#archived-hdrp

1 messages Β· Page 80 of 1

upper lark
#

ok thanks

turbid matrix
#

they don't really promote the multiple target or target swap functionality on "new" SG setup much though, but it's something that is handy if you shuffle between the SRPs

north belfry
#

Unity Version: 2022.1.0a15
HDRP Ray Tracing is Still broken for reflections
First Image is with Ray Traced Reflections enabled. And with Ray Traced Shadows enabled.
Second Image is with Screen Space Reflections enabled. And with Screen Space Shadows enabled.

unknown.png unknown.png
#

I really want to support raytracing in my game, and my game uses terrains as the main way to navigate, I cannot release my game when the features are still broken and have been broken since 2019

turbid matrix
#

@north belfry unsupported features != broken features

#

terrain support is on their backlog but there's no word when it will arrive. if you absolutely need it, you have to use meshes for RT reflections

#

or... use the mixed/hybrid mode to show raymarched reflections for things that can't exist on Unity's RTAS atm

#

also terrain issue should be one of the smallest issues you would face with raytracing, you can just use meshes for it (doesn't even have to be same fidelity, you can just use those meshes for RT alone)

#

for open world game, you will also miss any vertex manipulation shaders (foliage wind etc) from your RT effects. also particle effects will not get RT love either

#

there really isn't any great option for this, that mixed mode is a compromise which at least enables you to use some RT effects even if you can't support it for everything

dawn sorrel
#

owo what is this, is that a non broken screenspace reflection in HDRP I see.

#

I better boot up my crusty HDRP project and check it out, last time I checked it was an artifacted mess.

normal breach
#

Anyone know why HDRP all of a sudden would brake and show everything as static noise?

iron flame
#

SSR Alpha implementation is wrong.

Even though my min max Smooth settings are 0. reflection produces alpha according to Roughness. SSR looks brighter on low smooth surfaces compared to RTR. because it blends it with the Reflection probe.

I love HDRP, but I'm tired of not having a good SSR implementation for a long time.

unknown.png image_401_0360.jpg image_400_0360.jpg
summer glacier
#

eventually

#

Worth making a thread in HDRP forums about SSR quality as well

turbid matrix
#

heh, they'll just be like, not our SSR again πŸ˜„

#

people ranted a lot about HDRP SSR in past.. then they added accumulation mode for it as response - which even today is ghosting so badly you can't use it in realtime application

vague olive
vague olive
summer glacier
turbid matrix
#

accumulation itself wouldn't be that bad if they had better denoising strategy for it, it feels like their current temporal filtering is just some brute force thing that takes way too many frames to look nice

vague olive
turbid matrix
#

would be interesting to see what would happen if you could slap Nvidias NRD or AMD's FidelityFX Denoiser to the stock HDRP SSR

#

@vague olive I don't think anyone has ported stochastic SSR to HDRP, all implementations I'm aware of are for built-in renderer

#

would be interesting experiment to port it though

#

but like, if you look at the HDRP SSR result before denoising, it's actually quite close to what it should be, just way too noisy to be used as is and denoiser they have just doesn't do good enough job IMHO

#

of course I could be totally off here and it's just simply too noisy to be properly denoised in realtime :p

vague olive
#

@turbid matrix do you have idea how to solve reflection probes and metalic materials?

#

idk how unreal deals with it
but it doesnt leave black spots where the metalic is like unity does

turbid matrix
#

no idea what your issue with it is

vague olive
#

reflection probes bake metalics as dark

#

if you have a lot of metalic materials like a speace ship interior it comes out as very dark

turbid matrix
#

maybe you lift the scene lighting up in volume settings and probe gets the actual true lighting values? (so scene gets post effects but probe doesn't?)

#

no idea how the volume settings impact probe baking though, I'm not really a lighting guy πŸ™‚

iron flame
vague olive
turbid matrix
#

@iron flameyeah I've wondered that too.. RT reflection denoiser is way better atm but it's not been dialed for that noisy results either

summer glacier
vague olive
#

but i avoid true lighting values because unity bloom has no clamp values meaning any light is a solar flare for bloom

turbid matrix
#

that being said, I haven't checked what kind of targets they have for RT denoisers, they could bump the SM requirement beyond what HDRP SSR otherwise requires

vague olive
summer glacier
#

it doesn't really seem to improve it in any meaningful way though, no?

turbid matrix
#

wait, this PR was never merged?

#

I remember those gifs

vague olive
turbid matrix
#

and yeah I seen recent commits on it, using that same branch @iron flame just mentioned

#

I just thought they merged this work last spring already

#

I recently tested HDRP SSR and it was completely broken with accumulation but didn't test with this branch

vague olive
#

metals in HDRP be like

#

wtf is this xd

rich ravine
#

seems like your setup issue

vague olive
#

nope

#

reflection probes are baked

#

but for some reason it uses them in like 10%

rich ravine
#

You're using Linear color space, right? try to turn off sRgb on import for your textures

turbid matrix
#

I don't think you can accidentally have gamma enabled on HDRP, it should nag about it

vague olive
turbid matrix
#

but yeah I do agree that does look like some kind of setup issue on your end

vague olive
#

well

#

what you "feel"

#

isnt the facts here

#

i have literaly 7y of experience with the engine

#

so i would love to know what im doing wrrong for 7 y

turbid matrix
#

look, people just try to help you here

vague olive
#

by saying im wrrong

#

without saying why

rich ravine
#

if every metal would look like what you posted, half population of planet earth would throw rocks at Unity.. just saying..

summer glacier
#

No one is trying to talk down your experience, everyone here helps with no gain, often when someone complains about an issue it's something with their setup -- so it's a fair assumption to make and start from there

turbid matrix
#

you could try to import those problematic assets to a scene that is already preconfigured for HDRP proper and see what happens... as simplest steps I'd just:

  • run through HDRP Wizard, make sure everything is green
  • after wizard is happy, create a new scene and pick HDRP outdoor template for the scene
  • put your can in it and look if it seems still off
vague olive
turbid matrix
#

if it's still off, it's your materials

#

if is fine, it's your scene lighting/exposure

vague olive
turbid matrix
#

anyway, like mentioned, I'd test with those steps

vague olive
rich ravine
vague olive
#

thou its green btw

turbid matrix
#

then take the interior template I dunno.. point was.. test it on somewhere where we know HDRP has lighting including probes preconfigured

vague olive
#

hmm

#

there is this new scene

#

with some interiors

#

i think ill try importing a can there

summer glacier
#

HDRP has an interior template that's there by default for some time

turbid matrix
#

ah, I was talking about the options when you create the new scene

#

it's possible they don't have indoor version there for regular HDRP, it could have been there only if you had raytracing setup etc

#

but that "HDRP Template" thing has some small interior space as well, not sure how good test area it is though

vague olive
turbid matrix
#

yeah I get the issue if it only gives you that outdoor template πŸ™‚ but shouldn't you swap that sky setup for something suitable for indoor use then?

#

and like mentioned before, I'm not really a lighting guy so maybe better not listen to what I say in the first place :p

vague olive
#

here you go

turbid matrix
#

so the metallic sphere is fine but your can is pitch black?

rich ravine
#

I'll be damned, if this is the case of Flipped normals

vague olive
#

yes

vague olive
#

preview is still fine thou

rich ravine
#

can you share the fbx?

vague olive
rich ravine
#

ahh ok

turbid matrix
#

to me it looks like the actual base color is just too dark to be PBR correct

rich ravine
#

No no... I think he baked the texture in Blender with direct n indirect lighting toggled on

vague olive
#

now im confused

#

look

turbid matrix
#

if it's pure metal, I think the color should be light grey at most, but usually way lighter

vague olive
turbid matrix
#

it's quite hard to make guesses without seeing anything of the material setup though

rich ravine
#

by empty, like no lightings or hdris etc.. you'd get darkened textures

vague olive
turbid matrix
#

also if it's issue with mesh normals, you can just select mesh file on your project tab, change it's normals setting to "Calculate" and hit apply

#

it would ignore normals set in blender then but at least you'd see if the issue persists

#

(and then could fix it in blender)

vague olive
#

as you can see in the video

#

the problem is with the exposure

turbid matrix
#

yeah the material looks fine in the last clip

#

the transitions may be bit off there but rest of the scene is baked so it's not fully same setup

vague olive
#

thou it creates new problems but ok

turbid matrix
#

well.. if you don't like the real life lighting intensity setup, you can just not use it.. HDRP will work the same way as built-in if you just set every exposure value to 0 and use tiny lighting intensities

#

I mean somewhat, the values will not match fully but you can use lower intensity lighting with HDRP if you really want to

vague olive
#

no its not like i dont like it

#

look

#

thats a part of the template

#

unnaturaly dark spot near the ground

#

there is something wrrong with untiy handling metalics that i cant point directly at

#

because even if it was very dark metalic material should still take enviroment colors on itself

turbid matrix
#

you talk about GI now?

vague olive
#

yea i just jumped from topic to topic for no reason

#

no

#

im still talking about reflections

vague olive
#

ok i figuret it out

loud leaf
#

Is pmavridis in discord here?

turbid matrix
#

if is, then is lurking or has some clever alter πŸ™‚ never seen Pavlos at least on these RP channels

glad tartan
#

Has anyone here manage to get Stencil Masks in HDRP on Opaque materials? It seems to work for transparent but not Opaque

turbid matrix
#

can you be more specific?

