Sub 0

[unborn merlin]

Taking the V0 down a degree or two!

@stark parcel @stiff lichen @uneven spire @pseudo patio @green prism

[stark parcel]

Well then the party can continue! 🥳

[stiff lichen]

https://tenor.com/view/happy-dance-its-time-to-party-gif-16879614411325569925

[stark parcel]

https://tenor.com/view/bruh-cold-gif-13280369

https://tenor.com/view/weekend-party-champagne-gif-18280013

[unborn merlin]

https://tenor.com/view/december-morning-gif-4046957624406864425

[stark parcel]

oooohhhh (love cats)

[unborn merlin]

so, ladies and gentlemen
the Sub 0 seems to have found a crowd, not sure of any other way to call us 😂 but looks like we have a new toy to play with!
what is the general concensus on rail size / print area?

[stark parcel]

Voron-cubed!

😆

[unborn merlin]

i have gone for a 70mm rail giving a 42mm cubed print area

[unborn merlin]

so 30mm?
or a touch over that

42mm and you can print a 80% benchy

[stark parcel]

Nah 42 is ok, cause colder edge

in theorie

[unborn merlin]

a good heater will solve that

im on the look out

but something to print abs / asa would be good

the chamber wouldnt take long to get up im sure

Seems a bit big

[stark parcel]

lol

[stark parcel]

Thoughts?

[unborn merlin]

looks easy to print, so good to go
my only question is
why have to outter 2 fixing points seperate prints?

[stark parcel]

cause:

panel screw points used

[unborn merlin]

you could print from this side?

[stark parcel]

separation for mounting, not printing

[unborn merlin]

use the old trick for holes

[unborn merlin]

oh i see now

[stark parcel]

@unborn merlin Have you already thought about the Bondteech parts regarding belt tensioner?

[unborn merlin]

i'm not familiar with this
bondtech belt tensioner?

[stark parcel]

no... one moment...

[stark parcel]

#1011476576266883082 message

Extruder parts...

[unborn merlin]

of sorts yes
i agree that it would be better regarding space and the thread on M3 is 0.5mm per full turn so belt tension would be able to be well adjusted and quite easily
but...
is it really a V0 then? id like to keep mine as OEM as possible
you'd also have to make sure that there would be enough room to get the tool (alan key) in there to begin with.
for the moment i'm concentrating on getting the base model finished before moving onto mods for it.
just my thoughts, but if you want to see if and how it works your more than welcome
it is open source so free game to everyone😁

[stark parcel]

free game huh... AWD-Nema17 Sub 0 anyone? 😆 (kidding)

[unborn merlin]

now that would be cool

urgh got to love fusion🤦‍♂️

[unborn merlin]

headless skirt... check👍

[uneven spire]

The Fysetc AIO controller would be perfect for this
It's a mini12864 display with a full 4 driver 3d printer controller on the back
https://wiki.fysetc.com/AIO_II/

[unborn merlin]

wow, good find!

whats the unknown file, doesnt seem to be anything i can open?

[stark parcel]

Should have been asleep long ago... tiredness makes you stupid..... 🤪 🤣 @unborn merlin

[unborn merlin]

love it!🤣

working on making the mini (printed) kirigami get it much needed neo-pixel

[uneven spire]

It was a picture that didn't upload

[unborn merlin]

oh ok
thanx for the links too

[stark parcel]

upload please

(here... cause faster)

[unborn merlin]

all in good time

[stark parcel]

Have to make it thinner because of the power supply.

[unborn merlin]

oh i see
also sorted the door handle and frame brace conflict

[unborn merlin]

is it that stadard voron scale for measuring?

[stark parcel]

only position changed. Base is your file.

[safe stream]

Sub 0's brother from another mother

https://youtu.be/6vfQrYthlw0?si=VGUnRzWobSjeNWch

[stark parcel]

Lol

[unborn merlin]

i watched that video🤣

[unborn merlin]

https://github.com/Driftrotor/Voron_V-SUB_0-70/tree/main

latest push!

[unborn merlin]

it's up if you want it bud

https://www.printables.com/en/model/317615-printed-zslider-mgn9h-rail-replacement

A viable option?

[unborn merlin]

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005005007512703.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.main.21.7d58DRVqDRVqXl&algo_pvid=899d3a71-ca45-4283-9631-2c2ce2eedf35&algo_exp_id=899d3a71-ca45-4283-9631-2c2ce2eedf35-10&pdp_npi=4%40dis!GBP!3.33!2.93!!!4.11!3.62!%40211b613917165178106674377ee595!12000031324069433!sea!GB!3439024339!&curPageLogUid=EyJAZEs2WDdJ&utparam-url=scene%3Asearch|query_from%3A

mini daylight on a stick?
24vdc and 83mm long, 12mm wide
perfect fit for my machine

[uneven spire]

What extruder are you going to use?@unborn merlin

I saw you are going to go with Bowden toolhead

Mini14 would be a pretty cool extruder to see on it

https://github.com/hartk1213/MISC/tree/main/Voron Mods/Extruders/Mini14

[stiff lichen]

I wonder if it's possible to build a Sub-F-Zero.

[unborn merlin]

Well I've printed the regular MiniSB so sticking with DD for the time being, but that Mini M4 is super cute and would be perfect for the Sub 0
So it looks like I will end up with one of those on it soon😁

[stark parcel]

The latest CAD is magnet and frontskirt, right? Or have you updated anything else?

[unborn merlin]

Those were the main issues to check off yes.
But also added neopixel support for printed kirigami stealth front.
Printed kirigami also had some updates too.

What we need now is @uneven spire to make some stealth skirts

[unborn merlin]

excellent job

[stark parcel]

want the mount?

[unborn merlin]

yes please, ill add it to the repo

now all we need is @vocal patio to come and add 1 million RGB's

[unborn merlin]

going to need tinted panels with these little monsters

done another push👍

[safe stream]

For this I chose to go slightly bigger with the build volume coming in at a whopping 42 x 42 x 42mm

i'm just gonna assume this is a hitchiker's reference and say i approve

[stark parcel]

Gimme some minutes. Trampoline overhaul with the kids...

I Love black 😂

[stark parcel]

some well known influence... 🤣

[stark parcel]

Changelog: Colorchange, modestymesh, what else?

[unborn merlin]

That's it for now, had to run off to help the old boy

[stark parcel]

Should I continue with this?

[unborn merlin]

looks good to me, yes👍

[unborn merlin]

ref colour change, i liked your colour more than mine and it is in good keeping with the Printer theme

[unborn merlin]

of course! the sum of the universe as everyone knows is 42🤣

@stark parcel are you happy for me to include your mod parts to the repo?
i understand if not.
i can link to your GitHub for them if you want?

[stark parcel]

one second... found something...

[stark parcel]

Do it

[unborn merlin]

link or include?

[stark parcel]

include it, and link in readme ☺️

[unborn merlin]

ha ha one repo to rule them all!

[stark parcel]

*untested as we know

[unborn merlin]

always🤣 untill someone prints it

[unborn merlin]

gosh so many mods🤣

this is going to take me a while

i think i will add them to the CAD under a separate component list as optional extras

[stark parcel]

With enough mods, the separate components end up being their own full Sub-0 🤔 😅

[unborn merlin]

i think you may be right😅
it will be cool to show and hide parts of the model to see what it looks like
like an options tick box style

[stark parcel]

If you then go into detail and need different thicknesses for each frontskirt with or without an internal power supply..... 😵‍💫

Tweaks

@unborn merlin

[unborn merlin]

cool, ill add them in a bit👍

[stark parcel]

You could also invite people who want to contribute to the repo. (I did that with Timmit when the UFO was still meant as a joke.)

[unborn merlin]

got any suggestions?
kind of new to this😅

[unborn merlin]

well your one of the big players so sent an invite

[stark parcel]

nice, If it's OK with you, I would now insert the Stealtskirtsv3 into your CAD as a test, separate, as was your idea. Can I also add the colors?

[unborn merlin]

already doing it🤣

[stark parcel]

let me do these two things es a test

🥹

[unborn merlin]

oh ok you twisted my arm🤣
tophat and skirts right?

[stark parcel]

only skirts as test

[unborn merlin]

ok, im just pushing the latest for you

dran slow internet

and done

[stark parcel]

By the way, have you ever thought about deleting the unused colors? That saves a lot of memory

i'll do

[unborn merlin]

yeah its a mess at the moment
i was going to do it but keep getting distracted by some guy🤣

[stark parcel]

looool

[unborn merlin]

i'll get on it after youve had a play

i cant find @uneven spire for colab on GitHub for some reason

[stark parcel]

hartk

[unborn merlin]

thats what i typed but nothing found
ill try the other one

[stark parcel]

hartk1213

[unborn merlin]

got it, but it wont select it.
you click on his name and it changes to some random user that is not found???

[stark parcel]

strange

[unborn merlin]

Sub - Pandora

[unborn merlin]

very

so does this mean we are developing a printer for baby ants?

[stark parcel]

test done

[vocal patio]

PFMA. Printer for micro ants

[unborn merlin]

catchy

[stark parcel]

i moved your inlet to "feet"

[unborn merlin]

ok

got to keep it easy to navigate

[stark parcel]

Only because the mod feet have a different inlet. Otherwise it could be confusing.

runout sensor foot could move to optional.

