h1-high-heat-strategies

[left prism]

Eris goes oonga bunga

[random hatch]

All feedback have been noted and will be taken into consideration during tomorrow’s runs

[undone tartan]

Heartbreak strike

[random hatch]

o:

[pseudo kernel]

Divine strike for the deflect

[undone tartan]

?

Isn’t it obvious that you would want the biggest % increase in damage

[random hatch]

you know, pointed out it seems very obvious but usually when i play it’s kind of

Zeus go brr sometimes

thanks v much tho!

[undone tartan]

Zeus do not go brr on Hestia. Zeus go

[pseudo kernel]

Idk why you would actually go for Zeus attack on hesita

[random hatch]

i got a sub 11 min run on a lower heat with zeus hestia and it made me happy q.q

[undone tartan]

Yeah that’s baffling to me

[random hatch]

Sub 12*

but yes i will try out aphro hestia and hopefully be a little less dumb about it

Thanks guys

[pseudo kernel]

Well wmic used Zeus attack for all of his runs in a rowo so maybe Zeus attack hestia optimal

[left prism]

Wmic is also the one that can make you believe tidal dash isnt needed for top times in Eris

[pseudo kernel]

That's because it isnt

Optimal eris build is Zeus attack and frost flourish

[next acorn]

http://puu.sh/INBjw/96631982ae.jpg

Actually it’s this

[pseudo kernel]

Damn the rng gods blessed you

[raw cloud]

no

bouldy did

[dapper schooner]

seems to work when I play eris

[undone tartan]

Well not for Hestia though

[cursive portal]

Wmic sends a

[flat flicker]

heh

vowel cat guy

great username

[next acorn]

Westia

[cursive portal]

Wetsia 🔵

I remember kit did a tempest strike sub 9 hesty at some point

[bronze rapids]

It's quite handy in keeping enemies inside the special range actually

[mortal yarrow]

I seem to be stuck at heat 5 for a while. I ve been trying various strategies but to no avail. Anyt tips

[undone tartan]

Tight Deadline 3

5 heat is basically the same as 0 heat isn’t it? The heat options are that heat are so lenient that they’re basically not even there

[dapper schooner]

don't think that's a good pact for a beginner to clear

[undone tartan]

It doesn’t make the game harder

[pseudo kernel]

Sub 20 pretty easy tbh

[undone tartan]

Just makes you learn to play fast

Free heat

[quartz mantle]

Routine inspection 2 HS

[quiet mountain]

no gem without friction

[quartz mantle]

Alternatively just like

UC EM1 MM

Very simple pact

[quiet mountain]

start at 64 and go down until u win

[silent flicker]

suddenly clears 64 in one run

[cursive portal]

Guys I beat 64 heat

But its unrecorded : (

[hardy garden]

https://www.leereamsnyder.com/blog/hades-build-guide id take a read

[dapper schooner]

same :[

along with my modded 3:58 and my unmodded 4:56

[shy gulch]

😔

[undone tartan]

Sometimes I think the difference between Beo EM4 being hard and being free is the fact that Hades spear throw goes through block

If I could just block that attack at point-blank, EM4 would be genuinely easy

But instead it’s by far the hardest part of the run and 50+% of my runs get to and lose to EM4

If you only count runs that leave Tartarus then it’s like 95% of runs

Because I constantly have to be bull-rushing after his first two swipes on the triple spin

Which makes me so much more vulnerable

[hoary pasture]

bullrush the point blank spear

[undone tartan]

That’s what I do

[hoary pasture]

It's pretty consistent for me

[undone tartan]

But having to do that makes me much less safe than if I could hold block until he’s done

Because I can get hit after

Also I just can’t be safe waiting out attack combos by blocking because he can always pull out an attack that will kill me anyway

So I have to constantly be putting space between us

It completely changes the entire pace of the fight

[pseudo kernel]

Sounds like skill issue

[undone tartan]

Definitely

EM4 is kinda unfair but it’s also not RNG so a loss is entirely on me

Although it is a little funny that literally 90% of EM4 runs die to spear throw

[cursive portal]

lol

[hoary pasture]

Summons are plain rng

And sometimes they're really bad

[cursive portal]

90% feels like an overstatement

[hoary pasture]

really really bad

[undone tartan]

It’s genuinely not

I basically never die to anything else

[hoary pasture]

I feel like if you keep hades off screen you'll catch a spear

If you're close you should never take a spear

[undone tartan]

I keep him on screen

[cursive portal]

Why do play so close to him then

[hoary pasture]

sometimes you take a spear but like idk about 90%

[undone tartan]

I’m fine with every single other attack

[undone tartan]

To do damage to him?

[cursive portal]

Your cast has aoe

You dont have to bullrush literally into him

[undone tartan]

Oh to be clear, most of those spears are not from going through shield

[cursive portal]

Even if you do just bullrush away, dont greed too much for the cast pickups

[undone tartan]

It’s just his fastest and most damaging attack with the most range

No other attack is close to spear throw in any category

[hoary pasture]

Are you dash striking right after each bullrush

To start another

[undone tartan]

Almost always yes

[hoary pasture]

That can really get you

[undone tartan]

It can, yes

[hoary pasture]

But it also feels needed since bullrushing is too gud

idk

I dash strike often too

[undone tartan]

It does feel a little stupid how much stronger spear throw is than every other attack he has though

Very imbalanced

Lol I just realized that all but two of my non-EM4 deaths (other than chamber 3 running into traps because vorimed/bad hammer/chaos) in my last 3 hours of grinding have been to speeders

At least 8

Speeders are crazy

Every region is easy except for speeder rooms honestly

Like it’s Beo, I’m not gonna die to regular rooms

But speeder is really nuts

[dapper schooner]

if point blank spear goes through block then just play at range with cshot

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/841266682072530956/931680030856200232/860890017613873193.webp

[undone tartan]

I still avoid CShot aggressively

I’ll take any bad hammer over it

[cursive portal]

Based

[undone tartan]

I just don’t know how to play CShot EM4

Not with Beo anyway

And time isn’t an issue at all

I’m regularly getting to him with more than 6 minutes left

[dapper schooner]

what makes cshot EM4 so bad though

unironically

because thats how i cleared 50 and it was fine

[cursive portal]

I frames

Not being able to collect casts efficiently

[undone tartan]

Those i-frames are way more important than I originally gave them credit for

[next acorn]

Stopping this was my biggest improvement against EM4

Still do it too much but it’s way better than it used to be

[hoary pasture]

Just generally being aware that the dash strikes can hurt you is good

[undone tartan]

Yeah I pay attention to that

[hoary pasture]

I still do it a lot but they're much better timed than when I started EM4 etc

And sometimes I avoid them if its risky

[undone tartan]

Why does Hades cast also go through block?

