archived-dots

[gentle gyro]

Are you using script?

[late mural]

?

[gentle gyro]

Visual Studio for instance...

[late mural]

oh

im using visual studio mainly yas

2022 specifically

i just did not read the error close enough it appears, whoops, welp atleast i can attempt some stuff now and see what i can get working

yay... now i have to deal with installing c++ compilers and windows 10 sdks on my d drive....

[gentle gyro]

Lol

[late mural]

i remember back when i tried to install omnisharp back when i used visual studio code, it was a nightmare lol

it kept trying to install on my f drive (note i dont have an f drive, hence why this was a bad thing)

i spent weeks, and i never got it working, that is when i switched to visual studio instead lol

i hope c++ compilers wont have similer issues to omnisharp

[gentle gyro]

Ouch

[late mural]

lol

[gentle gyro]

Ok, I'll leave it to you for now. Going to run to the store. Let me know what happens!

[late mural]

ok enjoy!

oh and of course they are trying to promote windows 11 meaning the windows 10 sdk is hidden who knows where

ok apparrently from research unless i literally want to rewrite the code myself, i cannot install it on anywhere but the c drive, how fun, guess i gotta move a bunch of stuff that says it only works on c drive into my d drive somehow, because companies are lazy and cant seemingly be bothered to give users the choice of which drive to install on, and most are not portable either meaning if you do drag them somewhere else they wont run anymore, how fun

and they wont even let you choose which one is your c driver or your d drive, when i first built my computer it auto chose the 1 with 200 gb to be the c drive instead of the 1 with 1 tb of space and wouldnt let me change it, yay, im so sick of the whole c drive is the default drive that anything installs on nonsense, ahh, sorry for ranting....

[rotund token]

it'll default to whatever is in port 0 but you can definitely choose your drive when installing windows

[late mural]

welp clearly they hide the options, as i didnt see them lol, although i suppose it wont matter soon as ill be installing linux a couple weeks, yay

[rotund token]

think you'll find you have less fun with unity

[late mural]

yup, ill choose ubuntu so atleast i am allowed to have support, unlike other distros

[rotund token]

all i see is complaints on the forums from users using the linux editor

[late mural]

ye, i plan to dual boot, so that way i can switch between both and play to the strengths of both, a bit like what i do with ides

[rotund token]

do you have a rider license?

[late mural]

no i do not

[rotund token]

because entities only supports visual studios and rider

[late mural]

i have visual studio luckilly

visual studio is a c drive hog though, so i have it modified to be sort of portable, even if it isnt offically supported by visual studio

[rotund token]

not on ubuntu you don't 😅

hence i was asking about rider as it's the only supported ide

[late mural]

wine breaks visual studio im guessing?

[rotund token]

last i heard (a year ago) it really doesn't work well

[late mural]

annoying

is there any plan to add other ides to the list of support anytime soon, or are they only gonna start work on that closer to 1.0?

[rotund token]

not unity's fault

they're the ide's that support source generators

[late mural]

oh, welp that is annoying

[rustic rain]

I guess

you can solve it by using code without codegen?

[rotund token]

^

considering how little code gen exists in my project, i could probably get away with this

[rustic rain]

IJobEntityBatch and etc

[late mural]

i dont even know what codegen is lol

[rotund token]

entities.foreach, job.withcode, IJobEntity

don't use those and you'll be fine

[rustic rain]

I do like the idea of having no codegen

but at the same time

[late mural]

i see another easier solution

[rustic rain]

project will be 3 times bigger

kek

[rotund token]

but be 3x faster

🙂

[rustic rain]

how so?

faster where? In IDE?

[rotund token]

because you can't really write extremely fast code with entities.foreach

because you can't properly utilize changefilters

[late mural]

use whatever on ubuntu, then for building go to windows

[rustic rain]

ahem

changefilters? I need to look it up

[rotund token]

o_O

[rustic rain]

is that it?

[late mural]

just curious why does unity need to rely on an external program (the ide) to have something for it to work, cant it self contain it, or is it more complicated than that?

[rotund token]

yes

but WithChangeFilter on Entities.ForEach is a (mini) sync point

you can only avoid this using IJobEntityBatch and checking it yourself

[rotund token]

source generators is part of dotnet/c#

[rustic rain]

When you use the WithChangeFilter() function in an Entities.ForEach construction, ECS compares the Chunk.ChangeVersion for that specific component to System.LastSystemVersion, and it only processes chunks whose component arrays have been accessed as writeable after the system last started running.

I don't really see anything about sync point

[rotund token]

just trust me

or waste your time testing it

[rustic rain]

so I guess

[late mural]

i dont really know what that means im afraid lol

[rustic rain]

what you suggest

is check chunk's version?

[rotund token]

            {
                if (!batchInChunk.DidChange(this.EffectHandle, this.SystemVersion))
                {
                    return;
                }

[rustic rain]

any example code?

yeah

oooh

I remember that code

in Transform system

interesting

[rotund token]

the best optimization you can make to your code

is to simply not have to run it

[rustic rain]

kek

yeah, in OOP world

I remember certain parts

where there were

lots of early return checks

just to ensure code needs to run

in this regard it's a bit better, cause you check for chunk

instead of every object

[rotund token]

this is 10,000,000 entities

processing my entire condition, event, action, timer jobs

in 0.6ms

[rustic rain]

welp

[rotund token]

if i turned off filtering it'd be in the double digit ms

[rustic rain]

I see your point

[late mural]

woah that is a lot of entities, the most ive ever gotten up to is 30 thousand before my computer drops to 1fps

[rotund token]

im hopeful they fix the sync point in 1.0 since i know they're making some changes to filters and how it returns chunks

but in general, you should consider query filters to be mini sync points

• by mini sync point I mean dependencies in the chain that the system requires need to be waited on. compared to an archetype change which may require everything to sync

[late mural]

with the whole code gen situation, does unity actually use the ide, or does it simply look for files that the ide has?

[rotund token]

it doesn't use the ide

you need the ide to use your code

[late mural]

why though?

[rotund token]

source generators are a feature of c#/dotnet

you need an idea that supports them

otherwise you will likely lag like hell

easier if i just quote unity from the manual

IDE support

Entities 0.51 uses the Microsoft Source Generator feature for its code generation. Because of this, you should use an IDE that's compatible with source generators. Previous IDE versions might experience slow-downs or mark valid code as errors. The following IDEs are compatible with source generators:

Visual Studio 2022+
Rider 2021.3.3+

[late mural]

but why does the ide need to support them, what role does the ide play?

[late mural]

oh ok

[rotund token]

why does your ide need to support c#?

because that's your coding

[late mural]

the ide doesnt need to support c sharp, sure it makes it easier to know when you make mistakes, but for my first 2 years of learning unity mine was not set up properly so i had no idea what i was doing half the time lol

plus even non ides like notepad still allow you to code in c sharp

[rotund token]

only for psychopaths 💩

[late mural]

determination drives you into dark work flows

so ye, i dont get it at all why the ide needs to support anything, to me it just doesnt make sense, whatever the ide is doing, why cant unity just include it?

and do it itself?

[rotund token]

what your saying makes no sense

[late mural]

?

[rustic rain]

nothing stops you from coding in notepad, kek

[late mural]

i just dont understand why unity needs to use the ide, cause the ide is using something clearly, so cant unity use what the ide uses?

[rotund token]

it doesn't need to use an ide

you need to use the ide

[rustic rain]

but you use IDE for it's features, not because it's fancier

[late mural]

why?

[rotund token]

because that's how you write code

[late mural]

and?

[late mural]

yes, but why does unity need to use the ide?

[rotund token]

p;2234T342GRDEFGOIJFGOPIUH 1632PO89HTIHOP45TTGIUOHPGS

[rustic rain]

once again - nothing stops you from using notepad for coding, sir

[late mural]

it isnt like the ide uses unity,

[late mural]

how is this related?

[rotund token]

it doesn't need to use an ide
you need to use an ide

you'

[late mural]

why, usually i dont need to do anything, it does it for me

[rustic rain]

go try to code smth simple in notepad and report with results xD

[late mural]

i used to do that when i was about 8-10, never again will i do that, it is ok sure, but now that i know ides exist, it is nicer

[rotund token]

go try and program c# in IntelliJ

[late mural]

what is intellij?

[rotund token]

a java ide

[rustic rain]

you use IDE for this

this is Unity integration

notepad doesn't have

[late mural]

yes but it doesnt use unity, does it?

if so, why does it use unity?

[rotund token]

unity doesn't use anything

[late mural]

same

[rotund token]

you can run unity without an ide installed on your computer

[late mural]

how is that related to anything?

[rustic rain]

to expose those poggie woggie features to you?

[late mural]

?

[rustic rain]

you'll never know if smth is serializable without compiling, running and restarting

and here goes IDE

literally showing it

as you write code

[rotund token]

you keep saying the same thing

yes, but why does unity need to use the ide?
but unity doesn't use an ide

[late mural]

if it doesnt use an ide, then why is visual studio needed for building????

