lore-discussion

[brittle siren]

hibernated

[swift steppe]

this doesnt change anything its still a kid thats very weird

[north ferry]

I should write my fanfiction

[brittle siren]

yeah

but my biggest hear me out is Styanax Deluxe skin

[swift steppe]

anyways, im rlly hyped up for the new update

im really thrilled about what new lore were getting

[brittle siren]

and Nezha deluxe

[swift steppe]

lool

[brittle siren]

it not really moving that much beside a new proto and lil more Coda lore

[swift steppe]

theres still going to be a little bit of lore tho

[brittle siren]

I think prob near the end of this year the Void War come into conclusion, or much later

[swift steppe]

yeah

[north ferry]

Depends, they could probably keep it going for a while and then being slowed by the update cycles

[brittle siren]

yeah

[swift steppe]

thats also true

[lament stirrup]

The devs confirmed the void war is going to be four real world years long. So-

[swift steppe]

WHAT.

[brittle siren]

oh damn

[swift steppe]

OH MY GOD they got so much ideas then

holy im SO hyped up rn

[brittle siren]

Tau enjoyer is crying rn

[swift steppe]

i cant wait i want it all right now

[brittle siren]

(including me)

[north ferry]

I have learnt never to wait for story updates, they're so far apart.

[lament stirrup]

I'm pretty sure Tau is going to be part of the void war.

It would he incredibly strange for Albrecht to bring it up just for it to be irrelevant.

[brittle siren]

oh yeah nvm, Sentient lich when DE

[swift steppe]

tomorrow

[lament stirrup]

The lich changes its element every time you fail its requiem sequence

[swift steppe]

uh no bye

[brittle siren]

or add in new one
imagine they have all element all at once

[north ferry]

Both Tau and 1999 could be an entire story arc on their so hopefully they take time to expand both of them as part of the void war arc. Because it will intensely be disappointing if its just tacked on.

[swift steppe]

bruh

[north ferry]

I mean, changing up damage dealt or damage resistances makes sense.

It also have little cost if the randomise the damage so it could be a fun change.

[lament stirrup]

It becomes flat out immune to mercy kills from a specific warframe after the first failed attempt.

If it gains immunity to all your warframes it deletes your account and sends you hate mail in real life

[swift steppe]

LMAO WHAT imagine if that becomes real

XDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD

[river tangle]

fighting off kuva lich alone is already stressful, even with serious loadout

even sisters of parvos, and then this infested lich…

oh yeah, if dem boy band members are absolutely fine, there's a chance aoi could meet them in person

yay or nay

[sly pagoda]

The four new protoframes will be the members of On-Lyne. JK.

We know they are safe, but not if they are even still in Hollvania. Or maybe we will rescue them when getting Guitar Frame. but odds are they never show up. That said the fact they existed when showing the dance moves in devstream even if just as simple models means odds are DE does expect the originals to show up at some point.

[lean garden]

they did spend all that time modelling On-Lyne after all

[humble sierra]

Lavos seemed to have Primed himself

[lean garden]

Mad lad

Alternatively it could be read in the context of varzia's lines that lavos earned the right to be primed

[humble sierra]

"Others ascended" seems to be more akin to that "earned the right" sentiment

Like they mention he's the master of transmutation and then say he "forged his own"

[lean garden]

Thats what Im thinking

[lean garden]

Which flows back into earning the right bit

[strange plinth]

lavos prime trailer with lavos narrating
or ballas yelling about a fatherless frame again

[brittle siren]

I mean doesn't he kill all but 1 janitor and escape from that prison

[lean garden]

I break outta prison all the time

[brittle siren]

lmao

what I mean is, he basically kinda like Nezha, he has become a myth, and from the wording of his Prime codex entry, seem like none of the Orokin touch on him since the day he gone (and not even new Lavos)

wait so the if Lavos can turn himself into prime, that's mean some frame can do it themselves too, like Kullervo or Dante

[prime cove]

I like to imagine Kullervo becoming a Prime after he finally got therapy and realized that none of his "Seven Crimes" are his fault, and if they were, they're not anything he should feel sorry for.

Or maybe he was ALWAYS a Prime, but his depreciative view of himself combined with void manifestation is responsible for his standard appearance. And once all that guilt is gone, he's back to his former glory.

[strange plinth]

ooo i like that second theory

[prime cove]

As for Dante, Drusus did say that Dante was stricken by a corruptive influence, and that's why he left for the Entrati Library. His Prime form could be a "Saruman of Many Colors" situation, where it's an alternate version of him where he fell under the Indifference's thrall and was made his champion. His primed form a mockery of the Empire that stole from his new master.

We have void manifestations and multiverse theory, so why not? If not from another universe, then make it Drusus' worst fears of what became of his friend given life by the void.

[lean garden]

Mind you lavos has the knowledge and power of alchemy, something that neither dante nor kullervo have

[brittle siren]

I know that but what I mean here they both in the void rn

so the "conceptual embodiment" may have a factor for their upcoming prime

[lean garden]

They'd sooner conceptually embody a prime than transform themselves into a prime

[fluid vapor]

has jade shadows grown on yall?

i personally loved it

gave me the same feel as playing the second dream for the first time

but i've also heard a lot of people say if you're somewhat of a father figure you might be a bit bias

(not a father just been helping raise my nephew)

[tall echo]

Don't care much about the quest myself, but I want to know why it's considered a main quest

[fluid vapor]

i feel like it might be a set up

[tall echo]

How is it gonna connect into future quests

[graceful swan]

It’s set during the time Drifter went to 1999 showing what Operator is up to

[tall echo]

Will stalker help us with something important? His son maybe?

[fluid vapor]

my theory is well tau's still a really big threat, stalker "works" for hunhow

[tall echo]

That's not enough to justify main quest status by itself

[graceful swan]

The baby will probably have some relevance later

[fluid vapor]

maybe stalker has a sort of teshin like role in upcoming quest?

[graceful swan]

I don’t think it should be a main quest until we get more info

[fluid vapor]

I think stalkers gonna have to help us within the regard of "As a father i must do what i have to to protect my son"

[visual ermine]

Maybe they’ll set up some time skip shenanigans. We’ve been to the past might as well get involved int he future

[tall echo]

Or as a way to repay the debt

[fluid vapor]

well i mean....."debt"

i think stalker still kinda hates the tenno

but also when he was about to kill us the first time he hesistated like "wait thats a human, and a child?"

[tall echo]

You can be in debt to someone you hate
Pretty common in the current day

[fluid vapor]

so now as a father i think stalkers gonna have a lot different view as to how he feels about the tenno

maybe we get a chance to actually explain and he kinda sees us different that way

because imagine as a parent the pain you would feel in your heart seeing a child that had to kill their own parent to survive

[tall echo]

Probably less that and more "Wait, there's someone controlling these warframes?"

[graceful swan]

That was our whole thing with Alad in an old event lol

[north jolt]

I think when Second Dream first released this scene could of been interpreted as Stalker thinking "Wait, am I one of them!?" but since Jade's Shadow it's been heavily recontextualized to more something like you said

[drifting mirage]

It's frequently suggested that he may have been Tenno but I guess Jade Shadows did gut that

[north jolt]

Granted he was still really close to killing us anyway, until we got our own frame to intervene

[graceful swan]

Him learning what we were reminded him of what he had is probably what they want it to mean now

[north jolt]

Even Hunhow himself has softened up a little bit, so Stalker (story wise) in the future is likely to be way more chill towards us I think. Still edgy and brooding of course

[silk atlas]

Can't get over the people who wondered why Stalker is still so cross with us even after we helped him with Jade lol

[drifting mirage]

Edgy as a pizza cutter
It would be interesting if he treated the kid and the Drifter differently though

[north jolt]

Unrelated note but I want a scythe stance that lets me do that blade spin Stalker did as like a block combo or something

[glacial bough]

I mean he does. he's willing to leave us alone now

[drifting mirage]

I mean the part where the Drifter and him don't have canon history but the Operator and him do

[north ferry]

It feels like the common history is shared

I would have to play new war again but as far as I know Hunhow and Stalker upon meeting the Drifter treat him kinda as if they did have history.

[graceful swan]

They just thought Operator aged finally

[north ferry]

Yeah, pretty much.

[stiff fable]

Funny enough, the only one who doesn't make that assumption is Little Duck, who's working with the Quills.

[graceful swan]

Definitely not the only people who can tell the difference though

[fathom viper]

You know what it be messed up for DE to make on their next story quest; You the player have to decide who gets to permanently stay in the Tenno’s reality. Would you sacrifice the war-bred child who learnt what family and love truly means with the help of his ancient nemesis, and later be adopted by them; Or the Drifter, who only knew death and apathy from centuries of executions by their doing and later leaned to love and care for the Hex due to Entrati’s plan.
Who would you choose? Only one has to remain and the other will dissipate into nothingness and be forgotten.
Decisions Decisions

[graceful swan]

The Holdfasts know there’s 2

[fathom viper]

Aight that’s all from me, bye yall 🥰

[graceful swan]

Still picking Drifter

[graceful swan]

They kind of did that already once with Duviri

[fathom viper]

Not necessarily, remember, they swap places from time to time. Rn the Kid is in the Murmur, if your playing as the Drifter

A place where the laws of reality doesn’t apply

[frosty latch]

is a new quest gonna drop in march?

[graceful swan]

They share the same body 90% of the time

[proper barn]

Echoes is? Wait when does echoes drop?

There might be one.

But we don't know

[graceful swan]

Feb 6th

Star Days

Belly of the beast

Nighwave

Feb 12th Lavos

March Infested update

[fathom viper]

Whats star days?

[proper barn]

Well echoes with temple

[proper barn]

Wrong person. Star Days is valentines for Warframe. Ticker (best girl) sells unique items you can get.

[fathom viper]

Ahh ok

Ty

[restive river]

Best girl
Next to Little Duck and Yonta

[proper barn]

We can have multiple.

