division-universe

[torn shoal]

the only thing you got is your headcanon and just thinking "yeah but he is smart actually"

[sick lantern]

no, you're misinterpreting those comms by refusing to connect them to other parts of the plot

you're misinterpreting everything by taking it exactly as it is and not thinking that it's connected to other plot points

[torn shoal]

the coms : mcmanus is not smart
plot : he allies with smart people
you : that proves he was smart all along and masterminded the entire thing

[sick lantern]

and taking the word of a literal traitor as fact without considering that he might have to conceal his agenda when talking to the NSA

[torn shoal]

you're doing it again

"he might"

"maybe"

do you know ockams razor ?

you dont connect dots out of nowhere for no reason

[sick lantern]

fine then he DOES have to conceal his agenda

if you're so fixated on specific words

[torn shoal]

what agenda ?

give me a single piece of information that confirm he had an agenda

and not the "maybe he did that"

[sick lantern]

to take over the country with a viral outbreak, a mercenary army and the Hunters to counteract the BT's biggest threat

[torn shoal]

i didnt ask you to give me what you think he did

i asked a proof of it

you got no proof he hid any agenda

[tulip patio]

he is actively sabotaging our effort to stabilize DC

[sick lantern]

there are multiple which all but confirm he did. he works with a russian mercenary army. he created the hunters to kill non rogue agents. he undermined the NSA. he sent death threats to warren merchant.
You are refusing to consider a connection between multiple suspicious acts.

[torn shoal]

you're talking after the outbreak, not before

you're also making a "mastermind" rely on pure luck for the entire thing

you got nothing from before the outbreak that says he is hiding things or that he is a mastermind

[tulip patio]

in some of the descent comms he asks Ortiz I think for a backdoor into all the 3 AIs, including BT's Diamond

[torn shoal]

yes thats standard for the us gov, they do that for everything

[sick lantern]

No, I'm not.
He knew Sokolova before the outbreak and involved her in the creation of SHD tech with ortiz robotics even.
He sent death threats to merchant before the outbreak, because merchant was trying to warn people about the outbreak.
The Hunters were created before the outbreak.
he undermined the NSA operation to stop the outbreak which obviously can only have happened before the outbreak

[torn shoal]

also explained by why hunters exist

again, you got no intent

hunters are a failsafe, they were supposed to exist before the outbreak

[sick lantern]

to take over the country which he is currently actively involved in attempting.

[ashen jungle]

Okay everyone, it's time to take a break.

[untold harbor]

Ok, so all the info I’ve gathered from this talk is that Russian this and Russian that and omg who could’ve guessed THE HUNTERS ARENT A FAILSAFE

[tulip patio]

I don't know how much they're Russian really, they're americans and Black Tusk despite the Natalya's origins has no national ties to anyone

[untold harbor]

Oh yeah ofc but looking at all of this @sick lantern is pulling up actual stuff from novels to comms and all the way to lore not coming from the wiki but something that’s actually canon and can’t be changed

[sick lantern]

That was my intent

[untold harbor]

But taking all of this in, it makes sense because we have multiple Russian gear sets and they usually are near an area where a hunter spawns

[torn shoal]

hunters arent russian

[tulip patio]

I don't personally see that connection, hunters are americans

[torn shoal]

they work for mcmanus, not nat directly

[untold harbor]

Well they have ties to a Russian mercenary group

[tulip patio]

and even if Nat is Russian, she's working for herself not Russia

[torn shoal]

nat being russian doesnt make hunters russian, they work for mcmanus, and he allied himself with nat

[sick lantern]

i mention sokolova's russian background to extra emphasise how not-good the BT are

[untold harbor]

Yeah but it’s strange that Russian gear seems to drop near those areas and mainly those areas

[tulip patio]

they're not Russian, most of them are ex-military from USA and maybe around the globe, but they're not russians

[torn shoal]

wym ?

[untold harbor]

Yes, but I’m talking about boxes you loot

[torn shoal]

what boxes ?

[tulip patio]

yeah her family history definitely doesn't help her image lol I agree there

[untold harbor]

Loot boxes that are almost everywhere

[torn shoal]

loot boxes arent russian ?

[untold harbor]

I’m talking about the gear inside

[tulip patio]

I saw no confirmation random boxes around their areas drop specific loot, it's just RNG

[torn shoal]

gear is from all over the world

[tulip patio]

the weapons that drop from Hunter key crates aren't Russian either

[torn shoal]

there is litteraly 0 ties to russia beside nat being of russian descent

[untold harbor]

But for me it’s usually Russian gear and I hunt the hunters down from all ends of the map and It seems to be either Ak’s, RPK’s, SVD,s or petrov defense group gear sometimes American gear but always seems to be I get Russian

[torn shoal]

its random + you can get gear depending on the rotation of the area

[tulip patio]

maybe RNG was like that for you, me and the people I talk to saw no connection like that

[torn shoal]

open map, check targeted loot distribution, and you know why some gear drop in some place more

[untold harbor]

I’ve did that and it says it something not of those things listed

[torn shoal]

then its just random, you dont have more chance of getting an ak than a famas or an m4

[untold harbor]

It will say something like Striker gear or something but it’s Russian stuff specifically near hunter spawn

[torn shoal]

also ak are widlely aviable in the world, not just russia

there is very few items that have specific drop location, its usually named/exotics

[tulip patio]

Cleaners use AKs a lot and they're locals

[torn shoal]

normal guns just drop randomly from everywhere, same svd, rpk, etc

[untold harbor]

And where do they get them from?

[torn shoal]

its the us, you got 100 gun per habitant as a base, now 90% of the pop is gone so thats a lot more gun per person

[untold harbor]

There’s no way DC just had AK’s lying around they must have done an arms deal

[tulip patio]

there's a huge gun market in USA, AKs manufactured in my country are in USA market for example

not used in official capacity, mostly for enthusiasts

[torn shoal]

this is the us, there are all the guns aviable in the world for sale there, so after the apocalypse, be sure you gonna find a lot of everything

[tulip patio]

and it's also game logic, realistically these ragtag factions will use whatever they can find

[torn shoal]

they also have rpgs

[untold harbor]

Also the four factions in DC are bt, Outcast, Hyenas and True Sons and only few use Russian armory

[torn shoal]

they use a large variety of guns

idk why u're focusing so much on russia and russian guns tbh

if a hunter use a french gun you would say they are french ?

[untold harbor]

Because if the hunters have ties with Russian mercenaries then it’s strange you can find gear there as if mercenaries of that group were killed by the hunter and also I’m not saying there Russian what I’m saying is that the hunters were never a fail safe and that even with McManus being allies with NAT doesn’t mean that his hunter will just kill the mercenaries meant to guard him

[torn shoal]

you can find all type of gear, not just russian there, also why would hunters kill bt soldiers ?

[tulip patio]

well technically speaking the gear you get like that is just abandoned supplies, not stuff off dead bodies

[torn shoal]

and there is a ton of them, there is so many guns in the country you might start walking on them at some point lol

[small knot]

And besides BT is a mercenary company so they’re gonna buy supplies from various suppliers to suit their needs plus citizens buying guns from different manufacturers so it’s not weird to have foreign guns here

It’s not a deep Russia plot at the end of the day controlling BT or McManus we know it’s a corrupt cabal inside the US that’s been controlling everything so far

[torn shoal]

as far was we know for now at least

[small knot]

Mhm so Nat being Russian like you guys said already doesn’t mean anything given she’s working mostly with Americans in America

[torn shoal]

yeah, its just an easy way of saying "she scary and ruthless"

cause of clichés in media

[small knot]

Da in Russia bear don’t fight you, you fight bear

[torn shoal]

yeah stuff like that

[untold harbor]

Yeah, but we can think about this way or the possibilities that maybe the hunters put them in boxes nearby if they run out of ammunition in their primary weapon and they need a last resort to kill.

The possibilities are 50/50

[torn shoal]

no, the boxes have random loot, only very specific boxes have specific gear, and its always for exotics/named, not random high end

like you can find the chatterbox parts in the heynas box in the hotel mission, but you dont find "russian" gear in loot boxes near hunter more than any other

[solemn sentinel]

Do the Black tusk have enough power to take over several states?

[torn shoal]

they can if the division doesnt stop them

[small knot]

Possibly given that they probably were given a blank check by the US government since the cabal is the one supposedly funding them so we don’t know what else the BT have in store. I mean Brooklyn showed us that ||they have mobile nuclear reactors|| so that’s a testament to what they can do

[solemn sentinel]

Damn

[sick lantern]

depends on who’s there to resist them

[glad spruce]

Does anyone know if the Riker boss, Mugboy, is from Clarke Street or Bridge Pier missions?

It involves the wiki, mind you

[floral gull]

Division and Chill https://youtu.be/l5AASw4qgqw?si=GR6iQ1GXUAigAULT

[glad spruce]

Oh my god, that track in 8:24 is what I've been looking for in forever

Finally!

[ornate gull]

My question is what is their current manpower rn

BT might be large PMC, but with division against them.

I doubt they have more than 10k in reserve

[solemn sentinel]

we have killed a lot of em

[glad spruce]

Given that they're supplying the Hyenas once again and supplying Cleaners with purple flame, I'd imagine they're getting desperate

[wet cedar]

Cuz it’s tom clancy universe

And in tom clancy’s universe, Russia is always involved one way or another

R6 Siege outbreak event - caused by some unknown shit from Soviet satellite
Ghost recon games - always spin around Bodarks one way or another (except wildlands)
His own books were mostly abt Cold War period anyway
Splinter Cell - Voron branch that’s the same to third echelon

[ashen jungle]

@hearty cradle This is the lore discussion channel.

[signal thicket]

Just got the third echo on brooklyn and || Its a sweet callback||

|| Its cool how they dont show a second agent and depending on where you're standing you're basically exactly where you stood in the first game||

[mint citrus]

Okay, just gonna say it. Zeppelin was cool.

[sick lantern]

something can be cool and presented well whilst still not making proper narrative sense
ie star wars episode 8 hyperspace ramming

[ashen jungle]

I think that can safely apply to most things in those movies past the OG 3, and even the 3rd one.

[sick lantern]

im not gonna disagree lol you have a point but hyperspace ramming is even worse

[ashen jungle]

I can write a novel on what makes no sense in every one of those movies, but this is a div chat so I'll just say that this franchise doesn't even come close to how dumb those were.

[glad spruce]

I don't care that it doesn't make sense, the ||Zeppelin is amazing||

Poking logic at every story moment is boring

[torn shoal]

yeah obviously

zeppeling was fun

[hybrid cedar]

I say - MEGA Bulletproof shields

Whatever is in our shields , it got infused with humongous amounts of Plotarmorium

[torn shoal]

i mean ingame all shields do that basically, you can even tank a full rpg and you just get knocked back

[outer hill]

Hi. Has anyone gotten the new comm from descent? I noticed that there's 15 new audio files and i completed a nemesis run but didn't get any audio comm for it. 🫤

[patent narwhal]

zeppelin is cool but it falls apart story wise the second you put the smallest thought into it for me and it leaves me not caring that much for it

for an organization like BT it just seems so utterly impractical and dumb that they'd never do it when they could just like artillery barrage the hell out of the bridge

[glad spruce]

Comm 91 is available tomorrow, Tuesday

[small knot]

I think it was supposed to be more like a distraction or a tiny showing of what the BT can do cause Theo said most of the purple flame stuff is getting shipped outta state so we might see something truly scary later

But it is a feat of engineering since they mounted three razorbacks on its belly and the capability to drop purple flame bombs

At the end of the day tho fighting the Hindenburg 2.0 while it launches drones at you before you take it down with a SAM is pretty fun

[glad spruce]

Not to mention a Marauder with a laser weapon

[cosmic niche]

Yep the production quality of this expansion is far better than the other parts of the game. What lvl did you do it on?

