush phoenix]

theyre bad at not being homophobic

[tall echo]

I mainly meant that the support convos actually differ depending on each npc's gender

[lament stirrup]

You know, an endless mission set in the original care facilities for the Tenno (before they were put into zip folders on Lua) would be incredibly cool.

[tall echo]

Never really noticed that at all but sure

[drifting mirage]

I need you to either never say that again or exclusively say that

[proper barn]

Ballas is a big ole liar. I think Margulis was just the one that worked to help them. She even got the Infested scientist to help her.

[graceful swan]

Slept in the pods on the moon

[sweet wadi]

Given how many Tenno there were, I doubt they all lived in one physical house even before Lua, yeah.

[woven coyote]

Doubt the orokin even understood the concept of orphanage to build one too

[slow bramble]

What about our Tenno specifically? Since we're the special one in our particular timelines

[graceful swan]

Lived on the moon you see this in the Second Dream

[graceful swan]

They probably didn’t even get the chance to live in an actual house before being placed in pods

[woven coyote]

I still wonder where voruna's operator is

Wonder if they are still even alive

[graceful swan]

Maybe

It’s hard to perma kill an Operator

[old dome]

& jade's... & rhino's.......

did rhino even have a tenno or was he just stopped during his rampage bc there were a bunch of sleeping kids inside a room & he didnt wanna hurt them??

[graceful swan]

Stopped by a Tenno before that they didn’t even know Tenno could control frames

[north jolt]

So that was probably one of the catalysts to the Orokin figuring that out

"Hey you guys notice how these mutated murder cyborgs are more chill when these psychic powered children are around?"

[dire mountain]

Oh I'd love seeing the zoo before it got all infested. I'd love to see the animals they show on map.

[graceful swan]

If I made it i’d make a mission where you have to stop it from becoming infested

[dire mountain]

And if you're failing do you have to fight our animals

Or is that morbid

[graceful swan]

If you fail the animals become infested would be great motivation to succeed

[dire mountain]

True

https://tenor.com/view/brad-pitt-cry-sad-gun-aim-gif-16220733

[raw stone]

Yall just described Zoophobia. Yall remember that?

[graceful swan]

Didn't thats a fear of animals fearining the animals becoming infested is different

[raw stone]

NO wait, the game's called... Zoochosis or something right?

Anyway the animals got freaky. Like infested freaky.

[graceful swan]

Lol

[scenic depot]

whats the weight of a necramech bc i just saw a domestik drone carry mine away

[tall echo]

Domestik drones are secretly void gods

[woven coyote]

Yup zoochosis
Weird parasites turn the animals into monsters

[restive river]

That game had so much potential

[lilac aspen]

I believe it bombed due to the fact I think, like, one of the head developers passed away in the middle of it.

He va'd as the boss I think.

Basically he was the guy who was thinking of the story and the important stuff

And instead of stopping and trying to figure things out when he passed away, which would be reasonable and understandable, they kept pushing on.

[autumn sleet]

okay this is partly a meme but there might be some lore, what if a sister of parvos transitioned

[lean garden]

Like before or after becoming a sister

[autumn sleet]

after becoming a sister

[stiff fable]

Parvos would probably have him shot

Parvos is a monster

[autumn sleet]

i love the idea of parvos being evil, but his one boundary is trans rights

[stiff fable]

Considering he sold his own family into slavery and razed his childhood home because it didn't fit his brand?

He'd absolutely dome any new "brother".

[lean garden]

If being a woman is a necessary criteria for being a sister of parvos, parvos might have him shot, not because he transitioned, but because he has to quit

[stiff fable]

I don't think Parvos would be anti-trans, because he can put you in debt slavery for the process. It's purely a branding issue for him.

[lean garden]

I dont think he's against trans, he's just against you quitting

[restive river]

He’s actually just against men

[lime wing]

Guys. Just wanna confirm if I'm getting some info right
So the Zariman was a voidship sent to colonise Tau
Tmitw messed around and stranded it in the void. Turning the adults crazy. Our tenno made a deal with wally to get us out. Leaving behind a void being that mimicked the old us. We then were about to be executed by the 7 but it was found out we could soothe the warframes and Control them through transference.
Right?

[lean garden]

. Leaving behind a void being that mimicked the old us.
Que?

[lime wing]

The drifter is still a void being iirc

[lean garden]

so are you

[tall echo]

Drifter is as real as operator

Split timeline

[lean garden]

but no, its not a "void being that mimicked the old us" its a genuine alt timeline you, made when your timeline split at the deal

[lime wing]

Thank you. The rest was correct?

[tall echo]

Weren't about to be executed

[lime wing]

But wasn't there some talk about the orokin not knowing what to do with the tenno?

