paleontology

[outer tusk]

^

[stiff osprey]

Discovered in the 1800s with massive media hype around it, it was the T.rex before T.rex. Plus it's known from dozens of specimens, exhibited in like every museum in the northern hemisphere, and simply looks cool

[outer tusk]

hey Randomdinos uh I know your sigilmassa is just an edit but would you considered it to be more usable compared to other sigilmassa skeletal before it? like lanican's

[stiff osprey]

lancian's is fine and every other sigil skeletal is garbage so i'd say it's top 2

[outer tusk]

💀 wild

[gritty escarp]

Kinda disappointing it's not pushed into media alot

[stiff osprey]

It was for a while, stopped being pushed once good specimens of T.rex were found

[outer tusk]

if that's the case then Elemental model is pretty gas cause look how peak this is 😭

[stiff osprey]

lipped spinosaurine, instantly awful

[rich flame]

Dietpinosaurs

[outer tusk]

https://tenor.com/view/it's-just-so-peak-peak-panda-peak-panda-it's-just-so-peak-gif-10789048890486755182

[stiff osprey]

for legal reasons, that's a joke

[hallow spear]

you SUCK

[tough parcel]

Time to unlip

[hallow spear]

random is a horrible person cancel him (unless he gets un-busy and lets me pay him to make Stegouros) 🥺

[rich flame]

No he must smooch

[stiff osprey]

I can't suck, because i am lipless

[outer tusk]

ONFG THIS IS WHY TABLE IS THE TRUE GOAT!!!!

[hallow spear]

you broke my brain wtf

[stiff osprey]

this was a major issue as a baby mammal that needs to suck in order to live but i managed

[tough parcel]

Proof that random is perhaps...a dinosauroid...?

[gritty escarp]

Honestly like it when it's mouth is like a crocodile or gator

[fluid inlet]

Bro.

[fossil ingot]

How does Lanican's sigil looks like?

[outer tusk]

Anything I could change?

[fossil ingot]

It looks like Spino...but at the same time no

[umbral kite]

ok so how would theropod like spinos sleep would they sleep like crocs or birds witch one

[rich flame]

I’d say both

[umbral kite]

that dossnt make it clearer ap what would that look like

[indigo cradle]

I can't say I've ever read a paper on how dinosaurs sleep

[sudden wind]

I'm glad I did buy that saurophaganax model from PNSO, it's just so peak (as Allosaurus now)

[steady rock]

can i ask a question

[bitter quest]

What's the largest size estimates for Deinonychus? By length and weight.

Also how does it compare to the on in game to size

[bright veldt]

3.5 meters is the largest specimen. Based on what I've seen of mass estimates one of that size would be about 100 kg.

[glad gorge]

thx

[daring grotto]

i’ll never not read it as macaroni

[outer tusk]

this does go hard

[pliant cedar]

awesome bros would argue that a human could kill a deinonychus cause we weigh more on average, have more height, more intelligence, and more battle iq

(it would maul us)

[tulip dove]

Mammalian cunning...

[umbral kite]

do if dinosaurs where in our time our main predators would be small to mid size carnivores an large to any type of pterosaurs like that would u win a fight with a ostrich no it could kick ur gut out the best thing u can do is try to make ur self look bigger if that doesnt work try to choke it out but u probably lose ur nose

[pliant cedar]

theropods over 1 ton likely wouldnt hunt us frequently if they ended up in environments with lots of large game.
In places like europe they definately would tho.

our biggest worry would be theropods between 50 and 1000kg.

[storm heron]

Depends on the theropod

I can't see a 600kg Gallimimus hunting us . . . .

[open compass]

I'm sorry lol

[indigo cradle]

That's metal

[pliant cedar]

were all the mapusaurus in the huincul bone bed all of varying ages

[pliant cedar]

also, is flesh grazing a reasonable behavior for carcharodontosaurids

[sudden wind]

probably not

Their teeth are somewhat similar of monitor lizards, so they probably were tearing off their preys muscles and ligaments, which would result in immobilization and blood loss, though they'd probably die by the hatchet before bleeding out.

Only animals that I know off that are flesh-grazers are marine species so I doubt a terrestrial animal with high metabolic demand would do that over straight up killing a prey a large and feeding until satiation. It'd be even more riskier to go in and out for some meat sticks than just "fck it we ball in" and get your whole meal.

[pliant cedar]

yeah, killing an adult argent and having food for weeks, while risking death makes more sense than taking a chunk of an argent, risking death, and only recieving a small amount of food

[sudden wind]

I don't think they'd necessarily kill fully grown giant Titanosaurs regularly. It probably was more of an occasional instance but younger, smaller individuals that are within the 10-20 tons? Sure.

[frigid delta]

https://tenor.com/view/unacceptable-knight-lock-and-load-cocks-gun-gif-17380126

[pliant cedar]

yeah

[pliant cedar]

if we gave one a good enough reason to come after us maybe.

it might take a few chunks out of us if it did kill us, but it wouldnt actively seek out human sized prey

yes

[fluid inlet]

Who should I get first

[indigo cradle]

That Loki looks siiiiiiiiick

[tulip gyro]

i bought it

[tulip gyro]

spino!

[umbral kite]

Ok so how did spino sleep like if it sleep like a bird it probably couldnt due to it fin on it back but sleeping liek a croc would be unbalanced an i ferl if we knew jow they slept we could figure out how there there bodys would contect an how they moved swimmed but in general im very curious

[static stirrup]

Heartwrenching

[still beacon]

Where does the theory that “the dinosaurs were so big due to the higher oxygen levels” come from?

As far as I’m aware the Cretaceous had less than today, and that’s when dinosaurs peaked in size

[white matrix]

Last time I heard that was in Jurassic Fight Club

[pliant cedar]

dinosaurs got big because their anatomy allowed them to be big.

the herbivorous dinosaurs got big first during the triassic, and once the pseudosuchians that hunted those went extinct the theropods became larger to hunt those sauropods. Over time herbivorous dinosaurs got bigger due to a lot of other factors, and so theropods became larger to hunt those herbivores, not only that but because ecosystems were very productive during the cretaceous being big was advantageous in a lot of scenarios, so dinosaurs just kept getting bigger

[indigo cradle]

It's more than just oxygen like there's so many factors
Basically the entire ecosystem was built to sustain large animals

[pliant cedar]

thats why most of the largest predators in their clades emerged when ecosystems were very productive

(barinasuchus, deinosuchus, titanoboa, trex, megalodon, etc)

[hallow spear]

Morrison formation has to be the most unique example of productive but harsh ecosystem

[still beacon]

I’m pretty sure oxygen didn’t contribute to their size whatsoever

Also

Is he chattin or actually right

[umbral kite]

how social where theropods an also what is trikes what gene are they

[open compass]

Is this really real?

[sudden wind]

Maybe

[ancient crystal]

Crossing my fingers

[light osprey]

Calculating atmospheric oxygen concentration is heavily reliant on modelling with often little to no direct geologic proxies. Both suggestions of meaningfully high or low oxygen levels during the Mesozoic are problematic in some way, maybe even more so due to the fact the the Mesozoic contain drastically variable climatic conditions within that period of time and theres no feasible way that a generalisation would be accurate.

Oxygen levels also have nothing to do with dinosaur size, pneumatic bones are just more conducive to supporting larger sizes more often.

[vapid lotus]

no its a joke

[static stirrup]

it was actually a permian early bovine 👍

[novel atlas]

Well, sort of. It was a bunch if animals together, so Saurophaganax may have been a big Allosauroid...but it also had sauropod stuff in there

[hallow spear]

No it was actually real its scaled right to the chevrons & axis

[open compass]

So that means "Saurophaganax" name is a sauropod's name, but there is still a big allosaurus?

[hallow spear]

No but yes, ther abstract that is out clarifies that its very possible that the Holotype material (that carries the name Saurophaganax maximus) is from a sauropod, along with other material aka the Chevrons, axis etc from other specimens

[open compass]

I hope we'll get more news about it soon

[hallow spear]

Should wait until the paper is out to say anything

[open compass]

Yeah

[umbral kite]

guys i think we should call marin reptiles either ydroviasavra or naftiliasavra i took marin an aqutic an put the greek word for lizard or reptiles at the back like dinosaurs donu think this could work

[compact leaf]

no because marine reptiles aren’t a group they’re several groups in a trench coat

mosasaurs are squamates, ichthyolosaurs come from somewhere indeterminate, and plesiosaurs are closeish to turtles

[bitter quest]

Did you'll hear about the early gigantopithecus found? Possible dwarf species

https://www.anthropol.ac.cn/CN/10.16359/j.1000-3193/AAS.2024.0057

[umbral kite]

so are squamatea an ichthyolosaurs an indeterminate an pleaiosaurs not reptile or lizards if so then the name cant work

[sterile trail]

I just had a stroke reading that ;-;

[umbral kite]

are all the dino he list reptiles or lizard or not

[compact leaf]

it doesn’t work because they aren’t a unified group, all of those groups are still reptiles but they aren’t a single group beyond that

[umbral kite]

y

because theropod cerotopisan an saurpod hadrosaurs arent the smas but there all considered dinosuars an pterodactyl an quetz an rhamps arent the same but they are pterosaurs can u pls help me understand really confused now

[compact leaf]

they all share a common ancestor so it becomes a group, the different groups of marine reptiles do not share a common ancestor close enough to make it a valid grouping

[umbral kite]

what answter does an giant argent have in common with a taco

[compact leaf]

if you want to classify mosasaurs in that group then you also have to make lizards and snakes marine reptiles, and tortoises if you want to make plesiosaurs marine reptiles, it just doesn’t work beyond a common name for those things

[umbral kite]

snake marin reptiles isnt that still related to a land snake an if they tranfered to the ocean then that make sense for kost marin reptiles but if most stayed near the ocean or where born like that then i would think they be closly related

[pliant cedar]

is it dwarf in comparison to other apes, or dwarf in comparison to gigantopithecus

[bitter quest]

Dwarf to gigantopithecus, new early species basically

[sudden wind]

So, marine reptiles do not form a clade, or a monophyletic group (it's more so of a polyphyletic fictive group as they do not share the same morphological adaptations and do not have an aquatic common ancestor).

Among marine reptiles, we have :

• Mosasaurs, a group of giant aquatic lizards, therefore squamates (Lepidosauria), that invaded the seas approximately 95 MA.
• Thalattosuchians, a group of Crocodylomorph, therefor their closest modern relatives are crocodiles but their aquatic adaptations were evolved independently (Thalattosuchia is a group dating back from the Early Jurassic while modern crocs are somewhere in the EarlyCretaceous).
• Thalattosaurs, a group of aquatic reptiles which the relationships isn't completely clear. These guys are from the middle to late Triassic.
• Ichthyopterygianss, probably the most successful group of marine tetrapod ever with some of the most outstanding adaptations to their aquatic lifestyle : the Ichthyosaurs. Among Ichthyopterygians you can also count Huphesuchians which are odd little guys, which some were filter feeders. They appeared in the early triassic and may even have a Permian origin (but this is not based on fossil evidences).
• Sauropterygians, probably the group which had the highest diversity during the Triassic. They include stuffs like Saurosphargids, Placodonts, Nothosaurs and Plesiosaurs.
• Mesosaurs, the oldest land vertebrates to go back to the sea during the Early Permian.
• Marine turtles, they still are around to this date. However, some groups have gone extinct since then such as Protostegids (which is famous for Archelon).

Most of these animals do not share an aquatic common ancestor among diapsids. The ones that may do are Ichthyosaurs, Sauropterygians and Mesosaurs. All other groups have evolved their own ways to go back in the seas when given the occasion.

Other groups have also achieved to live in saltwater among reptiles, that being the case of some Crocodylians and marine iguanas, but also, during the Jurassic, the Rhynchocephalians with Pleurosaurus.

