#td2-raid-discussions

1 messages · Page 34 of 1

tawdry widget
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only boomer is hard capped, razorback's health is still by passable with enough buffs, syncs, etc

tender hollow
#

You people do realize that 1shot razor was only a thing with Pulse stacking.
Since this is not possible anymore 1shotting is not possible anymore.
Sync Shots with Dodge City and liberty only skip one Phase as they cant shoot through razorback

weary niche
#

Pulse stacking came later dude....

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The first one shot was before pulse stacking

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But yeah i don't really believe that 1 phase is possible anymore, or let's be honest who even cares as much, the golden age of speedruns have died out

tawdry widget
vagrant wing
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This was possible after gear 2.0 without stacking. Ask AJ we did it once i think as experiment iirc
Boomer can be cheesed (with shock - scorpio)
weasel as well
B&L can be done super quick (again ask AJ and SSR they developed something back then)
and rzr can be done quickly enough with the striker meta or alternatively HFR's method (i do think nowadays this method will require extreme luck or 2 phase for the very least)

fluid pier
# vagrant wing This was possible after gear 2.0 without stacking. Ask AJ we did it once i think...

Oh I know all that. I was part of the experimenting with Aj and Ssr. I was just skeptical that this was claimed to be recently done in an lfg group of random people especially after having already experimented around with things myself so I was asking for details. If this can be done so easily in lfg groups, I want to learn their strats so I can make my own lfg DH runs this quick every time too.

tender hollow
#

^ Negotiators does damage when Boomer is up, if you mark him when he is on his knees. Maybe with Dodge City/Headhunter/Regulus it can take out a big chunk of his armour with 2 shots after he gets up [or even when he is down].

fluid pier
tender hollow
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^ didn't know that. nice

fluid pier
tender hollow
#

they most probably had a couple who knew what they were doing trying out stuff

fluid pier
#

Yeah, and that’s why I was wondering what the strat they were using was. It seems like this should be a fairly easy thing to do if you just need a few ppl that are trying things out in a lfg run.

fresh lantern
#

I want to do my first raid, but I don't think I have builds for it. What builds do I need before I try to look for a group?

brittle fox
#

Does anyone have a pic of the control room screens with the letters for codes on them for the 2nd boss fight in IH ?

velvet wave
#

I am trying to find a group to do a raid. Trying get the exotics. Any good group?

tranquil flume
pallid widget
#

@fresh lantern for either raid as a starter build all red core dps. 3 Providence Defense, 1 Groupo, 1 Ceska, then Fox's prayer kneepads and or Contractors gloves.
Chest talent Unbreakable/Glass cannon. Backpack talent Vigilance /Composure. Crit hit chance 40%+, Crit damage 150%+

tawdry widget
lusty bobcat
#

Once you unlock the Regulus Project. Are those pieces locked behind your first kill of the week as well? or can you farm them multiple times in a week for the drops?

exotic epoch
#

@lusty bobcat the chest piece and backbackp drops form only raids

lusty bobcat
#

yea, i know those 2. But the regulus components (frame, grip, drum, ect) are those locked?

smoky tapir
#

first kill only drop tables

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so if you killed them prior that week, you will be required to wait till next reset

lusty bobcat
#

boooo. alright thanks

smoky tapir
#

the ingot from the chest can be gotten anytime the chest is opened (not just first)

stiff oxide
#

After Clearing Iron Horse with 8 Clanmates the IH Symbol for the Insignia is not available, only Williams was second try... is it a Bug?

tawdry widget
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it's a bug that hasn't been fixed since the day the raid was released

stiff oxide
#

Wow.. 😂 thx @tawdry widget

vernal bay
#

Hi, I've never tried raids before and thinking of trying in the near future. If one was to do raids, which is probably easier to start off with? IH or DH? I heard DH is more of a DPS check than IH but IH is more complicated and teamwork based?

dreamy whale
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DH is easier.

vernal bay
#

I've attempted and finished explore mode but a friend of mine told me he couldn't get past the 1st boss phase with the 2 miniguns

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are there significant differences between the 2 difficulties?

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he said the boss kept destroying the miniguns and they just gave up after stuck on that phase for 2 hours

flint iris
#

the boss kept destroying them cause your friend and his team took too long to kill him

vernal bay
#

wow... sounds tough...

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do we have like recommended setups for raids or something?

dreamy whale
#

DH is mostly about dps. Everyone on the group should have at least 50% chc and as much chd as possible (170-180%) is a good middle ground.

vernal bay
#

I see, so weapon type doesn't really matter as long as they have 50% CHC and roughly 170-180% CHD?

tribal mountain
#

You don't need to stack CHC if someone is wearing a Coyote mask.

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A lot of people have way over the mark min requirements for raids.

vernal bay
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I was thinking of attempting it with my friends so I doubt we've met the minimum (50% CHC and 170-180% CHD)

tribal mountain
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2 people with Coyote masks solves that for you.

vernal bay
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CHD included?

tribal mountain
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Yeah.

vernal bay
#

ok, and any gun type works or..?

tribal mountain
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So.....if you're shooting the bosses like Boomer? M1A or I use an ACS shotgun.

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But like, if I'm clearing Ads in Boomer room or even Razor. I use a Rock N Roll, Dynasty holster and Creeping Death backpack with Obliterate chest.

Most people try kick me from raids for wearing it 🤣

#

If the majority of your group is new, get the best DPS build you can get. Rifles and ARs, watch multiple videos and learn the Ads spawns.

vernal bay
#

I see, I'll keep that in mind

#

so that means SMG/Shotgun with HF gearset is a no go

tribal mountain
#

If you get to Boomer room and during a damage phase your're not able to do 2 bars of damage. Then your DPS is off and you need to swap things around.

tribal mountain
vernal bay
#

oh

tribal mountain
#

Anyone who tells you different is still taking an hour to do the raid and doesn't know anything.

vernal bay
#

so, is it possible to do with 7 people? like 1 full tank, 1 healer and 5 DPS?

tribal mountain
#

Yeah course, just take a bit longer but you'll get it done.

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For Razor though, full DPS.

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Nothing else.

flint iris
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Lol when I inspected your character I saw some very interesting builds you used for ih

tribal mountain
#

Me???

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You spying on me 👀

flint iris
#

I added you 👀

tribal mountain
#

Awkward.

flint iris
#

Like a few months back

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Lmao

tribal mountain
#

Oh yeah!!

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I run the normal healer/CC/tank builds in Iron Horse.

vernal bay
#

Razor is the Razorback at the final stage, right?

tribal mountain
#

But for DPS, shotguns only or I'm bored.

flint iris
#

Just Razorback in general

tribal mountain
vernal bay
#

is it possible without a healer though?

flint iris
#

I’ve gotta have more fun in raids. Standard dps is getting a lil dry

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Razorback is very possible without a healer

vernal bay
#

do we need CC at all throughout DH?

flint iris
#

Though most of the time, youll have a drone killer with a healing have as secondary

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Nope

tribal mountain
#

I remember I was in a LFG and a dude wanted to shoot heals down from Ads4 at everyone 🤣

flint iris
#

Ads4 is really the easiest one imo

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We always put the newbies there when we raid

vernal bay
#

ads4?

tribal mountain
tribal mountain
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Ads4 is the..........Ads4 corner.

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To your right as you drop down.

vernal bay
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lol ok

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what a name

tribal mountain
#

The sams in every corner are numbered.

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So you'd have an Ads4 person, their job is to kill the Ads that spawn in that corner, kill Chunga at the sam and prep the weakpoints on Razor.

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Ads1-4 all do the same thing.

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I prefer Ads2 because my holster sets them on fire before they get over the wall.

flint iris
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My favourite is gen 1

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Cause that’s where I usually kill drones

vernal bay
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sounds cheaty xD

flint iris
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And no one else in my clan is bothered to make a drone killer build

vernal bay
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drone killer build?

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like EMP Eclipse build?

flint iris
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Razorback spawns drones

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No not eclipse

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These are not normal drones

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You need high skill dmg to kill them

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Hard wired drone killer

vernal bay
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😮

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so skill build is viable at the final phase?

tribal mountain
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Only for one person.

flint iris
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Not in the tradition sense

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^

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That’s it, one guy

tribal mountain
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It's necessary, can't be done without it.

vernal bay
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I'm definitely doing that job then

flint iris
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That’s a big job

tribal mountain
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You have to get used to the timing.

flint iris
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^

vernal bay
#

eh?

flint iris
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Drone spawn timings

tribal mountain
#

I need a video to show this 🤣

flint iris
#

Shooting the crossbow, throwing the Nade, etc

tribal mountain
#

Hit EMP.

vernal bay
#

oh, the part where you toss nades into the razorback?

flint iris
#

That’s one out of many

tribal mountain
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Drop hive, pick up hive.

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Hit EMP again.

flint iris
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It’s hard to explain just like this

tribal mountain
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Hope there's no third wave.

vernal bay
#

definitely sounds like I need a video on this, the one I watched didn't really show such role of HW Drone killer

flint iris
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Yeah take a bit of getting used to the drone killer role

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For your first few times dps should be fine

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To get a grasp of the mechnics involved

vernal bay
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yeah.. felt like explore difficulty didn't really teach much...

tribal mountain
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@vernal bay A lot of the raid videos are old I'd imagine. The process changed after WoNY.

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Look for videos that are Level 40 or 2020 I would say.

vernal bay
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2020 huh.. alot are from early 2020

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are those still viable?

tribal mountain
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Nope, WoNY was this year wasn't it?

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Wait, was it?

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How long has this game been out? 🤣

vernal bay
#

no clue, I joined around mid Season 3(?) when Hunter Fury was the seasonal gearset

tribal mountain
#

Oh hell, WoNY was 2020 👀

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Yeah, 2020 Dark Hours videos should be viable.

vernal bay
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noted, I'll dig into those for ideas on how and what to run with

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thank you guys for the advices

flint iris
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Wony was this March petter

tribal mountain
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Yes, it was.

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Google failed me.

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As did my brain.

sterile rampart
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hi All, locking for Raid Ironhorse t get to last 2 Parts for the weapon propjects... Backpack Bullwork and Futire initiative

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english or german team would be nice

warm wren
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This channel is for discussing the raids, not LFGing them. Try over in #lfg-raid-pc.

sterile rampart
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Many thx for info...

zinc bluff
#

@polar sphinx do yall troll in raids every day bruh

warm ibex
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@zinc bluff i hope he is trolling all day 😂

polar sphinx
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Troll is life

zinc bluff
#

it's funny af though

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and people will instantly believe you because you're such a high shd level

hoary wyvern
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what does it mean RV10 or RV7,RV5 ? is it kind of difficulty ?

bold path
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pretty sure they mean the Raid Voice channel they will be in

hoary wyvern
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lol Thaks @bold path

bold path
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npnp

tender hollow
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I got 400 hours in the game, and I was like "wtf is this RV# slang O.o" hahahahah

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maybe some kind of build I'm not aware of

bold path
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you never know, never hurts to ask

bright temple
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how do I make a good healer build for raids?

tawdry island
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4 PCS Future (Mask, Chest, Holster, Knees), BTSU Gloves, Alps Backpack with either Opportunistic or Safeguard. Scorpio Shotgun and SVD when using Opportunistic, if using Safeguard it doesn´t matter.

tranquil flume
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Safeguard **

tawdry island
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👍 Corrected.

green prairie
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is there a group here for stadia players

flint iris
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Stadia can crossplay with PC so I guess you can use the PC channels

hardy shell
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main boss mechanic difference between discovery and normal?