[tall echo]

The tenno were in cold storage until a scientist decided to lure a pre-rhino near them to test a theory

...actually that was not a very good plan by that scientist was it

[lean garden]

iiiin essence
the "Tmitw messed around and stranded it in the void." is highly debatable, since we dont exactly know why the zariman failed its jump. It could very well be that the single giant jump went poopoo, or it could be wally's doing

the "about to be executed part" is before margulis took us instead, and then from there they kept us on lua, until it was discovered we could control warframes

[lime wing]

Okay, thank you.
I've got a friend who's not long from the war within and I wanna get the facts right :>

[tall echo]

Based on rhino codex the transference thing seems to have happened before margulis took the tenno

[lean garden]

cant be the case, transference as tech to control warframes was what ballas proposed

meaning margulis would have already taken in the tenno

since its her transference project which she developed specifically for the tenno

[tall echo]

I remember the tenno storage in the codex being described as very corpse storage-like

[lime wing]

So
Void jump failed, adults went insane. The real us are maybe dead? And wally created void versions of us. Splitting the timeline, leaving a version who was left in a book as a metaphor for escapism of the nothingness of the void
The tenno were put in cold storage but an orokin scientist tested an ancient rhino warframe and found out we could control them. Margulis became a motherlike figure for the tenno. But ended up being executed and the Lotus swooped in and mimicked her and took over as Margulis.

[tall echo]

No void versions

[lime wing]

"Devils of the void" What are the tenno actually

[tall echo]

Humans with void powers

Drifter wasn't left in the book, they accidentally created duviri based on an orokin storybook written by euleria entrati based on bedtime stories her father albrecht used to tell her

[lean garden]

real us very alive

[lime wing]

Gotcha. We're void twisted but still the same us

Also, the wiki states it was margulis who was the researcher who found out the tenno could be put into the first dream and Control the warframes with the help of somatic links

[tall echo]

Don't use wiki for lore

[lean garden]

how the hell did the wiki get all the way there

and what the hell is a first dream lmao

[tall echo]

Margulis did the majority of the transference research, but another scientist discovered it

[lean garden]

Im not sure if the timeline is accurate here

because davis making the tenno-frame link should transit to ballas proposing the tennoframe iteration of the warframe project, which specifically mentions transference

[lime wing]

Margulis lead a breakthrough but her research was taken from her. Myb

[tall echo]

Rhino codex describes the discovery of transference, does it not?

[lean garden]

this would imply that davis is riding on margulis's work

[lean garden]

no, it describes the discovery of transference as a means to control warframes

[lime wing]

So surrogate bodies, but those bodies were eventually replaced with warframes maybe

[lean garden]

the surrogate bodies were replaced with warframes when the transference project get subsumed into the warframe project

no longer therapy for the kids, but rather to weaponise them

[lime wing]

Because the orokin were desperate due to the sentient war

[tall echo]

"Then silence. Davis is panting, laughing? The beast fills the doorway, inches from him, dripping in blood, but still, without violence. It stands there, looking at its hands. Davis whispers, "No one would have believed me."

I crawl up the wall to stand, opposite the door. I've never seen this cell, a cold place with an array of shelves. A morgue? "Where are we, Davis?"

"This is where they keep them. The ones from Zariman.""

Doesn't sound like the fancy transference pods on lua

[lime wing]

Could it have been an older holding place for the tenno. Before they were put on Lua?

[lean garden]

I would take it as the place they were shoved into after margulis was canned

[lean garden]

mind you this is also running off the issue where there shouldnt have been any gap between when margulis took the tenno off the zariman, and when she started working on her project

like, a good chunk of her interactions with them was when they were awake

which resulted in one of them blinding her

and then only later she figured transference out

so I doubt she shoved them into morgues until she could think of how to treat them

[tall echo]

Actually, good point. I was probably blinded by it being partially about an incomplete frame

[misty rampart]

https://youtu.be/IekNOXhmuN8?si=C8U6BmxyqxoEZ72T after watching this video by Max Derrat (great channel btw) I've come to the discovery about the nature of kuva, conceptual embodiment and why the worm queen has sent a task force to the zariman.
In short; kuva, or at least crimson kuva is the blood of the indifference made manifest in the world of dust. With conceptual embodiments like that of the holdfasts and void angels being composed of the raw, unformed state of kuva.

[proper barn]

Did you link the right video?

Also there is a better bionicle lore video.

It's like 14 hours but it's better.

[graceful swan]

Where is it stated Crimson Kuva is the blood of the Indifference?

[proper barn]

Also Kuva existed before him and void travel.

[proper barn]

Also i will make our bionicle lore videos fight. https://youtu.be/j4YgQPX8SK8?si=RfscZnXTwNuZ6szk

[misty rampart]

that seems like a chicken or egg thing, given that in order for kuva to work, it would need the void itself to function. And if that's the case, then how would the orokin be where they are now, immortality included without the void for kuva to exist?

