lore-and-universe

[last anchor]

Oh so that's what Mushak looks like

[torpid night]

Unggoy farming is a in lore thing?!? Why did i just find this out?

[stray igloo]

What?

Also where is the flood at the time at halo infinite

[torpid night]

It a in lore game people play apparently

[stray igloo]

Grunts already have it so bad

[torpid night]

And i believe we have flood on the ark, may be wrong

[versed helm]

We do.

Halo Wars 2: Awakening the Nightmare.

[torpid night]

Also any forerunner facilities because the were testing on them

[versed helm]

There are Flood on Zeta Halo. They're just contained.

I saw a vid on that a while back.

Youtube.

[stray igloo]

Woulda been interesting to have a flood side mission in infinite’s campaign

like as a secret objective or just guarding a spartan core

[torpid night]

Halo has been lack on the space horror aspect for awhile now

[stray igloo]

Infinite could do the space horror so well

the amazing graphics and improved lighting

[west lava]

Awakening the nightmare wasn't that long ago

[carmine sleet]

Halo ain't exactly a horror franchise

[jaunty path]

i think the flood is too important for just a side mission

[humble mulch]

but top down games are also booty, and nobody cares about brutes

[carmine sleet]

Plenty of people cared about Brutes

They wouldn't have been brought back if nobody cared

And a game being in a different perspective than first person doesn't make a game bad

[humble mulch]

it was sarcasm

[carmine sleet]

It didn't come across as such

[scarlet hinge]

it was 7 years ago

[humble mulch]

well now you know

[versed helm]

ok so i really need to ask something about the rings

how did there come to be life on the rings?

[unique rune]

The Forerunners put it there

[versed helm]

the forerunners just put animals on the rings?

interesting, thx

[unique rune]

Pretty much

[carmine sleet]

They serve as conservation sites as well as galaxy wide super weapons

[torpid night]

Hard reset of the galaxy

[sonic lagoon]

Did Forerunners have baby incubators?

[weary nimbus]

The Forerunners had a caste of people called "Life Workers", headed up by The Librarian. They used their installations, Halos included, to study all kinds of life forms. Even humans lived on a Halo for a time, before the Didact conscripted them into "service"

[bronze prawn]

if in theory almost at the end of their time the Forerunners accepted that humans should take up the mantle

Why did they leave them with so little technology, the elites, the prophets and even brutes seem to have inherited more Forerruner technology than humans?

[last anchor]

Humanity was equal to the Forerunners at one point.
Then they lost the war with the Forerunners and in penance, were de-volved.
They had only gotten to the basic bronze age before the Forerunner-Flood War got started proper.

They were preserved and then resettled and left to do their own thing. The rest is human history as we know it.

[versed helm]

whos the first spartan

[empty bloom]

Whoever was the first Orion Candidate to finish getting augmented.

[bronze prawn]

how powerful are forerruner ships, like the ones in the shield world of etran harborage

[unique rune]

at least 2
maybe even 3

[polar dew]

Idk I think you’re underestimating the forerunners I’d say some of their ships reach even 5 or 6

[frosty fjord]

technically sgt Johnson was or is a spartan 1 due to him being a candidate for the Orion project

[carmine sleet]

There were multiple Spartan Is, we just don't know all of them

[scarlet hinge]

the ones in the harbourage are Sojourner-class dragoons; they were the most advanced ships in the Forerunner fleet at the time of the war against the Flood

https://www.halopedia.org/Sojourner-class_dreadnought

[eternal stream]

As a big fan of the franchise I feel like I should know more of the lore. Would you recommend the books or are the games canon?

[sonic lagoon]

So what happens when people get lost in slipspace?

[empty bloom]

... Also, thinking on it, if they're so desperate to avoid lootboxes on a Halo 5 PC port, they technically just have to remove the option to buy them with real world cash.

Because only a tiny handful of REQs not counting the multigold packs, less than 3, were paid only.

The boxes would still be in the game, but the part that's actually the problem wouldn't be.

I don't know if EU legislation would consider it a violation if you legitimately cannot purchase the box whatsoever with cash.

[orchid kettle]

They're either stuck in the dimension-- in which case they die of any multitude of ways

OR, since usually slipspace mechanics seem to suggest that slipspace just spits you back out into normal space if you don't have some quantum field around you

the person dies of the extreme stress of their molecules being rubberbanded back into the third dimension

[golden spear]

TBH: I wished 343 had kept the Forerunners as long gone

[orchid kettle]

as its mentioned that transitioning from slipspace to real space imparts a ton of force, so space craft have to be reinforced to withstand that pressure

so tl;dr: if anything is even left of the person, it's probably only a red mist free floating in space

[golden spear]

So a horrifying way to go

Not the worst fate in Halo though, being infected by the Flood is the worst way to go

[orchid kettle]

if its any consolation, i bet it happens so fast you don't even really have time to think about it

[golden spear]

Unlike Flood infection

[orchid kettle]

oh, and the fact that UNSC slipspace drives are very inaccurate compared to Covenant ones, leading to ships appearing thousands of kilometers off target, is also probably why the body just disappears

[golden spear]

Now being infected by the Flood is a fate worse than death

[orchid kettle]

because that red mist got teleported a ways away, and nobody would notice

[golden spear]

Also, one thing is surprising, did the Forerunners intend to keep humanity primitive forever?

Because they would have failed judging by how fast humans developed after they got devolved

[carmine sleet]

The Forerunners are still gone, seeing one and defeating him doesn't mean their empire is suddenly back

[carmine sleet]

They wanted humanity to succeed them after they fired the Halos, if they wanted to keep us devolved, it'd go against that plan

[golden spear]

The Librarian did, the Didact wanted us dead

[bronze prawn]

how is that of the didact going rampage for a talk with the gravemind ?

[sonic lagoon]

Can they get stuck in objects if they return?

[sonic lagoon]

I completely disagree and I’ll never be able to understand you’re mindset to be honest. Not worth my time, I respect your opinion though.

[midnight badger]

when did johnson get into the orion project?

after harvest?

[empty bloom]

Harvest was decades after the Orion project.

[tribal trench]

Orion was, what, 2470s?

80s?

[torpid night]

Is spartan team black lore friendly or were they a one time thing?

[dusk jetty]

Well I mean

They existed in canon

What they did is canon

Them dying is canon

Soo, yeah, lore friendly

[torpid night]

They died?

Man...

That sucks

[bronze prawn]

the ones killed by the didact ?

[empty bloom]

I mean, it's kinda fitting that they died in a comic, not to mention dying to the Forerunner General.

Like, if anything's gonna ROFLstomp 4 IIs at once, it's gonna be him and a horde of Prometheans.

Or gravity.

[bronze prawn]

how powerful are prometheans

lasky and palmer seem to kill them quiet easy

[empty bloom]

Well, the cutscenes are... Kind of meh? They're harder to kill in more complete depictions.

Kinda like Spartans, actually.

[bronze prawn]

the first time i face them in halo 4

[empty bloom]

Halo's a game where most depictions in gameplay, if not all, are heavily abstracted.

For example, the DMR and AR both fire the exact same round, but only the DMR can headshot enemies. The DMR can also fire in full auto, the AR can fire in semi auto.

It's more like-They got ROFLstomped by the Didact-who literally only died because Cortana had hardlight to manipulate and is implied to also have hacked his suit, and otherwise would've killed Chief-then got killed by shenanigans in the same comic Black Team died in.

And the rest of the forces, such as knights, routinely carry guns that can oneshot folks in MJOLNIR on a solid hit.

[real steppe]

Why did the Prophets replace the Elites with Brutes? Did i miss something? It just seems like an overall stupid idea. Why get rid of half your competent fighting force and cause them to switch over to the enemy,which heavily boosts your enemy's ability to beat you,WHILE the Flood are attacking you? It seems like such a terrible decision to make. Is Truth stupid?

[scarlet hinge]

the roots of the Schism are more about Covenant internal politics than any military obviousness. When the empire came into being three millennia ago, it was essentially the preexisting Sangheili space empire with a change in management, that slowly grew to incorporate other species as time went on. Crucially, for most of that time, the Sangheili and San'Shyuum sat at the top of that power hierarchy; the San'Shyuum respected for leadership but the Sangheili comprising the majority of the empire's mainline non-slave population.

When the Brutes came into the fold in the 2480s, this changed up the power structure massively, as there were now two similarly strong and militaristic species. However, the Sangheili have a history of aristocracy and complex feudal politics that makes it a pain to get anything done. Honour for one's clan and family are as important as actually getting the job done, meaning that petty disagreements and feuds get in the way of actual decision-making. The Brutes, by contrast, are a relatively simple pack-based social structure; if the Chieftain says jump, his underlings jump. If one of the underlings doesn't feel like jumping, he kills the Chieftain and becomes the new Chieftain (or dies trying). They're much more receptive to top-down authority of the kind that the imperial Covenant offers.

What this compounds to, for the Prophet of Truth in particular, is that he has an opportunity to replace the empire's primary caste with a new one - composed of highly violent and aggressive individuals who have no issues following orders and no issues questioning them. By contrast, the Sangheili question things a lot; when the war first began, a lot of the fighting troops had to be squirrelled away in antipiracy ministerial fleets as to avoid the ire of senior Sangheili admirals questioning the utility of their deployments. Later on in the war, there was a growing youth undercurrent of people actively questioning the war's necessity - the Lekgolo destroyed a Forerunner space station, and yet they were allowed into the Covenant and forgiven. What could humanity have done that was as bad as that?

Sooner or later, the Sangheili would turn to question why the war was still being fought after 30 years, when almost nothing had been gained from it. The war was started based on a lie in the first place; if the truth was spread that humanity were designated as the Forerunners' true inheritors ,then the empire would fracture overnight. Instead, the hierarchs declared war to cover up that secret, but there's only so long that's sustainable. By 2552, the divides resulting from these factors were becoming really unsustainable, and there was a brief moment after Regret was killed where Truth had the opportunity to do a power grab and likely turn the Covenant into a dictatorship using the Brutes as his military muscle, rather than the careful balance of power that had dominated in the prior centuries

We know that at least a good chunk of his plan was to send San'Shyuum to a shield world named Cloister to wait out the firing of the rings - likely with the intention of emerging from the cataclysm and reclaiming the galaxy purely for themselves

After the Prophet of Regret died, Truth's main competitor was gone, and it presented him with a very unique opportunity to sieze power. With one fell swoop, he could eliminate his main rival within the Hierarchy, and also use it as an excuse to cast down senior Sangheili officials for their "failure". In an alternate universe, it's possible that the Covenant's civil war was a brief military coup by the Prophet of Truth that resulted in Regret and the Sangheili pushing back and retaining control of the empire

[real steppe]

Oh,so that's why he let the Flood infection form kill Regret instead of helping him.

[scarlet hinge]

that was Mercy, but yeah

when the Hierarchs came to power, it was Truth and Regret who were plotting their ascension; Mercy just happened to be there when Mendicant Bias' revelation came to light - but they never really wanted him there

[real steppe]

Oh wait was Regret the one we punched repeatedly until he exploded into confetti?

