#tank-balance-discussion

1 messages · Page 180 of 1

west storm
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I think MM should not Up Tier tank Battles until at least T8, what do u all think?

twin egret
#

How can a big tank that can only go 40km be ore mobile than a light tank?

tribal moss
#

Fv201 not Fv301

The Fv201 is basically a heavy version of the Cent 1. Maybe u got the two mixed up lol

toxic raptor
#

cupolas are fine and should be a weak spot, its just most tanks can go through the front plate too easily

unique scaffold
#

smasher speed, pen, armour buff pls :p

teal stratus
full token
toxic raptor
unique scaffold
rich cypress
#

Alright, hear me out, The T95 never could neutral steer

toxic raptor
unique scaffold
unique scaffold
vernal plume
#

I dont agree on something:
All 152mm guns have 960 HE dmg.
Vindi who haves a 155mm gun does only 900dmg. Wich is incorrect. Is it possible to give Vindi 980HE alpha because its gun is 3mm bigger than the 152mm.

I just placed thumbs up so people could like if they agree.

WoT_Blitz_22-02-21_19_58_28.png
nimble zodiac
#

I mean, there are 122mm tanks who do either 400 or 420 damage, little shifts in damage based on caliber is normal

Also if you want thumbs up, don't give one to yourself 😳

I mean, I based this off of IS-3 and IS-4/Obj. 252U

low cliff
#

Technically 120mm guns do 400 and 122mm guns do 420
But then again 150, 152, and 155mm guns all have 640 apart from some special scenarios
oh yeah the chinese heavies get 400 alpha as well for the 112-2
Thank you WG for streamlined damage numbers

winged barn
vernal plume
toxic nymph
#

in general 120-122 is 400 in t6-8, and 420 in t9-10, except when it needs to be increased or decreased due to balance
so yea, it's basically useless

remote oriole
#

We have almost no consistency between the alpha and the caliber. I mean yes, there are vague values that a certain caliber will be around but we just have so many exceptions

lavish eagle
#

Fv301 is so weak for t8 😂also what's up with this 10 min slowmode

sinful leaf
nimble zodiac
#

@vernal plume they're both 122mms 🤦‍♂️

That's the premise of my whole argument

low cliff
#

also im 100% sure 252u and the is3 both have the same gun caliber
@winged barn yeah i realized that, I was thinking of tier 10 tanks where damage values are relatively-ish consistent across calibers apart from batchat, sheridan, and ho-ri

minor minnow
timber linden
orchid grove
#

@minor minnow Actually, 252 uses the BL-11.
It's also a 122, but it does the high tier 122 damage, 420, and not 400

sturdy fractal
#

Fun fact, in real life most tier 8 and 9 Soviet heavy guns couldnt pen any part of a jagdtiger's frontal armour (best this isnt the case in game though)

unique scaffold
#

Tier 8 and 9 Soviets wouldn’t even face a jag tiger since they would all be dead by the time the early models began

quick lichen
unique scaffold
#

reduce the D-25TA of the IS-5 aiming time by like 1 second so you don't have to stop 4 seconds to guarantee your shot doesn't eat the dirt

full token
#

Shoot and hope it can pen

toxic nymph
#

trust in the hand of stalin to guide your shell

unique scaffold
#

the pen isn't an issue, the aim time is the real issue

I mean like 95% of the time, if you stop for like 1 second that's not enough; the shot still flies off into oblivion

not to mention the tank is quite powercrept atm so it would be nice if it had a buff

low cliff
#

soviet tanks have inverse gun performance where the larger the numbers the more accurate it is
for legal reasons this is a joke

full token
#

IS5 is 1.5k gold tank. Instead, make a IS5 AX that fixes the aim time and some other issues and then sell crates and later for like 12k gold. Makes more money

viscid blade
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just got is4...couldnt be more disappointed, people always say this is the best heavy tank, even my fv215b has more armor!!! really needs buff in the front, 260mm is simply not enough! also cant it has such a bad gun, always misses... complete wasted time, used so much free xp and the tier 10 is so bad, wg please buff or im going to sell!

unique scaffold
#

Your nickname says it all

uneven narwhal
#

It all depends on your playstyle TBH
You can't take a tank which does not suit your playstyle and call it bad

low cliff
#

is this sarcastic or serious i can't tell

toxic nymph
#

nah, silent's just trolling.

north jetty
#

like thats ever gona happen

btw i know its a rick roll the website looks sus

full token
#

Lol sure, seems real

toxic nymph
#

you could've at least tried to make the path name more convincing
httpsnawotblitzcomen is totally not just the url for wotb en

crystal halo
#

Bruh, I was about to suicide de-cap, and I aimed my HE against the 100 HP enemy in cap, so what does my teammate do? He pushes me straight into enemy fire, proceeds to block my shot, kills us both and calls me a nub

wooden walrus
#

I know it's fake by looking at the spelling error of "broken" itself.

rough hill
vernal plume
unique scaffold
#

It’s fake stop posting it

azure otter
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html lmao please have better attempts at rickrolling

unique scaffold
#

It was bait

tacit tiger
sturdy fractal
vernal plume
azure otter
unique scaffold
#

@sturdy fractal the fact t49 can still roll for 975 alpha on HE and stomp enemy lights with one shot is dangerous T92 and Sheridan are on another level being faster more accurate and more protected giving them more HE alpha is a terrible idea

sturdy fractal
#

i know, that's the point in these light tanks, the Foch and Ho-Ri also suffer the same issue of relatively underpowered HE. funny thing is their HE damage fits the usual ~1.25 multiplier for HE but most 150mm+ guns have a ~1.5 multiplier
of course don't take away the extra bonus for the big guns but at least the Foch and Ho-Ri deserve a little HE alpha buff, probably along with the Sheridan

unique scaffold
#

They don’t though which ho ri or foch are you even talking about theres two versions of each (Sheridan has been nerfed for a reason)

azure otter
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im assuming its the tier 10s one which already has something to compensate for that which is clip damage for foch 155 and constant module damage for the hori and they both barely lose dpm when switching to prammo

indigo ice
#

What the T32 is still a great tech tree tank, and is NOT abandoned/powercreeped in the Meta. The gun/its penetration is obviously the largest struggle of the tank. But it has the strongest turret at tier 8 and the ability to go hull down effectively with 10 degrees of gun depression. And its cupola becomes incredibly small, making it extremely improbable to hit.
The fact that the American Heavies have gotten the new premium consumables, the enhanced engine boost is a game changer for this tank to get into extremely strong Hull Down positions in a way faster manner.
You can imagine this tank as basically an Emil with a way better turret (298+ AP/APCR Pen needed to reliably pen its mantlet-cheeks), slightly more manageable mobility, but a gun with only better dispersion at .337 vs .371 and AP pen (The T32 has slightly better premium penetration and gun handling than the Emil l).
Its role at tier 8 is basically the Kranvagn's at tier X, ironcially moreso instead of the Emil/Emil 1951.
The only possible buff for this tank that would be somewhat justifiable is a penetration buff.
If you're not performing well in this tank, it is because of poor positioning. Calibrated is a must for this tank so I hope you are running that. A tank with such a great strength can only be crippled so much by its below average gun.

tight ravine
#

Give grille same traverse as skorp and maybe a bit more camo like 5 or 4%

sinful leaf
#

Y give Grille more camo, all it need is better gun dep over front

candid steeple
#

Ah right we are nerfing KV-1S pen so tier VII is even more dominating while KV-1S is even bigger problem for lower tiers. Man Wg balance sucks so hard. Only reason why KV-1S is still relevant is because of that pen and Wg is like lets nerf it. This is a nerf not a buff. It's so obvious like a day and night.

sand field
#

😂

distant river
#

3rd best heavy (16th/46 overall) dpm with 1200 clip in 5 seconds isn't going to be weak 🤷‍♀️

candid steeple
#

T-32 in my opinion needs a slight dpm buff and a good penetration buff. I don't have problem with playing T-32 but I find that tank pretty boring to play with. And honestly there's way more better picks then it. Armor is eh because it's not that easy to go hull down when you are pulled with heavy tank route. Mobility is garbage pretty much. Armor is non existent on sides. And I got hit few times in cupola when being hull down. Tank has more cones then pros. But I got no idea how to buff it except its gun and mobility.

First of all tank should have gold pen of 260mm as Crusler or whatever its called.

Tbh I am surprised that I got 65% with 250 battles on it so my opinion has some value to it I think.

full token
#

2k hp on a tier 8... and consumables...

scarlet fjord
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why do heavy tanks burst 1200 damage in 5/6 seconds
but a tank destroyer Foch 155 which doesnt have a turret burst 1120 damage over 7 seconds

sinful leaf
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They could just undo the AP and HEAT alpha nerf and leave HE as is for Foch 155
Pretty sure it only got nerfed because it could two shot a Grille with HE

scarlet fjord
#

i like that idea
or give it a 5 second interclip
and ye it got nerfed cuz not just grille but rear of pretty much anything it could do like 2k damage in 7 seconds that was pretty broken but if they dont touch the HE alpha it's fine
would love if they make it 640 alpha again tbh

candid steeple
#

Foch 155 is junk in my opinion after it's gun nerf they even nerfed it's single shot gun to become the worst gun in the entire tier. It's like they have some special grudge against that tank. I would gladly drop the autoloader and take a 640 damage single shot gun but they removed ti ofc. Tank is not accurate enough and burst of 1000 damage for being exposed for 7s is so terrible. HE is not worth even trying to use since it is no different from AP damage. They revived Foch 155 with it's OP buff that was still not ruining the game and then nerfed it to the ground. Honestly if you ask me just remove that change all together and give me back my old single shot gun. If they are gona keep the tank being trash then better just remove the change. They obviously don't care about foch line since way too many tanks from that line are straight up trash and Foch 155 can't even be an enjoyable end goal. Tho props to Foch (tier IX) for still being somewhat viable but never played lel.

I don't enjoy playing the tank. Well I wonder why still Foch is so rear to see and when I see it it's most of the tank just an easy bug to erase. No good side armor. Front is always pennable. Tank has to expose it's self completely in order to shoot you because of non existent gun arch. It's hp can't support it being in the open for 7s. And risking for one shot to be rewarded for only 500 damage is bad. Ofc you can play agressive but it has to be planed well or you will just get demolished. At the moment you all got a compliment as 3k dpm and it's fast. Also long range sniping is questionable because Foch has less accuracy then other 560 damage guns and worse then most 640 guns.

scarlet fjord
#

you think Foch 155 is trash? Lol you got problems

#

lets just say u cant handle its armor and mobility correctly lol
tank is not bad WG's balance ideas are just questionable at the best

candid steeple
#

Lmao KV-1S pen is getting reduced to 160mm and Tiger I armor is 160mm. This nerf is so deliberate to make tank trash that its unbelievable. It got it's reload reduced by 3 second in exchange for not being able to pen tier VII heavies. Who came up with this. Man gotta love WG and their balance team. Their just keep being biased towards making tier VII way to dominant tier. Still waiting for that wr and damage chart for tier VII.

ARL 44 still has 212mm pen on it's gun. Hello WG where is nerf for that lmao.

KV-1S will just become even more broken against tier V like this and it's already too strong there. And KV-1S is not a medium tank to flank freely. Dividing from other heavies will most likely result in other heavies not knowing where their heads are because this are randoms at low tier.

scarlet fjord
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sorry to break it to you but the reload buff and aim time buff could potentially make it broken I've had talks with some players and youtubers think this as well i would more than gladly exchange its 175 mm 2nd in class ( imo op pen) to 160 for almost 3 second reload buff and aim time buff i can use my head and its brilliant mobility i dont need to pen Tiger 1 angled perfectly with AP i can work my way around that and 1 tank cant make a ridiculous tank like KV1S trash its OP in 7.7

remote oriole
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I wouldn’t go as far as calling it op but I do think that this change is beneficial for the performance of the KV-1S in general. Not like it has much of a chance against the op tier seven brigade now

candid steeple
#

Tbh when they are buffing KV-1S aiming time they could give T-150 an aiming time buff since tank has longer aiming time with 107mm gun then KV-1S with 122mm gun. Just saying. I know that T-150 is forgotten but it's a fine tank.

indigo ice
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No, I never said it didn't deserve a buff because I full-heartedly agree with a penetration buff as it needs it. On your original you literally said it has nothing good and it is trash. I pointed out its strengths and weaknesses yet you just ignored it because Tank with under 50% overall WR on Blitzstars = Trash. If so I guess the Jagdpanther ll having a 47% overall WR means it's bad and the KV-5 having a 52% WR means it's above average and fairly strong. If you won't even recognize its strengths but only focus on its weakness then you shouldn't be here complaining, it's called #tank-balance-discussion for a reason. Also apparently the tank is so "trash" (it has been statistically the same since release of blitz) that it was used in T8 tourneys a decent amount. (After enhanced engine boost). And if you're undermining its hull-down capabilities then rip the T54E2, because if it kept it's current statistics but lost the majority of its turret armor then it'll still be the same godly tier 8 tank it is right? No it won't be. In the end, your first post did not come across as "it really need a slight buff is what I'm trying to say." Because if that was the case, you wouldn't call the entire tank trash. All I was saying is the tank is not worthless rather than, "Trash" and "Not even strong at all, worst American Heavy to ever exist." (That title goes to the EXP btw)

barren zenith
#

Maus is getting a side turret armour buff too, what’s this gunna be a literal wall now?

tight condor
#

maybe buff the speed a lil bit on the SP I C

candid steeple
#

It's not a side turret buff but a side hull buff so you can't pen that line on the edge. They apparently don't think Maus is OP but yeah buff it while VK 72 for whatever it does it can be penned regardless.

@indigo ice ah also don't forget EXP's little brother M6A2E1. That tank is a butter.

hardy hazel
#

I still think that a tier 8 gun in tier 6 with +200mm pen makes armor innecesary, 420 alpha and less pen is not that big of a deal imo

sullen atlas
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buff the kv2. buff its pen, no you moron it wont be op, buff it back to when it was good. i hate it now, it was one of my favorite tanks and now it sucks

bitter perch
prisma jetty
#

The KV-2 is basically just an E100 in tier 6. It is already kind of fast, has a good side scraping armor profile, and an insane gun.

silent stream
#

Yes

azure otter
#

Just play the 107mm on KV2 to make it good smh my head

scarlet fjord
lone warren
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‘Back to when it was good’, so you mean when it was even easier to one shot tanks with HE right?
It was toxic and should never be brought back to its old state. The penetration nerf and the equipment slot indirect nerf was warranted.

And before you think I’m a KV-2 hater, it also used to be one of my favourite tanks back in the day. As a newer player, I hard spammed that tank so much. So I know what it was like at its strongest point.
@Norbi._.HUN#3918
Ok dont let me tag you I guess.

candid steeple
#

KV-2 was only strong for people who would drive in front of it get oneshoted and then cry about the tank. While when KV-2 fires once and it doesn't kill what it show at, it gets murdered by people who actually don't cry and know that it has 21s reload and fill it up to the top with led. Specially for heavy tanks. It can't pen a heavy tank in it's tier if that heavy tank doesn't want to be penned by it. And as for meds if it shoots once it will be dead before it can fire again. I honestly want it's old HE pen back. Tank has honestly been a dead tank since that nerf.

bitter perch
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It should be. Getting one shot by a kv2 abslutley ruins the game. Fun at the expense of others is not okay.

unique scaffold
#

@sullen atlas translation of your text : “your dumb because my crutch can no longer club in low tiers”

gleaming apexBOT
#

dynoSuccess Norbi._.HUN#3918 has been warned.

sullen atlas
unique scaffold
#

@sullen atlas I've already warned you for insults. Keep it up and you're going in time out.

#

Lol what does that have to do with anything that’s exactly what a clubber would say I’ve been here from 2014 and 2015

sullen atlas
# unique scaffold Lol what does that have to do with anything that’s exactly what a clubber would ...

waaaw guess what, ive been playing for over 6 years now too. and no, this is not what a sealclubber would say, this is what a guy who knows that the kv2 was nerfed to the ground and knows that the smasher should be nerfed would say. Any senseble people would defend their argument when someone starts to say that they suck at life and need to sealclub, and no, m not a sealclubber, i have 10 tier Xs , and i play with those.

unique scaffold
#

The KV-2 is fine now. It deserved the nerf it received. It has always been a skill less RNG slot machine on tracks. The problem was the 3.# equipment changes played to all of it's strengths and it needed to be dialed back.

candid steeple
#

Lets not forget that that nerf was before Smasher got released and after that so many tanks got buffe but KV-2 still remained in it's nerfed state which was to rebalance it in old tier VII and VI. Now everything got it's armor buffed but KV-2 still has that nerf. I think that it's unfair to stay like it given that way too many things got overbuffed.

Now KV-1S is also getting it's pen nerfed. Out of russian big 3 2 are getting nerfed. Only T-150 is still relevant but who still got that tank.

Laughts in KV-1S HE.

unique scaffold
#

Nah, it's fine now. No other tank at tier VI is capable of one shotting tier V's.