[rotund token]

it's not

[rustic rain]

it's not

kek

[rotund token]

msbuild is required

it's toolchain

[late mural]

and why cant ms build be installed without the ide?

[rotund token]

it's a toolchain that's included in visual studios but you can install it separate

you can build for windows on osx and linux

[late mural]

this conversation could have been 10 minutes shorter if you had said that at the beginning

[rustic rain]

🙃

[rotund token]

this wasn't the conversation

[late mural]

then what was?

[rotund token]

the conversation was just that source generators are only supported in rider and visual studios atm

nothing to do with compiling

[late mural]

?

what are source generators, why are they important?

[rotund token]

that's what unity uses to code gen entities.foreach etc

[rustic rain]

Entities.ForEach loop is source gen

by itself, it's not valid code

that will run

[late mural]

once again, we come back to unity using an ide!! The track is circular!

[rotund token]

NOOOOOOOOOOOO

STOP

[gentle gyro]

He didn't see the lead up

[rotund token]

rider/visual studios is not required for unity to use source generators

[late mural]

ok

[rotund token]

it's required for you to code in the same project that source generators have been used

so that your ide doesn't produce 13245i134251234 errros

because it can't understand that source generators have been used

[late mural]

and why are those errors bad?

[rotund token]

because if all you get is errors from your ide

you may as well code in notepad

because it's now useless

[late mural]

why?

?

[rustic rain]

oh god

[late mural]

im used to coding with errors, that is what i did a few months ago

[gentle gyro]

It obscures the real errors...

[late mural]

you can just disable the error message usually

[rotund token]

i can't tell if you're trolling

i have to leave

[late mural]

no, im an idiot, that is what

[rotund token]

i'm going to the shops, i can't handle anymore

[late mural]

?

oh ok...

[gentle gyro]

A little dramatic...

[late mural]

no it does not in visual studio code atleast (although that ide has other issues)

[gentle gyro]

True you probably can disable it

[late mural]

exactly, the loop repeats once more!! so why does source generator ide support matter then?

[rustic rain]

because if Unity generates code and your code editor doesn't support it

it will never know code is generated

or interpret it wrong

[late mural]

?

the code that is generated is not shown though?

so why should the ide care?

[rustic rain]

it is shown

[late mural]

when?

[rustic rain]

when you open it

[late mural]

ive never seen it

[rustic rain]

that's why you add

partial tag

[late mural]

dont open it then?

[late mural]

?

you have to explain stuff as simply as possible, i am extremely stupid and bad at tech and coding

[rustic rain]

nah, I'll just leave it as it is, kek

[late mural]

but i wanna learn, please

all i wanna do is learn, so im less dumb, if everyone is gonna give up on lvl 0 me, how am i supposed to ever gain knowledge?

[rustic rain]

if you wanna learn you can google that question

[late mural]

im very bad at googling

i tried, but i failed

[rustic rain]

then you might want to reconsider doing programming

[late mural]

im terrible at literally everything, atleast when im programming i can pretend that the reason people cant understand what im doing is cause it is tech stuff and not cause i dont know what im doing either

[rustic rain]

🕯️

[late mural]

i have literally spent over 40 dollars on courses teaching me how to google lol....

i just dont get it

[gentle gyro]

Googling really is a vital skill at all levels of programming

[late mural]

exactly, and i am unable to gain it

[gentle gyro]

Some times it dosn't work

when it doesn't then it is nice when you can find someone to help

But

[late mural]

but it never works for me, cause i dont know how to google, it is so different from the way i think that i just dont get it, i try, but i always fail

[gentle gyro]

Keep practicing Googling each time and you will pick it up a little more each time

[late mural]

i do keep practicing, and using courses, they dont help, i havent gained any skills at googling, not even a little

[gentle gyro]

From time to time when you are trying to Google something show others how you Google and what you are trying to find and get live feedback to see how others Google specifically what you are trying to Google

[late mural]

where?

is there a discord channel specifically for idiots like me that dont know how to google or something?

[gentle gyro]

Ask on channels or sites relevant to what you are trying to Google, not on Googling itself...

StackOverflow for instance...

[rotund token]

i'm back with ingredients for dinner. sorry @late mural you kind of broke me a little when you said you just hide your errors. i didn't mean to be so dramatic but i just couldn't stop laughing, i had to step away.

but don't be so hard on yourself mate, everyone has to learn from nothing

[gentle gyro]

Maybe not StackOverflow... They're not nice to people trying to learn...

[late mural]

it is ok lol, it is kinda dumb to hide errors, but my computer is not ok and hiding the errors is the best solution lol

[late mural]

ye, i learned that quickly lol

[late mural]

eh, but i learn so much slower than anyone else lol

[gentle gyro]

Doesn't matter how fast you learn as long as you go in the right direction... 🙂

[late mural]

which way is the right direction, as it feels like im not going any direction, rather a stick in the mud

[gentle gyro]

Trying and trying new things is the right direction...There is always a solution, sometimes it is just hard to find...

[late mural]

lol, i always try and try new things, but i never find solutions to stuff, atleast if i do find solutions they always have major flaws

[gentle gyro]

Yet...

I spent 5 days trying to figure out how to set up In-app Purchase with Google and Unity. I felt like I was getting Absolutely No Were. I finally just had a Major Breakthrough right before I started talking to you the first time. It was like I finally found the exit in a dark room. VERY Rewarding! I am very stoked to go forward now that I know where I am 🙂

[late mural]

nice lol, ill keep trying, i always do, just even when i do find the exit to dark rooms, it always feels the same, no reward, only more dark rooms

[gentle gyro]

It's definitely can be like that with computers...but as you learn more there starts to be a lot less dark rooms...

[late mural]

lol

[gentle gyro]

Well, I guess I'll get back to my project and see if I can capitalize on my new understanding...

[late mural]

i wish you luck!

[gentle gyro]

Thanks! You TOO!

[late mural]

lol

[late mural]

hmm i managed to build with il2cpp finally, although entites appear to not be there, is there some special build setting that enables entities?

[gentle gyro]

What do you mean. Can you share a screen-shot?

[late mural]

sure, i dont see how a screenshot of nothing really helps, but i shall oblige you nonetheless

[gentle gyro]

Well, the context of the nothing is really what I want to see...

[late mural]

ok

[gentle gyro]

Entities = GameObject?

[late mural]

no that aint how dots work, you see entities are quite different from game objects, they do not inhabit the same world

[gentle gyro]

Ah, dots...I've been eager to get into it but haven't had the time. Really looking forward to it. Unfortunately that means I won't likely be of much help...

[late mural]

lol

wondering in the build asset is there some setting that you enable entities for il2cpp perhaps?

[gentle gyro]

No clue

[late mural]

unfortunate

[gentle gyro]

Google this: unity entites not showing with il2cpp

[late mural]

the entities dont exist entirely btw, i know this due to my game object and entity sync system

[gentle gyro]

So more precisely: they are not being spawned?

[late mural]

they are not

[gentle gyro]

Any errors or warnings?

[late mural]

you cant see errors and warnings in builds right?

[gentle gyro]

What about during build?

[late mural]

none, apart from 1 warning about some random default unity tree having an outdated shader

i didnt have the tree in my scene though, just kinda chilling somewhere in the file system, so i dont think it is the problem

[gentle gyro]

Lol

Chillin 🙂

[late mural]

lol

[gentle gyro]

Are you suppressing any errors or warnings?

[late mural]

i hope not

wait no, i am

i have integrity checks disabled due to this dropping me from 60fp to 10 fps

[gentle gyro]

Errors and warnings are your best friends!

[late mural]

yes, and im getting none

oh apart from urp being angry it cant find the urp read me

[gentle gyro]

Can you run it without IL2CPP?

[late mural]

yes, mono works well!

im just interested in trying out both and comparing performance and stuff

[gentle gyro]

Are you building in Release or debug?

[late mural]

release cause it was the default option, should i try debug?

[gentle gyro]

Yes, I think you should get Log files...

[late mural]

oh ok ill try

this may take a while cause my computer is old

[gentle gyro]

Ok

[rotund token]

is your il2cpp not building or not running?

because there's a known bug in 0.51 with building il2cpp

make sure you select faster builds

[late mural]

oh i didnt know that, where can that be found

[late mural]

it has finished building now

[rotund token]

that's just build settings

[late mural]

thanks, ill report back if im too stupid to find it!

why does loading build setttings always take so long lol

[late mural]

ok ive got the settings set to faster builds, now after about 14 minutes ill report back!

[late mural]

woah that was faster then expected

it crashed after only a couple seconds!

here are the crash reports incase these help

any ideas?

[rotund token]

that's the editor log

not player log

[late mural]

yes cause it crashed when trying to build

[rotund token]

oh editor crashed?

[late mural]

yup

[rotund token]

  ERROR: SymGetModuleInfo64, GetLastError: 'A dynamic link library (DLL) initialization routine failed.' (Address: 0000024DEF4319D9)```

seems to be your issue

[late mural]

oh unlucky, which module do i need, or should i just go through a checklist of some type?