[ashen jungle]

@hard solstice This is the lore channel.

[hard solstice]

Sry

[solemn sentinel]

Where there any first wave agents that survived that remained loyal to the SHD/just helping people and fight against all the bad guys even when being declared rogue?

[sick lantern]

not all of the first wave went rogue
X amount of them died
and then the survivors who chose not to go rogue, mostly were killed by Keener

the only known first wave non rogue still alive iirc is the protagonist of the mobile game

maybe one of the agents from Compromised was a first wave as well can’t remember

[torn shoal]

The entire first wave is either dead, rogue and joined keener, or hiding which make them rogue

[solemn sentinel]

I ment first wave agent who was made Rogue but did't go bad guy or join Keener and is still alive

[solemn sentinel]

Got cha

[torn shoal]

If a rogue didnt join keener they still rogue so if they get spotted they still marked for elimination

[glad spruce]

Manhunt Comm 2, The Bunker.

||In the second debrief, Bardon Schaeffer informs Manny that Black Tusk have their secret bunkers in almost every part of the country. Almost being the keyword, as most of the time, it takes half a day drive to get between bunkers, or an hour or two on helo depending on weather conditions, but that requires a landing site or being able to jump in.||

||How can the Division compete with that? They don't, as Schaeffer admitted, hence why he and his Rogue allies were trying to shut down the bunkers, which Manny deduced that involves Black Tusk's network, DIAMOND.||

||Therefore, taking down the network means taking down the bunkers and all of Nat's tech.||

[glad spruce]

Descent comm 91. Bridge.

||Agent Hoskins discusses with Jessica Kandel in moving to Brooklyn, with the promise that after Faye Lau finishes her business in DC, she and Bridgette Douglas can meet the doctor in Brooklyn.||

||Kandel suggested telling Roy, but Hoskins argues he'll never understand and he'll never forgive Keener, not after the damage he did to the JTF. Kandel then asks Hoskins how did she forgive Keener, which the latter admitted Sarah Moretti and Bridgette were the major factors.||

||Hoskins then speaks that people shouldn't be judged in how they behave on their best and worst days, and they should be seen as who they are when things are boring. Do they choose to be kind? Or do they choose to create chaos?||

||Keener is an a-hole, as Hoskins admits, but she doesn't see him as evil. She sees him as a guy who lost himself in his trauma and took a destructive road back to the man he wanted to be.||

||Jessica asks if Hoskins saw Keener as a venture capitalist, but she sees him as a hero and a friend. And implores Kandel to see what Keener was building in Brooklyn.||

||Hoskins muses how back in January (during the events of Div 1), Keener was leaving cryptic messages where he crap-talks the Division. But when she sees what Vanguard and Glasses have built on Brooklyn, she knows in her gut that Keener can't be that man anymore, and argues that people need to have a chance to grow.||

||Kandel asks Hoskins if Keener still has the printer, but Hoskins is not aware what it is, and suggested Kandel to ask Theo for help.||

[torn shoal]

this is actually a good philosophical discussion, regarding owning mistakes, and defining who we are and how we should be judged, cause people change

someone bad can be good later, and vice versa

identy isnt set in stone

[sudden mortar]

but keener killed a lot of civillians and jtf, he should be dead 😫

[small knot]

||The manhunt voice comm actually reveals a lot with how embedded into the US the BT is. With bunkers being almost everywhere and not to far via helicopter it makes you think truly how big the BT is. Also the entire operation being held together by the Diamond network seems very faulty cause even with the national SHD network down we were still able to organize locally and have some form of order||

[torn shoal]

in this world, everyone killed a lot of people

[small knot]

Ya our agents probably have higher kill counts then probably some dictators. Sure they’re the bad guys but we are KILLERS bro

[glad spruce]

Finally got this week's Descent comm

Those CTD (Crash to Desktop) errors were giving me hell

[torn shoal]

remind me of year 1 crashes

that was awful back then

[glad spruce]

At the very least, I have two left to finish Danvers Network collectibles

[sick lantern]

he has a lot of corpses to apologise for before he begins to earn any forgiveness

[ornate gull]

Most first wave Rogue are among LMB casualties

[torn shoal]

most first wave is dead overall

tho its funny to get so many rogues in gameplay

[small knot]

I think of it like Order 66 in Star Wars, out of the 10,000 Jedi in the galaxy most were killed but a few hundred still lived

So most first wave are dead but still a decent chunk can be alive but there are still agents that go rogue now for their own reasons not just cause of keener or whatever

[torn shoal]

À rogue agent alone is basically a dead man, without support you die, that's why keener made a rogue network, so it's safe to assume all rogues from first wave are with keener or dead by now

Unless they can cheat the watch, but even getting rid of it doesnt stop isac from marking you if you encoubter another agent

[small knot]

Very true but I would think that now keeners rogue network would imo be either in a truce with us or just not worrying about us for now. So the rogue agents we encounter now are just those loner ones which is why ISAC is able to detect them when we get close. Cause anytime we go near Theo he doesn’t warn us about a nearby rogue

But that’s me theorizing and assuming what it could possibly be

[torn shoal]

Isac saying rogue nearby everytime we go to White house or brooklyn would get old very fast tbh

[small knot]

Again that’s why it’s a theory….a game theory

[torn shoal]

yeah im just pointing that out, nothing serious

[solemn sentinel]

Is our cell of agents that operates in DC and New York considered rogue since our literal boss Works with the Main bad guy?

[humble jacinth]

Yea

[solemn sentinel]

Neat

Is Anderson a worse leader for the True sons than Ridgeway?

[ashen jungle]

I think at this stage it's a case of 0x100 still being 0.

[sick lantern]

no, working alongside rogues does not automatically make you rogue, as per the division’s autonomous mandates and shown in the Hunted novel
also Manny isn’t the division’s “boss”, no one but the president can be

[solemn sentinel]

I ment Calvin McManus

Who works with the literal Leader of the black tusk

[gaunt ice]

no, because McManus betrayed the states and has no power over the Division to begin with, nor is he next in line of succession as far as ISAC’s concerned

if he did have powers then he’d have used it already

[solemn sentinel]

Ah okay, even tho he does one time refer To Division agents as his agents?

[gaunt ice]

he refers to his “agents” who are hunters working for him, like Johnson

[sick lantern]

the SHD is only technically under the DHS, but answers only to the president

[solemn sentinel]

No he did refer to a non Hunter that got killed in new York early on

[solemn sentinel]

Got cha

[gaunt ice]

thats when he wasn’t face off afaik

[solemn sentinel]

Right

[torn shoal]

Mcmanus doesnt have autority over agents anyway, only the président have, at best he can ask them to do something, not order them. However he has full autority to take them down if he feels that necessary, so that's not like he had 0 power.

[sick lantern]

you don’t need private secret Batman-fear-tactics assassins for something you’re allowed or supposed to do

[solemn sentinel]

ye

[sudden mortar]

can somebody clarify to me ||who is Peterson? On army terminal mission,|| we got "Sparrow" who was giving orders to Bichon at theo manhunt, ||Grant (evacuated) and Danvers that is dead. (Supposedly)||

[glad spruce]

IIRC, ||He's one of the Cleaner commanders. Or a Black Tusk officer like Danvers.||

[glad spruce]

I swear, if I have to hear a Div 1 evangelical worshipping the Green Poison one more time, I'm gonna lose it

[small knot]

Yes except we don’t get cool red watches sadly

[loud pilot]

Is my boy Rick valassi back If he is I haven’t found him yet

[torn shoal]

would be fun if he was in brooklyn in some easter egg

[small knot]

Please devs let us embrace being with the rogues and having ANNA as our go to ai and having the red watches

[honest briar]

I would love to be able to change between red and orange

[small knot]

Same here cause I forgot where in game it was but us SHD agents are viewed as rogue due to McManus classifying us as such and the BT acting as the true peacekeepers and force of the GOVT

Since BT is trying to establish order again since they’re paid by the cabal so us fighting them makes us rogue under their standards so I want us to actually embrace that and be rogue

[honest briar]

I know in the recruiter manhunt he says that we are off mission and basically rogue

[small knot]

Boom that’s what it was, cause that’s why the hunters are after us since they’re directly under McManus he’s sending them after us cause like you said we’re off mission. Just let us embrace that true “rogue” title that they label us as and give us the red watch. Plus we use a bunch of rogue tech, holograms, launcher, Achilles etc

[honest briar]

Yeah 100%, specially now we’re kinda working with keener and he has set up the rogue network

[surreal hearth]

So this is it guys we’re going after diamond then

So we’re pretty much classified as rogue agents while the diamond AI is trying to hunt us down using hunters in black tusk and as long as that diamond AI is active the black tusk keep coming unlimitedly

Honestly, it’s coming to the point we might as well we wearing red watches instead of orange

[torn shoal]

we're not rogue

[honest briar]

We know

[torn shoal]

at least not officially, consdering officially nothing really is left lol

[honest briar]

Issac perimeters still consider us on mission but to the likes of mcmanus we seem to be labelled rogue

[torn shoal]

yeah, thats when optics come into play, since there is no law or gov left, what we are and what we do depends on what people want us to do

there is no definition of legality anymore since there is no police/justice/etc

remember kids, gov and society is what we collectively decide what it is, rules arent created out of the void

[ashen knot]

There's still technically a line of continuity of government, after Faye shot Potus Ellis, there should be someone else under him, even if its sec. of education. (battlestar galactica lmao) And who's to say what type of intel that person was given. They would just use the existing power structure and resources, and if Mcmanus tells them the black tusk is in and the division is rogue, why would they have any other reason to doubt that. They would be struggling to maintain stat-quo and believing the div to be a threat and consider us an occupying force of the Capitol.

[tender jackal]

||Wait, is Manny a bad guy? I haven't been keeping up 😭||

[small knot]

Manny is not a bad guy and the term rogue now isn’t what we thought it means before

[torn shoal]

thats partially true, but im not sure it really matter tbh

[small knot]

Rogue now is anyone that opposes McManus, Nat and BT but the actual rogue agents are ones that actually turned their back on SHDs original mission

Our agents are rogue in the eyes of the cabal but we’re not ROGUE rogue since we’re still helping out and trying to maintain order

[small knot]

Ya there is a line of succession since Ellis was the third president then the secretary at a Cera camp. The lore from last season was them trying to systematically get the power to McManus but they had to stop the killing as it would’ve gotten way to suspicious for these people to drop like flies before stopping at Mac

[torn shoal]

like there is always the line of succession, there is no real way that "technically" nobody is in charge, but its more of a technicality so that isac is still working and agents can do stuff around, realistically, agents now do whatever they want as long as isac agree, but lets pretend bt and other faction are put to rest, and settlements thrive and actually help everyone around with no fighting, there is still no president, no congress, gov, police, justice, nothing is left basically, so isac wont turn off itself, and trying to do that would turn you rogue, even if there is no threat left
isac is both the reason agents can do what they do, and also the reason they cant stop cause it cant stop

unless isac recognize some authority (a new president), there is no going back to a peaceful state

to get a new president, you need to make the country vote, and its pretty clear thats not happenning anytime soon

unless the line of succession give us someone else that isac recognize, but then again, the entire power of shd is in their hands, thats a very dangerous thing

back in div 1, there was still a gov/justice system, so if division did bad stuff on his order, he could get impeach, now its def not happenning, case and point : ellis

anyone recognize new leader by isac hold the entire future of the us in their hands

so if he is an ally, thats good, if he aint, we doomed, and we need a rogue to do what they do best

like faye did to ellis

in the meantime there is still bt and other factions to get rid of, so we're really walking on a thin line, risking our lives to fight the factions, while we can still lose everything at any moment cause isac doesnt care what is right, only what is the law its following, which included very specifically that the president is a litteral god over it

tldr : people follow whoever they believe is their leader, except for isac which has a set list that doesnt care who's good or bad

[surreal hearth]

Seems like the rogues have been becoming a hero in Brooklyn for once

Nat used another proxy war card by using the cleaners as an out of salt to attack Brooklyn. Only this time they’re heavily modified with new flamethrower gases. That stuff is so nasty not even the rogue agents can’t handle these guys

[small knot]

Mhm it’s why Danvers was having Grant create those deepfakes to try and paint keener in a bad light since him and Theo have a good standing with the people of Brooklyn

[surreal hearth]

The question is….why the cleaners are going out of their way to destroy Brooklyn entirely? I feel like the plot thickens as I slaughter like 400 to 10 thousand cleaners

I’m also speculating that those deep fake software were used to recreate nemesis like Theo and Keener as nemesis

Overall, this proves the keener didn’t actually left New York, but stayed in Brooklyn all those years

[small knot]

The cleaners are only concerned about burning away the infection and anyone that isn’t them is infected so Brooklyn is just the same plus they were being manipulated by Danvers who was actually BT the whole time

[surreal hearth]

So it is indeed another of nats proxy attacks then knowing that she has her own BT agents being buddy buddy with other factions.

