Do you guys what the UNSC nova bomb is
#lore-and-universe
blazing dragon
west silo
The biggest under used plot breaker in halo history
gilded mason
under used
🤔
west silo
And all it takes to make is 7 high level nukes and one very strong box
It's only been used and mentioned like 2 times
3 actually
gilded mason
I consider that overused. 😋
warm dust
Well how often does the UNSC need to destroy a whole planet?
west silo
It's can also be used as the perfect fleet killer
It's range is pretty insane
Unfortunately any ship that delivers is basically dead
versed helm
NOVA is basically the UNSC's kamikaze attack
slim thorn
Actually it came from Reach itself where the nuke on Reach was also already run out. If not, Noble Team may not resort on using Savannah's slipspace drive.
nimble quiver
isn't first strike and fall of reach not really cannon anymore?
there were so many contradictions between those books and Halo Reach
main hill
Both had a bunch of updated versions of them to fix inconsistencies.
Well fall of reach did
Idk about first strike
versed helm
isn't first strike and fall of reach not really cannon anymore?
they're still canon, but like @main hill said there were newer renditions of them
nimble quiver
shame, I much preferred the book version of events
unique rune
The books are still canon
It's just that later printings of the books make some revisions to iron out some of the weirdness of the original releases
Stuff like Reach being the first time Chief's ever encountered Sangheili got retconned out because it'd be limiting and just kinda weird in general
versed helm
Stuff like Reach being the first time Chief's ever encountered Sangheili got ret...
agreed
cedar surge
Equal and greater
west silo
From what I've seen gen 2 is more easier to produce
There are times when it comes off as worse than gen 1
Like that time a magnum pierced its armor
Or that time it was a single needle shard pierced thorns armor
humble yacht
that happened to Daisy too
humble yacht
seems like the presence of shields in the lore is inconsistent for the sake of drama in some cases
west silo
And that's kinda weird now since in the books like silent storm and oblivion the needles just deflect off of the armor
obsidian thistle
that happened to Daisy too
Daisy is really odd atm.
As we dont know when she dies. She could be wearing CQB. And could die at any place and time in the Human-Covenant war
west silo
Psychic connections
vestal ermine
For the Forerunners who created the rings to starve the flood to death, why didn't they create the rings to destroy the flood?
humble yacht
the rings do destroy higher forms of flood. Like Combat Forms and higher
vestal ermine
As in the ring kills only the flood. Why wasn't it designed that way?
west silo
They did
vestal ermine
Yes, but the rings didn't kill all the flood.
humble yacht
because individual FSCs survived almost everything they threw at them and just restarted infections
west silo
The starving thing is just from CE
That was then retconed
We see it killing flood in halo legends and the terminals
Why would it not kill them?
The flood are stupid?
vestal ermine
I never knew that.
west silo
They'd just go somewhere else
Dang they might even evolve into the precursors for all we know
vestal ermine
Well I like to believe some Forerunners survived and decided to leave the galaxy to let us humans reclaim what rightfully belongs to us.
west silo
They did
vestal ermine
Good.
obsidian thistle
We see it killing flood in halo legends and the terminals
It didnt actually do what Legends depicted.
west silo
?
obsidian thistle
Legends - Origins is Cortanas interpretation of events.
west silo
Yeah we know somethings are wrong
obsidian thistle
Not actual historic imagery
west silo
But the ring killing them is canon
obsidian thistle
Kinda... its complex
humble yacht
the Halos don't target based on intelligence, but rather presence of a central nervous system
west silo
Tell that to HITD
humble yacht
i don't know what that acronym means
west silo
Hunters in the dark
humble yacht
what did Hunters in the Dark say?
obsidian thistle
Lets say unless there is a solvent. Bodies remain.
And spores remain. And isolated pockets in testing facilities and those lucky enough to be out of range. And "maybe" in shield worlds.
cedar surge
Oh uea
west silo
That animals aren't fully sentient
cedar surge
Animals survived on the ark since they aint sentient
west silo
So they can't be killed by it
cedar surge
Probably the most contrived reason for animals to be on the ark
humble yacht
who said that?
west silo
The people in the book
humble yacht
the people in the book, like the UNSC team?
cedar surge
Well couldn't it just be a theory?
west silo
Its the authors reason for why there are animal threats
cedar surge
Like a dumb theory?
west silo
It's the only explanation
humble yacht
so the narrator says that the animals survived the pulse
is that what you're saying?
west silo
Yes
humble yacht
or are you just assuming something that you think is logical?
cedar surge
Characters have made assumptions and exaggerations before
west silo
No outright the animals are not affect because there not fully sentient
humble yacht
it's one thing if its a character in the story, its another thing if the author narrates that outside of character dialogue
i don't have a copy of HITD so i can't verify but if anyone has a copy I'd appreciate if they can fact check this claim
west silo
Turn on the ostral signal
Anyways it retconed again because the halo can affect trees that can talk
By using insects
cedar surge
Trees that can what
humble yacht
according to Halopedia, the animals that were seen in Hunters in the Dark were seeded after the events of H3 by Tragic Solitude
cedar surge
So not the original blast but thae second one
humble yacht
and he altered them so he could control them psychically
cedar surge
But
humble yacht
so they weren't survivors of the pulse but rather newly created animals
cedar surge
Least he got a hobby
humble yacht
the only real retconning happened with HW2 when ATN showed a large contingent of combat forms having survived the pulse, even though the gravemind itself was killed by it
that inconsistency is largely why i don't like ATN
west silo
Wait so he created a bunch of animals to use as an army
Instead of using the robot army he had available
humble yacht
he didn't exactly have an army of the animals
but he had the animals attack Broadside One's team and then swooped in to save him in exchange for his "help"
if it had been sentinels attacking, Broadside One might not have trusted Tragic Solitude
west silo
That's the most diabolical thing I've ever heard
humble yacht
and then afterward, Tragic Solitude turned him into a cyborg so he could control him
Also, going back to the original point about whether the rings directly kill flood or not
even if Legends depiction of how Flood are affected is not necessarily canon, the H3 terminal logs from Offensive Bias say that after the rings fired, Flood-controlled ships became dead in the water, leaving Mendicant Bias with only ships directly under his control
based on that, we can conclude that the ring pulse does in fact disable flood forms. otherwise those ships would have kept going
west silo
Wait shouldn't thise ships have there own Ais?
