#lore-and-universe

1 messages · Page 49 of 1

empty bloom
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Kinda, yeah

exotic pulsar
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Thought they were called Brutes due to the way they treat PoW's.

empty bloom
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They're called brutes because of how they, as a society, function on practically every level.

exotic pulsar
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It's called a kratocracy, a type of government were "Might makes right". Meaning whoever is the strongest is the leader.

terse sage
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Versus their more "civilized" Sangheili counterparts

feral perch
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The Elites would have probably been victorious over everyone if not for Admiral Whitcomb's gift.

exotic pulsar
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Ah yes, the NOVA Bomb. A Nuclear ordinance capable of cracking planets.

empty bloom
feral perch
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¯_(ツ)_/¯

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I thought that Grey Team's guilt over what they did to Glyke didn't make much sense, me personally.

orchid kettle
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In my mind, they age and reproduce ( chiefsmirkle ) at the same rate as humans

exotic pulsar
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Actually yeah that brings up a thought. Why did RED FlAG involve capturing Covenant Leadership, when they could have hidden a NOVA Bomb on a Covie ship and send it to High Charity?

orchid kettle
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Like, Escharum is what, 89 and he's clearly an old brute and dying

empty bloom
tropic forge
empty bloom
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And they were trying to avoid making martyrs, conveniently not realizing the Covenant would've been more than happy to make their own martyrs.

orchid kettle
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I'm sure there's a few billion Brutes

exotic pulsar
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They knew enough that it was the Covenant Homeworld right?

orchid kettle
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but I also have to assume that there's several times more Elites

empty bloom
terse sage
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They were looking for the Covenant homeworld, they didn't know what High Charity was

feral perch
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They wanted to deescalate to a ceasefire at least.

empty bloom
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Meanwhile the Covenant leadership would've just martyred their coworkers.

feral perch
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Exactly.

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RED FLAG was doomed to fail.

exotic pulsar
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All of this because the Prophets mistranslated "Reclaimer" as "Reclamation".

orchid kettle
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I honestly think in 343's universe, that scene from Contact Harvest simply did not go down the same way

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but there's just no Contact Harvest reprint

tropic forge
# feral perch RED FLAG was doomed to fail.

The actual operation maybe could've succeeded, we've seen the Spartans do everything they would need to succeed elsewhere. It would not result in a ceasefire or end the war though. Prophets are way too familiar with a power vacuum.

exotic pulsar
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Honestly, it's more funny and ironic that a Grunt was the reason the war started and not a Brute. Which, would have been the obvious choice.

feral perch
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Basically it would mean the Great Journey was a lie if Forerunners were human, and it would undermine the Prophets' authority if humans were heirs to the Forerunners.

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either way, the San'Shyuum lose.

exotic pulsar
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But humans basically ARE the inheritors of all the Forerunners left behind. They basically gave us back the "Mantle of Responsibility".

terse sage
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That's the point

orchid kettle
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yeah, but in Contact Harvest, Mendicant just outright calls humans forerunner

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and then Mercy (or at least, the priest who would become Mercy) repeats this back to Mendicant in astonishment

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and Mendicant doesn't correct him, despite the conversation happening precisely because the AI was getting sick of watching the Covenant get everything wrong

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Its just-- this scene has 100% been changed in some way, and we just don't know how

exotic pulsar
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I don't even think that is all of Mendicant Bias, more like a fragment.

empty bloom
orchid kettle
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We hear in Outcasts as well that Truth told the Covenant at large that the war was happening because humans blew up some Forerunner stuff on Harvest

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which is some pretty new information

exotic pulsar
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We even sure that was true?

orchid kettle
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I mean, no, it's an excuse for the war of annihilation

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Thel just says that was the reason given by Truth

exotic pulsar
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I mean, Truth IS a mass manipulator.

orchid kettle
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but we, the reader, have not heard that excuse before

exotic pulsar
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Though apparently, that is just something built into the core of their race.

dusty ferry
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Yeah, the prophets love betraying people

unique rune
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kinda sus

cloud gale
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Lets be real here, 343 has destroyed the halo canon

runic wharf
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no 🙂

terse sage
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Personally I kinda disagree

runic wharf
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The worst you can pin on 343 is they had the deep misstep of Halo 5

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Which, for all intents, Infinite has corrected + put us back on the Forerunner/Precursor thread started way back in 2012 🙂

exotic pulsar
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IDK, the Prometheans were an interesting concept and at least gave us a fresh second enemy to fight. Just wish they were implemented better. By the time of Halo 3 at least to me the Flood felt less like a real threat and more of an annoyance.

gusty star
unique rune
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but what about the Halo cannon

runic wharf
dusk jetty
terse lava
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@orchid kettle The idea of Humans destroying a Forerunner reliquary on Harvest isn't new though. Thel mentions it in Cole Protocol, in his meeting with Regret. The ide

dusk jetty
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I thought they said the humans destroyed the “trove” of artifacts on harvest?

empty bloom
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Like, Cortana's rationale for her actions at least makes sense

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If you actually give a crap about her character and pay attention to what the game is pretty much screaming in your face, it even ties into the better parts of 4.

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(Such as establishing that the Mantle of Responsibility is an utterly abhorrent imperial piece)

runic wharf
empty bloom
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Which is a hell of a reach.

buoyant grail
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hola all

empty bloom
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As I said

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I don't hate all of 4's story.

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But the parts involving the Librarian, specifically? Vehement dislike.

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It just so happens to also be the most important part of the story that isn't a foregone conclusion (IE, Chief winning because he's the protag)

runic wharf
empty bloom
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It is very transparently so.

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We've had pretty lengthy discussions about it here, actually.

runic wharf
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I imagine so, I just view it in a similar nature to how Ringworld having luck be an ‘inheritable’ trait

empty bloom
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I mean the Spartan II program in general is pretty icky in terms of eugenicism.

runic wharf
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Yeah

empty bloom
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Halo 4 just kinda... Goes harder into that.

exotic pulsar
empty bloom
runic wharf
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I more just view it as being a non-factual thing ‘genetics’ wise because it often is treated such in universe, because like with IRL eugenics pseudoscience underlies much of it

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The ‘real’ aspect to it being the Geas pushing human development in a similar way to Mend. Bias for Covenant

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It is part of the story, but is it justified as being real in universe? I don’t think so

empty bloom
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¯_(ツ)_/¯

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That's fair, I suppose.

runic wharf
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Not trying to say your pov is bad

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Its 100% valid, especially w/ modern political context for RL stuff

empty bloom
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If I had a nickel for every time a big Xbox exclusive shooter franchise had weird material about eugenicism, I'd have two nickels.

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Which isn't a lot, but it's weird that it happened twice.

exotic pulsar
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Leonardo Decaprio whistle and point meme.

runic wharf
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A rather different thing I’d point to that is often viewed as ‘overdone’ is K5’s presentation of Sangheili as ‘incapable’ of building granaries and such, when the keep you are allowed access to by the narrative is one thats really out by the wayside and, clearly, reliant on Unggoy slave labor

exotic pulsar
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Look, we can all agree turning kids into super soldiers is messed up. Not arguing that.

runic wharf
runic wharf
empty bloom
runic wharf
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Oh

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Lmao, Never played

empty bloom
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Honestly

runic wharf
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Makes sense tho

empty bloom
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I think it has a disgustingly better story than Halo.

exotic pulsar
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Eh....

empty bloom
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But ironically, has a fanbase that cares far less about it.

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It's very consistent and a lot of the elements are both interconnected and consistent.

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It doesn't have the shakey foundation Bungie Halo established, which is a significant boon.

exotic pulsar
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The Locust Horde are basically genetically engineered monsters that were made in an attempt I think to make the Serans immune to Immoltion. Which was a fuel source that they mined for.

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The Serans, AKA Humanity, were fighting each other before the Locust even where a thing.

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What's weird though is that almot every man in that series is buff like a bodybuilder.

empty bloom
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The majority apparently do not.

exotic pulsar
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TBH though most of the men being built like bodybuilders is weird and they all stand pretty tall. Either the world of Sera has always been a savage place making them evolve like that or there is some form of genetic tampering.

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Though I wouldn't call the soldiers of the COG "Super Soldiers".

empty bloom
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IIRC it has high gravity or somesuch.

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Either way they're not human in the same way, as Sera isn't Earth.

exotic pulsar
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If Sera had high gravity it would also effect their height. Serans would be naturally more shorter but it seems every male stands above five feet easy.

empty bloom
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Not real High Gravity

exotic pulsar
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For as primitive as they are Brute weapons are rather lethal. I don't think anyone wants to get shot by a metal spike that has the ability to pin you to a wall.

last anchor
last anchor
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Also Sera's just...weird.

fair hazel
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I enjoyoed the librarian in halo 4

carmine sleet
uneven maple
wicked wasp
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Anybody else ever see the pelican controls in the cockpit? Stuff looks crazy

terse sage
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Do we know what happened to the rest of Gamma Company that wasn't on Onyx?

carmine sleet
meager pier
stoic hamlet
# terse sage Do we know what happened to the rest of Gamma Company that wasn't on Onyx?

Retained by ONI for special operations.

But it’s hard to say fully, because there were around 4 different placements for them.

Kilo-5 stated they were all retired.

Last Light stated they were all being retained by ONI.

The Field Guide stated they were placed on reserve status, but remained in the military as part of Spartan Branch.