[sick lantern]

again, there is no DIAMOND AI.

[gaunt ice]

diamond is a network afaik

[sick lantern]

^

[gaunt ice]

until they inevitably r*tcon it

[glad spruce]

Considering this week's Manhunt comm refers to BT's network as the Diamond Network, heavy x to doubt

[glad spruce]

When you think about it, our D.C Agent has had a pretty restless October

[torn shoal]

im pretty sure the apocalypse itself is kind restless

[glad spruce]

I'd more consider it post-apocalypse

[torn shoal]

idk, whats the point where you can say apocalypse is over when everyone is still killing each others

and the virus is still here too

[ashen jungle]

Technically post just means "after", so 5 minutes after a nuke drops, it's the post-apocalypse.

[torn shoal]

yeah i know, what im saying is that the apocalypse isnt over, we're still getting worse and worse things going on
or its not one big apocalypse and more like some multi layered apocalypse

still might have nukes come into play later if bt play their cards right too

[ashen jungle]

An apocalypse isn't a single event, Lyfe. It just means "the complete destruction of the world", the notion of a post apocalypse itself is kinda weird, but that's usually why there's a clarification on what kind of end-times it is.

In the Div-universe case: it's a virus, so that usually just means after the bulk of people were wiped out.

Green Poison has pretty much burned itself out on new people to infect, so the viral part of the apocalypse is over.

[torn shoal]

yeah most of the civilization is done by now

wonder what might come up for div 3 if it actually comes out someday

like if we gonna get the same world with different factions in a different place, or like a fully new world with a society that actually rebuilt itself, at least partially

not just settlements

[ashen jungle]

A time-jump makes the most sense, advance the story into the future so you can get a new cast.
Although I do suspect that it's going to be more like "5 years later" kinda thing.

[torn shoal]

its the most probable yeah

tho i'd love some wild new stuff, its hard to change too much from what people expect

[marble dawn]

I'd hope there has been some progress in rebuilding society in the third installment, even if it is just a city skybox we don't enter as the player

[torn shoal]

im fine if society isnt rebuilt but at least we need a different kind of setting

apocalypse or post apo get repetitive pretty fast

[sick lantern]

post-post-apocalypse (functioning society)
post-post-post-apocalypse (div 1 vibe again )

[torn shoal]

Would be funny tho if armest was still alive and released Green poison 2.0 but it's spreading with guns and not bills this time

[surreal hearth]

I will be real honest with you, but this deep fake situation has affected my perception against Keener

[late void]

Retconning at its most insidious

[surreal hearth]

Why the hell would you deep fake yourself if you know you’re the real deal and you just suddenly decided to cast the villain as a deep faker?

And to top it off the rikers and the cleaners now have new leadership after we put down previous leaderships and their current leadership in New York

[torn shoal]

Keener isnt the "réal" vilain, he is one of them, with his own agenda

And the other vilains have other agenda that contradict his

Also it's normal factions get another leader, they wont stop existing just cause we kill one guy

[surreal hearth]

Is it to spread fear against the black tusk cabals? Or something more dangerous when technology reaches to dangerous heights?

[torn shoal]

Imo it's to make people not make alliance with keener or make his rogue network not follow him anymore

[surreal hearth]

But that would means we shouldn’t fully trust ANNA since she’s part of the rogue network now embedded into the division network

[torn shoal]

anna is her own thing, just cause the rogue use her doesnt mean she is bad

[hybrid cedar]

The whole alliance between rogues and the division , aint a real alliance , more a very very brittle ceasefire because they HAVE to work together

I wouldnt wonder if there are still rogue cells trying to frick with us , or the rogues backstabbing us as soon as they can

i paraphrase the alliance as "HEY NOBODY SHOOTS THE DIVISION BUT ME"

[glad spruce]

I think it should be made clear that the deepfaked Keener is an actor.

Not the real Aaron Keener

I wouldn't be surprised if Nat supplied that actor to Grant and Danvers

[empty sapphire]

hey guys. so I know there's a person on youtube that does lore videos and such. do they have something similar to destiny's "10 hour complete story" thing? I missed so many seasons that it's confusing seeing all these people alive and on our side. and other characters that i'm unfamiliar with

[ashen jungle]

NGN is our lore-tuber, and yes!

[empty sapphire]

yes, that's the one. guess i'll look up a vid. I just don't want to watch 73 separate things to piece them together

[ashen jungle]

Division 1+2 story is over 4 hours, there's also specific ones for the Manhunts, etc, etc.

[empty sapphire]

lovely, will have something to watch then

[torn shoal]

ngn does full story recap every year iirc

smaller video for each season/manhunt/etc, which are more detailled if needed

he truly is the goat of lore with hawkster

[glad spruce]

I'm not sure if I should be considered on the same caliber as NGN.

But I do appreciate the compliment 😊

[torn shoal]

hey, you're the wiki guy

everyone else is just talking about stuff, you 2 are the ones doing the work to save the lore

[ashen jungle]

Let's not inflate anyone's ego.

[loud pilot]

Why does Aaron keener have a division watch collection we’ve taken his watch like 2 different times like does he have different watches for different days

[sick lantern]

he had a lot of dead Division agents to take watches from

[loud pilot]

That is true he did have Guccis full winter line at his discretion

[torn shoal]

thoses are special watches for rogue network iirc

[loud pilot]

iirc?

[torn shoal]

if i recall correctly

[true fox]

hey guys,

Have you seen that you have a new suggestion channel?
It has the topic for history.

[torn shoal]

yeah i saw, but idk what we can really suggest for lore

funnily enough, the story is really not that interesting overall, its pretty standard, but the story telling in missions is actually pretty great

also i think they took the story too seriously at the beginning and now they just throw random stuff cause its look fun, not cause its consistent

[surreal hearth]

Black tusk are literal Neo Nazis

[torn shoal]

not really ? beside wanting a totalitarian state, they have nothing in common

[surreal hearth]

Why you ask? Because only Neo Nazis can build a zeppelin

[torn shoal]

zeppelins were common back then

[surreal hearth]

A freaking future tech zeppelin

[torn shoal]

still not related at all to them

lot of countries had zeppellins back in the day

[surreal hearth]

No, but it does explain why nat used so many proxies

[torn shoal]

no it doesnt ?

proxies are common too

[surreal hearth]

The cleaners were used by the black tusk the same way the hyenas went after Parnell but was done covertly to avoid suspicious

[torn shoal]

so ?

its a common tactic, widley used in the world, especially the us

the cia does it a lot

[surreal hearth]

So this whole deepfake can 100% manipulate whatever faction you want whenever possible

[torn shoal]

yeah, but again, where's the connection ?

thats just vilain stuff, not even close to being related

just being a bad personne doesnt make you one of them lol

[surreal hearth]

The only source is their bunkers which nobody knows so the “Key” is the only way to break this ridiculous cycle of secrecy

[torn shoal]

i think you lost the plot

why would you compare them

[surreal hearth]

…..

This story has too many plot lost at this point

And now the plot continues as it turns out Keener and Parnell have the good old printer from the first game all along

[torn shoal]

no, im asking you why you compare them to nazis

when they have nothing in common

also im pretty sure we shouldnt be talking about thoses in the first place

[civic trellis]

while the bad guys are clearly bad guys

it sure is thin line involving that kind of real life politics on it

so be careful on it

[torn shoal]

i mean even considering real life politics i see no connection here

so we shouldnt even compare

[civic trellis]

more about "let's not talk about nazis"

[torn shoal]

yeah that would be a good thing

[true fox]

Let's start by giving feedback to improve (and maybe correct) the gaps, using everything that already exists.

Or do you want to invent future situations to suggest continuity?

[torn shoal]

i mean what would you suggest to fill the gap beside "dont do that" ?

[true fox]

It's a question for a long-text response.

But I say that I would start with Keener's return, and go from there.
Then, I would bring up key previous situations, preventing them from being forgotten and creating new gaps behind gaps.

Obviously, I am being very precise in this sea of information and details.

But I'm sure you know where to start, and I want to follow along with that.

…but I am prioritizing the problem of the collectible sets first. I already understand why… all of them are scrambled.

…I can hardly move on to other steps without fixing this first.

I understand that the more time passes and the more collectibles enter the game, the greater the effort to organize that sub-menu.

[glad spruce]

I made a suggestion anyway

[torn shoal]

I guess I could suggest more cam footage for the lore like we have, it's better than the 10k coms we got, but imo that's a funding issue, so wouldnt go far

[true fox]

Alright, I'll set aside some time to do the same.

Let's start with the known problems.

[glad spruce]

I'm still thinking of making a website that serves as a narrative/lore recap for Div 2.

Though designing a website is too ambitious to my current skills

[torn shoal]

There are some premade stuff to help

Depending on what you wanna do obv

[true fox]

I thought of the same idea, but reorganizing the Division page on the wiki wouldn't be enough, would it?

[solemn sentinel]

Why was the entire first wave only deployed to New York?

[ashen jungle]

Because the virus started in NYC, so if it was stopped there, it could've have gone further.

[sleek plover]

meanwhile british mi6 is deployed in old york at britain

[surreal hearth]

This whole fake their deaths was more likely as an “early retirement” as Parnell don’t want to go back fighting again now that he has a child

[sick lantern]

imagine abandoning your duty to the SHD and then abandoning your rogue lifestyle as well 💀

[surreal hearth]

I also may have to correct myself because I found out that nat isn’t always gonna be behind all of this situation instead she’s relying on her “black tusk agents” to do the dirty work for her

[glad spruce]

She's a privileged a-hole, so no surprise she'll have others do the dirty work for her

[surreal hearth]

Well, she attempted to use Anderson as a first sign of faction support, but failed miserably after we took down two true sons potential leaderships

I will retract my statement of calling the black tusk something that I shouldn’t have just because I was spooked with the Zepplin

[sick lantern]

zeppelins are a definitively German thing, but an imperial german thing

[surreal hearth]

I just didn’t expected them to create such a very dangerous weapon that could lead to world war 3. Those hovercraft fleets were bad enough as it is but imagine having a fleet of zeppelins.

This Denver guy wasn’t just some ordinary black tusk agent but an extremely cold asf calculated man that uses proxy wars in order to create more and new dangerous forms of black tusk weaponry.

The first proxy occurred when nat decided to use one of cals contacts to “remove or dispose” former colleagues like miss mikenly

Then black tusk started playing puppeteers by manipulating a council hyena survivor into capturing Parnell. Which ended by 100 bullets in his chest thanks to the division

Lastly Denver took charge of this puppeteer operation by acquiring two candidates in order to restore two factions back to full strength such as the cleaners and the rikers.

This could also means convert influence operations.

When the cleaners and rikers have new leaderships they were both gifted with new dangerous toys to kill the division

[solemn sentinel]

Why do we take orders from Manny? besides being the JTF liasion?

