Bring back the ability to boss players with a vote

[lime basin]

i wouldnt say that that is accurate raikoh but the current state of lobby meta is weak rn and needs to be iterated on.

[fallow basin]

Just bring back old boss mode. Lmfao. Simple fucking as. The solution is so easy and is what players want.

[golden mirage]

Dont revert boss mode, let it die.

[surreal nexus]

game quality is so fucking ass right now, if something isn't urgently done to revive op lobby, high level BAR may never return

https://tenor.com/view/game-dead-the-finals-dead-game-gif-9930968763958631232

[winged lily]

xD

[surreal nexus]

it makes me sad

[finite steeple]

It's absolutely insane how dramatic you are about this

[sage valve]

I agree with goaf sadly

Massive exodus from high os players

I’ve been playing this game since early 2023 and this is the worst high os lobby state by far

[finite steeple]

Arrakis is running, high OS Isthmus lobby is running, over 50 OS duel is running, uThermal showed up today again - pretty sure we're fine

[upper galleon]

lol

[surreal nexus]

lmfao

[upper galleon]

why this dude nobody knows is speaking like he ever played in good lobbies 😒

[surreal nexus]

why this low os dude lurk around all the threads about trying to revive the op lobby. so many comments, zero actual input. dunno why he bothers, nobody even talks to him

[finite steeple]

Yeah, no idea 🙂

[upper galleon]

we probably culled him out too many times rip

[wicked copper]

They're mad that they'll have 20 lobbies to choose from instead of 21 I guess.

[surreal nexus]

well only one lobby matters at the highest level for 8v8s

[finite steeple]

If it was just to watch you mald it would still be a valid reason, but really, it's because I want to play a good game with a good community

[surreal nexus]

its more sad than mad

[sage valve]

And then how is op lobby dead a good thing ?

[finite steeple]

It isn't - dead OP lobby is not anything I am in favor of

[wicked copper]

Good call; we all delusional I guess.

[sage valve]

Is it cause in the kingdom of the blind the one-eyed man is king ? So kill all op players so the mid 25 to low 30 os players can be kings ? Lol

[surreal nexus]

op lobby is also the best way to get good at the game by spectating

[wicked copper]

It's okay guys, OP lobby isn't dead.

[finite steeple]

but really, it's because I want to play a good game with a good community

[surreal nexus]

I interpreted what he said as saying that it isn't a 'good thing', not 'it isn't dead'

its obviously dead

[wicked copper]

I genuinely wouldn't be surprised either way.

If it was just to watch you mald it would still be a valid reason

[surreal nexus]

that was just a comment bc i insulted him first, its fair to clap back

[wicked copper]

Idk man, that seems to have been their thesis the whole time.

[surreal nexus]

i'm going to put real effort into making an op lobby today wish me luck

[south bluff]

what's your plan goaf

[finite steeple]

Good luck man. I really want everyone to have a good experience. Just not on other people's backs, and especially not on new player's backs

[upper galleon]

this thread look exactly like all the balances threads, always some 12 os dude that keep spamming in lol

[surreal nexus]

Damgam made a new Discord role I'm going to spam ping that until lobby is alive

[finite steeple]

OP lobby currently cruising with~30 OS average

[sage valve]

How are you shitting on new player experience if they have 400 lobbies to play beside ours

[finite steeple]

Getting kicked is a horrible experience no matter whether you have another place to go, and it resulted in a lot of reports because many people being kicked thought it was abuse

[sage valve]

It’s the other way around lol , they are messing with our high os player experience

[sage valve]

If I got kicked I would just git gud and stomp the guy that kicked me , sweatiest revenge ever

People is too mentally weak nowadays

[cinder gust]

🏏 💀 🐴

[finite steeple]

High OS players know the game and don't need to be retained as badly as new players. Putting off new players means the game won't grow

And I get your mentality, but please respect that not everyone shares it and many people would rather just play a game where they do not have frustrating experiences

[wicked copper]

Average is like 20 for the lobby btw

[sage valve]

How is frustrating to get kicked cause you are not good enough ?