Yet, when it comes to the group with most marine reptiles, I do wonder if their last common ancestor was aquatic or just had features which helped its descendance to become aquatic. The second hypothesis may explain all the different forms that existed. So they may all have possibly became aquatic independently.

[compact leaf]

yeah that

[regal cipher]

Confuzzled

[tranquil quartz]

Could Stegosaurs walk bipedally?

[umbral kite]

same because so far all of them are reptiles but not reptiles it very conuseing but this is way i got theyre not the same reptiles but all are reptiles but then y are all dinosaurs like theropod an cerotopisn hadrosaurs saurpods all called dinosaurs they arent all the same adoption but are still the same clade but marin reptiles arent in the same clade so wouldnt still make sense to jsut call them marin reptiles as a way to say all of them liek u do pterosaurs an dinosaurs

i am very confused still

because y are hadrosaurs an saurpod theropod an cerotopiasn all form dinosaurs they dont look to ahev the snae adoption

[static stirrup]

They all evolved from the same creature

[umbral kite]

what was that

[umbral kite]

And this chart show them coming from the same creature or related to it some how so does it not a clade like dinosurs

[halcyon cobalt]

some small maybe fuzzy bipedal dinosaur

[regal cipher]

I don't know dinosaurs I'm only here because of my gf 😭

[umbral kite]

ok if bipedal then y dont saurpod an cerotopiasm walk on bipedal

[halcyon cobalt]

they evolved to be quadrupedal to support their mass better

[compact leaf]

they all come from the same ancestor but that ancestor is so far back that other things also come from it that aren’t aquatic

[umbral kite]

yea dinosaurs an marin reptiles arent the same as it but that chart nessco should us it look like a lot of marin reptiles came from the same thing

[tough parcel]

They liked going up and down stairs quadrupedally, is that a crime :(

[umbral kite]

yes

[compact leaf]

you're missing the point, those marine reptiles share a common ancestor if you go far back enough but they still aren't closely related, mosasaurs and plesiosaurs are distantly related sure but mosasaurs are more closely related to snakes and lizards, you can't make an official "marine reptile" grouping that includes both without including things like lizards and snakes

[umbral kite]

ok but a other question then y are pterosaurs tranlate to winging lizard hut dotn have a relative to a lizars

[halcyon cobalt]

because in Latin “lizard” was used for most reptiles, not just squamates I’m pretty sure

[umbral kite]

so wat are squamates

vecause it say they are lizards an skinks

[woeful falcon]

This is an instance where I would just throw a wikipedia link and say "have at it"

[umbral kite]

they say not to trust wikipedia becaus poeple change it alot an often then knew it

[thorn grove]

It's usually fine for surface level knowledge which, no offense, but that's the level you seem to be at

[umbral kite]

ur not wrong

and if mosasaurs are closer to lizard an anake then wat are the rest closer to

[halcyon cobalt]

squamates are the group that contain lizards and snakes, mosasaurs are also squamates

[tough parcel]

Then check the sources

[thorn grove]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reptile
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squamata

[wary junco]

Totally agree with most things said here, just thought I'd mention thalattosuchians evolved marine adaptations independently but not aquatic adaptations as a whole, the transition from being a largely terrestrial clade to shifting towards being mostly semi-aquatic had already begun by the time thalattosuchians diverge and they inherit a lot of characters that are shared by other crocodylomorphs - tethysuchians, for example. There are also more marine crocodylomorph lineages than just thalattosuchians, a lot of tethysuchian taxa are predominantly marine (particularly dyrosaurids, although there are a few non-marine taxa in that group too) and then there are gavialoids and a few other assorted lineages too.

[umbral kite]

i read everything here but only processed 20% of it

so what i got out of it was terrestrial clade land thing grow to be semi aquetic an inherited feature of a aquatic things right am i missing anything

[vast sedge]

tanystropheus.
what the hell is this thing and why is its neck so damn long and why do it sit like that

[umbral kite]

wait did spino evolve from theropod but it may ahve inherited trait from crocs

[sudden wind]

They all are "reptiles" (or diapsids, which is a clade) but their hypothetical common ancestor was not aquatic and the same almost every diapsid there is today.

Just, marine reptile is a term describing a lifestyle and not a clade.

[sudden wind]

No, crocodiles have their own traits that Spinosaurus lacks. Spinosaurus is indeed a theropod and so a dinosaur, not a pseudosuchian.

[umbral kite]

ok then did they evolove they’re facial structure to hunt more aquaticly base on the life stills

[sudden wind]

The skull morphology of Spinosaurs evolved due to their dieter preferences, yes. Their skull has a very different construction from that of crocodiles, which shows it was not inherited from a common ancestor, so they are analogous.

[umbral kite]

are acro an giga related

[sudden wind]

Yes, they are closely related as both taxon/genera are within Carcharodontosauridae,. This is evidenced by homologous structures, which define the clade Carcharodontosauridae and so these features are synapomorphies and help us to classify animals and say who's related to who.

(gonna try my best to explain taxonomy because this is a subject I love)

[umbral kite]

an also wat the reaaon stegorid grow plates is protection but also mating because the are very thin an were like cookie but it it just had a open back that would be a. Constant threat to it so witch one was it

[sudden wind]

There are possibly several evolutionary drivers for stegosaur plates and "thagomizers". AFAIK, there isn't necessarily one argument stronger than the other so it could be caused by sociosexual behaviors or/and by predation. Iirc it is rather unlikely to be in response to thermoregulation but I'm sure @hallow spear can elaborate further on this subject than I can.

It'd be overall caused by natural selection anyway.

(it's anyway the only recognizable evolution force observable in the mesozoic fossil record)

[white matrix]

tthe underdog of the jurassic

[sudden wind]

Beta animal

[pliant cedar]

why did everyone agree that cera had to be portrayed as a crackhead in games

[outer tusk]

because large head and small body

[white matrix]

its buit for killing bigger stuff then itself

[umbral kite]

So does it have horn or it skull is just de formed

[pliant cedar]

a lot of theropods were built for killing bigger stuff than itself

[white matrix]

i mean in the game

[tall prawn]

guys how big is allosaurus (biggest species with biggest specimen)

[pliant cedar]

yeah, but even in game, most theropods can kill larger prey, it hink its just that everyone assumes that it would've been fodder in the morrison unless it was like a beserker, even tho they just niche partitioned

[white matrix]

Cera in game is made for killing bigger stuff then itself it has all the tools innit
fighting against allos is it for cera mains like me

[pliant cedar]

i mean yeah, but WHY was it made like that
in every game cera is an over the top beserker

[tall prawn]

..........

[woeful falcon]

Ask game devs haha

[tall prawn]

https://tenor.com/view/bruh-gif-24935909

[woeful falcon]

Wasn't responding to you home slice

[umbral kite]

i really want to knew how intelligent most apex theropods where where they like ravens or like pigeon

[hallow spear]

There ain’t exactly a direct consensus, but it’s very clear display/intimidation was a big driver in plates, defence may just an added bonus.. but of course something can be driven by multiple factors so it’s entirely plausible that it is also a thermoregulatory device ontop of this. like you mentioned it’s all caused by atrial selection and some cases intraspecific selective breeding

There really isn’t anything else to say on the subject because all literature on plates just agrees that it’s not for certain what the main function was for it

[hallow spear]

Impossible to determine for most if not all extinct dinos like Rex, Trike etc

[limber sonnet]

Is oculudentavis naga like an anole? I’m reading they had a crest similar to the neck flap displays lizards today have? I thought it was a bird…

[stiff osprey]

It was a lizard, the authors knew it was, but they published it claiming it was a bird because that would give it more media attention

[pliant cedar]

oh paleontology

[tough parcel]

Bro says that like it's unique to paleontology (it isn't in the slightest)

[halcyon cobalt]

yup it had a horn. We have found multiple individuals all with similar horns

is it possible that marine reptiles were more colourful than modern marine mammals? especially in reef environments

[static stirrup]

I mean aren't there extremely few marine reptiles currently

[stiff osprey]

quite a few marine mammals tho

the smaller marine reptiles were probably more colorful than marine mammals, but not the giant ones

[static stirrup]

Would this count as colorful

[ancient crystal]

Wobbegong plesiosaur is my new favorite thing

[rancid dove]

https://tenor.com/view/waves-awesome-splash-ocean-gif-11243520

[pliant cedar]

this is a paleontology channel,
oh astrophysics doesnt hit the same

[tough parcel]

What

[tulip gyro]

https://tenor.com/view/capybara-let-him-cook-gif-11999534059191155013

[tough parcel]

That still doesn't make it correct 🥀

[pliant cedar]

gualicho is such a hater 😔

[tulip gyro]

it does👳‍♂️ 🦐 🥚

[tough parcel]

I am 🔥 🔥 just say that popularity contests are

[tulip gyro]

he plays monster hunter wild, he only can be a hater

[umbral kite]

is it true that depending on thr inside of the skull you could possibly see how a dinosaurs brain may have developed an what it was good at or how it acted like having great sense of smell or being a bit more intelligent or being able to see 3d or it hearing an can lizard even hear

[tulip gyro]

Jon Jones is the best p4p fighter to have ever existed on this planet

[warped peak]

Is there any basis to the tend of Theropods having big ol spikey necks?

[stiff osprey]

the basis that it looks cool

[crystal dock]

^

Anything I should change for my torvosaurus?

[lavish frigate]

All my homies love lying

[fluid inlet]

https://tenor.com/view/foreman-george-foreman-joe-frazier-smoking-smoking-joe-gif-24373274

Imagine Jon Jones getting hit by George Foreman

[bleak rose]

Hey guys, there has been a long time since I came here, but I just had to tell you this crazy thing:

I had a very bizarre dream where a flock from an unknown species of a rhamphorhynchoidean pterosaur had somehow managed to survive inside a sealed cave-like ecosystem which somehow had sunlight? And were accidentally released into the world, becoming an invasive species specifically in parts of South America where they were outcompeting the local American Black Vultures for a niche.

These little pterosaurs had black skin and some kind of pseudofeathers covering their bodies, their beaks were wide, and non-pointy, and they had a very short tail like those of pterodactyls.

I know this doesn't reeeaaally fit real-life paleontology, but this dream was so vivid and I saw these beautiful ancient animals in front of my eyes, as my child (and adult) self always wished, that I had to tell someone else about this.

[jagged trellis]

tbf
thats really cool

[bleak rose]

Now that I was thinking about it, it actually kinda looked pretty much like a Tropeognatus

With that protrusion in it's mouth. But crow sized and with colors of black and grey.

[regal cloak]

A.R.G in the making

Or YouTube vhs series

[bleak rose]

A very far-off branched descendants of Tropeognatus, living alone in a sealed environment for millenia?

Yeah that's sick. Not so much the part where they become invasive but it could be indeed an interesting concept

[frigid delta]

unrelated but i'm gonna miss falcon's ghost pfp 😔

[sterile trail]

Opinions on Incisivosaurus?

[wind prairie]

man, I never have cool dreams like this anymore. Only nice ones that build up to something cool and then cutoff or are ruined just before I wake up

[sharp dragon]

looks like the average PoT player

[daring grotto]

i forget my dreams 2.6 seconds after i wake up lmfao

[fluid inlet]

Is big Joe the biggest most complete allosaurus

[frigid delta]

no it's Joe Swanson
jk idk either :v

[frigid delta]

fr?
https://youtu.be/cwhhTEAkOCA?si=VIWA-2t6Xxt29m2q

[lavish frigate]

Oh hey they changed the Rex again, looks sick ngl, the Dino Dan franchise has had weirdly great designs lately

[crystal dock]

I like it although am not a huge fan of the feathers

[daring grotto]

maybe a hot take but until the general populous is informed of and accepting of birds being dinosaurs, and them having feathers, i’d rather depictions of theropods have too much feathering than none

[indigo cradle]

It causes issues like the whole "Rex had wings" situation

[tough parcel]

It's a hot take because scientifically, you should aim for the most likely/most conservative reconstruction

If you wanna draw Yutyrannus looking like a mighty eagle, go ahead, but do not claim it as scientific

[lavish frigate]

Too late. This is Yutyrannus. Scientifically accurate.

