lore-discussion

[iron pond]

And the bomb didn’t kill him

[normal mountain]

Isn't Christopher dead long before the whole Techrot thing though?

[iron pond]

Its the helminth strain that hex have not just ordinary techrot

[normal mountain]

Yeah, but Albrecht didn't bring the Helminth strain until after the Techrot

[restive river]

^^^

[graceful swan]

Albrechts pitch: I can cure you of Infestation with a different Infestation

[wraith coral]

sooo...this is ukko???

[proper barn]

i mean eh

[wraith coral]

thanks god he has a mask.

[proper barn]

it just looks like random Ostron face

so no?

He would probably be older.

[wraith coral]

i... think kalymos is not feeling allright

[proper barn]

TAMBIEN

[winter geode]

do we know if light speed in warframe is the same as irl light speed?

the reason i ask is bc eleanor has a voice line about the stars looking completely different because so much time has passed which assuming light speed is still lightspeed and basic astronomical rules means a lot more than the estimated thousand-ish years has passed since since modern time

[sly pagoda]

Their brightness could change due to being farther away by our normal time.

[winter geode]

the brightness didnt change, their position changed

[sly pagoda]

I doubt shes meaning things like red shifted

[winter geode]

i mean if you just take it at face value it means the stars have changed position because time has elapsed and thats what stars do

[strange turtle]

Do you mean a Gemini voiceline?

[winter geode]

the thing im asking about is that stars dont really change very noticably in the course of ~1000 years

[winter geode]

its one of the random voicelines you get by talking to eleanor if shes in the backroom

[sly pagoda]

Its been way more than 1000 years between 1999 and whatever it is in current timeline

Id estimate many thousands of years possibly even tens of thousands.

[graceful swan]

10k is right

[strange turtle]

Yeah, the 1000 year estimate is between the end of the Orokin era and the Warframe modern era

[winter geode]

ohh

[graceful swan]

1k was the us murdering the Orokin and now

[winter geode]

so 1999 then about 9k years then old war then about 1k years?

[proper barn]

I don't think anyone thought it was 1k years

It's been like over 100k probably

[feral cape]

We don't know

[sly pagoda]

In the grim dark future of the 41st millennium there is only a brightly colored Warframe wiping out your platoon with a variety of war crimes. 😉

While riding a hover board

[winter geode]

yeah thats mb i thought it was 1k years from modern time to like the radiation wars and stuff

[feral cape]

The only thing we know the collapse -> modern era is 1k years

[winter geode]

so we dont know how far ahead of 1999 the orokin era is?

[sly pagoda]

Nope. We just know its way in the future

[graceful swan]

Didn't the comic say the Orokin changed history for the next 10k years

[sly pagoda]

Which comic?

[graceful swan]

1999 comic

[sly pagoda]

That could mean their empire lasted that long.

[restive river]

“Höllvania dhall chart the course of human history for ten thousand years.”

[obsidian sparrow]

Hi I recently finished the duiviri paradox after returning to it from a while back and I am having trouble remembering what happened earlier on and also understanding the lore of it in its entirety

[proper barn]

what specific questions do you have?

some answers might be "you will learn later" or "we don't know"

[obsidian sparrow]

Mainly like what is the duiviri world

[proper barn]

okay Duviri is world made by the drifter based on a book they had.

the book was written by mother and that's why she is the narrator

[obsidian sparrow]

And the drifter is a different version of the operator right like all the multi verse stuff

[humble sierra]

Yeah basically. New War goes into more detail.

[obsidian sparrow]

Yeah I haven't played the new war yet because my nechramech is Still crafting

[humble sierra]

Yeah be sure to mod your Railjack for speed and get some slightly stronger guns for the RJ

The rest doesn't matter, it's all set to your level

[obsidian sparrow]

K thanks

[manic mason]

got to make a question for the lore experts, cause I made a topic about it on reddit but I doubt it will go anywhere xD

we know that the game references mythologies on many things, but one is making me go ???? and is about the... finger from the void

is it a reference from anything?

on the topic i made i mentioned about a video I watched about the "digging" of a human finger that turned out to be a fake, but was something creationists used as trying to prove "noah geology" or something like that

if the void makes our feelings/desires true, Entrati thought he could pull something useful, yet scary, from it, which would be encarnating that concept in the form of the Finger

dunno if I am into something or not and the reference turns out to be from some mythology I have skimmed and not noticed

[lean garden]

Sometimes humans can come up with stories independent of mythologies

[humble sierra]

It could be a reference to that one painting of God and Man about to touch fingertips?

[manic mason]

hm maybe, but instead Entrati cut it...xD

[humble sierra]

Well, people shouldn't play around doors, that's how they lose fingers

[manic mason]

it can, but now we are getting the whole mesoamerica stuff that was teased years ago apparently so...

[humble sierra]

This one is on Wally

[lean garden]

?

[manic mason]

the Lettie chat where she goes absolutely nuts when we reference one of the old codex entries, that are actually from center/south american mythology

[lean garden]

No I get that, but what do you mean "teased years ago"

There are like several leaps this past conversation

[humble sierra]

There was a line that Lettie was freaking out over

I'm guessing that was a line said years ago

[manic mason]

yeah it is documented in some old topics, apparently way way back from The Second Dream

how even the whole "womb in the sky" concept came from it

[lean garden]

You need to show the line in question

[manic mason]

a more recent topic

https://www.reddit.com/r/Warframe/comments/1ht9xjx/as_a_reminder_of_the_new_strange/

[humble sierra]

Drifter: I'm not sure. But the Sentients have said some cryptic things.
Lettie: ¿Cómo qué? ¿Like what?
Drifter: "Merely framed Merely shaped they are called. There was no their mother, there was no their father."
Lettie: ¡¿QUÉ?! WHAT DID YOU JUST SAY?! WAIT WAIT WAIT WAIT WAIT WAIT
Lettie: ¿POR QUÉ? why are creatures from the far future quoting ¿a los PUEBLOS ANTIGUOS? ¿Qué chingados está pasando ahora?

Drifter: Lettie you've lost me again. Back up.
Lettie: AGGHHHH this makes NO SENSE Those words are the words of the ancient people of Chichén Itzá. WHERE DID YOU GET THEM?!
Lettie: THOSE ARE FROM A SACRED TEXT OF LOS PUEBLOS ANTIGUOS "¡¿CÓMO Y POR QUÉ!?"
Drifter: I - I don't - I don't know. I have no clue. I'd only be guessing.
Lettie: I do not drink But if I did now would be the time Aaayyyy this nonsense gets worse and worse every day

[stiff fable]

Yeah they quote the Popol Vuh in New Strange/Second Dream

Hushed and empty is the womb in the sky

[stiff fable]

I think I actually do know the inspiration for this

Talked about it a few days ago

[manic mason]

there that was the book, Popol Vuh, the old topic was this one

https://forums.warframe.com/topic/435490-popol-vuh-and-the-the-sentient-link-lore-speculation/

wayyyy way back on 2015 indeed

[stiff fable]

In Catholic tradition, relics and reliquaries are pieces of holy items, like the Cross, the nails, or objects belonging to saints

Most sacred of all are the bodies of the saints. Saint Francis for example kicked off a small war over his corpse when he died

[manic mason]

right we got a lot of saint parts and stuff like that, even Saint Nicholas got desecrated and separated in places of commerce

[stiff fable]

That exactly

Now here's the thing: there's a lot of extra pieces floating around

Like, you could build Noah's Ark out of all the nails and fragments of the cross enshrined in churches

According to Catholic tradition though, they're all real, because real relics can multiply themselves

[lament stirrup]

Hey. Thats terrifying.

[stiff fable]

Wally's finger is the key to void travel without a solar rail. There's a copy in the Railjack, there's a copy in the Zariman.

And it's called the Reliquary Drive.

[manic mason]

yeah the Reliquary name gives it out indeed

[stiff fable]

It's very likely that finding and defending the original will be a part of this arc of the story

Because if Wally ever gets it back he won't need to rely on the Murmur and the Fragmented One to scout ahead for him, he'll just be able to reach into reality at will

[manic mason]

we had a mission in the Zariman's Angels of Armageddon already right?

[stiff fable]

The finger in the Zariman is another copy, thankfully

Yonta mentions she's seen Wally hanging out around it

[tall echo]

Can the copies provide nutrition

[stiff fable]

borrowing her body for it ofc

Doesn't seem like it

[lament stirrup]

Hey, this is worse. /j

[manic mason]

I would guess you would end up like those smart guys that drank the kuva current on Duviri

[tall echo]

[stiff fable]

Messing with the copies turns you into a void angel after all

Have you seen how anorexic those guys are

You can see right through them

[tall echo]

Only if you're already a pure construct like the holdfasts

[stiff fable]

I mean, if you think about it, there's a ghost inside you next to your skeleton

[lament stirrup]

Wh
What do you mean next to my skeleton?