[gloomy prism]

Because Reddit is no fun other than the obvious irl money reasons what do you the the hypothetical lore reason behind heirloom skins? They seem to be made to be more aesthetically pleasing. Were they made for especially noteworthy Tenno? Or made as personal guards for high ranking orokin that demanded they be more ornamental?

[raw stone]

Tbh they seem like the peak of Tenno-made designs

The Orokin may show some fashion designs of eras past, but honestly they seem mostly... Central-based with African, Greco-Roman and other euro-classical affects. Of course it isn't strictly that... But on the other hand the Tenno always had eastern influences.

I'm gonna say... it's Tenno-made. However that... works. Maybe they commisioned balls or somn. I still don't know if Skins are technically considered in-universe real or not. Is it a coat of paint? What about the deluxes? Are they mutations?

[devout verge]

Is there any explanation how Ballas survived the Tenno uprising, and how he survived into the present? What he did in the meantime?

Or Erra, for that matter?

Were they just hiding in a cupboard somewhere? Taking a nap, but overslept?

[raw stone]

We, the players, regard them as they are: Cosmetics. But Warframes are... that. They're people turned golems. How do you even customize that with different bodies.

[raw stone]

Erra and the sentients at least must've been hiding in Veil Proxima, somewhere in the Oort Cloud just past Sedna. However Balls is interesting. I'm gonna keep calling him Balls.

[feral cape]

Ballas was likely hiding on lua and erra was presumed dead

[raw stone]

Lmao imagine Ballas like

https://tenor.com/view/sinon-s2-earthquake-makeup-rumba-gif-20992812

When Lotus pulls the moon from the void again.

[devout verge]

I can come up with plenty of "might have been" ideas. I'm mostly curious if there's an official explanation, including an explanation why that was the moment they came back.

Ballas being shaken awake from his nap freed from his panic bunker on Lua and meeting up with Erra and his sentinels who were drawn to Huntow and his awakening, and maybe looking on Lua for cues on how to fight the Tenno, is certainly possible. But it's essentially just a wild guess.

And how Erra survived is also a question. Seems like it was just "never found the body"?

[graceful swan]

Ballas only showed up when the moon reappeared and Erra we never actually see die

[devout verge]

Yeah, but Ballas being holed up for millenia right next to the Tenno seems like something someone would have commented on. But nobody ever did?

Also, Excalibur Umbra was on Lua, too, so maybe still not the safest place to hide.

And Lotus/Natah says she remembers him dying, Erra comments that she apparently still doesn't remember everything, and… that's it? No comment on what the unremembered truth actually was?

[upbeat glacier]

Who's the oldest living person in Warframe

[devout verge]

To many beings in Warframe have no clear defined age to answer that question.
Like, a whole bunch of beings predate the Old War, and everything before the Old War has only fuzzy dates.

[graceful swan]

Albrecht Entrati or Grandmother

[tall echo]

Cosmetics do not exist in lore unless clearly stated otherwise like valkyr gersemi

[upbeat glacier]

I was leaning to hunhow

[restive river]

Nihil?
Or do we not count cephalons

[graceful swan]

I guess Nihil could be the oldest

[sturdy flume]

That depends on if we consider the chronological age of the proto frames like Arthur that we bring to the present, because if we do they would be the oldest, but I don't think it would count because they aren't physically aged up when they go to the future,

[upbeat glacier]

True

[sturdy flume]

Or mentally for that matter

[swift steppe]

id say grandmother

[swift steppe]

who is nihil bruh

[restive river]

The glassmaker
An Orokin

[swift steppe]

oh

[smoky solstice]

WAIT I completely missed it, 4 more protoframes??? Ok so there is some lore stuff there

That's a big one

[swift steppe]

lmao

[smoky solstice]

It's so crazy too, like how tf are they gonna be introduced

[swift steppe]

with the power of friendship obviously

[smoky solstice]

Like "hey what's up, heard you got a cool thing going in this mall"

[swift steppe]

LMAO yeah i guess or they will be connected to the technocyte coda in some ways

[smoky solstice]

One of them is gonna drive me crazy and make me do another apex tank run for the accolade glyph

[swift steppe]

lmaooooooo

[smoky solstice]

They did talk about a new mission, I think it's the one they showed on the PC in the devstream

So maybe through that?

[swift steppe]

it would make sense yes

if not then they just didnt tell us yet and itll be in the next devstream

[smoky solstice]

Yeah they did say they're revealing more in the next one, I just am very surprised

[swift steppe]

im so hyped

[smoky solstice]

Didn't think they'd do more protoframes, like the hex quest already has the squad, gonna be weird to have more people become part of it and they're just not quest related

[swift steppe]

i mean

its not bcz the hex quest already has the squad that others cant just be recruited?

they got civilians in the mall now

why not recruit new people in?

the real question is why arent they recruiting other people to help them

[smoky solstice]

I mean maybe but there's not gonna be a quest for them (most likely) so idk, it's like extra dudes to the hex that aren't part of the big narrative

It's not that it doesn't make sense, I just don't know how it's gonna play out lmao

[swift steppe]

yeah

i wonder if theyll do protoframe for the other frames

like will they do 59 protoframes? thats a lot

well 60 cause temple but they might come out already being a protoframe

[smoky solstice]

Probably not that many, but I'm assuming they're gonna do like Rhino, Frost, Mesa, idk about the forth
Kinda like the classic frames that are not already in the hex

[swift steppe]

well the fourth may be temple but if they come out alr being a protoframe imo it just doesnt count

[smoky solstice]

So after a certain point, not gonna make sense since you get to like more modern frames

[swift steppe]

true

[smoky solstice]

What do you mean by coms out already being a protoframe

Come*

[swift steppe]

well

yk excalibur is already a frame

and then arthur came out (and the others) temple might just come out ALREADY being a protoframe

they(DE) might explain why and how they got framed lol

[smoky solstice]

Like cyte-09?

[swift steppe]

actually yeah?

[restive river]

They

[swift steppe]

i forgor about cyte-09 LOL

[swift steppe]

yes sorry

[smoky solstice]

But yeah, Temple makes sense to be the fourth

[swift steppe]

it doesnt tho?

[restive river]

It seems Cyte the frame existed before Quincy
He was just lost

[smoky solstice]

So that's what I'm calling, rhino, frost, mesa, temple

[swift steppe]

it doesnt make sense that temple is the fourth

[restive river]

Cant have frost without ember

[swift steppe]

the frame isnt out yet it doesnt make sense to count it

[swift steppe]

why?

[smoky solstice]

why can't temple make sense for the same reason as cyte

[restive river]

I mean
They’re kinda a duo

[swift steppe]

idk it just doesnt add up in my head

[restive river]

Temple makes as much sense as any other frame until we get more on them that may day otherwise

[swift steppe]

wdym?

[smoky solstice]

Like you think it was supposed to be a one time thing?

[restive river]

They’re a warframe same as any and likely did exist during the orokin era like Cyte

Meaning Albrecht could easily get a sample

[swift steppe]

no not at all i just dont understand why DE would count it as the fourth its not a frame that is out yet?? idk i might just be a little silly

[restive river]

Fire and ice?
Ember and Frost?

[swift steppe]

oh

[restive river]

More a thematic duo than anything

[swift steppe]

yeah alright i can see it now

[restive river]

We have zero details on Temple or the new protos
We’ll get details on both in the same stream
It makes sense to an extent they could be a proto

Which hey, a proto that’s nonbinary would be great for representation

[smoky solstice]

Maybe, I just feel like frost was the first prime (iirc), Rhino is the first warframe players craft, Mesa has like a lot of personality behind her and was released fairly early on as well, those fit so well. And if the fourth is not Temple, it could be ember but I don't think she's as big of a deal as the others

[restive river]

Not that that’s something they have to do ofc but it’d be nice

[restive river]

Loki was one of the starters, he fits more than Rhino and Mesa combined lmao

[swift steppe]

OMG imagine mesa

[restive river]

The new protos could be any of the frames we have new or old.

[swift steppe]

mesa protoframe is just sadie in rdr2 OMG

[smoky solstice]

Oh I forgot about Loki, tbf DE could forget about him as well LMAO

[restive river]

Xaku, Revenant and Caliban can work easily too
All Albrecht needs is a sample at the time of the old war and all warframes existed to some extent during the old war.

[swift steppe]

they spoke about ash too he might be one of the few that gets protoframe too

[restive river]

Caliban would’ve been difficult to get but not impossible, he has archon shards
Revenant has a paradoxical prime variant that I can see him mucking with
And Xaku is entrati coded in every way
There’s no frame that wouldn’t work

[restive river]

That was mostly because of the psuedo/exalted weapon chanhes

[smoky solstice]

Ok another thing for Mesa, she was in the Duviri intro cutscene, the most prominent warframe there

[restive river]

Like Garuda has as much of a chance as any other

[swift steppe]

why is there so many people getting hacked

[restive river]

Duviri has nothing to do with 1999 at the moment that’s not really relevant

[swift steppe]

wdym xaku entrati coded in every way

[smoky solstice]

Yeah but it shows that DE may want to put her there

That DE likes her aesthetic

[restive river]

Ability names
The prime has obols
They exist because of the entrati void expeditions

[smoky solstice]

Like all I'm saying is that she is one of the classics

[swift steppe]

ah yes true

[smoky solstice]

Are the current protoframes all release order, except for Loki?

[swift steppe]

loki would be a ghost

[smoky solstice]

Like excal mag and volt are starters, what about nyx and trinity

[swift steppe]

werent nyx and trinity the next frames that came out after the first 3?

[smoky solstice]

So it could just be that they go for release order + whatever that's new

[swift steppe]

i guess?

[smoky solstice]

Oh wait, there's a ton who were out as soon as the game was seemingly

Out of those, Rhino, Ash, Loki and Ember are missing

[smoky solstice]

Exactly 4...

[silk atlas]

No, they released along with the starters. Volt wasn't even the starter from the begining, it was Loki.

