lore-discussion

[unkempt sleet]

HE IS SAYING ITS NOT A "OH IT WAS A DREAM, IT DOESNT MATTER" TROPE THAT EVERY OTHER GAME USES

[silver vine]

how. bro only told me "act 3 is not a dream" nothing more nothing less

also its self therapy

[safe charm]

Ahhhhhh

YES it is

Were not doubting it

[hollow remnant]

guys it aint worth it

[silver vine]

yeah

[hollow remnant]

you won't be able to change his mind with simple facts and common sense

its impossible guys

[silver vine]

yall cant change my mind, because the creator knows what he cooked

[hollow remnant]

lets instead talk about how horrible finch is and how she should die brutally

[safe charm]

Okay so

Nicky goes to sleep his trauma bubbles up and he relives his trauma in his head

[unkempt sleet]

So literally a dream

[silver vine]

NOT dream

[hollow remnant]

tinycrow

just shut up

[safe charm]

Damn

[silver vine]

Id send you the QNA video, but its an hour and a half long

[safe charm]

I seen it!

I heard what he Said

Its all metaphorical

Yes

The thing represents Nickys fear

[unkempt sleet]

Literally a "dream" where Nicky has "a series of thoughts, images, and sensations occurring in his mind during sleep"

[hollow remnant]

im crying, this guy just wont give up

[silver vine]

he never even said the word "metaphorical"

[hollow remnant]

this is the most dedicated act 3 real truther ive ever seen

[silver vine]

only thing he said was "Act 3 isnot a dream, its self therapy"

[hollow remnant]

SELF THERAPY

THROUGH DREAM

THSIS ILITERALY PLOT TH

[safe charm]

So your telling me your telling me the shadow man

Is a real living

Entity

[hollow remnant]

tinycrow im gonna lick you nose

[silver vine]

if you were here a year ago, you wouldve seen many

[unkempt sleet]

A year ago?

[hollow remnant]

i wasn't here a year ago because i left

and i really doubt between 2022 and 2023 there would of been more act 3 real truthers

[silver vine]

then why the hell does Nikita keep saying act 3 is not a dream. answer this then I'll agree with you

[unkempt sleet]

I ANSWERED IT

[safe charm]

Because its more then A DREAM

[hollow remnant]

becuaud eyhes doens't want his stoy gto eb reduce to jsy adrem

[unkempt sleet]

BUDDY

[hollow remnant]

i give up

this guy wont ever

[safe charm]

Its an important self therapy in his head

Thats litteraly it

[hollow remnant]

theres no point guys, pack it up

[silver vine]

yeah pack it up

[hollow remnant]

again lets just bully finch

something we can all agree on

universally

as a species

is that she sucks

[safe charm]

Act 3 being real would suck as well would defeat

The whole purpose

[hollow remnant]

nicky burnt down petersons house with his mind just as easily as he created it

cinema

nicky has mind powers and can change reality

[manic dirge]

This is new lore trust guys

Trust my source 🙏

[unkempt sleet]

Okay so, Are the storms caused by the cults rituals or the Mayak itself

[safe charm]

Idk

[unkempt sleet]

To be specific, im not asking about how its in the books, more like in the games

[safe charm]

Uhhh

We dont know

Lol

[unkempt sleet]

Maybe Mike has a theory or something, I'll wait for him

[plush onyx]

ask nicky to give me all 4 alphas' uncooked files

[hollow remnant]

nope

[plush onyx]

yess

s

pls i need them

[hollow remnant]

build a time machine

and steal the files

[shut hill]

🤫

[unkempt sleet]

And the observatory
in HE it's a part of the Park's map as if it's an attraction in the park. But it doesnt make sense and it also wasnt a part of the park and was rather next to it in the Books iirc

[silver vine]

are we sure its actually the observatory from the books and not just a space themed attraction

since it does not have any cult related stuff in it

[unkempt sleet]

Actually that might be true maybe?

[silver vine]

other than the mayak lightning that is

[unkempt sleet]

I wonder what it is called in the files

Looking at it yea it does feel like an attraction

Is this explanation of the HE lore in the timeline good enough

[ripe berry]

yeah it fits what we know of the lore good enough

HE's lore is so straight forward if you look for it there's only like 2 things that could even be gotten wrong

[muted moon]

The storms happen, and the luck devices turn them into the weird purple ones

The actual storms are just storms that happened naturally

The luck devices just make them worse

[unkempt sleet]

erm

[muted moon]

In the mayak event in sn a storm was already going to happen

Evacuate posters

Mayak also used bad luck (purple) energy

So mayak probably functions similar to the devices

[unkempt sleet]

there's nothing in the games that suggest cultist rituals other than HN2 and we know they have the coins, not luck devices in HN2

[ripe berry]

BUT
if you remember correctly
the HNHS Stage 4 Book implies something like the events of Aaron Trilogy occurs in the games

the reason they use the coins is because the original Luck Devices are buried at the end of the Aaron Trilogy

even if Games, Books, and AS are 3 different canons details will still overlap and you can use evidence from one as evidence for the others

[unkempt sleet]

That is fair

but then we come to my main question again

is it Mayak or Cultist Ritual that's responsible for the storms in the Games

[ripe berry]

the way I see it
In books there's only the Luck Devices
in AS there's only the coins
and the games... it's unclear but I'd assume it's involved

wait

aren't the Luck Devices powered by some kind of crystal?

[unkempt sleet]

There was a crystal yea

[ripe berry]

what if the Luck Devices and the Mayak use these crystals for different purposes
both are altering probability (aka luck) after all

one's basically altering the probablity of a storm forming at that moment

[unkempt sleet]

hmmmm

[ripe berry]

and the other's altering the probability of events happening to something

[unkempt sleet]

what if the pit under Mayak is where the crystals come from

[ripe berry]

and the books themselves prove it can be linked to something other then people

[ripe berry]

OH SNAP!