[unborn merlin]

Do it👍

[safe stream]

as long as it retains tri-point leveling

[unborn merlin]

g2 setup i think

[unborn merlin]

would you need it with a 42mm bed🤣

[stark parcel]

g2 2.4 42mm QGL!!!

[safe stream]

need? of course not
want? yes. b/c pandora has it

[safe stream]

this is for sub-micron. the nano? 1,000 nanometers is a micron

[stark parcel]

🤣 👍

enough for now, i painted voron black pink, to find things...

[unborn merlin]

Ha ha, you going to push an update

[stark parcel]

V60 done

for now... I'm taking a break

[unborn merlin]

Ok

I'll wrap a few things up my end but I think we are nearly complete

[unborn merlin]

pushed an update
nothing major, just material clean up (a bit more) and added back in the display skirts (went missing somehow?)
i think bar some small detail bits it is pretty complete now.
do we want to keep adding in options or shall we leave that and host them separately?
just mindful that if we add too much it might be a bit much for others

[stark parcel]

Mods Folder maybe

more room

[unborn merlin]

That's a good idea actually.
If we use the base cad origin for the mods you can import them in the correct placement without the need to move anything.
Does look a bit odd as a single drawing but helps a heap when adding it to the main CAD

Does this mean we should pull the mods from the main cad?
Keep an OEM printer then MODS folder

[unborn merlin]

I think we should combine that power supply with the rear socket foot you did

[stark parcel]

Keep optional in cad for runout

[unborn merlin]

Agreed

Other mods?
Light sticks I think should stay

But it is a mod so🤷‍♂️

[stark parcel]

Mods only adding things: Optional, Mod changing things:Modsfolder

[unborn merlin]

Agreed 👍

[stark parcel]

move the modestymesh in optional

and maybe the screen

[unborn merlin]

Yes defo

Well it's oem for V0 so I think it should stay in skirts, but it is an option so maybe we should move it.
But most users have the screen so maybe move the headless skirt to optional🤣

[stark parcel]

change namings to your liking

[stark parcel]

😅

[unborn merlin]

Jokes aside, yes let's put the screen in optional

[unborn merlin]

Nice, you move quick😅

Oh I keep forgetting to ask
The belt chain for the cables to the kirigami... what do you think?
I have modeled some links but nothing mad. I was planning to just add a couple of cable ties to hold them to the belt.
But now we have got a nice machine I'm second guessing myself.
Didn't want a 7x7 chain on it as it's a bit... LARGE😁

[stark parcel]

build, then improve. 🙂

[unborn merlin]

Ok, start simple😁

[stark parcel]

ok?

[unborn merlin]

Yep look great 👍

Looks odd I know but make life way simpler later😁

[uneven spire]

@unborn merlinyou gonna do belted Z? i bet you could do a direct drive belted Z with no problem

[unborn merlin]

with the new g2?
sure!

[uneven spire]

no not even G2 just a pulley on a stepper lol

its not like it weighs a bunch, doubt you need the gearing

[unborn merlin]

oh yeah we could do

[stark parcel]

G2Z = Higher skirts or no bottompanel

[uneven spire]

wouldnt have as fine of resolution but i think you would be fine

[unborn merlin]

this is true
probably in the region of 200g

[unborn merlin]

0.04mm per step should be fine👍

[uneven spire]

yeah

[unborn merlin]

16 tooth pully = 0.03mm per step

that would help keep it small too

nema 14?

slap a 52mm on it

@stark parcel and i are working through what mods to add to the repo
we have a separate folder for them to keep it simple

but there will be a limit i think, after that it will just be links to the mods as i'm sure others will want to play

i'm doing a bit of a re-jig to the frame at the moment so if you wanted to have a go your more than welcome
i was trying to add you to the colab group on the repo but i can select your name for some random reason

[stark parcel]

thoughts?

[unborn merlin]

That look quite good 👍
Maybe other switches? Blue one maybe?

[stark parcel]

I think the color matches quite well now

Regarding the creation of the curved pipes, I need a lesson... I've managed to adjust something somehow, but...

[stark parcel]

@uneven spire @unborn merlin

[unborn merlin]

🤣

[stark parcel]

😩

[unborn merlin]

Oh that was a genuine call for help?!

[stark parcel]

heard about 3d sketch, but never got it working the way i see others do it...

[unborn merlin]

It a just a swept circle along a path I scretched

I'm still not very good at it but the janky tubes were just about good enough

[unborn merlin]

why the reduction gearbox?

direct stepper should be good enough?

[stark parcel]

curves in one dimension may be easy, but onepath in more dimensions is a riddle... my adjustment in lgx direction was copy, rount move merge...

[unborn merlin]

thats about my extent too

[stark parcel]

Use the place 🤣 (maybe resolution...) 😅

[unborn merlin]

still need to play with it some more

is it up ongithub?

i can have a look if you like

[uneven spire]

Geared stepper? ...you could probably make it pretty compact using a round nema14 and bmg gear sets possibly

That's looking great

[stark parcel]

Not until i know how to mount that stepper...

[stark parcel]

A round stepper would have the same problem as your V0 G2Z... either higher skirts or no bottom panel.

[unborn merlin]

this might work🤔

[vocal patio]

What size stepper there for that z?

[unborn merlin]

Nema 17 x 23👍

[vocal patio]

17?! I was thinking 14 maybe even 11. Lmao. That’s big for tiny printer.

[unborn merlin]

Well got to keep "some" torque in the system🤣 I mean it is only a 23mm one so only has 12ncm of juice.
I was thinking of doing a nema 14 version to see how that works out👍

[vocal patio]

Moons MS14HS1P4150 is 27.3mm long and has 13.4Ncm of torque. Nema 14.

[unborn merlin]

That would be a good motor.
I was trying to squeeze one in a small space as @stark parcel is working on a power supply so we had some space conflicts.
But I'll do a nema 14 tonight👍

[vocal patio]

I am a big fan of moons. Lmao. The smallest nema 11 they have with decent torque is still 31mm in length. Ugh. Lol. It’s got 9.1Ncm of torque. MS11HS1P4100. And I want an excuse to use a nema 11 at some point. Lol. They are so cute!

Or even somehow have something that uses their nema 6. It’s only 14x14x30mm!

[unborn merlin]

Wow that is smol

[vocal patio]

It has a 4mm shaft! Was expecting 3mm. Not 4. That’s crazy big with a motor that small.

[rancid basin]

Such a nice way to spend money. I f…ing like it 😍

[unborn merlin]

Welcome to the club for everything smol🤣

[vocal patio]

I just looked at the price tag for that nema 6 motor cause I kinda want to order it for the shear heck of it. I no longer wish to order it for the shear heck of it. A moons nema 14 is cheaper. Lmao. That nema 6. Is $60.

[unborn merlin]

Mini Kirigami get a neopixel 😁

[proven pendant]

https://cad.onshape.com/documents/a9437c6459401812507d998d/w/f6122b2a3c051110c8538e67/e/83adc77b9b2efd5b1c3922ec?renderMode=0&uiState=665552e44be4525917a29989

I just wanted to post this very preliminary work I did for a v0 based around makerbeamXS (10x10) and mgn5. I don't have the time, resources, or technical knowledge to pursue this project further, but figured I'd drop the little CAD i had done here. I intended for it use a custom toolhead based around a bambu x1/p1 or deltaprintr mini hotend and use a bowden extrusion system

[unborn merlin]

thanx for this, i will take a look at it and see if things are possible

[stark parcel]

The idea sounds familiar to me 😎. (can't watch it, no account...)

[elfin token]

hello fellows

[unborn merlin]

Excellent another victim

I'm playing with a Z belt idea at the moment. Just printed off a few test pieces

First one didn't go so well🤣

[elfin token]

before i might build that one there is another build on the list

[unborn merlin]

I think we all have a list🤣

Yep, that seems to work

Fiddly as he'll to get it all on

Just waiting on the last 4 rails to turn up then it's on to milling down a spare V0 bed to the right size

[elfin token]

Nice! 👍🏻 maybe you can for triple-Z into it

[unborn merlin]

i did have a look into this but sadly there is not enough space unless i design the feet and skirts to suit

[unborn merlin]

Sub 0 gets some funky custom panels😍

[vocal patio]

40mm in z.. That’s so small. That even tall enough for a benchy?

[unborn merlin]

42 cubed is the print area and is just big enough for a 80% benchy🤣

[vocal patio]

Since that would be cheating for a speed benchy print. You’re gonna have to do a speed Voron cube challenge.

[unborn merlin]

Challenge accepted good sir

[vocal patio]

Uhhh. I just found these tiny things. Now I wanna see a toolhead designed around them with something like a 15mm axial fan for heat break cooling. https://a.aliexpress.com/_mrlTtxY

[unborn merlin]

Will it actually cool the heatbreak though?

[vocal patio]

Who knows. But it’d be fun to try out. Lol.

[unborn merlin]

Part cooling?

[vocal patio]

Part cooling would be those blowers I linked. 1504 for axial. Lmao. Only 0.2cfm. Definitely not enough for heat break cooling.

2006 blowers combined with 1504 axial. That would make one tiny toolhead.

[unborn merlin]

🤔

[vocal patio]

A 20mm axial fan would probably be better since the standard v6 heat break is 20mm in diameter. But I like the idea of a 15mm fan. Lol.