Imagine you playing a football game , and randomly Ronaldo and Messi appear and they say they want to have a high level game and they will kick you from the game? Will you get mad ? Lol no , I will just chill outside and enjoy the show , how many times you will have good players together playing ? It’s rare right , while you can play in random football games any day and any time

[odd nimbus]

i concur!
the high os players are useless anyway, they make up 0.1% of the playerbase, therefore who really cares about them!
i say we just ignore them, as the player count keeps increasing, and high os players keep leaving (the teamgame scene), it only shows that they're not needed!!1

[finite steeple]

That is not what I was saying 🙂

[finite steeple]

The average is 26.02625

[odd nimbus]

thats what i was saying, numerically they dont matter

[finite steeple]

New players don't make up a large percentage either, the big mass is probably average players that played for a while already. But new players are the lifeblood of any game or community in general, and that is why the NUX - new user experience - is a critical part of making a good community

If they raise minrating now, average will go to 28

[surreal nexus]

what do you think brings new players to soccer?

it's because they see top players on TV

[finite steeple]

Wanting to be part of something, socializing

[surreal nexus]

and what do you think all those kids are talking about?

[finite steeple]

Well, casual soccer teams anyway

[surreal nexus]

its messi ronaldo etc

its the same for any sport

[finite steeple]

Hmm, I don't know if that holds for the majority, it certainly doesn't hold for me

[surreal nexus]

there are plenty of research papers written on the effect of sports players as influencers for their sport

https://johancruyffinstitute.com/en/blog-en/sport-marketing/athletes-as-fan-engagement-generators/

[finite steeple]

Fair enough, but ... I don't want to be the new Chisato or anything

[surreal nexus]

we're having different conversations - i'm talking about the large scale effect on the playerbase, you are talking about your personal experience

your personal experience is valid

but i'd like more high level games

[finite steeple]

No, we are both extrapolating from our personal experiences - I don't think everyone shares yours

Also, we just won together 😉

[fallow basin]

<@&549291872192036874> I thought baiting non-stop and providing zero contribution wasn’t allowed.

[lime basin]

if literally almost every streamer i watch is complaining about game quality or just not playing probably an issue outside of people that are louder critics of problems. sure, you can tell them to go train 20 people to play at 40os level but how many hours does that take versus just making the environment encourage good gameplay lobbies to form. the question should be about what makes op lobby happen and unfortunately that means u need a boss minus cringe shadowban mechanic (why added?)

[fallow basin]

Well, I started the “op lobby” almost every night for 6 months around dinner time NA time zone and ran it for like 8 hours straight and handed it off to Eurozone around 3:00 AM and then I’d sleep and wake up to an OP lobby still going hard. Now that I’ve moved on and don’t play as much, it’s just fucking dead. Before I did that, we would just log on, start congregating in a noob lobby until it filled with enough good players and then we would boss and minrate. It was a very natural process.

But now without me making lobby and without the natural boss process, lobby just perma dead. Get fucked I guess. lol.

[hot grove]

@fossil spire btw could we have the reasoning why Boss mode was decided to be removed unless its a lobby from scratch? was it highjacking or was it simply decided that votes will take care of lobby curation? or was it something else

this announcement post just assumes that boss wont be necessary if all the commands are votable

[upper galleon]

I member Nezah lobbies, was good times, now game is dead rip

[winged lily]

Well yea that was the conclusion.

Boss no longer needed = we can limit it's usage in public games

All the boss abuse reports have lead to the conclusion that we don't really want bosses in "public" rooms

[hot grove]

general state of lobby with no boss (40 minutes of voting 20minute of gameplay)

[winged lily]

That's another problem to solve

And boss is not the only possible solution

[hot grove]

90% of the boss abuse reports were blocks no?

[winged lily]

blocks, hijacking, kicking "for no reason" or kicking for being a noob

[hot grove]

blocks were never supposed to be a thing

[winged lily]

let's see what Devious says

[finite steeple]

It's just that he kept trying to skip maps he didn't like even after they were voted in 😛

[winged lily]

btw yes I hate the vote hell too

But yea the intention was that when you want to run a game with specific settings and be a boss of it, you host a game yourself

[fossil spire]

• applying new (unfair) settings and immediately starting game, + kickbans/stops mid-game, + stacking teams and immediately starting games... just tons of creative ways people used boss, that other players didn't find fair. We probably saw something like a 5%+ reduction in reports when the boss changes came in, which is pretty huge all things considered.