[glad spruce]

Because he's the coordinator for Division agents in D.C

[torn shoal]

we dont really take orders from him, he just point us in a direction, we do our own thing

we dont really take orders from anyone at this point

[ashen jungle]

It's mentioned at least once that "this is manny from the division", he's the closest thing we have to a boss.

[true fox]

Just to confirm a memory, the activation of the rogue network for the first time on Liberty Island used Keener's watch and Kajika's watch, which was with Lau applying a backdoor to the Black Tusk network, diamond?

[torn shoal]

yeah he is the closest thing to a boss, but he has no real power over us, he is mostly just doing his best to keep everyone on track, i'd say its more of a coordination role than boss, tho everyone refers to him cause he is the one with the most knowledge overall in most situation

[surreal hearth]

Here’s this long intel that an Ai managed to organize behind the Brooklyn attack

[glad spruce]

Looks like the bot auto-removed your post. Mind sharing it in DM?

[solemn sentinel]

lorewise not counting gameplay, how do factions like the outcasts, hyena and true sons still keep up their numbers with how much they have been decimated?

[sick lantern]

well just think about the last time any large group of those factions was actually relevant

[solemn sentinel]

like last season...and sorry if i just want a proper awnser for a lore question if it exist and i don't really care about "when they were relevant"

[sick lantern]

it was a rhetorical question to demonstrate that they're not "keeping up"

Hyenas and True Sons remnants getting used as muscle by the BT

[frosty bluff]

I’d like to think that the factions have a certain amount of troops under them that are associated with them, and most of them that we encounter are simply gameplay entities —so like for every 3 dead hyenas, 1 real hyena is dead, or something along those lines. Works for wandering npcs, though not really for mission areas

[solemn sentinel]

fair, mabye black tusk are helping the True sons recruting from outside DC under Anderson

[frosty bluff]

I mean, its definitely possible that former members of [ The Founders ] could’ve linked up with the True Sons, even though they were based in Philly

[frosty bluff]

🤨

[sick lantern]

who tf are the founders

[glad spruce]

A paramilitary faction that appeared in the Extremis Malis comic

[sick lantern]

wow well whatever recap video i watched on that years ago didn’t mention them lol

[surreal hearth]

It was an AI thing that gave me full details for what the black tusk was up to on Brooklyn

Was muted for doing that cuss it was a very very long detail

[glad spruce]

Hmm...

I would've done a better job at that than an "AI"

[surreal hearth]

I’ll give you the short version

[torn shoal]

dont give any version if its ai, they always do a VERY bad job

google ai tells people to eat rock to feel better, thats how bad they are

[surreal hearth]

After the failed attempt to kill the division on Rosevelt island using the true sons. Nat has had enough of just throwing cards against us and decided that her remaining people would lead the next “Psychological/propaganda/proxy war” by this one guy that planted the assault against Brooklyn

Nat is using every psychological manipulation tactics on the keener playbook but every time she tried to do that failed miserably and she almost attempted proxy successful with the cleaners if the division had appeared of killing her former best friend and that paradise lost place.

[ashen jungle]

You can tell that's probably not AI, because the grammar is....not great.

[surreal hearth]

Yeah my grammar sucks but atleast is not AI

Anyways we know that nat is struggling cuss she’s tired of being in hovercraft’s and soldier stink so this Denver guy was put in charge on a top secret project. But was located in Brooklyn

Black tusk named it Project Lichtluft.

[ashen jungle]

Project Light Air?

[surreal hearth]

Yes

The purpose of that project was to create an automated state of the art German inspired zeppelin capable of carrying a lot of swarm drones,rapid deployment,like some next level fallout4 brotherhood of steel blimp but with drones.

[ashen jungle]

Kinda seems like it'd be a fairly big target to shoot down.

And Agents can be equipped with a rocket launcher as one of their Spec Weapons.

[surreal hearth]

Ikr like I get it the zeppelin could have been used to destroy all division bunkers but the drawback is how freaking slow a blimp can be

[ashen jungle]

I mean even ignoring the Agents themselves, you have to keep refueling a blimp.

Assuming that it's not using hydrogen (because even BT are not that dumb), whatever they do use is still limited and probably explosive.

[surreal hearth]

That’s were the purple flame came in

I’m speculating that they were using this special fuel, which is the purple flame to increase mass durability on the fuel line for the Zepplin to last longer in the air

[ashen jungle]

A giant, slow moving target with a fuel source that we 100% know is combustible, since purple cleaners.

Something tells me that this won't take long.

[surreal hearth]

I’m just guessing that Denver watched too many German movies thinking that zeppelins would be a great successor to the black tusk arsenal

I will give him credit for one thing and it’s his new modified technology combined With the Conley modifiers to create a flame turret 2.0

Along with rocket turrets that are a literal nightmare to dodge.

[surreal hearth]

It’s not even the hilarious part. They left their SAMS out in the open for a clear shot.

[surreal hearth]

Black tusk may have the technology dominant but their ambitions have started to get questionable

Now this project was created behind a genocidal codename “Scorched Echo”

The codename was well embedded and rather than sent a whole BT squad to execute. They instead rely on three individual deep-cover agents to get the job done

🎯 PRIMARY OBJECTIVES:
1. Eliminate witnesses and collaborators connected to Project Lichtluft.
2. Destroy data caches and prototype tech left during the initial assembly phase.
3. Redirect blame to local factions, keeping Black Tusk’s presence hidden.

[surreal hearth]

Honestly we are pretty much screwing around with little nats bubble system that she created to ensure the term “failure” doesn’t infect her precious little pride

Maximum efficiency is what she really wants.

Nats bubble system is indeed fallible and cannot be questioned

Besides we are ALMOST this close to ending the black tusk once and for all.

[torn shoal]

We are not close at all to end Black tusk

They have bunkers all around and are the biggzst faction to date

• Hunters and true sons on their side

[frosty bluff]

I can only assume that they plan on ending black tusk before the start of Div 3

[surreal hearth]

Yeah but they are still vulnerable now that this “diamond network” is exposed and a manhunt is underway to find it.

[surreal hearth]

The hunters are in complete weak positions. They cannot directly engage us with with larger numbers of division agents ready to hunt down the hunters because the recruiter was killed. It will crippled their ability to get more hunters on the front lines.

[torn shoal]

Hunters dont need large numbers to fight division, same as division dont need large numbers to fight factions, also the recruter is just a title, they have many recruiters

[surreal hearth]

Damn so nat isn’t letting up

I’m also worried about the 3D printer that made its appearance at the end of division1

That same 3-D printing technology was the same one that created the eclipse virus along with the green poison vaccine

[obsidian jay]

Man I sure hope nobody steals it again

[torn shoal]

why would she ? she is the leading military force in the us, she has the bio reactor, vitaly, and so much more

the division and rogue is the only thing stopping them from controlling the country, even if cleaners and rikers are also fighting them on some places and maybe sometime win, they are no match on a large scale

[surreal hearth]

Funny enough, there were some rogues that were hero ones in Brooklyn

[torn shoal]

right being rogue doesnt mean being bad, it just mean not following isac orders

[surreal hearth]

Unfortunately, even with the rogues along with their tech. They got outmatched by the newly dangerous cleaners and rikers.

[torn shoal]

well, rogues arent facetanking them, same as the division

nobody would do that, its a bad move

[surreal hearth]

One for example a rogue sacrifice himself to buy the rest of the hospital staff to evacuate as many people as possible

Him and several rogue agents got killed by the newly formed cleaners and their purple flame weaponry

[torn shoal]

well rogues are still enemies of everyone else

[surreal hearth]

Enemies yes for their own interests but others like in the hospital were doing the right thing despite being red.

[torn shoal]

as i said :

its been a long time since we understood rogues doesnt equal bad

[surreal hearth]

Nat may have all the leverage, but we’re also destroying her security system

Destroying that zeppelin and taking over that old military base was a major loss for the black tusk.

And killing Denver in the process has crippled the black tusk ability for any further proxies to target us.

[sick lantern]

that's not true, the black tusk still have to contend with the molossi, freighties, reborn, and any other factions across the US opposed to their rule

they can't even control the areas where the majority of their known operations are. let alone the entire giant country

[surreal hearth]

I remember those guys

Those factions are basically supply types that delivers food, weapons, meds and so on

[sick lantern]

the freighties are
the roamers are the freighties but evil instead

[torn shoal]

you misunderstood my message : just because bt is superior to all other faction doesnt mean they control 100% of the country

[slim mortar]

Is there hunter chat here

[ashen jungle]

@slim mortar What exactly is a "Hunter chat"?

If you're asking if people will RP wth you on here: the answer is no.

[slim mortar]

Yes

[sick lantern]

luckily you missed that boat by a couple of years

[obtuse arrow]

When did this happen?

[surreal hearth]

One of the comms that says “rogue agents sacrifice to save a hospital”

[obtuse arrow]

In Brooklyn?

[surreal hearth]

Yep

[frosty bluff]

I wonder, if we do take down the Diamond Network and/or figure out a way to take out Nat, what would happen to the rest of their forces? I can only assume that Black Tusk would split up into smaller, more regional factions instead of either completely crumbling or remaining as one entity

For example, one branch essentially becoming an LMB-like force somewhere

[sleek plover]

Damn I hate lmb

[wild crag]

You're probably right, I think they'd split and turn on each other and the surviving groups would operate as roaming bandits led by warlords

It's been a while since I've kept up with the lore, why are we friends with the rogue agents now? How are our watches still orange when we are actively working with and taking orders from them?

[sick lantern]

@wild crag

Keener and Parnell have something something rogue network and a roster of Hunters? to help us fight the Hunters and BT

[solemn sentinel]

man just me or is it really fun to kill Black tusk?

[glad spruce]

They're a bit uptight to my liking. And they're snakes.

At least True Sons and Rikers are funny when we fight them

[marble dawn]

the bottom-of-the-barrel true sons dialogue in the latest manhunt climax was exquisite 🤌

[glad spruce]

Anyone knows who voice acts Hoskins in Battle for Brooklyn? Cuz it's definitely not Katee Sackhoff

[ashen jungle]

It's not just Madion Walsh again, is it?

[glad spruce]

Likely not.

[ashen jungle]

She has got range.

[small knot]

Yes we’re “rogue” to the cabal who is trying to act as the defacto US government since we’re not following what they say. But we’re not part of the rogue network since we still follow ISAC and SHD directives to help the people

[wild crag]

I think the way the story is going we’ll end up being rogue

Since the current plot line is about how not all rogues are bad, I think we’ll end up going rogue for a good reason

[sick lantern]

all rogues are bad, but forming a convenient alliance with them is allowed

not actually sure what Kelso did specifically to get hard marked rogue, but other than her, they're all bad

[wild crag]

She got marked just for working with Keener didn’t she

[sick lantern]

working with rogues doesn't mark you as rogue, we've seen it twice, so she shouldn't have
so either she did something she definitively shouldn't have or it's just a plot inconsistency

[ashen jungle]

If working with Rogues instantly marked you as a Rogue, we would've been marked the moment that Keener came in a few Seasons ago.

[wild crag]

Her watch went red when she was in the car with Keener and his crew so isn’t that when she got the official designation

[sick lantern]

but wasn't the player character also in that car- imma just roll with "plot inconsistency"

[wild crag]

ISAC’s big flaw compared to ANNA is that he sees things as completely black and white

[ashen jungle]

@sick lantern That was just Glasses, Keener, and Kelso.

[sick lantern]

really? i thought they like woke up in the backseat lol

[ashen jungle]

his codename being glasses will never not feel like an underhanded insult.