#

stencil buffer isn't material specific

glad tartan
#

Using stencil with HDRP and custom pass it works with transparent materials but not opaque

summer glacier
#

is it just me or are HDRP realtime 'every frame' reflection probes costing way too much in performance compared to built-in and URP?

#

There's also no frame slicing for them in HDRP

turbid matrix
#

@summer glacier it's not you

#

it's totally unfeasible cost for games atm

#

I don't think you are supposed to even use the realtime mode for anything but visualizations or while you tweak the settings in editor

#

there's no frame slicing but even if there were, HDRP probe baking is way slower

summer glacier
#

I think in red dead 2 the player has a reflection probe on him that updates each frame with frame slicing

turbid matrix
#

many games do that yeah, or just do slower update rate in general

shadow hound
#

Hi, can anyone help me on how to implement Nvidia Realtime Denoiser in unity? I simply need a starting point to this. Thanks

turbid matrix
#

@shadow houndI doubt many here actually have access to it, nvidia only gives the repo access to select few, congratulations on that btw

#

(that is, unless they've changed their policy since)

#

it's probably not a trivial swap for existing denoisers though so some experience on HDRP internals is recommended

#

if NRD is anything like AMDs denoiser, I'd expect the main trouble be in getting the source data fed in right form for it

#

or well... just to make this more clear, everyone CAN get access to NRD at least via UE git repo as nvidia has NRD source code on their UE RTX fork but can't use that codebase in Unity πŸ™‚

shadow hound
#

Oh, actually NRD is available to "everyone" there is form you need to submit basically and they'll allow you

turbid matrix
#

did that change?

inner parcel
shadow hound
# turbid matrix or well... just to make this more clear, everyone CAN get access to NRD at least...

I think
https://developer.nvidia.com/nvidia-rt-denoiser/get-started
Here is the link

NVIDIA Developer
NVIDIA Real-Time Denoisers - Early Access Program

NVIDIA Real-Time Denoisers Key Features and Components Release Notes Key Features and Components Fast ray tracing denoising solution NRD is designed to work with 0.5 or 1 ray per pixel Native implementation of the NRD API using engine capabilities Includes three denoisers: ReLAX, ReBLUR, and SIGMA Works with DX11, DX12, and Vulkan compatible eng...

turbid matrix
#

I mean they did decline people's NRD applications in past, it wasn't automatic approval like for nvidia game dev status to get their regular SDKs

vague olive
shadow hound
#

Nopes it's not auto

#

I had to wait for the whole weekend and then got an email from them

turbid matrix
#

maybe they've changed that since then

shadow hound
#

Ig

#

So yeah as I was saying

#

If I build it in the form of a dll, then should I modify HDRP itself? Or should I make a script to handle that?

turbid matrix
#

you have to modify HDRP internals to get it functional, yes

#

ok just checked, my application for NRD is still declined, oh well πŸ˜„

shadow hound
#

Oh, lol... Maybe try again?

#

When did you submit

turbid matrix
#

nah, if they chose not to include my company after doing some quick overview, I really don't bother

#

I submitted when it was announced

#

basically the way to get this approved would be to make a new nvidia dev account and apply again, it would probably go through

eternal laurel
#

Cant you run the denoiser as a post process effect or does it need data from the buffers ?

turbid matrix
#

you'd need access to the RT's that contain the data you want to denoise, also need to feed the denoiser data in form it wants - which most likely isn't 1:1 mapping with what HDRP uses atm

#

at least, that's my assumption, cant test this theory for obvious reasons 😁

eternal laurel
#

You could just ask redstone for it haha doubt there wil be trouble

shadow hound
shadow hound
shadow hound
fervent lantern
#

Hi, I have a HDRP scene that I would like to convert o URP. Anyone know of any tips how to do achieve this relatively quickly?

turbid matrix
#

@eternal laurel I actually have access to NRD source code, my access is just not licensed to be used with Unity

#

(if the access for NRD was what you meant by that comment)

#

there's no Unity integration available, only the SDK and Unreal fork that uses it

#

@fervent lantern main trouble is the materials using HDRP shaders, you can't just swap the shader as shader properties don't map 1:1 between HDRP and URP

#

for smaller scene, doing that manually might still work but is bit tedious

#

for any larger thing, I'd write some conversion tool/script or alternatively make SG that uses same texture etc property slots as the HDRP shaders in your scene has and swap that SG into those materials

#

since SG can contain both HDRP and URP targets, it's trivial to make SG work on both

summer glacier
#

Unity's built-in > URP, probably built-in > HDRP as well: have a VRAM issue. I tried converting a big project and unity crashed, among other issues. Had to manually update a batch of materials manually until all were converted. Not fun πŸ˜„

#

Honestly it wasn't even big, it just didn't have a very small amount of materials which seems to be the converter's limit

turbid matrix
#

@summer glacier it's basically HDRP equivalent of Unreal's capsule shadows. It was a hackweek project last year that didn't immediately see further progress.. it's nice to see they picked it up again

iron flame
# summer glacier https://github.com/Unity-Technologies/Graphics/commits/draft/rp/capsule-shadows ...

It's too bad that nice features like this don't continue to be developed.
another feature Hold
https://github.com/Unity-Technologies/Graphics/pull/570

GitHub
Convex shaped proxy [Hold] by adrien-de-tocqueville Β· Pull Request ...

Guide : https://github.com/Unity-Technologies/Graphics/blob/master/.github/pr-read.png.md
Display Addon : https://userstyles.org/styles/182991/unity-graphics-pr-readme
Purpose of this PR

Why is th...

turbid matrix
#

@iron flame same person did HDRP water shaders year+ ago but that work was never merged either

#

no idea if Anis reused any of that version for the upcoming HDRP water but it was more simple setup in the first place - without SG etc complexity involved

#

there's bunch of other nice ones getting left behind too

#

but on that one I can kinda get why it didn't

#

it's not visually any better than existing SMAA but it is also computationally closer to FXAA cost

#

still, probably wouldn't have been big deal having to maintain it (it's not like SMAA has gotten any bigger changes along these years after getting integrated either)

summer glacier
#

the one I linked

#

nvm I just saw 0lento's response above, didn't notice it πŸ˜„

iron flame
#

Convex shape Reflection probe projection. As a lighting artist. One of my jobs is to put reflection probes around. Box projection in HDRP is great, but not enough. if this branch was merged. My scene with SSGI (reflection probe fallback) would have looked so much better.

unknown.png
summer glacier
#

Yeah there's a lot of cool branches you can find in github, and pulls that were abandoned.

turbid matrix
#

I'm sure there are reasons for many of the things not getting merged despite looking like they were approved already... like some upcoming change that would make the work obsolete or difficult otherwise on the future version

#

Unity actually shipped 2021.2's URP with broken movecs in VR (it just disables movecs in VR now) despite they already had PR fixing this greenlit in the summer

#

it's just sitting there in the line even today

#

talking of graphics github... totally expecting this getting merged

unknown.png
#

it's not even that long time ago when some merge had line "DO NOT MERGE" on that repo πŸ˜„

#

or well something like that

iron flame
#

urp has been working strangely on mobile for a long time. I can't get 60 FPS stable. Of course, VR is also affected by this. 36-72 fps... I couldn't try VR with HDRP, I need oculus link :/
I wonder what weird bugs I will see in VR HDRP πŸ˜„

turbid matrix
#

just poor performance

#

well... there are some things that are broken, like screenspace or contact shadows (non-DXR ones)

eternal laurel
lethal carbon
#

noob question..
q1 ) Is it possible to mask custom passes with tags, not layers?
q2) My goals are as follows. How should I do it?

  • use custom pass outline (ex https://github.com/alelievr/HDRP-Custom-Passes )
  • custom pass effect should be applied to the child object even if only the layer or tag of the parent object is changed.
    (for example, Even if only the tag of the parent object (NPC) is checked as Outlined,
    the outline effect is applied according to the mesh shape of the child objects (Head, hand, body etc...) of Character A, the child object of NPC.)
NPC (Outlined)
 γ„΄CharacterA
      γ„΄ Head
      γ„΄ Body
      γ„΄ etc...
GitHub
GitHub - alelievr/HDRP-Custom-Passes: A bunch of custom passes made...