[rotund token]

* Assertion: should not be reached at C:\build\output\Unity-Technologies\mono\mono\metadata\class-accessors.c:86

some funky stuff going on here

[late mural]

what exactly does that mean

[late mural]

likely

my computer is old and a tad weird

[rotund token]

it's weird because it seems to be crashing in mono

not il2cpp

[late mural]

oh, that is odd

[rotund token]

i don't think it's even started the il2cpp build

[late mural]

oh

[rotund token]

and there are 2 separate stacks here

very weird

C:/Users/Calvin/AppData/Local/Temp/Unity/Editor/Crashes

what's in this folder

[late mural]

i shall check brb

2 crashes

1 from ages ago

when i learned the hard way not to use tif files

[rotund token]

can you close unity, open it

start an il2cpp build straight away

send log

[late mural]

sure, ill do that, it will take about 2 mins to start up because my computer is old, sorry lol

ok it has loaded

and ive pressed build

now we wait for the crash

it has not crashed yet, perhaps it was a 1 off thing?

welp it finished building, ill check to see if entities exist now

yes entities are working, yay!!!!!

hmm and weird side note, the graphics are a lot better on il2cpp than mono

[late mural]

although clearly not perfect, im still getting the weird white lines across the screen if i move the camera too much

[late mural]

wrong channel?

[small heath]

i use Dots 0.51 for project, i can't make component play animation, who can help me?

[muted star]

Hello everyone, I can't get [GenerateAuthoringComponent] to work with IBufferElementData.
Please let me know if you have any ideas how it could be fixed.
I get this error

using Unity.Entities;
using Unity.Jobs;

namespace ECS.Simulational.BufferElements
{
    [GenerateAuthoringComponent]
    [InternalBufferCapacity(32)]
    public struct JobHandleBufferElementData : IBufferElementData
    {
        public JobHandle Value;
    }
}```

[mystic mountain]

Not sure if it's valid to have JobHandles in a ElementData. But you can check the generated code and see what is up if you look into the error.

[muted star]

Yes I just checked, apparently it's not valid to have JobHandles in a ElementData. Thank you!

[viral sonnet]

how would I best find out that a DB has changed its pointer address when being moved outside the chunk. (internal capacity has exceeded)

well seems like a bad idea to cache pointers to DB elements :/

[rotund token]

i would say it is

[viral sonnet]

even with buffercap 0 I wouldn't be able to handle the resizes well

so caching of any sort is pretty much out the window

i'm looking for a way to add/remove elements and not hold any reference or id. one safe way is to use removeswapback

[rotund token]

so i have a similar issue

adding elements to target on effect creation and removing elements on effect destruction

effect destroying definitely my biggest bottleneck at the moment - i have to do the actual removal single threaded and i'm not sure there's an alternative (well technically I can do it multi threaded I just think the cost of setting this up out weighs the benefits)

for adding though I just use ecb.AppendToBuffer

the only ecb usage in my entire library

[viral sonnet]

i'm pretty much on the same problem 🙂

I can do it with no problems with some form of id but I rather not want to do that

[rotund token]

it's not that much of a problem for me because i expect my effect life cycle to be long enough not to be a huge issue (seconds to minutes to infinite)

but yeah if i needed high frequency changes be more problematic

[viral sonnet]

my effects will not be high frequency. smallest I'd think is something around a second

[rotund token]

if you do find a great pattern do share 😄

[viral sonnet]

yep, I'll contemplate some more 😄

oh, something i wanted to ask because you have much nicer test cases than me. have you tried instead of the memcmp zero to just have a bool = false on Execute that you set to true when changes occur.

[rotund token]

breaks the simd

the memcmp has been much faster than i expected

[viral sonnet]

ah, auto vectorizer doesn't like it probably. otherwise it shouldn't break it, i mean, there's no condition really

[rotund token]

but yeah, not sure how doing a float comparison per element is going to be faster than a memcmp on the whole lot at once

[viral sonnet]

oh, on second thought. you'd need a xondition to get the branch that something changed, right??

you could simd the branch but yeah, not worth it

the memcmp is really nice to stay branchless

[rotund token]

it's just very fast

[late mural]

hmm something i am wondering, for codegen, couldnt you just manually write whatever code it generates, and avoid the code gen, or is it more complex than that?

[coarse turtle]

typically yes

[late mural]

cool, thanks for the info!

[rotund token]

people like enzi and myself mostly write our jobs in IJobEntityBatch and avoid code gen

all codegen is doing is converting your code into IJobEntityBatch

[late mural]

oh i havent heard of IJobEntityBatch before, is that a method, or is it a seperate class?

[rotund token]

it's an interface for a job

it's the fundamental job for entities

[late mural]

ok cool, once ive eaten some breakfast im gonna mess around with it then!

[viral sonnet]

it's actually not that hard to get into it and I think it's much nicer 🙂

[late mural]

ooh im excited to learn it then, thanks so much for the info everyone!

[viral sonnet]

i really want to make this work, to cache direct pointers to DB elements. on changes I'd need to compare the old vs new pointer of the DB and update pointers - every other solution I can think of is quite the pain

from the old base pointer and outdated pointer to the element I could calculate the index and reapply with the new pointer

on reallocs, the indices will stay the same

removing will still be weird. best case is RemoveSwapBack and update the swapped back effect

and that would require a variable to know which main effect to update with the swapped back pointer. i just don't want to add a pointer to the main effect just for that case :/

[coarse turtle]

dang, I forget - but do ISystemStateComponentData work with the conversion workflow? i.e - does the component get added to the entity?

[viral sonnet]

afaik they are excluded

[coarse turtle]

kk, ah well, not a big problem to work around I guess

[viral sonnet]

I don't remember who it was, I think it was Manarz that was perplexed that instantiating a prefab didn't copy the StateComps

even though the prefab had these comps

[rotund token]

yeah it makes sense not to instantiate system state components

however it is a pain 10% of the time where it would be very useful

[dense crypt]

Why does my Camera not get converted in a subscene? 🤔

Here's why after some digging: https://docs.unity3d.com/Packages/com.unity.rendering.hybrid@0.51/manual/hybrid-entities.html

I was expecting it to be available as a managed component. However after adding the script define it is, although I'm not exactly sure what they mean by "the scene main camera can't be a hybrid entity". Since that compile flag seem to exist and work?

[rotund token]

as you pointed out in your link just add HYBRID_ENTITIES_CAMERA_CONVERSION

and it'll be converted as a companion object

the issue is camera.main is required for some built in things

[dense crypt]

Oh right, so specifically the MAIN tagged camera can't be converted, but other cameras can?

[rotund token]

personally i convert my main camera

without issue though

[dense crypt]

Yeah that's what I just tested and it seems to work flawlessly, makes me even more confused as to why that remark is there then 😅

[viral sonnet]

i'm saying outdated stuff. sorry. since when is this a thing?

[rotund token]

HYBRID_ENTITIES_CAMERA_CONVERSION been there for years

it was originally on by default until they identified issue and hid it behind a precompiler

[viral sonnet]

learn something new every day 😄

[lusty otter]

[...] is not declared [ReadOnly] in a IJobParallelFor job. The container does not support parallel writing. Please use a more suitable container type.

Can I disable this completely? I don't want to litter [NativeDisableParallelForRestriction] all over my fields.

[solemn hollow]

yep it was me. i guess my only real problem with it is that its not documented anywhere (havent checked the new doc for it yet. maybe it is now).

[dense barn]

Can I store the result of diferent jobs in a single native array?

[jovial mantle]

Hi guys. I made a game in the old good monobehavior/gameobject way. I want to outsource some of it to DOTS, namely the projectiles and the projectile hits. The player (and enemies) are gameobjects (cubes) with a rigidbody, collider, and player/enemy logic attached to it, and parented to this is the skinned mesh character with animator
IS it possible to get the projectiles, collisions (projectile hits) managed by DOTS and the rest by the old gameobject/monobehavior world?
Thanks a lot !!!

[late mural]

i would consider it likely possible, i personally am making a fluid puzzle game that is half dots, and half not!

[jovial mantle]

how do you manage the collision? as far as I understand:

1. My player (cube) with a collider, transform, rigidbody and player logic(mono, I'd like to keep it this way) -> converto to ENTITY
   2)it shoots prefabs converted to entities at enemies that have a similar setup as the player.

[late mural]

i manage collision a tad stupidly, for everything that needs to both collide with entities and game objects, i simply create 2 versions of, one entity version, and a gameobject version, if this object needs to move, then i have a script that syncs their positions, albeit it does take quite a while to get good optimization with having to move an object every frame, but it is possible

you just enable the render component on the entity or the gameobject, and disable the other, depending on which render thing you prefer more

trying to sync rotations is a tad harder, although possible with a bit of quaternion knowledge

also pro tip to help optimize transformation syncing every frame of the moving entities/gameobjects, make sure both the gamobject and the entity are not static and have a rigidbody, depending on which you are syncing to the other, have 1 being a kinematic rigidbody (controlled by animation, or in this case the transformations every frame)

[jovial mantle]

transform / rigodbody of the player (cube, collider) is moved with simple transform.Translate operations, the animations are not root motion, respond to whatever key is pressed etc.
when receiving shooting it would be converted to an entity to process the hits and then back to gameobject ?

