not russian soldiers
#irl-gear
acoustic harbor
royal pebble
yea i saw the vid a while ago and forgot who it was
acoustic harbor
the one is an actual soldier the other a drunk worker with cimbat expirience
royal pebble
tbh the DPR probably has more combat experience than the actual soldiers do
royal pebble
thats the downside of using proxies to fight a war, you dont get any combat experience yourselves lmao
acoustic harbor
ahh so the monoltihic uses mini tiles so the compromised area isn't as large?
frigid geyser
tbh the DPR probably has more combat experience than the actual soldiers do
after 8 years of fighting ? oh yeah i mean those guys are battle hardened as fuck, shame that they lack proper gear
acoustic harbor
Sparta is equipped well enough
low fox
it's isolated to the area that was hit
royal pebble
after 8 years of fighting ? oh yeah i mean those guys are battle hardened as fuc...
when Russia started the donbass war, they inadvertantly started giving Ukrainian troops combat experience and a field to test their modernized equipment in
by the time 2022 rolled around, the Ukrainian military was a total transformation from 2014
acoustic harbor
And civvies to bomb
frigid geyser
because it was almost entirely wiped out ?
acoustic harbor
it's no secret that whole lotta civvie areas had shit going on the last 8 years
Ukrainian army in 2014 was effectively chechen war reenactment
or late afghan
royal pebble
p much
frigid geyser
ye
royal pebble
now its turned around on them and the Russians are the Russians once again lmfao
frigid geyser
but yeah, less so gear, but more so tactics i would say that they tested
acoustic harbor
well the ukrainians got shit soved up their asses big time
Russias biggest support is still themselves
royal pebble
but yeah, less so gear, but more so tactics i would say that they tested
the gear has seen a large improvement though
frigid geyser
that too
royal pebble
Russias biggest support is still themselves
yea the DPR and LPR are shit and the Chechens are useless
frigid geyser
well the problem with russia is still it is lacking enough troops to maneuver
acoustic harbor
the Seps made more prpgress ultimately than the soldiers did iirc 
acoustic harbor
well the problem with russia is still it is lacking enough troops to maneuver
no it doesn't just russian highcommand is high 24/7
royal pebble
high 24/7 and getting drone striked all the time
acoustic harbor
also most units are like conscripts at least when the war began
frigid geyser
no it doesn't just russian highcommand is high 24/7
i meant currently in Donetsk
and then yeah
acoustic harbor
high 24/7 and getting drone striked all the time
doubt thar highcommand is getting bombed when sitting somewhere in russia
frigid geyser
russian high command has been acting shit
royal pebble
well the problem with russia is still it is lacking enough troops to maneuver
nah they have enough troops to maneuvre but not enough combat experience to make the troops effective and no command structure to make good decisions
theyve reformed their original plan like a dozen times by now to try and salvage some form of victory
acoustic harbor
russian high command has been acting shit
Butcha 💀
frigid geyser
on a tactical level the russians' been doing really good
but on the strategy level...
man what a fubar of a mess
acoustic harbor
I do love seeing towns get obliterated by 220mm thermobaric weapons
royal pebble
woah
frigid geyser
what can we say, the competence and valiance of soldiers cannot balance out the incompetence of the high command
acoustic harbor
Tos 1As are pretty effective and impressive ngl
frigid geyser
but yeah, those things are nasty
acoustic harbor
what can we say, the competence and valiance of soldiers cannot balance out the ...
they aren't that valiant
royal pebble
when theyre barraging a town full of civs its not exactly a hard thing to do
acoustic harbor
if you didn't know most soldiers are unknowing conscripts
royal pebble
or regular troops who werent even given any time to prepare for the war
frigid geyser
they aren't that valiant
generalized saying, not only about the current conflict
royal pebble
i mean
acoustic harbor
Ye pretty much especially the vdv
royal pebble
historically the regular russian soldier has not been good at fighting modern wars
frigid geyser
but yeah, russia went in prepared for a war, but it did underestimate a lot of things
acoustic harbor
and in comparison to popular believe the guys at hostomel didn't die
I know a guy who has friends there
at the first strike
frigid geyser
well thing is
royal pebble
i have a lot of videos of dead and mutilated russians in the streets of hostomel, just saying
hey maybe your buddies friends are one of them!
acoustic harbor
i have a lot of videos of dead and mutilated russians in the streets of hostomel...
there were multiple tries
that's why I added on the first one
acoustic harbor
not whole retreat afaik
frigid geyser
the hostomel airport first striking unit were a bunch of battle hardened vdv and special forces that used air support, despite being limited to hold the airport after they did not success to drop in more vdv
and then the casualty you see are more so the troops who forcefully marched from belarus
royal pebble
lack of armoured support for the VDV meant they folded pretty quickly when Ukrainian armour showed up and they didnt have any way to knock them out without helicopters or kornets
which they did have
but the helos had to leave eventually
frigid geyser
well, the airport was then further secured with help of infantry coming from belarus
the first wave did manage to hold the airport
royal pebble
eventually they did hold the airfield for a week or so
frigid geyser
but did not manage to get the reinforcement landed in
royal pebble
but they neglected to consider that the Ukrainians mightve saved the coordinates to the airfield, and got barraged by arty and drones
the airfield was too damaged to use afterwards so it completely defeated the point of holding it
frigid geyser
i would say it is that they underestimated the ukrainian defence in a way
they probably did not expect that the ukrainian forces would barrage their own planes
royal pebble
there were a lot of russian helos on the tarmac tho, the benefit of destroying them outweighed the loss of a few frogfoots i suppose
frigid geyser
the AN225 then ? one of the biggest sources of foreign currency for ukraine ?
but well, fuck im still depressed that its gone
royal pebble
that was destroyed on like the first week of fighting
images of the wreckage appeared before the arty strikes on the airport began
still a sad loss tho
frigid geyser
to be fair, the plane got barraged by ukrainian 122mm
during the artillery striking after the motorized inf pulled in
royal pebble
so regardless of who destroyed it in the initial days, it was already gone by the time they decided to arty it when the russians held the airport
yeah
low fox
what can we say, the competence and valiance of soldiers cannot balance out the ...