A bunch of custom passes made for HDRP. Contribute to alelievr/HDRP-Custom-Passes development by creating an account on GitHub.

#

If you have any other better problem approach, please let me know.
Is there a good option other than custom pass to use outline, ui blur, camera stacking?

exotic hare
#

Where and how can I modify light layers

inner parcel
lethal carbon
#

I'm also curious about the proper use of the outline custom pass as above.

Setting the layer to outline and applying it (use layer mask)was successful.
However, it is not affected by the child object. (It would be possible if i could change the all layer by traversing all child objects, but it looks like something silly.)

inner parcel
inner parcel
summer glacier
#

upcoming water system for HDRP in 2022.something
this is an early github version still not merged to master, also missing a few commits
many improvements will come to the final version most likely before release, similar to volumetric clouds
(not made by me obviously lol, made by anis from unity)

vapid matrix
#

how to enable RTX raytracing (for settings) if i dont have a rtx card?

#

where is it?

vapid matrix
summer glacier
#

previous generation also has support, like GTX 1070, 1060, it's all in that page

vapid matrix
#

yeah, i know. but i have vega 7

#

so if ill enable/disable raytracing in framesettings of camera, will it enable/disable RTX?

summer glacier
#

Test it out

turbid matrix
#

if vega 7 has DXR support, it should work

night birch
#

Guys

#

does any have 10 min time?

#

i have a problem with Photon Xd

turbid matrix
#

this isn't really place for that πŸ™‚

night birch
#

sryy

#

i thought iam in network

#

Xd

#

sry

summer glacier
turbid matrix
#

they have such? in past they only had one for Bolt

#

it's probably only discord I've ever been banned from πŸ˜„

summer glacier
#

Oh, how come? Tell tell πŸ˜„

turbid matrix
#

it's not really a story for this channel either :p

summer glacier
#

DM DM

muted crown
summer glacier
muted crown
#

i tried that one

#

it was invalid

#

and that's why I came asking you

#

oh boy am I stupid

#

it was also there...

#

Thanks @summer glacier

vapid matrix
#

How do I setup RTX for players if my AMD 5600G can't do RTX?😁

turbid matrix
#

simply.. you don't

#

you need some way to verify the results or it will be totally off

#

(meaning you have to dial the settings to work properly on your scene)

#

you probably CAN enable it without supported hardware on your dev rig but it's a horrible idea

vapid matrix
#

i enabled dxr (and probably raytracing) on my system

#

ui with dx12 looks very sharp

#

and fps dropped with raytracing and reflections enabled

#

but i dont think it is working properly

#

(i know i dont have rt cores)

turbid matrix
#

@vapid matrix how it works is that if you use those things on system that doesn't have DXR capabilities, it will automatically fallback to screenspace variants of those effects

#

but I do stress that you can't tell how your raytracing version will look like without being able to test it on actual hardware

#

it could be totally broken, or way too heavy, or just look horrible

vapid matrix
#

i wont say it looks VERY bad, but ok

unknown.png
turbid matrix
#

that is not the raytraced version you are looking at

vapid matrix
#

i know

#

there is no diff

#

i sent this version of a game to my friend

#

that has laptop with a 1660 (ti i guess) mobile

#

dont know if mobile will work

#

but on official site 1660 ti is supported

turbid matrix
#

even if it works, it will be very slow because that gpu doesn't have dedicated hardware for DXR

vapid matrix
#

yeah

#

but i have an option for disabling raytracing

#

like rt

turbid matrix
#

also be aware that DX12 on it's own runs tad slower than DX11 on HDRP

glad tartan
#

HDRP in master on GitHub is now at HDRP 14

vapid matrix
#

14??

turbid matrix
#

2022.2 alphas getting closer

#

they are already at beta internally on 2022.1

vapid matrix
#

omg

#

will 2022.2 bring better lighting?

rich ravine
#

2021.x lts when .. I can't stand using 2021.2b.. want to upgrade soon

glad tartan
rich ravine
#

yes, but I thought, i want to save some space, my hdd is in critical right now πŸ₯²

#

I think based on the roadmap it should be around february perhaps, for the lts

glad tartan
#

Replace the Beta with the official release? Unless you keep all Unity versions you install?

#

nah 2022.1 will be released about half way through 2022

rich ravine
#

I keep a lot of Unity versions installed still, bcos most of them are tied to certain projects

#

and also bcos it was related to some packages that's no longer supported in the newer versions

vapid matrix
#

segi is still alive???

unknown.png
vapid matrix
turbid matrix
#

@vapid matrixHDRP Wizard has DXR tab

vapid matrix
#

what

#

it shows even in dxr mode

dawn sorrel
#

I've seen 2 examples of in prod games on the unity subreddit using SSGI already, apparently it actually looks good surprisingly enough πŸ€”

turbid matrix
#

it's pretty good but the screenspace limitation is pretty obvious

#

if you have like fixed camera angle, SSGI can actually work quite nicely as you can control the artifacts better then

summer glacier
#

2022.1 seems like it will have very little features, similar to 2021.1

dawn sorrel
#

There is this one game about solving puzzles with portals in side view.

summer glacier
#

Oh I remember that one on twitter

dawn sorrel
#

If you frequent the subreddit, you might remember it, yeah.

#

@turbid matrix oh, it will look shit in first person constantly moving?

summer glacier
#

I used SSGI, in 2021.2 it's pretty nice but screen space limitations as lento said are pretty evident. I feel like it does better in open spaces where there's more light, not interiors --

#

Performance is really nice too

dawn sorrel
#

Ah dang. Well, I'll try it some time anyway.

summer glacier
#

Even in interiors you can get good results, but sometimes it can cause some issues since in the screen there might be very little light. SSGI would probably be great with fixed cameras as stated before. SSGI should probably be used alongside APV

dawn sorrel
#

I thought the new probes were abandoned in a branch somewhere?

summer glacier
#

I don't think so, frances seems to still be actively working on it

inner parcel
turbid matrix
#

@dawn sorrelyeah the issue really is that when you move away from the light source, you can definitely tell it's off

#

it looks great when the things are in screen data though

summer glacier
#

benefit of SSGI is no baking, but it can't really be compared to baked lightmaps/enlighten

#

enlighten is pretty nice, happy they brought it back.. what a show it was though lol. Shame it'll receive no improvements for years until it's support is over. Unity is already using an old version.

inner parcel
#

that's true if you're viewing your product as a developer. for end user playing a fps game with dynamic scene, it's usually rtxgi > realtime gi enlighten > ssgi

dawn sorrel
#

Well, if it's a multiplayer game at least, nobody will enable RTX, that's for sure πŸ˜›

summer glacier
#

also unity should really improve their occlusion culling.
There's an asset called perfect culling that does a much better job with next to no performance issues

dawn sorrel
summer glacier
#

ignoring the questionable occlusion quality, the performance overhead is too much

#

after a certain point it's just not worth using

inner parcel
#

It will come eventually. HDRP is quite young compared to other competitions

dawn sorrel
#

I can tell a Unity game is using occlusion culling when I can outrun it into an empty world or buildings vanish when the camera gets closer πŸ˜›

#

Unity would probably have to enter the 21st century first and add occlusion query support to command buffers.

turbid matrix
#

I still can't believe we are almost at year 2022 and people still bake lighting

#

it's so bad workflow

dawn sorrel
#

Idk, whatever probe setup AAA do seems less painful.

summer glacier
#

everytime I think about GI, I remember cryengines SVOGI.. so good.

turbid matrix
#

cryengine doesn't even have concept of baked lightmaps πŸ˜„

drifting vault
summer glacier
#

Performance is fast, quality is good, it's not perfect and can have light leaks but it's more than acceptable

dawn sorrel
#

Well nobody used the SVOGI Unity asset so it was abandoned innit.

turbid matrix
#

not feeling super optimistic on that though since all 3rd party unity gi solutions end up in gi graveyard

dawn sorrel
#

Oh yeah haha.

#

Did you stumble upon ruins on threads too?

#

There is also this sky occlusion thingy Unity implemented for some project didn't they.

turbid matrix
#

occlusion probes?

summer glacier
#

Occlusion probes

dawn sorrel
#

I never even knew it was something necessary.

