division-universe

[gusty fulcrum]

i thinks its fair to say that with all the context given, diamond isnt an ai

theres always some form of central database

with the information given its pure assumption that diamond is an ai

[sick lantern]

eevee i literally cannot fricking even rn

you didn't even know Diamond existed until five minutes ago, you thought it was fanon

please
Stop being overly pedantic

[gusty fulcrum]

you dont have to agree with me im just weeding the explicitly stated from assumptions

[fast wharf]

I have a bad feeling about this conversation

[sick lantern]

they are talking about the AIs that can be accessed through Division watches
they are talking about what McManus' analysts use, which we know to be ISAC, the AI
they are saying that if you can access one from the watch, with the right know-how you can access the other two, and we know that is how Theo accessed ANNA
every single piece of subtext in the conversation, all common sense and rational interpretation, says Diamond is an AI due to being described in literally the same way as the two other AIs, they just say database because they hold information that can be accessed, like the analysts do

heaven's sake

until they say "diamond isn't an AI", diamond is quite obviously an AI

[fast wharf]

Comically long text

[gusty fulcrum]

if they classify diamond as an ai then wed have to classify isac/anna as a database which id say is just incorrect

an ai accesses information from a database it is not a database in of itself

[sick lantern]

it doesn't matter you're being pedantic

[gusty fulcrum]

im not asking you to agree with me

[fast wharf]

Lost you still typing?

[lunar harbor]

Conclusion: Deez Nuts

[lunar harbor]

I see this somewhat differently.

Diamond:
Diamond seems to be actively linked, and are presumably on par to the other two (possible three, more on that later) systems, ISAC & ANNA.

In addition, Black Tusk actively utilise and bear Diamond in-combat; so I don't believe that they simply see it as a database to refer to.

However, we have to realize that Diamond is a system utilized by Black Tusk, not by SHD nor by Homeland Security.

Databases:
ISAC & ANNA, prior to their activation, seemed to have been passively collecting and filling the database(s) linked to their systems.

"They are recording everything all the time and are filling the databases"

However, Diamond seems to have been extracting data to a database independent from the ones that ISAC and ANNA utilise. This is what Claire was likely referring to.

"And what about the other databases? - Like Diamond?"

This makes sense.
Diamond, being one made for Black Tusk, extracts data to a Black Tusk specific database.
ISAC, ANNA, being made for SHD/Homeland, extracts data to a Government specific database.

A third, unknown system:
This is where the possibility of an unnamed, un-introduced system comes in. Let's call this "H".

Likely one utilized by the Hunters, who we now know operate as a contingency force under Calvin McManus.
Under this context, it'd make sense that this system would be kept secretive, independent - and would be one that McManus would hold in his watch along with the other two systems.

This is hinted.

" - as long as you have legitimate access to one of the systems, you can get into the other two"
" - feeding all three into the same repository could be beneficial"
"Cal wants us to update all three systems on his Watch"

As well, with this is mind; this explains why the Hunters are able to hack and repurpose our SHD Skills.

Sokolova VS McManus:
It's no secret that McManus and Sokolova don't like each-other.

It'd make sense that McManus would want to nose into her operations.

With this is mind, I believe that somewhere along the line, the "H" system was given backdoor access to Diamond.

"I mean, sure, it's all built on the same tech, if he wanted a back door into their operations to monitor them, it's just a matter of giving him access to their database."

Note the mention of "database."
Through the Black Tusk specific database mentioned above, the "H" system was likely given backdoor capabilities to Diamond.

Keener:
Keener was right.

Note the Liberty Island mission.

During the encounter with the Marauder Drone, Keener hacked both it, and the following wave of Warhounds.

With this in mind, Keener seemed to have gained/discovered access to the "H" system, and evidently discovered its properties.
Wrong. He did this through ANNA.

How, you ask?
Remember:

"They would all have access to the same backdoor. It's a matter of finding the right file. It's all there. But if someone gets bored or goes looking, they can find anything they want."

Parnell must have found this backdoor while doing his nerd thing. He probably then incorporated it into ANNA. During this however, either he or Keener must have discovered the existence of the "H" system.

This is what Keener could have meant by his message, "You have no idea what's coming."

OR

Keener discovered the "H" systems on his own, used it during Marauder/Warhounds, then proceeded to warned us at the end.

Future:
The all powerful backdoor. The key to every system. ISAC, ANNA, H, Diamond.

Through the quote above, Diamond could be able to utilize the backdoor to mess with ISAC/ANNA/H, once discovered.

"They would all have access to the same backdoor."

In the trailer, it looked as if Sokolova was extracting data from the Agent Watches.
Is this what she's searching for?

Just my thoughts though. Speculation.

[ashen jungle]

Can we get a tl;dr on that?

[lunar harbor]

No.

Sorry : )

[ashen jungle]

It's almost 4000 characters long, just prove to me that it's not fan-fiction and I'll leave it up.

[lunar harbor]

I mean, it's in the message(s) themselves

[fast wharf]

👏 worth reading

[lunar harbor]

Through the direct utilisation of quotes said within the Descent Comms

[fast wharf]

So, @lunar harbor in your conclusion there's actually (possibly) 4 networks?

Isac Anna diamond and "H"?

And all of the three are on the H network?

And keener discovered it due to a backdoor, meaning that he knew something worse than rogues and the rogue network?

[lunar harbor]

Essentially, yes.

3 Systems for the SHD/Homeland - ISAC (SHD), ANNA (Rogue), H (Hunter)
1 System for Black Tusk - Diamond

He evidently discovered a backdoor to Black Tusk's Diamond network.

And with the Hunters, Keener could've discovered "H" either through Parnell/ANNA, or by his own means.

[fast wharf]

So lemme understand, the moment keener appeard like a Hunter and hacked the warhounds (thing that shouldn't happen prob due to a strict coding and some good firewall and shit) that means he discovered a weakness for all the 4 systems, which makes Sense due to our skill hud turning red when he EMPs and when he shocks us with a interference (prob also a thing from H network)

Ngl they did keener dirty he could kill several countries if possible

With the eclipse virus and a whole custom made rogue network

[lunar harbor]

Well, with the upcoming season being "Vanguard", I guess we'll get to learn more about Keener

[fast wharf]

I mean the season name is the same as his codename

Ngl parnell actually had a reason to become rogue imo

He legit got his father murdered while he was censored and blind folded about what happened

Oh we forgot about rivens

[ashen jungle]

Oh so this is more "Keener had a reason for what he did" ?

[fast wharf]

The 5 network lmao

[fast wharf]

Not really

I'm talking about parnell

He got some Fair reason tbh

Except for the creation of the eclipse virus missiles

[ashen jungle]

I bet they love that defence at the Hague when they're brought up on war crime charges.

[fast wharf]

Lol

[ashen jungle]

I just run the littly blinky light that ruins any chance Agents have to Stealth, you're welcome.

[lunar harbor]

Blinky Light?

[fast wharf]

I mean all networks got some shiny light on a brick

So you're not the only

Probably hunters are the most unlucky ones lmao

Dudes can't go stealth due to so much watches and hud interference

[ashen jungle]

I moonlight as the oil-change light on all Toyota Camry's.

[lunar harbor]

It'd be hilarious if we discovered that the Hunters were secretly meme'ing on us through the Hunter Network; and we simply couldn't hear it

"Yoo, Fred - this dude brought a Turret with him to extraction again! Watch this!"

[ashen jungle]

I know there's been subsequent lore since WONY and blah blah blah, but I do miss when Hunters were just the weirdos who ran puzzles around the city for no explained reason.

[lunar harbor]

Heh - or spied on you from rooftops

[fast wharf]

That was on survival or div 1?

I've never saw them on those things

[sick lantern]

div 2 open world

[fast wharf]

Oh

I've saw them everywhere lol

[fast wharf]

Why does hunters use a heavy Tomahawk axe instead of a light and fast knife?

[gusty fulcrum]

brutality probs

[ashen jungle]

Hunters had them in div1, and axes are scaries than knives.

[sick lantern]

better at cutting through bone too if i had to guess

[fast wharf]

Would be even bad If they had kukris, that thing cuts easily through flesh and bones

[fast wharf]

I mean they had brutal executions in survival so maybe yes

[wicked gorge]

Probably to use Vietnam tactics to keep agents paranoid and exhausted from being on alert

[gaunt ice]

I mean axe is more versatile than knives if you know how to use them

[wicked gorge]

Honestly if anything, I’d expect hunters to use Karambits against agents, lethal and agile

[cold bramble]

What about that knife that leaves impossible to stitch wounds

[wicked gorge]

Twist knifes?

That would make sense lethal, easy to hide and carry, and a defense weapons

Their tomahawk is still the best

[cold bramble]

The Jagdkommando

Look it up

[wicked gorge]

Probably be the same effectiveness as a regular knife

It’s gonna leave a nasty wound, but there’s other knifes that can leave the same wound, but smaller or lighter

[cold bramble]

Can't patch it up though

[brave flicker]

the reason it's like this is because it's more intimidating than a knife. it's very likely that it's intimidating on purpose

from a game design standpoint not a lore standpoint tbh

[gaunt ice]

Honestly i think its just more versatile

You can break down a door or chop things with an axe

I mean arm is on the chopping list but there are other things too i guess

[fast wharf]

One tapping shields?

[gaunt ice]

I mean they’re bulletproof shields not axe proof shields so…..

