archived-dots

[viral sonnet]

hm, i'm not too familiar. is the whole mesh data serialized or smth?

[rotund token]

MeshRendererBaker

has to setup LODs

so each render is anywhere from 1-3 actual renderers

has to find the components

has to grab the meshfilter to get the mesh

has to get all them materials, if its a multi material split into sub entities

has to get the baked light data

and do this 30,000 times on gameobjects

then do like 8 add[shared]components per entity

i had a look at this yesterday, i saw no obvious way of speeding this up except potentially caching it per unmodified prefab instance

so I had a bit of an experiment and wrote a proof of concept that instead of storing the GO in the world, stores reference of prefab then instantiates them in system

(apart from known pains of instantiation during baking) the main issue completely breaks actually building scene workflow, you can only visualize it using baked data not authoring

so i don't think it's really a viable solution unless you wrote full entity scene tooling

[delicate swan]

Big oof, yeah thats rough, looked* it up and there is only post-baking processing for like, combining entities, not batching them like I thought

[rotund token]

I believe unity were working or wanting to work on a large open world demo so I'm hoping they're running into similar issues to investigate

or at least can provide me some guidelines on best practices around this workflow

[delicate swan]

Hmm, this is a very assumptious, high level toss out, but is there any way to replicate your runtime "local loaded subscenes" runtime logic, but based on the editors camera position instead of a theroretical player, while in the editor?

[rotund token]

my implementation of it?

i considered doing camera but it's problematic

for example in first person, players can spin their camera

and scenes won't load in time

it's not hard to make it frustum plane based

[delicate swan]

I meant for specifically for the editor, only loading the "local" sub-scenes from the editor scene window camera position, or at least activating/rendering the authors

[viral sonnet]

obviously there's a lot involved, but it shouldn't add up to 30sec for a very simple scene

all the data should be already indexed in the asset database

[delicate swan]

Yeah, reading through the baker docs, as long as all the per-gameobject-component asset dependencies are properly hooked up, it shouldn't be rebaking unchanged assets, it even calls it "Incremental Baking"

[rotund token]

i think it's incremental to changes you make after the whole thing has baked

because i can tell that's not true atm after reloads

i have an editor assembly with nothing but a single [CustomEditor] and no other assemblies referencing this

any changes to this will trigger all subscenes to rebake

there's no possible way they could have a dependency on this

[rustic rain]

are you recreating class inheritance in ECS? 😅

[viral sonnet]

i'm taking a look at it now myself 😄 i have the azure nature pack. that was the one you were testing with, right?

[rotund token]

for the most part yeah just baking their sample scene

but i have other scenes ive tested on previously

POLYGON Fantasy Kingdom & POLYGON Apocalypse

for example

[viral sonnet]

i'm pretty sure i had their sample scene at one point in my netcode demo as subscene.

and baking was nearly instant

[rotund token]

baking or conversion?

[viral sonnet]

but maybe i'm misremembering and it was just a normal scene

oh that was conversion

[rotund token]

pretty sure my scenes cached with conversion

[viral sonnet]

reimporting the whole package doesn't even take me more than 30 seconds 😄

only urp... argh

[rotund token]

oh its shaders dont support dots either

you need to update them

[viral sonnet]

are they in shadergraph? doesn't seem so

[rotund token]

amplify

i rewrote them in shadergraph

i was testing this pack in hdrp originally

[viral sonnet]

can you send me the shaders? 🙂

that's why i usually don't buy anything. support the default stuff damn it!

[rotund token]

i can but it'd be a huge pain

you have to manually go through everything and apply them

if you wan to to this fast probably easier to just add dots instancing to the amplify shaders

[viral sonnet]

i don't have amplify :/

oh i don't need it, right?

[rotund token]

i think you can just edit the output shaders that come with pack

[viral sonnet]

buggy AF - import azure pack, crash. move environment GOs into subscene, crash.

0.51 was more production ready than 1.0 now - i seriously hope unity is able to fix this stuff before the end of the year.

[rotund token]

read PM ^^

[delicate swan]

Ha! No, just arbitrary data loading into ECS components from text serialization with jobs support (after loading), I just tried to get some help in the advanced-code channel for what appears to be a bug in C# source generator support, but it devolved into somebody being convinced I was X/Y problem-ing

There's no inheritance or anything, its basically just mapping data with a string identifier to the right static function for that identifier that creates ECS components with that data in the right way, each "Component" in the xml is given its own set of static creation methods that are jobs compatible based on an attribute that registers it for the given common ID, essentially mapping externally loaded data directly into one or more ECS components, great for network transfers and whatnot

Problem is, I hate having to add each new bundle of static methods to some global thing by hand, its just ripe for typos and whatnot, especially dealing with lots of similar types, so I figured I would use a source generator to spit out a switch that just takes the string identifier and runs the proper static methods, but apparently thats just a bad idea, not sure how else to achieve it while keeping jobs compatible

[robust scaffold]

The crash splash page is like a close friend by now. I see it every day.

[robust scaffold]

Uhmmm. Yea... Yea. The baker or GOCS's back then were more flexible than now and I still miss [GenerateAuthoringComponent]. Otherwise, netcode has made leaps and bounds since then though.

[delicate swan]

Oh I miss [GenerateAuthoringComponent], that made it so simple to create little data types here and there, especially for testing stuff

[robust scaffold]

https://forum.unity.com/threads/dots-dev-blitz-day-2022-q-a.1365090/
Remember, dev questions on the 8th of december.

Also, discord's font is different. Hrm

[viral sonnet]

has the asset database bug been fixed in new 2022.2 versions?

[rotund token]

I look forward to reading 80% of questions that have already been answered or could be answered by the community 😅
That sweet 20% though

[rotund token]

which one

there are too many

[viral sonnet]

the newest one 😁

[rotund token]

i mean which bug

[viral sonnet]

there are more?? haha ok

[rotund token]

It's hard to find a version of unity where the patch notes don't include an asset database bug fix

there's usually 2-3 per patch

Are you talking about the major issue that i can't remember exactly what it was but it plagued 1.0 launch in b6?

[viral sonnet]

yep

[delicate swan]

what was the problem?

[robust scaffold]

The one where creating a file resulted in entity header corruption? Largely fixed. The one with random entity corruption on reload? Still happens.

[viral sonnet]

so tertle, the scene you sent me. does this take 30sec for you when you click reimport?

[viral sonnet]

hm, ok. still on b9. i don't have the former bug but the latter one. so if that's still not fixed. not much point in upgrading

[robust scaffold]

It's pretty rare. Maybe once an hour. Although I dont know how frequent it was on the < b12 versions because I was getting the former every domain reload.

[viral sonnet]

i'm confused. wasn't there a 2022.2f1?

i had this problem not seeing new versions in unityhub2 but now i have 3

newest is 2022.2.0b16 for me

@rotund token the subscene takes 10sec to reimport for me. what's weird if i profile the editor. hardly anything is happening. tbh, i can't even find stuff related to reimport. idle the scene takes 6ms, with reimport it's 13ms per frame

[rotund token]

there is, it's never been added to hub

or announced

you need to use the hub url to get it

[rotund token]

you have a 5800X right?

[viral sonnet]

5900x

[rotund token]

ah yeah

step up from my 3900X

profile then click Open to see the live baking costs

it should take just about as long to open as to import originally

i should point out i don't even consider this to be a detailed scene, there's no elevation or detailed buildings/cities

[viral sonnet]

yeah, that's what's so concerning. this is just a very small fragment of an open world

[rotund token]

to me the time to bake it is within acceptable range

the issue is it that they just all get rebaked continuously on any change regardless of relevance/dependency

i'm hoping this is just a bug

[viral sonnet]

ok i see now. 4.5s to open

[rotund token]

is this in a m2 drive?

this library is on an older ssd for me

i should probably compare moving to my m2

but apart from that, i have a 3900x and 32GB of ram. i shouldn't really be processor starved here.

[viral sonnet]

older ssd, sadly i don't have a m2 drive 😄

[rotund token]

going to be costly if we need to buy brand new 5k+ computers for everyone at work on next project just to load a subscene ^_^'

[rotund token]

ok the 30% faster loading intrigues me then

i guess the single thread performance of the 5900x just helps that much

[viral sonnet]

i was only looking at the conversion. this is the full one

overall 8.3s

[rotund token]

yeah but the actual time is 8s due to other costs entering

is the other 3s like the hierarchy?

my conversion was like 7s on that step

but that included all my own libraries

let me test in this standalone project i sent you

[rotund token]

ok so thats just loading scene from disk

that's fair enough - still a pain for workflow

[viral sonnet]

i don't get it. when you drag&drop the scene alone in the editor it's instantly open

no idea what MergePrefabs does

[rotund token]

i am much slower

i don't know why, this is project i sent you right?

second time is a tad faster but still much slower

[viral sonnet]

yes

[viral sonnet]

huge disparities

our processors aren't that much difference.

