cyber-and-careers

[fringe crescent]

what you guys think

[spare kernel]

There's plenty of security internships available

[fringe crescent]

can you give me a link or something

[spare kernel]

Depends on the country you're in, as well as when you're applying. Typically internships are during the summer and the closing date for internships this summer has passed in most cases

[fringe crescent]

hmmmm....

[spare kernel]

Best place to look is honestly just Googling for them

and LinkedIn

[fringe crescent]

will check

thanks

[torn spire]

It's equal tbh, hence the question. I've heard that you can transition better from SE to cybersec than the other way around. What do you think?

[slim oracle]

hi

first I did CS50 which is a programming course, I loved it

on THM I did Pre Security, Jr Pentester, now doing Cyber Defense

I want to program again

what are programming jobs that are related to what I learned on THM ?

[pseudo creek]

There are tools development for cyber, you can also look at DevSecOps jobs

[slim oracle]

thank you I'll take a look

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @pseudo creek

[slim oracle]

so you would say that software engineering for tools in cyber would require knowledge in cyber?

if so I'm happy, I put so much time in THM to then find out that I actually just want to go back to programming

time not wasted

[pseudo creek]

yes

[drowsy bronze]

What should I do if I want to transition from software dev(2 years of exp) to cyber?

[pallid flower]

Look for Application Security related roles ^

[edgy tiger]

Discover which parts of "cyber" interests you and work towards the skillset needed, as you are a software dev a application related security role would be "easier" to obtain.

[drowsy bronze]

would certs help

[wispy geyser]

certs and bootcamps would help i would imagine.

even though it's costly, it' may be worth the investment to be employed

[edgy tiger]

Certs would help to a certain point yes.

[trim patrol]

hey guys hope everyone doing well
I am preparing for comptia security+ exam and i have CCNA too already so i was thinking in real life practical jobs stuff what will you do i mean lets say a security analyst, they do have responsibilites but in short what will u have to do, generally speaking

[peak hazel]

https://businessdegrees.uab.edu/blog/a-day-in-the-life-of-an-information-security-analyst/

[peak hazel]

Should I be suspicious of copmanies on Linkedin advertising for Penesters WITH no experience ? Something doesn;t feel right ....

[static tide]

damn people complaining that companies want loads of experience now the same for no experience

[flat sedge]

I'd be skeptical, but it does happen. Many places prefer to grow their own instead of hiring experience.

[peak hazel]

I am guilty both ways but I atleast expected an educaton level but this seemed too open door ....

[pseudo creek]

I would assume if they are asking for someone with no experience, they plan to pay peanuts

[warm hinge]

Basic offer and demand mechanics at play as in any other market. If lots of people are fit for the position right from the get go, then don't expect to have a stellar salary.

It seems companies couldn't just find the skills needed so they would rather hire people with no skills and train them. As a matter of fact...I have to have a plan B in case we can't find the infosec analysts we need at the place where I work at (Guess which platform will be part of their training )

[warm hinge]

IMHO, if that's the thing you REALLY want to do and you don't have experience or certs to attract the attention from recruiters and want to get into it right now, it's a great opportunity. I would milk it as much as I can, get as much exposure as I can to anything related to the job (How scoping, SOW, RoE docs are drafted, how findings are communicated to clients, how tasks are divided between team members, etc) and after 1 year and some months I would move on to something better paid and that represents a bigger challenge.

[drowsy bronze]

im having trouble finding a roadmap for devsecop on roadmap.io. any recs?

[wind laurel]

Makes sense to hire with no experience if you plan to train them yourself, allows you to refine the person to have the skills desired for probably a lot cheaper than outright employing someone with those skills already, just takes more time

[modern sentinel]

hey guys, m looking for an internship 👀

couldn't find any
cuz they either require an undergrad or any cert

any advise?

[pseudo creek]

This is largely country dependent. In the US, internships are primarily for current college students.

[modern sentinel]

true that, m also a college student (first year)

just got into uni

[pseudo creek]

again is largely country dependent... based on you calling it uni, I'd say you aren't in the US... maybe if you state your country, someone can provide advice

[modern sentinel]

India

[wicked geode]

@pseudo creek Please, oh mighty one. Bless me with employment.

https://tenor.com/view/praying-pray-snoop-dogg-begging-please-gif-12502205

[pseudo creek]

ya gotta do the work

[modern sentinel]

m ready to put my 8 hours a day

[placid seal]

Hello everyone. I need a little advice on something.

If i had to choose between joining a big company and a start up for cybersecurity. How should I make my choice?

[fringe crescent]

can anyone suggest me some companies in india for cybersecurity ?

[fringe crescent]

good question . I am also pretty confused

[edgy tiger]

Write both pro’s and cons down and compare I would say

[placid seal]

Im presented with this decision this week and im stuck

[placid seal]

Thats what i did didnt end up to a conclusion

Is there anyone here who have worked in a small/startup company in cybersecurity?

[edgy tiger]

I have worked for a startup multiple times

[placid seal]

How was your experience?

[edgy tiger]

I prefer startups over big companies

[placid seal]

Why?

[edgy tiger]

My experience is that big companies are slow, everything takes ages in which startups are the opposite

Startups usually gives you more responsibility because they have less people

[placid seal]

Yes you are right on that. Big companies have a very "controlled" environment and work plan

But what about career overall?
Do you think it might affect my resume in any way?
If for example my CV have a big company name there dnt you think it will have more value?

[edgy tiger]

I have learned much more at startups then at the big companies

[fringe crescent]

how to get cybersecurity job in top companies like google , amazon etc

[placid seal]

Yes

[edgy tiger]

Being extremely good with a extremely good resume 🙂

[quick forum]

I work for a small company (≈10 people) but they're not a startup

[edgy tiger]

Or have the right connections

[placid seal]

The choice i've been presented is also not a startup. Its more like a small company with up to 25 people

[quick forum]

Don't have to deal with corporate nonsense, big advantage

We can get everyone in one place for beers, which is good

[fringe crescent]

which companies will you suggest to get internship in for freshers

[placid seal]

So you mean better mental health in a way

[quick forum]

Not exactly

[edgy tiger]

You know all your colleges which is rare at big corp

[placid seal]

I feel like there will be lots of competition in a big company and that will affect my ability to learn new things

[edgy tiger]

There are plenty, start doing your own research first we cant answer that question for you

[fringe crescent]

can you suugest any names

[placid seal]

I will soon finish my bachelor's degree so you can say this is like a start for my career.. besides doing bug bounty at home when im free

[edgy tiger]

https://www.google.com

[fringe crescent]

same here

although i haven't done bug bounty

[placid seal]

Also did an intern in the past

As a blue team

Although my interest lies more in red teaming

[pseudo creek]

What job are each offering you? Often you get more different type of experiences in smaller companies but may have more growth opportunities with larger companies as they may have a lot of different roles. You may also have a larger pool of mentors

[placid seal]

For the small company its cybersecurity engineer and the big one is cybersecurity consultant

But for the big one i will have mixed responsibilities: like pentest, some blue team stuffs among others

Its just the job title

For the small one i dnt think i will have anyone to mentor me

[pseudo creek]

Why would you think that?

And what would be your responsibilities as a cybersecurity engineer?

[placid seal]

Because they just introduced a new department for cybersecurity. If i join there will be myself and another guy

[placid seal]

Pentest, patch system, do vulnerability analysis, report, among others

[pseudo creek]

Hmm

[placid seal]

Ensure the system have the required policies for different users

Pretty much the same thing but for the big company will be able to work on different kinds of systems

[pseudo creek]

For both, you will be providing a service for external customers or are they internally facing?

[placid seal]

External customers for both

Might get internal stuffs as well

[pseudo creek]

I’d be a bit concerned about the small company, I’d classify it as much higher risk

I’m also pretty risk adverse though

[placid seal]

Yeah but apparently they have approximately 100 customers

And again
This is just the start of my career. I will obviously move on to another after a year or so

[pseudo creek]

Is the other person you will be working with very experienced?

[placid seal]

I dnt think so

[pseudo creek]

Basically pentesting should be learned under an experienced pentester, you could easily crash and burn

But worst case, you move onto another company

[placid seal]

I dnt want to have like just a few months in a company then move on to the next (except if the workplace is toxic or something)

Aiming for a mimimum a year

[pseudo creek]

Having 2 juniors doing pentesting for external customers sounds like a recipe for disaster to me

[flat sedge]

I second this. My initial experience with pentest was being a handed a seat for MSP and being told 'don't tip anything over'

[placid seal]

Im strongly leanint towards the big company here because i.will get to explore different types of system/project

[flat sedge]

It was not nearly as good as it could have been

[placid seal]

Pentest is easy to say than done in a company

[pseudo creek]

Just wait til you take a customers critical system down by accident

[placid seal]

That would be horrible

[pseudo creek]

honestly, we expect every junior person to make 1 big mistake within the first couple years... thats why you have supervision/more senior members there to help correct asap

I took down an entire site down once... was quickly corrected though

[narrow iron]

Question regarding pay. I'm currently making ~65k in my current job, not related to IT or Cyber. I'm in the final interview stages with a company for a cyber consultancy/auditing position, but am unsure how much of a paycut I'd be willing to endure. Does getting a foot in the industry matter then those first few months/years of pay in the industry?

[flat sedge]

Consulting is a different beast. You are a paid expert for 3rd party contracting, expect to be paid reasonably well. I personally would not take a pay cut from your current position, unless the only role offered is very junior.
If you do not have other IT experience or a comp sci background, expect that to happen.
Another consideration is that the ideal consultant from a business perspective has a very narrow knowledge area and expertise.

[narrow iron]

That's both why I see this role as a pro and a con. I have a degree in cybersec but this would be my first cyber/IT role so I'd expect a 'junior' level of pay. I'm aware that the art of negotiating requires me to have leverage, but I'm not sure how I could argue for more pay if they offer less than what I'm currently getting. Is cyber consulting/auditing career suicide then if I'd like to end up in blue/red teaming?

[flat sedge]

Auditing, from either side, seems to be a common stepping stone to more aggressive security positions; one of the most hated aspects of pentesting from the business side is that many pentesters just want to break all the things, without understanding scope or risk; I have heard a couple of hiring and training managers from a fairly large auditing firm complain about it.

If you have a cybersec degree, my understanding is that you are more pigeonholed in what domains your degree applies to with respect to being a SME than a similar comp sci degree.

[narrow iron]

I tried to stress that in my interviews tbh, that while it's fun to break things I get more joy in learning the "whys" and preventative measures that can be taken to not have theses vulns in the future. I don't mind using this job as a stepping stone (or a long time gig if I enjoy it), I just want to avoid getting pigeon-holed into an industry where if I don't enjoy it, it would be considered irrelevant (ie. auditing /=/ sysadmin) per se

[molten heart]

The incident response team is hiring at Visa! We are currently hybrid so applicants should be located near Ashburn, VA or willing to relocate. We can also sponsor work Visas.

Our team follows the sun so you don't have to worry about graveyard if you apply for Tier 1.

Tier 1 Analyst (Shift Work)
https://smrtr.io/8VzB9

Tier 2 Analyst (Not On Shifts)
https://smrtr.io/8Q3Fd

10% 401k match, and annual cash bonus and raise is standard. 20 days minimum PTO plus federal holidays, floating holiday, time off for kids school, voting, and more

Feel free to DM me with any questions, I can refer applicants who reach out to me.

[flat sedge]

Hey! If you are a recruiter, please vet your position with @tacit bobcat , and we have a special channel specifically for posting job reqs too. #jobs-board

[tacit bobcat]

Send me a mail from your professional email and I can get that set up ([e-mail])

@molten heart ^

[stoic cave]

Is that a legit domain?

ICANN has no information and neither does Google

[tacit bobcat]

first link goes to https://jobs.smartrecruiters.com/Visa/743999822561161-cybersecurity-analyst

second to https://jobs.smartrecruiters.com/Visa/743999821031537-senior-cybersecurity-analyst

[tacit bobcat]

looks like it may be that smartrecruiters thing shortener

[stoic cave]

Gotcha

[tacit bobcat]

seems to be running an nginx anyways 😛

is probably legit

[slim oracle]

what are the jobs that are the most full remote?

[red coral]

For a while now I've been mucking about trying to figure out what kind of security specialization I wanted to go down, but something's recently caught my eye. I'm exploring a little into cloud related stuff for AWS and Google Cloud Services, but I noticed there were job types that go along the lines of the role "Cloud Security Expert" or something buzzy like that.

Anyone have experience concerning cloud security operations and what it entails. Curious what y'all think of it. I'm not entirely sold on it all, but it's itching the part of my mind that is magnetizing me to it, currently.