[late mural]

im not much knowledgeable on animation, but yes it is possible to transfer that kinda data stuff between gameobjects and entities, although cause entity components cant contain methods, you will have to get used to using system bases as a middle ground to grab and give data

I have to go eat dinner now, so if you have more questions i shall have to respond to them later, but i wish you luck!

[jovial mantle]

aha makes sense coolcat, thank you very much for your tips. bon apetit!

[solemn hollow]

i would advise to use Jobs and Burst and stay with GameObjects. ECS comes with its own overhead and mixing physic engines sounds like a bad idea. syncing between entities and gameobjects is also rather slow. so i think you are far better off with only jobifiing your bullets

[karmic basin]

+1 for Manarz answer
PhysX and entities physics are two separated simulations you gonna get yourself headaches :p

[muted star]

Hi everyone, is appending multiple worlds to player loop not supported yet in the new 0.51 System editor window?

The first time I launch into the editor play mode after compiling it works fine but from the second time and onward I get this error.

[solemn hollow]

are you destroying the world?

[muted star]

Yes when exiting play mode the worlds are destroyed

private static World CreateWorldSafely(string _worldName)
    {
        World world = new World(_worldName);
        // Dispose of world on quit
        Application.quitting += () =>
        {
            if (world.IsCreated)
            {
                world.Dispose();
            }
        };

        return world;
    }```

[solemn hollow]

So its probably just that the Editor Window cant find this world anymore that you are trying to display in edit mode

[muted star]

Ah yes that makes sense, I just have to re-open the systems window and everything is fine 🙂

Is there a way to get a world by name? This way I could change my code so I won't have this inconvenience anymore.

[jovial mantle]

so game objects and process the projectile instantiation / hit/ disposal with Jobs and Burst? much asking but do you know by chance any resource to see this? thanks a lot Manarz!

[muted star]

I think I can loop over all worlds somehow and do it that way. Thank you @solemn hollow

[solemn hollow]

yes thats the only way i know of

[solemn hollow]

hmm sry i havent looked into using Monobehaviours and jobs too much yet. Im going full ECS for quite a while now so i dont really have resources.
But for Instantiation and Disposal you are going to need an Object Pool (AFAIK Unity has their own implementation of one now).
I dont know how you want to handle hits. if its with Raycasts then you should check out : https://docs.unity3d.com/ScriptReference/RaycastCommand.html

[jovial mantle]

the way I have it now is :
1)the projectiles are particles (shuriken) that calls on collision
2)I have them pooled
3)The player shoots this projectiles from the pool, which upon collision they come back to it
My idea is to use DOTS / Jobs / Burst in order to get rid of the pooling system and go nuts with the amounts of projectiles

[solemn hollow]

you could only get rid of pooling if you used Entities (and even then pooling entities might be a more performant way than recreating them depending on setup logic). but if you used entities youd need to calculate all collisions yourself since EntityPhyscis != MonoBehaviourPhysics.

if you need THAT many bullets then maybe you actually have to make the change to ECS but i think you need to do it with more than just the bullets then 😦

[jovial mantle]

I was scared you were gonna say this 😄

[late mural]

is there any default method for raycasting? Or is it still something that has to be manually made?

[rustic rain]

there are examples in sample probject, it's in pinned messages

[late mural]

thank you so much!

[safe lintel]

@jovial mantle btw there is a physx batch raycast api, and it might be better suited to what you want to do than considering ecs

I actually started off this same path back in 2019, "yeah let me jobify my projectiles" and ended up redoing everything in ecs. I probably could have released by now if I wasnt chasing dumb shiny tech things

[solemn hollow]

Isnt that what i linked? is there something else ?

[safe lintel]

@solemn hollow oh yeah it is, sorry just having my coffee now 😅

[solemn hollow]

no worries. i might have missed some other api. better to ask 🙂

[safe lintel]

what could have saved me from going down the full ecs route was back then I used the raycastcommand with a gameobject pool, but RaycastCommand in combination with Graphics.DrawMeshInstancedIndirect makes for a good alternative for performant projectiles and you only touch gameobjects when they collide with something

[muted star]

I'm currently trying to sync my simulation and presentation worlds.
The step I'm currently stuck at is spawning the corresponding clone entities in the presentational world.

            // Querying simulation world entities. They have been transferred from the simulation world to this presentational world.
            Entities
                .WithAll<IsMirroredToPresentationalWorldTag>()
                .ForEach((Entity _simulationWorldEntity) =>
                {
                    var prefabInstance = EntityManager.Instantiate(prefab); // Creating presentational entity

                    var val = new NotSoUuidSDC {Value = random.NextInt(), SimulationEntity = _simulationWorldEntity}; 

                    // Adding component to presenatational entity with simulation entity field
                    EntityManager.AddSharedComponentData(prefabInstance, val); 

                }).WithStructuralChanges().Run();

The field SimulationEntity is shown as invalid in the DOTS Hierarchy.

I also get the exception 'The entity does not exist.' in this system:

if (!mirroredEntitiesQuery.IsEmpty)
            {
                // Querying presentational entities created by the previous system
                Entities
                    .WithNone<IsMirroredToPresentationalWorldTag>()
                    .ForEach((Entity _presentationalEntity, NotSoUuidSDC _notSoUuid) =>
                    {
                        var simulationEntity = _notSoUuid.SimulationEntity;
 
                        // Trying to copy the transform component from the simulation entity stored in the notSoUuid to the presentation entity
                        EntityManager.SetComponentData(
                            _presentationalEntity,
                            GetComponent<Unity.Transforms.Translation>(simulationEntity) // Exception - 'The entity does not exist'
                        );
                    }).WithoutBurst().Run();
            }

Can the Entity somehow change when moved between worlds or will they always retain the same ID?

[solemn hollow]

@muted star my understanding was when you move entities to another world they get remapped.

[muted star]

Do you mean that their IDs change? I just tried logging the entities and the IDs seem to stay the same.
In the inspector however the entities are shown as invalid so they must have changed somehow 🤔

I'll have a go and read this, maybe I'll understand then

[rustic rain]

how are you even copying entities

from one world to another

[muted star]

I'm moving them

[rustic rain]

how?

[muted star]

Moving from presentational world to simulation world

query = presentationalWorld.EntityManager
.CreateEntityQuery(new EntityQueryDesc
{All = new[] {ComponentType.ReadOnly<IsMirroredToPresentationalWorldTag>()}}
);

EntityManager.MoveEntitiesFrom(presentationalWorld.EntityManager, query);

and the other way around of course

[rustic rain]

why?

wasn't the point of your double world is to avoid sync point?

[muted star]

Yes

Simulation world sync point is independent of presentation world

[rustic rain]

well, your moving entities is sync point

[muted star]

yes but it doesn't happen so often 🙂

[rustic rain]

that's not really true

they all have to update in one frame

so your worlds will be updated one after another (I assume)

[muted star]

yes but the jobs are independent

[rustic rain]

every frame, in sync

[muted star]

jobs in simulation world will continue running if jobs in presentation world are forced to complete

[rustic rain]

but you don't need 2 worlds, to do achieve that

[rustic rain]

nnnope, that's not how it works

[muted star]

yes I do when there are structural changes

[rustic rain]

your jobs in simulation will have to finish

before execution will get to next world

and only once first world is fully finished (all jobs)

it will start doing second world

basically, at some point in all worlds, there's call of CompleteAllJobs

which blocks main thread and causes all scheduled jobs to finish

[muted star]

Lets assume I have structural changes in the presentation world. All jobs in presentation world are forced to complete. This takes a bit of time and the simulation world basically has to wait for the presentation world. The jobs of the simulation world however are not forced to complete.

I can no longer find the docs on worlds and sync points but isn't this how it works?

[rustic rain]

but during execution of 1 world, second world is either haven't even started execution or is already forced to finish

System updates are done only on main thread

[muted star]

yes I know but in my example the simulation world jobs stay untouched and continue running

[rustic rain]

unless you somehow heavily modify world execution, it'll be forced to finish anyway

it's designed to finish execution completely

before execution is passed back to player

[solemn hollow]

they atleast have to be remapped in cases where the entity index already exists in the destination world. so its generally not safe to rely on entityIndex to identify an entity across worlds.

[solemn hollow]

Can you show a profiler screenshot where we can see the 2 worlds executing in parallel? im also a bit skeptical.

[muted star]

The worlds aren't executing in parallel. It was just my understanding that structural change sync points don't cause a different world's jobs to be force-completed.

but I could be wrong of course

[solemn hollow]

yes but i mean that would mean we could see a job from world 1 run parallel to a job from world 2. i dont say that isnt possible. im just not sure how that worldswitching is handled

[rustic rain]

there's some system in vanilla Unity

that calls CompleteAllJob

which makes it impossible

[solemn hollow]

man would that be awesome to run worlds on diffrent "mainthreads" and schedule jobs from there lol

[rustic rain]

but main thread is only one

and I have a feeling

world really needs "the real" one

[solemn hollow]

thats why i put the "" there. if you know the data of those worlds cannot effect eachother you can use diffrent threads to sync execution per world

[muted star]

Do you mean EntitiyManager.CompleteAllJobs()?