[delicate swan]

You guys on the same version of unity?

[rotund token]

nope

i am slightly more up to date

but i'd be surprised if that mattered because i had similar experience on his version

previously

[viral sonnet]

have you found the code for MeshRendererBaker? I can't find any 😄

[rotund token]

yes

i already put profile tags into it

to profile each part

[viral sonnet]

it eludes me! 😄

[rotund token]

it's called MeshRendererBaker ^_^'

rider finds it instantly

[viral sonnet]

wth, no hit in rider or my find in files tool

ok, sorry, which directory is this?

[rotund token]

com.unity.entities.graphics@1.0.0-pre.15\Unity.Entities.Graphics\MeshRendererBaking.cs

[viral sonnet]

haha, ok no wonder i wasn't able to find it.

main project has no entities.graphics 🤦‍♂️

[rotund token]

a picture is starting to form why this was so much faster for you

oh wait

no it must have been in project i sent you

you're just searching in wrong one

gotcha

[viral sonnet]

all good, your project hsa it ^^

looking at code now. so are we at a point where we have bakers which don't scale?

lots of individual GetComponent calls. single threaded systems. what is this?

[delicate swan]

Enterprise Quality Code

[robust scaffold]

See, once an hour

It seems to originate from the SceneTracker. And my entity list specifically avoids checking scenes. It just pulls a universal query from all entity managers.

[pliant pike]

I don't suppose anyone can tell what I'm doing wrong with this job

public partial class DestroyEntitysatDest : SystemBase 
{
    public EndSimulationEntityCommandBufferSystem endcommbuff;
    EntityQuery ExitTargetQuery;

    protected override void OnCreate()
    {        
        endcommbuff = World.GetOrCreateSystem<EndSimulationEntityCommandBufferSystem>();        
        ExitTargetQuery = GetEntityQuery(ComponentType.ReadOnly<EnemyTargetTag>(), ComponentType.ReadWrite<Translation>())
    }

    protected override void OnUpdate()
    {
        var GetCellindpos = new GetCellIndexFromWorldPos();

        var ecb = endcommbuff.CreateCommandBuffer().AsParallelWriter();

        var PaidExitTarget = ExitTargetQuery.GetSingleton<Translation>();

        Entities.
            WithAll<EnemyDudeTag>().
            ForEach((Entity entity, int entityInQueryIndex, in Translation currentpos) =>        
            {          
           
            if (math.distance(currentpos.Value, PaidExitTarget.Value) < 2)
            {               
                ecb.DestroyEntity(entityInQueryIndex, entity);
            }          

        }).ScheduleParallel(this.Dependency);
        Dependency.Complete();        endcommbuff.AddJobHandleForProducer(this.Dependency);
    }
}```

I keep getting this error all of a sudden which I never had before and I haven't changed this code at all The previously scheduled job DestroyEntitysatDest:DestroyEntitysatDest_LambdaJob_0_Job reads from the Unity.Entities.EntityTypeHandle DestroyEntitysatDest_LambdaJob_0_Job.JobData.__entityTypeHandle. You must call JobHandle.Complete() on the job DestroyEntitysatDest:DestroyEntitysatDest_LambdaJob_0_Job, before you can deallocate the Unity.Entities.EntityTypeHandle safely.

its like a completely separate job has somehow broke this job

[delicate swan]

Wait, do you call complete on jobs when you hand them to command buffers?

[robust scaffold]

I dont remember the specifics of the lambda jobs but if you set the dependency parameter of .ScheduleX(), you must assign the return back to the jobhandle.

[delicate swan]

It should do that automagically unless your doing something complex I thought

[robust scaffold]

so either remove the this.Dependency or equate it back to dependency Dependency = Entities...

Also, if you're completing it right after, just use .Run()

[pliant pike]

I only put the Dependency.Complete() because I thought that might fix it

[pliant pike]

not sure I understand exactly but removing this.depenency fixed it like you said, thanks a lot

[viral sonnet]

he meant Dependency = Entities.ForEach().ScheduleParallel(Dependency);

[robust scaffold]

various overloads of the lambda jobs.

[pliant pike]

oh I see now

[robust scaffold]

Removing it also works.

[delicate swan]

Unless its changed, from what I remember the Dependency chain is supposed to be somewhat automatic unless you have a more complex chained series of jobs

[pliant pike]

yeah and I guess I fell into the trap of not making it automagic

[viral sonnet]

yeah, or that. though i prefer explicit statements

[robust scaffold]

It is, kinda. Automatic as in if you dont specify a handle dependency, it's just Dependency = EFE.Schedule(Dependency);

[robust scaffold]

I'm lazy. But dont be half lazy. Either be full lazy or write it all out.

[pliant pike]

yeah I'll go for full lazy thanks

[delicate swan]

I wish I had a use case that needed large chains of jobs, the whole scheduling system is pretty neat

[pliant pike]

yeah its way better than it used to be

[viral sonnet]

hehe, that's like half of the system 😄

and yeah, the job system is really robust and fun to use

all this was much worse beforehand and on the rewrite i was pretty stunned how well the job system figures out when to start jobs

finding bugs though can be quite tedious. one stupid mistake and all comes crashing down 😄

[robust scaffold]

Finally got it in one image. Big old stack.

I've gotta say, making jobs out of structs is really beautiful for a big scheduling method. Especially if all the names are aligned vertically.

[safe lintel]

There was a forum post about the q&a going out, confirmed what we expected that 1.0 is releasing with the tech release. I’m still thinking even tho it’s improving there are a lot of issues bugs and pain points to get through in maybe not a lot of time left?

[robust scaffold]

Ehhhhh, there's a lot of bugfixing until it's ready for public preview. Note how unity hasn't announced the pre.1 build is available yet.

Definitely not full "release" release but I expect a public "pre.2" build by the time 2022LTS is announced.

[delicate swan]

I will consider it production ready when they get non-gameobject entity selection in scene view working, lol

[robust scaffold]

Ha. Nothing is rendering for me in scene view anyways

I'm using sprite renderer and unity has been pretty up in the air on the future of hybrid components.

[delicate swan]

Yeah, that and the opposite direction, haven't seen much news about the pure ecs runtime

[robust scaffold]

For now, they're bare minimum functioning but definitely not in a good place. That's 1 question I really want answered definitively on the 8th

[robust scaffold]

Tiny is dead. 6 feet under, for now.

And probably for the next 2 years at least. So dont hold out hope for that.

[delicate swan]

Damn, that's why there hasn't been any news

I already have the .net transition as my distant pie in the sky

[robust scaffold]

The entire team was dissolved and either redistributed or laid off entirely according to the last direct mention of that team.

[delicate swan]

I do recall that, wish Microsoft would hurry up and just buy Unity already

[robust scaffold]

Then again, it was only 4 guys so that isnt much.

Ehhhhhh. Eh. Microsoft buying Unity would be great for .net integration but it'll probably take years to bring the engine to that point.

Years unity is attempting to do anyways, without Bill Gates breathing down their necks.

[rotund token]

haha there's a system at work that's over 5,000 lines long

😄

'best practices'

one of those things that started smaller, and just having stuff tacked on and was left too late to refactor and no one wants to touch it

good times

[robust scaffold]

I mistakenly coded the entirety of the system list in my entity debugger in the main dispatch class. It was only 200 lines but separating it into it's own class was like pulling teeth.

[delicate swan]

Here's a talk that came out like 2 weeks about about just this (timestamepd to the .net future part): https://youtu.be/T6HhePbyAsg?t=1460

[robust scaffold]

Yea, the info in that is pretty old though. The pertinent parts about moving away from assembly refs and attempting to maintain compatibility with .net master branch were announced back in Unite 2020? Perhaps earlier.

[rotund token]

yeah this is a huge task for them

must have been working on it for a while

probably still a bit off

[delicate swan]

Yeah, that vids pretty much just a good overview of the work to be done and the plan as it stands still, with all the "weight shedding", its nice they still seem committed to it

[robust scaffold]

I honestly think we'll get DOTS production release before we see that.

[rotund token]

be so nice when we get onto core though

[viral sonnet]

what would that solve?

[delicate swan]

Part of the point of moving to core is getting inline with Microsofts future plans, iirc they were planning on merging .net core and mono runtimes

[viral sonnet]

anyway, i'm not supporting MS buying anything. they are big enough already 😄

[delicate swan]

MS is actually pretty good about buying to fund, they just like owning things they consider assets, and they def consider unity an asset as its one of most well known users of C#, and its also useful for internal prototyping and used for way too much

[viral sonnet]

what i pretty much don't get is why unity doesn't have a store with a 15% cut

[robust scaffold]

We got enough stores...

[delicate swan]

Same reason Microsoft Store sucks, turns out its actually pretty difficult to cultivate a good store, even when you have a direct line to developers

[viral sonnet]

EGS seems to be doing fine

[rotund token]

isn't it losing a huge amount of money/year?