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i want to make a test run with some friends before trying out the actual raid

frank barn
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for IH i believe at least some adds are shaved off

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and some mechanic are simplified little bit

vagrant wing
hardy shell
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DH since someone told me IH is just a dps check

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@vagrant wing

vagrant wing
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Ah no. That's the other way around. But since you clearly havn't done neither here're the changes between discovery and normal in DH:

  • adds & bosses health pull in lower
  • The computers on boomer will have a different pattern
  • The gases on weasel won't reach 20
  • after some tries the encounter will start weather you pressed the 2 panels right or not
  • B&L brackets are bigger
  • Razor back circles doesn't have to be charged at the same time

I might forgot something. I'll edit it if i remember @hardy shell

hardy shell
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I accidentally typed it the other way around,but thanks @vagrant wing

vagrant wing
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are you gonna do DH or IH then?

hardy shell
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DH since I don’t have a mic so I can just listen to the leader’s order and make it through

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Unlike IH when you need to talk like Eminem to pass Fiesel

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Also:”100 RPM BITCHES”

vagrant wing
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DH without a mic still gonna be tough, especially for first timers. GL

hardy shell
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Thanks

gaunt bloom
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somone looking for raid i can join

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looking for IH raid

tender hollow
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almost ready to raid hyena stronghold

limpid gale
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any raid i can join

warm wren
hardy shell
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ah fuck,what have you done

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you cant tag everyone

valid marlin
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They know that the everyone tag isn't working on this server, yet still try to use it. 🙃

hardy shell
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lol

hardy shell
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Hey,to anyone doing the raid with me before(th4nhhung),thanks for helping.i know I didn’t complete it and caused a lot of trouble for you guys due to not having a mic,but we almost made it.

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So,thank you

drowsy ivy
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Quick question for DH razerback Ravenous "huge damage" thing, how do you do it? seen ppl doing it but not sure how to do it, always been the EMP or outer circle guy, thinking about being the DPS for onces

verbal mist
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@drowsy ivy we use ravenous left shoulder (blue stacks) a total of 5 then switch to d50 with gunslinger holster and bam

drowsy ivy
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oh so that's how you take like 3/4 of the health off..being doing it with wrong shoulder...

verbal mist
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Yes you need to stack up on blue then switch to pistol with gunslinger holster . If you crit then it’s real big . Helps if someone wears coyotes mask in your group

drowsy ivy
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4 circles, 3 of them are the ravenous gang with me being the Capacitor EMP, 4 erections , and they already pop half the back with the first erection

verbal mist
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We break back first phase

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Two run ravenous and pistols with gunslinger

drowsy ivy
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what about third guy ?

verbal mist
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Really no reason for more than two to break weak points

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Just good dps players on rest

drowsy ivy
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got it ,thanks

verbal mist
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Np.

wary moat
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@verbal mist someone mentioned this before, optimist deagle with 1 bullet left then that ravenous blue stacks with dodge city holster

kindred moss
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hey guys sorry if it's been already answered, how many dilemma builds on boomer? just one or more?

wary moat
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i havent run ND there, knowing there are like 4 spawn points there, i think 4 are enough

little onyx
hardy shell
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I haven’t tried it,but can you use the Scorpio to stop the chunga from activating the wipe?

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In dh

flint iris
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Can’t you just straight up shoot it?

kindred moss
hardy shell
flint iris
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That’s a pretty big if

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And you shouldn’t need the extra time to do it tbh, they already take quite a long time to arm and as the ad guy, you should be close to the SAM anyway

hardy shell
flint iris
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How do you “forget”

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There’s literally flashing lights and a sound cue

hardy shell
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lol,fuck me,how do i know

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he mistaken station 4 with station 1 and lost a few seconds

flint iris
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.-.

hardy shell
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i mean,it was my first time so i keep forgetting the chunga for 3 times straight

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and my full red build isnt hitting hard enough

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one sec

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just sent you my build

vagrant wing
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You know you can shoot him in his butt for an easy kill right @hardy shell ? You can kill him with no reds with this methods

hardy shell
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yeah i know,im just asking if thats possible so that you can get some time if you start running too late

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im doing ih discovery

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can you explain phase 1 again @vagrant wing ?

vagrant wing
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What do you mean by 'phase 1'?

uneven garden
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@vagrant wing no reds is possible but tight. I was running drones the other day and my adds guy was down so I killed chunga with Rav but it was like seconds from wipe

vagrant wing
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It's not the point. They were complaining their red build doesn't hit hard enough so i explained you don't really need any reds to kill him @uneven garden

hardy shell
vagrant wing
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Again you'll have to clarify what you mean by that, sorry. I don't quute understand what we're talking about here. Are you referring to the entire 4th encounter? To part of it?

hardy shell
#

sorry 'bout that

uneven garden
#

@vagrant wing well lol if dps not enough to kill chunga I doubt the builds were raid ready tbh

vagrant wing
#

Right.
Jumping down you'll have 5-6 grenadiers to kill (can't remember the exact number)
Circles need to be charged at the same time as you probably know
Open both vents. Throw a concussion grenade into them
Rzr will open up - you'll do dmg to the weakpoints to reveal its health and dmg ita health (hopefully)
Dodge the rockets rinse and repeat
After each of these phases you'll get 1 or 2 heavies (depends on rzr health)

vagrant wing
uneven garden
#

Could be. I am p sure if you start running when you hear the alarm you would still have enough time to butt kill - only exception could be adds1 when damaging the gen4 weak point

tender hollow
#

Armour on DH bosses question: Do Boomer / Weasel etc. / Buddy and Lucy have armour?

warm ibex
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@tender hollow yep all of them have armor

tender hollow
little onyx
tender hollow
dusty violet
#

do the Future initiative chest and bag drop from the bosses or do i have to wait until the reset to find it within the chests? (ive completed it this week)

pliant cobalt
#

My psn is SOLIFUGAE and would like to know where to find raid groups. I am high level but have yet to do full raid and reap the rewards.

tender hollow
dusty violet
#

@tender hollow so even though ive finished the raid for the week im good to go farm the bosses and get the pieces? or are they "weekly" loot too?

stable coyote
#

In the "lfg-raid" channel people includes an "rv#" when they search for people. What does that mean? Me and my friends are new to raids & don't know much about terms

valid marlin
#

@stable coyote Raid voice channel No.

upbeat thunder
stable coyote
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Oh! Cool thanks

tender hollow
dusty violet
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not even looked into the regulus yet, trying to get ma healy boi set 😄

#

thanks for the info dude, mucho helpful

molten hearth
#

what does "fresh raid run" mean i see it all over the xbox lfg feature

hasty holly
#

rasid starting from the beginning

smoky tapir
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fresh raid means a fresh raid from the very begninning

molten hearth
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okay

smoky tapir
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and killing all the bosses

hasty holly
#

not only "farming boss 2" e.g.

brittle sluice
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Toxic_MaN.

fast blaze
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raid speed run discussion anyone?

normal mirage
#

👀

cloud shard
#

L

kindred moss
whole spoke
#

Does anyone have a general idea about the exact timing that Boss 1's shield minions for IH lose their immunity?

velvet wave
#

hey, I'm new to discord and was trying to figure out how to join the raid group.

whole spoke
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Is it right after Gray finishes his monologue?

humble solar
#

Too late for speedrun discussion 😭

tawdry widget
#

@whole spoke no idea on how many "seconds", it's just a timing thing you get after a few tries. you can watch it on youtube videos, though, should be easy to find.

balmy peak
#

iirc you can start damaging them when Grey says "keep me alive"

whole spoke
#

As soon as that line is said or after?

tawdry widget
#

It's actually before

tender hollow
tender hollow
whole spoke
#

Yes

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The two/three times I've tried to I've gotten the timing wrong and hit them while they were immune

tender hollow
#

Then yes as soon as the shields begin to move you can take the shot. If you’re landing the shot at the right time and it’s still saying immune, drop the raid and start a fresh one. It bugs out sometimes. Can also be a latency issue if your on a foreign server.

#

Also keep in mind that the time difference between doing the Sweet Dreams method and using the Regulus is only 2 or 3 seconds. Considering that you need a specific build to make the Regulus shot work (ie killing all 3 shields instantly) are those 2 or 3 seconds wasted because of slightly lower damage on the boss? If you’re near the top of the leaderboard and saving 2 seconds is a big deal then definitely do it, but if not are you really achieving anything with it?

humble solar
# whole spoke Yes

There is a white outline on the shield guys when they are immune and not too difficult to see it go away. Its within the 1st second the boss touches the ground

whole spoke
#

Right, thanks both

humble solar
#

I know colorblind mode helps see mortars and skills better, might help on the immunity line on them. Been awhile since I've had to do regulus. Im status

bleak mason
quasi urchin
#

What does it mean by "fresh" in #lfg-raid-pc ?
It doesn't seems to mean "new player"

upbeat thunder
#

means first run. from first boss to last.

quasi urchin
#

thanks

fierce jungle
kindred moss
#

Can we talk for a second on how to correctly do buddy and Lucy in a speedrun? We still struggle on how to balance damage and handle them. Any advice from fellow dh speedrunners?

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We usually do normally by kiting buddy in the blue shop and Lucy in the red one bring them down (slowly 😦 ) then kill buddy first and Lucy last. I’ve seen speedrun videos where they burn them down fast and I was wondering how they do that without sending them in overcharge

distant gull
#

@kindred moss glass cannon, booster hives and the Scorpio shotgun. My group does 4 people of each dog and as soon as Lucy stops her first spin we start firing. The goal is to bring them down together, sometimes we’ll over damage one of them and then just one person from each group is dedicated to switch dogs temporarily

tawdry widget
#

assign people to buddy and to lucy, check builds to see if they're "balanced" in damage output and just shoot

vagrant wing
#

@kindred moss another way is to utilize focus (which is better then GC at full stacks) there're several points in that room where you can stand without getting hit by lucy spin. You can get a full focus stacks and use an M1A with a booster hive

You can also use a striker with an LMG and pre acquire stacks as well

kindred moss
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We need to test placement. I guess Scorpio is used to give opportunistic and stun one of them while the others bring it down right?

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Also, buddy needs more damage than lucy usually, so opportunistic should be sticked to him right?

vagrant wing
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The stun mechanic for them is a bit weird imo. If @distant gull can elaborate i'd like to hear it. But yeah. Opp is important as well as the 20% buff from the scorpio at 7 bullets

tawdry widget
#

It also has the 20% extra damage on the last buff. Don't think it stuns them, though.

distant gull
#

@kindred moss @vagrant wing everyone uses the scorpio

vagrant wing
#

It does show the shock sign but it doesn't do much. However a survivalist in the group will grant additional 10% for it

vagrant wing
kindred moss
tawdry widget
#

The room isn't that big

tranquil flume
#

The debuff doesnt stack right ?

vagrant wing
vagrant wing
distant gull
#

@kindred moss @vagrant wing don’t know if it’s the best strat but we burn them within 10 secs of Lucy finishing her first spin

tawdry widget
#

Doesn't stack, but if multiple people are shooting it means that as soon as it ends, it will start again

kindred moss
#

Or just 8 dps?

tawdry widget
#

You can have a future initiative with a sombra backpack, opportunistic and crit damage rolled everywhere

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that person can buff the whole team and shoot both dogs for the buff

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I do that on IH first boss too

distant gull
#

@kindred moss 8 dps, a red FI build. We don’t use opportunistic for this one as it damages one more than the other and the person with opportunistic will waste time and dps by trying to proc it on both dogs

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We just run 8 red builds

kindred moss
#

How do you build that red Fi? 4 red fi with crit dmg and?