[unkempt sleet]

[ripe berry]

that'd make a lot of sense

[unkempt sleet]

We are making big revelations

[ripe berry]

(they curse the front cart of the Rotten Core Roller Coaster)

and since it can be used on objects
nothing prevents it from making storms

[unkempt sleet]

That would allow the luck devices and Mayak both control the weatheri think

[ripe berry]

after all what are storms but a bunch of water in different states combined together

[ripe berry]

yeah
even the Coins

Luck Devices are known about
so they disguise the Luck Devices as coins, which can be used for the same purpose

in HNVR they give bad luck based off their name

[unkempt sleet]

OOOOH

yea

[ripe berry]

and in AS they clearly give good luck

[unkempt sleet]

I think AS will explain the coins in either S2 or S3, so we'll see if we're right

[ripe berry]

yeah

[ripe berry]

I mean
it'd make sense for people to have Tokens from the Park they "can't use" since the Golden Apple Company shut down

so no one would bat a eye to the coins with the Golden Apple Symbol

[ripe berry]

we dunno if the crystals have any form of limitations

the reason they cursed the front cart of the Rotten Core was so they could kill two birds with one stone

they both kill Mya and ruin Ted's Reputation in his hometown

nothing indicates the crystals can't do certain things
we just don't see them do certain things

[unkempt sleet]

What if the Luck Devices were the things that use the crystals power and make it easier to do certain things
While the crystals themselves are more unpredictable

[ripe berry]

yeah

it'd make sense why they have a whole device instead of just a crystal

[ripe berry]

also the Mayak has wires going into the Pit to possibly try to harnest the power of the crystals

[unkempt sleet]

Wasnt Roger and Adelle trying to investigate the Strange Weather...

They found the source and looking at it maybe

[ripe berry]

yep

gotta try to harnest it's power to properly study it

since as you said the Crystals by themselves could be highly unstable

which is also probably part of the reason why they have railings in place around the pit
so no one tries to mess with the crystals and makes them do something dangerous

also so no one falls in but that bit's obvious

it appears something or someone did fall in at some point though
in AS there's only one hole in the railing
and it's right infront of a pathway coming from the main Mayak Building

Franklin laters falls in and you know the rest

the crystals seem to be rare though
as Raven Brooks is the only town with the weird weather stuff in HN Lore
well other then the scrapped HE Island Plot's RB Copies

[ripe berry]

however I'm 90% sure the game outright showed the existence of the crystals (in some form) on the island

[unkempt sleet]

if it was on the island that means i dont accept it as proof for the games 👨‍🔬

[ripe berry]

I know
I'm using it as supporting evidence

the only other planned instance of Weird Mayak Stuff also outright shows the Crystals

[ripe berry]

again
only supporting evidence here
BUT it fits with the other pieces so it makes sense

it just shows more proof the crystals are linked to Mayak AND the Cult, and also are rare as this is the only other place known to have the Crystals in any piece of HN Media

it's like using HNHS Alpha as evidence the Crow in Stage 5 is the Guest (or at least controlled by him)
both show Crows acting weird with the Peterson Family
which shows they intended this to be a plot point
but the exacts were likely changed throughout development before they finally came up with the Guest to explain it

[ripe berry]

this meanwhile shows they had ideas relating to the Mayak being powered by rare crystals around the same time SN Mayak Event and Books 4-6 were in development

[wooden hollow]

hey fellow neighbor-enthusiasts! what's going on?

[ripe berry]

it's not MAJOR evidence yes
but knowing the things they planned the for the series helps us understand their current line of thinking

[unkempt sleet]

Okay so like we think Mayak is able to start a storm?

[unkempt sleet]

Crystals

[ripe berry]

discussion of Luck Devices, Mayak, and the storms

[wooden hollow]

sounds complicated

[ripe berry]

and how they could be linked to the same Crystals
(Luck Devices are known to have Crystals at this point we're going through evidence and ideas relating to the Crystals and how they could be tied to the Mayak and it's ability to control Storms (plus the weird storms of Raven Brooks in general))

hell the Coins from AS could also use the same Crystals that make the Luck Devices work

[ripe berry]

and when you came in I was using HE's Scrapped Island Plot as extra evidence
because knowing what they were thinking of at one point, even if they changed up the game, can give you some ideas on how they might view certain things

it's not MAIN evidence since it's cut content

but it's still evidence

[unkempt sleet]

i hope AS confirms that the Luck Devices did exist but it probably wont

[ripe berry]

yeah

at the very least I hope there's something about the Luck Devices or the Crystals in AS

[wooden hollow]

maybe it's in the cult book

[ripe berry]

that'd make sense...

[unkempt sleet]

OOH YEA İ HOPE SO

[ripe berry]

I mean
maybe there's actual text written here
it could already mention luck devices

[unkempt sleet]

An illustration of the Luck Device design from the pilot...

[wooden hollow]

im so excited for the season 2 cult stuff, it looks so cool already

[ripe berry]

also remember the symbol here's potential meaning
#hello-neighbor message

[wooden hollow]

yesss

that doesnt seem like a coincidence

[ripe berry]

but do we know if the text here is unreadable
I mean they bothered to write "CAN'T SEE!" on there, barely readable

[unkempt sleet]

Even the snake is there, yea

[ripe berry]

what says the other text isn't readable

[ripe berry]

"The Snake or serpent symbolises transformation, renewal, change and can be used for healing. The Pentacle provides the Elements to bestow life, health and fertility." - Found by Noxified

[unkempt sleet]

Guest and the Luck

[ripe berry]

yep

afk

[ripe berry]

I have some ideas but I still have to do smth so I'll tell everything I came up with when I'm done

so remember the Book 7 Gemstones?
What if they're another form of the Crystals

I mean AS makes it clear the Coins (which likely are the AS version of Luck Devices and therefore likely also use the Crystals) can counter-act the effects of other Luck Devices/Crystals

so a Crystal being used with Lightning to cause a Time Loop could easily be prevented with other Crystals

[steady nest]

Ah man i love hn theorising

[ripe berry]

it's no wonder the AS Pilot Luck Device looks a lot like the Book 7 Gemstone Descriptions

they're the same exact thing

or well

not the exact same thing

but they use the same crystals

[ripe berry]

Book 7/Reset Day Gemstones are "steam punk looking dials with a gem in the middle"
which while not exact to the Luck Device Depiction in AS is very close in style

the Coins can counteract other coins on a small scale
but you need a lot to fully counteract their effects

Ted's left with only a few coins after Episode 5 and his luck runs out as he gets arrested

Ted also likely uses the coin collection he has to make the Business dudes slip and fall, to try to take their coins for himself

[strange lance]

its called planetarium or Observatory in the files

[ripe berry]

for Trinity to survive the upcoming events
she'd need a lot of the Coins or Crystals (see above convos to understand the Crystal stuff, tldr; Mayak, Luck Devices, the Coins, and the Book 7 Gemstones all seem to use some Crystals to cause the strange weather and luck manipulation and just about everything supernatural in the HN Lore), so no wonder the final fight's inside the Mayak

[strange lance]

oh yeah the glowy panels that light up when the cultists do the rituals from the books are in the Observatory dome room along with the fake skylight stars mentioned in the book which tb riga added in the full game.