If I'm really going to jump into Cloud related stuff, I figure I should probably pick up CompTIA's Cloud+, Server+, Linux+, Security+, AWS Cloud Practitioner, AWS Security Specialty, ISC2 CCSP, and then ISC2 CISSP? Probably some google certs to consider for cloud as well? Spitballing what kind of information I should be picking up for certs that would improve my value concerning this route should I decide to waddle down it.

[quick forum]

Most tech jobs now...

[slim oracle]

maybe in the US yeah

lucky b-words

[quick forum]

No... Many many countries.
If you want advice specific to your country, ask for advice specific to your country.

[slim oracle]

hey guys what are the jobs that are the most full remote in France ? thx

[tacit bobcat]

good luck, France is still a bit backwards w/r to remote work

[spare kernel]

Idk if you need all those. I’ve seen people get into cloud with just an AWS Solutions Architect cert. You’re most likely not going to land a cloudsec job with only certs, no matter how many you get. You’re gonna need cloud experience

[red coral]

Yeah, that's true. I suppose what I really need to work on is breaking into it as entry level cloud solutions to begin with and slowly work into cloud security. I should probably just look for the basic cloud certs to start with, though that may even be out of reach for me as I have no industry experience at all. I should probably start trying to look into getting help desk or PC repair experience to start with, maybe?

[pseudo creek]

Basically cert collecting isn't really the way to go... not sure there is much value in Cloud+, Server+ or Linux+. Even the AWS Security Specialty isn't something I recommend unless you are aiming to work for a small company and hope to implement AWS specific security services. Personally, I recommend AWS Solutions Architect Associate. You can get a cloud job without cloud experience but IT experience will help

CCSP is also really just a generic cert, not extremely valuable for entry level positions

[rugged delta]

I'd definitely agree with this, the certs are really only of value if you're working in a specific role but it would be expected you'd have other certs and experience prior to getting into a security role. The CompTIA certs like A+,Net+ are very entry level, Cloud+, Server+ I wouldn't see of benefit unless you're also working/certified in Windows/Linux and AWS Security is only really of use if you also hold other AWS certs. AWS certs are widely recognised and the salary for holding several of them can be some of the highest paying roles in the industry but hanging on one AWS cert is not getting you very far.

SSCP, CCSP are fine if you're pursuing the ISC2 track but they're really at the same level as CompTIA Sec+ as far as recognition goes. CISSP is still one of the most in demand cybersec certs even though it's intended for people with many years of experience. Overall though it's your experience and abilities that matter

[fair brook]

Hi

I need to start
please guide

[stoic cave]

Do you have a specific question?

[red coral]

@pseudo creek @rugged delta Thanks for the insights.

I imagine then focusing on AWS cloud certs and then seeing if I can spin cloud security into it as I go? Are the google cloud certs worth it to get or are they kind of niche and situational depending on the company? I don't really hear much about google cloud services and enterprise solutions. Another thing out there is Microsoft Azure certifications that seem somewhat useful but I don't know to what degree.

Essentially, what I want to do is go down the AWS certification path for cloud stuff, and maybe start poking at Security+ and the ISC2 certs as I go?

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @pseudo creek

[wind laurel]

following on from all the cert talk, i'm planning on taking the CompTIA Security+ pretty soon, but it sounds like even if i go through with getting certs i won't really be able to get anywhere? My degree is in game design, and i've spent the last couple years teaching game design/esports in a college, so would it be worth following the Security+ with an MSc in Cyber Security or would i realistically be able to eventually land an entry job with certs + dedication 😂 (UK, but would rather move to EU - if that changes anything)

[stoic cave]

A masters is more of a hindrance than a plus early career. It prices you out of entry level positions. I'd wait until you have a need for it, ie a company wants you to get it for promotion/management, and then have them pay for it

[wind laurel]

That's a really good point that i hadn't considered, thanks a lot! Will stick to dedicating myself to learning and picking up relevant certs and eventually try to get an entry level role 🙂

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @stoic cave

[stoic cave]

I'm not sure you have enough relevant professional experience so you may want to apply to some IT positions to build out the resume. Don't let that stop you from applying to security positions, but also don't feel down if you don't hear back from places.

[wind laurel]

makes a lot of sense tbh, will look to try get a straight entry in the beginning but if it ends up not being reasonable i'll pursue some more IT exp as an entry to the entry positions

[pseudo creek]

Yes, I think security+ and AWS Solution Arch Asc will set you up nicely. Google cloud just isn't as popular

[red coral]

Gotcha. I'll hit up the materials for Cloud Practitioner to dip my toe in and if it seems to sing to me, then I'll make sure I take the exam for that cert and work on the higher ones.

[tired sluice]

Anyone looking for a team to do Google CTF with? 🙂 Also looking for members to join! Good to gain practical experience, release writeups etc

[primal grail]

@red coral just sent you a message

[red coral]

No worries, I'm okay with it.

[rocky bear]

Hi, mind if I message you? I'm interested in joining for Google CTF :)

[rugged delta]

AWS is the biggest cloud platform in terms of the size of their cloud deployment worldwide, number of data centres, number of services offered, volume of client usage and experience in cloud management. AWS is the oldest of the large cloud platforms and salary for holding AWS certs is one of the highest paying globally. holding multiple AWS certs can net you a salary on par with high tier cybersec roles in some parts of the world.

Azure is the 2nd largest of the big three in terms of deployment size, usage and services offered. Their certs are not as widespread as AWS but MS have been pushing into a lot of organisations. Google Cloud is not as large as the other two but still has significant deployment and use, though not as many services on offer. Their certs are recognised in the cloud community but most cloud workers tend to certify in AWS, as although many of the services across the big three are similar, there are a few subtle differences.

As @pseudo creek says, AWS Solution Architect Associate is a good first step, since you need a good foundation in Cloud knowledge. I use A Cloud Guru for Cloud and Linux training but AWS has there own training solutions and there are others in the market

[red coral]

Is AWS Cloud Practitioner worth getting at all? Or should I side-step it and aim directly for Solutions Architect? What caught my eye initially was SysOps Administrator but looking around on even Glass Door, there's pretty much nothing in association to that cert aside from a generic SysOps listing. Would it be then the play to go Solutions Architect Associate, then work on pushing into Solutions Architect Professional?

[rugged delta]

It's worth reading the Cloud Practitioner material but that exam is mainly aimed at managers and sales people who need a good overview of the platform to interact with techs, clients and other people in the organisation. The Solutions Architect, SysOps Admin and Developer Associate are aimed at entry level cloud technicians and engineers and cover all the basics you need

[red coral]

Ah, okay. So it's good information to know, but not necessarily something useful to certify for a resume. I think I'll work on Solutions Architect then, grab up the other two if I can, push into the professional version of Solutions Architect, and then grab Cloud Security on the side and start working towards Cyber Security related certs focusing as much as I can on Cloud related stuff. Thank you for your insight!

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @rugged delta

[peak hazel]

I guess it's worth pointing out that if you re aiming at the security side AWS - then Pentester Academy has some pretty solid labs which will complement your AWS certs.

[red coral]

Interesting. I'll keep that one in mind, as well. I feel like the more wide-spread and commonplace usage cloud type infrastructure is used, the more relevant security focus on cloud services will become which might be a good "long play" to make. We'll see what goes down in funky town. Many thanks!

[peak hazel]

Spot on! I will also recommend adding Python to your tool kit as I have seen a wide variety Cloudsec AWS jobs listing Python in their requirements

[red coral]

Python, ay? Alright interesting. Will do. Thank you muchly!

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @peak hazel

[peak hazel]

Here's a job currentyl being advertised: https://www.genomicsengland.co.uk/careers/open-positions/platform-engineer-security-aws

[pseudo creek]

there are a ton of jobs that require AWS knowledge

I've been working in Cloud security for 6 years?

[red coral]

Is there anything else that seems to be in heavy demand similar to AWS? I see AI occasionally. IoT used to be buzzing for a straight minute and then I hear nothing about it. One I do see often is stuff to do with scrums and agile.

[quick forum]

Security on industrial control systems and other tech that isn't immediately conventional IT

[red coral]

Interesting. So unconventional and sort of niche things are also in demand that require dedicated security. Didn't think about that angle.

[quick forum]

Please clarify

[stoic cave]

ICS security is lagging... Hard

It's getting better though

That's one field I'm interested in

[calm badge]

hi, I am applying for a security automation engineer position. I am updating my cv now. can somebody help me with it? I can send my CV

[stoic cave]

Redact your CV of PII and post an image of it here

[calm badge]

How does it look? sorry I deleted personal information so it looks a bit off.

[peak hazel]

If looking for internship - this might be useful: https://www.cybersecurityeducationguides.org/guide-to-cybersecurity-internships/

[trim patrol]

Hi is anyone from CANADA, dm me please need some help
general q's about starting a carear and moving to canada expenses and stuff

ty

[quick forum]

As I said, it's always best to ask the question(s) directly

[dire nest]

If moiz keeps doing it, any chance this will be marked as spam?

[lost storm]

“Don’t ask just to ask” - smart person I know

[pseudo creek]

So you proclaim yourself to be selftaught but you've been in a professional role for 3 years. (99% of cyber people have never had formal education in Cyber). I would update your professional summary including what you are hoping to do.

I looked at your writeups, they aren't very write-upy? Basically you show screenshots of what you did but its not a writeup, more personal notes than anything.

You are also trying to showcase a web interface you wrote but your README is poor, doesn't describe what it is, the purpose, etc.

Also the skills certification and your certification being on the side makes it harder to read and easier to ignore.

Basically, your resume is bland, your github is bland.

[stoic cave]

Top to bottom:

Profesional Summary - don't need it, write a cover letter if you want one.

Employment history - put it below education as you don't have a lot.

Education - bring education up and mention nay courses that are relevant to computer skills in a relevant courses subsection.

Extracurricular - fine where it is.

Skills - put below education and make certifications and languages subsections. Look at AwesomeCV to make it look better.

The black lines don't look good

[dire nest]

If I had 200 writeups 1 website 2 mobile apps on google play, I learnt by myself from end of 2017 til now. Which was count as experience?

[stoic cave]

Do you currently have a visa allocated to you?

[quick forum]

They were directed here, and this is really minimodding I'll be honest. If you think there's a problem, ping a mod.

[pseudo creek]

most cover letters won't be read, I think a professional summary is fine but it should be max 2-3 sentences and should have a purpose

[stoic cave]

I mean the same could be said for resumes but

[dire nest]

I understand. That's a question I am curious. Not trying to violate #rules

[quick forum]

It's definitely not spam because it wasn't repeated and has value in this channel

[stoic cave]

Just my personal opinion on the executive summary

Especially once you get a thicker resume

[pseudo creek]

mostly because I've reviewed so many resumes and it is just so weird to see a resume and then look at the job they are applying to and both don't speak the same language... I do not have a summary on my resume because my experience aligns with positions I apply to

HR doesn't even send us cover letters if they are included, only if I get access to the system do I see the cover letters

[stoic cave]

That kinda seems like a problem with HR

[pseudo creek]

true true but they also know managers won't even read them

sometimes we get a dump of 100 resumes... so its like 'go sift through these'

[stoic cave]

Yeah, idk, I kinda owe my current position to a cover letter. So I may see them as more valuable than most

[rugged delta]

Take the top half and put them in the shredder. You don't need unlucky people in the company...

[pseudo creek]

basically I see the professional summary as something that links your resume to the job you are applying to. I just personally like to see them otherwise I assume you are just doing a resume blast and you aren't really looking for our specific position. Exception being if your experience is in line perfectly with the position (like I said, my resume does not have a professional summary)

[lost storm]

Have to agree with the HTB writeups. Just looked at them and they aren't very presentable. You have to click through folder structures, which is annoying already, and these aren't what I would describe as walkthroughs. These straight up look like personal notes.

[dire nest]

What if I look at the JD and research the tech stack they use, without experience but I know I can do it. Should I apply for? Any chances, it can bypass the experience requirement?

[stoic cave]

Depends on how much experience they are asking for. Self-learning is a lot different than the knowledge you pick up on the job

[pseudo creek]

sure, I've gone into many jobs without specific knowledge or experience in the certain areas

[stoic cave]

But you've had professional experience previously

I think they are talking about having zero Profesional experience

[pseudo creek]

well my first full time job was a WAN admin, I had a part time IT job at my college... but no professional experience

it also depends, are they asking for 10 years experience or 1-2 years?