[scarlet hinge]

yep!

[real steppe]

Ohh

Honestly i didn't know all that,i replayed the games recently and none of that was really explained at all

[scarlet hinge]

that is fair! a good chunk of it comes from the novel Contact Harvest, which explores how and why the war began

the B-plot of the book is about how the three Hierarchs ascend to power

it's a wonderful book, written by the writer of Halo 2

otherwise, it's mostly just picking up tidbits from various sources to form a cohesive narrative

it's less so something that's directly explained, but more something that becomes clear when looking at the wider backdrop of the setting

[real steppe]

Honestly that something that really should have been explained. We get a view into the inside of the Covenant in Halo 2 and yet we don't see the buildup to the schism...really at all. There's little to no explanation for it,when Halo 2 had the perfect opportunity since we played as a high ranking Covenant trooper for half the game.

From the POV you have in the games without having read the novels it just seems extremely stupid to kick out a good chunk of your effective fighting force and let them defect to your enemy

[scarlet hinge]

as it stands, Halo 2 already had a third of its story cut - so it's honestly amazing it can do as much as it does as it is

[real steppe]

Really?

[scarlet hinge]

yeah

the entire third act of the game was cut

after the Tartarus boss fight, you were supposed to go back to Earth for a few levels

that stuff ended up getting reused in Halo 3 for the stuff surrounding the Ark portal - only at the time of H2, the structure on Earth was the Ark

the idea was that you'd get inside the structure in Africa, fight Truth (and kill him), and then that would be the end of the game (and the entire franchise)

[real steppe]

Huh,i see.

[scarlet hinge]

https://www.halopedia.org/Earth_Ark

this page covers what we know of those final levels^

[real steppe]

Related,what the hell was Truth's plan anyways? He knew the Halo rings firing would kill everyone,right? Why did he keep going through with it? I know you mentioned he planned to keep the San Shyuum safe so he could maybe conquer the galaxy but the whole covenant on the Ark who helped him activate it would've probably been like "yo wait hold on we haven't ascended" and mutinied and killed him,no? What did he think would happen?

[scarlet hinge]

so the doylist answer there is that Halo 3 is a badly-written game, and Truth especially recieves some of the worst character shifts (as Joe Staten wasn't writing the game anymore for IRL dev reasons)

it's inconsistent

watsonian answer, is that it's likely that Truth probably was starting to crack from the pressure of the civil war, the flood, and the war against humanity. Digging himself into a hole and having no choice but to keep digging, until eventually - sooner or later- it would all catch up with him

Shi Kai Wang's illustration of him from the Graphic Novel illustrates that point excellently

https://www.halopedia.org/File:HGN_Shiek_Truth.jpg

[real steppe]

So the lore reason was that Truth is stupid

[scarlet hinge]

in a word, yes - though I think the answer is a hell of a lot more nuanced than that

[real steppe]

I mean yeah but even as a kid who was in the single digits i was still extremely confused as to why he would do it if he knew the Great Journey was bogus

Maybe it was double digits idk honestly when i was younger i was more concerned about how cool the Arbiter was than the story implications

[scarlet hinge]

I've always figured that by the time of H3, all of his grand plans had come crashing down, and he was now only thinking about the immediate future

when you have the UNSC, Elites, Flood, and Sentinels all gunning for you, there's no time to worry about what happens after you fire the rings

just fire them, and then worry about what to do with the Brutes you brought with you later

Truth's a manipulator - he'd try to figure something out

more likely though, he'd probably fire the rings, and then eventually get killed by his own Brutes once they realised they'd been led on

which does feel like a fairly fitting end in that alternative timeline

[real steppe]

Yeah exactly
There's this thought in my mind where,in an alternate timeline,Truth succeeds,fires the rings,and then Tartarus is like "hey,wait a minute" and a few seconds later Truth is a red paste on the floor

Which is an interesting thought - i wonder how different things would be in a universe that's basically just leftover Covenant who realised everything was a lie

[orchid kettle]

I always figured his thinking is that after firing the rings on the Ark, which is not within range of the rings, Truth could live out his days as God King on the Ark with the survivors, content with the assumption that they have fulfilled the goal of their Covenant and will surely be rewarded in the next life

In Halo 2's cut ending, The Ark is instead an actual facility on Earth instead of a portal to yet another floating artificial world

And inside this version of the Ark is some genetic information that has apparently been shaping human evolution

(something something, Forerunners made humans look like them after influencing the evolution of apes or whatever)

in this scenario, Id imagine Truth's plan would have been to insert himself into this generic repository

and effectively reshape life on Earth in his own image

some inkling of this goal may still exist in Halo 3, if you assume the plan would be to ultimately return to the galaxy, now free of all foes, and begin shaping a new world however Truth saw fit

If Zeta Halo is stacked full of cylixes, I wouldn't be surprised if the Ark had some San Shyuum specimens hanging around for Truth to take with him and re-establish his race with him as the undisputed god king

Im speculating a lot here since there are plenty of dastardly schemes Truth COULD be hatching that would still involve firing the rings

Halo 3 just doesn't tell us

and its totally possible he had no plan at all, but that's obviously a lil underwhelming

But I think some variation of "Destroy the world so I can remake it in my own image" works well enough

[bronze prawn]

how excalty the CSO super carrier manage to sneak into reach

Where the towers completely rendering the entire subcontinent not only impenetrable to sensors but also making it physically invisible? You could easily see that ship from orbit, not to mention a fleet and a landed army of Covenant making a lightshow like a major city. Its not as if Reach isn't the fleets headquarters with ships and space stations orbiting all around it.

If the pylons were making them invisible, how did they build them in the first place?

[orchid kettle]

Its something to do with not only the Spires, but the lil tower things you blew up in Nightfall as well

I believe the thinking is that the Covenant have been on Reach even before Winter Contingency, as there was a recon team that went missing a lil while before

so chances are, they showed up in some stealth ship, started planting the stealth pylons, and the spires have something to do with teleportation or communication

given how precise Covenant slipspace travel is, I honestly just thought the advance party could feed the fleet coordinates necessary to appear beneath Reach's orbital defense grid

There's mention of a Covenant stealth ship at Sigma Octanus in Fall of Reach, so maybe it was a ship like that that set the groundwork

[runic wharf]

Generally advance parties arrive weeks to months in advance of the general strike

You can get a sense for the rough timeline with how it occurs in Forward Unto Dawn, where you can observe the employment of orbital drop pods for the Sangheili Ranger teams

[humble mulch]

is there a reason the covenant dont speak english in halo 4

[orchid kettle]

A lore reason, probably not

but in terms of artistic intentions, it's because you're not really supposed to find the Covenant in 4 endearing or charming in any manner whatsoever

which Im pretty sure is the same thinking behind Reach enemies also speaking purely in some alien language instead of english

[humble mulch]

well reach is a prequel. it makes sense for them to not speak english

but it feels weird to play against the covenant for 2 games where they speak english, just for them to stop, then speak english again in 5

[zenith thicket]

the nanobots forgot the alien speech modulator

[humble mulch]

true

[empty bloom]

Pretty much this. They were going for intimidation. Which works... If you aren't a 7' tall transhuman wearing power armor.

[dusk jetty]

Intimidation only works if the thing is question is stronger and bigger than you

Namely, brutes

Which weren’t even scary in infinite 3 and reach so

Bungie made them pushovers

343 made the more powerful ones cool but the lower level ones are just styrofoam cups

[ruby canopy]

Them berserkers were something else. I did my first play through on legendary and being in an enclosed space and hearing them charging from wherever was some nightmare fuel

Usually resulting in death by being caught off guard

[empty bloom]

Shoulda made Berserkers explode. Styrofoam cups, but with knives hidden under them.

[dusk jetty]

Honestly they take this drug cocktail anyway

Why not turn them into those living bombs like iron man 3

[empty bloom]

I was thinking more dead man's switch charges, but yeah

[ruby canopy]

Hell no

I can’t imagine how many more times I would have died on legendary

Unless the repulsor could be used in the campaign

[empty bloom]

One of my main goals for learning to mod Halo 4 is making exploding crawlers that chase the player

[bronze prawn]

how chief understands the arbitrer in halo 2 and 3

also, if the theory of the translator in chief suit is corect, in which language was the gravemind speaking ?

[humble mulch]

then how does everyone else talk to arbiter

and arbiter understands them back

[versed helm]

I doubt it’s translator work for the majority of the dialogue spoken toward human characters. Lore wise the covenant know english, including arbiter, but with covenant on covenant dialogue such as conversations taking place inside high charity it’s been translated for us the player, when in reality they wouldn’t be speaking english. Halo 4? The covenant splinter faction doesn’t have a need to speak english, why continue to speak the language of your enemy post human-covenant war? Halo reach makes sense, first contact all that jazz. And on a design standpoint it is to make them more threatening.

[versed helm]

Chief and Arbiter speak english, Gravemind can easily speak english too through means of assimilation.

[hollow belfry]

okay so

how much stronger is atriox compared to bassus/escharum

and how come he looks so much larger than chief when canonically he is only a foot taller?

[forest ember]

“only a foot”

if you look at the starting cutscene in halo infinite he does seem about a foot taller

he’s just a lot bulkier

in difference that was there was probably because of stylistic stuff

the same way chief looks like 2 feet taller than palmer in one of the cutscenes

[ruby canopy]

I always took that scene as symbolic. That chief is seen as larger than life to a lot of people, in universe and out

[empty bloom]

https://tenor.com/view/halo-the-end-atriox-gif-27105465

[mellow flare]

mkkkreal

[vital stone]

I thought it was symbolic in the way that earlier in the game palmer said to chief "thought you'd be taller" as she's heard so many great things about the old war hero and is kinda disappointed by what she saw, but when he nukes the hell out of a literal death star, it's like he surpasses what she thought he would be, and sees him how he truely is, bigger and better than anybody else

Or it could be they just messed up the scaling in that cutscene with chief

[empty bloom]

I mean, either way, the size diff isn't canon.

Palmer's only a few inches shorter, IIRC she's like 6'9" to Chief's 7'2".

Hell, most of the members of Majestic are the same height as Chief.

[vital stone]

Wait, when she's in armor or out

[empty bloom]

Unclear.

It's kind of annoying trying to find IV height stats because they list Chief's height in armor and they list IV heights in either or seemingly at will.

[vital stone]

because if it's in armor she's prob actually around 6'5, which would make much more sense for an actual person

[empty bloom]

It wouldn't track with other listed heights.

Which leads me to believe it's in-armor height and out-of-armor weight.

Which is... Weird.

Physically speaking, Chief's 6'10" out of armor, so... it might actually be out of armor.

Spartan IVs aren't actually too far off the mark, heightwise, compared to IIs.

Honestly, I'd be surprised if a layman could see a difference, aside from the II having more surgery scars.

