s2-lore-discussions

[proven wolf]

To me, it feels like that Strelok was the hook/bait to lead CS to their demise.

There are holes in SoC too, and I don't mind them being filled, as long as things remain consistent and makes sense.

I don't get why Scar goes on about the shining zone... I just don;t like S2 story on many many levels.

[smoky hornet]

Popping in here to say reading this has actually given me a good view into Deathguards perspective

Also to apologize for being an asshole

[strong flume]

See that's the thing, Scar is going on and on about the Shining Zone cause he's officially an Agent of C-Con hell half of Spark doesn't really believe in it a few of their members say they're only in it to take it to the Ward, and that's it, Scar is going on and on about it cause his mission as an agent is to bring back C-Consciousness and to defeat the Ward, to do that he needs Spark, he can't accomplish both of those objectives without Spark and well Spark needs an idea to believe in, a cause to fight for, and lay down their lives for, the Shining Zone, where everyone can end up zombified but in their own little fantasy worlds, and you see his own view on the Shining zone shatters horrendously at the end when you have to fight him, he knows he's lost and he even states he doesn't know what to believe in and realizes he's an agent and he doesn't know what to do, we've beat him and he's just kicking now

It's a matter of Agents don't just have C-Con talking in their heads, they have to get orders, it's how they're independent enough to be used as spies and saboteurs in a way by C-Con, they keep a bit of their free will but still serve, it's best to think of them as sleeper agents, they're not gonna activate unless something triggers them to activate.

[proven wolf]

But the ending of the game doesn't reflect this mission.

And why would he know he's an agent... The only agent that had his programming go wrong, was Strelok. So he wouldn't know.

And why would he have a mission to bring C-con back?

[strong flume]

I can see why Scar talking about the Shining zone like a mad man and raving lunatic can be annoying or seem weird, when he was once a silent protagonist in a way, but he technically is a lunatic now, he's got memories that aren't even his own in his head, and by the end of the game he realizes it, that's the funniest part, diving heavily into HoC now, when you have to fight him, he realizes the whole story he tells you in Rostok, wasn't even his memories, it was of another original Spark member's memories, the whole "Thieves rule and Wardens drool" story he acts out in the trainyard isn't his story and when you go into the STALKER programming hallway, you see it, like he talks like a raving lunatic who's coming to the realization that he may just be a raving lunatic, trying to both justify that he can still win while somehow C-Con can still come back, but at the same time if they come back, it defeats the purpose of the shining zone cause at that point you destroyed them in a way

[proven wolf]

I take it this from HoC, so probably a kinda retcon about agents.

[strong flume]

No that's just a generalization I made from playing all the stalker games atm, and recently, I don't see agents as getting direct orders in their heads I see them as getting orders via their PDA's or from a secret drop etc. like how cold war spies used to operate, like that's why even in SoC you see Strelok have a strange PDA thing saying, "Kill the Strelok" and you don't hear C-Con throughout the game despite technically being an agent to a point, and he's not the only one with a PDA telling him to do stuff even in HoC there's like one or two STALKER agents with PDAs one is to still kill the Strelok and iirc Scar's was to activate the device at the Malachite base and then await further orders which is him making contact back with C-con which brings everything to a crazy climax there, cause C-Con is either still alive, or they're just an imprint and either way that was what his mission was

[proven wolf]

Don't like it one bit.

There is no reason for him to go mad... like the agent that Streak kills with the TVs.

He didn't go made... And why would he have a mission to bring C-con back, when was made an agent at the same time at the end of CS.

[proven wolf]

The TV's gave them their orders, the C-con explains it the end of Soc, and then sent out on the death trucks

[strong flume]

Well technically bringing in Clear Sky as a prime example and one of the biggest holes and why I think Kalancha being an agent makes sense a way, just going off Clear Sky, hear me out, everyone else in Clear Sky at the CNPP with the duel with Strelok has or gets a psi protection device meant to protect them from emissions happening while they're fighting, everyone BUT Scar, Scar doesn't get a psi protection device and in fact, he's the one being told time and time again, "if you get caught in another emission it won't end well for you" so it's very likely that, that record breaking emission, mind you that's his THIRD BLAST not even his first, combined with the TVs and getting implanted with another's memories, would drive him a little mad in a way but if Kalancha knew, Scar was an agent, and hell knew he was just gonna be put back in the STALKER program or even was to die completing his mission or their mission whatever to "Kill the Strelok" then it makes sense, Scar doesn't need a psi protection device he's gonna get hit by an emission and if he's an agent oh well and if he isn't well, one less loose end and one less person to possibly keep Clear Sky going if enough people make it back in one piece

[shrewd igloo]

Scar should be dead on HoC or atleast don't appear more than in lore mentions.

[strong flume]

The TVs indoctrinate them, yeah I think they give them their first orders but I do believe afterwards they can get given updates on their PDAs or some other way, it'd be much more efficient and I feel like it makes the little PDAs we see STALKER agents running around with make sense, they wouldn't need them if they're programmed from the start to just do that thing, it'd make more sense if they're getting updated objectives to do what they need to do because of those PDAs

[proven wolf]

If Scar was an agent sent to kill Strelok, he could have got pass all the monolith without the need to fight them, to catch up to him.

Would have been easier and quicker.

[strong flume]

And we see those little PDAs in HoC can change, when you fight Strelok and win, you can change the little PDA change from, "Kill the Strelok," to, "Mission Accomplished" which yeah I'm not basing this assumption that the STALKER agents don't need the TVs to get new missions off of anything besides how real world secret agents work basically, but in my mind at least, I think it makes sense and gives more of a reason as to why they even have those little PDAs in the first place and I think that's something we can agree on there, cause as you said if the TVs give them their orders, they don't/shouldn't need a reminder, they're programmed to follow those orders

[proven wolf]

Why would Strelok still have that mission 9n his PDA, no reason for it, he's not an agent.

[strong flume]

Strelok was in the agent program and in SoC you can see his little, "Kill the Strelok" PDA that you really only see once or twice iirc

https://tenor.com/view/sidorovich-checking-pda-kill-the-strelok-sidorovich-stalker-shadow-of-chernobyl-gif-11282798591427823075

Sorry for the Gif but that's from SoC that's the little PDA I'm talking about

[strong flume]

But yeah, it was moreso for an easter egg of, "Oh hey you finished the mission from the first game good job" moreso a nod than anything

[shrewd igloo]

Maybe that is more like a refference, not necessarly 100% canon.

[strong flume]

Yeah, but I'm taking it as they can change, it's not just a single thing on a screen, in general it doesn't need to be the exact text provided before, but still it just shows I think they can get missions from those little PDAs

Like, say a STALKER agent gets a mission to, "Sabotage Rookie Village," how they do that is up to them, but they can go and do it, say back, "Mission Accomplished," and they're basically an agent waiting for new orders to come in, so in theory, Scar probably had one saying, "Reconnect to C-Con"

[strong flume]

I don't think Scar was a C-Con agent at the time of CS I just said it as a point of, "Kalancha convienently forgets to give probably the most prominent member of Clear Sky at that point a helmet to protect himself despite him being the one telling Scar, hey don't get caught in another emission, you won't feel so good after," like that's either a major plot hole or like I said, he was an agent of C-Con and he was ordered to take Scar in and as Scar was about to complete Kalancha's mission, Kalancha went and basically ensured Scar would no longer be an issue as most of the leadership and even scientists would've gone and left a skeleton crew at best back at their main base in the swamps, including himself in a way iirc, and then poof the major emission happens, for all he knows Scar is either dead or probably fried in ways we don't wanna imagine or even now has become a Monolithian or STALKER agent himself and probably 90% of all the CS members who went didn't/couldn't come back so Clear Sky is also now scorched earth'ed and one less loose end faction to deal with thinking they can go and figure out how to control the zone or how it works

[pearl mirage]

So Im somewhat lost on what seeing the Stalkers view via the tv sceens (Dark one, Skif in the Ward ending). Can groups control stalkers they can see through or just watch what they see?

[strong flume]

Only C-Con can control STALKER agents, so Dark One was a STALKER agent which is why you can see through his eyes at the Ward facility, Ward was using that system to track down the STALKER agents that were still alive and operating in the zone, and as Korshunov says, many agents have already left the zone even, and went back to the mainland and that system no longer works on them unless they come back to the zone, those agents can still cause problems and chaos for the Ward and whoever else since they're basically sleeper cells waiting to wake up and operate, if they go to the mainland they may just do crazy shit out there etc.

[crimson hemlock]

I'm pop in to just say that we are still waiting for pvp/multip mode 😉

[half sky]

And to add to the answer - the TV screens at the end are not "everyone is now an Agent we can control" but more "We now see and hear what everyone in the world does since we control the Noosphere"

[proven wolf]

But where did the order come from?

Strelok shot the machinery to bits, along with C-con.

No way to get new instructions sent out.

And if it was an order incase something happen, the surely they would have tasked such an important job to more than one agent.

It makes no sense at all, if I was C-Con, I would have made sure that every agent would been tasked with instruction if something happened.

It's just poor story telling, IMO.

[normal drum]

Do you understand that the MDST and the C-Consciousness are two different entities?

[robust laurel]

You know, I realized a long time ago that this person finds it easier to write “What a terrible story, what an awful plot” a hundred times than to actually try to understand anything. Because understanding something — reading, listening, thinking — takes effort, while typing nonsense is easy. And actually backing up their opinion with arguments? Even harder.

What I don’t get is why this person is still in the chat. If you don’t like it — just leave. I’m not against people having their own opinions, and mentioning it a couple of times is totally fine. But when almost every single message is just “the plot is awful,” what’s the point of staying here? To drag everyone else down?

We got it — someone thinks the plot is bad. There’s no need to repeat it endlessly, it just turns into spam, provocation, and pointless negativity. For what purpose? What’s the goal?

Even if the plot is flawed — full of holes, inconsistent, whatever — what then? Will repeating it in every message change anything? This is a chat for discussing the story and the lore. Why come here just to ruin the experience for everyone else?

[proven wolf]

So only people who like the story are allowed to have an opinion?

You have some really poor takes. Born out of pure arrogance.

[robust laurel]

Dude, learn to read. I clearly said the problem is that you keep repeating it endlessly for no reason.

Saying it a few times is fine. Repeating it endlessly is the problem.

[normal drum]

You're repeating the same point without any further analysis for almost half a year. Aren't you tired?

[proven wolf]

What was it you said... "If you don't like it - just leave"

How about, go do one 👍

[proven wolf]

Where did I ever say the were the same thing?

[robust laurel]

Please learn how to read and finally finish school.

[proven wolf]

Why don't you stop being an arrogant ÷>[.

[normal drum]

The whole message before that. If you've played the game, you would've known such thing as the MDST existed.

[proven wolf]

So assumptions now.

[normal drum]

Of course, they are, I cannot look into your head so I'd known what you know. Your "questions" question me if you payed attention while playing.

[proven wolf]

Then don't post bs based on assumptions.

Pretty simple.

[robust laurel]

Man, almost every message you write contains either a logical mistake or a clear misunderstanding of the lore. You’ve gotten the lore wrong hundreds of times, and it has been explained and proven in this chat many times. Instead of simply asking, “What does this mean?” when something is unclear, you keep calling the story “broken” — and that’s not an attempt to understand anything, it’s just disrupting the discussion.

Again, it’s perfectly fine to say you don’t like something — but it should come with arguments, not endless repetition of the same complaint. You don’t know even the basic concepts of Stalker 2 because you don’t try to understand them. You’re not making an effort to figure things out; you’re just dismissing everything that seems confusing to you.

That’s not how a mature person behaves — that’s how a child reacts.

[proven wolf]

Understand them? You have barely told me anything, other than link posts that has nothing to do with what I asked.

Or links to your videos that in no way am I watching, cos there is now I supporting your BS.

[robust laurel]

That’s exactly what I’m talking about. You’re not trying to understand anything. You don’t read what people tell you because you honestly don’t care — you’d rather just keep repeating the same nonsense for no real reason.

Please don’t waste everyone’s time on your absurdity.

[proven wolf]

My absurdity? What like the MDST having access to the stalker program, if that is what people are suggesting?

When C-con, would never given that information to anyone, and something they controlled solely.

Because once again, HoC wrote something at odds to what C-con were. C-con played everyone, they told MDST what the needed to know just to get finances. But kept most of it to themselves.

C-con, were a law unto themselves. Their only purpose, was their own goal and no one else's.

You blindly accept everything you read in HoC, and never question it.

Like why would C-con give access to MDST, to the agent program?

They wouldn't, it was there secret program, for them to achieve their own agenda.

And it's not until the mission where you turn the network back on, that anyone would have access to the network used by C-con.

Seeing as it was the network that connected all C-con agents, monolith, etc together. From what I remember of S2

[normal drum]

Who do you think was working at the Jupiter factory? Who evacuated from there to Prypiat-1? Who was writing all that documents? It's established already in CS that it's not the Monolithians as they appeared only after the Superemission in 2011.

[somber hedge]

Does he know what the noosphere is?

[radiant harness]

unclear

[robust laurel]

Do you even realize that you never question your own claims?

1. If C-Con supposedly “never trusted anyone,” then who do you think kept them alive? Who, for example, put Strelok into the capsule in the alternative SoC ending?

2. There is nothing in the games that states agents or the Monolith receive orders directly through the Noosphere. Show me proof that it’s even possible to give commands or exert control through it. They did not control the Noosphere — that’s exactly why they needed another member in the group, the eighth participant. Reading information from the Noosphere and actually controlling it are two completely different things. You keep mixing this up because in your headcanon they somehow controlled it, even though the games never say that. Prove it — otherwise you’re just making claims without any evidence from the source material.

3. Where exactly are you getting your ideas about their goals or who trusted whom? Did you just decide that on your own? Maybe don’t treat your personal imagination as canon.

4. MDST and C-Con were part of the same team. C-Con were specifically the scientists whose minds were merged, which is why they’re listed separately — to avoid confusion.

5. They were still one team, and the agents were always handled by MDST, because C-Con physically couldn’t do it. Everything C-Con did up until 2012 was simply containing the Zone. They didn’t influence events directly, and in many ways it was MDST that kept them functioning. Even though C-Con were nominally the leaders, all real authority ended up with MDST, because MDST operated in the real world while C-Con were connected to the Noosphere.

And I’m pretty sure you won’t give a proper answer to any of these points — you’re willing to ignore any argument that doesn’t fit your narrative.

[radiant harness]

MDST is The Group from COP, basically, the scientists in the Tubes were all part of MDST but MDST itself isnt C-Con, The Group doesnt have any idea whats going on

[somber hedge]

It is known fact that (atleast during SoC) there ate still working and fully operational X-Labs, the C-Con is one of them

[normal drum]

The MDST as an idea existed long before Stalker 2

[somber hedge]

Also monolith soldiers arent mind controlled, they are brainwashed, and somehow have a connection to the C-Con

[normal drum]

Not a direct one though. They most probably were given direct orders at a Visiograph, for example, in the Monolith control room, while also having a common mission "protect the labs/Prypiat/CNPP/centre of the Zone" imprinted in their minds by emitters.

[robust laurel]

Do you remember when Strelok came to shoot the capsules, the ones where there was still a hologram of the Monolith? I mean the moment before the conversation with the Representative. That was clearly a visigraph, and more than that — there was specifically a hologram of the Monolith. Obviously, the fighters went into that room to receive orders.

[normal drum]

Logically, there would be no point in a Visiograph just standing and being ready for a communication with someone if Monolithians were controlled by some "induced psi-fields from the Noosphere"

[proven wolf]

1. From what I remember, they absorbed all the people they could... not all of the were turned into Monolith troops, some were put to tasks, developing weapons etc

Just because people were there, it doesn'tmean they had free will.

The whole point about the wish granted, was to allow them to get on with what they had to do.

2. Ending of SoC, monolith sniper taking target information fron C-con, whilst C-con consciousness was in the Noospere.

3. There goals were describe at the end of SoC, with the talk with representative and how they wanted to be left alone because mankind wasn't ready.

4. No you don't say, but doesn't mean they didn't have their own agenda.

5. I have seen nothing to say that it was MDST that handle the agents.

Probably something added in HoC.

C-con controlled everything.

[somber hedge]

However in strelok ending, he had to use the radio from skif to prevent them killing hin

[somber hedge]

I think it was more mistycal, since they believed in the monolith

[ornate venture]

midrovar has been warned

Reason: Bad word usage

[somber hedge]

Damn... i am dumb

[robust laurel]

1. Prove that they didn’t have it. If you’re claiming it, it’s on you to prove it.

2. On what basis do you say he receives orders specifically from C-Con? Faust was connected to the Monolith and was also a commander. It’s reasonable to assume he’s the one giving orders because he was capable of doing so. I have evidence; you only have assumptions.

3. And what exactly was their goal? Come on, I want to hear it clearly.

4. Prove it. You’re making a claim, so prove it.

5. There is literally a document in the game with orders to Scar from MDST.

[somber hedge]

They communicate with the monolith soldiers trough psi emissions

[robust laurel]

Strelok controlled the Noosphere, whereas C-Con did not.

[proven wolf]

1. IIRC, They said it in the conversation at the end of SoC.

[somber hedge]

Thats not how it works, for you to be under the influence of the c-con you have to be brainwashed, and there is a very very high chance you become a zombified instead of a monolithian

[robust laurel]

They said that they don’t trust anyone?

Moreover, they were willing to merge their consciousness with Strelok, the very person who later killed them. This arguably says even more about the fact that they trusted him.

[somber hedge]

The c-con did have control, but not the way strelok did, emissions took months to happen becuse the c-con was trying to heal the wound, and only released the emissions when the anomalous energy reached critical levels that even they couldnt control

[somber hedge]

Do you trust the C-Con? I dont i take everything they say as a grain of salt, and i dont believe in subtle matter, i believe after the c-con died the zone created a imprint of them in the noosphere

[robust laurel]

I’m talking about something else.
Strelok already had the ability to directly control and manage the Noosphere, whereas C-Con could not — that’s why they didn’t control the Monolith directly.

[somber hedge]

If i am not mistaken ghost or fang died 2 times

[robust laurel]

In this message, I explained in detail why this is not a problem.

#s2-lore-discussions message

[normal drum]

No, both died once

There are two graves of Fang, one made by Ghost and another by Strelok

[somber hedge]

https://youtu.be/AqhlgUMCsOE?si=vmDsZjvslTbBNhYs this is a very good video about subtle matter

[robust laurel]

@normal drum can you send this document?

[normal drum]

Currently not

[somber hedge]

Father valerian is also another good example

[normal drum]

Bug

And even if it wasn't (which would be some insane Zone mystery), Subtle Matter doesn't create a second physical body

[robust laurel]

I know about this video. The author leans too heavily toward one side, whereas in the game it’s deliberately left as an open question.

[somber hedge]

Disagree, specialy if you know about the first concepts of stalker cs, i do think stalker 2 came to add fuel to the cut content ideas, and father valerian is still there

[proven wolf]

https://youtu.be/TsLxsqy6-BM?si=wZU9wWAxZpirQGgm

From 32:40. In the first few sentance of the first question.

We absorbed everyone and set them to task. I meadiatialy after the experiment happen.

Monolith and the scientists, all controlled by C-con.

It's not head cannon... You just don't know where near as much as you think you do.

Everyone was controlled by C-con.

[normal drum]

Valerian in Cordon doesn't die so there's no mystery he's alive in HoC.

[robust laurel]

"We" includes MDST as well. They don’t specify that it’s specifically them.

[proven wolf]

Everyone.

C-con controlled everything.

[normal drum]

Still awaits to be answered.

[robust laurel]

Because they were the project leaders? Do you even understand what it means to be a "leader"?
How does that imply “control over the scientists”? How does that imply that the scientists had no free will? Stop presenting headcanon as fact.

[shrewd igloo]

Is not a bug

[shrewd igloo]

That is a EASTER-EGG added by the Level Designer, not canon

[normal drum]

Is there a confirmation that exists directly in the game and explains that?

