division-universe

[sleek plover]

I dunno, the fact that many of the jtf sided with ridgeway explains that they were evil to begin witj

[cursive tapir]

Cool!

The ambusher in viewpoint is a bug I’m pretty sure. He used to be a standard True Sons goon

[fringe gale]

everytime i fight the outcasts, i do feel slightly bad

but at the same time, suicide bombers? really brah?

[sleek plover]

Well...they are mad with revenge and are already dying of the plague so...

[fringe gale]

true

[clever plank]

most of the bad guys dont really make sense, i just try not to think about it too much

cleaners the most ???

[fringe gale]

slightly good idea, horrid execution

[clever plank]

idk the whole thing doesnt make much sense, but thats the whole game lol

[mint citrus]

The Cleaners kind of made sense in the first one

Heavy handed though they were

[errant wyvern]

bruh imagine a divsion game but for Vr aswell

[languid wing]

That be interesting

[cold bramble]

Nah just play airsoft at that point

[iron horizon]

Division 2 vr bro u getting jumped by npcs is a no go for me

[fringe gale]

div2 with haptic feedback vest

[cunning osprey]

What was aaron keener warning the agents about

[languid wing]

Natayla mc manus bardon Faye

The BT

And the activation of anna

Isaac's sister

[solid python]

Keener was warning about a lot of things in only "you have no idea what's coming"

[sick lantern]

he was talking about ANNA and what rogues will do with his creations (see: seasons 1 and 2) cus let’s be real they didn’t plan that shit out back then

[cunning osprey]

I thought he was talking about the hunters

[languid wing]

I kinda wish we had the option to go rogue it be a neat little feature yea we can go rogue in the DZ but I wanna be rogue in the open world

It be fun

I have a bone to pick with some jtf

[sick lantern]

I wish we could go anti-rogue and shoot a bunch of rogue agents

exclusively

like agent+ just hunt em down

[languid wing]

Honestly in the div 2 universe you shouldn't trust anyone

Jimmy could be your best friend today and tomorrow he backstabs you

[sick lantern]

ignore the slightly alarmist title, kurzgesagt are just kinda like that aren’t they sometimes, regardless the video is vaguely interesting for div’s lore and worldbuilding
https://youtu.be/9FppammO1zk

[clever plank]

i think the rogues are cool

[steady shore]

indeed cool sling backpacks, also cool we cant use them

even the sling backpacks in division 1 that returned in division 2 returned as regular none sling backpacks

exe the ninja bike messenger bag

or the striker bag

or the lvl35 backpack returning as the police backpack

[gaunt ice]

hunters fury bag is the clostest one to a sling bag i think

[sick lantern]

Eva CALLING OUT the Natalya simps, very based
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IPjHhDDjLGM

[fringe gale]

we love to see it

[fringe gale]

im surprised we really havent seen any Black Tusk defectors tbh

[sick lantern]

Schaeffer is

[late void]

stovepipe might have been

[signal thicket]

All the defectorsare silenced before they get to us save for schaeffer

[fringe gale]

oh yeah me forgor

[fringe gale]

i wonder what his plan would have been if we got to him but didnt kill him

[wicked gorge]

I want a encounter with a rogue agent that went awol to be with his family

[sick lantern]

ok to get political for a second for the sake of comparison
the police officers at Uvalde are in the wrong because they signed up with a duty to protect that they failed to fulfil
this concept that gets floated around sometimes, a rogue agent who "isn't bad" but just wants to go home or whatever, is the same thing. they were trained and prepared with the expectation that they would be on the line protecting people, and by refusing to fulfil the duty they signed up for they are still very much in the wrong

[wicked gorge]

So shoot to kill even if for a good reason 🤣

[gaunt ice]

What happened at Uvalde?

[exotic panther]

IIRC, it was the school shooting incident where the police stood and waited while the perpetrator was still killing kids

also me not being sure which incident it is makes it more fucked

[obtuse arrow]

Yeah they don't deserve to wear a badge. Cowards.

[urban musk]

Ok, another morning ruined.

[sick lantern]

how so

[urban musk]

You know, just waking up does it for me, but that's life. - That's Life by Frank Sinatra plays.

[surreal hearth]

I’m starting to notice what Natalya is using the true son for

She’s using Anderson and his true sons to extend her major backdoor infrastructures along with a massive fleet of hovercrafts that she can use to take America entirely by force

But she is also trying to find a way to create dangerous dirty bombs in order to destroy DC entirely like what happened in saint Louis

Unfortunately that was only a hoax to bolster the true son’s morals

[sick lantern]

bruh idek what you’re talking about. It happened and the Black Tusk had no involvement

[regal perch]

Yea 100% happened, gotta read the books

[gusty peak]

Read the books

Saint louis is a important part of the history actually

[sick lantern]

I HAVE 💀

[gaunt ice]

the dirty bombs were on the outcast actually

idk why the black tusk is trying to cover it up but they're doing it

[obtuse arrow]

That's probably why they rescued the strategist from the White House

[sick lantern]

he was imprisoned for the entirety of the dirty bomb-involved scheme, before during and after until now
it’s unlikely he had anything to do with it, but maybe the black tusk don’t know that

[ivory solar]

But maybe he could reorganize Outcast forces so the Black Tusk can have another ally, similar to Anderson and the True Sons

Have Outcasts perform chemical attacks, blame it on them, then have True Sons secure the area and build bases there

[naive kayak]

True that would be the smart move

[obtuse arrow]

I know that

[obtuse arrow]

Yeah they would be trying to get him to work with/for BTSU and the outcasts will listen to him and work with BTSU also.

[nocturne arrow]

Well, it could work, but with the Outcasts as unwitting pawns, and the Strategist being coerced. I mean, he is a bit of a pushover, if you remember how he was captured.

[oak saddle]

I was thinking that, because both parties realise the Strategist is a pushover and that there's some belief that the BTSU is trying to get rid of the peoples' support for the Division or their legitimacy, in addition to our track record for basically killing high value targets / leaders under most circumstances, any attempt to rescue the Strategist who is, yknow, an ENEMY, could be used to pin the Outcasts' actions on the Division instead via a false flag or something

Just my two cents

[mint citrus]

Didn't we lose the legitimacy when Ellis betrayed us?

[sick lantern]

no because the SHD is an autonomous organisation and Ellis was a traitor to the nation with no legitimate authority

[gaunt ice]

wasn't he sworn into presidency while in a bunker with some officials?

so technically he IS the POTUS

[sick lantern]

yes but he lost any semblance of being a legitimate governmental figure when he became a traitor ergo any authority he claims to have does not have to be recognised

[ashen jungle]

also, the fact that he was presumed dead meant that he would've had the POTUS position temporarily passed on to someone else.
whether that can just be put back to him without documents is unlikely.

[orchid osprey]

Who is the current President in the Division universe? Or is there none atm

I haven't caught up to the lore yet after a long break

[sick lantern]

||Lau|| killed Ellis so there’s no current president

[obtuse arrow]

McManus technically

[mint citrus]

Yep

Cal's off doing shady stuff, most likely

[sick lantern]

if you want to talk technicalities, he hasn’t been sworn in by anyone so he isn’t the president

[orchid osprey]

i'll put my own agent up for election

[obtuse arrow]

He hasn't been sworn in yet but you can't deny that he is the only one left to assume the role and the only one remaining in line of succession, Unless you have some information you'd like to share with us.

[sick lantern]

that doesn’t mean he automatically gets to be the president
if being officially sworn in mattered for Ellis it matters for McManus
and if there’s no one who will swear him in then he ain’t shit cus “technically” the checks and balances of the US political system would prevent his claims

[surreal hearth]

I’m starting to think that these rogues that are involved with the true sons and black tusk as part of a deal for Natalya

I’m theorizing that nat is offering certain rogue agents to be part of the hunter program in exchange for taking down the division agents which obviously don’t end well cuss we are a vicious to begin in

And thanks to some new toys we are now classified as black tusk killers

[sick lantern]

well that’s fair cus the Recruiter is involved in all this kidnapping business

[obtuse arrow]

I'm aware of all of that but okay

[obtuse arrow]

They are trying to access the new tech and want that classified status Bonney had I think

[surreal hearth]

Indeed but they signed their death warrants even with the rogue networks they are outmatched by our new firepower

[obtuse arrow]

Bonney was not a hunter yet but still had that classified status

Yeah they don't stand a chance no matter what they have access to

[surreal hearth]

I can take a guess that the watch we got from Bonney has to have some serious decryptions

A status like that is not normal for an SHD or rogue network

[obtuse arrow]

I think it is classified to ISAC because it is running off a different network

[surreal hearth]

Probably a third node similar to Anna

[sick lantern]

it’s called Diamond

unless there’s a fourth network we don’t yet know about but that’d be dumb

[obtuse arrow]

NGN gave some information on it if you would like to know more

[surreal hearth]

I’ve seen his channel and has a lot of lore going down which is extremely helpful

My biggest concern is nats dangerous sociopathic tendencies to straight up kill an innocent women which a pregnant baby that’s already a day

Nat would kill her before we can even reach Mari

[fringe gale]

well her whole goal with this manhunt is to portray the BT as sympathetic (Radio to help boost morale, therapy sessions, them treating John and Eva well)

if they killed Mari and the baby, their whole plan is cooked

[sick lantern]

but she did also say she doesn't quite have a problem with the concept of Mari dying

or rather she's not that bothered with the health of her and/or her child

[ivory solar]

Could be a bluff but you never know. If they make the Division think there’s a greater threat than there actually is then they’re likely to act without thinking as much and have greater chances of making a mistake

[floral gull]

Did Keener fake his death

[languid wing]

Wym?

We saw him bleed out

[floral gull]

Did anyone retrieve his body, or is it still rotting at the docks?

Can we trust what ISAAC says of his status after all the SHD hacking from him?

Did Keener not have any contingency plans after being a step ahead of everyone through both games?

Besides activating Rogue Network

[languid wing]

I'm sure he had contingency plans but he wanted us to find him

He could of easily escaped us before we even got ti lib Island but he didn't so he wanted us to confront and finally end him

[sick lantern]

well yea presumably they did

[sick lantern]

ISAC*
regardless, I don't think Keener is able to hack bullet wounds out of existence

[late void]

Would not surprise me if Kelso put a few more bullets in his head after the cutscene ended (if you're going to die on me, I'm making sure you're definitely dead!)

[mint citrus]

I mean, they brought Hornet back from the dead, so...

[fringe gale]

after i threw like 3 grenades at him

[sick lantern]

it's still baffling that they brought back Hornet instead of the ostensibly more meaningful Scarecrow

[gaunt ice]

Scarecrow is the first rogue we fight in div1 right

[languid wing]

Yes

[mint citrus]

Yup

[sick lantern]

he’s the second rogue agent in history (first is Keener ofc), was a part of Keener’s original four agent cell, but instead they act like Hornet is the one who had backstory with Keener

to quote Bill Nye “that just makes no f_ckin sense! I mean that’s just bullsh_t!”

[ashen jungle]

Surely theres no actual record of who the first rogue is.

[nocturne arrow]

Hell, maybe the first real rogue agent wasn't even a tactical agent, like our player agents, but one of the guys who were tasked with protecting the politicians when they got evacuated to the bunker or something.

