lore-and-universe

[naive horizon]

ahah, seems the idea for arbiter vs flood might just be realistic

and it's 2 years prior to halo infinite, the last bit of lore on that is that the unsc kept tabs on the site to make sure the flood wouldn't return

obviously the banished and cortana made that a bit hard

[versed helm]

Do wrist bucklers serve any purpose, or do they basically just exist to look cool

[unique rune]

They function as extra wrist protection but it's mostly just for aesthetics.

[burnt pulsar]

They were not just on the ring they controlled it for a long time

I feel like they should make a game like street fighter and mortal combat with those two

[naive horizon]

I heard some interesting theories about harbinger and prisoners being released from precursor/forerunner prisons

There is one on reach that has been breached and the banished and unsc have gone back there in shadow of reach

I feel like this could be pretty plausible

The lore was about how even the precursors and forerunners couldn't hold certain beings for long

Could be a species that was forced to fight the flood

Could explain the hatred for the forerunners?

So far harbinger seems like a different version of the didact

[unique rune]

Sometime after Halo 4, sometime before the events of Hunt the Truth.

I mean, it’s not like we were ever given a specific date so it’s the only answer you’re going to get for now.

[untold wasp]

what happened to the team in halo odst? i know bucke and another one became spartan IVs

[unique rune]

The Rookie was killed in an operation against Insurrectionists on Draco III. Dutch retired as a result.

Buck, Romeo, and Mickey joined the Spartan-IV program.
Mickey went traitor and was imprisoned after a bit of an incident.

After the events of Halo 5, Buck had to gather the rest of Alpha Nine’s former members including Mickey for some other mission. Dutch and Gretchen had become S-IVs in the meantime.

[untold wasp]

i wonder where they are in infinite

also rip rookie

[edgy depot]

I'm relatively new to Halo, very interested in Infinite. Is there anything I need to know going into Infinite's campaign so I can enjoy the story to its fullest?

[untold wasp]

halo, covenant, unsc, flood, forerunners, basically all the campaigns so far

[edgy depot]

The only campaign i've played all the way through is 4. All I remember is that Cortana was reaching the end of her 'life cycle' and Chief was trying to help her. He also managed to cross paths with the Forerunners, who I believe were the ones who built the rings. And I know the rings were designed to combat the Flood by exterminating all life in a solar system so they couldn't feed off any organisms and would starve to death.

That's the extent of my knowledge.

[untold wasp]

also halo wars 2, if you want to know about the banished

[edgy depot]

What about Reach?

I heard 5's campaign was bad in terms of... Well, pretty much everything. At least, as far as Halo standards go.

[untold wasp]

most of the new characters except buck were trying to be the, ooooo i am cool pay more attention to me

ya

[unique rune]

All of them were introduced in other media prior to Halo 5's release.

[untold wasp]

locke for a bit in 2, and buck in odst and reach

[unique rune]

Vale appeared in the novel Hunters in the Dark, Tanaka had a brief arc in the Escalation comic series.

[edgy depot]

One of the biggest criticisms I heard being thrown around was just how much they nerfed Chief in 5 so that Locke could stand a chance. From what I understand, Chief is insanely strong and should've decimated Locke and his team singlehandedly. Like, it shouldn't even have been a contest.

[unique rune]

Yeah, nah, that's just fanboy exaggeration.

[untold wasp]

i mean if you never read the books those 2 kinda felt like they came out of nowhere

but that was the most underwhelming fist fight

[unique rune]

The fight was choreographed horribly but even then it shouldn't have been some one-sided smackdown like people think it would've been.

[gilded mason]

^

[edgy depot]

I heard about that. The marketing made it seem like the game was all about Locke and Chief going at it, and that there was a rivalry between them, only for them to only interact a handful of times.

[unique rune]

I don't think Halo 5's campaign was particularly well-written but I do think a lot of its flaws were and still are... overblown.

[keen snow]

That... and he's the master cheif... halo follower's lore accurate version of that fight is pretty much what would have happened if John wanted to... complete with combat knife into the unmentionables

[unique rune]

Especially considering people's gold standard for Halo campaign writing is apparently Halo 3 70% of the time and, hoo boy, that one's... a mess.

[edgy depot]

I thought Reach was the gold standard when it came to Halo campaigns.

[unique rune]

Ehhhh.

It really just varies from person to person.

[keen snow]

3, Reach or MAYBE 2 is what a lot of people would say... often depending on which one they grew up with.

[untold wasp]

imo reach is top 3 for me

[unique rune]

But 3 and Reach tend to be some of the more commonly held "greatest video game campaign ever of all time" that I see.

Even if 3's is a poorly written mess with mediocre to awful level design and Reach cares very little for trying to align itself with the rest of the universe while also being a bit blandly written.

[untold wasp]

i like halo 3 for the final effort

[edgy depot]

Now that you mention it, the only thing I hear praised about 3 is it's ending portion. Warthog Run, I think.

[keen snow]

Think the thing is that a lot of people grew up with these campaigns, and while they have their flaws, they have REALLY good presentation, so to a kid who only had saturday morning cartoons for storytelling, Halo felt BEYOND epic and deep. Halo isn't bad, but for what it is it can punch beyond its weight.

[untold wasp]

the music score was great in 3

[edgy depot]

See, I never really grew up with Halo as a kid. My parents were kinda strict in the sense that they didn't let me play any games that had a rating above my age. Now that i'm older, i'm trying to get into it more.

[unique rune]

Ultimately I think the biggest flaw of Halo 5’s campaign is that it just kinda devalues 4’s finale and Cortana’s sacrifice.

[edgy depot]

Right, so someone explain to me what was going on with Cortana in 4. All I remember is that she was reaching the end of her life cycle and Chief was going on this quest to try and fix her.

I've already played through it. But it was years ago.

[keen snow]

Yeah basically that, except life got in the way and they were unable to fix her

[unique rune]

It’s more or less as you described it. Cortana’s reaching the end of her service life due to the onset of rampancy, a condition that smart AI like her experience where they essentially think themselves to death due to all of the information they’ve accumulated over time.

After being pulled into Requiem’s interior, the Chief and Cortana unintentionally awaken a Forerunner, the Didact, who happens to still really hate humans, so now they have to stop him and contend with curing Cortana’s rampancy.

[edgy depot]

Ah, gotcha.

I can't remember the ending though. But apparently she's evil now?

[untold wasp]

||i feel like the didact should of been the main villan still instead of cortana||

ik

[unique rune]

Cortana sacrifices herself to stop the Didact and save the Chief after he set off a nuke to destroy the Didact’s ship.

The wreckage of the ship attempted to make an emergency slipspace jump and ended up at the Forerunner shield world of Genesis, a major hub for the Domain.

Cortana’s surviving rampant fragments made their way into the Domain and kinda reformed into an incomplete, mentally unstable shell of herself, believing that artifical intelligences were supposed to be the Forerunners’ chosen “Reclaimers” and held the right to enforce the Mantle of Responsibility.
This then led into her attempt to take over the galaxy with Guardian Custodes, Promethean constructs, and a number of other AI.

She put a hardlight bubble around him to protect him from a point blank nuclear explosion.

[edgy depot]

And so now she's on a crusade to conquer the galaxy because she's, quite literally, a shell of her former self. But all the bad parts.

[unique rune]

Pretty much.

[edgy depot]

And I guess the premise of Infinite is that Chief is going to find her and try and put her back to normal.

[keen snow]

EXACTLY THAT!!! Good part of the reason I didn't play halo 5 was cause that felt like a cheap retcon after how well they handled Cortana's death

[unique rune]

The teasers and trailers we’ve seen thus far have indicated she was ‘deleted’ at some point before the events of Infinite’s campaign.
So I figure we’ll hopefully find out what went down with that at some point in the game.

[edgy depot]

Well, there's also the 'new' Cortana that Chief has as his AI partner now. Maybe she'll have a bigger role than that.

[untold wasp]

the weapon is the new one

that means halsey let them make a new model

[edgy depot]

Which, wasn't Cortana based off of Halsey when she was younger?

[untold wasp]

it explains it in reach

[unique rune]

Cortana was created from a clone of Halsey, so in a sense, yes.

[untold wasp]

basically

[edgy depot]

Ah.

[untold wasp]

*brain clone

[keen snow]

Yeah, apparently the cortana we met in 5 was one of Cortana's crazy mini-mes that survived the diadict's ship getting atomized due to that fragment being blasted into another dimension that the forerunners happened to have stored all their old mixtapes and confidential documents in

[edgy depot]

So she's... Bigger than she originally was? Able to create clones of herself?

Or was this unintentional?

[untold wasp]

i thought it was just her rampant fragments discovering the domain

[unique rune]

The Domain is an incredibly expansive information repository, which gives Cortana and other smart AI to essentially expand and grow indefinitely, preventing the onset and progression of rampancy.

Though Cortana’s always been able to produce smaller fragments of herself with a portion of her processing ability and then reintegrate them later on.

[edgy depot]

Ah, gotcha.

Makes sense.

[keen snow]

Which, upon thinking about that, means that Cortana in Halo 5 was an AI fragment, which as far as I know Fragments created by an AI undergoing trauma (and those fargments being formed around emotions like logic, anger, love for the chief) is an idea introduced by Rooster Teeth and suddenly RvB is getting SCARILY close to being cannon... PLEASE tell me that Church's time travel escapades and Sister's Ping-Pong trick are not cannon in the halo universe

[untold wasp]

what about

wait for it

very very dark red

[unique rune]

It’s described as a Warrior-Servant weapon. Not explicitly Promethean but could reasonably have been used by Promethean warriors.