It seems to do so from an even further range than spear throw

[ripe ermine]

Same reason probably. When it appears its hit box overlaps some not-blocking part of Zag so you get chunked

All kinds of hit box weirdness at the edges of this game, like Phalanx Shot doing backstabs from the front with Parting Shot

[hoary pasture]

I don’t think I ever had cast go through block

[cursive portal]

I have

Its has to be super pointblank though

https://youtu.be/U24rsfQ-_jI?t=1881

timestamped

or was it mid dash strike I actually cant tell

hmm probably was

[mossy zinc]

@eager anchor congratulations! If you re-think submitting your run, they have a modded high heat leaderboard over in the Hades Speedrunning discord (link to the server is pinned in #self-promotion). It might be eligible for that. Because of the specific mods you used in your run, it's not legal on the vanilla leaderboard (which doesn't allow mods that affect the run in any way).

[undone tartan]

52: DC1 AP1
53: DC2 AP1
54: DC0 AP2
55: DC1 AP2

Does that look like good heat progression for Beowulf?

I assume I don’t want to touch RI until 57+ (aka beyond my expected stopping point)

[mossy zinc]

DC1 AP1 is only 3 Heat.

So it already fails there.

[undone tartan]

[hoary pasture]

I don't like DC2 at all

Unless you're hard resetting for Snow burst then ig it's bearable until Aspho miniboss

It's so bad

[undone tartan]

Yeah that’s true

But AP2 sucks

Like a lot

But so does DC2… so

Yeah

You might be right

[hoary pasture]

Idk it's kinda fine when you only need 2 boons

RI0 so you have rolls

[undone tartan]

Honestly I might stop here for a bit. I really hate AP2

Just takes a lot of the fun out of it for me

[hoary pasture]

And for poms I already reset for lv5 by the end of Tart anyway so

Although it's kinda overkill

But it works

Just forget about your cast for the rest of the run

[undone tartan]

I’m just gonna miss having a build

And getting sudden rush

[hoary pasture]

Easy fix: RR

[undone tartan]

How… does that fix anything

[hoary pasture]

It's good damage

And dodge is nice

[undone tartan]

I’ve never learned RR so no

But it would be worth learning at some point for sure

[pseudo kernel]

Rr is really nice

[jaunty falcon]

I’ve only beaten 50 beat beo with RR

Otherwise I just die to dad

[undone tartan]

Maybe I will learn RR then. Do some FO2 EM4 16 heat runs with Beo to practice

I just realize that you can dash between your attack/dash strike and your bull rush charging. Should I be using this? Can’t tell how useful it is

[cursive portal]

Its good for speeding

Can throw you off at high heat I think

[hoary pasture]

I only use it for the first few chambers

Afterwards idk how to make the most out of it

Can also do it with cshot for speedrunning

[next acorn]

RR good

[undone tartan]

Oh I’m really gonna miss getting Chaos boons that actually do anything

[hoary pasture]

you can get special damage

[undone tartan]

To what degree should I fish for near misses? Just play like normal and take it when I get it? Play mostly like normal but put a greater focus on it? Look for specific attacks that I can get near miss on and make an effort to repeatedly take advantage of that?

Also I can’t really expect to get snow burst with AP2 can I? I struggle to get it on AP1

Do I switch back to FF?

[jaunty falcon]

Ngl I thought you were talking about fishing

I just play normally

The window is really generous

[hoary pasture]

You can do FF

I did FF for 55 unmodded

And 2 dashes

Got snow burst anyway

3 sack

[undone tartan]

[hoary pasture]

In hindsight I dont like FF

Sometimes you just have to sell the only thing you have from a god

I ended up with 25% I think which is good but ye you can just get like 15%

kinda sad compared to pstatus

on CP2 dad

[quartz mantle]

with p status you can end up having to sell the only other status you got

losing 5% versus losing 40%

[hoary pasture]

Well yea you can get rekt by UC any time

But it's kinda easier to work around it when it only needs 2 pieces

And it's RI0 so you're most likely gonna pick up some useless garbage along the way and also have 1/2 rolls

[quartz mantle]

Yea p status makes a lot more sense tbh

you're more concerned about the back half of the run

which is where p status > FF

[hoary pasture]

And hourglass is amazing too

highly recommend

You just get one of those

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/841266682072530956/954094584206594178/chrome_4QiE3JkqNi.png

And suddenly you dont care about 3 sack and you dont even time out

[quartz mantle]

:zagasm:

[quiet mountain]

member ship hourglass

[ripe ermine]

Just play normal you’ll get a plenty of activations naturally. The only conscious change I make is I might try to proc it against Elysium arrow traps while baddies are spawning

[undone tartan]

C27 Speeder Slugger brightswords

Frame 2 attack that does ~40 damage

[undone tartan]

Lol when I get savior greatshields on Hestia I literally just let them kill me. Not even gonna try

[dapper schooner]

just activate iframes on frame 1 then

[undone tartan]

Of course! Why didn’t I think of that?

[flat flicker]

just have smair

[undone tartan]

EZ AP2 Smair

[flat flicker]

quitter mentality

never gonna know if you dont try

thats how i know i can do 40 heat and cant do more

are u speedrunning elden ring yet

[undone tartan]

Nah

I’m doing challenge runs though

Was doing some RL1

Now I’m trying to do RL1 +0 no aux no buffs ||Margit|| flawless lmao

[undone tartan]

got it btw

[sacred star]

poseidon + dionysus is very good

poseidon dash + rupture + dionysus attack

i only play spear

then u get +3-4 dash from hermes and triple attack on dash attack

[mossy zinc]

Err... this channel is for discussion of strats at like 32+ Heat.