"here's Vanguard, Cassandra, and dorky specs"

[sick lantern]

either way the PC still doesn't have a red watch despite being in the same situation as Kelso

[wild crag]

I also picked up an audio file that had a bunch of agents that were being overrun. They asked for backup, and got told they were on their own. The agent then says “If we stay here we die, if we leave here we’re rogue! Send help!” Which is a very good example of how easy it is to be deemed rogue

[sick lantern]

yes, the classic WoNY retcon

[wild crag]

I picked that up in Brooklyn

[sick lantern]

it's wayyy older than the brooklyn dlc
or they just made a second collectible with that dialogue

¯_(ツ)_/¯ there's one in WoNY exactly like that

[wild crag]

I found it two days ago in Brooklyn so idk

I think it was in or around the clinic mission

[ashen jungle]

I think at this stage that it's safe to stop referring to it as a "Retcon", and start going with "its the lore now, deal with it"

For me its: Hunters are a failsafe for Agents, that's just the lore now.

[wild crag]

Honestly the reason we aren’t rogue is probably just because of gameplay reasons

[sick lantern]

I'm not gonna go check the exact wording of whatever arcane Descent comm said so, I'm just gonna presume McManus was lying

has a track record of doing bad stuff so I'm gonna treat that as his motivation

if he was telling the truth then i guess the writers are just whitewashing every villainous act in the franchise

[wild crag]

Also we have control of ISAC so I don’t know if it’s even possible for us to be deemed rogue since we own him

[sick lantern]

agents don't control ISAC, if so, why would anyone let themself be marked rogue

[wild crag]

Well no nvm Kelso got rogue’d I’m wrong

Idk I guess gameplay wise it would just be weird for us to be rogue since enemy rogue agents still fight us and whatnot

[sick lantern]

rogues aren't an allegiance, rogues can fight other rogues or do whatever they want

remember the one random BT aligned rogue who showed up one time (not the ones in season 3, the unnamed one from Anderson? manhunt season)

[wild crag]

Also new players coming in would be so out of the loop

They’d finish the base game story and then be immediately marked rogue for something they have no idea about lol

[sick lantern]

well that's the stuff they already have done in the game now. Keener shows up in the White House, Castle gets rebuilt, etc

[wild crag]

Fair

But yeah I mean I’d love to go rogue, it would be a great change of pace if they can figure out a way to make it happen

[sick lantern]

either we should be rogue and it's an inconsistency
Kelso shouldn't be rogue and it's an inconsistency
they don't want to confuse new players by making us rogue and it's a technical limitation
or Kelso did something evil™️ and it was unseen

[solemn sentinel]

i don't think we are rogue cause Cal by all means is a traitor to the nation and so was Elis, + our cell of agents in DC and new york and now Brooklyn are doing our damn jobs

• we buddies with the average civlian that did't break from the whole end of the world and joined one of the factions or became bandits

[sick lantern]

I know this I meant in terms of Keener and Kelso

[solemn sentinel]

fair

[torn shoal]

rogue is legal status, not related to morality

i dont know how many times i have to say this, but being rogue doesnt mean being bad, and being not rogue doesnt mean being good

and 2 parts of the administration can fight each other if their jurisdiction is not clearly defined and it overlaps

it happens a lot, for example on police cases

fbi vs local cops, etc, its such a common thing it becaome a trope in cinema

[frosty bluff]

Saw that on a movie thats being worked on

[frosty bluff]

So for example, would that comm about the agent looting a pharmacy fall under that?

[sick lantern]

show me a genuinely good rogue without stipulation

[torn shoal]

yes, he was doing good, but broke the law, isac said "bad rogue", so he went rogue

he subsequently lost his skills and died, so they reworked isac so that you can still use everything even if you're rogue

also kelso/faye are rogue, but its made pretty clear they were just under cover, not actually killing civilians for fun

theo its not clear yet, he is marked rogue but we dont know what he did to be marked

keener we know, even if he is an ally now, he did try to have us kill and stop the division

[solemn sentinel]

Keener is working with us now...but he also caused a lot of civlians to die and also he made a new virus too...

[torn shoal]

yes, people are multifaceted

even the war criminals, nobody is all good or all bad

[solemn sentinel]

yeah i guess so,

how did the outcasts manage to recruit anyone new after their formation? like they say they wanna hurt everyone who was not part of the quarantine, but we know some former Campus settlers joined them

[torn shoal]

no idea, but coercion is very effective

[zenith spruce]

i like that lore it kinda makes sense

[ashen jungle]

That's the point: you don't have to like it or dislike it, it's canon either way.

[zenith spruce]

i would rather be a hunter then a division agent also you could still act as a div agent while being a hunter if you wanted

like helping people out and stuff

[sudden mortar]

I wonder if Martin Haze is still alive. (you probably don't know who I am talking about, he is a JTF character that thank us for stabilizing Brooklyn on the division 1 tutorial, he says that he's lived in Brooklyn his entire life.)

[torn shoal]

yeah, hunters dont help people, they serve cal and nat by extension

[zenith spruce]

i mean if you were a hunter you could just not work for them i bet its happened

they do use former division agents

[torn shoal]

not really

if you dont work for cal, you're rogue to them

then you're hunted same as agents

[zenith spruce]

so what is a hunter just a person with equivalent training or better to a div agent who hunts them?

or do they have special training

[torn shoal]

better training + better gear specialized into killing agents

[zenith spruce]

could a div agent become one?

[torn shoal]

before the apocalypse you could, some did

[ashen jungle]

One literally did, we killed him.

[zenith spruce]

i like the idea of a rogue hunter turned div asset

[torn shoal]

now, the recruitement process is kinda wonky, and anybody can technically become one, but not as good

[zenith spruce]

so they dropped in quality :(

[torn shoal]

i mean everything dropped since the end of the world

also hunters going rogue and helping the division isnt impossible, but i dont think it happenned so far, and that would be hard to do

[zenith spruce]

also think there are hunters for the hunters? its like the old question who watches the watcher lmao

[torn shoal]

nope

[zenith spruce]

its like that one meme with a gunman behind the gunman then the sniper at the very end

[torn shoal]

yeah i know, its a fun one

but hunters are the last line of control it seem, unless writers decide to change that at some point

[zenith spruce]

i remember a line from a tom clancy book something along the lines of you can't keep a black operation secret forever and it would be funny if there were hunters who were vets who said noah this goes against our oath and ended up making yet another watch dog group but they got mostly wiped out by black tusk and the other hunters

but some still remain

[torn shoal]

very unlikely

also his line about secret is more about secret weapon/tech/army/etc, not that they would turned againt each others

[zenith spruce]

but is it possible even in the slightest because the idea sounds kinda cool like the hunters watching us could they be a part of a different group

[torn shoal]

maybe 1 of them max could betray cal and join the division, but that would be the max, cause the hunters are a force you fight in game, if you had them join you or completely kill them all you'd have to get an entire part of gameplay out

[zenith spruce]

i know

i find they idea some broke off to screw over cal once they learned what he was up too and most died sounds fun like the div doen't know they are being aided by a hunter or 2 but the btsu white tusk and otehr hunters do and are trying to track them down

[torn shoal]

best case scenario, they end up like lewis

betraying any faction usually goes bad in the division

[small knot]

Ya we are, we’ve been hunting them down in every city we’ve been going to

I think it’s why now Cal might be recruiting newer hunters that may be less effective then the originals due to us taking them down

[obtuse arrow]

Most of the hunters are only used against agents that do random things like salute a statue, shoot targets in windows, steal from refrigerators and things like that.

[frosty bluff]

Hey man, that Angel guy really wanted to find out who has been stealing his lunch

[sick lantern]

killing division agents means there’s less help available to people
we’ve two instances of undercover Hunters sitting back and not helping agents in their missions and in fact one of those Hunters gave harmful and malicious orders so no, you can’t be a Hunter and help people

[obsidian jay]

Brooklyn deviated from that just a little bit
especially with the skull one where he's sent to kill you after you killed all the other hunters
and the Fox one has you disable probably important satellites and set off alarms
idk whats going on with lumen, the plushie one, and the map one tho

and the horse one

[tawny frost]

theyre all just arbitrary sets for the hunters to have a reason to reveal themselves

the plushie one plantef explosive traps, so he reveals himself when youve escaped all of them

very few actually make sense

[solemn sentinel]

did all the rioter gangs from DS1 join the rikers, cleaners and other factions/got killed off

[sick lantern]

rioters are still in WoNY

rioter is a label, not a faction
there’ll always be rioters

[solemn sentinel]

true

[torn shoal]

rioters are an unofficial faction in div 1, but they arent organized as the others, they serve as tutorial mostly

they do have a dz boss near the south entrance, but thats it

[solemn sentinel]

fair

[torn shoal]

overall the rioters are just a grouping of random people that wanted to loot stuff and/or leave new york before getting the virus

not really interesting to look at

[solemn sentinel]

Aye

[zenith spruce]

what keeps a hunter form being a morale person tho like if you joined the hunters under good ethical reasons learned they weren't what they said they were and left that sounds possible not very likely but possible

same with black tusk

[torn shoal]

there is no morality in division anymore

its the apocalypse, having moral is a liability overall

[surreal hearth]

To me, the rioters are just a bunch of street thugs loosely organized and some of them have connections to black market gun trades with the rikers

[sick lantern]

no one joined the "super secret assassin group to brutally murder your allies on the whims of a dodgy politician" for good ethical reasons

[zenith spruce]

unless they were never told why they were recruited

i doubt the guy hiring you would tell you you were brought into a "super secret assassin group to brutally murder your allies on the whims of a dodgy politician"

i just think the idea is neat and would make for a cool character

[torn shoal]

well achktually

everyone in any army is recruited for that purpose mostly

any random soldier on any army doesnt know whatever geopolitical machiaviel thing is unraveling

you are recruited to obey order and not talk about it, whatever happen

thats why war crimes are a thing

[zenith spruce]

i mean you do swear an oath to uphold constitution and united states from enemies foreign and domestic and if you got the the cream of the crop to be a hunter i would expect at least 1 or 2 guys in that whole program to think for themselves

[zenith spruce]

true

[torn shoal]

constitution only matter if people care about it, so it depends if your gov/chief is a good person or not

and usually, govs arent really cool with treason even if thats to follow the constitution

[zenith spruce]

i mean some war crimes are understandable like the guys who mag dumped germans who surrendered in the liberation of a certain camp it was in a book about ww2 i read i can try and find it its very interesting

which was a war crime then patton said i didn't see a thing lol

[torn shoal]

no war crime is understandable man

lets not do some war crime apology

just cause the other side is doing it is no reason to do it yourself

[zenith spruce]

seeing the camps then mag dumping a surrendering german soldier is understandable

[torn shoal]

still a war crime

[zenith spruce]

i know you shouldn't do it I'm just saying i understand why you would in the heat of the moment in certain situations

[torn shoal]

yeah but thats why rules are a thing, if you just get heated and ignore rules/laws, then why have them in the first place

like "i was just heated" and its keener killing civilians, wouldnt sit well

[zenith spruce]

anyways imma get back to this mission also i haven't eaten all morning lol and it was very enjoyable yapping with yall i rarely see or have a actually fun conversation so thanks

[torn shoal]

np, bon appetit

[zenith spruce]

keener killing innocent people: i was just a lil annoyed UwU pls let me help you beat the bad guys now can we be friends

[torn shoal]

haha

[zenith spruce]

like i would work with the guy then kill him after instantly

[sick lantern]

how would you train anyone for that without telling them about it?

[zenith spruce]

be vague

very vague double speak is the art of saying stuff without really saying anything and politicians are very good at that

[rich lark]

Would you want division 3 to be further into the apocalypse maybe a year or two skip

[torn shoal]

its actually very bad, if you say "yeah you gonna do good stuff" then ask to murder innocent civilians out in the open, people not gonna follow u

[solemn sentinel]

Unless you true son

[zenith spruce]

yeah unless you explain it in a very clever way if you want examples there's a book called double speak by william lutz its very very funny and gives a good way of of showing how people lie without you ever knowing

[zenith spruce]

yeah they are something else lmao its a civvie imma kill it :D -least insane true son

[humble jacinth]

Which division tech skill would actually be useful in a irl situation

[ashen jungle]

Oxidiser would be great in helping remove junk scrap metal.