[proper barn]

We don't need wally

[misty rampart]

as one of the zariman tablets states that kuva is "Fluid with Void-derived capacity to conduct consciousness."

[proper barn]

For kuva to exist. Or even need to be able to travel to it. Cuz kuva/void just seems to leak into the world.

The queen uses Kuva Siphons to pull it out of the air.

And maybe even the operator/drifter.

[graceful swan]

Wally isn’t the Void

[digital grail]

https://tenor.com/view/willem-dafoe-looking-up-willem-dafoe-willem-dafoe-blue-willem-dafoe-meme-meme-gif-10294496856248602941

Why is it 14 hours

[proper barn]

Cuz its a lot

[misty rampart]

but it is made from the void.

[proper barn]

It's like 8 years(?) Of stuff

Why wouldn't it 14 hours?

10 years. 9 in a row.

[tall echo]

Wally isn't the void

[misty rampart]

I liked this video in particular because of how it compares protodermis to mercury, which is said to be used in alchemy to create the philosophers stone, which is said to give the user immortality.

[strange plinth]

yes, but wally does not have complete control over the void. he's got his section (that we see invading albrecht's labs) and there's the general void. duviri is somewhere in there as well, same with the granum void

[misty rampart]

you don't know the difference between is and made from. While Wally may not be the void itself, it was made from it.

[tall echo]

Kuva has void-derived properties, not wally-derived properties

The void existed before wally

[tall echo]

And that is still completely irrelevant to the origin of kuva

[graceful swan]

Where are you getting the idea Wallys blood made Kuva?

[misty rampart]

yes, but wally was the first thing made from the void.

[tall echo]

And?

Void and kuva still existed before wally

[graceful swan]

And there’s nothing pointing to Kuva actually being blood

We don’t even know if Wally can bleed

[tall echo]

It tastes like blood but that's not exclusive to blood

[graceful swan]

Should ask Albrecht if Wally bled when he lost his finger

[misty rampart]

if nothing else, the gods of sol and lua from 1999 are a reference to alchemy with sol and luna being the mother and father of the philosophers stone. So perhaps whoever Sol and Lua are in warframe were responsible in the creation/invention of kuva.

[strange plinth]

wally is the closest thing to a deity we have, n he's still off by a long shot
sol and lua have not had any proper power

[raw stone]

The giant jump actually did overload the drive. Yonta has a gab line about putting all the thrusters in sequence across the solar rails to then jettison the zariman across the stars to Tau.

Whatever they did the first time, I assume they were quite rushed cause everyone revolted aboard the first time and put a strain on everything... and then they were pressured by the council and tuvul.

Iirc... they were around Saturn beforr the jump failed. That's what I saw from the window in The New War quest intermissions with Operator

[lean garden]

thrusters lol

her line was disabling safeties in sequence

but yea that part is the "ship went boom" bit

but conversely, you can tin foil that wally made sure it went boom

[raw stone]

Oh

Nah. I don't think wally saw it till they got actively stranded in the void post-immediate crash.

However... we only see the time of the crash jump, and maybe after it. We don't know how long it's been between those. But not enough for plants to grow. I guess.

[lean garden]

he was in the reliquary drive before anything went down it seems tho

[raw stone]

Hmn. Bau, you wanna hear what I think? I think those could've genuinely been a mix of Radiation poisoning from the drive chamber... plus Wally.

Or hear me out cause I was beating around the bush; I don't think a finger severed from Wally has much power to what Wally can do. Also Void radiation

[steel creek]

WHO the hell is sam paige in warframe?

does anyone know who that is?

[lean garden]

a poor rando who got caught up with the techrot

[sweet wadi]

Are void angels unique to the zariman? They sort of appear during Deep Archimedea, but I don’t know how ‘canon’ that is.

To phrase it better, are angels a unique manifestation due to the ten-zero incident, or is angelification just the end result of exposure to an unsheilded reliquary drive in general.

[spice spade]

No idea

[lean garden]

I wouldnt take them as purely unique to the zariman, but I dont think theyre caused by exposure to the drive

more like severe exposure to the void

which goinkidink, is what half the entrati labs face

[sweet wadi]

It would be nice if the void corrupted ‘material’ overlay got updated to look more… angely.

[woven coyote]

But dont we have lines directly linking angels to using the reliquary as a "food" source by the holdfasts?

[lean garden]

Food yes, but not necessarily like the thing that creates angels yknow

[woven coyote]

One thing weird about this is that zariman doesnt use solar rails
Its like a colony sized railjack

[woven coyote]

Hmmm
The two things we have seen linked to becoming angels is the reliquary and the angels song, so to me i think it sounds about right

[silk sorrel]

Can someone summarize some points for me?

Are there canonically more than 1 of each Warframe?
If so, how and why?

Are the hex the origins of those specific Warframes? Like is volt actually Amir but a finished Warframe? As in if I break volts mask (similar to umbra) would I see Amir’s face?