[stoic cave]

That was going to be my follow up

[dire nest]

As I learn cybersec myself and more subjects about human psychology, the professional experience may comes from 1. understanding the situation/ the tools/ the protocols 2. The mindset to think to solve problems

[pseudo creek]

yeah no

[stoic cave]

No, professional experience is pretty specific

[pseudo creek]

professional experience really involves working on a team, taking direction from management/leads and working in a professional environment

[dire nest]

I agree 👍 100%

but that's what I don't have currently

[pseudo creek]

so is the job asking for 1-2 years experience or 10 years?

[dire nest]

2 to 4 years

[pseudo creek]

so your chances are slim to none but you could apply, wouldn't hurt

[dire nest]

I know my path will be rough. So frustrating

[lost storm]

keep at it and you'll get it!

[rugged delta]

Sebastián Ramírez, creator of FastAPI (a web framework for creating APIs based on Python) reported a similar case on Twitter a couple of days ago:

“I saw a job offer the other day. It required more than 4 years of experience developing with FastAPI. I couldn’t apply because I was only using it for 1.5 years … since I created it.”

“Maybe the time has come to re-evaluate that ‘years of experience = skill level’.”
https://samagame.com/blog/en/when-a-job-offer-asks-you-for-more-years-of-experience-in-a-software-than-it-has-been-since-it-was-created/

[pseudo creek]

I agree in specific technologies, usually years of experience is for professional experience in general... a recent topic came up in another discord the other day, person had no IT experience but had done lots of freelance work/bug bounty AND had previous experience in another industry (construction). I was like, I'd totally interview them because they have had to work on a team, under direction

[dire nest]

It force people without experience to do other freelance jobs. Or think again before reading again

[pseudo creek]

well that becomes tricky because no one wants to be your first job

[rugged delta]

If a person has some skills earned on other positions, definitely worth considering because they'll probably be eager to learn and stick around if you're supporting their growth and education

[pseudo creek]

that is why IT help desk is often recommended

[dire nest]

That causes another problem about spending time

[pseudo creek]

its a huge risk to hire someone if they have never had to work for a paycheck

so why would they choose you over the 50-100 other applicants?

something else you could do is develop a unique skillset

[rugged delta]

https://tenor.com/view/liam-taken-point-gif-18698093

[alpine marsh]

@quick forum I did some changing up

[shut violet]

now the one thing, and i dont know how valuable it is, is having a place for notable projects outside of school/work

I personally think thats important but maybe not?

[alpine marsh]

yeah, I just don't really have any projects on mind that I can put there

cause all my projects are ongoing non finished ones

[shut violet]

ah i see

for mine I have my home lab/ unraid server, and ill add that ive set up elastic in a cloud VM when i revise i think

my contributions for making CTF challenges as well

[quick forum]

Descriptions much better

[alpine marsh]

thx

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @quick forum

[proven crag]

Just looking to see if anyone has any advice for improvements I could make to these sections of my CV

[peak hazel]

This might help you as well too: https://www.qwikresume.com/resume-samples/automation-engineer/

[proven crag]

Cheers, I'm changing up the style a bit anyway, so there's some colour in there haha

[peak hazel]

No worries! Also here https://www.indeed.com/career-advice/resumes-cover-letters/resume-for-automation-engineer

[proven crag]

Yeah, am just going for a job at a local shop for over the summer holidays 😄

[peak hazel]

Summer holidays nice 🙂 I have interview tomorrow but it's distracting from Cyber studies sooo I might decline and take rest of the month to just get it done. Good Luck Burr.

[proven crag]

Cheers 😄 Gl yourself!

Changed the font from Arial to Calibri Light, changed some of the colour to the blue style that word has for text and we've got this

Looks a little less plain, idk about the colour though, might turn it black again icl

[quick forum]

I'd put your name as the title and left align

[proven crag]

Fair enough will do, remove curriculum vitae entirely yeah?

[quick forum]

Up to you, could do Burr Burrson - Curriculum Vitae but I know you just want to flex your latin GCSE

[proven crag]

Nah, I remember nothing from it, it was just how the sixth form had us do it when we did it then

Reckon the colour's a bit much?

[flat sedge]

I would suggest using a nice looking template instead of a roll-your-own in MS Word

[proven crag]

Yeah, I looked at the ones word comes with and icl, I thought mine was better but I've not looked else where

As I say, it's not got to be beautiful because it's a summer job, my biggest focus is definitely the wording

[flat sedge]

First impression you get with an employer is your resume. A 'meh' resume doesn't do you any favors.

[proven crag]

Of course not but I think the wording is also important, I don't want too much time putting into the look, I want it to look worth reading but not like the focus was aesthetic

[peak hazel]

You really need both! If if looks poor - you appear unprofessional too.

[proven crag]

It's a balance imo, if it looks unprofessional it'll get put aside but if it looks like you care more about how pretty it looks it'll get put aside also

[peak hazel]

True! I remembered trying to send a video CV I once saw on Youtube for an IT Role. .... and when I got to interview stage - they wanted to what I was thinking 🤣

[stoic cave]

Latex

I wouldn't use anything else

[flat sedge]

Not necessarily. A well-formatted and laid out resume that is mediocre content wise is easer to read that a bad looking but well-written resume. Which one do you think HR is going to forward to the technical hiring manager?

[stoic cave]

Machine readable, looks nice, etc

[flat sedge]

Your first approach on the resume is 'how do i get past the HR filters'

[proven crag]

This is what I've got atm, it's not a template but I've changed the style a bit more, a lot of the templates I'm seeing have a sidebar which I don't think is ideal where I don't have much to fill it with

Also I don't mind people knowing my name so dw about it not being redacted

[pseudo creek]

So resumes differ throughout the world but I highly dislike the bubbles trying to show knowledge. Basically if you put 4 bubbles, I assume you have multiple years of experience in that one area and would be a SME... if you have 5, I'd assume you basically are one of the people in the world with top knowledge in that area. It is really meaningless for most people and hard to judge.

You don't need to list Office as something on a resume, it is mostly assumed in tech. When you say Windows, do you mean Windows desktop? or Windows server?

Your contact info seems to be taking a lot of space

If you do a side panel none of the things in that area should go beyond one line but your Hobbies do

[proven crag]

The title is actually the same colour, it's just in the header bar

I removed the bold from the information under the name

[peak hazel]

Do you have to list your grades? I never have. I said have XYZ, Passed ABC certs but maybe things are different in other countries.

[proven crag]

It depends on how much you've got and where you are career path wise

[pseudo creek]

DOB? is that normal to put on a resume where you are? Your contact info is taking a lot of space and you aren't using your right side of your resume. Your personal summary should not have "I" in it and also you should get rid of fluff/subjective items. This should also be fairly concise, 2-3 sentences max

Why do you include your grades? It isn't a transcript.

Why is your work experience near the bottom?

Interests should be on the bottom but should also be concise.

[proven crag]

I've not got certifications and even if I did, I don't think my local shop knows or cares what they are but seeing my english language grade is probably important to them

I put work experience near the bottom as I've got very little, only having worked one job prior, I was told to include grades when in 6th form and when I got my first job in it I had them in so I guess I just kept them in.

I'll remove D.O.B that's non-important and I'll see if I can jumble around that top section a bit and remove the Is etc.

[pseudo creek]

ok this must be something UK specific, I mean I'm speaking from a US perspective but this resume wouldn't get very far

[proven crag]

I don't know, I've just been updating my CV from the one I used when I was last working

[alpine marsh]

How would you make the bubbles into words if I might ask?

[proven crag]

could be that it isn't worth listing all my GCSEs now that I've been to 6th form but idrk

Could I list it as Telephone: Landline / Mobile on one line?

[pseudo creek]

drop the bubbles is one way... another way is to make a descriptive skills section... things like
"Experience in automation utilizing Python"

[quick forum]

Yeah definitely no DoB

[pseudo creek]

I would only list 1 phone number

[quick forum]

For schooling, you usually put your grades. It matters until you've got experience

[pseudo creek]

but they do?

even if experience is a few years old

[quick forum]

Enough relevant experience

[proven crag]

I've removed telephone in favour of mobile instead

Got it down to address, mobile and email

[quick forum]

It's a single entry for experience, education will be more important here.

Not sure I'd go as far as GCSE but eh

[proven crag]

Should I put mobile and email on one line and use some of the right side or keep them on separate lines?

[quick forum]

I have all my contact etc on one line at the top, below my name

[alpine marsh]

what about something like "confident x amount of years"?

[proven crag]

Cheers

[quick forum]

If it's not professional experience in it, I wouldn't

[flat sedge]

Extracurricular at best. There's a huge difference between performing an activity as a hobbyist and doing it professionally.

[pseudo creek]

with my resume, I put I am a self learner and do list things that I have self taught

[quick forum]

Also @proven crag I really really highly recommend talking to your uni careers people. My uni has a CV help thing where they'll talk you through improving it

[proven crag]

I'd have to put address on a separate line to mobile and email unfortunately as their isn't enough space when I try and put them all on one line

[quick forum]

Address is not relevant

It's 2022

Not 1960

[peak hazel]

Self taufght - does that include onlince courses?

[proven crag]

Would you not say for somewhere local that it might be important?

[flat sedge]

Not really

[pseudo creek]

self taught to me is project based, things I've actually done

[quick forum]

How you get to work is your own problem ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[pseudo creek]

sitting in front of a coursera video, answering a few questions is not it

[peak hazel]

But my Coursera could is teaching to build stuff - mini projects ect??

[proven crag]

True I guess, it's only one line though that's why I'd debate it

[pseudo creek]

like when I went for my current job, I followed a udemy course where I created a pipeline which included packer and terraform, and did some other related projects, I did put on my resume that I was in the process of learning deployment pipelines using packer/terraform

lots of people go through coursera not doing any projects thoug

I also had a github that included those projects

[peak hazel]

Thank you @pseudo creek Great idea. I might need to follow Burr's idea and post my CV geared at cyber jobs when ready 🙂

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @pseudo creek

[proven crag]

Also would it be better to email and sort references to include in the CV or leave it as available on request and give them if requested

[peak hazel]

Available on Request is on mine

[proven crag]

As I have none for certain yet but can speak to any of my uni and sixth form tutors as well as my previous employer assuming they haven't left the company

[peak hazel]

Remeber you can use academic references too 🙂

[proven crag]

wdym?

as in uni and sixth form tutors?

[peak hazel]

Yes as professional referemces if you have no others: https://www.snagajob.com/blog/post/who-can-i-use-as-a-reference

[proven crag]

oh yeah

[peak hazel]

Obviosly get their permission first and dont surpsie them lool

[proven crag]

I've removed the subjective part of my personal summary but see no feasible way of writing a personal summary without I or being in 3rd person

[proven crag]

Yeah, I'm going to email ofc

[alpine marsh]

Imma put all my programming skills in a section for itself instead of under skills as I am self taught in all my programming

[peak hazel]

Because we all don't want to be Pentesters: https://cybersecurityventures.com/50-cybersecurity-titles-that-every-job-seeker-should-know-about/

[proven crag]

How would you go about asking if someone is okay with being a possibly reference for you?

[static tide]

hey bro i’m applying for a job can i stick you down as a reference

[proven crag]

just because I'm not sure how to word it really and I may not need them as a reference if the email I have for my previous employer still works

I just feel that would be too informal, especially when it's my sixth form tutors

[static tide]

ahh

[proven crag]

I remember at sixth form with emails we were expected to be very formal

[static tide]

thought it was personal references

[proven crag]

Nah

[static tide]

Hey <whoever>,

I’m applying for a job as a <whatever> and I was wondering if you would mind me putting you down as a reference?

Kind regards,

[proven crag]

I'm emailing my tutors and past employers to ask if they would be ok with being my references if they ask for references but just in case I want to email my sixth form tutors because I know my past employers were having a lot of job shuffling so if they aren't there still I'd like to still be able to list a couple for references

[proven crag]

Thanks, I appreciate it 😄

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @static tide

[proven crag]

Would you recommend that I send my CV off with the email or no?

Just because I've seen some places recommending that you do send it off to them (I've sent out my emails, but not included the CV just because I've stated what sort of jobs I'm applying for and being pretty generic I didn't think it worth sending a CV which needs to have slight changes per job application)

[quasi stream]

sending your CV with to your references? no

your references should either be:

1. professional (i.e. line managers)
2. character references
3. academic (which can also go into character)

they should have no need for your CV

[proven crag]

Cheers, I've got them sent off anyway now 🙂

Didn't send the CV anyway

[quasi stream]

the whole point of references is that they want to know how others perceive you / how you perform

not what you suggest them to tell via things like CVs(:

[proven crag]

Yeah, I didn't really see the point in giving them my CV, I let them know I was applying to local shops for work over summer but that was about it in regards to other details

Just so they have an idea what questions they could be asked etc.