[normal drum]

Then it's still not canon.

[shrewd igloo]

The level designer added that in refference to the plot of Anarchy Cell, he wanted add a refference to fallout on that level too, with a 357 pistol or smth on a body.

[normal drum]

Didn't know the exact story behind that, thanks

[robust laurel]

This is a mistake. From the old storyline that was cut during the game’s development.

[shrewd igloo]

Anarchy Cell never had a build or a plot included in-game (so isn't a remnant), just some levels of Anarchy Cell was rendered (Red Forest, Pripyat Underground and Swamps) but not finished on in-game thingis.

[proven wolf]

Are you that thick, you don't understand what "absorbed" and "Set them to tasks" means.

Do you not understand what happened to them.

They got brainwashed, and given tasks to do.

🤣🤣🤣🤣

[somber hedge]

Right but there is a body of him in the red forest

[robust laurel]

@sour galleon @nocturne mural is this still within the scope of the discussion?

[somber hedge]

You cant add a body of a NPC in the game and say its kot canon, that makes 0 sense

Easter eggs still follow the rules of the world they are in, or atleast should reference something

[normal drum]

Bug or easter egg, there is no explanation behind the body inside the game making it non-canon.

[robust laurel]

Provide proof that they were literally under control.

[robust laurel]

Not always; sometimes there are those who are completely killed by the rules.

[proven wolf]

Do not care.

You have been screaming head cannon at me, and here we are, the so called master of lore...

And yet, you had no idea that everyone in the zone for C-con, is enslaved to them.

[normal drum]

Why are there still Monolithians in CoP when there was no C-Consciousness to control them? Also, answer the previous questions.

[robust laurel]

You haven’t provided any proof that C-Con controls the actions of MDST. Being a leader is not the same as literally controlling. But go ahead, keep embarrassing yourself and writing nonsense.

[sour galleon]

The first simple sentence was not at all mandatory.
Guys, if ur opinions differ and u see that u can't convince each other, then why are u getting on each other's nerves?

[somber hedge]

Becuse tht believed in the monolith, they werent mind controlled they were brainwashed, when they stopped hearing the voice of the monolith, some like strider started questioning things, others believed they had to prove themselves more

[robust laurel]

I’ve detailed here exactly what the problem is.
#s2-lore-discussions message

[proven wolf]

I have never said MDST was controlled by C-con.

MDST we're just the financial backers... As said in the conversation with the Rep.

They played them.

[normal drum]

That's what I'm trying to tell him. He thinks C-Con controlled each Monolithian fully and individually.

[robust laurel]

Lol what???

[robust laurel]

Do you know who MDST are?

[proven wolf]

Never said that at all 🤣

[robust laurel]

@sour galleon I take it that putting a clown on every message is also considered part of the discussion?

[normal drum]

MDST, the Regulatory Board, what difference, right, @robust laurel?

[somber hedge]

The C-Con controls the monolith (the psi emitions and machines that emit it) and the monolith control the monolithians

[proven wolf]

HoC lore?

[robust laurel]

This is literally what I’ve said many times. The person just doesn’t understand the plot at all, but the main thing is to put a clown emoji. That’ll really boost their confidence.

[proven wolf]

Just calling your clown posts for what they are.

[robust laurel]

This is what I call MDST—the ones who fund C-Con

[sour galleon]

From his point of view. Well. I have no right to stop your "heated" argument in general. However, since you like to prove this to each other so much, I'll just say it. If I see anything about a person in the message, you'll get muted. I would advise you to either lower the tone of the conversation or end it

[nocturne mural]

I dunno what happened here, but SHUT THE HELL UP (stalker peak sky reference) I have some work to do

keep the topic for game, not for whatever you do

Or just stop arguing

[robust laurel]

@proven wolf you’re confusing MDST with the Regulatory Board. I guess this conversation is over since you don’t understand the topic you’re talking about.

[somber hedge]

No... its how it was, when strelok destroyed tha C-Con he also destroyed the machine that controlled the monolith

Coincidentaly if i am not mistaken its the same machine

[robust laurel]

The scene before the conversation with the Representative. That’s exactly when he destroyed the Monolith.

[somber hedge]

This

[proven wolf]

I honestly don't care.

You clearly had no understanding what "absorbed" and "set to tasks" means.

You clearly don't get the point, that you don't absorb people who already work for you. It was a clear indication that we're absorbed into something else, something more.

You claimed it all head cannon, everything I said.

Despite the fact the C-con representative says it himself.

How can you debate lore, if you ignore what happened previously?

[somber hedge]

If they absorved every scientist how the doctor escaped?

How lebedev left to form clear sky?

[robust laurel]

By now, everyone here can see that you don’t care about the lore—it’s obvious from your responses

[proven wolf]

Yeah, I know he destroyed the machine, but it wasn't as far as I was aware used to control monolith, the wish granted was explicity a trap.

If I remember correctly they used PSI fields.

[somber hedge]

Yes psi fields, emited by psi emitters

That were controlled by the wish granter (aka monolith aka machine)

[proven wolf]

Any PSI field

[somber hedge]

No not any

[normal drum]

You say you "remember" it. Provide a source where you've heard about "any psi-fields".

[somber hedge]

There are anomalous psi emitters, and uncalibrated ones turn you into a zombified stalker, your brain melt and fry, you only see monolithians and other zombified as friends, but you arent controlled or directed, however i believe monolithians woumd guide zombifieds in the north to attack the barrier

[robust laurel]

Don’t ask him for a definition of what “psi” is, because he won’t give it to you—he doesn’t know

[proven wolf]

Any... all PSI fields are connected...

And the Noospere, when emissions happen, what spills through the hole in PSI emissions, PSI energy.

[proven wolf]

No, I just refused to answer you, as I stated, I want to know your opinion on it.

[robust laurel]

So why are you ignoring @normal drum then? Why are you ignoring his question?

[somber hedge]

A monolithian is a stalker that has enough of its brain that hes able to atleast understand communication and capable of some level of strategy and coordination, zombifieds cant do that, but they do follow the mob rule, and there are also monolith preachers and ofcourse charon, monolithians with very high level of brain activity (still lower than ours tho) that were able to lead, and out perform the military during operation monolith, until he was taken out by strelok

[normal drum]

I don't think they've become less developed, Strider in CoP clearly shows they're just like others.

[proven wolf]

Your brainwashed to tasks, guard this protect that... but if need C-con can instruct them individually... like at the end of clear sky, with the sniper and target acquisition.

[sharp quartz]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/561153910891347968/1309918490551124028/ezgif-4-ae36444589.gif

Just in case bois

I see everything

[robust laurel]

[proven wolf]

Monolith had zero will, the were basically biological robots.

Brainwashed to do tasks... mumble about the monolith etc etc

[somber hedge]

Thats not true, they are in nature the same, they will fry your brain, however the ones controlled by the wish granter are far more powefull and potent that it will always brainwash you, the other ones that arent have different potence, for example the controllers emit psi fields but dont work for the monolith, and they are heavily hinted to have some parts of their original personality

[proven wolf]

It doesn't always brain wash you. It can kill you, as per the being buried under rubble ending.

[somber hedge]

It kills you by brain damage

Those endings on SoC are not canon so they dont actualy happen so we cant use them as a base

[somber hedge]

They do, there exceptions to the rule ofcourse where their brains stayed mostly intact, like strider and other prominent noontide

[jagged hull]

theyre not canon but they exist for a reason

[somber hedge]

That could had been a monolithian ordered by another becuse hes good at what he does, high ranking monolithians can probably think by themselves, but still all their reasoning and will is tied to protecting the monolith

[somber hedge]

Yes i was going to elaborate more, but i felt unnecessary, psi radiation wont kill you by physical means like ruble falling, but by brain damage

[normal drum]

Is there an evidence that there is confirmed irreparable brain damage? There were no brain damaged former Monolithians after the Monolith was turned off, they just lost their memories. There are also no visible incapabilities seen among the Monolithians.

[somber hedge]

The ruble falling there was probably due the heavy combat outside the CNPP

[gusty lotus]

Just cause they aren’t canon to the story doesn’t mean they couldn’t happen

[jagged hull]

im not convinced of the utility of attracting the best stalkers via an attractive myth to the center of the zone and just killing them. seems much more likely that people who visit the CNPP end up as agents or monolithians

[jagged hull]

yeah what happens is clearly just strelok's delusions, rubble doesnt magically start falling from the sky

[somber hedge]

Zombified, stalkers are still becoming zombified, even after the wish granter was shut off, they are still zombified

Again exception to the rule, noontide isnt all the ex monolithians, and most brain damaged were probably killed by stalkers and military due their nature after CoP, keep in mind degtyarev stayed in the zone with an elite military and stalker group, and we know he stayed in prypiat, so imagine the ammount of fighting they did

Also most the noontiders are seen around the base doing nothing, most prominent ones are the ones taking care of important tasks and management, they also have been for some years not under the influence, so there might be some healing, but they are still very weak to psi emissions, during the battle at sircaa just for the short time the wish granter was turned on was enought to turn all the noontiders around the zone back, becuse the psi wave was so strong and they turned older psi emitters on again

Also memory loss is a sign of brain damage

[somber hedge]

It isnt the idea to kill them, but its like a microwave directed to your brain, you will either resist and become a monolithian it or melt and become zombified

[jagged hull]

youd think there'd be zombies in the area in that case

[somber hedge]

It is a delusion yeah, its just that later on its show its actualy rubble, however psi emissions dont control the enviroment, idk a military helicopter crashed nearby as he made his wish and rubble started falling and all he saw was gold, its irrelevant

[somber hedge]

But there are zombies in the area.... atleast outside of it. Only the elite monolithians defended the wish granter

[jagged hull]

i dont remember seeing zombies in the cnpp map but its been a while since i played soc so i might be wrong

[somber hedge]

Again, read what i said, zombified stalkers dont go to the CNPP becuse they are directed, the only ones that are there are military with psi protection and the other stalkers, becuse strelok deactivated the BRAIN SCORCHER

The most powefull psi emitter there was

[jagged hull]

whoever was in charge of building the wishgranter surely would be able to calibrate the device to not completely fry most people, but theres not much proof in the game for either side of the argument. the reason why i think that its used for agent recruitment is that it simplifies the process and allows for easier recruitment, as compared to kidappings or escorting potential prospects from the brain scorcher or other psi-emitters

what we do know is that its fairly different to the brainscorcher, as seen in both soc and hoc, where the main character has to actually want to interact with the thing for it to start "working". due to that reason im leaning towards it being a more directed psi emitter

[somber hedge]

I am not talking about only the wish granter, but psi emitters and radiation in general

There are probably multiple types of psi emitters and levels of radiation that can change, STALKERS probably suffered a light version of brainwashing, like kinda what happened to scar and strelok, but zombified stalkers are still brainwashed, and monolithians are still brainwashed, plus we arent all the same, while some people will turn zombified others will turn into fully capable monolith soldiers

[jagged hull]

sure i dont mind what you said if its regarding other psi emitters, thats fairly commonly accepted

[normal drum]

• There is no evidence of existence of "brain damaged Monolithians who were killed off".
• Noontiders were doing nothing because they have no experience and were led by a hopeful but an incompetent leader, not because they were psychically traumatised.
• Not necessarily in the Stalker universe. Psi-influence does not damage the brain, it changes it. You can look up my theory about immortality in the Stalker universe, I wrote it a couple of days ago. Shortly, the nature of zombified, the experiments at the Orbita and the Scar ending prove that physically the zombified are perfectly fine and can regenerate, and their behaviour is not caused by brain damage.

[somber hedge]

Strelok was wearing a psi helmet to protect him agains the psi emitions

[somber hedge]

I am just going to ignore you at this point

No matter what i say or present you just repeat

[jagged hull]

the psi helmet is made to work against the psi emitters that the ecologists in yantar were aware of so i doubt that they made it work with the wish granter

[somber hedge]

"There isnt enough evidence" becuse of the perspectives we have, strelok and scar were fighting fully capable and brainwashed monolithians, degtyarev was fighting remnants and trying his best not to die and evacuate the military from there, not interacting with all the monolithians and learning from them, strider was a coincidence

[somber hedge]

Its complicated, becuse after the brain scorcher was turned off stalkers were able to rush into the center of the zone, and military was alredy going there so they were prepared to deal with the psi-radiation and emissions (helicopters that can resist the emission for example)

But then when the wish granter is turned back on in SIRCAA its enough to send noontide on a rampage, i dont remember what happened precisely there, but it was a psi emitter that they were turning back on right? Including the wish granter

[normal drum]

The Ninth is a coincidence, too? Monolithians who still believed in Monolith are not necessarily brain damaged, that's like saying all real cultists are brain damaged, but it's more connected to their life experience and character.

[somber hedge]

I am pretty sure you dont know how brain damage works and that it has multiple levels of severity, if you hit yohr head and forget you by medical definition suffered brain damage, just becuse you arent babbling around like a zombified stalker doesnt mean you cant be brain damaged

[normal drum]

Again about "memory loss = brain damage", by this logic, all Agents are brain damaged, too, but that doesn't make sense in the Stalker universe, because psi works on a different level.

[somber hedge]

Real life cultists arent monolithians, they joined the cult willingly, monolithians didnt

[somber hedge]

Just google braindamage. Not all brain damage is permanent

What me and lihacc discussed is if its permanent, and in my opinion it depends on the casr

For example zombified stalkers cant be cured

But monolithians can go back to society, atleas some of them

People have different capabilities, some people are more tough some arent, so maybe some people are more resistant to brain damage, but still not enough to prevent brainwashing but enough to prevent permanent damage

[proven wolf]

Another thing you need to remember, is that those mobile transmitters were for reinforcing the already brainwashed.

We know that, after SoC, when it's all shutdown. The brainwashing dissipates...

I don't think k they was ever intended, used for brainwashing new recruits.

[proven wolf]

Yup, it was the wish granter... And it was that point I gave up on the story.

Monolith, again? Yeah, F off (not you, the game, the story)

I literally had, had enough of it by that time.

So just completed the game as quick as I could and have never played the story since.

[somber hedge]

Oh also the psi emitters in the swamps by clear sky base, they werent under the control of the wish granter, but were active nonetheless

[proven wolf]

Was this something that HoC introduced, like the MDST?

[somber hedge]

I wonder if the reason monolith didnt overrun the zone wasnt becuse of freedom holding the barrier but becuse there werent psi emitters strong enough down south to maintain the control

[somber hedge]

Its in HoC professor kalanchs sets up psi emitters in the swamp to protect the clear sky base from being looted and raided by stalkers

[proven wolf]

I don't think they had any intention too.

Their only purpose really was to keep C-con free to do what they wanted.

[somber hedge]

Yeah but the more space they have the better i would have guessed

[proven wolf]

The ones you shut down.

[somber hedge]

Ye, skiff is built different

A true john stalker

[deep forum]

C-Con didn't need space. They just needed their pods.

[proven wolf]

Not really, they didn't need it. The smaller the area, the easier it was to defend.

Its why, when brain the scorcher was shut down, it was a massive deal.

[somber hedge]

Oh yeah, i meant to defend the further away you can keep your enemy the better

[deep forum]

assuming the number of monoliths doesn't increase with distance from the c-con, you just have less defenders per m² to defend.

[somber hedge]

Thats fair

But they could brainwash more people

Assuming they could build more brain scorcher level of facilities

[normal drum]

Have you ever tried to kill a zombified, how they still stand up no matter how much you hurt them unless you shoot in the head? That's a literal example of regeneration of the cells. Zombified can regenerate their bodies and consequently their brains, too, it's an obvious conclusion. The information on them, however, may disappear in the process. The brains can fully function perfectly fine but contain no information on them. That's one way to put it.

The second one touches the Scar ending. Skif in there clearly behaves like a zombified. Then how did he see what he saw there if his brain is damaged? There are only two acceptable realities here: 1) if his brain is damaged, then you accept that the Subtle Matter exists and Skif's consciousness aka his soul is in the Shining Zone because there's no other way Skif can experience such things with brain damage;
2) if his brain is not damaged, then you accept the zombified do not have any brain damage at all.

Any other case disregards the whole point of the ending. Why did the Representative want to zombify everyone then? If there's both no Subtle Matter and the zombified's brains are damaged, then how it works at all and what's the point of it?

[ornate venture]

midrovar has been warned

Reason: Bad word usage

[somber hedge]

Ahhhh i used a bad word

I will answer you when i get home brb

[normal drum]

No problem

(if i won't go to bed)

Just to understand how I see things on the zombified topic. ⬆️

I understand your grounded view on things, there are just facts that cannot be ignored by me.

In the "only trilogy" lore there's obviously no other explanation than "they have brain damage". But HoC creates a whole different perspective on the zombified. Scar is totally an underrated character, with an underrated ideology. War veterans would give everything to have peace in the Shining Zone.

[somber hedge]

1. Zombified stalkers can be killed by body shoots as seen in this video were a normal stalker executes a struggling zombie, and they dont regenerate, they can still feel pain but are very tolerant to it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNPQggI4hfc

2. "The information on them, however, may disappear in the process. The brains can fully function perfectly fine but contain no information on them. That's one way to put it."

thats fully wrong, they retain memories as shown of bad brainwashing, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e4mV0ES2VKk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-zTenkYANI

3. Skif is hallucinating, he isnt necesseraly zombified, plus its not a canon ending so we cant take it for sure that it would happen how it happened

Stalker zombification is not how we think of zombies, they still have brain function that they can use and reload their weapons to attack

this video also explains how zombified are, they arent mutants that can regenerate they are poor souls lost and left in a pitifull state, always kill the zombified stalker

i could also quickly download CoP and just unload into a zombie to show you that zombified can be killed with body shots

[somber hedge]

the thing is, scar was also brainwashed, his mind was broken and replaced by someone else and he doesnt know who he is anymore

[normal drum]

Try HoC zombified, not the trilogy ones. We're not in #👓trilogy-lore-and-story

[normal drum]

He's an Agent, not the same. Agents retain free will and do not become insane (Scar is a special case because he was programmed thrice, still was thinking clearly), and added memories do not "replace" a person, Scar didn't become Marshall because they literally develop and act differently based on the same experience (Marshall runs from Ward, Scar fights with them), not saying there's only one short period of life transferred, not the whole of the memories replaced.

And the point where the brains regenerate with loss of information, of course, applies only in the scenario where the Subtle Matter doesn't exist, if it does exists, then it becomes obvious that the zombified are connected to the Noosphere and are mimicking words and actions from their conciousness that exists in the Subtle World after the zombification (as explained in the linked message).

[robust laurel]

1. We’re talking about HoC, not the old trilogy. @normal drum clearly said that in the ‘only trilogy’ lore the explanation is simply ‘they have brain damage.’ But HoC introduces a completely different angle on what the zombified actually are.

2. All we really know is that they mumble something under their breath, but that doesn’t automatically mean they’re recalling memories. Quoting lines from the trilogy doesn’t work here either. The new voice lines barely hint at memories at all — they suggest that the zombified perceive something entirely different, as if they’re trapped in hallucinations or illusions.

3. Skif behaves exactly like someone who’s becoming zombified, and that’s consistent with the whole Spark storyline, where zombified stalkers appear repeatedly. The sawmill scene with Scar, the fight where he surrounds himself with the zombified, and many others all strongly imply that there’s a direct thematic connection between them and what happens to Skif in the finale. If the argument is that the ending ‘isn’t canon’ and therefore can’t reflect how things work in the Stalker universe, that’s a bold claim — and you’d need to actually prove it. Otherwise, it’s just an interpretation, not evidence.

[somber hedge]

if you want only stalker 2 voice lines thats fine... i used triology voice lines becuse they are clearer and easier to understand https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e4mV0ES2VKk

if father valerian body in CS cant be considered canon, i dont see why non-canon endings can be used in debates

[robust laurel]

I already said that there aren’t any lines that directly suggest they’re remembering anything.

[somber hedge]

since skif acts completly different in his beliefs depending on what choices you make

[robust laurel]

You’re comparing what was in the trilogy to what HoC shows.