I wouldn't say scars in general, because most IVs are veterans of almost the entire HCW, or at least significant chunks of it.

[vital stone]

I don't believe IVs can be that tall

[empty bloom]

Too bad, they are.

One of the specific augs they receive lengthens their bones.

The battery of bone reinforcements includes filling the bones with a fullerene lattice, titanium joint replacements, bone lengthening/growth, and complete ligament reconstruction.

[vital stone]

I don't like Spartan IVs

They just seem like watered down knockoffs

[empty bloom]

Which is... Wrong?

I mean, that is literally wrong.

And even if it was right, about them being 'knockoffs'... Firstly, IIIs exist too, where's the flak for them; Secondly, so? They're economically more viable, more ethically viable, and are still demonstrated as extremely effective under normal operating conditions (No, Zeta Halo is not a normal operating condition).

[vital stone]

At least the IIIs are still about 80% as effective as IIs

[empty bloom]

I like them more than IIs precisely because it's a logical step to make from IIs and IIIs, and fulfills the intent of the actual origins of the Spartan program anyways.

[empty bloom]

And so are IVs.

[dusk jetty]

All spartan gens are about the same plane of effectiveness

[empty bloom]

This is consistently expressed.

[wet swallow]

What is life ?

[empty bloom]

A perpetual cycle of torment.

[wet swallow]

Amen

[empty bloom]

Honestly, if anything, I think half the problems with IVs is that the UNSC never really got the chance to prove out the teething problems of deploying that many Spartans; IIs and IIIs were hardly ever handled like a 'proper' sortie, with IIs getting risked less and less as the war dragged on through 'easier' missions due to their cost, and IIIs having steady ops before getting dumped on last-chance objective raids.

[dusty ferry]

The only other time we see that sort of deployment is the return to Requiem to my knowledge

and that was more like 5-6 fireteams than send 300 guys

[empty bloom]

The full compliment of the Infinity was last seen getting thrown at Reach in SoR. I don't think they're listed as actually taking any casualties there.

[dusty ferry]

oh yeah, forgot about that

[empty bloom]

The Infinity is, however, an aberration in how IVs get deployed, which people don't realize because some people really struggle to look outside of the camera lens.

Your average IV team is pretty explicitly deployed a'la Noble Team or a'la Blue Team; Shipped to hot zones out of central bases, attached to dedicated units of some kind as a force multiplier/fixer team, etc.

[dusty ferry]

Isn't that obvious? There is only 1 active Infinity class carrier

[empty bloom]

You'd think, but the amount of times I have to explain that...

[dusty ferry]

unless eternity launched incomplete or something (which is not suggested anywhere, but if they wanted a fun little book series set in the created era, thats technically an option)

[empty bloom]

It did not, but that'd be interesting.

Half the problem is kinda... Knowing where the hell all the IVs are. We know a few fireteams from the Reclaimer era are still running around, like Apollo and Crimson.

But Apollo is explicitly a cycling unit.

[dusty ferry]

Thats tied even further into us never really getting the IV's POV

[empty bloom]

We get it a few times.

[dusty ferry]

outside like Buck and Osiris

and majestic

[empty bloom]

Spartan Strike and Assault, but those are more from a historical context; Buck's perspective, which people oddly take as gospel; Osiris and Crimson, the former of which gets reflected upon; Majestic; Rubicon Protocol; And a teeny bit of Hunters in the Dark.

[dusty ferry]

We have no real clue about how many are active, if there is only one augmentation location, how many seperate facilities they train at

[empty bloom]

Nowadays, all the IV lore we get is being discussed from the perspective of the people fighting alongside them, too, which doesn't help.

[dusty ferry]

if they are even super common in ships outside the infinity

[empty bloom]

Especially since they tend to get worf'd in these times.

[vital stone]

The IVs are only equally effective due to their Gen 2 mjolnir, which is hardware, SOF units cannot be properly effective if relying mostly on hardware

Remember the 5 SOF truths

[dusty ferry]

Like, apparently fireteam shadow or whatever was active in 2550 or whatever. which brings up so many questions

[empty bloom]

List them, then remember I don't care because why the hell are you deploying Spartans without MJOLNIR.

What sort of moron deploys a different format special use case supersoldier without one of the most critical parts of their kit?

[dusty ferry]

at bare minimum you'd be giving them SPI, but by this point that is pretty dumb

[empty bloom]

You're just asking them to get killed. Especially if you're trying to deploy them like regular SOF.

[vital stone]

Humans over hardware, quality over quantity, SOF cannot be mass produced, cannot be made after emergencies and usually need non SOF help

The S IVs break all five of those truths

[empty bloom]

Sounds like a lot of IIs and IIIs I know, actually.

[dusty ferry]

Red team is stuck in the middle of knowhere with basically no support outside a hyper outdated ship

[empty bloom]

It's almost as though these flaws are inherent to the concept of Spartans in general, but get conveniently ignored disproportionately for IIs and IIIs, because people are terrified of acknowledging their biases.

[dusty ferry]

well yeah, supersoliders aren't that great a strategy

[empty bloom]

That, and literally every criticism @vital stone has just discussed has literally been a failiure point on every gen of Spartan, not just IVs.

[dusty ferry]

especially when the ground combat is where you have actual odds of winning

[vital stone]

oh yeah, IIIs break all those truths too

[empty bloom]

Oh, no, IIs as well, you're just not acknowledging First Strike.

[dusty ferry]

isn't it worse for II's and III's though? II's had what a 30-60% failure rate, and there were only 75 recruits in the first place?

[empty bloom]

Or Fall of Reach.

[vital stone]

tbh I don't remember first strike all that well

[dusty ferry]

like, no mass production of them was possible. the III's at least had like a near 0 failure rate

[empty bloom]

Chief's armor failing almost gets him killed nearly a dozen times in that book, and armor related failures have had a direct impact on multiple II deaths.

[dusty ferry]

i don't think anyone really wants to. so much of our current view of S-IIs is challenged by it

one dies to improperly packed charge i think

[wanton notch]

The thing that opened my eyes to IVs was how 4's Spartan Ops made it feel like they were still effective and not "watered down." Despite my own opinion that I like S-IIs more.

[empty bloom]

Delta, you're one of the only people I've ever seen actually list Spartan Ops as even mildly positive. Props.

[vital stone]

only 33 of them survived augs

[wanton notch]

It's a hill I'm willing to die on, it was my favorite addition to any Halo game.

I get it's not everyone's cup of tea, however.

[empty bloom]

https://tenor.com/view/hulk-hogan-macho-man-mega-powers-unite-gif-12487008

[dusty ferry]

I wish we had a spartan ops style mode in infinite

[vital stone]

tbf I kinda liked spartan ops

[empty bloom]

I think Forge AI would've received more fanfare if they were handling it like that one mode in Gears 5.

[dusty ferry]

It wasn't that bad. The IV's acted like human people which was always the point

[empty bloom]

Y'know, making 'missions' with it.

[vital stone]

in my opinion it was better than people cried it wass

[wanton notch]

I do like how IVs are intended to be the morally acceptable choice.

[dusty ferry]

Yeah, 4 and 5 at least gave an impression that in 4 years the UNSC had changed

which given how tech advances irl, made sense on some level

[wanton notch]

Also, it's logical-- if you had people saying they want to be augmented, trained, and become a Spartan, you don't need to kidnap children anymore

Your pool just got a lot wider and deeper lol

[vital stone]

Yeah but then it kind of a case of too little too late

[dusty ferry]

and also isn't kidnapping children

[dusty ferry]

maybe? Its unclear if S-IVs were active during the HCW

[vital stone]

They're too old to recieve the augments that made the older gens so effective and have to go through an alternate route to get that efficiency

Including relying mostly on hardware

[dusty ferry]

like, we have just enough evidence which says they were active by like 2550ish

[empty bloom]

Which hardly matters when Spartans, as a raw concept, are already heavily reliant on hardware-which is not an uncommon problem in the UNSC.

[vital stone]

They started in jan 7th 2553

so after the end of the HCW

[dusty ferry]

the thing is the augs are close enough in efficacy to where its practically irrelevant

[empty bloom]

Like, yeah, reliance bad, but in the case of Spartans, it is literally a primary component of their function under standard conditions.

[wanton notch]

True, the MJOLNIR platform could be categorized as reliance on hardware

(RIP Samuel)

[dusty ferry]

its a thing having to do with fireteam shadow apparently being around before then, and they are confirmed to be S-IVs

[empty bloom]

He specifically mentioned it as a negative earlier in regards to only IVs due to GEN2. Which... Well, y'know.

[empty bloom]

We do know ONI was toying around with augs before the 'official release date' of IVs, not counting the IV-Protos.

[dusty ferry]

yeah, mjolnir is what makes spartans so great

[dusty ferry]

yeah, like 2547 ish i think?

[empty bloom]

So it could be a case of them being a 'prototype' unit with partial augs.

[dusty ferry]

with the meridian kids

side thing, MJOLNIR itself is kinda really bad if you think about it

requiring superhman abilities is bad design

made even worse by how expenisive it was initially

[vital stone]

Yeah but the thing is that the S IIs and Mjolnir were both made to be part of one whole

[vital stone]

Oh really now

[empty bloom]

So... Why is it bad when IVs do it, if they have the same design idea in mind.

[vital stone]

Because when it came to the IIIs and IVs, then it became reliance

[dusty ferry]

heck, the IV's actually have decades of hindsight on their side, so if anything they pair far better with the armor

[sterile osprey]

Would Noble 6 have been able to survive reach if he was a spartan 2?

[empty bloom]

No.

[dusty ferry]

No

[vital stone]

No

[sterile osprey]

Ok lmao

[empty bloom]

It was a reliance for the IIs that got them killed, so I'm calling this out as the bias it is.

[vital stone]

Noble 6 was probably on booster drugs during his last stand

[empty bloom]

He wasn't.

Well, at least, not Gamma-style stuff.

Because he wasn't a Gamma.

If he's hopped up on anything it's medical adrenaline, a'la what Stone was left with when she died.

[vital stone]

There was no reliance, it was what they got, and it wasn't good enough back when it was MK IV

[empty bloom]

That's a cope.

They were designed with MJOLNIR in mind from the start and only relied on it more and more as MJOLNIR got better.

IIIs weren't even designed with MJOLNIR in mind so that criticism doesn't apply to them, and IVs are semi-regularly deployed without MJOLNIR as well-it's what Mirage IIC is for.

So they also, by that same logic, wouldn't be reliant upon MJOLNIR.

MJOLNIR is the intended way, but none of the Gens specifically rely upon it to be effective-they rely on it to be effective in the way Spartans are intended to be used, but a hammer can be used to build a house or crack a skull.

[vital stone]

Nice metaphor there

Mjonir being a hammer too

👏

like what you did there

[empty bloom]

Eh. It's from Castlevania.