Are Warframe skins canon? And if so, how?

Please @ me or respond directly, it may be a while before I can come back to this

[white goblet]

Wally is strange, he seems to be like of the void but Not tied to to the void all that much, all things considered. It feels strange that he offered unique deals to both operator and drifter (operator's choice being 'shake my hand to save all of you' and drifter's being 'shake my hand to save all of them... but not you')

[graceful swan]

Eternalism

[lean garden]

1. yes
   1.5) we can 3d print more frames

2. No

3. Depends on skin, but mostly default to no

[lean garden]

Well the wording of the deal is the exact same, it has to be since there was no split before hand

[quiet wadi]

I thought all the angels were conceptual embodiment, literally the barely remembered embodiment of who they used to be, like the holdfasts are still around because their memories and failures/regrets are the strongest?

[white goblet]

OKKK from the top.

Yes; while the first iterations of a warframe may have specific quirks, once hte design is standardized, there can be many many versions of a warframe.

While early frames such as Umbra are made using a live human being subjected to the helminth, current warframes seem to be made from a braindead body, no life, just genetically created for tenno means (this is what i speculate are in defense objectives) Once a body is warframe-fied, it is outfitted with nueroptics, chassis, and systems to create one new warframe.

The hex are a special case. While they existed before warframes, they exist as a consequence to Warframes; a case only made possible because albrecht went back in time. To be clear, Albrecht did not create warframes, but he KNEW of volt and excal and trinity and sayrn. He took the helminth strain back in time WITH him to create the protoframes. Why? he sucks. nouf said.

What do you mean canon? they're just cosmetics?

[white goblet]

then why were the effects different

[lean garden]

Because the wording was vague enough

The specific wording is really "I can save them, all of them" wally really never said "you"

[white goblet]

i see. so my next thing is that the void seems to be the 'barrier' between different realities. the reason why wally is so strange is even though he is a being OF the void, he is still bound by enternalism

[lean garden]

Hey man, just cuz you come from there aint mean you arent above some laws

[graceful swan]

He’s bound by Strands of Khra not Eternalism

Wally already has affected stuff to do with Eternalism

[feral cape]

I mean being able to affect something doesn't mean you arnt bound by it

Planets cause the warped slope of spacetime and planets are very much bound by both

[raw stone]

Ah. But they did still use the solar rails to parade. But during that aforementioned "parade" which I may say took weeks to month, everyone still y'know.... revolted.

But that is also important. Yeah. I forgot they didn't need to use the solar rails. Do they... mention the accident's true causation during the holdfast rank convos or nqh?

[lean garden]

hang on you might need to source yourself on the parade bit

specifically using the rails to do it

[raw stone]

Yeah so basically... hold on

The tuvul uh... records? Don't mention it. It only mentions the revolts pre-jump.

I am away from my console currently but I remember Yonta mentioning it. Separately from the Jump Safeties.

Lemme check wiki lines

[white goblet]

the way i understand it is that solar rails are built, meaning they couldnt make it to tau properly using JUST solar rails. We also know that there was some subterfuge with the entire ship. I remember ember's description talking about how civilians on the zariman wasn't known to the whole empire.....

So maybe pre jump the colonists found out they were being gineua pigs? and revolted? then when the jump actually came it all went badly?

[lean garden]

the solar rails werent built at the time of the zariman

it was supposed to be built after the zariman jumped

[white goblet]

ope, my bad

[lean garden]

ngl its probably why the zariman was intended to do all the smaller jumps before they canceled that and decided to do one big one

[white goblet]

i see i see

well i think my theory still stands for the prejump revolts

[lean garden]

They revolted because they wanted out and off, but that didnt do squat

even hombask sabotaging the biomes didnt work

[white goblet]

yeah cause they figuired out that they were essentially guinea pigs on a warship

[lean garden]

warship? definitely not

[lean garden]

1. every other mention of the zariman labels it as a colony ship
2. this entry specifically already intends to make you question the designation as a warship

"why would you put children on a military ship?"
"we didn't (because this isnt a warship). That would violate procedure"

[white goblet]

ahhh i see. this entry has kaleen assuming they WOULDNT use a colony ship to attempt a large jump, so she ASSUMES its a military ship, when in reality it was a colony ship attempting a military level maneuver?

[raw stone]

The prime entries are a bit... watery with canonicity

The children on the zariman were a mistake maybe

That much at least was true.