[manic mason]

it's best that we just see the void envelope and not their remains... cause Drifter's "neutral" account of their parents "wearing" their limbs uuuuuhhhh

[tall echo]

The difference is that the holdfasts are completely made of void

[stiff fable]

When someone dies their body instantly loses like 3oz of mass. What else could that be

[lament stirrup]

Yes but
Why is it adjacent to my bones and not inside them?

[tall echo]

Not enough space

[stiff fable]

Bones don't have any spa--beaten

[fathom ridge]

We have bone marrow

[lament stirrup]

Are you implying ghosts are made of bone marrow.

[fathom ridge]

Maaaaybe

[manic mason]

bone marrow, ectoplasm, potato, pohtatoeh

[lean garden]

The conspicuously fart-shaped ghost standing next to my corpse:

[polar bobcat]

Your ghost shimmies out of your body like The Thing

[stiff fable]

https://tenor.com/view/thingu-the-thing-pingu-gif-18748365

[manic mason]

sorry I dont remember that episode of Pingu what

[stiff fable]

Look up Thingu on Youtube

[manic mason]

...oh!

[stiff fable]

YouTube's been trying to kill it for two decades lol

[manic mason]

my memory did apparently xD

[lusty vigil]

Anyone think the Man In The Wall is just half of Entrati. Hence why he exhibits human emotion and even decided to forgo Continuity?

[lean garden]

half in what sense

[lament stirrup]

The implication that Entrati's soul getting split in half made him a better person is hilarious, and also entirely consistent with the Orokin.

[humble sierra]

He decided to forgo Continuity out of fear that he was not actually Albrecht, his encounter with MITW basically made him insane

[lusty vigil]

Maybe the Man In The Wall is just the Man in the Mirror.

[digital heath]

My favorite implication of this is that apparently his daughter was like, "Hell yeah, bring on that immortality from questionable means!"

[lusty vigil]

And Rell, is us.

[lament stirrup]

Thats objectively not correct.

[lusty vigil]

Now, that's reaching

[lament stirrup]

Rell is explicitly a seperate character with his own childhood and parents.

[graceful swan]

But we kill Rell

[lament stirrup]

Technically Rell was already dead. We just break open his warframe.

[graceful swan]

We let the soul truly die

[lusty vigil]

The Indifference had someone to relate to.

And then, we caused him to go away.

[lament stirrup]

Rell was fighting the indifference.

[graceful swan]

We still aren’t Rell

[lusty vigil]

I already conceded that.

[graceful swan]

No you didn’t

[lusty vigil]

Here I did.

[fathom ridge]

I wouldn't say we "killed" Rell. More like we set his soul free and take the burden of being responsible with the indifference as the last thing he was concerned about was who will keep the man the wall at bay.

[lusty vigil]

Was Rell fighting him, or helping him stay calm despite the Orokin yanking pieces off of him.

[graceful swan]

Rell was keeping Wally at bay

[lusty vigil]

By keeping him company

[lean garden]

I dont think what eventually happened to rell is an indication that he was keeping wally calm

[graceful swan]

He wasn’t keeping Wally company

[fathom ridge]

Keeping him at bay whilst being tormented by Wally unfortunately

[humble sierra]

https://tenor.com/view/smile-gif-25512686

[lament stirrup]

What evidence do you have for this theory?

[graceful swan]

He was literally just keeping Wally from getting to us

[fathom ridge]

Definitely not company 💀

[humble sierra]

Yeah Rell was absolutely getting tormented

[lusty vigil]

Gonna go listen to the dialogue again.

[graceful swan]

Nothing in the dialogue states keeping Wally company

[lusty vigil]

Says you

[fathom ridge]

Him being tormented was a lot worse compared to Wally popping out of nowhere and say "hey kiddo ✌️"

[graceful swan]

I’ve replayed the quest 6 times

Read the dialogue another 15

Nothing states that

Rell comic he noticed Wally was different but Rell didn’t keep Wally company

[lusty vigil]

Nothing stated a fight.

[lament stirrup]

Gonna go ahwad and say this isn't how you talk about your extradimensional pals.

Why
Why does the screenshot look like that.

[lean garden]

did you screenshot your screenshot lmao

no thats the image editing interface not lens

[humble sierra]

Pfffft who said it was lens? That person is a total idiot

[lament stirrup]

WHAT IS EVIL BUT INDIFFERENCE
Gonna go ahead and say these constitute fighting words.

[graceful swan]

Wally 100 tortured Rell until Wally got free

[lusty vigil]

I think you guys are wrong here.

[graceful swan]

Prove it

[fathom ridge]

Alright, why is it that we are wrong?

[humble sierra]

Ok, there's provided evidence that suggests it was combative, can you provide evidence to suggest otherwise?

[graceful swan]

Don’t say things with nothing to back it up after it was just backed up

There’s no dialogue to suggest they are friends lol

Even if Wally said it that’s Wally being a troll

[fathom ridge]

Rap tap tap over and over and over ain't something friends would say to one another for centuries.

[graceful swan]

The quests theme was horror not friendship

[fathom ridge]

You legit get to hear how scared Rell was

[graceful swan]

Rell was too scared to speak

[lament stirrup]

Well, can't argue with that. Time to pack up folks, I guess Rell's descent into insanity was completely unrelated to all that other stuff.

[graceful swan]

I think they are gonna look for the slightest shred of evidence but find nothing

The whole quest was Wally taking over Rells mind

[fathom ridge]

Rell was also very tired (can't blame him. When was the last time he slept?)

[graceful swan]

1000 years ago

[fathom ridge]

He made so many sacrifices

[feral cape]

Is this a wally isn't evil thing?

Im late to the party

[graceful swan]

No they think Rell and Wally were friends

[fathom ridge]

Someone trying to say that we're wrong about Wally not being evil I guess?

[feral cape]

Thats definitely not it

[fathom ridge]

Yeah friends

[plush phoenix]

i dont even know that wally has a concept of morality

like is a lion evil for hunting gazelles

[feral cape]

We are not food

[glacial bough]

The Internet continues to make people be loud and wrong with confidence

[graceful swan]

Even after the evidence from the quest they said we are wrong

[lament stirrup]

I mean. A lion is evil for making gazelles kill their own children and then manipulating those children into giving it a foothold into the material world.

[feral cape]

Wally isn't eating us also wally is aware he is hurting us for funsies

[fathom ridge]

Just said we are wrong and not explaining why we're wrong.

[feral cape]

A sense of morality doesn't make you not evil

If I believe what I am doing is right that doesn't actually make it right

[graceful swan]

It’s not even something you need to read the dialogue to figure out

[feral cape]

My favorite example being the hive
The hive believe all suffering should end

Thus they kill all that could suffer

[lament stirrup]

I'm pretty sure the infested want to assimilate all life, not kill it?

[lusty vigil]

Rell was keeping him distracted. But the MITW reminds me of Ballas a little.

[feral cape]

The hive are a thing in a different game

[fathom ridge]

Naaah don't compare Wally to Ballas 💀
Ballas mad that he fumbled a baddie/j

[lament stirrup]

Ah.

[graceful swan]

You still haven’t stated your evidence of why we are wrong

[lusty vigil]

He was like, "look at ARM!"

[lament stirrup]

Wow, thats not a coherent sentence.

[glacial bough]

The only similarity between the two is that they're self-serving

[fathom ridge]

Avoidance is getting stronger here

[lusty vigil]

He was like, "Look at My Arm!"

[graceful swan]

Dodging I see

[lament stirrup]

Alright, thats closer to communicating comprehensible information. Now this time, try starting out by explaining what your talking about.

[graceful swan]

I think they are still dodging finding evidence because it doesn’t exist

[fathom ridge]

I have no idea what you're talking about. Can you break it down a bit?

[lusty vigil]

Ballas fumbled a baddie. Orokin have one long arm.

He shows it off thinking it would impress.

[uneven solar]

Guys who was like the man in the wall on the end of new war

[feral cape]

You're on the money

[fathom ridge]

You mean the orokin long arm fashion?

[lament stirrup]

What does any of this have to do with the Man in The Wall?

[fathom ridge]

It really doesn't

Bro is just dodging the question

[lusty vigil]

Inferences from the dialogue.

[feral cape]

What dialog

[hasty eagle]

Hey. Hey. Anyone get that conversation with Eleanor of what happen to her grandmother by the hands of her father?