And the Encyclopedia implies they’re still with ONI black ops.

I’d argue the Encyclopedia is the most likely fate, makes the nose sense and suits their background and history.

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We really just don’t know though, because 343 seem to want to leave them by the wayside.

terse sage
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Could it be possible that they simply integrated into the Spartan 4 program?

stoic hamlet
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They would be part of Spartan Branch, not the IV’s.

But that’s unlikely, as Last Light mentions they presented a significant PR risk due to their additional augmentations.

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Which is why ONI retained them in the first place.

terse sage
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Is the existence of the IIIs still classified?

stoic hamlet
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To an extent.

The Field Manual somewhat declassified them, and Outpost Discovery did mention them, off-handedly.

Essentially their operations are known about, but they themselves aren’t.

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But yeah, until we get an author or something willing to write about them, we won’t have any indication at all. And that assumes 343 wants someone to write about them.

terse sage
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They've moved on to the 4s

dusk jetty
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343 still has a couple individual spartan 3’s that appear in some novels. But as a whole, we haven’t heard anything about gamma company and such

stoic hamlet
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Yeah. It does make sense. The III’s really need a dedicated author, I think. Akin to Denning with Blue Team or Gay with Rion Forge/the Forerunner stuff.

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If I were ever hired on as an author, in my pipe dream fantasies, that’s what I’d like to do, heh.

exotic pulsar
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Honestly the additional augments that gamma got would make them a liability outside of a battlefield.

wicked wasp
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Like how the throttle is on the right

last anchor
stoic hamlet
orchid kettle
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who, in their eyes, would just be More Spartans

stoic hamlet
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That’s how it’s presented, essentially, yeah.

orchid kettle
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Still kinda wild to me how conservative extended media has been about the CAT-IIs

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especially when 343 is willing to say that Spartan-IIs originally thought to have been killed during the augmentation procedure are actually just in Halsey's freezer, waiting to be fixed

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since surely the concept of CAT-IIs already gives you an avenue of making up new Spartan characters in MJOLNIR who can fight aliens

stoic hamlet
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343 have always been very conservative about listing hard numbers with Spartans. It “limits stories” as they say.

orchid kettle
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Well, I just meant that it's strange how few appearances CAT-IIs make in extended media

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There's just like, what, Owen, Hazel, and the guy from one of the Fractures stories?

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Maybe it's because in the mind of the writers, CAT-IIs are too uncomplicated. They weren't ripped from their families by the UNSC, there's no clone of themselves they could run into. They don't go crazy after a couple days without their favorite smoothie.

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And they're not doomed to die suicide soldiers like their normal III counterparts.

stoic hamlet
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Possibly. I think it’s more the case that 343 just doesn’t know what to do with them. They don’t really seem to like the III’s in general.

They don’t dislike them.

But they don’t like them, either.

exotic pulsar
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Well that is because they were pulled out of the group as those specific spartan 3's were to valuable to waste on a suicide mission. If there was any 3's left most of them would be special fireteams if not part of the Spartan Branch.

stoic hamlet
orchid kettle
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I'll always complain about how there's just 300 Gammas MIA in the post-war era, but you could also argue that at least Saber gets to be major characters in several novels

stoic hamlet
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It’s kind of fitting, in a sad sort of way.

They’ve been forgotten, almost.

Even out of universe, the III’s are ignored and unknown.

orchid kettle
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Well, except for when they're hosting Outpost Discovery

stoic hamlet
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Heh, yeah.

orchid kettle
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Or teaching high schoolers karate

exotic pulsar
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Ah yes, the two Spartan 3's in Mark V B just standing there to look pretty.

orchid kettle
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I like Legacy of Onyx, as cheesy as it is, but it did feel a lil silly that the main character had self-defense classes with Lucy after school

stoic hamlet
exotic pulsar
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Speaking of, that Flood Infection Form. Is that form confirmed dead or is it under some form of stasis? Or is it just some form of realistic hologram?

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As if it's under stasis OD is just one Innie Bombing away from making it a way WORSE problem.

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I thought ONI was trying to be hush hush about The Flood, then you got Outpost Discovery having a flood infection form as part of the exibit.

last anchor
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Personally, I dont know why the lore went with that considering "dead" is a VERY loose term applied to the Flood considering its virulance.

stoic hamlet
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IIRC didn’t they retcon it to being a fake mock up?

last anchor
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Ive said it before and I'll say it again; all they had to do to make it work was have giant warning stickers all over the case reading "WARNING; HAVOK TACTICAL NUCLEAR DEVICE ARMED AND ACTIVE. DO NOT TAP ON THE GLASS"

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Not that Im aware of.

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If they did, it wasnt mentioned very loudly

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But, in truth, OD was intended to reach as wide an audience as possible, so they HAD to have the Flood in there somewhere so all the OGs who remember the Library could go "oh hey its an infection form, I remember that" and have a good time with their kids.

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Cause a lot of the photos I saw were of older dudes and their families rather than diehard fans (though Im sure there were plenty of those there too)

exotic pulsar
last anchor
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Presumably its paired down to be something thats only on Halo rings and they DONT mention the bit about the loss of Voi.

stoic hamlet
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A lot of the super die hard fans/Halo lore peeps got in early, IIRC.

There was a sort of “viewing party” that got in a day early on 343 approval.

last anchor
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Unless they changed THAT too.

last anchor
stoic hamlet
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Haruspis was part of that as well, I think? Back when he was just one of us, lol.

exotic pulsar
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Yeah it's most likely they don't mention what happened to Voi.

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Or the Mona Lisa.

stoic hamlet
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The Mona Lisa was classified regardless.

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Voi has more of a chance of being known about, to some extent.

exotic pulsar
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Yeah if those on the Waypoint managed to get camera feeds of Voi during the infection.

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Though I imagine ONI has the perfect cover up as to why a Covenant ship glassed half of Africa.

last anchor
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Thats...basically what the story was.

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The UNSC took out the AA guns there and in retaliation, the Covenant glassed the area to try and burn out the "filth" that did so.

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Similar to how they covered up what happened to New Pheonix

exotic pulsar
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Ah right, when everyone there got digitized by the composer.

terse sage
stoic hamlet
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….i’m keeping it, lol.

silk marten
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UNSC Pillar of Autumn vs Imperial 1 Star Destroyer

exotic pulsar
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Going to have to give it to the Star Destroyer. Shields on top of Turbo Lasers that are basically rapid firing plasma bolts. That, and the compliment of thirty six tie fighters.

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Also unlike the Covenant, the Empire has access to Ion Weaponry, which the Star Destroyer has four cannons each left and right. Ion Weaponry are known to disable ships.

unique rune
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The winner is whichever the writer of the scenario wants

terse sage
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Would the refitted Pillar of Autumn be better than a Marathon class cruiser?

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Being able to fire the MAC gun three times before recharging is a pretty big advantage

empty bloom
empty bloom
exotic pulsar
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XX-9 heavy turbolaser batteries (60)
NK-7 ion cannons (60)
Dual heavy turbolaser turrets (6)
Dual heavy ion cannon turrets (2)
Quad heavy turbolasers (2)
Triple medium turbolasers (3)
Medium turbolasers (4)
Q7 tractor beam projectors (10)

These weapons can rapid fire plasma by the way.

TIE line starfighters (72),
TIE/ln space superiority starfighters (48)
TIE/sa bombers (12)
TIE/IN interceptors (12)

runic wharf
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It is one of the reinforced Halc class

dusk jetty
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I’m fairly certain imperial-II has more fighters

exotic pulsar
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Imperial I, II has a bigger armament.

dusk jetty
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That’s what i thought.

dusty ferry
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Depends on how wxaggerated the Star Destroyer is

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Different sources give way different answers as to how effective any of those ships are

last anchor
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(Laugjs in Halcyon CIWS barrage)
Never underestimate the power of THE HOLY WALL OF FLAK

last anchor
cloud gale
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they still never offered an explanation for why the elites were no longer allied with you in halo 4

cloud gale
cloud gale
ruby canopy
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And that’s supposed to be its own little mystery in the campaign. As Chief asked Cortana in the first mission he thought they had a truce with the elites, and Cortana says a lot can happen in 4 years

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Leaves the player wondering what happened since. And it turned out to be a separate faction of elites

dusty ferry
stoic hamlet
dusty ferry
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would chief have known that though?

stoic hamlet
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About Xytan’s group? No.