[solemn sentinel]

Some of the healing tech

Lorewise do we know how the Fixer drone works? Does it just spray us with Sci-fi nano bots that repair our Armor

[ashen jungle]

I like to think it just has a bunch of ducttape and the little nano-bots tape up the bullet holes.

[solemn sentinel]

Lol,

Do the SHD in DC and New York even have the means/people to Reverse engineer Black tusk tech like the Warhounds?

[ashen jungle]

Well since the Warhounds are stolen from the DARPA labs, and that's where the SHD tech is made....

It's kinda hard to say.

[rich lark]

I like to joke that if it wasn't for the theft we'd have SHD Warhounds

[ashen jungle]

If it wasn't for the theft, we'd have 10ft tall Turrets.

I'll never forgive Nat for taking that from us.

[torn shoal]

If it wasnt for the theft we'd have the bio reactor and vitaly with us, but thoses greedy ceo man, cant be stopped

[obtuse chasm]

If Aiden Pearce was in division universe do you guys thinks he's Alive?

[rich lark]

Fun fact he's dead

[solemn sentinel]

yeah, do you think in the division 3 if or when it comes out that we will still face Natasha or will we face a other member of the secert cabal?

[rich lark]

I think 2 should wrap on nats defeat and 3 should focus more on restoration

The whole idea of restoring order has kinda been lost between all the spy shit

[tulip patio]

you know I always wondered, the overgrown vegetation around the maps, is that realistic? to me it always made the map look like 2-3 years into the story rather than months

[solemn sentinel]

i have thought about that... like its only been half a year, but idk if its spefiec to DC mabye

[tulip patio]

I at first thought yeah maybe it's a DC fauna thing, but Brooklyn looks the same

[solemn sentinel]

huh intresting

[tulip patio]

you can walk around in a big city like that and I guarantee you there's no cleanup crew constantly making sure there's no overgrowth like that, but no area looks like that

[solemn sentinel]

yeah it will take a few years for vegiation to overgrow a non maintained building

[tulip patio]

the visuals though are really good I have to say but yeah just gives me the vibe that years passed, some of the new mission areas in Brooklyn feel the same, like visiting some old WW2 overgrown bunker lol

[solemn sentinel]

lol, i have not played Brooklyn yet, meanwhile manhatten feels like a warzone

[solemn sentinel]

yeah that would be cool! mabye seeing a legit entire city that is now run by a new form of goverment who are clashing with other cities or factions who have rebuilt

[rich lark]

It's realistic

Look at how quickly the world begun to heal when COVID hit

[solemn sentinel]

it did?

[rich lark]

In a matter of a Year Wich Brooklyn takes about 7 months into the outbreak the world begun to heal waters became clear and clean

Air pollution fell

And animals begun returning to cities

[solemn sentinel]

yeah it is just more the overgrowth that seems rather fast

[rich lark]

There's not much data on overgrowth during COVID but who knows

[solemn sentinel]

oof

[glad spruce]

Maintenance over. Time to collect the weekly comm

[tulip patio]

I still do not remember seeing such plant growth suddenly months into covid

ok yes here it's a different scenario cause society still functioned during that but idk, still gives me the impression of a bigger time skip

[rich lark]

I get where you're coming from

But I think a part of it is games like the last of us where we see entire buildings flooded and overun with plants

[tulip patio]

oh yeah, I bet it went for a similar type of look to evoke the feeling of apocalypse

and it certainly looks great for sure, was more curious about the realism of it

[rich lark]

The very noticeable overgrowth that seems possible is in the DZ

Where no one is trying to even push anything back or trying to keep things manageable

[tulip patio]

yeah I can see it being realistic in the really abandoned areas, or even areas closer to countryside

[glad spruce]

Descent comm 92, Amherst.

||Jessica Kandel and Theo Parnell discuss about Amherst's printer, which the latter admit he has it, but he doesn't have his research. Kandel expresses that with ISAC, he has the research, every keystroke and failed experiment that Amherst made.||

||Theo mentions Green Poison not being a threat anymore, but what Kandel was trying to say with what Amherst did, it proved that it's possible for any nut job with the tech and the research to create something similar.||

||When Theo asks about the BSAV (Broad-Spectrum Antiviral) that Kandel worked on in Ann Arbor, she says that Natalya Sokolova had stole it and had her research scrubbed. Theo tried to reassure her, as he mentions that Agent Kelso and some of her fellow D.C agents managed to get the anti-virals from Tidal Basin.||

||Which led to Kandel asking how come they're not distributing it country-wide and vaccinating everyone, in which Parnell expresses that D.C's Division don't have enough and the means of distribution||

||Kandel expresses that with the printer, Amherst proved all it takes is one a-hole with the tech and the will. With the printer in Keener's settlement, they have the tech, but they need Ann Arbor's recipe for the BSAV.||

[glad spruce]

Manhunt comm 3, The Plan

||Bardon Schaeffer explains to Manny Ortega that in order to take down The Network for good, they need Claire Ortiz, the "football", and the Presidential Clearance.||

||Manny says they don't have those three, tho Schaeffer insists they have the clearance, but Manny was confused as he thought you need to be the President. Which led to Schaeffer frustratingly asking him if he asked Kelso what the Cassandra mission was before he let her go.||

||Schaeffer explains that he's the key to teh Black Tusk bunkers, not the Ortizx Robotics Network. He further explains that if Faye finished her mission and Ellis died, then that meant the latter transferred the clearance to the former's watch, which makes Manny realize that Faye's watch is the clearance.||

||Which led to Manny saying that Kelso has the watch with her, and she insisted to go dark since she'll put a target on the White House had she stayed. When asked by Schaeffer if she told him in a comms free space, Manny said yes as she insisted no comms, wi-fi killers, and EMPs, as she didn't want to be recorded just in case.||

||Schaeffer says it was smart from Kelso, musing that even with her being ex-CIA, they didn't revoke her training.||

Time to write them down in the wiki

[sick lantern]

||Faye’s watch|| is the president sure ok
I actually said “what!?” aloud

like a shang tsung soul steal just scwhipped on over

[glad spruce]

There's a difference between the clearance and the president.

The clearance being the Ark Protocol or "The Football".

[sick lantern]

Way to take what I said overly literally

[ashen jungle]

This is a lore discussion channel.

[sick lantern]

so they addressed that at last but not in a satisfactory manner

[glad spruce]

Did I miss something?

Ah, so some guy posting LFG or about the game, no related to the story and the lore.

[ashen jungle]

Close enough.

[glad spruce]

With Bardon Schaefer now out of his coma, the team receives intel about a deep-cover asset who’s been off-grid since the events of Coney Island. Extraction plans are underway-but time is running out, and staying under the radar is critical.``` - Crossroads article on the official website

Cuz I know some people were theorizing the Manhunt target is Matthew Grant.

[marble dawn]

Wasn't Grant at ||Army Terminal, then evacuated?||

[glad spruce]

I haven't played the mission in a while, so probably

I need to check the dialog once I have the guts to farm it

[small knot]

||When Schaffer mentions the “football” in the manhunt comms i assume he’s talking about the nuclear football? Cause that’s the only thing I can think of with the name football which also has me worried what the nuclear football does to take down the diamond network ||

[glad spruce]

||It has to be the nuclear football, so what else could it be?||

[surreal hearth]

That is alot of juicy information

It makes sense why she already knew about the printer but never Agent Hopkins

[glad spruce]

Hoskins

[torn shoal]

lets remember that football doesnt mean the same thing in the us and the rest of the world

for some reason you guys like to call football a sport where people grab the ball with your hand and dont use your foot

i feel it was an important reminder

[autumn tundra]

Any prior lore for Terry Robinson (Quartermaster in Brooklyn), he appears to be a BT/WT defector

[glad spruce]

Not that we saw.

We did have prior lore for Maral McCarthy and Rodney Bishop, who are both members in The Bridge.

Aside from that، no prior lore about Terry

[surreal hearth]

A black tusk defector?

[autumn tundra]

I assume he is a BT defector, because he is still wearing a black tusk shirt (technically white tusk I guess cause it's white), the same ones the heavies wear, and he has dog tags etc.

[surreal hearth]

White tusk aka the last man battalion merged white tusk

And yet we failed to secure stovepipe but realized that there was already a black tusk defect on our side

[surreal hearth]

It would be awesome for him to implement simulation to take on the white tusk

LMBs were notorious for one of the most anti-division tactics trained by the keener loyalists as well as well trained and well equipped gears part of division tech

Only the most well coordinated division agents can take on the most elite white tusk/ LMB anti-division special ops in the entire game

[zenith spruce]

at there peak could the the lmb take out the black tusk at there best

[ashen jungle]

No.

[torn shoal]

lmb couldnt even control a single city, while bt control multiple

also lmb heli could be taken down ingame

[full grail]

Tchernenko? haven't seen him since coney island (unless he was mentioned in warlords and i missed it)

[glad spruce]

Not a chance.

Tchernenko was kidnapped by Black Tusk during their attack on the White House.

[torn shoal]

Yeah at some point the div either has to défend the White house correctly or spread their assets into several places so that doesnt happen

[full grail]

So we meed to recover claire ortiz and the football, and then use them against the black tusk

sounds like the trilogy stories they like to do with seasons...

[sick lantern]

what cities

[full grail]

???

[ashen jungle]

@full grail Scammer.

[full grail]

ah

[ashen jungle]

One occasionally gets through, but 99% of them are blocked.

[glad spruce]

It may sound simple, but nothing is ever that easy with us Division agents.

[storm axle]

So kelso is rogue but is helping us?

[glad spruce]

Yes

And Faye was trying to help us and warn us about the Hunters, even though we killed her

In fact, we're allied with Keener and his team

[storm axle]

I love plot of division

[glad spruce]

Gotta love sarcasm

[storm axle]

First Rogue agent, person who killed many people, war criminal, antagoinst of both games is now our allie

[ashen jungle]

It's actually Aaron, not Alison.

Keener's first name. Just to avoid confusion.

[storm axle]

So kelso and faye went rogue but there actually were good and wanted to help us

Make ablosute sense

[ashen jungle]

Your grammar is steadily getting worse, I'm interested to see how bad it gets.

[storm axle]

I can use Polish if you want

[ashen jungle]

No you can not, english only on the server.
Translating it is not explaining the spelling though, or the weirdly angry tone.

If you dislike the story, explain why. Don't just post snappy one-liners.

[storm axle]

Im not translating anything i just write like that

And im not angry or anything. Its just kinda funny that our allies became our enemies but they actually were helping us

English is not my first language so i dont use it perfectly and sometimes things that i write may sound different from i want them to sound

[ashen jungle]

It's coming across like you want to make snarky comments about the story because you disagree with the direction it's taken.
But this is all off-topic so let's just go back to the lore. Misunderstanding dealt with.

[torn shoal]

People switching sides is def not the unrealistic thing or original

It's more common than gun fight in thoses type of stories

[glad spruce]

On one hand, I'm tempted to write a recap of Operation Cassandra, to help people understand what is it about

On the other hand, it might be better to wait till all this season's Manhunt comms in this season are available before I go there

[storm axle]

Btw
SHD can be put in almost every Apo themed media, and it still would fit

You can put SHD in the walking dead or The last of us and IT would still make sense

You can put SHD in planet of apes and it would fit in just fine

Yea

[torn shoal]

planet of the ape has no human civilisation so i dont think so

[storm axle]

But i'm talking about modern movies

[torn shoal]

im not a fan of reboot so i havent watched

[storm axle]

Me neither

I just Remember once scene i saw on tictok where apes, are fighting with cops on golden gate

[ashen jungle]

Okay fanfic over, back to the lore.