[delicate swan]

And they had to take a huge cut vs competitors to attract that attention, and they still have contention when something is exclusive to it vs steam exclusive

[robust scaffold]

It works if you advertise like mad and bribe everyone.

[viral sonnet]

so? better than anything involving gamepass

[delicate swan]

Gamespass is actually pretty sick if you have an xbox, can't really speak to pc games pass as I use steam

[rotund token]

i had a colleague who swore by the game streaming on PC

loved it

just played a different game every day

[viral sonnet]

yeah, great for consumers.

[delicate swan]

Epic's also not really worried about losing money on the store, they have a much bigger multibillion dollar product that generates enormous profit

[rotund token]

but yeah EGS has lost over $500mill and their own projections is losing money for at least another 5 years

that doesn't sound like something a public company strapped for cash wants to go into ^_^'

[robust scaffold]

Latency is killer though. For singleplayer or less reflex based games, it's great.

[rotund token]

yeah i believe he was mostly a SP gamer

was surprised the service even existed in aus

most of these services just dont come here

[delicate swan]

Oh yeah, I haven't even messed with the streaming stuff really, that said, I remember OnLive! That was game changing when it was new

[robust scaffold]

Nvidia's GeForce Now was really good back when I used it when I had a shit comp but good internet. But when I had some spare change to throw down on an actual comp, there was no need.

[delicate swan]

Yeah, its a good intermediate, wish Valve would do something similar just because I'd be more inclined to use something like that if it was in addition instead of a whole separate deal

[robust scaffold]

It's a fuck load of money and bandwidth for very small margins. And the legal headaches of trying to get all those licenses to host the games.

Nvidia was big enough to go "skip asking for permission, ask for forgiveness later" path and gain a huge market share because of it. Steam, despite their importance in game distribution, isnt as untouchable.

And now that Nvidia burned that bridge, valve doesnt really have a path forward in that field.

[delicate swan]

I'd be surprised if there were seperate legal ramifications to the way Nvidia is doing things

[robust scaffold]

Oh no doubt. But Nvidia has enough lawyers and fuck you no DirectX integration power to smooth over any problems.

[delicate swan]

What legal difference does it make where you run end software on a private end-to-end stream? Like, am I violating some anti-streaming clause by playing games over steam link?

[robust scaffold]

You? Standard IANAL but the T&S probably has something about that.

is it enforceable towards the random streaming it? Probably not so it's safe enough.

[delicate swan]

I guess my point is, especially with Nvidia's method, what sort of copyright/ip violation/legal threshold would they be committing by letting you download your own games via the authorized software onto a computer you were authorized access too?
Isn't that exactly the same concept as locally? I think its probably a concern in the questioning sense, but its not even kinda shady or bypass-y, I'd be curious what, if any, the legal complaints have been

Oh, ok, the complaints against Geforce Now I'm finding aren't that you can do it in general, its specifically that they had a subscription service that let you access games you didn't own outside their paid subscription, but didn't have the license to distribute those games to people who otherwise didn't buy them off of another storefront, I was very confused why people cared about the location of the hardware a paid and legally access game was run on

[robust scaffold]

That's outta my ballpark. Im sure google can probably answer that, if it's not locked down tight under NDA as these legal things are.

Progress has been excruciatingly slow as I attempt to figure out how to do this.

I dont know if I should keep the icon but I had a bunch of white space and well, nothing else to stick there.

[viral sonnet]

i'd prefer an entity reference that doesn't care about the version. saves 1 int

[rotund token]

sadly that would cause a lot of bugs

[viral sonnet]

yeah, i know. :/

i just wish the option was there. for example, any child doesn't need a version. same goes for parent.

or you reference some database entity that will always exist

maybe i'll try this out at some point and just hardcode version 0 or 1 (wherever it starts, i actually don't know ^^)

[rotund token]

i assume you mean only from parent?

but anything targeting the child does

so i'm not super sure of the advantage here

[viral sonnet]

well, the advantage is really just micro optimising 2 ints to 1. i know it's not great for the can of worms it opens

[robust scaffold]

Now for the hardest part, how am I gonna do the graphic. 128 visual elements?

[viral sonnet]

which graphic do you mean? the chunk visualisation?

[safe lintel]

ugh why is only one terrain collider getting baked. i wish they didnt make havok pro only because unity physics debug views still look like garbage

[robust scaffold]

Yea. The old one was made by generating a mesh then calling Graphics.DrawMesh. I'm gonna have to see if it's possible somehow in ui toolkit

[rotund token]

ah this bloody issue

it's got me before

                    {
                        state->PreviouslyEnabled = true;
                        OnStartRunning();
                    }

                    state->BeforeOnUpdate();
                    // ...
                    OnUpdate();

OnStartRunning updating before BeforeOnUpdate

so OnStartRunning doesn't have updated dependency which is triggered in BeforeOnUpdate

and if you try do so an operation you get
InvalidOperationException: The previously scheduled job StateFlagSystemImpl:StateJob writes to the ComponentTypeHandle<BovineLabs.Game.UI.UIState> StateJob.JobData.StateType. You must call JobHandle.Complete() on the job StateFlagSystemImpl:StateJob, before you can write to the ComponentTypeHandle<BovineLabs.Game.UI.UIState> safely.
and it seems I have to do something stupid like this

        {
            SystemAPI.QueryBuilder().WithAll<UIState>().Build().CompleteDependency();
            SystemAPI.SetSingleton(default(UIState));```

Dependency.Complete()
or
SystemAPI.GetSingletonRW<UIState>().ValueRW.Value = default;
do not work

Legitimately everything

1. I deleted a material only used in a urp full screen effect, everything rebake
2. any script reimport, even if it's in an assembly with only 1 script that is a CustomEditor with no other dependencies referencing it
3. restarting unity

the incremental works for me

i don't get full rebakes

that is part is fine

the 1. is a bit odd

it was a material referenced only by

Universal Renderer Data

which is only referenced by project settings

it was just a very unexpected case because i saw on reason it should trigger it so it surprised me

i can't repo it though

my guess would probably be along the lines for this case is i had script changes not-refreshed (i manually refresh assets in unity) and deleting this asset simply triggered a refresh

i lied

i may have triggered it again

i have no code in this project

not a single script

(outside of unity libraries)

i'm still not certain there's an issue there and i just haven't accidentally refreshed assets by making a deletion and triggered a domain reload another way

(sorry if I appear negative I'm not trying to be. I actually like baking I'm just a bit stressed as today was our semi content lock for our launch)

something I am finding though is i randomly get really big spikes in GameObjectChangeTracker:MergeEventsJob

this is 5 sequential profiles of Open subscene in the same domain

(sorry scale is off will have to look at numbers)

7000ms, 20500ms, 7800, 20300ms, 37000ms

i have both hierarchies open, but the old one focused

and the mode is automatic (authoring)

i literally just hit open

and sit watching the bar

cpu usage is 4%

yeah, these profiles are hitting the Open button the the SubScene script

i was profiling that specifically

if you want i can send you the scene, i split this off into a small standalone project so i could compare with Enzi

37seconds was the last

but that was an anomaly

sure

noticed there was a performance test for this so i was curious and ran them

[misty wedge]

Are the backing fields of auto properties guaranteed to be sequentially layed out inside a struct at the position the auto property is defined?

[viral sonnet]

are you talking about StructLayout.Auto?

[misty wedge]

I'm talking about the default behavior, so no attributes on the struct

[pliant pike]

I have a slight error I made the waypoints move instead of something too them 😆

[devout prairie]

is there an issue with adding a buffer using a parallel ecb, like this:

interestingly, i've only ever added buffers elsewhere using EntityManager or single thread ecb

But i'm getting an error with this

[misty wedge]

What's the error?

[devout prairie]

the buffer line is the only thing i've added to make the difference in the Spawner system ( where the error is saying the ecb was written )

[misty wedge]

That's coming from SetComponent, not AddBuffer

[devout prairie]

i haven't added any other stuff that i'm aware of except the buffer line

[misty wedge]

What does the buffer component look like

[devout prairie]

need to just double check that i think

[devout prairie]

nothing unusual

[misty wedge]

I'd turn off burst and look at the actual exception proper

[devout prairie]

it doesn't throw an exception with burst off 🤷

[misty wedge]

Then your burst cache broke

What burst version are you on

I'd restart the editor if you haven't done that yet

[devout prairie]

i'll try that

dots 0.51 on 2021.3

[misty wedge]

burst version, not dots

[devout prairie]

burst 1.7.3

[misty wedge]

I think that didn't have any caching issues, not 100% sure though. tertle reported the issue

Have you tried restarting?

[devout prairie]

just trying restart now

[misty wedge]

Also any reason why the unit you are spawning isn't already spawned with the buffer instead of adding it via an ECB?