But the idea of “fighting the covenant” isn’t one that should surprise him anyways. He studied military and political history. Empires as old as the Covenant don’t just disappear. If anything, the line makes more sense to be said by the rampant Cortana.

empty bloom
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He's basically the most influential example of the Swords of Sanghelios being far from the only influence on the Sangheili post-schism.

orchid kettle
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Voro is pretty angri about humans though, and its agreed that the Elites need to recover the artifacts on Onyx

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They're not suddenly humanity's best friends the nanosecond they're betrayed, even Thel is still distrustful of Chief after being betrayed by Tartar sauce and the Prophets

carmine sleet
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Only reason Arby was even willing to ally himself with Johnson during the last mission of Halo 2 was because he was desperate to stop Tartar

orchid kettle
carmine sleet
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Hearing the truth from Spark was the last thing he needed to hear before truly turning on the Covenant

orchid kettle
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While Voro and Xytan just know the Brutes are acting up

carmine sleet
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Indeed

orchid kettle
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Its honestly kinda wrong to claim that Xytan would have stayed the course had he survived Ghosts of Onyx, as Thel was hanging out with Guilty Spark by the end of 2

carmine sleet
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I imagine Xytan would've wanted to hear what Spark had said personally and asked him plenty of questions

terse sage
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What is the Banished view on the Great Journey?

carmine sleet
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Varies between Banished legion/clan. The Keepers still believed in it when they were part of the Banished for example

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But it's not the main goal of the overall Banished

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Like, Atriox doesn't believe in it

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Same with Escharum

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And I would assume Jega but we don't exactly know much about him and his beliefs

terse sage
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Is he even dead? We don't see his body, he just disappears

orchid kettle
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Castor is positioned as a bit of a weirdo in the Banished for still believing in the Great Journey, while his group are only really in the Banished at all because all Jiralhanae clans are kinda being strongarmed into joining

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His beliefs are just kinda tolerated, and he betrays them the first chance he gets anyway

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Being an Atriox worshipper is just kinda incompatible with believing in the Great Journey, since that's firmly something from the Prophets' Covenant, and Atriox's legend is all about how cool he was because he actively defied them.

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Itd be like an orthodox catholic being really into a guy who's whole deal is that he hated the Pope and bullied him back in high school

terse sage
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Yeah that would be weird

gusty star
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I believe Decimus also secretly still revered the Forerunners as Gods, but he did not make that known

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Hard for a lot of people to just abandon decades of indoctrination

empty bloom
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Jul himself had some serious religious doubts, but used religious trappings to cement his power base.

exotic pulsar
runic wharf
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he survived worse

empty bloom
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Jul was a third rate warrior who specced into things a face character should be doing

exotic pulsar
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If only we got an extra season of Spartan Ops that could have linked to the start of Halo 5 then things may have been clearer.

stiff trail
#

Skimming Wikipedia and I found
Basilides (Greek: Βασιλείδης) was an early Christian Gnostic religious teacher in Alexandria, Egypt[1] who taught from 117 to 138 AD

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Bungie and their mythological references

terse sage
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Tartarus being another example

exotic pulsar
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Bungie has always had mythological refrences. So many sevens.

exotic pulsar
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Do We even know how big the Covenant was at the height of their power?

empty bloom
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big

fair hazel
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I missed some star wars and halo discussion?

fair hazel
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Star wars ships aren't that strong or have that amazing firepower AND especially they don't have good range

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There's a severe lack of good older book style space battles in newer novels

scarlet hinge
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Eric Trautmann did, in reference to a Biblical passage - 1:17, the Revelation of St. John

uneven maple
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So was that why they came up with John 117?

lost yoke
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So sargeant Forge is a Spartan 1.1 or not?

orchid kettle
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being a Spartan 1.1 apparently also means ONI was slipping some special meds into your apple juice since you were a baby

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and its not strictly about getting superpowers because Johnson was your daddy

exotic pulsar
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Which it wouldn't. With the amount of turbo laser turrets it has and the fact that it also has Ion cannons would mean the PoA would be disabled just from the ion weaponry alone as it disables electronics.

meager pier
last anchor
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I am curious as to what would happen if the bridge of the ISD was struck with a triple-mac strike.

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Again, shields dont stop motion, we see that in Empire when they do a hand-brake turn and the entire command crew goes flying sideways.

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Slamming three tungeston slugs is going to make the entire bridge ring like a bell and probably kill most of the command/control crew.

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And Im fairly certain the range on a MAC is far more than a turbolaser (considering how wide the spray is whenever we see them in use at anything other than knifefight range)

fair hazel
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The star wars ships also are close range and not really long range. Especially confirmed by the last jedi

last anchor
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The Supremecy literally chasing the Rebellion like a dude tailgating.
God that was SO STUPID

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Im pretty sure the Battle of Sigma Octanus IV happened at longer range than that distance.

fair hazel
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Very much longer ranges and speeds

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You have ships going around planets, different accelerations going on, its interesting

last anchor
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The Keyes Loop goes WHEEEEE

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And also the Battle of Psi Serpentus.
Actually, Psi Serpentus is bigger than any on-screen Star Wars battle except the one in Rise of Skywalker isnt it?

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Everything else is a handful of ships (most often not even of equal tonnage).

stoic hamlet
orchid kettle
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🥺

last anchor
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1: Battle of Naboo (snub fighters vs one large command ship)
2: No on screen space battle
3: Battle of Courscant (knife fight range, again, though with reason, but still fairly close for such an important battle)
4: Battle of Yavin (snub fighters vs giant space station)
5: Chase in the Hoth Asteroid Field (one YT-1300 vs Death Squadron, which was only like...12 ISDs and the Executor? Not a big fleet really)
6: Battle of Endor (still knife fight, again)
7: More snubfighters
8: No real space battle, just...the Supremecy (BLECH)
9: Battle of Exogol (I refuse to acknowlage that was a space batte. That was not a space battle)

last anchor
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In Legends its enormous, tot he point where the systems sun was blocked out by the number of ships in orbit.
In canon, its smaller but the numbers aren't fully listed that I remember. They fluctuate as need be.

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(As do a lot of things in Star Wars...)

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Last I remember, Coruscant was three Republic Fleets (~85 vessels of varrying tonnage) against ~100 CIS vessels.

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Psi Serpentus was...hang on.

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Okay, Im not finding exact numbers but we can assume the three to one ratio put out by Denning...something like 400 UNSC vessels.
And the Covenant rolled in over 450

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Oh also I completely forgot
The Autumn had a nuke-bearing remote controlled longsword fighter.

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And ISD point defense is, at best, massively weak, and in some cases non-existant

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To the point that, after getting smacked around in Legends for a few battles, the Empire commisioned an ENTIRE ANTI AIR FRIGATE

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The Lancer

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Literally just a BOX WITH GUNS

exotic pulsar
last anchor
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Not on screen there hasnt been.

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And if theres some in the books, I dont remember em.
But I stopped reading most after the Retconomicon so.

orchid kettle
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Wasn't the three to one ratio first mentioned by Nylund

last anchor
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Considering Impossible Life was also written by him

orchid kettle
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and it more so meant like, the first two ships are gonna die taking the alien one out

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so you should bring a third lol

exotic pulsar
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Uh, yeah there has. Not every Star Wars space battle is broadside on broadside fighting.

last anchor
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23 Covenant vessels for ~a third of the UNSC fleet in Pegasi Delta.

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The fall of Reach in its whole (a heavy cruiser sniping an entire ship from ranges that make my eyes water)

last anchor
#

Cause absolutely every one I remember is either "recreation of Midway" with starfighters, or knife fights at spitting distance

orchid kettle
#

I always liked the idea that Truth couldn't let slip just how important the war of annihilation truly was for the Covenant

#

and that's why the Covenant got outnumbered sometimes in space battles at all

last anchor
#

Theres lore for that Im pretty sure.

orchid kettle
#

when surely their full might would dwarf anything humanity had

last anchor
#

Also, the Covenant was never intended for Total War anyway

orchid kettle
#

aka-- the fleet from First Strike

last anchor
#

Unyeilding Heirophant is a weird one.

#

I need to go break the encyclopedia out, I SWEAR there was mentions about how military matters were secondary to the Covenant.

orchid kettle
#

when you think about it, Whitcomb is kinda the MVP

last anchor
#

It was a religious theocracy first, military second.

exotic pulsar
#

Battle of Endor had ships engaging other ships from ranges far beyond shown in The Last Jedi. There has also been PLENTY of space battles shown in the Clone Wars 3D Series were they are slinging plasma at each other from far range.

last anchor
#

Yall have a nice day in hell
SUN

orchid kettle
#

dude protected Earth from the largest Covenant fleet ever seen at that point

last anchor
#

(Stupid, freaking...wheres that napkin with the Keyes Loop on it...)

#

Actually wheres the reference to the battle of Sigma Octanus, the one where the Cradle ate those shots for the battlegroup

exotic pulsar
#

The battle in corusant would be considered knife fight range as there is a scene of two ships literally broadsiding each other a hundred yards away. They could see inside of the other ship.

last anchor
#

Any combat where you can aim your guns using the naked eye and not have to rely on computers and Smart AI to do the targeting for you is knife fight range

#

They came out of hyperspace and the star destroyers are RIGHT THERE

#

Mind you, a lot of this is the result of, well.
Star Wars ships operating like WWII battleships.
The deck guns have DUDES in them. Everythings done by hand.

exotic pulsar
#

Not really? When they had to turn around due to the shield Death Squadron was a good distance away from the Rebel Fleet. They did get in closer to engage but not up thier nose close.

last anchor
#

(Okay that was weird...whatever)

Let me find the official desginations.
But they're still well within what the UNSC would consider knife-fight range.
MACs have effective striking distances in the millions of kilometers, so.

exotic pulsar
#

Yeah, because they are giant gauss rifles/rain guns.

#

The only thing close to the MAC gun Star Wars has is the main cannon from the Eclipse, and that could take out capitol ships like Star Desroyers in a single shot.

last anchor
#

And had to be mounted on something that big to make it work.
Gauss tech stays WINNING

exotic pulsar
#

IDK how considering shields on Covenant ships could block MAC rounds. Didn't it take like multiple MAC rounds to even kill a Covenant ship?

