lore-and-universe

[warm ridge]

it's full of pretty interesting stuff

not gonna reveal anything here until dec. 16th ofc

[dry cedar]

Yeah, but, like what was it, specifically?

The Cylixes Escharum finds look more like the Gasgira than the Harbinger.

She did, per RP and EoD.

Ephsu I isn't at all stated to be it. Implied, but not stated.

Within the century after the Rings fired is when they found and imprisoned the Xalanyn, not x.1550.

Nothing says a Shield World has to be planet-sized.

And I just threw that out there based on a thought I had.

[deep citrus]

Something I never understood about Halo's lore

[dry cedar]

Well, that is kind of what they are doing in the expanded lore, Sloan taking over the Created.

[deep citrus]

Even regular marines in the books are EXTREMELY capable of fighting covenant

So how could the Covenant land a large force without anyone noticing

[minor sky]

Ik Bungie's writing has a ton of problems, but it is truly incredible how big Halo 2's narrative was. The amount of lore, characters, and scope put into it is something else.

Joe Staten really knew what he was doing

[unique rune]

you just sort of have to live with game Reach’s UNSC being

kinda dumb and sorta technologically primitive mostly for dramatic effect

[deep citrus]

I never understood why they basically just chose to sacrifice something like 200+ spartan 2's

to hold a polar base

[minor sky]

It is what happens when you have to adapt something for another medium. Games have a ton of variables to account for

[unique rune]

don’t think about the fact that TFoR UNSC tech has them able to roughly anticipate what things might be incoming via slipspace using sensors detecting local gravitational weirdness

but then in the game nobody detected an enormous 300-km long Covenant supercarrier

[deep citrus]

TFoR?

OH the Fall of Reach

[warm ridge]

The Cylixes Escharum finds look more like the Gasgira than the Harbinger.
Escharum never finds any cylixes besides the one containing the Harbinger. That was Atriox who found the others.

The symbol is just ***presumably ***the Endless symbol, it has nothing to do with the Gasgira at all. A similar symbol can be seen on the Kylixian Heatwave. It's also possible the symbol has nothing to do with the Endless at all.

Ephsu I isn't at all stated to be it. Implied, but not stated.
More info surrounding this is revealed in Halo: Edge of Dawn, which I can't really talk about here until Dec. 16th, although that may extend past Dec. 16th.

Within the century after the Rings fired is when they found and imprisoned the Xalanyn, not x.1550.
I never said anything about when the Forerunners imprisoned the Endless? Not entirely sure why this is included here.

[deep citrus]

I can't STAND the expansion of the forerunners/precursor storyline

Just. They were so cool when they were mysterious

And humanity could BARELY fight off the covenant. And you bring in the precursor species with weapons that can destroy half a galaxy or more?

[minor sky]

It was going to happen one way or another

[deep citrus]

And who apparently can LITERALLY just will things into existance

[dry cedar]

I meant Atriox.

Well, the other Cylixes have glowing "designs" on them that look like the species within.

which Installation 07 was teleported to by the Forerunners a Millenia ago after the Halo rings had already fired

And stuff from an unreleased book doesn't seem like it's cool to post about

[minor sky]

They are eldritch beings. Being "god-like" comes with the job

[deep citrus]

Yeah that's my biggest issue with the narrative and them

The covenant were REALLY cool because it was a technologically advanced race that didn't quite understand what they were doing. But were strong enough to wipe you out. The forerunners/precursors DO know what they're doing

[minor sky]

Well, the Forerunners were in the dark about a lot of stuff

Their whole society is built on the idea that "they are the rightful holders of the The Mantle"

Which is a lie. And that causes plenty of more friction down the road

Forerunners were far from god-like, and their wars with both Humanity and The Flood are proof of that

[deep citrus]

Yeah but you go from the covenant, a species that maybe held planets, but it's unlikely, likely numbering in the tens or hundreds of billions

And who had super advanced tech that was basically burrowed. To the ones who made the tech. Can create essentially endless soldiers

and who now holds every single advantage

Against a humanity who is still devastated from losing the majority of it's worlds

[minor sky]

Except when The Didact returns, The Forerunners are all dead.

[warm ridge]

There was never 200+ S-II's.
You're thinking of the S-III's, aka the Spartan 3's, who wore SPI for the most part.

Spartan 3's were made to be expendable, cheap assets that went on suicide missions they weren't guaranteed to survive. Them dying was the expected out come for the most part.

Parangosky: "You want to trade lives for time"
Ackerson: "Yes, ma'am. Is'nt that the job of a soldier?"
Ackerson: "Is there another option? How many worlds are now cinders? How many billions of colonists have died? If we save a single planet, gain a few weeks, isn't that worth a handful of men and women?"
Parangosky: "Of course it is"

Parangosky: "You need a Spartan to train Spartans, of course, but tread damned lightly. This thing goes public, people find out we're making 'disposable heroes,' and morale will plument across the fleet. Make sure no one in Section Three knows about your Spartan-II trainer, or the Spartan-III's. They're going to have to vanish. Understood?"

[minor sky]

Not to mention The Didact is isolated to Requiem for the majority of 4.

[deep citrus]

I'm thinking of the end of The Fall of Reach where a bunch of Spartans jump into Reach

[warm ridge]

Ackerson had brighter ideas then this btw, he wanted to scale up Spartan production from 300 to over 100,000 in just 30 years. Quite a feat, but definitely a unrealistic one.

Remember, disposable heroes. Augmented Spartans that go in, destroy Covenant facility, die, repeat, endless meat grinding.

[deep citrus]

Ngl Spartans', outside of maybe Spartan 2's, seem really underwhelming'

[warm ridge]

Afaik less then 30ish Spartans were said to of ever been part of that battle.

[unique rune]

man I know space is big and all but I was checking the math again and like

game Reach UNSC let a ship roughly half the size of Massachusetts slip through undetected

through the defenses of the planet that is supposedly their greatest military stronghold

[warm ridge]

Maybe 40? It's a pretty low number to be honest.

[deep citrus]

I don't have the physical book to really know 😢

I have the audiobook

[warm ridge]

Oh yea, almost all the Spartans involved in that battle survived. @deep citrus

Not all of them mind you, but most of them yes.

[deep citrus]

That's the issue. In lore there was a MASSIVE space battle that included a truly gargantuan supercarrier. The largest Covenant ship that seems to then just dissapear

And that supercarrier literally oneshot mac guns and UNSC ships

[warm ridge]

If you want the full list, here.
https://www.halowaypoint.com/news/canon-fodder-feet-first-into-fall

[deep citrus]

Unless I'm thinking of something different. Which is possible

o thanks @warm ridge

[warm ridge]

a species that maybe held planets
sorry what?
The Covenant held thousands of planets, possibly over a hundred thousand. They're spread across a large portion of space, but not the entire Covenant was involved in the war.
Covenant were also much, much older then Humanity has ever been in space. Sangheili already knew how to make slipspace drives meanwhile Humans were struggling to create fire on Earth.

[deep citrus]

Oh so humanity was doomed from the beginning lol

[warm ridge]

The Ur-Didact was highly likely the last living Forerunner in the Milky Way galaxy, but this doesn't mean all Forerunners are dead. They settled on a distant planet outside of the Milky Way galaxy afaik.

[deep citrus]

I thought all the covenant were on high charity. I read the books like once, and played the games, but never really wanted to get SUPER in depth like I did with 40k

[minor sky]

You know what I mean

[minor sky]

The Forerunners as they once were are gone

[warm ridge]

The only reason the Covenant lost is because the Prophets, specifically Truth, because overambitious and fearful of the Sangheili taking his power away.

Which is how the Great Schism happened.

The Great Schism is the only reason Earth wasn't completely glassed lol

[deep citrus]

Were the Banished just a faction created later on or were they present from the beginning?

[dry cedar]

IIRC, they were created as a long-term enemy and debuted in Halo Wars 2

[deep citrus]

Yeah that kinda feels like the way with 343 studios

[dry cedar]

@deep citrus >>After the Banished's debut in Halo Wars 2 was well received by fans in 2017, 343 Industries later decided to make them the main antagonists for Halo Infinite midway through development.[179][180] Halo Infinite's development began in 2015.[181]

[warm ridge]

The Banished were formed around 2549. Not really sure what you mean by "created later on".

[deep citrus]

I mean did they appear during Bungie's tenure/the original set of books

[dry cedar]

See above

So, apparently, I did not RC

[warm ridge]

Why would that matter? It's irrelevant. Precursors appeared in Bungie's lore lol

[dry cedar]

I think they were just curious about behind-the-scenes stuff

[deep citrus]

It doesn't particularly. I'm just not huge on them. I did like them in Halo Wars 2, but they just kinda felt tacked on in Infinite

And I was curious if this was a long term plan or just something made for games

[unique rune]

in a way they kinda were

I think the Banished really suffer from being just kind of a weirdly developed and positioned faction

[deep citrus]

Wait

Does this mean the Flood have taken over ~100k planets?

[warm ridge]

@deep citrus if you're trying to focus exclusively on things that "only appeared in bungie lore", you'll have to wipe out the last 14 years of Halo lore. You'll also have to completely delete certain pieces of Halo lore that appeared in 2009, and 2010 as well.
Like for example -

• Halo Legends
• Halo Encyclopedia 2009 - 2011 editions
• Halo Waypoint in it's entirity

You get how that is absolutely ridiculous and dumb now?

[deep citrus]

I honestly think the Covenant vs Banished could've been interesting if you position it as a weaker faction that then took advantage of the great schism

[dry cedar]

I think @deep citrus was just asking about the development process

[deep citrus]

Nighter I'm someone who enjoys the overall overview of these factions more then anything

[warm ridge]

The Flood took over most of the Milky Way galaxy (or at least most of Forerunner controlled space) before the Halo rings fired. So that's a yes.

[unique rune]

they go from being a band of pirates/raiders/scavengers that are supposed to be super threatening but are incapable of getting rid of a lone, isolated, outdated converted colonization vessel and then suddenly got repositioned as the biggest threat in the galaxy to the UNSC and humanity and their allies in Infinite because people thought they were cool in HW2

[deep citrus]

I like to know how strong every faction is and it bugs me when a faction just randomly appears to appear

[warm ridge]

We're talking millions of planets, not just a couple hundred thousand btw. @deep citrus
In modern Halo lore, they don't have control of a single planet afaik.

[deep citrus]

Which seems to be the case with the forerunners (halo 4 and 5) and The Banished

[warm ridge]

Pretty sure that's exactly what happened with the Banished.

[deep citrus]

I'd imagine that's the story yeah

I just wish the Banished had been introduced from the beginning. But what're ya' gonna do

Or, alternatively, just call the Banished the remanents of the losers of the great schism. Which would still be likely billions lol

Anywy thanks for answering my silly questions ya'll

[sonic lagoon]

Yeah, it’s shame his role in writing 3 was so limited. That’s why I prefer halo 3 odst and reach to halo 3 campaign wise, since the writing went back to that Halo 2 quality. Halo Wars 1 and Halo 4 as well with Staten.

[tidal crater]

The smart move would’ve been to skip introducing more aliens like the Covenant or Banished altogether and instead put the focus on the Forerunners and the Flood, making Halo 4 the last mainline Halo. 343 should’ve expanded the Covenant War story through ODST Part 2 and Contact Harvest first, then moved into Halo 4 with art styles inspired by maps like Epitaph and Construct, giving Chief the ability to use Enforcers, Sentinels, and Mini Sentinels to fight the Flood keeping it fresh, intense, and fully Halo without dragging in more alien factions.

My perfect timeline would’ve been right after Halo: Reach: first Halo 3 ODST Part 2, then Contact Harvest, and finally Halo 4 then Halo 5 after that.