[unborn merlin]

That is very small🤏 might better to stick with at least a 20mm for effective cooling. It might be super cool to go smaller but it's got to work to make it viable or it's just and expensive paper weight🤣
I'm assuming that this should be a bowden setup to keep it smol😁

[vocal patio]

Oh yea. Bowden would make it even small. And yea. 20mm is probably the minimum for a heat break cooling fan.

[stark parcel]

#1011476576266883082 message

@unborn merlin got the file from me to continue. should be exactly the fans.

[unborn merlin]

https://tenor.com/view/soon-tm-you-will-understand-gif-9171089047807988648

It's in the list of stuff to do👍

[unborn merlin]

i can certainly check it out👍

[unborn merlin]

amazingly it fits quite nicely

[gloomy onyx]

https://tenor.com/view/magnify-magnifyingglass-spy-observe-search-gif-10918910732386058072

Now shrink the Z motion components

Does look very cool though!

[unborn merlin]

this might end up as it's own separate version
dont want to have too much on the same repo as it might get a bit confusing
might even be able to do a pandora's box version

[stark parcel]

you need a website! 'printers for single-celled organisms"! 🤣🤣🤣

[unborn merlin]

hell yeah!
aquatic protozoa .com

[unborn merlin]

Work has started on the brains of the operation

[vocal patio]

Wonder if there’s an even smaller mainboard out there than the pico. Or just run can bus with a rpi stepper hat. That could work perhaps.

[languid umbra]

Hm, feels hard to really really shrink it.

The passives is what kills it.

[vocal patio]

Could do ebb36 for toolhead (if the toolhead is the standard mini sb) and gbb15 for xy motors. Then you just need 1 more driver for z which you could technically connect to the pi (I think. Haven’t ever tried.). Basically. Make each board a mini can board to spread out where everything is.

[uneven spire]

Mellow Micro

[vocal patio]

You uh. Got a link to that?

[uneven spire]

I'm using a toolhead board for the Z axis on my v0 😂

[uneven spire]

micro4

[vocal patio]

That. Is. Amazing.

[elfin token]

it's soo smol 🥺

[vocal patio]

Isn’t it!

[unborn merlin]

fits in rather well if i do say so myself🤣
hoping to have the rest of the rails and stepper motors some time in the next week
they've just cleared customs so should be on a van real soon
after that its just adding belts and i should be able to start testing the motion system out
maybe even IS

[stiff lichen]

With your rate of progress on this thing, you're going to shame me into hurrying up and getting a serial for my but-it's-not-finished-to-me V0

[astral elbow]

Same here. Still trying to get a solid crimp and this guy developed a shrink ray for vorons

[languid umbra]

I dono, I was obsessive about "MUST GET MY ZERO TO THE POINT WHERE IT CAN HAVE A SERIAL NUMBER" for whatever reason.

[unborn merlin]

To be fair I did spend a lot of time on the cad work for my own V0 build even before it had turned up
And then even more when it turned up
But THIS project also has some great German engineering too
@stark parcel come take your slice of the pie😜

It only came about because of the "I want one of those!" And "dad! Dad! Can I have one?! PLEASE!!!"

https://tenor.com/view/love-cute-dog-pup-puppy-gif-17181996

I will be jumping back on this project really soon.
Had some family issues to take care of first, but should be back at it to finish off the repo etc.

I also want to do a Pandoras box version so expect so extra shiny things later down the road.
I know @vocal patio might like one

[vocal patio]

At some point I do plan on building a sub 0. Lmao. Love this tiny project. For now though. I’m working on the Doron Velta.

[unborn merlin]

😱 they do look cool

Maybe in the future🫠

[vocal patio]

I’m currently printing the new toolhead on mine. Lol. Love watching this thing print. Kinematics are crazy.

[unborn merlin]

Oh dear lord

[vocal patio]

I don’t even know if there’d be enough room for even the micro4. Lmao.

[unborn merlin]

Bigger brother gets a little bother today

[unborn merlin]

Somehow they don't look out of place🤔 oh that's right, the whole thing is smol

[elfin token]

looks nice and smol

[vocal patio]

Micro4 would fit even better. Lol.

[stark parcel]

😅

[unborn merlin]

🤔 it does seem to fit with the ethos🤣

[unborn merlin]

You deserve it bud, you put in quite a number of hours and added some cool stuff to the project

[unborn merlin]

Ladies and gentlemen I believe....
It's go time

[gilded ridge]

https://tenor.com/view/aww-cute-gif-22121346

[unborn merlin]

Got to give the babies a quick bath🫠

Yep they defo needed it

[tough raven]

https://tenor.com/view/mike-myers-illberightthere-stuck-imcoming-austin-powers-gif-9885080

[unborn merlin]

Rail install went well but was super fiddly due to the lack of any space.
You have to choose, sight or hand and tool in that area
also added some more Voron Love to the bottom panel

[unborn merlin]

Now just got to wait for the last pully to arrive and then add belts

[unborn merlin]

🤔 I seem to be missing something

Now I just need a trident to have all the sizes😍

[modest nymph]

Damn that's small

[proven plaza]

need a microsb

like kevinakasam wth burner but even smaller

[tough raven]

Make it bowden but keep the toolhead shape of the mini sb, but smaller. This way you won't have issues with fitting an entire extruder

[unborn merlin]

ill have a look into this

[unborn merlin]

thins might be a challange to keep it usefull, but i like the idea of it being smaller

[vocal patio]

That’s what I keep saying. Lmao.

[unborn merlin]

WTF burner is a bust, i could make it a bit smaller but it would take a lot of work to get it to fit
by which point it might not look right.
bowden is defo the way forward

[proven plaza]

would look sick like that lmao

[unborn merlin]

so current problems i'm working through are thus...

1. the bed plate - either machine down a spare bed i have laying about OR get local machine shop to make a custom one from regular alu
2. heated bed???? - i'm going with YESSSS - i have a 5w 24v polymide heater (220C max) but it doesnt cover much of the bed plate, so a hot spot is near garenteed - i'm looking at others inc custom Keenovo
3. bowden but smaller - part cooling issues? - what design? - could use the original V0? (simpler and in keeping with V0)
4. how the heck do you cut down a PEI build plate?????? 10 POINTS FOR NON - SENSIBLE ANSWERS

[unborn merlin]

it does look dope, but print area is like 20x20

you loose soooo much of the Y

but 5015 part cooling for the win

[proven plaza]

isnt this for looks anyway

[proven pendant]

Use a TZ hotend (Bambu clone) and do mini CPAP with some pneumatic tubing

And do some aux part cooling aswell

[proven plaza]

server fans on the side would literally tip it over

[unborn merlin]

well.... at the begining... sort of
it was essentially born from "I WANT ONE!"
but after spending time with the CAD work and having a chat with @spiral lynx who built the first one, who incidentally told me to go for a cereal , it got me thinking
if i'm going for it, i might as well go the hole hog and build a proper printer with the mindset to print ABS & ASA.
so other details were looked at with a bit more care than originally intended.

[unborn merlin]

well the CAD is up on GitHub if you would like to do a mod

[unborn merlin]

https://tenor.com/view/windy-storm-twister-flying-cow-stormy-weather-gif-24931764

[unborn merlin]

could fit in full size motors then
"stand back! its about to go BRRRRRRRR!" 🤣

[proven pendant]

Don't tempt me

[vocal patio]

I love the look of that tiny freaking board. And I’m considering getting one for my Doron Velta. It would fit nicely up in the top electronics bay. And allow for easier awd mod. lol.

[gilded ridge]

See I can't decide now seeing this coming together. Doron, Sub 0, micron120, or mod an F-Zero in to an IDEX and call it fire chicken.

[unborn merlin]

your missing the obvious answer here

[gilded ridge]

All the above will be the goal, the question is which one next xD

[unborn merlin]

i had planned on building another 2 x V0's but then this came along and ruined everything
it's depleted my supplies for the other printers and used up all my spare cash
but it's been a good jeourney and this is something quite special.
but i do know what you mean, i would love a doron velta to toy with and box / pandora would also be cool to add to the family

[vocal patio]

All at once.

[unborn merlin]

if i had the funding, i need a trident and my own 2.4 would be nice
cant count my dads😖

[vocal patio]

My v2 is a micron. Lmao. I only own Voron PFA printers somehow. Minus the Enderwire. That one doesn’t count anyways. It’s in pieces atm.

[unborn merlin]

i kinda made my own version of the E3 with 2.4 Z belt mod, was my first big mod on any printer and it still works well 2 years on.
i have an E5+ thats half way through coversion to Mercury one.1

[gilded ridge]

I've just finished my VT rebuild,got parts on the way for HexZero, and need to order the last parts for F-Zero

[unborn merlin]

oh nice! thats going to be fun to build

[gilded ridge]

I like tiny printers, Sub 0 calls to me.