#

Not even sure if any of the Death Stars would pose a threat despite the insane amount of turbolasers on each one and the 2nd could target ships.

last anchor
#

Covenant shields hold up harder than Star Wars ones do. Massively so.

#

Only thing that could consistently one-shot them was an ODP

#

Also the Death Star is a hilariously large all metal structure. Durasteel may be tough, but when Covenant vessels can burn planets...

#

(UNSC continues to stay winning on that; what it took the Empire a moon sized planet to do, they did with a car sized bomb)

exotic pulsar
#

What makes Covenant Shielding different from the Shielding of Star Wars? Both shields can stop both energy and kinetic weapons in thier tracks.

#

The only reason that Slugthrowers are so rare in SW is because everyone is using blaster technology. Just because it's now an exotic weapon doesn't mean no one has any defences against kinetic weaponry.

last anchor
#

Covenant shields are made using reverse-engineered Forerunner tech (probably hardlight if I had to guess)
Star Wars shielding is more of a cohesive energy field and, unless they changed it, most starships needed two individual kinds.
Ray and particle shielding.
Ray shielding stops energy weaponry and is MASSIVELY power thirsty to the point it was only ever turned on during combvat.
Particle shields stayed on all the time and were the reason micrometerorites didnt kill the crew half the time.

Covenant shields are all in one and seemingly require very little power to run (or the ships have internal reserve reactors, but then, the core of most Covenant vessels is a mighty pinch fusion reactor more powerful even than the solar annhilation one that ran Star Destroyers)

#

They're more efficent and as far as we can tell, stronger.

#

(Actually come to think of it Im pretty sure that ion blasts would just hammer a Covenant shield and dissapate)

runic wharf
dusk jetty
# exotic pulsar The battle in corusant would be considered knife fight range as there is a scene...

The battle of coroscuant was a complete mess, for lack of a better term. The seppies were well organized at first, but as more republic ships came back from the outer rim, everything got more and more spread out until it was just chaos. Lots of friendly fire, civilian casualties were in the millions, if not billions. The coroscuant guard and first responders present did a great job (you see the firefighters in ep3 and there’s some canon details in labyrinth of evil, despite the book itself not being canon.) the amount of debris was so bad that they had to move it all to another side of the planet just to open hyper lanes back up.

#

And even then damage wasn’t fully repaired until about 6BBY

last anchor
#

Tbf any battle on or near Coruscant is going to be messy, the entire planets a massive city

#

It'd be like having a naval battle over Chicago

#

Or Detroit

dusk jetty
#

With a population over a trillion

#

It’s impossible to not kill somebody innocent

maiden berry
last anchor
#

Miss me with living there, I thought 40k hive city's were bad...

last anchor
dusk jetty
#

The surface ain’t so bad. Most of the problems with population come from the undercity

#

We need to see more of the undercity tbh

#

Lots of room for stories and such

last anchor
#

RIP 1313

dusk jetty
#

If I could revive any project, that would’ve been the one.

terse sage
#

Is the 2003 clone wars' depiction of the battle still canon?

last anchor
#

I don't believe it is sadly

terse sage
#

I really liked how it portrayed the chaos on the ground

fair hazel
exotic pulsar
#

Not even five seconds into this battle and the venators are already shooting their turbo lasers from at a distance that is beyond close range.

#

10:42 of this vid CIS are firing at long range as well.

#

So yeah, capitol ships can shoot and hit something from extreme range, even the old ones from the Clone Wars. The Supremacy lacked range with it's main weapons because the plot demanded it.

versed helm
#

Anyone know why Emile is referred to as "A239" but Chief is "S117" and all of the other Spartans are referred to as Sierra just as the chief is? Why isnt Emile S239?

exotic pulsar
runic wharf
#

Spartan 3s are referred to by their Company letter

#

damn, beaten 😆

exotic pulsar
#

So Emile is the 239th Spartan 3 of Alpha Company.

versed helm
#

Ahh OK Ty Bois 🫡

exotic pulsar
#

John is called John-117 because he was the 117th canidate for the Spartan 2 program.

exotic pulsar
#

We may make fun of the modern military having something like the Warthog, but we can't resist the appeal of having an alien eat bumper of a armed offroad jeep going seventy eight miles an hour.

terse sage
#

Do we know if Kat and Noble 6 knew each other before Reach? They were both in Beta company

stoic hamlet
#

They might have known of each other.

terse sage
#

I thought there were 300 per class

stoic hamlet
#

No, they augmented over 300 per class.

300 was the minimum number they could augment.

#

Alpha had 497 total candidates.

Beta had 418.

Gamma 330.

terse sage
#

Huh, didn't know that

#

Ghosts of Onyx implied that there were 300 per class then Gamma was upped to 330

stoic hamlet
#

PROMETHEUS is “iffy” but there’s enough evidence that the 300 number is also correct.

Unless they rewrite Ghosts of Onyx to account for it, 300 Alpha’s were sent in to K7-49, no exceptions.

orchid kettle
#

I thought Beta was 375

#

oh, Nylund says both numbers in Ghosts of Onyx

#

he must have written chapter 8 and 9 pretty far apart from each other, because in chapter 8, which is where Kurt uses the 375 number, he assures Ackerson that even though its not the 1,000 he was looking for, he was confident they could graduate a higher percentage than Alpha

#

but then immediately in Chapter 9, we're told there's 418, and only 300 slots.

#

yeah, chapter 8 is also where Nylund refers to SPI as "PR suits"

#

so i guess it was just a remnant of an earlier draft and it didn't really get updated

fair hazel
stoic hamlet
#

Though the two terms could work together easily enough.

last anchor
#

PR leggings go under the SPI, maybe?

#

Its part of a layered optical camoflague system.

#

"PR" presumably just means Photo Reactive, which isnt explicitly a part of the SPI itself (its a feature but not intregal presumably)

carmine sleet
#

I just woke up and saw PR leggings and went "Why do Spartans need special leggings for public relations?"

runic wharf
carmine sleet
#

Likely doesn't help that I am recovering from some bad emotional trauma but this isn't the place to delve into that

runic wharf
exotic pulsar
# fair hazel That is pretty close actually...

I would not call the scene at ten minutes and forty three seconds “close”. Those venators are being engaged by CIS ships at pretty long range. These are ranges were you would need a targeting computer.

terse sage
#

I wish we could've gotten a mission or something showing the Battle of the Mortal Reverie, it seems like an interesting setpiece

meager pier
terse sage
#

Is there any real consistency in the size of spartan fireteams? Most of the ones we see are 4, but groups like Majestic are 5

surreal glen
#

I don't really know the specifications behind naming something as a squad, a team, a fireteam or whatever else
I would guess 3 is a squad, 4 is a fireteam and more than 4 is a team

stoic hamlet
terse sage
#

But Majestic is also labeled as a fireteam

stoic hamlet
#

It’s whatever’s needed for the mission.

empty bloom
#

For example, there's a 6 man fireteam in Spartan Ops that dies to a Pelican crash.

stoic hamlet
#

Blue team, for example, has been as few as 3 members, and as large as 10.

Red Team has been as few as 2 members, but as large as 22.

terse sage
#

I thought the 4s were assigned to more permanent fireteams

surreal glen
#

The names of the teams is also weird for me, especially with the ones that are named after a color
Like, Red Team members as seen in Halo Wars wear green armors with red stripes, Blue Team each one has its own color, but for the case of Black Team they all have black armors

stoic hamlet
#

They change as well. Apollo for example constantly rotates.

Eklund was part of Crimson but then reassigned. Etc.

stoic hamlet
terse sage
#

Rubicon Protocol implies that Shadow was together for a long time

stoic hamlet
#

Shadow are an outlier. Explicitly one of the teams there during the 2550 trials.

dusk jetty
#

There are couple teams on zeta that have been around since post 2552 iirc

#

Most are new though

terse sage
#

Idk why I noticed this but the majority of the spartans we hear in Infinite's audio logs have what I think is a russian accent

orchid kettle
#

gotta have the right amount of peeps for team slayer, after all

orchid kettle
#

5 members competed against Majestic in a war games sim, as seen in the Infinity Briefing packet, and all five members are named

#

but then in spartan ops proper, suddenly there's a new guy in the leader slot, and he's the only one named

#

so you could argue that Castle has had six members in its lifetime, but its not really confirmed that its had six at one time

#

Similar to how Majestic will later lose DeMarco but gain Ray, perhaps

stoic hamlet
#

As noted by Rosenda in Winter Contention:

Spartans weren’t ones for emotional or prolonged goodbyes. This was their reality—the next battle, the next directive, the next change in operational priority. Squad mates died and had to be replaced. Certain skillsets called for redeployment, whether as a fine scalpel or a blunt instrument.

terse sage
orchid kettle
#

Yes

#

he gets booted off of Majestic so Thorne can lead instead, and then dies sacrificing himself

terse sage
#

Dang

fair hazel
#

Some teams can last longer than others, it depends really.

orchid kettle
#

its all about the whims of the author

terse sage
#

Is it weird to kinda make my own fireteam characters

fair hazel
#

Blue team red team, their rosters can vary. They tended to have some recuring memebers but the colour names are just the team names

#

A lot of people do that

orchid kettle
#

nah, I think 343 is pretty aware of the appeal of making spartan ocs

#

i dare say the IVs partially exist to feed into that

terse sage
#

I call them Fireteam Hurricane, even made armor for them all in Infinite

empty bloom
#

It's only cringe if you write cringe.

orchid kettle
#

after all, its YOU, and your friends, as Fireteam Crimson

#

the super cool and bestest spartan team ever

fair hazel
orchid kettle
#

(except one of you is a hot blonde lady)

#

(i will let you decide who)

terse sage
#

I know exactly which of my friends would get unanimously voted into being that one

empty bloom
#

Spartan "Alpha Chad McCooldude", a 46 year old Spartan IIIG who got promoted to Spartan by dropping the mandibles of a killed elite on his ODST Officer's desk while suffering from madness, is cringe.