[fast wharf]

I always got one tapped by axes, maybe they're made out of bullets lol (joke)

[gaunt ice]

You dont wear an axe proof vest do you

[wicked gorge]

Tbh their axes are probably heavy customized, probably uses really light metals to keep it durable and effective

[fast wharf]

No like, they def made out of shield and vest piercing bullets

The tomahawks

They def are

Also what weapons do most Hunters use? (The survival and div 2 hunters)

ARs?

[sick lantern]

they all have one of an AR, LMG, or sniper, and one of an SMG or shotgun

[fast wharf]

So there's a pattern

One got ARs and LMGs (or sniper) and one SMG and shotguns

Kalashinikov is a great AR tho

[cold bramble]

I am not a fan of AKs for their looks

[gaunt ice]

I like black market aks

[cold bramble]

I like the more modern looking one with polymer parts and railed foregrip

[wicked gorge]

Didn’t they only use Russian weapons in survival?

I remember that being the main reason a lot of ppl thought hunters were Russian spec ops

[ashen jungle]

I think the main reason people thought that these mysterious villain characters were Russian, is that it's based on Tom Clancy plotlines, so there's 5:1 odds on the favourite of them being eastern-european at the very least.

[gaunt ice]

From what we knew back then there’s no reason for Russia to attack US whatsoever in the plot

[cold bramble]

Russian bad guys are too common in shooters for whatever reason

[gaunt ice]

So unless they reveal something like erm actually Vitaly intentionally gave Amherst the virus or something then it will just stick out as a weird detail

Were they Russian spec ops?Third wave?

[ashen jungle]

Cold War paranoia being pushed into fiction for decades.
Is why.

[gaunt ice]

Nah actually this guy named Ronald McDonald owns them

[cold bramble]

Metal gear, call of duty, battlefield, it is always the Russians I swear

[ashen jungle]

Wait, I haven't been keeping up with the new stuff. Is it confirmed that Amherst didn't make Green Poison now?

[gaunt ice]

No im just making shit up

Its purely a hypothetical idea but its basically a copium explanation to make Russia the bad people again

[ashen jungle]

I mean the lore lately already makes less sense than it used to with Hunters being retconned, BT doing their thing, etc. It wouldn't shock me that other things we've had confirmed already to be suddenly changed.

[gaunt ice]

Erm actually Ortiz made ISAC and ANNA and Parnell was a scam🤓

[ashen jungle]

If I wake up tomorrow and hear "Keener was actually a hero and trying to save the world from an alien invasion" I'd only be mildly surprised.

[gaunt ice]

Also 3rd network

The overarching plot bout the black tusk never made sense

Why not stay in Russia and rule over now that the government has collapsed

Why not help and weaponize the Division

What is their purpose other than i want to take DC

[sick lantern]

they did not

[wicked gorge]

Oh well

[wicked gorge]

Their a pmc and McManus is paying them to support his takeover of United States and be installed as rightful military force

[gaunt ice]

Dude
The world is literally ending,who the fuck cares about money

[wicked gorge]

Welcome to America, where somehow money is the most vital thing in a apocalypse

I agree with you, but I guess they plan to use that money and buy a lovely beach house when green poison ends

[cold bramble]

The bank over there sitting with all the money inside:

[wicked gorge]

Plot twist, the money McManus planned to pay BT with was stolen by the hyenas and that causes the BT to join the Division

[cold bramble]

Kelso is Hawaiian right?

[marble dawn]

Wasn't it said in that doctor's comms that most BT are mainly in it at this point because they like Natalya so much?

Which I don't really get considering she can't seem to go two sentences without being a big meanie in some way

[cold bramble]

BT?

[marble dawn]

black tusk

[cold bramble]

Oooh

[marble dawn]

doctor being the psychologist or similar we saved last season

billings?

[wicked gorge]

Probably now, but at first it was a financial decision

[fast wharf]

Although AKs are russian they do infact some good job

I mean they're the main weapon until today on russian militaries and things

[wicked gorge]

Pretty sure Aks are meant to be more durable

[signal thicket]

Doesn't the US produce the most AK-Pattern rifles in the world?
not out of place to see a bucnh in the setting

[cold bramble]

You know after the 100th guy exploded they would start making the gas tanks less exposed

Really why are every factions soldiers going into gunfights with a giant tank of gas strapped to their back and get surprised when it gets shot

[wicked gorge]

Because……….Hey look a legendary beanie

[static crypt]

Hmmm okay guys

how much of the Division do you think has gone rogue at this point?

[gusty fulcrum]

My random guess is like 20%

Id say 60% shd 20% rogue 10% dead

[marble dawn]

I dont get the door lock and friendly fire stuff in recent descent comms, on-mission agents break locks all the time

Guess ISAC just grew smarter over time as more data poured in?

[cold bramble]

Isn't it silly how ISAC has an option to just go rogue whenever you want

[sick lantern]

it doesn’t

[obtuse arrow]

Yeah it's kinda stupid

[cold bramble]

Does it automatically go rogue and go red once you do something wrong?

[sick lantern]

well you worded it like “yes i’d like to go rogue now please”

it’s kinda common sense, to be prepared for the possibility that these highly trained autonomous agents might be corrupt and try to take advantage of the end times. not really weird

less “an option to go rogue” and more “countermeasures for if they go rogue”

[late void]

In the dz though you just press a button to declare yourself rogue

[sick lantern]

you punch the shit out of the brick

that’s just the gameplay way to do it

[languid wing]

i assume the real way is when issac catches you doing a no no and flags you as rogue

though the things that make issac mark you as rogue are to broad. you run away from a fight cause you wanna survive you are rogue if you leave civies behind you are marked as rogue

many agents were marked as rogue just for tryna to survive to live another day

in the division universe its kill or be killed

[gaunt ice]

Bro what

[static crypt]

my agent running away from legendary DUA:

[sick lantern]

yea that’s the animation or at least in div 1 it was. you don’t go rogue in universe by saying “hey ISAC pls run rogueagent.exe and I’ll see ya never”

ofc it used to be “shot a division agent? rogue” but that sucked gameplay wise so they had to add that

[cold bramble]

why do some cleaners in some official art have firefighter clothes

[sick lantern]

what hazard are both cleaners and firemen exposed to on a regular basis?

[cold bramble]

none in game wear firefighter outfits though

just some hazmat outfit with those worker vests

[sick lantern]

concept art can often differ from reality, yes
if i had to hazard a guess they dropped the FDNY jackets because of cloth physics and/or just to make the silhouette more distinct

they still have them lying around as props fyi

[cold bramble]

they do?

i never seen em around cleaners

[sick lantern]

you can see them in UG and maybe also Napalm, I’m not sure

[cold bramble]

https://thedivision.fandom.com/wiki/Cleaners

[spiral rover]

Water

Division agents

LMB patrols

Deff not fire cant be that

[sleek plover]

Damn I hate LMB

[gusty fulcrum]

water lmao

[gaunt ice]

Wahtur

[devout surge]

Not sure where best to put this, but has anyone worked out what message is being projected onto the body of Agent Edwards?

[sick lantern]

actually some people in the secrets discord did recently

[devout surge]

IS there a non-discord way to see it? I really don't need to join another discord.

[sick lantern]

uhh ask @gusty fulcrum

[devout surge]

Let's pretend that will be sufficient to summon them. 🙂

[sick lantern]

? what else you want me to do?

[devout surge]

No, I meant that will be fine. I don't weant to retag them.

In any case, I think it's an ad for the projector itself. Bits of it talk about a "quality fast focus" and something about presets.

So, not really sure if it has any lore value.

[gusty fulcrum]

Are you asking if I have a screenshot of it cuz I don't

[sick lantern]

you found a URL or something right

or was that someone else

[gusty fulcrum]

Someone else lol

But you made me remember the convo

I don't remember what server that convo was in

[surreal hearth]

I got a feeling that the recruiter might be Kelsos father

Cuss I remember seeing her and her family in a picture during some thanksgiving long ago

Kelso left DC and went to New York in order to find her family

After kelso left the recruiter and agent Jonson popped out of nowhere at the same time of the recruiter’s appearance

Right after kelso left

Or after we’ve rescued Mari from a black tusk propaganda/makeshift hospital

There’s no evidence to back this connection up but there are facts about this pattern of people

This is gonna constantly keep us in the dark with yet more bread crumbs to follow

Even viper and Felix mentioned kelso but not our kelso

Our kelsos first name is alani her last name is kelso which means

There’s another person who’s last name is kelso and that person might be her father or mother

McManus is most likely to drop himself from black tusk surveillance in order to keep a low profile to find the right moment for that “stab in the back” if the division becomes too strong

[static crypt]

I thought it was because she no longer felt needed in DC

[sick lantern]

it was because the network went down and she was seeing to what extent was it not

[gaunt ice]

Yea she went to check in on NYC

[next hemlock]

Does anyone know what’s going to happen once Schaffer wakes up from his coma?

[gusty fulcrum]

we most likely will team up with him to take down the hunters

[next hemlock]

That sounds interesting

[gaunt ice]

Instantly dies for real this time

[next hemlock]

Wouldn’t surprise me if that happens

[floral gull]

Anyone know what's the current status of the movie?

