#Minor Pity System for boss drops

1 messages Ā· Page 9 of 1

alpine hull
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Day 1482 of telling madrona to listen to brio

sacred hare
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day 30 of saying a pity or anti bad luck system would be cool

dull linden
alpine hull
plain estuary
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Did any of the devs actually reply?

wooden tree
frank mason
plain estuary
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No? Maybe they haven't read it yet or they don't care right now

frank mason
wooden tree
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the pity system is the horse thatā€™s been beat so many times they got a new horse and beat that one too

slender grove
frank mason
dull linden
dry helm
alpine hull
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Boss rush is the pity system

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Sorry to break it to yall

final bay
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^ive been saying this

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But brio does not want to listen

charred fox
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Are you even clearing boss encounters? Or are you holding out like a tarkov d2 rat lord?

final bay
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Iā€™m lowkey just killing bosses tbh

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Too lazy for encounters

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I have bfc why do I need to do encounters

charred fox
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are you brio?

azure scarab
eternal shale
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šŸ™

north rover
azure scarab
north rover
final bay
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And I hate the pity system

eternal shale
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hey you and i are basically the same

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pretty much just the only difference is that i have both sentinel frags twice and such

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and i support the pity system

obsidian yoke
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we all support the pity system

dull linden
eternal shale
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@azure scarab i did not get a frag from my regular AS

rough swallow
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No frag, no clad even with boss rush event laser

frank mason
obsidian yoke
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we need a new fragless champion

tulip lance
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No one could ever replace him, surely

charred fox
kind steeple
eternal shale
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@azure scarab I did not get a drop from RD or my naval bosses today. Will do AC/AS later after I can use a few more gears

azure scarab
void spruce
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Bro are you fing serious?

tulip lance
torn oyster
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still hating this event and the no drop on AS since the begining (and no other drop boss as well in this event)

tulip lance
pearl plover
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this event is garbage honestly. it just made me realize having bosses spawn almost weekly is a waste of time. you get the same from them spawning daily whoch is nothing

north rover
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8000 messages and this is still going.

ornate python
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This honestly needs to be added soon into battle nations

tulip lance
eternal shale
crude elm
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Waiting for the mods to lock this chat šŸ˜‚

pearl plover
# tulip lance Fr tho

yes, its literally the same. normal weekly spawns u get nothing. daily u get .... nothing more often lol

frank mason
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10k stretch goal... Let's get it folks Salute

alpine hull
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Easy

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Brio must hit 0/100 for pity to be considered

robust ruin
dusty mural
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Brio has had his run but itā€™s clear heā€™s faltered

tulip lance
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I need my lucky number 7

frank mason
narrow frost
ornate python
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Iā€™m ok with that I just got my first frag this morning I just feel bad for those who have been beating it longer than I have with no frags

ornate python
frank mason
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In fact it seems more like MM elitism smirk

harsh mural
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no drops this boss rush

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reeeeeeeeeee

alpine hull
azure scarab
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Day 115 of asking Madrona for a pity system

alpine hull
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Day 2475 of telling madrona brio is right

elder igloo
sacred hare
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day 31 of saying a pity or anti bad luck system of literally any kind whatsoever would be cool

azure scarab
slender grove
frank mason
tulip lance
alpine hull
final bay
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My Melee is doing so much against AS despite being only r3

unkempt fjord
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The best part about this event is that now instead of being disappointed with no drop a few times a week Iā€™m disappointed a few times a day! Theyā€™ve 7xed the negative emotions I experience playing this game! Sick

tulip lance
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@unkempt fjord 0/8 and Iā€™m waiting for my 7th AS frag Sadge

barren robin
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I've been blessed with the only drop that matters, it's all I needed from boss rush

Screenshot_20260523-122118_Battle_Nations.jpg
alpine hull
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Fr 0/8 for me too

rough swallow
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Last clean of boss rush here and no clad, no frag, no worm laser

spare heron
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regretting my choices.

image.png
jagged owl
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So like

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What happens if brio gets a frag

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Do we just nuke this thread?

frank mason
plush shell
sacred hare
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its not a pity system really, its just speeding up the regular system

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that way you can do bosses and get no frags every day rather than only do bosses and get no frags every 3-8 days

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so while it is sort of like a pity in that it makes the boss killing at least consistent, it still does nothing about wether or not rng graces you

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now if the bosses respawned at consitent periods all the time rather than only for a single week that would definitely qualify as more of a "pity system" than what we currently have

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but as it stands tomorrow we go back to gambling for if a boss takes 3 days or 8 days again

plush shell
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Calling for a ā€˜minor pity systemā€™ is not the same as calling for a guaranteed drop right?

sacred hare
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the chance does not change, the only thing that changes is how many times you have rolled the dice

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or the speed at which you roll the dice in this case

plush shell
sacred hare
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you would have thrown the same number of times over a longer period of weeks without the boss rush

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is what im trying to say here

plush shell
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Thats correct yeah

sacred hare
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so being able to throw the dice 7-8 times in a week rather than 7-8 times in 7-8 weeks

plush shell
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But because you get additional attempts, that essentially increases your odds. Lets say you play for two years. Assuming 1 spawn per week, you would have roughly 104 attempts. So N=104. With this event you get 7 more attempts, so N=111. Thats by definition a better probability

plush shell
sacred hare
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thats if you had a week of the boss rush included in the weeks of non boss rush

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and by definition, probability is the average outcome over a period of time and a set of results, the purpose of a pity system is generally to prevent the outliers at the negative end of the probability graph

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as while probability can approach zero

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it can never reach zero

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there is always a non-zero chance of both getting another drop while having already gotten 100 in a row, and there is always a non zero chance of getting no drops after going 100 times in a row having gotten none

plush shell
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And going back to the essence of a ā€˜minor pity systemā€™ i would say that one way to implement this it to gradually increase player odds per frag from 3 to 4% if they havent got a frag yet over the course of lets say 30 attempts (just a suggestion, but this can be considered a minor pity system right?). This implies increased odds, similarly to the boss rush event. Therefore essentially we have the same outcome, only for everyone and not only those who got unlucky. Unless you want to aim for guaranteed drops, but thats not what i would define as a ā€˜minorā€™ pity system

sacred hare
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there seems to be some disconnect here, I am not saying that any pity system should solely benefit only those who have nothing, thats not how game systems work, a system would apply to all players reguardless of luck

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it is simply that those players who get lucky would still get lucky and therefore not reach the same pity rates as those who get unlucky

plush shell
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Pity is by definition something that is applied after a number of unsuccessful attempts

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Otherwise you are requesting increased probability in general

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Or a combination of the two

sacred hare
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did you not just say that you wanted it to be a system where each unsuccessful attempt increases the odds? I feel like we are both arguing for the same thing here arent we?

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Or at least I interpret the odds going from 3 to 4% being a form of increasing the odds based upon unsuccessful attempts

plush shell
sacred hare
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ah right the boss rush, I guess I got sidetracked from what I was probably trying to say earlier

plush shell
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So yeah we are probably arguing for the same (roughly), however with the added remark that I think boss rush is also already a placeholder for the pity system

sacred hare
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and I feel it is not an adequate placeholder as we are still returning to regular (rng timered) boss intervals, I guess im probably trying to say that bosses should have more consistent timers rather than there being the possibility to have a single boss spawn in the same time period as someone else has 3 bosses spawn or something like that

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because the rng of the boss spawn intervals feels like it can easily negate any pity effect or bonus from the boss rush

plush shell
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Yeah i hate that too. But thats another issue. No idea why its no set timer

plush shell
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I mean if you zoom out we all have the exact same probability, spawn time is just another factor to the model. But i dont think it adds anything

sacred hare
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it sure doesnt feel like everyone has the same probability when you got people with 0/70 on naval bosses and then people with 7/25 on AS and stuff

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7/25 on AS isnt a problem, but 0/70 sure is

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and I know that on an extreme long term probability graph or something

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it all evens out

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but I cant see some of the stuff being useful forever, take the AC frags for example, those are already mostly useless, and on such extreme timescales we might see powercreep and level cap increases to the point that "sure you managed to get your first AS frag after 3 years strait of fighting the boss" but by then the frag may just be... ya know... powercrept or something

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of course it all depends on how madrona goes forward with units and the potential level cap increase in the distant future

dawn nacelle
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not to mention that the hardest bosses (DN and AS) become easier once you have a boss frag of them

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so its extra painfull when you are in the 0/30

dusty mural
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@azure scarab join us

IMG_0860.png
torn oyster
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and another day without frag

soft jewel
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Every week madrona should give the person with the most attemps without a drop a free boss drop

tulip lance
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My 0 drop prophecy came true

alpine hull
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Same

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I'm blowing up the planet

pure ivy
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just barely avoided the 0-35 club (ironclad)

green sun
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I hope - genuinely

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That this was a combat data collection event and that they use this as justification.

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To just crank up boss drop rates or make bosses have a pity.

white turret
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Iā€™m in the 0-40 club now

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Apparently itā€™s less than a 10% chance for that statistically so Iā€™m just really lucky

eternal shale
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Me too!