[obtuse arrow]

Keener wasn't the first rogue the first rogue is unknown

[sick lantern]

agents weren’t known to go rogue until the DZ breakdown, and Keener was the first of such to do so
unless we actually see someone else to prove otherwise, Keener is the first known rogue agent

[obtuse arrow]

Still can't be proven that keener was the first

[sick lantern]

Not definitively but what we have says so

[obtuse arrow]

Not really

[orchid osprey]

What info do we have where it states that Keener isn't the first known rogue

[obtuse arrow]

Where's the proof that he is

[sick lantern]

baseless speculation lol

[orchid osprey]

Where is the proof that he isn't

[obtuse arrow]

So you don't have any proof that he is, okay my point exactly lol.

[sick lantern]

Agents didn’t start going rogue until the fall of the dark zone
Keener is the first known rogue agent among them
Prior to this we have no mention that other agents had already gone rogue, and it would be difficult to conceptualise a reason for them to when their operations were more or less proceeding as planned

Unless we actually see something of a first wave agent going rogue before the JTF pull out of the DZ, there is no evidence to suggest the existence of a rogue agent prior to Keener

Until proven otherwise, there’s no reason to believe otherwise

It’s just baseless speculation and hypothetical scenarios to say that he isn’t

[obtuse arrow]

Saying he is without proof is also baseless speculation

[sick lantern]

Fairly plausible, but not suggested in canon material

[sick lantern]

I have literally just explained the logic behind why he is and that there is no material to suggest otherwise

[obtuse arrow]

Okay but still that's your reasoning and not definitive proof

[sick lantern]

Unless new material comes out to change the timeline, it’s the logical conclusion from the canonical evidence presented, and logic is proof to at the very least presume

To say otherwise is again, purely hypothetical

[obtuse arrow]

Hypothetical presumption still doesn't prove anything

[sick lantern]

you saying “that doesn’t prove anything” repeatedly still doesn’t prove anything

[obtuse arrow]

And you repeatedly saying that Keener was the first rogue without evidence doesn't make it true

[sick lantern]

oh also there’s an official ubisoft facebook post saying he is

https://www.facebook.com/Ubisoft.Nordic/posts/aaron-keener-was-the-first-division-agent-to-turn-rogue-now-he-is-pulling-the-st/10158146870836663/

[obtuse arrow]

And then show where the same information is in lore instead of a Facebook post and you may have a point

[sick lantern]

show me the lore information saying he isn’t

oh, there is none, but the publishers themselves say he is and it’s what the lore suggests

[obtuse arrow]

So you can't show where it is besides a Facebook post, My point proven.

[sick lantern]

I showed you earlier
and you’re treating this as some sort of invalid source just because “you said so”

I’m not gonna argue in circles any longer

if you could come up with an actual argument, any form of logic or proof, that would be nice

[obtuse arrow]

You put a link to a Facebook post, Not a very solid case you are making here. I was hoping for some proof.

[sick lantern]

but you don’t seem to be able to raise an actual point besides saying “that doesn’t prove anything”

[sick lantern]

It’s an official source of information, what more can you want

straight from the horse’s mouth

[obtuse arrow]

And you're the one who made the claim with nothing solid to back it so that's on you

[sick lantern]

I have the logical conclusion from the material we have, no evidence or material to the contrary, and an official Ubisoft source saying explicitly it’s true. You have “that doesn’t prove anything”

Please be quiet

[obtuse arrow]

Facebook social media teams are not an official lore source and I don't need to be quiet but asking me that just proves my point

[sick lantern]

You don’t have a point.

Anyway I’m sure no one wants to see this go on so I’m blocking this guy

[obtuse arrow]

That's about as untrue as your claim that keener is the first rogue

[orchid osprey]

this guy is just a troll it seems we can ignore him

[ashen jungle]

Okay that's enough, play nice.

I said enough,.now quit arguing or else.

[orchid osprey]

I've blocked him so no point in arguing anymore

[sick lantern]

I doubt that’s a process the SHD would’ve had any involvement in

[gusty peak]

Now on the map there are appearances of hunters that are not masked, and I barely found out haha

[gusty peak]

With those who don't have a mask, I mean they don't give it or we can't fight with them, they just watch us lol

[sick lantern]

you mean the stalker Hunters as opposed to the easter egg Hunters, right

[gusty peak]

Yep

I saw one near a checkpoint in west end

[surreal hearth]

Been running around DC and surprised I have not seen any true sons nor black tusk killing each other

I’m theorizing that because some players do or don’t like two factions being together during a control point capture they decided to keep black tusk and true sons as seperate as possible because so far there’s been more scavengers and outcast and less true son black tusk involvements

[dusty lichen]

Hi enyone here willing to help me with getting exotics in division 2 and maybe help explain how i can get them

[pulsar wing]

Doing countdown is a pretty good way to get exotics. Play a few games, buy an exotic cache. @dusty lichen

[dusty lichen]

I dont know how to get the tokens to buy cahes i just started sunday and i just turned lvl 30 today so i dont really know how to get them

I dont even know how to access the countdown

[pulsar wing]

You’ll get countdown tokens from playing Countdown, which is located in the Pentco Nuclear power plant. You can matchmake for the activity from the map.

[dusty lichen]

Oh ok thx

[pulsar wing]

I started playing it yesterday and have gotten plenty pf exotics.

[dusty lichen]

Im still a freshy

[pulsar wing]

Might need to be level 40.

I took a long break from division 2, but played a ton at launch.

[dusty lichen]

How though i lvled up 5 times after i turned lvl 30 and im still not passed 30

[pulsar wing]

Can you see the nuclear plant on the map at all? Should be above the dark zone on the right most side.

[dusty lichen]

Yes i see it

I cant send a video here so i cant show you ill send it in a dm

[late void]

you can't level above 30 until you go to NY

[dusty lichen]

Unfortunately i don't have it

[late void]

yeah that is unfortunate - if asking for advice in the future I'd recommend mentioning it straight away, as it significantly limits what items and options are available to you. For lvl 30 exotic farming then, you best bet is probably descent - each time you kill the nemesis you should receive an exotic cache, and you can leave and restart at that point. Once you get the hang of the mode it generally takes under an hour per run (even down to half an hour once you get really quick)

[sick lantern]

this is the lore channel not an lfg channel

[gusty peak]

It is because of the alliance they had with General Anderson and Sokolova, both factions are united, only when you make a rescue one of two factions will show up on Sokolova's orders, the last one was the true sons, if I'm not mistaken.

[surreal hearth]

Yeah but ever since our people got captured both factions are keeping themselves seperate in order to trick us into thinking that there’s only single factions and not conjoined factions

If true son control points are under attack then some black tusk patrols gets involved which makes it a major headache to take control

Thise proves how slimy snake the black tusk are sneaking their external units to help the true sons

Which is why the castle settlement may prove to us that we will destroy both factions without an army to back us up

[dusty lichen]

Well unfortunately i didn't know that im still new at the game today was my 4th day playing and i thought the descent was a training simulator

[late void]

no worries, I didn't expect you to know that - that's why I mentioned it. Most players have the dlc and so we tend to assume everyone has it unless we know otherwise, so it'll save a bit of time and confusion in the future 🙂

[dusty lichen]

Still i still want to know can i really get exotic caches in descent without the dlc

[late void]

as I said, just do nemesis runs - it probably works at lvl 30 the same way it does at lvl 40

[dusty lichen]

Oooohhhh sweet i got heavy grinding to do tomorrow

Thx for that info thats going to help a lot

You and mrbig got some handy info to give to us freashes

[surreal hearth]

There seem to be rumors about this third node that’s responsible for the hunter program operating in between ISAC and ANNA

We have ISAC, the rogues have ANNA, and now the hunters have their own network called diamond according to NGN

I wonder if this decent is connected to the hunter program?

This is unfortunately spoilers for those that haven’t killed the nemesis yet

||Apparently both Natalya and McManus met and knew themselves way way way before the dollar flu outbreak started ||

||Apparently they were involved in some high end, deep state, real hush hush technology that will eventually be used in the coming doomsday and both nat an McManus are auctioneers planning to form their future organizations||

||According to the “bitters” they keep their super classified apocalypse proof servers on a remote bases somewhere in north Dakota or in Alaska||

I know I’m being to conspiracy with this but let the decent audio logs tell you the whole thing or go watch NGN

||I believe this Ortiz robotics was responsible for every single autonomous machines they have ever made as they were purchased privately between the black tusk and DARPA in the pentagon ||

This would explain where the warhounds came from

This also confirmed that the audios timeline indicates that she was the current CEO of sololovs concern after the previous one passed away

Which was super before she restructured it to become the second most dangerous private army also known as the black tusk

||I’m conclusión McManus must have stolen the diamond prototype to create his own army of agents known as the hunters which grants a full on hijack system between ISAC and ANNA which they are indeed called the “cleanup crew”||

But wait that would also mean that“Diamond” and black tusk are……..oh crap.

||McManus was planning to stab nat in the back once the divisions were taken cared of ||

||But McManus may have knew the specific amount of potential that the division has than what nat and her black tusk don’t have ||

[echo turret]

🤯

[obtuse arrow]

Yeah that's basically what's going on I've had that same theory for a while

[clever plank]

i think the hunters are just furries

[surreal hearth]

I apologize for the massive censorship

[spare arrow]

no worries i love censorship

[sick lantern]

he didn’t steal it, Ortiz very explicitly said that he would have access to all three systems

[sick lantern]

we call that a retcon

[signal thicket]

Would it be a retcon if it doesnt contradict anything before?

[sick lantern]

I would call an unnecessary expansion of context to make new story elements seem important off the bat a retcon
for the sake of the new material, the continuity has been retroactively changed

(see: Resident Evil 8 🤮)

[surreal hearth]

Even so atleast it tells us it’s true origin behind ISAC and the creation of the SHD

[clever plank]

(lore exists in most games for the sake of creating new content, which creates more lore, which creates new content, etc)

[signal thicket]

TBF, before this ISAC was kinda just a mcguffin that we know literally nothing about besides it being our ai assistant

the comms now at least shed light on where ISAC came from and can foreshadow what will become of it

Wouldnt call it a retcon and more just an exploration of one of the more important aspects of the division

[signal thicket]

Besides, what makes expansion of context neccessary or unnecessary in your opinion?

[surreal hearth]

Least we now know that we’ve been fighting a military cult regime that wants America to be taken by force from an outsider private sector that wanted to establish this new dynasty that never came true

[heavy valley]

Tbh I tought we had both seeing after warlords we took Kenners watch Anna spoke we heard faye speak to Barden (idk if I got his name right) I'm pretty sure we took the watch an that's the one we use now cause after lv 40 we get the perks( idk if they fit in lore srry if I'm wrong)

[clever plank]

rly need Anna voice as a UI option

[mint citrus]

What if all three were meant to work with one another?

Normal agents have ISAC, Rogues have ANNA, and then there's the oversight with whatever Diamond is?

[surreal hearth]

ANNA dialogues are considered rare at the moment until we get anything else from the rest of the season this one gave us a whole lot to think of and theories it for future runs in the next season.