Anyways, IIIs were made with SPI in mind but could wear MJOLNIR, as Noble and GEN2 Recluse displays. Likewise, IVs were designed with MJOLNIR in mind, but they were deployed with SPI and Mirage suits on ocassions where MJOLNIR was too 'loud' an option.

[dusty ferry]

And rakasha if it is not genuinely mjolnir

Side thing, can we get a warfleet style book on armor and stuff?

[empty bloom]

Rakshasa is a dedicated MJOLNIR variant to an unknown capacity, but it's more of a sidegrade than any specific gen as far as I can tell.

[dusty ferry]

Or just warfleet style books in general?

[empty bloom]

The monkey's paw curls inwards; The entire book is only about Mark Vb.

[dusty ferry]

The 3rd darkest timeline

[vital stone]

I always thought the Rakshasa to be like a spinoff to the mjolnir

[dusty ferry]

The darkest timeline is just about the design evolution of basic mark VI

[wanton notch]

MJOLNIR Lite™️

[empty bloom]

That hurt.

[dusty ferry]

Why?

[empty bloom]

No, I mean, it hurt to think that it'd be wasted on such a concept.

[dusty ferry]

ahh

[carmine sleet]

Yeah, I would want to learn more than just info about Mark VI

Let me learn about the various versions of Gen 2 and 3

And maybe the other non-Mjolnir power armours that exist

[empty bloom]

Well, I can tell you right now, they're never gonna do jack to ever even think about GEN2 again.

Much to my ire.

[dusty ferry]

and mine

love me some GEN 2 lore

[carmine sleet]

And my ire too

[empty bloom]

Alright, so where's the guy saying "Achtually I'm glad it's gone and it should never be here again"

Aaaaany second now

[carmine sleet]

Like, as much as I love Gen 3, since Halo 4 was the first Halo I got to play at launch, I have allot love for Gen 2

[vital stone]

[ruby canopy]

Actually I’m glad it’s gone and it should never be here again

[carmine sleet]

https://tenor.com/view/the-batman-pattinson2021-gif-18213870

[ruby canopy]

Could be. I don’t really know

[bronze prawn]

what does giilty spark refer when he said that the San'Shyuum " were accomplished manipulators, back before the firin of the array, at leest that hasnt changed "

something about the forreruner flod war - old -new lore ?

[ruby canopy]

Probably socially or technologically. Either way, I guess they were always one of the more intelligent species

I imagine anyways

[torn sleet]

Are there any Spartan 3’s still around ?

Besides Jun?

[unique rune]

Yes

Kevin-A282, Hazel-A302, Rosenda-A344, Owen-B096, Lucy-B091, Tom-B292, Ash-G099, and Olivia-G291 are still known to be alive and active at the current time. Plus presumably an unspecified number of Gammas that were reshuffled into other roles post-war.

And also the unnamed Spartan-G059.

[torn sleet]

Thanks

[pallid knoll]

Rosenda’s still alive?

[wise snow]

So ive never read the books or anything, but I keep hearing about this Mendicant Bias character. Who are they and why are they so important?

[unique rune]

As far as we know, yes. She was in communication with Jun sometime post-War during his time as Chief of Staff of Spartan Operations.

So it's possible she died sometime after that but everything's vague enough that I'm going with "she's still alive for now"

[pallid knoll]

ok thanks

[forest ember]

who says spartans have to serve in a specifically SOF capacity

they’re basically just augmented humans

hell SII and SIII tactics and strategy in lore are rarely that of a spec ops team

with maybe the exception of noble and gray teams

and black team i suppose

[wanton notch]

Technically, they fall under NAVSPECWARCOM which is, by definition, a special forces division.

[forest ember]

what exactly is the assembly anyways

[forest ember]

that's true

[sterile osprey]

what are the requirements to become a spartan 4? Ik it got much less restrictive but how much?

Could essentially anyone become a spartan 4 or is it just a lot more open?

[empty bloom]

Top of the line physical characteristics and notable (positive) aberrances in mental fortitude; Exceptional talent in leadership plus a career of gallantry, for example.

[empty bloom]

Physically, every Spartan IV ever has been physically in the top percentile of a percentile of humans, doubly proven by physical selection proving exceptionally taxing even to veteran ODSTs.

So, technically, "anyone" could be a Spartan IV, just like how "anyone" could be a Navy Seal; Which is to say, on paper, anyone without significant mental or physical handicaps could, but in terms of practicality, that number is extremely low; Except the scale is even more tight than it is for IRL special forces.

(Just using Seals as a generic 'special forces!!!!' example, I know they have issues IRL)

Part of the problem is that nobody wants to hear about SFC James, who failed out of the IV physical tryouts because of a broken wing in the fifth week of training before augs and couldn't get back on track.

So you don't hear much about how many people would logically fail at selection like that.

[orchid kettle]

The way its often depicted, a man in a suit shows up and offers you the chance to become a superhero, usually because somebody important noticed that you were a pretty cool guy

The way I figure it works is that Musa and Jun intentionally want a healthy balance of young and old, career soldiers and specialists, outer colony kids and core world brats

or its just a coincidence because it'd be kinda boring if every character in a team was a veteran ODST of twenty years

[carmine sleet]

Doesn't help when you get people yelling about how the IVs are all just former ODSTs when that's not what happened at all

[versed helm]

what does the public know about halo, flood, forerunners and stuff?

and cortana and banished too, i suppose

[orchid kettle]

To be fair, I understand the confusion when the games themselves refuse to have both in the same room at the same time

I would also understand thinking that IVs would all be former ODSTs if you were still under the impression that the old bnet article about ODSTs themselves being veterans of some OTHER special forces unit was still true

though honestly it doesn't feel like that was ever true, considering you had Mickey only mentioning being a former Pelican pilot, and Gage was just a transfer from the CMA

best I can figure is that those high standards were only really in effect during the Interplanetary War, the conflict that saw their inception

but the second the Insurrection began, where the UNSC's recruitment levels dropped alongside their approval ratings, those standards were relaxed substantially

and likely remained that way well into the Covenant War

Since now the only prerequisite to applying to be a Helljumper is to have served a couple years in one of the UEG's armed forces beforehand

oh wait, maybe that's what Traviss meant by ODSTs "recruiting from all three services"

the Spartan Field Manual mentions that IVs pull from the UNSC, CMA, and local Planetary Defense Forces

[fiery forge]

i like odst

[scarlet hinge]

Mendicant Bias was an AI created by the Forerunners to essentially run their military and devise strategems to counter the Flood, during their war

he was one of five Metarchs - the most powerful AIs of the empire

later during the war, he was convinced by the Gravemind to defect to the Flood, and in doing so, turned a significant portion of the Forerunner fleet on their own creators

the Forerunners then deployed another Metarch - Offensive Bias - against Mendicant, and the two were engaged in a titanic naval confrontation at the moment the Halos fired - resulting in Mendicant's defeat

after that, Mendicant was entombed on the Ark, only able to think about repentance and atoning for his actions - though a shard of his AI system was able to escape aboard a Keyship that ultimately crashed on the homeworld of the Prophets

that keyship later became the centre of High Charity, and Mendicant Bias was the one who told the Prophets they were idiots and that humanity were reclaimers - leading to the start of the war you see in the games

that's the TLDR version

[warped gust]

I would love if 343 released Halsey's Journal as an Ebook, or an audiobook Narrated by Jen Taylor

[orchid kettle]

They really should, yeah

[carmine sleet]

So long as they also rerelease the physical version too. I wanna be able to read through it and hold it with my hands

[wanton notch]

I really appreciated this

[wanton notch]

I still have mine somewhere, such a cool piece

[carmine sleet]

I got into Halo after Reach released so I never had the chance to get a copy

[orchid kettle]

I think I just bought mine off amazon

not the entire legendary edition, just the book

[versed helm]

what does the public know about halo, flood, forerunners and stuff?
and cortana and banished too, i suppose

[dusk jetty]

Well they likely know about Cortana and the banished

Id imagine there’s a lot of rumors about the flood

But halo iirc is completely classified

Nobody without security clearance would know about it

[unique rune]

Have S’Moa apparently advertises their onion rings as being the size of Halos so presumably there’s some public knowledge of them.

[versed helm]

So any chunks of both, or maybe even three rings ( I heard that there was a third 04 constructed somewhere, i wouldn't bet on that info tho ) floating around in space are just remnants of a very old ship that engaged a ginormous covenant remnant fleet and lost after destroying 90% of the invaders, right?

[versed helm]

actually if someone can confirm or debunk that it'd be great

[dusk jetty]

The area around the original 04 installation is an exclusion zone, nobody goes there from what I know, besides the whole bio weapon debacle

But there’s certainly debris fields, yes

But if your a guy who isn’t in the military, or anything related to it, like you work a desk job, I’d imagine anything about a galaxy wiping super weapon is hearsay at best

You likely know about Cortana and the banished, because Cortana literally broadcasted a message everywhere, and the banished fool around with humanity a lot. They fought the Viery militia in New Mohacs so at the very least they know about them. There’s other engagements with the banished as well, simple piracy to full on battles iirc

Venezia associates with them too

[versed helm]

What is Venezia?

[dusk jetty]

Short version: a particularly rebellious colony with a lot of shady associations

Long version, Halopedia probably explains it better than I do

They have covenant weaponry and associate with the banished, hate the UNSC etc

[versed helm]

I'm not that interested. The more i talk with people about lore, the less i wanna play the games. If i said anything else about that topic, It's BS ( Bank of the Sprawl, for any of the moderators that wanna know where the acronym came from )

[versed helm]

In other words, they're the Hungary of Halo?

[dusk jetty]

Sort of

They have committed openly rebellious acts

They would rather let a UNSC vessel explode from a reactor leak then land on their planet

Which is a real incident

[versed helm]

A meh analogy, but whatever, i went with it.

[versed helm]

Everything that ain't Earth really hates UNSC... Did they exploit them that badly? Did they discriminate them?

[versed helm]

I'd like to imagine that all info is published, and that the UNSC really takes the reclaimer title and all seriously, but we all know that ain't the case. We really could use some more smart AIs in that world.

I have questions about the flood overgrowth: What is it's purpose, exactly? Is it a part of a gravemind? And how fast could it transform to pure forms?
Wait, that births another question: How does the flood change it's hosts into pure infected biomass?

[carmine sleet]

That's not quite how it is, plenty of colonies are perfectly fine with UNSC and the UEG being in charge. There's allot of differing views from various people throughout human space

[wise snow]

Thank you very much!

[bronze prawn]

why/how the AI of the truth and reconciliation seem to now pretty well what the firing of the halos ACTUALLY will do

in the Halo CE terminal

[versed helm]

But weren't all outer colonies glassed? And aren't those that broke free from Earth either not rediscovered or really hate the UNSC?

[empty bloom]

No, they weren't all glassed. Several stuck around with the UNSC, though some went Indie.

[zenith thicket]

can i get some sauce on a two betrayals analysis

i know 343 gave gs granpa syndrome but id like to know the original intent behind sparks dialogue (know was not the right word xd)

[empty bloom]

Uh... Replace 343 with Bungie and remove everything past the word "Syndrome".