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@azure scarab I did not get a drop this entire boss rush

wintry garden
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0/27 with AS, I am now in the bottom 20%

alpine hull
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Brio is right

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There should be pity I haven't gotten shi

quasi pond
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Problem is that even going 0/40 really isnā€™t that unlucky

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Like, weā€™ve all hit that 1/xxxx odd before

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Much less a 1/10

wooden tree
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its less about luck and more about player experience. when some of the best units in the game are locked behind an artificial wall of RNG it feels terrible and nobody likes that

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nobody cares about not having a Sinister frag. the drop rate is lower than AS frags but its impact on the game is nonexistent

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Pity only helps players on the VERY low end who end up with no drops, people with exceptional RNG are already getting an insane amount of drops regardless of a pity system existing or not

wintry garden
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Also about time

Bosses take long enough to spawn that bad luck hits significantly harder

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Iā€™m now over 4 months without an AS frag

That couldā€™ve easily been 5, 5 and 1/2 months if it werenā€™t for boss rush

wooden tree
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Its different from like MMO drops where you can farm a boss/dungeon as you please, youre limited to when the boss spawns and thats it

pine birch
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gambling is bad?

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cmonnn

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lets be real here

alpine hull
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Yea AS frags need to be toned down a bit in general IMO cause frags are as good as the nomad rn which is scheduled for a need

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Nerf

final bay
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Tbh just set the respawn timer to strictly 3 days no

wooden tree
final bay
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Not really

alpine hull
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It's 5.6/100

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100 runs is like 2 years

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So even w 3 days it's like what 10 months

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Still like 2 strikes where ur account is deadass weaker cause u got unlucky

wooden tree
final bay
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Yeah 10 months ainā€™t a lot bruh

alpine hull
alpine hull
wooden tree
final bay
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Actually nah u can grow a whole baby in 10 months

wooden tree
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i think your perception of time is messed up SAD

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10 months for ONE unit is atrocious

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A CHANCE at ONE unit

final bay
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Idk bro I played same game for like 10 years

wooden tree
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not even guaranteed

alpine hull
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Nah just get 4 šŸ‘

sturdy creek
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As someone who has nearly 1500 hours in new world (rip) I love how they did their trophy mat drop system, wish it was in more games that are so RNG heavy with certain drops

final bay
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I just be like that

wooden tree
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good for you but has nothing to do with pity system

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also you have 0 guarantee to get a drop in 10 years

final bay
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Such is life

alpine hull
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I mean low-key should be a quest line where u get a melee from killing AS let's say 20 times imo

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Helps w clears

wooden tree
# final bay Such is life

atrocious system when the idea of video games is to have fun. Nobody is here to be told "such is life" when were debating mechanics that make the player experience better

final bay
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Lmao ainā€™t nobody was complaining abt ts 9 years ago

alpine hull
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Yea even as a fragger I think there should be 1 guaranteed one

alpine hull
final bay
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Bc there was enough broken units u didnā€™t even needed frags šŸ˜‚

wooden tree
alpine hull
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Yea the game was even more P2W than it is now which is crazy

wooden tree
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you basically got a paid AS frag on every promo drop

final bay
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And I loved them šŸ˜‚

alpine hull
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And some boss strike rewards were nuts

wooden tree
alpine hull
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Boars are unironically as good as AS frags

wooden tree
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only boar is really game changing

final bay
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Yeah

alpine hull
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So it was a flow of units coming into ones account

wooden tree
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none of the rewards were actually good though

alpine hull
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Ehh

wooden tree
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some were ok or serviceable

final bay
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Nah I liked apex infected

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They were jolly good

alpine hull
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Alot of the rewards were usable

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Which lead to people just being happy getting stuff

wooden tree
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im talking from a meta perspective

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i like cool units too even if i dont use them

alpine hull
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Current BN progression is hard cause it actually just feels like getting drops is the progression

wooden tree
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but like realistically theyll never get used cause they dont have any value

final bay
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Nuh uh

alpine hull
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Old BN you would get a few new units every month

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Rn the only new unit to get is the 3% from a boss

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Every week

final bay
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The real value is the friends and memories we made lt_morgan

wooden tree
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like people dont complain about sinisters even though the drop rate is lower, because it doesnt matter if you have it or not

alpine hull
wooden tree
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people truly only complain about AS frags because theyre so good. (ironclads now too just because ranking m10s is ass)

alpine hull
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Tbf tho frags aren't worth much rn

wooden tree
alpine hull
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Just will be in future

wooden tree
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disagree, the QOL they bring is more than enough to warrant their status

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melee frag makes AS easy mode even are R1

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ranged frags does the same for farming

alpine hull
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Ranged is relative to heavies rn at 60+ and yea I think there should be a guaranted way to get a melee so people with sub par clears can clear it easier

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Melees + ranged are also relative to nomads for new haven farming

brisk flume
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Skylia got more than 10 ac frags

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We meet again

barren robin
final bay
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I have 2 of each

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The ac frag

alpine hull
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I have 3 Dexter 1 sinister

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Same amount of AS and AC frags

sturdy creek
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I have zero AS frags Sadge

tulip lance
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Also youā€™re in MM now?

wooden tree
teal olive
# wooden tree i joined a couple days ago

Wait, whyā€™d you leave cause werenā€™t you leadership? Probably the wrong place to ask this, lol, so need to answer if you canā€™t or donā€™t want to

frank mason
teal olive
spare heron
wooden tree
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I wanted to do more so i joined MM. HSC is still a goated guild and they got a great group, nothing drama related just personal preference

tired sable
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@azure scarab

image.png
teal olive
pseudo trellis
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I ... had 0 drops the whole event ... sigh

teal olive
pine birch
azure scarab
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I give up

pine birch
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NOOOO

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boss rush has broken him

azure scarab
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The crusade is lost

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Its all over

frank mason
torn oyster
frank mason
azure scarab
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I was here for months

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It doesnt matter anymore Sadge

frank mason
tulip lance
plain smelt
#

Us brokies gotta rally for brio

pseudo trellis
plain smelt
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Day 1 of asking Madrona for a pity system

north rover
azure scarab
#

you will do well joebob Salute

brisk flume
spare heron
wooden tree
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@azure scarab you canā€™t give up!!

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Youā€™re the last stand against the anti pity system and fraggers

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without you, what will they have?

plain smelt
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Now Iā€™m never gonna get a frag Sadge

pure ivy
calm pebble
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@azure scarab you canā€™t give up

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whoā€™s gonna slander my name now

pure ivy
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the imperium has fallen

azure scarab
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what you're seeing right now is my final moments

sacred hare
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day 32 of saying a pity or anti bad luck system would be cool

plain smelt
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@fleet jackal what did you do to brio

IMG_0629.png
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Iā€™m gonna sue

eternal shale
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Day 1 of asking madrona for a pity system in memory of brio

plain smelt
#

The pity system will now be referred to Brioā€™s Law

shrewd iron
tired sable
#

He gets to stop playing BN

north rover
#

he won't be able to stay away forever

tulip lance
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@azure scarab Iā€™m sorry I failed you

final bay
dull linden
plain smelt
elder igloo
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Most normal players I've seen have 1-2 fragments with most just having a melee

wooden tree
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time has nothing to do with your chances to get a drop

elder igloo
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I am a STERN advocate for a first drop pity system

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I think it'd be perfect

wooden tree
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i agree with that too

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1 deop on your first kill then random chance after

elder igloo
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IVE BEEN SAYING THIS

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Beating a boss is a huge milestone for players in this game, at least it should be

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I think beating the mission version of a boss should drop their frags, then leave it to chance

spare heron
elder igloo
alpine hull
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I think it should be guaranteed melee

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Helps people with future clears alot

frosty dirge
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Itā€™s done after 35 clear

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Now 100 more for melee

alpine hull
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Brio is right

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Down with your dirty drop getters

tulip lance
wooden tree
alpine hull
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F2p goliath formation needs to happen

tulip lance
obsidian yoke
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If the fragless got a first drop pity system theyā€™d just be like me (which is awesome)

pure ivy
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šŸ˜­

north rover
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probably his last 98 bosses

alpine hull
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day 1 F2P goliath

barren robin
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Don't worry Brio, the real frags were the Opps we made along the way

kind steeple
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Half

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Iā€™m at 36 kills today

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And the odd of the next kill giving me a drop isnā€™t 89%

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Itā€™s still 5.91%

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even though statistically, there was a 90% chance I would get atleast one drop in the 36 kills so far

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on the other hand: there are people who get both drops in a single fight. Thatā€™s a 0.09% chance - the same statistical likelihood as going about 115 fights without ever seeing a frag.

And guess what? 115 fights without a frag can be over 2 years if you get unlucky and average a week per fight

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So if you want to do it by just simple probability maths: for every person who has gotten a double drop, thereā€™s going to be 1 person who goes, at minimum, an year without a drop. (115 * 3 days =345 days = 345 days)

If you put in the average respawn timer of 5.5 days instead, thatā€™s still a year and 9 months to get one drop where people got 2 in a single fight

pure ivy
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I wish people would just be honest about what they thought was a reasonable rate at which people should get frags

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that would be a good anchor point to base discussions around

kind steeple
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Thereā€™s no rate thatā€™s ā€œacceptableā€ without pity

pure ivy
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"Youre unlikely to be that unlucky" is a statistically sound but impractical response to a thread requesting reprieve for... being unlucky

pure ivy
kind steeple
#

thatā€™s exactly it

kind steeple
pure ivy
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(not the average rate at which people get a frag- that is already well established in game by the drop rates)

kind steeple
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Also for the record getting 5 flags in 15 attempts - WHICH HAS HAPPENED - is 0.16%

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Thatā€™s the same as 105 kills without a drop

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anyway imo you should get 1 set of drops guaranteed on the story kill, then the rest should be upto luck

pure ivy
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yeah

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I think that's an acceptable way to have a system where beating the boss guarantees that you get the nice "toys" to play with as a reward for your effort

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a lot of other games operate like that as well

leaden scarab
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1/32 AS

image.png
pure ivy
#

congrats!