[glacial bough]

I did, yes

[hasty eagle]

I found that sad.

[glacial bough]

It is. A terrible mercy

[hasty eagle]

Because she wasn't going to get better?

[glacial bough]

She was not

[hasty eagle]

I forgot the name of the grandmother's condition but it is real last I looked online.

Similar to dimentia somewhat.

[glacial bough]

iirc it's Alzheimer's

[hasty eagle]

The descriptions is exactly like that of my grandmother as we chat.

[lament stirrup]

Why didn't he just make her a Cephalon? Was he stupid or something? /j

[hasty eagle]

I wish the father could of found some other way, unless they were too stressed already?

Eleanor asked if there was a cure in the future. I don't remember my answers.

[glacial bough]

There isn't anything you can do for Alzheimer's other than put them into care

[fathom ridge]

Nursing homes

[hasty eagle]

This was far in the past.

[fathom ridge]

They were joking

[hasty eagle]

Oh.

Sorry I was locked in.

[graceful swan]

Rells tired

[quartz sky]

There's new Montessori strategies for Alzheimer's but there's no cure or medical treatment

[hasty eagle]

My brain focuses one at a time.

[glacial bough]

Ah, double checking for legally distinct Alzheimer's name, it's Pelham's Syndrome

[hasty eagle]

I might of told Eleanor yes, but I am not sure if the future has any cure... especially how much is changed

[lament stirrup]

Suda also has Alzheimers. From what I understand, becoming a Cephalon halted the degeneration but didn't undo the damage.

[glacial bough]

The Orokin definitely (should) have a cure

[hasty eagle]

I forgot about that

[glacial bough]

They just wouldn't share it

[quartz sky]

Their "cure" was significantly extending their lifespans and aging

[hasty eagle]

Suda was once mortal

I feel bad about her condition

[lament stirrup]

Or just stealing a healthier body.

[glacial bough]

All cephs were, yes

[hasty eagle]

But not fixing the brain

Hmm?

[quartz sky]

Nope

[hasty eagle]

Like the government?

[quartz sky]

Medically it's pretty complicated

[glacial bough]

Loid is just a straight up AI

[lament stirrup]

I said the Necraloid was never a human cephalon, but then it occurred to me that he might not actually be a Cephalon. Given that his body is metal instead of glass.

[hasty eagle]

So even in the future you can't fix what is already done

I was sad reading Eleanor's story

[quartz sky]

Some things are so complicated we may never fix completely

[north jolt]

I thought Necraloid was something similar to a Cephalon at first, but then Whispers came along so I guess Necraloid is just a copy implanted into a skullbot

[hasty eagle]

Eleanor is concerned Arthur would do the same if needed on her

[glacial bough]

As I said. The Orokin almost certainly could. But why would they ever share it with lesser thans

[quartz sky]

I mean, he would probably survive the zombie apocalypse for a reason

[hasty eagle]

Warframe is so full of fascinating moments

[quartz sky]

He is also a soldier

[quartz sky]

Oh for sure, that's why I'm in here and not just playing

[north jolt]

Also I know this trope exists in a lot of fiction, even a lot of scifi, but the Orokin being able to transfer their consciousness to new/different bodies imply that they actually know and can quantify what the human consciousness even is

[hasty eagle]

Faaaacts... like... it's so realistic because it's the same in real life no?

[hasty eagle]

Not the futuristic part

[north jolt]

On top of how to basically rip it out of the physical body and put it into a new one

[quartz sky]

I think about fortuna all the time

Ripping organic parts from the lower class

[hasty eagle]

Glass Cephalon were punishment partly? Look at THE BEAST OF BONES

our lovely Ordis

[lament stirrup]

Gara was also meant to be a Cephalon, but Ballas opted to make her into a glass warframe instead.

[north jolt]

Why the head thing tho? I mean I KNOW the stated reason why, but then shouldn't all of their limbs be prosthetic for that same reason? because on most of them the limbs are at least visibly organic

[hasty eagle]

I'd date Ducky... but the whole stomach head I'd need adjustment to

[north jolt]

Also what do they even do with all of the adominal organs in order to make room for the head?

[hasty eagle]

Do I kiss her head down there?

[north jolt]

And the ribcage?

[lament stirrup]

I assume they're sold for parts?

[north jolt]

How are these people even still alive?

[quartz sky]

Organic parts are a symbol of the upper class, modding them esp

[lament stirrup]

... science.

[north jolt]

I don't think anyone in Solaris is particularly upper class though, plus wouldnt the organic limbs, by the game's own logic, just freeze off?

[hasty eagle]

Future science

[fathom ridge]

Science

[lament stirrup]

Corpus might also incorporate biotechnology underneath the metal, if the offputtingly shapely thighs of Moas are any indication.
And also the mutalists but mostly that first thing.

[graceful swan]

Science Prime

[hasty eagle]

Doctor Who type science

[quartz sky]

Oh no, they just held onto what they can as long as they can I think

[north jolt]

Like before I got that revelation, I thought they were basically just brains in jars. Piloting mechanical/cyborg bodies on "rental" until they can fully restore their humanity (if ever)

[quartz sky]

I feel like the heads go first so they can be programmed into workers

In the same sense that cephalons are partially programmed

[lament stirrup]

I mean, they technically are brains in jars. Its just that the jar in question is their entire head.

[north jolt]

I read somewhere though that the specific reason the heads get encapsulated is to protect them from the harsh cold of Venus

[north jolt]

Well ,their entire abdomen actually

[hasty eagle]

People in Fortuna? Apparently it's like Iron Man, they have a lit UI display in their stomach housing

[fathom ridge]

Head in the stomach woo

[north jolt]

Why head in stomach if organic limbs no freeze off?

[hasty eagle]

Ducky is a baddie

[hasty eagle]

...complicated science

[north jolt]

Limbs dont freeze off, but head freeze off? I am confusion

[fathom ridge]

Agree...I need her badly 😔

[quartz sky]

Agreed

[hasty eagle]

DE, let us date Fortuna people.

[fathom ridge]

Dibs on Duck/j

[hasty eagle]

Any of us would be able

[fathom ridge]

Or legs

[hasty eagle]

...?

[fathom ridge]

Legs 👁️👁️

[hasty eagle]

I'm sure she has... nice-- I'm not finishing that sentence

I'm not a goon

[lament stirrup]

Thursby? The moa guy? The guy who gives your first quest? The guy who the entire Fortuna introductory questline centers on?

[lament stirrup]

Me explaining to da boss that I'm actually a henchmen.

[quartz sky]

From the wiki

Due to the bodily reconfiguration Solari augments cause, most Solari no longer possess traditional lungs and stomachs, and thus, are unable to eat in the traditional sense. Instead most heavily augmented Solari consume nutrient canisters through the use of gastronomy seals.

Less augmented Solari, such as the children, still possess traditional digestive tracts, and instead consume energy bars and canned fish.

[fathom ridge]

Nah Legs is his own character

[hasty eagle]

He's charismatic

[lament stirrup]

Hey, I hate the phrase "gastronomy seals"

[quartz sky]

The Solari are indentured workers with augmented robotic organs and limbs for performing physical labor and enduring harsh working environments.

[hasty eagle]

The one who gives you bounties to do in Fortuna is not a woman?

[north jolt]

Well that answers one of my questions at least

[quartz sky]

There's multiple who give you bounties

[drifting mirage]

Legs gives you your introduction to Fortuna

[hasty eagle]

The main one... bad at names

[quartz sky]

Very limited lore tbh

[fathom ridge]

Even kids gives you some missions

[drifting mirage]

Before he becomes Legs

[hasty eagle]

I forgot his name was Legs

Do they not have normal names?

[hasty eagle]

Yareli!

[quartz sky]

Eudico

[fathom ridge]

Best girl

[drifting mirage]

Thursby before the Corpus get to him again. Legs is his cover name after i think

[quartz sky]

Eudico: "Ugly thing, repossession. A Solaris falls too deep in debt, and Nef sends in his repo squads to take what he says he's owed. You know, mechanical body parts, even a full rig. In Thursby's case, cause he got none of that, they take the organics: arms and legs. Yeah, there's a market for those, too."

[hasty eagle]

They lose their old names? Didn't he have memory loss?

[quartz sky]

He changed his name to escape his debt

[hasty eagle]

oooooooh

[fathom ridge]

He does remember his name, he openly told us that he'll call himself legs- not cause he's just legs.

[hasty eagle]

So they're the way they are because of payment

[quartz sky]

And debt because the corpus stink

[lament stirrup]

No, Legs is a nickname because the Corpus sawed all his limbs off and the Solaris only had Moa parts to replace them.