[devout prairie]

i have had some occasional odd issues with 2021.3 for sure, compared to 2020.3

[devout prairie]

yeah i'm just using basic runtime conversion and then adding stuff when i spawn

[misty wedge]

I recommend you use prefabs, since runtime conversion is gone in 1.0 afaik

[devout prairie]

it is prefabs already yeah, just not using subscene conversion at all

keeping authoring to a minimum while i develop the project, as it's easier to just add/remove/change what components i want on things in code than clicking around on prefabs etc

yeah restarting fixed it

weird

thanks!

[devout prairie]

would you say that authoring has improved in 1.0, become simpler/easier, and have bugs been ironed out yet to the point where it's worth the hassle of moving to 1.0?

( besides the wider architectural improvements that 1.0 brings )

[pliant pike]

it sounds like the array doesn't exist when its being called or set

[misty wedge]

I think it's pretty good

all of the other stuff is definitely worth the upgrade imo

I have the strangest issue, and I don't know if it's me messing something up or if it's a known bug.

Everything works fine, but for some reason as soon as I do some actions in the editor, it breaks my collider blob assets. For example, clicking an entity in the entity inspector during runtime seems to mess the collider up for some reason. Anyone have an idea?

The error throws in BroadPhase.cs, since the pointer is not valid:

I also checked, BlobAssetReference.IsCreated is false

I'm not even doing anything special with the collider, it's just automatically created during baking by the PhysicsShapeAuthoring

It also only seems to break on the client, not on the server, which makes it even more strange

[robust scaffold]

ya know, coding in OOS and reference types everywhere makes life so much easier. Change one value and everything referencing it also changes magically. I can see why people like OOS.

[devout prairie]

silence, infidel!

[rotund token]

I assume you mean with an open subscene

[safe lintel]

I havent had that blobasset breaking with 1.0.0.pre.15 and 2022.2.0.f1 editor

[rotund token]

anyone noticed that if you turn off burst compilation

function pointers still seem to run bursted if you had already run them bursted once

[misty wedge]

No, just during runtime in the entity hierarchy

Really strange

[delicate swan]

Have you tried running it on another system too see if it still happens?

[misty wedge]

What do you mean?

Oh you mean a other pc

[delicate swan]

Yeah, my bad, should have been more clear

[misty wedge]

No, but I don't see how that can be the issue

[delicate swan]

Just to rule out potentially obscure hardware issues

[misty wedge]

I'll check when I'm home 👍

[delicate swan]

I only bring it up because I've had a mind-numbing experience once where a photo I was editing kept getting noise over time / edits, and a few games would crash with super obscure not-even-on-google errors, turns out I had some bad/funky ram that was flipping just enough bits to cause issues, but not enough near protected space it was causing a bluescreen

Ever since then, if something is randomly corrupting over use, my goto is to check it against another working machine, just rules out the vague and unlikely

[misty wedge]

I doubt this is it since it's very reproducible, also the PC is very new but I'll check regardless 👍

[rotund token]

is it a ghost?

[misty wedge]

I don't think it matters what I click to inspect

But I'll check once I get home

I don't understand why it only breaks on the client

[rotund token]

i'm unable to repo it

i have a subscene loaded both on client/server

and clicking in hierarchy or scene view causes no issues

but i don't have ghosts setup hence the asking

[misty wedge]

Even wieder, I have a graph system that uses Odin for serialization, if I change a value there, the same error occurs. Really weird

[rotund token]

maybe try remove odin?

[misty wedge]

I don't even save the graph

[rotund token]

(that said i have odin in this project as well, but it's not being used anywhere)

[misty wedge]

I can't really, I use it for a lot of serialization

[rotund token]

rip

[misty wedge]

It's not a debilitating issue either, just really weird and annoying

[rotund token]

wondering if their custom inspectors have issues

what version?

[misty wedge]

Odin?

[rotund token]

yeah

[misty wedge]

Not sure, I'd have to check. 3.something

But afaik their editors don't interact with the entity inspector

[rotund token]

ecs support was on their roadmap but yeah turns out mines a bit out of date

just curious

[misty wedge]

Is there a way to debug what is invalidating the reference? I can't set a watch on the PhysicsCollider.Collider blob asset

Something has to be changing the value somehow

[rotund token]

it's a bit weird if the subscene is closed

[misty wedge]

I don't get why it's only on the client

That's what's really confusing me

I guess I could locally copy the entities package, change the field to a proprty and break on the setter

[robust scaffold]

And they (i.e. nobody) said the graphic could not be done.

Actually surprisingly easy. Just draw a line for every column.

[rotund token]

ha thought you were doing the green background colour

but it's the lines!

that makes sense

cool

[robust scaffold]

Yea, lots of time wasted trying various things and seeing if they work.

[rotund token]

you ever notice on days when entities is playing nicely and not crashing

[robust scaffold]

Days? You mean minutes?

[rotund token]

something else steps up instead

      at UnityEngine.Rendering.ScriptableRenderContext:Submit_Internal_Injected <0x000e0>
      at UnityEngine.Rendering.ScriptableRenderContext:Submit_Internal <0x00072>
      at UnityEngine.Rendering.ScriptableRenderContext:Submit <0x000d2>
      at UnityEngine.Rendering.Universal.UniversalRenderPipeline:RenderSingleCamera <0x01892>```
common URP i don't want to deal with you

[robust scaffold]

huh, that aint good.

@viral sonnet 1 week of nonstop coding and I (almost) finally brought the Entity Debugger to the modern age.

[robust scaffold]

To be honest, I've never had the RP crash on me. Even in the middle of coding my lighting. No matter what I threw at it, at least on the shader side, it always stayed alive.

I definitely had GPU stalls for over utilization but that's Windows killing Unity, not my code.

[rotund token]

oh most of my crashes atm are from SRP

i have very few entity crashes atm

[robust scaffold]

Hybrid?

[rotund token]

entities graphics or whatever it's called now

but all the errors are from the srp but yeah it could be at fault

[robust scaffold]

Yea, always gonna call it hybrid. Entities is core dots.

[rotund token]

you know what, i do miss being able to see fragmentation

i want to confirm if chunk components still cause bad fragmentation

[robust scaffold]

I dont know if this can show that. All i'm doing is binning archetype chunks by entity count.

Maybe.

[rotund token]

thats basically what those lines show!

[robust scaffold]

I can post a zip of the current source but none of the selection work (other than inspector view) and none of the search bars are implemented.

If ya want it now or wait a day or three for me to finish this up

[rotund token]

it's down on my list of things to look at atm

but it's something i wnat to check out

i believe previously, and based off graphics source it might still be the case

but when you add a chunk component new entities will no longer be added to that chunk

i need to confirm this

[robust scaffold]

Give me a sec

[robust scaffold]

Do you know what the define is for netcode package?

[rotund token]

what do you mean?

[robust scaffold]

Tiny has the DOTS_RUNTIME define. The I want to gate a small section of code to run only if netcode package exists

or else this debugger will require netcode as a dependency

It's just these 3 lines

[rotund token]

they are defined on the asmdef

usually unity uses UNITY_NETCODE

but you need to set this up on your asmdef

this kind of thing

but for netcode

[robust scaffold]

Like this?

[rotund token]

Yes

You can leave out expression though if you don't care about version

[robust scaffold]

Alright, here's the asmref:

yep, plenty of bugs

[balmy thistle]

Wow

[rotund token]

KornFlaks is a man of focus, commitment and sheer fucking will

I'm curious how this graph drawing scales to high chunk counts

[robust scaffold]

Shouldn't matter. At most with an extremely fragmented chunk distribution, it's only 128 nodes. It's the backend data gathering that might choke. It's all OOS UIElement coding. No jobs or high performance coding found in the current various DOTS inspectors.

It runs on a structural change filter at least. So if you're doing structural changes every update, it might be pretty bad.

[rotund token]

You know I might take your implementation and just inject it into the existing archetype window

(just the graph)

[robust scaffold]

Eh. The problem with mine is that I frankensteined it together using a tree view. Every line is a different item. Which is why selection is disabled.

[rotund token]

Hmm I'd have to look

[robust scaffold]

But the graph will probably work with an injection of "ChunkGraph" found under EntityElements

[rotund token]

One of things I really like about ui toolkit is how easy it is to inject ui onto existing ui

[robust scaffold]

You'll need to connect up the ArchCounts which unity doesnt calculate for their archetypes.

[rotund token]

Like the filter I added to hierarchy

[robust scaffold]

Yea, and the ability to see what's actually going on by hovering over an element of the UI is very helpful

The graph itself is hardcoded pixel offsets so you'll need to pixel shift using CSS for that

[urban ore]

Would anyone happen to know why NativeList.Add has an in parameter, but the other types of native collections, like NativeQueue.Enqueue don't seem to use in params? From looking at the burst inspector, it seems like adding the in param to my native collection does dodge an extra copy of the struct? Is this maybe just a compilation level thing where I'm not seeing the fully optimized code?