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šŸ„³

pure ivy
tulip lance
alpine hull
dawn nacelle
#

i have a guidlmate at 0/50 drop for AS this poor guy

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i'm only at 0/11

wooden tree
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im like 100% sure 50 AS kills isnt even possible at this point

dawn nacelle
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that is what he said though

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but yeah he probably exagerated a bit

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but i can guarantee that he is in the 40 kills without drop

obsidian yoke
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I think @kind steeple is the most documented kills rn

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35 or 36 or sth

dawn nacelle
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but yeah i think my guildmate is a bit overdramatic still killing 40 AS without drop is diabolical

image.png
frank mason
robust ruin
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I am at 30

trail burrow
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Btw Impossible to get more than 50 Kills on AS. And thats considering you getting a 3 Day spawn timer for each one

frank mason
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Yep. Those guys are just really bad at counting

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Kinda like the people who said they killed over 100 ACs

robust ruin
trail burrow
#

Its been 125 days since AC came out which means 41 if you managed to hit every timer at 3 days, plus the seven we just got and the 2 that was stacked since there was the mission AS plus the one spawned behind it

frank mason
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40 AS is possible but 50-60 is pure hallucinations

trail burrow
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Technically yes Owl but you'd need to hit 4 day spawns

astral crypt
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Itā€™s only been 125 days since AS was first available to kill. Please expose this redacted user šŸ˜­

obsidian yoke
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I started 18 days late but I have caught up in numbers with some of the day 1s

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But yeah Iā€™d say upper 30s is likely the max for day 1s

trail burrow
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Im at 30 so I assume most are within 4 of me if you were from day 1

frank mason
obsidian yoke
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Iā€™m at 30 so Iā€™m a day 1 impostor

frank mason
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Or maybe EMP just openly admitted to cheating šŸ¤£

main current
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Agree. Especially when it comes to the boss rush week, I have seen many players got 0 drops and experienced greater disappointment and frustration than ever. I believe adding such system can help keep players being positive about the game.

green sun
kind steeple
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Iā€™m likely one of the luckier ones

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And I killed #36 and #37

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Today

kind steeple
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Because I have ss for a pretty decent number of kills after a point

dawn nacelle
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yesterday

kind steeple
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Iā€™m very doubtful of anyone who goes from 40 to 50-60 in the span of a few min lol

dawn nacelle
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its not the same person

kind steeple
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Ah

dawn nacelle
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i just dont want to expose my guildmate lol in the second screenshot

obsidian yoke
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40 is close to the theoretical maximum and highly unlikely already

eternal shale
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Day 2 of asking madrona for a pity system in honor of brio

pearl plover
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Yeh this event was garbage honestly. Defeated all bosses all week and no drop at all . Any single one. What wqs special about this event? Gettong nothing daily? Bruh

eternal shale
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I too did not get a drop during the event

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However, it was useful to get a lot of t3 resources which was nice

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Someone in this thread yesterday had a take that I really like, Iā€™ll find it and forward it here

eternal shale
pearl plover
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Imo if this replaced boss strike while pvp is out. Its really inderwhelming. At leats in boss strike you get units. Yes we got t3 resources but for what? If the most op units moving forward are basically AS frag and iron clad in naval

pearl plover
leaden scarab
#

ironclad is much closer to a TK than a generalist like AS frags

eternal shale
#

I agree that itā€™s demoralizing and spotlights the issues of leaving everything up to probability

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And I do think there needs to be something in place to at least help with the first drop

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Also lvl 65 has a really strong unit in portable electric fence

pearl plover
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What i dont like now is I dont get the reasoning behind weekly spawns. Its absurd. As daily is literally the same thing Make th spanw more often so at least there is something to do

eternal shale
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The variance also sucks

pearl plover
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Also, imagine pvp against lucky timmy with 3 -5 AS fragsā€¦ lol and people where worried this became rich get richer and poor poorer resource_skull2x resource_skull2x resource_skull2x resource_skull2x

astral crypt
obsidian yoke
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Tbh the fragless were expecting 7 days of disappointment, and those who did receive the 7 day of disappointment feels way worse when it actually happens (and when others get their drops)

pearl plover
pearl plover
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Dont bother responding bro ill not engage anymore

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I see u typing

astral crypt
obsidian yoke
#

Itā€™s not broken, but it precisely explains why there needs to be a pity system to protect the experience of the outlier group

eternal shale
#

if any donor wants to confirm it was on may 7

young swan
#

the guy everyone hates

image.png
#

but hey now i have a surplus of teeth cuz this massive red worm

plain smelt
void spruce
#

I got nothingā€¦. Not one drop from the boss rush event

eternal shale
#

šŸ¤

leaden scarab
void spruce
#

I mean it was fun at least :3

alpine hull
#

Death

rich trail
#

Brio nooo you can't give up

alpine hull
#

Why no

sacred hare
#

day 33 of saying a pity or anti bad luck system would be cool

jagged owl
#

Alex, you've broken brio

#

Are you happy nowSadge

alpine hull
#

Day 5000 of telling madrona to give brio what he wants

low swallow
#

THE FRAG-HAVERS HAVE WON

#

BRIO IS A FRAUD

prime whale
#

whats even more amazing odds is how brio started this thread AND he was the one to still not get a frag this event

eternal shale
#

fact check: brio did NOT start this thread

#

psychocat did

#

also brio is NOT the only who did not get a drop this event

#

wouldnt be surprised if hes not the only one who has yet to get one (of those at the point of clearing AS, ofc new players wont have drops yet)

calm pebble
#

brio the legend has been cooking everyone without any AS frags, i wonder how will he do once he acquires one?

#

the lore will continue later on~ brought to you by tortas

alpine hull
#

A fragger of the highest caliber wanted pity

#

It really is full circle isn't it

obsidian yoke
#

tbh everyone is more or less for the pity system

Brio derailed it and turned it into him vs fraggers

Im glad we can move on back to the topic

alpine hull
#

i mean its a good mechanic

#

although i rather have questline that guarentees vs pity but pity is prob way easier

teal olive
#

I am shocked by how many comments there are on here now, weā€™re reaching 10k ā˜ ļø

wooden tree
#

this thread is over 8 thousand messages and every point has been brought up 10 times over already. at this point we just chat in here to see how many comments we can get

#

itā€™s really just up to madrona at this point to implement a system or not

obsidian yoke
#

tbh yeah what needs to be said has been said

#

its just keeping this alive

proper niche
#

I dont think anyone with frags needs a pity system imo. But all the lower ranked newbies need it for sure

alpine hull
#

Nah pity system but only for people with frage

#

Gotta earn your first one

obsidian yoke
barren robin
pseudo trellis
rough swallow
#

AS KO, same result than during boss rush : no drop

manic adder
#

Day whatever it is of asking Madrona for a pity system for Brio

#

My goat cannot be forgotten

#

Even if he gets a frag at some point, he's still always going to be the face of the pity system

eternal shale
#

Day 3 of asking madrona for a pity system in honor of Brio

plain smelt
#

I already ruined my 1 day streak

eternal shale
#

idk how long until i ruin my streak but i wont get over 100 like my hero brio

plain smelt
#

Day 1 of asking madrona for a pity system

simple escarp
#

wheres @azure scarab

harsh mural
unkempt fjord
# wooden tree itā€™s really just up to madrona at this point to implement a system or not

Madrona is sadistic and wants their fans to suffer for some reason. Itā€™s why they disabled SP boosts for so long too. Allegedly 3% drop rate yet people have 100+ wins with no drops and other people have 20+. You might be thinking thatā€™s just normal standard deviations, but I can assure you itā€™s not. Madrona has disabled boss drops for certain people for some reason. Canā€™t figure that part out maybe they just get off to it idk. But thatā€™s why they wonā€™t implement a pity system. They donā€™t want everyone to have these units. Same reason they had the snake be the reward for bs1 when it was impossible to see if your guild was truly active or not

vale ledge
#

Calling the devs sadistic sure is a take of all time

dull linden
obsidian yoke
#

only sadistic ppl play this game

royal swallow
#

Also there's no physical way even with boss rush that anyone can get 100+ wins right now