I said this almost a year ago, Russia does not have the experience in its ranks to make at more potent
Part of that is because it doesn't have a professional NCO corps
But Russia's only actual experience in warfare is limited units who went to Syria, and nothing but insurgency and one offs here and there in other soviet states
frigid geyser
fair, i mean russia is also under lack of enough people for its military
and yeah
there really seems to be a lack of transfer of experience within units
low fox
they aren't allowed to operate anywhere else but those places because everybody hates them
royal pebble
the plus side of NATO fighting a 20 year long war is that two generations of troops have gotten combat experience and the administration fielding the military has learned valuable lessons on how to fight
low fox
NATO countries operate globally, virtually everywhere they want on every continent buy antartica
low fox
Combat experience in south america, europe, asia, africa
royal pebble
the Russians almost never leave the country to train
in fact they don’t leave the country at all
low fox
recent combat experience too
frigid geyser
to be fair.. the years of war on terror kinda fucked us and less so nato up
low fox
And this experience is held by NCOs at every level of our formations in every single unit
Not only that, but we continue to train in these locations with our partners and ensure that every part of our army has the capability to operate in every environment across the world
frigid geyser
you end up with a lot of people having experience, but that aren't suitable to conventional warfare anymore
low fox
Artic, Jungle, Desert, you name it
Well see that's just it
They are because they weren't using unconventional means to fight an unconventional war
Grunts were using our same TTPs against insurgencies
No, it didn't work, but what it did was validate that our combat doctrine was effective
and that's a huge part of US doctrine as well
we go out, and we send guys to war to validate the effectiveness of our doctrine
royal pebble
TLDR russia sucks and is gay
low fox
we know that what we do works before we ever send a large amount of guys to go do it
and it did work, tactically, we butchered the taliban, al qaeda etc
the problem was that the solution to that region was not a tactical one
frigid geyser
eh thing is that the war on terror fucked up the structure of the us military, kinda making it more geared towards low intensity warfare than the conventional one we see in ukraine
frigid geyser
in a way it did, and that's why you have the military reform back from brigades to divisions
royal pebble
the US has experienced conventional warfare previously however, they have that playbook ready
low fox
they will never not exist
the way it works is that every division has brigades
and these brigades are the largest deployable formation of the divsion
if need be, we can still just deploy the entire divsion
it changes nothing
it just didn't make sense to deploy divisions to fight an insurgency
brigades were found to be effective in doing so, and so that's what happened
if an entire division needs to be deployed against a modern threat
then they deploy the entire divsiion
division
but the brigade combat team concept has existed since the 90s
and we were still fighting modern wars then
frigid geyser
anyhow, the one that im getting at this that, the entire experience of low intensity warfare for the army, at least for the experience bits of it has created an entire generation of soldiers and officers whose combat experience are based on asymmetrical wars, which can be dangerous and misleading if the us is fighting a conventional symmetrical war again. don't get me wrong tho, the us military still have of the most combat experienced forces, but to what extent their experiences are relevant to something like conventional warfare/ww3 ?
if you see around where i am getting at
low fox
because we didn't train for afghanistan by training how to fight an insurgency
we trained for afghanistan by training how to fight modern nations
that's how we train for war
only SOF trains specifically for low intensity stuff
that's not how we do things
frigid geyser
not training wise, with that it is still conventional
but more for the actual combat experiences of the troops
low fox
because combat experience does not generate a baseline expectation for what combat will be like
that's not its purpose
frigid geyser
eh, fair i suppose
low fox
what it does is teaches you how to perform in combat
how to react to it
and how to process it
nobody is thinking fighting china or russia is the same as fighting afghans
but guys have been shot at before, shelled before, bombed before, etc
know what they need to do in that situation and engage the enemy despite that
that is not something russia has
there is a massive amount of disconnect between where their experienced people should be, and where the rest of their military should be
the US for example requires officers from our ranger regiment to go to regular infantry units
for a couple years at at time
you have to go from your special operations unit, to a regular infantry unit and lead that unit before you're allowed to return
every single one of them
NCOs with that experience can change duty stations and go to different units, maintaining that experience and leadership ability
frigid geyser
then again that yes, russia do lack the transfer of some of its experience from battle hardened troops to the other ones
low fox
yeah but they barely have any as it is
there's not a single unit in our military that doesn't have multiple
from reserve and national guard units, to our premier infantry units
and even though the GWOT generation is starting to leave the military
the lessons they've left with their troops through that experience isn't just gonna go away
we're in a transitional period now where people who join probably won't see combat like the guys before them did, but they have those people to learn from so that when their time comes, hopefully they're ready
frigid geyser
and hopefully that time will never come, eh...
low fox
there's no military on earth with that much experience at its disposal
no it will, that's just the nature of the united states now
at some point, it will happen again
and when it does, those who go to war during that time period will be the people who carry those lessons to the new blood like the guys now are doing
frigid geyser
that yeah, the world isn't really going to peaceful or what not
low fox
people bitch and moan about the US being the world police or whatever, but it has made us the dominant military force on this planet
without that global projection ability, we'd probably be like russia, lots of chest beating, but little substance
royal pebble
without that global projection ability, we'd probably be like russia, lots of ch...
without that the russians would’ve tried some fuckshit already
low fox
honestly people don't realize how lucky they are to have a military people are too scared of to fuck with
royal pebble
america’s reputation as the biggest dick in the locker room has basically ensured that WW3 hasn’t started
low fox
and there's plenty of substance to back it up
low fox
every modern country we've gone against in the last like 50 years has been absolutely shi ton
shit on*
grenada, panama, iraq, kuwait, afghanistan's actual government
shit on in the space of 2 years or less virtually every time
royal pebble
meanwhile Russia has been shit on by every third world country it has invaded or operated in
left flax
I mean, US and Aus got lynched in Vietnam, idk about the Korean war because nobody knows it happened and us and UK rage quit afghanistan
Still can't get over the fact the Taliban took Afghanistan in a week, quick asf
royal pebble
news flash the ANA sucks ass
summer helm
CHILL CUSTOMS - EU
left flax
news flash the ANA sucks ass
Honestly
low fox
the korean war was a stalemate so we just left
left flax
All high or don't know how to shoot, or both
low fox
the vietnamese were being slaughtered in countless numbers
royal pebble
All high or don't know how to shoot, or both
or just corrupt as shit
left flax
or just corrupt as shit
Da
low fox
to the point where if we had committed to the war, they likely would have capitulated
too bad nixon was a crook
we were tactically dominant virtually every time in afghanistan
but like i said, a tactical victory wasn't going to win afghanistan
how do you bring democracy to a people who dont even understand what democracy is
who dont even want it even if they did
left flax
Nuke it or sumthin
royal pebble
the idea of a political victory in afghanistan disappeared around 2010
low fox
we should have done to afghanistan what we did to syria
royal pebble
the people of afghanistan didn’t even notice a difference from before we were there to after we “liberated” them
low fox
kept it as a playground to deploy our boys to so they could stack some bodies and get experience
left flax
Speaking of Syria
low fox
half of them were so deep in the mountains they weren't even aware anything had changed lol
left flax
I love the video of the American group of humvees bumping into the Russians TIGRs, love that video
low fox
they were literally just nomads roaming between pakistan and afghanistan 24/7
royal pebble
kept it as a playground to deploy our boys to so they could stack some bodies an...
at least now we have Ukraine, we can send our newest toys there to see how they perform and make adjustments as needed
low fox
true
royal pebble
the UK is doing that right now
low fox
TTP and equipment validation
royal pebble
with their Brimstone system
barren kettle
half of them were so deep in the mountains they weren't even aware anything had ...