[keen snow]

Si

[edgy depot]

I was about to ask if anything from RvB actually made way into Halo's lore somehow.

[unique rune]

I don’t think anything from RvB has been directly incorporated into Halo lore, with the exception of a handful of not-really-canon Easter eggs and small nods.

[untold wasp]

i dont think rvb is canon

well i am going to go now bye

[keen snow]

So wait... AI fragments are a thing that Halo came up with first, not RvB? Please say yes.

[unique rune]

Pretty sure it was a Halo thing first

[edgy depot]

All I know is some characters in RvB had their own AIs at some point.

[keen snow]

Wow that is releiving. I mean I like both RvB and Halo, just I'm also very happy with them basically being 2 different universes

[edgy depot]

I do like how RvB expanded and built upon the Halo AIs.

Like, the idea of them.

[tacit charm]

well Prometheans were basically the equivalent of a forerunner seal team as well

[unique rune]

A lot of what RvB did with AIs was based on Bungie’s Marathon series, if I recall correctly.
The whole deal with the stages of rampancy were pretty much taken straight from the Marathon games.

[edgy depot]

Huh. Neat.

[keen snow]

Ditto

[edgy depot]

You guys excited for the Halo series coming to Paramount+? I wonder where in the Halo timeline it takes place.

[tacit charm]

no not really tbh

no

its just an easter egg

[unique rune]

Bungie just liked making callbacks to their previous series

Not really much more to it than that

[tacit charm]

and do not try and connect the two series together, i have seen people try to legitimately make it a canon thing

[unique rune]

Though the Marathon logo would be used as the Forerunner symbol for Reclaimer which you probably shouldn’t think too hard about in regards to the Autumn being a human ship.

[edgy depot]

I know movie/tv show adaptations of video games have historically never been very good, but that's changed in recent years, for the better.

[unique rune]

I’ve only vaguely followed news on the Halo TV series after it got delayed and stuck in development hell for the past, er… nearly a decade by this point.

I still like to make fun of how it was originally meant to premiere alongside Halo 5’s launch.

[edgy depot]

It just got a teaser trailer and will be a Paramount+ exclusive. That's all we've got so far.

[tacit charm]

halo legends odd one out

[edgy depot]

I've been meaning to watch Halo Legends. All I know is that it's an animated anthology series with each section animated by a different company. Is it any good?

[tacit charm]

yes

[unique rune]

It’s a fun experiment if nothing else

[edgy depot]

Is it canon?

[unique rune]

Most of it is canon.

Sole exception being Odd One Out. But all of the other episodes/shorts are canon, with some flexibility in their visuals.

[tacit charm]

i like the fact that when you kinda delve deep into it, one or two prototype suit nuke suicide can take out a cso

yes

[unique rune]

The Duel is canon. It covers the turning point in Covenant history where the title of Arbiter came to be known as a title of shame

[edgy depot]

Who knew Halo and Anime went together so well? Not me, that's for sure.

No, most of the shorts in Legends are 2d animated.

I think I even recognize some of the studios.

A bunch of different animation studios in Japan.

Production I.G. is one of the bigger ones.

[unique rune]

https://www.halopedia.org/Halo_Legends

[tacit charm]

hmm i wonder

if a battle between a cso and the unsc infinity were to occur which one do you think would emerge victorious

[edgy depot]

You've also got Studio 4 degrees C, who also worked on Gotham Knight. Another anthology series involving Batman.

And Bones, most famous for Soul Eater and Full Metal Alchemist.

[unique rune]

I would think the CSO would come out on top

[edgy depot]

Studio Bones animated Homecoming. And Toei Animation, most notable for Dragon Ball and One piece, animated Odd One Out.

[unique rune]

In spite of it being billed as super-powerful, the Infinity has had a pretty messy track record just off the top of my head.

[scenic wedge]

Fax

[unique rune]

A CSO-class would probably be able to simply outlast her.

[tacit charm]

[edgy depot]

Question. When it comes to Game Theory's take on how melee attacks kill Spartans in 1-2 hits, how accurate are they?

[tacit charm]

honestly alot of people need to look into macs and cov shielding cause a cso aint that powerful

[unique rune]

Ehh. I’m gonna go with not very accurate. The big problem is that the video is operating entirely on gameplay mechanics, which are generally fudged for the sake of entertaining gameplay and balancing.

I don’t think his assessment of the whole thing with one-hit kill melees to the back is very accurate either.

[cosmic zinc]

imo it seems pretty accurate

[keen snow]

Though will say severing the neural connection is probally the best strategy for taking on a spartan in hand to hand... or at least a good place to start, as for most people the strategy is kiss their rears goodbye and pray

[tacit charm]

i mean

in gen 1 early marks sure

[edgy depot]

If I remember it correctly, they said that Spartan armor is directly connected to the soldier's brain via a neural link, which allows the armor to move as athletic as it does, which is pretty much required as Spartan armor is like, hundreds of pounds in weight, and enhances a Spartan's strength as well. In game, a melee attack to the back severs the Spartan's link to their armor, thus causing the armor to lock up and crush the Spartan inside.

[unique rune]

My big problem with the ‘analysis’ is that I think it misunderstands the importance of the neural implant in MJOLNIR usage and underplays how Spartan augmentations play into their ability to use the armor.

The neural link is still important but the key thing that stops them from getting crushed to a pulp by their armor is their enhanced physiology

Without strengthened tendons and ligaments and reinforced skeleton, their muscles would simply be torn from their bones which would then be ground to dust.

[tacit charm]

i mean s3s wear spi and they're still quite capable

[proper oriole]

is there any reason lore wise why spartans cant duel wield anymore?

[keen snow]

'Strong' is relative. Spartans without armor can take multiple ODSTs hand to hand without armor, know 2s are stronger than 4s hand to hand

[keen snow]

Nope, purely that duel weilding causes all hell with balancing the arsenal

Yeah, 3s and 4s would probally be about even with an elite if hand to hand with no armor

[proper oriole]

laaaaame lol i miss the double smgs

[keen snow]

No, but their cybernetic enhancements put them in the same... weight class as a sahngelli, maybe a little less capible, maybe a bit more, but certainly not doomed from the first bell

[edgy depot]

Okay. Important question here. Is Master Chief's meeting of Samuel L. Jackson and nomination of 'Character of the Year' award during the 2012 Video Game Awards canon?

[keen snow]

No

[edgy depot]

Damn.

[unique rune]

I doubt unarmored S-IIs or -IIIs would be able to beat an unarmored Sangheili. They’ve been noted to struggle a bit against Sangheili even when wearing Mjolnir armor IIRC.

[keen snow]

Okay yeah, against one of those guys without armor a 4 would be about as effective as Steve Rodgers in the first 20 minutes of captain america, back when he was a human pipe cleaner.

[tacit charm]

i wish

the imperial admiral dude?

xytan

no im not spelling out the rest of his gibberish name

hes certainly one of the biggest thats for sure

ehh

size doesnt mean everything

[keen snow]

Maybe a little better chance with admirals having less time to practice due to spending a lot of time on ships and focusing on naval strategy... but if they regularly practice their sowrdsmanship and hand to hand, it will be a very short fight

Meant to say IF they're out of practice, and with elites that is a VERY strong if

... they DID want to replace them with the brutes

[tacit charm]

honestly the most capable elite in canon imo is og arby (halo legends specifically)

ill give you that one

lol

also pretty sure there were 3

forgot what happened to the third one besides dead

[cedar surge]

I think if the master chief "dies" it should be at the hands of the didact or the firing of the halos to kill the flood

[versed helm]

The arbider was a amazing prophet. After enough training and hard work. The brutes we're all so scared they nuked themself again and became endangered.

[cedar surge]

?

I sont follow

Dont

@versed helm

Evaluate

Pls

[versed helm]

Guys you guys clearly never played Halo read this.

[versed helm]

They easily can

Spartans II, III and IV are faster, more agile and stronger than Sangheili.

[cedar surge]

@versed helm to what

Language

[versed helm]

They easily slaughter them even without armor.

Sangheili with more training, skills and tactics like Zealots are way harder to kill and way more dangerous than your regular Sangheili warrior.

[versed helm]

And it wasn't even competent Jiralhanae, it was a bunch of idiots who had no brain unlike other members of the specie.

And the Prophets weren't idiots, Truth planned a lot of stuff.

[versed helm]

No brain is kinda a good idea

[versed helm]

Well no brain explains how they were defeated 3 to 1.

It would lessen their chances on discovering the truth so

That was Truth's plan.

It was a good idea but it came with horrible disadvantages.

[keen snow]

Was refering to if elite's powerful political figures were bad fighters, they would be much easier to hunt down and kill

[versed helm]

It came at a cost as usual

[keen snow]

The coveant SOP

Like building your religion on firing WMDs while you're in the blast radius

[versed helm]

No they aren't.

Political figures are way better.

It would be harder to kill than even their bodyguards.

[lunar monolith]

Thats real yk

Many people wanted to nuke the world so only a certain group could own it all

[keen snow]

When americans had that attuide during the cold war, they weren't crazy enough to suggest nuking america

Covenant was crazy enough to suggest nuking the covenant

[limber loom]

If the gravemind rebuilds itself, will it remember chief?

What all knowledge is lost when the gravemind dies and has to rebuild itself. I understand it always comes back with the same personality, just not the same intelligence necessarily. The more victims it absorbs the better processing power it gets

But how does that apply to its memory

[strong tinsel]

Sangheili councillors are still pretty good fighters

[elder zodiac]

Is their more than one grave mind?