#

The KV-2 in it's previous state created a unfun stagnant environment for other players. Now it's able to punish players who make mistakes without being outright broken.

sullen atlas
# unique scaffold The KV-2 is fine now. It deserved the nerf it received. It has always been a ...

happy now? have fun lol, i sure wont cuz people up at WG dont know what balance is. And @candid steeple you are correct. The HE pen should be upped, even with the pen buff it wont pen anything. it cant pen tier 5 either maybe tier 4 but guess what? 2 tiers appart matchmaking was removed 5 years ago, and that was broken. Why cant the smasher or the anni be nerfed? They are broken aswell, oh wait i know why, because people PAYED for them.

unique scaffold
#

If you aren't penning shots with the KV-2 you are doing it wrong.

The tank is fine.

hardy hazel
#

I think that if you want more pen in KV-2 HE then it should get an HE alpha nerf

You got the 107mm gun and that think is more eficient than the 152mm one

candid steeple
#

I mean tbh KV-2 nerf just made KV-2 to use more AP, at least that's how it is for me. Eather way I haven't played that tank in 2 years since I just left tier VI because of the smasher and gravedigger (snow plow). But I am now commenting about KV-2 because I still feel like KV-2 deserves a buff after everything that happened in the game. I mean Smasher is allowed to have 90mm pen or whatnot. 76mm of pen on HE is so bleh. Without calibrated shells that HE pen is completely useless.

If KV-2 gets an alpha nerf that tank is dead for good and I think that everyone understands that. Nothing else about KV-2 is good except the gun. Nerfing it's HE damage is like playing E100 with Maus gun.

There's a lot of people who say buff 183 lmao and it's cringe as hell.

unique scaffold
#

76mm is workable. Run CS and it's even better. The tank is brutal against tier V and is workable in tier VII.

Seriously. It's fine as is right now.

#

People really did forget wargaming took the lazy route at first and made a literal equipment piece that shouldn’t have been removed in the first place just for the kv2

#

This really reminds me of the folks saying the 183 needs a buff.

wooden walrus
#

Definitely I'm against that decision. No need to buff that. Or give a bit shells for it please.

quick lichen
#

laughs at people playing tier 6 for anything other than grinding

#

Look at #devs-answers , unsurprisingly the IS-4 and Maus are 1-2 again. That’s like the 30th time in 3-4 years

river valley
#

Buff AMX AC tank side armor

low cliff
#

@candid steeple So... let me get this straight
One of your gripes with the KV-1S' gun change (reload buff, pen nerf) is that it just makes the tank stronger against tier 5s and weaker against tier 7
And now you're saying the KV-2, a one-shot tank, should get its pen buffed? As if that doesn't destroy tier 5 even more than it already does?

candid steeple
#

KV-2 oneshots the same way and tier V and tier VI meds or lights. Look at tier V heavies and see if there's a single that mach 82-4mm pen or 76mm pen. Ah right the broken KV-1 has the lowest armor and it's the only tank that has a chance to be penned from the front by HE. Tier V heavies got higher thickness of armor then tier VI. I find it a bit ridiculous. And also KV-2 got a pen nerf before all this tier V heavies got their armor overbuffed. What do you want to get straight? Pls enlighten me.

low cliff
#

T1 heavy straight on: The mid-lower plate is 80-ish mm which is the same as calibrated HE pen. Factor in splash and the 680 hp pool of it gets wiped out
BDR straight on: Again, mid-lower plate is 70-ish mm so cali HE is pretty much guaranteed to go through. Even if it doesn't, splash damage.
Buffing the kv-2's pen means yes, it is better against tier 7s, but it also means an incredibly toxic playstyle for tier 5 tanks. I can't see the reason why you think the kv1s's reload buff makes it even more broken against tier 5 tanks yet think adding more scenarios for one-shots doesn't make it broken against tier 5

wooden walrus
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@low cliff to be honest, T1 Heavy's lower plate is not actually easy to use HE at, if the player uses Enhanced armor. I think the bottom plate is more than 85mm.

narrow bison
#

the opinion on buffing the KV2's 152mm is just based on hard felted emotions that happened years ago when it was nerfed and has no logical reason to actually buff a tank so it can one shot tier 5-6s again.

warm crest
#

Because before the KV-2 got nerfed it could be countered by all the Tier 5s and 6s since they weren't nerfed or Thanos'd.

lone warren
#

From my experience spamming the KV-2, the accuracy and reload time wasn’t as much of a hinderance as you think.
It’s tier 6. Everyone just stands in front of you, pushes you one by one, or doesn’t push at all even if you shot.
Not to mention the majority of players I met had no concept of armour, and would just unnecessarily expose their side to me

warm crest
#

People just explained that skill based match making would be awful

dreamy oar
#

Matchmaking is random. What part of random don’t u understand

unique scaffold
#

Sbmm is almost never fun lol

real bison
quaint flume
lone warren
#

Acceptance is the first step to becoming a better player

low cliff
#

Yes

sullen atlas
dense walrus
#

Literacy would also be a good first step

karmic portal
#

I feel like the kv2 is kinda useless with the nerfed he when a tank like the su100y exists. You have a way more reliable gun that for slightly less alpha.

real bison
sullen atlas
#

I never said moron bruh

elfin marlin
unique scaffold
#

I disagree with them.

#

@quaint flume this isn't the MM discussion channel.

real bison
pure tiger
#

Kv2 will be more useless after 7.7, when the kv1s will have a lot of more dpm

safe rapids
#

It won't if WG gives it's HE pen back, as it rightfully should

quaint flume
unique scaffold
nimble zodiac
#

@karmic portal 640 to 460/530 isn’t just “slightly less” alpha,

Yeah but SU-100Y lacks the reliable rolls needed to ONE-SHOT enemies

karmic portal
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@nimble zodiac pen wise it is tho. Say you shoot premium ap on kv2 to deal with other heavys or tier 7s. 545 vs 530 and the su100y still has way better handling and pen and reload.

I’d rather hit most shots without worrying than rely on Rng to hopefully get a one shot. Cause with the nerfed he, that one shot possiblity just got shrunk

toxic nymph
#

make a matchmaking channel and have the bot autodelete every comment on there

candid steeple
#

I fear that if they make that channel bot will burn from overheat by all the people complaining. It think it will make more trouble then good. But unlike there we here like thieves sneak in and post comments here while no one watches before they find out.

nimble zodiac
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Yeah but if we made it automute people who typed certain words and phrases like "fix MM", "unfair", and "WR", then it might just be worth it.

The KV-2 is something not to be ignored in battle, sure, like any tank, but it presents a great threat from any mistakes

dreamy oar
#

Idea for balancing smasher and annihilating, don’t change them just buff every t7 tech tree tank. Power creep them

candid steeple
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And then there a problem with tier VI players so they are not allowed to play. So we buff tier VI but then there's a problem with tier V so we buff tier V and then it goes on and on. That's the worst thing that they can do. It would have been way easier to just nerf those 3-4 premium tanks at tier VII and not overbuff other things. So much easier but here we are with this purely balanced tier that affects tier VI gravely.

dreamy oar
#

But the problem is that WG won’t and may NEVER nerf those premiums.

toxic cove
#

how I like to meet at least 3 TDs in every team every game, so cool playing against these monkeys

sinful leaf
#

183 doesn't need a buff until we start having heavies and mediums with 4k+ and 2.5k+ HP respectively.
Though at that point, there would be much bigger problems than needing to buff 183.

balmy cypress
#

The grille is fun but it kinda needs a Camo buff or a traverse buff
I’d prefer traverse buff as I play it aggressive anyway

noble quail
austere sandal
#

And also it has the function to wipe out some tier 5

mental pasture
#

Honestly, KV-2 has been a bad tank since the HE pen nerf, but I don't mind because it stills broken.

Just to remind you, broken tanks aren't always good, FV215b 183 is an exemple.

Also, if KV-2 wasn't a meme tank, it would be replaced by that T-150 in 5.5 update, because T-150 is actually consistent with it's line (actual decent armor, the cannon is good for frontline and extra close combats, sidescrape god, etc) meanwhile KV-2...

nimble zodiac
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KV-2 is probably there to support the KV-1, KV-2, KV-3, and KV-4 line, other than its popularity

minor minnow
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Yet it’s the oddball out of them all

spice prairie
#

Some unnoticeable tanks are up for game because their hasn't been any buff or nerf

tranquil hornet
#

Buff wz120. At least 5 degrees gun Depression. Sometimes unplayable as you just cannot shoot back.

barren zenith
#

Why does a 107mm gun do 320 damage when a 105mm gun does 350? KV-4 could do with an alpha buff

latent snow
barren zenith
scarlet fjord
candid steeple
#

KV-4 is a glorious tank that no one actually plays. Poor thing tho it doesn't need buffs. If it's a top tier most tier VII can just cry.

VK 100 honestly is only good because of that gun. Tank has way too many weak spots and it can't even face hug tank of similar height because of the turret ring.

And for 350 alpha I got no idea why it's like that but it seems that WG likes mediums to have that alpha while every other heavy follows the standard 310 damage. It's been like this for many years and in PC but they probably will never change that. Btw Leopard 1 standard damage should be 390 even though its 350 because it never rolls under 390. Gun caliber is smaller and aiming time is way shorter but it hits like 122mm gun. I dislike it quite a bit. Like I even saw it roll for 417 damage. Got no idea why it's allowed.

low cliff
#

105mm guns get 310 alpha in tier 8 (apart from the m4 ravioli).
Also bruh if you think a leo 1 never rolls under 390 you clearly haven't seen me hitting shots for <300 damage 4 times in a row
@Harbinger#0072 yeah ik if it comes down to it spamming pramo is always an option lmao

scarlet fjord
#

yeah u can fire pramo but ur so fast that u can just flank
u have 17 seconds to flank sooo

wild mantle
#

Remove the weak spots on the turrent of Vk72K

candid steeple
#

That tank is like weak spot here weak spot there weak spot here weak spot there. I turn this side you can shoot me here. I turn that side you can shoot me there. Tank is a mess. Buffing it's turret cheeks will mean that no one in the game can 1v1 VK so in my opinion making front of the hull only pennable by gold a better idea then turret. Like remove that middle line or buff it to 260-270mm. I don't know if there is a better face hug tank in the game right now so turret is no no.

barren zenith
scarlet fjord
#

WG needs to add the inter clip sound from PC to auto loaders when they touch the sounds of the game

candid steeple
# barren zenith Can’t remove the line for the purpose of keeping some accuracy, it will have to ...

At the moment VK is completely relient of rng not penning him and not you positioning so you show no weak spots. that's my problem with a tank. There is not a single position in which you can place VK that there is not like 3 weak spots that you can shoot at. If they load gold you can do nothing about it. Standard ammo still has way too many weak spots. Honestly Vk needs more hp then Maus (I don't want Maus buff but difference is large between those 2 specially in how effective armor is). Maus with no problems hides its weak points while VK has terrible but absolutely terrible dpm with armor that can't be in open and it's supposedly a super heavy tank. I mean VK needs an armor buff to decrease the ammount of weak points it has. E100, Maus can sidescrape and can turn their turret so they can't be penned. What can Vk do to block shoots? Pray to rng that enemy guns will miss? I don't think that that's a good design.

Yes but E100 needs gold to be penned unlike VG which even meds from half a map away can pen with AP.

barren zenith
#

Vk does not need more hp than the maus, maybe it does need that spot to be buffed but certainly not anything major, seeing as the vk on average performs really well

The e100 still has those weak spots at the edges of the turret ring or is that what they changed?

void mortar
#

You cant get e100 in position you cant pen it with heat. And when sidescraping cheek always come before he can shoot

scarlet fjord
#

E100 is more about being troll and having a strong gun rather than reliable armor tbh

candid steeple
#

And E100 has and more HP and more DPM. And it's armor is reliable when used correctly. Vk is so rng based.

mental pasture
#

It's realiable enough for me, not every tank actually have a 340mm prammo; so if you angle and sidescrape, you are actually in a extremely good situation

Screenshot_20210224-074754.jpg Screenshot_20210224-074805.jpg
scarlet fjord
#

problem is
you need to shoot XD
when you shoot your an ez pen or rather troll to pen

distant river
#

Angle like this, when you want to shoot turn hull and turret, snapshot as you rotate and keep turning inwards until you look like the normal sidescraping position. You are vulnerable for about half a second while you shoot (more if you aim) but because it's such an odd position people are super confused by it and don't have prammo loaded and pre-aimed at your cheeks which means that half a second is plenty to not take any hits. You can play it a more riskily by aiming for longer if you want, but I find that isn't particularly necessary

IMG_20210224_111102.jpg
real bison
scarlet fjord
sudden path
candid steeple
#

400 alpha for tier IX with good dpm is pretty naughty at that tier. I found that tank pretty unique from rest. Tank requiers a completely different play style form the rest and I found it quite interesting. Unlike now WG giving everything the same gun depression all the time. My main problem with the tank is that grind. Just for unlocking all the guns you can get Kranvagen with that xp. It's ridiculous. At most tank needs an cheek buff. WZ-121 also need it's cheeks to be remodeled. they are way too big. Only problem with that line is that they got nor the gun depression nor the turret armor to support them exposing themselves. Also WZ-121 hull upper plate could get remodeled to be steeper.

Gun is only good when you are so close that you can't miss a shot and the moment you move, the aiming circle explodes while Sheridan in full speed with bigger caliber hits you with ease. And if WZ-121 is so good why do I see way more E 50 M, leo 1, T-62A and even see more of STB-1. You can only say that WZ has good dpm with that caliber but that's it.

scarlet fjord
#

wait wait you want to buff one of the best medium tanks in tier 10?
121 has nice hull armor FOR a med its very long and its turret is weak compared to some meds because its gun is ridiculously good and it has nice mobility

fiery flame
unique scaffold
#

Can someone buff the tiger's armour so it lives up to it's legendary rep? It always gets bullied in battles lol
Edit: to counter you, dogofwisdom, I see noobs rushing out and dying instead of bullying others, they just rush out and turn around to show the butt of the tank, which is annoying bc their front has less chances of penning

full token
#

not a historically accurate game since the start

unique scaffold
#

Tiger is a tier 7 bully what

scarlet fjord
#

man the requests of buffing certain tanks here lately are always of some meta tanks lol

mental pasture
#

Tiger 1 is a tier 8 medium, change my mind

real bison
unique scaffold
#

@unique scaffold you know that’s irrelevant and applies to all tanks right that’s like saying buff the maus because you saw someone reverse into the whole enemy team in the open

#

lol, not, just the idiots not knowing how to play and its annoying wghen they either camp, rush or die and you lose.

keen ivy
#

Can we please nerf faith ffs

sand field
#

nerf american meds

charred tendon
#

No, they are not as good as you think
Fix the meds and lights camo and viewing range plus actually make them useful again

sand field
mental pasture
# charred tendon No, they are not as good as you think Fix the meds and lights camo and viewing r...

I honestly think in a different way to make meds/lights better
First of all, a general heavy tank view range nerf should happen, in big most of them (excluding the french ones, they aren't exactly heavies). Heavy tanks should be the shield of the team, not like a main battle tank that can spot, push without problems and hold the line all the time. It'll make meds/lights more relevant because the team WILL need them to spot the enemies.

And then we can think in another things like slight nerfs on camo or view range for certain mediums, to make the lights more important on the meta. Let's be honest, even if lights are supposed to be the spotting guys, there's some mediums that do it even better

An yeah, I believe that light tanks on meta will be healthier for the game than a heavy tank meta

candid steeple
# mental pasture I honestly think in a different way to make meds/lights better First of all, a g...