So wouldn't they still be in the fight?
cedar surge
Well they would have been corrupted by the flood and likely gone insane or broke
cedar surge
Like minimum wage?
west silo
It's only early in the war where ai were broken and insane
Nah at least you get paid
More like unpaid overtime
Forever
humble yacht
those ships would have been operated by flood-infected forerunners
west silo
Yes
west silo
But every forerunner ship has an ai
humble yacht
point is, after the pulse fired, MB lost most of his fleet
lone oak
yo chimera, whos your spartan waifu?
cedar surge
Friendship ended with Spartans,now elites are my best friends
lone oak
ngl, but arby be lookin kinda like a snacc
gilded mason
Oh yeah. Here's a quote from HITD regarding the conversation from earlier.
Luther turned to address them, shielding his face from the blankets of snow now coming down.
“We have very little to go on here, but I have a theory.”
“Let’s hear it,” the Spartan prodded.
“The Ark isn’t just a manufacturing plant for Halo rings. It was used as a sanctuary for life found across the galaxy, not just sentient life but species that depended on sentient creatures for their survival, whether for care or food or whatever.”
“You are saying,” N’tho attempted to clarify, “that the Forerunners kept the natural predators of sentient species on the Ark so they wouldn’t go extinct when the sentient beings on their own world suddenly died off?”
“Yes, they were trying to save entire ecosystems, not just sentient beings, whenever the Halo was activated. If they save a sentient being but return it to a world that is in the throes of ecological collapse, then no one wins.”
Luther is supposed to be a very smart scientist, by the way.
So it's definitely a case of the author not understanding things.
west silo
So he's saying they can survive the blast
But would die Because all the other species are dead?
humble yacht
no
gilded mason
Yes.
Luther is basically saying, for example, a housecat would die because its human owner was killed by the Halo.
humble yacht
sounded more like they saved wolves so when all the deer died, the wolves wouldn't starve
gilded mason
depended on sentient creatures for their survival, whether for care or food or whatever.
So it's both
humble yacht
cats would get killed by the halo too
gilded mason
Yes. But not according to this author, which was the point being made.
gilded mason
Yeh
humble yacht
it wouldn't be the first time an author seemingly ignored previously established canon 
gilded mason
It sure seems that way, huh
And yet...
Basically, Traviss isn't a good author in this espect
cedar surge
I feel like there was immense human bias when making that statement
gilded mason
I wonder if she wouldn't have such a huge bias for Mandalorians if they were aliens instead.
Since I'd have figured she'd have an affinity for Sangheili as well, considering, y'know?
gilded mason
Yeah, proud warrior race people. But one's an alien, one looks human. Which I assume is the important factor in this case.
humble yacht
they are human
but its also a culture, so some people not born on Mandalore could become Mandalorian by following their ways
kinda like Judaism and Israel
west silo
And jango
humble yacht
that one is contested
most of Jango's history was made non-canon after disney acquired SW
canonically, the Mandalorian government denounced Jango Fett and say he stole the armor and was not considered a Mandalorian
humble yacht
what even is that question
gilded mason
No
humble yacht
we don't know if he's mandalorian by blood
west silo
Oh
humble yacht
that stuff is now Legends. Not canon
all we know in canon is that the Mando government told the Jedi he was a thief
gilded mason
I think the dialogue regarding him was like, "We have no idea how this non-Mandalorian got that armor."
humble yacht
they could have been lying to save their butts, or they could have been truthful
west silo
Wow they really killed his back story
humble yacht
they killed alot of backstories
west silo
True
humble yacht
mara jade isn't even a person anymore
west silo
The new Jedi aren't even a thing anymore
The legends stories could get ridiculous sometimes sure
But Disney sure isn't doing better in that regard
west silo
The sequel trilogy is garbage
humble yacht
¯_(ツ)_/¯
west silo
The clone Wars
The mandilorian
Beautiful
Rogue one was also great
But they sure made the universe dead
humble yacht
i feel like we really drifted away from the original topic
barren ferry
Can a brute chieftains armor defend against a full energy sword swing?
Assuming the user followed through?
junior dome
Are Spartan IV augmentations the same as II?
gilded mason
Nope
Different, and less effective.
Though still pretty good, and with a 100% survival rate to boot.
fair hazel
I thought it was some halo vs Star Wars going on
gilded mason
Nope.
west silo
Not yet
slim thorn
Well, Spartan-IV mostly got their organ changed, isn't it? For II and III like... they don't need to change their organs, I guess? Palmer's eye color even changed because of augmentation
humble yacht
it's likely that biofabricated organ tech wasn't at a mass producible level during the S-II and S-III generations
that, or the replacement of certain organs was part of the reason adults could undergo the process
west silo
They also have some cybernetics as well
How would a Spartan get past a metal detector?