"why is there a new crater where that village used to be? eh must have moved"
low fox
"kill them this way"
royal pebble
they’re adapting it from aircraft deployment to being able to be fired from a truck
low fox
hmm that didn't work
left flax
It's kinda annoying seeing us sending all this shit to Ukraine fueling the war
Idk why we humans don't fucking learn
royal pebble
It's kinda annoying seeing us sending all this shit to Ukraine fueling the war
I...
we have to
low fox
humans are violent creatures
royal pebble
if we lose Ukraine to the Russians then they’ll never stop trying to expand
left flax
if we lose Ukraine to the Russians then they’ll never stop trying to expand
Then why don't we deploy?
low fox
thousands of years ago you would just grunt and hit somebody with a club and kill them
royal pebble
if we deploy, we start WW3
left flax
if we deploy, we start WW3
According to Russia it already began
royal pebble
the best we can do is supply the Ukrainians to fight and hopefully they’ll win on their own
low fox
now you have to write shit down on paper and give long speeches
and then get right back to killing people
left flax
the best we can do is supply the Ukrainians to fight and hopefully they’ll win o...
I just want the death to stop
low fox
if we physically enter ukraine, they are absolutely using nuclear weapons
royal pebble
I just want the death to stop
it will never stop
we will always be killing eachother
low fox
the worst thing we can do is back russia into a wall and give them absolutely nothing to lose
royal pebble
only things that change is how we kill and who we kill
left flax
A ukranian mate of mine died, and a few of the Russian lads on the dayz server I played are deployed in Ukraine rn
It sucks ass
left flax
It's even more fucked up, that these are people I talked, and still talk to
low fox
when i went over to HKIA we lost one of our best dudes in the IED attack
left flax
It's like it's not even happening
low fox
somebody's gotta do it and somebody always will do it
royal pebble
i was playing squad with a dude who lives in Ukraine, he’s in Zaporizhzhia, a town 40km from the Russians and the next on the list for an attack
low fox
cause a utopian society where everybody sings kumbayah is never going to happen
royal pebble
hopefully he got the fuck outta there already
low fox
humans are too violent and tribal
there will always be some reason to kill another person and take their shit
left flax
I just hope the guys I played with survive, they were super cool guys, spoke English too
Russian people have been some of the kindest people I've met online and in gaming, none of it makes sense to me now
royal pebble
the only russian friend i have is fixated on leaving the country and never coming back
left flax
It's even weirder because in the Russian server, a ukranian is playing still, lives in fuckin Kiev too
royal pebble
the invasion has been the last straw
left flax
the only russian friend i have is fixated on leaving the country and never comin...
Hope he makes it
low fox
i don't harbor any ill will towards russians
just those who professionally join their military
and their politicians
royal pebble
Hope he makes it
she’s trying to arrange a place to stay in Turkey
left flax
i don't harbor any ill will towards russians
Nobody should, its the fucking politician's and the war criminals that should be getting the hate
royal pebble
the fuckin turks are hiking up the rent though to take advantage of the situation
low fox
im not arrogant enough to think anyone is right or wrong on the global stage
but the enemy is the enemy and if you don't kill them, they'll kill you
left flax
she’s trying to arrange a place to stay in Turkey
Awesome, though Turkey sounds awful
royal pebble
and Russian money is worthless now so the price to stay in Turkey is probably astronomical
left flax
but the enemy is the enemy and if you don't kill them, they'll kill you
In all wars, you usually don't hate the man in your sights
royal pebble
Awesome, though Turkey sounds awful
i’d take fuckin Iran over living in Russia tbh
left flax
Just some guy in a uniform, same as you
left flax
i’d take fuckin Iran over living in Russia tbh
Eh fair
royal pebble
In all wars, you usually don't hate the man in your sights
never make war personal
killing is just the business
left flax
Because you'll come home a hateful bastard lol
royal pebble
yeah basically
left flax
I just hope we don't get involved, I don't want to kill dudes my age
Or anyone tbf
Damn im supposed to be playing skyrim rn lol
low fox
In all wars, you usually don't hate the man in your sights
i mean, when i was in the phillipines i sure didn't fucking like the ISIS dudes there
tell you that
royal pebble
if NATO gets attacked, i promise i’ll enlist that same week
left flax
i mean, when i was in the phillipines i sure didn't fucking like the ISIS dudes ...
Yeah
Yeah true, fuck them goat fuckers
low fox
some people are just evil and need to be eliminated
left flax
if NATO gets attacked, i promise i’ll enlist that same week
I will be too.
But
I wouldn't want a combat role, if I can avoid it I would
But if I can't avoid it, then oh well
royal pebble
fuck riding a desk
left flax
Not a desk job damn
royal pebble
what would u like to do
left flax
Fuck that I already work a desk
left flax
what would u like to do
Work at field hospitals for troops and civvies
royal pebble
i feel like if i saw what was happening to our boys i’d feel like shit for not being able to get payback for them
i’d rather be out there preventing it from happening than just doing damage control after it’s happened
left flax
Personally, I'd rather be there to help out the guys who were unfortunate enough to get shot
People are going to get shot regardless, they need people to look after them
barren kettle
every job is important, big or small
royal pebble
yea
every army needs people to do the boring jobs
personally it isn’t for me though
respect to those who do
left flax
Anyway I don't want to think about the war anymore, back to fucking werewolves in skyrim
Have a good evening
left flax
🙏
royal pebble
lmao good luck
bronze burrow
if NATO gets attacked, i promise i’ll enlist that same week
lol and you will still be untrained before the war ends
royal pebble
lol and you will still be untrained before the war ends
fuck it, better than sitting around on my ass watching the TV to see what happens next
why can’t we be friends again :(
crazy that this was only last year
and fast forward a few months, we’re at eachothers throats
royal pebble
they’re probably even better when you’re out in the middle of the syrian desert
bronze burrow
why can’t we be friends again :(
dude, russia invaded ukraine in 2014, we have not been anything close to friends since that
royal pebble
No matter what happens, I'll love the Russians. So many good friends
the ones who troll and spread hate can fuck off and die but yeah generally i agree
bronze burrow
thats just the reality
royal pebble
dude, russia invaded ukraine in 2014, we have not been anything close to friends...
