#Visibility is unbearably bad in 0.13 (FIXED IN 0.13.1!!)

307 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

manic shard
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Not sure if others are talking about this, but WOW 0.13 is such a massive letdown. All the new features seem really cool, the issue being that the new update is borderline unplayable due to the atrocious visibility, particularly in forest. Fog is way too thick, and enemies are now much duller looking, so it can at times be straight up impossible to tell where an enemy is even if theyre like, 5 feet from you. This is made even worse by the tall grass, which despite being thick enough to fully blind you, the player, the enemies have zero problem whatsoever shooting you through it as if it didnt exist. Even with enemy vision set to the lowest it will go, I always get spotted first 100% of the time, because of how absurdly close you need to get in order to actually see anything. The train yard in forest is particularly egregious in this regard, with the high amount of props, enemies, and grass, meaning that even if you can spot one enemy, you'll get flanked and killed by the 40 others that were invisible.

This is made even worse by enemies being almost totally silent. Sure, they have voice lines which play periodically, but apart from that they seem to make zero noise. No running sounds, no dialogue (unless theyve already spotted you) no gun sounds (apart from shooting, at which point it is too late). It feels as if enemies just materialize out of thin air now and it is viscerally un-fun.

Not to mention, the new fog just looks super ugly. Just all around a terrible addition. Day and night now have basically no distinction, as you cant see anything in either of them! :/

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Also, this is made so much worse for those of us playing on airlink with a quest. If you think visibility is terrible right now, imagine how bad it would be if your screen is effectively 500px of resolution due to AL's shitty bitrate at times.

twilit tide
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Man i don't know what game you're playing but this is not my experience at all.

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are your settings just cranked down to like minimum?

elfin nacelle
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Yeah I really dislike the fog and the x-ray mimics, but the game looks fine to me, it's pretty majestic tbh

glass willow
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Check this thread if you agreen with anything

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The most important info is on the start, then its just a yap fest

manic shard
glass willow
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Head onto our home base of Fanta Forest, we be the Fanta Forest Haters Club

manic shard
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yeah

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the worst part is when you load into the map, the fog takes a bit longer to load than the rest of the level (on a hdd) so for a brief few seconds the game TAUNTS you with how it used to look, and then gets dunked in the tomato soup

glass willow
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The Fanta Forest yeah

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Its my biggest enemy rn, its really tiring to play that map

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Look at this shit

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12 minutes difference

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Pechorsk/Forest

manic shard
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Wow even your forest looks way better than mine, wtf? I dont have any screenshots on hand but I dont think Id be able to even see to the end of that traincar on your right.

manic shard
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Not to mention the fog is also way brighter orange for me which is so hard on the eyes

glass willow
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This looks more similiar?

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Its varies trough the day

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Gets darker and darker and darker

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But theres never normal light

manic shard
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yeah except still, the fog seems to set in for you at liiike, ~100m out, for me its more like 20m out 😵‍💫

glass willow
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peninusla is crazy foggy

manic shard
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Can hardly see whats infront of me, if it wasnt for the fact that Id played plenty in 0.12, id be getting lost every minute in forest

manic shard
glass willow
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Yeah its really bad, it looks way worse in VR the screenshots dont really do it justice

manic shard
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but forest is so big, with so many enemies (who arent impacted by the fog at all) that its just awful

glass willow
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Yeah the forest is really bad

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Like borderline unplayable xd

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Atleast for me

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After spending couple hours there its just too much

manic shard
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especially with how enemies now have less visible outlines, the lack of light even in midday means they just become one with the props

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and it becomes impossible to spot a mimic ~10m away until they move or shoot

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The first top priority mission in forest, which normally I have 0 issue with at all, took me 3 outings, and the train yard part took the better part of half an hour to actually beat because of how nightmarishly hard it was to see the enemies (Combine with how it seems soldier mimics are tankier now? One ate THREE slugs to the chest at point blank and shrugged it off!)

glass willow
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But like you said, fanta forest is extreme difficulty right now, just unfair and unfun at this point

brazen venture
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The weird darkness should be fixed now

slow shell
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imma try it

glass willow
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ill be the judge of that

glass willow
brazen venture
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report back

glass willow
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Is there patch notes?

brazen venture
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[Radius Locations] Made the Forest location less dark.