#

Assuming you got really lucky and it spawned every 3 days you'd only have 1 (The initial spawn) + 32 spawns (every 3 days) + 7 (Boss Rush) for a max attempt of 40 runs, and that's if you're lucky

warm echo
#

Madrona is sadistic and wants their fans to suffer for some reason. Itā€™s why they disabled SP boosts for so long too. Allegedly 3% drop rate yet people have 100+ wins with no drops and other people have 20+. You might be thinking thatā€™s just normal standard deviations, but I can assure you itā€™s not. Madrona has disabled boss drops for certain people for some reason. Canā€™t figure that part out maybe they just get off to it idk. But thatā€™s why they wonā€™t implement a pity system. They donā€™t want everyone to have these units. Same reason they had the snake be the reward for bs1 when it was impossible to see if your guild was truly active or not

small geode
eternal shale
#

Madrona is sadistic and wants their fans to suffer for some reason. Itā€™s why they disabled SP boosts for so long too. Allegedly 3% drop rate yet people have 100+ wins with no drops and other people have 20+. You might be thinking thatā€™s just normal standard deviations, but I can assure you itā€™s not. Madrona has disabled boss drops for certain people for some reason. Canā€™t figure that part out maybe they just get off to it idk. But thatā€™s why they wonā€™t implement a pity system. They donā€™t want everyone to have these units. Same reason they had the snake be the reward for bs1 when it was impossible to see if your guild was truly active or not

dusk tusk
north rover
obsidian yoke
#

Madrona is sadistic and wants their fans to suffer for some reason. Itā€™s why they disabled SP boosts for so long too. Allegedly 3% drop rate yet people have 100+ wins with no drops and other people have 20+. You might be thinking thatā€™s just normal standard deviations, but I can assure you itā€™s not. Madrona has disabled boss drops for certain people for some reason. Canā€™t figure that part out maybe they just get off to it idk. But thatā€™s why they wonā€™t implement a pity system. They donā€™t want everyone to have these units. Same reason they had the snake be the reward for bs1 when it was impossible to see if your guild was truly active or not

dusk tusk
#

Well spamming this wont help, but u guys do u

unkempt fjord
dusk tusk
small geode
#

Delete the game peepo_salutking
Leave the server Shrug

wintry garden
tulip lance
dull linden
alpine hull
#

@azure scarab where's you daily

wooden tree
dusk tusk
dull linden
forest remnant
dusk tusk
forest remnant
#

skill issue clueless

brisk flume
dusk tusk
wet rivet
sacred hare
#

day 34 of saying a pity or anti bad luck system would be cool

final bay
#

Real

dull linden
# unkempt fjord Madrona is sadistic and wants their fans to suffer for some reason. Itā€™s why the...

Madrona is sadistic and wants their fans to suffer for some reason. Itā€™s why they disabled SP boosts for so long too. Allegedly 3% drop rate yet people have 100+ wins with no drops and other people have 20+. You might be thinking thatā€™s just normal standard deviations, but I can assure you itā€™s not. Madrona has disabled boss drops for certain people for some reason. Canā€™t figure that part out maybe they just get off to it idk. But thatā€™s why they wonā€™t implement a pity system. They donā€™t want everyone to have these units. Same reason they had the snake be the reward for bs1 when it was impossible to see if your guild was truly active or not

ornate python
#

Madrona is sadistic and wants their fans to suffer for some reason. Itā€™s why they disabled SP boosts for so long too. Allegedly 3% drop rate yet people have 100+ wins with no drops and other people have 20+. You might be thinking thatā€™s just normal standard deviations, but I can assure you itā€™s not. Madrona has disabled boss drops for certain people for some reason. Canā€™t figure that part out maybe they just get off to it idk. But thatā€™s why they wonā€™t implement a pity system. They donā€™t want everyone to have these units. Same reason they had the snake be the reward for bs1 when it was impossible to see if your guild was truly active or not

eternal shale
#

Madrona is sadistic and wants their fans to suffer for some reason. Itā€™s why they disabled SP boosts for so long too. Allegedly 3% drop rate yet people have 100+ wins with no drops and other people have 20+. You might be thinking thatā€™s just normal standard deviations, but I can assure you itā€™s not. Madrona has disabled boss drops for certain people for some reason. Canā€™t figure that part out maybe they just get off to it idk. But thatā€™s why they wonā€™t implement a pity system. They donā€™t want everyone to have these units. Same reason they had the snake be the reward for bs1 when it was impossible to see if your guild was truly active or not

alpine hull
#

Madrona is sadistic and wants their fans to suffer for some reason. Itā€™s why they disabled SP boosts for so long too. Allegedly 3% drop rate yet people have 100+ wins with no drops and other people have 20+. You might be thinking thatā€™s just normal standard deviations, but I can assure you itā€™s not. Madrona has disabled boss drops for certain people for some reason. Canā€™t figure that part out maybe they just get off to it idk. But thatā€™s why they wonā€™t implement a pity system. They donā€™t want everyone to have these units. Same reason they had the snake be the reward for bs1 when it was impossible to see if your guild was truly active or not

pure ivy
#

Madrona is sadistic and wants their fans to suffer for some reason. Itā€™s why they disabled SP boosts for so long too. Allegedly 3% drop rate yet people have 100+ wins with no drops and other people have 20+. You might be thinking thatā€™s just normal standard deviations, but I can assure you itā€™s not. Madrona has disabled boss drops for certain people for some reason. Canā€™t figure that part out maybe they just get off to it idk. But thatā€™s why they wonā€™t implement a pity system. They donā€™t want everyone to have these units. Same reason they had the snake be the reward for bs1 when it was impossible to see if your guild was truly active or not

pseudo trellis
wooden tree
#

Madrona is sadistic and wants their fans to suffer for some reason. Itā€™s why they disabled SP boosts for so long too. Allegedly 3% drop rate yet people have 100+ wins with no drops and other people have 20+. You might be thinking thatā€™s just normal standard deviations, but I can assure you itā€™s not. Madrona has disabled boss drops for certain people for some reason. Canā€™t figure that part out maybe they just get off to it idk. But thatā€™s why they wonā€™t implement a pity system. They donā€™t want everyone to have these units. Same reason they had the snake be the reward for bs1 when it was impossible to see if your guild was truly active or not

dull linden
#

copypasta

#

Dang that didnt work

#

Madrona is sadistic and wants their fans to suffer for some reason. Itā€™s why they disabled SP boosts for so long too. Allegedly 3% drop rate yet people have 100+ wins with no drops and other people have 20+. You might be thinking thatā€™s just normal standard deviations, but I can assure you itā€™s not. Madrona has disabled boss drops for certain people for some reason. Canā€™t figure that part out maybe they just get off to it idk. But thatā€™s why they wonā€™t implement a pity system. They donā€™t want everyone to have these units. Same reason they had the snake be the reward for bs1 when it was impossible to see if your guild was truly active or not

lyric monolith
#

Whole ass week of non-stop boss spawning and all I got was this lousy ass Sinister Frag.

The system is actually borked.

eternal shale
#

oh no i "only" got the rarest drop in the game!

lyric monolith
#

I have 2 of them and they're meaningless.

#

Ain't a collect-a-thon you can kill the AS 3 billion times but some loser will have 10 frags for some reason despite having the personality of a rock with a face drawn on it.

glass stone
#

The pity system's lore deepens

tulip lance
#

N. I sweat stop spamming so we donā€™t get this suggestion restricted

void lava
#

Id be interested to see where they have the proof of that copypasta lol

#

On a side note. Wonder how many people pulled the golden frag from experiment boss

north rover
#

It's not a golden frag, it's just a standard frag

lyric monolith
#

The Golden Frag despite existing and having player controlled anims isn't obtainable

#

and never has been.

kind steeple
#

Madrona is sadistic and wants their fans to suffer for some reason. Itā€™s why they disabled SP boosts for so long too. Allegedly 3% drop rate yet people have 100+ wins with no drops and other people have 20+. You might be thinking thatā€™s just normal standard deviations, but I can assure you itā€™s not. Madrona has disabled boss drops for certain people for some reason. Canā€™t figure that part out maybe they just get off to it idk. But thatā€™s why they wonā€™t implement a pity system. They donā€™t want everyone to have these units. Same reason they had the snake be the reward for bs1 when it was impossible to see if your guild was truly active or not

royal zealot
dusk tusk
# royal zealot hey ive thought that if everyone who wanted pity system stopped subbing/ buying ...

Well, thats the easiest way to bring change. There are so many instances where voting with your wallet have fixed these kind of things. I am not going to promote a game, where this kind of broken rng system is in place. I have done the same, will urge others to do the same. I know the battle nations devs are much better then the industry norm. But still instead of making a big hoop la, we should just stop the pateron and buying nanos until a btter system is in place.

Actions speak louder than words

frank mason
#

Don't let this distract you from the fact that Madrona is sadistic and wants their fans to suffer for some reason. Itā€™s why they disabled SP boosts for so long too. Allegedly 3% drop rate yet people have 100+ wins with no drops and other people have 20+. You might be thinking thatā€™s just normal standard deviations, but I can assure you itā€™s not. Madrona has disabled boss drops for certain people for some reason. Canā€™t figure that part out maybe they just get off to it idk. But thatā€™s why they wonā€™t implement a pity system. They donā€™t want everyone to have these units. Same reason they had the snake be the reward for bs1 when it was impossible to see if your guild was truly active or not

astral crypt
#

Dont let this distract you from the fact that DrWhere and Yugami were for sure paying. The two biggest whales in the game with 200 and 201 super tanks respectively. MaxSally may have been paying too given that the three of them simultaneously made massive jumps by hundreds of thousands points on the leaderboard

wooden tree
#

Dont let this distract you from the fact that DrWhere and Yugami were for sure paying. The two biggest whales in the game with 200 and 201 super tanks respectively. MaxSally may have been paying too given that the three of them simultaneously made massive jumps by hundreds of thousands points on the leaderboard

plain smelt
#

Day 2 madrona pity

rain roost
royal swallow
frank mason
royal swallow
#

You know what the heck I mean LOL

final bay
#

Madrona is sadistic and wants their fans to suffer for some reason. Itā€™s why they disabled SP boosts for so long too. Allegedly 3% drop rate yet people have 100+ wins with no drops and other people have 20+. You might be thinking thatā€™s just normal standard deviations, but I can assure you itā€™s not. Madrona has disabled boss drops for certain people for some reason. Canā€™t figure that part out maybe they just get off to it idk. But thatā€™s why they wonā€™t implement a pity system. They donā€™t want everyone to have these units. Same reason they had the snake be the reward for bs1 when it was impossible to see if your guild was truly active or not

quasi pond
#

Can concur, I have an inside man in Madrona.