[wicked gorge]

Knowing Ubisoft it will probably be some sort of underwhelming stuff, but my personal theory is he knows a exploit in the hunters tech

That or he knows a way to McManus

[next hemlock]

Maybe, he kinda reminds me of lewis in the sense as both were on different sides(lewis was true sons and he was BTSU) lewis helped us and defected to the division and maybe schaffer might do the same and the lewis sacrificed himself to stop a greater threat. So maybe Schaffer might do the same imo

[wicked gorge]

I think it was referred in season 9, but maybe Schaeffer knows the location of the nuclear football and the briefcase

[next hemlock]

🤔

[wicked gorge]

The division lore makes my head hurt

[mint citrus]

I think that once Bardon wakes up it'll basically be endgame for the Division. We find out what he knows, try to make moves

[sick lantern]

latest news

https://comicbook.com/gaming/news/the-division-movie-netflix-jake-gyllenhaal-update-rawson-marshall-thurber/

basically “vaguely still happening”

[late void]

Probably a cover story to avoid Nat's attention, wouldn't surprise me if she and Rhodes were digging in to how BT are listening in on all our comms and trying to figure out how to block them.

[surreal hearth]

So she’s doing something similar to what lau did

[late void]

Not going full rogue undercover though hopefully

[surreal hearth]

Kelso is most likely to seek out the truth and she most likely gonna have to find her family in fear she may face a mental challenge like lau after her sister was murdered by rikers

Consider this to be called “the lau crisis”

[late void]

Given the next dlc appears to be set in Brooklyn, it could well be either McManus or Nat are headquartered there, so that could be something she's investigating. Might also explain why keener wanted to bomb NY

[ashen jungle]

Isn't BT based in some lab outside of the city? Would make more sense since that's harder for Agents to reach.
If I was a needlessly evil CEO trying to take control of a post-apocalyptic country, I wouldn't have my base of operations be within walking distance of the enemy stronghold.

[gaunt ice]

Yea but tbf the black tusk aren’t very bright

I would just threaten to turn Campus and the rooftop settlement into Vietnam in 1968 if i were them

Back before they tryna pull this “erm actually we r gud”

[ashen jungle]

Bit over the top there.

[wicked gorge]

Tbf Ubisoft just makes a lot of there villains and groups not think like us

[gaunt ice]

I mean Wyvern had a point

What if in the very moment that they arrive in DC they announce that we either surrender or they’ll bomb tf outta us

We’re not taking the chances that its a bluff

Maybe bomb one of the settlements to make an example

[surreal hearth]

She snapped when she decided to missile launch against the whitehouse

But yeah examples like Wyvern is most likely an act of desperation of “if I can’t have military right then no one can” mentality

[gaunt ice]

I mean the idea of bombing a settlement to make a point

[wicked gorge]

I don’t understand why the BT didn’t attack when the network was attacked, to me that seems likes the perfect time to invade and conquer DC

[ashen jungle]

Nat didn't exist at the time, so.... Yeah.

Assuming you mean when the network was "down" pre-div2's DC campaign.

[wicked gorge]

Yeah

[ashen jungle]

Remember: Tidal Basin didn't even exist at that point, it was almost a month away from being added in post-release.

So unless I'm forgetting something, the last time we'd seen BT was in the prologue, and I don't think they were namedropped at that point.

There's an older intel-com floating around youtube somewhere that's been since removed from ingame, IIRC it was at a play-ground or something. It mentioned a CEO that was a guy. I think.

[wicked gorge]

I remember those, the unknown BT commander, i love Ubisoft when they haven’t fully planned out the villain

[ashen jungle]

If it was just a "commander", that could arguably be Bardon, since he was the head of the BT's Special Unit.

but since BT is a business with a corporate structure, the topic is a little...muddier.

Assuming it wasn't Bardon, my best guess to fit it in current canon is it was some sort of operations commander, not a full on CEO.

[sick lantern]

they were waiting for the division to deal with the factions so they could swoop in while dc was easy pickings

they thought that the remnants of the division couldn’t stand up to a numerically superior militarised force, even though that’s part of their specialty.

small brain plays from the start really

[gaunt ice]

Honestly it wasn’t that bad of a plan

Overwhelming force with superior fire power,air superiority and roughly comparable tech as Agents

They cant really account for John/Jane Wick joining Division

Invading by force was a bad idea sure but then when you consider it,in a world with no plot armor they would have won easily

Blast broadcasts like “get out of the white house or we send a bunch of marauders to run it over”

[surreal hearth]

Black tusk was in the shadow at the time but couldn’t move until they use the division long enough to surprise invade DC entirely

[sleek plover]

I wonder what black tusk rations would be like

@tepid ibex
how was ur rations like

[marble dawn]

probably just hoarded US MREs?

along with the newfound salad powers from season 11

[tepid ibex]

Uh…..deuhh….we had a buffet every night!

Far superior to any Black Tusk meals

The LMB delt strictly in gourmet meals!

[sleek plover]

Ahh yes, it is so impressing how you people fed urselves gourmet meals while the citizens you massacred and placed into camps starved

[surreal umbra]

LMB seem like the lesser of all the evils out of the first game

[late void]

Careful, you'll get him started

[gaunt ice]

I mean chaotic order is lowkey better than chaotic evil

Both still bad but being organized beats out being messy

As for what they eat,probably rations

MREs aren’t that bad

Maybe they have barbecue parties if they feel like it

[static crypt]

nah you guys are forgetting about the Rikers

you see what they did inside the NYSE?

[ashen jungle]

Create awesome rock concert stages?

[tepid ibex]

Why, I was talking about the citizens! Just ask Fred, who was at Grand Central Station!

[wicked gorge]

Apart of me feels like the recruiter is gonna be a fake agent Johnson, while the real one is being held hostage, but the odds of that being it are low

[gusty fulcrum]

i have a heavy suspicion main mission is fed bunker

[willow fulcrum]

Sup ive been off a while cus work anf all got finally back on division 2 so ive seen a lot changed so anyone wanna catch me up on lore last thing i remember was aaron keener😭 wats happening now

[static crypt]

i know it's very unlikely, but a part of me feels like it'll be Camp White Oak

that forested area the Recruiter was in at the end of the season trailer looked just like it

[gusty fulcrum]

It won't be white oak

They would confuse a lot of people by putting two manhunt locations on top of one another

[wicked gorge]

Where you leave off comrade

Im gonna bet that next seasons manhunt is gonna be liberty island

[tiny wraith]

For those that love lore Resurgence has it in spades

[sick lantern]

would be great if I could play the game :)

[tiny wraith]

You start as an 1st wave agent

[tiny wraith]

Get knocked the fuuuuuuggggg out and wakeup after events in div1

And what's her name has the eyepatch

[cold bramble]

If they decide to kill off the game early like apex, they should play a cutscene where keener just kills you off

[tiny wraith]

There not going it's pretty cool good grafix

And decent story

[fast wigeon]

hi

[vast grove]

My bet is on Kenly College

[wicked gorge]

They need to do something with Kenly, I haven’t touched that place since I got the diamondback

[gusty fulcrum]

What makes you say that

[vast grove]

Kenly was mentioned during manhunt already and they have assets/map from scrapped resident evil event. So I am saying Kenly (but fed bunker is second on my list)

[gusty fulcrum]

fed bunker was also mentioned to be fortified and vik is in west end so it adds up

[willow fulcrum]

So the new ios game since its new story would that make it lore canon too with upcoming heartland

[tiny wraith]

No it goes from pre1 to after div1 to beginning of div2

[willow fulcrum]

So basically resurgence is basically about the first wave agents who fell cus of keener

[sick lantern]

no

[willow fulcrum]

Then nvm confusion i thought it be the plot of d1 beginning a prequel

[tiny wraith]

The 1st mission is pre d1

Rest of game is post d1 and pre d2

[next hemlock]

Faye

[fossil gust]

why does Paul Rhodes hate SHD so much in WONY? scratch that, why does everyone seem to hate The Division in both games? weren't we the guys that almost singlehandedly kept places afloat where the JTF fucked up or are there just that much rogue agents/incompetent agents that smear SHD's name? i've heard a lot about how The Division was a bad idea in practice, but with all the good our div1 and 2 agents brought i think our Herculean effort should have a better reward than a Hunter axe through the cranium

[sick lantern]

Rhodes is a "patriot who is suspicious of the powers granted to The Division" which is fair-ish
he sorta-kinda came around over the course of div 1, then a bunch of shit happened off screen and is mentioned only, so he became a mega-hater in div 2

[wheat bane]

Considering most of the first wave of SHD agents became rouge’s and abused their powers I can understand how they hate The Division

[sick lantern]

it's a poor justification

[sick lantern]

considering he didn't know that at first, and the division saved his life, you'd think he'd be more grateful

[fossil gust]

i mean, the first wave went rogue precisely because the JTF fucked up so hard and most of them got killed. it makes sense for them to want to flip it around because of what is essentially a betrayal that dug NYC into deeper shit

and yeah that too

after all the things we went through in both games you'd think everyone would be a little more grateful for the SHD agents that are actually doing their job

[wheat bane]

Rhodes is on Div1 right?

[fossil gust]

i don't get it at all, society collapsed and it's unclear how the government is going to exert its influence even by div2. it's like the Black Tusk said, The Division are a bunch of gunslingers running around at the behest of an AI that thinks in black and white, but whose directives also happen to benefit like.. everyone. especially considering DC and NYC have both descended into a war zone where warlords vie for dominance.

[sick lantern]

yea

[wheat bane]

Does anyone know what happened to the SHD agents that were on the opening of Div2?

Before us going to DC

[sick lantern]

do you mean the trailer with the three agents and the paper plane and all
or the cutscene where the network goes down

[wheat bane]

Where the network goes down

In that floater like area

[sick lantern]

wut
do you mean the one or two agents who are in the tutorial? Sanders? (the black woman)

or if you mean it showing agents across the country, no info on that beyond the two cutscenes

[wheat bane]

This one

Sanders yea, I forgot her name

Where she says “You go to DC, we will stay here”

[sick lantern]

Sanders is in the pentagon missions iirc, and she then showed up in the White House after the BT assault (debatably as a stand-in for the player character)

[wheat bane]

OK its gonna be a stupid question but I am literally a newbie, are pentagon missions locked by any dlc?