It was just a huge source of drama, and people tended to take actions by a boss personally whereas they don't take votes nearly as personally. Any tool we can come up with to reduce votes without being as wide-reaching as boss is likely to avoid that extra load.

[south bluff]

has "vote to spec everyone unready/afk" been suggested already? that'd speed things up a bit

[fossil spire]

Spec-unready and auto-spec on minmaxrating change seem like low-hanging fruit, yeah

[wind sorrel]

If you start the lobby are you still the boss

[hallow cargo]

Pretty sure spec unready is already a mod only tesierver command, I think it might be nicer to do it as a SPADS command (real one, not one calling teiserver but that might work as well)

[serene oasis]

Rating check is done on match end already I believe.

[hallow cargo]

Yes. but some want to do it on minmaxrating change.

This was already discussed before

[serene oasis]

Is that not unfair if you waited an hour in queue and can’t play one game?

[hallow cargo]

I think current system is fine as is for that reason

[winged lily]

SHOULD'VE PICKED A ROOM THAT ISN'T GETTING HIJACKED EY

[hallow cargo]

But spec unready would certainly be useful

[winged lily]

ok continue

[hot grove]

you could join the 15 lobbies specifically made for you instead of waiting in a room thats clearly not for you

but same doesnt apply to vets

[winged lily]

everything should apply to everyone equally

no matter if you're 1 OS or 50 OS, 1 Chev or 6

[hot grove]

thats just stupid

[winged lily]

no

[finite steeple]

wtf, how on earth is that stupid

[winged lily]

What I mean by that

You should be kicked out as 50OS when room is 25 max, as much as 15OS should be kicked with 25 min

[hot grove]

if ur 50os ur gonna not gonna enjoy playing with anyone below 15os and it should be so vice versa

people with 40 os gap shudnt be in same room

[winged lily]

Yea

But that should be set up early

Before people flood the queue

Or if things are changed

they should be instantly reflected

like if you set minrating to 30, everyone below should be instantly gone from the queue at least

And everyone in the teams too

From what I understand that is a problem now

Where people already in the room don't get affected by changes to min/max

[hot grove]

i dont think theres too much of problems except that voting makes it so that theres 30minute of lobby sim in between everygame

recently since we accepted that game wouldnt be having too many high os players as before we would just play with minrating 10 and boss would just be for quickly going through map votes, spec votes etc

it would be like 30second lobby time as opposed to 10minute

[wicked copper]

@surreal nexus How was your experiment? (silent incase you're sleeping, not sure what TZ you are)

[finite steeple]

OP lobby happened and got a few games in (including one I snuck into, tehee). Now a rotato lobby turned fairly OP

Average rating was between 24 and 28 in that first OP lobby

[wicked copper]

Sorry, wasn't asking you

[finite steeple]

But there's the answer 🙂

[wicked copper]

Not really.

[south bluff]

how about auto-spectating people coming in from queue who don't ready within n seconds (20?)?

as one of those ! commands

[golden mirage]

The "op" lobby in action XD

[edgy pollen]

Even without vote minmax or vote boss, players can still hijack by votekicking or votespecing out low level players, hypothetically.