[tough parcel]

[daring grotto]

of course but for me at least i’d rather see a raptor looking like a pom-pom instead of naked lmao

[fluid inlet]

No one answered my question , big Joe the biggest allosaurus specimen with near complete material

[tough parcel]

What's your definition of "naked" because the issue is birds are rotund and perfect because they fly. The feathers form a shell to streamline their flight

Non-avian dinosaurs did not fly and as such, likely had that shaggy, short feather covering

[indigo cradle]

I've heard it described as looking like that shag carpet from the 70s

[tough parcel]

@stiff osprey

[umbral kite]

Guys i have a problem im dinoist i just hate torvo witha. Passion for no reason there just stinky an i just hate torvo for no reason

no other dino make as mad as a torvo does expect hatz but other than that i just hate torvo with a passion they wte atinky to me

[daring grotto]

i’m aware, i’ve been studying this stuff for a long time. assisted in teaching lectures and all. by naked i mean naked. no feathers

[tough parcel]

Then I dunno about you, but no-one does naked raptors (or related animals) much anymore

[daring grotto]

sure, but a lot of people still think they are. that’s my point

[tough parcel]

I think that's a consequence of JW franchise and should not be compensated for by overcorrecting in the other direction

[daring grotto]

you’re reading too much into this. my point was simply that i’d personally rather see theropods with too much feathering, than none at all

of course optimally you’d want it to be accurate. but if i had to choose one or the other, i’d rather the former

[tough parcel]

And my point is that since we don't need to choose one or the other, don't overcorrect

Otherwise we'll go back into the 2014s of "EVERY dinosaur gets feathers RAHHH!!!!"

[light osprey]

Perhaps their integument was more akin to the Mammalia or ratite?

[daring grotto]

in terms of mainstream media? we kinda do. regardless it’s just how i feel no need to argue over it, we vibe

[celest pond]

It is more complete than other specimens that are larger, it is larger than other fairly complete specimens, but it could potentially be the most complete of the large ones because the site is not exhausted and they may continue with more excavations.

[frank plaza]

What was the name of the new tyrannosaurid discovered

[magic monolith]

Labocania?

[frank plaza]

That's the one

[daring grotto]

longreach

[half marten]

https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/dinosaurs/images/7/71/Amurosaurus.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20160323105037

@fossil ingot

[tough parcel]

Puppy

[fossil ingot]

Ohh its written Amurosaurus
The guy wrote Amurasaurus
No wonder I didn't find it

[warped peak]

I love when Wikipedia states obvious biases in information with no evidence

[steady rock]

how accurate are these types of videos?

[outer tusk]

not accurate

[tall prawn]

wth is going on abt sue being 13 tons

[outer tusk]

maybe if you listened to what stego said you would get it

[tall prawn]

what did he say...

[outer tusk]

idk scroll up to his messages

[bright veldt]

Complete speculation and nothing more

[steady rock]

i feel like the only accurate one you can really get is livy

well actually, wouldnt you be able to get pinacosaurus's? i remember someone mentioning a voice box being found of it

[halcyon cobalt]

you could get the range of sounds, but never the exact patterns they used in life

[bleak rose]

Guys, sorry for interrupting but I have a question

Were all Saurischian Dinosaurs bipedal? It's just that with my limited knowledge, I can't remember if there were any saurischians which were quadrupeds

[outer tusk]

Saurischians consist of theropods and sauropods the former being completely bipedal but the latter have some early members that were bipedal

[woeful falcon]

So inaccurate that it never ceases to bug me that they're called studies. Click bait, nothing more. It's just poorly edited extant animal sounds

[tough parcel]

Um blub...dinosaurs are animals too so clearly they'd make the same noises as modern animals........

[woeful falcon]

Omg....

[bleak rose]

Oh wait.

So sauropods are saurischians? I always thought they were ornisthichians!

But wait, there were bipedal sauropod?

[tough parcel]

In the beginning, yes

[tranquil quartz]

Prosauropods

[bleak rose]

I mean... Afaik, they're purely speculative but based on certain scientific notions (the good ones, at least).

I personally find them really cool though

[tough parcel]

(They're really just slowed-down, reverbed goose calls or smth)

[bleak rose]

That's epic!

I still need to get a good hold of taxonomy because I struggle with it

[woeful falcon]

Spinosaurus's sounds in one of the vids are loon calls pitched down and reverbed

[bleak rose]

I understand. I still find the speculation cool

[steady rock]

would the mammals be more accurate?

[bleak rose]

I mean it's hard to be accurate when you literally can't even see the target.

We have especulated based on bone morphology, but without having any actual proof of the structures used by them to make sound, it's extremely hard to know how they sounded like exactly

[woeful falcon]

That channel's most recent content is stuff from video games. I feel that one should be able to judge if their vocalization vids are accurate at all

[daring grotto]

basically when it comes to sounds, certain animals have enough material and the like to reconstruct a very, very rough idea of their vocals (though even that’s a stretch), but overall the most we know is that they didn’t walk around screaming like jp lol

[bleak rose]

Oh! I see. Question: other than bone structure, what other things have we found that could tell us a little bit more about how they could sound?

[sterile trail]

First off, I understand your opinion about Torvo. Second off, Hatzegopteryx isn't a dinosaur. It's an Azdarchid or to be very broad, a pterosaur.

[daring grotto]

the hyoid bone is a big one, allowing plausible reconstructions of the tongue. we also have an ankylosaur with evidence of a syrinx, which is the “voice box” that birds have (we have a larynx), so we know at some point down the line, they started developing that over a larynx and the vocalizations may have been more like a bird’s. and, correct me if i’m wrong somebody, i believe they’ve managed to plausibly reconstruct tyrannosaurus’s throat?

[sterile trail]

If I remember correctly, it was Pinacosaurus

[daring grotto]

ye i think so

[bright veldt]

Here's an image of the new spinosaurus everyone's been talking about (This image has been taken with permission from the author so don't worry) https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/864787072739704832/1302015831907110922/IMG_2815.jpg?ex=6726943c&is=672542bc&hm=ffacbdf6da4c626205ed22e09764a1682e81554b24b2fa914096511e38922fa9&

[daring grotto]

unicorn spino

[tough parcel]

Jeez, that crest looks so much bigger now

[sterile trail]

Woah

Unicornisaurus lol

[fossil ingot]

Damn thats weird

[bright veldt]

Oh hey, the two-clawed therizinosaur I heard about like 10 years ago finally showed itself

[fossil ingot]

Damn this be cooking

[brisk acorn]

dang how much dinosaur news we gonna find this week holy moly

[tall prawn]

the hand of the claw on the right reminds me of the indominus rex

[tulip gyro]

Astorgosuchus irl

[tall prawn]

also ik you said allosaurus amplexous or fragilis or whatever th epanterias is is 4 tons but is it just 4 tons or its 4.5 tons,4.7 tons (ex)

[outer tusk]

Dawg I have no doubt it's just fine if you go for 4 tonnes flat, like you don't need an extra point to add on to it

[tall prawn]

gimme the length

[outer tusk]

Nah

[tall prawn]

https://tenor.com/view/do-it-star-wars-emperor-palpatine-palpatine-gif-799657800635657398

[outer tusk]

Just find it yourself

[tall prawn]

atleast gimme the source 😭 dont you dare refuse

[outer tusk]

Bro you have it right in front, it's not like you don't know you just can't seem to keep track of it when you "need" to

Also don't you force me to do anything or am telling mods to kick you out

[woeful falcon]

Its not a syrinx I thought, but a larynx. Syrinxes are known only of birds, separate from the larynx which they also have.

[hallow spear]

Ornithischians and Saurischians are seperate yes, Theropods and Sauropodomorphas are closer related than they are to Ornithischia

[stiff osprey]

You sure this was permitted? EJR posted it on Twitter but he blocked out the part with the actual skull reconstructions

[bright veldt]

The photo's by Archelosaurian, who stated he had permission to take the image and post it.

[umbral kite]

thx telling me that

[fluid inlet]

One of my favorite artworks ever of Torvosaurus

[tall prawn]

what abt this

[fluid inlet]

That one is up there for sure! but The angle and the dramatic scene of Torvo squaring up with ceratosaurus >>>

[tall prawn]

found a better image

changes ur mind?

[fluid inlet]

Nope but I also love this one

[lunar copper]

sometimes i wish i had nitro so i can make that my banner

[tough parcel]

Nitro is for losers

[tall prawn]

which it was in a right angle and was in a natural envorment

[lavish frigate]

No scientific backing, but I do really love some of the sounds they make

[lavish frigate]

Every dinosaur gets feathers raaaah isn’t always a bad thing if you do it right (#giveeverythingprehistoricplanetrexfeathers)

[west coral]

little guy

[tough parcel]

Evidence of ontogeny...?

[stiff osprey]

Bro used my skeletal for scimitarspinus but not for the actual animal it represents

[sterile trail]

Is that its name?

[woeful falcon]

The urge to say yes rn is palpable

[tall prawn]

i think he used dans oh nm i saw it

guys is there a torvo species in germany

[hallow spear]

Two.. clawed?..

[tall prawn]

life is mysterious

[bleak rose]

Wait, a crest? That's so bizarre, and cool

[bright veldt]

only two fingers on the hand

[west coral]

was too lazy to scale it to the holotype

[rancid arch]

@bright veldt lets shrink spinosaurus to like 4 tons and make carno 7.

[stiff osprey]

Evidence: i felt like it

[hallow spear]

Evidence: vibes

[outer tusk]

Should I chnage anything about my torvosaurus?

[fluid inlet]

New spinosaurus ?!

[cloud breach]

Woah who made it?

[tall prawn]

yes

uses these images for the head ig

[tall prawn]

rudolf hima

[cloud breach]

Nice Im a fan of his work as well

[tall prawn]

w

[unkempt roost]

Elden ring bossfight
Kronos, Morrison's Hunger.

[umbral kite]

guys wat can we find out about dinosaur skull mainly the inside because what if they were like smart to understand to grive or complex thing

[woeful falcon]

can't find out all that much

[open compass]

Btw it's from documentary "Dinosaur Empire"

[fluid inlet]

His latest work https://x.com/himarudolf/status/1851039251548553698?s=46

Rudolf Hima (@HimaRudolf) on X

Carved or Carted?

Twitter · Oct 28, 2024, 11:12 PM

[storm heron]

When they said they crest was shaped like a scimitar, they weren't lying . . . .

[storm heron]

Also, I assume the skeletal of the didactyl Therizinosaur is by GAT?

[sharp dragon]

A spinosaurid that has a unicorn horn? yeah that's not too surprising, would've thought that one with wings would be found first

[static stirrup]

I would be suprised if they didn't grieve with how many animals do it today, including birds

[outer tusk]

It is

[celest pond]

Those are outdated skeletals and skulls, they look prior to Elvis, they are much different now.

[frigid delta]

there are Torvo named 'Elvis' or what???

[tall prawn]

Yes iirc it’s the holotype I think

[tall prawn]

Thym “outdated”

[outer tusk]

Well technically Randomdinos is ( the one the right )

The one the left is just an edit of his without even lips and the head is from other artist

[outer tusk]

Random did do an Elvis, with Paleojoe also doing one

[frigid delta]

who this Torvo supposed to be???
the Elvis Presley of the Jurassic???

[outer tusk]

It is not the holotype

[celest pond]

Elvis is CMC VP15575, is not the holotype, it was found in Colorado near dinosaur national monument. It is the biggest most complete torvosaurus, the size of edmarka, and is currently being studied, a paper is on the works.