[carmine sleet]

Contact Harvest would need to be heavily reworked to make sense as a game, something which honestly doesn't sound worth it to me, especially when a new story could be told instead

Also, I wouldn't say making a Halo 4 where all we fight is the Flood is "keeping it fresh". Halo's more than just fighting the Flood, always has been since Combat Evolved

[lapis steeple]

Could Reach have been saved if Cole survived with his Flagship, the Infinity,the Type of Macs we gave Earth in Halo 2,the Spirit of Fire,20 Punichs and Enoch's+a ton a sabres or at least survived long enough for the schism to happen

[wispy pewter]

if Reach had an entire fleet of Infinity classes, perhaps.

see this is why they need to invest in more

instead of Spartans

[carmine sleet]

You could easily ask this exact thing but with a different planet, like Tribute, Arcadia or Madrigal. But also I doubt Cole not being at Reach was a deciding factor anyway, the Covenant fleets at Reach outnumbered the UNSC by allot. Plus, the Spirit of Fire isn't a ship meant for direct naval combat, she's a support ship. I doubt she would have affected much of what happened at Reach

[carmine sleet]

The UNSC definitely didn't have the means to invest into a fleet of Infinity class ships at the time Reach fell

[wispy pewter]

Yeah. Which is why I said they need to now

[carmine sleet]

You never used the word "now" in what you said

Like, you don't specify at all you were talking about the UNSC in 2560, who also can't just make a bunch of Infinity class ships due to supply line issues in the wake of the Created conflict and the Banished taking advantage of the situation

[wispy pewter]

ok I forgot a fullstop

[stoic hamlet]

Bringing up the Spirit of Fire in any serious context is like asking “could the RMS Olympic have saved the Japanese fleet at Midway?”

You might think I’m being facetious, but I’m genuinely not. That’s the closest comparable example we have, and it fits more than mos people realize.

[lapis steeple]

I say this because Reaches defenses were among the best in humanity

[carmine sleet]

I'm gonna be honest, I know less about naval combat than I would like to admit so I don't really know much about the RMS Olympic

[stoic hamlet]

She was an ocean liner (sister ship to the Titanic) converted into a Troopship during WW1.

[lapis steeple]

I say the Spirit of Fire because it's got a ton of resources kept within and most importantly Spartan 2s

[carmine sleet]

Ok, that's real neat. Didn't know the Titanic had a sister ship

[stoic hamlet]

It has 3 Spartan II’s (who weren’t even assigned to the ship itself or part of its actual complement), and the reason the UNSC lost Reach was due to the orbital war.

A ship meant for ground support isn’t really ideal for space combat. It wouldn’t really contribute anything.

Hence the analogy: what would the RMS Olympic have done to save the Japanese Fleet?

Just because a ship is a protagonist in a game (with some absurd plot armour, to boot) doesn’t mean she’d suddenly be some god of war.

Part of the reason she’s lasted so long is no one takes her seriously enough to kill her.

[marble lion]

The Titanic also had another sister ship the Britannic. She sank on November, 21st 1916 when she hit a sea mine off the coast of Greek island of Kea.

[stoic hamlet]

Yup though Olympic was the lead ship of the class.

[wispy pewter]

if they had sarisa class macs for every ship longer than 1km maybe they could

[lapis steeple]

I mean 100% battles won also The main question is could these additions stall Reaches downfall to the Schism

[stoic hamlet]

I mean, Tribute lasted until the schism but still got glassed partially.

Circumstance as well, I believe.

[wispy pewter]

I mean

20 punics?

sure

[vagrant ocean]

Reach did have orbital platforms, both Moncton and Erőd class.

[lapis steeple]

I know but the scenario proposes having their orbital defense grid be on the same level as earths

[vagrant ocean]

It also proposes the UNSCDF not having lost most of its large vessels by 2552.

[lapis steeple]

Mhm

[lapis steeple]

Only had a handful of Punichs by Reaches fall and One got destroyed in the battle

Etc

[vagrant ocean]

You do realize that once the full invasion fleet arrives the UNSC is still cooked right? Maybe they’ll last another week at most.

[lapis steeple]

I know Reach is done for I'm just saying that with bolstering could it at least last till the Schism

[vagrant ocean]

I still don’t agree. Maybe it can be extended till the first week of September but the same result will occur.

It wasn’t until November when the schism occurred.

Even if they sent the entire Home Fleet from Earth, it wouldn’t do much.

All you’ll succeed in doing is further cripple the Navy and kill more Spartans.

[wispy pewter]

I'd say if they had 20 Valiant class refitted with the Infinity Macs they stand a better chance

there were like 400 Covie ships right?

[vagrant ocean]

315

[wispy pewter]

ya

[vagrant ocean]

All with fighter and boarding craft complements.

[stoic hamlet]

Tbf, power of the MAC’s isn’t the problem. It’s the amount.

There were too many ships.

[wispy pewter]

Yeah but the Infinity macs could deal with alien ships easier

[lapis steeple]

So we have:
Cole with the Harvest

Earth levels of orbital defense complexes

A Ton of Sabres

20 Punichs

20 Enoch's

The Infinity and Eternity and their escorts

And finally the SOF to help with evacuation or something

[wispy pewter]

before the Infinity it was like 3 for 1 right?

[vagrant ocean]

Yeah the issue with this scenario is that it’s so incredibly unrealistic that you might as well say they also have an army of Sergeant Johnsons on the ground.

Even then, the fleet engagement over reach was the largest naval battle of the war.

[wispy pewter]

"What if the entire current US Navy was at Pearl Harbour"

[vagrant ocean]

Each Covenant vessel has a complement of fighter craft and boarding craft.

[lapis steeple]

Thats more what if the High Charity defense fleet was at the unyielding heiropant

[stoic hamlet]

Depends on how fast they reload/recharge.

[vagrant ocean]

Let’s say each Covie vessel has a dozen seraphs or banshees, that’s still 4,000 fighter craft the UNSC has to deal with.

[wispy pewter]

40+ ships and 2 Infinity class. Lol that would definitely help

No point going over it though. UNSC doesnt have 20 punics

[lapis steeple]

Its more to demonstrate how unfathomably cooked reach is to the point that the scenario isn't even proposing could it be saved but more could it be postponed before the schism

[lapis steeple]

Even if they beat the initial attacking forces they'll just send more

[vagrant ocean]

Still, it would give them another month at most. All you’d end up doing is kill any Spartan on Reach and further cripple the Navy.

[empty bloom]

The constant obsession with turning one of the Halo books least conductive to making a game into, well, a game, always struck me as incredibly odd.

[lapis steeple]

I mean the first Halo game was based on a book

And most of them are peak

*Most

[empty bloom]

...

Halo The Flood came out after CE.

[lapis steeple]

Wait it did

[empty bloom]

And Fall of Reach wasn't about the events of Halo CE.

[lapis steeple]

More you know

[coarse hamlet]

Fall of reach came out like half a month before ce but the game mandated the book and not the other way around

[sonic lagoon]

Did The Prophet of Truth ever love anyone? Was he capable of feat?

[minor sky]

Himself

Also that chair he sits in 24/7. Must of been really comfy for him be in it all the time

[sonic lagoon]

He was the most prominent pc elitist of them all.

[tight badge]

How many times stronger is an elite than a human

like 5?

[frigid heart]

Chiefs been manhandled by elites in the past in books so about as strong as Chief

Or more

[modest marsh]

I think you first need to understand that strength isn’t measured linearly as it can have different means of quantifying such as max lift or striking power, which we do not have precise stats for in regards to Elites

Individuals are going to be much stronger or weaker than others as a consequence in differences in muscle mass as well as neurosomatic conditioning

Ripa Moramee was probably way stronger than most Elites just going off his size

You also have to factor technology, because Elite combat harnesses function as a form of power armor, which can also vary in effectiveness

To use an exceptional example, Jega Rdomnai was able to effortlessly restrain Tremonious, a Jiralhanae chieftain

In his case though that’s almost certainly a consequence of his unique physiology and cybernetic upgrades and prosthetics

[modest marsh]

Also, I disagree with that particular phrasing

In TFOR and First Strike, he wrestles with an elite and struggles but ultimately wins in both cases

In TFOR, the elite is said to be an even match for him

In First Strike, it is noted that that particular Elite is in black Spec Ops armor and it is emphasized that Chief’s injuries from the events of CE have deteriorated his strength significantly, and yet they are still evenly matched

[tight badge]

I mean how much can they deadlift without augments or armor

[modest marsh]

Like I said we don’t really have stats for something like that, but given that Elites in storm harnesses (which generally are “sleeveless” and thus do not impact lifting or striking power with their arms) can displace Spartans it probably wouldn’t be a stretch to guess it’s upwards of several hundred kilograms, easily

[tight badge]

Numbers Ive found saying that an elite is 5 times stronger on average but contradictory is saying they can lift about a 1000 pounds

[modest marsh]

The heaviest object that an Elite has interacted with is when Ripa Moramee was nearly crushed by the Spirit of Fire’s FTL drive, but he managed to stop it

However this goes back to the problem of “he’s an exceptional elite whose physical strength is further amplified by his armor”

[modest marsh]

If you are using AI, it’s probably pulling from the fact that the last time a value was given for how much Mjolnir increases strength was in the 09 encyclopedia where it says it multiplies the strength of the wearer by a factor of 5

The “1000lbs” part is probably from TFOR where it says that the Spartans could lift 3x their body weight

Or because they can lift Spartans

[tight badge]

One thing I want all Sci Fi to do is actually state how strong things are on average because everything being vague or just not explained gets boring fast

[modest marsh]

I assume that the writers largely avoid giving out numbers for things like this because it creates contradictions or scenarios where things can behave strangely

It is rare for elites to be without their armor, but for all intents and purposes, fighting an elite in close quarters is meant to be a practical death sentence for any unaugmented human unless you are extraordinarily gifted and lucky

[tight badge]

Unless you are literally the strongest man on the planet good luck beating an elite

[modest marsh]

Dutch for instance manages to kill 2 elites in the comic Helljumpers, both times via strangulation/neck snapping, but as you say, he is legitimately stupid strong

In the former case, he does it by bending a steel bar around its jaw, which is, uh…not possible for normal people

In the latter case he does it by landing on top of it with his legs which gives him a lot more to work with in terms of torque

Funnily enough, in Mass Effect 2, the assassin Thane Krios has a similar technique for dispatching Krogan (their equivalent for Brutes)

[tight badge]

That’s pretty confusing how they do that

I do not know much about mass effect so correct me when I say that ODSTs and Thane are normal people and shouldnt be able to do that

[modest marsh]

Well, Thane is an alien, but anatomically similar to humans in terms of size and athleticism by all indications

[tight badge]

And in other Sci-Fi in the newest update helldivers are shown deadlifting 500kg platinum bars pretty casually

[modest marsh]

In fairness, Helldivers are quite literally abusing PEDs

In the case of Dutch, he is just an unusually strong guy

There isn’t a clear reason why besides the theme of him being the heavy weapons guy à la Team Fortress 2

[tight badge]

Thats not where it ends with divers a well timed punch shatters a voteless head even if they have weak bones thats still impossible for a normal person

[modest marsh]

While Helldivers trends towards realism in many ways I think you can infer the precise in game mechanics aren’t meant to be interpreted literally and that’s just an example of weirdness that can be introduced by trying to reconcile those things

Video games in general demand unrealistic physical attributes of the characters in it, particularly the player character, even if there is no in-setting justification for it

I mean, within Halo itself, you can play as an ODST, who are not subject to any form of performance enhancing substance or power armor, and yet they can still do things beyond what a real world athlete could

Some of that is going to be an intentional artistic choice, but for instance, I don’t think that “canonically” we’re meant to assume everyone on Alpha 9 could punch a Brute to death if they tried even though you can easily do that in gameplay

[stoic hamlet]

Or that they can punch a wraith to make it explode.

You can do that in gameplay, too.

[modest marsh]

No obviously that part is real

[tidal crater]

Yo wazzup guys, would anyone be able to read my Halo 3 ODST Part 2 script lol?

[stoic hamlet]

Sir/ma’am this is a Wendy’s.

[empty bloom]

Oh, I found out that Halo Infinite elites will, in fact, complain that there are no sleeveless combat harnesses with the Banished on Zeta Halo.

Which is funny.

[dreamy plover]

Revive Chak 'Lok for One more Game

[orchid kettle]

I kinda miss how in Halo 2, Chief and Arby only really punched tanks to open up a section where they could then drop a grenade into some critical piece of machinery

and then in every game afterwards, you can just beat the tank to death anyway and you wonder why anyone would even bother giving up a grenade

[empty bloom]

Well you see

Tonk

[modest marsh]

Well, it’s faster

[orchid kettle]

Yeah and thats fine for the scorpion in pvp, but in campaign it can feel like the wraith is less of a threat

Especially when combined with plasma pistol EMP

[unborn patrol]

the plasma pistol emp doesnt make any sense anyway

glad they have electricity based weapons now but they brought back the plasma pistol emp anyway

[vagrant ocean]

They brought the EMP back cuz people were crying.