[winged lily]

I hate connecting being AFK with Ready state

I might be around and just not ready

But at the same time you can have AFKs that are ready

We need reliable way to tell if someone is AFK and act upon that. There is the Zzz state already but it feels very unreliable. No idea how that works

[lime basin]

yeah afk thing is wonky sometimes it bugs out as well and the person asks why we are voting to spec

[winged lily]

also with queues taking an hour or two, 20 seconds sounds very harsh

[hoary loom]

High OS rotato is so toxic that nobody want go in, maybe a mistake but the reputation is here, nothing about boss feature. And a lot of rotato lobby was a hijack from other lobby, it is what it is

[south bluff]

spec-voting afk people who were queued is one of those things that take a long time

[lime basin]

i have never heard as much toxicity from straits and rotato lobby as ive heard about the glitters lobbies, even the super sweaty straits lobbies

[wind sorrel]

Actual high level OS lobby actually isn't that toxic at all

I mean the actual OP lobby, before it died

[finite steeple]

Probably tabbed out

[surreal nexus]

this guys takes are almost as bad as his ingame plays

which is to say he does the same shit every single day and still fails
🇲 🅰️ 🇩 🇨 🇺 🇿 🅱️ 🅰️ 🇩

[wind sorrel]

Not as an attack, but informational: actual OP Rotato lobbies are traditionally much, much higher. I'm not considered a great player, but the average OS for the 8v8 rotation lobbies I've played in this year is 30.69 OS. OP Lobby games are more like: https://bar-rts.com/replays/1ed47d6601dec7359f690b6315b4548a, https://bar-rts.com/replays/e4e57d6627ab5406c10cb5adf4477b48, or https://bar-rts.com/replays/addc7d665491e6a411e082f588f8d634.

[finite steeple]

Yeah, fair; I guess it's the most OP lobby we can get to work atm

[wicked copper]

That's what we want to fix.

[hot grove]

we arent blocking people out of spite, we arent kickbanning people because theyre not doing meta, its just spec votes for players who arent upto the minrating level its nothing personal

[finite steeple]

Right now the average OS is 27.56

[upper galleon]

It didn't change boss abuse anyways im still getting KB on sight by a player that can't win against me and got tired of dodging me 😦

Won 10 in a row one day against him, never played against me ever again

[edgy pollen]

If we wanted to be extra nice to the newbs, could make it so vote min/max chev/rank cant remove anyone from seat or queue. Like, if the lowest os in the room is 10, can't vote min above 10; if the highest is 50, cant votemax below 50.

Could vote at the threshold, then revote at a higher threshold once that person leaves.

But again all just made moot by votespec, so meh.

[finite steeple]

Yeah, that was my suggestion back in the day to slowly create the OP lobby - creep up the OS whenever possible without kicking someone. But that takes patience

[golden mirage]

True every higher os player has 6+ hours of free time daily to play BAR, they should just wait patiently for the lobby to form.

[orchid glacier]

I appreciate the screenshot complaining about you cherry picking with screenshots.

[edgy pollen]

It's at least the more gentlemanly approach to it. . . . If the high os players were to have some manners and act like nobility instead of impatient peasants with power . . . ;/

[finite steeple]

A nice way to put it

[upper galleon]

yea he's doing the very thing he says im doing
that's how liars work

[winged lily]

Man this thread is going in circles so much i'm surprised it's not closed yet

[edgy pollen]

⬅️ 🦙 ➡️ 🦙 🤏 🦙 🥝 🦙 🤣🦙 🦙

[orchid glacier]

Left llama
Right llama
Little llama?
Kiwi llama
Laugh(funny?) llama
Drama llama
Duck!

I need a translator.

[finite steeple]

I think it's a song

[edgy pollen]

kiwi was the closest thing i could find to "fuzzy"

[orchid glacier]

Anywho, on topic. I'd appreciate a way to end/limit repetitive map change votes, and a way to mass-spec afk/away/not ready people.

Boss was a method to do it, but if we could do the above without a boss we could be in a better place.

[finite steeple]

A custodian role that decides what is played but not who plays would be a way to do the first. A new command that swipes afk people if it passes would be a way to do the second

[fallow basin]

You can pussy foot custodial role all you want. Won’t fix what’s being complained about right now and that’s not what this thread asked for. Oh what do you know, you’re trying to “HIJACK” our boss thread for your custodial idea. Please make your own thread. Thanks.

[surreal nexus]

gg ragebait rated only 7/10

[toxic spruce]

Looks like 99% of users in here only cares about themselves, sad state of elitism.

"Im good therefore listen to what i say"

Your solutions are just ass, you are saying anyone besides you and your level are shit at the game and shouldnt exist and move somewhere else when you join. "There are 20+ noob lobbies just move so we can take over this lobby". This isnt a good solution by any measures.