[daring dew]

whats everyones thoughts on how ubisoft is directing the lore after the wony dlc

[small knot]

I dig it, I find it interesting that they’re trying to remake keener into more of an anti hero as he does what he does because it’s what needs to be done and he doesn’t mind morals behind it

Like launching the eclipse virus at city hall to take out the embedded hunters that were there and having it so the eclipse virus was actually his failsafe for dealing with the hunters

[storm axle]

What is the worst death in the entire serie?

[ashen jungle]

The guy that was lowered upside-down into the barrel of dc-62 in one of the DZ's in div2.

[storm axle]

Btw
Im still not sure, but first wave agent were activatrd only in NY?

[zenith spruce]

got a screen shot?

[ashen jungle]

It's part of one of the DZ stories, the guy in question convinced the community to get the DC-62 added to their place, and then it got cold and 💀

Gimme a bit to load in, I'll go get a fresh one.

@zenith spruce

[torn shoal]

yes, then 2nd wave was activated after we lost the entire first wave

[torn shoal]

this guy look very much together for a guy dead for a while

[ashen jungle]

The events of the franchise are done in fairly short order after the initial outbreak.

It has not been 9 years.
and since no insect predation: less decomposition.

[storm axle]

Ok, but second wave wad activated in entire America or only in NY again?

[torn shoal]

only in ny, but then the outbreak was global so they were activated all around

[storm axle]

Ok, thanks

[frosty bluff]

Bro deserved it 💀

[sudden mortar]

||I love Schaffer almost losing his patience with Manny, guess Manny isn't so smart after all ||

[glad spruce]

Radio tech and Network tech are two different ballgames

[torn shoal]

manny isnt really anything outstanding on any topic

he is a random guy that happenned to be in charge cause everyone is dead

[sudden mortar]

No wonders he joined the JTF, he is incompetent like them

[ember vector]

If I'm not mistaken, the Brooklyn DLC is nearing the 1st anniversary of the outbreak!

[ashen jungle]

If that's the case, then that's only 1 year, which is a lot faster than we've had IRL.

[torn shoal]

funny that we could retake dc + ny + brooklyn in such a short time

vs a fully geared and trained pmc and multiple factions

[ashen jungle]

Each Faction kinda hates the other ones, even if some are now working together.
Remember that BT geared up others in secret, they weren't just geared up on their own.

[surreal hearth]

I forgot the name of this guy for allowing DC-62 into Georgetown

[surreal hearth]

Wow after listening to the comms manny is literally incompetent

[glad spruce]

Fork found in kitchen

But in all seriousness, it feels like Manny is being treated as a punching bag

[marble dawn]

Yeah everyone is so mean to him and talking shit behind his back, whatd the guy do 😂

[torn shoal]

Nah but manny is a good guy, but he def isnt cut for this job

He did sent à lot of people to their death

Like giving us intel/update/coms is fine, but telling us what to do or overall lead is not his strong suit

Hey at least he isnt one of thoses npc that bump into us when we on inventory

[marble dawn]

There was the camp white oak meatwave tactics at least, I dont remember any other 'suicide missions' (not counting sheriffs missions)

Everyone else for the job is dead or deserted

[plush flame]

Thought people might find this neat.

I am making a division universe RP server, set in my home city of Pittsburgh.

The idea being Pittsburgh, in going into martial law as we know in lore, basically walls its self off from the rest of the world, and as far as I can tell from the map, it should have an SHD node somewhere in the city, as two lines cross each other at Pittsburgh.

I had a further idea that for the most part, the city, even going into martial law, recovers rather gracefully because of resource capabilities of the city, the division agents there even find a way to rig SHD tech so the train system here functions as a way to connect even regions beyond the dark zone walls, to make it easier to bring in individuals without possible quarantine problems.

The reason things begin to change is a mystery, starting with the factions within increasing in violence and aggression, seemingly out of nowhere, but as things progress, it seems like each faction wants something, and whatever that stuff is each faction wants, if put together, could lead to disaster.

I am even working up a map to use for the RP, which will be one or two zones to start with, and I will expand it from there, just to keep things fairly compact to start with.

If anyone has any ideas they'd like to contribute, lemme know.

[full grail]

@plush flame SHD node under Fort Duquesne 👀

[plush flame]

You know what, I was trying to figure out where to put it, and the building isn't there any longer, but you know, the underground area might still be there.

[full grail]

Could just pretend theres catacombs or something

[plush flame]

That was my thought, when I said underground area.

Since the museum is nearby, and a couple other nearby structures, oh and the old tunnel is there too.

It would be, especially since their would be less distinct dark zones and more anything beyond the most nearby districts would become dark zones.

Since the city could only support so much if martial law was enacted.

[full grail]

Vibe

post apoc pittsburgh was cool in the last of us, but didn't they just make up a completely new city layout?

[plush flame]

They might have, but honestly, making a proper city layout would not be that hard, if you kept it to a fairly compact circle of influence.

With anything beyond that being dark zones.

As well as any special locations beyond that being special missions or raids.

[full grail]

Would Dark Zones be that necessary? Considering apart from the downtown it's not that densely populated

[plush flame]

Dark zones would be areas beyond that sphere of influence, only because it would be an area that has little to no defended presence, but still with resources and locations of use, if one would want to go into the dark zones.

So its not a place you primarily need to go, but it still has its use, for example, later when I introduce rogue agents, their may be some who bided their time in the dark zone beyond the defended circle of influence.

Also for the RP, I am doing 6 main stat types, not just 3.

OFFENSIVE    - Strength
DEFENSIVE    - Absorption
SKILLS       - Intelligence
SPEED        - Endurance
HEALING      - Regeneration
TACTICS      - Technique

With 3 custom character types.
Agents - Division Agents
Civilians - Settlement Militia / Neutral Person Of Interest
Enemies - Named Faction Enemy / Special Enemy ( Rogue Agents For Example )

[full grail]

Damn this sounds cool

Was doing some reading on Pittsburgh and it seems like medicine and robotics/technology are two big industries in this century, could have like a virus study lab at the uni hospital, black tusk could be interested in building their robots there etc

[ashen jungle]

Sorry, but no RP stuff on this server.
We used to allow it, but someone posted multiple chapters and now it's a "no go".

[zenith spruce]

daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaamn

[sleek plover]

JUSTICE

[solemn sentinel]

think we will get a other story dlc that is the same size as Battle for Brooklyn?

[ashen jungle]

It seems likely that they'll be another DLC, if 3 is as far away as we think it is.

[sick lantern]

gotta love convoluted excuses to get the player alone

[solemn sentinel]

Did Keener let Dragov and Conley die on purpose?

[sick lantern]

probably, he does that a lot

[solemn sentinel]

true, also the fact the two were deffently more evilish than Theo,

[glad spruce]

You know what would be funny, if Black Tusk had their own Orson Krennic

[glad spruce]

Okay, I've replayed the Army Terminal.

Matthew Grant was there, he got extracted via helicopters alongside the scientists.

[marble dawn]

Could the target be Claire Ortiz? Only existing charater I can think of and she was mentioned in the recent comm

Unless its going to be a completely new character

[glad spruce]

The article on the official website states the Manhunt target is a deep-cover asset embedded in Sokolov Concern

[glad spruce]

Unless Claire managed to somehow to do facial reconstruction, I doubt she's the Manhunt target

[marble dawn]

Oh right

[solemn sentinel]

Would she also not be with her husband?

[glad spruce]

Yes

Last we heard from them, they were set in an underground bunker during the outbreak's early stages

[solemn sentinel]

yeah, i don't think she will co deep cover into black tusk to later help us without her husband

[frosty bluff]

I honestly don't know if there would be another dlc, but here is what I feel:

• There will be no more dlcs afterwards, since this current season feels like they're ramping up to ending the Black Tusk, and therefore concluding Div 2 Black Tusk arc.
• Working up to making finalized versions of all strongholds/missions, for example, as seen in Camp White Oak with the bridge being reconstructed.

[fringe mauve]

So what happened down in Norfolk, VA? I mean the size of the naval presence is huge down there

[frosty bluff]

They either were destroyed by the hurricane, got occupied, being salvaged, or is being utilized for military or as a home

[sick lantern]

the black tusk potentially tried to occupy the area, Broken Dawn says they went for military sites across the region
to what success we don’t know

[fringe mauve]

You know, I would love to see tye combat footage of them going after the marines. God it would be hilarious

[sick lantern]

crayon eaters vs high tech crayon eaters?

[fringe mauve]

Like all i can hear is the marines saying, "thank you Chesty for this bountiful harvest for which we are about to feast upon."

[storm axle]

The Pit?

Oh my god fallout reference

[lusty owl]

What is the big vehicle outside the front of the white house supposed to be? A SAM platform? Or a flying vehicle? It only has one wheel which seems weird for moving it.

[full grail]

It's a black tusk razorback - immediately after the stove pipe manhunt it's revealed it was a distraction to pull our agent out of the white house, allowing black tusk to attack it and steal the perfusion bioreactor and kill captain Lewis. Our agents make it back from coney Island in time to prevent BT from abducting schaeffer and doing more damage, culminating in destroying the razorback. It was basically a rehash of the first mission where you fight hyenas up to the white house, but with black tusk. There is also some black tusk trucks and gear scattered around the white house as a result

[lusty owl]

Oh okay. I don't think that mission appeared for me after Coney Island.

[full grail]

Yeah I think they removed it for some reason

You have to have done the Stove pipe manhunt mission for the first time though, have you done that?

[lusty owl]

Oh that must be why. I have never completed a manhunt

[full grail]

fair enough, I find them quite nice to spice up the grind of priority objectives at times

The stovepipe one is really hard, especially on your first run though

[frosty bluff]

And it gets harder once you start grinding that and keener's missions for the comms
Specifically, harder on your brain as you struggle to stay conscious on repetitive boredom and struggling to survive the dogs

[full grail]

I found cerberus to be wayyy easier than sparkle, just forced to take longer cause of the mechanic

[frosty bluff]

True.
Sparkle is either burning to death, being jammed, or burning to death

Cerberus runs around shooting at you, but its more boring due to that bullet sponge mechanic

And luckily, the Sparkles clones in Brooklyn weren't True Sparkles

Imagine doing that mission with the Four True Sparkles

[full grail]

yeah luckily you can melt the army terminal ones before they even fully activate with a good enough build

I definitely found Violet difficult on first playthrough as well

[sick lantern]

haven’t beat WoNY either?

[full grail]

Anyone else fell kind of cucked that the rogue marauder was only used in that one side mission?

Hopefully Theo brings it back for some manhunts

[glad spruce]

This is why I strongly believe in having Legacy Manhunts fully replayable

[torn shoal]

yeah also i could finally get my fkin coms from the recruiter manhunt

[frosty bluff]

Recruiter is actually easier than the dogs

[frosty bluff]

Just kill recruiter in your first, then teleport to the starting area of the map, farm the sub bosses, and afterward teleport back to the starting area

If you want to challenge yourself killing Recruiter multiple times, go ahead, but its more time efficient to kill those other bosses and not recruiter

[torn shoal]

idc if its easier, i need the coms

i dont care about a challenge

im still missing the coms cause i cant play the manhunt

you might wanna read what you're answering to

[frosty bluff]

How are you unable to play the manhunt? You can't swap the mission from Standard/Invaded/Faye Lau?

[torn shoal]

I can, it doesnt drop all the coms

[rich river]

Division 3 channels, when?

[sick lantern]

why make channels for a game that has literally zero info

[rich river]

to prepare for the flood

[sick lantern]

When? When is the info going to come out? We don't know.

no press release, no teaser, no trailer, nothing

[torn shoal]

there is litterally 0 info about div 3 we dont need that

[lusty owl]

I have beat WONY

[glad spruce]

When we get the first official info on Division 3, that's when we get the channels

[sick lantern]

there was a Razorback on Liberty Island

[versed lily]

Wait!? D3!? I have seen nothing about it

[glad spruce]

They announced it in September 2023

[strange rock]

I'm guessing the ||portable nuclear reactor|| is now in the hands of Theo and Hoskins?