[somber hedge]

so the triology is no longer canon?

if you cant use things that happen in the triology to back up claims

plus scar has clearly gone mad, and skif beliefs and actions change alot depending on the choices you make

[normal drum]

I've already talked about the zombified lines, won't repeat myself. ⬆️

[proven wolf]

Have they retconned zombiefied?

[somber hedge]

apparently they believe so

[robust laurel]

Do you even understand the issue here?
You’re comparing a non-canonical moment from Clear Sky with the HoC ending, which hasn’t been proven to be non-canon at all.

As for the trilogy — yes, a lot of things from it aren’t considered canon anymore. Everything shown in HoC is canon; everything else falls into a sort of grey area: not disproven, but something that should be used cautiously as evidence.

Take the zombified, for example. In the trilogy you could kill them with body shots, but under the new canon it’s only headshots — that’s a clear retcon. And there are plenty of changes like that.

[somber hedge]

if you believe in subtle matter, wich i dont

[somber hedge]

then its your theory basing only in stalker 2, and mine using things from stalker 2 and the triology, neither will prove the other wrong

[robust laurel]

#👓trilogy-lore-and-story

[normal drum]

The trilogy is canon unless HoC disproves it. For "only Stalker 2" and "Trilogy+Stalker 2" lore - #s2-lore-discussions. For "only trilogy" lore - #👓trilogy-lore-and-story.

[robust laurel]

I never said I believe it or don’t believe it. I clearly said it’s an open question, and the game leaves it up to the player to decide.

[normal drum]

You don't need to believe in the Subtle Matter because the regeneration is not Subtle Matter related, it's just a fact. A true statement.

[somber hedge]

if they can regenerate, and regenerate their brain, why they die when they get headshotted

why they dont simply regenerate? like you claim they do

[normal drum]

I can shoot a human in the head and then a controller will still reanimate them.

[robust laurel]

And controllers can raise the dead.

[ornate venture]

midrovar has been warned

Reason: Bad word usage

[somber hedge]

god thats bs, what the hell they did with my game

thats stupid in soo many levels (i am not talking about you guys)

[robust laurel]

It’s just the new lore. You may not like it, but the old rules don’t work anymore.

[somber hedge]

they had such a cool zombie concept and a trully tragic enemy, and they ruined it

[robust laurel]

It didn’t get worse — it actually became deeper. You just need to look into it more carefully.

[somber hedge]

nah bro, they went from people that have been lost, to the walking dead

[robust laurel]

Not exactly. It’s different. Walkers are more like an infection or necromancy, but this works on a completely different principle. I can explain in more detail.

[somber hedge]

and a controller is a necromancer

[robust laurel]

No

[somber hedge]

he is, if he can raise the dead... thats literaly a necromancer, maybe not a powerfull necromancer that can raise skelletons or bodies that are decomposing, but still a necromancer

[robust laurel]

Read this again, everything is clearly explained there.
#s2-lore-discussions message

[normal drum]

It's still tragic because you not all zombified get happy ending which is seen from their lines. The Representative explained that the intervention of SIRCAA damaged the Noosphere causing the mental images of the Subtle Matter to become isolated from one another. That means, just like Strider, they appear and exist in a sort of limbo, nothingness and/or psychological torture. Only the Scar ending resolves the problem, otherwise the zombified still do not arrive completely to the "afterlife". That's if we believe in the Subtle Matter. If not and there's only a copy/imprint of the mind in the Noosphere, then the situation is still of same tragedy as in the trilogy.

[robust laurel]

@somber hedge Do you see the point? In the Scar ending essentially achieved immortality by turning everyone into zombies, whether you believe in the Subtle Matter or not.

[normal drum]

If we believe in the Subtle Matter, a controller will only raise a body, by reconnecting it to the Noosphere, but the conciousness remains in the Subtle World (or the discussed limbo state).

[somber hedge]

bro all i see is the walking dead, you might see something deep in it, but its just.. cliche, it went from an enemy that can still have levels of inteligence where it doesnt necesseraly want to harm you (controller in CoP) to a necromancer...

I remember people saying that stalker 2 ruined some lore aspects, but i didnt believe it would be like this, changing whole concepts

i see what you guys mean now, and i can see that using stalker 2 lore i am wrong, but still i am disapointed

[robust laurel]

Well, the Monolith Regenerator already existed in Stalker 2 so you could have suspected something at that point
It’s basically an item that heals using magic

Again, I actually think the changes regarding the zombies are good from every perspective — it works well in tandem with the Scar ending.

[somber hedge]

thank god scar ending isnt real, the only thing we both agree is that screw the ward

[robust laurel]

The Ward ending isn’t entirely straightforward, just like with the zombified ones. But we won’t go into that topic

[somber hedge]

i am a fan of either skif ending or strelok

idk if GSC alredy confirmed a ending

[robust laurel]

I like Strelok, Spark, and Ward, but each ending is unique in its own way.
However, I really don’t like the Doctor’s ending

[nocturne mural]

Have you guys been talking in here for a whole day?

https://tenor.com/view/i-want-the-zone-to-disappear-strelok-wishing-strelok-facepalm-strelok-cnpp-gif-5127137257313069451

[somber hedge]

yes

hopes and dreams have been shattered

[normal drum]

To remind how awful it feels for a zombified/dead person to be trapped in this so called "Shattered World": #📸┃screens_and_videos message

"Dark. Can't see anything!"

[somber hedge]

right, but thats if you believe in subtle matter, before zombies were that, shattered minds, now they might just be copies

[robust laurel]

But if you believe, it’s even worse.
Because:

1. If subtle matter exists, the original suffers.
2. If it doesn’t, then it’s just a copy—the original has effectively perished in some sense.

[somber hedge]

wait

ok, wait a minute, so controllers control the brain trough psy-emitions, they could be using their power to activate the brain of the deceased stalker, thats why you need to shoot them in the head to be killed

not necesseraly that he's pulling them from the noosphere or subtle matter thing

[robust laurel]

Yes. You shoot him in the head to sever the Brain / Noosphere connection.

[somber hedge]

not necesseraly noosphere connection, but controller controlling

unless you see the controller and mutants manifestation of the noosphere

and zombified stalkers could just be hallucinating

[robust laurel]

Do you mean that they are just being controlled like puppets?
The thing is, it's not only a controller who can do that. In the final fight with Scar, no matter how many times you shoot the zombies in the head, they keep getting back up—and there’s no controller around

Here, the issue is precisely regeneration

The fight with Scar is, of course, an exception to the rule. In all other cases, as far as I know, zombies don’t get back up after a headshot

[somber hedge]

i mean i only had to finish them off once

also zombies dont need a controler

becuse they could just be ahem, brainwashed dudes 🙂

[robust laurel]

So yes.
Roughly speaking, if you don’t believe in Subtle Matter — and as far as I understand, that’s the scenario you’re leaning toward — then the fate of a zombie is still horrible, because the consciousness that was in the brain is, in a sense, destroyed.
If you do believe, then the consciousness ends up in a sort of limbo, where it also suffers.

So in both scenarios, it’s not the best fate.

[somber hedge]

aw it doesnt work

dammit let us send images 😠

[proven wolf]

One of the outcomes from wandering into one the PSI fields around the zone like the brain scorcher.

[vapid spire]

The ward ending basically implies it can see through anyone's eyes as a camera with the noosphere. Pretty much the NSA on super steroids.

[robust laurel]

The Ward are just as much sectarians as Spark. They sincerely believe in happiness for humanity, but only through their own methods.
The Ward are no less ideologically charged than Spark. That’s why they don’t abandon Skif — because they are the same kind of sectarians who believe in a bright future (just by a different path). In this case, Skif also doesn’t entirely maintain full rationality, and believes that it is possible to build a utopia.

[proven wolf]

Basically using tech from the zone to further their own sinister motives.

[hexed rampart]

Are the Xbox mods fixed?

[stray reef]

I took it more as what we have seen since Korshunov got into chamber is a lie - a memories implanted into Skif who is probably in some holding cell for further use by Agatha

something like Scar who was used by C-Cunts in emergencies

[proven wolf]

Couldn't do that, the brainwashing side of the tech had already been destroyed.

They could only see, not create.

[stray reef]

what? where?

[proven wolf]

I think Strelok said, IIRC.

[normal drum]

Nowhere, with the control of the Noosphere it's possible to mess with everyone's heads. However, it's highly unlikely that Agatha did anything more than turning Skif into an Agent, she doesn't need to implant Skif any memories.

[somber hedge]

it also annoys me that Korshunov can pretty much heal the zone in an instant

[robust laurel]

This follows from how anomalous energy works. All of this is also described in the lore — it just takes a long time to sit down and figure it out.

[somber hedge]

yeah but if the c-con wanted to do it before, and they said it was their objective

[stray reef]

Ward had one facility which is left intact when you get caught by Korshunov. Another one is in the Generator before Scar and is also left as it was found, you only retrieve agents' register/files.

[stray reef]

Why not, Skif is the only reason they got control over Zone. You are told multiple times by Korshunov how you are an asset 'that can get shit done'

Let's say another Spark forms and tries to capture Generators, Agatha could summon Skif who would be brainwashed to defend it at all costs

[normal drum]

Being an Agent doesn't always mean messing with memories. The MDST added some of the memories of Marshall to Scar so he had a reason to hate the Ward. In the Ward ending we do not see any changes with Skif. He gets what he wanted - home, and triumphantly flies from the Zone (good ending for Skif, but for the world - it depends).

[normal drum]

Agatha has the full control over the Noosphere, so there's no way anyone would try to capture the Generators*.

[stray reef]

I doubt it, he gets knocked unconscious and then Agatha physically gives him keys - the plan was that she would stay in remote place and use Korshunov as relay/vpn to Noosphere

and says 'give this stalker everything he asks for'

[somber hedge]

the C-Con couldnt do it

[normal drum]

Because that's her ideology - to make everyone happy no matter what. But unlike the C-Consciousness, it's done with just overseeing humanity, not forcibly removing negative emotions etc.

[normal drum]

Because they didn't have the full control (until the Spark ending)

[stray reef]

Skif and Strelok did capture it from C-Con. I thought her ideology is 'we can make shitload of money and get leverage over other elites'

typical CEO shtick

I just think 1984 is too ridiculous, although possible based on my understanding of the setting

Or rather boring

[normal drum]

It's more than that. The usage of anomalous energy will make humanity not just thrive, it will result in an overwhelming technological revolution. Those words about conquering the Solar system by Dalin were just an understatement. The reason why it all was kept in secret and the reason why they needed to control the Noosphere firat was to prevent a potential world war. The Generators are too revolutional, too powerful, if other goverments had discovered that, there would've been endless wars for the Noosphere, countless deaths and destruction etc.

To remind, there a lot of Generators all around the world, hidden and ready to start working the moment Project X finishes.

[frosty ridge]

We must discover the lore reason behind Agatha’s strongest ability: making her introductory cutscene play in 3 fps

Maybe that’s why she’s after the noosphere… to make the whole world play in 3 fps

[stray reef]

dang must be related to my PDA now working in 21 fps

[somber hedge]

I find it poetic that if strelok ending is true, makes it that both endings in SoC were you either kill or join the C-Con are... kinda true

[ornate venture]

dameinu_mookon has been warned

Reason: Bad word usage

[proven wolf]

I did the Strelok ending... didn't like it.... watched the videos for the other endings, didn't like them either, so decided on my own ending and became a stalker

[proven wolf]

The Ultimate 1984.

[somber hedge]

what i dont like is that someone HAS to enter the pod

[strong flume]

I wonder if DLCs will bring in other endings

[strong flume]

So I got a real good question here, what is the gun the ward is using in the first cutscene where you see Faust's men take them out and you get knocked out by Nimble?

There's an ak74u ofc, but the guy inside the building the Skif is about to stab definitely doesn't have an AK

[dull sequoia]

It's a G36 (GP-37 in-game) with the top mount removed. You can make a similar one if you upgrade a regular GP-37 buy adding a rail mount, but the one you refer to seems to have no optical mount whatsoever.

https://www.imfdb.org/images/7/76/S2_g36_cutscene.jpg

A better view from IMFDB.

[strong flume]

Yeah looks like some saiga abomination without the optic mount

[candid pilot]

The real G36 stuff doesnt allow a naked upper receiver, so either you'll have the integrated red dot/scope or you'll have a rail with flipable iron sights at the positions

[dull sequoia]

Maybe that's they called it GP-37, so they can do whatever they want with in in the game.

[strong flume]

Honestly was hoping it'd be some L300 variant yet to be released

Give me more guns to shoot

[candid pilot]

True, and its fully fictional. But just to say it 😉

[dull sequoia]

You can tell the weapon is way too long, especially the barrel, for it to be an LR-300.

[dull sequoia]

Absolutely.

[strong flume]

Yeah but, I mean, with the creative liberties taken by the team with the map and the guns already, I was just thinking it'd be cool

Call it the L301

[dull sequoia]

Actually, I just checked and the LR-300 does have a long-barreled version. However, the stock of an M4-like rifle is pretty easy to spot, and the gun in question doesn't have it. Besides, we already have the HK416. You can say it is a true M4/LR-300 successor in this game.

I would rather see the return of the Abakan. I love that gun in Clear Sky and Call of Pripyat.

[candid pilot]

The AN94?

[dull sequoia]

Yes.

[strong flume]

I want to see just more guns in general including that one, I liked the redundant nature of the weapons from the old triligy, no offense to anyone's favorite guns, but you had the ability to have a favorite gun with the OG trilogy there were arguably the "best" guns but you can still argue your favorite was good enough, in HoC it's just linear firearms till you find a better one inevitably, unless you wanna challenge yourself

[candid pilot]

loved the AN94 into BF4^^

[dull sequoia]

In Bad Company 2, as well.

[candid pilot]

Yeah, but no so proper balanced as later to play IMO

[dull sequoia]

Indeed. It's kind of sad that great weapons like the GP-37 or the LR-300 successor, AR416, and even the AK-74M are no longer endgame worthy. Their nerf feels weird. On the other hand, submachineguns have generally better stats...

[dull sequoia]

I only played the campaigns, no multiplayer, but I'm sure you are right.

[candid pilot]

I found BC2 much more fun to play

Especially into MP the lighthouse map into any mode

You had missed some action fun

[strong flume]

Yeah...I mean I get why we didn't get that many weapons, though GSC has proved they can remove ammo types and can probably add ammo types as well, so who knows in the future, maybe...hopefully the first DLC we get will have a few weapons in store for us to use, and maybe just a weapon balancing patch before then so we can have more weapons be viable, I get having better weapons than the starting weapons, but I do want to have the options for using an AK late game instead of what we gets

[dull sequoia]

I mean, technically, you can use an AK in late game just as you could use a sawn-off in the trilogy in late game, but I wouldn't call it fun.

[strong flume]

I'd call that masochism with extra steps

Though I'll admit, playing the older titles to HoC, the enemies were still kinda tanky sometimes unless you could land headshots

And my fidgety finger does not do panic induced headshotting well

[proven wolf]

I just didn't like the idea behind the artifact either.

It's just silly.

[proven wolf]

No idea.

[somber hedge]

"the artefact that started it all"

even tho the anomalous energy was pretty much very minimal to form an artefact, them trying to turn on the C-Con and doc doing what he did is what created the zone

[proven wolf]

Yup... C-con have a lot to answer for.

They could have made that artefact a legendary one, that could only have collected by killing Strelok, but it shouldn't have been the magical mcguffin to control the whole of the zone.

Just plane silly, and reconnected to lore of SoC.

I hate the story of S2 so so much.

[somber hedge]

not really killing strelok, the artefact should not be a thing, it removed all the mystery of the zone, something before unknown that we didnt knew its nature now suddenly has something that we can use to control it, not all, but a major part of the cosmic horror went away, and all the mystery aswell, part of what made stalker stalker, was the mystery, SoC while explaining alot still left alot unanswered, and stalker 2 came and answered alot, now the zone in my opinion is a solved mystery, and the fact that we dont really have a choice in the ending, becuse we cant chose to leave the zone as is

i hope the DLC's expand the lore by happening after the ending of the game, not during skif journeys or before it, but i bet there will be a DLC were we play as strider, and go to form noontide

and that we bring the original factions to the fore front again

it was alot better when the main factions portrayed how we should treat the zone, "either make it free or fight to destroy it" not how we will control the people

Freedom and duty offer very different views on the zone and 2 completly different solutions, and you can easily relate to one or the other, and even if you dont agree with one side, you can atleast see it as beliveable, i tend to agree with freedom, but i see duty point aswell

while spark and the ward want the same thing, they want to control the zone and its people, but dont agree on how, both have visions of utopia, but dont agree on how

and strelok and skif, again they both want the same thing but in different ways

strelok wants to protect the zone by completly shutting it down and trapping anyone inside of it, while skif wants to set it free

again, you have to chose from, 2 flawed utopias, 1 hell and 1 where you basicaly lose yourself

while in SoC, you either fell for the wish granter, and have to chose to either join the C-Con or destroy it, and at the time it left both endings VERY obscure

and all 3 games, evolved around the actions of strelok

[proven wolf]

Exactly, just like Dr Who, that was the mystery and why he was called Dr Who.... But nah, woke BBC idiots, went and ruined who Dr Who was and the OG was a little black girl, because of course. Thus destroying the very thing that made who he was.... That nobody new who he was, and it was a mystery, that fans discussed for decades.

S2, just had to continue to the story, and pick up from where the Zone would have been, after the death of C-con and the end of them trying to hold back the Noosphere from spilling into the zone.

[proven wolf]

That is something I wouldn't like to see, seeing as Noontide was such a wasted opportunity.

[proven wolf]

The ending was weird in SoC, I just took Strelok, finding a field, a free man again.

But I think part of the problem was, that game was so poorly managed, they just got something together, to shove it out the door. As it took someone coming in from the outside, and just get it sorted.

[somber hedge]

SoC had ALOT of cut content

[shrewd igloo]

the last sequence of the SoC ending is like a dream

[proven wolf]

The was a youtube video of the development process...

Dead city, some valley for some car part...

Lots missing.

[proven wolf]

You don't know what it is.

And it's like C-con could do anything, the all have holes in them.

So I take then ending for what it is, Strelok enjoying his freedom, thinking it's over.

[radiant harness]

lol

lmao

[robust laurel]

This guy really loves believing in his own headcanon

[proven wolf]

Oh look, Mr knows nothing is back.

Straight in with the insults, like the cesspit of a man he is.

[robust laurel]

Dude, it's not an insult, it's a fact — you literally use headcanon all the time, and everyone sees it

[proven wolf]

It's not, it's not my fault your are too stupid to know, that as soon as C-con started the experiment, thet brainwashed everyone around them, setting the tasks...

As stated in the video, showing the C-con rep saying this.

But to you this is head cannon...

Not mention you already stated that you disregard the lore of the original trio...

Just go away and keep your baseless bs opinions to yourself.

[robust laurel]

@nocturne mural

@sharp quartz how long is this guy going to keep breaking the server rules?

[nocturne mural]

stop with the insults of any kind

I ask you for the last time

I can't even go make a tea normally with you guys, wtf

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1254039371955437570/1280437674766766091/attachment-3.gif

[proven wolf]

Says the guy who just stroles in with the head cannon comments.

[nocturne mural]

I dunno what about cannon comments or whatever but no insults can be in here

got it?

[robust laurel]

I’m not the only one here telling you that you have a headcanon. I wish I were the only one saying it, but no.

[nocturne mural]

If you can't talk in here normally, just don't talk

Easy as that

I can also just mute both while I work so that I can monitor that chat after I finish my job

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1238970017329189024/1302524795937755188/ezgif-7-5875e47d1e.gif

[robust laurel]

If you don’t accept the events of S2 as canon because ‘you don’t like them’ or even worse, ‘they don’t match the previous canon,’ then go to the trilogy chat #👓trilogy-lore-and-story and don’t break the server rules here—this includes insults and off-topic messages. This channel is about the lore of S2, not the trilogy. Stick to the topic of the channel

[proven wolf]

Don't care.