#

There is an extremely secret file inside with a list of banned seeds

eternal shale
#

Day 4 of asking madrona for a pity system in honor of Brio

plain estuary
#

Madrona is sadistic and wants their fans to suffer for some reason. Itā€™s why they disabled SP boosts for so long too. Allegedly 3% drop rate yet people have 100+ wins with no drops and other people have 20+. You might be thinking thatā€™s just normal standard deviations, but I can assure you itā€™s not. Madrona has disabled boss drops for certain people for some reason. Canā€™t figure that part out maybe they just get off to it idk. But thatā€™s why they wonā€™t implement a pity system. They donā€™t want everyone to have these units. Same reason they had the snake be the reward for bs1 when it was impossible to see if your guild was truly active or not

dull linden
#

Don't let this distract you from the fact that Madrona is sadistic and wants their fans to suffer for some reason. Itā€™s why they disabled SP boosts for so long too. Allegedly 3% drop rate yet people have 100+ wins with no drops and other people have 20+. You might be thinking thatā€™s just normal standard deviations, but I can assure you itā€™s not. Madrona has disabled boss drops for certain people for some reason. Canā€™t figure that part out maybe they just get off to it idk. But thatā€™s why they wonā€™t implement a pity system. They donā€™t want everyone to have these units. Same reason they had the snake be the reward for bs1 when it was impossible to see if your guild was truly active or not

frosty dirge
#

Madrona is sadistic and wants their fans to suffer for some reason. Itā€™s why they disabled SP boosts for so long too. Allegedly 3% drop rate yet people have 100+ wins with no drops and other people have 20+. You might be thinking thatā€™s just normal standard deviations, but I can assure you itā€™s not. Madrona has disabled boss drops for certain people for some reason. Canā€™t figure that part out maybe they just get off to it idk. But thatā€™s why they wonā€™t implement a pity system. They donā€™t want everyone to have these units. Same reason they had the snake be the reward for bs1 when it was impossible to see if your guild was truly active or not

prime whale
#

Day 2 of Madrona is sadistic and wants their fans to suffer for some reason. Itā€™s why they disabled SP boosts for so long too. Allegedly 3% drop rate yet people have 100+ wins with no drops and other people have 20+. You might be thinking thatā€™s just normal standard deviations, but I can assure you itā€™s not. Madrona has disabled boss drops for certain people for some reason. Canā€™t figure that part out maybe they just get off to it idk. But thatā€™s why they wonā€™t implement a pity system. They donā€™t want everyone to have these units. Same reason they had the snake be the reward for bs1 when it was impossible to see if your guild was truly active or not

barren robin
# eternal shale Day 4 of asking madrona for a pity system in honor of Brio

Why do you think that'll happen considering Madrona is sadistic and wants their fans to suffer for some reason. Itā€™s why they disabled SP boosts for so long too. Allegedly 3% drop rate yet people have 100+ wins with no drops and other people have 20+. You might be thinking thatā€™s just normal standard deviations, but I can assure you itā€™s not. Madrona has disabled boss drops for certain people for some reason. Canā€™t figure that part out maybe they just get off to it idk. But thatā€™s why they wonā€™t implement a pity system. They donā€™t want everyone to have these units. Same reason they had the snake be the reward for bs1 when it was impossible to see if your guild was truly active or not

#

This is like Arkham Asylum all over again, 1 year without a pity system

vale meteor
#

It is funny to see the wild variance in boss drops for people.

#

No AS frags, but 9 Ironclads. The system is crazy whack but it just has to be some weird luck. (Or non-luck for those very unfortunate souls.)

#

I also agree it would be nice to reimplement the SP boosts in the store.

dull linden
vale meteor
#

They gatekeeping that stuff for so long, but these boost weekends should be clear that the in-game system should make it clear it's able to handle them.

frosty dirge
#

About time for guild boost

vale meteor
#

And navy grind is driving me to sadness.

frosty dirge
#

Is there a reason guild boost still not implemented yet

#

Or itā€™s the same excuse (player going faster than we thought)

dull linden
obsidian yoke
#

Madrona is sadistic is Madrona is sadistic is Madrona. Madrona wants their fans to suffer suffer suffer suffer sadistic suffer for some sadistic reason. Itā€™s why they disabled sadistic boosts for so long too. Allegedly 3% boost rate yet people have 100+ sp with no Madronas and other people have 20+. You might be thinking thatā€™s just normal sadistic deviations, but I can assure you itā€™s not. Madrona has disabled Madrona drops for Madrona people for sadistic reasons. Canā€™t figure that part out maybe they just get off to it idk. But thatā€™s why they wonā€™t implement a suffer system. They donā€™t want everyone to suffer for sadistic reasons. Same reason they had the snake be the reward for bs1 when it was impossible to see if your guild was Madrona or sadistic.

wooden elbow
#

Madrona is sadistic is Madrona is sadistic is Madrona. Madrona wants their fans to suffer suffer suffer suffer sadistic suffer for some sadistic reason. Itā€™s why they disabled sadistic boosts for so long too. Allegedly 3% boost rate yet people have 100+ sp with no Madronas and other people have 20+. You might be thinking thatā€™s just normal sadistic deviations, but I can assure you itā€™s not. Madrona has disabled Madrona drops for Madrona people for sadistic reasons. Canā€™t figure that part out maybe they just get off to it idk. But thatā€™s why they wonā€™t implement a suffer system. They donā€™t want everyone to suffer for sadistic reasons. Same reason they had the snake be the reward for bs1 when it was impossible to see if your guild was Madrona or sadistic.

#

we're all gonna get muted lmao

pure ivy
#

this thread should have been closed a couple of months ago, to me it seems like its being left open so that everyone can put their discussions (and trolling, lol) regarding the pity system in here instead of spreading it across like 50 different suggestions

wooden elbow
#

I mean it's genuine feedback a big part of the community cares about. I'd assume the trolling only started because theres little reaction by the devs. Tho I can understand why they won't yet

unkempt fjord
wooden elbow
#

Saying no outright sucks, saying yes without having a system ready sucks

royal swallow
pure ivy
#

šŸ’€

unkempt fjord
#

Oh true

#

I meant warlord lol

royal swallow
#

bruh

unkempt fjord
#

Point stands

royal swallow
#

That's a way different point

wooden elbow
#

lmaooo

unkempt fjord
#

Is it? Pray tell

royal swallow
#

Spacing out stuff over months vs paying for 300 all at once is different

wooden elbow
#

way different

unkempt fjord
#

Yes obviously the amount is different, how is the point different?

#

Also bought more nanos on top of that, doesnā€™t change the point at all

pure ivy
#

this conversation is exactly why this thread should be shut down lmfao, what is this šŸ˜­

royal swallow
#

It's kinda like renting an apartment vs buying it outright, usually more invested people buy it outright instead of spacing it out

wooden elbow
unkempt fjord
#

Ah yes, thatā€™s a great analogy. Buying vs renting an apartment, lmao

#

This thread is real feedback on why Madrona is losing $ and how they can amend the situation but they donā€™t care to

royal swallow
#

Well don't let this distract you from the fact that Madrona is sadistic and wants their fans to suffer for some reason. Itā€™s why they disabled SP boosts for so long too. Allegedly 3% drop rate yet people have 100+ wins with no drops and other people have 20+. You might be thinking thatā€™s just normal standard deviations, but I can assure you itā€™s not. Madrona has disabled boss drops for certain people for some reason. Canā€™t figure that part out maybe they just get off to it idk. But thatā€™s why they wonā€™t implement a pity system. They donā€™t want everyone to have these units. Same reason they had the snake be the reward for bs1 when it was impossible to see if your guild was truly active or not

wooden elbow
#

this thread is for a boss drop pity system. Not about why you don't have a mammoth badge. Sub to mammoth tier, get badge, simple.

unkempt fjord
#

Uh yeah?

#

Wasnā€™t confused about that lol

wooden elbow
#

Or don't, honestly 300 is a lot of money for a single month.

unkempt fjord
#

Thought this thread was about how the difference between warlord tier and mammoth tier is actually the difference between renting and buying an apt lol

wooden tree
# unkempt fjord Thought this thread was about how the difference between warlord tier and mammot...