If you guys are so smart then make a new lobby and wait for ppl to join. Or even better, communicate with each other and make a new lobby when you see players exist to fill 3v3-8v8.

Elitism will always ruin new player experience and its frowned upon from everyone but yourself.

The devs want increase of playerbase and once new players sees the elitism they will surely speedrun abandon the game (and spread bad reputation) or only play lowest possible os lobbies hiding in a corner hoping you dont join to take it over. Probably the worst new player experience possible and that shouldnt be allowed to happen.

This segregation means new players learn way slower for not getting mixed with better players and you will get a lot more casual/low skilled playerbase.

You wont become good by putting low os vs low os, this is just facts.

[surreal nexus]

You wont become good by putting low os vs low os, this is just facts.

Hate to say it but despite making a compelling set of arguments against current high OS players, once you finished your textual diatribe you finally reached the same conclusion that the people in favor of catering to high OS have been stating the entire time

GG at undermining yourself though

OP lobby is dead, the players that have left have said that enough isn't being done to facilitate OP lobby existing (priority queue, lobby hijacking), and so now you don't have high OS games for low OS to learn from

[toxic spruce]

Wait what? Im saying you should be inclusive. High os dont care one cent about low os, if they could they would remove em from the game completely as its just an annoyance/obstacle.

This is how people talk in here.

Totally forgetting you yourself were once a noob. Reflect plz.

[surreal nexus]

I got specced from lobbies a bunch when I was new, I didn't complain, I took it as a challenge to get better, gain OS, meet the min OS requirement, and then defeat the people that specced me. I got better by speccing the higher OS games. /reflect

[leaden solar]

Seems like being the best players worldwide in the only real true gamemode comes with a big nerf on being able to discuss and convince people of your arguments

[surreal nexus]

It was never inclusive, it never needed to be, it still doesn't. being inclusive ruins the experience for the people that want to play high level games

[leaden solar]

There are so many mixed things being called for in the various threads, as some wise person said above, maybe try to summarize things into actionable things that are not "revert things to before"

[toxic spruce]

What im suggesting is to not ruin new player experience by takeovers, there are better solutions than hijacking.

[surreal nexus]

there was already good progress this week with the new Discord role

it created a ~20 avg. OS lobby for 4 games

maybe that's been happening organically without the role but not during the times I've been playing

I think a good analogy is football - the English Premier League is not inclusive

[toxic spruce]

Thats a tournament

[surreal nexus]

i'll use a different analogy then

Challenger level league of legends is not open to Bronze players

[topaz mural]

20 avg is still kind of eh. I went in, saw that I'd be among the top os, concluded that it'd be no different from a non-op lobby, and closed to play scavs instead

[surreal nexus]

ideally it's min 30-35 OS but that hasn't happened for a very long time

[toxic spruce]

Matchmaking might fix everything for sure. Its just a question if it arrives in time.

[surreal nexus]

probably since before lobby hijacking was removed tbf

[topaz mural]

there were 0 players who qualify as min 35 at the time, even you were 34

[surreal nexus]

we had chisato and teddy who qualify

[topaz mural]

that was after I'd left, sorry

[surreal nexus]

and my journey from 40 to 34 has been paved with playing games with noobs

its not fun

i'm very anti noobs. I don't like them

[serene oasis]

the players that have left have said that enough isn't being done to facilitate OP lobby existing

Are there players who just left due to one of these reasons:

1. Not getting along with others at the top
2. Boredom
   ?

[surreal nexus]

absolutely

also burnout, wife aggro, dieing (rip arbaron), and finding other games

[buoyant junco]

wife aggro
dying

[steady magnet]

actually the players that don't get along with other ppl are the only ones still playing the game, everyone else is taking a break playing other games

[toxic spruce]

Having op lobby doesnt mean you have to ruin other lobbies. New players shouldnt need to expect changing lobbies just because someone hijacked.

The elitism part is "im here move along or get kicked". While it should be "ok enough players for op lobby WE move".

