#lore-and-universe

1 messages · Page 17 of 1

bronze delta
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Dangit, it went private. Let me see if I can find my post on Waypoint.

turbid lintel
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that's OK
You can continue to take exception to the books, I'm intersted in continuing to read theam and form my own opinions

bronze delta
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They greenlight the basic plot, from what I understand from Tobias Buckell, not the details that the author writes

abstract wren
gilded mason
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I remember when doing a pre-release interview, when asked about Lucy and the challenges of writing a mute character, she went "Oh, I've got ideas for how to write her ;)"

faint ore
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If Pilots from Titanfall fight with Spartan 4 who do u think would win? And why?
No weapons no Armor no attachment just fist and body

bronze delta
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Gross... If you can't write a disabled character, don't use them

gilded mason
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Yup

bronze delta
turbid lintel
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I'm interested to see how books 2 and 3 unfold.
I was admittedly shocked that the Sangheili seemed so inept at basic tasks such as farming and governance (due to the explained reasoning that the Shansyum just did everything for them), but I rolled with it and am waiting to see more. Thinking about it more, it's more a show of how much power the Shansyuum had over other races, than those races being inept.

gilded mason
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Thing is...that's contrary to how they're portrayed elsewhere

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And really just makes no sense anyway

turbid lintel
faint ore
bronze delta
gilded mason
bronze delta
turbid lintel
gilded mason
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Cole Protocol did

bronze delta
turbid lintel
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and any other examples of elite's governance mostly focused on their pre-covenant time

gilded mason
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It talked about Elites having governing bodies, making profits from farming, fishing, etc

faint ore
bronze delta
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Cole Protocol literally follows Thel 'Vadamee as a Kaidon of 'Vadam Keep

turbid lintel
gilded mason
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Prominent merchant families as well

bronze delta
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To say nothing of their colony worlds

gilded mason
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As well as at least half the adults on Sangheilios stay on-planet to govern it

gilded mason
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It's even funnier considering the source of that

orchid kettle
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Halsey being depicted in Glasslands, while inconsistent with previous versions of Halsey, honestly doesn't seem that out of line for how she appears in future media, including the halo tv show

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which I think Ive explained in this channel before

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I think this just IS somebody's perspective on the character, and they haven't really walked back on that except for like

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Osiris grabbing Halsey from Jul and she's immediately back on team good guys

turbid lintel
orchid kettle
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Well in Halo 4, Halsey defends the Spartan II Program, not just the supersoldiers themselves, but the program as a whole

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While Halsey in First Strike and Ghosts of Onyx has since disavowed the program

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Like, she no longer believes in sacrificing people for the greater good

turbid lintel
gilded mason
orchid kettle
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which is her whole lesson to Chief in First Strike

orchid kettle
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ONI

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ONI has absolutely no moral highground in this conversation when they're the ones who carried the program out and hired Halsey

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Of course it turns out the guy isnt ONI I guess? But Halsey seemed to think he was for most of the interview

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and when she finds out he's not, she just pivots to how cool Chief is

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and then the scene ends

turbid lintel
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She was under arrest and being questioned about them, so she was defending herself.
ONI always had secrets within themselves too

orchid kettle
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If you were defending yourself from ONI

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You wouldn't excuse the program

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You'd bring up how it was all ONI's idea in the first place and they hired you

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In Halsey's Journal, we even learn that ONI was well aware that the IIs would have to be children

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before they approached her

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Like, Halsey is a convicted war criminal here

abstract wren
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Except its not Parangosky anymore the leader is it not ?

orchid kettle
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why does she care about protecting ONI's secrets to ONI

orchid kettle
abstract wren
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hum, right

orchid kettle
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Its just nonsensical, but it is trying to make Halsey seem a bit sinister

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especially with that whole

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"When the Covenant appeared, nobody cared where they (Spartans) came from."

abstract wren
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But Halsey is protecting the program and herself against ONI who want to make her a scapegoat

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ONI just doing ONI stuff in the end

orchid kettle
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ONI's program

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that ONI hired her for

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Like, again

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the first logical thing you'd do

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is point out that the people blaming you

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are the ones who ordered, funded, and hired you

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Like think of it like this

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if I hired a hitman to murder somebody, and they do

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and then I turn around to the police and turn them in

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Dontcha think the hitman is gonna reveal who hired him

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is he gonna have any loyalty to me?

deep coral
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during halo infinite are there still humans on earth?

orchid kettle
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No, of course not

gilded mason
deep coral
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i thought they all got killed by banished or cortana bruh 💀

gilded mason
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Why'd you think that

abstract wren
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You seems to forget that ONI can just lock her up, and change the narrative

orchid kettle
deep coral
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cuz at the end of halo 5 earth was under attack

orchid kettle
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The UNSC has already claimed ownership of the Spartans

abstract wren
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She did by herself things

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Like clones

orchid kettle
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they're not random rogue soldiers in armor

abstract wren
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lots of clones

orchid kettle
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They're UNSC, and the UNSC loves to promote them as heroes

abstract wren
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of herself, of the children

gilded mason
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That was an ONI thing before Kilo-5 tried changing it

orchid kettle
gilded mason
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The children, at least

orchid kettle
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Is that it assumes ONI never once realized that none of the kids they stole were ever reported missing

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None

abstract wren
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Because ONI followed.
But they could just change that narrative..

orchid kettle
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and even if you blamed Halsey for flash clones to the press

abstract wren
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It's not that difficult to think..;

orchid kettle
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you know what the public hears

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"Wait you guys stole 75 kids?"

abstract wren
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It's the point of Hunt The Truth to show us that. Halo 4 tried for 1 minute and drop it.

orchid kettle
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Scapegoat implies that public blame is being placed on somebody

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but if you're only blaming halsey for clones

abstract wren
orchid kettle
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how is that a scapegoat

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You still just admitted to kidnapping kids

gilded mason
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What's funny is that Kilo-5 also said "Oh, yeah, ONI literally murdered every agent who didn't want to abduct the kids."

orchid kettle
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"Your honor, I did not steal $500 for the cash register! That was this other guy who did that after I killed the cashier!"

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Like, wow, genius

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You admitted to the worse crime

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in trying to cover up the lesser

dusk jetty
abstract wren
orchid kettle
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Also its not a scapegoat in Kilo-5

dusk jetty
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Oh we’re talking about oni

orchid kettle
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Halsey and Paragonsky talk behind closed doors

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privately, to each other

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why is Paragonsky accusing Halsey, and why is Halsey acting like she did go rogue with the clones

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Because its a retcon

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There's no 4D chess framing going on

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Like even if you could somehow blame Halsey as a rogue agent that made 75 supersoldiers in a lab without any government assistance

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how do you explain mjolnir

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or them all being in the UNSC

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"sorry citizens, this lady showed up with a bunch of supersoldiers in powered armor and said we could have them for 20 bucks"

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"i swear we were bamboozled"

dusk jetty
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To be fair, multiple projects in the UNSC were unknown to the larger group. Like most of Halo reaches campaign, and the Spartan III program

orchid kettle
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The question just is

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who are you trying to fool by scapegoating Halsey specifically

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you cant admit to the public that Chief is a kidnapped child soldier

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thats the whole point of Hunt the Truth

abstract wren
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yes indeed

orchid kettle
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and if you just say

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"no lord hood, Halsey came up with the clones!"

abstract wren
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It's exacly the problematic of Halsey//ONI problem

orchid kettle
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What, he's okay with kidnapping and murdering children

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but draws the line at clones?

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Its ridiculous

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Like, who else would the head of ONI be answering to

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if not like, Lord Hood (who probably already knows)

abstract wren
orchid kettle
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So who are they answering to

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Who's eyes are they trying to pull the wool over

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and how does only blaming Halsey for clones fix anything

abstract wren
orchid kettle
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What IS the point?

abstract wren
orchid kettle
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Whats the point of confronting Halsey about the clones in private? Why does Halsey admit to the clones being her going rogue?

abstract wren
orchid kettle
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Its not a scapegoat, it just IS true in Kilo-5 that Halsey somehow snuck the clones under ONI's nose

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And thats what Paragonsky is mad about

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That just is the book

orchid kettle
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Thats why she says

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"Who are you? The others were naval intelligence, but you..."

abstract wren
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Ok and ?

orchid kettle
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So what do you mean ONI's plan in halo 4

abstract wren
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Anyway you're digging too much on that

orchid kettle
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they're not IN halo 4

orchid kettle
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when that's just not what happened in the book

abstract wren
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And ONi is always making plans... it is its job

orchid kettle
stark atlas
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Do the Spartan Assault & the two Halo Wars games add anything interesting to the overall Halo narrative, or are they just little extra side stories?

orchid kettle
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Halo Wars 2 is basically the introduction of the Banished

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and you probably want to play Wars 1, if for no other reason than because it informs the Rion Forge trilogy of books and of course Wars 2

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Spartan Assault and Strike otherwise aren't really super important, and their removal from mobile stores kinda makes it feel like they've more or less been abandoned.

stark atlas
orchid kettle
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I also just really like the Wars games

abstract yarrow
stark atlas
abstract yarrow
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Although if you play Halo Wars 2 I’d also pick up Halo Wars 1 so that you’re more attached to the humans.

