lore-discussion

[jolly briar]

No longer living, in the physical sense

Basically, was he killed by erra when getting his skull pushed in

[graceful swan]

No

[lament stirrup]

The framing of Erra's scene heavily implies his body died, but he lacks the void scarring the Holdfasts do when in Duviri.
He also says he wasn't sure if he was dead or alive when he was thrown into Duviri.

Bare minimum I think he has a spinal cord injury and thats why he doesn't fight anymore.

[graceful swan]

He got nursed back to health meaning the fall hurt him more than what Erra did

[jolly briar]

Bare with me, I'm probably confused. Duviri is just an imagination of the drifter- so how could teshin enter his dream

[graceful swan]

Duviri isn’t a dream who told you that?

[jolly briar]

That's what I understood from the whole thing, void created it based off of drifters emotions, so it's contained within their brain (?)

[graceful swan]

It’s from a book

The book became real

[jolly briar]

Oh so it's more along the lines of another "dimension"

[graceful swan]

Like when people make a live action adaptation of a book

[lament stirrup]

If the live action adaptation could chop your head off.

[graceful swan]

Teshin was thrown into the Void

Somehow he landed into Duviri specifically

[jolly briar]

I'm realizing playing duviri before new war was a mistake

Well ik what I'm replaying

[restive river]

Duviri is a place in the void born from conceptual embodiment, which is what the void does when it reacts to emotions and concepts.

[restive river]

You can’t replay it

[jolly briar]

Ah...

[restive river]

Just look up a playthrough tbh

Though make sure you pay attention cause they throw some info that gets kinda tricky

Like Teshin theorizing on Thrax being a tenno (he’s not, you’re the tenno who made Duviri)

[graceful swan]

I’m still gonna conceptually embody Wally dead

[restive river]

Also on Teshin being alive
This is pretty concrete lmao

One was the monk Teshin, who fell from the sky into the lake on the island we now call Hermit's Landing. Seemingly lifeless, he was dragged ashore by Mathila who nursed his return to health. I have never known a constitution to match his; yet unlike us, he has… deteriorated… with the passing of time.

He was near death but they saved him

[graceful swan]

I’d say the fall did more than Erra did

[restive river]

Now he ages because he’s not a duvirian and cause ig Thrax doesn’t will it to be that he doesnt age

[restive river]

Tbh probably yeah

[graceful swan]

He did actually die in the quest

[restive river]

Considering Varzia was fine lmao

[graceful swan]

But Begin Again

[restive river]

What

Teshin
Never died
?????

[strange turtle]

They mean Duviri

[restive river]

Oh

[strange turtle]

Paradox

[graceful swan]

Teshin got snapped

[restive river]

Yes
He dies then but we do a little funny

[graceful swan]

Begin Again

[jolly briar]

So he's dead relative to origin system

[strange turtle]

No

Unless you mean that people think he’s dead

[jolly briar]

But not relative to duviri

[strange turtle]

In which case yeah, most probably do

[jolly briar]

Yeah, like he doesn't really exist in origin

[graceful swan]

People in the System think he is dead because they don’t know Duviri exists

[restive river]

Missing does not mean dead

[jolly briar]

Fair

[lament stirrup]

I mean, Varzia talks about him like he's alive.

[graceful swan]

People in the System think he is dead

[jolly briar]

So presumed dead

[graceful swan]

Her lines were written before he was gone

[restive river]

Her lines can also be past tense easily

[strange turtle]

I think they just haven’t updated her lines (because he’s alive anyway and she’s so minor so why bother)

[restive river]

Since she speaks very generally about him

[jolly briar]

Bold of me to assume anything in this game would be simple lol

[restive river]

It’s also unlikely she knows he’s dead

[graceful swan]

Most of the System don’t know about Duviri

[lament stirrup]

She was added three months before the New War. I doubt DE would've forgotten they were going ti send Teshing to Eeby Deeby.

[graceful swan]

To most of OS Duviri is just a book

[restive river]

At most the holdfasts, us and like 2-3 of the entrati know, right :?

[graceful swan]

Yeah

[strange turtle]

Also that, yeah. She doesn’t exactly get out much

[restive river]

She’s chilling with her pirate girlfriend

I wouldn’t get out much too lmao

[graceful swan]

Even Eurelia probably forgot about writing the book

[lament stirrup]

They should give Varzia steel path lines. This is definitly not becauae I want the hot bisexual woman to talk to me more.

[restive river]

We need to shove it in her face like “WHAT DID YOU DO”

[obtuse vine]

so teshin alive but chose to stay in duviri cuz mans is tired of the drama

[restive river]

I agree for totally not the same reason

[restive river]

ye

let him be a funny wizard

[jolly briar]

Fair, I'm doing the same at drifters camp

[graceful swan]

I heard there’s a convo where Drifter says he can’t leave

[lament stirrup]

In one of the KIM convo's, the Drifter can say they only visit Duviri because Teshin is trapped therr.

[obtuse vine]

unc staying in duviri so i can farm incarnons

truly the GOAT

[strange turtle]

Speaking of KIM and the Hex, was anyone else disappointed how they made it so there’s nothing between the Drifter and Operator?

Relationship wise I mean, obv not like texts with them

[restive river]

It’d probably be awkward for me too if an alt version of myself came out of nowhere then my mom entrusts them with important stuff instead of me

[upbeat glacier]

If ballas had a discord his username would probably be

BallsDeepInYourMom69

[chrome rivet]

Why do the Necramech's on Deimos's surface change their....targets from infested to us depending on which Worm is out?

[proper barn]

They don't. It's more on if they are active or not right?

[chrome rivet]

Not really? I mean if it's the blue worm, they won't attack us

Or maybe I'm misremembering things

Ok double checked. They simply are deactivated during Fass.

Why is that though?

[lament stirrup]

They're destroyed during orange worm. Surface necramechs are friendly when assembled. I think father pilots them.

The Infested are more hostile during Fass, so maybe they destroy all the necramechs?

[graceful swan]

Vome is Order Fass is Chaos

[chrome rivet]

What about the ones in the labs. Why do they attack us again?

[restive river]

Controlled by wally

[lament stirrup]

They can't tell the difference between Albrecht and Wally, which has astoundingly horrifying implications.

[upbeat glacier]

I also thought they've been wandering around so long they essentially went insane

[chrome rivet]

Necramechs have sentience?

Like Necra-Loid?

[normal mountain]

They at least have programming

[upbeat glacier]

I assume so

[normal mountain]

They dumb tho

[graceful swan]

Look, you were the second wave, kid. The Necramechs were Void-shielded, Sentient-pulse immune... as bright as a bag of hammers and just as dependable. Not like you.

[upbeat glacier]

Considering the ones wandering outside are able to distinguish us as friends because they're relatively newly constructed

[lament stirrup]

Nothing indicates they have "people" levels of intelligence, but I wouldn't put it past the Orokin to create artifical animal intelligence specifically for attack drones.

[upbeat glacier]

I was going to say probably dog level intelligence

Knows who the masters and the master's friends but kills everything else

[tall echo]

They attack anything that moves, spent too much time in the infested tunnels

[restive river]

the ones in the labs shouldn't have been exposed to the infestation

[tall echo]

I can't read

[graceful swan]

Real Warframe player found

[tall echo]

Nah I'm just tired

[lament stirrup]

I know the Deimos infested are scared of the void, but I want a crossfire mission with them in the Sanctum.

[graceful swan]

Mother isn’t afraid

[lament stirrup]

No, I mean there was an update teaser leading up to Whispers In The Walla where Latrox Une confirms the wild infested are acting increasingly anxious, with the implication that they could sense the Man In The Wall breaching the labs

[graceful swan]

Didn’t Helminth say something about that before any of that even happened too?

[lament stirrup]

Oh yeah, Helminth panics if you manage to get the Operator into its room

[graceful swan]

I wonder if the other strains are afraid

[lament stirrup]

I wonder if the Techrot was sabotaging the reactor on new years because they knew the radiation would ward off the Man In The Wall?

[graceful swan]

Probably not they probably just found their way in

[hybrid marlin]

Shieee

Can someone tell me who parvos guy is like one sentence

[graceful swan]

Corpus founder

[lament stirrup]

The Corpus if they had charisma and understood long term investment.

[hybrid marlin]

So is he alive or a ghost

[graceful swan]

Alive

[lament stirrup]

Alive thanks to the void.

[graceful swan]

Thanks to Protea

[hybrid marlin]

Then why aren't he fixing it instead of yapping

[tall echo]

He's fixing the part of the faction that belongs to him

[lament stirrup]

He is, he founded the Sisters of Parvos and its implied the Railjack.corpus ships belong to him.