that photo is living proof that two soldiers can still get along under common ground, it’s the politicians that want them to fight
frigid geyser
ultimately, the ones who knows truly what war is never wants war, people just get drag into it by this mess of a world to say the least
royal pebble
if the people who made the choices to go to war were there to actually see what it’s like then there’d be a whole lot more world peace
just saying
frigid geyser
Si vis pacem, para bellum, i guess
bronze burrow
of course you should never want war, but always ready for it, because it is not something you get to pick and choose, especially not when the stakes are the very existence of your nation and people, as the case is now.
but this discussion isn’t appropriate for this discord anyways, so im gonna go
royal pebble
yeah we are pretty much on the brink of WW3
frigid geyser
eh fair, so much for gear eh
royal pebble
these channels are never for the intended topic and everyone knows it
bronze burrow
yeah we are pretty much on the brink of WW3
just make sure it starts after next summer lol
royal pebble
just make sure it starts after next summer lol
why lmao
bronze burrow
so im fully trade qualified and deployable lol
royal pebble
lol true
misty mango
these channels are never for the intended topic and everyone knows it
average day in EFT official
bronze burrow
so anyways about gear, the mag clips on the canadian army tac vest are the most useless things ever and makes reloading so needlessly hard i fucking hate it
night rock
these channels are never for the intended topic and everyone knows it
never is
I'd just avoid the 🇺🇦 topic since mods very much do not like that being discussed
bronze burrow
yea
royal pebble
we will instead communicate our opinions on the ukraine war in morse code
bronze burrow
..:..-..
left flax
Mods don't like anything tbh
royal pebble
..-.-?
royal pebble
Mods don't like anything tbh
especially fun
left flax
Da
bronze burrow
Tak
night rock
.- -- --- -. --. / ..- ...
frigid geyser
talking about gear then, do you guys prefer to have the equipment, ammo loaded on a warbelt or a rig/pc ?
royal pebble
never choose one or the other
use both, and balance it out
minimize the amount of gear on the belt (weight on the hips sucks) but put everything you don’t want on your PC on your belt
pistol, one rifle mag, two pistol mags, dump pouch, IFAK
frigid geyser
yeah, that is for sure, but out of preference, what do you guys prefer ?
royal pebble
pistol, one rifle mag, two pistol mags, dump pouch, IFAK
this is for the belt
left flax
I just stuffed everyone on my plate carrier lol
royal pebble
PC is 3-4 rifle mags, tool set, water, admin pouch, one pistol mag, radio pouch
frigid geyser
eh fair, i put my equipment mostly on a rig, and then perhaps some tools and ifak on the belt
royal pebble
yeah
frigid geyser
don't know why but i prefer the pistol on leg holsters rather than the belt
royal pebble
i’d say 25-33% of the gear should be on the belt, no more than that
left flax
Leg holster always made me feel like it was falling off, made me run like I was needing a shit
royal pebble
don't know why but i prefer the pistol on leg holsters rather than the belt
you could try a middle ground, and just have a mid or low ride setup on your belt
frigid geyser
huh, that too
just that i feel slightly awkward to reach for my pistol if i put it on the belt sometimes
royal pebble
yea
it’s probably because it’s mounted too high
put your hand down at the side of your body, and where your fingertips end is where the barrel of the pistol should end
low fox
talking about gear then, do you guys prefer to have the equipment, ammo loaded o...
all of my equipment is split between both
i can fight off my belt alone if i have to
but my belt compliments my plate carrier as well to enhance both
misty mango
i can fight off my belt alone if i have to
first line gear
thats how im trying to build mine on
able to be fought with
but not sustainable
royal pebble
“don’t use one without the other” is essentially how battle belts and PCs are set up
but if need be you can work while lacking one of them
the belt and PC should compliment eachother and not replace eachother
misty mango
belt only should be worst case scenario
royal pebble
yeah
misty mango
kinda why im gonna put an IFAK on both my belt and carrier
royal pebble
two is nice but the one on your belt is realistically the one that will be used the most
since your belt is easier to take off than a whole PC
coarse laurel
“don’t use one without the other” is essentially how battle belts and PCs are se...
this is true, i took alot of load out of my plate carrier using the battle belt
royal pebble
yeah
bronze burrow
are you mil?
yes
coarse laurel
it makes it so that i always have my ifak and rounds and my SI pouch when i take off my plate carrier
royal pebble
it’s important not to load the belt up too much tho, having a lot of weight centered on your hips is a bad idea
misty mango
two is nice but the one on your belt is realistically the one that will be used ...
more looking into a BFG micro TKN for my belt
bronze burrow
like unit?
royal pebble
FSB
coarse laurel
yes
misty mango
and a bigger tearaway one for the rig
royal pebble
more looking into a BFG micro TKN for my belt
yeah
i have one just molle strapped to the belt
bronze burrow
yes
lol im not doxxing myself on here, im canadian army reserve infantry going reg force in a couple years
bronze burrow
nice
coarse laurel
the canadians were cool, they were under our UN Forces Korea command
royal pebble
hence the very poor part of the sentence lmfao @bronze burrow
poor funding for the Canadians have always bitten them in the ass
coarse laurel
they just worked in the big building in camp humprheys and hung around the DMZ for ceremonial duties
royal pebble
but the CF makes do and compensates with better training
bronze burrow
i dont feel like pulling out my tac vest cuz its in my ruck rn but that thing is attrocious
royal pebble
Canadian armour setup is the IBA + vest right?
bronze burrow
no
coarse laurel
the canadians i was with had their plate carriers
and their own version of our ACH with rails
royal pebble
yeah
they’re beginning to modernize, i’ve seen a few CF guys with high cut helmets and plate carriers
bronze burrow
the canadians i was with had their plate carriers
yeah deployed boys get the nice shit
bronze burrow
they’re beginning to modernize, i’ve seen a few CF guys with high cut helmets an...
currently a high cut is being tested, we are also testing various new chest rigs and shit ye
bronze burrow
thats nice, wish we had that lmao
coarse laurel
i use a FAST, the ACH, then a CVC
misty mango
k19
coarse laurel
CVC when im on a tank or my Medical track
bronze burrow
yeah those are the ones
coarse laurel
i do use my FAST in the tank and the track if it works, the J boxes are picky with the comms setup
royal pebble
can’t wait to join the canadian forces and experience what it’s like to be poorly funded
bronze burrow
i dont mind the helmet we have now, i just want a new plate carrier or rig instead of the tacvest
coarse laurel
for me its being able to use peltors
ive had to use peltors with the ACH and it sucked so i usually use the FAST becausse i have it mounted with an AMP arm
royal pebble
i have an MTEK and it doesn’t use arc rails so i have to get unity adaptors to fit comtacs
royal pebble
thanks for breaking my neck smh
coarse laurel
and speaking of the belt, its nice too because i have my holster paddle on it
coarse laurel
low fox
you know, the marine corps is very generous with its equipment
royal pebble
that is a rad setup ngl
low fox
how nice of them to give me a free carbon sf
bronze burrow
this ur own or issued?