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this is the relevant bit

glass willow
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Lets hope it actually fixes the fanta

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Pretty quick hot fix ngl good job mr devs

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Good shit its fixed

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This is 7am

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But

slow shell
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what but

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the crosshairs in the magnifier where not supposed to be there

glass willow
rancid rune
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I don't mind the poor visibility, but I do mind the lack of tools to improve it. The flashlights suck balls. My little reading light that I clip to my books that I read at night illuminates better than the shitty flashlights in this game. The flashlight is only useful for illuminating the ground right in front of you. It's not effective enough to illuminate enemies unless they're within 20 feet of you. Give me flares or NVGs or at least a more effective flashlight. Anything.

manic shard
# rancid rune I don't mind the poor visibility, but I do mind the lack of tools to improve it....

Imo the issue with visibility was not so much the darkness, it was the fact that the new models have very poor contrast with the rest of the map. I havent played in the new update, so its possible its a lot better now, but it felt as if the issue was not due to a lack of light. I'm cool with dark maps (especially if we get NVGs, thatd rock), but the issue was the hard time differentiating between map geometry and enemy.

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I'd love to give the new update a shot and see how it feels, unfortunatley just due to awful timing my Q2 controllers have developped a seemingly unfixable stick drift out of the blue 😵‍💫

frank pilot
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i just quit in frustration in the forest i feel like the environment is just so ugly and difficult to visually parse, its a chore to navigate anything compared to itr1

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i just cannot focus on anything in the distance

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the TAA makes the trees look very bad

manic shard
# frank pilot the TAA makes the trees look very bad

tbh thats a certified TAA moment. I absolutely loathe TAA (and other temporal post process / shading effects), they make things so smear-y and gross. Having the ability to disable it is always a blessing (hell I'd take no AA over TAA in most games)

frank pilot
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i just had the worst time i had to quit i didnt feel like i was there at all, i felt like a guy struggling with some hardware

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itr1 immerses me to the last battery percent but something about the way this one is presented makes me not want to spend time in it

twilit tide
manic shard
frank pilot
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theres parts of the itr1 where you can look out for hundereds of meters at stuff and it feels like its really there

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everything here in the distance looks fake its like fallout 4

manic shard
frank pilot
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especially that grass

twilit tide
manic shard
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It wasnt peninsula that changed, and it wasnt peninsula that I had an issue with, the changes only impacted Forest.

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-# also tbh it feels like things run worse with fog than they did before it

twilit tide
manic shard
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Ahh ok

twilit tide
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since that update, i forget what it was, i think i twas before the beta i don't notice any difference anywhere

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and i'm fine with all of them

manic shard
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I havent gotten in to check the new update yet, probably wont for a while sadly

twilit tide
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i like that forest has it's own color, as does peninsula as does outskirts

twilit tide
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forest sorta reminds me of kholkhoz in the original

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it had this sorta greenish color grading to it and it was sorta like a perpetual dawn, it never got super bright there

glass willow
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Peninsula is sort of silent hill experience rn

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This is Forest

manic shard
# twilit tide i like that forest has it's own color, as does peninsula as does outskirts

I like the fog being there, it's cool, my issue was just that it was too strong of a colour (Which was kind of ugly), and it was too thick, which ruined visibility. It felt as if the only periods of time you could reasonably go exploring in forest was from 12:00-14:00, anything else and youd pretty much be blind whereas enemies had perfect 20/20 vision and can see through trees/grass/fog/darkness

twilit tide
glass willow
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Black on black on brown

twilit tide
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i will say it does sorta feel like in general in itr2 that day is like shorter than the original?!