If you want to talk lore, then do so...

Then cut out all the bs you throw into it.

And get it into your head, the I disregard a lot of HoC's lore, because to me it's retcon bs fanfiction written by teenagers., and I don't disregard the lore from SoC...

And us two not agreeing on the lore of something we both love, just highlights how poor the writing in S2 is, as we should both be singing from the same page.

And we are not, because of all the crap retcons.

[nocturne mural]

Well

HoC is a canon, cause, I mean, it is?

No matter if you like it or no?

I mean, it is from GSC

So it is a canon, no?

Anyway, I just don't want to see any insults in here, that's it

[robust laurel]

Is it a rule violation if all a person does in the chat is complain about not liking the plot without any arguments and say that the old trilogy is better? Shouldn’t such a person be in #👓trilogy-lore-and-story

[nocturne mural]

I dunno actually, it is about s2 lore if you think about it, do you really want to complain all the time?

I mean

One time is pretty much enough?

But on the other hand, it is not a lore talk at all, it's just you don't like it

I mean, just be chill

If you don't like it, okay, whatever, your choice

[robust laurel]

This is exactly what I’m talking about—everyone already understands that he doesn’t like the story of S2, so why keep writing it? It just creates a toxic atmosphere

[nocturne mural]

No need to tell other people what is right and what is not

Just keep it chill

I think it concludes it, cause I won't be that active in here in the next few hours

Or I hope, that it concludes it

[robust laurel]

So if you don’t like the retcon, then just don’t stay in this chat. This chat is for those who accept the new lore—you are literally breaking the server rules. Yes, it’s a ‘headcanon’ because you openly said you don’t accept the new canon. But it is canon regardless of whether you like it or not. We are here discussing S2 based on its canonical events, while you are trying to impose your own version of the story, ignoring the facts of Stalker 2. So why are you even in this chat if you don’t like the story of Stalker 2 and don’t accept its events as canon? What exactly do you want to discuss here then? We understood 100 messages ago that you don’t like it, but you shouldn’t impose your headcanon on others as the truth, let alone call them stupid for it.

[nocturne mural]

Yeah, okay, you should stop as well

You guys, just chill for god's sake

[robust laurel]

I understand. But it’s annoying when people call me stupid just because I accept Stalker 2 as canon

[nocturne mural]

Understandable, but I think he got the point

[robust laurel]

Judging by the clown emoji on the message, not really

[normal drum]

Claiming headcanon to be true and spreading it among the people is misinformation and consequently - an offtop.

[gusty lotus]

It’s not that deep. People are free to express S2 lore how they want correct or not. That is the point of this channel but attacking each other over video game lore is childish

[robust laurel]

The problem is that this guy is spreading misinformation on this channel because, as he openly said, "Stalker 2 is fanfiction." He doesn’t accept its events as canon at all. And when I said that he is using headcanon, he just called me stupid because I accept the events of Stalker 2 as canon.

[normal drum]

A person had been repeating the same message "S2 lore is bs" for months, denying everyone else's arguments without trying to argue with a contra-argument, is this normal here?

[gusty lotus]

And it is their choice whether they want to believe him or not. It’s obvious the game is and will be canon made by GSC going forward.

Also deathgaurd has already been previously warned/muted for such behaviors

[sharp quartz]

While it's not personal threats - everything good

it's literally point of discussion

[robust laurel]

Ignoring the facts of Stalker 2 is offtop for this channel

[normal drum]

Shouldn't certain emoji reactions be considered a personal assault, too?

[sharp quartz]

If spreaded for a period of time - yeah

If we talk about clown emoji

[robust laurel]

@sharp quartz
Take a look at this and the below.

[sharp quartz]

I'm too sick right now, you will be muted both.
So cool the hell up

[robust laurel]

[proven arrow]

[slow light]

People are free to say what they want

Stop with the cringe gate keeping mentality

[proven arrow]

i agree with this guy above me

[normal drum]

Freedom of speech when bad faith comes in: 😨

[slow light]

Haven’t you been told to stop being a prick?

[robust laurel]

What’s wrong with what he wrote? Everything is on point. If you want to discuss Stalker 2, then accept all its events as canon. If you don’t like that some events aren’t canonical, then this isn’t the place to discuss that, because this chat is about the lore of Stalker 2 plus the original trilogy—not “we don’t accept Stalker 2 lore because it contradicts the trilogy, so we’ll treat the trilogy as canon and only accept Stalker 2 events that match the trilogy.” That’s just unconstructive.
People often come here to ask questions about Stalker 2 lore specifically, not the trilogy, and instead they get false answers based on outdated information from the trilogy, not Stalker 2, distorting the facts just because someone doesn’t like the retcon.

[slow light]

“False answers based on outdated information from the trilogy”

Considering S2 would never have been without the trilogy, the information is not outdated nor irrelevant

[normal drum]

.

[robust laurel]

Literally, that guy wrote that he considers Stalker 2 non-canon and fanfiction. And secondly, Stalker 2 has quite a few retcons, so yes, a lot of information is outdated regardless of the trilogy being released first. One doesn’t logically follow from the other.

[slow light]

Channel design on Discord does not negate the fact that S2 is a direct sequel with references to the original games therefore causing the lore of both games to coincide and be relevant in discussions irregardless of which of the four games are originally used to create a discussion

Natural conversation flow means the four games coincide as do the discussions surrounding lore

If this was a reboot and not a sequel then I’d be inclined to agree, but that isn’t the case

Using other media as an example; Scream 5&6 ruined the Scream movie franchise lore due to retcons but they were sequels not complete remakes and therefore arguments are valid. The same applies here

[robust laurel]

Do you realize that there are a lot of things that literally don’t match, like the lore of the zombified or a hundred other things? Should I make a list of all the contradictions for you or what?

[slow light]

You should respect that people are naturally going to draw comparisons and thus complain because this is a direct sequel, instead of thinking you have a right to gatekeep a particular channel because it doesn’t fit your narrative

[normal drum]

That's why the trilogy lore channel exists for, if someone dislikes "retcons", no one is stopping them to write there.

[slow light]

Nobody is stopping them from doing it here either

Who are you to dictate that?

[robust laurel]

Complaining is one thing, but it’s a different matter when someone deliberately misleads people who are interested in the lore of Stalker 2 specifically, not the trilogy. That person clearly said that Stalker 2 isn’t canon for them, and that’s exactly the problem. There’s a separate chat for the trilogy. This chat is for Stalker 2 plus the trilogy. But the trilogy doesn’t take precedence over Stalker 2 here.
So all events—I emphasize, all events—of Stalker 2 are canonical for this chat, whether people like it or not. And if someone publicly tries to deliberately mislead people here, that’s a violation and off-topic for this chat.

[normal drum]

Not I created that channel.

[robust laurel]

Because this is a Stalker 2 lore chat, not the trilogy. The trilogy is taken into account, but it isn’t the basis.

[slow light]

It’s not misleading unless someone does it in a toxic way in which case that’s what moderators are there for. But people are more than free to discuss the lore of all games in this channel as it is again only natural given that it’s a sequel

The only time it becomes a problem is when the conversation does not derive from S2 lore discussions and/or when it becomes a toxic mess

[nocturne mural]

Just as I said, don't insult each other and that's it

[robust laurel]

Next time a newbie comes here and asks something like, "Why is the Doctor Faust?" I’ll reply:
Don’t worry, my friend, Stalker 2 is fanfic lol, it’s full of retcons, you’re playing a dumb game with a dumb story. But the trilogy—oh, my beloved trilogy!—let’s discuss that instead, or better yet the dev docs or builds of SoC, right here in the Stalker 2 story chat.

[sharp quartz]

I'm tired

[slow light]

Reading comprehension clearly isn’t one of your strong suits given everything that was said

[ornate venture]

truewhiteperson has been muted for 2 hours

Reason: touch the grass, stop this spam shitshow

Muted until · Nov 19, 2025, 10:04 PM

[warm rapids]

Not sure if this is accurate but does monolith operate like a hivemind where if one sees you then the rest can too? If so, it would make fights against monolith way harder since they would coordinate better

[proven arrow]

no way...

@robust laurel L

[sharp quartz]

You want to be next?

[proven arrow]

we are best friends mods need to chill

[normal drum]

They all were psi-influenced in the same way (except Faust), and the Monolith doesn't give any personalised orders, but they still act individually. They were most probably given direct orders from the C-Consciousness through a Visiograph or the Monolithian PDA network, but they operate independently on the field, that's why they still need commanders. Faust is an exception because he wasn't brainwashed but was directly connected to the Monolith program network, giving him an ability to feel, to "see" all his "brothers" (as we discover it in the Swamps). The voice from Strider's flashback might come from either the Monolith program (in this case we assume there is a supercomputer, probably in the Red Fortress, that calculates strategies from what a person sees and then assists them on the battlefield) or Faust, "The Voice of the Monolith" who could use his controller abilities or/and his Monolith program connection to communicate with the Monolithians.

[sharp quartz]

I'm pretty like to share mutes

[proven arrow]

yeah sure you can mute me i was going to nap

[proven arrow]

https://tenor.com/view/scared-dog-shivering-dog-dog-shaking-meme-gif-26566244

[sharp quartz]

There's a small fun fact.
I like to mute people for 1000days 🤌🏻

So let's be normal here in communication

[proven arrow]

okay i will not escalate this further, should be your job to avoid that but you dont seem competent

[proven wolf]

@warm rapids They could also possible recieve orders directly from C-con, or possible other directly into the head through PSI fields as shown at the end of clear sky. When the monolith sniper received target aquasitions via a voice in his head.

[sharp quartz]

0 from 10 bait, so lame bro.
But it became offtopic

[somber hedge]

its his job to not escalate but doesnt mean he has to accept when people are rude to him, the other dude was told multiple times to chill and he didnt

like when we were talking about the zombified, remember in stalker its alot about perspective, and we have the C-Con that has everything to gain from us believing on them, this is why i dont believe in subtle matter, and why i dont believe that the zombified are in a dream state

its why i dont believe neither spark or ward, and yes the ninth had braindamage, dude was brainwashed, and yes i killed him as any decent human being should

[cold quarry]

(Ninth was a good dude; you meant Kvashka on the roof, right?)

[somber hedge]

no the monolithian that kidnapped that stalker in a mission you do for the technician

[cold quarry]

(he saved the guy whose group was attacked by mutants)

[somber hedge]

he didnt save the guy he kidnapped him, left the other one for death, when you arrive at the house the dude in the bad is literaly telling you where he is

when you kill him you see on his PDA that he accepted to join again with the monolithians that are going around trying to bring the monolith back, and putting a bad name on noontide

[cold quarry]

(have you not talked to the guy at Lens after he recovered? without killing Ninth?)

[somber hedge]

ofcourse not, i always kill him, he's literaly praying for the monolith to give him strenght to fight the monolith enemies

bro is a gunpowder barrel waiting to explode

[cold quarry]

(interesting that you have the Noon tag and not curious about his side of the story, but I digress)

[normal drum]

So you haven't even tried to look at the situation from Ninth's perspective?

It's your right to not believe him, but it's essential to know both sides of the conflict.

[somber hedge]

he's a brainwashed monolithian, that still prays to the monolith

i dont need much more evidence against him

[proven arrow]

Yeah i get it lol
I know the other dude personally and i was dunking on him being muted, then the mod comes along threathening with a 1000 days mute? He sounds exactly like those cringe "you dont want to see me angry" werewolf shitposts but this time its not a shitpost hes being for real

https://tenor.com/view/goku-rules-rule-1-dont-make-me-mad-rule-one-dont-make-me-mad-gif-8390529366396374891

[somber hedge]

right but the mod doesnt know that

[proven arrow]

Read again from the mute message, he said "i'm pretty like to share mutes"

And the 1000 day mute event happens after that

He wasnt uninformed, he was just looking for the smoke

[gusty lotus]

https://tenor.com/view/the-alpha-is-typing-sigma-beta-alpha-gif-15085961505239595360

[somber hedge]

lmao even tho i killed the ninth lens said i helped him lol

[proven wolf]

Their brains are fried, and no coming back.

[proven wolf]

WTF?

[strong flume]

I do believe that a lot of quests are bugged RN so not surprising

[strong flume]

I always thought that maybe if you took the zombified out of the zone for long enough they'd be cured or maybe be a bit more human but then again there's apparently STALKER agents on the mainland doing who knows what who knows where so

[proven wolf]

Actually, the video I remember seeing regarding C-con giving monolithtarget acquisitions maybe an edited video, so not correct...

But I do have a feeling that I spoke about this before and I can't find the video...

But C-con could do some funky shit...

[proven wolf]

As far as I am aware, there was no hope, their brains literally got fried...

Monolith on the other hand, still had a consciousness to work with, and once outside a PSI field, there programming would start to waver.

It's why they was ordered to prey near PSI emmitors, to keep brainwashing up.

[strong flume]

Yeah true, I just like to wonder what happens if you take a zombie out of the zone

Monolithians I get need their psi emitters and such due to them not being programmed but basically brain washed, but STALKER agents leaving the zone and doing who knows what on the mainland is something that is quite a loose end that never got closed, like those are programmed sleeper agents waiting to blow at a moments notice

[terse mirage]

Give it time. If ||The Skif Ending|| is Canon, then GSC doesn't have any choice but to ||Go outside of the Zone for Stalker 3||

[strong flume]

If we're talking about canon endings, honestly I only see Skif or Strelok endings as possibly canon, the other two are nice, but in the long run, they don't make much sense to me, Korshunov ends the zone, and that's basically it, and Scar turns us all into zombies, nobody lies though, they just kinda monkey paw us with what they do

[dull sequoia]

If that happens, it becomes just another post-apocalyptic shooter, with no identity anymore. But we'll see.

[terse mirage]

That depends if it still follows the Story. If Strelok gets his way, you CANT make another story unless its a sequel to Skif's because no on would be able to get inside the Zone. If we go with Skif's ending, the Zone becomes World-Wide. The story can continue limitlessly. Either that or they just leave it at Stalker 2, finish its development and call it quits.

[dull sequoia]

What stops Skif from making friends with other Stalkers or Ward or Duty or Freedom and assaulting Strelok's "fortress" and murdering him in his pod? It's not like Strelok didn't do the same in Shadow of Chernobyl, by himself... Strelok's tactic in his ending of Stalker 2 is far from foolproof, in my opinion.

[terse mirage]

Think about it this way. If Scar could control what Skif saw in his ending, what's stopping Strelok from doing the same or siccing Monolith on him like dogs?

[dull sequoia]

How many monolithians did Skif kill by himself while on his way to the pods, including the famed Granite Squad? I don't think there are enough monolithians doing Strelok's bidding to overcome the rest of the factions in the Zone.

The Ward faction itself might be enough to wipe out the remaining monolithians.

[terse mirage]

That's a fair point. Skif did go crazy againsy Granite canonically. But what's your counter point on the Psi-Illusions?

[dull sequoia]

Psi-Illusions in Scar's ending. Did Strelok do the same? It didn't look like it.

If Strelok wanted to control Skif, he could have just make him immediately friendly to the monolithians waithing for him outside. Instead, they drew weapons at each other, until Strelok controlled the monolithians and told them to stand down.

[terse mirage]

You are not considering a what if, Firebone.

If Strelok really wanted to, with everything he has available to him, could do it. He could also possibly spam emissions, alter the Zone's landscape, control Mutants, the list of possibilities goes on.

[dull sequoia]

That's a big if. We absolutely do not know what he can and cannot control, other than monolithians. I'm more of a regular kind of guy and I will say this:

https://tenor.com/view/he's-just-a-dude-jimmy-elvis-the-alien-he's-just-some-guy-he's-a-regular-joe-gif-13650282664843618926

[terse mirage]

I have to consider all possibilities. Planning can keep you safe in the long run. But it can also get you killed. In the end, all I can assume is, whatever happens happens, right?

[dull sequoia]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pafG42HIrVE

[terse mirage]

Such is the Will of The Zone.

[dull sequoia]

Skif in the pod, shutting everyone mind's off when he just wants some rest for a couple of hours: "Buh bye!"

[terse mirage]

Skif takes a rest and all of Monolith become Noontide again, freaking out. Running around screaming and looking at their hands like...it happened again?

[dull sequoia]

After 8 hours: Hey, back to work!

[strong flume]

I mean the way Richter and the rest talk about it, the Red Fortress and the Generators sound like the last hold outs of Monolithians after you deal with Dalin in general, like, their numbers were already bad before turning back to Monolithians, they have no way of reinforcing their numbers either, I know gameplay wise there'd always be enough Monolithians to fight but statistically, we're fighting the last Monolithians and theoretically, they'd run out quick, especially when we've singlehandedly dislodged them from two of their bases, one of which none of them could've thought we'd even be able to get to

Like they have no way of making more Monolithians, in any way, the brain scorcher is long gone and X19 is not only buried under rubble in the current setting, but the towers probably used to emit the psi waves to fry stalkers or turn them into Monolith soldiers and STALKER agents are also half destroyed, there's no way to reinforce any of Monolith's numbers once they've been reactivated, so unless some madlad finds a super psi field device the X labs didn't think to activate, or isn't already scavenged or destroyed, Monolith is probably a pushover faction by any other faction by the endgame if they're willing to sacrifice a few squads and positions to do so, especially Duty or Freedom, I say the only reason they really did the damage they did is cause of the shock and awe factor of them reactivating in a way, they were people's guides, and guards and squadleaders and people with knowledge and skill to be useful, blending in and suddenly they went from the town pacifist to taking down the town's best guns in a single firefight by themselves

[dull sequoia]

Yes, it also depends how big was Noontide, actually. I'd say their numbers weren't numerous to begin with.

Personally, I think Ward alone can wipe out the remaining monolithians. Not to mention if they ally themselves with Duty, Freedom or even the Military-like faction, I forgot its name.

[strong flume]

IPSF

Like don't get me wrong, I have no doubt a Monolithian can probably take down a squad or two of eager stalkers or ward soldiers in a proper firefight, especially when they've shock and awed the entire zone from being magically reactivated with no warning, but by the time their shock factor is done, and the zone especially Duty and or Freedom or Ward gets a footing to fight back, they're in trouble, cause unlike before where their ranks could just be filled by more adventurous and daring stalkers thinking they're the next main character, they're scattered and have no way of reinforcing anyone, and they have no safe haven really, no X19 and brain scorcher to keep everyone back and away from their main hubs to where all they need to do is plug a few gaps with men and nobody can get through, they're completely open

[frosty ridge]

I can save all the Monolithians by rizzing up Faust and convincing him nicely to turn off the Signal

[strong flume]

Just rizz Faust before he decides to leave Wild Island

[frosty ridge]

hey baby your brilliance is blinding haha oh oh im so sorry no thats my fault i didnt realize

[strong flume]

Damb I'm rizzed

[proven wolf]

That is the last thing I world want, personally

It would just mean, a place that's been in so many other games.

The zone is unique, in its style, location and feel.

[proven wolf]

I'm surprised, that you can't go back to the dish and turn it off...

Just one switch, and the networks off again.

[stray bridge]

https://youtu.be/5FWrwkcglTs?si=-x38QAvNVBOlobAR

[strong flume]

Which disk are you referring too?

[twilit adder]

Didn’t he say it would take a week to fix? That would mean he at some point gets it fixed and turns off the back up again

[proven wolf]

Dish.

The one that turns the monolith network back on.

[proven wolf]

Well, he's not wrong.

Points out a lot of what I have been saying.

And I didn't even know about the video.

Like I have said. I gave up on the story as soon as monolith came back.

[strong flume]

Oh, that shit gets reactivated cause we bring back an alpha artifact that was created by Dalin and his desperation, and Dalin decides to use it to connect to the Generators and the Noosphere remotely, basically he created a wireless connection to C-Con by accident? I honestly don't know, knowing Dalin he could've planned it all along or just bumbled into it like Dalin does, so there's not necessarily an off button

Dalin does that honestly, he's so desperate to see his father again that he just does things by accident cause he's tunnel visioned on either surpassing his father or seeing his dad again, there's points where you can see he's trying to surpass him but you can see he's still a kid wanting to seek his father's approval

[proven wolf]

Not sure C-con could have done anything.