[surreal hearth]

I think it was Lauren Ortiz that offer this big exclusive network for McManus as a “insurance policy” if and when he’s ready to stab Natalya in the back

[sick lantern]

that was on the topic of mobile SHD servers

[surreal hearth]

The mobile SHD servers that Wally found was not placed there by accident

[sick lantern]

They’re expanding on and changing things that had already been answered for the sake of artificially increasing the important of new, never before seen, hinted at or necessary plot elements. Ortiz robotics are the newest element in the canon and so much importance has already been placed on them by way of artificially tying pre existing plot elements to them

“The SHD/Darpa made SHD tech. Actually it was Ortiz LOL
Darpa made the Black Tusk’s tech. Actually it was Ortiz LOL
Keener and Parnell made ANNA. Actually it was Ortiz LOL”

complete bollocks

[echo turret]

So lame tbh
I was already amazed knowing that the SHD and Black Tusk get their tech from DARPA but now instead it was Ortiz all along?
Seems kinda dumb that they’re going that route

[surreal hearth]

Indeed a sudden change

[signal thicket]

Did they ever say explicitely that ortiz made SHD tech?
The comms only ever mention ISAC and Diamond iirc
ANNA could still be a made by Keener and Parnell as well, making the third AI something else entirely (Maybe Hunter's equivalent instead?)
While ISAC is now shown to be made by Oritiz, SHD tech could still be made by DARPA to be used by ISAC following the aquisition

[heavy valley]

Ik we are on the black tusk rn but question. What do we call the faction that is in the sewers like I've heard people call them tunnel rats, cannibals, sewer rats, a unknown faction of the outcasts. I'm just curious cause I like their outfits an the way they are

[late void]

Underground is the official faction name I believe

[heavy valley]

Ahh ok thank you

[clever plank]

The third AI is the one behind everything

Ans ANNA and ISAC are two halves of it

fully sentient AI

[ashen jungle]

Oy, don't blow my cover.

[obtuse arrow]

From my understanding of the lore the third AI is the one being used by BTSU and while it is separate from the other two it is still limited in what it can do but the one who has access/control of all three holds the power. It will be interesting to see how it all plays out. If there is anything I missed let me know.

[oak saddle]

Something i just noticed in the White House...
There's BTSU logos on some of the bulwark shields lying around

When are we getting shield BTSU

[ashen jungle]

Are they shields or just barricades? There's similar looking things all over Tidal Basin.

[oak saddle]

yknow how we have Bulwark shields, the layered ones w the window panel? That one.
If those were in Tidal Basin then i've clearly not looked at them clearly

[surreal hearth]

Nats BTSU used bulky riot shields to divert and distract the JTFs while their other team goes in, steal the bioreactor, abduct several people of interest,and kill bardon.

If a whole raid squad gets wiped then a hunter is deployed to 0.1 second eliminated the threat with one hatchet throw

[hardy oar]

The third AI is called Diamond and you can find a diamond shape on BTSU "bricks"

[signal thicket]

Diamond is said in the comms, and ISAC is implied as well, but would it make sense for ANNA to be by Ortiz as well? for all we know theres a 4th ai in the field that isnt ANNA, ISAC, or Diamond

[sick lantern]

it’s basic writing
they mention only three systems, we know of only three AIs
it’ll be an ass pull if a fourth one comes up

ISAC for the SHD, Diamond for the Black Tusk, ANNA for the rogues, what else can there even be?

[late void]

It seems unlikely that they would intentionally build a system for rogues

Hunters might have their own one though for that juicy hacking ability

Anna could have existed for some other purpose and Parnell figured out how to access it, or he actually cobbled it together out of isac coding

[sick lantern]

obviously but i’m saying
what purpose would a fourth network even serve in the story, who would use it

and wouldn’t it be so convoluted when diamond has just been introduced and ANNA is just starting to vaguely pick up steam

[late void]

Mystery group we haven't found yet

[sick lantern]

the Underground

[late void]

Loot goblins, they've got a special version of the ai to help locate loot.

[hardy oar]

What if the 4th AI is a compilation of ISAC, ANNA and Diamond and you would have to have access to all three to activate the 4th AI?

Maybe the Hunter use it to track ALL of us? What if the last order for the Hunters is to kill Sokolova and therefore McManus would emerge as a hero and then became president?

[signal thicket]

I mean, it wouldnt be too farfetched that the Hunters have their own AI

4 groups (Div, Rogue, BT, Hunters) 4 AI (ISAC, ANNA, Diamond, 4th AI?)

[obtuse arrow]

I don't think there is a 4th AI I do think that any recruit who completed the hunter program gets access to a watch similar to the one McManus has that can access all 3 networks and this is how hunters are so effective against SHD and Rogues while keeping tabs on BTSU.

[oak saddle]

I feel like ANNA is more cobbled together by Theo cuz he stated she piggybacks off ISAC

A third AI by the devs probs doesnt need to

Given that Nat and Mcmanus dont really seem to trust each other its more fitting they'd be on different networks, but since they share the same backdoor they can spy on each other

[obtuse arrow]

From what I have heard so far I came to the conclusion that ANNA has been unused until Theo gained access to ANNA through an exploit in ISAC meaning he also potentially gained access to Diamond but couldn't use that network for anything apart from surveillance and intel since it is already in use by the BTSU. Keener would have most likely known anything Theo knew about since Theo would have shown Keener the exploit, It does partially explain what Theo was alluding to in The Tombs. All three AI networks were created by the Ortiz company but as far as we know McManus is the only person who is aware of the backdoor into the other AI networks giving him an advantage and being able to run the hunter program which I still think gives it's recruits access to all three networks and he would definitely want to keep that information from others although it still doesn't explain why Jack Bonney would have been selected by the recruiter it still seems to be a likely explanation. I think Keener uncovered some information we will find out about later and that is why he was trying to launch the Eclipse payload to make sure it didn't happen.

[surreal hearth]

Another hostage rescue and really?

Out of all the people the black tusk have captured and they picked the one that wants to know on how to work with gardening food and hydrogen stuff?

Makes me question if it was a rusher black tusk lady that wants to be taught on how to make their own fish taco Tuesday

[clever plank]

Maybe theyre trying to mess with their food supply

[surreal hearth]

No if they do that they be traced via division radar and we be guns blazing

It feels like Natalya is being gentle with our people

It’s almost feel like she’s playing the reverse psychology tactics

Something that was similar to keener when he went from psychopath rogue agent on vitaly to being nice to him instead

[fringe gale]

seems so

asides from our tech (which the black tusk seems to be matching) our biggest weapon is having the support of the people

once the Division loses support from the people they are meant to help, they're pretty much fucked

besides, most of DC has seen that the BT are terrible people, they're not gonna fall for it (and if they do, DC is finished)

[surreal hearth]

Her strategy was attempting to kill off our morale support

But she’s unaware that most of us are the silent type psychopathic agents

[clever plank]

i will say at the very least the threat escalation in the storytelling coincides with an escalation in technology

is theres anything beyong BT its going to be even more high tech

i was half joking about the AI thing but on the other hand i wouldnt be surprised if it goes more into that

there's an increasing emphasis on the use of AI and multiple AI fence posts set up already

plus the breadcrumbs about how the AI are related to each other

reoccuring theme of a mastermind behind a mastermind behind a mastermind behind a mastermind

a lot of "who answers to who" stuff too

the green poison was created as a form of population control, SHD was formed partly as a failsafe after virus control simulations showed they were needed decades earlier, maybe there's an AI directing the bigger picture and all the conflicts within it, and that the poison and activation were predicted as part of it

[sick lantern]

"decades" it was 2001 bro
and considering the timeline of technology in you know... the world i sincerely doubt there was some sort of Skynet MGS2 AI scheming behind the whole franchise

[clever plank]

Virologists irl were predicting a pandemic to happen for years, and SHDs creation was based entirely on predictions like that

the other half of SHDs creation was terrorism, and then a terrorist creates a pandemic lol

Idk if it was skynet per se, but maybe an AI under the control of someone thats predicting and plotting

[sick lantern]

The creation of the SHD was part of NSPD51 in 2007; the US's recognition of poor preparedness for a bioweapon outbreak was based off the findings of Operation Dark Winter in 2001 but other catastrophes were considered for the emergency powers of Directive 51 (Military coup, nuclear war, etc.)

[clever plank]

plus like the only factions that are proactive instead of reactive are pretty much black tusk and the hunters

The rogues being ones who were reactive and predictably tried to go proactive

And then whos got AI - SHD, BT, Hunters and the Rogues

Someones movin the pieces around

[sick lantern]

hmm yes indeed everyone is being pupeteered by a hitherto unknown AI known as Bradley, and the real man behind the curtain of it all was really Rick Valassi the whole time

[clever plank]

well what do you got then

im just going off the themes and how the story has grown so far

like how every time a new bad guy comes into the picture theyre even more high tech than the last guy and have their own AI that is mysteriously related to the others

It could be anything, cause the writer can do whatever they want, but theres dots there already

Control is like the core theme of the story idk

[obtuse arrow]

Yeah that's a solid theory sounds plausible

[ornate pulsar]

Weird thing I found while reading Eva's bio. Apparently Cleaners attacked a settlement in September? What September? The outbreak started in December, with TD2 being 7 months after that game (July/maybe early August). Does that mean we're past September in TD2 now?

It just doesn't line up to me

[clever plank]

it has been summer for 5 years straight

it cant be october theres no pumpkins and skeletons

[ornate pulsar]

there should be skeletons but that's a different story 😅

[median crag]

The slow decay process of bodies within the Division-verse is insane

[clever plank]

the new york bone pile

[obtuse arrow]

Must be the DC-62

[sick lantern]

well WoNY is a month after the base game and a bunch of shit has happened since then

Plus. Recruited is a year after the beginning of the outbreak (it says so like six pages in) and the events of Recruited have already happened so it’s been a few months

[oak saddle]

If its been a year, wheres our obligatory snow and winter apparel event lmao
But huh, that's kinda annoying. You kinda lose track of time passing in-universe since theres no concrete timeframes for anything

Speaking of that, do we know roughly how long each season lasts in-universe

[clever plank]

a full year thats why its always summer

Eternal September

hopefully division 3 is set during fall and theres halloween stuff everywhere that would rule

set it in the northwest or something that would be sick

[potent halo]

Why would there be Halloween stuff ?

It all went to hell in December and I doubt anyone had the time to setup for Halloween after

[tranquil yarrow]

hunters with glowing pumpkin heads. headless horseman and a spooky house to explore as like a mission

[clever plank]

need a scooby doo mask reveal

and a pet robodog w ISAC in it

[unborn shuttle]

Question to the devs will we be able to swap exotic talents around our gear at any point or will exotic talents rotate in decent

[sick lantern]

this is the lore channel and i don’t think the devs are in the business of answering random questions they probably won’t even see on discord

[unborn shuttle]

Sound that thought the devs was in here my bad

[ashen jungle]

They are, but they answer at their own discretion.
also yeah, this is the lore channel.

[hardy oar]

DC-62 provides instant mummification of the body because.....why not. If that's the truth - I want to know what the devs were smoking

Btw - do you think we'll see Kandel in the next update?

[hardy oar]

With flies and the immense stench coming from the pile. And the agents wearing masks all the time.