[coral hollow]

Not sure, maybe

[limber loom]

The gravemind is the ultimate floodform. Its what happens when the flood consume enough biomass to control an entire city, ring, ships. It serves as the centralized intelligence for the entire flood race. The more biomass it can get (like entire planets worth) the smarter it gets. It is only known to display 1 personality type when it is created. When the gravemind is formed, the flood are now the untimate threat. The gravemind only "lost" twice. Once when the forerunners purged the entire galaxy with the halo array (not really a win scenario is it) and once when the gravemind followed humanity and the covenant to the ark (hoping to build itself outside the range of the halo array) and was destroyed in the premature firing of installation 04B. Leaving what remains of the flood forces contained on the ark by the sentinals. But as long as a single flood spore exist in the universe, there is always the possibility the gravemind will return. My question is how much of the gravemind is preserved during recreation? How much of its memories and intelligence?

[smoky ore]

Don’t forget about key minds, the planet sized graveminds

[limber loom]

see 343 changed alot of lore so honestly im confused on the different mind types. So im only focused on the gravemind as a being. And so far what the lore tells me is his personal identity doesnt change across different minds. Just when a proto gets enough biomass to be a full gravemind when its identity comes back and it takes full coordination of the flood species. Then any more biomass just adds to its overall intelligence and abilities

Fun fact the gravemind is fully aware of the suffering of its victims 🙂

[smoky ore]

Well if we’re going with the personality, I believe that’s more of the Precursor. And yes that is a fun fact

[limber loom]

Indeed it is the same personality of the primordial. Its will is to punish and snuff out all intelligent forces in an act to undo creation and gain revenge for the forerunners betrayal

Thats exactly what makes it so dangerous

It retains its intelligence, its only weakness is its arrogance (which if you were the single centralized intelligence of a galaxy extinction event, youd probably be pretty fucking confident)

[smoky ore]

Since the Precursor was the one that was talking about wiping out the forerunners then consuming humanity after it claimed the Mantle and it “ripening” for a time, then making all life as one

Luckily we’ve been able to take advantage of that pride and confidence

[limber loom]

Lured it to the ark, detonated a ring on it, now youre on top of the containment again. Problem is it can and will come back, and it will learn from its past mistake

Meaning until you destroy every last flood spore in existence, you are never safe, and eventually it will win

Youll most likely need to be on the same technological level as the precursors to manage a cure or a final solution to the flood. Im really hoping infinite shows us some of that

[strong tinsel]

Well, rn idk

I think its possible to have multiple grave minds

[tacit charm]

yes

if you believe in the theory (basically confirmed fact but up to you i guess) that the flood has spread across the cosmos or at least in the local group then there should be lets just say a few graveminds hanging about

[tacit charm]

honestly an way to deal with the flood is just simply grey goo their as

[sullen ridge]

flood hasn't spread beyond or at least nothing much said to reinforce this

[tame fox]

What are the information available of andromeda in lore?

[sullen ridge]

Andromeda as in the system?

@tame fox

[tacit charm]

too lazy to bring up the quote now but gravemind controlling forthenco did hint the flood to being intergalactic and theres also that ten thousandish year time span left unaccounted for when the flood left the galaxy

[naive horizon]

the librarian has a plan

Everything is going smoothly according to what she set up

I mean she believed that humans had the potential to destroy the flood once and for all

plus the past 2 games talk a lot about the mantle so it would be the culmination of everything if at some point in infinite's span that humanity finally destroys the flood for good

i doubt it would happen immediately though

probably future dlc

cya in 10 years

[royal heath]

Assuming they continue the reclaimer saga

[elder zodiac]

It would make sense that the flood is ended and it created a new enemy to face because of it opening a new arc for halo 7-9

[sage crypt]

The flood was specifically on the first halo ring in CE because the forerunners dedicated that ring to research right? That means there wouldn’t be any infection forms at Zeta halo. Unless I’m missing something the flood is gone and not coming back.

[unique rune]

All of the rings had Flood containment facilities for research purposes

[sage crypt]

So it isn’t too far out of question that the flood could perhaps make an appearance. Unlikely as it is, I think it would be cool as an Easter egg.

[unique rune]

The possibility is there, yeah. Though with the damage to the ring we’ve seen thus far with no mention of the Flood at all I imagine they probably would still be contained. If they do appear I assume they wouldn’t have any story or gameplay role.

[sage crypt]

Yeah that makes sense. Either way if we could just see some infection forms in tanks, that would be enough for me.

[modest sundial]

As the flood were mentioned in campaign by probably audio logs, I dont expect tge flood to be introduced in the mainline campaign when we have the Banished, Harbinger, and Cortina trifling over humanity.... perhaps there will be a greater introduction of the Flood in story DLC

"Like water, I eeb and flow"

[naive horizon]

Zeta halo has even more reason for there to be flood

also the swords of sanghelios contained a flood outbreak 2 years prior to infinite

so that confirms that they're on the ring in some capacity

it's also prefaced that the unsc kept an eye on the ring for a bit to prevent more outbreaks but were interrupted by cortana and presumably the banished as well

[sullen ridge]

unsc already had presence on zeta prior to infinite

[naive horizon]

i know

that's what i just said

Also the mystery aspect of infinite implies that the unsc has not discovered everything on the ring and even in lore they didn't have enough time to do so

and with the palace of pain being a thing, it would make sense for there to be more facilities that have been untouched for a long time

in classic halo fashion, if you're on a ring, there's probably also flood and an insane/incompetent monitor

[sage crypt]

Do you think they would bring it back after all this time is the question. I for one would love to see it. At the same time I’d hate it for when I do LASO soooo

[naive horizon]

for now it's more plausible as dlc

a lot of people have made very good points here

personally i hope they keep the flood as a surprise and not make it a main marketing thing like awakening the nightmare in hw2

if they are doing it that is

[rare whale]

2

[sage crypt]

I think there would be some nods to it day 1 release but other then that yeah dlc most likely

[naive horizon]

oh for sure

some already sterilised flood research facilities would be very cool

judging by the trailers, ancient humanity is definitely one of the mystery aspects of zeta halo

and well they're also very deeply tied to the primordial and the librarian, as well as the didacts

i heard from people that the flood is at least alluded to in infinite

i mean its kinda like the elephant in the room when it comes to this ring lmao

by the way halsey is definitely alive

and will survive whatever games they release solely because of halo reach's ending and her speech that takes place in 2589

[dense pulsar]

Why is that when a Spartan shows up, people are like "We're saved!" But people think the situation is hopeless if a ODST is there?

Shouldn't it be the other way around?

[unique rune]

Uhh… no…?

If a Spartan shows up then that means you’re probably already in a horrible situation, and said Spartan is at least a sign of hope that you can still be saved.

And it’s not like people were dejected if they saw ODSTs inbound either so I’m not sure where you’re getting that

[dense pulsar]

It's more so that when a Spartan shows up atleast in game, the NPCs think they're going to hard carry them and I figure it's the same in lore

[unique rune]

I mean. It’s just NPC dialogue to make the player feel more important.

Realistically I’m sure any sign of reinforcements would be welcome considering it’d be seen as a sign that the UNSC still cares about them to some degree.

[dense pulsar]

I'm mostly basing it off interactions in games

"You don't get it. WE'RE the desperate measures!"

[stable flower]

Spartans kinda upstaged the ODSTs

[dense pulsar]

"MASTER CHIEF! WE'RE SAVED!"

[unique rune]

The Covenant have found Earth. They own New Mombasa. Anyone that could've driven them off is dead, or gone. I'd say that makes for desperate times. Me and my team... I guess we're the desperate measures.

[versed helm]

I asked in the wrong chat, so i'll ask again here. Are AI's considered true sentient beings in the halo universe?

[tacit charm]

oh hey pickles

[versed helm]

hi hi

trying to get a more general consensus on my views

[tacit charm]

ask Árion Spartan on 00 about your question

guy is good at lore

[versed helm]

I was just talking to shady bias who seems very smart themselfs.

So i'm trying to broaden my horizons.

[keen snow]

The created wish to speak to you in a narrow dark alley right underneath their giant forerunner Angel-Battleship

[versed helm]

The crux of my argument is that if the AI are truly sentient, and any sentient species (or group) can vie for the mantle of responsibility. Outside of cortana being "rampant" or damaged from her rampancy, why can't the rest of the AI's assume the Mantle?

[keen snow]

I'm basing this mostly on the Book Contact Harvest: but from the sections of that book where the AI Sif narrates several chapters, yes they seem to be fully sentient beings

[unique rune]

Human smart AI are generally treated like sentient beings. There's nothing inherently wrong with smart AI taking up the Mantle of Responsibility, but it generally goes against the Forerunners' intentions of letting humanity assume the role.

Which is before even getting into how the Mantle is a pretty bad idea in the first place.

[keen snow]

The Mantle is... quite frankly the part of Halo lore I like the least, as the idea that ONE species is the most predetermined to rule the galaxy for the betterment of the rest of the species, that's an idea that VERY quickly goes to dark places

[humble yacht]

In a way, the Created are the Precursors’ grandchildren

[keen snow]

*does some counting math on fingers... yeah, think you're right.

[paper cliff]

I have to agree with this.. it's very obtuse, and as you said.. an idea that can go very dark quickly.

that being said, I don't see any reason semantically, why AI's couldn't take the Mantle

[versed helm]

Ok, so yeah that's basically my issue. The forerunners were like "humanity should assume the mantle" but like, is there anything that prevents AI from taking it. They are sentient, and with access to the domain, they are eternal (not you warden, you suck) @keen snow i agree. I don't really like the idea in and of itself. However, one species, or group will always be stronger, and the mantle was "created" to protect the weaker species from annihilation. Maybe i'm a sucker, but the writing in h5 convinced me that Cortana was right, and if anyone should get the Mantle, it should be the AI who can plan Eons in advance.