[quasi stream]

yup, pretty much all you need to tell your references. If you're applying for places that do DV, then they'll also be interviewed (quite in-depth) about your character, so it's polite to forewarn them

[quasi stream]

perfect. Let them know you're using them as a reference, saying where you're applying is polite for when they get the call/email they know who & why they're asking exactly

[proven crag]

Yeah, when they all respond, I'll thank them all and let them know if I end up using them as a reference (am not using all)

I've a couple of places I'll be applying to so I'll let them know when I respond

[quasi stream]

It's good practice & plote to let your potential references know that you're going to be using them as a reference before you apply

[proven crag]

My reasoning being that I've emailed my sixth form tutors in case the my previous employer's contact details are outdated etc.

[quasi stream]

not only is it polite, but it also helps make sure that your reference is actually contactable. If where your applying can't reach the reference, it slows down your application a hella lot

[proven crag]

I've asked them all if they'd be ok with it and haven't put them on my CV anyway

[quasi stream]

cool(:

sounds like you got it figured 👍

[proven crag]

I thought, I'll email them all and leave the CV as available on request because then I can apply while I wait back for the responses

[quasi stream]

On your CV I would put something like "References available on request"

[proven crag]

I'm not sending my CV in yet anyway

[quasi stream]

imho

[proven crag]

but that's how I've got it atm

[quasi stream]

perfect

"References available on request" is much better than "I'm not telling you if I have references whether or not I have them at all"

[proven crag]

I do doubt they'll care about references but it does no harm to have a couple if I can

[quasi stream]

Nah

References are v good

any decent employer will ask for a character reference

[proven crag]

Yeah, I mean as I say, it's only work at a couple of local shops so I don't know how much they'll care but it's a good idea to get some ready

[quasi stream]

true say

[proven crag]

I can ask if someone's ok being a reference and if they don't end up being contacted, nothing's been lost

[quasi stream]

Depends on the stores too. if we're talking retail, I interviewed for a retail store job in my 1st year of uni, despite 2 years work experience in IT, they asked about character references because retail is not IT

[proven crag]

Although, once they've given me the green flag, do I let them know that they've been chosen as a reference after the interview (where I presume they would ask for references if they wanted them)

The last job I worked already had contact with my sixth form so I didn't end up needing any references

[quasi stream]

If you expect to use them as a reference, let them know that you're considering them as a reference before you apply

[proven crag]

Oh yeah of course, but would they ask for references at an interview usually?

[quasi stream]

no, they should've considered/asked for them them already by that stage

[proven crag]

Right, cheers

[quasi stream]

at least in my experiences of interviews

[proven crag]

I mean I can't imagine it matters too much as long as you keep your reference up-to-date with what's going on

I imagine that's the biggest thing

[quasi stream]

pretty much aye (:

it's just about your reference being contactable and recent

i.e. no real point using a reference who hasn't seen you in 6 years or w/e & theres a chance their phone number no longer works/ is theirs

[proven crag]

Yeah, that's why my ideal references would be my previous employer and my academic advisor

[quasi stream]

for some professions your references have to be within <x time (:

[quasi stream]

yup perfect references

[proven crag]

My previous employer last saw me in 2020 (I was still in sixth form then but I see an advantage to having a professional reference in addition to an academic reference)

so getting my academic advisor instead of sixth form would be better because it's more recent, plus she's able to see my overall grades, attendance and taught my ethical hacking module so she's seen me in class and talked to me before

[quasi stream]

your advisor yes, they'd be a good character and academic reference. I assume you'd have a more 1:1 basis with them than somthing like a tutor in 6th form where the tutor groups (not classes mind you) are like 10+ people

[proven crag]

Yeah, it does depend a bit though because my computer science class had about 6 people total

and my sixth form tutor taught me through from year 8 to 13

[quasi stream]

6th form tutors are very often subject teachers, so they will be teaching 2/3 groups of timetabled classes in 6th, let alone the lower years

[proven crag]

Yeah for sure, I can see advantages of both

[quasi stream]

ultimately it's whoever you feel can give you the most accurate representation -- they are speaking about you

[proven crag]

Honestly, they both have their pros and cons but given how well first year's gone for me personally, I'm probably going to list my academic advisor

Only module I didn't get >70% was databases at 68% and my attendance has been good so I reckon it'd be a good choice to go with my academic advisor honestly

[quasi stream]

does sound like it (:

well sounds liek you got it figured so gl

(:

[proven crag]

cheers 😄 thanks again for the advice

[quasi stream]

I've had interviews in all sorts of roles: education, IT, (physical kind) security, NHS, retail, bar/hospitality and cybersec (I'm only 22 but I've been paying taxes since I was 16 lmao)

And I still hate them

[quasi stream]

np big man

[alpine marsh]

Changed it up a bit with the skills

and removed the bubbles

[kindred vine]

hey
question regarding CV
how should i add the tools and capabilities i have
?
i think about either
listing subjects like
Network Monitoring: tool 1, tool 2 .etc

or i can add the tools as part of a line

Analyzing network traffic using Wireshark, Network Miner for example

[pseudo creek]

yes, as part of a line is how I like to do it

[broken idol]

With a little description?

[pseudo creek]

Basically the purpose and how you used it

[kindred vine]

like to add it as part of sentence

• Detecting Incidents and IOCs using SIEM (Splunk), IDS/IPS (Snort)

so i add the tools and capabilities in one line

[pseudo creek]

I still think saying "experienced" "competent" "proficient" are very subjective. Like someone who lists "experienced", I'd expect them to have years of professional experience

[kindred vine]

you have to start somewhere . . .

the exprience i have is from the course i took
and it is obvious in the CV
xD if they assume by the word experienced that i have years of experienced then well good luck for them

[pseudo creek]

why would you be doing that?

-ban 923413421075075105 -ddays 1 Asking to hack wifi for free wifi.

[serene umbra]

🔨 Banned StrumGewehr#4116 indefinitely

[pseudo creek]

Sea Lion, not helping

[kindred vine]

oopsy

is that agains the rules?

my bad i tought it is a joke

[pseudo creek]

nah, they also DM'd me to say they were up to no good

[kindred vine]

lol
not smart i must say

[lost storm]

dummies lol

[primal sedge]

Hey Folks,I'm Apoorv Gupta 3rd year Engineering student from India.
I am interested in cybersecurity (ethical hacking) from class 9th.
I have experience in linux,C/C++,Python,have good knowledge in DSA.
Don't know the guide or any path how to learn about cybersecurity in less time.

[narrow iron]

Hi everyone, does anyone here work in IT/IS Consulting? Curious about your day to day, career progression and pay scales. I've been offered a position at an IS consulting company but I've never even considered consulting until this came my way

[sterile crane]

Hi All, After some advice on the eJPT exam for the UK. Is this worth doing as an entry into Cyber? I have been learning on INE through their free eJPT sessions but noticed its all in dollars so wanted to make sure it will be recognised in the UK. Anyone have any experience with eJPT?

[narrow iron]

eJPT is good as a "I'm trying to get into cyber" cert, but the OSCP and eCPPT are more valuable if your dollars are strapped. Go on linkedin/indeed and look for local jobs and use certs as your keyword search, see what employers want around you

[sterile crane]

Thank you, that has helped a lot 🙂

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @narrow iron

[narrow iron]

https://pauljerimy.com/security-certification-roadmap/
This is also helpful

[sterile crane]

Oh wow now thats a lot of certs

[narrow iron]

lol you're not supposed to get them all 😄 Just to show the framework of different industries, and that pentesting is but a small portion of cyber as an industry

[sterile crane]

Yeah, i appreciate the help! Ive been doing THM since the advent event and loving it, so fancy a career change but no idea where to start haha

[primal sedge]

Please someone answer to my question also @narrow iron @sterile crane

[quick forum]

Start learning now instead of asking other people how to learn

[sterile crane]

I doubt there is any shortcut to learning Cyber, Like i say im fairly new myself. Ive been doing since Nov 19 and would still class myself as a beginner. Just jump on THM and follow the paths.

[quick forum]

And don't be impatient like this.

[primal sedge]

I ain't asking for the shortcut, but thanks for some suggestion, I will look on THM and follow the path from there.

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @sterile crane

[fiery badge]

holy mother of computers

[fiery badge]

what do want to do exactly bhai

[primal sedge]

I have coding experience, just want to know the basic rules. Ex: when you start playing chess, you ask for some rules.That's what I'm asking.

[quick forum]

Well, hacking and cybersec is not coding or programming

So that experience won't help as much as you might think

Just get started on THM

[primal sedge]

ok

[sterile crane]

Id go, Complete beginner, then to the Jr Pentesting paths on THM. Both are extremely good at getting you to grips with some of the tools used.

[primal sedge]

ok

[quick forum]

@narrow zinc This channel is aimed at careers in cyber security, please try #infosec-general

[warm hinge]

Hey there, so I 've been trying to land an entry-level cyber security job without any experience or degree. I am getting no luck and not even a single call back. I've added to my resume that I am top 2% on TryHackMe platform as one of my insights and projects i've achieved. I'm wondering If I add a couple certifications on my resume, will that get me a better chance of being hired or at least getting an interview?. Thank you in advance

[stoic cave]

You mind posting a redacted resume?

Preferably an embeded image here

I'm about to go to the store but I'll review it for you

[warm hinge]

Absolutely!

I've cropped and marked out a few personal info but here goes. Don't mind if you are stern in your feedback!

[flat sedge]

Professional Summary needs to be tailored to the role you are applying to, having a generic summary of very-much not professional experiences doesn't do you any favors.
2% on THM doesn't mean anything, I would not include it.
Skills shouldn't take up that much room. 1 or 2 lines at most.
You have more than 10 years of work experience, don't list items that don't contribute to your skillset relevant to this position. But don't leave a gap longer than 2 months, regardless.
The only things that count as Education are accredited programs. If it's not accredited, it doesn't usually have any value in the US.
Certifications should only be listed if you have them. If you don't hold the cert, don't list it. It may be OK to say that you are currently studying for one cert, but not more than that.
Hobbies should show outside interests and a diversity of interests not "I play security games on these platforms"

[warm hinge]

Yikes! I have a lot of make up to do. I will apply this towards my new resume though, It will be a bit hard adding any work experience that is related to cyber sec since i don't have any besides the basic security implementations I learned at Geek Squad for android, iOS, mac, and Windows systems, maybe i can add this?

Here is another resume i build as well, just has two jobs

I will implement what you told me on this last one and try to condense it more.

[flat sedge]

Find an entry level role you like; look at the job requirements and look at similar job reqs. Only pay for a cert if it's on a LOT of job reqs, as that will help open the door for you.
Don't get a cert without a plan for why you need it, and only pay for it yourself if it gets you the job.

The About Me is a wall of text. It should be easy to read, and you don't need to use first person. It's assumed to be about you, no need to specify "I"

Multilingual is only a professional skill if the job requires both English and Spanish (unlikely).

Career Oriented isn't a skill, don't list things that aren't actual skills. Being Tech "Savy" isn't a skill either.

You also left a 2 year gap since your last job, it's more important to show consistent employment.

[warm hinge]

I've noted all your point outs! I will fix my resume and remove words like "Tech Savy" and replace them with actual skills and words that pertain to something I can do

Appreciate your feedback!

[stoic cave]

I haven't read juun's critique, but I more than likely agree with whatever his suggestions were

Also sorry, the store took longer than expected

[warm hinge]

Hey absolute no worries 🙂 I completely agree with you as well.
I started to search what the most prevalent CERTS on Indeed were and saw that Security+, CySA+, CEH and CISSP were the most sought out.

This with either a Bachelors degree OR an equivalent combination of experience and training

[stoic cave]

Sounds about right

That posting requires military by the way

[warm hinge]

This one was only requiring diploma and some certs but also an active military

yep 🙂

So if i was an active member and had my Sec + and CySA+ i probably would of gotten that job. And relocated

[stoic cave]

North Carolina is actually pretty competitive

Fort Bragg is right there

And that's where JSOC is/does their cyber stuff

[warm hinge]

I've heard about them. Don't they have a cyber security team and training they do?

[stoic cave]

Who? JSOC?

They pull their cyber talent from all the branches

[warm hinge]

Nevermind im thinking something else

That's really interesting actually

[stoic cave]

Joint Special Operations Command

[warm hinge]

Man, that sounds elite

[stoic cave]

It is

[warm hinge]

That would be goals right there.