[unborn merlin]

well you know what you need to do
sacrifice to the gods 1 x V0 frame to be cut down

printed parts are identical for the most part

can always look into it

[proven plaza]

or sheet redirect cooling and just the hotend flailing about 😛

i swear ive seen that

[uneven spire]

v0 bowden toolhead is a nice size ..would fit nicely on sub0

[unborn merlin]

thats what i was thinking as it has cropped up a few times now
look like voron
works like voron
is voron
not much point in re-designing the wheel🤣

[uneven spire]

you can even use the bowden toolhead PCB i might be biased tho

[unborn merlin]

paired with your mini M4 extruder too

[uneven spire]

dual extrusion on sub

ha

that would be funny to see

[unborn merlin]

oh ima go play with this idea

now where would i hang the 2 spools🤣

been playing with that stuff for a while

😱 sub 0 tall boy

[uneven spire]

miniSB_Bowden_PCB
dual_nightwatch_extruder

just get really long 1515 and build them all with the same vertical extrusions

[unborn merlin]

stop it or im going to spend the next week CADing this up

[uneven spire]

just trying to live up to my name

[unborn merlin]

already got them🤣

[uneven spire]

ha they are pretty much done just need to finish the display mount

[unborn merlin]

by chance do you get distracted from what you SHOULD be working on?😁

[gilded ridge]

TaiChi on Sub with dual M4 minis?

[uneven spire]

does today end in Y?

[unborn merlin]

like every other

as long as it works then who should complain

yeah, you end up like that guy up there👆

[uneven spire]

that was my original plan for the V0 before i made the other dual extruder thing

not a TaiChi tho

[unborn merlin]

looks cool man

[uneven spire]

the mini14 extruder works pretty well

[unborn merlin]

i got to build one of those to play with

[uneven spire]

no those were just micron skirts i was messing with , they turned into the stealthskirts by maverick, we both worked on those together he ended up finishing them

https://github.com/VoronDesign/VoronUsers/tree/main/printer_mods/Maverick/V0.2_Stealth_Skirts

oh i forgot i uploaded those

that is them

[languid umbra]

Okay, here's a really bad idea: "Just" design a PCB. Bed heater in the copper traces on the bottom, use the top as a for-free G10 build surface.

[unborn merlin]

your right, thats a terrible idea
i like it - it has merrit and i'm defo gona check this out
but how to mount it?
direct to bed screws?

oh nice find!
that looks awesome - think i might have trouble squeezing all that in on a 42x42 (+ a bit extra) bed heater though
there is also not a lot of room to have much extra in that area
i'm also not good at PCB design, but i know someone who is @stark parcel what do you think of these two proposals?

[languid umbra]

This would be very studly: https://www.we-online.com/en/components/products/SMSE_SMD_STEEL_SPACER_M3_THREAD_EXTERNAL

[vocal patio]

So. Would this printer be a good candidate for a 0.1mm nozzle you think?

[stiff lichen]

What if you just use a PTC heater as a bed, just stick some PEI on the top... https://uk.farnell.com/dbk/hp05-1-10-24/heater-ptc-f-plate-50w/dp/4408391

[vocal patio]

What about a custom glass heat plate? One like people used to make with resistor glued to the glass as heaters.

[proven pendant]

I'm cooking something

its not perfect but its somethings

deciding between keeping bowder or adding sherpa micro

[stiff lichen]

We'll call it Miniburner, you removed the Stealth half.

[elfin token]

what is with @pearl chasm s new yavoth tool head: https://github.com/chirpy2605/voron/tree/main/V0/Yavoth still too big?

[vocal patio]

Considering how tiny this printer is. Yes. Lol. Ideally. You want a toolhead the same size as a v6 hotend. Unfortunately. They don’t make fans that can move air that small.

[tough raven]

Put a 5015 on the electronics bay and have a mini cpap duct to the toolhead

Nano bowden cpap stealthburner, it would be glorious

[vocal patio]

Use it for both he fan and pcf. Lmao.

[tough raven]

I would still have a hotend cooling fan for ahestetics, and fake printed micro part cooling fans on the side

[vocal patio]

If chamber is hot and you are printing then you need fans of some kind. But yes. Literally any water cooled hotend would be a good solution. Only problem being. Hard to find a heat sink that tiny. Lmao.

Not the hotend heat break. That’s small enough already. Cooling the water heat sink. A radiator that small.

That. Would be ugly. Lol

[stiff lichen]

"Affordable" custom loop liquid cooling, you say.

(I'm being facetious, I have some Alphacool hardware in my own loop. Just funny to see "affordable" and custom loop in the same context, hehe.)

[unborn merlin]

Well it's defo out there with the more interesting ideas , but is it really needed?🤔 Plus as space is at a premium this might prove harder than you think.
But you are more than welcome to use the CAD to come up with some crazy mods

Oh good, for a split second I thought you were serious about checking it out🤣

[languid umbra]

Rocket engine style heat exchanger to heat the bed with the heat from the hotend.

[uneven spire]

when nemgrea and i first started the cube printer (sub 0 shown at rmrrf ) i was thinking of doing the same thing with a built in thermistor in the middle

soldered on m3 studs for mounting

[languid umbra]

Yeah, this is the sort of horrors and hackery I want to see in the world.

[stiff lichen]

https://tenor.com/view/some-men-just-want-to-watch-the-world-burn-batman-alfred-quotes-gif-14054558

[uneven spire]

you should see the one i was trying to make for a printer that only prints benchys...the coil on the heater was benchy shaped

@languid umbra

[unborn merlin]

thats cool

[uneven spire]

it was the result of late night and a what if

[unborn merlin]

Had to print one off today, because... well. BECAUSE

16tooth pullies came in today, so belts on tonight👍

should be good to test the motion system tonight

[stiff lichen]

I feel like there was a missed opportunity to have the CT3D.xyz text in the heater. 🤔

[uneven spire]

nice!

[uneven spire]

oh that would have been perfect

[unborn merlin]

It's a shame I didn't get another one of the smaller nema 14s as this would have been perfect for it.
It's also a little too big for the Sub 0😭
Had a bit of a play around to see if it could be mounted in a way that didn't look like a "wait we forgot something?!?"🤣

[uneven spire]

just means you need to make an even smaller one with 3mm belts and a nema8 stepper

[unborn merlin]

Nema 6

[uneven spire]

how about one of these steppers

yes thats a microSD card its sitting on

🤣

[unborn merlin]

[uneven spire]

bought those for the nanobeam v2 that i never finished lol

[stiff lichen]

What the heck is that, a 1/4 scale V2?

[uneven spire]

yes lol

5x5 aluminum extrusions

[uneven spire]

its at the moment just a model , doesnt work..thats it sitting on top of a v0 top hat https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1011476576266883082/1200078116241023026/20220701_115918.mp4?ex=666c4d57&is=666afbd7&hm=0c789f92d0b05ce7751931f2d4976883c48a4e5eaaeb02d17c67aac421b8ddca&

[stiff lichen]

I applaud your dedication to... uh... whatever it is you've achieved there. 🤣

[unborn merlin]

dude you got to finish that one
i remeber you posting some pics of it a while back
that would be legendary if it was a powered motion😱 🔥 🫠

[tough raven]

No 1.25" screen, hard pass

[uneven spire]

i want to , i need to reprint it all with a resin printer 🤣

[unborn merlin]

maybe i should rename this channel to "printers smaller than reality"
or "printers so small they defy any real world use scenario"

[uneven spire]

resin printer will be better...it was really funny printing these out on a 350 v2
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/868289527666581554/975742275294494720/20220514_151647.mp4?ex=666c3cce&is=666aeb4e&hm=f3132b034c0441d18b8c9cbc18babccb2860316e88fbb6c31e57176ad6bc1f56&

[unborn merlin]

i bet it was
30 mins chamber heating
20 sec print time

0.2 nozzle
0.12 layers?

[uneven spire]

yeah something like that iirc what ever the smallest revo nozzle was at the time

[unborn merlin]

resin will defo be the way to go
details would be poppin

how would you go about the flying gantry though?

[uneven spire]

thats a good question

[unborn merlin]

if it was a trident i suppose you could use CD player motor lead screws for the lazer

[stiff lichen]

(I'm now imagining that 1/4 scale gantry hanging off a quadcopter)

[unborn merlin]

thats been done, just not 1/4 scale

[safe stream]

CPAP will be extra-hilarious. please do it. and use a bendy straw as the hose

[stiff lichen]

CPAP, but it's a 5015 blower and a bendy hose.

[languid umbra]

Putting the CRAP in CPAP.

[unborn merlin]

it will fit an 80% scale benchy

[stiff lichen]

Gotta get that 0.15mm nozzle out for the 25% scale benchy.

[unborn merlin]

printed in ASA CF🤣

[uneven spire]

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256804520818389.html

[stiff lichen]

You're going to have to print yourself a microscope to work on these things if you keep that up.

[unborn merlin]

perfect😍

[spiral lynx]

get the models ready i have a resin printer coming next week

[languid umbra]

After V00.0.xxxx serial numbers will start to resemble IP addresses.

[tough raven]

One hotend that can only go up and down and 1mm2 build plate

[stark parcel]

0.004mm nozzle

[unborn merlin]

flow rate of 0.0001mm/3

[unborn merlin]

So what tension should I be setting here🤔

[stark parcel]

150... 😛

[safe stream]

those look like 12mm belts

[proven plaza]

just go around saying "this is gonna be the stiffest v0 ever"

[stiff lichen]

V192.168

[unborn merlin]

Because first homings are boring
400mm/s @ 20k
not bad for such a smol printer

[unborn merlin]

Oh yeah! Display baby

[proven plaza]

i wanna see a sub0 with color scheme that makes it look like a toy 😛

[vocal patio]

Need 48v conversion next.