[unborn patrol]

halo oldhead favourite pastime

[still heron]

Can't EMP vehicles in two. And if you're on Heroic or Legendary that can get you killed easily.

[still heron]

I mean while yes it is required for the noob combo there really wasn't much else to it on PvP. I don't think that it'll be like how it was in Reach.

[red horizon]

It's fun.

[modest marsh]

You can’t EMP drivable vehicles, but technically the EMP effect existed in CE

Plasma grenades had it too which is reflected in the novel First Strike where Chief, Johnson, and Locklear use them to fry the electronics on a locked covenant door so Chief could pry it open

It’s mostly relevant against sentinels specifically, because they’re instantly killed by the EMP effect rather than damage

[warm ridge]

because people complained about it, and the electricity based weapons really weren't all that good for emp in the 1st place.

plasma pistol emp is waay better

[unborn patrol]

what

its literally so easy to emp a vehicle with them compared to the plasma pistol

you just put a couple rounds into a vehicle and its empd

[warm ridge]

guess you just don't play on a high enough level like me 🤷

[still heron]

Think it's possible to change electric based weapons to power weapons in the future?

[empty bloom]

Disruptor isn't much of a power weapon

[unborn patrol]

girl what

[unique rune]

gotta get those high level plasma pistol EMP clutch plays

[unborn patrol]

their whole game hinging on dat EMP

[still heron]

Again, it's just a thought. Maybe with some modifications it could be one that can restrain armor for a brief moment.

[unique rune]

I don’t think people would appreciate reverse armor lock

[red horizon]

Armor lock armor lock armor lock.

[empty bloom]

Oh god no.

[carmine sleet]

I still like my idea of the shock weapons basically inverting the controls on a vehicle

[empty bloom]

You want to restrict movement? That's one of the single most hated mechanics in video game history.

Like? Every single slowdown effect in any game is vehemently hated

[empty bloom]

I feel like messing with your HUD is the best option for flavor, personally.

Doing stuff like removing the reticule or freezing the radar

[still heron]

I'm reminded of Radar Jammer from 3. I know about the active camo armor ability creating a similar effect for Reach and 4 but that's intentional.

[carmine sleet]

Maybe while on foot. I just think they should do something at least when you're shooting a vehicle with one

[still heron]

Speculations aside: how did the brutes in 2's Uprising level managed to get a stash of UNSC weapons? Did they salvage it from the Pelicans at the Library/Delta Halo landing zone or from the drop/weapon pods?

[red horizon]

Remind me, where did Uprising take place?

[still heron]

Near the Control Room on Installation 05 (Delta Halo.)

[red horizon]

Ah, well then more than likely the drop pods, and I wouldn't be surprised if they took UNSC weaponry as trophies of sorts.

[still heron]

Alternatively, Miranda could've sent a marine squad to secure the control room while she tried to bypass the barrier around the Library. Similar tactic as her father.

[vagrant ocean]

All are likely,

[carmine sleet]

Brutes are known to take trophies from those they kill

[vagrant ocean]

And they don’t have a bias against “primitive” projectile weapons like the elites do.

[stoic hamlet]

So are Sangheili, tbf.

…and humans.

…and Kig-Yar.

[vital condor]

Just finished halo ce, and watched the 11 terminal who are the prophets?

[dense falcon]

The ruling race of the Covenant

Regret, Mercy and Truth were the hierarchs, the three top decision-makers of the faction

[vital condor]

so in the jerarchy the prophets are the highest race

[modest marsh]

The prophets are considered the religious and political leaders of the covenant, yes

[vagrant ocean]

They are the popes of the Covenany.

[modest marsh]

They share stewardship of the Covenant’s government with the Elites, who make up its military leadership and can also serve on the high council as government officials similar to senators

The high prophets or “hierarchs” have supreme authority however

[vital condor]

i was gonna ask because in the terminal 11 a shangeili says that they will not notify the prophets of their new discovery until they hear everything the oracle need to say, why they would not notify them?

[minor sky]

That is so funny

[empty bloom]

Pretty much any species with a martial history honestly.

[minor sky]

But not the grunts

Well, I think that one Banished Grunt warlord took trophies

Could be misremembering

[modest marsh]

If you go off of in game dialogue, several lines from grunts indicate they want to keep pieces of Chief’s armor

[minor sky]

Hmmm don't remember those. Do remember the Jackals yelling "Kig-yar kill Spartan! Claim Helmet!" when you get shot

[empty bloom]

They've talked about claiming his helmet since Halo 2 at least

[minor sky]

The Jackals didn't speak english till Halo 5

[unique rune]

the Unggoy definitely have been saying stuff about taking his helmet or boots for a while

[empty bloom]

Grunts, not Jackals

[minor sky]

Oh

Sorry, mb

https://tenor.com/view/american-psycho-willem-dafoe-duh-duhh-obviously-gif-16794513

[still heron]

I still wonder about that. I know Thel doesn't have any issues using UNSC weapons since he's quite pragmatic/flexible in using any methods for victory/survival.

Guess "acquiring" trophies comes the curiosity on how to use/display them. Though hearing that Elite in Uprising underestimating the Rocket Launcher does give me a good chuckle.

[minor sky]

I was taking photos of the Promethean Knights in Halo 4's theater mode last night and I was reminded of how much I wish the Knights had more horror to their reveal

Their creation is genuinely creepy when you think about it, and I think they could've played it up more. The earlier versions of their designs really pushed the "soul trapped inside a machine" idea, and that kind of got lost a little bit. For the record I do like the final design, quite a bit. In fact, while I was taking those photos and seeing their animations in slow-motion, it really did strike me how good they can look

But I think they kind of lost the energy of their earlier concepts in the need to make a more accommodating design

They could've made up for the lack of it in the design with sounds, behaviorial effects, and scripting

Like, having Knights' sounds be made up of distorted human voices could make for a really creepy effect

[warm ridge]

He also struggles with an Elite directly in Halo 4 that was about to hit him with an Energy sword, before he was able to use the Elite's own force against it by "moving out of the way" and causing the Elite to go down the elevator shaft.
@tight badge @frigid heart

[sonic lagoon]

Can Insurrectionists be considered socialist, fascist, capitalist, or anarchist?

[lapis steeple]

We can't really call them any of that since they are the most scattered group in all of Halo. really Insurrectionist just means anybody who wanted freedom from the Unsc so there are remnants from the Interplanetary wars,Minor cells etc etc etc all kinds of groups

[dim goblet]

Tbf though Chief literally JUST came out of Cryo and if I'm not mistaken, that was the very first enemy in the game.

And he almost got rocked by a ship held together by duct tape and zip ties 3 seconds prior

[vagrant ocean]

We don’t really know, as the politics of the rebels are unexplored. I wouldn’t be shocked if there are Neo-Friedenist and Neo-Koslovic rebel groups, which are extreme futuristic forms of fascism and communism respectively.

[vagrant ocean]

It is theorized by me and @modest marsh (I think) that it was the cloning of genetically modified soldiers by the Friedenist and Neo-Friedenist movements in the Interplanetary Wars and Rainforest Wars that forced the UNSC to pass the Mortal Dictata.

Also I just noticed that the Spartan-II program only violates two of the known subsections of Section 1A/3.

[lapis steeple]

Why does someone as brilliant and accomplished as Silva make the dumb decision(Knowing the Cole protocol btw) to carry a COVENANT ship with flood

[lapis steeple]

Idiot

[empty bloom]

Because as a human being in a universe where he is under intense and immense pressure at all times, no other feasible way home, and no other operational objective beyond "Well, we have what could make a great bioweapon and a premium example of the enemy hardware, so maybe they'll give me a pass, and if we don't go back we'll all die", he lacks the ability to know things we do as fans.

It is a literary device known as 'Dramatic Irony', normally, but a failing to understand it is generally an issue in the chair, not in the story.

In this case, part of the irony is knowing his mission is doomed to fail. We know there were no survivors because of Chief's ending to the story in CE. No matter what, everyone but him and a handful died.

[sonic lagoon]

Anarchists would also be a good options, like the greens in the Russian civil war or like Zapatista in the Mexican civil war, trying to reclaim their own resources from corporations or centralized governments.

[vagrant ocean]

Some could also be corporate militias.

[warm ridge]

"just coming out of cryo" isn't a problem. Chief just came out of cryo in Halo 1, and within 5 minutes was already shooting enemies with an assault rifle & flying down to Installation 04 in 15 minutes.
Spartans are meant to be fully awake & able to use there full maximum strength within the 1st minute of waking up out of cryo, kinda the whole point you know?

if anything he'd be stronger because he just had a 4 year nap. He's not worn out, not fatigued, really anything. He's in absolute perfect condition.

[warm ridge]

• 1. The Marines didn't know all the dangers about the Flood, all they knew is that it was some sort of disease. Possibly a Covenant bioweapon gone out of control.
• 2. He was trying to save his own life by capturing a Covenant ship, which he could then use to contact UNSC forces to rescue him.
• 3. ONI gives him a pat on the back or something because now they can start experimenting with the Flood earlier then the events of Mona Lisa.

[marsh lintel]

for reasons i may or may not reveal later, how do elites suppress or mitigate injuries, if not with human health packs? i'm trying to avoid having their hp regenerate on its own here even though that's the case in halo reach lmao

[empty bloom]

They simply tough it out.

An elite in Outcasts has a compound fracture due to Vale breaking his limb, and spends the rest of his short life (As he dies of infection) in continuous pain.

[marsh lintel]

right, then i'm gonna have to get a little creative there.

[empty bloom]

Cases of elites seeking medical aid are pretty few and far between, though I would assume blood loss being mitigated by them understanding how to cauterize a wound is a thing, as in Halo 5 two Elite medics (Only a thing due to Thel's military reforms) discuss the reformed Covenant purposely lowering the heat on their energy swords to prevent wounds from cauterizing properly-meaning the concept of purposely cauterizing, or purposely not cauterizing, a wound is a known factor in their medical lingo.

Greivously wounded elites suffering from extreme blood loss often self-terminate to regain honor.

[modest marsh]

Broken Circle indicates the Covenant uses nanobots to facilitate disease prevention and possibly treatment of acute injury:

Like the others, Vil had been treated with antibiotic, microscopic nanoagents, which protected them with astonishing efficiency, destroying all local antigens invading their system before any harm could be done. The air was breathable on Janjur Qom, the gravity bearable, at least to Sangheili. But the insectlike flying creatures grew bolder, and soon sucked at Vil’s skin—they were tiny, almost diaphanous organisms that seemed to combine legs with wings. They died almost instantly when they drank his blood, not from nanoagents, he supposed, but because Sangheili blood was so very alien to this world.

[empty bloom]

Recalling a bit more, I think they do have some form of nanite-based medicinal tech mentioned in one of the books involving-

Crap.

[modest marsh]

Humanity and the forerunners seemingly both have a near identical technology though its degree of sophistication and capabilities are vague

The existence of the regeneration/repair field for instance

[empty bloom]

The regen field tends to get described as explicitly forerunner-tech based even in human hands IIRC

[stoic hamlet]

Also, tbf, John does basically the exact same thing once he gets the Ascendant Justice.

Yea, they don’t go right to Earth… but they go to Reach, which did still have UNSC forces and colonies in-system.

There were no Flood on board, but his plan was basically the exact same.

[empty bloom]

Halo 4's "Regen Kinetic Dispersal Field" is explicitly a Forerunner AA item cosmetically, despite being a piece of UNSC tech; And the Repair Field of Infinite is an explicitly Forerunner emitters in a UNSC package.

[modest marsh]

The halo wars application is strictly a human based technology though

(That we know of anyways, it may be secretly forerunner derived)

[empty bloom]

But does it fall in the field of mechanics abstraction?

[modest marsh]

It’s weird

Everything else has at least some sort of diegetic component and the actual concept of a glowing green field that repairs or heals stuff isn’t exactly unprecedented

[empty bloom]

Wars 2's mechanics tend to fall into a weird slot of quasicanon (Mechanics=/=Canon function) sometimes, like with the Bloodfuel guns.

[modest marsh]

This would make it singular in it being something completely non-canon whereas every other leader power or unit is at least based off of something

[empty bloom]

Where the Bloodfuel guns and equipment are canon, but what they actually do is not canon, and thus undepicted.