#

For example.

terse sage
#

My Fireteam's names are Gordon, Wyatt, Garza, and Rivera

orchid kettle
terse sage
orchid kettle
#

i like rakshasa

#

its a trash bag

#

and i think that's neat

terse sage
#

There are 2 types of Rakshasa users

fair hazel
#

Rakshasa is great for a lot of fits

terse sage
#

The ones who are chill and wear it cause it looks cool, and the edgy people who take themselves way too seriously

orchid kettle
#

It honestly just feels better suited for the IVs than anything else, given how many of their augs seem tailor made towards making the ultimate soldier for operating behind enemy lines for extended periods of time

terse sage
#

Yeah I wear it too btw

orchid kettle
#

Buck's boasts about how he could eat anything and his stomach would digest it, how they apparently only need a couple hours of shut eye every two days

#

Palmer's baffling claim in Initiation that she can breathe methane for an hour

#

which I think fans have taken to mean that she can survive in a methane heavy atmosphere for an hour

terse sage
orchid kettle
#

Rubicon Protocol kinda paints this image of regular MJOLNIR as like this high-spec sports car that needs frequent pit stops to remain in fighting shape

#

while Rak is just a trash bag, and thus, very easy to maintain without an entourage of specialized technicians

#

and its somehow still MJOLNIR too, so I assume it features most of the stuff youd expect a supersuit in Halo to have

terse sage
#

The spartans on Infinity probably operated much differently than the Rak users, relying on a more steady source of repairs and upkeep

orchid kettle
#

Yeah, that seems to be the idea

#

Its the Spartan Mothership

terse sage
#

How many spartans were on it?

empty bloom
#

They still did manage to hold that MJOLNIR in mostly functional condition for longer than any other time.

orchid kettle
#

300

#

or at least, 300 Brokkr armor assembly thingies

empty bloom
#

Personally

#

I think that it was understrength on Spartans by Zeta

#

it'd fit the already understrength crew

fair hazel
#

There's a rakshasa chest that has MJOLNIR armour repair thing

terse sage
#

We know there were a decent amount still based on Rubicon

orchid kettle
#

GEN3 may contain active camo by default as well

empty bloom
#

299 Spartans is still understrength, so.

orchid kettle
#

because multiple characters talk about it

fair hazel
#

Class-IV Techkit. Parts and tools for MJOLNIR maintenance in asutere conditions

#

Even despite maintenance needed the Spartans were able to operate with their MJOLNIR for months

orchid kettle
#

Two of the IVs in Rubicon use it to check up on Lucas, Blue Team has it in Shadows of Reach, and another IV in Rubicon mentions how his AC module got busted up

#

which i guess is why Chief can turn invisible in Infinite when he unlocks the thruster upgrades

fair hazel
#

Gameplay wise, we use it with upgraded thrusters

orchid kettle
#

he just decides to turn it on

fair hazel
#

Beat me

orchid kettle
#

maybe it's still on the fritz and only works in short spurts

terse sage
#

Do we ever find out what happened to Horvath?

orchid kettle
#

like Arby in Halo 2

fair hazel
#

It could be that it was slightly damaged and ore the parts he finds helped in its repair? or something

terse sage
#

I'm also curious about Vettel's fate

fair hazel
#

Wish it could be more useful in gameplay though...

terse sage
#

Because he was planning on rescuing Griffin, but clearly he either didn't try yet or failed

fair hazel
#

If John had woken up a bit earlier, more spartans would have lived

orchid kettle
#

I do kinda wonder if Rak retains the AC module

stoic hamlet
#

Regarding Spartan numbers, we know they deployed 120 IV’s to reach during operation WOLFE.

orchid kettle
#

I dunno, surely the suit is making some concessions besides the actual armor plating being toilet paper

#

the reactor after all is so small it doesn't even look like the suit has one

terse sage
empty bloom
#

I imagine Vettel met a similar fate to Hedge if he did not die outright.

#

We also know two additional IVs managed to escape the ring section by hijacking a Banished barge hauling vessel.

fair hazel
#

I wonder if any spartans escaped the house of reckoning

empty bloom
#

Personally, I hope they make a sequel with Hedge escaping.

fair hazel
#

it would be sad but funny if there were spartans in the house of reckoning when john went in there but he didn't realize

terse sage
fair hazel
#

Unless he lied. I feel bad about All the dead spartans and infinity crew we've known about. I just want them to live.

terse sage
#

Knowing Escharum, its possible he did lie

empty bloom
#

You're telling me someone in a story would do that? Lie?

#

Next you'll tell me a character can be wrong

stoic hamlet
#

four minutes

empty bloom
#

If you ignore the opening shots, opening bombardment, ringfall

#

And only count the amount of time it problably took for Atriox to jump and dumpster Chief

last anchor
#

Escharum is the President Snow of the Banished. Speaks tough words, but when it comes down to it, isnt really the best in terms of actual leading and strategic thinking.
"Ah yes, I will steal the friend of the Master Chief so he has no choice but to come to me!"
-Forgetting apparently that Chief was going to come kick him over ANYWAY because thats just what Chief does.
Break holds, find target, delete command/control. Standard Spartan operations

terse sage
#

I like the idea that Infinity took one hell of a fight to take down

#

Rubicon Protocol sorta paints that picture, with one of the characters mentioning the steady rumbling of the guns and a MAC gun tearing a Banished ship clean in half

last anchor
#

I mean, she landed entire firebases, multiple lifepods, Pelicans, Condors and more, plus her frigates.
Im pretty sure she could have held, Lasky just decided to sacrifice her to get the Weapon deployed.

#

To be honest getting jumped by basically the entire Banished fleet will do that for you

terse sage
#

And now we don't have any clue where Lasky is

orchid kettle
#

I don't think the Infinite deployed those bases

#

i mean i dunno maybe they did, Halo wars stuff is canon

empty bloom
#

"Standard UNSC PT practices should still be followed. However, due to physical augmentations, basic gym equipment should be considered unsafe for use. All exercise must be performed only on Spartan-IV-class, operative-approved equipment, locked in the S-Deck Armor Bay."

Lmao. The implication for this is pretty funny to me.

orchid kettle
#

I just thought those bases existed because Zeta Halo was already occupied by humans before Cortana

empty bloom
#

The implication being that IVs require special gym equipment for safety that isn't their own.

orchid kettle
#

but i thought IVs were just really fit Marines

terse sage
#

Its like that feeling when you're in the gym using a machine after a super buff guy, but like cranked up to 1000

orchid kettle
empty bloom
#

a. All Spartan-IV-class operatives will consume meals only from the designated Mess Hall aboard Infinity. Spartan-IV meals are specially prepared with two guidelines in mind to meet the specific needs of each individual.

i. Each Spartan-IV has different caloric needs based on activity data gathered by his or her individual physiometer.
ii. Each Spartan-IV requires different levels of vitamins, nutritional supplements, and ancillary medications to aid in continued physiological well-being and reduce risk of future implant rejections.

People tend to misread ii.

#

Because the implication on that one is just safeguarding to make sure implants don't get a chance to reject, which makes perfect sense.

#

And also make sure the IV's mindset is 'fit to fight', so to speak.

orchid kettle
#

personally i only eat the Chef's Surprise

terse sage
#

M o a b u r g e r

orchid kettle
#

its a small thing, but I will always miss the brutalist vending machine from CE

empty bloom
#

So what exactly is an Infinity-themed cupcake anyhow?

orchid kettle
#

that thing looked like it dispensed cheeseburger-flavor slop

empty bloom
#

What does it look like?

orchid kettle
#

and not actual cheeseburgers or anything like that

empty bloom
#

"Spartans from Sydney Team participate in an ancient "cage match" martial arts battle with no holds barred!"

#

I wonder who won.

orchid kettle
#

unfortunately then a tiny Dreadnought comes in and splits it in half

#

very sad

empty bloom
orchid kettle
#

"Cake, or humanity's greatest achievement?"

empty bloom
#

UNSC Infinity Poker Night! Tickets for Poker Night are on sale now in all Mess Halls or via Infinity's Waypoint intranet. This month's Grand Prize: priority seating on all intra-ship shuttlecraft and trains.

#

I like the implication of intraship shuttlecrafts utilizing a ticket system

orchid kettle
#

they're real big on poker specifically on the Infinity it seems

empty bloom
#

"I'm so awesome, that I beat a Spartan!... At poker"

#

Also

#

[Attention Spartans - no armor during the fun run!]