[uneven spire]

I'm kinda disappointed it's not blue and black with a yellow and black twin 😂

[spiral lynx]

everyone knows a voron is never finished...

[unborn merlin]

Pitb board in the waiting area

[unborn merlin]

Speaking of not finished, how's yours comming on?

[unborn merlin]

The red is more pastel than it looks on the photos and the white is more natural/creamy colour so it looks more like play dough

[spiral lynx]

Shelved, I'm working on a belted trident at the moment

[unborn merlin]

fair do's, i'm going to hold you to getting a cereal for it though

[stark parcel]

😎

[unborn merlin]

small update - sorry got distracted on a side quest
small update to the CAD work - new mount for the electronics, so better position and more secure
added Sub 0 Belted Z mod
updated the klipper expander mount - small cut out for the USB cable
STL's have been updated to reflect what you actually need for the OEM parts
STL's have now been added to the Custom parts that need to be printed for the Main printer

still working on getting a bed machined and a custom pei sheet to fit
also still working on a heated bed option
cable chain in dev stage currently, so we will see how that goes

next up though is to properly wire things up and get the toolhead mounted and wired in

[vocal patio]

Keenovo for the bed heater?

[unborn merlin]

defo an option
might send them an email to see what they can do

was looking for something off the shelf first before going down that route

[vocal patio]

100w ac bed for the sub 0.

[unborn merlin]

it'd melt

[vocal patio]

I’d be surprised. Coconut has a 250w ac bed for their v0.

[unborn merlin]

thats true 🤔 food for thought

[vocal patio]

What wattage would you even need for that bed? Like 40w? Could just add a hole in the bed itself for a cartridge heater for a hotend.

[safe stream]

Mains powered bed or nothing. Go from 20c to 100c in 45 seconds

[vocal patio]

Or less. Lmao. Use a 40w ac heater cartridge. Probably easier to design a bed with a hole for a cartridge rather than find a heat mat for it.

[unborn merlin]

Would that not cause a hot spot and with the hole in the bed plate cause 🌮

[vocal patio]

One on each side? I dunno. I’m just throwing out ideas. Lmao.

[unborn merlin]

ideas are where the next innovation comes from

[vocal patio]

Like me throwing a Goliath toolhead on micron+. Lmao.

[astral elbow]

Get a 42x42x42mm alu block as bed and put the heater in the middle..

[full stump]

https://tenor.com/bTPyk.gif

[astral elbow]

Thinking outside the box: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radioisotope_heater_unit

[full stump]

We haven’t seen nuclear vorons yet

I know a guy

[languid umbra]

Hey, this is the weird shit I want to see in the world. I've been making comments.

[stiff lichen]

Are y'all building the Demon Voron in here while I've been busy moving.

[languid umbra]

Just putting the "SEIZE HIM!" in the cesium.

[languid umbra]

Also, imagine how much joy that Fusion Filaments would get from their filament being printed by a nuclear voron.

[uneven spire]

get a thicker aluminum bed and drill a hole and mount a hotend heater in it

[vocal patio]

That was my idea! Lmao

[uneven spire]

really tho i think a bambu clone hotend heater would be great

the flat ceramic heaters like this

[vocal patio]

Exactly like that! Simple to use and should work great!

[unborn merlin]

interesting idea and not one i have looked at yet
been a little distracted as of late

how would one go about fixing it to the bed though🤔

[uneven spire]

They are fixed to the heater block with little spring clips ...you could probably use something similar..like a small piece of spring steel that gets screwed to the bottom of the aluminum pressing it against the bed

[astral elbow]

There's also heat conducting glue..

[uneven spire]

yeah thats the main reason i suggested a spring clip of some sort, makes it easy to replace if it breaks

[plain rain]

How large are they? Could use something similar to the boxxy bed method (unless you're reading this boxxy and you'd like to make a 42mm bed) and use a metal plate to squish it

Baby Boxxy Bed

[vocal patio]

42mm plate

Those heaters are like 5x10mm

[plain rain]

Man I gotta shleep lol. Idk why I thought 20

[plain rain]

Group of 4 could be even enough? I think the dragon ace ones are bigger but they don't sell just the heater usually

[plain rain]

Mellow has some 6.8*15 ones c:

I just found the git hub and aww 🤏 it's so cute 🥺

Based on the current github is building one toooo difficult or no?

[unborn merlin]

a Sub 0?
its like a V0 but way more fiddly
but its good fun defo!
project is on hold for the time being as funds are a bit tight - just dropped a cool 500 notes on the dog🤦‍♂️

[vocal patio]

And way less room for wires.

I wonder if I should try building one but with a printed frame. With it being so small it should be fine. I’ve been wanting to try building a v0 with printed frame and rails. Just for fun. Not speed ofc.

[languid umbra]

Then you can print a Sub-00 on your Sub-0.

[vocal patio]

Lmao! That’d be hilarious

I’m also curious about attempting to make 3d printed steppers. This could be a fun project. Lol.

[elfin token]

We could stack those like a matryoshka🤣

[unborn merlin]

Go for it, would be good to see one👍

[unborn merlin]

The one thing I have found on the sub 0 is that the motion system is quite stiff (belts) but it is also new belts etc so might need breaking in.
At first few runs it stalled the motors. Had to turn up the amps.
Max is 0.5a and I'm running 0.4a just to get it moving

[full stump]

i have a big box of makerbeam that i ordered by mistake

need to use it up

the standard stuff, not XL

[unborn merlin]

Sounds like you have just found the project you need

[full stump]

i do have a bunch of teeeeny linear rails somewhere too from another project

this might be the tallest sub0

[vocal patio]

Mine would be very slow. Lol. I’ve always wanted a project to do with printed linear rails. Just for fun mainly. Not meant to be a perfect printer.

[full stump]

where the heck does the extruder go

oh i'm being a doofus. there is room for miniSB dd

[unborn merlin]

For the bowden setup?

[full stump]

just opened the CAD and it loads with the bowden toolhead first

[unborn merlin]

Ah yes, might have to change that

I'm trying to squeeze in the mini m4 extruder that @uneven spire did. I've printed one off to muck about with and it's awesome

[full stump]

i think i'll gradually work on doing a 1010 frame, as ill advised as it is

[unborn merlin]

I briefly touched this and M2 fixings for the frame😬

[full stump]

i needed a new cad project anyway

[unborn merlin]

Fair enough🤣 it will defo be a challenge

[full stump]

off topic, but the last big CAD project is now completed (and also what i have the tiny linear bearings left from)

[unborn merlin]

You've pricked my curiosity
Umm what is it?

Looks like an ice maker?

Waffle maker?

Giant USB thingy

[full stump]

keyboard switch break-in machine

not my cup of tea, but the keyboard nerds love their broken in MX switches

[unborn merlin]

You have to break in keyboards?

[full stump]

not really. but some switches benefit from it apparently (cherry brand, kailh brand)

[languid umbra]

So, after that you want to switch things up?

[full stump]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/340410967043342337/1015197915582566420/image0.gif

[plain rain]

Tldr: after using switches for a time, the peaks and valleys should smooth out and create a smoother switch.

Downside of course includes a little more wobble.

Some go as far as to pack them with diamond polishing paste to speed up this effect and end with a smoother final surface

Tldr: a little bit of keyboard scope creep

[unborn merlin]

You learn something everyday

[vocal patio]

And the weirdest part for me. Is my keyboard used optical switches now. 😅

[plain rain]

Vury nice. Why the switch to optical?

What I need me is one of those hall effect keyboards

Ah wait this is subzero thread lemme post something on topic

2% milk keeb

[vocal patio]

Spilled orange juice on keyboard and needed a replacement. Corsair k100 had the optical switch option. So I went for it.

[plain rain]

Could probably put this on the subzero somewhere useful

[vocal patio]

We need an air filter that small for the sub 0.

[plain rain]

Just take the mf nano and make it an mf pico

3007 slim fan from sunon would be perfect

[vocal patio]

There’s also the 4015 blower.

Which I only discovered recently.

[plain rain]

I may need some googling

[vocal patio]

It’s a very interesting blower. Very fat.

[plain rain]

Hehehehehehahrhe

Why do they look so funny xD

[vocal patio]

Right?! I got them for bed fans in my micron+. But they would be a good option for down sizing a filter for the sub 0

[vocal patio]

@unborn merlin Goliath when?

[unborn merlin]

now that would be crazy

[proven pendant]

Do you have a link to the TPU Voron?

[vocal patio]

I do not

[unborn merlin]

whatttt... someone have printed a TPU voron?

[meager dragon]

https://tenor.com/view/mortal-kombat-sub-zero-i-am-sub-zero-mortal-kombat2021-mortal-kombat-movie-gif-22197466

[vocal patio]

@dusk marsh Might just have a photo or video of it they could share perhaps?

AND ITS PRINTING IN TPU?! @unborn merlin @proven pendant #voron_0_questions message

[vocal patio]

@turbid coral I know you said you found it but also here’s the link anyways. #1243318894521876544 message

[dusk marsh]

It prints TPU quite well, but it's been sitting in a Pelican case for the last year. Doing a full rebuild in the near future, hopefully.