[orchid kettle]

To be fair, at the time, we werent really told Reach existed in a system with other colonies

and John uses the excuse that because the Covenant already know where Reach is, there's no harm in going to it

[modest marsh]

Out of universe it’s clearly inspired by the halo 3 regenerator, but we don’t really have a good explanation why the UNSC would have an equivalent technology in 2531

[empty bloom]

Same with the weird modified railgun... Things. The ones Extractor Marines use.

[orchid kettle]

Halo 3 equipment is kinda just cringe

[modest marsh]

Aren’t those blitz units?

[orchid kettle]

Bring back the trailer bubble shield

[modest marsh]

Blitz I feel is in its own category

[orchid kettle]

I like the idea that its a lil grenade thing you throw into the dirt

[empty bloom]

Yes, but it was confirmed by Jeff Easterling that while the equipment those units use are canon, the actual function is not.

[modest marsh]

I mean, to be clear, I don’t think we’re meant to assume much of the RTS gameplay is meant to be representative of lore, and that would include the efficacy of a regeneration field in putting damaged vehicles and marines back together

[marsh lintel]

ok this i can probably work with.

[modest marsh]

A mist of nanobots is at least more plausible than uhhh

“Green energy” which is already what we have to work with in other cases

[empty bloom]

The actual wording of what he said is that the equipment is canon in terms of existence, but actual function is not the same, as the in-game description of the blitz units is basically life force/soul drain mechanics.

[sonic lagoon]

Meridian is basically a corporate militia but kinda aligned with UNSC at times. Do you differentiate between corporate militia and fascist? They kinda overlap but can be different.

[empty bloom]

(Personally, I like to think of it as being like the Necron Gauss weaponry)

[empty bloom]

Right, but it offers enough ambiguity that I could see it going both ways with the SoF, effectively.

[stoic hamlet]

I mean, per divine wind, it isn’t.

[empty bloom]

Also, if I'm not mistaken, the Regenerator of Halo 3 actually explicitly does not heal your actual injuries, only your shields.

[empty bloom]

But that is according to Halo EVG, so...

[vagrant ocean]

Well corporate militias are just extremist capitalist. Fascism will kill anyone they deem “defective”.

[modest marsh]

Yeah but consider that Denning could just be wrong smh

[modest marsh]

That’s true to gameplay

However, the drop shield in Reach does explicitly regenerate health and is treated as an in universe fact in the game manual

[empty bloom]

The drop shield is not the Halo 3 regenerator though.

The regen thing being a side effect that they don't quite get is pretty funny though

[hybrid pilot]

hello, lore people! been reading up on the Halo extended universe all year, and I went a little bananas and wrote a script for a sequel to Halo Infinite over in #1076327824924872755

would mean the world if people who really know the lore would care to give it a look and tell me where i messed up lol

it's quite long, so feel free to skim lol. it admittedly starts off slow, since it starts shortly after Infinite with Chief still stranded, but I think it picks up by the end of mission two

[sonic lagoon]

Yeah that’s why a lot of them aligned with fascists historically, even if they were not self-identifying as fascist, like in a lot of Latin American countries in the Cold War.

[vagrant ocean]

Fascists are also more willing to overlook cruel working conditions so long as they get paid to look the other way or the people are “lesser”

[sonic lagoon]

The rockefellers did so for years in the US during the gilded ages. Banana republics were very similar.

[sonic lagoon]

A lot of US presidents before Theodore Roosevelt were financially influenced to look the other way when corporate security went violent against workers.

[sonic lagoon]

Fallout even has very similar scenarios in pre-war America where corporations fight unions.

[stoic hamlet]

It’s almost like Fallout is inspired by the US of the 1900’s-1960’s.

[sonic lagoon]

Yeah, so basically the Cuban missile crisis, the Vietnam war, Woodstock style hippie culture (though hippie culture existed without the Vietnam was and had the same kinda clothing style of the 50s), Watergate, the Dissolution of the Soviet Union, Desert Storm, Afghanistan and Iraq war, Russo-Ukrainian war, and other events did not occur in the Fallout timeline. Without the Cuban Missile crisis the Kennedy assassination could have been looked at differently, in fact under Nixon the 50 states would be divided into 13 commonwealths, Nixon would have resigned for non-war related reasons, Reagan was still president but did not cause the Soviet Union to fall or even east Germany. Reagan is the last named US president that is the same as the real world timeline, though others in the real world may have been elected without their post-cold war events.

[wispy pewter]

Fallout is actually an alternate reality. The 50s aesthetic is just the design of the universe. And btw China strikes first canonically

[stoic hamlet]

Well, it’s a split from our own around 1945.

Fallout went hard into nuclear fission, whereas we went into transistors.

In terms of the nukes, yeah, China fired first, as there were US troops on the Chinese mainland, pushing towards Beijing. (After China invaded Alaska).

[wispy pewter]

Yeah. Can’t wait for season 2

[strange pumice]

Who the Janissary is?
I learned about them today, it's like rogue UNSC forces, like Spartans or marines?

[modest marsh]

Janissaries are an umbrella term for a competing class of super soldier program that was primarily developed by the criminal underground on Venezia to create mercenary agents that can be hired out to other factions

most of them are indentured servants, many seemingly forced into a contract to pay off debts, and aspects of the spartan program are crudely imitated

[strange pumice]

So if in short, it's like mercenaries that been created by rebels?

[modest marsh]

rebel-affiliated criminal groups

The main difference between Spartans and Janissaries is that Spartans were created at an exorbitant cost, while Janissaries are made with the expressed purpose of generating profit by leasing them out to groups that want to stay competitive with the UNSC that previously had a monopoly on super soldiers

[strange pumice]

Thanks

[fast heron]

So we see an executioner in halo wars 2 about to kill atriox before he rebelled, do you think the banished would use an executioner or at least have a unit that looked like executioner armor?

[stoic hamlet]

They’re raiders and mercenaries. They’ll use whatever they can get their hands on.

[fast heron]

Do you think they would use executioners though, like for public executions?

Maybe if someone betrayed the banished?

Or if they failed too many times?

[stoic hamlet]

I mean, yeah, Atriox kills anyone who can’t live up to his standards. He doesn’t tolerate failure.

[modest marsh]

I would think Chieftains and warlords and the like would carry out their own executions

Gravity hammers are already more than up to the task

[unborn patrol]

so whats the consensus on what the flood is right now? because for the longest Ive heard it was precursors becoming corrupted, but weve also heard that flood was the point all along? like the precursors built life to consume it. like farming cattle. or do we just not know what it is and both are equally valid theories?

which one it is also potentially defines the actions of forerunners

[jade cape]

The flood are corrupted precursors in origin, who mutated over time after transmuting themselves into dust for survival. Time mutated them into what they are now.

the idea that the flood was ever intended to be part of some plan is a narrative almost entirely from the Primordial/Gravemind, although there were some precursors (or at least it’s alluded to) who believed that what happened to the forerunners in the midst of their total demise & collapse was something of a cosmic reckoning, in a manner of speaking

a lot of the basis for all of this comes from the Forerunner Trilogy: (Cryptum, Primordium & Silentium) by Greg Bear, although I can’t recall it all super vividly, it’s mostly from memory

[modest marsh]

Part of the problem with determining what is absolutely true is that we are at the whim of unreliable narrators

It’s intentionally unclear what is known for certain

That being said, I think we can look to the thematic parallels between the Flood and the mythological inspiration it’s derived from

Most Flood myths assign some sort of divine power as the reason the disaster occurs, as retribution for some unforgivable sin that wipes out all but a few survivors

[sonic lagoon]

What are the ideologies of the Insurrectionists in the TV show? I have yet to watch it.

Also the cut brute tank from Halo Wars 1 is basically a wraith with a cannon instead of mortar, kinda like the AAT from the Star Wars prequel’s droid army.

[unborn patrol]

Yeah what I was thinking of as well

[minor sky]

When is Edge Of Dawn out?

[wispy pewter]

2077

[modest marsh]

Now

[warm ridge]

that's right 😳

[charred whale]

i am revisting Halo CE, i last played in my childhood so currently at the index site where masterchief gets the index
343 comments about his armour suit

which is by his standard class 2

and fighting the flood requires class 12 armour

why the duck didnt he just upgrade his suit goddamit

i mean look at it

he can control and repair the installation

[modest marsh]

You mean why didn’t Spark upgrade Chief’s suit?

That may have been theoretically possible under more ideal circumstances but clearly that wasn’t in the cards at the time

https://www.halopedia.org/Upgrade_seed

[carmine sleet]

I also doubt Chief would have been willing to just swap his armour out based off of the word of a floating light bulb he just met

[modest marsh]

Well…

“These Sentinels will supplement your combat systems. But I suggest you upgrade to at least a Class Twelve Combat Skin. Your current model only scans as a Class Two—which is unsuited for this kind of work.”

If there’s a battle suit six times as powerful as MJOLNIR armor, he thought, I’ll be first in line to try it on.

[carmine sleet]

Ok, to be fair, I haven't got round to reading The Flood, I've had allot going on

[modest marsh]

Well, may as well start with the omnibus release

[charred whale]

well man sees strong armour man happy

[charred whale]

but he literally teleported him

and its not like the index is running away

[modest marsh]

No, but the flood is attempting to capture and repair two FTL capable warships on the rings surface

[charred whale]

i mean they still escaped anyways

and then in halo infinte, does the spark talks about class armours aagain

or are we class 6 already

[modest marsh]

I think you’re a bit confused

The flood does not escape I04 successfully

There are two separate outbreaks that occur in its orbit but they are resolved with no survivors

There’s another, separate incident on the gas mining facility on the gas giant the ring was orbiting

The flood never managed to escape the system

[charred whale]

in like halo 2 they took over the covenant shipship tho

in halo 3 the landed in arc

maybe my memory chip is failing

[modest marsh]

There’s no flood in Halo 2 that were present in CE

They were all destroyed

The flood that appears in Halo 3 came from Delta Halo specifically

[charred whale]

https://www.reddit.com/r/halo/comments/166w6kb/how_did_the_flood_appear_in_halo_2_didnt_chief/

i understand now

[modest marsh]

Guilty Spark also isn’t in Infinite

As far as how combat skins are rated, there’s no real basis for what constitutes class 2 vs class 12

[carmine sleet]

I have a copy already thankfully, it's just I have so many books to read from Don Quixote to Dracula in the pile next to my bed

[modest marsh]

Based on a line that Spark says in halo 3 if the player dies, Chief upgrading from Mark V to Mark VI didn’t move the needle at all

[charred whale]

damm

[charred whale]

well 343 took over the project and buried a few things deep

but

what about gaurdians

i havent touched halo 4 and 5

[modest marsh]

It’s a throwaway line that isn’t meant to suggest anything on its own, but subjectively I think the purpose of it is to indicate the technological gap between “modern” humanity and the forerunners, given that the most advanced piece of military hardware ranks so low on their scale

The new lore makes much clearer distinctions in terms of what forerunner combat skins are capable of

[charred whale]

i think class 1 is unharmed human civilian and MC is class 2, so on 12 would be at the level of consiousness transfer and clones stuff i guess

[carmine sleet]

The classes are how good the armour is, not whether or not someone can transfer their consciousness

Like, if I transfer my mind into someone else's body, that's not me putting on a good suit of armour, that's me stealing someone else's body

[modest marsh]

You should probably check out Halopedia if you’re curious about this type of stuff because it’s going to explain a lot of the general stuff you’re curious about

Like, what you’re describing is more or less something forerunner society does by default, their entire civilization is a product of genetic engineering and transferring parts of their consciousness between each other to some extent

[charred whale]

https://www.reddit.com/r/AskScienceFiction/comments/2l7mq8/halo_is_there_any_record_of_a_class_18_combat/

https://www.reddit.com/r/HaloStory/comments/10ngp7k/combat_skin_classification_why_guilty_sparks/

[warm ridge]

Class 1 would be something like ODST armor, not "unarmored civillian".

[honest plume]

edge of dawn discussion [spoilers]

[wanton tinsel]

Spark actually just made that up on the spot to ego humanity, and the didact’s armor is just mjolnir tier (he’s a jedi, its not the suit)

Or at least that’s my theory 😎

[jade cape]

It’s a great novel. Think of it as a more comprehensive narrative retelling of the events of Combat Evolved. That’s all I’ll say without spoiling anything major or further.