[sacred star]

idek

what heat is

[mossy zinc]

Might wanna stick to #h1-for-new-players, that channel doesn't have spoilers.

This here is essentially the endgame channel.

[sacred star]

rly

well im not at endgame

so bye

[undone tartan]

[cursive portal]

Im heat

[mossy zinc]

Cool.

[undone tartan]

The difference between 52 heat Beo and 53 heat Beo is kinda

[pseudo kernel]

whats your pact

[undone tartan]

AP2 EM4

Hell mode

CP1

[pseudo kernel]

ap2 😔

[undone tartan]

Yeah exactly

[cursive portal]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/856212370019713035.gif?size=44&quality=lossless

[undone tartan]

I’m entering Lernie with no cast boon

[quiet mountain]

ezpz

[pseudo kernel]

lmao why didnt you reset

[quiet mountain]

unseeded gaming

[undone tartan]

Got ferocious guard and chaos shot

[pseudo kernel]

do you have shackle

[undone tartan]

Also spent the last 10 minutes in Reset Hell

[pseudo kernel]

10 minutes?

thats it?

[undone tartan]

Still mathematically improbable

Even without rerolls I should get it every 4 runs

[hoary pasture]

I think my 55 took 3 hours of resets

[undone tartan]

3 hours of resets just to get your C1 boon??

[hoary pasture]

no

I got it a handful of time

It was 3 hours total

[undone tartan]

So 3 hours of attempts

[hoary pasture]

yup

it actually took less time than my modded 55

[undone tartan]

Chamber 30 flood flare!

Let’s go!

[pseudo kernel]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/787779451865399368/951350511905431602/wmicclapping.gif

[undone tartan]

Died in C33

[next acorn]

Clearly a bad luck charm

[undone tartan]

I hate that flame wheels go around my shield and hit me from behind

It’s kinda stupid lmao

[next acorn]

Just don’t look at the rest of the run if you don’t get c1 boon

Then you cant get attached

[undone tartan]

I usually reset when I get vorimed

But I had 54% chaos shot and ferocious guard so I thought I’d give it a try

Bruh I keep getting offered everything except the cast

It takes me a statistically improbable number of tries to get it

Man AP2 is the antithesis of fun

Nothing kills my will to play the game like spending 20 minutes killing myself in chamber 2

[dapper schooner]

flood flare without mirage very useful

though i suppose it is still better than base cast

[hoary pasture]

base cast with shackle pretty gud

[undone tartan]

Mmm no

[undone tartan]

Bigger AOE and pommable

[next acorn]

Unpommable small pash

[undone tartan]

I should put “pommable” in quotes because it’s AP2

[dapper schooner]

imagine getting poms into a boon you want on AP2 if you didnt pick it up in c1 lmao

[undone tartan]

YOU CAN GET 3 OF THE SAME SUMMON IN EM4??

Wtf

❗

I got 3 sneaks

[left prism]

You never got that before?

[undone tartan]

What a trash boss dude lmao

[hoary pasture]

yea you can

[undone tartan]

EM4 is definitely the worst designed boss in the game

[hoary pasture]

amazing experience when you get 3 crushers

[left prism]

3 b.balls is fun

[undone tartan]

3 sneaks seems like the worst thing though

BBalls are fine on Beo

But sneaks are incredibly bs

Also is it just me or do spearmen regularly stab through block at range

It says “blocked” but I get hit anyway. And it’s just a spearman thing

I think I’ve seen Angel talking about this

It keeps happening to me

Also got a new bug today: a clone with no host. The last enemy left in the room was a clone from a cloner witch but the original witch was already dead and the clone was just chillin

[dapper schooner]

never happened to me on beo but i think its happened to angel on zag

[waxen relic]

They're orphans.

[hoary pasture]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/841266682072530956/955161797445419049/unknown.png

value gaming

[left prism]

Praying for blessed Chaos

[hoary pasture]

was pretty gud no rolls spent

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/841266682072530956/955163779736424498/Discord_2hxcoj8fUy.png

pray for second hammer

and yea

its explosive

[honest kernel]

someone remind me, whats the highest heat cleared no mods/unseeded

[next acorn]

62

[dapper schooner]

62 i think

[next acorn]

It will probably stay at 62 for a long time if not forever because at 63 and 64 you have to give up stubborn defiance

[honest kernel]

thanks

[undone tartan]

Longbows are by far the hardest enemy in the entirety of Hades

And then Greatshields are one tier below them

And then every other enemy is at least two tiers below that

[cursive portal]

Lol

[undone tartan]

3rd place is Dracons

But only BP2 Dracons

Unarmored Dracons are literally so free

But slugger/speeder dracons usually means it’s over

Day 1052 of complaining that benefits package is incredibly imbalanced leading to a greater impact of RNG on runs

[devout quiver]

couldnt you say that of boons and hammers

[undone tartan]

Not the same thing at all

I have influence over my build, at least boon wise. And I’ll never just die from not having a good hammer. But there are some Elysium rooms with BP2 Greatshields or Longbows that are harder than EM4 and that’s not a joke

Even if you do beat them, it can take as long as 3 minutes

[devout quiver]

Puller/Speedster Greatshields lmao

[raw cloud]

wait who are dracons again

[devout quiver]

the tunneling dragon things in asphodel

[raw cloud]

oh ew kill them

[undone tartan]

Puller?