[unkempt sleet]

Okay so why is it an attraction at the park

[strange lance]

it just is. Kids learn about space

space rides and all that

[unkempt sleet]

it wasnt in the books, wasnt it like just beside the park

[strange lance]

yes, and so was mayak, and so was the radio tower. But it seems that all of that has been moved closer to/in the park now

the cultists probably did their rituals when the place was closed

not like anyone is gonna be there at night

[unkempt sleet]

Stupid change to make the observatory an attraction inside the park

And it messes up with the ending of Book 5

[strange lance]

I think it adds to the park, makes it cooler

evil operations under everybodys noses right in the place they're having fun at

[unkempt sleet]

it doesnt work at all though
They wouldnt be able to work in there while its in construction
They cant do it while the park's open because it was literally open for one day
And it messes up Book 5's ending with Cleave and Aaron facing each other alone in the Observatory

it would work after the parks closed though but that would still mean its a stupid change overall

[strange lance]

lets just say nobody went into the dome room easy peasy

[unkempt sleet]

Kinda hard to imagine an attraction nobody went into at the opening day of a park that was advertised so much around the whole town but okay

[strange lance]

theres other parts of the observatory

it goes underground

thats where all the exhibits are

the dome just has some floating planets

which is kinda boring

[lean haven]

What if he’s the guest

[ripe berry]

no.

it's a neat idea
but it doesn't work lorewise

the Thing is only in people's heads while the Guest is real

[hollow remnant]

the thing isn't real

[ripe berry]

the Thing is a entity used to represent fear in the HN Universe

[lean haven]

The real question is who’s this

[hollow remnant]

a journalist or something

[lean haven]

I say a creep

[wicked heath]

simple.
A DEAD MAN

[plush onyx]

its nikita

he added himself into the game

as undercover man

to spy on people

[lean haven]

Nice

[silver vine]

I don't think that's a luck device

It fits more with the desc of the things from reset day

Brass steampunk looking dial with a gem in the middle

The thing which causes you to retain memories after time loops

[silver vine]

Coins aren't the AS version of luck device. Luck devices bring good luck to the user when used. Coins bring death upon you when you lose it.

[snow mauve]

no no no no

shushy shush

i dont wanna hear it

nope nope nope nope

not the shitty timeloops

anything but that

NOPE

[silver vine]

Watch timeloops be in AS season 3

[snow mauve]

i will rip your soul

then break into tinybuild headquarters

and destroy the whole world

[hollow remnant]

if time loops are in season 3, i will stop being a fan of hello neighbor

[small elk]

They trying so hard to be Little Nightmares bro😭🙏 /hj

[muted moon]

It's an older design that I'm pretty sure was in book 5?

Yeah

A similar design is in book 5, page 159

Oh wait

You aren't talking about the pilot design

Nvm

[silver vine]

Th luck device from book 5 does not have any gem in it

[ripe berry]

well

Ted's wording says Trinity's "all out of luck"

thus

the coins giving her a tiny bit of luck so she survives

[silver vine]

Hmmm

Even if that's the case, you don't need to do a ritual then

For it to give you luck

[ripe berry]

this says otherwise

[silver vine]

This is not the one from book 5

Which is what halloween was talking about

[unkempt sleet]

This is the one from book 6
Which is supposedly still a luck device

[ripe berry]

ok yeah
Book 5 Luck Device isn't a crystal
but there's still Luck Devices with crystals

[unkempt sleet]

it's the one that Ted built which supposedly looks the same as Aaron's Fake that Aaron uses it as a fake for Cleave to take. Which means what Cleave had also looks like this

[ripe berry]

and it functions iirc
meaning it's a real Luck Device

[unkempt sleet]

it is a real luck device
Ted just used the pieces from the Luck Device that his parents had dismantled

[ripe berry]

which implies at the very least that Luck Devices in the ~1960s use these crystals
wether or not the crystals are still in use due to other luck device designs is another question

but the cult treat it as a normal Luck Device so I'd assume they still have the crystal ones in use

sure they could have other designs, but it doesn't change the fact that at least some Luck Devices DO have these crystals in them

and the storm thing could be like
they're trying to tap into all the Crystal's Luck changing powers
Since 1 Crystal alone can't do much
so they wait for a Storm to do their rituals hoping they'd be able to use the full energy

granted
then the question becomes why don't they just go to the source for their rituals or whatever

[silver vine]

can we please talk about the lore behind the guest in HN1

[small elk]

Ah yes, the Guest is a smoker

[muted moon]

The ones without the crystals are probably just solely for the weather

Since all luck devices are weather detectors

So the ones without the crystals probably lack the luck power the crystal ones have

[ripe berry]

would make sense

[muted moon]

Also, when aaron opened up one of the crystal-less devices all he thought it was was a weather detector

[ripe berry]

ok

[strange lance]

the magic mayak crystal...

[ripe berry]

funny how most of what we talked about yesterday WAS about the crystals like this one

[snow mauve]

Useless

[strange lance]

Not entirely. The events of that game still happened

Maybe the cultists got those crystals from the island?