[slow phoenix]

all current warframes are copies (probably of copies), made by the helminth
the hex are from an ALTERNATE past, so in THAT universe, yes they are the original, but overall, they are not
warframe skins are probably not canon, but it depends on the skin most of the time

[slow phoenix]

i think this is more the orokin denying the kids being on the zariman in the first place, bc at first the orokin wanted to erase the tenno

[lean garden]

1999 is our past

not alternate

still dont make the hex any original dohickey

[white goblet]

nah, cause why would they lie to someone who already saw and TOUCHED the tenno? if they were so hellbent on erasing them, then why not just kill her before anything else? It feels like the people in this text were both unaware of the colony ship's mistake

[lean garden]

(its also hella early in Warframe's irl history, so the lore is already iffy at best)

[white goblet]

true! but i like to try to make everything fit, and only disregard information if it's straight up contradictory with smth else

[graceful swan]

Unreliable narrator type thing

[stiff fable]

it's not an alternate past but an alterED past

the thing is that unless the changes lead to the Orokin never happening, the changes are all negligable because the Orokin erase the history of humanity

[woven coyote]

Huge coverup, the orokin cant afford to fail after all
If people think they arent all powerfull they would revolt, bcs the orokin give them more than enough resons to with every breath

[sleek karma]

How many years does the entire WF story take place? We know that's the zarimon was sent into the void and came out in the middle of or right before the old war and the operator is about 14-16 and the old war wrapped up a few years after the operator gets there then they are put in stasis and under the 2nd dream and we know some amount of time passes and it's made to seem like it's a lot of time (hundreds or thousands of years) but is it? We know the void does stop aging as the drifter is an adult but only looks about 10 to a max of 15 years older than the operator and we know ballas, the twin queens, or alad v haven't gone through continuity so they should still be in the bodies they were in at the end of the Old war which work immortal meaning that the old war has to have been within a relative lifespan, to push this even further we see that teshin also is still alive and he is a human too, but we know he ages as in duvir he is an old man all that to say if the fall of the orikin empire and the old war where all that time ago why are so many ppl who should be ordinary humans still alive

Also I think the operator is specifically a minor hence why he isn't an option in 1999 as it would be weird for him to be able to form with fully grown adults

[humble sierra]

The passage of time isn't clear, and probably won't ever be expanded on. It could happen in a span of weeks or a year, or even a decade.

Teshin's aging doesn't tie into anything because the Void, and by extension Duviri, exists outside of linear time. The Lotus' hand was severed mere moments after Teshin "fell" into Duviri— but Teshin has aged by potentially decades, and has been in Duviri long enough to have a reputation. His aging could just have been manifested by the Drifter— Duviri's a storybook, and a key trope of stories like it is the "wise old mentor".

The biggest passage of time we see in the Origin system is the New War— and it's a misdirect. You're meant to see the Drifter and assume that Ballas has been in power long enough for the Operator (somehow surviving their wound) has aged into the Drifter.

But the Operator is still around 12-16 and hasn't shown any signs of aging (and it's not even clear if they're physically capable of aging, or if they're just some strange Void creature now)

[restive river]

The Operator hasn’t aged cause they were in cryosleep ever since they were put into the second dream

The Tenno arrived sometime during the old war, it had already begun and would go on for many more years
An undisclosed amount but possibly hundreds if memory serves correct

Also after the Tenno overthrew the Orokin they took another big nap for ~1k years

Mentally the tenno are older than their bodies

[mint laurel]

So the "canon" name of the tenno is Mara (name the devs ise for the tenno)

It would be Peak if Mara means Demon or Child in Void tongue

So the "Voull ne xata vok, Mara Lohk" of wally could mean something

Voull ne xata vok, Child of the Void

Voull ne xata vok, Demon of the Void

[humble sierra]

Child makes more sense because Wally isn't the only person to call you Mara Lohk

The Cavia refer you to that way occasionally, before you translate them, and when defeating the boss

And the Lotus(?) sings it too in the Lotus Eaters track

[mint laurel]

Yeah

Could be ironic, since op hates begin called a child

[somber lantern]

Is there any story reason you can get Garuda from Fortuna bounties? Or is she just there for the fun of it

[humble sierra]

Hates being treated like a child, at least.

[humble sierra]

So, Garuda's lore really explains everything

Firstly,

That's it, that's all the Garuda lore

[somber lantern]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1159566087059419156/1284152324339531901/XAKU_APPEARS..gif

[mint laurel]

And Mara Lohk could be a word game for Eternal Child since the Void is infinity and eternal

[restive river]

I will forever dispute it being demon
Being called a demon or devil was something Ballas, his followers and Helminth did
Nobody else

[restive river]

Or just void child or child of the void
Which
The Lotus calls us during Angels

[mint laurel]

How tf u have 2 pfp

[restive river]

Nitro

It bugs out sometimes

[mint laurel]

Bro pays for nitro 😭🙏🏻

[restive river]

Ok :p

[mint laurel]

To be fair, Discord got greedy and without nitro u can't send things above 10mb

I hate it

[restive river]

Yeahh
I’ve been paying since like 2018 and I like the featured and it doesn’t hurt my wallet so I’m chillin

I like having specific pfps for different servers

[sleek karma]

If the time between the awakening quest and the old was is 1k year haw are ballis, teshin, the twin queens, or alad v still alive/ not old and dirt?