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They are basically are new characters and there’s not too many call backs. But again, it will make more sense if you know who those Spartans are, where they’ve come from and who the Captain is. Like some of the designs for the characters in particular are very different.

icy yoke
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Real World military projects underfoot immense scrutiny. I think a more fair compromise would be to enroll kids in a school as a PRIZE like scholarship like something aki UNSC apprenticeship. Widen the candidate pool to 500 to get the 150 they needed. As training progressed, then real events unfold Parent's more willi f let their kids serve. Fighting the Covenant wasn't a geopolitical huxterism, IT was war for survival. Gutwrenchingly cruel....but essential

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More prominent aspect would be escalate development of the technology to modify Spartans. Spartan II received their augmentation procedures in 2525.
Spartan III program started in 2531 with augmentation about 5-7 years later. So a huge quantum leap in bioengineering from half the soldiers dying to 100% survival.

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Let's be clear, if Spartan III modifications were doable in real life the Pentagon đŸ‡ș🇾 would not hesitate to incorporate it.

stark atlas
obsidian thistle
stark atlas
obsidian thistle
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Uber cheap on Steam anyhow aha

stark atlas
obsidian thistle
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If you do care about extra stuff though. Get the Xbox One version of Assault

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If you get the right partner the co-op stuff is a right blast and a half!

stark atlas
obsidian thistle
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Nope. That unfortunately never came to Xbox. Stuck on PC and Windows Phones

stark atlas
heady geyser
heady geyser
obsidian thistle
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Still fun to play

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Which is why you should get em! But I will say Strike is cooler for where ya go than its story

heady geyser
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How’s a Yanme’e hive so deadly?

obsidian thistle
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Imagine poking a hornets nest. But instead of just getting stung and bit.

They are also massive, can pick up an average human with ease. And are intelligent.

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Oh and there is a lotta em

heady geyser
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I was surprised that they were able to take out Hieu Dinh fireteam

obsidian thistle
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I get the feeling they werent expecting the hive

heady geyser
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Same plus I feel like oni had a hand in his operation failed

unique rune
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I don't think ONI would intentionally cause one of their own operations to go wrong.

heady geyser
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True but I have a strange feeling that something happened ether before or during the operation

surreal glen
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In case someone isn't aware yet

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That moment where Dihn remembers how his squad got taken down took place during the Covenant war, before the events of Halo Infinite

dusty ferry
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Is he an S3 then?

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I swear that they were in SPI

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Or was he part of one of the elite odst teams who got spi?

unique rune
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S-IIIs were mainly issued SPI and some of the tech has seen limited use by ODSTs, but no, as far as we know he was just some kind of ONI special agent prior to becoming an S-IV.

dusty ferry
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so they just had weird armor in the cutscene?

unique rune
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Presumably he and his team were issued some modern version of SPI similar to the MIRAGE IIC available on MJOLNIR

icy yoke
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ODST had their own armor. Various versions were semi powered

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Spartan III SPI armor was semi powered, hence the name, but stealth and subtrefuge was more important than.essential necessity of returning alive. UNSC was buying time

vivid viper
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"When the Master Chief reached the main chamber, he discovered that the Harbinger was interfacing with transmitters to locate the members of her species. The Weapon attempted to intercept the connection by disabling transmitters. With the help of an unknown entity, the Weapon managed to shut down all three transmitters, but not before the connection successfully located the Endless. At the same time, the Master Chief fought and eventually defeated the Harbinger and her Banished and Skimmer allies. Dying, she sent a message to an unseen ally of her own, telling them that they had what they needed and vowed to the Master Chief that the Endless would return."
-Halopedia, article: John-117, section 2.4.12: Biography; Post-Covenant War Period, Test of Legends

...is that "unseen ally" Atriox? If the Legendary ending is to be believed then it has to be, right?

abstract yarrow
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That would make sense. He wanted to free the Endless as well.

obsidian thistle
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Time will tell hopefully.

bronze delta
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Possibly, but the data stream that the weapon was fighting was also sentient, if memory serves, so it could be something worse than Atriox

timid skiff
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I know this question is probably being asked alot, but do we have a lore-accurate galaxy map of Halo?

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all I come upon tend to be fan-made, and often with inaccuracies

hollow belfry
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wait so how did the banished dreadnoughts pierce the shield?

abstract wren
unique rune
versed helm
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It is believed that Cortana was only a fragment of the AI created by Doctor Halsey, the other being supposedly destroyed during the Fall of Reach, and some people theorise that the Weapon is that other fragment. This can be backed up by the fact that people went back to Reach and rebuilt it.

unique rune
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What.

Why is this a theory? We know Cortana was a whole entire AI. It’s been like this for the past twenty years. She’s able to split off fragments for various reasons but she herself isn’t one.

And the Weapon is effectively a copy made using the same process as Cortana with a spare flash cloned brain that Halsey had kept in storage for that reason.

timid skiff
abstract wren
timid skiff
abstract wren
unique rune
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Yes I know she’s not literally a copy, I said “effectively” because in most regards she is functionally the same

abstract wren
bronze delta
icy yoke
hollow belfry
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But

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Still

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Four dreadnoughts could disable the infinites shield?

dusty ferry
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The infinity’s guns were in the wrong direction

hollow belfry
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Oh

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Couldn’t they have turned the ship?

bronze delta
hollow belfry
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Yeah, but another question

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If the infinity had strong enough shields to ram a warship, when a warship rammed it, wouldn’t the warship shatter instead of the infinity?

gilded mason
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Nope

unique rune
icy yoke
gilded mason
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Man, I'm glad the Infinity got pummeled. So many people think it's the perfect ship that could never be defeated.

unique rune
hollow belfry
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Oh ok

hollow belfry
bronze delta
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Unrelated, but I want to get to writing; Doesn't MJOLNIR have a failsafe function that overloads the fusion reactor, turning the Spartan into a bomb?

hollow belfry
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it seemed like humanity was finally returning after being dragged through the mud

unique rune
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The Infinity plowed through a relatively old RCS-class armored cruiser in Spartan Ops. No shields, just lots of physical reinforcement.

Banished dreadnoughts are presumably a relatively new ship type, specifically designed with ramming in mind.

hollow belfry
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Oh

hollow belfry
unique rune
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With the big, heavily armored prow ‘n all.

hollow belfry
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Yeah

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Also

bronze delta
unique rune
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Or maybe I was misremembering the latter

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Ignore that bit

icy yoke
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Infinity took some damage ramming that ship...but acceptable. That was a cruiser... Infinity battled 4 dreadnoughts. Because its main armament are located Fore and Aft, it's at disadvantage in broadside exchange. Infinity dies have 10 dorsal mounted Onager style MACs enough to damage frigates and small cruisers, but not enough to take on 4 dreadnoughts

bronze delta
icy yoke
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Infinity case she would have to unload her missiles and side guns. Those are defense weapons

unique rune
bronze delta
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Perfect. Oh, I'm going to have fun with this lol

dusk jetty
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So I read the halopedia article on ai to get a better grasp of how the covenant make ai’s because I didn’t understand fully the explanation in first strike and now I’m even more confused

unique rune
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The short version is that they don’t really make AI at all

The few examples we do know of are pretty much crudely copied from captured human AI

vivid viper
# hollow belfry If the infinity had strong enough shields to ram a warship, when a warship ramme...

Infinity's shields could protect it from ramming that (much smaller!) cruiser, but consider the apparent size of the dreadnought that rammed it. If I were to guess I'd say that it was at least two thirds of the Infinity's mass making the shields basically useless in stopping it

and judging from the design I'd also say that Banished dreadnoughts are built to allow for ramming

also don't the Banished have some sort of substance that was excellent for anti-materiel purposes? for all we know the dreadnought's forward hull may be coated in that stuff

not to mention that Infinity was already in combat and Lasky had already given the order to abandon ship, so the shields might not have even been up anymore

dusk jetty
unique rune
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The duplication process seems
 very ramshackle. And then they put a bunch of their own limitations on their function. So the result is just kind of a scrambled mess that serves their basic needs and not much more

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It’s like a human dumb AI but hella janky

hollow belfry
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Also

vivid viper
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Eh? Might have to rewatch the Infinite opening then

hollow belfry
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During the boarding party, where did the hundreds of Spartans go?

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Shouldn’t Spartans be fully capable of defeating a banished boarding party?

vivid viper
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according to the audio logs they were still there, just whittled down over the six months

dusk jetty
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Or crew capacity, for that matter

hollow belfry
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Oh

dusk jetty
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Blue team was gone, I think Halsey was gone
 we have no knowledge of lasky or Palmer, which is a shame, because I like lasky. (Mostly because he resembles me in appearance, lol) on the matter of Spartans, there are a few from the audio logs and rubicon protocol that are genuinely MIA, like Horvath, and maybe kovan, I can’t remember.

vivid viper
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Blue Team was reassigned by either Lasky of Halsey before Infinity got to 07

unique rune
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Yeah, Infinity was running on less than half its normal crew complement at the time. Presumably Spartan personnel onboard were similarly affected.

dusk jetty
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I hope we see Palmer and lasky and the rest again. Would be a shame for them to go down the M’dama route

vivid viper
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^

bronze delta
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I, for one, really like Palmer. Really want her to still be alive

unique rune
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I want her to tell me that we can still destroy the enemy core again

bronze delta
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Well if the eggheads would've been taller...

bronze delta
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Also for the notion of Covenant AI, from Subject Denver, the San'Shyuum Alo Sebukah held on Midnight Facility:

[DENVER] "Has your kind never heard of the logic plague?"
[OBERON 5] "What did you say?"
[DENVER] "Even in victory, your species remains blind to the great realities of the universe. The logic plague was an instrument of the Flood during their war with the Forerunners. It corrupts intelligences."
[OBERON 5] "As in deactivated them?"
[DENVER] "No. They were sabotaged, or..."
[OBERON 5] "Or what?"
[DENVER] "Or worse. Completely undone and brought to madness. Made into a greater monster than even the Flood itself."
[OBERON 5] "I find that pretty difficult to believe."
[DENVER] "Certainly. It is your species' greatest weakness. It was for this reason that artificial minds were verboten in the Covenant, lest our own creations turn against us at our most critical hour. A lesson your kind will undoubtedly learn at great cost."

cunning copper
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here just to ask, is the bunker hill in canon?