[hasty eagle]

This is why every higher up rich wigs need to die

[lament stirrup]

How does he build robots without arms, anyway?

[hasty eagle]

ALL OF THEM

Alad V though...

Why do I want Alad V to uncle my kid?

[hasty eagle]

Limbs they add to themselves by other people for assistance

[quartz sky]

For the FBI this is in the game I swear

[fathom ridge]

I would never trust Alad V with any of my phantom kids.

[hasty eagle]

Lol

[drifting mirage]

I refer to him as uncle Alad as a joke tbh

[hasty eagle]

Great name for Drifter's future kids

[lament stirrup]

I will now gleefully reuse my own joke.

[drifting mirage]

He's the creepy uncle boy the good uncle though

[hasty eagle]

Phantom Kids

Drifter's child.

[fathom ridge]

Phantom kids wooo

[hasty eagle]

[fathom ridge]

And it's just a small version of the protoframe's Warframe.

[hasty eagle]

I'm ready for in-game Drifter parenthood if there's a timeskip

[lament stirrup]

Duplex Bond for the Protoframes when? /j

[fathom ridge]

I should draw a silly nine months only for my kid to look like their stupid mom/dad at some point

[hasty eagle]

Sorren's Warframe son is still a mystery

Will he grow?

[fathom ridge]

Definitely grow

[hasty eagle]

I would love helping taking care of Stalkers son

[fathom ridge]

Warframes aren't 100% metal

They're fleshy sometimes

[fathom ridge]

....like disturbingly fleshy

[hasty eagle]

Mixture of Orikin flexible flesh material

[fathom ridge]

LMAO I need to save that

[hasty eagle]

Or whatever

Amir looking like a happy dog

[fathom ridge]

Infestation flesh woo

[quartz sky]

I feel like orokin cells aren't power cells but contain some organic cells

[fathom ridge]

Imagine rebirthing a warframe smh

[hasty eagle]

If they ever did some sort of "You have a kid, name him/her." how would that work?

Especially if a guy dating Amir

I ask the hard questions

[lament stirrup]

Flashback to the Operator/Drifter's parents /j

[tall echo]

0%, actually

[hasty eagle]

That's a good tool to use

Giving a flash back to the tenno being born

[fathom ridge]

Uhhh science yeah!

Sometimes I forget that the operator/drifter had parents.

[hasty eagle]

Soulframe has a mechanic supposedly letting you make your mother which in turn shapes your kid self

[lament stirrup]

Having played Soulframe.
I don't think so???

Unless its been mentioned on a devstream?

[fathom ridge]

Making your parents simulator

[hasty eagle]

Is it only on PC?

[lament stirrup]

Early access on PC. You need to sign up for a demo code.

[tall echo]

Same like ???

[lament stirrup]

There's no character creation beyond picking your gender and prosthetic arm atm.

[hasty eagle]

I hate not having a gaming PC

[tall echo]

L

[hasty eagle]

But yeah. Cool feature in introducing a Drifter's kid. Flashback to themselves born in their parent's arms

Then go from there

Then make a name...

DE could go any direction with future content

[fathom ridge]

That day after the drifter's parents did the boombaya, the drifter was born. So name yourself.

[hasty eagle]

I just noticed your name is basically a miracle

Amiracle

[fathom ridge]

Yeee ✌️

[hasty eagle]

Amir--

Clever.

[lament stirrup]

Amiracle, Amir'a catholic twin brother.

[hasty eagle]

Sign up on their website or could it be done through STEAM?

[lament stirrup]

Their website.

[tall echo]

Only on website

[lament stirrup]

Soulframe has no steam page.

[tall echo]

It's not on steam yet

[fathom ridge]

And we have Rima the evil twin/j

[hasty eagle]

We get prosthetic arms in Soulframe?

[tall echo]

One

[hasty eagle]

Did we lose our original arm maybe?

[lament stirrup]

The players character class is determined by the prosthetic they have equipped. There are three choices. I don't think I can specify what the three do without breaking TOS?

[fathom ridge]

Our twin ate our arm (I have no context)

[hasty eagle]

Imagine born with one arm, other is a gift.

[tall echo]

It wouldn't

[hasty eagle]

... I could imagine

[hasty eagle]

I guess not

[hasty eagle]

Fair fair I don't want you in trouble

[fathom ridge]

Stalker refers to us by our username and sends an email to us so... we're determined by our username I guess.

[hasty eagle]

Interesting

-# YOUR ACTIONS HAVE CONSEQUENCES

[molten lily]

Lore question, how does the stalker message us in the first place?

[lament stirrup]

The Grineer doxxed our email

[hasty eagle]

Yeah

[molten lily]

Wait, really?

[fathom ridge]

Who knows

[lament stirrup]

No, I just thought that would be funny.

[fathom ridge]

He's a stalker for a reason/j

[hasty eagle]

Stalker was like "Thanks guys. Now to email."

[lament stirrup]

Although, its does make sense since the Liset is in Grineer custody during the tutorial.

[hasty eagle]

Stalker blames tenno originally for all the destruction they were controlled for?

[molten lily]

Also, on Caliban, did Ballas have any strong feelings on said Warframe. His response to Revenant was can be summed up by this meme, I know.

[tall echo]

How do the enemy factions message us after invasions? How does hunhow message us? Varzia, simaris, arthur?

[lament stirrup]

"BOUNTY
1MILLION KREDIT AND DETONIT CONTINER FOR TENNO SKOOM HEAD. THANK U"

[hasty eagle]

I don't know either.

[molten lily]

Rev’s is with his prime trailer.

[tall echo]

Only primes get narrated trailers

[hasty eagle]

That meme fits.

[hasty eagle]

Rev is not Prime yet?

[tall echo]

Well, they're trying to take it, they don't have it

[hasty eagle]

Cephalon Scrap. How did you become Cephalon?

[lament stirrup]

https://youtu.be/3HD6rfvMOgk?si=pYS6Xuas-0MoHXNY

[tall echo]

Caliban.

[hasty eagle]

Oh.

[tall echo]

Long story, but I bully nihil for it to this day

[lament stirrup]

Praying for Tauforged Caliban. Or at least Erra narrating the trailer.

[hasty eagle]

Player: "The hell is Tau?"

[tall echo]

I have his oubliette submerged in my helminth

[hasty eagle]

Scrap is such a specific name for a Cephalon

[tall echo]

Everyone except the ignorant wukongs and stuff know what tau is

[lament stirrup]

I keep his oubliette next to my Operator chair.
Which means he was probably there the whole time Lotus was being resurrcted and completely bewildered.

[hasty eagle]

Wukong: "Leave me out of this."

[tall echo]

Wukong is like a magnet for the players that ignore the story

[hasty eagle]

Should I not have Wukong?

[lament stirrup]

I injected Warcry over Wukong's 1 and build for his 4

[hasty eagle]

Farming for Wukong Prime.

[lament stirrup]

Wukong is just sterotyped as a frame for dumb players because his 1 summons a specter to play for.you.

[fathom ridge]

Idk anything about the Wukong drama. Could someone please tell me about it like I'm about to be tucked in bed waiting for a bedtime story at 9:30am ?

[tall echo]

You can have wukong, it's just that the majority of wukong players are... misplaced

[lament stirrup]

When your most popular ability is worse than a gear wheel item.

[tall echo]

The overlap between wukong mains and players that got stuck in tnw because it requires actual skill is probably quite large

[hasty eagle]

When I was in The First Desendant server many other people would be in VC like "Wukong is better than this garbage, play Wukong fam! Don't be a loser!"

And I'm like "Good for you, go away."

[molten lily]

General question, is Gara prime worth it?

[tall echo]

Yes

[hasty eagle]

Yip

[fathom ridge]

I- Wukong players were that bad 💀

[tall echo]

And he can just bypass most things with his cloud, has three free lives

[hasty eagle]

Many talk a lot of crap

(Wukong game right?)

[tall echo]

Wukong frame

[fathom ridge]

Frame

[hasty eagle]

...? Oh that

[tall echo]

Idc about the game

[hasty eagle]

I've met a lot of Wukong game degenerates

What makes Wukong the Warframe so bad?

[fathom ridge]

I don't think this should be in lore discussion

Hate to be that person to say this

[hasty eagle]

Going back to Warframe specifically

[tall echo]

Soulslikes attract bad people too. Left the largest soulsborne server because it was more toxic than a mission with a full saryn squad

[quartz sky]

Tnw?

[lament stirrup]

Well yeah, Saryn mostly deals corrosive damage /j.

[hasty eagle]

Wait so... Warframe Wukong is bad because people rush through stuff with him?