I think it's the case the faust takes control of monolith... being a super control thing...

It all falls apart, when he dies...

Ahhhhhh it's all a mess.

[strong flume]

Not really, it's kind of more so that Faust planted emitters literally everywhere noontide was and it's even made clear that the Sphere just turned into a giant psi emitter to catch the signal from the SIRCAA event and amplify and turn all ex Monolithians, the only ones who were/could have been safe were in the scientist bunkers, and Hermann didn't help matters any, he basically gave Faust everything he needed in return for Faust ambushing peeps who had the artifact scanners in an ever so desperate attempt to get an alpha artifact for himself and prove he's the greatest scientist of the zone, meanwhile Faust used that and just had to sit and wait for the SIRCAA event to unfold, he knew all he had to do was wait, cause he set everything else up for that to explode

Hell not only Faust, but Scar and Spark did so too, and at the Sphere the head officer was actually an ex monolithian who Faust slipped a psi emitter too with the instructions of "Hey plant this into the sphere and wait for the signal, we'll be reunited with the Monolith again" which was Faust's whole goal, he saw that freedom from the Monolith was weakness and death, before every Monolithian agreed and followed every order no matter the sacrifice and problem, now he's got random followers he recruits who agree with him while a majority see him as some crazy uncle blabbering nonsense and even those guys are divided amongst themselves with staying with Noontide, or going their own way to just being a little friendly splinter faction of noontide with quiet and them

And once that signal activates, I.E. Dalin turning on the Generators and reconnecting with the Noosphere from a wireless connection to the Generators thanks to the Alpha Artifact we gave him and literally chased down the entire first half of the game, it almost factory resets every Noontider into being a Monolithian again (there were a few who escaped it tho by being in scientist bunkers) and it's not like the signal is permanent either, and there's times when the signal does start to wear off a bit, we see this if we go to get a Monolith healing device from under a bus stop that was once a Monolith stash, if you sneak into the facility they're all kind of in a daze, even the Ninth is there and he's praying for one of his brother's to be healed, while the brother wakes up saying he had a nightmare of being a Noontider again, and a few other Monolithians do the same, the brain washing has them back as Monolithians completely and with the Sphere being turned into a makeshift brain scorcher I guess you could say for a time, that could only effect ex Monolithians and Faust and Scar spreading those psi emitters all over the zone, it got pretty much every ex Monolith soldier in the zone

So basically there was no way to turn it off, and even if you did somehow magically do so, the damage was done, Strider, The Ninth, everyone who turned had no way of changing back, they were back as if they were in the SoC days

[stray bridge]

I still think they should at least do more with Monolithians instead of "lets repeat trilogy "

[strong flume]

Well you gotta remember that the Monolithians in the main storyline are simply a shock and awe weapon used by Scar to advance his plans on bringing back C-Con, and well Faust planned to bring them back so they could all be united and then he could try and turn more people into Monolithians probably with the Duga once Scar activates that

[stray bridge]

They could make some monoliths turn and other not , so this way player gets a choice to aid them or something

But for me story is the weakest point. Starting from the Zones map overall, Clear Sky and Ccon being in contact since CS and Scar being an agent since CS ...

[strong flume]

There are Monolithians who didn't turn, but their numbers are so small that it's basically like asking for a squad to fight an army, the one we meet was on our mission to find the guy trying to get into Lamansk the only way he made it through the signal was from being in a scientist bunker, it protected him

He's the only one we know so far that wasn't affected, but we can assume there's probably one or two others, but like I said, the Sphere was turned into a giant basically signal amplifier and Faust and Scar we found out spread more emitters around just cause they wanted to ensure they got as many Noontiders and ex Monolith soldiers as possible

[stray bridge]

They should have gone half-half, some fell under influence of Faust others resisted or something like that. It could allow players to try to aid ex monoliths turn their "friends" back

[strong flume]

That's a change to the entire storyline in a way, they didn't have a choice in the end that's why they're Monolith again, most wouldn't have chose to join Monolith in fact we know of only like 10 ex noontiders or ex Monolith soldiers who sided with Faust, the rest just saw Faust as some angry and crazy uncle who needed to just be put back in their chair while screaming

[stray bridge]

Also as he pointed out Skif was just way over his head from being a nobody to becoming a guy who decides the fate of the world

[strong flume]

Skiff was played from the beginning like he was over his head the moment he got in the truck with Hermann

[stray bridge]

Syndrome of Chosen One of video games

[strong flume]

Hermann even admits he suspected we had the artifact he so desperately needed to prove he was the best scientist and Dalin should kiss his shoes basically, but he had a deal with Faust and in a way, he tried to honor it, but because he's Hermann his ego messed it up for him before he could even realize what was happening Faust took the scanner and artifact and basically told him, "want your part of the deal? Why don't you come find me and see if you can get it"

[strong flume]

Honestly Syndrome of the character just trusting people, like 90% of all the people we're dealing with were criminally untrustworthy back in the original trilogy series and guess what? Surprisingly they're still criminally untrustworthy, they just have a silver tongue and a monkey paw in their back pocket

[stray bridge]

I meant more where they put the player in that role by some reasons

Bascially I didn't like lore and story at all coming from Trilogy and playing them since they released. OG story wasn't mindblowing lets be honest. But it had continuinity and tied in with other games to some extent. But S2 chased nostalgia path to appease the og players but then suddenly decided to twist and change stuff because drama or something

[strong flume]

Yeah true, but that's just about the same for all STALKER characters, only difference is Skiff isn't a part of the original trilogy, the real flaw of Skif is just being trusting of people, everyone uses Skif, the Ward, Spark, Strelok, Doctor

[stray bridge]

OG characters didn't really affect the planet, they shaped the Zone to some extent

I get ya' Strelok was used as Scar was

But here Skif decided the fate of the worlf by the end

[strong flume]

Like Strelok was chosen one cause he miraculously survived a truck and went on to destroy the C-Con physically, Scar was a chosen one who survived an emission in the swamps then led and expidition to the CNPP to try and save the entire zone from an emission crisis and the Major...I honestly I guess he's the one guy who really wasn't trying to do much besides save some helicopter crews

[stray bridge]

Scar should have just stayed KIA/MIA in S2, because it feels they just brought him back for being a cool character that people loved from trilogy

[stray bridge]

They were special characters true, but they were just random stalkers that shaped the events in the Zone ....not the World as Skif did

[strong flume]

It's only the world if you do the Doctor ending, it's really just which one did you choose

If you chose the doctor ending then yeah, it affects the world cause we decide to join C-Con and fix what the Doctor broke and gave an extra mind to the C-Con hivemind, but if you do every other one, the zone is the only thing affected

[stray bridge]

Especially Streloks ending, where he just banishes everyone from the zone

I don't know which ending GSC takes as canon but the ward one seemed okay

[strong flume]

Nah he tells everyone who shouldn't be there to GTFO and if you insist on staying you're trapped inside

[stray bridge]

Well there is almost no reason to stay is it

[strong flume]

I mean peeps like Skiff stay and I can bet those who made lives in the zone probably chose too, only peeps who left were probably military and ward

[stray bridge]

But you can no longer leave , which means no more supplies in and out

[proven wolf]

Yeah, but we know that Monolith outside of PSI fields, the brainwashing dissipates...

Hence the PSI immiters used as praying stations, it kept the monolith brainwashed.

Once the Sphere, Duga, and immiters shut down, and monolith would have started not being Monolith again...

The game shows none of this.

As the only thing devs cared about was bring back Monolith again, because it's story built on member berries.

The Wish Granter, from what I remember from SoC, didn't control Monolith at all, it was just a trap set to lure Stalkers. Turn them into agents and Monolith.

And we know that C-con could affects people minds, coz the absorb everyone that was working for them, when the first experiment went live.

As they released an psi-emmision and brain washed everyone near CCNP.

HoC breaks this, It makes the Wish Granter more than it was.

The PSI emitters never did anything than keep the brainwashing up, and the PDA's were basic one, and Monolith were brainwashed to follow orders without question.

[strong flume]

Maybe rookies and peeps who had lives outside but most of the people in the zone to begin with are there for a reason, they're criminals or just people who have nowhere else to go and can't go back, that's why they've come to the zone in the first place

[stray bridge]

Hoc breaks many things. Zone map being the first. Why is Zaton all the way down south, why is Brain Scorcher to the West blocking nothing at all, why don't artifacts don't work outside the zone? Makes artifacts useless to sell to the outside world, Ward and Spark felt like they were tacked on to the story , why did Clear Sky fight the Monolith and vice versa in Clear Sky events when they did "work" together to stop Strelok

many things are weird

[proven wolf]

The curse of the member berries.

Lots of the old stalkers would have died or left...

With C-con dead, no one was able to stop the Noospere from spilling through...

S2 should have an anomaly fuelled, mutant filled, hell scape, and SIRCAA just wouldn't have existed there.

[stray bridge]

I get all that , but life in the zone will not be sustainable when you can't get the supplies from outside world (guns , food, equipments, clothing) where eventually stalkers will run out of everything

[strong flume]

Well you gotta try to shut down the Sphere and that's easily missable, the Duga only gets activated after you activate it and it's gotta be confirmed that if a Monolith soldier is away from a psi emitter they are cured of being a Monolithian, though you gotta remember what I said, if you played the game long enough and got to the bus station Monolith Stash to try and help the Doctor save Strider, you realize they're all remembering being Noontiders and some are even saying they have nightmares or dreams of it and don't know what to do while others tell them it's all fake, to banish those thoughts etc. and no it doesn't make the wish granter anymore special than what it was, it's deactivated in order to use the Alpha Artifact to connect with the generators, you gotta play the game a bit and pay attention to what's happening instead of focusing on "Nothing will make sense cause it's not the trilogy and I don't care" if you take that mindset away it'll start to fall into place, as Dalin only uses the wish granter to prove the alpha artifact works and it for a time turns Skif even but Dalin shuts it off and we're cured and found to have injured a Ward officer trying to help us, and we're shown that Faust's followers had Monolith PDA's and other Noontiders too, so it shows that if the PDA's were emitters used to keep their brainwashing up, they'd all have them

[proven wolf]

And supplies came in, because artifacts came out.

[stray bridge]

so many plot holes

I agree with you, some characters would have left the zone by S2, or died. Some changed their ideals 180 degrees since trilogy and feel like they were re-written, some were brought back from the dead....if this was a reboot I wouldn't mind this

[proven wolf]

If the was permanently Monolith away from PSI fields, the what's the point of getting Monolith to pray to them, psi immiters? Complete waste of time and effort then.

Agents can go anywhere, because their process is entirely different, aka the TV's...

Where as monolith, don't need that...

[strong flume]

Exactly that'll be the fate of everyone who stays, they'll have to eat mutants, make their own gear and adapt or die cause again supplies are cut off, that's an ending where you basically condemn the zone to consume itself

[stray bridge]

Yes, so every sane stalker would leave then. You can't live forever there. So basically Zone is "gone"

[ornate venture]

deathguard75 has been warned

Reason: Bad word usage

deathguard75 has been warned

Reason: Bad word usage

[proven wolf]

I wouldn't have minded a reboot. If they put the effort in and made it some serious 4D chess going on with C-con at the centre, masterminding it all and some sh1tty 2nd rate corporate garbage company with someone like Agatha at the front.

[stray bridge]

If you wrote any messages before that , they are not showing

Reason : Bad word usage

If this was a Reboot (it would have been better if it was) then I wouldn't care about what they did to the lore

As it's a reboot, but S2 story as is .....craps all over the OG lore

[proven wolf]

PDA's were not immitters.

If they were then this pda log from a Monolith who fell behind wouldn't have started losing his faith and letting the evil in.

" Brothers, the Monolith put my faith to the test, and I nearly strayed from the path. But I withstood! Glory to the Monolith! Its trials strengthen us! We were on our way back from the Dark Valley, and I fell behind. Evil grabbed at the opportunity and started tempting me. And... I doubted. The image of truth became distorted; the enemy whispered into my ear lies about how the Monolith uses us as slaves. But then I realized - it's a trial! I remembered the glory and the splendor of the Monolith. I regained my inner strength and my confidence. Since then I have no fear of any trials and know no doubts. Glory to the Monolith!

("On the test of faith")"

It's PSI-fields and why immiters are thing, otherwise what's the point.

[proven wolf]

It was basically the same, wolfed for the proper spelling of sh1tty.

[stray bridge]

Ah I see

Maybe they will do DLC some justice or create even more plot holes

[proven wolf]

In your opinion, as I think it's absolute garbage fan fiction.

I have been playing stalker since it's release in 2007...

If it's not a reboot keep the lore consistent. It's not hard when you spend £80+ million on developing the thing.

[stray bridge]

Same. Played every game since release and loved it. Story wasn't anything mindblowing but it was more or less consistent

So thats why I said S2 should have been a reboot with all this plot hole, lore ruining stage of a game

[proven wolf]

They even change the lore in different languages.

The UK version, is completely different from the Ukrainian version.

So they couldn't even keep the SoC lore between different languages consistent.

[stray bridge]

[proven wolf]

Reboot, yeah, but not with this story though.

[stray bridge]

Lets be fair. OG games had some inconsistencies but nothing that made you scratch your head and checking if you are actually playing Stalker game

[proven wolf]

They wasn't perfect, but that was probably down to the game being so poorly managed...

Nothing changes.

[stray bridge]

Well even with this story it wouldn't matter since it's a reboot. But S2 is continuation to Trilogy and they just hired a writter who didn't even boot up the OG

More like he picked up bits and pieces of story from forums and wiki lol

[proven wolf]

Should have played the game to death... and moved the story on.

With C-con gone, the zone should have been a hell scape.

Noontide hiding in this mutated hell scape, to escape persecution, o ly the hardest of STALKERS remaining...

New and horrific mutants... not just a stag... like WTF!

[proven wolf]

Exactly how they did it.

And they left no mysteries for us to debate...

Why try and answer everything?

Instead of discussing the mysterious, we are fighting over lore, cos it's so inconsistent.

It's sad.

[stray bridge]

Yeahy since Ccon is gone , zone should be more wild and unstable....they could have made more alien zone with this lore direction.

But they went in with....whatever this current story is

[proven wolf]

Yeah.... they literally changed nothing, added nothing... neutered to main factions.

Noontide great.
Ward, garbage boring corrupt corpos.

I new mutant, some different weapons...

If S2 was a beer, it would be the weakest pint of pee water ever...

Like zero effort put in, and just rehashing already established stuff.

To me, it falls so short of what the game deserves...

It's unique setting, feel, lore...

It deserved so much more...

I hate the story in S2.

[stray bridge]

• Ward - Duty 2.0
• Spark - Freedom 2.0
• Zone Map completely different from trilogy (ruining the established lore from OG)
• Revived characters
• Old characters that changed their ideals completely since OG
• Lore inconsistencies
• Scar brought back for nostalgia sakes
• Weird story
• Old factions set aside and don't play any significant role in story or sidequests. Etc etc

[proven wolf]

That's the word, the entirety of S2 was built on nostalgia bait...

Nostalgia, that word....

Is the thing I hate most in modern entertain... It's like people think that nostalgia bait will fix everything, be the backbone of everything...

It ruins everything, I don't want nostalgia, I want a consistent continuation of what I love, with respect it deserves.

Nostalgia bait... grrrrrrrrr

[stray bridge]

They should have just continued with what they had

Also why use the 10 year gap between OG and S2

[proven wolf]

No idea, as the really never explored what happened at the end of SoC....

[vital pollen]

Yeah lol the game is written as if barely any time has passed

[runic ibex]

Whats the lore behind the fire whirl

[proven wolf]

No idea.... but I think there were supposed to be more around the zone.

I get the feeling the floating black ball above the lake outside Malachite was meant to be something more.

[dull sequoia]

Doesn't it kill you when you get near it? It looks deadly so I didn't bother to try. 😄

[stray bridge]

Yeah like it was slapped on the last minute for story sake

[somber hedge]

can we all agree that one of the most atrocious retcons of stalker 2, forget the artifacts becoming useless in the mainland completly invalidating the artifact trade, or the fact that SIRCA can print artifacts, they trully butchered clear sky

[candid pilot]

Here I would suggest, that they expand the hall of artifacts into SIRCAA into that way, that all possible artifacts are present, just to have an idea how they look and how many we should expect

[somber hedge]

Nah thats not a good idea at all, the fact that that they have artifacts there showing is alredy bad, it removes some sense of discovery

Plus they look cool as hell, and we need a reason to go look for them

[proven wolf]

You can't get to it, despite being an ex-army boy, Skif swims like a toddler.

[somber hedge]

There are mutants in the water

[twin zodiac]

You do not recognize the mutants in the water

[proven wolf]

But you always drown.

I think swimming should be a mechanic....

Used in emergencies and the threat of mutants.

[smoky hornet]

The water is so irradiated it kills Skif in seconds on full submersion with a fully upgraded Exo

Marine training or not, swimming in the Zone is suicidal

[somber hedge]

Water cant be irradiated, whats in the water tho

[smoky hornet]

Water in fact can be irradiated it just takes a lot of shit

I’d say the Zone passes the threshold of a lot of radioactive shit

[elder bobcat]

The artifact trade doesn't get completely invalidated, them fading with time on the Mainland just creates a higher demand for resupply. SIRCAA spent years to try & synthesize the alpha artifact, the one they truly needed, and in the process managed to create formulas for various ones that can be found in the Zone (theoretically putting them in a beneficial spot market-wise, but that isn't relevant to the story as their goal was never to get the money from artifact synthesis). The way CS plot was integrated in S2 is a meme only if you're familiar with the CS dev process & desdocs — otherwise there are suggestions sprinkled across the trilogy (especially in CoP) that could (and for lots of ppl did) make players genuinely accept this version as is. That's how a large part of the audience was treating Lebedev & co for years anyway without giving it all a deeper thought.

[somber hedge]

My tought is that they were rogue cientists from the group, but now the clear sky game makes absolutely 0 sense

Since they are agents of the c-con putting an agent of the c-con (scar) on a mission where tht fight other agents of the c-con trying to stop strelok from entering the center of the zone

It would had been alot cooler if they were rogue agents that understand what the zone is and are trying to stop the C-Con from controllig the noosphere fuckig up the rest of the world

And it kinda does invalidate the artifact trade since, people wont pay huge amounts of money on something that might fade away in a couple of hours or days

There would had been a higher demand for artefacts but the price wouldnt rise becuse the cliet might receive dust or a useless rock

Would you pay alot of money on a shiny rock that might arrive at your place and last 1-3 days at best

What sort of research would you be able to achieve?

[smoky hornet]

I still question where all of you get these timelines for artifact lifespans, we’re never told how long they last afaik

[somber hedge]

And thay timer starts ticking as soon as they leave the perimeter of the zone, what if for some reason a dead drop gets forgoten or there are higher risks due to increased military patrols?

[somber hedge]

Literaly the first cutscene of the game where herman tells you

[smoky hornet]

He does not say a timeline

Also why would you trust a damn thing he says he lies to you repeatedly

[somber hedge]

1- i replayed that part this week

2- the artefact itself you get fades in just a couple of days and its the alpha artifact

[elder bobcat]

May pay less, but will pay nonetheless, hence why the trading will keep going unless the artifacts go extinct altogether. And artifacts are mostly gathered for their properties as well as various unrelated stuff like collecting, scientists would work with both anomalous energy enriched artifacts & whatever is left of em, hence why "selling dummies" is a thing too. It's all fine, my personal gripe with this whole thing is how the question still stands "why/when did artifacts start to lose their properties outside of the Zone?", cuz, unlike the trading matter, that part doesn't have an explanation — even given the Second Caribbean experiment literally exists in lore & would've been a perfect reasoning.