Or are they free missions?

[sick lantern]

i'm not sure but i think they're free

[sick lantern]

and the black tusk are a bunch of armed cutthroats running around at the behest of a power hungry oligarch

[fossil gust]

god i hate Parnell, i know he's trying to be on the good side of history but wow i hate how self righteous he is

[wheat bane]

Parnell?

[fossil gust]

Theo Parnell

[ashen jungle]

The nerd who has bad cardio and doesn't realise that he can just leave the final area instead of trying to snipe us from garage doors.

Yeah he's not really a likable character, with all the warcrimes.

[fossil gust]

i don't even care about the warcrimes i just hate that he's a wuss

[ashen jungle]

Let's avoid using the kind of language that the filter hit in the future, thanks.

[sick lantern]

what even was that conspiracy again? someone killed his dad or something?

[fossil gust]

yea i think so

[sick lantern]

can't remember because of how inane and meaningless it ended up being

who even did it

[fossil gust]

well it never meant anything so we never found out

at least i don't remember

[wicked gorge]

The candidate his father ( a good politician) was going against, had him assassinated to ensure that she got office, and keener manipulated Parnell with it

[wheat bane]

Ok question. How does one even get recruited to SHD before the Green Poison

[sick lantern]

be ex military or otherwise experienced, and be profiled with the right mindset

[ashen jungle]

There's also a certain level of "rich people's kids" in there. I guess they saw it as an easy way to get prestige, since no one thought Directive 51 would ever be activated.

[fossil gust]

didn't SHD recruiters also get a little sleazy at their jobs?

[gaunt ice]

Yea they cut corners in the recruitment process

People with psych problems like Conley,Keener or have ties with big Russian people like Sokolova’s lil bro in season 4 should’ve never been passed

The first thing Conley did was modify the fire hydrant so that the pressure coming out of it can break bones iirc

Next she turned it into a fucking flamethrower for “anti riot”

[fossil gust]

tf

if water pressure can break bones wouldn't it cut through flesh too?

[gaunt ice]

You can find those audio logs in NYC

[gaunt ice]

I dont remember it specifically

[fossil gust]

yea i heard that audio log, i don't remember anyone saying it could break bones just that another SHD agent disagreed with her

[gaunt ice]

But pretty sure it went from normal knock em down anti riot hydrants to something that leaves a mark

I might be wrong on the bone thing

[fossil gust]

i did hear something about it being dangerous though

[gaunt ice]

Theo has terrible cardio for a secret special force

[fossil gust]

i mean i always thought The Division has always been about intelligence gathering, we can see it in the safehouses

[gaunt ice]

Bro ran for like 10 minutes and fuckin wheezed

[fossil gust]

besides with the tech advantage of SHD im sure Theo is a skill build

[gaunt ice]

Not necessarily

They’re combat agents and shit

I mean agents have to be ready to dight

Usually

And tech build isn’t like a thing

Its just the game balance

[fossil gust]

well yea im not saying they can't fight im just sayin i don't think their primary focus is to be like, a super secret super agent that fights on every corner. even if they have the capability, 'continuity of government' doesn't always have to be fighting an occupying force

also the skill build thing is just a little joke

their tech makes up for the difference by making each individual agent a one man squad, but they'd still always be on the backstep with their numbers so i can't see fighting as their main focus

[wicked gorge]

If it breaks bone, then im pretty sure the pressure would damage skin

[fossil gust]

that's what i thought so as well

[wicked gorge]

If it’s the same pressure firefighters have in their trucks for hoses, then it would cut through skin like a knife through butter

[sick lantern]

yea Felix Sokolov, they’re definitely gonna follow up on the implications and plot threads they were setting up there
-someone on copium

[sick lantern]

when’s that said btw

[surreal hearth]

Well this is……unexpected

Our target “the snake Vic” is almost at reach but

We are gonna land at 25 on the Christmas morning

Oh boy I wonder what sort of big surprises that mister or miss recruiter is cooking up for us on this Christmas morning surprise?

[ashen jungle]

It's a com, IIRC in an office building. Haven't heard it in a while.
basically someone mentions wanting to get their kid in the SHD.

[wheat bane]

Did President Ellis ordered Black Tusk to invade DC? Is it said on the lore or a theory?

[wicked gorge]

No, the Black Tusk we’re waiting for the Division to neutralize the enemy factions to make it easier to steamroll D.C and install order

Ellie’s is more as the symbol to make people see them as more as a good force with the president on their side

[wheat bane]

Then where did Ellis run away right as Black Tusk arrived?

[wicked gorge]

As BT finally invaded DC and Ellis was sent in mostly as a scouting missionary first to slip intel on the divisions actions and get the location of the anti virals

[wheat bane]

I assume this is explained in a mission?

[signal thicket]

I assumed theo wasnt suppose to be a field agent like we are, and was suppose to be the part of the division that filled a more supportive role like Cindy is, or used to be

[wicked gorge]

Technically yeah, I think there’s a mission that explains it, but there’s a few coms that have Ellis talking to a BT officer about a alliance

Im pretty sure after the last invaded stronghold before tidal basin there’s a mission that explains it, i dont remember tho, that was 4 year ago

[bold pumice]

whats up with the cooling pumps in the stranded tanker mission? its crude oil, i dont know much about the production and refining of oil but i dont understand why it needs to be cooled

[wicked gorge]

Isn’t it obvious

It’s for the agents to set stuff on fire

[bold pumice]

aside from me being a pyromaniac lol

i genuinely dont think crude oil needs that much infrastructure dedicated to cooling. maybe im a dumbass.

[kind hare]

Merry Christmas everyone 🎄🎄🎄

[wicked gorge]

THE GOAT

[gaunt ice]

🐐

[wicked gorge]

Since tomorrow we’re getting the manhunt mission, what’s everyone’s thoughts on what’s going to happen

Also merry Christmas my fellow agents

[marble dawn]

Oh yeah I gotta go radio silent for tomorrow since im not playing until wednesday 😨

[wicked gorge]

Good luck

[marble dawn]

Anyway my guess is recruiter is agent Johnson and he recruits us for some undercover action against mcmanus

Would be cool if he or some other hunter ends up being our div1 agent though

[sick lantern]

hell nah

[static crypt]

CALLED IT !!!

[obtuse arrow]

Nice prediction I remember people were doubting you but you proved them wrong

[slim light]

well i mean every trailer show's where every final target might be and i was fucking right

[surreal hearth]

It’s time

Time to deal with this recruiter once and for all

We kill him or her maybe the hunters will leave us alone

[wicked gorge]

Th second Johnson said bring the sever to white oak, i fucking knew it

[wicked gorge]

Least we know what Bardon is useful for and ngl im kinda disappointed by the ending cutscene, but overall I enjoyed the mission

[surreal hearth]

We got tricked again

I’m not I’m struggling with this mission somehow

[wicked gorge]

What part u on?

[static crypt]

now we wait for the Vanguard season to start next

and with ||The Recruiter yapping about how we're essentially rogue||, makes me think we're gonna have another Rogue Agent story arc again

[sick lantern]

literally the same shit Schaeffer said before he turned, wasn’t true then and isn’t true now

[surreal hearth]

I’m honestly getting sick and tired of following breadcrumbs again I feel like the homeland security McManus is dangerously keeping a lot of stuff from all of us

I just don’t understand any of this anymore

Are we seriously the rogue agents?

Because if this BS breadcrumb secrecy keeps going, we have no choice, but to find a nuke and destroy the entire USA

But then that’ll make us even more dangerous or rogue

[sick lantern]

i genuinely have no clue how you reached this conclusion but fuck it we ball at this point

[surreal hearth]

It’s just constant breadcrumbing left and right almost endlessly

It’s just becoming the point of beyond understanding it’s no wonder why birdie took out the entire shade network and black tusk network at the same time

If we can’t keep our tech then no one can

[frail coyote]

anyone else have the final cutscene end at Nat taking over the settlement comms?

[static crypt]

yep

i think that was intended but idrk

[frail coyote]

anyone try unlocking the "Recruiter Insurance 1" yet?

[wicked gorge]

Since Birdie knows how to activate the counter measures, it was interesting to see the counter measures work against the hunters and now we have someone with the code, cant we use it against BT now

[gaunt ice]

inb4 arbitrary reasons

though ok here’s my best attempt at explaining the finale:
the Countermeasure works for all networks with no discrimination.
black tusk’s network or whatever seems to be a separate thing because they were unaffected by it

and since Johnson somehow isn’t rogue,he still has SHD tech so even if the hunter network is separate he’s still jammed

[gaunt ice]

no,its just random shit that they yap about to make you think that

what have hunters do for the people?
or black tusk,the “legitimate” force they’re backing

we have this exact topic discussed every 3 months or so and honestly

why?

no we are not rogue,they want you to think that you’re rogue or they’re being lied to by McDonalds to do his bidding

Johnson was definitely misled/gaslit into believing that siding with Kelso makes you rogue

no,the black tusk aren’t good people,according to ingame timeline they were still executing people in broad daylight like 2 weeks ago

no,the hunters aren’t there to clean up the bad apples like some sort of “third wave”,they brutally murder people and hang their corpses up as a sadistic memento,you think any good guy does that?

they kill agents rogue or not,the only difference between both is only their watch’s color

[surreal hearth]

I feel like they’re just taking the Keener playbook BS constant manipulation, psychologically and mentally they’re getting very very desperate to wipe out the division by any means necessary

[surreal hearth]

Exactly my point

Natalia‘s constant puppeteering is her powerful weapon.