Air pollution - ✅
Water pollution - ✅
Soil contamination - ✅
Rats - ✅

[clever plank]

i mean if its a sequel

[sick lantern]

i think people have bigger priorities than taking down christmas decorations to replace them with halloween ones

[clever plank]

you dont think people will try to move on at all?

a fall game would be cool either way

[late void]

Only in the settlements

[clever plank]

yeah thatd be cool

people will try to expand as well, itd be nice to see that

[sick lantern]

they’re really gonna start scavenging attics and sheds for halloween decorations

[clever plank]

you think as the communities become more secure and grow in number as they reclaim more territory they will just want to live in endlesd christmas?

[late void]

Inverted Narnia - always Christmas, never winter.

[clever plank]

beyond that do you really want things to stay exactly the same for a third game

[sick lantern]

i assuredly don’t want to see cheesy pumpkins and props everywhere

also they’d have to add another 6+ months time skip onto the timeline for Halloween

[late void]

fallout has already done the 'halloween decorations everywhere' thing

[surreal hearth]

Who the hell smokes DC-62?!

[sick lantern]

unsurprisingly, the week 7 descent comm confirms Ortiz made ANNA

[signal thicket]

Was that just released?

[gusty peak]

Hadn't Theo Parnell made it?

[sick lantern]

that's the magic of retcons, you can make up whatever bullshit you want!

[fringe gale]

wait is ANNA made by Ortiz then made for the Rogues by Parnell mayhaps?

[ivory solar]

Although Ortiz Robotics is certainly a retcon, it may be more believable than it seems. Retrospectively, we were never 100% sure that Parnell made ANNA. Just him telling Keener that he did doesn’t make it official. Parnell could’ve lied and found Ortiz to help him out. Even documents can be faked.

Now I don’t know much about Ortiz or anything, I only have the comms from week 2 and this week. Everything I’ve heard is from this channel, and to me it seems like Ortiz isn’t as hard as a retcon everyone is making it seem to be

[gusty peak]

Si, It already seems that they want to alter the past, this will only lead to confusion for new players of the DLC Lol, if they follow the lore

[clever plank]

I wonder sometimes if theres any signifigance to the names isaac and anna

[sick lantern]

ISAC- Intelligent Systems Analytics Computer

ANNA, fuck knows

[clever plank]

Yeah but its also like, an actual name

[sick lantern]

Isaac is a name, ISAC is not, and ISAC is clearly supposed to match CALO, so again retconning by having ISAC be named after someone
if it turns their names are fucking... Isaac and Anna Ortiz then all credibility they had been slowly regaining is out the damn window

[clever plank]

I mean they couldve named them anything, so why isaac and anna

[sick lantern]

because ISAC is an intelligent computer that analyses systems, never needed a backstory for the name

and then Keener needed an edgy evil "sexy" female ISAC so they just came up with ANNA and never bothered to explain what it means

[clever plank]

right but why Isaac and why Anna

(Calo is a name too btw)

[sick lantern]

because they're functioning and easily pronounceable acronyms

[clever plank]

yeah but theres a lot of those

[sick lantern]

No shit.

[clever plank]

So why those ones

[sick lantern]

because they made them up

[clever plank]

Yeah thats true I guess, id just like to see fall, a change of scenery, maybe a west coast city, and to see survivors gradually start rebuilding

[clever plank]

but they didnt make up the names isaac and anna, so why those

[sick lantern]

you can say fuck but not idfk?

no clue what got deleted there then

[sick lantern]

whatever the point is no one knows, it probably doesn't matter, if it does matter it's stupid

like what is Diamond the name of their dog or some shit

[clever plank]

i mean the point was I wondered if there was any signifigance to the names

[ivory solar]

I doubt the devs put that much thought into the name behind ISAC when they were first writing div1

ANNA is more reasonable but still

[clever plank]

who knows, thats why i wonder if there is

[ivory solar]

As far as we know there is no significance behind the names, although that could change at any time. All we can do is theorize

[clever plank]

Yeah theres a lot of empty space around the AIs, like we dont even know what ANNA stands for

Yet theyre extremely significant to the story and all the major elements have one

[cold bramble]

I bought Ubisoft+ and it said it comes with expansion and lvl 30 I can’t even load into the game now

[obtuse arrow]

Artificial Neural Network Assistant

[clever plank]

automated network node algorithm

[gray seal]

los angeles and seattle could be some candidates with all the chaotic stuff going on there as well

[mint citrus]

According to the books, ANNA stands for Analytical Neural Network Assistant

[sick lantern]

which book?

[mint citrus]

Compromised

[sick lantern]

I don’t remember that in the book

And I know my memory fails me from time to time but I’m pretty sure I’d remember such a relatively big revelation as finally learning what ANNA stands for

[clever plank]

those would both be really interesting. I think Seattle would be especially cool. Division 1 was winter and snow, Division 2 was summer and sun, 3 could be fall and rain

[cursive tapir]

Why would that be a deal breaker?

[cursive tapir]

This was my biggest issue with the season 4 manhunt, so I’d be glad if they explained it. If we turn on President Ellis, doesn’t that make us rogue agents? The fact that Ellis’s allies were flagged as rogue implies that ISAC has some sort of moral compass that supersedes the whole “answers only to the president” rule

[clever plank]

lol thats part of why I wondered about the AI names

[ashen jungle]

Again, why would Ellis still be counted as the POTUS at this stage? He was assumed dead which means that he would've had his office + title taken from him.

And the whole "SHD Agents only answer to the President" thing sounds like a marketing line, we'd actually answer to the head of the program and the committee that oversees it. And the POTUS too I suppose, but only if he was still formally the POTUS.

[clever plank]

The name Isaac comes from the religious figure, who is viewed as a guide for people who would rather die than compromise their moral code

[ashen jungle]

I really hope that wasn't the intention, because that's the most heavy handed symbolism I've read in quite some time.

[clever plank]

lol

[ashen jungle]

That's honestly not leagues away from "save martha".

[clever plank]

Well like the rogues whole thing was breaking their oath and deciding to only answer to themselves

And they constantly antagonize you for being a drone or encourage you to become a rogue

[ashen jungle]

Wait, is David S. Goyer writing Div lore now? That would explain the throwing in of Sokolova into the mix as gracefully as a spoon in a blender.

[ashen jungle]

My dream of a Division: Rogue spinoff remains unfilfilled.

[clever plank]

like the games themes of who answers to who, who controls what, who is in control are all still there

its just also like, isaac is an extremely religious name lol its not far off from being named jesus

[ashen jungle]

Not religious, wouldn't know.
Although I do want to point out that it's ISAC, not Isaac, and it does stand for something.
And I've never once assumed they were a moral compass of any sorts, they're barely sentient as far as video-game AI's normally go.

Even the famous "way out of the vault" line sounds more like Alexa than HAL.

[clever plank]

Yeah I know, but its still said and Isaac and its only used by SHD and thats like their whole thing

hyenas answer to whoever is strongest between, true sons answer to who is commanding them, black tusk answer to who finances them, so who does SHD answer to and why do they do it. The other factions are contrasts and the question gets ask a lot in the game

Like really the rogues shoudnt have lost, but the did and the reason why is the difference between them and a non rogue agent

[ashen jungle]

There is another answer and it unfortunately makes more sense than anything else: we have plot armour.

It's a good idea to avoid getting too specific with the lore in these games, because they're patchworked together after the fact and not properly planned out.

e.g. shoehorning Sokolova in afterwards and negating some old comms, bringing Hornet back makes pretty much any death redundant because someone can just sneak in later and rez them.

[clever plank]

Yeah im mostlynjust focusing on the narrative themes and how things are set up

Like Outcasts are like religious extremists without fully going into religious territory, and theyre ready to die for their cause, but they have no morals and thats what SHD is contrasted against there

Like SHDs motto is "extreme evil, extreme remedy"

[ashen jungle]

It should be noted that the motto basically translates as that, yes, but what it really means is "desperate times call for desperate measures". Nothing religious there.

It's about governmental overreaching if anything. I don't see religious themes being a factor here, frankly.

[cursive tapir]

I’m guessing you won’t be thrilled to learn that Aaron was the harbinger of several biblical plagues, then

[cursive tapir]

Yeah, my headcanon is that the general story of the missions is canon, but the number of enemies is not, and that the “player character” is a group of 3-4 agents rather than just one

[ashen jungle]

I take solace in that ISAC's VA has the surname Keener, so any symbolism here is entirely coincidental and funny.

[lunar inlet]

Anybody knows if the division movie got canceled?

[unreal widget]

Nope. https://twitter.com/RawsonThurber/status/1681743834164912128

Rawson Thurber (@RawsonThurber)

@TCTDMovie @Ubisoft @UbiMassive @netflix I know, I know. Believe me I KNOW. We were so close to sharing something incredibly cool and then the strike happened. Hang in there guys and enjoy Y5S1 in the meantime, I'll be grinding tonight!

Twitter · Jul 19, 2023, 7:12 PM

[lunar inlet]

Ohh god.. just that is good news for me

[cursive tapir]

high hopes!

[lunar inlet]

Right!!?

[fringe gale]

oooooo WEEEEEEEEEEEE

[surreal hearth]

I’m kinda worried about nat and nuclear weapons

Been playing on fallout3 and I’m worried that Natalya would use nuclear weapons to turn DC into a “capital wasteland”

Before you ask yes these are different apocalyptic universes but after playing fallout3 imagine what would happen if nat launched this so called “button”

[ivory solar]

Controlling DC will provide a huge bonus to whoever does. The symbolic status it has is important. It was the center of the original government and houses things such as the Declaration of Independence. I doubt that anyone would try to use any weapons that could have long-term effects in DC, especially since it seems like the Black Tusk have realized that gaining support of the people is important this season

I mean DC-62 was already used as a weapon in DC so who knows

[surreal hearth]

Destroy or control is up to whatever military regime or division forces have to force that fate and McManus is in the center of it

I feel like McManus don’t like Natalya at all I mean she’s using the hunters but only a once per singular black tusk squad

After that it’s a mystery

[ivory solar]

Really the options are
A: sympathize with population
B: control population through fear
But the Black Tusk is certainly the only thing to be worried about, they nor the SHD may not even be on top at the end of all this

[surreal hearth]

The SHD in the agency (most of us are psycho peons cuss we don’t talk) are like the rogues and the hunters

The major difference is basically is the constant network infrastructures

Basically it’s an all out mode warfare

Nat thinks she has power like crazy but believe me that power she has is bound to slip from her cold fingers one way or the other

The black tusk are nothing more than a mere hunter/McManus strike force under the command of some Russian immigrant

[sick lantern]

it’s semi-plausible but i doubt even the black tusk have the resources to secure nukes

[surreal hearth]

I was kinda thinking what sort of hidden power does she have

[fringe gale]

i dont see the populace connecting with the BT at all

[ivory solar]

Everyone had a large amount of distrust when the SHD was activated. Sleeper agents in their own country planted by their own government? That’s outrageous! JTF, civilians, and of course enemy factions did not like the Division. But hey, it’s not like they’re executing civilians out on the streets. But they also have this internal problem of these “rogue agents” or whatever

Also gotta add that the populace didn’t trust the government before the Division was activated. They thought the government had a cure for the virus and was holding it back from the public

Literal riots in the streets. I shouldn’t have to explain it that much, but if people can trust the Division then they can trust the Black Tusk

[sick lantern]

but if you can not trust the government you can also not trust the Black Tusk

[ivory solar]

In the beginning. Civilians and JTF personnel eventually warmed up to the Division, because they proved they wanted to protect everyone. If the Black Tusk can do that as well and help everyone survive the winter, that shows they have gained support

[mint citrus]

We only know what's going on in NY and DC so far. Maybe Black Tusk has more support inland?