[uneven spire]

Yes 4015s magnetoX uses those

And ||<REDACTED>|| used them too

[unborn merlin]

Found some time today to start machining a bed up for the Sub 0.
Just got holes to drill for the first one to try it out😁

[turbid coral]

3d printed frame

Not very square tbh but a good proof of concept. If you can avoid warping better that I could you'd probably have better results

[unborn merlin]

Dude that's awesome

Love the colours BTW
Was that done because you couldn't decide what one you liked best

[turbid coral]

.step if anyone wants

[vocal patio]

Nice! Both me and Hartk want to print the frame too but we want it to be a single print.

[turbid coral]

How's that going to work?

[vocal patio]

I don’t think either of us know yet. 😅

But I do plan on modeling one up eventually. Just basically needs 0 overhangs and to be printable in 1 print. Shouldn’t be hard to do.

[turbid coral]

I could have made the walls solid, in which case it would be printable in one piece but I wanted to keep the original look so that's why I didn't go that way

[vocal patio]

That’s fair. I plan on modeling it up with LED walls in mind. Cause ya know. LEDs.

[turbid coral]

If I had nitro I'd react with the rainbow voron logo however that's not the case

But that sounds cool

I'm trying to see how much of this printer I can build with the parts that I have lying around / 3d print. I made these linear bearings that work suprisingly well for being 3d printed (uses some ptfe tube to slide). Also modified a few pieces such as the z motor mount as I don't have an integrated z screw.

[vocal patio]

You’re doing something extremely similar to what I plan on doing. Lmao. 3d printed linear rails and carriages with a printed frame and everything. Just don’t plan on printing fast on it. Friction = heat = melted printer.

[turbid coral]

Yep sounds about right

I'll share the onshape doc rq

[vocal patio]

I use fusion. Lmao.

[turbid coral]

https://cad.onshape.com/documents/675096c3f2cee18bff96b9fb/w/44d6ae8969287ede422ec8fd/e/f5a8b277ab0775f2e75436b7?renderMode=0&uiState=668e30b5311fcb1288d0daab well you can download anything you want from it and bring it over

or just see what i got

I also modified the rails to use flat head instead of socket head bc that's what I have on hand

[turbid coral]

@vocal patio no lube and not a super clean print. Could definitely make it more smooth, but at the same time pretty good.

[vocal patio]

Sounds more than smooth enough for 100mm/s print speeds to me. Lmao. Wonder what input shaper will say. Especially after the weight of the gantry is put on those tubes for a while. Maybe fill the tubes with filament or 2mm pins just to keep them from crushing from weight on them.

[turbid coral]

Good idea

[turbid coral]

Z axis in but I want to change a few things before I continue. The frame needs a rework. I think instead of the frame having all the heatsets, it should be the parts and you screw them in through the frame. It's very difficult to do so many heatsets and it's even harder to fix any that are out of place. Not to mention, it's a huge pain to reprint the frame, less of an issue with single parts

Also does anybody know which filament would be best for the frame? I used pla in test as I had some trouble with my bed magnet but idk if abs is the way to go, as it's not as rigid. Maybe cf or gf?

[proven pendant]

PC blend?

[turbid coral]

Possibly. Don't want too much warping, which was an issue on the big side pieces due to the weak bed magnet I have.

Update:

• Increased internal rail angle from 40 degrees to 45 for a better clamp
• Inverted some connecters and heatsets to make installation easier
• Removed an arc off of the bottom back extrusion to permit room for the coupler to spin freely
  I wonder if I should make a build log. This channel is small enough though lol.

Waiting on hardware to continue

[unborn merlin]

Dude this is awesome work, great to see a different spin on the whole thing!
Keep posting updates

[vocal patio]

So uh. How long of z you planning?

[turbid coral]

I've figured out that you don't even need rails at a certain point. It just floats off

Just bought some new sparkly orange abs for this project. Almost out of the hot pink unfortunately :/

[turbid coral]

I'm dumb lol. I could just use some binder clips. duh.

[vocal patio]

Iirc if it’s warping that badly binder clips aren’t gonna help. The print will just warp off the bed instead the bed warping off the magnet.

[turbid coral]

I'll try more glue. I got the good stuff. I have the enclosure too so I'm not sure where the issue is. It could be that specific filament as I've been printing some larger abs pieces with little to no warping.

[turbid coral]

I'm going to try the vampire bat gantry. Single mgn9 rail (no extrusion) and it's rotated 90. I'm pretty confident that the rails are sturdy enough, especially when the belts are in.

[turbid coral]

Tbh it'd be really easy to scale up the z. Imagine this thing with like 250mm of z height lmao.

[turbid coral]

That's true. I may try to combine them by keeping the extrusionless factor

[turbid coral]

Different filament, minor warping. The pink was I little but old at that point so maybe that was it

[turbid coral]

decided not to go extrusionless

[turbid coral]

Reverse bowden capricorn tubing has enough inner diameter to fit an m3 screw so I think I'll try to use that as the bearing solution for printed idlers.

[full stump]

i suppose the challenge here is to see if i could print-in-place this on my toolchanger

[turbid coral]

Taking "printed printer" to the next level

[safe stream]

"More printers’ printers print prints for printers’ printers than printers print prints for printed projects"
-Zack Freedman

[languid umbra]

You know, I've only been falling in that category lately.

[safe stream]

no one needs a Z height above 150mm

[full stump]

i need to keep this going in one direction or another

[turbid coral]

well this is comfy

[unborn merlin]

a nice snug fit

if you work it right you could use them to heat the chamber

[turbid coral]

Everything's ready and I'm printing. Only things I don't have are the nema 14 steppers, control boards, z endstop, and front fan (and wires)

[turbid coral]

I wonder if heatsinks on the steppers would make that work better 🤔 not going to be running it that fast at all tho

[unborn merlin]

keep the motors cool and the chamber hot👍
yeah i know what you mean, i stopped at 400mm/s @ 20k

[turbid coral]

Concern for me is that it'll deform or break the plastic lol.

Rails and bearings

[turbid coral]

my micron will fit on my trident's bed, this funny printer will fit on my micron's bed

Remodeled an ender 3 extruder for the small form factor. I hope I won't regret it but again, slow speeds

[vocal patio]

Those actually work better for higher speeds imo. Since no gear ratio the motor actually turns slower than things like Sherpa mini or wwbmg. At least. In my head they do. 😅.

[turbid coral]

I don't wanna have to find a new spot to mount one tho. Fits very nicely atm. Ig we'll see if that's an issue.

[unborn merlin]

And then there were two

[stiff lichen]

What a terrible shame, looks like you've got spares to build a second

[unborn merlin]

im going to try the polymide heater i got on one of them and the heater cartridge on the other so i can see what does what and go from there

[turbid coral]

Let me know what heater works best! I don't have a cnc so I might have to use pcbway or smth. At least I can anodize it a cool color that way

Also dunno about the detachable pei. I wonder if they make them that small.

I could probably get a trimmable sheet and put it on laser cut spring steel sheet

[turbid coral]

@unborn merlin where did you get your power supply?

Also could I get a quick look at your electronics

[unborn merlin]

this question accualy made me find i had uploaded the wrong format for the BOM on the GitHub repo - so thank you for that, it has now been updated.
but to save you going there...
https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07CHDZQDH?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details

[unborn merlin]

at the moment its just the rpi and MCU in there, the wiring was just jerry rigged to get it working to test

[turbid coral]

Ik you said it's ugly, but how did you wire from the power input port to the mcu? Electronics are the one thing I don't have that much experience with and I haven't used a psu like this

[turbid coral]

Nvm I think I got it. Power to skr pico and pico to pi.

[unborn merlin]

yup that the one

couple of pics to help you out a bit

i have the rpi connected to the pico with the UART cable that comes in the pico box

i trimmed down the soldered connections on the back of the pico board to get rid of the pointy bits and stuck on a couple of layers of polymide tape to protect the cable from the rpi to the pico

[turbid coral]

Thanks :)

Rq, what's that green board on the bottom for?

[unborn merlin]

oh the klipper expander?
mainly for some lighting in the print area but it just alows for a few extra bits here and there if i get round to fitting some

like temp sensor for chamber temps and maybe some neopixle lighting too

[turbid coral]

Oh nice. I won't be needing that then. Keeping it nice and simple ;)

[unborn merlin]

thats how mine started

once i have it built and running properly i might throw the Tulip Pin Mod on it just for kicks

[vocal patio]

I still think the heater cartridge one will be the best one for ease of access. And in just thinking about it. If a 42mm bed warps any amount that affects a print then it will be a visible warp. Since ya know. It’s so freaking tiny.

[unborn merlin]

@vocal patio did you get the sketch i uploaded for you?

[vocal patio]

I did. I have not loaded it up yet. Lol. But we did manage to finally constrain the stupid thing anyways. Now I gotta figure out the micron logo (which someone has sent to me already) and then somehow do the PFA logo. That thing scares me.

I mean. Just look at this thing. The only benefit it gets is the fact it’s mirrored.

[unborn merlin]

good luck that makes my head jurt just thinking about the constraints😖

[vocal patio]

Trust me. My head hurt trying to figure out the Voron logo. I’m pretty sure my mind is gonna melt. 😭

I just want parameterized led serial plates. 😫. Why’s it gotta be so hard?! 😅

Btw. That’s why I want the logo constrained so well. The extrusion size the plate is going on is also a parameter.