#

I guess?

summer glacier
#

They planned to add it to unity.. but ofc never happened πŸ™‚

turbid matrix
#

afaik they have ported some of it to light probes, at least on URP

summer glacier
#

still salty over that

dawn sorrel
#

I don't even get the purpose, how does it make everyhing so soft.

summer glacier
#

vegetation looks 10x better with it

dawn sorrel
#

Yeah, but like what physical phenomenon is it supposed to be.

turbid matrix
#

light occlusion? πŸ˜„

dawn sorrel
#

But like what is light occlusion πŸ˜›

turbid matrix
#

you don't get flat lit trees in the forest

summer glacier
#

You can see it in kingdom come: deliverance, using cryengine 3 SVOGI

turbid matrix
#

light will get occluded by the branches

summer glacier
#

the occlusion of vegetation is just amazing. Honestly without it it looks bland as hell, typical bad unity vegetation

#

πŸ˜„

dawn sorrel
#

So it's sort of like a 2nd part of realistic shadows occluding only a bit.

turbid matrix
#

but no idea if that project is still alive or not

summer glacier
#

man.. if HDRP adds something like that.

dawn sorrel
#

There is an analytical shadows asset and that's it.

summer glacier
#

but of course not..

dawn sorrel
#

Graphics programmers are really allergic to finishing things it seems πŸ˜›

turbid matrix
#

that occlusion probes setup unity did for BotD is still functional on recent Unity versions

#

I recently tried it with URP

dawn sorrel
#

It's only for exteriors, right?

turbid matrix
#

can use it for anything that needs occlusion baked to 3D texture

#

Bakery has similar functionality too

#

occlusion probe thing doesn't work with high intensity HDRP lighting though... it was made when that wasn't a thing yet

eternal laurel
#

recently watched this https://youtu.be/h1ocYFrtsM4 Honestly it feels that it can be implemented in HDRP rather well and without having to re-write the pipeline at all

YouTube
SEED – Electronic Arts
SIGGRAPH 2021: Global Illumination Based on Surfels

This course was presented at ACM SIGGRAPH 2021. https://s2021.siggraph.org/

The SIGGRAPH presentation by Henrik Halen and Andreas Brinck presents global Illumination Based on Surfels (GIBS) – a solution for calculating indirect diffuse illumination in real-time. The solution combines hardware ray tracing with a discretization of scene geometry ...

β–Ά Play video
eternal laurel
#

What I dont understand from this video is the mentioned acceleration structure. If anyone know more about this and can point me to some resources πŸ™‚ that would be great

ember breach
#

Same, still discussing im my mind of trying to choose, but first trying to do DDGI in URP, then I can extend my knowledge beyond

turbid matrix
#

Forza Horizon 5 uses surfel GI as well (unless it's something else that they just call with similar terms)

#

not sure if it's the best example though as I don't think they've authored GI proper on all places on that game

#

it works nicely on some cliffs and boulders but their tunnels look totally off, like even bad for non-GI solutions

ember breach
#

yea, I saw in the vid that BF 2042 uses it, but literally saw tons of spots that were not lit properly that should not have a difficulty of mapping

#

like in BF just today

turbid matrix
#

still wondering when we'll get access to dynamic APV

#

I don't believe for a moment it doesn't exist internally at Unity offices

eternal laurel
#

Yeah and didnt they have a working version of DDGI ?

turbid matrix
#

prototype of it yeah

eternal laurel
#

But they never released any code for it

turbid matrix
#

yeah, expectation was that we might have gotten a preview of that DDGI 2 years ago

#

I did ask about it but the staff responses were bit cryptic on that so they must have known it may not release even back then

#

(asked from the presenters as I attended the Unite session where they presented it

eternal laurel
#

Im still mad about the distributed network baking

#

From hack week way back in the past

turbid matrix
#

I actually naively thought the progressive gpu lightmapper would have made light bakes way less pain in Unity... but reality is that you still wait forever to get your results

#

I can't see myself working like that, wonder how people do it

eternal laurel
#

I tried making a distributed system but it was so hacky I gave up

dawn sorrel
#

Probably by buying Bakery that has realtime preview πŸ˜›

turbid matrix
#

does the distributed lightmass work well on unreal?

ember breach
#

oh dynamic?

turbid matrix
#

@dawn sorrel that RT preview doesn't really match the final result though... there's probably a good reason why the Bakery RT-preview store page doesn't have ANY comparison shots between RT preview and final scene

#

you can just see if it's somewhere in the ballpark

#

but Bakery doesn't have progressive mode either so I guess it makes more sense if you use Bakery

#

@ember breach yeah I don't mean the current setup πŸ™‚

dawn sorrel
#

Ah, that's a shame.

#

So this surfel thing is realtime with no baking 😳

eternal laurel
#

From my limited experience unreal light baking is even more of problem

turbid matrix
#

they got faster gpu lightmass now

#

but wonder if that's even getting much love now that Lumen is a thing

eternal laurel
turbid matrix
#

I really dig that UE5 is aiming to do as much as possible in real-time... will be cool in 5 years when avg customers have gear that can utilize that

eternal laurel
#

Since our next game is procedural but rooms will be hand made I wonder how easy I can stitch lightmaps

dawn sorrel
#

That are supported on current hardware.

turbid matrix
#

@eternal laurel would that APV work for that? you'd think you could blend prebaked probes easier than make two separately baked lightmaps blend together nicely

#

no idea if they support that kind of setup with APV at all though

eternal laurel
#

I was thinking about that too but Im vey vey confused about APV

turbid matrix
#

well they DID implement SVOGI πŸ˜„

eternal laurel
#

Its not the probe volume thing that is experimental right?

dawn sorrel
turbid matrix
#

it's the same time (adaptive probe volume)

eternal laurel
#

Because they said that is not a GI solution

turbid matrix
#

@dawn sorrel UE4 had realtime-GI while it was still in beta, they removed it little before the full release as it didn't perform well enough on hardware at that given time

eternal laurel
#

And if its not how is it different from my solution that generates old light probes in a volume and respects colliders

#

Well its not my solution that came out wrong

turbid matrix
dawn sorrel
#

Well, AAA did it so why can't a single generic engine do it 😒

turbid matrix
#

that video is from 2012

eternal laurel
#

@turbid matrix so is APV used for GI or not ?

turbid matrix
#

the irony on UE4 removing that before release was that it would have been feasible tech perf wise just 2 years after initial release, they were just so hasty in scrapping it

#

@eternal laurel APV today can be used for baked GI, Unity doesn't recommend it as baked lighting replacement but it essentially does that still

dawn sorrel
#

I'm sure if Unity was open source we'd get a crazy programmer to implement realtime GI just like what happened in Godot and Stride.

eternal laurel
turbid matrix
#

"In its current state, use the Probe Volume system as a replacement for the per-object Light Probe system, not as a replacement for lightmaps."

unknown.png
#

the messaging is more like, it's not replacement of existing lightmaps (yet)

eternal laurel
#

But maybe

turbid matrix
#

it specifically does bake GI data to probes

eternal laurel
#

In my procedural context

#

Its just gonna work

#

If each prefab can hold its own volume

#

Got to test how they store the data

turbid matrix
#

they've worked on some tiling stuff for APV but I don't know how any of that works

eternal laurel
#

I bet its per scene

turbid matrix
#

even then the real question is if you can offset or rotate the scene content along with the probe volume

#

(which you'd need for procedural levels)

#

I'd expect it to just contain the volume specific data but it's been long time since I last tested APV

eternal laurel
#

I think stiching the lightmaps might be my best bet

#

But I will give APV a try too

#

Or yolo and try this serfel stuff. It seems to me it would work very well in my corridor type env

turbid matrix
#

does that surfel stuff work without DXR hardware?

#

no idea if that even runs on current Unity versions, it's ancient thing

#

pretty sure that sample is still more of showcasing how to assemble multiscene setup with baked lights but in fully fixed configuration

eternal laurel
#

Looks interesting but I dont want my level parts to be scenes

turbid matrix
eternal laurel
#

As for the serfel technique the surfels are raytraced but I dont see why DXR would be needed. Maybe Im groslly missunderstanding but I see no reason for the rays to not work in a compute shader

#

What does he mean its up on github?