Ah yes so what you propose is to make heavies blind. Heavies already got a lot worse view range then meds and lights, mind you. Your proposal is just an out right bias view. If heavies should lose view range why can meds then have inpenetratabel turret and gold that can pen heavies with no problems. Why not nerf that so meds get their view range but lose something with that. Your proposal is just outright a junk opinion. I am not betting on my self depending on suicidal medium tanks drivers. WG will never listen to this outright biased opinion. I again say. Heavies surely got an hp buff for no reason.

real bison
#

heavies got a HP buff to let them actually have an impact, as before, MTs with better DPM could just outright replace them

mental pasture
#

So you really do think that it's normal a super heavy like E100, Maus and IS-4 have 250m as base view range? actually 282m view range with double food + improved optics. Well, I think otherwise, Heavies shouldn't get that much view range; why a medium in your team if you can do the spotting with an IS-4? for example. It's not like if all heavies had only 20m less view range than a T-62a

Also, as I said, there's some meds that literately steal light tank's job, Dracula is one example@candid steeple

And then I ask to you who's the one with the actual "outright biased opinion"

vital basalt
sand field
full token
#

if people dont talk about it all day, it doesnt mean theyre unaware

winged barn
#

t28 noises

round latch
#

nerf T28 nerf M48 Patton

bitter perch
#

Bad idea

candid steeple
#

Gotta nerf them all

candid steeple
#

Okay WG you honestly have to fix your armor indicator. This is not the first time. For HE is shows that is pennable and then it doesn't pen? WHY IS IT THEN SAYING THAT ITS PENNABLE???? WHY. It's getting on my nerves. This is not the first time.

toxic nymph
#

+-5% variance

low cliff
#

external modules, +5/-5% rng

hearty steeple
#

^ I don't think there is a clear answer to this problem. If highlights appear at either extremes, there will be cases where either highlighted armour gets penned or part which is gray doesn't pen depending on which extreme end we talk about. This was a bigger issue when pen was +/-25% iirc

eager bolt
#

hello wargaming people if you see this. There are several tanks in need of SERIOUS buffs. One of them is the kv5, please improve both its armor which is easily pennable by 90% of t8s with ap. Also fix the gun, 10 seconds for 320 alpha with below average pen and gun handling, thats a joke. Secondly, buff the chieftan cupola or make it smaller or even remove it , but id say the best option would be to make it the same size as a t32. in tier 7, the vk 45 is a trashcan, there is no reason to play it, it has no armor and its big and slow. Lastly, PLEASE BUFF THE
STA-1 . Either make it fast or give it some sort of armor. im done

barren zenith
candid steeple
#

I just notice. Since when was KV-4 buffed? Last time I played it it had 180 mm armor on turret. Completely uneccecary buff but oh well that's WG. Now instead of requaeing skill to manage turret now it's another dumb tank with buffed armor.

scarlet fjord
#

Things i want WG to change:
#1 remove special consumables from all vehicles except FV4005
#2 fix heavy meta + 374 HEAT spam in fact nerf all op pen from heavy tanks except 50B and T57
#3 buff tanks like T28 Tortoise etc
#4 stop buffing wrong tanks
#5 after you over buff a tank by mistake dont play the shy card and pretend its ok to leave it as is

barren zenith
last shadow
#

In general
Wargaming doesn't like to admit that they f***ed up
See smasher annihilator feedback/ that ATGM incident

scarlet fjord
#

@barren zenith i wasnt talking about standard ammo i was talking about heavy tanks with 340 HEAT pen not the heavy tanks with 300-330 APCR/HEAT
and it wont be buffing super heavies their weak spots are still pennable the 374 HEAT just doubles the weak spot size of pretty much everything
and the reason i want special consumables gone is why does E5 have medium tank acceleration and op reverse speed for 15/20 seconds thats broken needs removing just 1 example
and special consumables is a fun idea for 1 tank dont just spam it on everything trying to buff tanks the lazy way
hey i am faster than you for 20 seconds
Or hey i am stronger than you for 20 seconds cuz u deal less damage now
if u want to give E5 that stupid speed boost at least nerf some aspects about it

river valley
#

Nerf black prince

green marten
scarlet fjord
toxic nymph
#

i'm guessing Robo got caught in the open and it permatracked him
or maybe he's never seen a sidescraping tank before

scarlet fjord
#

WG: We are aware that Smasher and Annihilator are over performing but we wont nerf cuz they are premiums
Also WG: buffs Annihilator ammo capacity
👀

river valley
#

No he was in hulldown and at long distance

unique scaffold
#

You don’t ever engage a bp at range nor it being hulldown...

minor minnow
#

🤦‍♂️

candid steeple
#

Black Prince is junk. Even if he is hull down just shoot that hatch. What? At most you will be punished for 180 damage for just trying. If tank is not in front of you and dpsing you are already in advantage against it. Nerfing it will just mean that it's unplayable at that point tho 240mm turret armor. The f* is WG doing with all this ridiculous buffs.

last shadow
#

They are obviously testing how much bs they can do without killing the game even more

nimble zodiac
#

Anyways, good luck having the accuracy to even hit the BP's hatch, even without gun depression, and if you think you can aim at one spot in 3.1 seconds, and fire, and back up before he trades you multiple times, good luck

Screen_Shot_2021-02-24_at_2.49.11_PM.png
vital basalt
#

Panther m10 can be buffed by giving it all over spaced armour like in pc,so it can be a anti t49,smasher,su152 etc.
its not a bad tank but there is much better tanks like just normal panther or Comet

Capture.JPG
candid steeple
#

It will only be an anti T49. Smasher and SU got AP that will go right trough it.

nimble zodiac
#

He meant HE, but HE barely touches it anyways

Screen_Shot_2021-02-24_at_2.59.48_PM.png
unique scaffold
#

Why do people think the add on armor even does anything it’s literally sheet metal made to look like that

nimble zodiac
#
  1. Irrelevant
  2. The 5k ratings players had and have to deal with it too

Well then do that to farm ;)

#

This channel is not to discuss matchmaking, even in ratings, that's what I meant

It still separates the good players from the bad

Let's dump it in general blitz if we wanna boof on ratings

scarlet fjord
#

although it does give you the idea that players under 50% shouldnt go in ratings
and dont let ppl that dont have at least 500 games in that tier buy a premium or collectable tank idc if it gives u money in the short run

drowsy plaza
nimble zodiac
plucky vigil
#

Can we get an option to opt-out of HighTier/LowTier battles? My Tiger I gets almost always matched with T8 tanks. While I can choose to play against same controls only, map mode and other options, fighting against same Tier tanks is the one I miss the most.

nimble zodiac
plucky vigil
#

Surely do not miss that! 😉 Just shows, that bad tier matching takes out a lot of fun.
More than bad luck... As stated before, my Tiger I and Tiger II are almost always LowTier for me. I just want to fight tanks in my tier. I feel its valid request, since penetration etc. vs. HighTier are really no fun. Using PremiumAmmo is too costly in the long run. I'd rather wait 5 minutes for a game, than having to fight HighTier enemies most of the time, but thanks for your response 😉

tired fjord
#

yeah there should be an option "only match with equal tiers"

autumn zodiac
#

If you like sitting in the queue forever by yourself by all means. We don't need same tier matchmaking

remote oriole
#

That would be like introducing another gamemode (because as it is equal tier battles rarely happen). It’s not entirely obvious how much influence it’ll have on the matchmaker but if it comes to the worst it will be an even 50/50 split which will effectively double the average matchmaking time. It also won’t help if everyone can select even more specialised matchmaking, for example you could then pick the combination of ‘same control mode only’, ‘Supremacy’ and ‘equal tiers only’ which would naturally decrease the pool for all other combinations, having a further negative influence on matchmaking time.

Now I don’t know about you but I don’t want to wait for a minute just to get a three minute game. At one point the relation between the waiting time and playing time is just so disproportional that I wouldn’t even bother trying to find a match. To me, and also to most people for that matter, one of the main cornerstones of matchmaking is time, and the less the better. Giving players more and more options influences said time negatively and should thus be avoided (which is also why I am against permanent fun-modes). If you were to add +/- 0 MM, then you should do it universally, not optionally.

hardy hazel
#

well, sometimes the mm doesnt put you in a match even if there are 20 ppl in queue in each tier +1/0/-1
true👇 i forgot

nimble zodiac
#

Tank types and platoons apply, remember

tired fjord
#

it actually wont doeble the matchmaking time. The matchamker takes it time to create battle lobbies due to not beeing able to create that many games at a time. when there are about 10000 players in the matchmaker, there wont be ppl matchmaked faster than when there are only 1000. Having a same tier matchmaking option would only even affect the players who chose that option, they still could be in games with players who didnt choose that option. Also, there should be changes in matchmaking in platoons. Its ot funny to get matchmaked with annihilators as e.g. alecto orr pz. 4 D

unique scaffold
#

You can’t get into a match with an Anni in Alecto or pz4 though whatever that means...

autumn zodiac
remote oriole
#

The matchmaker usually doesn’t operate at capacity on EU, due to that it’s possible to get into a game straight away. The main restriction is actually lack of players or matchmaker restrictions you yourself chose, such as game mode or platooning. I think that the inversely proportional relation between game modes and players is quite obvious as well

tired fjord
#

im sorry i thought Anni was tier 6 (sorry im new to the game), but still, i often got in games with tier 6 tanks when i was a tier 4 because my platoon member was playing tier 5.

low cliff
#

Tell your platoon member to stop playing tier 5

autumn zodiac
#

Or don't platoon

remote oriole
#

Your comments are making my braincells commit cell division. Stop it or my head will explode. I can only get so smart

unique scaffold
#

That’s called failtooning

whole silo
#

I can't see the t26e4 in a battlefield and no one playing it.

big question: should give a second life similar in pc version?

scarlet fjord
#

when i see ppl asking for buffs on 10/10 tanks like 121 my brain cells commit lifen't

stable pelican
#

I can not connect to the games is it normal ??

nocturne venture
#

i think the 121 needs -10 degrees of gun depression and frontal armor buff to 250 mm to be balanced

candid steeple
#

My only proposal for WZ-121 was to remodel it slightly. I mean progetto which is supposed to be a paper tank has better hull upper plate then WZ which is supposed to have armor. Turret cheeks are way way too big and upper plate can't bounce * unlease you are over angling it but sides are terrible so ... Oh well I am asking too much. I mean cheeks are so good that they are cowering the entire front of the turret without angling much that 220mm armor. WZ-120 is like difference between night and day in how cheeks of those 2 tanks are. You can't face hug because the moment enemy loads gold entire front turret is a pen and because mantel is non existent, you got nothing to eat that shot. WZ-121 is like it has armor but actually not.

tribal moss
#

The 121 is fine, honestly

Mix up the playstyle of a 4202 and a T-54.

No front line but a turret that's on par with other same tier meds with a brilliant gun.

light idol
#

Just out of curiosity, does anyone want a 121B-ish line? It could extend out of the T-34-2's 100mm, then say, the Type 59-II for Tier IX, and then the Type 79 at Tier X? 105mm L7 armed Soviet style tanks, but with meh DPM and accuracy. The 121B playstyle will no longer be a premium exclusive 😊

azure otter
#

Weegee would probably milk it and make it premium

blissful vigil
#

Wg won't as it's a premium :P

scarlet fjord
nimble zodiac
#

Also Progetto has relatively thin plates, but it is just able to abuse game mechanics to get a strong UFP

light idol
nimble zodiac
#

Then again, creating a line to play so similar to 121B would kinda ruin the specialty of 121B, sure it removes a paywall, but it doesn't serve anything new like a 4-shot clip the TVP presents

@mental pasture yes, as I said, game mechanics love Progetto. Just shoot the turret, at least WZ has some armor up there, super hard to HESH ;)

mental pasture
scarlet fjord
#

progetto is troll cuz auto ricochet angles for kinetic rounds its not really about thickness

nimble zodiac
#

Love how some Progetto players use enhanced armor JUST to auto-rico 152mm guns

But then I should test it again to see if the concept holds true

@scarlet fjord I have, but it's hard to say if the effective thickness makes it through, I used 268 on Pz. III's front, ricochet with EA

scarlet fjord
#

but wait they said it increases homogenization not actual thickness
so did WG change it?
has anyone tested 3x caliber rule with enhanced armor?

nimble zodiac
#

Will totally be up to test it ;)

But as far as my tests have shown, EA causes auto-ricos

@candid steeple we're discussing it between the auto-ricochet mechanic, whether it increases armor by sheer base thickness or tacks on extra mm in armor penetrations

candid steeple
#

If thing for hp is giving what is says to give and everyone understands it. Why then in the hell is there still a discussion about if it gives the armor or not. Would WG really say increase to armor but it actually doesn't do it?

I selected and the armor one. Oh well discord sucks.

Why wouldn't it affect third caliber rule if armor thickness increases. I mean that's only logical.

hp_buff.png
distant river
#

I believe it was not meant to affect the three calibre rule but on some tanks it does because WG are very very smart. Posit1ve had some screenshots showing that it did affect autobounce from what I remember but I'm too lazy to find them

light idol
# nimble zodiac Then again, creating a line to play so similar to 121B would kinda ruin the spec...

Hmmm, I don't mind the specialty of the 121B being removed. With all due respect to anyone who has it, it's not like they earned it through skill like in WoTPC, so it doesn't really serve as a special gift or award to most ppl (unless you earned it watching 5 ads a day for like a year, in which case, congrats, I prob do not have the patience for that). Many of the premium tanks I own are copy pastes of tech tree tanks, or a similar one. However, that may be because I buy tanks I like the look of etc, rather than if its op or unique or not. I can see why some would be pissed if a tech tree "121B" came up, but personally I wouldn't mind. It shouldn't be hard for WG to balance either, since they already have a tank to base the stats on.

As for the Progetto 65, its upper plate is very troll, idk how to nerf it though, since as others have said, its the auto-ricochet angle that is the problem, not the thickness. Maybe a mantlet nerf? It blocks shells from time to time

nimble zodiac
#

It doesn't need a nerf, only laziness (and sometimes, RNG) will punish enemies who try to shoot it

@scarlet fjord turret front: 70mm, yes, I know the shell looks like it hit the UFP but I don't trust WG's wonky registration

scarlet fjord
#

@candid steeple stop with the non sense pls read what they said first

@nimble zodiac idk one time idk if this is a glitch or enhanced armor at work but BC has 60mm of thickness
3x of that is 180
obv 183 has 183 mm gun so 3x caliber rule applies but it ricochets me on its upper plate so i GUESS enhanced armor works?

unique scaffold
#

Who would get a tech tree 121B though T62 and 140 already exist

light idol
candid steeple
#

Honestly speaking I bounced so many times on SU-130PM which has max 30 mm armor with 100mm guns so it's WG deliberately making you bounce ridiculous shots or their spagetty coding is terrible. All in all you can't trust their game mechanics. Like how in the 9 circles of the hell do you manage to bounce of SU if game mechanics are supposed to work.

Don't have the clips but they are hits in the front hull which has 30 mm. Btw even if it's a track shot and it goes trough 15mm of side armor will get penned regardless. I managed to bounce for waht I remember with Emil I and Type 59 of SU front armor. Those are all 100m and + calibers.

Actually once I bounced side shot which is actually 15mm. So hell if I know what is going on.

nimble zodiac
#

Oh do show me clips of that :o

I have an itch there could be track shots

What if... two caliber rule doesn't exist? :O

@candid steeple Blitzhangar has false info on that, armor inspector says it's 40mm

distant river
#

It's upper plate is actually 40mm and it's possible to autobounce but it seems like it's another tank with a broken hitskin so it almost always shows that it's HE pennable. I've bounced off it many times in my AT15 from poorly aimed shots but I can't remember ever bouncing off it in a 122

candid steeple
#

I don't see where is that 40 mm armor.

Lazy to mark but it's armor of upper plate.

Tank has no excuses to bounce but it does it regardless.

where_do_you_see_40mm.png
nimble zodiac
#

@candid steeple Blitzhangar has false info

The upper part is green because the turret behind it is pennable, idk what's up with that

So funny enough, no part of the tank is 30mm

@distant river not 50/50?

Ah, ok, yeah

Screen_Shot_2021-02-25_at_4.37.31_AM.png
distant river
#

^^ I'd trust armour inspector more than blitzhangar tbh but that's exactly where I was getting my info from (just without the fancy premium package 😒)

Although armour inspector is wrong on the gun arc of the grille...

No it's on the gun depression, in game it increases a large amount right at the side to be about 8° I think (I estimated it once I'll go find that) but it shows it as 4° in the middle and 5° at the very sides @MS-1#1707

candid steeple
#

It would be nice if WG had their own site showing stats and not us waiting for them to release crate tank again so then that we can see values. Both sits showing different is no different then not knowing which one is correct. It's dumb that WG is not releasing information.

I bounced of the side too tho ...

Btw look at this tier X match. Just saying xD

heavy_meta_dead_xD.png
nimble zodiac
remote oriole
#

#TotallyScientificMethods

image0.png image1.png
scarlet fjord
#

lmao

mental pasture
#

Someone praise this scientist, right now!

distant river
#

#TotallyScientificPeerReview?

unknown-36.png
mental pasture
#

Well, I just expect that none will measure cannon angles based on Panther's UFP angle...

candid steeple
#

Why does TVP has chance to kill a heavy tank with 2 magazines that it fires in 6s each. I mean how is that balanced. Not that it happened to me but I just noticed it. Another newly released medium or light tank that is broken while Kranvagen is slower then E100. Gotta love WG balance team.

As another medium tank do you have any one of counterplay to that tank. Like I side in PC they released it and it was broken here is the same thing. A tank that needs 12s to kill an enemy tank. Enemy has only 12s between all of it's shots to fire back before it's killed. And I say it like this because tank is fast unlike heavy autoloaders so you don't chose when it shoots at you but it.

nimble zodiac
#

FV4005: Yeah woo TVP unbalanced clipping off, nerf it!

In all seriousness WG likes making new lines OP/very good and then nerf it after all the speedrunners get the tier 10

leaden flare
#

@candid steeple
Kranvagn is one of the best heavys out there atm don't know why you think it's too slow

Next up TVP is fast yes has a high DMG clip but bad DPM you need a total of 50+ seconds to kill a heavy not including any possible bounces or heat needed to secure pens also not considering that a good amount of heavys have over 2,5k hp making them 3 clips unless RNG is gentle

barren zenith
candid steeple
#

So far that I saw as playing Kranvagen is that that tank needs a serious movement speed buff. Remove that useless booster and buff it's mobility. Snail rotates faster then that tank. Whenever you aim you are showing your hatches that can be penned with HE (did it many times) and hull has no armor. Dpm is lower then of Emil II. Like how is that tank one of the best. Dispersion is terrible. Average speed is 22 km/h. You won't be moving if you don't use that expensive booster. Aiming time is bad. It can't lift it's gun up. So what is so good about that tank except it's turret with few flaws. Everything else is worst then almost any heavy in the game. You like don't exist for about 30+ seconds before you can shoot again. And if you shoot single shot. Your dpm is probably worse then tier V.