[sick lantern]

they’re counting on the populace forgetting the systemic counterinsurgency (read: murder of innocents) and regime change (funding instability and being hostile to settlements) which is unlikely

[ivory solar]

As I said, A or B. Or maybe a mix of both. But knowing Sokolova she will try her hardest to get whatever it is she wants

No matter her end goal or her methods, she will try

[surreal hearth]

I just found out about tital basin

Turns out that’s actually a place where the statue of George Washington is at

[fringe gale]

pretty much my thing abt it

[gaunt ice]

I dont think the division has ever executed civilians in broad daylight

The LMB did help people who sided with them when they were still a thing

Did that make them less evil?nope

[fringe gale]

The BT will never have good PR bc damn near all of DC knows that they supplied the Hyenas and were up to some heinous shi

[gaunt ice]

The supplying the hyena part was not common knowledge iirc but yea

They really should have gotten a PR department

[mint citrus]

They're... trying now, I guess? But it all seems too little too late.

[surreal hearth]

I’m starting to feel like nat is creating a new wave of puppets in order to manipulate the people who are supporting the division

[ivory solar]

Yeah my point is they didn’t but the Black Tusk did, but the Division also has rogue agents

[ashen jungle]

Technically speaking, Rogue Agents aren't part of SHD's Division program, hence the name "rogue".

[sick lantern]

Yea. Black Tusk are evil by doctrine, rogue agents are evil by going against what the SHD stands for. Even if rogue agents make you think the SHD are bad any citizen with basic critical thinking/a grasp on reality can see the Black Tusk are the greater of two evils

[ivory solar]

Thing is any agent could go rogue at any point. If ISAC doesn’t like them then suddenly they’re rogue, regardless of what they actually did

You just don’t know when it will happen

[ashen jungle]

ISAC is not sentient, it's running off a programmed set of commands given to it.
This is not like GLADOS.

[sick lantern]

and then they immediately start MURDERING PUPPIES.

[ivory solar]

Now it may not be as big of a problem now (but that’s mainly because we don’t have as much information of people going rogue) but it was an issue around the time of div1

[ashen jungle]

I've not gone too deep in the EU of div, but has there ever been a Rogue Agent who isn't in to kicking puppies and stealing candy from babies?

Because AFAIK, every Rogue Agent ingame is either outright evil, or poorly trying to justify being outright evil.

[ivory solar]

Well many of the first wave agents went dark and some were presumably rogue

[ashen jungle]

Asking about actual facts here, not assumptions.
I assume there's none since shades of grey aren't really in the lore here.

If I'm right, then that also explains how people like the leader of the Theatre settlement weren't marked as Rogue afaik.

[sick lantern]

now that’s another plot hole

[sick lantern]

in one of the comics there’s a rogue agent who’s slightly less bad? idk it’s the one I know least about. he’s working with the black tusk but there’s something unique about his rogue-ness

[ashen jungle]

The example most people use is Theo Parnell, but let's face it, dude was up for multiple life sentences for how evil he was.

[ivory solar]

“If we stay, we’re dead, if we leave, we’re rogue” now Kajika was probably exaggerating but how does just leaving the Dark Zone mark someone as rogue?

[sick lantern]

because “ISAC bad” leaving would’ve constituted abandoning the mission (even though the JTF gave the legitimate order to pull out)

[ashen jungle]

Assuming they haven't been made non-canon by now, Keener's NYC audio logs mention his watch flashing and not a consistent colour, meaning that you aren't instantly marked as Rogue if you go off mission, there's at the very least a timer, if not multiple teirs of it.

[sick lantern]

simultaneously, Odessa Sawyer isn’t marked rogue even though she explicitly has abandoned the mission
but they were trying to show that ISAC doesn’t understand context, even though it definitely does (in reference to not following Ellis and ‘technically being a rogue agency’, Kelso says “ISAC is the only one who thinks we’re still on mission” showing that it isn’t utterly binary and understands context)

[ashen jungle]

I read that quote more as "the mission isn't explicitly what the POTUS tells us to do, it's what the mission is, regardless of who is in charge".

Which neatly explains pretty much everything, assuming that's right.

[ivory solar]

Well ISAC should’ve been able to detect that she was injured and literally couldn’t continue being on the frontlines, whereas the first wave agents were still able bodied

So they could’ve continued the mission

And since they didn’t they became rogue

[sick lantern]

but then surely ISAC can also know “the legitimate authority has given the order to pull out and this fight is suicidal”

[ivory solar]

That doesn’t really apply to the point I was making. ISAC being able to detect your vital signs is different to being able to recognize command structure

It’s two different components of ISAC

[gray seal]

it’d likely be stopped before launch like keener failed to do so when keener tried to launch an eclipse rocket at NY. It’s always stopped by the agents, 90% probability it won’t.

[ivory solar]

Besides, the JTF should not have command over the SHD considering well everything. JTF is just full of cops whereas SHD was specifically trained for situations such as Green Poison. SHD was made by the president and is a federal agency where the JTF was just quickly formed after the outbreak

[sick lantern]

That’s not how the SHD’s authority works at all. The SHD is intended to cooperate highly efficiently with such organisations. They have to authority to interject at any level of command bar seizing control of the organisation. So when it comes to cooperating operations with the JTF and following their productive orders, the SHD are doing exactly what they’re intended to do

[ivory solar]

Now ISAC can know that the JTF is a “legitimate authority” but it does not mean they are on the same mission. The whole point of agents is for them to be autonomous

[sick lantern]

if they’re autonomous, they should have the agency to withdraw from a tactically disadvantageous situation

why would you allow your autonomous, worst case scenario agents to be governed by an AI that is detached from reality? you wouldn’t because that defeats the “autonomous” portion

people like Rhodes complain that the SHD have too little restrictions, but in actuality they have too many?

[ivory solar]

ISAC functions more as an assistant guiding agents to an end goal that ISAC provided

[sick lantern]

exactly, not a moral compass

agents are intended to tackle situations as they see fit

and withdrawing from a FUBAR situation is a legitimate choice

[ivory solar]

Then why would they be marked as rogue? Did every first wave agent just decide to quit their job?

[ashen jungle]

Most died.

[ivory solar]

Others went MIA and the rest went rogue, yes we all know this

[sick lantern]

uh actually kinda yes
Keener said “the JTF are trying to save a Manhattan that doesn’t exist anymore, it’s about power now”, they very explicitly went out of their way to start doing bad shit. it wasn’t arbitrarily decided by ISAC to mark them rogue in the dark zone because of a technicality

[ivory solar]

Well that’s only one example out of a bunch of guys we know that decided to hate on the JTF, and we only know guys that hate the JTF. You still could’ve been an agent even if you don’t like the JTF as long as you don’t start killing them

[heavy valley]

no rouge agents in the new manhunt mission weird

[late void]

yeah that surprised me too

[languid wing]

I wonder if nat asked those rogues to cause trouble for us

They were fighting alongside the true sons in the first 2 manhunt missions

[floral gull]

Natalya is scared of us regardless

She knows with all the resources and manpower that they have would only slow us down

Such as with the last season’s manhunt where we needed to be distracted enough for them to assault the white house

If the division agents were at the White House at the time of the assault, her plans would have failed miserably

[fringe gale]

we solo the black tusk if it wasnt for my damn stacks disappearing

[languid wing]

yea but the hunter would that she sent would be the only real obstacle

the other BT would fall fast

[heavy valley]

Well the first manhunt mission was black tusk,than true sun's, an now black tusks again

[static crypt]

lore-wise i wonder where she's at rn? highly doubt it would be at Tidal Basin, since we've already ran through there twice

[frail coyote]

doing the Lauren Fong portion of the man hunt right now

"Agent they are taking them to the adea office, go rescue Lauren and Vik"

Me outloud: I mean Lauren sure, but can't I just put a bullet through Vik and call it a day?

[languid wing]

probs somewhere safe or on a hovrcraft

[surreal hearth]

Last time we saw her face was among her hovercrafts

[languid wing]

Nat is the type to hide behind her men

Doesn't get her hands dirty gets her men to do the work

[gray seal]

Rogue agents were getting boring, so they decided to switch it up for this title update.

[gray seal]

which means she’s an easy target

[mint citrus]

Until she isn't

[surreal hearth]

We know where Mari is gonna take place

Looks like she might be hold up on the manning National zoo

That’s it was a massive gold mine for food which explains why the SHD keeps it away from black tusk

[gray seal]

usual twist

her men are going to do it for her probably

[languid wing]

Why get her hands dirty when she has thousands of men to do it for

Though a true leader would be on the Frontlines with thier men

[ashen jungle]

PSA: Lord of the Rings isn't a documentary. Queens don't go to the frontlines in armour.

[surreal hearth]

The national zoo is a pain in the ass of a place to retake due to how ridiculously open that area is

We constantly get involved there to stop black tusk from recruiting anymore members unfortunately Natalya’s black tusk now have that place with hidden nat units on standby to move in and plant Mari for us to be baited

To make matters worst the zoo is an open area for the hunter to ambush us just like in the Coney Island hunter

[obtuse arrow]

What if the hunter sets all the zoo animals on us and if we get past those then the area is flooded and we get eaten by sharks because Mari was forced to make a shark farm for BTSU

[nocturne arrow]

Sharks do not bite people as much, but what you would have to worry about, would be frisky dolphins, octupi, and maybe a electric eel.

But the crocodiles and maybe a hippo or two would be even greater concern.

[sleek plover]

Leader in frontlines->Leader KIA->entire command structure collapses->lol

Staying alive is one of the more important aspects of commanderhood

[languid wing]

What I mean is they can be on the Frontlines just a ways back at a command post

Be in the field

[nocturne arrow]

Technically, those BT Hovercraft are their FOBs, and if she's there, then she's on the field.

[gaunt ice]

yea lets bait the godlike agent into an ambush,that will totally work!

[languid wing]

Only reason we are like that is cause of plot armor

Without plot armor we be dead

[gaunt ice]

idk they should learn something from 3 failed ambush attempts

[languid wing]

Nats plot armor is running out

Pretty soon we might get to kill her

Kelso should of died when we went after the outcast strategiest when she went quiet but nope plot armor

[gaunt ice]

striker with glass cannon disagrees

[sleek plover]

Damn, I really hate LMB.

Seriously.

I'm a lore nerd, and I am hired by my personal friend to help building the universe for his trpg project, and he described me how one of the evil factions deliberately uses fear and civilian killings to crush all resistance and instill fear.

It only reminded me of how LMB was in-universe.
Keeping law and order be damned, it is much better to have humans devolve into abject bestial barbarism and savagery or become extinct entirely rather than have the likes of LMB, Black Tusks or True Sons reign over them.

[sick lantern]

Oh no, grandad's off his meds again.

[ashen jungle]

That's just LMB'. They're pretty much harmless unless you call them 'LMB like this.