coarse laurel
this is my own
royal pebble
you can probably wear ur own shit to some degree
coarse laurel
its for a multitool
coarse laurel
its the realavid AR multi tool, i like it because it has the bit for adjusting sights
had it for 3-4 years so far
royal pebble
nah i’m talking about the pouch lmfao
coarse laurel
it came with it
coarse laurel
royal pebble
so you can zero your gun and stab the shit out of somebody with one device
coarse laurel
also helps with the carbon when cleaning
royal pebble
i want one ngl
coarse laurel
some of my bits are rusting, sadly
thats what happens when you crawl around mud and shit too much
same with my raptor shears
royal pebble
i store my tools in a double M4 mag pouch sealed in a plastic bag
little film of grease on the metal for good measure too
coarse laurel
im headed to a ranger training unit so i wont be using these for a while
with the exception of outside work shit and if im playing as OPFOR
for the ranger candidates
low fox
its a good thing i only re-enlisted for a check
ur not catching me going to ranger school
i am at a good weight
low fox
😔
royal pebble
divorced and killing people is the only way to go
coarse laurel
but now i have to go to airborne school, paramedic school, and work 48 hours at a time covering airborne school and ranger school classes and fucking best ranger competitions
low fox
L
coarse laurel
its so gay
low fox
airborne school could probably be taught in like 3 days
low fox
its not that bad
royal pebble
it’s time to be medically discharged from the military like every soldier over 30
my buddy got discharged from the marines on disability and he’s like 24, basically fucked for life
coarse laurel
its not that bad for a time but after my time there im def gonna go to bragg or some stupid shit
royal pebble
ty gubbernment
low fox
you're a medic right?
coarse laurel
yup
low fox
probably not gonna get a group assignment then
coarse laurel
3 people from my graduating class ended up in group
coarse laurel
we go everywhere
low fox
im aware
coarse laurel
like literally my first assignment was working in a provost marshal office
low fox
im just saying there's way more organic medical units on bragg than there are in group that you're likely to go to
coarse laurel
so it was chill
from what i was told, historically people in RTB end up in really good assignments after their time
coarse laurel
the group support
coarse laurel
yup
coarse laurel
better than an ABCT or an IBCT
low fox
depends on who your boss is
there's lots of people who could make your life easier in group
but choose not to of their own free will
low fox
thats what everyone says
coarse laurel
especially on the heavy side
low fox
just go drop a packet to CA or SOAR
being a CA medic is goated
being a SOAR medic is also goated
coarse laurel
CA might be a possibility in my future because of paramedic school
low fox
USASOC medics in general just have it real good
coarse laurel
getting the F2 ASI makes me prime candidate for SOAR too
can never have too many flight medics
low fox
as long as your PT and physicals are good and you can get through green platoon
bronze burrow
i would never be a medic of any sort, not my thing lol
coarse laurel
i didnt choose it either, i reclassed from being a Cavalry scout lol and it was the only choice i was presented with
low fox
i know the 160th can be real particular about the guys they pick up for medical stuff though
they serve some real high end customers
reputations are everything to those guys and they have a really good one
im sure you'll be fine though if you don't sandbag
there's so many dudes who got assignments to the 160th out of AIT and shit
and they sandbagged green platoon so they just told them to fuck off
not realizing that they hit the god damn lottery
coarse laurel
yeah they didnt know how good they had it
people coming from forscom would be more inclined to take it seriously because its either they fuck off and get sent back or they go to a better place
alot of people are desperate for the other side of the fence
its either that or ETS
low fox
ive had bad days here and there but man..
some of the shit i see the 82nd doing every day
dreams go to die in that unit lol
low fox
you probably will anyway though
although if you're lucky you might go to vicenza instead
coarse laurel
this is why its a good idea to hit up branch early on
i didnt thats why i ended up in an ABCT
from my cushy MP assignment
coarse laurel
an acquaintance of mine recommended i go to MMTC in benning
so i can have the chance to go on a mobile training team
as a broadening assignment
just go from post to post
low fox
if you can shoot yeah i dont see why not
coarse laurel
teaching classes
low fox
i dont really know much about them though
coarse laurel
luckily the school itself is like walking distance from where im goin to work
low fox
we're supposed to do broadening assignments every 2/3 years
which is how i got picked up for a combat tour out of SOCPAC
coarse laurel
oh yeah u guys are immune from that shit
coarse laurel
for us whiskeys its those 2 or instructors at ft sam houston/camp bullis
low fox
but there's also assignments in SWCS
but generally you dont go to SWCS unless you messed up or wanted to
i've gotten to do a couple really cool short assignments
when i was in syria for a bit a few months back doing IO stuff with JSOC was super cool
i've gotten some sick TDYs across the US
honestly, i dont know why anyone would want to stay in the regular army if they plan on staying in
coarse laurel
lol speaking of TDY's i have to do TDY in ft knox to babysit cadets
for their CST
coarse laurel
imagine bullying the cadets and one of them show up as a butter bar in your unit
lmao
low fox
it will only be worse
what's a butter bar going to say to me
we dont even have butter bars, you have to be a captain to come here
but if they were, i would still shit on them
coarse laurel
my old MEDO was a butter bar that was the butt of the joke because he looked like a pussy in my BN, he ended up being a bad ass dustoff pilot
prob got sick and tired of the tanker and infantry officers mocking him
hell of a character development
low fox
based
left flax
I want your nvgs
Now
shell sedge
Take em I fucking hate em
Idk if you know but NVGs fucking suck
I mean yeah there great for seeing in the dark but I hope your prepared for permanent eyesight damage
misty mango
average military issue shit
left flax
Take em I fucking hate em
I'll take em for sure 👀 been looking for a set for a while
left flax
average military issue shit
Still better than what I got
My NVGs are just eating carrots to see in the dark
left flax
Nah. Was looking into joining up the Royal navy but will probably be going fire services now
I don't need them for work, I just want a pair tbh
Was originally gonna buy the Russian pnv10T but well, can't get em now
shell sedge
Yeah tbh they aren't anything special
left flax
Still pretty cool though tbf
shell sedge
Believe me I was stoked the first few days but after a while they start to fucking suck and cause constant migranes anyone in any military will tell you that
The thing I don't fucking get is I Qual with my M4 and the fucking weapon system does not kick as much as it does in tarkov
frigid geyser
well, tarkov's recoil system been fucked for long time
shell sedge
It seriously gets on my nerves like if your playing a tactical shooter you should know how to hold a fucking m4 and not make it kick
left flax
The tarkov recoil is almost as if your character isn't a fully trained PMC lmao
It's dumb asf
frigid geyser
when you are supposed to be lol
left flax
Yah
shell sedge
......I also score sharpshooter or higher every Qual so I'm not really a good example to use 🤣🤣
misty mango
Believe me I was stoked the first few days but after a while they start to fucki...