I mean just remove that booster from Kranvagn and you will see how popular it is in tournaments. A tank a completely relays on a consumable. It's so junk balance choice by WG that it's unbelievable. While they release TVP as broken as it could be.

scarlet fjord
#

@barren zenith when the caliber of the gun is 3 times or more the size of the armor thickness a ricochet wont happen

nimble zodiac
#

Which means the shell is guaranteed to attempt a penetration, most like to think it will automatically penetrate but that's not true, though in nearly every case the two caliber rule ensures penetration

remote oriole
#

if the two caliber rule exist. But even if it doesn’t the pen of most shells is sufficiently high to pen anyways. I actually need to test that to find more clues as to whether the two caliber rule exists or doesn’t exist

full token
hearty steeple
#

I have been penned in the hatches of kran exactly zero times in my 88 games. What it does get is HE spammed in the turret front because people can't pen with gold either

Its mobility is a balancing factor. Otherwise you will end up with a 50b with insane turret armour.

candid steeple
#

I didn't get penned in hatches too but I did it to people so. But tank honestly needs that booster removed and it's mobility buffed by a great margin.

You are lacking and dpm and mobility and hull armor. Tank is honestly boring to play. Emil II in my opinion is a better tank tier for tier. Kranvagen is shallow in way too many points that I don't have interest in playing it. Trading everything for lousy turret armor and nothing else is really bad doing by WG. I mean remove that booster and see how many people will use it in tournaments. At least it could have good accuracy but it doesn't even have that.

You shoot HE at hatches ether way so it's a win win. Aim a bit lower the hatches and if it goes up yey and if it hits turret it's still about 300+ damage by 152-155 guns.

mental pasture
nimble zodiac
#

hatch shots = mitigated by skill
lack of gun elevation = mitigated by hulldown playstyle
slowness = mitigated by heavy brawls

dark pike
#

the hatches of the kranvagn are so small i would rather shoot HE instead of relying on rng

remote oriole
drifting depot
#

just why, WHY

they better sell it for like 100 dollars because I don't want this tank ruining my t8 games

dont forget to look at the armor thickness AND angles, it's basically the equivalent to the progetto 65 when it had 76mm of upper plate armor except now it's even worse because of its tier....

and also the gun isn't even bad.... just add consumables provisions and equipment to the thing and it's a laser....

LT-432_watermark.png
nimble zodiac
#

Seems pretty balanced ngl

Rip T-54 ltwt tho

@remote oriole this is lots like the ltwt tho, you seem to be fine with ltwt

scarlet fjord
#

so when 3x caliber rule applies
do you get op normalization from 2x caliber rule as well?

hearty steeple
#

It has the second highest top speed in the game. Compared to ltwt, it has a way better gun and way better mobility

remote oriole
#

In WoT PC, yes. Here, I’m not sure. It’s hard to test these things and be sure

About the LT-432, I don’t like the idea of balancing armour and mobility with a bad gun. That can work, but it can also go horribly wrong and I really don’t want to watch people yolo right through enemy lines and get away with it

The ltwt is slower, has a bigger profile and also worse armour (due to the angles and size). It plays a lot more like a medium than like a light. This tank looks like a tier eight LTTB to me; a fast and armoured light that used to run through the entire enemy team multiple times in its heyday

full token
#

Dont worry theyll release it in crates so itll be too rare to have any significant impact on the balance system. Like the Annihilator that i do not see in most battles

scarlet fjord
#

they say that about every op premium and they keep doing it and doing it and it all adds up
gamble 300$ in crates like M4 54 for tier 8

last shadow
#

What the actual f*** is that mobility and why does it need that much (for a light) armour

remote oriole
#

Wargaming imbalance department: Poisoning the game since 2018

candid steeple
#

Btw for people who still ask about caliber rules and what not there's an PC wot video explaining everything. Just for people who still ask about it to know.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UFktFSJZPsQ

YouTube
World of Tanks North America
World of Tanks PC - Explaining Mechanics - Armor Penetration

How do armor penetration mechanics work?
What is the difference between shell types?
Which shell type should you use, depending on the circumstance?
When do you hear “Critical hit!” without inflicting any damage?
This episode of Explaining Mechanics will answer these and other questions. Don’t miss it!

Twitter: http://twitter.com/worldoftank...

▶ Play video
leaden flare
#

@candid steeple the tank is more then fine how it is
first of all of you even hit the cupola of kran its a huge luck shot
2nd of all they did something wrong by not hiding them
3rd the tank is perfectly fine mobility wise and dpm wise ( the tank even tho its dpm seems low i still have the most dmg per game in it 3,3k )
All i can say is after what you said the tank is fine and its a you problem

And i dont see the broken part about TVP either you have to pen all 4 shots to even have a decent dpm if not youre screwed
its HEable sideways and the rear even for mediums and lights
And normal bounces are very rare unless someone hits mantlet or a horrible angle

last shadow
#

I agree
Please don't buff kranvagen's gun /s
Otherwise I won't be able to singlehandedly kill them with my foch 155

candid steeple
#

I want Kranvagen to get mobility buff. Gun is actually fine if you are not in a brawl but tank is too slow.

full token
#

Speed consumable

distant river
#

It should get a mobility buff (a small one) but the speed consumable needs removing at the same time. Right now the kran is great and doesn't need a huge change so I say just leave it so WG done mess it up

hearty steeple
#

Yes i would rather have them not touch it now than to deal with whatever abomination they might end up with while rebalancing something not broken

drifting depot
#

emil 2 needs the mobility buff aswell, or at least make that turret more reliable. you can literally just pramo spam it and it'll pen

stone gull
low crypt
#

Emil II just need it's pre nerf state, beside the accuracy can be negated by reticule.

minor minnow
#

Tbh I feel like the 10km/h nerf it received during testing should be reversed and the speed boost should be removed at the same time

scarlet fjord
#

omg now kranvagn buff?
guys stop lol

last shadow
#

how about we buff every other tank that is not op to an equally op level so that there are no more op tanks?
Instead of nerfing the op ones? /s

drowsy plaza
#

Just because some players can’t do well in a tank doesn’t mean it needs a buff.

#

I’m not crying for a T-22 or STB buff. I just accept I didn’t play them well this month.

image0.png
scarlet fjord
#

i would say remove the speed boost from the kran and maybe a marginal compensation for it
so basically a nerf on mobility not a buff...

last shadow
#

Nearly 3k wn8 on t22
NOT played well

That's still miles kilometers better than the average potato

candid steeple
#

Asking for buffing STB and T-22 is like saying that IS-4 is not strong.

minor minnow
scarlet fjord
#

WG dont realize it but 15-20 seconds of dumb mobility is just enough for that tank and its armor... relocate once or twice and holding off a whole team

candid steeple
#

Good to know that even gun mantlet that is non existent still gets penetrated. How weak can WZ-121 turret that is supposed to be armor be.

WZ-121_junk_armor.png
low cliff
#

There's no armor behind the gun mantlet so there's a spot that's 320mm thick

iron violet
#

VK 30.02 D needs a buff on its pen like 10 right now it barely pens anything unless you use prem ammo.

unique scaffold
#

Yeah no can we talk about this

image0.png
leaden flare
#

It's not even in testing so obviously it won't stay like that

orchid grove
#

What I'm more upset about is this....

This is a strict upgrade in every way

unknown.png
karmic portal
#

Both those tanks are kinda ridiculous. Hope the get nerfed. Imagine having more dpm and a higher power to weight ratio than a Leo 1, 7 degrees of gun depression, a Soviet turret, and t22 sides.

I don’t get why wargaming introduces tanks for testing like this. They basically just giving tanks to testers to stat pad with.

low cliff
#

testers don't really need statpadding though
Gonna be honest @candid steeple there's really not a huge upgrade between the amx defender and the 13 90

candid steeple
#

Did anyone look at AMX defender? That thing is massive upgrade in comparison to tech tree one that it's ludicrous. that's how WG makes their premium nowdays.

Btw that new premium russian light is hella ugly.

Armor is so that only 152+ calibers can pen with HE. 30 mm more penetration. Better dpm by 100-200. those are massive upgrades. How is that not way better? (those are the ones that I saw on a whim. Wont be surprised if there's more.)

orchid grove
#

@candid steeple Eh, AMX defender is only slightly better at best. Less clip potential, same unload time, roughly same mobility, same accuracy/gun handling

Basically, AMX defender gains pen in exchange for alpha. And also, AMX defender shoots faster than he aims, so at mid-long range, his unload time will be slower than 13 90 if he wants to hit his shells

low cliff
#

mfw i was typing out a paragraph in editing and then clicked off of it and deleted everything i was writing
Basically apart from the penetration the gun and mobility increases are negligible. However, 225 x3 vs 160 x 4 means the 13 90 gets better high rolls and has the opportunity to clip out 650-700 hp targets
The defender has much better armor but blitzhangar shows the weakest part of the 13 90 being the 50mm turret so anything with a gun caliber less than 100mm at tier 8 isn't penning with HE either way

remote oriole
#

I am disappointed that WG seems to insist that new tanks need to be better than average

winged barn
orchid grove
#

@winged barn Forget the aim time, look at that juicy extra 2 degrees of gun elevation

remote oriole
#

To be honest the armour will 'only' be trollish. As it is now it will certainly be very competitive, but I don't think that it has the power to change the meta in tier eight. But I really don't like to see Wargaming pushing the boundaries

full token
#

There’s a lot of tanks for WG to test... This will go well

scarlet fjord
viscid shell
#

Sorry to bother yall ammorack of amx m4 45 of mine was destroyed 5 times today. Two times by Lt and Mt

orchid grove
#

@viscid shell Why aren't you using repair kits to fix your ammo rack then?

drifting depot
#

he just said he gets ammo racked, you don't need your ammo rack to be damaged(yellow) before exploding.....

nimble zodiac
#

I doubt all 5 were insta-racks...

remote oriole
#

Lights and mediums usually don't critically damage ammoracks

coarse harness
#

Could you guys make a T8 tech tree med that's actually useful ?

frail silo
#

Pantera, Panther 2, T-34-2 maybe.
Don't seem very bad at all and kinda are playable.

viscid shell
# nimble zodiac I doubt all 5 were insta-racks...

Not all 5 at least 3 were insta . Rest by anni. Count is increased to 7 obj 252u and gravedigger again ammorack explosion. Vk 36 just after applying repair kit. But one thing here hp is quite low in all cases.

scarlet fjord
#

T-34-2 is great small nimble nice turret and packs a punch

winged barn
#

T44 is also decent

distant river
#

But only when you run the 122 :)

winged barn
candid steeple
#

Tbh most times that I see T-44 in a battle they use that 122 mm gun. Don't know why. I used the normal one and got high wr with it. I don't find T-44 that terrible or unplayble but on a weaker side. Still good tank to drive. My one problem with the tank was that I got oneshoted few times by T49 because of ammorack.

orchid grove
#

T69 is pretty nice

winged barn
#

nice but bad

distant river
# winged barn Imagine some noob reading that and thinking it's a good idea.

And then imagine seeing that noob on the reds and it's easy farming ;)

When I played it I started playing with the 122 as a joke, and then I actually preferred it over the main gun because I just found that one to be boring as hell. Then I found that my stats were somehow good from sheer luck so I ran with it and got to 100 games 😂

winged barn
candid steeple
#

Everyone has their own tastes xd

distant river
scarlet fjord
#

man if you wanna torture yourself run the 122mm on T44 lol

drowsy plaza
#

Why would anyone play the T-44 with the 122mm? Unless it’s some sort of sick meme

#

Honestly WG should remove the option now that the T-34-2 is in game.

#

Like they removed the derp on the M46 Patton

small crane
winged barn
#

#BringBackDerpM46

drowsy plaza
#

T-44 with 122mm is a bad joke

image0.png
#

Bad DPM, bad pen even with prammo and no upside

toxic nymph
#

t44 with 122 is a worse t342; t342 with 100 is a worse t44
*t44 has 7 gd iirc w/ 100mm

drowsy plaza
#

The T-34-2 with 100mm is similar to the T-44 trading a tad mobility for a better turret and better pen.

#

But the T-44 with 122mm legitimately has zero upsides

deft owl
#

Only upside is dispersion when moving, but thats nothing when you have that slow aim time and garbage dpm.

jagged crescent
sweet prism
#

WG doesn't make the on the move dispersion coeffs specific to gun, the 100mm guns in Chinese med line get same values as 122 mms, making them unusable

jagged crescent
#

yep derpier

unknown.png
stone gull
#

is skoda t-25 getting nerf or just rumors ?

barren zenith
#

Its pretty great so I’m not suprised, but then again any 152mm can 1 shot it off the planet

drifting depot
#

I find the skoda to be just an strv 74a2 but with more gun depression less accuracy and more speed so meh I guess it's good

candid steeple
#

I didn't enjoy playing Skoda t-25 so eh I don't care if it gets nerfed. Strv is still better an more enjoyable tank to play in my opinion. Skoda is way too clunky. 1.5s reload but aiming time is nowhere near that and accuracy is terrible. And you don't have armor to be close quarters. Tank is all over the place.

frail silo
#

accuracy isn't terrible
it is also speedy, though it doesn't have armor and is chonky
i think it is better than Strv just for the speed imo.

unique scaffold
#

Can you make an Annilator as the profile picture of this channel?

full token
#

Why do you want such a balanced tank to be the profile picture

dark pike
#

it is the epitome of balance

scarlet fjord
#

i really hope WG start focusing a little more on the audio on the game
like give us crew voices for the EU lines and i would love the intra clip sound from PC

unique scaffold
#

They switched to a new sound engine for this update for that tho for that’s why a bunch of sounds are crusty

candid steeple
#

Mhm game got quite better after this new sounds. They still gotta a lot of job to do but this is better then old sounds. Some gameplay quality at last.

scarlet fjord
#

some are better some are worse so idk dont like it so far to be honest i know they gonna work on it tho so not big problem i am really hoping for the reloading sounds though

low crypt
#

Crusty crust on my pizza crisps

full token
#

No, the tiger has a worse turret

gleaming apexBOT
#

dynoSuccess MS-1#1707 has been warned.

jovial arch
#

please raise the hitpoints of T28 Proto, that tank needs it. Almost like Ferdinand.

real bison
#

E4 isn’t broken lol

jovial arch
#

Well I think they need a bit of care, and E4 isn't OP. A tank that feels like a heavy with 1150 of HP and 20kmh need almost 1400hp, as Ferdinand. That won't make the tank OP.

candid steeple
#

T28 proto is cursed by design. It's the only tank that I played 200 games with but still had only 50% wr. I didn't find it too terrible but honestly I got no idea how to buff it. More hp sounds nice but T28 should get it too. T28 needs a buff more then T28 proto. Played both things.

real bison
#

man do I love showing new T28 Proto players that they can’t rotate their turret a full 360°

dark pike
#

t28 has been shown to be consistently bottom in win rate in the charts, why has it not gotten a buff yet

full token
#

Theyve been too busy trying to find solutions to the complex issue of the Annihilator and Smasher

hardy hazel
winged barn
#

Weegee employees are too busy making new premiums to be able to fix the tanks already in the game.

candid steeple
#

Too busy making new premium tanks and giving boosters to only tournament tanks so they can't balance the game while simultaneously making game worse with each new premium.

Still waiting for special consumables to be removed but oh well. Gotta make heavies in tournaments move like mediums for the purpose of "fast paced action gameplay" selling.

indigo knot
#

Can we remove Mines from tier 8 9 10

leaden flare
#

If the main tournament players have no problems with that it's okay I guess I don't see the big impact on my personal game experience after I adapted to them
Meds are still fast and lights are still faster
Heavys now move quicker for 19sek before being slow for 70s or Smth

People in tournaments adapted to it and seem to be okay with it or else I'd see more #removespecialconsumables or things like that behind Thier names

Also don't remove mines it's still my favourite map:joy:

scarlet fjord
#

Skoda T50 looks overcooked to me tbh

candid steeple
#

Like every other light or med line that's newly released.

But only new heavies are mediocer. VK was never OP Kranvagn is not that strong. But med and light lines every time overbuffed before they have to gut them.

Progetto was OP when released. Sheridan was the source of toxisity. Vickers was OP and still really strong. I see bias here.

New heavy is only allowed to be OP if it's a premium tank but honestly.

scarlet fjord
#

sort of true

drowsy plaza
#

@scarlet fjord it’s a fairly meh tank. It’s totally outclassed by the TVP T 50/51 with the extra shell and shorter interclip. The majority of Skoda T50 players are just decent players at this point and that is skewing a lot of results.

#

@candid steeple the Vickers CR was definitely OP at release - but the Vickers Light wasn’t OP, just strong. Prog was fairly balanced IMHO, the tier 9 less balanced due to the overly high HE pen. Part of the problem with release balancing is testing is done solo - and some tanks become absolutely monsters in toons that they can’t exploit as well solo in pub games.

scarlet fjord
#

I'm not looking at charts am saying based on stats tier 9 auto loaders

drowsy plaza
#

Well it does point to the T54E1 and Bat Chat’s should get proper 105mm alpha.