[smoky solstice]

CRAP I'M USING FANDOM

[swift steppe]

so they missing ember loki rhino ash frost

ah well this is fandom nevermind

[smoky solstice]

Frost was not on release

[swift steppe]

why did they change that

[smoky solstice]

According to this, only 4 are missing from the protoframe lineup

Could literally just be that

[swift steppe]

which one then

[smoky solstice]

I named all of them above your screenshot

[swift steppe]

ah sorry

[smoky solstice]

Could it literally just be them?

[swift steppe]

yeah they talked about ash getting a reworked he might also get a protoframe

literally bruce wayne

[silk atlas]

Because he's bad lol.

Or rather, he was considered "for experts" at the time so they picked a more beginner friendly frame

[smoky solstice]

Perhaps the loki proto is getting some character arc relating to how DE set him aside for someone else lmao

[swift steppe]

ah i see

[swift steppe]

LMAOOOOO yeah maybe

[silk atlas]

I remember when I picked Volt as my first starter on my PS4 playthrough because they mentioned "an alternative to gunplay" but then I realized I had to pretty much use guns anyway

[swift steppe]

lmaooo

[smoky solstice]

He's complete trash for beginners yeah, but he's not necessarily bad overall because his decoys can still break the game, and on-demand invis can also do that

[swift steppe]

at least you go fast i guess

[smoky solstice]

So I wouldn't go so far as to call him bad, only much worse for beginners than the current options, which are all great

[swift steppe]

thats not cool bro

[smoky solstice]

So yeah, unless Temple is coming in as a proto, it seems like it could just be the rest of the warframes which were there from the start, that would be very fitting at least

I'd put my money on that if I had to

[swift steppe]

maybe temple is the 5th they just dont say it

lol

[smoky solstice]

Could be, I think it is different for cyte though, because I think his whole idea in terms of this is supposed to be like he was actually there from the start, he was just hidden, so idk if that same kind of thing would work for temple

[swift steppe]

eh idk! well see when they come out

pretty frame tho

[smoky solstice]

Yeah, I'm sure they'll be announced next dev stream

[swift steppe]

excited to see people driving me crazy with their sound + octavia :3

[smoky solstice]

I'm really wondering what the gameplay will be like
Like is it gonna be like you have to riff and based on the combination of chords you play, you do certain things?

Sorta like dante but more fast paced?

Maybe smaller buffs put together at the end of the chord progression?

Idk, there's so many options

[swift steppe]

i dont know but riffing away the ennemies sounds really badass im not gonna lie

[smoky solstice]

Or yeah, it's gonna have like a guitar exalted weapon and based on how you riff, it may apply like debuffs to enemies, maybe armor strip etc and then at the end of your riffing you do this like big damage nuke

[swift steppe]

omggg that would be so cool

i wonder what their story is going to be

[smoky solstice]

Yeah

Well I gotta go but it's fun that we'll find a lot of this out soon

[swift steppe]

true!! its so fun

[smoky solstice]

Plus we're getting some stuff coming out throughout february (can't wait for the r5 dialogues)

[swift steppe]

me too omg!

[smoky solstice]

Anyway, good night everyone

[shadow stratus]

Good night! Rest well.

[swift steppe]

good night!

[raw stone]

Could have a fun little thing where the techrot has adapted the Technocyte so much that it had created Temple.

Or if they have a proto, this would be unavoidable... maybe. It'd be a paradox. But like... given they're releasing with Tech Encore, I thought hey... if the techrot adapted to us already and copies us (as said in the Legacyte Hunt by Eleanor), and another line that says they're "more akin to Warframes" Maaaaaaaybe the Techrot has created its own Warframe????

For some insane reason though, if a Temple Proto exists, we gotta explain why Albrecht has his hands on a Warframe from 1999. If what I'm cooking up here is what they're going with.

[umbral anchor]

Why do the Corpus' suits vary in colour so much? I always just saw it as a Star Trek reference but never gave it serious thought

[swift steppe]

idk i never rlly noticed

but now that you say it it may be due to different ranks in the corpus

i guess?

[tall echo]

Different professions

[tall echo]

Better idea: discount monster hunter hunting horn

[stiff fable]

Like with Cyte, it's going to turn out that Temple is a proper Warframe with history in the Orokin System that went dark after the collapse. Albrecht will have a sample and create a proto based on them, and they will be the basis for our blueprints.

[raw stone]

Ah

Yeah probably that but I would've loved the Techrot to dump out its own Warframe from interacting with the Tenno from circa 12,000+ AD

[zinc bronze]

Someone hit me about the lore of Jade and why she's pregnant

[tall echo]

Jade was a low guard(iirc) that fell in love with another low guard called sorren(pre-transformation stalker). She's pregnant because she was transformed into a warframe while she was pregnant

[zinc bronze]

Thanks

[stiff fable]

@zinc bronze if you want a bit of color to Scrap's summary, visit Teshin in any relay after you've finished Jade Shadows and look to his left (your right)

[zinc bronze]

I will keep that in mind

[upbeat glacier]

So this may sound weird

Hav you all noticed when we attack corpus areas there's no police or civilians or any non combatants

Unless that's the point and we're being very strategic

But even fortuna we don't see any law enforcement, medics, doctors etc

[sturdy arrow]

What is the lore reason for Aoi being A music vendor instead of being A Tommy Upgrader? I get that she loves music, but, in the lore, she's the team's bike mechanic

[north jolt]

IE, at the time he was OP (crowd control was the meta and invisibility is always useful) so pre-2015, he could very easily trivialize a lot of the early game

[sturdy arrow]

It's because the Solaris all lift together... Not really A need for any of those if they're all working with eachother...

[humble sierra]

Lore: there's no need for her to sell anything, the bikes are heavily modified already and they need upkeep more than upgrades. My guess is they were meant to be modular like K-Drives and she would've been selling parts like the Ventkids, but while making 1999 the schedule got a bit too tight for a modular bike system and they figured it was better to just have her sell Somachords

[sturdy arrow]

'Kay. Thanks for letting me know

[humble sierra]

If they ever add new stuff to the Atomicycle, I think it might be like separate ones with different abilities, like Archwings, and she might sell them that way

[sturdy arrow]

If the Orokin figured out quantum mechanics in order to make the relics, was it done with the Void (As per the Void being described as gifting the Tenno, "Its unique brand of physics,".)?

[north jolt]

I want to know more about the mechanics of their time travel because so far it seems (least lore wise) underutilized by the Orokin, despite being known to be possible, and I KNOW they didn't mostly avoid messing with it out of the kindness of their hearts and thoughtful consideration for the potential consequences of their actions

[undone sundial]

In railjack, they are on hangars and I think they activate, which makes me wonder if those suits have people in them and they are "sleeping"

[sturdy arrow]

Entrati was the 1 who was making the trips back in time. Considering Entrati's refusal of Continuity, and the grudges held against him, I'd say he'd be 1 of the only Orokins willing to go back to A time when the Orokin were much, much technologically weaker...

[undone sundial]

It's a specialization of function to color thing I think

[north jolt]

Its just weird to me he was (as far as we know) the ONLY Orokin actually using time travel

[sturdy arrow]

Miku-T is inside an empty room at the start of his story in New War Part 1, maybe he was deactivated before being called in to do Vipo things?

[undone sundial]

Interesting, maybe

[lean garden]

there's no police or civilians or any non combatants
Because we dont attack non-combatants

[upbeat glacier]

I'm saying none are even in the area

[lean garden]

Because thats a non-non-combatant area

[tall echo]

The corpus aren't gonna waste valuable workers on the slave colony

[drifting mirage]

We see Solaris miners in the ice mines in railjack missions; the Grineer have non combatants in the shipyard tilesets

[sturdy arrow]

What about the Domestik Drones or Propoganda Drones in Corpus galleons, or 100 Kuaka for Pest Control achievement?

[lean garden]

the kuakas arent civilians, and the drones are corpus machines

[sturdy arrow]

They are non-combatants

[lean garden]

if youre attacking the domestik drones thats on you

propaganda drones arent necessarily non-combatants

[sturdy arrow]

You said we, meaning every individual, not the collective

[lean garden]

hell, ascribing the non-combatant trait to machines is already deliberately detracting from the point

[lean garden]

so are you being contrarian or pedantic?

[sturdy arrow]

You and I both know I have no idea what those words mean.

[lean garden]

it means either youre just saying things just to disagree or youre excessively concerned with extremely minor details/rules

[sturdy arrow]

On the topic of machines, didn't the word Robot mean Slave Labor when it was first used? I wonder if the Orokin used the original definition when they became so technologically advanced 🤔

[proper barn]

Okay we do see guards coming down there later during the quest. 2 other things The coprus only come down to fortuna to collect like profits or if things go wrong. Also some of the Solaris used to be soilders.

corpus soilders even. they talk about it.

[normal mountain]

Law enforcement, I understand. With the way things are going on there, I'd be shocked if a Solaris stole something from another Solaris
The lack of medical practitioners, on the other hand, confuses me. Especially with regards to The Waverider, I would have expected that someone among Solaris U would have been there taking care of (Roki, I believe it was?) after she tumbled off her K-drive and was effectively in a coma

Simpler explanation is probably that no one can afford that level of education

[feral cape]

When has the void been described as that and also yes relics likely utilize void technology to create a quantum superposition

[feral cape]

Entrati was the only one who had a time machine and the knowledge to build one parvos just stole some information on temporal manipulation

[humble sierra]

Judging by Parvos' interest in Entrati's artifacts, I wouldn't be surprised if he starts messing around with time too.

I mean, I doubt they'd take it there, but it's definitely something to ponder

Maybe Parvos goes back in time before civilization and reinvents capitalism

[north jolt]

Goes back in time and meets Adam Smith

[uneven pebble]

I have avoided this channel because I have not played all the way through the game.

But I do want to ask, As someone who has played the game solo for ~10yrs on and off.
Am I the odd one out for thinking that Natah/Lotus is not a good entity?

I got the impression that is on purpose.

[lean garden]

not "good" in what sense?