thats why white phosphor is superior
frigid geyser
but c'mon, i feel like even the average guy shooting an ak or m4 wouldn't be as bad as the game...
misty mango
considerably easier on the eyes
frigid geyser
thats why white phosphor is superior
and cheaper
misty mango
aye
frigid geyser
altho fuck the mortar crew lol
shell sedge
There is a reason we don't use white phosphor
misty mango
"hey dumbfuck, heres a chemlight to brighten up your day"
shell sedge
It's cause the certain technology that we employ is built for green light
shell sedge
Lol you realize we have blackout lights for all night time operations
misty mango
yeah
i know about that
shell sedge
For the tactical stand point our NVGs are perfect for a health stand point just punch yourself in the temple hard asf and that's how it feels to wear NVGs
misty mango
sounds so pleasant
misty mango
once
i was being sarcastic with that comment though
shell sedge
That's what I meant
shell sedge
I'm going to milsim west later this year
misty mango
nice
shell sedge
Yeah
misty mango
i want to go to milsim west but its one hell of a commitment
especially considering im across the Atlantic
shell sedge
Yeah that's ummmm definitely a commitment I'm in the same state as milsim west lol
misty mango
that must make life a lot easier
shell sedge
Yeah also BLFC is an hour and a half away
misty mango
i mean
im planning on coming to the states sometime soon hopefully
just goddamn theres a lot to do
misty mango
Yeah also BLFC is an hour and a half away
luckyy
shell sedge
I'm furry too
misty mango
the closest proper con that i can somewhat go to is in Berlin
still gotta travel all the way iver there
shell sedge
Yeah we git a lot of cons
misty mango
indeed
acoustic harbor
Idk if you know but NVGs fucking suck
what NVGs do you have then?
gen 2s? have talked to multiple people and they never said anything bout eye damage
except your NVD is leaking
PNV 57 type shit
misty mango
old military issue pvs14s
ones you can buy are superior
mainly because they haven't been bashed more than the local prostitute
shell sedge
You think I read the fucking label of what kind of NVGs I have no
All I know is that when your a tank driver and you are on a 7 hour tactical movement in the middle of the desert you have the chance to get permanent eye damage
Believe me I've had bad fucking eyesight my whole life so when my shut is tweaked the slightest I can fucking tell
Shit*
acoustic harbor
You think I read the fucking label of what kind of NVGs I have no
you should tho? lmao
The gen is the most important thing
shell sedge
No the most important thing is getting the job done
acoustic harbor
shit like green/white phosphor is easy to differenciate
acoustic harbor
No the most important thing is getting the job done
not really? gen 2 and 3 have differences in range aswell as when they need an ir illuminator
that's pretty important as a IR illuminator makes you a fuckin IR Beacon
for anyone that has NVDs you will be a easy target
shell sedge
Have you worn nods in a combat training environment?
shell sedge
You don't know fucking shit tell you've actually worn em
acoustic harbor
you do tho?
acoustic harbor
shit like materials, technical differences, etc. are shit you can actually just get from looking at the tech behind it
shell sedge
I'm talking from experience not the fucking fun nutritional facts on the back of the box
acoustic harbor
would be the same as saying you don't know shit about armor unless you got shot
shell sedge
Do you our plates say that there rated to stop a 7.62x39 but you gonna trust it?
acoustic harbor
depending on manufacturer and materials yes
shell sedge
See the military doesn't have multiple manufacturers you get what you get and usually is the lowest bidder
acoustic harbor
but the military has standards that have to be met?
shell sedge
Not when your not in a serious wartime scenario
You think you ask the fucking standard when you get your Gen 1 iotv from 1995
acoustic harbor
The iotv still has plate standards to meet that's why you get em issued
also Kevlar doesn't loose that much ballistic capability over time
also it's different what you get issued in training and in deployment
were you on deployment with a gen 1?
shell sedge
Not me personally but there were people who were yes
What kind of military experience do you have?
Just curious
acoustic harbor
Not me personally but there were people who were yes
does surprise me looking at the US's budget
crimson prism
this setup goes hard
royal pebble
irl gear as in body armour and helmets
acoustic harbor
irl gear as in body armour and helmets
this tbh
solar summit
I broke a predator monitor mounting these, so that's a good idea. I should shoot the broken one
See if it pens
acoustic harbor
it most probably will
solar summit
Sacrifices must be made to the ergonomic gods
solar summit
what model is it? <@102589384804536320>
Some vivo one off amazon. But I had to mix and match parts from another brand since the vivo mount wants both monitors set up flat
royal pebble
ah
solar summit
The pole and desk mount is vivo, the arms are 'mount-it!' brand
coarse laurel
The thing I don't fucking get is I Qual with my M4 and the fucking weapon system...
What’s your mos?
coarse laurel
Do you our plates say that there rated to stop a 7.62x39 but you gonna trust it?
The green ESAPI’s do work against 7.62 AP
Don’t tell me you’ve only ever gotten black training plates
coarse laurel
The iotv still has plate standards to meet that's why you get em issued
It’s not the IOTV itself but the plates itself that get serviced that’s why every deployment cycle you might be asked to turn in your plates for new ones
The IOTV just holds the the plates and in the grand scheme of things it does it job even though it’s garbage
coarse laurel
See the military doesn't have multiple manufacturers you get what you get and us...
Lol not true, there are multiple companies with the same contracts producing one thing
Weird example but check your PT uniform
Some of em might say skillcraft some of em might be the federal prison industries
Same goes for IOTV’s and SPCS and whatever else we get issued
acoustic harbor
It’s not the IOTV itself but the plates itself that get serviced that’s why ever...
what shelflife do the plates have?
coarse laurel
2-3 years they need to be inspected for wear and tear
acoustic harbor
although I don't get how plates can have a shelflife, ceramic doesn't detirioate afaik
coarse laurel
if they are g2g they are re distributed
its not about the shelf life its about wear and tear
you seem to forget that we in the military are rough with our shit
we literally throw our plates on the ground
acoustic harbor
crunchy plate 
acoustic harbor
we literally throw our plates on the ground
why tho
coarse laurel
or rather we throw our plate carriers on the ground alot
like if we pull the emergency tab on the iotv
acoustic harbor
use training plates for that in training, will save you some shilling
coarse laurel
lol we do live fire exercises, fuck that
acoustic harbor
also Plates should withstand that, I think most do
coarse laurel
but yeah they need to be inspected and they rarely need to be replaced
before you deploy you have to RFI new plates
they look at the inspection date on your plates if its good to go you keep it if not they give you fresh ones
im guessing you dont know what preventative maintenance and checks are?