#

And HE to the T54E1

remote oriole
#

I would prefer to see a massive nerf-wave before I want to see any buffs to any tank

scarlet fjord
#

its too good compared to T54E1 and BC 25 AP
specially with its top speed
Might not be as fast as BC but its close enough and has troll armor

@remote oriole you have a point WG have this buff everything idea going on and they arent nerfing anything its not a good idea
the Smasher and Annihilator didnt help thats for sure

drowsy plaza
#

@remote oriole I think most of us agree - but WG doesn’t want to do that.

candid steeple
drowsy plaza
#

So we get power creep buffs and the occasional questionable nerf

cedar stump
#

The stats show the Tortoise underperforms in damage and winrate. People mostly play the Tortoise to get the Death Star, not because they like the tank (my guess). Therefore, when can we expect a Tortoise buff to make it more popular and fun?

winged barn
#

You mean you don't want to play a straight up worse jagdtiger in every possible way?

drowsy plaza
#

They just buffed the AT 15 - I’m sure some tier 9 TD will get buffed.

jagged crescent
#

would be cool if it happened faster tho

scarlet fjord
#

i think the T44 and the mod 1 need some buffs
specially the T44
mod 1 just needs a little pen on the gold round buff
T44 use to be a great tank now its kinda overwhelmed by the ridiculous amount of premiums flying around slightly powercrept

clever mountain
autumn zodiac
#

They nerfed all the low tier premiums

lilac robin
#

Vk 28 with the first gun barrel upgrade is stupidly weak. With 15 seconds of reload and the sides of opposition tanks being almost impossible to hit its very hard to even survive. I get that it works almost like a shotgun where shooting from behind the enemy and in close distance works best but at times it can't be possible so you're just left trying to flee

autumn zodiac
#

The 10.5 cm gun is a derp, unless you run about 33% of each shell type with Calibrated shells you shouldn't be using it

nimble zodiac
#

Irrelevant, complain elsewhere
Also you almost won, how curious

candid steeple
#

That Tiger 1 there is the tiger player that still thinks that Tiger 1 needs a buff. But yeah I saw a lot of battles like that too but whatever the reason this room is not for that.

Here's some interesting MM from tier X.

bru_hagain.png
karmic portal
#

I hate it when you get one med and they get 2 meds and a light. On some maps that makes it so hard to win,

yeah or maps like port bay

green marten
drowsy plaza
#

But there are a lot of fast heavies too. I will take an IS-7 or WZ-113 across to wreck red meds on Port Bay - or an E5 or Mk6 to Castle if short on the mobility side.

#

The are a lot of tanks that are technical in one class but are closer to another (see E3 Heavy Tank) or the AMX 50 B isn’t really a heavy tank in terms most would think.

#

Frankly I think WG should remove the type ‘matching’ MM aspect - as then each battle would really make their own META depending on tank composition

remote oriole
#

They at least loosened it which I approve of. Did I mention that I am a fan of imbalance because it creates the need for creative and unexpected gameplay? That's different from just the difference in playstyle and adds depth to the game 🙂

orchid grove
#

Adding the balance for classes in battles was the dumbest thing WG did to the matchmaker

Although at this point, with heavies now being ridiculously influential, it's almost a necessity now, which is dumb

If they simply removed the over/under 1 class balance rule, they'd see how ridiculously poorly balanced heavies are

deft owl
#

@cedar stump Tortoise is kept being trash on purpose imho. Wg wants owning a 183 should be as painful as possible. Funny thing is 183 is also trash. So you basically Grind on a trash tank to get a trash tank. Ironic.

In current state Tortoise is literally a downgrade in almost every aspect compared to Jagtiger. It definetely needs a significant buff.

bitter perch
#

it almost doesnt even mater because good heavy players are few and far between.

spice prairie
#

All of the tech tree tanks have very poor fire rate but with premium tanks it is very different. It seem all battle maps are suited for premium.

nimble zodiac
#

Churchill I with stock gun and 2.2s reload time: Sad

twin egret
#

Guys just let the Dev team do what they want, they know best ;)

jagged crescent
#

Annihilator moment

candid steeple
#

Letting the devs do whatever they want is like saying "Let it burn" xD

green whale
#

What's up guys

candid steeple
#

Duno. This room is quite quite without me starting something up where everyone jumps. Oh well.

vital basalt
#

huh still no buffs for tier 8 meds in 7.8 balance changes

scarlet fjord
#

Buff IS-7 dispersion please

Screenshot_1094_LI.jpg
mental pasture
#

A german 150mm gun have the same precision of a 130mm one? Also more gun angles and more DPM?

I see this as a proof of the german bias!

candid steeple
#

VK still crying out there. Worse accuracy, dpm, hp, speed, effective armor and so on compared to E100.

scarlet fjord
#

In all seriousness xd
the IS-7 will be moving a lot quicker meaning the gun will bloom even more compared to E100 making the accuracy worse when you think about it despite the marginal difference in dispersion factors in certain scenarios at least

dark pike
#

what do you guys think about the addition of spall liner and reticle calibration to the grille line in 7.8

unique scaffold
#

Not needed ._.

mental pasture
full token
#

Ehhh, will be fun with the WT now. A tank with a turret, good turn speeds, good gun, that can now be more accurate and even make HE pointless...

gleaming apexBOT
#

dynoSuccess [BUMM / BUUMM] Lottrino#7656 has been warned.

pseudo hedge
drowsy plaza
#

@scarlet fjord most E 100 will run CS - so the IS-7 has more DPM and generally the IS-7 will close with red meds while the E 100 needs some distance - so the dispersion on that IS-7 won’t be as significant

remote oriole
#

Grille doesn't need and shouldn't get camouflage. Dedicated camping tanks are no good for the game and will only make the game more frustrating and more superficial for everyone. I am very happy to see that Wargaming stays true to the playstyle they envisioned for the Grille and give players further supplement to have an easier time playing said supportive, second line or flanking playstyle.

I am still against the idea of op consumables and provisions, but I am at least glad to see that Wargaming doesn't just go for the straight forward (and quite frankly worse) solution of making the Grille a sniper tank, but try to allow more players to use it in a different and more engaging role.

Extra playstyles are no use if they only destroy other playstyles and if they decrease the fun of the game as a whole.

scarlet fjord
drowsy plaza
#

No need to run CS on an IS-7. It’s not primarily fighting heavies. Plus you can use mobility to pen sides of super heavies late game if you need too

#

It’s fine

#

Any buffs and it’s too effective a med destroyer

#

I’m not the greatest player and I can figure that out and how to employ it well in this meta

#

I’d rather see an IS-4 and E5 nerf

#

Because those two tanks are overcooked

#

And E3 nerf

real bison
#

E3 was fine until they gave it speed

yes, let a frontal armour bunker travel at the same speed as an IS-4

drowsy plaza
#

Yes

#

The super consumables have been a bad idea since day 1

full token
#

Why did the WT have to also get the consumables? It’s not a terrible tank

Could just give it to the tanks that need it more... The WT will be even more annoying now. A turret, camo, already decent gun which now becomes even more accurate, and now you can’t even HE spam at one when it’s spotted

drowsy plaza
#

@full token the same reason the T25 AT got them. They blanket add them to the lines at certain tiers

#

Which throws balance out the window.

scarlet fjord
#

its mobility isnt about circling heavies its only fast when you get it rolling and bowling u can get to a flank of heavies yes but u can do that in many heavies but they dont need to waste time they just dab the HEAT round and pen you everywhere (not asking for pen buff) accuracy buff so when you fight meds (small nimble tanks that snap shot you) you can actually pen back or shooting weak spots of heavy tanks IS-4 has better accuracy and 340 HEAT i 100% am about buffing dispersion

if they nerf heavies i wont mind IS-7 but they buffed everything specially the E5 and IS-4 buffs really made me mad tbh they are so imba and they dont wanna nerf them and btw just cuz i can do that too doesnt change my mind about IS-7 needing accuracy buff

Screenshot_969.png
drowsy plaza
#

Honestly as @remote oriole pointed out the best start to balance is removing all the super consumables.

#

Then actually balancing tanks

#

I mean the Maus is skewed on Ru due to lower gold spam - but NA and EU show the IS-4 is vastly over performing too.

image0.png
remote oriole
#

Unrelated opinion, but recapping the heavy hp buff, it wasn't as bad as I expected. It did create a heavy meta, but in particular due to the matchmaking (and its focus on balancing classes) most other classes took a lot less damage in popularity and effectiveness than I expected.

In fact, I enjoyed playing mediums, lights and tds more after the heavy hp buff. It's a curious thing that made me rethink how I perceive imbalance. This is obviously a personal experience, but I found that the game makes me think creatively about how I can over come the odds; it presented me with a new challenge that broke the boredom by repetition that fell over the game (again, personal impressions and experience).

While it is still true that it did no good to the balance of the game, and that it created a blatant heavy meta, I must admit that I was judging it too harshly and tat I didn't see the upsides in creating imbalance. Maybe fair fights are not only tactically unwise, but also not entertaining

unique scaffold
#

There is truth into that but let’s be honest it’s soul crushing to be the last one standing after a hard fought battle in say tier 8 and there’s 3 full health heavies left

mental pasture
twilit crystal
#

@drowsy plaza reticle calibration seems fine imo. The speed boost and sandbag not so much

scarlet fjord
#

i mentioned that a while back they need to remove the op consumables except for 4005 maybe
but WG dont wanna do that cuz its wasted effort i really hate the lazy way of balancing tanks like that
the IS-7's problem when i drive it is it misses these shots that you need so much sometimes and on average you waste like 2-3 shells sometimes because you have E100's gun handling

dusky cedar
#

Jesus give retical calibration to is7 not grille

mental pasture
#

Jesus, don't give it to any of them!

Actual buffs will be always better than op consumables

@HeroWonds#1261 Maus isn't op, it's just the german technical superiority doing it's job :wink:

full token
#

RIP spamming HE at the grille line 😦

candid steeple
#

Btw Maus is spammed right now and it's so farr above any tank at it's tier. IS-4 is much more rare now to see then Maus or most heavies. I am still behind it that Maus is broken. A big brick that doesn't have to do anything and still does a lot. For IS-4 you load gold and upper hull plate is cheez. People still defend Maus but take IS-4 as broken reference. Yeah sure.

scarlet fjord
#

Maus is not broken... you can counter it with most tanks in your team its perfect at its job but it isnt broken

nimble zodiac
#

Many argue the HP crutch is the problem

outer glen
#

183 Branch need speed booster especially AT series and can just buff conqu tier 9 heavy turret like 10mm more or 20mm bcuz tier8 lt and meds can ezly pen it with regular shells

wind bough
#

retical calli? for Grille? instead of buffing the camo, giving it retical camo? srsly? retical calli is useless since its already so accurate

nimble zodiac
#

Nah gotta get dem shots on the mooove brooo

mental pasture
scarlet fjord
#

i would not run reticle cali on grille even if it had it a waste of your slot your gun hits everything anyway

zenith solar
#

The Annihilator nerf is the most immediate one to be had. Only then tier 7 can be playable and relevant again. (Also tier 6 when bottom tier).

wind bough
stone gull
#

what is point of having armor like 268 ?? Everyone can pen easily 268 and its not that accurate. 268's armor ability is not getting HE shells. Now grille will be OP because its fast, accurate, very well hiding tank and the spall liner will be broken. Imagine 1v1 with grille as a med tank you cant he him because you will deal same damage+you can hit the track and deal low damage.

image0.png
gleaming apexBOT
#

dynoSuccess Vildanijum_104#4735 has been warned.

static swift
#

hello

latent snow
#

The amx defender is garbage

unique scaffold
#

Every single arrow pointed a RU defender would happen, but nooooo wg wanted to be special and make the amx have one more shell, and slightly faster, you could give it a 2.75 interclip I wouldn't care, where is out german defender tank wg?

lunar niche
#

WG and their laziness to actually buff a tank/line shows up yet again.

Slap the same new super consumables and call it a buff lol.

nocturne mauve
#

They’ve already ruined it with heavy bias

candid steeple
#

Heavy bias? More like medium and light bias so they had to buff heavies.

unique scaffold
#

Why give the entire grille line reticle? Did these tier seven players responsible to hitskins becoming less reliable and making all these ridiculous claims that do not even make sense give any good advice? Is the T28 and T95 underperforming? Well give the entire line reticle and speed boost and make the T25 AT and E3 overperform. Now back to the Grille line. The only tank in the line that makes sense giving these cracked consumables is the St. Emil. The Grille sure may need a buff but buff something else at least. The RHM and WT are fine where they are and they do not be touched by balance changes. The next time you hear someone cry about the E100, Maus, or Sheridan, make sure their average tier is not seven.

distant river
#

Yez maus totally fine no heavy bias at all 👌

7.6_-_t10.png
unique scaffold
#

For the record they nerfed medium pen and from then on things were alright @candid steeple

candid steeple
#

Yet every med has 240mm or more of Ap pen. And that you call little?

karmic portal
#

Yes when every other tank has more lol. You just threw a number out with no comparison

candid steeple
#

Heavies got nigher pen because they are shooting at other heavies from the front because they can't esealy flank as meds. But meds don't shoot at that much armor when fighting against other meds so why have high pen? What? You want to esealy pen heavies from the front? Is that balanced? You med players are not looking at the game and complaining. I am heavy tank player but my meds got higher wr then heavies. Says something about the class which is weaker and more impactful.

leaden flare
#

I get the feeling you don't even play this game ?

Usually the meta on most maps is all go one general direction means meds shoot heavys frontally as well so they need the pen at least I do that beeing a 65% superuni on most tanks so I guess I at least know somehow how to play my tanks

Heavys are by far the most impactful of all tanks combining a god load of hp with decent to really good Dpm

thin ermine
winged barn
#

...

You personally doing better in one type than the other means very little, when overall stats literally show the exact opposite.

Sure, I can compare a vk45a to a chimera and say "heavies trash"
But I can also compare a shark to a pershing.

Heavies, which generally have enough mobility to not hold them back, hp pools that laugh in the face of alpha and dpm, hard hitting guns, on top of better armor.

If a heavy is wasting time in a heavy slugfest, sure they are less effective. But when you tank a heavy and just roll over the med flank, there is a huge impact.

low cliff
#

Wait until he finds out pre-change meds had 250+ mm pen on standard rounds and tanks like the leo 1 and e50m having 268mm and 270mm pen

drowsy plaza
#

And 330 HEAT

unique scaffold
#

Also before armor and penetration chance buffs aswell

drowsy plaza
#

The fact is since 3.8 equipment heavies got the most out of it. Then the prammo nerf in 3.9

#

The loss of the 10% rammer hurt the mediums more than heavies

candid steeple
#

It's actually cringe that people think that meds should have higher pen then heavies while they are fighting less armor. I mean this is already hint of med bias in this chat room. I got problems with heavy buffs but this is just pure med bias that I see in this chat room right now.

Just before hp buffs it was speed is everything mets. I don't know in what appartment of speed heavies belong to. Yet again I got a question to why did they buff all heavies at tier X. Till you don't unsware me that stop crying because it's apparently to hard to not look over that fact.

drowsy plaza
#

Med bias? This isn’t 2014 anymore

#

Heavies got buffed way beyond proportion.

#

Ever since 2.7 meds in 8+ have been taking hits. Now some of the early med nerfs where needed. But it’s gotten a little silly.

scarlet fjord
#

Grille line actually getting reticle calibration loool

drowsy plaza
#

Most heavies have too much view range and mobility - combined with their HP means they can do a lot more medium roles than meds can heavies.

#

IS-4 can literally yolo a medium and win - and not all mediums can extract from it easily

low cliff
#

Gonna be honest not a single person here has advocated for increased pen on meds, it's just you who's rambling on about penetration and an apparent med bias

Hot take but if your meds have a higher winrate than heavies that might be a personal problem.

drowsy plaza
#

Hmm. Seems balanced.

image0.png
#

6 heavies over the line, 1 med, 1 TD

nimble zodiac
#

Ah yes, VK 72.01 K

U rite, funny lookin E100

drowsy plaza
#

It’s a fantastic TD 😉

unique scaffold
#

Which you haven’t even said anything to support your argument I’ll ive been seeing is “waah I can’t deal with meds their penetration is too high for my heavies waah” if you think 250mm of pen is too high 270mm must be a privilege and it really is... now if you want to list the tank you’ve been using this whole time please do

twilit crystal
#

Also @drowsy plaza don't forget class balancing. Imagine totally random mm

drowsy plaza
#

Yup. @twilit crystal brings a good point. The only reason heavies are partially balanced here is there are generally 3-4 on each team.

leaden flare
#

Yeah especially considering a t7 heavy toon against a t7 med toon and two t6 heavys is the most imbalanced things in Blitz that counts for every tier

nocturne mauve
#

At least limit the heavies so that you have the same tier heavies in each team

unique scaffold
#

Also tier 8 is also a good example of how over-blown heavy buffs are most of the time if you play a light your gonna end up facing 3-4 heavies and if your pour your whole will into the match chances are theirs always bound to be 2 heavies with full hp left standing

drowsy plaza
#

Tier 8 meds (non premium) have always had the shaft. It’s just gotten worse over the years.

lilac robin
#

Tbh as much as I'd like to participate im still on tier 7 so see you soon lol

unique scaffold
#

I won’t be surprised if he goes silent never answering what heavy he was driving lol

candid steeple
#

People tend to forget my complaining of overbuffing heavies for no reason at tier VII and VIII specially in armor department. But oh well. Easy to use as argument out of blue. I specially love people who defended Tiger II buffs but now it's used as argument. Goog good.

candid steeple
#

Btw TVP 1350 damage one clip. BTW BTW 1350 damage a clip. I call it well balance med on release as always by WG standards. While keeping Kranvagen as boring as hell to play.