[restive river]

People live long in the Warframe universe, especially the Orokin
Darvo is over 100 and considered young iirc

Ig you missed that the queens use continuity to survive too, jumping from grineer body to grineer body

The Orokin as a whole could live for a long time, both due to edited genetics and through continuity

Heck Teshin starts to show his age once he’s in Duviri

[old dome]

which really begs the question of why...

why duviri of all places? why then??

[restive river]

We don’t know how long he was there exactly, plus he got injured so I’m sure that did a number on him

It sounds like he’s there longer than one might think iirc

[lean garden]

why is alad v on that list lmao

[restive river]

Yeah idk

Alad wasn’t around for the Orokin Era let alone the Old War

[dire mountain]

Umbra was made well into the Old War actually. Nothing about him is early

[white goblet]

frames made in the orokin time, instead of after

[dire mountain]

So like, all of them?

There haven't been many, if any warframes developed after the Collapse

[restive river]

Umbra was made like
At the tail end of the old war, iirc he’s one of the most recent
The most recent being revenant due to his circumstances iirc

[junior nacelle]

Xata is Truth, so maybe something like "Do you know the Truth, Child of the Void"

[junior nacelle]

On the third: some skins are implied to be canon as seen in the Leverian entries

For example with Atlas there is a specific type of helmet skin for Atlas shown that is different than the default. There is also specific syandanas associated with certain warframes, for example Atlas and Gauss

[left oyster]

Quick little yap sesh, but do yall ever feel bad for corpus soldiers? Like imagine ur a regular dude, a family man at that and u and ur family are struggling, u live on Venus and ur barely making ur home coolant payments on time so ur house is freezing and yr kids are starving, theres no jobs and u see corpus advertisement, u think to urself, ur not a killer but ur family is struggling and u have no other choice and the job is to drop off some wares on neighboring planets next thing u know ur peacefully traveling in space and then BOOM out of nowhere alarms are blaring, people are screaming, its just pure chaos and all u can do is hide and watch a singular war machine clear out an entire Obelisk in a matter of minutes for seemingly no reason and just leaves, leaving u drifting alone in space never to see ur family again. Crazy

[feral cape]

There purpose bred they don't have families

[left oyster]

Never once have i heard this

Last time i checked they were just mercenaries

Or regular ppl

[dire mountain]

Predominantly a merchant guild, Corpus labour and security forces are composed of mostly purpose-bred humanoid crewmen and animal-like robots, both equally indoctrinated into a ritualised and propagandist devotion to labour and work.

(Venus Cephalon Fragments)

[feral cape]

Everyone we fight is evil and you should feel no qualms killing them

Even the sorta in the right sentients

Because they wanted to kill the orokin they just thought that everyone was the orokin

[glacial bough]

You can feel bad about the circumstances, but those people still made their choice when there are multiple outs to the Corpus system

[feral cape]

I mean sure there are outs but like it's pretty much the same as grineer

And given that there purpose bred beyond a desire for personal survival over potential money they dont have a reason to want to leave

Like revo-9

[tall echo]

Why is it so common that people just disappear from this channel after being shown evidence

[feral cape]

Idk

Its a common thing for warframe players in my experience to disappear when asked for evidence

And when they don't disappear it's either some circular reasoning or the evidence is just more of them saying stuff

[dire mountain]

Those who know

[feral cape]

Its alot of people saying x defys physics and when told to say how they can't

Its really funny to me how some of the first examples I get told are limbo or rhinos stomp despite both of those operating under physics

Limbo is fictional physics but rhino is real world physics

[lean garden]

"You tell me how a body is supposed to suddenly shoot fire"
Like this is a sci-fi game? The word fiction is there?

[dire mountain]

Nuh uh its more science fantasy 🤓

[restive river]

And if you want an expiation
Powered by the Void

[feral cape]

Also i mean it's not too far fetched the idea is feasible some form of bio electricity type ordeal could be the basis

[restive river]

Like the infestation does a lot as is too

[feral cape]

Also i get people bringing up void hole as a thing and black holes in general in fiction never behave like they should

[dire mountain]

You just kinda have to accept that all the insane and wacky stuff is just part of the fantasy setting. It's like complaining magic isn't realistic 😭

[feral cape]

Because that's really really boring

Like if black holes ever behave realistically they simply can not exist in any tangible form

You can't really weaponize it because of hawking radiation and graviting goes both ways

[restive river]

How does the void hole do cold damage

Space magic

[dire mountain]

Void magic

[feral cape]

And according to my good friend drew it should flash fry the sol system nearly instantly upon use with the power of multiple millions of galaxy's worth of stars

[restive river]

Potato tomato

[feral cape]

This is why black holes can't be realistic ever

[restive river]

Whatever the void hole is
It’s not a black hole, just visually resembles one
Minus like
Bending light :p