[rustic rain]

yeah

[muted star]

"A world owns both an EntityManager and a set of Systems."

[rustic rain]

it'll block main thread until all jobs are finished in world

[muted star]

yes in one world

not all worlds (?)

[rustic rain]

so whatever you are trying to do with 2 worlds, is just not possible

[muted star]

okay :p

[rustic rain]

but second world will only start execution after 1st world is finished

[muted star]

yes thats fine

as long as jobs of second world arent touched

[rustic rain]

they are forced to finished

before world execution is over

and only then second world will run

[solemn hollow]

but the point is he doesnt want to run the second world in some frames

[rustic rain]

that's not fine

that totally defeats the purpose

[rustic rain]

in that case he can just put his simulation into some variable rate group and update it however he wants

presentation will still have to run every frame in order to draw stuff

[solemn hollow]

yes that would be the approach id go for

[muted star]

whay do you mean by that?

in case of structural sync point?

[rustic rain]

first world is finished, only then second starts

[muted star]

all within one frame yes, but jobs can run over multiple frames

[rustic rain]

no?

are they?

[muted star]

of course

[rustic rain]

ahem

I really doubt it

Do you have any reference where you found out about that?

[muted star]

https://docs.unity3d.com/Manual/JobSystemNativeContainer.html

[solemn hollow]

sure jobs can run over multiple frames. the problem is syncpoints force them to finish too often

[muted star]

TempJob can run up to 4 frames. Presistent can run forever theoretically

[rustic rain]

ah

now I get it

but still, world will ensure it's finished though

before second world can update

[solemn hollow]

only if you couple the dependency to a syncpoint

[rustic rain]

and if you don't you'll get a mess, where job might get scheduled before first is even finished

at very least Unity will throw some errors at you for that, I think xD

[muted star]

As far as I experienced Unity wont throw errors if you schedule too many jobs. It will just queue them.

[rustic rain]

I mean

if you schedule job

and then on next frame you schedule it again

but first scheduled is not even finished

[muted star]

at some point youll run out of memory. But jobs are run in parallel and if there is currently no available thread they are queued until there is an available thread.

[solemn hollow]

but anyways why do you need a second world for all of that. as issue suggested use systemgroups with diffrent updaterates. for example fixedupdate for all simulation stuff and the usual updategroup for presentation stuff

[muted star]

I don't think that that will prevent structural changes from force-completing the jobs scheduled in the different update group.

[rustic rain]

why is that even a problem?

they will have to force finished at the end of frame anyawy

[solemn hollow]

it wont but does it matter? you output presentation frames as fast as possible either way

aside from that just dont do so many structural changes

[muted star]

I explained this before. I will run long-running jobs in the simulation world. They shouldn't be force-completed. Otherwise there would be terrible lag whenever this happens.

[muted star]

jobs can run over multiple frames and aren't forced to complete unless you explicitly do so (or if there are structural changes)

[rustic rain]

so instead you'll have a terrible lag whenever you try to copy your data for presentation, since you'll need to ensure simulation jobs are all finished

[muted star]

I'm no longer copying but moving

[solemn hollow]

isnt there a way to run jobs across sync points? system dependencies are synced. cant you circumvent that by handling dependencies yourself somehow?

[rustic rain]

it's irrelevant, point is that you can't read data that is being written

[muted star]

Yes I already have a solution for that problem

[solemn hollow]

im pretty sure before you can move entities all jobs concering them have to be completed. so again a syncpoint which will cause the lag

[muted star]

That would be a good solution. 👀

[muted star]

Yes there is a syncpoint in the simulation world, but only after all jobs in the simulation world have completed (I coded it this way)

[solemn hollow]

so before that syncpoint nothing will move to representation world. again you need to complete all heavy work before move and then render. exactly the situation you dont want

[rustic rain]

why simply designing a simultion that just meant to update every frame (or tick) is not an option?

[solemn hollow]

id see it working with copy maybe cause you can copy incomplete data and not wait for jobs maybe but moving seems wrong

[muted star]

Yes nothing will move to the presentation world. But the presentation world will do interpolation and pretend that it is being updated.

[rustic rain]

whatever you are trying to achieve is extremely hacky

[muted star]

Copying would be more convenient but has bad performance

[muted star]

Nah so far it's pretty lit ^^

[solemn hollow]

what type of simulation are you going for that you cannot run your jobs in 1 frame?

[muted star]

Pathfinding. Local avoidance and more. (deterministic) All the complicated stuff you need for an RTS

[rustic rain]

ahem

is your game supposed to run on super low fps?

[muted star]

of course not xD
Presentation world will barely be affected by all this stuff

because presentation runs at high framerate while simulation runs at a refresh rate (or so it appears)

[rustic rain]

yeah, but since you update data for your presentation only at certain sync points

that would mean

that all frames you render ibnetween

are same

or at least, entities in them will be same

[muted star]

simulation world is not actually running at slower refresh rate
but the important logic runs at slow refresh rate if that makes sense

[muted star]

No as I said presentation will happily interpolate and make everything seem fluid

[solemn hollow]

oh man do i have a better solution for you lol

just dont update all of the chunks every frame. split it up. balance the load

[rustic rain]

yeah, just design your game around updating normally

[solemn hollow]

in 1 frame do the pathfinding for group 1,2,3,4 and in next you do it for 5,6,7,8. etc

[rustic rain]

instead of literally wasting a lot of main thread time to just move/copy entities from 1 world to another

[solemn hollow]

i do that with my AI. i can run thouthands of agents with really complex logic just because i loadbalance them

even without loadbalancing i can still run hundrends each frame though. atm gamedesign wouldnt even need loadbalacing

its also really simple to implement

[muted star]

Maybe I won't move anything at all later. I could switch to a command pattern later with the principle staying the same. I'm just trying it out right now.

[rustic rain]

besides

[muted star]

Does your game have deterministic lockstep networking? That's what I'm going for and I think your solution would make it a lot more complicated.

[rustic rain]

I doubt your simulation will work fine along with all other systems that need to be updated fully in one frame

since whatever long running job is using, will be locked for it

and other jobs will have to wait

[solemn hollow]

no it doesnt. but i do think you can find a way to deterministically balance work across frames.

thats all

[muted star]

Yea it's definetly an option I'll have to consider. Maybe it's not so bad 🙂

[muted star]

Nice solution!

[solemn hollow]

the only "hacky" part is the GetNativeArray call inside the job to bump the change version

i think it does what you need and gives you a smoother less spiky framerate. and for sure is way more performant than copying worlds around

[muted star]

I just tested my theory and it seems to work as I imagined.
I'm constantly doing structural changes in the presentation world and continually scheduling long running jobs in the simulation world.

In the profiler you can see that the simulation world jobs have already been running for over 20ms and haven't been force-completed by the structural changes in the presentation world.

[solemn hollow]

nice! good to know it works.

not a fan of the solution still 😄

[rustic rain]

are they actually long running and not just new every update?

[solemn hollow]

they are new every simulation world update right?

[lusty otter]

Repost, would appreciate if anyone knows.

[solemn hollow]

no idea if you can. however even if i could i wouldnt. this warning is there to make raceconditions practically impossible as long as you dont disable it. good to know where you might run into those when debugging

needing this all over your code smells wrong to me

[lusty otter]

I'm fully aware of the dangers of blowing my foot away by disabling it.

My situation is, I have a large struct with many fields and some of them are native containers; instead of passing all those fields one by one I simply pass this one large struct to all the jobs.

Problem is in some jobs some fields of this large struct are readonly, in some jobs they are not, in some jobs I want to disable parallel for restriction, etc.

There's no way to individually configure each field for each job, the only solution seemingly is to just duplicate all fields to every single job struct and that's incredibly error prone and not DRY.

[solemn hollow]

but this struct is not per entity right?

[lusty otter]

Oh I'm not working in the context of ECS, just plain old job system and Burst.

[solemn hollow]

ah alright. you could maybe do some factory that returns a struct setup as you need it. other than that idk

[lusty otter]

Yeah, and it's not like if I litter [NativeDisableParallelForRestriction] on all my fields solves it, because that's no different from just turning off safety altogether.

The fundamental problem is just that inner fields of a same struct may have different restrictions in different jobs, and there's no way to configure it from outside.

This also applies to things like properties (but fortunately you can do [field: NativeDisableParallelForRestriction] for example) and nullable types (which has no workaround it seems)

[viral sonnet]

ECB speed is so pathetic. stress testing with 250k instantiation of buffs and ECB takes aroud 300ms. that's over 1ms for 1k. crazy how long it takes. but then again, no burst, no MT. what am I expecting

to bring it into perspective. like 95% of this is adding a buffer and some elements to it. and this part is pretty broken because the buffer array of the ecb is only temporary and has to be copied. i have to think of something different

[pliant pike]

yeah, that's why its not usually advised to use ECB to instantiate(unless you really need to organise the structural changes)

[rotund token]

We have noticed this, and also noticed the impact on iteration time, so for 1.0 we've developed an alternative to EFE that requires several times less work from the sourcegenerators (which are both what slows down VS and also one of the many sources of bad iteration time in the unity editor). It unfortunately does require y'all (and also us) to convert manually, though. :/

That's going to be fun for some people

So they probably are going to the foreach query syntax in 1.0 for more than just ISystem

[gentle harness]

How can I use [ReadOnly] ComponentDataFromEntity within an Entities.ForEach job?