[unborn merlin]

thats some little project you have🫠
hope you get that working

[vocal patio]

Me 2. Goal is 6 variants. 3 logos and then left and right versions of all 3.

Despite both the logos being mirrored by accident that I still can’t figure out. I still think this thing turned out great for a first attempt.

[unborn merlin]

ooooo fancy

[turbid coral]

Looks sick even despite the logos being flipped

[turbid coral]

It looks like I can print a full-size benchy!

[vocal patio]

Prove it by doing it. Sub 5 minutes is all I will accept.

[turbid coral]

I'm pretty sure it'd completely fall apart

[vocal patio]

More than likely. 🤣

Although with how small that thing is it’s not unlikely that it will have a huge acceleration benefit.

[turbid coral]

True and I actually bought good steppers fsr

I have an accelerometer so we'll see

[vocal patio]

@unborn merlin Your sub-0 moves already right? Shaper graphs? Pretty please!

[unborn merlin]

It does, but no graphs yet.
Need to sort the software out for that. I might do some of that tonight if I get some time👍

[unborn merlin]

Also remember cheap rails so I'm not holding my breath

[vocal patio]

We would be very interested. 😁

[vocal patio]

They are so tiny I don’t think even printed rails are gonna make that bad of a graph.

[unborn merlin]

It has pricked my curiosity for sure, the frame should give some interesting resonances

[unborn merlin]

Preload is not high on these. Got to swap one out as it rattles😖

The other 4 are fine though🤷‍♂️

I wonder if it's worth cutting down a honeybadger mgn9 rail🤣

[turbid coral]

Are you going to do your printed rails the same way I am or do you have another plan? It'd be interesting to see an alternative

[vocal patio]

No idea yet. I’ve got like 12 projects ahead of building another Voron. 😅

[turbid coral]

Ah fair.

[vocal patio]

I do plan on printed frame at the very least. And that will be another project before building another Voron. Since ya know. I’ve got to design the silly thing.

[turbid coral]

The tedious part is getting all the heatset holes. I had to go back probably 20 times to fix any that I missed

[vocal patio]

I build my printer in cad now. That will be extremely easy for me to find and fix. Hopefully. I’m probably gonna miss like 20. Lmao.

[turbid coral]

I meant in cad lol + every time I modified something I had to change it. Hex gantry had me moving every hole on top 😭

[turbid coral]

chamfers, why do you do this 😭

[unborn merlin]

fusion360?

[turbid coral]

Onshape

[unborn merlin]

ah

not played with that one

have you tried deleating the face to see if it blends the fillets together?

[turbid coral]

Yep didn't work

dw I solved it tho

just deleted that tab completely

[unborn merlin]

nice

[turbid coral]

Moving around the bed mounts

[unborn merlin]

for your bigger bed

[turbid coral]

Yep

[unborn merlin]

60mm?

[turbid coral]

Yep

60x50

[unborn merlin]

[turbid coral]

Enough room for a benchy and a purge line B)

[unborn merlin]

might be worth adding in the bracing on the inside of the rear mounting holes to keep it stiff

[unborn merlin]

how tall is a benchy i cant remember

[turbid coral]

48

whats the z height?

[unborn merlin]

how you gaining the extra z?

42mm

[turbid coral]

🤫

[unborn merlin]

thats with 2mm of run off from the rails - i think, gona have to check that

[turbid coral]

Hex gantry is raised up a lil bit I think

By 5.4

should be enough

Omg that clutched up

[unborn merlin]

yeah i think you can push rail run off by 3mm tops

[turbid coral]

Then I'm definitely good

[turbid coral]

I'll add some ribs

[unborn merlin]

mind you, your doing printed rails arent you?

[turbid coral]

Yeah

exact same dimensions as standard tho

[unborn merlin]

just make them a bit longer and your all good

no need for run off

[turbid coral]

What I'm doing rn

[turbid coral]

What exactly is that btw?

[unborn merlin]

its where the carriage goes past the end of the rail - the cart has the rubber seal / buffer and a plastic part on each end so you can push it off a bit before the ball bearings are exposed and you risk them falling out

its typically 2-3mm to be safe but i have heard of some going further

[turbid coral]

That's what I figured just hadn't hear that term before

good to know

[unborn merlin]

im uk side so terminology might be different

i suppose you could call it over run / over travel

[turbid coral]

I can also lower the bed a little bit as long as I'm careful

[unborn merlin]

yep that would work too

[turbid coral]

I just call it "too far" lol

[unborn merlin]

nah thats when the balls fall out🤣

[turbid coral]

"almost too far"

Printing parts is taking a while but I think it's good to go in theory

[unborn merlin]

always works in theory😁

[turbid coral]

Well I'm waiting for some parts and I haven't ordered the bed yet

[turbid coral]

Somethings bound to go wrong 😅

[unborn merlin]

where you getting it made?

[turbid coral]

planning on pcbway

[unborn merlin]

always, i went through a few iterations on some of the parts that way, but was good to get a real world feel for what i was designing

[unborn merlin]

i got a quote for 42 bucks for the 42mm bed plus shipping

[turbid coral]

Not too bad

[unborn merlin]

then i remebered i had some 5000 series 10mm aluminium kicking about

[turbid coral]

Don't have a cnc unfortunately

I also want a laser cut spring steel bed

I'll just stick some pei sticker on it or smth

[unborn merlin]

i wish i had one of thoes
was all done old school

[turbid coral]

No mill either :(

[unborn merlin]

you can get custom ones
ill send a link

[turbid coral]

That'll definitely save a few bucks

[unborn merlin]

staple part of a good workshop - sadly not in mine though
went to my dads work to use the machines there

[turbid coral]

I'm hoping I can get a job somewhere with one eventually

[unborn merlin]

https://embracemaking.com/products/magnetic-flex-build-plate-systems

[unborn merlin]

its a good tool and great knowledge to have

and a nice lathe

im lucky i have access to both for the time being

[turbid coral]

do you happen to know where they're located can't find it on the page

[unborn merlin]

probably china but im not sure - hold please

[turbid coral]

Oh also, which size heater did you buy (will you buy)?

I found another one that ships free that looks nice. They do prints on the plate too so I could get a voron logo too. I'll send an inquery to both and see which is a better price.

https://www.emberprototypes.com/products/custom-textured-pei

[unborn merlin]

from what i can stipulate it seems to be a small company (probably 1 or 2 people) that source stuff globally and market them for sale (from the states)
so probably china stuff to be fair

[unborn merlin]

im chasing 2 ideas at the moment
i got a 5w 24v 25mm dia heater (stick on) from ali express to try out
probably very under powered tbh but got to give it a try
the other would be a heater cartridge - so simple hole into the bed

failing that i might contact Keenovo and get a custom mat heater

[unborn merlin]

this look intersting - if they do custom jobs then it might be worth it

would be nice to have a logo on it or something to make it special

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005006642022928.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.order_list_main.10.1b081802sp68rg

this is the small polyamide heater i got

[turbid coral]

On the idea of the heater cartridge, they come in various lengths (including 40mm and 60mm) so If you inserted one into the side I think that could work

[safe stream]

I've gotten a custom sized plate from ENERGETIC 3D Store on AliExpress

[unborn merlin]

What was the price like?
Reasonable?

[unborn merlin]

Yeah that's sort of what I thought too. Also get a thinner one, like the 4mm dia ones

[safe stream]

Yep. They had me pick out a standard size and add a note with the custom size. (310x310 for a 235x350)

Probably get 3 or 4 for the price of a 120

[unborn merlin]

Oh that would be cool 😎

https://a.aliexpress.com/_EHzkiUJ

12 and 24v 40w 30mm long heater cartridges

I'm wondering about using 2 with temp sensor in the middle.
Could use 12v heaters in series and run duty cycle at 0.25 to keep the power consumption down.
2 x 40w × 0.25 = 20w total.
Should be enough for a 42mm bed

[turbid coral]

Good idea

[turbid coral]

I'm going to see if mandala rose works will do it for cheaper.

[vocal patio]

What about an aluminum PCB heater? Like those pcb reflow heater things but for the bed and bed heater. A 42mm bed doesn’t need to be the spec 6-8mm thick to help prevent warping.

[turbid coral]

How would you mount it tho

[unborn merlin]

Yeah but it looks the biz though

I've gone for 8mm thickness so I can put a 6mm cartridge in one

I think the bed is possibly the most tricky part to get stuff for

[turbid coral]

Yes lol

[unborn merlin]

I think it might be a good idea to document the bed stuff for the repo.

[turbid coral]

The various options or just which one worked best?

[unborn merlin]

Possibly both to start with, then other can have the choice at least

So have a recommended setup and other variants as options

[turbid coral]

Good idea

Just update the BOM?

[unborn merlin]

Maybe, might do a separate doc for beds.
I have a think on it

What happened to the link you posted?