Don't there bones basically have metal grafted onto them
slim thorn
Linda is the only one that has organ changes at S-II, practically because of her clinically deceased earlier that must be revived through replace a certain organ.
craggy sierra
Reading the last half of that felt like having a stroke
junior dome
@slim thorn what?
humble yacht
I’m assuming a language barrier
They’re talking about how during FoR, Linda got headshotted by plasma (among other injuries)
Halsey had to flash clone replacement organs for her
But interestingly, that would suggest that the new organs lacked exposure to the chemicals agents used to augment the S-IIs
west silo
I don't know I think it just made here more awesome
That does bring up the question why does Kat has a metal arm instead of just cloning a new one
humble yacht
Because an arm is composed of several different tissues
Organs, on the other hand, are usually one or 2
Much more simple to grow in culture
humble yacht
No
west silo
Well is there anything that says that cloning limbs are harder?
I know that creating a full on human being is very difficult because of how complex a human body and brain is
tropic forge
Cloning and reaugmenting an arm may be more difficult.
humble yacht
Think about what makes up an arm
Bone tissue. Connective tissue. Muscles. Circulatory system. Nerves. Skin
cedar surge
A robot arm would be less complex
slim thorn
Robot arm like Kat are less complex
Even Halsey will be most likely using robotic arm
humble yacht
Then you have to grow the arm to the correct length and somehow attach it perfectly
cedar surge
Its a entire limb with multiple parts vs a robot arm that can be made quickly
slim thorn
Making a tissue like that isn't simple. Even Naruto's hand uses Hashirama's cells and wrapped up with bandages for safety purposes. If Halo does have someone that possess high or extreme regenerating capability, ONI would love to have it studied.
cedar surge
The unsc can flash clone new organs
humble yacht
😐
west silo
I didn't say anything
cedar surge
Sure
west silo
Lance you traitor!!!
So anyways what are the chances of pavium and voridus being alive
humble yacht
Pavium? Probably decent
humble yacht
Voridus? Atriox probably killed him for disobedience
slim thorn
Pavium could take over Decimus
west silo
There is a little hope for voridus
slim thorn
Or probably Voridus intends to drag out the security on the breach.
west silo
He's basically there forerunner tech expert
slim thorn
Since Decimus' position was vacant, I was thinking that Pavium can fill it
west silo
Oh yeah he's who I meant
slim thorn
He's good at controlling economy and siege strategy
For Voridus, I don't know if Pavium's plea is enough
west silo
Yeah but his brother is basically his down fall
slim thorn
Unless Atriox plan to make him permanently stationed close to High Charity
Atriox knew Voridus is at fault while Pavium is doing his best effort to rescue him.
west silo
He seem more likely to die fighting atriox to protect he's brother
slim thorn
If it was at UNSC, Pavium probably can earn Medal of Honor
Unless Atriox was merciful enough, to the point of possibly assigning Voridus at a specific area and stripped off the command.
west silo
That's seems extremely merciful
slim thorn
Assigned at one area that he made with his soldiers was also a part of mercifull
slim thorn
Well, now with Atriox is gone, Pavium can secure Voridus
cedar surge
Well voridus would have invaluable experience fighting the flood for the banished
And if the banished are going to raid capture and take over more forerunner installations they will need that
west silo
Basically burn everything
slim thorn
True that, but who's going to have a knack on the Forerunners aside of Colony?
Colony already did plan to launch a starfighter to SoF
west silo
Is colony still alive?
west silo
Didn't we kill him in spearbreaker?
cedar surge
No you just ruined their plan
west silo
Or was that just a random hunter captain
cedar surge
It would be a bit dumb to kill off high ranking banished leaders offscreen
slim thorn
No, Colony was a leader and Hunter Captain was a Commander appointed by Colony
west silo
Cool
slim thorn
Also, I don't think Jerome can also go anywhere anyway
Since he's basically a Battle Commander
west silo
He's a commander now
slim thorn
Yeah, he's been assigned as Field / Battle Commander to command UNSC on the field
slim thorn
Fed was a Junior Lieutenant
Equivalent to Lieutenant at the ground army
So far I think only Fred that was an Officer for active field S-II (Set aside for Musa) that was still alive.
I'm curious, though, why UEG doesn't want to apply a cryo-prison for prisoners?
west silo
Too immoral?
Wouldn't really be a punishment if there just spending there entire time sleeping
gilded mason
It feels like it might possibly be less immoral, since you wouldn't have to spend day in and day out within the prison system, aging all the while.
slim thorn
I mean, we've seen many UNSC personnel sleeps on their cryo-sleep on their journey. But we've never seen a prisoner being put into cryo-sleep to fulfill its sentences.
slim thorn
I don't think it will be used for life sentence
west silo
Well you don't age
slim thorn
Unless it was for someone who was decide to be punished for hundreds of years
slim thorn
I recall an anime from Galaxy Angel where the officer volunteers to be a criminal as she was put into cryosleep for hundreds of years, awakened because of her mind that was made by her hatred, and she return to her prison to continue serve her sentences on cryosleep.
The thing is, when she awake in the future, she can be nobody
As technology changes, also probably society also changes
slim thorn
Sentenced for like four to five hundreds years
slim thorn
If it was on Halo perspective, you're at ONI and volunteers to take the blame
And you have to take that sentences while ONI covers it up for the mess they made.
west silo
Take about dedication
west silo
Anyways isn't muda like the overseer or trainer of Spartan 4s
west silo
I have heard something about musa that I kinda need clarified
slim thorn
Muda or Musa?
west silo
Musa
Ehh I just said useless
Basically in newblood there is a traitor Spartan killing other trainees
This is a huge problem because someone is killing everyone
But musa kinda just brushes it off to do something less important
So I kinda need some context
gilded mason
Oh yeah, I remember discussions that Musa really just seems...really apathetic to the lives of his Spartans.
slim thorn
Probably he could be like Halsey
Or ONI who deemed them expendable
Considering S-IV were all volunteers
west silo
Halsey never saw here Spartans as expendable
She was pretty much willing to doom humanity just to save a few
slim thorn
Then ONI's way of thinking
gilded mason
Though to be clear, she thought humanity was already doomed.