It's hard finding an entry level job at that

with no experience and degree. I think I should just go for my degree and score on an internship

I've already got like 4 credits than i dropped out, so now I have to pay out of pocket for 2 terms to be able to obtain financial aid again

My appeal was denied 😦

[stoic cave]

Maybe look at a different college? Idk

[warm hinge]

I was thinking that

Doing this online college

acreddited too

But than i'm also told on YouTube and other influencers on twitter that i follow that you don't need a degree

[stoic cave]

Degree can't hurt but I'm not sure how it works for later in life. @flat sedge is probably the better person to ask questions if you have any about that

[warm hinge]

all you need is a cert and some tryhackme experience

Thanks, i appreciated your feedback nonetheless

[stoic cave]

Calling bullshit on that lol

They're lying trying to sell you a course

[warm hinge]

I mean i understand. There is more than just having THM experience and some certs lol

[patent wyvern]

Is it possible to get an internship without any college?

[warm hinge]

That's a really great question

I'm going to attempt this next.

[pseudo creek]

In the US, it varies but I’ve seen people whose career has been held back by lack of degree

But where you get your degree matters less when you have experience

[warm hinge]

How would you go about gaining experience without having a degree?

What are your thoughts on cyber security bootcamps?

This one specifically https://bootcamp.uoregon.edu/cybersecurity/landing/?s=Google-Unbranded_RFull&pkw=%2Bcyber %2Bsecurity&pcrid=512902667736&pmt=b&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=GGL|UNIVERSITY-OF-Oregon|SEM|CYBER|-|OFL|_RFull_|ALL|NBD-G|BMM|Core|General&utm_term=%2Bcyber %2Bsecurity&s=google&k=%2Bcyber %2Bsecurity&utm_adgroupid=113190942433&utm_locationphysicalms=9032964&utm_matchtype=b&utm_network=g&utm_device=c&utm_content=512902667736&utm_placement=&gclid=Cj0KCQjwwJuVBhCAARIsAOPwGASp5VIMF3vMSPdSuxksMC5KQRA4ST4_zjyGt50pDJFAsDZ2JEVxDAEaAufBEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

[pseudo creek]

Scams…

Or should say money grabs

[warm hinge]

Not to insult you but what makes them scams?

besides all the money they want up front lol

I mean, do they teach you stuff you can learn on youtube and other places much cheaper?

[pseudo creek]

Every single cyber boot camp I’ve seen basically tells you what certs to get and provides some support to get those certs, which you can do for a fraction of the cost

[warm hinge]

Yooooo, this is so true lmaoooo

That's what the rep was basically telling me

[pseudo creek]

Like that one focuses on Comptia, look up professor messer and get network+ and security+

Also having 5 certs isn’t better than 2 when you have limited experience

[warm hinge]

Yes ! I told the rep I was already pretty much done with Security+ and Network + just haven't taken the exams, and she no longer knew what else to suggest me lol

[pseudo creek]

If you have no job experience at all, id focus on IT help desk and SOC analyst

[warm hinge]

This is what i'm trying to aim for. What I do at Geek Squad really isn't really cyber security related. SOC analyst jobs is what I've been looking at

This one is remote and it doesn't require a degree or cert!

Nevermind they also do require degree. Anyway seems like I need to redo my resume apply for my Sec+ and CySA+ since that's what i;ve been seeing predominantly for SOC analyst jobs and hopes that i get somewhere. Thanks peeps

[pseudo creek]

Also realize you will be competing against people that do have degrees but don’t let a degree requirement deter you from applying

[warm hinge]

I'm just gonna do all three even if i have to pay outta pocket for my 2 terms to get my financial aid again

I just want to do my dream job to be honest, which is to become a pentester

[dire nest]

What do you think about agency that write wrong techs or require too much in the JD?

[dull cypress]

How do you guys modify or polish your resume? Im thinking about have freelancer helping me. Idk if it's gonna work or not

[quasi stream]

Not all that improbable, although degrees do help you get your foot in. Cyber security is not a beginner field to work in, so any experience (especially IT-related) will be great

part-time (especially entry) cybersecurity roles are hard to come by - but they do exist. Be careful trying to balance your studies, performance at work and life - it is very tough. I'm doing the same right now, and I can tell you, I'd rather stick to one or the other.

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @quasi stream

[red coral]

Been trying to figure out role names when it comes to Cloud IT related stuff, especially for security, and it looks like the typical role name for security is Cloud Security Engineer, and it's role superior is Cloud Security Architect?

For anyone that might want to know the naming.

[stoic cave]

Internships, on the US, are generally reserved for those in higher education or high school.

[stoic cave]

Post a redacted copy here. Don't pay anyone.

[warm hinge]

Besides the eJPT, are the other INE certs worth pursuing?

[quick forum]

Now that they're changing their pricing structure, I'd steer clear of eJPT too

[warm hinge]

Would you recommend just studying for OSCP then?

[stoic cave]

Yes, it's the entry level pentest cert

Practicals is gud

[peak hazel]

Yes, it does feel like INE are in it for the money. Dont believe me and fancy a laugh:https://community.ine.com/ - check out their forums and complaints about their servise is a contant. There are definitely more affordable and better optionss like PNPT, Security + HTB Dante labs and not forgetting OSCP.

There is also virtualhacking labs which is decent and affordable.

[nimble crow]

Yeah, I'm currently taking the eJPT because it was something to do between PenTest+ and getting money for my OSCP, and the training is pretty useless.

Bunch of labs just disappeared from the training as well.

I think they're trying to update the curriculum or something, but it's rolling out in the sloppiest way imaginable.

[high jasper]

Newbie here ... I have some questions I'm hoping to get cleared up

[high jasper]

I'm in the midst of a university cybersecurity degree program, in which many of the classes end in real-world certs ... I've been getting tripped up on PenTest+, because I don't know the coding that well for different types of attacks (injections, directory traversal, etc.) ... does anyone know where I can go to get this figured out?

[peak hazel]

#programming would a good place to start and all THM have osme courses too.

[high jasper]

I'm this close to passing it because I get the conceptual stuff just fine, but trying to read the single lines of code and tell which does what is slicing and dicing me

I'm looking thru the THM stuff ... any clue as to which rooms I should go to? I've been looking in the PenTest+ room, but so far, it hasn't helped much ... perhaps I just need to do more

[nimble crow]

@high jasper Is it the Linux stuff specifically that's tripping you up?

[high jasper]

@nimble crow no, it's the coding in Ruby/Python/Bash/PowerShell ... in one scenario on the exam, they'll give you about a dozen individual lines of code, and you have to match up with what exploit the line of code is for, as well as the remediation ... yet absolutely none of the materials that I have read through contain any of this information.

[nimble crow]

Yeah, I remember the one.

[high jasper]

The materials tell you about the exploit, but they don't give you an actual example of the code for that exploit

[nimble crow]

The thing is, it's not really teaching you to code or expecting you to know what the code does, it's just seeing if you recognize certain conventions for each of those different languages as a basis on where to look further to actually understand them.

Like knowing a Toyota from a Chevy on sight so you know what parts to look for.

So it's sorta hard to teach, and it'd be overkill to learn each of those just for the exam (although they are all generally useful).

[high jasper]

but the scenario doesn't ask what language it's in ... it asks what the code does ... but since it all looks similarly unfamiliar to me, I have no idea

[nimble crow]

Yeah, no, I get it. One sec.

[high jasper]

thing is, I have a software background, just not in scripting languages ...

[nimble crow]

I had a chart somewhere that had the same basic block of code in each of the four different languages to show the little things to look for in differentiating them.

[high jasper]

so this stuff being what's tripping me up is extra frustrating

[nimble crow]

Lol, then we're speaking the same language. I just graduated with my BS in CS, and found cybersec in my senior year.

Java? C++? No problem. Bash? wtf is that?

Lol.

[high jasper]

kind of, yeah

give me 10,000 lines of COBOL and I'll find the missing period that's causing the program to fail

[nimble crow]

But it's basically asking you for something similar to that. Like if you had hello world in Java, C++, and say python, could you identify which is which?

[high jasper]

give me one line of a script and I'm like "huh?"

[nimble crow]

Damn, that's old school then.

[high jasper]

lol

[nimble crow]

I mean, honestly? I just got through because I knew anything super foreign to me was powershell, stuff that looked like actual code was ruby, python just always looks like python, and bash I was loosely familiar with.

[high jasper]

unfortunately, I'm not all that familiar with any of them

[nimble crow]

But like maybe tackling the intro course on each through CodeAcademy to get a feel for them.

[high jasper]

"CodeAcademy"? is that a site?

[nimble crow]

Yeah, one of a handful that have information on various coding langauges.

[high jasper]

interesting

[nimble crow]

codeacademy, w3schools

uh

Shoot, there's one more I'm forgetting.

LinkedIn Learning if you're on there.

[high jasper]

I'll look for those ... thanks

[worthy shoal]

freecodecamp is decent as well if you want something, you know, free

[high jasper]

free is good

[quick forum]

You can usually get the idea of an exploit even if you don't know the language

[high jasper]

a lot of them look incredibly similar, so it is difficult for me to tell the difference

[quick forum]

That's good, because it rarely matters

[stoic cave]

What James said is largely correct. In your case, you're not going to be able to learn all of those languages at once, so choose one to focus on. Preferably one with common constructs, like C++. Also, look up pseudo code exercises to get you thinking on the right track.

[tacit bobcat]

Assuming it's coded in a reasonably sane manner

[molten geyser]

Hey, secondary student here(uk/ Irish highschool) I am about to do not so well in my overall exams and might not be able to make it into general entry computer science in college

However there’s an alternative degree called computer science infastructure that seems to focus more on networks then theory, the course has listed that It’d be good for going down the software engineer/ it security route which is ideal for me.

Would I be at a massive disadvantage to general entry comp sci in doing this degree?

I have an alternative route where I can do a two year course and go straight into year two of computer science from there, but I’m not sure what my best options are

[nimble crow]

@molten geyser Kinda depends if you wanna go into development or IT. As someone who just graduated with a degree in comp sci, it is a notably different skillset to IT.

[molten geyser]

Not entirely certain which way I’d like to go with it I’m afraid

Thanks for the insight

[austere drum]

And what is the difference between CS and IT or Informatics lets say?

[nimble crow]

Ok, so I can only actually speak from the academic CS position, but basically with CS you're gonna learn a shitload of math and theory. Lots of algorithmic stuff, lots of exposure to programming languages, and being able to demonstrate understanding of various data structures. Stuff to make a program run smoothly, but shockingly little about what environment that thing you built is going to have to interact with in the real world.

Remarkably little scripting, extremely little beyond theory on how to secure a system, and very little that's platform specific.

[peak hazel]

This might help to https://cs.stackexchange.com/questions/81408/whats-the-difference-between-computer-science-and-informatics

[austere drum]

Υeah, look like the same to me. In fact my BSc is named 'Informatics' and we do what you describe. Also the rankings include even electrical engineering in Computer Science.

[primal heath]

Guys I am thinking to go for OSCE3, I have mostly experience on cloud and DevOps and pen-testing. What you think about this decision, how should I prepare for this and which path should I choose for this?

[leaden yew]

Hello. If I want to take Azure, Comptia, Network and OSCP certifications, how to pick a specific one and how to determine if I need to follow a training?

[peak hazel]

I am not sure how to guide .... Hower conside Networkring and OSCP as your basics. Why because any Cloud environ (AWS, AZure or GCP) is hosted on network envornment. So while getting your OSCP - add Azure 900: Azure Fundamentals to your list. This way you have the Networking side covered (OSCP) and your Azure (AZ-900) covered. You can decide which pathway best suits you.

[round lance]

Hello, I’m looking for some advice on a career change into cyber. Bit of a background, BSc Software, MSc Security, PhD Software, I think acceptable understanding of computer architecture, OS, networks (to CCNA Level), and a bit of programming. Got exposed to basics of hacking during my MSc, but eventually ended up as a software consultant (Manager Level) in the top 10 tax firm, based in London UK. Pay is very good, but I hate my current job. Been thinking about switching to actual tech job, but I’m a noob in every aspect, success in the labs doesn’t mean I know my way around in the real world.
Is there anyone who walked this path and could help me find a way to switch without taking a huge hit to my salary? With a kid and a mortgage, so can’t compromise much on that end unfortunately.

[shell kestrel]

Hey guys, i wanna ask something but sorry if my english is bad.. Currently i’m preparing for cybersecurity role internship. What kind of projects should i do to make my portfolio standout? Is there any advice?

[small roost]

make a youtube channel and create content on cybersecurity and participate in bug bounty programs idk

[stoic cave]

Are you in school? What kind of program?