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but like i wake up at sunup and the suns not gonna be up for like 2 in game hours lol

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like at all

glass willow
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I do feel the color pallete could be improved

twilit tide
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even the sky is barely getting light then

manic shard
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7 am ingame looks like 10 pm irl

twilit tide
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yeah i agree with that

glass willow
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I think outskirts has the best color palette so far

manic shard
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havent been there yet, really wish my controllers didnt randomly decide to crap out and get hella stick drift out of nowhere

twilit tide
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like night seems like 16 hours and day seems like 8 hours

manic shard
twilit tide
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i'm so fucking annoyed, i soldered a nea analog switch onto my index controller cuz my left one died and it's been like 3 months and the left one is already dying again

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i apparently got some trash tier switches

manic shard
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oof thats rough

twilit tide
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soldering and taking apart that controller is a MASSIVE pain in the ass

manic shard
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yeah, quest 2

twilit tide
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like it feels like valve designed them to be just a very expensive throway product

glass willow
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have to room lit up properly

manic shard
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it is

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its a joystick issue

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not a tracking issue

twilit tide
glass willow
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Fair enough

twilit tide
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the screens in the quest 2 are awful

glass willow
manic shard
twilit tide
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super low contrast

manic shard
twilit tide
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i have zero visibility problems there in index

manic shard
# manic shard ah fun

that explains why 90% of props ingame and LITERALLY EVERY ENEMY = the exact same colour (black)

glass willow
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Then ur like, idk masochist

twilit tide
manic shard
twilit tide
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i see like 3 people complaining about it

glass willow
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Alright xdd

manic shard
twilit tide
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when i am navigating around the forest i can see enemies and everything fine

glass willow
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Every other game looked 100% fine

manic shard
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its partially an issue of the bad screen, partially airlink and its crusty bitrate, but a good part of it is enemy design just... not standing out much at all

twilit tide
glass willow
manic shard
manic shard
twilit tide
twilit tide
manic shard
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which is why having an accessibility / difficulty option for higher contrast enemies would be nice, not something everyone has to use, but makes things a lot more enjoyable for those of us who have this issue

glass willow
glass willow
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Or like eyes or something

manic shard
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like how they were before 0.13

twilit tide
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there's like 3 people in this thread

glass willow
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10 upvotes on my post tho?

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It got fixed in patch notes so obviously wasnt intended tho?

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w/e you do you

twilit tide
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like what is going on here

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this post is a DAY old haha

glass willow
twilit tide
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he's clearly talking about the new version

glass willow
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I have 3 open

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it got fixed today, this post got opened yesterday when it was still bad

manic shard
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but again i still dont think the fog was the main issue here

twilit tide
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there was a hotfix today?

glass willow
manic shard
glass willow
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But im the one who cant count

glass willow
glass willow
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I think peninsula is little overkill right now

twilit tide
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okay well i haven't played since the hotfix today, i played yesterday and the visibility was fine

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i played the day before that and the visibility was fine

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and the day before that lol

glass willow
manic shard
twilit tide
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what did they even fix?

manic shard
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forgot thats on by default

glass willow
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Real the patch notes dude he literally replied on them xd

brazen venture
manic shard
glass willow
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[Radius Locations] Made the Forest location less dark.

manic shard
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though again, i havent seen it ingame yet

glass willow
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Literally it

manic shard
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so no idea if it actually solved the main issue i had

glass willow
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Im like 95% sure it will

manic shard
glass willow
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Its a really big improvement from te previous fanta forest

manic shard
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the left one has such horrible stick drift i literally cant move ingame

glass willow
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You got batteries charged? xd

twilit tide
glass willow
twilit tide
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and i was merely pointing out things will have poor contrast on an ancient headset infamous for having poor contrast lol

twilit tide
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and i woke up an hour ago, i did not know there was a hotfix

manic shard
# glass willow You got batteries charged? xd

no i dont mean "dead" as in theyre out of battery i meant like, the actual analogue stick itself has been damaged / has some crap in it and now has really bad stick drift to the point where it makes moving ingame impossible

twilit tide
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i have not seen it since the hotfix.