Puller is free what

[devout quiver]

depends on aspect i guess

[undone tartan]

Puller is probably the easiest benefit in the game

I guess maybe on Fists it’s rough

So far I’ve only tried 50+ heat on the good weapons

[devout quiver]

Yeah, and my only real 32+ runs have been on fists

[undone tartan]

Well for my 40 heat fists runs (did 40 on every aspect), I don’t remember puller being a problem

[devout quiver]

Was working on 32 Chiron when i left off, but a series of new releases pulled me off of hades

I mean you're probably better at the game than i am

[undone tartan]

That isn’t my point

Speeder and slugger are definitely always gonna be in a tier of their own, only ever contested by savior on some specific enemies/aspects

Savior greatshields on Hestia are basically just a reset because some rooms are borderline impossible

And if they are possible, they’ll still take close to 3 minutes

Unless you have some specific boons or you have piercing fire

Then they’re less bad but still often a run killer

That’s my issue with BP2 being so imbalanced

One run I could not notice it, but then my next 5 runs could all be single-handedly killed by bad BP2 RNG

[cursive portal]

Puller greatshields literally do not exist

[devout quiver]

Good

sounds awful

[cursive portal]

They used to

Was too hard

[devout quiver]

[cursive portal]

Also saviours didn't have a limit on how many blue hearts they gave

That sounds

Fun

[undone tartan]

Oh god

Wtf

That means some rooms could actually be literally impossible

[cursive portal]

Yes

[devout quiver]

mfw Speed/Savior numbskulls

just get a blue heart bar that goes off the screen in ten seconds

[cursive portal]

The Hestia/arthur run killer

[undone tartan]

Savior numbskulls on Hestia are fine compared to savior greatshields or speeder longbows

Or even slugger longbows

[cursive portal]

Depends if you have tidal dash

[devout quiver]

longbows sniping from off screen

[undone tartan]

Tidal Dash doesn’t really help with Ely enemies that much does it?

[cursive portal]

Sure does with bows

[undone tartan]

Oh

[cursive portal]

Break their armor, get in their face

[undone tartan]

But there’s 6 of them and they’re spread out

That’s what my last two Hestia 50s died to lmao

In a row

[jaunty falcon]

Just had a 55 heat hestia run die to saviour speeder swordsmen in 34

😦

[undone tartan]

Seems about right

Chamber 34 is where most Hestia runs die

[devout quiver]

just don't play hestia, easy enough

[jaunty falcon]

I’m not playing beowulf

[devout quiver]

Gilgamesh is calling your name

[jaunty falcon]

no

I stopped at 40

[devout quiver]

[undone tartan]

I wonder how high I could go with dash only Gilgamesh

I did 40 heat dash only because honestly that’s probably the easier way to do it

What a trash aspect

[jaunty falcon]

50 sounds like pain unless you get early shoals

Shoals is so good for dash only

[devout quiver]

Gilgamesh holds my highest heat clear currently

[jaunty falcon]

Fix it now

[shy plinth]

What's wrong with gilga

:3

[undone tartan]

Lmao what

[devout quiver]

I haven't played in almost a year now.

[undone tartan]

Damn

[devout quiver]

Yeah Gil is my only 32 clear

[shy plinth]

My first 32 and first 40 were both on gilga

[undone tartan]

For real?

Why

[shy plinth]

Claws are fun

[devout quiver]

extra dashes are fun

[undone tartan]

Gilgamesh is probably the most unsafe aspect in the entire game if you use your attack or special

[shy plinth]

Why would I do that

[undone tartan]

[shy plinth]

Just press the zoomy button

[jaunty falcon]

Gilga experience: 🐾 😃 💥 😔 😠

[shy plinth]

I'm not reaching all the way up to the top of the controller

[devout quiver]

my 32 was an ME clear

[shy plinth]

The good buttons are down here

[undone tartan]

Yikes

[shy plinth]

Merciful claws OP

[jaunty falcon]

Pretty much all of my 40 heats on melee weapons used ME

[shy plinth]

Yeah like why wouldn't you

[jaunty falcon]

ZAP

Drunken strike

[shy plinth]

Good reason

[jaunty falcon]

DAP

[devout quiver]

a different run of ME Gil was also the first time i killed EM4, weirdly enough

[undone tartan]

Because idk maybe you don’t want to get hit by every single attack from every single enemy from Tartarus to Hades

[cursive portal]

Hmm yes cant wait for muh epic jolted to be crossed out

[shy plinth]

Getting hit with gilga divine dash? Seems unlikely

[jaunty falcon]

Common clouded judgement 😩

[undone tartan]

It’s actually incredibly likely

[shy plinth]

Cursed

[cursive portal]

Is clouded even good

I literally have no clue

[undone tartan]

Because Gilgamesh’s garbage dash strike has so much end lag for no reason

[jaunty falcon]

Smoldering air probably works out being a 200% clouded judgement

So no

[shy plinth]

Pretty late in the day to choose violence towards us gentle and kind gilga mains

[jaunty falcon]

Boiling point is much better

Or whatever it’s called

[shy plinth]

I believe that is the name of the boon that I had to just look up

[jaunty falcon]

Hunters instinct

Support fire > hunters instinct for charging the call

Unless you’re using zag bow or Nem

[shy plinth]

Support fire better than hunter's instinct eh

I believe you

[undone tartan]

Literally getting blade dash is gonna charge your call 5x faster than clouded judgment

[jaunty falcon]

Or shoals

[shy plinth]

What I have learned: Support fire good shoals good

https://tenor.com/be5I5.gif

[undone tartan]

Shoals actually is good

Support fire sucks most of the time but it’s better than Hunter instinct

[devout quiver]

I was always surprised with how nice Blade Dash was whenever i had it

[jaunty falcon]

Engulfing vortex makes it fun as hell

[undone tartan]

It’s good for charging your call and it does mediocre damage

[jaunty falcon]

It’s quite good as well

Probably third best dash

But so far from 1 and 2

[undone tartan]

Yeah probably

[devout quiver]

early on i avoided it like the plague for some reason

[shy plinth]

Is blade better than hunter dash at high heat?

[undone tartan]

Situational

[jaunty falcon]

For everything except maybe Rama and hestia yeah

[undone tartan]

Hunter dash is either great or useless

[jaunty falcon]

Or zag bow

[shy plinth]

Sure but it seems like hunter dash is better on the weapons actually played at high heat

[undone tartan]

Spread Fire Zag Rail?