this is what it basically is
Here’s an example
They are still susceptible to wear and tear hence the need for inspection and PMCS every few years
Or every deployment cycle
coarse laurel
why tho
also as a medic ive had to pull that tab and have the plates slam into the ground so i can gain quick access to the casualty's wounds
also had to do that when i had to pull people out of a wrecked humvee
its not like the civillian world where your plates just sit pretty in your closet or whatever, shit gets banged up alot when you constantly use em and slam em on the ground
and yes ceramic plates can/do shatter if dropped, even though they can take impact from a high velocity round
had one dude shatter his because he placed it on the bottom of his duffel bag and one of the baggage handlers probably dropped said duffelbag
coarse laurel
Ceramics
compact dagger
neat
coarse laurel
This is true for all ceramics
They can break if you drop them, blunt force is different from an impact from a high velocity round
If not break at least crack or crack the thing which will compromise structural integrity of the armor
compact dagger
our army just doesnt give a fuck, a year in and havent had them inspected
pretty sure its the same for guys that have been here for 3 years
coarse laurel
It be like that
compact dagger
what do they even do with the ones that don't pass ?
just destroy and trash them ?
coarse laurel
Yeah
They actually run them through an xray type of machine to inspect for cracks or deformation
Then certify them as good to go or unserviceable
compact dagger
wondering, if they wanted, could they just cut out part of the big plate to fit in the side plate bags ?
low fox
Do you our plates say that there rated to stop a 7.62x39 but you gonna trust it?
they're rated for way nastier stuff lol
coarse laurel
^this
compact dagger
given that the big plate had enough undamaged area that it would be possible to cut it
coarse laurel
It would still be unserviceable
Reminds me of some dude tho cut an ACH’s ears off to turn it into a high cut
low fox
i don't recommend that at all but people do it
coarse laurel
He cauterized the the cut but the Kevlar is as good as unraveled
low fox
and even with cracks the ESAPIs will still function as intended
albeit at a slightly lower protection level most likely
coarse laurel
It’s a safety thing basically
compact dagger
I wanted to do the same, just buy some 6b47 or smth and make it a highcut
like 715 guys did
but cant find them anywhere for sale for a price i'd be willing to spend
low fox
my plates haven't been inspected since 2018 when i got them lol but its not that big a deal to me
i get a fresh set when i go overseas anyway and there's nothing these can't stop that would be an issue even cracked in the united states
blessed standalone plates 🙏
compact dagger
wdym with standalone plates /
coarse laurel
It means they don’t need plate backers
low fox
and plate backers are just soft armor ?
they don't need soft armor, padding or anything else
just pop them in my carrier and they'll perform as intended
compact dagger
ah, nice to know
low fox
and at 4.7 pounds, they're light as fuck
compact dagger
That's the part I don't understand about plates, why do they need soft armor to "perform as intended" if the plate itself is rated for X
just as I get it, the plates we have will stop 30-06 M2AP when used with soft armor, but won't if i don't have the soft armor ?
low fox
couple reasons
one of them is that the plate will stop the round but the potential deformation has the potential to harm you
another is that in the event of a penetration, the soft armor will catch any remaining fragments from the penetrator
but another reason is because soft armor is already a requirement for line troops because of the risks they commonly experience
so it's just more efficient to create the soft armor and plate as one system
test them as one system and rate them as one system
it's only really likely that the plate will have issues with the heavier ends of the rounds it's rated for without soft armor but there's no way to say for sure
compact dagger
Ah, thanks for explaining
in a few hours when I get to the base I might have some additional questions about soft armor
low fox
the main reason troops are bogged down in soft armor is because the most common recorded fatalities are related to fragmentation or explosives
compact dagger
we have some inserts that are supposedly helping you in some way when you get shot
but idk just seems of to me
like small piece of paperlike something
low fox
which is why people are reluctant to give line troops high cuts and plate carriers
compact dagger
how the hell does it help with anything
low fox
it'll likely stop frag
that's more likely to kill you than getting shot will
the problem is that explosives work by sending shrapnel up and out
so if you have a high cut and you're unlucky, you're gonna get seriously fucked up
same with a plate carrier
the areas without coverage are gonna get torn through by shrapnel
the reason that alot of SOF units are issued this stuff is because they are far more likely to be shot than blown up although both happen
coarse laurel
also you want padding when you get hit because the force feels like god drop kicked you in the chest
you will have broken ribs
i guarantee it
but ull live
low fox
depends on the round but yeah, it'll get you real good
although it also depends on the plate
compact dagger
so if you have a high cut and you're unlucky, you're gonna get seriously fucked ...
Yea, until I will get somewhere with even a slight chance of getting shot at I will think plate carriers and highcuts are better
but when i will get in that scenario i will probably rethink a lot of things
armor being one of them
low fox
like i say relatively often, my only combat tour we didn't really deal with a ton of IEDs though they were there
99% of the time it was just a shit ton of gunfire
but the dudes in afghanistan for most of the war and iraq especially
they were getting blown up every other day
it's hard to find a good balance that does both
nations are getting better at it though
the MSV Gen II is probably one of the best carriers the DoD has released in recent memory
the IHPS is an abomination but the ECH and ECH high cut are pretty solid helmet
s
i'm honestly surprised the army didn't opt to go with the ECH high cut, but i think it probably will soon
acoustic harbor
also as a medic ive had to pull that tab and have the plates slam into the groun...
In thatc casei can understand, I meant why train with actual plates when you can use dummys that don't get harmed
low fox
because they can save your life from stuff other than bullets
acoustic harbor
i'm honestly surprised the army didn't opt to go with the ECH high cut, but i th...
Well Highcuts as a soldier is dumb idea, 80% casualties are frag
low fox
there was a JRTC rotation where there was a vehicle parked on a hill or something with the trailer, and somehow the trailer suddenly jerked forward and sandwiched a guy who was inspecting the back of the vehicle in between it
acoustic harbor
as an SOF or quick in n out team okay
low fox
if he didn't have his plates in, he would have been dead as fuck
it cracked a few of his ribs but he was otherwise fine
low fox
Well Highcuts as a soldier is dumb idea, 80% casualties are frag
depends
the marines for example aren't as likely to deal with fragmentation
acoustic harbor
Plates saving the day again
low fox
which is why they have them
the majority of explosives where they're gonna be operating, or at least are supposed to will be from naval gunfire
that and grenades as usual
and rockets
acoustic harbor
also in general i think lowcuts are a better idea if they can fit comms
low fox
but maritime theatres aren't saturated as heavily with explosives as other ones are
acoustic harbor
ye weight n all but as a soldier that has to deal with any kind of frag
low fox
there's always frag
i dealt with it too, although not in high amounts
the issue is that when there's a really high amount of frag
acoustic harbor
Fragsuits
low fox
those only really have a place for gunners though imo
or i guess if you're assaulting something quick and you really want that extra protectio
n
coarse laurel
true true
royal pebble
genuine question but why would you want a mandible on your helmet while you’re a gunner in a helicopter?