Idk

I'm too tired to theorize rn

[supple coral]

good thing im here

but for an unrelated reason

#stageplay

#theorizing of something

[heady flint]

walter white is the neighbor

[shell gull]

Not The Guest but alr

[silver vine]

Bro

It's clearly the guest

What else can it be

[muted moon]

the guest didnt even exist at that point

h&s, then maybe

but this is hn1

[lean haven]

So were is this kids parents

[muted moon]

adult man

[lean haven]

But he was a kid in the first act

[muted moon]

yes

he has parents

read the books

[lean haven]

Ok

[hollow remnant]

my god

[muted moon]

I mean as a character

When hn1 was made

He literally didn't exist

As an idea

Or anything

The books don't say that

That's a theory that was made based solely on an achievement name

[silver vine]

Not really

The art station desc says he's existed for ages

[wicked heath]

out being parents

[trail haven]

Haven't been here for days

[shell gull]

A drawing of a Bird, The Guest didn’t exist at all during that time in the Lore, and I don’t recall The Guest wearing a Tie with Yellow Feathers, Smoking and wearing Underwear.

It’s just a drawing Mya and Aaron made amongst the others.

[hollow remnant]

holy shit guys

you are actually unbelievable

[muted moon]

It wasn't confirmed

All the art station says is he existed for ages

The achievement name is ancient curse (which could be relating to the coins as well)

[unkempt sleet]

or the peterson curse

[muted moon]

Yeah

[unkempt sleet]

but idk if that would qualify as ancient

[muted moon]

How?

[unkempt sleet]

well nightmare 3 is about the cult

[muted moon]

Nightmare 3 doesn't even relate to the guest

[unkempt sleet]

it shows that they're fueled by their greed

[muted moon]

It's not a guest coin

It's a cult coin

No

[ripe berry]

yeah

[muted moon]

Noone controls the coins

[ripe berry]

Greed and Power
pretty sure Alex said smth about HN2's themes including Greed at some point

[unkempt sleet]

Yea

[muted moon]

They did

The coins are ancient

The coins curse you

Cursed coins

[ripe berry]

Bingo.
https://www.reddit.com/r/GameTheorists/comments/uayb6q/ceo_of_tinybuild_and_producer_of_the_original/

"Meanwhile the sequel is all about love on one side, and greed on the other."

[unkempt sleet]

Love with Aaron and Ted and Greed with the Cult

[ripe berry]

yeah

not referring to the coins
but the cult themselves

[unkempt sleet]

the achivement is for the Nightmare 3

[muted moon]

The coins are ancient

[unkempt sleet]

which represents the cult

[muted moon]

The coins curse is ancient

The guest isn't even in nightmare 3

[unkempt sleet]

in the books the luck devices were ancient

[ripe berry]

and the Coins function similarly to the Luck Devices

[muted moon]

The book equivalent of the coins are ancient

The coins have the same powers

[unkempt sleet]

Norman Darby says that when he's talking with Aaron iirc

[muted moon]

The coins are definitely ancient

[ripe berry]

in AS they're giving people enough luck to avoid the curse of death
in HNVR they're known as Unlucky Coins
showing the coins can control luck on both sides just like the Luck Devices

[muted moon]

He says probably ancient

[steady nest]

The goose ideology

[ripe berry]

thus
the coins are likely a variant of Luck Device

[muted moon]

No

Peterson stick together

[steady nest]

Naw guest is like raven brooks folklore

[muted moon]

No

But the guest posessed his body probably

He probably came into existence as a result of whatever happened in mayak

[steady nest]

Naw nikita said the goose is old

[muted moon]

Not ancient

Mayak is a weather station

In the books his parents built it

It's not the same in the AS

[unkempt sleet]

it could still be the case. we just gotta wait

[muted moon]

But they're probably the same age

In both as and books

Or a similar one

[muted moon]

No

Petersons stick together shows it more as an abandoned creepy unfamiliar place

[unkempt sleet]

It could be that they worked there without the kids knowing, or it could be not, we'll wait and see

[muted moon]

Anyways, in reset day the crystals were described as looking like chips of something that had been smashed to pieces, I wonder what they were parts of?

[steady nest]

Franklin seems to know the layout kinda

He leads ted to the tunnels

[unkempt sleet]

that is true, i didnt realize that

[steady nest]

Also isn't there a picture of teds parents in hn2s files?

[steady nest]

The neighbors tie to mayak only makes sense when mayak is build by the neighbors parents kinda

Otherwise ted would've need to do a lot of digging to discover mayak

[unkempt sleet]

Do you guys think this means anything for the lore

[ripe berry]

the hell stairs

[unkempt sleet]

erm akshally the stairs go to heaven

[wicked heath]

I believe in the emesis

[shell gull]

I’m talking about his Character not the Lore.

[silver vine]

The coins are from the amusement park

[muted moon]

theory 2 is wrong

theory 1 also cant really work

since in the AS mayaks origin isnt confirmed

idk

i dont think its ever confirmed

yes

of course its older than that

its a town

probably 1800s?

im pretty sure the books said it was around then

[silver vine]

Theory 2 is utterly wrong

That dude is a good guy

[subtle aspen]

What is Mia and Diana's wearing on dolls ?

I mean tree puppets in ending Path Hn2

Crow man is tree puppet? Like mechanics sounds

[ripe berry]

Introduction to the fact there's 3 timelines
Games
Books
and AS
this is the most likely thing based off a leaked Investor's Document that for legal reasons I can't share
and while it takes a bit of explaining to make the HNVR Ending work it is possible
and SN gives a Games Mayak origin
and Peterson's Stick Together was based off a early idea for a game intro, meaning it's possible it can be counted as canon to the games if you count something like HE Island Plot as canon

[unkempt sleet]

Ohhhh yea i forgot SN makes the Mayak still built by Ted's parents in the games timeline

[ripe berry]

yep

[ripe berry]

so Theory 1 is 100% possible

[strange lance]

I still think the books are in the same continuity as the games just with inconsistencies. They're waaay closer to the games and directly connect to them

Idrc what people at tb have to say about the lore

Also I'm pretty sure the AS and books being on a different tree branch was just them showing hn media that not games, hence it branching off

Everything is canon, even the AS

Its just about continuity (is it in the same timeline)

[unkempt sleet]

but they retcon HNHS so much 🕺

[strange lance]

This needs to stop being said, same for hn1. Those games were made when the books were not a thing

The books expanded and fleshed everything out

Then when they wanted a park game they had to change stuff from the books

[silver vine]

You can think whatever you want man, but I don't think Nicky literally CELEBRATED with the rescue squad after what they did to him in book 3

[unkempt sleet]

Then that just means Books did not tried to follow the games...