[somber hedge]

We have evidence that what he says is true, and skif goes looking for herman as soon as he loses his apartment, and he has connections with people inside the zone that alredy know herman

[somber hedge]

I dislike it becuse it kinda breaks how the world works, same with other changes in stalker 2

Like its not that huge of a deal tbh, but i dislike it nonetheless, it also opens more trades since now theres also the scannrr business

[elder bobcat]

Doesn't break anything allat much, tho certainly should've been explained instead of just coming off as "it's always been like that, welp, anyway".

[normal drum]

We can assume about "why" that the artifacts are radiating the anomalous energy (thus giving positive/negative effects on people) so eventually they lose all of it if not recharged by an Emission etc.

[elder bobcat]

Plausible, but wasn't the case in the trilogy, hence why there should've been an event outlined past 2012 explaining why the properties of all artifacts have changed in a way that doesn't allow em to contain said energy for long outside of the Zone. The Second Caribbean experiment would've been perfect for that, given how global the impact of it was & how it caused anomalies (and therefore artifacts) to appear outside of the Zone. Such an event could've turned things 180, why not, but it has to be mentioned — otherwise the clash with the trilogy is unavoidable.

[somber hedge]

I hope when the inevitable free play mods come, we get repeatable missions for scanners and diggers stuff

Like, you get an artefact and a scanner and you need to recharge it, and the digger stuff could be finding x eletronics

Ok thats a bit off topic but i wish that would be represented more in gamr

[normal drum]

Yeah, but even if it's just a retcon, it's a good one. The artifacts are obviously valuable outside the Zone. But if they haven't relatively quickly faded there, they would've been even more valuable. Sydorovych would've been a multimillionaire already in 2012, why would've he continued to live in a bunker and not, like, used his money to buy some supplies/men from the Great Land in that case? We do not see that so I' coming to a conclusion that the artifacts weren't that valuable even in the trilogy times so there had to be a reason for it, and fading is a good enough reason.

[normal drum]

Who said Lebedev and others were Agents? Because they weren't, they're just working for them. The main trait of an Agent is that they don't know who they are working for.

[somber hedge]

If a retcon includes "it always has been this ways guys" its not a good one, period

[normal drum]

Then what is a "good retcon"?

[somber hedge]

Sidorovich is alredy rich af in SoC, hes greedy af and he buys out the military by himself to leave the cordon alone

[somber hedge]

In my opinion, none, however i would atleast like an explanation, not a "it alwayd has been this way even tho no evidence pointed that"

[somber hedge]

They can also be called agents, its just thst the word ir mainly used to refer the stalker program

[normal drum]

What about other traders?

[somber hedge]

They probably also do pay off the military surrounding his business, but its sidorovich money alone that prevents rookie villagr from being destroyed by the military

Sidorovich is the richest merchant in the zone (atleast until zalissya is formed), that is not represented in gamr, becuse he is the first trader you meet, but you do ser that his bunker is full of shit he sells

Everyone that entered the zone had to go trough him, artifacts going out were mainly trough him, not to mention hes a known scammer and would constantly ripoff the rookies

[radiant harness]

COP doesnt matter, thats a good retcon

wipe it from existance

the whole thing

[elder bobcat]

It's the one that could've been easily avoided if there was at least a one-liner tying it together with the trilogy 😁

I agree on the trading part in general, cos back then I've always asked myself "if artifacts are those ever-green, extremely useful shiny things & never lose their properties — what's the point of getting another one of those when you can use your thing forever?". When the product is so good it could be used to a great effect limitlessly — that's how the trade would actually stop once all the people with good money get every artifact they want. Won't happen overnight, but a decade or two — and those artifacts would be more common outside of the Zone than they are within the Perimeter 😄 Yet this is why it's also never mentioned in the trilogy just exactly for how long the artifacts get to keep their usefulness — we can only draw a conclusion from various dialogues that it's quite the opposite of what Hermann tells in the S2 intro. Which is why the topic needed to have an explanation, and a perfect one would be "previously artifacts were lasting long & their cost was immense, then this dооfus Dalin went with the Second Carribbean in 2019 & things went to shіt, the entire structure of the Noosphere along with anomalies & artifacts were the same no longer — why do you think the dummie business you were busy with became relevant all of sudden??" etc. Would also go well with what Representative's talking about throughout the Spark path. But oh well 🤷‍♂️

[normal drum]

huh why

[somber hedge]

Common discord mod L

[radiant harness]

COP story sucks

simple as

[somber hedge]

Ofcourse its a brazilian mod with bad takes

[normal drum]

Yeah, it'd be a simple solution, but then it would be needed to be explained how it's working. We know the experiment damaged the Noosphere, but usually the anomalous energy comes from the Noosphere to the physical world, not the other way around so idk 🤷‍♂️

[vapid spire]

CoP's story did suck but I wished its gamplay elements and map sizes were in SoC.

[somber hedge]

If you think about it shouldnt it be cheaper to buy an artifact than send it back for a scanner?

Ok i guess it would depend on the artifact supply, plus the artifacts have more effects that arent relevant for gameplay

I hope theres an artifact to fix ED we need to help our bro's

[elder bobcat]

Now that doesn't need an explanation at all 😁 Anomalies are the Noosphere spawns in the material world, along with the artifacts. The Noosphere essentially stores the "data" for all of it: meddling with the Noosphere you risk to meddle with the "data", which causes transformations/changes & yadda-yadda. It's self-explanatory, you just gotta point a finger at an event cataclysmic enough for such a turmoil to become possible — the Second Caribbean experiment qualifies pretty well, given how it's described & its aftermath.

[radiant harness]

We are not the same

[shrewd igloo]

Good retcons imo:
Zombi thingi
Iron Forest being an actual level
Some areas being more faithful to the real locations and/or being moved to other more "faithful" locations

[somber hedge]

Zombified wasnt a good retcon imo

Before it was a tormented dude that barely had any of his personality left, and couldnt control his actions

Now they are undead, if you believe in subtle matter, if not they are just copies

[normal drum]

It's better to put it like:
If you believe in Subtle Matter, they are undead but their souls suffer in the afterlife. If not, they are tormented dudes that barely had any of their personality left, and couldn't control their actions, but technically there is a copy of their mind which only exists with some Noosphere rearrangements.

[proven wolf]

Maybe in pools and lakes where it can collect, but not rivers etc.

As the it's washed away, preventing lethal build up.

[somber hedge]

also

the medigun from tf2 is canon on stalker 2

[elder bobcat]

They're pretty damn dead when you kill em in the game. Not sure if I missed some wild convos in this chat on the topic, but I wouldn't say they were retconned in any way really, behave pretty much the same as was shown in the trilogy.

[somber hedge]

controllers can ressurrect stalkers that you have killed

and long dead bodies also get back up

[elder bobcat]

I honestly have never encountered that once. It's always been pre-placed zombies (long dead bodies, as you put it) that controller's been raising up, but never the lads who I killed myself. But perhaps I'm just dealing with the critter too fast to see that manifest 🤷‍♂️

[somber hedge]

controllers are alot weaker in s2 aswell

[elder bobcat]

N O P E. Especially not in comparison to ShoC & CS where they don't even have a simple melee attack.

[ornate venture]

midrovar has been warned

Reason: Bad word usage

[somber hedge]

controllers in the triology have an Aura that prevents you from getting closer, and their psi-blast is alot quicker

not to mention that atleast in CoP they stun the stalkers and if the stalker is affected for a time by the controller it will turn against you and shoot you

[elder bobcat]

That "aura" is called "psi-field" & not once has it ever prevented any player from coming up close & simply knifing the poor defenseless guy in 5 secs 😁

The blast is quicker, but it does not stagger the player as much as in S2. Nah, controller is a whole another lvl of threat in comparison to the trilogy: more HP, hurtful melee attack, and you won't get too close anyway cos he hits you with the close range staggering impulse/blast, then a long range staggering blast, gathering zombies around himself & actually hiding behind them, psi-field is just as powerful given in S2 it causes fantoms to appear, who also kick your аss — nah, mate, trilogy controller ain't even close.

EDIT: and on top of that he also zombifies others like in CoP, too! I believe that grifter Zone Slug once had a vid demonstrating this ability with him spawning a controller in the bandit camp in Red Forest — lads did indeed get zombified in real time with animations 'n all & started shooting their former mates. NAAAH, S2 controller clears hard

[proven wolf]

What?

I hate all these Easter eggs.

I just want zone.

[proven wolf]

Master of puppets

[somber hedge]

the way the monolith are able to withstand all the radiation and not care, is becuse they have a healing gun

[strong flume]

Is it me or do the S2 poltergeist feel like they're more accurate with their anomaly attacks like, I'm sorry I feel like the flamegeist didn't pinpoint my exact location to burn me out of cover or just in general with their anomalies in the og trilogy, meanwhile in S2 they feel like they're pinpointing where I'm hiding and where I plan to move too

[jagged hull]

if its not changing how things were in the past then its by definition not a retcon

[dull sequoia]

They do have melee attacks in Clear Sky. Only in Shadow of Chernobyl could you go point blank and troll them with impunity.

[elder bobcat]

You're right, they do have a melee attack in CS! But it's so weak that guess what happens: https://youtu.be/Aq7WtOeuyKs?si=aMsJPv0zfYBh3LiF

[dull sequoia]

Indeed. The melee attack is weak, but, combined with the psi-influence, it gets the job done.

[elder bobcat]

Yea, the bІоwjоb gets done as demonstrated in the easily replicable clip above 😁

[dull sequoia]

Anyway, I agree. The Controller in Stalker 2 is much more dangerous. I like the trilogy a lot more than Stalker 2, but it's best to not be blinded by nostalgia.

The Stalker 2 controller can't be cheesed now that it has the blast attack when you get close to him.

[elder bobcat]

He couldn't be cheesed as easily before the addition of that attack as well, given his melee is like a third of your HP taken in one hit + fantoms dumping magazines in your аss + swarms of zombies he loves to hide behind. Now it's another extra step to overcome and if the medkits in this game weren't as OP as they've always been — he'd probably be the second most dangerous enemy in the game behind Chimera only (for real, that is, cos technically he is the second most dangerous, but has nowhere near as much HP as Chimera or Pseudogiant to make you sweat for minutes, which is good for the gameplay overall, but people will always bring those two tanks above simply because of how spongey they are & how many resources you gotta spend to take em out).

[strong flume]

New boss fight pseudo giant with controller abilities

[somber hedge]

right but it did change..

[jagged hull]

yeah

but do you see how saying that good retcons are not retcons doesnt make much sense

[somber hedge]

becuse no retcon is good, if you need to go back on your story and change something out of the blue to fit your narrative instead of making an explanation on to why things change

[fathom veldt]

resist the change

[proven wolf]

When was this a thing?

[somber hedge]

it was shown in s2

[proven wolf]

I always thought it was because they couldn't feel pain, due to brainwashing... Just just biological unrelenting monsters.

[normal drum]

They don't feel pain, but that's not helping them with radiation-related diseases. Regenerators fix this issue.

[proven wolf]

I know there were some hotspots... But few and far between.

[midnight vault]

Like the last of us "remake" and part 2?

[clever ruin]

Im not sure if this has something to do with lore, but why did monolith go to zalisya?

[normal drum]

It's the shortest and easiest way to reach Duga.

[gaunt gate]

Yeah

[gaunt gate]

That's why we did that

[gentle summit]

so

the artifact that burnt down skifs apartment was a artifact from when the zone came to be?

[strong flume]

It's another alpha artifact so basically not the same, but the same type

[strong flume]

Are you talking about the regenerators? Wasn't that always a thing just hinted at in the OG trilogy or that we got to see? Or was it just that we knew they had advanced healing stuff we just never really got to have it plainly put in front of us

[proven wolf]

Nothing a shot of vodka couldn't fix.

[proven wolf]

The only thing I remember was they felt no pain.

"here are some retards here, they call themselves Monoliths... or someone else started calling them that - well, no matter. Basically, they're not afraid of pain. If they run out of cartridges they jump on you themselves and literally try to gnaw through your throat.

(dialogue with a random Freedomer in Pripyat) "

Not unless I missed something.

[delicate rampart]

Why does certain armors have puffed out sections? Are they for added ballistic protection

[somber hedge]

-_-

[strong flume]

[midnight vault]

Ok so it kinda surprised me that we still have monolithians in CoP, seems like the Monolith program work separately from the brain scorcher.
That make sense to see why there are still so many of them in Stalker.
But it's kinda weird that Monolith stronghold is in the cooling tower region, should that be in Pripyat?

[normal drum]

The main hypothese is that the supercomputer "Skala" is responsible for the Monolith program, that's why the Red Fortress is their stronghold. The program, however, was already turned off in CoP along with the whole X-Network (either with Strelok destroying the Monolith projection or, more probable for me, him turning the X-Network in X7), the monolithians couldn't hear the Monolith anymore and resorted to using preachers to keep their faith.

[median hawk]

Brain scorcher was to keep people out the centre of the zone, where they had the monolith stored, monolithians are still in HoC because what they gonna do? Die off when strelok wrecked C consciousness? Hell no, they were just tools used by them to keep people away

[midnight vault]

So once you turned into Monolithians there's no going back? Then how does Strider and his group exist? I'm kinda confused

[median hawk]

Basically, when strelok killed off c consciousness, their control over monolithians got cut off

[normal drum]

Mind altering emiting fades away if not present for long time, some "woke up" confused early like Strider

[normal drum]

C-Con didn't control Monolithians like puppets, there's a program for that.

[median hawk]

Not controlled but same thing as when strelok got brain washed, but with c con gone and wish granter off, the brain washing worn off I guess?

[midnight vault]

And the ones that haven't wake up yet stay in their monolithian state and continue to guard Pripyat? I guess that Why there're still so many Monolithian guarding the path to underground where the stalker program is(where the point of no return is) and the road to the Ccon pods?
If anything it seems like they got an indefinite source of foods and waters for their job lol

[normal drum]

Agents and Monolithians are different entities, Agents' programming doesn't wear off, the Monolithian programming does

[median hawk]

Its similar i guess yes, but i swear monolithians were literally stalkers brainwashed into protecting the wish granter from CNPP being acessed

[normal drum]

They organised themselves for some time, when they were praying near the emitters, they were begging the Monolith to return.

[median hawk]

The monolithians guarding the path are still the ones wishing for it to come back, aka the ones that mostly followed faust, but also as strider said in HoC, a lot of the monolithians are still wandering about trying to figure out wtf happened

[deep forum]

This but I think the point can be made that it still was a drastic cut for most. So this state of "trying to establish a connection to the wish granter again" was still a controlled state and then some snapped out of it. There is no analog transition (you can be 0.3 monolith controlled) but a digital one (you are controlled or not). This can be assumed because most people at Noontide state that they forgot everything and can't remember the transition. They lose their Monolith fighting abilities immediately, their cold heart and so on. None of them states "I was unsure whether I should do XYZ and at some point I no longer did it" but instead we get a description of a clear cut from everyone.

Only exception is maybe Subtle Matter Strider who is in a specific state and therefore difficult to take into account.

[smoky hornet]

One little addendum: Korshunov himself states Noontide still has their skills, says something like ‘Those combat skills stay with a man for life’

Granted I think he means muscle memory stuff and not the actual full knowledge

[pine kite]

Yeah that's what I interpreted it to mean

Skills and general knowledge are there but memory is gone

Semantic vs episodic knowledge

[proven wolf]

No.

[proven wolf]

It's do with PSI fields, and why the prayed to psi emitters, because they was brainwashed to do so.

Not unless they retconned this in HoC.

[proven wolf]

Because the was brainwashed for several reasons.

1. Psi Emitters kept them brainwashed.

2. To spread the myth of the Wish Granter, as the Wish Granter was a trap.

And some people think that theses emitters or towers could connect monolith too C-con.

[strong flume]

Basically, imagine it, you are kind of dropped into a middle of basically a war zone, you have natural survival skills peak military tactics and training ingrained into your brain that you can't even make sense of, your body reacts to fight or flight before you can even think, to make you one of if not the best you can be at fighting, and you were basically snapped awake while probably fighting others with people dressed like you and probably talking like you and everyone else is wanting you dead for being you and you don't even know what you were basically, Strider and his crew are essentially outcasts among outcasts trying to find a home, in CoP he's trying to either get his crew recruited into Duty, or Freedom and doesn't care which just so long as they're safe with a group and not targetted for being what they aren't anymore, and so they can move on, a lot of Monolithians during CoP are basically free to make their own decisions but it's human nature in a nutshell, "This is what we've always done, so we keep doing it cause we know no other way and it's too terrifying a concept to find another way," they preach to a god that doesn't make sense to even them probably, but they know no other way, they see it as they've always done it, and they wish to be reunited with that god the Monolith

Of course you can make the argument they were still close to emitters and so they were stuck being Monolith but it wouldn't make sense for the numbers in my mind we see in CoP, they're still too numerous and able to hold far too much territory against multiple flanks and multiple factions at that as well, if the emitters were the key Strider's group would be the ones we see holding Pripyat, instead we see Strider and his squad essentially just kind of camping out praying for the best and kind of looking despot at their situation until the player helps them out, I think it's more they knew they worshipped the monolith and that's what they always did, add the fact that human psychology does state that the human brain has a spot for religion so it's not too hard that some people were kind of more fanatic than others and kept the others in line and in the status quo of worshipping the Monolith despite no longer really having C-Con be around

[deep forum]

oh, interesting. I thought a Noontider stated that he no longer has good aim, but I am not so certain now. Maybe I just interpreted too much in one of the ""Back then we were monsters but now I can no longer hold a gun"" kind of comments and came up with this wrong assumption.

[strong flume]

Also I wanna point something out, why do we keep getting more and more of the path to the generators shown and given to us on the PDA, we still can't access it, but yet we're getting more and more of it shown on the PDA it feels like or am I tripping? Like there's a whole route directly to the generators just locked behind a few pieces of rubble next to the old bus station we also no longer have access too

Like maybe I'm just tripping or am forgetting but I definitely feel like the PDA is showing more of this little road up to the Generators on the map than it did before, which makes me more and more curious as to what it will unlock when or if we finally get access to it, there's a bunch of bunkers and looks like army barracks and stuff there and even a chemical anomaly area maybe so it's just like teasing it feels like that there's map additions being done without our knowledge

[gentle summit]

oh my god sirca needs to just explode

[rugged pebble]

If the Wish granted was gone from the CNPP
What things might we see in game when it comes out I wonder

I believe also that area around should be even more irradiated than any area in game for more challenging traversing

[lapis vapor]

Oh yes please more cnpp spéculations, cant wait to explore that area

[proven wolf]

But how long it took for the brainwashing to fade away, depended on the person.

And there is PDA entry for a monolith soldier who fell behind his squad, and his faith wavered in the Dark Valley.

HoC also changed what the Wish Granter did too.

If the psi emitters weren't required for brainwashing, then they served no purpose... Which makes even less sense.

PSI emitters weren't definitely used to maintain brainwashing, and possibly used as a connection to C-con.

[proven wolf]

Well, an enormous amount of content was left out.

[strong flume]

I mean I'm not talking about HoC really I'm talking about CoP lmao with how the Monolith still exists despite C-Con being destroyed, despite there not really being anyways to keep any connection at all, they're literally religious fanatics and I think that's the thing you're forgetting, they're religious fanatics, human psychology comes into play a lot for that, even without the emitters they're a group all dedicated to a religion and every one of them is worshipping it, you're seeing it as surface deep and not seeing a deeper picture, psychologically there's parts of the human brain that is dedicated to religion and worship, like that's part of the human brain function due to how much we've had it in our existence, that sort of thing is exactly what the Monolith is scratching and it's affecting them probably on a deeper level than brain washing, cause you also have to remember, if it was just brain washing, they'd be able to remember their entire lives and go back to just being Stalkers but no they're in fact still unable to remember anything about their previous lives or of serving the Monolith, they remember neither, and then the group in CoP holding Pripyat is still worshipping, and are still Monolith, they're holding ground and are the numerical majority of Monolithians as we only see Striders group and they've become disenfranchised with the whole idea, and just left, hence why I said they're outcasts of outcasts in CoP

[dull sequoia]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHUYEXdoAvU

The guy at 0:17 almost found his free will for a split second.