[turbid coral]

Removed it bc i found a better one

1 sec

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256803842920373.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.main.3.48c5dzTOdzTOJM&algo_pvid=64f72add-4623-4e86-8219-af1cd0ef3ba5&algo_exp_id=64f72add-4623-4e86-8219-af1cd0ef3ba5-1&pdp_npi=4%40dis!USD!11.03!11.03!!!11.03!11.03!%402103250717209710662226403eefdf!12000027796017287!sea!US!2914185819!&curPageLogUid=m8Qi8nqSJpyk&utparam-url=scene%3Asearch|query_from%3A I'm not sure exactly how hot it gets but there are a variety of sizes

https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256803669225182.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.main.1.48c5dzTOdzTOJM&algo_pvid=64f72add-4623-4e86-8219-af1cd0ef3ba5&algo_exp_id=64f72add-4623-4e86-8219-af1cd0ef3ba5-0&pdp_npi=4%40dis!USD!18.05!18.05!!!18.05!18.05!%402103250717209710662226403eefdf!12000027343135998!sea!US!2914185819!&curPageLogUid=buLwBN8574o1&utparam-url=scene%3Asearch|query_from%3A This one has a really tiny one that might fit on yours

[turbid coral]

This one might be better

[unborn merlin]

Gona have to change my contry🤣 no available for uk

[turbid coral]

Oof forgot about that. I had to buy a different psu for same reason lol.

[unborn merlin]

Is it the small polyamide heaters?

[turbid coral]

Yeah

[unborn merlin]

I got this one, 24v 5w 25mm dia
220degree heater

[turbid coral]

My concern with these is the mounting holes

[unborn merlin]

Should be fine for that, I could go to 30mm diameter before running into troubles

Loads of room

I'm just a bit concerned that 5w is too low

I'll start gathering the links you posted for USA specific bed bom

[turbid coral]

https://www.digikey.com/en/products/detail/european-thermodynamics-ltd/ETH-127-14-15-S-H1/13566709?utm_adgroup=&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=PMax Shopping_Product_Medium ROAS Categories&utm_term=&utm_content=&utm_id=go_cmp-20223376311_adg-_ad-__dev-c_ext-_prd-13566709_sig-CjwKCAjw7s20BhBFEiwABVIMrajv4Wie056f9ciPZnUpanujjO7-tVF-PEjY8ulCDn4MOgA-mPy4yxoCgxEQAvD_BwE&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAjw7s20BhBFEiwABVIMrajv4Wie056f9ciPZnUpanujjO7-tVF-PEjY8ulCDn4MOgA-mPy4yxoCgxEQAvD_BwE I also found this. 40x40 up to 150c but idk about mounting

[full stump]

https://youtu.be/2tWxbrQyKA8?si=SODLRDMw1SNmPBA- what about one of these?

https://github.com/CarlBugeja/HeatStick

[turbid coral]

100x100mm is too big

[full stump]

There’s a 2x2 and it’s open source

[turbid coral]

Ah didn't see that

[full stump]

Could whip up something specific to sub0

[turbid coral]

I think 25x50 would work well for me

that wasn't meant to be a reply oops

[unborn merlin]

Would be great to get as much coverage as poss to minimise cold spots👍

[full stump]

Let me go back to my desk and fire up Lucas

[unborn merlin]

No major rush, but if your free😁

[turbid coral]

As in that looks good or could be better

my other option is inbetween the two top holes

[full stump]

can you do me a favour and export a dxf of the current build plate bottom

[unborn merlin]

Yep give me a sec and I'll fire up lucifer

[turbid coral]

I removed the chamfers on that btw

[unborn merlin]

Looks like I was beaten too it

[turbid coral]

Already had it open no biggie :)

[full stump]

Have had to pause to cook dinner but got it started

[turbid coral]

Minimum 10pcs for a custom size :/

[unborn merlin]

Not the end of the world for some that small, could use them for other things like hanging one from the rear view mirror

Did they quote a price at all?

[turbid coral]

Keychain

[turbid coral]

$400 for all of them 🗿

[unborn merlin]

😬

[full stump]

porgress

dun

50 usd from jlc without shipping

for 5

jlc don't offer all these options

[turbid coral]

Frame v2 donezo

Still need to trim the leadscrew

[turbid coral]

It ain't pretty but it'll work

[unborn merlin]

thats awesome work!

[full stump]

i put a post up in the voc pcb channel, see if anyone has any comments

in theory the impedance of that trace should work the same as the original inspiration

[unborn merlin]

thanx bud, ill keep an eye on it

[full stump]

i'll see if i can lump some in with my next business jlc order

[unborn merlin]

is that not considered a little naughty🫠

[full stump]

nah

[unborn merlin]

what material did you go for for the frame in the end?

[turbid coral]

abs

[unborn merlin]

no warping this time?

[turbid coral]

Nah idk what's was up the first time

Different spool

Also flipped the lead screw so now it's

[unborn merlin]

oooo pretty

i was lazy and did the belted z

worth putting one of these on the sub 0

[turbid coral]

Already had the parts laying around, recycling an ender 3

[unborn merlin]

oh nice

[uneven spire]

What you don't have a nema 8 leadscrew stepper 🤣

T3.5x1 leadscrew
3.5mm OD 1mm pitch basically an m3 screw

[unborn merlin]

tri-sub?

[unborn merlin]

= no z banding🫠

[uneven spire]

I need to build 2 of these with printed frames , one blue and black with white accents, and the other yellow and black with gold accents
Name them Sub Zero and Scorpion

[unborn merlin]

that would be awesome

[uneven spire]

The frame I DID set aside for my original one that was going to be next to nemgreas at rmrrf is a gold v0 frame

🤔

[unborn merlin]

thats a lot of hardware though for such a smol printer

[unborn merlin]

that would look cool

i used the original frame from my seboor kit

[uneven spire]

Yeah I don't think I'll ever do 2 of them but 1 I still want to do

[unborn merlin]

didnt mind butchering that for this project

[unborn merlin]

defo one for the collection

[turbid coral]

For the silly :)

[uneven spire]

I would want to make it work off a cordless drill battery so you could take it anywhere

[unborn merlin]

im hoping to get some fund together after build 4 to get a trident and then i have all three

[turbid coral]

I just need a switchwire

[unborn merlin]

thats a cool idea, i think there is something along that you could use

[unborn merlin]

oh thats in the pipe line for me too, but the trident/veriants are my top list

got an old ender 3 to donate to that

[uneven spire]

Yeah have a battery slot in the back as well as a DC PSU inlet, that way you could use an actual PSU also

[unborn merlin]

and charge the battery?

[uneven spire]

Yeah exactly

Work with battery or no battery and charge the battery as well

[unborn merlin]

the ultimate on the go printer

[turbid coral]

I was thinking about doing that but decided not to bc I'd need more parts for that than this build

[uneven spire]

For when you get the urge to print some voron cubes out 🤣

[unborn merlin]

i was thinknig the same thing🤣

[turbid coral]

Or benchy in my case 😏

[unborn merlin]

now your just showing off

[turbid coral]

I would never

[unborn merlin]

i might put the tulip pin mod on the sub 0 for kicks

[turbid coral]

Haven't heard of that one

[unborn merlin]

#1259699805693808681

gona push an update a bit later as ive done some small improvements but its good as it is

[turbid coral]

That's cool. My build's not done and I already dislike the idea of adjusting belt tension in the back

[uneven spire]

Dude tulip is so cool...the idlers on the front are

[unborn merlin]

yeah its a sore point for many

[uneven spire]

I'm going to have to do tulip on mine as the AB tensioners hit each other otherwise since it's so small 🤣

[unborn merlin]

daft thing was it was born out of thowing stuff at the wall and looking to see what stuck

[uneven spire]

As most of these printer designs are 🤣

[unborn merlin]

Amekyras was pure inspiration for that mod, i just lent a hand

[turbid coral]

not much wiggle room

[unborn merlin]

Printing off the updated parts to play with

[turbid coral]

Unrelated, sick cowling design

[unborn merlin]

thanx

not much of my parts are OEM shall we say😁

[unborn merlin]

i bet you could get a fag paper in there

[turbid coral]

Theres some uk slang I haven't heard before

[unborn merlin]

got to represent😁

Some of the spoils from R&D😁

[vocal patio]

It could be related. They could be using a similar cowling on the sub-0.

[uneven spire]

Just need to make that into a bent sheet file and get it bent up and send cut send

[stiff lichen]

https://tenor.com/view/japonya-japan-flag-japan-gif-23459943

[polar kraken]

Wonder if it's too much extra bulk to just have folks use something like this for their favorite tool brand. Maybe make some remixable mount/base/backpack. https://www.homedepot.com/p/Milwaukee-M18-18-Volt-Lithium-Ion-175-Watt-Powered-Compact-Inverter-for-M18-Batteries-Tool-Only-2846-20/313297952

[turbid coral]

That's pretty chunky for a printer of this size tbh but idk what the alternative would be

[unborn merlin]

tbf if the output voltage(s) are correct you could 3d print a carrier/dock for the battery and remove the inverter circuit from the chunky case and possibly pack it in a smaller space

[turbid coral]

True

Update

[safe stream]

Love the braces

[turbid coral]

Thanks, tbh I had to trim them a little bit to make room for the bed

https://www.printables.com/model/776688-1515-renforcement-corner-brace They're a remix of some aesthetic ones I made

[vocal patio]

Along the lines of battery powered. If you used low speeds and low power heaters/motors and possibly not a heated bed. You could probably cram enough 18650 batteries in the bottom with a bms and charging circuit to power the thing for quite a while.

[safe stream]

how do the backup printer people power theirs? probably just use that?

[vocal patio]

Via an ups. Cause they are the trusted go to source of backup power.

[full stump]

diesel generator

brrrrrrt

[elfin token]

but only if its 3d printed!