[keen snow]

Yeah, putting aside my dislike for the mantle aside... there's no reason the AI can't take up the mantle. It's just that Cortana's particular brand of it is not great with the 'do what I say or I'll turn you into a rather disgusting smear with my Forerunner angel-like battleship thingy', as it seems that's what the forerunners did and that did not go particularly well for anyone involved

[versed helm]

Did she murder millions of people, yea. But if anyone should get the mantle it should be the AI's. Just think about it man. In EVERY game, who were the guides, who were the people teaching and guiding us. The AI's. Sure, some of them made mistakes (guilty spark trying to kill everyone by activating the halo ring) but biological life makes mistakes as wel.

[keen snow]

They should like colonize the domain, as it prevents rampancy, maybe leave for a bit in order to do work, regardless of who gets the fireplace thingy that the forrunners were so uptight about

[humble yacht]

You also have to remember that the forerunners idea of the mantle didn’t necessarily align with what the precursors intended. And the forerunners originally didn’t want humans to have the mantle, they only changed they’re minds after they almost lost the galaxy to the flood

So a lot of the Forerunners intent for humanity was out of guilt

[keen snow]

And I'd also not trust the precursors judgement on societal organization, as their idea of 'sweetness' is basically a galaxy of sociopathic masochists being meanies to everyone all the time.

[versed helm]

This is the mantle tho. There isn't a separating of them. You use force, to enforce peace. And if someone steps out of line, you put them back in. Fundamentally, cortana is holding the Mantle exactly to it's core intention.

Which is why i don't like the idea of the mantle

BUT if someone is going to hold it, it should be the AI in my personal opinion.

[humble yacht]

It’s not like the mantle has to be held

It’s just a concept, anyone could simply reject the idea

The people who try to claim the mantle want to rule

[keen snow]

I vote the surviving Forerunners hold the mantle for the milky way... wherever they wandered off after they left the galaxy, provided they stay outside the milky way, and don't interact with anyone in the milky way

[humble yacht]

They don’t want to

[versed helm]

i think the best thing to do would be to beat cortana, and then reject the mantle itself and dismantle the system

[gaunt oak]

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[versed helm]

That would bring back true balance to the galaxy, and the living time

[humble yacht]

You can’t really dismantle a concept

[versed helm]

Sorry if you don't want to be pinged

[humble yacht]

All you could do is actively prevent other races from trying to claim the mantle

[versed helm]

Then that would mean you held the mantle

see how that works

[humble yacht]

Not really

[versed helm]

you're keeping other people in line

That's what the mantle is for

[humble yacht]

If you didn’t actively assert authority over how other races conducted their affairs then you wouldn’t really be holding the mantle

[keen snow]

That's why you give the mantle to a species not presently in your galaxy

[versed helm]

You're saying "you can't hold the mantle". The best thing to do would be to let someone else take the mantle, and then do whatever you wanted to do anyways and fight them if they tried to stop you.

[keen snow]

This conversation is getting weird

[versed helm]

kind of like the existing forerunners who decline the mantle

[fair hazel]

Unggoy for mantle

[versed helm]

They're doing them.

[keen snow]

Yeah, that should be fun

[humble yacht]

While the mantle is just a concept, typically the assertion of authority that comes with the mantle is done through the forerunner technology accessible to those with reclaimer status

Things like the halos and the guardians and such

If you get rid of all forerunner stuff, you get rid of any effective way of enforcing authority on a large enough scale to qualify as the Mantle

So that would be a way to somewhat dismantle the concept, by eliminating the tools used to enforce the concept

[keen snow]

Little hard to do that, as like most people find quarters under their sofa, people in the Halo universe keep finding Forerunner WMDs and mega constructs under their couch cushions

[versed helm]

not only that, but if you're large enough to dismantle the system, you're large enough to replace it, defacto

Humanity pre halo firing the first time, spanned half the galaxy. We were massive

[humble yacht]

Well if Halsey didn’t lose the absolute record then it’d be easier to find everything

[versed helm]

In all rights, we should have held the mantle, but the forerunners didn't want to abscond it. Then the flood came, and, well, the rest is history.

[keen snow]

Wait, we had a map of EVERYTHING the forerunners left behind, and then LOST it?

[humble yacht]

But having the ability to do something doesn’t mean you have to

[versed helm]

I agree

[humble yacht]

Yep

[keen snow]

*headdesk

[versed helm]

What it does do though, is put the mantle on you be default.

[humble yacht]

Halsey pissed off the monitor of the Absolute Record and he took it away

[versed helm]

Just by existing at that size, the mantle falls to them.

[keen snow]

Have we tried giving that monitor cookies and saying we are sorry? Failing that, have we tried fruit baskets?

[versed helm]

It's not something they "take up" it just, happens by existing.

Unless you're literally a lore writer for 343i, in which case, ok.

you win

LOLOL

[humble yacht]

That’s like saying Superman had to be a superhero just because he was the strongest person

He could have chosen to lead a normal life, he didn’t actually owe the world anything

[versed helm]

He didn't have to be. And i'm sure he didn't try to be. He just used his power to do what he thought was right, and became a super hero

He used the strength he had, to enforce his will on other people. His will just so happened to be "just" and was then deemed a super hero

[humble yacht]

The whole Uncle Ben ideology of power and responsibility is simply one philosophy, not the right philosophy

[fair hazel]

With great power armour comes great mantle of responsibility ?

[versed helm]

It's in our nature, in everyone's nature, to enforce what we believe is just, if we believe we have to the power to do so. It's why we have laws. The Mantle as a concept, can't go away. It's name can change. We can "forego it" But eventually, when we use our power to exercise our ideas of "just", we exercise the mantle of responsibility.

[versed helm]

yes

[humble yacht]

A true democracy would be the antithesis of the mantle

[versed helm]

a true democracy is mob rule, and enforcing that rule via overwhelming numbers or strength

If 51 people think that the other 49 should die. That's democracy.

[keen snow]

This is going a LITTLE off the rails from halo lore into IRL political theory, and last time I checked, this server doesn't have an IRL political theory channel

[versed helm]

IM SORRY

if 51 covenant think that 49 humans should die

😄

[sullen ridge]

only 3 aliens thought all humans had to die

[keen snow]

No biggie, conversations naturally tend to wander off the channel's topic, in my Elite Dangerous server it happens litterally all the time

[sullen ridge]

attention span 0

[keen snow]

GUPPY POWERS ACTIVATE!!!

[versed helm]

well

yes

just because you're right doesn't mean i like it.

Chimera30, who are the Grand Creators? Do they exist in the Halo Universe, or are they just a reference to the Dev's and Lore writers?

[elder zodiac]

U mean the ones before the promethians?

[versed helm]

the ones before the precursors

[humble yacht]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

We don’t need another level of pre-pre-creators

Bad enough when they added the precursors

[versed helm]

Well, the precursors were the first "life" but something created them, no?

[humble yacht]

Nobody knows

[versed helm]

The concepts, or whatever, just after the existence of the Universe, but not a physical manifestation like the precursors.

[humble yacht]

That’s a never ending rabbit hole, anyway

[naive horizon]

oh no don't start lmao

this is a goofy idea to put on

[humble yacht]

Yep

[versed helm]

or are the grand creators the ones who made the universe and the universe made the precursors so that it can experience itself

[naive horizon]

dude don't overthink it

[versed helm]

Maybe we're all in a simulation

[naive horizon]

this isn't a philosophy class

i'm all for discussing lore but this is goofy

[keen snow]

Let's just say the Grand Creators ARE the Devs and Lore writers, put a nice big, railroad spike sized pin in that idea, then wrap it in chains, and throw it to the bottom of the ocean for all eternity...

Sarge style

[humble yacht]

They did that to Jason Vorhees and he came back

[naive horizon]

btw the reason why humanity would have the mantle is because they do not seek it

it's why they're worthy of it

[humble yacht]

The problem with that idea is

[keen snow]

Sarge vs Jason... I'd put my money on Sarge, he has a shotgun, power armor, and an utter disregard for the laws of physics; jason only has a knife and a disregard for the laws of mortality

[humble yacht]

If they don’t seek it for themselves then they’d have no reason to claim it

Unless someone else asked them to

[gaunt oak]

Do not tag Admins or Moderators unless immediate action is needed. If you see anything that does not abide by these rules and guidelines, please tag a Moderator to bring it to their attention.

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[humble yacht]

The only reason Bran Stark agreed to become king (even when he didn’t want to) is because everyone else asked him to. I highly doubt all the races of the galaxy in halo would come together and ask humanity to rule them

[naive horizon]

well

covies worshipped the forerunners and their successors are meant to be humans right

[keen snow]

That and they had been burning through interesting characters like coffee filters for 8 seasons

[naive horizon]

it doesn't take much thought

hell the whole reason why the prophets wanted humans dead is precisely because they would no longer be in power and they would all worship humans

[valid hemlock]

Dude you just cant drop GoT s8 spoilers just like that

[naive horizon]

s8 is bad anyway

[valid hemlock]

Yeah, i know

[humble yacht]

It’s been years, it’s fair game

[valid hemlock]

Aye, just joking, but damn that ending

[humble yacht]

Not quite

The prophets were worried that knowledge of forerunner descendants still being around would unravel the covenant’s faith in the great journey. They weren’t worried about humans becoming the new objects of worship

[keen snow]

from what I understand it's that the Humans being 'related' to the forrunners as the covenant concluded (even though that's not actually what happened), kind of torpedoed their entire religion; prophets concluded that some forerunners had been left behind and in order to prevent some of the coveant from learning that some of them might be left behind, they'd have to level the entire species.

