[NCIP 24] Arena Improvements. 24.12.30

[last relic]

NCIP: https://github.com/planetarium/NCIPs/blob/ncip-24/NCIP/ncip-24.md

Abstract

The Arena feature is transitioning detailed rule processing to external services to reduce on-chain load and improve nuanced rules, aiming for a better gaming experience. Key updates include changes to ranking and scoring calculations, opponent list refresh methods, and clan score processing.

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Motivation

1. Reduce timing sensitivity in Arena rules:
   • Improve user experience by addressing high timing sensitivity, especially noted during the service disruption on Thor Planet on December 18, 2024.
2. Expand operational flexibility:
   • Create an environment where entities beyond Planetarium can manage Arena events.
3. Reduce player fatigue:
   • Simplify decision-making by reducing the need to check extensive opponent lists before playing.

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Rationale

1. Offloading detailed rule processing to external services reduces chain load, enabling more intricate handling.
2. Create rule structures that accommodate players from various time zones.
3. Enable customizable rules (e.g., scoring and ranking methods) for different event organizers.
4. Enhance player experience by providing tailored opponent lists based on player’s level.

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Specification

Arena Rule Changes

• Ticket Refill Count:
  • Initial and subsequent refills grant 5 tickets.
  • A total of 20 refill stages provides up to 100 tickets as before.
  • Additional ticket purchases limited to 40 tickets (4 per interval).
  • Purchase Prices:
    • Season: Starts at 1, increases by 0.2 per purchase.
    • Championship: Starts at 2, increases by 0.2 per purchase.
• Score and Ranking Updates:
  • Current: Score and rank updated after each battle.
  • Revised:
    • Updates occur at the start of each ticket refill interval.
    • Scores and win/loss stats for battles within an interval are displayed in the UI and reset at the next interval.

• Opponent List Updates:
  • Current: Opponents are displayed within a range of +200 to -100 points of the player’s score.
  • Revised:

    • At each ticket refill interval, 5 fixed opponents are displayed based on rank groups:

      • Groups: 2 groups above, 1 group at the same rank, and 2 groups below.
      • Opponents are chosen randomly from these groups.
      • Opponent refresh:
        • First refresh per interval is free.
        • Subsequent refresh costs: 10K crystals (second refresh), 1 NCG (for further refreshes).

    • Scoring Table:

      Group	Range (%)	Win Score	Loss Score
      Upper 1	20–40% above	+24	-1
      Upper 2	40–80% above	+22	-2
      Same	80–120% equal	+20	-3
      Lower 1	120–180% below	+18	-4
      Lower 2	180–300% below	+16	-5

    • If fewer than 5 opponents are available in groups, additional opponents are selected from lower groups.

    • Example: Rank 1 player’s list includes 2 from the same group and 3 from the group below.

  • Battles cost 5 AP per action.
  • Ingredients previously awarded as Arena rewards are now obtainable from specific stages in each world.

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Battle and Score Processing Updates

• Opponent List & Scoring:
  • Transferred from on-chain contracts to dedicated external services.
• Event Management:
  • Allows event organizers other than Planetarium to customize rules (e.g., scoring and ranking).
• On-Chain Records:
  • Chain will log and return battle results processed through external services.

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Clan Battle Feature

• Clan Scoring:
  • Clan scores are calculated by summing the top 10 players’ scores within the clan.
• Rewards:
  • Clan rankings determine rewards at the end of the season.
• Details:
  • Refer to the dedicated NCIP for clan-related updates.

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Expected Schedule

• Initially planned for Thor Planet in 200270, but due to the complexity of transitioning rule handling to external services, it will be implemented in 200280.
• 200280 Adjustments:
  • Simultaneous Arena updates across all chains.
  • Thor-specific temporary clan rankings and aggregation for final testing before full deployment.