[tall echo]

Problem is that he's still a greedy prick

[hybrid marlin]

Weird

I've read something about the forced breeding facilities in pluto

Also is the chroma strongest frame in lore

[lament stirrup]

No?

[hybrid marlin]

?

He's a dragon

[lament stirrup]

I don't think that makes him the strongest to anyone but a medieval peasant.

[hybrid marlin]

Then who is

[lament stirrup]

I don't think any one frame is physically stronger than the rest, but I'd argue Umbra or Kullervo are mentally the strongest.

Umbra's the only know frame that can conciously refuse transference and Kullervo's emotions were volatile enough to form a Duviri island.

[hybrid marlin]

Im pretty sure rhino is much stronger than nova or ember

[lament stirrup]

Yeah, in terms of lifting weights. But. Nova has the power to control antimatter.
Each frame sort of has their own specialties no other frame can match.

[hybrid marlin]

He's a big chonky dude while others are frames with anime girl proportions

[hybrid marlin]

You know that's not possible right one of them bound be stronger than rest

Like in League of legends lore. Aurelion Sol created the whole universe other heroes fighting on. But in game he's not that strong

[lament stirrup]

I guess statistically? But like. None of the warframes in Lore are particularly leagues above the others.

Remember when Lotus said Chroma had unparalleled ability to adapt?
And now we have Lavos. And Caliban. And Cyte 09

[hybrid marlin]

My headcanon meg can hurl spaceships to eachother and destroy it

Source: my bottoms

[restive river]

I can see the argument for Xaku or Dante being some of the strongest purely because of their ties to the void

[lament stirrup]

Mag can canonically pull down crew ships, albeit not without some effort.

[restive river]

Tbh with frames I think you need to define what you mean by strongest

[hybrid marlin]

Yeah i never thought about that loid says that he's different from other frames

[restive river]

Like Jade literally has the Jade Light at her disposal

[hybrid marlin]

Dante is still a human compared to other frames

[restive river]

He was the smartest

[restive river]

No, he was still considered a frame

[hybrid marlin]

Mf can talk in game bro

[lament stirrup]

No? Loid says Dante could only communicate through writing. Loid or Drusus, I forget which.

[restive river]

Not really?
Frames can’t talk, but Dante could write

[hybrid marlin]

While rhino ate orokin goons like a cannibal

[restive river]

He speaks through voidtongue but that’s def more the book than it is him

[restive river]

Loid

[hybrid marlin]

Dante says weird things during casting skills

Cyte is also making some sounds like he's speaking trough walkie talkie

[lament stirrup]

Oh yeah, the sound effects. Not sure if they count since they're repeated phrases and in Dante's case, specific patterns of void tongue.

[hybrid marlin]

Did umbra ever spoke?

[upbeat glacier]

Hear me out
Tenno civil war

[restive river]

"Warframes cannot speak, as a rule. Their creator decided they should only scream, or roar, or howl. Dante spoke through his writing, and his voice was beautiful."

[hybrid marlin]

It's been years since i did the quest

[restive river]

No, he did scream tho

[restive river]

Thats the book.

Go replay Dante’s leverian

[lament stirrup]

We actually used to have those with Dark Sectors. DE had to discontinue them because veteran players kept screwing over newer players with their resource taxes.

[hybrid marlin]

Lore discuss: why does little duck is wearing tight jeans on venus

[restive river]

Fashion

[hybrid marlin]

Also hold on isn't venus closer to sun than earth?

[upbeat glacier]

Oh I'm referring to open conflict like a war over something like how there's chaos divers and chaos Marines

[restive river]

Yes

[hybrid marlin]

How the hell is venus is a frozen hell

[restive river]

The Orokin terraformed it.

Like they did to many of the planets and moons

[upbeat glacier]

Let players choose sides

[lament stirrup]

The Orokin "terraformed" it by pouring coolant and dirt on it.

[hybrid marlin]

It says on google venus temp is 465 degrees

[lament stirrup]

They're roughly as good at terraforming as the average rich person.

[upbeat glacier]

Wouldn't railjack vs railjack be fun?

[lament stirrup]

I need large scale ship combat.

[upbeat glacier]

Same

[lament stirrup]

Let me fight a Hunhow sized sentient with Cy. Its enrichment.

[upbeat glacier]

Also I wish with we could get bigger ships

I want a battleship

[hybrid marlin]

Hold on one more question. Arthur's left eye is damaged and white just like umbra's eye

Is umbra the real arthur

[graceful swan]

the Orokin cooled the planet

[lament stirrup]

No, Arthur's scar is from an electrical injury, while Umbra's eyes could be symmetrical if the helmet had broken on both sides.

Also Umbra is explicitly a dax from the Umbra era.

They might have similar cataracts because of the Excalibur batch of the technocyte virus?

[restive river]

I thought his scar was from him dying during the comic :?

[north ferry]

I mean, they're both exclaibur, it's quite easy for the reference being deliberate but also could be accidental.

[hybrid marlin]

It's still weird that they choose that design

[restive river]

Arthur cannot and is not related to Umbra in any way other than they’re both excals
Thats it.

[woven coyote]

With umbra its probably a matter of cinematography

Camera defaults on right side so for us to properly see umbra regen his helmet it needed to be his left side

[north ferry]

Which is to say, that's absolutely a reason to give them both similar scars because theme or something.

[lament stirrup]

Just checked, and sure enough he doesn't have the scar before the Scaldra corner them. I honestly thought the scar was from Amir's transformation.

[restive river]

Yeah, its just a thematic parallel cause excalibur
Nothing more

[hybrid marlin]

Also armor the hex members wearing are clothes or is their flesh started to turn

[restive river]

Flesh

[hybrid marlin]

Ew

[north ferry]

Yup

[lament stirrup]

Its their flesh, with military fear strapped on top.

[hybrid marlin]

We plapping clanker cheeks boys

[lament stirrup]

Incidentally, DE could pull such a powermove by having us time travel to medieval times, meet the mythical king Arthur, and discover that he unleashed the Technocyte plague by drawing the sword in the stone.

[north ferry]

Flesh, it really can't be a suit because that just sort of ruins the whole narrative point of them as protoframes.

[lament stirrup]

Its insane and completely removed from the narrative, but I think it would be really funny.

[north ferry]

I'm having enough difficulty with 1999, please not more shrinking the setting with time travel

Lol, but as usual it's an interesting concept.

[hybrid marlin]

But all of their armor are all neat and symmetrical unlike the techrot enemies who are putrid and ugly

[lament stirrup]

Entrati gave them an enhanced strain mixed with the modern warframe batches.

[silk atlas]

Because it's not (just) Techrot

[humble sierra]

A few of Arthur's scars ||are from Amir panicking when he first got his electric powers||.

[hybrid marlin]

Still it's like they wearing tailored suits with designs on them rather than biological transformation

[restive river]

Is it explicitly stated?

[lament stirrup]

I assume they attached their own gear on top of the protoframe suits.

[hybrid marlin]

Honestly look at our bodies my collarbone was broken years ago now it's fixed but bit thinner

[north ferry]

The narrative point is not really Techrot but Warframe and if warframe is reduced just a suit. Well...

[hybrid marlin]

Like body isn't a symmetrical thing it grows with random patterns

[lament stirrup]

Unless you've got an incredible story to confess, I don't think your collarbone is comprable to being infected with a cultivated version of a cybernetic plague.

[humble sierra]

Not the specific scars but the fact that ||Amir gave him a few. Amir|| says so in a chat message. I'd imagine the eye was probably a separate thing though, since it's such a prominent detail.

[restive river]

The eye thing seems to be from them dying and coming back but maybe could’ve been Amir
We see it happen in the comic so could go either way maybe

[north ferry]

Yeah and some warframes aren't symmetrical, once again, it is certainly tailored. Either pseudonarratively or deliberately.

[hybrid marlin]

Maybe albert guy designed them on his computer that he left in backrooms

[lament stirrup]

I think he designed them with the giant techrot mouth he keeps in his closet.

[hybrid marlin]

That is why their bio components grew perfectly symmetrical

[north ferry]

Uhhh

[tall echo]

You do know that all frames are humans mutated with a controlled strain of the infestation, right?

[lament stirrup]

All original frames*
The foundry built ones are clones assembled in the worlds worst jigsaw puzzle.

[north ferry]

Either it was a specific choice to give them preexisting frames from Origin, the Helminth 'picked' from it's available frames, or a replication of the original process that just so happened to produce identical protoframes.

[tall echo]

They are designed, but not by albrecht

[hybrid marlin]

Did in comics they explained when are they losing their minds and faces

Did they*

[north ferry]

Wut?