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iv seen this image

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i dont know if it real

bronze delta
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Bunker Hill?

cunning copper
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bunker hill class battlecrusier

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how do i put the image

bronze delta
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Unless you have the rank for it, it has to be a link.

cunning copper
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this

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is it canon

bronze delta
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There is a UNSC Bunker Hill, but it's a destroyer, not a class of ship, so far as I know

cunning copper
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also

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theres a game were yu can play as diffrent ships

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and one of the ships is the bunker hil

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give me a second

bronze delta
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Lemme check the Encyclopedia

cunning copper
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also in the project stardust wiki thing it says it the last two models were destroyed at the battle of earth

icy yoke
cunning copper
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but there was no battlecrusier in the battle of earth

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oh

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😩

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also

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is there a sahara class prowler know as the port stanly?

bronze delta
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Yes

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And yes, there's no canonical mention of Bunker Hill-class Battlecruiser; battlecruiser isn't even really a class of UNSC ship

icy yoke
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That's a hierarchy not a class....
Ships by size/tonnage/weapons

  • Corvette
    -Frigate
  • destroyer
  • Cruiser
  • Heavy/Battle cruiser
  • Battleship/Dreadnought
dusty ferry
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one of the crusier classes is called a battlecruiser informally

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forgot which one

obsidian thistle
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Ya talking about the battleship

gentle stirrup
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@obsidian thistle I have a direct question for you about your old canon order. Mind if I friend you?

obsidian thistle
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The Canon Order is something I havent discussed in years. So glad I moved to Halopedia!

deep coral
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why grunts always talking bout nipples

orchid kettle
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what else do they have to talk about

hidden cobalt
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elites that have been mean to them, guns, humans, memories of their homeworld, that sort of thing

dusty ferry
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Isn’t part of the lore that grunts speak human as a counter culture thing?

icy yoke
obtuse crow
icy yoke
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Yes. UNSC was reworking a new ship architecture post Covenant war. It's ships got more streamlined, less bulky. The Anlace as my Favorite....definitely has that next generation feel.

icy yoke
# obtuse crow It’s such an odd ship design.

The Vindication was designed by UNSC as a carrier killer...so they incorporated twin Super MAC battery the kinds of MAC they put on Defense stations. But unlike those they have slower recharge times so they fight as distance.

deep coral
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doesn’t plant vs zombie lore integrate into halo?

dusty ferry
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wut

stark atlas
hollow geyser
deep coral
dusty ferry
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how does PvZ lore integrate with halo

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i'm confused

obtuse crow
uneven maple
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Ahem what?

deep coral
dusty ferry
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i don't

icy yoke
dusty ferry
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ehh, i was close enough

icy yoke
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grunts enjoyed human culture so much that a black market was invented with grunts selling human soap opera's and songs.

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Kinda like how American pop culture seeped into Soviet Union and east Germany in 80s. By 80s portable televisions smaller than 9 inches and weights less than 9 lbs even with rabbit ears đŸ“ș TV could pirate broadcast US and western shows and music videos

odd coral
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in the intro of halo ce, did the pillar of autumn just stumble across the ring by chance? and were the covenant already on the ring?

timid skiff
odd coral
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ok that makes sense, thanks

scarlet hinge
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the superheavy cruiser nomenclature is mostly one of weird administrative quirk in-universe

scarlet hinge
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the resulting information combination allowed Cortana to discern that the Forerunner artifacts were pointing towards something. When the Autumn was to enact the Cole Protocol during the Fall of Reach at the end of August 2552, rather than jump to random coordinates Cortana decided to use the opportunity to jump the ship to the coordinates she'd been investgiating

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The Covenant's Fleet of Particular Justice followed the Pillar of Autumn's jump trajectory, but due to their superior slipspacial transit technology they were able to arrive before the Autumn did, and began to set up shop and lie in wait

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there's around 2-3 weeks between the end of Reach (August 30) and the start of CE (September 19)

stark atlas
bronze delta
# scarlet hinge the valiant-class is described as a battlecruiser in the encyclopedia

The 2022 Encyclopedia says that it's sometimes called a battlecruiser, but was drafted as an in-between for a battleship and a cruiser. I would assume though that the "super-heavy" comes in that for all the cruisers, they are the heaviest at 17 million tonnes.

The more odd thing to me is the use of "battleship" in terms of space warfare. Cruisers still work, as there are many ships (the cruisers) that are designed to emphasize their own armor and weapons, rather than a fighter compliment. But what makes for a "battleship" - at least today - is having guns over eight inches in calibre or displacing more than 10,000 tons (which doesn't really apply in space).

Realistically, I imagine every single ship in the UNSC fleet could be considered "battleships", and the Cruisers could all realistically be considered "battlecruisers". But those are more loose terms, not true designations, to denote what a ship is capable of doing, rather than it's combat role.

bronze delta
stark atlas
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Wait... Yeah, I put 2252, instead of 2552. I don't know if any human could extend there life 500+ years. đŸ€Ł

bronze delta
#

The Dark Side of the Force is a pathway to many abilities some consider... Unnatural

icy yoke
#

Numenorean life span....I'm good

#

Want them name a cruiser UNSC Numenor

#

Really wish we saw more UNSC destroyers in action.....

stark atlas
#

UNSC 0-Bi

icy yoke
scarlet hinge
icy yoke
#

Valiant are described as super heavy cruisers, I'm guessing ships are sorted by weight class of arsenal they possess. Armed with 2 Heavy MAC .

scarlet hinge
#

Again though, it's sometimes called a battlecruiser in universe (as mentioned in KiltdHeathen's more detailed response above)

#

i'm confused why the WW2 classifications are relevant at all

delicate birch
#

How did Spartan Thom or the previous noble 6 die on reach in a fight with the covenant if they haven't even discovered the covenant yet until the winter contingency was declared

#

Uh oh we got a plot hole

unique rune
#

Uh, no, we have a fundamental misunderstanding of the Human-Covenant War.

tropic forge
unique rune
#

Humanity had been fighting the Covenant for nearly thirty years by the time Reach takes place

#

The Winter Contingency was declared because they'd found the Covenant on Reach specifically

delicate birch
#

I thought the trailer showed Tom on reach destroying the cruiser

unique rune
#

He destroyed some other Covenant cruiser on a different planet

delicate birch
#

So the trailer got recon

#

Retconed

unique rune
#

No?

#

The trailer was always set months before the events of the game

delicate birch
#

Brain no work

bronze delta
#

That trailer shows the Battle of Fumirole, dated April 22, 2552. It's also when Kat lost her arm.

#

The ship destroyed there was the Sanctity of Purification

obsidian thistle
#

Its also not set on Reach but Fumirole.

bronze delta
#

Man, that is crazy to think Kat had only had her prosthetic for four months

#

I'm digging, but offhand does anyone know how fast a Spartan-IV can run, or more specifically how far they would be able to get in 15 seconds?

tropic forge
bronze delta
#

I know Kelly's speed was 62 kph; not to sound argumentative but do you have a source on the S-IV's before I go with that? I know they can outrun a horse (Halo: Initiation) pre-Mjolnir, so I'm trying to model off that as well

#

Oh

#

Horses run at 55 mph (88 kph)

bronze delta
#

Pending a stronger canonical source (still very open to it for accuracy) I've got 88kph while outside of Mjolnir, as that's stated to be Palmer's baseline augmentation. (That's equal to 1.22 horses according to my calculator app). In Mjolnir there would be an upscaling of that, so perhaps a safe assumption would be around 95kph (1.31 horses).

So at 26.3 meters per second, in armor they'd be able to cover 394.5 meters (1,294 ft, or just over 4 football fields) in 15 seconds.

tropic forge
#

The actual line is from the Spartan Field Manual:

#

In most environments, Spartan can achieve long jumps of several meters and maintain a running speed of 40kp/h (24.9mph) without Mjolnir armor.

bronze delta
#

AH, thank you! So around 60kph would be a safe bet for in-Mjolnir?

tropic forge
#

Yeah, based on the idea that they're roughly par with Spartan-IIs.

#

In armour, at least.

bronze delta
#

So that'd be 16.6 meters per second, 249 meters (817 feet) in 15 seconds. Still pretty impressive

#

That is a maintained speed, though. In The Fall of Reach John-117 was able to sprint at 105 kph, but he tore his Achilles tendon doing that. Spartan-IV's don't have that flaw, so I may use that speed for my scenario as a quarter-minute sprint.