[uneven pebble]

I mean, she did what she did to serve her own wants after helping massarcre an equally degenerate empire.

[glacial bough]

It was her wants sure, but that isn't a bad thing in this case

Her want was keeping her children alive

[uneven pebble]

She literally took the will of the Tenno and used it for her own wants.
Probably not a saint .

[lean garden]

Ok lets break it down here

[uneven pebble]

Because she was sterile.

Like, not hating, the lore is great in that regard.

Very interesting character

[lean garden]

I mean, she did what she did to serve her own wants
Is that necessarily bad?
after helping massarcre an equally degenerate empire.
Equally?

[glacial bough]

She didn't? The Tenno still did their own thing

Or what exactly are you meaning

[uneven pebble]

That wasnt how I interperted it. She fooled them into thinking she was their dead adoptive "mother"

[strange plinth]

kinda depends where you are in the story, though
some of her actions make sense in retrospect, but not when first revealed
yes, she turned the tenno back on the orokin. but it wasn't just her that did that, ||ballas reprogrammed her to||

[lean garden]

She fooled them into thinking she was their dead adoptive "mother"
Not her doing, also the tenno didnt think she was margulis

[glacial bough]

Yes and no. She became a mother figure, but we didn't think she was Marg

That also wasn't even her choice to begin with

[uneven pebble]

Ok where I am at doesnt explain that very clearly.

[lean garden]

Actually where in the story are you

like post TNW or?

[uneven pebble]

Its a mess, because I played before a lot of story quest got pushed out so far.

So atm I am not even at that point, but last i played I did the Natah quest.

So a lot of what I see now is confusing AF tbh lol

[lean garden]

ah ok, I take it from the way youre spoiler tagging the operators you've just finished The Second Dream? Or have you not done that yet?

[uneven pebble]

No, I havent. I did something that lead up to the opperators WAY back in the day. I know the gist.

I listened to some catch up lore on YT but tried to stop/skip the spoilers

[lean garden]

Ah, I see, you're lacking in the played experience department. I'd suggest playing through the quests

[strange plinth]

ok, Natah is the first time that we get that bit of 'is the lotus lying to us?'
if that's as far as you've gotten (i do not know when natah released compared to where it is in story), just keep playing story quests imo

[lean garden]

but uh, any of the "flaws" you see with the lotus will be explained down the road

[uneven pebble]

The Natah story line was pre-archframe when I last played

[lean garden]

All roads will lead to a certain dingus

[hoary vapor]

Is it just me or does Viktor's dialogue (in Fall) seem to imply that generally no citizen in Hollvania buys into the Scaldra propaganda?

[lean garden]

if thats what youre coming away with, youre doing a great job at not buying viktor's bs

which I hope hollvanians share

[north ferry]

You would hope but uhhh...

[proper barn]

what part are you on?

[uneven pebble]

The moon before Saturn

[proper barn]

also for a little bit it was a theory. it has since dissipated for reasons.

[uneven pebble]

fair warning, I am half a handle in.

[proper barn]

what?

also What was the last story quest you did?

[uneven pebble]

I cant recall mate .

[glacial bough]

They are a level of inebriated

[proper barn]

oh

they are british or one of the ones that use the Tiny UK flag on theirs.

[uneven pebble]

I tried to speak murican, but Ive had a bottle and a bit of whisky .

[proper barn]

Lmao even murican has like 3 different verisons

[uneven pebble]

Thats fair

I think a handle is Southern for 1,5 bottles.

Ive tried to learn over the years.

[proper barn]

Austriala

I think.

[uneven pebble]

North East Victoria, but yes,.

We're doing IRL lore now.

[proper barn]

The difference between someone from Louisiana and New York is you take the new york guy and give him a vallum now he sounds like he's from Louisiana. That only works for those 2 states

but it's very funny.

anyway

[uneven pebble]

I can speak 4 languages.
Italian. Irish (Galige), English and Australian.

[proper barn]

the reason is btw they are both port cities.

[uneven pebble]

That does make sense tbh

I live in the mountains hundreds of KMs from the the coast, so the Irish and Italians that got here REALLY wanted to be out here.

Oh and the Koorie mob. But I cant speak much of that.

Just their English words they use.

[proper barn]

oh you haven't done natah yet or the second dream.

[uneven pebble]

Not in its current itteration. I played through when Lotus spilled the beans about the sentiends WAY back in the day

[proper barn]

i mean

[uneven pebble]

I know the gist, but the game has changed.

[proper barn]

that would have to be

before the solar rails.

have you done the second dream?

[uneven pebble]

Im not sure tbh,. it was before the onogata or what ever.

[uneven pebble]

dont think so. I have listened to some lore to catch up, but I turned it off when I realised I didnt know wtf it was saying.

[proper barn]

okay

well going through the story should help.l

but yeah for reasons people thought Lotus might be evil when she was "gone" cuz we got a cliffhanger for like

so from 2017

till 2021

she was literally gone for story reasons. it won't be that long for you cuz you can just go from one quest to another.

but yeah she isn't but there was a theory for it.

like this is a real item ingame.

for your K-drive lmao.

anyway GET TO THE SECOND DREAM and onward.

[uneven pebble]

I dont think she is evil. But she isn't a saint either.

Good writing really.

[restive river]

I mean
She did betray her entire people for a buncha kids she was, to an extent, programmed to care about

[uneven pebble]

Arent we all progamed etc etc...

[restive river]

No.

[uneven pebble]

We are though

[restive river]

She
She was literally programmed with Margulis’ personality

[uneven pebble]

mmhmm

[restive river]

She’s not human, she was made as a mimic and sent to infiltrate the tenno to destroy them
But she denied that directive cause we’re chill and she became our new mom (the old one died cause Ballas is whiny (and the one before that we killed/watched die))

[uneven pebble]

you're missing the alegory there.

[restive river]

Not really?
She literally denied what she was “programmed” to do
She defied her purpose

[uneven pebble]

Yeah, I know.

[north ferry]

You for someone as cunning and intelligent as Ballas was, you would be surprised he didn't consider replicating the character that got Margulis attached to the children would cause the same thing to happen again.

Then again, a. He doesn't understand geninue care and affection b. He did have a plan in place that probably got interrupted.

[strange plinth]

"cunning and intelligent" is no match for hubris
something the orokin, ballas especially, had tons of lol

[brittle siren]

Question: from the design standpoint is Temple was made during 1999 and was not design in the Orokin era?

[lean garden]

we got no info for that currently

[raw stone]

Basically my same question

[brittle siren]

https://fixupx.com/syncrasis/status/1885466125720293561?s=46&t=5XSoAshUqsO-YG_gq2tB3Q

[raw stone]

Except it'd be that The Techrot had dumped out Temple (WHICH I STILL THINK IS KILLER AND SHOULD HAPPEN.)
But it's more likely they're also a long-hidden pre-fall warframe like Cyte which SUUUUUCKS.

I am also excited for the glitter. I hope it shares their accents/metallics.

Also technically if the Techrot had dumped out Temple... then technically Temple would be the first warframe to ever be made in the timeline, but it requires a paradox. The protos/drifter have to arrive at 1999 for it to have happened, for the Techrot to imprint and replicate.

It is ALL a crack theory. Do not take it as a spoiler, do not take it as fact. But if it comes true you may send me... 1 cosmetic on my wishlist (kidding)

[brittle siren]

Idk if rock still exist in Orokin era

[raw stone]

True.

But that's irrelevant to the whole... where did Temple come from question.

To you and me tho it's obvious that since Temple is a 1999 frame, they're gonna have a proto right?

[proper barn]

oh hey my favorite non-binary rocker. that isn't david bowie.

[lean garden]

I mean, guitars evidently do

[raw stone]

Shawzins, yup

I hope Temple gets their own Shawzin

[winter geode]

Did wally kill tagfers wife or was that just the void being the void

[strange plinth]

what rank are you with the cavia?

[raw stone]

You don't know what killed them till you finish the syndicate

[strange plinth]

rank 4 or 5 iirc yeah
just want to know if its a misunderstanding thing or a lack of information thing
don't want to spoil it if they can still experience it yk

[raw stone]

Rank 5 is their death, rank 4 is their diving bell experience.

If you guys ever wondered why bird 3 sells those archon shards, rank 5 is... why. Begrudgingly

Also wonder why Entrati has enough archon shards to stock his many vaults with.

[strange plinth]

i think loid or the netracells have an explanation on his stock of archon shards? something about experimenting with them i think?

[raw stone]

Wonder how he got them more than why I guess.

Sorry, just... forgot. Questions are everything.

[strange plinth]

yeah i get it
i think there's still something there about that but i could be wrong

[raw stone]

There might. You could explain it as Erra having Archons since Old War...

But how many Archons died? How many shards got transformed? Do the archons infinitely survive but are reduced to larval states till they have another warframe to parasitize? I'm sure there's lore bits somewhere on them but... I am reluctant to retouch New War.

(Plus I'm sure Veilbreaker itself has some lore bits too. What with Pazuul being revealed then.)

[tall echo]

Archons are old war creations

[raw stone]

Ah.

Well I standed to be corrected.

[tall echo]

That's one of the first things hunhow tells the drifter

iirc

[raw stone]

Ah.... new war cinematic stuffffff

[tall echo]

It seems that archons can also be revived infinitely as long as there's a sufficient supply of archon shards

[raw stone]

True.

Not sure if they ever explain how the archons can do so. All the archons seem to require hosts tho.

[brittle siren]

so if the Hex now in a loop forever, so the version of them outside the loop is dead?

(i mean not dead with time, killed)

[strange plinth]

that's the funny part about time loops

[brittle siren]

because time still have to flow, so our current time could exist

I would think it like "Miss Peregrine's Home for Peculiar Children" kind of loop

[graceful swan]

There isn’t a person outside the loop unless you bring Eternalism into it

[brittle siren]

but then how the timeline can moving normally to the current warframe time?