#

Like they wouldn't already beat everyone easily lmao

#

(It's problably for the safety of the deckplates)

last anchor
#

The most perfect poker face: MJLONIR HELMET

compact ridge
#

We need a Firefight map based on the Battle of the Mortal Reverie, just as wide scaled and brutal in the book

terse sage
#

That's what I was saying earlier

#

Glad someone agrees

#

It'd be an awesome setpiece, especially if it was at night

runic wharf
#

It was a 2 day battle

#

It could feasibly be set night or day

#

or both

terse sage
#

They mention several layers of barricades falling during the battle so it could be a sort of game mode where you hold one line until it falls, then retreat to the next

obsidian thistle
#

Soooo

#

Shocking reveal

#

Laskys middle name may not even include J at all

#

The internet has lied to us all

#

It may be Thomas Michael Lasky! 😮

FB_IMG_1702423359227.jpg
compact ridge
empty bloom
#

Day night cycles in games are frequently much faster than it is in the game itself.

terse sage
#

Is there fighting on other sections of Zeta halo?

pallid knoll
#

maybe whatever the people from Halo 5 are doing

empty bloom
#

As far as is known, problably.

plush compass
#

How the heck was Xytan jar Watrinee so tall

#

And why is Kurt so tall

terse sage
#

Kurt is just built different, not sure about Xytan

plush compass
#

And why did the forerunners make Sarcophagus so gigantic

#

They coulda built a smaller Dyson sphere

#

Around a smaller Star

stoic hamlet
# plush compass And why is Kurt so tall

Unlike every other Spartan, Kurt spent most of his life in one place, not going through Cryo and etc. So he was able to age "naturally" more or less.

THough he's tall af regardless, lol

terse sage
#

I kinda love the fact that no one in the UNSC really knows how the Needler works

dusty ferry
#

technically, no one knows how it works

#

not even the elites

terse sage
#

All they know is that it does work

orchid kettle
#

they have their bones encased in ceramic

terse sage
#

I thought he was above average tall even during training

#

But Sam was the tallest

stoic hamlet
orchid kettle
#

but

#

b0nes

#

the skeleton isnt magically growing more ceramic

stoic hamlet
#

yeah idk, but it's apparently a thing.

orchid kettle
#

i still wanna know how they de-augged Randall

#

what did they do with his old skeleton

terse sage
#

the whole "de-augmentation" thing is really stupid imo

orchid kettle
#

honestly it sounds like it just exists because randall's actor in nightfall didnt want to stand on a milk crate the whole time to appear larger

#

otherwise I have no idea why he cant just be a Spartan that retired or whatever like Maria

terse sage
#

Or just have him not be a spartan

orchid kettle
#

i mean that too

#

but the audience might get bored if a story doesnt involve a spartan

#

however nebulously

terse sage
#

People seem to like Halo 3 ODST just fine

orchid kettle
#

but honestly yeah, Randall's point as a character is that he's former UNSC turned pro-independent colonist

#

and that doesnt really necessitate being a spartan

terse sage
#

I also think the whole "people won't like it because no spartan" thing doesn't rlly work when you realize a lot of people like ODST

orchid kettle
#

i mean im mostly just meming

terse sage
#

Fair

orchid kettle
#

it could just be because 343 enjoys deep lore cuts

#

because Randall actually was introduced in Pariah, the Soren short story in Evolutions

#

but i dunno, personally I dont need an update on every named character ever

last anchor
#

Most of the ones we've have just been "yeah now they're dead" so

fair hazel
#

I like the deep cuts

#

so opposite of you

#

you can unshorten people even now

orchid kettle
#

"yeah turns out their marriage was failing because they didn't actually like each other outside of life or death situations."

#

like dang, what does matt forbeck have against married couples

terse sage
#

I think they didn't really like civilian jobs, I don't think they didn't like each other

#

But it's been awhile since I read Bad Blood so maybe I'm wrong

orchid kettle
#

Its mentioned that they were taking their frustrations out on each other, and would have filed for divorce if Jun hadnt offered them Spartanhood

#

which I dunno, just sounds like they're not compatible

exotic pulsar
grim barn
#

Kurt was the biggest spartan in lore I'm preatty sure.

ruby canopy
#

I believe Sam was

scarlet quiver
#

Was Sam fully grown?

stoic hamlet
#

He was 7’4” when he died at 14.

urban portal
#

Bro was Tall

tribal trench
#

all spartans are

#

kurt is over 8 feet iirc

fair hazel
#

Not lucy

terse sage
#

Is Jorge above average size for a spartan or is NOBLE team just short

light orbit
#

If Flood spores could infect anything that breathes in how did Arbiter and the Elites live 💀

#

Please someone tell me

fair hazel
#

They have to make contact

light orbit
#

But Arbiter in Halo 3 was in High charity around the end of Halo 3 and surely there had been almost tons of Flood spores flying around in the ship so there was a chance he had breathed it in. That goes same in Halo 2 when Arbiter, The Shipmaster and the elites at around the end of the mission where you chased the heretic went into a building that was foggy and had a lot of flood

#

There was clearly a chance Arbiter was in contact

unique rune
#

The short version is "don't think about it too hard".

The long version is that there might be some minimum exposure time or concentration needed for anything to happen, but it's never really been explained so for gameplay's sake you should just try not to think about it too hard.

light orbit
#

I watched too much HiddenXperia 💀

stoic hamlet
empty bloom
light orbit
#

Yes I watched him

last anchor
#

We might have an asnwer for the Arbiter in Broken Circle actually of all things. One of the Sangheili assigned to the Janjur Quom mission mentions nanotreatments to ensure they're immune to any pathogens brought by the biting insects on-planet.
Presumably, thats standard practice even into the modern era for the Covenant.
I wonder if those nanotreatments could help counteract Spore inhallation.

Obviously it wouldnt stop a direct Infection Form strike but then, nothing can.

versed helm
#

Elites' energy shields cover the whole body including their face. So flood spores probably get blocked from entering the shied while air gets through, or the suit has an air recycling system that controls the air underneath the shield.

#

But when the shield gets broken, I dunno

terse sage
#

I assume Chief's armor and shields prevents him from inhaling spores?

stoic hamlet
#

MJOLNIR armour is sealed and has 90 minutes of air in the base model.

With stuff like CBRN gear and etc that’s likely extended far longer.

#

Even ODST (when fully sealed) features 15 minutes of air as a base.

orchid kettle
#

Space assault ODST armor has 90 minutes of air as well

stone stump
#

Forgive me if I'm wrong but in reach when six takes off his helmet, isn't his suit not fully powered on because the armor is missing the helmet

orchid kettle
#

The suit would have power because the backplate is what contains the reactor

#

The shields just wouldn't be active

stone stump
#

Ok

runic wharf
#

By that point shields have failed anyways

gusty star
last anchor
#

True.

#

Also apparently Reddit took it upon itself to weave all of the Fractures armor into the mainline canon through armory hall-style blurbs.
Honestly, its surprisingly good stuff. Wish I'd know it was happening before.

empty bloom
last anchor
#

Its like, one dude doing this I think so, yeah.
Im surprised thats the only one that doesnt work.

exotic pulsar
last anchor
#

They added stuff to explain how it further ties in

#

IR the shoulder knife lead to the creation of the THORNBLADE armor

exotic pulsar
#

Why do these shoulder pads sound like recharge stations for energy swords? Because they sound like recharge stations for energy swords.

orchid kettle
#

either way, something wacky

unique rune
#

The knives need power to knife harder

last anchor
#

Personally I figure they're plasma sheathed. Extra cutting capability

versed helm
#

Random question

#

Is it ever stated what color forerunner blood is?

exotic pulsar
#

I don't think so?

#

@empty bloom I call upon thee.

empty bloom
#

Not a clue.

#

Sorry.

exotic pulsar
#

@versed helm There is your answer.

versed helm
#

Huh

empty bloom
#

Looking on it, the blood of a Forerunner has never been depicted.

versed helm
#

Weird, you’d think it’d be mentioned atleast once

exotic pulsar
#

Would it really matter in the grand scheme of things?

versed helm
#

Not at all, I just randomly thought about it when I was thinking about that one human-forerunner war cutscene

exotic pulsar
#

Seen a lot of weird stuff in the fandom, like Flood infected Hunters. Not sure that would even be feasible due to how the lekgolo work. If anything they would just be used for biomass.

versed helm
#

I think the individual worms have nervous systems but it’s just unfeasible to do anything with

exotic pulsar
#

Yeah, a nervous system specifically designed to combine together with others of their kind.

versed helm
#

Exactly

#

I’m more curious about the incredibly inconsistent spores

exotic pulsar
#

Since they can only be used for biomass if that is the case we wouldn't be seeing flood hunters, lucusts, or even scarabs.

versed helm
#

I’m still unsure if that refers to the infection forms or the literal airborne spores

exotic pulsar
#

A bit of both leaning towards the airborne spores. All flood forms whether that be the basic spore, to even the combat forms have the flood super cell inside of them.

versed helm
#

The thing I’m curious about if is the “single flood spore” line is literal, or if they were just being hyperbolic, cause if a single airborne spore is enough, pretty much every encounter is death unless your in a sealed environment suit

exotic pulsar
#

Shipmaster versed the Flood before during Halo CE so he knows just how dangerous the parasite can be. Could have been hyperbolic or just a way to show that the Flood are so dangerous that direct and swift action must be taken in order to stop the spread dead in it's tracks.

versed helm
#

I’m more curious about the fact that if it’s literal Arbiter was trudging around flood zones with his clearly exposed face

#

I guess you can just say shields do something for that

exotic pulsar
#

That is why we have the Emergency Contact Protocol Upsilon. In the event of a Flood containment breach, all Unified Earth Government and United Nations Space Command rules of engagement are suspended during the duration of the containment. Upon declaration of UPSILON, Spartan Flood containment Fireteams may be deployed to assist with quarantine efforts, though are specifically prohibited from handling samples of Flood biomass, or attempted treatment of wounded personnel.

exotic pulsar
#

He wasn't infected due to "plot reasons".

empty bloom
#

It's a caution. If the flood is unchecked enough that a spore goes errant, it can undo an entire civilization.

versed helm
#

Flood airborne infection is a weird topic, like I said earlier it’s kinda inconsistent

empty bloom
#

Oh, absolutely.