#

I had forgotten about that incident

#

Or perhaps put that at the aforementioned 95kph as my Spartan wouldn't have an A.I. to possibly up that speed

#

For the situation she's outrunning a fail-safe detonation system of her squadmate's MJOLNIR armor

bronze delta
versed helm
#

I just realized how big the weapons in halo are, I'm talking in comparison to a normal human being

cyan owl
#

Technically: using running speed we can calculate the size of arenas and the campaign map.

bronze delta
deep coral
#

why do spartans not carry bio foam on them to not die in battle?

bronze delta
#

Modern MJOLNIR kits after [GEN1] Mk VI have automatic biofoam injectors

deep coral
#

also what is bio foam made of bruh

errant briar
#

The medicinal compound is morphophetamine in a polyethyltriphosphate liquid medium dispensed with nitrous oxide. When applied, the polyethyltriphosphate and nitrous oxide mix to create a foaming effect that can encapsulate, disinfect, and numb wounds.[3] Within the Unified Earth Government, biofoam is an OTC-legal product and can be purchased legally "over-the-counter.

bronze delta
#

Beat me to it lol

errant briar
#

Jus had to whip out halo wiki real quick

deep coral
errant briar
deep coral
#

bio foam is just a healing potion ong

errant briar
#

Whipped straight outta a RPG

bronze delta
deep coral
#

i was gonna ask som but ima just go on halo wiki 💀

errant briar
#

Halo books are so complicated

errant briar
bronze delta
#

The conversation rapidly moved past, but if you've got questions regarding some of Halo's deeper lore, this is the place to come

deep coral
bronze delta
#

What's the question?

deep coral
#

why hunters don’t got armor on they back

bronze delta
#

Convenience for the games

errant briar
#

Damn no casual swearing on server

deep coral
#

oh fr?

errant briar
deep coral
#

you aren’t gonna like this

#

but i got another question

#

can hunters see without their helmet?

bronze delta
#

Yes

errant briar
#

Worms ini

bronze delta
#

If memory serves, the lekgolo worms "see" off more bioelectrical currents than true vision

deep coral
#

i thought the worms only had mouths

#

what about scarabs

bronze delta
#

Scarabs are basically massive platforms for larger colonies of lekgolo

#

Functionally they're Uber Hunters

errant briar
deep coral
#

how much per mile?

#

can’t be over 15 cents

errant briar
#

20.6 credits a mile

dusty ferry
#

locuses are big hunter\

#

krakens are mega ultra hunters

deep coral
deep coral
#

if hunters are scarabs

#

then that makes them the only anti flood vehicle

unique rune
#

I mean
not really

#

They're still made of organic material and would be very much vulnerable to the Flood
they just can't really be converted directly into combat forms

deep coral
#

hunter worms can’t get infected by flood

#

because they don’t a central nervous system

#

@errant briar i’m after your job

#

i’m the lord guy now

#

đŸ’Ș

bronze delta
#

They do still have a hive intelligence that could be exploited when the Flood gets powerful enough. Keep in mind this is an organism that can infect AI

unique rune
#

Hunters can't be infected, sure, at least not that we know of.

But like. They're not immune to being converted to Flood biomass to construct pure forms or other environmental structures.

deep coral
#

@errant briar nvm

#

got proved wrong two times 😔

bronze delta
deep coral
#

how come you don’t see different races of grunts in every game?

bronze delta
#

You do

#

I mean, not together unfortunately. But it's rare that a game has multiple phenotypes. So far only Reach and Infinite have done that with the Rhuutian and T'vaoan Kig-Yar

#

However Halo: CE, Halo 2, Halo 3, Halo Reach and Halo Infinite have the Kafv Unggoy, Halo 4 has the Zimzib Unggoy, and Halo 5 has the Ritrit Unggoy

surreal glen
#

That's more the game design affecting the development than the attention to detail and lore. If you were to design tons of Elites with different heights, some different mouths, skin colors and such it would take a lot of time that you could be spending on more important aspects of the game. Furthermore, more models are more storage for the game, which strains the engine. Even for example, in GTA V, you can come across an NPC, then walk for a while and find another NPC with exactly the same voice, model and clothes

wicked wasp
#

Someone tell me their favorite halo side character and favorite book

#

Personally my favorite character is buck

#

Currently in the process of reading new blood and the flood rn

fair hazel
#

Silentium and legacy of onyx

deep coral
wicked wasp
deep coral
#

ong

#

he always falling in halo five though

wicked wasp
wicked wasp
wicked wasp
deep coral
#

i’m saving up for them

wicked wasp
#

Nice

#

Which ones you getting

deep coral
#

i gotta get all of them or i’m not reading one

#

i gotta get every single one or i’m not reading them

wicked wasp
#

Uh

fair hazel
deep coral
#

idk why but i can’t play or read som if i don’t have all of it

wicked wasp
deep coral
#

i’m comfy waiting to get a sequel but not if its already out 💀

#

i know that power armor provides water but does it provide nutrients to its user?

surreal glen
#

Yes

#

Otherwise Noble Six wouldn't have survived 9 days unconscious between the end of Long Night of Solace and the beginning of Exodus in Reach. And Master Chief wouldn't have survived for 6 months adrift in space during the events of Infinite

deep coral
#

how did master chief survive the halo ring blast though

#

from halo 3

surreal glen
#

Cortana says it herself

#

"We made it through just as it collapsed"

icy yoke
deep coral
#

i skipped through

surreal glen
#

The entire ship crossed the portal, escaping the blast

#

What I don't understand is why the ship got split into 2

deep coral
#

i thought part of the ship got left at the halo

bronze delta
#

Mendicant Bias bisected the ship, sending the Chief to Requiem in an attempt to atone for his sins

deep coral
#

if two graveminds or keyminds encounter each other, do they merge into one or som along the lines of that

bronze delta
#

They're all one consciousness

deep coral
#

even if two grave/keyminds were in different galaxies they are still telepathically connected?

icy yoke
bronze delta
deep coral
#

and maybe only some are the flood?

#

i don’t think the wiki can handle my questions đŸ„±

bronze delta
#

The Precursors certainly are: Path Kethona is outside the Milky Way, and is where some surviving Precursors are. And yes, only some of them became what the Flood is now

deep coral
#

took bro a while

#

the wiki can’t handle my brain power

#

🧠 đŸ’Ș

uneven maple
#

Nice

hidden cobalt
#

would be interested in y'alls feasible explanations as to why fuel rod cannons blow up in halo ce's campaign

orchid kettle
#

Grunts are silly, clumsy lil fellas

dense falcon
#

Same with swords

Though they abandon this entirely in future games because it was a silly idea.

sick current
sick current
hidden cobalt
#

personally I like the theory that halo ce fuel rods are built with some kind of "regulator" trigger and and when grunts die they let go of it, and as for energy swords they might be some kind of ancestral sangheili type which relies on their particular type of personal energy shields to stabilize the energy flow. I know theres like no basis for this tho /shrug

wicked wasp
#

Did you guys know that Mickey was a lower rank than the rookie?

#

Also, Romeo was the same rank as the rookie.

orchid kettle
#

yeah

hidden cobalt
#

did not know that

orchid kettle
#

Yeah the odst gang is kinda weird

#

we're told that ODSTs are all veterans of other special forces units, but I don't think we really have any example of a character having a history like that

#

My head canon is that used to be true, but since the Insurrection lead to all time low recruitment rates, the UNSC suddenly got a lot less picky about everything

#

which is surely how Gage can end up signing for the ODSTs when he wasn't even UNSC to begin with

dense falcon
#

Oh yeah

wicked wasp
#

Honestly there are only a few non-spartan spec ops units that are not odst

#

Like force recon

orchid kettle
#

Dirt has this cool idea where the CMA is seen as the UNSC's irrelevant little brother that gets all the crappy hand me downs

wicked wasp
#

Naval special warfare

#

MARSOC

orchid kettle
#

which I like a lot, I think it automatically makes the CMA stronger as a world building element than like, the UNSC Army

wicked wasp
#

I wish there was more spec ops units shown other than odsts

orchid kettle
#

I don't mind ODSTs being the main spec op guys

wicked wasp
#

Me neither

orchid kettle
#

I don't like the UNSC being the US Military in space

wicked wasp
#

They’re my favorite

orchid kettle
#

so I rather we did focus on what specifically the 26th century has to offer

wicked wasp
orchid kettle
#

I do want attention placed elsewhere tho, instead of everything being about spartans

wicked wasp
orchid kettle
#

we have cyclops, and scorpion tanks that you control with your brain

#

but everything is spartan spartan spartan

wicked wasp
#

There needs to be an odst 2

#

I would love to see a spin-off game that is more realism based

orchid kettle
#

like, did you know, aside from the Flood which is of course an adaptation of CE

#

the Scorpion tank has never been in a book

wicked wasp
#

Don’t spoil

orchid kettle
#

or at best, hasn't been the focus of any action scene

wicked wasp
#

I have played ce tho so still

orchid kettle
#

Characters use warthogs, pelicans, hornets, even a mongoose

#

but no love for the main battle tank

#

that again-- apparently you can operate with your mind

#

or at least aim the main gun with

wicked wasp
orchid kettle
#

which sounds like a super cool scifi concept

wicked wasp
#

It combines realism with sci if

orchid kettle
#

but since its not a green man in a super suit, we don't get to see it

wicked wasp
#

Fi

orchid kettle
bronze delta
#

I mean, we do have the "We Are ODST" trailer that shows a kid jumping right into the ODST

orchid kettle
#

and it doesn't help if you happen to not be a fan of what the real US military does to begin with

wicked wasp
#

I don’t mean immediately go from civ to odst

#

But go through marine basic

#

Then get to go to odst

orchid kettle
#

even though yeah, the cinematography doesn't really suggest a massive, eventful time jump like what we see at the end

#

where we see him as a freshly scarred rookie, to an older, grizzled veteran leading his own team

#

I do like the idea that ODSTs can come from all walks of life, but of course you could argue thats true regardless because they're not kidnapped child soldiers

#

I think in this server I mentioned before how the benefit of IVs is how they could all have their own histories and emotional hang ups compared to IIs or IIIs, but that benefit obviously also applies to the ODSTs

#

its just kinda a difference of power levels

#

Though I think regular people overcoming these alien monstrosities is more fun

hidden cobalt
#

v good points benson

unique rune
#

With the UNSC you’ve combined every military force on the planet, each with their own quirks and traditiona, then shunted it 500 years into the future

I don’t think it makes much sense for them to bear that much direct resemblance to the US Armed Forces

#

Like just look at how much the US Army alone has changed over the course of about 250 years

orchid kettle
#

I just think the benefit of fiction is that you get to make up your own thing

#

humans in Halo should be relatable, sure

#

but when the US Marine Corps is sponsoring HCS events and has its fingers in other parts of the video game industry, its hard not to wonder what the motivation is towards making the UNSC as close to the US armed forces as possible

last anchor
#

The ones at HCS Seattle didnt really do much.

orchid kettle
#

Its kinda my beef with IVs and a large chunk of their presentation as well, where it kinda felt like actual propaganda

#

not just in universe propaganda

#

it kinda got remedied with Halo's new direction, since clearly being a IV isn't all fun and laser tag when they're being skinned alive for their armor

last anchor
#

And the weird stuff the UNSC does to you to make you a IV since its mentioned as being "less stable" than the IIs

orchid kettle
#

but never actually going that far

#

especially when 5 looked like Chief straight up went rogue and was locked in a far deadlier conflict with, uh, Locke

#

marketing for 5, I mean

last anchor
#

I doubt it would actually do much considering how many people in "The Slush" seem to be already highly suspicious

orchid kettle
#

Its weird how Thorne just knows about it

#

like its common knowledge

#

i guess he listened to Ben's podcast?