[wicked gorge]

You would think the person with the most knowledge on the division would know how to wipe them out easily

[surreal hearth]

It doesn’t affect us because we follow orders under ISAC and manny but it’s affecting manny hard

[wicked gorge]

Who is potus now, technically it’s McManus cause I’m pretty sure the bt and the hunters were as donating the line of succession, but wouldn’t he be flagged under treason against the United states

[surreal hearth]

Oh how much I hate Natalya now

She manipulated Vick to delete all of the information regarding her involvement with Odea tech and then pretended that he tripped an alarm to lure the hyenas against us

Using some cheesy line like it was an act or something

[wicked gorge]

That part I feel like Ubisoft just said, okay how do we make the np. That backstabbed the agent likable

[surreal hearth]

Seems like vik is involved on everything from cal and nat

Very before the black tusk arrival

[wicked gorge]

My whole issue on the manhunt is taking the server to white oak, yeah Johnson brought up good points on why they should, but with the network still finicky, i really doubt they let agents take the server offsite

If it was a squad or 2 of agents that would make alot of sense, but for just 2 agents is a bit of a plot hole for me ( my opinion)

[cold bramble]

almost the entirety of division 2 feels cheesy

[cursive tapir]

Wait, an I crazy? Didn’t we kill Birdie in a previous season? The black tusk sniper who went “KAW”?

[wicked gorge]

Different birdie

Weird coincidence tho

[sick verge]

Also she was called chirpy

[quiet jackal]

I wonder where does this all leads,like we all know division 3 is in making

Like are we getting McManus and Sokolova as fights soon?

For me it would be better to have them sooner then later

[brittle lion]

Division 3 will likely go back to the beginning of the outbreak, just in a different city

[wheat bane]

or(a crazy theory) in a 3rd wave of agents

I know thats impossible as the whole world is doomed but maybe

a small teeny tiny chance

or like you said, beginning of the outbreak

[brittle lion]

I think getting away from New York and DC will do wonders, I honestly think Chicago will be a good bet for that winter vibe and exploring what happens there during the outbreak

[wheat bane]

True, getting away from NYC and DC will make huge impact

[brittle lion]

And then as the story progresses as a live service game, maybe even delve into the rebuild phase ala Division 2

[loud harness]

long shot idea
maybe it’s a agent getting activated while on vacation in another country
Canada/mexico

[wheat bane]

from what i know(cant confirm) SHD agents must stay in America

as they are sleeper agents and they can be activated anytime

[wheat bane]

but one problem. Outbreak began on New York and then spread from there

[brittle lion]

Lot of travel during the holiday season

[wheat bane]

Could make sense

[quiet jackal]

I know we are kinda far from it probably couple of years

But I hope people that write stuff in DiV2 have clear head and write it properly and satisfying

[brittle lion]

Yeah, honestly feel like it’s a 2026 /2027 kind of release

[wicked gorge]

One day my dream of seeing a agent in samurai armor and carrying katanas will be fulfilled

[quiet jackal]

Also for god sake wake Schaeffer up

Its so annoying at this point

[brittle lion]

I’m also curious how Heartland’s story will play out, even if it’s in a made up town

[wicked gorge]

He aint waking up till Ubisoft demands

It’s a made up town

[quiet jackal]

wdym?

They have writers for that kind of stuff

[brittle lion]

I know it’s taking place in the midwest, but like, where in the midwest?

How did the virus spread to the rural areas?

[wicked gorge]

If im right around the Great Plains I think?

[brittle lion]

That kind of thing

I live in the midwest so I have some interest haha

[loud harness]

there’s a silver creek in Ohio

[wicked gorge]

Only way I could see the virus making its way to rural towns is convoys and supply chains

[brittle lion]

Supply chains for certain

[wicked gorge]

I think I just found a major plot hole

[brittle lion]

I live in a rural area but St Louis is within reach after about an hour

[wicked gorge]

If McManus is the secretary of defense and has tons of information on the division, couldn’t he just send the hunters and Black tusk to the nodes in the Midwest

[brittle lion]

So quick spread of any kind of infection is completely reasonable

[wicked gorge]

If only a rogue and a army of outcast were almost successful in destroying one node, imagine the bt and hunters going in

[brittle lion]

I do hope they manage to incorporate actual seasons in Division 3, would do wonders for immersion and aid in storytelling

[wicked gorge]

They probably will keep it, I think it was a success for the division

[brittle lion]

No I mean actual seasons reflected visually

Division 2 is in perpetual summer

Though it’s possible the Manhattan DLC may end up being a winter map given the timeline we’re seeing

Which would be really cool

[wicked gorge]

I would like to see whether match up with the months

Snow for nov-fed and dampened areas for mar-may

[wheat bane]

people running away as soon as hearing a mass spreading infection?

[wicked gorge]

That’s also true, lots of zombie shows sees people heading to rural and desert areas

[quiet jackal]

I haven't played Div1 but I've seen there was snow everywhere

and Div2 takes place at what Spring,Summer?

[wicked gorge]

Yeah

Man it’s crazy that we’ve been playing for 4-5 years now and in the timeline it’s only been a few months since the launch of the game

[lone salmon]

Don't get your hopes up. I'm pretty sure in one of Eva's broadcasts she mentions how it's conveniently gonna be a "year with no snow"

[sleek plover]

Damn I hate LMB

[lone salmon]

"Ah fuck" - Agent Johnson

[surreal hearth]

McManus is a major hush hush type

Most of his hunters came from various programs before and after the outbreak we already know that agent Johnson who turned out to be a hunter himself was following orders but nat use him to puppeteer and manipulate us in order to steal the mobile SHD cloud server

Would have ended the division then and there if not for birdie suddenly switching sides and then massacre and entire black tusk forces using McManus own mortar weapons

Unfortunately killing the traitor Johnson means that McManus is most likely gonna further cave himself in knowing that he just lost his only tool for recruiting more hunters for his cause

It’s also confirmed that he may have been using the diamond network to mask his identity from ISACs network

Or most likely blend in with us

[gaunt ice]

when was that mentioned

if Birdie can hack ISAC then i dont see why she cant fake his identity

its actually a plot point in one of the books

an agent goes rogue and with the rogue network he can mask his status

i dont think diamond was something concrete yet

[surreal hearth]

Since i found out that after Johnson got mortar nuke to oblivion and ISAC failed to confirm the kill or tell if his status was classified like jack bonnie

Just went silent on us

[surreal hearth]

Well she’s no agent or rogue just another tech expert that knows her way around technology

[gaunt ice]

nah pretty sure he's dead

dead dead

[static crypt]

tbf isac was being fucked up during that whole mission

[gaunt ice]

though bro's a robot lol

[surreal hearth]

Oh right

[gaunt ice]

no one takes a whole mortar round and have their corpse fucking intact

not just intact,bro threw a one liner

[surreal hearth]

ISAC got bonked offline multiple times

[surreal hearth]

I find that part hilarious

[static crypt]

because they are still bullet sponges

[gaunt ice]

nanomachines son

[surreal hearth]

Then that is one hard dead bullet sponge

[gaunt ice]

they harden in response to physical trauma

[surreal hearth]

You guys gotta admit that atleast the bastard deserves getting mortar nuked after we got mortar many times already considered it a double payback

[static crypt]

lesson learned

never keep mortar launchers near division agents

[surreal hearth]

Actually now both Cindy and birdie have committed war crimes themselves

Cuss I remember that Cindy took control of that stuff as well

[gaunt ice]

based

[surreal hearth]

Well we helped her took control of some black tusk mortars on Conley island

[wicked gorge]

Johnson can’t be the only recruiter, Honestly McManus seems too smart for that, so I think he has a few more recruiters

[wicked gorge]

Still, it’s such a big plot hole to overlook

[surreal hearth]

Well how about that hell dude from paradise lost?

He’s no hunter but he was carrying a lot of watches on his armor chest

[wicked gorge]

Im pretty sure it was a hunter embedded in the cleaners

I think one of the coms between hellfire and Nat mentioned McManus, but i dont remember

[surreal hearth]

A sledgehammer hunter that wears watches and then upgrades two lovebirds into killers

[gaunt ice]

im more inclined to believe that the cleaner guy got BT gear

and one of them happens to have a hunter mask

[surreal hearth]

Yeah that was his name hellfire

[gaunt ice]

like sure McManus has the manpower but black tusk is superior when it comes to logistic

i refuse to believe that Hellfire or whatever is a hunter

[surreal hearth]

NGN and I agreed

[wicked gorge]

Yeah wiki says he’s a undercover hunter

[gaunt ice]

like they're meant to be these trained spec ops

[gaunt ice]

wiki's fan made

[surreal hearth]

Hellfire was no hunter he was just one of McManus hidden contacts that nat uses for “emergency insurance uses”

And yes for some unknown reason all of these high priority targets have these so called “insurance” of some kind

[gaunt ice]

its pretty impressive that bro killed all the agents at the estate with a fucking axe

also his fire makes him bulletproof lmfao

i like to believe that the fire fucking melted the bullets

[surreal hearth]

Like lau and she has four insurance on her after finding out about shaeffer

[wicked gorge]

I guess in black diamond we’ll finally stop the black tusk

[gaunt ice]

when's black diamond again

[wicked gorge]

2025 due to the maintenance work

[gaunt ice]

thats not the name of the dlc is it

[surreal hearth]

The diamond part was mentioned among the NSA audio logs

[wicked gorge]

That’s what the roadmap called it so I guess it is

Could be a placeholder, but rn it’s called Black Diamond

[surreal hearth]

The major question is on how ANNA will play in these roles?