Bam, there's the answer you're looking for.

[zenith thicket]

where do bungie say it

[empty bloom]

In CE.

Because, y'know, it's dialogue that they had added the moment they okay'd the script and voice work.

Because he's so clearly loopy. Like, the intent for that could not be more obvious if they tried.

... Did Bungie like, need to add a neon sign-carrying Sentinel that follows Spark around that says "This guy's off his rocker" or something?

I mean, like them, I would figure him just randomly babbling and humming all the time, then eventually going on an entire tangential conversation with someone who Chief clearly is not would be enough.

Maybe a sentinel following him around holding a bunch of cue cards.

[hot zodiac]

As far as hard explanations, Bungie had none for why Spark thought Chief was a literal 100,000 year old Forerunner. That was a mystery until the Forerunner novels in terms of "answers".

Lots of theories though. Don't let Trench get ya down he's just negative about criticism towards 343

(If that was even your intention)

A lot of people have started to think it's just a Marathon reference but I'm not so sure, at least not the only reason. It has to be close though.

[empty bloom]

Nah, in this case it's simply correcting misaimed criticism.

[hot zodiac]

I'm not sure what benefit there is to this but there actually wasn't an answer for this until 343 lol

[empty bloom]

I took it as him thinking that 343i somehow retconned CE's dialogue, tbh.

Because like, his dialogue never actually got changed, but he was so clearly unwell anyways, so even if it was unelaborated upon forever, it's not like they somehow retconned anything.

[hot zodiac]

That's a different discussion

[empty bloom]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[hot zodiac]

I think people forget that we didn't actually know much

For the events 100,000 years ago we had cliffnotes

[orchid kettle]

Im a pretty big fan of Spark not really being crazy at all

He only ever says "You", which I like to think refers to humanity itself

It kinda then begs the question of why humanity doesn't already know about its origins, and suggests that humans being ignorant wasnt part of the plan

[hot zodiac]

Yeah, like he sounds crazy to everyone else

[bronze prawn]

what are we arguing ?

[hot zodiac]

He is "eccentric" but actual lunacy would be misplaced

That said, he's 100% talking about Chief directly

[bronze prawn]

are you sure

[orchid kettle]

Its also a bit of a joke line, but I find it interesting that if you shoot Guilty Spark, he has a chance to say

[bronze prawn]

“But you already knew that. I mean, how couldn’t you?” “Last time you asked me “If it were my choice, would I do it?” My answer has not changed

[orchid kettle]

"Please, stop being human."

[bronze prawn]

And " why do you hesitate to do what you have already done?”

[orchid kettle]

implying he's already pretty familiar with, well, people and humanity

[hot zodiac]

This is absolutely a factor though. When he pours through the autumn records on human history, he's ecstatic to finally be able to know what we know

[orchid kettle]

There's somewhat of a suggestion that the biblical story of Noah's Ark and the flood that almost wipes out all life is based on true history

[hot zodiac]

And then he stops thinking we're some 100,000 year old guy

[orchid kettle]

therefore-- somebody had that knowledge and passed it on to present day humanity

[bronze prawn]

spark was really pleased that humans FINALLY get to their ring

[orchid kettle]

so my theory is that Spark was under the impression that we should already know everything

I guess because why else would humans be back if they weren't ready to reclaim their stuff

[bronze prawn]

“Last time you asked me “If it were my choice, would I do it?” My answer has not changed . ?

[hot zodiac]

Yep. It's curious how Guilty Spark is always contrasting the Covenant's misappropriated religious nomenclature to Forerunner technology, but then just straight up says "The Flood" and "The Ark"

[orchid kettle]

Its also very interesting how in Ghosts of Onyx, the sentinel that tries to talk to Ash knows what Latin is

and attempts to communicate with that first

[bronze prawn]

how do you pretend to give other name to " the flood"

"the parasite" the virus - the precursors

[hot zodiac]

Because in this case, the misappropriation is reversed. We've already ascribed a religious context to these events. But for some reason, we already have an idea of this conflict before discovering Forerunner artifacts.

[orchid kettle]

Yeah, and in the cut Halo 2 ending, its because the Ark is a facility on Earth that's beaming information into mankind subconsciously

Kinda like the Librarian Geas of today-- but the Ark blows up at the end, and I guess it implies that now humanity is free to choose its own fate

[hot zodiac]

They moved the Ark and indexing into space, but kept the human development in the portal.

[orchid kettle]

while the Librarian Geas is probably nowhere near done with humanity

[bronze prawn]

crazy the amount of things that are happenning rigth now in the halo universe

343 is having loniless- 2401 has a flood problem- the didact is sleeping

[orchid kettle]

But yeah, GS's words are intentionally mysterious in CE, and combined with the cut Halo 2 ending, I believe implies that humanity SHOULD have been aware of the Halo rings and what their purpose was before finding them

[hot zodiac]

For whatever reason, the portal information beam doesn't fully work though. We have an idea of the Flood war but it's crazy wrong. And Guilty Spark's comment in Two Betrayals is still unique case, not just general Forerunner knowledge like the sentinel, but specific individual memory?

[orchid kettle]

but something went wrong, either the machine that beams knowledge doesn't work as well as they thought, or we ended up skipping a few dozen steps on the way to Reclamation by finding the Sigma Octanus crystal and deciphering it

[hot zodiac]

Or maybe, Chief was the unique case. It's hard to say.

It is possible it was just a loose screw in Guilty Spark, but that's not really the MO.

[orchid kettle]

You could also make the argument that Spark lapsing into thinking that he's talking to a Forerunner implies Chief looks like one

in his "class two combat skin" or whatever

[hot zodiac]

We don't have any clear theory though, which is also not that usual.

[orchid kettle]

Like I said, I kinda enjoy the idea that he's not crazy

AND when he turns evil again in 3

Its because of his faulty forerunner programming

[bronze prawn]

spark is the only " villain" that I not enjoy killing

[orchid kettle]

Where because a ring is back in the equation, protocol takes over

and protocol dictates action

Because whenever a ring isn't involved, he's pretty chill

[hot zodiac]

We don't get enough time with 2401 to know if he also believes in Chief being a specific Forerunner, but he DOES think Chief should already know about firing the rings like spark.

[bronze prawn]

even the gravemind said to chief " and has his mind concluded"

maybe all asumme humans were smarter

[hot zodiac]

Yeah, that was just canon. He tells you twice "Protocol dictates action" about destroying his ring.

I mean "faulty" is not the right word, the programming was too well lol

[orchid kettle]

Well, faulty in the sense that his "Laws of Robotics" thing is prioritizing the ring's integrity over anything else

the fault is more so with whoever programmed him I guess

[hot zodiac]

Yeah the laws of robotics concept aren't a factor

The Forerunners have weird protocols

[orchid kettle]

especially in 3 when the ring's integrity is being prioritized over stopping the Gravemind

[hot zodiac]

He wouldn't even be able to use the thing because if he succeded he would've killed the Reclaimers lol

But hey, protocol dictates action man...

[bronze prawn]

quite quite acceptable...

[gusty briar]

Good evening chat

I have a question, some spartans like in reach have night vision and master chief does not have it, instead he has a helmet mounted flashlight

Why is that?

[unique rune]

Just a gameplay thing.

[orchid kettle]

personally I like flashlights more

i like how atmospheric it feels

[gusty briar]

The sniper rifle has NV

[unique rune]

It’s just a gameplay thing. Don’t think about it too hard.

Bungie probably only did the night vis thing because they seemingly forgot to put flashlights onto the helmets.

[wanton notch]

Flashlight is more versatile anyway. NV is good only when light is limited and you've got range between your enemy

[versed helm]

Spark should be 343's favorite character, change my mind

[orchid kettle]

no it should be Sparks

the ODST sniper guy of Sunray 1-1

[empty bloom]

You know, actually, it would be pretty cool to have some of the SoF's crew be made into Spartan IVs. Work em into a Noble-style mixed fireteam of IIs and IVs who've worked together for literal years at this point.

[drowsy mesa]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fdwbyb3TE8o

[meager pier]

What happens if Gray Team runs into the Grey Knights?😱

[zenith thicket]

nah a thread said that 343 did that so i was curious and regurgitated it here to see if it was so

[zenith thicket]

thx

[balmy gulch]

I never understood why the forerunners decided that killing all life forms to starve the flood is easier than exterminating the flood. Imagine if humans thought that the best solution to defeat coronavirus is by killings themselves.

[unique rune]

I mean. That’s… oversimplifying it more than a little bit.

The Flood got very out of hand. In the sense that it reached a stage of full sentience in which it was able to fight entire military campaigns against the (second) most advanced civilization in the galaxy. That’s not something the Forerunners could just wipe out with conventional warfare.

Last I checked, no terrestrial viruses have been able to take on the US Navy in any physical combat.

[bronze prawn]

the ancient actually purge entire planets to prevent more outbreaks sooooo.....

[balmy gulch]

How do languages work in halo lore? Does everyone speak English?

[swift kraken]

No. Covenant studied Humanity before "Introducing" themselves so knew a bit (know your enemies) Spartans just have auto Translators in their suits.

ODSTs.... Idk, Game Reasons that the Brutes speak it.

[ruby canopy]

I can’t entirely remember the lore reason as to why the covenant use English. But I’m pretty sure it’s mainly for the player to just better understand what is going on

I remember there was a big fuss when halo 2 came out as to why the aliens were speaking English

[swift kraken]

In 'Fall of Reach' their first message is untranslated according to Halsey to the S-IIs

And Cortana has a boatload of translation software which is why we "hear" the Covies better after CE (she was in the Ring and gained better software allegedly

[ruby canopy]

That’s a good enough reason for me

[swift kraken]

XD

Fair enough

[craggy acorn]

how long did spartan 3 program last

I heared it lasted like 5 years

[swift kraken]

Longer than the S-II actually

[uneven maple]

i know the flood is a corrupted form of the precursors, but ignoring that just assuming that the flood went to war against the precursors at both of their heights of power, who would win?

[swift kraken]

There was only 1 class of 30-40 of 2s meanwhile there were more than 600 S3

[craggy acorn]

I see

[swift kraken]

There where at least 2 class of 300 s3 and m those were the ones where 1 group had no survivors and abnother had 2: Tom and Lucy

[swift kraken]

Flood

tHE FLOOD IS 1 EVIL PRECUSSOR WHO SAID "f U GUYS" TO THE gALAXY

(CAPS sorry)

Meanwhile the others just decided to let the Forerunners kill them

Meaning every Precurrsor could do the Flood thing but chose Pacafism

And one was just like, "Nuh uh"

[craggy acorn]

is James-005 dead or just in space, floating

[swift kraken]

Well, polly dead by now. They never found his body cause it was floating above Reach... While it was being assualted...

So... Unlikely.