[tall echo]

It's unknown how our modern frames are made

[humble sierra]

The ProtoFrames are not the original ones

Arthur doesn't grow up to be Excalibur

[lament stirrup]

The Drifter confirms the modern frames are mindless copies in a KIM convo with Quincy.

[hybrid marlin]

When does our beloved aoi becomes a fishtank face

[humble sierra]

She doesn't

Albrecht took a look at the Warframes, went back in time, and made them in 1999

Aoi is based on Mag

[tall echo]

Ah yes, because the drifter knows exactly how everything works

[lament stirrup]

They're literally one of the two people who build warframes in the foundry???

Its literally on their ship next to their dog bed.

[hybrid marlin]

Didn't he done that to ensure warframes not to be destroyed in the future

[tall echo]

The foundry doesn't require knowledge on how to make stuff

[north ferry]

I mean, pretty sure that's established before the KIM conversation but yes.

[lament stirrup]

You literally have to recover the blueprints. You don't need to be an expert to check whether or not the ingredients include one screaming human being.

[graceful swan]

A lot of what Drifter says really is stuff he wouldn't even know because he wasn't there to see it and there's been nothing suggesting he was actually told

[hybrid marlin]

Tbh i don't even know why im bothering my mind with this half baked lore

[tall echo]

It's not half baked, you just seem to be understanding it at your own pace

[hybrid marlin]

There isn't a logical reason why are we fighting to save a abandoned city filled with monsters

[tall echo]

Because it isn't abandoned

[graceful swan]

Warframe actually has some of the best lore

[lament stirrup]

Its not abandoned. Literally 70% of the transmissions mention civillians.

[hybrid marlin]

We never saw a single npc

[north ferry]

You just don't see them

[tall echo]

Rank up the syndicate

[hybrid marlin]

I thought we would with rank 5 in the mall

[lament stirrup]

YOU LITERALLY DO???

HUH???

[graceful swan]

Not seeing something doesn't mean they aren't there

[tall echo]

[lament stirrup]

There's literally non Tenno people in the mall at rank 5.

[graceful swan]

The Mall literally has NPCs at rank 5

[north ferry]

Look. I get the issue, there are alot of issues I feel with how Warframe communicates it's lore, but it's good work.

[hybrid marlin]

Where exactly

[lament stirrup]

Everywhere?

[tall echo]

Everywhere

[hybrid marlin]

Why my game doesn't have them then

[lament stirrup]

Do you just fast travel between shops and the bounty board?

[hybrid marlin]

Weird

[tall echo]

You gotta open your eyes first to see them though

[hybrid marlin]

No after hex mentioned opening mall to people i roamed around and there was nobody

[tall echo]

You have to reload the area obv

[lament stirrup]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U7qrnEgxxqM

[north ferry]

Well, not there until ranl 5 apparently and tbh, i feel like there should be, why should I care about the stakes of the civilians when there are distinctly absent.

It's just a missed opportunity a little.

[lament stirrup]

They're absent because you only visit combat zones, not shelters.

[tall echo]

They can't just plop down multiple animated npcs without some kind of loading screen

[hybrid marlin]

That's the epicenter of fallout right why is even there civillians still

[north ferry]

Oh in game I'm fine with that, but in the mall I feel like having just a couple of ideas.

[lament stirrup]

You time travel to before the reactor.blows up and prevent it from blowing up in the finale.

[tall echo]

The entire city is blocked off

[north ferry]

If you really want to, imagine countless sick, dying, starving and horrified civilians in the buildings behind the windows.

[lament stirrup]

See this? This is why the devs aren't putting civillians NPCs into the mission.

[graceful swan]

Most people have to stay inside because y’know infestation

[hybrid marlin]

Ik im talking about we spent 1 year in game wise everybody else probably ran away or something

[north ferry]

Considering how much they hammer home how horrible war is, it's an easy thing to imagine.

[tall echo]

Scaldra doesn't care about civilian casualties. They actually cause a lot of them to make space for loyalists

[lament stirrup]

The city's under quarantine with the Scaldra controlling the perimeter.

[restive river]

There’s no running away unfortunately, not for that many people

[graceful swan]

Only reason we go out in it is because Drifter is immune to Infestation and Hex are already Infested

[restive river]

^

[hybrid marlin]

You know i wish we had more mission types including where we saving bunch of grineers from infesteds

[north ferry]

Tbf, as much as I think it would help selling a vibe and narrative having a least a handful of non-frames in the mall early. The people Lettie and Quincy coordinate with. At the some the emptiness is probably a deliberate choice.

[restive river]

The citizens are at a severe disadvantage because of the efervon goo and the infestation

[north ferry]

You mean the game modes no one plays?

[restive river]

Also Scaldra actively oppressing citizens for their own gain

[restive river]

You mean the worst gamemode in the game?

[tall echo]

More of the most hated mission type, exactly what we need

[restive river]

Let’s have an altered spy mission that’s on a tileset that’s even more of a maze to navigate too

[hybrid marlin]

L you never done 4 nova team and instantly teleported npcs

[lament stirrup]

I can barely find one friend to play warframe with much less three.

[graceful swan]

Isn't the most hated content Conclave?

[restive river]

Nah

[tall echo]

I have no strong opinion on the mission type

[tall echo]

Nah conclave is just abandoned

[hybrid marlin]

Honestly i'd be down to see more different stuff other than killing the whole scaldra army in survival

[graceful swan]

Ah so essentially not playing at all

[lament stirrup]

Funnily enough, we did get another civillian rescue mission with Shrine Defense.
People complained about having to acknowledge the NPCs (who you cant see) so much that the devs had to reduce their voice lines with the next hotfix after it dropped.

[restive river]

I was joking
But yes I would like to see more unique gamemodes too

[graceful swan]

Didn't we get multiple unique game modes the last 2 updates

[lament stirrup]

Faceoff and legacyte harvest.
I'd consider Hellscrub half a unique game mode, personally.

[graceful swan]

Koumei also gave a unique version of defence

[restive river]

There’s only so many unique gamemodes you can do tbh

[north ferry]

I think the work they do with building on preexisting game modes with twists like Koumei and 1999 are going a good route with those things.

[restive river]

I like that they’re remixing them

[restive river]

Same :D

[hybrid marlin]

I'd be down to play different modes for same rewards ngl

I hate doing voidfloods

[north ferry]

Though I do dislike hellscrubbers, cleaning them off is just so frustrating.

[hybrid marlin]

Shoot the blue things

[restive river]

I found its really easy with sampotes slam

[proper barn]

use them

[graceful swan]

Did Lotus Eaters actually give us anything new bar like 3 lines can't remember

[proper barn]

is also a answer.

[hybrid marlin]

I ate lotus

[proper barn]

I think it added other things like new incarnons.

[restive river]

More than 3 lines
But no, nothing new gameplay wise

[restive river]

Nothing specifically tied to the quest tho

[lament stirrup]

Lotus hangs out in the Sanctum and has ambient dialogue.

[graceful swan]

Oh yeah

[north ferry]

Yeah it really kinda sucks as a stand alone quest, it really is a prolgue thing and puts her someplace different. It's kinda telling that she's so affected by Indifference's call.

[graceful swan]

I haven't been back to Origin for a while because of the Backroom lol forgot she got the lines on the edge of Wally

[lament stirrup]

I'm pretty sure the devs explicitly stated it was a prologue.

[graceful swan]

Wally should give her a railing so she doesn't fall

[lament stirrup]

Can't she fly?

[north ferry]

I refuse to have my base of operations anywhere but the orbiter.

Yes she can, she is still a Sentient.

[upbeat glacier]

Anyone else wonder what happens to capture targets

[north ferry]

Actually, does she default to Lotus appearance there or is she the player's custom one?

[lament stirrup]

She uses the players custom one in Lotus Eaters, including the Natah and Xaku skins.

[north ferry]

They suffer then presumably get interrogated by someone else or Simaris.

[graceful swan]

I remember when people were saying she'd only use the skin that was in the image for the quest

[upbeat glacier]

https://youtu.be/jqvTTeZDM2o?si=ub1H2rV18VQrAEPJ

Cutscene that still confuses the heck out of me

[lament stirrup]

Gamers when they can't tell the difference between their assumptions and reality.

[upbeat glacier]

Is the indifference Wally or is Wally the indifference

[lament stirrup]

The Indifference is one of Wally's titles.

[north ferry]

Man in the Wall is what Rell called him and how we're first properly introduced I believe.

Indifference is what Albecht labeled it.