[latent spruce]

Flood ain't been released/found yet, and Atriox & the Endless are absent

But Nuking The House of Reckoning, Best thing to happen.

[manic steppe]

Is there a reason why forerunner structures in the game look almost perfectly preserved without any sign of aging?

But irl a human structure unmaintained for like 5 weeks looks like an ancient vine covered lost temple

With parts falling off

I’m exaderating ofc

[warm ridge]

In what world makes you believe this?

It takes at least 3 - 6 months before a place really starts looking abandoned. Depending on how much rain there is, how fast things grow, etc.
Oftenly it can take well over a year before anyone even notices. Happens a lot when someone dies in there home & they didn't know or have anyone who checks up on them from time to time.

As for Forerunner stuff, easy. They use nanobots and shit, the whole structure basically self cleans itself.

Overtime this stuff can malfunction or break, but only in certain areas really.

[manic steppe]

I was Exaggerating but still

[warm ridge]

did you read the part about forerunner stuff

[manic steppe]

Yees

It does make sense

Is that like cannon or a theory

[empty bloom]

I don't think it shoots anything, no.

[unique rune]

those weird towers that are all over the rings shoot something

wouldn’t call them cannons though

[warm ridge]

yes that's cannon, forerunner stuff self cleans itself all the time.

like I said these systems do break down from time to time

[unborn patrol]

so funny I think

[latent spruce]

Gives them a good look though

[latent spruce]

Sentinal swarms.

[latent spruce]

They are communication beacons

[wispy pewter]

Halo 7 might be cookin

[deep gulch]

Hopefully it’s tasteful and so satisfying it sticks the ribs.

I sometimes question why some Halo Writers would have a Sangheili make love to a human woman.

Like kissing a Sangheili had to take weird tastes and real plunge into the unknown.

[unique rune]

probably not much of a stretch considering people like getting real freaky irl

[wispy pewter]

sci fi writters bro. James Cameron had his MC do that

[deep gulch]

So freaky and bizarre. You know in real life there would definitely be cases of humans and Sangheili relationships if the Halo universe was real. Like someone would get curious and try it eventually.

[minor sky]

I feel like that is a circumstance that would eventually happen with sci-fi universes that have humans and aliens corporating

[deep gulch]

It would eventually. Some odd ball would do it.

But like dang. How can a human have actual sexual attraction to one of those.

[minor sky]

Babylon 5, Star Trek, Mass Effect, ect. They all feature that sort of thing as a major part of their narratives

[deep gulch]

Brrrrr. Turians aren’t too much better.

https://tenor.com/view/mass-effect-vetra-turian-gif-13473467

Dang. Still no gifs

[minor sky]

Well on the flip-side, Captain Sheridan only met Delenn after she became Half-Human

always thought they should've made Sheridan a Commander when he was put in charge of Babylon 5. Always felt that title was more appropriate for the guy in charge of a Space Station

But that is a different sci-fi series

[deep gulch]

I wonder if Sangheilis have to be extra careful when giving a human a massage so they don’t break any bones.

[minor sky]

Anyway, with any luck I'll get a copy of Edge Of Dawn come Christmas

Really looking forward to reading the whole thing, especially after that preview

[deep gulch]

That is true. Lots of Sci Fi has that. Alien and human love is very common now.

[deep gulch]

Imagine if a Marine was taken captive by Covenant forces and a Brute took a liking to him. Such fear it would cause a man suicide may be an appropriate option.

[wispy pewter]

i do not want to imagine that

[dusk jetty]

Intelligent Cross species romance is inevitable in science fiction so long as the setting allows for it

I think for halos sake it’s a bridge too far but for mass effect and Star Wars where the alien designs are far more human inevitably those questions creep into mind

[dry cedar]

This and Dovo Nesto/Order of Restoration seems like the trajectory they're setting up for H7

Cloister supposedly has the means to restore the San'shyuum to how they were before the rings firing, and the San'shyuum were in a formal alliance with the Archaeohominids for a millennia or so, while humans are now basically their archnemesis, so it'll be interesting to see how that angle plays out as time goes on.

[minor sky]

I haven't read Edge Of Dawn yet but idk if I really want another Covenant 2.0 after the Jul 'Mdama plotline crashed and burned and we already had an entire trilogy about why the Covenant sucks and should be destroyed

[deep gulch]

I understand. Tiss a terrifying thought that would break even the most masculine and hardened Marines. Tiss not a pleasant thought.

[deep gulch]

Facts. Mass Effect and Star Wars? All for it.
Halo is just off putting.

[frigid heart]

I’ve heard great things about Edge of Dawn, but no covenant 2.0

[empty totem]

Does anyone have Halo: contact harvest? The novel

[minor sky]

I do but I haven't gotten to read it yet

[empty totem]

Can I dm you real quick

[minor sky]

Why?

[empty totem]

I am thinking to get Contact Harvest but I was wondering what the pages actually look like inside

Do you think you could dm a picture if you have time (optional)

[minor sky]

Sure

[manic steppe]

Did yall know the halo theme’s chant is the religious gospel of the covenant that the prophet of regret sings?

[minor sky]

You'll have to change your DM settings

They are currently set to friends only

[minor sky]

Yeah, really cool detail

Reminds me of how in Halo 4 the chanting that plays when the Didact awakens is the same chanting from Halo Cryptum when he awakens in that book

[manic steppe]

https://youtu.be/eOLY_-vqIbk?si=G52lO_1hs4DLp0RB

Honestly halo is my favorite sci fi lore, it’s genuinely underrated. Theres so much detail and i feel like theres an answer for every single thing

[lapis steeple]

Uhhh now that I think about it

When Arby says "Were it so easy" the first time does he mean "If only we could work together that easy" or "Haha did you think you could kill me like that"

[unique rune]

probably a bit of both

[last prairie]

Good afternoon, I wanted to ask if you know of any Halo game lines that would go well with the design we are doing for #1450869980567703613 especially something related to Arbiter and Master Chief

[latent spruce]

One San'Shyum? Heresy

[ripe willow]

Are the team status LEDs in Spartan helmets only for the IIs? I'm reading The Rubicon Protocol, and it hasn't been mentioned once, and the only books I've read so far with leading Spartan characters have been the ones with Blue Team, so I have been wondering about that.

[stoic hamlet]

III’s also have them with SPI.

It’s not something always mentioned though.

[fading flume]

[manic steppe]

Are there any massive surviving ancient human structures in the galaxy, or were they all destroyed / deteriorated?

Or ancient human structures in general

Ik in halo 1 and 2 the halo rings and stuff were supposed to be human structures, but the story changed by halo 3

[unique rune]

There’s probably some stuff still around
26th century humanity has recovered some examples of ancient human armor and at least one warship so I would imagine there are probably some more permanent installations waiting to be found

[fallow forge]

I just finished edge of dawn and im confused

[tight badge]

The UNSC found an ancient human ship

And according to a book I don’t know which one there were entire ancient human civilizations the forerunners didn’t know about

they were presumably still killed by halo but there could be large amounts of ancient human tech just sitting around

[ripe willow]

Forgot about the IIIs for a second 😭

[grizzled anchor]

Wonder what that corruptor IS doing rn

They escaped with a ship thats capable of slipspace travel

But we aint hear nun bout that since then

[grizzled anchor]

I like How jega got cooked by that little trap The III's set up cuz They thought It was easy pickings on 2 lone demons

6 special forces Units and a whole outpost

For 2 suicidal spartans

Peak trade

[empty bloom]

We did hear what happened.

There was a continuation last Haloween for it

[grizzled anchor]

Oh fr ?

I didnt see that

Gonna hear that audio book soon then

I love The ideia of flood infested spartans

[empty bloom]

The Condor crashed after slipspace jumping to a nearby system, and the subsequent crash basically left the multiple flood forms on the Condor forming a pseudo-pure form (Really, an actual pure form definitionally) around and inside the Spartan, comprised of the Spartan and a few of the engineers from the mining site.

Said pure form is currently helping defend and feed a gravemind in a dying system that is trying, presumably, to contact other flood.

[grizzled anchor]

Holy

Well thats bad

Really bad

Would be Peak to see It in a campaign

[tight badge]

Ive been wondering this for a while in a fight, what wins a death angel from a quiet place or a brute

[empty bloom]

God, that's such a stupid name for a monster. "Death Angel".

[tight badge]

Indeed

[grizzled anchor]

Tho i didnt expect The Spartan to turn into The pure form since thats essentially wasting Its mjolnir

[empty bloom]

The MJOLNIR was already 'wasted' aside from as extra armor.

[grizzled anchor]

Mhmm good point

Tho judging from The cosmetics

[empty bloom]

Part of GALLOWS involves destroying systems integral to proper MJOLNIR function, and a flood combat form isn't a particularly 'special' change for a Spartan. It's more like just a regular Spartan that now fights for the flood as another infection vector than a traditional combat form, but even then it's not super special beyond Spartans being rare.

[grizzled anchor]

Its pretty clear The flood can meld Any equipment and Pierce almost any material to Its own use

[tight badge]

They’re also invincible (poorly written) but that just means every hit from a brute will go into its organs

[empty bloom]

A combat form piloting a Mantis is frankly a more dire threat than a flood Spartan most of the time.

[grizzled anchor]

That does Go for Any vehichle tbh

[empty bloom]

That's literally my point lmao

A floodified Spartan is a threat to things, sure, and a bigger threat than most, if not any, combat form-or even some pure forms-but it's still not a particularly high value target, realistically speaking

[grizzled anchor]

Back my phone had died

[minor sky]

I wonder if they ever considered making Halo 4 take place way further into the future. I think that would've been a really fascinating angle to explore though I like a ton of the stuff they did wind up doing. Just a hypothetical really

[grizzled anchor]

Indeed but honestly Its essentially a death sentence to Any small group of Units tbh

Also

[grizzled anchor]

Ngl The worst vehicle infested pilot would be The HRUNTING YGGDRASIL FR

[unique rune]

in hindsight it feels like they probably should've set it at least like 15 years after the end of the war just to give everything more breathing room

I assume they must've felt constrained by the rampancy "limit" being ~7 years but surely they could've written in some kind of low-activity state for smart AI to stretch that time out

[grizzled anchor]

Ohhhh you Sweet Sweet poor Child

People have odd attractions to Anything

[minor sky]

Yeah. Then again, I do get the appeal of Chief waking up 4 years later and seeing a Galaxy that has changed in so little time

[unique rune]

I wonder if maybe they also felt some extra pressure from Reach's end cutscene
what with it showing a scene presumably from 2589 where humanity is recolonizing Reach with its new vaguely Forerunner-y cruiser

[minor sky]

Also if they did do this, odds are Lasky and Del Rio's ages would be swapped

Which is weird to think about

[minor sky]

Yeah. Would be an interesting angle pick up from Reach's final scene

Then again, idk how receptive fans would be if Chief woke up and everybody was dead

Halo 4 but it begins like the director's cut ending of Army Of Darkness

[spice forge]

Hi

[stoic hamlet]

I mean, yeah, it was a win for the Covenant, they just underestimated how good their counterintelligence was.

They duped ONI and the Banished, and convinced ONI to send at least 4 Spartan III’s and potentially (depending on timeline) the largest single deployment of MJOLNIR-armoured Spartans into a trap.

It was very much a Covenant win from top to bottom.

The issue was they did it so well they couldn’t have actually won the ground battle, assuming it took place.

[wispy pewter]

Yes

[deep gulch]

It’s so cool that Master Chief is officially part of the UNSC Navy. Like it’s just rad! He’s like a Navy Seal super soldier.

[latent spruce]

The III series was the more expendable version

[vagrant ocean]

He’s what Navy SEALs wish they could be.

[stoic hamlet]

Shame him being part of a military and beholden to a chain of command never actually comes up much.

[vagrant ocean]

Yeh, cuz most of his plots involve him being cut off from higher levels of command.

[still heron]

You can't really be a proper Spartan if you can't really be self sufficient especially during battle or when you're behind enemy lines.

I know each team is different and some stand out for certain tasks rather than others.

[lapis steeple]

"This Halo game is terrible,the good guys are dying."-my 7 year old brother on Reach

[stoic hamlet]

Gameplay wise sure, but even in the books he tends to flaunt the chain of command, or has some protocol that lets him circumvent it.

It’d be nice for that not to be the case, sometimes.