[craggy acorn]

Ooh

[carmine sleet]

We have a new Waypoint Chronicle up on YouTube

[fair hazel]

spirot of fireee

[obsidian thistle]

A lotta deep cuts in this

[quiet shoal]

So how do war games weapons work

I know they don’t kill each other but what do they use for the weapons

Is it like a vr simulation orrr

[unique rune]

Huh. They... changed the spelling of Vaughan's name?

Nice to have first names for Sunray 1-1 now at least.

[glossy abyss]

Anyone know a place where I can download all of the halo books for research purposes? Or at least a place to read them all?

[quiet shoal]

There are pdfs online

I read the fall of reach on a pdf

[carmine sleet]

They mentioned the cat!!!

[obsidian thistle]

Please support the official releases! 🙂

[quiet shoal]

I do

[quiet shoal]

But I found one online

[obsidian thistle]

Yea please dont share that! Or encourage using that! Thanks! 🙂

[dusty ferry]

It’s augmented reality, so like they have a fake gun that shoots bullets that only exist in the simulation

[quiet shoal]

Oh ok cool

[quiet shoal]

k

[humble mulch]

Is halo wars canon, is arbiter actually dead

[empty bloom]

No. That's Ripa, not Thel.

[humble mulch]

Huh

[empty bloom]

So, Arbiter Ripa, the one in Wars 1 with a noncanon appearance in Wars 2 Multiplayer, died.

Arbiter Thel, the one you play as in 2 and fight alongside in 3 and 5, is still alive.

Sorry, not Rtas, derp

[empty bloom]

This is Ripa, he is the dead Arbiter.

And this is Thel, who is alive.

[humble mulch]

Is that why he has a completely different personality

Slapping elites everywhere

[empty bloom]

Uh... Yes. They're entirely different people. Ripa was dishonored and disgraced for entirely different reasons, mostly involving how much of a cur he was.

Which is also why he made a good Arbiter for what he was tasked for, apparently.

Thel was, at his core, actually a pretty honorable and open-minded dude, and fairly reasonable.

[steel stone]

That arbiter and the one from Halo Legends were so freaking cool. They both dual wielded swords, imagine them as bosses they would be so awesome fighting

[empty bloom]

Problably not too different from Jega.

[steel stone]

I completely forgot about him, need to play infinites campaign again, think I beat it only 1 time

[bronze prawn]

the swords of Ripa were so cool

that personalized style like a mini helmet was neat

[wanton notch]

Ripa 'Moramee (Arbiter in HW1) is dead.

[wanton notch]

Agreed, the dual energy swords was a really neat design

[real steppe]

Why didn't the UNSC make combat robots?
Kat in Halo Reach mentions that her robot arm is strong enough to punch through MJOLNIR
It's gotta be cheaper and less time consuming than abducting children and training them for like 15 years and modifying their bodies to become superhuman

[empty bloom]

The UNSC did make combat drones and autoturrets to support normal forces, but they were mostly used for local stationkeeping.

That's... Pretty doubtful, as a statement, on Kat's part; Spartans generally haven't been shown to be capable doing more than denting SPI, so even regular MJOLNIR is kind of of a tough ask. She does specify visor, but again... Tough ask.

It is, but that's also why Spartan IVs exist.

Just because a Spartan's the one saying it, doesn't mean it's actually true.

[unique rune]

Even if we assume what Kat says is true, the issue is probably more to do with the control system than anything else. Sticking dumb AI inside them would be relatively cheaper but likely too inflexible for the chaos of a warzone, while sticking a smart AI in would be risking a high-value asset that could be used far more efficiently at a higher level.

[real steppe]

Too inflexible for a warzone? Wdym?
You drop a bunch of robots into a warzone and tell them to shoot at the aliens - what's the need for flexibility?
If it's disarming a bomb or something i understand,but for just shooting at aliens?

[zenith thicket]

covie ai btfo unsc coder

[real steppe]

None of those words are in the bible

[zenith thicket]

godbless

[unique rune]

I mean. Fighting a war is more than just “shoot the bad guys,” especially for the roles that Spartans were meant to fill.

[real steppe]

For Spartan 3s,they were essentially "made" to die
To buy everyone a little more time

And yeah it's more than shoot the bad guys but a good number of roles in the military,like infantry,have that goal

[unique rune]

Spartan-IIIs were made to “trade lives for time,” sure, but they didn’t do that with human wave tactics. They did that through high-risk, low-profile precision strikes with limited outside support that could go horribly wrong at any second.

[real steppe]

I'm still a bit confused,why couldn't they just have a bunch of robots fulfill the role of infantry then? I doubt they'd have the money to completely replace people of course but like,it would probably still help in the defense of locations or something to have robots that are stronger than your average joe and can take multiple bullets without needing to be in a hospital for months

[unique rune]

The UNSC has automated weapons like turrets and other defense systems, I would imagine they don’t have robot infantry because that probably would be horrible to integrate with flesh and blood infantry but also because computers are confounding things that get worse the more you learn about how they function.

[wanton notch]

So, Rizz, Kai and Vannak being part of Omega team prior to creation of Silver... that was a bold move

[carmine sleet]

It's a logical choice for their main canon counterparts

[pallid thicket]

Are we ever gonna see the Maethrillian in any of the games? The books suggests it still exists after the firing of the Array

[empty bloom]

Because the absolutely insane myriad of possibilities in the chaos of an active warzone preclude such things as fully autonomous killing machines operating 'simply'. There's nothing simple about the engineering challenge.

[scarlet hinge]

first, define for a computer what an alien is

"oh, it's a creature standing roughly 5-7ft tall with two arms and two legs and a head"

now your war robot is massacring civilians

[carmine sleet]

It's possible we'll see it again, we just don't know

[bronze prawn]

did noble 6 really "figth for weeks against thousands of covenants"

it always mentioned that In ThE bOoK he figth for weeks but I think that even the spartan 3 progam didnt exist before reach

[empty bloom]

Hooooo boy.

Okay, so for starters, Reach was during the very last year of the war.

[empty bloom]

The Spartan III program had already existed for 21 years by the time Reach fell. Spartan B312 was in the second class of IIIs.

Secondly, no book has ever actually included Noble Six in it, ever.

And he did not fight for weeks against the Covenant on his own when he died.

Also, Ghosts of Onyx, which introduced the Spartan IIIs to the series, was written in 2006.

It's really weird how suddenly there's all this ridiculous misinfo about Noble Six. Guy barely has a known combat history or chain of events by design.

[carmine sleet]

Yeah, it is odd there's suddenly been a bunch of people claiming that the IIIs came after Reach fell

[versed helm]

blame it on Lore & Theory, folks

[empty bloom]

... is that an actual person who's going around saying that?

[craggy acorn]

What if noble 3 Jun-A266 came with noble instead of going with Halsey
would Noble 6 would've gone to the pillar of autumn?

[carmine sleet]

Unknown

He could've tripped and fell out of the Pelican before Noble got to the Autumn

[craggy acorn]

lol

[carmine sleet]

Or he could've been hit by a brick and suffered a serious head injury

[unique rune]

Might’ve seriously injured himself trying to get the If They Came to Hear Me Beg achievement

[carmine sleet]

That too

Or maybe a Grunt got lucky and a sniper round managed to hit their methane pack at a specific angle that it bounced off, ricocheted off of a bunch of rocks and then hit Jun

[versed helm]

explain

[empty bloom]

I'm asking you to explain

I didn't understand what you meant

[versed helm]

there'a a halo youtuber that makes " Lore & Theory " videos

I've notices that about 30% of the misinformation aligns with what is said there

[empty bloom]

Oh, so it's a specific one

I mean most of them do that but I thought you were being specific about a channel named that explicitly

[cerulean topaz]

Did anyone talk about the recent canon fodder stuff yet?

[unique rune]

I’m pretty sure that was just Frank O’Connor having a laugh.

[carmine sleet]

We also know Jun lives as well thanks to Halo Initiation (I think that's the name of the comic which confirmed he made it off Reach)

[empty bloom]

Halo Fandom

[last anchor]

He also shows up in Escalation and both New and Bad Blood as well as Lessons Learned

He almost died but Tom saved him like a boss

[carmine sleet]

Yea, but the first appearance was before Escalation

[obsidian thistle]

Oh hey some new/old Stanchion lore

https://twitter.com/Halo/status/1760798621631455323?t=gpjBV6u1IFFAeyhAwkZ5CA&s=19

Halo (@Halo) on X

"They'll take the hat off an Elite at two-thousand yards. And they ain't cheap."

Channel your inner Linda-058 and master the art of precision with the UNSC's sniper rifle arsenal 🎯

#Halo101

Twitter · Feb 22, 2024, 10:48 PM

Its manufacturer is HRN

Something that one could see as an interpretation of what the old logo tied to the Stanchion said in the Halo Graphic Novel.

I personally read it as LRV. But I can see how one would read HRN

[last anchor]

Could work for LRV
"Long Range Ventilation"

Killing Range; 4.5 KM
Oh baby yes

[obsidian thistle]

I keep forgetting that many people never knew that text was now readable in newer versions of the HGN

[last anchor]

You'd be surprised how many people dont know the HGN exists

[deep citrus]

Im kinda confused by noble team still. Did the covenant send an advanced team to reach via tiny vessel and thats why they're shocked that the covenant are there? Because like...they showed up with a truly giant fleet

And The Fall of Reach makes it sound like they had notice. They even formed a full line of their own ships

[carmine sleet]

There's some weird messiness in the timeline that Reach introduced that 343 has put in allot of effort to reconcile

[fair hazel]

They sent certain teams to take out the visegrad relay, used stealth and established a cloaked presence on reach. That was lead by Rho 'Barutamee.

Later on other fleets arrive and on the 30th, the big fleet arrives to fell reach

the UNSC kept the invasion secret, also so they could enact operation red flag and use reach as a bait, but I don't think they expected such a big fleet at the time

[deep citrus]

Ah makes a bit more sense. Thanjs

[sonic lagoon]

What uniforms would pirates have worn?

[carmine sleet]

That's assuming all pirates were unified and organised enough to think having uniforms is important

I imagine most would be wearing overalls or something similar since being practical is more important when doing piracy

[scarlet hinge]

look up the Belters and the Free Navy from the Expanse series - that's probably about as close approximation as you'll get from a visual standpoint

[bronze prawn]

why the heretic leader never show the monitor in his heretic transmissions

i mean if the rest of the covenant saw how the oracle tell the truth would be way way more impactful

[empty bloom]

They'd problably just blast him to bits from orbit in that case. The entire hit was because he was transmitting at all-the more important his message, the harder they'd hit him.

Which might be why he didn't-if he started transmitting something that brazenly, they'd do more than send a hit squad.

[bronze prawn]

still the mesaage and doubt would have been sended

[empty bloom]

I mean, Halo 2 takes place in under a week. I doubt it'd matter much in the end.

And considering the Prophets managed to lead everyone by the nose for centuries, I could see them lying more.