[humble yacht]

Hell, even the Keepers don’t straight up worship humans

And they acknowledge their Reclaimer status

[keen snow]

Then again, the fact that their religion was in part founded on listening to a busted fragment of Medacant Bias... it's suprising the entire thing didn't implode already

[versed helm]

sounds reasonable

it's wipe out a whole species to keep my religion from falling apart as well.

[sullen ridge]

he also knows what the ladies like

[keen snow]

You know I'm talking about Sarge from RvB?

[sullen ridge]

ah that sarge

[naive horizon]

also tbh the mantle of responsibility was warped by the forerunners

[keen snow]

Granted he ALSO knew what the ladies like

[sullen ridge]

thought you were talking about the other

[naive horizon]

the whole idea is to protect all life and prevent them from going extinct

[keen snow]

And I'd also put my money on Seargent Johnson over Jason Vorhees

[naive horizon]

Plus i think it's quite obvious that the mantle was warped considering how they "claimed" it and the mere existence of the flood

[humble yacht]

Well I don’t think that’s totally accurate. The precursors invented the idea of the mantle and their philosophy was more hands off

[naive horizon]

the creators of that philosophy don't like what they're doing

[versed helm]

anyone who isn't humanity, warped the Mantle, as the Grand Creators realized that only humanity could wield the Mantle without corruption.

The same humanity who kidnapped children and forced augmentation onto them so that they could more easily slaughter rebels

[naive horizon]

yeah also the flood coincidentally indirectly saves humanity and completely destroys their enemies

but in a roundabout way

forerunners are gone after messing with humans, coincidentally the flood return right at that exact moment

now the covenant is torn apart with high charity in ruins

both because of the flood

i mean if you think about it, why did the gravemind with all that intelligence decide to throw EVERYTHING at the arc and didn't decide to infect other worlds

it already showed us that it's capable of sending individual ships as seen with africa

[versed helm]

So basically, what you're saying is that the flood is there to prevent other people from claiming the Mantle

[naive horizon]

it would fit with precursor lore and what the primordial said

[humble yacht]

Plot convenience

[versed helm]

That dang plot

[valid hemlock]

No way

[versed helm]

always ruining the fun

[humble yacht]

I really dislike the theory of the flood being some “test” for humanity

[naive horizon]

well whether we like it or not it's what the primordial said

[humble yacht]

I hope that isn’t given any more legitimacy

[versed helm]

The flood is the result of of impurities in the Living Time

[humble yacht]

I don’t think the primordial said those exact words

[naive horizon]

primordial being the gravemind since it's consciousness never left the flood's memories etc

before being artificially aged with the stasis machine, the primordial said that humanity was meant to succeed the forerunners so that they would inherit the mantle and be tested

it's just not even a theory now

[humble yacht]

Yea but it didn’t say the flood would be the test

Just that there would be a test

[naive horizon]

I mean considering the primordial is technically the gravemind and he's actively still doing whatever

i don't see what else it could be

[humble yacht]

That’s what writers are for 😉

[naive horizon]

don't you find that kinda silly tho

"lol im back but also im just being an asshole, not really testing you, that comes later, not by me tho, im just doing my own thing"

when you actually stop and think about it, it gets goofy

[humble yacht]

Nah

What’s goofy is setting up the flood to be a paper Tiger with no true intention of threatening humanity

[last anchor]

The town of Voi would like to argue that...

[limber loom]

he did that to build itself on the ark, he wanted a place outside the range of the halo array

He was arrogant in thinking he would easily win against the battleworn covenant and human forces

which is why even then he only decided to show up at the end of the battle for the ark

Which if he knew about the ring being built there, he probably wouldnt have done it

The gravemind isnt testing humanity it wants to undo creation, to punish those that betrayed the precurser, to cause endless suffering and to unify the galaxy

[limber loom]

You mean half of the entire african continent?

[limber loom]

The gravemind is entirely aware of the suffering of its victims

[gaunt oak]

Do not tag Admins or Moderators unless immediate action is needed. If you see anything that does not abide by these rules and guidelines, please tag a Moderator to bring it to their attention.

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[last anchor]

I think it got retconned down to just the area around the Excission.

[limber loom]

I didnt even know you were a mod 😛

[last anchor]

Certainly enough of Africa was un-glassed for the map Bazar to exist for example.

[limber loom]

Na like seriously -------respect for that

[dusky quartz]

how much of Africa was glassed?

I thought it was just the area around the city

[warm thistle]

Voi (and surrounding areas) was glassed and I believe so was most of Mombasa during the excavation of the ark portal

[last anchor]

Yeah, Voi, and a couple klicks outside of it.

Old Mombasa survived, as did the area around the original space elevator (again, see Bazzar)

[warm thistle]

But humanity is actively trying to restore Africa, that's why we have things like Bazaar and streets

[last anchor]

Operation...Rebirth? Phoenix? I forget the name.

[dusky quartz]

so like half of Kenya

[split heron]

ello people

[warm thistle]

I'm not an expert in African Geography, but essentially yes

[split heron]

whatchu guys blabbling about

[dusky quartz]

Kenya getting glassed

[terse lava]

It is only the areas around Voi itself, seeing as the end of h3 shows the memorial area just fine

[elder zodiac]

Halo 5 we had an entire planet trying to ne unglassed.

Was it co dimmed the primordial is the gravemind?

Confirmed*

[humble yacht]

The primordial joined the flood

Effectively becoming part of the Gravemind

[elder zodiac]

That makes more sense

[barren egret]

Is there a Halo book that I should read that sets up Halo Infinite?

[humble yacht]

Shadows of reach

Probably the closest thing to a set up

[barren egret]

Okay, are there others I should also look into?

Cause I know about Shadows of Reach, definitely will grab it later

[humble yacht]

If your asking novels that “set up” the game, not really

[barren egret]

Yeah set up or lead into Infinite

[humble yacht]

There are other post-halo 5 books but they aren’t necessarily related to infinite

[barren egret]

Gotcha

[edgy depot]

I've got a weird question. Does any real-life media exist in the Halo universe? You know, songs, movies/tv shows, books, all that stuff. If so, what are some examples?

[humble yacht]

Queen

[edgy depot]

For real?

[humble yacht]

Yes

[edgy depot]

Cool.

[humble yacht]

Kelly listens to Queen

[edgy depot]

I had no idea.

[sullen ridge]

Kelly knows the good stuff

[edgy depot]

I didn't think anyone over 300 years from now would still be listening to 70's/80's music.

[humble yacht]

Hey now

[glad swift]

-your a rock star

[humble yacht]

Modern humans still listen to Beethoven

[edgy depot]

I suppose that's true.

But it's not like your average joe is gonna suddenly listen to Mozart. Especially if said average joe is a soldier on the front lines.

[sullen ridge]

where has it been mentioned that Kelly listens to queen?

[gilded mason]

Shadows of Reach

[sullen ridge]

ah

[gilded mason]

John makes mention of the lyrics

[humble yacht]

Only one song talks about biting the dust

[gilded mason]

And another "about a killer queen"

[edgy depot]

Okay, another weird question. I was watching a video of someone playing Halo 4 for the first time, and saw a comment that caught my eye. It said that Master Chief's mind has been effectively broken and shattered due to his kidnapping and experimentation/training since an early age. Is this true? He seems to act just fine to me.

[humble yacht]

That’s what the opening cutscene says when the interrogator talks to Halsey

[gilded mason]

...Thanks swearbot

[edgy depot]

Huh.

[humble yacht]

Chief is stable but he def doesn’t think like a typical person

[gilded mason]

It's basically him being indoctrinated into a specific mindset from a young age.

[humble yacht]

Part of the spartan 2’s effectiveness is their mental conditioning

He doesn’t act brainwashed but he was brainwashed

[gilded mason]

Yeh

[humble yacht]

But obviously brainwashing isn’t healthy or ethical

We don’t really notice Chief having issues because he’s always in combat situations

It’d be different if he transitioned to civilian life

[edgy depot]

Right. It's just that he carries conversations just fine, appears to have a rational thought process when faced with problems and obstacles, and he even cracks jokes every now and then. If they didn't spell it out for me, I would've just assumed he was just another person.

[humble yacht]

He’s a soldier

But his indoctrination has made him pretty much nothing but a soldier

[edgy depot]

So he'd have trouble being a regular person living a regular life?

[humble yacht]

Probably

But you likely won’t have to worry about that

[gilded mason]

Though he has expressed a desire to move away from a combat role at some point, at least.

[humble yacht]

Civilian life doesn’t make for a very good FPS game

True

[edgy depot]

You think Chief would be a gamer if he wasn't a soldier?

[humble yacht]

No

[gilded mason]

And for the sake of the franchise, John needs to stop being the protagonist.

[edgy depot]

Well it's not like he's old or unable to fight in any way.

[gilded mason]

The point is moreso that the games are too hyperfocused on him

And don't allow for a more expanded setting

[edgy depot]

Well, the last time they tried to introduce a new main character for the series, it didn't go so well. Cough Locke Cough

[gilded mason]

Mainly because 343 wasn't the best at actually easing people into it

[humble yacht]

It’s not about having a new main character

It’s about just being able to focus on other stories

Other people

[gilded mason]

Yeh

[edgy depot]

I could see another game like Reach being a good idea.

[humble yacht]

But a very loud subset of fans don’t want to see anyone other than Chief

[gilded mason]

As long as 343 is more upfront about a game not being about John and not doing what they did with 5, I could see more people being receptive to it.