#

and ONI's attempt to discredit him didn't work that well?

#

But I digress--

#

i know its silly to complain about the military being glorified in a series a lot of people consider to be military scifi

#

but i just end up preferring the uniquely Halo parts of Halo

last anchor
#

The Marines can attempt to make the UNSC Marines like themselves as much as they want too. The last time someone tried that, the book it was in was lambasted as "the worst Halo novel ever"
That was The Flood by William Dietz of note.

#

I dont think they'll be getting many recruits for actual military service out of Halo.

orchid kettle
#

To be fair people seemed to enjoy the Flood for its original bits

#

what i got sick of was

#

"Chief fired his rifle in a controlled three round burst."

#

repeated ad infinitum

#

Like past a point I just skipped Chief chapters to get to the original stuff

icy yoke
sick current
abstract yarrow
#

Ohhh new Intel. So looks like that desert map with the terraforming stuff is associated with the Created. Makes sense, similar to the Sanghelios map. It’s a monologue of one of the Created running the facility. Oddly they don’t get a name and it seems to be set prior to the events of Infinite.

So, between this, Sloan and them adding new AI to the game with Irratus. I am fairly sure they are going to add one of the “repentant” and “good” Created that Sloan seems to be referring to in the other Intel. In fact this one doesn’t sound too sus so it’s possible this unnamed Created could be setting up an origin for an AI they intend to add.

#

Which makes sense. It’s a lot easier to do that within the scope of the multiplayer story and there’s precedent with the Weapon/Chief for that.

#

BTW, since by this point they have actually confirmed beyond any doubt Created are still a thing. Does that mean they made Irratus and that’s who the Banished stole him from? Who else would be trying to make AI from other species?

unique rune
#

As far as we know it was a human company experimenting with other brain donors

#

Could’ve been Created-aligned but I don’t think there’s anything that really suggests it

sick current
#

Prior to Contact Harvest, had humans found alien life? Not even necessarily sentient, just any organic life not on Earth.

hazy shadow
#

Organic, plenty. Look at all the fauna on different colonies. But intelligent? No.

sick current
#

I thought so

deep coral
#

wait

#

nvm

#

are unngoy descendants of crabs

#

or crab like creatures

dense falcon
#

They have crustacean-like features and eat seafood, but they can't be descendants of Earth crabs since they're not from Earth.

orchid kettle
#

don't you know

#

the original life form the Precursors seeded across the galaxy

#

was crab

deep coral
#

i know just they kinda look like crabs

#

that’s why i said crab like creature

#

if i found an grunt on earth i’d be scared bruh

deep coral
wicked wasp
deep coral
scarlet quiver
#

Totally would befriend a grunt.

#

Do you think they are delicious?

dusk jetty
#

I just sat down and we’re discussing grunt taste in lore and universe channel.

#

This is certainly a moment of all time

unique rune
#

According to some UNSC service members, rumor is that they taste like lobster, so. Might taste good?

timid skiff
last anchor
#

Grunts breath methane. Something tells me their flesh would taste real bad

deep coral
deep coral
deep coral
#

with butter

icy yoke
#

I'm not saying aliens..... but....

bronze delta
#

Sorry, I'm catching up so I'm reading old stuff

last anchor
#

The Spartan Field Manual. Basically S-IVs require regular medical checkups to ensure their implants and augmentations are functioning properly

bronze delta
#

Ahhh, see that's less due to instability and more just to maintain the peak. Honestly, that's the greatest advantage that the Spartan IV's have. Those routine checkups make sure that they're always at the top of their game, replacing things that are damaged or worn out, be it cybernetics or organics.

The II's don't get that benefit. They're augmented and then it's just down from there.

heady geyser
dusty ferry
#

Yeah, the hellcat lore blurb mentioned that S-IVs could tune the augmentations after the fact

#

Which is a big benefit when you considering that technology will get better

#

Especially with all the one off mentions of new breeds of augmented super soldiers in halo 5 and the Rakshasa armor core

heady geyser
#

I always thought that the Spartan IV augmentations were a one and done thing

dusty ferry
#

You would think so, but apparently they are better at this now

heady geyser
#

I mean I do agreed that S-IVs can tune the augmentation afterwards like I said before I never knew that they can do that

dusty ferry
#

Yeah, who knows how that works

bronze delta
#

I would imagine something akin to if they're more prone to sniping, increases to the augmentation of their sight and reaction time. If someone who prefers to be fast, increases to muscle density and ligament foundation, bone strength for CQC, etc

hazy shadow
#

Pretty close to what Kiltd said. It's the slight tweaks to enhance specialization. SIIs did do this, but on a more organic level. They had the years of training and practicing to hone them into specialty prior to augmentation, and then augmentation took those specialties to the next level. SIV augs don't seem to be as powerful in that regard, outside of customization after the fact.

bronze delta
#

Actually when compared side-by-side, the augmentation of the S-IV's build off Project ASTER, and improve on it greatly. The notion that the Spartan-IV's are inferior to the Spartan-II's is propagated by a few things:

A fan "interview" with Frankie, and him coming up with something on the spot
Edward Buck regarding the relationship between II's and IV's as "Gods versus demigods" in New Blood (really, just Buck's opinion)
Fan preference and nostalgia.

When the facts are considered, the S-IV's are actually superior to the Spartan-II's on a biological level, even without their [GEN2]. The only advantage that the Spartan-II's have is their training and having been Spartans for longer. (i.e. more used to the augmentations)

hazy shadow
#

I don't see anything that could confirm that. There's hardly anything that can show SIV augmentation being superior to SII, and even then there are still tradeoffs like bone density and muscle mass that I was pretty sure were documented as being inferior and thus necessitating the Gen2 armor project, which SIIs would still benefit from. đŸ€·â€â™‚ïž

bronze delta
#

There was a lot of explanation as to what went into Project ORCHID. One moment, I did a write up on this.

deep coral
#

are unggoy at the top of the food chain on their planet?

#

i don’t think they should if they are

bronze delta
#

sigh One second, let me hack this up...

#

MUSCULATURE (INCLUDES SKELETAL AND ENDURANCE)

Project: ASTER contained the following for musculature: Catalytic Thyroid Implant (boosts muscle growth, leading to an increase in muscle mass, boosts bone density and durability), Muscular Enhancement Injections (increases muscle strength and endurance), Carbide Ceramic Ossification (3% coverage of bone structure to improve durability)

Project: ORCHID contains the following: Muscular/skeletal engineering series (growth and strengthening of muscle tissue, allowing them to work harder; enhances muscle memory; bones reinforced with skeletal fullerene lattices - regarded as stronger than steel - achieving greater coverage over bone mass; joints reinforced and/or replaced; ligament and tendon reconstruction and anchoring), Circulatory and metabolic improvement (heart is implanted with a synthetic weave allowing it to pump harder and longer; blood composition is modified to improve clotting and neutralize toxins; metabolic and digestive systems optimized to improve nutritional intake)

Result: The Spartan-IV's undergo procedures that achieve the exact same results that Project: ASTER does. What's more, Spartan-IV's have a higher physical augmentation than that of Spartan-II's. They have greater endurance, their bones are stronger and better reinforced, and their muscles are anchored so that they do not tear from the bone when overworked (John-117 succumbed to one such injury in Shadows of Reach). With improvements to their blood system, Spartan-IV's also stand a much lower chance of succumbing to exhaustion or fatigue due to minor injuries and blood loss.

#

REACTION TIME (INCLUDES OPTICAL)

Project: ASTER contains the following: Occipital Capillary Reversal ("marked improvement" to visual perception), Superconducting Fibrification of Neural Dendrites (300% increase in reaction time, marked increase in intelligence, memory, and creativity).

Project: ORCHID contains the following: Neurological series (Neural system is "super-myelinated", greatly improving reaction time; nervous system is subject to increase in cyclic adenosine monophosphate responses and the rebuilding of neuroendocrine cells.) Organ implantation (Corneal implants are provided, improving the subject's eyesight and night vision)

Result: As with other augmentations, the series that Spartan-IV's undergo achieve and improve upon augmentations that the Spartan-II's undergo. Visual as well as neural improvements are the same, if not greater, as well as added benefits of being able to see in the dark (not just enhanced vision), and augmented repairing of the neural network. Whereas Spartan-II's may begin to "break down" and lose that marked improvement in memory and creativity, Spartan-IV's do not.