So she didn't think saving her Spartans would change anything
gilded mason
Indeed. A basically freak occurance saved everyone
west silo
More like truth stealing defeat from the mouth of victory
gilded mason
Yeh
west silo
If he had just delayed the schism at least by a month they would have won
Dang once the ring was found I would have forgotten all about it
cedar surge
Or the elites could have started it
gilded mason
Would have happened eventually, yeah. Though perhaps not quickly enough.
cedar surge
Is it really a betrayal when Arby at it betrayed first
cedar surge
Or maybe ONI could have caused another grunt rebellion
cedar surge
I mean A brute betrays a elite every other Tuesday
west silo
Hey I can use that word
cedar surge
Yea
gilded mason
Nah
It was truth that basically forced arbiter to betray```
It's more that more and more Elites were questioning the war, with large amounts already sympathetic to humans. That would eventually spill over to the council.Thel already work alongside humanity. I just hope that Thel returns at Halo: Infinite
Because it will be like a duo going work side-by-side again like at Halo 3.
west silo
They could spin it as them being rewarded for doing a good job of killing humanity
That's sounds like something they could actually do
Like right after destroying one of humanity's final strong hold they then discover the very thing they were they were killing humanity for
It would be the greatest moral boost
terse lava
kinda what happened though. They crushed Reach, and then found Halo. I wonder how widespread that actually got, seeing as Thel couldn't get in contact with High Charity
west silo
So how fast is unsc terraforming tech
terse lava
centuries at worst(at the start of the Covenant war)
west silo
What's the marginal world?
Only one I can think of is post glassed Meridean
And that might have something to do with the fact that it was glassed
tropic forge
Not specified; the OSFM just mentions that new terraforming technologies were introducted that could be alter margianl worlds in mere decades.
Decidedly not glassed worlds, as it's talking about the initial colonial expansion.
west silo
Cool
versed helm
Humanity does re-settle on Reach, though. Right?
I think we see it happen at the end of H:R, with the focus on Six's helmet, and ships landing in the background
Unless, of course, that was Blue Team's ship landing to look around in CASTLE base, which would be a whole new level of mind trip
gilded mason
Well, the date for that scene was 2589, or somewhere around that. Pretty sure that was recolonization.
terse lava
Just shows the Created nonsense only lasts so long
stable flower
Did MC forget there were other Forerunner installations? He asked "other installations" when Del Rio is talking about the Prometheans.
versed helm
Pretty sure he meant that as "other installations are going nuts too?"
next fox
Do we have any lore about events in the 27th century
versed helm
We havent hit the 2600s yet
versed helm
Well, the date for that scene was 2589, or somewhere around that. Pretty sure th...
Wont that ending be considered retconned, since Bungie is no longer the studio?
gilded mason
I mean, anything could end up retconned. But that scene being from Bungie wouldn't make it a likely conclusion or anything.
versed helm
I guess it depends on whether 343 will take it in as canon or not now, given the whole Created and Banished scene.
gilded mason
Well, I doubt the Created thing will continue all the way to 2589
And the Banished are just stupid pirates
versed helm
Cause, if humanity took so long to get to the covies,(which actually happened due to an internal war in the covies), how will they fare against two enemy factions, both of which have a good superiority over them?
gilded mason
So are you saying humanity will be destroyed by 2589, or something else?
stable flower
I was hoping the Banished wouldn't be a Covenant substitute, but...
gilded mason
Two more days, ATP.
versed helm
Not that drastic. But, given what all has happened between the us seeing that scene and 343 releasing a new storyline, colonization doesnt seem possible, even after this
Can someone tell me what the timestamp on Contact Harvest is? I can't remember
gilded mason
Hm?
versed helm
Like, what year does it happen in?
gilded mason
2525
versed helm
And Halo 3 is 2552, if I'm not wrong
gilded mason
Ye
versed helm
So, if the Covenant hadn't gotten into a civil war, humanity was in a war with them for 27 years
gilded mason
Yeh
versed helm
And a losing one, at that
And there's a pretty good chance that the Banished won't have an internal war, because of how Atriox manages things.
gilded mason
Unless Atriox dies.
versed helm
Not all that likely, is it, though
gilded mason
Kinda is.
versed helm
How so?
gilded mason
He's not holed up in some secret fortress unknown to all. He could conceivably be killed just by destroyed his ship, camp, etc.
And he's getting on in years.
He'd probably die of old age in a few years anyway
versed helm
343 will actually let that happen?
gilded mason
At some point, sure
slim thorn
People wants Atriox died by the hands of Red Team, practically Douglas-042
gilded mason
Well before 2589, at least
versed helm
How old is he right now?
gilded mason
About 50
slim thorn
Isn't Tartarus around that age when he died?
versed helm
Tartarus died of bullets
gilded mason
About 61 when Tartarus died
versed helm
Normal Jirlahane life span is 100+ human years
The source of that info is reddit, though, so it's a bit sus
gilded mason
Nah, pretty sure it's shorter, though I'm checking now
tropic forge
Brutes are probably shorter lifespans
versed helm
NO
tropic forge
Whoops.
versed helm
Halopedia doesn't mention normal Jiralhane lifespan
Brave, could you delete that spoiler comment, please?
slim thorn
Still, Tartarus can move fast despite he's 61
But then again, ONI can easily play Jiralhanae.