Getting one by doing var FactionFromEntity = GetComponentDataFromEntity<Faction>(); inside OnUpdate() works fine, but it can not be marked as read only

I considered ```cs
public partial class MoveToCombineTarget : SystemBase
{
[ReadOnly] ComponentDataFromEntity<Faction> FactionFromEntity;
protected override void OnUpdate()
{
FactionFromEntity = GetComponentDataFromEntity<Faction>(true);
Entities.ForEach(...Job...).Schedule();
}
}

But doing this causes ``FactionFromEntity`` to be a reference type, which can then not be used in a job

So is it possible to use a ReadOnly ComponentDataFromEntity without using a job struct?

[viral sonnet]

called it 😄 what a change, lol, all because VS is a steaming pile of ...

[pliant pike]

whats this Visual Studio thing 😕

[viral sonnet]

when iteration time is improved, very welcome change

it slows down dramatically on code-gened code

or when having projects loaded like Unity.Collections

[pliant pike]

oh so I guess that's why it was slowing down

I thought it was a bug with VS 2019 that's why I finally updated

[viral sonnet]

vs 2022 is even worse

[pliant pike]

dammit

[viral sonnet]

their new auto completion has a really hard time with it

but slowness is just one of the problems of vs2022. i had to deal with annoying bugs too

[pliant pike]

this is really starting to tempt me to try Rider

[viral sonnet]

lol

i bought an annual license 😀

[pliant pike]

except I can't really afford it

[viral sonnet]

how can you afford vs2022?

[pliant pike]

the community version

[viral sonnet]

ah i see. yeah, sadly rider has no community version. just a trial :/

maybe a student license or smth

[tidal gulch]

if you have a student email, you can get 1 year of jetbrains products for free (Includes Rider and Resharper)

[safe lintel]

also it does fallback to the version you bought so it doesnt have to be an ongoing cost if you happen to purchase it

shame its not like zbrush where the one purchase and all the updates for free. my 3.0 license just keeps on getting upgraded 🥰 wonder how long that will last though

[viral sonnet]

for rider? when does this happen? can you buy a month and then use this version forever? 😄

[rotund token]

12 months of uninterrupted subscription payments qualify you for receiving a perpetual fallback license.

All yearly subscriptions include a perpetual fallback license.

[viral sonnet]

oh, that's cool!

finally a good sub model. i hate it when the sub runs out and you lose total access

looking at you unity!

[rotund token]

to be fair unity subscription really gives you nothing these days

it's just a legal requirement ^_^'

[viral sonnet]

pretty much. i don't know why I'm even paying anymore. i don't release a game anyway ^^ dark skin is also free now

with the changes to Entities.ForEach, I'm once again happy that I don't have to go through any changes. job structs 4tw

and I have to say, what a superfluous endeavour by Unity. I don't even want to know how much time went into this. If I were them, I'd just force everyone to use job structs. haha

[rustic rain]

It must be local and you need to add "withreadonly" method

[viral sonnet]

how are you managing pre-defined archetypes that have a lot of variations? i have a mix of components that can be instantiated based on settings and with just 4 the number of archetypes i have to manage kind of explodes

now if I'd ever add a 5th I don't know how to handle this

my preferred way would be to just instantiate a prefab. maybe some kind of mask and the prefabs get computed procedural?

[rustic rain]

Why managing components is a problem?

You simply need component type array which can be made through infinite options kek

[muted star]

Yes in my test I schedule a new job every frame.

[muted star]

It says that the jobs have been running for over 20ms

and FPS are high

[solemn hollow]

so now your simulation runs as slow as pathfinding :S

[muted star]

Its just a test :p

[solemn hollow]

i sure hope your pathfinding doesnt block all cores for 20 ms xD

[muted star]

main thread is always clear and that would still be ~50 updates per second ^^

[wanton apex]

Hello !

I have some performance issue with my prototype of ECS Particle System when trying to add physics to my particle.
The simulation performance are good, but anytime I instantiate a particle with physics simulation, the Build Physics System update and kill the performance. Do you know if there is a workaround to avoid this performance drop due to building the physics world ?

[rustic rain]

Physics have a lot of checks in editor

Can't really remember how to disable them

[wanton apex]

Thanks ! I will search for it !

Maybe this ?

[rotund token]

turn that off

turn off jobs debugger

turn off safety as well if you just want to test max performance

[wanton apex]

Thank you ! I try this. performance are really better with Integrity Checks disable

[rotund token]

yeah it like halves performance

[wanton apex]

Is it normal that a system which spawn 5000 entities per frame took more than 150ms to execute ? Sorry for all this questions, I'm not familiar with ECS and don't realy know what are the performances to expect

[karmic basin]

Are you going the ECS way for fun/learning or are you looking for performance ? For the latter I would use the VFX Graph for an insane amount of particles

[wanton apex]

I'm trying to learn ECS. (I made a small project with it two years ago, but I forget almost everything I knew). And a particle simulation with physics interraction looks a good use case and stress test for ECS, while VFX Graph doesn't support physics (only Depth Map collision which is very limited)

[bleak junco]

hi, is there a way to turn off PhysicsCollider in ecs?

[rustic rain]

you simply exclude entity from physics world

remove shared component

[wanton apex]

If you want to keep the simulation, you could change de CollisionFilter of the Collider too, look at th "Modifying Collider" exemple in the documentation : https://docs.unity3d.com/Packages/com.unity.physics@0.51/manual/core_components.html

[rustic rain]

well, you can take a look in profiler to figure out why it took so much

otherwise it would be just a blind guess, kek

[rotund token]

how are you spawning them?

if it's via ecb then yeah that's what i'd expect

best bet would be via batch operations in EM and you could probably get that down to 20-40ms

[wanton apex]

It's from main thread :

var nativeArray = new NativeArray<Entity>(entityCount, Allocator.Temp);
EntityManager.Instantiate(emitter.particlePrefab, nativeArray);

But the AddComponents are not batched because I need some random initialization on it :

for (int i = 0; i < nativeArray.Length; i++)
{

    var entity = nativeArray[i];


    EntityManager.SetComponentData(entity, new Translation()
    {
        Value = UnityEngine.Random.insideUnitSphere * 100.0f
    });
    EntityManager.AddComponentData<ParticleMovementComponent>(entity, new ParticleMovementComponent()
    {
        maxSpeed = 10.0f,
        currentSpeed = 0.0f
    });
...

[rustic rain]

you can burst that as a job though

that would be way faster

make sure your components already added in instantiation

so no archetype changes

and then just make a job that you will instantly run

you can use Unity.math's Random struct for random

[rotund token]

yeah you definitely need to burst compile that setting component data

[wanton apex]

I'm not sure to understand how to setup components in batch. Should I have a second system that initialize value with burst after the entities are generated with the right archetype?

[rustic rain]

first you ensure they already exist, even if values are default

your prefab must have them

then

you can make IJobEntity job

or IJobEntityBatch

[wanton apex]

Yep, the profiler said that the AddComponentData is the costly operation

[rustic rain]

and do your random init inside bursted code

that will also take advantage of CPU cache

[wanton apex]

I don't want it bacause I want the particle to be configurable, so having them prebuilt in the prefab is not an option (i think ?)

[rustic rain]

well

it's only about simply having them

[rotund token]

your code above has no condition?

[rustic rain]

not about having values on them

but if that's also the case

you can add components batched

and then set values through job

[wanton apex]

What do you mean by condition ?

[rotund token]

you're adding ParticleMovementComponent to every entity you just created - why is it not already added on the prefab

[wanton apex]

Okay, i'm going to rewrite this spawn system with batch and burst in mind, thank you very much for the advice !

For this one that's the case yes, but as exemple physics components are based on a condition

[rustic rain]

can't you just have several prefabs for different options?

at very least you can make them automatically through code

that would speedup runtime instantiation

[wanton apex]

As exemple :

if (emitter.usePhysics)
{
    PhysicsHelper.SetupPhysicsBody(EntityManager, entity, blob,
    UnityEngine.Random.insideUnitSphere * 10.0f, new float3(0, 0, 0), 1);
}

Thanks, I will try to work with archetype to optimize it !

[bleak junco]

yeah, it's one of the workarounds I was thinking about, was wondering if it's possible to disable collider without removing data from the entity

[wooden dagger]

can i use Physics2D.OverlapXXX in jobs?

[rustic rain]

nothing managed

is allowed in bursted code

[rustic rain]

yeah, just remove shared component of physics world

without this component entity is excluded from physics

no need to remove collider or body component

[wanton apex]

Does the physics continue to simulate it i this case? Gravity as example ? I understand that demminik want to keep the velocity and gravity apply to the entity with the collider disable on it.