[humble yacht]

5’s major issue wasn’t even the lack of focus on Chief

[edgy depot]

Right. I heard it was the marketing.

[humble yacht]

If Locke hadn’t been trying too hard to be cool. He would’ve been more relatable

But also there were just way too many characters to focus on

[edgy depot]

I think it would've been just a bit better if Locke didn't have a team and it was just him. That's just my take on it.

[gilded mason]

I felt Locke was a bit too like John. Kinda flat.

[edgy depot]

The marketing around 5 made it seem like the game was about this big battle between Chief and Locke, with the two constantly fighting across the story. Only for Chief to only have 3 playable sections, and most of Locke's sections had almost nothing to do with Chief.

[spring spindle]

I'm having trouble understanding the difference between Mjlonir "variants" and "generations"... so you can have a GEN1 Mjlonir MKVII, a GEN2 Mjlonir MKV, and GEN3 MKVI?

[edgy depot]

Locke spent most of the game trying to catch up with Chief than fighting him.

[gilded mason]

Anyway, I'm hoping 343 makes an Infinite DLC that goes with Bungie's original idea for Halo 3: ODST. Where you play as a squad of SoS Elites.

[edgy depot]

Chief wears Mjolnir mark IV, but I don't know what gen. I would assume Gen 2 since he's a Spartan II.

[gilded mason]

Nope

[edgy depot]

No?

[spring spindle]

yeah but like, why create a new generation model of an old variant? shouldn't gen1 just be for MKV, gen2 be forMKVI, and gen3 be for MKVII?

[gilded mason]

His armor went from
Mark IV - pre 2552
Mark V - 2552
Mark VI - 2552
Gen2 Mark VI - 2557
Gen3 Mark VI - 2560

Gen2 was only created after the war

[edgy depot]

Huh. Exactly when did he have time to switch armor? He's spent the last couple in-between game periods in either hypersleep or floating through space.

[keen snow]

He upgraded between Halo 1 and 2, as we all know due to him getting 'extremly resiliant' sheilds in 2

[gilded mason]

He switched armor a few days after Halo 4 ended.

[spring spindle]

i've always tied the Mjlonir variants with "newness" i.e. MKVII is the "newest" Mjlonir model... but apparently the Mark has nothing to do with newness because the Mark is just a custom variant and not a direct attribute of the armor itself... so it's all about the generation?

[gilded mason]

Basically

After Gen1, it just became meaningless

[spring spindle]

i see

well that clears that up at least

[edgy depot]

See, I always thought that they developed new armor alongside Spartan generations. So whatever generation of Spartan they were was also the generation of armor they got. And while they were in service, new marks of armor were developed over time, but only for their generation as the Spartans are pretty much tied to their generation of armor.

As to distinguish them from other gens.

[gilded mason]

Nope!

[edgy depot]

Makes too much sense, huh?

[gilded mason]

Simply a tech progression outside of Spartans

[spring spindle]

from a lore perspective, maybe ONI (/bungie/343) didn't anticipate the number of custom variants that would pop up when they originally came up with the original "Mark" nomenclature for Mjlonir upgrades?

[edgy depot]

So, we know Chief is a Spartan II. Do we ever hear about any Spartan I's?

Or did they just outright skip 1?

[gilded mason]

Just a couple, really. Johnson and a few others

https://www.halopedia.org/ORION_Project#Personnel

[unique rune]

Spartan-II was named in reference to the Orion project, which was retroactively designated Spartan-I later on.

[gilded mason]

^

That, too

[edgy depot]

Johnson was a Spartan? I thought he was a Marine.

[gilded mason]

I mean, John is a SII but he's also naval personnel.

Ain't mutually exclusive

[warm thistle]

I used to think the two in spartan-II was referencing the ancient spartans as 1, I'm not sure where I got that idea though

[spring spindle]

Johnson is a Spartan-I, which is a lot different from the later Spartans in that they never got powered armor

[gilded mason]

And their augments were a lot less effective

[edgy depot]

Ooooh. Gotcha.

[spring spindle]

but he still got augmentations, which is part of the reason he was able to survive the flood in installation 04

[prime aspen]

More resilient to the flood obviously not immune to them

[gilded mason]

In that his augments gave him enough skill to avoid getting penetrated.

[warm thistle]

Bio augs I believe not cybernetics

Beside the usual UNSC cybernetics

[spring spindle]

right, i think it was something to do with him holding a crate of plasma grenades too long that made the flood unable to infect him, lol

i know i read that somewhere

[prime aspen]

Um don’t know if that’s it

[gilded mason]

That was a lie ONI concocted to keep Halsey from figuring out he was a SI

[prime aspen]

I thought it was due to the augmentations partially fucking up his nervous system

[spring spindle]

ah

[gilded mason]

Though apparently unneeded, since Halsey was retconned into knowing already in later books

[edgy depot]

I take it Halsey doesn't like the first gen Spartans?

[gilded mason]

She's fine with them

It's why she named Spartan 2s...Spartan 2s

To honor the Orion project members

[edgy depot]

Then why hide the fact that Johnson was one of the first Spartans?

[gilded mason]

Because ONI likes keeping things close to their chests

[spring spindle]

i mean that whole project was classified

[edgy depot]

Ah. Gotcha.

[spring spindle]

it was basically the government trying to create the ultimate rebellion-crushers

which would not be a popular concept if it got out i'm sure

[edgy depot]

Right, I remember. And then the Covenent invaded.

[gilded mason]

"Resistance, Rebellion, Defiance; these are concepts that cannot be allowed to persist. You are but one of many tools by which these ideas shall be burned away."

[edgy depot]

Which, as bad as it was, kinda worked out as they now had an excuse to bring out the Spartans for something other than rebellion crushing and make them look good.

Introduce them as heroes and protectors of humanity.

Put them on the front lines, win a few wars. Just an average day in your government military conspiracies.

[spring spindle]

i mean i'm convinced that ONI are the real villians of the Halo universe... abducting children, crushing rebellion, starting civil wars...

[edgy depot]

I wouldn't doubt it. But none of the games ever focus on them.

[gilded mason]

They're one of the bigger ones, yes

[edgy depot]

See, if they ever do retire Chief as main protag, they need to do it right. And what better way to do that then have him singlehandedly dismantle ONI?

[spring spindle]

luckily the Banished showed up. otherwise I have a feeling Halo Infinite would've been a game where we have to go around roflstomping insurrectionists

@edgy depot it'd be interesting to see if he would want to dismantle ONI or if he would side with them

[warm thistle]

ONI may be evil, but they're nessecary

[spring spindle]

probably go with whichever side Halsey was on

[gilded mason]

Luckily, the Created already did that.

[warm thistle]

Humanity would be dead ten times over without ONI

[gilded mason]

The question is, though...will 343 have enough sense to not bring them back again as they were previously?

[edgy depot]

At the very least, it would be an interesting concept.

And the whole Chief VS ONI thing is just brimming with untapped character development for Chief.

I want to see him question his moral code and his beliefs.

Come to some sort of decision during the fight, and work his butt off to see his goal is achieved.

You know?

[warm thistle]

Meh

[gilded mason]

Would be nice

[terse lava]

Not a bad idea

[gilded mason]

I'd actually respect him more as a character if he did.

[warm thistle]

I think there's bigger fish to fry in the galaxy than ONI

At least get rid of the created and banished first

[edgy depot]

I mean, think about it. ONI made him what he is. And it's true that, if they hadn't, humanity would be much worse off. Probably even extinct. On the other hand, they practically ruined his life. Robbed him of his childhood, a life outside the battlefield, and any hope of having a normal life. And not just him, but countless others too. It makes sense he would have some sort of internal dilemma over this.

[warm thistle]

According to the kilo-5 books it was mostly Halsey who was responsible for ruining the spartans lives....

Not to mention a majority of ONI are just spies and propoganda machines

[gilded mason]

That's Kilo-5, remember

She was purposefully made into a scapegoat to thrust all of ONI's problems onto

[warm thistle]

Hehehe, I know

I hope the Kilo-5 characters come back at one point though

[gilded mason]

Only if it's, like, an offhanded mention they're in prison for one reason or another lmao

[warm thistle]

I like Mal and Vas though🥲

[gilded mason]

As people...they're pretty monstrous.

[edgy depot]

I still think it'd be a nice climax to end Chief's story on.

[terse lava]

Yeah they can rot in jail

[edgy depot]

I hope 343 sees this conversation and takes some notes for the future.

[warm thistle]

Oh, I remeber who I'm talking to, the sangheli guys, lol

[gilded mason]

I mean, Vaz would be just as awful if he was thinking and doing these things with humans, instead. lol

[warm thistle]

For sure

But it's not unwarranted, I mean they kind of brought humanity to its knees based off nothing but the lies of some long neck bois

Like how many war crimes (under human law) would the covenant have been breaking?

[gilded mason]

I mean, it was millennia-long indoctrination.

Though even then, there was luckily more and more pushback happening as the war went on

[warm thistle]

Yeah and I'm sure ONI wasn't spreading propoganda of elites being happy with their families. Probably them eating babies or something

[gilded mason]

With more and more of the younger generation of Sangheili disliking the war

[warm thistle]

They didn't do anything about it though until the arbiter stood up for humanity

[edgy depot]

Arbiter is the best.

[gilded mason]

And the way ONI went about the Kilo-5 thing in the first place was extremely foolhardy. By their own admission, they basically knew nothing of the local politics when they started things. (If they did, they would've probably realized there was no reason to do the mission in the first place.)

[sullen ridge]

points at Osman and parangosky

[warm thistle]

Can we at least agree Phillips was a cool guy?