Considering Jiralhanae probably continues their "immolation."
fair hazel
Tomorrow it won’t be spoiler territory
versed helm
Why not?
slim thorn
Because it's 1 month passed ever since SoR is released
versed helm
Ahh
wintry igloo
What books do you need read before shadow of reach???
fathom sail
Do we know anything about unsc members having tattoos?
I'm also wondering how personal information is stored, how one could create personal information in the form of the unsc personnel information
west silo
Well tattoos most likely aren't banned and still around
And with personal information?
Probably the same way you or i
fathom sail
Well, I also mean with the Spartan numbers, or the ai serial numbers
carmine sleet
Plenty of characters in Halo have tattoos, Captain Keyes got an ODST tattoo after he saved a bunch one time and Jun has one on the side of his head
Also, personal information would be stored in a database. As for a format in how that would be laid out, I don't think they've given us an official template for that
fathom sail
Ah, that's what I was looking for, an official template/guide
Any suggestions for a hell jumper tattoo?
Preferably similar to one in lore?
fathom sail
(I also found this for UNSC Personnel Information - https://www.halopedia.org/Career_Service_Vitae)
surreal sparrow
carmine sleet
We've known that for a while
cedar surge
Probably stuff could be improved
humble yacht
west silo
Sorry
west silo
So how old is atriox?
gilded mason
About 50
gilded mason
I guess around there
west silo
And tartar?
cedar surge
Chief is 41?
gilded mason
<= 43
slim thorn
By current body age, probably Fred.
Chief is the youngest
Considering he was sleep on cryo pod for 4 years
cedar surge
He should follow cutters skincare routine
stable flower
The Elites' way of life in the post-war era is pretty depressing
cedar surge
How so?
I mean yea due to unfortunate circumstance inside and outside lore they can't build barns
gilded mason
lol
But yeah, they seem to be fine for the most part from what I can tell, besides some conflicts on some planets
cedar surge
Hey wait did the spoiler chat disappear?
gilded mason
Nope, still there on my end
cedar surge
Also yea the blooding years were coming to a close
Nearly over by the time the created came
gilded mason
Ye
cedar surge
And the raids some banished clans were doing were
Actually I don't think that arc concluded anything for elites or brutes in escalations
Nothing was resolved for either
cedar surge
Yea it only served to show there was traitors in the Spartan program
unique rune
Seems like a real weird way to try and get the community onboard with S-IVs.
Write the core S-IV cast of Spartan Ops kinda... annoyingly... toss in a traitor. Maaaaaybe not a good look for the next generation of Spartans.
cedar surge
Yea I mean
The closest to a traitor spartan before was a disfigured washout who became a innie and died
So full on traitor Spartans doesn't paint the fours in a good light
stable flower
They're at war with the Brutes, in a civil war, and now they're being subjugated.
cedar surge
Is it really a civil war anymore?
Its not really a war between entire races anymore. More like war between left over covenant factions
unique rune
Everyone's being subjugated.
Not like infighting wasn't a common thing with other species either.
west silo
Really?
The grunts never had any infighting
Nor the kig yar
And I doubt there was any in the hunter society
unique rune
I mean. Humans fought each other. Jiralhanae were prone to it.
Unggoy were too busy trying to not die most of the time.
unique rune
Yeah, I can't imagine they'd get by without any internal conflict, even if we haven't necessarily seen it canonically.
fervent glade
technically if halo takes place in this universe about 500 years from now then that means bungie exists in halos universe and predicted the future
humble yacht
It’s not this universe
fervent glade
that's a let down
west silo
Obviously it doesn't take place in our universe
But it does follow our time line from modern day to the future
Just minus halo out of the timeline
west silo
True they do suck at balancing
cedar surge
It diverged already 100 000 years ago
Then followed the timeline for a while before 2018 I think
west silo
So basically a new battle star galactica stiutation?
Where the future is actually the past?
Mind blown
fervent glade
well now you probably know Im not versed in it
west silo
Pretty good
Tho the ending is kinda spilt
cedar surge
Well didn't it have a buncha movies and a video game
west silo
Nope just one movie
No game
And a short comic series that made everyone idiots
Basically the escalations before there was escalations
cedar surge
Like escalations but twice worse?
ocean ibex
I doubt we’ll invent FTL travel in 270 years
fervent glade
Their was a possessed Halsey?
west silo
With how bad the art was see probably was
fervent glade
I don't understand
west silo
The way they draw the characters is awful
Ohh yeah and going by escalations elites can't drink something without it getting all over the place like some big lizard baby
fervent glade
well I can imagine they have SOME way of drinking like using their four mandibles as a lower jaw
they did that in halo legends
west silo
I meant can't
fervent glade
oof they made elites bigger freaks than they already were
as if halo the flood didn't insult the covenant enough already by making incapable warriors who only win battles by glassing everything. Thats actually what Keyes said in the book
peak veldt
How guilty is Halsey?
On Halo 4 they make her out to be a boogieman mad scientist war criminal that everyone hates.
I've always had vibes that she's more somewhere between low chaotic good and chaotic neutral. Doing bad things under "Ends justify the means"
Always had vibes that she was thrown under the bus by ONI. As in while she was the lead and brain behind Spartans, they reap the rewards and get rid of her.
slim thorn
Based on moral, not much since her program did successful up to this point. Not to mention her program gives birth to future program such as S-III and S-IV.
If it was on Halsey herself in person, she was very guilty. She lost her entire family in a just three months.
peak veldt
Since my thought was on if ONI threw her under the bus, I am thinking yes since it sounds like she would have been replaced if Spartan project was delayed.
grand iris
What would be the best way to put Crimson team in the spotlight?
opal birch
@peak veldt Halsey is absolutely guilty. The Spartan-II program is immoral and unethical. Being a relatively successful program doesn't matter, the program involved kidnapping kids. But ONI is just as guilty if not more, since they greenlit the program and they greenlit the S-IIIs, which took advantage of the desire for revenge a lot of those orphaned kids had to turn them into expendable super soldiers. ONI also made Halsey their scapegoat.