Call it high rolls one after the another. Pretty balanced in my opinion. I am not mistaken for seeing what is popping on my screen so you can argue as much as you want.

low cliff
#

Mind telling me what crackhead math gets 310*4= 1350?
I'm not even going to bring up the cons of the tvp because you seem hellbent on thinking that new medium lines are somehow op while heavy tanks aren't
Well if you're going off high rolls you can get 1500 burst on a kranvagn and 1725 burst on a 4005.
Hell, you can get 2064 burst on a 4005 HE max roll in 4 seconds with the intraclip reload.

toxic nymph
#

what's this guy on?

candid steeple
#

Yes Kranvagen a heavy tank with dpm of tier V tank. FV is a TD and I got one clipped like that two times but when can that tank do that when it's as big as a house.

This thing does 1300+ damage in 6s khmm khmm.

I don't think that Kranvagen is weak but it's boring to play. You wait for 30+ seconds before you can be a tank again. It's not fun gameplaye to me. And it's hella slow. That's probably my biggest problem with a tank.

remote oriole
#

Why does everyone say that the Kranvagn is weak? Every time I hear that I die a bit more inside

nimble zodiac
#

Which generation of egirl is this?

Anyways, Kranvagn only needs to wait 12 seconds, or if you're considering aftershot, 15.5 seconds to be a tank again

Remember that it's an autoreloader, which serves very well mechanically in battle

Also it's 1240 burst on average, nice job assuming it'll be high rolls constantly

minor minnow
#

Personally, I love my Kranvagn more than I like my E5 or such, just because of its turret and versatility. This may be a stretch but I enjoy it a lot

low cliff
#

Your "khmm khmm" is seriously driving me insane because yes let's just ignore

  1. 1300+ damage when the average burst is 1240. That's like saying the T49 is OP because I got ammoracked.
    oh wait
  2. We're just gonna not talk about how the TVP isn't exactly a small tank?
  3. Just ignore the 22 second magazine reload
  4. Just ignore its armor profile (spoilers, there is no armor)
latent snow
#

I just lost a battle in my AMX Defender because I ran out of shells....

winged barn
candid steeple
#

Also you can't HE it from the front like Leopard 1 or BC.

It's called Leo 1 lower plate my dud.

low cliff
#

Leo's got 130mm of unangled frontal armor, TVP has 160mm of unangled frontal armor. You can't HE a leo either

winged barn
#

Oh, but you can HESH them all day

outer glen
distant river
orchid grove
#

@distant river Well, with the Maus, you rarely have other options

unknown.png
winged barn
#

Anyone else ever taken a maus to the med side and just rolled forward? It's kinda funny to carry a team just by driving

drowsy plaza
#

@winged barn yes, but often my team tries to go town once I arrive and I end up like a beached whale

#

I have decided to park mine for a few months

#

My 90 is about as tragic. But I have more spots if that says anything.

nimble zodiac
#

Relatable.

Screen_Shot_2021-02-27_at_5.22.21_PM.png
karmic portal
#

I feel like the spall liner to grille is kinda a nerf cause no more people shooting he and hitting gun

nimble zodiac
#

Nah

thin ermine
drifting depot
#

to nearly any super heavy for that matter

thin ermine
#

true...

ancient sluice
#

will there be any alteration to the Annihilator or Smasher?

full token
#

Why alter two tanks that dont have any effect on the balance system and are too rare to bother about

lavish plume
#

How can report someone who give hi self to an opponent to be high on the board ?

sinful leaf
fiery flame
ancient sluice
jagged crescent
#

I would like to see an increased pen on the medium standard shells

nimble zodiac
#

Maybe in tier 8, but geez don't do it to the tier 10s

crisp whale
#

Mediums are fine IMO. Armour, especially on the heavies, needs to be relevant.

jagged crescent
#

You must be really special if you think I'm suggesting something massive like 20mm+ or whatever.
Just enough pen so that the meds can just aim at weakspots instead of just having to load the gold.
The heavies will be fine considering how meta heavies are in every tier since they all got 200-500+ hp buffs

wind bough
#

4005 183mm when?

nimble zodiac
#

When 183mm guns are balanced

Never.

unique scaffold
#

i do not get the guys that want the 183 to get buffed. That nerf was well deserved and the balanced window is small and it is better for derp guns to underperform

full token
#

Give 183 reticle calibration lul

turbid smelt
wooden walrus
wind bough
#

that can bring new meta in tours
only reason literally

low cliff
#

Unless wg adds in an E-100 mounted with a 183mm gun 183 caliber guns aren't going to be meta in tourneys
Speaking of which E-183 when
(yes I am aware the 100 stands for weight class and not gun caliber)

karmic portal
#

Can it be autoloader? E100 183 defender?

iron violet
#

We should hold a vote or petition to remove the annihilator from game

azure otter
iron violet
toxic nymph
#

at very least, i'm going to want my $10 back

azure otter
iron violet
#

@azure otter ok so 3250 gold, thats 10 bucks in gold

drifting depot
#

what about letting you pick 1 from a roster of idk, 3? tier 7 premium tanks

outer glen
#

Buff tortoise frontal armor and give the branch speed booster and also badger

distant river
# orchid grove <@!465228183613210635> Well, with the Maus, you rarely have other options

You have the option to shoot other tanks, the only reason I win so much in my maus is because I park myself right in front of the reds and demand their attention and they happily give it to me. When that happens it doesn't matter if they shoot prammo or not, they will be stuck for minutes focusing on a tank that just won't die, when they should just ignore me and massacre me at the end. The stats aren't high because of lack of prammo they are high because people focus it, and because it has enough hp and armour to survive in that focus.

@thin ermine still worse than doing something useful and shooting a target who has mobility/a half decent gun and 1k less hp. And that's not the fault of prammo/no prammo, if anything I'd imagine being reluctant to shoot prammo would encourage you to shoot other targets who aren't red...

hardy hazel
candid steeple
#

Out of entire turret being a butter when you load gold. At least make it so that it's non existent mantlet can't been penned.

Screenshot_3.png
real bison
#

if they have to load gold to pen your turret, you’re doing something right

candid steeple
#

It was a snapshot but yet again this is not about that but about turret armor that exists but actually doesn't.

winged barn
#

If they load gold, they are hitting you for half of your alpha. That's a clear win. Just trade shots 1 for 1. It's a tank that hits like a heavy, has quality dpm, and decent mobility. Let's give it heavy armor too, great idea.

Screenshot_20210228-064013_Armor_Inspector.jpg
candid steeple
#

I asked for mantlet buff and you say Heavy armor. Duh people here. I mean STB-1 used to be paper tank but now it has mantlet which cowers half of the turret and more that nothing can pen while it having 10 degree of gun depression. I just ask for non existent mantlet to actually at least stop shots there but apparently that's too much but other meds that they overbuff turret armor to be like heavy is balanced. Yeah right. They can give T-62 A and 3 more gun depression and buff mantlet even more but people don't complain about that. Now I ask one small thing to be stronger and it's like requesting for med to have heavy armor. Gotta love people here.

With how rng is in this game those 2 small cheek weakspots are pretty hard to hit and you are more likely to hit other red parts and bounce clean of.

E 50 M got buffed to have armor of E100 on it's turret too btw and turret is a lot smaller. We won't call this buffs as heavy tank buffs but WZ-121 small mantlet buff will make it as it is a heavy buff.

full token
#

STB doesnt actually have the turret armor to sit hulldown and bounce. It has weakspots and also red spots, which just means that itll bounce if the enemy has little time to aim, but sometimes they get lucky and do the damage

sudden path
candid steeple
sharp saddle
#

STB-1 turret only works when you keep it moving.
Otherwise anyone who knows how to aim will hit you

leaden flare
#

@candid steeple hmm only my russian style meds don't have 260mm+ pen on Thier standard rounds all other have the 260mm pen
268mm for FV 4202 and Leo
263mm for M60,m48 and my 30b probably also STB
And below that are the Russian style meds, TVP, e50m and prog 65

scarlet fjord
#

Nice WG buffing 113 armor profile slightly but no IS-7 accuracy buff

latent snow
scarlet fjord
#

its making me angry because 113 was more than fine

nimble zodiac
#

At least they fixed up the 0mm plates on the turret

Rip spammy gun on Churchill I, never gonna hit the weakspots it needs to xD

orchid grove
#

I mean, I like the 113, and I’ll take a buff to one of my favorite tanks, but even by WG’s own charts, 113 is the single highest DPB tank in the game

nimble zodiac
#

The lower plate buff serves no real benefit, or maybe just anti-HE from the brits in very specific situations, the 0mm plate fix would mean something if people ever shot HE at the turret, intending to land it on those 0mm plates. The real buff here is the side armor no longer crumbles once it falls below auto-bounce, surviving a solid 3-5 degrees more against heavies

scarlet fjord
#

not like this is relevant but they made it from 0 to 120 mm thick while 40mm being its surrounding that was so lazy i swear to god lol

nimble zodiac
#

Eh, at least non-183 HESH HE can't touch it

barren zenith
scarlet fjord
#

ammo rack is fine just run some protection and dont yolo at 183's angled lol

wind bough
minor minnow
#

^^^

nimble zodiac
#

Mistakes = ammo rack

Battle hardened talks about the players, forged to avoid their ammo racks

barren zenith
scarlet fjord
#

needs accuracy buff WG's buff everything is catching up to it specially since they nerfed it in the past

minor minnow
#

It should have better gun handling than the IS-4 imho, to make up for the poor penetration

round latch
clever mountain
#

Conquerer and Caernarvon need some turret and HP buffs imo.
The Co w gets taken to shreds by any tank with decent pen can go right through its large cheeks.

nimble zodiac
#

Well it’s supposed to play a power gun on a weak tank style, sure it’s slow but that g u n n n

And heavy HP

For Caernarvon though it definitely needs more DPM

winged barn
#

I love comparing the caernavon and cent 1 turrets to the AX, 5/1, and def mk1

jagged crescent
uneven narwhal
#

Why do people see a IS-7 ammorack compilation and then decide that the IS-7 is a bad tank and you are gonna get ammmoracked eveytime?
I'm not saying that the IS-7 suddenly becomes a meta tank if you don't consider the ammorack, but it is still a great tank if played correctly

full token
jagged crescent
twin egret
hardy hazel
jagged crescent
#

Lower plate will still be weak. Sides will still be pennable when not sharply angled.

wooden walrus
turbid shard
#

Whoa berholdt is still alive amazing

outer glen
#

Bruh the tank they really need to buff the freaking tortoise

rough hill
#

t28 : stare of pain

scarlet fjord
turbid shard
#

Can someone play with me?

unique scaffold
glass pagoda
#

idk if anyone else feels this way but i personally feel the grille needs a camo buff

rough hill
#

its big as a barn, imagine that thing having good camo, it does need one but it isnt reasonable for something so big to have such camoflauge

hardy hazel
#

Isnt that the despective "B-word" that you use to say "Son of a B-word" but in spanish 🧐 ?

rough hill
#

take a screenshot and call the mods so he cant get away with it by deleting it

hardy hazel
#

<@&481447501690568709> there is a bad word in spanish

real bison
#

lol

gleaming apexBOT
#

dynoSuccess Tresspaser436#8183 was muted

worthy basin
#

imagine using the wrong prefix

round latch
#

Why wargaming giving WT consumables it was already balanced, good and my fav. tank in the game but Grille and Rhm needed it

rough hill
#

nashorn : am i a joke to you

frail silo
wind bough
scarlet fjord
# wind bough not everything is a damage dealer regarding the accuracy i have simple thing for...

just cuz its not a damage dealer doesnt mean you should give it 303 APCR rounds and the accuracy of a 15 cm german heavy gun with less alpha and DPM
it at least needs to hit its targets
its lowest performing heavy tank DPB wise anyway
but IS-4 is ok to have 340 HEAT and better accuracy better armor arguably similar mobility broken turret etc

@nimble zodiac i dont mind the 303 APCR either i can cope with it thats why i was asking for the accuracy buff not gold pen buff i was just stating how bad the gun was in every aspect on firepower except maybe alpha compared to other heavies by a tad bit

nimble zodiac
#

I still find 303mm APCR workable 😳

Know what would be pretty fun? 500 alpha 😂

round latch
scarlet fjord
#

i actually wouldn't mind it getting 490 alpha instead of accuracy buff at least the accuracy would be justifiable at that point even tho the M4 54 has 480 alpha and IS-4 accuracy but thats a CoLlEcTaBlE
@nimble zodiac would at least be an even more fun playstyle

zinc fossil
#

Nerfing the M6 ahead of the Magnus release is really awful move, and clearly done just to make the Magnus better in comparison

wind bough
nimble zodiac
#

@zinc fossil M6 planned to get nerfed in 7.8, after the Magnus release

hardy hazel
scarlet fjord
# wind bough why don't u talk about its mobility? also german 15cm gun is accurate enough ins...

your fast? so sacrifice your gun for it? 113 is fast? E5 is fast with special consumable etc but 113 has like 3400 DPM way more accuracy if you learn to put yourself in places where traverse speed wont affect you much its so much faster it sacrifices armor for it but IS-7 sacrifices its entire gun for armor and mobility the sacrifice is too big for what it gets IS-4 can do that job but better in every way almost
and as i mentioned we were talking about its inferior firepower not that i should run calibrated shells to fix 303 APCR or "change my playstyle" i think 3800 WN8 in it doesnt need changing playstyle the tank itself needs a firepower boost you can look at the graphs its under performing in that area

winged barn
#

It's not that the is7 needs buffs. All the other heavies need nerfs

wind bough
# scarlet fjord your fast? so sacrifice your gun for it? 113 is fast? E5 is fast with special co...

u said yourself aswell
its dropping some accuracy and pen for armor
this is a game
if it had a better gun it would completely make other tanks such as is4 and 113 irrelevant
and yes
113 and is7 has same mobility but is7 is way more armored even on side turret and side skirts which 113 doesn't have , on the other hand 113 has rate of fire and gun handling
thats why im saying it doesn't need buff

u have to give up on a thing and gain something esle, u cannot have everything at once
+
u have higher alpha compare to other similar tanks

zinc fossil
#

They've planned to nerf the M6 ahead of the Magnus release then, doesn't mean the intent and reasoning isn't obvious

scarlet fjord
# wind bough u said yourself aswell its dropping some accuracy and pen for armor this is a ga...

113 is significantly faster forward not the same mobility mate and trading a gun (your most important statistic in the game) for armor and mobility instead of traverse speed and slightly inferior armor is not worth it and no way in hell will IS-7 be overperforming IS-4 and 113 with a slight accuracy buff idk if you understand how much you need for that to happen almost a 1000 DPM difference is a joke to you it seems
higher alpha wont matter as much as it should when you end up missing 2-3 crucial shells on average per game

nimble zodiac
#

They’re nerfing the wrong tank anyways

Nerfing the wrong things on T1 heavy too

vital basalt
#

idk this doesnt looks so "same"

Capture.JPG
scarlet fjord
#

you can see how inferior the mobility is except for 15% traverse difference
for 900 more DPM and much better gun handling and gold pen granted the standard round is pretty bad
instead of 40 more alpha and a bit more armor
all i want is it to have a bit less dispersion cuz E100's accuracy on 460 alpha is just meh
i agree with Master tho all the heavies need nerfing but WG dont like that idea too much they are even buffing 113 next patch the very tank we are already discussing about being superior than IS-7

winged barn
wind bough
#

is7 has much more HP compare to 113 anyways
lmao seems im talking with the wrong guys here
not gonna waste my time anymore
i brought my reasons wanna take it or nah
the way u are talking every single tank u own should get buffed without a logical reason
as i said u cannot have everything at once
i said pretty much the same mobility
yes im aware 113 is faster but with is7 u are bringing way more armor and hitpoint with pretty much same speed to battle

scarlet fjord
#

u say i didnt bring any arguments to the table but apparently u didnt read a single word lol

north coyote
#

Stop being so technical

still jolt
#

113 has way bigger DPM and mobility. I'm also thinking is7 should get buffed. It is very inaccuracy, also is7 armor aint the best. You can't sidescrap in it because everyone will penetrate you and you can't just show your front because it has a big weakspot underside.

sinful leaf
#

Buff all the heavies so they're overpowered then buff 183 to balance the heavies. Flawless balancing idea, wouldn't you agree?
||For obvious reasons I have to state that this is a joke||

drowsy plaza
#

The biggest problem is the fact folks use the IS-4 as a start point. The IS-4 at very least should get a mobility nerf - given it’s got a better gun, and armor profile that most other heavies. I don’t think the IS-7 needs a buff - simply because it is already great at bullying mediums. The WZ-113 is worse in that respect on a lot of maps as it is hampered by the traverse.