[rustic rain]

no

it will simply be paused

until you add that component back

[wanton apex]

Okay, thanks !

[bleak junco]

are you talking about this one?

[rustic rain]

yeah

[bleak junco]

ok, I think it's suitable for now, thanks

[wanton apex]

Sorry for tagging you again, i'm rewriting my system, but I'm not sure what is the best way to achieve this fast instantiation.
I have rewrite my AuthoringSystem to add all the required component in the conversion stage, so no AddComponents are needed after instantiation.
Now i'm not sure about the call to instantiate it. Should I call from a main thread system EntityManager.Instantiate(entity, nativeArray) without dealing with burst and ECB, or should I call this method from an ECS with a Burst job ? While the ECB is executed in the main thread at the end, I'm not sure about the use of it in this case

[rustic rain]

you instantiate thorugh EM

[rotund token]

if you need to instantiate a large amount of entities then yes just use the EM.Instantiate

[rustic rain]

and then run your job that sets up components

[wanton apex]

Okay, thank you very much !

Is there a performance reason to use IJobEntity / IJobEntityBatch instead of a ForEach or is it just for code organisation / reuse ?

[rotund token]

foreach/IJobEntity code gens into ijobentitybatch

you can do specific optimizations with IJobEntityBatch though that aren't always possible otherwise

[wanton apex]

Thank for the answer !

[eager pawn]

How would I initialize my component data to a value? I'm thinking of making a config entity and a system for it that only runs once in the beginning, then somehow make system 2 access that data. Is that correct?

[rustic rain]

you use authoring components for that

for Unity's meant workflow at least

[eager pawn]

does this work if i want to set it to something that's returned by a function?

[rustic rain]

nah, that only works for prefabs

or subscenes

[olive kite]

Since updating to v.51, assembly reloading takes almost a minute, despite the profiler saying that the actual compilation is 4 seconds. Any tricks to help speed this up a bit? previously it was about 15 seconds total, so I'm feeling the difference quite a bit now.

[viral sonnet]

it's a quadratic problem. at some point I don't want to write the combinations by hand

i can solve it, i just wanted to know if i'm the only one dealing with such a problem

[rustic rain]

I don't really see how it's an ECS problem though

[viral sonnet]

i could do it the naive way and use a bunch of conditions and AddComponent to the ECB but that's painfully slow

[rustic rain]

what are you even doing?
I thought you just instantiate entities with specific archetype

[viral sonnet]

i instantiate effects and those can have a multitude of combinations of components, pre-set via archetypes. triggers, duration, stacks, the list goes on,

previously this was low enough to not be concerning but now I moved data out from the main comp which could be optional

[rustic rain]

so your concern is about how to handle processing of it?

not instantiation?

ooor?

[viral sonnet]

instantiating. anyway, i found a good solution for the problem. i now calculate the needed comps in convert stage and save the archetype in my effectData blob. that also got rid of some conditions on the instantiate. pretty nice and I don't have to code something complicated which I really wanted to avoid

[elfin spire]

Onwards I go, new project and currently testing from 2019 to 2021 -- which version of unity do you use with your DOTS project (entities or jobs+burst mono)?

[rustic rain]

2021 is the only way, until they port ecs to 2022, kek

[woeful comet]

@rotund token I remember that you were talking about making a DOTS serialization library a couple of months ago. Did you ever release that?

[neat kayak]

i'm getting the error Temp\GeneratedCode\Assembly-CSharp\MeshApplySystem__System_1236479004.g.cs(93,96): error CS8377: The type 'CustomMeshData' must be a non-nullable value type, along with all fields at any level of nesting, in order to use it as parameter 'T' in the generic type or method 'InternalCompilerInterface.UnsafeGetRefToNativeArrayPtrElement<T>(IntPtr, int)'
i've seen a lot of errors where the generic type or method in question is NativeList<T> but haven't been able to find helpful resources for this. i'm using entities v0.51.0-p.32 and jobs v0.51.0-p.32

here's the CustomMeshData struct

using System.Collections;
using System.Collections.Generic;

using UnityEngine;
using Unity.Mathematics;
using Unity.Entities;

public struct CustomMeshData : IComponentData
{
    public List<float3> vertices;
    public List<int3> triangles;
}

[viral sonnet]

he'll be on in a few hours. to answer the question, no he didn't

[viral sonnet]

you can't have a managed list in an IComp. use DynamicBuffer instead or UnsafeLists (although that's really advanced)

[woeful comet]

Sad times 😦

[neat kayak]

sadge

[viral sonnet]

that said. mesh data is better off in another data type. ecs is not well suited for that.

[neat kayak]

anything I should use instead?

the reason I'm using this at all is because I'm going to be updating meshes at runtime

[viral sonnet]

totally depends. is it some knd of voxel data?

[neat kayak]

not voxels, the meshes can take whatever shape. think "parts"

they get grouped into larger assemblies, which is why I'm using ecs for this

[viral sonnet]

hm, for prototyping I'd stick to DynamicBuffers then.

[neat kayak]

alright, good to know

[rotund token]

I haven't released it. I wrote a bunch of samples then procrastinated on documentation and distracted myself with effects

My concern is I haven't used it enough in production conditions to confirm it as a long term viable solution

I don't really like releasing things I haven't confirmed as production ready

[viral sonnet]

find some testers 🙂

[woeful comet]

I'm sure there are plenty of volunteers here 😉

[rustic rain]

hmmm, is it possible to Remove components based on Write group?

basically Remove all components of write group X?

[pliant pike]

I don't suppose anyone knows a good way of finding out if an entity exists for only one frame?

like I think it does but I can't be entirely sure and I don't have the skill to pause it at exactly the right moment

[rotund token]

Rider pause points is useful for this

Instead of breaking when it hits certain code you can pause unity

That said with journaling and being able to inspect an Entity during a break point less use these days

[pliant pike]

well that sounds handy

i really should probably look into rider

just don't want to pay for it till I'm a proper dev if ever

I'm not sure journalling would work in this case, I guess I could try 🤔

[rotund token]

You just know where the entity is created and destroyed

Just break point on that or put in a log

[pliant pike]

yeah I know where its created and destroyed but the issue is in another system

it might be destroyed before it reaches the other system

[rustic rain]

hmm, potentially, if I for some reason would want to make multiplayer in my singleplayer game
What kind of static fields will be ok to use?

Obviously, smth that can only exist on player's machine would not be ok, like input, or time delta

but what kind of data will be ok?

[pliant pike]

I have a basic stupid question do subscenes not working with [GenerateAuthoringComponent]

neh mind they do just me being stupid again

[pliant pike]

lesson for anyone else dont put enabled = false; at the end of a system that has a requiresingletonforupdate otherwise you might end up wasting an hour trying to figure out why the system isn't running

[rustic rain]

why use that field at all?

from what I see, it's made for debugging purposes

[pliant pike]

yeah but if I just want a system to run once only 🤷

[rustic rain]

use OnStartRunning?

[pliant pike]

but I had problems before with that running more than once

[rustic rain]

well, it will run again if at some point

your singleton cease to exist

and then appears again

[pliant pike]

that's kind of the issue I was only using enabled = false in this case for debugging

[coarse turtle]

hmm not sure if im doing anything wrong with the scriptable build configuration assets, but does Headless Mode work for anyone? I keep getting builds with GUIs

[rotund token]

are you using -batchmode?

[coarse turtle]

I can pass in -batchmode as a build instruction?

thought that was for the editor 🤔

[rotund token]

you can just pass -batchmode to any built application at runtime

[coarse turtle]

o

[rotund token]

https://docs.unity3d.com/Manual/PlayerCommandLineArguments.html

-batchmode Run the application in “headless” mode. In this mode, the application doesn’t display anything or accept user input. This is useful for running servers for networked applications.

[coarse turtle]

o neat

im surprised that I have to do that now since I have an archive of old builds where i didn't have to explicitly launch the application with -batchmode

[drowsy pagoda]

I setup my code to take some scriptable object data and load it into a static class (cached array) which later the ECS conversion system reads from to author components respectively. This works in editor both play mode and live conversion no problem. But in player it does not. I think it’s because the convert code in player is assembled much sooner than it is in editor. Where can I inject my build cache code so that everything will be ready for ECS conversion to read from?

[viral sonnet]

how would i save an EntityArchetype in a blob?

unity complains it's a pointer :/

[drowsy pagoda]

There are a few things I'd like to check during runtime and I have some debug logs in the Convert methods. I noticed that Debug.Log does not actually post logs in builds written in conversion phase. Is there a way to enable that?

[rotund token]

this is a bit confusing to me

what are you trying to save?

[viral sonnet]

I'm back peddling. I basically have spell data in a blob and definitions for effects too. my archetype previously was very basic so the approach wasn't that bad. I have now saved the archetypes in a hashmap but I'm actually rewriting it to just have prefab entities for the effects that I want to instantiate. much cleaner.