1. Early February 2025: Previewnet setup and feedback collection.
2. Mid-February 2025: Mainnet release with version 200280:
   • Ticket refill timing updates.
     • Display 5 opponents based on rank groups.
     • Additional opponent refresh options.
   • Clan ranking and list display.
     • Additional rankings and rewards for top clan members (Thor-only).

[placid barn]

This looks great!

Can we attack the same enemy multiple times in a round?

[last relic]

By default, each opponent on the list can only be battled once unless the list is refreshed.
However, if the same opponent appears again after refreshing the list, you can battle them once more before refreshing again.

[placid barn]

That sounds fair

I guess that sending a fight attempt outside of the list of 5 with third party apps will result in a fail?

[last relic]

The fight results on the chain will be processed correctly. However, if they do not go through the Arena service managed by each organizer, they will not be reflected in the respective Arena's score. This system is currently under preparation.

[sage egret]

no more minus points in failed defense?

[crystal frigate]

are we forced to use the arena pvp api? or we can continue using another arena api like now?

[last relic]

That part will be announced once further progress has been made. Thank you for your patience.

[gleaming wave]

I don't quite understand how to get points.
I understand that you see 5 people, but if you attack a group that is in the top group and a group that is in the bottom group, do you get the same points?
If my group is in the top group, do you get 24 points then?

[gleaming wave]

Is there a score penalty if the defense fails?

At the beginning of the arena, the scores are almost the same, but I'm curious how the upper, middle, and lower groups will be distributed.

[gleaming wave]

Are you going to enjoy the end of the year by raising important topics and making people curious?

[dusk escarp]

Hi. These Arena specs updates look very interesting and sound fair! Love it! 💯💯👑👑

May I ask for some clarifications:

1. The upcoming Arena events (approx. next week) will still use the old format, won’t it?

2. Is there a limit to how many list’s refreshes you can make each interval (cost NCG) ?

3. The opponents we defeated, will they lose points?

[gleaming wave]

I think it would cost more each time the list is refreshed.

[keen trail]

There's also the possibility for the external API's (i.e 9CAPI) to match what the external system is doing. It's going to depend if that system's code is open source and not completely RNG, but rather a replicable logic.

It could also mean the end of unofficial arena results. But I'm not currently too worried about this.

[dusk escarp]

Costing more will be better I agree.

[tawdry garnet]

I love the changes, but I think I will only really understand them in practice, will we have a preview server to test? 🙏

[keen trail]

Early February, yes

[crystal frigate]

i am very worried as alot of mods depends on it, we will see soon then.

[keen trail]

Considering Planetarium heavily endorses modding. I highly doubt they will intentionally make it that way.

Even if the initial version may not be external API friendly, it is something that could be worked on.

[crystal frigate]

that is good to know

[keen trail]

Personally, I'm not too worried right now. There isn't much here that makes worried at this time. There isn't anything here that would me go "yeah, 9CAPI PVP is over".

[tawdry garnet]

i read the article on the website and it's better to translate than on discord, i liked it even more 🤣

different system for gaining and losing points too, I thought it was cool

[keen trail]

I hope that planetarium can however specify the headless branch of the previewnet when it occurs. So Third Party Devs can look at the new system as early as possible.

[tawdry garnet]

this is necessary for everyone to be able to adjust

[keen trail]

Ideally want to test any 9CAPI Implementations during previewnet. Not during the release.

[tawdry garnet]

exact

[last relic]

The five players shown to you will vary based on your rank and points. However, for every player, defeating the opponent at the top of your list will earn you 24 points, while defeating the opponent at the bottom will earn you 16 points.

If the table is not displaying clearly on Discord, please refer to the NCIP document for more detailed information. Thank you!

[last relic]

We are still debating whether to retain the point deduction when losing to a designated opponent. For now, in the initial draft, we have removed this penalty.

[last relic]

This has been delayed for quite some time, but I wanted to start the discussion on this matter before the year ends.