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I’m gonna waste my time farming crit dmg fi pieces today

tawdry widget
#

If want to overcharge, keep the skill tiers, add BTSU and either have an all red backpack with named kard in your hand to overcharge, or just have a skill tier rolled on to it, so you don't need the kard.

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If you don't want to overcharge, roll weapon damage on the cores

tender hollow
distant gull
#

@kindred moss My red FI build has crit damage yes, then I’d use grupo or badger tuff. My red FI isn’t really used a lot when I raid. But I can swap out for contractors, fox prayers while having a vigilance or opportunistic backpack.

tender hollow
kindred moss
tender hollow
tawdry widget
#

If you just want to burn them, getting those stacks probably takes too much time

distant gull
#

@kindred moss there’s multiple strats that you can use. Best thing to do is get you group of 8 and test them and try and find the balance of damage as each persons build will be slightly different

tender hollow
#

One key point that a lot of groups forget about is making sure you consider all the passive bonuses you can add. Talents like Overwatch, Opportunistic, FI buff, having a demolitionist in each sub group, having a firewall player within 10m of target. On their own they don’t seem like much, but all of those passive buffs combined can add up to more than a 50% damage increase.

kindred moss
#

Thanks guys, need to bring my clan there today and do some testing.

tender hollow
kindred moss
weary niche
#

I know a lot people used Ravenous actually there, i never went back to first raid to try it tho

hardy shell
#

how do i make the razorback tower goes up?

#

we keep shooting the drones and broke the 2 weakpoints,but nothing happened?

cunning night
#

Did you throw concussion grenades in the vents?

hardy shell
#

i have to?

smoky tapir
#

Razorback: Stand in 4 circles to 100% to unlock the vents, break the vents on both sides and throw a grenade into the hole to make it rise

hardy shell
#

its discovery and nobody knows what to do better than me

smoky tapir
#

you have a timelimit from once all 4 circles are at 100% to blow up the vents and throw the grenades in

#

the vent will turn green when a grenade has blown up inside it

cunning night
#

Once you destroy the vents, you have to throw grenades in. Nobody really does this in discovery I found.

#

I’d recommend you watch or read a guide. There’s still more steps after that.

hardy shell
#

lol i keep throwing sticky inside and only now do i realize it

smoky tapir
#

has to be a regular concussion grenade as well

cunning night
#

Frag, firewall, or GL works too.

hardy shell
#

my entire group has zero shit 'bout what to do

#

i really regret this

cunning night
#

Is this through matchmaking?

hardy shell
#

yup

smoky tapir
#

discovery apparently

cunning night
#

It’s always like that

smoky tapir
#

which is dumbed down and missing mechanics

hardy shell
#

they dont read chats

#

this is madness

cunning night
#

Nobody ever knows

smoky tapir
#

which is why MM wont exist for the normal version

hardy shell
#

THIS.IS.DISCOVERY MODE

#

they dont even deal enough dps

#

and doesnt know that they have to shoot at the chunga asses

cunning night
#

One person can technically do the whole encounter if people keep ads in check.

smoky tapir
#

its half the reason most people stay far far far away from discovery

cunning night
#

But, that’s sometimes too much

smoky tapir
#

for RB, you need 2 to know what their doing as 1 can't cover both side's chungas

cunning night
#

There’s never 2

smoky tapir
#

if 2 know what to do, they can duo it 😛

cunning night
#

That I’ve seen

#

Locked to one in discovery

#

It’s been awhile since I tried, so I could be wrong

smoky tapir
#

i did discovery twice, once for the experience and once to do the commendation for the bears

hardy shell
#

FINALLY,THEY GET IT

#

AND THEN THEY CANT KILL THE CHUNGA BECAUSE THEY JUST TRY TO GO FOR THE HEAD

cunning night
#

Yeah, if they had DPS they could still kill him.

#

I did it last time when I didn’t feel like running halfway across the map. Unless you want to just experience the raid, discovery is a waste of time.

#

Try to find a clan or team that runs raids.

hardy shell
#

finally

#

after dying 30 times because no one knows how to stop wipe

#

in discovery

#

we actually did it

cunning night
#

Congrats

hardy shell
#

this is torture

#

but hey,that m1 with max damage and ranger on it is decent

#

sike,it was garbage compared to what i have to went through

#

i would rather stay in the dz,dying to some armor/dps bug chinese-named SOBs than this

cunning night
#

It all depends on the team. Raids can be fun.

hardy shell
#

"Stop sending me fucking clowns.Now if you excuse me,Im gonna shoot myself in the head"

#

woah

#

i got 3 caches from there

cunning night
#

Most discovery raids are just what you described. Don’t base it on that.

hardy shell
#

well yes,ive done a actual raid with a group made out of shd 600+

#

its fun

#

but not this deezkoveri thing

cunning night
#

Understandable. I did discovery when I was waiting or was bored.

hardy shell
#

discovery mode is the new "youre going to brazil" meme

sacred stone
#

Has anyone heard of Negotiators Dilemma Gear Set causing Buddy and Lucy to glitch out?

vagrant wing
#

Nope. Glitched how?

sacred stone
#

Not sure I was told not to run that set during Buddy and Lucy.

humble solar
#

@sacred stone definitely weird, some people i know run it with no problem. Could've just been a dps issue where your group leader said not to run it.

verbal mist
#

it was glitched in the past

cunning night
#

Yeah, it used to definitely glitch out Razorback, never heard of B&L though.

valid marlin
#

@humble crescent

  1. No need to post it in multiple channels.
  2. You already know that the raid channels are not the place to look for a clan (as you said yourself in the other channel) so why do it anyway?
  3. Post it in #td2-clan-recruitment where people are actually looking for clan members
kindred moss
#

hey there seems like there's a trick to speed up codes at fieser in IH, anyone knows the way?

uneven garden
#

@tender hollow

icy hull
#

Wrong channel, please use the Raid LFG one.

fluid pier
#

@kindred moss roger dodger

molten hearth
#

so DH is all about critical hit chance?

vagrant wing
molten hearth
#

ok well when i was doing it, i was supossed to hold the doors where enemies come from and i was struggling and they told me that i neeed high crit hit chance

vagrant wing
#

Crit chance won't do you any good by itself, you probably need to improve your build a little that's all. Generally speaking the "meta" DPS build does relay on high crit chance (around 50%) but there're alternatives...

molten hearth
#

hm

#

max crit chance is 60% right?

vagrant wing
#

Yep

#

Bare in mind - crit chance without high crit dmg won't give you much. If you go that route you'll have to have a decent chd too

molten hearth
#

ok

#

and what's a good gun for holding these entrances

#

one of em reccomended a p416 with ranger because the enemies run away and i hit harder

vagrant wing
#

Depends on your playstyle and your environment (which obviously i know nothing about)

molten hearth
#

yeah i see

vagrant wing
#

I personally prefer an M1A variant or a fast firing AR (the p416 isn't one of them) but again that's preference also i have no idea how hard it is to shoot with a controller

molten hearth
#

not that hard

vagrant wing
#

If you're a good shooter, the safest weapon for it would be an M1A variant i believe

molten hearth
#

Ok

#

What about shotguns, like... Sweet Dreams?

vagrant wing
#

Ah no. If you do want to use STGs (which i strongly suggest not to) use either the super90 or an ACS, SASG12 might be good as well

molten hearth
#

ah okay

#

I'm running a p416 with ranger

vagrant wing
#

You do realize the talent won't give you anything when holding the doors right (just asking...)?

molten hearth
#

Yeah

#

I'm always running a baker's dozen as secondary

humble solar
vagrant wing
#

Also the p416 has a bad DPS overall too

molten hearth
#

Yeah I have a hard time picking an ar

#

They said an smg won't work

vagrant wing
#

FAMAS/M4/Car7/Honey Badger are the best for DPS (in that order) the AK come afterwards i believe (not including exotics ofc)

humble solar
#

@kindred moss if you dont have a coordinated team with pretty good awareness it will not work. Only for speedruns

molten hearth
#

Yeah got it

vagrant wing
molten hearth
#

I dunno

#

They're the experts I'm just listening 😂

vagrant wing
#

I feel like your build is a problem when you're willin to switch wpn class just like that. Head over to #td2-build-advice , in the pinned msgs there's a good spreadsheet some good ppl made. Go through it. There're some solid builds there too

molten hearth
#

Got it

#

Thanks for the advice m8

vagrant wing
#

np

tender hollow
# molten hearth What about shotguns, like... Sweet Dreams?

Shotguns are awesome for holding down the doors. I run 50% Crit Chance 206% Crit Damage and I use a M1A CQB with boomerang and also a Rock n Roll. Drop your turret right in front of the door to slow the enemy down when the door opens and then go nuts with the Rock n Roll. Then if you need to shoot across the room use the M1A. I agree with @vagrant wing you’re probably getting little to no benefit from Ranger. Boomerang or In Sync are your best bet.

vagrant wing
#

isn't the Rock an Roll in the list i posted? 🙂

tender hollow
#

Probably, I hadn’t read down that far yet haha. @vagrant wing

molten hearth
#

It can be good to use tamperproof to keep the enemies in place

#

One guy kept throwing a tamperproof turret there

#

Also how do you get 206 chd

vagrant wing
molten hearth
#

fair

#

I only have 70

vagrant wing
#

honestly you'll be fine with something lower than that too

molten hearth
#

I mean no one starts with perfect gear

last scaffold
#

I dunno, I'd rather have a bit higher crit chance than crit damage since crit damage entirely depends on you actually critting

vagrant wing
#

That's not what i meant. Going pure chd has disadvantages too. Like everything in life too much of one thing can't be good for ya 🙂

tender hollow
# kindred moss hey there seems like there's a trick to speed up codes at fieser in IH, anyone k...