[surreal nexus]

i accept that completely, i know others dont

lobby hijacking was never nice and it makes sense that its gone, but as an indirect and not fully correlated consequence, op lobby is gone too

while i personally still think the ends justify the means for lobby hijacking, it makes even more sense to me that others see it differently and I think they're basically right to remove it

[finite steeple]

Saber, I wish you didn't block me because I agree completely 😛 and I am glad for your perspective. everyone who makes me feel less like I am screening into the wind ...

[fossil spire]

Lobby hijacking isn't gone though? Nothing is stopping people from voting in a minrating on a lobby, its just that what is happening is obvious to the voters now

[topaz mural]

just to confirm, you are screaming spiteful nonsesnse into the wind

[surreal nexus]

jesus this Devious Null too op with the facts

[toxic spruce]

Removing is simply a click of a button opening a new lobby with mirror settings.

Goaf is in Team 1, hes been playing a few noob games waiting for op ppl to join, he sees its enough for 3v3-8v8, he invokes command oplobby? This asks all players in lobby and friendlist if they should make an op lobby. 7 out of 20 clicked yes. Goaf accepts? Then yes new lobby is made for 4v4 or more if more op players follow suit.

I dont see how this cannot exist.

This could even be automated as more op players comes online.

Single checkbox "do you want oplobbies to form? Yes.

[topaz mural]

let's see how this plays out once minrating actually has an immediate effect

[leaden solar]

Let me give a try at disentangling some of the points.

• Things take a lot of time to vote

  • minrating vote: not a problem imo. goes through regularly, you do it once every few rounds depending on queue. priority queue would be great to have, but not necessary
  • lobby settings vote: its a one time thing per lobby, hijacked or not. shouldnt be an issue.
  • speccing afk players: not really a new thing, not a problem in other lobbies. a "spec all afk players" vote at once could be helpful but seems like a small detail
  • nextmap vote spams: rotato exclusive problem. there have been multiple additions like the auto rotate command, plus choosing various limited sets of maps to rotate through. if you still dont like some maps in there, maybe come up with a smaller pool? (or just stick with 1 map lol). this seems to be the main time consuming bit where boss mode can help.

• Getting a lobby started in the first place

  • Hijacking: A lot harder now, and seems like its not coming back. You might want to try "hijacking" an existing low os rotato lobby rather than converting a glittery isthmus lobby that youre currently in. Idk about this
  • No Streameur / Less High OS ppl sticking around: Is this really just because of boss changes? Or is this a convenient scapegoat?

• Arrakis block list drama

  • idk seems like an ego problem all around. the drama has been going on for months, be it with threads about how cheetah doesnt deserve his OS while cheering on xfactor for queueing with hoelander for low OS op take abuse. that well seems so poisoned i dont get why raikoh & co still want to join that specific glitters lobby so badly? why keep joining a group that despises you, and you despise them? only somewhat comparable situation on isthmus is insta dodging when shoty joins to build 100 AFUs, but thats usually 1 kickban after a thrown game and not some blacklist stuff.

[finite steeple]

yeah, you need a proper majority now, and from what I've seen yesterday, people don't seem to be very eager to spec people - it seems to have more been the people that would ask for boss

[sage valve]

It’s easier to delegate everything to a boss , and have 1 guy managing the lobby instead of 16 people , this is the same in democracy , we all have 1
President right ? Only thing is make sure you boss Vote right people

As for noobs , they will get force spectated that’s a fact. It’s a painful experience for them to get rolled Instantly , same for high os.

Hybrid lobbies also make high os players stop playing the lobby

[odd nimbus]

from observation, seems like it detects mouse movement on lobby, so u can be watching a video while waiting for people to sort themselves out (cus that takes like 10mins usually) and you get the ZZZ, and if i were to get specced/kicked for that, it'd also be pretty ass

[finite steeple]

You'd have the time during the vote and hopefully a ring before that to move your mouse, and then the command shouldn't spec you any more

[rotund dune]

I think the lack of OP lobby is hurting BAR and we should do what we can to bring it back. For many players its aspirational to watch and a endgame target. For others it is a lobby that collects the most competitive people and makes the rest of the lobbies more chill. For me main issue is that minratingvotes is too difficult to get to pass.