[outer tusk]

also do you want me to send the left torvo skeletal edit?

[outer tusk]

called used is from carcharsauce

[outer tusk]

correct if am wrong, and I do apologize but from this angle doesn't the 'now' skull look crushed?

[celest pond]

That's is the accurate Torvo, those reconstructions are outdated based on allosauroid proportions

[outer tusk]

really?

[celest pond]

It is not, Elvis has the best and most complete preserved maxilla, the dry mesa maxilla was broken and reconstructed like allosaur maxilla.

[outer tusk]

oh, well damn

[celest pond]

The ascending process of the maxilla was very low, parallel to the ventral margin

[outer tusk]

so may I ask skeletal wise paleojoe's ( the one on the right ) would be more accurate?

[celest pond]

Let me share a pic of it

They are both outdated, with allosauroid and tyranno proportions

[outer tusk]

so at the moment there is no accurate torvosaurus skeletal?

[celest pond]

This is a replica of Elvis skeletal mount made by the same paleontologist that prepared the real specimen

[tall prawn]

Ngl Elvis looks less tyrannosaur like

Then other torvo specimens I see

[outer tusk]

So in short when referencing from torvosaurus we should use this Elvis mount?

[celest pond]

Yes

This is the maxilla

[outer tusk]

that's really impressive

[celest pond]

You can see that is very low and narrow

[crystal dock]

Oh really, btw I was asking earlier about my torvosaurus heads and I was hoping you saw it

[celest pond]

gurneyi maxilla (top) showing similarities with Elvis maxilla. Dry Mesa original specimen (bottom), red lines pointing to the cracks of the ascending process and how they reconstructed more vertical oriented like in Allosaurus, but now we know that's incorrect.

[celest pond]

I'll check it

Sorry cant find them

[crystal dock]

^

[celest pond]

Btw Elvis is 10,5m long and ~2,5m tall at ilium blade. Some bones are same size of those of Edmarka, ribs are similar to louisae quarry Edmarka and pubis and vertebra are same size even bigger (caudal) than Nail quarry Edmarka.

[outer tusk]

also would Dan Folkes be also outdated too?

[umbral kite]

dinosaurs arent lizard but arent bird but closer related to birds

[halcyon cobalt]

yup

[celest pond]

They look quite correct with the lacrimal to jugal dorsoventral height being narrower than premaxilla and maxilla height

[umbral kite]

rectangle head built dinosaur

[celest pond]

Dry Mesa for sure, French and gurneyi look more accurate but still too tall compared to Elvis. But they are different species so can't assure about those at 100%

[umbral kite]

wat was para an arco in trhe same time period an place

[celest pond]

Also gurneyi holotype is bigger (maxilla body) than Dry mesa as you can see in the previous pic I shared.

This one

[umbral kite]

ok is they are dinosaurs or are closely related to dinosaurs

[outer tusk]

what

[umbral kite]

are dinosuars bird or related to birds

[outer tusk]

birds are dinosaurs

[umbral kite]

oh so i got that confused with lizards because i though dinosaurs where closely related to bird also a thing on google said bird are technically lizards

[tranquil quartz]

No birds are dinosaurs

[celest pond]

Because the other specimens are fabricated, Elvis is the most complete Torvo, the only Torvo with associated semiarticulated cervical and dorsal series, and the only Torvo with the femur preserved.

[sudden wind]

no

[umbral kite]

I knew but that wat it said

[outer tusk]

Parasaurolophus and acrocanthosaurus literally lived multiple million years apart from each other

[outer tusk]

btw would you say Hartman's would be more accurate at least showcasing the skull being more narrow and less boxier?

[umbral kite]

so this isnt true right

[outer tusk]

it is true

[still beacon]

All birds are dinosaurs but all dinosaurs aren’t birds

It’s like saying, “all cats are mammals but not all mammals are cats”

[celest pond]

Yes Scott Hartman's is way more accurate, but that one you posted is Scotts one modified, incorrectly, the tibia is enlarged, torvos leg are shorter than usual for an average theropod.

[outer tusk]

Blame table ong!!! he did it!!! ( btw what about this edit by my friend 'Le_Gustta' )

[celest pond]

Looks better

[outer tusk]

Torvosaurus is so gas

[celest pond]

But still the legs look too long? Scott's one is this

Nvm the one of your friend looks longer due to the gap between the femur and tibia so it seems accurate

[outer tusk]

okay

[livid laurel]

probably they added more cartilage

[livid laurel]

btw would you say that the postcranial skeleton of Hartman's skeletal is also more accurate then other skeletals?

[celest pond]

Yes, looks like it's partly based on Dry mesa "small" or mid invididual plus some parts of "brontoraptor", and he updated the skull based on Elvis

The MNI for Dry mesa is 3 individuals, 2 of almost same size and the 3rd one smaller. There are 2 right tibiae of similar size, 72cm, so those must be from the 2 big individuals. That they should be around 9-9,4m. A 72cm tibia for that long animal is proportionally shorter than other theropods around that size. For example the +9,5m Allosaurus 680 has a tibia of 85cm. Metatarsals of Dry mesa are also shorter, with the big ones being 35cm and the one of the smaller individual 33cm. For comparison an Allo around 8,5m (DINO 2560, amnh 6125) have 37 and 36 cm metatarsals respectively.

But the elements are very robust.

[livid laurel]

okay thanks

[outer tusk]

Brontorapto does kind go hard as a name

[keen forum]

that one isn't randoms that is alpha 8's edit of it

[keen forum]

the skull may look different if you want to use else as the base but for the most part random's torvo isn't outdated

[keen forum]

random's torvo funny enough uses this as a base ( for the most part and they aren't really that different )

[celest pond]

I dont know which one is Randoms or which one is Randoms but edited, but they have clear differences in the limb-head proportions and torso-head proportions, also as reconstructed, the sacral neural spines shouldn't be visible from the side, in the replica and mount are visible because the left ilium is crushed, but the right ilium is not and it covers almost all the neural spines.

The size of some elements doesn't fit with reported measurements, also Elvis is almost reaching 35ft, but still not 35ft, and that is with 55 caudal vertebra. The skeletals have 50 cuadals, so they should be even shorter. (In my opinion derived megalosaurids should have 50, 55 seems too many, in that regard they reconstructed it better)

[tough parcel]

We can literally just do @stiff osprey and ask what happened with your TOrvo

[hallow spear]

^

[outer tusk]

uhm if you still wanna know this is random torvo ( unedited )

[stiff osprey]

The limbs are different because I used 'Brontoraptor' as the primary reference; its pelvis and limbs are known from one associated individual, while the Dry Mesa bonebed is at least 3, probably 4 or more individuals

The maxilla is based on T.gurneyi; as the image states, obviously there was no allosaurid or tyrannosauroid material used in the skull reconstruction.

[outer tusk]

can I still call Torvosaurus ( Brontoraptor ) for the funnies

oh yeah I guess I can ask this now but Random did you see my torvo?

[stiff osprey]

I'll have a look at the Elvis material when that paper comes out, then I'll see what needs to be changed

[outer tusk]

damn so what MorrisonFPaleo said is right but we would have to wait for the paper right?

[stiff osprey]

He is assuming most of the Dry Mesa material belongs to equal sized individuals, which is possible and would indeed make an animal like Hartman's. But I don't work with taking bonebeds for granted that way. We'll see if Elvis gets a good osteology

[outer tusk]

damn, uh can I still use Hartman's though?

[stiff osprey]

yes, especially since there are those who still believe Dry Mesa and the Brontoraptor quarry are different species. The pelvis notably is pretty different between the two

[outer tusk]

uh could your skeletal still be used?

[stiff osprey]

Sometimes you have to make that judgement for yourself

[outer tusk]

DAMNNNNN that's a hard ass quote

[stiff osprey]

Chances are both will turn out to have errors in the postcrania if Elvis is described

[sullen cairn]

other funny para news big maxilla #2's toothrow is actually shorter than the toothrow measurement for walkeri in Wyenberg-Henzler 2022

the mind continues to be baffled

[celest pond]

People need to understand that before Elvis there were hardly any articulated remains of taneri, there were associated remains but it is not even clear whether these belonged to the same individual or to several. I consider 3 to be more parsimonious in for Dry mesa. it was suggested a long time ago that perhaps some of the cranial remains were from a larger individual than the axial or appendicular skeleton, but with the discovery of elvis i think it is now clear that big cranial remains comes with proportionally short axial and appendicular remains. It's hard to make accurate skeletals from obscure species, there are famous species that are particularly difficult, much more than what people expect for them being well known names.

[celest pond]

Just to clarify I wasn't implying you used allosaurid and tyrannosaurid remains, I was speaking about Britts 91 reconstruction and the original Torvo looks

[keen forum]

iirc when it was put over the mount they didn't too many differences but that could change with the elvis description, given how some mounts aren't the best

[stiff osprey]

Oh yeah, no worries

[stiff osprey]

The main differences between the Elvis mount and my skeletal were the length of the lower limb (tibia + mt3) and tail. But Elvis's tibia is only known from a fragment and only 2 caudals were known when they made the mount

[outer tusk]

man I love brontoraptor

[crystal dock]

Btw I made something for my concept game and was wondering if something like this okay

[velvet burrow]

-# Viavenator mentioned

[outer tusk]

yes

[noble dune]

Anyone know of any good pachycephalosaurus skeletals?

[umbral kite]

guys wat is a archosaur

[woeful falcon]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archosaur

[static stirrup]

It's a clade including pterosaurs, psuedosuchians, dinosaurs, only alive members today are birds and crocodiles to explain it shortly
but yeah what blub sent

[stark herald]

Immature skulls of the theropod dinosaur Coelophysis bauri from Ghost Ranch, New Mexico
https://app.pan.pl/article/item/app010852023.html

A brief review of non-avian dinosaur biogeography: state-of-the-art and prospectus https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/10.1098/rsbl.2024.0429

[wary fable]

Is it just me or does prehistoric planets archelon look a bit oversized

[bright veldt]

It’s probably perspective. It’s not Archelon either.

[outer tusk]

^

[frank plaza]

Is there any more concrete info on the oxalaia?

[tall prawn]

W pic?

[bright veldt]

No

[frigid delta]

there's one
it's a burned dust now

[fluid inlet]

https://youtu.be/P9_Ow8thEzQ?si=2Zr6wLctfPgkp3GD the goat

[elfin pulsar]

Yeah maybe if you hit it with one of those toy cars

[warped peak]

People forget how powerful cars are

Also tbh wouldn't a sauropod have much better odds?

[steady rock]

wouldnjt anything like, elephant sized and have better odds? i never seen a elephant get hit by a car but i feel like it would take it better then a nodsaurid

[warped peak]

Armor is nice but a fast enough car is still Liquifying you through it

[fluid inlet]

Your car don’t count

[elfin pulsar]

lol

[steady rock]

actually, i feel like they can flip cars maybe if hit, i've heard of wombats flipping cars when hit

[stiff osprey]

The car itself also gets liquified, cows and moose do plenty of damage to cars while being much smaller and unarmored

[woeful falcon]

they are each other's natural enemies you see

[stiff osprey]

Because the metal would melt when destroyed, we never found any fossils of the cretaceous car

Unless... the car car odontosaur?

[fluid inlet]

This!

[woeful falcon]

the ghost lineage was right in front of our eyes....how could we not have seen it

[frigid delta]

https://tenor.com/view/say-that-again-say-that-say-that-agian-marvel-fantastic-gif-12441585058103544841

[warped peak]

Oh that wasn't even in the question. Car is totaled instantly.