Or maybe I'm totally missing some important point about in params in these use-cases?

[viral sonnet]

nice! good job

[viral sonnet]

^ this

[robust scaffold]

Ya know, as educational as this journey was. I spent wayyyy to long on this. I'm gonna leave it unfinished for now until I have an overwhelming urge to complete the search and filter functions. Im gonna go back to my sim coding.

[pliant pike]

stupid question but is there some trick to get a bunch of the game objects converted in a consistent same order so that in a nativearray they are all in the same order

at first it was converted in reverse order no on second boot its just random 😕

[robust scaffold]

if they're all in the same subscene, they might be baked in order if they all trigger incremental builder.

Alternatively, assign an integer to each one using a monobehavior

[pliant pike]

I can't even use subscenes to be honest they don't seem to be converted into the main scene for some reason when its closed 🤷‍♂️

[robust scaffold]

?

[pliant pike]

yeah I don't know either I think its some bug with my version/project

[pliant pike]

I guess I'm going to have to do the add the integer thing every new boot the order is completely different, I've never come across this before

[robust scaffold]

With incremental baking, I doubt entity baking is deterministic.

[pliant pike]

well that sucks

[pliant pike]

ok I think I found a way to convert the gameobjects in the same order I just place them all in an empty gameobject and convert that and it seems to work

[robust scaffold]

What?

[robust scaffold]

Convert to entity??

You on 0.17?

[pliant pike]

no 0.51

if I have convert to entity on them all individually then its just random, but if I do it like the above the its in the correct order

[robust scaffold]

Huh

[pliant pike]

I'm sorry I'm not sure what the confusion is

[robust scaffold]

There were a lot of quirks with C2E which is why Unity dropped it with 1.0. I guess that was one of them.

Make sure to unparent these entities or else you'll be eating massive transform costs for parenting.

[pliant pike]

oh really, interesting I did not know that, I only have one entity navigating through them so should be fine for now though

[robust scaffold]

Thats if you change the transforms of any of these. If they're all static, then a change filter will skip them.

The ParentToLocal 4x4 matrix might be wasting chunk capacity though if not used.

[pliant pike]

ok that's something to be aware of in the future

to be honest I would just generally convert them straight to blobassets if I was going to do things completely properly

[robust scaffold]

I just thought of something, wouldnt it be nice to see the hierarchy broken into chunks?

And yes, I did get filtering by archetype working

[viral sonnet]

that's neat!

[robust scaffold]

And you can click on the chunk headers to highlight the archetype it's a part of. No more hunting down the components list to find the specific archetype on a list that's 50 items long and foldered. Downside is no scrolling to the chunk info though due to how the list is constructed.

And yes, this will show all of the world entities with matching archetypes if player loop is selected (only useful for netcode tbf).

[worn umbra]

Any pros/cons of passing direct instance vs RefRW/RefRO instances to JobEntity's constructor?
I think using RefR/(OW) is better due accessibility check during job execution, but more performant would be using direct instance because two jobs cannot edit the same data. Do you agree with my theory?

[rustic rain]

what constructor?

what are you doing?

RefRW and RefRO are only used for aspects

[worn umbra]

I think you are not right. For example GetSingletonRW.

How do you want to modify a singleton without RW variant if RefRW is supposed to be for aspects only?

what constructor?
For a class that is implementing IJobEntity

[rustic rain]

you don't use RefRW/RefRO in IJE, also you don't use class for it

it can only be struct

it's way easier than that

you just use ref modifier on parameters in void Execute

codegen will generate job for you

ref for modifying ofc

in for Read only

https://docs.unity3d.com/Packages/com.unity.entities@1.0/manual/iterating-data-ijobentity.html#create-an-ijobentity-job

[worn umbra]

My bad. I should use better wording. I meant structs, not classes. Anyway, I simplified it here to get quickly to the right point, and with the following messages, I made it quite too simple as it lost its sense. What I meant is IJobChunk, where you need to pass handles for component types and so on, but in some scenarios, you want to get there a singleton that you want to modify. This singleton is passed to other jobs in the same system. So you have to pass your singleton into the job's constructor, and my question was if it is better to pass the Value of RefRW or the RefRW wrapper. I imagine calling the ValueRW will run some locking mechanism; therefore, if I pass it there without the RefRW wrapper, it can be locked for other jobs modifying the same Singleton but different data. They are always touching different data.

[grizzled nexus]

from 1.0.0-pre.15 changelog

[rustic rain]

oh

I see

it's optional though

and probably only useful in very large jobs (codewise)

with many nested helper methods

which get rekt by ref and in parameters

[rustic rain]

mind showing code of what you are trying to do?

[worn umbra]

Sorry, it is not about code. It is a knowledge question to check if my theory is correct. When designing these systems in depth, I will need to use the right approach. So I need to understand how it works. I can give you an example:

Let's say you have a singleton. Where do you have stored float3. You will update this float3 with three jobs, where each job is editing one value of float3. You will need to disable some restrictions and do a workaround to be able to do this. Each job will require a set of types that are partially shared between the three jobs. So the right approach is to use IJobChunk here and mark the types as ReadOnly. Each job needs write access to the singleton.

public void OnUpdate(ref SystemState state) {
  var singleton = state.GetSingletonRW<Something>(); // Returns RefRW<Something>

  // apporach 1 - which I think is locking the edit access for all jobs:
  var unwrapped = singleton.ValueRW;
  new Job1{ singleton: unwrapped }
  new Job2{ singleton: unwrapped }
  new Job3{ singleton: unwrapped }

  // approach 2 - you will need to call singleton.ValueRW in the job. 
  // That means each job will try to lock the 'singleton' for itself and it will pontentially throw an error?
  // If they manage to write into the singleton at the same time 
  new Job1{ singleton: singleton }
  new Job2{ singleton: singleton }
  new Job3{ singleton: singleton }
}

The Jobs in approach1 hold a reference to Something, and the jobs in approach2 hold a pointer to Something with some write-validation on dereferencing. In one scenario, you are exchanging safety for performance, and in another, vice versa. That is the logical outcome for me.

[rustic rain]

oh, no no
You are not supposed to do that

RW can get invalidated before job is actually executed

[worn umbra]

ahh

[rustic rain]

you need to either store entity value instead and pass lookup to collect data during job

or just pass copy

[worn umbra]

So the RefRW is WeakRefRW.

[rustic rain]

it's just pointer to actual data

but as soon as structural change happens - it can be invalidated

and safety system will not pass it

you might want to store true singleton data somewhere else outside of entities if you just want to pass pointer to it around

[worn umbra]

Thank you, where did you find this information? I was going through Entities docs and have yet to find an answer.

[rustic rain]

I'v been in this channel for almost a year now 😅

above you can see my implementation of singleton struct concept

it's persistent and never gets moved around like entity data

one struct type per world design

[worn umbra]

Thank you very much, I understand what is going on now. 🙂

[gusty comet]

Are we able to set an Enableable component as initially disabled from a Baker now?

[misty wedge]

Yes

Is there a way to get a ref to a part of a NativeArray<byte> as a specific type beginning at a specific offset?

There's SliceConvert, but I can't find anything to get a ref to an element of the slice

[robust scaffold]

Get the pointer, offset it to the start of the slice, cast to the type

[misty wedge]

Yeah that's basically what I ended up with

And there are no alignment issues with this? Since the data will not be memory aligned

I've never tried this so just making sure it's fine

[robust scaffold]

Eh, profile it

[oblique cosmos]

Anyone know if this error is actually a real thing or just something that got messed up? Because Google results are borderline non-existent but suggest it's something messed up, perhaps?

structs cannot be passed to or returned from external functions in burst. To fix this issue, use a reference or pointer.

[robust scaffold]

https://docs.unity3d.com/Packages/com.unity.burst@1.8/manual/csharp-calling-burst-code.html
No clue what you're attempting to do but here they use float4s which are structs

[oblique cosmos]

Just playing around with some simple extensions such as:

So ... your link sounds like it is a real thing, then?

[robust scaffold]

Ah, no. That return float3 will not work

use (float3 vector, float3 planeNormal, out float3 result)

then assign result. Burst compiled methods must return void.

[oblique cosmos]

I see. Good to know, thanks!

I imagine your link will describe everything well enough to figure it out!

[misty wedge]

Here are the supported types for return values

[oblique cosmos]

Gotcha, thanks!

[robust scaffold]

Where is that list again?

[misty wedge]

https://docs.unity3d.com/Packages/com.unity.burst@1.8/manual/csharp-burst-intrinsics-dllimport.html

[robust scaffold]

Ah, buried in there. I remember seeing it in 1.6 or something. A while ago and lost it.

[misty wedge]

Yeah it's somewhat hidden in the docs

[gusty comet]

Great! Is there a new api to do that from inside a Baker?