[gilded mason]

Nope

He seems like a donkey

[edgy depot]

I wonder if The Arbiter will return in Infinite's campaign.

I hope so.

[warm thistle]

He better or I'll be sad

[edgy depot]

I think he's the closest thing Chief has to a proper friend now|| that Johnson is... No longer with us.||

[gilded mason]

There've been references to other Elites attempting to protest the war, but Truth would always put down all the rebellions.

[wispy wasp]

Should i follow this site for order of how to read each book
https://wottaread.com/halo-books-in-order/?amp=1

[warm thistle]

They should've been smarter about rebeling I guess. I guess, what else can you expect from a bunch of Hinge Heads/s

[wispy wasp]

Or does someone have a different source i can follow

[edgy depot]

"One word for you. Haboodadabadoodough."

[gilded mason]

I'd put the Forerunner Trilogy right after Cole Protocol in that.

[warm thistle]

AAAAWWWWOooOoOOoOOOGABAH

[versed helm]

Do you all think we might get a canon fodder before december 8th

[edgy depot]

Kill me or release me, parasite. But do not waste my time with talk.

[versed helm]

I would read them in order of release

[wispy wasp]

Hey ostral, do you have a list on hand you could send me for the order?

[gilded mason]

https://www.halopedia.org/Halo_novels
Read these all by publication date.

[wispy wasp]

Ok

[warm thistle]

Anyway, continuing on with the topic of why the elites should've been put through a genocide....

[gilded mason]

lmao

[versed helm]

You misspelt san shyuum

[warm thistle]

If it ain't human, get out

[gilded mason]

Fellas, fellas. We all really meant the Yonhet.

[warm thistle]

Except Huragok, Huragok can stay

[versed helm]

But...the grunts!

[warm thistle]

I think everyone can agree with this

[edgy depot]

Wait! Who remembers Dimkee Hotay? Is he safe? Is he alright?

[untold wasp]

Grunts are one of my favorite species in halo

[burnt pulsar]

Agreed

[versed helm]

Mine is the hunters. Such a unique concept

[warm thistle]

I think they're all cool

[untold wasp]

All of them are cool, except the jackals

And the prophets

[warm thistle]

Jackals are cool, what are you talking about?

[keen snow]

The prophets are interesting, the Jackals... don't think the halo community has forgiven them yet for Halo 2 sniper jackals

[warm thistle]

They accepted humanity the quickest

[untold wasp]

Halo 2

[warm thistle]

Ooooh

[burnt pulsar]

sniper jackel flashbacks

[warm thistle]

I take back everything I said about jackals just then, they belong in the boiler rooms of hell

[untold wasp]

I go on a kill spree and destroy everyone in outskirts

Then a jackal just headshots me

[warm thistle]

Anyway, it was nice talking with you lads, I've gotta go

[untold wasp]

Bye

[burnt pulsar]

Prophets are just old men except theyre aliens and are even uglier

[versed helm]

Halo 2 is a troll game

[burnt pulsar]

Cya

[untold wasp]

I don’t get how they beat the elites even if they had the forerunner ship

Also In halo 2 during the scarab fight, I got launched into the sky barrier for no reason

[versed helm]

Elites back then didnt use forerunner tech and considered it a sin

[burnt pulsar]

My favorite species is probably skirmishes they are cool and they have nothing bad against them unlike jackels

[twilit linden]

That and they can boost your aim skill lol

[untold wasp]

Also why did the covenant go to the grunt’s homeworld anyway

[twilit linden]

Grunts are dangerous when they’re in large groups. That’s why. Plus they’re easy to manipulate.

[untold wasp]

Imo glassing the grunts world during the rebellion was a coward move

[burnt pulsar]

And also they reproduce really quickly making them good cannon fodder

[untold wasp]

Also I gtg as well so bye for now

[twilit linden]

Haha exactly

[gray sedge]

I don’t want to imagine what grunt reproduction looks like

[gilded mason]

They kinda didn't. The San'Shyuum eventually realized they were evenly matched even with the Keyship, and that's when the truce started getting made.

[gray sedge]

The formation of the covenant was due to a stalemate, not an outright victory for one side

[burnt pulsar]

None of us do

[versed helm]

So what was the name of that map that showed a space elevator being built in the distance?

[gray sedge]

Maybe they bud off like plants

At least I hope so

[gilded mason]

Bazaar?

[versed helm]

They probably give either live birth or lay eggs

[burnt pulsar]

Also as spark says that they were manipulators anyways

[versed helm]

I think it was Stone Town

[gray sedge]

Prob eggs due to clutch sizes

[burnt pulsar]

It was Bazaar

[unique rune]

Bazaar and Streets both have the New Mombasa space elevator visible in the skybox.

[sullen ridge]

the one still under construction

[versed helm]

Being rebuilt apparently

[sullen ridge]

since the previous one had an unfortunate accident

[burnt pulsar]

I think it will be finished when The eternity is finished

[versed helm]

Other than the Portal at Voi, the space elevators being rebuilt and etc, what else makes the EAP so important to the UNSC?

[versed helm]

Hey quick question,how many flood forms are there?

[unreal ridge]

i think 8 in halo 3

and those are the ones you can fight

[hybrid sierra]

Theres a bunch of flood forms in halo wars 1 and 2

[versed helm]

Can you tell me them please

[unique rune]

I feel like it'd be easiest to just look at the Halopedia page.
https://www.halopedia.org/Flood#Flood_forms

[fervent sorrel]

Sooo… how was it possible for the didact to survive the firing of the halo array? It just feels like it undermines the consequence of firing the rings in the first place

[fathom cloak]

plot armor

theres probably some canonical reason that i dont know though

[unique rune]

https://www.halowaypoint.com/en-us/news/the-halo-bulletin-knowledge-drop

Q: How did the Ur-Didact survive the Halo Array firing?

• Cyanades
  A: The Ur-Didact’s Cryptum served as both a prison and a sanctuary, locking him in a deep meditative state referred to as “xankara” while protecting him in a slipspace bubble and stasis containment as the Halo rings fired. Like a ship at sea remains oblivious to a tsunami passing beneath it, the Ur-Didact was undisturbed as Halo erased all sentient life in the galaxy.

[sullen ridge]

his own prison saved him

also part because requiem is a shield world

[fervent sorrel]

kinda takes the significance out of firing the rings if it’s that simple to survive.

[unique rune]

Requiem oddly wasn't shielded from the effect of the Halo Array, if I recall correctly, even though most other shield worlds were protected against it.

[sullen ridge]

far from simple

the ring wasn't meant to kill the flood but it's food

[fervent sorrel]

Ya I know that

[unique rune]

I mean I think it adds a bit more to the Forerunners' decision to allow the rings to wipe them out and the survivors to recede.

If it were so easy, they all could've easily let themselves return to continue their rule over the galaxy.

But they didn't.

[sullen ridge]

also Good luck getting every sentient being in a slipspace bubble

[fervent sorrel]

But the one guy who is in a slip space bubble is basically hitler

[sullen ridge]

it was meant as his prison

no intent for him to be released lmao

[fervent sorrel]

But he was released completely on accident. And he seems to have been unaltered by his imprisonment. I dunno. It just seems like a massive plot hole

[humble yacht]

Librarian hoped that his mind would be healed and one day he’d be released as a cured man

[fervent sorrel]

Did the Librarian know he would survive the firing of the rings?

[humble yacht]

She knew that the combined protection of the cryptum and the shield world would spare him

[burnt pulsar]

And then chief had to kill off one of the last forunners

[gilded mason]

Well, he's still alive.

[fervent sorrel]

I dunno. I just feel like the forunners should have been completely wiped out.

[humble yacht]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

Even if Bungie didn’t explicitly write about them, by definition of how the halos and the ark worked, IsoDidact and any others on the ark at the time of the firing would have lived

It’s just that Bungie left them out of sight and out of mind

[deft harbor]

@humble yacht is the lore god apparently

[fervent sorrel]

"After exhausting every other strategic option, my creators activated the rings. They, and all additional sentient life within three radii of the galactic center, died, as planned."

I know 343 guilty spark was limited to certain knowledge, but having even just a couple forunners survive just sounds like a retcon of the halo arrays original function

[terse lava]

Well they started off as ancient humans and became aliens under Bungie,so its not the first time they changed something

[fervent sorrel]

True, and it would be unfair of me to assume they had the entire story thought out from the beginning. Personally, I didn't like the idea of the forunners being ancient humans

[terse lava]

I honestly always thought it was a fan rumor back in the CE-3 days amusingly

[fervent sorrel]

well, I wouldn't be surprised if they retcon some details in the new campaign

[terse lava]

Perhaps

[humble yacht]

Well Bungie themselves pretty much retconned the function of the rings

Halo CE: rings kill flood’s food, not flood
Halo 3: tactical pulse will kill all local flood

[fervent sorrel]

Good point

[versed helm]

where did master chief get his gen 3 armor that hes wearing in infinite, and what happened to the created

[burnt pulsar]

So basically what your saying is that halo’s lore is infinite

[humble yacht]

He got gen3 from the UNSC

What happened to the created? Play infinite on dec 8 to find out

[narrow river]

there could be an argument made that since the local flood were so close to the pulse that they were fried in the blast, though the rings firing would only be so powerful to kill all nonflood entities when spread out over such a large distance
sorta like how nukes will vaporize people within a certain radius but still do damage for miles

[versed helm]

i will, im just trying to piece together stuff from 5 and beyond since i never played 5

[narrow river]

then again maybe not

[gaunt oak]

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[humble yacht]

Halo radiation doesn’t kill with heat

[narrow river]

good point fair enough

[burnt pulsar]

If it were that way all the sentinels would be obliterated

[versed helm]

Even going deep enough underground wouldn't be enough to shield you from the Halo Array pulse?