#

Did bakery go free πŸ˜†

turbid matrix
#

I assume it's some repo paid customers get access to

eternal laurel
#

There was a talk from bethesda on how they used lightmaps for the proc dungeons in blades

dawn sorrel
eternal laurel
#

And I want to do just that to be honest

#

Perhaps this and apv will "magically" solve my problems haha

#

One can hope

dawn sorrel
#

Well, you'll also have to write some shaders to blend the seams so enjoy your undocumented adventures I guess πŸ˜„

turbid matrix
#

(still require those 3D textures to be prebaked)

#

I guess that isn't really intended for baked geometry but you'd think it would still work altho being more expensive

vapid matrix
#

yooo rtx in hdrp is incredible

eternal laurel
ember breach
#

@turbid matrix I wonder why those APV probes aren't DDGI instead, maybe they are hiding it in behind somewhere in closet. But rn they are very, very simple, where you gotta have a lot to lightup scene, so yeah not great lightmapping, always bleeding everywhere, literally on 1m thick wall

eternal laurel
#

Actually Im wrong about that the rays need to collide with geometry. I guess I have to watch it again

ember breach
#

Yeah, but if you have 1060 6GB onwards just use DXR, if you are using mobile than most wont even have compute shaders

thorny quiver
#

Hi, Im making my first HDRP project but ive noticed that the scene view looks really dark and depressing compared to the game view or the scene view in an urp project. I guess that normal but I would still like to "fix" it, is there any way I can do that?

turbid matrix
#

@thorny quiverrun through HDRP Wizard and create a new scene after that, it will have lighting and exposure dialed to sane defaults

#

you can still play with those values, it's just easier to start with something that's functional from the start

thorny quiver
turbid matrix
#

@thorny quiverhttps://docs.unity3d.com/Packages/com.unity.render-pipelines.high-definition@12.0/manual/Render-Pipeline-Wizard.html

#

meaning, run that tool and hit "fix all" if it finds issues

thorny quiver
#

Ah alright thanks

stray nova
#

Do Volumentric Clouds not work on Apple Silicon builds? I've followed the directions for enabling them and I get an error saying my config doesn't support them.

hot pivot
#

Hey! I have some problems with custom passes :
I added two custom passes to add an "outline" shader effect. It works pretty well in editor, but i see nothing in the packaged build.

I have no idea what the probleme is... And i don't know what i can do to figure out what is wrong πŸ˜…

If someone has an idea...

unknown.png
#

(the expected result)

unknown.png
hot pivot
inner parcel
hot pivot
#

oh...

#

How could have been so dumb.... dcd

#

didn't know there was an option to enable forward or deferred in the hdrp asset.. i though it was because i didn't implemented all the passes in my shaders

#

Well thanks πŸ˜…

vapid matrix
#

how do I setup DXR for settings on unsupported hardware?

loud leaf
#

What GPU?

turbid matrix
ember breach
#

reading it rn πŸ˜„

inner parcel
vapid matrix
vapid matrix
eternal laurel
#

I dont think you will get dxr on a cpu

vapid matrix
#

it won't have dxr at any point

#

it is like gtx 1050

shadow hound
#

DXR on 1660 Ti is okay for editing, like just okay, imagine a CPU now lol

vapid matrix
#

hdrp on vega 7 works ok

vapid matrix
#

ok

high prairie
#

How do you write to the motion vectors buffer? And is there an easy way to generate motion vectors for static geometry based off the past & current frame depth buffers for the static geometry that needs the motion vectors?

#

Since everything is static it would just be from the camera moving / parallax effect

vague notch
#

i upgraded my project from urp to hdrp and now it does not even open

#

it crashes and outputs no errors

high prairie
#

How do you write / read from the g buffers in hdrp?

chrome locust
#

You can use AOV system. I don't recommend tapping gbuffers directly even though we don't change the encoding they aren't meant to be public API.

chrome locust
# ember breach yea, I saw in the vid that BF 2042 uses it, but literally saw tons of spots that...

As far as I know bf 2042 does not use GIBS. When I left EA we were adding support for enlighten to GPU probes. GPU probes was the system i developed for NFS. This is the system that now every EA game is using. Dragon age and dead space will be GPU probes + lightmaps.
GIBS is limited exclusively to ray tracing hardware.
GPU probes is similar to APV in unity, but has also support for Englighten. Mathias, Matti and Carlos added support for enlighten, really good light leaking workflows and made it happen on 60fps

#

GIBS isn't feasible in my opinion because it fully requires ray tracing. EA needs to develop a proper sdf radiance scene and it would be super expensive. Dynamic GI is a very hard problem.

ember breach
#

Yeah, thats why first I am trying to make my own DDGI which could be bakeable so it can run on devices without DXR support.

chrome locust
#

Godots sdf scene is fantastic. However their probe grid is terrible imo. Everything super blocky. I think a combination of GIBS, far field lighting, and very efficient sdf scene could be compelling

#

DDGI is insanely expensive. I don't think is feasible either for real time

ember breach
#

Yeah saw that and was blown away, literally was like why arent we having anything similar in Unity in so many years...

ember breach
chrome locust
#

I don't know why unity didn't catch up here. Missed opportunities. But things are moving. So future is exciting.

#

I think we should cut things like background live baking :)

ember breach
#

Yes, but I do not like how much stuff they are hiding, if they said yeah we are making GI solution that will be this and that, so I do not have to do my own would be cool, but for dynamic AVPs we still haven't had a single thing said or shown

chrome locust
#

10x of cost in maintenance and a pool of never ending bugs. And still barely works

#

Oh we haven't hidden anything

#

We are still planning

#

Trust me, when something starts you will start seeing the PRs

ember breach
#

πŸ˜„ yeah like most of the times my editor crashes when seeing live baking result happening... if you mean current solution

chrome locust
#

Yeah I think we gotta cut some maintenance cost

ember breach
chrome locust
#

So we make room for capacity

ember breach
#

yeah, I think there should be like restructure in like stopping the most of the maintenance altogether, most of the features are kinda feeling old at this point and the new ones could take over if they got full time work at them for few months

eternal laurel
turbid matrix
turbid matrix
#

to be honest, I feel like Unity should have that kind of setup for all baked lights

#

of course you can do this on unity today already, just feel it would be nice to have this more integrated to the workflow

ember breach
#

Definitely, but nice seeing something like that coming to APV.

marsh urchin
#

hello

#

can someone help me pls

#

why is my hdrp so

Screenshot_20.png
outer carbon
#

Are you using the HDRP pipeline in your graphics settings?

marsh urchin
#

idk

#

i will look

#

i dont have a render pipline

#

how can i change it

high prairie
#

How can I force my unlit shader to write to the Camera Depth Texture?

marsh urchin
#

i mean set this up

outer carbon
marsh urchin
#

okey

#

thx

stark vine
#

I have a custom terrain shader but it don't work with terrain system. I compile my shader graph into code and add the tag "Terrain compatible" and assign it to the material but it doesn't work :(
the result is just a bugged terrain πŸ€”

unknown.png
turbid matrix
#

that message should be selfexplanotary

#

you need to use terrain shader compatible with HDRP

#

terrain shader graph is still quite far away

ember breach
stark vine
stark vine
stark vine
#

(i turn my tangent space to object but he is always in tangent space)

mint trout
#

any idea why my rotated textures come out a different colour?

sinful locust
mint trout
#

fixed it lol

#

i didnt have my normals set to "normal" in the inspector

#

thats 2 hours of my life wasted

turbid matrix
#

@sinful locust could go for 2022.2 even, we'll see

#

2021 cycle isn't getting new features anymore unless they make some big exception and 2022.1 is already at beta (internally) so it's close to feature cut off point already

#

Unity also already set the master branch on graphics github to SRP 14, meaning 2022.1 is already getting backport treatment there

#

so... chances that water is going to get on 2022.2 earliest are getting higher every day

#

afaik there's nothing on the water itself that wouldn't work on older HDRPs if you manually ported it there but it will be PITA to maintain

turbid matrix
#

or recompute the mesh normals?

#

if you have faulty normals on either texture map or in the mesh, lighting will look off and can make the color look different depending on the rotation

#

can't immediately think of other reason

olive girder
#

Has anyone found out that 2020 hdrp is slower than 2021?

#

I have a project with almost an empty scene and with a rtx 2070 I'm running at 80 fps 😦

turbid matrix
#

@olive girder that is expected, HDRP is still getting tons of optimizations so new versions should be faster

#

it's kinda opposite what I'm seeing with URP atm :/

#

also, HDPR enables a lot of features out of the box which you might not even be using, you can definitely get more than 80fps on somewhat empty scene with HDRP and RTX2070

#

This was a stupid test but that's HDRP 12 (Unity 2021.2) with every setting turned off on my RTX2070 super. With some content and settings better optimized for the content, you'd still be hitting few hundred fps

HDRP-Sphere-rtx2070s.jpg
#

and yeah, rendering a ball without any options enabled is silly and doesn't really prove anything (other than that you can't really get past 1200fps on HDRP with RTX2070S - unless you go fully unlit). Reason this test even exists is because got sucked into this pointless forum debate where someone claimed HDRP only being capable running 30fps while rendering single sphere... ...and one can probably guess how we got into this from that

#

the real point why I showed this was... you can slim down the HDRP rendering a lot if you turn off things you don't really need. Nobody is really going to turn every option off - that's not really point here - just trying to say there's a lot to gain if you disable things you don't use atm.

turbid matrix
#

(HDRP 14)

olive girder
#

@turbid matrix I see, is there anywhere I can see how to on/off the options you mention?

summer glacier
#

Use the profiler, find out what's taking so much. Usually on an empty scene, unless your GPU is powerful, GPU will be the bottleneck on HDRP. Since HDRP by default has a lot of post-processing and other stuff running on the gpu.

olive girder
#

we have many shadow casters

#

but similar amount to the sample scene

summer glacier
#

you profiled GPU and CPU? What's your bottleneck?

olive girder
#

also we dont have anything baked but just 1 realtime light

#

gpu mostly

#

the game is empty

summer glacier
#

You should know the cause from the profile data -- if you have it open, can you send me the profiler data

#

I'll check it out

#

you can export it

olive girder
#

it's not as simple as that, I was about to say we have some lamps as well creating low quality shadows

summer glacier
#

Disable shadows on all lights, is your perf back to normal?

olive girder
#

i ll export it never the less and send you

#

no 😦

#

we get some very minimal gains

#

we disabled all the volumes

summer glacier
#

Hmm, I need to see the profiler info

olive girder
#

sec unity crashed

#

πŸ˜„

#

do you want deep profiling? πŸ˜„

#

@summer glacier

summer glacier
#

How come your spending 25ms on the cpu?