Overall Result: The Spartan-IV's are superior. Not only do their comparable and additional augmentations support it, but the general treatment by the UNSC ensures it. Spartan-IV's can survive in greater hazardous conditions, breathing foreign gasses such as methane and surviving with no greater sustenance than tree bark. Their organs are optimized and/or replaced, likely leading to longer, healthier lives.

What's more, while the "routine checkup" is often taken as a negative, it is one of the greater benefits. The Spartan-II's were augmented and released into combat. They receive no follow-up, no routine maintenance and checkup. What they have is constantly on a slope toward degradation. On the other hand, the Spartan-IV augmentations are constantly improved. Faulty organs are replaced, broken cyberware is repaired. They are constantly maintained at a higher degree of combat readiness and effectiveness.

#

PSYCHOLOGY:

We have numerous examples of Spartan-II's either disobeying direct orders (John-117), going completely AWOL (John-117, Randall-037/Aiken), or being discharged and intensely bitter (Serin-019/Osman). Halsey's dismissal of the unnamed ONI agent is also flawed; Spartan-II's do have routine issues integrating and interacting with both UNSC personnel and civilian populations, leading to several instances of tactical and diplomatic difficulties.

Contrary to this Spartan-IV's are better able to work with both their peers and civilians. They are able to recognize when tact is needed; for example Tanaka knew it would be better to act politely and respectfully on Meridian, whereas Blue Team was unopposed only because Cortana told Sloan to let them through. As well, your portrayal of Spartan Ops is skewed. Yes, we see that the Spartan-IV's are able to flirt, boast, and joke around. Yet the very second duty or chain-of-command comes into the picture, they immediately form up, stand to, and get the job done. Halsey's dismissal of the Spartan-IV's is only evidence of her bias.

#

(For clarity this was in a debate, so some of this is directed)

deep coral
#

i got another question 😔

#

are unggoy at the top of the food chain on their planet

#

😔

bronze delta
#

The ecosystem of Balaho hasn't really been explored, but as they're a more technologically advanced race, it would be assumed so, yes.

deep coral
#

wait

#

humans consider grunts smart

#

oh nah

bronze delta
#

Natively they're Tier 6: Industrial

bronze delta
#

I just had an idea for the Precursors. So far we know two forms that they were able to take; the Flood (which is kind of fungal, when you think about it) and some plant-like being seen in Point of Light. What if their biology is entirely plant-based?

deep coral
#

straight outa whole foods 💀

bronze delta
#

Where are they described as bat-like?

deep coral
#

that’s just me though

bronze delta
#

Where though?

unique rune
#

something something but fungi are technically more like animals than plants

#

buddy you must be looking at some really weird bats

gilded mason
#

They're fun guys. =)

deep coral
bronze delta
#

Which depiction, though?

deep coral
#

just me

#

holup

#

read that wrong

#

i’ll send you the bat creature

bronze delta
#

Do you mean the Gasgira, or the Skimmers?

deep coral
#

nah

#

the precursor 😔

#

it’s hard to explain

#

🧠 ❌

icy yoke
# bronze delta PSYCHOLOGY: We have numerous examples of Spartan-II's either disobeying direct ...

Spartan IV started off as Adults hence were raised in human environment to acclimate and handle subtle nuances if casual human conversation. The augmentation procedures were aimed to eliminate the instances based on trial and error Where II and III would die. IV were built to last... UNSC wanted return on investment...not clear how well they need medical intervention if they retired.....but UNSC wanted a soldier they could produce instantly. II and III required intense years long psychological reconditioning, III were vengeful psychopaths they let loose on the Covenant knowing full well they'd not come back. IV were meant to come back......

wicked wasp
#

Most attractive halo character

gilded mason
#

Rtas, probably?

uneven maple
#

Johnson

meager pier
#

You like how it seems they're moving fractures away from just being non-canon what ifs, to hypothetical stuff in canon?

wicked wasp
unique rune
#

I mean
No one’s forcing you to use it

#

But yeah I much prefer having Fractures that have a stronger relation to main canon

#

Tenrai and Entrenched are kinda neat but feel like a bit of a dead end with little investment

abstract yarrow
# meager pier You like how it seems they're moving fractures away from just being non-canon wh...

We’ll see if they keep it up. Yeah, it’s a novel way of putting more lore into the game without committing to it. Just knowing Created are around, are a thing and this is what they could do is fairly insightful.

Also there’s no reason they couldn’t make the WW2 or Japanese armour it’s more that those were elseworld.

I am just curious about if this simulation thing, both this and Irratus, is just for this season or if it’s a recurring thing that might have some bearing on campaign.

I think it’s fine. Chief is a cyborg with the neural link with Cortana and they have depicted that as a union of human and AI. So making a twisted Borg version of that isn’t off brand or that out there.

icy yoke
#

Cal x oBrien

dusty ferry
#

Forunner esque mjolnir sounds dope

bronze delta
dusty ferry
#

Is it those probability mirror things the forerunners had?

bronze delta
#

....I'm going to have to read into that, but possibly. I'm stemming off the mention on the "Noble Loyalty" coating that Jorge arrived in the Tenrai Universe, and having them be basically alternate dimensions or realities relative to the Halo Universe. Where Jorge gets to the Tenrai Universe via Operation: UPPER CUT, my Spartan gets to Drengr (I have it as Yggdrasil) via a Precursor.

dusty ferry
#

this is the tech

#

in theory, the seeds for the noble loyalty reveal were always there

#

Slipspace canonically caused time travel in I love bees

#

alternate universes is one step beyond

orchid kettle
#

as opposed to "What if Spartans were Samurais"

dusty ferry
#

Some of the MCC ones sound sick as heck

#

Like no cap, I want a novel about the gundam one

bronze delta
dusty ferry
#

I know, i just finished downloading MCC earlier and remembered PREFECT existed

#

seeing more things in the style of lets say the builder armor from the Halo Anniversary terminals would be dope

bronze delta
#

That Probability mirror is interesting; I might find a way to have that implemented. In essence though, what I'm writing is that some of the Precursors remained behind to shepherd Humanity in the guise of their gods. Specifically I'm using Freyja, and she takes my Spartan from the Halo Universe milliseconds before a nuclear explosion (almost exactly like Cortana did with John-117 in Halo 4) and brings her to the Yggdrasil Universe, where she is a major leader.

dusty ferry
#

seems legit, Neural physics is weird

bronze delta
#

I am absolutely going to be using the Drengr armor for her appearances in the third book

wicked wasp
zealous pecan
#

Did the covenant know of the flood before halo 1

#

And reach

obsidian thistle
#

Yup

#

The game Halo Wars happens 20 years before that and the Covenant were in active conflict with the Flood on the surface of a Shield World.

#

To add to this; the Covenant discovered that shield world a few years ahead of the game also. Which means the Covenant at least knew of the Floods existance for awhile.

#

Who knows if they knew of the Flood ahead of then however

abstract yarrow
#

Have you read some of the Chimera core lore on the armour bits. Proper nightmare fuel. 😄 Like there’s one where they can pump them full of combat stims but it causes them to grow these tumours that need to be “pruned” in between fighting.

Like I am a little surprised. I would have said if you really wanted to have the Created go another direction it would be along the lines of the Geth. They lose their forerunner technology so they use UNSC robots and weapons to basically fill the same place Prometheans did. Lower tech. The Encyclopaedia suggests they were going to sort of merge the Created and Prometheans. Both aren’t exactly ruled out BTW in the recent lore since this is just Sloans simulation.

Chimera is more sort of keeping the nightmare fuel of Halo 4 Prometheans with people being turned into machines but going more down the cyborg route instead of people being digitised. I don’t know. Maybe that’s an easier sell for people? It’s much more obviously an evil take on the Chief/Cortana thing and an excuse to not have Prometheans in. But that is going all in on the Created being evil. That’s not setting up the Culture as a Rogue Servitor, that’s Driven Assimilator and the Borg.

gilded mason
deep coral
#

was the rookie given the hyper-lethal threat level?

dusk jetty
heady geyser
bronze delta
# deep coral was the rookie given the hyper-lethal threat level?

All Spartans are "hyperlethal". This isn't an actual designation, and is more just a colloquialism. From Halopedia:

"By 'hyper-lethal"', Halsey presumably refers to Noble Six's file, in which Colonel Urban Holland describes B312 as '...more akin to a hyper-lethal vector than a soldier.' Ostensibly, the 'one other Spartan' Halsey mentions is meant to draw parallels between Noble Six and the Halo series protagonist John-117, as both characters' exploits in gameplay are defined by the player's actions. Given the wording in Six's file, however, it is somewhat questionable whether 'hyper-lethal' is a legitimate 'rating' at all, or merely a descriptive phrase used by Colonel Holland. The information sheet for Spartans in Halo: Ground Command suggests the latter, mentioning that 'each Spartan is a hyper-lethal special forces operative'. In this light, assuming every Spartan is indeed regarded as 'hyper-lethal', Halsey's remark in the A Spartan Will Rise vidoc could even be interpreted as sarcasm."

wicked wasp
wicked wasp
#

although jun did consider him for the program he died before he could become a spartan

bronze delta
#

The Rookie isn't described as "hyperlethal", to my knowledge.

deep coral
#

he should’ve been ong

deep coral
icy yoke
sonic lagoon
#

Can the Logic Plaque infect androids, akin to the kind seen in the alien franchise?

bronze delta
#

If androids existed in Halo, yes

vivid viper
#

how long can a Spartan-II live?

gilded mason
#

Unknown

icy yoke
#

Assuming 26th century medicine aging is presumably slowed.
Also continuity Cancer is largely eliminated from human genome...cancer largely dealt with in cases of environment (smoking, etc)
Spartan II have had their cardiovascular systems augmented to survive the rigors of stress and prolonged combat.
Spartan IV have their hearts fortified with organic copolymer so their heart rates can beat past 200 per minute without arythmia

sonic lagoon
#

Does the halo universe have any gangs or organized crime?

icy yoke
#

Vast geopolitical problems between 22nd and 24th century human society.