[shell kestrel]

Yes, i’m currently pursuing bachelor degree in cs

*computer science

[stoic cave]

For internships, the general expectation is that you have an understanding of the basics, ie material from Security+. Having coursework you can relate to the topic is also great. A Homelab is another way that you can show your interest and learn a bit too. I also wouldn't pigeonhole yourself either to just cybersecurity internships. The internship I got was in IT and I still was able to get a job in security after school.

[peak hazel]

Are you looking for Summer Interships: https://gb.bebee.com/job/20220612-78d0207c9cca818ec79de69a26335fc3?utm_campaign=google_jobs_apply&utm_source=google_jobs_apply&utm_medium=organic

[shell kestrel]

Thank you for the advice 😊

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @stoic cave

[cursive halo]

Any tips for jobs outside of highschool?

Most applications are either refused, or ignored after viewed

[stoic cave]

Do you have some more information? What are you applying for, previous professional experience, etc

[cursive halo]

Yeah that's the issue. I don't have any previous employment experience, and since the area where I live is very rural, I don't really have any applicable skills

[coarse geyser]

It very much depends on the country, I would suggest looking for organisations that get people in/right after hs in the high-tech world.

[stoic cave]

Ok, what are you applying for?

[peak hazel]

Useful advice from Reddit to college student: https://www.reddit.com/r/AskNetsec/comments/vat2j1/professional_advice_needed/

[warm hinge]

Quick question how would i go about getting into a cyber security job?? Are there any entry level jobs or are internships a good place to start?? And is it okay to not know certain things and to jump into one of those roles??

[quick forum]

There are entry level jobs, trainee programs, and internships.
Cyber tends not to be an entry level field, you often need some IT experience first.
There are definitely jobs out there for going straight into cyber, my first full time job is pentest and I'm straight out of university

[unborn compass]

What did you study?

CompSci and then a Cybersecurity Master degree?

[warm hinge]

Where is a good app or webiste to find these jobs or trainee programs? I have been looking on indeed and linked in by am not seeing any “beginner” slots to fit into per say . They seem to say remote or in a different state. I am willing to relocate, but i would want to know all about it before i make any big decisions

[quick forum]

Cyber Security Batchelors. I got the job before I graduated

[warm hinge]

Im studying cyber security and computer science bachelors

[flat sedge]

Honestly, comp sci will do a much better job of preparing you for a wide variety of careers. Most cyber programs are still very new and don't do a very good job of preparing undergrads for the huge variety of cyber roles. CS does have a lot of theory, and that theory is applicable to the entirety of the IT space.

Unless you have a very definite career path that you are on and workign towards progressing, CompSci will be much better 'value' than cybersec.

James is a rarity, don't take his career path to be the 'standard' way to go about getting into a cybersecurity role.

[unborn compass]

That's what I heard... I have already chosen my studies (I just finished high-school) but I was asking out of pure curiosity.

[stoic cave]

I think i got "lucky" too

[quick forum]

There's more and more trainee and genuine entry roles though

Like Tux posted a trainee scheme, I got in as a trainee technically, I know several others

[unborn compass]

Is pentesting an entry job for cybersecurity?

[quick forum]

It sounds like they're stateside though, so the advice on degree is probably very applicable

[unborn compass]

If so what are the roles that require more experience?

[quick forum]

Typically no.

[flat sedge]

There are still very few out there - the number is growing, but that's primarily because the workfoce doesn't have a ready supply of qualified candidates for the traditional roles.
It's not a bad thing, just a thing that needs to be taken into consideration when exploring career options

[flat sedge]

Compliance, pentest, vuln management & assessment, security tool configuration, security architecture off the top of my head. I'm sure there are more

[quick forum]

Vulnerability Research is a cool one

[unborn compass]

Thank you! I have no clue about what some of these roles are, imma duckduckgo it

[quick forum]

@grand trellis Here's the interview questions.
Sorry, I got sidetracked with food

[grand trellis]

Thanks!

[old perch]

hello!

[warm hinge]

Shoot! Sorry about bananaisu I found my answer to my question

This is extremely valueable and so glad i stumbled upon it. thank you for this

[glass zinc]

Hey, can anyone comment on the average Jr. Penetration Tester yearly salary in their country? The websites usually have outdated or incorrect info and I prefer to hear it from someone that says they're in the industry already.

I'm a Unity Dev with a salary of $60k/yr and I hope to transition to a red team jr by the end of next year. I don't know if it's realistic to expect to at least keep my salary

[glass zinc]

Croatia, but I might give US jobs a shot (even if they do seem hesitant to hire overseas)

[stoic cave]

There are many layers in trying to work for a US company. These include work sponsorships, how your taxes are going to be handled, etc. Your country may also have rules on working for US companies as well, such as requiring an office to be in the country.

[clear drift]

Heya! Is there a role in cyber security that can have night shifts?

Ooor very flexy time?

[stoic cave]

SOC work is generally done in shifts

[slim oracle]

do you think I could easily find a help desk job if I move to Toronto ?

yea it's a random question but I want to move out of my country so bad

[stoic cave]

Previous message I've posted before: Do you have a sponsor/visa? I'm not from Canada but they have a pretty rigorous immigration process. For instance, in order to immigrate, you need to have someone financially sponsor for your first 7 years in the country. Meaning if you stop paying things, they are responsible for you.

You need to go talk to the Canadian Consulate wherever you are

[slim oracle]

are you sure about that

I’ve lived in Canada for a year and I’m french, I was never sponsored

anyway I want to know if it’s hard to find a job in Toronto, specifically for an entry job in IT such as help desk, without a degree but with experience as a help desk

[quick forum]

A lot of office jobs have relatively flexible hours, from my searching

[cursive tree]

What's up guys. So recently I got into the cyber security stuff and I come from a programming background. I have seen websites for learning cyber security like hackthebox and tryhackme. Could anyone tell me what I should be doing or what courses I should be following on THM? Penetration testing seems most interesting to me so far, and I would like to land a job related to it relatively soon.

I've heard that I should be doing certificates like eJPT, but is that enough to get me a job or internship or should I do something else too?

[quick forum]

The advice varies a little bit country to country, but certifications can be helpful in getting you an interview.
The problem is that security doesn't tend to he entry level in terms of entry to the workplace, and pentesting doesn't tend to be entry level in term of entry to security. That's not to say neither are possible, just that it can be really difficult. There's a good amount of trainee and internship programs, the industry is really really hurting for talent at the moment

[cursive tree]

Hmm ok, well what do you think I should start to look at learning now? Pen testing is just what I'm thinking to lean towards but, what do you think would be a good way to get into the industry as a beginner?

[quick forum]

I'd certainly focus on the fundamentals to start, get your IT and networking knowledge solid. Good pentesters build on those skills. For me, hacking is all about understanding how something works and using that understanding to exploit the difference between how it should work and how it actually does

If you're looking to do web application pentesting, I'd recommend learning some web development so you can better understand how everything fits together.

[cursive tree]

Sounds like a plan. What paths would you say are the best for this on THM? I'm currently doing the complete beginner one and don't know what I should start doing afterwards

[quick forum]

Complete beginner is deprecated, I'd recommend starting with pre security

[cursive tree]

Ok

The thing is that I don't want to miss on some things. Does pre security cover pretty much everything that complete beginner does?

[bronze wind]

kind of but you can do it all if you want

i do jr pentester after pre security

[quick forum]

You do need to support THM with independent reading IMO.
If you like background noise while you're doing other stuff, I used to watch Defcon talks while doing homework etc back along. Even if you don't understand, I found it really cool to hear more about the topic

THM was really good for me converting my standard IT knowledge into pentest knowledge. It's got a lot better at that standard IT knowledge but I'd say you definitely need to supplement it.

[cursive tree]

Where do you find things to read about this btw?

Do you go on YouTube or just find articles on Google?

[quick forum]

There's so much content out there on the internet, the main issue is filtering good from bad

Learning to google effectively is absolutely the best skill you can get for this industry

[cursive tree]

Yeah that's true lol

But I'm just curious what you look for

Cuz tbh I'm at this point that I don't know what there is and I have no clue what I should look for lol

[quick forum]

Use THM at a starting point, and work on a topic until you're comfortable (or come back to it later to get more comfortable with it)

Say you hit the OSI Model room, work through it and then learn a little more. Watch some YouTube on it or something

[cursive tree]

Hmm that's actually a good idea

[quick forum]

Channels on YouTube like Computerphile, LiveOverflow, John Hammond, and more have really good educational content

LiveOverflow has a really nice Minecraft hacking series running at the moment, it's super interesting to see the process and logic even if you don't understand the technical side yet

[cursive tree]

Damn ok I'll look more into this

Cheers a lot bro

[quick forum]

Please don't call me bro, but you're welcome

[cursive tree]

Oh sorry

Thanks a lot nevertheless

[remote gale]

+1

@cursive tree start with pre-security

And start making notes of rooma

[quick forum]

You can carry on through complete beginner, there's some good content on there. The issue is that some of it doesn't work as well as it should

[remote gale]

It will help u brainstorm topics u learnt

[cursive tree]

Alright I'll maybe make the switch. From what I've seen they are pretty much the same but complete beginner is just longer

[remote gale]

Does LFI still prevalent today?

[quick forum]

Yes

I don't see how that's particularly relevant to the discussion though.

[remote gale]

I just wanted to ask

[remote gale]

Well Pre security really helps u develop your base skills

[quick forum]

#infosec-general would be the best place for questions that aren't careers related

[remote gale]

I see sorry

[stoic cave]

No, I'm not. As I said I don't live there, but it's what I was told by someone trying to gain citizenship. When you were there, were you there as a student or just visiting? Countries generally require different levels of visas for each.

[stoic cave]

Personally, I don't see this happening due to you not living in Canada currently.

[clear drift]

Thank you @stoic cave @quick forum

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @stoic cave

[slim oracle]

I was a student and then I worked, I could even apply for permanent residency but it was in 2020 so with the pandemic the situation was uncertain I preferred to go back home

[slim oracle]

lol that has nothing to do with my question I’m not asking if you could see me living in Canada I’m asking if it would be easy to find a job as a help desk if I lived there

I’m sure you can use your imagination to picture that I live in Toronto, now tell me if you think I could find a job as a help desk

[narrow iron]

I live in TO. Help desk has a ton of jobs available, but it’s competitive to get in, even with the “Comptia trifecta” as a baseline.

You’d have better luck applying to smaller companies in the GTA, as the heart of Toronto is extremely competitive, esp with UofT grads getting co op positions at most of the good spots downtown

[slim oracle]

I see thank you. I didn’t expect uoft grads to work as help desks lol

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @narrow iron

[narrow iron]

My friend, infosec/IT is so scuffed in Canada lol

[vital laurel]

What is UOFT?

[narrow iron]

University of Toronto

One of Canada’s more prestigious universities

@slim oracle I will say though you may have a tough time starting out due to immigration racism. When I was in school alot of my program were international students, and a lot of them were turned away from jobs while the naturalized Canadians had no issues getting coops

May have just been a run of bad luck, but I didn’t like the look of it

[slim oracle]

thank you @narrow iron that helps me in my decisions

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @narrow iron

[slim oracle]

you see I didn’t even know that IT was scuffed in Canada

[narrow iron]

I obv don’t know your personal situation, but I’d try to get work in the US if it’s an option for you. While there is good money to be made in Canada, breaking past that initial experience hurdle is much more difficult here

Also a majority of the companies here that people want to work at are American companies 😂 so why not skip the middle man

I also don’t want to sound like the sky is falling though. If you have a degree and some certs, you will get hired somewhere and then you’d need to build from there

[slim oracle]

yeah of course I would rather work directly in the US but it's more complicated for a European unfortunately

thanks for your input @narrow iron

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @narrow iron

[tacit bobcat]

There's Waterloo next door as well

[narrow iron]

Thankfully/unthankfully my only two friends that were in Waterloo comp sci went straight to apple after graduating in the states

[tacit bobcat]

Fair enough

I was at Waterloo in ECE so...

[vital laurel]

I like McMaster

[cunning spruce]

Hey everyone would it be ok to post my resume here for some feedback?

[broken idol]

I'm sure it will, just redact all personal stuff and someone will get to it eventually.

[cunning spruce]

Thanks @broken idol Would appreciate feedback from anyone

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @broken idol

[cunning spruce]

It's a bit on the incomplete side at the moment as the Skills section needs to be fleshed out im just having a hard time crystalizing what I would consider safe to mention at a job. I am not sure how much i can use from say homelabbing or personal tinkering

[broken idol]

I have put that sort of stuff as a hobby in mine. It's not really things I've been taught by anyone, more what I do on my own time.

I don't know if anyone will agree with me, or they do the opposite.