#

ignoring editor overhead, 19ms

#

There's no GPU data in that file, although it doesn't look like GPU is your bottleneck

#

Can I get another one with GPU data, although it looks like it maybe is CPU bottlenecked

#

worth making a build and profiling there, as the editor has a lot of overhead. And your spending a lot of time on the CPU, but most of the cost source isn't showing up
Unless GPU is your bottleneck and CPU is waiting for it, but for some reason it has no WaitForGPU or similar

olive girder
#

that's why I said it wasn't that easy, currently I have some AI in there as well but minor stuff, not sure why it would take up 6 ms - also weird that it didn't include gpu data

#

80 fps is on build - in editor I have 60

summer glacier
#

Vsync is off I assume?

#

How much ms is GPU taking in profiler?

olive girder
#

vsync is off

#

it says 0

#

ha

#

gpu just says draw calls etc

summer glacier
#

If GPU module is on in profiler, it should tell you how much time it's taking, similar to CPU

#

what OS are you using?

olive girder
#

11 windows

#

2020.23

summer glacier
#

go to Profiler modules

#

and enable GPU

#

rendering is not gpu

olive girder
#

aha, disclaimer, it wasnt me who tested all this for 2 weeks

#

94ms

#

on other

summer glacier
#

Try disabling expanse completely and switching to HDRI/physical sky and see what happens

#

but yeah that value is weird, if profiler isn't showing it -- you need to use Renderdoc

olive girder
#

expanse was added after I removed the normal one, I get 10 fps difference

summer glacier
#

it feels like overhead though, CPU editor loop is taking 37ms and in total CPU cost is 55.30ms GPU is 57ms

#

so maybe the crazy high values are caused by editor overhead

olive girder
#

build isnt much faster though 😦

#

without expanse

summer glacier
#

I meant that the crazy values (50ms, 90ms) are caused by the overhead, after that is your actual project cost

#

and if you want to profile GPU on a build, you need to disable graphic jobs in player settings

olive girder
#

yeah sure, but I cant check with renderdoc for more than just debugging really, it doesnt have time profiling

summer glacier
#

create a development build with graphic jobs disabled, and profile GPU+CPU, that should give you actual costs for your project

#

if possible send it as well

olive girder
#

how come graphics jobs create issues

summer glacier
#

GPU module doesn't work with it, don't really know why

olive girder
#

ah ok

#

i ll do a build now

inner parcel
# olive girder unfortunately we've spent a couple of weeks on it and we aren't very sure still ...

80fps is totally not acceptable. Can you create a new project with empty scene and all assets/graphic settings and send it?

My game (almost 2M vertices and few directional lights and lots of point light, few post process, volumetric fog, TAA and motion blur) runs at 300-500fps on rtx 2070s that too in 2020.3 (in release build)
2021.2 still runs within the same range but the fps is more stable there thanks to dynamic res

olive girder
#

@summer glacier

eternal laurel
#

Is that a project or a build I can test on my machine too

olive girder
#

profiler data

eternal laurel
#

My bad I was thinking you responded to malloc

#

If you build your test scene with a fps counter I can test it too

summer glacier
#

looks pretty good, 6.8-8~ms

summer glacier
# olive girder

SSAO is taking 1ms on the GPU, way too high. did you enable full res for SSAO?

#

If so disable it, and lower the settings if they're very high

olive girder
#

this is without expanse, it runs at 110 fps

#

hmm

summer glacier
#

The results are pretty good, it looks like you're just a little bit GPU bound, but sometimes it's a really small difference.

#

if you lower SSAO quality, and disable motion blur, you will probably start being CPU bound

#

it's a good balance rn

olive girder
#

this one didnt have a directional light

summer glacier
#

GPU:

  1. reduce SSAO quality, disable full res if it's enabled (1ms)
  2. Do you need motion blur? It's expensive relative to other post processing costs, 0.35ms
  3. volumetric lighting is taking 1.5ms but I assume that's needed

CPU:
Normal costs really, you can try caching shadows (that aren't directional light shadows)
You can cache directional light shadows as well, but since directional caching is bashed on frustum you'll have to update it very often compared to others, to prevent popping shadows issues

olive girder
#

this is with expanse

summer glacier
#

Also you have quite a few drawcalls, 1.1k -- can you try reducing it? Combine similar meshes if possible

olive girder
#

we have a day/night cycle so directional cant be cached

#

for the other shadows I think hdrp has a way to reduce shadows to 1 fps or something?

summer glacier
#

You can cache it still, you're only caching shadows so they don't render every frame

#

for directional light you can update it every few framees, find the right value for your project

#

make sure lights that don't need volumetrics have it disabled, shadows as well

olive girder
#

check example4 which has the lights cause that's running at 67 fps πŸ˜›

#

Build

summer glacier
#

on example four you're GPU bound big time

olive girder
#

yeah, and all I changed is added the directional light from expanse

summer glacier
#

Expanse can be expensive compared to HDRP stuff, even if you don't use clouds

#

expanse is taking around 3.1ms for sky

#

and 1.5ms to update sky

#

Unlike unity physical sky, expanse don't cache sky so you get it's cost each frame

#

it would still be better to use RenderDoc for your use case as it shows everything, but from how things are looking

olive girder
#

believe me when I say that we had tried all the above and we weren't getting any improvements, probably this new clean scene put things together again

summer glacier
#

you can do what I said to get a few ms, reduce SSAO quality, maybe disable motion blur, disable volumetric on lights that don't need it
and reduce your batches/drawcalls

olive girder
#

we were using enviro before

#

I ll see if we can cache expanse's stuff as well

#

we can't afford -40-50 fps just for that

summer glacier
#

I doubt it, needs some work to expanse sky system, I asked brad about it once (author of expanse), there are some benefits for not caching, but obviously there's costs as well

olive girder
#

yeah Im talking to him in his forum as well

#

but we just started using expanse 2-3 days ago, we've had the fps issue for a month

summer glacier
#

The question is how does it compare with physical sky and unity directional light? Without expanse?

olive girder
#

I think enviro and maybe some other stuff was causing some pretty big issues that now have been removed

#

120 fps

#

with the default sky and just one directional light

summer glacier
#

That's pretty good

#

Expanse is great but can be a bit expensive

#

depending on your project

olive girder
#

our project won't have much going on

#

no particles or special vfx at all times

#

it ll have 30 characters, a day/night cycle and AI

#

characters wont be visible at all times

summer glacier
#

If you eventually upgrade to 2021.2 you can use FSR/DLSS/Temporal upscaling to help with GPU costs, although it won't help massively on 1080p without some visual differences

olive girder
#

noted but it's not LTS

summer glacier
#

You can try to optimize expanse settings for sky/fog/atmosphere

olive girder
#

yeah I just had the default setting and the day/night cycle

#

Im worried now that I m missing something and I ll go back to the bad fps tomorrow

summer glacier
#

Check out quality settings on expanse, try reducing atmosphere/fog to potato quality

#

if it's not set already

olive girder
#

πŸ˜„

#

will do

#

thanks Max

#

I ll poke you when I look at things again

chilly frigate
#

i would like to use a layered lit material on an object to layer 2 shaders on top of each other, but it doesnt work, how would I go about doing this?

grizzled flame
chilly frigate
#

not shader materials

glad tartan
inner parcel
inner parcel
chilly frigate
#

I ended up using a different methood! But thanks!

inner parcel
#

it's not required in most setups. it's mostly needed by artists going with a different work flow

barren goblet
#

Hi, I want to use the RTHandle in the CoreRP files, but it use the Unity.Rendering one.