#

Course there is crime and gangs

sonic lagoon
#

Here is a thought, what if a facehugger impregnated a gravemind?

unique rune
#

Probably nothing
Any usable biomass would just get absorbed into the Gravemind's body and get repurposed for something

bitter quiver
#

Thats even assuming the facehugger doesn’t get infected on the way to the gravemind

sonic lagoon
#

It has acidic blood

bronze delta
#

That literally would be of no issue to the Flood

sonic lagoon
#

How so?

#

It burns flesh.

bronze delta
#

The Flood repurposes everything on a molecular level. This would include acid blood.

sonic lagoon
#

Wouldn’t the acid burn the flood cells?

bronze delta
#

No

#

This is an organism that can, when powerful enough, affect and alter the very fabric of Space Time. Acid blood isn't going to be able to thwart it.

unique rune
#

Acid also isn't like, magic anti-material juice. There's all kinds of things that can be done to protect against it. Like your body has various layers and secretions to block and neutralize stomach acids so you don't digest yourself from the inside.

And if our janky human physiology can pull that off, Flood super cells absolutely could.

last anchor
#

Meat is meat

#

Oh is someone thinking Xenomorphs are immune to Flood infection again

#

Bro come on. That’s like saying the Xenos could take on the TYRANIDS.

#

Also uhhhhh

Facehuggers are like dinner plate sized. The Gravemind is the size of A HALOS CONTROL ROOM (at least the one we saw is)
It’s tentacles stretch for MILES

#

NOT. HAPPENINF

uneven maple
#

Wait.. I had a crazy idea

#

Could the necromorphs be consumed by the flood?

unique rune
#

As long as they're made up of organic matter, sure

uneven maple
#

I'm imagining a dead space and Halo crossover where chief and Isaac team up to fight the necromorphs and the flood and then you get a wierd necromorph flood gravemind

#

That would be cool

icy yoke
#

Xenomorphs polysaccharides physiology and acidic blood is distinctive of a biological battery suggests the energy supply ofbthe gestated creature is short so it's preoccupation is finding hosts with which to reproduce. Flood organisms parasitize all.... with some augmented humans showing some mild resistance.

icy yoke
#
  • medicines
  • advances to help their AI overcome rampancy. (See Holomatrix)
  • improvements in fusion reactor schematics to boost energy productivity of their ships
  • food productivity, soil reclamators to repair glassed worlds
hidden cobalt
#

from what little i understand of necromorphs, their infectious quality is more than just of the flesh, it's partially mystical/mentally memetic in nature, so if necromorphs encountered flood it would probably result in hybridization rather than conflict

#

i do think highly acidic lifeforms would be harder to floodify though? but i'm not so sure about flood blood in general. likely the flood would just kill headcrabs and suffer minimal damage from them. as for xenomorphs they would probably have a much tougher time. (xenomorphs stand a decent chance at mutating/infecting at least a segment of the flood imo)

sonic lagoon
#

The acidic blood for xenomorphs can cut thru metal starships. Their bodies remain a constant obstacle, even after death. Flamethrowers assist in taking them without splattering their blood and burning yourself by their blood splattering on you.

bronze delta
#

The Flood bends the boundaries of space and time, infects artificial intelligences, and has permeated into multiple timelines

dusty ferry
#

Wasn’t there a thing where they like turned off slipspace in the novels

#

Or they like inhibited that transition or something

bronze delta
#

I believe so, yes

last anchor
#

Rather a massive pain in the rear for the Forerunners, that.

last anchor
# sonic lagoon The acidic blood for xenomorphs can cut thru metal starships. Their bodies remai...

Extremophilic issues are no particular danger to the Flood. FSC constructs simply do not care what happens to them because they are, at core, just biomass converted.
Flood forms will happily leap through raw vacuum between ships to continue their job of infesting others, as we see in First Strike.

The blood of the host is irrelevant; the meat, the mass, is.
That being said I think the Flood still requires calcium for certain things? The main issue would be if the Xenomorph could be converted properly or if it would have to be absorbed just as mass instead of being turned into a combat form

bronze delta
#

I mean, especially considering that the Flood has converted entire planets - like, not just the population, but the entire planet - the Xenomorphs literally have no chance. Their blood would run cold, perhaps cauterizing a few Flood, and then more would pour over them even as the FSC adapts and converts their biology

unique rune
last anchor
#

I wonder if Xenomorphs have any calcium in em. They're silicon based yeah?

sonic lagoon
#

So would they need to drain the xenomorph body before converting it to biomass?

bronze delta
#

Very doubtful. As mentioned above, there is a 100% chance the Flood would have a base to the xenomorph's acid

unique rune
#

Dump enough sodium bicarbonate on it and problem solved

wicked wasp
last anchor
#

Not a hard thing to aquire if you're the Flood methinks

last anchor
wicked wasp
last anchor
#

Not...really.

wicked wasp
fair hazel
#

That doesn't...

meager pier
#

Here’s a wild, pretty bonkers theory, is that the Halo Array, or at least the template for them wasn’t exactly developed by the Forerunners, but the Precursors, and the Forerunners found it and figured out how to reverse engineer it to some degree, thus explaining why it’d wipe out Precursor structures

sick current
last anchor
#

Looking back, I realize it was Ghosts of Onyx.

#

During the battle around High Charity

sick current
#

alright

bronze delta
sonic lagoon
bronze delta
#

The lore indicates the Flood consumes everything

obtuse crow
#

It consumes space and time.

sick current
obtuse crow
unique rune
zealous coral
#

¿Hay una versión en español para la tradición y el universo?

abstract yarrow
#

I am not sure. There’s a Spanish chat in general from what I can see.

sonic lagoon
icy yoke
#

Alkaline blood

unique rune
#

Probably just some violent fizzing and not much else

deep coral
#

why do normal jackals have broken language but the skirmishers can speak fluently

dusty ferry
#

I don't know, maybe the phenotypes affect the vocal cords?

hidden cobalt
#

different education/child rearing practices perhaps, skirmishers are like a different type of jackal

#

(i also wonder if when we hear covvies speak english in the games if it's some sort of automatic ai translation feature)

flat kernel
#

I believe skirmishers are a sub species of kig yar, and have a different culture and slightly different physical characteristics.

dusty ferry
zealous coral
#

Did the grunt rebellion happen on high charity because I don't know

dusty ferry
#

I assume it was probably empire wide

zealous coral
visual fox
#

Anybody know how to scale here?

dusty ferry
#

in what context?

visual fox
#

Like character scaling @dusty ferry

#

Vs battle

#

Universal-Boundless tiering type of thing

dusty ferry
#

ahh, i have ...

#

experience

bronze delta
#

Is that the "who would win in a fight" kind of stuff?

dusty ferry
#

yes

#

it is a bad place

bronze delta
#

Yeah, I generally don't engage in them. It's often pitting two incompatible things together like Master Chief vs Doom Slayer (who is basically a literal god)

visual fox
#

The COD community seem to think that their zombies can defeat the flood

#

Lol

#

And they’ve scaled them to Complex Multi

#

But some research and I can already tell the Halo Cosmos scales higher

#

With the Forerunners creating/interacting with 12th Dimensional spaced

#

Which would put them at Hyper

#

And the flood obv scales to the forerunners

dusty ferry
#

the fact i understood that is actually annoying

visual fox
#

Lol

#

Ah it happens

#

You must adapt to survive

latent junco
#

I could prolly go on many long lore rants in which I'd only understand about half of what I was sayin lmao

dusk jetty
#

I was going to say that master chief versus doom slayer would be like a certain predatory whale versus the giant squid, and the whale would win every time but iratus showed me what I refused to see

boreal bane
#

I pardoned that for you

unique rune
#

Ah yes, “who would win” debates. Or as I like to think of them, “my thing is cooler than your thing”.

obsidian thistle
#

Who would win depends on the writer.

A single Mongoose could take down an Covenant Assault Carrier if an writer wanted.

last anchor
#

Ya-YEET

vale solar
hidden cobalt
#

lmao, true, but you could write something cool like rigging it with explosives and then launching it off a ramp into the engines or whatever.

vale solar
#

that would have to have a couple of FENRIS warheads strapped to it to do that much damage I would think, as those Carriers were described as being incredibly difficult to take down

hidden cobalt
#

just strap a havok on it and good to go XD havokgoose

last anchor
#

Considering a Spartan rode a nuke-covered Banshee right up to a Covenant vessel of some kind and knocked it out, its possible

#

Would be a pretty sick move I gotta say

orchid kettle
lucid bone
#

Is dr Halsey still alive or was dud by ONI

orchid kettle
#

the covenant space pickle is actually just a human mongoose using 10% of its true power

orchid kettle
lucid bone
orchid kettle
#

I bet she could

#

she would hack Atriox's exoskeleton hand thing instantly just by looking at it

#

and make him hit himself over and over

gilded mason
#

👏

hidden cobalt
#

doubt halsey is dead, it's unknown if she was on the infinity or not, and even if she was it's possible she escaped? she could be in cryosleep on zeta halo or something as it's possible for normal people to do that w/ meds.

orchid kettle
#

I mean, yeah, normal people use cryo all the time

dusty ferry
#

And that one guy from spartan ops

obsidian thistle
#

SpOps did have a secondary scientist who kinda just vanished from the narrative

last anchor
#

Team Gargarin just kinda got eaten by the machinery at their research site

dusty ferry
#

I feel like a side game could make great use of a scientist as the excuse for upgrades

#

Like, I don’t know a beta 5 game

#

Imagine how goofy some of those missions could be

#

Upgrades and different mjolnir variants having actual purposes

#

That would probably be hard to implement though

orchid kettle
#

Who's the leading mind in every field that matters

sonic lagoon
#

Can the flood survive radiation and if so how many rads?

dusk jetty
# sonic lagoon Can the flood survive radiation and if so how many rads?