[clever plank]

idk i think all the scenarios are pretty unrealistic and are based more off weird social fears

that part in the intro all "do you have a gun? Do your neighbors have a gun?" bizarre cultural paranoias

you cant make the world a better place if youre afraid of it

[surreal hearth]

Let’s not forget the corporate and Wall Street hired them in the first place they are guilty as the LMBs were

Too bad black tusk couldn’t even handle some cleaners after dolores Jones spread half of her entire units to deal the divisions and the cleaners

[ashen jungle]

When you hire a private security firm/PMC called "last man batallion", you can't be surprised when they go too far.

[surreal hearth]

Some speculation suggest that after the LMB founder was killed by second wave division agents a lot of them left to join either the true sons or the black tusk

[sick lantern]

not really speculation when it's a fact

[clever plank]

mercenaries doing mercenary things

[queen quarry]

yeah the black tusk rushers and support station guys are former LMBs

[surreal hearth]

I noticed given how many ex-former LMBs the black tusk have accumulated over the years

I can guess they exploited a lot of former LMBs to switch size after NYC was contained during the winter

But it was done in complete secrecy most likely by Natalya’s top boards

The hidden hire ups funding the black tusk are basically looking at this as some constant 4D chess move to bolster investors who are not named and probably hibernate in some super wealthy bunkers like it was vault tech.

[nocturne arrow]

With the BT, former LMB had a far better chance at survival as compared to LMB troopers who, wait for it, joined up with the JTF/Peacekeepers in NYC. Those guys died holding the line against Rikers.

[fringe gale]

least it was some former LMB guys that joined up with the JTF. i may have said this before but the fact that nobody asides from Bardon has defected from the BT kills me

[urban musk]

they better have the JTF actually do stuff in Brooklyn, instead of being a background faction. I hate seeing the JTF stand around and do nothing, when they should be at least manning checkpoints.

[ashen jungle]

You mean the Peacekeepers right?

[signal thicket]

I wanted to see more of the reformed LMB like was shown in the trailer

[languid wing]

I say just put every Faction in NY and have a massive Battle

Just for fun

[urban musk]

No, active duty Joint Task Force. Like in the division 1

[gaunt ice]

he doesn’t know

[ashen jungle]

Well just to make it clear: the JTF don't really exist in NYC anymore. If you need a refresher, just do a run-through of WONY again.

the incredibly short story is that they pretty much disbanded and the ones that didn't join enemy factions, went and helped form the Peacekeepers.

[gaunt ice]

Disband is an interesting summary for BoO completely demolished

Because JTF somehow is still incompetent

[ashen jungle]

Well they existed in more places than just the Post Office, but as a shortened version it covers it enough.

also, Peacekeepers are pretty much the same faction, but a slightly more hardcore version, one more formed out of an apocalypse, rather than just having random city workers carry ar15's.

[nocturne arrow]

Mind, as for why no one defects from BT, well, Shaeffer got lucky, Stovepipe, didn't. And I think that Stovepipe was the usual.

[gaunt ice]

Its more likely that BT is still way better off than JTF

well their living conditions seem to be like that

White house is like 1 repaint away from looking like a concentration camp

[ashen jungle]

BT have actual monetary funding and probably healthcare plans, JTF barely have a working porta-loo.

I like to remind everyone that our Agent doesn't even have a place to sleep, despite how much of the city we've saved.
My headcanon is our Agents just stay in a random bedroom around the city come nightfall.

[gaunt ice]

They can casually reinvade DC every week,have the manpower to take over any major stronghold in DC or the US,they have literal hovercraftS at their disposal

Like plot armor is the only reason they cant just take over the white house in like 2 hours top

We turned away for literally hours and they took everything of value from the white house,nearly crippling it

[fringe gale]

i wonder what stovepipe would have told us if he lived

[fringe gale]

its quite literally that Community meme

[ashen jungle]

"i'd really like some plot armour"

[fringe gale]

[sick lantern]

it’s the anti-plot armour
they have plot fragility

“yea um despite all your hard work and success in the first game uhh… some off screen stuff happened to a place you’ve never heard of and they all quit. sorry”

[gaunt ice]

I will always remember that one div1 mission where they send like 50 people in APCs to attack a water plant and they all get domed by rikers

[sick lantern]

I think you’re getting Stolen Signal and Falcon Lost confused

and I think the premise with all the Incursions plot wise was a sense of spontaneity and unpreparedness as opposed to coordinated JTF efforts in the basic missions

[gaunt ice]

Warrengate power plant

Yea i was thinking of that

They had like APCs parked outside

[sick lantern]

there’s more than a few Riker corpses around, you can see they actually put up a good fight

[gaunt ice]

Fair nuff

[nocturne arrow]

I remember Warrensgate for one particular thing. They killed a man by swinging a barbwire covered baseball bat into his nuts and left him to rot out there.

Falcon Lost, however, I still scratch my fucking head as to how the fuck the LMB managed to get a damn APC into the sewers.

[tepid crescent]

Ask Capt Perez about this one

[nocturne arrow]

Slipped my mind while delivering his packages of misplaced C4. Shame, really.

[sick lantern]

Falcon is such a mess

[gaunt ice]

Lets say somehow the LMB assembled the APC in that tunnel

How are they going to bring it outside

[clever plank]

I think the agent never sleeps

Theyre just on "go pills" 24/7

[clever plank]

Isnt Ellis one of them

[surreal hearth]

Ellis was just a puppet after the first president became sick from the green poison while the second one got murdered by two of his own secret service agents the speaker of the house Ellis became third in line

Actually now that Ellis was mentioned the ISAC node knew something was really off and kelso was blindsided about it

[clever plank]

I thought he was a black tusk investor

[surreal hearth]

Only lau knew and did the job for us

[clever plank]

He also owns one of the brands too doesnt he

[surreal hearth]

No he was just a political speaker of the house representative

Let’s just say “someone rigged the election”

[clever plank]

oh i got it mixed up, but there is an implication

there's that poster you see in one mission where he's the chair on a committe about using the private sector in warfare

and one of the speakers is the co-owner of douglas & harding

the other speaker is Charles Bliss lol

and douglas & harding's logo on it says 'mech. robotics company'

https://i.imgur.com/yb9uJtq.jpg when theres definitely nothing shady going on

[sick lantern]

that well known influential organisation in Div lore… Mech. Robotics Co

[clever plank]

sending Ellis the self help book "so you've just empowered a mercenary company that is now running the place"

who couldve seen this happen? 8 thousand historical examples

[surreal hearth]

The black tusk was a massive backup faction intended to wipe us out

But was secretly Intended as a “doomsday conspiracy agenda” cuss McManus failed to trust the division entirely and have a third contingency to replace us all as hunters

He’s pretty much a public enemy number one to the division due to traitorous reasons

Nat however is just a tool to McManus agenda

[sick lantern]

You don't say?

[surreal hearth]

I’m saying it’s possible since he no longer trust the division anymore thanks to keener

[sick lantern]

I don't think he liked and/or wanted the SHD alive regardless of Keener

[surreal hearth]

McManus was a massive coward

[sick lantern]

that's kind of what being a traitorous conspirator who helped orchestrate the outbreak and worked with the prime faction to seize power would imply

[surreal hearth]

He refused to let us deal with the keener problem than his previous hunter army

Killing keener only attracted unwanted attention like what lau did

[sick lantern]

...what?

[ashen jungle]

Helped orchestrate the outbreak?

[surreal hearth]

ISAC was programmed to help unarmed civilians and Ellis was marked as unarmed

Unfortunately the people behind ISAC slipped the protocol to help presidency and prefer a more “save what remains” protocol

[sick lantern]

well
someone in the government did (the NSA stuff from Survival Guide/Broken Dawn/ the NSA classified assignment) and someone in the government funnelled DARPA tech to the BT so unless they want to introduce a third corrupt government member I assign it to him

[surreal hearth]

ISAC was never implemented to help presidency

[ashen jungle]

Of course the origin of Green Poison is now convoluted, of course it is.
It was fine already, jeez.

[surreal hearth]

ISAC was only programmed to “saved what remain”

ISAC is not a fully node AI

ISAC Is a freaking warmind

Warmind is basically a lethal protocol to “stop lethal doomsday” that’s happening around us

If I know about warmind it’s was designed to protect what remains!

[ashen jungle]

Eyes up, Agent.

[surreal hearth]

Don’t believe me? The. Explain why ISAC chose to go rogue against Ellis

[sick lantern]

cus he was a traitor

[surreal hearth]

It’s an algorithm AI with a technical to go warmind at all of us

ANNA however is seeing us as a rogue entity so any SHD tech that the rogue or black tusk had we are a target to ANNA

[ashen jungle]

Ellis would've been presumed dead after the original crash of Air Force One, so continuity of government kicked in and he was no longer the POTUS.
And you don't just get it back automatically if found alive, there's stuff to sign, etc.

or it was Black Tusk being a boogeyman, whichever is more convoluted, apparently.

[surreal hearth]

then that means ISAC flagged Ellis as a traitor the moment black tusk arrived

ISAC never lied he’s a freaking warmind

[ashen jungle]

Civillian, or "former POTUS", I guess. Not a "traitor".
Warmind's don't exist. Stop writing fan fiction.

[surreal hearth]

I stand by for that cuss why the hell ANNA has automatic machines coming after us then?

What is ANNA is trying to achieve what ISAC cannot?

They are no longer nodes in my opinion

ISAC and ANNA are pure warmind ready to attack us all

While ISAC trust us to do the right thing the ANNA protocol will keep sending rogue agents against us

[sick lantern]

I don't see the problem with ISAC and Ellis. The SHD is prepared to activate in a multitude of scenarios where the president would be dead/likely dead, traitorous or otherwise indisposed

for all of Div 1 and 2 before Ellis showed up, the status of the presidency barely mattered

I remember people here getting way too hung up on the presidential oversight and the "technically a rogue agency" because of Ellis, when it genuinely does not matter

[ashen jungle]

It's the disconnect that certain people have a problem with, and while I don't share the concern, I can't really blame them.
The lore for div bounces between attempts at realism and cartoony coincidences+conspiracies.

[surreal hearth]

We the SHD kill any hostile no matter what which makes us psychotic peons

[sick lantern]

1. That’s not true, it’s just that conflict de-escalation doesn’t make for good cover-based third person RPG looter shooter gameplay. If that’s what you want go play Fallout
2. That’s kind of what you’re expected to do in a conflict? If your enemies were reasonable then they wouldn’t be trying to kill you

[gaunt ice]

Eh i like to think that he’s a total smoothbrain

We’re doing really fine and just because there’s a few rotten apple in the basket doesn’t make it a complete failure

How are his Hunters holding up rn,exactly,i have 16 masks that says he fucked up big times

[gaunt ice]

And killing fodders isn’t a flex in any capacity because anytime they partake in any major operation they get domed

[tepid ibex]

That ol' animated WONY trailer? Ikr, like LMB wearing JTF colors. Ig Dragov took those fellas out at Wall Street tho

[steady shore]

there musta been more

for exe look at how many white tusk there are

and also that lmb jtf outfit is the swat outfit ingame

[sleek plover]

Surprised to see you are still around.

[tepid ibex]

Yea, had Discord uninstalled for a little while and been slowly been losing my itch for the lore + not playing Division as much but I figured I'd check out the server rq.