isn’t there a pretty low chance of getting shot in the face when you’re that high up
low fox
genuine question but why would you want a mandible on your helmet while you’re a...
flak, shrapnel, keeping the wind out, etc
low fox
things like ZSUs that rely on ballistics instead of rockets/missles are still very common
compact dagger
not sure how comms work on helis but it might also keep the wind out of the mic, so easier to be understood by pilots/other crew
low fox
not sure how comms work on helis but it might also keep the wind out of the mic,...
it's an intercom system, though I'm not super familiar with how it works with the aircrew helmets
wise fern
I have flectarn shirt flectarn hat two combat belts, a canteen and a mag pouch
I need more
Idk what to get
low fox
https://www.army.mil/article/228671/new_protective_gear_saves_soldiers_life
le case and point
great for gunners
summer warren
wrong channel however
Lmao
dapper inlet
For some thermal Nod thing mounted to my LSZH+1
Thermal helmet-mounted monocular? Name? I'm gettin' bored of my night vision, looking to get into thermals as well.
bronze burrow
thermal is cool but at the same time i hate the idea of thermals existing lol
blissful leaf
Idk what thermal it is it used to be some kind of thermal scope or camera but was converted
royal pebble
thermal is the most unfair yet epic way to kill people since the invention of the flamethrower
low fox
Thermal helmet-mounted monocular? Name? I'm gettin' bored of my night vision, lo...
I just ordered a BNVD 1431 MK2 with OMNI 6 tubes with great spec sheet to use for work.
low fox
as an SOF or quick in n out team okay
I understand you have a long background in SOF, and in shrapnel heavy environments?
twin pecan
thermal is the most unfair yet epic way to kill people since the invention of th...
fight underground ig
royal pebble
the taliban seemed to have no qualms with dying above and under the ground
twin pecan
I'd rather take chances underground vs above ground thermal
royal pebble
underground is dicey for other reasons though
tight quarters, dark as shit, cave-ins
twin pecan
Also i think being underground/in mountains kept said Taliban alive
royal pebble
yeah it did
low fox
Thermal helmet-mounted monocular? Name? I'm gettin' bored of my night vision, lo...
I've used thermals as my main NOD on ops. It's terrible. Within an hour or so I was nauseus and started puking, the feeling was not unlike motion sickness/car sickness. Due to it being a digital device, and having a refresh rate etc, be sure you can physically use them before investing too much. My employer didn't want to pay for bino's so I've gotten them myself now, just waiting on receiving them. I prefer to use a bino setup, with either individual pod shutoff or bikini covers, and only use rifle mounted thermals.
low fox
underground is dicey for other reasons though
I understand you've fought in tunnels a lot?
royal pebble
no but i have some common fucking sense lmao, hop off
twin pecan
I think thermal clips are a thing so it doesnt have to be just thermal
You get night vision+ thermal
low fox
Thing with tunnels is that smokign out is a viable tactic
royal pebble
or just straight up collapsing it at both ends
low fox
or just straight up collapsing it at both ends
finding the other end is another bag of cats
twin pecan
Thing with tunnels is that smokign out is a viable tactic
Depends on how well made the tunnel is
Basically cant do that with China's tunnels
Well bunkers*
royal pebble
depends on the environment itself too
low fox
I'd rather take chances underground vs above ground thermal
I've fought under ground. During the ISIS war, I had an advisor contract, so I was deployed for most of it. I have been in both the Karachouk mountains tunnels in Makhmoor as well as in the Mosul tunnels. I preferred to not use my nods, actually. Rather just a bright as fuck weapon mounted light with strobe capabilities.
Thermals would have been useless. Nod's... well mine didn't have the rubber eye pieces, so I would have had huge backsplash, been visible as hell. Plus, with no ambient lights, I would have been dependent on IR lighting.
royal pebble
the viet cong dug their tunnels deep and interlaced with tree roots, which would reinforce the tunnel’s structure and help prevent cave ins
low fox
the viet cong dug their tunnels deep and interlaced with tree roots, which would...
they also dug smoke pits
twin pecan
I've fought under ground. During the ISIS war, I had an advisor contract, so I w...
I mean as being the equalizer against thermal
royal pebble
thermal optics is a very scary concept to fight against
twin pecan
But thats really cool
royal pebble
or the perception of fighting against, i guess you never know if the enemy has them or not
twin pecan
I think CQC is probably the only somewhat equalizer a lesser equipped force has against a more modern/equipped force in terms of combat. Assuming they can't just blow you up
low fox
thermal optics is a very scary concept to fight against
Yes and no. Most thermals you'll come across can sure spot you maybe up to 800m away. But the resolution on thermals is the problem. only the crazy expensive models (Which most militaries would not buy for anything other than SOF) have resolutions you can actually be efficient with on ranges of 300m+
royal pebble
ye the ranges at which you see hunting grade rifle thermal optics being used in places like Ukraine or the middle east is less than 300m
probably 100-200 meters
still better than no thermals whatsoever
low fox
I mean, you'll be hard pressed to find thermals with a resolution that allows you to effectively engage targets, in a combat scenario, more than 300m away for under $10K. I'd say you should go as high as 20K to be effective at those distances in combat, not deer hunting.
Most armies will not spend that on something that is relatively fragile, has a terrible battery time and will probably end up on ebay, if issued to regular troops.
And if you are not experienced with thermals, and have an infinite supply of batteries, you'll be extremely ineffective.
However, most combat vehicles today have thermals in their turret.
low fox
still better than no thermals whatsoever
Yes and no. If the choice is between good NOD's and shitty thermals.... always go with good nods.
barren kettle
you sound like a guy with some knowledge
low fox
you sound like a guy with some knowledge
in my background I've had significant training, I work as a contractor these days.
royal pebble
epic
low fox
I mean, great nods or the average commercially available thermals are not an end all solution. Unless you have the proper training, and all the other gear those items depend on to be effective, and then have some more training, and an effective weapon system, you're not going to be doing anything that fancy.
Thermals, or NOD's will not turn a sheepherder into a Tier 1 or 2 operator just by existing in his inventory of equipment. Both those items require significant training.
low fox
I understand you have a long background in SOF, and in shrapnel heavy environmen...
i do, what's your point
if you did tunnel rat stuff good on you hoss
but that shit is a death trap
hence why rather than try and go into tunnel we don't have to go into, we drop a bunker buster through the dirt and kill everybody inside
any form of CQB in shit like tunnels is probably the most dangerous thing you could ever engage in, to the point where there are now dedicated units in our own SOF organizations for that sole purpose