The flood survived in high charity for years after the reactor overloaded, so I’d assume they could. Whether or not it affects them is up for debate. I haven’t the expertise to say how much rads (proper term is rotogens) but the elephants foot at Chernobyl emits about 8,000. High charity, given that it’s reactors are far larger then Chernobyls, is likely extremely radioactive.

sonic lagoon
unique rune
#

Probably nothing measurable

bronze delta
#

Would the UNSC have a mayday signal for ground troops surviving from a ship crash?

dusk jetty
#

This is an interesting question. I think I could give a decent answer to this question, but nothing 100% true. Humans can handle a maximum of 9.5 concentrated sv. That’s less then a fraction of a single rotogen. Given that infection forms are even more fragile, it’s likely that flood cannot handle very much radiation. However, when we take into account the fact that high charity is quite large, the situation changes. The flood have a capacity for mutations, given their many different forms. Given this, we can assume that flood are actually more resilient then humans, but by no means tough. Now for the question of just how radioactive is high charity? Well, think of radiation contamination like water. You can just walk in the rain, you could swim in a lake, or just be doused with a hose. Walking through Chernobyl would be like swimming in a lake. You would die, to say the least. But given that high charity’s reactor room is separate from the rest of high charity (you can see the mausoleum of the arbiter in the distance on the level Cortana, suggesting that there are multiple pieces of high charity) it’d be more like walking in the rain in high charity. You would probably survive, albeit with some “injuries” so with that in mind, the flood can handle more than any human could, but they aren’t invulnerable

bronze delta
#

They could potentially be invulnerable, as the FSC is able to survive direct slipspace transit

icy yoke
#

Ground beacon... communications om not sure they have a FTL communications beacon fir ground troops

bronze delta
#

Oh for sure, but lemme clarify a bit for what I'm looking for; if there's nothing it's totally cool:

In my story my ODST squad drop from their frigate that's basically crash landing. When their Sargent is reaching out to any local UNSC groups, he reports that the frigate had catastrophic damage and crashed near their position. Would there be a code word for that? E.g. something like "mayday", "pan-pan" or "broken arrow"?

deep coral
#

is the halo tv show a different universe than the one from books/games

gilded mason
#

Yes

sick current
#

The Infinity is not necessarily destroyed, right?

gilded mason
#

Maybe not. But hopefully it is.

obtuse crow
#

Maybe we see the eternity.

gilded mason
#

Doubtful. It was still half-finished last we heard about it

deep coral
sick current
gilded mason
sick current
#

Clarification?

gilded mason
#

It's the only relevant ship these days, apparently "all-powerful", has massive amounts of plot-armor, etc

sick current
#

Then the eternity will be much, much worse

gilded mason
#

I hate the implications of the Eternity as well, yeh

sick current
#

Also, people are ok with Master Chiefs plot armor, but a ship surviving for three games is not ok

#

His plot armor is much thicker than the infinity

gilded mason
#

I hate his plot amor as well

#

I want the games to move on beyond him

sick current
#

Me too

#

Trilogy is all we needed

#

I think halo 4-5 should have been about a new main character, not even a Spartan necessarily

gilded mason
#

Ye. Hell, don't even make some singular main character. Let many characters have the limelight throughout the new games

sick current
#

Like, I get it if he was lucky during training, but for a smart ai to use luck as a reason seems silly

sick current
#

What a waste

obtuse crow
#

Imagine six and chief fighting on 04 together.

sick current
hazy shadow
#

MC is the right combination of personality and blank slate for the player to write for himself. Sure, Six and the Rookie went a bit farther down one end of the spectrum but there simply wasn't room for there to be multiple Chiefs in the universe. I think Rookie should have survived for sure, but Six dying makes complete sense.

obtuse crow
#

Six could have survived if Emile didn’t do the stupid and don’t check his back.

deep coral
deep coral
obtuse crow
deep coral
obtuse crow
bronze delta
deep coral
#

how do energy shields recharge?

bronze delta
#

Cycling the suits power supply to normalize the field

bronze delta
wooden elbow
icy yoke
# deep coral how do energy shields recharge?

I wondered same thing, it's either on or off.
Star trek posits same aspect.... shields at percentage of strength.general rule, shields will absorb all incoming damage regardless of how large that damage is, but will allow a “bleed through”

#

That bleed thru causes damage

#

So when shields have to recharge, the system is basically cycling back. Regeneration of the layer. Shield also exist as a particle field likely the particles are being regenerated.

#

It's like putting up a microscopic brick wall if you can do it faster than the sledge hammer can knock it down.

#

My theory shield generator is expending energy to dissipate the weapons energy from the shields. But this creates a load on the generator that makes the process less effective, said machines need cycle time, compute cycle frequency to energy input and COOL DOWN time, and that the effectiveness drops exponentially with the increase in load, somewhat similar to the inverse square law, but the power can be less than 2 and must stay above 1. A power of 1 represents 100% efficiency.

icy yoke
# obtuse crow Maybe we see the eternity.

Eternity, has been in drydock with parts used to repair Infinity.
ANOTHER issue Is the Quantity of Forerunner tech onboard.... dies UNSC have capability to make new ones or build substitutes.
Infinity made incredible long distance slipspace jumps. Considerable distances..... does humanity possess the ability to replicate that

#

Infinity Slipspace engine was exclusively powered by salvaged Forerunner Vacuum energy collector... I doubt UNSC had technical know how or resources to build another.
However other UNSC ships escorted Infinity independently... maybe new higher speed jumps are possible without the VE unit

deep coral
obtuse crow
#

Weapons might be able to get a few hundred.

#

But the real question is.

#

Where is the Eternity?

icy yoke
#

Eternity is either in drydock or broken up for parts

#

Incomplete hulk

#

One weirdest aspects Infinity is her main weapons are off center

#

Not to mention her two guns are hundreds feet apart, in a line of sight hitting a target only one can be accurately aimed at a time

dusty ferry
#

Presumably she was being built in the same facility as the infinity itself

#

Which according to lore the sol system should probably still be occupied by the remnants of the created

obtuse crow
dusty ferry
#

So they may have done something with it

icy yoke
#

Infinity was assembled on Secret concord facility in the Oort cloud

dusty ferry
#

Who knows

#

We know the created have fallen apart

#

Somewhat

#

And we know at least some occupied worlds designed new mjolnir (Mercury helmet)

#

i want more explanation of the occupation of worlds

#

is this every UEG world

#

only some of them?

#

how are the banished doing right now

#

are they as threatening as they seem, or are they only a regional power

#

is balho okay?!?!!

#

are the created continuing to unglass places?

#

what is their policy on unemployment

terse lava
#

The Banished are pretty much a large fish in a small pond, only appearing as a major threat due to everyone else being weakened. As for Balaho, it's mentioned that, with the fall of the Created, "With the Created's control over local systems curtailed, attacks on Balaho and nearby colonies by Covenant splinters and pirates has been vastly reduced by warships built and crewed by the Unggoy, eager to free their kind and other abused minor races from slavers and raiders." Seems our favorite little gas suckers are doing alright for themselves

dusty ferry
#

Yay

#

thank you for having answers

terse lava
#

welcome

timid skiff
#

thanks for the info though, I am glad we have an insight on the Unggoys

terse lava
#

@timid skiff The part with Balaho is from the 2022 encylopedia

dusty ferry
#

I will fact check that in a few hours when I get my encyclopedia

#

I will be angry if I see that line, because I have had months to find that line

meager field
#

hi, I'm trying to avoid spoilers but just have a quick question about Mendicant Bias & Offensive Bias

#

how did Offensive Bias defeant Mendicant Bias? Aren't they both just AI programs?

orchid kettle
#

I've never been super into the forerunner part of the lore, but I think they just had a cool fleet batlle in space

#

since even if they're AIs, they can still do stuff like controls ships or command troops and whatnot

#

otherwise I think AIs fight by like, trying to outhack each other and delete the other guy's system32 folder first

timid skiff
obtuse crow
icy yoke
full crest
#

One complaint I have with Halo 2's story is the gravemind's ability to use teleportation. Like when he sends Chief and Arbiter on their merry way couldn't he also send a ton of flood as well?

obtuse crow
#

He probably could.

orchid kettle
#

Its cooler tho if you send an entire ship full of flood

bronze delta
#

The combat forms may not have been as physically resilient to direct slipspace travel, and might have fallen apart

last anchor
#

Considering that most humans report debilitating vertigo after using Forerunner teleportation? Yes.

autumn creek
#

MarkV or markV(B) yall

dusk jetty
surreal glen
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If we remember, in CE, Guilty Spark was able to teleport Master Chief and himself thanks to some crazy monitor power

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In Halo 2, Gravemind has Penitent Tangent kidnapped, so he's most likely using that monitor's power

heady geyser
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Same with Tangent

heady geyser