[upbeat glacier]

Soooo

[limber pulsar]

wally is just a fun community made name to shorten The Man In The Wall. theyre all the same thing

[upbeat glacier]

Does that mean the way to beat the indifference is to essentially overdose it on emotions of love, happiness, anger, sadness, etc

[lament stirrup]

I'm faintly convinced the Devs started calling it The Indifference because thats easier to fit into a script.

[humble sierra]

Love is the key, fear might empower it

Fear likely created it

[north ferry]

Unless you make up some sort of theory about how using a different name creates a different version to interact with.

[lament stirrup]

Each of the Murmur units has had their own nametags and we just didn't notice.

[humble sierra]

Tfw after the void quest you now have to deal with multiple MITW entities because the community gave It so many names they have more power

[north ferry]

I feel like the void is a much about the sense of self, and fear, as a more instinctual thing is beneficial to it.

[upbeat glacier]

The opposite of all emotions is indifference

[lament stirrup]

The Indifference title refers to its opinion on humans lives, not its own emotions.

[humble sierra]

Yeah but you have to wonder if that's just a pretentious, fancy name, especially since it's smiling all the time

[graceful swan]

“The first scholar looked into the Void and he feared it and his fear took shape that's how all this started”

[hybrid marlin]

Backrooms

[humble sierra]

Just checked, they aren't there

Unless they're just listening to Lettie and I

[upbeat glacier]

Also anyone know why aoi dies or how she dies

[humble sierra]

Brain imploded

[lament stirrup]

"For the love of Parvos, help me."

[hybrid marlin]

Check under ur pompadour let

[humble sierra]

Due to overworking herself

[restive river]

^

[upbeat glacier]

Oich

Also in the bad ending

Imo I believe Quincy wants to die

[restive river]

she’s the least used to her powers, mostly having proficiency with smaller objects
She struggled with the truck for example

[north ferry]

Burned out her own brain and presumably hemorrhage.

[restive river]

@hybrid marlin Takes one to know one, 🤓

[hybrid marlin]

Tank took 3 days to reach there and aim on quincy. Mf we played you just bullet jump

Even i could escape that

[upbeat glacier]

Thats why I believe he wanted to die

[north ferry]

I mean the whole failure sequence is somewhat contrived, but yeah it does feel like he had somewhat given up.

[upbeat glacier]

That or it's a reference to saving private Ryan

[restive river]

I mean
It was that or being nuked lol

[lament stirrup]

I'm faintly convinced Quincy expects the city to go up in smoke amyway.

[north ferry]

Pretty much yeah.

[restive river]

He does, his plan was to just leave but he decided not to

[humble sierra]

In the comic, he wanted to kill Albrecht instead of capturing him for a cure like the rest of the Hex

He's given up on himself

[hybrid marlin]

What is the lore reason of Dante being doritos?

[lament stirrup]

What

[restive river]

Wizardframe

[north ferry]

Uhhh, there isn't one. It's an aestheic choice.

[lament stirrup]

Depressed and hot, pick a struggle, Quincy.

[upbeat glacier]

https://youtube.com/shorts/ZMB1ld8XLBU?si=SjORypvKOIW_c7-b

Imo I feel like DE was referencing this with Quincy

[hybrid marlin]

Shadow wizard credit gang we love casting void

[humble sierra]

That's partly how we help him. It's not just "use your 1, fool", we help him emotionally— as the Tenno help the Warframes

[north ferry]

I mean I don't feel it's a trope that is unique to Saving Private Ryan.

[humble sierra]

Aoi was definitely the best example for the emotional thing, but imo the execution made her look really stupid

"I can't do it"
"Yeah you can"
"Oh yeah lol"

[restive river]

I haven’t really seen the trope of sniper aiming down sights and a tank being aimed right at them before

[hybrid marlin]

Me lore talking at 02:42 in the morning

[north ferry]

Thinking back on it, there is the implication they aren't using their abilities properly and they like, mars chart.
But then they're modded so good and have access to all their kit in playable sections so it's just confusing.

[proper barn]

we see what happens to Maroo they get teleported to like a interrogation place.

[humble sierra]

Amir got a parazon tutorial

[lament stirrup]

I don't think their mods are canon, insofar as their stats represent their existing combat skills.

[upbeat glacier]

Also I want a bolt action rifle in Warframe

[proper barn]

is one of the snipers that?

[lament stirrup]

Boltor of course/j

[upbeat glacier]

No no

[lament stirrup]

The base Vectis and Vectis Prime with Depleted reload also.

[lament stirrup]

Based Hunt Showdown.

[hybrid marlin]

Tigris is similar like a looney toones shotgun

It has a very weird trigger tho

[upbeat glacier]

Would our boolets even work in Warframe

[north ferry]

Oh where's this?

[silk atlas]

Bullet is bullet. There's the fact we have very clear parallels to real-world guns now.

[north ferry]

I mean I don't think any of the guns are designed for bullets like ours but, small fast piece of metal is pretty universal.

[humble sierra]

The early game Maroo quest. We don't see the room itself, IIRC, but we capture her the same way and talk to her via the communication things

[thick viper]

Why bullet when you have bolt

[proper barn]

1999 bullets work.

Also we use bullets and swords cuz the sentients took over all the super doomsday weapons.

[upbeat glacier]

Every sentient gangster till they get shot with a big iron

[quartz sky]

insert cowboy song here

To the town of Höölvania rode a stranger one fine day

[upbeat glacier]

Hardly spoke to folks around him, didn't have too much to say
No one dared to ask his business, no one dared to make a slip
For the stranger there among them had a big iron on his hip
Big iron on his hip

[quartz sky]

I really wish there was an actual radio we could listen to like the fallout games. If I could have every song in the game on shuffle I would

[upbeat glacier]

We need a cowboy event for Warframe

[polar bobcat]

Radio on the Atomicycle to play all the tunes would be neat

[tall echo]

How would that even work

[upbeat glacier]

Do you guys think the idea of Warframe having us go back in time to a world war 2 themed time be cool?

[upbeat glacier]

Go back in time to cowboys and outlaws

[tall echo]

Why

[upbeat glacier]

Because it be cool

It be cool if we could do duels with tenno like the cowboys

Maybe a quick time event we can do against each other

[tall echo]

There's a duel room for dojos

Gotta keep in mind that without new rewards there's no reason to create an entire event

We already have mesa and a revolver weapon skin

[proper barn]

We have a cowboy Warframe

[upbeat glacier]

I said a cowboy themed event

[proper barn]

I know

[tall echo]

No good reason for one to exist

[north ferry]

We also Have duiviri

[north jolt]

I thought we gave her a bit of a energy surge to increase her power, along with the morale boost

[north jolt]

There actually is one, sorta. The Grinlok I think

[upbeat glacier]

Me grinlok

[north jolt]

Actually gonna double check but Im 90% sure it acts like a bolt action

However with the proto skins and a couple actual proto weapons, it would be cool/funny to have something like a Mosin Nagant in the game. Either as a skin or dedicated weapon

Also frick I was wrong, Grinlock is lever action

[tall echo]

We told her how to manipulate the mechanism easier

[north jolt]

That works too

[lament stirrup]

Strictly speaking, I think the Drifter just calmed Aoi down long enough for her to think to manipulate the reactor's machinery rather than just jamming them in full force.

Well, by strictly speaking, I mean "This is my personal guess"

[tall echo]

Drifter says something like "do you see it" iirc

[lament stirrup]

That's Quincy, when they activate his wall hacks.

[tall echo]

I was too busy being blown away by the feels to memorize every detail tbf

[proper barn]

Me too

[drowsy crown]

Who’s the cowboy frame?

[restive river]

Mesa
Cowgirl

[humble sierra]

Yeah her prime look has chaps and a cowboy hat, and her 4 is the classic "deadeye" thing

[proper barn]

people have said but Mesa. had the Hat 6 shooters fasted in the west you know the works. She has a blindfold on so she "has a Challange" lmao.

[humble sierra]

Her 4 is dual revolvers with speed shooting her thumb being turned into the hammers

[proper barn]

yeah her thumbs are triggers lmao.

Also she does like "trick" shooting poses in her un-augmented 4.

[humble sierra]

On mobile you can actually walk without it

I think it's a bug but it's possible it's just due to sprinting

I'll check on console one day because I rarely remember to sprint there

[proper barn]

i mean you use her 4 augment to walk a little but more importantly to ROLL

[humble sierra]

On mobile you can lock your sprinting

[proper barn]

the roll is way faster.

than walking.

i think all the 4s you can "walk" in you can roll and the roll is 10 times faster and it's effected by yellow taus

[upbeat glacier]

Dagath backstory+ Jades = I really think genocide to the orokin was too kind

[proper barn]

i mean that's all of um but those two

and like ash and lavos are the big ones.

like the Guy in Lavos' lore just taught people achlemy.