[strange lance]

You're judging continuity over a credits image?

What did you want SW to show a depressed nicky

That wouldn't be nice to see

[silver vine]

You said it was canon?

[strange lance]

What?

[silver vine]

It was Aaron looking into from guest world

[strange lance]

What does that have to do with what I said

[unkempt sleet]

Also like HE happening after what happened in Book 3 i dont see happening at all

[silver vine]

Nicky would never forgive them

Especially after what happened to him

[strange lance]

HE is them forgetting Nickys existence and building cars what

[unkempt sleet]

Me when im Nicky and i make a engineers club with my friends and my friends abandon me and my club to make a social something club then i go missing and they decide to go back to engineers club

[silver vine]

They didn't give a shit about Nicky

[strange lance]

Their whole arc is literally being bad friends and trying to be better yall lack media literacy so much

[safe charm]

Hide and seek was early when they didnt know their full vision yet

[silver vine]

That's the side of the rescue squad

In talking about Nicky's side

He would not want to be with them anymore

[unkempt sleet]

That felt so forced especially in book 3 though

[strange lance]

Well too bad?

Adults living in their houses

[silver vine]

They died after act 3

[unkempt sleet]

#hello-neighbor message im not writing all that again but yea

[silver vine]

Trinity and Enzo died

[strange lance]

Well we don't know if enzo died

(And never will)

[silver vine]

He most prob did

[silver vine]

If Aaron's truly dead, then Enzo shares the same fate

[unkempt sleet]

Also the fact that the Golden Apple Amusement Park was removed and it was a huge part of book 2 and 3 and Park just being there in HE just makes me think they're better off not being the same timeline

[silver vine]

Exactly man

[strange lance]

Again they retconned this. Its been established that its abandoned now. Even in HND they show a abandoned park, not a burned one

Thats just how it is now

That how retcons WORK

[unkempt sleet]

I'm not saying its not retconned, I'm just saying it's a bad retcon if the retconned thing is a big part of 2 books

[strange lance]

Yeah its a bad retcon and ruins those cool moments from the books, but it is what it is

Without that retcon we never would've gotten ANY park content in the games

[silver vine]

Y'know another bad retcon? The house not burning down

[unkempt sleet]

Well and it makes it hard to make a cohesive timeline with books and games

[strange lance]

Idk I like that one personally. It makes the house more ominous. The way its still standing years later

Plus I don't see Aaron as the type to burn down a house

[unkempt sleet]

That's why i think books, games and AS being different timelines works out more well

[unkempt sleet]

If that's the case it was probably like an anger induced accident like Mya's death

[silver vine]

The books also ruined the moment from HN1 where Ted puts up missing posters and cries with the thing watching him

[strange lance]

It is

[silver vine]

Wait what

[safe charm]

Hes the Neighbor

[safe charm]

Bruh

[silver vine]

This guy is called Ted

He's also called Theo

Also called as Teperson

[unkempt sleet]

Ted

[silver vine]

Most importantly, called as THE NEIGHBOR

[unkempt sleet]

Missing Pieces

[silver vine]

Theo getting arrested is one of the most historical moments in the franchise truly

[unkempt sleet]

It's the first book

[silver vine]

I never thought I'd see him behind bars at all

[strange lance]

I just personally don't see how its hard to make the books work with the games when we GOT a game that was retelling the books in a more "complete" form, correcting stuff like the park no longer being demolished. Its so very obvious whats trying to be said its so funny. Also the books in general have tried very hard to work with the games, they even mention in the later book descriptions how they would be important to the recent games (HE and og HN2) and its true they were

But I don't wanna drag this on

So I'll end it there

[steady nest]

This should explain the thing

[unkempt sleet]

"correcting stuff like the park no longer being demolished" what

[strange lance]

Did you play hnd

[unkempt sleet]

Park being demolished was never a thing in Missing Pieces

so HND doesnt cover it

[unkempt sleet]

the whole EarthPro thing starts at book 2

[strange lance]

In the books it literally mentions how the park is flattended theres nothing left

[steady nest]

Also apparently gn2 was already written when bosco bay released

[safe charm]

Wdym

[silver vine]

Earthpro completely wiped away the park and covers it in concrete in book 3

[safe charm]

Proof?

[unkempt sleet]

That's book 3

[safe charm]

Where did they say it was written already

[silver vine]

That's book 3 man....

Yes

[safe charm]

And book 7

[safe charm]

Ohhh

[steady nest]

(This was the qna from bosco bays release)

[safe charm]

Maybe he confused

Them

When he Said this

[steady nest]

Alex moment

[unkempt sleet]

Yea that would make more sense

[silver vine]

So, GN2 happens between HN1 and HN2?

[strange lance]

It does not

[steady nest]

There are cellphones around gn2 so idk

[silver vine]

It's a bit hazy on the timeline

[strange lance]

No comic book fills in the gaps between hn1 and hn2

That have never existed

Yes

[unkempt sleet]

In that scene yea

[steady nest]

Gn2 was absolutely fire

[silver vine]

Guest locked up Ted in guest world

[safe charm]

?

[strange lance]

No?

[silver vine]

As seen in Aloha 1,5

[strange lance]

That was metaphorical

[safe charm]

Thats metaphorical most likely

[strange lance]

It was not literal

[steady nest]

I think it was written by a dude who worked on over the garden wall

Ok so given that gn2 was written when bosco bay released

Can we like

Drop the idea of old lore and new lore

🙏

N

No one?

Ok...

[safe charm]

Unless its outdated no

[silver vine]

Yes please

[steady nest]

https://tenor.com/view/pepe-gif-17998277

[silver vine]

I'm with you man

[strange lance]

Said that wrong, I meant burnt down. Its not burnt in hnd anymore its just abandoned.