[hot grove]

I think new blood need to be high OS players now, new streamers etc. seems the population has rotated out

[rotund dune]

#midtieristhenewOP Its sad but our 25 average lobbies are usually the ones getting big queues and massive views now. Thankfully there is some new streamers these days but will take a while for them to get to your level. What happened to Spreeezy?`I mean i have heard some rumours, but dont really know. Spreeez seemed to be able to draw some OPs out of hiding

[serene oasis]

Spreezy left due to conflicts with some people he played with.

[hot grove]

Spreezy had the best rage baiting content can't deny that

[rotund dune]

I heard he was straight up bullied. Regardless, OP lobby is important. We need to figure out how to get it back up on regular basis. Reduce lobbysim should be a priority imo.

[cinder gust]

A high skill competitive lobby is important. A lobby full of people who constantly toe the line of moderation and are perceived (whether correctly or not) by the vast majority of the rest of the community to negatively impact their games when they join them less so

[hot grove]

Bro I'm moderated like 20 times I'm still less toxic than most ppl in other lobbies it's not even close

Sheep is considered toxic but he literally just flames gameplay-only

[rotund dune]

Thats one of the reasons why they need a place of their own to hang out.

[cinder gust]

Maybe one of the (many) reasons the 'op lobby' has become a problem to keep alive, is because the new players who are becoming skilled don't like playing in that environment.

[hot grove]

I gave up on flaming gameplay but it's something I shud do so PPL git gud

[rotund dune]

True, we are many that might have evolved past mid tier that avoid OP because we are to old/casual to getting flamed. I personally cant stand even people calling me noob, so i play with people i know and like

I still think we need OP lobby. This game needs a high level competive scene outside of tournaments

[hot grove]

Currently the highest skill games r FFA bcz yudi x-factor star etc only play FFA now

[cinder gust]

The amount of derogatory comments in these threads, in lobbies, in games from people based purely on "your os is below 20 stfu" is quite frankly appalling.

You want more good players to play with, but seem to think the only way to cultivate them is to abuse them into learning to play better for the privilege to join the 'op lobby'. Everyone here has equal rights, rights are not linked to OS, and never should be.

[topaz mural]

Is the amount of derogatory comments towards skilled players no less appalling? Even if they're coming mostly from 1 persistent dude who you keep enabling

[cinder gust]

You cannot be part of a community purely with he goal to use it for your own ends, with no accountability and responsibility to actually foster the community. It's not here for your enjoyment, its here for everyones

[hot grove]

I've gave my 2 cents in threads for what they were worth, did some bug reports etc. literally all I'm asking for is boss back lulw

[topaz mural]

The amount of toxicity I see from lower-level players vastly outnumbers the toxicity from 40+ os. Some of it is that there's just a lot more noobs around to be toxic, but in significant part it's because hating on successful people is apparently a socially acceptable thing to do.

[hot grove]

At the end of the day, what we want is what other players will eventually want when they start to understand the game. So it's not a selfish ask

[rotund dune]

You all got valid points. OP lobby self-destructed, but wasnt helped by lobby changes. I personally think its better to gather the intense sweats instead of mingling them with the rest. But instead of having a self-policed lobby we could actually create an environment that works for high os rotato players.

[rotund dune]

I want an OS system that doesnt value me higher than you because i play lower level players than you do. That makes me avoid OP lobby. It wont be fun to play 2 weeks straight with losses and flaming before my OS is balanced correctly vs OP players

[hot grove]

Yeah some people asked for OS decay so inactive players don't come back and get farmed for the next 20 games

Saw some very old player come back at 37os and lose back to back to 20os bcz he's playing after months. There shud be some decay on it but it's different issue for thread I guess

[cinder gust]

So, not going to actually discuss points, just gonna keep moving goal posts?

[odd nimbus]

thats literally unfixable without forcing intermingling

[rotund dune]

i know. or making OS relative to map etc. Or cap OS gain to difference between your os and lobby average os.