Yes. Definitely a speed run strategy. You need to be unbelievably fast on the codes and the boxes to do it, and even then it requires some finesse. If you’re team is already fast on Boss 2 it can save you between 30 and 60 seconds so it’s not a huge saving but definitely significant as you get closer to the top of the leaderboard. I’d suggest mastering the Boss 4 strategy first, if you’re using the old strategy there the time saving can be around 6 minutes.

molten hearth
vagrant wing
# molten hearth Also how do you get 206 chd

but to answer your question:
12 x 6 = 72 (from minor attr)
12 x 3 = 36 (mods)
15 (3 providance)
15 (Grupo)
17 (rifle minor attr)
10 (rifle mods)
20 (watch)
25 (confirmed by the mighty B3nd - thx!)
total: above 200

humble solar
#

35% is base

#

@tender hollow have you gotten below 7mins of morozova?

tender hollow
# molten hearth Also how do you get 206 chd

Some people use tamperproof, but next time you try it have a look at the difference if you just use a plain old turret. The door opens and they just stand there shooting your turret (if it’s placed in the right spot) which makes tamperproof pointless. Also frees up your chest talent for something more beneficial like Glass Cannon. As far as crit Damage goes 170% is fine you should have no trouble at all, mine is just higher because I like to fully min Max my builds to get the most possible damage out of them. Also I moved away from the traditional 3 piece providence setup because I’m on Xbox and I don’t land a lot of headshots, so I’m able to run all crit damage mods on my gear and my weapons and still maintain 50% Crit chance

molten hearth
#

Man I'm not even gonna try to use glass cannon

#

It sounds so frustrating to use

#

I run unbreakable and vigilance

humble solar
#

I run focus on just about every build except for 4th boss, some like PGC. Its preference based. But would highly reccomend getting away from unbreakable. Its put you in a bad habit of relying on the 2nd armor proc and can get deadly

tender hollow
humble solar
#

Spotter, focus, obliterate, dps talents

tender hollow
humble solar
#

Yea lol moro's a pain. And close a few times. Would've had it last run but the last heavy died in the train and key didnt spawn for like 20secs and ended up missin a turret phase.

tender hollow
# humble solar Spotter, focus, obliterate, dps talents

Spotter is an excellent choice since it doesn’t rely on you getting stacks to achieve the damage. Just put up a drone or put on the technician laser pointer and it’s an easy damage buff without the draw back of glass cannon @molten hearth. Focussed is still the best for damage, just as long as you don’t mind getting a sore left trigger finger from tapping it all the way through the raid 😂

flint iris
#

base is 25 chd not including watch

humble solar
#

Forgot to subtract watch, thanks @flint iris

tender hollow
humble solar
#

I have not see that, but thats division for ya

#

I hate the train wipe on the way to moro after williams. Do yall get that too?

tender hollow
#

I would highly recommend making a spare load out with glass cannon. Just use it for open world missions for a while and gets some practice with it. It isn’t really as hard to use as people think, just takes practice. But if you can learn to be comfortable using it you will be glad you did.

tender hollow
humble solar
#

Lol medkits, have not seen that one either.

fierce jungle
#

What's happening is that the train is saving it's progression from the last time you did it. so if the train takes 30s to get to the end, but you finish it in 20, then it'll take 10 seconds to get to the end next time you do it

humble solar
#

@fierce jungle thanks

tender hollow
#

Working as intended 😂

humble solar
#

So thats why sometimes it wipes at the door opening up and sometimes you make it half way through before the wipe

tender hollow
# humble solar Lol medkits, have not seen that one either.

Yeah nobody else has. It has something to do with my build setup and the medkit. We switched so that someone else was in the furnace and it was fine. But when I went back in happened again. Strange thing is it happened about 6 weeks ago and then it just stopped. Then 4 weeks later it happened again and my build was the same the whole time.

verbal cypress
#

For standard DPS builds, is it better to go 3 piece providence, 1 piece grupo, then contract gloves and fox prayer kneepads? (DPS weapons classic m1a + police m4 with dmg out of cover)
Should you swap 1 thing out to get, say a fenris piece for the assault rifle damage or 2 piece walker for weapon damage and damage to armour?

#

Also should talents be obliterate and perfect vigilance/vigilance?
Or is focus better to run?
Trying to make my DPS build less scrub like

humble solar
#

@verbal cypress focus is the highest dps talent for chest, but its a little different to use and most dont like it. And the 3pc prov is standard with foxes and contractors. Very good build even without focus, but imo a really good build is 2pc walker with contractors and foxes, perf focus, and either coyotes unless you have a teammate already proccing the far chc buff, then you can wear a grupo as last piece. Stats are around 30/175 with grupo 30/190. Heavily dependent on the far mask proc but with it you can easily hit 8.5 mil per shot minimum with m1a rifleman, if you are good with headshots

verbal cypress
#

@humble solar wouldn't the perfect focus chest piece be a waste since the gear sets first benefit is marksman rifle damage, which would be wasted?

#

Also would you be using crit damage mods, or going more for headshot damage mods?

humble solar
#

Chd

tender hollow
#

For a standard dps build, if your moving around a lot obliterate. If your not moving around a lot, then (perfect) focus, and stuff isn't at short range

verbal cypress
#

Alright. You would still go for a perfect focus piece even if youre not using a marksman rifle though, rather than using focus on something that has gear set bonuses you benefit from?

humble solar
#

Yea the mmr bonus is whatever, doesnt matter. And like ninja said, if you do move around a lot, focus is harder to use and keep procced. I personally use PGC when i dont use that build but to each their own. You may like obliterate better or spotter.

verbal cypress
#

Alright, thanks @humble solar @tender hollow

long basin
#

on the final boss part of Iron Horse ... morozova ... is anyone else experiencing persistent mortaring/rockets in the tunnel after each stage?

#

any solution to avoid it?

uneven garden
#

It’s been like that since a few weeks ago

long basin
#

since tu12?

humble solar
#

@long basin yes. Some helpful tips to avoid some of them are to throw out decoys and wait to go into the tunnel when the barrage sounds off. The drum beat.

long basin
kindred moss
#

It’s been a pain lately, that’s our only wipe issue, the tank goes down due to mortars staggering him out of the cave and everyone dies

#

It’s just luck

#

Trying to find a solid way to avoid it but it’s hard

molten hearth
#

do secondaries really matter in raids

quasi urchin
tawdry island
#

yes

lyric scaffold
#

anyone doing the raids? i need the exotics valibadea86 pc ubiconnect

smoky tapir
hardy shell
verbal mist
#

I use sawyers on ih boss 4

#

They do glitch sometimes though and you get staggered . But it’s s blue and when I door camp I really like that extra damage

#

Turn your vibration off your controller if you’re ps4 or Xbox . It helps a bunch in explosions

hardy shell
#

one more:when morozola calls in the second airstrike,how do you hide from it when the small cliff thingy is covered in electrics?

#

im still new to this thing

verbal mist
#

You go in when it’s not electric . Stand at the sand bags

#

I always tell clan mates to stand at fuck and off on the signs lol

hardy shell
#

but how?even when the cannon fires the place is still covered?

verbal mist
#

Shouldn’t

#

Once you shoot her down to siren it should stop

hardy shell
#

so i just knock her over?

verbal mist
#

No you damage her . It will sound a siren then run to back

#

There’s multiple things need to happen . Rockets, key , damage to morozova

smoky tapir
#

to stop the shocky bits in the cave, you MUST kill the bullet/shell first

hardy shell
smoky tapir
#

you DO NOT damage her until the bullet/shell is destroyed with rockets

#

the one thats being loaded

hardy shell
#

i have to shoot the shells first before dps-ing her?

smoky tapir
#

the "wipe" phase happens when she's lost 3 bars of armor, down to 4 bars of armor and when all the armor is gone

#

No damage should be ever done to morozova until the cannon shell has been destoryed (if you dont know how it works)

vagrant wing
#

"ever" is a strong word 🙂

smoky tapir
#

i edited it 😛

#

since the right strat is get her within a bar of pushing but usually the person handling the interuppts can mostly do that

hardy shell
#

just 1 more:when the boss is going to do that rocket from the sky,and youre the target,how do you stop it?

vagrant wing
#

explosive stagger of any kind

hardy shell
#

just stagger her?

#

menacing scorpio sound in the distance

vagrant wing
#

explosive stagger

smoky tapir
#

any explosive damage will stagger her (some CC effects as well)

#

first phase you can technically use grenades to stop it but it gets faster as the fight goes on. explosve sticky can work, best is the ravaneous since its very easy to proc the explosive effect

grand bramble
#

This is where the ravenous shines to stagger her.

pure leaf
#

im ready for a iron horse raid but i dont have a mic on xbox hit me up

mellow pike
wraith plaza
jovial wyvern
#

I need a gang for raids. I'm yet to complete iron horse despite playing the game for many hours.

smoky tapir
#

#lfg-raid-ps4, use that chat, not general raid one

jovial wyvern
#

PS4 BTW or maybe some kind person can drop me boulder chest and backpack do let me know

thorny parrot
#

Is the bighorn viable for raids with dps builds? Seems like it has potential but I don't see anyone else running it, maybe due to recoil pattern, or can't keep consistent headshots? Idk what do you guys thing?

icy hull
#

yes its viable (nearly everything is). Viable = doable.

steel basalt
#

if youve completed a raid, do you still get rewards from the bosses like loot drops?

smoky tapir
#

any bosses you have NOT yet killed will still give thier first loot kill table, ones you have killed prior will give just normal boss drop loots (ie no raid exlusive stuff)

steel basalt
#

so i cant go back and try to get the gear i am missing for the project....

thorny parrot
#

@icy hull Ahh gotcha, guess I'll have to try it out and see how it performs, base damage alone without proccing semi auto talent seems like it hits hard so I'll see

steel basalt
#

after completing it for the week...

smoky tapir
#

until the reset no

steel basalt
#

fuck

#

thank you

smoky tapir
#

the regulus parts are on the first kill loot table only

#

except for the ingot which is in th ebox

steel basalt
#

wait so....i can farm IH for foundry and FI?

#

sorry a bit confused

smoky tapir
#

you can, the chest and Back can ONLY drop on the first kill table. but the end box can also drop them on each open

steel basalt
#

ahhh ok

#

unfortunately those are the only pcs iam missing...

#

thank you again

smoky tapir
#

you could also run a fresh group again and ask if anyone doesn't mind sharing

#

some dont mind sharring the chest/back drops

steel basalt
#

ehh i may try that

#

id like to get these projects done

smoky tapir
#

its how i got 2 of mine originally as people are just looking for the ravaneous

steel basalt
#

ah

cerulean radish
#

Is there a recommended SHD level for the raids or is the damage negligible?

vagrant wing
#

Nope. You can raid at any lvl. Just make sure you have a good build or two

cerulean radish
#

Sounds good. Should probably look up strats. Is it worth it to do Discovery beforehand?

flint iris
#

Not really

tender hollow
flint iris
#

What?

tender hollow
#

tony stark had enough iron

#

he needs water

humble solar
#

🤔

wraith plaza
steel basalt
#

oh didnt know that

hearty ocean
#

do you get foundry chest and backpack blueprint from discovery?

thorny parrot
#

No

hearty ocean
#

okay ty

flint iris
#

I like your profile pic taste

hearty ocean
#

LOL

green spruce
#

wait a minute

#

clones?

#

ben part 2?

flint iris
#

#nonitrogang

hearty ocean
#

#nirtogang

undone spoke
#

Anyone know if you can open DH raid box multiple times a week?

#

If you have enough keys

dreamy whale
#

Last boss drops key. Beat him 5 times you have 5 keys.