[tall echo]

It just doesn't require brain cells to play

[hasty eagle]

Ah okay

[tall echo]

The new war

[hasty eagle]

I didn't think any required specific styles?

[quartz sky]

Ahhh right. I think I was on Excalibur umbra then

[lament stirrup]

The New War has simple puzzels, the bane of all gamers.

Also stealth sections that boil down to glorified "wait a second for the guard to pass by" segments.

[hasty eagle]

No problem, I wuv you Amirrrrrr

[tall echo]

Stealth and actually difficult bosses

[fathom ridge]

I love tnw puzzles! (Please end me.)

[quartz sky]

I love puzzles too ngl

[hasty eagle]

(No.)

[fathom ridge]

Awww wuv you too 🫶

[quartz sky]

But this is also the lore group so I think there's a nerdy overlap

[hasty eagle]

I like puzzles even if I groan annoyed.

[tall echo]

I'm an extreme nerd but I like to believe that I have at least some skill

[quartz sky]

Nerds usually care enough to research and develop necessary skills

[hasty eagle]

Hmm. Koumei needs more skins.... come on. Come on! And some lore expansion.

[tall echo]

I did play through most of ds1 and all of eldering at least once

[quartz sky]

That def takes skills

[hasty eagle]

Am I the only one occasionally playing Koumei?

[tall echo]

Give it time, she's one of the newest frames

[molten lily]

Sike, they were a mature green dragon, roll initiative.

[hasty eagle]

True.

[hasty eagle]

I'm not a dragon.

[fathom ridge]

Nat twenty 😏(one)

[hasty eagle]

There's a shape shifting dragon?

[tall echo]

I rolled a 1

[hasty eagle]

Are we playing a board game?

I roll 4

[tall echo]

I actually rolled a 1

[lament stirrup]

🎲

[fathom ridge]

Dnd

[quartz sky]

I got a 4 for initiative

[hasty eagle]

Dang

Went from lore to fable and dragons

[molten lily]

When you’re playing a ttrpg but Komei is the DM (she always fudges the roles).

[quartz sky]

A great dm fudges rolls

[hasty eagle]

Oh Koumei is fable master

[tall echo]

I wish I could actually play dnd

[molten lily]

Then Koumei must be Matt Mercer incarnate.

[fathom ridge]

Same

[quartz sky]

I haven't dmed in a few years but I have some things written

[hasty eagle]

Get a group together and you can

I'd join

[quartz sky]

Me too

[fathom ridge]

Me too

[hasty eagle]

If you have time I mean

[lament stirrup]

Like a hellscrubber becoming a Babau, a DnD group has spontaneously germinated.

[quartz sky]

We could always do a text based game. I used to do a lot of that type back in the day

[hasty eagle]

-# Mee 3

[quartz sky]

Does this discord have a dice roller?

[fathom ridge]

Yup

[tall echo]

I am in a group organized by a discord friend but it's kinda stuck in session -1(nothing is happening)

[hasty eagle]

Imagine DE making a table top DnD Amir edition

[quartz sky]

Lol

[hasty eagle]

Or something

[molten lily]

Ngl, a Warframe TTRPG sounds sick

[quartz sky]

That'd be cool

[molten lily]

Let’s crowdfund it.

[hasty eagle]

[quartz sky]

Character sheets based on the warframes

[fathom ridge]

Imagine drifter ended up doing art commissions for the DnD characters

[hasty eagle]

That's going to take time but worth it

[quartz sky]

But regardless, I could start a text based game if y'all want something chill. Just dm me if you're interested

It would be some reading

[hasty eagle]

And each Hex member has their own style according to their chosen class

...or however DE does it

• Eleanor the Trickster Rogue

• Amir the dashing Wizard

[quartz sky]

Aoi wanted to play something with animal companions lol

[fathom ridge]

Quincy the paladin

[quartz sky]

Either a hunter or a druid

[hasty eagle]

[fathom ridge]

Def druid

[quartz sky]

Hunter was always my favorite to play

[hasty eagle]

"Nef Anyo, the evil sorcerer power broker has teamed with Viktor the depressed one!"

[fathom ridge]

Man would love to but unfortunately we live in different timezones 😭

[hasty eagle]

I like reading.

[quartz sky]

That's why I was thinking text based! It can sit until the next person is ready to take their turn

[heady widget]

Any suggested lore videos for warframe that can explain it well

[hasty eagle]

Oh that might confuse things

Oh no

I HATE KEYBOARD

[quartz sky]

Lmao

[heady widget]

I say this because what i have watched,, played, and learned leaves me with so many questions

[hasty eagle]

I never used that word in years either

No need to

[quartz sky]

Unfortunately I haven't dug into lore videos yet

I kinda hoping the guy who used to do the destiny lore video essays picks up wf

[hasty eagle]

I'm not great at picking up lore videos often. And some on Warframe are years old.

Needs refreshing

[tall echo]

Orokin archives

[quartz sky]

If someone writes the essays I'll record them lol

[hasty eagle]

I'm surprised that one word mistake wasn't counted as blocked words

[fathom ridge]

I just read this chat for lore diving

[quartz sky]

Same

[tall echo]

Lore videos tend to be unreliable

[hasty eagle]

Eh

Not all are bad

[lament stirrup]

An astounding number of people mistake their opinions for facts.

[hasty eagle]

Yeah

[quartz sky]

Oop

[tall echo]

That's a good idea actually. I could set up a server

[quartz sky]

Count me in if you do! People used to play DND over email

[hasty eagle]

I however listen carefully when someone is making an opinion and they stress clearly that it's not fact.

But other people are like "Duh... see? He said it true!"

[quartz sky]

Takes a while but it's chill and casual

[hasty eagle]

As in those people turn brain off then complain later

[fathom ridge]

If its text based then I'm in (my net is slow sorry)

[hasty eagle]

(Mine is occasionally. Hopeless no more lizards makes my power box explode.)

...dumb lizard

[quartz sky]

I am the lizard in your power box gnawing on the wires

Mmmm tasty wires

[hasty eagle]

Nooooo

[quartz sky]

Spicy

[hasty eagle]

That previous one died so

Cooked

Zap-zap

[quartz sky]

Oh I'm cooked lmao

[hasty eagle]

Lore!

Tenshin

What we know so far?

[tall echo]

He's dead but not

[hasty eagle]

-# (I might fall asleep soon.)

[hasty eagle]

Ah yes. Good observation.

He's playing dead so he can chill in a cave.

[tall echo]

It's almost 5:30am for me but I woke up at 1 so I'm just. Here. Existing. And playing cyberpunk.

[fathom ridge]

Teshin Teshin a father or mentor we never know but all we know so far is that he's dead and alive/j

[hasty eagle]

11:28 PM here

Our timezones are so far.

[fathom ridge]

11:29 in the afternoon

[hasty eagle]

-# Tenshin Tenshin he's our man, if he's going senile, then he definitely needs sleep.

Didn't he attack us once in Duviri or was that Wally lurking?

[fathom ridge]

Nah that was not him

[hasty eagle]

Oh.

[tall echo]

Well, I'm gonna make that text game server, anyone who wants to join just react to this message with

[hasty eagle]

Indifference?

[tall echo]

Disguised duvidax

[fathom ridge]

Our lil man cave was invaded by one of Thrax's guard

[hasty eagle]

Oh that fooled me that time. I was playing then like "Chill! Chill grandpa!"

[fathom ridge]

Pffft

[hasty eagle]

I can't imagine Tenshin as senile, that'd make me sad.

[fathom ridge]

Grandpa would never hurt us I swear

[hasty eagle]

Nah fam... back to when Eleanor said her father did mercy on his mother, her grandmother.

Could they not afford a nursing home?

[glacial bough]

Nursing homes are kind of expensive

[fathom ridge]

Giving their backgrounds I doubt they could

Given

[hasty eagle]

Ah

[glacial bough]

Plus they'd need a home made for that kind of care

Depending on what else Pelham's does

[hasty eagle]

True...

I mean, me mum and I are handling my grandmother okay so far

I can't imagine wanting to put my hands on any family

[fathom ridge]

No one is able to care for grandma unfortunately

[hasty eagle]

Yeah, nursing home want to charge thousand of dollars to keep my grandmother in. Hell to that.

I'm not even rich.

[glacial bough]

Being real, the same sort of thing may have happened at whatever facility she would be in if she degenrates too far

[hasty eagle]

My gran has dimentia innit.

No escaping brainrot.

(Suddenly I'm British?)

Welp.

[fathom ridge]

Pfft

[molten lily]

I’d rather get it at the end of life than at the beginning 💀 (but hopefully not at all, it’s a really hard thing to manage for all parties involved.)