[hot grove]

The thread was never on point, it's talking abt op lobby's state which is for #1277718157074759681 and #1233481418500345928.

Already have discussed what could be done regarding boss.

1. Bring old boss back
2. Introduce new role to skip through lobby votes faster but with less overall privileges
3. Make voting faster by detecting non voters and counting them as !vote b

[cinder gust]

So, that's a no. thx for confirmation

[topaz mural]

4. fix the startbox bugs

[hot grove]

What r the startbox bugs

[topaz mural]

mostly pve thing, but if you want to troll a lobby, try moving around the startboxes. Even if the change gets voted no, the startbox is still deleted and needs a new vote to return

[hot grove]

I remember whispering !loadboxes to server host to brick the startboxes in op lobby sometimes

[cinder gust]

"I remember doing things to deliberately make the game experience worse for my community sometimes"

[hot grove]

It's just a game why r u so serious

It's called trolling we do it sometimes to have fun

[cinder gust]

Because you keep asking everyone to take it seriously and play competitively, but only when it suites you

[hot grove]

I always play competitively

Even when I'm half afk I'm more competent than most players according to stats

[cinder gust]

and we're back to elitism

have a good day

[hot grove]

Rippsy just baiting at this point

0 real input just going around in circles

[golden mirage]

From what I understand thats not rly the case. Maybe partly ye

[golden mirage]

100% this, a lot of ppl just play smth else (we do have sick lounge minecraft server) and the state of bar isnt encouraging.

[lime basin]

your new games have failed and where does that bring you? Back to me. -minecraft

[rotund dune]

You think they will come back if changes are made?

[golden mirage]

I dont see any promising changes that are being made so I guess not.

[finite steeple]

Do you really think the ability to promote a boss is the essential pinnacle of high OS player retention technology?

[rotund dune]

I think making high os players find a match at their level within reasonable time is essential. We play games for fun, its not fun waiting forever to fill minrating lobby. This is something we should prioritize to fix.

[finite steeple]

Absolutely, but bringing back the old boss nonsense is not the answer (and I doubt it would change much anyway)

[rotund dune]

My suggestion is making minratinglevel require alot less votes. Maybe also autospec people below the requirement as soon as passed and not after next game. We need matchmaking badly and have to make bad solutions like this until we got it

[finite steeple]

What do you mean "a lot less"? It certainly can't take less than a majority, and I think every vote takes the same proportion to pass, so changing minrating alone wouldn't really make sense

[split solar]

Btw guys maybe you could make some public event on the official thread called „high level lobby” this way you could synchronize at least 16 players to kickstart your own lobby and end this sad drama?

[mossy hatch]

there is no need, there isnt enough players for that anymore

[rotund dune]

50% should be enough and non voters removed from count.

[split solar]

At least try ;c

[faint merlin]

was a fairly decent looking min rating 10 lobby i saw on twitch for all of one game before it died

[hot grove]

I can troll and still beat u in 1v1

Keep the shit to urself ur no one

[lime basin]

omg i am SO MAD that people put up straits votes in rotato lobbies as a joke

also can we note that the expectation on high os/competitive players is to play competitively at all times but they complain about others not doing it regularly they get called out for that time that they made hovers on a land map 50 games ago

[orchid glacier]

Beating someone 1v1 is not relevant to being avoided in team games due to being a self-admitted troll.

[hot grove]

I'm 44os in team games what r u again

[lime basin]

also its not good for the game that its content creators on twitch arent streaming/playing the game when those guys make tournas and organize so much (nebu, volshok, ldm, even zow was helping cast op) we need people making content to get more playuers

[cosmic quartz]

I'm going to take this as a summary of ideas from this thread, as I'm not going through 1k+ posts of it:

Please feel free to suggest other ways of solving the problem. As far as I can tell, boss is not coming back at this time. 1. and 2. both sound like complete non-starters, 3. maybe but you will have to do the digging and propose a concrete implementation that improves votes.

I'm now going to close this thread, as, as pointed out previously, it's going around in circles and devolving into flinging shit at each other. Once you have a solid proposal, open a new one.