[upbeat glacier]

Honestly should have glassed them all

The thing where you put people in jars

Seriously how much money would a therapist make in Warframe lol

[chilly relic]

ight anyone actually know or figured out what wally is trying to do?

[proper barn]

No

Generally cause chaos.

Is the most accepted answer.

[gloomy flint]

Are there remains of o block on this games earth?

[hollow flare]

nah don't want them around even in cephalon form

[proper barn]

o block?

[gloomy flint]

O block

[proper barn]

what does that mean

[tall echo]

O block?

[proper barn]

tell me what it means don't just reply to me with the word

[tall echo]

Is that the minecraft version of o fortuna

[gloomy flint]

Place

[proper barn]

i am not doing this.

Give me a detailed explation or don't talk about it.

[gloomy flint]

Ok

[graceful swan]

Do you mean Oro works?

[strange turtle]

It’s an area in America known for violent crime

Also something to do with certain rappers

[raw stone]

Oh right, O block. Tbh we never see much outside of Hollvania. Plus we only know Amir to be from some random place in Libertatia

[old dome]

billions... provided the ppl theyre therapizing can actually pay up

idt theres anyone w credits in the origin system actually,, other than nef anyo alad v parvos & ballas... the regular ppl are poor af

the tenno being rich or poor really depends on whether the cosmetics we buy are canon events that happen or not

[old dome]

sybaris:

also uhhhhh not boltor... OH rubico

[woeful nest]

So exactly why is 1999 a loop? Is it purely Drifter's time abilities or... is Wally trying to keep them and the Hex in "hell"

[graceful swan]

Check your inbox

[north jolt]

This isn't really a theory or prediction, just a lore thought I had for possible future events. But wouldn't be really messed up if fkng Alad V came back into the picture by making a deal with Wally?

[lean garden]

wouldnt be out of character for him at all

might even tie into what parvos might have done to learn voidtongue

[tall echo]

Why would cosmetics matter? Plat isn't the primary currency

[north jolt]

I actually forgot that Parvos knows void tongue now? When did that happen?

[lean garden]

thats what Drusus says

[north jolt]

Ohh, I only played a little bit of that disruption node

[lean garden]

when Drusus watches Dante get goobered by wally, he remembers hearing the same kind of language exiting parvos's mouth

[lean garden]

its from Dante's leverian

[north jolt]

Then I haven't visited the Leverian in a while :d

Point is Parvos making a deal with Wally is a scary thought

[lean garden]

you will need to get dante, and then find his prex on the back of the empty pedestal

iirc

[north jolt]

Well I got nothing better to do rn :p

I just wonder, is it possible (even if difficult) to learn void tongue without direct help from Wally?

[tall echo]

Unknown

[mint merlin]

how can the drifter reverse time in 1999?

[sly pagoda]

I believe there is two theories.

1: This 1999 is actually a Duviri like creation only this time by Albrect but since it would still operate on the same rules, the Drifter has the ability to take control of the time loop.

2: Its actually 1999 from Warframe's timeline and the time in Duviri has given the drifter to create a limited and localized loop, Or take over one that was already in progress. Hollvania is now in a Groundhog day of sorts.

[lean garden]

Im betting on some version of no.2

no.1 is incompatible with the existence of the Coda based on the last known trailer of the coda

[sly pagoda]

(humor)if its 2, I am just saying there is a window of opportunity to grab some golf clubs and find a stargate... 😉

[graceful swan]

I’d say manipulating the fact it was a loop already

[old kettle]

Stop the Void Cascades kicking my butt. Its a good challenge. xD Ive been doing other things procrastinating on it, I might just get some more spectors if I can use them.

[wraith coral]

If... On holvania the scaldra is the old version of the grinners...so libertia army would be the old version of corpus??

[lament stirrup]

The Scaldra aren't ancient Grineer.

And the Liberatia army are an anologue to Americans not private military companies?

[wraith coral]

I think you dont get it

Im saying that bc this is the first of the first of first of the first appear of their existance

The first concept of the concept

[lament stirrup]

The Scaldra aren't Grineer. They just look similar because they're both green fascists.

[wraith coral]

In relaying on it bc of the scaldra having the royal family

[limber pulsar]

they arent the first of anything. they just both happen to have a millitant aesthetic

[wraith coral]

Bc this is a theory...

But just listen

[limber pulsar]

you can headcanon whatever you want, but there is explicitly no actual canon connection

[wraith coral]

Im going on it bc they have same aspects

This is what a theory means right-...

Theory

Not a fact or not fact since the orokin empire and 1999 have a LOOOOONG age distance

From ..eachother.

But still existing on same word and timeline

Bc this .. is a timetravel...

[unkempt swan]

Yeah the time gap between orokin and 1999is unknown but it should be colossal

At least 40k

[wraith coral]

Or even more

Since the orokins deleted the pre orokin age data

[silk atlas]

"the scaldra is the old version of the grinners"
This is just wrong, and nothing suggests this besides "Well both of them use green and oranges in their palettes"

There is no weird "proto-Grineer" in 1999 because the people who made the old old Grineer don't even exist yet (The Orokin)

[unkempt swan]

Well the griner descend from these guy like everything in warframe

[wraith coral]

Every army had a other name

A older version are they the same thing? No, but take inspiration on it

[limber pulsar]

well by that logic cavemen are the actual protogrineer

[silk atlas]

So does everyone else, that's not useful info, especially when there's no records of old Earth from the Orokin Era anyway to trace ancestry.

[wraith coral]

Like the same for 1200 army to modern EUA army

They are the same, but they evolve, they adapt they had alot of different models

[silk atlas]

There's no inspiration for them to take from. They were dead and forgotten about by the time Orokin happened.

[wraith coral]

Different equipments, names changed

[unkempt swan]

Yes but it's easy to imagined that the scaldra would be some kind of elite force made to last

[wraith coral]

They dont need to be precise old age grinner army

[limber pulsar]

but they explicitly did not. nothing from “modern” earth survived to the orokin era

[lament stirrup]

There is literally no connection that can be made between the Scaldra and Grineer that wouldn't just boil down to them being military dictatorships.

[wraith coral]

It dont need to have a connection

[silk atlas]

There's no connection, they're unrelated besides both of them being armies of people, full stop.

[wraith coral]

It just need to be a example

[silk atlas]

???

[restive river]

It’s at least 10k.

[unkempt swan]

Yeah but it's before orokin erra maybe descendant from the scaldra could have become orokin themselves for all we kmow

[tame radish]

QQ. my GF just finished second dream and asked me if tenno knew that Margulis was executed and lotus took over and tenno just accepted her as the new mother.

[silk atlas]

This whole conversation started because you wanted to make a connection between Scaldra and Grineer though????

[unkempt swan]

Correct

Bit that's not the point

[silk atlas]

Then what is

[wraith coral]

A army dont need to exist to made the whole lineage

They need a idea, and its follows

[restive river]

They have no connection other than a vague resemblance which is mostly because they’re both military factions that use chemical weapons.

[limber pulsar]

but there is no lineage. theres no ambiguity here

[restive river]

We know how the Grineer started and it wasn’t with the Scaldra.

[wraith coral]

Both is war criminals

[silk atlas]

THE IDEAS DID NOT SURVIVE THAT WAS ALREADY ESTABLISHED

[restive river]

And so are the Tenno, your point?

[wraith coral]

Actually the whole origin sistem have war criminals ..

Grinner, corpus, mom

[lament stirrup]

Its not the Geneva Convention, its the Geneva Contest.

[lean garden]

Homie is being very liberal with the concept of "spiritual successor"

[limber pulsar]

the only connection they have is both being millitaries, but grineer didnt even start out as a military

[wraith coral]

Yeah if i dont read wrong i think the tenno said the grinners was a type of hard work unity

[restive river]

We know how the Grineer came to be
They were made as a cloned working class and it was only thanks to the twin queens, who were Orokin children, that they even rose to power.

[wraith coral]

Dont bring this to me, this was the saddest thing i ever read about the lore

[restive river]

???