Correct me if I’m wrong but I’m 90% sure

flint iris
#

As long as you have enough you can open the box

undone spoke
#

ok

toxic orchid
#

okay i feel this is a silly question, my team has been getting hit with mortars way to much during boss 4 when we are waiting, we dont go in until after the wipe sirens go off or just before they land, and we always getting hit with 2 mortars... T.T

velvet wave
#

I'm looking for a raid group to join. can someone assist?

crude sleet
#

Lfg raid

valid marlin
hearty ocean
#

@toxic orchid you need to get rid of the tanks that controlling the panels

#

or your team just a bit slow on doing stuffs

quasi urchin
#

how people actually start from the last boss in dark hours ?

toxic orchid
#

tanks controlling the panels on boss 4 for ih?

cerulean radish
#

Should I know what RV means before raiding?

warm wren
#

RV means Raid Voice. It'll be followed by a number, which correlates to the channel the raid will take place in/is taking place in.

#

Similarly, GV means Group Voice, with the same number designation scheme.

cerulean radish
#

Ah the channel. Thanks.

slender kite
#

can anyone recommend a IH raid guide thanks

vast musk
#

add Lunar_NA 🙂

muted horizon
#

I'm looking to try out my first IH, any suggestions on a first-timers build?

acoustic kraken
#

WHERE CAN I FIND SNAKE DEN?

#

caps sorry

muted horizon
#

this is raid-discussion.

acoustic kraken
#

oh damn, sorry

slate crypt
#

@muted horizon I would recommend just a standard DPS build if it's your first time

muted horizon
#

Oh so same as DH then, anything special I need to bring with it?

slate crypt
#

Depends on who you run with I would make sure to have a coyotes mask on hand in case they want you to run one.

muted horizon
#

oh easy then, already part of my default DPS
cheers for the info, glad it's not a Technician situation like in DH.

slate crypt
#

No problem

scenic lynx
#

Hi, Anyone doing / done / seen Raid (or majority of) using Skills? Just curious ... Thx

tawdry widget
#

You're asking about 1 person in the team doing the full run on a skill build and by skill build you mean a damage skill build? Or you're asking about 8 people on skill builds?

#

If I recall correctly, DH was done with 8 people on skills before TU8, think there was video of that run, but I can't find it buried in Youtube. Not sure if anyone tried IH.

#

I can see DH being easily doable up until Razorback, I'm not sure if a sniper turret or just a regular turret would work there. Either way, it'll probably be a slow run, all and all.

#

On IH, it should also be doable with 8 people on skills, should also be a slow run and I'm not sure how "small" details, like the weak points to move the crucible on second boss, or the weakpoints on the molten iron and turrets on the third boss, are easily dealt with, with skills. Maybe with whatever skill is used for those Razorback weakpoints on DH.

#

If you were asking about 1 person doing the whole raid on a skill build (and that skill build isn't a healer), yeah should be easily doable, but that person will probably be carried by the other 7. There are places where a demo build, for example, can shine spawn camping doors, but probably not everywhere.

#

Especially when the time comes to kill the bosses themselves.

#

@scenic lynx ^^^

scenic lynx
#

Thanks for the FDBK. Yes, was thinking more a single person doing skills dmg, as opposed to healing. Maybe CC... we are building a team, trying new stuff, but will be doing it in hardcore mode (permadeath). Talk rose about the value of having one do CC and 'other' skill bits.

uneven garden
#

We tried skill dmg build on IH, wiped at the very last second because striker drone killed morozova too early

#

With capacitor weakpoint on boss 2 is fine, just the lava on the third boss need 4-5 shooting at the same time

viscid fossil
#

we did IH skill @ 56 min, it was fun

last cipher
#

what do u need to do a raid

#

gear wise or whatever

#

I just got into the game and want to check them out

tawdry widget
#

@scenic lynx pre-TU8 the hardcore raid composition was 8 people with aces & eights so they kept buffing each other. I'd probably try to figure out a composition in this spirit. especially since in hardcore people don't really farm that much

hardy shell
#

F

tender hollow
#

In one IH run on the last boss, in the 2nd and 3rd phase, we destroyed the 4 mortar canons before going into the tunnel, and both times did not get bombarded by mortars in the tunnel.

I wasn't really paying attention, as I was on dps, but the guy leading the raid said something like we shoot a single missile at each mortar first, then destroy each one. Has anyone used this tactic?

tender hollow
#

It is the mortar in the train which is shooting at the players going in the tunnel. If mortars are destroyed you will not get hit, no matter auf its 1st 3rd or whatever Phase.

Never heard of the single rocket to each mortar tactics, if it works it will find its way into lfg group runs i'm pretty sure

tender hollow
#

^ it most probably wont, as you spend maybe 3-5 minutes extra on the 2nd and 3rd phase, but maybe if you have wiped 2 times already due to mortars might be worth trying

and your right @tender hollow, as we never get mortars in the first phase in the tunnel

vagrant wing
tender hollow
#

after the red shell was destroyed. I'm pretty sure the guy said shoot only one missile at each mortar first left to right.

vagrant wing
#

Make no sense to me then. You can spare 2-3 rockets to shoot the mortars while the shell still up and destroy it in time if everybody use the rockets as soon as they drop.
As it's stands once the shell has been destroyed i see no reason for it unless you were doing it so that everyone will DPS the moratrs afterwards. With that said, i personally think that, shooting 4 rockets on 2 mortars to destroy them completely and DPS the last will prolly be better but honestly i never tried it

tender hollow
#

Thanks @vagrant wing. Maybe they shot one missile then dpsed the mortars to destroy each one. It was definitely totally different from what we normally do.

undone spoke
#

When do raid keys reset?

smoky tapir
#

tuesdays

lost maple
#

question.. dark hours overcharge and pulse doesnt work anymore?

undone spoke
#

no

tawdry widget
#

It works, it just doesn't stack.

#

Meaning, instead of having 15% more damage times 8 players (120% more in total), now you can only have 15%, no matter if only 1 or all 8 use pulse when it's overcharged.

slate crypt
#

Is it still a viable way to deal with the drones?

tawdry widget
#

Don't need overcharge to deal with drones. 4x hardwire, 1x wyvern with glasscanon and another yellow core of your choice.

slate crypt
#

Ok thanks

tawdry widget
#

Skill damage rolled on all pieces plus the glass cannon, it's enough. Don't forget to use a secondary skill to reset the jammer pulse and to use hardwire's backpack so the hw cooldown goes down from 20s to 10s.

slate crypt
#

Will do

kindred moss
#

@slate crypt you can even roll the last piece on a red and use capacitor to be able to deal some dps too with your weapon

#

you'll need technician to have tier 6 pulse anyway

slate crypt
#

I'll give that a shot next time I run it. Thanks for the tips

tawdry widget
#

Probably better to stick with survivalist, just for the crossbow

#

But it depends on the team, of course.

kindred moss
#

yeah, i use technician and drop the grenade it's all about preference 🙂

#

i really love capacitor and i try to use it on skill builds that's why i changed my hw build for razorback

tawdry widget
#

Personally, if I'm on circles, it's either survivalist or demolitionist. Demo round explodes instantly, so much quicker than missed grenades...

#

You can, however, use the TDI Kard and keep Survivalist, just can't forget to have it in your hand when using jammer.

kindred moss
#

need to get back doing dh sometimes, we were abusing ih for weeks now

#

still have to test ravenous with optimist d50 on weakpoints, looks promising

tawdry widget
#

it's quite good

#

1 tap d50, switch to an AR and finish the weakpoint, all in a matter of seconds, alone

flint iris
#

With strikers?

tawdry widget
#

not a fan of striker, but I guess that can make it even faster

flint iris
#

Ah ok

tawdry widget
#

3x providence, 1x sombra, 1x fox, 1x gunslinger, all to chc/chd

flint iris
#

Yeah makes sense

#

Ravenous and optimist d50

tawdry widget
#

I have one with with In-Sync

#

think that's at least in theory better

flint iris
#

In sync should work good as well

#

But I just empty until 1 bullet is left in the d50

kindred moss
#

on a regulus build with gunslinger its better to spec into headshot or crit dmg? i run it with sacrifice, gunslinger punch drunk prov backpack with vigilance, prov gloves and fox

#

to maximize the regulus bang

tawdry widget
#

headshot

#

for max headshot damage, it should be 1x sacrifice, 1x punch drunk, 1x airaldi backpack, 1x airaldi gloves, 1x fox, 1x gunslinger

#

that gives the highest combination of headshot from bonuses

lusty bobcat
#

question for just general raid practices. do people find it helpful for someone to be using the coyote mask during a raid? or would you rather everyone just run a normal full DPS build?

muted horizon
#

Coyotes can easily fit into a normal red DPS quite easily.

lusty bobcat
#

yea, it's what i normally use in mine. but it keeps me from using the 3pc providence to have it.

muted horizon
#

What's your build without it?

lusty bobcat
#

3pc providence - fox prayer - GS gloves - fenris chest

#

i run an AR build

#

60%crit - 151% crit dmg - 140% weapon damage

muted horizon
#

Ah, so yeah on a full red build, Fenris's 10% AR damage is actually closer to 3%, I'd honestly think about just swapping it out.

#

it's a team-wide buff, and even if someone else has it on, the buffs don't stack but you can each proc a different one.

lusty bobcat
#

yea, thats why i use it currently. bring a little utility in the full dps build. As far as replacing fenris, maybe swapping to a ceska chest would be better? 10% crit

#

I dunno. I've only been raiding and really trying to max a full red build out for like a month maybe? still having to math stuff out lol

muted horizon
#

Not a big deal, there's actually a really good resource over in build-advice > pinned message > hub, the "full meta jacket" build.

lusty bobcat
#

ahh i see, yea thats my build now, just a fenris chest instead of a providence

fiery sphinx
#

Hi everyone, i want to know if chest from "Future Initiative" only drop on "normal" raid?, my main build is healing, i like play that role but i need that part to use the gloves from BT. There is not normal Raid MM right?. Sorry for bad english

thorny parrot
#

Yes, the Foundry Bulwark and Future Initiative chest and backpack are locked behind Iron Horse Raid on Normal difficulty.

vagrant wing
tight spoke
#

Hey everyone, can anybody DM me a picture of the loadout for a raid tank build?

tawdry widget
#

@tight spoke which boss?

#

2nd in IH needs burn resistance, 4th in IH is better with explosive resistance

smoky tapir
#

its not 100% required for burn resist for 2nd boss however

#

and note that the shield isn't affected by exp resist either

#

ideally you want vanguard as your chest to give the group the blue armor buff. Back has otpions between protector/galvanize (preferred)

tight spoke
#

Hmm, good question. As you've probably noticed by my question I'm new to raiding. What's a like a good base setup I guess that I can expand upon with these resistances?

Currently for regular missions I have like a shield deflector build. Which is 4 piece foundry, a belstone chest with intimidate & memento.
With the technician hive to help the shield and the deflector shield. All of this is mostly armor core and skill dmg secondaries for the deflecting.