Madrona is sadistic is Madrona is sadistic is Madrona. Madrona wants their fans to suffer suffer suffer suffer sadistic suffer for some sadistic reason. Itā€™s why they disabled sadistic boosts for so long too. Allegedly 3% boost rate yet people have 100+ sp with no Madronas and other people have 20+. You might be thinking thatā€™s just normal sadistic deviations, but I can assure you itā€™s not. Madrona has disabled Madrona drops for Madrona people for sadistic reasons. Canā€™t figure that part out maybe they just get off to it idk. But thatā€™s why they wonā€™t implement a suffer system. They donā€™t want everyone to suffer for sadistic reasons. Same reason they had the snake be the reward for bs1 when it was impossible to see if your guild was Madrona or sadistic.

wooden tree
#

itā€™s fun to break the suggestion rules for just this one thread to stay alive

wooden elbow
#

Ig they still do read the messages in some way... if they'd be completely opposed to it, it would have been shut down alr

wooden tree
#

well itā€™s up to the moderators, even if thus thread was shut down another pity system thread would be opened in like 5 minutes anyway

azure scarab
wooden tree
#

might aswell just keep this one up

wooden elbow
#

yes but at this point you could just make an announcement explaining why they won't and why they close the thread. I would hope that ppl can accept a devs decision at some point no?

wooden tree
#

devs saying outright there wonā€™t be a pity system will genuinely be some peopleā€™s last straw

#

not saying anything keeps the door open

royal swallow
#

It's a bit of a mixed bag for me tbh, on one hand I can get people being mad they don't have frags, on the other it's also makes the drop that more impactful when someone gets it.

azure scarab
wooden tree
royal swallow
pure ivy
#

(Ok maybe not dozens but the point still stands)

wooden tree
pure ivy
azure scarab
wooden elbow
# royal swallow It's a bit of a mixed bag for me tbh, on one hand I can get people being mad the...

I agree, but making it outright luck based sucks too. there are many approaches. Add a questline that is unlocked after a certain amount of kills without drop or Stack the chance until guaranteed or allow the boss to be killed w/out respawns timer until first drop but without other rewards idk man many goood solutions available. I firmly believe everyone should get a fair and relatively simple way to get their hands on frags of any kind. Why not add a golden version of all frags with 1/5 th of the drop rate but same stats just to keep the kind of hype alive ?

#

collector type shii

royal swallow
#

I mean I'm fine with the cosmetic version with it

#

Honestly its how it should be anyways

#

But rn we gotta wait til the Z2 old stuff gets put back before any major revamps happen

pure ivy
royal swallow
#

Given the popularity of the thread, boss drop rework might happen

pure ivy
#

šŸ«”

wooden elbow
#

Man I just want any drop. I'm down to a 5% Combined chance of having no drop at this point

#

Just no sinister, I will ragequit. (watch Alex read this and give me a sinister next ac)

royal swallow
#

Sinister is pretty good vs ridgy didge

#

(Assuming you get multiple and level them up)

wooden tree
#

itā€™s useless

wooden elbow
#

because it's a 1% and I have L7s

pure ivy
#

Sinister just feels terrible to get ngl

eternal shale
#

Yk what else is pretty good vs RD?
Wimps, L7

royal swallow
#

If I ever get 3 of them, that sandworm wont know what hit em

pure ivy
#

Itā€™s rarer than an AS frag but way less useful so it just feels like you were unlucky in your moment of luckiness

wooden tree
#

a unit beint good against ridgy didgy is like placing last in a race and get a participation trophy

wooden elbow
#

Tho the ridge boss is one of my faves design wise

royal swallow
#

Same, it actually forces you to build around it and teaches you damage typing

pure ivy
#

3x wimp/ 1x LCT/ 3x treb can already clear ridgy if youā€™re willing to take some resets and losses so AC frags being good against RD isnā€™t really that big of a selling point

royal swallow
#

Saw a really hot take awhile back that said ridgy didge was horrible design, because all bosses should be able to be taken on with end game units like vets and megas

wooden elbow
royal swallow
#

Like bruh, was it really that hard to learn how to fight vs resistances

#

Part of the fun about BN endgame is finding new ways to take on the bosses

#

SP grind is painful I will admit tho

#

But once you have the units you need, no amount of money can save you, just pure strategy

sullen jasper
royal swallow
#

I just found a way around it since I didn't have sandworm drill at the time

sullen jasper
#

dont need low early game level units from 10 to 15 levels ago KEKW

royal swallow
#

I used 3 crawlers, 2 portable walls, a salamander, and an elemental trooper

#

I probably could go cheaper if I wanted to, but this is the most consistent comp I found so far

granite ginkgo
sullen jasper
royal swallow
#

I haven't even reached level 65 šŸ™

#

I login everyday too

wooden tree
#

strategies are limited and itā€™s not very creative, i know madrona saud they made do with what they could work with so iā€™m not really upset

#

i think AS is a better boss thatā€™s shown at the wrong level, if it was placed at like 65 people wouldnt complain about it

wintry garden
#

As someone who wants to see AS nerfed, I actually agree with that if it showed up at 65 I wouldnā€™t have any issue with it beyond there not being many options for free to play and the existing options being gated behind prestige

alpine hull
#

AS is a p2w boss imo cause it's borderline impossible to beat consistently with f2p strats while ridgy is a puzzle boss with multiple interesting and creative solutions.

#

Ridgy >>>> AS imo

royal swallow
#

AS is a way worse off boss in my opinion

#

Comps are VERY limited and VERY reliant on BS units to consistently do

#

Ridgy Didge, you got a variety of comps you can try to lead you to the answer

#

And some of them aren't even that pricy or hard to grind

wooden tree
#

AS is considered P2W because of the level bracket itā€™s introduced in

#

Theres so many AS strats coming out now, it also requires thought to create good formations for it, not just checking the boss page and instantly having a solve

tulip lance
pure ivy
#

If we had wide access to some of the plasma units at later levels AS would be a lot more manageable

royal swallow
#

Compared to the Ridgy Didge? At least that one you can switch your burner, tank, and crusher. AS you defintely need a R6 Vet, R5-6 Megas, a freezer, and snakes/backliner

#

You can't really switch up sub for the vet or Mega/Super tanks

wintry garden
#

Fence subs for vet

royal swallow
#

Still its pretty limiting compared to the Ridgy Didge comps you could do, and most of the units for AS require heavy time intensive grinds

#

Ridgy Didge I just needed 2 hours to train the crawlers and I was gucci

wooden tree
#

Thatā€™s not strategy or choice when they all do the same thing

royal swallow
#

Yeah but you have way more options to choose from depending on how you want to inflict that ailment

wooden tree
#

that doesnā€™t make the boss interesting when youā€™re given the answer

royal swallow
#

Elemental Troop has the best burst, Nomad can work as a decent alternative, use a heavy chem tank, or if you're crazy enough, go for a Salamander

#

You know the answer, its how you get to the answer that most people enjoy

wooden tree
#

youā€™re taking a test with the answer key, it doesnā€™t matter what work you show when you already know the answer

royal swallow
#

It kinda does matter, its why most tests tell you to show the work

#

Anyone can find the answer if they get lucky, its how people get to the answer that matters and how better to optimize it in the future

wooden tree
#

there isnā€™t any optimization for worm

#

AS had room when it was released and still has room now for interesting kills

royal swallow
#

Compared to the Ridgy Didge?

#

We talking about the same boss?

wooden tree
#

because that boss asks interesting questions for you to solve

wooden tree
#

youā€™re forced into a strategy where your unit choice doesnā€™t matter

royal swallow
#

You could go with crawler or Sandworm drill, you want crawler if you're at a lower level and sandworm drill if you're at a higher level

#

If you have a few drops on AS, you could use those too for your crushers

#

Alternatively if you didn't have the level requirements or black nanos for either above, you could use the trebuchet

wintry garden
#

Unit choice against Ridgy Didge determines speed and survivability.

You have a lot of options and the only reason it feels like everythingā€™s the same is due to a lack of units that fill niches.

We donā€™t have a high AP crushing unit for instance

royal swallow
#

For AS, most people are gonna straight up tell you Vet and megas

wooden tree
royal swallow
#

It literally is strategy when you have to plan out what units you can use at the current moment

wooden tree
#

I knwo itā€™s easy to discredit AS when youā€™re not the one actually making the strategies for it, but AS is a boss that required actual effort to come up with kill strats for

royal swallow
#

not everyone i level capped, and SP grinding, so finding alternatives is always interesting

wintry garden
#

But the thing with ridgy didge is thatā€™s itā€™s good because itā€™s different from other bosses and pushes you to use units you normally wouldnā€™t.

It actually feels different from the other bosses.

royal swallow
#

Yeah exactly

wooden tree
#

you can make a boss like that and NOT make it so simplistic a 5 year old can kill it

wintry garden
#

AS on the other hand feels like a cross between Kraken and Dreadnought

wooden tree
#

all you need is the ability to read and you can kill worm

#

thatā€™s not interesting

royal swallow
#

a 5 year old would probably spam tanks and vets and die to it

wooden tree
#

If they can read tbey kill it 100%

wintry garden
wooden tree
#

the answer is written out for them

wintry garden
alpine hull
#

Every boss is solved already

wooden tree
#

AS required people to actually experiment and put their brain to work, worm requires none of that

alpine hull
#

AS is only hard cause of rng

wooden tree
#

AS is more than a reading check

alpine hull
#

AS is get stunned unlucky

wintry garden
#

Itā€™s also an rng check

alpine hull
#

Only way to bypass is frag/melee strat

wintry garden
#

Pyro strat does bypass the rng mostly

wooden tree
#

RNG is not bad for games like this, and keeping that RNG in check is apart of what makes AS strats so interesting

alpine hull
#

AS isn't really that hard anymore cause fences

wooden tree
#

You plan your strat around RNG

wintry garden
#

Fences do make AS turbo solved

alpine hull
#

AS is kinda still not too hard even after stuns but it's still down to unit ranks for the most part

wintry garden
#

AS is just what has the biggest numbers that survives

The rest is just rng

alpine hull
#

Worm is fun and has a more balanced drop

royal swallow
#

Also you don't need to grind 12 hours for a decet vet and mega

#

You can solve Sandworm with fringe units if you know what you're doing

#

AS comes down to a stat and RNG test

wintry garden
#

Someone in my guild brute forced it with nomad and megas

wooden tree
#

agree to disagree about the bosses, I will be disappointed if we see more bosses like the worm added into the game since i think their creative space is basically non existent

alpine hull
#

Worm is turbo easy

#

But it was designed to give people teeth

#

So it fills the roll

#

I like the mechanic

royal swallow
#

I mean that's kinda the point of the worm, its only hard if you don't know the strats, it teaches you that you gotta learn how to read

alpine hull
#

But I would enjoy more difficult bosses in future

royal swallow
#

That and learn the hidden mechanics abuot armor and resistances

#

The game really doesn't explain that too well unfortunately

wintry garden
#

It doesnā€™t do a good job of explaining practically anything

royal swallow
#

People will have to learn after sandworm

#

It's not too bad, but you just gotta know, that's why people have fun with it

#

There are multiple ways to handle it, and with every level, you can find a better way to clear it more consistently

#

I have to graduate from crawlers eventually because they take a beating if the scream RNG hits

wintry garden
#

I hope we get a combination of bosses like ridgy and bosses similar to, but not as overturned/ inappropriately leveled as AS.