[misty wedge]

I don't know if there's a function that doesn't need the entity passed, but this also works

[robust scaffold]

GetEntity without any properties sent in returns the primary entity currently modified by the baker I believe.

[misty wedge]

I just found it weird there isn't an overload that gets passed nothing similar to the AddComponent method

[misty wedge]

I meant the SetComponentEnabled method

Since you don't need to pass any entity to AddComponent

[robust scaffold]

Ah, hrm. No clue

[misty wedge]

Still good to know, thanks 👍

[robust scaffold]

Ya can probably write an extension as well. Just this:```csharp
public void SetComponentEnabled<T>(bool enabled) where T : struct, IEnableableComponent
{
CheckComponentHasBeenAddedByThisBaker(_State.PrimaryEntity, TypeManager.GetTypeIndex<T>());

_State.Ecb.SetComponentEnabled<T>(_State.PrimaryEntity, enabled);

}```

[gusty comet]

Yeeeeessssss

[misty wedge]

Any idea why I can't use the authoring components for physics if I locally import the package?

(I have no compile errors)

[rotund token]

Reimport physics

I've had this issue a few times with a lot of different packages

Where it didn't import properly

[robust scaffold]

Find the package folder in the directory view in Unity and just reimport the entire folder.

[rotund token]

^ good advice because there are likely other issues

[robust scaffold]

Tertle, have you seen the new jetbrains fleet? Looks like a VSCode knockoff

[rotund token]

Yes

Looked at it a week or so ago

Was interested in the collab features

I don't think code with me works with rider still

They hit a snag or something

[robust scaffold]

It looks interesting. Using VS code now for generic text editing. Worth moving over?

[misty wedge]

I've used it a bit, but C# support is terrible compared to rider

Atleast a month ago when I tested it

[robust scaffold]

No doubt, rider is dedicated C#. A trimmed down better integrated intellicomplete VSC might be worth

[misty wedge]

Well, the point of fleet is that it gives the same experience. From what I understood initially, fleet uses their other IDE "engines" in the backend for language specific features if you activate smart mode

And that isn't the case yet afaik

Not sure what the issue specifically is

[robust scaffold]

Huh, ehhhh. Guess I'll just stick with VSC then. If I wanted a code editor, I'll boot up one of the mainline ones.

[misty wedge]

The idea is very intriguing at least, I just worry that their monetization model will completely fail to compete with VSC

[rotund token]

I still use notepad++ 😄

[misty wedge]

(since that's free, and fleet isn't)

[rotund token]

You could say the about rider though vs VS

[misty wedge]

Rider has been a lot better than VS for me

granted, I'm using rider for free atm 😅

[robust scaffold]

broke student time

[misty wedge]

Although I do commend jetbrains for their licensing model. It's sad that so few companies reduce the subscription fee for long time customers

[robust scaffold]

yea, unless it's cheap enough from the start. I draw the line at 10 bucks a month.

[warped fog]

I’m an atom guy for non C# work, but they’re sunsetting it this month. There’s other editors (is sublime still a thing?), but generally speaking I don’t like all the telemetry vscode sends back. Would love to find a new editor that isn’t a full IDE (I work in nodejs and golang too)

[robust scaffold]

https://github.com/VSCodium/vscodium There's VSCodium, VSC with telemetry stripped from the source. Otherwise basic text editors work. I heard of people coding in microsoft word.

[misty wedge]

I use VSCode for stuff at work exclusively, which is mainly python and some JS. For those languages it has very good support imo

[warped fog]

Yeah, I may check out vscodium. Or go back to sublime. Atom checked a lot of my boxes, shame MS killed it. Thanks for the recommendation.

[safe lintel]

megacity sample out fyi https://github.com/Unity-Technologies/Megacity-Sample

[rotund token]

oh that's huge

[misty wedge]

literally

[rotund token]

huge 🤔

i guess i have to pull with git/lfs

[safe lintel]

isnt it git lfs that doesnt work with download?

[robust scaffold]

No announcement, huh

[safe lintel]

theres crashing mentioned in the thread, happened to me too several times - https://forum.unity.com/threads/megacity-feedback-discussion.647248/page-4
seems like if I play immediately before it finishes doing whatever stuff in editor it doesnt crash

[rotund token]

Audio seems to just use a pool of audio sources

[safe lintel]

its really underwhelming(the audio), just got it to play now

[robust scaffold]

https://github.com/Unity-Technologies/Megacity-Sample/blob/master/Assets/Scripts/Authoring/Lights/LightRef.cs
Lights are just pooled gameobjects, ha.

[misty wedge]

I thought graphics with HDRP already supported all light types?

[robust scaffold]

As hybrid components.

[misty wedge]

Ah, I thought they were converted to some kind of ECS format

[robust scaffold]

Nah

[misty wedge]

I wish all of the rendering components were at least available as hybrid components

[robust scaffold]

Tilemap renderer when?

[rotund token]

2033

[misty wedge]

SortingGroup is also missing

[robust scaffold]

An optimist I see.

I mean, theoretically it's simple enough to remake. It's all the in-editor tooling and rule tile functionality that's difficult to replicate. Although those are open source.

And physics integration. I need the ability to pull a tilemap collider into a mesh for DOTS physics and coding that seems like pain

[misty wedge]

Yep, I use entities for object collision atm

(and also since they need to be synced by the server)

[robust scaffold]

Although theoredically I can do so using a 2 pass cube/rectangular length set process but that's just pain.

[viral sonnet]

unityhub3 is a POS: Unable to refresh license. Please try again.

anyone has downloaded the full megacity demo?

[safe lintel]

yeah

[viral sonnet]

tortoisegit is stuck on Resolving deltas: 100% (2401/2401), done. and the project keep growing

how large is it?

just the assets folder

[safe lintel]

17.9 gb

[viral sonnet]

whoa ok 😄

[safe lintel]

I took the dog for a walk while fork downloaded it 🙂

[viral sonnet]

they still didn't bother to add 2022.2.0f1 to unity hub ...

[robust scaffold]

I think it's only available for the public for us (dots people) because how unusable the asset database crashes were

[viral sonnet]

i see

great f1 release 😄

lol

download page is completely broken for me: https://beta.unity3d.com/download/1c1f8590be28/download.html

or i dunno, maybe it's supposed to be that way

[rotund token]

i don't think that is meant to be a user facing page? (or maybe its just broken =D)

[robust scaffold]

Heh, yea. Just use the unityhub link below it in edge

It should open up unity hub that will prompt the download

[safe lintel]

github page for megacity has a link for the hub editor

[robust scaffold]

Nah, the source is pure HTML.

[viral sonnet]

link doesn't work for me

[rotund token]

unityhub://2022.2.0f1/1c1f8590be28

works for me just tested

[safe lintel]

unityhub://2022.2.0f1/1c1f8590be28 this one? i did set my url association with the hub

[rotund token]

if it doesn't work you blocked permissions or something at some point

[viral sonnet]

hm, i already have it installed now. link works now for some reason 🤷‍♂️

[rotund token]

SystemAPI.Query still doesn't work with structural changes right?

[misty wedge]

I don't think so, didn't see anything in the patch notes

[rotund token]

shame but whatever, ToEntityArray from query it is

(cant use ecb, this is for setting up managed components)

[robust scaffold]

I think it works for creating entities given an archetype. Dani listed only 3 allowed structural changes and that was one of them

[rotund token]

i just want to add a managed component

which i don't think is allowed as it affects the existing chunk

[robust scaffold]

On a side note, I finally gotten around to testing havok vs unity physics for circle on box and box on box sliding. Surprisingly, unity physics without contact stabilization is superior to havok in sliding across edges with minimal jumping / repulsing artifacts. Havok is really bad at sliding boxes.

[warped fog]

My game is strictly 2d too and I make heavy use of tile maps. Between that and official ECS sprite support, I think it’s gonna be a hot minute. -.-

[robust scaffold]

Yeaaaaa, it's pain.

[misty wedge]

It's still pretty fast with the batch set methods, but actual support would be nice

[robust scaffold]

Havok has extremely sharp jumps when sliding across edges between colliders at all box bevel radii whereas unity physics without contact stabilization has near un-noticable jumps at 0.075 (each static box being 1x1x1 unit cubes).

[warped fog]

I did stumble across this yesterday, looks kinda neat but I’m waiting for 2022 lts before I try it out.
https://forum.unity.com/threads/1-0-3-nsprites-sprite-rendering-package.1367463/#post-8632077

[robust scaffold]

Unity physics with contact stabilization had the same sharp jumps as havok so I think it's something to do with stacking stability.

As my game is 2d top down with no stacking, disabling it is free.

[rotund token]

ooo this megacity

has an updated? custom entities HLOD package
I found it interesting that it was removed from entities graphics

[robust scaffold]

I say sharp jumps as in 2 or 3 pixels whereas unity physics without CS has 0 or 1 pixel of jumping.