#

If you buff the dispersion on the IS-7, you end up needing to buff a lot of mediums. It’s easier to nerf several of the other heavies that are over performing

still jolt
#

I wouldn't say is7 is great for bullying mediums. It turns very slowly also like it has a big weakspot from the front soo even on a front to front fight meds can penetrate him.
It ain't bad but could be buffed a little.

scarlet fjord
#

its imo best heavy at bullying them but accuracy buff is needed cuz its DPB is way underperforming meds wont struggle cuz there are tanks that go med side in heavy class that arent IS-7's u need at least half decent accuracy to hit weak spots that your weak penetration needs to deal with to begin with heavy tanks do need nerfing but WG arent doing that soon specially the E5 and IS-4

sinful leaf
#

Literally the only way to fix the problem of battles lasting too long without breaking game balance is to nerf heavies but WG seems to think that buffing TDs will shorten average battle time, when more than likely it will probably increase it because of the nature of the TD class. Tbh I don't think WG will nerf heavies, nor buff mediums. At this point I'm willing to compromise for no more buffs to heavies in exchange for losing any opportunity in the future to buff meds at this rate imo

hardy hazel
#

Dont forget view range nerf for heavys

scarlet fjord
#

they have to nerf them the game wont last long when its heavy meta all the time question is how long until the devs decide its time to do their job
besides the 113 buff literally shows everyone that they are down right buffing wrong tanks and not touching the under performing ones

jagged crescent
#

tbh, the 113 is going to be more or less the same with or without the buff

Not really, if you over angle, you're still gonna get penned if people aim at the armor behind the tracks since that portion of the side armor is still staying the same.
Weakspots will stay as weakspots while strongspots will still be the same as strongspots, now they're just a little stronger which makes no difference since you shouldn't aim there anyways

although the stronger side turret armor might be useful

The wr on it was never that consistent. The update before it was right in the middle. What remained more or less the same was it's relative damage output.

safe rapids
#

Just a bit better at sidescraping I think

full token
#

I don’t see why a tank that’s the 3rd highest WR for heavies on WG’s chart requires a buff rn

fiery flame
#

IS7 is probably the worst tier 10 heavy tbh

drowsy plaza
#

Unless you count the 215b (which to me is fine - but it doesn’t seem to do well in charts) the Mk6 and the T57.

image0.jpg
#

My 30-60-90 in heavies makes me think that the Mk6 does need a buff - it’s significantly under performing from my historical data. But that’s just me. I don’t play the T57 enough to comment.

#

Of course the chart also shows the E5 is slightly under performing 😂

sinful leaf
#

When I still used to play the game frequently(which was around two months ago) I used T57 quite a lot. It's fine imo, the reverse speed is a killer though at 12 km/h. You screw up once with your positioning and you will hurt a lot or even get destroyed because of the awful reverse speed. It's literally faster to retreat by turning around then driving forward rather than driving backwards in most cases on maps that are not cramped. Overall, doesn't need a buff but a reverse speed buff to 15 km/h would be appreciated.

#

Also I really wouldn't trust the dev answers charts for balancing purposes sometimes because it doesn't accurately reflect the performance of all tanks across all servers

full token
#

Would be nice to get the stats for the servers that people here play on

jagged crescent
#

server regions have different metas

candid steeple
#

Btw too people saying buff FV215B 183. 5600 damage only second class. E4 5600 first class almost mastery. Just pointing that out. Tank must be weak.

rare sleet
#

Yeah cuz land 2 good hesh shots and thats 2700 damage or land 3 Ap shots and its already 2700 damage aswell.

scarlet fjord
#

its often to get nice games in 183 actually you just need a team that distracts your enemies and you to be a player that doesnt camp in it and u have a big damage game

low cliff
#

Yes, because damage has some correlation with aces and aces have 0 correlation with tank performance

scarlet fjord
#

true i cant say the charts are accurate about everything but based on logic some things do make sense
like the 113 changes it spot on those charts by a significant amount between 1 update even though it received no balance changes nor is it facing something that counters it that was implemented in that patch
meaning they arent accurate about many things in my opinion

sullen atlas
#

Ok what i don’t get is: in blitz, tanks have more hp (then on pc), but fv183 has less alpha dmg then on pc...what? Wargaming logic

unique scaffold
#

I mean i dont see it here

nimble zodiac
#

@sullen atlas It's already broken with 1300 HESH

@unique scaffold ask if it's about balance, edit your message, eh... gotta invite it to your server

drowsy plaza
#

Honestly the unfortunate way WG does the balance chat leads it to being skewed - it shows data from all 55-65% players. not 55-65% players in that tier. As we know there is a massive difference in being a 55-65% player in tier X, and a 55-65% player who plays mostly lower tiers -- and some high tier, or just got into high tier.

#

I find the analysis done by Jylpah on his website to be significantly more informative - albeit he doesn't have a lot of RU players - and only has logged players who generally have higher WR

toxic nymph
#

it doesn't seem that WG tracks those stats internally the way that blitzstars does
looks to me like the statistics on your main and stats page are the only ones they track

scarlet fjord
sullen atlas
#

Have you played pc with 1750 alpha? And I do 1.2k every time,like, the last time i got a clean 1.5/1.4k was like 2 months ago, i played yesterday (gonna edit and make a meme vid about it) where my biggest was 1.230 dmg, so the alpha is really bad (unrelaible),where with an Ru251 I do the alpha 225 pretty reliably I have random numbers with the deathstar, this includes the pathetic 600 dmg i once did WITH AP... (this isn’t a joke, i wish it was) but i get why, because on pc wot, there are 15 tanks instead of 7, meaning twice as much combined HP and therefor, the deathstar is (more) balanced. My point is, that the dmg is WAY too Rng based

unique scaffold
#

Then what’s your point because you just answered your original statement

scarlet fjord
#

in PC the T57 heavy gun would be broken here and pretty much every other auto loader cuz they need to speed the games up there as its 15 tanks not 7 imagine Foch B in blitz
hell they tried giving Foch 155 auto loader with 640 alpha and it was pretty damn broken because of its HE mainly so they panic-nerfed it a bit too much

sullen atlas
#

I mean, foch is still kinda op

low cliff
#
  1. You just answered your own question about why the 183 isn't getting an alpha change
  2. I am 80% sure damage rng is through standard deviation; 1200 damage isn't that far off from the 1300 average. You should be rolling 1200 more than 1500 and about equally to 1400.
indigo crater
#

This is a list of (hopefully) all heavies that have 0mm behind space armour on the turret [any tank with 0mm, did not care about size or possibility of penetration (OBJ 252U -250mm)] are there any means of fixing this issue or not?

bugged_mantlets.jpg
nimble zodiac
#

They’re planning to fix the little tigers in 7.8

jagged crescent
#

I hope they do something about the 0mm behind the centurion/carnaevon mantlets

Puru you do know that I'm asking for a buff for the cent/carn right. . .

deft owl
#

@jagged crescent Centurion 1 and Caernarvon has bigger problems then the 0mm armor behind gun mantlet.

Their premium counter parts are literally just better at everything yet we didnt see buff to them for a long time.

light idol
#

For those wondering exactly how OP is the Annihilator? It does the same amount of dmg on avg as Tier IX heavy tanks (1650 ish) (according to blitzstars). IDC if WG nerf the tank even though I paid for it, it's destroying Tier VI-VIII, in fact idc if they nerf any premium really, balance should come first imo. But out of all of them this one really needs to be nerfed HARD

drifting depot
#

yeah yeah we know I got like 70%+ Winrate or whatever, please stop ranting about the annihilator at this point I'm not even gonna read the entire message and I don't think anyone will 😐 you'll have to wait for everything around it to get buffed if you wanna take on one effectively like the smasher nowadays

hardy hazel
#

i read it 👍

worn tulip
#

#BuffKV1Armour

nimble zodiac
#

Buff KV-1 back to its glory days and it’ll still be meh 😂

light idol
rare sleet
#

Buffing all the tanks around a broken premium tank is seriously a really stupid thing you have to do to balance a broken tier. War gaming should spend more time testing premiums before they send them out to the live server.

twin egret
nimble zodiac
earnest ledge
#

Hello all

teal cape
#

Guten tak

full token
twin egret
toxic nymph
#

-145hp, so pretty serious

unknown.png
sand field
#

Balanced?? (Tech tree Pershing's full upgraded gun stats)

931e51e9070a6570a0d27761cc76e8d3.png
hardy hazel
#

prem pershing or normal pershing?

full token
twin egret
scarlet fjord
drifting depot
unique scaffold
#

When british tanks nerf? They are too op

full token
#

Theyre ok now. Some are nice tanks and some are weak

vital basalt
unique scaffold
barren zenith
#

Who on Earth wanted the centurion action x to replace the fv4202?

tribal moss
full token
remote oriole
#

Poor British tanks. Have never been the best but still get a lot of hate

warm dirge
#

Can someone please buff the frontal turret armor of the ARL 44? I know the tank is OP, but its hard to play when everyone just aims at your turret. Maybe you could decrease the pen, because 215 pen in a T6 is way too much. But please buff the frontal armor of the turret, or increase its HP. Everyone just aims at the turret and you have no way to block it, since your turret is paper everywhere

tribal moss
#

Nahh, keep the turret as it is. The gun's brilliant lmao

warm dirge
#

Yes I agree. The gun is amazing. Its just that the turret is bad. Its a good tank, one of the best, but the description of a heavy tank is not so accurate when you have a turret that is too ez to pen with the smallest guns

low crypt
#

Why would you want to have a tank that's already is awesome n amazing to get a buff? Isn't that like splashing water to a grease fire?

north peak
#

WG - we wont nerf premium tanks as there is not enough people playing them

The annihilator has 3,203,084 total battles and around 13k battles in the past 90 days, how is that not enough people playing them?

sudden granite
leaden flare
#

must agree on that arl is insane its fast, gun is broken, armor can work if used right and has way too high dpm

scarlet fjord
#

its hilarious to me how 121 has 245 AP pen XD
and more than Leopard 1 and 113

indigo knot
#

I would love to see Chimera, 252U, Progetto 46(tier 8) in the balance charts (please don't tell me there is not enough data regarding these since they are not played much, for sure they are played more than SU101, WZ110, Pershing, Indien Panzer which are in the charts)
Also tier 10 collectors like T95e6, 5A and T22 (maybe 5A and T95e6 are not played much but I believe that T22 is played more than 113gft for sure which is in the charts)

remote oriole
#

The 1% of battles rule is a sorry excuse to hide (op) premiums

jagged helm
#

Still waiting for m48 Patton buff btw

leaden flare
#

still waiting for a WT auf pz IV nerf that tank is basically a better grille a tier lower if it gets those consumables it will be beyond broken

wind bough
#

put waffen in tier 10 instead of grille
ez

crystal bone
#

Tbh I prefer grille over wt

unique scaffold
#

hi

real bison
scarlet fjord
fickle light
#

Buff Matilda BP turret front plate about 30mm(pls)

sand field
#

Buff Pershing DPM, turret and frontal armor

indigo crater
#

Buff American mediums in general

twin egret
barren zenith
#

Rly? Why tho? The FV4202 is a great tank and suits the line

shy ocean
#

Buff Leo 1 🤣

outer glen
#

Fv4202 need max speed buff even the heaviest mt has 60km max speed bruh

autumn zodiac
#

It doesn't need a speed buff it has one of the best P/W ratios so it gets up to speed nearly instantaneously and doesn't lose much speed going up hills or turning

hardy hazel
barren zenith
drowsy plaza
#

@outer glen sorry the M48, the M60, the WZ-121, the 121B, the Prog, the STB, and all three Russian Meds in X don't do 60....

outer glen
#

E50M does @drowsy plaza

low cliff
#

50M's power-weight ratio is one of the, if not the, worst among tier 10 meds. You won't be reaching 60 kmh unless you're going down a hill.

hearty steeple
#

It is in fact the worst among meds.

We are talking about acceleration and p/w. Not the actual tank performance. @Skeletalchild#0749
Also discord refusing to ping :/

latent snow
sharp saddle
#

You can reach 60km/h without going downhill but that takes a hot minute

winged barn
#

If only you could toon it with a Dracula to push it

twin egret
winged barn
#

The only tank that fits the full hull down description is the cent 1... kind of

Every other tank in the line is completely gun focused

Are you saying the comet has armor?
It doesn't
Nothing that is even moderately reliable anyway

barren zenith
twin egret
unique scaffold
#

Those are hill bullies they can hold but not for long anyways

winged barn
#

5 1 and mk1 both have turrets that actually work, so yes they are. They aren't a part of the line though.
Those 2 tanks both also have better turrets than the 7/1

The 7 1 is purely gun focused. The armor won't hold up well at all, and the turret isn't actually all that solid. Its gonna be taking damage if it peeks a ridge.

The 4202 is an extremely situational tank, but once it finds itself in a situation where it can fully abuse it's dpm, there really isn't a better tank for the job.

Screenshot_20210302-111506_Armor_Inspector.jpg
rare sleet
#

Btw Fv4202 on blitz is better than Fv4202 and Centurion action X on PC, if the fv4202 were to change to a Action X it would be a nerf to the line not a buff.

winged barn
#

Now that I'm looking at the mantlet of a 5/1, that's a half a meter of armor... somehow

vital basalt
#

wg be like:mantlet is already impenetrable so lets do it 500mm while Cent 1 gets 200mm mantlet cuz why not

hardy hazel
#

I think i have bounced more shells in my 7/1 not playing it in hull down than in my 4202 playing hull down, there is no need of cupola if the turret is butter imo

still jolt
#

J O K E

unknown.png
twin egret
rare sleet
twin egret
rare sleet
twin egret
unique scaffold
#

looks at leopard and 50B and 4005

rare sleet
#

What you want wargaming to add another tier 10 premium?

dull idol
#

Obj279e

twin egret
winged barn
autumn zodiac
winged barn
#

Lol I'm dumb
Thought it was 34 2

still jolt
#

#buff Type59

nimble zodiac
#

Sorry, I couldn't hear you over the strong turret armor

karmic portal
#

It’s actually kinda funny how the t 34 1 is a tier 7 and only slightly worse than the type 59.

winged barn
#

The hull is a very significant difference, accompanied by gun depression

karmic portal
#

Is it tho, and one less degree of gun depression? For a whole tier. Nah

winged barn
#

Autopen hull vs an armored hull...

karmic portal
#

Nahhh

drifting depot
#

Nahhh

sand field
#

Balanced

eb8e33fd681cf7fe2e47d590f6abaab6.png
deft owl
#

@sand field Why did you equip stock gun to Pershing?

toxic nymph
sand field
#

^ the difference is just that it has 180 pen anything else is just the same as top gun

drifting depot
#

slightly better accuracy I believe but yeah, trash. at least let it have that good hulldown murican tanks are "meant" to have

hearty steeple
#

Giving the Pershing some more dpm would be a nice start, and would actually make it slightly useable.

latent snow
#

Cent 1 needs a buff more than the Pershing does

wind bough
#

most of the lower tier tanks are like something else than the tier 10 ones
no wonder new players can't grow better quicker
tier 7,8 should feature the tier 10 tank aspects
for example patton line
tier 7,8 should have somewhat stronger turret than other mediums with same tier
then when u go in tier 9 suddenly everything become worse
not good gun handling
no turret armor
no armor overall

i believe tier 9 should be somewhat vehicle that features similar play style to tier 10 one but with worse aspects
in patton line
tier 9 just has similar gun depression and nothing else
no wonder new players sometimes have no clue to use some of the tanks cause previous tiers wasn't anything like the tier 10 one

river valley
#

maybe buff IS-series tanks gun depression? They have very good turret armor, which means they could be good hulldown tanks but the depression is too low for hulldown. Maybe just 2 degrees

unique scaffold
#

They already are hulldown tanks you don’t know what 7 degrees of gun depression is on a tank like the IS family do you

tribal moss
#

Hulldown IS-3
Who needs a 252U when u have one of these?

drifting depot
#

mhm

twin egret
#

🤔 buff the side armor of the FV215b, make it a viable sidescraper, there's this really weird spot behind that protruding piece of hull amor that is just 56mm,and not 76mm like the rest. maybe change the 76mm to 104mm

sand field
jagged helm
#

Is m48 Patton even still in the game

plucky current
#

Just remove fv4202's cupola, its turret armor is already bad. It would be better if it had AP instead of APCR

scarlet fjord
#

buff T44

runic coyote
#

T44 is quite good

scarlet fjord
#

Turret is butter patch the gun mantlet 54 lt wt has more dpm is faster with a stronger turret and a slightly weaker hull but light tank camo and same pen values nice logic WG

plucky current
#

pen in t44 should be a lil bit buffed

scarlet fjord
#

Maybe pen buff and DPM buff
or turret fix make the turret strong instead of buffing meta tanks WG go buff what needs buffing

gleaming apexBOT
#

dynoSuccess Strolol#0908 has been warned.

runic coyote
#

They should buff the new t8

drowsy plaza
#

@sand field I think you wanted this.