Halsey at least regrets what did, though it doesn't change what she did.
humble yacht
it's a complex issue
Chief is proud of what Halsey made him, but at the same time he wouldn't wish that fate on anyone else
coarse trail
Thing is, if not for the sudden invasion of the Covenant, kidnapped kids being raised to be superhumans killing other humans doesnt really inspire much no matter the explanation
cedar surge
How do you think the arbiter and other elites would think if they knew about the creation of Spartans
coarse trail
Seeing as superiority and honor is important to Sangheili culture
They would acknowledge the strength of the resulting spartans
Reject the brutality of the procedure
Or maybe even not reject it, depends of the view of the elites - Brutes would be far more accepting of brutality and the strong surviving
grand iris
Regarding the hatred the S-III's have for the covenant does it mean all the species that are in the covenant?
coarse trail
It would mean all of them, yeah
raw panther
They come from glassed worlds
Where their families were killed
Its not like, if you were in their shoes, you would have seen a jackal rip your parents in half, and be like "Yeah, those guys suck, but the elites and grunts are aiii"
Its a hatred towards the whole system
grand iris
If one of them got the chance at killing a prophet I'm sure they would take their head and place it on a stick for all the covenant to see
Must take a lot of willpower to hold back their hatred for covenant species post war if they are allied to UNSC
raw panther
Im sure there were a couple instances of "Blue on Blue" with human forces
humble yacht
the way the IIs and IIIs were brainwashed were different. for IIs, their indoctrination was all about doing what was best for the UNSC (framed as doing what was best for humanity), so when the Covenant came along glassing worlds, of course the spartans hated them. but as Chief said, he fought alongside too many honorable aliens to stereotype them all
raw panther
Human forces arent as dogmatic as Sanghelli ones, if an elite was given an order from a superior, they would follow it, cause it pertains to their Code of Honor
grand iris
Ah yeah, like the S-II's they were let loose on innies as well weren't they?
coarse trail
Their hateboner for Covenant is so encouraged that actual suicide missions with them become possible - which works cause that's the main purpose of S IIIs: expendable superhuman soldiers
humble yacht
S-IIIs, on the other hand, probably have a harder time separating the "good" aliens from the "bad"
humble yacht
what I want to know is: how the hell did the UNSC make enough GEN3 for all the Spartan IIIs and IVs on Infinity
they must have started the gen3 project really early
grand iris
How they made their own monsters. They killed millions and the survivors are burning for revenge
How would a modified and even tougher training regiment based on the S-III training program for S- IV's work?
humble yacht
¯_(ツ)_/¯
it helped that someone who went through that training oversaw it
one interesting parallel between the IVs and IIs is that back when Chief was in training, he ignored his team to achieve victory and ultimately failed the training exercise
you know who also did that? Palmer
grand iris
Kurt and the original trainer for the s-ii's trained them right?
humble yacht
Kurt and Mendez trained the IIIs. Jun trains the IVs
raw panther
Mendez
grand iris
Ouch. How mistakes repeat after years
humble yacht
Ouch. How mistakes repeat after years
Yeah but that failure helped shape Chief into the leader he is today
the same can be said of Palmer
grand iris
She's ODST right?
raw panther
Yeah
grand iris
Well Jun did recruit her so it means something
barren ferry
what was the standard armor color for spartan 3's?
humble yacht
¯_(ツ)_/¯
grand iris
Either green or a light shade of brown
grand iris
But it's far better than ODST armour
barren ferry
yeah, you're referring to SPI i think
grand iris
Yeah
raw panther
Its only better cause they can go invis
humble yacht
i mean only before reach did it suck
not quite. only a select few Spartan IIIs got MJOLNIR during the war
Noble Team were among those special IIIs
grand iris
SPI had another advantage too. Headhunter SPI had energy shielding added to it
And other upgrades
humble yacht
it wasn't until after the war ended and the remaining IIIs were transferred to Spartan Branch that they all got MJOLNIR
opal birch
Not all SPI then had those upgrades then
grand iris
Yup sadly
humble yacht
it's worth noting that the "cheapness" of the Spartan IIIs came from their armor, not their augments
opal birch
And Headhunters didn't exists in large numbers
grand iris
But they achieved the impossible in their missons with less. That's very impressive
ocean ibex
They never did
They were only allowed group missions for special occasions
Usually it was comprised of 2 people
grand iris
Headhunters during the war were around 5 teams with 7 more in reserve
opal birch
I mean 2 whole companies got wiped out in the process
They did want ONI originally wanted them for
grand iris
Alpha and Beta have more than 300 that were not accounted for in each operation too
Alpha and Beta Spartans are already in a game. Hope to see Gamma Spartans in their own spin-off game
raw panther
You know what would actually be hype?
Playing a campaign as a marine defending Reach.
Im not talking about ODST though.