[robust scaffold]

Ah, it's interesting but ehhh. I'll probably roll my own sprite renderer.

[warped fog]

👀👀👀

🍿

[safe lintel]

did you enable the contact welding?

[robust scaffold]

On havok? Where's that?

[safe lintel]

think the havok physics settings

add a havok component last time i used it should be there?

[robust scaffold]

Ah, lets see if this changes anything

[robust scaffold]

No difference. Still 2-3 pixels of jumping.

[robust scaffold]

I've set custom tags on both the box and moving sphere.

[rotund token]

did you mark your meshes

with the tag?

hmm

[robust scaffold]

This is the wall setup. Slide up and down.

It's worse if the wall bevel radii are 0.

Sliding across a lot of edges is something very specific to my use case but it's rather interesting that unity's free solution is superior to microsoft's paid version. Although their version is intended for stacking stability.

[rotund token]

@safe lintel just out of interest, how long did it take you to import all the megacity subscenes?

i am quickly realizing 32GB of memory is not enough for Unity development anymore 😰

[robust scaffold]

did you open all of them?

[rotund token]

they're all in the root game scene

progress update: 163 seconds to do 18 of 96

[robust scaffold]

They shouldnt have autoload toggled on. Wow

[rotund token]

slowly popping in

[rotund token]

pretty sure they bake regardless of autoload

none of my subscenes have autoload enabled (i have a script to force disable to go through my subscene loading) and they always bake on domain reload

[robust scaffold]

Wow. I did read last night you had a talk with one of the unity peps on baking performance. Anything come about that?

[rotund token]

pretty sure my workflow is going to have to be keep all game subscenes in a separate scene and just keep a basic development scene in the main

wont be able to play the actual game without a few minute wait

progress update: 357 seconds to do 33 of 96

estimating 17min to import the subscenes for this

glad i finally have something large enough to test this

[robust scaffold]

Yea. I think actual scenes are the way to go and small handfuls of subscenes per scene is best.

[rotund token]

going to painfully do a bunch of workflow testing on this subscene

probalby going to legit buy the fastest AMD and fastest intel cpus on market early next year

just to compare which can import faster

[misty wedge]

I upgraded recently, it made a huge difference

[rotund token]

my cpu is /good/ though

it's still the 2nd fastest at work even though it's 2 years old

[robust scaffold]

I got some empty timeslots on my uni's supercomputing cluster. I wonder if I can chuck unity onto it...

[misty wedge]

My CPU was really old thats probably why it made such a big difference

[rotund token]

(just in case anyone is interested, i'm doing like pre-pre production work for a decent budget project that intends to be quite open world which is why i'm so focused on editor workflow on subscenes atm)

[robust scaffold]

Makes sense, and faster subscene loading in general helps everyone

[rotund token]

i don't want to be committing to a workflow that is going to cause us problems 2 years in

obviously unreal 5.1 is extremely tempting for this type of project now that it supports skinned renderers

but i'd rather not suggest pivoting the company...

[misty wedge]

You could probably write something similar to unreal's map chunk system using subscenes

[rotund token]

oh i already have something similar

[misty wedge]

I assume that'd be useful for a large open world

[rotund token]

progress update: 829 seconds to do 78 of 96

[robust scaffold]

Hopefully you dont need to rebake every domain reload

[rotund token]

i totally have to rebake every domain reload, and that's my issue

[robust scaffold]

Even closed subscenes?

[rotund token]

from my testing yes

[robust scaffold]

oh god

[misty wedge]

Why do they need to rebake?

[rotund token]

well if you made a data change to a script that was baked

there's no way around it

but if I'm not changing the runtime data (and authoring I guess though this feels optional) then I really think they need to find a way not to rebake it

[misty wedge]

Well yeah, but you aren't doing that each recompile

[rotund token]

at least this is using 45% of my CPU

1137

just under 19min

let's just hit play before i test a domain reload ^_^'

i suspect the next import won't be as slow - i've realized this is on my slowest drive by far because my normal drive had no space

so i'm going to move it

and try again

hilarious good start, menu didnt support ultrawide 😄

they've put some effort into this menu, i like

[robust scaffold]

Are they using UIE or UGUI?

[rotund token]

it's running impressively well

mostly just editor overhead

[robust scaffold]

21 fps, very chunky editor

[rotund token]

it's mostly phyiscs

the actual render part here is great

[robust scaffold]

the coreeees

[rotund token]

i have 20M tris on screen

3521 batches

[misty wedge]

took roughly 500 seconds for me

but I was playing rimworld at the same time so maybe it wouldve been a bit faster

[rotund token]

yeah i realized i had burst off

so i'm running it again ^_^'

[safe lintel]

it was like 3 or 4 editor starts after crashes and yeah was looking like my 32 doesnt cut it these days

[rotund token]

i suspect i'll be about 500 as well

[rotund token]

i didn't crash at all though

so that was good

very happy with this performance from rendering side

in a build i shouldn't get those double physic updates

[safe lintel]

@robust scaffold i did have my ground set to the tag used for contact welding

[robust scaffold]

It's not amazing visually but it's amazing technically. Especially as someone with some experience with rendering

[rotund token]

i want to test this in a build

[robust scaffold]

I was using 6 static 1x1x1 cubes stacked and sliding 0.4 radius sphere and 0.8 sized cubes along the surface of this box stack.

[rotund token]

that 2ms for cpu rendering beating expectations

if i can get past baking import workflow issues this seems promising for project

physics next concern ^_^'

so much wasted cpu time in Initialization as well

[safe lintel]

the player car sound is really obnoxious now 🙂

[robust scaffold]

looping generic car mp4. If unity couldnt be bothered to find a good audio source, just dont have any.

[safe lintel]

@rotund token have you tried moving any subscene gameobjects around? i just tried moving some wall section and its a slideshow

[rotund token]

interesting

incremental baking is the thing that has worked pretty well for me

but no i haven't, i'm making a build which requires another bake

my poor memory though

legit need 128GB next machine i'm not falling for the 64g trap! (i would like it to last a little while)

oh that said, ram is expensive atm not sure i can afford that

[viral sonnet]

i can't get out of the hit play-> crash loop

[safe lintel]

live conversion is a bit heavy

can that even be disabled now? didnt see the option in preferences, switching to non runtime authoring mode has the same result performance wise

[rotund token]

you can

but you need to go into internal

and it resets on domain reload

[safe lintel]

and crash, internal where?

[rotund token]

open the about window

type internal

you will see duplicates in your scene view though

[viral sonnet]

hm, i didn't turn off safety checks now and first time play worked

[rotund token]

because it wont update the old baked version

[viral sonnet]

rendering is pretty good. mostly around 1ms

aaand crash again. wow

[rotund token]

suckers i have not crashed at all

(i am tempting fate)

[safe lintel]

with live baking off performance is still kind of bad, like 5fps stutter but better than like 0.2fps before. and crash!

[viral sonnet]

so overall, it's no nanite but still allright 😅

[rotund token]

how many subscenes do you have open? just 1?

[safe lintel]

just 1

[rotund token]

i don't think in this scale of project you will be editing it as a subscene

just open it as a regular scene

[viral sonnet]

yeah

[safe lintel]

it was actually decent performance all those years(!) ago when they first released it

like nowhere near the crashes and slowdowns

[viral sonnet]

then baking happened

[rotund token]

really? megacity wrecked me originally

i still have the project here

[viral sonnet]

try it. I don't trust my memory 😜

[safe lintel]

yeah still got it somewhere too though I think some dependencies got messed up as it complains about certain packages not being available

[rotund token]

make a build

[safe lintel]

so you gotta upgrade some stuff and newer versions arent compatible with the old code(afaik dspgraph package is one)

[rotund token]

hope it works (it did)

ok

so

i can domain reload in megacity without importing scenes again

even restarting unity does not require this

it's caching fine

which is great

but what the hell is going on

[rotund token]

all this complaining and it works as expected

[robust scaffold]

I saw the gif on the forums and it had building blinking in and out. Distant sure but still pretty obvious

[rotund token]

oh yeah i saw at least 3 cases of this

just seems like some lod settings not setup well

[robust scaffold]

The async loading of subscenes was smooth but the LOS/D needs work.

Or crank up the distance fog setting if they had any

[viral sonnet]

i saw something on twitter that has really cool, nearly invisible lod fading

don't quote me on it but it looked official

[rotund token]

i think new urp has lod fading

https://docs.unity3d.com/Packages/com.unity.render-pipelines.universal@14.0/manual/whats-new/urp-whats-new.html#lod-cross-fade

https://docs.unity3d.com/Packages/com.unity.render-pipelines.universal@14.0/manual/universalrp-asset.html#lod-cross-fade

[robust scaffold]

That looks so odd.

[rotund token]

thats because you're seeing it up close

[misty wedge]

Crashes instantly in the editor for me too

[robust scaffold]

True. I need to play around with geometry shaders and see if I could procedurally generate those as well.