#

I hate it

versed helm
#

And that’s not even getting into the zombie style “get hit your infected” that sometimes happens?

#

I think that might’ve been in only one thing actually

empty bloom
#

Yep

#

It's

#

Very weird

#

Honestly, it's best tied to 'as the writer (and the infection load) ordains' and left beyond normal consideration.

versed helm
#

Because I remember seeing somewhere, even attacking the combat forms releases airborne spores

#

So unless your super far away with a DMR you can say hi to the Gravemind

exotic pulsar
#

That is why the Shadow of Intent glassed the entire city and the outskirts of Voi.

runic wharf
wicked wasp
#

Guys how was Emile able to say “I’m ready how bout you” after being stabbed through the lungs pretty much

tribal trench
#

he was a spartan III

#

they were built different

pallid knoll
tribal trench
#

(real answer: spartan IIIs were literally made to basically kill as many enemies as possible when they died. Berserker rampage. Kinda like a gorilla)

empty bloom
#

That was IIIG's schtick. IIIA and IIIB were not subjected to the frontal lobe augmentations.

tribal trench
#

yeah but with those modifications they were still a lot more unstable than any II

empty bloom
#

Emile is a IIIA, A239.

versed helm
#

I never got how he could see past the giant scratched in skull aside from rule-of-cool

empty bloom
empty bloom
tribal trench
#

i’m talking about IIIs in general

empty bloom
#

And you are wrong if you are doing that.

versed helm
#

So they can see more than just the visor shows?

empty bloom
# versed helm So they can see more than just the visor shows?

Exactly. It's like the visor of Adeptus Astartes from 40K; The 'lenses' of their helmet are, for all intents and purposes, additional armor plating that doubles as an effective sensor surface. The VISR 'coating' is effectively a covering for sensory systems such as cameras and IR probes, not the Spartan's face.

versed helm
#

So it’s basically just a giant wall of cameras then?

empty bloom
#

Basically.

versed helm
#

That explains a lot

empty bloom
#

It's why helmets like Recluse or GUNGNIR do not come at a significant cost to Spartan operability.

tribal trench
#

do ODST helmets (both Pre and Post-MJOLNIR) do the same thing?

empty bloom
#

No.

#

Well, pre-MJOLNIR, at any rate.

versed helm
#

I thought the ODST helmet was made for MJOLNIR, operating off the Reach description

empty bloom
#

The Spartan and nonSpartan equivelants of MJOLNIR helmets, such as ODST or AA or Volant, differ on a fundamental basis from their opposing counterparts. The addition of specialized sensor systems, additional armor plating, shield waveguides, and other such equipment drastically changes the profile of the helmet in question.

#

It's why a MJOLNIR helmet can weigh double or more than the original helmet it was based upon.

empty bloom
runic wharf
#

The Visor isn’t solely a suite of cameras; It serves the same polarization/depolarization direct to daylight use as normal visors

#

It Can be visorless, and that is done on more ‘rugged’ designs, but visors are not ~= to camera suite

empty bloom
runic wharf
#

😭

empty bloom
#

The faceplate is the face, or visor, of the Spartan, and is an armored cowling for sensory equipment.

runic wharf
#

yes thats true

empty bloom
#

Now, personally, I think the sensory equipment the faceplate armors in such a fashion can include the Mk1 eyeball.

#

But that requires a granularity of canon that, simply put, we are not afforded.

#

Would it surprise you to know I am entirely too many shots of gin and rum deep?

runic wharf
#

I know that Mjolnir Does directly input light (at some level) at least back with Gen IV/V because of references made to how polarization was necessary in several instances that I can’t directly recall

#

It could, however, be polarization in front of the cameras

empty bloom
#

That's what I figure. Or the cameras themselves.

runic wharf
#

which would be a bit jank but possible

versed helm
empty bloom
#

Lmao

runic wharf
empty bloom
#

Yeah I love that term

#

Specifically, I love it because it throws people off, like a 1D107 code

versed helm
#

Threw me off

runic wharf
empty bloom
#

But yeah, it's a bit iffy on where the dividing line is for a visor and VISR.

versed helm
#

On the topic of armor I wonder if every variant shown is actually an existing design that’s been used or if some are just prototypes or proof-of -concepts that are added for customization purposes

empty bloom
#

I prefer believing the latter is the most common for Spartans, despite comics and such trying their damndest to prove me wrong.

#

Like so.

#

God, Didact's such a stud.

versed helm
#

I don’t remember what happened, didn’t he get demolished in a comic after H4?

empty bloom
#

That's basically what happened.

#

There's a book coming up on the subject of the Didact soon.

versed helm
#

Im curious how they event got a knife into the helmet in the first place

#

spartan strength I guess

empty bloom
#

Very carefully, don't worry about it.

versed helm
#

Was there ever even an explanation for how Master Chief got his H4 armor?

empty bloom
versed helm
#

I have to look back and see how different the H4 and H5 suits are

#

I think there’s some difference but it’s not coming to me right away

#

And then there’s the Infinite armor

empty bloom
versed helm
#

He changes suits a lot doesn’t he

#

On an entirely unrelated note I just remembered the Yonhet exist

runic wharf
#

Sangheili are better anyways

empty bloom
#

So

versed helm
#

I’m not super up to date on forerunner lore but didn’t she put him in the Sphere?

empty bloom
#

The funny timeout sphere yeah

versed helm
#

Was that before or after they “broke up”

empty bloom
#

After

versed helm
#

I gotta replay H4 cause I completely forgot what the point of that was

#

The sphere I mean

tribal trench
#

It was basically a prison for the didact

exotic pulsar
tribal trench
#

the cryptum

exotic pulsar
#

Yeah he was put in there to basically chill out and think about what he did, but being in there just made him more mad.

unique rune
#

the Ikea timeout light fixture

versed helm
#

So mission accomplished? They imprisoned the guy who hates humans, let him stir on his hatred for humans for like 100k years, then he got let out and acted on said hatred for humans

tribal trench
#

ask his wife

#

she was the xenophiliac

empty bloom
versed helm
#

Did the forerunners know Halo would mess up most of the precursor stuff? They did right?

unique rune
#

No

orchid kettle
lone plover
#

what if the UNSC gain access to battletech laser...that include up to naval laser

#

would it change anything

orchid kettle
#

In fact, Fall of Reach at least provides further evidence for the visor just being a glass pane that Chief is looking through, as the flash of a laser fired by the Covenant ship that Sam will later sacrifice himself to blow nearly blinded him

#

With it being mentioned that his "faceplate" barely managed to adjust in time

#

But, naturally, you cant really be blinded by a display feed of a light source, in the same way that a video of the sun isnt harmful to stare at compared to the real thing

#

unless of course the display itself is blindingly bright

#

but you would kinda hope the helmet doesnt have the power to flashbang chief at any time

#

Nylund was also a really big fan of the helmet's visor (which is the term used a couple times in TFoR) being able to retract into the helmet

#

I guess because he wanted Chief to be able to take a sip of capri sun without having to ditch the helmet entirely

empty bloom
dusty ferry
#

the faceplate could just be sensors that can be seen through or something.

#

the two descriptions don't have to contradict

fair hazel
#

? It's like enhanced see through with ability to dim and other stuff

last anchor
#

Presumably, MK IV was an actual see through face plate. Same with early MK V
As MJLONIR evolved and advanced however they presumably enhanced and replaced it (note; Gungnir, in MK V(B), where the entire visual source was a camera)

wicked wasp
tribal trench
#

we don’t know his lungs were even impaled lol

wicked wasp
#

Well a sword went like right through his chest

tribal trench
#

we just know it was his abdomen

wicked wasp
#

And it’s unlikely that it happened to go right in between his lungs

tribal trench
#

if you really want to be like that

given all presented information, we can say in confidence that Emile’s lungs were not pierced by an energy sword.

wicked wasp
#

Alright fair enough

empty bloom
#

From the perspective of the player character, all likelihoods are reversed

stoic hamlet
gaunt oakBOT
obsidian thistle
#

For those who care and didnt notice last time

#

343i added yet another M90 into existence

versed helm
#

I just went down a rabbit hole of reading the reach data pads and now I’m just confused

#

So…AI Illuminati was behind everything?

obsidian thistle
#

Their influence is debated

#

But they existed

pallid knoll
obsidian thistle
#

Kinda

versed helm
#

It implies they did stuff with the spartan program, potentially the insurrection, even contacting the covenant and for some reason…trying to disprove glassing?

obsidian thistle
#

Chimera armor has a story tied to them. But also not

versed helm
#

Like do they still exist…?