[bronze prawn]

yeah kinda werid how the great schim

happens like in 2 3 days

a rebellion like that in the entire covenant would have months

[empty bloom]

Technically, the Schism is 'still' ongoing.

The Covenant was a huge empire, and the divisions its rupture caused have had a direct impact on the current timeline-especially folks like Jul Madama's nuCovenant.

[last anchor]

And Selin Nian's little band we havent heard of for a while

[deep citrus]

Even the battle for high charity would probably take months or years. Depending on how virilant the flood are

[empty bloom]

It canonically took less than 72 hours, which isn't surprising because like half the biomass would come from civilians.

Even an old, fat prophet can be made into a combat form.

The interior of High Charity, in terms of combat, would be an absolute nightmare. Civilians pining for escape, Brute and Elite positions fighting eachother (If any elites were even left) for control over the vessel's guns and strongpoints or even evac points, and literally everywhere you'd see flood.

Gravemind hit at exactly the worst possible point they ever could have hit.

[spare kite]

Anyone else find it weird how the CMA/CAA just caved into the UEG when they decided to dissolve them? The CMA/CAA effectively had autonomy and ultimate control of the outer colonies, so I would imagine that just giving that all away would have sparked some pushback from the CMA/CAA. If I were to take a realistic approach from it, I would assume that there wanted to pushback, but that the existence of the UNSC stopped them from creating any discontent, because had they did the UEG could have just pulled the UNSC to stop any threats.

[cunning wave]

Why did the Prophets decide to betray the elites in halo 2?

[spare kite]

Because Brutes are big dumboes that arent smart enough to think for themselves. Hyerbole of course, but Brutes were easier to control.

[cunning wave]

Why did they even bother making a new arbiter then?

[spare kite]

That one could be for numerous reasons. Making Vadam Arbiter could hide disloyalty. After all why make an Arbiter if you're just going to replace the Elites anyways. The Arbiter is also in some ways a puppet so they could have created a new Arbiter to take out the Heretics with the preferred outcome having the Arbiter die at the end.

[empty bloom]

Convenient pawn, turned out to be a pretty damn strong pawn.

[unique rune]

To get an influential Sangheili figure out of the way.

[empty bloom]

That too

That, and it's ultimately a Halo plot

[spare kite]

Speaking of Halo plot. I had someone literally tell me with genuine intent that the Halo 3 story dislike only comes from 343 fanboys that want to defend the 343 era of Halo. Like im not an apologist for 343 but Halo 3 is like known to be the worse of the og 3 in terms of story, and thats been knows since like forever lol.

[last anchor]

People have their takes. They always will.
Thats the inevitable result of media consumption.

[empty bloom]

Defence of likes breeds strange takes.

[bronze prawn]

youre not alone

most of spanish fans of halo agree that halo 3 is the worst

more nostalgic than game

[sonic lagoon]

Breeds are different indeed.

[vital stone]

I thought all og stories were pretty on par with quality

[pure heath]

Is the TV Series now Canon or an Alternate universe?

[empty bloom]

It's still the same alternate universe it's always been.

A'la the Marvel Comics versus the Marvel movies.

[pure heath]

Oki thank you

[meager pier]

Yeah, it’s an adaptation

[carmine sleet]

Aye, which is why some things are different, regardless of if it's better or worse

[spare kite]

I would rather have a canon story especially since this is really the first Halo material that is in the tv/movie scene. And I say first not to imply that stuff like legends of nightfall and fod dont exist. But first in that this is the first one with a real budget behind it. Nightfall had a budget of 10 million, while the show has that budget per episode.

Its not like star wars where you have countless movies with countless shows both live action and animated. Halo just doesnt have that presence on the screen aside from gaming so I continue to be miffed on their decision.

[last anchor]

Probably cause its a game series first and foremost.
All the good stuff will be in either the games themselves, or the books.

In truth I prefer it this way; rather than 9/10 series for Star Wars, at best, being mid (looking at literally anything that isnt Andor or Filoni directed), I'll take solid games, good books, and a TV show that while not amazing does what it needs to do and shows people how brutal Halo combat can be.

Its pulling 40k fans. That alone is enough.

[spare kite]

I agree? I don't think we're disagreeing. My point is that I would have liked a canon show since this is the first one with real budget behind it.

[last anchor]

One step at a time.
If the TV show does well (and it seems to be) then we'll get more from it. Its about interest and fan reaction.

[forest ember]

did the unsc ever find the spirit of fire

[empty bloom]

Kind of.

The UNSC at large still has no idea the Spirit is even alive and intact, but The Ferrets do.

[forest ember]

who are those

[empty bloom]

A squad of "Former" Spartan III Gammas.

[forest ember]

oh wait is that

ash

and lucy

and all them

[empty bloom]

Yep

Well, not Lucy

[last anchor]

Lucy's on Trevelyan/Onyx with Tom and Mendez still.

Last we heard they were getting sweet, sweet BBQ

[vital stone]

tbh the alternate timeline stuff is just a cheap e><cuse for paramount+ to do whatever it wants with the source material without halo fans saying 'HEY WAIT, THAT'S NOT HOW IT WORKS!'

[vital stone]

If I were to make a halo tv show I'd actually not make master chief the main character

Just rather a legendary figure that shows up a few times along with blue team

[plain lagoon]

So halo multiplayer is canon. Why do one in 5 Spartans have a limb missing

It’s either one limb missing or all of them

[frosty herald]

Tell that to the covenant

[wanton notch]

I mean, with how many Spartan IVs there are, and how deadly plasma/hardlight is...

[plain lagoon]

.. true-

Feels a bit too common for dismemberment of limbs

[vital stone]

Simplest reason ever

it's a cool look

[empty bloom]

Psychopathic voices claiming to be from the real world tell them to chop off and reattach limbs as the voices will

[forest ember]

spartan paraplegics are canon

[ruby canopy]

Sounds like the dark urge

Bg3 and halo crossover when

[last anchor]

Augmentation failures too

[plain lagoon]

My Spartan the grafted

[dense pulsar]

So where does Helldivers fit into the ODST timeline?

[plain lagoon]

Everyone at the start of season 1 having the urge to chop off all their limbs

[last anchor]

It doesnt

[plush compass]

I don’t think all of the multiplayer customization is canon

Like the whole Santa helmet thing

[wanton notch]

It's been talked about before, basically anything with "343 Industries" as the manufacturer is intended to be non-canon.

[warped gust]

What's the canon Issue? 1 in 5 of the Spartan III's of Noble has a missing limb

Weren't the Timmy and Olive helmets Glitches in the War Games

The real life military has "warrior zones" on base for service members to play videogames. I'm sure the WarGames simulation has some stuff that's just for fun

isn't Forge canon?

[empty bloom]

Yep, even had a hiring buzz in-universe as a "Cartographer" program.

[meager pier]

Scale 1-10, how excited are you for Epitaph on Tuesday?

[bronze prawn]

how does space controlled area works in the halo universe

was the galaxy divided like in 4 sides, the covenant, the UNSC, the banished and the rebels. And until almost 29 years of war any of those factions find a halo ?

[empty bloom]

Pretty much the entirity of all factions were involved in a tiny sector of the Orion Arm of the Galaxy.

[dense falcon]

So plasma weapons are better against shields, ballistic weapons are better against unarmored targets. Are shock weapons only special in chain damage and disabling vehicles? Or are they better at dealing a certain type of damage too? What about Hardlight weapons?

[last anchor]

Hardlight is just all around good, it works on armor, shields and vehicles about equally well from what I can tell.
Shock weapons are better against shields and worse against armor, like plasma, but with more balance towards the middle.

[quaint rover]

Can someone explain to me what Chief's canon Mark IV Armor is? We have the version seen in the Fall of Reach animation, the armor seen in Halo Legends and Forward Unto Dawn and the 'canonical' Mark IV worn by Jerome and Red Team in Halo Wars and Halo Wars 2.

[carmine sleet]

There are multiple versions he wore throughout the war

[scarlet hinge]

there wasn't one; they were changing suits all the time in a very fast and iterative R&D process. It was only later in the 2530s that the ONI budgeting teams got annoyed and forced Halsey to start using a standardised "Mark" nomenclature. At that point, everything that already existed was deemed "Mark IV" and she began envisioning Mark V as a truly groundbreaking next generation of suit

for most of the time Chief was using Mark IV, they wouldn't have termed it Mark IV - they just simply knew it as MJOLNIR (or whatever specific project codenames they were using such as the COBALT CV.117 etc)

as such, pretty much all of the Mark IV variations you see in canon media have room to exist and be used by Chief at some point in-universe

[quaint rover]

But it wasn't until Mark V that Chief had one consistent armor through that Mark's lifespan?

[scarlet hinge]

you could say that, but he only used Mark V for a total of like, a month

he got his Mark V suit on August 29, 2552, and got his Mark VI on October 20 of the same year

the first Mark V suits came online in November 2551 with Noble Team recieving the [B] variants made by Ackerson's teams without any involvement from Halsey

but Halsey's "true" envisioning for Mark V wouldn't come around until nearly a year later, and it was outfitted for the Spartan IIs for RED FLAG

one thing to consider about Mark IV is that for most of its lifespan, it wasn't a standardised bit of kit. Each Spartan was getting unique armour essentially hand-crafted to fit them and their needs, and each new model was incorporating new technology demonstrators and testbeds that would go on to feed the next cycle of development

by contrast, pretty much every Mark V suit was the same

Mark V was the end goal of Halsey's MJOLNIR dreams for the longest time, and then that barrier was pushed further and further with VI and VII

the main things that V has that IV didn't, though, are the energy shielding and the capacity to operate a Smart AI

[quaint rover]

So John blew through an entire armor assembly through the events of Reach, Halo CE, the return trip to Reach, and the return to Reach all in like 2 months

[scarlet hinge]

pretty much

you see the arms technician complaining about it at the start of Halo 2

[quaint rover]

Jesus H Christ - no wonder the quartermaster was chastizing Chief, I would've hit him over the head with his helmet for neglegence and abuse of UNSC property

[scarlet hinge]

Your plating was about to fail, there's viscosity throughout the gel layer... Optics - totally fried. And let's not even talk about the power supply. You know how expensive this gear is, son?

that said, it's hardly like he was actively neglecting things

he spent most of that time in near-constant combat with no logistical support

if anything it probably speaks more to Mark V's efficiacy that it got burned through in such a short timeframe

by contrast, the VI platform seems a lot more stable

[quaint rover]

Surprised any of these armors have green paint by the end of it - from the sounds of things they should all look like the underside of a Ford Engine

Bout as well put together at that point too

[scarlet hinge]

by another contrast, Kelly was using her Mark V well into the Onyx campaign

though they seemed to upgrade to their GEN2 gear pretty much as soon as they got rescued, and were in their H5 armour by the time of the Gao Conflict in 2553

(Fred and Linda got their H5 armour shortly after initially returning to Earth)

[quaint rover]

So - aside from Operation First Strike, there was no point in time that Blue Team's core members (John, Fred, Linda, and Kelly) operated together as a unit in their Mark V Armors?