[cunning spruce]

It's something that i feel worried about but I think i'll take the chance and include it

I just worry if they see a big discrepancy between the job desc and skills it might make them thinki m lying

[merry matrix]

I'm no authority on the topic, but my rule of thumb for the skills is whether or not I can speak to my experience on it for a reasonable amount of time. For example, I can speak to experience with Microsoft Azure because I set up a whole CTF environment using it for a local event, so I include it along with mention of that project on my resume.
On the other hand, while I can read and change a Powershell script from knowing programming fundamentals, I can't really speak to any significant experience with it, nor am I fully comfortable with using the syntax on my own (meaning I frequently have to look up how to do what I want in the language), so I don't have it listed as a skill for myself.

Gotta strike that middle ground between overselling and underselling yourself

[flat sedge]

As @merry matrix said, if you aren't willing to spend at least 20 minutes talking off the cuff about a topic in an interview, don't put it on your resume. Few things are as awkward as "Well, we like what you've said so far, tell us about what you like about X topic from your resume" and end up having to go with "I don't know anything, I'm just interested in it"

That's pretty unacceptable as far as interview answers go, given how free information is

[small roost]

what if you don't have experience in tech besides self learning and come from a different line of work?

[peak hazel]

Are you up for the Challenge: https://www.mitnicksecurity.com/join-the-team

[merry matrix]

There's nothing stopping you from working on a few personal projects to showcase your technical ability. I think one of the most frequent things I see in these infosec servers from new people is that they just say "I do TryHackMe, HTB, and The Cyber Mentor courses" and they just expect to have it just with that.

Those things are cool, but definitely not the end all be all, especially as these platforms grow.

[flat sedge]

Find applicable skills in your earlier jobs or career. While I don't list them any more, some of the foundational security skills I learned from working for a commercial general contractor, a steel erector, as a call center CSR, and as a pizza delivery driver.
Work planning, customer service, and task prioritization are all extremely relevant skills I learned from that those environments.

[narrow iron]

It appears my workplace is willing to cover any MS cert for 100% of the fees. Are there any that immediately stand out for me to take?

[peak hazel]

I saw this posted elsewhere: Pester Intern @ Bishop: https://cybersecjobs.io/jobs/penetration-test-intern-direct-supply

[stoic cave]

If you're looking to hire, I suggest going through @tacit bobcat as they can give you the recruiter role.

[cobalt escarp]

Hey @wooden tiger please don’t post jobs with sketchy URLs unless you have the recruiter roles

[wooden tiger]

Oh, sorry.

[jolly gyro]

How do I follow up to see if I got the job or not? I had my final interview 2 weeks ago and have an offer from another company. I would like to compare and pick the best one. But fear time is not on my side

[tawdry jetty]

I'm not entirely sure, but I wish you luck and all the best!

[peak hazel]

If you applied for the role via a 3rd party like a recruitment agency 0 you should be able chase them up any time. However if directly you could always drop them a friendly email thanking them for the interview and expressing your interest in the role but drop in that you got another offer - but they are preffered choice. I have done this twice and they appriecate the heads-up . All the Best!

[worn spire]

https://www.indeed.com/viewjob?t=cyber+security+curriculum+engineer&jk=027f9ae7a67e6e7f&_ga=2.16108598.1824116211.1655835353-1029001450.1647652923

[peak hazel]

This looks interesting! Thank you Gek,

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @worn spire

[jolly gyro]

Thanks for the advice!

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @peak hazel

[tacit bobcat]

confirmed the role, should be alright now 🙂

[wooden tiger]

Alright, let's try that again 🙂

[tacit bobcat]

use the #jobs-board, it'll get more visibility for longer

[cunning spruce]

@flat sedge Thanks for the advice. I do feel comfortable talking about those topics even if I haven't had work experience. I'll add those going on out

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @flat sedge

[stark wolf]

generally speaking, why is CEH so hated on?

[undone shore]

1. by all accounts, the content is old, outdated, and occasionally outright incorrect
2. it's a ridiculous price for what it gives you
3. EC-Council are a morally bankrupt organisation

From memory the exam itself is a meme as well, but don't quote me on that one.

[quick forum]

It's multiple choice unless you buy CEH Practical

[undone shore]

Well, there we go then

[quick forum]

Plus the deep discounts they offer for some orgs basically invalidate their pricing

I could get it down to like £100-200

With training materials

[undone shore]

$1200 non-discounted for crap training materials and a multiple-choice exam, which doesn't have any HR benefits outside of India or a few backwards US orgs.

Certs can have training benefits, and/or HR benefits. CEH has neither.

[olive oyster]

My interviewer said the exact same thing and asked me to skip this and head straight for OSCP

[paper lily]

you would hope

[soft epoch]

anyone have any example resumes for working in IT? I've noticed that the "colorful resume" creators are actually not helping me in getting a job

[hollow fossil]

So, I got an internship offer but the company is about an hour away from my house. What's the best way to say "id like to work with you but i would like to wait for other offers"?

Or could I ask for a grace period?

[glass zinc]

When are you expecting these new offers? In the next few days or a bit later?

If it's going to be a while before you receive a new offer, I'd just take the job now and quit when a better one shows up.

Also, it's an internship, so it's probably under 6 months. You can take that time to look for jr. positions in closer locations

[hollow fossil]

Judging by the number of applicants, probably a lot longer than a few days.

Also, you can quit an on-going internship? Won't that taint me in some way?

Lot of juniors positions expecting at least 1 or 2 years so that's a bummer for me 😦

[jade dune]

anyone here work in cybersec field in aus?

[glass zinc]

Depends on your contract. Most likely you have to work up to 5 days once you give notice.

Now, about being tainted.. I don't think anyone really cares. You're bound to get that question on interviews here and there, but you should be fine.

If I was in your shoes, I'd take the job straightaway. If a better one comes along, then you worry about quitting or holding your current job

[spare kernel]

Check profiles on LinkedIn. People sometimes have their resumes on there

[hollow fossil]

Sounds good thanks. It being a bit far is a turn off though. Hopefully I can persuade them into letting me go remote or hybrid.

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @glass zinc

[warm hinge]

I am planning to go for CEH but confused that whether i should go for CEH theory or Practical?

and i am also planning to go for eJPT so which CEH cert would be better ?

[broken idol]

Where do you live?

[warm hinge]

India

[broken idol]

I've seen on here that the CEH Theory is a multiple exam. Practical sounds more hands on.

If you search on this server for CEH you'll get hundreds of answers on this.

[warm hinge]

i just want a CEH certification which can compliment eJPT.

[broken idol]

From my understanding though, CEH isn't as good as it was.

[pliant yacht]

Till date , i don't think i have ever heard a positive thing about CEH

[warm hinge]

I know but here in India most of the companies set CEH as a prerequisite for Jobs.

that's the min. requirement to get shortlisted

[hot marten]

I've done CEHv11 theory because my ex-company paid for it. It was my official introduction to "hacking". It was not too hard, but I have to say it feels like such a scam. The exam site and everything around it is so bad and buggy. The materials lack depth and are copy&pasted web content. I plan to do the practical to be able to call myself "CEH master" and because it is so cheap if you already have the theory. I would not do it if it wasn't that cheap.

The mail they send you after you pass the theroy. Reads like a phish 😄

[rugged delta]

Yeah the CEH these days has certainly been shown to be less thanpractical when it comes to being an ethical hacker. Depending where you're based, it has limited utility these days. OSCP is certainly the better option or the SANS GPEN (if you can find someone to fund it)

[stoic cave]

In the US, 3-7 days is the typical time frame for a response to an offer. An hour commute isn't that bad either.

[stoic cave]

You probably wouldn't be able to put it on your resume. I wouldn't quit unless there was an extremely good reason, ie they're abusive or family emergency.

[hollow fossil]

True, it's just that I have 2-3 companies that I'm interested in getting a response from.

[hollow fossil]

I'd figure.

[stoic cave]

There's interest in getting an offer and actually getting an offer

One is tangible

[fringe rivet]

Is OSED worth it carreerwise?

I tried asking in the offsec server but got ignored

[peak hazel]

The recruited contacted my friend who is a Pentester with 3 years experience FOR .... A junior Pentester role where the candidate must atleast 5 years experience OSCP, OSEP and LPT. How is all that's good is that a junior role ?🤣

[rugged delta]

If you're going to be doing exploit development or other related jobs, that's what it's geared towards

[nimble crow]

Don't get me started.

[rugged delta]

It's bad enough that recruiters are asking for CISSP for entry level positions but if a person has an OSCP, they're going to be able to start a junior pentester role and be learning intensively. If the have the OSEP they're pretty advanced and have probably proven their capabilities in a team already and are looking for more responsibility and money. I don't know anyone who has the LPT but there are plenty of other advanced certs a Junior Penetration Tester wouldn't be able to pass.

If the salary's less than $150k they're only taking the piss and even at that, they're taking the piss

[fringe rivet]

Welp ED is interesting imo but I've always wanted a software development job

[rugged delta]

Pretty soon all jobs will be software development jobs 🙂

[nimble crow]

Until the Butlerian Jihad, anyway.

[fringe rivet]

What do you mean? Do you think everyone will be using (secure) frameworks in the future?

[nimble crow]

Probably more along the lines that all work is ultimately gonna run on code at some point in the future.

[pseudo creek]

it has a pretty narrow scope in the cyber world, but so do most OffSec certs. OSCP can carry weight beyond pentesting, the others, not really

[static tide]

in the uk at least, i've only ever seen OSCP required, never any of the other ones - i don't know if i've ever seen the others tbh (only oswe and osep like once or twice)

so here they're obviously very good for knowledge, but past a certain point (oscp), it's crest/cyberscheme that get you the careers, not offsec

[peak hazel]

Very true! My friend's based in Dublin so I don't know much things are diffrent there.

[rugged delta]

Dublin is the European HQ for MS, Google, Bookface, Red Hat, Fireeye, Tenable, IBM and loads of other IT and cybersec-dependent companies and financial institutions. According to a friend of mine in the business there's currently about 90 OSCP holders in Dublin

A lot of people here are cybersec BSc or HDip graduates but there are hundreds of cybersec people here with all levels of skills from all over the world

[worldly shore]

Just got the good news I’ll be starting my first cybersecurity job either July 18 or August 1 as a Security Analyst on my current company’s SOC team! I’ve been here for ~5 years on the claims side (huge old US insurance company) as a claims adjuster and FINALLY all the pushing and poking paid off! No degree or work history in IT but it took close to 3 years of essentially non stop learning and asking “what can I do to get on this team….ok what next” 😂 THM gets like 90% of the credit cuz sharing every room directly to LinkedIn even had the CISO impressed. Thank you for a great tool 🙏🏾

[pliant yacht]

If anyone have any remote cyber -security red team intership role available , Please let me know .

Time period : 1-2 months preferred.
I can pass my LinkedIn profile or resume if anyone want to take a look at it .

I am ok if the intership would be unpaid but paid one would be better :D

[peak hazel]

Did you miss this: https://www.upskillcyber.co.uk/

[pliant yacht]

UK Nationals or have resided in the UK for the last 3 years
:(

[pliant yacht]

I am based in India just to make it clear .
I am interested in any Indian companies or any other company who accepts foreign interns .

[peak hazel]

It would have been a good opportunity. Try large companies I know Vodafone has interships at some point - not sure if open.

[glass zinc]

Anyone have tips for switching careers? I'm a SE right now (5 years of exp), and looking to get into CS. Realistically, highest I can get is a junior position when starting out (maybe even Intern), and the pay cut will be huge in my country (probably 70%). I don't know if anyone went through something similar

[pseudo creek]

Look into app security, it shouldn’t be a pay cut

[glass zinc]

You think it's a good enough starting point for a smoother transition into pentesting?

[pseudo creek]

Yeah definitely

[nocturne hornet]

I'm in the same boat, but with more years of experience in software dev. What is app security?

[pseudo creek]

I would look it up... some pentesting especially in europe includes app security, in the US, it is usually its own thing

[proper mesa]

same - I finished a bootcamp and updated my resume, applied to several dozens of jr level pentester jobs, nobody even wanted to talk to me 🥲

[faint ice]

could be your personal letter and cv is not good enough to get to manual review

[proper mesa]

true - but my bootcamp provided service to polish up my resume and linkedin profile, which i went thru, and still not even one interview in months (a lot asking for my SE exp tho 🙃 )

[quick forum]

It also varies where you are, different countries look for different things

[faint ice]

CV:s in sweden == 1 a4 page maximum

[quick forum]

That's relatively standard

[faint ice]

heard a lot of people from other countries whos cvs are multiple a4 pages ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[nimble crow]

Not if you want to get it read.

[nimble crow]

Webapp stuff would give you a serious edge if you have that experience. So much of CS you hear about it network stuff, but everything is a webapp these days.