Itā€™s also nice to have a good old stat checker every now and then like AC.

alpine hull
#

We need a like boss rush that just all the bosses together

#

That's be fun

#

Fight AC and As and x17 all at once

final bay
sacred hare
#

day 35 of saying a pity or anti bad luck system would be cool

tulip lance
alpine hull
#

It's like a key

harsh mural
#

My frigga

alpine hull
barren robin
#

Let's do a poll:
Option 1 = The more bosses you kill increases the chances of getting a drop by a tiny percentage each time

Option 2 = Fighting a Boss triggers some numbers being generated and numbers are picked tonguarantee a drop on those numbers, e.g. 5% drops trigger 100 generations with 5 random numbers selected to represent which kill will get the drop

Option 3 = like option 2 except it just picks 1 out of the 100 numbers and the rest are full odds, to make it closer to seeming binomial put with a baseline of drops

wintry garden
#

shard system

#

shard system is the one that plays with the other game mechanics

#

and best conveys pity

barren robin
# barren robin

I just realised, basically option 1 is Socialism, option 2 is Communism and Option 3 is Norway. We're currently America

wintry garden
sturdy creek
#

Each kill drops 1-5 shards randomly for whatever boss you defeat, redeem 100 shards for the boss drop

#

Natural boss drops can still occur alongside with shard drops

#

That guarantees everyone has a boss drop at around 30-33 clears for any boss in the game

barren robin
#

not a fan of shards tbh

#

makes them less special

#

I think instead of that there could be a Karma system

alpine hull
#

I rather have quest line

barren robin
#

If we're talking about interacting with other game mechanics

alpine hull
#

Pity that guaranteed at 30 clears and quest that give a Dexter at account 40 and melee at account 60

edgy parrot
#

Increasing chances of a drop after each boss kill is what makes the most sense. (Which would be tied to each boss individually, so one boss doesnā€™t steal all the luck which would be another complaint)

It would be a hidden stat so you would still be excited to see the drop after a win.

Problem is some people have trash boss luck, like killing a boss 50+ times without a drop while others get 5+ drops is bad design and it needs to change. (looking at you dreadnought)

barren robin
#

There is literally no defensible position against some form of pity system

#

You would essentially have to say "oh but I feel better knowing some people are getting screwed over by the dice"

#

"Makes my 5 frags feel more special"

granite ginkgo
#

I thought a pity system was a given tbh, it will only be a matter of time.

It'll be stupid not to when its already a time-gated farm when modern competitors have pity systems.

Or maybe Madorna is waiting to introduc units that fulfill a similar niche so its not such an advantage.

halcyon ledge
#

Really just need boasted % on first of each unique drop so players can have better chance of collecting 1 of each unit then all additional are current drop rates

#

Whether thatā€™s a flat boost or an increasing or even a shard system simply for the first of each unique drop

edgy parrot
#

Having pity being limited to one would be a bandaid imo, it needs to be repeatable

pure ivy
#

but that has its whole host of other issues that make it unappealing

#

pity system really is the bridge solution that can tide everyone with a valid complaint over until the other 95% of the game's roster gets improved to be semi-meta at some point in the game's life cycle

eternal shale
#

Day 5 of asking madrona for a pity system in honor of Brio

simple escarp
#

@azure scarab

#

bro i think this was for you...

dull linden
shrewd iron
dull linden
#

Im all for the pity system for the first drop but after that its straight absurd

wintry garden
#

Not the worst idea

Putting them in there and making them trainable using exclusively a new resource drop from AS wouldnā€™t be the worst thing

#

Much better than the current system at least

dull linden
#

You dont need multiple frags like that tho. 1 to 2 is all youll ever need. Doing that will just make it so everyone will have a ton of them which cheapens everything

#

I think this is what the devs fear most which in that sense i 100% side with them on that

#

People see someone with 5 frags when they will still be at the same advantage as someone with 2 of them

wintry garden
#

Will it? Does it?

I guess if the boss drops too many, but if it drops a balanced amount it wonā€™t.

1-5 and costing 100 to produce would still be months to over a year or over half a year on average for a single unitā€¦ certainly wouldnā€™t end up with having too many in that case.

plain smelt
#

Day 3 madrona pity

wintry garden
#

But also no, someone with 5 melees can field a whole frontline

Thatā€™s a lot better than having 2 of them

plain smelt
#

Huh

#

No

#

If you come at me in PvP with a frontline of melees Iā€™ll eat you alive

obsidian yoke
#

the best argument for having more than like 2x of each frag is to have replacement ready when one fall in a fight like bs

#

lets you be a lot more aggresive in pushing points

wintry garden
#

But also

If thereā€™s not that much of a difference between between 2 and 5, why care if the pityā€™s repeatable

#

That too

wintry garden
plain smelt
#

I donā€™t want @tulip lance having 10 rng frags + 5 pity frags

#

One and done

wintry garden
#

So what if he does

plain smelt
#

Iā€™ll get mad

edgy parrot
wintry garden
#

Iā€™d argue that because this game has contests and will have PvP, it makes no sense to have any unit (including duplicates of units) gated behind rng or limited events. The exception being if those events repeat often, the units are functionally cosmetic, the units are banned from or nerfed in those game modes, or similar.

#

Even with the proposed shard system, the absolute best you could hit pity would be 20 clears or 110 days (over 3 months) and that would be an extremely low chance of happening.

Itā€™d typically take 34 clears or 187 days (over 6 months).

Thatā€™s not going to lead to excessive amounts of a unit

dull linden
#

Alright devs I am on your side now. Zero pity system based

gaunt holly
#

Been killing bosses for months and every day as a part of the boss event. No drops. I am going to go insane.

#

only 2 kraken tentacles and 2 dex frags

plain cape
#

going to hijack to say my 2 cent. Have a system like rainbow six siege packs. First kill is 2%. No drop? Next kill odds go up by 1%. Once you get a drop, odds go back down to 2% and the cycle continues. I killed the AS on average 5 times a month, so just using that number by the end of a month you'd only go up by 5% a month. It's not a crazy busted idea, and just helps those who have tough luck

lofty path
wooden tree
#

thatā€™s the pity system thatā€™s being argued for Maaaaan

obsidian yoke
#

yeah its like most ppl dont read

frank mason
#

Oh no Oolkki and Yugami have brought the Can't Read Virus from HSC to MM šŸ˜†

dull linden
plain cape
brisk flume
wooden tree
#

I donā€™t cheat at wordle i have a method

plain cape
#

2% is the current AS frag spawn chance. And even if it was just for the first frag I still think thats a fair deal. For other bosses with a higher frag chance you can just chance the % increase to keep the starting chance the same. Imo I think the increasing odds should stay for every drop

wooden tree
brisk flume
wooden tree
#

instead of varying percentages

plain cape
#

something like that

wooden tree
#

i think thatā€™s more confusing than just setting them all at the same drop rate

plain cape
#

idk how to respond to that lmao

#

thats a trivial issue vs going 25 AS kills with no drop

#

I get what you're saying, if someone wants to track their odds of a drop. A suggestion would be to show the % rate of drops for all encounters. Say fighting boars and you didnt get a teeth drop, it would show greyed out teeth with 2% under it. So for AS frag it would be greyed out frags with 2% under each, then 3% next run so on and so on. That way you dont guess and can keep track

wooden tree
#

iā€™m agreeing with you on the system

#

but just set all the drops to the same deop chance so their pity counter goes up equally

#

instead of deop rates being different and pity counters beint different

plain cape
#

if thats what it takes to help others get frags then im all for it

wintry garden
placid hinge
#

Maybe they can implement this pity system in a form of building your own frags, you get a small amount of parts from Ancient Sentinel if you killed it and didn't get the frags.

plush shell
wooden tree
#

Pity systems are designed to ensure olayers on the low end get atleast something, olayers are already on track to get 8 AS frags this year with the current system, while others could get no AS frag for the entire year

#

ā€œoh but frag inflation!!!ā€ itā€™s already a problem but only a portion of the playerbase gets to take advantage of it. Theres also other ways to mitigate this issue like limiting how many frags you can place per formation or banning them outright with modifiers like infantry only

wintry garden
#

Yeah, frag inflation already happened so itā€™s not a counterargument.