[rotund token]

oh was going to suggest you check out netcode

it stores all ghosts components in a blob assets

it has huge meta data about ghosts stored in blobs

[viral sonnet]

oh cool, will check it out. maybe I can learn a thing or two

[rotund token]

it's basically ghostauthoringconversion.cs

1 mega authoring script

[viral sonnet]

what I currently have works, but I have to set data from the blob like duration and I could skip that with a proper prefab

or stuff like spellId. I rather skip this 🙂

do you know why we need a parameter for conversionSystem.CreateAdditionalEntity. I just put this into it because I have no clue what it actually wants

[viral sonnet]

i've asked this previously, seems like the only way to create an additional entity in conversion stage is through conversionSystem.CreateAdditionalEntity but that has baggage i don't need like parent, LTW, etc... why does a simple dstManager.CreateEntity isn't working?

[solemn hollow]

its for the mapping system. it just tells the additional entity from which gameobject conversion it came. so that for example the conversion can be retriggered in liveconversion.

[viral sonnet]

I can only make this work with conversionSystem.CreateAdditionalEntity(this)

and I've looked at the wrong entity before. the mentioned comps are not on the new entity, so this part is all fine

well funny, must have been the entity cache or smth. now it's all working 😄

i couldn't instantiate my prefab and the converted entities were gone in play mode

[rotund token]

because it's called conversion not creation 😄

[viral sonnet]

I'm still not getting why dstmanager.createentity isn't doing anything.

[rotund token]

it doesn't setup the subscene data that's required like SceneSection

so it's not attached to any section so can't get loaded

[muted star]

In my editor, re-opening the systems window doesn't solve the issue anymore 🤔

[muted star]

Bumping my question again. Has anyone experienced this problem before and found a good solution?

[rustic rain]

Debugger windows are pretty bugged ngl
Even simply removing systems will result in window getting broken

it'll throw exception and stop updating

[muted star]

Is the old debugging window also broken? I saw that it still 'works' in a video from TurboMakesGames but can't find where to open it.

[solemn hollow]

are you doing stuff with the editor world too? if you delete that somehow the error would always pop up i guess

the old window works fine. should be where the profiler is

[muted star]

Oh thank god that this one works 😅

[muted star]

Not touching the editor world 🤷‍♂️

[muted star]

How can I stop entities from colliding and doing the weirdest things?
I need physics shape and physics body for raycast detection but I don't want this chaos to ensue.

[rustic rain]

disable collision between them?

hm

[rotund token]

why is it dynamic if it's just used for raycasting?

just remove the body so it's a static object

(not sure what's up with your layers though)

[muted star]

I tried that before and it didn't work but I'll give it another try soon

[lone harbor]

Hello! Noobie question. I'm trying to change color of all RenderMesh. The material is getting changed but changes do not apply on entities. Please helpppp

[rustic rain]

you are getting shared component from 1

I would assume it's just shared comp index in list

[lone harbor]

Yes, I have only one unique RenderMesh and using index 1 because 0 is default

[rustic rain]

are you certain your shader uses that color field?

[lone harbor]

I use URP Unlit shader

[rustic rain]

pretty sure you need to write special property through method

.SetColor or smth like that

but I don't remember what is property name

[lone harbor]

It updates the color slightly only on a first frame. As I said before, I can see in inspector that material's color is changing but entities are not getting updated

[safe oyster]

So, i decided to try ECS for the first time so I imported all the packages bit I got all this compile errors
im using unity 2022.1.8f1 and my Entities and Hybrid Renderer are on version 0.51.0-preview.32

[karmic basin]

Uninstall the com.unity.dots.editor package

It's now embedded in entities

Also unity 2022 not officially supported

From manual:

You must use Unity Editor versions 2020.3.30+ or 2021.3.4+ with entities 0.51.

[safe oyster]

oh i see

[karmic basin]

Any conflict you find will be yours to solve

[safe oyster]

i thought it includes 2022

thanks man

[karmic basin]

you're welcome

(maybe 2022 is okay, I'm just not aware if that's the case)

[lone harbor]

I figured it out. The problem is that setting color doesn't affect hash of the shared component. That's why Entities API doesn't do anything

[safe lintel]

@lone harbor there are material property overrides for instanced properties(color etc). the hybrid renderer urp samples should have an example to go from, you dont need to/shouldnt touch the shared component rendermesh(unless you wanted to do that for all the materials sharing that chunk)

actually docs too - https://docs.unity3d.com/Packages/com.unity.rendering.hybrid@0.51/manual/material-overrides.html

[lone harbor]

Understood, but why material color change doesn't affect entities at all? Is that because Unity create BlobAsset from material internally?

[safe lintel]

it should affect it that way, not really sure why

[rustic rain]

have you tried changing it the way, so hash is changed?

allthough...

it's definetely supposed to change even without applying shared component

since you change same material object

[muted star]

I'm currently trying to replace the Unity.Transforms systems with the deterministic UnityS.Transforms systems.

However the systems are nowhere to be found in the entity debugger. Only the custom system group seems to have been added.
Do systems have to be added in a specific order? What could be the issue here?

var world = CreateWorldSafely(_worldName);

        // Add Systems to World
        var slimmedUnitySystems = new List<Type>();
        for (var i = 0; i < _unitySystems.Count; i++)
        {
            if (_softFloatTransformSystems != null && IsUnityTransformSystem(_unitySystems[i]))
            {
                // Filter out unity transform systems in favor of soft float transform systems
                continue;
            }

            slimmedUnitySystems.Add(_unitySystems[i]);
        }

        var allSystems = new List<Type>();
        allSystems.AddRange(slimmedUnitySystems);

        if (_softFloatTransformSystems != null)
        {
            for (var i = 0; i < _softFloatTransformSystems.Count; i++)
            {
                Debug.Log("SOFTFLOAT " + _softFloatTransformSystems[i]);
            }

            // Add soft float transform systems
            allSystems.AddRange(_softFloatTransformSystems);
        }

        // Add my own Systems
        allSystems.AddRange(_customSystems);

        DefaultWorldInitialization.AddSystemsToRootLevelSystemGroups(world, allSystems);

        return world;```

[misty wedge]

Any tips on what to do if a job runs fine without burst, but fails when turning burst on? It throws a System.NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object with very little additional information, since it was compiled with burst...

This is the stack trace: https://hastebin.com/qedenowuko.hs

[misty wedge]

What happens if source generation fails? My code still seems to run

[misty wedge]

If have no idea what is going on. All of my non-burst code works fine, but if I change it to burst it fails with cryptic errors. Arrays are suddenly out of range even though nothing in the code or setup changed

It's almost as if it was using old code somehow. Swapping from synchronous compilation to asynchronous also changes the error between runs, very strange

[rustic rain]

Have you tried restarting Unity? Or reimporting project

[misty wedge]

I already tried restarting unity and deleting the generated files in the temp folder

I'll try reimporting, but I doubt it will help. I'm guessing it's something wrong with burst, I don't know

[karmic basin]

I expect it would run with previous/outdated code

[misty wedge]

Maybe that's the issue then? Although I don't understand why the non-bursted code would work in that case

[solemn hollow]

rewrite the job to avoid codegen if you think thats the problem

[misty wedge]

It has no code gen

It's all IJobEntityBatch

[rustic rain]

any example?

[misty wedge]

Of the failing job?

[rustic rain]

yeah

how it looks, how you call it

[misty wedge]

This is the calling code: var tileHandle = tilePathfindingJob.ScheduleParallel(_tilePathfindingQuery, 1, Dependency);, so nothing really special there

I'll post the job but it's pretty big

Like I said, it works fine without burst, but when enabling burst I get weird errors

[misty wedge]

Mainly this one

[rustic rain]

so what are errors?

[misty wedge]

It fails before it even executes

https://hastebin.com/qedenowuko.hs

[rustic rain]

that doesn't seem like complete stack trace

kek

[misty wedge]

Well, that's all there is 🤷

The actual exception is a NullReferenceException

Reimport seems to have fixed it

That really annoys me since I know next time something like this happens I'll be poking around in the dark for a few hours.

Maybe I should just reimport each day

[rotund token]

What version of burst

[misty wedge]

1.8.0

[gentle harness]

How do I build my project? Clicking build on my BuildConfiguration asset spits out "Build failed. There are no scenes to build"
I have no idea how to select a scene to build, and I can't click through the add components list

After clicking Add Component

After clicking Unity.Build.Classic

[rustic rain]

add component menu is broken for build assets, kek

you can either try creating required asset in 2020 version

meaning asset with all required components

or you can try adding them blindly, kek

[gentle harness]

I have tried lol

I can't use 2020 as I'm using runtime ui toolkit

[rustic rain]

no, you just need to create asset

then you can drop it into your 2021 project

[gentle harness]

What are the required components? I can search for it and then click Global to add it

[rustic rain]

uugh

scene list?

Classic Build Profile

General Settings

[gentle harness]

Got that

[rustic rain]

that's about that

[gentle harness]

When I click build

[rustic rain]

pretty self explanatory

[gentle harness]

Is it referring to subscenes?

[rustic rain]

no, it means scenes

all of them

you build none, kek

[gentle harness]

Hmm

[rustic rain]

but you build through asset