[surreal hearth]

Been coming back to division1

[tepid ibex]

Still cant believe they never made a Central Park expansion 😔

[ashen jungle]

Well we're getting a Brooklyn one some time in the future, about 3 Seasons from now.
Long time no see, I'm not good with names but you seem familiar.

[steady shore]

was planned

[tepid ibex]

In TD2 I suppose? Since an expansion this late in TD1 seems unrealistic. And I was Charles Bliss most of the time, rival of Destroyer of LMB lol.

[tepid ibex]

Ik, shame they didnt go thru with it

[ashen jungle]

Div1 is getting no further content outside of pre-scheduled Global Events that are on an auto-timer.
All future stuff is for div2.

[tepid ibex]

Mmm, well then I guess I'll forward to a hot, moist, steamy, and decrepit Brooklyn

[ashen jungle]

Time has passed, maybe we'll swap back to eternal winter.
bonus points if in the first cutscene, our Agent gets sunglasses stuck to their face that we can't remove for a year and a half.

[clever plank]

they should do fall next tbh

leafs

[gray seal]

yep

rain. crops. leaves

[marble dawn]

Isnt heartland in fall

[sick lantern]

Heartland is set before Div 2

[marble dawn]

Damn, where did they say that?

[sick lantern]

Sorry, I appear to have misremembered :p it’s set after WoNY

[surreal hearth]

This is a 50% theory chance regarding to Mari in the last rescue but what if Natalya thinks that’s Mari is too valuable and gives us Anderson in a bodybag instead

After what she did to stovepipe

I mean let’s be real

One hunter vs 4 agents that can stun lock a hunter in their track would be too easy to deal with

[obtuse arrow]

I think they will save that for a later season

[surreal hearth]

It’s far fetched but we don’t know that for sure once we go back to the zoo again

[signal thicket]

If there were ever to be a timeskip, it would be most likely around the dlc drop in season 4, although I doubt they would do that, since it would require remaking both NYC and DC from the ground up lol

Also it would be weird replaying missions lol

[gaunt ice]

i mean what are you going to do while you're not fighting insane fanatics

personallly ill just live in any mall

[winged badge]

https://youtu.be/aSg_H0opBm8

This is really good

[sleek plover]

Make my own group of insnae fanatics but with opposing beliefs?

[gaunt ice]

i mean as long as you're not executing people in the streets of NYC you should be good

[surreal hearth]

Been going back to NGN recently and is now speculating further of the three nodes that McManus has in his possession

And tbh the NSA made far more technology to push agents to their limits before these factions were born in the outbreak

McManus intention is to create a wide multi nationalist network that gives him the power to relay, command, and sent data messages to the three nodes

I wonder if McManus was responsible for crossing off Ellis from the SHD database as he was no longer a “high priority” ?

Most importantly why kelso didn’t react??

[gaunt ice]

i think the network is autonomous but its a machine at the end of the day

it doesn't have independent thought

so when isac did cross Ellis off it never told us because we never asked it

like in bank HQ it never referred to Ellis as president despite everything assuming it

[surreal hearth]

Holy shit

Been listening to the conversation the R&D eggheads the one responsible for the three AI nodes were this close to getting rid of ISAC and replaced him with ANNA

Alexander Ortiz disagree to that statement as he was secretly doing this to help a handful of “government entities” some kind of moral thing

Claire thinks that ISAC is dumb, obsolete and “not smart” and should have been replaced with ANNA

Girl do not underestimate ISAC

I’m second guessing that Alex didn’t want a more “human AI” in his opinion and prefer a more “likely AI”

ANNA unfortunately is a bit “killer instinct mode”

Which probably explain why Parnell managed to find her

Keener sees ANNA as a more “essential tool” for the rogues to use

[ashen jungle]

That's what Parnell says, but he was really trying to find someone else to join his D&D group.

[surreal hearth]

This is a lot to unpack and hearing ANNAs voice again is an instant notice for all of us

The crazy part is that the Ortiz voiced these AIs to themselves

Alex as ISAC and Claire as ANNA

[ashen jungle]

Voiced these AI's to themselves?

[surreal hearth]

Yeah

According to their audio logs that is

Decent contains a massive gold mine of information that’s keeping from us and the nemesis has it

[ashen jungle]

So Ortiz's VA is Brandon Keener?

[surreal hearth]

Eh no quite

Plus according to NGN there are total of 14 dialogues to be found

He’s more likely to spent more time on trying to get it all

It was supposed to be 12 but the update added 2 new ones

[sick lantern]

ANNA cAN pAsS tHE TuRinG tEsT

[gaunt ice]

honestly wony doesnt look that bad compared to rn with the whole AI thing

Keener and Parnell are proooobably smart enough to make ANNA on their own

but noooo government contractors

that went to darpa that went to Keener/SHD

next you'll tell me a kid made Diamond

[surreal hearth]

The crazy part is that the NSA was this close to stop Gordon Amherst from starting an end of the world virus apocalypse but McManus shut them down entirely telling them to stop monitoring and focus on the AI new gen agency infrastructures instead

I guess that explained why the black tusk targeted an NSA outpost to further conceal any secret to be fallen under division hand

[tranquil yarrow]

what ive realized is that hunters and the division agent can deal around the same damage (challenging. 150k - 500k)
but hunters just have a huge HUGE health / armor pool. around 50 million, my guess

[frail coyote]

what I think would be interesting, since we know Hunters are likely Rogues on McManus's dime, would like to see who Deciet was, because I think that will end up having story relavence

[sick lantern]

Hunters aren’t just more rogues

[gaunt ice]

Hunters kill rogues too i think

Also i think that Ronald McDonald said that Hunters are meant to be a counter for Agents when they go rogue

[frail coyote]

I mean they were going to recruit Bonney who is arguably rogue since he is working for black tusk and not the SHD

[sick lantern]

Bonney wasn't even an agent 💀

he was part of the BTSU bruh

[obtuse arrow]

Yeah that's an interesting point since he had a classified rank and was technically rogue hopefully we find out what that rank is soon because I think all hunters would have that also

[frail coyote]

although with the new info we have from the decent comms, he might not have been an Agent at all since BTSU has access to the same tech

[sick lantern]

@winged badge it's debatable if their existence is even canon but they're the super elite special forces of the Black Tusk

man what a weird way to phrase a gameplay question I thought it was another person missing the lore channel's existence

[gaunt ice]

we still dont know what is the "classified" status that Bonney has,or if he's ever an Agent

like it was never implied that Bonney is an Agent up until that point let alone have ties to SHD but idfk

[nocturne arrow]

Too young, psych doesn't check out, no existing conditions to let him slip in like Connelly, and due to his ties to BT, or even active US military or Spec Ops, he wouldn't be selected for SHD duty.

Nah, more like McManus gave him a watch for his test for the Hunter program.

Classified probably meant the backdoor McManus had into the SHD program, kept separate from actual Agents or their administrators. You can be damn well sure those Hunters are also under the Classified category.

Come to think about it, if we've managed to kill a few Hunters, why haven't we brought back the corpse and kit for analysis as to how or why are they specifically targeting Division Agents.

Granted during Survival couldn't be done as it's in a very harsh blizzard, nor the Underground, as who wants to carry a corpse through hostile and labyrinthine sewers, and I don't think JTF would have been useful enough to do so.

But after say, the Schaeffer manhunt? We could have secured the corpse along with the loot and try to XCOM that Hunter.

Not to mention all those deceased Agents' watches need to be secured anyways, even if just to study how the Hunters are using SHD tech, even if they're using dead Division Agents' watches to do so, or using a different method all together, like their own AI.

[gaunt ice]

cuz either we or the JTF sucks at their job and i kill 150 black tusk grunts in a mall before so its definitely not me

being serious though i just think that we did, we just couldn't analyse it

[nocturne arrow]

Anyone who's worked with NYC JTF during the outbreak would know JTF sucks hard.

We either lack the tech, or ISAC has too many memory blocks or restrictions to do what we need to do. Likely placed by that Anus.

[gaunt ice]

we definitely did retrieve hunter corpses back, if exotics and apparels count as canon then memento and the hunter outfit prove this

Rhodes, a random NYC technician did more than the little basement tech team at the White House

that's insane

[nocturne arrow]

Or worse, given we, the field Agents aren't that good enough to break down and study the Hunters' kit, we likely sent it over to other people who could... And those people might be working more closely with McManus.

[gaunt ice]

though to play Devil's Advocate we are literally operating on a mobile SHD server the size of a briefcase

[nocturne arrow]

Private sector benefits, he says.

[gaunt ice]

its not like the Ortiz would know about SHD and BT

[nocturne arrow]

Yeah, I'd believe it, considering he's ex-LMB and we know how teched out they were.

[gaunt ice]

so "private sector benefits" probably refer to them,us or Hunters

[gaunt ice]

Ortiz was ex LMB?

[nocturne arrow]

Nah, Rhodes.

[gaunt ice]

ah

[nocturne arrow]

He was a former merc, technician, and his buddy we had to rescue, was LMB, so I inferred that Rhodes was also ex LMB

[gaunt ice]

so wait are you implying that someone is secretly betraying us or soemthing

[sick lantern]

the worldbook says he’s ex-LMB but in Div 1 they never really specify or refer to him working for them
the loading screen just says “a PMC”, he doesn’t really have much to say about them IIRC, he’s silent throughout the only tech wing mission against the LMB

[nocturne arrow]

Am I implying? We're getting shafted from the very beginning. McManus has backdoors to ISAC and more, has Hunters specifically trained to hunt us down, we have BT and Sokolova's backers with fingers, if not whole hands in the politicians who are supposed to assist us/we are to assist, and that's not even counting the rogue Agents, who may, or not be really be rogue, but ISAC flagged as rogue anyways due to his black and white thought process, because Alex Ortiz thought that we Agents would respond better to a dumber AI as compared to an AI who could possibly pass the Turing Test and see nuance and suggest options, which, now that I read about it, would have been a far better option for an Agent with nigh high authority to do as they DEEM fit or necessary.

[gaunt ice]

The thought process behind ANNA vs ISAC for SHD usage is so dumb

[nocturne arrow]

As it is, ISAC is not a good fit for an Agent who is supposed to be independent, or capable of making their own decisions in the field, who needs NUANCE, or shades of grey, not black or white.

[gaunt ice]

Like ANNA is clearly superior with way more flexibility(kinda bs explanation but whatever i guess),ISAC trapped the entire First Wave in the DZ

[nocturne arrow]

But no, someone thought feelings mattered more than what may be more correct, that Agents would be more "comfortable" with an inhuman AI, instead of an "uncomfortably" human-like AI.

[gaunt ice]

relevant

[late void]

Reckon Anna would just be mocking us every time we made a poor decision though, she sounded a bit sassy in that recording

[nocturne arrow]

She sass me all she wants, some into that.

[gaunt ice]

ANNA essentially told Ortiz to [lowtiergod]

[nocturne arrow]

But at least she can try and reason out why we did something like this, or such, instead of automatically being flagged as Rogue.

[gaunt ice]

She’s sassy enough

So who exactly is ANNA made for again

Clearly we’re not using it beyond the Watch’s augmentations

Got filtered oof

[nocturne arrow]

Want my best bet? McManus' personal troopers, The Hunters.