[drifting knoll]

anyone know any good, ACCURATE dinosaur model kits? Looking for a quality assemblable and/or paintable models, preferably around 8-12inches (Moderate desk or self decoration size)

[daring grotto]

people forget how much damage a 3000lbs+ hunk of metal traveling faster than anything on land was meant to go can do

[daring grotto]

not kits, but PNSO is pretty much the best accurate dino model company out there, with HLG also rising up there

[fluid inlet]

I’ve also seen bears survive car crashes in multiple videos. Obviously the greater the speed the less likely an animal will survive but now you switch the bear out for an ancient tank I like its chances a lot more.

[sharp dragon]

Ankylosaurs actually disappeared from the fossil record once the Flintstones cars were invented

[frigid delta]

ight mr deino let's get u back to ur swamp now

[tacit pine]

Depends on various other factors, regardless this vividen hate just seems dumb to me tbh, not a fan either but its just a youtube title to attract viewers?

[sharp dragon]

YOU CAN'T MAKE ME GO BACK THERE!
Proceeds to quickly shuffle away into the woods in a panicked mess

[frigid delta]

angy gorilla noises

whose mapu should i use again?
lambor or random?

[white matrix]

cap

look at all their tyrannosaurs

[sharp dragon]

Gorilla Vs The Large Fowl

[fluid inlet]

Yeah they look terrible , I’m holding on buying any until the lip theropods start coming out. Their yang looks real good tho.

[daring grotto]

other than being lipless they’re literally fine lol. their updated rex is gorgeous. just display them with the mouth open, and the liplessness isn’t noticeable. i own almost every model

besides, they are doing lips now, their sauro-allo looks incredible

[frigid delta]

.

[sudden wind]

This has been tested though. An abstract mentioned doing biomechanical tests on a digitalized Borealopelta armor and they got these results.

Though I'm pretty sure the animal, borealopelta, will die later on from internal injuries. Just physically the armor let's it tank a car.

[daring grotto]

oh it would absolutely die later from internal injuries. impacts are brutal

[pliant cedar]

would defo experience some kind of head injury, like concussion or worse

[fallow plank]

Is it true that a complete spinosaurus skull has been found? Or have I been tricked?

[tulip gyro]

https://tenor.com/view/floppa-gif-22431180

[pliant cedar]

you have been decieved

[fallow plank]

https://tenor.com/view/crying-emoji-dies-gif-21956120

[white matrix]

Not complete

[bleak rose]

Correct me if i'm wrong, but: isn't the mass of a cow enough to damage and even derail a single vehicle?

[bleak rose]

Yerah that's what i meant! Of course, the animal would either instantly die or eventually die due to injuries, but i think a nodosaurid could cause heavy damage to a car and its driver

[steady rock]

https://tenor.com/view/ball-car-flip-gif-12220396595156908000

[pliant cedar]

if deer can cause car crashes a cow defo can

[elfin pulsar]

Ye but if it’s a high speed car the cow also gets completely eviscerated, that’s the point

[bleak rose]

Of course

[tall prawn]

is this still an indet

[twilit prawn]

Its wild that there is a theory suggesting saurophaganax as a sauropod

[tall prawn]

is that a yes or a no

[tall prawn]

not a theory but ok

[twilit prawn]

?

[stray wren]

Saurophaganax's type specimen is possibly chimeric with sauropod remains. As for Allosauroidea indet. it is still an indet last I remember

[celest pond]

No, it's Allosaurus sp.

[white matrix]

By the way, quick question. On the image shared by Scanova on the Scimitar-Crested "Spinosaurus", it says "New Spinosaurine". Is it not a Spinosaurus ? Or is it a "Wait and see" question ?

[stray wren]

It's a wait and see atm

[white matrix]

Okay, thanks !

[tall prawn]

i wanted it to be fragilis 😭

[hallow spear]

Tenatively.. it may still be an Allosaurid, Saurophaganax maximus

[celest pond]

Well you know what is going on with that genus, and you can't attribute 26083 to maximus unless you are lumping all maximus in fragilis. Because 26083 has the characters that differentiate fragilis from maximus.

26083 is currently being histologically studied along with other fragilis specimens.

The paper is still some years from being published.

[hushed fossil]

I need good comparison images between pterosaur, scansoryopterygid, bird and bat wing anatomy. Would appreciate it

[tall prawn]

thym

its not sauro 😭 🙏

[outer tusk]

bro it's not that serious

[tall prawn]

https://tenor.com/view/solo-leveling-shh-stfu-gif-24578668

[outer tusk]

nah

[tall prawn]

yes lil bro

[outer tusk]

my brother in christ aren't you the one that begged for rnadomdinos to make you a skeletal because you're birthday is coming up?

[tall prawn]

ye and?

and werent you the one that theatened to kick me for something that wasnt deep lets go to the dms its a bit offtopic...

[outer tusk]

you don't see what wrong with that? literally asking someone who is a skeletal maker to do you a favor without considering paying them cause working on a skeletal isn't easy or yk considering they might be busy with other things

[outer tusk]

if that's the case idk why you mention that

[tall prawn]

alr i was only asking him out of curiousity

[outer tusk]

dawg there was already no chance he was gonna do a skeletal based on your request like he said

[tall prawn]

it was only "epnatieras" sure ik its fragmentary but whats wrong with it

[outer tusk]

because it would literally just be his saurophaganax skeletal or an upscaled ver of his allosaurus

[tall prawn]

not proving ur point cuz he could just change a few things of it

[outer tusk]

you literally wouldn't need to change anything about it, the only thin you would change epseically for the latter would be the size and that's it everything else would literally be the same

[tall prawn]

nah

[tall prawn]

well he could just replace his sauro thing and rewrite it as epanterias

[outer tusk]

then it wouldn't change anything like I said ( all you did was chnage the name )

[tall prawn]

but lets be real here he wouldnt care unless ill pay him

[outer tusk]

Well no sht if you don't pay him he's not gonna give a damn

[daring grotto]

🧍‍♀️

[hallow spear]

im reffering to the neural arch only, which is a single bone

[west coral]

This is fake btw, brick created it as a joke

[fossil ingot]

Nu uh.
Saurpod Sauro real(trust)

[river plinth]

It was never real oooooooo 👻
Perfect Halloween twist

[river plinth]

The cake was a lie

[river plinth]

So there was iguanodon sized allosaurus?

[ionic crescent]

Spinosaurus sp.

[celest pond]

Well then if you only refer to the holotype you still could not refer 26083 to Saurophaganax (1123) because they do not overlap at all.

[hallow spear]

Uhuh but I was never talking about 26083

[celest pond]

Yes

[river plinth]

YOOOO POT GOT IT RIGHT THIS WHOLE TIME I'd ping Matt and tell him they're doing good research ahead of there time but I can't

[celest pond]

Oh OK, my initial reply was only about 26083

[frank plaza]

Yo anyone got some info in the Megalosaurus?

[steady rock]

found dead in a ditch

[hallow spear]

Oh im ngl i thought you responded to something else (I went and checked the original thing)
You're right its either fragilis or Allosaurus sp., id probably lean to A. fragilis given its been reffered to such in other literature including Loewan 2020 and 2009

[hallow spear]

Its only partially a joke(if not a joke at all), its scaled correctly to how big "Sauropha" would be as a sauropod based on the Chevrons and the Axis + it being a Diplodocid (with said material) is the most likely attribution

[celest pond]

Yes definitely is more fragilis than jimmadseni.

[hallow spear]

yes

[outer tusk]

may I ask if 26083 is closer to either allosaurus fragilis or allosaurus sp. it would still be a 3-4 ton animal right?

[tulip gyro]

elephant

[umbral kite]

How old would we say a saurpod theropod hadrosaur an ceratopsian would get

[cloud breach]

4t yeah

[hallow spear]

Probably closer to 4-5, Limb bone allometry gets 4.5t give or take

[cloud breach]

4.2t is what you get directly scaling from 2560 and also accounting distortion of the caudals (length)

[outer tusk]

Yeah I noticed even with the limits remains we still have a pretty massive theropod

[hallow spear]

Which means 4-5t is still a consistent result

[static stirrup]

What would you guys say is a mistake people make when trying to etc make very accurate paleoart, but end up going so far it's inaccurate?
I know feathered dinosaurs get this treatment but what else

[cloud breach]

Ik its just another method

[cloud breach]

Soft tissue? Doesnt happen often though tmk

[loud wing]

I don't like people becoming fans of feathers and pushing them on scaly dinos like adult tyrannosaurus (or any other species that was found with skin impressions) 💀

Gives me the same cringe as scaly raptors every time

Were you talking about this? Not sure

[tulip gyro]

Nah, feathered rex is peak, If we use the saurian version.

[grizzled ledge]

i never realized/knew how fragmentary torv is

[bright veldt]

Truth be told tyrannosaurs were probably feathered still, just not to an exaggerated extent that we saw in the past

[hallow spear]

Frankly you’re being too generalised with “tyrannosaurs” should be specific to a group or genera

[bright veldt]

I'm referring to tyrannosauridae specifically

[hallow spear]

Then i definitely disagree given there’s no evidence for any of the larger ones especially to be feathered, maybe you can argue size for Alioramus and co, but I would not see any reason for the rest of them, plus there are scale impressions

[cloud breach]

It could be feathered but vestigial on larger ones

[outer tusk]

going back to 2015, vulture feathering was the only valid option for a feathered tyrannosaurus rex

[light osprey]

It’s quite a silly and arbitrary model of integument distribution as well.

[bright veldt]

I just find it hard to believe they'd be completely devoid. That's not present in any other coelurosaur family. Even if just a little.

[small geyser]

What about very sparse feathers similar to hair on an elephant?

[light osprey]

A case by case perhaps. Most derived tyrannosaurs evolve during a period of very equitable global climates, I think there’s also nothing discounting shedding of integument during the waning coolhouse climate of the Maastrichtian. The African elephant is pretty much hairless in its adult life as well.

[stiff osprey]

Complete loss of filamentous integument is basically unheard of in animals, but yeah it would probably be so sparse that it would be invisible from a distance

[light osprey]

Would an African elephant’s hair show up in a skin impressions though?

[outer tusk]

yea because I said it, my source??? turst me bro

[river plinth]

Probably like the same lifespan of a elephant or a good bit older

[river plinth]

https://tenor.com/view/anjanath-mhw-monster-hunter-world-monster-rawr-gif-17086904

Another franchise accidentally making discoverys

@vast sedge also

[vast sedge]

wth

[river plinth]

@vast sedge from here and up look

[river plinth]

You got shammed smekeldwarfed even

[vast sedge]

scientists make up their mind challenge

[river plinth]

Lmao

[ancient crystal]

Bubble wrapping, basically the opposite of shrink wrapping (which is still the larger mistake imo, but everyone knows about that one) where the artist goes so far in the other direction that their depiction ends up looking like the animal had some catastrophic endocrine disorder

[umbral kite]

How old would a argent get in it jole life span

[barren lagoon]

did concavenator have feathers or like protofeathers? because i have seen some renditions with them and some without them

[gentle vessel]

Conc has quill knobs on its arms iirc but that's the only evidence we have of feathers

[barren lagoon]

Ok I was wondering because I’m making a 3d models and I am deciding whether or not / how much feathers to give them

[gentle vessel]

Are you talking about on the arm or full body? bc the only concrete evidence we have is just quills/feathers on the arms. It's your model though so do whatever you feel like

[barren lagoon]

i may do some over all feathers but ill try to stay accurate, i wasnt sure how much it had before so i gave it like a feathery down

I will add some more quill like stuff around the arms now

For accuracy

[storm heron]

In terms of accuracy, it is really up to you in terms of feather density and coverage. All we have suggests Concavenator could have had a feather "wing" on its arms (not a literal quills). We have no idea of how the rest of its body looked like in terms of integument, so you have the freedom to be creative.

[lavish frigate]

“Dinosaurs did not have a Monarchy” might be the most zero fun statement I’ve ever read

[storm heron]

All of these options can be equally valid. You just need to keep in mind that some parts of the body would have more sparser coverage than others.