[wraith coral]

Both was twins

They only know they was sisters but they used too bad grinner bodies

They suffered with the grinner decease

[restive river]

They were horrible people

[wraith coral]

Orokin right

[restive river]

They used continuity on grineer bodies to try and live as long as they could

[wraith coral]

I think the grinner decease is one of the most sad things

[restive river]

Ok

[wraith coral]

Like imagine u are the most efficient marine

But also have a serious dementia

They will only gets worst with the time

[restive river]

My sympathy for the Grineer only extends so far since they’re an active threat to us and civilians lmao

Like Steel Meridian and Kahl’s Garrison is who I care about

[wraith coral]

But also have kahl

Kahl is cool

[strange plinth]

^
i want tyl regor to have succeeded minorly. repair the clone rot just a bit. but not super-super soldier

[silk atlas]

Kahl is also a defector

[wraith coral]

Is... Tyl regor officially dead?? Like ik he call us to a 1v1

[limber pulsar]

theyre the dying embers of a fascist empire obsessed with maintaining genetic purity, there are some good grineer but the clonerot itself isnt really what makes them tragic

[restive river]

Yes

[wraith coral]

But like man so far tyl was the smartes of them

[graceful swan]

It’s as simple as if they shoot me they die if they don’t I’m chill with you

[limber pulsar]

most assassination bosses die for good after you fight them

[wraith coral]

Ik theres more smarties

[strange plinth]

i think so?
he's not involved with anything after his boss fight
not counting like
tyana pass

[lament stirrup]

-# toobmen

[restive river]

Tengus too

[silk atlas]

The Citrine stuff released after the Tyl Regor fight.

[restive river]

Tyana pass technically happens before

[lament stirrup]

[wraith coral]

OH GOD... He is right

We "kill" before the new war

[restive river]

To a degree yes
It’s also important as to why they’re shooting at me for me

[graceful swan]

Yeah

[wraith coral]

Ngl, theres something that tells me the worm still active

[restive river]

The worm queen is still active, yes

[wraith coral]

Voruna is some way new

[restive river]

She’s actively trying to get more Kuva and the whole Voruna stuff

[wraith coral]

And worm was not so... Happy

[restive river]

Voruna and the kuva missions are post war within

[wraith coral]

Idk you can see a serious different worm, she is not shy or submissive

She seems legit pissed but somehow controled for some reason

[restive river]

I
Dont think that was in question?

[wraith coral]

She still with the passive agressive behavior

[limber pulsar]

worm queen also was the one who sent grineer to the zariman. shes still the leader of the grineer, she just doesnt get as much focus as parvos does which is a shame

[restive river]

Which kinda makes sense cause she’s not too bright

But she is still a threat

[limber pulsar]

for some reason, people tend to be a tiny bit upset when their sister theyve known for thousands of years is killed

[wraith coral]

But... Yet she still somewhat a good strategist
??

[restive river]

I like how a majority of Grineer believe both queens to be alive still

[restive river]

That isn’t necessarily her doing the strategizing lol

[wraith coral]

Ikr but...

She still good at it??? How its possible

She is not a very... Smart looking one

But she also can be a threat to us

Wich the born of the liches

[restive river]

Wdym she’s still good at it???

[wraith coral]

IDK

SHE IS SMART JUST AS A WALL

But... The empire still strong???

[restive river]

You’re saying she’s good at it but in what way?

[wraith coral]

Idk how explain

[restive river]

Because the empire that was pre-established didnt fall apart?
Yeah, thats not entirely on her.

There’s grineer that work under the queens
Thats how that works, how they function

[wraith coral]

I mean she somehow make the grineers on fortress believe both Queens are alive

[limber pulsar]

we dont really see much of it, but the grineeer empire is kinda falling apart. worm queen and tyl regor are like the only major grineer left alive. they just will never actually go away because of gameplay reasons

[wraith coral]

How?? I do t want to know either

[restive river]

Thats not a difficult thing to do

[wraith coral]

Ik grinners are not a very bright beings ...

AFTERALL we manage to break in the fortress, get close enough to the Queens and the whole fortress was chilling

[limber pulsar]

most grineer dont interact with the queens any. lotus didnt even believe they exist at first

[strange plinth]

railjack trailer(?) showed some grineer are aware or at least think that the elder queen is dead, but keep quiet about it.
For the Queens vs For the Queen doesn't make that much of a difference for a clone soldier that has an average lifespan of 3 minutes (exaggeration, but still.)

[wraith coral]

Still, i believe worm still want to kill us rlly rlly bad

She is looking foward some big stuff

Like zariman and lua

She was looking straight forward to voruna

[restive river]

Of course she does, what?

[wraith coral]

She rlly rlly want voruna

[restive river]

Her wanting to kill us was never in question

We know she’s after Kuva as well

To live longer

[heady widget]

Bruh Stalker dad of the year material my butt cheeks. We help deliver this mans child and get his memories of jade and take his girl to a nice resting place. Oh but i still must kill the tenno yo wtf. If i deliver your baby and you try to kill me aint getting any love from me. Its clear its the same stalker with his rave party scythe.

[wraith coral]

Ngl... Some of us use his deadwife corpse as a weapon

Soo...

[heady widget]

I mean its not the corpse just a copy

Still f

[wraith coral]

Still, he saw her die on his face

His whole house was destroyed

And he dont know how to take care of a baby

[strange plinth]

stalker will still refuse to hurt her, and he would be aware of the fact that we're using a copy

[limber pulsar]

not like stalker is an actual threat nowadays, he just shows up for ol times sake and its all in good fun

[restive river]

Not destroyed, just under siege

[restive river]

He still hates us, our situation is just more complicated now

When we use the copy of Jade that we have I do think that’s us trying to honor her btw

[strange plinth]

don't think we're quite there yet, but i can't imagine us helping him has been thrown aside entirely.
def more complicated, as ducky said

[wraith coral]

Soren mind is way too messed up

Too much happened too top fast

[restive river]

It was already p messed up

[wraith coral]

On one day he remembers his wife, she is dieing, tenno help us, tenno help to birth his child, his wife dies, he gets new powers, his house get invaded by the corpus IRS AND he got shot on leg

[normal mountain]

Makes sense
Stalker does show up whenever we exchange motes with Ordis

[restive river]

Yeah, he could attack us then but because we honor Jade he doesn’t

[normal mountain]

Even brings his kiddo

[wraith coral]

Also... For what it seems whem a warframe is sentient we can feel what are they feeling,

Soo seeing this and looking at jade stories specially with her interacting with a tenno

It was kinda a heavy thing for the operator to deal with too

Like what eleanor said once, how we still standing

[normal mountain]

Heh
Just realized this means our Operator has experienced the pain of childbirth

💀

[wraith coral]

Yikes

But also it seems that our operator is having a more mature mood on recent quests

Our operator stop being childish on war within becomes slightly and emotionally stable on sacrifice and become more mature on jades shadow

[restive river]

Yes that’s called Transference.

[normal mountain]

We finally growing up

[wraith coral]

Yeah... Ik....

Anyway.

[restive river]

I mean mentally they’re older than their body so
Yeah

[wraith coral]

Also they probably saw tooo too much for a child to see

War, diplomacy, tortures

[normal mountain]

Betrayal

[wraith coral]

Betrayal

Abandoned

Loneliness

[restive river]

I mean yeah
Deeply traumatized by the Zariman just for those memories to be sealed and unsealed 1k+ years later, add that with the years of war and everything they’ve seen from when we start the game

[wraith coral]

Also for what it seems we actually killed our parents on zariman

[normal mountain]

I mean, seconds after awakening, Vor tries to make the kid a mindless slave

[wraith coral]

It could be hella dirty from wally if he suddenly starts to mimic our parents body to unstable the drifter mind

Hella efficient and cruel

[normal mountain]

.. I could see him do that
He mimicked Loid in front of Albrecht and mocked their relationship

Mocking dead parents isn't too far from that

[restive river]

It was us or them
Thanks Wally

[wraith coral]

You gave a childs worst trauma possible

[restive river]

I still think he could use our parents directly against us by having their void angels appear

[wraith coral]

God, fighting our to death again

This could be hella brutal as a final fight against wally

[normal mountain]

But as an added insult, he gives them back their personalities
So as they come attack us they're just screaming apologies
think Jordas Golem fight

[restive river]

Could get some wonderful body horror with that too
Our parents heads sprouting out from the void corrupted body of the angels, their bodies attacking us while we try to help them but it’s no use as they are much more far gone than the holdfasts were

[normal mountain]

dear Sol that's twisted

[wraith coral]

Or maybe how wallyy did with hex on zariman

[normal mountain]

And perfectly in character for him
Well done

[graceful swan]

Plot twist we killed them already in the army of Angels we already killed combined

[wraith coral]

I didnt understand a thing .

Oh nvm

Idk what can be worse as weapon

[normal mountain]

So
Void entities are virtually immortal
Who's to say that they won't come back?