[glad spruce]

Yes. With that ||reactor|| in their hands, they won't have to worry about sustaining power for the settlement when Winter arrives.

[strange rock]

Was wondering if it was in the bridge settlement after completing army, looks like it's not
Also interesting that the Black Tusk are starting to call us rogues

[glad spruce]

As far as Black Tusk and Cal's Hunters are concerned, any Division agent who don't fall in line are Rogues, regardless whether their watches are red or not

[sick lantern]

the black tusk are a private, non governmental entity so that doesn’t really matter

[strange rock]

In the grand scheme of things yeah it's doesn't, but I think narratively at least in game it's the first time I think I've heard us being called rogues
There might be past comms that I don't recall of course

[sick lantern]

I remember Schaeffer in season 3 distinctly saying the sheriff wasn’t rogue, he just didn’t care about rogue vs non rogue

people in the fandom have been calling the division rogue for years, maybe the writers have started to get caught in it too, weirder things have happened

[glad spruce]

This Descent comm from Y6S1 has Birdie commenting our player agents are Rogues, regardless of our watch status and why she sees it that way.

https://thedivision.fandom.com/wiki/Workaround

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=igUYZWdEfMk

[torn shoal]

thats cause we are rogue for hunters, which are allied to bt, so they consider us rogue too

[sick lantern]

“You're fighting the Black Tusk. Cal is with them, if he's in charge and you're fighting him, you're kind of Rogue, my dude.”
except Cal is not in charge

[torn shoal]

cal is in charge of hunters

so unless president order him to stop, he can do whatever he wants

i mean even if the president order him to stop he cant do whatever he wants, its not like president had any power left anyway

the only armed force that could follow him would be agents following isac

which is basically the same as right now

i dont understand why people care so much about "who is actually in charge legally" when there is no law or rules or justice system anymore

the country fell long ago, its time to build a new one, not rebuild the old one that brought the end of times

[obsidian jay]

Well
we don't tell him about
the darkzones

[gaunt ice]

because le rogue is cool en awesome!!!!!!!

red watch edgy, dark grim rogue agent OC

[glad spruce]

Rogues are awesome. I'm glad you agree, chairs 😛

[obtuse chasm]

Does ANNA and ISAC bestie?

[glad spruce]

I don't know if they're besties, considering they're designed differently from each other

[obtuse chasm]

It would be nice seeing them talking to each other like so wholesome

[marble dawn]

From what little interaction we've got I got sibling vibes (but the brother is a bit simple)

[small knot]

Hey what counts as an enemy officer?

[vast agate]

I don't know. Two supercomputers started communicating directly with each other in Colossus: The Forbin Project and it didn't bode well for humanity.

[glad spruce]

Descent comm 93, Tchernenko.

||Theo Parnell and Jessica Kandel discuss about Vitaly Tchernenko, where Kandel calls Tchernenko an idiot due to his part in creating the Eclipse Virus, even though he was initially trying to create a cure. While Parnell admits there were mistakes made in creating the Eclipse, Kandel still made her stance clear: She refuses to work with Tchernenko and doesn't want him in her lab, so she tells Parnell to get him out.||

[glad spruce]

Are you referring to the second Scout objective? That's for named enemies in West End

[true fox]

😕 .

Does she at least understand the real situation, why everything happened?
Next week, I hope Theo answers.

[glad spruce]

Manhunt comm 4, The Recruiter.

||Manny Ortega and Bardon Schaeffer discuss Brian Johnson (aka The Recruiter), as Schaeffer knew he was a Hunter and tried to warn The Division about him but couldn't due to his coma.||

||Manny admits his screw-up, letting Brian manipulate him, and Schaeffer tells him it's not his fault. At the end of the day, Brian Johnson is a honest and trustworth who wanted to rebuild society and raise a family in relative safety. He just happened to end at the wrong end of the stick.||

||Manny muses that if everyone agrees what rebuilding society should be about, they wouldn't be in this mess. And Schaeffer counters that people disagree whether they should drink cow milk, especially how parents should raise their children, which are things that no civilization managed to solve.||

||Manny understands Schaeffer's position, mentioning about being becoming a new dad. Schaeffer congratulates him and asks how he's holding up. Manny admits he's nervous, but committed to the role, as being a parent is a job that no one could quit easily.||

[tulip patio]

I wish they'd drop all the stuff about relationships/parents/flirting whatever from the comms

I want to see what Black Tusk do next not Manny's relationship lol

[ashen jungle]

Human beings tend to be interested in that sort of thing.

It's a staple of most stories for a reason.

[tulip patio]

yeah they should keep it as background detail I am here for the post-apocalyptic conflicts not this

like yeah sure mention it, it happens and it's normal, but I don't care about it going on and on, some other comms had this issue too, talking about dating, I am not in a dating sim here

[ashen jungle]

Luckily, no one is trying to date you. So it's not a dating sim.

[tulip patio]

they keep talking about dating which is taking up space

[glad spruce]

Considering Manny is a guy who's torn between his duties and becoming a father, it'd feel jarring not to have that part involved

[ashen jungle]

The best part about the div franchise has always been the background details that make up the world.
Once people's basic needs are met, they're going to move on to the other essentials.

[tulip patio]

there was this other comm with I forgot who, probably that one rogue woman that was a hunter her name escapes me now, two characters were talking about her dating someone and she made some reply along the lines of "eughhh gross" it sounds like cheap dialogue

[ashen jungle]

Do you mean Lau's SO, an early Manhunt focus, and one of the first people we ever hunted down?

[tulip patio]

think it was her, Douglas

[glad spruce]

Bridgette "Viper" Douglas

[tulip patio]

I forgot details, and it's not like all comms are like that, but too many of them are about that in my opinion, some world building makes sense like Manny's kid and relationship but it feels they keep dragging it on at times instead of focusing more on the conflict

[ashen jungle]

The conversation was about her hooking up with Keener.
Replies like that do make it seem like you aren't following the story.

[glad spruce]

And my favorite Rogue Agent

[tulip patio]

I am following the story I just forgot details, me not remembering the details of a rather irrelevant comm doesn't mean I am clueless

my point is it's a pointless comm, it felt like just filler which it was

[ashen jungle]

You not remembering who Viper was is a little more than forgetting some small details.

[tulip patio]

I just forgot her name lol

[ashen jungle]

She's also the daughter of the guy in the White House firing-range.

kind of an important character.

[tulip patio]

I know she was rogue and also meant to become hunter, it's not relevant to my point though idk why you insist on it, my point is comms like the one I specified are filler

[ashen jungle]

IIRC a comm just before/after that one is where they hinted at the White House traitor.

Which only works if you set her up as a sympathetic character.
Humanise her, which is what comms like that do.

Why am I bothering with this.

[tulip patio]

they did humanize her when I learned she was indirectly on your side

that was done well and not what my issue is, my issue is filler

[glad spruce]

A few comms about characters sharing a bit of their personal life is not the end of the world

[tulip patio]

pressure from her father? yeah I get what impact that has, the business, her decisions leading up to her becoming rogue, the detail about being a hunter, all great, but certain comms insist too much about pointless details, like the dating Keener one, that detail is just extra

there's others too, they go on too long about certain aspects, wish we'd get more leaked Black Tusk comms, more details about the bunkers leading from last week, things like that

[ashen jungle]

There is absolutely no way to type this out so you understand.
Just turn off your sound if you don't want to hear the comms.

[tulip patio]

no need to be snarky

[ashen jungle]

Coming in to a channel that is specifically about discussing the lore, and saying that you wished they would not talk about aspects of the lore, is a weird take.

It's coming across as "i dont want to hear about these people talking because of the specific topic", and not just because its dating.

There is no way to only talk about purely plot relevant lore points week-to-week and still have enough to keep it interesting for the big reveals.

[tulip patio]

no my point is, I will "type this out so you understand", I wish they focused more on the lore partaining to the grander conspiracy going on in the background, more so than on characters' personal lives. I am not saying don't humanize them at all, just that they lose focus on that overarching story and focus too much on specific lives.

[glad spruce]

I forgot to mention that part in the comm. Jessica Kandel believed Tchernenko was ||experimenting on people when he created the Eclipse, hence why she didn't want him in her sights and her lab.||

[ashen jungle]

If she was talking about dating a character that you liked, say, some guy, would you be more interested in hearing about it?

[tulip patio]

for example with Manny, his story about finding love and having a kid in this scenario is quite interesting I admit and to an extent I really liked it, but it feels like now every known character has to congratulate him and every few comms I have to hear about it, when the relevant details of this little story were already communicated to us.

[true fox]

Now I really hope that Theo answers this

thanks

[tulip patio]

Irrelevant, I do not care about who she dates, her connection to Faye was what mattered, they elaborated on it and that's it, do I need to hear a string of her going "eugh" to people she wouldn't want to date now?

[ashen jungle]

She literally said that about one single person.

Someone who is incredibly plot relevant.

It helps elaborate on their relationship, and why she might not have actually been bad-bad, someone who could've been an ally.

[tulip patio]

Yes and my point is that one time felt like filler, Keener does his own thing, Douglas does her own thing, we learned about them both, that one comm was filler and I have a feeling they will keep giving us fillers like that.

[ashen jungle]

As I've said a few times now: you can not have a story that is purely go-go-go with the main plot. Filler is required.

[tulip patio]

Ok they can do that, I just disagree on it.

[ashen jungle]

Yes, and I'm asking what you would do to fill in 14 comms worth of relevant story , and still leave reveals for future Seasons, DLC, etc?

[tulip patio]

Some filler is expected I just wish they purposed it differently too, like fleshing out more factions instead or something like that, I feel most characters so far like Douglas are quite elaborate already, as elaborate as they need to be for the plot.

[ashen jungle]

We literally did not know about any of this stuff with her until these comms. She is not a well defined character before now.

[tulip patio]

Ok but I specified, I did not mean all her comms are filler, just specific ones like her comment about dating Keener

[ashen jungle]

I would like to see story on other characters, but as these are Manhunt comms, they have to relate to the current Manhunt story.

Like ANNA talking about how they're maybe kinda in-love with Keener. That helps define that ANNA has more sentience than maybe people realise.

[tulip patio]

Ok then how would you say the Keener one adds to the story? Specifically the idea of her dating Keener?

[ashen jungle]

^

Read the replies and take from them what you need to.

[tulip patio]

They already did that about her with the other comms, what about this one specifically adds to it?

[ashen jungle]

I am 100% giving up on this now. You do not get it.

[tulip patio]

"Hey Bridgette would you date Keener?" - "Eugh no gross".

What does this add? Her actually being an inside agent working with Keener, her relationship to her father and the history of her family business. Her ties to Faye, all those added something, what does this add though? You give up because you have no way to explain what it adds compared to all those other more meaningful comms and details about her. You do not get it lol.

[glad spruce]

It adds more credence to the fact that Bridgette is a lesbian, since I'm sure some people would come to the wrong conclusion, and think she and Keener are an item, when they're actually best friends.

[tulip patio]

They made that clear before though.

[ashen jungle]

I can confirm that even if you put the word in your name, chevrons around your pfp as a pride flag, and a rainbow skull inside said pride flag chevrons, people will still mistake it.

The elaboration is necessary.

[tulip patio]

I don't see how because I never heard anyone think her and Keener were together, who she was interested in was made clear before

[tulip patio]

Like a similar example to this would be somehow people thinking Manny and Kelso were together before just because they had some discussions, merely because they worked together, but it was never implied and nothing was said so we didn't need such a clarification.

[ashen jungle]

If a man and woman are in the same continent in fiction, someone is going to assume that they're sleeping together.