[steady nest]

Yo lessgooooo

Hnd?

More like peak hello neighbor game

[strange lance]

More like sadly dead

I wanted season 2 and 3

[steady nest]

True...

Same...

[unkempt sleet]

Well thats true

[silver vine]

I think HND other seasons were supposed to finish the story of the books

[steady nest]

I wanted more levels man

I wanted a day night cycle...

Its truly a tragedy

[silver vine]

Indeed

[unkempt sleet]

But it also means the fire that collapsed the tunnels didnt exist...

[strange lance]

HND was meant to end with nicky opening a final door with a guest key..I wonder what that was for...

[silver vine]

Wait whaa

[unkempt sleet]

Is there any proof to that other than the Guest Key's existence

[steady nest]

Everyone, lets please have a moment of silence for Hello Neighbor: Nicky's Diaries

[strange lance]

😔

[silver vine]

Can someone show me this guest key

[steady nest]

Silence please

[steady nest]

Thank you very much

[silver vine]

Woah

It's guest kid

[unkempt sleet]

?

[steady nest]

It means Nicky's story is not over in act 3

👍

Which is cool because adult nicky is peak

[unkempt sleet]

[strange lance]

Theres probably some leftover phrases in the files relating to when the key was gonna be used but Idk how to access mobile files

Also just by using common sense you can assume this key would be the final one considering the last time Nicky saw Aaron was in hnvr when the guest took him away

[steady nest]

Lore time

[strange lance]

Book 1-3 and then hnvr

Just makes sense

[steady nest]

Yo if hnvr ties to the books then where did the bagger, inventor and scout spawn from

[unkempt sleet]

popped into existence

[steady nest]

"investor" 💀

[strange lance]

They've been popped into existence

They've kinda just always existed now

[steady nest]

Hnvr retconned the books and destroyed nikitas original vision....

Now steel wool is the devil

[strange lance]

Technically SN did first. They were originally random kids and then were changed to all be friends with Nicky

[steady nest]

Shit

Hologryph you sick bastards....

[silver vine]

If it ties to the books, then Nicky most prob did not speak to them after he escaped

I don't think he wouldve even celebrated his escape

Bro got super traumatized

[steady nest]

Nicky in hnvr vs Nicky in as

[silver vine]

Nicky in AS is even more traumatized

He got so traumatized that his eye color changed

[silver vine]

Nono

Yulia told that SN characters were always book characters from the start

[steady nest]

I like to think that ted did nothing to nicky and the guest got into his mind or something

[silver vine]

Most likely

[strange lance]

That doesn't make sense when the alpha kids were literally all random kids

[unkempt sleet]

thats probably the case

[silver vine]

Yes the Alpha kids were random

I'm talking about the kid classes

[unkempt sleet]

"Locks cant keep it out, It gets in your head"

[silver vine]

They weren't random kids

[strange lance]

Well I know that lol

I was talking about the alpha kids in my message

[silver vine]

Yeah some PPL don't even accept that and think Yulia is just straight up lying

[steady nest]

Devil behaviour...

[silver vine]

Yeah basically what she told was that book desc of the kids were given to AS animators who made the pilot designs and the pilot designs were given to hologryph by tB and hologryph made the SN classes

For Some reason, some PPL think that she's just straight up lying to cover up mistakes

[unkempt sleet]

But isn't Maritza's book design was very different in the Nicky Trilogy

[silver vine]

Yeah

[unkempt sleet]

How did that happen

[silver vine]

That's one of the main reasons some PPL think she's lying

[unkempt sleet]

If it happened like you said

[steady nest]

Hn fans moment. If it doesn't make sense at the first glance, then they are obviously being lied to

[silver vine]

But Trinity is accurate to her book 1 desc

She's dark brown with beaded braids

[unkempt sleet]

I'm not saying she's lying but that's a weird situation with Maritza's design

i would want to know the reason for it

[silver vine]

Idk

Animasia prob messed up or smth

I honestly don't know

[silver vine]

That all what she told

[steady nest]

Hologryph obviously confused maritza with bagger

[unkempt sleet]

[strange lance]

I mean they obviously know enzo and maritza are not meant to be white they legit gave enzo a sombrero 😭

I'm surprised they never bothered fixing the skin color

[silver vine]

Maritza is a little browner in the AS

[strange lance]

I guess

At least SW fixed it on her hand model

[silver vine]

I kinda wish Ivan was Russian

Hin having a Russian accent in AS would've been pretty cool

[steady nest]

Ivan with a heavy eastern slavic accent is peak

[astral agate]

When has he been depicted as a Russian?

[unkempt sleet]

Guest is evil

he's not broken or something

[silver vine]

Guest is pure evil

Theo is broken

[safe charm]

Theo is kinda both imo well i wouldnt say puré evil but evil and broken

[shut hill]

He’s just misunderstood 😢 😔 🥹

[tribal talon]

Peterson is broken

If he never lost his wife and daughter he would’ve never turned evil

[devout needle]

Sup @chrome shore

[plush onyx]

The thing is 100% evil

[shell gull]

Not true.

[safe charm]

Well in Aaron trilogy hes pretty nice

To me

[shell gull]

You mean yelling at his Kids for absurd things is Nice?

[safe charm]

Thats nicky

Trilogy mostly

[shell gull]

True.

But Ted was always Psychotic, he was always out to get The Cult.

[safe charm]

Nicky trilogy feels like a different interpitation of him

Sometimes

It feels like they Changed direction to make him more sympathetic

[shell gull]

Well yeah it’s supposed to feel different due to what happened in Aaron’s Trilogy.

[safe charm]

In nicky trilogy its heavily implied he was Always a bad person and weird in the head

In Aaron trilogy hes more of a father with secrets and anger problems lol

Also did you know gn2 was written

By the time gn1 released

[shell gull]

Yeah.

[safe charm]

Im thinking alex might have confused them

But then again gn2 cant be before

Hn2 or old hn2 can it

Its impossible

[shell gull]

No.

GN2 took place after Old HN2.