[wicked gorge]

Maybe that’s why we’re going back to NYC

[surreal hearth]

Where most likely to rescue agent kelso in the future cuss she did went to NYC for something else

And that something is to find answers about everything

And all of this dates back to where the outbreak began

[wicked gorge]

Season 3 is supposed to invoke Keener and is supposed to be centered around him a bit, if im right

Im just wanna point this out, Black Tusk got their ass kicked 3 times in camp white oak and thought, damn this is the perfect place to come back to

[surreal hearth]

The camp white oak is a major stronghold for POTUS and it was a key importance of politics everywhere

[wicked gorge]

Yeah ik that, but still you think they would have learned

[surreal hearth]

Black tusk getting involved repeatedly means they got super clingy of that place aaand it’s because the JTF had to abandoned the place entirely thanks to heads and tails killing them

Feels like the JTF sucks at securing major areas

[wicked gorge]

I find it funny that every-time we launch the game now, we can see agent Johnson on the right side

[surreal hearth]

As much as I hate vik he was right about nat

[wicked gorge]

Reason the JTF can’t hold anything is cause it’s mostly a skeleton crew at the White House, the JTF is the weakest faction in DC technically without the division

[surreal hearth]

Exactly we don’t have that many JTF support since the US military got fragmented thanks to Antoine and his mutineers of traitors

Which formed the true sons

[wicked gorge]

You would think the civilian militia would help out

Kinda sad we never heard of the true sons that defected to the division during season 10

[surreal hearth]

There’s been several defectors that fled true sons entirely and they are most likely in hiding just there’s not much

Anderson is most likely banging nat twice on Sundays by now cuss sheesh those two

[wicked gorge]

Im curious on how Keener got access to ANNA

[surreal hearth]

Isn’t it obvious

It came from Parnell

Theo Parnell

[wicked gorge]

Yeah but you really think Parnell could have access a complex ai like Anna? I know he’s a skilled hacker, but I feel like he isn’t that good

[gaunt ice]

Keener found it apparently

he needed Parnell to decrypt it

[surreal hearth]

I could take a guess that McManus wanted all three AIs under one control for him and only him

But keener sabotaged it by hijacking ANNA

[wicked gorge]

The 4 hidden hunter comns are interesting, especially the last 2

Idk about y’all, but when Birdie was shutting the network down, it kept reminding of the tech Keener had that shut ours down

[surreal hearth]

Right I remember that part

I wonder if she was using ANNA from all of this carnage?

[wicked gorge]

Doubt it, she might have had the SHD server nearby or something to tap into it

It still puzzles me why Manny let us take the server to White Oak

[surreal hearth]

Because he got manipulated by Johnson most likely to steal the mobile server for nat

Now your gonna go and say “manny messed up again” moment

[wicked gorge]

Still, with the network being in a bad spot, i dont see why letting 2 agents take basically your last line of defense to a Black Tusk site

It’s mainly one of those choices where you have to decide save one or hundreds

[surreal hearth]

Vik went all conspiracy theory about how these SHD mobile serves can kill babies

[gaunt ice]

they didn't wanna risk us going in without tech like last time

[wicked gorge]

Are y’all disappointed we can’t use the mortars in the castle

[surreal hearth]

And manny has the right to be paranoid about it

[surreal hearth]

The mortar is most likely gonna be used as some major defense line against the black tusk invasion

[wicked gorge]

I understand so we could have our tech, but if they did get away with the server, we would be defenseless

[wicked gorge]

But i wanna call a air strike 😦

Also if BT need servers so bad, they can just go to a node and take them

[surreal hearth]

We had enough fun with mortars for one day since they really created so many shockwaves against us

[wicked gorge]

So apparently you can find Johnson hideout

[surreal hearth]

They just took the bioreactor but couldn’t find a cloud server

[wicked gorge]

I still think Hellfire is a hunter, i heavily doubt Nat and McManus would work with a cleaner or just a contact of them

It also adds the fact that if he’s really a Hunter, how many hunters are embedded in the factions

[floral gull]

Can someone remind me who Birdie was in the early days of Division 2? I think I forgot who this character was

[cold bramble]

cant blame him ngl

[cold bramble]

isnt she a new character or something

only mention of a birdie before was a BT sniper

[floral gull]

Hmm 🤔

Who’s left in this series for manhunts besides Cal and Sokolova? If they decide to put up Manny and Kelso, I think we are out of major characters to kill, maybe Sawyer

[sick lantern]

they’ll come up with another Stovepipe-type character to show up, act like they’re going to do something important, then die unceremoniously if they need to fill out time with a manhunt

[sick lantern]

the Black Tusk’s operations are limited to the east coast
you reminded me that they namedropped the Black Tusk having a connection with the Roamers and literally nothing fucking came of it

that’s the formula for the plot “a thing happened/was mentioned, then nothing came of it”

[marble dawn]

Strategist and the russian tchernen what now doctor guy

You guys listen to the comms? || Division 3 set in nuclear winter? ||

[empty shell]

Comms?

Sorry, first time checking out this channel :D

[solid python]

The audio messages stuff

[sick lantern]

short for communications, used to refer to collectibles audio messages (as those make up the majority of div 2's seasonal added collectibles)

[empty shell]

thanks

[wicked gorge]

I find it curious that McManus brought up Kelso and Keener in the hunter comns

[quiet jackal]

Nah Cal is full of S* he manipulated Johnson that "his side is right side" meanwhile he is responsible personally for Ellis with Nataliya

I still think we are gonna get probably one more raid before the end with either McManus or Nataliya

Nataliya has model and everything and McManus is ghost as of now in my opinion he is endgame

[marble dawn]

Id guess Nat manhunt leading up to the dlc

Likely in for a filler season this year

[static crypt]

A Nat manhunt would be good as the last ever one for the game

and then transition into Division 3 whenever that comes out

[surreal hearth]

I’m not gonna lie Natalia Sokolova may be smart, but she’s also a complete coward

Been listening to a couple of audio logs from Birdy. She seem to know a lot more Intel about the black tusk and Natalia.

Turns out Natalia has a number of deep state cabals within their super secret hideout bunker to keep nuclear fallout out.

Any rich person would afford a bunker for millions of reasons and it’s confirmed that this hidden bunker might be the black tusk HQ

[wicked gorge]

I pretty sure birdie said one of the bunkers were the black tusk HQ

[gaunt ice]

Honestly the argument that BT gud might be more compelling if they didn’t execute people

[floral gull]

2nd manhunt on an escaped Bardon Schaefer, this time he’s still on the wheelchair as he faked his coma halfway through

[wicked gorge]

Since the dlc is getting pushed back im curious on how the story is gonna go

[patent narwhal]

considering it was already pretty far away from day 1 my guess is probably some reruns unless they haven't made the general story and how we get to it already

[cold bramble]

doesnt wanna get the suit dirty

[wicked gorge]

That’s a lot of CEOs, they call the shots and act supreme, but the second you strip those roles away, they’re nothing but a person

[cold bramble]

I gotta admit, i forgot that most of the leaders arent little push overs

really in the entire franchise, only sokolova and maybe even keener or emeline really didnt have the balls to fight you

everyone else actually wanted to rock your shit and now you got kim kardashian getting banged by some dude leading a pretend rag tag group of "patriots"

[vale oak]

wth is "recruiter insurance 1"

[lone salmon]

clues for extra comms

for that one, at night (after 2100), pull on the lever near vik's station, follow the lights

[vale oak]

o ok

i wonder what the next season will be abt

[lone salmon]

from the sounds of it we'll be heading back to new york to pick up the pieces

probably catch up on kelso too

[surreal hearth]

Least keener did since he had nowhere to run

And so does emelie both of them fought and died well in the end

According to vik he has a lot of connections for a lot of military installations he used to work with including Nat and cal

Before we all start throwing our roller mines and set him on fire hear him how

He knows more of this situation than manny given how sokolova really messed with his head up

We cut one old manipulator and then two more pops out of nowhere playing their twisted manipulative games

And Natalya? I thought she didn’t have interest of having any of the SHD serves back when black tusk and the divisions were in demo testing

I wonder what changed her mind to let Johnson steal our mobile servers then?

[wicked gorge]

The devs said that next season we’ll be going back to New York and discover what keener knew about, or involve his character somehow

[vale oak]

nice nice

i hope we get more of the stuff they did for white oak

like an update of some of the mission areas

looked pretty neat :3

[wicked gorge]

The hunter insurance you gotta do at night btw

[vale oak]

yeah i did insurance 1

how to do 2 tho

[wicked gorge]

Second one is by capital hill

My best recommendation is YouTube, easiest solution, I hate they all have to be done at night, but they’re easy

[wicked gorge]

Im a bit annoyed that she wants the servers for her tech and that’s mainly because of some plot holes ive thought of

[vale oak]

you need wony for the manhunts right

[wicked gorge]

Yeah

[vale oak]

alr

[wicked gorge]

Idk about y’all, but I miss the little descriptions on the exotic attachments, I feel they added extra character and help maxed them stand out more

[obtuse arrow]

Yes

[wild grove]

How about Agent Johnson's agents/friends? Agent Ward and Agent Dunne. They could be next or were back at killing general Anderson

And lets hope that Bardon Scheaffer finally wakes up

[vale oak]

same

[surreal hearth]

Agent ward was killed by hyenas during a classified assignment

Also I found out why nat wants the servers

She was starting to underestimate the division and the hunters making her feel a little unmatched and because the shade tech has beyond expectations than her own black tusk tech she was trying to steal on of our servers in order to upgrade both black tusk and true sons with shade tech which would become a nightmare to deal with

This feels like McManus might be onto her and because he never told her about the multi node watch he has in his possession then it’s clear that she definitely now wants that network

[late void]

Still waiting for McManus & Sokolova to stop pretending to be allies and start laying into each other, would make our job rather easier.