[feral cape]

I also get the very rare occasion of someone sending something that could almost be evidence

[dire mountain]

Yeah it's not a black hole really

It is in the name

Void hole

[feral cape]

Like i see a ridiculous amount of people claiming the jade light erases you from existence in the ontological sense

[restive river]

What

Yonta

[feral cape]

Because porvos said this "Warframes were what this villain hunted. It is said a number of 'frames had been erased from history by this monster, models who no longer exist on any record. Those who are not remembered. I"

[restive river]

Literally
Yonta

[feral cape]

Which is simply not what he ment

[dire mountain]

Like okay sure if it was still 2017

[feral cape]

Erased from existence in this context just means ballas deleted the file and pouted real hard

[dire mountain]

But we've learned more about the jade light since then

[lean garden]

urm achktually its sci*-fi* fantasy the word fiction is still there ☝️ 🤓

[restive river]

Cause the Orokin never erased things from history, no it was the magic green beam that did that

[dire mountain]

Isnt all fantasy fiction

[feral cape]

The little space on the internet for battle boarding makes head for very funny statement

I've had people just deny the existence of aleph numbers and "larger" infinities

Because they think there's just the one infinity

[lean garden]

technically its more because theres sci-fi and then theres fantasy, both are fiction, but their own genres, sci-fi fantasy is when you combine the two, so you have starships and lasers but they run on fantasy elements for example

[dire mountain]

Wikipedia calls the genre science fantasy

[feral cape]

There's also the "no guys this is all physics and magic isn't real" genre of sci fi where its definitely magic

[dire mountain]

Arguably halo to an extent

Especially with the forerunners and precursors and slipspace

[lean garden]

daheck

thats news to me

[dire mountain]

also tbh sci-fi fantasy doesn't have the same ring to it as science fantasy

[lean garden]

eh, not really, thats all science stuff, science fantasy is more like, star wars stuff

barring that its really space opera

then again its not really mutually exclusive

[dire mountain]

The halo comment was about the "no guys this is totally all physics"

[lean garden]

youve got tech to make ships and droids and planet destroying not-moons

and then you got a farm boy lifting caca with his mind

[dire mountain]

And its mostly restrained to the things ive mentioned

[lean garden]

me when I cant read

[feral cape]

Halo is probably a media i have the biggest grudge against purely because i think the logic plague is very stupid and dumb and the worst thing ever

The flood makes an argument the ai can not disprove

And who cares just tell them I don't care what then smart guy

[dire mountain]

"You know, you make a very good point. Unfortunately: L + ratio."

[feral cape]

Yea

Or the ultimate technique repeat what they said in a nerd voice with your finger pointed up 👆

[dire mountain]

They could also just pull an ordis

"Ordis is not listening. La la la."

[lean garden]

what was the argument again?

[feral cape]

Something Something the flood is actually good for humanity or something

[dire mountain]

Honestly couldn't tell you

[lean garden]

did none of the AIs have a "Yea nah" installed?

[feral cape]

",On the most basic level, it takes the form of facts or arguments delivered with carefully engineered deliberation to directly or indirectly persuade the targeted intelligence to act in a certain way. This often takes advantage of the entity's existing ideas and values to achieve the desired result."

The most basic counter to this is to make an ai that doesn't do anything other than what I originally designed it to do

Or just make my ai la la la I don't care you guys stink

[dire mountain]

Apparently the general ideas they present are "Hey don't you all want eternal life and companionship and knowledgeable"

The AIs are like "ah that sounds dope sign me up" apparently

[lean garden]

Rasputin from Destiny would dogwalk the logic plague

[feral cape]

The AI the ARTIFICIAL intelligence wants eternal life

The guys who don't die

[dire mountain]

Actually

[lean garden]

Dude on multiple occasions just up and went "yeap I'd die cya"

[dire mountain]

Smart AIs such as Cortana have a 7 year lifespan

[lean garden]

they uh, kinda do

or at least the human ones

[dire mountain]

Because then they start to think themselves to death

[lean garden]

I think the forerunner ones lasted longer

[feral cape]

Isn't that only for the unsc? Didn't the forrunners not have that issue

[lean garden]

Technically sometimes the forerunner cheat and do what is essentially a cephalon trick

like 343 guilty spark used to be a human

[dire mountain]

The prometheans as a whole really tbh

At least the knights

[lean garden]

oh yea the halo 4 buggers

anyways, AI like Rasputin would take a dump on the logic plague

[dire mountain]

Digitized them said "yeah here go control a war machine against the Flood" (it didn't really work)

[lean garden]

cant ask for a more logically illogical AI than Red himself

[feral cape]

Crazy part is i first head the logic plague because some guy said the flood could use it against Rasputin

[lean garden]

"To protect humanity, I must allow myself to let humanity die"

what a chad for gambling like that

[feral cape]

God he's a genius

[dire mountain]