[bright veldt]

Concavenator's thing is very wierd. People talk about it either being quill knobs or muscle scars, but it would be very wierd either way.

[barren lagoon]

would this be more accurate

[warped peak]

Anybody know the accuracy of this scaling regarding Hippopotamus gorgops?

[bright veldt]

We had a talk in here about this before. This is accurate afaik.

[warped peak]

Okay just wanted to double check lol

[storm heron]

Yea neither is conclusive iirc.

[fluid inlet]

This goes hard

[loud wing]

I'm referring to t rex specifically, it's been found with scales on almost every body part

Not smaller tyrannosaurids, that's another topic

and to be more precise, I was talking about full feathers mode as in dromeosaurids, not sparse quills

[fringe magnet]

Hey is there any reason why most paleoart gives dinosaurs very small eyeballs?

[stray wren]

Mostly because the bigger you are the smaller your eyeballs look, despite them being rather large in your head. Skin and muscle cover most of your actual eyeball

[fringe magnet]

I see I see ty

[indigo cradle]

Could you imagine what we'd look like if our whole eyeball was visible

[hardy sentinel]

I love how dinosaurs have survived 3 confirmed mass extinctions (Triassic, Jurassic, Cretaceous if you are smart and count birds) and are on their way to survive a fourth (The one humans are currently doing). The dinosaur liniage is a fire one

[indigo cradle]

Simple more primitive designs just work

[hallow spear]

The end of the Jurassic wasn’t a mass extinction

[umbral kite]

what are all the cladds like therepods an saurpods

[halcyon cobalt]

just use Wikipedia dude

[hallow spear]

Use wiki its decent for this like this

[hardy sentinel]

aren't eras ended with mass extinctions?

[hallow spear]

Well if you class it as a mass extinction then dinosaurs must be unkillable given like 99% of groups survived the Jurassic to Cretaceous transition

[hardy sentinel]

so it was more of a "peaceful" transition? What really defined it as a new era then?

[umbral kite]

Thing like theropod are subbroaders

[outer tusk]

what

[light osprey]

The only qualifying factor is some sort of major global ‘transition’ or ‘event’

[hardy sentinel]

what transition/event changed the jurassic into the cretaceous?

[light osprey]

A major global marine regression. It caused some groups to go extinct but it was in no way a mass extinction

[hallow spear]

iirc that also happened in the Cenomanian -> Turonian

[light osprey]

That was an anoxic event, dissolved oxygen was released from the oceans, creating toxic waters

[hallow spear]

oops

[outer tusk]

"they poisoned the water supply"

[hardy sentinel]

Imagine dying because you're an idiot and then becoming nearly perfectly preserved so people can look at your idiotness (He swallowed a fish too big for him)

[outer tusk]

Don't be mean, he can't help it

[hardy sentinel]

"this thing can barely fit in my mouth, lets eat it" -Dumb fish

[white matrix]

I know the paper is not out yet, but how likely is it that the new Spinosaurus sp. represent a male Spinosaurus ? The idea of male Spinosaurus being way smaller..I don't know why I like the idea x) I mean if specialists think it is a new species then who am I to say otherwise x)

[hardy sentinel]

How exactly do you tell the gender? Is there something unique about it? What if it is just a younger indevidual?

[white matrix]

I believe that to determine if a specimen is young or not, you look at the rings in the bones, kinda like a tree iirc

Most of the time with gender, it's a guessing game, but there are exceptions

[hardy sentinel]

I don't think they would chop open fossils to find out, most fossils are really fragile and would probably shatter the whole thing

[wary panther]

Depends on the animal the fossil came from

[white matrix]

My idea for it being a male Spinosaurus only comes from the scimitar crest, which could be for display, but that's not enough evidence. It's just a "headcanon" of mine until the paper drops

[hardy sentinel]

What is the name of the specimen? I wanna take a look

[white matrix]

No name, the paper didn't drop. We only have a snippet kindly shared by Scanova. I can find it if you want

[wary panther]

Yeah probably, its unlikely they mated like birds considering they have massive tails in the way

Most likely having reproductive organs similar in appearances to modern reptilians

[white matrix]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1180886330331365489/1302025618975752383/IMG_2815.png?ex=6729e91a&is=6728979a&hm=5e351b39ff8f686ee4943d1c0620911c2ca37d692ead1e6e871b9098d4b0be70&

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1297959061790396547/1302614645151895613/C68D0F11-4F08-4D55-B59B-448C1EFA0AEA.png?ex=67296aac&is=6728192c&hm=93293342874282c7004ad82c57eb37afe35c3b7e62bf059bd788093bad0ead09&

[hardy sentinel]

that would be a WILD size difference

[wary panther]

Might just be a new species tbh, are we sure it was found in a similar time formation to Spinosaurus AG?

[white matrix]

Lemme see if I can find the answer, if not, we'll have to wait for the paper

[hardy sentinel]

Even if it was in the same time formation, it could still be a new species. With it eating smaller fish and S. Aegypticus going for bigger fish (I'm so creative I know)

[wary panther]

Yes but why THAT similar?

[hardy sentinel]

Similar attraction methods 🤷

Keep in mind, Spinosaurus is a genus, not a species, and within genuses thing can be VERY different (Just look at snow leopards and tigers)

What i'm tryna say is it's not entirely out of the question for this new thing to be a new species of Spoon, and just being smaller and for a different niche

[white matrix]

Apparently it was discovered in Niger

[hallow spear]

Moving the tails out of the way isnt difficult

[wary panther]

Yes, but that niche would have been heavily occupied by Smaller Spinosaurs, Crocs, and POSSIBLY large predatory fish, just don't see how an animal that big could survive with that much compeition while being THAT much similar in apperance

[wary panther]

Much more difficult if we assumed they mated like birds

[hardy sentinel]

It was probably autocorrect from "sails"

[hardy sentinel]

so uhh minor issue, wouldn't this new Spinosaur fall prey to the already present and similar sized Suchomimus (Which lived in Niger at the same time)

[wary panther]

Tiger V leopard comparison you made would come handy right now

[white matrix]

Maybe, or maybe there was niche partitioning between the two, maybe Spinosaurus sp. hunted different, smaller fish than the bigger Suchomimus ?

Only the paper could answer that, we have to wait, I don't know how long

[hardy sentinel]

That doesn't make sense in this scenario, was more or less saying how different things in the same genus could be. Not niche partitioning between two very different genuses with animals of similar sizes (if you include the sail ofc)

[wary panther]

I mean you do have a fair point that a Suchomimus could probably make this New Spinosaur prey, but then again this new fully grown Spinosaur would probably make a similar sized Suchomimus its prey as well, it could certainly hold its own for sure

[hardy sentinel]

This one has Spinosaurus Sp in it as #3 btw (called Siggilmassasaurus)

[wary panther]

Is the Spino AG too small or is that Sucho just that large

[hardy sentinel]

I think it's normal sized, they are just using a woman here, so it might be a 5 foot something instead of 6 foot comparison. Don't quote me on that tho

Here are sizes added on the post so you can check em out

also I found a wiki page on Siggil/Spoon Sp

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sigilmassasaurus#History_of_research

[stark herald]

no just teeth

[stiff osprey]

They didn't live at the same time, Suchomimus lived ~112 million years ago while this new spinosaur lived between 105-97 mya

[hardy sentinel]

ah thanks

[umbral kite]

i tried to find this but all i got was this Domain, Kingdom, Phylum, Class, Order, Family, Genus, and Species so what would. Sauropod theropod cerotopaians fall under

[hushed fossil]

Thanks for nothing I guess

[daring grotto]

clade

ie

to put it extremely simply, clades are groupings within the ranks of biological classification

[wary panther]

Anyone know what theropod this is?

and if ANYONE can recall an individual called Dinosauria 101, please let me know

[outer tusk]

Allosaurus

[vapid lotus]

same person as chocolatecake123 and triceratopshorridus DA

[vapid lotus]

allosaurus

[wary panther]

really?

[drifting knoll]

Chat I’m drawing Gigantoraptor for Dinovember day 4

What level of fluff do you guys think

[pliant cedar]

medulary bone for reptiles is the best way, as it is formed by females to provide calcium for eggs

[warped peak]

I say go full stylized exotic

[umbral kite]

thx

[wary panther]

Too bad most dinosaurs barely preserve it, or just don't

[umbral kite]

ok so wat bigger argent or patagotitan because every time i look it. Up it never get a consistent answer

[pliant cedar]

indeed
its even worse for reptiles when we dont have it, cause the cloaca does the same thing for both genders ;(

[daring grotto]

well the medullary bone only forms when “pregnant”, which adds even more rarity to the incredibly rare instance of fossilization, not to mention the bone is designed to essentially disintegrate

[pliant cedar]

it was found on a rex specimen right

[wary panther]

And look at this too, B Rex confirmed to be female, doesn't show any variation in Tyrannosaurs to make other separate guesses on dinosaur sexes

[pliant cedar]

[daring grotto]

most sexual dimorphism in birds is external, like displays and stuff. and even if we do get those preserved, we don’t know if it’s for males. literally the only way to know is the medullary bone, but it’s absence could mean male or non-pregnant female

[wary panther]

And we don't even know which was larger than the other hell if a non-pregnant female Tyrannosaurus and a Male were equal in mass and proportions you wouldn't be able to tell

MASSIVE IF but if we assume that it's the typical dimorphism like many animals (With many males being larger than their female counterparts) AND disregard skull variation having any possible effect on Sexes, AND disregard the possibility of other species of Tyrannosaurus (While LOW, still possible) having sexes interchangeable in size (Species A bigger male smaller female/ Species B smaller male Bigger Female) WE MIGHT be able to assume a Tyrannosaurs sex

[pliant cedar]

i see what u did with that last line

[wary panther]

What do you mean?😳

No seriously what do you mean, I have no clue what you are talking about. Should I have said Tyrannosaur's sex or Tyrannosaurs' sex

[pliant cedar]

nevermind

[proud prawn]

It's about an SVP abstract that did in fact compare the energy absorption ability of Borealopelta's armor to the values generated by "high-speed automobile collisions".

You can really tell that most people commenting about the title/concept clearly did not watch the video haha

[tacit pine]

yeah fr

[pliant cedar]

it could take a car crash, but surely it would die from internal damage afterwards

[proud prawn]

I'm sure it would

[wary panther]

Depends on the car

[proud prawn]

smart car gets folded in half

[wary panther]

In America, everything is bigger 👍

[proud prawn]

I calculated in the video the mass/speed that would correspond to Habib & Brown's energy values of 125,000 Joules. The equivalent of a 2020 Toyota Corolla going about 30 mph/48 kmph would match up with Borealopelta's limit of energy absorption

[fossil ingot]

Ngl legs might be a bit to short
This New Spino is said to had Taller/Longer Legs then reg Spino

[wary panther]

But in all honesty considering how the predators it lived with weren't heavily built enough to get through its armor I'm fairly sure it was more then enough

[proud prawn]

Anything bigger, or the same size but faster, would be too much for it to handle

[pliant cedar]

ankylosaurs would be the number on dinosaur getting into car accidents if they were around today

[wary panther]

it would PROBABLY die but considering how much mass it has it would be a great issue getting rid of the carcass

[proud prawn]

Just look at how much of an issue white-tailed deer are in the US today in terms of vehicle damages and accidents. A 1300 kilogram nodosaur with spiked armor would be an order of magnitude more difficult to deal with

[tough parcel]

It forms in response to severe trauma as well as it is a calcium reserve to avoid overtaxing the animal

[wary panther]

Has anyone considered a costal bear theory for the variation in US as well as Candian Tyrannosaurus size?