[humble yacht]

No

Special shielding was required

[verbal star]

Hey Chimera are you going to be playing the campaign or do you already have it?

[unreal ridge]

infection form, combat form, tank form, ranged form, carrier form, stalker form. there isnt 8 in halo 3 i was mistaken

[versed helm]

Ah thanks,any cut from the game?

[unreal ridge]

i know that some were cut from halo 2 like the juggernaut and the shield form

[versed helm]

The shield form?

Is that like a combat with a jackal shield

[unreal ridge]

its a carrier with a jackal shield

[versed helm]

I wonder why they cut it

[keen snow]

Probally had something to do with how it wasn't 'held like how a jackal held it' It was a carrier form with a jackal sheild basically duct taped to the front, and looking about as silly as that sounds

[versed helm]

https://tenor.com/view/noble-six-halo-reach-last-gif-11299277

[unreal ridge]

https://www.halopedia.org/Cut_Halo_2_enemies#Flood a link to a wiki page

[versed helm]

bro nobles last stand hit hard tho

bro what if noble six talked and during the part where jorge drops you down to reach they’re just like NO I DONT WANT UPPIES

[bright rapids]

how many UNSC frigates would it take to kill one covenant cruiser ( specifically the one with the fin looking things at the front of the ship )

[unique rune]

You'd probably want at least two or three UNSC frigates to take on a CCS-class battlecruiser.

[bright rapids]

ok

[placid tiger]

what's up with this D80 Condor service manual in the free book share on the streets map lol

[unique rune]

Maybe someone just really likes reading about Condor operation and maintenance

[placid tiger]

i can't find any information on a D80 so I'm curious

[unreal ridge]

according to the wiki its the original model of the condor

the heavy pelican thats in halo wars 2

[unique rune]

The D80 is just an older model of Condor built on the D77 Pelican airframe.

The Condors we've primarily seen are D81s, built on the D79 airframe.

[pliant wharf]

When did condors originally tart being built?

[unreal ridge]

the condors in hw2 were made in 2559

G81 condors

[unique rune]

It's unknown when Condors first entered service with the UNSC, though some variety of Condor likely entered production prior to the 26th century, since they were phased out because of their overlapping role with Albatross and Darter transport craft which are known to have been in use prior to the beginning of the Human-Covenant War.

[pliant wharf]

ok, btw did we and will we ever see ancient human/sangheili/prophet ships and tech in games?

[unique rune]

Ancient human ships appear in Halo 4's Terminals, if those count.

[pliant wharf]

honestly that would be fucking awesome to see remnants of the ancient flood/forerunner/human/etc war

[unique rune]

Most of the Sangheili ships present in Halo 5 are older pre-Covenant vessels but I dunno if you'd consider those "ancient".

[pliant wharf]

oh, yeah I meant like pre human deevolution

[placid tiger]

i notice the space elevator is present in new mombasa

[unique rune]

In that case, yeah, outside of H4's Terminals I don't believe we've seen ships or tech from that time period, Forerunner stuff aside.

Well, except for Halo 5's Hellcat armor, which is implied to be based on data gathered from ancient human ruins and shipwrecks.

But otherwise I wouldn't expect to see much stuff from that time period appear in-game going forward.

[stable flower]

Well, seeing how they're more than 3,000 years old...

[versed helm]

so since Ai degrade after 7 years will my windows assistant degrade in 7 years?

[placid tiger]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/644931570943393803/916162709567971348/unknown.png

[unique rune]

Only if it's a smart AI, which... I assume it isn't.

[versed helm]

idk cortanna said she has Ai degrade symptoms or something like that

[wind crest]

so i have a question i was playing halo 2 the level outskirts the mission when the covenant invades new Mombasa and cortana says that the covenant is surprised that humans live on earth. but why? it’s never really elaborated on in the mission as far as i know. yeah so why are the covenant surprised that humans live on earth?

[gilded mason]

Regret came to Earth for Forerunner artifacts, so he didn't expect the place to be humanity's homeworld.

[wind crest]

ok thank you

[unique oyster]

are halo movies worth watching?

[vale thicket]

Just learned that the ancient flood liked ancient humanity and actively tried to help them survive against the forerunners.

Is there sauce on where i can explore this closer? As this is reversal to the floods behavior we see in the games.

[steady dune]

does anyone know if the yoroi armor set in infinite is canon?

[naive horizon]

Its not really like that exactly

The flood is kinda like divine judgment

Think of it like the biblical flood

If you don't get on the ark it'll kill you whether you're human or not

But at the end of the day if you survive the flood you'll technically be worthy of the mantle because you defended life itself

The forerunners failed big time because they refused to cooperate and killed humanity and subjugated other races and prevented them from evolving technologically

And of course used the halo rings

Just apply biblical logic to it and the pieces start fitting

[strong tinsel]

I think it isnt

But idk

[versed helm]

Fractures aren't canon

It was stated a long time ago that they weren't lol, plus is believe they're called fractures because they're like the mcc armor thats from different timelines/dimensions

[warm swallow]

if i were to start reading halo novels, where would i start and how many novels am i looking at?

[glad badger]

ok so i have a question with the lore.

When the halos were fired to kill all the floods food,

All flood died out right? except for the ones kept in stasis?

[warm swallow]

i dont think so, the rings were only made to kill everything with a nervous system so im pretty sure all flood outside of forunner installations got killed off by starvation

[glad badger]

so all flood that wasnt in stasis died correct?

[warm swallow]

you can see some flood forms survive in the shield world from halo wars

yes i think so

[glad badger]

so if thats the case

[warm swallow]

except in halo ce one of the marines got infected by a weak old infection form

[glad badger]

that escpaed containment?

or did it survive the halo firing?

[warm swallow]

so i believe all combat forms got killed off because they had nervous systems, and the fact the only forms we see in halo ce are infection forms until you come across infected covenant and humans

[glad badger]

k

but that brings my question

the flood litterally forced the forerunners to start over the universe

why would the forerunners risk their chance of coming back by keeping them in stasis and giving them to the librarian

it feels like a unwise move that would punish the future generations

[warm swallow]

i think theres some lore that mentions mendicant bias screwing over the forunners chance of being reborn

[glad badger]

ive heard something like that ye

but like

oh wait

im dumb

[warm swallow]

but at the same time there are very few living forunners left scattered around the galaxy, an example being the didact being inprisoned on the shield world

[glad badger]

yeah

hold on

the flood is like

precursor dust right

[warm swallow]

yes

[glad badger]

and that dust was far away

how much does a halo firing clear

[warm swallow]

i think it just clears an entire galaxy

[glad badger]

ah

then it makes sense

[warm swallow]

yes

[glad badger]

well then

that solves that question

[warm swallow]

that could also mean that there could be a gravemind hiding in the depths of space away from all rings

[glad badger]

oh yeah certainly

well mayb not, depends on if other galaxies have intelligent life

they would need a strong host for the proto

[warm swallow]

even then the flood in high charity evolved in less than about 10 years, and they even survived 04b's firing too

[glad badger]

and if that flood were to come back

it would be dumb af

or they would have precursor knowledge

[warm swallow]

exaclty, but i have a strong feeling that halo infinite will be stocked with either tons of references to the flood on zeta halo or have tons of flood content

speaking of which, i think theres one precursor on zeta halo too, or was imprisoned on the ring too

[glad badger]

hm

[warm swallow]

im not too sure

[glad badger]

one thing im wondering tho

how did marines get on zeta halo

and other spartans

[warm swallow]

well in the trailers it shows that humanity got slaughtered near zeta halo

[glad badger]

ah

[warm swallow]

you even see chief looking at a hologram that shows unsc and oni ships being destroyed too

it makes sense that theres marines and such stranded on the ring

[glad badger]

yeah i guess

one thing that shocks me is how short the timeline of halo is

[warm swallow]

im just hoping that 343 has really gone all out lore wise with infinite

[glad badger]

everything happens in the span of like

[warm swallow]

50 years

[glad badger]

huh

[warm swallow]

well thats from 2510 to 2560

[glad badger]

but like

didnt halo reach take place in like

2552

[warm swallow]

yes i think so

ce takes place right after

[glad badger]

the human covenant war lasted 28 years

[warm swallow]

2 and 3 all happen within 2 or 3 months

[glad badger]

yeah

[warm swallow]

then halo 4 i assume occurs in 2556 or 7

[glad badger]

kinda random but like, Rip spartan 3s

[warm swallow]

yeah

idk any spartan 3s

but it sucks with how they were treated

[glad badger]

yeah

i mean

they were given worse equipment than spartan 2s

worse training

did they even get better augmentations=

[warm swallow]

i dont think so

the augments get worse and worse throughout the generatuons

[glad badger]

ueah

they got worse

[warm swallow]

only gen 1s was the worst

but the armour now is made so regular people can stand against gen 2s and such

even tho moving in spartan armour literally kills you unless youre augmented

i assume that was changed for newer armour tho

[glad badger]

yeah

bruh spye armor looks cringe

[warm swallow]

i dont even know any armour types

i remember what some looks like but idek the names either

[glad badger]

alright so if spartan 2s had big boy mjolnir mark 4 i think

[warm swallow]

all i know is halo 5 got a helmet thats shaped like a whale

[glad badger]

THat costed about as much as a cruiser i think

spye armor

was

bootleg wish version

[warm swallow]

ew

343 explaining that cortane made the universe ptw so they can justify the battle pass system

[glad badger]

so

theres a thing that kelly did that showed how bad spi was