#

Tank Compare doesn’t allow the top gun in the top turret

gleaming apexBOT
#

dynoSuccess renegrau#5132 has been warned.

sand field
#

yes, its still the same anyways

gleaming apexBOT
#

dynoSuccess _beelzebhubh#7483 has been warned.

#

dynoSuccess King_Tiger1008#7936 has been warned.

drowsy plaza
#

@sand field yeah the Pershing is badly powercrept but the Cent I for most players is worse. (I think Pershing is worse - but that’s just me)

plucky current
#

wow warned for just «hi» ok. Pershing in my opinion may not be the most t8 tank in need of a buff, cent 1 is way worst, the alpha is too low, maybe 200 instead of 190 may make the enemies fear you more.

leaden flare
#

I was kinda ok with cent 1 but then again I've only played it for 17 battles with x3 and x5 what I realised was it could stay the way it is if it gets more turret Armor or give it some more DPM
Alpha changes won't change anything on how enemys see you
Speed is decent

sand field
minor minnow
#

I haven’t played either tank (nor do I plan to) so this is just an inexperienced person on the tanks perspective: firstly, the Centurion is much larger than the Pershing, giving it a sort of advantage right there. The Pershing also has alpha over the Cent, so while it may have slightly worse penetration, it hits harder when it does pen

jagged helm
#

Facts: you have more chance to drop the obj907 in a daily chest than meeting a m48 Patton or a Ferdinand on the battlefield

runic coyote
#

There are also just too many p2w versions of some Techtree tanks like Raac, Action X, DefenderMk1, Obj252U or the shark

drowsy plaza
#

@jagged helm I played 148 games in my M48 in the last 90 days.

#

Only 63% 😦

jagged helm
#

@drowsy plaza hero

To be fair this poor dude is so awesomely underpowered because of others mediums powercreep

Im even telling myself if u change 2-3 characteristics it can litterally be a t9

drowsy plaza
#

My point being people are playing it

#

You could change 2-3 characteristics in any tier X and have it be a tier 9.

nocturne mauve
#

Where’s the heavy nerf

jagged helm
#

M48 needs really small changes to be a t9
Are you saying m48 Patton is balanced ?

Nb of players is easily checkable on blitzstars
There are 2200 players of m48 on last 90days
Well there are 3 times more players of stb1, and 5times more t62a players than m48 players

unique scaffold
#

Buff t22 ty

minor minnow
#

Buff smasher DPM is too bad

vital basalt
#

M48 should have that M48A5 turret and maybe 5meter more view range like in pc,yes i know this is blitz not pc but there is really no point playing M48 if you have Stb1
same as M46,Type61 is better in almost every single thing

unique scaffold
#

They should buff the Cent 1 and the Fv4202 or atleast give them special consumables and/or provisions

hearty steeple
#

Tbh I don't find the fatton to be bad at all, especially after that recent gun buff. Yeah i guess it does get over shadowed by stb. Tbh i am bot entirely sure what buff will be good for it, maybe turret armour. More gun buffs?

A bigger question, does it even need buffs, or should we think about nerfs to other tanks.

lapis canopy
#

Buff IS-7 plssssssss

Screenshot_2021-03-03-22-05-22-00_f9762a4a918eaeda58407aaab3073a28.jpg Screenshot_2021-03-03-22-05-29-02_f9762a4a918eaeda58407aaab3073a28.jpg
scarlet fjord
#

Buff IS-7 pls

Screenshot_1094_LI.jpg
vital basalt
#

lol

tiny snow
#

Smasher and annialator needs nerfed or everything else needs buffed.

lapis canopy
#

Annihilator can't be neff

leaden flare
#

how about fixing the at15 gun mantlet it has 0 armor behind it
idk if its actually 0 but people with 200mm or less just straight up pen it with no problems at all

tame fox
#

Quick question: has anyone else tried facehugging an obj 252u with an Annihilator?

I have been trying it out and it seems either most of the obj players do not know how to play (they may not be switching to prammo?) or they actually cannot pen the Annihilator reliably in a facehug. Meanwhile I can easily dump all three shots into their hatches pretty much every time.

sand field
#

I rarely see people facehugs even myself so.. no

drowsy plaza
#

If they can’t pen they don’t know how to aim.

tame fox
#

I think the upper plate may actually be an auto bounce in reality. When I have shot at it before in close quarters it is difficult to pen

uneven narwhal
#

I think the IS-7 premium rounds need a buff in penetration, I can't even pen the cheeks of a Jageroo or an E100 reliably even if they angle slightly

scarlet fjord
#

if u run calibrated u can you have to sacrifice your meh DPM for it

minor minnow
#

With the alpha it carries I wouldn’t mind waiting half a second more

twin egret
pseudo hedge
#

AP more module damage

runic coyote
remote oriole
#

AP doesn’t deal more module damage. It just has more normalisation

scarlet fjord
#

pls T44 buff on the penetration values and or DPM

twin egret
orchid grove
#

@twin egret It reduces the angle of impact of a shell.

AP has 5 degrees of normalization, so if you hit a 100mm armor plate sloped back at 60 degrees, it'll treat it as a 100mm plate sloped back at 55 degrees instead

So that 100mm plate vs. HEAT is 200mm effective
But vs. AP, it's just 174mm effective

twin egret
#

ah thank you

nimble zodiac
#

If only people had watched the official video of WoT's shell penetration mechanics, instead they have Droodles, putting up a slide showing auto-bounce for HEAT at 80 degrees and 2.5 degrees normalization for APCR xD

@minor minnow set calculator to degrees, take base armor, divide by cosine of the angle, where 0 is flat, a rule of thumb is if it's 60 degrees, effectiveness doubled. Just make sure to subtract the normalization from the angle you're taking the cosine of xD

minor minnow
#

I watched the official video, I understand it, now I just have to be good at geometry :/

celest plume
#

Is7 needs buff

scarlet fjord
#

buff IS-7 dispersion

remote oriole
#

The WoT video isn’t exactly the most accurate source for Blitz. HEAT doesn’t autobounce in Blitz. HE fragments. The two caliber rule doubles the normalisation in Blitz (instead of using the formula). Maybe even more things I’m currently unaware of

drowsy plaza
#

Cardinal rule of Blitz mechanics, as soon as you know then they change.

orchid grove
nimble zodiac
#

Sure they may have changed it after this video, but the denominator wasn't doubled 🤔

Screen_Shot_2021-03-03_at_1.28.49_PM.png
minor minnow
#

If the caliber is more than 2 times the armors flat value? (H)?

remote oriole
wind bough
#

4005 183mm when
More paper big guns when
Eu techtree tds where

minor minnow
#

No

nimble zodiac
#

Yeah we kinda don't want to ruin the FV4005

They'll tell you when they're adding them, stop asking for tanks

wind bough
#

60tp when

latent snow
#

Waffentrager auf E100 when?

safe rapids
#

Actually giving it a 3 shell 128mm would not be too bad, or a 2 shot 150mm like the old Foch gun, makes up for it with paper armor.

nimble zodiac
#

So... first idea is to copy the FV4005? xD

unique scaffold
#

2019 4005 all over again or just a worse one

heady spoke
nimble zodiac
#

That’s not the only thing they’d have to do

celest plume
# scarlet fjord buff IS-7 dispersion

Well not the dispersion, the dispersion is quite ok for the is7 judging on a 460 alpha damage gun on a heavy tank i think the frontal armor needs to be buff a little more or at least troll it like the 268’s

sudden granite
#

It needs more speed 🤡🤡

winged barn
#

Careful there, you may convince noobs that it needs to move faster than mediums

celest plume
nimble zodiac
leaden flare
#

@winged barn mediums ? make it faster then lights and the acceleration of lt 432 rn

hollow ore
#

This might be a stupid question but... Why can’t WG nerf Premiums?

orchid grove
#

@hollow ore They theoretically can, they just don't since they don't want to nerf tanks people paid for

scarlet fjord
nimble zodiac
#

Wahhh APCR pen low wahh

I use AP

I kinda feel like 303 APCR should be around what heavy prammo pen should be anyways, the overkill pen is just not reliant on skill

celest plume
#

apcr pen is terrible tho no offense

orchid grove
#

The APCR is fine. Not everything needs to have great pen, and IS-7 frankly doesn't need it either so much as it should get a gun handling buff

winged barn
deft owl
#

Is-7 absolutely does not needs any buff.

nimble zodiac
winged barn
#

Finally getting the much needed churchill 1 and churchill 7 nerfs. Its about time. Both destroyed low tier matchmaking.

nimble zodiac
#

Nooo, I can't hit anything with my 2.2s reload time xD

mental pasture
# deft owl Is-7 absolutely does not needs any buff.

I disagree but I respect

I believe that IS-7, instead of IS-4, should be more focused in attack and advance than defense, as like if IS-7 was a spear and IS-4 a shield. In the current stats, IS-7 isn't able to do it very well.

But again, that's just my opinion as a main TD and heavy player

karmic portal
#

The is7 apcr with cali is not that bad

drifting depot
#

about the Churchills though, the mk6 is absolute bs to fight against, bounces waaaaaay to much even over grey spots like WHAT just WHAT

thin ermine
#

@drifting depot load gold and shoot right above the gun mantlet, you’ll pen every time

nvm I just realized u were talking abt churchills and not chieftans. Im tired

drifting depot
#

just look at this, the lower plate has more effective thickness than most t6 tank's penetration and FOR SOME REASON whenever I APCR one with my agent which is over 200mm it randomly bounces like WHY it shouldn't even happen and the hitmarks tell me it did hit the lower plate GEEZ is there some unfixed bug with the armor or what

Screenshot_20210303-232213.png Screenshot_20210303-231725.png Screenshot_20210303-231717.png
pure tiger
#

churchill mk VI is a stronk tonk, a farm of wn8

crystal halo
#

It has very exploitable weakness though, it’s probably one of the worst prems

wooden walrus
#

Not that worst though.

twin egret
#

what is it's weakness? It's tracks? if you say so I will be laughing

drifting depot
#

and if you say the hull and turret roof so will i

low cliff
#

I mean with the first image I'm gonna assume the bottom plate is 150mm thick at a 22 degrees angle. 150mm is slightly above average in terms of tier 6 pen, standard ammo should go through, pramo punches through easily

drifting depot
#

yet half the time it just doesnt

drifting depot
#

hilarious

pseudo hedge
#

Omg no u had one bad team. Want me to lean u a shoulder to cry into?
Want a paper towel too ?
It wasn't even like 7:0 or 7:1.

drifting depot
#

shh

tiny flare
#

@steel bison just one bad matchmaking and you got over 4k dmg? Or is there more of these

scarlet fjord
leaden flare
#

@bold dagger can you clean up this mess I'm pretty sure MM complaints aren't supposed to be in balance discussion

gleaming apexBOT
#

dynoSuccess iwasQuick#3579 has been warned.

stone gull
#

got it srry

bold dagger
#

yeah no worries

river valley
#

AMX AC tanks side and rear armor buff please

fiery flame
#

Rear armour buff, seriously... why?

unique scaffold
#

Most of this guys proposals make no sense

vital basalt
#

yea but i gotta admit that it needs a little buff to side armour,its 40mm now so 122mm can overmatch it so it can be good to buff it to 45mm maybe?

indigo knot
#

Actually just give IS7 some gun handling buffs and 303 AP instead of Apcr

plucky current
#

is7 is actually good, fv215b should receive a side armor buff to make it able to sidescrap, and vk 72 too, i don't really understand the point of playing rear turreted heavy tanks if they can't sidescrape. To balance that just remove the sand bag equipment.

vital basalt
#

nobody said its bad,but there is just better tanks with better specs

minor minnow
#

If you’re going to whine about matchmaking then go

mental pasture
#

@steel bison delete that and blur the names, you're doing naminng and shaming rn

vital basalt
#

Complaining about MM in this channel will result in 7 day Mutes - use #general-blitz-discussion for complaints about MM cant u just check the pinned message?

nimble zodiac
#

How about we just let the man get rekt by mods? 😂

austere sandal
#

yeah uh... lets go

nimble zodiac
#

@onyx mulch wrong channel bud 👀

sand field
#

Dang that sucks

unique scaffold
#

@onyx mulch when do you read the pinned messages?

scarlet fjord
sacred rain
#

Can i play against some T6 with a T7? Can u do that?

rare sleet
#

no

hardy hazel
#

Why do you want to do that?

sand field
#

Its called seal clubbing

rough hill
#

why just why cant we buff vindicator's HE to 960 from 900, it's already garbage enough and i dont think having normal HE damage for a 152mm gun would break it if smasher, a turreted heavy tank can have it, so can a turetless td

steel bison
coarse harness
#

Give T9 BC 380 dmg HE
Also give T54E1 HE in general

IMG_20210304_173953.jpg
normal root
#

Ok that’s never gonna happend

scarlet fjord
#

he has a point
Standard B has 105 HE pen 350 alpha (auto reloader) mechanism
T54E1 has no HE 310 alpha (auto loader) this is BaLaNcEd
Skoda T50 has 420 alpha HE gj wargaming
BC has 350 alpha gj wargaming
Standard B has 350 alpha on standard rounds

winged barn
#

HE is becoming less and less useful, as the tanks that you actually shoot HE at are getting spall liners.

toxic nymph
#

no more he-clipping waffles and grilles

thin ermine
#

pinned msgs are about as effective as the current seeding system

twin egret
hardy hazel
#

Yeah, even if the damage is lower the module damage still the same, right?

nimble zodiac
#

HE is now more of a guaranteeing some damage shell, like super prammo, if you shoot in the right area, you’ll always get damage, in high tier at least

twin egret
lapis canopy
unique scaffold
#

Hello good. I would like to talk about the jadtiger plates as to make it more like real life it should function as shielding rather than decoration.

minor minnow
#

They’re simply track links. They wouldn’t serve any purpose other than just being there, and even then they’d be near useless

stone gull
#

they re actually dont provide crazy amount of armor. It can help bout he shells but otherwise both is just spare part for tracks

hardy hazel
#

They cover a small area, if i have the choice of shooting te center or those plate im going for the center

unique scaffold
#

In my case that I use this tank it is needed to avoid that the light tanks do more damage to the tank from the sides hitting the plates and not the armor.With just that the armor is raised about 30 points by the probes of the plates you are satisfied.

Jagdtiger_Porsche_suspension_Sd_Kfz_186.jpg
#

It occupies little but protects and due to the dispersion of the cannons and other factors they can make it not penetrate the armor and hit the plate and also for something the Germans placed that plate there

vital basalt
#

eh they can make it extra 10/20mm armour,not spaced armour but normal armour like the tracks Is3 Defender's upper plates,but there is not really need for that,its still gonna be pennable by everything

Capture.JPG
drifting depot
#

I hate how many bs bounces the is3 def gets out of that

nimble zodiac
vital basalt
#

ohhh true it was Is3A in pc that has tracks tho Def still has extra armour in those parts while normal Is3 dont gets that

foggy aurora
#

Those are tracks because back then there was gonna be the IS-3A which as seen in the picture below has tracks on the pike nose which was kinda the same tank in terms of in game model as the defender which was made after the IS-3A

image0.png
scarlet fjord
#

WG can you patch the 30mm view port on IS-7 u can pen that with HE in face hugs

nimble zodiac
#

Skilled players wouldn't let that happen, gun blocking in mind

orchid grove
#

@unique scaffold The thing about track links, is that they're made of softer steel than normal armor plating, so offer less protection than their nominal thickness would imply. Moreover, the softer steel allows shells to normalize more before impacting the real armor underneath (often making the armor worse, which is why the US army discouraged crews from putting track links on the front of their Shermans, although crews persisted in the practice)

Also, just a pre-emptive measure. Before anyone brings up that exceptionally stupid "WWII armor and gunnery" or whatever book and says "hurr durr real life normalization actually makes shells curve away from the normal" because they read that ridiculous book, or saw info sourced from it, just look at photos of armor tests. Shells do normalize towards the normal. Just because some stupid amateur authors are bad at physics doesn't make it the truth

unique scaffold
#

Oh well I thought it was just another plate turned out to be a caterpillar. Thanks for your attention @orchid grove

scarlet fjord
#

@nimble zodiac thats not how you fix a problem

nimble zodiac
#

I mean, you can damage the enemy in the process, I see just strategy

scarlet fjord
#

ah yes because IS-7 is so completely broken we need to leave a 30mm view port at the front of the turret to balance it
the tank doesnt deserve it

nimble zodiac
#

It hasn't made any tangible differences in battle, most of the time it comes through facehugs, which wouldn't happen too often, mainly because of the team aspect preventing viable facehugging. Also not many players know, perhaps just an advantage of knowledge.

No reason to remove it, negligence is responsible for that 30mm port getting shot

scarlet fjord
#

your not answering my question
why does the IS-7 deserve the weak spot? is it broken? op?? armor is unpennable? whats your point the weak spot isnt well known and not exploited by a lot of people so dont remove it? if anything IS-4 is the one that deserves something like that