[tough parcel]

If you can provide enough T. rex specimens for such an analysis, maybe

But as it stands so far, we do not have such resources

[wary panther]

Unfortunately, but I would love to know the differences in predation of prey for a Tyrannosaurus located in Canda vs one located in the lower south

[pliant cedar]

lots of mountains in laramidia, i wonder how that impacted tyrannosaurs

[umbral kite]

guys how is komodo dragon the worlds largest lizards but crocodile are considered lizards

[woeful falcon]

Crocodiles aren't considered lizards

[umbral kite]

but when i looked it up it said croc where comsidered reptiles

[woeful falcon]

Yes, they're reptiles but not lizards. Turtles are also reptiles, but they're not lizards

[umbral kite]

is this wrong

[woeful falcon]

No it's not. Crocodiles are in a group of reptiles called the archosaurs. Birds are also in this group

[umbral kite]

ok so there reptiles is like a clade or category for all birds lizard reptiles an crocs right but not lizards that somethign completely different right

[woeful falcon]

What

[umbral kite]

croc are reptiles but not lizards

[static stirrup]

if this helps

[umbral kite]

ok so croc aren’t lizard but there reptiles right

[woeful falcon]

Yes

[umbral kite]

ok other question what bigger argent or patagotitan

[magic monolith]

Should be argent

[sudden wind]

"Lizards" isn't even a clade btw : it just describes a morphology within Lepidosauria.

[umbral kite]

i dont knew how true this is

[warped peak]

I never questioned the armor would survive. But saying it could "Tank a car crash" when it would almost certainly die afterwards to internal injury, just because the armor was not shattered, is definitely a bit misleading.

In a car crash, both parties lose. I did not watch the video nor do I intend to, I was merely commenting on the nature of the title.

[celest pond]

Although I agree with the estimates of 4.2-4.5t for 26083, how did you scale from the weight of DINO 2560 if no reconstruction has ever been made of that individual? (except for Scott Hartman and it's just a side view), all other 2560 reconstructions are based on Madsens composite that actually doesn't have a single 2560 bone, all are from CLDQ, so all those reconstructions are undersized or not accurate at all. Unless if you are using 2560 femur circumference.

And even Scott's one isn't 100% accurate

[warped peak]

Made a rough size chart of the largest extinct Chondrichthys, + the largest extant member

[drifting knoll]

My Dinovember calendar: ones in bold I have not chosen yet!! Please help me pick some! I will have full scientific name out once the day actually comes but if yall have any suggestions for genus of certain dinos lmk. Fridays are specifically Pterosaurs and Wednesdays are for any non dinosaurs or dinosaurs not in the other clades

[warped peak]

I added a less small Megalodon and it makes me cry lol

[drifting knoll]

Sent this here bc I feel like you guys would have opinions on the genus of the dinos I haven’t picked a genus for yet

[hallow spear]

https://x.com/fossilcrates/status/1853505831632818683?s=46&t=Im902yodl7_eUDwKAn4w0Q
me when i maliciously spread this everywhere

Aka, the holotype is still a Allosaur, given all the context clues and implication

Fossil Crates 🦖🦕 (@Fossilcrates) on X

Snax Lives! Snax Lives!

Andy Danison spared #Saurphaganax, keeping the genus, and those animated debates, alive and well!

Andy, Triassic maestro Zeke @raptor_chatter are two of the amazing next-gen paleontologists I had the privilege to hang out with at #Svp2024
#FossilCrates

Twitter · Nov 4, 2024, 6:33 PM

[fossil ingot]

So Sauro is???
Alive?

[halcyon cobalt]

allosaurus maximus

[fossil ingot]

[warped peak]

Rough edit of Big Arctotherium built off of a skeletal of moderate sized Arctotherium

(Original Source: https://www.deviantart.com/blazze92/art/Arctotherium-angustidens-440223159)

[outer tusk]

downsize P. ludvigseni to 5.8-6m, and ptychodus to 9.6m finally for paraheli downsize it to 10 meters

[warped peak]

OOp I ued wrong species for Proteo my bad. Working off a diagram not assuming complete allometry from a modern frilled shark, though realistically it should be around 8m instead of 9. Ptychodus is about accurate though, based on the soft tissue found this year for the species matched to Ontogeny in sharks

Paraheli I'm not 100% sure on

[outer tusk]

Dragonthunder aka Fabio accurately sacled Paraheli at 10 meters so you should use it

[warped peak]

Will do so after, appreciated. It's a funny fish

What's the current idea on the biomechanical purposes on the Helico-type tooth whirls? Last I checked it was slurping ammonite out of shells IIRC

[hallow spear]

sent already nerd!

[outer tusk]

yeah

[tulip gyro]

damn

[outer tusk]

@warped peak use this for whale shark

[cloud breach]

Randomdinos

There has been plenty of recons 2560 is an archetypal Allo

And also no Im using a volumetric estimate

[celest pond]

Randomdinos is based on Madsens composite, is quite different from 2560 in proportions and some morphology and a little smaller, the skull is in fact 2560 tho

[celest pond]

Be careful, Wait for the paper, definitely not going to announce the conclusions on a twitt

[hallow spear]

you're too petty about things sometimes, it fits the DINO 2560 measurements that are available, random revised and edited to fit what the Loewen thesis states, its just not publsihed yet

[celest pond]

? I didn't want to be mean, where did I said something bad against the reconstruction?

[hallow spear]

it doesnt matter

[celest pond]

At least the last time I saw it (years ago by now) it was clearly based on Madsen monograph, that's petty? I even have it downloaded because I liked how it was made

He correctly used 9+14 for the vertebrae, contrary to many other reconstructions

Props to him, also I like the scapulacoracoid position, more vertival

[hallow spear]

Hes edited it to fit the measurements from Loewen 2009 i think it was, which changed the sacrum among some other things, also added 2 caudals as it was missing them.. probbaly more but icba to go check, regardless he has changed it

[celest pond]

Nice then, do you know where can I find it?

Still my coments were more regarding the appearance of the dorsals and the size of them. At least in the old version they were the ones of the plates. Don't know the new version.

[frigid delta]

"the two strange lizards met, as it was written"
https://x.com/SalmonArtist/status/1853382775396868604?t=EwRiUsGCho4oXJ7Brt3tjQ&s=19

Salmon the artist🐟🐉 (@SalmonArtist) on X

Allo and "Saurophaganax"

Twitter · Nov 4, 2024, 10:24 AM

[celest pond]

For context this is what I was talking about, scaled to same skull and femur length.

[outer tusk]

OMG IT'S FLOATING SKELETAL!!!

[woeful falcon]

I assume this one, which was actually posted a year ago. Happy birthday
https://www.deviantart.com/randomdinos/art/Allosaurus-fragilis-skeletal-reconstruction-2-0-992237249

[hallow spear]

that mount is at an angle tho.. ive seen different angles of it, the skull and neck are not at the same angle as the body

[outer tusk]

it was actually yesterday

[cloud breach]

Still has the exact same vertebral count

Yeah its a matter of angle

And also the neck is contracted in Randoms

[celest pond]

I'm talking about the dorsals

[woeful falcon]

Its funny you say that, bc I also thought it said nov 3rd, but when I looked back at it again it said 4th and it confused tf outta me

[cloud breach]

Dont most specimens have generally shorter neural spines than that

[celest pond]

They are clearly undersized and do not match the morphology at all, the anterior dorsal spines of 2560 are much more rectangular and bigger than CLDQ. AFAIK Randoms dorsals are scaled to the plates. Also note that in the mount the scapulacoracoid is a little further back at mid length of 10th presacral, so in the position of Randoms (correctly at the very beginning of the 10th presacral) the difference in the dorsal series would be even more noticeable.

[celest pond]

I'm not saying is bad, it is clearly accurate to the famous monograph, is just not 100% 2560, and still one of the best skeletals out there.

[cloud breach]

Well obviously, since its missing an entire tail also

[outer tusk]

☠️ someone bit it's tail off

[woeful falcon]

man I ain't talking bout when it was posted in private paleo server #30

[outer tusk]

It's not private though? Also ngl idk what it being even private have to do with anything since it's still a source where it can be founded

[tulip gyro]

you flexing with being in a private paleo server

[cloud breach]

Either way the neural spine will probably not affect the mass that much

[woeful falcon]

If that's T2.0 that one's private homie, can't just freely make an invite lol. Most people aren't in it, including MorrisonFPaleo here the person askin'

Vs deviant art which anyone can just go and look at

[celest pond]

Apparently thr new version is the same one that I have and used in the comparison

[outer tusk]

well it's also in theropoda 1.0 so yeah

[tough parcel]

@stiff osprey Your Allosaurus is being fought over again

[celest pond]

Yes, I just asked if there was any one apart from hartmans, but the dorsal series size and the position of the scapulacoracoid and ribs can make a lot of difference in the weight.

[woeful falcon]

Which you'd apparently be surprised to know most people don't even know exists

[outer tusk]

so?

[woeful falcon]

Idk why I'm getting a "so" here I was just saying it was its birthday today and was met with an "um actually" bc it was also posted in discord servers most people don't know exist, probably earlier than the third too if we really wanted to split that hair

[celest pond]

I mean he probably is going to confirm he used Madsens plates, scaled to them as there wasn't available info about 2560 at the time, so not a fight at all, just talking about the facts, it's not wrong nor bad it is the classic composite instead of a 100% 2560

[tough parcel]

Ik, it's a joke, don't worry lol

[celest pond]

BTW his USNM 4734 is the best reconstruction of that particular individual ever IMHO

[outer tusk]

that cool

wait have your seen uh big_boi reco nof the head if so I have an edit of it with that of random USNM 4734

[stiff osprey]

I'm not at home atm, and the updated version still needs redrawing of the gastralia and pelvis, so I can't post it

But I edited it to the DINO 2560 measurements in Loewen's thesis, while the drawings of individual bones are still based on Madsen, as it is the only online source for images of 2560's postcrania

[outer tusk]

skidibi sigma ohio rizz level 10 kai cent duke dennis random dinos!

[stiff osprey]

Never say that again

[outer tusk]

sorry big boi

[celest pond]

Same thing I was saying, also keep in mind Madsens plates are not based on 2560, those are CLDQ individuals scaled to a size type.

[honest cobalt]

[drifting knoll]

^ anyone?

[woeful falcon]

Throw ma boi Carnotaurus in there somewhere for a Theropod thursday

[drifting knoll]

oh yes sir how could I forget! 🫡

[velvet burrow]

I'd also say either slip Llukalkan, Eoabelisaurus, Inawentu or Chilesaurus in there

[woeful falcon]

Regaliceratops

[tranquil quartz]

Tyrannotitan Thursday

[sharp dragon]

Deinocheirus Mirificus Century

[bleak rose]

Guys do you have any recommendation on online pages/vlogs that publish news about up-to-date paleontological discoveries?

[barren adder]

https://tenor.com/view/diplodocus-walking-dinosaur-dippy-sauropod-gif-9726403018625107104

the walking animation on the diplodocus is impeccable!

[white matrix]

Stenonychosaurus inequalis is the 'replacement' for the invalid Latenivenatrix mcmasterae. Correct?

[bright veldt]

Yes

[white matrix]

Alright. So Stenonychosaurus inequalis's size range must be large, corect?

[bright veldt]

give or take yeah

[white matrix]

Also, I am confused about the new 'Latenivenatrix TLC'. Does that mean that anyone who already has Latenivenatrix can access it, or only the ones who purchase the game itself? And while I am here, can anyone explain to me what 'TLC' means?

[bright veldt]

TLC is "Tender, Love, & Care" it just means giving it an update it deserves. It's not anything content-related. It's just an update.

[white matrix]

So, my Latenivenatrix also has all the new things, right?

[bright veldt]

ye

[white matrix]

Alright. Thank you so much Scanova the Carnotaurus. You have been big help. One more question though, are those additional abilities, or are they the 'new' abilities?

[bright veldt]

It's half and half. Typically a TLC update both improves/changes old things and adds new things. It's a case-by-case basis.

[white matrix]

Thank you so much.