[graceful swan]

Time loop

[brittle siren]

again, if the time loop override the timeline, those event happened in warframe would not exist, it gonna be still 1999. Yet Loid still exist, so that's mean, that loop is just a pocket one and only the town affected

I would think it the same like "Miss Peregrine's Home for Peculiar Children" case

[graceful swan]

Only one of us going also helped not break time

[strange plinth]

time loop shenanigans: the only time where a conceptually embodied 1999 would be easier to explain

[raw stone]

At some point void shenanigans then has to hide 1999 unless in the future the loop actually pops.

Again, Miss Peregrine's. The only sitch is that that movie/series has them sort of stay on a secluded island home. This is a whole city-state on a continent, likely.

Plus, they can technically leave the contained bubble there. But they have to return to keep the loop contained from burst -- okay I see it.

[tall echo]

The 1999 loop is part of the active timeline, and the timeline doesn't care about the looping part

[crimson cave]

are mods lore accurate?

[humble sierra]

Yeah there's lore regarding mods, and Ordis has lines about them

[north jolt]

I know it is what it is now, but I think in some ways the "every frame gets a prime" promise kinda limits how a frame can be introduced into the game, in terms of being brand new. We don't really have any room for any "post-fall" frames to exist

[north jolt]

Is it possible to escape the time loop by just physically leaving Hollivania?

[raw stone]

Probably.

[north jolt]

Makes sense but is also kinda funny "Screw this I'm out!"

[raw stone]

But Hollvania seems to be a walled off city-state of my opinion. Either by manual means of containing the Techrot, or as the architecture lends itself.

[burnt light]

Drifter only one that can come and go?

[north jolt]

But the next question is, if only Hollivania is in this time-loop pocket dimension thing, does it look any different to those outside of it?

[raw stone]

Thank you whoever brought up Miss Peregrine's tho.

[raw stone]

Yeah. Technically. The only one who can technically leave.

Leave in the sense of escaping back to the future.

[burnt light]

I imagine it’s destroyed to those outside not realizing it’s in a bubble

[lean garden]

I imagine that its not just hollvania

too much narrative complication if only a locale was isolated

[raw stone]

Ooh. Probably. Maybe it actually got destroyed in a nuclear fallout from Albrecht's og loop.

[lean garden]

I wouldnt write myself into a corner like that (hire me DE)

[north jolt]

To me it seems like the story has been implying such tho

[lean garden]

how so?

theres not much that isolates hollvania from the rest of the timeline

[raw stone]

The schism here is that... the Void is resetting the day until Drifter arrives to expand toward the year.

[burnt light]

Crazy everyone there calls us Marty and then I remember our Drifter probably don’t even remember their own name

[north jolt]

Well we haven't really seen any indication that anyone outside of Hollvania is experiencing the time loop too. Only those within, least so far

[lean garden]

I mean, absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence

[raw stone]

Could also explain the endless Scaldra goons tbh.

[north jolt]

To me it seems like a situation similar to "the zone" in the Stalker serious, but with timey wimey stuff

[burnt light]

I assumed its walled off and no one’s allowed in

[raw stone]

Scaldra are... humans we can't reason that they aren't and an endless supply of humans in Hollvania? Unlikely.

[north jolt]

But so far we only have evidence of it taking place IN Hollivania. We know little to nothing about the state of the world outside of it, other then most people being ignorant to the techrot overrunning the city

[lean garden]

I mean, the year does reset

[burnt light]

Each reset their numbers go back up to full, who knows how many there are

[raw stone]

They could be flown in, sure, but also unlikely enough to replace how many we slaughter.

[lean garden]

but again that doesnt mean that the rest of the timeline in that segment isnt affect too tho

[raw stone]

Yes but I meant day to day really.

[north jolt]

But at that point aren't you just making baseless assumptions then? :p a lack of evidence is also, not evidence

[raw stone]

Idk. Maybe they are flying in people overnight? And that's why it's like that?

[graceful swan]

When in doubt just give birth

[north jolt]

So far we only know of the time loop affecting Hollivania, so IMO we can only reasonably assume that its isolated to the city until we get confirmation otherwise

[raw stone]

Spiders. Everywhere

[lean garden]

its a major difference between assuming that only hollvania is affected because we dont have the perspective of those outside, and assuming that the entire timeline is affected, because its a timeloop

gimme a sec getting pathos clamps

[north jolt]

Going back a bit, what are the implications you was talking about in regards to the time loop only affecting Hollivania?

[burnt light]

We even know how big the city is? I feel it’s big

[raw stone]

At least that map on KIM

[north jolt]

Probably big enough to (in universe) hold a few million people? not including the Scaldra

Just a guess but Id assume its a pretty decent size, maybe "medium" sized city

[raw stone]

City-state

[graceful swan]

It’s bigger than we have access to

[raw stone]

Enough to have a military

[north jolt]

And a stadium, and a theme park

[raw stone]

Because they do specify "Hollvanian Military"

[north jolt]

A very big stadium and theme park at that

[raw stone]

The stadium seems to be on the outskirts of the city tbh. It's on that hill right?

[graceful swan]

I wonder if that tower is where Scaldra command hide

[north jolt]

And the Scaldra are just a relatively small branch of it. I imagine its like a "German army/ SS" type of arrangement

[north jolt]

I think so yeah

[raw stone]

(Not me burning down time cause I' waiting for The New War to be removed from my account...)

Anyway yeah.

Oh also at some point the stadium gets jettisoned into space for rj.

Idk if that happens constantly during the new year like auld lane syne Boomf, Stadium Iron Giant'd to orbit.

[burnt light]

Or maybe rebuilt the same way

[raw stone]

We'll see in Encore.

No... to me, from that tennocon reveal, it looked like the stadium got erupted from the ground and placed in space tbh.

[graceful swan]

I wanna find Viktor so I can shut him up

[north jolt]

Doesn't it also end up in OUR main timeline?

[burnt light]

Thought it does

[raw stone]

Our timeline is 1999.

[north jolt]

I meant in the future

[raw stone]

Warframe's a giant AU.

[north jolt]

Cause we don't have a railjack in 1999

[graceful swan]

1999 is the past of our timeline

[raw stone]

Lmao pffh I got flashbacks... REEEEEMIX

[north jolt]

And we can't launch our bikes into space anymore 😢

[raw stone]

ofc we don't got a rj in 1999. That's timetravel.

[north jolt]

Sooooooo

Does the stadium travel to the future or something?

[raw stone]

Did they... explain Coda liches to you my guy?

[graceful swan]

We have a Landing craft in 1999

[raw stone]

Someone pull up the slides.

[north jolt]

Im just wondering how the Coda end up OUR time. The timewith all the scifi guns and grineer and Corpus and space mom. That timeline. The one that's not 1999 :V

[raw stone]

The stadium gets jettisoned into space a la Fortitudo fight in Bayo 1. We, Bayonetta, fly in with our RJ in The Future, to fight the Liches in the future aboard their Stadium Arena Show.

[north jolt]

Got it

[raw stone]

https://tenor.com/view/bayonetta-fortitudo-video-games-angel-explosion-gif-20167664

Visualize this happening.

[north jolt]

Im also visualizing the Coda kidna just floating around in space for a long time, from their POV

[raw stone]

Yeah basically.

They could also be molting. They do emerge from cocoons in the tennocon teaser. Perhaps a second Molt.

[lean garden]

back from getting pathos clamps.

Ok so:

1. When we are told of 1999, we are constantly being presented with the year of 1999, at no point is it suggested that the location itself within 1999 is anything special, but rather the year itself. What this means is that when we are given the time loop, it is far more reasonable to understand that this is a loop of 1999, special because of the year and not of the location of Hollvania.
2. When I say "absence of evidence is not evidence of absence" its because your claim is that because we dont hear anything from anyone outside of hollvania, it means that they're outside the time loop, in essence being "absent" from the timeloop. This is different from saying "just because we dont hear anything means that theyre not affected", because Im not saying theyre absent from anything, I'm saying that the evidence does not flow into that conclusion.
3. The implications would then be the issue of other entities outside entering hollvania. DE sure could go down this route if they really had a bubble in mind, but then they'd have to come up with a whole host of things that at this point is already extra, such as who would want to go into the bubble, why, what gear do they have, who are they aligned with, can they understand whats going on in the bubble, how much time has passed already since the thing is looping etc. Its alot of work for something thats by and large already finished

[stiff fable]

That or the coda just goes and hides in the technocyte hivemind until it's spat out in the future

[lean garden]

The coda get so pissed at us they deliberately wait a WHOLE long while just to get back at us

[stiff fable]

Hahaha

[north jolt]

Obviously the year itself is important yes, but I figured so was Hollvania too. Entrati could of chosen anywhere really, so I figure he must of had a reason for choose Hollvania, either out of some kind of convenience for himself or some deeper reasoning. Hollvania is also one of the locations where the techrot first breaks out so it has that significance as well. Aside from that I'm still not sure about the supposed issues with the time loop possibly being a isolated "bubble" over Hollvania. We only hear of Hollvania being affected, so my current stance is just simply: Until we get solid confirmation otherwise, Im assuming only Hollvania and those within are being directly affected by the time loop. The only outside entities I know of in Hollvania are us, the Hex, Albrecht and maybe Viktor. Some people have also mentioned Hollvania being walled off anyway so I don't think a whole lot of people currently are freely entering or leaving the city

[lean garden]

I mean youre free to hold that stance

But "we dont hear anything from anyone outside" is not valid evidence for that stance

the fact that we dont hear anything allows for me to believe the whole segment of time is in a loop, and you to believe only the city is in a loop

but its not a confirmation of either

[north jolt]

Okay, but what specifically leads you to believe the former then?

I know you mentioned entities coming in and out

[lean garden]

Point 1)

from the above

[north jolt]

Right, but I think both the year and the location matters.