[hasty eagle]

Saying Eleanor would have to be put down one day if she loses herself to the techrot? Nah fam... I'm finding another way

I wonder if they'd age or eventually be Warframes

[quartz sky]

Elder care used to be entirely community based. Nursing homes and retirement homes are a fairly new invention (as far as human history)

Elderly used to even be feared and treated horribly

[tall echo]

Likely the latter

[hasty eagle]

That's sad.

Nobody's perfect

[quartz sky]

Lmao

[hasty eagle]

Why you laughing mate

[quartz sky]

Of course that's a very white eurocentric history. Every culture is different

[hasty eagle]

[molten lily]

?

[quartz sky]

Some cultures take pride in their treatment of family elders

[tall echo]

Rell really did suddenly become brit it seems

[hasty eagle]

Well I know some nursing homes in America don't always treat elderly nicely

[quartz sky]

Even the ones treated nicely aren't in great living conditions

[hasty eagle]

I just wish dimentia was slowed to a stop

[hasty eagle]

So... double edge sword

[quartz sky]

Such is the american way

The same architects that design our prisons design our schools and homes

Very corpus lol

[hasty eagle]

So what we goin' do? Would Drifter transference help keep Eleanor from losing her sanity moving foward?

[quartz sky]

Possibly yeah

[fathom ridge]

Definitely

[hasty eagle]

Like a temporary drug

[fathom ridge]

Me personally I'd do that

[molten lily]

How does this have anything to do with the Warframe lore?

Ngl, we might be going on a tangent now.

[quartz sky]

In the Warframe lore chat??? Neverrr

[hasty eagle]

Long as Wally stays the hell away. Wally laughs if you break up with Arthur that weirdo.

[fathom ridge]

Healthcare for El's grandma situation

[fathom ridge]

THAT CAN HAPPEN??

[hasty eagle]

Yes

[marble pewter]

Damnnn

Only Arthur?

[quartz sky]

Does he laugh if you break up with anybody or just Arthur?

[fathom ridge]

Hi mar!

[hasty eagle]

Unless edited I believe it's real for any Hex you break up with in backroom

[marble pewter]

Hi Amiracle!!

[hasty eagle]

Wally is EVERYWHERE fam

[tall echo]

Friend reqs sent to all reactees, gotta accept or I can't inv to the text rpg server

[marble pewter]

Huh interesting..goes along with the lore I suppose

[hasty eagle]

Oh okay

[molten lily]

Ngl, I wonder how crazy is the Void. Like, from inside of a glass bell (something tells me that for being a scientist, Albrecht was very stupid when it came to the materials with which he chose to create a vessel to study it.)

[hasty eagle]

Wally is rather powerful

...and annoying

[marble pewter]

Of course

[molten lily]

I guess you could say he’s giving us the finger (bad pun alert).

[proper barn]

It's glass so he can see.

Like what else would he use?

[hasty eagle]

Makes sense however Wally would be around to keep us on our toes innit

[molten lily]

A combination of elements. Glass is not that durable.

[hasty eagle]

[proper barn]

"Concrete diving bell" how would you see?

[proper barn]

How would he see anything?

[molten lily]

Have it only be partially made of glass

[marble pewter]

Wally likes to play mind games

[molten lily]

Or utilize cameras.

[lament stirrup]

I mean, it's very specifically called Seriglass, which is presumably a material akin to the glass Gara uses.

[hasty eagle]

Apparently in the future glass is a common scientific useful material aside from shattering

Quincy: "Wally looks like he lost his willy during containment. Albrecht snip it off?"

[molten lily]

Gara is not that durable. Legit she used herself as a bomb to blow up a sentient during the old war, thus causing the Eidolons.

Maybe in game she is, but I don’t think in lore that can be said the same.

[lament stirrup]

She didn't use herself as a bomb, she carried a bomb.

[hasty eagle]

I'm imagining Quincy saying this

[marble pewter]

Yea in his voice too

[molten lily]

Regardless of cause, the effect still led to her death. How much power could she reasonably withstand in lore if this is the only feat with which we can compare it to?

[lament stirrup]

Gara is technically in the lower half of warframes in terms of armor, but her splinter shards and glass walls are decently durable if they can put up with constant weapons fire.

[glacial bough]

This...very much ignores context

[molten lily]

That being?

[lament stirrup]

It was a bomb she set off point blank, of course she didn't survive.

[glacial bough]

Everything about Gara and everything about the bomb

[molten lily]

They had more details about the bomb?

Was it forged from the Unum or something?

[lament stirrup]

Well it was designed to kill a Sentient bigger than all three Eidolons combined, so. Presumably it was a bit more than a lone warframe could handle. Point blank.

[main crane]

Isn't the Sentient that landed on Earth a massive one? I'm pretty sure Gara used a powerful bomb to blow it up.

[proper barn]

Yes the ediolons are small fragments of it

[glacial bough]

We don't need more, it was bomb powerful enough to blow the Plain Sentients to pieces, something at least half the size Hunhow is.

No frame would survive it going point blank, regardless of using glass or not

[molten lily]

There’s also one more factor, what are the effects of the void on a human body? Albrecht survived, but he went mad, and seemingly had his skin removed as seen in portraits of him vs how he appears in game. Unless this has something to do with Kuva transfer. Only question is, by that point wouldn’t the Orokin empire have died? Where would he be getting the vessels?

[glacial bough]

Albrecht didn't go mad

[molten lily]

He didn’t?

[lament stirrup]

No offense, but that has nothing to do what I said.

[glacial bough]

And we know the effect Void has, it just drives you insane, sometimes

[main crane]

He didn't go insane. He just got scared.

[lament stirrup]

Also, he explicitly swore off continuity, Loid had to regrow his body with some kind of artifical womb.

[proper barn]

I think they say cloned/grown flesh.

[molten lily]

It connects back to it. Seriglass is supposed to be tough, but it would stand to reason that the power of the void is significantly more than anything contained within that bomb, making the usage of a seraglass diving bell foolish.

[lament stirrup]

No one had been in the void before. ALbrecht couldn;t have known what kind of power the void has

[glacial bough]

They really aren't connected. The bomb and the Void are not comparable in this situation

[molten lily]

So then in that case this perhaps was exactly what DE intended. Perhaps this was the reason why the whole bell breakage and the void exposure even occurred.

[lament stirrup]

Yeah thats. How writing a story works. You intend the events to happen.

[molten lily]

I’m just surprised that the logic held up very well.

Albrecht doesn’t know what void is, so to get visibility he makes a bell out of glass (possibly this also represents just how easily everything went wrong in the Warframe universe). Therefore, everything that occurred was, more or less, a foolish endeavor that yielded destruction.

[main crane]

Technically if the glass didn't break, the entirety of the Warframe lore wouldn't happen. Imagine a reality where the Sentients wiped out the Orokin during the Old War because they didn't fully understand the Void.

[molten lily]

The sentients wouldn’t even be made without the void.

How per se? Well, if no one had discovered the void, there would be not travel to Tau.

[main crane]

Oh wait yeah. So basically, the Orokin would just rot in the messed up Origin System.

[molten lily]

Basically.

[lament stirrup]

I think Hunhow imagines that timeline on a daily basis

[glacial bough]

The glass breaking does not have major bearing on the Orokin's exploration of the Void

[molten lily]

The Void gains sentience and a form because Albrecht imprinted onto it.

[lament stirrup]

WEll, that's just one theory of how the Indifference came to be

[molten lily]

He gazed into the abyss and it gazed back at him, in Nietzsche’s terms.

[glacial bough]

Yes. The doesn't have much bearing on the Orokin exploring Void tech

It would be slower without the Finger to study, of course

But they'd still be able to open a way through the Void and eventually make Solar Rails

[molten lily]

Being that DE inspires Warframes with mythology, it also makes sense that they would have some knowledge on philosophy.

Being that they are the ones making the story.

[main crane]

I don't think they would study it. The Orokin already thought of it as a joke and a failure since Albrecht has been trying to prove it for ages until the incident happened.

[molten lily]

In a way, Albrech is kind of the endgame villain. He is literally the cause of everything. Him and the void.

With out him, ther is no void travel. That means no sentients, no Zariman, no Tenno, no Warframes, no war.

[lament stirrup]

Causing a story is different from being the villain in it

[molten lily]

The Grineer and Corpus may still exist, but they would what reasonably would be the last remnants of a dying star system.

[main crane]

It would be crazy if he was right all along. That he's not the one who escaped the Void but his duplicate (which is also the reason he rejected Continuity).