plain cape
#

8 units a year is not a lot lmao and as you said its average. a lot of people are still going to get bent over by this system and not get a frag for months. It would take 4 months of clearing to get to around 25%, given you had average spawns.

plush shell
#

Players on average will have a boss strike formation that consist only of frags and maybe a support unit or two

wintry garden
#

things will get rebalanced

#

and boss strike is going to be changed

#

we've known this for a while

#

even then, there will always be a meta

#

something being that dominant is an issue with either the unit or other units, not its availability

elfin kite
#

If we want to talk about meta, it's a problem in and of itself that the best unit (currently) in the game is an rng drop. The crux of this entire situation is that the AS frags are overtuned compared to other options

#

Imo there's really only 2 options: make obtaining them more consistent or rebalance them

plush shell
#

But let it be known that there is nothing ā€˜minorā€™ about a pity system that averages at 8 AS drops a year lol

steel mango
#

The thing I fear most people are forgetting, they look at armyā€™s from the old game built from years of killing bosses and grinding and want to be right back there now, we have already been given nomads to be trainable (not as strong as a frag) with we get flooded with boss drops no one will find the use for trebs mammoth artillery ect the scarcity means we will use a larger diversity of units that is not a bad thing

silver raft
#

52 weeks in a year, so you're averaging just under 7 weeks for a frag - that's just under 2 months

idk getting a prize for 2 months of hard work (not counting all the prior grinding needed to even attempt AS) seems cool

#

2 months is about the average f2p pacing for new pull-targets in most gachas rn and that seems to be good for keeping retention and most importantly converting f2ps to low spenders

granite ginkgo
#

2 months is fine, but some people take way longer, thats the issue at hand

silver raft
#

mathematically it's on-par with industry standards

steel mango
#

We donā€™t want this going down the gotcha trackā€¦

silver raft
#

and well considering how much the gacha industry has grown in the past 5 years

granite ginkgo
#

Oh ok i read your msg wrong than FatRaptor

silver raft
#

the fundemental difference is the artstyle which captures a reasonably separate audience that gives BN even a semblance of a niche

#

the story is delivered visual novel style

teal olive
# plush shell But let it be known that there is nothing ā€˜minorā€™ about a pity system that avera...

Rebalancing is in order, yes, but thereā€™s no point in certain people having 8 AS frags while others in the community can go an entire year without getting anything.

I think the best solution, if people are worried about ā€œfrag inflation,ā€ would be limiting how many can be brought into battles or boss strikes. A pity system is definitely needed. I also donā€™t understand the logic that its ā€œrarityā€ would go down just because more people have one. Madrona has already made it clear they want to mitigate FOMO, so it only makes sense for that philosophy to apply to drops as well, especially when some people already have 5+ AS drops.

granite ginkgo
#

I do feel like gachas are the most similar comparison to Bn

steel mango
silver raft
silver raft
#

that's a good thing

steel mango
silver raft
#

but doesnt change the fact that frags are a core piece of the meta

#

and you do not need to have participated in strikes to beat the AS - vet/mega strat is very much a thing

#

ofc it plays like ass but you know...

steel mango
# silver raft and you do not need to have participated in strikes to beat the AS - vet/mega st...

I agree that they are meta, but a high rank tf2 heavy will preform just as well to speed up SP grind

From what Iā€™ve seen melee is great for making AS easier

But neither of them are game breaking and there are boss strikes where one or the other will see little to no use and preform about the same as any old tank as their attacks are designed for specific enemie types unlike the nomad

eternal shale
#

So sad that brio is no longer with us; I canā€™t ping him to say that I did not get a clad today

#

Nor to say that I did not get a construct frag from AC yesterday or x17 today

silver raft
#

doesn't seem very game design philosophy to me - i have a slight hunch that being nice to your players may be helpful for player retention than screwing them

steel mango
silver raft
steel mango
#

No

silver raft
#

a new player's going to see this game and see other players have cool toys that they can't get no matter what - that seems like a turn-off for committing time and money to the game and something very easily rectified by just... not... doing this...

wintry garden
# steel mango Except you get to choose to train all but 5? Of the current units in game with o...

7

7 are RNG: Tamed Adult Sandworm, Tentacle, Clad, and the 4 frags from AC and AS

but paying money for units is what gachas are and you do that in BN. Difference is the cost is consistant in BN, while it isn't in gachas.

In both, you have ways of obtaining units for free, either because the unit is guaranteed or because you get currency for free, or there's some free method of obtaining units.

silver raft
#

BN has units that are literally unobtainable

#

that's not good for long-term health

wintry garden
silver raft
#

like imagine if i wanted to play counter strike but then "oh you can't use the SG553 because you weren't around to unlock it during a big ranked event" like sure the AK's just as good but still feels like quite the slap in the face no?

wintry garden
steel mango
#

200k is low

wintry garden
#

it's really not

steel mango
#

500k?

silver raft
wintry garden
#

but still within the same ballpark

#

you need to use a number that makes sense and just looks reasonable

teal olive
# steel mango I agree that they are meta, but a high rank tf2 heavy will preform just as well ...

Iā€™d have to disagree with this a bit.

One literally helps in almost any formation, and the other helps kill the hardest boss in the game with even one melee. That sounds pretty game-breaking to me. A lot of people who struggled during the strikes did poorly specifically because they didnā€™t have a heavy hitter like the frags. Maulers could only do so much.

Both are anti-air (which was a huge problem during strike 2), and one can literally wipe out two full rows of enemies, now even having 2-3 increases your chances of clearing every wave. Thatā€™s insanely strong for a single unit. Most people only really started performing well once the Nomad released, and the ones doing well usually had a frag drop.

steel mango
#

But working together to get one should be easier and encouraged over the personal target

wintry garden
#

it would be

#

at 200k

silver raft
wintry garden
#

you could also only ever get 1 individually

you'd need teammates to get more and to get the other rewards

steel mango
silver raft
#

it takes a lot longer to show but the 2 free nomads isn't really a long-term solution

if anything this goes to show how slow the new player influx is (luckily - otherwise the nomads would probably be blown out of proportion too)

steel mango
silver raft
#

and nanos are a finite resource

#

i would suggest adding a quest that gives 2 nomads as a reward and if possible limiting it to only those acccounts which didn't get the 2 free nomads from the strike

#

but im pretty sure that's too progressive for most

steel mango
#

Why not everyone why not reward long time players with the bonus of both?

alpine hull
#

Nanos are an infinite resource

#

Just become a thief

silver raft
alpine hull
#

Steal from the bank

teal olive
alpine hull
#

Nomads are relative to frags max rank

#

R8 nomad is a messed up unit

steel mango
#

Frags are more situational than nomads

silver raft
teal olive
#

Which is why theyā€™re getting balanced, sadly

alpine hull
#

They on the same tier

silver raft
alpine hull
#

If frags are gonna stay same strength they should add pity I say as a member of big frag

steel mango
alpine hull
#

Nomad has freeze

#

And indirect

#

Frags have raw bulk

silver raft
#

esp melee

#

melee is literally the best damage sponge in the game

alpine hull
#

Melee is

steel mango
alpine hull
#

Nomad is the best attacking unit against silver wolves and rebels

alpine hull
steel mango
#

Give everyone 3 of those and be done with it

alpine hull
#

šŸ’€

#

Please no

#

I just think the game needs to even whales vs fraggers vs poor

steel mango
#

And nomad solves their AA argument

Nomad was the pity frag without cheapening the frags for when you do get them

alpine hull
#

Yea I attacked with nomads more than frags during BS2

#

They did so much dmg

silver raft
steel mango
#

Having stuff like wandering samurai being trainable for like 10 powder to diversify damage options would be better for game health than everyone gets a frag I feel

wintry garden
#

we could have both in a more balanced game, instead of the mess we have now

that'll only be worse once we get plasma

alpine hull
#

Plasma low-key makes it better

silver raft
alpine hull
#

The game is actually less p2w cause plasma art are game breaking

steel mango
#

Ftp party

silver raft
#

That's exactly why plasma was added by z2

wintry garden
#

competetive game modes exist/will exist

so we can't have exclusive units without it being an issue

silver raft
#

That was a truly Brilliant Move

alpine hull
wintry garden
alpine hull
#

They said they want an elo system

alpine hull
#

It would be crazy

pure ivy
#

PA was so stupid it actively drained the thinking out of the game LMFAO

#

at least with other stupid boardclears like RF and LM have their limitations, like RF getting blocked and being piercing, or LM not being able to hit air and not having the greatest DPT against tanks or armored units that had crushing resistance (even if it could lock them out by constantly stunning them)

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with PA, you just add filler attacks and checkboard spam until you win

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not to mention how absurdly beefy it was for an artillery unit lol

north rover
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Z2 kind of painted themselves into a corner there with how they started giving the enemy some of the promo units

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Imagine trying to use a ā€œstandardā€ arty when the enemy has something that can oneshot half your backline at once

wintry garden
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yeah

enemies never should have been able to use nano, promo, or boss strike units outside of one-off content and challenge modes, but Z2 never had any challenge modes

sacred hare
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day 36 of saying a pity or anti bad luck system would be cool

plush shell
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Pity would be good to get your first frag, afterwards its over

alpine hull
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Day 50000 of telling madrona to smite brios egg

vale holly
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Michelle Obama

silk girder
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michael

eternal shale
crude elm
vale holly
crude elm
wintry garden