[tall echo]

What

[lean garden]

sure, but in game we've been directly told of the importance of the year

that indicates that in one way or another the focus of 1999 is well, 1999

hollvania being the site of the techrot is important too, but that comes as an additional factor of the year of 1999

because the techrot was also there in 1998

but its 1999 thats been looped, first the last day of that year, and then the whole year

[stiff fable]

worth remembering that Albrecht was capable of traveling to BEFORE 1999 originally, and the loop came later

So it's not like there's a hard rule about 1999 being so totally special

[lean garden]

yes, but my focus is that he isolated a loop on 1999

cuz the Grand Clown himself was on the scene in 1998 and perhaps earlier

[stiff fable]

Right, I'm submitting this as more evidence for "there's no bubble, just six people, a cat and a Drifter stuck repeating events"

[lean garden]

hell lets go further, the isnt any bubble and its just the trumna show for 7 clowns and a cat

[stiff fable]

Did your autocorrupt replace Truman with Trumna or was that human error

[lean garden]

human

[woven coyote]

Arent there a few chats with lettie and i think quincy where drifter asks if they keep in touch with their families? And i think one of them replies that it doesnt matter because of the loop

[restive river]

Kimulacrum has a convo locator, if you remember any part of that you could find it easily

[north jolt]

Important question

What fish in the WF setting do you think makes the best sushi?

[proper barn]

Does the unum count?

[main crane]

Funny looking fishes in Deimos. Jokes aside. Probably Murkray cuz it's rare, is found in the ocean, and requires a Murkray bait which isn't a regular bait.

[north jolt]

The Unum is not fish

If it's not a "human" but it's flesh is identical to human flesh, is that cannibalism?

[proper barn]

It's not identical to human flesh at all. It's more whale.

Have you seen it?

[north jolt]

I thought the flesh towers used human DNA?

[feral cape]

No

[proper barn]

No.

It's a tower that bleeds kuva

[north jolt]

And is made of flesh. But what kind of flesh?

[high bay]

How are the various space craft in Warframe built? Like how/where was the Zariman built? Seems to me that the thing is absolutely massive given that it can have five missions in the same vessel

[north jolt]

Ok cool, so what kind of flesh is it?

Human, whale, bear, fish, cat?

[proper barn]

Closest to whale seemingly.

[north jolt]

Are you saying that just because its big? or

[proper barn]

No cuz of how it looks

[north jolt]

Lots of fat/blubber

[proper barn]

And like it looks like whale bubbler basically.

[visual ermine]

Also the place is called “Cetus”

[main crane]

Cetus could either mean whale or the Constellation. That makes sense.

[stiff fable]

There was a trend in sci-fi a few decades ago for lab-grown meat horror stories

Wouldn't surprise me if one of the writers read the same stories and had the idea in the back of their head

[north jolt]

Normal scifi settings using lab grown meat for food

Orokin in Warframe: "Lets make buildings out of this stuff!"

[visual ermine]

It’s kind of the perfect symbol of motherly self-sacrifice without us actually knowing much about the character

[stiff fable]

(still think it could be Wally's finger)

[restive river]

I don’t think details are really given for that process

[restive river]

Mostly depends on if she predates him or not

[stiff fable]

I mean the Earth's surface was uninhabitable for a big chunk of the Orokin era...

[north ferry]

Biological computers is also a science fiction trope sooo

Perhaps a form of infestation

[feral pawn]

Hi! I have a question about the Hex Quest! More specifically... when we start another Duviri style time loop at the end of it..... where did this ability come from? Is it because of Drifter's connection to/creation of Duviri that we have the power to create timeloops? Or was this a one time deal?

[silk atlas]

Loid heavily suspects that the extension of the loop was Albrecht's doing, but lord knows why Drifter would mention "resetting the pieces" if that was the case.

[uneven lantern]

It also uses the same spiral imagery as Duviri loops

[silk atlas]

Issue is that the whole thing with Duviri's power was given back to Thrax at the end of the quest, so lord knows how the heck Drifter still has that.

[feral pawn]

Wasn't Thrax just a representation of younger us? Who used Duviri as a mental escape from the horrors on the Zariman?

[silk atlas]

He was not, no. Character from the book.

Thematically, yes, but not actually.

[uneven lantern]

The npcs think drifter is thrax

With conceptual embodiment, thematics are reality

[feral pawn]

It was... so... maybe it's because of the indifference that we were able to create another loop with all the stuff that was surrounding us during the sequence where we were yoinked by the Man in the Wall?

[silk atlas]

I'm talking about the other way around, Thrax being Drifter, which isn't the case because story book character.

Why they would confuse Drifter for being Thrax, not a damn clue because I can't remember if Drifter had control of Duviri some time before the quest.

[stiff fable]

Drifter offloaded their memories of the Zariman into Thrax I believe, but what he returned was control over Duviri... By resetting the loop.

If they'd kept the fully assembled doll the Drifter would have kept full control over Duviri

[feral pawn]

It's genuinely curiosity causing... because the loop has gone back so much further back than just to the start of the day like what Duviri loops back to and what the original loop in 1999 seemingly did. Us being there physically somehow allowed us to loop all the way to the start of 1999 to be able to save everyone...

[stiff fable]

So the power to reset time loops is separate, and it turns out that Albrecht and the Drifter were experiencing December 31st 1999 as a time loop

[north ferry]

It's very confusing and to be honest, I haven't seen anything point to specifics yet.

We do know Albretch has visited Duviri, or at least heavily implied he has. So he could have learnt of the reset and time loop capabilities of the void.
Despite Thrax being given control over the loop, the Drifter now knows they can do it, so it's not too much of a stretch to imply they could have control.

[humble sierra]

He outright says he has been to Duviri

Well maybe not "Hey I was in Duviri" but he describes it outright in one of his logs

And he's got Duviri artifacts in the Netracells, most notably the mask of the Vagabond

Which is implied to be MITW in Duviri

[north ferry]

It gets weird considering you can run the Hex Finale at any point in the year and despite the progress and changes made over the year, the events of the finale are the same.

Okay. I only knew about the stories in Duviri about him, not his side of things.

Also, do we have any indication there was only the day or full year timeloop for Albretch?

[glacial bough]

We only know the loop ended up being just the lat day of 1999

[feral pawn]

Well, we saw the loop in action at the start of the quest, it only went back to the start of the day

[glacial bough]

Yeah, but the loop had been altered by that point ith Wally encroaching

[north ferry]

I can't remember now.

[visual ermine]

Have I mentioned I hate time travel as a plot mechanic? I really hate time travel as a plot mechanic.

[feral pawn]

Is there any evidence to suggest that the Man in da Wall breaching into the loop affected the period of time the loop spread across?

[north ferry]

We don't see the spiral

Tbf, Warframe does time travel better than most.

So the start of The Hex has a direct rewind of the nuke exploding, not a spiral reset. It's entirely possible the Drifter is only introduced on the last day of the whole loop. Since the nuke is such a plot point it could also be implied this is what they're shown

[feral pawn]

It's rlly weird that the Drifter does reset it to the start of 1999 when he reset the loop, considering Duviri only ever looped back to the start of the same day, even when he was in control of Duviri for the extremely short period of time

[north ferry]

The more I think about it, the more I'm thinking it's always been the year. But I will admit I don't have all the evidence.

It is after all, named after the whole year.

[feral pawn]

Imma be honest, the more and more we get of the Man in the Wall, the Murmur and the indifference, the more I genuinely respect Rell as a person. He was single handedly holding back like the most dangerous entity in the entire origin system, even long after his death

[smoky solstice]

I don't think this is the case. For one, Loid tells us that it's changed. But also, the opening scene to the Hex kinda disproves it, since the nuke goes off, and then it goes back, and then we're in "December 31st, 1999"

the reason it changed, I don't think it's made clear, either Albrecht shenanigans, or Drifter shenanigans of them going hard in that moment of extreme emotion

I mean Loid implies it's Albrecht shenanigans, I just find the Drifter version cooler

[stiff fable]

Albrecht studied the Duviri loop and is the one talking about the Drifter needing time to change things, so my money is on Albrecht being behind the loop changing

[smoky solstice]

yeah, well, I guess it has to be a bit of both, since it's the Drifter triggering the loop, but in terms of the start of the loop changing, yeah

it just feels bad to attribute such a cool moment to Albrecht of all people

[stiff fable]

Albrecht is a very cool person.

Just not a nice person.

[smoky solstice]

he's an a**hole is my point

[stiff fable]

Oh he is

But unlike every other Orokin not named Dagath he has his head in the right place

Even if his heart is in hell

[smoky solstice]

I mean the character is cool but I also don't want him to be the reason behind one of the coolest moments in the quest happening, you know? so it's like I can live in my cope head canon where it wasn't actually him

[stiff fable]

One of the games I played in high school had a character very similar to him

Guy named Amon Jero, superwizard, necromancer, villain for the middle third of the game

Only for it to turn out that he was fighting the same thing you were and just had gotten into the habit of not talking about what he was fighting because no one believed him

[feral pawn]

Albrecht likely thought about how Drifter could use the additional time better, but it definitely wasn't Albrecht who changed the loop's timespan. We can see a difference between a loop Albrecht makes (start of 1999) vs a loop that the Drifter makes (end of 1999). The spiral is a clear cut sign that Drifter is the one doing it, imo

[stiff fable]

His story ends with his soul damned to hell and him having killed his own granddaughter because he couldn't stand other people inconveniencing him even a little

[smoky solstice]

speaking of which, what do you think are the odds of an indifference good guy situation

[stiff fable]

0.00%

[smoky solstice]

I feel like it has to be low

well I wouldn't put it at 0, he hasn't been too antagonistic towards the protagonists after all, there's an opening

I'm thinking like 10% chance

[stiff fable]

My suspicion is that it has to play by certain rules to reach a certain outcome

Effect leads to cause

So it's helping us for the same reason Albrecht is, funny enough

If Ballas Narmer masked the whole Origin System it wouldn't be able to get its finger back

[smoky solstice]

well I wouldn't say he's helping us, we're just more like not the thing he cares about, we're just more an obstacle, so he's trying different approaches with us

[stiff fable]

So Ballas has to go

And that means pulling and pushing at the right time

[smoky solstice]

BUT this could easily be turned around into "oh albrecht is actually the one who's doing the stuff that will lead to bad outcomes"

[stiff fable]

I mean, I'm sure Albrecht's activities ARE going to end with misery

[smoky solstice]

and then some forced allegory about xenophobia because we thought this void guy was bad but actually he's good and albrecht was just being bigoted

that would play so well I'm sure

[stiff fable]

Yeah no 0%

Albrecht is what's called a Byronic Hero

[cursive isle]

I have a question about the drifter's sibling. Sibling is mentioned in dialogues with Eleanor and Aoi, and it is not an optional answer choice, that's the only one(in Aoi's case).