[wraith coral]

We probably can be controled to our partners so wally will not have success on it

But our drifter seems rlly... Different whem it comes to zariman or our parents

Like it hurts to remember

[graceful swan]

Nothing actually suggests Angels come back to life they can just heal

[restive river]

It sounds like their history was the same as the Operator’s up until the deal

[wraith coral]

It hurts so much that even with the duviri torture we still remember at it on detail

[restive river]

We only remember thanks to Teshin tbh

[wraith coral]

Eternalism

Atleast that annoying cephalon teache us something

[restive river]

Yes actually, as both possibilities of Operator and Drifter happen
One gets saved
The other does not
Both made the deal.

[silk atlas]

That's not even applicable here...

[restive river]

It is, we’re literally talking about the time it’s applicable lol

Which is operator and drifter

[silk atlas]

I'm losing it

[restive river]

You’re okay

[normal mountain]

Nothing suggests they don't
And we already have the immortal Corrupted Vor

[wraith coral]

We have our powers but dont know how to use

[restive river]

Years of it not being applicable and now it finally is

[restive river]

Drifter doesn’t get powers until the new war.

[wraith coral]

Yeah

But its weird, it seems like we did the deal with our selfs

Soo a deal on a deal

[restive river]

We made the deal with Wally who takes on our form

But in the new war we’re just giving the Drifter their powers afaik

[wraith coral]

The interaction with operator and drifter hurts so much my head

[restive river]

Not really pulling them into the deal or anything like that since they already had a deal with Wally

[graceful swan]

Vor is immortal because of a key though not naturally immortal

[wraith coral]

We can ser a lil detail on his stomach

Just a Scratch

[wraith coral]

Im rlly curious to know what is the next step of our indifference

It seemed rlly angry at us on zariman

[normal mountain]

My point is that our parents could still come back for a boss fight
If not actually them, then random Angels given their personalities

[wraith coral]

Nah the angels maybe need alive beings to have a body

Like the whole zariman crew on first stages

[graceful swan]

If Wally really wanted to do that he could just copy their appearance and fight us

[wraith coral]

Naaah, too easy and simple

Dont looks like wally behavior

[restive river]

Angels are the result of the conceptual embodied memories of the crew feeding off of the finger, they aren’t human and aren’t traditionally alive

[wraith coral]

More like a virus

[restive river]

Kinda sure

[normal mountain]

Aren't traditionally alive
That phrase always cracks me up

[wraith coral]

I see them as a type of virus bc of the void

[restive river]

The holdfasts or the angel’s song?

[wraith coral]

I have one theory that void has many faunas on it

[restive river]

It’s accurate

[wraith coral]

Line the zariman, the murmur, and duviri

[restive river]

The void doesn’t do anything by itself, it requires emotions and concepts to make anything

[normal mountain]

I know
Just every time I hear it I laugh

[wraith coral]

Thats what i mean

Like a fauna that adapts

[normal mountain]

Not technically false
Albrecht threw lots of animals into the Void

[wraith coral]

The void it self looks like a distorted sea

[restive river]

Imagine if Wally uses them in the future to fight us, a horde of void corrupted conceptually embodied animals

[normal mountain]

VOID FISH

[wraith coral]

Void fish= void wyrm

[restive river]

Did you mean: Fishonacci?

[graceful swan]

I wonder if it made a frame by itself

[normal mountain]

Not Duviri fish
VOID FISH

[restive river]

May I introduce you to Xaku?

[limber pulsar]

void doesnt make anything on its own

[restive river]

I do hope that we get a moment where we lack a frame while in the void and conceptually embody one on the spot so we can fight

[graceful swan]

What about Revenant Prime

[restive river]

Maybe Unum

[wraith coral]

Do not say this name.

[graceful swan]

Voidonacci

[wraith coral]

https://tenor.com/view/joongcat-wtf-is-this-gif-25115179

[woven coyote]

Fishonacci fishtarion the 2nd

[humble sierra]

Fishtor Fishdonyoi

[woven coyote]

kinda wanna see the unholy amalgamation of neil's characters

[humble sierra]

I've been begging for a Fishtarion

If I had the artistic talent, I'd make it myself

[strange turtle]

Led by CE Minn

[strange turtle]

That’s Mr Fishonacci to you

[dry aurora]

So how does something become a warframe and another a cephalon, in the grand scheme of things

[humble sierra]

Cephalons get their brains scooped out and then 'uploaded', essentially. Warframes (Spoilers for The Sacrifice) ||are humans that are injected with modified versions of the infestation, which changes them and turns them into the "robotic" weapons we see||.

[dry aurora]

Gotcha so just varying punishments

[humble sierra]

No, for Warframes it wasn't always a punishment. For example, they turned Dagath to save her life. Gara volunteered— in that particular instance, some Orokin wanted to "glass her" for her audacity (which means "turn her into a cephalon"). Ballas found it funny so turned her into a Warframe with glass powers.

[graceful swan]

Even Ballas as much as a liar as he is even said Volunteers or not becoming a frame as a punishment was probably rare in comparison

[north jolt]

Something I always wondered about some warframes and in particular Stalker (and by extension his acolytes).His body is basically Excalibur, for all intents and purposes, but his actual powers don't match Excalibur's. Depending on rather you're fighting him or playing him in Circuit/Ascension they're more similar to a mishmash of Ash/Mirage/Nyx with their own nuances and differences, and I always wondered if there was a specific lore reason (either stated or theoretical) as to why this is?

Same for the Acolytes, you can tell what main frames each is based on, but they all got the same helm as Stalker and their own mismash of abilities not really matching their aesthetic counterparts

[graceful swan]

Stalker was made when DE were lazy when making models that’s why

He’s a very old frame

[north jolt]

I mean I know that's the REAL reason (similar to the similarities between Nyx and Excal design's too) but Im talking lore

[upbeat glacier]

How does the bo staff kill anyone in Warframe lol

Your just bonking people

[north jolt]

And I know some of his powers like the laser disco ball were probably given to him by Hunhow, right?

[silk atlas]

-The person who has never been hit really hard by a sturdy stick before.

[silk atlas]

There is no lore reason, those are just what he got.

[humble sierra]

There could be a lore reason, considering that Ballas had enough control over the strain to give Gara glass powers as a joke

[silk atlas]

Mirage also completely shafted Ballas and ignored whatever he was trying to do, so it's a nothing burger.

[quartz sky]

Bonked to death

[north jolt]

I just wonder if there was ever like a class of warframes that weren't as "refined" or "specialized" as the ones used by the Tenno. Like with Xaku we already know a bunch of frames are basically lost to time for one reason or another right? so what if the explanation for the aesthetic similarities but mismatched powers is these individuals (Stalker and his acolytes) were kinda just experiments in a way? The Orokin just messing around with abilities and kits and like the Stalker, maybe even tasking some of them to be guardians and protectors? but that's just a theory

A GAME THE...

[quartz sky]

Isn't there a cultural difference between prime frames and regular frames?

There's something in the lore

So I imagine it goes both ways

[north jolt]

Kinda? there are less flashy and decorative mass produced frames, which I guess would make the primes the more "premium" and "artisanal" equivalents

Im not sure if that necessarily applies to Stalker and his acolytes though, who are what Im specifically referring to here

[restive river]

Some primes were awarded

Some came before though

[hushed parcel]

is Equinox actually two people?

[north jolt]

Like you got the acolyte who looks like Limbo, the one who looks like Mesa etc but they don't actually have the ability sets of either

[restive river]

No

[quartz sky]

I did see stuff in the wiki about the black markets versions of orokin prime frames. It implies in the black market they were developing Warframes so I imagine there was some experimentation happening

[quartz sky]

Yeah that was interesting to read about. The orokin made some primes first, and others were based on Tenno original designs

[north jolt]

Also not lore related but DE should just give us Stalker helm at some point and make it universal for all frames

[quartz sky]

As far as stalker and the acolytes, it wouldn't surprise me if they were also transformed as a punishment like him but didn't become a frame they wanted/needed/had too many of so they were either cast out or disappeared during the great collapse because they didn't want to kill

Or found they were too good at killing lol

Probably one of the only groups who recognized the collateral damage of the collapse with all the civilians and stuff that also were killed

Hard to imagine why they hate orokin and Tenno besides that

[north jolt]

I kinda hope we get more actual lore expansion on them along with Stalker

[quartz sky]

Me too!

[north jolt]

But basically the theory I had for the mismatched abilities and features tldr starting out as "second rate" (for lack of a better term) frames given guardian roles like Stalker was before the collapse

[quartz sky]

I like how you put that, totally see it

[north jolt]

Not necessarily "inferior" because we see Stalker's approximate body count by now. More like just, more "crude" compared to mainstream warframes, but still effective

[quartz sky]

Given the importance the orokin put into aesthetics it wouldn't surprise me if they were that shallow and petty

Some of them are noted to just have bits of machinery here or there, as if they were incomplete and were forced to jerryrig themselves together

[north jolt]

Maybe, some of them also share minor aesthetic features with other frames like Torment having some of Equinox's tassels. Could be Orokin's doing, or maybe a trophy of some kind acquired later on?