#

there's no SetTexture inside the RTHandle

#

is it because it is an internal function?

eternal laurel
#

but I'm very unsure on how to test it. I'm just currently reading trough the code its very interesting

#

foreach (var brg in brgers) eat burgers

summer glacier
#

Is the GPUdriven work going to be in HDRP/gameobjects?

iron flame
trim bone
#

@summer glacier my understanding is yes, it was the stuff that dots required but they are now making the api gameobject friendly

turbid matrix
#

@trim bone lol, no

#

just sent that PR

#

anyone can send PRs to that repo

trim bone
#

damn was hoping we had an inside man to divulge secrets!

vapid plaza
#

guys

#

how do i make bounced lighting... im making a realism mod for gta 5 so pls help

eternal laurel
vapid plaza
#

oh wait wrong channel

eternal laurel
#

wrong server my man

turbid matrix
#

@eternal laurel what I'm most curious on this is if they will backport these to 2022.1 or if it will be 2022.2 only

#

I mean now the engine API itself, I totally don't expect RenderBRG to exist in 2022.1

eternal laurel
#

Probably 2022.2 only I feel backporting of features like this does not happen

turbid matrix
#

features, especially this magnitude sounds totally out of the question, especially since 2022.1 is already at beta

#

but one can backport things manually still - as long as the engine side changes exist

#

that splitVisibilityMask doesn't exist on current 2022.1 alphas as it just landed to trunk internally... but I have no idea how they split stuff like that there

#

lack of splitVisibilityMask, cullingSplits and cullingContextcullingSplits seem to be only things preventing us from running this on current 2022.1 a16

#

yes, I tried

eternal laurel
#

I have no idea what those are I didn't even try to run that branch

#

cullingContextcullingSplits sounds like it needs a name refactor

turbid matrix
#

lol

#

yeah

eternal laurel
#

I started researching if it is possible to do HZB culling in HDRP today but I dont think it's gonna be as easy as I hoped

summer glacier
#

It's being merged to gpudriven not master

eternal laurel
#

I just like its not just for dots

turbid matrix
#

^ this

eternal laurel
#

I'm sure if they go into more gpu driven occlusion we can get serious performance gains

summer glacier
#

Hopefully it lands for gameobjects, would really push HDRP performance/scalability.

glad tartan
#

I've missed all the GPU driven stuff. WHats covered in that or what is it trying to achieve?

#

Are we finally getting Geometry Culling?

sinful locust
turbid matrix
#

at the unity offices atm πŸ˜„

#

that's the full version number

sinful locust
#

is there a feature target list of what they plan to add this release?

turbid matrix
#

nothing you could rely on

#

basically you can look at the productboard for things they are currently working on but there's no promise on which version those will land

summer glacier
#

Just got access to an RTX for a bit and started testing Raytraced GI, honestly a bit disappointed, didn't go as I expected

#

There was a lot of noise in the corners when moving, and I have no idea how to deal with sky ambient lighting. I thought raytracing would work that out but it doesn't seem to.

#

Tried to get an outdoor > indoor environment and it didn't work quite right

#

Also tried pathtracing. Using a few simple cube meshes all with the same material, but only 2 out of 7~ show up in the pathtraced image. Any ideas why? They all have the same material, and all are simple cubes extended to create a room.

#

Also tried DLSS and it's really impressive, antialiasing alone is awesome πŸ˜„

fathom knot
#

Probably a stupid question, but why are these objects not getting light mapped? They are static objects..

fathom knot
#

even if i drag the exact same material as the things that are being properly mapped, it still doesnt get mapped

inner parcel
fathom knot
#

when it was imported it was light layer default and some weird decal setting, so i removed it and just left it back to the seemingly normal light layer default

#

but still nothing

#

if i clear the baked light data i get:

5f2a7773a95a0cedee85255b855c8da0.png
inner parcel
#

Baked lightnap isn't correct. You sure no error in console during baking?

fathom knot
#

nothing atm

inner parcel
#

during bake

fathom knot
#

ok ill watch it really close during the bake

inner parcel
#

Not before or after

fathom knot
#

nothin

inner parcel
#

Is generate uvs enabled in the mesh import settings?

fathom knot
#

no πŸ€”

#

but the other ones dont have it on either

#

sounds like they should though..

inner parcel
#

not all meshes need it. I don't want to go offtopic with it since were probably in wrong channel (correct channel for this is #archived-lighting )
Enable it for keyboard and try once

fathom knot
#

god bless u

#

we good

loud leaf
#

No fallback hierarchy works for dynamic environments, but it's never going to look as good as baking

loud leaf
#

About the noise in the corners, I don't think there's anything you can do about that, every version has had it, there is no denoising history available there when moving

summer glacier
#

Thanks. Reflection probes I understand, but why light probes?

#

Also -- anyone knows how to get the pathtracer to render the entire screen, and not just two meshes out of 7?

loud leaf
barren goblet
#

what is the MSAA resolve

#

?

iron flame
iron flame
#

Forward MSAA 8x + TAA

Deferred TAA

image_412_0060.jpg image_416_0060.jpg
glad tartan
#

Nice I was wondering when we'd get a sample for strand based hair. I thought it was going to be the scene they showed in the What's new page for HDRP though.

eternal laurel
#

Is the hair system out in some version I would love to test it out

turbid matrix
#

Marchner hair might be in current 2022.1 alpha. Actual hair system is not available at all

eternal laurel
#

So the strand system and possible sim is not available yet

#

Damn unity really need a system where I can sub to get a email wjen stuff is available

glad tartan
#

I don't think it's actually strand bases hair/splines yet. I think it's just smaller hair cards that's similar to strands.
We should have strand based hair system at some point. Right now you would have to use an asset from the asset store for the strands.

turbid matrix
#

@glad tartan there's been references to internal package com.unity.hair but it's not on public registry atm

#

meaning, they are working on something

glad tartan
#

Yea, they have it on the product board list and that image they have in the docs definitely looks like strands. So they are working on something for sure to be able to render that. Hope we can get our hands on that soon.
Water and Hair are good additions. maybe we will see it in 2022 alpha or beta along with the water system.

tranquil dock
#

did you ever figure this out? i'm having the same problem in URP

drifting vault
tranquil dock
#

was worth a shot. sorry for the ping!

drifting vault
sacred sundial
#

any help on this?

summer glacier
#

How do you handle ambient lighting (sky) when baking light with HDRP? For example using an HDRI in HDRP
I noticed in URP baking lights while having an env/sky, the sky light is also baked and it'll render correctly for interiors, if there's an open areas, some ambient light will get in from there.
That doesn't seem to be the case at all with HDRP, am i missing something or do we have to completely rely on reflection probes to get 'some' ambient light?

scarlet hull
#

In particular the lighting environment part

round slate
#

How do i make reflections (ssr) blurry? A lower smoothness only disables them.

Unbenannt.PNG
glad tartan
#

@round slate You can also lower the smoothness value that SSR will start reflecting from. Minimum Smoothness

Override-ScreenSpaceReflection1.png
scarlet hull
#

Or at least, to have it look more realistic

fallow lynx
#

So, I found this little gem https://github.com/alelievr/HDRP-Custom-Passes/blob/master/Assets/Scenes/CameraDepthBaking/CameraDepthBake.cs#L33-L38 which I understand is used to perform your own culling on a secondary camera, so that the objects that are out of view from the main camera can be rendered. However, till HDRP 10.7, CustomPassContext.cullingResults is readonly so I cannot set it directly

Is there a alternative approach / hack to achieve this same functionality in v10.6 / v10.7?

Edit : I tried reflection, didn't seem to work πŸ€”

turbid matrix
#

@fallow lynx doesnt that repo have like branch with reflection approach

#

It will not work with il2cpp builds tho

#

Basically how you make that work for all build types is that you just make a local copy of that package and modify the thing to not be readonly

turbid matrix
sinful locust
#

hmmm I upgraded from 2021.2.0 to 2021.2.5 and my shadows are now all blocky if I have my farclip plane set far. Any ideas?

#

rendering a solar system at 1/100th scale.

#

I did see the following in 2021.2.4 but unsure if its related Graphics: Added: Added a field to the CullingParameters structure to allow for adjustment to the near clipping plane for shadow clipping - this is independent of the rendering camera near clipping plane.

summer glacier
#

Can have a copy of the project on 2021.2.3 to narrow the issue, probably what you posted

sinful locust
#

On a somewhat related note... I have to crank point lights up to silly levels in order to get a mini-solar system to light up properly, where as a directional light doesn't have this problem. Not sure how best to handle this, point light for a star is preferable so that light is cast properly on all objects in the system, but it doesn't seem to be tuned for these light levels lol.

summer glacier
sinful locust
#

roger that

sinful locust
#

Odd, ok this is from 2021.2.0

#

this is from 2021.2.3

#

so it seems it broke somewhere between 2021.0 and 2021.3 😐

summer glacier
#

@sinful locust Could have to do with 'HDRP: Fixed performance on PrepareLightsForGPU by burstifying light loop'
which started using jobs & burst for light culling amongst other stuff, and had to touch shadow code to get it to work with it. It's a big change so good chance it's the culprit

#

It was added in 2021.2.2, I'd try 2021.2.2 and if it's there make a bug report and mention the possible cause

sinful locust
#

ya I confirmed it was in 2021.2.2, checking 2021.2.1 now

summer glacier
#

lmk if it's in .2.1

sinful locust
#

will know in about 30 seconds

#

2021.2.1 is fine, so the issue started with 2021.2.2

#

again the issue only shows itself with a large near/far clip difference.