[shy plinth]

Except eris

[undone tartan]

It’s worthless on shields

[shy plinth]

I'm sure blade dash eris is fun

[jaunty falcon]

Only half your hits are dash strikes

So nah

[shy plinth]

Hrm reasonable

[jaunty falcon]

Blade dash eris has a few low 6s

But eris wr has no dash so…

[shy plinth]

Lol who knows

[jaunty falcon]

Wmic cracked

5:20

[shy plinth]

The best dash is eris dash

5:20 my word

[jaunty falcon]

Modded

But still

[devout quiver]

no dash best dash

that way you can use shackle

[jaunty falcon]

Just shows how good clockets is

And jolted

[shy plinth]

Jolted and clockets eh

Starting to piece together how this one connected

Though also I am certain the execution was incredible

[jaunty falcon]

“Ooh early Poseidon”
Attack swap, cast, hydraulic
roll
Cast, hydraulic, sunken treasure
crap

[honest kernel]

trying to do all weps 32 heat. got to hades with rama but ummm, well umm, fo2 was a mistake

[undone tartan]

What build are you using?

[honest kernel]

uhh where do I find run history

[undone tartan]

Admin chamber

[honest kernel]

https://imgur.com/UxJL4Ic

I wasn't going for anything, just took what I got

I got 3 aphrodite boons after curse of longing but no empty inside

I got 2 sack as well and I think like 5 mins on the clock, plenty of time for hades

but never fought fo2 hades before

got to p2 then died

[left prism]

Can either practice tight deadline 3 to drop to fo1/use hard labour 3
Tl;dr on rama, start aphro attack/grab zeus-ares-dio special (your choice) tag enemies then dash strike powershot

Hammers mainly twin-triple-point blank-perfect shot

If you want to keep fo2 can also use dem special

[honest kernel]

I don't wanna keep fo2 lol

idk if td3 is gonna work, I managed td3 with arthur but rama I'm so slow

[undone tartan]

That’s a sentence I never thought I’d see

generally Arthur is considered way slower than Rama

[honest kernel]

arthur you just dash swing and it clears rooms so fast lol

[left prism]

Pratice always good so worth trying ig

[honest kernel]

I'll try haha

[undone tartan]

Are you using JS or CP?

[left prism]

Js1

[undone tartan]

Oh I see it

Why DC1?

If you’re tagging with your special, wouldn’t you do either 2 or 0?

[honest kernel]

special clears it for doom

idk

[left prism]

Rama is specially good at clearing dc

[hoary pasture]

Just take DC2 JS0

[undone tartan]

Special shoots 3 arrows

[honest kernel]

will the split hit other enemies 2 times?

[undone tartan]

I mean maybe not but just special twice

It’s worth it

Not too hard

[honest kernel]

yeah sure

I'll pratice td3

[undone tartan]

TD3 is definitely a good idea

[honest kernel]

fo2 hades is too much for me lol

[hoary pasture]

Swap it for HL5

[undone tartan]

Yeah do HL5 FO1/0

[hoary pasture]

You can do HL5 FO0 TD3

Should be okay

[undone tartan]

Yeah do that

[honest kernel]

will give that a shot, thanks guys

[left prism]

Have fun

Also you know about gaining DDs from athena with stubborn defiance?

[honest kernel]

umm whats this?

[left prism]

If you pick last/deathless stand from Athena on a room where you lost your SD you gain a DD then SD recovers next room

[honest kernel]

interesting

I'll see if I can get that after divine dash

[hoary pasture]

I personally don’t like Divine dash as much anymore but it works

*on bows and shields

[honest kernel]

OHH U have to lose your SD to get DD

i did not know that

[honest kernel]

what special boon is best for rama

[hoary pasture]

Any flat damage is fine

So Zeus Ares Dionysus

Situational one would be Demeter with Killing freeze but that's 2 boons

[flat flicker]

Zeus special start is “meta” but you can just use the specials for tags and a big attack and do well rama is insanely busted

[undone tartan]

Start?

I wouldn’t start special on Rama

Definitely start with an attack boon

Since there’s so many good options for special

[jaunty falcon]

Anyheat starts special

[quiet mountain]

aphro o clock

[jaunty falcon]

But heat starts Artemis usually

[undone tartan]

Oh well that’s different

I assumed they weren’t speedrunning

[next acorn]

Why not

[undone tartan]

I definitely don’t like it too much on Beo, I know that

Just isn’t necessary

But then again, most dashes are kinda useless on Beo. Or at least Tidal is (without CShot)

[quartz mantle]

Hunter Dash kinda stonks

Can’t die to things if they’re already dead

[hoary pasture]

idk just does nothing for me

on swords and fists high heat it's probably like best dash

on bows I want hunter and on shields it just does nothing except eat your poms sometimes

atleast for me

[undone tartan]

I remember enjoying divine for Rama but Hunter is still generally better

[hoary pasture]

not gonna complain if I get it

But not gonna force Athena for it either

and ive been liking athena call a lot

so ill just take that if I have the option to

[quartz mantle]

Athena call very goated

[undone tartan]

If it’s not AP2, I take dash over call for DDs

At least in Tart or Asphodel

In Ely I’d take call

[dapper schooner]

i actually really like divine on beo

fills dash without opening duos

and preferable to mistral which is the other one that doesnt open duos

[undone tartan]

Blade Dash doesn’t open duos does it?

Not with passion or flood flare anyway

[dapper schooner]

apparently it opens curse of drowining which makes no sense

but its a thing

[undone tartan]

Wait it does?

How

I thought you needed a curse for that

Like with the other curse duos

[dapper schooner]

yeah i thought the exact same thing

but no

it opens with all ares cores other than cast

(including the call)

[undone tartan]

That’s really dumb

Every good curse duo is unnecessarily hard to get but the terrible one is easy

[dapper schooner]

you say "ever good curse duo" like theres more than one

[undone tartan]

True

I couldn’t remember the third one

But yeah CoL is not great either

Although tbf the requirements on that one make sense because it needs doom

It’s just CoN that has unnecessarily strict prereqs

[dapper schooner]

yeah

wish blade dash opened that one instead

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/818342872888770560.webp?size=128&quality=lossless

[next acorn]

Athena call is very

[hoary pasture]

yea

pretty gud if your weapon is decent at building call gauge and you give it like 1 pom

you can get so much from it

[next acorn]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/787779476888354816/927373071042617374/unknown.png

Will never forget this

No hits outside of acorn

[hoary pasture]

stonks

happened to me yesterday

was dying for a patty or athena dd then I end up not getting hit

[honest kernel]

oops, the emote had a swear

[undone tartan]

[honest kernel]

@undone tartan @left prism I DID IT thanks for the help, I ended up doing the last stand trick but didn't even need it

[undone tartan]

What did you do? 32 heat?