[quartz sky]

Trophy is more likely given their MO

[restive river]

Considering Stalker is a frame I’d assume the Acolytes are as well

[quartz sky]

There was that whole bit where he hesitated killing the operator because he was possibly remembering when he was a tenno

But idk if it's been confirmed

[north jolt]

Have you played the Jade's Shadow quest yet?

[limber pulsar]

stalker was never a tenno, no warframes were

[north jolt]

And yeah, Im assuming even aside from the helm the other acolytes are similar to Stalker in that regard

[restive river]

He wasn’t a tenno

He never needed a tenno because he never went feral and was wholly loyal to the Orokin

[quartz sky]

Slay

[quartz sky]

Kind of dark considering 1999s premise lol

Needing a tenno that is

[restive river]

Warframes were created without the tenno ever being a thought

Since they predate the discovery of the tenno and transference

Gen 1 frames worked fine until they didn’t
They got scrapped then the tenno came along and they used them again, this time with the tenno to pilot them

[quartz sky]

What made the gen 1 frames "not work"?

[limber pulsar]

turns out forcibly turning random people into infested killing machines doesnt make them very loyal

[quartz sky]

Ah so they unionized lol

But yeah, irritating that we're at square one with 1999 then! Creating Warframes without full consent, using a tenno to keep them in line

[limber pulsar]

less ‘unionize’ more ‘most of them were basically feral animals barely different from the rest of the infested’

[restive river]

Infestation made them go feral

Most went feral anyway, enough that the Orokin scrapped them all together

The Orokin suppressed the consciousness of frames when they implemented the Tenno, letting the Tenno pilot them
Ofc not every frame was scrapped, Jade and Stalker for example
Jade even got a Tenno cause she wasn’t as obedient but didn’t show signs of ferality, plus her having access to the Jade Light probably meant she was too important to just destroy

[quartz sky]

Plus Excalibur umbra

[restive river]

Umbra’s a special case, he was given a special bolt that made him remember killing his son on repeat

[fathom ridge]

A tinge of punishment from Ballas.

[restive river]

He’s mostly just another case that we’ve seen of high emotions / trauma allowing frames to retain sapience

[restive river]

Just a straight up punishment

[quartz sky]

F ballas fr

[limber pulsar]

even then umbra was only a bit above the level of feral beast really. just able to focus that hate towards ballas

[fathom ridge]

Something worse than death unfortunately.

[quartz sky]

I hope Albrecht doesn't "scrap" the hex after he gets what he needs from them

[north jolt]

I wouldn't put it past him, especially how some of them want revenge against him

[quartz sky]

Vicious cycle

[fathom ridge]

I'm sure that wouldn't be the case as Drifter might prevent that.

[quartz sky]

That's what I hope!

[lament stirrup]

I'm pretty sure the reactor going off was him "scrapping" the Hex.
Mind you, I think he picked Hollvania specifically because he already knew the reactor was going to wipe out the city.

[restive river]

The Orokin were good at that

[restive river]

He was
But it seems his actual goal was perhaps for us to get closer to them, love is Wally’s poison after all

[quartz sky]

He is such a romantic and messy homosexual

[restive river]

We love/hate albrecht

[fathom ridge]

He shot us and said "Bond with them to save them smh"

[quartz sky]

Hmmmm, not h*rny enough to save the world, try again

[fathom ridge]

I was genuinely surprised by what Albrecht said when he shot the drifter. I'd expect a "Then die with them" or something like that. It's more like he understood the situation and was willing to have Drifter try this second chance route.

[lament stirrup]

Albrecht, of all people, telling us to be less distant with our loved ones.

[fathom ridge]

You think it's his way of saying don't be like him?

[lament stirrup]

"Don't be like me, kids."

• BANG *

[quartz sky]

Lmao

That tracks

Bad dad's be like

[fathom ridge]

"Learn to love first." Flexes Lex prime

[north jolt]

Should of used Lato Prime if he REALLY wanted to flex

[lament stirrup]

It would be so funny if they revealed that Albrecht has the power of transference and canonically owns an Excalibur prime.

[north jolt]

Or just transfers into Kalymos

[fathom ridge]

Drifter hugging Kalymos? No, Drifter actually hugging Albrecht/j

[quartz sky]

Albrecht becoming an estranged father divorced cat dad

[north jolt]

Albrecht becoming cat

[fathom ridge]

A furry confirmed

[quartz sky]

For his crimes

[lament stirrup]

"Loid, my loyal man-cat."

[fathom ridge]

Speaking of Kalymos. She's basically living with Drifter? If so I imagine she'll be taking up most of Drifter's bed.

[lament stirrup]

The Drifter doesn't have a bed. Kalymos takes the couch and the Drifter sleeps on the floor.

[fathom ridge]

We can always make a bed (I'll never)

[restive river]

There’s multiple couches lol

[lament stirrup]

Kalymos doesn't let the Drifter use any of them.

If they fall asleep in one she just drags them back onto the floor.

[north jolt]

Kalymos owns all of them

[quartz sky]

I want to see kalymos bap ordis around like a cat toy

[fathom ridge]

Kalymos ain't that mean 😭
She'd sleep on top of Drifter. Suffocating them.

[quartz sky]

I feel like she'd sleep in the operator chair

[fathom ridge]

That chair looks uncomfortable ngl

[quartz sky]

Yes, but it looks big and important

[fathom ridge]

Kalymos's way to prevent the operator from working like how cats sleeps on laptops

[blissful merlin]

Low-key wish we could have like….hmmm skins for the operator chair…idk lol. I’m trying to think of cool cosmetics they could do for it. It’d be cool if we could customize it like maybe like the one we were in on lua or something else? More cosmetic items. Just a random thought when I saw people talking about the chair 🤣

[rancid wave]

Don’t you need to be one of the zariman kids for that?

[proper barn]

To transference? Not really. Well you would need a bolt in both of you to do that but they can't do what we do

Of going in and out if a frame.

[hollow flare]

what is the duviri paradox? is it the fact that the drifter and operator need each others help before they can rescue the other one or something?

[proper barn]

Also it's kinda outta time. Cuz you can do it whenever.

But the Drifter gets out of duviri during the like time between we get stabbed and we login back in the new war.

[hollow flare]

cuz the operator doesn't know the drifter's existance until like the second half of the new war, and the drifter could only get out because he/she got helped by the operator

[proper barn]

Cuz they are who bring lotus' Hand back.

Like we regrow lotus from the Hand Drifter gets in duviri.

[hollow flare]

hmm

so without the drifter she'll be wiped out, guess it's also the reason y he has a normal hand in the origin system, or even 1999

[proper barn]

The operator can't escape without the drifters help.

[proper barn]

She was just a Hand even when the quest originally came out btw

[hollow flare]

and vice versa ye

[proper barn]

You just didn't notice.

[hollow flare]

oh I played much later

so for me she was a ghostly figure

[proper barn]

Not she was a hand

Still.

The part of her that was real and not ghostyl was her hand.

Go back and look you'll see. @hollow flare

[restive river]

Don’t you just need somatics and a bolt?

Like ballas wasn’t bolted

[proper barn]

Yes? Or do you both need bolts?

Idk what a bolt would look like

[restive river]

I dont think it says anywhere that both parties need bolts.

[proper barn]

Sure

Does ballas have somatics?

[restive river]

Like we were never bolted, but we did have somatics.

[restive river]

He would have had to have them

[hollow flare]

she looked like this, also a glowy big flower at he hip

[proper barn]

Her hand

[restive river]

This was when she was regrowing from the hand

[proper barn]

Is real and there you just aren't at the right angle

[hollow flare]

I'm not doubting that

[hollow flare]

u said just a hand

[proper barn]

This is a ghost

[hollow flare]

that's what confused me

[proper barn]

Not her real hand anyway.

[hollow flare]

so I thought it was just her hand in the seat

nothing else

[restive river]

Iirc there’s a feint energy version of her

She’s an eidolon by this point

[hollow flare]

yes, that's what I meant by a ghostly figure with a big glowing flower at the hip

[proper barn]

Yee

[restive river]

Ye

[lean garden]

y

[hollow flare]

also 1999 is this alt timeloop dimension right? kinda like duviri?

[proper barn]

No?

It's 1999. We just loop it cuz we can I guess.

[hollow flare]

is it the literal past of the origin system?

or 1999 of another reality

[restive river]

Yes.

[restive river]

Alternate to real world Earth but the true past of the Origin System