[vagrant ocean]

I like to think it has to do with the original plan of the program where the Spartans would be used as deep penetration teams where they’d have no contact with HIGHCOM until after the mission is complete, such as Operation: TALON, and they really only took orders from Halsey at first cuz they were HERS.

[grizzled anchor]

Mhmm we might be talking about different ocurrences

I was referencing a short story Halo:Head Hunters

In that specific setting we see 2 Head Hunters with spi (hence why i replyed to you) take out a small covie outpost but in The end They get ambushed by 6 silent shadow elites

Jega ended up being confirmed to be The elite that talks back to one of The spartans

[grizzled anchor]

Hence why This trade was really good for The unsc

[stoic hamlet]

I’m referring to the same event.

New Lore from Edge of Dawn recontextualizes it.

When combined with the lore from the original short story, it is objectively a win for Covenant counterintelligence units.

It’s arguably irrefutable, even.

The original short story mentions that 4 Headhunters and a second wave of a dozen Spartan III teams were earmarked for the assault on what they had been told was a high value dig site.

Jonah notes in the story that deploying this many Headhunters was a never before done thing. ONI broke all prior deployment parameters to send in 4 of them, plus had a second wave of III’s and orbital support for the main assault.

Based on the timeline and what we can infer, the operation took place after 2549, which means these other dozen teams are either Noble, Gauntlet, Strident, Echo, Red, and Anchor plus six more unnamed teams, or if not them, then it can only be a dozen teams from Gamma Company.

Regardless, ONI took the bait, there was nothing there, and they’d committed almost 100 Spartans to a wild goose chase.

The Banished also went to the moon, which means they were also hooked in by the fake Intel.

[grizzled anchor]

Damn Ive been proven wrong

I should Go listen to These audio books

[empty bloom]

Nah, he's not a glory hound who has a thing for committing war crimes.

... Though, ironically, he is made for war crimes.

[empty bloom]

I think the current largest MJOLNIR-wearing deployment is still the Infinity's Requiem op (The second)

[manic steppe]

I like the idea of the unsc having full on protocols and stuff in case of master chief going rouge

They use him as a weapon not a real human soldier

[empty bloom]

So in terms of timeline as a whole, I think this would just be the third largest deployment.

... NGL, I wish we'd have gotten a full top-down overview on what the Second Requiem excursion actually involved.

[stoic hamlet]

Yeah.

But War-Era, this moon mission would be it if the “dozen Spartan III teams” are the MJOLNIR ones.

Assuming 6 members per team with 12 teams, that’s 72 suits of MJOLNIR.

[empty bloom]

Like maybe I'm just an absolute freak but I actually really want to know what the order of battle was, how the IVs were deployed, what the various objectives were for a first strike, etc

[stoic hamlet]

I curse that we still don’t have an Imperial Armour analogue.

[lapis steeple]

Was the 100,000 thousand SIII plan by Ackerson ever feasible

[empty bloom]

It's I, not 1, but I appreciate the attempt.

[stoic hamlet]

I mean, with the IV’s? Kind of.

Very much a sort of best case scenario.

[empty bloom]

I feel like it makes the most sense for him to be meaning that as an eventuality-phasing out the IIIs for IVs.

[stoic hamlet]

Like, it wouldn’t happen that quickly, but it can definitely happen.

That’s basically what he meant.

[empty bloom]

Yeah, but you know hwo weird people get.

If they actually explicitly stated that I wager you'd have upset fans.

"Why would Ackerson mean IVs? IIIs are better and even he'd know it"

[lapis steeple]

Considering we're dealing with Ackerson here I'm pretty sure he did mean that quickly

[stoic hamlet]

I mean he does literally mention wanting the technology and stuff disseminated to everyone in the UNSCDF.

[stoic hamlet]

Nah, Ackerson wasn’t an idealist, or an idiot.

If anything, his projections originally were actually too small.

He says he hopes Kurt can get 100 Spartans deployed in 10 years (Kurt manages over 300 in 5), and though his numbers afterwards were technically off, they weren’t off by a lot with the successive classes.

[empty bloom]

A baneblade variant grid for the Scorpion when

[tight badge]

Curious about halo 3, would the absence of installation 04 change much, as in would the combined pulse no longer work or just be slightly smaller

Because if it no longer works theres 2 small portions of the galaxy on the south and eastern parts of the outer arm that would be unaffected

[modest marsh]

if you want to get technical, i think you could reasonably argue that chief has in fact committed war crimes if you only count his interactions with human combatants

mostly thinking of his legally dubious summary execution threat for refusal to comply with his orders

[orchid kettle]

Still crazy to me that Jun even had enough goons lying around to entertain so many Spartans

[slim salmon]

Is there a reason to how every weapon has a flashlight?

Does Master Chief have 2 tiny sticky flashlights that he slaps onto the underside of the guns he picks up or what?

[empty bloom]

His helmet has a flashlight.

[slim salmon]

The flashlight points to where his gun points.

[empty bloom]

Cool.

So?

That's a rhetorical so

[slim salmon]

...

So how does the flashlight work?

[unique rune]

I mean
it's the helmet's built-in lights

they point where the weapon points because it would be annoying for gameplay if they didn't

[slim salmon]

How?

[unique rune]

they just do

idk he's supposed to be looking in the same general direction that he's pointing a gun?

[slim salmon]

They're less annoying when a flashlight beam is not flying everywhere when you melee

Not that the flashlight during melees are that much annoying.

[unique rune]

there's not a lore reason for everything
some things are literally just for player convenience

[slim salmon]

Still

I'm very pedantic

[unique rune]

in CE it goes all over the place because Bungie attached the flashlight to the gun position and forgot to change it when they realized that it wouldn't make sense for guns that don't have flashlights attached

[modest marsh]

there's only one light source in CE's engine anyways

it cant handle that many light sources

[velvet briar]

I dont know if this is the best place to ask this or if there may be a better place, but I am looking for like a 10 hour video basically explaining the entire lore in pretty decent detail. Doesnt actually have to be that long just used that number to see how long i can actually get. I havent been able to find something even close to this, just a bunch of shorter videos in playlists and such.

[slim salmon]

By "2 tiny sticky flashlights" I meant a flashlight for each weapon he has.

[deep citrus]

Are all UNSC ships atmospheric capable?

[modest marsh]

Worth pointing out that the third person model has the flashlight projecting from one side of Chief’s head

[modest marsh]

It’s implied that they largely aren’t or at least this if they are it’s a relatively recent innovation

[slim salmon]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VV8MWjpuVDE

[modest marsh]

Most depictions kinda just ignore this though out of convenience

The Pillar of Autumn for instance is explicitly stated to not be able to land on the surface of Reach unassisted, so it used a “class L flash-dock” which was Bungie’s way of saying “magic”

[stoic hamlet]

343 even called this out in MCC, I believe.

[modest marsh]

Part of the problem is that UNSC ships are so large, like genuinely city sized in terms of volume and tonnage, that even moving around in the atmosphere at all would be catastrophic to the surrounding environment

The Paris class frigates loitering around during Tip of the Spear should be generating hurricane level forces from just being there

[deep gulch]

Random question. Do you think the Spartan II are just slightly better then the Spartan III or significantly better?

[modest marsh]

You need to define what you mean by better

[deep gulch]

Stronger, faster, more agile. Physically superior.

[modest marsh]

I think that the IIIs fresh out of training were significantly better prepared and effective than their Spartan-II counterparts, which would substantially mitigate most physical disadvantages if any

Their main differences are a consequence of experience and age

[stoic hamlet]

^^^

[deep gulch]

I like that! The Spartan III seem more then capable and on par with the Spartan II

Like my goodness Halo Reach showed just how epic they were.

[stoic hamlet]

That question overall feels rather.l. Hmm… baity.

[deep gulch]

Noooooo. That was not my intention. Sorry if it was.

I read online that the Spartan II were the best.

So I was curious just how much better they were then the Spartan III or if they were even better at all physically.

[stoic hamlet]

The more tends to state they’re roughly equal, but II’s have more experience. So Maggruber’s comment is generally the best held idea of how that would clock out.

[deep gulch]

Like John is a total legend and all but a lot of the Spartan III just seemed so capable that the 2s couldn’t be that much better than the 3s if they were better.

[deep gulch]

Ahhhh. I see. Roughly equal and on par with each other. 2s only significant edge is more experience then.

[deep citrus]

Did 3's have access to the same armor?

2's armor had better shield strength then many elites.

IIRC when introduced it was also supposed to have a better refresh rate and just generally be better in general

At the cost that you basically had to be a Spartan to have any chance of wearing it. They put it on a regular guy and he died in seconds because he couldn't control his reflexes

[modest marsh]

Only select Spartan-IIIs were given any form of Mjolnir armor during the war, most wore or continue to wear SPI/Mirage as far as we know

For branding purposes however it seems like Mark V[B] (the Reach armor) is more or less a visual shorthand for IIIs

[modest marsh]

The original idea was that (before retcons) Mjolnir shielding was reverse engineered and improved based on Jackal shield gauntlets specifically since in the original novel release, Elites hadn’t been encountered before

Because of that, the performance of Mjolnir shielding is mainly based off of how Jackal shields perform in the lore, even though based on gameplay Spartan shields are equal or worse than elite shields

Jackal shields being the basis for Mjolnir shielding is still canon, it’s just a little awkward considering how functionally they’re exactly the same as elite shields

Also technically elites didn’t have personal energy shields like they do currently until the final year of development in CE, originally they were just gonna carry shield gauntlets just like Jackals do

[latent spruce]

Didn't know that.

[deep gulch]

Dang. Halo is so epic. You can read about the lore for years and still learn new stuff.

Do you sometimes see the Spartans as a glimmer of hope for humanity at times? Like the Covenant are way more numerous and advanced but humanity can still produce a being that can crack a Brutes skull or cripple a brute with a bit to a spine.

[latent spruce]

Yep

Spartans never die

Chief at least

[deep gulch]

It’s so cool. Like these giant aliens are bigger and way more advanced yet humanity has produced beings that can fist fight Brutes and win.

[latent spruce]

We have 3000+ years of war and conflict under our belt

What do they have?

Stolen ancient tech they can barely use

[deep gulch]

It also seems like they have even more disadvantages. Like the Covenant is way more dysfunctional

Elites and Brutes hate each other. Grunts and Jackels hate each other.

[latent spruce]

Addaptation over inovation.

[deep gulch]

Lots of species that don’t like each other being forced to fight with each other

[latent spruce]

That was Captain Keys' observation

Grunts and Jackels for one

[modest marsh]

It is worth noting that many of the covenant member species were space faring or nearly space faring prior to their induction, including the elites who were already engaging in interstellar colonization before humans built the pyramids without using any forerunner technology

[stoic hamlet]

Notably, most Spartan II’s didn’t receive shielded armour until 2552. Everything before that was ineffective prototypes.

[modest marsh]

Because of retcons, a lot of key human technological innovations are strongly implied to be forerunner based even before the end of the covenant war

[latent spruce]

The Brutes just discovered the RADIO

[modest marsh]

Brutes also have a lot of environmental disadvantages

Like double earth’s gravity to contend with

[latent spruce]

They evolved to live with that

[modest marsh]

Their magnetosphere may genuinely also make radio communications more difficult

[latent spruce]

Doisac was their HOMEWORLD

They were treeclimbing bears before the firing of Halo

[modest marsh]

Halo has a lot of human exceptionalism going on but that doesn’t mean the aliens weren’t also capable in their own right

[empty bloom]

You do know capitalizing here is just making you look like a goober right

[latent spruce]

True

[modest marsh]

Undermining their rivals doesn’t make humanity seem more impressive

[latent spruce]

Also true

I'm just spitting lore

And sci-fi

[empty bloom]

Plus, just because they rediscovered the radio doesn't necessarily mean they had other things they still had. They rediscovered electrolasers, a tech that, for all intents and purposes seems mostly unique to them, less than 50 years after they discovered radio.

The Shock Rifle specifically is based off of pre-collapse Brute weapons.

[modest marsh]

Yeah, like I was suggesting, they probably had to come up with much more sophisticated solutions to make more mundane technologies possible in their native environment

[empty bloom]

It being rediscovered that fast implies that there were working examples to work off of, and considering they were a post-apocalyptic society, I'd say the "Rediscovering radio and rocketry" thing is more "They had both but they couldn't reliably remake it"

[latent spruce]

Ok.

I don't get much other view than my own a lot.

I don't talk to others much like this.