[last relic]

1. Unfortunately, it seems we will need to continue using the current method until the next Arena.
2. For now, there doesn’t appear to be a specific limit on refreshes. (Although repeatedly refreshing by spending NCG is not something we actively encourage.)
3. As I mentioned in response to Somaking's question above, we are currently considering removing this feature. However, if there are strong opinions in favor of keeping it during this discussion, we may consider reintroducing it.

[last relic]

Yes, we aim to complete the development as quickly as possible, set up the previewnet, and facilitate thorough testing and discussions.
Please bear with us for a little while longer~ 😊

[last relic]

Thank you for your valuable feedback. If similar opinions arise after more players experience it firsthand, we will consider making adjustments.

[last relic]

Thank you for your valuable feedback. If similar opinions arise after more players experience it firsthand, we will consider making adjustments.

[placid barn]

It might be possible to get a lot of tied scores without the penalty on defence losses. Although it might be close to impossible to get max points all the time

There is also something fun and strategic in beating specific players so that you can finish in front of them

Which is only possible if they lose points on defense

[glacial crystal]

I think we need to limit the number of times the list refreshes to avoid players changing it unlimitedly to be 100% sure of winning.

and when the list is refreshed will the weak player be repeated and attacked multiple times,and when the defense fails will the chosen person lose points?

I also think about locking items before the season starts to avoid familiar opponents being able to remove or transfer items to each other, thanks a lot

[gleaming wave]

If my character is ranked 1st during the season, will a character appear that can get 24 points?

[gleaming wave]

If the refresh cost doesn't increase, everyone will just keep refreshing until they see a weak opponent. I think the refresh should happen automatically every 30 minutes and the cost should increase for the rest.

[glacial crystal]

I think by limiting the number of times the opponent refreshes, increasing the price will be unfair to new players.

[placid barn]

this is a very very good point.

Maybe just having the same points on all available targets (no matter their points, more or less) and make the difference in ranks from minus points on defenses lost could be simpler?

For anyone in top 10 it would be impossible to get max points with the current proposed system. So maybe in the final round someone can come from behind and get a better rank simply because he has more available maximum points that the top players cannot get

[gaunt sparrow]

How to avoid all the players battle in the last 20 minutes could get more chance to win?

[placid barn]

the enemy lists are locked on ticket reset, it makes no difference mo matter when you fight

Another thing i noticed is that buying tickets is way more impactful than before.
Right now we have 20 rounds x 8 tickets + 40 extra, for a total of 200.
After the rework there are 20 x 5 + 40 extra, for a total of 140.
So they give 40% extra points, compared to the current 25%
They are also capped at 4 per round. That means players will have to buy extra tickets in half the rounds.

**Isn't it too much? **Almost half of the arena is based on extra tickets... Maybe limit them to 20 / season and make them a bit more expensive? That way we keep the "tradition" of buying tickets in just the last 5 rounds and keep their impact to 25%.

[gaunt sparrow]

I think it tells me that updates occur at the start of each ticket refill interval. not at the start of each refill stage.So this may resolve the first ticket what you use, but the remain 4 tickets also has the same problem. the later the better.

[placid barn]

I think it just updates what you did during that round, as in win loss and ticket status, but what you can attack and how many point you can get on each enemy is locked for the round

[keen trail]

My way of reading this is that it updates the targets you can attack after each ticket usage. The leaderboard remains on round finish.

But until we see the implementation it's up to interpretation.

[elder garden]

The new system will let the chain handle battles and record the results, and Arena providers will decide scores based on those outcomes.
Since it’s a different approach, the APIs will probably need to be updated too.

[elder garden]

We’re planning to make the development process and server open to the public, even before the preview.
Please check the arena-service channel on the Planetarium Dev server for updates. Unfortunately, I can’t share the link here as it’s restricted. 🙂

If you have any questions or requests related to development, feel free to ask in the arena-service channel on the Planetarium Dev server.

Whether it’s asking for an API to support your website or one for analysis purposes, we’re open to all kinds of suggestions!