[honest kernel]

ye with rama

[undone tartan]

Nice

[left prism]

Nice

[honest kernel]

Around what heat does the game just become really rng dependant

[undone tartan]

55+

Maybe a bit earlier

But definitely not until at least 50

[honest kernel]

Gotcha

[quartz mantle]

Depends on your pact it can start at 50 if you don’t want to do EM4

Once you pick up the tiers of JS and CP you start relying on free rooms or a really strong build and once you combine that with AP2 or RI2 your build can start to get pretty lackluster without resetting or playing modded

[mossy zinc]

EM4 is also kinda RNG.

[quartz mantle]

In a way but you’re not exactly reliant on good summons to win, bad summons just make it harder

You are typically reliant on boons to win tho and running AP2 with high JS and CP can make that rough

[cursive portal]

Very

[cursive portal]

Show me one rama 50 that won with bballs and sneaks

[mossy zinc]

special only rama is unaruably the only way to make this trash weapon useable. and even then its only somewhat useable since it only has access to one special hammer. its basicially nothing compared to the superiority of chiron. the attack charges up way too slowly to be useable and shared suffering is a gimmick at best, it adds nothing to help pulling this aspect out of mediocrity. if youre lucky enough and get repluse shot you might - and I say MIGHT get the chance to actually get an attack off with this thing, and even then its simply not worth it. the attack speed is way too slow and the damage completly pales in comparison to actually fast hitting aspects like gilgamesh. its sad to say but supergiantgames design philosophy of making most hidden aspects basicially a slow and unusable version of their base weapon has backfired completly. first beowulf - now this. hidden aspects are supposed to be strong and rewarding for the sheer grind I had to go through to unlock them. I dont even know if I want to unlock hidden rail at this point

[hoary pasture]

eh

Sneaks and bballs are bad for literally every weapon

Don’t make it a Rama thing

If anything Rama has the most potential to burst a bball

Sneaks are pain not much you can do on anything

[mossy zinc]

They weren't making it a Rama-only thing, they were just giving an example of EM4 RNG screwing you over.

[undone tartan]

Nah BBalls are fine for Beo in my experience

P1 sneak or two sneaks in P2 still kills most runs though

[hoary pasture]

Maybe

But you can always play better instead of blaming it on the summons

We reset for tons of garbage, might aswell reset for EM4 summons if you cant manage sneaks

[undone tartan]

I mean, sure. I can play better to survive a lot of incredibly bad BP2 rooms. Still is very frustrating to die to them, since it’s just by bad luck that they showed up

[hoary pasture]

Yea

That’s how the game works

[undone tartan]

Yeah

[hoary pasture]

Shocker

[undone tartan]

I wish they still made balance changes though. A nerf to speeder and nerfing (if not removing honestly) EM4 sneaks would go a long way to making high heat feel more fair and enjoyable, at least for me

[quartz mantle]

I mean taking the pact option means you’re agreeing to the bs that may ensue

If you don’t like BP2 combos or EM4 sneak then don’t take those pact options

Or accept that sometimes you’ll run into a difficult room

[hoary pasture]

Yea the pact is unfair sometimes

Just how it is

Plenty of high heaters got kinda used to AP2 RI0

It’s bs but like what can you do

[undone tartan]

I’m aware. But I think it should be balanced

If a pact is going to make the game harder, it should do it in at least a kinda consistent way

[quartz mantle]

That is not how a lot of pact options work

[undone tartan]

Yes it is

[quartz mantle]

AP and RI literally exist to make the game less consistent

[hoary pasture]

Yea

[undone tartan]

The only that don’t work like this are AP, BP, and EM4

[quartz mantle]

So you can’t rely on getting the same broken build every time

[undone tartan]

And RI makes your builds less consistent but does it in a very consistent way

[quartz mantle]

Yea every pact option changes the game in a different way

[hoary pasture]

Idk about bp

Bp is a get gud thing

[undone tartan]

BP is very inconsistent

[hoary pasture]

Yea that’s true

[undone tartan]

Nah there are some basically unbeatable rooms

[quartz mantle]

Perhaps to you

[undone tartan]

And also some literally unbeatable rooms with some builds

[mossy zinc]

I don't think there is any point in discussing what the pact should or shouldn't be.

[hoary pasture]

Those are very rare tho

[undone tartan]

Not on Hestia they’re not

[quartz mantle]

You can beat saviors on Hestia

[hoary pasture]

Hestia has a normal attack you know that right

[quartz mantle]

Especially if you get the proper build

[undone tartan]

When I play high heat Hestia, about 30% of the time I get a nearly unbeatable room that’s harder than EM4

Saviors aside

[quartz mantle]

The proper build being: a damaging dash

[hoary pasture]

I see that as a you thing then

[quartz mantle]

^

[hoary pasture]

Saviors are the only thing I’d consider

[undone tartan]

Literally just 7 speeder slugger shields in a small room is just rip

[hoary pasture]

Yea

[undone tartan]

Or bows

[hoary pasture]

Thought you’d say that

Speeder sluggers are everywhere

Just get better at handling them

[undone tartan]

Even when it’s not rip, it’s still a ~2 minute room

[quartz mantle]

Nah mike is right

[undone tartan]

I know

[quartz mantle]

I mean it’s understandable that you have a lot of trouble with them

[undone tartan]

But that’s not my point

[quartz mantle]

They’re hard

But idk what blaming the game is gonna do for you

[undone tartan]

I don’t like the incredibly inconsistent difficulty. I think it’s bad. That’s my only argument. Whether or not these rooms can be beaten is a separate issue

[quartz mantle]

You’re literally using a mechanic to make the game harder on purpose

Congrats and welcome to Hades the Video Game

[hoary pasture]

A lot of bp perks are very tough tho

[quartz mantle]

Inconsistent difficulty is literally the name of the game

[undone tartan]

Yes but I think that pacts should do it in a way that doesn’t increase the impact of RNG on a run. That’s all I’m saying

[quartz mantle]

Have you met the Pact of Punishment

It’s whole gimmick is inconsistent difficulty

[hoary pasture]

Teleporting enemies are very hard to handle sometimes no joke

And poppers

[quartz mantle]

You’re also literally playing a rougelike

[undone tartan]

Nah if you make a tier list of difficulty, there’s probably 3 that are infinitely harder than the others.