[glacial bough]

Albrecht still would have proven it to be real with the fateful trip.

[molten lily]

Maybe that’s why Wally is doing what he’s doing. I would be pretty pissed if an imposter took my place, wouldn’t you?

[main crane]

But if the glass didn't break, the Void wouldn't get through him, thus summoning the Indifference.

[lament stirrup]

It's not clear if the void needed direct physical contact with ALbrecht for the Indifference to notice him

and/or be created.

[tall echo]

His intense fear in that moment likely caused wally

[molten lily]

But it stands to reason that direct exposure was the reason why it happened.

[glacial bough]

Wally is a separate matter to proving the Void has something

[molten lily]

I mean, look at the animals he used for testing.

[lament stirrup]

I don't think fear alone birthed Wally. Otherwise Thrax would be at least as, if not more powerful than the mITW

[tall echo]

Wally is what proved that the void was more than a void

[molten lily]

Thrax isn’t that powerful because he’s ultimately constrained to his own world.

[tall echo]

Intense emotion in the void causes creation. Albrecht was terrified after the bell shattered

[proper barn]

he thought Wally would become the last thing he saw.

he did not also he did it after a lot of drugs.

[main crane]

The Void is attracted to those who seem different. Much of the animals he sent to the Void died, with the ones unique being gaining sentience and a voice, speaking through Voidtongue.

[glacial bough]

The finger is what made the research go as fast as it did, yeah. But no glass breaking still means an open portal into the Void to prove it

[molten lily]

What were all of those messages though? Fear. Fibbonachi broke the containment because he was afraid of losing newfound sentience. The bird is afraid that Albrecht will never return because of sentience.

[tall echo]

The existence of the void was known, the fact that it contained anything is what caused the interest by the other orokin

[molten lily]

All of these animals first response was fear. Coincidence? I think not.

The opposite of fear and strife would be tranquility.

[main crane]

Fear and loss. The feeling of powerlessness. It's what attracts the Indifference.

[proper barn]

they only lived cuz of Fib. I still think that happened to all the animals wally just kiled them right after. he didn't get a chance with the last ones.

[molten lily]

Then the difference would be either tranquility, determination or resilience.

[vestal egret]

so like me after eating taco ball and sh!tting for an hour straight?

[proper barn]

no it's love

literally has been said it's love.

[molten lily]

Then why exactly wasn’t it defeated before? There was fear with the test subjects, but there also was love.

[glacial bough]

That entirely depends on interpretaion of events. I've argued it before, I subscribe to the Void have been a theory before his trip, not a proven existence

[molten lily]

One of them had a mate during the journey.

[main crane]

Tagefer and Minn

*Tagfer

[lament stirrup]

Right, but Albrecht's fear couldn't have possible been that much worse than the Drifter's when they made Duviri. I'm convinced there's some element to the Man In The Wall that sets it aside from a regular conceptual embodiment.

[molten lily]

Think about it, the void is indifferent but emotional. The indifference title could just be referring to the fact that it is pure, unfettered emotion. It does not care, it just feels. It just does. The opposite would be looking at something with tranquility of some kind. If you can see a situation with unclouded eyes, you can look past negative aspects and grasps the whole of something.

[glacial bough]

The only thing we can say for sure is that Albrecht is what caused it to have a shape and draw it's eye to the Origin system

[feral cape]

The title of indifference was a name given to that thing by albretch in hopes of depowering it

[molten lily]

In many ways, the void is indiffernet because it is chaos. How is chaos deprived? By being calm and not being afraid to stare down your own demons.

[feral cape]

Names have power and how could something indifferent act

[molten lily]

Well, indifferent means uncaring. But this does not mean lacking emotion.

A person can still not care about anyone but also feel.

[molten lily]

This, exactly.

[lament stirrup]

Problematic take, but I don't think Tagfer and Minn were ever in "love" the way humans would see it. There relationship happened entirely while they had animal intelligence and its not until Tagfer comes out of the Seriglass bell with newfound intelligence that he could recontextualize their relationship.

[molten lily]

The thing is though is that love not only a unsolvable concept, but also a biological function.

[lament stirrup]

The urge to reproduce is a bit different from love

[molten lily]

Most species cannot survive if the members do not love or care for each other.

It’s why sacrifice happens.

It’s why tough love happens, why animals get kicked out to fend for themselves. They need to learn how to survive, thus tough love is shown by their parents.

[proper barn]

I mean Tag talks about how he hopes she was self aware before she died.

[main crane]

Well, some species, even in the real world, feel affection for their mates. Some birds are known to have a mate for life and when one dies, the other either goes out alone for the rest of its life or dies from depression. It's what happened to Tagfer, but since he gained sentience, he always remembers and misses Minn.

[proper barn]

I will also say they probably have some like affection towards each other even as just mates just not as complex.

[glacial bough]

That depends on if his species mates for life or not

[main crane]

Also, Tagfer is the last of his kind

[molten lily]

Maybe the whole key to this thing is if Albrecht brought Loid along. After all, indifferent was basically how Albrecht acted towards his daughter and Loid himself.

He was so concerned with getting the void “understood” or making it “useful” that he neglected the only people who were still there for him and his research.

His daughter left. The only person he has that could fix this with him is Loid.

So Loid might actually be the key to this all if he takes another final journey with Albrecht.

Perhaps this feeling of more complex love between human life would be the thing that nullifies Wally’s indifference.

[glacial bough]

It wouldn't

or I suppose, it shouldn't

[molten lily]

But Albrecht is what physically made Wally. His fear made him.

[glacial bough]

Wally interacted with a whole ship full of loving couples and it didn't matter

[molten lily]

He also didn’t entirely break into the ship.

Otherwise the vast majority of the residents would be drifting in the void itself.

[glacial bough]

In theory. We don't know at all what actually sourced Wally

[molten lily]

The Holdfasts wouldn’t exist then.

[glacial bough]

He very much did. He was directly involved with the parents going as crazy as they did

[lament stirrup]

I don't think physically touching a couple is what wards Wally off, insomuch as the concept of love and also incredible amounts of violence.

[molten lily]

That was a leakage. They were not completely subsumed in it like Albrecht was.

[lament stirrup]

We can't measure how much void energy got onto the ship since we only have brief flashbacks off the Zariman incident.

[sudden cave]

albrecht wasn't completely subsumed

[molten lily]

The bell broke.

[glacial bough]

There's nothing to suggest any difference. Being in the Void is being in the Void, there's no degrees to it

[sudden cave]

well, he's not an angel

[lament stirrup]

I think only conceptual embodiment ghosts can become void angels

[molten lily]

This*

[glacial bough]

No, the parents did too. It's what happened to "Angel" in the ARG recordings iirc

[lament stirrup]

The parents came back as conceptual ghosts firsts, after their first deaths. I think?

[molten lily]

There’s recordings?

[glacial bough]

The Zariman ARG has us unlocking logs from someone on the ship

[sudden cave]

"subsumed" means taken over by or made a part of. albrecht is clearly still a distinct entity. he's certainly affected, but subsumed is not the correct word

[glacial bough]

It's mainly an indication of the progression to madness the ship goes through

[lament stirrup]

The ARG doesn't contain specifics on the process of becoming an Angel, besides Kira turning into one during the last audio log.

[glacial bough]

Ah, "Angel" would just be the regular madness then

[molten lily]

I never knew that Warframe would become a horror game LMAO.

[lean garden]

My take on it is that the recordings were of the original flesh humans, not them becoming angels, but them going insane. Subsequently Kira, who we know was a holdfast becomes an angel after unlocking all the files

[sudden cave]

i was under the impression the angels are what the holdfasts turn into when they start listening to the void song

[lean garden]

which would be correct, since this is directly communicated to us during the quest

[molten lily]

General question, how do the holdfasts even exist.

Didn’t all adults on the ship go insane?

[lean garden]

Conceptual embodiment go brrrrrrrr

[molten lily]

Huh???

[sudden cave]

warframe has always been a horror game. it's just existential horror instead of cheap jumpscares

[lean garden]

Not all, the holdfasts were literally holding fast until they all died in various ways

turns out a quick way to avoid madness is death!

[sudden cave]

you know how people say "believe in yourself"? holdfasts took it literally

[hasty eagle]

"Oi. I hear you been lookin' at me. You uh... you like what you see? Even li'le Indifference likely wants a taste." 😏

Also Quincy saying that. Not me, no.

[sudden cave]

mildly relevant question: what do you think would happen to the zariman if the Heart failed again? or is the heart no longer necessary now that there's a giant gaping hole in reality, albeit with a ship stuck in it?