I wouldn't take this into the raid off course, more looking for how I can adapt this into a full tank build that's serious rather than a deflect to mess around with build

smoky tapir
#

i personally run 4pc FB as its "THE" shield set but a TB tank does provide a lot of utility

#

and nothing in IH requiresa full super tank "i take all damage rawr" but you can take a lot of heat with an FB tank and have no survivability issues

#

do note that if you DO play tank in IH, it does require more knowledge about fights then being DPS since theres a lot to do as a tank

lusty bobcat
#

@vagrant wing Yea, currently i'll be keeping my Fenris set until i can get a usable Providence chest piece. I've used the Memento for so long in other content, I think i really hurt myself by not focusing on picking up a good alternate when i swap out for Coyote for brand set bonuses. Memento is so good, just not in raids i've found out.

thorny parrot
#

@smoky tapir my tank build has vanguard and 4 piece foundry, i run memento for extra cores and trophys (mainly another skill tier for artificer) would i be better running something like belstone with protector for the ih raid?

smoky tapir
#

galvanize or protector are both technically better

thorny parrot
#

Nevermind i hear its not as good in raids with memento

#

Ok thanks

smoky tapir
#

i personally prefer galvanize since you control the buff vs protector its the enemies that control it

lusty bobcat
#

The problem with Memento in raids, is you dont get a trophy unless you get the kill. If you're running it in a tank build, you'll be hard pressed to get the killing hit on enemies against 6-7 people in full red dps builds.

uneven garden
#

if you run stagger may be more regen as you will face tank and prep morozova. Key tank doesn’t really matter as long as you have 6 tier shield you can run 2red to help with a little dmg

verbal mist
#

made a galvanize tank. Its fun .

wraith plaza
thorny parrot
#

Ah cool, though I'll probably run my Belstone Armory backpack with Protector instead

kindred moss
#

hunter with memento and the mop is nice in front of the doors at morozova.

#

youll get tons of stacks and basically you dont let them out the doors if your build is min maxed

#

when medics starts to spawn you switch to scorpio

#

the mop is nice cos of armor on kill, keeps you up and running 100%

jagged pebble
#

Whats mop? @kindred moss

tawdry island
#

Named Six12 Shotgun

tender hollow
#

Wanna do my first DH soon and advice on what builds is it pure dps ?got a few different builds

thorny parrot
#

For Dark Hours as a newbie, go in with a full red DPS build. If 1 or 2 people are running coyotes mask, you can have around 45%-50% Critical Hit Chance and 150%%+ Critical Hit Damage from what I hear. Otherwise try and get as much CHC and CHD possible. For chest talent, I see people running Glass Cannon, Obliterate, and Unbreakable. Backpack talent I see most being Vigilance and Composure. I am still new with raids but this is what I have been told and seen. Anyone else can feel free and correct me if I'm wrong about anything, but Dark Hours is mainly a DPS check raid.

flint iris
#

Seems fine ^

thorny parrot
#

Cool, I'm no expert at raids, still learning the ropes on Iron Horse and just recently learned Dark Hours. I personally like running my Bighorn DPS build with braced and composure, but run coyotes and a different build if needed for team buff

#

I know braced ain't DPS compared to obliterate or glass cannon but it does allow more sustained, consistent dps since you are landing your shots, therefore I think it is a dps talent. It's fun running it with boomer since headshots are required when hes down and thats where bighorn shines👌

vagrant wing
#

It's fun running it with boomer since headshots are required
that's not true at all, sorry

tender hollow
#

Thats good as I've just got the bighorn

atomic nova
#

Tbh if you roll up to an LFG raid on Xbox with braced and a Big Horn, as bad as it is you will most likely be kicked

#

But idk how it goes on PS4

smoky tapir
#

use #lfg-raid-ps4

jovial wyvern
#

How hard to get great stuff from raid? I like foundry balwick and ongoing directive stuff. Seems they've put some of the best pieces there.

icy hull
#

only raid exclusives are the Exotics, and Foundry and FI chest and backpack. all other drops are in the world normal Target loot.

verbal mist
#

Not being negative but other than the raid exclusives the gear is normally trash from raids .

flint iris
#

normally

#

ive gotten some very good shit from raids

#

but those don't come close to the stuff ive dismantled or sold

verbal mist
#

Yeah I guess I’ve kept a few items but very few

#

@flint iris we got to 37 mins last night ih woot woot . Gonna try some practice strats tonight

flint iris
#

oo damn nice

oblique cedar
#

Can the raid take 5-4 hours because if yes I need to clear some space in my schedule

icy hull
#

Yes and no. Depends entirely on your groups ability to clear it. Can take ~30m or a few hours.

slate crypt
#

Also depends on the experience of the group

hardy shell
#

From discovery lol

ivory rampart
#

Any written guide for IH?

vagrant wing
alpine sequoia
olive rain
#

I have a question I am looking to finish the regulus project all I need is the peaces from the bosses from IH but I was doing the last boss before I started a fresh IH to get my peaces but when I did that the peaces didnt drop why is this?

warm wren
#

its gotta be your first clear of the week

#

the regulus pieces wont drop if you've already completed IH that week

true moat
#

@olive rain fresh run every Tuesday making it a sure drop of bits

olive rain
#

I wonder why this is the way it is?

smoky tapir
#

its only on the first kill drop table, just like the chest/back pieces of FI/FB are

jovial wyvern
#

How hard is raid on normal for a player who's average at best (me) but with a team with some very good players and some experienced ones plus maybe a few newbies too?

smoky tapir
#

IH or DH

#

DH, its straightforward and taking a couple of new people along doesn't hurt to much. IH its a bit different as a lot of people get jobs to do and can be quite hard for newer players.

trim heron
#

Anyone looking for 1 extra person for a raid

icy hull
gloomy mango
#

Can you go into the raid with the whole group blind and still do it or is it bullshit like Destiny?

smoky tapir
#

DH, maybe, but IH no

normal mirage
#

the entire group can't be blind when doing any raids in div2

smoky tapir
#

at least not if you want to clear it in a reasonable amount of time

#

it took the world first clears about what 8-9 hours if i recall

gloomy mango
#

So bullshit like Destiny, got it

normal mirage
#

IH is more mechanic intensive than DH but I would read up a bit / youtube the basic mechanics at least

smoky tapir
#

i mean every RAID in any game is basically like that

#

else it wouldn't be a raid

normal mirage
#

^

smoky tapir
#

games wont handhold you thru the harder content

gloomy mango
#

One thing is difficulty, Destiny moon logic is way beyond that

alpine sequoia
crisp lintel
#

whats a good build to bring to dh? I havent done the raid since the new york expansion

ivory rampart
#

@warm wren can you please create a channel for level 30 raid players ?

tender hollow
mortal coral
#

sorry :(

tender hollow
# crisp lintel whats a good build to bring to dh? I havent done the raid since the new york exp...

The basic Dark Hours Raid build is 3 Providence, 1 Grupo, Contractors Gloves & Fox’s Prayer knees. All red with 50% Crit Chance and as much Crit Damage as you can get. Fully min maxed builds will normally have just over 200% Crit damage but it isn’t essential to be that high just try to be over 150%. Vigilance on the back pack. Most people run Glass Cannon on the chest but if you’re new to the raid then you can try something else like Focused or Spotter, anything that gives a damage boost. And definitely not Unbreakable, that’s for sweaty PVP builds 😂

lost maple
#

question. smg build good for raid? like (hunter fury)

warm wren
#

In certain parts of iron horse you can use it, but its not the top choice.

lusty bobcat
#

I don't like glass cannon for DH. Prefer unbreakable, or Obliterate. Glass cannon you get dropped when a sheet of paper blows in your direction

icy hull
#

yup Unbreakable very nice for raids too.

warm wren
#

If its your first time in a raid, unbreakable is really nice

lusty bobcat
#

I still run it, just to add a little survivability to the full red build incase i randomly get hit by something

tawdry widget
#

You can run Unbreakable, yet just be aware that's damage you're not doing and someone else is compensating for it. If you're getting dropped when a sheet of paper blows in your direction, take cover when said sheet of paper comes closer. With Glass Cannon, at least you can kill the sheet of paper faster.

#

😉

smoky tapir
#

thing is though the raid bosses are in general NOT DPS races. A lot of the fights wipe cause of survivability issues players have.

tawdry widget
#

Grey, Williams and Razorback beg to differ. The longer you drag those fights, worse.

#

Williams fails most of the time precisely for lack of DPS. Does it have to be Glass Cannon? No. But Unbreakable helps no one.

smoky tapir
#

grey is not even close to a dps race. he seems that way but hes not if you actually know how the mechanics work. if theres ANY shield guys up, he takes reduced damage but people tunnel on him all the time and thats how teh blue armor is gained

#

williams is all about accuracy, less his pack is up, the less he heals and the pack doesn't have that much life.

#

razorback has soft cap limits to the amoutn of damage you can do to it

#

and the fight doesn't get harder the longer it goes, its the 2 steps in difficulty. 100-50% and 50-0%

tawdry widget
#

And with lack of dps, it sometimes feels like the weakpoints also have some sort of soft cap.

smoky tapir
#

the 2 main weakpoints do have a 50% health cap and the 4 openable weakpoints have any damage carried over betwween phases

#

and losing a player is a potential 12.5% dps drop. having a talent say obliterate vs unbreakable makes up <1% of the raids dps

tawdry widget
#

I know. I'm saying that with lack of DPS, the two front or back weakpoints aren't being destroyed in one phase, to open the main front or back weakpoint. Mainly due to lack of dps.

smoky tapir
#

but any damage carries over so dps doesn't matter

#

and the main cause of wipes on that isn't due to lack of dps, its lack of awareness and survability.

tawdry widget
#

Gotcha, do 8 phases instead of 4 because it always carries over. Sounds good. 👍

smoky tapir
#

Dead dps does 0 dps, dps with survivability does at least 11% of a raids dps vs a full 12.5 in full damage.

tawdry widget
#

You're taking the assumption that someone with a DPS talent on the chest is going to die. That's precisely my point, just because you have a DPS talent you can still stay alive, doing DPS, with or without cover. In other words knowing how to play the game.

smoky tapir
#

when you see a raid wipe, why did the raid wipe. DId 1 or 2 people die and you get into a rez phase. IF so thats not a dps issue, its a survivability issue. If there were hard berserk timers and such, then yes dps then needs to be considered

tawdry widget
#

And Unbreakable solves that, from your perspective?

smoky tapir
#

unbreakable helps survivability, if unbreakable procs just once, thats basically a revive saved

tawdry widget
#

It's easier to kill them before they kill you.

#

How so?

#

Unbreakable procs once your armour is broken, it's not insta death.

smoky tapir
#

a lot of times, it leads to the death after armor is gone, health gate isn't always active

tawdry widget
#

A lot of the times, you still get killed after Unbreakable is on cooldown.

#

What will it be then?

#

Crutches or no crutches?

smoky tapir
#

if just 1 person dies in a fight, the benefit you get from having full on dps over say unbreakable is gone since 1) you have someone doing 0 dps due to dead, 2) you have a 2nd person prob also not doing dps now as they have to revive them or needing to use a revive hive charge

tawdry widget
#

Knowing how to position yourself and learning the spawn points or just thinking "I have Unbreakable, I got this"?