I felt as though in ODST you were just an underpowered spartan.
craggy sierra
Sounds like it’d just be a game where you die...like the Reach game already was.
humble yacht
marines didn't show up on reach til the very end
raw panther
Whatyu talking about
craggy sierra
I mean they were probably around somewhere. But yeah.
humble yacht
most of the soldiers you saw in the game were UNSC Army
craggy sierra
Most of the forces you see in the reach campaign was the army.
raw panther
Oh. Yeah.
craggy sierra
Marines only appeared around POA in the last mission
craggy sierra
Mechanically speaking though Halo isn’t equipped to really make a game that doesn’t make you feel like a spartan.
cedar surge
I mean the closest halo hot was odst
And well
You could just melee brutes to death
humble yacht
Marines and Navy were for space operations
cedar surge
You could still tip off turrets
humble yacht
Army was for planetary defense
craggy sierra
You’d have to strip everything out and delete eliminate the arena shooter oriented mechanics and AI from the enemies and make it play closer to something like COD.
cedar surge
Expinditionary?
craggy sierra
ODSTs are statistically stronger than spartans ever were.
raw panther
@craggy sierra A MAN CAN DREAM
craggy sierra
In Halo chief usually had 70 shields and 45 HP. Your character in ODST got 80 of both.
cedar surge
Ah yes
craggy sierra
They are tankier than spartans
craggy sierra
Stamina is literally just shields given a different screen effect as far as the game is concerned.
cedar surge
It of everything it could have been its stamina
tender knoll
Spartans are the strongest humans ever. Maybe aside ancient humans.
cedar surge
I don't think they even downsized the odsts
craggy sierra
They did downsize them
tender knoll
And this has been said many times
craggy sierra
That’s why the grenades come out like a foot higher than you expect.
craggy sierra
Cause they didn’t downsize the grenade arc to accomodate
cedar surge
Man I wish they actually used the knifes
craggy sierra
But yeah Halo’s gameplay is just cursed to forever be discontiguous from the lore at this point.
tender knoll
I know domino had a giant knife in his chest.
cedar surge
You would have to have entirely different gameplay to be a odst or marine
Spartans cone through like a wrecking ball
Everyone else doesn't
craggy sierra
You’d have to make automatic weapons not be useless and adjust the entire gameplay balance to account for being an entity that is supposed to die from like 3 shots of plasma tops.
cedar surge
Well you also get some heavy damage from near misses
Actually this reminds me of ARMA
ocean ibex
A direct hit from a plasma shot should cause 5th degree burns
cedar surge
Yea reminds me of arms where s few shots could kill you
craggy sierra
in gameplay balance, being an incredibly low TTK entity up against incredibly high TTK entities is no bueno. Halo’s lore depicts shielding from aliens being much weaker than in the games with AR’s punching through to headshots with only a few rounds.
Meanwhile in-game it takes like a full clip depending on difficulty...and it can’t headshot.
south pumice
Wack
coarse trail
Sadly, the dissonance between gameplay and lore is huge
Canon Chief would be moving fast like Doomguy with speedboost
But the Elites would be also hard to kill
And all enemies can kill you easily
Etc etc
Which begs the question, how scary did the Covenant saw Chief during their first sighting of him that he got the name "Demon"
teal echo
yo
west silo
Well the first time elites encountered Spartans on a full scale battle
They destroyed an entire fleet of a hundred ships
teal echo
when was that?
west silo
1 week after reach sams death
teal echo
Interesting
west silo
They then single handedly killed the covenants best soldiers the silent shadows without breaking a sweat
west silo
And then proceeded to destroy a major covenant construction ring that was making a CSO ship
That's 26km by the way
And then destroyed 2 of the covenants citys below killing millions
Soo yeah they scary yo
ocean ibex
Doesn’t the CSO alone carry like 2 million foot soldiers
humble yacht
¯_(ツ)_/¯
west silo
We know it had 2 million ghost
gilded mason
Nope, nobody here
humble yacht
people only want to do something when they aren't allowed to do it smh
humble yacht
gross
gilded mason
ur gross
west silo
Naked elite boi
gilded mason
He wore a tabard
west silo
Half naked then
humble yacht
You think Gadogai is going to kill Castor or not?
west silo
Did he still have energy shields
humble yacht
i dunno, maybe he's playing the long game
gilded mason
He's definitely a brute I would rather be around more than others we've seen
humble yacht
castor is a dumbo who thinks there is a Great Journey
gilded mason
Though at least he's not a barbaric jerk
humble yacht
I'd rather be with a logical jerk than a polite zealot
west silo
One that would feed you to his pack?
humble yacht
also SoR pretty much dunks on the idea that the Banished had humans
gilded mason
Yeah, that was nice
humble yacht
makes sense for a group that still loves forerunner stuff
west silo
And is pretty chill for working with the humans who killed his best bud
humble yacht
Keepers are basically covenant if they weren't trying to exterminate humans
gilded mason
Yeah
west silo
Yeah
west silo
That's the major question
humble yacht
how did she manage that? are all the humans spies?
west silo
Are all the ferrets spies?
gilded mason
Think so
humble yacht
so what happens when Castor tells them to activate the ark and they refuse?
gilded mason
I guess they'll just have to refuse and find a way out
stable flower
In the words of TenthRingWanderer, the Banished are now the Covenant-But-Not-Covenant-But-Kill-Humans-Anyway.
gilded mason
Or...
They somehow convince Castor to cast off his desire for the Great Journey and instead use the Forerunner creations they already have to bring mercy and actual salvation to the less fortunate beings of the Orion Arm.
...But that's a bit of a long shot
west silo
Yeah makes total sense
gilded mason
eyy
humble yacht
Castor's head is full of faith
gilded mason
Veta Lopis: "Maybe the real Great Journey was the friends we made along the way."
humble yacht
Castor: smashes Lopis with his hammer
You think Voridus is dead by the time Atriox leaves the ark?
gilded mason
It seems likely from a characterization perspective.