When was that

I haven't really played since arrivals

[lean garden]

Rasputin is filled with humanities literature, "eternal life" aint gon be enough lmao

[lean garden]

during the collapse

Rasputin determined that the only way to ensure humanity's survival was to alter his morality protocols to allow for human death... by his hands

[feral cape]

Protocol midnight something to alter all existing moral protocols to something else for the betterment of human

[lean garden]

he wasnt entire wrong, but man he was outmatched, not his fault tho

[lean garden]

mind you this isnt a "I'll kill humanity myself" thing, this was a "I'd shoot a shuttle down if it served the greater good of humanity"

or
"I'd get a colony ship designed with the express purpose of getting out of here to turn around and start shooting at something they cant hope to beat"

[feral cape]

Hmm warframe lore yes

Good thing the mods don't check here often

[lean garden]

ordis would dog walk the logic plague

[feral cape]

Unless minion is secretly lurking

[lean garden]

homie threw himself into a beam on instinct, eternal life shermal life

[feral cape]

Any ai i can think of outside of halo would beat the logic plague because the logic plague is an inherently stupid concept and only works because the plot demands it

Ultron the thunderhead(scythe) daleks probably the weird ai stuff in cyberpunk

[lean garden]

the daleks arent AI

[feral cape]

Honestly the cyberpunk thing is because it's essentially a brick compared to everything else

[feral cape]

My bad i don't watch British one piece

[lean garden]

and like even if the daleks were, they'd spit on the logic plague for not being a dalek

theyre that racist

[feral cape]

Nice argument idiot watch this slurs

2 am

Good night lore discussion

[tall echo]

Daleks are disgusting blobs in trash can tanks

[digital grail]

How is Dr who British one peice?

[graceful swan]

https://tenor.com/view/television-tv-tv-shows-exterminate-doctor-who-gif-18824276

[tall echo]

It's british
It doesn't end

[lean garden]

show is a bout a person with special powers who travels all over the place and for some reason everyone cant stop rooting for them. Also the show never ends

[tall echo]

The doctor's only special power is really just that he's extremely hard to kill permanently

[glacial bough]

Yes and no. He's definitely got Time/Destiny going for him to a degree. Explicitly iirc

[lean garden]

that from the 13th doctor aint it?

[tall echo]

Well a time travelling time lord having time on their side isn't unexpected but not a direct power

[glacial bough]

No, it's something from extra materials

Either novels or audio about the Time War

[tall echo]

Man is typing

What an incredible sentence

Man has typed

That's just unnecessary

[left oyster]

Unnecessary, but not wrong

[tall echo]

Yeah but still

[proper barn]

why did you reply so far back? lmao.

[left oyster]

Cuz it was under my initial comment

[proper barn]

sure.

[left oyster]

?

[proper barn]

Oh i was just saying okay.

I didn't mean anything else. anyway don't me mean.

[sly ibex]

Does that make Heartland Canadian One Piece?

[dire mountain]

Whats American one piece

[graceful swan]

It did end then it Began again

[sly ibex]

Do not be rude to other users in the server.

[dire mountain]

No way dominus thrax

[sly ibex]

CSI, or something?

[left oyster]

Im not being rude i was stating the fact that im not on discord 24/7

[graceful swan]

The Doctor is both Thrax and Drifter

[dire mountain]

Greys anatomy

[sly ibex]

And outright stating that others here are in a very demeaning way.

[dire mountain]

Thats probably longer than one piece

[left oyster]

Ig

Mb

[dire mountain]

Timey wimey eternalism or whatever he says

[sly ibex]

Just try to be mindful of the rules, and you'll be just fine. 😄

[strange turtle]

But did it end as it began?

[graceful swan]

Find out in 2000 years

[stray herald]

why did albrecht think wally wouldnt be in 1999?

or is my question is fundamentally wrong

[graceful swan]

He didn’t he said Wally couldn’t easily follow not couldn’t make it to 1999

[stray herald]

then why was loid so pissed

and why go to 1999 to begin with

[graceful swan]

Because Wally couldn’t easily follow

[stray herald]

ok that answers both

[proper barn]

I mean his love left and he can't him again.

[charred patio]

game night has never been the same since they realized that umbra is a beast at monopoly

[strange plinth]

yeah i'll accept that into canon

[graceful swan]

Hasn’t been the same since they realised he’s a beast at Komi more like

[charred patio]

last time they had stalker over, those two blew up half of the orbiter over komi

[restive river]

Still wish we had pvp komi…

[digital grail]

Fr

Credit betting on komi

[timid chasm]

If drifter went from zariman then being trapped in duviri after it was created, would kullervo be technically the first Warframe he encounters.

[restive river]

If they encountered them at all while in Duviri, yes

[tall echo]

Probably not since the hold is a disconnected island that appeared a while after the main thing

[restive river]

Kullervo was confined to his hold