manic shard
glass willow
glass willow
manic shard
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ive heard some people say its subpar compared to more high end headsets

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but its also... 400$... so like

brazen venture
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The colours can be sorta washed out

glass willow
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Yeah thats what i mean

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Its not like HDR quality but not black/white xd

brazen venture
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anyway try not to argueeeeeee

manic shard
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yeag soz

glass willow
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Im not saying its the best headset ever, just its not that bad xd

twilit tide
glass willow
manic shard
twilit tide
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compared to even current outdated technology like the index

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Just going from index to quest 2 when i rented my spare room to a guy who had a quest 2 and i wanted to play resident evil 4 in it i was surprised how bad the contrast was in it.

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there's no blacks, just greys

glass willow
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You can see the more gray mimics way better then the black ones

manic shard
# twilit tide quest 2 has a very very poor quality and very old lcd in it

again, even though the quest 2 isnt great, the fact is that its the most accessible headset and the most commonly used, so its important for developpers to keep that in mind. like how desktop games should be able to run on middling hardware, even if that hardware is "outdated" and subpar, because not everyone has - or can afford - the top tier stuff.

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-# also as far as tech stuff goes 4.5 years old should not be old enough to be considered "obsolote" and be ignored imo but maybe thats just me

glass willow
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Here we are with a new Comparison! Welcome to another Through the Lenses Video! The series where we compare our VR headsets to see which one is the best, and which one is the right for you! This Episode is pretty special because we are gonna see with our eyes the new Meta Quest 3S ( Meta Quest 3S + ► Free $30 Store Credit: https://www.meta.co...

▶ Play video
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Worse sure, but not that much

twilit tide
glass willow
manic shard
glass willow
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You will be fine Izzy, it was a bug xd the forest is like 4x times better now

manic shard
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anyways, this is getting offtopic. im gonna leave it here: summary on my issues for anyone new that finds the thread:

my experience (on a q2, with airlink) has been that there is too little contrast between enemies and their surroundings, and that enemy visibility feels too high, even on the lowest setting. Having a difficulty / accessibility option to have greater enemy contrast (such as glowing eyes, or a "halo" shader on their edges, like many competitive games use to distinguish playermodels against map geometry) would be greatly appreciated and make the game more easily accessible for people on headsets with bad contrast / bad eyesight.

glass willow
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The second screenshot is only 7am, so it only gets better and already better then 3pm before hotfix

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Let me know whenever you get to it how it feels

glass willow
# glass willow

Its really visible in the distance where shadows fall off how big of a difference it is

rich lance
rich lance
glass willow
rich lance
# glass willow What

in the settings you can change the time scale, giving you more day light over time

glass willow
glass willow
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But now its fixed

frank pilot
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tried the game without TAA last night looked even worse 😦

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also trees were massively bugged

rich lance
manic shard
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Update for 0.13.1 (Hadn't played until today): This is mostly fixed! Visibility in forest is much better now, thanks devs! A bit of feedback for further improvements: alterations to the mimic camo (Especially of soldiers) to make them more visible against grey backdrops would be much appreciated. Maybe a coloured band on the arm like some militaries use to ID their troops?

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Visibility is unbearably bad in 0.13 (FIXED IN 0.13.1!!)

solid mortar
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Guys the game should remove taa and put dlss instead

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The screenshot was taken from a youtube video so its compressed as hell,in the headset the difference would be insane

glass willow
manic shard
# solid mortar

absolutely not -- Not everyone is playing on a new generation of gpu, and so removing older AA would massively screw over people on old cards, like a 2080, which can otherwise run the game just fine. I don't like TAA, but DLSS is not a substitute for it. Honestly, I would rather just have FXAA support lol, despite it being antiquated and a bit ugly, it holds up well with motion (no temporal ghosting like DLSS and TAA) and runs quick.