[scarlet hinge]

there is not

closest you get is the Fall of Reach itself, but ofc John/Linda and Kelly/Fred were split up into the ground and space teams

in H2A's terminals, we see Fred & Linda being debriefed on the events of FIRST STRIKE and they're wearing their Centurion/Argus gear respectively - with Fred depicted like that on Onyx in Mythos and then on Gao in Last Light

by contrast, Kelly is depicted as using Mark V on the cover of Ghosts of Onyx, but then in Hermes in the Mythos artwork

and the GoO cover has an unnamed Mark VI Spartan, who was deliberately left vague by 343 and could either be Will or Fred (probably Will, given the above)

[obsidian thistle]

The Will theory reigns supreme

[carmine sleet]

I do really enjoy the Will theory

[reef orbit]

What about halo the fall of reach. When they were tasked with the capture of a covenant ship and prophet

Who here has read the books

[ruby canopy]

I believe the spartan IIs were still in mark 4

As far as I can remember noble team were the only Spartans to wear mark 5 during the fall of reach

[reef orbit]

So you have read the books

??

[ruby canopy]

I have

Long time ago

[reef orbit]

Which one do you think is the most loreful

[ruby canopy]

Not sure how to answer that

[reef orbit]

By loreful I meant important to the story

[dusk jetty]

Fall of reach contains stuff not really said much in the games, I think for a specific game though it would be Rubicon Protocol

[reef orbit]

I'm on ghosts on onyx

[carmine sleet]

That operation never ended up happening because of Reach being attacked by the Covenant. Had that op happened, the S-IIs would have been in Mark V

[ruby canopy]

Most important might be a matter of opinion, but if I were to say which are my favorite, it would be fall of reach, ghosts of onyx, the cole protocol, and contact harvest

And first strike to round out my top 5

I read the first 4 trilogies way long ago, so I think my list is due to nostalgia. Those and halo evolution were the only books I’ve read as well

[terse lava]

Yeah most important would boil down to more so opinions. The closest I'd argue from "lore-useful," for the original trilogy would be Fall of Reach(explains why CE happened) and Ghost of Onyx(shows what happens between 2&3).

[orchid kettle]

I think Contact Harvest is pretty good for laying the foundation for the central conflict that's gonna be featured in most media

[last anchor]

Forerunner Trilogy

[wanton notch]

Something Has Happened is a fun comic if you enjoyed Halo Wars btw

Just re-read through it yesterday

[turbid vigil]

Hey everyone, quick question. Not exactly sure if this is the right place to ask this, but does the 2019 release of halo evolutions include the extra short stories that are present in the 2 volume release?

[obsidian thistle]

No

The stories are still exclusive to the volumes

So now you have to pick between the minor typo corrected 2019 release, or the older and harder to get Volume releases

[turbid vigil]

Harder to get is an understatement

Still, thank you

[bronze prawn]

how did the forerruners had children

[unique rune]

When a mommy Forerunner and a daddy Forerunner love each other very much…

[bronze prawn]

geez

the idea of the didact and the librarian....., is just inimaginable

[tribal trench]

i mean… no offense but how else do you expect lol?

for real though they do go into forerunner breeding practices for a bit in… I want to say Cryptum?

[bronze prawn]

theres plenty of especies in the galaxy

the elites dont have genitals

[tribal trench]

not external ones, no

they are reptiles

they lay eggs and fertilize those separately

[bronze prawn]

see

[tribal trench]

Forerunners are mammals though

[bronze prawn]

therea another way of had children in the inmense galaxy

[runic wharf]

Incubate, not fertilize

[tribal trench]

my bad

[runic wharf]

And reptilian describes them better, given that they are warm-blooded

Amongst several other biological schema that'd distinguish them from Earth-based reptiles

[bronze prawn]

didnt the elite culture allowed the arbitrer to come, make love to your wife or something and you ll have to take care of the children

[runic wharf]

Thel, in particular, could not

Only those who possess the swordmaster suffix could pass on their genes to all females, married or otherwise

[last anchor]

Thel was a fleetmaster

I don't think Rtas was one either was he? He's a Shipmaster (at least he is now)

[empty bloom]

I always thought that was a weird thing.

[sand plover]

halfway through reading Epitaph. It's interesting

[meager pier]

How is it so far?

[reef orbit]

Hey so I just finished reading the fall of reach, the flood, first strike and ghosts of onyx but just to make sure does glasslands in the kilo five trilogy tell how blue team got out of onyx. I've heard people say that but who better to confirm it than the halo discord people.

[reef orbit]

How do you already have epitaph? I have to wait another twelve hours until Amazon delivers it

[last anchor]

Some stores have it out already.
Same thing happened with previous Halo titles.

Basically if a book isn't going to be in rabid demand (which hasnt been a thing since the early 2000s with Harry Potter books in truth) they had no reason not to put them on the shelf early to get them out of the back room so more inventory can be brought in.

The same thing happened with the last two Halo novels to be released and also the Encyclopedia.

[fair hazel]

yes

[obsidian thistle]

There is also publisher/region release drift

Sometimes publishers release stuff later. Happened with a few books where Halo had a different US and UK release

[bronze prawn]

so what happened to james 055

actually die out of starving, is still spining over reach, he capture a covenant cruiser, an allied ship found him

[carmine sleet]

Unknown, most likely dead

[sand plover]

My Indigo/Chapters had them out 2 weeks ago

[sand plover]

im enjoying it. it's good

[empty bloom]

Well, his corpse is certainly still floating around Reach, at any rate.

[ruby canopy]

He’s just alive somewhere in a space cave

[boreal bane]

Halo: Epitaph Spoilers thread - please use this thread until the next of next month
https://discord.com/channels/471722331820130324/1107998816268996628

[runic wharf]

Neither was Rtas, correct

[runic wharf]

It is both weird and sensible with how Sangheili bloodlines and relations are-Women generally are the ones who choose relationships, and because marriages are kept under relative wraps having… Relations with a married individual wouldn’t be necessarily something that would socially stand out

[bronze prawn]

why miranda or captain keyes never took any combat armor if they gonna do some fild combat

instead of kipping their commander uniforms

[empty bloom]

Otherwise you wouldn't know it's them.

Though, in original CE, Keyes was in a BDU uniform after you rescued him. This change did not carry over to CEA.

[carmine sleet]

Kinda wish it did, not gonna lie

Like, if I was stuck on a large ring world, I'd rather be in something meant for survival than a uniform worn on the bridge of a large ship

[bronze prawn]

that commander uniform seems really unconfortable

did johson drive all the way to the control room in halo 3

as we drive it back to the dawn

[carmine sleet]

Yes

But it was much less explodey when be did it

So I just discovered this line where a Skirmisher talks about wanting to find the Sword of the Faithful beam rifle from Halo 5

[empty bloom]

Honestly, officers in Halo always wearing dress uniforms annoys me in sci fi.

[bronze prawn]

look at rtas a ship commander, with cool AF armor to figh in the ground

[empty bloom]

Very common trope, very annoying trope.

With life and death being on a knife's edge

(Glass and vacuum)

Why are you dressed your best, instead of dressed your best-er.

[carmine sleet]

At least Cutter's in HW2 looks like a more practical outfit

[reef orbit]

I just finished reading halo ghosts of onyx and for the first time ever in halo I had a feeling. Of dread come over me. Probably the most depressing book in halo. I find it worse than the whole planet of Reach getting glassed and noble team dying. The way Kurt's sacrifice is described in the book is saddening.

Who agrees with me that ghosts of onyx is the saddest halo book

Also what books should I read before reading epitaph. I just got it

I have epitaph and Cryptum in my forerunner series

[ruby canopy]

It is indeed a damn sad story. And I would probably recommend the forerunner trilogy, but to be honest I’m not even sure what epitaph is all about so I can’t really say

If you liked ghosts of onyx, I would recommend the halo evolutions story headhunters. You can also view that story on YouTube as they made it into a motion comic of sorts

Also, if you want another sad story I recommend halo evolutions the Mona Lisa

[reef orbit]

How fun

[forest ember]

nah bro that’s creepy

[ruby canopy]

I’m referring to Henry. Halo’s greatest character

I don’t want to spoil it, but what happens to that group of marines is pretty damn sad

[bronze prawn]

they got infected by the flood ?

or the classic one that they sacrificed themselves "to prevent the parasite to escape"

[forest ember]

yeah i’ve read it

[ruby canopy]

Didn’t want to spoil it for Saul

[pallid thicket]

I really wanna start seeing humans in the Banished. I can definitely see Insurrectionists joining

Both have a hatred for the UNSC in common

[empty bloom]

Wouldn't make a lot of doctrinal sense for either.

Banished is primarily a Brute-led org, and many innie groups post-war are actually known for being Xenophobic.

[bronze prawn]

just realizes how in the zealot ambush to noble team

carter saves kat by pushing her down avoiding the zealot sword strike

[pallid thicket]

Wouldn’t be the first time Atriox convinced a species out of old prejudices and into the Banished

He convinced most of the Sangheili of Silent Shadow to join even though they were actively hunting down Jiralhanae post-war

[frosty herald]

I could honestly see some innies in the banished if it could mean the UNSC being gone

One challenge would be tho is if the banished are willing to respect their autonomy

[orchid kettle]

We've also gotten confirmation that some Venezian mercenary groups are apparently pal'ing around with the Banished

[quiet hearth]

so i was meaning to ask about the covenant vehicles' names, did the humans learn them through listening in to covenant soldier conversations? did they make the names up themselves? did the humans ask a covenant elite during interrogation?

[unique rune]

They’re made up human names. The Covenant has their own names for them.

[bronze prawn]

why halsey give noble 6 a bottle containing cortana instead of a chip to put in our helmet and help us in combat

to then delivert it to the POA

[quiet hearth]

too logical

[quiet hearth]

eh makes sense

[unique rune]

Mk.V[B] doesn’t have that feature

[bronze prawn]

i mean we hear and got intel from this auntie dot

[unique rune]

Auntie Dot wasn’t housed in Noble Team’s suits

It was communicating with them externally

Full AI integration wasn’t a thing for MJOLNIR until the proper mainline Mk.V model that the Spartan-IIs upgraded to for RED FLAG

[bronze prawn]

wasnt that integrated with shield technology

but noble team has already shield armor

[unique rune]

Mk.V as a whole was when energy shields were made standard, the earlier B model that Noble is outfitted with didn’t have the AI integration

[orchid kettle]

you can kinda see some Covenant/Banished names for vehicles in the recent encyclopedia release

for example, a "Ghost" is known as a scout-bike

or whatever "scout-bike" translates to in their alien language

[torpid sapphire]

Now I'm trying to remember what was the ingame lore reason for red team having shielding in Halo Wars 1. Unless its explained away as a gameplay mechanic like armour endurance or something

[unique rune]

Originally it was just a gameplay mechanic, later retconned as field testing for prototype shielding units.