#

Which makes me wonder if double precision was lost somewhere in the process of bursting lighting πŸ™‚

summer glacier
#

Bug report time πŸ˜„

sinful locust
#

yup... makes me sad, one of the big advantages of HDRP vs URP for me is the support for large farclips πŸ™‚ and 2021.2 fixed the TAA farclip issue only to introduce this two patches later lol

summer glacier
#

Yeah seems like a relative camera rendering issue

sinful locust
#

how can u tell?

#

oh just because HDRP uses relative camera rendering duh πŸ™‚

summer glacier
#

yeah, it's why you can render and things so far away without any issues, and this most likely has to do with the burst stuff that effected it

#

Also worth making a thread 'bug' report, devs tend to see it

sinful locust
#

odd that they made such a big change post 2021.2 release

summer glacier
#

It was a risky backport, but honesty worth imo. Big CPU improvements for high light counts (and in general to, no matter how many you have)

sinful locust
#

ill agree assuming they fix this lol πŸ™‚

#

I cannot have a space game with farclip of only 1+e6 lol

summer glacier
#

Sounds like a major issue to me, so it'll be fixed, the issue is when πŸ˜„

sinful locust
#

heh ya

#

which forum should I post in

summer glacier
#

just keep pestering them about it πŸ™‚
if you don't see results after some time

#

HDRP section, unity forum

sinful locust
#

roger that thanks

summer glacier
#

much more likely to be fixed quicker if you provide a project that reproduces the issue, otherwise QA might just scrub it off

#

no worries πŸ˜„

fierce parrot
#

hey guys, why does my decal look like this when placing it on an object?

unknown.png
iron flame
#

and set Fade angle on decal

fierce parrot
#

yeah but in some cases I need to place it like that

iron flame
#

With low projection depth and Fade angle the problem is solved.

unknown.png
#

Angle fade off

unknown.png
fierce parrot
#

Thank you πŸ˜„

placid igloo
#

Hey guys, got a problem

#

I know the intensity is too great on the lighting to the left

#

Any reason why the top right is pixelated like that?

turbid matrix
#

I mean, you definitely want MB to be off in VR, it's not that... but why just have setting for MB only for it, why not have "exclude from XR" checkbox for all volume component overrides if you go for this route?

#

you'd think if someone does have VR support with HDRP, they'd just remove the effect though, or if the title has "optional VR mode", you'd really assume there would be dedicated quality tier with separate HDRP asset for it anyway

summer glacier
#

now this is interesting.. πŸ˜„

#

I wonder how it's performance will be like.
Umbra is alright for small scenes, once it's not very small anymore, overhead becomes big enough that it's not worth using.
A better static occlusion culling method is the one used by the "Perfect Culling" asset in the store.
It takes longer to bake, but it's extremely fast, next to 0 overhead no matter how big your scene is, and more accurate.

#

Either way, i'm pretty sure this will be better than umbra so it's a win already, plus fully dynamic πŸ˜„
Also i think it's going to support both HDRP/URP, but not sure yet

remote forge
#

If you are curious about the implementation: https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/developer/articles/technical/masked-software-occlusion-culling.html

There are two parts to it, the rendering of the depth buffer the occlusion masks (conservative geometry) and then fast bounding box testing against this buffer. Basically the slow part is the rendering of the depth buffer so normally you don't want to render everything into this and instead render the bigger stuff and proxies (so like a big cube instead of a full building geometry). If you understand the pros and cons of the system it works really well and we have seen a lot of performance increases in a number of scenes. Big pro is: Can get same frame culling data back from occlusion system. Con is: Not pixel perfect (conservative) need GPU occlusion for pixel perfect.

eternal laurel
remote forge
#

This isn't GPU occlusion and we don't have a tight eta, i'm guessing some beta releases late 2022 (tooling side for auto generation of simplified occluders is the big thing here because the workflow is not great without it). When something is available I'll poke this channel. IMO if you need something now for your project it's best not to wait for a release of something like this as roadmaps do change and feedback happens when we go through project testing.

eternal laurel
#

I underatand its not gpu culling. A fully burstes dynamic occlusion system just got me excited. Our project is on a long deadline too. As for the tooling we use the AutoLod package and simplygon. However I dont mind having our modelers produce a occlusion mesh per asset in order to use and test this. We are already producing simplified collision meshes for most assets anyways haha. Anyways thanks for the info. Havent been this excites for a feature in a long time. Cant wait for this + the brg stuff

remote forge
#

Are you on DOTS or non DOTS?

#

The BRG stuff is πŸ”₯ I haven't been so excited about something we are releasing in a few years. It's kind of 'under the hood' for most people - but its really fucking fast in terms of rendering throughput when compared to game objects (and even the current hybrid renderer in dots).

upbeat sorrel
eternal laurel
remote forge
eternal laurel
summer dome
trim bone
#

by hybrid renderer is that referring to v1 or v2?

inner parcel
#

v2
v1 isn't being developed with bleeding tech anymore

tawdry hound
#

I just installed hdrp and i don't know why my ground looks so weird, does someone know how to fix that?

scarlet hull
tawdry hound
#

How can i disable pixel displacement?

scarlet hull
#

It's in the material of your ground

tawdry hound
scarlet hull
#

Oh ?

tawdry hound
#

Is that the right setting?

scarlet hull
#

Yep, it's disabled, if it's still doing the effect your showed then .... well right now I don't know

tawdry hound
#

oh ok, thx for the help tho

scarlet hull
#

What is your ground made of ? Terrain ?

tawdry hound
#

It is just an plane

#

It looks like the cube is moving

fierce parrot
#

Hey guys I've got a question: I've implemented a simple spray with decals, but I want to draw a simple line by using decals... Where should I start?

turbid matrix
#

@tawdry hound showing the actual material would probably help narrowing this down better... without knowing better that looks like you are trying to use some weird projection shader on surface that doesn't work with it

tawdry hound
scarlet hull
scarlet hull
tawdry hound
turbid matrix
#

could it be some mipmapping / texture filtering issue on that texture asset?

scarlet hull
turbid matrix
#

looks funky alright, nothing on those materials stand out as totally incorrect

tawdry hound
scarlet hull
#

Haha, knew it !

fierce parrot
#

With texture, I would have other problems like rotation...

scarlet hull
fierce parrot
#

I want to draw with the decal πŸ™‚

#

draw lines

#

with a ray

scarlet hull
#

But as often, multiple solutions exist for the same problem. You could also for example use a line renderer with a decal shader.

fierce parrot
#

that doesn't seem to work :/

#

it looks really bad, I think linerenderer has some own "bugs"

tawdry hound
#

How can i use a material skybox in hdrp?

#

I can only drag in an texture2d

scarlet hull
scarlet hull
#

What I proposed initially is to use a stretched decal projector, but obviously it only works for straight lines

fierce parrot
#

which is still confusing to me

scarlet hull
fierce parrot
#

can you also do it on a wall?

#

For me, it disappears when I draw a linerendere with alignment.z on a wall with decal shader :/

scarlet hull
fierce parrot
#

wow

fierce parrot
#

can you send me your project?

scarlet hull
#

My project is the HDRP sample, nothing fancy.
As for the line renderer, here is it's inspector :

unknown.png
#

And the material :

unknown.png
fierce parrot
#

I have no idea why it is not working

unknown.png
#

oh.. it appears on the other side. Why is that?

unknown.png
#

What am I doing wrong?

#

This is how I am creating the linerenderer

scarlet hull
#

Maybe you just have to rotate it 180 degrees on Y πŸ˜„

fierce parrot
#

Hm I'm using a ray for creating those two points... which rotation should I use?

scarlet hull
#

I'm talking of the gameobject itself.
Z should point against the wall (of the reverse ?)

fierce parrot
#

Does this make sense?

inner parcel
#

and see for yourself how the projector is working?

fierce parrot
#

I think I have a bug but can't really see it

#

I'm placing the linerenderer on the object but it always appear on the other side

#

(not exactly on the other side but one can see it on the opposit side ^^ )

scarlet hull
fierce parrot
#

How can I fix this? Im really new to this

scarlet hull
#

Lije I said, rotate your object.
In the script you've posted above, add line.transform.Rotate( 0, 180, 0); after the first line.