[gleaming wave]

Currently, this game has very few new users, so it may not be a consideration. And I think limiting refreshes will make the arena battles a little more intense. (I think there will also be a little more trading in the market, such as strengthening equipment, etc.)

I think the Arena reward rankings should also be reduced. Currently, almost all Arena participants receive rewards, so I think rewards below 50 are almost meaningless. There are probably many users who don't even stake 500 gold, so rewards below 250 are not very meaningful.

[glacial crystal]

I'm thinking of eliminating daily gold roll call and increasing the arena rewards for positions 250 and above to encourage new players.

[last relic]

Yes, we’ve carefully reviewed your concerns about the unlimited refreshes and non-increasing costs. We will consider adjustments to this aspect, update the changes, and request further feedback. Thank you for your valuable input!

[last relic]

Yes, it is likely that the second-ranked player will appear in the list where you can earn 24 points. If no players meet the basic conditions, the system will check one rank below at a time to find eligible opponents.

[last relic]

Yes, we’ve carefully reviewed your concerns about the unlimited refreshes and non-increasing costs. We will consider adjustments to this aspect, update the changes, and request further feedback. Thank you for your valuable input!

[last relic]

If no players meet the basic conditions, the system will check one rank below at a time to find eligible opponents.

[last relic]

Yes, we will also take your suggestion into further consideration. Thank you!

[last relic]

The opponent list and score criteria are fixed at the start of each round (at each ticket refill timing).
Even if you use 1 or 2 tickets, the list and rankings will not be refreshed.

[last relic]

The opponent list and score criteria are fixed at the start of each round (at each ticket refill timing).
Even if you use 1 or 2 tickets, the list and rankings will not be refreshed.

[last relic]

Allowing new players to earn Arena rewards aligns well with the basic direction of the game. However, since Nine Chronicles has been a long-running game, it requires significant investment for new players to catch up with the progress and growth of existing, long-time players.

This is why we are actively exploring various new approaches to address this balance. Your interest and feedback in these efforts would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!

[tawdry garnet]

https://tenor.com/view/ban-discord-mod-gif-17404888196318737743

[last relic]

Subject: Arena Improvements & Apology for Delayed Update

Hello,

We apologize for the delay in sharing this update. We wanted to provide a confirmed announcement once development had progressed sufficiently.

The various situations that occurred in this arena have been valuable lessons in improving future arenas. However, we sincerely apologize for any frustration they may have caused. We will make the following changes for the next arena:

Target Selection Adjustment

If there are more than 1,000 participants, target selection will be limited to the top 1,000 ranks. This prevents lower-ranked, ineffective targets from being exposed, as seen in the previous Odin and Heimdall arenas.
UI Enhancements

The current round and purchased tickets will now be displayed in the UI. We regret that players had to memorize this information manually, and we appreciate your patience.
Stability Improvements

We are making adjustments to ensure smoother operation in cases where node conditions are unstable or equipment status changes are not properly reflected.
We highly value player feedback and will continue to explore various improvements to create a stable and engaging arena experience.

Thank you for your support!

[spiral locust]

Maybe, can we have a free auto refresh after every battle? I mean to give chance to actually get +22 without spending our refreshes since they are limited?

[glacial crystal]

Why not randomly 100 points above and below each person
For example : He A rank 30 poin 3100, roll random

• 22đ : random rank poind 3170-3200 (%...)
  +21đ: random rank poind 3120-3169 (%...)

....

+16đ-20đ: random rank poind 3000-3119 (%...)

The opponent selection mechanism will be similar to the old mechanism, creating fairness and less focusing the war on one person

[glacial crystal]

It is unreasonable because it will be a war of the rich and will cause unfairness

[spiral locust]

How come it become unreasonable when everyone's opponents refreshes after evey battle. This is regardless if the player is rich or not.
The current setup requires reset after fighting off the +22. The rich that you mention benefits on this as we the poor ones, have our every NCG count.