[gaunt gate]

Poor guy

[proven wolf]

I wouldn't say they existed, and the brainwashing wasn't ending like over night, some one would obviously carry on.

But then I hated CoP and gave up on it.

It wasn't a religion, it was brainwashed BS, spread the idea that the Wish Granter was real. Why would C-con want anything more than what they need. Why did Monolith worship the monolith, because they was told to. And no, they wouldn't remember, they effectively had a brain format, new instructions given, that required constant reinforcement. The only ones that didn't were the agents, as they had to go through a special process to become agents.

And no, it's got nothing to do with this "god gene", it's literally, C-con enslaving them to form their wishes, that is it, nothing else. C-con was at the centre of everything.

GCS just went and retconned the whole frigging thing, and created some poorly written fan fiction, and tried to literally answer everything, and nothing remains a mystery for people to talk about.

The fact that so many people are argued and debated the lore, some not acknowledging the first 3 games at all, and others like me completely disregarding a lot of S2's all together. Just goes to show how poorly it was done.

We should be arguing the mysterious of the zone (cant do that, they left none), as not everything needs to be answered, and not trying to make heads or tails of this retcon BS.

[strong flume]

I mean it is a religion, you just can't simply convert to it, it's a perfect brain washing tool too, who better to protect your most precious center of an area to the death, who better to follow orders no matter how near suicidal they could be? Brainwashed zombies who need to be near a psi emitter 24/7 or a group that worships you cause you made them a religious fanatical group that would do anything to appease you cause they see you as a god, even without the psi emitters, the human brain has spaces dedicated to religion, it's a brilliant idea to use a religion to keep a brainwashed slave a willing brainwashed slave, and when they're freed in CoP it makes sense that a majority wouldn't just be magically going back to how they were before the Monolith, everyone wanted them dead, nobody wants them alive, they're a radical group that murdered stalkers and soldiers alike, people lost friends and brothers to them, even if they wanted too, they couldn't the rest of the zone wouldn't let them, plus add a few people who were probably near psi emitters like you said and Faust who could preach to them and make them believe they had a higher purpose and were chosen ones and that their god would return if and make them whole again etc. etc. and you've got a recipe for a group who's unknowingly scorned the entire zone and is basically imprisoned by their past still worshipping a thing they are supposedly free of

[clever drift]

Hi guys, I started the game around 3 days ago and I just went through the mission "Wishful thinking" by siding with Strider, Dubny and the others; and after I finished the cutscene I have a question:

Did strider attempt to shoot himself rather than being controlled, because when you watch it you can see him struggling and barely moving and once the Monolith yelled "come to me", he proceeded to let go of his gun easily and just get up

[strong flume]

Yes he tried to shoot himself, he knew what was happening and probably was choosing to shoot himself rather than go back to Monolithian

[dull sequoia]

Strider is such a great character. I know it's just a game, but really felt sorry for him. Lying to him in Subtle Matter feels like the only reasonable way to go, in my opinion.

[strong flume]

I could not bring myself to lie to a man who sacrificed everything and lost, though I won't lie, no matter how much peeps may dislike the HoC storyline, remembering Strider from CoP made my eyes kinda tear up, one recognizing his name in Noontide, then seeing him basically being like, "I died, but it was for a reason right? I didn't sacrifice everything for nothing right?"

[dull sequoia]

Yeah, Strider is awesome. It's a shame they killed him. He deserved more screen time in the DLCs.

[strong flume]

Yeah I'm hoping they expand on the subtle matter in the dlcs and bring Strider back for a bit, maybe have him be some hallucination we see helping us during the dlc like Reznov was to Alex in Black Ops 1 and shiz to realize no he's dead depending on our choices or no he is "alive" more or less and kinda expand on the choices we make and how we see things like Subtle Matter or if it's just a psi trick and hallucination

[dull sequoia]

Uuh, the Reznov analogy is great and a very nice idea.

Korshunov, Dalin, Scar, ALL MUST DIE!

Strider if the Zone goes global:
See how times have changed, my friend?! Now it's their land, their people, their blood...

[strong flume]

Lmao yeah that would work so well, make it seem like Strider is coming unravelled especially if we tell him he failed despite all his sacrifices, all the time we've known Strider he's always been the calm and honestly polite and charismatic one, true death of the character then to make him then decide he's tired of playing nice and after losing everything just want everyone dead in some desperate attempt of vengeance all under the pretense of freeing Noontide from Monolith

[dull sequoia]

"Skif, I'm not hearing gunshots!"

[strong flume]

"Skif, Scar betrayed us, used us, we have to kill him, to free Noontide, Scar must die, Korshunov must die, Strelok must die, everyone..."

[dull sequoia]

Good ol' Tricky Strider. 😄

In all honesty, Scar shouldn't even be called Scar anymore. That joke of a man isn't Scar. He's Marshall.

They should have scrapped the Scar character altogether, but I understand why nostalgia is also important. On the other hand, he should have been the cool character from the original story. The fan theory that Charon from Shadow of Chernobyl was Scar after being brainwashed at the end of Clear Sky is better than HoC's husk of Scar with Marshall's personality.

[strong flume]

Yeah I get why he's like that, like I've said before in here, he's gone through enough to drive anyone crazy, like I'd be more surprised if he was sane and sounded like he wasn't a raving lunatic preacher after everything he went through, surviving 3 emissions the last one sounding like it was a record breaking emission too, getting his brain programmed and getting Marshal's memories implanted into him with the last known mission given to him to somehow someway bring back C-Con, and then at the end of the game right before his duel you just see his reality that was programmed into him snap and just see him desperately trying to make sense of it all before just snapping back to his programming of the STALKER program and fighting us

[dull sequoia]

Yeah, I actually was relieved for a second when he realized the Marshall fiasco, hoping he would come to his senses. Too bad.

[strong flume]

I feel like he did come to his senses with that at least a little bit, especially when he had to come to terms that "Yeah C-con is dead and maybe they could be brought back, but no that would defeat the idea of the shining zone...no..dammit" and I feel like he wouldn't have even wanted to live, we were his suicide button but he wasn't just gonna roll over and die, he was gonna fight and go down kicking and screaming if he had too, and if you do remember, he doesn't just die, he doesn't beg or cry or even let out a scream, mf laughs as he goes down at least everytime I've dueled him he's always gone out with a laugh

Like other agents, especially when exposed to TVs don't laugh at us on their way out, they just get brain fried and go down, he takes 4 TVs and laughs at the fact he dies

But again also, he's been brainwashed, memory implanted and emission fried so many times that it's a miracle of the zone he's still able to walk and form coherent sentences, then again, does make him tanking 4 TVs as an agent make sense saying he's taken worse

[dull sequoia]

At least they didn't change Degtyarev very much. I think people would have rioted otherwise.

[strong flume]

Oh god yeah you're right there, also Wolf too

And Sidorovich, can't forget that bastard

Any of those guys change and Stalker wouldn't be Stalker

[dull sequoia]

Sidorovich is very easy to be hated. Personally, I would kill that guy without much remorse. At least I annihilated his hitmen he sent after the new traders and basically spit him the face, figuratively speaking, when he asked about that mission. But, it's true, he is part of Stalker. Degtyarev, on the other hand, how can one dislike him?

[strong flume]

You and half of Rookie Village, I am not saying I'm surprised he wasn't killed off screen in the last 10 years between the games but I am relieved we still see that fat bunker rat still scamming rookies, if he suddenly became a charitable character beloved by all I'd have to believe he'd have a stroke and forgot what money and value in items was and found wish granter and made a wish all in the same time, and true you just can't honestly, like he never truly did too much or too little and is just a certified badass through and through no matter how you look at him

[dull sequoia]

https://tenor.com/view/flash-run-fast-gif-26117164

Me on my way to kill Sidorovich if such an opportunity arises in HoC DLCs.

[strong flume]

Oml yeah I'm sure everyone would love to or at least fully rob him blind and leave him at the mercy of the rookies

[dull sequoia]

Yeah, just kidding.

https://tenor.com/view/creepy-vsauce-smile-gif-2980605684719370270

[strong flume]

Yeah we would probably all take that opportunity

[dull sequoia]

A character stirring up strong feelings, whether of sympathy or hate, is just a testament to his quality.

There's no denying Sidorovich is a polarizing figure.

[strong flume]

Oh yeah, like where Deggie is probably one of the most beloved characters who's hard to hate, he's simply just a badass doing his job that I feel like even Bloodsuckers think twice before charging him to Sidorovich being the one person we wish we could chuck a frag behind the counter of, they're amazing, I know S2's characters I remember fondly and most of are definitely Star and Quiet

Star for being the polar opposite of Scar in S2 but seemingly putting up and even being approving of Scar's antics while understanding what he means while Quiet is literally just a gullible Sidorovich who wants to be the idea of Sidorovich, rich and able to have influence

[dull sequoia]

Whenever I look at Star during one of Scar's freak shows, I can't help but get the feeling he's tired of Scar's shenanigans. Like my brain tells me to read Star's face as bored, but trying to appear happy. 😄

Regarding Degtyarev, he is the most badass mutant hunter in the whole zone. That guy is capable of local extinctions.

I can't even remember how many bloodsuckers I've killed in Call of Pripyat. Whenever I run into one or see one in the distance, it's killing time.

[strong flume]

Yeah but he still is just the polar opposite of Scar and I love the dynamic, honestly he's probably just one of Scar's longest and closest advisors and does he believe in the shining zone? Probably not, but does he just wanna stick it to the Ward and prove that Stalkers are best? Probably more than likely, and honestly so true Deggie can probably be attributed as to why we haven't seen any hamsters? I forgot their names but they were so annoying, honestly I hope that comes into lore too that he just legitimately led an extinction level hunt on them all, also do wanna know who the mysterious stalker is on Wolf's PDA who says he blew up an X lab entrance to keep the Cordon safe

[proven wolf]

Who better what?

C-con just made troops that felt no pain, and utterly obedient... They didn't need to make a religion for that, as they had already had complete control.

What they needed was a way of spreading the the myth of the Wish Granter, the trap to lure Stalkers away from the secrets of the zone.

The religion is completely irrelevant to Monolith, as they had lost completely who they were and 100% dominated by C-con.

Hence why mo olith did nothing but mumble about the monolith to be a real thing, not as a trap, but an actual object.

You can't set a trap, if you tell everyone it's a trap. But if spread a lie, that these relenting monsters believe in, and never stop talking about, then you got believability.

It was all an illusion created by C-con, for one task. Religion had nothing to do with the brainwashing and control of Monolith, it was everything to do with spreading a lie.

[pine kite]

Isn't it said in clear sky that there was a monolith cult before the emergence of the more familiar monolith faction? They all ended up going north and presumably got brainwashed

Once they're under control it probably doesn't matter much but the belief seems relevant in some capacity

[strong flume]

You're looking at it surface deep again, think about it, even you posted a quote from the old series of a Monolithian apparently questioning his faith in the Monolith, but then acting like it was a test and snapping back to being Monolithian, it's a matter of yes they're brain washed but also it's better to have a brain washing that could be more permanently affecting a troop without the need of an emitter, their belief in the religion sounds like it has a lot to do with how they act especially with how in CoP, if emitters were the sole reason like you said for the Monolith, they wouldn't be able to have kept control of Pripyat so well and wouldn't have the numbers necessary, like I said earlier, it would've been Strider in charge then of Pripyat, rather than the Monolith, and even in HoC we see Noontiders who aren't Monolithian remembering even their prayers to the Monolith, so obviously the religion I feel has more to do with it than just, "Oh they're brainwashed but once that brainwashing is gone they should be free but aren't so must mean story plot hole"

[proven wolf]

I don't know how?

The first monolith were formed when the zone was first created, as C-con absorbed all the previous staff and security.

A faction then left for the centre of the zone, and got absorbed too. Probably as result of the monolith being turned on, and it starting to broadcast it's message across the zone.

The monolith was created by C-con as trap.

So I am assuming it was created after the formation of the zone. Seeing as it was created as way of luring stalkers away from them.

[proven wolf]

I'm not looking at it surface deep, you're just reading to much in it.

Trying to attribute one thing to another, and ignoring why C-con built the monolith.

It was a trap, that was it, nothing more nothing less. And I get the impression that the monolith was created after the formation of the zone, but C-con had already absorb all the staff working in the labs, as scientists and guards... When the zone was formed.

They went in with intentions to rid humanity of it's dark side, only to realise instantly that they screwed up, at which point, C-con, the brainwashing, then became a thing.

[strong flume]

Monolith was a last line of defense, it wasn't some trap though? If it was just a trap then they'd just be a giant suicide cult that zombifies or kills them immediately, and the brain scorcher would've just had some other purpose like more than zombifying stalkers

Monolith was a tool a blunt instrument and a last line of defense for those who somehow got past the brain scorcher and X19, and to go and wipe out those who would attempt such, who's numbers get replenished by the brain scorcher, if Monolith was just a trap then they'd not be used for anything other than just sitting there till they rotted, but they don't, they get orders, they go on patrols, they eat, they drink, they stay alive

[long latch]

is SIRCAA a splinter faction of the X labs? or a completely new thing created by Degtryev and Strelok?

[strong flume]

SIRCAA is a somewhat spinoff of x labs I would say, it's a new thing but at the same time it's an old thing

[pine kite]

It's the new face for the old bosses from outside the zone

[normal drum]

A new thing, but sponsored by the Regulatory Board (who sponsored the X Project). Degtyarev has nothing to do with it, and Strelok only was working for them in 2016-17.

[long latch]

is there anything other than the game about the events leading up to the game? or there is no additional lore post CoP and PreHoC

[pine kite]

There's the ARG lore, which anomalous dugout has a good video on

[proven wolf]

The Wish Granter was the last line of defence, but it was also a trap.

What's is the point in spreading the myth of the Wish Granter, if it wasn't a trap?

C-con was wanted to be left alone to deal with the mess they they created, the Wish Granter stood outside the locked door that lead to C-con.

You could hear it at various points in the zone, calling to you, as per the video below.

https://youtu.be/1JAR5qd2h18?si=qXmdMSIKlmrwvJcy

The other thing is, the Brain Scorcher, did just turn people into zombies, stalker were also used for other tasks become Agents and monolith.

[pine kite]

It's mainly about stuff between the trilogy and S2, though it contains some documents that predate the zone's creation too

[somber hedge]

This is correct, however it could be clear sky bullshitting us

[proven wolf]

Yes, but we don't know when the Wish Granter was made. And the zone was left alone for sometime after the experiment went wrong... As per the video https://youtu.be/1JAR5qd2h18?si=qXmdMSIKlmrwvJcy It is very possible that this faction (probably created by the first stalkers that could hear the voice of the Wish Granter), was hearing the Wish Granter and was the first to be called to it, trapped, and brainwashed to become monolith, or their name sake. And went of to investigate this voice of the monolith calling to them.

I haven't see or heard anything to suggest otherwise.

[normal drum]

No, because it's the regular stalkers who were talking about the original Monolithians.

[normal drum]

No one was hearing the Wish Granter before they've got there, there's nothing like that told in the game (SoC nor CS).

CS:

"It's hard to say. To answer that question I would need to know what's in the center of the Zone. Some say the Monolith, others say the Wish Granter... the more unpretentious ones dream about fields of rare artifacts... I was at the power plant myself, a young specialist at the time, but I don't know what's there now. What I can say is that the Scorcher appeared for a reason. It prevents the center of the Zone from being reached. People cannot go beyond the Brain Scorcher." - Lebedev

"Well, a whole faction has gone missing. And it's not like they were taken out by people or wiped out by monsters. They just vanished, warts and all. These guys were weird too, with a real hard-on for the Zone. They believed that the Zone was alive, and in its center was a Monolith - a Wish Granter. So they declared themselves the protectors of this Monolith. And then one fine day their whole faction just got up and took off for the center. Yep, right to the Wish Granter. They headed for the Scorcher, crossed the Barrier, and no one has seen them since." - the Duty barman on Ahroprom

"People say many things. Some even say that everything that happens in the Zone and the Zone itself are alien handiwork. The theory is that they left a module, the Black Monolith, somewhere in the center, which changed everything around it. A sort of global experiment on mankind. It's like a weapons testing facility for them, you know? Stalkers collect artifacts and sell them on, which means that every large science research center probably has a few. And that's how the Black Monolith spreads its influence around the world. Nobody knows what the consequences will be. Maybe artifacts are just trinkets and maybe they really do affect humans somehow. Maybe this theory is a load of bull, but who's to say the Zone isn't here spreading artifacts around for a reason? If only we could get some answers from the people who've been beyond that damn radar. They could tell us if there's really a Monolith in the center or not - that would clear things up some." - a Freedomer in the Dark Valley

"Well, we've been here a while, so we keep a pulse on things. Recently the Monolith faction turned up out of the blue. Some time ago I had a contract on a few Monolithians. Those guys are something else, I tell ya. Always going on about the Monolith, a genetic module, whatever it is. So, then they get up and leave on some kind of pilgrimage, beyond the Radar. We thought that was it - rest in peace, you silly bastards. But lo and behold - our pilgrims come right back, even crazier than before. Now I'm wondering as to what they got hold of, there in the center of the Zone. Could they have found the actual Monolith? Or did they find jack right alongside shit, and the frustration of it all made them go completely haywire? Hey, with those psychos - who knows." - a Mercenary at the Military Warehouses

SoC:

"On the test of faith"

Brothers, the Monolith put my faith to the test, and I nearly stayed from the path. But I withstood! Glory to the Monolith! Its trials strengthen us! We were on our way back from the Dark Valley and I fell behind. Evil grabbed at the opportunity and started tempting me. And... I doubted. The image of truth became distorted; the enemy whispered into my ear lies about how the Monolith uses us as slaves. But then I realized - it's a trial! I remembered the glory and the splendor of the Monolith. I regained my inner strength and my confidence. Since then I have no fear of any trials and know no doubts. Glory to the Monolith!

"On the Monolith in dreams"

Brothers, the Monolith summoned me last night and I spoke with it. It was awesome in its greatness, nearly blinding me, but its light filled me with powers beyond mere mortal comprehension! I know, I feel its power within us all! Only firm faith can overcome evil. It told me its power can fill only those who have faith. Finally, it revealed to me that our victory is at hand!

"On those who got to the antennae"

Brothers, did you hear about unbelievers who broke through to the antennae? Fortunately, the Monolith guided us and the brothers picked them off just in time. One was eliminated immediately, the other two ran away. Cowards! They're all cowards! True faith leaves no room for fear! Two managed to escape, but the Monolith is wise and omniscient. It would not have let them live without a reason.

"A convert in the Black Forest"

Brothers, as we were patrolling the outskirts of the Dark Forest we came upon an unfaithful loner. We did not kill him, seeing as he was already on his way to conversion, although he was still half-way in his animal state... Such is the wisdom of the Monolith: once again it revealed to us the true countenance of our enemies. Now our faith is even stronger! It is at hand, brothers! The victory over the unbelievers is at hand. Soon the Monolith will fulfill our greatest desires! Those who are truly faithful to it will be drawn to it, its glory, its greatness! We shall abide in its radiance forever!

"On the fighting in the Dark Valley"

I walked in the Dark Valley, a place teeming with unbelievers who haven't seen the power of the Monolith yet. We were on guard duty. The attack came at night. We fought bravely. My brothers stood their ground as befits true believers, and the Monolith summoned many them that day. But not me. My time had not come yet. My gun was useless and silent. And suddenly the Monolith spoke to me: "You are one of mine, and my power rests with you. Stand strong in your faith and you shall defeat my enemies for my greater glory!" And then I turned into shadow. I bent down and walked around them. Dumb savage spies, they didn't notice a thing. They thought we were dead and were laughing at the empty bodily shells of our brothers. But I was already behind their backs. And then the power of the Monolith came forth from my hands. And that's how he killed them all. I'm happy to serve you, oh, Light of Perfection!

You're sure we played the same games? Because the Monolith faction was definitely not "just a trap", it was always more than that, and Stalker 2 continued this tradition.