An entity with only a static physics shape and ghost authoring (i.e. no custom components) is capped out at 58 entities per chunk. So sad.

[safe lintel]

y'all getting your questions ready for the dots dev day q&a?

[robust scaffold]

I just want to know what is being or will be done on the hybrid components side. That's the largest pressing question

[safe lintel]

i wanted to ask that question too but i think the answer is nothing

[robust scaffold]

yea, and the unity peps who pop in here occasionally largely echo that

Maybe if the dots rendering folks stop by, if one of them can provide an example where they used compute buffer begin write() and somehow synchronized CPU writing with GPU reading.

[rotund token]

"look at megacity to see how you can do it!"

only question I have which i doubt would be answered

is what new features are coming to animation? is it just a big rewrite using existing statemachine approach or will we get modern animation features, for example motion matching?

[robust scaffold]

They did signal that animation is the next big push for dots so you might get an answer

[rotund token]

they kind of left animation off one of the topics to ask about

but yeah i'm pretty sure any feature answer would be vague

generally you'd want to show those off in some big push!

[robust scaffold]

topics concerning ECS, Entities, Entities Graphics, Burst, Jobs, Netcode, Character Controller, Unity & Havok Physics, and Samples & Documentation
hrm

[rotund token]

^

[safe lintel]

gonna ask about animation cos they teased it in the blog

cant mention animation and not expect followup questions!

[balmy thistle]

…

[robust scaffold]

Maybe what's the status of world specific baking. Like client and server worlds. There's clearly method hooks inside the baker right now but they dont work.

[rotund token]

i loaded up netcode the other day in project and i loaded a world on client

then loaded it on server (in play mode)

and it seemed to bake again before loading

i was confused because i didnt think this was hooked up yet

[robust scaffold]

Using the multiplayer tools?

[rotund token]

no

i do have concerns about this client/server baking doubling bake times ^_^'

but i am feeling a bit more confident about this scaling after testing megacity

giant first bake, seems reasonable stable reloading

[rotund token]

while i'm not sure this would happen, i kind of think i'd like this would just be a post processing step on the entities themselves

removing components or adding extra things

[robust scaffold]

I think netcode does that anyways using the ghost component attributes

netcode does a lot of structural changes...

[rotund token]

yes

[rotund token]

I:\Documents\BovineLabs\com.bovinelabs.game\Library\PackageCache\com.unity.netcode@1.0.0-pre.15\Runtime\Connection\NetworkStreamDriver.cs(197,13): Burst error BC1016: The managed function `Unity.NetCode.NetworkStreamDriver.<>c__DisplayClass20_0.<Listen>b__0(Unity.NetCode.NetworkStreamDriver.<>c__DisplayClass20_0* this, ref Unity.NetCode.NetworkDriverStore.NetworkDriverInstance instance, int driverId) -> void_aef4d46f9ec6d18a03913cfa3cd76414 from Unity.NetCode, Version=0.0.0.0, Culture=neutral, PublicKeyToken=null` is not supported

why is this not an error for other people

oh wait

i guess issue is i'm calling it from burst

and it's not supported

that'd be why, just stack is useless

[dense oriole]

hey -- can you somehow limit the number of workers working on an IJobEntity? I'd like to set a max number so I can preallocate less memory :p

[rotund token]

there's 128 max workers

which can be retrieved from

JobsUtility.MaxJobThreadCount

0-127 thread index

there's also
JobsUtility.JobWorkerMaximumCount
and
JobsUtility.JobWorkerCount

if you want to limit total number of workers

[dense oriole]

thanks! ❤️

[viral sonnet]

my crashes from megacity 🙂

[robust scaffold]

What does it say in the crash logs?

[rotund token]

these are mostly crashes i see in my normal project

i have a feeling if you turn off burst they go away

[robust scaffold]

turning burst off megacity though

[rotund token]

well i accidently baked it without burst

then turned it on

and never crashes

i mostly see this in my own project with burst on and some weirdness

turning burst off

clearing cache

and restarting editor usually seems to make things better

that said, this is anecdotal i have no actual hard evidence for this

[viral sonnet]

if anyone is interested in the mega city crashes

the stacktrace is always a bit different.

[rotund token]

o_O

[robust scaffold]

enzi here with those infectious crashes. gonna make tertle's megacity crash as well

[viral sonnet]

haha, what. it's just .dmp files

has tertle scanned a virus in my memory dump?

[robust scaffold]

They're all segmentation faults on deallocation. I had this problem plenty of times when I mistakenly overran my pointers. They might have a ptr[++i] instead of ptr[i++] somewhere.

[rotund token]

no idea it's trigger Trojan:Script/Wacatac.B!ml in windows defender

[viral sonnet]

https://www.virustotal.com/gui/file/7bc9986105a8492ad157baa938f45530689525a419665a5c05655e62206d6eb8?nocache=1 you might want to dump whatever program reported that ^^

[robust scaffold]

my windows defender said the files were perfectly fine

[viral sonnet]

good old windows defender

[rotund token]

now that's interesting

this is like first time in 2 years windows defender has actually scanned something for me

very odd

[robust scaffold]

just scanned my downloads folder

[robust scaffold]

man's living 8 months in the past

[viral sonnet]

i rather rely on malwarebytes 🙂

windows defender has too much false positives and the realtime protection slows the system down way too much

[rotund token]

1 false positive in 2 years

isn't that bad

(or is at false positive 🧐 )

[viral sonnet]

even if, how would a .dmp file hurt you? 😄

[robust scaffold]

I've never had any false positives with WD. In fact, I dont think it even runs

[viral sonnet]

best of both worlds! but seriously, turning off realtime protection speeds up your system

[rotund token]

not much point in running it at all then 😄

i really don't find any performance issues (at least not since i ditched mechanical drives years ago)

[viral sonnet]

the slowdowns are huge with creating large files

if you don't do that you are mostly good

[rotund token]

hmm let me test

how big is large?

a 3GB didn't even register on a profiler from windows defender

was near instant

i would have thought lots of small files would be more problematic tbh though

[viral sonnet]

you sure you profiled the right exe? yeah, a large amount of small files is also problematic

and watch for hdd reads

[rotund token]

yeah i had 0 hard drive reads

thats the primary thing i was watching

[viral sonnet]

well then it wasn't scanned i'd say. you would see at least some read

[rotund token]

11GB file in 7s 1.5GB/s

well yeah it's obviously not being scanned

so it's not slowing me down 🤔

anyway i know this used to be a problem

we had an old guide in some doc that was like, exclude unity project from windows defender to speed up workflow

i think it was related to building project speeds

made like a huge difference

[viral sonnet]

i turned it off several years ago. maybe it got better. are you running w11?

[rotund token]

no

until they give me my vertical task bar back without 3rd party software

they will not get me on W11

[viral sonnet]

same brother

haha i feel so petty about this but what can i say.

[rotund token]

i lose 223,600-93,600=130,000 pixels with a horizontal task bar

i will have none of it

[viral sonnet]

preach it!

i don't know what they were thinking with this change. i'm annoyed by the lack of a vertical task bar and i don't even have a ultrawide monitor

[rotund token]

Obtained 20 stack frames
0x00007ff64a3b36fe (Unity) DynamicHeapAllocator::Deallocate
0x00007ff64a3b3f72 (Unity) MemoryManager::Deallocate
0x00007ff64a3bc90a (Unity) free_alloc_internal
0x00007ff649c919a1 (Unity) dynamic_array<void * __ptr64 [38],0>::~dynamic_array<void * __ptr64 [38],0>
0x00007ff64a63f73f (Unity) SharedMeshData::~SharedMeshData
0x00007ff64c1f02ca (Unity) Mesh::ReleaseAndAssignMeshData
0x00007ff64c1e79e4 (Unity) Mesh::`vector deleting destructor'```

you know what, that's enough unity for today

too many crashes, i'm doing something else

  at (wrapper managed-to-native) Unity.Collections.LowLevel.Unsafe.UnsafeUtility.MemCpy(void*,void*,long)
  at Unity.Entities.Editor.UnmanagedSharedComponentDataDiffer+UpdateShadowChunksJob.Execute (System.Int32 index) [0x000ff] in I:\Documents\BovineLabs\com.bovinelabs.shattered\Library\PackageCache\com.unity.entities@1.0.0-pre.15\Unity.Entities.Editor\Hierarchy\Model\ChangeTracking\UnmanagedSharedComponentDataDiffer.cs:870 ```

[robust scaffold]

Ahh. Enzi infected your comp!

[viral sonnet]

KornFlaks is laughing while he doesn't realize I've him infected for years

[rotund token]

i've barely been using unity today

whenever i do it's just crash after crash

cbf

[viral sonnet]

are you running f1?

[rotund token]

?

oh yes

[robust scaffold]

He's on 2022.2F1

[viral sonnet]

i think that release is cursed