Sorry

[empty bloom]

I remember going on a whole spiel here about how Brute society and how they dress/what they value reflects what cultures they were from on their native Doisac, with the more Tartarus-styled skein being your more aggressive raider factions that were more high-consumption and 'savage', while those more aligned with Atriox' philosophy were the ones who were actively trying to rebuild society on Doisac.

Thus reflecting why the former focused more heavily on trophies and leathers for armor ("Use what we got for what we need now" scavenger/nomad) and the latter focused more heavily on repurposing and salvaging material ("Rebuild civilization" homesteader types)

[latent spruce]

At least he got to revive Jiralhane culture before Cortana destroyed Doisac semi-Death-Star style

[empty bloom]

It's also likely why the former is far more obsessed with heirarchy. "Might makes right" as a cultural doctrine usually screws you over in the long run.

[latent spruce]

Yep.

[empty bloom]

I wonder if the immolation is still in the living memory of the brutes.

[vagrant ocean]

Escharum apparently remembered it. But don’t quote me on that

[manic steppe]

What foods are served in the unsc cafeterias?

[latent spruce]

Pizza

At the Mortal Reverie

Before it was destroyed

Give or take

[empty bloom]

It's hard to tell if he remembered the immolation, or if it was an allegorical dream about Doisac's destruction by Cortana.

[vagrant ocean]

I mean, he was in his 20s.

[empty bloom]

I don't think he actually says

[wind fiber]

After the emergence of the Spartan-IV program, were the surviving Spartan-III personnel re-equipped with standard MJOLNIR armor, or did they continue using the low-cost, disposable SPI armor employed in the original Spartan-III operations?

[wispy pewter]

Some were given Mjolnir

Like the guy who had to babysit some teenagers

[wind fiber]

Is Jun-A266 being referred to when mentioning the Spartan-III who “babysat” a group of teenagers?

[wispy pewter]

No

I forgot his name

Owen

[wind fiber]

Does he serve as an instructor within the UNSC, or under ONI’s supervision?

[velvet briar]

Anyone in here literally consider themselves to be an absolute expert on all things halo lore? I am working on a video series and I want to fact check all the lore information I will be using in it. If you consider yourself to fit this please drop me a DM so as not to clog this channel up.

[minor sky]

If I recall correctly, in Halo CE the flashlight was originally tied to just the Assualt Rifle but that was changed to the helmet. So all the flashlight animations are tied to the weapon

[stoic hamlet]

He (Owen-B096) is under Spartan Branch, currently (as of the 2022 Encyclopedia, so September-ish 2559), assigned to anti-banished operations.

[empty bloom]

I kinda wonder how the IIIs are gonna feel about Jannies.

[minor sky]

That'll be interesting to see

So rq-
Locke was on board Infinity before it arrived on Zeta Halo
Vale has been out doing stuff with the Arbiter
Buck is with Alpha Nine
Where is Tanaka?

[empty bloom]

I wish I knew :c

But alas, she has been replaced with the emerald shinobi-wearing Glorbo

Oh, fun fact about Tanaka's armor

[minor sky]

She designed it herself?

[empty bloom]

She wears the male-scaled version of Technician, not the female-scaled version from MP.

Because her techsuit is a lot bulkier than even the male techsuit

[minor sky]

Huh. Neat

[minor sky]

Who?

[empty bloom]

Because while Blue Team all wears the MP techsuit, every member of Osiris has their own custom techsuit in campaign and their armors use the MP techsuits in MP.

[empty bloom]

Joke about how they released Vale, Buck, and Locke in Infinite's armor hall but not Tanaka's, deciding instead to use a random set of Shinobi

TBH I think that's actually downright criminal because Tanaka's armor, straight up, fits the aesthetic of Mark VII the most

Like, I've done partial renders of kitbashed Mark VII and Halo 5 technician and it fits like a glove

[minor sky]

Yeah. Odd choice to leave her out

What'd be cool is a story with Locke surviving on Zeta Halo by himself and at the end when he finally makes contact with UNSC forces he runs into Tanaka.

[empty bloom]

When I was bright eyed and bushy tailed two years ago, there was a notion I had that Tanaka could have a feasible DLC/book story of her trying to find and rescue Locke while maintaining a Mantis on Zeta Halo-isolated and alone as a lone Spartan, but managing to keep together better than the Rubicon Spartans by virtue of being a certified MJOLNIR Technician and able to keep her stuff running better than almost anyone.

[minor sky]

Not terrible.

[empty bloom]

Basically having a long story about her landing on a snowy part of the ring and reflecting on how this was starting to remind her of her teenage years on a glassed world-having to scrape and hunt to survive, and make use of every bit of tech she could get her hands on.

[minor sky]

I like that idea

Tanaka's backstory is really interesting to dig through

[empty bloom]

Whereas Chief got by being heroic and iconic and having help and whatnot, Tanaka would've survived the long way, and gotten by mostly via grit, determination, and tech skill.

Because Tanaka's character is effectively shown as being fiercely independent.

[minor sky]

Mhm. I still want a Locke story set with him trapped behind enemy lines but that could easily be happening concurrently

It really does suck that Halo 5 was too damn big for its own sake

Too much stuff, a lot of it interesting, barely any of it getting time to breathe

[empty bloom]

Yeah, I'd say it's easily the Halo beaten down the worst by the "Every Halo is missing an extra act" issue

Like, every Halo would benefit from it, but 5 would probs benefit even more than Infinite did

[minor sky]

5 needed to be like three different games

I sometimes wonder what it'd be like if 343 decided to forego the traditional release and instead just release episodic campaigns under the "Halo 5" banner with the multiplayer as a separate suite. Probably highly implausable but it is a though

I am still of the opinion that the Created plotline needed to happen later down the road

[empty bloom]

The Created plotline, IMO, is fine where it is in terms of start date.

But Halo Infinite needed to be a decade or two down the road.

Have the UNSC be on the backfoot for years, let the Created have a huge power consolidation

Because while the UNSC was absolutely on the backfoot in the HCW, the version they're dealing with in the Created Conflict is a whole different breed of problem

Where they can't hold ground, only scavenge

Have the Infinity be on its last legs, continuing the Forerunner finding mission because it literally just needs the parts to keep working right, and having it culminate in a UNSC-resurgent bull-run against the defenses of a Created-occupied Earth

[minor sky]

I think we needed more time in the post-war Galaxy

You have to really set up the context of how the Created could rise

5 tries this but also has to rush through it because it also has 10 other things to do

I think they had a good idea with Halo 5 having Chief "go out on his own". Letting Chief get to walk through the post-war Galaxy while dealing with Cortana's death doesn't sound like a half-bad idea for a follow up. (Ftr that 2nd bit it my idea not something 343i explictly planned)

Also the more I think about it the more I realize maybe I am onto something with beginning the Reclaimer Saga with an ODST sequel. It would be a very natural place to show how the Galaxy shifts after the end of the war while also setting up multiple plot threads that'd be relevent in Halo 4.

I'd imagine you'd cross parts of Old Blood with some of the stuff in Escalation. Like having Alpha-Nine being escorts during a meeting between the Arbiter and Brute leaders instead of Majestic. Easy way to set up stuff like the Civil War on Sanghelios and how the Covenant Splinter factions come into play

[sturdy zinc]

Good question.

Wish we had an answer

[wispy pewter]

I think the opposite needs to happen. Halo 4 had humanity on the rise only for them to be set back again the next two games

[modest marsh]

Halo 4 already had its share of set backs

A large swath of Infinity’s crew were wiped out including potentially hundreds of Spartans, the ship itself was heavily damaged and needed months of refit and repair, a good number of the home fleet’s ships were taken out, a major city had its entire population evaporated

[wispy pewter]

😔

[minor sky]

I wish that we, you know, saw Infinity take said damage

[deep gulch]

Do you think they are trying to start with a fresh slate with the remaster of Halo 1, 2, and 3?

Like they are going to do some retcons.

[minor sky]

No

[deep gulch]

Coolio

[minor sky]

Halo CE remake exists because it is a good framework for the team (many of whom didn't work on 4, 5, or Infinite) to get used to working together and making Halo on Unreal

[deep gulch]

Ahhhhh. It’s to get them experienced and accustomed to working with each other while making a profit.

It’s so cool we will eventually get a Halo 3 remastered. Like it’s about gosh darn time.

It better have multiplayer!

😠

[marble lion]

There is no indication of Halo 3 remaster happening. It’s most likely the sequel of Infinite will be next after the CE remake.

[vagrant ocean]

Not a single credible source for that info. Rumors are not reliable.

[latent spruce]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pHJmfFFsYLs

[minor sky]

I was talking about Halo 4

Where Del Rio goes off about how Infinity is damaged but as far as we can see it looks totally fine

Kind of wish Infinity (the level) ditched the tank sequence had let us fight our way through the ship before hopping in the Mantis

[latent spruce]

Oh.

My bad

[frigid heart]

The 3 remaster is all rumors, no facts

[unique rune]

remakes of H2 and H3 would probably get me to finally quit bothering with Halo

[empty bloom]

Literally nobody has ever once reliably confirmed this.

[dim sage]

cant wait for Halo combat resolved part 3 in 2029

[dim sage]

the biggest clickbat about Halo 2 A for me was when they showed us how nice the campaign remaster was and i legit thought the multiplayer was gonna look like that too but its just halo 4 1.5 lol

[modest marsh]

I mean, we do see huge chunks of the ship that was torn off from the crash as well as the smoldering ashes floating in the air from the burning wreckage, it’s just that the ship is so big that you can’t really tell without looking up close

[tight badge]

Are the brutes relatively close to extinction? Because they went through a massive nuclear war, only had 33 years to rebuild before humanity and they likely lost hundreds of millions of men and then 5 years after Cortana blows up doisac

[wispy pewter]

space is huge

[tight badge]

Yeah but 66 years for a species to recover population wise from nuclear devistation

[modest marsh]

Reminder that in 1925 the global population was estimated to be 2 billion total

Even with a technological reset and decimated population, them joining the covenant would mean they’d gain access to industrialization and medical care that would allow for their population to rapidly grow in just a few decades

[empty bloom]

That may be part of the utility of them canonically having brothels.

God, that is gross to say.

[modest marsh]

As far as I can tell it’s not explicitly stated either way, but it’s possible Brutes, much like most of the other alien races, are polytocous, meaning they could potentially have large litters allowing them to replenish their population more efficiently than humans

[vagrant ocean]

Think of the smell.

YOU HAVENT THOUGHT OF THE SMELL YOU GAST!!

[empty bloom]

Eh

[wispy pewter]

67

[tight badge]

Mods smite this man

[wispy pewter]

for a species that loves to fight and kill... high population recovery seems very implausible

[unique rune]

I mean
they’re not solely focused on fighting and killing
they’re intelligent enough to establish organized societies and culture

they’ll be fine

humans have a history of loving to fight and kill each other and so far we’re… doing

we are certainly doing

[warm ridge]

The problem with this idea is that it implies the Alien species are able to rapidly grow up "fast", which from what we know with the Jiralhanae, Sangheili, & San'Shyuum, that's not the case.

For example, Thel Vadam was one of the youngest Sangheili's to gain the role of "Supreme Commander" despite appearing to be a fully grown Sangheili in all media we've seen of him.

Afaik I believe only the Kig Yar, and Unggoy are said to have this capability. Where there young grows up rapidly. We're basically fighting "kid versions" or "extremely young adult" versions of the Unggoy for a vast majority of the Halo series.

What i mean by this, Unggoy are already "adults" by the time they're between the ages of 5 & 8 years old.

[vale matrix]

Spoiler question for Edge of Dawn novel

||So in the Epilogue, Thel says he had Vale go solo on the mission to Suban. I’m curious if there’s a book that covers that? I assume it’s Outcasts?||

[modest marsh]

That’s irrelevant to the point I was making

If the question is if whether or not they have the biological capacity to replenish their population at the rate needed to not go extinct, I think you can reasonably infer that they do in fact have that capability when combined with the economic and technological advantages of the Covenant

[carmine sleet]

https://discord.com/channels/471722331820130324/1450514677779136683

[gusty star]

Please delete this and post in the spoiler chat

[gusty star]

Doisac had a population of 12 billion around the end of the HCW

And that’s not including god knows how many were spread around space

[tight badge]

Wouldn’t that be majority grunts like most planets the covenant owned

[gusty star]

So their population is probably mostly fine but just doesn’t have a homeworld

We have no idea if there were many grunts on the planet, if any

[modest marsh]

“Covenant owned” does not mean that their population distribution is homogeneous

[minor sky]

I can't remember who said it here originally but the point of "Chief disobeying Del Rio should've been more about Chief having to put aside his duty to the UNSC to help his friend" rather than just "Del Rio is a jerk" has been one of the most illuminating critques of Halo 4's narrative for me. It has really got me to think thought what the UNSC side of the narrative was missing

[stoic hamlet]

It’s kind of the issue with a lot of the post war/Chief disobeying the UNSC ideas.