[somber hedge]

no one heared the wish granter or the monolith calling troughout the zone...

what are you on about xD

the wish granter is a myth, a zone legend, that people dont know if its true or not

we dont know alot about the original monolithians, only what other people tell us, we never saw them directly

[proven wolf]

You obviously never played SoC, coz that big thing at the bad endings of the game...

Is the Wish Granter, and it was built by C-con.

This is STALKER 101 stuff.

And we do know about the first monolith, coz they were the troops and guards stationed there, and the faction that went missing, which was later bulked up with random syalkers and Clear Sky.

And yes the monolith called to stalkers, as during SoC you can here it calling out to you as you progressed through the game. With lines as per the video I previously posted.

All the wish Granter Endings from Soc.

How could you not know this?

https://youtu.be/ixypaA652hw?si=yf-UY1CU-UkAMWU_

[proven wolf]

Actually you hear the Wish Granter calling out to you, as you travelled through the zone.

As per the video I posted.

[normal drum]

The Marked One hears the voice exactly once, while not being around the Wish Granter - after his last dream, on the Radar. It's not a proof as it can be interpreted in other ways, too. While playing SoC, you must've seen that the tunnels inside the CNPP are filled with loudspeakers, and - what a coincidence - you can hear the Wish Granter only in that place. Not on the way to it, not near the CNPP, but it only constantly repeats inside the sarcophagus, when logically it should've been speaking anywhere. Although it was retconned by CS and CoP to make the voices psi-based, it should be kept in mind that the developers at that time never envisioned that the Wish Granter could speak to someone outside the CNPP.

[somber hedge]

I am talking about the stalkers perspectives, dont try to do a gotcha on me when you miss my point, the wish granter never called for anyone, no one in the zone bar monolith heard the voice of the wish granter/monolith.

You talking about the dream cutscenes? where you hear the voice? strelok was alredy at the CNPP before so thats probably him recalling it, but in SoC at no point we hear the classic "come to me" line outside of the CNPP itself

[somber hedge]

Also your video shows nothing about it being heard trought the game, just that it is heard at some point... did you even play SoC? i mean come on

[normal drum]

Like, if I need to give a source for my argument, I have localisation files / the game itself downloaded to prove it, I do not post Anomaly footage as my only proof 🤷‍♂️ My opinion is that everyone in this chat should do this, and not only rely on their memory.

[bleak trellis]

this channel definitely ruins lives

[proven wolf]

And what do you think stalkers will do, in a zone full of wonderous things? Look for it.

And no, I'm not talking about the dream cut scenes, when you are wandering around the zone, you can hear the Monolith at points

[normal drum]

No, you cannot. Maybe it's thing in Anomaly or any other mod but not in vanilla SoC.

[proven wolf]

Well yeah, that's why I say that you could hear the Monolith in the zone.

Because I played it and heard it.

[proven wolf]

Never played Anomaly or gamma.

And you could hear the voice.

[normal drum]

In SoC you hear it directly after the last dream sequence and in the sarcophagus, that's it. Find a footage with the unmoded game and where it's present in any other place in the Zone, if you want to prove it.

[proven wolf]

So you do hear it, after the dream sequence..

You just said it yourself.

And I still get the feeling you hear it when you enter certain maps for the first time.

Been so long since I played it.

[normal drum]

As I said yesterday, it will never be a solid proof, because it's Marked One we're talking about, the one who already had been near the Wish Granter, and he heard it exactly after it was shown in his dream. I can say that the voice was a part of his dream (aka him remembering his past), too, and there will be no way to disprove it. The same with the Wish Granter specifically calling Strelok to come to him. However, I can ask a question: "Why has the Wish Granter done this? Hasn't the C-Con spent the whole other game to not let him do that? At that time he already had the mission to meet the Guide, or, more than that, already met Doctor who told him the Wish Granter is fake and that he needs to find the decoder in Prypiat. Therefore it's highly dangerous to even encourage Marked One to go to the north." That's why I don't believe it called Strelok.

[proven wolf]

For the same reason that any one leads an enemy to specific location.

To trap them and defeat them.

[normal drum]

Strelok already knows that the Wish Granter is fake, and C-Consciousness knows that Strelok knows because they can observe the Noosphere.

[proven wolf]

But Strelok is not the only one in the zone, and C-con may not have known that Guide told Strelok the wish Granter is a fake. And if you don't meet Guide in SoC, you don't know the wish Granter is fake either... You bumble upto it, and in my case got buried in rumble.

So they would have been acting on the assumption that Strelok didn't know it was fake, if this was the case.

There is nothing to suggest it is not trap, a lure to draw stalkers to it, by playing to the greed of stalkers.

[normal drum]

Logically seeing, Strelok goes to Prypiat right after turning the Scorcher off, so he should've already seen Guide and Doctor by that moment. Otherwise, sure, he doesn't know and gets killed by an illusion. But he hears the voice in both cases, so the reason "they wanted to trap him anyway" falls off because it implies C-Con are stupid. If we use arguments from HoC, then the Representative says they knew Doctor helped Strelok to kill them.

[proven wolf]

No, you only learn about the true ending when you get to Pripyat and find the hidden loot with the number to the door to C-con, IIRC. Without it, you know no wiser.

This video from about 9:40 on wards, in it... The representative states they lured stalkers to the centre promising rewards of their greatest desires.

Aka the Wish Granter, they captured them and put the to tasks

https://youtu.be/m45zGBxPaf8?si=ngi4nusUCJAXN1jU

[normal drum]

No, it's Doctor who gives Strelok coordinates to the stash and it's not the "number to the door" but a decoder. Lead up to the true ending begins with looking for Guide.

Luring stalkers to the north is way simpler than "the voice which calls random people to come to it". There are no signs/hints/sayings in SoC/CS which could tell that someone was hearing the Wish Granter calling to them. Representative's choice of words doesn't imply it, too. It was just genuine curiosity which led some people to find a way to the CNPP. As the Representative says, the psi-installations like the Brain Scorcher are responsible for capturing stalkers who who then would become Agents (their main goal as they wanted Agents to "protect the Zone's secrets"). The Wish Granter was only the last line of defence, definitely meant to kill stalkers who would come too far than it was needed (like we see it in false endings). Absence of dead stalkers near the Wish Granter and C-Consciousness' reaction to someone sneaking to the Sarcophagus (a literal Superemission) lead to a conclusion that Strelok's group was the first couple of stalkers to reach the Wish Granter ever, no one else came to it and really wished for something, they were caught way earlier.

[proven wolf]

Whatever, the point is you need to go to stash the learn the truth.

Where have I said that it was just only the Wish Granter luring people in?

For last couple of days I've also been saying that monolith were also spreading the myth of the Wish Granter... Or is this bs to you too?

If both of these are wrong, then how the f-ck did C-con spread the lie and myth of the Wish Granter?

It's like to you the whole thing magically popped out of thin air, C-con were incompetent useless twat waffles, that didn't know jack.

They actually sent out scented letters, flowers, and pretty please, to get stalkers to lure them to their demise.

[normal drum]

C-Consciousness didn't create myths about the Wish Granter or the Monolith, the regular people did. Haven't you watched the very same video you've shown? "From the moment the Zone was formed, many people have thrived to get to its center. But we cannot let that happen." What C-Con needed to do is just to create a stone hologram in the sarcophagus, and to not reinvent the wheel and just take the name "Monolith" from the original Monolithians. Representative explicitly said that they didn't want people to get to them. The myths were harmful to them. That's why they activated the line of psi-installations, created Agents, and then, when Strelok found a way to bypass this line, they formed the Monolithians to repell everyone who's getting close to the centre.

[somber hedge]

what points? when? where?

[somber hedge]

its not a thing not even in anomaly xD

[somber hedge]

thats becuse you do hear it, in the CNPP

[normal drum]

Do not know, never played with mods

[proven wolf]

There is no point debating with you.

So according to you, the people (Stalkers) randomly made up a myth (a thing that grants your wishes in the centre of the zone), about something that actually does exist (Wish Granter, that exists in the centre of the zone), which was created by C-con, that no one had seen or been told about... What are the chances? Hey.

It's right in front of your face, but you just can't see it.

If you know people are going to be drawn to centre of the zone as the rep says... Then give them something to be drawn to, that isn't you. Draw them away from you.

And if they get through all the other stuff you have put in place to stop, then what better to have something like the Wish Granter, a trap, as a last line of defense.

And spread this this trap, this illusion, than having the likes of the monolith, talking about, praying to psi-emmiters, to give an illusion of cult, religion, creating rumours of something at the centre of the zone.

You literally can not put 2 and 2 together...

The genius of the illusion...

I can't help you my friend

[proven wolf]

And out in the zone, but as the other guy said, that may have been after cut scenes, when you turn off the brain scorcher etc.

I'll have to double check at some point though.

[normal drum]

First, you're underestimating creativity of the people. Second, how do you know the Wish Granter was built before the myth appeared?

[granite swan]

What's the lore behind not being able to enter ghost city?

[proven wolf]

That's funny, coz your under estimating the creativity and the 4D chess played by C-con.

[normal drum]

There's literally a zone with unexplainable things and deadly mutants, of course people would imagine that it may be an alien meteorite causing this or an another mystical thing.

[somber hedge]

you missed the points were he talked about how in CS he talks about the prelude of monolith?

people are being drawn to the centre of the zone becuse the deeper you are in the zone the stronger artifacts there is, yes the wish granter is a big part of it, but stalkers that dont believe it still want to go deeper in the zone, to get artifacts and to figure out wtf is going on

the wish granter was never a line of defense, its the monolith, the wish granter is a trap, to lure experienced stalkers to join the monolith, but thats it, and some if not most stalkers dont believe in the wish granter

[somber hedge]

that happens only 1 time, in a dream sequence and to strelok only, since he is the only stalker to ever come back from the center of the zone (that we know of) and unless stated otherwise no one else would have heard the wish granter calling, becuse they never heard it, its strelok remembering things

[somber hedge]

idk, what is it?

[granite swan]

Limansk

[normal drum]

In the past - anomaly fields. Now - unknown, we're waiting for the DLC to explain it.

[somber hedge]

tbh there is no inlore reason as for now in HoC, becuse skiff can go waay off his path and go to the cement factory and ETC, probably due to cut content, and the oever 40 or something faction specific side quests you could had taken

[proven wolf]

Missed what point?

I missed nothing...

I clearly stated, that people will be drawn to the centre of zone... The rep said this...

And as you just stated, the Wish Granter was a trap.

If you know people are going to go to the centre, set up a trap for them.

You don't tell them it's a trap, you make it out to be something else, like something that grants wishes... Then you get all your troops (brain washed Monolith) to go on about it all the time...

A result of which, stalkers over hear these conversations about a monolith/wish Granter...

What is so hard for people to understand about this?

I haven't missed anything...

[granite swan]

I actually went for the factory as soon as I left the lesser zone for a rhino

Cement factory and the red forest have been my home lately and I really haven't been progressing the story, just roaming around and seeing what's changed

[proven wolf]

So people who want to go to the centre of zone, now also go looking for the wish Granter, this myth, this legend.

Rather than looking for you.

[proven wolf]

Cement Factory has been my home too.

Love the place.

[normal drum]

You do realise Monolithians do not yap around about the Monolith around stalkers specifically to "spread the myth"? They kill them, they do not leave them wounded, and, as I've already provided with materials from SoC which you decided to ignore, they follow their religion fully, it's not just a show for stalkers.

[granite swan]

Only complaint is why is the bed on the 4th floor

[normal drum]

There's literally no evidence, no line of dialogue in any of the games that says that the Monolithians exist to spread the myth, like, from where this theory is based of?

[somber hedge]

unfortunaly not alot

[somber hedge]

https://tenor.com/view/monolith-preacher-games-stalker-gif-19391373

[ornate venture]

midrovar has been warned

Reason: Bad word usage

[somber hedge]

i give up on that ;-;

[proven wolf]

Oh really, I remember NPC talking about monolith troops talking about the monolith being a thing.

"How do you explain the appearance of Monolithians from beyond the Barrier? I saw one of them once. He was wounded, his eyes were glazed over and he was mumbling the same words over and over: "Defend the Monolith!" I don't think he could feel pain, 'cause he wouldn't stop trying to grab my buddy's throat until we emptied a few clips into him. What do they want?"

From CoP

And I remember, seeing more stuff like this.

[proven wolf]

Exercise to work off all the sausage you eat 🤣

[somber hedge]

that is during CoP, the monolith has been shut down for some months now, they are not under the affect of the monolith, what you claim is that the stalkers learned about the wish granter trough monolithians, wich is not true, monolithians do scream and praise the monolith during combat, but not as a way to inform stalkers of the existance of monolith, just a war cry

[normal drum]

I repeat, they were fully religious. This and talking about the Monolith while trying to murder a stalker even while being wounded are not mutually exclusive.

[proven wolf]

That's because your supposed to work it out for yourself.

Like C-con are going to go around letting everyone know it's a trap.

What is wrong with gamers these days.

Everything has to be laid out on a plate form them.

Can you not work this stuff out...

[somber hedge]

monolithians dont exist to spread a myth... their sole porpouse is the defense of the C-Con.... and how the heck do you come to the conclusion when you see someone that is tottaly out of itself, and cant keep yelling about the monolith be "wow he must be wanting to inform me something"

[proven wolf]

They were fully brainwashed and and forced to believe that the Monolith was a thing... Not a trap set be C-con..

What's the point in setting a trap, then telling everyone it's a trap...

When you people to keep away from you.

[proven wolf]

OMG, what is wrong with you people.

Of course they are there to defend, they have guns, ignore pain, and completely ruthless... But they also spread the myth of the Wish Granter...

People, you have brains, use it.

[somber hedge]

so your telling me that, if you see someone that is completly careless, kills everyone in their path, and cant stop yapping about "the holy monolith" or kill in completle silence and perfect coordination, and somehow you come to the conclusion that "huh there must be a shiny rock in the center of the zone that grant wishes"

[normal drum]

You're too badly trying to see things that just aren't there. SoC did lay everything on a plate, it's just that some people try to ignore some details to advance their own narrative.

[somber hedge]

keep in mind you never see them do otherwise, becuse it is very rare to see your average stalker survive a encounter to the monolith

[somber hedge]

i bet he believe in conspiracy theories xD

[proven wolf]

WTF are you talking about?

I just posted this conversation...

"How do you explain the appearance of Monolithians from beyond the Barrier? I saw one of them once. He was wounded, his eyes were glazed over and he was mumbling the same words over and over: "Defend the Monolith!" I don't think he could feel pain, 'cause he wouldn't stop trying to grab my buddy's throat until we emptied a few clips into him. What do they want?"

A wounded fecking monolith, talking about defending a "Monolith"

And what about Stalkers, that have close calls as patrols go by.

Jesus H Christ, use some common sense.

[somber hedge]

"so dude, this guy came back, and his whole group got killed by those monolithians, and he cant stop yapping about a granter of wishes.... damn he must know something" look how stupid your logic sound

[somber hedge]

"man this dying fanatic is yapping about his god in his death bed... there must be a granter of wishes somewhere... it must be on the sarcofagus ofcourse"

[proven wolf]

What do you mean are not there?

You need to spoon fed, you literally can't work things out, unless it is spoon fed to you.

[somber hedge]

"so i was trying to find my way trough radar.. and i saw a group of monolithians kneeling and praying to a weird construct... i didnt hear them saying anything, but they couldnt stop moving their heads in circles.... there must be a granter of wishes somewhere i can see from their interaction... i can see it in their eyes even tho they are wearing gasmasks"

[proven wolf]

What a stupid argument to make... Jesus Christ, use some fecking common sense and stop resorting to straw man arguments

[somber hedge]

"danm freedom bro, we just defeated a horde of those monolithians... and i was thinking to myself you know, maybe what if, their monolith, the only reason we call them monolith is becuse they believe in they cant stop talking about it right, and even tho all interactions we have with them, they yell "glory to the monolith", i wonder if there's a hidden meaning behind it, like there must be a granter of wishes, imagine if the monolith is infact a wish granter, and they got there and asked for a wish, and now cant stop defending it.. its like their lost all their free will........ damn i need to go see this wish granter for myself"

[somber hedge]

funny that i am applying your logic...

[normal drum]

You cannot build theory on speculations, only facts. You cannot connect hidden and little details to the global picture if you are not, as you said, "spoon fed", because those are facts, a foundation, you do not build a house without it.

[proven wolf]

You're a clown, and just talking silly bollox now.

Adiós, enjoy you're deranged bs.

[somber hedge]

naaah bro, the zone is clearly made by the illuminaty, its soo obvious, even tho the game doesnt tell you or show any evidence to that, it must be the free masons

[somber hedge]

bro is mad that i used his logic

[normal drum]

@nocturne mural

[proven wolf]

And you need to be spoon fed everything coz your so narrow minded, you need everything to laid out on plate.

Adiós.

[somber hedge]

please leave

stop saying goodbye and not leave

[normal drum]

@sour galleon

[nocturne mural]

What is this shit

[normal drum]

.

[nocturne mural]

Shut both

How many times did I tell you to not insult people

You want another mute?

[proven wolf]

Not mad, you just talking silly bollox.

No point debating with you, if you can't be bothered to apply logic...

It's not my fault you have to been spoon fed information.

[nocturne mural]

Last

Time

I do

Tell you

To stop

All of you

If I see someone write anything after this message on this topic, you'll get 1 week mute

[somber hedge]

why do artifacts no longer heal you? yall think there's a lore reason behind? or just gameplay porpouses?

[normal drum]

Most probably gameplay reasons, the artifacts which prevent bleeding still can be called healing, and we have the Heart of Chornobyl which gives the regeneration effect.

[somber hedge]

i wish they would had brough other legendary artifacts, like the heart of the oasis

[lapis vapor]

What do you think will bé canon, degtyarev kept or gave the Heart of the oasis to the ecologist ?

[shrewd igloo]

What do you think will be canon, skif having a night of passion with ritcher or the heart of chornobyl being destroyed by suslov?

[long latch]

man Skiff is in a world of shit i tell you what!!! WOOOOOO!!!went from doing a "simple job" (V & Jackie) to now being up to his neck in shit. I just discovered the monolith is at SIRCAA...though i think its better off there than at the ruins of CNPP. I was researching the noosphere last night watching youtube videos on it thats freaking WILD that thats a real thing and with CERN and HAARRP god only knows what our corupt governments are up too when you think about it and this game its scary!

[normal drum]

Cool, but note that the definition of the Noosphere in Stalker 2 differs from the real theories, you will get that by further playing

[cyan geyser]

Had a thought. That antenna in Limansk was built by the Radiowave Institute, and they had no connection with the Group. What do you think would happen if we activated it in the presence of someone from Noontide?

Yes I realize this line of thinking is pretty much what leads to thinks like the Zone, and the experiments that took place within lol

[vapid spire]

Speaking of artifact changes where any effects changed in recent patches. Cause flytrap no longer has any negative effects.

[jaunty comet]

Was C-Consciousness trying to do a human instrumentality project with the Noosphere

[sterile blade]

Any news on the sphere in malachite? Looked all over the Internet, nothing concrete apart from its an easter egg to the book/film.The OG Wishgranter

[normal drum]

No, they were trying to remove all negative emotions and thoughts from every person on the planet (their first plan), and after their "death" - to make everyone immortal by removing their consciousnesses from their physical bodies and putting them to the Subtle World - a realm within the Noosphere where mental images of people can communicate with each other, thus creating a new reality, free of death, pain and suffering (their second plan according to the project "Shining").

"We're all to stand upon the sea.
Through death, through darkness, thus.

I choose the nets that swallow me.
This mortal coil failed us." - Scar.

[errant magnet]

What is the propose of the generator area ? And what can I do there ?

[pine kite]

You will go there as a part of the main story

[somber hedge]

I cant wait for the wave of people coming from GAMMA trying to argue that thats canon

[vital pollen]

why is ISG not in stalker 2??? any why is clear sky dead i won the faction war for them