[narrow rain]

its very obviously took place before because Old HN2 takes place after the town was ravaged by the storm

which occurs partially in GN2

not only that it shows how Ted fully became the guest because in old HN2 ted was the guest

[safe charm]

Maybe gn2 was connected with a Even older version of hn2 then we Think

Idk

Because by alpha 2 guest wasnt the Neighbor right?

[ripe berry]

GN2 Connects to HG ;trol:

[narrow rain]

alpha 2 isnt a real version of the game but during the time of the AI trailer/E3 trailer they were likely pushing away from the guest because thats when alexus started getting involved

so GN2 ties into the story pre-alexus

[safe charm]

Was he meant to switch between forms you Think?

Or just guest full on

[narrow rain]

no

[safe charm]

Still if gn2 was connected with an older hn2 the Neighbor wasnt fully the guest

[narrow rain]

discussing this pre-HN2 release was fun but discussing it now we are talking about a hypothetical game that never existed which always sours my mood

[safe charm]

Cause he got possessed

[narrow rain]

they likely just gave the writers notes of what needs to be conveyed in the books but to just write in their own way

which is why nothing lines up

[safe charm]

Scott Cawthon

Situation moment

Or do you Think guest strangling the Neighbor

Was metaphorical?

[muted moon]

At the end of gn2 his sweater rips, so gn2 is before reset day but after hn2

[strange lance]

in gn2 mayak explodes its after hn2

[safe charm]

Yeah it defenitly is after but Im unsure mayak was ever gonna be in hn2 after 1.5 era

[narrow rain]

mayak isnt even in HN2

[strange lance]

Not now but it was going to be. Gn2 was a continuation of og hn2

Not the hn2 we have now

[narrow rain]

alpha 1 and alpha 1.5 didnt have mayak in them either

[silver vine]

Nono

GN2 was written during HN2 Alpha 1 days

The Neighbor is missing during those days

And this book explains why he's missing

Yes, technically it does fill in the gap between HN1 and very very old HN2

[silver vine]

What I'm thinking is that it's before the old old HN2, the oldest concept of HN2 where Neighbor is missing, town is abandoned, and guest roams free. It makes sense to me

[strange lance]

I wasn't talking about those, also of course they wouldn't have mayak they're small alphas

[strange lance]

while true, its obvious that they changed things as MITH was taken out of the story

along with probably other stuff

to better fit it after hn2 instead of during it

which it undeniably is

its really only like 2 things that make it very clear. Ted is fully possessed and merged with the guest at the end of this story while in hn2 and prior they are separate, mayak explodes which means no more insane weather which is also in hn2 and prior.

also it just makes sense to be after hn2 lmao

still miss him though 😔

he sacrificed himself for the sake of continuity ✊

[silver vine]

[strange lance]

😔

only good mith design

he'd make a great model

purple fits him better than dark blue

[solid dew]

not even wearing socks

that and him being in a crappy run down building in hga1's intro almost makes him seem poor

[muted moon]

hn2a1 story is the pipe to other world story without the pipe to other world

its just everything after the player enters the pipe

[muted moon]

it probably was originally meant to be old old story, but later became old story

im pretty sure alex first mentioned it like a month before a1.5?

[muted moon]

????????

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9a_zMzzgAM please watch this video

this is after the events of hn2 act 1

hn2 alpha 1 isnt canon

its an alpha

[muted moon]

we know?

its not like hn2 alpha 1 is possibly canon or anything

it just isnt

[muted moon]

this

its NOT

ITS NOT CANON

ITS AN ALPHA

hn2 alpha 1 takes place in guest world

not the town

an alternate dimension

the neighbor and quentin got there by going through a pipe large enough to fit an entire car

its not canon

its an alpha

[hollow remnant]

???

[muted moon]

thats a newer version of guest world

[hollow remnant]

since when was hn2 alpha 1 in guest world

[muted moon]

since always

[hollow remnant]

i swear HN2 alpha 1 was just set in a post storm version of the town

[muted moon]

guest world was in a map called testfield alpha 01 base

testfield 01 base is an older version of hn2a1

the hn2a1.5 skybox is called guestworld

they are both guest world

hn2a1 is an extremely old idea for guest world

it does

guest world was in a map called testfield alpha 01 base
testfield 01 base is an older version of hn2a1

yes

thats because one was in early 2020

the other was in 2021

ALPHA 1 ISNT CANON

ITS NOT CANON

ITS NOT

[hollow remnant]

hes knows its not

[muted moon]

hn2a1 is guest world

the files confirm its guest world

YES

whats wrong with it?

[hollow remnant]

yes because the files were made by the developers

developers made the game

idk but it just is i guess

[muted moon]

guest world was in a map called testfield alpha 01 base
testfield 01 base is an older version of hn2a1

the hn2a1.5 skybox is called guestworld

[hollow remnant]

clearly different from current guest world

[muted moon]

yes

[hollow remnant]

wait but how do we know the map name of guest world was it actually in a game or something

[muted moon]

he followed the neighbor through a giant pipe

[hollow remnant]

where is this implied tho

im very confused

[muted moon]

unused logic

[hollow remnant]

oh

[muted moon]

im not making this up lol theres literally code for this

[hollow remnant]

i'd like to see the code

i think

you are taking this a little too seriously

its an old version of guest world

[subtle aspen]

I wanna seasons like in books

[muted moon]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/720318918165659779/1233221505995898941/HelloNeighbor2_2024-04-26_12-56-18.mp4?ex=66bff687&is=66bea507&hm=61555c82cf78bcb692c428e6d1deb80d1b19d9b960157c688305746e4d239c51& heres what the sequence would of looked something like (obviously wrong map and a lot of stuff is missing)

[subtle aspen]

Bad blood 6 episodes or more like I think

[hollow remnant]

what the hell lmao

[muted moon]

hn2a1 is meant to be guest world

hn2a1.5 isnt really

[hollow remnant]

where was this supposed to fit in

[muted moon]

hn2a1.5 is more like a mix between hn2a1 and hn2a2

[hollow remnant]

would it have been like the opening cutscene or something?