I literally don’t die except in speeder/slugger/savior rooms

Ever

[undone tartan]

No it’s not. Literally just BP, EM4, AP, and arguably RI but I don’t think RI is the same

[quartz mantle]

I’m just gonna press the Skill Issue button and move on

Have a good day

[undone tartan]

It’s a skill issue, yes. That’s not my point

[hoary pasture]

True

But pact is not changing anyway

[undone tartan]

It is not

[hoary pasture]

Could be better sure

[undone tartan]

I am only defending my initial point

I think that BP is one of the worst designed pacts for sure

[cursive portal]

I dont use he/him anymore just fyi

[undone tartan]

I just think it’s unfortunate to see my enjoyment of the game be so negatively affected by things that could just be fixed by changing a few numbers. But there’s nothing to be done about it, I get that

[honest kernel]

@cursive portal oh wow you beat 62 heat? that's insanely impressive, well done!

[cursive portal]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/875371440684294175.gif?size=44

ty

[honest kernel]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/875371440684294175.gif?size=44

@cursive portal may I ask how long it took you?

[cursive portal]

too long

only me and 2 other people-baj and ykc have it

[honest kernel]

that's actually incredible, grats again

[pseudo kernel]

I also beat 62 heat

[cursive portal]

gg

[honest kernel]

[dapper schooner]

very nice

[undone tartan]

I actually got an unmodded 4:48 on Arthur

[honest kernel]

[undone tartan]

[dapper schooner]

damn that's pretty close to beating my unrecorded unmodded wr of 4:45 where I was also playing blindfolded

[undone tartan]

Well we can’t all be as good as you

[pseudo kernel]

I almost beat that with zag sword but my cat distracted me

The crazy thing was that I don't even have a cat

[honest kernel]

I have 4:37 playing with my feet

[undone tartan]

Yeah right! Proof???

[honest kernel]

[long minnow]

I got 0:01 without even launching the game

[quiet mountain]

i got 4:20 69 heat aspect of ganjamesh unrecorded tho :/

[dapper schooner]

yo you're pretty good at the game

[long minnow]

It was a dead run

[jaunty falcon]

Proof?

[undone tartan]

Ganjamesh is kinda funny

[undone tartan]

Just deadass got a 3 minute long Hestia c34

Rip run I guess

Wasn’t even savior

Just got ~10 speeder greatshields

And it’s just like insanely hard to hit them, especially with auto aim

Because it kept aiming at the closest one, even if they had their shield up

[undone tartan]

Ok no it was 2:20

Bro I’m literally considering doing AP2 RI2 BP1 50 heat

Not even kidding

Legit thinking about it

[jaunty falcon]

What is it rn

AP1?

[undone tartan]

I tried RI2 AP1 and RI0 AP2

[cursive portal]

ri2 ap2 is pretty free on hesty

[undone tartan]

I prefer AP1

[jaunty falcon]

Yeah RI2 AP2 allows you to take basically no JS or CP

Easy

[undone tartan]

Or BP1

[mossy zinc]

JS and Hestia are not friends.

[undone tartan]

To increase my odds of having fun while playing the video game

I can handle JS totally fine until I get bad BP rooms in Elysium

[jaunty falcon]

JS is the problem not BP

[undone tartan]

So far I have not lost a single run to a non-speeder/slugger room. 100% of my deaths have either been to bosses or speeder/slugger

Out of like ~30 attempts

[jaunty falcon]

If you have less enemies you have fewer speeder slugger enemies

[undone tartan]

Only takes one slugger bow sniping me for 54 to kill a run

But yeah I know what you’re saying

So RI2 AP2 JS2 CP1? Hell mode

Or even JS1 CP2??

Or… other idea…

Not play Hestia

Rama 50 instead

Or Zeus

Because as much as I love Hestia, 50+ heat Hestia is honestly kinda miserable

Like I know that every death is my fault because I could play better but when I only die to insanely bad Ely rooms (or bosses which is my fault, I hold that L), it’s just is very demoralizing and makes me feel like I’m just grinding RNG instead of trying to improve

[jaunty falcon]

JS2 CP0

You can do that

No hell mode obviously

That’s what I did

[undone tartan]

Isn’t that only 49?

[pseudo kernel]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/725021639506526249/937162392616456233/Screenshot_551.png

this is what i used

[jaunty falcon]

^

I did JS2 CP0 instead

[undone tartan]

Hmm ok

And just expect to take shackle all the way to Hades?

Or should I look for an attack boon

[jaunty falcon]

Look for one

You basically are looking for any rare+ non tempest strike % attack boon

If it’s Artemis you can take common and be fine

[undone tartan]

Well I can’t exactly be choosy about it

It’s AP2 RI2

I’ll be lucky to have a single roll

[hoary pasture]

Do it like real gamers

EM4 style

[pseudo kernel]

dc2 drunken strike

[honest kernel]

whats the best spear for 32

[undone tartan]

Achilles imo

[honest kernel]

I suspected so, the damage buff after special is pretty phat

[undone tartan]

Yeah Achilles falls off a much higher heat where you can’t consistently get a good cast build since flurry jab is kinda unsafe for very high heat

But at 32 it’s great

[honest kernel]

I feel like everything is "good" for 32

[undone tartan]

Pretty much everything works

Some things are better than others

Achilles cast builds are good because they can do good damage while also being safe

[honest kernel]

how does one submit a run to the high heat leaderboard, in case I eventually go for 40+

[hoary pasture]

If you mean the sheet it’s pinned here and there is a link in there to make a form submission

[honest kernel]

hmm lets see if I can find it

[hoary pasture]

#h1-high-heat-strategies message

[honest kernel]

yeah I found the pin, I'm tryna find the submission link

do you just write stuff down in the form submission tab?

[hoary pasture]

There is a link in the most recent runs tab to the right, should be this:

https://forms.gle/YDWq5HG5Lcu8UH1i6

[honest kernel]

oh I didn't see that whoops

thank you

I notice in some of the videos it shows a death at the start, why is that?