Likewise, if your background is embedded, you have a huge edge on IoT security. It's just a matter of being able to demonstrate incorporating cybersecurity principles into whatever work you already know.

[low moss]

Hi guys! i've been reading the chat, and out of curiousity, what certification do you need to land a job in CS?

[austere fractal]

Have you checked the pinned messages?
Zojja wrote 2 pretty decent posts about certs

[low moss]

hey thanks for replying, i haven't, ill have a look 🙂

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @austere fractal

[low moss]

hey @austere fractal i got a question, im kinda new in the field and i was wondering how things move around here. i just read the pinned messages about the certs. The question is, with a Security+ you can land a job? i suppose its not just getting a cert, you gotta get hours in the subject, and really learn your field, but in europe enterprises just hire with a cert? do you need a bachelor's degree?

like the main question is, do you need higher degree studies to land a job, or can you just know your field and with a cert land a job?

[austere fractal]

There are probably other people that can give you a more reliable answer.
But considering the demand, I'm pretty sure there is no need for any higher degree, so yes, having a valuable cert and being familiar with what you do, you can certainly get a job.

[low moss]

dope! thanks bro, that was what i was looking for

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @austere fractal

[worthy shoal]

Yeah, degrees are not needed in many countries but they can help quite a lot

[low moss]

Is that i dont really want to get a degree... i like to study the things i like and i get bored with other subjects, so tryhackme + some certs looks like a promising plan i suppose 🙂

[worthy shoal]

It is a plan can certainly work, at least I hope so as it is kinda my plan as well lol

[low moss]

lol, sounds like "mom im quitting my job to become an influencer"

jajajajajajajajajaa

na, i work atm

[flat sedge]

DevOps security is HUGE right now, as a SE you have an advantage to learning the why part of static and dynamic code analysis as part of the pipeline. Being able to explain to the team why the huge list of stuff isn't 100% false-positive is huge.

[flat sedge]

No one cert will get you a job, neither will a degree. What will get you a job is having the right attitude and a demonstration of your skillset. What a degree does do, is that it shortcuts your promotion path often by several years. In my area, an entry level dev or sysadmin with a bootcamp or entry level certs makes somewhere in the $40-60k range. With my BS in CompSci, I started at $70k. So ask yourself where your value is, and where you want your career to go.
Look at the local job listings and see what's listed for entry level roles and target your learning for those skillsets.

Also realize that without a degree or accreditations, it lowers your starting salary substantially.

[low moss]

Hey Junn, thanks for responding 🙂 regarding bootcamps, are they recommened?

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @flat sedge

[peak hazel]

Came across this for formatting CV:https://github.com/stephensemmelroth/ResumeTemplate

[spring marsh]

Can anyone help me with some entry level job titles for cyber security field?

[quick forum]

SoC analyst

NGL

[simple vine]

does anyone in here currently work in threat detection?

[stoic cave]

I'd just ask the question if you have one

[hollow fossil]

How would you describe THM and HTB in an interview? Had this question in an interview. I just explained that it's a bunch of virtual machines hosted on a network and we use a VPN to connect to the network, from there we use cyber security skills and tools to perform penetration testing on it to gain "flags".

ofc i asked first if they knew about virtual machines and stuff just incase they're not quite catching me.

[nimble crow]

At this point, I'd just describe THM as a learning platform with numerous learning paths for various levels of familiarity with cybersecurity and IT skill from the beginner to the intermediate-advanced, and then focus on specifically which skills you feel it has taught you to the point that you're confident enough to use them for work.

Like a lot of it is CTF focused, but there are walkthroughs and other stuff as well, and CTFs can be written off as unrealistic.

[uneven igloo]

I think this should be a rule if you ask me. What you try to accomplish beyond the first page can be covered in your cover letter

[quick forum]

Honestly I would be a little concerned if a cyber security interviewer/panel didn't know what a CTF was

[olive oyster]

Have anyone went for CREST certifications before? I'm looking to do CPSA and would like if there's any study guides XD

[faint ice]

the cover letter should also at maximum be 1 single a4

[hollow fossil]

I'd be too but this wasn't a security role so. More of a app testing role.

[uneven igloo]

Yes, my latest CV only states my last 10 years of work and my cover letter is usually 3/4s of a page that is tailored to the company I'm approaching. I include a link to my LinkedIn and portfolio site for further reading if they choose to. Less is more often.

[peak hazel]

Yes, I am in process now. I recommend downloading the syllabus and the recommended reading is The following material and media has been cited as helpful preparation for this examination by previous candidates:

Reading Material:
Network Security Assessment (by O’Reilly, 2nd edition)
Hacking Exposed Linux
Red Team Field Manual (RTFM) (by Ben Clarke)
Nmap Network Scanning: The Official Nmap Project (by Gordon Lyon)
Guide to Network Discovery and Security Scanning
Grey Hat Hacking (by Allen Harper, Shon Harris & Jonathan Ness) and on the site - they do point some training courses. I, myself, am using a mixture of Net Security, Red Team, THM and google.

[olive oyster]

awesome thanks! how long are you taking to prepare for the exam?

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @peak hazel

[peak hazel]

Sadly this is my 3rd attempt as I failed to prep properly. Now I have been at in for 2 months with working full time. As a THM Wizard- you should find it relatively easy 🙂 but still best to be prepard 👍

[static tide]

network security assessment is very good

[pliant yacht]

Good Luck ScriptKitty
You will pass it this time

[peak hazel]

Everyone said how easy it was sooo 2ce I failed to prepare - this time and giving due prep time 🙂

[pliant yacht]

When are you planning to schedule the exam ?

[peak hazel]

15th July booked

[pliant yacht]

Study well

[peak hazel]

Thank you! I will do .

[serene umbra]

Gave +1 Rep to @pliant yacht

[olive oyster]

there's an unofficial practice test on UDEMY for CPSA also.=)

[peak hazel]

Personally! I won't trust it as Udemy cant voouch for the quality. I am just creating own notes from syllabus.

[peak hazel]

This site has also been handy source of reference: http://securityhorror.blogspot.com/p/unix-user-enumeration.html

[lost hatch]

hi, does someone know a reliable website where cybersecurity salaries in europe and US are referenced by type of job? (soc analyst, pentester, malware analyst, CISO...)

[spare kernel]

Glassdoor, LinkedIn etc. Take all salaries posted by individuals with a grain of salt because a lot of people like to lie about their salaries. Check job posts on LinkedIn as they sometimes list a salary

[scenic harbor]

Is there any thm rooms that are a good exercise for eJPT exam

[peak hazel]

For eJPT unsure but for eCPPT then use Gate Keeper.

[nimble crow]

Wreath does a good job of teaching principles that are especially important for the eJPT. The JPT learning path also obviously is quite relevant.

Although realistically, you need to review their training materials as well. There are things on the eJPT that, while valid ways of doing stuff, are kinda off the wall unless you realize that INE teaches stuff to the eJPT (or at least the prior materials they had did).

The way it breaks down, the first half is network pentesting type stuff, some privesc, etc, then once you fully exploit those systems, you make a pivot into the back half of the exam to do some webapp pentesting and enumeration.

I passed the exam last week, so this is all pretty fresh yet.

[scenic harbor]

I had just finished eJPT’s training for eJPT but idk if I’m gonna go for it yet cuz I’m still in highschool. The training wasn’t to hard for me which is a confident boost for me tbh.

I look at the eCPPT and it looks pretty expensive for me to go for and I still have time either way

[nimble crow]

If you can fully exploit Wreath, have done their training, and are confident on your ability to handle networking stuff, go for it.

[scenic harbor]

Thanks!

[nimble crow]

Yeah eCPPT is a whole different level.

But especially as a high schooler, it would be a neat little flex, imo.

[peak hazel]

You are well covered on THM wit Wreath, Throwback and Holo and Koth labs plus other rooms 🙂

[nimble crow]

Yeah, once I finish this cyber defense path, I'm going after Throwback.

Wanna see this rarified advanced general chat.

[peak hazel]

My plan is: Athem CTF + Jr PT, Throwback labs which leads nicely to enumerating and breaching ad rooms too 🙂 Thats my plan soo far 🙂

[nimble crow]

Just finished the JPT path. It's quite fun.

[peak hazel]

Now what @nimble crow ?

[nimble crow]

Lol, Cyber Defense and CySA+ this coming weekend. I start PWK July 3.

Always something to study for!

[scenic harbor]

To be saving on money should I just study for oscp to be better prepared for when I graduate hs

Like can the eJPT get me a job in the future

[nimble crow]

Not doing penetration testing. It might get your foot in the door and help you land work right out of high school if you're not looking to go to college, but the real pentesting stuff is gonna want OSCP, a degree, or experience (and probably even at least two of the three).

Like the main reason I took the eJPT is that I just graduated college, hadn't yet figured out how to pay for the OSCP, but wanted to keep making some kind of progress in the field, plus I find having an exam in mind helps focus my studying.

Like, there's a million and one things out there that I could be working on, but at least picking an exam and making it the focus helps to narrow down what to do next.

[scenic harbor]

Did you get a tech related job after you got your eJPT

[nimble crow]

Lol, I got it last week, and I graduated a month ago, so I'm still in that job hunt phase, but the eJPT alone is not going to be enough to get a job pentesting. It shows an aptitude for the field and some might see it as a good stepping stone for like a network admin job or something, but I'll let you know when I find work.

The fact that this is the second time I've graduated into a recession is not doing me favors.

[scenic harbor]

Ok so then what jobs are you applying for then

[nimble crow]

Security engineer, penetration tester, cybersecurity analyst. You can see my list of qualifications in my profile along with a bachelor's in comp sci but no paid IT experience, security or otherwise.

But I can tell you in the last month, none of the recruiters have made mention of the eJPT.

[scenic harbor]

ah gotcha

[peak hazel]

https://redsiege.com/about-us/careers/ - Now recruiting for Pen testers.

[stone plinth]

hi is anyone providing an online internship ? i'm looking for one.

[pliant yacht]

Mee too
Please let me know if you find one .
I am based in India .

[pseudo creek]

in general, searching for an internship is not a passive thing, you need to be out there, searching, applying. Now it isn't bad to ask because maybe someone knows of one but largely internships are country dependent, which brings up another level of difficulty of asking on a discord server

[stone plinth]

that's the thing, i dont wanna do it in my country they mostly require me to speak French i want something in English but they are limited here

[pseudo creek]

again, your search is going to take extra effort then

[rugged delta]

A lot of internships prioritise college grads in places where large organisations employ from the local grad pool but there are always openings for potential candidates with other means of demonstrating knowledge or experience. Look on recruitment websites and company sites but also look out for recruitment fairs, conferences and other organised gatherings by companies, professional orgs and other groups in the field

[north terrace]

Hey guys

Is an MSC in computer science good in a career in cyber security?

[nimble crow]

If you've got some experience? Sure. If you're just starting out, that's iffy. Do you have an MSc or are you asking about pursuing one?

[stoic cave]

If you have no prior professional experience it's more than likely going to be a hindrance. This is due to you being priced out of entry level positions. Masters are generally reserved for those going into management or are later in their career, 6+ years, and should be paid for by the company of possible.

[pseudo creek]

Please for the love of everything good in the world, don't get a MS in Cyber to get your foot in the door, concentrate on certs and building a portfolio

[uneven cliff]

Hey guys, I just joined the server 👋

I think a similar question was just asked but in my case it's a bit different.

I graduated last fall with a BS in CS. I completed a 10 month cyber security boot camp, got the sec+, and last week got my net+. I have about a years experience in IT (working and internship) and now I'm working in a large company as a "cyber" sysadmin.

I just learned about Wgu and feel like I could easily knock that out in less than 6 months. I'd probably get the pentest+ first then start that. I'm also interested in going for the ejpt and then OSCP after.

My question is, should I knock out the masters course quickly at this stage of my career and while I'm still young and without responsibilities or should I wait a few years like mentioned?

I'm also joining the air national guard to work in their cyber area

Originally my plan was to take the ejpt and OSCP but now learning about wgu changed my perspective

[flat sedge]

You already have a degree, value of WGU is going to be limited.

Until it somehow helps your promotion path, don't get a masters.

[uneven cliff]

So even if I have my job pay for tuition, and I can get my masters within 6 months, I shouldn't do it? Are there any downsides of taking it early?

[flat sedge]

It overvalues you for the position you're in; there's a value over time that a business wants to fill a role. If you promote yourself out of that too early (which a masters likely would), the company has to spend money to backfill your role earlier than expected.

[uneven cliff]

Gotcha

Thank you

[mossy pewter]

Quick question

is this in the UK