Also during the flashbacks(when assembling the doll) in the Duviri Paradox quest, we see two older characters several times. Are these the drifter's parents?

And in one of the flashbacks we see these adults praising another young character. These are just no name characters, or maybe they are the parents and this young relative of the drifter?

[stiff fable]

It's not stated outright and I believe the Aoi conversation only comes up if you mention having a sibling with someone else

The "envy" Duviri flashback is purposely vague so you can insert your own idea of what's going on

Maybe it's a classmate getting praised, maybe your sibling, maybe someone your best friend

Or enemy!

[smoky solstice]

oh actually to be serious for a second with this, I think his character arc has to end with love and joy actually, because that's what he neglected and that was the problem with his approach of stopping the indifference
there's already a turnaround there but I think it's only going to have to go further in that direction

[stiff fable]

Anyway Byronic Heroes. They're moody, prone to anger and depression, make plenty of mistakes, and make the people around them miserable by failing to read the room

[smoky solstice]

I don't think misery can be the ending since it kinda goes against the whole symbolic thing building with how you shouldn't neglect this stuff in the pursuit of what you deem to be the most important thing in the universe

[stiff fable]

The most easily accessible example is Dr. Frankenstein from the famous short story Frankenstein

[cursive isle]

In a dialogue with Eleanor, you can either simply listen to her story about her brother, or add that you understand her, because you also had a sibling.

But in the dialogue about the Aoi's family, there is an option to ask about siblings, and there is no longer an answer option saying that you didn’t have one

[smoky solstice]

I think you're just describing anti-heroes, idk if that's a synonym

[stiff fable]

Anti-heroes are a more extreme example

[feral pawn]

Well, if the drifter has a sibling, that would also mean the operator does, too. Because they are the same person, just from different outcomes. And I don't think Lotus would hide that fact from us, right?

[stiff fable]

Where they're bad guys who are fighting other bad guys

[smoky solstice]

nah, anti-heroes are bad guys who have features which can be relatable and just in general have a good side to them to where you wanna root for them somewhat

[brittle siren]

uh no

[stiff fable]

Yeah that's what I mean, byronic heroes aren't bad guys

[smoky solstice]

it's not really about fighting, it's more about the fact that there's good in them and they have relatable characteristics to where you don't want to see them fail all the way

[stiff fable]

Dr. Frankenstein creates a creature out of corpses and maddened science and once it comes to life he realizes it terrifies him and tries to kill it

[brittle siren]

anti hero is basically mostly good in term of the grand scheme of things, but they do not bound my rules or law, like Venom or Deadpool

[cursive isle]

In a conversation with Aoi, it is said that this sibling had the same fate as the drifter's parents:

-I had a sibling.

-Past tense... do u mind if I ask what happened?

-Same thing that happened to my parents. The Man in the Wall.

[stiff fable]

Venom's a monster fyi

Deadpool is a good example

[brittle siren]

and he is anti hero

[stiff fable]

Nah

Villain protagonist, not anti-hero

[stiff fable]

3rd option doesn't mention siblings

So you can in fact roleplay being an only child there

I had that convo and it didn't come up

[brittle siren]

he is anti hero lmao, google is free

[stiff fable]

bro I read Venom for years

[brittle siren]

well depend on the comic ofc but mostly he is anti hero

[stiff fable]

The fact that his movies made him an anti-hero and the comics moved in that direction doesn't make him one

[brittle siren]

so he become god of light and fight his own creator Knull make him a villain

[smoky solstice]

so wait, was the deal about just the kids in the classroom (notably not including the drifter) then?

[brittle siren]

rightttttttttttttt

[stiff fable]

They were the survivors from the Drifter's class

[brittle siren]

you "read" but never actually understand how Venom work

[stiff fable]

There were other survivors

[smoky solstice]

well yeah but how can you say you saved all of them when their sibling wasn't saved?

[stiff fable]

Absolutely

[smoky solstice]

I feel like that's a pretty important thing to include

[stiff fable]

He saved the people who survived up to that point

Anyone who died before that, didn't

[smoky solstice]

oh that makes sense

[stiff fable]

The Zariman presumably had a population of millions

[brittle siren]

Venom personality come from Peter, and because Peter reject Venom, he from a "hero" to "hate spider man but still have morality". That the most tldr of Venom. Depend on the comic and host, Venom could be anti hero, hero, or villain

but mostly he is anti hero

he just hate Peter

[stiff fable]

The fact that "hundreds of thousands" of children survived means that hundreds of thousands of kids died

[north ferry]

My points the 'go back' is not a Spiral Reset, but is just a time reverse with a white screen Transition.
Where did Loid say it has changed? Cause I probably missed or forgot that.

On a similar note, I feel like as annoying as it is, it's entirely in line with Albretch for him to craft a master plan to cause the situation.

[smoky solstice]

millions? I mean it's a huge ship but those dormizones didn't seem THAT compact

[north ferry]

Oh this discussion again.

[stiff fable]

The Zariman's roughly the size of Praghasa

[smoky solstice]

actually wait

yeah the ship is like planet sized, at least if the star chart is to scale

[stiff fable]

Who was large enough to fit the entire Sentient armada inside

[feral pawn]

Loid sent us mail after the Hex quest, talking to us about how the loop has changed significantly

[stiff fable]

It's not lol

[smoky solstice]

which I don't think it is for most of the system but maybe for this?

[lament stirrup]

Do we have any in-game size comparisons for the Zarinan?

[north ferry]

It probably could easily fit a city.

[brittle siren]

how big is the sentient ship

[smoky solstice]

yeah nvm, that doesn't really make sense

[stiff fable]

People are just bad at scale

[cursive isle]

I'm just wondering if the adults shown were actually drifter's parents, and not just some older crew members. This ones

[stiff fable]

Yes they are

[north ferry]

You have Grineer or Corpus ship close next to it but there's no indication if they are to scale.

[stiff fable]

The faces and skin colors on the photo change to match your Operator's

[smoky solstice]

but also, you could maybe fit the people, problem is that all the living spaces, considering that a big part of the ship is open area not being used for living spaces, it's not like there's not enough space for there to be that many people, it's moreso that I'm not sure if there's enough space for that many dormizones, which presumably are like a single family unit

[stiff fable]

People are just kinda bad with scale

Think about New York City. Home to upwards of 10M people.

[glacial bough]

The first image no. The second image maybe

[north ferry]

Scale is hard to get your head around.

[brittle siren]

I mean this Grineer/Corpus ship is 1/3 of the Zariman already

[stiff fable]

I'd say the ship is actually even smaller since it's approaching the Zariman

[lament stirrup]

The star charts sizes are abstracted.

[brittle siren]

unless it not scaled well tbh

[cursive isle]

They are the same people

[lament stirrup]

I imagine the devs have made the Zariman's scale hard to measure on purpose, since its ostensibly got a population roughly as big as the player base.

[smoky solstice]

yeah but it's got apartement buildings, things that go up, not gonna have that on a ship

[stiff fable]

Ever been on a cruise ship?

[north ferry]

I mean, there are scale issues in railjack too but those ships are also supposed to be big.

[smoky solstice]

what about them

[stiff fable]

They're floating skyscrapers

And fit thousands of people at once

Comfortably

[smoky solstice]

they're not that huge I think

[stiff fable]

The Zariman is much much much MUCH larger than a cruise ship

[smoky solstice]

like skyscraper tier

[cursive isle]

And this character in the center in the first picture has a different appearance for different players... Because this is the sibling of the wanderer/operator? All other characters are the same for everyone, and this character is definitely not a copy of the operator.

[stiff fable]

.....cruise ships are 14 stories tall

[smoky solstice]

fair point ig, I'm just not sure if there's as much wasted space on a cruise ship. Like the game doesn't make it clear how much space is living spaces, but a lot of it seems like open areas and hallways, I feel like cruise ships are more efficient there

[glacial bough]

I wouldn't say the Zariman is as large as Praghasa, but it is far larger than any other ship in the system bar maybe a Formorian

[smoky solstice]

but I can't be sure

[stiff fable]

Cruise ships had full sized ampitheaters inside them

[smoky solstice]

cruise ships also have like big open areas

[stiff fable]

They're a spectacular waste of space

Fun to visit tho'

[glacial bough]

Meaning it's anywhere between 5 and 10 km in length

[smoky solstice]

it's just a bit hard to tell. Especially since they also needed to produce their own food on the ship, so there's also a lot of space used for essentially agriculture. Like with millions of people, you'd need a LOT of that

but it is a huge ship

[stiff fable]

Anyway yeah the Zariman was nowhere near planet sized, or moon sized, but still could comfortably house people whose job it was going to be to terraform an entire solar system

[smoky solstice]

so I'm not sure, I'm 50/50 on this. I think it can comfortably house hundreds of thousands, maybe up to 500k easy, but more than that? I'm not sure

[stiff fable]

It could easily have held more

[glacial bough]

It easily could

[stiff fable]

It was a ship the size of a modern metropolis

[glacial bough]

4k is already about the size of New York City

[stiff fable]

Mexico DF and New York City combined

[smoky solstice]

it's not about just space, it's about the amount of space you'd need to use to produce essentials to upkeep the people on the ship

[brittle siren]

how big is Praghasa compare to the moon

[stiff fable]

much smaller

[glacial bough]

Still smaller than the moon

[wintry siren]

Hey I got a text wall of lore analysis on indifference and compassion, may I post it?