[left prism]

To show the run is not seeded

[honest kernel]

ah ok

[undone tartan]

Prerun death is required for unseeded runs

At least for SRC

[honest kernel]

alright gotcha, anything else to note?

[undone tartan]

No quitting to menu

[honest kernel]

[hoary pasture]

Don’t block the igt

Nor the save icon

[honest kernel]

I wouldn't even know how to do that

[undone tartan]

With speedrun splits if you had those

[honest kernel]

that's only for speedrun submissions tho right?

[undone tartan]

I don’t 100% know the rules for the heat leaderboard but they’re probably the same. There’s no verifiers so it’s kinda an honor system (but someone could check the vod and notice)

[hoary pasture]

Kinda yea

If you’re just pushing heat you don’t really care about biome splits since you just want a clear in the end

But it’s optional

[honest kernel]

cool

[undone tartan]

Oh did you just mean spilts?

Yeah splits are always optional

I don’t even use them for my speedruns because I’m a casual

[honest kernel]

I'm a casual too

[hoary pasture]

Same

[mossy zinc]

@honest kernel run must be recorded in one continuous video, the previous death must be shown (for unseeded), and no mods that have a direct effect on the run are allowed.

[honest kernel]

[mossy zinc]

If you only have a screenshot, you can still submit it, but it will only go into the "victory screens only" category.

Also, runs need to be 32 Heat or higher.

[honest kernel]

wasn't gonna do mods anyway

[mossy zinc]

Except for the challenge categories like Mirrorless. Those can be whatever Heat you like.

[honest kernel]

yeah gotcha, not gonna bother with 32 tho. Will probably start recording at 40+

[cursive portal]

Record your runs

🔫

[honest kernel]

what do you guys use to record

[cursive portal]

Shadowplay

OBS is another good choice

[mossy zinc]

Girls record, too.

[honest kernel]

no that's not

I was using guys as generalizing term for any gender

[undone tartan]

Proof

[cursive portal]

Guys is gender neutral usually

[honest kernel]

that was my intention

[mossy zinc]

'Tis not. If you ask somebody to draw three guys, they're not gonna draw a girl.

I use OBS Studio.

[honest kernel]

I'll see if shadowplay can record for 20 mins

[dapper schooner]

no

[honest kernel]

actually longer I think, since pre run and pauses

[ripe crane]

Onlyfans

[jaunty falcon]

OlympianFavour

[cursive portal]

Yoo its crepes

[honest kernel]

YO CREPES?!?!

[quartz mantle]

That is a banger profile banner

[pseudo kernel]

Thanks

[honest kernel]

Agreed

Moe shop album

[ripe crane]

Wait who are you people. How do you know my name?!

[mossy zinc]

It's right next to your profile picture.

[next acorn]

whats a profile picture

[mossy zinc]

Food.

[next acorn]

How does one eat a png

Asking for a friend

[jaunty falcon]

I created my pfp

[honest kernel]

I hope you don’t plan on eating that very prideful dusa

[next acorn]

perchance

[honest kernel]

How could you

She so sweet

[next acorn]

Sweet…

Sweet tastes good

[honest kernel]

NO NOT THAT TYPE

[next acorn]

[honest kernel]

Than is the best lover

[cursive portal]

56 hesty fella

[honest kernel]

got a question about JS, does the increase of enemies spill over into creating more waves of enemies or is it just more enemies per wave?

if that makes sense

[undone tartan]

More enemies per wave

[honest kernel]

oh good

[undone tartan]

But there’s a limit to the number of enemies that can be on screen at once

So it can have waves that spawn slowly as you kill them

That may feel like more than one wave

[honest kernel]

gotchu

thanks

that's alot better than creating more waves

[undone tartan]

Like unarmored flare wheels in C34

Which can be like a minute long wave

[honest kernel]

[undone tartan]

Yeah

[dapper schooner]

it kills time but atleast it doesnt kill zag

on the other hand when speeder chariots show up i know im dead.

[hoary pasture]

[dapper schooner]

i wish speeder didnt exist :[

[hoary pasture]

I wish BP2 buffs would stack

So you can get a chariot with 2 speeder perks

Or 2 slugger

[dapper schooner]

no pls :[

[undone tartan]

Or at least it could be a bit less absurd

[dapper schooner]

how would double teleport work

[hoary pasture]

That would be awful

Or double linkers

Idk

[undone tartan]

Speeder chariots aren’t as bad as speeder bow / shields imo

[dapper schooner]

double linkers is just double damage on the link

its not that bad

[dapper schooner]

bow is p bad yeah

[hoary pasture]

Double poppers

[dapper schooner]

i dont think speeder shield necessarily is as much of an increase as the others, but still strong since shield by itself is a strong enemy type

[undone tartan]

Well they just turn so quickly

It’s like impossible to actually hit them

https://youtu.be/wHco0UfYK3Q

[dapper schooner]

i dont play hesty so maybe thats why i havent noticed it as much

[cursive portal]

Bouldy

Just get piercing fire

[dapper schooner]

did you time out to heroes on this btw

[undone tartan]

Yes

[undone tartan]

EZ AP2 Piercing fire

[dapper schooner]

just roll the 1 in 6 ez

[honest kernel]

Oh snap Crepes is alive

Good to know

Late to the party but hey

[honest kernel]

I'm really struggling with 32 spear, anyone got good build that isn't guan yu

[raw cloud]

there’s an achillies guide somewhere

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1eAOEli9KqJOVyPD7U-6D1o1yZx1tDMQWLDcMJr8G84E/edit

[honest kernel]

last time I went zeus the game didn't give me jolted till elysium

and then the time before that I got splitting bolt before meg

roguelites smh

[undone tartan]

Achilles cast builds can work well for 32

They’re quite safe

[honest kernel]

it's ok I won :)

but thanks anyway

[undone tartan]

Oh nice

[mossy zinc]

@honest kernel 🔫 https://clips.twitch.tv/TrustworthyPreciousJayMcaT-GM7rxScsaehtl7iw

[honest kernel]

[cursive portal]

Submit your runs 🔫

[honest kernel]

I did!

[cursive portal]

gj

[next acorn]

can't submit your runs if you don't record them