[bright veldt]

👍

[serene moat]

Is noxovenator a fantasy dino? The one absentia is making? Is there any skeletal for this or for what it used to be

[wary junco]

it's entirely fictional

[mighty dagger]

Hullo PaleoChat, I'm curious-

I've been seeing irritator compared to pelicans with the discovery of its jaw type, so im wondering if Spinosaurudae as a collective might have carried themselves in that sort of posture

Head sort of resting on the neck as they walk. I haven't seen paleoart of this. Is it possible?

But I still imagine a more, elegant?, posture. Thoughts?

[scenic flame]

Both are wrong, pelicans are far more extreme than what irriator and potentially other spinosaurus have going on, they also don't have nearly enough flexibility in their necks to do that

[mighty dagger]

Alright, thanks much

[hallow spear]

I think Olof compared it to a Cormorant

[scenic flame]

Ye

[outer tusk]

yep

[umbral kite]

what is the largest sauropod hadrosaur theropod cerotopsain an anything that pf a clade like what the largest thing in each clade

[wary panther]

Bro please don't tell me Ben G Thomas got the case of Tyrannosaur glaze 🤦‍♂️ https://youtu.be/W87JG8aclTo

[tough parcel]

T. rex is my goat

[wary panther]

He was such a good paleo youtuber, UNTIL he made this list

[tough parcel]

Cry all you want, T. rex will always be #1 💅

[wary panther]

its NOT that. It's just that too much Tyrannosaurus talk becomes a bit repetitive

[umbral kite]

guy what the largest cerotopsain

[wary panther]

Look it up

[umbral kite]

i did an it said giga was the largest theropod

[hallow spear]

Argentinosaurus, Shantungosaurus, Tyrannosaurus, Triceratops, Stegosaurus, Ankylosaurus

[outer tusk]

the goat covering the goat, the glaze is needed

[umbral kite]

are this all the clades for dinosaurs Theropoda
Sauropoda
Hadrosauridae
Ceratopsia
Stegosauria
Ankylosauria
Pachycephalosauria
Iguanodontia
Protoceratopsidae
Diplodocoidea
Titanosauria

[outer tusk]

no you're defintely missing a lot

[light osprey]

Perhaps the nanotyrant can usurp the tyrant lizard?

[tough parcel]

[hallow spear]

no theres a lot more, the ones i listed are just the main ones, Sauropoda, Ornithopoda, Theropoda, Marginocephalia, Stegosauria, Ankylosauria

[hallow spear]

Wow, the largest, peak theropod evolution turns out to be actually strong and a formidable opponent therefore earning top tiew, what a big surprise!

[umbral kite]

Of any prehistoric creature was alive what would cause human the most problems

[hallow spear]

thats too subjective but id say for livestock or farms id say Raptor type things, Utah, Deinony etc.. for Infrastructure id say Sauropods, Large ornithischians, large Theropods

[umbral kite]

no like what would eb a good guess mine is giant pterosaurs like hatz or quetz an small to mid sized theropods like raptor or carnos things liek that

[wary panther]

Biggest problem is a mid sized carnosaur/tyrannosaur of any kind

[umbral kite]

because they mostl likely hunted human sized things

[wary panther]

They would die if they hunted humans

Only in small, underdeveloped places do you see predators ever hunting humans on the regular

[outer tusk]

Medium size theropod didn't hunt human size things if anything they much of similar size prey again humans might not be hunted but would be considered killed if things does goes very wrong

[umbral kite]

if a random human just out an about was an carnosaur was hungry would they most like run if the carno just started going for them the chance fo survival are like 25/75 who knew it could lose interest

[wary panther]

Carno isn't a carnosaur💀, is it?

[umbral kite]

It it name shorten

[wary panther]

I said any theropod in the Carnosaur group, look it up

[umbral kite]

What is a carnosaur?
Carnosaurs. The very name evokes danger — Greek for "meat-eating lizards." These theropod dinosaurs must have terrorized their dinosaurian prey during their peak in the Jurassic period.
https://ucmp.berkeley.edu › diapsids
The Carnosauria - University of California Museum of Paleontology

[outer tusk]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carnosauria

[tulip gyro]

Idk what's wrong with this, rex is simply the deadliest

[heady bay]

It’s the largest predatory theropod that is actually known from decent remains and is widely available to study. It’s not rex glazing it is just being well known that’s literally the reason it is talked about more is because we have more things to talk about when it comes to it because we’ve known about it longer and have more info to go off of.

[umbral kite]

I thought carnosaurs was the was the small version pcynosaur

[warped peak]

Are large Madtsoiids like Vasuki thought to have constricted prey? I know it's believed for the smaller members

[tranquil quartz]

Thats Carnotaurus an abelisaurid

[indigo cradle]

Carnosaur ≠ carnotaurus

[pliant cedar]

yeah probably, but at the same time they may have used their jaws more often, considering they have no venom, and especially vasuki being the largest predator in its environment

[warped peak]

Especially considering they were less adapted for constricting, makes sense

[pliant cedar]

that is interesting, I would really like to see a matsoiid snake hunting decently large prey. I wonder how it went about doing it. too bad wonambi died out 40k years ago

[zealous ravine]

Clades are literally every group, from Saurolophini to Dinosauria, so no, that’s not even close to all of them lmao

[zealous ravine]

And also, for the record, Pycnosaurus is a large Carnotaurus lmao. (And it probably looked less like Carnotaurus than path portrayed it seeing as those horns seem to be more or less exclusive to Carno)

Comparing the two is wild when Carnotaurus is known from a nearly complete specimen, just missing the tail and lower legs, that even preserves skin impressions. Meanwhile Pycno is known from a few fragments of leg and tail

[minor thistle]

Was corythoraptor a omnivore? and which was its primary food intake?

[frigid delta]

accidentally poops this
https://x.com/Fossilcrates/status/1853505831632818683?t=E-JI7LGVPeaverUc-AKoUA&s=19

Fossil Crates 🦖🦕 (@Fossilcrates) on X

Snax Lives! Snax Lives!

Andy Danison spared #Saurphaganax, keeping the genus, and those animated debates, alive and well!

Andy, Triassic maestro Zeke @raptor_chatter are two of the amazing next-gen paleontologists I had the privilege to hang out with at #Svp2024
#FossilCrates

Twitter · Nov 4, 2024, 6:33 PM

[bright veldt]

All oviraptorosaurs were primarily herbivores of tougher vegetation.

[frigid delta]

what abt Ovi the Egg Stealer?

[bright veldt]

Oviraptorosaurs in general. Oviraptor never stole any eggs. Those were its own.

[frigid delta]

fr?

[tough parcel]

Then was the young raptor mandible(?) found within the nest false or...?

[bright veldt]

remains washed into the site from above

[tough parcel]

Oh how quirky

[fluid inlet]

But Dinosaurs couldn’t yea ok

[sterile trail]

Pog

[fluid inlet]

This is literally a 7 ton theropod

[woeful falcon]

I don't...quite understand the point being made here

[fluid inlet]

They said it was impossible blub

[woeful falcon]

Who

And what dinosaurs? I assume sauropods cus that's usually what rearing like that typically pertains to

[sudden wind]

What I understood as the clade the less likely possible to rear up id Brachiosauridae because of their cog/com close to their fore limbs.

[hallow spear]

What point are you trying to make

[sudden wind]

Dinosaurs and rearing up.

[tough parcel]

Society when the compact elephant can rear up better than the elongated sauropod

[steady rock]

would ceratopsians be able to rear up like a comapct elephant

[sudden wind]

Yeah probably.

[hallow spear]

no
Ceratopsians are one of the things that probably just couldnt rear up

[tough parcel]

Ceratopsians have gigantic blocks of bone for heads, elephants less so

[sudden wind]

Isn't ceratopsid COM close to the center of their body?

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s00114-014-1239-2

[hallow spear]

its not just aobut the COM

[light osprey]

Surely the ceratopsid centre of mass is more anterior than not though right?

[hallow spear]

yea its further forward than that

[sudden wind]

Any studies suggesting that? Cause this one does say that Ceratopsid COM is more forward than that of other ornithischians (with Ankylosaurs having the most backward ones due to their dermal armor) and does compare with skull ornementation vs without.

c-d seems fairly okay as the reconstruction is not based on GSP and seem to be more in line with other Chasmosaurines, so it really does not look too far off to me.

[hallow spear]

i have a model of trike

[sudden wind]

Though I will agree than COM isn't the only factor about an animal capacity to rear up.

[hallow spear]

Im basing what im saying on trike & the other large ceratopsians by extension

[light osprey]

That model sure is something

[sudden wind]

Musculature is also to account, but I wouldn't exclude entirely ceratopsids to rear up (unless you wanna make them rear up like monitor lizards or elephant or like keep the position for long times).

[hallow spear]

I dont think a short rear is impossible like a short "jump", but one like the elephant is depicted doing i just dont think so

[sudden wind]

Yeah then we both agree on that.

[hallow spear]

i could potentially do some tests to see what the most optimal position would be

[sudden wind]

Something I'd see being possible would be sort of like a crocodile imo.

As we always say, fck around and find out!

But it'd be something very occasional and probably uncomfortable, not high + not possible to keep for very long.

Elephants have HELLA long limbs, which Ceratopsids are like chubby and short.

Does anyone happen to havr this one hatchling Trike picture that's just standing up like a man lmao?

[hybrid canyon]

anyone know any good paleo artists? I really want to follow some on instea

[indigo cradle]

Ceratopsids are large and heavy, and half of that is head

[stiff osprey]

Andrey Atuchin is goated

Other highlights would be Fried Wierum, Douglas Henderson (I doubt he has an insta though) and Sergey Krasovskiy

[wary panther]

Randomsdinos have you ever made paleoart?

[tough parcel]

Heh...

[wary panther]

Wait, you do dragon scaling? The more you know

[stiff osprey]

Mostly skeletal reconstructions now, but I used to post drawings of live scenes as well

Issue is I only ever draw when I'm bored doing something else

[stiff osprey]

According to the skeleton model in GOT season 5, dragons are theropods, so this counts as random dinos

[tough parcel]

Guh, chat is this real?

[wary panther]

It actually might be

[warped peak]

Avian or non avian

[minor thistle]

Gabriel Ugueto

[warm saddle]

Firdassoy( pretty sure he still uses insta)

[light osprey]

Ville Sinkkonen

[sudden wind]

Me /jk

Otherwise, yeah Audrey Atuchinznd Ville Sinkkonen are my personal favorites, but then Cristian Bacchetta, ddinodan, Caetano Soares, Simone Zoccante, Rudolf Hima, Lautaro Rodriguez Blanco, paleoiii, Speed Thief and many more.

[tacit pine]

Dang drogon is small compared to the books

[minor thistle]

How plausible was it that fukuiraptor was omnivorous?

[crystal dock]

It's not a omnivore

[minor aurora]

today i learnt that the carnotaurus and ceratosaurus are apparently related

[warped peak]

Yep and they're also related to Deltadromeus

[minor aurora]

really trashy image sry but it turns out the things were related to everything

[tough parcel]

Well yes, related animals will always share a common ancestor

[pliant cedar]

so could something like a stegosaur or ankylosaur do it

[compact leaf]

stegosaurs were definitely capable of rearing, I don’t think ankylosaurs would be able to at all

[bright veldt]

Yeah not really. Too hefty.

[pliant cedar]

the legs of the larger ones were probably too small proportionally to even push themselves up vertically anyway

[umbral kite]

guys what where horn on ceratosaura y does it have horns does it head butt thing or just use it for display or did it us it to protect its nest in dens

[tulip dove]

Prob used for display afaik, they're not made for combat

[crystal dock]

And they're not really horns as they don't function as such

[hallow spear]

^ likely display

[pliant cedar]

is the whole keratin sheath thing not accepted anymore

[sterile trail]

Wait what