#

Do we know what’s true of those pads and what’s up in the air?

obsidian thistle
#

The data pads were left by a guy going crazy by the influence of the Assembly

#

So on paper

#

Everything is suspect

versed helm
#

It’s just weird to me there’s not one but two “maybe humanity was kinda sorta guided by a shadow thing” type plot points now

#

Cause it’s like, Librarian does a Geas to make humans get power armor and other things, and apparently, potentially, the assembly were also tangentially involved?

obsidian thistle
#

I suppose a way to view it is this

#

The Assembly is the human side fighting back against the Forerunner stuff

#

Sometimes the Forerunner stuff wins

#

Sometimes the Human stuff wins

#

Sometimes they work in concert

#

Sometimes they cancel each other out

versed helm
#

And apparently there’s something to maybe do with the ancient human AI as well, so is it basically two unrelated semi-ancient things both do their thing and they just happen to match up?

obsidian thistle
#

Yup! You being cheeky and reading the wiki 😉

#

Heh I respect that

versed helm
#

I’m trying to catch up on what’s new

#

It’s been…

#

A lot

terse sage
#

I have no idea whats happening right now

#

Wth is "the assembly"

versed helm
#

Something about the AI Illuminati

#

That’s been guiding humans to do things

obsidian thistle
#

Best to be very clear on where stuff comes from! 🙂

versed helm
#

The real question is what did humanity do by themselves at this point

#

As in modern humanity

obsidian thistle
terse sage
versed helm
#

But the assembly data implies it was them who contacted the covenant

#

Or a rogue member did

#

Or tried

obsidian thistle
#

It never says they contacted the Covenant.

versed helm
#

I guess it’s natural for a big franchise that’s a few decades old that things will be confusing

terse sage
#

Having a universe that big almost guarantees that things will contradict

obsidian thistle
#

Again however! In-universe the data is debated

terse sage
#

Also I'm still really confused about the Reach (game) vs Fall of Reach (book) debate

#

Like i get that Reach (the game) was meant to override Fall of Reach, but then it's kinda implied that they're both canon

versed helm
obsidian thistle
versed helm
#

Yeah, but the whole Sloan thing after it

#

It’s weird

meager pier
obsidian thistle
#

Catalog was a good idea but badly done

#

It needed more oversight to ensure what it answered wouldnt hit it badly lol

#

Something Canon Fodder QnA does a lot better

dusty ferry
obsidian thistle
#

The M90-TC

Backpack-MerchImage3_900x.png
#

So this could lead to this sorta scenario

#

I am trying to pick between if I want a M90 or a M90A shotgun before I go in a Pegasus that is fitted with M90A 30mm gauss cannons. My friend over there is talking about how he likes his M90-TC, and M90 Shoud on his MK50 Sidekick, while also wondering how to fire their M90B PDM.

#

Thats a lotta M90

dusty ferry
#

thats a baller sentence

obsidian thistle
#

And the existence of the M90A gauss cannon and M90B PDM would infer that M90 and M90A versions exist where applicable

#

So that is a LOT of M90 around

last anchor
#

Im going to get some shotgun casings and put em on it

#

Just cause

drowsy mesa
#

Halo: Empty Throne delayed from July 30 to October 8....

dusty ferry
#

Oof

#

Wait which one was that?

empty bloom
dusty ferry
#

Oh, the one which is probably breaker trip

empty bloom
#

Yeah

exotic pulsar
#

While the Warthog would be impractical in the modern military considering protection. We can't deny the idea of it being fun making an enemy alien eat bumper going seventy eight miles an hour. Honestly it feels like the warthog should be faster for a off-road vehicle meant for scouting but also hit and run tactics.

unique rune
#

The Warthog’s official specifications are weird because its top speed is (slightly) lower than the M820 Scorpion’s.

Still faster than a Humvee I guess.

uneven maple
ruby canopy
#

Seems like oversight. No reason the scorpion should be faster than the warthog imo

#

Lore or gameplay

exotic pulsar
unique rune
wicked wasp
#

So at the beginning of Halo 2, is that when Johnson was promoted to Sergeant Major?

sonic lagoon
#

What was the economy of Humanity like?

runic wharf
sonic lagoon
runic wharf
#

It varies per world greatly; Some places were socially organized towards the production of only one production chain, and this would leave its mark in the diversity of life available. In a built up colony, such as Reach, you would have a social life that varies greatly region to region based upon the kind of professions available, with the social cohesion and isolation that ‘your work is your social standing’ brings

#

Corbulo in Forward Unto Dawn shows the variances in social life, even amongst generally ‘high’ standing society, were very deep

empty bloom
empty bloom
# ruby canopy Seems like oversight. No reason the scorpion should be faster than the warthog i...

So, funny thing is-an ungoverned tank actually can, under ideal conditions, move as fast as their lighter utility vehicle counterparts. The top speed of an Abrams with the standard governor device is about 45mph; The top speed of an Abrams without this governor can be upwards of 65 MPH, with stories of Abrams reaching a staggering 85 MPH in reports by MPs charging tankers with speeding at Fort Knox, allegedly.

#

The standard top speed of a HMMWV, the closest equivelant we have to a Warthog IRL, is roughly 70MPH.

#

The stark difference is usually acceleration and terrain.

#

Also, tanks really hate being pushed that fast, due to the nature of tracked movement.

runic wharf
#

There is a not insignificant difference between the Scorpion and Abrams in how their mass is distributed; Scorpions have 4 separate pods to distribute torque, and thus acceleration, and presumably offer far better engine performance per ton

empty bloom
#

Don't even get me started on how absolutely absurd the Scorpion's volume is.

runic wharf
#

It’s a stupidly sensible tank for the kind of war the UNSC faced

It’s also patently absurd in every capacity

#

(Colonial wars of high-mobility)

empty bloom
#

The most sensible part of it is stating how stupid it is lmao

#

Thing's got bigger dimensions than the failson known as the Maus

runic wharf
#

Yeah, making it absolute target practice for any air-capable opponent

empty bloom
#

You know what I want in my urban counterinsurgency vehicle? A vehicle with a lower end wider than the regulation road.

runic wharf
#

7.8m is not wider than roads in halo, tbf

empty bloom
#

Mmmn. Fair enough. I'll add an almost.

runic wharf
#

It is also worth noting just how much the pods take up as part of the volume compared to the crew capsule; It’s a survivable bugger that can do hull down and high angle of fire well

#

It gets blown up a bit easy in games, but in lore its a fair bit more sturdy

#

Having independent drivetrains is a survivability boon even if it would put maintenance crews on mental health watch

empty bloom
runic wharf
#

Its deadzones are awful
It does have good fire angles, though

empty bloom
#

I had a five day argument with 40+ paragraphs about how bad that damn tank actually is at it being a tank.

last anchor
#

I will insist, to the end of my days, the Scorpion isnt an MBT, its a light vehicle designed for air dropping.
And that theres another, far more reasonable vehicle somewhere in the backlines we never see.

Like how there as that paradrop tank for supporting paratroopers

empty bloom
#

For just as long.

last anchor
#

Its too wide for much of anything.

runic wharf
empty bloom
#

Which is literally one of the last things you want in an airdropped vehicle.

runic wharf
#

But it works well as a cheap, low manpower, high survivability unit

empty bloom
#

The best excuses I can think of for its absurd design is either surviving entry with the crew in it (Via pelican deployment) or being originally designed for an entirely different role that had nothing to do with its name.

#

The former being the reason I assume the Pelican's the size of a C-130.

#

Just masses of foamed plates meant to assist in constant reentry.

runic wharf
#

It’s a colonial suppression tank that is built to spread around limited quantities of manpower with high quantities of good enough firepower

empty bloom
#

The flashbacks are starting.

runic wharf
#

It isn’t meant to deal with hostile armor, or with a peer adversary, but with groups of rebels equipped with second rate weapons

#

It can do that against Covenant forces because their own Armor systems are incredibly obsolete in design thought

#

They work for their role, and thats about all one can say for them positively

empty bloom
#

terror Dear god, the M808 is made since 2218.

runic wharf
#

yep

#

Its an awful design that gets around its issues because the UEG had such a monopoly on the tools of war

#

And gets around them in the war of annihilation because the Covenant is a lumbering feudal giant that has no coherence or unified intent in design.

runic wharf
#

😔

#

UNSC vehicles are all incredibly silly in how they are designed

ruby canopy
#

A tank moving that fast just seems so… odd

empty bloom
#

The modern MBT is incredibly fast by old tank standards.

stoic hamlet
#

There is something to be said about those old IST’s though, the image is quite striking.

sonic lagoon
#

What would the economy of the Covenant resemble?

willow pilot
#

Would you guys be open to seeing more of other squads and characters like Spartan Locke again?

#

In halo are they “Vikings”?

#

Cause the Spartans are called Spartans but are they any characters or groups who are called “Vikings”?

sick galleon
#

Is Spartan Locke the same Spartan that you play as is Halo 5? Sorry if it's a stupid question Ive only played Halo 5 once and I don't remember anything from it

willow pilot
#

If I could send gifs , I’d send a gif of him

stoic hamlet
willow pilot
runic wharf
gray cloak
#

albeit the covenant is a heavily militant group, so they probably didn't really have time to be buying commodities.

#

especially with things like the unggoy rebellion, the great schism and the war against humans and the flood happening.