'Cause that was a gigantic mess up, to put it mildly
humble yacht
i mean
west silo
More like killed along the way
humble yacht
it was a direct order ignored
atriox doesn't seem the kind to tolerate insubordination
gilded mason
Yeah
And not only did it almost kill everyone on the Ark, but also basically reset Atriox's logistics plans to zero
west silo
What better way to fix the situation by leaving them to fix all of it
gilded mason
I guess 'Volir?
humble yacht
Shipmaster was a hired hand, and Atriox wasn't exactly happy with him
west silo
In scarifice there are a bunch of second in command
humble yacht
there can only be one second in command
humble yacht
the banished sure as hell wouldn't run by committee
west silo
Weren't they there in the HW2 Phoenix logs
west silo
You sure?
humble yacht
yea
gilded mason
Yep
west silo
Am pretty sure it was mentioned in the Phoenix logs
I thought the book just expanded on it
humble yacht
i don't think CIA would have missed something like that
the book doesn't mention the hand
where at the ark do you think the portal to Reach appears?
the portal to voi appears directly above the ark, does the portal to Reach appear in the same spot? can only one portal be active at a time?
also why would the forerunners have put such an important installation on Reach. ancient humanity had no connection to reach
west silo
If it did you'd think the SOF would try to send something through
cedar surge
You think Atriox chosen are ever gonna come into play?
humble yacht
i imagine Atriox's forces left behind would have prevented that
cedar surge
Atriox's chosen and brute warlords
cedar surge
It looks like there's also some elite warlords in the banished now too
west silo
Yeah
cedar surge
And the armor looking good
humble yacht
who's an elite warlord?
cedar surge
New toys
gilded mason
Honor is what people make of it
west silo
Honor guards were in the banished
gilded mason
A lot of people would have different ideas on what "honor" means. If they even care in the first place
cedar surge
There's toys of new elites with new armor called elite warlords
So the chosen would be the banished goner guard
humble yacht
the banished honor guards weren't necessarily original honor guards
humble yacht
¯_(ツ)_/¯
grey guards is just what chief called them
did HW2 have any grey-armored jump pack brutes?
cedar surge
Don't think so
humble yacht
didn't they come off of Escharum's corvette?
maybe they're part of his personal guard or something
west silo
Then again elites are mercenarys now so honor really went out the window
humble yacht
not all of them
west silo
The banished ones
humble yacht
Gadogai did not seem like he was on a payroll
cedar surge
Banished sounding pretty well equipped in a created subjugation era
humble yacht
not the way he talked about Escharum and Atriox
well they're pirates
they steal stuff
cedar surge
Probably going to be like in the OT
Flood are the main threat
Forerunner stuff second
humble yacht
also they managed to unite a bunch of other splinter groups under their banner
cedar surge
Then the main alien baddie
humble yacht
so they got all the Keeper stuff and all the stuff the other groups had too
humble yacht
i dunno about hundreds
stone otter
I hope they have a big fleet
humble yacht
they have a super carrier
humble yacht
no
humble yacht
they mention a separate super carrier in SoR
humble yacht
how the hell did Infinity not detect that when they arrived
cedar surge
Which mean they have multiple
humble yacht
not necessarily
it's "a" because it was only mentioned once
the Banished peaced out of reach like cowards, Bill. they ain't kicking the Created's butt anymore than the UNSC could
cedar surge
Well they sure could end the unsc right now
They hace them outnumbered and outgunned
humble yacht
well that's mostly thanks to cortana, it seems
cedar surge
But a big battle would attract cortana
Oh yea
The colonists or militia
Yea they were acting like idiots
cedar surge
Yea and how they seriously harmed themselves with their own c 10 they armed
humble yacht
That’s what happens when you lack formal training
cedar surge
And they acted like they new more than actual spartans when blur team tried to give advice
humble yacht
They were angry at blue team
cedar surge
Because they weren't there to liberate reach
humble yacht
And they botched their original operation
cedar surge
Did they know what was happening in the galaxy at the time?
humble yacht
They didn’t care
They said they’d rather deal with a guardian than the banished
Also, why the hell are they called Reavians?
cedar surge
Man with the moon dead and meridian massacred and the galaxy subjugated that just sounds dumb
cedar surge
Maybe cause of the area they are in?
cedar surge
Oh
humble yacht
How neat is it that Kalmiya made a subroutine to look after the lab even after she was gone?
Considering that Kalmiya was an early generation smart AI, pretty impressive
cedar surge
I thought it was a created moment
humble yacht
If only
I wish there was an epilogue that showed after the guardian showed up, maybe having Cortana appear in the lab and looking around, getting suspicious
cedar surge
I sure hope those marines got on the ground before cortana comes and knocks them out of the sky
cedar surge
What?
humble yacht
What is it with Chief and his drivers dying
cedar surge
He steals their plot armor for himself
Liked chapov though
Least the militia got their wish
humble yacht
I like concussed Fred
cedar surge
Banished left and now they get to deal with a guardian
I also really liked how that banshee attack really messed blue team up
For the whole book
humble yacht
The shaft attack messed them up more
The book really makes gen3 armor seem underwhelming
cedar surge
Really?
It seemed strong
And the computer that instantly answered chiefs questions
humble yacht
Not that instant
Noticeably slower than an AI
Kelly treats cortana like Voldemort
west silo
Actually gen3 is sick as hell
It took 2 shots from a seprah which mind you is supposed to go against longswords and broadswords
cedar surge
Direct hits or
west silo
Direct to maybe glancing
cedar surge
Well AR and sniper fire was able to down banshees and heavily range seraphs
west silo
Bansees have always been weak
Also they were using special ammunition
Remember the AR with uranium rounds
How much do grunts weight?
slim thorn
110 to 120kg
west silo
And chief was able to throw 10 of them onto the roof of a building in only 40 seconds
It's gets more impressive depending on how big the building is
slim thorn
If Chief was on high adrenaline, he can pull it off
west silo
Maybe
teal echo
what does that mean?