[stiff fable]

the trick is that the Orokin actually can make spaces that are bigger on the inside

[smoky solstice]

like new york city doesn't have huge farmlands on it. And tbf, neither would the ship, I assume they have some sort of tech to be more efficient than that, but that would still be a decent amount of space already written off like that

[north ferry]

Considering this is the distant future where humanity has spread across the solar system. Easily scale up from what our human mind think is big.

[stiff fable]

Right but New York City also doesn't use vertical space

Ever heard of the Walled City of Kowloon?

[brittle siren]

so unless DE suck at adjusting size, Zariman is small

[smoky solstice]

interesting point

idk

[wintry siren]

If I may, the main theme of warframe I’ve seen is to meet indifference with live and compassion. Wally, drifter, and albrecht when introduced, are clearly indifferent characters, be it in name, practice, or behavior. Albrecht hasn’t been able to connect with anyone properly for a very long time, since he went to the void, the man in the wall being indifference, and the drifter repeatedly dying only to start healing after the new war.

Albrecht hasn’t taken note of this, wanting drifter to do what he can’t and meet the man in the wall with compassion with this being directly but not clearly expressed with the end of the whispers in the wall quest as the giant vessel we control via transference tenderly meets the vessel the man in the wall possesses.

I suspect that the man in the wall is like dominos Thrax, a scared child who doesn’t want to be alone. But unlike Thrax, the man in the wall is alone, and has nothing to lose if he lets loose on everything.

Drifter is one of the few characters in warframe that can meet indifference with compassion, and the one that allows the audience to learn how that works

[stiff fable]

Also like I said, Orokin structures were larger on the inside than out

[smoky solstice]

you could be right, maybe I am just not able to fathom that many people on a spaceship

and it's actually legit

[smoky solstice]

yeah idk what you mean by this

like some sort of magic or just some sort of illusion

[stiff fable]

space magic

[brittle siren]

or it could be void magic

[stiff fable]

Your orbiter is larger inside than the size of the ship

[brittle siren]

ever read Doraemon

[brittle siren]

actually the orbiter size is pretty accurate

[stiff fable]

Not including the back part

[smoky solstice]

so what's the trick

[stiff fable]

course the only frontal view we get is from the Drifter's camp

[stiff fable]

Until you can visualize a tessaract there's not any way to explain it

Except in like magic terms, the ship's a bag of holding

[stiff fable]

You can take a ten foot pole and shove it into a one foot bag

[brittle siren]

anything related to the void instantly illogical compare to irl laws of physic

[stiff fable]

I feel I have to point out that ship design never actually made it into the game because it couldn't possibly fit the cave in the Drifter's camp

[smoky solstice]

so it uses 4d shenanigans?

[stiff fable]

more or less

[glacial bough]

There isn't meeting Wally with compassion. He's a being that actively causes and thrives on discord

[north ferry]

I mean, we have yet to see.

[brittle siren]

do you know that they use the same design on earth star chart right?

[glacial bough]

Albrecht is well aware about Drifter's empathy, it's the entire purpose of setting of 1999

[peak ether]

D’you think he’s in the wf discord?

[wintry siren]

I disagree with not meeting Wally with compassion but I see where you’re coming from

[stiff fable]

I remember that being a different design?

[peak ether]

There’s at least 10 Wallys in this discord

[wintry siren]

Who would win, Wally or witness

[stiff fable]

Wally

[wintry siren]

(My money is in Wally)

[lament stirrup]

Who's "witness"?

[stiff fable]

Remember, the difference between the 40K Warp and the Void is that the Warp is much safer

[brittle siren]

whoever make this image need to update lmao

[wintry siren]

The main antagonist of destiny

[lament stirrup]

Ah. I wouldn't know.

[brittle siren]

orbiter and the armada is collide lmao

[stiff fable]

lol yeah I was like "wait that's a razorback"

[wintry siren]

E prime

[stiff fable]

Honestly I kinda wish WF would do something interesting with Final Terminus

[stiff fable]

It was originally the last point on the star chart, maybe even the place where the relay to Tau was supposed to be

also hey yeah that is the same design, guess I was wrong

[wintry siren]

The orbiter confused me for a solid 8-9 years

Until like, Friday

[lament stirrup]

Isn't it on Mercury?

You know, it would ne incredibly cool if they made the "junction" for Tau the sun because of Ballas' shenanigans.

[stiff fable]

wait isn't there one on Pluto?

Also lol that'd be neat

[wintry siren]

Oh wait why are there like two relays destroyed?

[glacial bough]

THey were detroyed in the Eyes of Blight event

[stiff fable]

because PC players kept letting them get blown up

[wintry siren]

The what

[glacial bough]

And DE cut the difference when they merged the platforms

[stiff fable]

More seriously, when Formorians and Razorbacks were first introduced, they could and did actually destroy relays

[brittle siren]

Wally be like: let's reset the relay

[lament stirrup]

There was an event where the grineer started attacking relays.
The playerbase collectively refused to do it because they didn't think DE would really destroy the relays.
Guess what happened next.

[stiff fable]

Every console lost a different set

Other relays were destroyed in successive assaults

[brittle siren]

is it still able to destroy relay

[wintry siren]

Hold on, was it because the grind was bad?

[stiff fable]

Probably not tbh

Warframe was originally supposed to have more of a living story?

[lament stirrup]

No, I think it was just unionized stupidity combined with the debate-bro need to be "right".

The unique relays (I.E. the design with open fires and an ember statue) are the result of the relays being rebuilt.

[wintry siren]

Was this at a point in time when games didn’t change the game world?

[stiff fable]

Where players would advance the setting themselves by teaming up with different factions and fighting it out

[brittle siren]

btw are Prex canon in the game, because how Cyte is a secret frame and only been recreate in 1999 has a prex

[stiff fable]

Quite the opposite, Steve was looking at EVE Online

[stiff fable]

yeah totally, though I suspect the Prex numbers are for our own benefit

[lament stirrup]

Worm plays with a set of Prex in the cutscene hidden in Voruna's leverian.

[stiff fable]

But Warframes are already legendary figures, even the lost ones can have depictions floating around that no one recognizes as a Warframe

[brittle siren]

oh ok

[lament stirrup]

I think so? I don't know.

[stiff fable]

Like Koumei actually, her statue was literally just in Cetus and people thought it was a rock

[brittle siren]

make sense why Revenant does not have 1

[stiff fable]

I mean Ember didn't have a Prex until last year's Belly of the Beast update

[brittle siren]

unless Unum stir things up, again

[stiff fable]

that's why the numbers are non-canon but the prex are. Someone's going to whip one up for him.

[peak ether]

Speaking of, why does worm get to play with appropriately sized prex cards but we get gigantic ones as decoration

[lament stirrup]

You can size them down with the "scale" option.

[stiff fable]

Good question, especially since when we pick them up they're normal sized

[wintry siren]

I know it’s a weird question but I know there’s a lack of believe stuff like that when it’s not popular in said media like “they won’t kill the main character” and then boom, John Excalibur is dead on the ground

[stiff fable]

Media swings back and forth between "safe" and "brutal" all the time

[wintry siren]

My point exactly

[peak ether]

They’re still huge even when you make them as small as possible

[stiff fable]

Game of Thrones TV show, Attack on Titan and the like heralded a push for more lethal stories

[brittle siren]

also some Prex has "gold" material on the side

(mostly warframe prex)

[wintry siren]

Season 1 was brutal

[lament stirrup]

"Yeah, our story is realistic and mature!"

its just shock value

[wintry siren]

For GoT

[peak ether]

Did frost and mag get shiny prex cards as well?

[stiff fable]

Yeah the book was worse lol

[brittle siren]

nah

not even excal and volt

[stiff fable]

The heirlooms? Nah.

[peak ether]

Damn

[brittle siren]

worst Heirloom confirmed

[peak ether]

Less Fomo for me at least

[brittle siren]

Rhino Heirloom is just chef kiss

[humble sierra]

A Gwent-style Prex game would be insane

[brittle siren]

imagine Ember and Rhino Heirloom cards is exodia

[wintry siren]

EXODIA THE FORBIDDEN ONE

[lament stirrup]

When they finally reintroduce Worm, its going to a be a minigame where we play Prex for Kuva.

[stiff fable]

Real talk I want the 5e homebrew

[stiff fable]

It'd be extra funny if they got Brennan Lee Mulligan to run a session of it

[brittle siren]

I certainly do not thrist for him

[stiff fable]

https://tenor.com/view/arsequeef-aq-critical-role-crit-role-cr-gif-21503769

[wintry siren]

Oh that would be good

[brittle siren]

Styanax would be fitting for Heirloom if he not a new frame (and hard to farm)

[wintry siren]

I’m imagining Brennan Lee Milligan doing a dnd session at Höllivania now

[stiff fable]

He'd have been 10 at the time hahaha

[lament stirrup]

If they release a warframe boardgame it should be an economic simulator where you play as the Corpus trying to run a business while under fire from the Tenno.

[stiff fable]

that'd make a solid eurogame

[brittle siren]

also my headcanon is Heirloom frame is exclusively made for very rich Orokin

[stiff fable]

Goonokin

AKA First Descendent players

/rimshot

[wintry siren]

Oh…oh no. Knowing what the’ve done

[stiff fable]

I mean Dagath is right there

[brittle siren]

tbh I found DE fanservice is more reasonable than FD

[stiff fable]

oh 100%

[brittle siren]

they not rich so Ballas make a smiling face on her

[stiff fable]

still laughing about the guy who was like "I think both are equal" and then googled Bunny and was like "I was wrong"

[wintry siren]

That’s what I mean!!! AAAAAUUUGHH why must the lore be so

[stiff fable]

honestly, because people remember it

[wintry siren]

And I know it’s real but what couldn’t have been protoframe stuff only where it’s like “you want to hold hands”

[brittle siren]

I hate this already thanks