#

And? Aren't you meant to use revive hives with other people too?

smoky tapir
#

i mean sure, if you know how to position and such, then go ahead and use full dps

tawdry widget
#

It's a team effort.

smoky tapir
#

unbreakable provides that security blanket without impacting the raids dps by "that" much. like i stated, its about 1% per person

tawdry widget
#

That's my whole point. Unbreakable is a crutch talent. Learn how to play the game, learn spawn points, learn positioning, know when to fall back. Sometimes you'll die, that's part of the game and the learning experience, but at least do it with full DPS, not putting your lack of DPS on other's peoples shoulders.

smoky tapir
#

and at times, people do make a mistake and die, even the best of us

warm wren
#

I'd say use unbreakable to learn the spawns, then switch to GC/PGC.

tawdry widget
#

Yes. This is a game. It's not a life changing experience to die in a game.

smoky tapir
#

but im mainly saying, the raid bosses are not dps races, 99% of wipes are caused by someone dying and they starting a death train to get that person back up

tawdry widget
#

@warm wren that sounds good in theory, rarely happens in practice. Like any crutch, people will get used to it and since it worked before, with other people compensating for you, it will continue to work like that. Yet, you're not pulling your weight.

warm wren
#

Ah, yes. People compensating for that 1% of damage you arent doing to a healthgated boss.

tawdry widget
#

Ok. I'll explain it in another way. 8 people in DH, 7 have DPS talents on their chest, 1 have Unbreakable. Who's the odd one out?

#

Or the other way around, 7 have Unbreakable, 1 has a DPS. Who's the odd one out?

#

Sure, 8 people Unbreakable, let's do it. 7 DPS, 1 Unbreakable, doesn't sound too good.

smoky tapir
#

and when 1 of those with a dps talent dies that could of been prevented due to unbreakable proc and the fight ends in awhipe

#

difference beteeen a raid group with 8 unbreakable and 8 dps talents i like i stated, prob about 8% dps assuming everyone was equal.

tawdry widget
#

Again, it's Unbreakable that's going to fix it? My experience tells me otherwise.

warm wren
#

Glass cannon is oftentimes too much extra damage for people to handle, and the adds in the raids hit pretty hard. So if you can handle that extra damage taken, awesome. If you cant, thats cool too.

smoky tapir
#

and really raid gruops not including an FI healer is just wasted potential as well but thats another can of worms

tawdry widget
#

There are more talents beside Glass Cannon, as there are more talents beside Unbreakable.

#

FI healer in Iron Horse, agreed. FI healer in DH, while it also makes sense from a buff perspective, it's a role often taken by a lazy player that wants to be carried and do nothing. Unless you're talking about a full red FI, with Scorpio and Opportunistic. Which is a role I haven't seen much of, a true support in the spirit of the pre TU8 Tip of the Spear.

smoky tapir
#

FI on 1 player gives more dps then if that 1 player played as dps.

tawdry widget
#

I know the math.

smoky tapir
#

sometimes its all about being the buff boy

tawdry widget
#

Not disagreeing. Only refuting that on DH, since you don't really need heals, that build shouldn't be a classic all yellow FI.

#

It can be a full red, you do damage, you buff damage.

#

And for that you need someone that farmed that build, didn't just go in to the group and said "dibs, I'll be healer, take me to the last boss".

smoky tapir
#

true, granted ill still take a lazy fi over another dps anyday as long as teh fi is built right

tawdry widget
#

As you might've already guessed, I'm not a fan of lazy people 😉

smoky tapir
#

i get ya and i know more dps is good but i'll also take survivabiity anyday. Never know when you'll be "THAT" guy that caused the raid wipe

tawdry widget
#

Every build and every role, has their kinks and needs to be learnt how to be played. People that roll tank or healer like it's something easier to do doesn't sound good to me.

smoky tapir
#

unbreakable also does help protect you from "other" peoples mistakes like morozova's attack

#

best player in teh game with PGC and not taking any damage. othe rplayer makes mistake and misses interuppt, you dead

tawdry widget
#

Think you've already answered the real issue with that. Then the problem isn't the game, it's people you're playing with. You're not protecting yourself from the NPCs, you're protecting yourself from other people's NPCs that are leaking from somewhere, or the boss that wasn't staggered, etc. In essence you don't trust the people you're playing with. And I get that. It's hard do trust an LFG group you don't know. But in a perfect scenario, with a team that you know and trust, Unbreakable should be your last option.

smoky tapir
#

but ill always say it to any new player, unbreakable or survivability first. staying alive helps you learn the fights, your not "that guy" right away dies. As you gain experience, you can transistion to more full dps but staying with unbreakable/etc does not make much of a differnce in terms of full raid dps numbers

tawdry widget
#

Because in a perfect scenario, I'm not keeping tabs on who did what wrong and cause the wipe, because I know that person will learn from that mistake.

#

That's also true for a new player. Ok, you messed up here? No worries, next time try this. Easy.

smoky tapir
#

until theres a fight wher you have 3 mins to kill the boss or its gg and the timer is tight, on then will i fully advocate that that extra 7-10% raid dps actually matters

tawdry widget
#

My point isn't the X amount of damage. My point is: are we all in this together or not?

#

Unbreakable tells me someone isn't. Whatever "this" is. And yes, this is still just a game, etc.

#

Everyone makes mistakes, everyone can cause a wipe, everyone can die. And everyone can learn from all that... with a DPS talent on their chest.

smoky tapir
#

makes mistakes yes but if a wipe is a direct cause of it, your still wasting peoples time being the direct cause of a death when it "could of" been prevented running survivability

tawdry widget
#

Again, I'm not keeping tabs as long as everyone is up for learning. Myself included.

#

If you go into a raid and it's agreed that everyone runs Unbreakable, I agree with that statement. If that agreement isn't made, then I take that a DPS chest talent is the norm and if you're not running it you're the odd one out.

smoky tapir
#

is what it is then but i will always take an unbreakable person over a dps talent person if i was picking randoms

tawdry widget
#

¯_(ツ)_/¯

smoky tapir
#

since there are no dps checks yet

#

and often times too, ill use B&L as an example, too much dps can cause issues there if it snot balanced. more dps makes the margin more narrow then having less dps

tawdry widget
#

Might as well start taking rainbows and talents that don't synergise. I bet those people can also stay alive. Can't kill anything, but they'll stay alive. And even be the last ones to die if there's a wipe.

icy hull
#

........ that's not even comparable..

tawdry widget
#

If survivability is better than dps, then it's exactly that.

icy hull
#

thats not how it works.....

lusty bobcat
#

I run obliterate most of the time, i just dont like the increased damage taken. However i also run Coyote mask to buff up everyone elses damage. But even with unbreakable, i'm sitting at 48-50% crit and like 190ish crit damage, before coyote buffs, i wouldn't say that anyone is having to carry my dps through a raid, especially in DH.

tender hollow
#

I rarely now, but if a team has borderline dps and are dropping like flies, I will wear unbreakable.

But a lot of times, if you wipe boss 3 or 4 IH, when you look at who is dying frequently, that person is wearing glass canon.

alpine sequoia
#

Glass cannon doesnt necessarily mean that's what's the root of the problem, it also falls on skill, I almost exclusively raid with full red glass cannon and 99% of the time its other people going down first because mobs overwhelm them or they cant keep up with the mechanics

oblique cedar
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Hey I was wondering if the raid operation iron horse is only for dlc holder or people with out the dlc can do this raid?

icy hull
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It's for both

vocal delta
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for me as a example, i often use glass cannon However. when i saw the ad control of our team isnt enough, I will change back to unbreakable to prevent huge arrmor lost.

tender hollow
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^ exactly. if your running with a good team, then you know your teamsmates will deal with their spawn and you only need to deal with your own spawn. if your not, then ads will hit you from the sides and back.

uneven garden
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IMO the two adds ppl on morozova better not run GC. Their job is to keep adds from running everywhere not putting out dmg

#

rockets can run GC if need to spawn keys quick but that’s for speed run

keen pumice
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Run focus not glass cannon.

tender hollow
tender hollow
tender hollow
azure ruin
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imo, dps builds should use focus or GC. if you aren't comfortable with GC, maybe obliterate. These talents give you some value instead of unbreakable which doesn't give you any dmg from talent. Use crusader shield..it will give you that unbreakable-like talent on the top of your choice of dps talent you are running underneath.. and best part is, its on 20 sec cooldown ( if your shield is destroyed ) whereas unbreakable procs only once a minute.. also as long as your shield is alive, your vigilance talent will stay active.. and shield has almost double health than your 700k armor on full red build

kindred moss
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I agree on the “kill them before they kill you or overwhelm the group” glass cannon is good but not for everyone. Focus is better but also here not for everyone. Both talents needs some skill by the player to adapt to them, either by using crusader and shoot around covers to minimize the exposure (not that it’s always possible though) or learning to continuously go in and out of scoped aim to keep focus up... usually when some ppl in my groups are struggling to keep up with gc I suggest them either spotter with technician pointer or obliterate, I love spotter since it’s instant always up damage with no drawbacks. Also, sometimes raid group fails because they don’t take two mins to properly set up passive buffs in the group or either support builds and pieces (coyote, opportunistic a tp tank or damage build, future initiative, overwatch and so on) there are a lot of ways to get a nice damage out of a group without relying on glass cannon. That’s my 2c btw

tender hollow
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Couldn’t agree more. Taking the time to put a Demolitionist in each sub group, a Firewall within 10m of the boss and a status effect on the boss when you have a Survivalist in your team makes a massive difference. When you combine those damage buffs with Overwatch, Future Initiative, Opportunistic and True Patriot you’re getting nearly 90% more damage. Obviously sometimes it’s difficult to run all of these at once, but it’s worth trying to see if you can fit them in. Personally I switch between Glass Cannon and Focused when I’m on DPS depending on the situation. Focused is not so good when running through the train yard in Iron Horse on the way to boss because of how quickly you move, so I run Glass Canon. Killing adds on boss 2 though is a great place for Focused because you’re static a lot of the time.

steady radish
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Can I get the eagle bearer on discovery mode or do i need to do normal mode?

tawdry island
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EB only in normal mode.

verbal mist
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I run spotter most raids

#

Run unbreakable on boss 2 because I’m running a side solo . I’ve tried other talents and seem to die by getting shot in back

hardy shell
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Spotter only gives 18% damage right?

#

Why pick that over obliterate,which gives you 25%?

#

If you’re running dps,you should have 40%< chc,more than enough

vagrant wing
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Spotter gives 15% outright no delays or draw backs. Hence the reason

#

Obliterate takes time to kick in, require you to shoot to keep it up and has a cooldown

iron lake
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for the 2nd boss at IH raid. regarding water, is it safe at 80-85 or beyond that is also safe?

tawdry widget
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up until 90/95 is safe

keen pumice
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Spotter requires a specific skill or attachment to make it work. Obliterate you just shoot stuff.

vagrant wing
keen pumice
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I know what you said and it doesn't change my response.

#

Spotter only works with Decoy, Pulse, or tech laser. It's not bad but its requirements are really specific, especially considering obliterate doesn't take that long to build up.

#

Pulse goes away around the same time as obliterate unless you have skill tiers

vagrant wing
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Obliterate has 5s cooldown. More over obliterate is additive while spotter is multiplicative (which makes them somewhat similar in dmg output) and since you don't get the entire obliterate buff instantly i prefer spotter when i don't have to run a specific spec. I hope that answer your question

keen pumice
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I didn't have a question.

#

25% TWD isn't necessarily better than 15% amp damage

vagrant wing
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oh sorry i confused you with the other guy

vagrant wing
keen pumice
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But the point is, Obliterate doesn't have a cooldown it has an uptime which means it goes away after 5 seconds but it doesn't require you to do anything but get critical hits. Skill cooldowns are quite terrible with 0 skill tier so you're looking at a 20 seconds pulse cooldown which is just not really optimal.