[muted moon]

4 cutscenes

[hollow remnant]

oh

[muted moon]

hn2a1.5 literally uses a hn2a2 bg house

[muted moon]

as well as hn2a2 features

like the pinboard

[hollow remnant]

Alpha 2 quentin office appears at the end of alpha 1.5

[muted moon]

yeah

to explain pipe to other world intro: quentin basically was investigating the neighbor in raven brooks, taking photos and stuff, and followed him through the pipe to other world to guest world

[muted moon]

in guest world the events of hn2a1 would happen, but the ending was the fake neighbor ending

[hollow remnant]

why would the neighbor willingly drive into guestworld? is he stupid

[muted moon]

he drove to guestworld and back a few times

and also did stuff around the house

like lawnmowing

and watching tv

[hollow remnant]

oh

[muted moon]

through a weird pipe

[hollow remnant]

is that what all that neighbor rootmotion shit was about

[muted moon]

yes

[hollow remnant]

i just assumed that was early content for the next alpha

[muted moon]

no

it was leftovers

from an early story

[hollow remnant]

when did we learn all this about an early version of alpha 1

[muted moon]

datamining

[hollow remnant]

pipe is big

[muted moon]

green thing is the pipe

[hollow remnant]

thats all really interesting

i never knew that about alpha 1

please do not post

[muted moon]

this is guest world

the guest does whatever it likes in guest world

so yes

the pipe was scrapped ages ago

the pipe was like an early idea

no

you can either get there in your dream or by stumbling into it

with dreaming it you can get out by waking up

when you kinda just get stuck there randomly its harder

up until reset day it looks like he didnt really have any powers outside of guest world

he doesnt have weather powers

he just has shape shifting and some sort of teleportation power

[hollow remnant]

with the exception of the pilot, is there any non alpha/beta media in HN that isn't canon

[muted moon]

no

he doesnt have storm powers

[muted moon]

empathy im pretty sure isnt canon rn

[hollow remnant]

empathy never came out tho

did it

[muted moon]

yeah, but it was meant to be a game

and its still being worked on

[hollow remnant]

still??

[muted moon]

AS guest only has shape shifting im pretty sure

[muted moon]

its not scrapped, its just paused

[hollow remnant]

oh

guest

[muted moon]

guest

not canon

that was the guest in guest world, with lots of powers, and super old

besides, he didnt even kidnap the neighbor

it was a fake

maybe

probably depends where you shot him

real world guest fight would probably go something like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ij2fCvlW-cQ

the guest in hello guest was the neighbor in a costume

[muted moon]

but still strong

i dont think him falling was canon though

he probably would die if he canonically fell down that far

[hollow remnant]

so confused why they didn't just make this the ending for alpha 1 considering it was already finished

[muted moon]

no they didnt

they just animated his falling animations

that doesnt really mean anything

not possession

possession isnt confirmed

and this was hg

[hollow remnant]

the neighbor was literally just the guest

[muted moon]

its literally just falling animations

quentin has them

he can fall the same height and survive

its literally just animations

if he didnt have them

it wouldnt look good when he fell

you dont

it could also be him fighting his bad thoughts

we dont know what actually happened there

no

theres lots of explanations

also

thats not hg

thats a year later

thats him wearing a suit

what?

what do you mean kill the kids

when did he kill kids

what?

when did he kill them with a shovel

maybe

since the guest literally just materialises

id say probably no

probably more metaphorical

like

him fighting his bad thoughts

also pris literally says that it was him in a suit

so even if he WAS possessed, this still is a suit

thats not a shovel though?

thats just him in the suit attacking pris

yes i know

i have the book

what do you mean

it was literally just lightning

pris also was fine

wasnt hurt at all

have you even actually read gn2

its the neighbor

in a suit

pris says so

its shown after they leave the water

it just is

yeah

hes in a suit

its him in a suit

yeah

why not

how does possessing make more sense

yeah

when is it shown

theres nothing hinting to it

its literally him in a suit

why not?

[muted moon]

that makes sense

he didnt die

yes

its metaphorical

he isnt actually hurt

no?

its never shown

all thats shown is bubbles in the water

yeah

if he was being possessed, how could a non-physical creature be hurting him?

sure

so what purpose would the guest have in possessing the neighbor then?

no

the ending confirms it wasnt the guest shape shifting

when the guest walks away from the window you literally see some of the fabric of the neighbors sweater

[muted moon]

ripped off

because one of the characters later says so

direct quote from the book: "There was no raven man. it was just Mr. Peterson in a costume. At least, I'm pretty sure."

not 2 seconds

probably minutes

regina says hes been down there for a while

ok, explain the ripped part of his sweater when the guest walks away from the window

what?

no

she was hanging on a rope

when pris arrives, she says he had been down there for a while

IM NOT TALKING ABIOUT THAT

REGINA

HANGING FROM THE ROPE

ABOVE THE WATER

yes

[muted moon]

also, explain this

how could teds sweater get ripped if its just the guest shape shifting?

its the last page

cant you check?

no

later

the very last one

you see part of the neighbors ripped sweater

yes

that

thats part of the neighbors sweater

how did it get there if its just the guest shape shifting?

this is by their house

why would it be there from the explosion

explanation 1 debunked

[silver vine]

And now he's working on RBO

[muted moon]

hes also working on auditorium

[hollow remnant]

auditorium?

[silver vine]

Ah right

[silver vine]

That server is basically dead now

[muted moon]

the kids survived it

the water probably took some of the impact and heat

plus at the end we literally see a piece of his sweater

so he had to have survived

the entire house survived

its just on fire

[silver vine]

@muted moon what do you actually think happened to the neighbor here

[muted moon]

him fighting his bad thoughts

guest represents his desire to destroy the town and stuff

[silver vine]

Guest is his bad thoughts?

[muted moon]

wouldnt that make sense

[silver vine]

Then how come Pris saw the guest

[muted moon]

because he was wearing a suit

she literally says he was wearing a suit

[silver vine]

Not taking about that

I'm talking about the beginning

[muted moon]

probably him roaming around the town?

[silver vine]

Guest first appears in the mirror, and then appears in front of the car

[silver vine]

Not possible, Ted just drove to the place afterwards

[muted moon]

they crashed their car

they could of been unconcious for a while

[silver vine]

Ok