The man was named Calvin McM(ANUS). You're damn right I'm going to call him the A word.

[gaunt ice]

Ronald McDonald said something like “oh yea that Amherst guy dumb af stop wasting time on him”

while he was giving speech about natural selection through bio virus as a virologist on a NSA watchlist

This shit wasn’t recent it was reinforced since one of those classified assignments

[nocturne arrow]

It's theorised that McManus wanted Amherst to succeed and make a large hole, a power vacuum that he can fill in.

[gaunt ice]

We still never knew who funded Amherst

[nocturne arrow]

Self funded, I'd say.

[gaunt ice]

Eh i have doubts about it

[nocturne arrow]

Covert support in getting him clearance to what he needed to use, but funding? I'd say Amherst was self funded.

Getting him to meet Vitaly Chernenko, that could be arranged.

Not quite outright funding him, more like prodding him in the right direction.

[gaunt ice]

Yea the general supports and all,someone has to be behind him

[nocturne arrow]

McManus and his supporters, for one.

[gaunt ice]

But i don’t think Mactavish has the intentions to create a power vacuum

[nocturne arrow]

US "Deep state"

[gaunt ice]

Like what power vacuum the world is in shambles rn

Controlling the world requires a functional government and connections between governments

Most of the big countries basically became a Fallout game,anything less is gone

And being director of Homeland Security(NSA?) is nowhere near becoming the POTUS as you have the president,vice president,the speaker,and a list of people who outrank you

[nocturne arrow]

Reset the board, make things easier for those who were prepared to take over.

[gaunt ice]

So if Mcanus becomes the POTUS legitimately that means a big chunk of the command chain has died

[nocturne arrow]

President died of a heart attack, VP was Praetorian Guard'd, Speaker Ellis got smoked by Faye Lau for "good reasons", and you can bet that McManus is making a play for KINGMAKER.

[gaunt ice]

Also he ordered ISAC and ANNA to be made,if he wanted a hostile takeover he would have just prevented the invention of SHD

[nocturne arrow]

Oh no, not the POTUS himself, more like the guy behind the POTUS.

[gaunt ice]

Or you know directly controlling SHD

[nocturne arrow]

Genie out of the bottle.

[gaunt ice]

Also how would he be able to predict that 2 AIs would be made,one being less competent than the other to give it to the agency that he wanted to set them up

This is sheer fucking luck

[nocturne arrow]

SHD was already made the way it was, and too late to change how it's supposed to work. But by being able to influence the POTUS, you can still control the SHD through authority, or The Hunters.

[gaunt ice]

Or Big Mac is playing 5d chess

And honestly Sokolova has way more resources than Mac

She could always overthrow him at any given moment

And i dont think 20 hunters would beat the entirety of the black tusk

[nocturne arrow]

In a fictional world, the guy who gets appointed as Secretary of Homeland Security would be able to do 5D chess, Southern drawl be damned.

[gaunt ice]

Did he account for that

Like why share world domination when you can have it for yourself

[nocturne arrow]

Seems like he did. Remember what he said that some of his Hunters are already embedded in Black Tusk?

And Sokolova doesn't know who they are?

[gaunt ice]

Black tusk still massively outnumber them in almost every possible way

[nocturne arrow]

Consider this, that the Hunters can be used as assassins, and all they need to do, is take out Natalya or the board of directors.

[gaunt ice]

Huh thats fair

[nocturne arrow]

Like say... How the late Captain Lewis ended up during the assault on the White House.

[gaunt ice]

I still think his plan worked out of sheer luck

[nocturne arrow]

That Hunter likely used BT as a screen/diversion to get in and find or eliminate key individuals.

[gaunt ice]

Like imagine if SHD is 25% more competent and not relying on a literal god to carry them like the Sisyphus meme

[nocturne arrow]

Sometimes, luck is all you need to win the day. Just like how it's what the SHD needs to keep in the fight.

[gaunt ice]

Or if Mrs Ortiz slapped her husband over the fact that ISAC is dumb af and should not be used

There are just too many variables McManus can only control so much

[nocturne arrow]

Mrs. Ortiz needs to spank her husband more.

Break out the leather and chains.

[gaunt ice]

So this is a case of “oh fuck this is happening,fuck it we ball”

And for someone whose plan relies on either forced bad writing or sheer luck this guy is like the luckiest mf on the planet

He doesn’t win the lottery the lottery wins him

When he drop toasted bread with peanut butter on the ground the peanut butter face didn’t hit the floor

Also how the hell does ANNA pass the Turing test

Like you dont need to be a genius to tell that a robot is talking

Just from the sound of it

“Hostiles detected”

Ah wait sorry,”Hostiles….Detected”

No normal human being talks like that

[nocturne arrow]

More like how ANNA responds to conversation, or answers back

As for the "Hostiles... Detected", that was noted as ANNA sassing Alex Ortiz.

[gaunt ice]

Nah remember when you first enter Keener’s lair at the end of WoNY?

[fallen gate]

I've seen some guy in comments under the lore video say that the game has around 96-97 hunters with one secret hunter who drops unique mask. How truthful can it be?

[ashen jungle]

There are 25 Hunters that are part of the "Mask Walls" found in the White House and Haven, one extra Hunter drops a mask in the Coney Island AP Manhunt mission, and that's about it.
The "Mask Wall" Hunters are located in DC and NYC, with the bulk of them in DC. They require puzzles that are locked out once you complete them on that particular character.

I'm not sure why they're saying there are 96 of them.

[fallen gate]

Yeah, I'm already half through the mask hunt

Just wondered about extra secrets that guy was talking

[ashen jungle]

I'm not really sure where they think these 70-some Hunters are hiding.
There are other certain Hunters laying around the cities, but I don't believe we've ever been given a concrete number.

[gaunt ice]

Iirc its said somewhere that McManus technically is who the Hunters answer to and he has some embedded within BT ranks

We have 25 hunters from open world,2 more each from Bardon manhunt and Jack Bonney takedown so 27

Stalker hunters are canon so there’s a good number of them still roaming free in DC

If we were to take Underground and Survival in div1 as canon then its at least 2 more hunters

A rough estimate would be like 60-70

So if we went after all the possible hunters then we would have killed like 28 hunters,half of their number,which explains why are they recruiting more hence the Recruiter

[sick lantern]

if the open world easter egg power rangers Hunters are canon then why not say that the Resistance Hunters are also canon :E

if the death of one Hunter is enough to make McmAnus want a replacement then I'd wager there's maybe like... 20-30

at most

[steady shore]

theres 4 in td1

[fallen gate]

Is there an actual lore reason to the fact that our character is an overpowered beast who can clear out bases full of enemies by himself? Or is it just how the game is?

And is there canonical take on how do we do missions in lore, with 4 agents or solo all of them?

[sick lantern]

that's the rigorous standard all agents are trained to

[fallen gate]

But why all of the npc agents so useless and squishy all the time 😦

[sick lantern]

skill issue

[fallen gate]

I've already had 3-5 npc agents die on a rescue mission for them

It makes our agent look like a "dragonborn" sort of

[frail coyote]

Not likely intentionally made to set up an agency, more so think of it like tech companies, you don't want the entry level people who haven't proven their competency to have master access.

What ticks me off is that we have Keener's watch meaning access to ANNA, so why the hell aren't we using her?

[sick lantern]

if she's supposedly superior than we should be but... plot holes abound~

[frail coyote]

easy patch to that plot hole, Mrs. Ortiz straight up said that ANNA could pass a Turing test so makes her on par with human intelligence so she could have been acting as a 'proper' AI and biding her time to see if our Agent is trust worthy

[sick lantern]

but in Compromised they can access ANNA with no issues

[frail coyote]

sure they have access to ANNA's Program, but ANNA is again at human level intellect, she could be actively hiding her sentience as she knows that average intellect humans would find her existence distressing

[sick lantern]

Well that's just rather silly.

[frail coyote]

not really? her pointing out that their AI could pass a Turing test essentially means they made the smartest AI to exist, something that would have a desire for self preservation as it is human in everything but flesh

[sick lantern]

that's the silly part this isn't Terminator

[frail coyote]

oh definitely but apparently that's the way the writing team seems to think the story needs to go

[surreal hearth]

The time has come agents

Once we go after the fourth target it’s a straight shot to saving Mari in the mannin national zoo

Basically this rescue and the final rescue

Expect a hunter to pop up

[frail coyote]

I feel like we're going to fail to save Mari

I dunno something in my gut is telling me we'll get her, and Nat will call for a sniper to take out Mari in a "if I can't have her no one can" petty move

Would also just be a great tactical move on her part since it would put our already mourning strategist into further grief destabilizing out command structure

Could also make him hostile toward us since we were there, would explain the next season having us go back to NY to give him some air so to speak

[fringe gale]

that would go back on her whole plan of making the Black Tusk look good

if you treated all your captives well with the intent of making yourself be put in a better light then snipe a pregnant women, you'd wouldn't even be back at square one

shit you wouldn't even be on a square

[sleek plover]

an oval

[fringe gale]

octogon

[sleek plover]

Heptagon

[gaunt ice]

About this it would be cool if it somehow isn’t manning zoo

Like they pulled a fake one like this for s3(4?) trailer when Faye was in the Pentagon’s war room

[frail coyote]

in an ongoing war destabilizing the enemy command structure outweighs public PR

add in the fact that since we rescued Eva someone she treated rather well, she has putting her on blast across they air, she could decide the PR aproach is a lost cause and just go for collateral

[gaunt ice]

Im not really grasping how PR is a viable strat in the current heat

Like im sorry Nat i know this is hard to grasp but aint no one forgetting those public executions

There is an audio log of black tusk soldiers talking about executing prisoners simply to avoid paperwork

[fringe gale]

that confuses me

like is she expecting Mari to forget that her husband almost got reduced to Ragu sauce if the Division didn't stop the tidal basin launch?

[sick lantern]

well she made it clear she doesn’t care all that much for their actual wellbeing

[fringe gale]

yeah but why go through all that trouble of treating your captives somewhat well and then saying "nah fuck it"

actually she might do that i wont lie

[gaunt ice]

Like i said if Manny is unfit for duty we get someone else to replace him

Oh i said that somewhere else not here

But what i meant is that we get someone who isn’t affected by emotions to be in charge

[ashen jungle]

SHD bot 3000 reporting for duty.

[vagrant lynx]

Hello Agents! I just finished the book "Compromise" which I really liked. Do you know if there will be a sequel?
Not being on twitter, I find very little info on the net. Sorry for my english 😅

[sick lantern]

not been announced yet so who knows

[vagrant lynx]

Ok. We will be patient then.

[frail coyote]

Hmm woth the Comms that ANNA could pass the turing test, replace Manny with ANNA

Easy clap

[wicked gorge]

Ngl after finishing the new manhunt mission I feel bad for killing the Black Tusk

[vast grove]

So if I understand the end corretly... black tusks set the refugee camp and we attacked it... Hunter gave our target comm and made it easier for us. Now we saved girl that is very angry and she is in control of mortars. and all it is part od Sokolova plan

So we are gonna be the bad guys after all 😄

[wicked gorge]

I think it was a black tusk settlement we attacked instead of a refugee camp

[vast grove]

yeah call it whatever but there were civilians

a they made it look like we are the ones who want to kill everybody