They need to rely on Chief actually being logically wrong, but morally right, irrefutably so, with no room for Chief to “get out of it”.

But if that’s the case a lot of people won’t like it, because Chief in their eyes literally can’t do wrong in any fashion.

[deep gulch]

Random question. Is the forerunners are humans retcon a sensitive subject that should be avoided?

[unique rune]

it’s a subject I’m tired of reading about so yes I think it should be avoided

[frigid heart]

Generally I think it depends on who you talk to. Most don’t really care, many accept the new lore, some will argue with you.

[deep gulch]

Ah! So it’s a dicy topic then. If it’s divisive then I’ll avoid it.

Thank you Emperor and Hunter.

🙏

[modest marsh]

I don’t think you’ll incite any hostility here, it’s more so that it’s a topic that’s been discussed at length for many years without much headway

[minor sky]

I have been really conflicted on if they should've gone with "Del Rio is a jerk" as a contrast to Keyes (both of them) and Lord Hood or have spent enough time to make Del Rio's point of view seem valid

I think I've ultimately come to the conclusion that the latter is the better choice

Showing the Infinity actually take some major blow back or having Chief underestimate the power of the Didact would give Del Rio an actual arguement of "I am not going to jepardize my crew and the most important ship in the fleet". That is also to mention showing Cortana's rampancy actually put people rick during Infinity's stint on Requiem would make him ordering her to be taken offline seem a lot more reasonable

Obviously, you could still have Del Rio's outburst, just the events leading up to it make it a lot more valid

I kind of like the idea that Del Rio is somebody who has never been a massive fan of the Spartan IIs (alla Silva), and that would be part of his dismissal of Chief. You wouldn't have to say it bluntly, just leave some hints

[minor sky]

But with this angle in place, the dilemma is really a matter of Chief standing by his friend or "following orders"

If I were reorganizing the campaign I'd want Infinity and Reclaimer to show the might of the post-war UNSC, with the Covenant forces you've been on the backfoot against for the opening levels getting squashed by Infinity. Then you'd have a level between Reclaimer and Shutdown that'd be something like an extended version of the librarian sequence from Reclaimer. Here you can really show the danger of the Didact beyond "evil bad guy", where the confident UNSC a gets hard kick to the face

Making Del Rio's decision to leave a lot more clear. Hell, if you really wanna push harder on Del Rio's narrative characterization take that moment at the start of Reclaimer to show him weighing his options to stay or leave Requiem

[empty bloom]

I remember once asking if someone would consider Chief doing an absolutely heinous act-beyond the pale of decency or morality, but purely, objectively horrible by the standards of any functional society-to be a mark against him.

Their response was to say they'd even help Chief do it. In the context of the example I said, it did not leave me with a particularly good opinion of the person I asked.

The justification was that Chief was a galactic hero and deserved to get away with crimes.

[still heron]

Like scorched earth policy/WMD? That's a no. Yeah, in the case of the Flood you don't really have a choice, but not everyone knows about that.

[unique rune]

I know he’s a fictional character ‘n all but the idea that Chief is always right and justified and can do no wrong is wild

[empty bloom]

Uh, it's something I can't say here.

[empty bloom]

Yep.

[still heron]

I know, but I rather keep it In Universe. Don't want to go to certain forbidden topics.

[empty bloom]

It's kind of an emblematic factor of that sort of personality I find inherently disqualifying when it comes to trusting that sort.

[still heron]

Section 2 did do a pretty good job on the mythical nature of the Spartans to the public masses in lore.

[unique rune]

“the hero is always right and justified” is how CoD campaigns are written lol

[still heron]

Least Mass Effect took that mindset out on consequences based on your morality. Heck, you can actually make Shepard's backstory as controversial as possible. The "Butcher of Torfan".

[wispy pewter]

Not like Chief is a villain. Of course everyone would help him if he wanted to bury Del Rio

[minor sky]

I do love how Hunt The Truth showed Del Rio becoming a senator who wasn't bitter about getting the boot at all

[empty bloom]

No?

What are you talking about lmao

Rhetorical, you're saying something that objectively is not true.

[stoic hamlet]

It’s an interesting case because even if they are, you can still have pushback, and have it be understandable.

Like, as an example from the books, Oblivion has John and Blue Team rescue a bunch of marooned kids who were the children of pirates. It’s heavily implied that said kids also manipulated things to make sure they were rescued at the expense of other UNSC personnel. Even ignoring that, though, the entire mission was objectively a failure, and it cost the lives of hundreds of sailors in the form of 4 destroyed UNSC warships protecting Blue Team from orbital and aerial attack.

You could easily see a case where crewmembers of the surviving warships blamed Blue Team for getting their friends killed because “Spartans are worth it”. Would those sailors be right to blame Blue Team? No, not really… but how many times have warships and regiments been bait to allow Spartans to do the miracles they do? How many thousands have died so John can strike a cool hero pose with twin M7’s while a city burns around him?

How many is too many?

[still heron]

I'm reminded of that ship who took a shot from a Carrier in Halo 2.

[wispy pewter]

I mean Lasky helped him

[empty bloom]

Just because I'll help you with one crime does not mean I'd help you with a different one.

[vagrant ocean]

Ecamole

[stoic hamlet]

you see nothing

[vagrant ocean]

How dank is the pack that AJJ rips on the daily?

[minor sky]

i go back to my idea of Del Rio having a bad view of Spartan IIs before Halo 4

[minor sky]

Can anybody give me a quick thumbs up or thumbs down on Edge of Dawn rq?

[gusty star]

Just read it bro

Doesn’t matter what we think

[minor sky]

I am reading it, I just haven't gotten the book yet

I plan on reading it regardless, I just wanna know if anybody has enjoyed it or not

[wispy pewter]

Thumbs up

[unique rune]

is a big toe to the left helpful at all

[marsh lintel]

i wonder how you even begin to mine blamite without it supercombining prematurely?

[empty bloom]

Very carefully.

[stoic hamlet]

Just mine the ‘ite, not the ‘blam

[modest marsh]

Despite what gameplay indicates, the crystal doesn’t seem to be volatile in its inert state

You can crush it up just fine since that’s what the gun does anyways

What makes it explosive is whatever energy it gets infused with when it gets shot out of the gun

[empty bloom]

This has me thinking of Halo-themed Dracula flow lines

A shame I can't say any of the ones I've thought of here, though.

[obsidian thistle]

Its actually very stable when not charged

Seeing as you can shoot the ammo and crystal in numerous games with no ill effects

Charged blamite on the otherhand

[still heron]

Similar rules apply for Infusion Gel?

[minor sky]

One thing about 4's narrative that kind of makes me scratch my head is the fact that Johnson's death and telling Chief to "not let her go" is never mentioned or referenced

Feels like it would've been an obvious thing to build off of and actually make Johnson's death more than just trying to spice Halo 3's story up

(FTR I don't mind Johnson's death so much as I do Miranda's)

[gusty star]

I vaguely remember the line being referenced in one of H4 or H5 trailers

But honestly media literacy tells us that Chief was obviously thinking about that line the whole of Halo 4

Like Chief obviously did not want to let her go no matter how bad it got

He doesn’t need to outright say “Johnson told me to never let you go” in order for the audience to understand how important that was to him

[deep citrus]

Does halo infinites book have enough references lol

Doesnt sound bad, havent read it myself, just listened to a synopsis

[gusty star]

What is Halo Infinite’s book?

Rubicon Protocol? Edge of Dawn? Empty Throne? Epitaph?

Why these all begin with the letter E

[deep citrus]

Newest one ye. Edge of Dawn

[lean drum]

Halo has so many stories. Like sooooooooooo many. Like 30+ books at least.

[minor sky]

Sure, it is more so a lack of seasing to oppertunity to show the moment effecting Chief beyond when it happened

Yes you can totally infer that Johnson's words are influencing Chief in Halo 4. I thought of that myself, but I also think it is a missed opportunity to not take that moment and develop it further in Halo 4 or Halo 5

That actually segways really nicely into another thing-
In the HCS Panel for Halo 5's 10th anniversary, Josh Holmes mentioned how the earliest concepts (Poncho Chief) were all based on the idea of "Chief venturing out on his own". That comment really stuck with me and how I kinda think it would've been an interesting direction to head in, making Halo 5 a lot more reflective/dialed back in its story.

The final game really pushed hard with the "galaxy spanning, planet-hopping blockbuster adventure" angle. And coming off of how Halo 4 ended with "She said that to me.... about being a machine" (still one of the few moments in a video game that has gotten me on the verge of tears) Halo 5's direction feels.... uneven

Said panel also had Tim Longo mention that he'd probably cut down the amount of characters to just focus on Blue Team and yeah that is probably the correct move. Then again, hindsight always is 20/20

[dusk jetty]

I think 5 has the right foundations but it sweeps its legs out from underneath itself a few times

Split perspective is fine in halo, and I don’t even mind the replacing chief angle even if it was the intention (doubt)

Just think the choice of villain and general pacing make it stumble

[minor sky]

Absolutely

I just realized as I read your message that they basically carried over the issue Spartan Ops had of most of the story being told to you through voiceover

(I was playing some of Spartan Ops earlier today)

[minor sky]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=dFgGhYu2RxQ&pp=ygUUaGFsbyBibHVlIHRlYW0gdGhlbWU%3D

Listening to this track is sort of like a taste of what that hypothetical game would look like

Especially with how it builds off the track during Midnight's final cutscene

[wispy pewter]

If they ever kill off Atriox off screen it should be red team

[carmine sleet]

I doubt Red Team will be going anywhere near Atriox with their current circumstances preventing them from leaving the Ark

Especially not near where Atriox is

[wispy pewter]

I hope they movie that story forward

They can’t be stuck forever

[unique rune]

sounds pretty lame tbh

[marble lion]

I have doubts on Red Team would kill Atriox off screen, if it ever happens. It will be a while and when we might see Red Team again

[minor sky]

It does still kind of bug me how HW2's story hasn't gotten a proper ending some 8 years later

[deep citrus]

Halo feels kinda more like two seperate stories in my view

Story one was humanity struggling to survive against a much stronger and generally more technologically advanced species.

Story two is humanity trying to rebuild. Only to get knocked down over and over.

These two stories could connect. But they seem insistent on ensuring that humanity has no real basis to be the dominant force. The infinity has been nearly destroyed. Something humanity put a vasy majority of its resources into. Its troops are scattered. Population likely still not recovered.

It feels like theyre stuck in the mindset humanity had against the covenant. Humanities fleets are weak but their ground forces are strong.

[minor sky]

Thinking more on Del Rio's writing/characterization, I am of the mindset that they should've taken a similar approch as Captain Jellico in Star Trek. It has been a minute but I recall the writing of Jellico being done to where all his decisions come from an understandable position

[empty bloom]

It already kinda does IMO

[minor sky]

I kind of get the feeling they wanted to lean into that with stuff like the opening cutscene to Reclaimer or Del Rio's "He isn't the only one" line.

But they don't really push it as hard and Del Rio comes off more like an arrogant jerk

Hell, in the earlier drafts he was even more of a jerk

[obsidian thistle]

Del Rio for UEG President 2560.

(Legit I think would be a great move fictionally)

[minor sky]

I do love him becoming a politician in Hunt the Truth

Very great next step to take his character

Also the bits where he is very clearly not bitter about getting the boot as Captain of Infinity

[obsidian thistle]

He also has the biggest out to surviving the Created

And HAS the fact he ordered Cortana to be destroyed

[minor sky]

Oh yeah that's a solid angle

[empty bloom]

Honestly, him getting the boot is something I think would be very appropriate regarding bitterness over.

[obsidian thistle]

I could see him using the Created crisis to get the remaining Spartan-IIs retired

Seeing as John "saving" Cortana