[gaunt ice]

10000 black tusk would steamroll 100 hunters tho so doubt

[late void]

I suspect McManus has more up his sleeve than hunters. Could likely hack/disable all the BT tech too.

[gaunt ice]

that would be lowkey bs i wont lie

[late void]

well, the recruiter seemed to have an infinite duration invulnerable deflection drone, so bs is kind of the name of the game these days

[wicked gorge]

Ofc they have a infinite defender drone, but no, ours is made of cardboard

[mint citrus]

Rules for us, not for them

[gaunt ice]

Ok but on the bright side

They’re so bad at their job they still lose even with that

Whats the science behind a defender drone anyway

[wicked gorge]

Uses a microwave emitter to attempt to halt bullets , I think

If im right it puts a certain radiation wave around the agent that stops bullets, i hope im wrong cause that sounded very stupid

[late void]

waiting for someone to try it with a real microwave. Cook themselves while at best causing metal objects to spark a bit

[cold bramble]

why should just get thousands of them and give them all cancer

[wicked gorge]

All we gotta do is get the comn from McManus saying “my fellow hunters, while our defender drones are our strongest tech, y’all have been exposed enough to have a type of cancer…. It was a honor to serve with you”

[ashen jungle]

If someone ever finds out a way to make ammo that infinitely respawns if you just wait 30 seconds, wars would never end.

[late void]

Revive hives would be fun. Go skydiving without the parachute!

[wicked gorge]

Riot foam launcher, someone pisses me out imma stick them to the ground

[nocturne arrow]

Matryoshka rolly pollies. Fun with bombs for the whole family.

[gaunt ice]

banshee pulse would just be the cqc goat

metal gear solid but every enemy has a Banshee pulse(Snake dies)

[unreal widget]

Hey Agents,

Thomas Parrott, the author of the Operation Crossroads Novels is doing an AMA right now, so if you have questions you can post them here:

https://www.reddit.com/r/thedivision/comments/18ujg4l/author_thomas_parrott_ama/

[next hemlock]

For the turrets I’m not sure how that would work

[sick lantern]

automated turrets are probably the most realistic piece of tech?

[wicked gorge]

Just saying having a SHD turret and seeker mines would make everyone a menace

[next hemlock]

I think so

[next hemlock]

Fr

[wicked gorge]

Anyone else want new skills in the Division? I love the skills we have and helps build the lord for their tech, but im curious on what tech they could add

[ashen jungle]

The obvious answer there is what enemies have and we don't, e.g. fire foam, bows, etc.

[wicked gorge]

Idk if it’ll count as lore, but does anyone remember that the division 1 had stealth mechanics in its alpha

[lament chasm]

Xdefiant dome shield

[sleek plover]

Makeshift/ Junk skin for all my drones and turrets

will go well with my rioter look

[wicked gorge]

Dammit now I gotta see a Glock duct taped to a drone now

[wild grove]

Now i have some unanswered questions.
So the hunters are highly trained division agents right? But in division 1, why were they in the Underground and Survival trying to kill us? We were on the mission right or were we rogue for a long time?

[sick lantern]

they’re not division agents, and they kill division agents because hunters are the bad guys

wait actually they kinda are division agents now sometimes sorta

idk. it’s dumb. i wasn’t under the impression that Johnson was representative of every hunter being a skimmed off division agent

[wild grove]

You sure? Mr Recruiter AKA Brian Johnson was a division agent and in the mission he said that he trained other division agents to take down the Rogue treat

[sick lantern]

i did just say

[wild grove]

Yea

I remember i watched a very old video about the hunters and they said that they were highly trained Russian special forces to take down Division agents to get Vitaly Tchernenko back

[sick lantern]

that was just a hypothesis

[wild grove]

Yea

[marble dawn]

In the new comms we learn that Cal wasnt too big into Lau, so maybe he sent hunters after our div1 agent considering them 'off mission' for taking orders from her

In survival it could also just be them after the same antiviral(?) stuff your objective is to get in the mode, I forget what it was

[wicked gorge]

I don’t think the hunters in the underground are cannon, but for the survival lore, I think it’s cause the black tusk are working behind the scenes and they want to have the cure before the division to seem like the true hero’s

Also if division agents are trained to be resourceful and adaptive, wouldn’t they be taught on what to do if the network was destroyed

[sick lantern]

rogue agents kill the commander and Lau has to step up, and somehow, working with Lau is the rogue option. impeccable logic

[sick lantern]

yes, like in Survival or any time you’re in the DZs and disconnected from the network the whole time. that’s besides the fact that it defies all logic for the network to be taken down by a single decapitating strike at all

[wicked gorge]

To me, the whole division 2 felt like “oh they destroyed are network and we dont have access to our tech and we’re scattered” like you said destroying one server cluster for the network shouldn’t shut it down

Just shows how unprepared they really were

[wicked gorge]

Also the network isn’t disabled in survival and in the dark zone is probably signal jammers to prevent stuff coming in and out

[sick lantern]

not down but “shot tf out by a hurricane” same effect

otherwise the agents could just be like “hey i crashed over here let’s meet up”

[wicked gorge]

Happy new years to my fellow agents

[gaunt ice]

Wouldn’t it be technically the LMB since they launched the AA guns? @sick lantern

[gaunt ice]

Just another thorn in the eye wouldn’t you say

[wicked gorge]

Wdym? I was talking about it seemed the division wasn’t prepared for a network failure

[gaunt ice]

Oh sorry i tagged the wrong person

[wicked gorge]

You good no worries

To answer your question, The Lmb did launch the missiles that killed the commander, but it was mainly Keener launching the air strike

[sleek plover]

Damn I hate LMB

[tepid ibex]

Nuh uh

[sleek plover]

Freedom is a right. Liberty is a given.

To deny this is blasphemy.

[urban musk]

Thoughts on the JTF? @sleek plover

[sleek plover]

They are the status quo, but so far the best alternative out of all factions

Despite me being a full-blown antifa and anarcho-communist, I must agree that JTF is the best option to rebuild united states.

True Sons, however, are just LMB 2.0

While BTSU is 3.0

[urban musk]

can't deny that logic

[sleek plover]

The bad guys I would definitely sympathize would be outcasts and rioters

[urban musk]

I can sympathize with outcasts, but I cannot do the same with MOST of the rioters.

[sleek plover]

as for hyenas and rikers...well...at least LMB, BTSU and True Sons are worse than them.

[urban musk]

there are some comms in the div 1 that makes me sympathize with some of the rioters.

but the rest? nah.

[sleek plover]

Tbf the reason I sympathize with the rioters are because.

1. they are basically starving desperate people.
2. they have literally no ideology

But tbh, I would definitely go rogue while not being a keenerite, and form my own faction

[urban musk]

If they didn't riot and burn aid centers, they wouldn't be starving.

[sleek plover]

you mean cleaners+

?

Also LMB kills social workers

[urban musk]

Rioters?

[sleek plover]

Cleaners are guys with the gas masks and flamethrowers

[urban musk]

yeah, what is a riot?

and what is used during riots?

[sleek plover]

I hate them a but worse than Rikers and less than LMB

they are jerks tho

[urban musk]

I would go as far as to say every except the civilian militia faction in DC and most in NY are bad.

[sleek plover]

At least JTF is sane for the most part

excluding true sons guys

Definitely would viciously prank ex-LMB who joined in new york with itching powders

cuz if I cant kill them, im gonna make their morale suffer by turning their lives into hell

[urban musk]

the JTF in the div 1 and peacekeepers + civilian militias in div 2 are the ONLY good factions without evident evil intentions.

[sleek plover]

That I agree

They are basically what is left of united states

[urban musk]

the JTF in dc just watched as the True Sons let the Outcasts suffer.

now the main bulk of the JTF in DC are just civilians who signed up and volunteered.

[sleek plover]

Exactly

We should give our militia proper gear

like green jtf helmets

[urban musk]

only those worthy of having them will get them.

[sleek plover]

They are worthy tho

they literally survived against True Sons

and Black Tusks

and kept their communities safe so far

or maybe we could hold job interviews

[urban musk]

Ok, I will admit, the JTF who survived guarding the white house from the black tusk and remained loyal during the true sons reign of terror deserve the helmets.

[sleek plover]

Give the civilian militia guys opportunity to properly join JTf

[sleek plover]

most definitely

[urban musk]

actually, that is happening in the castle settlement, there's a recruitment center

[sleek plover]

But seriously, if we have a proper friendly JTF faction guys

with divided archetype roles

I must guess that they will follow the same archetypes as the true sons does

Assault
Chargers
Snipers
Engineers
Medics
Tanks
Etc

[urban musk]

that would make the most sense.

[sleek plover]

And as for castle...I cannot fully trust them

some of tjem used to be ex true sons inder lewis right?

[urban musk]

only one remaining is wally.

[sleek plover]

They gonna be also pranked real bad

oh

good

I kinda retired after stovepipe

[urban musk]

also, I really hope we get to see the JTF again during the brooklyn expansion.