Having upscaling as an option for optimization would be nice, but it should not be a substitute for AA, the two are not the same.

solid mortar
manic shard
# solid mortar You just forgot that dlss4 is available on all rtx gpu so you if you have an rtx...

Only partially, in order to get the full features of dlss4 you need a 50 or 40 series card.

Also, again, upscaling is not and has never been a substitute for AA.
Also, AMD gpus exist.
Also, not everyone wants their game's graphics to look like ai hallucinated blurry garbage. DLSS is not some magic pill that solves everything. Its nice as an option, but to act like it should singlehandedly replace all AA is foolish

solid mortar
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You dont understand that am talking about the upscaling and AA of dlss4 which is available on all rtx gpu its the only thing that matter, do we care about MFG which cant work il VR?no.and as you can see,taa is so dogshit that even an upscaler (dlss4) is better than the native taa in terms of clarity which is concerning,anyway adding dlss4 means adding dlaa4 which is the native option of dlss4 which is just the best and by far AA(but you lose performance by using dlaa)

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And fxaa is blurry you didnt mention that,dlss4 would improve clarity while improving performance compared to TAA,i have already tested it on another vr game,dlss is now just better than native taa

brazen venture
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doesn't DLSS not work too well with VR

manic shard
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Fxaa is blurry, and it runs stupendously well on any GPU made in the last 900 trillion years or so, but most importantly it doesnt run into the issue of temporal ghosting artificats which are present with TAA and DLSS/DLAA and in most cases imo are way, way uglier than any lingering aliasing problems with FXAA.

brazen venture
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like FSR

manic shard
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yeah

brazen venture
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while also performing better overall

manic shard
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FSR also has the benefit of being compatible with older cards, I played through ITR1 with fsr on a 1660 super and got 90ish fps on high settings

solid mortar
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Fsr4 is compatible with 2 cards and fsr 3.1 is a blurry mess,you didnt try dlss4 that why

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You think that we are stuck with the blurry mess of dlss3 but no

brazen venture
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i've tried dlss4 during the arc raiders playtest recently

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and it was just

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eh

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compared to intel XESS and FSR

solid mortar
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It can depend on game but i doubt about it but olay

brazen venture
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and dlss ran like garbage and made everything super moldy looking

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on a 4060

solid mortar
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Yeah did you update drivers and manually forced dlss4?

brazen venture
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yes

solid mortar
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Weird

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You are the only one with this kind of...experience

brazen venture
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initially it was weird driver shit then i tried after fixing it and dlss still ran weird

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lemme see if i can get a screenshot i took of the weird visuals

solid mortar
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Did you try it on only one early access game??

brazen venture
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fully implemented into it

solid mortar
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Okay but this is an early access game so...

brazen venture
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same with the other options given

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that is a factor yeah

solid mortar
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Anyway there is no way to not just try to implement dlss just to see if it works good i dont want to stay with taa

brazen venture
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anyway why not instead give us both FSR and DLSS

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like ITR1 had

solid mortar
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Yes

brazen venture
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before they exploded dlss because it wasn't helping and kept doing weird shit

solid mortar
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Because it was dlss3

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Or 2

glass willow
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Dlss4 is crazy solid

brazen venture
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i think it was 2

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i had this convo before with someone and we had to dig up some old shit to figure it out

solid mortar
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Dlss and fsr evolved a lot we have to give a try in VR,we are in 2025 there is no reason even no man sky has them

glass willow
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Helldivers dlss is fire

solid mortar
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We could improve performance by 50% while getting better visuals we need them

brazen venture
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looked

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from what i can see from my previous convo

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dlss 1.0

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lol

glass willow
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xd

solid mortar
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Yeah now i understand why they removed it,time to change

manic shard
solid mortar
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I hope you dont play with aa at 1080p

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Upscaling i mean