[lean garden]

The heart's functionality is separate from making a big f u hole in space

its the difference between holding an ice cube and turning on the AC

also like the zariman is just plugging the hole, even if the heart goes down, it wont change the physical action the zariman is performing

[sudden cave]

they're really rather vague on what the heart actually does, in the quest dialogue. the line is something like "solar rails, warframes, it all goes away [if the heart breaks]" which is next to useless in terms of, like... concrete technical information

[sudden cave]

good metaphor

[lean garden]

which is why we have our lord and saviour the kim texts

which states that the heart bathes the entirety of Origin in a void halo

like background radiation

[marble pewter]

I love how the lore is more in depth in the messages :’))

[lean garden]

imo its a genius way to feed players with the lore, since players are more interested in horni then they are in lore

[blissful merlin]

Lmao not me. Give me more and more lore please

[marble pewter]

That’s true— hah but I remember watching hours of vids for Warframe lore or spending my time on the wiki

[sudden cave]

bold of you to assume i can't do both at the same time

[marble pewter]

real

[lean garden]

who ever said you cant do both

[sudden cave]

i have many talents 😆

[lean garden]

you have two hands no?

[sudden cave]

lmao yes and they are both for writing warframe pwps

which must be lore-accurate because i'm good at time management

fr imo the heart is kind of dumb as a plot device. either that or my headcanon/speculation is it's necessary for the vast majority of void tech (solar rails, other... stuff?) but the tenno have an innate connection gifted by wally (which seems supported by the "freely given"/"butchered" bit in the hex finale, and by the tenno obviously still being able to operate their warframe with the heart out, albeit in a vastly reduced capacity). otherwise it just feels... cheap, narratively. "oh yes you have mysterious magic powers you gained in a deal with the devil but actually psych, they only work because of this human machine," yknow?

[proper barn]

Hmmm not to the warframes themselves though.

The warframes themselves being able to be controlled seems to be through void powered means.

[glacial bough]

It's explicitly only necessary for the tech of the system and frames. Tenno are seprate and our powers work fine without it

[proper barn]

Cuz like other things have controlled warframes.

Warframes just listen to tenno the most.

Also the heart explains why diemos is in infestation. Cuz that was the way they stopped the sentients from invading diemos and taking out the heart.

[main crane]

Well... We haven't unlocked our full potential during the Heart of Deimos quest.

[sudden cave]

depends whether you mean the warframes who are people or the warframes who are shells
also it was my understanding that transference is part of the tenno powerset - in fact possibly one of the most fundamental parts

at least, post-war within. before that we rely on tech to do the same thing

[proper barn]

You can have done it after you did that. Most of us did have second dream and war within done by then

[glacial bough]

Listen only. Other things controlling fames (the 2 times it's happened) are very much mind control

Well, discounting the handful of specters running around

[proper barn]

What is a transference bolt

I dont know if frames have it or not.

[stiff fable]

It's the thing that Ballas latched onto Umbra to control it

[glacial bough]

All frames have it. Umbra has a unique design

[stiff fable]

Some people take that to mean that all Warframes have one

[proper barn]

I just assumed like the bolt or whatever that is in all frames to let us control them is powered on by the heart. So when it's down we can't use warframes but still have our powers. @sudden cave

[stiff fable]

I don't believe that's the case because the Operator and Drifter use transference on other things that wouldn't have one, like Orowyrms

[proper barn]

Then why does

Um the Sentient thinks only work on warframes?

They have a name.

Teshin kills one in the new war for us.

[stiff fable]

That's an orphix

[glacial bough]

There's not really any other way to read it. Ordis' comment on it only works with Bolts being a standard thing

[main crane]

Orphix

[proper barn]

Yeah.

[stiff fable]

They're interrupting Transference

[proper barn]

But they don't

[stiff fable]

Which is separate from what a transference bolt would do

[proper barn]

Cuz necramechs work well I think they have shielding

[main crane]

Void shielding

[glacial bough]

"Uncertain if any Tenno has linked with this design. The Transference bolt seems different, but we cannot build this without more data."

[stiff fable]

Right, it's just that Nectamechs have thicker armor

[sudden cave]

(frankly i also think heart of deimos should be unlocked after war within, because the depowered segment is clearly meant to be you as the operator and censoring it with the warframe directly contradicts what the characters say immediately beforehand)

[glacial bough]

No, you're meant to have a frame

[stiff fable]

You're not going to just abandon your Warframe even post TWW

[glacial bough]

Having Op mode just makes it kind of trivial

[sudden cave]

i don't think anyone ever actually explains what this means. father just says they're "void-shielded" which i have to assume is code for "handwave why this works when the frame doesn't"

unless i missed something, which is always possible

[stiff fable]

Basically. But the term's been used a few times, like on the Zariman before the crash

Mostly means that it can't be messed with by external factors

[sudden cave]

it has? do you remember the context? tbh i was confused for a... lot of the angels quest, lol

[stiff fable]

Yeah, it's literally what they used to keep the void out

Got name-dropped a few times in TNW

I think some of the AIM messages mention it offhandedly in the same way

"when the void shields went down and the void rushed in" kind of deal

[sudden cave]

...wouldn't that mean the tenno shouldn't be able to transfer into the voidrig, because transference is a void power...?
then again this is also the game that gave us "anti-entropic radiation" which is an oxymoron so

it's not exactly hard sci-fi

[stiff fable]

Not really, transference is less of an ongoing connection and more of a transfer

When you're inside the Warframe you're INSIDE it

Then the Orphix puts down it's interference and punts you out

[lament stirrup]

Transference is usable by non-Tenno like Ballas and Silvana, so its presumably not purely a void power.

[sudden cave]

it is? i didn't remember that, is that what they use kuva for? it's been a while

[stiff fable]

well no all Orokin technology is void based

[lament stirrup]

Kuva is used for continuity, which moves a persons mind into a new body.

[stiff fable]

.....Kuva is void based

It's literally got bits of void juice inside it

[sudden cave]

is that not just transference with extra steps

[stiff fable]

Continuity is permanent transference

[lament stirrup]

Transference can be cut off by things like Orphixes, nullifier bubbles, and brain damage. Continuity is moving in and putting your feet on the table.

Transference also involves your entire body becoming energy and entering the chosen vessel.

[stiff fable]

Well no, actually you just move your consciousness

[lament stirrup]

(The drifter confirms the above when discuasing souls with quincy)

[sudden cave]

nullfiers don't kick you out of your warframe tho? the blue bubble corpus guys?

[stiff fable]

The Operator uses a different method to teleport from the chair to besides the Warframe

[lament stirrup]

They don't, but you can't use transference to enter or exit a warframe while inside the bubble.

[stiff fable]

They're cutting power to the Warframe, the Corpus as a whole doesn't know about the Operators

[sudden cave]

huh, i never tried that

i avoid them like the plague lol

[stiff fable]

It's probably an oversight, Operator mode is counted as a fifth Warframe ability

[lament stirrup]

I mean. Warframe powers are explicitly void based.

Irrc, captain Vor compares warframes to prisms refracting light.

[stiff fable]

But there're interesting side effects if you're in void mode inside of a Nullifier

[sudden cave]

yeah but you also can't do it in the elevator of the zariman or the hallway out of cetus, which is just gameplay/story segregation

[stiff fable]

Right, but Nullifier bubbles do exist to block void based powers

[lament stirrup]

The number of times I've dashed into the elevator as the Operator and just left my warframe to get soaked by void contamination must be embarassing for Cavelero.

[stiff fable]

Interestingly, the Kuva Grineer do have the tech to boot Operators out of Warframes, since the Queens do know about the Operators

[sudden cave]

the... what are they called, the trocars or whatever, yeah

[lament stirrup]

Trokarians.

[sudden cave]

that one, yeah

[lament stirrup]

Also the metal cysts the elder queen uses to directly interface with the operators mind.

[stiff fable]

Honestly the Tenno should probably be killing a lot more people to bury the secret of the Operators again

[sudden cave]

it's a late arrival spoiler, too many videos on space youtube

[stiff fable]

Time for Orokin Collapse 2.0:Collapse Harder

[sudden cave]

i wonder, how many people really know about the operators who aren't either our allies (who we trust, presumably) or our enemies (who we're already trying to kill)? like, i don't think darvo canonically knows, unless i missed something. he could probably put it together, but we also talk to him all the time. it's not really an intuitive guess for most people

[stiff fable]

That's a good question

The bit that concerns me is whether Parvos knows

Anyone else can be dealt with fairly easily, but Parvos....

[lament stirrup]

He had a Warframe comissioned, so unless Protea volunteered he actively worked with a Tenno

[stiff fable]

Most of the Orokin didn't know about the Tenno