#

Maybe with tech laser I could see it but you're missing out on better spec's when it comes to DPS

keen pumice
vagrant wing
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alright - bad phrasing on my part. Consider my 'cd' as 'uptime'

keen pumice
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Yeah I got you I understand bro.

#

I'm not calling spotter bad or anything and I don't fault you for using it, it just doesn't feel as optimal because it requires certain specs or attachments that will hinder your DPS or feel.

#

For example, the gunner spec is insanely good for any DPS build, it has all those missing pieces but you can't use spotter with it optimally to have continuous damage.

#

Plus obliterate will stay up as long as you hit critical hits so its uptime is infinite technically.

#

Spotter in PvP though? 👌 Use nightwatcher and see the fireworks.

#

Plus I mean what skill are you gonna give up? Revive Hive or crusader shield?

vagrant wing
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Well as i understand it, the discussion that start the whole thing was about talents for a DPS player (without the team in mind) hence when the other guy asked about Spotter vs Obliterate i answered what i answered. When you consider the group it's ofc an entire different story
imo Gunner isn't good at all of my playstyle (as does Technician) so i avoid using it. As for 'hinder your DPS' i mildly disagree. But that turning into an argument about preferences which leads to nowhere so i'll stop here

keen pumice
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Understandable. But I mean hey, if you're talking about solo play or just not getting the team involved the best possible is glass cannon vigilance. Obliterate is the next best thing because it requires no set up. Literally just shoot your gun.

#

But I mean gunner is literally meant for DPS. 5% rate of fire on kill, constant ammo regen, faster reloads, armor on kill. Like what more can you ask for?

#

But hey, It's not an argument it's a discussion.

#

I'd rather get other peoples opinions and how stuff works for them to see how other people play the game you know?

vagrant wing
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If you put it that way...
I personally only use spotter when i go into the DZ (which i can't remember when was the last time) and/or i'm sick with my HH on the open world
Other DPS builds involve around focus or PCG
The reason i personally don't like gunner for DPS builds is because it doesn't give you any passive buff (dmg wise). You can argue that Tech doesn't give you that either and you'll be right, But since i use my spotter with 1/2 offensive skills (drone & turret) i prefer it over gunner. As for Obliterate vs Spotter - i already talked about that. Since this discussion turn into a build discussion rather than raid discussion i suggest to move it to #td2-build-advice

keen pumice
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Lol yeah I understand. I got you.

dusky bolt
keen pumice
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Again. Not saying it's the best, I'm saying it's really good without requiring a specific specialization. Like damn am I not clear enough for you?

dusky bolt
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and there are requirements to using obliterate.

keen pumice
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The next best thing is an expression meaning it's one of the best among these

dusky bolt
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if you dont crit, you dont build obliterate stacks

keen pumice
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What are you required to do that you don't do already?

#

So you're telling me that with your AR's/LMG's/SMG's you don't crit all the time?

dusky bolt
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How would you build obliterate stacks if you're running a skill build?

keen pumice
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You missed the entire conversation

dusky bolt
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Unless you are saying a skill build isn't a dps build?

keen pumice
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Skill build is not a DPS build

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DPS build is using weapons, red core and minor attributes, and talents to achieve the highest damage per shot and damage per second with a weapon.

#

Skill build is using skills to achieve that. Which includes status effects.

#

Doing tidal basin smell ya later

dusky bolt
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DPS = damage per second

#

which is what the skill build does as well

warm wren
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DPS build is any build that does as much damage per second. You either have a "Traditional" DPS build with weapons, or what most call a "Skill DPS" build.

dusky bolt
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I don't know where people get the idea that DPS = red build only

warm wren
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Generally you clarify what build you are running further than "dps"

#

If you are running an EP build, you wouldnt say "i'm running a dps build" would ya?

dusky bolt
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No I wouldn't. if it has skill damage rolls, it would be a skill dps build

warm wren
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DPS means damage per second, but its generally a red build, because you'd add "skill" to a build that uses skills to do damage.

keen pumice
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Real qestion

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If me and the other guy were talking about a "weapon damage" DPS build, why would you bring skill damage in the conversation?

#

That doesn't even make sense.

#

Plus glass cannon is better than spotter for skill damage anyway.

#

Bottom line is, spotter is great but situational. Obliterate is great and can be used in any crit build. Different talents have different purposes, no I'm not getting in to an argument with you. So, I'm going back to my tidal basin. Have a good day.

#

Don't bother responding I'm not gonna look at it.

dusky bolt
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Spotter isn't situational. You just may not know how to use it.
I'm just saying that your statement of "Obliterate is the next best thing...", is incorrect.

warm wren
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for a traditional red DPS crit build, it is. Spotter is a sidegrade that requires, at the low end, a skill, and at the higher ends, a spec change. GC is more damage, not debating that, but obliterate is more damage for doing something that you are already doing.

dusky bolt
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I disagree that obliterate is better because there is a build up and you lose that build up when you reload or fail to land/crit your shot.
there are too many variables if you want to compare the damage output from obliterate. it isn't a linear increase in damage like spotter.

#

even if your bullets shot out like a laser (outsider?), you have to crit. Which means by the time you reach max stacks, you may have to reload or have half of your magazine left.

warm wren
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A dedicated crit build will crit 60% of the time. Most ARs have 30 rounds base, with 50 rounds because most use the +20 round extended mag. Most of your bullets will crit, and if they dont, why are ya stacking CHD?

dusky bolt
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Yea, my statement is on the assumption you are at 60 chc

#

50 rounds * 60% chc = 30 rounds, averagely would crit and build obliterate

kindred moss
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I’ve spent a fair amount of time testing this and my numbers always put chest talents like this on my builds: Perfect focus > Perfect Glass cannon > spotter > obliterate.

Obliterate fails to keep up with m1a’s while spotter is always up with them, on ar’s/lmg’s there’s less difference but still spotter makes up for more sustained dps over obliterate. You might argue that gunner has a way better dps on the spec weapon than technician missile launcher but you get a free skill tier which isn’t bad at all on reviver hives (with tdi kard too) or drones/shields and so on.

warm wren
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Exactly. On average reloads take less than 5 seconds, and once you get to 25 obliterate stacks, all it takes is 1 crit every 5 seconds to keep the buff at its full potential.

dusky bolt
warm wren
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Now note, i'm not saying either is better, they both have their tradeoffs. Technician & Spotter are amazing VS BTSU because of their reliance on tech, and Obliterate is just easy to use overall.

dusky bolt
warm wren
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Theres always another ad to shoot.

dusky bolt
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Also unless, you are using the outsider talent and have amazing tracing aim or the ads are very close to you, you actually miss quite a few shots.

dusky bolt
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because not every ad will be in the open for you to shoot

#

most blacktusk ads are in cover most of the time, even worse if you use an lmg.

warm wren
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Theres always something to shoot that can trigger an obliterate stack.

#

And i know that spotter is more damage, but all i'm saying is that they are used by different people

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some like to use sharpshooter & a rifle, some like gunner & their ARs, some like technician & their spotter chest, its up to the player to decide what to use

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as long as its a DPS increase, awesome

tender hollow
keen pumice
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If it takes you 5 seconds to reload theres a problem

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Especially with the gunners every 3rd reload perk I find it hard to lose obliterate stacks

#

On CP's I it's always up.

#

You just give up so much using technician instead of gunner and running pulse instead of hive or crusader

tender hollow
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Everyone who’s seen any of my posts in the past knows I love Perfect Glass Cannon. I run it from start to finish in Dark Hours and for about half of Iron Horse. But I totally understand that not everyone is comfortable with the 60% extra damage you take which is fine. But I would strongly encourage everyone to make the build and go run around in open world missions to get used to it. You will find that you’re playing style changes to accomodate the talent and within a matter of only a week or two you’ll have no trouble running it. There is a very good reason why the best players run Perfect Glass Cannon in raids and (with the exception of perfect focused) nothing else even comes close. But, with that said, I have to agree that Obliterate should not be your next choice. Firstly you need to land critical hits to stack it which is harder to do with M1A CQB and even harder with the Classic M1A. Yes it’s easier with an assault rifle but they do way less damage. Secondly, there is no point in either raid where you have a continuous stream of adds so you will lose your stacks. Thirdly, even at full stacks it’s no better than Spotter or even Spark. If you’re not running Glass Cannon or Focused then Spotter is definitely the next best option. Running technician gives you increased damage to robotics which is great on Buddy & Lucy, so you just chuck on the laser pointer and spotter is always active. You gain increased headshot damage and stability with Sharpshooter, so just put you’re drone in the air and spotter is always active. Gunner is mildly advantageous if you’re running a striker build for the increased rate of fire, but you never really run out of ammo or need that tiny bit of bonus armour anyway, so I certainly disagree that Gunner is a good choice for a DPS build.

tender hollow
keen pumice
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I pretty much use Gunner and Sharpshooter for everything just because the bonuses they give you are really advantageous. Now I get your point but you can't just outright try to say obliterate is bad. I hit 1 mil crits with my AR using obliterate and the same with the others. You take less damage and it's easy to keep up because most encounters you come up on in raids you do have a pretty steady stream of ads.

#

But you missed literally everything that I said. They're all situational. You won't use all of these perks for everything in every scenario so arguing that one is more or less "better" than anything else is completely up to perspective. You should use what works for you at the end of the day.

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But honestly, running technician with M1A is meh especially when you can run sharpshooter for 15% headshot dmg with sharpshooter.

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Pretty much everything in the game can be argued to be better than everything else besides Coyote's Mask because it'll always be the BiS

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Also 10% AoK is a lot when you chain kills (which is what your build should be able to do if it's good enough). Constant ammo regen comes in handy for AR builds when you can't restock as often as you would like. Faster reload speed means more DPS, 30% bonus armor on armor kit means you take less damage for a short time after applying. Also you give your teammates ammo when you regen ammo.

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Plus you don't always have to use what's best in slot to do good DPS.

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That's why you guys have no fun with the game and wanna quit to do other shit because you just use what's the "best"

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Like nobody cares what's the best. My P416 isn't the best gun in the game but it still crits at 1.1-1.3 mil with the right buffs and I do DPS just fine

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When I speed run I'll use BiS because it makes it faster but have fun with the game before you conform to the meta.

#

You guys forget this game is about fun and discussions and not a constant DPS comparison and competition

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Ask Aspect, we were literally having a conversation about this very subject, we all know spotter glass cannon and focus will out DPS Obliterate but it's still there, it's fun and it's still viable in endgame content. End of story.

tender hollow
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I mean you’re in a raid discussion chat room with speed runners and people who have 1000’s of raid completions who are trying to pass on the knowledge they have. People have been asking questions and discussing the best DPS alternative to Glass Cannon so here we are explaining it. I didn’t see anyone ask what was the most fun build to run in the raid. Hey if you’re an experienced raider and you want to go have fun running different builds then go for it. But my comments were directed to people learning the raids and to people who may be having trouble doing enough DPS. So if you’re finding that you’re actually running out of ammo during raid fights then clearly you’re having trouble doing enough DPS and should pay attention.