[sleek plover]

Me too

You know, the only reason i bought this game was because i read the wiki out of curiosity, and read the LMB article and decided these guys are the worst

[urban musk]

I don't know why they have so many fans.

[sleek plover]

and during that time division 2 was just out and rumors of returning to new york and cleaners being fightable was rampant

So I decided, at division 1 LMB isnt completely wipe out, so in WONY maybe I get to do some.remnant hunting

But alas, those BT chargers dont even have any unique dialogue to give me satisfaction

[urban musk]

BT are IMO just as bad as the LMB.

[sleek plover]

I knkw thr reason why...but it will make it too political

and thats the huge no-no when it comes.to gaming servers.

So i'll just say what I think and delete it after 5 seconds, so read it properly okay?

there

[sleek plover]

BT is the ultra-LMB

I just hope the ex LMB guys get their own separate unit or sth

so.I can get tje satisfaction of wiping what is left of tjem for good

and I am sure White Tusks are not canon just like the legendary missions, not sure they are ex LMB even

[tepid ibex]

They’re not canon, idk why they have their own Fandom page tbh. They’re supposed to be the ‘best of the best’ i guess, not exclusively LMB. Just the Scouts/Rushers and Support Station guys are LMB

[ashen jungle]

I always saw "White Tusk" as just the BTSU faction of Black Tusk, the one that Schaeffer was in charge of.

Black Tusk Special Unit, their special forces, for those in the cheap-seats.

[sleek plover]

I hope their balaclabas are rubbery, uncomfortable and sweaty

[surreal hearth]

Ooh shit

I just noticed something

When birdie told us about the black tusk HQ being in some work in progress bunker to house billions of people that survived the outbreak

She mentioned biometric scan that only BTSU leaders have access to it

I think killing them have caused nats precious bunker to go on lockdown or something unless

Now we really gotta protect Barton hard

I’m starting to understand why kelso mention we have a key

[sick lantern]

I was expecting something less literal than “he is literally capable of opening a special door”. Bet ChatGPT did it

[wicked gorge]

Im guessing you found the audio log that mentions that

[lunar inlet]

probably someone asked already... but is Heartland coming out on january for real??

[wicked gorge]

But my whole problem with Schaffer being the key is, if he’s presumed dead or captured, wouldn’t they delete his biometrics from the system

[wicked gorge]

I think it’s coming out mid 2024

[lunar inlet]

so no official news ?

[wicked gorge]

As far as I know 2024 is when the game is supposed to come out

And@I think they said it would be mid 2024 but I can’t remember

[lunar inlet]

I see... damn start january with hearland would have been 2 good

[wicked gorge]

Im curious on how the melee system is gonna work

[sick lantern]

one would think
there was one comm of Natalya having the WH observed i think to see if they could figure out if he was a traitor or not. but surely, remove him to be sure, and if he’s still loyal just put him back on the system? so yea it’s dumb if they go that route

[wicked gorge]

I love the division story, but lately I’m seeing a few plot holes

[surreal hearth]

Yeah that’s exactly what I heard

Nat building a bunker but also trying to steal our server means that she might be threatening us with nukes

And she may have cut ties with cal due to failed to contain us

[surreal hearth]

Good point

But birdie mention that these kinds of coding or network systems require more than one hand alone

Assuming that kidnapping our people is most likely “borrowing” to fix or support multiple infrastructure for her black tusk but only temporarily until we rescued them all

[quiet jackal]

I mean Barton was going rogue also,so how do you know he still has access for that bunker

Usually its smart to replace a person once it becomes Risk...unless there is lazy writing involved

[sick lantern]

see the problem is the writing consistently is

they’ve specifically brought up doors that are bio locked and BTSU members have access
so the expectation for that is that the rogue BTSU member will open the door for us, and he sure as hell isn’t shaping up to be or do anything else so far

in a better written story, I would have more faith

[quiet jackal]

yeah...lets hope Schaeffer actually wakes up and does something to get on our side bcs its so dull that he is in coma since what season 3?

[bold pumice]

ok so stupid question but if the hyenas and rikers had a full on faction war, with both at full strength, who do you think would win

[ashen jungle]

It's honestly a hard question, I think on sheer passion alone the drug addicts would take it.

[bold pumice]

my moneys on Rikers tbh

they just have better camaraderie and better leadership.

[ashen jungle]

Well, had.

I think some of the Hyena leaders are still alive.

[bold pumice]

the council?

'cause i know for a fact a lot of them got their positions through treachery

theres a couple of logs from the hyenas discussing their dysfunctional leadership

[ashen jungle]

Well most of them are dead at this point, but they would've been replaced.
Rikers it's harder to say, since everyone who was running the faction is dead.

Dragov, whatsherfacethatihadtofarm100timestogetherExoticindiv1, and the one at the Bounty.

[sleek plover]

TBH i rather see them allied to form a east coast wide crime syndicate

[bold pumice]

i could see the rikers and hyenas getting along

but like.. i hate the hyenas so much

[sleek plover]

Most of them are former gang members anyways, and they also ar united by being rikers prison inmates and Hyena council

so why not unite again and forn a east coast syndicate

Once they are gathered, they will be easuer to crush than when they were scattered.

[bold pumice]

its so sad that div 2 takes places soo far away from new york

oh, speaking of which, how the fuck did jupiter get the cleaners to DC

[sleek plover]

Tugboats

Canoes

Mayflower ships

And in honor of the pilgrims, they all got scurvies

[bold pumice]

glad that isnt contagious

imagine all the cleaners got sick on the way and burned themselves up before reaching DC lol

[sleek plover]

they got hella seasick and burned themselfes out of it

hey you stole my spot

"Feeling dizzy eh? That sounds like the green poison."

[bold pumice]

how many cleaners do you think just do what they do for kicks

like most of them arent doing it for fun, most of them have to have this shit take a huge toll on them

[opaque ridge]

stupid question rq cause im still halfway through div2 and its been a while since i finished div1, which game are the rikers from?

[bold pumice]

division one and warlords

[sleek plover]

I once had chatgpt write a standup comedy line based in post division 1 told by civilian comedian performing in front of JTF.

The best it could manage was making fun of them calling themselves cleaners while wearing all that hazmat suits all day and spraying fire would make them all sweaty and thats like reallt bad for personal hygene

[bold pumice]

:(

[sleek plover]

It also said what LMB stood for is lose many battles

And making fun if rikers that their number one accomplishment in life is prison break and they built their identity after thr jail

followed by some lame midlife crisis joke

[bold pumice]

y'know i thought about it for 30 seconds total lol

i was thinking what if the cleaners and outcasts actually met

[vale oak]

wait did they ever mention where the 2025 dlc will take place

[bold pumice]

and was like they both like burning people

[sleek plover]

Florida

[bold pumice]

then i remembered how many outcasts are infected

[ashen jungle]

They didn't even technically break out, they were released.

[sleek plover]

blame the AI rivs

[ashen jungle]

I would never blame myself.

[ashen jungle]

The image used in the promo was of the Brooklyn Bridge, so....

that's our best guess so far.

[sleek plover]

I meant the chatgpt

[ashen jungle]

Oh right, I'm 100% not a chatbot.
I have veins and everything.

[vale oak]

ooo nice

[sleek plover]

Nope, you are a technocyte built puppet controlled by edgy superpowered teens

[ashen jungle]

They're actually adults now, although it's arguable if all of them are technocyte puppets or just mannequins with flesh inside.

but enough about the LMB.

[sleek plover]

But either way, you are a lesbian

and that is unchangable

[ashen jungle]

Did the pfp circled in a lesbian flag and the word "lesbian" in my name not give it away?

[bold pumice]

i dont actually know much about the LMB

just started div 1, learning a lot about it

[sleek plover]

basically, all.my hatred put aside

they are some.kinda pmc

[bold pumice]

the rikers looked super tame in comparison to the biker rikers we get in div 2 lol

[sleek plover]

who was originally hired as bodyguards

led by a retired colonel

who decided they should go nazi

[ashen jungle]

LMB were the equivalent of Black Tusk but in div1 and not as oligarchy-evil-like.

[bold pumice]

i know that much. PMC paid to protect wall street and the embassies.

[sleek plover]

And killed civil workers

and conscripted civilians into death squads

[ashen jungle]

In fairness, that is also what True Sons did.

[sleek plover]

And said freedom.is.not a right, denying literally everything what america stands for

lol

I downloaded div 2 just because I read about them in a wiki, and decided since they are not completely obliterated in div 1, I coukd go remnant hunting there

[bold pumice]

wish the true sons were more morally gray sometimes.. feel like they coulda pulled a spec ops the line and forced the player to question themselves with the true sons

[sleek plover]

Trust me

the most morally.grey pt i see in div enemy factions

are rioters basically being starving people

and outcast being vengeful victims

[ashen jungle]

Outcast want to actively spread the virus, they're about as morally grey as Emperor Palpatine.

[bold pumice]

ehh

outcasts, i disagree with

[ashen jungle]

The kinda point of div2 is that literally no enemy faction is redeemable. All of them are insane and evil.

[bold pumice]

rioters? i agree. i feel for a lot of them. but they arent justified in their shit either. stealing from CERA while giving food to quarentined people? beating civvies in the streets for their money??

[bold pumice]

i dont like that, it doesnt feel right to me.

[ashen jungle]

If you want moral complexity, a looter-shooter is the wrong kinda game for you.

2 of the factions literally use flamethrowers. Nothing complex about that.

[bold pumice]

you could argue 3 because of that one true son

and then there was another that used incendiary 'nades